,id,q,r,s,q',r',Unnamed: 6,total no.: 7987
10,10,"""I personly would not condone an abortion , however i would n't condem a person who wanted one : its there choice . you ca n't pass your ideas of when life began ect on to another person but its highly debatable and each person has a right to decide for themselves . you can not prove life begans at conception , and the burden of proof for taking away one 's rights relys on proof . points 1 ) child birth is dangerious , deadly and painful . many women have died during child labor . due to our bi-pedalism the female hip is much smaller than it should be making it most of the time impossible to give birth ( thus a c-section ) how can you force someone to carry around a child they do not want for 9 months ? 2 ) rape 3 ) if you try to stop it , you wo n't . you will just put it back on the street ( much like drugs ) doctors will be preforming back alley abortions . 4 ) if your mother doesnt ' want you who will ? people say oh adoption is in such high demand . true : however its not because of a lack of children its because of buerocratic XXXXXXXX . the gov . does n't want to be responsible for child abuse so they over screen adoption parents and make it diffucult to get a child . the cost is astronomical . 5 ) overpopulation is a problem . note : religion should not influence your decision in law making . only in personal moral decisions .""","""This is a pretty touchy issue , and I agree with the different points of view .. most of them make sense ... while I do n't personally agree with abortion , I do n't feel that I have the right to tell someone else what they should do . The way I see it , is that it 's their body , their life , they are the ones who will be affected by their decision . I do n't have to like the choices someone else makes , and I do n't have to agree with it , but while I have that right , I also believe that people should have the right to make those decisions . Are these anti-abortion people going to step in and pay for the cost of having the baby , raising it , etc .. ? ? ? Maybe some of those are the issues people consider when having an abortion . Maybe the woman was raped . I see the point when someone said that the baby should not be punished for that , and I agree with that , but the rape was committed against the woman 's will ... she did n't ask for that to happen , and if a pregnancy results from that , that is also against her will , so why should she feel that she has to have the child ? What does she tell the child when it decides to ask who its father is ? ? The child could still be born and given up for adoption , and that is a good idea , but maybe the woman will relive the rape throughout the pregnancy by being reminded of it on a daily basis .... all I feel is until it happens to you , and YOU are forced to make these kinds of choices , you should n't judge anyone else for the choices that they make .""",AGREE,"""I personly would not condone an abortion , however i would n't condem a person who wanted one""","""This is a pretty touchy issue , and I agree with the different points of view""",,
19,13,"""Do you not even get statutory sick pay ?""","""You have to be off for more than 4 days and after that I would get the princely sum of £79.15 per week .. hardly worth having . Unlike teachers I can not stay at home and get paid when it snows too .""",DISAGREE,"""not even get statutory sick pay""","""have to be off for more than 4 days and after that I would get the princely sum of £79.15 per week""",,
43,31,"""While indeed marriage was once a religious ceremony , it is fairly clear that ceremony has been taken away from the religion and added as an American tradition , so to speak . I know of someone who once proposed that we get rid of marriage altogther and give everyone civil unions except for thos acknowledged by the church . As feasible as that may be , marriage is too rooted in our American culture . For that reason it is best to truly offer rights to everyone as our constitution so rightly protects .""","""That was put nicely . No argument here . Maybe marriage should be taken out and give everyone civil unions . And if you wanted to be considered married it can be your religious ceremony""",AGREE,"""marriage was once a religious ceremony , get rid of marriage altogther and give everyone civil unions""","""That was put nicely . No argument here . Maybe marriage should be taken out and give everyone civil unions .""",,
52,33,"""`` They believe that mechanistic evolution is just too improbable. `` Ah ... do they now . You see , Berkinski et al seem to have a limited comprehension as to what causes life to change in space and time . Where they see improbability I see inevitability- life , in whatever form we care to discuss , is vying to survive against a whole battery of challenges . Some of those challenges confront it on a short term basis- the need for food , suitable environmental conditions in which to survive and so on . Others may be an issue over a longer period of time- the need to find a mate and reproduce , can it survive annual changes in local climates . Ultimately , life has to be able to adapt to the longest term changes- like a major shift in underlying climatic conditions or local topography . And so on- we can consider a whole host of changes that confronts life at various times over different timescales . What is clear from such consideration is the never ending need for life to able to adapt- the Earth is a dynamic and forever changing place ( even the very ground beneath you now is transient in nature ) and environments have changed dramatically over the course of this planets history . If life were still and static it would never have come to be in the first place . If it can not adapt to a new challenges quickly enough- well just think of all the examples we have of life that is extinct . So I really can not see why Berkinski and his peers find natural evolution , or whatever you care to call it improbable- the driving forces are there to see if you are inclined to learn about them . What I really find improbable is the notion of an omnipotent supernatural enitity outside of the physical universe somehow being able to comprehend and interact with the life in ours- and even to have the desire to do so !""","""I believe you 've missed the point . He 's not against evolution ; change of species over time into other species . He in fact , from what I can gather , does indeed believe in evolution He 's arguing that it did n't come about through materialistic processes .""",DISAGREE,"""Ultimately , life has to be able to adapt to the longest term changes- like a major shift in underlying climatic conditions or local topography .""","""He in fact , from what I can gather , does indeed believe in evolution""",,
55,33,"""`` They believe that mechanistic evolution is just too improbable. `` Ah ... do they now . You see , Berkinski et al seem to have a limited comprehension as to what causes life to change in space and time . Where they see improbability I see inevitability- life , in whatever form we care to discuss , is vying to survive against a whole battery of challenges . Some of those challenges confront it on a short term basis- the need for food , suitable environmental conditions in which to survive and so on . Others may be an issue over a longer period of time- the need to find a mate and reproduce , can it survive annual changes in local climates . Ultimately , life has to be able to adapt to the longest term changes- like a major shift in underlying climatic conditions or local topography . And so on- we can consider a whole host of changes that confronts life at various times over different timescales . What is clear from such consideration is the never ending need for life to able to adapt- the Earth is a dynamic and forever changing place ( even the very ground beneath you now is transient in nature ) and environments have changed dramatically over the course of this planets history . If life were still and static it would never have come to be in the first place . If it can not adapt to a new challenges quickly enough- well just think of all the examples we have of life that is extinct . So I really can not see why Berkinski and his peers find natural evolution , or whatever you care to call it improbable- the driving forces are there to see if you are inclined to learn about them . What I really find improbable is the notion of an omnipotent supernatural enitity outside of the physical universe somehow being able to comprehend and interact with the life in ours- and even to have the desire to do so !""","""I believe you 've missed the point . He 's not against evolution ; change of species over time into other species . He in fact , from what I can gather , does indeed believe in evolution He 's arguing that it did n't come about through materialistic processes .""",DISAGREE,"""If life were still and static it would never have come to be in the first place""","""you 've missed the point He 's not against evolution ; ,""",,
63,35,"""Here 's the relevant point of exposing how evolutionists dealt with defining the Coelacanth . Before evolutionists knew that living examples of this fish existed , they never even hesitated in taking the observable physical features it exhibited and thought nothing of creating a completely inaccurate and totally fictional biography of that fish 's evolutionary journey . They not only claimed that it crawled on the Sea bottom which proved it was an intermediary fish , but they made assumptions based on the fact that it birthed its young live rather than being an egg layer .""","""What is your evidence they did n't do this ? Remember , today 's Coelacanth is different .""",DISAGREE,"""of exposing how evolutionists dealt with defining the Coelacanth .""","""'s Coelacanth is different .""",,
73,37,"""Why do you expect me to provide evidence when you never do ?""","""Then you freely admit that you lied when you said this , and I quote : People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail . AND Arch is doing nothing but distorting the very thing he holds so dear , I mean , how is accurately quoting passages from the bible distorting it in any way ? You do nothing but post drivel which makes no factual statements at all . And you call that debating ?""",DISAGREE,"""Why do you expect me to provide evidence when you never do ?""","""Then you freely admit that you lied when you said this , and I quote : People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail .""",,
75,37,"""Why do you expect me to provide evidence when you never do ?""","""Then you freely admit that you lied when you said this , and I quote : People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail . AND Arch is doing nothing but distorting the very thing he holds so dear , I mean , how is accurately quoting passages from the bible distorting it in any way ? You do nothing but post drivel which makes no factual statements at all . And you call that debating ?""",DISAGREE,"""Why do you expect me to provide evidence when you never do ?""","""You do nothing but post drivel which makes no factual statements at all .""",,
77,38,"""Why ? What has caused you to believe such things ?""","""wow , I never thought a qoute would be so stupid as to compare it to a house . Fine then what if I compare your head to a house that is housing ur brain . But it would be perfectly legal to rip it out and steamroll it on the street for allto see . ( by ur rules of course this would be a perfectly acceptable thing to do )""",DISAGREE,"""Why ? What has caused you to believe such things ?""","""I never thought a qoute would be so stupid as to compare it to a house .""",,
81,39,"""So taking peoples rights away is an american value ? I think I will push for legislation to make cancer surgery illegal . After all cancer cells are human life too and with modern medical tech they could become a human being also .""","""In a way , taking rights away is an American value since we have prescribed methods for doing it . For instance , we have legislatures which posess authority to remove a large number of what you likely consider to be rights . Here are just a small number that come to mind : 1 ) Right to murder 2 ) Right to own slaves 3 ) Right to rape 4 ) Right to abusing children 5 ) Right to vote 6 ) Right to smoke ( if you 're under 18 ) 7 ) Right to drink ( 18th Amendment ) 8 ) Right to engage in certain activities in public 9 ) Right to drive as fast as one wants 10 ) Right to dump dangerous chemicals in the nearest river The list goes on really . The fact is that you do n't object to taking rights away in principle , you only object to taking away those rights that you wish to retain . That is quite inconsistent . Where do you get the idea that one has a right to perform an abortion anyway ?""",DISAGREE,"""So taking peoples rights away is an american value ?""","""In a way , taking rights away is an American value""",,
93,42,"""I know that the Apostles witnessed God 's miracles .""","""Montalban -- Can you define for me the concept of 'knowledge ' in the sense that you use it ? Would n't 'believe ' be a more accurate word to replace 'know ' in the above statement ? Otherwise , how is it that you can personally 'know ' something that other intelligent and faithful Christians recognize as belief -- not knowledge ?""",DISAGREE,"""I know that the Apostles witnessed God 's miracles .""","""Can you define for me the concept of 'knowledge ' in the sense that you use it ?""",,
95,42,"""I know that the Apostles witnessed God 's miracles .""","""Montalban -- Can you define for me the concept of 'knowledge ' in the sense that you use it ? Would n't 'believe ' be a more accurate word to replace 'know ' in the above statement ? Otherwise , how is it that you can personally 'know ' something that other intelligent and faithful Christians recognize as belief -- not knowledge ?""",DISAGREE,"""I know that""","""Would n't 'believe ' be a more accurate word to replace 'know '""",,
100,57,"""First off , the scientific method goes : 1 ) Form Hypothesis 2 ) Test hypothesis 3 ) Form conclusion ( or theory ) * correct me if I wrote the scientific method wrong *""","""You guys know me . Always happy to correct anyone . As electrolyte pointed out , ( 1 ) the first step in the scientific method is the observation . A scientist observes something that raises a question . ( 2 ) Then comes the hypothesis , that is an attempt to explain the observation . The hypothesis can be an educated guess or even wild speculation based on previous knowledge or intuition , or it may be based in previous science and an understanding of scientific principles . ( 3 ) One then makes a prediction that is a necessary consequence of the hypothesis . That science is predictive is one of its salient characteristics . In the case of the scientific method , the prediction is said to have the power to falsify the hypothesis . In other words , if the prediction can be shown to be false , then the hypothesis must also be false . If the prediction is true , then the hypothesis is supported . So now we have the observation , the hypothesis that explains the observation , and a prediction that is a consequence of the hypothesis . The next step ( 4 ) is to design an experiment to test the prediction , and then ( 5 ) to perform the test . If the prediction fails the test , then it may be abandoned . However , as electrolyte pointed out , the process may be circular , because if the prediction is falsified , additional observation from the test may be used to adjust the hypothesis at ( 2 ) , and a new prediction is made at ( 3 ) , and so on . In creation science , the process stops at ( 2 ) , except that the hypothesis is based on dogma and scripture , not reality .""",AGREE,"""First off , the scientific method goes : 1 ) Form Hypothesis correct me if I wrote the scientific method wrong""","""You guys know me . Always happy to correct anyone .""",,
99,57,"""First off , the scientific method goes : 1 ) Form Hypothesis 2 ) Test hypothesis 3 ) Form conclusion ( or theory ) * correct me if I wrote the scientific method wrong *""","""You guys know me . Always happy to correct anyone . As electrolyte pointed out , ( 1 ) the first step in the scientific method is the observation . A scientist observes something that raises a question . ( 2 ) Then comes the hypothesis , that is an attempt to explain the observation . The hypothesis can be an educated guess or even wild speculation based on previous knowledge or intuition , or it may be based in previous science and an understanding of scientific principles . ( 3 ) One then makes a prediction that is a necessary consequence of the hypothesis . That science is predictive is one of its salient characteristics . In the case of the scientific method , the prediction is said to have the power to falsify the hypothesis . In other words , if the prediction can be shown to be false , then the hypothesis must also be false . If the prediction is true , then the hypothesis is supported . So now we have the observation , the hypothesis that explains the observation , and a prediction that is a consequence of the hypothesis . The next step ( 4 ) is to design an experiment to test the prediction , and then ( 5 ) to perform the test . If the prediction fails the test , then it may be abandoned . However , as electrolyte pointed out , the process may be circular , because if the prediction is falsified , additional observation from the test may be used to adjust the hypothesis at ( 2 ) , and a new prediction is made at ( 3 ) , and so on . In creation science , the process stops at ( 2 ) , except that the hypothesis is based on dogma and scripture , not reality .""",AGREE,"""First off , the scientific method goes Form Hypothesis""","""the first step in the scientific method is the observation""",,
104,58,"""Pro choicers claim they are for the rights of women . If that is true why do n't pro-choicer want the pregnant women who seek abortion to be informed . I read yesterday , how the pro-choice people are trying to block legislation that would help women make better CHOICES about their pregnancy . If I find the link , I 'll post it , but the legislation was anyone who seeks an abortion , must have access to a sonogram before the abortion . That having an abortion `` may `` cause post-abortion stress syndrome , which for some it does ! It 's sad , pro-choicer , do n't want women to be `` informed `` to the best of their ability . Sonogram can be helpful tool to the WOMAN in helping her make a better CHOICE , and are n't pro-choicers all about CHOICE . So why block this legislation ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate .""","""First off , not all pro-choice advocates support this position . Second , How does a sonogram help to make an informed choice ? What does a sonogram actually inform a pregnant woman about ... that she is pregnant ? I would think that if she was going to get a sonogram , that she would know that she is already pregnant . Seems like simple logic to me . By saying it would help them make a better choice , do n't you really mean to say that it might influence them to not have an abortion , which is actually your choice for them ? You seem to be counting on the puppy store effect . You can drive by the puppy store every day without giving a thought to buying a puppy . But if you actually stop and look at one , you might just feel sorry for the pathetic little puppy couped up in the little cage , and decide to buy it just to `` rescue `` it from it 's plight . It goes something like this : `` awww ... look at the cute little puppy , we ca n't leave it here , we just have to take it home `` . 4 months later , that same cute little puppy is sitting in an SPCA shelter waiting to either be adopted or destroyed . All because it 's do-gooder owner made the decision to buy it based on emotion rather than informed choice .""",DISAGREE,"""Pro choicers claim they are for the rights of women""","""not all pro-choice advocates support this position""",,
106,59,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC .""",AGREE,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC .""",,
107,59,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC .""",AGREE,"""? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC""",,
108,59,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC .""",AGREE,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC""",,
110,59,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything lest I be dubbed PC .""",AGREE,"""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""","""I shuddered at same but did n't want to say anything""",,
120,61,"""Biology is centered around the theory of evolution . Without it , biology is hardly biology .""","""So biology did n't exist before the theory of evolution was formulated ?""",DISAGREE,"""Biology is centered around the theory of evolution""","""So biology did n't exist before the theory of evolution was formulated ?""",,
128,63,"""A woman owns her head , just as she owns the rest of her body . If you accept women as legitimate self-owners and not a slave caste , both the legality of abortion and the illegality of steamrolling their heads follows .""","""But would n't the baby inside own their body as well ?""",DISAGREE,"""A woman owns her head , just as she owns the rest of her body .""","""But would n't the baby inside own their body as well ?""",,
131,78,"""Your chance of committing sucide at 0 % is completely false . If you feel that way it is OK , but the scientific fact is your chance is : 2 % if your a white male .""","""The situation has nothing to do with chance . People do n't have to draw cards to figure out who is going to have to kill themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""scientific fact is your chance is : 2 %""","""has nothing to do with chance""",,
163,81,"""To me , somehow , it smacks of self-idolatrization , prideful in being `` next `` to God .""","""What else would you expect from the people who created a god in their own image ? Your thinking here is right , religion has a long history of being egocentric .""",AGREE,"""To me , somehow , it smacks of self-idolatrization , prideful in being `` next `` to God .""","""What else would you expect from the people who created a god in their own image ? Your thinking here is right , religion has a long history of being egocentric .""",,
184,83,"""It is just incredible to me that so many people accept the basic premise that evolutionists put out there , which is that there is enough variation within a species that would genetically disallow a portion of the population to breed .""","""Nope . Not part of evolutionary theory . It would be stupid to claim that increased genetic variability would `` disallow `` any portion of the population from breeding .""",DISAGREE,"""It is just incredible to me that so many people accept the basic premise that evolutionists put out there ,""","""Nope . Not part of evolutionary theory .""",,
197,84,"""Hope you like this one . I really think it 's funny . http : //www.workingforchange.com/comic.cfm ? itemid=19521""","""Heh , half the science with twice the religion , nice""",AGREE,"""Hope you like this one . I really think it 's funny .""","""Heh , half the science with twice the religion , nice""",,
211,87,"""What ? ? You mean their society did n't implode due to giving civil unions to all , under the weight of legal quagmire as some who have argued against this from the gay pride movement have asserted ? ? The sky did n't fall ? Imagine that .""","""The reality is that it 's the ANTI-GAY side who too often include pretenses of `` society imploding `` ... Can you name me anybody who has asserted `` society imploding `` or `` weight of legal quagmire `` on the `` gay pride movement `` side ? Once again , you run away with pointless strawman arguments ...""",DISAGREE,"""You mean their society did n't implode due to giving civil unions to all , under the weight of legal""","""society imploding `` or `` weight of legal quagmire `` on the `` gay pride movement `` side ? Once again , you run away with pointless strawman arguments""",,
213,88,"""`` Six pairs of these aortic arches loop over the pharynx . In primitive fish , these arches persist and enable the gills to oxygenate the blood . In adult birds and mammals , in which lungs oxygenate the blood , such a system makes little sense - but all six pairs of aortic arches are formed in mammalian and avian embryos before the system eventually becomes simplified into a single aortic arch . Thus , even though our physiology does not require such a structure , our embryonic condition reflects our evolutionary history. `` ( Developmental Biology : Seventh Edition , Scott F. Gilbert , Sinauer Associates Inc. , 2003 , p500 )""","""Another characteristic in this same general area that ties us back to fish is the development of our parathyroid glands - which are very similar to gill buds in fish - from a particular pharyngeal arch : the same one that in fish gives rise to the gill buds ! Moving on to the kidneys for a minute . The human embryo forms not one , but 3 successive kidneys : the pronephric , mesonephric , and metanephric kidneys . Only that last one persists and only it is the kidney you and I and all of our fellow humans use . Why do human embryos go through two transient and simpler kidneys before getting it right ? Here 's a hint : the other two are carry overs from simpler organisms ! The evolutionarily simplest vertebrates , such as hagfish and teleost fish , develop only the pronephric kidney : it is their adult functional kidney . Now move up an evolutionary notch to ( other ) fish and amphibians . In their embryos , the first kidney still develops , but soon begins to degenerate and is replaced by the mesonephric kidney , which is the functional adult kidney in these organisms . Now move up another evolutionary notch , to reptiles , birds , and mammals . Their embryos form the first kidney , which then degenerates and is replaced by the second kidney , which then degenerates and is replaced by the final , metanephric kidney : their adult functional kidney . The above is not anywhere near a complete list of embryological evidences for common descent/evolution . PS : Note the serial addition of developmental stages that occurs in kidneys as one moves up to higher evolutionary levels : `` ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny `` . Of course this `` law `` does not hold for all organs/organ systems in all organisms , but it does hold for a few cases . And that 's enough to clearly indicate evolution of those organ systems by their being retained from ancestors and then modified during embryonic development .""",AGREE,"""our embryonic condition reflects our evolutionary""","""And that 's enough to clearly indicate evolution of those organ systems by their being retained from ancestors and then modified during embryonic development .""",,
215,88,"""`` Six pairs of these aortic arches loop over the pharynx . In primitive fish , these arches persist and enable the gills to oxygenate the blood . In adult birds and mammals , in which lungs oxygenate the blood , such a system makes little sense - but all six pairs of aortic arches are formed in mammalian and avian embryos before the system eventually becomes simplified into a single aortic arch . Thus , even though our physiology does not require such a structure , our embryonic condition reflects our evolutionary history. `` ( Developmental Biology : Seventh Edition , Scott F. Gilbert , Sinauer Associates Inc. , 2003 , p500 )""","""Another characteristic in this same general area that ties us back to fish is the development of our parathyroid glands - which are very similar to gill buds in fish - from a particular pharyngeal arch : the same one that in fish gives rise to the gill buds ! Moving on to the kidneys for a minute . The human embryo forms not one , but 3 successive kidneys : the pronephric , mesonephric , and metanephric kidneys . Only that last one persists and only it is the kidney you and I and all of our fellow humans use . Why do human embryos go through two transient and simpler kidneys before getting it right ? Here 's a hint : the other two are carry overs from simpler organisms ! The evolutionarily simplest vertebrates , such as hagfish and teleost fish , develop only the pronephric kidney : it is their adult functional kidney . Now move up an evolutionary notch to ( other ) fish and amphibians . In their embryos , the first kidney still develops , but soon begins to degenerate and is replaced by the mesonephric kidney , which is the functional adult kidney in these organisms . Now move up another evolutionary notch , to reptiles , birds , and mammals . Their embryos form the first kidney , which then degenerates and is replaced by the second kidney , which then degenerates and is replaced by the final , metanephric kidney : their adult functional kidney . The above is not anywhere near a complete list of embryological evidences for common descent/evolution . PS : Note the serial addition of developmental stages that occurs in kidneys as one moves up to higher evolutionary levels : `` ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny `` . Of course this `` law `` does not hold for all organs/organ systems in all organisms , but it does hold for a few cases . And that 's enough to clearly indicate evolution of those organ systems by their being retained from ancestors and then modified during embryonic development .""",AGREE,"""aortic arches loop these arches persist and enable the gills""","""characteristic another evolutionary notch ,""",,
228,91,"""Keeping porn legal and accessible on the internet , keep taxes high , keep abortion legal .... keep people voting democrat . Send as many people to hell as possible .""","""So you 're saying that the rationale behind this vast conspiracy being executed by people who allegedly do n't believe in hell ... is to send people to hell ? Pretty self-refuting , do n't you th -- er , no , you do n't think at all , do you ?""",DISAGREE,"""Send as many people to hell as possible .""","""to send people to hell ?""",,
239,93,"""Evolutionists have screwed up in that they have always assumed that the gene is the fundamental unit of life ,""","""Uh . No they did n't . Have you ever actually taken a biology course ?""",DISAGREE,"""Evolutionists have screwed up""","""No they did n't""",,
259,97,"""I know of no one that is pro life believes the mother should die so the baby can live .""","""Obviously not . If the right to life trumps all other rights , then it follows that the mother 's right to life and the child 's right to life cancel each other out . Mind you , if it 's her choice then the pro-life movement endorses such heroism , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""I know of no one that is pro life believes the mother should die so the baby can live .""","""If the right to life trumps all other rights , then it follows that the mother 's right to life and the child 's right to life cancel each other out .""",,
266,98,"""I guess the question should be , why does the pharmacist think he knows what 's better for the patient than the doctor does ?""","""In all fairness the Pharmacist does serve an important vetting role in the supply of medication to patients- they check what has been prescribed by the doctor against they know about and correct errors that are made ( which do happen ... I was once given a 7 week course of anti-malarials which turned out to be suitable for taking no more than 28 days at a time ) . That aside I 'd agree with sinjin .""",DISAGREE,"""I guess the question should be , why does the pharmacist think he knows what 's better for the patient than the doctor does ?""","""In all fairness the Pharmacist does serve an important vetting role in the supply of medication to""",,
279,108,"""That can be proven .""","""No it ca n't . Scientific theories are n't `` proven `` . You can observe the fact of gravity but you ca n't `` prove `` that the theory that explains it is correct . In fact , the theory of gravitation is one of the least secure theories of modern science .""",DISAGREE,"""That can be proven .""","""No it ca n't . Scientific theories are n't `` proven `` . You can observe the fact of gravity but you ca n't `` prove `` that the theory that explains it is correct .""",,
288,110,"""So , this magical program that is supposed to represent life actually can also produce aeroplanes ! I 'd like to see DNA morph into such things !""","""you based this ( and other claims ) on a summary of the biomorphs program at website that either a ) did n't also provide dawkins limitations on the program or b ) had the limitations and you did n't bother to relay this information to the forum . You then make incredulous statements about how unrealistic the biomorphs are . any quotations of web pages are irrelevant because they do not address the basic issue that you are suggesting dawkins puts the biomorphs forth as a model of evolution and natural selection . This is not true as i have quoted part of his book that puts limitations on the biomorphs program , and draws attention to what `` morals `` should be drawn out of the biomorphs .""",DISAGREE,"""this magical program that is supposed to represent life actually can also produce aeroplanes !""","""you based this ( and other claims ) on a summary of the biomorphs program at website that either a ) did n't also provide dawkins limitations on the program or b ) had the limitations and you did n't bother to relay this information to the forum . ``""",,
330,123,"""I have to watch for snares now ? I didn ’ t say it , nor does the Bible , that only males of the human race have souls .""","""Well , assuming that when the Bible says `` you `` in passages that are telling `` you `` to do something with your soul , I would hope that it also applies to women . But it never comes out and says `` women and men have souls. `` This does n't mean they do n't have them . Same thing with animals . The book is n't written for non-humans , so when it says `` you `` we can assume it does n't refer to non-humans . But the book never says `` animals do n't have souls. `` So we ca n't assume that they do n't ( according to the bible ) .""",DISAGREE,"""the Bible that""","""to I have for""",,
336,124,"""I 'm calling you out . Exactly what is the street price for an AK-47 in Miami ? Obviously you have the answer to this question , along with evidence that your answer is correct and factual , or you 're just trolling and trying to derail a serious discussion , proving that you have nothing to contribute .""","""My bet is on the latter since I have yet to see any serious debate beyond insults from it . Since it is West Palm Beach police department doing the deal Miami is out in left field . Pardon the redundancy .""",AGREE,"""I 'm calling you out .""","""My bet is on the latter since I have yet to see any serious debate beyond insults from it .""",,
337,124,"""I 'm calling you out . Exactly what is the street price for an AK-47 in Miami ? Obviously you have the answer to this question , along with evidence that your answer is correct and factual , or you 're just trolling and trying to derail a serious discussion , proving that you have nothing to contribute .""","""My bet is on the latter since I have yet to see any serious debate beyond insults from it . Since it is West Palm Beach police department doing the deal Miami is out in left field . Pardon the redundancy .""",AGREE,"""you 're just trolling and trying to derail a serious discussion , proving that you have nothing to contribute .""","""My bet is on the latter since I have yet to see any serious debate beyond insults from it .""",,
358,126,"""Cybererratus , is Gary Ridgway something of a hero to you ?""","""Could you avoid your constant use of strawman ` s fallacies please ?""",DISAGREE,"""Cybererratus , is Gary Ridgway something of a hero to you ?""","""Could you avoid your constant use of strawman s fallacies please ?""",,
359,126,"""Cybererratus , is Gary Ridgway something of a hero to you ?""","""Could you avoid your constant use of strawman ` s fallacies please ?""",DISAGREE,"""is Gary Ridgway something of a hero to you ?""","""Could you avoid your constant use of strawman s fallacies""",,
363,127,"""This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ?""","""Irrelevant . Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",DISAGREE,"""This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration .""","""Irrelevant . Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",,
365,127,"""This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ?""","""Irrelevant . Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",DISAGREE,"""error becomes immediately evident willingly cut the life-support""","""Irrelevant the argument would apply .""",,
367,127,"""This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ?""","""Irrelevant . Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",DISAGREE,"""mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that""","""kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",,
370,127,"""This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ?""","""Irrelevant . Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",DISAGREE,"""What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ?""","""Whatever kind of person or mother she is , the argument would apply .""",,
375,128,"""18th Century Pennsylvania , which had its own RKBA , passed a law which required citizens to take an oath of allegiance to the state or face being disarmed . This was to protect the state against those who might be loyal to the British Crown . So why ca n't the US take similar measures to protect itself against terrorists ?""","""Because there 's absolutely no due process in this proposal . Your name is on the list , your rights are revoked . That 's not due process . There 's no court of law , no trial , no verdict , no attorneys , no chance for the accused to defend themselves , etc . We still have n't forgotten the Homeland Security memo that said veterans and those opposed to abortion could be potential terrorists .""",DISAGREE,"""So why ca n't the US take similar measures to protect itself against terrorists""","""Homeland Security memo that said veterans and those opposed to abortion could be potential terrorists .""",,
372,128,"""18th Century Pennsylvania , which had its own RKBA , passed a law which required citizens to take an oath of allegiance to the state or face being disarmed . This was to protect the state against those who might be loyal to the British Crown . So why ca n't the US take similar measures to protect itself against terrorists ?""","""Because there 's absolutely no due process in this proposal . Your name is on the list , your rights are revoked . That 's not due process . There 's no court of law , no trial , no verdict , no attorneys , no chance for the accused to defend themselves , etc . We still have n't forgotten the Homeland Security memo that said veterans and those opposed to abortion could be potential terrorists .""",DISAGREE,"""So why ca n't the US take similar measures to protect itself against terrorists ?""","""Because there 's absolutely no due process in this proposal .""",,
383,129,"""Galileo- The Supreme Court has ruled that the Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group , organized or otherwise , it 's not about serving any duty to the state or government .""","""Well if it has nothing to do with a militia that would mean that the preamble is merely unnecessary verbiage . So you want people to just ignore the plain text of the Second Amendment- at least the part you do n't like . The preamble lets us know that the main focus if not the sole focus of this amendment is the militia . David Konig is another historian that has found both the individual rights interpretation and the collective interpretation unsatisfactory . He says the Second Amendment protects an individual right that is exercised collectively . '' Indeed , to serve in the militia and participate in this civic duty was more than a duty : it was a civic right of a peculiarly eighteenth-century nature unlike either the 'individual ' or 'collective ' models argued for today . On neither side of the Atlantic , that is , did the debate concern itself with this right in the present-day sense of an 'individual ' or personal constitutional right ; but at the same time , its common emphasis on widespread individual arms-bearing for public service distinguishes it from today 's narrowly applied 'collective ' application to the National Guard . No individual right existed unrelated to service in a well-regulated militia ; no effective militia could serve its purpose without an armed citizenry . This type of right may appear paradoxical to us today , but it fitted 'the inner coherence of a given system of beliefs ' 4 held by people in the past , and which made sense to those familiar with the concept of an individual right exercised collectively. `` David Thomas Konig | The Second Amendment : A Missing Transatlantic Context for the Historical Meaning of `` the Right of the People to Keep and Bear Arms `` | Law and History Review , 22.1 | The History Cooperative""",DISAGREE,"""The Supreme Court has ruled that the Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group""","""if it has nothing to do with a militia that would mean that the preamble is merely unnecessary verbiage""",,
386,129,"""Galileo- The Supreme Court has ruled that the Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group , organized or otherwise , it 's not about serving any duty to the state or government .""","""Well if it has nothing to do with a militia that would mean that the preamble is merely unnecessary verbiage . So you want people to just ignore the plain text of the Second Amendment- at least the part you do n't like . The preamble lets us know that the main focus if not the sole focus of this amendment is the militia . David Konig is another historian that has found both the individual rights interpretation and the collective interpretation unsatisfactory . He says the Second Amendment protects an individual right that is exercised collectively . '' Indeed , to serve in the militia and participate in this civic duty was more than a duty : it was a civic right of a peculiarly eighteenth-century nature unlike either the 'individual ' or 'collective ' models argued for today . On neither side of the Atlantic , that is , did the debate concern itself with this right in the present-day sense of an 'individual ' or personal constitutional right ; but at the same time , its common emphasis on widespread individual arms-bearing for public service distinguishes it from today 's narrowly applied 'collective ' application to the National Guard . No individual right existed unrelated to service in a well-regulated militia ; no effective militia could serve its purpose without an armed citizenry . This type of right may appear paradoxical to us today , but it fitted 'the inner coherence of a given system of beliefs ' 4 held by people in the past , and which made sense to those familiar with the concept of an individual right exercised collectively. `` David Thomas Konig | The Second Amendment : A Missing Transatlantic Context for the Historical Meaning of `` the Right of the People to Keep and Bear Arms `` | Law and History Review , 22.1 | The History Cooperative""",DISAGREE,"""Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group""","""So you want people to just ignore the plain text of the Second Amendment""",,
389,129,"""Galileo- The Supreme Court has ruled that the Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group , organized or otherwise , it 's not about serving any duty to the state or government .""","""Well if it has nothing to do with a militia that would mean that the preamble is merely unnecessary verbiage . So you want people to just ignore the plain text of the Second Amendment- at least the part you do n't like . The preamble lets us know that the main focus if not the sole focus of this amendment is the militia . David Konig is another historian that has found both the individual rights interpretation and the collective interpretation unsatisfactory . He says the Second Amendment protects an individual right that is exercised collectively . '' Indeed , to serve in the militia and participate in this civic duty was more than a duty : it was a civic right of a peculiarly eighteenth-century nature unlike either the 'individual ' or 'collective ' models argued for today . On neither side of the Atlantic , that is , did the debate concern itself with this right in the present-day sense of an 'individual ' or personal constitutional right ; but at the same time , its common emphasis on widespread individual arms-bearing for public service distinguishes it from today 's narrowly applied 'collective ' application to the National Guard . No individual right existed unrelated to service in a well-regulated militia ; no effective militia could serve its purpose without an armed citizenry . This type of right may appear paradoxical to us today , but it fitted 'the inner coherence of a given system of beliefs ' 4 held by people in the past , and which made sense to those familiar with the concept of an individual right exercised collectively. `` David Thomas Konig | The Second Amendment : A Missing Transatlantic Context for the Historical Meaning of `` the Right of the People to Keep and Bear Arms `` | Law and History Review , 22.1 | The History Cooperative""",DISAGREE,"""Supreme Court has ruled that the Second Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with being part of any militia group ,""","""Well if it has nothing to do with a militia that would mean that the preamble is merely unnecessary verbiage .""",,
391,130,"""Why bother when you know logic , rational thinking and womens rights always take second seat to antiquated belief system dogma ?""","""How very true . Anti abortion people feel their opinions should be forced upon a women and her choice about her body should not matter . They would feel different if someone were telling them they could n't have a tumor or parasite removed from them because of someone elses belief system .""",AGREE,"""rational thinking and womens rights always take second seat to antiquated""","""a women and her choice about her body should not matter""",,
404,131,"""OccamsRazor : Another point to consider is populations- without reproduction there are no replacements for dead individuals .""","""Also already covered in my thread-starting post . ( IÂ ’ m not overlooking your further thoughts on this : they follow ) .""",AGREE,"""Another point to consider is populations- without reproduction there are no replacements for dead individuals .""","""Also already covered in my thread-starting post .""",,
423,133,"""Destroying the theory of evolution -- which has no-doubt had trillions of hours of intellectual thought devoted to it -- is one of my greatest pleasures . It 's simply a pleasure making it look so ridiculous .""","""So you are more knowledgeable about biology than all of the biologists who have spent their lives studying the topic ? You have repeatedly demonstrated you ignorance and many of us have repeatedly instructed you in the fundamentals of biology and science , and yet you claim to know more than real scientists ?""",DISAGREE,"""Destroying the theory of evolution hours of intellectual thought""","""more knowledgeable about biology repeatedly demonstrated you ignorance""",,
432,134,"""Would you consider abortion in the following four situations ?""","""And if I did then so what ? Hiter 's Mom and Saddam 's Mom both were given the option to abort their pregnancies by nurses and decided against it . So I guess this makes pro-lifers responsible for the holocaust and the slaughter of Kurds ?""",DISAGREE,"""Would you consider abortion in the following four situations ?""","""And if I did then so what ? Hiter 's Mom and Saddam 's Mom both were given the option to abort their pregnancies by nurses and decided against it . So I guess this makes pro-lifers responsible for the holocaust and the slaughter of Kurds ?""",,
442,135,"""Biologically speaking , the fetus is human""","""The fetus is also a parasite , and if the woman chooses to do so , she has the right to extract it from her body .""",DISAGREE,"""the fetus is human""","""The fetus is also a parasite""",,
447,136,"""I would n't disagree with you that abortion is murder . I do n't agree with executions either nor do I agree with wars . A life is lost when an abortion occurs . This is almost undefendable unless you want to debate whether a life even existed at the time of the abortion . I also accept that society is hurt by people having abortions . Women especially suffer psychological trauma from the loss of their child .""","""Then I do n't get your point that I am not affected by abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""I would n't disagree with you that abortion is murder . I do n't agree with executions either nor do I agree with wars . A life is lost when an abortion occurs""","""Then I do n't get your point that I am not affected by abortion .""",,
458,138,"""That seems to be the fatal flaw in the study . So the murder rate does n't suddenly decrease when you are 26 miles away from a gun show . Some people have said that gun shows increase murder in places as far away as Mexico . Simply comparing homicides rates in areas very near gun shows to homicide rates in other areas does n't prove anything .""","""You could have saved yourself some typing if you had of read the premise at all :""",DISAGREE,"""That seems to be the fatal flaw in the study . So the murder rate does n't suddenly decrease when you are 26 miles away from a gun show . Some people have said that gun shows increase murder in places as far away as Mexico .""","""You could have saved yourself some typing if you had of read the premise at all :""",,
469,140,"""Yeah , I 'm scared Milo , I 'm scared that a rational , apparently intelligent person can read these passages and come to the conclusions that you do .""","""Thanks for the complement on intelligence .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm scared that a rational , apparently intelligent person can read these passages and come to the conclusions that you do .""","""Thanks for the complement on intelligence .""",,
471,140,"""Yeah , I 'm scared Milo , I 'm scared that a rational , apparently intelligent person can read these passages and come to the conclusions that you do .""","""Thanks for the complement on intelligence .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm scared that a rational , apparently intelligent person can read these passages""","""Thanks for the complement on intelligence""",,
504,149,"""Hey , I 'm a 7th grader . You 've got to give me some props ... : D Yes , I do classify myself as a scientific newbie . But I am definitely by no means illiterate .""","""Well ... You can apparently read , but what you have apparently chosen to read - and accept - says much .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , I do classify myself as a scientific newbie . But I am definitely by no means illiterate .""","""You can apparently read , but what you have apparently chosen to read - and accept - says much .""",,
511,150,"""Butwhat of the fetus/babies that were wanted by daddy but not by mummy what does termination stop then ?""","""The burden of a pregnancy is the woman 's . It should be left up to her and her doctor to decide what is best for her .""",DISAGREE,"""wanted by daddy but not by mummy""","""The burden of a pregnancy is the woman 's .""",,
515,151,"""Nothing at all . You think open carrying of loaded handguns in public will become fashionable in CA ?""","""Why not ? You said yourself kalifornia was a `` trend setter `` . It is alread the law in many states .""",DISAGREE,"""You think open carrying of loaded handguns in public will become fashionable""","""Why not ? You said yourself kalifornia was a `` trend setter `` .""",,
523,152,"""This post contains a perfectly simple explanation of why ToE is a sham along with a challenge to any Darwinist to prove me wrong . ToE is constructed on a fraud premise . This premise says that the fundamental unit of evolution is the gene . Whenever an evolutionist talks about  “ evolution ” he ’ s not talking about mere phenotypic change – he ’ s talking about changes in genes . To a Darwinist , just because an animal changes phentoypically , or even if he passes these changes down to progeny does not mean that  “ evolution ” has occurred . A fish could morph into a human , but if there are no changes in genes then this would not be considered `` evolution. `` The only way evolution can happen , by their own definition , is if there is a change in genetics . This premise , I suggest is a complete and total fraud ... and I will explain why now : Let ’ s take humans and dogs , for example . When compared side-by-side , sure enough , humans may have an assortment of genes that dogs do not – and possibly the other way around . But just because humans may have certain genes that dogs do n't , does not mean that these genes cause the difference between humans and dogs . Of course , there are no  “ dog genes ” or  “ human genes. ” But likewise there are no  “ tongue genes ,  ”  “ tail genes ” or  “ toenail genes. ” Parts are not translated genes . Thus , the assertion that new genes got created or that individual genes mutated over time to chnage one kind of animal into another is blatantly false and physically impossible . But it 's worse than that . As I said before , humans have a whole slew of genes – theoretically , at least -- that dogs ( or other animals ) don ’ t have . But evolutionists still contend that these genetic differences cause the difference between the organisms ! That ’ s why they analyze DNA with such scrutiny ! But did it ever dawn on them that studying genetics is a compete waste of time because of the real possibility that each dog or each human has the genes they have because of what they are ? Scientists have been telling us for decades that who or what we are is determined by what genes we have ... But they ’ ve got it backwards ! Instead , we have the genes we have because of who we are . A dog is n't a dog because he barks ; a dog barks because of what he is . Same with genes . This , of course , spells destructin to ToE because it means genetic evolution is a fraud . Evolution , thus , should not be a theory based on changes in genes , but a theory based on changes in traits . But scientists continue to mess around with genes and try to make the body do weird things by mutating them . They simply won ’ t give up because they ’ ve seen correlations between gene activity and various physiological responses . But here ’ s where they ’ re screwing everything up : When you were a kid did you ever stand on your head ? If so , did your face ever get red if you stayed upside down for a period of time ? If so , do you admit that it was the act of being upside down that caused the blood to rush to your head ? Or , do you have the audacity to claim that you were upside down because your face was red ? That ’ s excactly what science is doing with genetics : they ’ ve got the audacity to claim that changes in genes ( the red face ) is causing the organsim to change physiologically ( go upside down . ) In reality , what ’ s happening is the organism is experiencing a new environment ( turning upside down ) and then the genes are responding in kind ( turning red ) . The only way you can prove this logic wrong is to do one of two things : 1 ) show me conclusively that mutations happen completely randomly and unoriented to environmental pressures . 2 ) show me that the same environmental pressures on genes will not produce the exact same physiological effects over and over and over . So there it is . Go for it .""","""So what this guy is saying is that he believes in natural selection but not evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""a perfectly simple explanation of why ToE is a sham ToE is constructed on a fraud premise `` The only way you can prove this logic wrong is to do one of two things : 1 ) show me conclusively that mutations happen completely randomly and unoriented to environmental pressures . 2 ) show me that the same environmental pressures on genes will not produce the exact same physiological effects over and over and over . So there it is . Go for it .""","""this guy he believes in natural selection but not evolution ?""",,
563,164,"""All of these quotes refer to interracial marriage , views of race , and the  “ proper ” interaction between the races . They date from 1823-1964 and were culled by reporter Eric Zorn from a Boston University Law Review article and a brief filed with the U.S. Supreme Court . Zorn ’ s article was published in the Chicago Tribune , May 19 , 1996""","""But , these are still males and females of the human species passing on their genetic capacity to reproduce themselves , which we know Gay folks can not do in nature . GL , Terral""",DISAGREE,"""All of these quotes refer to interracial marriage , views of race , and the  proper interaction between the races .""","""But , these are still males and females of the human species passing on their genetic capacity to reproduce themselves""",,
564,164,"""All of these quotes refer to interracial marriage , views of race , and the  “ proper ” interaction between the races . They date from 1823-1964 and were culled by reporter Eric Zorn from a Boston University Law Review article and a brief filed with the U.S. Supreme Court . Zorn ’ s article was published in the Chicago Tribune , May 19 , 1996""","""But , these are still males and females of the human species passing on their genetic capacity to reproduce themselves , which we know Gay folks can not do in nature . GL , Terral""",DISAGREE,"""All of these quotes refer to interracial marriage""","""But still males and females passing on their genetic capacity to reproduce Gay folks can not do in nature""",,
592,169,"""as for the proof , its really not a proof at all . if God is defined as a perfect being in reality , that does not mean that God exists . if i define a ufo as a flying spacecraft from another planet in reality , that does not make such things exist . its just a definition . i really dont see how that can be even considered a proof basically , the definition : `` a being possessing every perfection and every positive attribute `` is not a true definition , because both perfection and positive attributes are subjective . so theres really nothing to work with here God , by this definition , doesnt exist""","""Well , according to Descartes , if I have an idea of a most perfect being , I shall distinctly perceive that such a being must contain all perfections - including reality in every degree . So this idea also contains existence . God 's essence is to exist , and of no other thing can this be said . ( Existence in everything else being contingent . ) To refute these arguments , and some philosophers doubt they can be refuted , I think you will need to take another tack .""",DISAGREE,"""is being in another exist can be and to this""","""'s essence is to exist , and of no other thing can this be said . ( Existence in everything else being contingent . ) To refute these arguments , and some philosophers doubt they can be refuted , I think you will need to take another tack""",,
603,170,"""WOW that is a supernatural act where ever i have seen one , to be able to roll a dice billions of times ! !""","""well that could happen if somhow you mutated into some .. i dunno ... 600 armed person . ?""",DISAGREE,"""WOW that is a supernatural act where ever i have seen one , to be able to roll a dice billions of times ! !""","""well that could happen if somhow you mutated into some .. i dunno ... 600 armed person . ?""",,
609,171,"""because who in their right minds wants to be known as a descendant to a bunch of disgusting Brutes ? No one !""","""Well , that is the argument that one hears from creationists so often . So when are you going to get to the most delicious , highly satisfying entertainment ? Even more important , when are you going to expose the theory of evolution ? YOu do n't seriously propose that your little series of cow pies is actually meaningful , do you ?""",DISAGREE,"""who in their right minds wants to be known as a descendant to a bunch of disgusting Brutes ? No one !""","""Well , that is the argument that one hears from creationists so often YOu do n't seriously propose that your little series of cow pies is actually meaningful , do you ?""",,
611,172,"""Give Ryuuichi a break will you . She is a 17 year old girl that is contemplating getting sterilised and is sharing that with the rest of us . Christ , wasnt anybody here 17 years old ?""","""Yes I was 17 years old before , but if I asked a question , or told my business , I was mature enough to deal with the responses whether they were in my favor or not . Now that I 'm 26 I can take people not agreeing with me . I 'm not knocking her decision , just her attitude .""",DISAGREE,"""She is a 17 year old girl that is contemplating""","""Now that I 'm 26 I can take people""",,
612,172,"""Give Ryuuichi a break will you . She is a 17 year old girl that is contemplating getting sterilised and is sharing that with the rest of us . Christ , wasnt anybody here 17 years old ?""","""Yes I was 17 years old before , but if I asked a question , or told my business , I was mature enough to deal with the responses whether they were in my favor or not . Now that I 'm 26 I can take people not agreeing with me . I 'm not knocking her decision , just her attitude .""",DISAGREE,"""Give Ryuuichi a break will you . She is a 17 year old girl that is contemplating getting sterilised and is sharing that with the rest of us . Christ , wasnt anybody here 17 years old ?""","""Yes I was 17 years old before , but if I asked a question , or told my business , I was mature enough to deal with the responses whether they were in my favor or not . Now that I 'm 26 I can take people not agreeing with me . I 'm not knocking her decision , just her attitude .""",,
645,178,"""The discussion really got blown out of proportion somewhere along the line . I just had a problem with justifying abortion with false terms . It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge . This is obviously the purpose of a dictionary and thus that is what I try to reasonably use in a discussion .""","""But even the dictionary definition contains multiple meanings - reflecting the multiple uses of a particular word - and even many of those definitions were vaguely stated . I think that most people on both sides of the debate value `` human rights `` . In valuing `` human rights `` , they have a particular image in mind of what is `` human `` in that case . Do you really think that , by forcing them to acknowledge one of the dictionary definitions of `` human `` , you will change their view on who or what deserves `` human rights `` ? There view is based not on official definitions but on underlying feelings of what , in humans , they value - and mental existence is one criteria that is a requirement for them and for myself . I do n't know who the main person is that is pushing the arguements about definitions now - you or Shooterandproud or ShadowPickachu or Sigma or gman , etc - but , whoever it is , please think about what exactly it is you are trying to accomplish . Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",DISAGREE,"""blown out of proportion justifying abortion with false terms""","""dictionary definition reflecting the multiple uses of a particular word""",,
646,178,"""The discussion really got blown out of proportion somewhere along the line . I just had a problem with justifying abortion with false terms . It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge . This is obviously the purpose of a dictionary and thus that is what I try to reasonably use in a discussion .""","""But even the dictionary definition contains multiple meanings - reflecting the multiple uses of a particular word - and even many of those definitions were vaguely stated . I think that most people on both sides of the debate value `` human rights `` . In valuing `` human rights `` , they have a particular image in mind of what is `` human `` in that case . Do you really think that , by forcing them to acknowledge one of the dictionary definitions of `` human `` , you will change their view on who or what deserves `` human rights `` ? There view is based not on official definitions but on underlying feelings of what , in humans , they value - and mental existence is one criteria that is a requirement for them and for myself . I do n't know who the main person is that is pushing the arguements about definitions now - you or Shooterandproud or ShadowPickachu or Sigma or gman , etc - but , whoever it is , please think about what exactly it is you are trying to accomplish . Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",DISAGREE,"""It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge .""","""Do you really think that , by forcing them to acknowledge one of the dictionary definitions of `` human `` , you will change their view on who or what deserves `` human rights `` ?""",,
647,178,"""The discussion really got blown out of proportion somewhere along the line . I just had a problem with justifying abortion with false terms . It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge . This is obviously the purpose of a dictionary and thus that is what I try to reasonably use in a discussion .""","""But even the dictionary definition contains multiple meanings - reflecting the multiple uses of a particular word - and even many of those definitions were vaguely stated . I think that most people on both sides of the debate value `` human rights `` . In valuing `` human rights `` , they have a particular image in mind of what is `` human `` in that case . Do you really think that , by forcing them to acknowledge one of the dictionary definitions of `` human `` , you will change their view on who or what deserves `` human rights `` ? There view is based not on official definitions but on underlying feelings of what , in humans , they value - and mental existence is one criteria that is a requirement for them and for myself . I do n't know who the main person is that is pushing the arguements about definitions now - you or Shooterandproud or ShadowPickachu or Sigma or gman , etc - but , whoever it is , please think about what exactly it is you are trying to accomplish . Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",DISAGREE,"""It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge . This is obviously the purpose of a dictionary and thus that is what I try to reasonably use in a discussion .""","""Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",,
648,178,"""The discussion really got blown out of proportion somewhere along the line . I just had a problem with justifying abortion with false terms . It seemed more than obvious to me to use the meaning of words that is common in the English langauge . This is obviously the purpose of a dictionary and thus that is what I try to reasonably use in a discussion .""","""But even the dictionary definition contains multiple meanings - reflecting the multiple uses of a particular word - and even many of those definitions were vaguely stated . I think that most people on both sides of the debate value `` human rights `` . In valuing `` human rights `` , they have a particular image in mind of what is `` human `` in that case . Do you really think that , by forcing them to acknowledge one of the dictionary definitions of `` human `` , you will change their view on who or what deserves `` human rights `` ? There view is based not on official definitions but on underlying feelings of what , in humans , they value - and mental existence is one criteria that is a requirement for them and for myself . I do n't know who the main person is that is pushing the arguements about definitions now - you or Shooterandproud or ShadowPickachu or Sigma or gman , etc - but , whoever it is , please think about what exactly it is you are trying to accomplish . Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",DISAGREE,"""justifying abortion with false terms .""","""Do you seriously think that changing a persons definition of a word will alter their view on abortion rights ?""",,
656,180,"""without abiogenesis proven evolution can not be proven .""","""See above , yet again""",DISAGREE,"""abiogenesis proven evolution can not be proven .""","""See above , yet again""",,
668,182,"""Who said anything about a different form of love ?""","""You did when you talked about someone loving objects , or a mokey , etc .""",DISAGREE,"""a different form of love ?""","""you talked about someone loving objects""",,
673,190,"""If every creature in the population changes its phenotype at the same time in response to an evironmental cue ( diet , temperature , predators , etc ) , this could give the illusion of evolution -- or change -- in the fossil record .""","""Great idea . Explain why all the tests that prove it wrong are irrelevant .""",DISAGREE,"""If every creature in the population changes its phenotype at the same time in response to an evironmental cue ( diet , temperature ,""","""Great idea . Explain why all the tests that prove it wrong are irrelevant""",,
711,198,"""Maybe someone already said this but , problem is , we cant let the government take away any of our rights . Once they start doing that it would set precedence and who knows were it would end . Personally I wouldn ’ t own a gun for self defense because I am just not that big of a sissy .""","""You know what they call people like you ? Victims .""",DISAGREE,"""someone already said this but , problem is , we cant let the government take away any of our rights""","""You know what they call people like you ? Victims .""",,
715,199,"""On Wednesday , April 28 , the Assembly Appropriations Committee met to consider Assembly Bill 1810 and Assembly Bill 2223 . AB1810 was placed into the suspense file due to financial costs and will be reconsidered in the near future . This bill may be acted upon at a later date . Please continue checking your email and NRA-ILA : : for any updates on AB1810 . AB2223 was re-scheduled for next week . AB1810 would establish a registration system , similar to the one currently in place for handguns , for all newly-acquired long guns . Under AB1810 , the make , model and serial number of the firearm as well as the identifying information of the purchaser would be recorded and kept on file by the California Attorney General ’ s office . If AB1810 were enacted , violent criminals would continue doing what they do now – obtain firearms through illegal means . This bill would not decrease crime but will rather have disastrous effects on the already financially unstable Golden State . AB1810 would impose additional burdens on California ’ s taxpayers to maintain the registration system as well as on the state ’ s licensed firearms dealers , small businesses who already deal with extensive business requirements . One simply needs to look at Canada , a nation with draconian firearms registration , to see the results – billions in cumulative administrative costs , annual cost overruns , no clear substantiation of public safety benefits , unjust prosecution , and a bureaucratic complexity that daunts those willing to comply . Ironically , California is considering a new registration scheme as Canada is considering doing away with its system .""","""Let 's ask our California resident what he thinks of this new law . A waste of money in financial crunch time , or just good law making ? However , that is not the only options . You can say whatever you like . It is a free country . At least for now . Given all of the new laws being made , and the bureaucracy they create , thus adding more and further regs . associated with bigger government , the trend does n't look good for Freedom from governmental intrusions . But at least for now .""",DISAGREE,"""If AB1810 were enacted , violent criminals would continue doing what they do now – obtain firearms through illegal means .""","""It is a free country . At least for now . Given all of the new laws being made , and the bureaucracy they create""",,
726,201,"""Originally posted by Gabor By the way Newton was also a Bible scholar . Was he behind this great `` age of science `` mentally ?""","""And as a result of his Bible studies he rejected the Trinity .""",AGREE,"""Originally posted by Gabor By the way Newton was also a Bible scholar""","""a result of his Bible studies he rejected the Trinity .""",,
736,202,"""So therefore , the child is not the woman 's body . my other conclusion would be , the woman really doesnt have the right to do anything to that baby inside of her except to be a vessel in carrying out that childs destiny to be born . thats just my thoughts ..""","""That 's really simplified . It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant . It lives off her life processes - her blood , her immune system , her calories - it puts stress on her joints , muscles , heart , and bladder . Pregnacy can demand major sacrifices in behavior and diet - some of which can be detrimental . No a baby is n't the woman 's body - but a pregnancy IS .""",DISAGREE,"""that childs destiny to be born . thats just my thoughts""","""That 's really simplified . It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant .""",,
739,203,"""-- the old way does n't hold water .""","""What ? The understanding of HOX genes has n't actually changed the understanding of mutations to other genes . It has added an additional dimension . I 'm not sure what you mean by `` the old way , `` but an understanding of regulatory genes does not negate anything that went before . It only adds understanding . Sadly , you do n't seem to understand .""",DISAGREE,"""the old way does n't hold water .""","""It only adds understanding .""",,
746,204,"""Originally posted by gilligan8503 if i want to kill myself , i do n't fear it . you act like people have multiple personalities and can not control what the other is doing . if i choose to commit suicide , it 's all good . that is what i want . if someone shoots and kills me , i have not choice . you say you fear a fatty diet , but i bet you wo n't walk into a gang circle and XXXX them off . do it if you are so sure you do n't fear guns .""","""No I wo n't walk into that situation . What you feel to be right is OK with me . It is what you feel to be right and try to make it public policy is what I disagree with . You should fear yourself . YOU are a greater danger to yourself than a felon with a firearm . You have an extremely skewed sense of risk assement . I do n't expect to change your mind , after all I do n't expect to convince someone with an irrational fear of flying that it is safe . Want to kill yourself ? Sucide ? That is very irrational is n't it ?""",DISAGREE,"""i want to kill myself , shoots and kills me , i have not choice .""","""Want to kill yourself ? Sucide ? That is very irrational is n't it ?""",,
761,208,"""Yes , I do .""","""Well then present it and stop being stupid .""",DISAGREE,"""I do .""","""stop being stupid .""",,
765,209,"""In fact , scholars ( even non-Christian ) have brought back some of the Gospels to less than 7 or 8 years after Christ .""","""I believe the earliest gospel estimation is placed around 50 ad , which is almost 30 years after Jesus died .""",DISAGREE,"""have brought back some of the Gospels to less than 7 or 8 years after Christ .""","""I believe the earliest gospel estimation is placed around 50 ad , which is almost 30 years after Jesus died .""",,
784,213,"""The meticulously preserved , unchanging 66 Books of the Bible are n't compelling ?""","""Unchanging 66 books ? ? You mean that the 4 books that Martin Luthor rejected is n't a change .. Or the 80 odd books that are considered canon by the Ethopian Orthodox ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""The meticulously preserved , unchanging 66 Books of the Bible are n't compelling ?""","""Unchanging 66 books ? ? You mean that the 4 books that Martin Luthor rejected is n't a change .. Or the 80 odd books that are considered canon by the Ethopian Orthodox ? ?""",,
797,216,"""Catholics have a different belief . The goal is to always save both mother and child . If the fetus dies during the attempt to save both , then that 's what happens . For instance , with an ectopic pregnancy , the goal is n't to kill he fetus , the goal is to save both mother and fetus .""","""you told me in an earlier post that the mother should die , even if they predict the fetus will kill the mother . your bible states otherwise .""",DISAGREE,"""If the fetus dies during the attempt to save both , then that 's what happens .""","""if they predict the fetus will kill the mother . your bible states otherwise""",,
813,219,"""They are n't the same . the point is that a group that is fraught with immoral behavior has no crediblity or authority when it comes to dictating what people should or should not do on the basis of morality . Consider it this way : Bill Clinton speaking about how a boyfriend should act in accordance to fideilty . No one is going to believe him because has squandered all of his crediblitiy and authority . It 's the same way with the Catholic Church .""","""So , by your logic , if there 's a bad cop in New York , then all the cops in Boise , Idaho must be bad as well .""",DISAGREE,"""group that is fraught with immoral behavior has no crediblity or authority""","""by your logic , if there 's a bad cop in New York , then all the cops in Boise , Idaho must be bad as well""",,
815,219,"""They are n't the same . the point is that a group that is fraught with immoral behavior has no crediblity or authority when it comes to dictating what people should or should not do on the basis of morality . Consider it this way : Bill Clinton speaking about how a boyfriend should act in accordance to fideilty . No one is going to believe him because has squandered all of his crediblitiy and authority . It 's the same way with the Catholic Church .""","""So , by your logic , if there 's a bad cop in New York , then all the cops in Boise , Idaho must be bad as well .""",DISAGREE,"""They are n't the same . the point is that a group that is fraught""","""So , by your logic , if there 's a bad cop in New York""",,
819,220,"""Life is not gaining complexity or creating new informationÂ… .""","""Please define complexity . Please define information . Both definitions should be relevant to biology .""",DISAGREE,"""Life is not gaining complexity or creating new""","""Please define complexity . Please define information""",,
833,223,"""Does anyone know a pregnant woman who has `` demanded `` an abortion ? Why is this horrificly false phrase bandied about so carelessly and freely ? It shows a grave disrespect for women who are making painful , soul-searching decisions about pregnancy . Why this great disrespect for women in this position ?""","""You must have been watching the same sunday morning tv political talk show as I was semi-listening to this morning . Some pro-abortion woman went off on a tangent about the phrase `` abortion on demand `` . Would `` abortion for convienence `` be more accurate ?""",DISAGREE,"""woman who has `` demanded `` an abortion""","""pro-abortion woman went off on a tangent""",,
835,223,"""Does anyone know a pregnant woman who has `` demanded `` an abortion ? Why is this horrificly false phrase bandied about so carelessly and freely ? It shows a grave disrespect for women who are making painful , soul-searching decisions about pregnancy . Why this great disrespect for women in this position ?""","""You must have been watching the same sunday morning tv political talk show as I was semi-listening to this morning . Some pro-abortion woman went off on a tangent about the phrase `` abortion on demand `` . Would `` abortion for convienence `` be more accurate ?""",DISAGREE,"""Does anyone know a pregnant woman who has `` demanded `` an abortion ?""","""Some pro-abortion woman went off on a tangent about the phrase `` abortion on demand ``""",,
846,225,"""Explain to me how copying something is creating something new .""","""Read what i actually wrote for a change Yank .""",DISAGREE,"""how copying something is creating something new .""","""what i actually wrote for""",,
848,226,"""Last time I checked most state boards merely set the guidelines , whether or not they are followed is something entirely different . Still the fact that you have a board of education spouting such ridiculousness is pretty damn amusing .""","""The way it works in Kansas , the state board of education sets the guidelines and sends them out to all the school districts where they sit in a box in a closet somewhere . During much of the time when all this idiocy was going on , I was ON the local school board and had never once opened one of those books . We all knew they existed , and nearly half of us knew where ours were , it was just not something that anybody generally cares to look at . I would be shocked if you could find me 10 kids in the entire state who have ever read the state school boards definition of `` science `` or their guidelines . It is just not something that comes up . IMO , that is why this issue came up in kansas . Our state school board here has VERY little power or control , so nobody really pays attention to them . When the first set of changes occured , there was a lag of about 6 months before anybody even realized it and then it was somebody from the media .""",AGREE,"""time I state boards set the , whether or not they are followed is . that you have a board such""","""Kansas , the state board of education the guidelines and them to all school districts where they in a box in a closet . time I not that you have boards or . It is set""",,
851,226,"""Last time I checked most state boards merely set the guidelines , whether or not they are followed is something entirely different . Still the fact that you have a board of education spouting such ridiculousness is pretty damn amusing .""","""The way it works in Kansas , the state board of education sets the guidelines and sends them out to all the school districts where they sit in a box in a closet somewhere . During much of the time when all this idiocy was going on , I was ON the local school board and had never once opened one of those books . We all knew they existed , and nearly half of us knew where ours were , it was just not something that anybody generally cares to look at . I would be shocked if you could find me 10 kids in the entire state who have ever read the state school boards definition of `` science `` or their guidelines . It is just not something that comes up . IMO , that is why this issue came up in kansas . Our state school board here has VERY little power or control , so nobody really pays attention to them . When the first set of changes occured , there was a lag of about 6 months before anybody even realized it and then it was somebody from the media .""",AGREE,"""most state boards merely set the guidelines , whether or not they are followed is something entirely different""","""state board of education sets the guidelines and sends them out to all the school districts where they sit in a box in a closet somewhere""",,
853,226,"""Last time I checked most state boards merely set the guidelines , whether or not they are followed is something entirely different . Still the fact that you have a board of education spouting such ridiculousness is pretty damn amusing .""","""The way it works in Kansas , the state board of education sets the guidelines and sends them out to all the school districts where they sit in a box in a closet somewhere . During much of the time when all this idiocy was going on , I was ON the local school board and had never once opened one of those books . We all knew they existed , and nearly half of us knew where ours were , it was just not something that anybody generally cares to look at . I would be shocked if you could find me 10 kids in the entire state who have ever read the state school boards definition of `` science `` or their guidelines . It is just not something that comes up . IMO , that is why this issue came up in kansas . Our state school board here has VERY little power or control , so nobody really pays attention to them . When the first set of changes occured , there was a lag of about 6 months before anybody even realized it and then it was somebody from the media .""",AGREE,"""Last time I checked most state boards merely set the guidelines , whether or not they are followed is something entirely different .""","""The way it works in Kansas , the state board of education sets the guidelines and sends them out to all the school districts where they sit in a box in a closet somewhere .""",,
859,227,"""Most state constitutions that I have looked at expressly protect the right of the ballot initiative . We are , of course , limiting ourselves to state laws since the federal government has absolutely nothing to do with marriage .""","""That 's not quite true either . Federal laws grant many rights and privledges to married people . The feds may not have a say on who can get married , but there are federal laws that benefit married people .""",DISAGREE,"""We are , of course , limiting ourselves to state laws since the federal government has absolutely nothing to do with marriage .""","""The feds may not have a say on who can get married , but there are federal laws that benefit married people .""",,
868,229,"""ur definition of evolution is incorrect . if u go to any dictionary who would find that evolution by definition is a process of simple , basic things evolving or changing into complex structures in laymens term i guess [ ex . society , religion , government and language ] . what u seem to be defining is biological evolution . as for creationism ... I havent decided how i should define it . is it religion , science , idea , theory , or bs . there r many defintions . creationism use so many kinds of definition that there is no point 2 define it ... that and i have no idea . all the dictionary i 've seen r different and bias I 'm just trying to correct . sorry if i had offended u. btw colcletus next time u should be more specific , but i assume u meant biological evolution . oh yeah sorry if my definition sucks . i was in a hurry .""","""Well , you have proven yoruself to be a man with no brain , that is for sure . The definition that was given was the one that scientists use , not the layperson .""",DISAGREE,"""is a process of simple , basic things evolving or changing into complex structures in laymens term""","""not the layperson .""",,
877,230,"""# There were 7,387 black homicide victims in the United States . Of these , 6,345 ( 86 percent ) were male , and 1,042 ( 14 percent ) were female . # The homicide rate for black victims in the United States was 20.86 per 100,000 . In comparison , the overall national homicide rate was 5.30 per 100,000 and the national homicide rate for whites was 3.11 per 100,000 . # For homicides in which the weapon used could be identified , 82 percent of black victims ( 5,743 out of 7,011 ) were killed with guns . Of these , 73 percent ( 4,204 victims ) were killed with handguns . There were 701 victims killed with knives or other cutting instruments , 247 victims killed by bodily force , and 200 victims killed by a blunt object . Hes betrayed his own people !""","""OMG Brady , he betrayed HIS PEOPLE ? and I thought WE THE PEOPLE were his people .""",DISAGREE,"""his own people !""","""thought WE THE PEOPLE were his people .""",,
884,239,"""3 ) Of course if you throw out morality as a basis for law , there & # 8217 ; s no reason , other than economics , to not allow gay marriage .""","""Well good at least you are aware there is no reason beyond your opinion of morality against gay marriage . So by all means do n't marry a man and the problem is solved .""",DISAGREE,"""if you throw out morality as a basis for law , there s no reason to not allow gay marriage .""","""at least you are aware there is no reason beyond your opinion of morality against gay marriage . So by all means do n't marry a man and the problem is solved .""",,
889,239,"""3 ) Of course if you throw out morality as a basis for law , there & # 8217 ; s no reason , other than economics , to not allow gay marriage .""","""Well good at least you are aware there is no reason beyond your opinion of morality against gay marriage . So by all means do n't marry a man and the problem is solved .""",DISAGREE,"""Of course if you throw out morality as a basis for law , there s no reason , other than economics , to not allow gay marriage .""","""Well good at least you are aware there is no reason beyond your opinion of morality against gay marriage .""",,
894,240,"""spoken as a true loony lead for brains gun crazy Thank you for proving me right""","""Just trying to help out where I can , and if it proves you right well that makes a first time huh ? Sarge its a first ! !""",DISAGREE,"""spoken as a true loony lead for brains gun crazy Thank you for proving me right""","""Just trying to help out where I can ,""",,
903,242,"""What you 're saying , in effect , is that if there are three naughty children in a class and only one of them gets punished , he ca n't actually have been naughty , because if he had , the other two would have been punished too .""","""No , I ’ m saying all three of them could have been naughty , but the other two were teachers pets . Let ’ s name the children , let ’ s call the one who was punished ~ID~ , and we ’ ll call the first of the two pets ~atheistic evolution~ and we ’ ll call the other unpunished one ~global warming~ . AE and GW have influential parents , they attend a lot of PTA meetings , and have influence on how the teacher is paid , or if the teacher is fired .""",DISAGREE,"""if there are three naughty children in a class and only one of them gets punished , he ca n't , the other two would have been punished too .""","""have been naughty , but the other two were teachers pets have influential parents , they attend a lot of PTA meetings , and have influence on how the teacher is paid , or if the teacher is fired .""",,
909,243,"""Habbit , I would be more than happy to debate you , unfortunately you do n't quite yet have a grasp on the meaning of the word .""","""k , but what does my name have the current discussion ?""",DISAGREE,"""I would be more than happy to debate you , unfortunately you do n't quite yet have a grasp on the meaning of the word .""","""but what does my name have the current discussion ?""",,
907,243,"""Habbit , I would be more than happy to debate you , unfortunately you do n't quite yet have a grasp on the meaning of the word .""","""k , but what does my name have the current discussion ?""",DISAGREE,"""I would be more than happy to debate you , unfortunately you do n't quite yet have a grasp on the meaning of the word .""","""but what does my name have the current discussion ?""",,
922,245,"""Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor , it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE wo n't mistake for the real thing . [ 1 ]""","""So that ’ s a problem of  “ fundamentalism ” , and not a problem with the one creating the  “ parody ” ? Apparently the creation of parodies for  “ fundamentalism ” is a large part of atheism .""",DISAGREE,"""Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor , it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism""","""So that ’ s a problem of  fundamentalism , and not a problem with the one creating the  parody ?""",,
941,248,"""Everything on Earth follows a logical , sensible , and rational order , and I think that it is in this order that God rules and for him to break it would be to break his own laws . the laws he gave this Earth .""","""No , that is not true . What about miracles ?""",DISAGREE,"""God rules and for him to break it would be to break his own laws""","""that is not true""",,
943,249,"""And your point is , Mr . I Am What 's Right ?""","""I do n't know what point he was trying to make , but if the best you can do in liberal NYC is squeak out 51 % support , then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally .""",DISAGREE,"""And your point is , Mr . I Am What 's Right ?""","""I do n't know what point he was trying to make , but if the best you can do in liberal NYC is squeak out 51 % support , then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally .""",,
945,249,"""And your point is , Mr . I Am What 's Right ?""","""I do n't know what point he was trying to make , but if the best you can do in liberal NYC is squeak out 51 % support , then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally .""",DISAGREE,"""is ,""","""then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally .""",,
946,249,"""And your point is , Mr . I Am What 's Right ?""","""I do n't know what point he was trying to make , but if the best you can do in liberal NYC is squeak out 51 % support , then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally .""",DISAGREE,"""point""","""then gay marriage does n't have a chance nationally""",,
947,250,"""ADF : NH gov 's proposed revisions to marriage redefinition bill fail religious freedom test - Alliance Defense Fund - Defending Our First Liberty And there it is ... The repeated demand from the anti-gay for SPECIAL PRIVILEGES for the `` religious `` detractors . I fully support CHURCHES and PASTORS from being exempt , but it 's not necessary . Currently , our RELIGIOUS discrimination protection is much stronger than our gay discrimination protection , but do you see churches being forced to perform inter-religion marriage if the church doctrine is against it ? NO ! Do you see atheists saying `` I like the look of this church . I do n't belong , but I 'm going to force you to rent the church for my wedding party anyways. `` ? ? NO ! The existing language and constitutional protections are good enough . But when given more explicit ( redundant ) wording , what do the anti-gay marriage organizations demand ? Something NO GROUP HAS EVER HAD before . They want BUSINESS OWNERS to be free to discriminate if they have `` religious objections `` ... What if their objections are NON-religious in nature ? Why is the religion supposed to get the special perk ? ? ? And as mentioned , NO GROUP HAS EVER HAD this . There were plenty of religious interpretations against black equality and interracial marriage . But did we give THEM special privilege to ignore and discriminate against interracial marriages ? NO ! The really refreshing part of all this ? These whiny temper tantrums just do n't matter ... If the NH legislature includes the religious exceptions ( if they are just reconfirming that churches / pastors do n't have to perform ceremonies they do n't want to ) , then the governor WILL sign it .""","""This all comes down to fear of retribution from gay people . They know that they have been the leading cause of our oppression , they know that the tide and culture is turning in our favor . Sometimes the oppressor finds in a minority it oppress a mirror of itself . They think it is right to oppress us and see can not see that we have no interest in oppressing them or even revenge for the oppression .""",AGREE,"""Defending Our First Liberty And there it is ... The repeated demand from the anti-gay for SPECIAL PRIVILEGES""","""Sometimes the oppressor finds in a minority it oppress a mirror of itself .""",,
956,252,"""If there is a such thing , why does the protection stop after a time ? This ? intellectual property ? is not the same as property , real or otherwise .""","""You question whether intellectual property exists ? It is really property . It is a field of law . Studied at Berkley http : //www.law.berkeley.edu/institut ... 2/ipintro.html and at Columbus http : //faculty.cua.edu/fischer/Intro ... /IP % 20Home.htm In part regulated by Copyright http : //www.copyright.gov/ legislated around the world http : //www.worldlii.org/catalog/2296.html It is most strange that you do n't 'believe ' that it exists . It is just as real , in law as any other form of property , though it is not 'real property ' .""",DISAGREE,"""If there is a such thing , why does the protection stop after a time ? This ? intellectual property ? is not the same as property , real or otherwise .""","""It is just as real , in law as any other form of property , though it is not 'real property ' .""",,
966,261,"""Finally .. we have the biggest error of all . I 've bolded the part that destroys everything .""","""Including the universe ?""",AGREE,"""I 've bolded the part that destroys everything .""","""Including the ?""",,
968,261,"""Finally .. we have the biggest error of all . I 've bolded the part that destroys everything .""","""Including the universe ?""",AGREE,"""we have the biggest error of all part that destroys everything""","""Including the universe ?""",,
969,261,"""Finally .. we have the biggest error of all . I 've bolded the part that destroys everything .""","""Including the universe ?""",AGREE,"""have the biggest error of all . I 've bolded the part that destroys everything""","""Including the universe""",,
972,262,"""There is one shred , that life exists . There is not a shred of evidence that life came into being by only natural processes .""","""So god is unnatural ?""",DISAGREE,"""There is one shred , that life evidence that life came into being""","""So god is unnatural ?""",,
973,262,"""There is one shred , that life exists . There is not a shred of evidence that life came into being by only natural processes .""","""So god is unnatural ?""",DISAGREE,"""not a shred of evidence that life came into being by only natural processes""","""So god is unnatural""",,
997,268,"""Ok . But they have handcuffs on and are in a straitjacket . They are required by law to make certain assumptions that do n't pass a straight-face test . They 're required by law to assume that Congress is going to do everything they say they 're going to do despite the fact that there 's clear and compelling evidence that they never have and they probably never will in certain regards . For example , you know , cutting provider reimbursements dramatically . Well , all right , do n't hold your breath . And so the fact is , I think , technically the numbers add up to say it will reduce the deficit over ten years and even beyond that . I think based on realistic assumptions , no way .""","""I shoulda worked for this guy when I had the chance . He goes on to say that Bush was the most fiscally irresponsible president we have had ... but Obama is threatening that title . This is something I have repeatedly said !""",DISAGREE,"""They 're required by law to assume that Congress is going to do everything they say""","""He goes on to say that Bush was the most fiscally irresponsible president we have had""",,
1004,269,"""... and be used to try innocent people in a court of law .""","""You lost me there . Try them how and for what ?""",DISAGREE,"""be used to try innocent people in a court of law .""","""Try them how and for what ?""",,
1010,270,"""As the proud father of an adopted child , I am thankful every day that forty years ago , a sixteen year old girl had the courage to make the right decision . Dono""","""Shazaam ! You were n't kidding in another thread when you said `` us old geezers `` were you ?""",AGREE,"""As the proud father of an adopted child , a sixteen year old girl had the courage to make the right decision""","""were you ?""",,
1009,270,"""As the proud father of an adopted child , I am thankful every day that forty years ago , a sixteen year old girl had the courage to make the right decision . Dono""","""Shazaam ! You were n't kidding in another thread when you said `` us old geezers `` were you ?""",AGREE,"""As the proud father of an adopted child ,""","""us old geezers ``""",,
1028,273,"""What if you kill them before they kill you ? Good luck arguing to that one !""","""So I have the choice between staying safe and then claiming insurance damages , or risking my life to kill a burglar and ( likely ) cause damage to my own property in the process ? Somehow , I 'd rather stay safe . Better to lose my laptop than my life .""",DISAGREE,"""What if you kill them before they kill you ? Good luck arguing to that one !""","""my life to kill a burglar and ( likely ) cause damage to my own property in the process ? Somehow , I 'd rather stay safe . Better to lose my laptop than my life .""",,
1040,286,"""I 'm developing a theory about communication ... the form of communication requiring the least thinking ( for yourself ? ) is insult . What do you guys think ?""","""I disagree , it depends on the nature of insult . '' You suck ! What kind of a dumb name is 'Robbie ' anyway ? `` Hardly requires a stretching of the old grey matter . But the snappy one-liner and the witty retort , or just a carefully crafted insult all require a fair amount of intelligence and insight . Flat out denial requires least thought . I.e . '' you 're wrong ! '' , `` you 're wrong 'cos God says so ! `` '' You 're wrong 'cos Dawkins says so !""",DISAGREE,"""the form of communication requiring the least thinking ( for yourself ? ) is insult .""","""a carefully crafted insult all require a fair amount of intelligence and insight .""",,
1053,289,"""Or another example of how denying homosexuals access access to anything but the same legal institutions as heterosexuals will never result in equality . The domestic partner registry just is n't sufficient ; why would anyone think that creating a similar marriage-substitute will be equal ?""","""There 's nothing magical in the word `` marriage. `` Just because one is called that does n't mean it 's any more legally superior than a `` marriage substitute `` ( as you call it ) . Splenda may not be called `` sugar `` , but at the end of the day ( or should I say the morning ) it still does just as good of a job sweetening the coffee . They 're both sweetners . Why should we change the composition of sugar just so you can say the sweetner-composition YOU want is termed 'sugar ? '""",DISAGREE,"""Or another example of how denying homosexuals access access to anything but the same legal institutions as heterosexuals will never result in equality .""","""YOU want is termed 'sugar ? '""",,
1054,290,"""Because the article mentioned quite a bit about the observations that he was conducting . These are very important in the scientific method .""","""The article said very little about his observations and almost nothing about his methods .""",DISAGREE,"""Because the article mentioned quite a bit about the observations that he was conducting . These are very important in the scientific method .""","""article said very little about his observations and almost nothing about his""",,
1058,290,"""Because the article mentioned quite a bit about the observations that he was conducting . These are very important in the scientific method .""","""The article said very little about his observations and almost nothing about his methods .""",DISAGREE,"""the article mentioned quite a bit about the observations""","""The article said very little about his observations""",,
1064,292,"""You are joking right ?""","""Must be getting about time to drag out the old car and five gallon bucket routine again , since far more kids die that way , and since we are talking toy guns we will go with unintentional deaths . Think it will get it across to him , or any of them ? United States Child Mortality , 2003 Number and Rate of Child Deaths , per 100,000 Population ( 2003 ) Total Child Population Number of Child Deaths Child Mortality Rate ( Ages 0-19 ) 81,216,385 53,539 65.9 Infant Mortality Number and Rate , per 1,000 Live Births ( 2003 ) Number of Live Births Number of Infant Deaths Infant Mortality Rate ( Ages 0-1 ) 4,089,950 28,025 6.9 Selected Causes of Death , Ages 0-19 , per 100,000 Population ( 2003 ) Cause Number of Deaths Mortality Rate Natural 36,364 44.8 Perinatal Conditions 14,364 17.7 Congenital Anomalies 6,771 8.3 Neoplasms 2,466 3.0 Respiratory Disease 1,625 2.0 Circulatory Disease 1,713 2.1 Nervous System Disease 1,626 2.0 SIDS 2,162 2.7 Unintentional Injury 12,035 14.8 Motor Vehicle 7,677 9.5 Drowning 1,062 1.3 Fire/Burn 551 0.7 Poisoning 650 0.8 Suffocation/Strangulation 910 1.1 Firearm 151 0.2 Homicide 3,001 3.7 Firearm 1,844 2.3 Suicide 1,737 2.1 Firearm 810 1.0 Suffocation/Strangulation 724 0.9 Poisoning 112 0.1""",DISAGREE,"""You are joking right ?""","""Must be getting about time to drag out the old car and five gallon bucket routine again , since far more kids die that way , and since we are talking toy guns we will go with unintentional deaths .""",,
1099,299,"""Why in the name of god would you discuss acceptable reasons for domestic ownership of guns in a conference about curtailing illegal international gun trafficking ? The two are entirely unrelated . I seldom hear of people discussing the benifits of marriage during rape prevention seminars . While the two are concievably related , they are entirely seperate topics .""","""Is that what you said right before they started banning assault weapons ? 'Oh , let 's just see what Sarah Brady wants to do ? ' Obviously , you 're gullible . Since you 're such a brainiac and all , why do n't you visit the UN website and see what your beloved UN is up to ? And again , read this slower this time ( if that helps ) 'On the other hand , not one acceptable reason for individuals owning guns is mentioned . '""",DISAGREE,"""While the two are concievably related , they are entirely seperate topics .""","""not one acceptable reason for individuals owning guns is mentioned . '""",,
1107,300,"""Even better were does it say that evolution is proven ?""","""In the thousands of scientific papers that present the thousands of bits of evidence that go to prove evolution beyond all sensible sane and reasonable doubt .""",DISAGREE,"""Even better were does it say that evolution is proven ?""","""In the thousands of scientific papers that present the thousands of bits of evidence""",,
1110,301,"""I wonder if those who would use abortion to euthanize certain babies would also support euthanization of others who live outside of the womb .""","""Wonder what `` euthanization `` is . Never heard of it before , and neither has the dictionary .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion to euthanize certain babies would also support euthanization""","""Never heard of it before , and neither has the dictionary""",,
1125,310,"""Oh I do n't doubt the medical establishment talks the talk occasionally , they just do n't walk the walk . They do n't treat their patients with a method that corresponds to those things you just mentioned .""","""Utter XXXX . Doctors will regularly provide advice on lifestyle changes to those at risk of a variety of diseases and conditions , contact information as to where they can find support in making those lifestyle changes , and if appropriate refer them to psychologists to assist them in making those changes . Dentists will give long lectures on the evils of eating sugar and suggest appropriate snack replacements for sugary foods . What else does `` walking the walk `` entail ? Should the `` medical establishment `` follow their patients around and forcibly prevent them from having a lifestyle they believe to be harmful ?""",DISAGREE,"""Oh I do n't doubt the medical establishment talks the talk occasionally , they just do n't walk the walk . They do n't treat their patients with a method that corresponds to those things you just mentioned .""","""Utter XXXX . Doctors will regularly provide advice on lifestyle changes to those at risk of a variety of diseases and conditions , contact information as to where they can find support in making those lifestyle changes , and if appropriate refer them to psychologists to assist them in making those changes""",,
1130,311,"""Come on JP really . So what happens when opportunity is not equal ? What is the point of doing anything to solve a problem if there is a disregard for achieving measurable results . The whole point of creating an equal opportunity is to correct an imbalance . What type of results , if any , would be acceptable ? I did n't say the government is always right or the intended goals are always achieved . That is our fault for putting people in government with the intelligence of carpet and then allowing them to stay .""","""It ’ s not my responsibility to ease job requirements so that an underachiever can reap the same rewards as an achiever . That ’ s not my idea of equality .""",DISAGREE,"""What is the point of doing anything to solve a problem if there is a disregard for achieving measurable results .""","""job requirements so that an underachiever can reap the same rewards as an achiever . not my idea of equality""",,
1144,314,"""let 's take a look at a non-biblical God , then . if such a God exists , what is his definition . can he interact with the physical realm ?""","""Well , your typical diety is generally immortal , omnipotent or nearly so , all knowing or nearly so , and concerned with humanity in some way . Creating the universe is a bonus , but not required . They 're all described as living outside the world , but being able to interact with it . Whatever their relationship with our universe is , it 's clearly outside the realm of science as we know it . What does this mean in terms of proving their existence ? Since their interactions with us are outside the realm of science , science ca n't really say anything unless the dieties in question specifically choose to interact with us in a way which science could verify . That is to say , the existence of any God ca n't be proven against that God 's will , but I believe that if a diety wanted to have it 's existence known than it would certainly be able to do so .""",DISAGREE,"""if such a God exists , can he interact with the physical realm ?""","""science ca n't really say anything unless the dieties in question specifically choose to interact with us in a way which science could verify""",,
1152,315,"""I agree with you -- there is a definite need to meet the needs of gay people as well as married people . We need to find ways to meet everyone 's need regardless . But this is n't a marriage issue , it 's a issue of meeting people 's needs regardless of marital status . IOW , the bottom line is that marriage should n't even be a prerequisite for people getting aid in such a case as this . In such awful tragedy , it should n't matter whether someone is marred or not .""","""So how come you automatically qualify and we do n't ? What makes you better than us ?""",DISAGREE,"""I agree with you -- there is a definite need to meet the needs of gay""","""So how come you automatically qualify and we do n't ? What makes you better than us ?""",,
1175,319,"""I agree as well . Urban Hot Islands are not a big deal . Of course they will be warmer ( more energy , lighting , etc ) but that does not mean the Earth will suffer catastrophic climate change .. only in movies .""","""Here here !""",AGREE,"""I agree as well . Urban Hot Islands are not a big deal . Of course they will be warmer ( more energy , lighting , etc ) but that does not mean the Earth will suffer catastrophic climate change .. only in movies .""","""Here here !""",,
1181,320,"""For bringing health care to women without the means ? For providing Pap Smears , Mammograms , and birth control for women without the means ? Providiing pre-natal , and post-natal care ? Oh , heck , let the women die of breast cancer and uterine cancer""","""No , for murdering innocent babies in the womb by performing abortions that were not necessary but just being done as a means of birth control .........""",DISAGREE,"""For providing Pap Smears , Mammograms , and birth control for women without the means""","""for murdering innocent babies in the womb by performing abortions""",,
1184,320,"""For bringing health care to women without the means ? For providing Pap Smears , Mammograms , and birth control for women without the means ? Providiing pre-natal , and post-natal care ? Oh , heck , let the women die of breast cancer and uterine cancer""","""No , for murdering innocent babies in the womb by performing abortions that were not necessary but just being done as a means of birth control .........""",DISAGREE,"""For providing Pap Smears , Mammograms , and birth control for women without the means ?""","""No , for murdering innocent babies in the womb by performing abortions""",,
1188,321,"""Now why are Americans fat , there 's a good question .""","""And one for another topic . I 'm curious as to how people on here can claim that the American health care system is the cheapest , most efficient , economical model ( and overall `` best `` option ) given the stats presented above .""",AGREE,"""why are Americans fat , there 's a good question .""","""And one for another topic""",,
1193,322,"""Even if it was just a clump of cells ( I can hear this one coming ) in the beginning , the fact is , in the end it will most likely be a live human being and that is n't changed by it 's alleged `` clump of cells in the beginning `` status .""","""Just because a clump if cell will develope into a live human being does n't mean the mother is obligated to let it happen in her body whether she want it to or not . If that bothers you then STOP DWELLING ON IT .""",DISAGREE,"""it will most likely be a live human being and that is n't changed by it 's alleged `` clump of cells in the beginning `` status .""","""Just because a clump if cell will develope into a live human being does n't mean the mother is obligated to let it happen in her body whether she want it to or not .""",,
1221,344,"""Nine months of discomfort is nothing compared to life in prison for voluntary manslaughter !""","""Spoken like a true man .""",DISAGREE,"""Nine months discomfort prison""","""true man""",,
1253,361,"""Have you lost your mind ? I got no idea what you are talking about .""","""deliberate acts of fabrication to produce false and fradulent claims as to what others have said . You cited my posts which did not imply anything of the sort you claimed it did and what I thought . In fact , some of the cited refute such claims .""",DISAGREE,"""Have you lost your mind ? I got no idea what you are talking about .""","""deliberate acts of fabrication to produce false and fradulent claims as to what others have said .""",,
1263,363,"""It disproves climate change about as well as Piltdown man disproves evolution .""","""Agreed , which tells me that spending $ Trillions on an uncertainty of this magnitude has to be driven by alterior motives .""",AGREE,"""It disproves climate change about as well as Piltdown man disproves evolution .""","""Agreed""",,
1268,365,"""Originally posted by kelvin90701 `` Canada , Australia , and New Zealand all have many guns ( though not nearly as many handguns as does the United States ) . The key difference is that these countries do a much better job than we do of keeping guns out of the wrong hands . Their experience shows that when there are reasonable restrictions , relatively few outlaws can possess or use guns. `` - http : //www.vahv.org/NEJM-ed.html I am 100 % in favor of outlaws not having guns . If you have not noticed , 3 groups of people can not have guns in this country . 1 ) The insane 2 ) Criminals 3 ) Domestic violence perps It is currently illegal for outlaws to have guns . Passing another law will just make outlaws `` double-lly `` illegal . NO MORE LAWS are need . ENFORCEMENT of current laws is what is needed . If law # 1 is not enforced , what makes you think law # 2 will be enforced ?""","""Well if you 're going to quote that article that mentions Canada to support your opinion , then does that mean you 're in favor of gun registration and licensing ? Canada has them . And if the NRA is really interested in enforcing laws why do they ask congress to reduce the budget of law enforcement ? The NRA uses its political muscle to make it easier for criminals to obtain guns . Robert Ricker , former top lawyer of the NRA , talks about it .""",DISAGREE,"""ENFORCEMENT of current laws is what is needed""","""if the NRA is really interested in enforcing laws why do they ask to reduce the budget""",,
1280,368,"""Alright , I 'll accept your term of punish . If you did n't fully understand what I was trying to say in my last post , here is a quick run down of it . Abortion = Punish Child If God is good he would n't punish an aborted child Therefore an aborted child will go to heaven If this were not true then God would be punishing the child . I hope this is clear .""","""What I am trying to point out is that it seemed like you jumped from the term `` punish `` to accusing me of not believing that God would take an aborted child to Heaven . It did n't seem like a logical jump . I know what you meant , but I did n't see the connection .""",DISAGREE,"""I hope this is clear .""","""I know what you meant , but I did n't see the connection""",,
1287,369,"""It is called being diplomatic . I hope you do n't find out why I have to choose my words with such care . The spanish inquistion used to shove a towel all the way down peoples throats wet it so it woud expand and then pull it out . They certainly tortured people at the drop of a hat however maybe they were not that upset by the heliocentric model specifically maybe it was because some people supporting the heliocentric model claimed the concept of life elsewhere .""","""People make mistakes ( excepting some pro-evolutionists who respond with anger and blame others of 'twisting their words ' . )""",DISAGREE,"""The spanish inquistion used to shove a towel all the way down peoples throats wet it so it woud expand and then pull it out .""","""People make mistakes""",,
1288,370,"""Well they had to be ready to kill at a moments notice ... god could call for it to take care of all the nonbelivers .""","""Yes Chrstians should be disarmed so the `` moral `` atheists , humanists , pagans who crucified people should rule over us . . . that would give everyone a warm fuzy feeling inside . Matt 26 : 1 And it happened , when Jesus finished all these sayings , He said to His disciples , 2 You know that the Passover is coming after two days , and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified . Of course there are valid reasons why Christ armed His men . Romans 13 : 1 Let every soul be subject to higher authorities , for there is no authority except from God , but the existing authorities have been ordained by God . 2 So that the one resisting authority has opposed the ordinance of God , and the ones opposing will receive judgment to themselves . 3 For the rulers are not a terror to good works , but to the bad . And do you desire not to fear the authority ? Do the good , and you will have praise from it ; 4 for it is a servant of God to you for the good . But if you practice evil , be afraid ; for he does not bear the sword in vain ; for he is a servant of God , an avenger for wrath to the one practicing evil . 5 Because of this , it is necessary to be subject , not only on account of wrath , but also on account of conscience . 6 For on this account you also pay taxes , for they are ministers of God , always giving attention to this very thing . 7 Then give to all their dues : to the one due tax , the tax ; to the one due tribute , the tribute ; to the one due fear , the fear ; to the one due honor , the honor . Luke 11 : 21 When the strong one , having been armed , guards his dwelling , his goods are in peace . 22 But as soon as one stronger than he comes , he overcomes him ; he takes away his armor on which he relied , and deals out his arms . '' a moments notice ... `` Well it appears the guaranteed scheduled time is on the day of judgment . Luke 19 : 27 But these enemies of mine , those not desiring me to reign over them , bring them here and execute them before me .""",DISAGREE,"""they had to be ready to kill at a moments notice ... god could call for it to take care of all the nonbelivers .""","""Chrstians should be disarmed so the `` moral `` atheists , humanists , pagans who crucified people should rule over us""",,
1291,370,"""Well they had to be ready to kill at a moments notice ... god could call for it to take care of all the nonbelivers .""","""Yes Chrstians should be disarmed so the `` moral `` atheists , humanists , pagans who crucified people should rule over us . . . that would give everyone a warm fuzy feeling inside . Matt 26 : 1 And it happened , when Jesus finished all these sayings , He said to His disciples , 2 You know that the Passover is coming after two days , and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified . Of course there are valid reasons why Christ armed His men . Romans 13 : 1 Let every soul be subject to higher authorities , for there is no authority except from God , but the existing authorities have been ordained by God . 2 So that the one resisting authority has opposed the ordinance of God , and the ones opposing will receive judgment to themselves . 3 For the rulers are not a terror to good works , but to the bad . And do you desire not to fear the authority ? Do the good , and you will have praise from it ; 4 for it is a servant of God to you for the good . But if you practice evil , be afraid ; for he does not bear the sword in vain ; for he is a servant of God , an avenger for wrath to the one practicing evil . 5 Because of this , it is necessary to be subject , not only on account of wrath , but also on account of conscience . 6 For on this account you also pay taxes , for they are ministers of God , always giving attention to this very thing . 7 Then give to all their dues : to the one due tax , the tax ; to the one due tribute , the tribute ; to the one due fear , the fear ; to the one due honor , the honor . Luke 11 : 21 When the strong one , having been armed , guards his dwelling , his goods are in peace . 22 But as soon as one stronger than he comes , he overcomes him ; he takes away his armor on which he relied , and deals out his arms . '' a moments notice ... `` Well it appears the guaranteed scheduled time is on the day of judgment . Luke 19 : 27 But these enemies of mine , those not desiring me to reign over them , bring them here and execute them before me .""",DISAGREE,"""Well they had to be ready to kill at a moments notice ... god could call for it to take care of all the nonbelivers .""","""Yes Chrstians should be disarmed so the `` moral `` atheists , humanists , pagans who crucified people should rule over us .""",,
1311,377,"""A pistol-packing , 80-year-old Bronx man was arrested on gun charges after he tried to turn the tables on a mugger who beat him and stole his Social Security money , authorities said yesterday . Feisty Lester Campbell - a retired security guard who cops said was carrying a hidden , unlicensed .38-caliber handgun - cashed his $ 262 Social Security check near his home on East 139th Street in Mott Haven at 10 a.m. Monday .""","""11/30/03 Some undesirable consequences of New York City 's gun control laws Gee Wiz Brady , now you are reaching all the way back to 2003 ? You are indeed a strange bird !""",DISAGREE,"""80-year-old Bronx man was arrested on gun charges""","""Some undesirable consequences of New York City 's gun control laws""",,
1313,377,"""A pistol-packing , 80-year-old Bronx man was arrested on gun charges after he tried to turn the tables on a mugger who beat him and stole his Social Security money , authorities said yesterday . Feisty Lester Campbell - a retired security guard who cops said was carrying a hidden , unlicensed .38-caliber handgun - cashed his $ 262 Social Security check near his home on East 139th Street in Mott Haven at 10 a.m. Monday .""","""11/30/03 Some undesirable consequences of New York City 's gun control laws Gee Wiz Brady , now you are reaching all the way back to 2003 ? You are indeed a strange bird !""",DISAGREE,"""pistol-packing , 80-year-old Bronx man was arrested on gun charges after he tried to turn the tables on a mugger who beat him and stole his Social Security money""","""undesirable consequences of New York City 's gun control laws Gee Wiz Brady , now you are reaching all the way back""",,
1323,380,"""They both like to indoctrinate the young . That was the point .""","""And where exactly is your proof that `` Stop , do n't touch , leave the area , tell an adult `` is indoctrination and translates to `` go out and buy a gun , buy as many guns as possible , obsess over the gun , etc. ``""",DISAGREE,"""They both like to indoctrinate the young . That was the point .""","""And where exactly is your proof that `` Stop , do n't touch , leave the area , tell an adult `` is indoctrination and translates to `` go out and buy a gun , buy as many guns as possible , obsess over the gun , etc. ``""",,
1335,382,"""That ’ s why today , after what happened to George Tiller , I know that the only thing that will assuage my personal grief over his shocking loss is for leaders across our nation to join me in expressing outrage at this heinous crime , this domestic terrorism . And yes , they need to call it out in exactly those terms . That ’ s what it is . I want to hear massive outrage on the part of the community . I want it to start with President Obama . His statement today is a good beginning . But that ’ s not nearly enough . He must immediately outline an action plan to increase federal protection for providers and clinics and call for stringent enforcement of the Federal Access to Clinic Entrances Act . He has an opportunity to make a speech that addresses women ’ s moral right to reproductive self-determination as passionately as his brilliant speech about race did during the primary . He can and should lead the nation to a larger and more productive conversation about the complex choices women make , and why women deserve the respect , equality and justice inherent in the right to choose to have , or not have , a child . He should bring together pro-choice and anti-choice leaders and get them to issue a joint statement decrying Tiller ’ s murder as well as all such violent opposition to one another ’ s efforts . Now that would be real common ground . .... The silence overall from leaders so far has been deafening , as attorney and longtime Arizona volunteer for reproductive rights causes Leon Silver pointed out . And if our leaders remain silent , I can tell you with perfect assurance what will happen next . There will be more violence . Dr. Tiller ’ s friends , family , patients , colleagues and the many pro-choice activists who have supported him over the years need the vigil in Wichita and those springing up elsewhere to mourn the 67-year-old doctor ’ s death and celebrate his exceptional life . The larger community of reproductive health professionals and activists , including those who bravely escort women safely into and out of health facilities for abortions , need to cry and hug and lift one another up on the wings of their convictions that they are doing God ’ s work , saving women ’ s lives in the fullest sense of the word . I am with them in spirit . But when it comes to changing a culture that has marginalized abortion by shaming women and hounding , even murdering , the doctors and clinic staff who provide safe abortions , when it comes to changing a culture bent on shaming women who are , in all good conscience , making the most moral of personal decisions -- candlelight vigils alone will never be enough .""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils | Salon Life""",AGREE,"""Dr. Tiller ’ s friends , family , patients , colleagues and the many pro-choice activists who have supported him over the years need the vigil in Wichita and those springing up elsewhere""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils | Salon Life""",,
1337,382,"""That ’ s why today , after what happened to George Tiller , I know that the only thing that will assuage my personal grief over his shocking loss is for leaders across our nation to join me in expressing outrage at this heinous crime , this domestic terrorism . And yes , they need to call it out in exactly those terms . That ’ s what it is . I want to hear massive outrage on the part of the community . I want it to start with President Obama . His statement today is a good beginning . But that ’ s not nearly enough . He must immediately outline an action plan to increase federal protection for providers and clinics and call for stringent enforcement of the Federal Access to Clinic Entrances Act . He has an opportunity to make a speech that addresses women ’ s moral right to reproductive self-determination as passionately as his brilliant speech about race did during the primary . He can and should lead the nation to a larger and more productive conversation about the complex choices women make , and why women deserve the respect , equality and justice inherent in the right to choose to have , or not have , a child . He should bring together pro-choice and anti-choice leaders and get them to issue a joint statement decrying Tiller ’ s murder as well as all such violent opposition to one another ’ s efforts . Now that would be real common ground . .... The silence overall from leaders so far has been deafening , as attorney and longtime Arizona volunteer for reproductive rights causes Leon Silver pointed out . And if our leaders remain silent , I can tell you with perfect assurance what will happen next . There will be more violence . Dr. Tiller ’ s friends , family , patients , colleagues and the many pro-choice activists who have supported him over the years need the vigil in Wichita and those springing up elsewhere to mourn the 67-year-old doctor ’ s death and celebrate his exceptional life . The larger community of reproductive health professionals and activists , including those who bravely escort women safely into and out of health facilities for abortions , need to cry and hug and lift one another up on the wings of their convictions that they are doing God ’ s work , saving women ’ s lives in the fullest sense of the word . I am with them in spirit . But when it comes to changing a culture that has marginalized abortion by shaming women and hounding , even murdering , the doctors and clinic staff who provide safe abortions , when it comes to changing a culture bent on shaming women who are , in all good conscience , making the most moral of personal decisions -- candlelight vigils alone will never be enough .""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils | Salon Life""",AGREE,"""That ’ s why today , after what happened to George Tiller , I know that the only thing that will assuage my personal grief over his shocking loss is for leaders across our nation to join me in expressing outrage at this heinous crime , this domestic terrorism . And yes , they need to call it out in exactly those terms . That ’ s what it""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils | Salon Life""",,
1339,382,"""That ’ s why today , after what happened to George Tiller , I know that the only thing that will assuage my personal grief over his shocking loss is for leaders across our nation to join me in expressing outrage at this heinous crime , this domestic terrorism . And yes , they need to call it out in exactly those terms . That ’ s what it is . I want to hear massive outrage on the part of the community . I want it to start with President Obama . His statement today is a good beginning . But that ’ s not nearly enough . He must immediately outline an action plan to increase federal protection for providers and clinics and call for stringent enforcement of the Federal Access to Clinic Entrances Act . He has an opportunity to make a speech that addresses women ’ s moral right to reproductive self-determination as passionately as his brilliant speech about race did during the primary . He can and should lead the nation to a larger and more productive conversation about the complex choices women make , and why women deserve the respect , equality and justice inherent in the right to choose to have , or not have , a child . He should bring together pro-choice and anti-choice leaders and get them to issue a joint statement decrying Tiller ’ s murder as well as all such violent opposition to one another ’ s efforts . Now that would be real common ground . .... The silence overall from leaders so far has been deafening , as attorney and longtime Arizona volunteer for reproductive rights causes Leon Silver pointed out . And if our leaders remain silent , I can tell you with perfect assurance what will happen next . There will be more violence . Dr. Tiller ’ s friends , family , patients , colleagues and the many pro-choice activists who have supported him over the years need the vigil in Wichita and those springing up elsewhere to mourn the 67-year-old doctor ’ s death and celebrate his exceptional life . The larger community of reproductive health professionals and activists , including those who bravely escort women safely into and out of health facilities for abortions , need to cry and hug and lift one another up on the wings of their convictions that they are doing God ’ s work , saving women ’ s lives in the fullest sense of the word . I am with them in spirit . But when it comes to changing a culture that has marginalized abortion by shaming women and hounding , even murdering , the doctors and clinic staff who provide safe abortions , when it comes to changing a culture bent on shaming women who are , in all good conscience , making the most moral of personal decisions -- candlelight vigils alone will never be enough .""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils | Salon Life""",AGREE,""". Dr. Tiller ’ s friends , family , patients , colleagues need the vigil in Wichita""","""George Tiller needs more than candlelight vigils""",,
1344,383,"""I hope you dont believe everything that is written in a textbook that has been changed over and over . The Bible never has .""","""Actually the Bible has changed , not to mention had omissions .""",DISAGREE,"""been changed The Bible never has""","""Actually the Bible has changed""",,
1348,384,"""Abortion is murder in countries that define it as murder . It is n't murder in those that do not define it as murder . You seem highly confused over the terms murder and killing . Pouring bleach down a toilet is killing : it kills bacteria . Slaughtering a cow for meat is killing . Murder is an illegal killing of a human . For an abortion to be murder , a country must define the embryo and/ or fetus as a human and must make the killing of that embryo and/ or fetus illegal . As to the idea that we are all glad we were not aborted , this is a nonsense statement . It 's like being glad that my house did n't blow up last night killing me in my sleep before I knew what had happened . On that note , I 'm really glad I did n't suffer a heart attack whilst typing this reply ! We are taking thousands of lives . It 's whether the killing is justified that is important . That is what the whole abortion debate comes down to : does a woman have the right to chose to kill a fetus that is growing within her .""","""You seem fairly intelligent . However , it is you who seems `` highly confused `` over the definition of murder . You see , you are speaking in terms of legal jargon as it is applied inside a particular country . I 'm referring to the moral implications of taking the life of a defenseless person without its consent . I might have better represented my argument to you by stating : we will never know with absolute certainty whether or not am unborn human constitutes a person , and thus whether or not aborting them constitutes killing them , i.e . murder in a strictly moral , and not political , sense . In response to your attacking on my saying we are glad we were n't aborted , yeah it has no bearing on my argument and I put it in for fun . Good for you to spot it .""",DISAGREE,"""Murder is an illegal killing of a human . For an abortion to be murder , a country must define the embryo and/ or fetus as a human and must make the killing of that embryo and/ or fetus illegal . As to the idea that we are all glad we were not aborted , this is a nonsense statement .""","""I 'm referring to the moral implications of taking the life of a defenseless person without its consent . I might have better represented my argument to you by stating : we will never know with absolute certainty whether or not am unborn human constitutes a person""",,
1365,394,"""So since she does n't come out , we just assume that the four people that they have affidavits from are not lying , or maybe BEING PAID BY THE KERRY CAMPAIGN ?""","""So the Kerry campaign paid them 4 years ago ? The transcript is from 2000. http : //www.truthtree.com/Censorship/posts/141.html""",DISAGREE,"""So since she does n't come out , we just assume that the four people that they have affidavits from are not lying , or maybe BEING PAID BY THE KERRY CAMPAIGN ?""","""So the Kerry campaign paid them 4 years ago ?""",,
1375,396,"""If all of our experiments show the Earth is 4.5 billion years old , then that is how old it is . If the Bible says something different , then either God meant Genesis for peoples past and now uses scientists to explain things better ( though I am uncomfortable with this idea as many scientists are atheists ) , or our puny minds , compared with God 's , have n't yet worked out how Genesis and an old Earth tie together""","""Such as what ? It is not like putting two electrodes into the Earth and getting a measurement on some sort of gadget . The only way to measure how old something is , is by using a set of arbitrary assumptions . There are few things that you need to take into account , such as the rate of decay , and so on . Creationists know that there is something seriously wrong with the radio-metric dating methods . Explain this then , carbon dating of wood under lava that was erupted from Rangitoto ( an island volcano near Auckland , NZ ) indicates that the erruption was around 200 years ago ( the name is said to mean `` Red Sky `` , suggesting that the Maoris , who have been their for 1000 years at the most , witnessed this event ) . Yet potassium-argon dating of the lava rock has given ages of up to half a million years old ! Now this alone is a big flaw . Any person who uses their logic can tell that the result of the potassium-argon is way out , it should be less than 200 years . The radio-carbon date is only restricted to thousands of years , because even after several hundreds of thousands of years , there will be no more radio-carbon left . The above came from Snelling , A. , `` Dating Dilemma : Fossil wood in `` ancient `` sandstone `` , Creation 21 ( 3 ) :39-41 . Creationists do n't have ( by their own admissions ) all of the answers when it comes to radio-metric dating methods , but they can see enough that there is something seriously wrong with the underlying assumptions . Professor Richard Mauger says : `` In general , dates in the `` correct ball park `` are assumed to be correct and are published , but those in disagreement with other data are seldom published nor are discrepencies fuly explained. ``""",AGREE,"""If all of our experiments show the Earth is 4.5 billion years old , then that is how old it is""","""The only way to measure how old something is , is by using a set of arbitrary assumptions .""",,
1384,398,"""What this means is : that we will never figure out the intricate workings of the genome , no matter how much we learn about it .""","""In my lifetime , we 've made huge strides , but there 's a lot more to learn .""",DISAGREE,"""What this means is : that we will never figure out the intricate workings of the genome , no matter how much we learn about it .""","""In my lifetime , we 've made huge strides , but there 's a lot more to learn .""",,
1389,399,"""I am gravely offended by those who claim to be on a first name basis with God , who claim to know exactly what it is that God wants and believes/ To me , somehow , it smacks of self-idolatrization , prideful in being `` next `` to God .""","""What else is new ?""",AGREE,"""I am gravely offended by those who claim to be on a first name basis with God ,""","""What else is new ?""",,
1397,400,"""In Genesis , humans are created seperately from all other creatures , but apes and monkeys are not specifically mentioned .""","""But on the other hand , Genesis is n't a scientific document . No wonder . Why would a bronze age nomad from the Levant be aware of at least 3 tailless species of primates , or even the tailed primates from Africa , South America , and even Madigascar . If they are n't mentioned in the Bible , do they exist ?""",DISAGREE,"""In Genesis apes and monkeys are not specifically""","""Why would a bronze age nomad from the Levant be aware of at least 3 tailless species of primates , or even the tailed primates""",,
1409,403,"""i 'm saying , 'according to the dictionary ' may not mean that much . the dictionary is too , what is the word , standard to describe certain things . it says 'killing of a human ' , but what about the vegans ? they believe that killing an animal is murder . words and the meaning of words change over time .""","""But the government ca n't work with connotative meanings . It has to go by what is written . In this case , the definition of murder by every source I have read states that murder is the killing of another human .""",DISAGREE,"""it says 'killing of a human ' , but what about the vegans ? they believe that killing an animal is murder . words and the meaning of words change over time .""","""But the government ca n't work with connotative meanings .""",,
1410,403,"""i 'm saying , 'according to the dictionary ' may not mean that much . the dictionary is too , what is the word , standard to describe certain things . it says 'killing of a human ' , but what about the vegans ? they believe that killing an animal is murder . words and the meaning of words change over time .""","""But the government ca n't work with connotative meanings . It has to go by what is written . In this case , the definition of murder by every source I have read states that murder is the killing of another human .""",DISAGREE,"""i 'm saying , 'according to the dictionary ' may not mean that much . the dictionary is too , what is the word""","""But the government ca n't work with connotative meanings""",,
1420,405,"""A position of pro-choice is pro-life because the lives and quality of life of women are valued .""","""Leonard Peikoff said it first""",DISAGREE,"""A position of pro-choice is pro-life because the lives and quality of life of women are valued .""","""Leonard Peikoff said it first""",,
1436,408,"""Furthermore , as usual your analysis is ridiculously limited . Arizona and Arkansas , two states with anti-gay measures , voted for McCain electorally . Florida voted for Obama by a margin of 51 % . If we go with some easy/sleazy assumptions for quick math , that means that if about 2 % of those voting for Obama decided they did n't want gay marriage , then the anti-gay marriage initiative would pass .""","""And your analysis is flat out lacking . What everyone else seems to realize is that the reason Obama won is because of FAR higher turnout , many by African American voters . ( Who more tend to be ... taa daa ! ... Democrats ! ) There is definitely a considerable discrepancy in Obama supporters and gay marriage supporters . Of that , there can be no doubt . And your anaysis of the FL situation is completely removed from reality . FL requires a vote of over 60 % for an amendment to pass . It would n't pass at 59 % , let alone 50 . So not only do you demonstrate a lack of even knowing what was needed there , it does n't even fit as an apt comparison .""",DISAGREE,"""Arizona and Arkansas , two states with anti-gay measures""","""And your analysis is flat out lacking""",,
1435,408,"""Furthermore , as usual your analysis is ridiculously limited . Arizona and Arkansas , two states with anti-gay measures , voted for McCain electorally . Florida voted for Obama by a margin of 51 % . If we go with some easy/sleazy assumptions for quick math , that means that if about 2 % of those voting for Obama decided they did n't want gay marriage , then the anti-gay marriage initiative would pass .""","""And your analysis is flat out lacking . What everyone else seems to realize is that the reason Obama won is because of FAR higher turnout , many by African American voters . ( Who more tend to be ... taa daa ! ... Democrats ! ) There is definitely a considerable discrepancy in Obama supporters and gay marriage supporters . Of that , there can be no doubt . And your anaysis of the FL situation is completely removed from reality . FL requires a vote of over 60 % for an amendment to pass . It would n't pass at 59 % , let alone 50 . So not only do you demonstrate a lack of even knowing what was needed there , it does n't even fit as an apt comparison .""",DISAGREE,"""as usual your analysis is ridiculously limited""","""And your analysis is flat out lacking .""",,
1445,409,"""Nothing at all . You think open carrying of loaded handguns in public will become fashionable in CA ? I think if anyone took to this they 'd find themselves asked to leave establishments routinely . I 'm not against concealed carry in principle but open carry seems silly to me . I smell posers .""","""Open carry is gaining momentum in Michigan , so who knows ? And the I smell posers comment ... well , I 'll just say that I think you 're jumping to a premature conclusion . I 'm catching up on this thread and have a few more pages to go , but I wanted to address this comment before I go on . Most of us who openly carry in Michigan , are licensed to conceal , but we are carrying openly to promote the concept . Let me note that I , too , believe that openly carrying an unloaded firearm is asking for trouble . I ca n't see how it could make any situation safer , with it taking seconds to load a gun and get it into battery . Luckily we carry loaded here , which drastically changes the dynamics . When one can go from either concealment or a side holstered weapon to putting holes in a center mass in under a second , that 's an effective deterrent . Then we hear the `` gun grab `` argument - if you 're openly carrying , anyone could grab your gun . This just is n't practical . If a criminal wants a gun , h'es going to B & amp ; E a house or obtain it by other means than trying to take it off of someone who 's wearing one . There 's just too big a chance of getting shot . Not to mention that when someone is openly carrying , they generally have a heightened state of awareness . We pay more attention to what 's going on around us . Another hitch in that argument is equipment . Most who OC , like me , have retention holsters . They `` lock `` the gun into place in the holster and a button must be pressed to draw the weapon . Therefore , someone would n't be able to just sneak up and pull the weapon from its holster . Criminals traditionally go for easy targets . If Joe is visibly armed and Pete is n't , which would be the more likely victim ? If a thug walks into a C-store with ill intentions and sees a customer or two armed , I can say with certainty that the thug will wait until the store 's empty or pick another location . Carrying openly can be an effective crime deterrent , and seeing armed good guys here and there is a constant reminder to the criminal element that we ( , the People ) are taking arms and proactively defending ourselves . Just bear these things in mind before jumping on the `` open carry is crazy `` bandwagon .""",DISAGREE,"""carrying of loaded handguns in public will become fashionable in CA ?""","""well , I 'll just say that I think you 're jumping to a premature conclusion""",,
1486,416,"""sarablaze , there 's billion of people like you , do n't know why but just `` follow the follower `` !""","""Oh , so is your God the Chinese government ? Honestly , most atheists will say people believe in God because they ca n't think for themselves and must rely on something in order to exist . Where 's the difference ? The Chinese follow the Chinese government like puppy dogs because they ca n't think for themselves , and they rely on the government in order to survive .""",DISAGREE,"""there 's billion of people like you , do n't know why but just `` follow the follower `` !""","""Oh , so is your God the Chinese government ?""",,
1488,417,"""However , not all members of the population are able to breed .""","""And reproduction rates are not uniform among a population . Do n't let him bait you into following his unstated assumptions . However , I must say that those are fine examples of competition within populations . Good work . Same with `` artificial `` ( or at least , not exactly natural ) selection .""",AGREE,"""However , not all members of the population are able to breed .""","""And reproduction rates are not uniform among a population . ``""",,
1491,417,"""However , not all members of the population are able to breed .""","""And reproduction rates are not uniform among a population . Do n't let him bait you into following his unstated assumptions . However , I must say that those are fine examples of competition within populations . Good work . Same with `` artificial `` ( or at least , not exactly natural ) selection .""",AGREE,"""However , not all members of the population are able to breed .""","""And reproduction rates are not uniform among a population ``""",,
1512,421,"""4Forums is pleased to announce a formal debate between Cerebro and zachvac : Resolved : Intelligent Design should be part of the public schools ' science curriculum , taught as a valid alternative to the Theory of Evolution . Cerebro will argue the affirmative , zachvac the negative . A 5/4 post structure has been agreed upon . Cerebro will begin and end this debate . A time limit of one week will be allowed between each post . The judges for this debate are sinjin , jitobear , and joebrummer . Their decisions are final . Best of luck to Cerebro and zachvac .""","""So umm . What 's going on ? This was posted a week ago plus about 4 hours ago . I frankly do n't care if my opponent posts a day late and would hate to win because of time . BUT the first post was even easier , he could have been typing it as we found judges and I think he mentioned he had started already . I PMed him earlier this week reminding him of the limit and have not recieved a response . Of course maybe the fact that he has n't logged on since 11/14 has something to do with that .""",DISAGREE,"""4Forums is pleased to announce a formal debate between Cerebro and zachvac : Resolved : Intelligent Design should be part of the public schools ' science curriculum , taught as a valid alternative to the Theory of Evolution . Cerebro will argue the affirmative , zachvac the negative . A 5/4 post structure has been agreed upon . Cerebro will begin and end this debate . A time limit of one week will be allowed between each post""","""This was posted a week ago plus about 4 hours ago . I frankly do n't care if my opponent posts a day late and would hate to win because of time . BUT the first post was even easier , he could have been typing it as we found judges and I think he mentioned he had started already . I PMed him earlier this week reminding him of the limit and have not recieved a response . Of course maybe the fact that he has n't logged on since 11/14 has something to do with that .""",,
1539,426,"""Here we go again .""","""Yep ...""",AGREE,"""Here we go again .""","""Yep""",,
1548,428,"""I think at least part of the reason is that they do n't wear their sexuality on their shoulder and flaunt it . And they do n't seem to live for the purpose of 'gay pride . '""","""More silliness on your part . Think about it . Gay couples together for 40 or 50 years . That means they were living together in the 1950s and 1960s . Those people were the foundation of the gay-pride movement .""",DISAGREE,"""And they do n't seem to live for the purpose of 'gay pride . '""","""Those people were the foundation of the gay-pride movement .""",,
1549,428,"""I think at least part of the reason is that they do n't wear their sexuality on their shoulder and flaunt it . And they do n't seem to live for the purpose of 'gay pride . '""","""More silliness on your part . Think about it . Gay couples together for 40 or 50 years . That means they were living together in the 1950s and 1960s . Those people were the foundation of the gay-pride movement .""",DISAGREE,"""they do n't seem to live for the purpose of 'gay pride . '""","""Those people were the foundation of the gay-pride movement""",,
1582,436,"""exactly . they 're like the swiss , just ca n't seem to make up their minds I think i 'll sway this way today , wait maybe that way .""","""Just liike Stalin""",AGREE,"""they 're like the swiss , just ca n't seem to make up their minds""","""Just liike Stalin""",,
1588,437,"""Have you got any other articles that would support these baseless claims and wild accusations ? One source is n't good enough for a scientific approach .""","""Well , you could try actually reading the second of my two links - there 's three relevant sources provided in that post , one of which cites a further two studies . 'Baseless ' and 'wild ' , it ai n't .""",DISAGREE,"""One source is n't good enough for a scientific approach .""","""'s three relevant sources provided in that post , one of which cites a further two studies""",,
1600,439,"""I wasn ’ t familiar with  “ Poe ’ s Law ” either . Here ’ s what I found on it ; Deleted from Wikipedia - Poe 's law ( deleted 15 May 2008 at 06:32 - Deletionpedia ) It lasted 21 days on Wikipedia before being deleted , and it was originated by a Christianforums poster named  “ Nathan Poe ” . Doesn ’ t really seem like that big of deal to me , but the atheist community seems to be increasingly fascinated with anything at all that allows them to mock Christianity . As this now famous genius  “ Poe ” puts it ;""","""Actually , it got combined with an entry with a whole bunch of other 'laws' at List of eponymous laws - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia It 's still there .""",DISAGREE,"""lasted 21 days on Wikipedia before being deleted ,""","""Actually , it got combined with an entry with a whole bunch of other at List of eponymous laws""",,
1608,440,"""I do n't think so . It is my understanding that the Pro-Life side argues that the fetus is not part of the woman 's body ( because it is a separate organism ) and therefore the issue does n't boil down to conservatism vs. liberalism . For example , there are some Libertarians ( i.e . capitalist-liberals ) who argue on the Pro-Life side , not because they want to force morality on people , but because they want to apply anti-murder laws more consistently .""","""But it is part of the woman 's body because it 's dependant on her . Eventually it will be a person , but it 's still part of the woman 's body because it is totally dependant on her body . Saying that this is false is imposing other peoples ' morals ( that it 's a life before it 's born ) on someone else rather than giving the woman the choice about her body and allowing her to decide whether she wants to go through pregnancy and have a baby or not . That 's the pro-choice argument . I agree that as science progresses , we can reach a compromise .""",DISAGREE,"""the Pro-Life side argues that the fetus is not part of the woman 's body ( because it is a separate organism )""","""But it is part of the woman 's body because it 's dependant on her .""",,
1612,441,"""A lot of garbage has been bandied about concerning the emotional trauma a woman suffers after she has had an abortion . There is no substantive , unbiased research on this topic but a cursory sampling seems to indicate that women who report great emotional trauma after an abortion were already mentally unbalanced , possibly subject to depression or dramatic mood swings or other mental disturbances prior to becoming pregnant and having an abortion . I am inclined to believe that such emotionally-disturbed women are incapable of making a rational choice in many instances and they probably would have suffered enormous emotional consequences whatever choice they made . .""","""Oh ! I get it ! abortion is fun , it is only a traumatic experience ( to kill your unborn son/daughter ) for `` unbalanced `` women""",DISAGREE,"""There is no substantive , unbiased research on this topic but a cursory sampling seems to indicate that women who report great emotional trauma after an abortion were already mentally unbalanced , possibly subject to depression or dramatic mood swings""","""Oh ! I get it ! abortion is fun , it is only a traumatic experience ( to kill your unborn son/daughter ) for `` unbalanced `` women""",,
1614,441,"""A lot of garbage has been bandied about concerning the emotional trauma a woman suffers after she has had an abortion . There is no substantive , unbiased research on this topic but a cursory sampling seems to indicate that women who report great emotional trauma after an abortion were already mentally unbalanced , possibly subject to depression or dramatic mood swings or other mental disturbances prior to becoming pregnant and having an abortion . I am inclined to believe that such emotionally-disturbed women are incapable of making a rational choice in many instances and they probably would have suffered enormous emotional consequences whatever choice they made . .""","""Oh ! I get it ! abortion is fun , it is only a traumatic experience ( to kill your unborn son/daughter ) for `` unbalanced `` women""",DISAGREE,"""A lot of garbage has been bandied about concerning the emotional trauma a woman suffers after she has had an abortion""","""Oh ! I get it ! abortion is fun""",,
1631,443,"""Well Whoop-Dee-Doo ! If you want Homosexual Marriage , be prepared to shell out more $ $ $ when Uncle Sam comes to collect when , in the inevitability , you should call it splitsville .""","""Everyone expects that . What they do n't and should n't have to expect is that they will be specifically targeted and have to pay more , be penalised more , etc . than hetero couples such as yourself or me and my husband .""",AGREE,"""be prepared to shell out more $ $ $""","""they do n't and should n't have to expect is that they will be specifically targeted and have to pay more""",,
1660,446,"""Actually , as Another Opinion pointed out , there are more considerations beyond that . Emotional ones . Some people would have a hard time giving up some part of themselves ( or how ever they see it ) , thus there are the cases of changed minds . Others may constantly worry later on 'how is s/he doing , are they okay or not ... ' in regards to the child . I was merely addressing certain aspects of this topic .""","""Dude , I already said I considered numerous things , so I do n't know why you keep complaining about this .""",DISAGREE,"""Actually , as Another Opinion pointed out , there are more considerations beyond that .""","""Dude , I already said I considered numerous things""",,
1677,448,"""The article as a whole never made that argument either . Lie number .... oh I ca n't keep track anymore , let 's just call it 40 .""","""Okay Yankee Fan . Keep pretending that it does n't . Well , if you never read the article , you would n't be pretending as that would be an argument from position of ignorance .""",DISAGREE,"""The article as a whole never made that argument either .""","""Keep pretending that it does n't .""",,
1684,448,"""The article as a whole never made that argument either . Lie number .... oh I ca n't keep track anymore , let 's just call it 40 .""","""Okay Yankee Fan . Keep pretending that it does n't . Well , if you never read the article , you would n't be pretending as that would be an argument from position of ignorance .""",DISAGREE,"""The article as a whole never made that argument either . Lie number .... oh I ca n't keep track anymore , let 's just call it 40""","""you would n't be pretending as that would be an argument from position of ignorance""",,
1703,452,"""I would like to point out that it was hardly a land slide . Current admninistration is not as popular as either Reagan or Clinton was . This nation is divided . Nothing is dead .""","""George Bush won the majority of votes ( the first majority winner in 16 years ) in an election with the highest turnout in US history ( > 117Million voters ) . The Senate Minority Leader was defeated by a nobody . Democrats lost at least 3 seats in each of the House and Senate , something that never happens in a Presidential election year . This gave the Republican majority in both branches of Congress even more control . 11 Liberal ballot initiatives went down in flames by huge margins . If liberalism IS N'T dead , then it 's in ICU on a heart and lung machine .""",DISAGREE,"""This nation is divided . Nothing is dead .""","""IS N'T dead , then it 's in ICU on a heart and lung machine .""",,
1709,453,"""If the stars were created near the earth and then streched out as the Bible says they were the relationship of time and distance would be quite different and would explain how light from a distant star could be seen .""","""Please start with the Bible passage . Then explain what you mean by `` stretched out `` and why this would affect our perception of space and time .""",DISAGREE,"""the Bible says they were the relationship of time and distance would be quite""","""why this would affect our perception of space and time .""",,
1713,454,"""WHEN GOVERNMENTS ARE A THREAT The U.N. claims that guns used in armed conflicts cause 300,000 deaths worldwide every year . The solution proposed in conference 's `` Program of Action `` ? Keep rebels from getting guns by requiring that countries `` prevent , combat and eradicate `` what those countries who want to stop rebels from getting the guns define as `` the illicit trade in small arms `` This may be an understandable `` solution `` from governments that do n't trust their citizens . But it also represents a dangerous disregard for their citizens ' safety and freedom . Why ? First , and most obviously , because not all insurgencies are `` bad. `` It is hardly surprising that infamous regimes such as those in Syria , Cuba , Rwanda , Vietnam , Zimbabwe , and Sierra Leone support these `` reforms. `` To ban providing guns to rebels in totalitarian countries is like arguing that there is never anything such as a just war . In hindsight , would Europeans have preferred that no resistance was put up against Hitler ? Should the French or Norwegian resistance movements simply have given up ? Surely this would have minimized war causalities .""","""Do you think this resistance got their most useful weapons out of a normal store ? Please don´t try such arguments without knowing about European history .""",DISAGREE,"""would Europeans have preferred that no resistance was put up against Hitler ?""","""Please try such arguments without knowing about European history .""",,
1716,455,"""I got the information from : `` Finally , there is large-scale evolution that may be referred to as molecules-to-man evolution ,""","""And so on . Yes . a lie generated by creationist liars is what you use as source for what scientists are claimed to adhere to ? Your dishonesty is actually rather startling . This is the worst attempt at dishonesty I have seen from lying creationists yet , and your gleeful introduction of that lie shows how truly and completely dishonest you are . Would you stop your lies . You are pathetic .""",DISAGREE,"""there is large-scale evolution that may be referred to as molecules-to-man evolution ,""","""a lie generated by creationist liars is what you use as source for what scientists are claimed to adhere to ?""",,
1731,458,"""However , one thing to consider while debating pro-lifers is that they generally do not care about women 's rights .""","""... or facts""",AGREE,"""to that do 's .""","""facts""",,
1740,459,"""Way to support your controversial assertion , Bell .""","""Way to miss the entire point , Clerisian . My point was that is it a horrible experience for many women , and that I wish we could strive towards a society where abortions were no longer needed . Wishful thinking by a midtwenties female who just went through the most horrifying experience of her life , forgive me if I did n't clarify well enough . I ca n't imagine that anyone would disagree with that .""",DISAGREE,"""Way to support your controversial assertion""","""Way to miss the entire point , My point was that is it a horrible experience for many women , and that I wish we could strive towards a society where abortions were no longer needed""",,
1745,460,"""4. a relationship in which two people have pledged themselves to each other in the manner of a husband and wife , without legal sanction : trial marriage ; homosexual marriage .""","""Encarta http : //encarta.msn.com/encnet/featur ... fid=1861628509""",AGREE,"""a relationship two people have pledged themselves to each other in the manner of a husband and wife , without legal sanction .""","""Encarta""",,
1762,477,"""In other words , you think there is no room for moderates . But the real world is not so black and white and compromise is often necessary .""","""No , there 's no room for traitors . We do n't need presidents of firearms manufacturing companies that made campaign contributions to Obama , or those who will immediately sign onto pointless programs just to avoid a lawsuit .""",DISAGREE,"""think there is no room for moderates . But the real world is not so black and white and compromise""","""We do n't need presidents of firearms manufacturing companies that made campaign contributions to Obama""",,
1769,479,"""civil union for all couples marriage only for those wanting kids""","""So if a gay couple plans to adopt , they can get married ? And if a straight couple gets married , and then find out they ca n't have kids , does their marriage gets changed to a civil union ? Or is it just desire to have kids ?""",DISAGREE,"""civil union for all couples marriage only for those wanting kids""","""if a gay couple plans to adopt , they can get married ? if a straight couple gets married , and then find out they ca n't have kids , does their marriage gets changed to a civil union ?""",,
1779,482,"""You can not rationally show us how something can be OUTSIDE of science .""","""Well , you contradict yourself again , as you argued for rational beliefs in love , without recourse to science ; quoting 'common sense ' . Focus .""",DISAGREE,"""rationally show OUTSIDE of science""","""contradict yourself rational beliefs in love ,""",,
1803,487,"""So what ? A person has a right to defend themselves , as spelled out in the Constitution . Or would you rather the 80 year old just get beaten to death for his $ 262 ? Or maybe you 'd feel better if he 'd suffered the same fate as the home invader over in Maryland . He made the mistake of breaking and entering into a student house and was slaughtered with a sword . And what point are you trying to make anyway ? It 's not like the 80 year old went on a killing spree of anything . Nobody got murdered . So what 're you moaning about ?""","""people keep saying thats the law in texas , so Im saying that this is the law in New York , He broke the law so he had it coming , next time dont disrespect the law and get a license , Im just showing how some of the people on this board are major hypocrites , you suddenly get all soft on crime when you dont like the law ,""",DISAGREE,"""He made the mistake of breaking and entering into a student house and was slaughtered with a sword""","""Im saying that this is the law in New York , He broke the law so he had it coming , next time dont disrespect the law and get a license , Im just showing how some of the people on this board are major hypocrites ,""",,
1825,492,"""And your argument is not a good one . If I said `` this food is bad because it 's poisonous , so lets use this one and add poison to it. `` Does that make any sense ? NO .""","""Actually , your argument makes no sense . It 's not the pesticides used on the tobacco crop that makes it harmful , it 's the chemicals they add to the tobacco to make the smoke more palatable . Your whole point here is moot .""",DISAGREE,"""this food is bad because it 's poisonous , so lets use this one and add poison to""","""'s not the pesticides used on the tobacco crop that makes it harmful ,""",,
1853,501,"""What are the reasons which you would present behind the statement `` all human life is sacred `` ( or whichever similar statement you think is the core of your pro-life stance ) ?""","""Because to not view it as sacred presents a greater potential for harm . People sometimes to take a disposable view of things that they consider unimportant . To view humanity as sacred helps protect humanity .""",AGREE,"""What are the reasons which you would present behind the statement `` all human life is sacred ``""","""to not view it as sacred presents a greater potential for harm To view humanity as sacred helps protect humanity .""",,
1862,504,"""I ca n't think of any good reason to qualify the delivery of healthcare other than need for a physician . Where one lives or does n't live , makes no difference , and neither does the fact that a person has broken the law . Health care is a civil and human right in a democratic society .""","""Show me where healthcare can be found in the Constitution as a guaranteed right . Just saying so does n't cut it . We are ( or were , any way ) a nation of laws .""",DISAGREE,"""Health care is a civil and human right in a democratic society .""","""Show me where healthcare can be found in the Constitution as a guaranteed right .""",,
1863,504,"""I ca n't think of any good reason to qualify the delivery of healthcare other than need for a physician . Where one lives or does n't live , makes no difference , and neither does the fact that a person has broken the law . Health care is a civil and human right in a democratic society .""","""Show me where healthcare can be found in the Constitution as a guaranteed right . Just saying so does n't cut it . We are ( or were , any way ) a nation of laws .""",DISAGREE,"""I ca n't think of any good reason to qualify the delivery of healthcare other than need for a physician""","""Show me where healthcare can be found in the Constitution as a guaranteed right .""",,
1871,506,"""That is your right . But it does not make the `` Bang `` true .""","""And you have a right to cling to superstition and magic as true . But that does n't make mythology true .""",DISAGREE,"""But it does not make the `` Bang true""","""But that does n't make mythology true .""",,
1873,507,"""one other point , and i brought this up lots of times here and elsewhere , is that about `` christian/evolutionism hybrids `` . that is , those that disregard the genesis story in the light of `` modern discoveries `` , yet they believe that God exists and that salvation through jesus is attainable as the bible prescribes . while it is logically impossible to disregard genesis and at the same time accept the new testament , many people out there are comfortable with the idea . it totally eludes me though""","""I think the christians you describe do not disregard creation in Genesis per sae . They would agree absolutely with your 2 fundemental truths at the start of your post . However , they do not see it as a history as such , but more as an analogy to what happened . Some take it simply to say that God created the universe and put a soul in humans and find the detail of that ( not the soul bit ) in what we have discovered through science . Others would say it becomes `` historical `` at a certain point- Adam and Eve or maybe Noah . I do n't think they are any less christian than those who choose to believe the story of creation literally , and it would surprise me to hear someone say that was the case . I think it does pose some awkward questions to hold such a view though , and while I do n't see all your 8 examples in your later post as being the ones I have heard , they are certainly of that nature . Christianity has struggled with the logical conclusions of observation of the physical world for much time . Some of the examples from history are amusing today- the Omphilodian Heresy where the very discussion of whether Adam and Eve had navels was a heinous religous crime . The Heliocentricity debate where the Catholic Church eventually relented their scripture based denial of the earth orbiting the sun . And today the debate over the old earth and evolution . This seems to arrive from the fact that the religon is so encompassing in its assertion of truth . While this helps to create a powerful system of belief , it can put it in an awkward position when new discovery is made . The nature of peolpe seems to be the same conflicts have arisen again and again- with just the point of contention changing .""",AGREE,"""those that disregard the genesis story yet they believe that God exists it is logically impossible to disregard genesis and at the same time accept the new testament""","""I think the christians you describe do not disregard creation in Genesis per sae . Some take it simply to say that God created the universe and put a soul in humans and find the detail of that ( not the soul bit ) in what we have discovered through science . Others would say it becomes `` historical `` at a certain point- Adam and Eve or maybe Noah .""",,
1898,513,"""Well that was a lovely story and cudos on working in the anti-war angle . No , the 50 or more GIANT posters in a row alongside a public ( taxpayer funded ) roadway do not affect me personaly in any way from a shock perspective . As I said , I am strongly against abortion , I have seen the same pictures many times before . My complaint is the virtual forcing of all citizens to view the photos as they drive down a public roadway , and the harrassing of motorists at stop lights . Mainly my point in posting this thread was to try to find out if this was a common type of anti-abortion protest in other parts of the country . I 'm quite sure many other `` conservatives `` will view this type of protest as a wonderful thing . I think it actually works against the anti-abortion movement and alienates potential supporters .""","""The good side of war is altogether too often overlooked . Anyway , at the protest here recently they were giving out keychains with little plastic fetuses supposedly of about the stage of development of the average abortion . Nice huh ?""",DISAGREE,"""working in the anti-war angle , am strongly against abortion ,""","""The good side of war is altogether too often overlooked""",,
1913,517,"""Frankly , tell me what you know about the Bible and what it says about Christ .""","""I know that Christ is n't mentioned in either of the Old Testament creation myths . In fact , he is n't mentioned in the Old Testament at all . He is mentioned a lot in the New Testament , the stories that were written 40 to 100 years after he is supposed to have lived .""",DISAGREE,"""Frankly , tell me what you know about the Bible and what it says about Christ .""","""I know that Christ is n't mentioned in either of the Old Testament creation myths . In fact , he is n't mentioned in the Old Testament at all . He is mentioned a lot in the New Testament , the stories that were written 40 to 100 years after he is supposed to have lived .""",,
1918,518,"""and I do think that your intellect is being leveraged in pursuit of the wrong goal , namely the creation of a fortress of semantics , idiosyncratic terminology and untestable assertions from within which you can hurl abuse at others .""","""* * Back to the dark side , eh , and 'argument by personal attack upon the character of your opponent ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""idiosyncratic terminology untestable assertions""","""by personal attack""",,
1924,520,"""Gays should allowed to have a legal partnership which is exactly the same as hetrosexuals have and it should called 'garriage ' . Job done""","""what about to d-y-k-e-s marrying each other , would you call it `` butch-ery `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""it should called 'garriage '""","""would you call it `` butch-ery `` ?""",,
1929,522,"""Actually the defending of ATF would n't do much with regular guns since they have little to do with them . ATFs function is with NFA guns , which you probably know little , or nothing about .""","""Actually , I have fired an NFA gun before .""",DISAGREE,"""ATFs function is with NFA guns , which you probably know little , or nothing about .""","""Actually , I have fired an NFA gun before .""",,
1935,524,"""But , even if all this were untrue , it really has nothing to do with America . Canada may very well have been prepared to accept gays into its army without serious repercussions , specifically a degradation of its cohesion . If this is the case , then good for them . It does not mean America is in any such stage .""","""So are you saying that Canadian society is less bigoted than US ? Are you saying that because US society is bigoted then it is right to pander to the bigots and allow them to dictate the rules of society ? Oh and BTW , the British Army openly allows homosexuals as well , and seems to function well enough too .""",DISAGREE,"""Canada may very well have been prepared to accept gays into its army without serious repercussions , specifically a degradation of its cohesion .""","""So are you saying that Canadian society is less bigoted than US ?""",,
1945,526,"""Nearly all animal phyla * made their first appearance in the fossil record at essentially the same time , an interval of some 5 million years [ ET * * ] ( about 525 to 530 million years ago [ ET * * ] ) called the `` Cambrian Explosion . '' 51""","""1 ) This is outdated . The beginning of the Cambrian `` explosion `` has been dated to ~543 million years . And , this more accurate date for the base of the Cambrian has been known for more than 10 years !""",DISAGREE,"""Nearly all animal phyla * made their first appearance in the fossil record at essentially the same time , an interval of some 5 million years [ ET * * ]""","""This is outdated""",,
1966,531,"""I 'd have to agree with Sotomayor . So far , I have not heard one logical argument for giving the state the ability to assert control over the body of a woman and make very private decisions for her .""","""Do you agree with me that a child 's right to their life should begin when their life does ? I 'm just wondering , ....""",DISAGREE,"""I have not heard one logical argument for giving the state the ability to assert control over the body of a woman""","""a child 's right to their life should begin when their life does ?""",,
1987,535,"""However , ever since he ( Chuz ) started a thread attempting to convince others of this 'fact ' , he has consistently ignored the vast majority of arguments against his reasoning - while continuing to tout the 'fact ' in other threads .""","""I 'm not sure what thread or posts you are talking about , IANGB . But If you are talking about posts where I invited you to start a challenger 's corner debate , ... here we are .""",DISAGREE,"""However , ever since he ( Chuz ) started a thread attempting to convince others of this 'fact ' , he has consistently ignored the vast majority of arguments against his reasoning - while continuing to tout the 'fact ' in other threads .""","""I 'm not sure what thread or posts you are talking about , IANGB . But If you are talking about posts where I invited you to start a challenger 's corner debate , ... here we are .""",,
1998,537,"""Again , you are the affirmative , you must support your claims . Please support the claim that we are using an atheist presupposition . I think we are using more an agnostic presupposition , which is a neutral one .""","""Neutral ? One of the main standards and reference points for science and evolution on the internet is talkorigins.org . It 's promoted as an educational site - a place with answers to criticisms of the evolutionary theory . It 's every bit as biased as AnswersinGenesis , yet in many cases it 's difficult for ID proponents to target . Part of the broad definition of evolution is microevolution , about the only segment of the broad term that is provable . They can masterfully employ that to make an ID proponent appear uninformed or irrational if he questions happenstance orignis , or other unproven evolutionary assumptions . They make their atheism clear in many ways however . They devote a page to comment about the `` International Flat Earth Society `` , pretending they believe it to be a legitimate site . Almost any rational adult can see that it 's phony . ( Wikopedia calls it a hoax ) There 's nothing neutral , or even agnostic , about that site , and it appears to represent the anti-ID-in-schools mindset to a T. If there 's actually a more neutral , agnostic , scientific website that opposes ID being taught in schools , I 'd like to see it .""",DISAGREE,"""Again , you are the affirmative , you must support your claims . Please support the claim that we are using an atheist presupposition . I think we are using more an agnostic presupposition , which is a neutral one .""","""Neutral ? One of the main standards and reference points for science and evolution on the internet is talkorigins.org . It 's promoted as an educational site ``""",,
2023,543,"""Your addiction to violence is showing .""","""And your Orwellian position is showing .""",DISAGREE,"""Your addiction to violence is showing .""","""And your Orwellian position is showing .""",,
2042,547,"""A slimey claim you can not support as usual . In developed Nations , the U.S. is far down the list as has been posted on this very board at least 5 times . Those 'other ' Nations also have far more crime and violent crime than the U.S .""","""So what developed nations have lower murder rates than the US ?""",DISAGREE,"""Those 'other ' Nations also have far more crime and violent crime than the U.S .""","""So what developed nations have lower murder rates than the US ?""",,
2050,549,"""Are you for limiting abortion to that ?""","""Limiting it to what ?""",DISAGREE,"""limiting abortion to that""","""Limiting it to""",,
2068,553,"""The failings are in the participants , not the system . The sins you enumerate would afflict us if we still lived in caves . The human condition . It can be countered . Jesus had something to say about it , among others .""","""Well said ! The two things that seem to motivate us most are fear and greed !""",AGREE,"""The failings are in the participants , not the The sins you enumerate would afflict us if we still lived in caves""","""Well said ! The two things that seem to motivate us most are fear and greed !""",,
2073,561,"""In developed nations with stricter gun laws there are less murders .""","""We 're you just talking about oversimplification ? I see you conveniently leave out the in depth issues that contribute to how other nations work . Police powers , government oversight , economy , the rights of the people , etc . Why do you choose to believe that the gun laws are the sole determining factor that make all the difference ?""",DISAGREE,"""In developed nations with stricter gun laws there are less murders .""","""Why do you choose to believe that the gun laws are the sole determining factor that make all the difference ?""",,
2086,564,"""The word `` evolution `` has such a broad meaning that it does n't have to mean atheism , but it since it is practically the only weapon that atheists have to combat the religious worldview , that 's what it often DOES mean . If it should n't mean it , but it is used so that it does , then that 's what it actually means .""","""Actually , the word evolution never means atheism except when used by creationists who want to pretend that science is anti-christian .""",DISAGREE,"""The word `` evolution `` has such a broad meaning that it does n't have to mean atheism ,""","""the word evolution never means atheism except when used by creationists who want to pretend that science is anti-christian .""",,
2093,565,"""You 've got to be kidding me . Dark : [ a region of space/time ] devoid or partially devoid of light""","""Let 's take this slowly ... a ) Montalban is asked to give a definition of unknowables , and does so Mach : It 's illogical , merely defining it does n't prove it exists . b ) Mach is asked to show a scientific test for dark Mach : Look I do n't have a scientific test for dark , but I can prove it exists by giving a definition of it ! Once again you defy yourself ! So , merely defining 'darkness ' does not prove it exists BY SCIENCE . What you have done is to confirm that it ca n't be defined BY SCIENCE . SHOW ME THE SCIENCE THAT DEFINES DARKNESS . If you ca n't then we have evidence for a suggestion that something exists ( in nature ) that science ca n't test for .""",DISAGREE,"""You 've got to be kidding me""","""Look I do n't have a scientific test for dark , but I can prove it exists by giving""",,
2096,566,"""and thus science can be achieved with regards to anything that can be known .""","""What about speculative and theoretical sciences ? Is a circle 'real ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""can be achieved with regards to anything that can be known""","""speculative and theoretical sciences""",,
2098,566,"""and thus science can be achieved with regards to anything that can be known .""","""What about speculative and theoretical sciences ? Is a circle 'real ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""and thus science can be achieved with regards to anything that can be known .""","""What about speculative and theoretical sciences ?""",,
2116,570,"""Like I said in # 2 , most of the earth ’ s oxygen comes from the plants in the ocean and we still have al the other forest .""","""The other forest does not photosynthesize all year round , the other forest is also in just as much danger as the rainforest . For some reason , radical environmentalists choose to place undue emphasis on the de-forestation of rainforest rather than global forest as a whole .""",DISAGREE,"""oxygen comes from the plants in the ocean and we still have al the other forest .""","""radical environmentalists choose to place undue emphasis on the de-forestation""",,
2121,571,"""I rely on the police .""","""^ This is the funny part ! .... My answer : .45acp strapped to your hip ... .05 seconds to respond to threat ... Crocidile Dundee 's answer : Call the police ... 1-30 seconds to get to the phone .... 1-3 seconds to dial police ( if you have 911 ) 30 Seconds to 5 minutes to splain yourself ..... 5-30- ? ? ? time for police to respond .. My analysys : Your dead ! ! ! Having the logic bus mow you down : PRICELESS ! ! ( sorry Kelvin ... COuld not resist ! )""",DISAGREE,"""I rely on the police .""","""5-30- ? ? ? time for police to respond .. My analysys : Your dead ! ! ! Having the logic bus mow you down : PRICELESS ! !""",,
2138,574,"""2 ) By what mechanism does the designer interact with the natural world ?""","""This remains unspecified . ( I explained this in the last paragraph )""",DISAGREE,"""By what mechanism does the designer interact with the natural world""","""This remains unspecified""",,
2136,574,"""2 ) By what mechanism does the designer interact with the natural world ?""","""This remains unspecified . ( I explained this in the last paragraph )""",DISAGREE,"""By what mechanism does the designer interact with the natural world ?""","""This remains unspecified .""",,
2163,582,"""The militia of the Second Amendment is a militia that is described as being well regulated ( regulated by both the federal government and the states as spoken of in Article 1 of the Constitution ) . In our own day , I think the National Guard would be the only militia that qualifies as being well regulated . Alexander Hamilton spoke of the desirability of the militia being well regulated : `` It requires no skill in the science of war to discern that uniformity in the organization and discipline of the militia would be attended with the most beneficial effects , whenever they were called into service for the public defense . It would enable them to discharge the duties of the camp and of the field with mutual intelligence and concert an advantage of peculiar moment in the operations of an army ; and it would fit them much sooner to acquire the degree of proficiency in military functions which would be essential to their usefulness . This desirable uniformity can only be accomplished by confiding the regulation of the militia to the direction of the national authority . It is , therefore , with the most evident propriety , that the plan of the convention proposes to empower the Union `` to provide for organizing , arming , and disciplining the militia , and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States , RESERVING TO THE STATES RESPECTIVELY THE APPOINTMENT OF THE OFFICERS , AND THE AUTHORITY OF TRAINING THE MILITIA ACCORDING TO THE DISCIPLINE PRESCRIBED BY CONGRESS. `` The Federalist Papers - THOMAS ( Library of Congress ) We could go back to the days when most citizens were required to enroll in the militia , have guns and get military training- to what the Founders really meant when they spoke of a well regulated militia being the security of a free state . But the Supreme Court along with pro-gun activists claiming to be pro- Second Amendment have decided to turn their back on that part of the Second Amendment while giving the lip service to the idea of a militia .""","""Well regulated as in the second amendment does not mean regulated by the government , it means well equiped and prepared . The framers of the constitution often spoke of a tyrannical government and how to keep one from coming to power , so why in the hell would they have said lets just give the government total control of guns . Your definition of well regulated makes about as much sense as adding another day to the week .""",DISAGREE,"""RESERVING TO THE STATES RESPECTIVELY THE APPOINTMENT OF THE OFFICERS""","""The framers of the constitution often spoke of a tyrannical government and how to keep one from coming to power""",,
2170,583,"""Notice how it describes the level life on Earth had attained around 270 million years ago , yet I just watched a documentary on Nat . Geo that very clearly showed that 270 million years ago , the Earth was basically engulfed in volcanic flames . Another example of contradictory evidence within the scientific community regarding the different stages of evolution the Earth experienced in order to get where we 're at today .""","""No contradiction ; the Permian extinction was the most severe in history and noted as such in the page linked .""",DISAGREE,"""Another example of contradictory evidence within the scientific community""","""No contradiction ; the Permian extinction was the most severe in history""",,
2173,583,"""Notice how it describes the level life on Earth had attained around 270 million years ago , yet I just watched a documentary on Nat . Geo that very clearly showed that 270 million years ago , the Earth was basically engulfed in volcanic flames . Another example of contradictory evidence within the scientific community regarding the different stages of evolution the Earth experienced in order to get where we 're at today .""","""No contradiction ; the Permian extinction was the most severe in history and noted as such in the page linked .""",DISAGREE,"""the Earth was basically engulfed in volcanic flames""","""the Permian extinction was the most severe in history and noted""",,
2195,587,"""How is this a perfect design in the image and likeness of a perfect God - or was this the result of the evolution of a skeleton system made for walking on four legs that is somewhat less than perfect for bipedal locomotion ?""","""I think you can forget about God the super `` engineer `` on this one : your final question contains a necessary and sufficient condition to explain the case .""",AGREE,"""How is this a perfect design in the image and likeness of a perfect God - or was this the result of the evolution of a skeleton system made for walking on four legs that is somewhat less than perfect for bipedal locomotion ?""","""I think you can forget about God the super `` engineer `` on this one : your final question contains a necessary and sufficient condition to explain the case .""",,
2205,589,"""Originally posted by dsadevil The purpose of a car is not to kill someone/thing with , it is for transportation . If it is misused , it can kill , but as y'all claim , that applies to anything . The key difference with guns is that the primary and really sole purpose of guns is to kill something with . No one carries them for aeshtitic appeal . Is it true some people carry them for defense ? Sure , but its defense on the premise that you can kill someone who attacks you , or at least deter them via threat of death . This is n't to take sides in this debate , I do n't want to . But I have heard this argument made many times before , and it is getting annoying because it is clearly invalid .""","""dsadevil , your argument has been ignored . It seems that the pro-gunners have a habit of ignoring arguments that do n't support their agenda . It 's also happened in this forum with the subject of fatty foods .""",AGREE,"""Originally posted by dsadevil The purpose of a car is not to kill someone/thing with , it is for transportation . If it is misused , it can kill , but as y'all claim , that applies to anything . The key difference with guns is that the primary and really sole purpose of guns is to kill something with . No one carries them for aeshtitic appeal . Is it true some people carry them for defense ? Sure , but its defense on the premise that you can kill someone who attacks you , or at least deter them via threat of death . This is n't to take sides in this debate , I do n't want to . But I have heard this argument made many times before , and it is getting annoying because it is clearly invalid .""","""dsadevil , your argument has been ignored . It seems that the pro-gunners have a habit of ignoring arguments that do n't support their agenda . It 's also happened in this forum with the subject of fatty foods""",,
2219,592,"""Bigots will be bigots . ...""","""and a quote from jitobear :""",DISAGREE,"""Bigots will be bigots""","""a quote from jitobear :""",,
2254,603,"""It seemed logical to me once , the idea of macro-evolution . Let us suppose we have a species called `` X `` . If over a period of time the population became split by distance , we could call them `` X-1 `` and `` X-2 `` . Again , over a period of time , changes may have happened in one group , through mutations , so that `` X-1 `` may have changed so much that if the two populations were ever re-united , they 'd be unable to inter-breed ... thus they 'd be two distinct species . Evolutionaries call this Sympatric Speciation .""","""Actually , mutations accumulate in both populations .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolutionaries call this Sympatric Speciation .""","""Actually , mutations accumulate in both populations .""",,
2258,604,"""`` ( 19 . ) Even if criminals didn & # 8217 ; t have access to guns , they could always use baseball bats or knives to commit crimes instead , because we all know that it & # 8217 ; s just as easy to do a drive-by stabbing or clubbing as it is to do a drive-by shooting .""","""So now we 're embracing the concept that the victims of brutal stabbings are less important than those who 've been shot to death ?""",DISAGREE,"""criminals guns knives shooting""","""victims brutal stabbings shot to death""",,
2273,609,"""Much like whether it was Julius Caesar who crossed the Rubicon , or a decoy of his .""","""More proof to prove my point , thanks !""",AGREE,"""Much like whether it was Julius Caesar who crossed the Rubicon , or a decoy of his""","""More proof to prove my point , thanks""",,
2289,613,"""Regardless of the name change , the calendars are still keyed on the birth and death of Christ ... and that will be so at least until the atheists are able to come up with another numbering system and force it on everyone else just to pacify their own baby mentalities .""","""I thought that the most commonly accepted date for the alleged birth of Jesus was in 4 B.C . Assuming the current calendar really were keyed on the birth of Christ , how could Christ have been born Before Christ ?""",DISAGREE,"""the calendars are still keyed on the birth and death of Christ""","""keyed on the birth Christ have been born Before Christ""",,
2304,617,"""N. Wells ... if the Neanderthal morphology changed into modern human morphology quickly , then that means non-evolutionary mechanisms were responsible .""","""Well all you have to do is tell us the minimum time during which it could happen by NDS theory and then how long it actually took and we can compare the numbers . Of course you will have to detail how you arrived at both sets of numbers . Enjoy""",DISAGREE,"""Wells ... if the Neanderthal morphology changed into modern human morphology quickly , then that means non-evolutionary mechanisms were responsible .""","""Well all you have to do is tell us the minimum time during which it could happen by NDS theory and then how long it actually took and we can compare the""",,
2309,619,"""I am still sympathetic to your first post , and I can understand your frustration from being attacked like here , but I am disturbed when you say `` Science is a joke `` . Did you really mean this ?""","""Yes . Because evolution requires an old earth , supersport has lumped geology into the evil conspiracy . As our best explanations for the formation of the earth appeal to cosmology , that field as well as astronomy fall within the realm of quack science , according to supersport . In fact , every scientific discipline that has any connection whatsoever to evolution must be corrupt ; obviously , chemistry is one of them ( we ca n't make glycogen or DNA without magical , `` atheistic `` polymerization , right ? ) .""",DISAGREE,"""I am disturbed when you say `` Science is a joke `` .""","""every scientific discipline that has any connection whatsoever to evolution must be corrupt ;""",,
2312,620,"""This is the `` right `` SCOTUS to hear the case , IMO .""","""Do n't expect Scalia to be too friendly to this case , and of course whatever Scalia does Thomas does . It would be sadly ironic if we progunrights people lost this case even with Kennedy 's vote .""",DISAGREE,"""This is the `` right `` SCOTUS to hear the case""","""Do n't expect Scalia to be too friendly to this case""",,
2321,623,"""I see you Americans deal as loosely with the French and Spanish languages , as you do with English ! Surely it is something like Viva Libertad , or Vive la Liberte , but Viva La Liberty ? ? ? ? ? Leo""","""I think it 's a twist on lousy use of French in movies . BTW , your former would definately be Spanish . Tu hablas espanol ? No me gusta hablar espanol .""",DISAGREE,"""Americans deal as loosely with the French and Spanish languages""","""it 's a twist on lousy use of French in movies .""",,
2344,626,"""If I can find the time , is anyone here interested in debating the virgin birth in the debate section ? I would debate it didn ’ t happen .""","""Actually Hank I agree with you . I do n't believe it happened either . I am curious to hear your opinion on the matter .""",AGREE,"""virgin birth I would debate it didn ’ t happen .""","""Actually Hank I agree with you I do n't believe it happened either .""",,
2353,627,"""I do n't know what I think about this . Personally , I believed that Cain and Seth did marry their sisters . I know , sounds like incest , and today that is what it would be . However , you need to remember that there were no exact set of laws at the beginning of the creation . Almost all of God 's followers were spoken to by him and were given visions and angels to tell them what to do . I do n't believe it was considered incest till the law was written abolishing that sort of thing . I 'm not sure about him creating other women either , but you could be right . After all , I 've found the idea of him creating life on other planets AFTER the creation acceptable ( still wondering about the end of the creation where he stopped though ) so with that view in mind , I suppose it 's possible .""","""Yea I agree with you on how there was no exact se t of laws at the beginning of creation . The reason I say that they most likely did n't marry their sisters is mostly cause God gets mad at Cain and places a mark on his head so everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his . Kinda just says that there are other people out there .""",AGREE,"""I believed that Cain and Seth did marry their sisters . I . I 'm not sure about him creating other women either , but you could be right .""","""places a mark on his head everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his there are other people out there .""",,
2354,627,"""I do n't know what I think about this . Personally , I believed that Cain and Seth did marry their sisters . I know , sounds like incest , and today that is what it would be . However , you need to remember that there were no exact set of laws at the beginning of the creation . Almost all of God 's followers were spoken to by him and were given visions and angels to tell them what to do . I do n't believe it was considered incest till the law was written abolishing that sort of thing . I 'm not sure about him creating other women either , but you could be right . After all , I 've found the idea of him creating life on other planets AFTER the creation acceptable ( still wondering about the end of the creation where he stopped though ) so with that view in mind , I suppose it 's possible .""","""Yea I agree with you on how there was no exact se t of laws at the beginning of creation . The reason I say that they most likely did n't marry their sisters is mostly cause God gets mad at Cain and places a mark on his head so everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his . Kinda just says that there are other people out there .""",AGREE,"""no exact set of laws at the beginning of the creation . I do n't believe it was considered incest till the law was written abolishing that sort of thing .""","""Yea I agree with you on how there was no exact se t of laws at the beginning of creation . The reason I say that they most likely did n't marry their sisters is mostly cause God gets mad at Cain and places a mark on his head so everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his .""",,
2352,627,"""I do n't know what I think about this . Personally , I believed that Cain and Seth did marry their sisters . I know , sounds like incest , and today that is what it would be . However , you need to remember that there were no exact set of laws at the beginning of the creation . Almost all of God 's followers were spoken to by him and were given visions and angels to tell them what to do . I do n't believe it was considered incest till the law was written abolishing that sort of thing . I 'm not sure about him creating other women either , but you could be right . After all , I 've found the idea of him creating life on other planets AFTER the creation acceptable ( still wondering about the end of the creation where he stopped though ) so with that view in mind , I suppose it 's possible .""","""Yea I agree with you on how there was no exact se t of laws at the beginning of creation . The reason I say that they most likely did n't marry their sisters is mostly cause God gets mad at Cain and places a mark on his head so everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his . Kinda just says that there are other people out there .""",AGREE,"""you need to remember that there were no exact set of laws at the beginning of the creation .""","""I agree with you on how there was no exact of laws at the beginning of creation .""",,
2360,628,"""and ? ? ? ? ? ? ... that did n't answer my question .""","""Wead my weply to wascally ... Species evolve because the sequence and organisation of genes evolves . It does n't take a vast amount of genetic change to evolve one species from another , but it does take genetic change , and molecular geneticists are currently mapping the sort of changes needed to alter rates and timing of gene expression.If you remove the genes from a cell that requires constant gene expression to function , it will cease to function . That 's so obvious it does n't need explicating . I do not see , hoever , how any of this can be used to make an anti-Darwinian case . Biologists already know there 's more to evolution than Darwinian natural selection , hells bells , even Darwin knew that ! There is nothing in theory to prevent autoregulatory gene networks that control their own expression evolving by natural selection . If there is , somehow every biologists seems to have missed it .""",DISAGREE,"""and ? ? ? ? ? ? ... that did n't answer my question .""","""Species evolve because the sequence and organisation of genes evolves . It does n't take a vast amount of genetic change to evolve one species from another , but it does take genetic change , and molecular geneticists are currently mapping the sort of changes needed to alter rates and timing of gene expression.If you remove the genes from a cell that requires constant gene expression to function , it will cease to function .""",,
2370,629,"""Not to make thing seam even darker or any thing but Resident bush made it policy to cut aid to countries in Africa who gave out condoms and other birth control Only counters in Africa that teach abstinence get US aid . .""","""Actually , I believe it was a Reagan policy continued by both Bushes .""",DISAGREE,"""cut aid to countries in Africa who gave out condoms""","""I believe it was a Reagan policy continued by both Bushes .""",,
2410,637,"""It is disappointing that you would continue with this mistake . I said that God is both knowable and unknowable . You simply think that equates to the same thing , and thus you argue against what you believe I say , rather than what I said .""","""You claim god is unknowable ( partially or otherwise , it does not matter ) . You claim to know something of the unknowable , thus , you make a self-contradictory statement . Again . For what ... the third time ? Drop it , you 're arguing illogically and I 'm embarassed for you .""",DISAGREE,"""said that God is both knowable and unknowable .""","""You claim to know something of the unknowable , thus , you make a self-contradictory""",,
2418,639,"""What guy and what post ?""","""Benjamin , post 1 . The guy who , to all appearances , has gone away .""",DISAGREE,"""What guy and what post ?""","""Benjamin , post 1""",,
2422,640,"""Well , it is all really silly . You 're fighting over an issue that will never be resolved . Believ what you want , because you can never be proven wrong . Let church teach creation and school teach evolution , stop fighting over this , and everyone will be happy .""","""And let 's do away with these stinking debate forums ! So if it 's silly to discuss that , what about brand of trucks ? Would that also be silly ? V10 Gasoline or 6.0 Diesel ? How big a tire can you put on a stock 3/4 ton truck ? See , you 're right . It 's just silly .""",AGREE,"""You 're fighting over an issue that will never be resolved . Believ what you want""","""And let 's do away with these stinking debate forums""",,
2430,642,"""And like the police , the Navy could plan and execute raids . Maybe escorts are n't the way to go . I have n't suggested they should . I am suggesting that other solutions might be more effective and less dangerous to merchant crews .""","""Oh thats not politically kerect and secially wif the chosen one doing the world apology toure I do n't see that going down . Well lay a few on us sin baby . Give us the deal .""",DISAGREE,"""And like the police , the Navy could plan and execute raids . Maybe escorts are n't the way to go .""","""Oh thats not politically kerect and secially wif the chosen""",,
2441,645,"""The fact is that some arctic foxes never are pure white . http : //www.greglasley.net/Images/ArcticFoxF2.jpg""","""Yup ! That 's the white morph . Does n't help your case any .""",DISAGREE,"""http : //www.greglasley.net/Images/ArcticFoxF2.jpg""","""That 's the white morph . Does n't help your case any .""",,
2469,652,"""I would suggest that you re-read the suggested texts . Let me restate : 1 ) All organisms produce so many offspring that their numbers would increase exponentially without constraint . Yet adult populations remain reletively constant .""","""And that 's an observation , is n't it ? Not an assumption . Calling it an assumption was the mistake . Darwin devotes a whole chapter to this .""",DISAGREE,"""I would suggest that you re-read the suggested texts . Let me restate""","""And that 's an observation , is n't it ? Not an assumption .""",,
2492,655,"""Would you have supported the `` freedom `` for Hitler and his cronies to own guns in 1932 ? Mao in 1947-48 ? Because those freedoms directly led to the abrogation of the ultimate right -- the right to life -- for at least 30 million people .""","""Oh really ? Gun ownership allowed these `` lunatics `` as you call them , to become government dictators ? If I owned 50 guns and 10,000 rounds of ammunition , you 're saying I could run the government with an iron fist all by myself , just like that ? Any random person can just appoint themselves God over the entire nation , without a single ounce of resistance just because they 're armed ?""",DISAGREE,"""Because those freedoms directly led to the abrogation of the ultimate right -- the right to life""","""you 're saying I could run the government with an iron fist all by myself , just like that ?""",,
2496,656,"""and that creation scientists are liars .""","""No problem . Pick your creation `` scientist `` and I 'll show you how they are a liar .""",AGREE,"""and that creation scientists are liars .""","""Pick your creation `` scientist `` and I 'll show you how they are a liar .""",,
2512,659,"""Just when you are ready to come get my guns ...... remember !""","""And you 're accusing him of not debating properly ? That 's the best you can do ?""",DISAGREE,"""Just when you are ready to come get my guns""","""And you 're accusing him of not debating properly ? That 's the best you can do ?""",,
2514,659,"""Just when you are ready to come get my guns ...... remember !""","""And you 're accusing him of not debating properly ? That 's the best you can do ?""",DISAGREE,"""ready get my guns""","""you 're accusing him That 's the best you can do ?""",,
2523,662,"""Just out of curiousity , does anyone on here really agree with using abortion as a means of birth control ?""","""Of course it should n't be used as birth control , but because of religious ignorance against birth control , in any form , so many do n't have easy access , or even proper education about such things . Places which have proper access and education have far fewer unwanted pregancies as well . The USA has twice as many unwanted pregancies as Canada and I think 36 times as many as Japan . BTW , an interesting fact is that the USA ( 280 million } is now the 3rd most populous nation in the world right after China ( 1.3 billion ) , and India ( 1 billion ) . The former USSR had been 3rd , I think , with a little over 300 million .""",DISAGREE,"""does anyone on here really agree with using abortion as a means of birth control ?""","""Of course it should n't be used as birth control , but because of religious ignorance against birth control , in any form , so many do n't have easy access , or even proper education about such things . Places which have proper access and education have far fewer unwanted pregancies as well .""",,
2538,665,"""Life has never been made in the laboratory .""","""That 's not evolution . Life has evolved in the lab , many times .""",DISAGREE,"""Life has never been made in the laboratory .""","""That 's not evolution .""",,
2555,677,"""Do we want America to be known as an abortion nation ? America should ban abortion , that way we can set a good example for other countries so that they may follow our good example . If people die because of black market abortions than , even though I am a Catholic , I say that they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""So you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",DISAGREE,"""America should ban abortion , If people die because of black market abortions they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""So you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",,
2556,677,"""Do we want America to be known as an abortion nation ? America should ban abortion , that way we can set a good example for other countries so that they may follow our good example . If people die because of black market abortions than , even though I am a Catholic , I say that they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""So you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",DISAGREE,"""America should ban abortion , that way we can set a good example for other countries so that they may follow our good example . If people die because of black market abortions than , even though I am a Catholic , I say that they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""So you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",,
2558,677,"""Do we want America to be known as an abortion nation ? America should ban abortion , that way we can set a good example for other countries so that they may follow our good example . If people die because of black market abortions than , even though I am a Catholic , I say that they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""So you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",DISAGREE,"""America should ban abortion If people die because of black market abortions than , even though I am a Catholic , I say that they deserve it after what they did to a poor child .""","""you would rather that a grown woman , a mother even , died in pain rather than an 8 week old foetus which can not feel pain ?""",,
2562,678,"""The women of Islam need to become feminists . That 's all that 's needed .""","""Theres a book my mom has called `` The trouble with Islam `` by some lady . I do n't know her name , but it looks like it may bee a good book for you .""",DISAGREE,"""The women of Islam need to become feminists . That 's all that 's needed .""","""Theres a book my mom has called `` The trouble with Islam `` by some lady .""",,
2591,690,"""We did n't discover it , we invented it . The Greeks firstly IIRC . Guess what , they were n't Christians .""","""Your statment is like saying we evented 2+2= 4 . We did not envent it , it aways existed . Same with logic , its a concept that exists apart from the meterial universe . But in the atheists worldview , only the meterial universe exists .""",DISAGREE,"""We did n't discover it , we invented it .""","""We did not envent it , it aways existed .""",,
2593,691,"""False alarm : General Misunderstanding is still calling the shots ! There 's no such thing as 'Natural and undirected ' . Drop a rock and tell me how 'undirected ' the results are for you .""","""Tell me who directed it .""",DISAGREE,"""Drop a rock and tell me how 'undirected ' the results are for you .""","""Tell me who directed it .""",,
2597,692,"""Without life itself , quality is a non-issue .""","""Exactly , you have contradicted yourself and shown that the `` sanctity `` of life is a necessary foundation for the `` quality of life ``""",DISAGREE,"""Without life itself , quality is a non-issue .""","""Exactly""",,
2598,692,"""Without life itself , quality is a non-issue .""","""Exactly , you have contradicted yourself and shown that the `` sanctity `` of life is a necessary foundation for the `` quality of life ``""",DISAGREE,"""Without life itself , quality is a non-issue .""","""you have contradicted yourself and shown that the `` sanctity `` of life is a necessary foundation for the `` quality of life ``""",,
2624,697,"""Science could clear that question up with a little carbon 14 test to rule out recent exsitence :""","""This why we think you 're a liar . http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dino ... teocalcin.html""",DISAGREE,"""Science could clear that question up with a little carbon 14 test to rule out recent exsitence :""","""This why we think you 're a liar""",,
2626,698,"""I do n't think those blanket statements necessarily apply . You have to realize that there is something behind the proclamations of that sort of morality ; human life is sacred is n't just a proclamation , it 's a philosophy . The case could just as easily be made that pro-choicers are basing their morality on a proclamation as well , that `` reason is the basis for morality `` . Even if you call either a case of proclamation , it 's the philosophy behind it that serves as the basis for the morality , not statement itself .""","""What are the reasons which you would present behind the statement `` all human life is sacred `` ( or whichever similar statement you think is the core of your pro-life stance ) ? If morality is based only on arbitrary proclamations , then there is little chance of consensus because other groups or religions come up with other arbitrary set of rules and we are back to the situation of , in the worst case , chaos and , in the best case , a majority imposing arbitrary rules on an unwilling suffering minority . I suspect that a lot of people , if not most people , at least partially follow some version of `` treat others as you would have yourself be treated `` . When , as children , we were scolded `` How would you like it if ... `` that is a tactic of teaching this rule . For those who are religious ( which I only marginally , occasionally and hesitatingly am ) , even Jesus stated `` Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. `` in the Sermon on the Mount talk ( as quoted by ShadowPikachu ) . Many world religions and philosophies seem to incorporate that general rule , which is partly why I think it has a reasonable chance at being incorporated as a global base of morality .""",DISAGREE,"""blanket statements something behind the proclamations""","""all human life is sacred treat others as you would have yourself be treated""",,
2651,702,"""Hello everyone , I am a high school student seeking help . Me and my partner are about to enter a debate on firearms , and we already know that we are for guns . Can you all just tell me if you are for guns or not and a short reason why ? Thank you .""","""Well , to keep it short , IÂ ’ ll cite you to what I think are two of the best expressions of why the RKBA exists . The first was said by an Englishman named Andrew Fletcher , whose work was frequently cited by our founders to justify armed resistance against British misrule in America . The second was said by a Judge in my beloved Commonwealth of Virginia : And I can not see , why arms should be denied to any man who is not a slave , since they are the only true badges of liberty . . . .The possession of arms is the distinction between a freeman and a slave . He who has nothing , and belongs to another , must be defended by him , and needs no arms : but he who thinks he is his own master , and has anything he may call his own , ought to have arms to defend himself and what he possesses , or else he lives precariously and at discretion . And though for a while those who have the sword in their power abstain from doing him injury ; yet , by degrees , he will be awed into submission to every arbitrary command . Andrew Fletcher , Political Works , pp . 35 and 221 ( 1749 ) . The right of self-defense is the first law of nature ; in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest possible limits ... and [ when ] the right of the people to keep and bear arms is , under any color or pretext whatsoever , prohibited , liberty , if not already annihilated , is on the brink of destruction . Sir George Tucker , Judge of the Virginia Supreme Court and U.S. District Court of Virginia , in I Blackstone COMMENTARIES , Sir George Tucker Ed. , 1803 , pg . 300 There are many solid legal , moral , and practical arguments in support of private firearm ownership . Some are short , but many are long . I know quite a few of them , and IÂ ’ ll happily share them with you if you want some more ammo for your debate . Just let me know here . -- - False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience ; that would take fire from men because it burns , and water because one may drown in it ; that has no remedy for evils , except destruction . The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature . They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . Can it be supposed that those who have the courage to violate the most sacred laws of humanity , the most important of the code , will respect the less important and arbitrary ones , which can be violated with ease and impunity , and which , if strictly obeyed , would put and end to personal liberty -- so dear to men , so dear to the enlightened legislator -- and subject innocent persons to all the vexations that the guilty alone ought to suffer ? Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants ; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides , for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man . They ought to be designated as laws not preventative but fearful of crimes , produced by the tumultuous impression of a few isolated facts , and not by thoughtful consideration of the inconveniences and advantages of a universal decree . Thomas Jefferson , Commonplace Book , 1774-1776 , quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria in On Crimes and Punishment , 1764 A militia , when properly formed , are in fact the people themselves , and render regular troops in a great measure unnecessary . . . .the constitution ought to secure a genuine and guard against a select militia. . .and include. . .all men capable of bearing arms. . . . But , say gentlemen , the general militia are for the most part employed at home in their private concerns , can not well be called out , or be depended upon ; that we must have a select militia. . . . [ of the select militia ] These Corps , not much unlike regular troops , well ever produce an inattention to the general militia. . .whereas , to preserve liberty , it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms , and be taught alike , especially when young , how to use them . . . .The mind that aims at a select militia , must be influenced by a truly anti-republican principle ; and when we see many men disposed to practice upon it , whenever they can prevail , no wonder true republicans are for carefully guarding against it . Richard Henry Lee , Additional Letters from the Federal Farmer , p. 169-170 ( 1788 ) Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India , history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest . If we want the Arms Act to be repealed , if we want to learn the use of arms , here is a golden opportunity . If the middle class render voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial , distrust will disappear , and the ban on possessing arms will be withdrawn . Ghandi , 2 M. Gandhi , An Autobiography of the Story of My Experiments with the Truth , p. 374 ( M. Desai , trans . 1927 ) . Whenever , therefore , the profession of arms becomes a distinct order in the state. . .the end of the social compact is defeated . . . .No free government was ever founded , or ever preserved its liberty , without uniting the characters of the citizen and soldier in those destined for defense of the state . . . .Such a well regulated militia , composed of freeholders , citizens and husbandman , who take up arms to preserve their property , as individuals , and their rights as freemen . M. T. Cicero ( a pseudonym taken by a writer arguing during the constitutional debates ) , Charleston State Gazette , September 8 , 1788 It has been asserted by the most respectable writers upon government , that a well-regulated militia , composed of the yeomanry of the country , have ever been considered as the bulwark of a free people . Tyrants have never placed any confidence on a militia composed of freemen . John DeWitt , The Anti-Federalist Papers , p. 75 ( M. Borden ed . 1965 ) Make mass searches and hold executions for found arms . V. I. Lenin , Collected Works , Vol . 35 , 4th ed. , p. 286 . From Congressional Record , April 28 , 1970 , p. H3601 . If the opposition disarms , well and good . If it refuses to disarm , we shall disarm it ourselves . Joseph Stalin , Reply to the discussion on the Political Reports of the Central Committee , Dec. 7 , 1927 . Stalin , Works , Vol . 10 , p. 378 . From Congressional Record , April 28 , 1970 , p. H3601 .. The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms . History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing . Indeed , I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty . So let 's not have any native militia or native police . German troops alone will bear the sole responsibility for the maintenance of law and order throughout the occupied Russian territories , and a system of military strong-points must be evolved to cover the entire occupied country . Adolf Hitler , dinner talk on April 11 , 1942 , quoted in Hitler 's Table Talk 1941-44 : His Private Conversations , Second Edition ( 1973 ) , Pg . 425-426 .""",AGREE,"""Me and my partner are about to enter a debate on already know that we are for guns""","""happily share them with you if you want some more ammo for your debate .""",,
2665,704,"""may there never be a 34th !""","""Agreed !""",AGREE,"""may there never be a 34th !""","""Agreed !""",,
2679,706,"""And the reason they say that -- one of them -- is that NS on the level of the population is random .... which makes absolutely no sense what-so-ever . With a constantly changing environment it is so obvious to me that different groups of animals would do better in different environments . This is where competition really happens .""","""He only understands natural selection when he belives that it goes against what is accepted by scientists .""",DISAGREE,"""is that NS on the level of the population is random""","""only understands natural selection when he belives that it goes against what is accepted by scientists .""",,
2683,707,"""I concur . Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago and the Wild West still has n't gotten here . What the hell is it waiting for ?""","""The Muslim invasion . You guys need targets right ?""",DISAGREE,"""Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago and the Wild West still has n't gotten here""","""The Muslim invasion . You guys need targets right""",,
2688,708,"""Those links have long been refuted http : //www.creationwiki.org/ ( Talk.Or ... dd_information http : //www.creationwiki.org/ ( Talk.Or ... e_new_features""","""`` refuted ? `` O'rly ? First they start off defining evolution as `` moleclues to man `` despite what evolution actually states . That further proves my point about strawman . They do n't discuss what evolution actually is . Furthermore , the whole notion that increasing capacity and adaption is not increasing complexity is insane . If I take a simple structure , modify it to form something more complex , is that not a change in complexity ? The whole idea that modifying DNA , changing it , removing and adding is n't actually changing anything is retarded . And they are separating macro from micro . That 's an invalid argument given that macro is nothing more then the aggregate of micro . A billion tiny changes makes a few large ones . The second idiotic article cites Natural genetic engineering . Despite there being absolutely no evidence of this occuring anywhere .""",DISAGREE,"""Those links have long been refuted http :""","""The whole idea that modifying DNA , changing it , removing and adding is n't actually changing anything is retarded""",,
2699,712,"""Can you imagine what the U.S. population would be without abortion ? Who will take care of all these children when the potential parent can not ?""","""The idea of abortion as population control is absurd , especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts ago . Anyone who has read a biology book knows the world has methods of population control on its own , we do n't need to be doing stuff like that ourselves .""",DISAGREE,"""U.S. population would be without abortion""","""especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts""",,
2710,716,"""DNA is just a representative of what we are , where we live , what our social environment is , what our ecological environment is , etc .""","""BWAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH ! [ /quote ] So you are saying that my DNA reflects the fact that I live in Texas ?""",DISAGREE,"""our social environment is , what our ecological environment""","""DNA reflects the fact that I live in Texas""",,
2722,720,"""Well , there is no way I 'd ever need an abortion , except for rape . I decided at 10 to live a life of celibacy because so much human suffering is related to desires of the flesh .""","""Well that explains your anger . I hope you are blessed with homeliness . Makes your commitment easier to keep . How old are you now ?""",DISAGREE,"""there is no way I 'd ever need an abortion , except for rape""","""I hope you are blessed with homeliness . Makes your commitment easier to keep""",,
2725,721,"""Modern society does not fit well with the society of 2000+ years ago , with their beleifs eroding away those who see themselves primarily as 'American Christians ' may find this involentary loss of beleif as worrying and threatening to the older , more familiar ways . This might manifest as a general feeling of fear and being threatened , hence the percieved need for weapons .""","""So , are you saying that all anti-gunners are fearless ? ? ? If so , ,I must laugh .""",DISAGREE,"""might manifest as a general feeling of fear and being threatened , hence the percieved need for weapons""","""all anti-gunners are fearless""",,
2732,723,"""As we all have seen , creationists ca n't debate if their lives depended on it . Let 's examine their style 1 ) Refuse to comment upon scientific procedures 2 ) When faced with hard facts , move the argument to either a emotional ground , or question the personal , non-scientific beliefs of the evolution believer . 3 ) Lie like there is no tomorrow 4 ) Refuse to acknowledge anything they simply do n't like 5 ) When faced with a point they can not use # 2 on , ignore it completely like it does not exist 6 ) Classical ad-naeseum Can you think of any more ?""","""1 . ) Refusing to comment on scientific procedure means absolutely nothing . Maybe we do n't have anything to say . 2 . ) Testing your beliefs of your own scientific conclusions is not wrong . 3 . ) I do n't lie dude . 4 . ) Because we do n't give the response you would like is not wrong . 5 . ) Do n't think so . 6 . ) The only thing classical ad-naeseum is your own preconceived idea's of creationism and creationist . You do n't want to debate the issues like normal civil people , you just want try to make fools of creationists . Usually you 're the one who start 's the insulting . Your hatred is obivious and you 're open to nothing . Just good 'ol boys patting each other on the back . I know this probably does n't apply to everyone , there are some good guys out there .""",DISAGREE,"""As we all have seen , creationists ca n't debate if their lives depended on it .""","""Refusing to comment on scientific procedure means absolutely nothing .""",,
2757,737,"""But abiogenesis , and so much more of `` science `` attempts to stop religion - attempts to alter the worldview of students . In the Arthur Jones copy/paste in my first post , did you notice how he said that his professor , Otto Lowenstien , `` made a point of telling me that no creationist would be allowed to do research in his department ! ``""","""I believe this is wrong . But this is a private company , and if they want to discriminate based on religion , that 's fine , just as a church may outlaw atheists . Do I agree with it ? No . But does it have to do with our debate ? No . This is about the science classroom . Also , again abiogenesis is a hypothesis , the same level as ID .""",DISAGREE,"""But abiogenesis , and so much more of `` science `` attempts to stop religion - attempts to alter the worldview of students""","""I believe this is wrong . But this is a private company , and if they want to discriminate based on religion ,""",,
2765,738,"""I wo n't try to explain this , but anybody who has the book can read pages 240-243 to see what marc is once again omitting . Miller continues by explaining that he feels God 's interactions with the world are few and far between because they are strategically placed , and he puts it in a context than any believer has surely heard , believed , and repeated dozens of times : We do n't see huge Godly magic tricks because `` God does n't work that way. `` When I ask for an obvious sign , like my keyboard floating before my eyes , and it does n't happen , the excuse I hear is that `` God does n't work that way. `` Now , all of a sudden , marc has a problem with that explanation . Go figure .""","""And that 's all irrelevent , because pages 240-243 concern what happens in the world today , not what happened concerning creation . His feelings about God 's interactions with the world today would be different if he had a basic knowledge of the Bible .""",DISAGREE,"""pages 240-243 Miller continues by explaining""","""what happens in the world today knowledge of the Bible""",,
2771,739,"""4 ) Yes , there are all kinds of long winded rants about all the details of how the ID proponents were being treated perfectly fair . It 's up to anyone who actually watched the movie to decide if these people just were n't intelligent enough to make the grade , while ALL the Ward Churchill 's of the academic world seldom seem to have any problems .""","""Notice that nowhere here do you address the claims and evidence -- which the movie apparently lacks -- about the assertions of `` the expelled. `` Trying to deflect attention from your inability to respond substantively wo n't fly with us ; these guys are fudging the stories and sharing only selected pieces in a specific attempt to hide what really happened . For what it 's worth , I feel a hell of a lot more vulnerable as an atheist in my profession and location than IDers should feel in research and teaching academia .""",DISAGREE,"""long winded rants about all the details of how the ID proponents were being treated perfectly fair""","""profession and location than IDers should feel in research and teaching academia""",,
2775,740,"""Your stated stereotype of the person in the story is racist . It 's a racist stereotype and you know it .""","""Since you redacted my previous statement , I repeat it for your benefit : There is nothing racist about the truth . Notice the underlying message in your posted article is about the Court of Appeals throwing her LAWSUIT out . That was the underlying agenda which motivated this racist jerk who also happens to be black . It is common of these people today to refuse to obey the law , then blame the cops for not allowing them to act like they do . Remember that it was she who was speeding in a school zone , then to refuse to give up her keys made her a public safety threat . She deserved what she got even though the thought of a pregnant woman being tasered is scary to me , she could have avoided it by cooperating with the police . I 'm not pregnant and I would cooperate to avoid it . This is why I think she had other motives which makes her the lowest of the low since she was carrying another life within her .""",DISAGREE,"""racist""","""There is nothing racist about the truth . That was the underlying agenda which motivated this racist jerk who also happens to be black .""",,
2781,741,"""In other words , you think a Supreme Court decision should only shut down the debate if it 's a decision you agree with . Roe v. Wade and Heller do share some striking similarities .""","""Heller is about determining the answer to a long standing question on the nature of the Second Amendment , and how much gun control is legally allowed . Roe v. Wade is about finding legal precedent for the murder of unborn children . I see absolutely no comparison between the two .""",DISAGREE,"""In other words , you think a Supreme Court decision should only shut down the debate if it 's a decision you agree with""","""Heller is about determining the answer to a long standing question on the nature of the Second Amendment ,""",,
2792,743,"""Its the reading comprehension thing kicking in . ... [ according to ATF special agent William Newell , about 17 percent of guns associated with crime in Mexico came from the United States . ... 5th paragraph""","""Except that that would be the author 's words , not a direct quote . Notice the absence of quotation marks ? Special Agent Newell never said `` 17 % came from the US `` . The author has as much trouble with the stats as you . 17 % of the total have been traced to the US . We do n't know the percentage of the total that did indeed come from the US but is untraced or untraceable . See the difference ?""",DISAGREE,"""Its the reading comprehension thing kicking in according to ATF special agent William Newell , about 17 percent of guns associated with crime in Mexico came from the United States .""","""Except that that would be the author 's words , not a direct quote . Notice the absence of quotation marks ? Special Agent Newell never said `` 17 % came from the US `` . The author has as much trouble with the stats as you . 17 % of the total have been traced to the US .""",,
2809,745,"""Even if you want to lump any and all divine intervention under `` creationism `` , disproving evolution would not prove creationism . That 's called a `` false dichotomy `` .""","""how is disproving the best explanation scientists can come up with for the diversity of life without divine intervention not an argument for divine intervention ?""",DISAGREE,"""disproving evolution would not prove creationism .""","""how is an argument for divine intervention""",,
2837,748,"""Oh , I know what he is trying to establish there . I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish . Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen ( according to him ) . In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""Because the Iliad and Odyssey do not claim to be divine does not mean they should be placed under a different threshold as the Bible . Otherwise , it 's special pleading on your part , and thus logically fallacious . This is one of many inconsistencies between skeptics in regards to the scrutiny of the Bible . They are unwilling to put the standards they have on the Bible against other books similar in age . If they did , there would not be a single book left standing .""",DISAGREE,"""Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen ( according to him ) . In fact , as a return question someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""Because the Iliad and Odyssey do not claim to be divine does not mean they should be placed under a different threshold as the Bible .""",,
2844,748,"""Oh , I know what he is trying to establish there . I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish . Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen ( according to him ) . In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""Because the Iliad and Odyssey do not claim to be divine does not mean they should be placed under a different threshold as the Bible . Otherwise , it 's special pleading on your part , and thus logically fallacious . This is one of many inconsistencies between skeptics in regards to the scrutiny of the Bible . They are unwilling to put the standards they have on the Bible against other books similar in age . If they did , there would not be a single book left standing .""",DISAGREE,"""he is trying to establish there . I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish""","""This is one of many inconsistencies between skeptics""",,
2845,749,"""I 'll be nice ... Out of context sermon ? How about a paraphrased question ... Know the differance ? Forgive me for not having the cut and paste abilities that you have ... Dont be one of those people who gets all huffy puffy over the question . I am all for being armed ... I AM armed ... I have years of tatical weapons training . You should also know ... I have also been a Christian for 26 years ... I am more likely to agree with you , then disagree with you ... But if its an `` out of context sermon `` you want ... let me put down my Bible ... Ill give you a sermon .""","""Sure let me have your sermon/propaganda of misinformation since it does n't match the context of the Scriptures . propaganda n : information that is spread for the purpose of promoting some cause . mis·in·form Pronunciation Key ( msn-fôrm ) tr.v . mis·in·formed , mis·in·form·ing , mis·in·forms To provide with incorrect information . con·text Pronunciation Key ( kntkst ) n. 1 . The part of a text or statement that surrounds a particular word or passage and determines its meaning . 2 . The circumstances in which an event occurs ; a setting . And since your `` experience `` does not guarantee you to be an expert I will stick to the context which matches what I have said . Job 32 : 4 And Elihu had waited for Job with words , because they were older than he in days . 5 When Elihu saw that there was no answer in the mouth of the three men , then his anger burned . 6 And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and said , I am young , and you are very aged ; so I held back and was afraid to make my knowledge known to you . 7 I said , Days will speak , and many years will make wisdom known . 8 But it is a spirit in man giving them perception , even the breath of the Almighty . 9 It is not the great that are wise , nor the aged who perceive justice ; 10 so then I say , Listen to me ; I will declare my knowledge , I also .""",DISAGREE,"""I am all for being armed ... I AM armed ... I have years of tatical weapons training . You should also know ... I have also been a Christian for 26 years ... I am more likely to agree with you , then disagree with you""","""I am young , and you are very aged ; so I held back and was afraid to make my knowledge known to you . 7 I said , Days will speak , and many years will make wisdom known .""",,
2863,752,"""As my Aunt and Uncle helped to provide a loving and safe atmosphere for my mongoloid cousin until he died , so too would I provide love and security for the downs or mongoloid produced by any of my children . It 's called a `` family unit `` . Yes , I am willing to do that .""","""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""",DISAGREE,"""As my Aunt and Uncle helped to provide a loving and safe atmosphere for my mongoloid cousin until he died , so too would I provide love and security for the downs or mongoloid produced by any of my children .""","""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""",,
2864,752,"""As my Aunt and Uncle helped to provide a loving and safe atmosphere for my mongoloid cousin until he died , so too would I provide love and security for the downs or mongoloid produced by any of my children . It 's called a `` family unit `` . Yes , I am willing to do that .""","""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937 ?""",DISAGREE,"""Aunt and Uncle helped to provide a loving and safe atmosphere for my mongoloid""","""Mongoloid ? Is this 1937""",,
2881,756,"""Next they ’ ve trashed God ’ s creation by diverting everyone ’ s attention . It ’ s a subtle move that not many people have noticed . But I ’ ve noticed . What they ’ ve done is a clever sleight-of-hand move . Science no longer looks at animals . They no longer study how organisms interact within their environments . Instead they ’ ve turned everyone ’ s attention to genes , bacteria and virusesÂ….and this is because they know full-well that most people know nothing about these thingsÂ….Thus , they assume ( correctly , unfortunately ) that most people will just take their word for it .""","""The concept that science no longer looks at animals boggles my mind . My brother is a wildlife biology major in college meaning his primary focus is ...... looking at animals and their relationships to one another . It is somewhat understandable that your misconception could arise because molecular biology and genetic engineering are the latest crazes in science . The simple fact is most of the big breakthroughs when studying whole animals have been made . A similar turn has occured in chemistry . I could argue that chemists have subtly turned away from chemical reactions . All the research now is about electron orbitals and nano-structures . The reason for this is these are new fields that are relatively young and many scientists are interested in them . I myself am doing research on buckminster fullerenes . It does n't mean we 've abandoned good old fashioned reactions , we just have more field to play in now .""",DISAGREE,"""God ’ s creation by diverting everyone ’ s attention . It ’ s a subtle move that not many people have noticed . But I ’ ve noticed . What they ’ ve done is a clever sleight-of-hand move .""","""The simple fact is most of the big breakthroughs when studying whole animals have been made .""",,
2928,772,"""`` The Myth of the Pedophile Priest `` : http : //www.catholiceducation.org/ar ... ion/re0534.html""","""Seeing the article you linked to was written in 2002 , over three years ago , do you think the author could perhaps incorporate the new data and rename his piece , `` Maybe There Is Some Truth About Pedophile Priests After All `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""The Myth of the Pedophile Priest""","""do you think the author could perhaps incorporate the new data and rename his piece , `` Maybe There Is Some Truth About Pedophile Priests After All `` ?""",,
2937,774,"""Oh ... so humans all must have the same bone structure ? Kind of like pigmies and Kenyans look so similar . I 'll prove to you on a future post how Neandertals developed their traits -- including their bone structures through a nonrandom mechanism .""","""Prove something besides your ignorance ? Homo-erectus and Neandertals differ in cranium size , bone size , bone structure , number of bones as well as the length and width of individual bones . I can see why people are laughing at you""",DISAGREE,"""Neandertals""","""Homo-erectus and Neandertals differ in cranium size , bone size , bone structure , number of bones as well as the length and width of individual bones . I can see why people are laughing at you""",,
2945,776,"""One drug , Lapatinib , can halve the speed of growth of breast cancer in one in five women with an aggressive form of the disease .""","""So , you are talking an incredibly expensive drug that MAY work 20 % of the time when it is used . Are they just letting these people die .... giving them morphine for the pain and letting them waste away ? No""",DISAGREE,"""One drug , Lapatinib , can halve the speed of growth of breast cancer in one in five women with an aggressive form of the disease .""","""So , you are talking an incredibly expensive drug that MAY work 20 % of the time when it is used . Are they just letting these people die .... giving them morphine for the pain and letting them waste away ? No""",,
2960,779,"""Do your own research . I am not interested in playing a game .""","""I 'm not surprised . That 's a typical response when someone calls your bluff . Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""I am not interested in playing a game .""","""That 's a typical response when someone calls your bluff .""",,
2963,780,"""I remember staying at my grandfather 's house during the summers as a child . After a little exploration , I found the rifle he kept down in the basement and the rifle and ammunition that was in one of the bedrooms on the ground floor .""","""Well obviously you did n't shoot yourself or somebody else .""",DISAGREE,"""I found the rifle he kept down in the basement and the rifle and ammunition that was in one of the bedrooms""","""obviously you did n't shoot yourself or somebody else""",,
2969,781,"""It is the secular museums that are not willing to admit their commitment , by faith , to an unproven story of origins . Yet their words betray them . For instance , the Museum of the Earth ’ s Guide for Museum Docents repeats the mantra :  “ Questions or debates about evolutionary mechanisms have nothing to do with our confidence in whether evolution occurred. ”""","""What ?""",DISAGREE,"""It is the secular museums that are not willing to admit their commitment ,""","""?""",,
2978,782,"""Examples of logical absolutes are : something can not be itself and not itself at the same time ( Law of non contradiction ) . A thing is what it is ( Law of identity ) . A statement is either true or false ( Law of excluded middle ) . These are simple , absolute logical absolutes .""","""There are contradictions in the bible , for so the bible does n't obey the law of non contradiction . As to the law of identity , Jesus is called both the `` Son of God `` and the `` Son of Man `` , which means Also , many parts of the bible are taken as 'metaphors ' - yet the law of excluded middle should prevent us from doing that . I 'm sure someone will be able to refute my individual points , but on the whole the bible is not an entirely logical source . Furthermore , even if these laws were created by a God , this God does not have to be the same one described in any religion whatsoever . In fact , he does n't have to be omnipotent , so he could even be dead - Atheists could state that God created these laws then died . In which case , God does not exist but Atheists have still accounted for the creation of said laws .""",DISAGREE,"""A statement is either true or false ( Law of excluded middle ) . These are simple , absolute logical absolutes .""","""There are contradictions in the bible , for so the bible does n't obey the law of non contradiction""",,
2979,782,"""Examples of logical absolutes are : something can not be itself and not itself at the same time ( Law of non contradiction ) . A thing is what it is ( Law of identity ) . A statement is either true or false ( Law of excluded middle ) . These are simple , absolute logical absolutes .""","""There are contradictions in the bible , for so the bible does n't obey the law of non contradiction . As to the law of identity , Jesus is called both the `` Son of God `` and the `` Son of Man `` , which means Also , many parts of the bible are taken as 'metaphors ' - yet the law of excluded middle should prevent us from doing that . I 'm sure someone will be able to refute my individual points , but on the whole the bible is not an entirely logical source . Furthermore , even if these laws were created by a God , this God does not have to be the same one described in any religion whatsoever . In fact , he does n't have to be omnipotent , so he could even be dead - Atheists could state that God created these laws then died . In which case , God does not exist but Atheists have still accounted for the creation of said laws .""",DISAGREE,"""Law of non contradiction Law of identity ,""","""There are contradictions in the bible , for so the bible does n't obey the law of non contradiction""",,
2982,783,"""There will be more guns on the street whether the Court hears the case or not or regardless of how the Court might rule : gun laws don ’ t effect criminals .""","""If guns laws do n't affect criminals then how do you explain the low rates of criminal gun use in nations like the UK ?""",DISAGREE,"""gun laws don ’ t effect criminals .""","""If guns laws do n't affect criminals""",,
2987,784,"""Shut up habit . You really and truly have absolutely nothing to say . As my mother used to tell me when I was 5 , you 're talking privelages have been revoked .""","""1 ) It 's Habbit . You could at least take 5 seconds to get my name right . 2 ) Considering you and your friends are the ones complaining , not debating ? 3 ) Actually , none of my posting privileges have my revoked . Try again .""",DISAGREE,"""have absolutely nothing to say""","""complaining , not debating""",,
2993,792,"""And secondly , it 's a bit rich for them to call it murder when a blastocyst can turn into a tumour . And oncologists murder tumours all the time ...""","""There you go . It 's difficult to find which side of your mouth to talk out of when the facts are the facts !""",DISAGREE,"""And secondly , it 's a bit rich for them to call it murder when a blastocyst can turn into a tumour . And oncologists murder tumours all the time ...""","""There you go . It 's difficult to find which side of your mouth to talk out of when the facts are the facts !""",,
3003,794,"""You can make the statement 'Based on the current available evidence , I do not believe in the existance of any god/gods . '""","""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it . Sorry if this is just turning into word games .""",DISAGREE,"""I do not believe in the existance of any god/gods . '""","""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it .""",,
3031,800,"""I smell an arcane semantics-based proof brewing ...""","""Give it a rest ... what is evident here is more coffeehouse vasilation on your part ... no foam .""",DISAGREE,"""I smell an arcane semantics-based proof brewing ...""","""Give it a rest ...""",,
3041,802,"""There will always be the silly argument that allowing people to own guns makes gun thefts more likely , thus putting guns in the hands of criminals ... making us all more unsafe .""","""How is that silly ? You do realize that the vast majority of firearms used in crimes are stolen no ? And many of those are stolen from legal buyers . While it is a poor argument to argue that firearms should be banned for that primary reason , the underlying principle of control over supply is hardly silly . Unless you think that control over nuclear weapons is silly . Maybe you would . After all , you are Isly .""",DISAGREE,"""There will always be the silly argument that allowing people to own guns makes gun thefts more likely , thus putting guns in the hands of criminals .""","""do realize that the vast majority of firearms used in crimes are stolen no ?""",,
3058,805,"""So you may want us to believe that abandoning Gods truths and principles is the way to save the church foundit , which I do n't think you actually believe at all , and I 'm sure your god satan agrees with what you recommend . But that is n't how it works in reality , as abandoning Gods truths never leads to good which the massive losses to the above mentioned churches membership is evidence of . Spiritually Dead churches do n't grow , living churches which possess the Holy Spirit of the living God do . So stop your lies and twisting of reality foundit .""","""I spoke no lies . I can substantiate my position WITH POLLS that actually ask the people leaving WHY they are leaving . Rather than listen to that , Archie would have us listen to people who are ENTRENCHED in REPEATING the very reasons why people are leaving Christianity ... Such glaring misrepresentation of reality is obviously an act of a dinosaur complaining as it sinks into the tar pit . A logical person can very well ask `` If the reason people leave Christianity is because the religion is not adhering to biblical principles , then WHY do we STILL HAVE MOST CHRISTIANS thinking homosexuality is a sin ? `` Cause you see , changes like the above with the Lutherans DO NOT come about because most people WANT the church to be more strict ... They come about because there are MORE people in the church who WANT the change .""",DISAGREE,"""So you may want us to believe that abandoning Gods truths and principles is the way to save the church foundit""","""I spoke no lies . I can substantiate my position WITH POLLS""",,
3068,807,"""And this study is just on tadpoles . Does anyone think that this is not a world-wide , creation-wide phenomenon ? Of course it is . Every creature is a product of their environment . Traits are formed from the beginning of conception -- all the way throughout life . Over time , this may give the illusion of `` evolution `` in the fossil record .""","""Fossils show inherited change . Adaptation does not .""",DISAGREE,"""And this study is just on tadpoles . Does anyone think that this is not a world-wide , creation-wide phenomenon ? Of course it is . Every creature is a product of their environment . Traits are formed from the beginning of conception -- all the way throughout life . Over time , this may give the illusion of `` evolution `` in the fossil record .""","""Fossils show inherited change . Adaptation does not .""",,
3077,808,"""I see no duplicity between the two .""","""They are both written in the bible . Neither of them have any evidence ( apart from the bible ) to support their existence . One of them has been proven to be utterly false . This naturally discredits the other , as they appear in the same publication by the same author . Why decide one is true when the other is clearly not , and neither have any other supporting evidence ?""",DISAGREE,"""I see no duplicity between the two .""","""They are both written in the bible .""",,
3084,809,"""Whether the intelligence responsible for the organization of living systems is a force of nature or whether it is directed by some god -- either way , life is intelligently designed .""","""And thats a point of view which has no evidence to support it .""",DISAGREE,"""Whether the intelligence responsible for the organization of living systems is a force of nature or whether it is directed by some god -- either way , life is intelligently designed .""","""thats a point of view which has no evidence to support it .""",,
3087,810,"""Well if it was illegal , would you consider it a crime ?""","""What the Hell kind of a question is that ?""",DISAGREE,"""if it was illegal , would you consider it a crime ?""","""What the Hell kind of a question is that ?""",,
3091,811,"""I , and most people , have a firm assumption , based on all of our and all human 's experience , that the world that we live in exists and that our experiences of the moment are real .""","""How is that based on experience ? We have no data that says 'an outside world exists ' . The assumption that such a world exists is made before we can use the data .""",DISAGREE,"""and most people , have a firm assumption , based on all of our and all human 's experience , that the world that we live in exists and that our experiences of the moment are real .""","""How is that based on experience ? We have no data that says 'an outside world exists ' . The assumption that such a world exists is made before we can use the data .""",,
3107,813,"""This is not true . The wording is highly misleading , because it implies that according to evolutionary theory there were human-ancestors and chimp-ancestors side by side in the primordial ooze ; there were 'us ' and 'them ' . That is absolutely and categorically not the case . I know you insist you understand what evolutionary theory claims , but statements like this demonstrate otherwise . I do n't know what to do except try to help you understand better .""","""I know , because I do n't believe there was any primordial ooze at all . But you do . And you also believe that simple celled life formed in that ooze , then evolved into bacteria to enzymes then amino acids , ( not necessarily in that order ) leading to more complex life forms which eventually crawled out of that ooze and breathed air as amphibians , then to reptiles which some how evolved wings to become birds , and through all of this alleged conglomeration of life came mammals after the Dinos were forced into extinction by that big ole comet . And do n't bother telling me that they believe birds came from Dinos because I 'm aware of that belief too . But none of it can be proven at all when all is said and done .""",DISAGREE,"""it implies that according to evolutionary theory there were human-ancestors""","""leading to more complex life forms which eventually crawled out of that ooze and breathed air as amphibians""",,
3134,819,"""For instance , she has also listed the `` tornado in a hangar assembling a 747 `` argument against abiogenesis , which I know was fed to her and to which not one atheist here could resist replying at least , `` Umm , not quite ... ``""","""Well , my reply probably would n't be that polite ...""",DISAGREE,"""not one atheist here could resist replying at least , `` Umm , not quite ... ``""","""Well , my reply probably would n't be that polite ...""",,
3135,819,"""For instance , she has also listed the `` tornado in a hangar assembling a 747 `` argument against abiogenesis , which I know was fed to her and to which not one atheist here could resist replying at least , `` Umm , not quite ... ``""","""Well , my reply probably would n't be that polite ...""",DISAGREE,"""against abiogenesis , which I know was fed to her and to which not one atheist""","""Well , my reply probably would n't be that polite""",,
3168,832,"""I beleive Currently a strictly materialistic approach has come up with better results in some circustances when it comes to what we can measure . This makes it reasonable to approach any question dealing with what we can measure from a strictly materialistic standpoint .""","""Really , what is the materialistinc approach to which you refer ( assuming you 're also talking about 'pain ' ) ? a ) Is it strictly materialistic , or do they use non-material methods as well ? b ) Can it be used to onbjectively measure pain ?""",DISAGREE,"""strictly materialistic approach has come up with better results in some circustances when it comes to what we can measure""","""it strictly materialistic , or do they use non-material""",,
3187,835,"""The English government has effectively abolished the right of Englishmen , confirmed in their 1689 Bill of Rights , to `` have arms for their defence , ``""","""To be more accurate , ( not something noted amongst the pro-gun rabble ) the right of protestants to have arms for their defence against catholics . I think we 've all seen quite enough of this `` defence `` in Northern Ireland . ( assuming that yanks can locate the place with a map )""",DISAGREE,"""effectively abolished the right""","""the right of protestants to have arms for their defence against catholics""",,
3185,835,"""The English government has effectively abolished the right of Englishmen , confirmed in their 1689 Bill of Rights , to `` have arms for their defence , ``""","""To be more accurate , ( not something noted amongst the pro-gun rabble ) the right of protestants to have arms for their defence against catholics . I think we 've all seen quite enough of this `` defence `` in Northern Ireland . ( assuming that yanks can locate the place with a map )""",DISAGREE,"""have arms for their defence""","""right of protestants to have arms for their defence""",,
3191,836,"""Except that it does nothing of the sort ... But then , what can we expect from somebody citing a website trying to sell you liquid vitamin supplement ... Nevertheless , we look into the Pottenger 's cats claim . Here is a page called , `` Lesson of the Pottenger 's Cats Experiment : cats are not humans. `` Although it 's a page aimed at explaining why this `` experiment `` is not applicable to humans , it exposes the other , erm , flaws in this experiment . The one striking me based on the wikipedia list of diets for the groups should be obvious to everyone : many of these cats were being deprived of protein . This page confirms and elaborates . In fact , its first point is that today 's cats have no problem reproducing for several generations on today 's cooked food . The difference is that good owners do n't feed their pets deficient diets . The real irony here is that this experiment -- were it reliable -- would be the antithesis of supersport 's Lamarckism . In order for supersport to be supported , the cats being fed inadequate diets would re-develop those broken pathways for manufacturing essential amino acids . Obviously , they did not . The only thing we see here is the effect of poor ( i.e . positively malnutritive ) diet . We can conclude that supersport 's Morton 's demon is pretty much in full control . There 's no other explanation for somebody seeing this experiment and thinking it supports Lamarckism , or even counters evolutionary theory , even if he does n't know the basics of experimentation and nutrition .""","""The reality is this is no different the following link : ie ... the animals who were fed one diet passed on traits differently than those who were fed another diet . Traits , according to evolutionists arise RANOCMLY . Get that , geniuses ? RANDOMLY . This is not random . Structural damage in this case did not happen randomly .... nor did the dengenerative effects to the fur , nervous systems , bones , allergies , and mental processes . Instead this was all dictated by the environment . Thus , despite the emergence of new traits in the milk/cooked food-fed diet of the one population , it had nothing to do with darwinian random mutation or natural selection . This is a hole . A huge hole .... it 's environmental evolution ... that is , animals simply changing with a changing environment . Lamarckism predicts that the environment changes first , followed up by new traits . Neo-darwinists say that new traits arise before and/or unoriented to the environment , only to be then be selected . I win . And this is no different than the following : http : //www.the-scientist.com/2004/7/5/14/1/ Normally , the fur of agouti mice is yellow , brown , or a calico-like mixture of the two , depending on the number of attached methyl groups . But when Duke University researchers Jirtle and Waterland fed folic acid and other methyl-rich supplements to pregnant mothers , despite the fact that all offspring inherited exactly the same agouti gene ( i.e. , with no nucleotide differences ) , mice who received supplements had offspring with mostly brown fur , whereas mice without supplements gave birth to mostly yellow pups with a higher susceptibility to obesity , diabetes , and cancer . LAMARCKJean-Baptiste Lamarck ( 1744–1829 ) The environmental ability of epigenetic inheritance may not necessarily bring to mind Lamarckian images of giraffes stretching their necks to reach the treetops ( and then giving birth to progeny with similarly stretched necks ) , but it does give researchers reason to reconsider long-refuted notions about the inheritance of acquired characteristics . Eighteenth-century French naturalist Jean Baptiste de Lamarck proposed that environmental cues could cause phenotypic changes transmittable to offspring . Checkmate , losers . Oh , and by the way , electro-loser ..... it does n't matter if this diet experiment can be extrapolated to humans or not . ( Of course I realize you are just spouting your mouth off just to hear your head rattle ) ... the reality is , though , these cats evolved new traits by way of non-darwinian mechanisms . So did the mice in both experiments and so did the pigs . Are you truly trying to tell me that cats and mice and pigs evolve by way of the inheritance of acquired characteristics but humans do n't ?""",DISAGREE,"""Except that it does nothing of the sort""","""Get that , geniuses ? RANDOMLY""",,
3204,838,"""This post is directed mainly toward men . Women feel free to discuss , but I would like the actual answers to the questions to be from the men . Hitlers or Helpers ? Which one are you ? Hitler defined the Jews as nonhumans , as parasites , so he did execute them . He did . He exercised his freedom of choice , imposed his will upon them , and had them cleaned out from the country . He had them removed , scraped away . A helper is someone who stands alongside another in assistance , and protection . So , which are you ? What kind of a man are you ? Do you have the guts to stand up and defend the weak and helpless ? Or , have you redefined human life so that you can justify killing it ? Do you have the guts to be men and stand for what is right ? Or , is sitting in your couch , watching TV , easier to do than be good men ? Do you have the strength to curtail your own sensual desires ? Or do you seek women for your own pleasure , and then destroy the lives formed in the long because they are inconvenient ? Or , let 's see where you stand ? Are you a Hitler or a helper ? - REAL MEN stand up for the innocent even at the cost of their lives . - REAL MEN do what is right , even when it 's inconvenient . - REAL MEN recognize that there are things greater than themselves , like righteousness , integrity , the need to protect women , the obligation to provide for children , and they live their lives according . - non men get women pregnant after a tryst of satisfying their own desires , and then the emotional burden on the woman to destroy the life within her . - non men advocate killing the weak and defenseless . - non men hide behind the sinful and asinine intellectual arguments of liberals and the ungodly in order to justify the destruction of life so they might be self-assured , and self comforted . - I 'm a real man because I stand against unrighteousness - even when it is extremely difficult . - I 'm a real man because I protect the innocent and the weak . - I 'm a real man because I stand against other males who seek to justify killing the weak and innocent . - I 'm a real man because I advocate the production and preservation of life . - I 'm a real man because I do not set the mother against the child . - I am a real man because I do n't redefine life in emotionally neutral and dry intellectual terms to ease my own conscience . I 'm a helper working against Hitlers !""","""If this is the only way you define manhood , then congratulations . You know passion is a tricky thing . It can bring great gains in society , great achievement . It can also bring horrible horrible things , like this writing . You are making a strawman , if you create your own opposition and make them absurd , then it is surely absurd . You know , here 's what I think about abortion . It does n't matter to me . I do n't really care either way . That being said , it is safer to legalize , it is better to regulate it , and ultimately , as men , we do n't get the choice , do we ? The day when you have to walk into that abortion clinic and make that decision , you stand up and tell me what a real man is . Those poor girls and women who go through abortions did what they had to do , more than you could ever do . Do n't stand on your high horse and lecture the world on the virtuousness of your position . Do n't talk about being virtuous , be virtuous . A `` real man `` helps those who he loves , whether he likes what they did . A father loves his sons and daughters , despite what they do , rather in spite of what they have done . Good day to you .""",DISAGREE,"""the actual answers to the questions to be from the men""","""that abortion clinic and make that decision , you stand up and tell me what a real man""",,
3216,848,"""If they are produced from human minds , and human minds are mutually contradictory , then how can the constructs be absolute ? Therefore , the laws of logic are not human constructs .""","""This contradicts the fact that logic is an invention born of brain power . If there were no living beings , there would be no logic . There would be plenty to think about but nobody to do any thinking requiring what we know today as logic . Logic is TOTALLY a human construct . ... and since it has nothing at all to do with the existence of God , atheists are just as good at it as the Bible Thumpers . As a matter of fact , I know an atheist who is far more logical than anyone else I 've heard to date .""",DISAGREE,"""the laws of logic are not human constructs .""","""Logic is TOTALLY a human construct .""",,
3219,849,"""God IS GOOD all the time ...""","""Then why does n't He answer prayers like He says He will in the Bible ?""",DISAGREE,"""God IS GOOD all the time ...""","""Then why does n't He answer prayers like He says He will in the Bible ?""",,
3229,851,"""Is abortion a crime ?""","""No .""",DISAGREE,"""Is abortion a crime ?""","""No .""",,
3235,852,"""Do n't count on it . The number of scientists in the American scientific community that subscribe to creationism is about % 5 , based upon a relatively recent poll . I will try to dig it up . Also , calling most Kansas residents stupid for voting in Christian Board of Education members is ridiculous . Religious views are almost never even mentioned in local politics . At the most , you see perhaps a flyer that says `` Vote ______ `` . The Christians who want to teach Intelligent Design in schools are an extreme minority that the media , in all its story-searching rating-mongering glory , is blowing out of proportion .""","""And , what percentage is that ? How was the poll conducted ? Who conducted it ? How was the determination made about who was a 'scientist ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""American scientific community that subscribe to creationism is about % 5 , based upon a relatively recent poll .""","""How was the determination made about who was a 'scientist ' ?""",,
3242,853,"""There is quite a bit of debate what the militia can be interpreted as , and individuals ignoring the laws as they see fit is anarchy ( checked out the Free State project , you are a beleiver in Arnacho-captalism or so it seems which is a form of anarchy ) , nothing nessesarily wrong with it though . Understood the point it was making , just the logic is flawed .""","""1. militia - the entire body of physically fit civilians eligible by law for military service ; `` their troops were untrained militia `` ; `` Congress shall have power to provide for calling forth the militia `` -- United States Constitution . There is only debate on militia from those who wish to redefine its meaning into something it is n't . 2 . '' The Free State Project is a plan in which 20,000 or more liberty-oriented people will move to New Hampshire , where they may work within the political system to reduce the size and scope of government . The success of the Free State Project would likely entail reductions in burdensome taxation and regulation , reforms in state and local law , an end to federal mandates , and a restoration of constitutional federalism , demonstrating the benefits of liberty to the rest of the nation and the world. `` Working within our political system to bring back liberty minded governance like our founding fathers envisioned . Anarcho-capitialism it is not .""",DISAGREE,"""There is quite a bit of debate what the militia can be interpreted as , and individuals ignoring the laws as they see fit is anarchy""","""militia - the entire body of physically fit civilians eligible by law for military service ; `` their troops were untrained militia `` ; `` Congress shall have power to provide for calling forth the militia `` -- United States Constitution .""",,
3244,854,"""Shows what lengths women can go to if legal abortion is n't an option .""","""No it does n't , as abortion WAS a legal option in this case . This was not a legality issue , but an education issue .""",DISAGREE,"""what lengths women can go to if legal abortion is n't an option .""","""it does n't , as abortion WAS a legal option in this case . This was not a legality issue , but an education issue""",,
3275,859,"""Evolutionists can not support thier theory and expect you to find proof to support yours .""","""I thought you said that you had been following the converstaion . I guess you did n't understand any of it .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolutionists can not support thier theory""","""I guess you did n't understand any of it .""",,
3278,859,"""Evolutionists can not support thier theory and expect you to find proof to support yours .""","""I thought you said that you had been following the converstaion . I guess you did n't understand any of it .""",DISAGREE,"""you .""","""I thought you you had been the . I guess you did n't any of it .""",,
3280,860,"""5 ) What experiments have been conducted to verify the occurence of intelligent design ?""","""A lot of work has been done on that topic . I would recommend reading Debating Design from Darwin to DNA It is a monster of a book , but it is definitely worth the read .""",DISAGREE,"""What experiments have been conducted to verify the occurence of intelligent design ?""","""A lot of work has been done on that topic .""",,
3289,861,"""I have characterized certain ideas , notions , and opinions as stupid and simple-minded , but not you personally .""","""Oh , WW , come on now . If you say something to me about how Vitality works , and I say 'that 's a stupid / simple-minded idea ' , are you seriously telling me you would n't take that as a personal attack ?""",DISAGREE,"""I have characterized certain ideas , notions , and opinions as stupid and simple-minded""","""WW , come on now .""",,
3288,861,"""I have characterized certain ideas , notions , and opinions as stupid and simple-minded , but not you personally .""","""Oh , WW , come on now . If you say something to me about how Vitality works , and I say 'that 's a stupid / simple-minded idea ' , are you seriously telling me you would n't take that as a personal attack ?""",DISAGREE,"""characterized certain ideas stupid and simple-minded""","""how Vitality works stupid / simple-minded""",,
3290,861,"""I have characterized certain ideas , notions , and opinions as stupid and simple-minded , but not you personally .""","""Oh , WW , come on now . If you say something to me about how Vitality works , and I say 'that 's a stupid / simple-minded idea ' , are you seriously telling me you would n't take that as a personal attack ?""",DISAGREE,"""but not you personally .""","""you would n't take that as a personal attack ?""",,
3293,862,"""Today , no informed creationist would deny natural selection .""","""Then 99 % of creationists are not informed as far as I can tell . It seems that your position is that `` informed `` creationists are neo-Darwinists , fully accepting of the theories of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""no informed creationist would deny natural selection .""","""Then 99 % of creationists are not informed as far as I can It seems that your position is that `` informed `` creationists are neo-Darwinists ,""",,
3292,862,"""Today , no informed creationist would deny natural selection .""","""Then 99 % of creationists are not informed as far as I can tell . It seems that your position is that `` informed `` creationists are neo-Darwinists , fully accepting of the theories of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""no informed creationist would deny natural selection .""","""It seems that your position is that `` informed `` creationists are neo-Darwinists""",,
3301,863,"""Regarding the line to be drawn between valid and invalid medical circumstances , I suspect it is best left to the physician 's who encounter and are familiar with the various causes for concern . I personally know quite little about them . The ones I would categorize as valid would be those that threaten the continued healthy life of the mother in such a way as to include the possibility of her being unable to function as a mother and caretaker of not only the expected child but those she may already be tending . Reduced to a short sentence , the line should be drawn under the doctor 's signature .""","""You have a good point about the imporance of the mother being healthy enough to take care of the other children . So often , this debate is phrased in terms of the mother 's rights vs those of the fetus , but we often forget ( including myself ) that other people can also be deeply affected by abortion decisions - including the family which might lose a mother . I would also generally agree that the doctor can often best say what type of health risk exists . Even there , though , the doctor him/herself would have to have some level of judgement about what level of risk is `` acceptable `` and what is n't . Ultimately , someone has to make that decision . Part of the goal of this thread was to discuss what type of risks are acceptable and what are n't .""",AGREE,"""those that threaten the continued healthy life of the mother in such a way as to include the possibility of her being unable to function as a mother and caretaker of not only the expected child""","""You have a good point about the imporance of the mother being healthy enough to take care of the other children""",,
3313,865,"""how do you know you were born heterosexual ? what suggests that you were born with a particular sexual orientation ?""","""Because , not once , did I have feel any sort of physical attraction to the same gender as myself . I have known other people who have . I do n't 'CHOOSE ' who I think is sexually attractive . It might have been environmental , but it certainly was n't a 'choice' I have to assume that at least for some , if not most homosexuals , that pattern repeats itself .""",DISAGREE,"""how do you know you were born heterosexual ?""","""Because , not once , did I have feel any sort of physical attraction to the same gender as""",,
3322,867,"""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish . As such , I have not been absolutely convinced of this . Do you mind helping me out a little by drawing this argument out in a little more detail ?""","""Sure . The woman is a person , and individual , sentient human being . She has the same right to control her bodily resources as any other person does . As such , you can no more force her , against her will , to provide bodily resources to an embryo or fetus , than you can yourself be forced to give of your bodily resources against your will . Even if somebody is bleeding to death , and your blood can save their life , they still do n't have the right to force you to safely give them of your blood . Each person have that right to control their bodily resources . If you want to force the woman to remain pregnant , you are forcing her to give of her bodily resources against her will . When you do n't insist that everybody else be subject to such requirements , then the argument is hypocritical and misogynistic . And , of course the US Supreme Court agrees with this , thus ruling that per the 14th Amendment of the US Constitution , the woman has the right to privacy , to control her onw body .""",AGREE,"""argued throughout these posts , Do you mind helping me out""","""is , to somebody is bleeding to death ,""",,
3340,871,"""So you are saying that because the gun is of value you should just let the burgular take everything else of value , Rape your wife and possibly kill you all because you might get shot ? XXXX . You are now quoting that burgulars will invade homes more because there are guns in there ? Again this is this frauds own personal research to meet his agenda . Please show me his raw data .. otherwise it is XXXX . Your quote starts out with fact ( the 74 % ) then goes off into fantasy land of the quotes of one or two CRIMINALS who support your global socialist agenda and then he does `` his own study `` . XXXX ! GOA and other pro freedom groups footnote and annotate thier sources for your review not some `` oh we looked at the fbi statistics and from `` our own `` research we have found that pistol gripped assault rifles can go on a kill crazy rampage whether or not a human is actually holding the thing `` XXXX ! The latest is the BATFE is XXXXXX at the brady foundation for misrepresenting their data ... hmm ..... C R A P !""","""Well , if burglars want to steal guns then it makes sense that they would be likely to target the homes of gun owners . And the source is from the recently published book Evaluating Gun Policy which you can read and review . The source is listed at the bottom .""",DISAGREE,"""You are now quoting that burgulars will invade homes more because there are guns in there ? Again this is this frauds own personal research to meet his agenda . Please show me his raw data .. ``""","""if burglars want to steal guns then it makes sense that they would be likely to target the homes of gun owners and The source is listed at the bottom .""",,
3371,878,"""Yet there was a case that I read about somewhere , where a sticker was placed in science textbooks advising children to study evolution `` with an open mind `` , and an ACLU lawsuit ensued .""","""Indeed . Cobb County Georgia . And the sticker was found unconstitutional in Federal Court . The problem was that it was religiously motivated , was placed only in biology texts , did n't say anything true that the teachers were n't already teaching , and actually was not accurate . The sticker was found to be unconstitutional because it violated the second prong of the Lemon Test . I suspect that you do n't know what that is . Anyway , the 11th Circuit reversed .""",AGREE,"""Yet there was a case that I read about somewhere , where a sticker was placed in science textbooks advising children to study evolution ``""","""Indeed . Cobb County Georgia . And the sticker was found unconstitutional in Federal Court .""",,
3377,879,"""http : //news.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai ... 5/nabort15.xml""","""I think that I do n't have quite enough Tobasco in my Bloody Mary .""",DISAGREE,"""http : //news.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai ... 5/nabort15.xml""","""think that I do n't have quite enough Tobasco in my Bloody Mary""",,
3396,890,"""It contradicts a literal interpretation of the Bible .""","""And ... ?""",DISAGREE,"""It contradicts a literal interpretation of the Bible .""","""And ... ?""",,
3399,890,"""It contradicts a literal interpretation of the Bible .""","""And ... ?""",DISAGREE,"""literal interpretation of the Bible .""","""And ... ?""",,
3404,891,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890 Robbery = 22,186 Aggravated assault = 24,831 Property crime = 149,989""","""And YET ! The good mayor has the time , money , and extra man power to go to other cities and look for crimes ? Heck . I have been to New York , and he has an awful lot of nerve going anywhere else looking for crimes to solve . And what criminal enterprises has the people of his good city people supplied other cities with . I mean besides the crimes his investigators committed . Drugs , thugs , and murderers to name a few . Bloomberg , stay the heck where you belong !""",DISAGREE,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890 Robbery = 22,186 Aggravated assault = 24,831 Property crime = 149,989""","""And YET ! The good mayor has the time , money , and extra man power to go to other cities and look for crimes ?""",,
3405,891,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890 Robbery = 22,186 Aggravated assault = 24,831 Property crime = 149,989""","""And YET ! The good mayor has the time , money , and extra man power to go to other cities and look for crimes ? Heck . I have been to New York , and he has an awful lot of nerve going anywhere else looking for crimes to solve . And what criminal enterprises has the people of his good city people supplied other cities with . I mean besides the crimes his investigators committed . Drugs , thugs , and murderers to name a few . Bloomberg , stay the heck where you belong !""",DISAGREE,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890 Robbery = 22,186 Aggravated assault = 24,831 Property crime = 149,989""","""And YET ! The good mayor has the time , money , and extra man power to go to other cities and look for crimes ?""",,
3407,891,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890 Robbery = 22,186 Aggravated assault = 24,831 Property crime = 149,989""","""And YET ! The good mayor has the time , money , and extra man power to go to other cities and look for crimes ? Heck . I have been to New York , and he has an awful lot of nerve going anywhere else looking for crimes to solve . And what criminal enterprises has the people of his good city people supplied other cities with . I mean besides the crimes his investigators committed . Drugs , thugs , and murderers to name a few . Bloomberg , stay the heck where you belong !""",DISAGREE,"""Violent crimes = 48,430 Murder = 523 Forcible rape = 890""","""lot of nerve going anywhere else looking for crimes to solve""",,
3409,892,"""I 'm new to this idea that science has over-ruled Creation . Please explain .""","""The 7 day creation I am referring to , not merely the possibility of divine creation through the Big bang etc""",AGREE,"""science has over-ruled Creation""","""7 day creation I am referring to not merely the possibility of divine creation""",,
3419,893,"""Because it is illegal to own a handgun without a difficult-to-get permit in New York ,""","""So according to you , you 'd prefer it if only the bad guys are armed , because that makes it easy to tell who 's the bad guy and who 's the good guy ; being the good guy is never armed , and thus never able to defend themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""without a difficult-to-get permit in New York ,""","""being the good guy is never armed , and thus never able to defend themselves .""",,
3422,893,"""Because it is illegal to own a handgun without a difficult-to-get permit in New York ,""","""So according to you , you 'd prefer it if only the bad guys are armed , because that makes it easy to tell who 's the bad guy and who 's the good guy ; being the good guy is never armed , and thus never able to defend themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""Because it is illegal to own a handgun without a difficult-to-get permit in New York ,""","""you 'd prefer it if only the bad guys are armed , because that makes it easy to tell who 's the bad guy and who 's the good guy""",,
3418,893,"""Because it is illegal to own a handgun without a difficult-to-get permit in New York ,""","""So according to you , you 'd prefer it if only the bad guys are armed , because that makes it easy to tell who 's the bad guy and who 's the good guy ; being the good guy is never armed , and thus never able to defend themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""it is illegal to own a handgun without a difficult-to-get permit""","""because that makes it easy to tell able to defend themselves""",,
3436,895,"""Clearly this John Raven just wants a bigger budget and so he 's made up yet more stuff about the problems of CO2 pollution""","""Why is this clear ?""",DISAGREE,"""a bigger budget and so he 's made up yet more stuff about the problems of CO2 pollution""","""Why is this clear ?""",,
3441,895,"""Clearly this John Raven just wants a bigger budget and so he 's made up yet more stuff about the problems of CO2 pollution""","""Why is this clear ?""",DISAGREE,"""John Raven just wants a bigger budget and so he 's made up yet more stuff about the problems of CO2 pollution""","""Why is this clear ?""",,
3450,896,"""Good questions . I agree that this logic is somewhat flawed ( unless quote mined ) . God could have made Adam and Eve . He could then have planted evidence that life evolved to this point . The miracle could have happened , too , in much the same way .""","""See my post above , Hi . marc ignores fundamentals of Miller 's beliefs that he clearly spells out in trying to push his anti-Miller argument .""",DISAGREE,"""Good questions . I agree that this logic is somewhat flawed ( unless quote mined ) . God could have made Adam and Eve . He could then have planted evidence that life evolved to this point .""","""See my post above , Hi . marc ignores fundamentals of Miller 's beliefs that he clearly spells out in trying to push his anti-Miller argument .""",,
3454,897,"""Does private gun ownership deter crime ?""","""I believe yes , because a robber might not rob a house if he/she knows that their is a gun inside that house .""",DISAGREE,"""Does private gun ownership deter crime ?""","""I believe yes , a robber might not rob a house if he/she knows that their is a gun""",,
3462,899,"""Ok your right , I probably should of read that one over , but i believe the rest still stands .""","""Well , JP rightfully pointed out that the percentage of rape victims becoming pregnant are VERY small , so it really does n't carry much weight when trying to argue for the `` right `` to have an abortion""",DISAGREE,"""I probably should of read that one over , but i believe the rest still stands .""","""rape victims becoming pregnant are VERY small""",,
3463,900,"""You stated the `` Illiad `` has historical figures . Many writings do . What distingustes the two is that one is fact and the other fiction . Noone claimes that Homer was conducting a documentary of this time and these people .""","""I see . So the Bible is true because you claim it is true .""",DISAGREE,"""historical figures""","""Bible is true""",,
3466,901,"""We are talking about constitutional rights . In that case , even if you want to put religion into the mix . You really ca n't .""","""But behind that are deeper , more fundamental issues about what homosexuality IS and the morality of it . To many people who view homoseuxality as immoral , your movement seems to be trying to write immorality into law .""",DISAGREE,"""talking about constitutional rights""","""behind that are deeper , more fundamental issues""",,
3467,901,"""We are talking about constitutional rights . In that case , even if you want to put religion into the mix . You really ca n't .""","""But behind that are deeper , more fundamental issues about what homosexuality IS and the morality of it . To many people who view homoseuxality as immoral , your movement seems to be trying to write immorality into law .""",DISAGREE,"""religion into the mix""","""homoseuxality as immoral""",,
3469,902,"""Alexander Hamilton 1775 The Sacred Rights of Mankind are not to be rummaged for among old parchment , . or musty records . They are written with a sun beam in whole volume of human nature , by the hand of the divinity itself , and can never be erased or obscured by mortal power . The fact that the Constitution did not include a bill of rights to specifically protect Americans ' hard-won rights sparked the most heated debates during the ratification process . To the Federalists , those who favored the Constitution , a bill of rights was unnecessary because the Federal Government was limited in its powers and could not interfere with the rights of the people or the states ; also , most states had bills of rights . To the Anti-Federalists , those who opposed the Constitution , the prospect of establishing a strong central government without an explicit list of rights guaranteed to the people was unthinkable . Throughout the ratification process , individuals and state ratification conventions called for the adoption of a bill of rights .""","""Ninth Amendment - Unenumerated Rights""",DISAGREE,"""Constitution did not include a bill of rights to specifically protect Americans ' hard-won rights""","""Ninth Amendment - Unenumerated Rights""",,
3475,904,"""The suspect , identified as a 41-year-old doctor with personal and professional problems , is in custody in Fujian province . The victims were reported to be mostly first-graders . Three children died at the scene and five died later at a hospital , authorities said . At least five other children were injured .""","""The biblical end has got to be near . This was a Doctor who spends all of his life saving people 's lives .""",DISAGREE,"""victims first-graders children died""","""end has got to be near""",,
3477,904,"""The suspect , identified as a 41-year-old doctor with personal and professional problems , is in custody in Fujian province . The victims were reported to be mostly first-graders . Three children died at the scene and five died later at a hospital , authorities said . At least five other children were injured .""","""The biblical end has got to be near . This was a Doctor who spends all of his life saving people 's lives .""",DISAGREE,"""The suspect , identified as a 41-year-old doctor with personal and professional problems , is in custody in Fujian province . The victims were reported to be mostly first-graders .""","""This was a Doctor who spends all of his life saving people 's lives .""",,
3489,907,"""Because Africa is n't one big homogeneous ecosystem . There are jungles , plains , deserts , swamps . Himps living in the jungle were n't in competition with himps that started migrating out onto the plains . Their food sources are different , their territories are different . The more suited to plains-dwelling we became , the less attractive a prospect it was to return to the jungle . Pretty straightforward , really .""","""But himps living in the jungle were in competition with other himps which did n't migrate to the plains . And pressures from predators , climate and changes in the ecosystem should have continued to force the need or desire to control their environment as our line of himp grew to do . My point is that with all of the same basic tools to start out with such as fingers , opposable thumbs and walking upright , there is no reason why only our line evolved to the level that human beings have attained with the same hundreds of millions of years , and the same pressures pushing us all forward , or towards extinction .""",DISAGREE,"""The more suited to plains-dwelling we became , the less attractive a prospect""","""there is no reason why only our line evolved to the level that human beings""",,
3495,909,"""sinjin - No comment .""","""Good , this is n't the time for either side to be making politically motivated comments , even if the case is over a week old .""",AGREE,"""sinjin - No comment""","""making politically motivated comments""",,
3500,910,"""that sure was a load of knowledge you revealed there .""","""Pregnancy is a health issue only for the woman . Your glib remark pretending to sympathy is insulting .""",DISAGREE,"""that sure was a load of knowledge you revealed there .""","""Your glib remark pretending to sympathy is insulting .""",,
3504,912,"""It does n't mean that state has to recoginze your marriage if you move in though . You also forgot the last part `` And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts , Records and Proceedings shall be proved , and the Effect thereof. ``""","""Actually , I think Kronos is right in this case -- at least from the standpoint of most consitutional scholars . Of course the framers did n't envision the wording to be used in this way for this purpose -- this is what 's simply called a `` loophole `` , in this case anyway . It 's why there has been an effort in recent years to close the loophole with a constitutional amendment defining marriage .""",AGREE,"""It does n't mean that state has to recoginze your marriage if you move in though . You also forgot the last part `` And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts , Records and Proceedings shall be proved , and the Effect thereof. ``""","""Actually , I think Kronos is right in this case -- at least from the standpoint of most consitutional scholars . Of course the framers did n't envision the wording to be used in this way for this purpose -- this is what 's simply called a `` loophole `` , in this case anyway .""",,
3511,914,"""U.S . Senator Frank Lautenberg ( D-NJ ) and U.S . Representatives Peter T. King ( R-NY ) have introduced common sense legislation to deny firearms and explosives to terrorists . Currently , federal authorities can not stop sales of guns — including military-style assault weapons — by dealers to known or suspected terrorists . This gap in the law threatens our nation 's safety . A new GAO report finds that , from February 2004 to February 2009 , there were 963 cases in which a known or suspected terrorist attempted to buy a gun . In 90 percent of those cases — a total of 865 times — they were cleared to proceed with that purchase . One of those cases involved the purchase of explosives . Congress must pass the Terror Gap bill to stop known or suspected terrorists from buying guns .""","""So penfold and brady you are in favour of denying citizens rights even though they have not been proved to have commited any crime ? Ed Kennerdy was on that list so should he be discriminated against even though he has commited NO crime ? What is next putting black people on the list purely because of the colour of their skin ? You sicken me you two . Why on gods earth would terrorists be buying civilian guns when they could just use AK47 ? Did you sniff petrol as a youngster as you seem to have .""",DISAGREE,"""Congress must pass the Terror Gap bill to stop known or suspected terrorists from buying guns .""","""What is next putting black people on the list purely because of the colour of their skin ? You sicken me you two . Why on gods earth would terrorists be buying civilian guns when they could just use AK47 ?""",,
3513,915,"""I 'm no slaver but ... All firearm transactions must be through a FFL with a background check . First sale and any subsequent transfers of ownership . No private party to pp sales without FFL oversight . Mandatory theft/loss reporting . Potential jail time for failure to report . Mandatory jail time for filing a false theft report .""","""And the black market where the felon bought it ?""",DISAGREE,"""First sale and any subsequent transfers of ownership .""","""And the black market where the felon bought it ?""",,
3527,919,"""I have some questions for everyone here . For example , what is each side trying to prove ? Are the evolution supporters trying to convince others of evolution , or are they trying to defend evolution ? Are the creationists trying to disprove the current theory of evolution , or are they trying to win converts ? Also , why do you believe what you do about the universe ? ( `` The other side is wrong `` is n't the real reason you to believe what you do , I would think ) Here are my answers : I am here because I enjoy debates , and I am trying to defend evolution from people who do n't understand it . I believe that there is no god because I see no compelling evidence . I was brought up without anyone telling me what to believe , though I went to church occasionally . I also read the bible , but this failed to convince me . Finally , I wonder why the bible has convinced some but not others . I hope this thread proves informative .""","""That is about the same for me ( although I never went to church ) , and I find it more of an intellectual stimulation , and I can learn a lot too""",AGREE,"""what is each side trying to prove ? `` I was brought up without anyone telling me what to believe , though I went to church occasionally I also read the bible , but this failed to convince me I wonder why the bible has convinced some but not others""","""That is about the same for me I find it more of an intellectual stimulation I can learn a lot too""",,
3530,920,"""To equate miscarriage with manslaughter is preposterous .""","""To force women to have babys that they dont even want is even more `` preposterous `` .""",DISAGREE,"""preposterous""","""even more `` preposterous ``""",,
3533,920,"""To equate miscarriage with manslaughter is preposterous .""","""To force women to have babys that they dont even want is even more `` preposterous `` .""",DISAGREE,"""miscarriage with manslaughter is preposterous""","""to have babys that they dont even want is even more `` preposterous""",,
3541,922,"""Yes , that is the point !""","""And you have yet to provide stats that prove that gun shows are a threat .""",DISAGREE,"""is the point !""","""you have yet to provide stats""",,
3560,927,"""The reason abortion at any stage of a pregnancy is unethical is because you can not justify killing a human life based on its stage of development . I am 18 years old . I am not allowed to gamble or to buy alcohol until I am 21 . This is because studies show that my brain isnt developed enough to way consequences . I am not fully developed yet . This does not make me less human than those who are older than me . This might be alittle out there for some but if you cross the line one day you could be killing babys because they can not walk yet they arent quite human because humans can walk upright . A human is a human no matter what stage of developedment it is in . But I can see how just telling someone that it is just a fetus makes it easier on them . Abortion has its place . In the need where the mothers health is endangered its completely understandable but its not understandable when its done out of convenience .""","""cmitch , you cite certain studies as the reasons for why laws have been passed forbidding underage drinking and gambling . Do you , by chance , know what those studies are ? Furthermore , why would your being legally unable to drink or gamble make you less of a human ? Does drinking and gambling make you more human ? I 'm having difficulties in following your arguments .""",DISAGREE,"""The reason abortion at any stage of a pregnancy is unethical is because you can not justify killing a human life based on its stage of development I am 18 years old . I am not allowed to gamble or to buy alcohol until I am 21 . This is because studies show that my brain isnt developed enough to way consequences . I am not fully developed yet . This does not make me less human than those who are older than me . might be alittle out there for some but if you cross the line one day you could be killing babys because they can not walk yet they arent quite human because humans can walk upright . A human is a human no matter what stage of developedment it is in .""","""cmitch , you cite certain studies as the reasons for why laws have been passed forbidding underage drinking and gambling . Do you , by chance , know what those studies are ? Furthermore , why would your being legally unable to drink or gamble make you less of a human ? Does drinking and gambling make you more human ? I 'm having difficulties in following your arguments .""",,
3561,927,"""The reason abortion at any stage of a pregnancy is unethical is because you can not justify killing a human life based on its stage of development . I am 18 years old . I am not allowed to gamble or to buy alcohol until I am 21 . This is because studies show that my brain isnt developed enough to way consequences . I am not fully developed yet . This does not make me less human than those who are older than me . This might be alittle out there for some but if you cross the line one day you could be killing babys because they can not walk yet they arent quite human because humans can walk upright . A human is a human no matter what stage of developedment it is in . But I can see how just telling someone that it is just a fetus makes it easier on them . Abortion has its place . In the need where the mothers health is endangered its completely understandable but its not understandable when its done out of convenience .""","""cmitch , you cite certain studies as the reasons for why laws have been passed forbidding underage drinking and gambling . Do you , by chance , know what those studies are ? Furthermore , why would your being legally unable to drink or gamble make you less of a human ? Does drinking and gambling make you more human ? I 'm having difficulties in following your arguments .""",DISAGREE,"""is I am not allowed to gamble or to buy alcohol until I am 21 . This is because studies show that my brain developed enough to consequences the""","""Do you , by chance , know what those studies are ? Does drinking and gambling make you more human ?""",,
3575,930,"""5 ) Show me one instance of an evolutionist ( any book , any website ) admitting that  “ evolution ” may not be evolution at all , but simply an individual organism ’ s ability to utilize his genetic diversity and adapt himself to his local environment – that selection may not have anything to do with phenotypic change .... and instead of vertically , evolution first happens horizontally . ( A trait of a good scientist is to consider opposing viewpoints and alternatives , not to ignore them . )""","""Apart from the 'horizontally instead of vertically ' part which I did n't understand - we 're a hundred or so years too late , unfortunately . You might as well ask for an example of a book or website on cosmology that 'admits ' the sun may just be a big ball of fire pushed by a scarab beetle , and not a nuclear furnace about which the earth orbits . There comes a point where continuing to seriously 'consider ' a viewpoint becomes a waste of time and resources , because sufficient testing has been done and evidence recovered to discount it . We may one day encounter evidence that completely overturns the whole applecart , but so far it has n't happened .""",DISAGREE,"""Show me one instance of an evolutionist ( any book , any website ) admitting that  evolution may not be evolution at all , but simply an individual organism ’ s ability to utilize his genetic diversity and adapt himself to his local environment""","""might as well ask for an example of a book or website on cosmology that 'admits ' the sun may just be a big ball of fire pushed by a scarab beetle , and not a nuclear furnace about which the earth orbits""",,
3579,931,"""It was a media circus , and had plenty to do with the establishment clause of the first amendment .""","""So the Establishment Clause was included to promote atheism , eh ?""",DISAGREE,"""had plenty to do with the establishment clause of the first amendment .""","""Establishment Clause was included to promote atheism , eh ?""",,
3592,934,"""I appreciate that you said that because you are one of the few Creationits who realize that nothing the bible says is completely proven and a fact ... it 's not the infallible word of God ... it 's a book my humans and that IS a fact ... And the examples you gave ( Tower , Noah ) only state that ... I really like your opinion and really appreciate that ...""","""i think shortej is not a creationist . he/she never said so , and started off by saying he/she accepts evolution and maintains her catholic beliefs . ( i have a hunch its `` she `` )""",DISAGREE,"""you are one of the few Creationits who realize""","""i think shortej is not a creationist . ``""",,
3593,934,"""I appreciate that you said that because you are one of the few Creationits who realize that nothing the bible says is completely proven and a fact ... it 's not the infallible word of God ... it 's a book my humans and that IS a fact ... And the examples you gave ( Tower , Noah ) only state that ... I really like your opinion and really appreciate that ...""","""i think shortej is not a creationist . he/she never said so , and started off by saying he/she accepts evolution and maintains her catholic beliefs . ( i have a hunch its `` she `` )""",DISAGREE,"""I appreciate that you said that because you are one of the few Creationits who realize that nothing the bible says is completely proven and a fact ...""","""i think shortej is not a creationist . he/she never said so , and started off by saying he/she accepts evolution and maintains her catholic beliefs .""",,
3604,937,"""Other paranoid voices argue that the citizens should arm themselves against their own government .""","""So you think the Constitution is `` paranoid `` huh ? You need to read the Federalist and anti- Federalist papers and quotes from our FF .""",DISAGREE,"""citizens should arm themselves against their own government .""","""You need to read the Federalist and anti- Federalist papers and quotes from our FF .""",,
3621,941,"""I was and am fine actually . Do n't know about anyone else , but I do n't think you have that much impact on our lives SS Who 's more arrogant ? The person searching for truth or the person who claims to know everything ?""","""oh , it 's obvious that non-darwinists have no affect on you guys . Nothing will ever change your mind because your mind is not made up on the evidence ... it 's made up on your worldview and your belief in materialism .""",DISAGREE,"""you for""","""that have on you . is the and""",,
3627,942,"""those kind of websites are like porn to gun nuts but getting big gun wont compensate for being born with a small one""","""Just as being anti-gun wo n't compensate for being born with a small brain .""",DISAGREE,"""those kind of websites are like porn to gun nuts but getting big gun wont compensate for being born with a small one""","""as being anti-gun wo n't compensate for being born with a small brain .""",,
3642,945,"""and some people were saying `` They are just that close in showing how life could come from non-life. ``""","""Well , it showed how it was physically possible to generate amino acids from inorganic material . That 's rather impressive . Again , irrelevant and unrelated to the Scientific theory of Evolution , regardless of you trying to create that association . Your continued attempt at doing so despite having been shown and told multiple times that the two are unrelated , well that only shows one thing , namely that you are dishonest .""",DISAGREE,"""life could come from""","""irrelevant and unrelated to the Scientific theory of Evolution ,""",,
3670,951,"""I am a Christian , so I believe that the meaning of life is to be re-acquainted with God and to live your life in according to his Word . Which , in my opinion is a far better life than : `` I 'm born of chance , I did n't ask to be here , I serve no purpose , so I might as well live egocentrically for the next 78.4 years until my life ends. ``""","""78.4 years ? Well excuse me but I intend to live much longer than that . I was thinking about 112.7 years . Yeah . That 's about right .""",DISAGREE,"""next 78.4 years until my life""","""78.4 years ? Well excuse me but I intend to live much longer than that . 112.7 years""",,
3702,958,"""Do you believe that a fetus in a women 's body is just undeveloped tissue or a start in where human life begins ? Undeveloped tissue . Both . Human life .""","""Both . It 's where a human life begins but not a life yet .""",AGREE,"""Human life .""","""human life""",,
3703,958,"""Do you believe that a fetus in a women 's body is just undeveloped tissue or a start in where human life begins ? Undeveloped tissue . Both . Human life .""","""Both . It 's where a human life begins but not a life yet .""",AGREE,"""undeveloped tissue or a start in where human life begins ? Both . Human life .""","""It 's where a human life begins but not a life yet .""",,
3704,959,"""Is the bible our constitution ?""","""Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar 's and to God the things that are God 's . And good moral character is one of the things to render unto God . So , the answer is there is a higher Law than the Constitution . God rules ! And now the verse of the day : A man who remains stiff-necked after many rebukes will suddenly be destroyed -- without remedy . - Proverbs 29:1""",AGREE,"""the bible our constitution""","""higher Law than the Constitution""",,
3742,977,"""ugh , another court case coming""","""Well , John Roberts is on his way to be the next Chief Justice , and word is , Priscilla Owens is in the bullpen for O'Connor 's seat .""",DISAGREE,"""court case""","""John Roberts Chief Justice Priscilla Owens O'Connor 's seat""",,
3764,988,"""Mutagenesis Is Often Futile Bacterial populations are estimated to spend most of their time under strong growth limitation ( 53 , 55 ) , and many of these stresses can not be relieved by mutation ( e.g. , lack of any carbon source , exposure to extreme physical conditions ) . If mutagenesis were induced by such stresses , it would create deleterious mutations without hope of benefit . A mechanism for stress-induced mutagenesis might be advantageous if cells could determine that ( a ) the problem is solvable by mutation and ( b ) that death is assured if no mutation is forthcoming . Without such prescience , cells with a mechanism for stress-induced mutagenesis would be eliminated by repeated rounds of futile mutagenesis .""","""In other words , a cell trying to 'survive , thrive and reproduce ' via a self-induced state of stochastic hypermutation would most likely just end up killing itself ...""",DISAGREE,"""Mutagenesis Is Often Futile , stress-induced repeated rounds""","""cell trying to self-induced hypermutation""",,
3773,989,"""You are missing the point . Evolutionists say that certain animals in a population are GENETICALLY superior than others .... and these genetic superiors are more successful breeders . Do you understand this concept ? So when you say that more humans are born than reproduce , that 's not particularly important because I submit those who go on to reproduce do so mostly because of choice or circumstance -- not because of their GENES . How can you possibly refute this ?""","""Sometimes the state of the education system in the USA makes me cry .""",DISAGREE,"""humans are born than reproduce ,""","""the state of education system in the USA me cry""",,
3799,995,"""The only state is Mass . and unless you use a friend 's address , they wo n't marry out of state couples .""","""So sorry ; I have a friend who works and lives in the D.C. area , but he has residency in Mass. , because he owns a home there . And he was able to be married only because he owns a home there ?""",DISAGREE,"""The only state is Mass . friend 's address they wo n't marry out of state couples .""","""I have a friend who works and lives in the D.C. area , but he has residency in he owns a home there . And he was able to be married only because he owns a home there ?""",,
3819,1002,"""That 's why you do n't find them much below the Arctic circle . Anyway , the change still is n't evolution . That 's my claim""","""What 's your claim ? That the seasonal molt of arctic foxes is evolution or that it is not ? As usual , your responses show muddled thinking .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's why you do n't find them much below the Arctic circle . Anyway , the change still is n't evolution . That 's my claim""","""What 's your claim ? That the seasonal molt of arctic foxes is evolution or that it is not ? As usual , your responses show muddled thinking .""",,
3823,1002,"""That 's why you do n't find them much below the Arctic circle . Anyway , the change still is n't evolution . That 's my claim""","""What 's your claim ? That the seasonal molt of arctic foxes is evolution or that it is not ? As usual , your responses show muddled thinking .""",DISAGREE,"""why you do n't find them much below the Arctic circle , That 's my claim""","""What 's your claim ? the seasonal molt of arctic foxes is evolution or that it is not ?""",,
3836,1004,"""Im sorry but what is the point of this video ? was there something you wanted to discuss ?""","""I think VTs reason for posting that video was to show that this 12 year old girl has more wisdom regarding abortion , and sensitivity to human life than most adults possess today . And she rightfully pointed out the true and very real downsides of what abortions represent for the women who get them . She showed that the human misery of killing more than a million unborn babies a year goes much deeper than just the babies that die from abortions . they affect the mother emotionally as well as her future `` wanted `` children in many cases .""",AGREE,"""Im sorry but what is the point of this video ? was there something you wanted to discuss ?""","""VTs reason for posting that video was to show that this 12 year old girl has more wisdom regarding abortion ,""",,
3843,1006,"""In discussions in this forum , I have found that a key differentiator between pro-life and pro-choice proponents is their approach to morality . Pro-life proponents tend to ultimately have a morality based on moral proclamations - religious or otherwise - that can not be questioned and need no supporting arguement . The proclamation `` All human life is sacred `` is the main one which leads to their pro-life stance .""","""sounds good .""",AGREE,"""a key differentiator between pro-life and pro-choice proponents is their approach to morality .""","""sounds good .""",,
3859,1008,"""Yes , but ... Sotomayor is a very strict legal beagle . Had I the best sort of law degree from the best university , I would very much fear to take her on in the field of established law . She observes the law down to the last dot , dash and comma . However ... while the right to choose is still a part of established law , the radical and experimental present Supreme Court does not hesitate in the least to legislate new law and new meanings to law . Were Sotomayor to be persuaded by the Roman Catholic cabal of the U.S. Supreme Court that the Court should take it upon itself to rewrite Roe v. Wade , she might join in with the legislative five to make a new and more restrictive law regarding abortion .""","""As a matter of perspective on the above ; Roe is , was and always will be the historical reference for an example of `` judicial activism. `` Roe did not establish the `` right to chose `` if it had , the States could not regulate abortions at all . The activists judges in Roe manufactured law in an attempt to balance the rights of a woman to her privacy against the States right to regulate abortion . Does n't anyone care about researching the facts before theygo running off at the mouth anymore ? Roe v. Wade - Oral Arguments MR. JUSTICE REHNQUIST , ( later to become Chief Justice ) dissenting.http : //www.audiocasefiles.com/acf_cases/8960-roe-v-wade `` The Court eschews the history of the Fourteenth Amendment in its reliance on the `` compelling state interest `` test . See Weber v. Aetna Casualty & amp ; Surety Co. . . . ( dissenting opinion ) . But the Court adds a new wrinkle to this test by transposing it from the legal considerations associated with the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment to this case arising under the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment . Unless I misapprehend the consequences of this transplanting of the `` compelling state interest test , `` the Court 's opinion will accomplish the seemingly impossible feat of leaving this area of the law more confused than it found it. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Roe v. Wade , she might join in with the legislative five to make a new and more restrictive law regarding abortion .""","""Roe is , was and always will be the historical reference for an example of `` judicial .""",,
3867,1010,"""Ok , so you are admitting that the unborn fetus , is in fact , a child ? I have to believe that is what you mean from your statement above . That being the case , do you condone the killing of a child that is born but will likely live in poverty the rest of his or her life ? Do you condone the killing of a handicapped child that is born ? If not , then you ca n't condone abortion . Also , who gives you the right to decide what is best for a child by killing him or her ? That should not be your choice ( this is another problem with humanism , because there is no moral authority to stop people from doing whatever they want to do , hence the adage that humanism is a philosophy that has both feet planted firmly in mid-air ) . I am sure the child would n't agree to that choice if given a voice to do so .""","""Of course I believe an unborn fetus is simply an unborn child . The only difference is that the unborn has no means of survival without the mother and is not recognized as being a living person . I do n't wish that this child should be killed , but as I said before it can be for the best . And if you really do believe in heaven , then the child is going there anyways . Why would you wish a life of suffering on it instead of being able to skip all that and go straight to heaven ? This is the type of logic that works against those who believe in a soul since it really does n't make much sense to live on Earth when heaven is a million billion times better . Just to answer your question with a question , how do you know a child would choose life over death when it has never lived ? People commit suicide everyday but I 'm sure they would also choose life over death if they had been in a better situation . Perhaps this is being too extreme . A person would likely choose to live when faced with death , but whether it logically make sense is another question . People will try to live through starvation , sickness , and misery because it is what their mind tells them to do . Is it really best that they are alive ?""",DISAGREE,"""do you condone the killing of a child that is born of a handicapped child""","""it can be for the best . And if you really do believe in heaven , then the child is going there anyways""",,
3868,1010,"""Ok , so you are admitting that the unborn fetus , is in fact , a child ? I have to believe that is what you mean from your statement above . That being the case , do you condone the killing of a child that is born but will likely live in poverty the rest of his or her life ? Do you condone the killing of a handicapped child that is born ? If not , then you ca n't condone abortion . Also , who gives you the right to decide what is best for a child by killing him or her ? That should not be your choice ( this is another problem with humanism , because there is no moral authority to stop people from doing whatever they want to do , hence the adage that humanism is a philosophy that has both feet planted firmly in mid-air ) . I am sure the child would n't agree to that choice if given a voice to do so .""","""Of course I believe an unborn fetus is simply an unborn child . The only difference is that the unborn has no means of survival without the mother and is not recognized as being a living person . I do n't wish that this child should be killed , but as I said before it can be for the best . And if you really do believe in heaven , then the child is going there anyways . Why would you wish a life of suffering on it instead of being able to skip all that and go straight to heaven ? This is the type of logic that works against those who believe in a soul since it really does n't make much sense to live on Earth when heaven is a million billion times better . Just to answer your question with a question , how do you know a child would choose life over death when it has never lived ? People commit suicide everyday but I 'm sure they would also choose life over death if they had been in a better situation . Perhaps this is being too extreme . A person would likely choose to live when faced with death , but whether it logically make sense is another question . People will try to live through starvation , sickness , and misery because it is what their mind tells them to do . Is it really best that they are alive ?""",DISAGREE,"""so you are admitting that the unborn fetus , is in fact , a child ?""","""Of course I believe an unborn fetus is simply an unborn child""",,
3869,1011,"""Not really . It just means that Homo erectus was around in Africa 200,000 and 125,000 years ago . So some of them stayed around in Africa . What 's your point ? ]""","""ah yes ... the `` what 's your point `` defense -- even though you just read my point ... which was the blacks got a later start under the darwin plan of evolution -- which prompted the whole `` out of africa `` version evolution so they could avoid their theory being labled as racist . That 's the point ... it was right in front of you . What 's your point for asking such a dumb question ?""",DISAGREE,"""What 's your point ?""","""ah yes ... the `` what 's your point `` defense What 's your point for asking such a dumb question ?""",,
3878,1013,"""Just like you did with your astounding ignorance of erosion ? Fresh Organic Sample is just as old as centuries old time capsule because they are both on top of the ground ! Where do you buy your South American Villagers Dinosaur commercial art ? I 'd love to give some to the kids !""","""Is that all you 've got ?""",DISAGREE,"""Fresh Organic Sample is just as old as centuries old time capsule because they are both on top of the ground !""","""Is that all you 've got ?""",,
3886,1015,"""This sentence is so badly constructed as to be nigh impossible to parse , and so I have no clear idea of what it is supposed to mean ....""","""So stop relying on press reports . The original paper is at sciencemag.org/cgi/reprint/317/5835/214.pdf ( add the standard prefixes )""",AGREE,"""This sentence is so badly constructed as to be nigh impossible to parse""","""So stop relying on press reports . original paper is at""",,
3898,1026,"""AMD4EVER , thank you for your reply . Does your nickname suggest you do n't like Intel ? Just wondering .""","""It used to mean that , now it is just a screen name . I was a big fan of AMD back when I was invested in them . They are still a decent company but they ca n't seem to keep up with Intel . I like your screen name as well . IÂ ’ m guessing you got the idea from Braveheart which is my favorite movie of all time !""",AGREE,"""AMD4EVER do n't like Intel ?""","""big fan of AMD still a decent company I like your screen name as well""",,
3901,1027,"""I have never received an actual explanation for the doctrine of eternal damnation from anyone I 've asked . It is something I struggled with before turning to Atheism , something I tried desperately to rationalize , and was one of the main points that LED to me becoming Atheist Many Christians claim that their God is omnipotent/omniscient . They claim that their God is a god of compassion , love , and mercy . Yet , with all of this , they claim that God punishes all people who do not accept Jesus as their savior with eternal torment in Hell , i.e . the vast majority of mankind numbering into the billions . What possible compassionate purpose can infinite torture have ? The punishment does n't even serve a remedial purpose because the tormented one is not allowed to repent . It 's only conceivable purpose ( to me at least ) is sadism . How is this not evil ? This thread is especially so I can her the thoughts of Christians on this and how they rationalize it , but anyone can feel free to chime in with observations , etc .""","""Well , here is my take on it . I really believe that only the truly evil end up in Hell . Those like Hitler . I think that anyone else goes to heaven - Wiccans , Atheists , Buddhists , etc . - anyone who follows Christ 's message of love , tolerance , and acceptance , whether knowingly or not . Those who preach hate , and those who act on that hate , like Hitler , the KKK , and any other person/persons filled with hate ( sad to say , this seems to apply to our own friend Archie here ) are the ones who will end up in hell .""",AGREE,"""I have never received an actual explanation for the doctrine of eternal damnation from anyone I 've asked .""","""I think that anyone else goes to heaven - Wiccans , Atheists , Buddhists , etc . - anyone who follows Christ 's message of love , tolerance , and acceptance , whether knowingly or not . Those who preach hate , and those who act on that hate , like Hitler , the KKK , and any other person/persons filled with hate ( sad to say , this seems to apply to our own friend Archie here ) are the ones who will end up in hell .""",,
3912,1031,"""I think when trying to prove the xistance of god , you are in a similar situation . You can not see god , you can not measure him , though some claim they can feel his presence . Personally , I believe in god , and I feel a little sorry for those who do n't . Faith in something bigger than yourself , bigger than all mankind , can give you something to hold onto when there seems to be nothing else . Personally , I believe in god because sometimes he talks to me . It is like a little voice in the back of your head that gives you nudges inthe right direction ( sometimes the voice is not so little ) . Maybe I am schizo . Maybe it is my subconscious . Personally , I believ it is god . I have never gone wrong heeding that little voice , though I have often walked right into a heap of trouble when I have ignored it . Anyway , that is my proof . I do n't expect it to convince anybody but me , but there it is .""","""i like your point on faith and believing in something bigger than yourself . i think man has an instinctive drive to better himself . and everyone believes in something bigger than himself , and its totally in the mind . for some its God . for some its their dreams . for some its their family , community , country , future generations of mankind . whatever it is , it is absolutely based on faith , and it is an element that pushes you to better yourself . faith in something bigger than yourself inspires improvement and self esteem , and i think everybody needs it""",AGREE,"""Faith in something bigger than yourself , bigger than all mankind , can give you something to hold onto when there seems to be nothing else . Personally , I believe in god because sometimes he talks to me . It is like a little voice in the back of your head that gives you nudges inthe right direction ( sometimes the voice is not so little ) . Maybe I am schizo . Maybe it is my subconscious . Personally , I believ it is god . I have never gone wrong heeding that little voice , though I have often walked right into a heap of trouble when I have ignored it . Anyway , that is my proof . I do n't expect it to convince anybody but me , but there it is .""","""for some its their dreams . for some its their family , community , country , future generations of mankind . whatever it is , it is absolutely based on faith , and it is an element that pushes you to better yourself . faith in something bigger than yourself inspires improvement and self esteem , and i think everybody needs it""",,
3917,1033,"""What possible concern is any of that to you ?""","""Now , I could ask the same thing .""",DISAGREE,"""What possible concern is any of that to you ?""","""Now , I could ask the same thing .""",,
3918,1034,"""and it can certainly impact your life ( faith ) , however it can not be said that faith is based on rational belief , or takes part in reason , in any way , it is the opposite of reason .""","""You 're still yet to show evidence for this . You have yet to post a 'reason ' other than re-stating your belief . On that post I put forward ( in Posts # 40 , # 46 , and # 66 ) evidence that agrees with my stance .""",DISAGREE,"""faith is based on rational belief , or takes part in reason""","""a 'reason ' other than re-stating your belief .""",,
3920,1035,"""Once again , my point was that evolutionists contradict each other .""","""Then by that standard , christianity is horse puckey ! Christians contradict each other . Oh ! But wait . Anyone who disagrees with you is n't `` really `` a christian .""",DISAGREE,"""evolutionists contradict each other .""","""Christians contradict each other .""",,
3922,1036,"""Prominent conservative J. Harvie Wilkinson of the 4th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals compared Heller to Roe v. Wade and criticized it for its lack of adherence to conservative methodology :""","""And before Heller , numerous judges declared that the Second Amendment was nothing more than a collective right that belonged to the states , giving them permission to have private militia armies for their own defense . In the end though , both they , and Wilkinson are wrong and their opinions matter not .""",DISAGREE,"""adherence to conservative methodology :""","""private militia armies for their own defense .""",,
3938,1041,"""What I find intresting is that the Rev . Joseph bigot Fuiten can not see that christians are a protected group and given special rights under the law . He sits there in his constitutional protected fortress and lobbs stones at gays and lesbians .""","""I 'd say there were a lot of stones going both ways . Do you know the Rev . well enough to be able to make that claim , that he 's a bigot ? Or is it he represents the system ?""",DISAGREE,"""the Rev . Joseph bigot Fuiten can not see that christians are a protected group""","""the Rev . well enough to be able to make that claim""",,
3958,1048,"""Suing the Boy Scouts and anyone else who disagrees with them .""","""Because they refuse to let openly gay fathers join because they cry pedophile .....""",AGREE,"""Suing the Boy Scouts and anyone else who disagrees with them .""","""Because they refuse to let openly gay""",,
3962,1049,"""Are you a real man or do you send PMs to mothers applauding and endorsing violence against their children ?""","""He did n't ! I hope you reported that to the admin""",AGREE,"""endorsing violence against their children""","""I hope you reported that to the admin""",,
3961,1049,"""Are you a real man or do you send PMs to mothers applauding and endorsing violence against their children ?""","""He did n't ! I hope you reported that to the admin""",AGREE,"""do you send PMs to mothers applauding and endorsing violence against their children""","""He did n't""",,
3966,1051,"""* * Which is why you darwinists , for all that you parade yourselves as 'scientists ' , are really nothing but 'true believers ' , intent upon evangelizing your core ideology , materialist atheism .""","""Nope a true believer will insist on his belief system even in the presense of overwheliming contrary evidence . So far you have not managed to produce andy such evidence to the contrary . Should you do so in a rational scientific way which can be verified then Darwinists will throw down the theory and join you in your conclusions with verve . I am not however going to wait for it to happen . Tis up to you .""",DISAGREE,"""Which is why you darwinists , for all that you parade yourselves as 'scientists ' , are really nothing but 'true believers ' , intent upon evangelizing your core ideology , materialist atheism .""","""Nope a true believer will insist on his belief system even in the presense of overwheliming contrary evidence . So far you have not managed to produce andy such evidence to the contrary .""",,
3969,1051,"""* * Which is why you darwinists , for all that you parade yourselves as 'scientists ' , are really nothing but 'true believers ' , intent upon evangelizing your core ideology , materialist atheism .""","""Nope a true believer will insist on his belief system even in the presense of overwheliming contrary evidence . So far you have not managed to produce andy such evidence to the contrary . Should you do so in a rational scientific way which can be verified then Darwinists will throw down the theory and join you in your conclusions with verve . I am not however going to wait for it to happen . Tis up to you .""",DISAGREE,"""Which is why you darwinists , for all that you parade yourselves as 'scientists ' , are really nothing but 'true believers ' ,""","""Nope a true believer will insist on his belief system""",,
3983,1054,"""Yet to the woman the fetus is nothing more then cancer . The fetus is in her body and still should remain HER choice . Until someone comes up with a way for a fetus to live outside the body , without help , then it is nothing more then cancer and a parasite on the womans body . How about a compromise on this issue MEN should not have a say or decision about abortion and we all leave any legal desions to women . Since this is a womans issue let them decide and males but out .""","""A woman can think was she wants but it is still a human being . Killing parasites was often the argument for eugenics ya know ... a parasite on society ... just thought I 'd let that slip . Nevertheless , I think the woman should have the choice .. and she does . However , if she makes the choice to kill another human being we should punish her or whoever did it .""",DISAGREE,"""Yet to the woman the fetus is nothing more then cancer . The fetus is in her body and still should remain HER choice .""","""A woman can think was she wants but it is still a human being .""",,
3988,1055,"""I do n't blog about computer science very much but rather about areas of science with political implications such as global warming , the relationship between guns and crime and the use of DDT against malaria . Usually I 'm inspired by reading an article and noticing something that does n't seem to be correct . I then do a little bit of research and before you know it I have a blog post explaining what is wrong and why it is wrong .""","""Just another anti-gun Blogger . I could go on , but doing so would boar the heck out of everyone , to include me !""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't blog about computer science very much but rather about areas of science with political implications such as global warming ,""","""Just another anti-gun Blogger . I could go on""",,
3995,1056,"""The Senators and Representatives before mentioned , and the Members of the several State Legislatures , and all executive and judicial Officers , both of the United States and of the several States , shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation , to support this Constitution ; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States .""","""So it seems that the framers of the Constitution did n't think that a Bible was necessary .""",AGREE,"""The Senators and Representatives before mentioned , and the Members of the several State Legislatures ,""","""So it seems that the framers of the Constitution did n't think that a Bible was necessary .""",,
4005,1059,"""Fact is grant money is n't going to embryonic stem cell research because it has n't yielded results favorable to the investment ... now scientism on the other hand has an agenda in supporting the pro-choice contingent they do n't care about objectivity , truth , right ... wrong ... evidence , fact , reason , common sense , clinical trials . All they care about is their agenda , abortion on demand . Thought I 'd poke a hole the glass of Kool-Aid you folks are guzzling here : Stem Cell Research - The Next Four Years Under Barack Obama | Science Blog Congressman Daniel Lipinski - ( July 30 , 2007 ) Adult Stem Cell Research Puts Patients First , Proponents Say""","""The only arguement I hear from these links against embryonic stem cell research is that , in ten years , it has n't yielded sufficient results for human trials . If that is your only arguement against its scientific viability then it is a weak one . Many technologies , biological ones included , can take a long time to develop . Certainly , the adult repair stem cells that are mentioned in your articles may have their uses and sound as if they also deserve research money . However , one can not just listen to one side of the story to make a decision . The scientists researching repair stem cells , patients who benefited from them , and doctors who use them are obviously going to sing its praises when it does introduce some gain . However , the embryonic stem cells might have even more potential , given the time and money to develop the technology . So , unless you can show me evidence that embryonic stem cells will never achieve their potential or that repair stem cells can achieve everything that embryonic stem cells are hoped to achieve , then your arguement against embryonic stem cell research continues to be unconvincing .""",DISAGREE,"""grant money is n't going to embryonic stem cell research because it has n't yielded results favorable to the investment""","""If that is your only arguement against its scientific viability then it is a weak one .""",,
4010,1060,"""Shazaam ! You were n't kidding in another thread when you said `` us old geezers `` were you ?""","""I 'm not sure what the threshold for gezzerdom is , but I fear I have passed it . Dono""",AGREE,"""Shazaam ! You were n't kidding in another thread when you said `` us old geezers""","""I fear I have passed it .""",,
4023,1063,"""The coelacanth , according to fossil records , and according to evolutionists , allegedly went extinct millions and millions of years ago . Until they were found alive . As if this should be any surprise . The theory of evolution mindset once again contradicts observable science .""","""Experience contradicts previously accepted experience . That 's how science evolves . Science . Evolves .""",AGREE,"""The coelacanth , according to fossil records , and according to evolutionists , allegedly went extinct millions and millions of years ago .""","""That 's how science evolves . Science . Evolves .""",,
4039,1066,"""'' infer ( an unknown ) from something that is known ; conjecture. ``""","""and a conjecture is ;""",DISAGREE,"""infer ( an unknown ) from something that is known ;""","""and a conjecture is""",,
4047,1068,"""The fact is kronus that i was just responding to Ripskar asking if , and I quote : `` Anyone fancy a sweepstake on how long this insanity will take to go belly up ? `` You see , he did n't offer a link that gave odds on his opinion so neither do I have to . But I 'm sure that when http : //answersingenesis.com came on line , atheists and anti christian bigots all over the internet took bets they would fail just as ripskar is doing now with the creation of this new site . It 's just a common sense deduction dontya know .""","""I know exactly what you were saying . And it seems I was right , you have nothing to back up your claim that people were betting that it would fail . It 's just something you 're `` sure `` of , i.e . something you made up . Like I figured .""",DISAGREE,"""Anyone fancy a sweepstake on how long this insanity will take to go belly up ?""","""And it seems I was right , you have nothing to back up your claim""",,
4077,1073,"""OkÂ…this is really a continuation of my  “ Evolutionists ’ Worst Nightmare Post. ’ It ’ s merely an extension that PROVES the dishonesty of evolutionists .""","""Well , given that your term is a fabrication of the creationist 's mind , I suppose you 're right . Evolutionists do n't actually exist . Therefore you could assign whatever traits you wanted to them , including dishonesty . Evolutionist is a term designed to cast evolution as a faith based notion . The problem is there is no faith in evolution , faith is a belief in something with no proof . Evolution has proof . Therefore it can not be a faith based idea . A typical creationist attack is to misrepresent their target by creating a strawman of it . They then declare it is wrong and by proxy , the actual theory wrong . It 's fundementally weak , but inline with a belief that is scientifically unsound .""",DISAGREE,"""OkÂ…this is really a continuation of my  Evolutionists ’ Worst Nightmare Post. ’ It ’ s merely an extension that PROVES the dishonesty of evolutionists .""","""Well , given that your term is a fabrication of the creationist 's mind , I suppose you 're right . Evolutionists do n't actually exist . Therefore you could assign whatever traits you wanted to them , including dishonesty .""",,
4078,1074,"""As I explained above , it is not reasonable to expect quality of life to take a backseat to the sanctity of life .""","""why ?""",DISAGREE,"""As I explained above , it is not reasonable to expect quality of life to take a backseat to the sanctity of life .""","""why ?""",,
4080,1074,"""As I explained above , it is not reasonable to expect quality of life to take a backseat to the sanctity of life .""","""why ?""",DISAGREE,"""it is not reasonable""","""why ?""",,
4081,1075,"""The mentally disabled are not able to drive . They depend on level-headed , indiscriminate folks like you and I to do that ... and most everything else for that matter . Do n't forget who depends on whom . I wonder what that wonder was ? Hmmm ...""","""Well , it depends on your definition of retarded I guess . The standards to get a drivers license are really not that high . Think of how dumb the average person is , and realize that 50 % of people are dumber than that . Kinda makes you cringe . And you wonder what has prevented me from being in an accident ? Well , perhaps the fact that I am a concientious , defensive , and skilled driver who excercises caution while on the road . Maybe next time someone pulls out in front of me , I should just throw my hands in the air and scream `` take the wheel jesus ! `` I am sure some magical being will fly down from heaven and save me from crashing . Yeah ... sure .""",DISAGREE,"""level-headed , indiscriminate folks who depends on whom""","""definition of retarded excercises caution `` take the wheel jesus ! magical down""",,
4090,1077,"""Why Matthew S do you find this article so fascinating ? Why is there honor in marriage ? What is it about marriage that makes it an honor ?""","""Because I am one who likes see things from different angles . What better way to fight your enemies then to understand their viewpoint . Before I am attacked on the the last statement , just because I understand a viewpoint does not meant that I accept it as true or that I do n't reject it .""",DISAGREE,"""Why Matthew S do you find this article so fascinating ? Why is there honor in marriage ? What is it about marriage that makes it an honor ?""","""Because I am one who likes see things from different angles . What better way to fight your enemies then to understand their viewpoint""",,
4096,1078,"""Does anyone know how Carbon Dating Works ?""","""Sure , here ya go ... Radiocarbon Dating""",AGREE,"""Does anyone know Carbon Dating""","""Sure Radiocarbon Dating""",,
4122,1083,"""Marriage is between a man and a woman . If we allow marriage to be redefined to include same-sex couples , the Twin Pilllars of Morality and Spirituality ( which have served as beacons of the American culture since our beginning ) will not stand .""","""And those pillars will be replaced by something stronger like equality and Justice .""",DISAGREE,"""Marriage is between a man and a woman . If we allow marriage to be redefined to include same-sex couples ,""","""And those pillars will be replaced by something stronger like equality and Justice .""",,
4146,1088,"""That would be beating the bejesus out of a kid as opposed to teaching him or her how to govern his or her impulses by themselves .""","""Like you were raised ? Looks like it did n't work and now those hormones must be kicking in ? Nothing worse than a menopausal female grinding her ax ... their favorite victims ? Males .""",DISAGREE,"""how to govern his or her impulses""","""Like you were raised ?""",,
4161,1094,"""And thus , breeding becomes more of a random lottery than something that 's based on genetic superiority or fitness . This flies in the face of evolutionists ' thinking . ( Does anyone know of someone who is unable to breed ? )""","""People who are sterile ca n't breed .""",DISAGREE,"""This flies in the face of evolutionists ' thinking""","""People who are sterile ca n't breed .""",,
4163,1095,"""Challenged by Creationists , Museums Answer Back By CORNELIA DEAN Published : September 20 , 2005 ITHACA , N.Y. - Lenore Durkee , a retired biology professor , was volunteering as a docent at the Museum of the Earth here when she was confronted by a group of seven or eight people , creationists eager to challenge the museum exhibitions on evolution . They peppered Dr. Durkee with questions about everything from techniques for dating fossils to the second law of thermodynamics , their queries coming so thick and fast that she found it hard to reply . After about 45 minutes , `` I told them I needed to take a break , `` she recalled . '' My mouth was dry. `` That encounter and others like it provided the impetus for a training session here in August . Dr. Durkee and scores of other volunteers and staff members from the museum and elsewhere crowded into a meeting room to hear advice from the museum director , Warren D. Allmon , on ways to deal with visitors who reject settled precepts of science on religious grounds . Similar efforts are under way or planned around the country as science museums and other institutions struggle to contend with challenges to the theory of evolution that they say are growing common and sometimes aggressive . One company , called B.C . Tours `` because we are biblically correct , `` even offers escorted visits to the Denver Museum of Science and Nature . Participants hear creationists ' explanations for the exhibitions . So officials like Judy Diamond , curator of public programs at the University of Nebraska State Museum in Lincoln , are trying to meet such challenges head-on . Dr. Diamond is working on evolution exhibitions financed by the National Science Foundation that will go on long-term display at six museums of natural history from Minnesota to Texas . The program includes training for docents and staff members . '' The goal is to understand the controversies , so that people are better able to handle them as they come up , `` she said . '' Museums , as a field , have recognized we need to take a more proactive role in evolution education. `` Dr. Allmon , who directs the Paleontological Research Institution , an affiliate of Cornell University , began the training session here in September with statistics from Gallup Polls : 54 percent of Americans do not believe that human beings evolved from earlier species , and although almost half believe that Darwin has been proved right , slightly more disagree . '' Just telling them they are wrong is not going to be effective , `` he said . Instead , he told the volunteers that when they encounter religious fundamentalists they should emphasize that science museums live by the rules of science . They seek answers in nature to questions about nature , they look for explanations that can be tested by experiment and observation in the material world , and they understand that all scientific knowledge is provisional - capable of being overturned when better answers are discovered . '' Is it against all religion ? `` he asked . '' No . But it is against some religions. `` There is more than one type of creationist , he said : `` thinking creationists who want to know answers , and they are willing to listen , even if they go away unconvinced `` and `` people who for whatever reason are here to bother you , to trap you , to bludgeon you. `` Those were the type of people who confronted Dr. Durkee , a former biology professor at Grinnell College in Iowa . The encounter left her discouraged . '' It is no wonder that many biologists will simply refuse to debate creationists or I.D.ers , `` she said , using the abbreviation for intelligent design , a cousin of creationism . '' It is as if they are n't listening. `` Dr. Allmon says even trained scientists like Dr. Durkee can benefit from explicit advice about dealing with religious challenges to science exhibitions . '' There is an art , a script that is very , very helpful , `` he said . A pamphlet handed out at the training session provides information on the scientific method , the theory of evolution and other basic information . It offers suggestions on replying to frequently raised challenges like `` Is there lots of evidence against evolution ? `` ( The answer begins , simply , `` No. `` ) When talking to visitors about evolution , the pamphlet advises , `` do n't avoid using the word. `` Rehearse answers to frequently asked questions , because `` you 'll be more comfortable when you sound like you know what you 're talking about. `` Dr. Allmon told his audience to `` be firm and clear , not defensive. `` The pamphlet says that if all else fails , and docents find themselves in an unpleasant confrontation , they excuse themselves by saying , `` I have to go to the restroom. `` Eugenie C. Scott , who directs the National Center for Science Education and is conducting training sessions for Dr. Diamond 's program , said that within the last year or so efforts to train museum personnel and volunteers on evolution and related topics had substantially increased . '' This seems to be a cottage industry now , `` Dr. Scott said . Robert M. West , a paleontologist and former science museum director who is now a consultant to museums , said several institutions were intensifying the docents ' training `` so they are comfortable with the concepts , not just the material but the intellectual , philosophical background - and they know their administrations are going to support them if someone criticizes them. `` At the Denver science museum , the staff and docents often encounter groups from B.C . Tours , which for 15 years has offered tours of the museum based on literal readings of the Bible . The group embraces young-earth creationism , the view that the earth and its plants , animals and people were created in a matter of days a few thousand years ago . '' We present both sides from an objective perspective and let the students decide for themselves , `` said Rusty Carter , an operator of the group . Mr. Carter praised the museum , saying it had been `` very professional and accommodating , even though they do not support us. `` A typical group might have 30 or 40 people , he added . Kirk Johnson , a paleontologist who is the chief curator at the museum , was philosophical about the group . '' It 's interesting to walk along with them , `` he said . Participants pay the admission fee and have as much right as anyone else to be in the museum , Dr. Johnson said , but sometimes `` we have to restrain our docents from interacting with them. `` John G. West , a senior fellow at the Discovery Institute , whose researchers endorse intelligent design , said he was not aware of organized efforts to challenge museum exhibitions on evolution . He added , `` It is not unheard of for museum exhibits to be wrong scientifically. `` Dr. Scott , who trained as a physical anthropologist , said that in training docents she emphasized `` how the public understands or misunderstands evolution and some of the misconceptions they come in with. `` She hopes to combat the idea that people must choose between science and faith - `` that you are either a good Christian creationist or an evil atheist evolutionist. `` '' It 's your job , `` she told docents , `` not to slam the door in the face of a believer. `` At the American Museum of Natural History , which is about to open what it describes as `` the most in-depth exhibition ever `` on Darwin and his work , curators and other staff members instruct volunteer `` explainers `` on the science behind its exhibitions , according to Stephen Reichl , a spokesman . If visitors challenge the presentations , the explainers are instructed to listen `` and then explain the science and the evidence. `` Sarah Fiorello , an environmental educator at the Finger Lakes State Parks Region who took part in the Ithaca training session in August , said she was now prepared to take the same approach . When she describes the region 's geological history on tours of its gorges , visitors often object - as even a member of her family once did - that `` it does not say that in the Bible. `` Now , she said , she will tell them , `` The landscape tells a story based on geological events , based on science. `` Dr. Durkee also said she found the session helpful . '' When you are in a museum , you ca n't antagonize people , `` she said . '' Your job is to help them , to explain your point of view , but respect theirs . '' I like the idea of stressing that this is a science museum , and we deal with matters of science. ``""","""Kudos to them for stepping up to the plate . A part of me thinks it 's sad that it has come to this , and will surely develop further , but part of me thinks this is just the sort of thing needed . Most creationists do n't realize that they are creationists . Maybe more of them will start to prod and ask questions of people like museum curators , and perhaps some of them will leave with a broader science knowlege . Actually , I might begin to believe that this upwelling of support for young earth creationism and intellegent design creationism might have its benefits . If more and more people come out of the woodwork and inadvertantly admit that they are scientifically illiterate by hitting people like museum curators and teachers with creationist arguments against evolution , then maybe more of them will debate the topic long enough to have an epiphone . They might just realize they had been blinded by faith , not in their god or holy book , but by what preacher Joe down the corner had told them .""",DISAGREE,"""we need to take a more proactive role in evolution""","""Most creationists do n't realize that they are creationists""",,
4167,1097,"""No , but my wife is .""","""Why is it left to me to have to respond to this ? I guess the question is , what is she petrified of ?""",DISAGREE,"""No , but my wife is .""","""Why is it left to me to have to respond to this ? I guess the question is , what is she petrified of ?""",,
4177,1101,"""I have been around firearms my whole life and I have never once been a mindless # # # # # who is being contriolled by a firearm .""","""We accept your word .""",AGREE,"""I have been around firearms my whole life and I have never once been a mindless # # # # # who is being contriolled by a firearm .""","""We accept your word .""",,
4181,1102,"""Fine for the Aussies . It will never happen here , unless the government just takes them . Did I ever do the gun buy back calculation for you ?""","""I think I remember seeing some post concerning that . It think it went to the affect of the buy back paid only a fraction of what the weapon was worth . But anyways I hope it never does happen here . A voluntary buy back is fine but a forced one should n't be considered . I do n't believe the government will make it a policy to increase gun controls to the level where it is forcing people to get rid of guns . I think they realize the 2nd amendment is strongly against this and they would get called on it .""",AGREE,"""It will never happen here , unless the government just takes them .""","""I do n't believe the government will make it a policy to increase gun controls""",,
4186,1103,"""I Should the Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""Maybe they did it on purpose ? They push through the amendment to quiet the RR while the issue is a hot botton topic , but make sure it 's unconstitutional so that it 'll get shot down . Just a thought .""",DISAGREE,"""Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""RR while the issue is a hot botton topic , but make sure it 's unconstitutional""",,
4192,1105,"""If God is all-powerful , then His words should be all that 's needed . To me , the world is proof that God is all-powerful . The beauty and complexity is just staggering . ( if all the DNA in the human body was stretched out it would circle the moon 6,000 times ! ) http : //www.ba-education.demon.co.uk/ ... ience/dna.html""","""So much about complexity on earth has been discovered since Darwin , yet comparatively little more complexity has been discovered in all the dead rock planets all around us . But Darwinism will always be the faithful beginning point for atheism , just as the Bible is for us .""",DISAGREE,"""The beauty and complexity is just staggering .""","""Darwinism will always be the faithful beginning point for atheism , just as the Bible is for us .""",,
4207,1110,"""Also , a fetus is n't a child . A child can live without it 's mother . A fetus can not . We do n't see a fetus as a parasite , but that essentially what it is .....""","""Thats an odd analogy . Can a child survive without its mother ? I 'd say a baby is no less dependent on its mother the first few years than it is when in it grew in the womb . Is the child still a parasite then ?""",DISAGREE,"""Also , a fetus is n't a child . A child can live without it 's mother . A fetus can not .""","""Thats an odd analogy""",,
4210,1112,"""Ok according to the bible God only created the first two beings , Adam and Eve . Now christians dont rule out science , and science has shown that we produce offspring . God has created these offspring but not directly . Think of photosynthesis , we eat meat , this is getting energy from the sun indirectly . So we have shown that we ourselves produce offspring but we are put here and given the abbility by God to produce offspring . As far as your question on why God alows addicts to have babies it can be explained as this . We where given the freedome of choice to decide if we want to be an addict , wrong put we have the choice . God created us to have that choice , or else we would be robots . The bible also says God knows everything yet to come , so he new that this particular person would become an addict and have baby . God can stop this put he doesnt interecpt dirrectly with our choices .""","""So God already knows if a particular person will become an addict ? That does n't leave much free choice for that person , does it ? If I go to a restaurant and God already knows I 'm going to choose the poached salmon for my entree , then I do n't have much choice in the matter , do I ? Omniscience and free will are mutually exclusive . If God is omniscient , then we are indeed ultimately robots . Deluded with the perception of free will , but robots none the less . Unless of course , God is so omnipotent that he can know everything and still allow free choice . But then reason , logic , and thought become delusional . Sounds like a loose / loose situation to me .""",DISAGREE,"""he new that this particular person would become an addict and have baby . God can stop this put he doesnt interecpt dirrectly with our choices .""","""God is omniscient , then we are indeed ultimately robots . Deluded with the perception of free will , but robots none the less . Unless of course , God is so omnipotent that he can know everything and still allow free choice . But then reason , logic , and thought become delusional . Sounds like a loose / loose situation to me .""",,
4215,1114,"""And do n't you find it significant that a gun , a symbol and tool of violence , can raise levels of testosterone ? What kind of effect does testosterone have on behavior ? Dogs become more friendly when testosterone is reduced in their bodies through neutering :""","""So Starguy since you are obviously afraid of guns and wo n't go near , you do n't have to worry about any `` violent testosterone 's `` but if you want to be friendlier well you know how to do it . OUCH .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't you find it significant that a gun , a symbol and tool of violence , can raise levels of testosterone ?""","""if you want to be friendlier well you know how to do it . OUCH .""",,
4223,1115,"""Two requisites are essential to be a true antiabortionist : 1 ) To promote fetal civil registration 2 ) To promote legal punishment for abortionist mothers""","""Well said . Except for a very few , all the profetallifers here refuse to discuss either . They would rather buff , bluster , and bloviate in the most general of terms .""",AGREE,"""Two requisites are essential to be a true antiabortionist""","""Well said .""",,
4227,1116,"""The military does not use shotguns ? Please check the army 's new shotgun : http : //www.benelliusa.com/firearms/m4.tpl""","""I believe I said the military does not use sawed off shot guns , and then I said it does use other forms of shot guns . You have never did explain why you as a gun owner defends every gun control law Sarah Brady wants ! There is a name for people like you and I believe it is traitor !""",DISAGREE,"""military does not use shotguns ? check the army 's new shotgun""","""military does not use sawed off shot guns I said it does use other forms of shot guns .""",,
4248,1120,"""There 's no mention of gays in the constitution . Our agenda is incorporation and equal treatment . What 's yours ? You seem to forget we already tried this standard . And it 's for this reason that the 14th Amendment came into existence ; because allowing local communities to disregard the constitution on the basis that it did n't apply to them , was a massive failure and outright racist .""","""We 've already been over this and again you 're confusing two separate issues . I think everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""",DISAGREE,"""no mention of gays in the constitution Our agenda is incorporation and equal treatment .""","""you 're confusing two separate issues . everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""",,
4267,1127,"""we simply do not evolve , there is no scientific proof just ideas which change from day to day that also explain our siciety today .""","""But there is evidence that we do evolve . I 'll give you an example . In areas of west Africa where malaria is endemic there is an allele of hemoglobin that confers resistance when heterozygous . In other environments that allele is not beneficial and is , in fact , deleterious . It is fatal when homozygous . Now according to evolutionary theory such an allele should decline where it offers no benefit . Studies show that this allele is less frequent by about 2 percentage points in Americans of west African ancestry .""",DISAGREE,"""we simply do not evolve , there is no scientific proof just ideas which change from day to day that also explain our siciety today .""","""But there is evidence that we do evolve . I 'll give you an example . In areas of west Africa where malaria is endemic there is an allele of hemoglobin that confers resistance when heterozygous . In other environments that allele is not beneficial and is , in fact , deleterious . It is fatal when homozygous . Now according to evolutionary theory such an allele should decline where it offers no benefit . Studies show that this allele is less frequent by about 2 percentage points in Americans of west African ancestry .""",,
4272,1128,""".... that would probably help me make quite popular , which would help me reproduce .... however this trait has not arisen yet .... why not ?""","""Please stop demonstrating your complete inability to understand evolutionary theory . How is Texas Stadium meaningful in the population of the earth ? Do various blimp pilots who soar over Texas Stadium have better sexual success than you ? You seem to be a bit of a sad sack .""",DISAGREE,"""would probably help me make quite popular , which would help me reproduce .... however this trait has not arisen yet .... why not ?""","""How is Texas Stadium meaningful in the population of the earth ? Do various blimp pilots who soar over Texas Stadium have better sexual success than you ?""",,
4274,1128,""".... that would probably help me make quite popular , which would help me reproduce .... however this trait has not arisen yet .... why not ?""","""Please stop demonstrating your complete inability to understand evolutionary theory . How is Texas Stadium meaningful in the population of the earth ? Do various blimp pilots who soar over Texas Stadium have better sexual success than you ? You seem to be a bit of a sad sack .""",DISAGREE,"""that would probably help me make quite popular , which would help me reproduce .... however this trait has not arisen yet .... why not ?""","""Please stop demonstrating your complete inability to understand evolutionary theory . How is Texas Stadium meaningful in the population of the earth ? Do various blimp pilots who soar over Texas Stadium have better sexual success than you ? You seem to be a bit of a sad sack .""",,
4279,1128,""".... that would probably help me make quite popular , which would help me reproduce .... however this trait has not arisen yet .... why not ?""","""Please stop demonstrating your complete inability to understand evolutionary theory . How is Texas Stadium meaningful in the population of the earth ? Do various blimp pilots who soar over Texas Stadium have better sexual success than you ? You seem to be a bit of a sad sack .""",DISAGREE,"""this trait has not arisen yet""","""stop demonstrating your complete inability to understand evolutionary theory .""",,
4292,1130,"""Not all women are the same . And , your attitude is very offensive if you believe that all women must carry an enormous burden of guilt if they have an abortion .""","""Yes , and since some might not , it should not be mentioned at all ? Personally I only know a half dozen people who have had abortions ( at least that I know if ) . 1 of them does n't care , she has had 6 or 8 abortions ... pretty much used them instead of the pill . 2 are pro life zealots now and feel terrible about the fact they had aboortions . 2 are pro life , but not zealots . The final one was overwhelming pro choice prior to her abortion . Attended rallies and everything . SHE felt so bad about havinghte abortion afterwards that 6 months later she blew her head off . She could not get it out of her head that she had killed a baby . She became totally obsessed and finally cracked . So , yea ... maybe it is not so out of line for people , including men , to say `` Think about it real hard because a lot of people regret it `` . You do n't have to get shot to know it hurts .""",DISAGREE,"""your attitude is very offensive if you believe that all women must carry an enormous""","""She could not get it out of her head that she had killed a baby .""",,
4322,1133,"""Pointing out some of the achievements of science which could not have been accomplished in any other way , is not `` raising science on a pedestal `` - it 's merely reciting the obvious .""","""Straw man . I am not attacking the achievements of science . I am attacking the notion that you have that scientists are exempt from the catalogue of influences that affect everyone else ; with only the slightest admission of a tiny possibility of cultural influence - which was quickly dismissed anyway with the false analogy of comparing evolution to aeronautical engineering .""",DISAGREE,"""Pointing out some of the achievements of science which could not have been accomplished""","""catalogue of influences that affect everyone else""",,
4331,1134,"""you yourself were once in exactly the same position and condition as an unborn child is now , and look at what you have become .""","""You SERIOUSLY need to take a basic biology course so you can stop sticking your foot in your mouth An egg is NOT larva , and larva is NOT a caterpillar , and a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly - much the same as a zygote is NOT a embryo , and a embryo is NOT a fetus , and a fetus is NOT a baby , and a baby is NOT an adult . I challenge you to prove that a larva is exactly the same as a butterfly . If you ca n't even do something as simple as that , then you 'll never understand the process/transformation of what a human has to go through , and THAT in and of itself should give you a clue as to how much in denial you are in , and how much you have to twist the truth around just to justify your version of events . Deal with it !""",DISAGREE,"""you yourself were once in exactly the same position and condition as an unborn child is now , and look at what you have become .""","""An egg is NOT larva , and larva is NOT a caterpillar , and a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly - much the same as a zygote is NOT a embryo , and a embryo is NOT a fetus , and a fetus is NOT a baby , and a baby is NOT an adult .""",,
4335,1134,"""you yourself were once in exactly the same position and condition as an unborn child is now , and look at what you have become .""","""You SERIOUSLY need to take a basic biology course so you can stop sticking your foot in your mouth An egg is NOT larva , and larva is NOT a caterpillar , and a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly - much the same as a zygote is NOT a embryo , and a embryo is NOT a fetus , and a fetus is NOT a baby , and a baby is NOT an adult . I challenge you to prove that a larva is exactly the same as a butterfly . If you ca n't even do something as simple as that , then you 'll never understand the process/transformation of what a human has to go through , and THAT in and of itself should give you a clue as to how much in denial you are in , and how much you have to twist the truth around just to justify your version of events . Deal with it !""",DISAGREE,"""yourself were once in exactly the same position and condition as an unborn child is now""","""you 'll never understand the process/transformation of what a human has to go through , and THAT in and of itself should give you a clue""",,
4352,1137,"""This is despite the fact that there are real variations between species that make a real difference in fitness .""","""Hmmm ... He may get things right only when he thinks getting it right contradicts evolution ...""",DISAGREE,"""This is despite the fact that there are real variations between species that make a real difference in fitness .""","""He may get things right only when he thinks getting it right contradicts evolution ...""",,
4354,1137,"""This is despite the fact that there are real variations between species that make a real difference in fitness .""","""Hmmm ... He may get things right only when he thinks getting it right contradicts evolution ...""",DISAGREE,"""This is despite the fact that there are real variations between species that make a real difference in fitness .""","""He may get things right only when he thinks getting it right contradicts evolution""",,
4356,1138,"""`` If the Founding Fathers could read the Ninth Circuit 's opinion , they would be cheering , `` said Mr. Henigan . '' By so forcefully challenging the perversion of the Second Amendment by those who seek to dismantle our gun laws , the Court has honored the Framers and their Constitution. ``""","""http : //www.bradycampaign.org/press/r ... asp ? Record=442""",DISAGREE,"""If the Founding Fathers could read the Ninth Circuit 's opinion , they would be cheering , `` said Mr. Henigan . '' By so forcefully challenging the perversion of the Second Amendment by those who seek to dismantle our gun laws , the Court has honored the Framers and their Constitution. ``""",""": //www.bradycampaign.org/press/r ... asp ? Record=442""",,
4366,1139,"""No one wants to take your `` marriage `` away Matt . It 's a free country -- no one 's going to block your way to any chapel that will marry you . Do your gay thing . But let marriage be marriage -- it 's a different matter . People just want to keep you from tampering with the institution of marriage .""","""Oh really the people who where behind the petition drive here in michigan want to deny me marriage , Here I will let the head of the organization that spearheaded the drive explain it in her own words . http : //www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp ? ID=19408""",DISAGREE,"""People just want to keep you from tampering with the institution of marriage""","""the people who where behind the petition drive here in michigan want to deny me marriage""",,
4378,1141,"""That 's stupid ( and totally inaccurate ) . But I will say one thing - I would make partial birth abortion a federal crime with the death penalty for whoever performs one . And I 'd make their executions public and put them on pay TV , and use the proceeds to fund homes for unwed mothers , etc . Those late-term abortion butchers are the most despicable individuals known to mankind , and they deserve what they get .""","""And I propose we put lunatics who make threats to completely legitimate doctors in a state mental ward for a few years to straighten them out . As to the abortion issue , are the pro lifers really that willing to risk one of their precious fetuses over a traffic ticket ? !""",DISAGREE,"""I would make partial birth abortion a federal crime with the death penalty for whoever performs one .""","""pro lifers really that willing to risk one of their precious fetuses over a traffic ticket ? !""",,
4383,1142,"""I 'm talking about `` evolution `` as defined by creationists . That includes abiogenesis and the big bang . I have attempted to show that these theories require fewer assumptions and are therefore more likely to be right .""","""And why are you letting them define what the theory is ? Especially when it is wrong . Of course , I am arguing that having fewer assumptions has nothing to do with being right .""",AGREE,"""I 'm talking about `` evolution `` as defined by creationists . I have attempted to show that these theories require fewer assumptions and are therefore more likely to be right .""","""And why are you letting them define what the theory is ? I am arguing that having fewer assumptions has nothing to do with being right .""",,
4403,1144,"""Why Tester , do n't you point out his straw-man which this thread is based upon ?""","""Because I think you misinterpreted his point . See below :""",DISAGREE,"""Why do n't you point out his straw-man""","""Because I think you misinterpreted""",,
4409,1145,"""Based on threads I 've been reading here , there is a real tendency among some of the pro-choicers to portray pregnancy as a horrible thing that cause women to suffer -- that it is somthing bad or undesirable . - How could the opportunity to bring a life into the world , a wonderful miracle , be so awful by default ? Rather than bring into this peripheral thoughts to the question , such as rights and legal issues ( which are discussed at length here already in other threads ) , I 'd love to hear straightforward relelvant answers to this . I am also already aware that pregnancy can sometimes involve complications or that it can at times cause financial constraints . But I am mainly interested in seeing why there is a default tendency in pro-choice arguments to argue from the standpoint of pregnancy being a bad thing . Any thoughts ?""","""the bad thing about pregnancy is that it brings a life into the world . the most common reason for abortion is that the woman does not want the child . abortions that occur due to complications or medical risks to the mother or child make up less than 5 % of the total .""",DISAGREE,"""How could the opportunity to bring a life into the world , a wonderful miracle , be so awful by default ?""","""the bad thing about pregnancy is that it brings a life into the world .""",,
4417,1146,"""You assume that the majority want gays to enjoy those same benefits . That 's a big assumption .""","""I assume nothing of the sort . That statement only relies on that fact that if same-sex couples were allowed to marry , the marriage rights of opposite-sex couples would be unaffected and would remain completely intact .""",DISAGREE,"""You assume that the majority want gays to enjoy those same benefits""","""I assume nothing of the sort . That statement only relies on that fact that if same-sex couples were allowed to marry ,""",,
4420,1146,"""You assume that the majority want gays to enjoy those same benefits . That 's a big assumption .""","""I assume nothing of the sort . That statement only relies on that fact that if same-sex couples were allowed to marry , the marriage rights of opposite-sex couples would be unaffected and would remain completely intact .""",DISAGREE,"""that the majority want gays to enjoy those same benefits""","""I assume nothing of the sort .""",,
4427,1147,"""Would you have supported the `` freedom `` for Hitler and his cronies to own guns in 1932 ? Mao in 1947-48 ? Because those freedoms directly led to the abrogation of the ultimate right -- the right to life -- for at least 30 million people . Gun control is NOT about a government trying to disarm a people so that government can be tyrannical .""","""You could n't make an association like this to save your life . Hitler gained power by deception much like what is happening now . The Warsaw Ghetto Uprising ( google it ) puts to rest any claim you have made about Hitler . He did disarm Jews , Gypsies and others he was afraid of because they did not support him . He also had some weird features you share like torturing and burning helpless creatures ! People can not be tyrannical by definition . Check it out ! Your claim is dismissed for want of cause and no true stated claim .""",DISAGREE,"""Would you have supported the `` freedom `` for Hitler and his cronies to own guns in 1932 ? Mao in 1947-48 ?""","""You could n't make an association like this to save your life . Hitler gained power by deception much like what is happening now .""",,
4440,1148,"""One question I would like to get answered is should the US have an amendment against adultery ? I think this dose a lot more harm to the  “ sanctity and value of marriage ” Just had to put in my $ .02 , and would you all let me know if there is ever a good answer ?""","""Question is what sort of punishment would you have for adultery if there was an amendment ? Financial , already their in divorce . Are you going to lock adulterer up ?""",DISAGREE,"""should the US have an amendment against adultery ? I think this dose a lot more harm to the  sanctity and value of marriageÂ""","""what sort of punishment would you have for adultery if there was an amendment ? Financial , already their in divorce .""",,
4452,1152,"""The only question would be is it harmful or exploitive to the one being manipulated ? If so , how can we tell ?""","""It is n't possible to tell . What is called the `` scientific `` approach is to analyse social statistics to derive probabilities , a methodology which assumes that the present is the same as the past , all well and good for the physical sciences , where the way particles behave does not change , but inappropriate in application to complex systems like people , that may react in ways totally unanticipated . Not only is unpredictability inherent in such systems , but the more ways you try to manipulate them , the more uncertain the reaction to any particular intervention becomes . So what do you do then , just take this method anyway , even given you ca n't predict the results , just take your best shot ? When it fails , just say `` oops , well , we had good intentions , we ca n't be blamed `` . If that 's all we have to work with , we are truly screwed . There are however , alternative ways of deciding whether you should do something to trying to predict its outcome .""",AGREE,"""manipulated If so , how can we tell ?""","""It is n't possible to tell . What is called the `` scientific `` approach is to analyse social statistics but inappropriate in application to complex systems like people the more ways you try to manipulate them , the more uncertain the reaction""",,
4459,1154,"""And it also took an amendment to give the slaves rights , not a judge .""","""And why is that ? Because the framers of our constitution felt that all white men were equal , the rest were property . It is this kind of ignorant and narrow minded thought that will have people rubbing their heads in 200 years , wondering why gays were ever treated as second class citizens who did not deserve the same rights given to straights .""",DISAGREE,"""amendment rights not a judge""","""framers of our constitution white men were equal property 200 years gays were treated as second class citizens""",,
4465,1163,"""One of the NRA 's favorite quotes . '' The context of 'that every man be armed ' was who would provide for the arming of the militia , the states or the federal government not a personal right. `` http : //www.potowmack.org/emerappi.html # pathen""","""From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that . Your clearly very wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""One of the NRA 's favorite quotes . '' The context of 'that every man be armed ' was who would provide for the arming of the militia ,""","""From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that""",,
4466,1163,"""One of the NRA 's favorite quotes . '' The context of 'that every man be armed ' was who would provide for the arming of the militia , the states or the federal government not a personal right. `` http : //www.potowmack.org/emerappi.html # pathen""","""From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that . Your clearly very wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""NRA '' `` http : //www.potowmack.org/emerappi.html # pathen""","""link NRA DID NOT say that or publish that""",,
4471,1164,"""Actually , there are two color morphs in arctic foxes that are determined by a single locus . You are incorrect to claim that the brown morph becomes pure white . That is incorrect . Oh ? http : //www.anwr.org/gallery/images/08-Arctic % 20Fox.jpg That looks pretty darn white to me .""","""Right . That is the white morph in winter fur . Here it is in summer fur . And here is the blue morph in summer fur and winter fur . The fact is that some arctic foxes never are pure white . And it does n't take a matter of months for them to change from dark to light . I spent a year where I saw lots of these animals every day . Remind me to tell you about Archie , who lived under the C Battery mess hall . But that 's not really the point . Your clumsy bait and switch was beginning a discussion about evolution and then trying to represent the seasonal change in color of foxes as evolution . The ability of the foxes to change may be evolution but the fact that they do change every year and then back again is n't .""",DISAGREE,"""there are two color morphs in arctic foxes that are determined by a single locus . You are incorrect to claim that the brown morph becomes pure white .""","""That is the white morph in winter fur . Here it is in summer fur . And here is the blue morph in summer fur and winter fur .""",,
4485,1167,"""If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics , in canada and states that still premit abortion . Are we to fill the prisons with those seeking abortions in places where it is legal if they live in states that do not allow abortions ? Prolifers better becare for what they wish for . Prolifers tend to be conservative and do not like taxes . They better get ready to pay , in taxes , for the extra prisons and social programs needed for all those abandoned children .""","""Re : Are we to fill the prisons ? -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Quote : Originally Posted by Gilluin If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics , in canada and states that still premit abortion . Are we to fill the prisons with those seeking abortions in places where it is legal if they live in states that do not allow abortions ? Prolifers better becare for what they wish for . Prolifers tend to be conservative and do not like taxes . They better get ready to pay , in taxes , for the extra prisons and social programs needed for all those abandoned children . I would gladly double my taxes to help save the weak and the unborn . Better idea though instead of locking up the women/men seeking termination and euthanasia why not lock up the obs/gyno/ and doctors that carry out theses procedures ? Pro life is NOT just about termination of pregnancies .""",DISAGREE,"""If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics , in canada and states that still premit abortion .""","""Are we to fill the prisons with those seeking abortions in places where it is legal if they live in states that do not allow abortions""",,
4489,1168,"""and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet .""","""That is a truism . Who says that scientific materialism need be the only measure of scientific truth ?""",DISAGREE,"""and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet .""","""Who says that scientific materialism need be the only measure of scientific truth ?""",,
4505,1178,"""This is also a highly controversial issue , and it is not right to forcibly subject a minor to the political views of her parents""","""I 've heard this type of statment before and it does n't seem to hold water . Opposing abortion is not a political view , its a moral view and children are subject to their parents moral views from day one until they are adults . Its called parenting .""",DISAGREE,"""and it is not right to forcibly subject a minor to the political views of her parents""","""Opposing abortion is not a political view""",,
4514,1181,"""OHHHHH I do send me please I love to see men in kilts the hairier the better""","""Oh you little tramp !""",AGREE,"""I love to see men in kilts the hairier the better""","""Oh you little tramp !""",,
4515,1181,"""OHHHHH I do send me please I love to see men in kilts the hairier the better""","""Oh you little tramp !""",AGREE,"""I love to see men in kilts the hairier the better""","""Oh you little tramp !""",,
4533,1187,"""I enjoy written debates very much , and I 'm trying to show how evolution can establish atheism in the U.S. government ...""","""And you 've been failing miserably , partly because your definition of `` atheism `` is asinine . Even most Christians would disagree with you .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm trying to show how evolution can establish atheism in the U.S. government ...""","""you 've been failing miserably , partly because your definition of `` atheism `` is asinine .""",,
4550,1193,"""I am even prohibited by law from performing a background check .""","""Not if you have permission to do one from the buyer . If I sold a firearm , and did n't know the person so well , I would do one . I have contacts in businesses who can do them for me for free . Its just a smart thing to do . Should it be the law ? No way . But I would do it . Better safe than sorry in this instance .""",DISAGREE,"""I am even prohibited by law from performing a background check .""","""If I sold a firearm , and did n't know the person so well , I would do one . I have contacts in businesses who can do them for me for free . Its just a smart thing to do . Should it be the law ? No way . But I would do it . Better safe than sorry in this instance""",,
4562,1195,"""May I ask what you mean when you say Who is God ?""","""Well you seemed to jump to a conclusion about who God was , not what he really is !""",DISAGREE,"""May I ask what you mean when you say Who is God ?""","""Well you seemed to jump to a conclusion about who God was , not what he really is !""",,
4564,1195,"""May I ask what you mean when you say Who is God ?""","""Well you seemed to jump to a conclusion about who God was , not what he really is !""",DISAGREE,"""what you mean when you say Who is God ?""","""you seemed to jump to a conclusion about who God""",,
4569,1196,"""Since you scoff at the idea that the laws that govern energy and matter must coincide with the formation of energy and matter , tell me this , which did God create first , the laws or energy and matter ?""","""No I do not say that the creation of energy and matter did not coincide the creation of the laws that govern/regulate them . What I say is that the laws are not the RESULTS of the existence of energy , matter etc .""",DISAGREE,"""which did God create first , the laws or energy""","""No I do not say""",,
4570,1197,"""And im not really sure what a `` pregnancy `` is according to you .. please explain .. When i hear the word pregnant , i think of 2 people , not just 1 .""","""There are many people who may be involved and impacted by pregnancy - but only one person is actually physically pregnant .""",DISAGREE,"""When i hear the word pregnant , i think of 2 people , not just 1 .""","""only one person is actually physically pregnant .""",,
4586,1200,"""So gun owners are being discriminated for `` who they are. `` I guess you could put it that way . You could also say that violent killers and serial rapists are being discriminated against for `` who they are. `` By the way , I support gay marriage but do n't support the mayor 's actions .""","""I believe that this is what they call 'sarcasm ' . As for the second part of your comment , why am I not surprised ?""",DISAGREE,"""So gun owners are being discriminated for `` who they .""","""this is what they call 'sarcasm ' .""",,
4590,1201,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg , an embryo , a fetus , is a heinous , anti-life crime .""","""what is your basis for this ? You said :""",DISAGREE,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg ,""","""what is your basis for this ?""",,
4593,1202,"""how about a Swiss University ? they have full automatic weapons in most homes , and target shooting is a national sport .""","""According to guncite.com only 14 % of homes in Switzerland have a fully automatic weapon in them . http : //guncite.com/swissgun.html""",DISAGREE,"""how about a Swiss University ? they have full automatic weapons in most homes , and target shooting is a national sport .""","""According to guncite.com only 14 % of homes in Switzerland have a fully automatic weapon in them""",,
4594,1202,"""how about a Swiss University ? they have full automatic weapons in most homes , and target shooting is a national sport .""","""According to guncite.com only 14 % of homes in Switzerland have a fully automatic weapon in them . http : //guncite.com/swissgun.html""",DISAGREE,"""they have full automatic weapons in most homes""","""According to guncite.com only 14 % of homes in Switzerland""",,
4614,1206,"""`` It seems to me that with all the mortals throughout the world , including the Pope , praying fervently for the life of Terri Schiavo to be saved , the Bible God , to whom they were praying , should have intervened . ... ... For instance in Matthew 21:21-22 , the author quotes Jesus , aka God , as saying , `` I tell you the truth ... If you believe , you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer. `` Then in Mark 11:23-24 , the author quotes Jesus again saying , `` I tell you the truth , ... whatever you ask for in prayer , believe that you have received it , and it will be yours. `` If those quotes were correct and Jesus , aka God , was telling the truth , it begs a very important question : was not a single one of those who prayed worthy of having his or her prayer answered ? It 's frightening to think the Pope would not be considered worthy enough to have his prayers answered , but apparently , according to Jesus , aka God , and providing the quotes were translated correctly , he was not. `` ( Harold R. Larimer , Where was Jesus , aka God ? , American Atheist Newsletter , July 2005 , p5 )""","""So is Jesus , aka God , a liar ? Or was not even one of the millions of believers who prayed for Terri Schiavo 's life to be saved really God 's child ? Gee , I wonder how many people out there are being led by a pastor , priest , or what have you , that prayed but God did n't listen because that religious leader is a fraud ? Hmmm , maybe the rape or molestation of young boys , adulty , and so on , by religious leaders is more widespread than anyone could have imagined ? ! ? ! ? !""",DISAGREE,"""It 's frightening to think the Pope would not be considered worthy enough to have his prayers answered""","""So is Jesus , aka God , a liar ?""",,
4641,1211,"""It becomes somewhat irritating to deal with people who 's ignorance is matched only by their arrogance . Election day saw a sweeping repudiation of legally sanctioned same sex marriage in 11 different states , including relatively progressive Oregon . This follows similiar votes for amendments defining marriage in California and Missouri . What does this all mean ? Well , for starters , it indicates that a federal marriage amendment has a fighting chance . It should remind us that sanctioning gay nuptials has n't one thing to do with the oval office occupant . It is well known , or should be known , that the process for amending the constitution does not involve the President . The Amendment Process There are essentially two ways spelled out in the Constitution for how it can be amended . One has never been used . The first method is for a bill to pass both halves of the legislature , by a two-thirds majority in each . Once the bill has passed both houses , it goes on to the states . This is the route taken by all current amendments . Because of some long outstanding amendments , such as the 27th , Congress will normally put a time limit ( typically seven years ) for the bill to be approved as an amendment ( for example , see the 21st and 22nd ) . The second method prescribed is for a Constitutional Convention to be called by two-thirds of the legislatures of the States , and for that Convention to propose one or more amendments . These amendments are then sent to the states to be approved by three-fourths of the legislatures or conventions . This route has never been taken , and there is discussion in political science circles about just how such a convention would be convened , and what kind of changes it would bring about . Regardless of which of the two proposal routes is taken , the amendment must be approved by three-fourths of states . The amendment as passed may specify whether the bill must be passed by the state legislatures or by a state convention . See the Ratification Convention Page for a discussion of the make up of a convention . Amendments are sent to the legislatures of the states by default . Only one amendment , the 21st , specified a convention . In any case , passage by the legislature or convention is by simple majority . It is interesting to note that at no point does the President have a role in the formal amendment process ( though he would be free to make his opinion known ) . He can not veto an amendment proposal , nor a ratification . In spite of this , opponents of a marriage amendment acted as if defeating Bush would spell the death of such a proposal . Apparently , it 's easier to identify a single scapegoat or hold up an unworthy strawman for condemnation than it is to recognize that there is an overriding public sentiment against alternative lifestyles being officially sanctioned .""","""I 've seen people ( on TV ) who would actually know about such things say that the fact that these things passed in these states pretty much spels doom for any possible constitutional ammendment . Do n't ask me how they figure this . It 's just what they were saying .""",AGREE,"""legally sanctioned same sex marriage in 11 different states , Amendments are sent to the legislatures of the states by default""","""I 've seen people ( on TV ) who would actually know about such things things passed in these states pretty much spels doom for any possible constitutional ammendment""",,
4648,1212,"""Pro-choice at least lets people decide what is best from them and the child . Can you honestly say it is better for a child to be born and mistreated and/or under fed until it dies than it is for a child to simply be aborted ?""","""Ok , so you are admitting that the unborn fetus , is in fact , a child ? I have to believe that is what you mean from your statement above . That being the case , do you condone the killing of a child that is born but will likely live in poverty the rest of his or her life ? Do you condone the killing of a handicapped child that is born ? If not , then you ca n't condone abortion . Also , who gives you the right to decide what is best for a child by killing him or her ? That should not be your choice ( this is another problem with humanism , because there is no moral authority to stop people from doing whatever they want to do , hence the adage that humanism is a philosophy that has both feet planted firmly in mid-air ) . I am sure the child would n't agree to that choice if given a voice to do so . Let 's go ahead and do it your way by taking religion out of law . Is murder still illegal in your humanistic world ? Likely it is still illegal because even humanists realize that anarchy is not suitable for society . Then why is this not murder ? Look back to effects this has on women . That is also bad for society . And that affects us all .""",DISAGREE,"""Pro-choice at least lets people decide what is best from them and the child""","""so you are admitting that the unborn fetus , is in fact , a child ?""",,
4666,1216,"""I agree , no oath should be taken lightly . However , I believe that a certain amount of interpretation is essential , especially in grey areas that medicine can wander into . Abortion to save the life of the mother is a grey area that doctors have to wrestle with . Separating siamese twins where there is only one heart , allowing one to live while the other dies instead of both dying is a grey area . Following an oath such as that to the letter puts things too much in black and white , when a lot of good medicine happens in the shades of grey .""","""In the examples you gave , the doctor is clearly trying his * very best to save the most lives he can . What if the Siamese twins were in no mortal danger while together ? And what if one Siamese twin has legs but the other does n't ? Is n't the other twin dependent on the one with legs ? Could a doctor ethically remove the legless twin if the legged twin wanted to and if the legless twin was retarded and the procedure would leave the legless twin dead ? * ( or her best .. I 'm sorry but my doctor is male , so I will no longer use `` his/her `` or `` he/she `` ... it just gets tiring after a while ... )""",AGREE,"""I agree , no oath should be taken lightly . However , I believe that a certain amount of interpretation is essential , especially in grey areas that medicine can wander into . Abortion to save the life of the mother is a grey area that doctors have to wrestle with .""","""In the examples you gave , the doctor is clearly trying his * very best to save the most lives he can .""",,
4670,1217,"""Why do Americans want so many guns ? What are you most afraid of ?""","""One has to wonder why gun haters always ask this quesion . Has this question ever been asked of people that read books ? It is interesting how people that want to ban the right to bear arms never apply their logic to the rights they like . The gun haters clearly like the 1st amend . The gun haters use their 1st amend right to attack the right to bear arms . When racist use their 1st amend right to attack other peoples right it is called hate speech . So why is it that gun haters demanding the banning of the right to bear arms is not considered hate speech ? After all gun haters are just like the other hate groups . All they do is attack the right to bear arms . Not once has a gun hater ever demand that dangerous criminals be punished .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do Americans want so many guns ?""","""Has this question ever been asked of people that read books ? It is interesting how people that want to ban the right to bear arms never apply their logic""",,
4675,1218,"""LOL , so much for the expanded claims of training in order to exercise an inalienable right . First the gun grabbers claim guns are complex and require `` training `` and on the other hand demonstrate that they are so simple to operate that untrained creatures like dogs and snakes can operate them just fine .""","""Since animals can operate them , gun owners obviously need sufficient training to make sure they are used safely . It seems they need a lot more . On the other hand , the problem is largely self-limiting , since the cretinous owner either dies or hopefully learns from their stupidity once they recover from their injuries .""",DISAGREE,"""First the gun grabbers claim guns are complex and require""","""gun owners obviously need sufficient training to make sure they are used safely .""",,
4680,1219,"""Ten gunned down in southern Alabama . At least seventeen gunned down in Germany . On Monday , March 9 , 2009 , some twenty-seven human beings were living , breathing , going about their respective businesses . They are no more .""","""I know ... I know . I agree with you that it 's sad more of those people could n't or did n't take advantage of concealed carry to help prevent so many deaths . That needs to change along with education so more people can defend themselves .""",AGREE,"""gunned down , human beings were living are no more""","""I agree with you it 's sad needs to change""",,
4690,1222,"""In point of fact , the low birth rate in most of Europe is not due to the availablity of abortion , but to good sex education and the ready availablity of effective contraception to everyone who needs it . See this study , for instance : http : //www.advocatesforyouth.org/PUB ... heet/fsest.htm People have small families because they want small families . In point of fact , the abortion rate in Europe is generally much lower than the rate in the US , due , again , to education and contraception . Would you force folks to have children they do n't want ?""","""His point also addresses the intentional overpopulation for the purpose of overwhelming declining populations by Islam .""",DISAGREE,"""point of fact , in you force folks to have children they do n't want ?""","""point also addresses the intentional overpopulation purpose of overwhelming declining populations""",,
4698,1225,"""Really ? The Republicans have just discovered that 80 % of hip replacements are done through Medicare and that the waiting time is much shorter than in Canada .""","""So you are saying the US system is better ?""",DISAGREE,"""80 % of hip replacements are done through Medicare and that the waiting time is much shorter than in Canada .""","""So you are saying the US system is better ?""",,
4702,1226,"""We saw this in the recent Supreme Court decision . They chose to focus a lot on the role handguns could play in defending house and home against criminals , but seemed to have no problem with a ban on machine guns- the kind of guns that would logically seem to be most protected by the Second Amendment because of their usefulness in military conflicts which would make them a better deterrent against tyranny than other types of firearms . Thus , the Supreme Court chose to `` strain at a gnat and swallow a camel `` to use a Biblical idiom in their treatment of the Second Amendment .""","""Now you 're playing word games to confuse people . Page 11 of the Heller ruling stated that the definition of `` arms `` include all modern forms of bearable arms that 're in common use . They did n't rule on machineguns because they were n't part of the case .""",DISAGREE,"""seemed to have no problem with a ban on machine guns""","""They did n't rule on machineguns because they were n't part of the case .""",,
4715,1233,"""I went from pro-life to pro-choice .""","""And I the opposite ... Kind of a wash I guess .""",DISAGREE,"""I went from pro-life to pro-choice .""","""And I the opposite .""",,
4722,1235,"""If you think that just as many people die from stabbing and beatings in other developed nations as people die from guns in the US then you need to do more research .""","""Millions of people died before guns came into existence . Hundreds of thousands per day , per incident . Prove otherwise .""",DISAGREE,"""people die from guns in the US""","""Millions of people died before guns came into existence""",,
4723,1235,"""If you think that just as many people die from stabbing and beatings in other developed nations as people die from guns in the US then you need to do more research .""","""Millions of people died before guns came into existence . Hundreds of thousands per day , per incident . Prove otherwise .""",DISAGREE,"""stabbing and beatings in other developed nations as people die from guns in the US""","""people died before guns came into existence . Hundreds of thousands per day""",,
4729,1237,"""I have a hard time believing a 1 day old baby can live independently""","""And , of course , you totally miss the point . The point is that a 1-day-old infant can be cared for by ANYBODY ! It is no longer dependent upon the body and resources of only one person . But , of course , if that one person is only a lowly , less than human woman , that lowly person has absolutely no rights to compare with that of the almighty , holy fetus .""",DISAGREE,"""I have a hard time believing a 1 day old baby can live independently""","""It is no longer dependent upon the body and resources of only one person""",,
4733,1239,"""Though people may want to win out in a job interview over someone more qualified , most do n't morally expect that that should happen since they realize that that expectation would not be fair . They may make a buck off of a person but , unless they are con artists who lie to get that buck , most will do it in a way they consider fair , under laws they themselves would be willing to live under .""","""That 's a nice silver-lining take on the situation , but you and I both know that there are times someone who has a greater and more pressing need for the job ( even to feed his family ) gets put aside for someone who does n't need it as badly . The issue here is n't `` fairness. `` This issue is doing unto others as you 'd have them do unto you . If you 're going to hold the golden rule up as a rule , you have to be consistent .""",DISAGREE,"""win out in a job interview over someone more qualified , expectation would not be fair , most will do it in a way they consider fair""","""The issue here is n't `` This issue is doing unto others as you 'd have them do unto you""",,
4736,1240,"""You missed the whole point of my story . I was not disgusted at the poor people I was disgusted at the government under a socialist mindset . I love poor people , heck I was one for a while ( and really kinda still am ) .""","""Oh , you have a problem with Socialism ? Is that so ?""",DISAGREE,"""I was disgusted at the government under a socialist mindset .""","""have a problem with Socialism ?""",,
4743,1241,"""This crushes ToE at the most fundamental level . I 've been telling this board for months that the gene is not the player in biological change that everyone thinks it is . The popultion has been told for decades that they are simply a culmination of their genes .""","""To be fair , that was always a poorly-framed and badly-lit pop-media snapshot of scientific thinking , and was propagated far more often in recent times by the opponents of evolution , such as yourself , than by any actual scientist .""",DISAGREE,"""the gene is not the player in biological change that everyone thinks it is .""","""that was always a poorly-framed and badly-lit pop-media snapshot of scientific thinking ,""",,
4746,1242,"""We might add that the inability of neo-Darwinists , including Dawkins himself , to imagine how an organism could inherit traits acquired through life-struggle doesn ’ t mean they aren ’ t picked up nonetheless .""","""Actually NDS does not have to imagine the mechanism involved they actually know the mechanism . By the fact of their being alive ( which is in fact the `` life-struggle `` ) they acquire ( as a population ) mutations . Some of those mutations aid them in their `` life-struggle `` and thus become more likely to appear in the succeeding generation . Thus the succeeding generations have a slightly different memory of the past than their predecessors . And thats that ; the author clearly does not grasp the means by which complexity emerges in biological systems . Once more Adami is applicable here . And I have to add that the mechanisms of mutation , selection , and inheritance are well established at the molecular level , at the micro-cytological level , at the nuclear level , at the cellular level , at the organisimal level , and at the population and ecological levels . EAMs only riposte to that large empirical base is - to invoke mysterious and unknown and undemonstrated mechanisms which have no basis in fact . Sorry but the EAM hypothesis does not fly any better than a solid lead balloon .""",DISAGREE,"""the inability of neo-Darwinists , including Dawkins himself , to imagine how an organism""","""I have to add that the mechanisms of mutation , selection , and inheritance are well established at the molecular""",,
4748,1243,"""No ..... I do n't like it . Marriage is a specially protected government institution for a reason ....... namely that the family unit is the backbone of society . Redefining this government institution means weakening society as a whole .""","""You mean like the constitution ? Like renaming all of the rights and protections some get others do not . Like redefining all of the benefits that this staple of american society so depends on ? Like ... I would ... saaay the 14th ammendment perhaps to only inlcude some people and not others and ignore the fact it is the baisis of our socierty here in the USA ?""",DISAGREE,"""protected government institution for a reason""","""ignore the fact it is the baisis of our socierty""",,
4754,1244,"""Which is also true after ANY cell division of any kind , and as such again is a rather meaningless point .""","""So , we agree again . This is the second time you have labeled one of my points meaningless . I do not disagree . In and of themselves , they are meaningless . Any meaning is assigned to them by whoever wishes to interpret them .""",AGREE,"""also true after ANY cell division of any kind , and as such again is a rather meaningless point .""","""So , we agree""",,
4781,1251,"""By the way - you keep making yourself look , well , stupid when you opost these breathless diatribes while not having even a basic understanding of the material . As shown already on one of the other forums where you posted this .""","""Perfect . A creationists caught repeating the same refuted arguments on different forums . Resistance is met , run like a coward to another forum .""",DISAGREE,"""you keep making yourself look , well , stupid when you opost these breathless diatribes while not having even a basic understanding""","""Perfect A creationists caught repeating the same refuted arguments on different forums . ,""",,
4789,1253,"""CCW LAWS ARE FOR TRACKING GUN OWNERS WHO EXERCISE THIER RIGHTS ! ! !""","""I agree . What is the point ? Felons with firearms do not bother with CCW licenses .""",AGREE,"""CCW LAWS ARE FOR TRACKING GUN OWNERS WHO EXERCISE THIER RIGHTS ! ! !""","""I agree . Felons with firearms do not bother with CCW licenses .""",,
4796,1255,"""And , if you were given that evidence , in what way would that change your opinion of homosexuality ?""","""I believe I said I would change my view . I will change my view on the issue of whether homosexuality is genetic .""",AGREE,"""if you were given that evidence , in what way would that change your opinion of homosexuality ?""","""I believe I said I would change my view""",,
4829,1262,"""He didnt have a license . So will Doc Jones tell us that this is substantiated by LAW so thats that or does he only say that when he happens to like the law ? He cant have it both ways .""","""So what ? A person has a right to defend themselves , as spelled out in the Constitution . Or would you rather the 80 year old just get beaten to death for his $ 262 ? Or maybe you 'd feel better if he 'd suffered the same fate as the home invader over in Maryland . He made the mistake of breaking and entering into a student house and was slaughtered with a sword . And what point are you trying to make anyway ? It 's not like the 80 year old went on a killing spree of anything . Nobody got murdered . So what 're you moaning about ?""",DISAGREE,"""He didnt have a license . substantiated LAW""","""So what ? A person has a right to defend themselves , as spelled out in the Constitution .""",,
4835,1264,"""This is a good site , but very atheist I think . Do you know of a good theistic equivalent ? I do not mean like those awful websites that misrepresent science to try and shoehorn the world into their Bible stories ( sorry to pick on Christians here , but it is Christian ones that I notice ) , but ones that look at real science and look to see if a theistic explaination works for things ?""","""Since evolution is a non-theistic theory ( it does not consider if there is a god or not ) , you will have to look at some like http : //www.theistic-evolution.com/ I would also look up Kenneth MIller on the web ... a highly Christian biologist who defends evolution .""",AGREE,"""but theistic awful websites that misrepresent science""","""you will have to look http : //www.theistic-evolution.com/ look up Kenneth""",,
4844,1265,"""1 . No , but my Mom was , and my Sis was and my Wife was . To the good fortune of my Brothers and Sis 'n me and my nieces and my kids , we all were welcomed into the world . Mom said that I was one more kid than she had hoped for but that she let me live anyway . I really appreciate it too . 2 . 1/4th . My wife of course was the expert . She was magnificent as she raised them kids . I did a good job of providing and stuff that dads do too . I used to take my little girl dove hunting with me . I 'd shoot dove , she 'd run out and fetch them . She 'd have them cleaned by the time she got back to me . My son , could embarrass me when shooting and outfish me every time . He did n't like that I made him clean all the fish either . They turned out to be great people . 3 . Yes Ma am . Myself . I have no dead bodies in my past . You ?""","""So , how many kids do you have ? And , do you know their names ? What they like to do ? It does n't sound like you 've been much of a dad if all you did is providing for them . Did you watch TV sports the rest of the time ?""",DISAGREE,"""To the good fortune of my Brothers and Sis 'n me and my nieces and my kid I did a good job of providing and stuff that dads do too . My son , could embarrass me when shooting and outfish me every time . He did n't like that I made him clean all the fish either .""","""So , how many kids do you have ? And , do you know their names ? What they like to do ? It does n't sound like you 've been much of a dad if all you did is providing for them . Did you watch TV sports the rest of the time ?""",,
4845,1266,"""As rights of only one of two are being considered .""","""When the needs of the two are in conflict this is unavoidable .""",DISAGREE,"""rights one of two considered""","""needs of the two are in conflict unavoidable""",,
4850,1267,"""Hate to burst your ballon , but the mayor of San Francisco had JUST been elected . He does n't need to worry about votes for a long time . Judges are supposed to rule on the Constitutionality of laws when asked to do so . They are doing their job . If it violates the Constitution it is illegal . Plain and simple . They are not making law .""","""Well he has further political aspirations .......... The 9th circuit in Sodom ( SF ) is always making law instead of interpreting it ........ That is why they are over ruled so often .......""",DISAGREE,"""mayor been elected does n't need to worry about votes are supposed to rule doing their job""","""he has further political aspirations circuit always making law instead of interpreting it""",,
4854,1267,"""Hate to burst your ballon , but the mayor of San Francisco had JUST been elected . He does n't need to worry about votes for a long time . Judges are supposed to rule on the Constitutionality of laws when asked to do so . They are doing their job . If it violates the Constitution it is illegal . Plain and simple . They are not making law .""","""Well he has further political aspirations .......... The 9th circuit in Sodom ( SF ) is always making law instead of interpreting it ........ That is why they are over ruled so often .......""",DISAGREE,"""mayor of San Francisco had JUST been elected . Judges are supposed to rule on the Constitutionality of laws""","""Well he has further political aspirations The 9th circuit in Sodom ( SF ) is always making law instead of interpreting it""",,
4863,1269,"""So that no girl , underage or otherwise , refuses to seek treatment for fear of what their parents will think or say . If a girl can not be tested for a STD without parental notification and she does not wish her parents to know she had sex ( or fears their wrath ) , she may not go in for testing . In general , knowing whether you have a STD is a good thing .""","""But why does this generation get to bypass the same authority that every other generation before them submitted to with their parental oversight ? How is it right now for 13,14 and 15 year old kids to make such adult decisions without their parents knowing ? Are you suggesting that 13 year old girls are mature enough emotionally to make such adult decisions about getting an abortion ? And if so , do you then also believe that a 13-15 year olds should be allowed to adopt a child ? Or to enter into a contract to purchase a home or car ? Because those are also adult decisions and it does n't seem reasonable to me that we should allow them to slide on emotionally damaging decisions about sex or abortions and then insist they 're not mature enough to participate in other adult decisions . Kids need consistency in order to grow up to be responsible adults and by your way of thinking , you will just add more confusion and insecurity in an already difficult time in an adolescents life .""",DISAGREE,"""If a girl can not be tested for a STD without parental notification and she does not wish her parents to know she had sex""","""it does n't seem reasonable to me that we should allow them to slide on emotionally damaging decisions about sex or abortions""",,
4868,1270,"""In a socialist nation , the government issues identity cards to all its citizens , to ensure `` national security `` . Anyone suspected of wrongdoing can more easily be rounded up and imprisoned than in a free society . In a socialist nation , the government is the most important entity in determining whether an individual or group of individuals is prosperous or not , if a business is suspected of having links to terrorism , abortion , islam or political opponents , funding can be cut , ensuring high moral standards are maintained throughout the land . In a socialist nation , the government funds schools and determines their curriculum - ensuring that all students learn the appropriate facts rather than controversial theories , ensuring the stability of the governing regime . In a socialist regime the head of state is held to be deserving of respect and admiration from his subjects , ensuring a stable rule - those opposing actions taken by the government are regarded as `` unpatriotic `` and `` appeasers `` . In this way it is easy for a socialist nation to wage war and ensure foreign nations have friendly governments , where a less socialist government may not have the funding to maintain a high-tech global police force .""","""I think you 're mixing up socialist and fascist . Patriotism is anathema to socialism .""",DISAGREE,"""those opposing actions taken by the government are regarded as `` unpatriotic `` and `` appeasers `` .""","""think you 're mixing up socialist and fascist . Patriotism is anathema to socialism .""",,
4870,1271,"""BTW , please tell Gush Limpbutt that there is a world of difference between human , i.e , possessing the right genes , and personhood , which begins at birth .""","""If you are open minded enough to consider an opposing point of view , Maybe one day you and I can debate those claims . But if you are a typical drive by post and run away `` choicer ? `` I would n't be interested . I digress ! The purpose of this thread ( as I understand it ) was for people to introduce themselves and say a little about their position . The purpose of this thread was not to debate our differences . I 'll not respond to any more `` baiting `` of that sort in this thread . If you have questions about the details of my views , I will gladly answer those . As I may have some questions about yours .""",DISAGREE,"""possessing the right genes , and personhood , which begins at birth .""","""I 'll not respond to any more `` baiting `` of that sort in this thread .""",,
4875,1272,"""So you 're posting in an effort to bait specific people ? You can try putting their name in the subject , addressing them specifically , or emailing them . It may also help if you declare it rather than ask a question . If you ask a question and get an answer , then remark `` duh `` , it does n't ... cast a good light on the writer . -Mach""","""Well said .""",AGREE,"""So you 're posting in an effort to bait specific people ? You can try putting their name in the subject , addressing them specifically ,""","""Well said .""",,
4893,1275,"""And do n't you find it significant that a gun , a symbol and tool of violence , can raise levels of testosterone ?""","""I 've seen no solid evidence to prove there 's an actual connection between guns and testosterone levels . Just more of your correlation/causation bull * * * * . One could easily argue that those with naturally higher than average testosterone levels would want to hold a gun more than they would a stupid child 's toy . Millions of people are carrying guns every day , and they 're not having hostile encounters with other people . Not even in high stress situations . That kind of blows your `` study `` out of the water . Try again .""",DISAGREE,"""And do n't you find it significant that a gun ,""","""I 've seen no solid evidence to prove there 's an actual connection""",,
4928,1283,"""`` And if your right hand causes you to sin , cut it off and throw it away . It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell. `` ( Mathew 5:30 ) Do you actually believe that Jesus wants us to cut off our right hand if it causes us to sin ?""","""He was using it as an example . He was saying that if something in your life causes you to sin , get rid of it ! BTW , thanx for giving me the references to your verses ! It is really annoying to have to search through the Bible to find verses that people quote without references .""",DISAGREE,"""Mathew 5:30 Do you actually believe that Jesus wants us to cut off our right hand if it causes us to sin ?""","""He was using it as an example . He was saying that if something in your life causes you to sin , get rid of it ! thanx for giving me the references to your verses !""",,
4930,1284,"""... not only that but if you 've been reading along with my recent threads , it vindicates everything -- and I mean EVERYTHING I 've been saying on here regarding health .""","""Except that it does nothing of the sort ... But then , what can we expect from somebody citing a website trying to sell you liquid vitamin supplement ... Nevertheless , we look into the Pottenger 's cats claim . Here is a page called , `` Lesson of the Pottenger 's Cats Experiment : cats are not humans. `` Although it 's a page aimed at explaining why this `` experiment `` is not applicable to humans , it exposes the other , erm , flaws in this experiment . The one striking me based on the wikipedia list of diets for the groups should be obvious to everyone : many of these cats were being deprived of protein . This page confirms and elaborates . In fact , its first point is that today 's cats have no problem reproducing for several generations on today 's cooked food . The difference is that good owners do n't feed their pets deficient diets . The real irony here is that this experiment -- were it reliable -- would be the antithesis of supersport 's Lamarckism . In order for supersport to be supported , the cats being fed inadequate diets would re-develop those broken pathways for manufacturing essential amino acids . Obviously , they did not . The only thing we see here is the effect of poor ( i.e . positively malnutritive ) diet . We can conclude that supersport 's Morton 's demon is pretty much in full control . There 's no other explanation for somebody seeing this experiment and thinking it supports Lamarckism , or even counters evolutionary theory , even if he does n't know the basics of experimentation and nutrition .""",DISAGREE,"""it vindicates everything -- and I mean EVERYTHING I 've been saying on here regarding health .""","""Except that it does nothing of the sort ...""",,
4933,1286,"""I agree . Richbee tends to think `` If I disprove atheism , I prove theism ! `` And the scary part is , he even knows that agnosticism , polytheism , and pantheism exist . I can disprove theism in a wink , but I ca n't prove atheism .""","""Argh . Atheism is no belief in a god , `` without belief in god `` . Why would you try to prove a negative ? Did you wake up today and believe in a UNI because you could n't prove it did n't exist ? Richbee has a long way to go to `` prove `` anything other than his fondness for rhetoric . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""prove atheism""","""Why would you try to prove a negative ?""",,
4950,1298,"""Originally posted by Crim RUT of proof ? This is how science operates . That does n't make the interpretations equally valid . Their days are not comparable with modern times . They did not have instantaneous spreading of information , equal technology , or nearly the same number of scientists .""","""And thats my point , science operates on it 's means of accesing valid mechanisms . That said , science will only allow what IT decides is `` valid `` , just like the church . Science defines what is valid and what is n't , just like the church . '' Instantaeneous `` comunication and large volumes of scientists does NOT make science any more right , it meerly increases the volume of stuff that they come up with . And again , your point brings back the arguement that when technology proggresses further we may still discover things which force science to re-write their books . Your view is purely subjective , even the evidence itself is opinion .""",DISAGREE,"""They did not have instantaneous spreading of information , equal technology , or nearly the same number of scientists .""","""Science defines what is valid and what is n't , just like the church . '' Instantaeneous `` comunication and large volumes of scientists does NOT make science any more right , it meerly increases the volume of stuff that they come up with .""",,
4952,1298,"""Originally posted by Crim RUT of proof ? This is how science operates . That does n't make the interpretations equally valid . Their days are not comparable with modern times . They did not have instantaneous spreading of information , equal technology , or nearly the same number of scientists .""","""And thats my point , science operates on it 's means of accesing valid mechanisms . That said , science will only allow what IT decides is `` valid `` , just like the church . Science defines what is valid and what is n't , just like the church . '' Instantaeneous `` comunication and large volumes of scientists does NOT make science any more right , it meerly increases the volume of stuff that they come up with . And again , your point brings back the arguement that when technology proggresses further we may still discover things which force science to re-write their books . Your view is purely subjective , even the evidence itself is opinion .""",DISAGREE,"""This is how science operates . That does n't make the interpretations equally valid .""","""science operates on it 's means of accesing valid mechanisms .""",,
4961,1300,"""Gun Laws Effective Only If Enforced -- Courant.com""","""it totally emasculates our gun laws . That sums it up in a nutshell . And the nutjobs and control freaks wonder why we get P.O.ed at the suggestion of more feel good do nothing to solve the problem other than screw the law abiding gun control .""",AGREE,"""Gun Laws Effective Only If Enforced""","""problem other than screw the law abiding gun control .""",,
4966,1301,"""There is nothing inherently irrational about the theory of evolution being used to explain life in the physical universe , yet creation begins with an irrational premise , that we can `` know `` about the `` unknowable `` .""","""Is this a rational statement ? If so , prove it rationally , by science .""",DISAGREE,"""yet creation begins with an irrational premise we can `` know `` about the `` unknowable `` .""","""Is this a rational statement ? If so , prove it rationally , by science .""",,
4973,1302,"""Those that believe in a right to ones own body have only one logical conclusion for this .""","""I see that you fail to see the logic that the less dominant Siamese twin ALSO has a right to their own body . One is not supporting the other - they are supporting each other so their rights are equal . Besides , both have a mental existence so , at least for me , abortion ( or , in this case , one being killed for the rights to body of the other ) would not be allowed .""",DISAGREE,"""right to ones own body logical conclusion""","""you fail to see the logic less dominant Siamese twin ALSO has a right to their own body""",,
4983,1307,"""If these DROS records really are destroyed after 15 days , what 's the point in having the DROS system in the first place ? What 's the justification for giving the attorney general access to a database of registered and documented transactions , if the information can only exist for 15 days , and anything longer than that is illegal ?""","""sinjin - I did n't mean to imply any linkage between your opinions and those of another poster . Apologies .""",AGREE,"""If these DROS records really are destroyed after 15 days , what 's the point in having the DROS system in the first place ? What 's the justification for giving the attorney general access to a database of registered and documented transactions , if the information can only exist for 15 days , and anything longer than that is illegal ?""","""sinjin - I did n't mean to imply any linkage between your opinions and those of another poster . Apologies .""",,
4988,1310,"""ID has no evidence , no predictions , and simply no way to falsify it . It 's not science . It has no observation , identification , description , or experimental investigation .""","""That 's simply not true ;""",DISAGREE,"""ID has no evidence , no predictions , and simply no way to falsify it .""","""That 's simply not true ;""",,
4997,1311,"""The bill would also protect gun manufacturers and dealers that have allowed their weapons to fall into the hands of criminals through their own negligence .""","""Really ? I do n't think you know what you are talking about . Please provide evidence to back your claim . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""The bill would also protect gun manufacturers and dealers that have allowed their weapons""","""Really ? I do n't think you know what you are talking about""",,
4998,1312,"""I was opposed to the presidency of George W. Bush but I would n't have been disrespectful .""","""And you are proud of that ?""",DISAGREE,"""I was opposed to the presidency of George Bush would n't have been disrespectful .""","""And you are proud of that ?""",,
5000,1312,"""I was opposed to the presidency of George W. Bush but I would n't have been disrespectful .""","""And you are proud of that ?""",DISAGREE,"""I was opposed to the presidency of George W. Bush but I would n't have been disrespectful .""","""And you are proud of that ?""",,
5005,1313,"""The ID movements form of ID states that there are `` large gaps `` in the theory of evolution that can only be explained by the presence of a supernatural designer . Behe is happy to think that it is the christian god ( like the rest of them ) , but they ar n't allowed to say that , because if they do , they violate that annoying ammendment !""","""So if I understand this correctly , we should n't believe evolution because it has gaps , but we should believe ID even though no one will/can say when the design happened , where it happened , what it was , or who the intelligence was ? Is that about right ? Seems to me the ID is nothing but gaps . Whenever I push an IDer for details of their claims , all I get is an anti-evolution position . Not even IDers seem to be able to say why ID should be considered correct .""",DISAGREE,"""The ID movements form of ID states that there are `` large gaps""","""So if I understand this correctly , we should n't believe evolution because it has gaps""",,
5015,1315,"""Originally posted by FreeThinker Where did Man descend from , if he did n't descend from Monkey ?""","""There are two major theories , many hold to the `` Out of Africa `` replacement model . The perspective of the Out of Africa model ( often called Out of Africa II , referring to a second migration from Africa of a hominid population ) adherents is that when there was a migration of H. erectus out of Africa into Asia and Europe , these populations ( seen in materials like the Chinese and Indonesian erectus ) did not contribute a significant amount of genetic material to later populations that led to modern humans ( some claim no genetic ancestry to these groups and their descendants at all , a `` strict `` replacement model ) . At approximately 200 kya there was a second migration of hominids out of Africa . This time it was fully modern H. sapiens , which proceeded to replace whatever populations that then occupied Asia and Europe . Some see direct competition and extermination of the native populations , some see passive replacement due to better adaptive strategies , and some see genetic admixture with the preponderance of genetic material coming from the incoming human populations , eventually replacing and assimilating them into the greater collective . In this view there is a specific speciation event that occurred which led to the origin of H. sapiens in Africa , and this population is the forerunner of modern humans , leaving the European Neanderthals , Chinese erectus , and others out in the cold . Homo Sapiens""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by FreeThinker Where did Man descend from""","""The perspective of the Out of Africa model ( often called Out of Africa II , referring to a second migration from Africa of a hominid population ) adherents is that when there was a migration of""",,
5020,1316,"""No Electrolyte , science lies ! here is the undisputed truth : Noah and his three sons traveled the globe , collected two representatives of each species ( or seven of each clean species depending on the chapter ) .""","""No they did n't Mutz , the animals came to them 2 by 2 .""",DISAGREE,"""science lies ! undisputed truth : Noah and his three sons traveled the globe , collected two representatives of each species""","""No they did n't Mutz , the animals came to them 2 by 2 .""",,
5021,1316,"""No Electrolyte , science lies ! here is the undisputed truth : Noah and his three sons traveled the globe , collected two representatives of each species ( or seven of each clean species depending on the chapter ) .""","""No they did n't Mutz , the animals came to them 2 by 2 .""",DISAGREE,"""No Electrolyte , science lies""","""No they did n't""",,
5026,1318,"""I was convinced he was deliberately annoying people and I said as much , he was not finding much in the way of conversation here .""","""Yes ... if you ignore people , they eventually go away ... except for me , of course .""",AGREE,"""he was deliberately annoying people and I said as much ,""","""Yes ... if you ignore people , they eventually go away .""",,
5028,1319,"""I do n't believe it is DrNo , because by its very definition evolution claims that Man evolved from the lower animals . It relegates us to nothing more than a biological organism with no more value than an viral bacteria . Another problem you run into regarding Genesis is the spiritual relationship Man has with God and Adams fall from grace . Evolution erases that relationship which erases the need for the need for being reunited with God through the shed blood of Christ on the Cross . Also , you must redefine what evolution teaches altogether in order to credit God with original creation and then assume evolution is His plan for humanity . That 's why the evolutionists are rejecting your premise out of hand . Your version of it is a sacrilege because it goes from being Natural to Supernatural if God is credited with original Creation . One must not compromise what the bible says in order to find a happy medium with the worlds philosophies . That is folly and will only lead to confusion . What you should ask yourself is why are beasts which can only be described as dinosaurs be found mentioned in the bible ? How did Ancient , so called stone aged men describe living creatures at the time , in their world which evolutionists will tell you were extinct for at least 60 million years by then , only 6,000 to 10,000 years ago ? Here 's what I mean . Behemoth has the following attributes according to Job 40:15-24 It  “ eats grass like an ox. ” It  “ moves his tail like a cedar. ” ( In Hebrew , this literally reads ,  “ he lets hang his tail like a cedar. ” ) Its  “ bones are like beams of bronze , His ribs like bars of iron. ”  “ He is the first of the ways of God. ”  “ He lies under the lotus trees , In a covert of reeds and marsh. ” Job 40:15-24 ( New International Version ) 15 `` Look at the behemoth , [ a ] which I made along with you and which feeds on grass like an ox . 16 What strength he has in his loins , what power in the muscles of his belly ! 17 His tail [ b ] sways like a cedar ; the sinews of his thighs are close-knit . 18 His bones are tubes of bronze , his limbs like rods of iron . 19 He ranks first among the works of God , yet his Maker can approach him with his sword . 20 The hills bring him their produce , and all the wild animals play nearby . 21 Under the lotus plants he lies , hidden among the reeds in the marsh . 22 The lotuses conceal him in their shadow ; the poplars by the stream surround him . 23 When the river rages , he is not alarmed ; he is secure , though the Jordan should surge against his mouth . 24 Can anyone capture him by the eyes , [ c ] or trap him and pierce his nose ? Leviathan has the following attributes according to Job chapter 41 , Psalm 104:25,26 and Isaiah 27:1 . This is only a partial listing—just enough to make the point .  “ No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up. ”  “ Who can open the doors of his face , with his terrible teeth all around ?  ”  “ His rows of scales are his pride , shut up tightly as with a seal ; one is so near another that no air can come between them ; they are joined one to another , they stick together and can not be parted. ”  “ His sneezings flash forth light , and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning . Out of his mouth go burning lights ; sparks of fire shoot out . Smoke goes out of his nostrils , as from a boiling pot and burning rushes . His breath kindles coals , and a flame goes out of his mouth. ”  “ Though the sword reaches him , it can not avail ; nor does spear , dart , or javelin . He regards iron as straw , and bronze as rotten wood . The arrow can not make him flee ; slingstones become like stubble to him . Darts are regarded as straw ; he laughs at the threat of javelins. ”  “ On earth there is nothing like him , which is made without fear. ” Leviathan  “ played ” in the  “ great and wide sea ” ( a paraphrase of Psalm 104 verses 25 and 26—get the exact sense by reading them yourself ) . Leviathan is a  “ reptile [ a ] that is in the sea. ” ( Isaiah 27:1 ) [ a ] Note : The word translated  “ reptile ” here is the Hebrew word tanniyn . This shows that  “ Leviathan ” was also a  “ tanniyn ” ( dragon ) . Job 41:18-21 18 By his exhaling a light does shine , and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning . 19 Out of his mouth go burning lamps , and sparks of fire leap out . 20 Out of his nostrils goes smoke , as out of a seething pot or caldron . 21 His breath kindles coals , and a flame goes out of his mouth . Isa 27:1 In that day the LORD with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent , even leviathan that crooked serpent ; and he shall slay the dragon that [ is ] in the sea . How do we rationally explain these creatures existence so recently in our human history if they were extinct for millions of years ? And if they were the imaginings of bronze age sheep herders as your atheists/evolutionists would have you believe , then how did these ignorant people describe creatures we can now recognize from fossil evidence ? And while your at it , ask yourself if it 's reasonable that the bones of dead creatures have survived from 60 million years to some estimated to be more than 200 million years without becoming dust ? Does that make rational sense to you ? Just look at the egyptian embalming methods for preserving the Pharaohs . They are still a marvel to modern scientists yet they are nothing more than frail shells no more solid than the texture of a bees nest after a short 3000 to 4000 years in a dry and sealed sarcophagus . Yet bones/fossils buried in the Earth with the upheavals , alkalis and acids in the earth in addition to the weather have survived over 60 million years ? You must ask yourself if sciences explanations pass the smell test in the realm of common sense . And that decision is yours alone .""","""Sorry but I think you are mistaken in that the bible `` describes `` dinosaurs . The first description is most certainly a description of the hippopotamus , which were abundant in Egypt , etc . The second seems to be crocodile of some sort . Most likely the Nile crocodile . Tanniyn is not just described as dragon , but also as serpent or scaly creature . At that time there was no other large scaly creature other than the Nile crocodile . They might have been describing a whale , but whales do not have scales . As to your claim of evolution , that depends on what `` God `` would mean by `` create. `` YOU can create something out of something else ca n't you ? So than evolution is a possibility .""",DISAGREE,"""evolution claims that Man evolved from the lower animals .""","""The first description is most certainly a description of the hippopotamus , which were abundant in Egypt , etc . The second seems to be crocodile of some sort . Most likely the Nile crocodile .""",,
5037,1324,"""so why do they call polar bears and brown bears different `` species `` when they can breed and produce fertile offspring together ?""","""Because , when each is in its natural habitat , they are reproductively isolated .""",DISAGREE,"""why do they call polar bears and brown bears different `` species ``""","""each is in its natural habitat , they are reproductively isolated""",,
5038,1324,"""so why do they call polar bears and brown bears different `` species `` when they can breed and produce fertile offspring together ?""","""Because , when each is in its natural habitat , they are reproductively isolated .""",DISAGREE,"""brown bears different `` `` when they can breed and fertile offspring together ?""","""when each is in its habitat , they are isolated .""",,
5041,1325,"""We need special licenses for abortions now ?""","""Only if you are making decisions .... any decision you make requires a license from the UN .""",AGREE,"""We need special for now ?""","""Only if you are decisions .... any you make requires a from the UN .""",,
5042,1325,"""We need special licenses for abortions now ?""","""Only if you are making decisions .... any decision you make requires a license from the UN .""",AGREE,"""We need special licenses for abortions now ?""","""Only if you are making decisions .... any decision you make requires a license from the UN .""",,
5046,1327,"""How many men who are single fathers and take sole responiblity for thier children because the women refuses to do so will you find if you go looking ? A few yes , but how many more women will you find in the reverse prediciment ?""","""I know of at least 3 personally , including my brother . He fought for custody for years and it nearly bankrupted him . He was trying to get his kids away from an ex-wife that would go away with her boyfriend for weekends at a time and leave their 15 year old daughter in charge of threee younger siblings .""",AGREE,"""will you A few yes , but how more in the prediciment ?""","""and He was trying to get his away from an that would go with her for weekends at a their 15 year old daughter in charge of threee siblings .""",,
5066,1333,"""I 've never understood this need to call babies he or she , rather than `` it `` . I refered to my own daughter using `` it `` for the first month after she was born . It was only because my own mother objected to me doing so that I stopped . Babies look like babies , not like boys or girls . It makes sense to refer to them as `` it `` . It also saves strangers getting embarrased when they guess the gender wrongly . Refer to babies as `` it `` : it is n't disrespectful and it 's sensible .""","""Well i know it would n't be sensible for anyone to call my child an it that is just disrespectfull to both your partener and child .""",DISAGREE,"""It makes sense to refer to them as `` it `` . It also saves strangers getting embarrased when they guess the gender wrongly . Refer to babies as `` it `` : it is n't disrespectful and it 's sensible .""","""anyone to call my child an it that is just disrespectfull to both your partener and child .""",,
5072,1334,"""So is it safe to say you may be for pro-ignorance ? With technology ANSWERS become clear . Everything cost money . Education cost money , therefore knowledge has a price tag . Do you now suggest people do n't go to College because it too is yet another EXPENSE . Society should NOT be inventing equipment that advance our intelligence . Sonograms are great tool for understanding more to those women who have doubt . I do n't know about you , but I 'm all for empowerment with knowledge . Most people are `` VISUAL `` people and perhaps seeing the unborn may make the CHOICE clearer for the woman . I 'm for educating those from ALL PERSPECTIVES . Most people would rather see physcial evidence that a sonogram may provide than the RHETORIC of SLOGANS and IDEALISTIC POINTS OF VIEW . I know your kind ... `` just trust me `` is your motto .""","""You know 'my kind ' ? How very presumptuous on your part . Then you know individual choice is the issue , not enforced medical procedures . You did n't answer the question regarding pregnant women who intend to carry to term being required to have a sonogram .""",DISAGREE,"""it safe to say you may be for pro-ignorance ? With technology ANSWERS become clear . Everything cost money . Education cost money , therefore knowledge has a price tag . Do you now suggest people do n't go to College because it too is yet another EXPENSE . Society should NOT be inventing equipment that advance our intelligence . Sonograms are great tool for understanding more to those women who have doubt . I do n't know about you , but I 'm all for empowerment with knowledge .""","""Then you know individual choice is the issue , not enforced medical procedures . You did n't answer the question regarding pregnant women who intend to carry to term being required to have a sonogram .""",,
5074,1335,"""2 . The resurrection story of Jesus is : A. a myth - see answer ' A ' above . B. a legend that grew over time , well after anyone could have proven the legend false . C. a lie fabricated by his followers immediately after his death D. an honest misunderstanding ; the Jews lost the body and were embarressed to admit their mistake while his followers were hallucinating E. Other ( limit your response to 50 words )""","""A .""",DISAGREE,"""A. a myth""","""A .""",,
5103,1341,"""The Bible says that God created every thing in 6 days . That does not neccensaraly mean it only took 6 days . The meaning of the word `` day `` in the language the Bible was written in means basicly `` a long period of time `` . That would explain why some fossils are millions of years old . That does not how ever prove evolution .""","""Except that the word for day in Genesis 1 is 'yom ' and was understood to be a twenty-four hour day .""",DISAGREE,"""Bible says that God created every thing in 6 days . That does not neccensaraly mean it only took 6 days . The meaning of the word `` day `` in the language the Bible was written in means basicly `` a long period of time ``""","""Except that the word for day in Genesis 1 is 'yom ' and was understood to be a twenty-four hour day""",,
5117,1344,"""My understanding is that evolutionists believe that monkeys or apes came before man , and that somehow monkeys or apes ( I am not sure which ) turned into man over millions of years . Is this correct ?""","""No . Perhaps some effort into educating yourself would be appropriate . I presume that you expected a yes answer and your next question would have been , `` why are there still monkeys/apes ? `` I sincerely request that you look at all of the skulls in the following two pictures . Please give me your opinion as to what each of these may be and how they came about . Please be aware that `` GAWD DID IT `` is laughable . I am aware that you are usually free from thought , but please make an exception and think about your answers . http : //home.houston.rr.com/bybayouu/skulls.html http : //home.houston.rr.com/bybayouu/skulls2.html""",DISAGREE,"""evolutionists believe that monkeys or apes came before man , and that somehow monkeys or apes turned into man over millions of years .""","""No . Perhaps some effort into educating yourself would be appropriate""",,
5123,1346,"""As far as the abortion issue goes there is no God that supports the murder of the innocent unborn in the womb ........""","""So , how many unborn babies did your God drown in Genesis ? Talk about hypocrisy .""",DISAGREE,"""As far as the abortion issue goes there is no God that supports the murder of the innocent unborn in the womb""","""So , how many unborn babies did your God drown in Genesis ? Talk about hypocrisy .""",,
5130,1349,"""I understand bullet wounds are kind of nasty because they 're deep .""","""Actually depth has nothing to do with it . You can be shot through and through and suffer no serious injuries . What matters is what 's hit in the middle . Of course knife wounds are far worse . You 've got a small hole versus a deep gash that 'll cut arteries and organs in its path .""",AGREE,"""I understand bullet wounds are kind of nasty because they 're deep .""","""Actually depth has nothing to do with it .""",,
5144,1353,"""The following blows the barn doors wide open as to exactly how evolutionists operate . It proves that they make stuff up on the fly – and that their methods of dating humans are completely flawed and flexible at any moment -- just like their whole theory is .""","""http : //www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html Somehow merely clicking the link makes you look like a hypocrite .""",DISAGREE,"""The following blows the barn doors wide open as to exactly how evolutionists operate . It proves that they make stuff up on the fly – and that their methods of dating humans are completely flawed and flexible at any moment""","""Somehow merely clicking the link makes you look like a hypocrite .""",,
5146,1354,"""You would go to hell for having sins . Since lying is a sin , it would be a hell-worthy offense .""","""You go to hell when you do not ask for FORGIVENESS from your sins and ask Christ to govern your life and help you to stop sinning . I am still a sinner , but I am forgiven and I ask Christ daily to help me with my fleshly desires .""",DISAGREE,"""You would go to hell for having sins . Since lying is a sin , it would be a hell-worthy offense .""","""You go to hell when you do not ask for FORGIVENESS from your sins and ask Christ to govern your life and help you to stop sinning . I am still a sinner , but I am forgiven and I ask Christ daily to help me with my fleshly desires .""",,
5162,1357,"""Finally , it just makes sense .... it makes physiological change smooth , simple and economical , with minimal waste ( death . )""","""Actually , it makes sense only to you . If you look at nature for just a little while , you willl become aware of a great deal of death . But it is mostly very economical since scavengers make sure that there is minimal waste .""",DISAGREE,"""Finally , it just makes sense""","""Actually , it makes sense only to you""",,
5171,1366,"""Bryan , Off the top of your head , can you think of any other misdemeanors that result in the suspension/removal of a persons rights for the rest of their lives ? I know that felonies do , but is n't this unique in that it specifically removes a constitutional right based on a misdemeanor conviction ?""","""It is my understanding that it involves only domestic violence misdemeanor cases with a conviction .""",AGREE,"""the suspension/removal of a persons rights for the rest of their lives""","""it involves only domestic violence misdemeanor cases with a conviction .""",,
5181,1368,"""In states that have enacted bans against gay marriage . Divorce rates of traditional marriages are on the rise in such states , while declining in states which allow gay marriage : Instant Tea Blog Archive Divorce rates higher in states with amendments banning gay marriage Check out the stats at the above link .""","""But you are smart enough to realize that the ban on gay marriage has nothing to do with it .""",DISAGREE,"""Divorce rates of traditional marriages are on the rise in such states ,""","""realize that the ban on gay marriage has nothing to do with it""",,
5195,1371,"""Chicago could limit handgun ownership , require registration - chicagotribune.com Now I know we did n't expect Daley to just roll over and take his losses like a real man . But to suggest that people be allowed to own only one single handgun is quite a step even for him . Even DC did n't try that one . I do n't see how such a proposal would ever pass a legal challenge . You 'd never get away with telling people they could only buy one book in their lifetime . And what exactly are you supposed to do if the gun you buy turns out to be something you do n't like for whatever reason ? Or what if it breaks and ca n't be repaired ? Are you going to be allowed to replace it or are you gon na be SOL ? And how about all those collectors out there ?""","""Just like a mayor , steal more chain than he could swim with ... Or : `` The State , there is no power but the State `` - ( who said this ? )""",AGREE,"""Chicago could limit handgun ownership , require registration - chicagotribune.com""","""Just like a mayor , steal more chain than he could swim with""",,
5199,1372,"""MEDICAL FACT : On the tenth day of the seventh month the production of red blood cells is taken over by the bone marrow -- the inner sanctum of the babies tabernacle .""","""Wrong and no one has ever called bone marrow an inner sanctum and I do n't know what a baby 's tabernacle might be .""",DISAGREE,"""On the tenth day of the seventh month the production of red blood cells""","""I do n't know what a baby 's tabernacle might be .""",,
5208,1373,"""If no , why take cognisance of any of it ?""","""Yes and no""",DISAGREE,"""If no , why take cognisance of any of it ?""","""Yes and no""",,
5236,1379,"""Why , is there something wrong with being pro abortion ?""","""Is there something wrong with choosing to have a cheese sandwich as opposed to peanut butter and jelly ? Do you prefer actually having to make personal moral choices or do you need a rigid and inviolable instruction manual to run your life ?""",AGREE,"""Why , is there something wrong with being pro abortion ?""","""Do you prefer actually having to make personal moral choices or do you need a rigid and inviolable instruction manual to run your life ?""",,
5239,1380,"""The bible also says that I should be killed for my haircut . The bible said that I should be able to own Mexicans as slaves . The bible says that we should kill all women if they have sex before they marry . Should we make these laws too ? The bible has nothing to do with laws . If you do n't like gay marrige , do n't marry someone your own sex . Simple as that .""","""Prove it , shooterandproud .""",DISAGREE,"""The bible said that I should be able to own as slaves . The says that we should kill if they have sex before they""","""Prove it , .""",,
5241,1380,"""The bible also says that I should be killed for my haircut . The bible said that I should be able to own Mexicans as slaves . The bible says that we should kill all women if they have sex before they marry . Should we make these laws too ? The bible has nothing to do with laws . If you do n't like gay marrige , do n't marry someone your own sex . Simple as that .""","""Prove it , shooterandproud .""",DISAGREE,"""If you do n't like gay marrige , do n't marry someone your own sex""","""Prove it""",,
5245,1382,"""Cops are being trained on semiautomatic weapons , which fire a single shot at a time and are more accurate . Some semiautomatic weapons can fire with pinpoint accuracy from as far as 100 yards away . The magazines used by law enforcement typically carry 20 or 30 rounds , adding to the ability to better respond under fire .""","""So what ? They 're better than shotguns for dealing with criminals in urban and crowded settings .""",DISAGREE,"""Cops are being trained on semiautomatic weapons""","""So what ?""",,
5250,1383,"""Are there any gay marriage supporters on these forums that do not think gay marriage is required by the US Constitution ?""","""I do n't think that any marriage rights are required at all by the Consitution .""",DISAGREE,"""Are there any gay marriage supporters on these forums that do not think gay marriage is required by the US Constitution ?""","""I do n't think that any marriage rights are required at all by the Consitution""",,
5305,1422,"""Typical little child , all he can offer is condescending insults while never daring to refute the arguments made . But you 're in good company as that is all your cohorts can do also . You must reject and denigrate that which is just as reasonable an explanation of the available evidence as your side offers . That 's why it 's a waste of time going around in circles with you guys . But I 've made my point .""","""Do n't you just hate the search function here ? Commercial Products of Creationism Fluid Mechanics , The Fossil Record and the Flood Communist Governments And that took me 3 seconds . Your grandiose claims of superiority and insults are rather moot given that anyone can do a basic search and show that your arguments and statements are essentially nothing more then self praise . The historical facts do not support basically anything you 've ever said . Quite frankly , I 'm not sure why anyone bothers with you given your ignorance regarding chemistry . I still love how you argued that Co2 was the reason that insects grew so large in the past .""",DISAGREE,"""Typical little child condescending insults never daring to refute the arguments waste of time going around in circles with you guys""","""Your grandiose claims of superiority and insults are rather moot given that anyone can do a basic search and show that your arguments and statements are essentially nothing more then self praise historical facts do not support basically anything you 've ever said not sure why anyone bothers with you given your ignorance""",,
5302,1422,"""Typical little child , all he can offer is condescending insults while never daring to refute the arguments made . But you 're in good company as that is all your cohorts can do also . You must reject and denigrate that which is just as reasonable an explanation of the available evidence as your side offers . That 's why it 's a waste of time going around in circles with you guys . But I 've made my point .""","""Do n't you just hate the search function here ? Commercial Products of Creationism Fluid Mechanics , The Fossil Record and the Flood Communist Governments And that took me 3 seconds . Your grandiose claims of superiority and insults are rather moot given that anyone can do a basic search and show that your arguments and statements are essentially nothing more then self praise . The historical facts do not support basically anything you 've ever said . Quite frankly , I 'm not sure why anyone bothers with you given your ignorance regarding chemistry . I still love how you argued that Co2 was the reason that insects grew so large in the past .""",DISAGREE,"""Typical little child , all he can offer is condescending insults while never daring to refute the arguments made""","""Do n't you just hate the search function here ? Commercial Products of Creationism Fluid Mechanics""",,
5308,1423,"""In fact , this along with mutations essentially destroys the belief of molecules to man evolution as they both have no possible way of acquiring the massive amounts of new genetic information required for evolution to be a valid explanation for our origins .""","""What are you talking about ? I thought we were talking about changes in allele frequencies and differential reproductive success , and you barf out some nonsense about information and molecules to man . What does that mean ? How is that applicable to evolutionary theory ? Are you a parrot or can you actually define information . Are you talking about Shannon information ? Yaukey information ? What do you mean when you say `` information. ``""",DISAGREE,"""along with mutations essentially destroys the belief of molecules to man evolution""","""I thought we were talking about changes in allele frequencies and differential reproductive success ,""",,
5310,1423,"""In fact , this along with mutations essentially destroys the belief of molecules to man evolution as they both have no possible way of acquiring the massive amounts of new genetic information required for evolution to be a valid explanation for our origins .""","""What are you talking about ? I thought we were talking about changes in allele frequencies and differential reproductive success , and you barf out some nonsense about information and molecules to man . What does that mean ? How is that applicable to evolutionary theory ? Are you a parrot or can you actually define information . Are you talking about Shannon information ? Yaukey information ? What do you mean when you say `` information. ``""",DISAGREE,"""destroys the belief no possible way required for evolution to be a valid explanation for our origins""","""What are you talking about ? changes in allele frequencies you barf out some nonsense What does that mean ? Are you a parrot or can you actually define information ``""",,
5311,1423,"""In fact , this along with mutations essentially destroys the belief of molecules to man evolution as they both have no possible way of acquiring the massive amounts of new genetic information required for evolution to be a valid explanation for our origins .""","""What are you talking about ? I thought we were talking about changes in allele frequencies and differential reproductive success , and you barf out some nonsense about information and molecules to man . What does that mean ? How is that applicable to evolutionary theory ? Are you a parrot or can you actually define information . Are you talking about Shannon information ? Yaukey information ? What do you mean when you say `` information. ``""",DISAGREE,"""In fact , this along with mutations essentially destroys the belief of molecules to man evolution""","""What are you talking about ? I thought we were talking about changes in allele frequencies and differential reproductive success""",,
5312,1424,"""If its white and a baby . There are far more unwanted children , even if we exclude aborted feti , than there are potential adopters .""","""An accurate understatement : http : //www.unicef.org/publications/files/SOWC_2005_ ( English ) .pdf # search='how % 20many % 20child ren % 20in % 20the % 20world % 20go % 20un % 20adopted % 3F '""",DISAGREE,"""even if we exclude aborted feti , than there are potential adopters .""","""accurate understatement :""",,
5314,1424,"""If its white and a baby . There are far more unwanted children , even if we exclude aborted feti , than there are potential adopters .""","""An accurate understatement : http : //www.unicef.org/publications/files/SOWC_2005_ ( English ) .pdf # search='how % 20many % 20child ren % 20in % 20the % 20world % 20go % 20un % 20adopted % 3F '""",DISAGREE,"""If its white and a baby . There are far more unwanted children , even if we exclude aborted feti , than there are potential adopters .""","""An accurate understatement :""",,
5330,1427,"""Although much younger than the dinosaur bones we had been collecting , these fossils were still thousands of years old , dating back to a time when the Sahara was much wetter than today . The bones of crocodiles , snakes , and huge freshwater fish mutely testify to a time when the region boasted broad rivers and deep lakes that abounded with wildlife .""","""Really if this is another one of your fresh organic sample = age of decades of time capsule because they were both on top of the ground , you 're officially delusional .""",DISAGREE,"""Although much younger than the dinosaur bones we had been collecting , these fossils were still thousands of years old""","""Really if this is another one of your fresh organic sample = age of decades of time capsule because they were both on top of the ground""",,
5346,1431,"""I can understand your point that , in the absolute , metaphysical sense , we can never be 100.00 % sure of any of our knowledge . Just because all humans always have experienced the existence of the world , does n't mean that it is 100.00 % certain , just that the probability that it is true approaches 100.00 % ( say , 99.9999999 % ) . The greater the amount of evidence , the closer that certainty is to 100.00 % . That 0.0000001 % leaves room for obsurd scenarios - such as that an omnicient being is causing us all to merely imagine our reality , or the scenario of the movie `` The Matrix `` . These can be fun to ponder ( especially in a social situation after a few drinks ) , but no one takes them seriously . If anyone did seriously live by the idea that the world may not exist , they would quickly do something stupid and die , or change their minds .""","""No-one experiences the existence of an outside world . Explanations such as the Matrix can explain sense impressions as well as some concept of 'external reality ' . We have no more evidence for one than the other . The fact no-one takes them seriously is a psychological point about human beings , nothing to do with reality per se .""",DISAGREE,"""If anyone did seriously live by the idea that the world may not exist , they would quickly do something stupid and die , or change their minds .""","""fact no-one takes them seriously is a psychological point about human beings , nothing to do with reality per se .""",,
5349,1432,"""Your position , it seems to me , turns on issues of quality of life and social justice such that children are entitled to either a minimum quality of life or none at all , and that preserving a woman 's right to control over her body is necessary for her quality of life as an equal citizen .""","""I do not argue so much the quality of llife of an individual woman but more for the quality of life , indeed of having access to life itself , of the children of the woman involved , because in many situations the concern and nurturance of a mother may be the only thing keeping children alive , especially in poor , war-torn nations that do not enjoy the relative wealth of the United States .""",AGREE,"""it seems to me , turns on issues of quality of life and social justice such that children""","""argue so much the quality of llife of an individual woman but more for the quality of life , indeed of having access to life itself""",,
5351,1432,"""Your position , it seems to me , turns on issues of quality of life and social justice such that children are entitled to either a minimum quality of life or none at all , and that preserving a woman 's right to control over her body is necessary for her quality of life as an equal citizen .""","""I do not argue so much the quality of llife of an individual woman but more for the quality of life , indeed of having access to life itself , of the children of the woman involved , because in many situations the concern and nurturance of a mother may be the only thing keeping children alive , especially in poor , war-torn nations that do not enjoy the relative wealth of the United States .""",AGREE,"""Your position , it seems to me , turns on issues of quality of life and social justice""","""I do not argue so much the quality of llife of an individual woman but more for the quality of life , indeed of having access to life itself , of the children of the woman involved""",,
5353,1433,"""The fetus has never achieved conciousness , let alone has known anything .""","""Well , you get the idea .""",AGREE,"""The fetus has never achieved conciousness , let alone has known anything .""","""Well , you get the idea .""",,
5382,1438,"""Conversely , if the fetus and the mother are equal , the fetus does not have the right to suck nutrients from the mother against her will .""","""What are you talking about ? The mother along with the father made the baby .......""",DISAGREE,"""does not have the right""","""What are you talking about ?""",,
5383,1439,"""This is not evolution . It is not a mutation . This is adaptaion .""","""Actually , it is a mutation . Just like the color of the fur is a mutation . Polar bear fur is not white , it is colorless . Moreover , it is hollow . That is another mutation . And Polar bears have longer legs than their closest relatives , the brown bears . They have smaller ears . None of the changes are caused by `` friction `` . By the way , the webs between the toes of a Polar bear are very much like the webs between the toes of a duck . Adaptation is , by the way , evolution . I presume that is the word you meant to use . Adaptation is not adaption . You talk about the process as if it were adaption and then call it adaptation . In reality it is adaptation .""",DISAGREE,"""This is not evolution .""","""Adaptation is , by the way , evolution .""",,
5393,1440,"""Why the clinical practice of medicine has no use for Darwinism , despite claims that it is impossible to practice medicine without applying its principles""","""Tell that to CDC pathologists . Or just read this post . ETA : Alternatively , let 's look at the logic in this way : because the field of quantum mechanics is useless for helping me describe classical physical systems , quantum mechanics must be wrong . I think this illustrates the fallacy satisfactorily .""",DISAGREE,"""Why the clinical practice of medicine has no use for Darwinism""","""Tell that to CDC pathologists .""",,
5400,1441,"""1 ) The context changes nothing . The comment is the same with or without more sentences surrounding it . 2 ) `` rejected giving marriage rights/benefits to unmarried straight couples `` ? ? ? That 's like saying , `` I believe that black votes should not be counted , and whites who choose not to vote should also not have their votes counted. `` To try and compare a situation where one group has the CHOICE to use a right , and then chooses not to , to a second group that is DENIED that choice , is mind-bogglingly absurd .""","""Not at all . The issue is receiving the marriage benefits . If gays were given all of the benefits of marriage for just living together , we would n't have a fight at all as you would have gotten what you want . It is n't the marriage that is important to you but the benefits . And the debate in Italy of singles who live together seeking marriage benefits also is a good example of the can of worms that will be opened if society concedes to the gay crusaders the undue rights they are demanding . Why is it absolutely impossible for you to reply to an issue without first redefining it to fit your warped World view ? Have you no objectivity within you at all ?""",DISAGREE,"""The context changes nothing .""","""Not at all""",,
5403,1442,"""Do you think she was the same person she was when in a coma as she is when coherent ?""","""Well , not completely , but yes , quite the same . However , this is irrelivent- she was n't a person , because she was in a coma . Does that give me the right to kill her ? Of course not ! What about fetuses born in comas ? Can we kill them ? What about people in vegetative states ? After all , they ar n't perfect , so let 's kill them !""",DISAGREE,"""the same person she was when in a coma""","""Well , not completely , but yes , quite the same . However , this is irrelivent- she was n't a person""",,
5410,1443,"""So having guns is not part of being armed ?""","""Simply having them is n't the point . It 's about being able to use them .""",DISAGREE,"""So having guns is not part of being armed ?""","""Simply having them is n't the point .""",,
5414,1444,"""Despite the clinical term , the word is generally used to describe gun control advocates . It is mildly derogatory , less so than similar slang terms such as those mentioned above . It is most commonly used as a pejorative by gun rights advocates .""","""Try the link . You 've done the 'name calling ' , at least you could be honest about what you are doing .""",DISAGREE,"""It is most commonly used as a pejorative""","""You 've done the 'name calling ' ,""",,
5425,1447,"""Even though the Bible is not a scientific text book and does n't purport to be , nowhere is it scientifically inaccurate . In addition , many of the scientific ideas you are so impressed with are nothing new to the Bible . It was speaking of these things long before modern science spoke of them .""","""Scientifically innacurate ? 1 word : Creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""In addition , many of the scientific ideas you are so impressed with are nothing new to the Bible .""","""Scientifically innacurate ? 1 word : Creationism .""",,
5471,1464,"""Compared to what ? The U.S. ? That would be laughable if it was n't so serious , it is plain ridiculous . The CDC and NAS studies Tither has posted so many times still has n't sunk it has it ? There is no benefit to any gun control law that has been studied ! Now here you are ignoring and contradicting scientific facts ... again .""","""Do n't expect your misrepresentations of the findings of those studies to sink in . I 'm not that easily fooled .""",DISAGREE,"""would be laughable if it was n't so serious , it is plain ridiculous""","""Do n't expect your misrepresentations of the findings of those studies to sink in . I 'm not that easily fooled""",,
5477,1466,"""Got evidence to back that up ? ? I 'm not sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really . -Wez""","""Still dumb to compare the two . Both are no good . Theft is better then murder ... however a theif bragging because he did n't murder is a fool .. Chris Rock actually did a funny skit on this . Stoner is not good , alcoholic is not good , herion addict is not good . You ask if I have evidence ... yes , my own two eyes . Do n't believe me then so be it , but there are many articles that say the effects of marijuana ... at the very least it is like smoking . I stress very least .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really""","""Still dumb to compare the two""",,
5478,1466,"""Got evidence to back that up ? ? I 'm not sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really . -Wez""","""Still dumb to compare the two . Both are no good . Theft is better then murder ... however a theif bragging because he did n't murder is a fool .. Chris Rock actually did a funny skit on this . Stoner is not good , alcoholic is not good , herion addict is not good . You ask if I have evidence ... yes , my own two eyes . Do n't believe me then so be it , but there are many articles that say the effects of marijuana ... at the very least it is like smoking . I stress very least .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really . -Wez""","""Stoner is not good , alcoholic is not good , herion addict is not good""",,
5479,1467,"""Well , at some point they are sentient beings ( surely you agree ) , that 's the point that the fetus becomes a person in my opinion . Before that it 's not really too bad . I do n't have a problem with people `` having sex in an improper way `` or choosing to `` screw each other how they would like to screw each other `` . I do have a problem with people creating a feeling being and then killing it , as is the case when fetuses become sentient and are aborted . You also say that it is my opinion , which it is , but it is also your opinion . You have said that women who have abortion because they ar n't responsible are making bad decisions .""","""They are , but its their descision nonetheless .""",DISAGREE,"""You also say that it is my opinion , which it is , but it is also your opinion""","""their descision nonetheless .""",,
5484,1468,"""You make assumptions that arrogantly consign all religious people to irrational beings . It is rather irrational and sad to do so . Ah but for a little insight to see that you apply to science a place science does n't seek . Are you saying that given enough time you can come with answers ? That 's a statement of faith . This must be why you 're determined to raise science onto a pedestal , so you can believe that it 's answers are above us , giving us guidance from above - simply replacing the role of God/church with science . Why do you apply the term evolution to these ? Do you , deep-down , believe that these have resulted from evolution too ? You are not alone in making evolution an absolute all-encompassing world-view ... Oddly enough Close_slave_can denies that anyone does this .""","""It 's not an `` arrogant assumption `` to point out that religious faith involves making a `` leap in the dark `` - it 's a metaphor that attempts to illustrate the facts of the case . I 'm saying that given ADEQUATE EVIDENCE , science , IN PRINCIPLE , can answer all questions concerning the MATERIAL world . That is actually quite a limited statement if you bother to read it carefully . Pointing out some of the achievements of science which could not have been accomplished in any other way , is not `` raising science on a pedestal `` - it 's merely reciting the obvious . Yes , I am saying that reasoned arguments from anthropology can and do account for the evolution of morals , the law , etc . in human societies . The growth in complexity of physical organisms is analogous to the growth of social complexity in human societies : the study of the former can throw light on the development of the latter . I have not tried to address the torrent of `` points `` that cascade into the of rest of your post : I do n't understand what you 're talking about . As for the allegation that I 'm driven by `` ideology `` - I have n't a clue what sectarian policies you think control me .""",DISAGREE,"""This must be why you 're determined to raise science onto a pedestal , so you can believe that it 's answers are above us , giving us guidance from above - simply replacing the role of God/church with science""","""Yes , I am saying that reasoned arguments from anthropology can and do account for the evolution of morals , the law , etc . in human societies""",,
5522,1477,"""Ok , I will admit that I have not been reading your posts that do not involve me . I think you said something about not answering questions directed at others , right ? Are you now saying , `` read all of my posts , anyway `` ?""","""Well , I 'll forgive you . But if you 're going to make comments about my willingness to post in another thread , should n't you read that thread first ? Should n't you read my posts in that case ? It did involve you because you referred to it .""",DISAGREE,"""Ok , I will admit that I have not been reading your posts that do not involve me""","""But if you 're going to make comments about my willingness to post in another thread , should n't you read that thread first ?""",,
5531,1479,"""I do however question why he took such a job in the first place . He had to have known that this was part of his duties as the laws currently stand .""","""I think that 's a good question . I also wonder how long the medical establishment has had this rule ? Since there must be some long-standing procedures in executions in the United States that require , by law , a doctor 's supervision .""",AGREE,"""in the first place . He had to have known that this was part of his duties""","""medical establishment has had this rule ? Since there must be some long-standing procedures in executions""",,
5534,1480,"""You would be a fool to think marijuana is n't harmful . You would be a fool to think alcohol is n't either . Although 1 beer a day is much better then a joint .""","""Got evidence to back that up ? ? I 'm not sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really . -Wez""",DISAGREE,"""marijuana is n't harmful . You would be a fool to think alcohol is n't either""","""sure how a stoner 's worse than an alcoholic really""",,
5535,1481,"""Those who object to same-sex marriage primarily ( or so they claim ) because it would `` change the definition of marriage `` should perhaps be made aware that that train has already left the station : Merriam-Webster On-line http : //www.m-w.com/dictionary/marriage Dictionary.com http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage Encarta http : //encarta.msn.com/encnet/featur ... fid=1861628509 American Heritage http : //www.bartleby.com/61/2/M0120200.html This is not to say that every current dictionary includes such a definition ... yet ... but a number of major on-line ones demonstrably do , and to my knowledge human civilization has yet to suffer any negative effects . ( By the way , the above entries also include the typical `` husband and wife `` kind of arrangement as well . Funny how words can have more than one meaning , is n't it ? )""","""The whole `` change the definition of marriage `` is mainly a scare tactic used by anti-gay religious bigots . They do n't seem to realize that words can have several meanings .""",AGREE,"""change the definition of marriage Merriam-Webster On-line""","""change the definition of marriage do n't seem to realize that words can have several meanings""",,
5580,1492,"""I am no pacifist .""","""Sorry did I say pacifist ? I meant yellow bellied pacifist.However if its any consolation , I meant anti 's in general not just you Sinj.sorry if it sounded that way .""",DISAGREE,"""I am no pacifist .""","""pacifist I meant yellow bellied I meant anti 's in general not just you""",,
5596,1494,"""ToE says that there are two forces in evolution : random mutation , and natural selection .""","""Just a technical point . Evolutionary theory does not require that mutations should be random . Molecular geneticists are well aware that some genes in some organisms mutate more often than others ; alternatively , some genes are conserved more strongly than others . It 's just that hotspots apart , there is no evidence for result-orientated directed mutation of genes . Within certain constraints , they appear to be random , but evolutionary theory as such does n't demand that they should be . Second , natural selection through competition for resources is n't the only force constraining evolution ( though it is the major explanation of adaptation ) . There is also genetic drift which can distribute neutral mutations through populations , and there are probably also other factors such as structural constraints and canalisation affecting which mutations can see the light of day ( i.e . get exposed to natural selection ) and which will not .""",DISAGREE,"""ToE says that there are two forces in evolution : random mutation , and natural selection .""","""Evolutionary theory does not require that mutations should be random""",,
5612,1497,"""Except for possible exception of a couple evangelistic atheists , the design argument is from the creationist side . It is pretty old being first stated by William Paley . Darwin respected Paley and thought his arguments beautiful until he actually started looking at reality ( Darwin also lived in that same rooms at Christ 's College , Cambridge that Paley did ) . The argument from design is presented as `` proof `` of God or an `` intelligent `` designer for those who want to pretend that intelligent design creationism ins't creationism . But the argument on the other side is that it is flawed design and therefore is n't `` proof `` . Evolutionary biologists do n't assert that there is not god , only that there is no evidence from nature that there is one . Science is naturalistic . Even if some scientists ( and others ) are philosophical naturalists , science does n't work that way . It is methodological naturalism simply because there are no tools by which science can examine or quantify the supernatural . It sounds silly when some claim that scientists are wrong when they fail to consider the supernatural in naturalism .""","""If we were to debate whether God made us perfect as he could have , then of course we can make the point that he obviously does n't exist .""",DISAGREE,"""The argument from design is presented as `` proof `` of God . Evolutionary biologists do n't assert that there is not , only that there is no evidence from nature that there is one""","""If we were to debate whether God made us perfect as he could have , then of course we can make the point that he obviously does n't exist .""",,
5630,1500,"""you see , the thing is that not everybody agrees with some of the theories that usually accompany evolution ( including Big Bang , abiogenesis , etc ) that try to answer the question `` how come existence `` .""","""But I think that is the point . What if you did n't agree with the germ theory of disease ? Does that mean that it should n't be taught in health classes in our schools ? Should it be replaced by the bad humors of night air theory ? But not everyone agrees with that theory either .""",DISAGREE,"""theories that usually accompany evolution come existence `` .""","""germ theory of disease humors of night air theory""",,
5645,1502,"""# 2 was questioning the personal , non-scientific beliefs of the evolution believer""","""If I am to believe in something even if it 's scientific , I should be able to challenge the belief 's of the person who 's pushing it . If they do n't believe in what they 're selling , why should I .""",DISAGREE,"""non-scientific beliefs""","""scientific , why should I .""",,
5649,1503,"""I believe it ’ s Satan ’ s presence that causes atheism and it also causes false religions to be dreamed up .""","""So newborn babies only have no Christian beliefs because Satan has removed them ? My position would be that the 'natural ' ( read : before external influences ) state of a person is atheism , for the same reason that you 'naturally ' have no belief in gremlins . People are n't born with beliefs , they are naturalised into them - whatever that belief may be .""",DISAGREE,"""Satan ’ s presence atheism false religions""","""So newborn babies only have no Christian beliefs because Satan has removed them ? People are n't born with beliefs ,""",,
5666,1513,"""I 'm sure this has been asked before , but are humans of the ape kind or are apes of the human kind ?""","""Well , man has been called the third chimpanzee . Cladistics is some decades old now , and it has suplanted the old Linean system . While discoveries are still assigned genus and species names , evaluation of morphological charisteristics by computer yield much more realistic evolutionary trees .""",AGREE,"""I 'm sure this has been asked before , but are humans of the ape kind or are apes of the human kind ?""","""Well , man has been called the third chimpanzee .""",,
5672,1515,"""Should we allow health-care to the homeless , and illegal ? For the homeless : Yes . However , I think that it should be based upon how they got to be homeless . Because , sometimes , it 's their fault . And in those times , I do n't think that we should have to cover all of their health-care . DO I believe that we should cover some of it ? Yes , because it 's the right thing to do , and it is what our nation claims . Equal rights . However , I have nothing to say on the issue of the illegal , because a member in my family was recently attacked ( stabbed ) by one , and the wounds are too fresh , and if I speak on it , I will be speaking with prejudice , so I will leave that subject alone . But , what are your views ?""","""I think we should not spend inordinate amount of resources on trying to determine who is homeless and if it his own fault . Anyway , whose business is it where someone lives ?""",DISAGREE,"""However , I think that it should be based upon how they got to be homeless .""","""we should not spend inordinate amount of resources on trying to determine who is homeless and if it his own fault .""",,
5673,1516,"""Choose life at any cost . The only thing worse than living in a state home is not living at all .""","""On the issue of not living at all i `` m not shure there is a reasonable answer as to how someone who was never born could possibly recognise not exsisting as being `` worse than living ... `` Let me say I personally do n't like the idea of aborting a pregnancy . However I ca n't possibly understand how we would not FIRST adopt all those kids in homes first and then fight the battel for saving the unwanted unborn .""",AGREE,"""Choose life at any cost .""","""how someone who was never born could possibly recognise not exsisting as being `` worse than living""",,
5674,1516,"""Choose life at any cost . The only thing worse than living in a state home is not living at all .""","""On the issue of not living at all i `` m not shure there is a reasonable answer as to how someone who was never born could possibly recognise not exsisting as being `` worse than living ... `` Let me say I personally do n't like the idea of aborting a pregnancy . However I ca n't possibly understand how we would not FIRST adopt all those kids in homes first and then fight the battel for saving the unwanted unborn .""",AGREE,"""Choose life at any cost .""","""I personally do n't like the idea of aborting a pregnancy""",,
5703,1524,""" ” Well , the first popular technique of creationists is to try to find examples of bad radiometric dates and offer these up as proof that radiometric dating is totally unreliable . Henry Morris , in his 1974 book `` Scientific Creationism `` made the claim that K/Ar dates for lava from the 1801 Hulalalei volcano lava flow ranged from 160 million years to 3 billion years old . With results like these , radiometric dating must be totally useless - how could scientists possibly be so stupid as to believe that radiometric dating could be of any merit when a simple lava flow gives such a wide range of dates - right in their own research ? As usual with such claims , we 'll have to dig a little further to get at the truth . Morris cited a study by Funkhouser and Norton – `` Radiogenic Helium and Argon in Ultramafic Inclusions from Hawaii `` published in the Journal of Geophysics Research , vol . 73 , pgs . 4601 - 4607 . What Morris did n't bother to inform his readers was that the study concerned xenoliths - fragments of foreign rock broken off by the magmas intrusion through the crust . Since they are not completely melted by the magma , they are in fact much older than the lava flow ( with K/Ar dating , what you are really dating is how long it has been since the rock solidified from the molten state - at this point the daughter Argon can no longer escape from the rock ) . That particular study confirmed ( as geologists already suspected ) that xenoliths could not be properly dated with the K/Ar method . The Funkhouser and Norton study clearly stated that the `` ages `` determined by K/Ar dating had no geological meaning and also determined that the xenoliths contained excess argon trapped in `` air `` bubbles inside the rock . Of course there was no mention of these details by Morris or any of the internet postings I have seen that still list this `` problem `` - despite the fact that Dalrymple answered it over 10 years ago . In the same paper , Dalrymple goes on to describe in detail several other quotes taken out of context by Creationists. ” ( http : //www.gate.net/~rwms/AgeEarth.html )""","""So the radiometric data stand : the Earth , moon , and older meteorites are all 4 or so billion years old , not just a few thousand . Changing Decay Rates ? Another Creationist attempt to counter radiometric dates that are incompatible with their young-Earth religious position is to claim that decay rates are not constant , thereby throwing a monkey wrench into the calculations . There are at least two problems with this argument . First , it is not at all clear how varying decay rates could result in multiple decay sequences all agreeing on the age of an object . Remember , for example , the oldest exposed rocks on earth , dated using different parent radioisotopes ? All five of the decay sequences ( Rb-Sr , Pb-Pb , U-Pb , Th-Pb , and Lu-Hf ) clustered right around 3.7 billion years . If decay rates vary enough to throw off dates by billions of years , why would they vary in exactly the way needed to consistently produce the same results ? Second , radioactive decay of nuclei is not comparable to chemical reactions . In chemistry , the rate at which chemical reaction proceeds can be altered in a number of ways , such as by changing the temperature , acidity , pressure , or reactant concentrations . Such changes , however , have essentially no effect on nuclear decay . In fact , experimental attempts to alter decay rates have been made , but failed .""",DISAGREE,"""Hulalalei volcano lava flow ranged from 160 million years to 3 billion years old""","""radiometric data stand : the Earth , moon , and older meteorites are all 4 or so billion years old""",,
5719,1528,"""We are up to our eyeballs in `` intermediate fossils `` , yet along comes a Creationist to ask : `` Where is the intermediate fossible which should be there between 1027 and 1028 ? Clearly evolution is a fraud ! ``""","""And yet , even though creationists ask for detailed lists of every creature in transition over a period of several million years , I have never found a single creationist who can trace his ancestors back to Adam , a period of only about 6,000 years . The best I can do is to trace my ancestors back to the 1600s .""",AGREE,"""We are up to our eyeballs in `` intermediate fossils `` , yet along comes a Creationist to ask : `` Where is the intermediate fossible which should be there between 1027 and 1028 ? Clearly evolution is a fraud !""","""And yet , even though creationists ask for detailed lists of every creature in transition over a period of several million years , I have never found a single creationist who can trace his ancestors back to Adam , a period of only about 6,000 years""",,
5730,1530,"""Once again , it is perfectly reasonable to assume someone breaking into my house in the middle of the night means to harm myself and/or my family . I would be well within my rights .""","""You were n't referring to your home in your little story of helplessness .""",DISAGREE,"""Once again , it is perfectly reasonable to assume someone breaking into my house in the middle of the night means to harm myself and/or my family . I would be well within my rights .""","""You were n't referring to your home in your little story of helplessness""",,
5733,1531,"""`` Abortion is not murder . Murder is illegal . Since Abortion is legal , it can not be murder. `` This is the formal structure of the ridiculous and false arguments to suggest that abortion is not murder . '' It can not be murder , because abortion is legal. `` Amazingly , you citizen-slaves fall for this illogical and ridiculous rant . The argument is illogical because it pre-supposes that abortion not being murder is valid in the premise . It does not matter if you do it , or the law supposes the premise True . It is also illogical because the definition of murder used has an arbitrary operator ( `` illegal `` ) , and no legitimate definition can have such an arbitrary operator as a part . The idea that deliberately killing a womb-trapped child is not murder is insane , lie-based and ridiculous .""","""The purposeful taking of life regulated by the government is something that is decided by the people . The people decide what determines what is allowable and what is not . When it is acceptable and when it is not . This is done in agreement , obviously not unanimous . Theses laws are created by the view of society at the time . Our society permits the ability to change those laws as our values change . You may call it murder , but you are wrong . There is no logical argument you can present to make your view correct . To suggest that legal abortion is anything else is an expression of your frustration why others do n't share your views . There is no logic in your argument it 's pure emotion and an immature understanding of how to cope with problems that do n't go your way . If you think your view is indeed the view that is best for the people then be thankful in the US the opportunity exists for you to effect that . I can assure you though lieing about it , sensationalizing it , bullying people about it is n't going to get many people to consider you . Please do us both a favor before you go off on a discourse of the rights , or feelings or value of the fetus remember what I said about we as a society decided what is acceptable and what is not . We make these laws for ourselves for that reason , because we do attempt to value life . That attempt does not always satisfy all of the people all of the time , but it never will . I do n't need a formula to understand how our society functions nor do I stomp my foot and throw insults or intimidate people who do n't see you being right . Nor would I justify behavior that from anybody else concerning something of less import would be unacceptable . If you do n't like the law , then do something about it . If this is what you deem to be the best and most effective way to do that , I suggest you find a to become comfortable with it .""",DISAGREE,"""formal structure of the ridiculous and false arguments abortion '' you citizen-slaves fall for this illogical and ridiculous rant pre-supposes that abortion not being murder is valid in the premise""","""decided by the people laws are created by the view of society at the time You may call it murder , but you are wrong no logical argument you can present pure emotion immature understanding Please do us both a favor""",,
5735,1531,"""`` Abortion is not murder . Murder is illegal . Since Abortion is legal , it can not be murder. `` This is the formal structure of the ridiculous and false arguments to suggest that abortion is not murder . '' It can not be murder , because abortion is legal. `` Amazingly , you citizen-slaves fall for this illogical and ridiculous rant . The argument is illogical because it pre-supposes that abortion not being murder is valid in the premise . It does not matter if you do it , or the law supposes the premise True . It is also illogical because the definition of murder used has an arbitrary operator ( `` illegal `` ) , and no legitimate definition can have such an arbitrary operator as a part . The idea that deliberately killing a womb-trapped child is not murder is insane , lie-based and ridiculous .""","""The purposeful taking of life regulated by the government is something that is decided by the people . The people decide what determines what is allowable and what is not . When it is acceptable and when it is not . This is done in agreement , obviously not unanimous . Theses laws are created by the view of society at the time . Our society permits the ability to change those laws as our values change . You may call it murder , but you are wrong . There is no logical argument you can present to make your view correct . To suggest that legal abortion is anything else is an expression of your frustration why others do n't share your views . There is no logic in your argument it 's pure emotion and an immature understanding of how to cope with problems that do n't go your way . If you think your view is indeed the view that is best for the people then be thankful in the US the opportunity exists for you to effect that . I can assure you though lieing about it , sensationalizing it , bullying people about it is n't going to get many people to consider you . Please do us both a favor before you go off on a discourse of the rights , or feelings or value of the fetus remember what I said about we as a society decided what is acceptable and what is not . We make these laws for ourselves for that reason , because we do attempt to value life . That attempt does not always satisfy all of the people all of the time , but it never will . I do n't need a formula to understand how our society functions nor do I stomp my foot and throw insults or intimidate people who do n't see you being right . Nor would I justify behavior that from anybody else concerning something of less import would be unacceptable . If you do n't like the law , then do something about it . If this is what you deem to be the best and most effective way to do that , I suggest you find a to become comfortable with it .""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion is not murder . Murder is illegal . Since Abortion is legal , it can not be murder. `` This is the formal structure of the ridiculous and false arguments to suggest that abortion is not murder . '' It can not be murder , because abortion is legal. `` Amazingly , you citizen-slaves fall for this illogical and ridiculous rant . The argument is illogical because it pre-supposes that abortion not being murder is valid in the premise . It does not matter if you do it , or the law supposes the premise True . It is also illogical because the definition of murder used has an arbitrary operator ( `` illegal `` ) , and no legitimate definition can have such an arbitrary operator as a part . The idea that deliberately killing a womb-trapped child is not murder is insane , lie-based and ridiculous .""","""The purposeful taking of life regulated by the government is something that is decided by the people . The people decide what determines what is allowable and what is not . When it is acceptable and when it is not . This is done in agreement , obviously not unanimous . Theses laws are created by the view of society at the time . Our society permits the ability to change those laws as our values change . You may call it murder , but you are wrong . There is no logical argument you can present to make your view correct . To suggest that legal abortion is anything else is an expression of your frustration why others do n't share your views . There is no logic in your argument it 's pure emotion and an immature understanding of how to cope with problems that do n't go your way . If you think your view is indeed the view that is best for the people then be thankful in the US the opportunity exists for you to effect that . I can assure you though lieing about it , sensationalizing it , bullying people about it is n't going to get many people to consider you . Please do us both a favor before you go off on a discourse of the rights , or feelings or value of the fetus remember what I said about we as a society decided what is acceptable and what is not . We make these laws for ourselves for that reason , because we do attempt to value life . That attempt does not always satisfy all of the people all of the time , but it never will . I do n't need a formula to understand how our society functions nor do I stomp my foot and throw insults or intimidate people who do n't see you being right . Nor would I justify behavior that from anybody else concerning something of less import would be unacceptable . If you do n't like the law , then do something about it . If this is what you deem to be the best and most effective way to do that , I suggest you find a to become comfortable with it .""",,
5763,1536,"""Concepts do not `` come from `` somewhere , they are not physical entities and do not have physical properties such as locations , beginnings or ends . They do not require a creator , physical ( the universe ) or imaginary ( God ) .""","""This is my thinking exactly . Waxy""",AGREE,"""Concepts do not `` come from `` somewhere ,""","""This is my thinking exactly .""",,
5774,1538,"""Only one innocent bled in this case .""","""The point is you dancing in the blood , of at least one innocent . Why else post this ? Especially with no comment ?""",DISAGREE,"""Only one innocent bled in this case .""","""The point is you dancing in the blood , of at least one innocent . Why else post this ? Especially with no comment ?""",,
5785,1540,"""Socialism , communism and capitalism are n't the only choices for how to organize an economy . Also , the US at present is neither `` pure capitalist `` nor socialist . I do believe that some people should re-evaluate their definitions of socialism , as they seem confused about what it is .""","""The US is still the closest thing to a pure capitalist country in the world . But you are correct , our system is not a pure capitalist one . We have reminants of all types of systems including socialism . In the modern world I do n't think a society as large as the US is could be run under just one pure system .""",AGREE,"""Also , the US at present is neither `` pure capitalist `` nor socialist . I do believe that some people should re-evaluate their definitions""","""our system is not a pure capitalist one . We have reminants of all types of systems including""",,
5789,1540,"""Socialism , communism and capitalism are n't the only choices for how to organize an economy . Also , the US at present is neither `` pure capitalist `` nor socialist . I do believe that some people should re-evaluate their definitions of socialism , as they seem confused about what it is .""","""The US is still the closest thing to a pure capitalist country in the world . But you are correct , our system is not a pure capitalist one . We have reminants of all types of systems including socialism . In the modern world I do n't think a society as large as the US is could be run under just one pure system .""",AGREE,"""the US at present is neither `` pure capitalist `` nor socialist .""","""The US is still the closest thing to a pure capitalist country in the world""",,
5791,1541,"""for the sake of this topic , would it be ok if we borrow the word evolution from your biologist for a minute ?""","""Well , I ca n't stop you . But if some creationist says `` But in that other thread you said evolution meant , blah , blah , blah ... `` do n't come crying to me . Ok , getting off my soapbox now , I 'd say you 're totally right . Certain branches of Christianity , like Catholisism , have traditionally been very resistant to change . Unwilling to adapt , one might say . And the Catholic church has been in a state of decline of late . The social climate in which Catholosism thrived no longer exists , and so it is n't doing as well . We also see lots of little churches springing up , filling religious enviromental niches , as it were . What can we predict for the future ? Here 's my guess . The two main enviromental factors that will shape religion will be a desire for stability and an ability to adapt to new ideas . As communication and travel become easier , people will be exposed to more new ideas and cultures , and religions will be forced to deal with people saying `` Yeah , but what about this new idea I just heard ? How does that fit in ? `` On the other hand , as people get exposed to other ideas , they 'll want to have some core of ideas of their own to hold on to . Sort of a psychological anchor . I figure we should expect to see the more dogmatic churches fade away , as people become exposed to more , different ideas . If you ca n't adapt , you become extinct . Churches that espouse firm moral ideas based on humanisitic reasoning will probably do well .""",AGREE,"""for the sake of this topic , would it be ok if we borrow the word evolution from your biologist for a minute ?""","""Well , I ca n't stop you . But if some creationist says `` But in that other thread you said evolution meant , blah , blah , blah""",,
5795,1542,"""Does Dembski claim to have discoverted a 4th law of thermodynamics , or the 4th law of thermodynamics ? While it is true that there are already 4 laws of thermodynamics , there is no 4th law of thermodynamics . The current laws run from 0 - 3 , so the third law of thermodynamics is the highest numbered one there is right now . Also , I believe that Stuart Kauffman - who is clearly not a creationist or ID creationist - has ( also ) claimed to have discovered the 4th law of thermodynamics .""","""I thought I had worded my post quite clearly . I even pointed out that it appeared that Dembski thought that there were only three laws of thermodynamics and claimed to have discovered a 4th ( which he of course named the 4th law of thermodynamics ) . He seems unaware of the zeroth law .""",DISAGREE,"""Does Dembski claim to have discoverted a 4th law of thermodynamics , or the 4th law of thermodynamics""","""He seems unaware of the zeroth law .""",,
5802,1543,"""Upon what basis would discussion be acceptable if not scripture ? If we are to debat the topic , what sources for informational purposes do you consider as `` authoritative `` ? EF""","""A rational mind .""",DISAGREE,"""Upon what basis would discussion be acceptable if not scripture ?""","""A rational mind .""",,
5830,1549,"""Dead moths were glued or pinned onto trees to provide impressive photography .""","""But no one ever claimed that they were glued on the trees for any other reason that to show the protective coloration . Why is that a fraud ? Would n't it be better that you actually learned the facts rather than allowing someone else to dupe you with this misinformation .""",DISAGREE,"""Dead moths were glued or pinned onto trees to provide impressive photography .""","""Why is that a fraud ? Would n't it be better that you actually learned the facts rather than allowing someone else to dupe you with this misinformation .""",,
5835,1551,"""No person shall knowingly sell , offer or display for sale , give , lend or transfer ownership of , acquire or possess any assault weapon .""","""As should be plainly obvious , this is an almost total ban on all semi-automatic weapons in the City of Columbus , not just those that have been traditionally considered 'assault weapons ' ( automatic firearms ) . Note definition ( L ) ( 2 ) . Almost every semi-automatic pistol is included in that definition . Whether an all-out ban on guns is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , or an assault-weapons ban is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , it should be obvious to any reader that the Columbus city council is trying to push through an all-out ban on guns by calling this an assault weapons ban .""",DISAGREE,"""acquire or possess any assault weapon .""","""As should be plainly obvious , this is an almost total ban on all semi-automatic weapons""",,
5836,1551,"""No person shall knowingly sell , offer or display for sale , give , lend or transfer ownership of , acquire or possess any assault weapon .""","""As should be plainly obvious , this is an almost total ban on all semi-automatic weapons in the City of Columbus , not just those that have been traditionally considered 'assault weapons ' ( automatic firearms ) . Note definition ( L ) ( 2 ) . Almost every semi-automatic pistol is included in that definition . Whether an all-out ban on guns is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , or an assault-weapons ban is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , it should be obvious to any reader that the Columbus city council is trying to push through an all-out ban on guns by calling this an assault weapons ban .""",DISAGREE,"""No person shall knowingly sell , offer or display for sale , give , lend or transfer ownership of , acquire or possess any assault weapon .""","""it should be obvious to any reader that the Columbus city council is trying to push through an all-out ban on guns by calling this an assault weapons ban .""",,
5846,1555,"""In the end , both Thompson 's and McDonagh 's arguments prove too much . They allow us to kill any human being who is dependent upon us , young or old , if that person restrains our personal liberty .""","""Slippery slope .""",DISAGREE,"""In the end , both Thompson 's and McDonagh 's arguments prove too much . They allow us to kill any human being who is dependent upon us , young or old""","""Slippery slope .""",,
5850,1556,"""Good Lord , grow up . I believe in him , you do n't , that makes you feel superior because we believe in the tooth fairy and you do n't , blah , blah , blah , invisible guy in the sky , etc , etc . I 've heard it all before ... a THOUSAND times . This thread is obviously for people who DO believe in God , so take the programmed parrot talk elsewhere .""","""`` One day you 're going to realize that you 're `` evangelizing `` and `` witnessing `` have pushed far more people away from religion then has brought them in. `` '' You 're not telling people about God , you 're guilting them and putting them down . You 're drawing an imaginary line that separates `` us `` from `` them `` , and you 're cutting yourself off from other people . When Jesus `` evangelized `` ( I believe with all my heart he would hate that word ) , he made honest friends , not with the purpose to `` convert `` them . He did n't hand them a track and scare them into being a Christian . No wonder people hate Christians , for God 's sake I 'm starting to hate Christians. `` Maybe you should follow your own advice ... jim : Yes , God loves Saddam but He hates the way he is acting .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe in him , you do n't ,""","""Maybe you should follow your own advice ...""",,
5851,1556,"""Good Lord , grow up . I believe in him , you do n't , that makes you feel superior because we believe in the tooth fairy and you do n't , blah , blah , blah , invisible guy in the sky , etc , etc . I 've heard it all before ... a THOUSAND times . This thread is obviously for people who DO believe in God , so take the programmed parrot talk elsewhere .""","""`` One day you 're going to realize that you 're `` evangelizing `` and `` witnessing `` have pushed far more people away from religion then has brought them in. `` '' You 're not telling people about God , you 're guilting them and putting them down . You 're drawing an imaginary line that separates `` us `` from `` them `` , and you 're cutting yourself off from other people . When Jesus `` evangelized `` ( I believe with all my heart he would hate that word ) , he made honest friends , not with the purpose to `` convert `` them . He did n't hand them a track and scare them into being a Christian . No wonder people hate Christians , for God 's sake I 'm starting to hate Christians. `` Maybe you should follow your own advice ... jim : Yes , God loves Saddam but He hates the way he is acting .""",DISAGREE,"""Good Lord , grow up .""","""Yes , God loves""",,
5860,1559,"""`` I do feel threatened . I do feel harmed , `` said Assemblyman Brian Kolb ( R-Canandaigua ) . '' It 's a direct challenge to me and how I was brought up. ``""","""So it seems that gay people and our families are to remain 2nd class citizens to preserve this evil mans heterosexual privledge . How is it that `` the way he was brought up `` is more important then protecting gay people ? What of they way gay people were brought up ? What about the threat to our freedom that Brian Kolb and his evil religion and political party represents ? I was brought up by my father , taught in school that all people are equal . His refusal to extend marriage to gay people is a threat to me and I do feel harmed and it is a challenge to the way I was brought up . I do live in Michigan and not in New York but his evil statements and attitude are the same here if not worse . I was shocked to find out the Romney was the son of a former Michigan governor and that he is from Michigan . Does figure with all the anti gay religious nut cases that are swarming in the woods here in Michigan .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's a direct challenge to me and how I was brought up. ``""","""How is it that `` the way he was brought up `` is more important then protecting gay people ?""",,
5878,1565,"""Answers include but are not limited to : • People need a solution for the Problem of Evil . • People want to have an `` objective `` standard for good and evil . • God said it , I believe it , that settles it .""","""Mormons believe that Satan is the brother of Jesus .""",DISAGREE,"""People need a solution for the Problem of Evil .""","""Mormons believe that Satan is the brother of Jesus .""",,
5884,1567,"""You talked about a 'natural bias ' that would stop evolution in its tracks . You 're going to have to be more specific about what 'stopping evolution in its tracks ' means . Do you mean preventing inheritable variation ? Preventing natural selection ? Preventing gene flow ? What ?""","""Things like future proof of a young earth - evolution needs billons of years . Or proof of severe weather conditions that would destroy the evolutionary process . Life on earth dies completely if it gets out of a fairly narrow temperature range , any time during those billions of years .""",DISAGREE,"""Preventing natural selection ? Preventing gene flow ? What ?""","""Things like future proof of a young earth - evolution needs billons of years .""",,
5887,1568,"""And you do n't have clam 's clue what my theory is , anyway .""","""YOu know this how ? Because I did n't post in those threads ( mainly ) ? If you check my posting style I tend to weigh in when I think something needs to be said . Other than that I generally just read without comment . I seem to recall commenting on your style of summing people up at range before ....""",DISAGREE,"""And you do n't have clam 's clue what my theory is , anyway .""","""YOu know this how ?""",,
5896,1571,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for centuries . I 've just gotten tired of it -- and righteously so .""","""haha , so because of this you should make fun of men and not women ? That makes no sense but I figured you 'd say this .""",DISAGREE,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for 've just gotten tired of it -- and righteously so .""","""so because of this you should make fun of men and not women ? That makes no sense but I figured you 'd say this .""",,
5912,1575,"""Notice he is from a baptist church . The most bigest < term that has been banned > are baptists or catholic .""","""Really ? ? ? Maybe you should do a little research before you make sweeping statements like that . -- http : //www.rainbowbaptists.org/""",DISAGREE,"""Notice he is from a baptist church . The most baptists or catholic .""","""http : //www.rainbowbaptists.org/""",,
5932,1580,"""Nature does n't allow homosexual sex to create life , to reproduce , and though humans use sex as entertainment , it obviously was meant for a greater purpose . Biology shows us we need both male and female to create life , that male and male does n't create life , that indivdual gratification does n't create life . If you want to attach relgious or philosophical significance to sex you may at this juncture . That is why I think it is wrong . Humanity would n't be around if homosexuality were the standard , homosexuals would n't exist without heterosexuals . You may be looking for a more fundamental `` morality `` to my basis . I choose to validate my beliefs on science and years of living proof of heterosexualitie 's superiority , and when I mean hetero superiority I mean strict hetero adhearance , no socially unacceptable behavior being thrown in like `` cheating `` or `` rape `` .""","""Really ? If `` nature `` meant for all things to reproduce through heterosexual methods then maybe all other forms of reproduction would not exist , hmm . They would have been `` eliminated `` because heterosexuality is far superior . Think again . The majority of organisms on this planet reproduce using binary fission ( bacteria dividing ) , asexual reproduction ( there goes your `` individual gratification argument ) , and zygotic reproduction . None of these things require sexes of any type . Even animals that have `` normal `` sexual reproduction can reproduce using a process known as parthenogenesis , in which only a female is required to produce offspring ( turkeys and lizards do this ) . If homosexuality is n't natural or is inferior , then why do we see examples of it in nature . The bonobo ( closely related to the chimpanzee ) exhibits heterosexual and homosexual activity in both genders in the wild , and the bonobo and humans share a very common ancestor . Look , you ca n't say that one way of reproduction is `` the standard `` since it is clear that different species reproduce in a variety of ways . You also ca n't say that homosexuality is a disorder if you follow your previous logic that what is `` natural `` is valid . Also , you said that heterosexuality is superior because it has a `` greater purpose `` . By implying that something has a purpose , you stray from the realm of Science by assuming a teleology . If you want to assume that things were given `` purpose `` by some higher being , that 's fine , but you 'll have to stick to religion to defend your argument . In science , it is impossible to assume a purpose . For example , what is the purpose of a river ? To flow to the ocean ? To carve a canyon ? To carry sediment ? You can say what something is good at doing , or what it does , but you can not say what it was `` made `` for ( purpose ) without implying some grand design that can be easily provided by your local religion . As for hetero and homosexuality , it can be said that heterosexuals are better at producing offspring than homosexuals . Does that automatically make heterosexuality superior based on the arbitrary criterion of number of offspring produced ? So in the eyes of a value system that believes that something is valued higher that creates more offspring or `` life `` , heterosexuality would be superior . But in the eyes of science and reason , your argument does n't hold water .""",DISAGREE,"""Nature does n't allow homosexual sex to create life Humanity would n't be around if homosexuality were the standard , homosexuals would n't exist without heterosexuals . ``""","""heterosexual methods then maybe all other forms of reproduction You also ca n't say that homosexuality is a disorder if you follow your previous logic that what is `` natural `` is valid .""",,
5947,1584,"""`` The Delaware Department of Justice initially insisted to The News that gun purchasers must declare who the weapon was intended for so that person 's background could be checked . Yesterday , a spokeswoman for the Delaware Department of Justice said it misinterpreted the law and that Brady was not obligated to state that the gun was for her son as long as he was legally qualified to own a firearm .""","""Form 4473 , question 11a reads as follows : 11. a . Are you the actual buyer of the firearm ( s ) listed on this form ? Warning : You are no the actual buyer if you are acquiring the firearm ( s ) on behalf of another person . If you are not the actual buyer , the dealer can not transfer the firearm ( s ) to you . Sarah Brady lied on the background check form , she bought the gun on behalf of her son and supplied it to him , thus ensuring that he would n't have to worry about the NICS check red flagging him . By gun control standards she 's guilty of a straw purchase and should 've been sentenced to ten years without parole in a federal prison .""",DISAGREE,"""gun purchasers must declare who the weapon was intended for so that person 's background could be checked""","""Form 4473 , question 11a reads as follows : 11. a . Are you the actual buyer of the firearm ( s ) listed on this form ?""",,
5985,1596,"""11 ) Show me one instance of natural selection proven by controlled experiment . Heck , show me one controlled experiment attempting to test natural selection .""","""Pretty much every experiment ever carried out in a petri-dish ; take your pick Also the revisited peppered moth experiment I linked to earlier .""",DISAGREE,"""show me one controlled experiment attempting to test natural selection""","""take your pick""",,
5994,1598,"""Why conception ? When a mature ovum leaves the ovary , it has every potential of turning into a human being . How dare I stand idly by while that potential life is wasted , unfertilized ? No ; clearly , it is my duty to try to reach that ovum with my seed . God said to be fruitful and multiply , so I am just following God 's will . They also went through the `` stage `` of being an unfertilized ovum . What about all the ova that were n't fertilized ? ! Just wasted , completely wasted and forgotten ! THE HUMANITY ! OH GOD ! ! ! Or , spend three months pregnant and then get an abortion , then you lose only one `` potential `` human instead of four . ( WHY MENSTRUAL CYCLES , GOD , WHY ? ! ) NOTE : To clear up any misconception , I am not promoting , condoning , or admitting to the act of rape . This is simply parody of what happens when we use unrealistic standards . I 'm sure that Joe does n't promote the rape of women to prevent the passing of unfertilized ova , but I think that his lack of doing so is inconsistent with his position expounded upon above . Bull hockey . Precautions occasionally fail . You can make an argument against the `` irresponsible `` pregnancies , but you ca n't lump every abortion into the group . Even Archie ran away when I nailed him on this one . Only in this country ? You ( purposely , no doubt ) overlooked the issue of whether they are `` people. `` Hell , by menstruating , women murder every month according to your logic .""","""The abortion issue is one that rightwingers use to threaten women and keep them `` in their place. ``""",DISAGREE,"""God said to be fruitful and multiply , so I am just following God 's will""","""abortion issue is one that rightwingers use to threaten women""",,
5999,1599,"""Why do you think the dude in the article said how `` depressing `` all this is ?""","""That 's not what he said . Why do you find it necessary to lie ? But of course , you are quoting a news story . I have had experience with news stories that purport to quote what someone has said .""",DISAGREE,"""you think the dude in the article said how `` depressing ``""","""I have had experience with news stories that purport to quote""",,
6000,1599,"""Why do you think the dude in the article said how `` depressing `` all this is ?""","""That 's not what he said . Why do you find it necessary to lie ? But of course , you are quoting a news story . I have had experience with news stories that purport to quote what someone has said .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do you think the dude in the article said how `` depressing `` all this is ?""","""That 's not what he said . Why do you find it necessary to lie ? But of course , you are quoting a news story""",,
6004,1600,"""I have been on the local board of education for 2 years now and have never heard the phrase `` Young Earth Creationists `` in any official capacity , nor has anybody ever suggested that it be taught .""","""Of course not . That battle has already been lost . Creationism is religion and it can not be taught in a science class , even when it is called `` creation science `` and the data is distorted and mininterpreted . The most recent attempt by creationists in Kansas on the State Board ( and yes , they were YECs ) was to eliminate all requirements to teach evolution , and all references to an old earth from all curriculum standards .""",DISAGREE,"""have never heard the phrase `` Young Earth Creationists `` in any official capacity""","""Creationism is religion and it can not be taught in a science class , even when it is called `` creation""",,
6013,1601,"""I disagree I hear it all the time . What are you going to do when science fills in the gaps and such nonsense .""","""Umm ... thats the point of saying God of the Gaps - when science fills in the gaps then there is less for your God to do .""",DISAGREE,"""I disagree I hear it all the time . What are you going to do when science fills in the gaps and such nonsense .""","""the point of saying God of the Gaps - when science fills in the gaps then there is less for your God to do .""",,
6021,1602,"""No worries mate . Brooklyn 's 81st Precinct probed by NYPD for fudging stats ; felonies allegedly marked as misdemeanors New York cops 'fudge ' stats like the Tories to make their `` strict gun laws `` look more compatible to the States that do not have draconian anti gun laws and need not depend on the cops protecting you when they have no duty to do so . I have been following UK stats for a long time and no matter who is in power , the crime rates increase . Often the perp is set free and the victem is the one punished like the incident you mentioned : Pushing someone out the way while attempting to escape is a violent crime under UK law .""","""You realise I 'm talking about if the burglar is running away , not the householder , right ? Looking at it again I realise I may not have phrased it clearly enough . I 'm saying that some of those `` violent `` crimes may simply have been burglars pegging it when disturbed .""",DISAGREE,"""Often the perp is set free and the victem is the one punished like the incident you mentioned : Pushing someone out the way while attempting to escape is a violent crime under UK law .""","""You realise I 'm talking about if the burglar is running away , not the householder""",,
6026,1603,"""So much for 'genetic altruism '""","""Well not exactly . The article addresses some commonality in humans and chimps with regard to altruism exhibited toward chimpanzees who are not known to the chimp exhibiting the behavior . The point was to draw a possible parallel between human altrusim which is known to go beyond mere kinship selection and the chimp behaviors which also appear to go beyond kinship-selection . The discussion goes to the fact that humans and chimps share a common ancestor at the point where humans and chimps went their separate evolutionary pathways . One possibility is that such a common ancestor may have had the capacity to also be altruistic to individuals outside its kinship group . Or of course that chimps and humans both developed their respective altruistic behaviors independently after the branch point . None of this negates the concept of biological altruism in the form of kinship selection which a geneticall based effect . Indeed the article recognizes that chimps DO exhibit kinship selection effects ! There is of course no reason at al that one can not have kinship selection as well as other motivators for altruistic behavior . So its rather premature to take kinship selection ( which I think is what WW means by genetic altruisim ) off the table just yet . The article certainly does not draw the same conclusions as WW would have it do . Once more the rabbit hops over the actual work to his own preferred conclusion . SOP for the lagomorph .""",DISAGREE,"""So much for 'genetic altruism '""","""Well not exactly . The article addresses some commonality in humans and chimps with regard to altruism exhibited toward chimpanzees""",,
6034,1605,"""There is a huge difference in the things he described above , and what science does to determine what happened billions of years ago , what chance , evolutionary principles affect human behavior - countless other philosophical things that science involves itself in .""","""I do n't see a huge difference . The same methodology science used to come up with sonograms and amniocentesis was used to come up with evolution . After all , both sonic imaging and amniocentesis are theories .""",DISAGREE,"""what science does to determine what happened billions of years ago , what chance , evolutionary principles affect human""","""I do n't see a huge difference .""",,
6037,1605,"""There is a huge difference in the things he described above , and what science does to determine what happened billions of years ago , what chance , evolutionary principles affect human behavior - countless other philosophical things that science involves itself in .""","""I do n't see a huge difference . The same methodology science used to come up with sonograms and amniocentesis was used to come up with evolution . After all , both sonic imaging and amniocentesis are theories .""",DISAGREE,"""There is a huge difference in the things he described above""","""I do n't see a huge difference""",,
6056,1608,"""My point was that just because an animal has features that resemble different animals does n't mean it has evolved from them .""","""But who has claimed that it is so ? Certainly not evolutionary biologists . So you are claiming that since birds fly and bumblebees fly that evolutionary biologists claim that birds evolved from bumblefbees ? And since the snout of a Platypus ( you did n't even invest the integrity to learn how to spell that correctly , did you ? ) has a superficial resemblence to a duck , it must be that evolutionary biologists are asserting that the platypus evolved from a duck . I 'm still waiting for an explanation of where you studied evolution , by the way . You assured us that it was a `` detailed `` study . And yet , you display your total ignorance by equating evolution to `` gotten better. ``""",DISAGREE,"""does n't mean it has evolved from them .""","""I 'm still waiting for an explanation of where you studied evolution""",,
6076,1612,"""The following is from an article ,  “ What Drives Evolution ” from LliveScience , and quoting Pigluicci . Perhaps someone who has been here long enough to acquire such privilege can post the link for me . Wascally Wabbit ?""","""* * Sorry , b. I went to livescience and to pigliucci , but could not find the link . You can send it to me , PM or email , and I 'll post it for you .""",DISAGREE,"""to can for""","""I went to livescience and to pigliucci""",,
6081,1613,""" “ To announce that there must be no criticism of the president , or that we are to stand by the president , right or wrong , is not only unpatriotic and servile , but is morally treasonable to the American public. ” — Theodore Roosevelt""","""I see that you have adopted my signature line ( slightly misquoted ) . I will yield to you and remove mine today . We must agree that Teddy was a great Liberal President . Dono""",AGREE,"""To announce that there must be no criticism of the president , or that we are to stand by the president , right or wrong , is not only unpatriotic and servile , but is morally treasonable to the American public. — Theodore Roosevelt""","""We must agree that Teddy was a great Liberal President .""",,
6091,1616,"""I believe there is special dispensation for those who 've never had a chance to hear the Good News . The last Pope mentioned something dealing with this a few years ago IIRC . This is also why the great commision for Christians is Evangelism .""","""But you know what really does n't make sense ? Why are they evangelising to people ( who they know most of them will reject them ) if those people get a special dispensation ? They 'd be condemning people to hell by evangelizing , would they not ? Why not leave the people be and let them get the special dispensation ?""",DISAGREE,"""The last Pope mentioned something dealing with this a few years ago IIRC .""","""But you know what really does n't make sense""",,
6094,1617,"""What a crock . I find myself loving when you go on and on so that I can continue to wail on you with the Truth Stick of No Mercy™ . It 's usually you who is responsible for shutting yourself up . No , you 're branded as a religious zealot when you make arguments that people who do n't share your exact beliefs should have their rights taken away . Liberals were responsible for things like abolition of slavery and women 's suffrage that overturned the oh-so-traditional status quo . Now we 're working toward death with dignity for the terminally ill , reasonable gun control , access to abortion and contraception ( without sparking the ire of fundy parents and community members ) ... are these things that are despised by the rest of the world ? No , but things like slavery , sexism , rampant crime , and politicization of private issues are . The main cause of so much hate and disrespect is the phony war we 're fighting and our tactics in violation of international law , our attitude of superiority in the world , and our outright bullying of others , all of which are being pushed the most by -- you guessed it -- not liberals . No , Archie , you and your boys can take the blame for that one . Archie 's projection complex strikes again ! Pretty much , we can take whatever Archie says and know that the truth is the precise opposite .""","""Do n't be too sure of yourself because he 's said a lot more truthful things in his life than you could hope to say . also your `` science `` is scissors , glue , and tape . no proof of it exists if the earth was millions of years old than there would be no fossils of dinosaurs and people and do n't say preseservative because they do n't last that long ill let you think about that""",DISAGREE,"""Archie 's projection complex strikes again ! Pretty much , we can take whatever Archie says and know that the truth is the precise opposite .""","""Do n't be too sure of yourself because he 's said a lot more truthful things in his life than you could hope to say . also your `` science `` is scissors , glue , and tape .""",,
6100,1626,"""Here 's a quote from mayr regarding selection , `` Only relatively few individuals in a given generation would qaulify and survive the selection procedure . That small sample would be able to preserve only a small amount of the whole variance of the parental population . Such survival selection would be highly restrained. `` What Evolution Is . pg . 118 So .... do you evolutionists agree with this ? Let 's take humans . Are only a few people in this generation `` fit `` enough to go on to breed ? Is Mayr smoking crack or what ? ? ? ? ? ? This theory is pathetic .""","""And what is the full quote ? Was it talking about , lets say for example , tutles , where over 90 percent of them die before reaching adulthood ? In many species , that is true . The 'rule of thumb ' is that the more individuals do not reach adulthood , the more offspring that species has .""",DISAGREE,"""relatively few individuals in a given generation would qaulify and survive the selection procedure .""","""The 'rule of thumb ' is that the more individuals do not reach adulthood , the more offspring that species has .""",,
6117,1632,"""What I 'd prefer is that the candidates be honest about their views , whether it 's popular or unpopular . But even knowing we 're talking about political candidates ( who may lie to get votes ) , when a candidate says something is his or her view , I think we have to take them at what they say when they answer a question like that so directly and emphatically . Otherwise , there 's little point in asking questions to begin with other than maybe watching the reaction of body language and how they would respond under pressure , and so forth . Political discourse has to operate to where when a candidate gives a given view as HIS or HER view , they are taken at their word that IS their view . '' No `` ca n't mean `` yes `` and so forth .""","""No , that 's too niave an approach . We know politicians are going to tell some lies , I trust that 's a given . We , as political consumers , ca n't simply take politicians at their word . If we want to make informed decisions about candidates we need to develop the skills to make useful judgement calls about what they 're saying . We need to figure out how often they lie , what they lie about , how big their lies are . Obviously we should n't need to do this , it would be great if we could actually take our politicians at their word . Bad the sad reality is that we ca n't , not at this stage anyway . In this particular case , if Biden says he does n't support gay marriage I 'm just as likely to think it 's because he knows that open support could cost him the White House as any other reason . It 's sad that such double speak is needed , I 'd love it if enough courageous politicians stood forth and ended the political need for lies , but until that wonderful day I 'm not going to be naive and take everything they say at their word , nor am I going to jump up and down and point fingers at every falsehood . I 'll try to judge the politicians by their actions , and their lies by their magnitude , scope , and quantity .""",DISAGREE,"""What I 'd prefer is that the candidates be honest about their views , whether it 's popular or unpopular . ''""","""No , that 's too niave an approach .""",,
6124,1633,"""Despite all your hoplophobia , governments have killed more people , their own people in the last century than all wars combined . That is an indisputable fact .""","""What does this have to do with nations like England having lower murder rates ? Try to stay on topic .""",DISAGREE,"""governments have killed more people That is an indisputable fact .""","""What does this have to do with nations like England having lower murder rates ? stay on topic .""",,
6149,1635,"""No they could n't .""","""Oh , OK then .""",DISAGREE,"""No they could n't .""","""OK then .""",,
6159,1636,"""In order to study intelligence , it is essential to know and understand motivation , and motivation can not be known or understood without first knowing and understanding the value system of the entity under study .""","""Well , sort of . It is n't necessary , but if you 're predicting intelligence from what someone does rather than direct measurements of physical properties , knowing their motivation level might allow you to make more accurate predictions . Nevertheless even without knowing the subjects ' motivations at all , today 's generic intelligence tests still have excellent predictive power for success in both school and employment , and are perhaps better predictors for future success than any other method we have ( including interviews , personality inventories , aptitude in a particular field )""",DISAGREE,"""know and understand motivation , and motivation can not be known or understood""","""today 's generic intelligence tests still have excellent predictive power""",,
6160,1636,"""In order to study intelligence , it is essential to know and understand motivation , and motivation can not be known or understood without first knowing and understanding the value system of the entity under study .""","""Well , sort of . It is n't necessary , but if you 're predicting intelligence from what someone does rather than direct measurements of physical properties , knowing their motivation level might allow you to make more accurate predictions . Nevertheless even without knowing the subjects ' motivations at all , today 's generic intelligence tests still have excellent predictive power for success in both school and employment , and are perhaps better predictors for future success than any other method we have ( including interviews , personality inventories , aptitude in a particular field )""",DISAGREE,"""In order to study intelligence , it is essential to know and understand motivation , and motivation can not be known or understood without first knowing and understanding the value system of the entity under study .""","""Well , sort of . It is n't necessary , but if you 're predicting intelligence from what someone does rather than direct measurements of physical properties ,""",,
6176,1638,"""Democracy determines what is morally acceptable in this country . WE have prositution legalized in Nevada but other states do not accept it . That is democracy . The people decide what is `` right `` and `` wrong `` based upon teh criteria that is conforming to the constituion .""","""Well on this one , I will just say : read jitobears responce .""",AGREE,"""The people decide what is `` right `` and `` wrong `` based upon teh criteria that is conforming to the constituion .""","""read jitobears responce""",,
6177,1638,"""Democracy determines what is morally acceptable in this country . WE have prositution legalized in Nevada but other states do not accept it . That is democracy . The people decide what is `` right `` and `` wrong `` based upon teh criteria that is conforming to the constituion .""","""Well on this one , I will just say : read jitobears responce .""",AGREE,"""Democracy determines what is morally acceptable in this country . WE have prositution legalized in Nevada but other states do not accept it . That is democracy""","""Well on this one , I will just say : read jitobears responce .""",,
6182,1639,"""Also , to all the woman who have had abortions , do you regret it ? Think about it , that unborn baby you just killed could have been the man who cured cancer , or the doctor who saved a dying baby , or the first female president ever .""","""I 've always disliked this line of logic because it implies that the value of somebody 's life depends on their relative accomplishments and it invites the counter argument that the unborn in question could also become a criminal . Indeed , it has been argued that abortion has reduced crime , poverty , overpopulation and the depletion of natural resources .""",DISAGREE,"""Think about it , that unborn baby you just killed could have been the man who cured cancer , or the doctor who saved a dying baby , or the first female president ever .""","""always disliked this line of logic because it implies that the value of somebody 's life depends on their relative accomplishments""",,
6200,1642,"""You 'd have to explain why other developed nations with a lot less guns also have a much lower murder rate than the US .""","""I have yet to see any conclusive evidence that this is true and undeniable . You wan na prove in an undeniable manner that developed nations around the world have fewer deaths than America ? Then get cracking and gather the evidence . Start proving that the various governments around the world are n't lying about their annual death rates . The UK has been found guilty of continuously altering statistics to make themselves look safer than they really are . So do you have any proof that the annual number of deaths of a country like Germany , are the true number and not some government sponsored , people 's friendly statement to make people feel less afraid ?""",DISAGREE,"""explain why other developed nations with a lot less guns also have a much lower murder rate than the US""","""yet to see any conclusive evidence that this is true and undeniable""",,
6216,1645,"""That 's because legal gun owners ( at least the majority of them ) , are n't criminals . They follow most gun laws .""","""So ? The majority of most people are n't criminals , and follow most laws . How is this different ?""",DISAGREE,"""That 's because legal gun owners ( at least the majority of them ) , are n't criminals .""","""The majority of most people are n't criminals , and follow most laws .""",,
6238,1649,"""You said there are not physical entities . The atheists world in only physical""","""this is not true . the intangible , such as time , ideas and emotions , are just as real to atheists as anybody else . atheists dont subscribe to a spiritual realm , but that doesnt mean they dont agree on the existence of the non-physical . there is a difference""",DISAGREE,"""You said there are not physical entities .""","""this is not true .""",,
6240,1649,"""You said there are not physical entities . The atheists world in only physical""","""this is not true . the intangible , such as time , ideas and emotions , are just as real to atheists as anybody else . atheists dont subscribe to a spiritual realm , but that doesnt mean they dont agree on the existence of the non-physical . there is a difference""",DISAGREE,"""You said there are not physical entities . The atheists world in only physical""","""this is not true""",,
6241,1650,"""And I personally wo n't believe anything off of a site like that , nor would I believe anything that I got off a site that was blatantly anti-creationism .""","""Well , where else is the information going to come from ? Nobody else cares about the creation vs. evolution debate except for creationists and evolutionists .""",DISAGREE,"""And I personally wo n't believe anything off of a site like that , nor would I believe anything that I got off a site""","""Nobody else cares about the creation vs. evolution debate except for creationists and evolutionists .""",,
6250,1651,"""And indeed , like Dawkins says , without natural selection there is no darwinism ... there is no evolution ...""","""And with natural selection ? Are you trying to get us to accept your conclusions without providing evidence for your premises ? It does n't work .""",DISAGREE,"""like Dawkins says , without natural selection there is no darwinism ... there is no evolution ...""","""Are you trying to get us to accept your conclusions without providing evidence for your premises ? It does n't work""",,
6251,1651,"""And indeed , like Dawkins says , without natural selection there is no darwinism ... there is no evolution ...""","""And with natural selection ? Are you trying to get us to accept your conclusions without providing evidence for your premises ? It does n't work .""",DISAGREE,"""without natural selection there is no darwinism ... there is no evolution ...""","""Are you trying to get us to accept your conclusions without providing evidence for your premises ? It does n't work""",,
6262,1653,"""I do n't disagree but since we 'd prohibited felons from buying firearms ( new ones anyway ) , we have created the NICS system . Why would n't we want to apply it to all transactions ?""","""Because you 've presented no credible evidence to support the claims that private transactions are an established and major source of firearms for criminals . If you ca n't prove it 's broken , you do n't have grounds to call for fixing it .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't disagree but since we 'd prohibited felons from buying firearms (""","""Because you 've presented no credible evidence to support the claims""",,
6267,1654,"""Maybe they sincerely think that most people have a perfect perception of how far 4 , or 8 , or thousands of light years are .""","""On the contrary , anyone who takes an interest in such things is well placed to appreciate just how hard it is to grasp such distances .""",DISAGREE,"""Maybe they sincerely think that most people have a perfect perception""","""anyone who takes an interest in such things is well placed to appreciate""",,
6276,1655,"""[ Me : ] Herbert Spencer has become famous for his `` Social Darwinism. `` But the irony here is , Spencer was pushing his ideas for more than a decade BEFORE the Origin was published . It is a mischaracterization of history to claim that Spencer 's ideas have anything to do with the `` implications `` of evolution at all .""","""You then cite the Wikipedia entry on Spencer :""",DISAGREE,"""But the irony here is , Spencer was pushing his ideas for more than a decade BEFORE the Origin""","""You then cite the Wikipedia entry on Spencer""",,
6280,1656,"""Will you `` allow `` us to focus on ONE thing ? You see , if we have a list of 4 things , and we go through them one by one , we can maybe arrive at the end ! ! ! Crazy thought is n't it !""","""Which thing are you now focusing on ? My God ? All theories relating to a god ? God being knowable or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""allow `` us to focus on ONE thing ?""","""Which thing are you now focusing on ? My God ?""",,
6282,1656,"""Will you `` allow `` us to focus on ONE thing ? You see , if we have a list of 4 things , and we go through them one by one , we can maybe arrive at the end ! ! ! Crazy thought is n't it !""","""Which thing are you now focusing on ? My God ? All theories relating to a god ? God being knowable or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""Will you `` allow `` us to focus on ONE thing""","""Which thing are you now focusing on ?""",,
6306,1662,"""The term PACS stands for Pacte Civil de Solidarité , which was introduced into French law on 15 November 1999 . Put simply , a PACS is a contract signed by two people of the same sex or opposite sex , who are over 18 years old and want to organise their life together . It ’ s an agreement that can not be entered into by two people who are part of the same family , who are already married or who are already part of a PACS . The contract – which can prepared by the parties themselves or by their lawyer - is registered together with all relevant documents at the registered office of the civil court in the area where the couple live . The couple are free to detail their obligations to each other in the contract . But in any case by law they are obliged to help and assist each other . The precise level of support is proportional to their income . The couple are jointly responsible for any debts incurred by the other through normal daily living – but not if those expenses are deemed excessive . All other debts remain an individual ’ s personal responsibility . Unless the couple have decided to hold their assets in common according to the system of  ‘ indivision ’ - where each item bought after the PACS is signed is deemed to belong jointly to both of the partners - the estates of each partner remain separate . Each partner remains the owner of the assets he or she buys - and responsible for his or her debts . The main advantages of a PACS are concerned with tax . The  ‘ pacsés ’ as they are known in France benefit from being taxed as a couple - and not as two separate individuals . This can often reduce their overall income tax burden And since August 2007 , the surviving partner of a PACS benefits from the same inheritance tax regime as a surviving spouse in a married couple - which means there are no death duties to pay .""","""Bonus question : ( Can you spot the grammatical error within the quoted text ? )""",DISAGREE,"""The term PACS stands for Pacte Civil de Solidarité , which was introduced into French law on 15 November 1999 .""","""Can you spot the grammatical error within the quoted text ? )""",,
6325,1666,"""it would be full of rapist , murderers , etc. , along with Hitler , Bin Laden , and all the other murderers who kill in the name of god . Would I want to goto heaven with them ? No . It would be a sad place .""","""Terrible logic . The first problem is , 99 % of the people who truly love Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior are not rapists , murderers , etc . The second problem is , God loving a person and that person going to Heaven are completely different things . It 's God 's love that allows you to go to Heaven . Crim-""",DISAGREE,"""it would be full of rapist , murderers , etc. , along with Hitler , Bin Laden , and all the other murderers""","""The first problem is , 99 % of the people who truly love Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior are not rapists , murderers , etc""",,
6334,1675,"""This entire issue was dealt with on this threat here , starting at post 250 .""","""You either did not read my post thoroughly , or are intentional misrepresenting me . Post 250 ( which I had actually read before starting this thread ) is nothing but DamEtel rambling about homologies between vertebrae embryos . That has absolutely nothing to do with the unexplained homologies that the Denton talks about . Evolution simply can not , reasonably speaking , account for the homology between your arm and leg , among other examples .""",DISAGREE,"""This entire issue was dealt with on this threat here , starting at post 250 .""","""Post 250 ( which I had actually read before starting this thread ) is nothing but DamEtel rambling about homologies between vertebrae embryos .""",,
6348,1677,"""Would depend on how sucessful they thought the handing in was , but do n't you have to register for a leicence ? So all legal owners are know already and can be checked off against the guns they have handed in , I would imagine that there must be departments of the police who deal with tracking black market unregisted guns so these could be cracked down opon . In addition you would have to make possesion of a firearm illegal , then you have to balance defending your property with revealing you are commiting a crime ( will be fairly obvious if you use one and you would have to get rid of it anyway when forensics investigate the crime scene ) . Would also have to look at countries that have carried out sucessful ones to see if there are any little points or mistakes to pick up . If there is a lot of resistance you could make possesion of a gun attempted murder , would make people think very carefully whether they would want to carry them , especailly criminals- comunity service or light sentace for a mugging or long term prison sentance for attempted murder if they are carrying a gun while doing it , even in bank robbery they would likely think twice about the additional years .""","""Wow ehat a brave new world you live in .... Now lets say just 1 % of all gun owners resisted ( in the us that is several hundred thousand peppered through the land ) . With media attention to such infighting between government and citizens how do you deal with this ?""",DISAGREE,"""So all legal owners are know already and can be checked off against the guns they have handed in , I would imagine that there must be departments of the police who deal with tracking black market unregisted guns so these could be cracked down opon .""","""Wow ehat a brave new world you live in .... Now lets say just 1 % of all gun owners resisted""",,
6350,1678,"""Just a question for you - hypothetical What would happen if we took a bunch of people , stuck them on a planet with no access to any knowledge of God or Christ - and say we left them there for a couple hundred thousand years . Are they more likely to come to the conclusion that Genesis 1 & amp ; 2 happened , some other random story of religious creation , or something a little closer to what scientists have come up with ? Be honest !""","""I 'm always honest ! It would become a completely atheist planet in no time - what makes the earth different is Christ 's teaching and actions while he was here , and the following ACTS of those who witnessed it . His Disciples ( mainly Peter ) were scared little rabbits while he was alive , and after his resurection , were n't afraid of anything . That historical fact and other similar ones have had quite an impact for Christianity . The debate about whether God exists or not is n't only about the origin/science debates .""",DISAGREE,"""What would happen if we took a bunch of people , stuck them on a planet with no access to any knowledge of God or Christ""","""His Disciples ( mainly Peter ) were scared little rabbits while he was alive , and after his resurection , were n't afraid of anything . That historical fact and other similar ones have had quite an impact for Christianity .""",,
6356,1679,"""5 ) Moving on , if we look teh other way , evolution is actually a theory not physically proven , one of it s theory suggested that human started out in Africa while another in Asia , but if u look at them none resembles the other and none have a characteristic of an animal .""","""And of course , the theory of gravity is n't `` physically `` proven either . Neither is the heliocentric theory or atomic theory or the germ theory of disease . However , evolution has been observed to occur and the current theories are the best explanations that we have for the observations . As far as your mangling of the `` Out of Africa `` theory , it would be nice if you actually learned what you are talking about before you babble such nonsense .""",DISAGREE,"""Moving on , if we look teh other way , evolution is actually a theory not physically proven ,""","""And of course , the theory of gravity is n't `` physically `` proven either .""",,
6359,1679,"""5 ) Moving on , if we look teh other way , evolution is actually a theory not physically proven , one of it s theory suggested that human started out in Africa while another in Asia , but if u look at them none resembles the other and none have a characteristic of an animal .""","""And of course , the theory of gravity is n't `` physically `` proven either . Neither is the heliocentric theory or atomic theory or the germ theory of disease . However , evolution has been observed to occur and the current theories are the best explanations that we have for the observations . As far as your mangling of the `` Out of Africa `` theory , it would be nice if you actually learned what you are talking about before you babble such nonsense .""",DISAGREE,"""evolution is actually a theory not physically proven""","""the theory of gravity is n't `` physically `` proven either . Neither is the heliocentric theory or atomic theory or the germ theory of disease .""",,
6365,1680,"""The National Guard interpretation of the militia is totally false . The NG is a standing army . The militia is not . The NG can be federalized . The militia can not . They wear the same uniforms . The officers all know each other and play golf together . If the NG is the militia , then I want to have stock plies of weapons at schools , hospitals , libraries , and churches . No federalization of NG . Complete and total seperation of NG from federal influence , communication , and socializatlion , right down to even different uniforms .""","""We are saying the same thing .""",AGREE,"""The National Guard interpretation of the militia is totally false .""","""We are saying the same thing .""",,
6369,1681,"""Very often , it is irresponsible sexual practices or insufficiently responsible sex that leads to the unwanted pregnancies that lead to abortion . By reducing the number of unwanted pregnancies through proper contraceptive use ( including doubling up to reduce pregnancy risk ) or abstinence for those that can be convinced , one would then automatically reduce the number of abortions . I think this is one area where our two sides actually agree in the general idea that it would be good to reduce the number of abortions by reducing the number of unwanted pregnancies . Imagine what could be accomplished if our sides actually worked together in this direction . I think that the devil is in the details , though , in how each of our sides would work to achieve this . So , what are your views on how best to decrease the number of unwanted pregnancies and why do you hold those views ? Do you advocate teaching abstinence only ? Teaching proper contraceptive use in school ? Other ideas ?""","""I think you should teach everything about pregnancy and sex . The problem comes in when no one takes your seriously . Abortion allows for a no consequence view on sex . It 's like teaching the dangers of steroids in baseball yet the consequence is to take a 1 day class on substantive abuse if you get caught . Of course the rewards are much better . Same thing with attitude towards sex . If you have that fail-safe than the consequences really are n't too bad so preventing pregnancies becomes harder .""",DISAGREE,"""Very often , it is irresponsible sexual practices or insufficiently responsible sex that leads to the unwanted pregnancies that lead to abortion .""","""I think you should teach everything about pregnancy and sex .""",,
6382,1685,"""1 . It is wrong to ntentionally kill innocent human beings .""","""Of course .""",AGREE,"""It is wrong to ntentionally kill innocent human beings""","""Of course""",,
6388,1687,"""'' If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father and mother ... they shall take him to the gates of that town ... and all the men of the town shall stone him. `` - Deut . 21:18""","""Amazing how you simply took out the parts of the verse that did n't support your arguement . '' If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him , his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town . They shall say to the elders , `` This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious . He will not obey us . He is a profligate and a drunkard. `` Then all the men of his town shall stone him to death . You must purge the evil from among you . All Israel will hear of it and be afraid. `` Profligate : completely given up to dissipation and licentiousness . Licentiousness : lacking legal or moral restraints ; especially : disregarding sexual restraints""",DISAGREE,"""If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father and mother ... they shall take him to the gates of that town ... and all the men of the town shall stone him. `` - Deut . 21:18""","""did n't support your arguement . '' If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him , his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town . They shall say to the elders , `` This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious . He will not obey us . He is a profligate and a drunkard. `` Then all the men of his town shall stone him to death . You must purge the evil from among you . All Israel will hear of it and be afraid. ``""",,
6420,1711,"""Of course I believe an unborn fetus is simply an unborn child . The only difference is that the unborn has no means of survival without the mother and is not recognized as being a living person . I do n't wish that this child should be killed , but as I said before it can be for the best . And if you really do believe in heaven , then the child is going there anyways . Why would you wish a life of suffering on it instead of being able to skip all that and go straight to heaven ? This is the type of logic that works against those who believe in a soul since it really does n't make much sense to live on Earth when heaven is a million billion times better . Just to answer your question with a question , how do you know a child would choose life over death when it has never lived ? People commit suicide everyday but I 'm sure they would also choose life over death if they had been in a better situation . Perhaps this is being too extreme . A person would likely choose to live when faced with death , but whether it logically make sense is another question . People will try to live through starvation , sickness , and misery because it is what their mind tells them to do . Is it really best that they are alive ?""","""Stephen Hawkins would have a very good chance of being aborted today . What if Einstein would have been aborted ? What if , what if , what if ... How do we know what would happen at any time whith anyone if they were simply allowed to live and not be killed before they were born ? I do n't know if anyone would want to live if they got a glimpse of heaven . I know I want to go there . But my beliefs do n't allow me to kill myself to get there . Nor do they allow the justification of murder by saying the child is better off .""",DISAGREE,"""Of course I an unborn fetus is . that the as ,""","""would a of . if ? , to live and not be I do n't want heaven go there the the child is""",,
6421,1712,"""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""","""What makes you think I do n't . Yours is not the only religion on earth ! ! And I did n't just jump to the concluision that your soul needed concern , so do n't jump to it with me .""",DISAGREE,"""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""","""so do n't jump to it with me .""",,
6424,1712,"""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""","""What makes you think I do n't . Yours is not the only religion on earth ! ! And I did n't just jump to the concluision that your soul needed concern , so do n't jump to it with me .""",DISAGREE,"""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny""","""What makes you think I do n't""",,
6429,1713,"""Originally Posted by Archangel : This woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , What evidence do you have of that ? Tiger Woods is black and he said he felt entitled . Personally , I think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""Tiger is entitled . Because of his money and fame , he 's entitled to some hot and not-so-hot action .""",DISAGREE,"""Archangel : woman is a jerk feels entitled because she black , What do you have that ? Tiger Woods is black and he entitled . Personally , I some of the racists are liberals who want to keep blacks on their government-paid plantation .""","""Tiger is . Because of his and , he entitled to hot and not-so-hot""",,
6430,1713,"""Originally Posted by Archangel : This woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , What evidence do you have of that ? Tiger Woods is black and he said he felt entitled . Personally , I think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""Tiger is entitled . Because of his money and fame , he 's entitled to some hot and not-so-hot action .""",DISAGREE,"""This woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , What evidence do you have of that ? Tiger Woods is black and he said he felt entitled .""","""Tiger is entitled . Because of his money and fame , he 's entitled to some hot and not-so-hot action .""",,
6432,1713,"""Originally Posted by Archangel : This woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , What evidence do you have of that ? Tiger Woods is black and he said he felt entitled . Personally , I think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""Tiger is entitled . Because of his money and fame , he 's entitled to some hot and not-so-hot action .""",DISAGREE,"""What evidence do you have of that ? some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals""","""Tiger is entitled Because of his money and fame""",,
6437,1714,"""5 ) I have answered most of this statement above , but you must also take into account the incredible cooling that must have occurred when boiling-hot water came into contact with billions of cubic miles of next-to-freezing rainy air . You get the picture .""","""Well , let 's think about that for a moment . The earth 's atmosphere has a mass estimated at 5x10^18 kg , and that 's if we count all of it , right up to the troposphere . Three quarters of a billion cubic miles of water would have a mass of around 3x10^21kg , almost a thousand times greater . So even if the heat from the emerging floodwaters was dissipated into the entire atmosphere , the water would only be cooled by about 0.1 degrees before atmospheric temperatures reached equilibrium and no more cooling could occur .""",DISAGREE,"""5 ) I have answered most of this statement above , but you must also take into account the incredible cooling that must have occurred when boiling-hot water came into contact with billions of cubic miles of next-to-freezing rainy air . You get the picture .""","""Well , let 's think about that for a moment . The earth 's atmosphere has a mass estimated at 5x10^18 kg , and that 's if we count all of it , right up to the troposphere . Three quarters of a billion cubic miles of water would have a mass of around 3x10^21kg , almost a thousand times greater . So even if the heat from the emerging floodwaters was dissipated into the entire atmosphere , the water would only be cooled by about 0.1 degrees before atmospheric temperatures reached equilibrium and no more cooling could occur .""",,
6440,1715,"""Well you never know cause your pro life and for the death penalty .""","""That and VOR keeps flip flopping on his positions and he refuses to clarify his contridictions .""",AGREE,"""you never know life and the death .""","""That and VOR and he refuses to clarify his .""",,
6445,1730,"""What could possibly be wrong with my having one ?""","""Well , parts break and it could take a long time to order or be repaired . If you got the bucks , I think two would be a better choice .""",DISAGREE,"""What could possibly be wrong with my having one ?""","""parts break and it could take a long time to order or be repaired , I think two would be a better choice""",,
6447,1730,"""What could possibly be wrong with my having one ?""","""Well , parts break and it could take a long time to order or be repaired . If you got the bucks , I think two would be a better choice .""",DISAGREE,"""wrong with my having one""","""parts break and it could take a long time to order or be repaired""",,
6448,1730,"""What could possibly be wrong with my having one ?""","""Well , parts break and it could take a long time to order or be repaired . If you got the bucks , I think two would be a better choice .""",DISAGREE,"""What could possibly be wrong with my having one ?""","""two would be a better choice .""",,
6453,1731,"""I think this just goes to show what most people already know -- that most out there , including many so-called `` progressives `` , really do n't give a hoot about gay rights when it 's crunch time .""","""And amusingly enough , you who claim you do n't have any interest in changing the outcome spend soooo much time posting on these threads ... Perhaps that 's another claim that 's just false in your opinion ?""",DISAGREE,"""many so-called `` progressives `` , really do n't give a hoot about gay rights when it 's crunch time .""","""you who claim you do n't have any interest in changing the outcome spend soooo much time posting on these threads ... Perhaps that 's another claim that 's just false in your opinion ?""",,
6462,1732,"""The meticulously preserved , unchanging 66 Books of the Bible are n't compelling ?""","""How do you know that this is n't the case ? And , speaking of unchanging , take a look at this . What I am saying is : a ) We do n't have any evidence ( except the bible 's word ) for the authenticity of the bible . Take a look at my signature . b ) The bible may not change , but human society does . I would be more likely to believe the bible if it did n't make claims of ( scientifically ) impossible things , like a worldwide flood or an omnipotent god .""",DISAGREE,"""Bible""","""We do n't have any evidence ( except the bible 's word ) for the authenticity of the bible The bible may not change , but human society does I would be more likely to believe the bible if it did n't make claims of ( scientifically ) impossible things""",,
6463,1733,"""To the Editor : Re  “ The Sex Speech ” ( column , June 12 ) : Nicholas D. Kristof recognizes the depth of racism and the breadth of sexism in the United States . But nonwhite women in this country face both , and suffer real consequences as a result : African-American women are four times more likely than white women to die in childbirth . The United States ranks first among developed nations in the number of women who die because of pregnancy-related complications . Every woman has the right to survive pregnancy . There is no reason , as Mr. Kristof notes , that the United States should not be a leader in making this basic human right a reality . That means financing reproductive health services , from contraception to maternal health care . What better way to address the intersection of racism and sexism and  “ to repair America ’ s standing in the world ” than to save women from dying during pregnancy , whether they live in an African village or Greenwich Village ? Nancy Northup , President Center for Reproductive Rights New York , June 13 , 2008""","""http : //www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/op ... 18kristof.html""",DISAGREE,"""Every woman has the right to survive pregnancy What better way to address the intersection of racism and sexism and  to repair America ’ s standing in the world than to save women from dying during pregnancy , whether they live in an African village or Greenwich Village ?""","""http : //www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/op ... 18kristof.html""",,
6506,1742,"""1 . Jesus was : E : a man who probably existed , perhaps even with good ideas about living . Stories about Jesus were embellished with ideas stolen or adapted from other religious and cultural stories . 2 . The resurrection story of Jesus is : E : Complete bunk with no reliable supporting evidence .""","""Thank you for your response .""",DISAGREE,"""Jesus was : E : a man who probably existed , perhaps even with good ideas about living . Stories about Jesus were embellished with ideas stolen or adapted from other religious and cultural stories . 2 . The resurrection story of Jesus is : E : Complete bunk with no reliable supporting evidence .""","""Thank you for your response .""",,
6508,1743,"""You have presented no evidence that DC police were complicit in harassing the man at his home ,""","""Leading the parade out of their jurisdiction and title to protect them and failing to report to the agencies actually with title and jurisdiction is n't evidence of complicity ? You are fried .""",DISAGREE,"""no evidence that DC police were complicit""","""failing to report to the agencies actually with title and jurisdiction is n't evidence of complicity ? You are fried .""",,
6515,1745,"""Why do n't you just sum it up with `` If you 're not a fundamentalist Christian `` ? You also fail to consider Christian agnostics .""","""I think that 's a good definition . What is a Christian agnostic ? ( Never heard of them . )""",AGREE,"""Why do n't you just sum it up with `` If you 're not a fundamentalist Christian `` ? You also fail to consider Christian agnostics .""","""I think that 's a good definition . What is a Christian agnostic ? ( Never heard of them . )""",,
6521,1747,"""Originally posted by Debater I do n't mean that . What I mean is that I wish to hear both sides of an argument : Liberals and Conservatives""","""But will you listen ?""",DISAGREE,"""I wish to hear both sides of an argument""","""But will you listen ?""",,
6535,1751,"""If I was a creationist , I 'd try to avoid discussing the merits of my belief . Assume that if not A , therefore B. Creationism is true because evolution is false !""","""Thank the lord you are not a creationist ( pardon the pun ) . The method you referred to above is known as deductive reasoning , and is known to be a very valid way of finding a solution even by most 3rd graders . Also , I look at the Bible as a written record of what actually happened as well as the holy book . Seeing as scientists have believed the journals of young Native Americans from a hundred years ago , I do n't see the problem of believing the written journal of hundreds of very wise men and women , including God himself .""",DISAGREE,"""If I was a creationist . Assume that if not A , therefore""","""referred to above is known as deductive reasoning""",,
6565,1754,"""Yes , I was a fetus , and at that point in time I was NOT technically a human being . I had the potential to become a human being but I was n't not one . I was human cells dividing .""","""So you 're claiming that you `` transformed `` from part of your mother to a human . So you 're claiming that you were once almost your mom 's arm or leg ? lol ! Biologically , this is simply a farce statement .""",DISAGREE,"""fetus NOT technically a human potential to become a human human cells dividing""","""So claiming `` simply a farce""",,
6584,1755,"""Because you know that the living chimpanzee that shares 98 % of our genetic code , and is living evidence that such shared DNA is in no way evidence of human descent at all completely nullifies and negates all of the claims made by evolutionists that these genetic markers in long dead animals could possibly ever be proven to be our ancestors .""","""Because .....""",DISAGREE,"""living evidence that such shared DNA is in no way evidence of human descent completely nullifies and negates all of the claims made by evolutionists these genetic markers could possibly ever be proven to be our ancestors""","""Because""",,
6592,1756,"""Quite frankly , you do n't know squat about me . So stop trying to pretend you do . I have gone on record to say I think Christianity does a lot of good in the world . I have even tried to correct Matthew in his anti-Christian tirades . ( Until I gave up realizing it would do no good ... ) I hate to break it to you , but the WORLD typically functions with people putting out negative news . You hear about how Joe Blow broke the law . Do you ever hear about how Johnny Atlas keeps the law ?""","""I know that you are a contrarian that gioes out of his way to argue nonsensical points .""",DISAGREE,"""Quite frankly , you do n't know squat about me . So stop trying to pretend you do . I have gone on record to say I think Christianity does a lot of good in the world . I have even tried to correct Matthew in his anti-Christian tirades . (""","""I know that you are a contrarian that gioes out of his way to argue nonsensical points .""",,
6594,1756,"""Quite frankly , you do n't know squat about me . So stop trying to pretend you do . I have gone on record to say I think Christianity does a lot of good in the world . I have even tried to correct Matthew in his anti-Christian tirades . ( Until I gave up realizing it would do no good ... ) I hate to break it to you , but the WORLD typically functions with people putting out negative news . You hear about how Joe Blow broke the law . Do you ever hear about how Johnny Atlas keeps the law ?""","""I know that you are a contrarian that gioes out of his way to argue nonsensical points .""",DISAGREE,"""Quite frankly , you do n't know squat about me . So stop trying to pretend you do""","""I know that you are a contrarian that gioes out of his way to argue nonsensical points .""",,
6587,1756,"""Quite frankly , you do n't know squat about me . So stop trying to pretend you do . I have gone on record to say I think Christianity does a lot of good in the world . I have even tried to correct Matthew in his anti-Christian tirades . ( Until I gave up realizing it would do no good ... ) I hate to break it to you , but the WORLD typically functions with people putting out negative news . You hear about how Joe Blow broke the law . Do you ever hear about how Johnny Atlas keeps the law ?""","""I know that you are a contrarian that gioes out of his way to argue nonsensical points .""",DISAGREE,"""you do n't know squat about Christianity does a lot of good in the world""","""contrarian argue nonsensical points .""",,
6668,1787,"""There are those that believe that mechanistic evolution ca n't explain for all of life 's systems .""","""WOW ! Is that English ? Are you sure that you understand the question ? Is this little bit on unintelligible babble supposed to be meaningful ?""",DISAGREE,"""There are those that believe that mechanistic evolution ca n't explain for all of life 's systems .""","""Is this little bit on unintelligible babble supposed to be meaningful ?""",,
6708,1794,"""Why ? Because police cars attached to the Washington MPD ’ s Civil Disturbance Unit had escorted the SEIU protesters ’ buses to Baer ’ s home . Such cross-jurisdictional escort activity is not uncommon for both departments according to Friz and Metro Police Department spokesperson Officer Eric Frost . Still , the District police did not inform their colleagues of what was about to happen in one of their Maryland neighborhoods .""","""So cross jurisdictional escort is a fairly common occurrence in the area . You will note that it is not the local cops talking about not being informed .... it is the author of the article whining about it .""",DISAGREE,"""Because police cars attached to the Washington MPD ’ s Civil Disturbance Unit had escorted the SEIU protesters ’ buses to Baer ’ s home .""","""So cross jurisdictional escort is a fairly common occurrence in the area .""",,
6720,1796,"""Hmm , yeah , I never got sadness from a dove 's call . { shrug } Well , more familiar animals , like our domesticated pals show their emotions all the time . Dogs are full of emotion . Just leave the house and they get instantly depressed . Seperation anxiety in dogs is profound . I know my dog expresses his utter joy every time I grab the leash . He knows we 're going somewhere besides the boring house . If he sees me playing with another dog or giving the other dog a treat , he 'll get really jealous and you can tell .""","""I see your point and this goes back to my reply that emotions really show nothing as far as being spiritual .""",AGREE,"""like our domesticated pals show their emotions all the""","""that emotions really show nothing as far as being spiritual .""",,
6741,1800,"""Hate to have to spoil things , but the rest of the world has really no interest at all in Kansas and its scholastic problems""","""Actually they do . Whether or not you think they should is another matter entirely . Did you not notice where the article came from ? From a paper in India . I also found articles on the same subject from papers all over the country as well as in other countries such as Romania . Save your snobbery for someone else .""",DISAGREE,"""the rest of the world has really no interest at all in Kansas and its scholastic problems""","""Actually they do . Whether or not you think they should is another matter entirely""",,
6743,1800,"""Hate to have to spoil things , but the rest of the world has really no interest at all in Kansas and its scholastic problems""","""Actually they do . Whether or not you think they should is another matter entirely . Did you not notice where the article came from ? From a paper in India . I also found articles on the same subject from papers all over the country as well as in other countries such as Romania . Save your snobbery for someone else .""",DISAGREE,"""Hate to have to spoil things , but the rest of the world has really no interest""","""Did you not notice where the article came from ?""",,
6769,1805,"""Darwin vs. Darwin : how he conceded that his theory was contradicted by known evidence ( or lack thereof ) , though he hoped later findings would vindicate him -- which still has n't happened after 150 years""","""More lies . I mentioned genetics and observed instances of speciation , yes ?""",DISAGREE,"""how he conceded that his theory was contradicted by known evidence""","""More lies .""",,
6772,1806,"""3 ) Reptile develops bird feet . These are far greater hinderances than assests , they go away .""","""Why would they go away ? Birds still have bird feet . How are they a hinderance ? Have you looked at the feet of tridactyl dinosaurs ? Are you aware that dinosaur tracks were at first thought to be the tracks of large birds ? Would n't `` bird feet `` be beneficial to an animal that lived in trees ?""",DISAGREE,"""Reptile develops bird feet . These are far greater hinderances than assests , they go away .""","""Why would they go away ? Birds still have bird feet . How are they a hinderance ? ``""",,
6779,1808,"""Proof please .""","""Actually , you should n't ask that . If they 're stolen , ( commonly from vehicles , as OC stated ) , well , would one have the leave them in a vehicle if he lives in a state that issues CCWs without having to go through a big legal hassle ? Not really""",DISAGREE,"""Proof please .""","""Actually , you should n't ask that .""",,
6781,1809,"""The criminalization of abortion was the real abuse of power . It was mostly done by a few sexist and political oppertunist members of the AMA to stop women from practicing medicine and by xenophobic/racist Protestant groups who feared a non-white/non-Protestant majority here in America after the Civil War cleared out many of them .""","""So the intent hiding behind abortion laws all along was to keep women in the gutter . There was not any legititamte concern for the unborn fetus . It was all about how they could keep women down . Tell me then , would someone who supports a ban on partial birth abortion do so simply because they want to repress women ?""",DISAGREE,"""The criminalization of abortion was the real abuse of power . It was mostly done by a few sexist and political oppertunist members of the AMA to stop women from practicing medicine and by xenophobic/racist Protestant groups who feared a non-white/non-Protestant majority here in America after the Civil War cleared out many of them .""","""So the intent hiding behind abortion laws all along was to keep women in the gutter . There was not any legititamte concern for the unborn fetus . It was all about how they could keep women down . Tell me then , would someone who supports a ban on partial birth abortion do so simply because they want to repress women ?""",,
6811,1817,"""Science , like religon , is just another way to see the world .""","""But they are implemented completely differently .""",DISAGREE,"""Science , like religon , is just another way to see the world""","""they are implemented completely differently .""",,
6816,1819,"""You assume that policemen are trustworthy . I believe the question should be , `` Why do we trust policemen more than others ? `` I believe the bell shaped curve applies to all large groups of people . There are likely just as many dishonest cops as there are dishonest non-cops , based on a percentage of their group .""","""I believe the question was aimed at those who advocate only the police being armed and nobody else , the ones who believe that only the police have good reason for having access to guns , but no regular person needs a gun for any reason whatsoever .""",DISAGREE,"""You assume that policemen are trustworthy .""","""I believe the question was aimed at those who advocate only the police being armed and nobody else ,""",,
6827,1821,"""I think he meant that the `` Constitution goes out the window `` as far as Tither 's opinion is concerned not that Tither actually violated the Constitution .""","""And yet you have no problem with this law Galileo ?""",DISAGREE,"""meant that the `` Constitution goes out the window `` as far as Tither 's opinion is concerned""","""yet you have no problem with this law Galileo ?""",,
6845,1826,"""BS . Where is the raw data ... The link you show is from www.gunowners.org over there and does not give links to the raw data so it is probably skewed to make themselves look better . Your own words condemn you""","""There called footnotes The GOA is peppered with them not like the made up XXXX from the brady bunch and other civil rights violators like yourself . Why do n't you try disputing facts than making up stories and childishly trying to copy me . Here lets start with this .... Please read and explain to me how ( if ) any of these 40 things are wrong Mr . Civil-Rights violator : 1 . Banning guns works , which is why New York , DC , & amp ; Chicago cops need guns . 2 . Washington DC 's low murder rate of 69 per 100,000 is due to strict gun control , and Indianapolis ' high murder rate of 9 per 100,000 is due to the lack of gun control . 3 . Statistics showing high murder rates justify gun control but statistics showing increasing murder rates after gun control are `` just statistics. `` 4 . The Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban , both of which went into effect in 1994 are responsible for the decrease in violent crime rates , which have been declining since 1991 . 5 . We must get rid of guns because a deranged lunatic may go on a shooting spree at any time and anyone who would own a gun out of fear of such a lunatic is paranoid . 6 . The more helpless you are the safer you are from criminals . 7 . An intruder will be incapacitated by tear gas or oven spray , but if shot with a .357 Magnum will get angry and kill you . 8 . A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet . 9 . When confronted by violent criminals , you should `` put up no defense -- give them what they want , or run `` ( Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Pete Shields , Guns Do n't Die - People Do , 1981 , p.125 ) . 10 . The New England Journal of Medicine is filled with expert advice about guns ; just like Guns & amp ; Ammo has some excellent treatises on heart surgery . 11 . One should consult an automotive engineer for safer seatbelts , a civil engineer for a better bridge , a surgeon for internal medicine , a computer programmer for hard drive problems , and Sarah Brady for firearms expertise . 12 . The 2nd Amendment , ratified in 1787 , refers to the National Guard , which was created 130 years later , in 1917 . 13 . The National Guard , federally funded , with bases on federal land , using federally-owned weapons , vehicles , buildings and uniforms , punishing trespassers under federal law , is a `` state `` militia . 14 . These phrases : `` right of the people peaceably to assemble , `` `` right of the people to be secure in their homes , `` `` enumerations herein of certain rights shall not be construed to disparage others retained by the people , `` and `` The powers not delegated herein are reserved to the states respectively , and to the people `` all refer to individuals , but `` the right of the people to keep and bear arm `` refers to the state . 15 . '' The Constitution is strong and will never change. `` But we should ban and seize all guns thereby violating the 2nd , 4th , and 5th Amendments to that Constitution . 16 . Rifles and handguns are n't necessary to national defense ! Of course , the army has hundreds of thousands of them . 17 . Private citizens should n't have handguns , because they are n't `` military weapons `` , but private citizens should n't have `` assault rifles `` , because they are military weapons . 18 . In spite of waiting periods , background checks , finger printing , government forms , etc. , guns today are too readily available , which is responsible for recent school shootings . In the 1940 's , 1950 's and1960 's , anyone could buy guns at hardware stores , army surplus stores , gas stations , variety stores , Sears mail order , no waiting , no background check , no fingerprints , no government forms and there were no school shootings . 19 . The NRA 's attempt to run a `` do n't touch `` campaign about kids handling guns is propaganda , but the anti-gun lobby 's attempt to run a `` do n't touch `` campaign is responsible social activity . 20 . Guns are so complex that special training is necessary to use them properly , and so simple to use that they make murder easy . 21 . A handgun , with up to 4 controls , is far too complex for the typical adult to learn to use , as opposed to an automobile that only has 20 . 22 . Women are just as intelligent and capable as men but a woman with a gun is `` an accident waiting to happen `` and gun makers ' advertisements aimed at women are `` preying on their fears. `` 23 . Ordinary people in the presence of guns turn into slaughtering butchers but revert to normal when the weapon is removed . 24 . Guns cause violence , which is why there are so many mass killings at gun shows . 25 . A majority of the population supports gun control , just like a majority of the population supported owning slaves . 26 . Any self-loading small arm can legitimately be considered to be a `` weapon of mass destruction `` or an `` assault weapon. `` 27 . Most people ca n't be trusted , so we should have laws against guns , which most people will abide by because they can be trusted . 28 . The right of Internet pornographers to exist can not be questioned because it is constitutionally protected by the Bill of Rights , but the use of handguns for self defense is not really protected by the Bill of Rights . 29 . Free speech entitles one to own newspapers , transmitters , computers , and typewriters , but self-defense only justifies bare hands . 30 . The ACLU is good because it uncompromisingly defends certain parts of the Constitution , and the NRA is bad , because it defends other parts of the Constitution . 31 . Charlton Heston , a movie actor as president of the NRA is a cheap lunatic who should be ignored , but Michael Douglas , a movie actor as a representative of Handgun Control , Inc. is an ambassador for peace who is entitled to an audience at the UN arms control summit . 32 . Police operate with backup within groups , which is why they need larger capacity pistol magazines than do `` civilians `` who must face criminals alone and therefore need less ammunition . 33 . We should ban `` Saturday Night Specials `` and other inexpensive guns because it 's not fair that poor people have access to guns too . 34 . Police officers have some special Jedi-like mastery over hand guns that private citizens can never hope to obtain . 35 . Private citizens do n't need a gun for self-protection because the police are there to protect them even though the Supreme Court says the police are not responsible for their protection . 36 . Citizens do n't need to carry a gun for personal protection but police chiefs , who are desk-bound administrators who work in a building filled with cops , need a gun . 37 . '' Assault weapons `` have no purpose other than to kill large numbers of people . The police need assault weapons . You do not . 38 . When Microsoft pressures its distributors to give Microsoft preferential promotion , that 's bad ; but when the Federal government pressures cities to buy guns only from Smith & amp ; Wesson , that 's good . 39 . Trigger locks do not interfere with the ability to use a gun for defensive purposes , which is why you see police officers with one on their duty weapon . 40 . Handgun Control , Inc. says they want to `` keep guns out of the wrong hands. `` Guess what ? You have the wrong hands""",DISAGREE,"""The link you show is from www.gunowners.org over there and does not give links to the raw data""","""Here lets start with this .... Please read and explain to me how ( if ) any of these 40 things are wrong""",,
6852,1828,"""Good point . Touche . Though lots of folks have not had abortions . Certainly most men have not . I was just growing tired of a certain little poster 's uninformed opinions of sexual activity . My post was intended to be a little playful . If it missed the mark , mea culpa .""","""I know . I just do n't want to be accused of only spitting in one direction . Carry on .""",AGREE,"""Though lots of folks have not had abortions . Certainly most men have not .""","""I just do n't want to be accused of only spitting in one direction .""",,
6874,1833,"""No , it does n't make it right but it 's not right to treat women as breeding animals either .""","""Problem is , you think requiring a woman not to kill someone is `` treating them as breeding animals `` . Kind of an odd thought .""",DISAGREE,"""it right but it 's not right to treat women as breeding animals""","""think requiring a woman not to kill someone is `` treating them as breeding animals ``""",,
6899,1838,"""No , and your classification here is rediculous . This is not a matter of refusing to serve sombody based on their religon .""","""What 's ridiculous is your mis-reading of the argument . I 'm both discussing individual pharmacists , and their refusal of service to individuals based on the drug the individual wants , which is already assumed to be dispensed at that pharmacy or chain .""",DISAGREE,"""No , and your classification here is rediculous .""","""which is already assumed to be dispensed at that pharmacy or chain .""",,
6911,1841,"""One of the quotes in your signature is- `` The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is , as a last resort , to protect themselves against tyranny in government . -Thomas Jefferson `` But this is a bogus quote . http : //www.guncite.com/gc2ndbog.html Why do you use a bogus quote ?""","""Lacking substance as usual .... Whether Jefferson said it or not is not the issue . The topic of this thread is `` 15 myths about gun control `` But you seem unable to make a logical point so you resort to attacking the individual ... Significant portions of this article are excerpted from Michael Z. Williamson 's excellent and witty piece , It 's amazing what one has to believe to believe in gun control `` 1 . Banning guns works , which is why New York , DC , & amp ; Chicago cops need guns . 2 . Washington DC 's low murder rate of 69 per 100,000 is due to strict gun control , and Indianapolis ' high murder rate of 9 per 100,000 is due to the lack of gun control . 3 . Statistics showing high murder rates justify gun control but statistics showing increasing murder rates after gun control are `` just statistics. `` 4 . The Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban , both of which went into effect in 1994 are responsible for the decrease in violent crime rates , which have been declining since 1991 . 5 . We must get rid of guns because a deranged lunatic may go on a shooting spree at any time and anyone who would own a gun out of fear of such a lunatic is paranoid . 6 . The more helpless you are the safer you are from criminals . 7 . An intruder will be incapacitated by tear gas or oven spray , but if shot with a .357 Magnum will get angry and kill you . 8 . A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet . 9 . When confronted by violent criminals , you should `` put up no defense -- give them what they want , or run `` ( Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Pete Shields , Guns Do n't Die - People Do , 1981 , p.125 ) . 10 . The New England Journal of Medicine is filled with expert advice about guns ; just like Guns & amp ; Ammo has some excellent treatises on heart surgery . 11 . One should consult an automotive engineer for safer seatbelts , a civil engineer for a better bridge , a surgeon for internal medicine , a computer programmer for hard drive problems , and Sarah Brady for firearms expertise . 12 . The 2nd Amendment , ratified in 1787 , refers to the National Guard , which was created 130 years later , in 1917 . 13 . The National Guard , federally funded , with bases on federal land , using federally-owned weapons , vehicles , buildings and uniforms , punishing trespassers under federal law , is a `` state `` militia . 14 . These phrases : `` right of the people peaceably to assemble , `` `` right of the people to be secure in their homes , `` `` enumerations herein of certain rights shall not be construed to disparage others retained by the people , `` and `` The powers not delegated herein are reserved to the states respectively , and to the people `` all refer to individuals , but `` the right of the people to keep and bear arm `` refers to the state . 15 . '' The Constitution is strong and will never change. `` But we should ban and seize all guns thereby violating the 2nd , 4th , and 5th Amendments to that Constitution . 16 . Rifles and handguns are n't necessary to national defense ! Of course , the army has hundreds of thousands of them . 17 . Private citizens should n't have handguns , because they are n't `` military weapons `` , but private citizens should n't have `` assault rifles `` , because they are military weapons . 18 . In spite of waiting periods , background checks , finger printing , government forms , etc. , guns today are too readily available , which is responsible for recent school shootings . In the 1940 's , 1950 's and1960 's , anyone could buy guns at hardware stores , army surplus stores , gas stations , variety stores , Sears mail order , no waiting , no background check , no fingerprints , no government forms and there were no school shootings . 19 . The NRA 's attempt to run a `` do n't touch `` campaign about kids handling guns is propaganda , but the anti-gun lobby 's attempt to run a `` do n't touch `` campaign is responsible social activity . 20 . Guns are so complex that special training is necessary to use them properly , and so simple to use that they make murder easy . 21 . A handgun , with up to 4 controls , is far too complex for the typical adult to learn to use , as opposed to an automobile that only has 20 . 22 . Women are just as intelligent and capable as men but a woman with a gun is `` an accident waiting to happen `` and gun makers ' advertisements aimed at women are `` preying on their fears. `` 23 . Ordinary people in the presence of guns turn into slaughtering butchers but revert to normal when the weapon is removed . 24 . Guns cause violence , which is why there are so many mass killings at gun shows . 25 . A majority of the population supports gun control , just like a majority of the population supported owning slaves . 26 . Any self-loading small arm can legitimately be considered to be a `` weapon of mass destruction `` or an `` assault weapon. `` 27 . Most people ca n't be trusted , so we should have laws against guns , which most people will abide by because they can be trusted . 28 . The right of Internet pornographers to exist can not be questioned because it is constitutionally protected by the Bill of Rights , but the use of handguns for self defense is not really protected by the Bill of Rights . 29 . Free speech entitles one to own newspapers , transmitters , computers , and typewriters , but self-defense only justifies bare hands . 30 . The ACLU is good because it uncompromisingly defends certain parts of the Constitution , and the NRA is bad , because it defends other parts of the Constitution . 31 . Charlton Heston , a movie actor as president of the NRA is a cheap lunatic who should be ignored , but Michael Douglas , a movie actor as a representative of Handgun Control , Inc. is an ambassador for peace who is entitled to an audience at the UN arms control summit . 32 . Police operate with backup within groups , which is why they need larger capacity pistol magazines than do `` civilians `` who must face criminals alone and therefore need less ammunition . 33 . We should ban `` Saturday Night Specials `` and other inexpensive guns because it 's not fair that poor people have access to guns too . 34 . Police officers have some special Jedi-like mastery over hand guns that private citizens can never hope to obtain . 35 . Private citizens do n't need a gun for self-protection because the police are there to protect them even though the Supreme Court says the police are not responsible for their protection . 36 . Citizens do n't need to carry a gun for personal protection but police chiefs , who are desk-bound administrators who work in a building filled with cops , need a gun . 37 . '' Assault weapons `` have no purpose other than to kill large numbers of people . The police need assault weapons . You do not . 38 . When Microsoft pressures its distributors to give Microsoft preferential promotion , that 's bad ; but when the Federal government pressures cities to buy guns only from Smith & amp ; Wesson , that 's good . 39 . Trigger locks do not interfere with the ability to use a gun for defensive purposes , which is why you see police officers with one on their duty weapon . 40 . Handgun Control , Inc. says they want to `` keep guns out of the wrong hands. `` Guess what ? You have the wrong hands""",DISAGREE,"""The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is , as a last resort""","""The right of Internet pornographers to exist can not be questioned because it is constitutionally protected by the Bill of Rights ,""",,
6921,1844,"""So how do you explain the soft tissue , flexible , red tissue found in t-rex bones ?""","""quite easily actually . http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dinosaur/flesh.html You 've already been refuted on this issue before . Typical creationist . make argument , watch it get refuted and bring it back after people have forgotten you already made it . SS= Liar Does it keep you awake at night knowing you 're a repeat fraudster ? Again with the fraud . http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dinosaur/blood.html Fossil Meat Found in 380-Million-Year-Old Fish The fish is explained by the first link to talkorigis i gave . I fully expect you to make the same refuted arguments in a month . This is why I should n't bother with people like you .""",DISAGREE,"""explain the soft tissue , flexible , red tissue found in t-rex bones""","""Liar Does it keep you awake at night knowing you 're a repeat fraudster ?""",,
6932,1847,"""Next , Dr. Lipton destroys any notion that our genes control us : `` ..... the media repeatedly distort the meaning of two words : correlation and causation . It 's one thing to be linked to a disease ; it 's quite another to cause a disease , which implies a directing , controlling action . If I show you my keys and say that a particular key `` controls `` my car , you at first might think that makes sense because you know you need that key to turn on the ignition . But does the key actually `` control `` the car ? If it did , you could n't leave the key in the car alone because it might just borrow your car for a joy ride when you are not paying attention . In truth , the key is `` correlated `` with the control of the car ; but the person who actually turns the key actually controls the car . Specific genes are correlated with an organism 's behavior and characteristics . But these genes are not activated until something triggers them. ``""","""So this means that genes are not related to the traits our body has ? I did n't think so ...""",DISAGREE,"""Specific genes are correlated with an organism 's behavior and characteristics""","""So this means that genes are not related to the traits our body has ? I did n't think so ...""",,
6949,1851,"""I disagree . They are all effective methods of deterring crime . I will concede that guns can also be effective , but none of these is 100 % effective at removing the risk . This is why I do not understand the need to own a gun , when in most cases other methods can be effective .""","""Because the effectiveness of other methods do n't come close to that of owning a gun for personal protection . If they did then the police would n't have guns because it would be redundant and not cost effective .""",DISAGREE,"""This is why I do not understand the need to own a gun , when in most cases other methods can be effective .""","""effectiveness of other methods do n't come close to that of owning a gun for personal protection .""",,
6950,1851,"""I disagree . They are all effective methods of deterring crime . I will concede that guns can also be effective , but none of these is 100 % effective at removing the risk . This is why I do not understand the need to own a gun , when in most cases other methods can be effective .""","""Because the effectiveness of other methods do n't come close to that of owning a gun for personal protection . If they did then the police would n't have guns because it would be redundant and not cost effective .""",DISAGREE,"""I will concede that guns can also be effective , but none of these is 100 % effective at removing the risk .""","""If they did then the police would n't have guns because it would be redundant and not cost effective .""",,
6955,1852,"""but then you have to dump all your ( secular ) `` scientific `` theories in there aswell .""","""Yes . Scientific theories do n't deal with God .""",AGREE,"""but then you have to dump all your ( secular ) `` scientific `` theories in there aswell .""","""Yes . Scientific theories do n't deal with God""",,
6992,1867,"""How were they able to get an `` aggravated assault `` charge pinned on you ? I 'm assuming she never had a mark on herself to show the cops . Had you two had a previous domestic call history with the police ? Hopefully justice will be served when you get your day in court . Then you 'll get to experience the wonder that is `` family court `` , if you have n't already . You have my sympathies .""","""No mark , no bullet hole nothing . Her and her father claim that I just touched my gun ... which I did n't ! They even testified at the preliminary that I did n't touch anyone nor did I make any threat what so ever . That I just put my hand on my gun . The police on the scene did n't charge me . They went to the Sheriffs Dept and took warrants on me and my mother . My wife got my mom for assault claiming she was trying to grab our daughter from her and was fighting with her . Yet again no marks.I even have evidence of premeditated revenge from threatening text messages days earlier from her dad and her saying stuff on myspace . She took out orders of protection on us but the judge dismissed them QUICK ! We got indicted so now we 're facing a plea hearing . The other judge made us take joint custody . Primary custody has yet been asigned . My lawyer is the best in the area and also a good friend of mine . He 's trying to get it dropped before court . But they claim I just touched my Glock . That does n't meet the statute really in these circumstances . The responding officers even thought it was BS .""",DISAGREE,"""How were they able to get an `` aggravated assault `` charge pinned on you ? I 'm assuming she never had a mark on herself Hopefully justice will be served when you get your day in court .""","""No mark , no bullet hole nothing . Her and her father claim that I just touched my gun even have evidence of premeditated revenge from threatening text messages days earlier from her dad and her saying stuff on myspace .""",,
6995,1867,"""How were they able to get an `` aggravated assault `` charge pinned on you ? I 'm assuming she never had a mark on herself to show the cops . Had you two had a previous domestic call history with the police ? Hopefully justice will be served when you get your day in court . Then you 'll get to experience the wonder that is `` family court `` , if you have n't already . You have my sympathies .""","""No mark , no bullet hole nothing . Her and her father claim that I just touched my gun ... which I did n't ! They even testified at the preliminary that I did n't touch anyone nor did I make any threat what so ever . That I just put my hand on my gun . The police on the scene did n't charge me . They went to the Sheriffs Dept and took warrants on me and my mother . My wife got my mom for assault claiming she was trying to grab our daughter from her and was fighting with her . Yet again no marks.I even have evidence of premeditated revenge from threatening text messages days earlier from her dad and her saying stuff on myspace . She took out orders of protection on us but the judge dismissed them QUICK ! We got indicted so now we 're facing a plea hearing . The other judge made us take joint custody . Primary custody has yet been asigned . My lawyer is the best in the area and also a good friend of mine . He 's trying to get it dropped before court . But they claim I just touched my Glock . That does n't meet the statute really in these circumstances . The responding officers even thought it was BS .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm assuming she never had a mark on herself to show the cops .""","""They went to the Sheriffs Dept and took warrants on me and my mother .""",,
7000,1868,"""Therefore , I believe that God designed Finch brains to be able to subconsciously decipher when the environment changes and when a modified beak is needed . Likewise I believe God made it so peppered moths are able to modify their wing-patterns based on environment or background colors . This is no more unbelievable than the fact that a fish can change colors or that a snail can grow a bigger shell in the presence of predators . It all comes from the same creative Designer . And what ’ s funny is evolutionists – in one breath – will tell you how they do not deny plasticityÂ….yet in the next breath will tell you that ’ s not how finches and moths changed ! If these people were intellectually honest , they wouldn ’ t talk out of both side of their mouths like thatÂ…they would admit the truth . But I no longer expect the truth out of atheists .""","""To be honest I 'm still not sure what your plasticity arguement is about . You seem to argue that animals can change shape and design like pokemon when the need arises . Now , my body , in the precence of foreign organisms , will create brand new protiens designed to kill the invaders , but this is a simple genetic process well understood by biologists . I still ask you to show me some study where an animal has been placed in an altered environment and makes a larger beak , grows extra limbs , etc . The problem with your fish and moth examples are growing larger shells or changing colors are abilities , not permanent changes , that are shared by the organism 's offspring . If a snail grew a large shell when there were many predators around , its offspring would not have the same large shells unless a similar predator threat existed . You 're arguements about plasticity essentially claim the story of how the elephant got its trunk is a valid evolutionary theory .""",DISAGREE,"""But I no longer expect the truth out of atheists .""","""You 're arguements about plasticity essentially claim the story of how the elephant got its trunk is a valid evolutionary theory .""",,
7008,1870,"""To me , viability , sentience , the development of the nervous system and the brain , and the experience of pain in a fetus during the third trimester begin to mark the ethical boundaries . But those , too , as indicators , are not absolute . And the woman comes first . It 's between her and her physician . It 's not my job to judge whether she suffered appropriately enough or not .""","""You state `` the woman comes first `` . This seems to be your only `` absolute `` . Why does the woman come first ? Is it because she is fully developed ? Is she more important than the child she is carrying ?""",DISAGREE,"""It 's between her and her physician . It 's not my job to judge whether she suffered appropriately enough or not .""","""You state `` the woman comes first `` . This seems to be your only `` absolute `` . Why does the woman come first ? Is it because she is fully developed ? Is she more important than the child she is carrying ?""",,
7011,1870,"""To me , viability , sentience , the development of the nervous system and the brain , and the experience of pain in a fetus during the third trimester begin to mark the ethical boundaries . But those , too , as indicators , are not absolute . And the woman comes first . It 's between her and her physician . It 's not my job to judge whether she suffered appropriately enough or not .""","""You state `` the woman comes first `` . This seems to be your only `` absolute `` . Why does the woman come first ? Is it because she is fully developed ? Is she more important than the child she is carrying ?""",DISAGREE,"""To me , viability , sentience , the development of the nervous system and the brain , and the experience of pain""","""You state `` the woman comes first `` . This seems to be your only `` absolute""",,
7012,1871,"""The propaganda is obvious . The guidebook encourages docents to proclaim their evolutionary faith with boldness and confidence :  “ Be polite but firm. ”  “ Practice . Your credibility is higher , and you ’ ll be more comfortable , when you sound like you know what you ’ re talking about . Rehearse answers to the most frequently asked questions Â… . ”""","""Why is that propoganda ? It 's exactly what you do .""",DISAGREE,"""The guidebook encourages docents to proclaim their evolutionary faith with boldness and confidence :""","""Why is that propoganda ? It 's exactly what you do .""",,
7013,1871,"""The propaganda is obvious . The guidebook encourages docents to proclaim their evolutionary faith with boldness and confidence :  “ Be polite but firm. ”  “ Practice . Your credibility is higher , and you ’ ll be more comfortable , when you sound like you know what you ’ re talking about . Rehearse answers to the most frequently asked questions Â… . ”""","""Why is that propoganda ? It 's exactly what you do .""",DISAGREE,"""The propaganda is obvious . The guidebook encourages docents to proclaim their evolutionary faith with boldness and confidence :  Be polite but firm.  Practice . Your credibility is higher , and you ’ ll be more comfortable , when you sound like you know what you ’ re talking about . Rehearse answers to the most frequently asked questions Â… .Â""","""Why is that propoganda ? It 's exactly what you do .""",,
7021,1872,"""It is just as likely that an alien from uranus landed on premoridalearth , took a dump , and we are all decended from an intergallactic tapeworm .""","""And that is more likely than a magical being who poofed everything from nothing , do n't you agree ?""",AGREE,"""It is just as likely that an alien from uranus landed on premoridalearth""","""And that is more likely than a magical being who poofed everything from nothing""",,
7018,1872,"""It is just as likely that an alien from uranus landed on premoridalearth , took a dump , and we are all decended from an intergallactic tapeworm .""","""And that is more likely than a magical being who poofed everything from nothing , do n't you agree ?""",AGREE,"""It is just as likely that an alien from uranus landed on premoridalearth , took a dump , and we are all decended from an intergallactic tapeworm .""","""And that is more likely than a magical being who poofed everything from nothing , do n't you agree ?""",,
7047,1876,"""Why then is this not taught in history classes ? Why are we taught AS FACT that Homer wrote them ?""","""We are n't . Not even in literature classes are we taught this .""",DISAGREE,"""Why then is this not taught in history classes ?""","""We are n't . Not even in literature classes are we taught this .""",,
7061,1879,"""This forum is starting to get a little bit boring and is using up to much of my time .""","""So , we on this board are n't receptive to your proselytizing ? Sorry about that . This particular forum is intended to be a scientific discussion , based on logic and evidence . We certainly do n't want to waste your time . The door is over there . I find your dismissive , superior attitude to be offensive , to be honest. , so I ca n't say I 'll miss you . But should you ever want to discuss evolution and creation in terms of actual science you will be welcome to return .""",DISAGREE,"""This forum is starting to get a little bit boring and is using up to much of my time .""","""So , we on this board are n't receptive to your proselytizing ? Sorry about that . This particular forum is intended to be a scientific discussion , based on logic and evidence . We certainly do n't want to waste your time .""",,
7063,1879,"""This forum is starting to get a little bit boring and is using up to much of my time .""","""So , we on this board are n't receptive to your proselytizing ? Sorry about that . This particular forum is intended to be a scientific discussion , based on logic and evidence . We certainly do n't want to waste your time . The door is over there . I find your dismissive , superior attitude to be offensive , to be honest. , so I ca n't say I 'll miss you . But should you ever want to discuss evolution and creation in terms of actual science you will be welcome to return .""",DISAGREE,"""This forum is starting to get a little bit boring and is using up to much of my time .""","""So , we on this board are n't receptive to your proselytizing ?""",,
7073,1881,"""( 6 ) Natural selection supposedly accounts for the development of new kinds , but actually tends to preserve the present kinds , since an incipient organ or new feature of any kind would have no `` survival `` value unless it were fully functional from its very beginning .""","""Actually , natural selection tends to preserve a species with only minor changes in a stable environment . But environments tend to change . I do n't know what that `` incipient organ `` junk is supposed to mean . Is that another way of saying `` what good is half a wing. `` Well , check out a penguin to find out . Look at a seal flipper . It has the same bones , arranged in the same way as a monkey . What good is it for a land animal ? And what does `` fully functional `` mean ? What function ? Perhaps the new organ had a different purpose - take the clawed hands of fossil birds for example . They were good for catching prey and climbing , just like they were for their dinosaur ancestors . But those clawed wings also allowed early birds to fly .""",DISAGREE,"""Natural selection supposedly accounts for the development of new kinds , but actually tends to preserve the present kinds , since an incipient organ or new feature of any kind would have no `` survival `` value unless it were fully functional from its very beginning .""","""Actually , natural selection tends to preserve a species with only minor changes in a stable environment . But environments tend to change .""",,
7078,1882,"""This is the situation as it is in Britain .""","""Another oft-repeated lie .""",DISAGREE,"""This is the situation as it is in Britain .""","""Another oft-repeated lie .""",,
7102,1886,"""And Horn didnt go to jail thanks to those right to kill laws or castle laws that the NRA supports !""","""If you had bothered to spend more than two seconds actually looking up what happened , you would 've seen that Joe Horn was cleared of all wrong doings by a grand jury , not on the grounds of the new Castle Doctrine of Texas , but the already existing laws that permits the use of deadly force for preventing property crimes . These laws were on the books for years before Texas officially adopted the NRA endorsed Castle Doctrine . And even so , what 're you complaining about ? Would you rather Joe Horn be the one killed and the criminals alive today ?""",DISAGREE,"""Horn go to jail thanks to those right to kill laws or castle laws""","""Joe Horn was cleared of all wrong doings by a grand jury , the already existing laws that permits the use of deadly force for preventing property crimes Would you rather Joe Horn be the one killed and the criminals alive today ?""",,
7116,1889,"""Ah , but the issue in this thread is what the fetus really means to anti-choicers/anti-lifers . I do n't drink and I 'm not overweight . But I bet you have a bad habit with junk food and FOX news/couch potatoism . With a sixpack by your side .""","""The issue is about you linking an incident where a pregnant woman had so little regard for her unborn baby that she picked a fight with the police and somehow use it to demonise the police and the pro life people . I could not imagine anyone could be stupid enough to do this without the aid of strong drink but thank you for reminding me that you can do it easily .""",DISAGREE,"""the issue in this thread is what the fetus really means to anti-choicers/anti-lifers do n't drink and I 'm not overweight .""","""issue is about you linking an incident where a pregnant woman had so little regard for her unborn baby she picked a fight with the police and somehow use it to pro life people could not imagine anyone could be stupid enough to do this without the aid of strong drink""",,
7124,1891,"""Science helps those who seek to understand God in a more profound way , to learn about the intricate and complex unfolding of His creation .""","""And science helped Stenger write his book . How can the same subject make a stronger case for both of two completely opposing viewpoints ? another""",DISAGREE,"""to learn about the intricate and complex unfolding of His creation""","""helped Stenger write his book""",,
7128,1892,"""Why do n't we do the same for straight marriages then ?""","""Sure , I have no problem with the idea of a given state allowing a straight couple to file for divorce remotely somehow , if that couple is residing in a different state .""",AGREE,"""Why do n't we do the same for straight marriages""","""I have no problem with the idea""",,
7130,1893,"""The Book of Genesis is either secular or observed history ? Somebody get marc a dictionary , please . ( And I 'd link him to a long list of observed instances of speciation , but he 'd ignore it yet again . )""","""When is science going to get started on the book of Exodus ? Job ? Proverbs ?""",DISAGREE,"""The Book of Genesis is either secular or observed history ? Somebody get marc a dictionary , please .""","""When is science going to get started on the book of Exodus ? Job ? Proverbs ?""",,
7142,1897,"""Say goodbye to roe v wade and hello to rights for the unborn , the most innocent among us .. YES ... ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL . '' We hold these truths to be self-evident , that all men are created equal , that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights , that among these are Life , Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. ``""","""Oh no ! Here comes Palin , run for cover . Because I really fear ignorant and hypocritical conservatives . As to your argument , while were out calling fertilized eggs `` men `` , lets call plant life `` men `` as well .""",DISAGREE,"""Say goodbye to roe v wade and hello to rights for the unborn , the most innocent among us .. YES ... ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL . '' ``""","""As to your argument , while were out calling fertilized eggs `` men `` , lets call plant life `` men `` as well .""",,
7147,1905,"""1 ) All organisms tend to produce more offspring than can possibly survive .""","""False and that does n't invalide evolution given how it 's a misrepresentation of one of the statements in the theory . Gould can take his comments and shove them up his * * * .""",DISAGREE,"""All organisms tend to produce more offspring than can possibly survive .""","""False and that does n't invalide evolution""",,
7162,1908,"""`` That may be true , but it is n't harmful so I doubt it really should be on the list. ``""","""Well that may be your contention , but medically that is not necessarily true . Maybe being gay does n't mean you are suicidal or depressed , but there is more of it going on in the gay life than in the hetero . That in itself is a wake up call . Depression and suicide are harmful , even if it does n't touch you personally . If it were as simple as you say the APA would n't be re-evaluating `` reorientation therapies `` would they and with positive critiques too . You would n't have prominent gay activists like Camile Paglia deriding the gay community for being malcontent when those unhappy with being gay seek and desire the way to be hetero .""",DISAGREE,"""it is n't harmful so I doubt it really should be on the list. ``""","""Well that may be your contention , but medically that is not necessarily true .""",,
7173,1910,"""DOH ! yah beat me to it ! I 'll elaborate with the Zardoz answer : Stupid people want other stupid people to believe in their stupid belief systems and when they find non-stupid people , they have a coniption fits because they 're too stupid to understand that their beliefs are stupid . Simple version : Stupid is as Stupid does Come be stupid with us .""","""You know something , I just came here to browse , but upon discovering that you feel that people who believe in God are stupid , and their beliefs are stupid , just # # # # # # me off . Not that you dont believe , but your use of the word stupid . I happen to be one of those stupid people you refer to , and so I will say this- People can say or believe whatever they want to , but we are all going to die one day , and something will be waiting on us when we do die , so before you start calling people names , I would explore the possibility that maybe christians are right , because in the inescapable end , we will all find out . And if we as christians are right , your eternal future dont look to good . And one more little thought , people thought the guy who said the world was round was stupid , but he was right in the end .""",DISAGREE,"""Stupid people want other stupid people to believe in their stupid belief systems and when they find non-stupid people , they have a coniption fits because they 're too stupid to understand that their beliefs are stupid .""","""upon discovering that you feel that people who believe in God are stupid , and their beliefs are stupid , just # # # # # # me off .""",,
7172,1910,"""DOH ! yah beat me to it ! I 'll elaborate with the Zardoz answer : Stupid people want other stupid people to believe in their stupid belief systems and when they find non-stupid people , they have a coniption fits because they 're too stupid to understand that their beliefs are stupid . Simple version : Stupid is as Stupid does Come be stupid with us .""","""You know something , I just came here to browse , but upon discovering that you feel that people who believe in God are stupid , and their beliefs are stupid , just # # # # # # me off . Not that you dont believe , but your use of the word stupid . I happen to be one of those stupid people you refer to , and so I will say this- People can say or believe whatever they want to , but we are all going to die one day , and something will be waiting on us when we do die , so before you start calling people names , I would explore the possibility that maybe christians are right , because in the inescapable end , we will all find out . And if we as christians are right , your eternal future dont look to good . And one more little thought , people thought the guy who said the world was round was stupid , but he was right in the end .""",DISAGREE,"""Stupid people want other stupid people to believe in their stupid belief systems""","""I happen to be one of those stupid people you refer to""",,
7176,1911,"""So , what is the current treatment and how effective is it ? Obviously it is more COST effective . We dont know what the current treatment is , or how effective it is , because what you posted here is a one sided opinion piece masquerading as a news article , and you ate it up .""","""Current 'treatment ' includes : Use of a placebo Laying on of hands Prayer Tossing salt over thy shoulder Planting 3 kernels of rice in the ground under your home Saying the Pledge of Allegience And thanking the Obamasiah for a bountiful crop of beets . Oh , and if you can locate the witch , have her confess to the crime of making you ill ... and punished for doing so ... you stand a better chance of living longer with said cancers .""",DISAGREE,"""So , what is the current treatment and how effective is it ?""","""Current 'treatment ' includes : Use of a placebo Laying on of hands Prayer Tossing salt over thy shoulder Planting 3 kernels of rice in the ground under your home""",,
7200,1916,"""However , all I wanted to state is that truth is not reliant on scientific evidence .""","""Duh ! You do n't seem to have a grasp on what science is . Science is n't a search for truth . It is an attempt to explain observations naturalistic events without appeals to gods , angels , or demons .""",DISAGREE,"""is not reliant on scientific evidence""","""attempt to explain observations naturalistic events""",,
7207,1917,"""Sigma , I was only joking . It hit me this morning though that if I 'm willing to talk about abortion without bringing up God , I wonder if the Pro-Choicers could argue their position without bringing up `` women 's rights `` . ; - )""","""Women 's rights actually exist , unlike the Christian God .""",DISAGREE,"""argue their position without bringing up `` women 's rights""","""Women 's rights actually exist""",,
7208,1917,"""Sigma , I was only joking . It hit me this morning though that if I 'm willing to talk about abortion without bringing up God , I wonder if the Pro-Choicers could argue their position without bringing up `` women 's rights `` . ; - )""","""Women 's rights actually exist , unlike the Christian God .""",DISAGREE,"""I wonder if the Pro-Choicers could argue their position without bringing up `` women 's rights""","""Women 's rights actually exist""",,
7209,1917,"""Sigma , I was only joking . It hit me this morning though that if I 'm willing to talk about abortion without bringing up God , I wonder if the Pro-Choicers could argue their position without bringing up `` women 's rights `` . ; - )""","""Women 's rights actually exist , unlike the Christian God .""",DISAGREE,"""without bringing up `` women 's rights `` .""","""Women 's rights actually exist""",,
7213,1918,"""The funny thing about all this , and the oh-so-ironic thing is this :""","""`` Since some of these transcripts ferry code for proteins as dutiful mRNAs , this new perspective would encompass traditional genes. `` That is indeed the funny , ironic bit , that the article SS cites as `` death of genes `` specifically refutes his claim .""",AGREE,"""The funny thing about all this , and the oh-so-ironic thing is this :""","""That is indeed the funny , ironic bit , that the article SS cites as `` death of genes `` specifically refutes his claim .""",,
7228,1921,"""Interesting that those three are also the weakest and rarest of arguments when arguing for gun control . In fact , I have never witnessed anyone basing their entire gun control argument on the fact that `` gun owners lack the testicular fortitude to fight someone in hand-to-hand combat. ``""","""Actually , I find it near impossible to discuss the second amendment without gun control advocates bringing up the third argument . Weak ? Yes . Rare ? No . In my opinion , all arguments in favor of gun control are weak .""",DISAGREE,"""those three are also the weakest and rarest of arguments when arguing for gun control""","""I find it near impossible to discuss the second amendment without gun control advocates bringing up the third argument .""",,
7234,1922,"""It appears to me , that if slavery had been put up to a vote in Texas back before the civil war , and Texans voted to add an amendment to their state constitution legalizing slavery of blacks ( which they would have ) , you could as simply say `` Maybe , just maybe , the reason that many American people think slavery of blacks is right is simply because it IS. ``""","""Well , the slavery analogy for gay rights is past it 's applicability at this point -- one was a property issue ( also rooted in deep prejudice ) , the other is a morality issue . Many people oppose gay marriage out of morality and NOT prejudice . The same ca n't be said for slavery . There are many ways that the analogy does n't work and that 's just one of them . In fact , it could as easily be an analogy to reverse it and say that the ones who did the enslaving were analogous to gay rights lobbyists and the abolitionists were analogous to those who seek to protect marriage . After all , the plantation owners were the ones really fighting for ill-conceived rights -- rights that they should n't have had .""",DISAGREE,"""It appears to me , that if slavery had been put up to a vote in Texas back before the civil war , and Texans voted""","""ones really fighting for ill-conceived rights -- rights that they should n't have had .""",,
7271,1931,"""I am a gay Christian woman , live in Northern CA , and am VERY happily MARRIED to my wife as of June of 2008 . It is NOT a sin to be GLBT ...""","""The Word of God says otherwise . Romans 1:25-27 - They exchanged the truth of God for a lie , and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised ... Because of this , God gave them over to shameful lusts . Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones . In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another . Men committed indecent acts with other men , and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion . You 've rewritten Biblical Christianity . 2 Timothy 4:3-4 ( New International Version ) - For the time will come when they will not put up with sound doctrine . Instead , to suit their own desires , they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear .""",DISAGREE,"""I am a gay Christian woman , live in Northern CA , and am VERY happily MARRIED to my wife as of June of 2008""","""they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear .""",,
7278,1940,"""Mr. Jack , Abortion does n't have to be done if the amniotic sack is cut . An abortion never has to be done .""","""So you feel that Mrs Vo should have been allowed to run the risk of dying ? Your statement `` An abortion never has to be done `` only holds true if you place the value of the unborn child over that of the mother in all cases . Do you really believe that ?""",DISAGREE,"""Mr. Jack , Abortion does n't have to be done if the amniotic sack is cut . An abortion never has to be done .""","""Your statement `` An abortion never has to be done `` only holds true if you place the value of the unborn child over that of the mother in all cases .""",,
7295,1943,"""Most premature baby survivor : http : //news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070219 ... y_070219205236""","""That is amazing . I find it crazy that this baby is much younger and smaller and far less developed than many of the babies that are aborted . Abortion is murder .""",AGREE,"""Most premature baby survivor :""","""I find it crazy that this baby is much younger and smaller and far less developed than many of the babies that are aborted . Abortion is murder .""",,
7299,1944,"""As for Irreducible complex structures , one thing you have yet to understand , even though it has been explained to you at least a dozen times , is there are two methods for ic structures to evolve naturally , and indeed it has been shown this is the case""","""You know what , since simple contradiction without reason while ignoring any responses seems to be good enough for you evolutionist I will simply save my words . Evolution does not explain the advancement of life . OHH AHH , beat that one .""",DISAGREE,"""As for Irreducible complex structures , one thing you have yet to understand , even though it has been explained to you at least a dozen times""","""Evolution does not explain the advancement of life . OHH AHH , beat that one""",,
7303,1944,"""As for Irreducible complex structures , one thing you have yet to understand , even though it has been explained to you at least a dozen times , is there are two methods for ic structures to evolve naturally , and indeed it has been shown this is the case""","""You know what , since simple contradiction without reason while ignoring any responses seems to be good enough for you evolutionist I will simply save my words . Evolution does not explain the advancement of life . OHH AHH , beat that one .""",DISAGREE,"""As for Irreducible complex structures even though it has been explained to you at least a dozen times""","""simple contradiction without reason while ignoring any responses you evolutionist I will simply save my words . Evolution does not explain the advancement of life""",,
7315,1946,"""But Miller is with Jesus ( and by extension , you ) : he says that God exists and that Christianity is true . Or , if you insist that he 's against you , you 're left with this conundrum : You call Miller and theistic evolutionists incorrect , and he calls you and anti-evolutionists incorrect ; why is your position any more logical than his ?""","""Because his , as a Christian , does n't follow the Christian Bible to anywhere near the extent that mine does .""",DISAGREE,"""You call Miller and theistic evolutionists incorrect , and he calls you and anti-evolutionists incorrect ; why is your position any more logical than his ?""","""Because his , as a Christian , does n't follow the Christian Bible""",,
7326,1948,"""You consider this refuting my evidence ? What amazes me is that you all scoff at creationism , yet this is the best most of you can offer to refute scientific evidence which supports the flood . A ) I 'm not a member there . And 2 ) have you ever whistled in the wind ? Why would I waste my time on a forum which specializes in promoting the evo lies and scientific distortions in order to defend their cult religion which seek to erase God from the equation regarding how we came to be ?""","""Archie , why should anyone even bother with you ? You ask someone to explain polystrate fossils-three people do . You plug your ears and go `` la-la-la , I ca n't hear you `` , then demand that someone explain polystrate fossils . Someone else posts 100 categories of evidence against a global flood , and you wave it away as `` evo lies `` . Yet you demand we take your biased site at face value . I swear , you get dumber by the minute .""",DISAGREE,"""scoff at creationism , scientific distortions""","""polystrate polystrate fossils""",,
7334,1948,"""You consider this refuting my evidence ? What amazes me is that you all scoff at creationism , yet this is the best most of you can offer to refute scientific evidence which supports the flood . A ) I 'm not a member there . And 2 ) have you ever whistled in the wind ? Why would I waste my time on a forum which specializes in promoting the evo lies and scientific distortions in order to defend their cult religion which seek to erase God from the equation regarding how we came to be ?""","""Archie , why should anyone even bother with you ? You ask someone to explain polystrate fossils-three people do . You plug your ears and go `` la-la-la , I ca n't hear you `` , then demand that someone explain polystrate fossils . Someone else posts 100 categories of evidence against a global flood , and you wave it away as `` evo lies `` . Yet you demand we take your biased site at face value . I swear , you get dumber by the minute .""",DISAGREE,"""Why would I waste my time on a forum""","""why should anyone even bother with you ?""",,
7339,1949,"""It varies . Sometimes elementary/middle school kids and sometimes older minors like high school kids . I not talking about gangbangers if this is where you 're going .""","""How do you know none of the `` children `` were actually gang members engaged in illegal activity , and that fact was simply excluded because it was n't considered newsworthy ?""",DISAGREE,"""Sometimes elementary/middle school kids and sometimes older minors like high school kids . I not talking about gangbangers""","""How do you know none of the `` children `` were actually gang members engaged in illegal activity""",,
7392,1957,"""And if I /worship/ anything , it 'd be reason and thought .""","""Ahh . Now I see why you turned into an agnostic , if you even believed Christianity in the first place .""",DISAGREE,"""reason and thought""","""agnostic Christianity""",,
7396,1958,"""1 ) Show me one instance where science transplanted a group of animals to a new environment and observed them for multiple generations to see if new traits quickly/purposefully/nonrandomly emerged .""","""Zoos are indeed a good example . Although the environments are made as close as possible to the natural habitats , penguins are often kept in open-air enclosures in temperate or even tropical climates . And there are two critical differences in even the most carefully constructed zoo : the absence of any predators , and the absence of any prey . So why do n't the animals quickly/purposefully/nonrandomly cease exhibiting developmentally costly traits which give them an advantage against predators or prey who are n't present ?""",DISAGREE,"""a group of animals to a new environment and observed""","""Although the environments are made as close as possible to the natural habitats""",,
7399,1958,"""1 ) Show me one instance where science transplanted a group of animals to a new environment and observed them for multiple generations to see if new traits quickly/purposefully/nonrandomly emerged .""","""Zoos are indeed a good example . Although the environments are made as close as possible to the natural habitats , penguins are often kept in open-air enclosures in temperate or even tropical climates . And there are two critical differences in even the most carefully constructed zoo : the absence of any predators , and the absence of any prey . So why do n't the animals quickly/purposefully/nonrandomly cease exhibiting developmentally costly traits which give them an advantage against predators or prey who are n't present ?""",DISAGREE,"""Show me one instance where science transplanted a group of animals to a new environment""","""Zoos are indeed a good example .""",,
7426,1965,"""I 'm curious how the YECs could use this in an argument since the process described could hardly occur in nature .""","""They ca n't , if you value science and common sense , however , science and common sense are irrelevent in their world .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm curious how the YECs could use this in an argument""","""They ca n't if you value science and common sense , however , science and common sense are irrelevent in their world .""",,
7428,1966,"""Do you believe that , if we have the technology , we should resurrect the dead to walk the Earth as zombies ?""","""Sigh .... what a bad question .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you believe that , if we have the technology , we should resurrect the dead to walk the Earth as zombies ?""","""Sigh .... what a bad question .""",,
7447,1971,"""Do you necessarily care for each and every other person in this world ? Well if you do n't maybe we should justify the free killing of other people as we please . I personally do care about the well being of children and i wish there was more that could be done about certain situations . Unfortunately there are people that make false facts on the availability of such things as adoption . Some of the facts on this issue are available at : http : //www.ncfa-usa.org ( I am including a link to this American site because i think most of you reading this are American ) A common misconception about pro-lifers is that they 're women-hating . This is a misconception put out by feminist groups that support abortion , the truth is there are many female pro-lifers , my pro-life group at the University of Waterloo actually consists mainly of women , sadly this may be due to the fact that women tend to care about others much more than men , affirming my above statement about caring about the children .""","""I know that not all people who are pro-life are woman-hating . I , too want to see abortion reduced to the bare minimum . I just disagree with most pro-lifers on how to accomplish that . My issue was with ROCC 's attitude in the post I was responding to . To summarize he/she said that your should n't get pregnant and if you do - you just get to deal with it . There is absolutely no regard for an individual 's situation , the attack is entirely focused on women and it offers NOTHING that will help reduce abortion . ROCC 's statement was quite woman-hating , but no , it is not indicative of the pro-life side 's feelings about women . The only times I am compelled to really think pro-lifers are anti-woman is when they have the `` pregnancy is a woman 's due punishment for promiscuity `` attitude or demand that a woman die/put her health jeapardy or demand rape victims go through with pregnancies . If you ca n't see the woman in even those most extreme situations , then you clearly have zero regard for women . I believe that abortion stands it best chance at being reduced by addressing the things that lead to unplanned pregnancy and the reasons women choose to abort . To demonize women and simply take away choice without addressing these things will not reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies , or gauarantee responsible choices . It will lead desperate women to desperate action , though ( i.e. , coat hangers ) .""",DISAGREE,"""affirming my above statement about caring about the children .""","""It will lead desperate women to desperate action , though (""",,
7452,1972,"""I have had some experience with this topic ... My father was murdered when I was 12 , the perp was convicted a year later and was charged with 1st degree murder and sentenced to death .. flash forward 24 years He ran his course of appeals and every legal proceeding you can imagine . His lawyer after 20 years of him being on death row came up with `` retardation `` Mind you he `` walked `` 3 times .. all of which I was there to witness . I was to be a witness to the execution by request of my grandmother who has passed on . anyway at the last minute he got a stay of execution . Back to the drawing table .. Last year after several hearings , they came to the conclusion the he was mentally retarded .. scoring a 75 on his IQ test . The limit for the death penalty is 70 . He was a high school graduate , had a family , held jobs .. and clearly competent , nonetheless they found him otherwise . So now he is off death row , and the DA has told me that it is possible he could get parole eventually . With all that it has been a very trying time for me and I have had to struggle with how I really felt about the death penalty . I have been a supporter but never really could my put heart into my conviction . I do not know if it is out of revenge or not , hard to say I am too close to the matter . But I did feel let down when they took him off death row , now I feel like there will never be justice . I put so many years of waiting for that moment ... it sounds kind of sick , but as much as I dreaded witnessing it , I also looked forward to it . I do think that maybe life in prison may be better , only if his experience there is just awful .... but the revenge side of me , just wants him to suffer what my father suffered . but if you were to ask me to think about this the old fashion way , which would be I should be the one to flip the switch .. not so sure I could do it . so with all that I still do n't really know if I in my heart , support the death penalty or I am just after revenge . The victims of violence I would imagine go through this struggle . Side note ... the man who murdered my father also killed a young girl when he was a minor ... he had escaped from the correctional facility he was in .. and it was several years later when he killed my dad .""","""So sorry , Anastasia ... that 's a horrible thing to face . And now , using that excuse ? What ! If justice was swift for the guilty then he would not have escaped only to do it again . Some criminals never change , and via your testimony , only live to do it again . There are some who need to be put to death . Your situation made me shudder , Anastasia . But , I am glad you did n't let it ( revenge ) effect you to the point of taking his life yourself . If it would have been my father , those many years ago , I can not say that I would have waited , nor would have accepted that lame excuse of retardation . I could very well be in prison myself .""",AGREE,"""I was to be a witness to the execution by request of my grandmother who has passed on .""","""are some who need to be put to death . Your situation made me shudder , Anastasia .""",,
7463,1975,"""... I am not sure your wealth makes you different from someone else . It means you wealth is unequal .. we are talking about just people . We all end up 6 foot under ( so to speak ) in the end .""","""So it does n't matter that someone dies in their forties from hunger and cold because they are homeless and penniless , whilst another lives in luxury with the best food and medicines until his 80s : they are both equal ? What planet do you live on , for it sure are n't the real world ...""",DISAGREE,""" I am not sure your wealth makes you different from someone else .""","""So it does n't matter that someone dies in their forties from hunger and cold because they are homeless and penniless , whilst another lives in luxury with the best food and medicines until his 80s : they are both equal ?""",,
7464,1975,"""... I am not sure your wealth makes you different from someone else . It means you wealth is unequal .. we are talking about just people . We all end up 6 foot under ( so to speak ) in the end .""","""So it does n't matter that someone dies in their forties from hunger and cold because they are homeless and penniless , whilst another lives in luxury with the best food and medicines until his 80s : they are both equal ? What planet do you live on , for it sure are n't the real world ...""",DISAGREE,"""I am not sure your wealth makes you different from someone else . It means you wealth is unequal .. we are talking about just people . We all end up 6 foot under ( so to speak ) in the end .""","""So it does n't matter that someone dies in their forties from hunger and cold because they are homeless and penniless , whilst another lives in luxury with the best food and medicines until his 80s : they are both equal ?""",,
7484,1978,"""yeah , holding onto religion is like holding onto the ancient times . if you wish to worship a higher power , i say do it by yourself .""","""Why are you so afraid of religion ?""",DISAGREE,"""yeah , holding onto religion is like holding onto the ancient times . if you wish to worship a higher power , i say do it by yourself .""","""Why are you so afraid of religion ?""",,
7500,1981,"""How is killing a child pro child ?""","""Who is killing children ? Except for George Bush who has seen to the killing of thousands of children in Iraq .""",DISAGREE,"""How is killing a child pro child ?""","""Who is killing children ? Except for George Bush who has seen to the killing of thousands of children in Iraq .""",,
7505,1989,"""The problem will come when little Billy goes home and tells Mum that the teacher said that the Bible is wrong . Then comes the real `` controversy. ``""","""Indeed . If a teacher teaches 'the controversey ' correctly , and lays out the facts and let 's kids decide for themselves ( is that done for ANY subject ? ) , certainly , the most indoctrinated will say creation wins . But what about the open-minded ? What about the students that can actually grasp the fact that creationism offers nothing in the way of supporting evidence ? that is rests solely on trying to poke holes in evolution and appeals to biblical authority ? Those students will conclude that creatiomnism is bogus , and may cause them to question their 'beliefs . ' Two things could happen : 1. the Right -wing zealots will enforce laws making it a crime to put creationism ina poor light , forcing teachers to bow down or be fired . Conservative correctness with the force of law . 2. the Right-wing zealots will realize that their little plan backfired , and let the issue die Scarily , if this should come to pass , if things do not change much politically , I see option 1 as the most likely . During the Cold War , politicians had 'godless Soviet atheism ' to rally against with religious fervor . The Conservatives are now latching onto Fundamentalist Islam as the new 'Red Horde ' . And lots of gullible people are buying into it .""",AGREE,"""Bible is wrong""","""If a teacher teaches 'the controversey ' correctly , and lays out the facts and let 's kids decide for themselves""",,
7509,1991,"""Coincidentally , Tasers are not completely non-lethal . If your attacker has some underlying problem ( say , heart disease ) he carries a greater risk of being killed .""","""And if you wind up killing somebody with a less-lethal device then you 've got a mess of legal issues facing you . It 's better to avoid such headaches .""",DISAGREE,"""Tasers are not completely non-lethal . If your attacker has some underlying problem ( say , heart disease ) he carries a greater risk of being killed .""","""And if you wind up killing somebody with a less-lethal device then you 've got a mess of legal issues facing you .""",,
7517,1995,"""there are many who are against the theory of evolution and state there are many problems with the theory of evolution .""","""No biggie , right ? Typical creationist `` teach the controversy `` stuff . But wait ! The `` encyclopedia `` follows this up with it 's damning evidence to show the many holes in the ToE ! Read on evolutionists , and despair ! !""",DISAGREE,"""there are many who are against the theory of evolution and state there are many problems with the theory of evolution .""","""No biggie , right ? Typical creationist `` teach the controversy `` stuff . But wait ! The `` encyclopedia `` follows this up with it 's damning evidence to show the many holes in the ToE !""",,
7524,1997,"""Do you really think the paper tape is really the fundamental reason why violence is not an issue in Switzerland ?""","""Oh , it certainly is an issue . Martin Killias , a Swiss criminologist , did find a link between gun ownership and homicide in Switzerland . However , my point was to ask you if you would be willing to abide by such regulations . The law in Switzerland requires that military weapons kept in the home be unloaded and stored under lock and key . I do n't think Switzerland is a gun-nut utopia .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you really think the paper tape is really the fundamental reason why violence is not an issue in Switzerland ?""","""Oh , it certainly is an issue .""",,
7528,1999,"""And why is it that animals who do n't often change their environments are the very same animals who havent `` evolved `` in millions of years ... ie ... crocodiles , sharks , bats , etc ?""","""LOL .  “ Bats haven ’ t evolved in millions of years ”""",DISAGREE,"""And why is it that animals who do n't often change their environments are the very same animals who havent `` evolved `` in millions of years ... ie ... crocodiles , sharks , bats , etc ?""","""Bats ’ t evolved in millions of""",,
7531,2000,"""Second Island ? I 'll have no choice but to parse this for what it is ... it is agreed that mutations can exist , but they only exist laterally , like dogs for instance ... you may have a beagle , that is short and not so hairy that may develop adaptations through breeding that aid it in survival locally ... but what you will not see is a dog that develop wings because it had to fly to the closest food site .""","""So it 's shifted from `` no new structures `` to `` I can think of a structure that ca n't evolve. `` Me too . Evolutionary theory says that some things are not possible to evolve . But new structures , as you learned , do evolve .""",AGREE,"""it is agreed that mutations can exist , but they only exist laterally you will not see is a dog that develop wings""",""" Me too . Evolutionary theory says that some things are not possible to evolve . But new structures , as you learned , do evolve .""",,
7533,2000,"""Second Island ? I 'll have no choice but to parse this for what it is ... it is agreed that mutations can exist , but they only exist laterally , like dogs for instance ... you may have a beagle , that is short and not so hairy that may develop adaptations through breeding that aid it in survival locally ... but what you will not see is a dog that develop wings because it had to fly to the closest food site .""","""So it 's shifted from `` no new structures `` to `` I can think of a structure that ca n't evolve. `` Me too . Evolutionary theory says that some things are not possible to evolve . But new structures , as you learned , do evolve .""",AGREE,"""it is agreed that mutations can exist , but they only exist laterally , like dogs for instance""","""So it 's shifted from `` no new structures `` to `` I can think of a structure that ca n't evolve. `` Me too .""",,
7547,2004,"""Studies of the origin of the first life form , the origin of the earth , and the origin of the universe DO form a large part of intelligent design . Of the several `` different scientific diciplines `` refered to above , they all have one thing in common since there is only one basic alternative to intelligent design , and that 's undirected , random , happenstance processes . For purposes of this debate , can we come up with one general two word phrase for the `` different scientific diciplines `` - a phrase perfectly comparable to intelligent design , which `` theory of evolution `` is clearly not ? How about `` happenstance origins `` ? Since you declare that intelligent design is not science , you have to have a criteria for science that intelligent design does n't fit . Does `` happenstance origins `` fit the same criteria ? If there is no way to test or falsify intelligent design , there is no way to test or falsify happenstance origins . If intelligent design is n't repeatable , happenstance origins are n't repeatable . Other scientists ca n't apply a scientific method to happenstance origins to get the same kind of results as the original scientist , and on and on . Evolutionists imply that with time , they may be able to scientifically get to the bottom of happenstance origins . That 's no more ( or less ) plausible than intelligent design advocates claim to be able to scientifically get to the bottom of intelligent design . If you demand to know how we can prove intelligent design is false or true before we consider it as science , why ca n't the same be asked of you before you consider the progressive steps of happenstance origins to be science ?""","""Happenstance origins is my term , taken from two easily definable words . It means origins without intelligence . Origins from random , unguided , natural processes with no supernatural guidance . It is the first of about six different processes that make up the broad term `` evolution `` . It 's a process that any opposition to ID has to have . It ca n't be addressed , and it 's no more or no less scientifically equal to the unaddressed question of where an intelligent designer came from . If the unaddressable consequential steps of one lead to science , then the unaddressable consequential steps of the other equally lead to science .""",DISAGREE,"""basic alternative to intelligent design undirected , random , happenstance processes How about `` happenstance origins `` ?""","""Happenstance origins is my term Origins from random , unguided , natural processes with no supernatural guidance `` It 's a process that any opposition to ID has to have""",,
7548,2004,"""Studies of the origin of the first life form , the origin of the earth , and the origin of the universe DO form a large part of intelligent design . Of the several `` different scientific diciplines `` refered to above , they all have one thing in common since there is only one basic alternative to intelligent design , and that 's undirected , random , happenstance processes . For purposes of this debate , can we come up with one general two word phrase for the `` different scientific diciplines `` - a phrase perfectly comparable to intelligent design , which `` theory of evolution `` is clearly not ? How about `` happenstance origins `` ? Since you declare that intelligent design is not science , you have to have a criteria for science that intelligent design does n't fit . Does `` happenstance origins `` fit the same criteria ? If there is no way to test or falsify intelligent design , there is no way to test or falsify happenstance origins . If intelligent design is n't repeatable , happenstance origins are n't repeatable . Other scientists ca n't apply a scientific method to happenstance origins to get the same kind of results as the original scientist , and on and on . Evolutionists imply that with time , they may be able to scientifically get to the bottom of happenstance origins . That 's no more ( or less ) plausible than intelligent design advocates claim to be able to scientifically get to the bottom of intelligent design . If you demand to know how we can prove intelligent design is false or true before we consider it as science , why ca n't the same be asked of you before you consider the progressive steps of happenstance origins to be science ?""","""Happenstance origins is my term , taken from two easily definable words . It means origins without intelligence . Origins from random , unguided , natural processes with no supernatural guidance . It is the first of about six different processes that make up the broad term `` evolution `` . It 's a process that any opposition to ID has to have . It ca n't be addressed , and it 's no more or no less scientifically equal to the unaddressed question of where an intelligent designer came from . If the unaddressable consequential steps of one lead to science , then the unaddressable consequential steps of the other equally lead to science .""",DISAGREE,"""If there is no way to test or falsify intelligent design , there is no way to test or falsify happenstance origins .""","""It 's no more or no less scientifically equal to the unaddressed question of where an intelligent designer came from""",,
7555,2005,"""..... but like I said earlier ToE does not admit that the diet or any enviornmental variable can influence traits in offspring . Traits are dictated by genes and genes are closed off from the enviornment . This is the basic dogma of Weismann 's barrier .""","""Actually it is n't . No , really , it is n't ; I 'm not making this up ; I think you 've genuinely crossed a wire somewhere there . Traits are partially described by genes ; they 're the starting point - as you once put it , the 'hard drive ' - but the process of turning genes into an organism is unquestionably influenced by the environment - chemically , thermally etc etc . That 's one reason frogs need so damn many genes while placental animals can get away with a lot fewer : frogspawn have to tolerate such widely varying temperatures during development and need proteins that work correctly at all those temperatures , whereas mammalian foetuses develop in a chemically and thermally regulated environment . Weismann 's barrier says only that hereditary information moves from genes to body cells but never in reverse . The genes provide the starting point , the developmental process - modulated by environmental factors - turns that information into an organism , but there 's no feedback . Retroviruses might constitute a hole in that barrier , which opens up some interesting possibilities . Anyway , the point is , the ToE as it stands does not say , in any shape or form , that genes alone dictate traits and nothing else gets a look in . What it does say is that although the environment can modulate the eventual phenotype during development , it ca n't directly feed back the results of expressing those genes to the genotype . The environment can only have an indirect 'say ' in the genotype of organisms , by allowing some to flourish and inhibiting the success of others . That 's why , in the other thread where we 're discussing the butterflies , I describe the Darwinian process of arriving at environmental sensitivity in the way I do : the environment modulates the phenotype differently in the different seasons ( based on chemical or thermal variation ) and Natural Selection , in this case , is the organisms with genes that consistently yield the 'best ' phenotypes in that variable environment flourishing better . Simmer for a couple of million years and ... well , there you go .""",DISAGREE,"""but like I said earlier ToE does not admit that the diet or any enviornmental variable can influence traits in offspring .""","""Actually it is n't . No , really , it is n't""",,
7557,2005,"""..... but like I said earlier ToE does not admit that the diet or any enviornmental variable can influence traits in offspring . Traits are dictated by genes and genes are closed off from the enviornment . This is the basic dogma of Weismann 's barrier .""","""Actually it is n't . No , really , it is n't ; I 'm not making this up ; I think you 've genuinely crossed a wire somewhere there . Traits are partially described by genes ; they 're the starting point - as you once put it , the 'hard drive ' - but the process of turning genes into an organism is unquestionably influenced by the environment - chemically , thermally etc etc . That 's one reason frogs need so damn many genes while placental animals can get away with a lot fewer : frogspawn have to tolerate such widely varying temperatures during development and need proteins that work correctly at all those temperatures , whereas mammalian foetuses develop in a chemically and thermally regulated environment . Weismann 's barrier says only that hereditary information moves from genes to body cells but never in reverse . The genes provide the starting point , the developmental process - modulated by environmental factors - turns that information into an organism , but there 's no feedback . Retroviruses might constitute a hole in that barrier , which opens up some interesting possibilities . Anyway , the point is , the ToE as it stands does not say , in any shape or form , that genes alone dictate traits and nothing else gets a look in . What it does say is that although the environment can modulate the eventual phenotype during development , it ca n't directly feed back the results of expressing those genes to the genotype . The environment can only have an indirect 'say ' in the genotype of organisms , by allowing some to flourish and inhibiting the success of others . That 's why , in the other thread where we 're discussing the butterflies , I describe the Darwinian process of arriving at environmental sensitivity in the way I do : the environment modulates the phenotype differently in the different seasons ( based on chemical or thermal variation ) and Natural Selection , in this case , is the organisms with genes that consistently yield the 'best ' phenotypes in that variable environment flourishing better . Simmer for a couple of million years and ... well , there you go .""",DISAGREE,"""ToE does not admit that the diet or any enviornmental variable can influence traits in offspring .""","""the ToE as it stands does not say , in any shape or form , that genes alone dictate traits and nothing else gets a look in""",,
7573,2008,"""The purpose of this thread is to discuss recent findings on the optimality of the genetic code . Selected articles in the OP include the following : Early Fixation of an Optimal Genetic Code Evolution of the genetic code : partial optimization of a random code for robustness to translation error in a rugged fitness landscape The genetic code is nearly optimal for allowing additional information within protein-coding sequences An extension of the coevolution theory of the origin of the genetic code Can the genetic code be mathematically described ? On the Hypercube Structure of the Genetic Code Topological structure of the triplet genetic code A Neutral Origin for Error Minimization in the Genetic Code . Does codon bias have an evolutionary origin ? A chemical toolkit for proteins & # 8212 ; an expanded genetic code Evolution and multilevel optimization of the genetic code Feel free to add more interesting articles as the discussion continues . Article 1 Thus , to begin , in the first article it was determined by the researchers that : No better codes out of a million biosynthetically restricted codes . This conclusion might be misleading though ( addressed here ) , as the paper states that the tested codes were from a biosynthetically restricted set based on the current hypothesis of the evolution of the genetic code from pre-biotic scenarios . When not viewed from this point of view , other , more optimized codes are possible . The next article ( nr 2 ) shows that : Thus showing in that analysis which include all possible codes ( not only biosynthetically restricted codes ) that the genetic code is partially optimal with regards to error minimization . It should be noted though that analysis only included a subset of the possible optimality feature of the code . From article 3 The analysis above did not include other nearly optimal features of the genetic code including : A ) The actual code is far better than other possible codes in minimizing the number of amino acids incorporated until translation is interrupted after a frameshift error occurred . B ) The code is highly optimal for encoding arbitrary additional information , i.e. , information other than the amino acid sequence in protein-coding sequences . Thus , two more features for which the code is close to being optimal . What is interesting about these two optimal features is that they may facilitate evolution i.e . the code is primed for the future by being optimal in allowing future incorporation of additional information . In article nr.4 The coevolution theory of the origin of the genetic code is discussed . The theory suggests that the genetic code is an imprint of the biosynthetic ( biosynthetically restricted ) relationships between amino acids . A few interesting observations can be made : Firstly , from the article : It should be noted that other exotic amino acids are also used by a few other codes ( derived form the original ) . E.g . Selenocysteine and pyrrolysine are encoded for in many archaea and vertebrates . Archaea , however seem to be the most primitive organisms , thus these encoded amino acids must have been fixated early on . Thus an interesting question can be applied to an `` evolving `` code as posited in the above quote : Are these `` still evolving `` mRNAs , still evolving ? Or did it hit an inevitable global optimum ? Secondly , from the article : Is it correct to assume that in the presence of the precursors of the standard genetic code ( e.g . intermediates of glucose degradation and the citric acid cycle ) , the intimate relationship between these molecules resulted in the inevitable organization of the genetic code ( global optimum of the system ) ? Articles 5-7 These articles discuss fascinating mathematical representation of the genetic code . For example , in article 6 a representation of the genetic code as a six & # 8211 ; dimensional Boolean hypercube is proposed . Abstract : Article 8 : In this article it once again discusses the optimality of the code and a few fascinating conclusions were made . For example : Also form the article : Thus , an important point is raised : The article cautions on blithely using natural selection as an explanation for the features of the genetic code . Article 9 : In this article , the functional integrity and how the architecture of the code relates to it is discussed . From the article : Thus , the properties of the code allow it to maintain its own functional integrity . Also form the article : The maintenance of the integrity of the code is not dependent on selection , but dependent on internal variables ( feedback system ) for maintaining functional integrity . Again , showing another form of optimality . In article 10 : Fascinating research was conducted whereby a sundry of different unnatural amino acids with novel three and four base codons have been selectively incorporated ( engineered ) into proteins yielding viable organisms . An intriguing question arises from this research . It is easy to imagine these to arise through chance and selection ( e.g . amino acids with photoaffinity ) and then be incorporated into the standard code . Yet the code seems to remain stagnant . For billions of year after fixation , little evolution happened in the code . Why ? Did it arrive at a global optimum in a pre-existing fitness landscape , with a pre-existing fitness function ? Finally , Article 11 : The article cites many of the optimal properties above and concludes : Indeed . The genetic code sure is interesting . Whatever the explanation for the origins of the code , whether intentional agency , only RV+NS , self-organization or a combination of these , the fact that these processes converged on a single , reasonably optimal code that is able to facilitate evolution makes it look like it was an inevitable result from the system . The system seems to be rigged and biased towards certain outcomes similar to the evolution of life .""","""Again , as an ignorant layman , I can only get the gist of this material , but how anyone could possibly argue against the genetic code as a product of intelligent design is beyond me .""",DISAGREE,"""maintenance of the integrity of the code is not dependent on selection""","""how anyone could possibly argue against the genetic code as a product of intelligent design is beyond me""",,
7579,2009,"""At what stage does the fetus have the possibility of being self-aware ?""","""Self-awareness ' is not a strictly objective , scientific term . I recall reading in my college psychology textbooks that the concept labeled 'self-awareness ' does n't happen until many months after birth . At the end of the day , in order to answer the question , I think you 'd need a pretty solid definition of self-awareness , and coming to agreement on what 'self-awareness ' is or should be may not be an easy task . In a strictly biological sense , there is no debate that the biological life of a mammal begins at the point of conception/fertilization . There is no reasonable dispute to this observed fact . Only when subjective terms such as 'self-awareness ' and 'personhood , ' etc . come into play can there be valid debates . Show me a biologist or embryologist who states that the biological development of a unique mammal does not begin at conception/fertilization , and I 'll show you a semantics game . It is perfectly valid for someone to have the opinion that 'life ' begins with recordable brain activity ( as early as 40-days post-conception ) ... or 'self-awareness ' or any other such concept , or when the entity would be 'viable ' outside the womb . But there are varying levels of brain activity . There is no agreed upon definition of self-awareness . And viability is an ever-changing concept ( a 12-week fetus was delivered recently in Minnesota , and as far as I know is still alive and doing well -- please feel free to update me if you have heard any other news ) . If we look to biology to answer the question of when a unique entity begins its biological development that will not end until it 'dies , ' then the answer is conception/fertilization .""",DISAGREE,"""At what stage does the fetus have the possibility of being self-aware ?""","""the concept labeled 'self-awareness ' does n't happen until many months after birth .""",,
7581,2009,"""At what stage does the fetus have the possibility of being self-aware ?""","""Self-awareness ' is not a strictly objective , scientific term . I recall reading in my college psychology textbooks that the concept labeled 'self-awareness ' does n't happen until many months after birth . At the end of the day , in order to answer the question , I think you 'd need a pretty solid definition of self-awareness , and coming to agreement on what 'self-awareness ' is or should be may not be an easy task . In a strictly biological sense , there is no debate that the biological life of a mammal begins at the point of conception/fertilization . There is no reasonable dispute to this observed fact . Only when subjective terms such as 'self-awareness ' and 'personhood , ' etc . come into play can there be valid debates . Show me a biologist or embryologist who states that the biological development of a unique mammal does not begin at conception/fertilization , and I 'll show you a semantics game . It is perfectly valid for someone to have the opinion that 'life ' begins with recordable brain activity ( as early as 40-days post-conception ) ... or 'self-awareness ' or any other such concept , or when the entity would be 'viable ' outside the womb . But there are varying levels of brain activity . There is no agreed upon definition of self-awareness . And viability is an ever-changing concept ( a 12-week fetus was delivered recently in Minnesota , and as far as I know is still alive and doing well -- please feel free to update me if you have heard any other news ) . If we look to biology to answer the question of when a unique entity begins its biological development that will not end until it 'dies , ' then the answer is conception/fertilization .""",DISAGREE,"""what stage does the fetus have the possibility of being self-aware ?""","""There is no agreed upon definition of self-awareness""",,
7601,2013,"""Yeah , sure your right . Take Ellen for example . It was not too long ago ... or perhaps it was ( I 'm getting old ) that she came out of the closet screaming about being gay ... and how proud she was to finally be able to say it out loud .""","""And that 's when her career and popularity took a nosedive . Now that she 's no longer playing the activist , she 's becoming popular again .""",AGREE,"""sure your right""","""when her career and popularity took a nosedive""",,
7600,2013,"""Yeah , sure your right . Take Ellen for example . It was not too long ago ... or perhaps it was ( I 'm getting old ) that she came out of the closet screaming about being gay ... and how proud she was to finally be able to say it out loud .""","""And that 's when her career and popularity took a nosedive . Now that she 's no longer playing the activist , she 's becoming popular again .""",AGREE,"""she came out of the closet screaming about being gay ... and how proud she was""","""that 's when her career and popularity took a nosedive""",,
7599,2013,"""Yeah , sure your right . Take Ellen for example . It was not too long ago ... or perhaps it was ( I 'm getting old ) that she came out of the closet screaming about being gay ... and how proud she was to finally be able to say it out loud .""","""And that 's when her career and popularity took a nosedive . Now that she 's no longer playing the activist , she 's becoming popular again .""",AGREE,"""how proud she was to finally be able to say it out loud .""","""Now that she 's no longer playing the activist , she 's becoming popular again .""",,
7608,2015,"""I see that no one has responded to the primary point of the post - that being that as Evolution is a naturalistic science and is , by definition , exclusionary to the supernatural , it can not be used to prove or disprove creation . Equally , as ( young earth ) creation is based on the Bible , and therefore rules out a completely naturalistic means to life as it exists today , it also can not be used to prove or disprove evolution . The two ideas are alternatives to each other , not proofs against one another . Frequently in creation vs evolution discussions I see 'creation is wrong because x , y , z aspects of evolution disprove it ' . Or , 'evolution is wrong because x.y.z aspects of creation disprove it ' . This , however is fallicious . The ideas are merely alternatives . Can we agree that the merit of each theory is separate and must stand on it 's own evidence irrespective of the other theory ?""","""I think i disagree with the majority of people that have already posted here . evolution and creationism are mutually exclusive , and the both can not be true at the same time , since there can be only one true way that life originated ( even though i know that `` evolution `` is not the correct term to describe the origin of life , and die-hard evolutionist might chew me out for using it wrongly . I prefer to use the term `` spontaneous origin `` rather than `` evolution `` ) . since creationism and the collection of spontaneous origin theories are mutually exclusive and can not coexist , then upon proving either you automatically disprove the other . and if a 3rd unforseen theory is proven as the real way life originated on earth , then it would automatically disprove the both creationism and the current spontaneous origin theories the 2 concepts are pretty much diametrically opposed right now , both competing for evidence to support its case , and a strengthening of one theory automatically implies a weakening of the other""",DISAGREE,"""The two ideas are alternatives to each other , not proofs against one another .""","""evolution and creationism are mutually exclusive , and the both can not be true at the same time ,""",,
7625,2018,"""Another view of this nylon-eating-bug is given ... `` Finally , Mr Cerutti is out of date about this new nylon digesting ability allegedly from a frame shift . New evidence shows that the ability was due to plasmids [ e.g . K. Kato , et al. , ? A plasmid encoding enzymes for nylon oligomer degradation : Nucleotide sequence analysis of pOAD2 ? , Microbiology ( Reading ) 141 ( 10 ) :2585 ? 2590 , 1995 . ] In fact , more than one species of bacteria have the ability , residing on plasmids . This suggests that the information probably already existed , and was just passed between different types of bacteria. `` '' All that would be needed to enable an enzyme to digest nylon is a mutation causing loss of specificity in a proteolytic ( protein-degrading ) enzyme . This may seem surprising ? How would a loss of information create a new ability ? Answer : enzymes are usually tuned very precisely to only one type of molecule ( the substrate ) . Loss of information would reduce the effectiveness of its primary function , but would enable it to degrade other substrates , too . Since both nylon and proteins are broken down by breaking amide linkages , a change in a proteolytic enzyme could also allow it to work on nylon . If this process were continued , the result would be a general enzyme with a weakly catalytic effect on the hydrolysis of too many chemicals to be useful where much selectivity is required . To put it into perspective , acids and alkalis also catalyze many hydrolysis reactions , but they also lack specificity . Indeed , an inhibitor of a protein degrading enzyme also inhibits the action of the nylon degrading enzyme `` http : //www.answersingenesis.org/home ... e7-24-2000.asp Talkorigins gave their usual doubletalk `` Whilst this particular case does not `` prove `` evolution , it is consistent with , and supportive of , the theory of biological evolution. `` Why do they say this ? Because it 's still a bacteria . It 's not like it suddenly became a large multi-cellular organism . But it might just prove that this bug was so well designed that it can cope with newer situations . One site does say that it , the bacteria , had the capability already within it of change ? not resultant in ? mutations ? , but more like switching on previously dormant apparatus . http : //members.tripod.com/aslodge/id89.htm One poster on another forum summed the problem up like this ... `` In order for species to advance there would have to be a net information gain , which is n't the case with nylon eating bacteria . The bacteria gained the ability to digest nylon , therefore was able to survive in a new environment . Two distinct advantages But , the bacteria lost its ability to survive in its old environment , eat its former diet and suffered a 98 % loss in efficiency . Three disadvantages . So by taking two steps forward and three steps backward , where is the net gain ? If nylon eating bacteria was `` proof `` of evolution , we would still be pond scum , but with the ability to digest whatever happened to become the primary food source. `` http : //www.christianforums.com/t52336""","""None of these alternate views go outside the framework of evolution . They all use poor wording , though , and try to lead one to some conclusion about `` information `` or something .""",DISAGREE,"""Finally , Mr Cerutti is out of date about this new nylon digesting ability allegedly from a frame shift . ''""","""None of these alternate views go outside the framework of evolution .""",,
7629,2019,"""Explain what you mean by the laws of physics .""","""The laws of physics are short , descriptive statements that describe the operation of certain natural phenomena that always seem to occur in the same way . Many times the `` laws of physics `` have been amended by further information , causing the law to be restated . Actually , I think he meant the way that we have observed the universe and all of nature to operate .""",AGREE,"""what you mean by the laws of physics .""","""The laws of physics are short , descriptive statements ``""",,
7640,2021,"""First of all not all Astronomers believe that . All though it is a very long way to the closest star we really do n't know how far stars are away from us it is not possible to know . It is an educated guess at best .""","""It 's not tough , especially for close stars . http : //www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/CosmosNotes/distance.htm You use triangulation based on the orbit of the earth .""",DISAGREE,"""It is an educated guess at best .""","""It 's not tough , especially for close stars .""",,
7644,2022,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional but who really needs an assult rifle anyway , unless to go on a shooting spree i dont think anyone would go `` hunting `` with an ak47 , you wouldnt be able to keep much of what you shot""","""Who are you to tell me which `` tools `` I need ? The second amendment has NOTHING to do with hunting and in a free country again I ask if I am not a criminal what threat do I pose to you if I have a friggin howitzer ? BTW Sterm Guerrer ( or something close ) was a termed coined by the NAZIS for a small fully automatic weapon ( i.e . MP44 or todays MP5 ) translate sterm guerer it is `` ASSAULT WEAPON `` . Know the sources of things and the motives become clear . MOLON LABE ! !""",DISAGREE,"""i dont think anyone would go `` hunting `` with an ak47 , you wouldnt be able to keep much of what you shot""","""Who are you to tell me which `` tools `` I need ? The second amendment has NOTHING to do with hunting and in a free country again I ask if I am not a criminal what threat do I pose to you if I have a friggin howitzer ?""",,
7658,2025,"""What makes you so certain that the minority is right on this issue ?""","""Well , now this is the question that really matters , and the answer is a long one . But to state it as simply as possible : denying same-sex marriage hurts many people . It forces same-sex couples to pay for the marriage of opposite-sex couples while no one is forced to pay for their marriages . It denies them access to raise children and ability to cover their children and spouses with their medical insurance , along with the many other benefits of marriage . It uses the law to teach the people that the lifestyle and religion held by same-sex couples is wrong , and this forces them to feel the disapproval of society . There is no reason to perpetuate these harms . I have heard many arguments opposed to same-sex marriage , but there is not even one of them that justifies these harms . In fact , I would even say that there is not one argument against same-sex marriage that makes logical sense at all . Thus , even if same-sex marriage brought no benefits , there would be no reason to keep it illegal ; a free and equal society does not deny rights or benefits to anyone , unless it has a very good reason to . And there just is n't any reason to deny rights and benefits to same-sex couples .""",DISAGREE,"""What makes you so certain that the minority is right on this issue ?""","""denying same-sex marriage hurts many people . It forces same-sex couples to pay for the marriage of opposite-sex couples while no one is forced to pay for their marriages . It denies them access to raise children and ability to cover their children and spouses with their medical insurance , along with the many other benefits of marriage . It uses the law to teach the people that the lifestyle and religion held by same-sex couples is wrong , and this forces them to feel the disapproval of society . There is no reason to perpetuate these harms .""",,
7659,2025,"""What makes you so certain that the minority is right on this issue ?""","""Well , now this is the question that really matters , and the answer is a long one . But to state it as simply as possible : denying same-sex marriage hurts many people . It forces same-sex couples to pay for the marriage of opposite-sex couples while no one is forced to pay for their marriages . It denies them access to raise children and ability to cover their children and spouses with their medical insurance , along with the many other benefits of marriage . It uses the law to teach the people that the lifestyle and religion held by same-sex couples is wrong , and this forces them to feel the disapproval of society . There is no reason to perpetuate these harms . I have heard many arguments opposed to same-sex marriage , but there is not even one of them that justifies these harms . In fact , I would even say that there is not one argument against same-sex marriage that makes logical sense at all . Thus , even if same-sex marriage brought no benefits , there would be no reason to keep it illegal ; a free and equal society does not deny rights or benefits to anyone , unless it has a very good reason to . And there just is n't any reason to deny rights and benefits to same-sex couples .""",DISAGREE,"""makes you so certain that the minority is right""","""It forces same-sex couples to pay for the marriage of opposite-sex couples while no one is forced to pay for their marriages""",,
7661,2026,"""I do n't know what exactly to think of it only I think it saves us the cost of prisons !""","""I would favor capital punishment IF our system was always fair and equal , it is not ..... would O.J . have walked if he had been a poor man ? I would support capital punishment if we only convicted guilty men ... that is not the case . The list of men on death row who were found to be innocent and released is long and growing , and we can only guess how many innocents have been put to death . To me the harshest punishment would be to wake up knowing that this day would be like yesterday and tomorrow will be like today - for the rest of my life . Anyone who has had surgery can tell you that being put to sleep with chemicals is absolutely painless . Deterrent ? Do states with the death penalty have a lower murder per capita than those that do ? From a fiscal standpoint , it is cheaper to keep the convicted in prison for life than it is to execute them , and a whole lot easier to correct an error . Will we continue to have state sanctioned revenge ? Probably . Dono""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't know what exactly to think of it only I think it saves us the cost of prisons !""","""From a fiscal standpoint , it is cheaper to keep the convicted in prison for life than it is to execute them , and a whole lot easier to correct an error""",,
7665,2027,"""Do not deceive yourself into thinking that `` literal `` Biblical Creation would be proved true if evolution were proven false . We would need a third theory .""","""Actually there are already a couple floating around . One fascinating one : Gaia theory and the Daisyworld model . It 's all around self-organising systems and the earth as a self-regulating system/organsism/something or other . James Lovelock and co . Interesting to read but sometimes feels a little too 'lets-all-just-get-along ' to be real , hard-core theory . Either way , it 's probably a lot more likely to be accepted than creationism , should evolutionism for some reason be disproved .""",AGREE,"""Do not deceive yourself into thinking that `` literal `` Biblical Creation would be proved true if evolution were proven false . We would need a third theory .""","""Actually there are already a couple floating around .""",,
7689,2034,"""There is a huge difference between fission and fusion . fission bad , fusion good .""","""Oh yeah , generalizations are cool ! Let 's all jump on this bandwagon ! Black people bad , white people good . Muslims bad , Christians good . Fission bad , fusion good . Geez .""",DISAGREE,"""is a huge difference between fission and fusion . fission bad , fusion good .""","""Oh yeah , generalizations are cool ! Let 's all jump on this bandwagon ! Black people bad , white people good . Muslims bad , Christians good . Fission bad , fusion good . Geez .""",,
7696,2036,"""I suppose the only way to prove this theory is to show where those particles originated . Else to quote Crim it is merely `` magic `` .""","""Not knowing is n't the same as claiming magic .""",DISAGREE,"""Else to Crim it is merely `` magic `` .""","""Not knowing is n't the same as claiming magic .""",,
7704,2038,"""( this is satire by the way )""","""And a good one at that . I can hear the wheels a-spinnin & # 8217 ;""",DISAGREE,"""this is satire by the way""","""And a good one at that""",,
7719,2041,"""Biologically speaking , the fetus is human ...""","""But psychologically speaking , a first trimester fetus is not a being since it lacks sentience . DNA is all it takes to confirm that something is human ; like your fingernail pairings .""",DISAGREE,"""Biologically speaking , the fetus is human ...""","""DNA is all it takes to confirm that something is human ; like your fingernail pairings .""",,
7734,2044,"""Not too wordy as much as too BS ' y . Ok , how about ... currently legal physician inflicted murder of unborn humans ?""","""I think jyoshu has posted a BS meter which is pretty nice .""",AGREE,"""Not too wordy as much as too BS ' y .""","""I think jyoshu has posted a BS meter which is pretty nice .""",,
7736,2052,"""I agree . How can a god that has shown us no suffician evidence of his existance , expect us to believe in him/her . I do believe in a higher power , but not a `` God `` , not one who judges , or hates , or does whatever . We personify god . People create , and people judge . Not `` god `` .""","""Thats a very compact piece of logic . I imagine that you are a very efficient individual .""",DISAGREE,"""How can a god that has shown us no suffician evidence of his existance""","""I imagine that you are a very efficient individual .""",,
7742,2053,"""I 'd congratulate you on your win DamEtel , but I 'm more impressed with your patience .""","""Well , I personally agree that I 'spanked ' marc9000 ( http : //www.4forums.com/political/showthread.php ? t=6348 ) . But we 'll have to leave it to the judges to make the formal decision .""",AGREE,"""I 'd congratulate you on your win DamEtel""","""I personally agree that I 'spanked ' marc9000""",,
7752,2056,"""Sounds like a caper to me , when you going to start Clive/peddler ?""","""Just as soon as peddler 's cheek stops stinging and he picks the glove up ...""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds like a caper to me , when you going to start Clive/peddler ?""","""Just as soon as peddler 's cheek stops stinging and he picks the glove up""",,
7758,2057,"""This was the second escape for Paul . In 1991 , he walked away during a day trip in Medical Lake and was later captured . He attacked a sheriff 's deputy in the jail booking area , knocking him unconscious , and was convicted of first-degree escape and second-degree assault . Phillip Paul had a normal childhood in Sunnyside and was popular , but he started acting strangely as a high school student . He said he was hearing voices and thought they were witches , Tom Paul said . He was diagnosed with schizophrenia .""","""Yep , the cops will protect you as will the State Is that your teabagger sinjin ?""",DISAGREE,"""He attacked a sheriff 's""","""Yep , the cops will protect you""",,
7762,2058,"""is it hard to imagine similar eyes , but are less complex on a more basic level ?""","""Yes , if the intermediate stages do n't work .""",DISAGREE,"""hard to imagine similar complex""","""Yes intermediate stages""",,
7779,2062,"""Do you mean : not to allow women to abort if they wish so is more preposterous than to equal manslaughter with abortion ?""","""I think you mean `` equate. ``""",AGREE,"""Do you mean : not to allow women to abort if they wish so is more preposterous than to equal manslaughter with abortion ?""","""I think you mean ``""",,
7780,2063,"""Have n't you seen all of the programs and News reels of people with their necks being crushed by toilet seats ? I recall seeing an Emergency Room on a Fridday night in downtown Detroit that was full of people turning blue because they had a toilet seat wrapped around their neck ! ( Some folks will say anything , eh ? LOL ! ! ! )""","""Yes they sure will .... with what 776 accidental deaths last year due to guns as opposed to 3,402 accidental drownings seems like more should be spent on preventing drownings than guns . But if your intellect is not up to understanding hyperbole ( literary form of exageration to express a point ) I will try in the future to keep it down to your level .""",DISAGREE,"""toilet seat wrapped around their neck ! ( Some folks will say anything , eh ? LOL ! ! ! )""","""But if your intellect is not up to understanding hyperbole""",,
7784,2064,"""I am not arguing the validity of that rationale , but that is at least part of the reasoning , I believe .""","""Fair enough . But I am curious to see if anyone can defend the rationality of the rationale ( whatever it is purported to be ) . You 're obviously not obliged to do that , but that is sort of the curiosity that I have .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not arguing the validity of that rationale""","""But I am curious to see if anyone can defend the rationality of the rationale""",,
7788,2065,"""If you are n't for majority rule then what are you for ? Dictatorship ? Minority rule ? Monarchy ? no rule ? I mean , give me something here .""","""OK try the US Constitution . We are a representative democratic republic not a majority rule nation . Majorities hold certain powers but they are limited . Minorities continue to have rights which may not be infringed by the majority . Amibiguity and sharing of interests in various types of personal and social decisions is a necessary component of this system . We are built on compromise and that has served us well .""",DISAGREE,"""If you are n't for majority rule then what are you for ? Dictatorship ? Minority rule ? Monarchy ? no rule ?""","""OK try the US Constitution . We are a representative democratic republic not a majority rule nation .""",,
7794,2073,"""Yeah , that kind of is the whole point of the joke , seeing both sides of the argument ( creationists/evolutionist ) it only seemed fair to make fun of them both . Notice though , that there 's no pro-religious people protesting out at this joke , they must have a sense of humour ?""","""I do n't see anyone protesting at this `` joke. `` A good joke is at least based on some reality .""",DISAGREE,"""that kind of is the whole point of the joke , seeing both sides of the argument ( creationists/evolutionist ) it only seemed fair to make fun of them both""","""I do n't see anyone protesting at this `` joke. `` A good joke is at least based on some reality .""",,
7797,2073,"""Yeah , that kind of is the whole point of the joke , seeing both sides of the argument ( creationists/evolutionist ) it only seemed fair to make fun of them both . Notice though , that there 's no pro-religious people protesting out at this joke , they must have a sense of humour ?""","""I do n't see anyone protesting at this `` joke. `` A good joke is at least based on some reality .""",DISAGREE,"""there 's no pro-religious people protesting out at this joke ,""","""I do n't see anyone protesting at this `` joke. ``""",,
7802,2074,"""foundit66 : i have several comments. . You had some interesting points . When you said that marriage does not revolve around sex , you must have overlooked the part where i stated the other most common reasons . I said exactly this : `` the most common reasons for marriage are love , sex , and preocreation . Anyone can love anyone . Anyone is capable of having sex with anyone else ( if you could call `` gay sex `` `` sex `` ) .""","""But you 're missing one important fact . NONE of those `` reasons `` are required for marriage . Absolutely none of them . Any combination of man/woman can marry for whatever reason they want . Even if it 's just drunken fun .""",DISAGREE,"""most common reasons for marriage are love , sex , and preocreation .""","""of those `` reasons `` are required for marriage . Absolutely none of them . Any combination of man/woman can marry for whatever reason they want .""",,
7816,2077,"""3 ) Crying that they did n't know what they were being interviewed for ? If they 'd have known , would they have refused to participate , or lied about something ?""","""Some of them know ( from experience , because many nutjob anti-evolutionists are positively dishonest -- like Mathis & amp ; Co. ) that statements have to be phrased carefully for at least one of ( at least ) two reasons : First , these people know a sh * tload less about the technicalities than the interviewers do ; second , words may be chosen more carefully to try to prevent snippets being used out of context . You can see both in this instance , with the explanation of one postulation involving crystals and Dawkins referring to the ultimate Darwinian development of any theoretical panspermia initiators ( which got cut off to be spun into a ridiculous quote mine ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Crying that they did n't know what they were being interviewed for ?""","""Some of them know ( from experience , because many nutjob anti-evolutionists are positively dishonest""",,
7820,2077,"""3 ) Crying that they did n't know what they were being interviewed for ? If they 'd have known , would they have refused to participate , or lied about something ?""","""Some of them know ( from experience , because many nutjob anti-evolutionists are positively dishonest -- like Mathis & amp ; Co. ) that statements have to be phrased carefully for at least one of ( at least ) two reasons : First , these people know a sh * tload less about the technicalities than the interviewers do ; second , words may be chosen more carefully to try to prevent snippets being used out of context . You can see both in this instance , with the explanation of one postulation involving crystals and Dawkins referring to the ultimate Darwinian development of any theoretical panspermia initiators ( which got cut off to be spun into a ridiculous quote mine ) .""",DISAGREE,"""they have refused to participate , or lied about something""","""technicalities than the interviewers do ; second , words may be chosen more carefully to try to prevent snippets""",,
7831,2079,"""Then there is the argument that flaws in the death penalty lay with the judiciary system , not with the actual penalty itself . While anyone can accept that a  “ perfect ” judiciary system would only send real murderers to death row , even if this were the case , it does not negate the problems mentioned before .""","""Well , what faults ? You say that innocent people are sentenced to death far too often . Well , the death penalty does not sentence people , our judiciary system does . The death penalty is mearly a punishment . I will agree that some innocent people have been sent to death row , and when their innocence was discovered , they were released . A perfect judiciary system would not sentence innocent people , and would alleviate all problems with the death penalty . If we had a perfect system and no innocent person was ever sent to death row , we could take them directy from sentencing to a little room beside the courtroom containing a bed and a few drugs , put an IV in them , and carry out the sentence before the jurors got out of the courthouse . Of course , we know that our judiciary system is an imperfect thing , so we understand the need for appeals .""",DISAGREE,"""Then there is the argument that flaws in the death penalty lay with the judiciary system , not with the actual penalty itself .""","""Well , what faults ? You say that innocent people are sentenced to death far too often""",,
7828,2079,"""Then there is the argument that flaws in the death penalty lay with the judiciary system , not with the actual penalty itself . While anyone can accept that a  “ perfect ” judiciary system would only send real murderers to death row , even if this were the case , it does not negate the problems mentioned before .""","""Well , what faults ? You say that innocent people are sentenced to death far too often . Well , the death penalty does not sentence people , our judiciary system does . The death penalty is mearly a punishment . I will agree that some innocent people have been sent to death row , and when their innocence was discovered , they were released . A perfect judiciary system would not sentence innocent people , and would alleviate all problems with the death penalty . If we had a perfect system and no innocent person was ever sent to death row , we could take them directy from sentencing to a little room beside the courtroom containing a bed and a few drugs , put an IV in them , and carry out the sentence before the jurors got out of the courthouse . Of course , we know that our judiciary system is an imperfect thing , so we understand the need for appeals .""",DISAGREE,""" perfect judiciary system would only send real murderers to death row ,""","""A perfect judiciary system would not sentence innocent people , and would alleviate all problems with the death Of course , we know that our judiciary system is an imperfect thing""",,
7845,2081,"""You missed the point of the question . I 'm not talking about 'rights ' or legal issues . I 'm wondering why pro-choice people often portray pregnancy as a horrible thing in their arguments . Period .""","""Well let 's put it this way . I really like playing baseball . So I put in a law that says everyone has to play baseball unless they 're in a position where it will threaten their life . Since it 's such a wonderful thing no one should have any problem with a law passed , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm wondering why pro-choice people often portray pregnancy as a horrible thing in their arguments . Period .""","""Well let 's put it this way . I really like playing baseball . Since it 's such a wonderful thing no one should have any problem with a law passed , right ?""",,
7853,2083,"""Intrigued , as always I went to dig a little deeper into the methods used . Generally speaking , one of the best dating methods for an amphibolite metamorphic rock would be to separate out amphiboles for Ar-Ar dating . Using the argon-argon variant of K-Ar allows many cross checks for excess argon or argon loss that are invisible to standard K-Ar dating . At the very least , a better approach would be to date the rocks using individual minerals . The worst possible method would be to measure the age on an inhomogeneous whole rock sample . In the footnotes , the methods are described as follows : Whole rock ’ samples were analyzed in all cases—K-Ar at Activation Laboratories , Ancaster , Ontario , Canada ; Rb-Sr , Sm-Nd and Pb-Pb at the PRISE Laboratory , Research School of Earth Sciences , Australian National University , Canberra , Australia . .... In short , this is a classic example of geochronology done poorly . Snelling either deliberately chose the worst rocks and the worst methods in order to guarantee strange results or was grossly incompetent . Well , ok maybe both . I also notice that the data are not given in the creation article . If someone has a more detailed description of the results , it 'd be fun to look at the individual data points more carefully . Lastly , Snelling implicitly suggests that if geochronology is not correct every single time , then it can never be trusted . Wonder if he ever gets on a airplane .""","""He has a bit more basic information about R.A.T.E . on his webpage . TO also has a page critiquing R.A.T.E . methodology . Sorry , I know you 're looking for more substantial personal feedback , but this is some good basic information that does n't rely upon a billion links . You also might consider asking this question on iidb.org , and maybe Dr. Meert will respond to you personally . More importantly , let us not get hung up on analyzing the raw empirical data only . For example , if I use a stopwatch to time how long it takes for light to flood the room after I turn on the switch , and I come up with 0.06s , you ca n't argue with my empirical data : I timed it at 0.06s . The fact that human response time is comparatively lousy and that a stopwatch is awful for extremely short time intervals is more significant that the stopwatch reading itself . This is the primary error that R.A.T.E . makes .""",AGREE,"""In short , this is a classic example of geochronology done poorly . Snelling either deliberately chose the worst rocks and the worst methods in order to guarantee strange results or was grossly incompetent . Well , ok maybe both .""","""He has a bit more basic information about R.A.T.E . on his webpage . TO also has a page critiquing R.A.T.E . methodology . Sorry , I know you 're looking for more substantial personal feedback , but this is some good basic information that does n't rely upon a billion links .""",,
7865,2085,"""Almost but not quite all ? It has been observed to change one kind of plant into another .""","""Really , did it take long ? ROFL . Did they turn grass into a tree or maybe rice into a tomato ? Got pics ?""",DISAGREE,"""It has been observed to change one kind of plant into another .""","""Did they turn grass into a tree or maybe rice into a tomato ? Got pics ?""",,
7877,2087,"""But , I guess that when one worships the Almighty Fetus , the lives of real people are of no concern .""","""the fetus would be a real person ... and it seems like .... in order to make the iraq war/abortion connection .... you would have to support the war !""",DISAGREE,"""I guess that when one worships the Almighty Fetus , the lives of real people are of no concern .""","""the fetus would be a real person""",,
7888,2089,"""Indeed , all we see in this world is extinction .""","""And speciation , and television programs ... The list is longer than that .""",AGREE,"""Indeed , all we see in this world is extinction .""","""And speciation , and television programs ... The list is longer than that .""",,
7909,2092,"""However , theism better fites the evidence than atheism .""","""That 's HIGHLY debatable . ( unless you meant fights ( fites ? ) the evidence , then I would agree . ) Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""However , theism better fites the evidence than atheism .""","""That 's HIGHLY debatable""",,
7922,2095,"""They can `` marry `` whomever they love . Benefits though , are a different matter . The state and society views marriage as an opposite-sex institution . It 's not about anyone getting harmed ; no one said it was .""","""BUt it comes down to gay people being harmed by not being allowed to marry . Any time a group is excluded because of someone elses religious beliefs that group is harmed .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not about anyone getting harmed ; no one said it was .""","""Any time a group is excluded because of someone elses religious beliefs that group is harmed .""",,
7931,2097,"""Michael Moore belongs to NRA .. he never said he was anti gun ... I worked on Bowling for Columbine , and so many people got the wrong impression""","""Oh ? You worked on Bowling ? When did the NRA and KKK ever burn a cross together ? Hmmm ? I can take a hint . Just something about that movie tells me Mike Moore is anti-gun . Hey how about Chuck Hestons speech ? Some how I got the impression he gave the speech in Denver ? Did you ? You know the 'from my dead hands speech ' . Anyhow how did Chuck Heston get to wear TWO different suits from one speech ? Anyhow . If Mike Moore of Flint Michigan was behind that counter , would Mike Moore be alive ? Survive with broken facial bones ? Survive with internal injuries ? Or overhelming beat his attacker that he survives unhurt and stopped his attacker ?""",DISAGREE,"""Michael Moore belongs to NRA .. he never said he was anti gun""","""did the NRA and KKK ever burn a cross together ? Hmmm ? I can take a hint . Just something about that movie tells me Mike Moore is anti-gun""",,
7942,2100,"""Illinois just allowed 167 death row inmates released from death row . Just in case one of them might not be guilty . I say , what about the other 166 that are guilty ?""","""Just so you know Peach , the 167 death row inmates are now serving life in prison . At least that one who 's not guilty might now have a chance to be free .""",AGREE,"""inmates""","""the are that guilty""",,
7951,2101,"""Hello , Let me see , N.O.W . that 80 % Lesbian Lot ( by their own count and definition ) , continue to whine about women not being given 'equal rights ' , all the while , 51 % of the population ( that 's women ) own the MAJORITY of the wealth , represent the greatest number of teachers , have more rights on college campuses than their male counterparts , have more legal rights than men , are given legal custody of children-even when they are drug addicts/drunks/abusers , and are overwhelmingly the recipients of alimony ( regardless of their being no children in the marriage ) . Ah yes , the 'poor victims ' of all that male power . Women start professional careers later than men , yet demand the same amount of pay that their male counterparts , get , having spent years in the corporate trenches to achieve their status and pay grades . Women continue to whine about how they are victimized by men in the USA , despite the facts to the contrary . N.O.W . has n't bothered a peep about all the Muslim women in the world being beaten , maimed , and murdered , on a daily basis ; they 're too busy complaining that some unsuspecting woman heard a 'sexist ' joke while passing by a male counterpart 's office ( one guy telling another guy a joke ) . Yes indeed , poor 'oppressed ' American women . Whiners the lot of them ; never happy and wanting to make everyone around them just as unhappy . The bottom line is this : there is nothing between a woman 's legs , which is worth putting up with that , which is between her nose and her chin . And you can quote me on that ! Keep up the whining , I 'm sure the Muslim woman being beaten to death , clitorectomies being performed with rusted razor blades , and noses being cut off , wo n't bother you a bit ; you 've got a man in the office whom you wish to undermine , or a corporation you wish to sue , for some slight against your 'womanhood . ' Cheers from the Rockies""","""Well - at least your name is right on .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm sure the Muslim woman being beaten to death , clitorectomies being performed with rusted razor blades , and noses being cut off , wo n't bother you a bit ; you 've got a man in the office whom you wish to undermine , or a corporation you wish to sue , for some slight against your 'womanhood . '""","""Well - at least your name is right on""",,
7963,2103,"""This thread follows on from a discussion elsewhere , in which I said I would consolidate the issues I have with EAM as it has been described to me . I 'd like to preface my comments with a bit of personal context . I 'm often accused of being a 'darwinist ' , the implication being that I am emotionally shackled to a particular philosophical perspective . This is not the case . Accusations of being a 'materialist ' similarly have no teeth in this discussion , for the very simple reason that if a Vital force exists and can influence the physical world then it too belongs to the natural and material , rather than the supernatural . Materialism would simply expand to accommodate it , as it has with other forces .""","""* * A couple of quick poiints . First , you are very emotionally involved in the materialist/mechanist metaphysic , whether you grasp the full implications of that metaphysic , [ beyond its denial of certain religious mythologies ] , or not . Otherwise you would not so vehemently and tenaciously defend that metaphysic against any suggerstionthatits take on reality , its ontology/cosmoly , is incorrect -- even when , as in the case of EAM , that suggestion comes from a metaphysical quarter that has no ideological connection to any religious mythology , and in fact is also antithetical to those myths .""",DISAGREE,"""Accusations of being a 'materialist ' similarly have no teeth in this discussion""","""you are very emotionally involved in the materialist/mechanist metaphysic""",,
7979,2106,"""but they do support the choice to abort a fetus or embryo . An argument made for slavery was that `` you do n't have to own them but do n't tell us what to do `` .. a fairly similar argument but does n't show whether or not abortion is wrong just that some lines of thinking should be questioned .""","""And they have . The only reason you think a fetus is equatable to a human is because it is made of organic matter . What if there was a piece of cardboard in the mothers stomach ? Its non-organic and is in the same mental state as an embryo ( that is , no mental state ) . The only difference is the matter its made out of .""",DISAGREE,"""a fairly similar argument but does n't show whether or not abortion is wrong just that some lines of thinking should be questioned .""","""The only reason you think a fetus is equatable to a human is because it is made of organic matter .""",,
7987,2107,"""Barbarian observes : It 's remarkable then , how much progress we 've made . You may or may not approve of the theory , but it works very well at learning more about biology . And , as you may have noticed , we 've been very successful at interpreting the data . We 've learned to do a lot of things as a result . One of the most important reasons scientists accept the theory is that it works .""","""What is the `` Scientific Method `` of evolutionary research in contrast to the `` Scientific Method `` of Creation research ? And why is your method superior ?""",DISAGREE,"""We 've learned to do a lot of things as a result . One of the most important reasons scientists accept the theory is that it works .""","""What is the `` Scientific Method `` of evolutionary research in contrast to the `` Scientific Method `` of Creation research ?""",,
7992,2108,"""'' kinds `` is meaningless""","""kind : Race ; genus ; species ; generic class .""",DISAGREE,"""kinds ``""","""kind :""",,
7997,2109,"""I support legalization of every drug . I 'm sure most of you are young and have been fed XXXX like `` Marijuana will kill you. `` Actually it does less damage to the brain then alcohol and it can not kill you . It is impossible . It takes 20,000 joints in one sitting to overdose on marijuana . Alcohol however kills thousands of americans each year from alcohol poisoning . You know that XXXXX pothead . He did n't get dumb from pot , he got dumb from birth . Marijuana does not have long term effects on IQ . The only side effect is the lazy side effect . The day after a person tends to be more lazy however it is like a hang over ..... it only lasts for a day . There is no reason why it should remain illegal . I also support all drugs being legalized because the drug war has failed . We spend billions each year on the drug war and I can call someone right now and pick up some crack . It is a failure . What we should do is make it government controlled and then spend the money to fight drugs on drug education . Flood the schools with ACTUAL info about how herion kills and how it breaks a person down . Tell the kids how you can die from one use of coke . Tell them the short term and long term effects of each drug . If we can educate our kids and even adults through an ad campaign about what drugs do to you then we could save far more people . Also allowing drugs to be regulated will lower the prices and effectively kill drug dealers and gangs off the streets . There are so many benefits to legalizing drugs . Anyone want to fight it ? I have proof to back up what I say and also have the effects of each drug .""","""You 're an XXXXX who has obviously never worked ina first responder category . If you think that increasing the volume and social acceptance of drug use to the same level of alcohol will 'solve ' anything , then you are just an XXXXX . You have obviously never seen whart drug abuse does to families and people 's lives . You 're right , alcohol is worse , and the main reason its worse is because of 2 reasons , volume and availability ala social acceptance . Legalizing all drugs would have catastrophic social impacts . Do n't feed me that line about taxing it and using the money for rehab . We have taxed the XXXX out of tobacco and alcohol the last 100 years and the last time I checked alcoholism and lung cancer had n't been erradicated .""",DISAGREE,"""Actually it does less damage to the brain then alcohol and it can not kill you .""","""the same level of alcohol will 'solve ' anything""",,
8008,2111,"""ID [ intelligent design ] says that , get your arguments straight ,""","""No , the `` life ex nihilo `` doctrine of YE also denies God 's word in Genesis .""",DISAGREE,"""ID [ intelligent design ] says that , get your arguments straight ,""","""No , the `` life ex nihilo `` doctrine of YE also denies God 's word in Genesis .""",,
8010,2111,"""ID [ intelligent design ] says that , get your arguments straight ,""","""No , the `` life ex nihilo `` doctrine of YE also denies God 's word in Genesis .""",DISAGREE,"""ID [ intelligent design ] says that , get your arguments straight ,""","""No""",,
8025,2114,"""Thanks ! There 's a petrified forest in Mississippi also . I do n't know how long it took to produce the petrification and expose the pieces , but I 'll find out next trip . I 'm curious how the YECs could use this in an argument since the process described could hardly occur in nature . Are they going to argue that all the petrified woods could have been formed within the 6000 year life of the earth ? Likely , the use of argon was simply to preclude the presence of oxygen . Other inert gases could have done the same .""","""Am i stupid or something ... whats a YEC ? Young Energetic Children ? Yacking Economistic Critters Yummy expensive cupcakes ? Maybe im just dumb or something ... i hope it was one of those three for my sake .""",DISAGREE,"""Thanks ! There 's a petrified forest in Mississippi also . I do n't know how long it took to produce the petrification and expose the pieces , but I 'll find out next trip .""","""Am i stupid or something ... whats a YEC ?""",,
8032,2115,"""Nope . Yowm could be day ( a in opposed to night - thus only around 12 hours or so ) , it could be a 24 hour day , it could be days ( as in a lifetime ) , it could be just a general term for `` time `` or a `` period `` . It could also mean year . Yowm can be translated as each and every one of those . So your statement is false that it is `` understood `` to be that when it could just as easily be translated as one of the others .""","""However , if you read Genesis 1 , it is obvious because of the fact that they repeatedly say 'and it was night and day xxxx ' , it means literal days . While it could be 'translated ' to mean another , the fact 'it was night and it was day on the xxxx day ' demonstrates those translations would be dishonest .""",DISAGREE,"""Yowm could be day ( a in opposed to night - thus only around 12 hours or so ) ,""","""However , if you read Genesis 1 , it is obvious because of the fact that they repeatedly say 'and it was night and day xxxx ' ,""",,
8058,2120,"""It 's a fairytale based on pure philosophy .... and this philosophy is based on a foundation of assumptions .""","""Well , that is your philosophy , which is based on a ( badly made ) foundation of ( inaccurate ) assumptions .""",DISAGREE,"""this philosophy is based on a foundation of assumptions""","""your philosophy , which is based on a ( badly made ) foundation of ( inaccurate ) assumptions .""",,
8092,2127,"""You made a 'just-so ' statement about what is scientific method , and your own talkorigins site suggested this was one of several philosophies . Further you said definitions do n't need to be justified/proven , and again I cited talkorigins that shows this is n't the case . Sorry you missed it ! See post # 115 of `` Out of China `` and Post # 145 of `` Lets discuss the actual reason creationists object to evolution `` for scientific method , note the later I responded to questions you 'd asked . You 'd have thought you 'd have been curious to see what answer I had posted to a question you 'd asked . and Post # 147 of `` Lets discuss the actual reason creationists object to evolution `` for definitions of definition""","""I responded to your posts on the thread of `` Lets discuss the actual ... `` I suggest we continue that discussion there .""",DISAGREE,"""You made a 'just-so ' statement about what is scientific method ,""","""I responded to your posts on the thread of `` Lets discuss the actual""",,
8095,2128,"""Proponents of ID usually do n't argue religiosity or scripture ,""","""Actually , they do . They just do n't want it to leak out . But it 's too late . The cat is out of the bag . Internal documents from the Discovery Institute as well as statements by ID creation proponents from the Dover trial make it quite clear that ID creationism is based on religion and scripture as much as `` creation science `` was .""",DISAGREE,"""Proponents of ID usually do n't argue religiosity or scripture ,""","""Actually , they do . They just do n't want it to leak out . But it 's too ``""",,
8106,2130,"""ev·o·lu·tion ( P ) Pronunciation Key ( v-lshn , v- ) n. A gradual process in which something changes into a different and usually more complex or better form . See Synonyms at `` development `` . 1 . The process of developing . 2 . Gradual development . 3 . Change in the genetic composition of a population during successive generations , as a result of natural selection acting on the genetic variation among individuals , and resulting in the development of new species . 4 . The historical development of a related group of organisms ; phylogeny . 5 . A movement that is part of a set of ordered movements .""","""this is where the most confusion comes in , and why many evolutionist that are particular about the definition of evolution gets into arguments . # 3 is the only one close to the scientific definition , and still this is technically lacking and only serves the very layman level you continue to insist that all misinformation is a result of YEC 's distorting the definitions . YEC 's didnt write the definitions in dictionary.com , noe the hundreds of other dictionarys that have similar definitions . furthermore , your definitions have done nothing to educate people who are seeking more information . they only serve to display your disdain for creationists and your lack of objectivity""",DISAGREE,"""The process of developing""","""your definitions have done nothing""",,
8128,2136,"""Fear-mongering is what that 's called .""","""uh , yeah , that was their intent ! Under color of law no less . The truth always seems to be your worst enemy does n't it ?""",AGREE,"""Fear-mongering is what that 's called .""","""yeah , that was their intent ! Under color of law no less .""",,
8142,2139,"""It is becomming quite clear that the creationists here know jack squat about evolution . Let 's see if they can defend their belief . Let 's start with the ark . How did the marine animals survive the flood ?""","""Where 'd Noah get Tasmanian tigers ?""",AGREE,"""Let 's start with the ark . How did the marine animals survive the flood ?""","""'d Noah get Tasmanian tigers ?""",,
8144,2139,"""It is becomming quite clear that the creationists here know jack squat about evolution . Let 's see if they can defend their belief . Let 's start with the ark . How did the marine animals survive the flood ?""","""Where 'd Noah get Tasmanian tigers ?""",AGREE,"""It is becomming quite clear that the creationists here know jack squat about evolution .""","""Where 'd Noah get Tasmanian tigers ?""",,
8181,2149,"""Which planet in your parallel universe did this happen on ? You should stick to topics on which you know something ............... Oh , sorry , I see your problem .""","""Said the troll that lives in the UK""",DISAGREE,"""You should stick to topics on which you know something""","""the troll that lives in the UK""",,
8192,2152,"""Far too simplistic to be called accurate , there is some truth in this .""","""How would I fill in some of the gaps ? Here was my sequence : something like unicellular life to multi-cellular life , random multi-cellular conglomerations to an amoeba , to a fish , to a dinosaur , to a mammal , to an ape , and finally to a man ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""Far too simplistic to be called accurate , there is some truth in this .""","""How would I fill in some of the gaps ? Here was my sequence : something like unicellular life to multi-cellular life , random multi-cellular conglomerations to an amoeba , to a fish , to a dinosaur , to a mammal , to an ape , and finally to a man ? ?""",,
8199,2153,"""It can get worse . For example its difficult to justify a sponge turning into a mammal . The number of changes is enormous and sponges are also not known for being particulary caring of their young .""","""yea but ToE does n't say mammals evolved from sponges -- it says we evolved from reptiles .""",DISAGREE,"""The number of changes is enormous and sponges are also not known for being particulary caring of their young .""","""mammals evolved from sponges -- it says we evolved from reptiles""",,
8197,2153,"""It can get worse . For example its difficult to justify a sponge turning into a mammal . The number of changes is enormous and sponges are also not known for being particulary caring of their young .""","""yea but ToE does n't say mammals evolved from sponges -- it says we evolved from reptiles .""",DISAGREE,"""It can get worse difficult to justify a sponge turning into a mammal The number of changes is enormous sponges are also not known for being particulary caring of their young""","""but ToE does n't say""",,
8205,2154,"""If you took a human being today and dropped him in a forest or jungle , he would immediately look for a sharp rock to cut wood with , and after making a shelter he would find a flint and stone to start a fire with . Once he accomplished the basics , he would make a weapon and hunt for meat .""","""And he would do all these things because he had watched the Discovery channel , not because he is inherently bright enough to deduce from first principles that flint and stone make sparks , that dried vegetation can be burned , why burning vegetation might be a good idea or that fire even exists . You are gifting your human with a huge quantity of social DNA that billions have lived and died to accumulate .""",DISAGREE,"""dropped him in a forest or jungle immediately look for a sharp rock to cut wood with making a shelter flint and stone to start a fire with make a weapon and hunt for meat""","""he would do all these things because he had watched the Discovery channel not because he is inherently bright enough You are gifting your human with a huge quantity of social DNA that billions have lived and died to accumulate""",,
8211,2155,"""For pro-lifers , it is not simply because an embryo shares human DNA . It is because the embryo is a human being . It makes no differences whether the embryo is developing , for it is then simply a developing human being .""","""But why ? What is so important about an embryo that it can be given a `` person `` status ?""",DISAGREE,"""the embryo is a human being .""","""What is so important about an embryo that it can be given a `` person `` status ?""",,
8219,2165,"""I feel that so many of these bans on gay marriage were done in hate and haste . There was a ; acl of critical thinking on many parts . That was the failure . They were so worried about banning gay rights , they did n't think through the process .""","""You 're giving them waaaaay too much credit . All of these amendments were prepared and supported by the same national organizations working with local groups . They 've heard the arguments about how broad these laws are and have n't changed a single one . They know exactly what they 're doing . In a few cases , after assuring people that they did n't intend to interfere with domestic partnership legislation , they filed suits to do exactly that once the amendment passed .""",DISAGREE,"""that so many of these bans on gay marriage were done in hate and haste""","""All of these amendments were prepared and supported by the same national""",,
8232,2171,"""Every minute of every day , somewhere in the world , most often in a developing nation , a woman dies from complications related to pregnancy or childbirth .""","""http : //www.thelizlibrary.org/liz/004.htm Normal , frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy : * exhaustion ( weariness common from first weeks ) * altered appetite and senses of taste and smell * nausea and vomiting ( 50 % of women , first trimester ) * heartburn and indigestion * constipation * weight gain =snip=""",DISAGREE,"""a woman dies from complications related to pregnancy or childbirth .""","""Normal , frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy : * exhaustion ( weariness""",,
8248,2174,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God""","""And the religious have killed many millions more because the others did not believe in the `` right `` God .""",DISAGREE,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God""","""And the religious have killed many millions more because the others did not believe in the `` right `` God .""",,
8250,2174,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God""","""And the religious have killed many millions more because the others did not believe in the `` right `` God .""",DISAGREE,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God""","""the religious have killed many millions more because the others did not believe in the `` right `` God .""",,
8266,2178,"""Through the media ’ s support of the presuppositions taught in high schools and under graduate institutions people all to often espouse their expertise in their knowledge of the certainty of evolutionary  “ theory ” which is most always overwhelmingly lacking and incorrect .""","""And you , on the other hand , because you are not educated in science in general , and evolutionary theory ( why the quotation marks ? ) specifically , are qualified to correct those of us who spent years in study of the topic .""",DISAGREE,"""Through the media ’ s support of the presuppositions taught in high schools and under graduate institutions people all to often espouse their expertise in their knowledge of the certainty of evolutionary  theory which is most always overwhelmingly lacking and incorrect .""","""And you , on the other hand , because you are not educated in science in general , and evolutionary theory ( why the quotation marks ? ) specifically , are qualified to correct those of us who spent years in study of the topic .""",,
8284,2181,"""I do n't believe they have a right to do it for one . But yes , they can smoke if they please because I do n't believe it is wrong . Abortion I do feel is wrong and thus do n't support anyone doing it . There is a big difference . I guess if you felt abortion is right you just would n't wan na do it then I would ask why you would n't wan na do it ? If you get back to `` you think it is wrong `` then the same rule applies as above . Like Al Sharpton thinks abortion is wrong however he supports other people doing it . This is hypocritical in my book .""","""Except it 's not . It 's perfectly acceptable to morally disagree with drinking and smoking ( and encourage others not to do it ) and still believe others should have the freedom to choose for themselves . chloe ,""",DISAGREE,"""they can smoke if they please because I do n't believe it is wrong .""","""It 's perfectly acceptable to morally disagree with drinking and smoking""",,
8286,2182,"""She was not violent and she had an obvious health condition .""","""Being pregnant is a health condition now ? Or is it the most natural condition in life since it is life begetting life . You ignorant feminists want it both ways as you now worry about a baby getting an invitro shock as you promote , endorse and defend the brutal and violent murder of 1.4 MILLION BABIES each and every year in America alone . And you will have the nerve to call me a hypocrite in this very post ?""",DISAGREE,"""She was not violent and she had an obvious health condition .""","""Being pregnant is a health condition now ? Or is it the most natural condition in life since it is life begetting life . You ignorant feminists want it both ways as you now worry about a baby getting an invitro shock as you promote , endorse and defend the brutal and violent murder of 1.4 MILLION BABIES each and every year in America alone . And you will have the nerve to call me a hypocrite in this very post ?""",,
8292,2183,"""Wrong . http : //www.4forums.com/political/365915-post54.html Tell me , when God commands the Israelites to exterminate the Medianites , did he make an exception for pregnant women ?""","""He was n't discussing abortion nor was He promoting it . He was declaring war on an unclean people whom He commanded the Jews to wipe out in a time of WAR . Again you rip an event out of context and attempt to imply God was endorsing abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""exterminate the Medianites exception for pregnant women ?""","""declaring war on an unclean people event out of context""",,
8318,2190,"""I dont seem to get the punchline . Maybe its meant to be nonsensical ?""","""Yes . Oddly , the picture makes as much sense as most creationists .""",AGREE,"""I dont seem to get the punchline . Maybe its meant to be nonsensical ?""","""Yes""",,
8333,2194,"""Why should mere blobs of animate matter be concerned for the temporary well-being of other blobs if both are going to die ?""","""So that is your opinion of humanity ? How sad . Or maybe your are erecting a strawman and not doing a very good job of knocking it down .""",DISAGREE,"""Why should mere blobs of animate matter be concerned for the temporary well-being of other blobs if both are going to die ?""","""So that is your opinion of humanity ? How sad . Or maybe your are erecting a strawman and not doing a very good job of knocking it down .""",,
8342,2196,"""This is your refutation to science and evidence ; to simply re-state your position . Mach , this is turning into a war of attrition , to see who gives up posting first . I have , however evidence on my side . You have opinion ; and you actually state that evidence will not persuade you !""","""No Montalban , fallacy or falsity will not persuade me to think a true claim is false . Your faith can not differentiate truth from falsity , so we can not use your faith-based evidence , since it always results in circular reasoning , and ultimately , contradiction . If you wish to support your refutation with logical or justified evidence , please do . You have not . I make no such claims about the unknowable . I have claimed , that your claim , is illogical : =============================== Defined : Unknowable : not knowable www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn - based on Law of Contradiction A proposition can not be both true and false . Is it knowable ? No , by definition , it 's unknowable . False Is it knowable ? You claim you know it . True Knowable : Not Knowable . The claim - I know something of the unknowable - Is a logical contradiction . -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- - Your claim remains contradictory , despite your anger and frustration and assumptions about me . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""This is your refutation to science and evidence ; to simply re-state your position .""","""fallacy or falsity will not persuade me to think a true claim is I make no such claims about the unknowable""",,
8347,2197,"""http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v=ibqwKb4cCsg""","""Oh , he does n't want abortion , huh ? If you take the Old Testament to be true , you just lied here . Let 's look , shall we ?""",DISAGREE,"""http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v=ibqwKb4cCsg""","""he does n't want abortion , huh ?""",,
8374,2210,"""This article , from the Daily Telegraph , states that data from the `` Climate Research Unit at the University of East Anglia `` shows `` that for the years 1998-2005 global average temperature did not increase ( there was actually a slight decrease , though not at a rate that differs significantly from zero ) . `` Does anyone know anything about this university ( i.e . is it reputable in this area of science ) ? Also , any thoughts on the author and his interpretation of this data ( if the data is reliable that is ) .""","""My thought is , do n't treat editorials as if they were sources of facts . I went to the CRU website , and their home page has a graphic showing definite warming over the time period in question . http : //www.cru.uea.ac.uk/ Bob Carter , the guy who wrote your editorial , is either a fool or not above lying to make a point . The world is clearly getting hotter , all the data supports this . It 's not like we 're talking rocket science here . All this takes is reading a thermometer and writing down the results , which is a task that people have mastered for quite some time now . Anyone who tells you that we are n't heating up is either in denial , or in the pay of someone who does n't want to be told to stop polluting .""",DISAGREE,"""This article , from the Daily Telegraph , states that data from the `` Climate Research Unit at the University of East Anglia ``""","""My thought is , do n't treat editorials as if they were sources of facts .""",,
8378,2211,"""One has to wonder why gun haters always ask this quesion ( sic ) . Has this question ever been asked of people that read books ? It is interesting how people that want to ban the right to bear arms never apply their logic to the rights they like .""","""Spot the difference between reading a book and carrying a gun . I 'm sorry if you ca n't . People do n't carry books because they 're worried about being assailed by someone with an eraser .""",DISAGREE,"""Has this question ever been asked of people that read books""","""Spot the difference between reading a book and carrying a gun""",,
8389,2214,"""See rule 3a .""","""And just what is rule 3a""",DISAGREE,"""See rule 3a .""","""And just what is rule 3a""",,
8393,2215,"""In other words , how can an atheist with a naturalistic presupposition account for the existence of logical absolutes when logical absolutes are conceptual by nature and not physical , energy , or motion ?""","""This whole thing is simply an epistemological argument , for which there is no answer . What is the nature of knowledge ? There are positivists ( Abe here ) and there are constructivists ( what Abe says you have to be if you do n't believe in god . ) This is a metaphysical debate that is decades old and it simply depends upon your point of view for the purpose of the discussion at hand .""",DISAGREE,"""when logical absolutes are conceptual by nature and not physical , energy , or motion""","""This is a metaphysical debate that is decades old and it simply depends upon your point of view for the purpose of the discussion at hand""",,
8435,2223,"""I do n't think that there are any marriage rights for anyone gaurenteed by the constitution . I believe that if marriage is offered to heteros , and they seem to think it is their right to get married , then marriage must be extended equally to gay people . I believe that one group using their religion as a basis to form laws that violate another groups religious freedom , with govenment support , violates the constitution .""","""So , I guess you did n't get the memo that this country was FOUNDED on Christian/Judaic beliefs . Remember : You do have rights ; to an extent .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe that one group using their religion as a basis to form laws that violate another groups religious freedom , with govenment support , violates the constitution .""","""guess you did n't get the memo that this country was FOUNDED on Christian/Judaic beliefs . Remember : You do have rights ; to an extent""",,
8438,2223,"""I do n't think that there are any marriage rights for anyone gaurenteed by the constitution . I believe that if marriage is offered to heteros , and they seem to think it is their right to get married , then marriage must be extended equally to gay people . I believe that one group using their religion as a basis to form laws that violate another groups religious freedom , with govenment support , violates the constitution .""","""So , I guess you did n't get the memo that this country was FOUNDED on Christian/Judaic beliefs . Remember : You do have rights ; to an extent .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think that there are any marriage rights for anyone gaurenteed by the constitution .""","""I guess you did n't get the memo that this country was FOUNDED on Christian/Judaic beliefs .""",,
8443,2224,"""I 'm not joing the anti-gay rights movement here , but perhaps they are thinking that people are trying to add a new element to their already established bathrooms . For example , the introduction of glass partitioning instead of the traditional barriers . They try closing their eyes , but they ca n't resist the urge to look and then ... arrrggghhh !""","""Or perhaps Mach just does n't understand the concept of an 'analogy . ' No one was claiming they want 'rights restricted ' because of of bathrooms . He 's either being beligerent by intentionally portraying the analogy as a premise , or incredibly dense . I 'm starting to wonder if it 's the latter . . . .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not joing the anti-gay rights movement here , but perhaps they are thinking that people are trying to add a new element to their already established bathrooms .""","""No one was claiming they want 'rights restricted ' because of of bathrooms""",,
8472,2236,"""Actually , one . After the adoptions years ago , we hit the financial slump and had a suprise ... The costs will extremely low . I 've also been in discussion with numerous friends who 've delivered , same story . Somehow , no matter how there is no money and no help , babies get born . And as I 've said , there are plenty of organizations that will cover all costs finacially in cases of adoption .""","""There may very well be such things near you , but at the time I knew of none near me - besides the fact that the actual cost was just one of the many factors .""",DISAGREE,"""Somehow , no matter how there is no money and no help , babies get born . And as I 've said , there are plenty of organizations that will cover all costs finacially in cases of adoption""","""There may very well be such things near you , but at the time I knew of none near me - besides the fact that the actual cost was just one of the many factors .""",,
8489,2239,"""The Bible only refers to `` high hills `` , and the mountains today wre formed only towards the end of , and after , the Flood by collision of the tectonic plates and the associated upthrusting . In support of this , the layers that form the uppermost parts of Mt Everest themselves of fossil-bearing , water-deposited layers . This uplift of the new continental land-masses from under the Flood waters would have meant that , as the mountains rose and the valleys sank ( as Psalm 104 suggests ) , the waters would have rapidly drained off the newly emerging land surfaces . The collapse of natural dams holding back the floodwaters on the land would also have caused catastrophic flooding . Such rapid movement of large volumes of water would have caused extensive erosion and shaped the basic features of today 's Earth surface . As a result of this extensive erosion ( caused by the retreating Flood waters ) it is not hard to envisage the rapid carving of the landscape features that we see on the Earth today , including places such as the Grand Canyon of the U.S.A . The present shape of Uluru , a sandstone monolith in central Australia , is the result of erosion , following the tilting and uplife , of previously horizontal beds of water-laid sand . The feldspar-rich sand that makes up Uluru must have been deposited very quickly and recently . Long-distance transport of the sand would have caused the grains to be rounded and sorted , but we do n't see this at Uluru , i.e . they are jagged and unsorted . Which indicates rapid transportation ( like through a cataclystic Flood ) . If they had sat accumulating slowly in a lake bed drying in the sun over eons of years , which is the story told in the geological display at the park centre , the feldspar would have weathered into clay . Likewise , if Uluru had sat in hte once-humid area of central Australia for millions of years , it would have weathered to clay . But besides the `` fact `` that it has reportedly been exposed to weathering for hundreds of millions of years , the feldspars are still very fresh , as though they were exposed only yesterday . Similarly , the nearby Kata Tjuta are composed of an unsorted mixture of large boulders , sand and mud , indicating that the material must have been transported and deposited very rapidly . Receding floodwaters eroded the land , creating river valleys . This explains why rivers are often so much smaller than the valleys they flow in today - they did not carve the valleys . The water flow that carved out the river valleys must have been far greater than the volume of water we see flowing in the rivers today . This is consistent with voluminous Flood waters draining off the emerging land surfaces at the cose of Noah 's Flood , and flowing into the rapidly sinking , newly prepared , deep ocean basins . [ Above information from the `` Updated and Expanded Answers Book `` by AiG , p . 165-166 . ]""","""Please . PLEASE , read an introductory Geology or Geography/Geomorphology textbook . Then we 'll talk . Yikes . Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""The collapse of natural dams holding back the floodwaters on the land would also have caused catastrophic flooding . Such rapid movement of large volumes of water would have caused extensive erosion and shaped the basic features of today 's Earth surface .""","""PLEASE , read an introductory Geology or Geography/Geomorphology textbook .""",,
8502,2248,"""Seriously ? That 's your reasoning ?""","""Er , no . That is AnswersinGenesis ' reasoning . Are you having difficulties reading ? It seems so , as you are unable to distinguish between what a poster says and what an organization they are quoting says .""",DISAGREE,"""Seriously ? That 's your reasoning ?""","""Are you having difficulties""",,
8504,2248,"""Seriously ? That 's your reasoning ?""","""Er , no . That is AnswersinGenesis ' reasoning . Are you having difficulties reading ? It seems so , as you are unable to distinguish between what a poster says and what an organization they are quoting says .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's your reasoning ?""","""no . Are you having difficulties reading ? It seems so , you are unable to distinguish between what a poster says and what an organization they are quoting says .""",,
8527,2253,"""If you want to challenge my assertion that these are transitional you will need to understand a bunch of words that you may have never heard before , like furcula , carina , hallux , gastralia , pubis , fibula , fenestra , pygostyle , and so on .""","""Lurch , I do n't appreciate your condescending tone . If you want to challenge my assertion that you are a pompous XXX that jumps to conclusions , you will need to be a little less judgemental and start thinking outside of Darwin 's Black Box .""",DISAGREE,"""If you want to challenge my assertion you will need to understand a bunch of words that you may have never heard before""","""I do n't appreciate your condescending tone If you want to challenge my assertion that you are a pompous XXX that jumps to conclusions , you will need to be a little less judgemental""",,
8536,2255,"""In the never going to happen scenario I would n't pick because I would n't pick between two 30yr olds sitting there . You could say `` if you have your mother ( assume you love your mother ) on one table and a random person on the other table which would you choose to kill or both die `` ... if you picked your mother to live does that mean the other person is less of a human worthy of rights ? Spare me the ridicious scenarios .""","""Cthulhu may go too far in his/her assumptions about the indecision of pro-life people , but his scenario does bring up an interesting challenge . I 'm sure that it was never meant to be presented as a realistic scenario - that was not the point . The point was to try to make pro-life people admit that the baby is more worthy of consideration than the newly fertilized zygote . Your example of choosing between ones mother and a stranger is equally unrealistic for most of us but does not address the same type of question ( the question in that case being how much worth one places on personal connections in deciding the worth of a person ) . There are occasional situations in life where one is faced with choosing between two awful choices and one can only choose the lesser of two evils . Those type of situations can be quite interesting since they reveal to us our priorities and details of our moral reasoning . I remember being comfronted with the too-many-people-on-a-lifeboat scenario ( so how does one decide who lives and dies ) during comfirmation years back - again to force us to explore our moral reasoning . Cthulhu 's scenario may be an unrealistic one but would force someone who is pro-life to consider the relative worth of the baby vs zygote . It may be a very uncomfortable question ( all of the lesser-of-two-evils questions are ) but can be quite revealing . Given that introduction , if you or other pro-life people were faced with that awful choice , would you : 1 ) Consider both so exactly equally worthy that you would indeed be frozen in indecision , or possibly decide based on chance ( a flip of a coin ) 2 ) Choose one over the other based on moral considerations Note : I believe it would be obvious to almost everyone that your choosing one over the other does not mean that you condone the killing of that other . It would be just a choice of the lesser of two evils , where it is acknowledged that both choices , in your view , would be evil .""",DISAGREE,"""if you picked your mother to live does that mean the other person is less of a human worthy of rights ?""","""It would be just a choice of the lesser of two evils ,""",,
8547,2260,"""Yes , if you argue with a liar like that , the debate ends up being over their lies , not about the subject .""","""But when some are ignorant enough to believe in a false science like evolution , which is based on lies and deceptions , they prove right there that they have n't enough knowledge of the truth , nor a sense of discernment that is capable of even determining what is true or a lie . So who are you people to even judge the intelligence of those who will ultimately be proven to have known the truth regarding our origins , to the lies that you so proudly defend ? I say this only so you pseudo intellectuals will have some personal introspection to consider rather than just assuming that you 'll get the correct answers by leaning on human understanding . It is incredible that you ca n't even see that you are bankrupt when you rely on unprovable assumptions that are based on preconceived notions , that have been both failing and conflicting with all of the new discoveries made in each generation to follow , thereby forcing the need to redefine the parameters by which evolution works every 10 years or so . So evolution is n't a science , it 's a working piece of fiction in progress that is constantly being tweaked and shaped to fit the preconceptions no matter what new evidence is discovered that contradicts it .""",DISAGREE,"""if you argue with a liar like that , the debate ends up being over their lies ,""","""some are ignorant enough to believe in a false science like evolution , which is based on lies and deceptions ,""",,
8559,2265,"""http : //www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,157267,00.html Saturday , May 21 , 2005 AUSTIN , Texas — The Texas Senate ( search ) approved a proposed constitutional ban on same-sex marriage with a 21-8 vote Saturday , sending the issue to voters . State law already prohibits same-sex marriages . If approved in a statewide vote in November , Texas ( search ) would join 14 states that statutorily and constitutionally ban same-sex marriage . Massachusetts is the only state that allows such marriages , although Vermont and Connecticut have approved same-sex civil unions . Opponents have criticized the ban as discrimination against gays and lesbians and warn it could harm heterosexual families if domestic partner benefits , powers of attorney and common law marriage are called into question . Sen. Todd Staples , R-Palestine , who sponsored the legislation in the Senate , said none of those scenarios would be affected and would not prevent same-sex couples from adopting children . The House has voted to ban gays from becoming foster parents , but that measure has received little support in the Senate . Staples rejected arguments the amendment would discriminate against gays and lesbians and the estimated 43,000 same-sex couples in Texas . Sen. Rodney Ellis , D-Houston , equated the amendment to Jim Crow-era laws that discriminated against blacks . '' At least they had the good sense to never write their bigotry into the state Constitution , `` said Ellis , who called the amendment `` trash. `` Staples said he is offended by accusations the amendment is anti-gay . '' There 's a distinction between intimate associations and the right to have the government recognize or subsidize your arrangement , `` Staples said .""","""So ? ? ? ? Are we supposed to be surprised ? Hardly State constitutions and / or their amendments do n't mean diddly squat if they are not in agreement with the US cconstitution .""",DISAGREE,"""approved same-sex civil unions""","""Hardly State constitutions and / or their amendments do n't mean diddly squat""",,
8558,2265,"""http : //www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,157267,00.html Saturday , May 21 , 2005 AUSTIN , Texas — The Texas Senate ( search ) approved a proposed constitutional ban on same-sex marriage with a 21-8 vote Saturday , sending the issue to voters . State law already prohibits same-sex marriages . If approved in a statewide vote in November , Texas ( search ) would join 14 states that statutorily and constitutionally ban same-sex marriage . Massachusetts is the only state that allows such marriages , although Vermont and Connecticut have approved same-sex civil unions . Opponents have criticized the ban as discrimination against gays and lesbians and warn it could harm heterosexual families if domestic partner benefits , powers of attorney and common law marriage are called into question . Sen. Todd Staples , R-Palestine , who sponsored the legislation in the Senate , said none of those scenarios would be affected and would not prevent same-sex couples from adopting children . The House has voted to ban gays from becoming foster parents , but that measure has received little support in the Senate . Staples rejected arguments the amendment would discriminate against gays and lesbians and the estimated 43,000 same-sex couples in Texas . Sen. Rodney Ellis , D-Houston , equated the amendment to Jim Crow-era laws that discriminated against blacks . '' At least they had the good sense to never write their bigotry into the state Constitution , `` said Ellis , who called the amendment `` trash. `` Staples said he is offended by accusations the amendment is anti-gay . '' There 's a distinction between intimate associations and the right to have the government recognize or subsidize your arrangement , `` Staples said .""","""So ? ? ? ? Are we supposed to be surprised ? Hardly State constitutions and / or their amendments do n't mean diddly squat if they are not in agreement with the US cconstitution .""",DISAGREE,"""Massachusetts is the only state that allows such marriages ,""","""amendments do n't mean diddly squat if they are not in agreement with the US cconstitution .""",,
8583,2285,"""Why ? Because being the victim of a violent crime happens enough times for it to be a genuine concern . I 'd like to see your statistics to show that violent crime rarely occurs , because the statistics I 've seen show that it happens quite regularly .""","""I did not say that violent crime `` rarely `` occurs , merely that the risk of being a victim of such is lower relative to other risks . I am genuinely curious if you care as much about protecting your heart as you care about protecting yourself from criminals .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'd like to see your statistics to show that violent crime rarely occurs""","""rarely `` occurs , merely that the risk of being a victim of such is lower""",,
8591,2287,"""Also , Ham 's wrong about the bible . It 's not that the bible is eliminated , it 's that the bible is not considered to have primacy over actual evidence , whereas Ham wants the bible to have primacy over everything .""","""The bible is evidence . Its existence is a fact . What that fact represents is subject to interpretation . Ken 's argument is that choosing to believe the bible is infallible is no more or less of a presupposition than choosing to believe that logic is infallible . He 's right in absolute terms , but those axioms are not equally congruent with reality .""",DISAGREE,"""bible . It 's not that the bible is eliminated , it 's that the bible is not considered to have primacy over actual evidence""","""fact represents is subject to interpretation .""",,
8604,2290,"""HOW OFTEN do you see people change their minds based on somebody fighting for `` gay rights `` ? I have seen it , but it 's only a handful of times . Out of HUNDREDS of people I 've talked to , it 's only a `` handful of times `` . Suppose Democrats do pick up the gay banner hard and heavy . Full gusto . What 's the effect ? I seriously expect minimal . This is going to be a battle over time . Gays got sodomy laws overturned , and the reaction was anti-gay marriage laws and amendments . The SIMPLEST thing , that should have been the most obvious to everyone , of sodomy laws overturned got a `` anti-gay marriage law/amendment `` reaction . These fights ARE BEING picked and chosen . ROFLMAO ! No . We fundamentally disagree there . How long have you been arguing the gay marriage issue . And you state that you SUPPORT equality on every issue with only the gay marriage hold-out , right ? If YOUR mind ca n't be changed in all that time , why do you think that we could win over the nation just by having Democrats come out hot and heavy . Furthermore , THINK about it . HOW LONG have we been pushing for ENDA ... And we just tried the vote , and it failed ... EVEN ON THE ISSUE THAT HAS OVERWHELMING MAJORITY SUPPORT , the anti-gays are able to stop the win . What do you think will happen on an issue we DO NOT have majority support on ?""","""Well , all I can say then is that no action is just about as bad as failed action , and IS as bad in terms of anything current . Either way you do n't have gay marriage . You have a majority in Congress right now , and you 're not demanding much change just because of fear of backlash ? Yeah , there would be backlash . Heck , the Civil War was the ultimate backlash , but that did n't stop abolitionists from demanding more than TOKEN change , and it 's a good thing they did . It 's your gig , though , so do what you want . I do n't see much point in laboring this discussion any more ; I 'm just pointing out my observations .""",DISAGREE,"""How long have you been arguing the gay marriage issue . And you state that you SUPPORT equality on every issue with only the gay marriage hold-out , right ? If YOUR mind ca n't be changed in all that time , why do you think that we could win over the nation just by having Democrats come out hot and heavy . Furthermore , THINK about it . HOW LONG have we been pushing for ENDA ... And we just tried the vote , and it failed ... EVEN ON THE ISSUE THAT HAS OVERWHELMING MAJORITY SUPPORT , the anti-gays are able to stop the win . What do you think will happen on an issue we DO NOT have majority support on ?""","""Either way you do n't have gay marriage . You have a majority in Congress right now , and you 're not demanding much change just because of fear of backlash ? Yeah , there would be backlash . Heck , the Civil War was the ultimate backlash , but that did n't stop abolitionists from demanding more than TOKEN change , and it 's a good thing they did . It 's your gig , though , so do what you want . I do n't see much point in laboring this discussion any more ; I 'm just pointing out my observations .""",,
8615,2291,"""As a Christian comfortable with their faith and reality .""","""The Bible contradicts `` reality `` . So does heaven and hell . Once you start doubting parts of the Bible , the rest falls apart . Can you PROVE that their is a heaven or a hell ? Can you PROVE that there are miracles ? No ! When you do n't believe in part of the Bible , you might as well not believe in all of it .""",DISAGREE,"""As a Christian comfortable with their faith and reality .""","""When you do n't believe in part of the Bible , you might as well not believe in all of it .""",,
8616,2292,"""BUT along come a man-made invention that allows those certain portions to live on , and survive . In once case - nylon , the other , the artifical heart . You call this evolution .""","""What does a mutation have to do with a heart transplant ? What are you smoking ?""",DISAGREE,"""that allows those certain portions to live on , and survive""","""does a mutation have to do with a heart transplant""",,
8618,2292,"""BUT along come a man-made invention that allows those certain portions to live on , and survive . In once case - nylon , the other , the artifical heart . You call this evolution .""","""What does a mutation have to do with a heart transplant ? What are you smoking ?""",DISAGREE,"""In once case - nylon , the other , the artifical heart . You call this evolution .""","""What does a mutation have to do with a heart transplant ? What are you smoking ?""",,
8629,2294,"""How is that a strawman ? Your challenge directly relies upon something you assume to be proven , but has not been . Therefore even in a hypothetical stance , your underlying arguments are invalid , thus leading to everything else being invalid . You 're not doing so well on this forum .""","""It is clearly not a strawman argument . I think he does n't know what `` straw man `` means and I think he is meaning to say `` red herring. `` It is n't a red herring either ; it 's a perfectly logically related question . I would guess he does n't see that as he neither understands evolution nor bacterial resistance and , thus , the relationship .""",DISAGREE,"""Therefore even in a hypothetical stance , your underlying arguments are invalid , thus leading to everything else being invalid .""","""I would guess he does n't see that as he neither understands evolution nor bacterial resistance and , thus , the relationship""",,
8651,2298,"""I think what hurts me the most , is when I meet scientists that have slowly turned to atheism and agnosticism Because of science . We all doubt . It is in our nature . But , science is just too small . It is impossible for me to live inside of it 's box .""","""But why do you think that doubt limits people 's ideas ? If anything it helps to expand them .""",DISAGREE,"""We all doubt .""","""why do you think that doubt limits people 's ideas ?""",,
8665,2302,"""Just imagine if firearme safety was as heavily promoted in schools as sex education is . If we were to train children how to handle firearms , I feel confident that we could reduce accidental shootings , which the gun control crowds claim as one of their goals . No more of the `` I thought it was unloaded `` or `` it just went off accidentally. `` Ironically , I believe that federal gun-free school zones coupled with zero-tolerance policies make it nearly impossible for this to happen . Gun control could be costing children 's lives . Or maybe it 's just Darwinism in action .""","""I think you could teach gun-control at a gun-free school , too . Sex-education is also taught in schools that forbid their pupils to couple on the school yard .""",AGREE,"""heavily promoted in schools as sex education is . If we were to train children how to handle firearms""","""I think you could teach gun-control at a gun-free school , too . Sex-education is also taught in schools""",,
8669,2303,"""Even if more guns do help prevent mass shootings it does n't necessarily follow that allowing more law abiding citizens to carry guns around is the solution .""","""So your answer is to just continue with the way things are now : continue forcing the law-abiding to go unarmed and let only the shooter have exclusive access to guns so they can kill all they want ? How many unarmed people have to be killed in a `` gun free zone `` before you come to realize that mandating unarmed and helplessness will do nothing to save even a single life ?""",DISAGREE,"""it does n't necessarily follow that allowing more law abiding citizens to carry guns around is the solution .""","""continue forcing the law-abiding to go unarmed and let only the shooter have exclusive access""",,
8670,2303,"""Even if more guns do help prevent mass shootings it does n't necessarily follow that allowing more law abiding citizens to carry guns around is the solution .""","""So your answer is to just continue with the way things are now : continue forcing the law-abiding to go unarmed and let only the shooter have exclusive access to guns so they can kill all they want ? How many unarmed people have to be killed in a `` gun free zone `` before you come to realize that mandating unarmed and helplessness will do nothing to save even a single life ?""",DISAGREE,"""does n't necessarily follow that allowing more law abiding citizens to carry guns around is the solution .""","""So your answer is to just continue with the way things are now : ``""",,
8677,2304,"""Where better to find more info on the evolutionary migration of humanity than from friendly atheist.com . Keep that pure science with no agenda coming you guys .""","""Well , ya know , if you actually , oh I do n't know , VISITED THE SITE , you 'd see that the `` friendlyatheist.com `` is a blog-like page ( and not the one that is actually giving the info on the evolutionary migration of humanity ) and it gave a link to the actual website that we are talking about ( the second link I gave ) : http : //www.bradshawfoundation.com/journey/ But then , maybe we 're expecting a little too much from a creationist .""",DISAGREE,"""Where better to find more info on the evolutionary migration of humanity""","""Well , ya know""",,
8680,2305,"""Phil S : Does n't it get tedious seeing the same creationist arguments rehashed over & amp ; over again ? Willful ignorance is so irritating . A person has to pray very hard to keep their mind closed to anything they might learn from these debates .""","""Hence why this forum is essentially a joke . Without PRATTs , creationists have nothing . Go to the link in my signature for a place that cracks down on PRATTs .""",AGREE,"""Does n't it get tedious seeing the same creationist arguments rehashed over & over again ?""","""Hence why this forum is essentially a joke""",,
8689,2306,"""My point is the embryo and zygote have potential to think . Their brain activity ( none ) is completely normal for their stage of development . Infants don ’ t know much , but their brain activity is normal for their age . It doesn ’ t make them less of a human because they think less .""","""No but the fact that infants have brain activity makes them a world of difference between a zygote that has no brain activity . They can think and feel and exhibit all the characteristics of other human beings . A zygote exhibits none of those characteristics .""",DISAGREE,"""My point is the embryo and zygote have potential to think .""","""No""",,
8686,2306,"""My point is the embryo and zygote have potential to think . Their brain activity ( none ) is completely normal for their stage of development . Infants don ’ t know much , but their brain activity is normal for their age . It doesn ’ t make them less of a human because they think less .""","""No but the fact that infants have brain activity makes them a world of difference between a zygote that has no brain activity . They can think and feel and exhibit all the characteristics of other human beings . A zygote exhibits none of those characteristics .""",DISAGREE,"""My point is the embryo and zygote have potential to think""","""No but the fact that infants have brain activity makes them a world of difference between a zygote that has no brain activity .""",,
8696,2308,"""Now , if the mother chooses to abort that person will not be born .""","""Well , by the strict defintion of the word `` born `` , an abortion is considered a premature birth .""",AGREE,"""if the mother chooses to abort that person will not be born .""","""an abortion is considered a premature birth .""",,
8717,2311,"""Pregnancy and childbirth are among the greatest dangers that women face in Africa , which has the world ’ s highest rates of maternal mortality — at least 100 times those in developed countries . Abortion accounts for a significant part of the death toll .""","""-Mosheh Thezion""",DISAGREE,"""Pregnancy and childbirth are among the greatest dangers that women face in Africa ,""","""Thezion""",,
8721,2312,"""Genisis includes many events and personel that have been proven to take place and lived . Why would a book be right about the lives and events recorded in it and wrong about origin .""","""Because the men who wrote it mixed their mythology in with their heros . The first 11 chapters of Genesis are obviously mythology . And if what you say is true , then I guess that means that the Illiad is historical . Why would Homer be right about some lives and events , but wrong about others ? And of course , there are other parts of the Bible that are pure fiction - Jonah and Job for example .""",AGREE,"""Genisis includes many events and personel Why would a book be right about the lives and events recorded""","""Because the men who wrote it mixed their mythology in with their heros Why would Homer be right about some lives and events , but wrong about others ?""",,
8742,2316,"""In the second paragraph , just because something is beyond us , do you not think we can relate to it at least in a rudimentary fashion if not in a perfected ( complete ) fashion ?""","""Hmmm .... I think maybe it 's possible to have a brief , fragmentary awareness of a higher order , a glimpse of something that is just too vast for the human brain to rationalise , but definitely not in terms of ( for example ) recieving ten commandments on a mountain , or a woman being impregnated with divine offspring , etc . It 's possible that our brains could work like recievers , picking up fragments of the universal consciousness but if that is the case I think it is more likely to lead to madness than enlightenment ! I said I have had no experience of 'God ' but I have had ( and some will scoff I know ) bizarre , spiritual experiences on LSD and mushrooms , which I have only done a few times ( before I get accused of being a spaced-out hippie ! ) . The only way I can describe the experience is as a realisation that everything , all matter and energy , is connected in a fundamental way , and more than realising it you actually experience it , you experience being part of something all-encompassing , and once you are a part you are also the whole in its entirety . You lose all sense of self , and gain a new sense of something akin to omnipresence . Of course this may just be a hallucination entirely confined to the brain but it feels so real at the time that it 's hard to know .""",DISAGREE,"""In the second paragraph , just because something is beyond us ,""","""Of course this may just be a hallucination entirely confined to the brain but it feels so real at the time that it 's hard to know .""",,
8752,2318,"""because of big advances in military technology it 's difficult to see how the kinds of arms typically owned by modern American gun owners would be very effective against the type of arms used by those in the armed forces .""","""Read the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising .""",DISAGREE,"""it 's difficult to see how the kinds of would be very effective against the type of arms used by those in the armed forces .""","""Read the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising .""",,
8760,2320,"""Nor have we excluded the divine ; we have merely shown that if god exists and is involved he is being consistent .""","""Right . We are explaining natural phenomena by natural means . We do so simply because we can test natural explanations while we can not test the supernatural . We use methodological naturalism ( not , by any means , philosophical naturalism ) to observe , test and explain the natural . This is not a denial of god or an assumption about the existance of a god . It is a recognition of the fact that we can not investigate the supernatural by natural means . Even methodological naturalists can be theists - Kenneth R. Miller for example .""",AGREE,"""we have merely shown that if god exists and is involved he is being consistent .""","""Right""",,
8765,2322,"""You need n't be far left to support reasonable gun regulation . What current firearm related issue would drive an `` anti-gunner `` to commit a terrorist act ? Or are you just lumping anyone who supports gun control in with PETA and radical environmental groups ? I 'd be watching for the next murderous domestic terrorist to come from the ranks of those sporting teabags . Wan na place a little wager ?""","""Suckers bet ? I think so , you anti 's are so damned ascared of guns you do n't have a clue of how to commit a `` murderous domestic terrorist `` act of that nature . Your nothing but a bunch of pacifist , scared of your own shadows , with Brady leading you .""",DISAGREE,"""You need n't be far left to support reasonable gun regulation .""","""Suckers bet""",,
8769,2323,"""It is all relative to our perspective Matt , so from the perspective of the Age of Grace , the Age of the Law seemed harsh . But do n't forget that the same God who gave us the Age of the Law , also gave us the Age of Grace which we currently reside in . And you can thank what Jesus did for this Age .""","""So in other words , you 're saying that somewhere along the lines , God changed his mind .""",DISAGREE,"""the same God who gave us the Age of the Law Age of Grace which we currently reside in . And you can thank what Jesus did for this Age .""","""in other words , you 're saying that somewhere along the lines , God changed his mind .""",,
8778,2325,"""This argument is frightening for two reasons . First , it must reject the notion of parental responsibility in order to succeed . Second , in spite of that weakness , people in high places think it 's compelling . Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg , writing in the North Carolina Law Review , has admitted that Roe v. Wade was deeply flawed , and instead quoted the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment in support of abortion . Women get pregnant , she argued , men do n't . Abortion gives women a shot at equality . She then cited Thompson for support . The responsibility a mother has toward her child supersedes any claim she has to personal liberty . If it does n't , if Thompson 's and McDonagh 's arguments succeed , then release Susan Smith . Release the deadbeat Florida tourists . If parenthood is an act of heroism , if mothers have no moral obligation to the children they bear , if child-rearing is a burden `` above and beyond the call of duty , `` then no child is safe , in the womb or out .""","""Were this true , adoption would be outlawed . The counter arguments to the Violinist Argument do not apply , and in many cases what they assert is false . Very weak .""",DISAGREE,"""This argument is frightening for two reasons . First , it must reject the notion of parental responsibility in order to succeed . Second , in spite of that weakness , people in high places think it 's compelling . Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg , writing in the North Carolina Law Review , has admitted that Roe v. Wade was deeply flawed , and instead quoted the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment in support of abortion . Women get pregnant , she argued , men do n't . Abortion gives women a shot at equality . She then cited Thompson for support . The responsibility a mother has toward her child supersedes any claim she has to personal liberty . If it does n't , if Thompson 's and McDonagh 's arguments succeed , then release Susan Smith . Release the deadbeat Florida tourists . If parenthood is an act of heroism , if mothers have no moral obligation to the children they bear , if child-rearing is a burden `` above and beyond the call of duty , `` then no child is safe , in the womb or out .""","""Were this true , adoption would be outlawed . The counter arguments to the Violinist Argument do not apply , and in many cases what they assert is false . Very weak .""",,
8797,2333,"""Tastyfish : Fire is well down the line after brain size has started to increase Well I agree with that simply because humans have larger brains than chimps and fire is associated only with humans .""","""Homo habilis is the first species to use fire as a tool I think .""",AGREE,"""Fire is well down the line after brain size has started to increase""","""Homo habilis is the first species to use fire as a tool I think .""",,
8798,2333,"""Tastyfish : Fire is well down the line after brain size has started to increase Well I agree with that simply because humans have larger brains than chimps and fire is associated only with humans .""","""Homo habilis is the first species to use fire as a tool I think .""",AGREE,"""I agree with that simply because humans have larger brains than chimps""","""Homo habilis is the first species to use fire as a tool I think .""",,
8803,2334,"""So you deny that this man is a victim ? Realize that the gunshot drew attention , and attention is something criminals do n't want . Maybe without that gunshot , the guy would 've been beaten to death . But I suppose you 'd be happier , because at least the old man was n't a gun owner . Or I suppose you think he should 've let the criminal have the money ; all that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing .""","""In other words youre happier because the old man did something criminal and broke the law . Admit it .""",DISAGREE,"""So you deny that this man is a victim ?""","""In other words youre happier because the old man did something criminal and broke the law .""",,
8804,2334,"""So you deny that this man is a victim ? Realize that the gunshot drew attention , and attention is something criminals do n't want . Maybe without that gunshot , the guy would 've been beaten to death . But I suppose you 'd be happier , because at least the old man was n't a gun owner . Or I suppose you think he should 've let the criminal have the money ; all that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing .""","""In other words youre happier because the old man did something criminal and broke the law . Admit it .""",DISAGREE,"""So you deny that this man is a victim ? Realize that the gunshot drew attention , and attention is something criminals do n't""","""In other words youre happier because the old man did something criminal and broke the""",,
8819,2337,"""Yeah , it was 9-zip on the individual right to kba in Heller . Over 35,000 watchers ... no one thought it would not be incorporated . Part of the transcript with Tom and Erin :""","""Hm , that does not seem to match the reading of Steven 's dissent . He seems pretty set against incorporation . [ T ] he right to possess a firearm of one & # 8217 ; s choosingis different in kind from the liberty interests we have recognized under the Due Process Clause . Despite the plethora of substantive due process cases that have been decided in the post-Lochner century , I have found none that holds , states , or even suggests that the term & # 8220 ; liberty & # 8221 ; encompasses either the common-law right of self-defense or a right to keep and bear arms and In short , while the utility of firearms , and handguns in particular , to the defense of hearth and home is certainly relevant to an assessment of petitioners & # 8217 ; asserted right , there is no freestanding self-defense claim in this case . The question we must decide is whether the interest in keeping in the home a firearm of one & # 8217 ; s choosing & # 8212 ; a handgun , for petitioners & # 8212 ; is one that is & # 8220 ; comprised within theterm liberty & # 8221 ; in the Fourteenth Amendment The practical impact of various gun-control measures may be highly controversial , but this basic insight should not be . The idea that deadly weapons pose a distinctive threat to the social order & # 8212 ; and that reasonable restrictions on their usage therefore impose an acceptable burden on one & # 8217 ; s personal liberty & # 8212 ; is as old as the Republic . As THE CHIEF JUSTICE observed just the other day , it is a foundational premise of modern government that the State holds a monopoly on legitimate violence""",DISAGREE,"""Over 35,000 watchers ... no one thought it would not be incorporated .""","""that does not seem to match the reading of Steven 's dissent .""",,
8824,2338,"""To abort because of an identified significant malformation is perfectly reasonable to me . My wife and I discussed this early in her pregnancy since we we 're told that our chances of a serious genetic abnormality was 1 in 74 . Long odds on a horse but seemed a real possibility at the time . We were in complete agreement to abort in the worst case scenario .""","""Because of course , ... people with genetic malady 's have no right to their lives anyway . Right ?""",DISAGREE,"""To abort because of an identified significant malformation is perfectly reasonable to me""","""people with genetic malady 's have no right to their lives anyway . Right ?""",,
8829,2339,"""Come on now . That 's a bit simplistic , is n't it ? Drop a hottie between those same college boys and watch the testosterone at work there . Lots of things can make men aggressive .""","""If they really like women . It 's not totally clear that Bush `` likes `` woman .""",DISAGREE,"""things can make men aggressive""","""It 's not totally clear that Bush `` likes `` woman""",,
8836,2341,"""But , when the religious `` fund raising `` has been clearly demonstrated on the anti-gay side , one would think that a demonstration of proof would be pertinent before any definitive statement can be made ... Otherwise , your claim of `` just is n't true `` lacks substance ...""","""See simplified version of what I already posted above .""",DISAGREE,"""Otherwise , your claim of `` just is n't true `` lacks substance ...""","""See simplified version of what I already posted""",,
8856,2346,"""What is the proposed progression in macroevolution ? Is it something like unicellular life to multi-cellular life , random multi-cellular conglomerations to an amoeba , to a fish , to a dinosaur , to a mammal , to an ape , and finally to a man ?""","""This is a good site to look at for such answers . Tree of Life Web Project By the way , 'and finally to a man ' implies both a direction to evolution and an end point . Both of these are not part of the modern synthesis .""",AGREE,"""What is the proposed progression in macroevolution ?""","""This is a good site to look at for such answers Tree of Life Web Project""",,
8872,2349,"""Assuredly , a very high state of being constantly afraid .""","""Oh joy another drive by with absolutely no proof or evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""Assuredly , a very high state of being constantly afraid .""","""joy another drive by with absolutely no proof or evidence""",,
8889,2352,"""We do n't ignore it . We look at the circumstances-all these stories are from civilizations/groups that live on or near flood plains . Floods are common place . Catastrophic floods , not so much . You , however , must ignore things .""","""Sure you ignore , excuse , justify and interpret any and all info according to your own preconceived notions and comfort zones . Not to mention according to your fleshly understanding which completely ignores the supernatural nature of the great flood . That 's why you come up with foolishness like every one of these stories took place in flood plains , as if you could ever prove that at all based on current topography . And yet you boldly make the claim as if it 's some proven fact . And you guys will say that the story of Gilgamesh precedes the writing of Genesis , therefore Genesis must have stolen the story from the Babylonians rather them being separate records of the same event . What ignorance and rationalization that is in order to justify a fallacious denial of the Genesis account . Here 's an example why that is . There are hundreds of books written about the Moon Landing . So there is obviously a first account written about it . And I 'm sure that years later , other books were also written on that same exact event . Are those later books lies ? Or were their facts stolen from the prior books , or taken from the event itself , just as the first book was ? So you see , your excuses and attempts to dismiss the great flood for such irrational reasons do n't make any sense at all .""",DISAGREE,"""We look at the circumstances-all these stories are from civilizations/groups""","""So there is obviously a first account written about it . And I 'm sure that years later , other books were also written""",,
8895,2353,"""If the moderators feel that this is not an appropriate post for this forum , then they have to make the call to delete it . Just to make it a debate , though , I 'll pose this question : Does anyone else miss the presence of any one of the individuals who was behind the usernames of Lurch and Ungerdunn ? Why or why not ?""","""This is dangerously like inviting ad hominem ; especially from those such as myself who do n't miss him at all . And he is not here to defend himself .""",DISAGREE,"""moderators feel not an appropriate post miss the presence""","""inviting ad hominem he is not here to defend himself""",,
8901,2354,"""... to curtail abortions . Any woman who has an abortion for convenience only ( not raped , no incest , no danger to the mother 's life ) shall have both ovaries removed . What do y'all think ?""","""Actually there is a better solution . Mandatory male and female birth control pills , financial penalties if you stop taking . Anyone who would get off the pill would want a kid , therefore , abortions would cease .""",DISAGREE,"""to curtail abortions""","""Actually there is a better solution .""",,
8913,2356,"""The problem with this is that the public school systems do not want to acknowledge that there even is a God .""","""So you are not an American ? You believe that your religion should be forced on everyone by the government ? Is it OK if I am allowed to teach your children my religion ?""",DISAGREE,"""the public school systems do not want to acknowledge that there even is a God .""","""You believe that your religion should be forced on everyone by the government""",,
8926,2359,"""To expound on my last post : And yet this is taken to be fact unanimously in our history books . Funny how easy this book gets a pass . If we think it 's Homer then for this book , that 's good enough . But not so with the Bible . There can be absolutely no kernel of uncertainty , which in ancient texts , ambiguity is unavoidable . In regards to who wrote these books , the best evidence we have leads to Homer . Therefore , we decide it is almost certainly Homer who is the author . This is undisputed . However , in regards to the Bible , skeptics overturn the use of Occam 's Razor and require more than adequate proof of the Bible 's claims . Even though the Bible is the most heavily documented writing of its day , still skeptics require more in order to believe the Gospels are actually true . Double standard much ?""","""Ah , but then , it might not have been Homer . But then again , whether it was Homer or someone else , is n't earth shattering . Much like whether it was Julius Caesar who crossed the Rubicon , or a decoy of his . Now , if we found an account from Roman times of how Julius Caesar split the waters of the Rubicon by urinating in it so his troops could pass ... Occam 's Razor would not point towards accepting it as true . In reading about John the Baptist ... should one listen to the Bible , or Josephus ?""",DISAGREE,"""To expound on my last post :""","""it might not have been Homer .""",,
8947,2366,"""Rubbish , there are many that argue otherwise . The life of twins can be viewed as starting at the moment the zygote/ embryo splits for example . The reality though is there is no single point at which a human life begins : the moment the egg and sperm form , the moment of conception , first division and implantation , the moment the heart starts to beat , the moment of birth etc all mark stages in the formation of a new life .""","""oh yeah rubbish rubbish , scientifically speaking , human life ( using a most bsic term ) begins at conception . the twins exist as two seperate entities the moment each contains the individual human dna . seems to me you better be certain when it begins before you go around ending it . if you are driving at night an you `` think `` you might see a person ahead in the middle of the road you are hopefully not gon na drive over that person . Instead that uncertainty should lead you to stop . If you dont like that example , consider a hunter who is unsure what is in the bushes .""",DISAGREE,"""there is no single point at which a human life begins :""","""human life ( using a most term ) begins at conception .""",,
8958,2371,"""Why do we sometimes feel guilty or ashamed when we have done something wrong ?""","""Because your mommy and daddy told you `` no , no , no `` when you did something wrong . Even my dog does that . When she was a puppy she used to poop in the corner of the dinning room and pee in the guest bedroom . She was always ashamed even before I found the evidence . In fact , because she was ashamed was the reason that I went looking .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do we sometimes feel guilty or ashamed when we have done something wrong ?""","""Because your mommy and daddy told you `` no , no , no `` when you did something wrong .""",,
8962,2373,"""I also got a kick out of you saying this : I prefer to use more `` neutral `` sources , but I 'll take a look for myself and verify everything I can . Yet , you neither offered verified links to support the one you posted , nor did your original link respond directly to SOCs issue by showing that countries which legalize gay marriage do n't result in higher homosexual activity .""","""1 ) Charliegone 's article was a published research article . I would love to know where `` NARTH 's `` editorial was published , if it even was published . 2 ) NARTH 's article DID NOT show any `` higher homosexual activity `` because of legalized gay marriage . It thoroughly failed to show ANY rise in homosexuality in ANY `` gay marriage `` country . It showed some studies which were reportedly done in those countries , but that 's it .""",DISAGREE,"""showing that countries which legalize gay marriage result in higher homosexual activity""","""article DID NOT show any `` higher homosexual activity `` because of legalized gay marriage""",,
8973,2376,"""The Bible reports there was a time in the history of humans that lifespans were incredibly long . According to Genesis people lived to over 900 years old .""","""How is mythology relevant ?""",DISAGREE,"""The Bible reports there was a time in the history of humans that lifespans were incredibly long .""","""How is mythology relevant""",,
8977,2377,"""I keep hearing the statement let the people decide or let the people vote . Why should people be allowed to vote on my marriage ? No where else and in no other civil rights aspect do we see this type of statement .""","""Because Matthew , society has to take the time to define its standards . We do n't start with the assumption that anything-goes ; standards are developed over time . Your question is no different than the recent couple in Germany in the news who are brother and sister wondering why they should not be allowed to marry . Marriage laws have to have limits somewhere in terms of what sort of arrangements of people suffice to be considered marriage , and this is all a part of simply determining ( over time ) where those limits fall . Many rights in our society DID have to go through a people-deciding process , so you are wrong that on no other issue do we see that sort of thing happening . In fact , even with civil rights itself , it happened in the form of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 . It happened earlier than that with women 's suffrage . Voting on civil rights is a well established precedent . Some things have become rights , some have n't . It 's a process that our society goes through in defining its standards . The problem is that some in your movement seem to want to circumvent that process .""",DISAGREE,"""people be allowed to vote on my marriage""","""Marriage laws have to have limits somewhere in terms of what sort of arrangements of people suffice to be considered marriage""",,
8980,2378,"""Why sure , I 'll simply report the facts and let you decide , unlike msnbc !""","""Somehow I do n't think a high percentage of Ham 's `` facts `` are facts .""",DISAGREE,"""unlike msnbc !""","""percentage of Ham 's `` facts `` are facts .""",,
8982,2378,"""Why sure , I 'll simply report the facts and let you decide , unlike msnbc !""","""Somehow I do n't think a high percentage of Ham 's `` facts `` are facts .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'll simply report the facts and let you decide""","""Somehow I do n't think a high percentage of Ham 's `` facts `` are facts .""",,
8983,2379,"""Science has now quantitated that a genetic mutation of as little as 1 billionth ( 0.0000001 % ) of an animal 's genome is completely fatal.The genetic difference between human and his nearest relative , the chimpanzee , is at least 1.6 % Calculated out that is a gap of at least 48 million nucleotide differences that must be bridged by random changes . And a random change of only 3 nucleotides is fatal to an animal . Evolution ca n't work , and is not scientific .""","""Ah , no this is n't true at all . Not even close , actually . The Human Genome project has never discovered anything of the sort . The average human has far more than three mutations . Just take a look here : http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/mutations.html Where you may find the quote :""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution""","""Human Genome has of the""",,
8988,2380,"""You want to see the killing of our kids as well""","""Yes . It 's part of this massive conspiracy . We 're trying to thin out your population so we can take Australia for our own .""",DISAGREE,"""You want to see the killing of our kids as well""","""We 're trying to thin out your population so we can take Australia""",,
8989,2380,"""You want to see the killing of our kids as well""","""Yes . It 's part of this massive conspiracy . We 're trying to thin out your population so we can take Australia for our own .""",DISAGREE,"""killing of our kids""","""We 're trying to thin out your population""",,
8993,2382,"""The Biologist must have been thinking that a `` giant mushroom `` was the cause and evolve it . Now , that 's very funny !""","""I 'm quite sure that the biologist did n't get his degree from an accredited university . Any honest biologist would have realized very quickly that the DNA of a mushroom and the non-existent DNA of an igloo quickly disprove his hypothesis .""",DISAGREE,"""giant mushroom `` was the cause and evolve it . Now , that 's very funny !""","""Any honest biologist would have realized very quickly that the DNA""",,
8997,2384,"""In conjunction , and continuing from the above post I present this . It seems that not only do evolutionists put forward examples of artificial selection as evidence of natural selection , they also present purpose as randomness . A good example is the Typing Monkeys scearnio `` Attempts have been made to support evolution by appealing to mathematics to justify long ages . For example , Nobel prize winner , George Wald , wrote , `` Time is the hero of the plot . Given enough time anything can happen - the impossible becomes probable , the improbable becomes certain. `` ( 1 ) Thomas Huxley ( `` Darwin 's Bulldog `` ) used this technique in Oxford , in 1860 , while debating Samuel Wilberforce . He stated that if monkeys randomly strummed typewriter keys for a long enough time , then sooner or later Psalm 23 would be printed out . Huxley used this argument to demonstrate that life could have originated on Earth by chance . ( 2 )""","""What remarkable prescience , considering that the typewriter was invented in 1874 , I must admit that I stopped reading after that . Izzy""",DISAGREE,"""It seems that not only do evolutionists put forward examples of artificial selection as evidence of natural selection , they also present purpose as randomness""","""the .""",,
9008,2389,"""Question No . 3 is very different than No . 1 . You suggested an affirmative to any of the three would result in the loss of one 's CCW . I do n't buy that .""","""I suggested nothing . You are reading into this some thing that is absent . '' The nurse then informed me , if I had answered yes to any of the questions , I would have lost my concealed carry permit as it would have gone into my medical records and the VA would have reported it to Homeland Security . Looks like they are going after us vets. ``""",DISAGREE,"""You suggested an affirmative to any of the three would result in the loss of one 's CCW . I do n't buy that .""",""" The nurse then informed me , if I had answered yes to any of the questions , I would have lost my concealed carry permit as it would have gone into my medical records and the VA would have reported it to Homeland Security . Looks like they are going after us""",,
9015,2391,"""Oh , I do n't know that she is any nuttier than the next person . However I think her opinion is wrong . I also think her argument is not correct . A person can not impose themselves on your property without your consent - and you CAN remove them , and even kill them if they are a threat to you .""","""That 's the trick , is n't it ? If its a threat . But since when is a fetus a threat ? Sure , when the fetus is endangering the mother 's life , fine . But 97 % of the time , it 's not . Can a woman kill using her own body ? Steal ? Rape ? No , of course not . I ca n't rape anyone and get away with it because I used my own body . Next time you get caught stealing , tell the judge that you were using your own body to do it , and you can do whatever you want with your own body . Enjoy the following laugh . And prove to me that a fetus is not a living human . In fact , find ANYTHING that is made of cells and is or was not living .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't know that she is any nuttier than the next person . However I think her opinion is wrong .""","""In fact , find ANYTHING that is made of cells and is or was not living .""",,
9019,2392,"""When the citizen has no rights , then an accusation is enough to convict .""","""This is the situation as it is in Britain .""",DISAGREE,"""When the citizen has no rights , then an accusation is enough to convict .""","""This is the situation as it is in Britain .""",,
9037,2407,"""I do agree that channeling male aggression into non-lethal pursuits is worthwhile . I do n't see a place for firearms in that effort .""","""Then let 's move this discussion to another forum where it would be more appropriate .""",AGREE,"""I do n't see a place for firearms in that effort .""","""Then let 's move this discussion to another forum where it would be more appropriate .""",,
9042,2410,"""Or that strange pull to make a bad decision .""","""I know of no such strange pull . I have heard of psychotics who have such impulses and even some who hear voices . I worked with one once . He was fairly stable and quite likeable when he took his medication .""",DISAGREE,"""strange pull to make a bad decision""","""have heard of psychotics who have such impulses and even some who hear voices""",,
9047,2412,"""Now you 're being ridiculous .""","""Certain people include the big bang in the `` general theory of evolution `` . This is the statement I made and it is a fact and not ridiculous . I did not discuss the truth of the statement I made the comment the statement is made .""",DISAGREE,"""you 're being ridiculous""","""This is the statement I made and it is a fact and not ridiculous .""",,
9089,2426,"""the term evolution itself has `` evolved `` so much that its hard for many people to pin an accurate definition to it .""","""Really ? I was n't aware that the definition had changed . I do know that a definition was formulated as part of the modern synthesis back in the 1930s and 40s . That is the definition I learned some decades ago , it is the one I have always used , and it is the one that I still find in modern biology texts . It is also the one that all biologists that I know use , and of course the meaning definition of what evolutionary biologists mean when they talk about evolution should be determined by evolutionary biologists themselves . It seems kind of an empty exercise to invent a definition that is n't what evolutionary biologists mean and then argue against it in an effort to disprove evolution . Let me put it this way , do you think that it would be acceptable in a discussion of Christianity if I were allowed to invent my own definition of what a Christian means when he talks about salvation ? So please , please tell us about some of these changing defintions . Like I said , I 've been using the same one for over 40 years and was n't aware that it had changed .""",DISAGREE,"""term evolution itself has `` evolved `` so much that its hard for many people to pin an accurate definition to it .""","""Really ? I was n't aware that the definition had changed . I do know that a definition was formulated as part of the modern synthesis back in the 1930s and""",,
9097,2428,"""Joe > > and it did not refer to homosexuality .""","""Really ? Let ’ s see ,""",DISAGREE,"""Joe > > and it did not refer to homosexuality .""","""Really ? Let ’ s see ,""",,
9103,2431,"""Among the 15 states with the highest homicide rates , 10 have restrictive or very restrictive gun laws . 20 percent of U.S. homicides occur in four cities with just 6 percent of the population - New York , Chicago , Detroit and Washington , D.C. - and each has a virtual prohibition on private handguns . New York has one of the most restrictive gun laws in the nation - and 20 percent of the armed robberies . Even more troublesome is the fact that the places where gun control laws are toughest tend to be the places where the most crime is committed with illegal weapons:22""","""Face it . Gun control is nonsensical . NOBODY has EVER managed to show any benifit from it . At best , it has no effect on crime and at worst it increases it .""",DISAGREE,"""the 15 states with the highest homicide rates , 10 have restrictive or very restrictive gun laws""","""Face it . Gun control is nonsensical""",,
9114,2436,"""It sounds to me that this `` new `` enzymatic activity came from non-coding dna switching on a gene to produce it . That is what one would expect to find .""","""Nope . Frame-shifts move the whole code down one step , making entirely new genes . Often , this is disastrous , but sometimes , a useful new enzyme results . Barbarian observes : It 's remarkable then , how much progress we 've made . You may or may not approve of the theory , but it works very well at learning more about biology . And , as you may have noticed , we 've been very successful at interpreting the data . We 've learned to do a lot of things as a result . One of the most important reasons scientists accept the theory is that it works .""",DISAGREE,"""That is what one would expect to find""","""Nope .""",,
9120,2438,"""It would be nice if you pick a horse and ride it .""","""He 's doing his best Jesus impression ; remember when Jesus rode into Jerusalem on the backs of two asses ?""",DISAGREE,"""be nice if you pick a horse and ride""","""his best Jesus impression when Jesus rode into Jerusalem on the backs of two asses ?""",,
9123,2439,"""Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States .""","""So let 's see these statistics to prove that hundreds were saved . For issues in Chicago , I 'd trust a source that 's actually from Chicago sooner than I 'd trust CNN .""",DISAGREE,"""Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States .""","""For issues in Chicago , I 'd trust a source that 's actually from Chicago sooner than I 'd trust CNN .""",,
9124,2439,"""Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States .""","""So let 's see these statistics to prove that hundreds were saved . For issues in Chicago , I 'd trust a source that 's actually from Chicago sooner than I 'd trust CNN .""",DISAGREE,"""compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States .""","""For issues in Chicago , I 'd trust a source that 's actually from Chicago sooner than I 'd trust CNN .""",,
9139,2443,"""You claim that there was a god that created the earth in 6 literal days with a miracle , flooded the earth with a miracle and scattered the people of earth and created new languages with a miracle . Now why do modern obervations of the physical world have to support these miracles ? If god made a copy of adam as he was 8 days after creation and placed him in a modern day hospital is n't it plausible doctors would state he was an adult man . So if you could say a human that is a few days old is a mature adult , Could n't you also a universe that is a thousands of years old is billions of years old . Just looking at the muscle tissue in adams arm when it was an hour old you would conclude it had grown over a period of many years . How can you rule out the possibility that this is a good analogy for humanities current observations of the universe and conclude that it had grown over millions of years when it was actually only 1000s of years old .""","""'No , actually the earth is 150 years old . FACT . And its age never changes . FACT . '' -Chris Formage , Grand Theft Auto : San Andreas .""",DISAGREE,"""How can you rule out the possibility that this is a good analogy""","""'No , ''""",,
9144,2444,"""It does seem obvious that a woman ought to be allowed to protect herself from an attacker and use lethal force to do so , if necessary . If this is true , then we must concede the legitimacy of abortion , which , McDonagh claims , is parallel in a relevant way .""","""So , if the argument is analogous , abortion is justified .""",DISAGREE,"""If this is true , then we must concede the legitimacy of abortion""","""So , if the argument is analogous , abortion is justified .""",,
9146,2445,"""of those add new body parts except for this one .... evolution of multicellularity in a unicellular green alga ( Boraas 1983 ; Boraas et al . 1998 ) ; ... which is n't even a result of mutation . Got anything else ?""","""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend . You claimed : `` have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing structure. `` Now you are changing your argument away from structure as new proteins and especially enzymes ( which are proteins ) do n't count .""",DISAGREE,"""unicellular green alga""","""creationist 's best friend""",,
9147,2445,"""of those add new body parts except for this one .... evolution of multicellularity in a unicellular green alga ( Boraas 1983 ; Boraas et al . 1998 ) ; ... which is n't even a result of mutation . Got anything else ?""","""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend . You claimed : `` have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing structure. `` Now you are changing your argument away from structure as new proteins and especially enzymes ( which are proteins ) do n't count .""",DISAGREE,"""which is n't even a result of mutation . Got anything else ?""","""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend .""",,
9148,2445,"""of those add new body parts except for this one .... evolution of multicellularity in a unicellular green alga ( Boraas 1983 ; Boraas et al . 1998 ) ; ... which is n't even a result of mutation . Got anything else ?""","""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend . You claimed : `` have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing structure. `` Now you are changing your argument away from structure as new proteins and especially enzymes ( which are proteins ) do n't count .""",DISAGREE,""" which is n't even a result of mutation .""","""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend""",,
9152,2447,"""If a God exists , then God is as God is .""","""True but this progesses nothing twoards a conversation because you have no told me the nature of such an existance . You have said if A is then A=A .... thats saying a lot without saying anything at all because you have failed to provide what A is .""",DISAGREE,"""God exists""","""progesses nothing twoards a conversation""",,
9166,2451,"""Having troubles getting past step one Simone ? You just got ta try harder to want a God in your life . I know that it 's more useless than tits on a man but hon , you got ta open your mind and heart up to the uber-natural farces that permiate the other semi-non-existing planes of being . And if yer still having troubles wanting to believe , you can send me some money . It seems to help people want to believe if they 've paid good , hard earned money for it . Something about not wanting to see your investment go to waste ... or was it not wanting to be proven to be a fool who fell for a scam ... But , psychologically putting money on it seems to help you believe .""","""You have hit on something . But Christ said give all your money away and follow him , but not many believers obey this commandment . Most Christians are very interested in making more and more money . Capitalism and christianity are incompatible .""",DISAGREE,"""You just got ta try harder to want a God in your life .""","""But Christ said give all your money away and follow him , but not many believers obey this commandment .""",,
9191,2456,"""To support creation you must first tackle the concept of something `` outside `` the knowable universe . Because this is irrational , the entire concept of creation is irrational to `` believe `` in . You can believe in it , but you must accept that the belief is not a rational belief .""","""Firstly , we take the actual events of creation and the existence of God by faith - because we were not there to observe the events happening . Similarly , evolutionists must also take the supposed progression of life from simple to complex by faith , as we were not there to observe the events happening and they certainly can not be repeated today . If someone gives you an eye witness account of an event that happened before your time and all the evidence that you have collected does not contradict that account , is it no logical and rational to believe that eye witness ' account ? In a similar way , we have the Word of our Creator who does n't lie and who was there in the beginning . The actual physical evidence fits nicely with what we would expect if the Bible is right , e.g . fossils , mutations , the fact that there are billions of sea things burried in massive `` underwater graves `` all over the Earth - some while still eating or giving birth ( i.e . had to be rapid ) . So if the evidence that we have collected does not contradict what His eye witness account says ( i.e . Genesis ) than , is it not logical and rational to believe it to be true ? In fact , it would be illogical and irrational to not believe it !""",DISAGREE,"""To support creation you must first tackle the concept of something `` outside `` the knowable universe .""","""Firstly , we take the actual events of creation and the existence of God by faith""",,
9220,2461,""" ‘ Creationists believe in microevolution but not macroevolution. ’ These terms , which focus on  ‘ small ’ v.  ‘ large ’ changes , distract from the key issue of information . That is , particles-to-people evolution requires changes that increase genetic information , but all we observe is sorting and loss of information . We have yet to see even a  ‘ micro ’ increase in information , although such changes should be frequent if evolution were true . Conversely , we do observe quite  ‘ macro ’ changes that involve no new information , e.g . when a control gene is switched on or off .""","""AH ! the old `` information `` gambit . It only shows that anyone who uses this does n't no what they are talking about . Take a biology/genetics class and you 'd realize how stupid this sounds . Thank you for finding this page ! ! !""",DISAGREE,""" ‘ Creationists believe in microevolution but not .""","""Take a biology/genetics class and you 'd realize how stupid this sounds .""",,
9225,2462,"""in the same way God can not create a round square .""","""God can do whatever He wants . Although one can say `` God does not `` or `` God is not `` , a thiest believeing in and worshipping the God of Abraham and Joachim I do not think should ever say `` God can not `` anything .... With God , all things and everything is possible . Sentiments such as those expressed above in my view seem to be evident in Western Christianity where it seems believers are too often trying to bring God down to our level , imposing limits etc .""",DISAGREE,"""God round square""","""God can do whatever He wants . ``""",,
9240,2464,"""The only thing I think is settled is the Judgment of God that Sotomayor and her spiritually-stunted , unbiblical , like-minded cohorts will be coming under if they do n't repent of the innocent blood they helped shed .""","""I see . So , you know the souls of others ? and how God will judge them ? Interesting . That certainly does settle a few things ....""",DISAGREE,"""the Judgment of God that Sotomayor and her spiritually-stunted , unbiblical , like-minded cohorts will be coming""","""So you know the souls of others ? and how God will judge them ?""",,
9266,2469,"""I agree that women deserve better choices and such , but banning abortion eliminates their usually best choice . Women do deserve better , but how can you say that while advocating an abortion ban ?""","""Abortion is their best choice ? ? ? ? ? ? Yet women deserve better ? Why do you think abortion is their best choice ?""",DISAGREE,"""I agree that women deserve better choices and such , but banning abortion eliminates their usually best choice""","""Abortion is their best choice ? ? ? ? ? ? Yet women deserve better ?""",,
9270,2469,"""I agree that women deserve better choices and such , but banning abortion eliminates their usually best choice . Women do deserve better , but how can you say that while advocating an abortion ban ?""","""Abortion is their best choice ? ? ? ? ? ? Yet women deserve better ? Why do you think abortion is their best choice ?""",DISAGREE,"""Women do deserve better""","""Yet women deserve better ?""",,
9289,2473,"""What happens , is that if you show a new body part evolving , such as the cecal valve in certain lizards , they just push the goal posts back a bit : `` No , I meant a new body part that is so complex that it could n't possibly evolve quickly enough for someone to observe it happening . And no one has ever observed that to happen , so evolution is false. `` Oh .""","""Walking-fish : It 's a simple game . Just demand that `` evolutionists `` show them an example of a macroevolutionary event within a microevolutionary time frame . And if such a feat were ever accomplished it would serve as an example of special creation rather than evolution anyway .""",AGREE,"""the cecal valve in certain lizards , they just push the goal posts back a bit : `` No , I meant a new body part""","""It 's a simple game . Just demand that `` evolutionists `` show them an example of a macroevolutionary event within a microevolutionary time frame""",,
9292,2473,"""What happens , is that if you show a new body part evolving , such as the cecal valve in certain lizards , they just push the goal posts back a bit : `` No , I meant a new body part that is so complex that it could n't possibly evolve quickly enough for someone to observe it happening . And no one has ever observed that to happen , so evolution is false. `` Oh .""","""Walking-fish : It 's a simple game . Just demand that `` evolutionists `` show them an example of a macroevolutionary event within a microevolutionary time frame . And if such a feat were ever accomplished it would serve as an example of special creation rather than evolution anyway .""",AGREE,"""And no one has ever observed that to happen , so evolution is""","""Just demand that `` evolutionists `` show them an example of a macroevolutionary event""",,
9299,2475,"""Butwhat of the fetus/babies that were wanted by daddy but not by mummy what does termination stop then ?""","""It stops us from saying we ara a rational people . I do n't support any laws that would allow a father not to have a say so about his child being aborted . Are there any ? ? If it were a life or death thing for the mother no question . As I stated I do n't like the idea but making it illegal would simply put more unwanted kids in state homes . Lets take care of the living first !""",DISAGREE,"""wanted by daddy but not by mummy what does termination stop then""","""I do n't support any laws that would allow a father not to have a say so about his child being aborted""",,
9305,2476,"""yeah that last sentence was lame but can you argue against my point ?""","""If you are saying that we are soon going to be overpopulated and that governments will can either address the problem now or face horrendous consequences in the near future .. then no , I cant""",AGREE,"""that last sentence was lame but can you argue against my point ?""","""no , I cant""",,
9307,2476,"""yeah that last sentence was lame but can you argue against my point ?""","""If you are saying that we are soon going to be overpopulated and that governments will can either address the problem now or face horrendous consequences in the near future .. then no , I cant""",AGREE,"""yeah that last sentence was lame but can you argue against my point ?""","""we are soon going to be overpopulated and that governments will can either address the problem now or face horrendous consequences""",,
9338,2483,"""And when one does ?""","""He or she is still subject to attracting a mate more effectively than other monkeys , as a step toward producing offspring more effectively via any number of mechanisms .""",AGREE,"""And when one does ?""","""still subject to attracting a mate more effectively than other monkeys , producing offspring more effectively""",,
9339,2484,"""Okay , and you , of course , are n't going to be lazy . So , seeing how you started this thread , would you please explain to us what your point is ?""","""`` It is our contention that if 'random ' [ chance ] is given a serious and crucial interpretation from a probabilistic point of view , the randomness postulate is highly implausible and that an adequate scientific theory of evolution must await the discovery and elucidation of new natural laws , physical , chemical and biological. `` quoted from above . It would help if you read the post .""",DISAGREE,"""are n't going to be lazy . started this thread would you please explain to us what your point is ?""","""that if 'random ' [ chance ] is given a serious and crucial interpretation from a probabilistic point of view , randomness postulate is highly implausible an adequate scientific theory of evolution must await elucidation of new natural laws , physical , chemical and .""",,
9350,2486,"""So you speak out intelligently and knowingly with you best evidence yet ... `` Creationists of any ilk fail to understand the power of the environment in acting on genetic diversity over time. ``""","""And you have been so kind as to prove my point . Obviously you fail to understand . I can recommend some books for you to read to educate yourself a little . Let me know . At any rate , after extensive reading of the opinions of creationists such as Mr. Kent Hovind and Ken Ham , we truthfully characterize the creationist knowledge of science when we say :""",DISAGREE,"""So you speak out intelligently and knowingly with you best evidence yet ... `` Creationists of any ilk fail to understand the power of the environment in acting on genetic diversity over time. ``""","""And you have been so kind as to prove my point . Obviously you fail to""",,
9354,2487,"""Sometimes the law is an XXX , and juries are dumber than you might expect . In general terms , the law should encourage people finding a firearm to call the police . It 's generally not a good idea to be walking the streets taking them to the police . What should have happened in this case ( assuming all is as it seems ) was that the case should have been dropped as a prosecution was not in the public interest , and similarly the jury should have told them where to stick it , as they have in other cases where the law as written has produced an unjust result ( as it happens the law itself is not usually at fault , just that the particular situation has not been envisaged ) . I just hope a pardon is issued for the unfortunate victim of this .""","""No what should 've happened was Mr. Clarke not being arrested at all , over a matter of a technicality . With the UK always offering so many `` gun amnesties `` , always telling criminals that they can turn in their illegally possessed guns and there will be no move to prosecute them , you 'd think the officials would extend the same courtesy to honest citizens , that they do to violent criminals .""",DISAGREE,"""Sometimes the law is an XXX , and juries are dumber than you might expect . In general terms , the law should encourage people finding a firearm to call the police . It 's generally not a good idea to be walking the streets taking them to the police .""","""No what should 've happened was Mr. Clarke not being arrested at all , over a matter of a technicality . With the UK always offering so many `` gun amnesties""",,
9359,2488,"""Afterwards , due to a diet of breads , deserts , cooked foods , sweets and toxicity , humans have been degenerating ever since . There is no way to stop this . Our species is dying . Information is weakingÂ….genomes are decaying . If it were not for the internal mechanisms we have in our bodies for controlling the frequency of mutations , extinction of the human race would come quickly .""","""More assertions . Look at the `` helpful mutations `` link .""",DISAGREE,"""Afterwards , due to a diet of breads , deserts , cooked foods , sweets and toxicity ,""","""More assertions . Look at the `` helpful mutations `` link .""",,
9371,2490,"""How is allowing both their lives valuing the fetus over the women ?""","""Because you do n't give a damn about the circumstances of the woman . All she is to you is a pregnancy and nothing more .""",DISAGREE,"""How is allowing both their lives valuing the fetus over the women ?""","""All she is to you is a pregnancy and nothing more .""",,
9396,2501,"""If minorities ' civil rights are truly being taken away and hurt due to ballot initiatives , then that is a far better reason to change the system than the fact there are people out there who misuse the system .""","""And the risk to minority 's civil rights is , of course , the reason for the bill . They are , after all , limiting what can be started via initiative , not eliminating the initiative process altogether . The fraud was merely an example of why the change is needed . As has been argued here before , if civil rights need protecting , it 's from the majority . Allowing civil rights to be modified via the initiative process simply makes it too easy for the majority to impose it 's will on the minority . That 's not what a Democracy is about , at least not our Democracy .""",AGREE,"""If minorities ' civil rights are truly being taken away and hurt due to ballot initiatives , then that is a far better reason to change the system than the fact there are people out there who misuse the system .""","""to As has been argued here before , if civil rights need protecting , it 's from the majority . Allowing civil rights to be modified via the initiative process simply makes it""",,
9407,2504,"""your probably referring to the mexican basin crater . mass extinction does n't prove evolution . the flood as described in the Bible is an example of mass extinction . besides , in order for the asteroid theory to work , the asteroid would have to create an almost global tidal wave that would effectively kill the animals by drowning . also similiar to the effects of the flood .""","""You just ca n't fit all those animals on an ark .""",DISAGREE,"""also similiar to the effects of the flood""","""You just ca n't fit all those animals on an ark""",,
9420,2508,"""it ca n't always be cared by anyone . What if no one wants the baby or you ca n't get to a place where you can give the baby up ( maybe snowed in for a week ) . Can you kill the baby then because it is now dependent on you .""","""it can be cared by anyone who wants to care for it . a 1-day-old baby is a natural citizen of the country in which it was born , and therefore is protected by the law of that country . killing the baby would be murder . a person being dependent on someone else does not mean that the host can kill the dependent person at their discretion .""",DISAGREE,"""it ca n't always be cared by anyone""","""it can be cared by anyone who wants""",,
9425,2511,"""If anything , the special dependant class already exists in the form of the heterosexual married couple , funded by the rest of society , married or not . Any `` loopholes `` that exist are now only to the exclusive benefit of heterosexual married couples .""","""I have never disagreed that marriage is a special dependent class . My point is that it is a society-sanctioned special class .""",DISAGREE,"""special dependant class already exists in the form of the heterosexual married couple""","""have never disagreed that marriage is a special dependent class it is a society-sanctioned special class .""",,
9433,2522,"""Lately , it ’ s been tough for us atheists . From recent scientific discoveries that show the amazing complexities of the simplest forms of life , the subsequent mathematical improbability of random , chance , godless processes producing and maintaining life , to people like Behe , Dembski , Spetner , and many websites untainted with liberalism and political correctness of the mainstream media , the movie  “ Expelled ” that showed a very real probability of how we ’ ve been so close to violating the U.S. Constitution in academia . Well I have news for Christians/conservatives – they ’ re the ones who are deluded ! [ insert stream of vulgar name calling here ] Because God does not exist – random chance made the universe with all its order and complexity ! How do I know this ? From Madelyn Murray O ’ Hair ! She said so , she proved how smart she was when she won her  “ separation of church and state ” lawsuit in 1963 ! She has garnered so many followers that also happened to have an interest in science , that they ’ ve managed to take over the scientific community ! How could they be wrong ? How could their current representatives , Dawkins and Harris , be wrong ? They obviously know all things ! Now , who should we believe , the Bible , written and preserved over the entire period of the human ability to write , no matter how many attempts have been made to destroy it , or Dawkins and Harris and their millions of followers in the scientific community ? It doesn ’ t matter what the Bible says , Tiktaalik Roseaea is real ! A small band of atheist explorers said so ! We can look in telescopes and see all the galaxies we want ! We know it took that light hundreds of billions of years to reach us ! No God would have made the universe , and sat around that long waiting for us to be able to see it ! Heh heh , is science unbelievable or what ? Now , if you think we don ’ t know how big those galaxies are , how many stars they contain , how many planets they contain that have life on them , how long it takes their light to get here ( accurate to only a few hundred light years , plus or minus ) , you must be deluded or something ! Just ask us , we ’ ll tell you ! According to Christians , orderly , specified complexity in life and the universe show a mathematical improbability very close to impossibility of random , purposeless origins and existence of reality . That ’ s ridiculous – all you have to do is note that someone wins the lottery just about every week despite that individuals almost impossible chances - that tells you that evolution HAD to have happened ! Dawkins and Harris clearly say that God does not exist , though some deluded non-atheist scientists say that chance can ’ t fully explain evolution , let alone the origins of life . Dawkins has dreams that spacemen came long ago and sowed the seeds of life on earth then flew away , never to be seen again ! How could he be wrong – he knows all things ! It ’ s amazing how the Bible can give us such obviously sound advise concerning finances , morality , behavior , as well as such accurate predictions about the breakdown of those things , and be so wrong about everything that science tells us about politics , and liberalism [ Obama/Ried ] visual here ] and be so wrong about the age of the earth , or how long it takes light to reach us ! I ’ m sure we ’ ll find out life originated from lifeless matter someday , it ’ s been just around the corner for 150 years now . Never mind that the corner keeps getting further and further away scientifically , we ’ re going to find it really soon ! Look , I ’ m an atheist , and us atheists , we understand that things like miracles that defy the laws of physics ( the origin of life by natural processes ) are the truth . We know there is no God , we will never question that , because we are 100 % certain that Madelyn Murray O ’ Hair was right ! Christians aren ’ t certain about anything – they don ’ t know how God originated , or where he is ! They have no clue about all those galaxies like we do ! Clearly , stuff like morals and finances , and written history have no place in our lives in the 21st century , we must live by the words of Dawkins and Harris – soon they will be able to cure ALL diseases , make us all live forever , and count more galaxies for us ! So that when there is no more death or sorrow thanks to science , and people like Dawkins , Harris , and Obama are ruling over every aspect of our lives , they ’ ll inform me that they ’ re correct , and they 'll have ways of seeing to it that I agree with them . Are Christians ever that logical ? So Christians , who exactly is the deluded one here ?""","""I don ’ t have the time nor the funding to put this in video form like Harris and Dawkins . I do n't think many , if any , Christians really do - satire about atheism is n't a strong Christian practice , not nearly as strong as atheist satire about Christianity , it seems . Maybe that 's what made Poe 's Law so notable in the beginning of this thread .""",DISAGREE,"""Lately , it ’ s been tough for us atheists . From recent scientific discoveries that show the amazing complexities of the simplest forms of life , the subsequent mathematical improbability of random , chance , godless processes producing and maintaining life , to people like Behe , Dembski , Spetner , and many websites untainted with liberalism and political correctness of the mainstream media , the movie  Expelled that showed a very real probability of how we ’ ve been so close to violating the U.S. Constitution in academia .""","""I don ’ t have the time nor the funding to put this in video form like Harris and Dawkins . I do n't think many , if any , Christians really do - satire about atheism is n't a strong Christian practice , not nearly as strong as atheist satire about Christianity , it seems .""",,
9434,2523,"""Atheists do , but it doesn & # 8217 ; t necessarily mean that they represent science . You haven & # 8217 ; t gotten in over your head & # 8211 ; most who post here don & # 8217 ; t know much about science . TQ doesn & # 8217 ; t , and of course he & # 8217 ; ll tell you that I don & # 8217 ; t. There & # 8217 ; s a big difference between science , and the creation/ evolution controversy . Many atheists who seem to be interested in science are actually only interested in it to the point that it helps them feel & # 8220 ; intellectually fulfilled & # 8221 ; , to discredit religion . Some of the best reading on the creation/evolution controversy isn & # 8217 ; t written by scientists , but by philosophers who have done just enough scientific homework on the subject to keep a clear focus on the controversy , without confusing it with too much detail . Michael Ruse and Bradley Monten are two excellent atheist authors on the subject . Religious authors , practically too many to name . William Dembski , David Berlinski , Phillip Johnson , Cornelius Hunter , many others . You would do well to read anything by any of these people . Far too many young people seem to make the mistake of getting most all of their information from rabid atheists who are also degreed biologists , like Richard Dawkins . He & # 8217 ; s become a celebrity , and most degreed biologists who are not rabid atheists are a little to timid to take him on in a very direct way , without fear of discrimination , academic or otherwise . Michael Behe is one of the few who has been somewhat successful at it , not in avoiding discrimination , but in his ability to make a comfortable living in spite of it . Read & # 8220 ; The Edge of Evolution & # 8221 ; , or & # 8220 ; Darwin & # 8217 ; s Black Box & # 8221 ; sometime .""","""Oh yes , Mr Behe makes a comfortable living out of selling to the ignorant . His newest book is just a rehash of his old book , and has the very same flaws that have been destroyed over and over again . As for your 'religious authors ' being respected .. they are respected perhaps by the fundamentalists that do not understand what science is about .""",AGREE,"""who are not rabid atheists are a little to timid""","""As for your 'religious authors ' being respected""",,
9444,2528,"""[ the revolt ] ended when the poorly-armed and supplied resistance was crushed by the German troops ... Approximately 13,000 Jewish residents were killed during the uprising ( some 6,000 among them were burnt alive or died from smoke inhalation ) . Of the remaining 50,000 inhabitants , most were captured and shipped to concentration and extermination camps , in particular to Treblinka . ... According to the Stroop 's report , his forces suffered 16 killed in action and 86 wounded ( these figures included over 60 members of Waffen-SS , and did not include the Jewish collaborators ) . The real number of German losses , however , may be well higher if unknown . For the propaganda purposes , official German casualties were claimed to be only few wounded and none killed , while the Polish underground bulletins claimed that hundreds of Nazis died in the fighting .""","""Even if 'hundreds of Nazis ' died , the outcome of the Uprising was a complete victory for the German armed forces .""",AGREE,"""the revolt ] ended when the poorly-armed and supplied resistance was crushed by the German troops .""","""Even if 'hundreds of Nazis ' died , the outcome of the Uprising was a complete victory for the German armed forces .""",,
9448,2529,"""Many of the Cambrian fauna , still survive today , all looking much like they did over 500 million [ ET * * ] years ago .""","""Actually , not at all true . The organisms of the Cambrian look little like modern animals . It is only the major phyla that are recognized by the derived characteristics . For example , the cordates first arise in the early Cambrian , along with primitive inverebrates . You can safely say that no animal living today looks much like any living then . For example , there were no amphibians , no reptiles , no insects , no birds , and of course , no mammals . Your shotgun approach is n't actually worth answering in any detail . It is n't even your work .""",DISAGREE,"""Many of the Cambrian fauna , still survive today , all looking much like they did over 500 million [ ET * * ] years ago .""","""Actually , not at all true . The organisms of the Cambrian look little like modern animals . You can safely say that no animal living today looks much like any living then .""",,
9456,2531,""".... NOW YOU 'RE SMOKING CRACK HERE DUDE . I 'm sure there are some people that deal all kinds of things , but someone who regularly sells pot pretty much only sells pot . I 'm not saying 100 % of the time , but pot smokers do n't go into some ghetto crackhouse to get their pot . Jesus , man , are you that out of touch ?""","""No , I think that he 's right on target . The drug dealers that are caught here in Michigan usually get caught with weed AND more hardcore drugs . Theyy 're `` full service `` dealers . Weed is a gateway drug , you know .""",DISAGREE,"""NOW YOU 'RE SMOKING CRACK HERE DUDE . I 'm sure there are some people that deal all kinds of things , but someone who regularly sells pot pretty much only sells pot .""","""I think that he 's right on target . The drug dealers that are caught here in Michigan usually get caught with weed AND more hardcore drugs .""",,
9457,2531,""".... NOW YOU 'RE SMOKING CRACK HERE DUDE . I 'm sure there are some people that deal all kinds of things , but someone who regularly sells pot pretty much only sells pot . I 'm not saying 100 % of the time , but pot smokers do n't go into some ghetto crackhouse to get their pot . Jesus , man , are you that out of touch ?""","""No , I think that he 's right on target . The drug dealers that are caught here in Michigan usually get caught with weed AND more hardcore drugs . Theyy 're `` full service `` dealers . Weed is a gateway drug , you know .""",DISAGREE,"""NOW YOU 'RE SMOKING CRACK HERE DUDE . I 'm sure there are some people that deal all kinds of things , but someone who regularly sells pot pretty much only sells pot . I 'm not saying 100 % of the time , but pot smokers do n't go into some ghetto crackhouse to get their pot . Jesus , man , are you that out of touch ?""","""No , I think that he 's right on target . The drug dealers that are caught here in Michigan usually get caught with weed AND more hardcore drugs . Theyy 're `` full service `` dealers . Weed is a gateway drug , you know .""",,
9471,2534,"""It worked just fine for the first half of the 20th century . And training should never be a requirement for exercising a constitutional right .""","""Very well said . However , we also believe that gun owners should get as much training as possible , necessary , desired etc . It just should not be required to participate in a Right Recognized by your Constitution as Inalienable , and therefore protected . That sets a bad precedence for the rest of our Bill of Rights . However , safe handling of any potentially dangerous tool is just common sense .""",AGREE,"""And training should never be a requirement for exercising a constitutional right .""","""Very well said . However , we also believe that gun owners should get as much training as possible , necessary , desired""",,
9481,2536,"""Well lets speculate about how many possible explanations we could concoct if left to supposition . I 'm talking about the only two explanations for the origins of life that have ever been entertained as viable empirically testable concepts in modern science .""","""God is not a testable , valid theory for being and origin . It fails the falisfiablily AND verificationism criteria -- quite badly . It 's also highly subjective . Creationism is n't even a peer reviewed , promulgated theory in any credible community . It would n't , and does n't , last 5 minutes against logic or science . Creationism = continual propagation of the same cut-paste arguments which have been refuted day in and day out , but not heeded . Creationism IS N'T a powerful force -- it 's fraudulant repetition .""",DISAGREE,"""the only two explanations for the origins of life testable""","""God is not a testable""",,
9489,2538,"""* * Apart from the fact that this claim is utterly unsupported empirically , and is so nebulous as to be fundamentally vacuous , what is there in the article that prompts kronus to say such a thing ? Apparently kronus took this as his cue -- `` To investigate whether there was any genetic basis for the effect , the research group examined the expression levels of about 9000 genes in the brain of the chickens . In birds exposed to stress , there was a number of genes where the expression was either increased or decreased , and the same genes were similarly affected in the offspring. `` N.B. -- -The 'genes ' DID NOT change . The 'genes ' in the brain did not mutate . So there goes RMNS darwinism as an explanation for evolved traits in the offspring , right from the jump .""","""So you do n't have genes in your body that are n't activated ? Aka my father has blue eyes and my mother brown eyes . I have 1 blue eye gene in my body yet I do n't have 1 blue eye and 1 brown eye . But 2 brown eyes . So it 's obviously not active . ( ok bad example ) Do n't know the exact name for it . But do n't rabbits have a genetic response hard coded . As every animal . That when they are being chased that they make irratic maneuvres . He says that the chickens had genes that had some hardcoded information about how to respond to certain conditions . They got activated in them . And the same information was passed to the children . So they do n't come out all big eyed and is mister big teeth my uncle ?""",DISAGREE,"""So there goes RMNS darwinism as an explanation for evolved traits in the offspring , right from the jump .""","""So you do n't have genes in your body that are n't activated ?""",,
9500,2540,"""From what I DO know of you , you have quite the reputation over at IIDB , something to do with `` butterfly wombs `` which you claimed butterflies had .""","""What is IIDB ?""",DISAGREE,"""you have quite the reputation over at IIDB ``""","""What is IIDB ?""",,
9502,2541,"""abortion is bad , there should n't be a need for it in the perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""","""I believe murder is wrong , and there should n't be any of it in a perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own . But it 's not about me , it 's about the person being killed . Think about it .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion is bad , there should n't be a need for it in the perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""","""I believe murder is wrong , and there should n't be any of it in a perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""",,
9504,2541,"""abortion is bad , there should n't be a need for it in the perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""","""I believe murder is wrong , and there should n't be any of it in a perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own . But it 's not about me , it 's about the person being killed . Think about it .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion is bad , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force""","""I believe murder is wrong , any of it in a perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality""",,
9515,2543,"""Well ... that does tend to happen when you waste time arguing the obvious as if it were a rebuttal to anything .""","""So I can take this as a quote to use for you in the future to show you that ( at one time ) you did n't disagree with that argument ? Good to know ! It 's bookmarked !""",AGREE,"""does tend to happen when you waste time arguing the obvious""","""So I can take this as a quote to use for you in the future""",,
9534,2547,"""I can tell you that you have totally swallowed the information you copied from the website above . You have already decided that you will not believe . Because you do not want to . Because you do not have to right now . All is too easy for you .""","""Actually looking back I wish I had n't posted a lot of what is on those websites . It is a lot of poor arguments and I 'm glad I was able to realize that over the last 3 months . Had I already decided to believe that all of it was true I would n't be here debating you now . You say I do n't want to know . I wonder if you would want to know if God did n't exist . Is that why at the end of your post you seem so unhappy to debate this further ?""",DISAGREE,"""You have already decided that you will not believe . Because you do not want to .""","""Had I already decided to believe that all of it was true I would n't be here debating you now .""",,
9536,2547,"""I can tell you that you have totally swallowed the information you copied from the website above . You have already decided that you will not believe . Because you do not want to . Because you do not have to right now . All is too easy for you .""","""Actually looking back I wish I had n't posted a lot of what is on those websites . It is a lot of poor arguments and I 'm glad I was able to realize that over the last 3 months . Had I already decided to believe that all of it was true I would n't be here debating you now . You say I do n't want to know . I wonder if you would want to know if God did n't exist . Is that why at the end of your post you seem so unhappy to debate this further ?""",DISAGREE,"""You have already decided that you will not believe""","""Had I already decided to believe that all of it was true I would n't be here debating you now""",,
9557,2553,"""then surely you ca n't explain away why enzyme a and co-enzyme b are separate compounds but work together to produce another by-product .""","""Well , in the case above , it was step-by-step . First , an existing enzyme was modified to a new use , and over time , became refined to work better and better . This is the way evolution works . Nothing is de novo ; it 's always a modfication of something else . Second , a mutation produced a regulator that only allowed the enzyme to be produced if the substrate was available . Again , this was refined by natural selection over time . In the end , the newly-evolved system was irreducibly complex , because all three parts have to be present for the system to work . And do show us your numbers proving that such processes ca n't produce new information . If you do n't know how , I 'd be pleased to show you how a mutation changes the information in a population .""",DISAGREE,"""are separate compounds but work together to produce another by-product .""","""it was step-by-step . 's always a of something else .""",,
9566,2555,"""Read these storys of self defence and then tell me Brady how you can justify these The injustice of the British ban on self defense Making matters worse , the British legal system seems to treat crime victims worse than it treats the criminals who attacked them . An example is the Tony Martin case : Tony Martin was a farmer , whose remote farmhouse had been broken in to many times . Martin feared future burglary attempts and the risk of being attacked by a violent burglar . When a pair of burglars broke in while he was home , Martin opened fire with a pump action shotgun . The 16-year-old burglar Fred Barras was killed , and 33-year-old Brendon Fearon was wounded in the leg . Later on that day , the police arrested Tony Martin and charged him with the crimes of murder and wounding with intent . At trial , Martin argued that he had acted in self defense , but the court found that he had fired while they were trying to flee . He was convicted of murder and sentenced to life in prison , although the conviction was later reduced to manslaughter with a 5 year sentence . The surviving criminal , who had over 30 criminal convictions , then sued Tony Martin for the injury he suffered during the burglary . The parole board refused to grant Tony Martin an early release because he  “ has shown no remorse and would continue to pose a danger to any other burglars. ” Martin was eventually released from prison after spending years in prison and being vilified by the anti-gun groups in the UK for shooting criminals who had broken into his home . Another example , from 2009 , also shows how the British legal system favors criminals over their victims : A millionaire businessman has been jailed for attacking a man who held his family hostage in their own home – while the criminal went free . Munir Hussain , who was threatened at knifepoint and tied up by a gang of masked men in his living room last year , was told he must go to prison for 30 months to preserve  “ civilised society ” . But Walid Salem , a criminal with more than 50 convictions , was handed a two-year supervision order for his role in the break-in at an earlier hearing . He was one of three men who ambushed Mr Hussain , his wife and children as they returned to their home in High Wycombe , Bucks , on Sept 3 last year after attending Ramadan prayers at their local mosque , Reading Crown Court heard . Their hands were tied behind their backs and they were forced to crawl from room to room before being forced to lie down in the living room . But when Hussain ’ s teenage son managed to escape and raise the alarm , he seized his chance and turned on his captors . . . The brothers were found guilty of causing grievous bodily harm with intent by a jury in September . Sentencing , Judge John Reddihough told them it was his  “ public duty ” to jailing Munir Hussain for 30 months and his brother for 39 months . This one is quite nice as well Cleared : Builder who chopped off thug 's ear with Samurai sword after he threatened to rape and kill his family | Mail Online Well thank god for the gun ban in england . It has completely wiped out all crime meaning no citizen ever needs to defend themself .""","""When the criminal has greater civil protections than his victim , and this is viewed as being civilized , a society is doomed .""",AGREE,"""British legal system seems to treat crime victims worse than it treats the criminals who attacked them British legal system favors criminals over their victims gun ban in england has completely wiped out all crime""","""the criminal has greater civil protections than his victim , this is viewed as being civilized , a society is doomed .""",,
9588,2571,"""But evolutionists are just as religious as Christians : they have their own unseen miracles – ( random mutations ) ….their own clergy ( scientists ) …their own Bible ( The Origin of Species ) .... and their own god ( Natural Selection ) .""","""Well said . With this religion , the gap is very wide between the `` average guy `` and `` authority `` , because their clergy is more involved in politics than the clergy of Christianity , or the Creator himself . It fits with more Democrats being evolutionists , and more Democrats favoring bigger domestic government .""",AGREE,"""But evolutionists are just as religious as Christians : they have their own unseen miracles – ( random mutations ) ….their own clergy ( scientists ) …their own Bible ( The Origin of Species ) .... and their own god ( Natural Selection ) .""","""Well said .""",,
9598,2572,"""The possibility that life was created by extraterrestrials currently has 0 evidence to support it .""","""Well , `` evidence `` for an extraterrestrial creation is n't just through visions and people who have `` seen `` UFO 's . You forget `` evidence `` given by astronomes such as the people from SETI . ( SETI is an organization founded after scientists have discovered a strange signal from outer-space . From there on the organization has developed very much ) The signal , the SETI people got showed the first three prime numbers . This is very strange because it has never happened before ( the scientist who detected the signal , called it WOW-signal , because it was so strange ) This signal shows a major part of Design : Specification But unfortunately , to show that it is really true , it is missing another part : Complexity The signal is evidence , but unfortunately it is too short . If those scientists would detect a signal that shows the prime numbers from 2 to 101 it would meet both parts : it has specification and complexity ... The SETI people would party all night ... So these `` theories `` are n't as unproven as you think they are ... ( I still do n't believe it happened like that )""",DISAGREE,"""The possibility that life was created by extraterrestrials currently has 0 evidence to support it .""","""Well , `` evidence `` for an extraterrestrial creation is n't just through visions and people who have `` seen `` UFO 's . You forget `` evidence `` given by astronomes such as the people from SETI .""",,
9630,2575,"""And let us not forget that its very well documented that mutations in DNA do lead to new chemical structures which are part of the body of microbes . Any contention that new `` parts `` can not be based on genes is doomed to failure on a simple empirical basis . It is without question the case that the bacterial flagella parts are specified by genes AND that changing those genes changes the corresponding parts .""","""so what if flagella parts are effected by a change of genes ? .... so are fly wings . The challenge was to present me any evidence that mutations can actually create new raw material for selection . You have to get out of the swamp somehow . I think this concept of mutations as being creators has gotten a pass for too long now .""",DISAGREE,"""And let us not forget that its very well documented that mutations in DNA do lead to new chemical structures which are part of the body of microbes""","""so what if flagella parts are effected by a change of genes""",,
9635,2576,"""Shortly after its writing in 1859 to the present day , it spawned a whole new world of ethics and philosophy , and is firmly entrenched in popular culture .""","""Actually , ethics and philosophy are irrelevant . If they are based on Darwin , then they are wrong . Possibly are you referring to the eugenics policies and genocide policies of christian Nazis ?""",DISAGREE,"""Shortly after its writing in 1859 to the present day ethics and philosophy popular culture""","""Actually , ethics and philosophy are irrelevant . If they are based on Darwin , then they are wrong . Possibly are you referring to the eugenics policies and genocide policies of christian Nazis ?""",,
9654,2581,"""MIRRORED POST , ... it might be easiest to preserve flow later on if we do n't actually mirror each of our posts once comments arrive ( and inevitably digress ) - just let people quote/cite us from this one if needs be . I certainly plan on adding in more off-topic commentary/digressions in the mirror thread ( marked in these posts as * , when I remember to ) .""","""Iangb , I would have thought that you would be intellectually honest enough to have ( at least ) accepted the fact that I have supported my claims . I also thought that ( by now ) someone from your side of the abortion issue would step in ( in this thread or by private message ) and hold you to your claims of being 'intellectually honest . ' At this point , I actually have you questioning Planned Parenthood 's definitions ? QUOTE ;""",DISAGREE,"""MIRRORED POST""","""At this point , I actually have you questioning Planned Parenthood 's definitions ? QUOTE ;""",,
9664,2591,"""Except that Occam 's razor is used for comparing hypotheses . In this example , I expect that the `` car hit the animal `` hypothesis is simpler than any other hypothesis .""","""And what do you conclude from this comparison ? That the car hypothesis is correct and any other hypothesis is wrong , right ? So you stop investigating . But is that how we should do science ? NO . It 's laziness and an intellectual copout . What we have is a misuse of the Razor . The Razor is not supposed to be used for comparing hypotheses . Instead , it 's supposed to keep hypotheses out of descriptions of phenomenon .""",DISAGREE,"""I expect that the `` car hit the animal `` hypothesis is simpler""","""The Razor is not supposed to be used for comparing hypotheses""",,
9674,2593,"""From your statement I presume that the moment you were conceived you became aware of being a human .... this is very interesting indeed as you had no brain at that time .""","""Actually , at the moment I was conceived , someone else became aware of me becoming a human . Brain development does not define a human , it is our potential that helps define us .""",DISAGREE,"""From your statement I presume that the moment you were conceived you became aware of being a human""","""Actually , at the moment I was conceived ,""",,
9681,2594,"""Not only have I undercut your snails""","""Oh No , everyone ! Our Mollusca has been undercut ! Whatever shall we do ?""",DISAGREE,"""Not only have I undercut your snails""","""Our Mollusca has been undercut ! Whatever shall we do ?""",,
9690,2596,"""Just because it ca n't be classified as bird or reptile does n't mean that it 's a `` link `` . Where are the fosils showing it evolving from a bird or reptile ? That 's right , there are none .""","""It 's possible that Archaeopteryx is not a direct descendant of modern birds but it 's certainly not far from the line and it shares both avian and therepodian characteristics .""",AGREE,"""does n't mean that it 's a `` link `` .""","""it 's certainly not far from the line""",,
9694,2596,"""Just because it ca n't be classified as bird or reptile does n't mean that it 's a `` link `` . Where are the fosils showing it evolving from a bird or reptile ? That 's right , there are none .""","""It 's possible that Archaeopteryx is not a direct descendant of modern birds but it 's certainly not far from the line and it shares both avian and therepodian characteristics .""",AGREE,"""it ca n't be classified as bird or reptile does n't mean that it 's a `` link""","""not a direct descendant of modern birds but it 's certainly not far from the line""",,
9726,2607,"""People tend to miss the most obvious ( and most dangerous ) way to institute gun control That is to restrict the sale and manufacture of bullets . Without bullets , your gun is nothing but a paper weight . Bullets are also much more difficult to produce than guns . While they can be reloaded , casings are incredibly difficult to make on a small scale . The only way to really do it is to turn them down one at a time on a lathe . Dogs CAN be used to sniff out gunpowder and primers . This is a danger I think people miss when they start bannign certain types of ammunition . Right now , `` cop killer `` ammo is outlawed in the united states . Gun advocates laughed our butts off when they did this , since the `` cop killer `` amunition as they described it does not exist ouside of hollywood ( NO , coating a bullet with teflon will not enable it to pierce body armor , it will lubricate your barrel when you shoot it , though ) . I personally don ; t think this is anything to laugh about . BAnning guns is a stupid and unworkable plan , banning ammo could actually be dangerous .""","""Ahh ... There you have it . Restrict ammo , not guns . Would be a far more succesful way of enforcing gun-control .""",AGREE,"""BAnning guns is a stupid and unworkable plan , banning ammo could actually be dangerous .""","""Would be a far more succesful way of enforcing gun-control .""",,
9724,2607,"""People tend to miss the most obvious ( and most dangerous ) way to institute gun control That is to restrict the sale and manufacture of bullets . Without bullets , your gun is nothing but a paper weight . Bullets are also much more difficult to produce than guns . While they can be reloaded , casings are incredibly difficult to make on a small scale . The only way to really do it is to turn them down one at a time on a lathe . Dogs CAN be used to sniff out gunpowder and primers . This is a danger I think people miss when they start bannign certain types of ammunition . Right now , `` cop killer `` ammo is outlawed in the united states . Gun advocates laughed our butts off when they did this , since the `` cop killer `` amunition as they described it does not exist ouside of hollywood ( NO , coating a bullet with teflon will not enable it to pierce body armor , it will lubricate your barrel when you shoot it , though ) . I personally don ; t think this is anything to laugh about . BAnning guns is a stupid and unworkable plan , banning ammo could actually be dangerous .""","""Ahh ... There you have it . Restrict ammo , not guns . Would be a far more succesful way of enforcing gun-control .""",AGREE,"""That is to restrict the sale and manufacture of bullets .""","""Restrict ammo , not guns .""",,
9731,2609,"""Here in New Hampshire , not known as a bastion of liberalism , Civil Unions passed the state legislature this year . I am now covered under my partner 's state sponsored ( he 's a state worker ) health insurance . We are grateful .""","""Oh , I hear you . I am covered by my partner 's insurance here as well . I would not have been able to get the insurance if we were not legally a union . It 's amazing . And I am REALLY greatful for that !""",AGREE,"""Here in New Hampshire , not known as a bastion of liberalism , Civil Unions passed the state legislature this year .""","""I am covered by my partner 's insurance here as well .""",,
9733,2609,"""Here in New Hampshire , not known as a bastion of liberalism , Civil Unions passed the state legislature this year . I am now covered under my partner 's state sponsored ( he 's a state worker ) health insurance . We are grateful .""","""Oh , I hear you . I am covered by my partner 's insurance here as well . I would not have been able to get the insurance if we were not legally a union . It 's amazing . And I am REALLY greatful for that !""",AGREE,"""I am now covered under my partner 's state sponsored ( he 's a state worker ) health insurance . We are grateful .""","""I would not have been able to get the insurance if we were not legally a union . It 's amazing . And I am REALLY greatful for that !""",,
9740,2611,"""It would be bad enough if it was just the teacher chewing gum and telling the students do n't chew gum . But it does n't stop there . The teacher makes the rule no gum chewing in class . Then later that same day she instructs Billy and Sally to chew gum . Johnny sees this and decides to chew gum too , thinking that its ok. Of course , he gets expelled from school for breaking the rules . In this case the teacher is n't just breaking her own rules , she also commands some of her students to break the rules as well , yet still penalizes those who break the exact rule if they were n't commanded to do so .""","""Those who set the rules can do with them as they please . It is n't illogical nor hypocritical . It IS illogical to assume you can chew gum if the rule is `` you cant chew gum `` and the teacher allows one student to chew gum .""",DISAGREE,"""The teacher makes the rule no gum chewing in class . Then later that same day she instructs Billy and Sally to chew gum . Johnny sees this and decides to chew gum too , thinking that its ok. Of course , he gets expelled""","""It is n't illogical nor hypocritical . ``""",,
9766,2620,"""Then surely you can see that happenstance origins taught in science classes on the level that it is today comes dangerously close to violating the establishment clause of the first amendment ! Do we rectify that by attempting to eliminate happenstance origins from science class ? Nooooo , we rectify it by allowing the proper amount of ID in science class to balance it !""","""perhaps we should read the first amendment again . Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion ( and other stuff , but that 's all that pertains to religion ) . It means it should n't single out a religion . It should n't teach something just because it 's religious , but it also should n't not teach something just because it 's religious . Making a law banning the teaching of abiogenesis and ID as hypothesies would violate the first amendment because the only reason we would be banning it would be because of the establishment of religion . And even if the first amendment does say what you seem to think it does , you think the solution is to violate the first amendment more to balance it ?""",DISAGREE,"""happenstance origins taught in science classes on the level that it is today comes dangerously close to violating the establishment clause of the first amendment""","""It means it should n't single out a religion . It should n't teach something just because it 's religious , but it also should n't not teach something just because it 's religious""",,
9774,2624,"""This is a racist statement .""","""What evidence do you have of that ? Tiger Woods is black and he said he felt entitled . Personally , I think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""",DISAGREE,"""This is a racist statement .""","""I think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals""",,
9776,2625,"""Hmm . Does that mean that you are against the death penalty ?""","""I think its pretty obvious ............ I would say judging by his statement he is against the death penalty .............""",DISAGREE,"""against the death penalty""","""against the death penalty""",,
9781,2626,"""For instance , take the model of the solar system . It has been observed that the planets and the Earth orbit around the sun ( heliocentric model ) , not everything orbiting around the world ( geocentric model ) .""","""It has ? Silly me . I thought that it was the conclusion made from an analysis of lots of data and measurements . You have a faulty understanding of science .""",DISAGREE,"""It has been observed that the planets and the Earth orbit around the sun ( heliocentric model ) , not everything orbiting around the world ( geocentric model ) .""","""You have a faulty understanding of science .""",,
9818,2634,"""Chuz , the purpose of this summary is not to summarise your arguments as a whole - it is to summarise what your argument is up to this point . Why not post just a summary of your position so far , as you see it - I can do the same , then you can continue with your argument ? There 's no point in writing an argument , summarising it and then leaving the thread before I 've had a chance to respond to even your argument ( never mind your summary ) . If you are going to simply ignore any criticisms of your reasoning , then I struggle to see the point of you repeatedly requesting a one-on-one debate in the first place - you essentially regress your argument to the 'because I said so ' that you are ( presumably ) hoping to avoid , it 's just that there 's slightly more detail .""","""I see your point , Iangb but I 'm not about to be leaving before you 've had a chance to respond . I wo n't be `` leaving `` at all . You challenged me to produce an argument , so I 'm going to produce my argument . I will then summarize the argument , and you can respond to it and we can then discuss / debate those specifics that you have a problem with . Truthfully , this is how I should have first responded to your challenge . Doing it piece meal has only resulted in a less focused debate . -- Chuz""",DISAGREE,"""There 's no point in writing an argument , summarising it and then leaving""","""I wo n't be `` leaving `` at all .""",,
9820,2635,"""No Christian sin ? ? ? Other then the intent to kill and then doing so""","""And isnt that called pre-meditated murder if the baby ended up being killed ? ? hmmm""",AGREE,"""Other then the intent to kill and then doing so""","""And isnt that called pre-meditated murder if the baby ended up being killed""",,
9822,2636,"""While 'commonly ' may or may not be true , this does end up happening at least some of the time ( and possibly a lot of the time ) .""","""Based on what evidence can you make this conclusion ?""",DISAGREE,"""While 'commonly ' may or may not be true""","""Based on what evidence can you make this conclusion""",,
9831,2639,"""I 'm sure invading armies would be deterred by people sniping them off at random ( which is what would happen if any ever tried an invasion of America , especially in the rural areas )""","""There is some truth here . Did you ever see `` Independence Day `` ? They were taking pot-shots at the alien ships when they first arrived . It did n't stop the aliens ... sure only a film ... let 's look at real life ... modern - Iraq - Sadaam gave guns out to the people just before Gulf War II not so modern - Boer War - Dutch farmers in South Africa were all excellent marksmen - Britain still invaded . US Civil War - I believe that the Confederate States were pretty well armed as far as the white citizens were concerned . US still invaded .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm sure invading armies would be deterred by people sniping them off at random""","""gave guns out to the people just before Gulf War II not so modern""",,
9839,2647,"""However , having seen so many of Matthew S 's rants on oppression I was really taking the opportunity to ask if he really knows what oppressionmeans .""","""I think the history of discrimination against gays does count as oppression . Being classified as a `` mental illness `` with cures that could possibly involve shock `` therapy `` , castration , or lobotomies , having our sex be illegal , the type of harassment we have seen which should make any civilized person blush ... I understand you think the `` oppression `` could be worse , but quite frankly how many minority groups have undergone what gays have undergone ? I mean , there is no competing with the atrocities committed against the blacks , and millions of Jews died in the holocaust ( along with gay people ) , but what more is required before you can look at gay history and not see it as `` oppression `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""Matthew S 's rants on oppression I was really taking the opportunity to ask if he really knows what oppressionmeans .""","""I think the history of discrimination against gays does count as oppression""",,
9842,2648,"""So the start of personhood for a particular person is a variable , based on that individual ’ s memory . Twenty years ago I could remember events at my fourth birthday , but today those memories are gone . For a while I had personhood at 4 years of age , but today , looking back , I did not have personhood until I was 6 . As I age and my memory fails , it may turn out that I did not have personhood until I was 21 years old . Personnhood comes and goes . Do I have it right ?  ” Not aware ” ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Not aware of what ? Shoot a gun behind them and they will flinch . They are aware of loud noises . Throw them wildly into the air and they will cry . They are aware of their own movement . Pinch them , they will cry . They are self aware as they chew on their toes . And of course puppies are aware as well . Unless of course I do not understand what you mean by aware .""","""With all due respect my friend , this is foolishness . It 's as if you 're saying that a persons existence is based on their memories from their past . That is ridiculous because if it 's true then , we oughta take every person who 's in the throws of Alzhiemers out and euthanize them because they ca n't remember what they did yesterday . Just because you ca n't remember what you did at 4 does n't negate for one moment that you still existed at 4 so your existence had value and substance even though you can no longer remember what happened back then in your life .""",DISAGREE,"""So the start of personhood for a particular person is a variable , based on that individual ’ s memory .""","""this is foolishness . It 's as if you 're saying that a persons existence is based on their memories from their past .""",,
9906,2664,"""Your faulty logic is easy to spot : Your only looking at the 26 decided cases listed by the VPC , 2 being slightly more than 92 % of 26 . But , your making the absurd assumption that the VPC listed all the aquitted or dismissed cases . Why would they ? They were compiling a list of CCW murderers . It 's far more likely they were screening out the dismissed and aquitted cases and missed these two . Your 92 % figure is lacking a solid basis and can not be used to predict the outcome of the 49 pending cases .""","""Well , it does say on the site `` Any concealed handgun permit holders who are eventually acquitted of their alleged crimes are not included in the tallies maintained on the site although the facts surrounding the shooting are detailed. `` So if you go to their pdf file you can still find out details about the very few cases that were acquitted or dismissed : http : //www.vpc.org/fact_sht/ccwtotalkilled.pdf""",DISAGREE,"""Your faulty logic is easy to spot : Your only looking at the 26 decided cases listed by the VPC ,""","""Well , it does say on the site `` Any concealed handgun permit holders who are eventually acquitted of their alleged crimes are not included in the tallies maintained on the site although the facts surrounding the shooting are""",,
9921,2675,"""I 'm not sure what you mean . Your quotes from dictionaries certainly give no indication of any blurring . I 'll give you another definition acceptable to biologists.Natural selection is the process by which organisms well adapted to their environment survive to produce offspring while those more poorly adapted may not . In this way , particular combinations of genes are propagated differentially .""","""And how does this compare to your ideas on artificial selection ?""",DISAGREE,"""Your quotes from dictionaries certainly give no indication of any blurring""","""how does this compare to your ideas on artificial selection ?""",,
9965,2690,"""I have done some reading on the marriage penalty and there might be some truth to what your saying although you do get insurance breaks . I still say that marriage should be a religious ceremony of two people and the government should have no agenda in the matter . here is a site you should look at . http : //moneycentral.msn.com/content/Taxes/P48908.asp""","""You have much to learn , my young padawan .""",DISAGREE,"""some reading on the marriage penalty . I still say that marriage should be a religious ceremony of two people and the government should have no agenda in the matter""","""You have much to learn , my young padawan""",,
9986,2696,"""Uh oh . Cash is n't asking for just any kind of evidence , but convincing evidence . We automatically lose because `` convincing `` evidence is already defined by Cash as something we are unable to present .""","""Got that right . Yankeefanwill refuse to define what he means as it allows him to reject everything that proves we are right . Notice he does n't define what a new body part means . Notice his reply to Symbiote . He 's not interested in the real definition of evolution and how it works . He 's attempting to 'refute ' evolution based on his own strawman . It 's a classic creationist tactic . Never discuss honestly the issue but attempt through dishonest methods to refute evolution . Our failure to meet yankeefan 's strawman criteria will only prove to rational people that his strawman is poorly designed . But to an avid creationist who has been annihilated on another board over and over again , it will feed his ideology that his evidence free belief is valid . Of course it 's still a false dichotomy , but logic , reason and facts are not found in YEC creationism .""",AGREE,"""Cash is n't asking for just any kind of evidence ,""","""Got that right""",,
9987,2696,"""Uh oh . Cash is n't asking for just any kind of evidence , but convincing evidence . We automatically lose because `` convincing `` evidence is already defined by Cash as something we are unable to present .""","""Got that right . Yankeefanwill refuse to define what he means as it allows him to reject everything that proves we are right . Notice he does n't define what a new body part means . Notice his reply to Symbiote . He 's not interested in the real definition of evolution and how it works . He 's attempting to 'refute ' evolution based on his own strawman . It 's a classic creationist tactic . Never discuss honestly the issue but attempt through dishonest methods to refute evolution . Our failure to meet yankeefan 's strawman criteria will only prove to rational people that his strawman is poorly designed . But to an avid creationist who has been annihilated on another board over and over again , it will feed his ideology that his evidence free belief is valid . Of course it 's still a false dichotomy , but logic , reason and facts are not found in YEC creationism .""",AGREE,"""something we are unable to present .""","""refuse to define what he means as it allows him to reject everything that proves we are right .""",,
10002,2701,"""You ca n't hand these issues over to corporations with no real national allegiance .""","""And yet you seem to feel we should leave these issues to the government , which has done nothing but corporate takeovers in regard to banks , automotive industries , and now health care .""",DISAGREE,"""You ca n't hand these issues over to corporations with no real national allegiance""","""which has done nothing but corporate takeovers in regard to banks , automotive industries , and now health care""",,
10010,2703,"""Yeah , so what about it ?""","""It 's just incredibly bad fact-twisting .""",DISAGREE,"""Yeah , so what about it ?""","""It 's just incredibly bad fact-twisting .""",,
10024,2704,"""I still find it ironic that so many people actually construe the 9th amendment to achieve a magical number of rights .""","""Well , one has to use something to make the Constitution say something that it does not say ; especially if it does n't say something that one really , really , really wants to have .""",AGREE,"""I still find it ironic that so many people actually construe the 9th amendment to achieve a magical number of rights .""","""Well , one has to use something to make the Constitution say something that it does not say ;""",,
10041,2706,"""The only person being dishonest around here is you . Need I post every single time he made that claim in this thread for you to take responsibility for the claim being made ? And why are you commenting on a thread you obviously have n't read if you 're denying what is written clearly for all to see ? Why must you people come to threads I 'm on and derail them with ridiculous minutia rather than actually deal with the debate that is being argued ?""","""You know why . Because they want you to stop posting . Most of them want to rant , and they do n't want their rants challanged . It 's typical of the whole evolutionary community , I 'm afraid . Obvious_child and I are exploring this up in the `` numbers `` thread .""",AGREE,"""The only person being dishonest around here is you . Need I post every single time he made that claim in this thread for you to take responsibility for the claim being made ? And why are you commenting on a thread you obviously have n't read if you 're denying what is written clearly for all to see ? Why must you people come to threads I 'm on and derail them with ridiculous minutia rather than actually deal with the debate that is being argued ?""","""You know why . Because they want you to stop posting . Most of them want to rant , and they do n't want their rants challanged . It 's typical of the whole evolutionary community , I 'm afraid . Obvious_child and I are exploring this up in the `` numbers `` thread .""",,
10058,2708,"""I CAN EMPIRICALLY PROVE THE EXISTENCE OF THE GOD OF THE BIBLE VIA ITS CENTRAL CLAIMS""","""Well , that 's at least one helluva way to say good bye .""",DISAGREE,"""CAN EMPIRICALLY PROVE EXISTENCE OF THE GOD OF THE BIBLE""","""that 's at least one helluva way to say good bye .""",,
10088,2712,""". If you can inject me with something that compels me to seek out and drink a coke , then I am not acting freely , and if I am not choosing to act in a certain fashion , then intelligence is not involved , at least not directly , in what I do .""","""Well this involves the free will / determinism debate , you say you are n't free if your preferences are implanted ... I say you are free when you act in accordance with your preferences , regardless of how those preferences were arrived at . I think to claim you need to `` choose `` your preferences is absurd , as the act of choosing requires prior preferences , which presumably also required a choice .... and the question of how we acquired our first preference arises ...""",DISAGREE,"""If you can inject me with something that compels me to seek out and drink a coke , then I am not acting freely , and if I am not choosing to act in a certain fashion ,""","""Well this involves the free will / determinism debate , you say you are n't free if your preferences are implanted .""",,
10091,2713,"""There are many , many , many people who have done work to stop/block gay marriage and other gay rights when they , themselves , are not gay . That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition . All I am asking here is that Archie , you , JP , etc . own that .""","""To the extent that working toward social change on any moralistic issue is an 'imposition ' , sure . But I think one could say that about anything that has a social effect .""",AGREE,"""That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition .""","""is an 'imposition ' , sure .""",,
10096,2714,"""Your reasoning of the effects of abortion are correct . The liberals who see abortion as a normal , acceptable , right to choose abortion are aborting themselves into extinction . Reverence , and a love of life is not what motivates Muslims . The power of Islam is . There is nothing to indicate that Muslims `` love `` life . They 'll cut your limbs or head off for nearly any reason . They 'll remove your head with a hacksaw so to take the time for `` you `` the victim to enjoy the moment and to voice your opinion and video it for your family and countrymen to enjoy .""","""Do you want anyone to take you seriously ?""",DISAGREE,"""The liberals who see abortion as a normal , acceptable , right to choose abortion are aborting themselves into extinction .""","""Do you want anyone to take you seriously ?""",,
10100,2715,"""The whole evolutionist theory goes against common sense like this at every turn . None of it makes any sense on any level . S""","""Actually , it is based on the `` common sense `` that you put down . Thank you for posting .""",DISAGREE,"""The whole evolutionist theory goes against common sense like this at every turn . None of it makes any sense on any level . S""","""Actually , it is based on the `` common sense `` that you put down .""",,
10107,2716,"""4 ) the reason for the long hands would b that they didnt have any technology or equipments with them , no shovel , no bucket , no knife and etc .... which meant they use their hand for everything , digging , carrying rocks , walking and etc ... the reason for the bent back is they did n't have chairs or bed that would straight out ur collumn nor did they knew any better .""","""Oh dear . Have you ever looked at a human spine ? It is curved : it 's bent . A straight spine is a knackered spine . As to the hands bit , what are you on about ? You are aware I hope that the story that the nosey elephant got it 's trunk because a crocodile grabbed the end and stretched it is just a story ?""",DISAGREE,"""the reason for the long hands would b that they didnt have any technology or equipments with them , no shovel , no bucket , no knife and etc ....""","""Oh dear . Have you ever looked at a human spine ? It is curved : it 's bent .""",,
10111,2717,"""I am surprised that the creationist are n't saying everything that is is because their god created it though the people who have invented the products .""","""Because that 's self defeating . If they said that , they 'd be admitting that evolution is correct and that literal creationism is wrong as what we see today was built off of the sciences that support evolution .""",AGREE,"""I am surprised that the creationist are n't saying everything that is is because their god created it though the people who have invented the products .""","""Because that 's self defeating . If they said that , they 'd be admitting that evolution is correct""",,
10135,2719,"""Undesired first pregnancy is an acute problem for many girls who choose to go under the surgical knife , even though that often ends up with infertility , broken life etc . Dry fasting is an alternative to first pregnancy abortion . If applied , up to 2-3 months old embryo gets dissolved after 15-16 days of the fast . Plus , there is no `` christian `` sin . Vitalij""","""No Christian sin ? ? ? Other then the intent to kill and then doing so""",DISAGREE,"""If applied , up to 2-3 months old embryo gets dissolved after 15-16 days of the fast . Plus , there is no `` christian `` sin . Vitalij""","""No Christian sin ? ? ? Other then the intent to kill and then doing so""",,
10142,2720,"""If you plan to set that methodology aside in favour of something else ,""","""* * The `` methodology `` of science is not materialism/mechanism/darwinism , but simply empiricism leading inductively/abductively to hypotheses regarding regularities in causation in nature that can be tested via the predictive experimentation of the scientific method . Neither empiricism or the epistemological process of the scientific method are the exclusive property of materialism/mechanism , nor did they originate from within that metaphysic , despite the beliefs of materialist/mechanists to that effect . Unfortunately , some 150 years ago , that methodology was set aside , and has remained out of sight , with regard to the hypothesis that is generally referred to as 'darwinism ' .""",DISAGREE,"""If you plan to set that methodology aside in favour of something else""","""* * The `` methodology `` of science is not materialism/mechanism/darwinism , but simply empiricism leading inductively/abductively to hypotheses regarding regularities in causation in nature that can be tested via the predictive experimentation of the scientific method""",,
10159,2721,"""In contrast , evolutionists laughingly look at the miniscule differences between individuals of a population and dare call those who survive the `` fittest `` -- when actually , since each member of the population is almost exactly the same , the `` fittest `` are actually just the luckiest""","""They are not exactly the same . See the examples above . It is not random .""",DISAGREE,"""In contrast , evolutionists laughingly look at the miniscule differences between individuals of a population and dare call those who survive the `` fittest `` -- when actually , since each member of the population is almost exactly the same , the `` fittest `` are actually just the luckiest""","""They are not exactly the same . See the examples above . It is not random .""",,
10161,2721,"""In contrast , evolutionists laughingly look at the miniscule differences between individuals of a population and dare call those who survive the `` fittest `` -- when actually , since each member of the population is almost exactly the same , the `` fittest `` are actually just the luckiest""","""They are not exactly the same . See the examples above . It is not random .""",DISAGREE,"""In contrast , evolutionists laughingly look at the miniscule differences between individuals of a population""","""They are not exactly the same . See the examples above .""",,
10168,2722,"""How can a museum about creationism show `` Fossil `` collections ? Aren ; t those more about supporting evolution ? I am very puzzled !""","""Fossils are evidence , not theory . They can be used in the construction of any theory , including creationism . Whether this is 'just ' or not , is another issue . I point this out as many seem confused about evidence , and think that it just points to something without interpretation""",DISAGREE,"""How can a museum about creationism show `` Fossil `` collections ? Aren ; t those more about supporting evolution ? I am very puzzled !""","""Fossils are evidence , not theory . They can be used in the construction of any theory , including creationism""",,
10173,2722,"""How can a museum about creationism show `` Fossil `` collections ? Aren ; t those more about supporting evolution ? I am very puzzled !""","""Fossils are evidence , not theory . They can be used in the construction of any theory , including creationism . Whether this is 'just ' or not , is another issue . I point this out as many seem confused about evidence , and think that it just points to something without interpretation""",DISAGREE,"""Aren ; t those more about supporting evolution ? I am very puzzled !""","""I point this out as many seem confused about evidence , and think that it just points to something""",,
10179,2723,"""unemployment did not decrease during reagans administration , it increased . and the deficit remained extremely high until clinton 's administration . can you please respond to FDR and his New Deal that saved the country ?""","""FDR saved this country ? If I recall , it was in 1933 that , because of a combination of weakened capital situations from Reconstruction Finance Corporation loans which published lists of the loan takers , and a nation-wide banking holiday , banks around the country went through a new wave of demise , dropping the D/C and D/R ratios so sharply that , in one month alone , the money stock ( M2 ) fell a whopping 4 1/2 % . Wasnt it under FDR that the NIRA codes , and , after 1935 , the NLRA , enacted minimum wages , driving up nominal wages and thus unemployment ? Wasnt it during FDR administration that the reserve ratio was * doubled * , sending us back into another recession starting 1937 ? The only thing FDR `` saved `` was the depression for a couple more years . -GFA""",DISAGREE,"""unemployment did not decrease during reagans administration , it increased . and the deficit remained extremely high until clinton 's administration .""","""FDR saved this country ? ``""",,
10180,2723,"""unemployment did not decrease during reagans administration , it increased . and the deficit remained extremely high until clinton 's administration . can you please respond to FDR and his New Deal that saved the country ?""","""FDR saved this country ? If I recall , it was in 1933 that , because of a combination of weakened capital situations from Reconstruction Finance Corporation loans which published lists of the loan takers , and a nation-wide banking holiday , banks around the country went through a new wave of demise , dropping the D/C and D/R ratios so sharply that , in one month alone , the money stock ( M2 ) fell a whopping 4 1/2 % . Wasnt it under FDR that the NIRA codes , and , after 1935 , the NLRA , enacted minimum wages , driving up nominal wages and thus unemployment ? Wasnt it during FDR administration that the reserve ratio was * doubled * , sending us back into another recession starting 1937 ? The only thing FDR `` saved `` was the depression for a couple more years . -GFA""",DISAGREE,"""can you please respond to FDR and his New Deal that saved the country ?""","""FDR saved this country ? If I recall , it was in 1933 that , because of a combination of weakened capital situations from Reconstruction Finance Corporation loans which published lists of the loan takers""",,
10194,2726,"""Originally posted by Tim As far as politicians and gun-control goes what I 'm most worried about is the NRA corrupting politicians .""","""You make the supposition that before the NRA got to a politician that he/she was in a state of purity before . Q : How can you tell when a politican is telling a lie ? A : When their lips move .""",DISAGREE,"""Tim As far as politicians and gun-control goes what I 'm most worried about is the NRA corrupting politicians .""","""You make the supposition that before the NRA got to a politician that he/she was in a state of purity before .""",,
10213,2734,"""It is rather disrespectful but do n't think it is limited to one side . Most protestors on both sides are n't great . one thing did spark my interest , and it is said often , why is it a `` hard decision `` if you are pro-choice ? Is it hard because you do n't know if you want a baby around or not ? Could n't this decision be just as hard before being pregnant ? Even so , why link it to going to an abortion clinic ? You hear `` It was hard enough to come to this decision in the first place `` but how is going through some protestors making this decision harder ? No one would admit to this but it is statements like `` It was hard enough to come to this decision in the first place `` that make me believe that someone realizes it is wrong and the struggle that makes it hard is whether or not to do the right thing or do they thing that would benefit you the most . And in that case , I agree ... that can be a tough decision .""","""How curious that not everyone can admit that this kind of treatment is wrong . How interesting that another issue comes up instead of addressing the blatant , in-your-face kind of mistreatment of an individual making a private , personal decision . Like many decisions in life , this is one that is difficult to come to . It does n't mean it 's a wrong one . It 's hard because your options are so very serious .""",DISAGREE,"""And in that case , I agree ... that can be a tough decision .""","""Like many decisions in life , this is one that is difficult to come to . It does n't mean it 's a wrong one .""",,
10215,2735,"""Check out this USDOJ report entitled `` Violent crime rates have declined since 1994 , reaching the lowest level ever recorded in 2002. `` http : //www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/viort.htm Why do you call this revisionist history ? And please do n't copy and paste a bunch of stuff from some progun website again .""","""So what the hell does that have to do with anything ... oh and do not tell me that the AWB was the reason ... Assault weapons are used in less than .20 % of crimes : `` Assault weapons are not the weapons of choice among drug dealers , gang members or criminals in general . Assault weapons are used in about one-fifth of one percent ( .20 % ) of all violent crimes and about one percent in gun crimes . It is estimated that from one to seven percent of all homicides are committed with assault weapons ( rifles of any type are involved in three to four percent of all homicides ) . However a higher percentage are used in police homicides , roughly ten percent . ( There has been no consistent trend in this rate from 1978 through 1996 . ) Between 1992 and 1996 less than 4 % of mass murders , committed with guns , involved assault weapons . ( Our deadliest mass murders have either involved arson or bombs . ) '' Whats your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""Violent crime rates have declined since 1994 , reaching the lowest level ever recorded in 2002. ``""","""Assault weapons are not the weapons of choice among drug dealers , gang members or criminals in general ''""",,
10226,2740,"""That should be the basis of all laws if it does no harm then it should be permited .""","""I love this line . I assume by `` harm `` you mean an actual physical harm or some kind or another ( physical in this case includes loss of items ) . So this would cut our laws in half . Walk around naked ? No big deal ! Have sex on the street why doing cocaine ... go for it ! Drunk in public ? Who cares ! The list can go on forever .""",DISAGREE,"""the basis of all laws if it does no harm then it should be""","""I love this line . I assume by `` harm `` you mean an actual physical harm or some kind or another""",,
10239,2746,"""We can not accept the child at this time .""","""Do n't forget adoption . The other option is to have the baby checked with what is called `` genetic counseling `` . At 5 and 1/2 weeks it is unlikely there is significant damage . You can have doctors test for it first . There are lots of folks that would be willing to adopt a child who has those challenges . Do not give in to despair . If you choose an abortion , you may regret it far more than you regret smoking and drinking heavily . My wife has wept over hers . This is a big decision . Please get counsel from those that know you and who you can trust . EF""",DISAGREE,"""We can not accept the child at this time .""","""Do n't forget adoption . The other option is to have the baby checked with what is called `` genetic counseling `` .""",,
10249,2749,"""I wasn ’ t familiar with  “ Poe ’ s Law ” either . Here ’ s what I found on it ; Deleted from Wikipedia - Poe 's law ( deleted 15 May 2008 at 06:32 - Deletionpedia ) It lasted 21 days on Wikipedia before being deleted , and it was originated by a Christianforums poster named  “ Nathan Poe ” . Doesn ’ t really seem like that big of deal to me , but the atheist community seems to be increasingly fascinated with anything at all that allows them to mock Christianity .""","""Can ’ t your religion survive a little mockery ? On the other hand I can understand why your worried your religion being so ridiculous and all .""",DISAGREE,"""the atheist community seems to be increasingly fascinated with anything at all that allows them to mock Christianity .""","""your religion being so ridiculous and all""",,
10253,2751,"""In that case , I 'm wondering why you did n't notice that it provided evidence for an aspect of evolutionary theory ... Basically , it provided evidence that a previous ad-hoc hypothesis was unnecessary to explain the development of hands and feet . I 'd summarize the rest of the article for you , but you ought to understand it already .""","""* * Actually it provided proof that RMNS does n't explain the development of hands and feet , but I do n't expect you to be able to understand that .""",DISAGREE,"""In that case , I 'm wondering why you did n't notice that it provided evidence for an aspect of evolutionary theory ...""","""Actually it provided proof that RMNS does n't explain the development of hands and feet , but I do n't expect you to be able to understand that .""",,
10264,2756,"""If you choose to claim that you are pro-life , what are you dong about saving the lives of these women who truly want to have their pregnancies continue . What are you doing about their potential babies which you , by your heartlessness , are not allowing to be born because you do n't want to expend a penny in international aid for prenatal care for women all over the world .""","""Why is it you assume I 'm doing nothing about it ? Do you know how many charities I support which serve in Africa ? The question is , what are you doing about it since it is only you whom you have complete control of . Think about actually contributing to programs like Doctors without borders rather than question my giving when it has already been proven on multiple threads that it is conservatives who contribute the lions share to charities in this country . All the liberals do is whine , complain and raise taxes so someone else will have to support their pet programs .""",DISAGREE,"""you do n't want to expend a penny in international aid for prenatal care for women all over the world .""","""I 'm doing nothing about it ? Do you know how many charities I support which serve in Africa ?""",,
10266,2757,"""Originally posted by JFriday Patriot and Kelvin : Your crushing of other people arguments with facts and statistics has to stop , you two are running everyone else off . Where has everyone gone ? We need more liberals on this website . Lets ask Norm to go drag some commies over here .""","""If you know where the commies have a debate forum , please post it here . I would like to go and join . Just to make it clear I 'm joining the forum , not the commies .""",AGREE,"""We need more liberals on this website . Lets ask Norm to go drag some commies over here .""","""If you know where the commies have a debate forum , please post it here . I would like to go and join .""",,
10275,2759,"""Indeed , for several decades , molecular evolutionists have relied on an evolutionary view that abandons the Darwinian presumption of abundant pre-existing variation , assuming instead that the rate of evolution depends directly on the rate of introduction of new alleles by mutation .""","""Interesting , but it appears to ignore the fact that there is pre-existing variation ( just look at the pictures ) . Emphasizing mutations is ok , but relying solely on them will probably skew results .""",DISAGREE,"""that abandons the Darwinian presumption of abundant pre-existing variation , assuming instead""","""pre-existing variation ( just look at the pictures ) . Emphasizing mutations is ok ,""",,
10276,2760,"""Racist ; Neither Protestants nor Catholics constitute a Race .""","""Milesian Race vs Anglo-Saxon race . They just happen to be Protestants and Catholics . Sorry , I should have known that would be over your head .""",DISAGREE,"""Racist ; Neither Protestants nor Catholics constitute a Race .""","""Milesian Race vs Anglo-Saxon race . They just happen to be Protestants and Catholics . Sorry , I should have known that would be over your head .""",,
10305,2764,"""This is a push to promote lawlessness . The San Francisco fiasco is the prime example . People with certain agendas are refusing to follow the laws . This is a devastating precedent for our Nation .""","""It is an attempt to follow the law and the law states equal protection for all citizens ... hence the 14th ammendment .""",DISAGREE,"""The San Francisco fiasco is the prime example . People with certain agendas are refusing to follow the laws""","""the law and the law states equal protection for all citizens .""",,
10334,2770,"""The fact is , we all constantly face the threat of potential harm every minute of every day . Risk is a part of living . I would like to know why guns specifically are needed to mitigate the risk of being the victim of a crime , when other methods ( better locks , alarms , non-lethal weapons like pepper spray and tasers ) can be effective .""","""Because guns are the best method available on the market . Settling for second best when you could have the best is just stupid . Better locks ? The best they 'll do is slow down the person seeking to harm you , their effectiveness is contingent on the strength of the door they 're on . Alarms ? So somebody will know that you 're in danger , what then ? That wo n't get the police there any faster than dialing 911 . Non-lethal weapons ? Somethings non-lethal is a non-option . Brandishing a can of pepper spray wo n't cause an attacker to flee for their life , it wo n't hold them at bay until the police arrive to arrest them , it wo n't stop a violent individual from across the room , and it sure as hell wo n't affect somebody that 's doped up on narcotics . And stun guns are more useless than knives , because as I 've said before , you need to get right up against your attacker to use them . You have to get within stabbing distance to shock them , do you really want that to be your best option for protecting yourself ? The idea is to keep the bad guy away from you , not let them get right next to you . All of these non-lethal devices , they set up the false notion that the life of a criminal intent on hurting or possibly killing you , is worth more than your own life . That belief is stupid and should be done away with . Ask any woman that 's ever been raped if they feel that their attacker deserves to live more than they do .""",DISAGREE,"""The is , the to why guns specifically are needed to mitigate the risk of being the victim of a crime ,""","""Because guns are the best method available on the market .""",,
10343,2772,"""i think its finally settled that physical ( testable or tangible ) evidence of God can never be found . this is not only because of its elusive nature to science , but also because of religious requirements . from a scientic perspective , nothing ever occurs outside of the realm of phyical law . that is , physical laws are constant and unbreakable , and there is nothing new or unpredictable or inexplicable about them . because the laws of physics completely govern ever aspect of the universe , there is nothing left for a supernatural being to do , at least where the phsical realm is concerned . there is no supernatural phenomenon , and no occurance that natural physical laws do not affect from a religious perspective , knowledge of God can only come through faith . we already know that faith is certainty in the absence of rational evidence , in other word believing without evidence . Hebrews 11:6 says `` And without faith it is impossible to please him . For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him. `` faith is the key to religion , and only through faith can religion be established . therefore , if some physical observation could verify God 's existence , then it would contradict what religion says about God . this is a real catch 22. you search for evidence to solidify your faith , but if evidence comes you dont need faith , and without faith you can not relate to God in all , as far as i 'm concrned , it is totally futile to seek rational proof of God 's existence . even if it was found , it wouldnt be found . i remember saying that it is possible to prove that God exists ; that is , in the event that God showed up and said `` hey , it 's Me ! '' . but even this can never happen , because such a scenario would contradict the bible , and thus not prove God exists as far as the bible is concerned . and when all is said and done , it still doesnt answer the question `` does God exist ? ``""","""But then it also does n't answer the question `` does anything exist `` , nor does it answer an infinite number of `` existence `` questions . Do `` trolls `` exist , follows the same reasoning . If you find one , they are no longer a fairy tale/imaginary creature , they are some organic life form that can be measured , tested , and quantified .. i.e . no longer an imaginary creature . So they can no more be found than god . So replace god/troll with an infinite number of other imaginary things and you 'll see why the question `` Does god exist ? '' , has no real importance in the physical universe . ( does the tooth fairy exist , does a unicorn exist , do flying pigs exist , etc . ) In fact , I like that statement . The existence of god is not imporant ... Rather - the FAITH in god ( s , etc . ) is what is `` important `` , and the thoughts most certainly exist in the physical world and have a measureable impact . I think that 's why I do n't mind so much `` religion `` per se , it 's the human condition that brings suffering , and uncertainty , into our lives and for some people , the feelings brought about by their faith seems to treat the condition . ( the human condition also brings joy , love , etc. , but I 'd like that without the pain personally ) I only mind it when things in the physical universe are `` attacked `` with the premise of belief in god ( s ) , which is a waste of human energy ... we have a limited time , do n't spend it using fallacy to undermine those who are actually trying to build on the foundation of human knowledge . And any belief in something without evidence scares me if it becomes a driving force behind decisions . ... she 's a witch because she MADE the crops die ... she must be burned . ... he broke `` god 's `` law and therefore must be guilty .. ... this is `` god 's `` war .. Yeah , that still scares me . That 's why I think , at least in the US , the seperation of church and state is so ridiculously important , and accepted . While there are fundamentalists that rail against it ... it 's hopefully obvious that with ~80 % of the US believing in an imaginary `` god `` , but also having a separation of church and state and the most generally advanced scienctific community in the world , then the two can obviously co-exist , and I 'd go so far as to say thrive as long as the line is drawn and not crossed . I learned something in responding , thanks for the spark . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""i think its finally settled that physical ( testable or tangible ) evidence of God can never be found . `` ''""","""So replace god/troll with an infinite number of other imaginary things and you 'll see why the question `` Does god exist ? '' , has no real importance in the physical universe .""",,
10345,2772,"""i think its finally settled that physical ( testable or tangible ) evidence of God can never be found . this is not only because of its elusive nature to science , but also because of religious requirements . from a scientic perspective , nothing ever occurs outside of the realm of phyical law . that is , physical laws are constant and unbreakable , and there is nothing new or unpredictable or inexplicable about them . because the laws of physics completely govern ever aspect of the universe , there is nothing left for a supernatural being to do , at least where the phsical realm is concerned . there is no supernatural phenomenon , and no occurance that natural physical laws do not affect from a religious perspective , knowledge of God can only come through faith . we already know that faith is certainty in the absence of rational evidence , in other word believing without evidence . Hebrews 11:6 says `` And without faith it is impossible to please him . For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him. `` faith is the key to religion , and only through faith can religion be established . therefore , if some physical observation could verify God 's existence , then it would contradict what religion says about God . this is a real catch 22. you search for evidence to solidify your faith , but if evidence comes you dont need faith , and without faith you can not relate to God in all , as far as i 'm concrned , it is totally futile to seek rational proof of God 's existence . even if it was found , it wouldnt be found . i remember saying that it is possible to prove that God exists ; that is , in the event that God showed up and said `` hey , it 's Me ! '' . but even this can never happen , because such a scenario would contradict the bible , and thus not prove God exists as far as the bible is concerned . and when all is said and done , it still doesnt answer the question `` does God exist ? ``""","""But then it also does n't answer the question `` does anything exist `` , nor does it answer an infinite number of `` existence `` questions . Do `` trolls `` exist , follows the same reasoning . If you find one , they are no longer a fairy tale/imaginary creature , they are some organic life form that can be measured , tested , and quantified .. i.e . no longer an imaginary creature . So they can no more be found than god . So replace god/troll with an infinite number of other imaginary things and you 'll see why the question `` Does god exist ? '' , has no real importance in the physical universe . ( does the tooth fairy exist , does a unicorn exist , do flying pigs exist , etc . ) In fact , I like that statement . The existence of god is not imporant ... Rather - the FAITH in god ( s , etc . ) is what is `` important `` , and the thoughts most certainly exist in the physical world and have a measureable impact . I think that 's why I do n't mind so much `` religion `` per se , it 's the human condition that brings suffering , and uncertainty , into our lives and for some people , the feelings brought about by their faith seems to treat the condition . ( the human condition also brings joy , love , etc. , but I 'd like that without the pain personally ) I only mind it when things in the physical universe are `` attacked `` with the premise of belief in god ( s ) , which is a waste of human energy ... we have a limited time , do n't spend it using fallacy to undermine those who are actually trying to build on the foundation of human knowledge . And any belief in something without evidence scares me if it becomes a driving force behind decisions . ... she 's a witch because she MADE the crops die ... she must be burned . ... he broke `` god 's `` law and therefore must be guilty .. ... this is `` god 's `` war .. Yeah , that still scares me . That 's why I think , at least in the US , the seperation of church and state is so ridiculously important , and accepted . While there are fundamentalists that rail against it ... it 's hopefully obvious that with ~80 % of the US believing in an imaginary `` god `` , but also having a separation of church and state and the most generally advanced scienctific community in the world , then the two can obviously co-exist , and I 'd go so far as to say thrive as long as the line is drawn and not crossed . I learned something in responding , thanks for the spark . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""i think its finally settled that physical ( testable or tangible ) evidence of God can never be found .""","""But then it also does n't answer the question `` does anything exist `` , nor does it answer an infinite number of `` existence `` questions .""",,
10348,2773,"""We all know the logic makes sense . Slowly increasing global temperatures cause a dramatic decrease in global temperatures ! Just compare the early blizzard that just hit the two Dakotas here in the states with that of the 1920 North Dakota blizzard to see if there is a difference between now and then .""","""Come back when you learn the difference between climate and weather .""",DISAGREE,"""Slowly increasing global temperatures cause a dramatic decrease in global temperatures !""","""Come back when you learn the difference between climate and weather .""",,
10350,2773,"""We all know the logic makes sense . Slowly increasing global temperatures cause a dramatic decrease in global temperatures ! Just compare the early blizzard that just hit the two Dakotas here in the states with that of the 1920 North Dakota blizzard to see if there is a difference between now and then .""","""Come back when you learn the difference between climate and weather .""",DISAGREE,"""Slowly increasing global temperatures cause a dramatic decrease in global temperatures""","""when you learn the difference between climate and weather""",,
10376,2780,"""We supposedly evolved from simplistic monkeys to what we are today .""","""Either a gross misunderstanding or a gross misrepresentation of evolutionary theory .""",DISAGREE,"""We supposedly evolved from simplistic monkeys to what we are today .""","""Either a gross misunderstanding or a gross misrepresentation of evolutionary theory .""",,
10389,2781,"""Feel free to repeat any prior arguments you 've made , Chuz ; I welcome this thread as the 'start anew ' you suggested elsewhere . While I 'll probably use the ideas I 've rebutted with before , I 'm quite aware I was n't as accurate in my wording of some posts as I could have been ; so no assumptions of my position on any specifics , please , just as I will ( try to ) make no assumptions of yours . In light of that - and given that it is you who is defending your position - I leave it to you to make your own arguments , rather than have me rebut a possibly misrepresented one . Fire away . NB : This is in the Challenger 's Corner on request from Chuz , not me . As such , I can not guarentee a swift reply - one is highly likely , but not guarenteed . Hopefully this wo n't make much of a difference . Pasted from another thread ;""","""Quote : Originally Posted by Chuz Life ; You have my respect for accepting the challenge , ( my challenge to you to issue this challenge ) IANGB . You also have my respect for defining your disagreement with me in a fair ( almost uncomfortably ) challenging way that considers both our points of views quite nicely . I accept your challenge and ( as you eluded to ) reserve the right to take my time on some of the more challenging responses . If we have to agree to disagree at the end , I hope that we will have had the most informative . intellectually honest and civil discussion possible . And that it serves as an example and benefit to others . Let 's get it on !""",AGREE,"""In light of that - and given that it is you who is defending your position - I leave it to you to make your own arguments , rather than have me rebut a possibly misrepresented one .""","""You also have my respect for defining your disagreement with me in a fair ( almost uncomfortably ) challenging way that considers both our points of views quite nicely""",,
10398,2782,"""Assuming this right exists .... you could say that you have no right to kill it though , you can only try to starve it . -You have consented sex and get pregnant . The pregnancy is a direct consequence that was known when having sex . -You have consented to a stranger coming into your house to eat dinner . The stranger coming in and sitting down and using your plates and eating your food is a direct consequences of you inventing him in for dinner . -If you say you do n't want the unborn to `` live off you `` anymore then the only thing you can do is starve it because you ca n't kill it as it did nothing that it was not allowed to do until just now . -You have decided the stranger must go , however , you do n't have a right to kill him right there as you did n't give him any reasonable time to leave .""","""You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out .""",DISAGREE,"""Assuming this right exists .... you could say that you have no right to kill it though , you can only try to starve it . -You have consented sex and get pregnant .""","""You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out .""",,
10400,2782,"""Assuming this right exists .... you could say that you have no right to kill it though , you can only try to starve it . -You have consented sex and get pregnant . The pregnancy is a direct consequence that was known when having sex . -You have consented to a stranger coming into your house to eat dinner . The stranger coming in and sitting down and using your plates and eating your food is a direct consequences of you inventing him in for dinner . -If you say you do n't want the unborn to `` live off you `` anymore then the only thing you can do is starve it because you ca n't kill it as it did nothing that it was not allowed to do until just now . -You have decided the stranger must go , however , you do n't have a right to kill him right there as you did n't give him any reasonable time to leave .""","""You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out .""",DISAGREE,"""Assuming this right exists .... you could say that you have no right to kill it though , you can only try to starve it .""","""You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out .""",,
10396,2782,"""Assuming this right exists .... you could say that you have no right to kill it though , you can only try to starve it . -You have consented sex and get pregnant . The pregnancy is a direct consequence that was known when having sex . -You have consented to a stranger coming into your house to eat dinner . The stranger coming in and sitting down and using your plates and eating your food is a direct consequences of you inventing him in for dinner . -If you say you do n't want the unborn to `` live off you `` anymore then the only thing you can do is starve it because you ca n't kill it as it did nothing that it was not allowed to do until just now . -You have decided the stranger must go , however , you do n't have a right to kill him right there as you did n't give him any reasonable time to leave .""","""You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out .""",DISAGREE,"""Assuming this right exists you that you have no right to kill it , can only starve it . -You have consented and get pregnant . The pregnancy is having to a stranger your in eating of""","""the if had nowhere to go and it was cold out .""",,
10413,2783,"""Which Nat ' l Parks will now allow guns ?""","""Just those in places where CCW is already legal . If you can carry in your state , you can now carry in Nat ' l parks ... in that state . If you live in Illinois or Wisconsin , you must do like everyone else : call 911 out on the trail , wait for police to find you , then protect you from the rapist who has patiently waited for them to arrive . I ca n't figure it out . This law simply makes it legal for those who have their CCW to carry in Nat ' l parks too . They ALREADY carry everywhere else . The Brady bunch makes it sound like there 's something about the border of a park that will make us drooling , neanderthal gun owners flip our lids .... but just in the park . Why are we perfectly safe everywhere else , but all of a sudden , we 're dangerous ...... in the park ?""",AGREE,"""Which Nat ' l Parks will now allow guns ?""","""Just those in places where CCW is already legal . If you can carry in your state , you can now carry in Nat ' l parks ...""",,
10417,2784,"""Thanks Patriot for the well researched response . Although I am not a gun rights advocate , I am also not anti-gun and in the spirit of trying to get the two sides of this issue to reach some sort of understanding , here is what I believe to be the major points of those who support a ban on assult weapons . First of all , I do agree that the definition of assult weapons is a little strange , and it essentially boils down to the guns that look scary . However , the spirit of the law was to try to ban weapons whose main purpose was militaristic in nature . That is , guns that are able to be fired rapidly , have a large magazine , and reasonable stopping power . Thus , although the ban would not eliminate all of the `` dangerous `` weapons ( I assume that an M1 , the rifle that beat the Nazis , would be legal ) it does cover a lot of them . Of course , most 2nd amendment rights supporters would say that all this does n't matter , it does n't matter what purpose the gun serves , it is unconstitutional to infringe upon the rights of Americans to own any gun they want , no matter the purpose . What gun control advocates would say , however , is that the constitution says 'arms ' not guns , and it becomes the job of the goverment to determine what was meant my this . I think that most gun control advocates would agree that the second amendment probably did not intend for people to be able to buy chemical or biological weapons , for example . And , I for one , hope that is not what they meant , particularly in light of the recent war on terrorism . A common remark is `` why would it matter if I had a nuclear weapon if I am a law abiding citizen and would never use it against my neighbor ? `` The problem is that we do n't know what the intention of everyone is , and there are certainly terrorists in this country now who are American citizens and would use such powerful weapons against usif they were able to acquire them . Of course a semi-automatic .223 caliber rifle is not the same as a chemical weapon , but the point is that ( I think ) most people do n't think that you should be able to own absolutely any weapon that you want , so one must attempt to define what is too dangerous for ordinary citizens to own . I do n't think that I covered all of your points , Patriot , but this is getting long , so I will cut this off here , and I hope to get a response from you . I will be interested in your thoughts . -Dan""","""The ban on assault weapons stands on such poltically weak and Constitutionally weak ground that Congress only had the guts and the will to try it for 10 years . It expires this year . The right to own arms is expressly clear . It shall not be infringed by Congress . The federal government is fully empowed to keep arms away from convicted fellons , it does not have the power to limit them from citizens . Those people who `` you do n't know ( what they may do ) `` ? When the government is effective enough to prevent crime or has the power to do so , then we no longer live in a free society . Keep in mind that free choice also allows a person to decide to break the law . It cuts both ways , you can not take away the choice to break laws and allow good citizens truely be free . The only governments through history that have been effective in crime prevention has been tyranically communist countries with extensive secret police . The present people in former communist block countries today are sad to see thier streets full of crime , they recall `` back in the day `` how safe it way to walk down dark streets in saftey . Yes they were safe from criminals , they were not safe from the secret police . The moment the secret police eyed you for real or imagined statistical probability of breaking a crime or become a political enemy , you dissapeared and no one ever saw you alive again . The WMD analogy is poor . You will not find any vendors . Please find another one . There may be Constitutionally poor arguments in favor of banning WMDs for civilians , that argument is moot . You will not find any vendor . The Constitution protects my right to own arms . That does not mean arms vendors must be forced to sell thier product to me if I want one . That argument is moot . The Firearms Act decided that sawed off shot guns and the Thompson machine gun is to be banned from civilian ownership . Early Supreme court DECISIONS support this . Early judicial opinion of the the Firearms act was based on the fact that the Thompson and sawed off shot gun was not a military serviceable weapon and does not apply to the 2nd Amendment . The Thompson and sawed off shotgun were not used by the US Army . Guess what ? The Thompson was adpoted by the Army a few years later . So then , what does that mean ? Judicial opinion is of the direction that military serviceable weapons are protected by the 2nd Amendment . What does that mean for the assault rifle ban ? It means it is on shakey Constitutional ground . Some points I have for you : 1 ) Flash supressor ? Argued by anti-gunners prevent shooters from hiding thier position . Completely false . Flash hiders can hide flash from the target . It 's main purpose is to hide flash from the SHOOTER ! The flash startles the shooter and makes bullets ballistically unstable : `` Excessive muzzle flash happens when unburned powder ignites at the muzzle , causing turbulence behind the bullet with a detrimental effect on accuracy. `` - http : //www.shootingsoftware.com/loadens.htm Flash has more to do with the ammo than the attachment on the end . The Flash hidder ban has lowered target shooting scores more than protecting lives . 2 ) Magazine limit ? Argued by anti-gunners to save lives . Argued to prevent rapid and large expendature of rounds down range upon victims . True , but how often do you hear that ? When it does happen it is national news . The real threat is from guns that contain more 2 less than 4 bullets : http : //ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/abstract/9/2/151 The anti-gunners know this and are comming after your 6 shot revolvers next . They just wanted people to started getting used it to idea of banning bullet capacity . So then . The ban on more than 10 bullets ? It really does not do anything than give a false sense of security . If public policy productive and actally do something , then the ban on 10 bullets is a farce . 3 ) Bayonet ? I can not even fathom a reason to ban them other than emotional reasons . Simly because they look dangerous I suppose is why they are banned . Will someone please let me know ? Public policy should not be based on emotional reasons to be truely good and effective policy . 4 ) Pistol grip ? They make controling an automatic weapon easier to sight on your target . Well then , if you rifle is semi-auto , then what reason is there to ban them ?""",DISAGREE,"""guns that are able to be fired rapidly , `` remark is `` why would it matter if I had a nuclear weapon""","""machine gun is to be banned from civilian ownership It 's main purpose is to hide flash from the SHOOTER !""",,
10419,2784,"""Thanks Patriot for the well researched response . Although I am not a gun rights advocate , I am also not anti-gun and in the spirit of trying to get the two sides of this issue to reach some sort of understanding , here is what I believe to be the major points of those who support a ban on assult weapons . First of all , I do agree that the definition of assult weapons is a little strange , and it essentially boils down to the guns that look scary . However , the spirit of the law was to try to ban weapons whose main purpose was militaristic in nature . That is , guns that are able to be fired rapidly , have a large magazine , and reasonable stopping power . Thus , although the ban would not eliminate all of the `` dangerous `` weapons ( I assume that an M1 , the rifle that beat the Nazis , would be legal ) it does cover a lot of them . Of course , most 2nd amendment rights supporters would say that all this does n't matter , it does n't matter what purpose the gun serves , it is unconstitutional to infringe upon the rights of Americans to own any gun they want , no matter the purpose . What gun control advocates would say , however , is that the constitution says 'arms ' not guns , and it becomes the job of the goverment to determine what was meant my this . I think that most gun control advocates would agree that the second amendment probably did not intend for people to be able to buy chemical or biological weapons , for example . And , I for one , hope that is not what they meant , particularly in light of the recent war on terrorism . A common remark is `` why would it matter if I had a nuclear weapon if I am a law abiding citizen and would never use it against my neighbor ? `` The problem is that we do n't know what the intention of everyone is , and there are certainly terrorists in this country now who are American citizens and would use such powerful weapons against usif they were able to acquire them . Of course a semi-automatic .223 caliber rifle is not the same as a chemical weapon , but the point is that ( I think ) most people do n't think that you should be able to own absolutely any weapon that you want , so one must attempt to define what is too dangerous for ordinary citizens to own . I do n't think that I covered all of your points , Patriot , but this is getting long , so I will cut this off here , and I hope to get a response from you . I will be interested in your thoughts . -Dan""","""The ban on assault weapons stands on such poltically weak and Constitutionally weak ground that Congress only had the guts and the will to try it for 10 years . It expires this year . The right to own arms is expressly clear . It shall not be infringed by Congress . The federal government is fully empowed to keep arms away from convicted fellons , it does not have the power to limit them from citizens . Those people who `` you do n't know ( what they may do ) `` ? When the government is effective enough to prevent crime or has the power to do so , then we no longer live in a free society . Keep in mind that free choice also allows a person to decide to break the law . It cuts both ways , you can not take away the choice to break laws and allow good citizens truely be free . The only governments through history that have been effective in crime prevention has been tyranically communist countries with extensive secret police . The present people in former communist block countries today are sad to see thier streets full of crime , they recall `` back in the day `` how safe it way to walk down dark streets in saftey . Yes they were safe from criminals , they were not safe from the secret police . The moment the secret police eyed you for real or imagined statistical probability of breaking a crime or become a political enemy , you dissapeared and no one ever saw you alive again . The WMD analogy is poor . You will not find any vendors . Please find another one . There may be Constitutionally poor arguments in favor of banning WMDs for civilians , that argument is moot . You will not find any vendor . The Constitution protects my right to own arms . That does not mean arms vendors must be forced to sell thier product to me if I want one . That argument is moot . The Firearms Act decided that sawed off shot guns and the Thompson machine gun is to be banned from civilian ownership . Early Supreme court DECISIONS support this . Early judicial opinion of the the Firearms act was based on the fact that the Thompson and sawed off shot gun was not a military serviceable weapon and does not apply to the 2nd Amendment . The Thompson and sawed off shotgun were not used by the US Army . Guess what ? The Thompson was adpoted by the Army a few years later . So then , what does that mean ? Judicial opinion is of the direction that military serviceable weapons are protected by the 2nd Amendment . What does that mean for the assault rifle ban ? It means it is on shakey Constitutional ground . Some points I have for you : 1 ) Flash supressor ? Argued by anti-gunners prevent shooters from hiding thier position . Completely false . Flash hiders can hide flash from the target . It 's main purpose is to hide flash from the SHOOTER ! The flash startles the shooter and makes bullets ballistically unstable : `` Excessive muzzle flash happens when unburned powder ignites at the muzzle , causing turbulence behind the bullet with a detrimental effect on accuracy. `` - http : //www.shootingsoftware.com/loadens.htm Flash has more to do with the ammo than the attachment on the end . The Flash hidder ban has lowered target shooting scores more than protecting lives . 2 ) Magazine limit ? Argued by anti-gunners to save lives . Argued to prevent rapid and large expendature of rounds down range upon victims . True , but how often do you hear that ? When it does happen it is national news . The real threat is from guns that contain more 2 less than 4 bullets : http : //ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/abstract/9/2/151 The anti-gunners know this and are comming after your 6 shot revolvers next . They just wanted people to started getting used it to idea of banning bullet capacity . So then . The ban on more than 10 bullets ? It really does not do anything than give a false sense of security . If public policy productive and actally do something , then the ban on 10 bullets is a farce . 3 ) Bayonet ? I can not even fathom a reason to ban them other than emotional reasons . Simly because they look dangerous I suppose is why they are banned . Will someone please let me know ? Public policy should not be based on emotional reasons to be truely good and effective policy . 4 ) Pistol grip ? They make controling an automatic weapon easier to sight on your target . Well then , if you rifle is semi-auto , then what reason is there to ban them ?""",DISAGREE,"""First of all , I do agree that the definition of assult weapons is a little strange , and it essentially boils down to the guns that look scary .""","""Simly because they look dangerous I suppose is why they are banned .""",,
10461,2795,"""In some cases , a kind is like a family . Hopefully the site Variation , information and the created kind should be able to answer this question .""","""Then you are just throwing around words without knowing what they mean . Instead you give me a link to a page of pseudoscience . Are those the ones who lied to you ?""",DISAGREE,"""In some cases , a kind is like a family . Hopefully the site Variation , information and the created kind should be able to answer this question .""","""Then you are just throwing around words without knowing what they mean . Instead you give me a link to a page of""",,
10463,2795,"""In some cases , a kind is like a family . Hopefully the site Variation , information and the created kind should be able to answer this question .""","""Then you are just throwing around words without knowing what they mean . Instead you give me a link to a page of pseudoscience . Are those the ones who lied to you ?""",DISAGREE,"""In some cases , a kind is like a family""","""Then you are just throwing around words without knowing what they mean .""",,
10466,2795,"""In some cases , a kind is like a family . Hopefully the site Variation , information and the created kind should be able to answer this question .""","""Then you are just throwing around words without knowing what they mean . Instead you give me a link to a page of pseudoscience . Are those the ones who lied to you ?""",DISAGREE,"""site Variation information created""","""you are throwing around words give me link pseudoscience Are those the ones who lied to you ?""",,
10480,2797,"""Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder By David Corn , Mother Jones Posted on April 10 , 2009 , Printed on April 10 , 2009 Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder | | AlterNet Is there a connection between same-sex marriage and mass murder ? That 's what one religious right outfit is suggesting . This week , Morality in Media disseminated a statement noting that the Iowa Supreme Court had legalized gay marriage on the same day that a gunman murdered 13 people in Binghamton , New York . The headline on the release : `` Connecting the Dots : The Line Between Gay Marriage and Mass Murders. `` The group 's president , Bob Peters , notes that the `` underlying problem is that increasingly we live in a 'post-Christian ' society , where Judeo-Christian faith and values have less and less influence. `` And , he continues , this `` secular value system is also reflected in the 'sexual revolution , ' which is the driving force behind the push for 'gay marriage . ' '' Here 's the punch line : It most certainly is not my intention to blame the epidemic of mass murders on the gay rights movement ! It is my intention to point out that the success of the sexual revolution is inversely proportional to the decline in morality ; and it is the decline of morality ( and the faith that so often under girds it ) that is the underlying cause of our modern day epidemic of mass murders . That is , he 's not saying that gay rights activists are directly responsible for the murderous actions of gun-toting madmen . But Peters maintains that those who champion gay rights are undermining the moral fiber of society and that this assault on traditional values creates an environment in which killing sprees can more easily occur . These acts of gun violence , he insists , are the poisoned fruit of the push for gay marriage . Talk about exploiting tragedy to advance an agenda . It might be tempting to dismiss Peters and Morality in Media as marginal , but this group did receive federal funding from 2005 through 2007 . The money supported a Morality in Media project , ObscenityCrimes.org , which paid two retired law enforcement officers to review citizen complaints about obscenity on the Internet and to forward the best leads to the US Justice Department for possible prosecution . A total of $ 300,000 was provided to Morality in Media through two earmarks Rep. Frank Wolf ( R-Va. ) placed into spending bills , according to Peters . And a portion of that money went to cover Peters ' salary . As The New York Times reported in 2007 , no obscenity prosecutions had resulted from the Morality in Media 's obscenity-tracking work . Peters tells me that since 2007 -- thanks to the fuss about earmarks -- he has received no more funds from the US government . After the earmarked grants ran out in 2007 , he did apply directly to the Justice Department and was turned down . Since then , he has raised private funds to keep ObscenityCrimes.org going . That may be for the best -- particularly for Morality in Media . Peters has recently attacked President Barack Obama 's pick for deputy attorney general , David Ogden , as an `` ACLU-minded `` sort who would `` likely weaken `` government efforts `` to curb sexual trafficking and sexual exploitation of children. `` It would be difficult -- or , at least , awkward -- for Peters to blast a Justice Department that was funding his own work . In his statement on gay marriage and mass murder , Peters notes that Christianity and Judaism teach `` that we are to love our neighbors as ourselves and to forgive others. `` But on the subject of gay marriage , he does seem to have a rather unforgiving approach . David Corn is the Washington bureau chief of Mother Jones and the co-author of Hubris : The Inside Story of Spin , Scandal , and the Selling of the Iraq War and is the author of The Lies of George W. Bush . He writes a blog at davidcorn.com . © 2009 Mother Jones All rights reserved . View this story online at : Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder | | AlterNet""","""Once again as the noose tightens and they see their days are numbered . The religious elite feel their power and hold over the masses slipping . With Iowa and Vermont being major victories they 'll stop at nothing to instill fear and confusion upon the American people to try and stem the tide that has been long overdue in rising .""",AGREE,"""Peters tells me that since 2007 -- thanks to the fuss about earmarks -- he has received no more funds from the US government .""","""Once again as the noose tightens and they see their days are numbered .""",,
10484,2797,"""Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder By David Corn , Mother Jones Posted on April 10 , 2009 , Printed on April 10 , 2009 Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder | | AlterNet Is there a connection between same-sex marriage and mass murder ? That 's what one religious right outfit is suggesting . This week , Morality in Media disseminated a statement noting that the Iowa Supreme Court had legalized gay marriage on the same day that a gunman murdered 13 people in Binghamton , New York . The headline on the release : `` Connecting the Dots : The Line Between Gay Marriage and Mass Murders. `` The group 's president , Bob Peters , notes that the `` underlying problem is that increasingly we live in a 'post-Christian ' society , where Judeo-Christian faith and values have less and less influence. `` And , he continues , this `` secular value system is also reflected in the 'sexual revolution , ' which is the driving force behind the push for 'gay marriage . ' '' Here 's the punch line : It most certainly is not my intention to blame the epidemic of mass murders on the gay rights movement ! It is my intention to point out that the success of the sexual revolution is inversely proportional to the decline in morality ; and it is the decline of morality ( and the faith that so often under girds it ) that is the underlying cause of our modern day epidemic of mass murders . That is , he 's not saying that gay rights activists are directly responsible for the murderous actions of gun-toting madmen . But Peters maintains that those who champion gay rights are undermining the moral fiber of society and that this assault on traditional values creates an environment in which killing sprees can more easily occur . These acts of gun violence , he insists , are the poisoned fruit of the push for gay marriage . Talk about exploiting tragedy to advance an agenda . It might be tempting to dismiss Peters and Morality in Media as marginal , but this group did receive federal funding from 2005 through 2007 . The money supported a Morality in Media project , ObscenityCrimes.org , which paid two retired law enforcement officers to review citizen complaints about obscenity on the Internet and to forward the best leads to the US Justice Department for possible prosecution . A total of $ 300,000 was provided to Morality in Media through two earmarks Rep. Frank Wolf ( R-Va. ) placed into spending bills , according to Peters . And a portion of that money went to cover Peters ' salary . As The New York Times reported in 2007 , no obscenity prosecutions had resulted from the Morality in Media 's obscenity-tracking work . Peters tells me that since 2007 -- thanks to the fuss about earmarks -- he has received no more funds from the US government . After the earmarked grants ran out in 2007 , he did apply directly to the Justice Department and was turned down . Since then , he has raised private funds to keep ObscenityCrimes.org going . That may be for the best -- particularly for Morality in Media . Peters has recently attacked President Barack Obama 's pick for deputy attorney general , David Ogden , as an `` ACLU-minded `` sort who would `` likely weaken `` government efforts `` to curb sexual trafficking and sexual exploitation of children. `` It would be difficult -- or , at least , awkward -- for Peters to blast a Justice Department that was funding his own work . In his statement on gay marriage and mass murder , Peters notes that Christianity and Judaism teach `` that we are to love our neighbors as ourselves and to forgive others. `` But on the subject of gay marriage , he does seem to have a rather unforgiving approach . David Corn is the Washington bureau chief of Mother Jones and the co-author of Hubris : The Inside Story of Spin , Scandal , and the Selling of the Iraq War and is the author of The Lies of George W. Bush . He writes a blog at davidcorn.com . © 2009 Mother Jones All rights reserved . View this story online at : Religious Right Group Claims Same Sex Marriage Leads to Mass Murder | | AlterNet""","""Once again as the noose tightens and they see their days are numbered . The religious elite feel their power and hold over the masses slipping . With Iowa and Vermont being major victories they 'll stop at nothing to instill fear and confusion upon the American people to try and stem the tide that has been long overdue in rising .""",AGREE,"""Religious Right `` ''""","""they see their days are numbered religious elite feel their power and hold over the masses slipping""",,
10496,2799,"""I 'm going to play devil 's advocate for a moment . Suppose this expedition had set out and had n't found the transitional fossil . Would we accept this as falsification of the hypothesis on which the prediction was based ? I suspect not , as we know that fossilisation ( in the first instance ) and the uncovering of said fossils ( in the second ) are contingent , not necessary , events . By Popperian criteria , if we would not accept a nil result as falsification , we can not trumpet a positive result as validation .""","""I think reason why the `` hypothesis validated `` card has been played here is because : 1 . The time window for the expected transitional form is about ~20 ma , a narrow window by geological timeframes . Given this the researchers examined the stratigraphic column to select locatities where the rocks were of the corresponding age and selected sites accordingly . 2 . Tiktaalik was expected to live in a certain type of environment , and this expectation was used to further narrow the localities that would be explored as potential deposits for containing the expected `` transitional `` form . 3 . Having selected the locality , expeditions were mounted and successfully recovered remains of the anticipated beastie . Upon analysis it was found to lie in terms of evolutionary development between the most derived/advanced fish and most primitive tetrapods that had been previously known . Given the huge expanse of the Earth 's surface 1 and 2 helped the researchers select comparitively tiny areas to examine and the fact they found what they ( roughly ) expected to find says their hypothesis ( we will find remains of transitional form x at locality y ) was borne out . If no remains had been found then further expeditions might have been successful and the hypothesis could of been validiated at a later date . If they had found , lets say a more primitive form than the previously most advanced fish or a more advanced tetrapod than the previously most primitive form then I think that might amount to a falsifiaction . Having said all that I think that to claim a hypothesis was validated in this instance is slightly confusing as palaeontology is like archeology- you can never be 100 % sure everthing has been found and one small discovery can force a rethink of what that had been established up to that point . Also , IIRC , none of the three articles in nature make any reference to a hypothesis being validated I 'd describe it more as being an expectation being fufilled .""",DISAGREE,"""devil 's advocate falsification of the hypothesis""","""hypothesis validated `` amount to a falsifiaction palaeontology is like""",,
10497,2799,"""I 'm going to play devil 's advocate for a moment . Suppose this expedition had set out and had n't found the transitional fossil . Would we accept this as falsification of the hypothesis on which the prediction was based ? I suspect not , as we know that fossilisation ( in the first instance ) and the uncovering of said fossils ( in the second ) are contingent , not necessary , events . By Popperian criteria , if we would not accept a nil result as falsification , we can not trumpet a positive result as validation .""","""I think reason why the `` hypothesis validated `` card has been played here is because : 1 . The time window for the expected transitional form is about ~20 ma , a narrow window by geological timeframes . Given this the researchers examined the stratigraphic column to select locatities where the rocks were of the corresponding age and selected sites accordingly . 2 . Tiktaalik was expected to live in a certain type of environment , and this expectation was used to further narrow the localities that would be explored as potential deposits for containing the expected `` transitional `` form . 3 . Having selected the locality , expeditions were mounted and successfully recovered remains of the anticipated beastie . Upon analysis it was found to lie in terms of evolutionary development between the most derived/advanced fish and most primitive tetrapods that had been previously known . Given the huge expanse of the Earth 's surface 1 and 2 helped the researchers select comparitively tiny areas to examine and the fact they found what they ( roughly ) expected to find says their hypothesis ( we will find remains of transitional form x at locality y ) was borne out . If no remains had been found then further expeditions might have been successful and the hypothesis could of been validiated at a later date . If they had found , lets say a more primitive form than the previously most advanced fish or a more advanced tetrapod than the previously most primitive form then I think that might amount to a falsifiaction . Having said all that I think that to claim a hypothesis was validated in this instance is slightly confusing as palaeontology is like archeology- you can never be 100 % sure everthing has been found and one small discovery can force a rethink of what that had been established up to that point . Also , IIRC , none of the three articles in nature make any reference to a hypothesis being validated I 'd describe it more as being an expectation being fufilled .""",DISAGREE,"""Suppose this expedition had set out and had n't found the transitional fossil . falsification""","""If no remains had been found then further expeditions might have been successful and the hypothesis could of been validiated at a later date If they had found , lets say a more primitive form than the previously most advanced fish or a more advanced tetrapod than the previously most primitive form then I think that might amount to a falsifiaction .""",,
10505,2800,"""It makes more sense to believe in a devine creator , then to believe that every kind of living thing evolved from one another .""","""Because ...""",DISAGREE,"""It makes more sense to believe in a devine creator , then to believe that every kind of living thing evolved from one another .""","""Because ...""",,
10525,2803,"""What say you now , Sinjin ?""","""I believe I am on record as not supporting registration of either handguns or long guns as long as NICS checks are conducted for all sales and transfers of ownership records are recoverable from FFL 's with a warrant .""",DISAGREE,"""What say you now , Sinjin ?""","""I am on record as not supporting registration of either handguns or long guns as long as NICS checks are conducted""",,
10540,2806,"""& # 8220 ; Americans just aren & # 8217 ; t gullible enough to believe that they came from a fish , & # 8221 ; he said .""","""And they wonder why the science community does n't take them seriously ...""",DISAGREE,"""Americans just aren t gullible enough to believe that they came from a fish , he said .""","""And they wonder why the science community does n't take them seriously ...""",,
10553,2808,"""Genesis says that all creatures were specially created . It fits with the observational evidence but there is no smoking gun that proves it .""","""And I 've never seen anyone present observational evidence that would indicate that all creatures were specially created . Please do so .""",DISAGREE,"""It fits with the observational evidence but there is no smoking gun that proves it .""","""present observational evidence that would indicate that all creatures were specially""",,
10548,2808,"""Genesis says that all creatures were specially created . It fits with the observational evidence but there is no smoking gun that proves it .""","""And I 've never seen anyone present observational evidence that would indicate that all creatures were specially created . Please do so .""",DISAGREE,"""Genesis says that all creatures were specially created . It fits with the observational evidence but there is no smoking gun that proves it .""","""And I 've never seen anyone present observational evidence that would indicate that all creatures were specially created . Please do so .""",,
10562,2810,"""That 's what faith does . It limits your options .""","""Here 's a nice little Google def : A convinced belief ; a condition of mind fully satisfied ; next to actual knowledge . We have faith the sun will rise to-morrow morning , but the knowledge can not be actual until after sunrise . It appears that a Law or theorem is fundamentaly based on faith . If you could n't build on the belief that something will happen , we 'd be stuck never forming new hypostheses . You may have it backwards .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's what faith does . It limits your options""","""If you could n't build on the belief that something will happen , we 'd be stuck never forming new hypostheses . You may have it backwards .""",,
10565,2810,"""That 's what faith does . It limits your options .""","""Here 's a nice little Google def : A convinced belief ; a condition of mind fully satisfied ; next to actual knowledge . We have faith the sun will rise to-morrow morning , but the knowledge can not be actual until after sunrise . It appears that a Law or theorem is fundamentaly based on faith . If you could n't build on the belief that something will happen , we 'd be stuck never forming new hypostheses . You may have it backwards .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's what faith does . It limits your options .""","""We have faith the sun will rise to-morrow It appears that a Law or theorem is fundamentaly based on faith""",,
10578,2813,"""I will not turn this into another debate that often comes up with this issue . But for the sake of clarification can you tell me if you believe it possible that the rights of the being 's inside the mother are being infringed upon ? That is , when do you deem it worthy of protection ? ( I wo n't debate this , I 'm just curious as to your view ) .""","""Actually , I am of the opinion that the fetus has no natural rights of its own . Any rights we grant to a person as a citizen or national are granted at the moment of birth . By granting equal rights to a 3week old fetus that you do to a 20 year old man , you are endangering the rights of the woman who carries that child . Yes , I believe that in most circumstances , the child should be carried to term , but there are exceptions to every rule , and I 'm not quite ready to forsake the lives and health of women to protect unborn children . Yes , I think the unborn child is worthy of protection , but not any more so than the mother , in fact probably less .""",DISAGREE,"""can you tell me if you believe it possible that the rights of the being 's inside the mother are being infringed upon ?""","""Actually , I am of the opinion that the fetus has no natural rights of its , I think the unborn child is worthy of protection , but not any more so than the mother , in fact probably less .""",,
10587,2814,"""Sez u . Your problem being that when you assert the assumption that your philosophy , [ materialism , etc . ] , mirrors reality , my reasoning repeatedly shoots it full of holes , and , quite understandably , that # # # # # # you off .""","""Nothing you 've ever said regarding classical evolutionary theory has ever ' # # # # # # ' me off , because in every case you have demonstrated contempt-fuelled ignorance of what it actually states . The number of incorrect statements you 've made about what 'darwinists think ' or 'darwinists believe ' or , quite recently , what darwinists ' materialist ideology 'forces them to assert ' is large and increases daily . And so long as you continue to batter your pet strawman of the ToE in preference to tackling the real deal , I wo n't have to 'defend ' anything ; I 'll just have to keep on correcting the same old mistakes .""",DISAGREE,"""Your problem being that when you assert the assumption that your philosophy , [ materialism , etc . ] , mirrors reality , my reasoning repeatedly shoots it full of holes""","""Nothing you 've ever said regarding classical evolutionary theory has ever ' # # # # # # ' me off , because in every case you have demonstrated contempt-fuelled ignorance of what it actually states .""",,
10600,2817,"""No , that is because the courts let the Darwiniacs win in Alabama and not let the stickers be put in the books .""","""I think that case was in Georgia ( a different state ) and so far as I know homosexuality was not involved . However if you want to worry about a legal case you need to look at Dover Pa. Not the sticker case in Cobb County .""",DISAGREE,"""the courts let the Darwiniacs win Alabama stickers""","""Georgia homosexuality was not involved . you need to look at Dover Pa. Not the sticker case in Cobb County .""",,
10602,2817,"""No , that is because the courts let the Darwiniacs win in Alabama and not let the stickers be put in the books .""","""I think that case was in Georgia ( a different state ) and so far as I know homosexuality was not involved . However if you want to worry about a legal case you need to look at Dover Pa. Not the sticker case in Cobb County .""",DISAGREE,"""No , that is because the courts let the Darwiniacs win in Alabama and not let the stickers be put in the books .""","""I think that case was in Georgia ( a different state ) and so far as I know homosexuality was not involved .""",,
10613,2819,"""This is a statement written by someone who obviously has not read scripture . One of the most astonising `` proofs `` if you will , that the Bible is of supernatural origin , is predictive prophecy . Science can not , as you claim , `` explain `` everything , and it has no natural explanation for the predictions made in scripture . How can science explain through statistical probablity the over 600 prophecies in Biblical writings that have come to pass ? Also , how can it explain how supposedly uneducated people ( uneducated in the ways of modern science ) wrote about astronomy as if they knew about the universe as we do today . How could they have described the hydrological cycle as we have only come to know it recently ? Ecclesiastes 1:6 The wind goes toward the south , And turns around to the north ; The wind whirls about continually , And comes again on its circuit . How did they know that the earth `` hangs on nothing `` when the accepted norm of the day did not even accept that possibility ? Job 26:7 He stretches out the north over empty space ; He hangs the earth on nothing . How did they know that the `` vapors `` of the earth rise to create moisture , that is seeded by lightning with nitrogen and then falls as rain to fertilze the soil ? Jeremiah 10:13 When He utters His voice , There is a multitude of waters in the heavens :  “ And He causes the vapors to ascend from the ends of the earth . He makes lightning for the rain , He brings the wind out of His treasuries. ” Hydrothermal vents [ 4 ] are described in two books of the Bible written before 1400BC—more than 3,000 years before their discovery by science . Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah ’ s life , in the second month , the seventeenth day of the month , on that day all the fountains of the great deep were broken up , and the windows of heaven were opened . Even though the Bible is not a scientific text book and does n't purport to be , nowhere is it scientifically inaccurate . In addition , many of the scientific ideas you are so impressed with are nothing new to the Bible . It was speaking of these things long before modern science spoke of them . The story goes `` They ( scientists ) are slowly working their way to the mountain 's peak painstakingly measuring and analyzing every step that they take . After many years of research , they finally arrive at the top of the mountain , scale over its leading edge , only to find a group of theologians sitting there with the answers all along. ``""","""Apparently you 've got one powerful set of rose colored glassed . I guess you spend a lot of money on those 1-900 psychics too . Nowhere is it scientifically inaccurate ? Are you serious ? Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""most astonising `` proofs `` if you will , that the Bible is of supernatural origin , is predictive prophecy . Science can not , as you claim""","""got one powerful set of rose colored glassed""",,
10619,2820,"""This is not a case of disagreement on the interpretation of evidence , it is science versus science fiction .""","""Recall I mentioned your use of hyperbole earlier ? its in that sentence as well""",DISAGREE,"""not a case of disagreement on the interpretation of evidence , it is science""","""Recall I mentioned your use of hyperbole""",,
10643,2828,"""Well , that 's generally true of any process that uses energy . Some is wasted .""","""Some ? 90 % is more than some in my opinion . That is a horrible waste . Just think if we could retain 50 % of the energy we consumed . We could start eating 1/5th of what we normally eat .""",DISAGREE,"""Well , that 's generally true of any process that uses energy . Some is wasted .""","""Some ? 90 % is more than some in my opinion . That is a horrible waste .""",,
10658,2845,"""http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/wood ... oodpecker.html""","""know all about Talk Origins . I was hoping to avoid `` argument by link. `` My hope is to here someone hear actually explain it in their own words , rather than using an evolution propoganda site .""",DISAGREE,"""http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/wood ... oodpecker.html""","""I was hoping to avoid `` argument by""",,
10670,2847,"""Originally posted by Patriot Not only the most overturned , but wrong in this case at least .""","""Not only do their superiors in higher courts think they are a joke , but their peers in other circuit courts think they are a joke .""",AGREE,"""Not only the most overturned , but wrong in this case at least .""","""Not only do their superiors in higher courts think they are a joke ,""",,
10678,2848,"""Fundamental Rights This relationship of citizen and state is fundamental to democracy . In the words of the U.S . Declaration of Independence , written by Thomas Jefferson in 1776 : We hold these truths to be self-evident , that all men are created equal , that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights , that among these are life , liberty and the pursuit of happiness . That to secure these rights , governments are instituted among men , deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed . More specifically , in democracies , these fundamental or inalienable rights include freedom of speech and expression , freedom of religion and conscience , freedom of assembly , and the right to equal protection before the law . This is by no means an exhaustive list of the rights that citizens enjoy in a democracy , but it does constitute a set of the irreducible core rights that any democratic government worthy of the name must uphold . Since they exist independently of government , in Jefferson 's view , these rights can not be legislated away , nor should they be subject to the whim of an electoral majority .""","""And here our Government recognizes : Rule of Law : Fundamental Rights of Citizens Democracies exist to serve their people""",AGREE,"""This relationship of citizen and state is fundamental to democracy . they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights""","""Fundamental Rights of Citizens Democracies exist to serve their people""",,
10677,2848,"""Fundamental Rights This relationship of citizen and state is fundamental to democracy . In the words of the U.S . Declaration of Independence , written by Thomas Jefferson in 1776 : We hold these truths to be self-evident , that all men are created equal , that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights , that among these are life , liberty and the pursuit of happiness . That to secure these rights , governments are instituted among men , deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed . More specifically , in democracies , these fundamental or inalienable rights include freedom of speech and expression , freedom of religion and conscience , freedom of assembly , and the right to equal protection before the law . This is by no means an exhaustive list of the rights that citizens enjoy in a democracy , but it does constitute a set of the irreducible core rights that any democratic government worthy of the name must uphold . Since they exist independently of government , in Jefferson 's view , these rights can not be legislated away , nor should they be subject to the whim of an electoral majority .""","""And here our Government recognizes : Rule of Law : Fundamental Rights of Citizens Democracies exist to serve their people""",AGREE,"""That to secure these rights , governments are instituted among men , deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed . This is by no means an exhaustive list of the rights that citizens enjoy in a democracy ,""","""Fundamental Rights of Citizens Democracies exist to serve their people""",,
10706,2854,"""Do you believe it is wrong to torture toddlers for fun ?""","""No , but in some cultures they mutilate them for meaningless tradition .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you believe it is wrong to torture toddlers for fun ?""","""No , but in some cultures they mutilate them for meaningless tradition .""",,
10709,2855,"""There is a natural need to see clearly , wear clothes , and regulate child birth . Marriage is to promote children bearing and making a family unit . Like small business loans are made to promtoe business , not every business will eb successful but that is the prupose of the loans . It is impossible to know if a heterosexual will give birth just the likelihood .""","""But what about the married couple who know right up front they do not intend to have children , do n't even intend to try ? Do we ban them from marriage to ?""",DISAGREE,"""There is a natural need to see clearly , wear clothes , and regulate child birth .""","""Do we ban them from marriage to ?""",,
10716,2871,"""Poetry does not mean fiction .""","""But poetry will never be taken seriously in political decisions . Atheists have a lot to like in songofgenesis , do n't they ? another quote""",DISAGREE,"""Poetry does not mean fiction .""","""But poetry will never be taken seriously in political decisions .""",,
10728,2873,"""Rarely has truth ever supported one side of a political movement .""","""I 'm not saying we got it all right""",DISAGREE,"""Rarely has truth ever supported one side of a political movement""","""not saying we got it all right""",,
10732,2874,"""by this stupidity a KKK mob with guns is a militia !""","""We call that a strawman , here . You have much to learn . Let me explain . A militia is a group of armed , ordinary citizens who gather . There are all these `` militias `` running around screaming that they 're a militia , but if my town was attacked for some reason , the citizens could just get some guns and gather on main street ... to form a militia ! Now do you understand ? If so , I expect you to ignore me . If not , then you 're hopeless . I ca n't get much clearer than that .""",DISAGREE,"""this stupidity a KKK mob with guns""","""strawman Let me my town was attacked for some reason""",,
10738,2875,"""Anyone who can quote the Uncommondescent blog as if it were serious science obviously is clueless about evolution . As are the Uncommondescent bloggers . They wear their bibliolatry on their sleeves .""","""the blog is just the link for the article .... geez , get a grip .""",DISAGREE,"""As are the Uncommondescent bloggers . They wear their bibliolatry on their sleeves""","""the blog is just the link for the article""",,
10740,2876,"""1 ) Refuse to comment upon scientific procedures . 1 . ) Refusing to comment on scientific procedure means absolutely nothing . Maybe we do n't have anything to say . But if you have nothing to say , then how can you refute the point . Yet this does n't stop creationists from attempting to refute established scientific facts with misinformation , ignorance and outright lies . 2 ) When faced with hard facts , move the argument to either a emotional ground , or question the personal , non-scientific beliefs of the evolution believer . 2 . ) Testing your beliefs of your own scientific conclusions is not wrong . Duo_Maxwell 's point is when creationists are incapable of refuting a fact that disproves their worldview , they switch to non scientific tactics that have nothing to do with the veracity of the scientific theory in an attempt to confuse the issue . Such as you did in another thread when you asked `` WOULD YOU BET YOUR LIFE ON IT ? `` Theories in science are continuously tested and in over 150 years the theory of evolution has NOT been falsified . 3 ) Lie like there is no tomorrow 3 . ) I do n't lie dude . Sure you do , probably due to ignorance , but none the less ...... You said in another thread `` My point exactly . Carbon dating is by no means accurate , there it does not refute creationism. `` Carbon dating and radiometric dating are very accurate . But like any tool , when used improperly , they wo n't give accurate results . But when used properly , they give excellent data . How do we know they are accurate , because they are cross checked , they are verified by other dating methods . Samples that are dated by radiometric dating methods are dated by more than one method before a date is reached . For a sample to be dated by 2 different isotopes and both isotopes are flawed yet give the same date range is simply impossible . Carbon dating ( which is only good for about 50,000 years ) is checked against ice core samples , dendochronology , lake varves , just to name a few other dating methods , and it is virtually always verified . For all these different dating methods to be wrong and still give us the same dates just ca n't happen . 4 ) Refuse to acknowledge anything they simply do n't like 4 . ) Because we do n't give the response you would like is not wrong . No , creationists ignore the data that refutes their points . 5 ) When faced with a point they can not use # 2 on , ignore it completely like it does not exist 5 . ) Do n't think so Then you 've done no research on the subject and have n't read many of the creatinist posts on forums like this one . You did it yourself in the thread where you said this about carbon dating : `` I did n't ignore the quote , I just do n't believe it . There have been many inaccurate test. `` You do n't believe it why ? Have you studied the evidence , do you know how carbon dating works , have you ever carbon dated something and explained the flaws ? No , the only reason you do n't believe it is because it destroys the possiblity of a young earth . You ignore the evidence , sweep it all away with an unsupported `` I do n't believe it `` , that is exactly what point 5 is saying . 6 ) Classical ad-naeseum 6 . ) The only thing classical ad-naeseum is your own preconceived idea's of creationism and creationist . Preconceived ideas ? ! ? You forget that up until 200 years ago , creationism was the accepted model , based on PRECONCEIVED ideas taken from the Bible . But christian geologists started to look at the evidence and found that the earth could not possibly be only a few thousand years old and there never could have been a global flood . And in all the time since , there has been no evidence found that supports a young earth or global flood and mountains of evidence that refute both . Science is n't about preconceived ideas , science is about finding an explaination for the available data , even if that explaination destroys cherished , PRECONCEIVED ideas that are found to be false . So let 's hear what preconceived ideas science has that are refuted by the evidence .........""","""Why is it when Creo 's do n't believe something , Evo 's always think because they have studies or what have you that we Creo 's have to accept it as proof . I mean you do n't accept anything as proof from Creo 's . If Creo 's did some carbon testing and did it accurately and got some anomaly 's , you 'd still reject it . I did n't lie not even by ignorance . I just do n't believe it 's true , but I take it I 'm not allowed my beliefs . What fact has disproved my worldview , my worldview is intact as it ever has been ?""",DISAGREE,"""Refuse to comment Maybe we do n't have anything to say .""","""Creo 's do n't believe something do n't accept anything""",,
10747,2877,"""He said it in Genisis , and yes the Bible is inspired by god , No its not poofed down by him but through his prophets he did get his message accross . If you choose not to believe it ... Oh well your funeral .""","""So what standards of proof do you hold the bible to ? What allows you to hold it next to other religious or fantastical texts and say `` Yes , this one is definately , without fail , the word of God , and this one is not. ``""",DISAGREE,"""and yes the Bible is inspired by god , No its not poofed down by him but through his prophets he did get his message accross""","""So what standards of proof do you hold the bible to ? What allows you to hold it next to other religious or fantastical texts and say `` Yes , this one is definately , without fail , the word of God , and this one is""",,
10751,2878,"""My def of evolution is that man evolved from a piece of star dust .""","""and this :""",DISAGREE,"""My def of evolution is that man evolved from a piece of star dust .""","""and this :""",,
10768,2882,"""But the interesting thing is evolutionists refer to this survival of the fittest on the level of the INDIVIDUAL . They say that members within the same species are in competition with each other .""","""Not really . Even Darwin recognized that it is populations that evolve , not individuals . Natural selection is differential reproductive success . I suspect that you are n't able to understand anything that Dawkins has said .""",DISAGREE,"""They say that members within the same species are in competition with each other .""","""Not really . Even Darwin recognized that it is populations that evolve , not individuals .""",,
10786,2886,"""Is there anyone here who is pro choice and does not subscribe to moral relativism ( ie : the idea that there is no such thing as absolute right or wrong ? If so , for what reasons are you pro-choice ? I am curious .""","""because all children should have parents who want them dearly . btw , `` moral relativism `` is absurd . a phase people pass through as they discover diversity and is bewildered by it , thinking all are equally valid . it is a stance of both immature/superficial reasoning and moral depravity .""",DISAGREE,"""Is there anyone here who is pro choice and does not subscribe to moral relativism If so , for what reasons are you pro-choice ?""","""because all children should have parents who want them dearly btw , `` moral relativism `` is absurd .""",,
10787,2886,"""Is there anyone here who is pro choice and does not subscribe to moral relativism ( ie : the idea that there is no such thing as absolute right or wrong ? If so , for what reasons are you pro-choice ? I am curious .""","""because all children should have parents who want them dearly . btw , `` moral relativism `` is absurd . a phase people pass through as they discover diversity and is bewildered by it , thinking all are equally valid . it is a stance of both immature/superficial reasoning and moral depravity .""",DISAGREE,"""moral relativism""","""btw , `` moral relativism `` is absurd .""",,
10804,2890,"""Intellegent Design is the study of the idea that certain biological phenomena are too complex to have been evolved from a series of simpler organisms , and therefore must have been created fully functional from the onset . It is based on the idea that if we can observe an organism or an organic function whose existence can not be explained by the successive adaptation of the evolutionary model , then that organism or function is evidence for intelligent design . When intelligent design first emerged , among the long list of examples of irreducibly complex phenomena were the eye , the flagellum and blood clotting . All of these have been shown to have simpler counterparts which also fucntion , and therefore which could have been the evolutionary basis for the emergence of these more complex functions . These examples are summarized in wikipedia 's article Irreducible complexity - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""","""Yes I know , a lot of people have done a lot of work to try to refute Behe ’ s work . From your link ;""",AGREE,"""design""","""Yes I know , a lot of people have done a lot of work to try to refute Behe ’ s work . From your link ;""",,
10825,2902,"""If God transported them , we immediately have removed the flood myth from the realm of science . As if the flood itself did not do this already ...""","""IF ' is the question . It suggests that Holy Tradition does not know the answer . Secondly , the issue of the flood itself could still be true and tested scientifically ... as to whether an historical Noah existed that you might consign to 'myth ' . Does anyone here not find it interesting that there is almost a universal factor in societies concerning a global flood ? PS I have already discussed M-Eve on another post .""",DISAGREE,"""have removed the flood myth from the realm of science""","""interesting that there is almost a universal factor in societies concerning a global flood""",,
10830,2903,"""Notice how the places where guns are banned have the most massacres . Those who instituted laws preventing people on campus from defending themselves should be held partially liable for these crimes .""","""Say what ? You can not say for certain that anything would have happened . For all we know if the kids in the classroom had guns they could very well have started shooting and then how do the other students know which one is the real threat ? After all , all of them are shooting fellow students , right ? So how do they know who the shooter is if EVERYONE is shooting ? Who knows what kind of massive gun fight such a thing could turn into . I support gun rights as much as the next person . But having them in a school environment is just plain ridiculous .""",DISAGREE,"""the""","""school environment is just plain ridiculous .""",,
10841,2906,"""Did n't a famous gangster once escape from jail using a gun he carved from soap ? Maybe OZ should ban bars of soap ?""","""Yea that was uncle John !""",AGREE,"""Did n't a famous gangster once escape from jail using a gun he carved from soap ?""","""Yea that was uncle John !""",,
10881,2915,"""It 's not that we pro life people do n't care about womens rights it 's that we care about the babies rights too .""","""No one here is talking about babies The fact that you would incorrectly call a ZEF a 'baby ' only proves that anti-choicers think that women are invisible .""",DISAGREE,"""it 's that we care about the babies rights too""","""incorrectly call a ZEF a 'baby ' only proves that anti-choicers think that women are invisible .""",,
10904,2918,"""# 1 What does a virus have to do with this discussion ? I see in the post above you argue the same thing with clive . Are you for real ? Mach Says : There are trillions of unique living organisms , some possibly hundreds or thousands of years old , living on my bathroom counter , complete with genetic material , etc .. I wipe them down with windex and do n't think twice . What 's the problem here ? Mana'ia says : virus is simply a piece of DNA ( or RNA - Ribonucleic Acid ) that is wrapped in a protein coat . This is called the virus particle . Who said anything about viruses ? Another strawman . Bacteria Mana'ia . Bacteria are living , unique , fully classifiable LIFE , ORGANISMS . # 2 , Again , who is arguing that living cells are not living ? This entire line of reasoning looks to be strawman aimed at pro-choice advocates . Really , who is arguing against the fact that science classifies living cells as living ? # 3 Define distinct any way you like , it 's arbitrary , and irrelevant .""","""I had researched some stuff about viruses that was applicable about life in general because it is the only thing that is not defintely classified . So the argument was about life , the other stuff was just peripheral . Do n't make such a big deal about including other tings in it .""",DISAGREE,"""I see in the post above you argue the same thing with clive . Are you for real ?""","""So the argument was about life , the other stuff was just peripheral .""",,
10910,2919,"""becuase science condridicts what the church has told people . First there was that the earth wasent the center of the universe , that really disturbed the religous institutions of the time . Then geology and evolution which made it obvious that the worlds been around much longer then what is suggested by the bible , and that it wasnet created in such a short time .""","""Let 's give credit where credit is due . Science taught that the world was the centre of the universe . The leading scientists convinced churchmen to take allegorical passages of the Bible and re-interpret them as literal . The ancient Greeks , who were esteemed in Europe as the pre-eminent scientists of their day believed this . They also believed that people were made up of four elements . And taught this . Scientists backed up racism `` No rational man ( writes Thomas Huxley , a contemporary evolutionist ) , cognizant of the facts , believes that the average Negro is the equal , still less the superior , of the white man . And if this be true , it is simply incredible that , when all his disabilities are removed , and our prognathous relative has a fair field and no favor , as well as no oppressor , he will be able to compete successfully with his bigger-brained and smaller-jawed rival , in a contest which is to be carried out on by thoughts and not by bites. `` ( Thomas H. Huxley , `` Lay Sermans , Addresses and Reviews `` ( New York : Appleton , 1871 ) p. 20 . Huxley was arguing that blacks could not compete intellectually with Caucasians , even under equal and fair conditions . ) '' http : //www.goodschools.com/darwin.htm What then is your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""First there was that the earth wasent the center of the universe""","""The ancient Greeks , who were esteemed in Europe as the pre-eminent scientists""",,
10937,2924,"""Just the Fact a Renter on my Grandmothers land owning a gun stopped a would be bungler from breaking and entering . Thanks to tools humans can defend ourselves . Do we need to ban fertilizers just cause evil people used it to kill people in OKC and First WTC bombing .""","""If she was only facing a 'bungler ' , then what did she have to worry about . Sorry , could n't resist .""",DISAGREE,"""Just the Fact a Renter on my Grandmothers land owning a gun stopped a would be bungler from breaking and entering""","""If she was only facing a 'bungler ' , then what did she have to worry about . Sorry , could n't resist .""",,
10940,2924,"""Just the Fact a Renter on my Grandmothers land owning a gun stopped a would be bungler from breaking and entering . Thanks to tools humans can defend ourselves . Do we need to ban fertilizers just cause evil people used it to kill people in OKC and First WTC bombing .""","""If she was only facing a 'bungler ' , then what did she have to worry about . Sorry , could n't resist .""",DISAGREE,"""Just the Fact a Renter on my Grandmothers land owning a gun stopped a would be bungler from breaking and entering""","""then what did she have to worry about . Sorry , could n't resist .""",,
10942,2925,"""The only time , the girl will give the name ... is when the guy made promises , and refuses to marry ... refuses to care .. and the girl is left alone .""","""To clarify : is it the womans choice whether the guy is prosecuted after he has been named , or is it the states ? By what you 've said so far , it seems that all this law does is give woman the power to punish men if they get pregnant by them ; despite the fact that the woman was just as consenting as the man at the time of the coitus . There are also contraceptive paths for women that do n't involve condoms . If a woman gets pregnant because she forgot to take the pill that morning and always relied on that rather than on condoms to stop her getting pregnant , why should the man be punished ? The message here should be simple . If you do n't want an abortion , and are n't currently in a position where you can support your children , do n't have unprotected sex . At the moment , it is the woman 's choice alone whether she has an abortion or not , so it is the woman who has to look after the child if she is single after its birth . If you want to add men to that equation , you have to add them in both places - give them the legal right to 'have an abortion ' ( force their partner to have one ) , and make them legally responsible for the child if they do not do so . Then you have an entirely connected couple from coitus onwards ; both consenting to sex , both choosing not to have an abortion and both caring for the child after birth . I doubt that that law would be a popular one , either - but if you are going to force a man to take equal legal responsibility for a child , you have to give them equal legal opportunity to avoid it .""",DISAGREE,"""The only time , the girl will give the name ... is when the guy made promises , and refuses to marry ... refuses to care .. and the girl is left alone .""","""if you are going to force a man to take equal legal responsibility for a child , you have to give them equal legal opportunity to avoid it""",,
10949,2926,"""Yes they do Genius . And so do humans .""","""I know , but it is you that got it wrong : Quote :""",DISAGREE,"""Yes they do Genius . And so do humans .""","""I know , but it is you that got it wrong""",,
10958,2927,"""If I serve you Zachvac , will you bless me with great wealth ?""","""of course .""",AGREE,"""will you bless me with great wealth ?""","""of course""",,
10969,2929,"""I think you 'll find that Byzantine ( http : //www.byzcath.org/ ) , or Greek Catholic , are Catholic . Like the Maronite Church they practice Eastern Rites as Orthodox do , but they acknowledge the Pope as the head of the Church . * They even say the original `` Nicene Creed `` as we do .""","""Yes , the Byzantines are a Catholic Rite . The Catholic Church is divided into rites- there are seven I believe , the Roman , of course , being the largest . The Byzantine Catholics are an Eastern Catholic Rite , and as you said are almost identicle to the Orthodox Churches except that they acknowledge the Pope as the head of the Church . East to West , a website regarding all the churches of the Catholic Church , especially those of the east . Real quick , the Orthodox acknowledge the Pope as the successor of Peter , but not as the head of the Church . Am I correct ?""",AGREE,"""I think you 'll find that Byzantine ( http : //www.byzcath.org/ ) , or Greek Catholic , are Catholic .""","""Yes , the Byzantines are a Catholic Rite .""",,
10975,2930,"""You might be interested to know that Chicago had a black mayor from 1983 to 1987 -while the ban was in effect . You 're just playing the race card . So a law that is applied equally is discriminatory ? Sounds like doublethink . Other races would be better off unarmed too . Historically , it is as valid an argument as the argument that some state gun laws were racist after the Civil War . And they could have experienced more without gun control . You 're jumping to conclusions . What is unconstitutional is judges ' interference in matters best left to the legislature . I take a conservative view of the judiciary 's powers under the Constitution .""","""You are a foreigner yourself I recall you admitting . What do you lable that ?""",DISAGREE,"""You might be interested to know that Chicago had a black mayor from 1983 to 1987 -while the ban was in effect . You 're just playing the race card . So a law that is applied equally is discriminatory ? Sounds like doublethink .""","""You are a foreigner yourself I recall you admitting . What do you lable that ?""",,
11032,2938,"""A definition is the meaning of word that someone created using their own opinions .""","""How strange . It seems that Habbit 's definition of the word definition is meaningless . Physicists and chemists can define what they mean by the word `` carbon , `` but according to Habbit that is just their opinion . According to Habbit , carbon can be a chocolate candy meant to be eaten in a car . That may be his opinion and he considers it as valid as specific definitions assigned to words used by experts in any given field .""",DISAGREE,"""A definition is the meaning of word that someone created using their own opinions .""","""How strange . It seems that Habbit 's definition of the word definition is meaningless . ``""",,
11037,2938,"""A definition is the meaning of word that someone created using their own opinions .""","""How strange . It seems that Habbit 's definition of the word definition is meaningless . Physicists and chemists can define what they mean by the word `` carbon , `` but according to Habbit that is just their opinion . According to Habbit , carbon can be a chocolate candy meant to be eaten in a car . That may be his opinion and he considers it as valid as specific definitions assigned to words used by experts in any given field .""",DISAGREE,"""definition is the meaning of word that someone created using their own opinions .""","""Physicists and chemists can define what they mean by the word `` carbon , `` but according to Habbit that is just their opinion""",,
11042,2939,"""By Reduction to the Absurd : Suppose that God is in fact all-powerful . If he is all-powerful , then he can do anything . Yet this raises the question , `` If God can do anything , can he make a rock so hard that he himself can not break it ? `` If the answer is yes , then God can not break this rock , so there is something he can not do . If the answer is no , then he can not make such a rock , and thus there is also something he can not do . Therefore , it is impossible that God can do everything , and it is thus impossible for him to be all powerful . I ca n't claim originality for this proof , but I have never heard any good refutation of it , and yet people still act as if God is all powerful despite the absurdity of such a notion . If there is a refutation , then I 'd like to hear it .""","""The question is illogical . By declaring the existence of an all powerful God then saying God can not do something is not a comment on his powerfulness but rather the direct representation of his nature . Your question by its very statement does not test wether or not God is all powerful but wether or not God is comprehensible . See another thread for that topic . The statement that God is all powerful defines his nature . To state then that he can not do something outside of his nature as proof of the non existence of his nature is circular in logic .""",DISAGREE,"""Suppose that God is in fact all-powerful . If he is all-powerful , then he can do anything .""","""The question is illogical . By declaring the existence of an all powerful God then saying God can not""",,
11048,2939,"""By Reduction to the Absurd : Suppose that God is in fact all-powerful . If he is all-powerful , then he can do anything . Yet this raises the question , `` If God can do anything , can he make a rock so hard that he himself can not break it ? `` If the answer is yes , then God can not break this rock , so there is something he can not do . If the answer is no , then he can not make such a rock , and thus there is also something he can not do . Therefore , it is impossible that God can do everything , and it is thus impossible for him to be all powerful . I ca n't claim originality for this proof , but I have never heard any good refutation of it , and yet people still act as if God is all powerful despite the absurdity of such a notion . If there is a refutation , then I 'd like to hear it .""","""The question is illogical . By declaring the existence of an all powerful God then saying God can not do something is not a comment on his powerfulness but rather the direct representation of his nature . Your question by its very statement does not test wether or not God is all powerful but wether or not God is comprehensible . See another thread for that topic . The statement that God is all powerful defines his nature . To state then that he can not do something outside of his nature as proof of the non existence of his nature is circular in logic .""",DISAGREE,"""God is all powerful despite the absurdity of such a notion""","""The statement that God is all powerful defines his nature""",,
11052,2940,"""5 ) Everthing develops simultaniously . Abomination is the result half way through development , species either dies out or reverts to former self .""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously . Probably not . So back to the original question that you ducked with ad hoc arguments . What is Archaeopteryx . If it is a bird , why does it have a tail , grastalia , teeth , pre-orbital fenestra , and on and on . If it is n't a bird then why does it have feathers , opposable hallux , pneumatic bones , a furcula , and even a small carina in one specimen ? How can creationism explain Archaeopteryx ? http : //home.houston.rr.com/bybayouu/ ... graphica_1.jpg""",DISAGREE,"""Everthing develops simultaniously .""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously .""",,
11050,2940,"""5 ) Everthing develops simultaniously . Abomination is the result half way through development , species either dies out or reverts to former self .""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously . Probably not . So back to the original question that you ducked with ad hoc arguments . What is Archaeopteryx . If it is a bird , why does it have a tail , grastalia , teeth , pre-orbital fenestra , and on and on . If it is n't a bird then why does it have feathers , opposable hallux , pneumatic bones , a furcula , and even a small carina in one specimen ? How can creationism explain Archaeopteryx ? http : //home.houston.rr.com/bybayouu/ ... graphica_1.jpg""",DISAGREE,"""Everthing develops simultaniously""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously . Probably not .""",,
11049,2940,"""5 ) Everthing develops simultaniously . Abomination is the result half way through development , species either dies out or reverts to former self .""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously . Probably not . So back to the original question that you ducked with ad hoc arguments . What is Archaeopteryx . If it is a bird , why does it have a tail , grastalia , teeth , pre-orbital fenestra , and on and on . If it is n't a bird then why does it have feathers , opposable hallux , pneumatic bones , a furcula , and even a small carina in one specimen ? How can creationism explain Archaeopteryx ? http : //home.houston.rr.com/bybayouu/ ... graphica_1.jpg""",DISAGREE,"""Everthing develops simultaniously .""","""But it has never been claimed that everything developet simultaneously . Probably not .""",,
11059,2941,"""What if the jury is wrong ?""","""/hypothetical mode on . The State murders an innocent man . /hypothetical mode off .""",AGREE,"""What if the jury is wrong ?""","""The State murders an innocent man . /hypothetical mode off .""",,
11063,2942,"""So Simone , if the shooter had instead driven his Toyota Prius into a crowd , killing many as a result , would you call for banning Toyota Priuses ?""","""I think the correct term is Priuseses""",DISAGREE,"""if the shooter had instead driven his Toyota Prius into a crowd , killing many as a result ,""","""I think the correct term is Priuseses""",,
11071,2944,"""Yes , 1 ) It 's against Gods Law-an Abomination . 2 ) God loves the gay people but hates the Sin- there is help- I can get any gay person in contact with someone who used to be gay and has been set free and he will be willing to help , just let me know and i will get his websight to you and his phone number if you like . 3 ) Jesus loves you and you still have a chance to have questions answered that no one in the secular world can answer .""","""But in terms of legality and constitutionality , do you believe that they should still be prohibited ? Also , how can god hate ? I thought he was true love . Scratch that -- I thought he was unknowable . Thanks""",DISAGREE,"""It 's against Gods God loves the gay people but hates the""","""how can god hate ? I thought he was true love""",,
11092,2956,"""the problem then is , how could the universe begin in the midst of absolutely nothing ( no time , no matter , no space , no energy ) ? what could possibly trigger the universe 's beginning ? ( and then of course , where did these triggering events come from ? ) you will end up at negative infinity at some point""","""I think the currently popular belief is that time itself is limited . Space , time , energy , matter and laws all came into existence together . Of course that 's impossible for us to envisage ....""",AGREE,"""how could the universe begin in the midst of absolutely nothing ( no time , no matter , no space , no energy ) ? what could possibly trigger the universe 's beginning ? negative infinity""","""currently popular belief is that time itself is limited . Space , time , energy , matter and laws all came into existence together . Of course that 's impossible for us to envisage ....""",,
11100,2957,"""This crushes ToE at the most fundamental level .""","""You 're going to have to do a better job of explaining why . Mostly you talk gibberish .""",DISAGREE,"""This crushes ToE at the most fundamental level""","""Mostly you talk gibberish""",,
11106,2958,"""It 's kind of funny that they claim this happened , but ca n't get the woman to come out and say it ?""","""Not many women would say they had an abortion now , let alone back when it was illegal . It is an emotionally trying event . I can understand why she would n't for that reason alone . Another possibility is that the Administration is buying her silence , or it could be a combination of the two .""",DISAGREE,"""'s kind of funny that they claim this happened , but ca n't get the woman to come out and say it ?""","""Not many women would say they had an abortion now , let alone back when it was illegal .""",,
11111,2959,"""ABC aired a special on the effectiveness of CCW on campus . They had a student take a concealed weapons class ( who had never fired a gun before ) . After the class , they put him in a classroom with 20 or so people dressed in protective gear and face shields . They armed him with a simunition pistol ( a pistol that fires non-lethal rubber projectiles used for training ) . In the middle of a simulated college `` instruction period `` , a police SWAT team member charged in and started shooting . This was to conduct an `` experiment `` to see if students carrying concealed weapons was an effective means of stopping a mass killer . Guess what happened ? When the `` shooter `` busted into the classroom , the armed `` student `` immediately went for his gun , got it tangled in his shirt tail , and was shot with a simunition round . The conclusion reached by ABC and `` proven `` was that CCW was ineffective in a mass shooting scenario . DUH ! ! ! What a surprise ! A complete novice with only three hours of basic firearms experience was instantly killed by the TRAINED POLICE OFFICER WITH 15 YEARS EXPERIENCE AS A SWAT TEAM MEMBER ! Yup . Having an experienced CCW holder who is familiar with modes of carry , clearing concealment garments during presentation , basic defensive firing positions , and has practiced extensively with his firearm go against an emotionally imbalanced , drug or alcohol affected , common shooter is n't a real test . You have to put a young , inexperienced , trainee with THREE WHOLE HOURS of firearms familiarity up against a DECORATED SWAT TEAM MEMBER . This is considered `` scientific proof `` that CCW is no good by ABC .""","""What else can you expect from a leftist media . It would go against the agenda to show any thing else . After every liberal knows a firearm owner is a bumbling red neck , racist , sexist drooling dim wit .""",AGREE,"""ABC aired a special on the effectiveness of CCW on campus . `` This is considered `` scientific proof `` that CCW is no good by ABC .""","""What else can you expect from a leftist media . It would go against the agenda to show any thing else .""",,
11118,2960,"""Another theistic evolutionist that I would consider to be sincere could easily have the same ignorance of the Bible as Miller , but the difference is that Miller wrote a book attempting to compare the two ( evolution vs. Christianity ) and he has no excuse for being largely uninformed on one of the two subjects that he 's trying to compare .""","""Just as you are uninformed on the other subject ? I honestly believe that is the only reason you do n't at least partially accept evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""same ignorance of the Bible as Miller he has no excuse for being largely uninformed on one of the two subjects that he 's trying to compare .""","""Just as you are uninformed on the other subject ? I honestly believe that is the only reason you do n't at least partially accept evolution .""",,
11120,2960,"""Another theistic evolutionist that I would consider to be sincere could easily have the same ignorance of the Bible as Miller , but the difference is that Miller wrote a book attempting to compare the two ( evolution vs. Christianity ) and he has no excuse for being largely uninformed on one of the two subjects that he 's trying to compare .""","""Just as you are uninformed on the other subject ? I honestly believe that is the only reason you do n't at least partially accept evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""Another theistic evolutionist that I would consider to be sincere could easily have the same ignorance of the Bible as Miller""","""Just as you are uninformed on the other subject ?""",,
11133,2962,"""First , it neglects to mention that there is a moral code in every society , even atheistic ones . They may not claim divine source or similar for it , but informal rules of `` this is done , and this is NOT done `` emerge . Always .""","""And yet I alread showed what the `` moral code `` of atheistic societies has done for the world : II 128,168,000 VICTIMS : THE DEKA-MEGAMURDERERS 4 . 61,911,000 Murdered : The Soviet Gulag State 5 . 35,236,000 Murdered : The Communist Chinese Ant Hill 6 . 20,946,000 Murdered : The Nazi Genocide State 7 . 10,214,000 Murdered : The Depraved Nationalist Regime III 19,178,000 VICTIMS : THE LESSER MEGA-MURDERERS 8 . 5,964,000 Murdered : Japan 's Savage Military 9 . 2,035,000 Murdered : The Khmer Rouge Hell State 10 . 1,883,000 Murdered : Turkey 's Genocidal Purges 11 . 1,670,000 Murdered : The Vietnamese War State 12 . 1,585,000 Murdered : Poland 's Ethnic Cleansing 13 . 1,503,000 Murdered : The Pakistani Cutthroat State 14 . 1,072,000 Murdered : Tito 's Slaughterhouse IV 4,145,000 VICTIMS : SUSPECTED MEGAMURDERERS 15 . 1,663,000 Murdered ? Orwellian North Korea 16 . 1,417,000 Murdered ? Barbarous Mexico 17 . 1,066,000 Murdered ? Feudal Russia""",DISAGREE,"""it neglects to mention that there is a moral code in every society""","""yet I alread showed what the `` moral code `` of atheistic societies""",,
11134,2963,"""So many questions arise in the study of fossils ( paleontology ) that even many evolutionary paleontologists put little stock in the fossil record . Basing one 's belief in evolution on the shaky ground of paleontology can scarcely be considered scientific.35 `` We are about 120 years after Darwin and the knowledge of the fossil record has been greatly expanded . We now have a quarter of a million species but the situation has n't changed much . The record of evolution is still surprisingly jerky and , ironically , we have fewer examples of evolutionary transition than we had in Darwin 's time. `` - Dr. David M. Raup , Curator of Geology , Museum of Natural History , Chicago14 ( http : //www.straight-talk.net/evolution/fossil.htm )""","""Gee , gives the impression that Dr. David M. Raup , Curator of Geology , Museum of Natural History , Chicago , puts little stock in the fossil record and rejects evolution , helping support the preceding assertion that surely one ’ s belief in evolution based on paleontology can scarcely be considered scientific . But that ’ s not at all what Dr. Raup was stating . While Googling for a fuller quote , I ran across a page that showed how this – and many other – statements by Dr. Raup were distorted by Creationists . To start with , here is a fuller quote :""",DISAGREE,"""Basing one 's belief in evolution on the shaky ground of paleontology can scarcely be considered scientific.35""","""But that ’ s not at all what Dr. Raup was I ran across a page that showed how this – and many other – statements by Dr. Raup were distorted by Creationists . To start""",,
11137,2963,"""So many questions arise in the study of fossils ( paleontology ) that even many evolutionary paleontologists put little stock in the fossil record . Basing one 's belief in evolution on the shaky ground of paleontology can scarcely be considered scientific.35 `` We are about 120 years after Darwin and the knowledge of the fossil record has been greatly expanded . We now have a quarter of a million species but the situation has n't changed much . The record of evolution is still surprisingly jerky and , ironically , we have fewer examples of evolutionary transition than we had in Darwin 's time. `` - Dr. David M. Raup , Curator of Geology , Museum of Natural History , Chicago14 ( http : //www.straight-talk.net/evolution/fossil.htm )""","""Gee , gives the impression that Dr. David M. Raup , Curator of Geology , Museum of Natural History , Chicago , puts little stock in the fossil record and rejects evolution , helping support the preceding assertion that surely one ’ s belief in evolution based on paleontology can scarcely be considered scientific . But that ’ s not at all what Dr. Raup was stating . While Googling for a fuller quote , I ran across a page that showed how this – and many other – statements by Dr. Raup were distorted by Creationists . To start with , here is a fuller quote :""",DISAGREE,"""So many questions arise in the study of fossils ( paleontology ) that even many evolutionary paleontologists put little stock in the fossil record""","""Dr. David M. Raup , Curator of Geology , Museum of Natural History , Chicago , puts little stock in the fossil record and rejects evolution""",,
11151,2965,"""'' Let 's go ahead and do it your way by taking religion out of law . Is murder still illegal in your humanistic world ? Likely it is still illegal because even humanists realize that anarchy is not suitable for society . Then why is this not murder ? Look back to effects this has on women . That is also bad for society . And that affects us all. ``""","""Hey , thanks for the quote ! Am I published now ?""",DISAGREE,"""Is murder still illegal in your humanistic world ?""","""thanks for the""",,
11146,2965,"""'' Let 's go ahead and do it your way by taking religion out of law . Is murder still illegal in your humanistic world ? Likely it is still illegal because even humanists realize that anarchy is not suitable for society . Then why is this not murder ? Look back to effects this has on women . That is also bad for society . And that affects us all. ``""","""Hey , thanks for the quote ! Am I published now ?""",DISAGREE,"""Let 's go ahead and do it your way by taking religion out of law . Is murder still illegal in your humanistic world ? Likely it is still illegal because even humanists realize that anarchy is not suitable for society ``""","""Hey , thanks for the quote ! Am I published now ?""",,
11157,2966,"""The movement to teach YEC is non existant .""","""Right . It was thrown out of schools back in the 1960s , and again in the 1980s when attempts were made to dress creationism up in the jargon of science and call it `` Creation science. ``""",AGREE,"""The movement to teach YEC is non existant .""","""Right""",,
11174,2970,"""YOU clearly do n't understand how serious marijuana is . When you 're drunk , you do n't know your drunk . Same thing with being high .""","""So what does this have to do with the topic ? Alcohol is legal , marijuana is n't , but they both serve the same purpose ( getting high ) , so why should one be illegal and the other not ?""",DISAGREE,"""YOU clearly do n't understand how serious marijuana is""","""Alcohol is legal , marijuana is n't ,""",,
11178,2971,"""Russian women were provided cheap and easy abortions and these were 'more reliable ' than Soviet made condoms .""","""Wrong . It was Soviet women . The USSR no longer exists . Unless you believe that those godless commies are just playing possum ?""",DISAGREE,"""Russian women were provided cheap and easy abortions and these were 'more reliable ' than Soviet made condoms""","""Wrong . It was Soviet women .""",,
11187,2974,"""For example , Scalia stated in Heller : `` Nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on long-standing prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill , or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings , or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. ``""","""That 's because these questions were never , ever , EVER raised in the original Parker case . None of the six DC people who took the city to court possessed a felony record , they did n't bring up anything other than the fact that DC made it impossible for them to legally buy and own a handgun . That 's all the court addressed . If they addressed anything else in the Heller case it would 've been judicial activism , legislating from the bench .""",DISAGREE,"""the mentally ill , or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive""","""they did n't bring up anything other than the fact that DC made it impossible for them to legally buy and own a handgun""",,
11195,2983,"""Do you have any compassion ? Besides you have never answered my question .""","""Because this question is irrelevant .""",DISAGREE,"""have never answered my question""","""this question is irrelevant""",,
11197,2984,"""Then why do you believe in it ?""","""Believe in what ? If it helps - God 's love surpasses all logic . I have complete proof that God exists . From that point onward there is no need to argue with things that are deemed as logical . To me there 's more to life than the logical things .""",DISAGREE,"""why do you believe""","""Believe in what ?""",,
11209,2986,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God , ...""","""Actually , that story was an invention after the fact . It never happened . At least that is what the witnesses who were there said . Why do christians feel that it is OK to invent such stories to support their point ? Is n't that lying ? Is n't lying wrong ?""",DISAGREE,"""They shot a girl because she believed in God ,""","""that story was an invention after the fact . It never happened .""",,
11230,2990,"""I agree completely . These christians make up their mind that something is in the bible and whatever it says is what it says . It is so hard to change their opinions .""","""you know why ? because God touches our hearts like nothing you have ever felt before . it is amazing""",DISAGREE,"""I agree completely . These christians make up their mind that something is in the bible and whatever it says is what it says . It is so hard to change their opinions .""","""you know why ? because God touches our hearts like nothing you have ever felt before . it is amazing""",,
11253,2995,"""Your god is also the god of deceit . Why else would he erase all evidence of such a flood ? Why erase the bones from the animals that must have died as the emigrated from the arks resting place ? Answer those two and I 'll have lots more""","""Well to answer the first question ... not all evidence has been erased . In fact there is quite a bit of evidence for the flood . How do you explain remains of crabs and other sea creatures found in the same area inland as dinousaurs and other land dwelling creatures . The Grand Canyon is also evidence for the flood . A canyon of the same type was formed when Mt . St. Helens erupted when the snow and ice melted at the top and rushed down the slope . Even evolutionists have admitted that it looks just like the Grand Canyon , only on a smaller scale , and that it appears to have been created over millions of years but in fact it only took a couple of hours . For you to say that there isnt any evidence is a very ignorant thing because there is just as much evidence or more supporting the flood as there are people and things that dont support it . To answer the second question ... not all bones are fossilized . Bones do decompose . Also perhaps people just havent been looking in the right places . No one knows for sure where the arks true resting place is let alone the paths the animals took going away from the ark so there is no way anyone could start looking for bones even if they did exist . It is possible that they havent been just stumbled upon if they are still around to be stumbled upon . Even if i am wrong in what i have stated in my answers there isnt anything that can back up completely what you have implied in your questions .""",DISAGREE,"""is the of . all evidence a flood""","""there are people and things that dont support it . To answer the second question ... not all bones are fossilized""",,
11256,2996,"""Science could clear that question up with a little carbon 14 test to rule out recent exsitence : if there 's carbon in them bones you guys are screwed . Gee , I wonder why they do n't run these tests . Corruption ? Yes , that 's it ... corruption ...""","""Bingo . Old fossils can be corrupted ( contaminated , to be precise ) by contacting anything from human skin to pollen in the air . This would add a relatively large amount of carbon to the fossil and would indicate that the fossil is recent . It 's not hard to imagine this happening in the hands of inexperienced scientists ... * cough * Creationists * cough *""",AGREE,"""Science could clear that question up with a little carbon 14 test to rule out recent exsitence : if there 's carbon in them bones you guys are screwed . Gee , I wonder why they do n't run these tests . Corruption ? Yes , that 's it ... corruption ...""","""Bingo . Old fossils can be corrupted ( contaminated , to be precise ) by contacting anything from human skin to pollen in the air . This would add a relatively large amount of carbon to the fossil and would indicate that the fossil is recent""",,
11297,3010,"""Now firearm deaths in the US in 1999 totalled 28,874 of which more than 16,500 were suicides , 10,800 murders and the rest accidental or undetermined .""","""So what ? If somebody wants to die then they 'll kill themselves no matter what .""",DISAGREE,"""firearm deaths in the US in 1999 totalled 28,874 of which more than 16,500 were suicides ,""","""So what ? If somebody wants to die then they 'll kill themselves""",,
11298,3010,"""Now firearm deaths in the US in 1999 totalled 28,874 of which more than 16,500 were suicides , 10,800 murders and the rest accidental or undetermined .""","""So what ? If somebody wants to die then they 'll kill themselves no matter what .""",DISAGREE,"""firearm deaths""","""somebody wants to die then they 'll kill themselves no matter what""",,
11317,3014,"""I certainly would NOT want someone forced to do something against their religious beliefs . If I went to a public official and it were against their religious belief to perform a heterosexual civil ceremony , I 'd simply find someone that would , rather than try to force that person to do it . Here 's the corrected link , by the way : http : //www.breitbart.com/news/2006/11/14/D8LCTCSG0.html""","""And if people have a `` religious belief `` whereby they do n't think blacks should vote , or that interracial marriage should occur , should governmental officials who have those `` religious beliefs `` just be allowed to ignore their duty ? What if I had a religious belief that prevented me from performing my governmental tasks for Christians ? Should that be respected as well ? They are paid to do their job . People who get to pick and choose what their `` job `` should entail because of their religious beliefs should find another form of work . If when I was in the military , I had suddenly stood up and said , `` Woah ! Hey ! I joined the military but it is against my religious beliefs to hurt others , and this plan of action will hurt other people. `` Should that be respected and I keep my `` job `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""If I went to a public official and it were against their religious belief to perform a heterosexual civil ceremony , I 'd simply find someone that would , rather than try to force that person to do it .""","""They are paid to do their job . People who get to pick and choose what their `` job `` should entail because of their religious beliefs should find another form of work .""",,
11326,3016,"""But why take my word for anything ? Since we are talking about children , lets take a look at what pediatricians ( the American Academy of Pediatrics ) say .""","""No thanks ! I 'd rather not . My link above disclaims anything they have to say .""",DISAGREE,"""we are talking about children , lets take a look at what pediatricians""","""My link above disclaims anything they have to say""",,
11351,3021,"""Thank you Lurch . You have gotten to my point : Evolution ( as taught in modern public school textbooks ) is a religion , not a scientific fact ( as claimed by sarablaze ) .""","""So what you are saying is that even though you claimed to have studied evolution , you have not . I understand . In fact , my religion is not evolution . I even hold my religion in higher regard than to consider using it as an insult . Since you think that calling science a religion is an insult , your religion must be trivial and largely meaningless . But that aside , since you want to lump all of science into the word `` evolution `` so that you can reject it all at once , I 'm just going to use the word science . sarablaze is n't a scientist and , like you , has probably had very little scientific education . But I 'm going to try to explain to you again . A religion is held by faith . That means that it is not supported by actual evidence . On the other hand , science is not accepted by faith since it is built on a process of questioning and testing everything . There is nothing in science that I `` believe `` . Do I believe that the earth orbits the sun ? No . But when presented with the observations of the relative positions of the sun and planets , the most parsimonious explanation is that it is so . I accept that and will accept that until someone can present more evidence and a better explanation . That is true of all science . I do n't believe any of it but accept the explanations that have been tested that account for the observations . In science , by the way , the facts are the observations - not the theories . So the facts of gravity are the observations of things falling to earth and observations of the relative positions of the planets . The current theory of gravity only imperfectly explains those facts - it is part of the general theory of relativity developed by Einstein . In biology , the facts are that we observe living things to change over time . We even have facts from many different fields ( biogeography , genetics , molecular biology , population genetics , morphology , embryology , paleontology , and others ) that point to the fact that living things change over time . The explanations of the mechanics of those changes form the theory of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution ( as taught in modern public school textbooks ) is a religion""","""Since you think that calling science a religion is an insult , your religion must be trivial and largely meaningless . ``""",,
11349,3021,"""Thank you Lurch . You have gotten to my point : Evolution ( as taught in modern public school textbooks ) is a religion , not a scientific fact ( as claimed by sarablaze ) .""","""So what you are saying is that even though you claimed to have studied evolution , you have not . I understand . In fact , my religion is not evolution . I even hold my religion in higher regard than to consider using it as an insult . Since you think that calling science a religion is an insult , your religion must be trivial and largely meaningless . But that aside , since you want to lump all of science into the word `` evolution `` so that you can reject it all at once , I 'm just going to use the word science . sarablaze is n't a scientist and , like you , has probably had very little scientific education . But I 'm going to try to explain to you again . A religion is held by faith . That means that it is not supported by actual evidence . On the other hand , science is not accepted by faith since it is built on a process of questioning and testing everything . There is nothing in science that I `` believe `` . Do I believe that the earth orbits the sun ? No . But when presented with the observations of the relative positions of the sun and planets , the most parsimonious explanation is that it is so . I accept that and will accept that until someone can present more evidence and a better explanation . That is true of all science . I do n't believe any of it but accept the explanations that have been tested that account for the observations . In science , by the way , the facts are the observations - not the theories . So the facts of gravity are the observations of things falling to earth and observations of the relative positions of the planets . The current theory of gravity only imperfectly explains those facts - it is part of the general theory of relativity developed by Einstein . In biology , the facts are that we observe living things to change over time . We even have facts from many different fields ( biogeography , genetics , molecular biology , population genetics , morphology , embryology , paleontology , and others ) that point to the fact that living things change over time . The explanations of the mechanics of those changes form the theory of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""You have gotten to my point : Evolution ( as taught in modern public school textbooks ) is a religion""","""I do n't believe any of it but accept the explanations that have been tested that account for the observations""",,
11367,3024,"""I do n't think you 're stupid by any means ; the skill with which you have manipulated our discussions has been considerable .""","""* * Nor do I think you at all stupid . I do not debate stupid people , there is no challenge in it . Nor do I debate arrant foolishness and irrational notions such as biblical literalism . It 's no more challenging than shooting fish in a barrel , and no more satisfying than destroying a child 's faith in the tooth fairy . But I do take offence at you characterizing my ability to reason logically and to think with some originality as being nothing more than 'manipulation ' and sophistry .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think you 're stupid by any means""","""Nor do I think you at all stupid . I do not debate stupid people , there is no challenge in it .""",,
11368,3024,"""I do n't think you 're stupid by any means ; the skill with which you have manipulated our discussions has been considerable .""","""* * Nor do I think you at all stupid . I do not debate stupid people , there is no challenge in it . Nor do I debate arrant foolishness and irrational notions such as biblical literalism . It 's no more challenging than shooting fish in a barrel , and no more satisfying than destroying a child 's faith in the tooth fairy . But I do take offence at you characterizing my ability to reason logically and to think with some originality as being nothing more than 'manipulation ' and sophistry .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think you 're stupid by any means""","""Nor do I think you at all stupid . I do not debate stupid people , there is no challenge in it .""",,
11375,3026,"""im sorry he was killed""","""I 'm not . -- -""",DISAGREE,"""im sorry he was killed""","""I 'm not . -- -""",,
11390,3028,"""It is our contention that it 's the pro-death advocates who misrepresent the facts in order to justify their infanticidal proclivities and justifications as they release women of all personal responsibility and expect the innocent child to be sacrificed at the alter of their immoral lifestyle so they can continue to act irresponsibly .""","""So every woman who has an abortion lives an irresponsible life . Care to give any examples , or are you just spouting rubbish with no experience or knowledge whatsoever ?""",DISAGREE,"""It is our contention that it 's the pro-death advocates who misrepresent the facts in order to justify their infanticidal proclivities""","""So every woman who has an abortion lives an irresponsible life .""",,
11391,3028,"""It is our contention that it 's the pro-death advocates who misrepresent the facts in order to justify their infanticidal proclivities and justifications as they release women of all personal responsibility and expect the innocent child to be sacrificed at the alter of their immoral lifestyle so they can continue to act irresponsibly .""","""So every woman who has an abortion lives an irresponsible life . Care to give any examples , or are you just spouting rubbish with no experience or knowledge whatsoever ?""",DISAGREE,"""they release women of all personal responsibility and expect the innocent child to be sacrificed at the alter of their immoral lifestyle so they can continue to act irresponsibly .""","""So every woman who has an abortion lives an irresponsible life .""",,
11393,3029,"""Originally posted by American Where did the dirt come from ?""","""Well , the short version is that shortly after the big bang , the universe was filled by a hot quark plasma . As it expanded and cooled , the process of nucleosynthesis produced the primordial elemental abundance , primarily hydrogen , with some deutirium , helium , and lithium . The physics is well understood , and verified by observation . Quantifying uncertainties in primordial nucleosynthesis without Monte Carlo simulations At roughly a billion years of age , stars and galaxies formed , some fraction of the stars that formed were massive supergiants , that burned up their hydrogen into other elements , up to the atomic number of iron . This occurred at a tremendous rate and in a few more billion years , these stars went supernova and exploded . Prior to going supernova , these stars go through a phase where the outer layers of the star are shed , providing ways to transport the lighter elements away from the star . You can see this in the following link : Hubble Chemically Analyzes the Ring around Supernova 1987A The trememdous radiation of the supernova permits the formation of elements with atomic numbers higher than iron . The force of these explosions scattered the newly created elements , creating vast gas and dust clouds . Eventually , the shockwave of another explosion initiated the collapse of one of these clouds , and the spinning hydrogen cloud begins to heat , eventually initiating nuclear fusion , and becoming our sun . As the sun began to increase it 's heat output , the volatile remains of the accretion disk are driven away from the inner portion of the solar system , leaving mostly heavy elments . Comets bombarded the inner solar system , transporting water , carbon , and amino acids to the newly forming earth , making dirt . In short , a truely wonderful creation .""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by American Where did the dirt come from ?""","""As it expanded and cooled , the process of nucleosynthesis produced the primordial elemental abundance , primarily hydrogen , with some deutirium , helium , and lithium .""",,
11395,3029,"""Originally posted by American Where did the dirt come from ?""","""Well , the short version is that shortly after the big bang , the universe was filled by a hot quark plasma . As it expanded and cooled , the process of nucleosynthesis produced the primordial elemental abundance , primarily hydrogen , with some deutirium , helium , and lithium . The physics is well understood , and verified by observation . Quantifying uncertainties in primordial nucleosynthesis without Monte Carlo simulations At roughly a billion years of age , stars and galaxies formed , some fraction of the stars that formed were massive supergiants , that burned up their hydrogen into other elements , up to the atomic number of iron . This occurred at a tremendous rate and in a few more billion years , these stars went supernova and exploded . Prior to going supernova , these stars go through a phase where the outer layers of the star are shed , providing ways to transport the lighter elements away from the star . You can see this in the following link : Hubble Chemically Analyzes the Ring around Supernova 1987A The trememdous radiation of the supernova permits the formation of elements with atomic numbers higher than iron . The force of these explosions scattered the newly created elements , creating vast gas and dust clouds . Eventually , the shockwave of another explosion initiated the collapse of one of these clouds , and the spinning hydrogen cloud begins to heat , eventually initiating nuclear fusion , and becoming our sun . As the sun began to increase it 's heat output , the volatile remains of the accretion disk are driven away from the inner portion of the solar system , leaving mostly heavy elments . Comets bombarded the inner solar system , transporting water , carbon , and amino acids to the newly forming earth , making dirt . In short , a truely wonderful creation .""",DISAGREE,"""Where did the dirt come from ?""","""the universe was filled by a hot quark plasma . As it expanded and cooled ,""",,
11408,3031,"""The main creationist lie is that people use evolution in our current society as an excuse to do bad things . Sorry folks I have never met somebody that does this so bringing it up just convinces me you are a liar .""","""The comment of someone with an IQ of about 48 . Ray M .""",DISAGREE,"""The main creationist lie is that people use evolution in our current society as an excuse to do bad things . Sorry folks I have never met somebody that does this so bringing it up just convinces me you are a liar .""","""The comment of someone with an IQ of about 48 .""",,
11423,3034,"""I have a little doubt about this cat diet story . My great grandmother had cats , and she always fed them cooked chicken from the farm . I remember her showing me how she used the chicken parts . My grandfather raised kittens from this cat family and he fed them store cat food in cans , which had been cooked . ( My grandmother passed away before I knew her . She drowned the unwanted kittens , according to family stories . ) But I remember playing with the cats . And then my mother inherited cats from the same litters and she feeds them dry cat food and canned cat food . The cats I grew up with in our home had litters , and so our present cat is about 8 or 9 generations along and is perfectly healthy . All along they were house cats and never allowed outside to catch birds or mice , so far as my mother recallls . ( There is only one kitty now , because my Dad does n't like cats and my sister developed an allergy , which seemed related to cats -- but she is over this now . ) All of them were fed cooked food . So the story about cats does not ring true with me . BTW , all the cats I knew from my grandfather to present lived to about 16-20 years old . And none of them died due a specific disease .""","""Well either the Pottenger cat/pig/mouse thing is either the truth or they made the whole thing up . I think we are seeing a mirror of this experiment in society today ... please notice how diseases are striking people at younger and younger ages .... it 's not going to get any better , either because people are not taught the reality about nutrition -- and that what they eat not only effects them , but their offspring as well .""",AGREE,"""I have a little doubt about this cat diet story . My great grandmother had cats , and she always fed them cooked chicken from the farm .""","""Well either the Pottenger cat/pig/mouse thing is either the truth or they made the whole thing up .""",,
11429,3035,"""To a woman who does not want to be pregnant ...""","""If a woman does not want to be pregnant , she can abstain from sex . It works !""",DISAGREE,"""To a woman who does not want to be pregnant""","""If a woman does not want to be pregnant , she can abstain from sex""",,
11439,3037,"""Can someone explain to me how Noah took mosquitoes on the ark ? Those abominations need sitting water to hatch and develop . A boat being toss around like a toy is hardly going to have pools of sitting water . Plus what did all of the insectivores eat for 40 days ?""","""Actually , the storm lasted for 40 days and 40 nights . The ark was actually afloat for a year or so . So I guess the answer is that the ark had all kinds of pestilent insects winging about and biting and stinging the occupants . The problem is , how did these aquatic breeders actually propagate in the feces and urine infested bilge of the ark ?""",AGREE,"""Those abominations need sitting water to hatch and develop""","""So I guess the answer is that the ark had all kinds of pestilent insects winging""",,
11447,3039,"""It 's simple , really . This grand experiment in self rule and governing was based on the ideals of many of the world 's great phiosophers . Make no mistake , many of the framers of our laws were voracious readers of history and world governments through the years , and as such , realized quite early , laws , outlining the functions of government , needed to be spelled out as much as possible to ensure that government was fair and equitable for all .""","""So the founding fathers and their work is basicy viewed as an authority based on their competence ?""",DISAGREE,"""It 's simple , really . This grand experiment in self rule and governing was based on the ideals of many of the world 's great phiosophers .""","""So the founding fathers and their work is basicy viewed as an authority based on their competence ?""",,
11463,3041,"""Yep . This is a good thing , might as well make use of a dead person . Too bad we ca n't experiment on dead human bodies w/o permission . It would benefit society a lot more if we could .""","""And LIVING ones even more ... ok Adolph .""",DISAGREE,"""This is a good thing , might as well make use of a dead person""","""ok Adolph .""",,
11465,3042,"""I am by nature and training and experience argumentative . Its a way of life .""","""just curious ... what do you do for a living ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am by nature and training and experience argumentative .""","""just curious ... what do you do for a living ?""",,
11471,3043,"""Only one God does exist when it comes to politics in the western world .""","""So I got ta ask , how does that prove that evolution is allegedly atheistic when there are many other Gods out there ?""",DISAGREE,"""Only one God does exist when it comes to politics in the western world .""","""how does that prove that evolution is allegedly atheistic when there are many other Gods out there ?""",,
11474,3043,"""Only one God does exist when it comes to politics in the western world .""","""So I got ta ask , how does that prove that evolution is allegedly atheistic when there are many other Gods out there ?""",DISAGREE,"""Only one God does exist when it comes to politics in the western world .""","""So I got ta ask , how does that prove that evolution is allegedly atheistic when there are many other Gods""",,
11477,3044,"""Yes it never happened . it is a myth""","""Or do you think that the Big Bang did n't happen ?""",DISAGREE,"""Yes it never happened . it is a myth""","""do you think that the Big Bang did n't happen ?""",,
11481,3044,"""Yes it never happened . it is a myth""","""Or do you think that the Big Bang did n't happen ?""",DISAGREE,"""it is a myth""","""you think that the Big Bang did n't happen ?""",,
11487,3045,"""Sorry , but I have to say this . Who the hell gives a flaming turd what Freud thought ? He was a coke head quack who pulled a bunch of bunk out of his butt and called it psychotherapy . ..""","""Many Atheists I have encountered call God a human effort in wish fullfillment . THat seeking God and salvation through Jesus Christ is an illusion . Many of these folks are quoting Freud whether they know it or not . Ha ! In the end , he was a Theist !""",DISAGREE,"""Sorry , but I have to say this . Who the hell gives a flaming turd what Freud thought ?""","""THat seeking God and salvation through Jesus Christ is an illusion . Many of these folks are quoting Freud whether they know it or not . Ha ! In the end , he was a Theist !""",,
11498,3047,"""Have you ever had an abortion ?""","""Good point . Touche . Though lots of folks have not had abortions . Certainly most men have not . I was just growing tired of a certain little poster 's uninformed opinions of sexual activity . My post was intended to be a little playful . If it missed the mark , mea culpa .""",AGREE,"""Have you ever had an abortion ?""","""Though lots of folks have not had abortions .""",,
11506,3049,"""Yes , as I ’ ve been debating about for the last four pages .""","""Okay it ’ s confusing enough without bring in new terms . Let ’ s just leave it at human beings .""",DISAGREE,"""debating about for the last four pages .""","""confusing enough without bring in new terms . Let ’ s just leave it at human beings .""",,
11508,3049,"""Yes , as I ’ ve been debating about for the last four pages .""","""Okay it ’ s confusing enough without bring in new terms . Let ’ s just leave it at human beings .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , as I ’ ve been debating about for the last four pages .""","""Okay it ’ s confusing enough without bring in new terms .""",,
11513,3050,"""It is in the Bible , which is the inspired word of God . It is presented as an actual event - as opposed to an allegorical or metaphorical tale . Therefore it is true .""","""Ca n't argue with this illogic .""",DISAGREE,"""It is in the Bible , which is the inspired word of God . It is presented as an actual event""","""Ca n't argue with this illogic .""",,
11517,3050,"""It is in the Bible , which is the inspired word of God . It is presented as an actual event - as opposed to an allegorical or metaphorical tale . Therefore it is true .""","""Ca n't argue with this illogic .""",DISAGREE,"""which is the inspired word of God . as opposed to an allegorical or metaphorical tale""","""Ca n't argue with this illogic .""",,
11531,3053,"""Since we already had one example of a Creationist lowlife tactic in the George Gaylord Simpson quote , I decided to skim the site and see if I could find another . I did .""","""Do n't you think this would fit the 'Creationism is nothing but lie 's thread a bit better ? Although I notice The Skeptic making disparaging remarks about your examples , it seems he attacks you more than deal with the well documented examples you have .""",DISAGREE,"""we already had one example of a Creationist lowlife tactic in the George Gaylord Simpson quote , I decided to skim the site and see if I could find another .""","""Do n't you think this would fit the 'Creationism is nothing but lie 's thread a bit better ?""",,
11556,3061,"""The definitions : The actual law : As should be plainly obvious , this is an almost total ban on all semi-automatic weapons in the City of Columbus , not just those that have been traditionally considered 'assault weapons ' ( automatic firearms ) . Note definition ( L ) ( 2 ) . Almost every semi-automatic pistol is included in that definition . Whether an all-out ban on guns is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , or an assault-weapons ban is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , it should be obvious to any reader that the Columbus city council is trying to push through an all-out ban on guns by calling this an assault weapons ban .""","""-- -- -- -- At first glance this statute seems to merely track the now-expired federal AW ban , and I would watch out to see if its supporters are selling it as such . It is in reality far more restrictive than the expired federal ban ! I don ’ t know if it is being sold as merely a  “ common sense state enactment of the old federal ban that expired and no longer protects us ,  ” but if it is , then here is why that argument is fraudulent : The old federal ban was far less restrictive because it defined an AW ( in addition to some firearms deemed automatically an AW ) as having 2 or more of the cosmetic features , while this new statute says it needs only 1 cosmetic feature . That is a significant difference which allows this proposed law to capture many more firearms than the old federal ban . It looks like the old federal ban definitions were used as a template for this new statute , but whoever wrote it decided to change it down to 1 offending cosmetic feature knowing full well it would ban far more firearms . If I were you I would let my legislator know this difference . For comparison , here are the AW definitions from the old federal AW ban : 18 U.S.C . § 921 is a listing of how terms are defined in the firearms offenses portion of the Code , and it defines a federally banned AW as follows : ( 30 ) The term `` semiautomatic assault weapon `` means - ( A ) any of the firearms , or copies or duplicates of the firearms in any caliber , known as - ( i ) Norinco , Mitchell , and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs ( all models ) ; ( ii ) Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil ; ( iii ) Beretta Ar70 ( SC-70 ) ; ( iv ) Colt AR-15 ; ( v ) Fabrique National FN/FAL , FN/LAR , and FNC ; ( vi ) SWD M-10 , M-11 , M-11/9 , and M-12 ; ( vii ) Steyr AUG ; ( viii ) INTRATEC TEC-9 , TEC-DC9 and TEC-22 ; and ( ix ) revolving cylinder shotguns , such as ( or similar to ) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12 ; ( B ) a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of - ( i ) a folding or telescoping stock ; ( ii ) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon ; ( iii ) a bayonet mount ; ( iv ) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor ; and ( v ) a grenade launcher ; ( C ) a semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of - ( i ) an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip ; ( ii ) a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender , flash suppressor , forward handgrip , or silencer ; ( iii ) a shroud that is attached to , or partially or completely encircles , the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned ; ( iv ) a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded ; and ( v ) a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm ; and ( D ) a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of - ( i ) a folding or telescoping stock ; ( ii ) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon ; ( iii ) a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds ; and ( iv ) an ability to accept a detachable magazine . ( 4 ) for any person , other than a licensed importer , licensed manufacturer , licensed dealer , or licensed collector , to transport in interstate or foreign commerce any destructive device , machinegun ( as defined in section 5845 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 ) [ this being the tie-in to the NFA tax ban on machine guns ] Note , by the way , that these definitions still exist in the US Code and have NOT been repealed or have expired . What expired was a portion of another statute , which made it a crime to possess these weapons . For reference , that statute is 18 U.S.C . § 922 [ which lists several acts committed with firearms considered to be crimes . The AW ban added the following language , which has since expired but still exists in the Code ] : ( v ) ( 1 ) It shall be unlawful for a person to manufacture , transfer , or possess a semiautomatic assault weapon . ( 2 ) Paragraph ( 1 ) shall not apply to the possession or transfer of any semiautomatic assault weapon otherwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of the enactment of this subsection . ( 3 ) Paragraph ( 1 ) shall not apply to - ( A ) any of the firearms , or replicas or duplicates of the firearms , specified in Appendix A to this section , as such firearms were manufactured on October 1 , 1993 ; ( B ) any firearm that - ( i ) is manually operated by bolt , pump , lever , or slide action ; ( ii ) has been rendered permanently inoperable ; or ( iii ) is an antique firearm ; ( C ) any semiautomatic rifle that can not accept a detachable magazine that holds more than 5 rounds of ammunition ; or ( D ) any semiautomatic shotgun that can not hold more than 5 rounds of ammunition in a fixed or detachable magazine . The fact that a firearm is not listed in Appendix A shall not be construed to mean that paragraph ( 1 ) applies to such firearm . No firearm exempted by this subsection may be deleted from Appendix A so long as this subsection is in effect . ( 4 ) Paragraph ( 1 ) shall not apply to - ( A ) the manufacture for , transfer to , or possession by the United States or a department or agency of the United States or a State or a department , agency , or political subdivision of a State , or a transfer to or possession by a law enforcement officer employed by such an entity for purposes of law enforcement ( whether on or off duty ) ; ( B ) the transfer to a licensee under title I of the Atomic Energy Act of 1954 for purposes of establishing and maintaining an on-site physical protection system and security organization required by Federal law , or possession by an employee or contractor of such licensee on-site for such purposes or off-site for purposes of licensee-authorized training or transportation of nuclear materials ; ( C ) the possession , by an individual who is retired from service with a law enforcement agency and is not otherwise prohibited from receiving a firearm , of a semiautomatic assault weapon transferred to the individual by the agency upon such retirement ; or ( D ) the manufacture , transfer , or possession of a semiautomatic assault weapon by a licensed manufacturer or licensed importer for the purposes of testing or experimentation authorized by the Secretary . ( w ) ( 1 ) Except as provided in paragraph ( 2 ) , it shall be unlawful for a person to transfer or possess a large capacity ammunition feeding device . ( 2 ) Paragraph ( 1 ) shall not apply to the possession or transfer of any large capacity ammunition feeding device otherwise lawfully possessed on or before the date of the enactment of this subsection . ( 3 ) This subsection shall not apply to - ( A ) the manufacture for , transfer to , or possession by the United States or a department or agency of the United States or a State or a department , agency , or political subdivision of a State , or a transfer to or possession by a law enforcement officer employed by such an entity for purposes of law enforcement ( whether on or off duty ) ; ( B ) the transfer to a licensee under title I of the Atomic Energy Act of 1954 for purposes of establishing and maintaining an on-site physical protection system and security organization required by Federal law , or possession by an employee or contractor of such licensee on-site for such purposes or off-site for purposes of licensee-authorized training or transportation of nuclear materials ; ( C ) the possession , by an individual who is retired from service with a law enforcement agency and is not otherwise prohibited from receiving ammunition , of a large capacity ammunition feeding device transferred to the individual by the agency upon such retirement ; or ( D ) the manufacture , transfer , or possession of any large capacity ammunition feeding device by a licensed manufacturer or licensed importer for the purposes of testing or experimentation authorized by the Secretary . ( 4 ) If a person charged with violating paragraph ( 1 ) asserts that paragraph ( 1 ) does not apply to such person because of paragraph ( 2 ) or ( 3 ) , the Government shall have the burden of proof to show that such paragraph ( 1 ) applies to such person . The lack of a serial number as described in section 923 ( i ) of this title shall be a presumption that the large capacity ammunition feeding device is not subject to the prohibition of possession in paragraph ( 1 ) .""",AGREE,"""The actual law : As should be plainly obvious , this is an almost total ban on all semi-automatic weapons in the City of Columbus ,""","""At first glance this statute seems to merely track the now-expired federal AW ban , and I would watch out to see if its supporters are selling it as such""",,
11569,3063,"""Welcome to America where democracy only works when the people are opposing lawlessness and sin ... since the 1950s there has been an exponential progression to kick God out of the land .""","""Actually it started when they wrote the consitution - you can practice your religion , but you ca n't make me do it or even give a flying monkeys XXX about it .""",DISAGREE,"""an exponential progression to kick God out of the land .""","""make me do it or even give a flying monkeys XXX about it .""",,
11577,3065,"""Oddly enough I found Thomas 's opinion to be most compelling . The dissent was surprisingly weak ... even for a dissent . It did n't even really make sense . The actual opinion was kinda weak but I got bored reading it so I skimmed the second half . Ha .""","""Thomas favored incorporation through priviledges and immunities , correct ? That likely makes the most sense but the Court probably feared how far that could go , since the logical conclusion is the abolition of individual State law . Not that the `` substantive due process `` is well defined , but likely the Court felt they could rein in any excesses through that interpretation .""",AGREE,"""The actual opinion was kinda weak but I got bored reading it so I skimmed the second half .""","""favored incorporation through priviledges and immunities , correct ? That likely makes the most sense but the Court probably feared how far that could go""",,
11590,3067,"""Now name one country with universal socialized healthcare with a population of 300 million citizens modulus , just one if you can . Your exemplar countries are tiny in comparison to us so lets get realistic and compare apples to apples for once , ok ?""","""The population of the European Union is 501,259,840 .""",AGREE,"""Your exemplar countries are tiny in comparison to us""","""The population of the European Union is 501,259,840 .""",,
11605,3070,"""Max has outed himself as a hillbilly who can not spell or incorporate correct punctuation . I wonder if this effects his ability to know what evidence is ? Apparently so since he believes man evolved . '' attacking in `` LOL ! Ray M .""","""Sorry Ray , but your `` effects `` should be `` affects `` . Perhaps you need lessons in the English language too ?""",DISAGREE,"""Max has outed himself as a hillbilly who can not spell or incorporate correct punctuation . I wonder if this effects his ability to know what evidence is""","""Ray , but your `` effects `` should be `` affects `` . Perhaps you need lessons in the English language too ?""",,
11622,3073,"""The most practical triumph of science over religion is not the acceptance of the fact of evolution by the pope , or of the acknowledgement of a heliocentric solar system ... it was in the seventeenth centuary , when churches began to put up lightning conductors""","""I was reminded of this , also ...""",AGREE,"""The most practical triumph of science over religion is not the acceptance of the fact of evolution by the pope , or of the acknowledgement of a heliocentric solar system ... it was in the seventeenth centuary , when churches began to put up lightning conductors""","""I was reminded of this , also ...""",,
11630,3074,"""Evolutionists often claim  “ Evolutionary biology has moved past Darwin ’ s model ” but they never specify what it has  “ moved to ” .  “ Natural selection ” doing some mysterious thing to a collection of genomic accidents ” is the only materialist explanation I ’ ve heard for the origin of biological novelty . ( How could  “ natural selection ” ( premature death ) , possibly create anything ?  “ Natural selection ” can only select that which is already created , and RM & amp ; NS is the only detailed materialistic explanation I ’ ve heard suggested for such creation . All other explanations include some form of intelligent , purposeful organization . If that organizing intelligence is internal , that would make it no less no less intelligent . Theism is compatible with the concept of a natural organizing intelligence , but theism is not the only alternative to materialism . For instance : All living systems have some ability to respond to stimuli , intelligently and purposefully . Inanimate objects do not . All living systems have some of our own ability to override automatic function in times of emergency , and make novel , fallible , spontaneous , subjective choices . Living systems have ability to monitor their own level of function , recognize weaknesses , and to explore novel responses . Furthermore if function is not immediately restored , intelligently organized biological systems have the ability to explore other possibilities immediately , without being removed from action by  “ natural selection ” . If some people choose to call the creative intelligence of nature  “ god ” , I have no objection . As an agnostic , I don ’ t speculate about the origin of mass , energy , electromagnetism , gravity , creative intelligence -- or anything else . Fanatical evangelical atheists would be the only people who feel obligated to do battle against the term  “ intelligent design ” . http : //30145.myauthorsie.com/""","""Well for one thing , Darwin did not know about genetics . He knew there was a mechanism , but did not know what that mechanism could be . As for everything else , you are making what is known as a 'straw man ' , also assertions without evidence , and just plain bad logic .""",DISAGREE,""" Natural""","""Darwin did not know about genetics""",,
11636,3076,"""The legal middle ground is called `` civil unions. ``""","""You know , I would be fine with that as long as it were truly a middle ground . If that term were used equally among straights as well as gays . But it 's just a term . The same as with the term `` marriage. `` It 's just a term . Just a word . Personally I feel the government needs to get out of the business of marriage altogether . Let the legal term be agreed upon unilaterally .""",AGREE,"""middle ground `` civil""","""I would be fine with that as long as it were truly a middle ground But it 's just a term . The same as with the term `` marriage. `` It 's just a term . Just a word .""",,
11669,3082,"""the fact that the world is governed by laws of logic is exactly what eliminates god . since logic exists , god is not needed . i suppose you assume that logic needs an intelligent initiator of some sort in order for it to exist ? why ? logic dictate that adding quantity causes that quantity to increase . this would occur with or without god 's existence and needs no devine intervention to be consistently true . logic dictates that a system in equilibrium has a total of equal opposite forces and that the sum of all the forces in the system is 0. this is not contingent on god 's presmce either . the more explanations of phenomena that can be logically explained , the less god is needed . god and logic are indirectly proportionate . an increase in logic causes a decrease in god""","""Good has nothing do with logic . Explain what good and logic have in common ? ? ? ? The Christian theistic worldview can account for the laws of logic by stating that they come from God . God is transcendent ; that is , He is beyond the material universe being its creator . God has originated the laws of logic because they are a reflection of His nature . Therefore , the laws of logic are absolute . The are absolute because there is an absolute God . The atheistic worldview can not account for the laws of logic/absolutes , and must borrow from the Christian worldview in order to rationally argue .""",DISAGREE,"""world is governed by laws of logic adding quantity causes that quantity to increase""","""Good has nothing do with logic God is transcendent""",,
11675,3082,"""the fact that the world is governed by laws of logic is exactly what eliminates god . since logic exists , god is not needed . i suppose you assume that logic needs an intelligent initiator of some sort in order for it to exist ? why ? logic dictate that adding quantity causes that quantity to increase . this would occur with or without god 's existence and needs no devine intervention to be consistently true . logic dictates that a system in equilibrium has a total of equal opposite forces and that the sum of all the forces in the system is 0. this is not contingent on god 's presmce either . the more explanations of phenomena that can be logically explained , the less god is needed . god and logic are indirectly proportionate . an increase in logic causes a decrease in god""","""Good has nothing do with logic . Explain what good and logic have in common ? ? ? ? The Christian theistic worldview can account for the laws of logic by stating that they come from God . God is transcendent ; that is , He is beyond the material universe being its creator . God has originated the laws of logic because they are a reflection of His nature . Therefore , the laws of logic are absolute . The are absolute because there is an absolute God . The atheistic worldview can not account for the laws of logic/absolutes , and must borrow from the Christian worldview in order to rationally argue .""",DISAGREE,"""since logic exists , god is not needed . i suppose you assume that logic needs an intelligent initiator""","""The Christian theistic worldview can account for the laws of logic""",,
11688,3084,"""German For Assault Rile Right ? I Read Up On The History Of The Ak47 I Find It Fscinating As All Hell , Now I Own One ! With All The Bells And Wistles .""","""Get the red star arms trigger ..... Freekin awsome . Get the ultimack foward rail and mount an OKO red dot ... Get a KVAR synthetic stock set ( I got OD green ! ) TOO cool .... Then get 5k rounds and shoot the hell out of it ! Here check it out ( notice the surefire on a barrell mount that set up was less than $ 75 bucks total ! ) Picture was takin in PA My hammer of liberty""",AGREE,"""On The History Of The Ak47 I Find It Fscinating As All Hell""","""Get the ultimack foward rail and mount an OKO red dot""",,
11700,3085,"""An intelligent designer would design a system to produce the product as easily as possible . After the singularity was designed there is simply nothing left to do but sit back and enjoy the show .""","""would this be considered intelligent design ? to me it would be like winding up a top , loading it with paint , and then letting it spin on paper to create a painting . the process is deliberately set in motion , but the painting itself is random and not deliberate . where the paint falls is not by design , even though the overall pattern would be . anyway , to answer the question , there are lots of people who believe in a creator as well as evlution , so the beliefs are not mutually exclusive . the problem is that christianity depends upon the account of genesis being true . spontaneous origin is mutually exclusive to genesis , but evolution by itself is not necessarily . but evolution poses other problems such as the age of the earth and the existence of dinosaurs that creationists are stumped by . in order to belief in evolution , you must , at the very least , disregard the genesis account . and disregarding genesis automatically invalidates christianity . but it doesnt necessarily invalidate the existence of a creator . pretty wierd , huh ?""",DISAGREE,"""intelligent designer would design a system to produce the product as easily as possible""","""where the paint falls is not by design , even though the overall pattern would be .""",,
11723,3087,"""From memory we spent one or two classes on it . We talked about black moths became more common after pollution and how Larmack was dismissed because there is no way for say a giraffe parent to pass on the fact it was always stretching its neck to its offspring . This was hardly contraversial and the television teachs me far more anyway . How was evolution presented at your school .""","""You know , I can not even remember if we covered it in middle school or high school biology . I do remember learning about Mendel and his genetics , but I swear I ca n't remember if we even mentioned Darwin 's name . If we spent any time on it at all , it was very little . Our biology classes were mostly devoted to taxonomy , anatomy/physiology , and cellular machinery .""",AGREE,"""memory we spent one or two classes on This was hardly contraversial and the television teachs me far more anyway""","""we covered it in middle school or high school biology""",,
11749,3100,"""I 'm just impressed this type of experiment was done at all .""","""So SS . Please explain it all to me . Please show that you are not conclusion jumping and making unwarranted extrapolation based on poor understanding of the material . In other words , show me that you understand by explaining the research to me . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm just impressed this type of experiment was done at all .""","""So SS . Please explain it all to me""",,
11763,3104,"""Senate to vote on concealed weapons measure - Yahoo ! News So what kind of message is the NRA sending ? That it does n't really matter if people who carry around deadly weapons are able to hit a target at the shooting range or if they understand the law about when they can legally use their weapons or if they have drinking problems and sometimes get in fights ? The NRA talks about respecting the right of self defense but it 's clear they want rights without responsibilities . If they really believed in self defense then it seems that they would be pushing for legislation that required people that carry to obtain a minimum level of training so that they would be in a better position to defend themselves rather than supporting legislation that undermines state gun laws . Now come the slippery slope arguments or the `` well it 's a right `` arguments ....""","""Oh goodie , same MO . First a biased claim repeated on Yahoo from canned propaganda source , VPC with a few quotes from staunch marxists that would like to ignore the Second Amendment and the entire Constitution , then you include the suppositions and dire warnings which have never come true but you are not finished yet . Your quote contains the usual lies about training and education plus an appeal to interfere with State Rights which 34 States have specifically stated their support of through their State AG . Not enough yet ? '' well it 's a right `` is no longer an argument , it is fact . Read Heller v D.C. and the myriad of cases including 35 Supreme Court cases that have always held the Second Amendment protects those individual rights . Even Roe v Wade states the rights found in the BOR such as ... `` the right to keep and bear arms `` to be a fundamental right . What you have is an unConstitutional right being demeaned by a person who swore an oath to protect and defend it ... making them/him a traitor .""",DISAGREE,"""The NRA talks about respecting the right of self defense but it 's clear they want rights without responsibilities . ``""","""Oh goodie , same MO . First a biased claim repeated on Yahoo from canned propaganda source '' `` ...""",,
11768,3105,"""I think a more telling question would be , why the hell would you rather feel constantly threatened than feel safe ? It seems completely idiotic to me . Smiley""","""And now you say that gun owners are cowards ?""",DISAGREE,"""why the hell would you rather feel constantly threatened than feel safe ?""","""And now you say that gun owners are cowards ?""",,
11794,3111,"""And that fear could motivate the criminals to be armed themselves- thus putting the public in more danger . Such a fear could start an arms race . Try looking at the big picture .""","""Stop telling me to look at the big picture when you 've had both of your eyes gouged out ! Your entire statement here is beyond stupid . If the criminals felt that the only time to be armed was when their intended victims could fight back , then the criminals in DC would never be armed and the police would n't have needed to introduce gun shot sensors in the city . But since DC was the murder capital of the United States , that says an absence of hard targets is n't a guarantee that the abusers will play fair and not use weapons .""",DISAGREE,"""And that fear could motivate the criminals to be armed themselves- thus putting the public in more danger .""","""If the criminals felt that the only time to be armed was when their intended victims could fight back ,""",,
11798,3112,"""Biomorphs are an embarrassing attempt to explain just how a complex structure such as an eye might come about by gradual mutations , except they only do this by fooling you into believing the program mimics a natural possibility - when it ca n't , not when you are running the program and interfering at will .""","""no they are not . you quote a web site that is not dawkin 's interpretations of biomorphs and suggest that the web site 's interpretation is what dawkins created biomorphs for . it is outlines very clearly in `` the blind watchmaker `` as to what limitations should be put on the biomorphs when comparing them to real life . again i say to reclaim integrity admit that dawkins never suggested that biomorphs should be considered as a model for evolution or natural selection , and there was only one main point to be taken from them ( small mutations are more likely to produce benefits than large mutations ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Biomorphs are an embarrassing attempt to explain just how a complex structure such as an eye might come about by gradual mutations , except they only do this by fooling you into believing the program""","""no they are not . you quote a web site that is not dawkin 's interpretations of biomorphs and suggest that the web site 's interpretation is what dawkins created biomorphs for .""",,
11817,3116,"""Democrats have consistently lead the charge for gay equality , consistently opposed by Republicans .""","""And yet , in this case , your candidate emphatically says no to supporting gay marriage . And you are n't outraged by that ? That 's what I do n't understand . The article focused on Palin 'needing to clarify ' , but did n't even take Biden to task for being against gay marriage !""",DISAGREE,"""Democrats have consistently lead the charge for gay equality , consistently opposed by Republicans .""","""And yet , in this case , your candidate emphatically says no to supporting gay marriage .""",,
11834,3119,"""Why would such a scheme exist ? People do n't create conspiracies on a whim ; they exist to achieve a goal , specifically some sort of gain that can not be achieved legitimately . At first glance , there seems to be no gain to be made by adoption of ToE : not money nor power nor reputation .""","""Because all scientists hate god , this is a fact .""",DISAGREE,"""Why would such a scheme exist ? People do n't create conspiracies on a whim ;""","""Because all scientists hate god , this is a fact .""",,
11836,3119,"""Why would such a scheme exist ? People do n't create conspiracies on a whim ; they exist to achieve a goal , specifically some sort of gain that can not be achieved legitimately . At first glance , there seems to be no gain to be made by adoption of ToE : not money nor power nor reputation .""","""Because all scientists hate god , this is a fact .""",DISAGREE,"""they exist to achieve a goal , sort of gain""","""Because all scientists hate god , this is a fact""",,
11858,3124,"""I bet he is on his yearly hunting trip""","""Well Im not hunting animals""",DISAGREE,"""I bet he is on his yearly hunting trip""","""Well Im not hunting animals""",,
11867,3126,"""Your post was fine until you started into the `` demonizing `` bit . Why did you feel the need to get in that dig ? It 's sad that the pro-choice movement has resorted to portraying a desire to protect the life of the unborn as `` demonizing `` women . Intellectual dishonesty .""","""Well is n't the beilef commonly held that women will be damned if they commit abortion unless they repent ? I think that veiw is primarily the one doing the demoniaing is n't it ? - `` I may be going to hell in a bucket .... `` But at least I stand up for what I believe .""",DISAGREE,"""the pro-choice movement has resorted to portraying a desire to protect the life of the unborn as `` demonizing `` women .""","""Well is n't the beilef commonly held that women will be damned if they commit abortion unless they repent ?""",,
11908,3137,"""The issue of whether or not gay marriage is a 'human ' / 'civil ' right is begging the question ...""","""Certainly , because with calm empathy you can casually address such a matter simply because the struggle does not pertain to you personally . To be able to put into question the love of another human being is simply not only alarming in nature , but damning to the very definition of love , equality , and freedom in creation of man .... And to trump this as a question of morality only serves as a mask to curtail the prejudice objections one personally has to a ceremony , right , and relationship that person will not even be personally affected by ....""",DISAGREE,"""The issue of whether or not gay marriage is a 'human ' / 'civil ' right is begging the question ...""","""be able to put into question the love of another human being is simply not only alarming in nature , but damning to the very definition of love , equality , and freedom in creation of man""",,
11909,3137,"""The issue of whether or not gay marriage is a 'human ' / 'civil ' right is begging the question ...""","""Certainly , because with calm empathy you can casually address such a matter simply because the struggle does not pertain to you personally . To be able to put into question the love of another human being is simply not only alarming in nature , but damning to the very definition of love , equality , and freedom in creation of man .... And to trump this as a question of morality only serves as a mask to curtail the prejudice objections one personally has to a ceremony , right , and relationship that person will not even be personally affected by ....""",DISAGREE,"""The issue of whether or not gay marriage is a 'human ' / 'civil ' right is begging the question ...""","""Certainly , because with calm empathy you can casually address such a matter simply because the struggle does not pertain to you personally .""",,
11922,3139,"""As to whether he can be/do all those things you listed ; if he is the almighty omnipotent deity that is claimed , then he can be all those things and more . He can be any and all gods ever worshipped and ever will be worshipped . He can be the greatest of the great and most wretched of all ( at the same time ) . And all this before breakfast . It is only the feeble imaginations of mankind that limit him ( which is n't that surprising , given that they created him ) . Smiley""","""Well now , there you go . . . .RIGHT ON ! !""",AGREE,"""He can be any and all gods ever worshipped and ever will be worshipped .""","""Well now , there you go""",,
11929,3141,"""It 's hard for me to believe that people in your movement do n't know that generally , people 's view on a political/ideological issue is a different matter than whether or not they would save their life or help them . Surely you all are n't THAT out of touch with the way people are .""","""You see , that 's the problem : `` generally `` . You obviously know little or nothing of how prejudice works in this country .""",DISAGREE,"""people 's view on a political/ideological issue is a different matter than whether or not they would save their life or help them .""","""generally `` . You obviously know little or nothing of how prejudice works in this country .""",,
11930,3141,"""It 's hard for me to believe that people in your movement do n't know that generally , people 's view on a political/ideological issue is a different matter than whether or not they would save their life or help them . Surely you all are n't THAT out of touch with the way people are .""","""You see , that 's the problem : `` generally `` . You obviously know little or nothing of how prejudice works in this country .""",DISAGREE,"""people 's view on a political/ideological issue is a different matter than whether or not they would save their life or help them .""","""You obviously know little or nothing of how prejudice works in this country .""",,
11940,3143,"""And the reason for this is they do not accept the notion that the environment can cause a mutation . Thus , they simply chicken out when it comes to any testing that would falsify their theory . However , what they DO do , is resort to confusing people by playing around with bacteria and other assorted organisms in the lab .""","""Scientists do not want to ( and/or are not allowed to ) do experiments on animals that will kill some of them . All of the evidence that you will find will be based on experiments that do not harm animals ( except , of course , for insects ) .""",DISAGREE,"""by playing around with bacteria and other assorted organisms in the lab .""","""Scientists do not want to ( and/or are not allowed to ) do experiments on animals that will kill some of them""",,
11950,3145,"""Shh shhh it 's ok mellow mellow mellow . Relax you have managed to go from legalizing gay marriage to a collapse of our legal system and the downfall of man 's ability to reason and govern himself in two paragraphs . Maybe gay people would like to enjoy some of the happiness you get from your marriage and same as you that happiness is worth the oppressiveness incurred as a result . You may have more in common with gay people than you think .""","""I was just following your logic to its ultimate logical conclusion . Liberals do n't give a damn about individual freedom ; they want governmental control over all aspects of your life . They want gov't control of healthcare because they think we 're too dumb to fend for ourselves . They want to indoctrinate our kids in school because they do n't trust parents to be parents . The list of liberal intrusisms into our lives is endless . And I have no problem with gays , just their attempts to redefine marriage .""",DISAGREE,"""You may have more in common with gay people than you think .""","""was just following your logic to its ultimate logical conclusion""",,
11957,3147,"""Organic Evolution : the origin of life""","""So you do n't believe that life had an origin ! WOW so you think its always been present on the Earth ? Not even the bible goes that far ! And you fail to account for the observation that there IS life .""",DISAGREE,"""Organic Evolution : the origin of life""","""So you do n't believe that life had an origin !""",,
11977,3152,"""I remember looking at the classic evolutionary latter ( ape to man ) poster and thinking .. yep , that 's how He did it . Makes perfect sense . Dang , He 's smart .""","""So what is the bible then ? Simply a nice story-book for you to read from ? If Genesis is simply a representative story from which we can interpret the actions of god to mean natural selection and evolution , what about the ten commandments ? It always amazes me to hear people with positions like this insist that it is okay to play fast and loose with their interpretations of Genesis or the Arc , but God really does hate the homosexuals . It says so in Leveticus , right ? So it must be word perfect truth ... This bit about the origins of the earth ? Oh , we just interpret that as god designing evolution . But that part about people burning in hell for eternity , that 's true , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""I remember looking at the classic evolutionary latter ( ape to man ) poster and thinking .. yep , that 's how He did it . Makes perfect sense . Dang , He 's smart .""","""So what is the bible then ? Simply a nice story-book for you to read from ? If Genesis is simply a representative story from which we can interpret the actions of god to mean natural selection and evolution , what about the ten commandments ?""",,
11990,3155,"""I believe we have a human responsibility to one another .""","""No , you believe we have a human responsibility to the government . There is a huge difference between charity and the government threatening people with jail or death if they do n't hand over their wallets .""",DISAGREE,"""we have a human responsibility to one another .""","""you believe we have a human responsibility to the government""",,
11989,3155,"""I believe we have a human responsibility to one another .""","""No , you believe we have a human responsibility to the government . There is a huge difference between charity and the government threatening people with jail or death if they do n't hand over their wallets .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe we have a human responsibility to one another .""","""No""",,
11992,3156,"""and also , when you say you have experience , do you mean in `` real `` debating ( HS and College ) or just on this and other sites ?""","""We often have debates in our Sixth Form ( College ) , but I have also attended several `` debate camps `` - each a weekend long . I also attended a day at oxford which was made up of a few formal debates and just a bit of teaching on Philosophy and Classics . Apart from that - I have been on debate forums for quite some time , and I 've gained experience from there too .""",DISAGREE,"""when you say you have experience , do you mean in `` real `` debating ( HS and College ) or just on this""","""I have been on debate forums for quite some time , and I 've gained experience from there too .""",,
11998,3157,"""2 ) Reptile develops wings . These thing are completely useless on a dino , they evolve right the hell away .""","""Why would they be useless ? They are n't useless on birds ? And how is this qustion different in any meaningful way from the above ? Are n't wings forelimbs with feathers ? It seems that soaring or gliding or even faster running would be extremely useful .""",DISAGREE,"""These thing are completely useless on a dino , they evolve right the hell away .""","""Why would they be useless ?""",,
12003,3172,"""Another Opinion `` mental existence `` - meaning any rudimentary mind in the form of rudimentary thought , emotion , sense of self , perception of pain or other senses , etc . My assumption is the scientific assumption that our minds are determined by the functioning of the brain and by its state of development and health . Of course , one could argue the religious view of a soul external to our bodies determining at least part of our mental existence , but there is no evidence to support any such religious view - it is all taken on faith . Where abortion rights are concerned , separation of Church and state would not allow for women 's rights to be restricted based on a religious argument .""","""No disagreements . Something left out ( probably because it was assumed ) , is memory . What you call mental existence I would say is a description of what causes or leads to personal identity . To me it is self evident that there is no person or personhood without a personal identity . There might be disagreement about what the particulars are concerning how to identify a personal identity , but it seems self evident to me that a mind is required , and without a brain , there is no mind , so a brain is required . It seems to me self evident that if there is no brain , there is no person . Of course , others will disagree . Some say that the unique DNA of a zygote is enough for personal identity , but if this is true , identical twins ( with identical DNA ) would have to share one personal identity , and one soul . In the case of a chimera , two souls/unique DNA in two zygotes , would have to blend into one person/soul . ( No , most chimeras are not schizophrenic ) . I believe an integral part of [ personal identity > mental existence > personhood ] is memory . Whether it is short term , or long term , without memory there is no sense of self . ( I may be stating the obvious , but you never know . ) ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ It is not clear if your list of indicators for mental existence is  “ one will suffice ” , or  “ several are required ” . I don ’ t think it matters all that much , but I ’ m not sure , just wondering .""",AGREE,"""My assumption is the scientific assumption that our minds are determined by the functioning of the brain and by its state of development and health .""","""No disagreements . What you call mental existence I would say is a description of what causes or leads to personal identity .""",,
12012,3174,"""I 'm very curious to see how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude .""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did . I do n't see it .""",DISAGREE,"""how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did . I do n't see it .""",,
12013,3174,"""I 'm very curious to see how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude .""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did . I do n't see it .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm very curious to see how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude .""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did . I do n't see it .""",,
12015,3174,"""I 'm very curious to see how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude .""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did . I do n't see it .""",DISAGREE,"""how many other pro-abortion advocates will chime in and defend this mothers morally corrupted attitude .""","""The bahavior is only `` morally corrupted `` if there is , in fact , something wrong with what they did""",,
12019,3175,"""Well done Nato ! I ca n't believe you took the time to Fisk all of these stupid points . Originally Posted by NATO 556 Sarah Brady is a straw purchaser then . She knowingly broke the law by buying a gun for somebody else instead of letting them go through the NICS check system . Who knows what else she 's done and who she 's supplied guns to . Showing the RIDICULOUS nature of some gun laws ! Even the Antis ca n't ( or maybe wo n't ) obey them ! Ridiculous paperwork traps that even caught and surprised the Queen of gun control !""","""`` A story in some early editions of yesterday 's Daily News incorrectly reported that gun-control advocate Sarah Brady may have skirted Delaware 's gun laws when she bought a rifle for her adult son but did not declare who was going to own the weapon . '' The Delaware Department of Justice initially insisted to The News that gun purchasers must declare who the weapon was intended for so that person 's background could be checked . Yesterday , a spokeswoman for the Delaware Department of Justice said it misinterpreted the law and that Brady was not obligated to state that the gun was for her son as long as he was legally qualified to own a firearm . '' In addition , a spokesman for Brady said , 'Sarah Brady told the gun store that the gun was for her son and filled out the forms that they asked her to fill out . ' '' The News regrets the error. `` CORRECTION""",DISAGREE,"""She knowingly broke the law by buying a gun for somebody else instead of letting them go through the NICS check system""","""The Delaware Department of Justice initially insisted to The News that gun purchasers must declare who the weapon was intended for so that person 's background could be checked""",,
12024,3176,"""Carla ( Gennipher you may comment if you like ) , How long has artificial contraception been around ?""","""For sure about 6000 years .""",AGREE,"""Carla ( Gennipher you may comment if you like ) , How long has artificial contraception been around ?""","""For sure about 6000 years .""",,
12046,3180,"""If the Chicago handgun ban were truly discriminatory then it likely would have been struck down under the equal protection clause- a part of 14th Amendment which you do n't seem to care if states such as Arizona violate in their attempt to deal with illegal immigration . Disarmed blacks may have been victimized by the KKK while state governments looked the other way during the late 19th Century but fast forward to 2010- now blacks are much more likely to victimized by other blacks than by racist whites . If the intent behind the Chicago handgun ban is truly racist then why allow blacks to own rifles ? I recently read that you can learn to shoot a rifle more accurately in one hour than you could shoot a handgun in a lifetime of practice . Areas such as D.C. and Chicago have large populations of blacks and some argue that restrictive gun laws help fight crime in such areas while others argue that it makes crime worse . It 's part of the modern gun control debate- a debate that I think true judicial conservatives would stay out of as Justice Stevens pointed out .""","""Actually it has been prosecuted under 42 UDC 1981 and 1986 . It dates back to the first Civil Rights ruling in , oh , about 1866 but I would have to check the date to be certain . That is one reason Thomas and Stevens felt it was incorporated under the P or I clause . What is your point about the rifle comment ? Did it just sound cool so you threw that out there for the cats ?""",DISAGREE,"""a part of 14th Amendment""","""under 42 UDC 1981 and 1986 .""",,
12058,3183,"""There are a few fictional works which addressed this possibility and brought up interesting points . One is Aldous Huxley 's book Brave New World . In it , people were grown in artificial wombs , not born , and they could be genetically designed . In the book , a high level official of this society mentions to the main character that an experiment had been tried in which all the people made were brilliant , athletic and beautiful - anyway , characteristics that we admire in people ( nothing was said about picking their moral character ) . They ended up killing each other in competition for the better jobs and for leadership since nobody was willing to play the subservient menial role . Therefore , this society purposely grew humans who were at different levels ( some very mentally deficient ) to supply a distributions of people who could fit the distribution of roles necessary for society . Therefore , on an individual level , I do n't have much of a problem with genetic engineering ( assuming that we really fully knew what we are doing , which is doubtful since many unforseen side effects could occur ) . However , on a societal level , it could be very problematic .""","""Well , I did n't really mean to go that far . But I 'm talking about problems like that all worked out , thought about previously , and that the problem was worked out . I 'm talking more about , what if you could make laborers stronger , scientists smarter , and rid us of physical and mental abnormalities ( such as down syndrome , narcolepsy , etc. ) . I do n't think of making everyone the same for that reason . I 'm just saying , what if there was a way to better society without going overboard ? If the problems were worked out , which I 'm sure they will be , what would your moral view on it be ?""",AGREE,"""and One is Aldous Huxley 's book Brave New World . In it , people were grown in artificial wombs , not born , and they could be genetically designed They ended up killing each other in competition for the better jobs""","""Well , I did n't really mean to go that far .""",,
12059,3183,"""There are a few fictional works which addressed this possibility and brought up interesting points . One is Aldous Huxley 's book Brave New World . In it , people were grown in artificial wombs , not born , and they could be genetically designed . In the book , a high level official of this society mentions to the main character that an experiment had been tried in which all the people made were brilliant , athletic and beautiful - anyway , characteristics that we admire in people ( nothing was said about picking their moral character ) . They ended up killing each other in competition for the better jobs and for leadership since nobody was willing to play the subservient menial role . Therefore , this society purposely grew humans who were at different levels ( some very mentally deficient ) to supply a distributions of people who could fit the distribution of roles necessary for society . Therefore , on an individual level , I do n't have much of a problem with genetic engineering ( assuming that we really fully knew what we are doing , which is doubtful since many unforseen side effects could occur ) . However , on a societal level , it could be very problematic .""","""Well , I did n't really mean to go that far . But I 'm talking about problems like that all worked out , thought about previously , and that the problem was worked out . I 'm talking more about , what if you could make laborers stronger , scientists smarter , and rid us of physical and mental abnormalities ( such as down syndrome , narcolepsy , etc. ) . I do n't think of making everyone the same for that reason . I 'm just saying , what if there was a way to better society without going overboard ? If the problems were worked out , which I 'm sure they will be , what would your moral view on it be ?""",AGREE,"""on a societal level , it could be very problematic""","""what if there was a way to better society without going overboard ?""",,
12067,3185,"""In fact , the only feasible way that a tree-swinging monkey could change into a man would be through some freak accident ( aka -- random mutations . )""","""Well , if you breed them , you could get taller monkeys with less hair ( and other humanlike characteristics ) . Even so , it would take a long time .""",DISAGREE,"""through some freak accident ( aka -- random mutations . )""","""you could get taller monkeys with less hair""",,
12072,3186,"""Ok , so you are aboard an airplane full of people heading to New York or any major city in the United States . Would you be comfortable knowing that someone who wants to crash the plane can legally bring a gun on board , thus making it easier for him to follow through with his plan ? Or would you rather make it more difficult for him to hijack the plane ? Your choice .""","""Actually even with a concealed weapons permit , I do not believe you are allowed to possess a firearm on board an aircraft . The Second Amendment protects the right to OWN firearms and other weapons , and to use them in self defense . It does not grant a person the right to bring a gun on a plane , nor do I see how it could be interpreted to mean such a thing . Where do you get this question ? And terrorists already recieve their weapons illegally . It is NOT LEGAL for any country to sell weapons to a terrorist country/nation/organization . But somehow they always get their hands on weapons . Hmm ... I do n't think they go out to their local shooting range and pick up a 9mm pistol . While it is possible ( if they passed the backgroud check that is ) , its not probable . Because they would still have the illegal avenue to pursue the purchase of firearms with . If you want to ban firearms , the only thing you 're doing is taking away the rights of citizens to defend themselves . Terrorists and criminals in general will find a way to obtain the firearms they desire no matter what laws are in effect . Llike they would follow the laws anyways ? They ARE terrorists you know . )""",DISAGREE,"""would you rather make it more difficult for him to hijack the plane ?""","""The Second Amendment protects the right to OWN firearms and other weapons , and to use them in self defense . It does not grant a person the right to bring a gun on a plane , nor do I see how it could be interpreted to mean such a thing .""",,
12079,3187,"""Er , no . That is AnswersinGenesis ' reasoning . Are you having difficulties reading ? It seems so , as you are unable to distinguish between what a poster says and what an organization they are quoting says .""","""Generally , when someone posts an article without a disclaimer , they agree with the findings and the reasoning of the article provided . Besides , your statement does not change the fact that the reasoning provided is foolish .""",DISAGREE,"""Are you having difficulties reading ?""","""your statement does not change the fact that the reasoning provided is foolish .""",,
12074,3187,"""Er , no . That is AnswersinGenesis ' reasoning . Are you having difficulties reading ? It seems so , as you are unable to distinguish between what a poster says and what an organization they are quoting says .""","""Generally , when someone posts an article without a disclaimer , they agree with the findings and the reasoning of the article provided . Besides , your statement does not change the fact that the reasoning provided is foolish .""",DISAGREE,"""AnswersinGenesis reasoning reading poster""","""article agree with the findings reasoning of the article provided your statement does not change the fact that the reasoning provided is foolish""",,
12081,3188,"""This is the essense of natural selection - and goes in nicely with the Biblical account of our origins , i.e . variation within a kind and that kind 's have the ability to only lose information - not gain it .""","""Well , since you have natural selection completely wrong , it must not go too well with the Biblical account . By the way , now you have introduced another word that has no meaning in the context . What is a `` kind. `` Please be specific so that I will be able to recognize a `` kind. `` Please show why a `` kind `` only has the ability to lose information .""",DISAGREE,"""natural selection goes in nicely Biblical account our origins kind lose information""","""natural selection must not go too well Biblical account the way no meaning `` `` kind""",,
12090,3189,"""How can we test it ?""","""I thought we were assuming it was true ?""",DISAGREE,"""How can we test it""","""I thought we were assuming it was true ?""",,
12097,3190,"""It 's a lot easier to kill someone with a gun than a cigarette or a beer .""","""And it 's a lot easier to kill people in a crowd when using a car or a truck than with a gun . The entire `` Easier to kill `` argument is rather irrelevant , because there 's always something that makes it easier to kill somebody with when compared to something else . You 've also failed to show why your statement is justification for attempting to ban a legal product . So how about you explain that .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's a lot easier to kill someone with a gun than a cigarette or a""","""So how about you explain that .""",,
12103,3191,"""Now , creationists are going to want to try to change the subject away from providing a product . That just shows they have nothing .""","""And what does Marc do ? Try to change the subject .""",DISAGREE,"""want to try to change the subject away they have nothing .""","""what does Marc do ? Try to change the subject .""",,
12120,3195,"""Does one have to be a FFL to sell a firearm one owns ? '' 33 states do not restrict private , intrastate sales of firearms at gun shows in any manner. `` Gun show - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""","""And we 've already presented , countless times in the past , that all evidence points to less than 1 % of guns recovered from crimes being traced back to gun shows . Ergo there is no emergency that needs to be addressed by forcing private citizens to carry out documented transfers in a business setting .""",DISAGREE,"""Does one have to be a FFL to sell a firearm one owns ? '' 33 states do not restrict private , intrastate sales of firearms at gun shows in any manner. ``""","""And we 've already presented , countless times in the past , that all evidence points to less than 1 % of guns recovered from crimes being traced back to gun shows .""",,
12134,3198,"""The NT was compiled in the late 4th Century AD , being criticised at the time for the overtly political choice of which texts were included as Canon and which were rejected to become the Apocrypha . Further it is now generally accepted that the text was altered at a later date to comply with OT prophesy . Like The Saxon Chronicles , King Arthur or Robin Hood there is too much romanticisation and mythologising to be certain of virtually anything in the text .""","""Actually the Apocrypha is made up of pre-Christian texts , and late 4th century is a bit of a stretch for the new testament , certainly all its component texts were widely accepted by the 2nd century . I do n't whether it is `` generally accepted `` that the text was altered , it seems to me that you are projecting your own views based on the hypotheses of some scholars on to Biblical scholarship in general .""",DISAGREE,"""The NT was compiled in the late 4th Century AD , being criticised at the time for the overtly political choice of which texts were included as Canon and which were rejected to become the Apocrypha . Further it is now generally accepted that the text was altered at a later date to comply with OT prophesy .""","""Actually the Apocrypha is made up of pre-Christian texts , and late 4th century is a bit of a stretch ``""",,
12139,3199,"""so 1 vote for fact""","""Well sort of not .""",DISAGREE,"""1 vote for fact""","""Well sort of not .""",,
12151,3203,"""how can family values shift in a nation withint 10 years ? ? 10 years ago america would have never thought they wouldve needed to put Marriage Ammendments on the ballot let alone have less than 60 % of the people actually vote for it . ITs sad to see a nation degrade exponentially fast and not to mention the people 's consciences getting seared at the same time . Its kinda like the germans after slow and steady progress of the nazi party changed the whole nation 's perspective on the jews . people that were against the nazi party 5 years prior found themselves turning jews into concentration camps . i see a similar progression beginning in america to the point that this comment itself will be bashed by those on here whose conscience has been seared to the point that they think 2 men being married is ok . If everyone in the world was gay , the human race would become extinct . Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote""","""So gay people , in your opinion , have no right to form the families of their choice ? So you are defending the continued oppression of gay people ? We are sick of conservative family types . We are tired of the closet . The phrase `` we are mad as hell and we are not going to take it any more `` applies . I see in your response the comming of the camps to lock and exterminate gay people . It is that type of thought , that jews were subhuman , that led to the final solution . As it is here with conservatives and religious right nuts , who believe gay people are sub human sickos in need of curing or killing .""",DISAGREE,"""how can family values shift in a nation withint 10 years ? ? people that were against the nazi party 5 years prior found themselves turning jews into concentration camps""","""So gay people , in your opinion , have no right to form the families of their choice ? `` I see in your response the comming of the camps to lock and exterminate gay people""",,
12154,3205,"""`` No . Probability arguments such as those Behe uses are pretty meaningless because there is no basis on which to calculate them. `` - i take it you have n't read the book ? '' All we can measure is average observed mutation rates in populations , which are commensurate with the speed of genetic diversification seen in primate lineages . In fact , such rates of diversification are used as the basis of the molecular clock to infer dates of separation of lineages when the fossil record is n't clear. `` -ok `` Behe does n't understand probability . If he were tossing coins , he 'd be absolutely astonished by the sequence of heads and tails he obtained , because each sequence is vastly improbable. `` - I think you are doing yourself a disservice by by such silly claims . If random mutations are `` random `` do n't you agree that the probablity of 2 mutations happening on the same gene at the same time is pretty low ? And that 2 mutations happening on the same gene at different times is lower than one mutation on the gene ? '' He 'd probably attribute that to ID , too . However , biological evolution is based on cumulative and dependent probabilities , not independent ones , which makes them difficult to calculate . The reason biologists do n't care much for Behe is that he 's demonstrated a lack of understanding of some pretty basic concepts in science. `` '' Since the probability is incalculable , then no. `` - So the theory that RM initiated the changes that led from from monkey to man is unfalsifiable ? '' We infer that mutations are random because directed mutations have n't been observed except under very limited circumstances . If some gene or DNA sequence undergoes a point mutation , who is to say it happened because of some random cosmic ray , or because the Creator decided in his infinite wisdom to suspend the laws of nature for that moment and poke molecules around ? The answer is no-one , because no-one can calculate the relevant probabilities . However , the Creator hypothesis is scientifically barren because it explains everything , and hence explains nothing at all. ``""","""I do n't agree with this either/or binary logic .""",DISAGREE,"""However , the Creator hypothesis is scientifically barren because it explains everything , and hence explains nothing at""","""I do n't agree with this either/or binary logic .""",,
12161,3214,""" “ Most support abortion for the `` extreme `` cases only ( in the US ) . So does President Bush. ”""","""Then none of them are pro-life . To be pro-life means you respect the right to life for the fetus . You can ’ t just pick and choose when abortion is right .""",DISAGREE,"""Most support abortion for the `` extreme `` cases only ( in the US ) . So does President Bush.Â""","""Then none of them are pro-life . To be pro-life means you respect the right to life for the fetus . You can ’ t just pick and choose when abortion is right .""",,
12171,3215,"""A British couple held hostage by pirates for more than three months have told of brutal treatment at the hand of their captors who they say are perilously close to killing them . In separate telephone interviews with CNN affiliate ITN , Paul and Rachel Chandler pleaded for help and spoke of their fears that they were just days away from death . An emotional Rachel Chandler also spoke of how she thought `` dying would actually be an easy way out `` and how she wanted to see her husband `` at least once before we die. `` The Chandlers were taken by pirates from their 38-foot yacht , the Lynn Rival , just days after setting sail from the Seychelles islands for Tanzania . Their captors initially demanded a ransom of $ 7 million , but the British government -- in line with longstanding policy -- has refused to pay . '' Please , please find a way of helping us because it really is a very desperate situation here , `` Rachel Chandler said in the latest interview , in which she said she had not seen her husband for two weeks since they were violently separated . '' I 've broken a tooth because I was hit on the head with something , probably the butt of a gun ... I do n't know ... and yes , so we have been physically attacked. `` Rachel Chandler , 55 , who along with her husband has been held for nearly 100 days , said the pirates had issued a new deadline . '' They 've just told me that if they do n't get the money within four or five days they 'll kill one of us. `` Audibly close to tears , she also asked for a message to be passed on to her husband . '' The message to him is hang on for me because I hope -- my biggest hope -- is that I shall see him at least once before we die. `` She added : `` It 's hard not to feel , well , dying would actually be an easy way out . It 's hard to explain but it is when you 're all on your own in this country and you 've no idea where you are and no idea when something might happen and whether I 'll see Paul again . It 's just very , very despairing `` In a separate telephone interview 24 hours earlier , Paul Chandler , 59 , described how they were separated and savagely beaten . '' We tried to stay together and they threw us to the ground and whipped us and beat Rachel with a rifle butt and I was dragged off , taken to a different location . '' I was allowed to telephone her about 12 days ago . Se said she was being tormented all the time and then she said she was giving up . They 've lost patience . They set a deadline of three or four days , if they do n't hear , then they say they will let us die . '' We 're held in solitary confinement effectively . You know it 's just [ like being ] treated as a captive animal. `` It was not clear under what conditions the captives , who have been in sporadic telephone and video contact with journalists , had been allowed telephone access . ITN said both conversations had been shared with the British Home Office and his family . Britain 's Foreign and Commonwealth Office 's official line on hostages says `` the government will not make substantive concession for hostage takers , including the payments of ransom. `` Pirates have been very active off the east coast of Africa in the past several years , operating out of lawless Somalia . Last week , pirates attempted to hijack an Indian crude oil vessel 105 nautical miles from Somalia , the EU 's anti-piracy naval force said . The pirates opened fire on the ship and were later arrested . Piracy on the high-seas reached a six-year high in 2009 , according to the International Maritime Bureau , which monitors shipping crimes .""","""So why should merchant ships be required to go unarmed and defenseless in dangerous areas ?""",DISAGREE,"""The pirates opened fire on the ship and were later arrested . Piracy on the high-seas reached a six-year high in 2009 ,""","""So why should merchant ships be required to go unarmed and defenseless in dangerous areas ?""",,
12180,3216,"""Four words that always gets an evolutionist into trouble , `` Evolution has been proven `` .""","""Really ? I do n't see myself in trouble for saying them . I stand by them , for they are truthful words .""",DISAGREE,"""Four words that always gets an evolutionist into trouble , `` Evolution has been proven `` .""","""Really ? I do n't see myself in trouble for saying them . I stand by them , for they are truthful words .""",,
12204,3219,"""Darwinism says that there is no such cooperationÂ….that organisms ’ traits must arise randomly – only to be later selected according to how well they fit into a given enviornment .""","""Actually , selection occurs by differential reproductive rates . What this means is that organisms which reproduce more will have more offspring than the others ( obviously ) . Therefore , traits that help organisms reproduce will become more prevailant .""",DISAGREE,"""traits must arise randomly""","""Actually , selection occurs by differential reproductive rates .""",,
12230,3222,"""That was the whole point of asking the questions , to prove evolution is n't an absolute truth .""","""The absolute truth is that for many of us evolution explains the diversity of life we see all around us better than `` poof `` ever did .""",DISAGREE,"""to prove evolution is n't an absolute truth .""","""The absolute truth is that for many of us evolution explains the diversity of life we see all around us better than `` poof `` ever""",,
12232,3223,"""People this country was born for people to live their live their own way , weather that means same sex , or different religion . If you dislike this and go against it your not a true Amercain . IF you say that same sex marriage is against the Bible your not a true Amercain . This country is built to go against having the church run everthing . So tough it , if men and women want to have same sex and marry each other , thats their choice and by Amercains we will honer their RIGHT ! ! ! to do so ! Thank YOU""","""Well let me tell you what Thomas Jefferson thinks of your pro gay sin folly : `` Whosoever shall be guilty of Rape , Polygamy , or Sodomy with man or woman shall be punished , if a man , by castration , if a woman , by cutting thro ' the cartilage of her nose a hole of one half inch diameter at the least. `` - Thomas Jefferson Amendment VIII : Thomas Jefferson , A Bill for Proportioning Crimes and Punishments Sodomy was outlawed in every state of the Union at one time . But now that homosexual sinners are coming out of their closets like the brazen hedonists that they are , we 're regressing back to Sodom and Gomorrah values . Americans reject gay marriage . It 's a perversion and an abomination .""",DISAGREE,"""People this country was born for people to live their live their own way thats their choice""","""It 's a perversion and an abomination""",,
12236,3223,"""People this country was born for people to live their live their own way , weather that means same sex , or different religion . If you dislike this and go against it your not a true Amercain . IF you say that same sex marriage is against the Bible your not a true Amercain . This country is built to go against having the church run everthing . So tough it , if men and women want to have same sex and marry each other , thats their choice and by Amercains we will honer their RIGHT ! ! ! to do so ! Thank YOU""","""Well let me tell you what Thomas Jefferson thinks of your pro gay sin folly : `` Whosoever shall be guilty of Rape , Polygamy , or Sodomy with man or woman shall be punished , if a man , by castration , if a woman , by cutting thro ' the cartilage of her nose a hole of one half inch diameter at the least. `` - Thomas Jefferson Amendment VIII : Thomas Jefferson , A Bill for Proportioning Crimes and Punishments Sodomy was outlawed in every state of the Union at one time . But now that homosexual sinners are coming out of their closets like the brazen hedonists that they are , we 're regressing back to Sodom and Gomorrah values . Americans reject gay marriage . It 's a perversion and an abomination .""",DISAGREE,"""if men and women want to have same sex and marry each other""","""woman shall be punished , if a man , by castration , if a woman""",,
12248,3225,"""SS : says the mind controls the genes""","""And SS is once again wrong . If you really believe that then try to tell your genes to give you tiger stripes which will be inherited by your children . Good luck .""",DISAGREE,"""says the mind controls the genes""","""SS is once again wrong If you really believe Good luck .""",,
12259,3227,"""Abortion targets a very specific group of human beings : unwanted , unborn children . Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide . The Convention defined genocide as any of a series of acts designed to `` destroy , in whole or in part , a national , ethnical , racial or religious group. `` The acts listed include among others , causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group , imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group or forcibly transferring children out of the group .""","""You 'll find that abortion targets none of these : `` national , ethnical , racial or religious group ( s ) . `` Unwanted , unborn children is not a specific group . Nor are members of any group specifically targeted for abortion . The practice in open to all in the US . Sorry . But all that shows is an abundant level of ignorance . Now , if you can show that abortion is only used to cull the Romany populations in East Europe ... then you may have a point .""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion targets a very specific group of human beings unwanted , unborn children . ``""","""You 'll find that abortion targets none of these `` Unwanted , unborn children is not a specific group . ...""",,
12263,3228,"""My undisputable Biblical proof that atheists are deluded and stupid . ( Yes , this is a SATIRE . )""","""By the way , that video , among others is obviously satire on literal creationists . Edward Current has been running around making satirical videos on creationists and theists . The funny thing is , you ca n't figure out it 's satire . What is even funnier is that you appear to think that the arguments Edward Current gives are actually good and prove that atheists are deluded . He uses so many fallacies including circular reasoning and you ca n't seem to notice that those methods of argumentation are extremely poor . But then again , you seem to think that Co2 is the primary input gas for ATP production rather then O2 .... I 'm still waiting for your equations proving that ATP production is massively higher with Co2 rather then O2 .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , this is a SATIRE""","""ca n't figure out it 's satire""",,
12264,3228,"""My undisputable Biblical proof that atheists are deluded and stupid . ( Yes , this is a SATIRE . )""","""By the way , that video , among others is obviously satire on literal creationists . Edward Current has been running around making satirical videos on creationists and theists . The funny thing is , you ca n't figure out it 's satire . What is even funnier is that you appear to think that the arguments Edward Current gives are actually good and prove that atheists are deluded . He uses so many fallacies including circular reasoning and you ca n't seem to notice that those methods of argumentation are extremely poor . But then again , you seem to think that Co2 is the primary input gas for ATP production rather then O2 .... I 'm still waiting for your equations proving that ATP production is massively higher with Co2 rather then O2 .""",DISAGREE,"""My undisputable Biblical proof that atheists are deluded and stupid .""","""Edward Current has been running around making satirical videos on creationists and theists . The funny thing is , you ca n't figure out it 's satire .""",,
12271,3230,"""France""","""Wrong , France 's form of government is a semi-presidential republic , with rather democratic leanings . They do however tax the rich at a very high rate , up to 70 % . This has caused the rich to leave France , taking their money , buinesses , and thousands of jobs with them . Starting in 2007 , France began lowering/ eliminating wealth taxes in an effort to draw those people and companies back to France . They have seen the error of their ways and are trying to do something about it .""",DISAGREE,"""France""","""France 's form of government is a semi-presidential republic , with rather democratic leanings .""",,
12298,3235,"""Accidents happen , that 's just how life works . They 're tragic , and they 're upsetting , but there 's no way to avoid them .""","""I 've found a way to avoid gun accidents in my home .""",DISAGREE,"""Accidents happen , that 's just how life works""","""I 've found a way to avoid gun accidents in my home .""",,
12316,3239,"""Here 's an example of how NS is nonrandom on the populational level :""","""We already accept that it is . You do n't have to convince us . However , consider what this does to your argument that natural selection is random .""",AGREE,"""how NS is nonrandom populational level""","""do n't have to convince us natural selection is random""",,
12339,3243,"""This is why many kids nowdays are born with Adhd or childhood depression . In my opinion it 's the result of our previous generations ' declining quality of diet .""","""Better is worse ? See above .""",DISAGREE,"""This is why many kids nowdays are born with Adhd or childhood depression""","""Better is worse ?""",,
12369,3249,"""With guns criminals can do even more damage .""","""Not really .""",DISAGREE,"""guns criminals""","""really""",,
12372,3250,"""Isa 27:1 In that day the LORD with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent , even leviathan that crooked serpent ; and he shall slay the dragon that [ is ] in the sea .""","""As above""",AGREE,"""the ,""","""As above""",,
12380,3253,"""In fact , the whole sacrafice of Jesus Christ was needed because of humanity 's sinful nature .""","""Jesus was a retarded ancient hippie who walked passed people who were starving and dying , yet did n't help them . Jesus is a man who ignored his family and considered his disciples family instead . Jesus is a man who did n't come to preach peace , but use a sword . Jesus is a man who did n't repudiate much of the Old Testament atrocities . Jesus is bad , and Jesus is GOd , therefore God is bad . I do n't care what the biblical stoner said .""",DISAGREE,"""whole sacrafice of Jesus Christ was needed because of humanity 's sinful nature .""","""Jesus is bad , and Jesus is GOd , therefore God is bad .""",,
12383,3253,"""In fact , the whole sacrafice of Jesus Christ was needed because of humanity 's sinful nature .""","""Jesus was a retarded ancient hippie who walked passed people who were starving and dying , yet did n't help them . Jesus is a man who ignored his family and considered his disciples family instead . Jesus is a man who did n't come to preach peace , but use a sword . Jesus is a man who did n't repudiate much of the Old Testament atrocities . Jesus is bad , and Jesus is GOd , therefore God is bad . I do n't care what the biblical stoner said .""",DISAGREE,"""the whole sacrafice of Jesus Christ was needed because of humanity 's sinful nature .""","""Jesus was a retarded ancient hippie who walked passed people who were starving and dying , yet did n't help them .""",,
12387,3254,"""Since God is omnipotent that is true . Omni means all . Potent means able to have intercourse . Wow I think I may have won Hank 's debate and the only proof you need is at dictionary.com""","""Well as long as you ignore the evidence , why do you need proof . Blind faith works just fine .""",DISAGREE,"""God is omnipotent that is true""","""Well as long as you ignore the evidence , why do you need proof . Blind faith works just fine""",,
12393,3263,"""So you do n't support Connecticut passing a civil union law ?""","""It 's a flawed step in the right direction . I support it compared to nothing . I did not support it when they were considering CUs vs. full marriage . They took the politically expedient way out . Lest you leap to any unwarranted conclusions , my main objection is the blatent inequality inhererent in CUs .""",DISAGREE,"""you do n't support Connecticut passing a civil union law ?""","""did not support it when they were considering CUs vs. full marriage .""",,
12395,3263,"""So you do n't support Connecticut passing a civil union law ?""","""It 's a flawed step in the right direction . I support it compared to nothing . I did not support it when they were considering CUs vs. full marriage . They took the politically expedient way out . Lest you leap to any unwarranted conclusions , my main objection is the blatent inequality inhererent in CUs .""",DISAGREE,"""you do n't support civil union""","""It 's a flawed step in the right direction . CUs vs. full marriage""",,
12403,3265,"""The pro gun-control side tries to protect individual rights from being violated by criminals .""","""Really ? I have n't seen you post your support for any law or proposal that would punish criminals in the most severe ways possible . All I 've ever seen you post support for is more laws that criminalize things that are n't crimes and do nothing to harm others .""",DISAGREE,"""pro gun-control side protect individual rights from being violated by criminals .""","""I have n't seen you post your support for any law or proposal that would punish criminals""",,
12404,3265,"""The pro gun-control side tries to protect individual rights from being violated by criminals .""","""Really ? I have n't seen you post your support for any law or proposal that would punish criminals in the most severe ways possible . All I 've ever seen you post support for is more laws that criminalize things that are n't crimes and do nothing to harm others .""",DISAGREE,"""pro gun-control protect individual rights violated by criminals""","""post your support law or proposal criminalize things that are n't crimes""",,
12443,3277,"""There anything other than distance to stop people going to another state ?""","""Yes , it is against the law in most states to do that .""",AGREE,"""There anything other than distance to stop people going to another state""","""Yes , it is against the law in most states""",,
12448,3278,"""Agnosticism is for hedgers .""","""Atheism is for cynical , self-righteous twits""",DISAGREE,"""Agnosticism is for hedgers .""","""self-righteous twits""",,
12456,3280,"""a coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena . and databed you should be ashamed to say rock solid while at the same time failing in every way to defend evolution from a `` crackpot `` and his insane catholic overlord .""","""Well feel free to disprove evolution anytime .""",DISAGREE,"""you should be ashamed to say rock solid while at the same time failing in every way to defend evolution from a `` crackpot `` and his insane catholic overlord .""","""Well feel free to disprove evolution anytime .""",,
12486,3292,"""This joke is based on some reality , `` the conquest of the North Pole is traditionally credited to Anglo-American Navy engineer Robert Edwin Peary , who claimed to have reached the Pole on April 6 , 1909 .""","""so your claim is that the date means that your `` joke `` is based on reality ? It takes more than that .""",DISAGREE,"""joke is based on some reality April 6 , 1909 .""","""the date means that your `` joke `` is based on reality ? It takes more than that .""",,
12507,3294,"""Sorry for responding in Kronus 's stead . I 'm sure he can defend himself but I found it unjust the way you replied to his post and attacked it on foundations that you did n't have .""","""Actually , I had no intention of responding to WW . As I 'm sure you can see by now , he does n't actually respond to what 's written , but rather just engages in lies and insults . He 's not worth the effort to debunk ; he 's self-debunking .""",DISAGREE,"""Sorry for responding in Kronus 's stead""","""I had no intention of responding to WW""",,
12528,3296,"""Â “ I taught my students that the biochemical mechanisms employed by cellular organelle systems are essentially the same mechanisms employed by our human organ systems . Even though humans are made up of trillions of cells , I stressed that there is not one new function in our bodies that is not already expressed in the single cell. ``""","""So individual cells contract to move cytoplasm around and to transport oxygen within itself ?""",DISAGREE,"""I stressed that there is not one new function in our bodies that is not already expressed in the single""","""So individual cells contract to move cytoplasm around and to transport oxygen within itself""",,
12537,3297,"""Every system has its flaws . Does that mean that we should abolish every system ?""","""No , we should n't abolish every flawed system . However , when the flaw results in putting innocent people to death , it is not worth the risk . In 26 years the death penalty has been in effect in my home state of Illinois , there have been more people exonerated due to irrefutable evidence than have been put to death . I think that constitutes a serious problem .""",DISAGREE,"""Every system has its flaws . Does that mean that we should abolish every system ?""","""No""",,
12548,3299,"""Simone , brain washing and programming works multiple ways . Everyone does it to some form or another . The only question would be is it harmful or exploitive to the one being manipulated ? If so , how can we tell ?""","""But , of course , religion is a mere matter of brainwashing and programming . Some people , very obviously , need this sort of intrusion into their lives because they ca n't figure it out for themselves . And , there are some very profound and meaningful religious teachings . However , if one is not permitted to question the tenets of a particular belief system , I find that dangerous . Like in your sect . You do expect complete obedience , do you not ? No questioning of your authority ?""",AGREE,"""brain washing and programming works multiple ways .""","""religion is a mere matter of brainwashing and programming .""",,
12552,3300,"""Our resident genius supposes a vagina is an entrance/exit to a child trap ... interesting .""","""While I do n't follow the whole `` child trap `` thing , ... whatever it is , ... Would that be any more ridiculous than the notion that a vagina is an entrance/exit to personhood ?""",AGREE,"""to a child trap ... interesting .""","""While I do n't follow the whole `` child trap `` thing , ... whatever it is""",,
12560,3301,"""carefully think about this statement . christianity is based upon the essential beliefs that : 1 . God is all-powerful 2. man is fallen and in need of redemption""","""Well , there is a little more to it than that , but agreed .""",AGREE,"""christianity is based upon the essential beliefs that : 1 . God is all-powerful 2. man is fallen and in need of redemption""","""Well , there is a little more to it than that , but agreed .""",,
12572,3303,"""If we think it 's Homer then for this book , that 's good enough . But not so with the Bible . There can be absolutely no kernel of uncertainty , which in ancient texts , ambiguity is unavoidable .""","""It 's not just a kernel of uncertainty . Jews and Christians alike say that Moses wrote the Pentateuch , but a reading of the Pentateuch makes it obvious that this can not be true . Luke did not write the book of Luke , the apostle Matthew did not write the book of Matthew , and we do n't even claim to know the authors of many books of the Bible . Look up the Documentary hypothesis ; early scholars shuffled `` holy writings `` together like a deck of cards to get the Old Testament that everybody today knows and loves .""",AGREE,"""If we think it 's Homer then for this book , that 's good enough . But not so with the Bible""","""Jews and Christians alike say that Moses wrote the Pentateuch , but a reading of the Pentateuch makes it obvious that this can not be true""",,
12569,3303,"""If we think it 's Homer then for this book , that 's good enough . But not so with the Bible . There can be absolutely no kernel of uncertainty , which in ancient texts , ambiguity is unavoidable .""","""It 's not just a kernel of uncertainty . Jews and Christians alike say that Moses wrote the Pentateuch , but a reading of the Pentateuch makes it obvious that this can not be true . Luke did not write the book of Luke , the apostle Matthew did not write the book of Matthew , and we do n't even claim to know the authors of many books of the Bible . Look up the Documentary hypothesis ; early scholars shuffled `` holy writings `` together like a deck of cards to get the Old Testament that everybody today knows and loves .""",AGREE,"""There can be absolutely no kernel of uncertainty , which in ancient texts , ambiguity is unavoidable .""","""It 's not just a kernel of uncertainty . Jews and Christians alike say that Moses wrote the Pentateuch , but a reading of the Pentateuch makes it obvious that this can not be true .""",,
12579,3304,"""Some people attempt to explain unknown causes in nature by God 's direct intervention . This has been called , `` the God of the gaps. `` While God could certainly intervene in the natural process ( called a miracle ) , to make God responsible for common natural phenomena means that as each scientific discovery finds a natural explanation of what was previously attributed to God , the direct intervention of God becomes unnecessary . That is , as the gaps in knowledge become smaller , the God of these gaps becomes correspondingly smaller . People with this mentality see science as a threat to their faith . Obviously , were such a view held by the founders of modern science , there would have been no incentive to find answers to the natural phenomena . Understanding these natural phenomena as secondary causes , places God above them where increased ability to explain how they occur not only does not `` decrease `` God , but adds wonder to His creation. `` http : //www.leaderu.com/offices/o_hel ... dor_faith.html""","""And depending on what human is `` finding the answers `` it can unfortunately cheapen and deny many central Biblical teachings .""",AGREE,"""Some people attempt to explain unknown causes in nature by God 's direct intervention""","""it can unfortunately cheapen and deny many central Biblical teachings""",,
12581,3305,"""How can there be a gap in a theory that does not discuss what that subject in which the gap resides ? Evolution is the study of the change in allele frequencies . Non-life does not have alleles . Therefore evolution can not address or study the origins of life as those do not have alleles . You can not have a gap in something you do not study . Your argument is like saying that subject X is a gap in accounting when subject X is clearly a marketing issue . For someone who criticizes those who study and accept evolution for not studying ID , you seem to be guilty of the same .""","""So then you will agree that evolution is useless in getting at possible answers on what really matters , how we got here ? If you concede that then I 'm happy to end this discussion . I recall , however , visiting the Smithsonian and seeing a detailed description of how amino acids combined to form the building blocks of life . Evolutionary theory does address origins and its explanations are unsuppported by evidence . politicalref.com""",DISAGREE,"""evolution can not address or study the origins of life as those do not have alleles .""","""evolution is useless in getting at possible answers on what really matters ,""",,
12597,3308,"""First of all any XXXXX who has hung out on the beach knows jellyfish [ and similiar creatures ] are not real prone to fossilization in the first place . Leave one on the beach for a couple hours and observe , I mean vote , on what happens to it . This to an intelligent person would make it very plain the fossils had to form during some sort os watery catastrophic event .""","""So all jellyfish die on the beach ? Hardly . Let 's use this same type of logic though . A jellyfish is pretty fragile , as you pointed out . Would n't a jellyfish that was very rapidly covered in sediment be broken into many pieces , if not ground to a paste ? Would n't this entirely rule out the possibilty of preservation in this manner ?""",DISAGREE,"""jellyfish [ and similiar creatures ] are not real prone to fossilization in the first , This to an intelligent person would make it very plain the fossils had to form during some sort os watery catastrophic event .""","""So all jellyfish die on the beach ? Hardly . Let 's use this same type of logic though . A jellyfish is pretty fragile ,""",,
12623,3313,"""It seems to me that there ’ s a divide between Creationists and materialists ... ( well lots of them , actually ) . < snip > That ’ s why anytime a Christian points to any evidence such as the power of prayer , the mind , the mind/body connection , the placebo effect , consciousness , mental abilities , spirituality , or any other trait that can not be explained materialistically , it ’ s quickly asserted that these are not  “ science. ”""","""Well , that 's not quite right . Science is a methodology for investigating phenomena , not an enumeration of them . So it is perfectly possible to scientifically investigate , say , the power of prayer . Consider for a moment what you actually mean by 'materialistically ' : what is it that defines something as being material ? Gravity is every bit as intangible as a miracle , yet you would automatically characterise it as being part of the material world . Why ? The answer is that it is amenable to the scientific method : assertions about gravity can be repeatably tested . If ghosts and poltergeists were amenable to the same methodology , it would be possible to construct scientific theories concerning those , too , and they would be considered no more exotic or 'supernatural ' than clouds or rainbows . When you get your head around that , it 's immediately apparent that it is n't the power of prayer or spirituality per se that are n't scientific , it 's the methodology people have for dealing with them . Indeed , when the scientific method is applied and does n't yield the results believers in such matters want , the typical response is to come up with excuses why we should n't expect the scientific method to work . Unfortunately you ca n't have it both ways ; if you want to come to the party you have to adopt the dress code . Really , none of this would be a problem if science did n't have a ( from a religious perspective ) nasty habit of finding explanations for , or hidden and unexpected complexities within , features of the material world about which religious texts or leaders had already made firm pronouncements . Because despite the fact that you , SS , and others see science and evolution as an enemy of your philosophy and spirituality , the actual bone of contention is always in the material world . So who 's really treading on whose toes here ? It 's your choice to shackle your spirituality to a particular - and demonstrably wrong - version of material events , SS , not mine .""",DISAGREE,"""It seems to me that there ’ s a divide between Creationists and materialists ... ( well lots of them , actually ) . That ’ s why anytime a Christian points to any evidence such as the power of prayer , the mind , the mind/body connection , the placebo effect , consciousness , mental abilities , spirituality , or any other trait that can not be explained materialistically , it ’ s quickly asserted that these are not  science.Â""","""Well , that 's not quite right . Science is a methodology for investigating phenomena , not an enumeration of them . So it is perfectly possible to scientifically investigate , say , the power of prayer . Consider for a moment what you actually mean by 'materialistically ' : what is it that defines something as being material ? Gravity is every bit as intangible as a miracle , yet you would automatically characterise it as being part of the material world . Why ? The answer is that it is amenable to the scientific method : assertions about gravity can be repeatably tested . If ghosts and poltergeists were amenable to the same methodology , it would be possible to construct scientific theories concerning those , too , and they would be considered no more exotic or 'supernatural ' than clouds or rainbows . When you get your head around that , it 's immediately apparent that it is n't the power of prayer or spirituality per se that are n't scientific , it 's the methodology people have for dealing with them . Indeed , when the scientific method is applied and does n't yield the results believers in such matters want , the typical response is to come up with excuses why we should n't expect the scientific method to work . Unfortunately you ca n't have it both ways ; if you want to come to the party you have to adopt the dress code . Really , none of this would be a problem if science did n't have a ( from a religious perspective ) nasty habit of finding explanations for , or hidden and unexpected complexities within , features of the material world about which religious texts or leaders had already made firm pronouncements . Because despite the fact that you , SS , and others see science and evolution as an enemy of your philosophy and spirituality , the actual bone of contention is always in the material world . So who 's really treading on whose toes here ? It 's your choice to shackle your spirituality to a particular - and demonstrably wrong - version of material events""",,
12628,3314,"""Sina mostly followed instructions and smiled alluringly at men because she would have been beaten if men didn ’ t choose her . But sometimes she was in such pain that she resisted , and then she said she would be dragged down to a torture chamber in the basement .  “ Many of the brothels have these torture chambers ,  ” she said .  “ They are underground because then the girls ’ screams are muffled. ” As in many brothels , the torture of choice was electric shocks . Sina would be tied down , doused in water and then prodded with wires running from the 220-volt wall outlet . The jolt causes intense pain , sometimes evacuation of the bladder and bowel — and even unconsciousness .""","""Oh , but Sina does not live in a womb so she is unimportant .""",DISAGREE,"""Sina would be tied down , doused in water and then prodded with wires running from the 220-volt wall outlet . The jolt causes intense pain , sometimes evacuation of the bladder and bowel""","""but Sina does not live in a womb so she is unimportant .""",,
12629,3314,"""Sina mostly followed instructions and smiled alluringly at men because she would have been beaten if men didn ’ t choose her . But sometimes she was in such pain that she resisted , and then she said she would be dragged down to a torture chamber in the basement .  “ Many of the brothels have these torture chambers ,  ” she said .  “ They are underground because then the girls ’ screams are muffled. ” As in many brothels , the torture of choice was electric shocks . Sina would be tied down , doused in water and then prodded with wires running from the 220-volt wall outlet . The jolt causes intense pain , sometimes evacuation of the bladder and bowel — and even unconsciousness .""","""Oh , but Sina does not live in a womb so she is unimportant .""",DISAGREE,"""mostly followed instructions and smiled alluringly at men because she would have been beaten if men didn ’ t choose her .""","""Oh , but Sina does not live in a womb so she is unimportant .""",,
12645,3316,"""Unknown criteria ?""","""See Sarge 's post about Ted Kennedy being listed . What did he do that would make him get on the terrorist watch list ? And what about the four year old boy who was denied flight because his name was also on the watch list ? Because his name was the alias of a known terrorist . What answers do you have to address these points ? We 've had plenty of people claiming that being on the no fly list , or the suspected terrorist watch list , should be all the criteria necessary for denying a person the right to buy a gun . And now we have the mayors claiming that failing the background check -even if it 's because the Attorney General is abusing his power- should be grounds for criminal prosecution . That 's not liberty . That 's not justice . That 's not freedom . That 's not American values . That 's completely unacceptable , and goes on the show the character of those who support gun control . Secret police and secret courts to be used against the American people will not be tolerated !""",DISAGREE,"""Unknown criteria ?""","""We 've had plenty of people claiming that being on the no fly list , or the suspected terrorist watch list , should be all the criteria necessary for denying a person the right to buy a gun""",,
12660,3319,"""3 . The Bible has at least 3 stories of how the universe began . That 's one sure tipoff that the Fundie interpretation is wrong .""","""Actually , it is a tip-off that they need to pick one interpretation or confuse their position by trying to assume all three .""",AGREE,"""That 's one sure tipoff that the Fundie interpretation is wrong .""","""it is a tip-off that they need to pick one interpretation""",,
12670,3321,"""Preliminary figures indicate that , as a whole , law enforcement agencies throughout the Nation reported a decrease of 4.4 percent in the number of violent crimes ....""","""Our emphasis on Police and crime fighting reduced crime . Not gun control ! Our murder rate is largely an Inner City drug and drug gang related problem . Fix that and then you will finally be doing something !""",AGREE,"""Preliminary figures indicate that , as a whole , law enforcement agencies throughout the Nation reported a decrease of 4.4 percent in the number of violent crimes ....""","""Our emphasis on Police and crime fighting reduced crime .""",,
12675,3322,"""This is n't my position . I 'm arguing that your attempts to demonize magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds is foolish . Furthermore , if no honest citizen needs a 15 round magazine , then no police officer needs them either . If we can reload them quickly enough for it to not matter , then the police can do it too .""","""You deny what I wrote is your position . Well if your position is n't that `` it 's not necessary to have high capacity magazines because gun owners can reload quickly when defending themselves against criminals `` then logically your position must be that such high capacity magazines are necessary for self defense . But if such magazines would benefit law abiding citizens in an armed conflict then why could n't they also benefit criminals ?""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm arguing that your attempts to demonize magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds is foolish""","""You deny what I wrote is your position . Well if your position is n't that `` it 's not necessary to have high capacity magazines because gun owners can reload quickly when defending themselves against criminals `` then logically your position must be that such high capacity magazines are necessary for self defense""",,
12683,3324,"""Firstly , there are plenty of non-dictatorial countries with gun ownership in place . It 's this that you 'd have to look at , rather than look at features of already existing dictatorships - I bet all dictatorships banned murder , as well . Secondly , gun ownership would not prevent a dictatorship , just make it harder . If `` guns do n't kill people , people do `` , then surely `` gun control does n't cause dictatorships , people cause dictatorships `` ?""","""Oh , no , young Skywalker . It is you who are wrong . About a great , many , things . The title above what you are reading says `` Which is more likely to become a dictatorship `` , not `` It 's impossible to turn a country with loose gun laws into a dictatorship . '""",DISAGREE,"""Firstly , there are plenty of non-dictatorial countries with gun ownership in place .""","""It is you who are wrong . About a great , many , things .""",,
12723,3335,"""We talk a lot about media bias , but sometimes the mainstream media goes so far beyond what should be acceptable fair and balanced reporting as to call into question their integrity . Like every other gun banner , she apparently sees the solution to gun crimes as taking guns away from the people who did n't commit the crime in the first place . ABC did n't stop there . Yesterday morning on `` Good Morning America , `` reporter David Muir continued the agenda-based `` reporting `` by proffering Michael Wolkowitz , a board member of the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence , as an expert on firearms without bothering to mention that he was basing his whole argument on propaganda . In neither segment did ABC present the opposing viewpoint , choosing instead to promote their own biased agenda , including promoting yet another anti-gun piece they are planning to air this Friday entitled , `` If I Only Had a Gun , `` which Sawyer noted included a segment highlighting that `` since there is an impulse to think if I had a gun I could protect myself and others , we have an experience we 'll conduct based on a real incident in which we show you what happens. `` I 'm sure that reenactment will be completely unbiased and realistic , right ?""","""Well , so much for unbiased reporting !""",AGREE,"""I 'm sure that reenactment will be completely unbiased and realistic , right ?""","""Well , so much for unbiased reporting !""",,
12747,3355,""" “ For example if you say `` 10,000 people died in a car accident last year `` you do n't downplaying the ones that died in 2004 ”""","""But you know it is more then just that . The poster gave a specific date that is relevant to when abortion was legalized . It shows the poster is being selective and may hold prejudice to fetuses who aren ’ t aborted by legal abortions . You see , it is the pro-life movement 's selective outrages that makes me think they are n't serious about abortion as a whole .""",DISAGREE,""" For example if you say `` 10,000 people died in a car accident last year ``""","""But you know it is more then just that .""",,
12764,3357,"""You 're saying it 's impossible to take marriage out of the government ? Give all people currently married a civil union , and let people from now on get a civil union from the government , and marriage from the church . It really would n't be that hard .""","""I think we all could live with this .""",AGREE,"""saying it 's impossible all people currently married a civil union , let people get a civil union from the government""","""we all could live with this""",,
12772,3359,"""You claim that the distinction between a baby being a bodily function of a woman or not is a matter of  “ empirical fact ” , this is just not so . I think you should rethink what  “ empirical fact ” is . Empirical fact , are facts that are said to be true on the basis of empirical observation . If I see a light on in a room , that is an empirical observation , and for me , that the light is on , is an empirical fact . However , if you and I both empirically observe at a fetus in a womb then the only empirical fact we could both agree on , I think , is that there is indeed a fetus in a womb . I say that fetus is part of a persons body performing a function , you say its something else , and that ’ s a mater if ideology , not mere observation .""","""So for example if I say `` you are a part of my body , and therefore I have a right to kill you `` , is this simply a matter of ideology ? I admit the distinction is not clearcut at early stages of development , but how do you support the idea that post-birth children are `` a part `` of their mothers ' bodies and therefore legitimate to kill ? It is no more legitimate to say that a fetus is a part of a woman 's body than it is to say that a woman is a part of a fetus ' body . Just as a woman is not a subordinate slave to the fetus within her , the fetus can not be considered subordinate in rights to the woman it is inside .""",DISAGREE,"""You claim that the distinction between a baby being a bodily function of a woman or not is a matter of  empirical fact , this is just not so you should rethink what  empirical fact is mater if ideology , not mere observation""","""It is no more legitimate to say that a fetus is a part of a woman 's body than it is to say that a woman is a part of a fetus ' body Just as a woman is not a subordinate slave to the fetus the fetus can not be considered subordinate in rights to the woman""",,
12788,3362,"""At least I & # 8217 ; m not advocating hauling astronomy to court and getting it thrown out of significant parts of the public realm . Do you think they & # 8217 ; re all genuinely mystified that someone would suggest that other branches of science be held to the same criteria that evolutionists have set for ID ?""","""Er , they are held to the same standards . ID fails to meet them . That 's the point""",AGREE,"""Do you think they re all genuinely mystified that someone would suggest that other branches of science""","""they are held to the same standards""",,
12795,3365,"""I thought I got to the substance of your argument quite well , and prefer not to drone on with a million quotes . If you want to press your argument further you will need to construct an argument as to why `` putting someone in the position `` obligates you to sustain their life , and when doing so you may want to examine the consequences of that position , to see if you can apply it consistently . You put it there therefore you are responsible for it is n't , in itself , an argument .""","""You are , in effect , telling me that putting someone in a position that will inevitable leave them dead does not make you responsible for their death . If I fire a bullet at your head , while that bullet is in mid-air , I am no longer doing anything to hurt you , and you are fine . However , I have set in motion affects that will result in your demise . This makes me responsible for your death .""",DISAGREE,"""If you want to press your argument further you will need to construct an argument as to why `` putting someone in the position `` obligates you to sustain their life , and when doing so you may want to examine the consequences of that position , to see if you can apply it consistently""","""You are , in effect , telling me that putting someone in a position that will inevitable leave them dead does not make you responsible for their death .""",,
12801,3367,"""I was under the impression that he was referencing the video ... since he always interchanges the words embryo and fetus I just rolled with it .""","""So you 're both wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""I was under the impression that he was referencing the video ... since he always interchanges the words embryo and fetus I just rolled with it .""","""So you 're both wrong .""",,
12813,3369,"""I thought that crocodiles and alligators were in about the same state as they were millions of years ago and that was because thier habitat did not require them to change therefore the odd slight mutations that gain the advantage and lead to change was of no advantage .""","""Right . It 's called stasis . Species that are well adapted to their environments tend to change little in a stable environment . It is still true that fossil crocs are not the same as modern crocs . There are obvious differences .""",AGREE,"""crocodiles and alligators were in about the same state""","""Right 's called stasis .""",,
12820,3371,"""Opinions ?""","""Wow . A very unusual and distressing story , and probably why saline abortions are no longer used . It is very unfortunate for her to have to live with that disability .""",DISAGREE,"""Opinions ?""","""A very unusual and distressing story""",,
12837,3374,"""If the Senate does agree to the legislation , Connecticut becomes the first state to voluntarily establish civil unions .""","""So laws passed by the legislature are `` state approved `` while rulings of the courts are not ? The media portrayal of gay rights is always awful .""",DISAGREE,"""Connecticut becomes the first state to voluntarily establish civil unions""","""So laws passed by the legislature are `` state approved `` while rulings of the courts are not ?""",,
12843,3376,"""Naturalistic presumption has become sacrosanct in the rhetoric of the professional scientists who have been crystal clear on how they define creationism .""","""It 's not part of any rhetoric -- evolution is fact . It 's no more rhetoric than gravity or the founding principles behind Newtonian Physics .""",DISAGREE,"""Naturalistic presumption has become sacrosanct in the rhetoric of the professional scientists creationism""","""evolution is fact It 's no more rhetoric than gravity or the founding principles behind Newtonian Physics .""",,
12849,3377,"""I have worked with a few weed addicts too . I am glad companies drug test becuase of this . These fools look stoned 24/7 after awhile and are the worst employees on earth .""","""Maybe they just drink too much coffee . And you probably work with more `` reefer heads `` than you think .""",DISAGREE,"""I am glad companies drug test becuase of this""","""Maybe they just drink too much coffee ``""",,
12884,3385,"""Do you believe that you will hear an understanding of God that you 've not heard before , or are you of the belief you are open-minded on the subject , and might well have an epiphany ?""","""What possible concern is any of that to you ? Some actually search for knowledge through debate . This is a debate forum if you recall . Do n't play if you 're not so inclined but to post warnings not to fall in this trap , c'mon .""",DISAGREE,"""are you of the belief you are open-minded on the subject , and might well have an epiphany ?""","""Some actually search for knowledge through debate .""",,
12902,3388,"""It 's up to you . Stop bringing up red herrings and/or arguing by personal attack , or do n't expect me to treat your posts with any less contempt than I have for most of what 's been posted to this board .""","""Evidence or logic that causes you a problem is not a red herring . As for arguing by personal attack , once again I think I 've been remarkably patient given the unending stream of dismissive and insulting comments I 've endured along the way .""",DISAGREE,"""Stop bringing up red herrings and/or arguing by personal attack ,""","""As for arguing by personal attack , once again I think I 've been remarkably patient given the unending stream""",,
12910,3389,"""Read what i actually wrote for a change Yank .""","""This is what socially inept losers do when they know their argument is # # # # , deny they ever made one . I 've asked repeatedly for an example of the evolution of a new body part in a population and all you 've done is confirm the fact that you 're an absolute # # # # # .""",DISAGREE,"""Read what i actually wrote for a change Yank .""","""This is what socially inept losers do""",,
12912,3390,"""Do n't you dare try and give me a lecture about cherry picking ! All you ever do is cherry pick ! You come around about once a month , scour the news to find a crime committed with a gun , and you use that single incident as if it 's evidence that there 's a serious problem that threatens the entire nation . If that 's not cherry picking then I do n't know what is . As a gun owner I 'm also a property owner . Or are you denying that guns are property ?""","""I 've been posting at least a few times a week . That 's a lot more than once a month . I pointed out that the US has higher levels of gun crime than most developed nations while you tried to focus on a few tragedies in response to someone questioning the claim that criminals will always get guns . I think it 's obvious whose argument is more cherry picked .""",DISAGREE,"""As a gun owner I 'm also a property owner""","""I pointed out that the US has higher levels of gun crime than most developed nations while you tried to focus on a few tragedies in response to someone questioning the claim that criminals will always get guns .""",,
12915,3391,"""And , regardless of whether 99.9 % of the people in the US approve of the court 's decision in Roe , that decision would still be judicial activism , and as such , would still merit reversal by the Supreme Court .""","""No more so than the Scalia/Uncle Clarence Thomas cabal opining that the words NO LAW mean something other than what they do when they rule in a First Amendment case .""",DISAGREE,"""And , regardless of whether 99.9 % of the people in the US approve of the court 's decision in Roe ,""","""NO LAW mean something other than what they do when they rule in a First Amendment case .""",,
12918,3392,"""There are no new forms of life emerging .""","""Wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""There are no new forms of life emerging .""","""Wrong""",,
12933,3396,"""Erm ... we are ? Levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are usually quoted as parts per million , currently a little over 380ppm , 150 years ago closer to 280 . In 1970 about 330ppm . Carbon dioxide in the Earth 's atmosphere - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""","""Then why are you a Global Warming Advocate Jo ? Since you just produced evidence that over the last 150 years , throughout the complete Industrial Revolution since fossil fuels have been being burned , the Atmospheric Co2 levels worldwide have only gone up by 100 ppm ? http : //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi ... on_Dioxide.png Are you forgetting that the Earth 's atmosphere has the ability to constantly clean itself , so once we get third world industrialized countries throughout Asia and Africa to adopt clean air policies , world wide air pollution will become a distant memory in no time at all ? Also , your stats in addition to these stats http : //scienceandpublicpolicy.org/pr ... te_crisis.html prove that the threat of Global Warming is a myth .""",DISAGREE,"""Levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are usually quoted as parts per million , currently a little over 380ppm , 150 years ago closer to 280 .""","""Then why are you a Global Warming Advocate Jo ? Since you just produced evidence that over the last 150 years , throughout the complete Industrial Revolution since fossil fuels have been being burned , the Atmospheric Co2 levels worldwide have only gone up by 100 ppm ?""",,
12952,3399,"""a childish `` psychopant `` ? ? ? ? what is that ? pants for psychos ? do you wear a pair then ?""","""I think he meant a sycophant .""",DISAGREE,"""what is that ? do you""","""I think he meant""",,
12957,3400,"""Don ’ t expect the recent retractions and exonerations to change that . One of the strongest , most-repeated findings in the psychology of belief is that once people have been told X , especially if X is shocking , if they are later told ,  “ No , we were wrong about X ,  ” most people still believe X . As Twain and Churchill knew , sometimes the truth never catches up with the lie , let alone overtakes it . As I wrote last summer in a story about why people believe lies even when they ’ re later told the truth , sometimes people ’ s mental processes simply go off the rails .""","""Absolutely true ! I discovered that with my fluoride research ... For whatever reason , most people take another 's word for what the truth actually is instead of searching for it themselves . If the lie is an easier pill to swallow than the truth pill , they 'll take the lie .""",AGREE,"""One of the strongest , findings truth never catches up with the lie , mental processes simply go off the rails""","""Absolutely true discovered , instead of searching themselves the lie is pill , they take the""",,
12975,3410,"""A second chance to make it right .""","""While your story is a sad one I disagree that you should be happy with having a `` second chance `` . I believe this because you gave your unborn child no chance . I probably should n't say `` you `` because it seems like you did n't have a choice in the matter . Anyway , thank you for sharing your story and welcome to the forums .""",DISAGREE,"""A second chance to make it right .""","""I disagree that you should be happy with having a `` second chance `` .""",,
12977,3410,"""A second chance to make it right .""","""While your story is a sad one I disagree that you should be happy with having a `` second chance `` . I believe this because you gave your unborn child no chance . I probably should n't say `` you `` because it seems like you did n't have a choice in the matter . Anyway , thank you for sharing your story and welcome to the forums .""",DISAGREE,"""A second chance to make it right""","""While your story is a sad one I disagree that you should be happy with having a `` second chance `` . I believe this because you gave your unborn child no chance .""",,
12998,3413,"""Why are you blaming me ? What did I do ? How can you stop it from happening ? You are good at flaming rhetoric but apparently you do n't have an actual clue on what you are asking . You want us all in the exact same position as Ms. Ross ! Peaceful , compliant victims of vicious predators ! By the way , did you see this ? If you had your way , I would be dead too ! Na ! I think I will keep my rights , and you can keep your pipe dreams of a violence free society !""","""Oh good grief ! I have always lived in rough areas . In one city , Alburquerque , a drug deal went sour 10 feet fom where I slept , and a guy had his head blasted away by a shotgun . Where I worked , less than a block away , a gunner massacred everyone in a video rental place . I was even obliged to ferry a guy with a slash on his throat to an ER , I did n't know the stupid beast , I was scared to death , but I felt it my Christian duty ( even though I am not a Christian ) to get the guy to where he could get treatment . And I do n't own a damned gun because I am not chicken-hearted .""",DISAGREE,"""If you had your way , I would be dead too ! Na ! I think I will keep my rights , and you can keep your pipe dreams of a violence free society !""","""! I , a and had a gunner massacred everyone in a video rental place . , I my""",,
13001,3413,"""Why are you blaming me ? What did I do ? How can you stop it from happening ? You are good at flaming rhetoric but apparently you do n't have an actual clue on what you are asking . You want us all in the exact same position as Ms. Ross ! Peaceful , compliant victims of vicious predators ! By the way , did you see this ? If you had your way , I would be dead too ! Na ! I think I will keep my rights , and you can keep your pipe dreams of a violence free society !""","""Oh good grief ! I have always lived in rough areas . In one city , Alburquerque , a drug deal went sour 10 feet fom where I slept , and a guy had his head blasted away by a shotgun . Where I worked , less than a block away , a gunner massacred everyone in a video rental place . I was even obliged to ferry a guy with a slash on his throat to an ER , I did n't know the stupid beast , I was scared to death , but I felt it my Christian duty ( even though I am not a Christian ) to get the guy to where he could get treatment . And I do n't own a damned gun because I am not chicken-hearted .""",DISAGREE,"""Why are you blaming me ? What did I do ?""","""And I do n't own a damned gun because I am not chicken-hearted .""",,
13010,3414,"""For those who are pro-life , how much of a role does your belief in a soul ( assuming you hold such beliefs ) play into your views on abortion ? To explore this , would your views on a particular abortion change if you knew for certain that a particular fetus has no soul ? The reason I bring this up is that , for those of us with largely secular views , the idea of the soul is closely analogous to our idea of mental existence , sentience , etc . I suspect , therefore , that much of our thinking may end up being similar but that you view this mental essence as starting at conception and we take the scientific view of it happenning much later in a pregnancy . I know that , apart from that arguement , you value potential more than we do . However , I suspect that concepts of the soul do play a role in the views of most on the pro-life side . Would you be willing to discuss such ideas ?""","""I think more than this is the principle of human dignity . That humans have inherent dignity and value at every stage of life . This is transcendent of whether they are conscious or unconscious and it is why we treat 24 week premies who have no real conscious existence and a 30 year old automobile accident victim in a coma on a respirator and you and me the same . So strongly do humans recognize this inherent dignity that even in death a person is dignified with a funeral ceremony recognizing their life had inherent meaning and value . We build memorials to those who were victimized in life .""",DISAGREE,"""For those who are pro-life , how much of a role does your belief in a soul ( assuming you hold such beliefs ) play into your views on abortion ?""","""I think more than this is the principle of human dignity .""",,
13011,3414,"""For those who are pro-life , how much of a role does your belief in a soul ( assuming you hold such beliefs ) play into your views on abortion ? To explore this , would your views on a particular abortion change if you knew for certain that a particular fetus has no soul ? The reason I bring this up is that , for those of us with largely secular views , the idea of the soul is closely analogous to our idea of mental existence , sentience , etc . I suspect , therefore , that much of our thinking may end up being similar but that you view this mental essence as starting at conception and we take the scientific view of it happenning much later in a pregnancy . I know that , apart from that arguement , you value potential more than we do . However , I suspect that concepts of the soul do play a role in the views of most on the pro-life side . Would you be willing to discuss such ideas ?""","""I think more than this is the principle of human dignity . That humans have inherent dignity and value at every stage of life . This is transcendent of whether they are conscious or unconscious and it is why we treat 24 week premies who have no real conscious existence and a 30 year old automobile accident victim in a coma on a respirator and you and me the same . So strongly do humans recognize this inherent dignity that even in death a person is dignified with a funeral ceremony recognizing their life had inherent meaning and value . We build memorials to those who were victimized in life .""",DISAGREE,"""Would you be willing to discuss such ideas ?""","""I think more than this is the principle of human dignity .""",,
13037,3418,"""Many contemporary authors prominent in bioethical circles distinguish sharply between being a human being and being a human person . These authors claim that for an entity to be regarded as a person , it must have developed at least incipiently exercisable cognitive capacities or abilities ..... ( Another view } distinguishes between a living human body and a living human person .""","""What Is a Human Person and Who Counts as a Human Person ? : A Crucial Question for Bioethics by Prof. William E. May There is also an extremely academic school of thought which views the human person in terms of the ego in all its derivations . I can not hope to summarize what this is all about , please refer to : Philosophical Critiques : The Human Person - 3 One could also consider the social development of an infant , inasmuch as humans are , in most cases , very social animals . According to primatologist Sarah Blaffer Hrdy , the human species is specifically developed to be part of a social system and a newborn infant comes ready made to push all the buttons of the system :""",AGREE,"""distinguish sharply between being a human being and being a human person""","""What Is a Human Person and Who Counts as a Human Person ? : A Crucial Question for Bioethics by Prof. William E. May There is also an extremely academic school of thought which views the human person in terms of the ego in all its derivations .""",,
13051,3424,"""Then be troubled because ID is clearly creationism . For example , an early draft of `` Pandas and People `` stated : `` Creation is the theory that various forms of life began abruptly , with their distinctive features already intact : Fish with fins and scales , birds with feathers and wings , mammals with fur and mammary glands. `` After attempts by `` creation science `` to get religion taught as science failed in the courts , the text was altered . The published text reads : `` Intelligent design means that various forms of life began abruptly through an intelligent agency , with their distinctive features already intact : Fish with fins and scales , birds with feathers , beaks and wings , mammals with fur and mammary glands. `` And yet you are n't troubled by the fact that these two non-synonymous ideas can both be explained merely by exchanging either `` creation `` or `` intelligent design `` and `` God `` or `` intelligent designer. `` And , of course , there is the view of Judge Jones of the Dover , PA trial who stated in his decision , `` The evidence at trial demonstrates that ID is nothing less than the progeny of creationism `` and `` The overwhelming evidence at trial established that ID is a religious view , a mere re-labeling of creationism , and not a scientific theory. `` Oh , let 's see . How about the fact that both ideas rely on some magical invisible being that brought everything about by some unspecified means . What is funny is that for public consumption ID claims that the identity of the designer is unknown ( wink , wink ) . However , as is stated in the Discovery Institute 's private Wedge document , one of the goals of ID creationism is : `` To replace materialistic explanations with the theistic understanding that nature and hurnan [ sic ] beings are created by God. `` That sounds like creationism to me .""","""And lets ont forget the parts where they did n't completely relabel all of the creation to ID and we ended up with `` Cdesign proponentsists ``""",AGREE,"""Fish with fins and scales , birds with feathers and wings , mammals with fur and mammary""","""And lets ont forget the parts where they did n't completely relabel""",,
13090,3432,"""All I 'm saying is that it is a lot larger leap , based on common sense , to say `` The Universe began when an uncreated atom exploded causing a chain reaction that eventually lead to the creation of all in the Universe through mere happenstance ...""","""Well , fine . If you can quote a scientist claiming the above , I 'll join you in declaring her mistaken . You could be searching a long time .""",DISAGREE,"""All I 'm saying is that it is a lot larger leap , based on common sense ,""","""Well , fine .""",,
13097,3434,"""I never claimed anyone did live inside an embryo .""","""Well , you 're writing from an embryo 's point of view , when an embryo does n't even have a point of view . It would be like writing from a rock 's point of view .""",DISAGREE,"""I never claimed anyone did live inside an embryo .""","""Well , you 're writing from an embryo 's point of view , when an embryo does n't even have a point of view .""",,
13102,3435,"""If a woman does not want to be pregnant , she can abstain from sex . It works !""","""Abstinance ? ! Heaven forbid .""",DISAGREE,"""abstain from sex""","""Abstinance""",,
13116,3439,"""And what did Noah do about the termites ? [""","""Well nobody has turned up the Ark have they , termites could assure that if properly used . After 40 days and more they would be ravenous .""",DISAGREE,"""Noah termites""","""Ark termites After 40 days and more they would be ravenous .""",,
13126,3441,"""Actually , the biological development begins when the ovum is formed , when its mom is a fetus herself ... ... Nope , it is at its mom 's fetal stage ( in the case of humans , 18-45 years before its birth ) .""","""While it may be true that an ovum is formed during the mother 's fetal stage , an ovum is not a unique human entity in and of itself . It does not become a unique human entity until it is fertilized at conception . ( Do you like semantics games ? )""",DISAGREE,"""Actually the biological development begins when the ovum is formed , when its mom is a fetus herself Nope , it is at its mom 's fetal stage""","""While it may be true an ovum is formed during the mother 's fetal stage It does not become a unique human entity until it is fertilized at conception .""",,
13127,3442,"""One can live off the other ... and if so do you kill the non-dominant one . They did n't say anything in this video but one is more dominant than the other normally . Does the dominant one have the right to kill the other for living off of them ? Can one girl kill herself or do harmful things to her body if she chooses ... even against the other heads will ? So many questions and since the pro-choice stance is ever complex I figure this would be an interesting response .""","""I am curious about the logic you used in your reasoning in thinking that pro-choice proponents would support having one of the girls on the video killed to let the other one have a better life . What , specifically , in anything that we have said would make you think that killing one of those girls would be ok ? Since you brought up the questions , I wonder what your answer would be to that second question : `` Can one girl kill herself or do harmful things to her body if she chooses ... even against the other heads will ? `` Along those lines , do you support people 's rights to kill themselves ?""",DISAGREE,"""One can live off the other ... and if so do you kill the non-dominant one .""","""I wonder what your answer would be to that second question : `` Can one girl kill herself or do harmful things to her body if she chooses , do you support people 's rights to kill themselves ?""",,
13148,3449,"""LOL . Well that 's so nice of the copy who let you know . And that 's very interesting -- `` every time `` -- Archangel . How many times have you been stopped ? And for going how fast ? I 'm sure it was a lot more than 35 mph ! And you have the nerve to talk about `` responsibility `` or how this woman was a jerk ? Or to call me names ? Dearest , I never speed because I take my responsibilities as a citizen so seriously , and i have never received a speeding ticket . Were you driving under the influence as well ? How many lives did you put at risk , Archangel ? What pomposity ! What hypocrisy !""","""Just as you constantly lie here to us on this board , now you are lying about your conduct on the road as a driver . I have had my license for a full 40 years now and have never had it revoked . Nor have I had an accident in over 25 years , but in those first 15 years I got 4 or 5 speeding tickets and all of them deserved . But none of them were for speeding in a school zone where children were present . And none of them were for public endangerment . I was famous for getting on the highway and cruising at 80 or 85 mph in a 65 . By this woman doing 35 in a school zone , she was doing 15 mph over the legal limit where children are present ; which of us do you think was more egregiously breaking the law ?""",DISAGREE,"""How many times have you been stopped ? And for going how fast ? I 'm sure it was a lot more than 35 mph ! And you have the nerve to talk about `` responsibility `` or how this woman was a jerk ?""","""now you are lying about your conduct on the road as a driver""",,
13151,3451,"""After all these years it still hurts .""","""Certainly it does .""",AGREE,"""After all these years it still hurts .""","""Certainly it does""",,
13160,3453,"""I have read all of your post and all you talk about is my facts being irrelevant , but as a Christian i belive Jesus and God are one , and the bible is the word of God so therefore its also the words of Jesus .""","""I know that I 've tried to make this argument before on another thread but Jesus was not God in that sence but the Son of God . God even says in the Bible that Jesus is his son so that they are apart of eachother but are not the same . Also , how do you know that a lot of the laws put into Leviticus were not just ones added by the chief priest ? After all , the Bible was writen down by human hands . Also I want to make reference to John 3 : 16-17 ( TEV * translation ) 16 : For God loved the world so much that he gave his only Son , so that everyone who believes in him may not die but have eternal life . 17 : For God did not send his Son into the world to be its judge , but to be its savior . * I specify the translation because it seems that most of the posters are using KJV , which kind of annoys me when I try to read it .""",DISAGREE,"""Jesus and God are one""","""Jesus was not God in that sence but the Son of God""",,
13173,3456,"""most research indicates social deprivation as being main causes of crime coupled nowadays with drugs SO WHY ARE GUNS BEING BLAMED FOR CAUSING CRIME ! ! ! I 've been saying this for years ... Criminals have always had guns ban or not That is the exact point of this thread ... guns bans/control does n't stop the criminals , endangering the populace . If you want to argue anti-gun ... do n't support the side of us `` redneck-hillbilly-gunnuts `` that you think are so stupid .""","""But the number of criminals that have firearms can be reduced . In developed nations that have very strict gun laws there are a lot less criminals obtaining and using guns to commit crimes . How does your theory explain that ?""",DISAGREE,"""SO WHY ARE GUNS BEING BLAMED FOR CAUSING CRIME !""","""But the number of criminals that have firearms can be reduced .""",,
13182,3457,"""Back when I was arguing for ID I posted a lot at www.arn.org :""","""Not to hijack the thread , but there 's a question about ID that I 've never been able to get an answer to . arn.org did n't help , but maybe you can DamEtel ? What was the Designer supposed to have actually done , and when ? I mean , did he create the first single celled creatures from scratch and dump them in the ocean billions of years ago , or did he just nudge some chemicals towards each other ? Did he cause specific mutations in certain animals at some point to get a desired result ? Or did he build animals from scratch , fully formed ? I ca n't find any answers to these questions anywhere .""",DISAGREE,"""when I was arguing for ID I posted a lot at www.arn.org :""","""What was the Designer supposed to have actually done , and when ?""",,
13189,3459,"""Go pound sand . You 're the people who want the Separation of Church and State , remember ? Get your sick , satanic mits off the church .""","""Then get your sick , satanic mitts off everyone else .""",DISAGREE,"""Separation of Church and State""","""sick , satanic mitts off""",,
13195,3460,"""In its review of death penalty expenses , the State of Kansas concluded that capital cases are 70 % more expensive than comparable non-death penalty cases . The study counted death penalty case costs through to execution and found that the median death penalty case costs $ 1.26 million . Non-death penalty cases were counted through to the end of incarceration and were found to have a median cost of $ 740,000 .""","""Then , how much money should spend on the war on terror ? Should we bankrupt the country to do it ? Is it necessary to spend so much that we go bankrupt , or is it better to wisely spend the money we have and to fight an intellegent war against terror ?""",DISAGREE,"""death penalty expenses 70 % more expensive""","""war on terror bankrupt the country""",,
13209,3464,"""the trait has to arise first . do you really think the traits Jim mentioned could happen randomly ? ... by mutation , no less ?""","""I think Kronus pretty much covered that one ... quite well actually . It 's sad SS , you always harp against NS , but you obviously have no clue what NS is really all about . I suggest a little educational reading . I at least read the bible before I began to publically debate it 's validity .""",DISAGREE,"""do you really think the traits Jim mentioned could happen randomly ? ... by mutation , no less ?""","""I suggest a little educational reading . I at least read the bible before I began to publically debate it 's validity .""",,
13211,3464,"""the trait has to arise first . do you really think the traits Jim mentioned could happen randomly ? ... by mutation , no less ?""","""I think Kronus pretty much covered that one ... quite well actually . It 's sad SS , you always harp against NS , but you obviously have no clue what NS is really all about . I suggest a little educational reading . I at least read the bible before I began to publically debate it 's validity .""",DISAGREE,"""do you really think the traits Jim mentioned could happen randomly ? no""","""I think Kronus pretty much covered that one""",,
13218,3466,"""which can quickly alter shape , color , size , structure , and behaviors of animals ?""","""That only occurs with some animals under very specific conditions . And low and behold , animals need the genes that code for it .""",DISAGREE,"""which can quickly alter shape , color , size , structure , and behaviors of animals ?""","""That only occurs with some animals under very specific conditions . And low and behold , animals need the genes that code for it .""",,
13236,3470,"""You 'll have to ask gnojek that . It appears he thinks that any pronouncement by a scientist suggesting CO2 production is a problem is a conspiracy theory by scientists to get bigger budgets : `` As scientists we will tell you that there is a major problem that can only be solved through science , which can only be done with money . We 're scientists and we really like grant money to do research . Would n't it be great if we had a global initiative to fund this research indefinitely , or until the global warming problem is solved ... `` It 's the YEC movement all over again : there 's no proof , the evidence could be interpreted either way , it 's a scientific conspiracy theory , the Devil is behind it : it 's un-Christian to cut back on fossil fuel burning etc""","""Ah , my bad ...""",AGREE,"""there 's no proof , the evidence could be interpreted either way ,""","""Ah , my bad ...""",,
13242,3471,"""Yes it is patent that you would assume that . Your wish to advertise this and tell the world , repeatedly must make you of some import . Repeatedly you make this a personal issue . I have addressed posts and say 'another poster has said ... such and such ' . But you insist that I address YOU in such posts . Now you are going at it again , saying I 'm not answering questions . This is an attempt to take the moral high-ground , and is itself highly deceitful , especially in light that you have in the past accused me of saying things that I did n't ... see our discussions re : Archie , the transitional bird-beast . Also , you name-call , and then chuck a tantrum if anyone does the same back . I must say here that I do wish you 'd stop personalising this , as it only leads to more confrontation , not discussion . Calling people names is just grand-standing . It is the sort of behaviour that suggests someone who is just interested in making themselves heard , regardless of anyone else .""","""And there is still no evidence on the table for YEC .""",DISAGREE,"""Repeatedly you make this a personal issue . I have addressed posts and say 'another poster""","""And there is still no evidence on the table for YEC .""",,
13258,3473,"""I do n't care much either way , as long as he never walks around loose again . But life in prison is going to cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars . That money could be better spent in the war on terror .""","""That 's why I say , `` Kill the bastard ! ``""",AGREE,"""life in prison is going to cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars . That money could be better spent in the war on terror .""","""That 's why I say , `` Kill the bastard ! ``""",,
13256,3473,"""I do n't care much either way , as long as he never walks around loose again . But life in prison is going to cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars . That money could be better spent in the war on terror .""","""That 's why I say , `` Kill the bastard ! ``""",AGREE,"""I do n't care much either way , as long as he never walks around loose again .""","""That 's why I say , `` Kill the bastard ! ``""",,
13272,3475,"""Of course St. Peter had the Bible , he had the Old Testament , and he he also had the New Testament , in his mind , because he lived and learned from Jesus . This is precisely whi St. Peter is one of the writers of the New Testament , because he already knew it .""","""So he knew everything Paul did , what was written in Revelation ...""",DISAGREE,"""St. Peter had the Bible , he had the Old Testament he also had the New Testament he lived and learned from Jesus St. Peter is one of the writers of the New Testament , because he already knew it""","""he knew everything Paul did what was written in Revelation ...""",,
13278,3475,"""Of course St. Peter had the Bible , he had the Old Testament , and he he also had the New Testament , in his mind , because he lived and learned from Jesus . This is precisely whi St. Peter is one of the writers of the New Testament , because he already knew it .""","""So he knew everything Paul did , what was written in Revelation ...""",DISAGREE,"""Of course St. Peter St. Peter is one of the writers of the New Testament""","""So he knew everything Paul did what was written""",,
13282,3476,"""Habbit has been reduced to meaningless insults . He made a fool of himself by demonstrating his ignorance of language and now has nothing worthwhile to say .""","""Do n't like it when the person you 're arguing against can be as sarcastic as you are , huh ? I understand , I get these types of whines all the time . thistownwilleat-""",DISAGREE,"""He made a fool of himself by demonstrating his ignorance of language and now has nothing worthwhile to say .""","""Do n't like it when the person you 're arguing against can be as sarcastic as you are , huh ?""",,
13304,3478,"""Because naturally the man should be responsible to pay for it ... one way or another , to support it ... and her in marraige , or provide child support , as provided in the law ... he did the deed , and must be made to pay .. The idea is that if men are held responsible for abortions , then they will put on a condom instead of taking the chance , ... and hence .. reduce the abortions or the need there of , and this would incourage them to marry .""","""Why is there this onus on the man to do everything ? As I said before , it is just as much the woman 's choice to have unprotected sex as it is the mans - if this is not the case , then it is already covered by rape laws . By your proposition , only the man need worry about birth control - the woman has no legal necessity to do so at all . It 's not a case that 'the man did the deed ' - both parties are potentially just as culpable . If you 're going to introduce legal consequences for abortion , they are going to have to affect all the guilty parties ; the woman included . However , personally I would argue against adding further legal restrictions to abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""he did the deed , and must be made to pay .. The idea is that if men are held responsible for abortions , then they will put on a condom instead of taking the chance""","""it is just as much the woman 's choice to have unprotected sex as it is the mans""",,
13312,3479,"""We 've already been over this and again you 're confusing two separate issues . I think everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""","""Well of course everybody is entitled . But as history has shown many southern states in America chose to ignore the Constitution and deny black people their rights on the basis of their skin color , using the `` black codes `` enacted after the Civil War . If it were n't for the 14th Amendment that forced state governments to abide by the constitution , minorities would still be out in the cold . The only thing we 've been over , is that government and gun control is racist , not the Second Amendment .""",DISAGREE,"""I think everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""","""as history has shown many southern states in America chose to ignore the Constitution and deny black people their rights""",,
13315,3479,"""We 've already been over this and again you 're confusing two separate issues . I think everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""","""Well of course everybody is entitled . But as history has shown many southern states in America chose to ignore the Constitution and deny black people their rights on the basis of their skin color , using the `` black codes `` enacted after the Civil War . If it were n't for the 14th Amendment that forced state governments to abide by the constitution , minorities would still be out in the cold . The only thing we 've been over , is that government and gun control is racist , not the Second Amendment .""",DISAGREE,"""We 've already been over this and again you 're confusing two separate issues . I think everyone is agreed that people no matter what race are entitled to equal protection under the law .""","""If it were n't for the 14th Amendment that forced state governments to abide by the constitution , minorities would still be out in the cold . The only thing we 've been over , is that government and gun control is racist , not the Second Amendment .""",,
13333,3482,"""Quotes from your silly little book of fairytales do not qualify as evidence of anything but an over active imagination and your interpretation of said book leaves much to be desired .""","""So , we are debating creation , yet you do n't consider quoting the bible , the single most important original proponent of the creation account and to you , it does n't qualify as a source for what is being discussed here ? You say this and expect to be taken seriously ?""",DISAGREE,"""Quotes from your silly little book of fairytales do not qualify as evidence of anything""","""we are debating creation , yet you do n't consider quoting the bible , the single most important original proponent of the creation account""",,
13342,3483,"""thanks for posting ... I will watch this . I ca n't say I have high hopes though , considering it 's on PBS . They do n't have a great track record for scientific neutrality . I 'm sure this will have some sort of biased darwinian spin on it .""","""This is ridiculous . Evolution is `` scientifically neutral `` . It 's you who has the bias .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm sure this will have some sort of biased darwinian spin on it .""","""This is ridiculous . Evolution is `` scientifically neutral `` . It 's you who has the bias .""",,
13346,3484,"""Steeeeve , ALABAMA voted out `` miscegenation `` in 2000 `` by act of legislature `` . http : //www.usatoday.com/news/vote2000/al/main03.htm Loving v Virginia ruled Alabama 's law as unconstitutional over 30 years prior . The truth is that when the court notes that a law is unconstitutional , the law becomes unenforceable . The COURT does not remove the law from the books . The legislature must accomplish that act by its actions . But the action of the court , invalidating the law , PRECEDES the action of the legislature ... I am asking about states where the legislature , without having the courts already striking down the law , took it upon themselves to remove the miscegenation law all by themselves . That is the point .""","""And I 'm saying all but 16 states had already had the law removed before the Loving case . Most of these were done via the legislature and very few had the law overturned by a court . In fact , only California comes to mind as a state that had the statue overturned by the courts instead of on repeal by the legislature . Who knew ... but there is a wikipedia page on this : Anti-miscegenation laws - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia It does n't say whether or not it was via a court case or not but I know that California was a court case and Massachusetts and many Northern/mid-west state were via legislature action . Also , the Supreme Court case ruled the Virginia law unconstitutional not the Alabama law . It is just understood that similar laws will be overturned thus they are negated .""",AGREE,"""am asking about states where the legislature , without having the courts already striking down the law , took it upon themselves to remove the miscegenation law all by themselves .""","""And I 'm saying all but 16 states had already had the law removed before the Loving case . Most of these were done via the legislature and very few had the law overturned by a court""",,
13364,3487,"""And then there 's the fact that registration databases are nothing more than money pits that serve no crime fighting benefits , Canada has stated such . Any attempt at a database is going to waste taxpayer money , take police off the streets , and require police to prosecute honest people for paperwork errors rather than going after gang members and other criminals . Oh and then we come to the fact that criminals will never register their weapons , leaving them untraceable !""","""While it 's true that criminals wo n't be lining up to register guns that they already own , gun registration could make it harder for them to obtain more guns in the future . Registration could require law abiding citizens to be more careful about who they sell their guns to as well as making it easier to trace back a lost or stolen gun to the original owner .""",DISAGREE,"""registration databases are nothing more than money pits that serve no crime fighting benefits Any attempt at a database is going to waste taxpayer money , take police off the streets , and require police to prosecute honest people for paperwork errors rather than going after gang members and other criminals criminals will never register their weapons leaving them untraceable !""","""criminals wo n't be lining up to register guns that they already own gun registration could make it harder for them to obtain more guns Registration could require law abiding citizens to be more careful about who they sell their guns to easier to trace""",,
13366,3487,"""And then there 's the fact that registration databases are nothing more than money pits that serve no crime fighting benefits , Canada has stated such . Any attempt at a database is going to waste taxpayer money , take police off the streets , and require police to prosecute honest people for paperwork errors rather than going after gang members and other criminals . Oh and then we come to the fact that criminals will never register their weapons , leaving them untraceable !""","""While it 's true that criminals wo n't be lining up to register guns that they already own , gun registration could make it harder for them to obtain more guns in the future . Registration could require law abiding citizens to be more careful about who they sell their guns to as well as making it easier to trace back a lost or stolen gun to the original owner .""",DISAGREE,"""registration databases are nothing more than money pits that serve no crime fighting benefits criminals will never register their weapons , leaving them untraceable !""","""true that criminals wo n't be lining up to register guns gun registration could make it harder for them to obtain more guns in the future .""",,
13372,3488,"""Is even 'channel ' sufficiently ateleological a verb ?""","""Yes . It describes an action without ascribing its form to its end result , outcome , whatever but strictly to a cause/s force/s in action . That is why 'selection ' is always teleological . In order to select or choose anything , an end must always be in view . There must always be a volitional discrimination of options based upon a criterion dictated by the desired end . The only time `` channel `` becomes teleological is when something live [ a human or a beaver , let 's say ] intententionally does the channeling . But since it is understood that mechanical forces can also 'channel ' , unintentional , out of simple mechanics , the word channel can not be called teleological . In the same way , 'sorting ' can be considered non-teleological , hence mechanical , and thus suited to your glossary , because things can be sorted by mechanical forces alone . But 'selection ' always requires volition and awareness . So 'selection ' is always teleological .""",AGREE,"""Is even 'channel ' sufficiently ateleological a verb ?""","""Yes . It describes an action without ascribing its form to its end result , outcome , becomes teleological is when something live [ a human or a beaver . So 'selection ' is always teleological .""",,
13392,3491,"""Honest question Arch : where is the problem with a potential variance of 10 billion years ? I know this question may appear ridiculous to you but could you take the question in the spirit it was meant ?""","""Answered above . I edited my post with further explanation .""",DISAGREE,"""where is the problem with a potential variance of 10 billion years ?""","""I edited my post with further explanation .""",,
13393,3492,"""Then your argument too is flawed by the same principals of debate .""","""Because ? The conventional big bang is just as unlikely as God . Therefore your claim is wrong . However the current believe mainly among physicists and astronomers is that there is no end and there is no beginning to the universe . Expansionary theories along with contractionary theories that are being observed have led many to believe that the current universe was born from the death of the last universe . There is no end and there is no beginning . You are out of your league .""",DISAGREE,"""Then your argument too is flawed by the same principals of debate""","""Because ? The conventional big bang is just as unlikely as God . Therefore your claim is wrong .""",,
13411,3494,"""Time to get a helmet ... Where to start with this proposal ? First such a plan could lead to DC style gun control where you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , and then they could immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban .""","""So ? A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",DISAGREE,"""you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , creating a de facto ban .""","""city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",,
13409,3494,"""Time to get a helmet ... Where to start with this proposal ? First such a plan could lead to DC style gun control where you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , and then they could immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban .""","""So ? A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",DISAGREE,"""Time to get a helmet ... Where to start with this proposal ?""","""A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",,
13406,3494,"""Time to get a helmet ... Where to start with this proposal ? First such a plan could lead to DC style gun control where you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , and then they could immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban .""","""So ? A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",DISAGREE,"""First such a plan could lead to DC style gun control where you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , and then they could immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban""","""A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",,
13408,3494,"""Time to get a helmet ... Where to start with this proposal ? First such a plan could lead to DC style gun control where you could only own a handgun if it was registered with the city , and then they could immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban .""","""So ? A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",DISAGREE,"""own a handgun if it was registered with the city , immediately halt any and all registration at any time , creating a de facto ban""","""A city could just as easily ban all future sales of firearms to citizens without gun registration .""",,
13421,3495,"""I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate .""","""Could it partially be the fact that they do n't want antiquated belief system dogma making their decisions ? Must have access to a sonogram sounds like a lobby group attempting to sway opinion while enhancing revenue . Does the legislation force pregnant women who have not chosen abortion to have a sonogram ? Raising children creates post-delivery stress syndrome .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate""","""fact that they do n't want antiquated belief system dogma making their decisions ? Does the legislation force pregnant women who have not chosen abortion to have a sonogram ?""",,
13422,3495,"""I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate .""","""Could it partially be the fact that they do n't want antiquated belief system dogma making their decisions ? Must have access to a sonogram sounds like a lobby group attempting to sway opinion while enhancing revenue . Does the legislation force pregnant women who have not chosen abortion to have a sonogram ? Raising children creates post-delivery stress syndrome .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate""","""Must have access to a sonogram sounds like a lobby group attempting to sway opinion while enhancing revenue . Does the legislation force pregnant women who have not chosen abortion to have a sonogram ?""",,
13429,3496,"""Objections ? ( Lurch , do n't tell me that I have n't studied evolution because I have . )""","""Really ? Then give me the definition of evolution . I 'm not asking for a statement of theory , or an example of evolution . What is the definition used by evolutionary biologists of evolution ? I suspect that you have n't studied evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't tell me that I have n't studied evolution because I have .""","""Then give me the definition of evolution , What is the definition used by evolutionary biologists of evolution ? I suspect that you have n't studied evolution .""",,
13436,3497,"""So why are people from the gun lobby always whining about restrictions like this ?""","""Because you people keep wanting one restriction after another after another after another . Nothing is ever good enough for you , you always want more than ever . Well we do n't want to abide by your wishes , gun ownership is a recognized right , and your hatred of rights wo n't be tolerated . We 're not going to just stand by and be painted as the bad guys because you have the mentally disabled belief that banning gun ownership will reduce crime , and anybody who disagrees with you want to see people killed .""",DISAGREE,"""why are people from the gun lobby always whining about restrictions like this ?""","""Because you people keep wanting one restriction after another , We 're not going to just stand by and be painted as the bad guys because you have the mentally disabled belief that banning gun ownership will reduce crime""",,
13444,3497,"""So why are people from the gun lobby always whining about restrictions like this ?""","""Because you people keep wanting one restriction after another after another after another . Nothing is ever good enough for you , you always want more than ever . Well we do n't want to abide by your wishes , gun ownership is a recognized right , and your hatred of rights wo n't be tolerated . We 're not going to just stand by and be painted as the bad guys because you have the mentally disabled belief that banning gun ownership will reduce crime , and anybody who disagrees with you want to see people killed .""",DISAGREE,"""why are people from the gun lobby always whining about restrictions like this ?""","""We 're not going to just stand by and be painted as the bad guys because you have the mentally disabled belief that banning gun ownership will reduce crime , and anybody who disagrees with you want to see people killed .""",,
13470,3500,"""Define `` information `` in a testable , biologically meaningful way .""","""Just a reminder , Belfrey : Do n't hold your breath ...""",DISAGREE,"""Define `` information `` in a testable , biologically meaningful way .""","""Just a reminder , Belfrey : Do n't hold your breath ...""",,
13477,3508,"""Id never hurt a child , Id much prefer to torture gun owners""","""So now you 're freely and willingly admitting that you 'd take pleasure in inflicting pain and suffering on innocent people who have never done anything to you ? Good God ! No wonder you do n't like guns and want to see everyone disarmed !""",DISAGREE,"""Id never hurt a child , Id much prefer to torture gun owners""","""you 'd take pleasure in inflicting pain and suffering on innocent people No wonder you do n't like guns and want to see everyone disarmed !""",,
13479,3509,"""Originally posted by fallingupwards oh no ! ! broker has threatened to stop loving this country if we help the poor ! ! we better go back to capitalism ! !""","""You will never help the poor with a socialist system . The first casuality of a socialist state is the spirit of charity . The concept of charity in European societies does not exist , because it is the government job to the help the poor . Government officials just do n't strike me as being natural care givers . What then happens is you get a token `` official `` who pretends to give a rats pututie for carring about the poor , to make all the heartless people in a socialist state feel good that the government is doing something .""",DISAGREE,"""broker has threatened to stop loving this country if we help the poor !""","""You will never help the poor with a socialist system .""",,
13487,3512,"""by simply calling a fetus a `` parasite `` and thus daintily strutting off away from one 's obvious duties""","""The only 'duty ' that any human being has with a parasite is to extract it as quickly as they can , if they chose to do so .""",DISAGREE,"""simply calling a fetus a `` parasite `` and thus daintily strutting off away from one 's obvious duties""","""human being has with a parasite is to extract it as quickly as they can , if they chose to do so""",,
13513,3520,"""So you 're saying that the modern day militia no longer utilizes privately owned weapons ? In 1792 the militia made use of privately owned weapons and thus the federal government kept a record of privately owned weapons to determine its military readiness . [ /url ]""","""No . I am saying . Privately owned guns serve the purpose of the militia , which is all citizens over 17 years of age . I am saying , a list of names and addresses do not serve any purpose of military readiness . My signature , yes it has no bearing on the Brady.org . I appologize for any confusion if anyone has interpreted as so . Your signature is about gun registration in a gun registration thread .""",DISAGREE,"""militia no longer utilizes privately owned weapons ?""","""Privately owned guns serve the purpose Your signature is about gun registration""",,
13521,3523,"""This just makes good sense . Teach it how it is , not how you wish it was .""","""We do . And you are on a school board and you spout creationist * * * * like that ?""",DISAGREE,"""Teach it how it is ,""","""And you are on a school board and you spout creationist * * * * like that ?""",,
13537,3526,"""The only difference is that the gene for making short hair has been eradicated from the population by natural selection -- that is it .""","""Right . The frenquecy of the alles have changed over time .""",AGREE,"""the gene for making short hair has been eradicated from the population by natural selection""","""Right .""",,
13545,3528,"""Um , OK : Utah mall reopens after rampage - Crime & amp ; courts- msnbc.com""","""And the mall plainly had `` no guns allowed `` signs displayed at all the entrances , meaning the shooter broke the law when he brought his gun in and started shooting . Now , find me a school massacre that took place where concealed carry is actually legal on campus .""",AGREE,"""Um , OK : Utah mall reopens after rampage""","""And the mall plainly had `` no guns allowed `` signs displayed at all the entrances , meaning the shooter broke the law when he brought his gun in and started shooting .""",,
13553,3529,"""Well , there is a new discovery on the block . This time , evolutionary psychologist David Buss , from the University of Texas , argues that murder is also an adaptation . Murder could be traced back to the  “ ruthless evolutionary drive to reproduce ” , he said . Thousands of years ago killing an enemy would boost a man ’ s social status and improve his chances of attracting a mate , the book argued . Murderers ’ genes won the evolutionary battle over those of their victims and the instinct to kill now lies dormant in all of us , Prof Buss argued . I don ’ t want to comment on Buss ’ s argument as I have not read the book . Nevertheless , since it is so easy to create a new field of scientific exploration about human behavior using Darwin ’ s theory , I am inspired to try my hand at it .""","""This can only be plausible if the victims were killed before they reproduced . But , still evolutionary psychology is tenously at best called `` science. `` Just as most of psychology IMO is barely science , if at all .""",DISAGREE,"""argues that murder is also an adaptation . Murder could be traced back to the  ruthless evolutionary drive to reproduce , he said .""","""This can only be plausible if the victims were killed before they reproduced .""",,
13585,3543,"""Nobody considers a petri dish pregnant ,""","""But they consider the exact same thing inside a human that has yet to be implanted a pregnancy ? Double standards much ?""",DISAGREE,"""Nobody considers a petri dish pregnant""","""But they consider the exact same thing inside a human Double standards much ?""",,
13592,3544,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""That 's like asking why do you get to choose what to do with your own hair or teeth , because it is part of YOUR body . Men have this right . Women have this same right .""",DISAGREE,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""Men have this right . Women have this same right .""",,
13595,3544,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""That 's like asking why do you get to choose what to do with your own hair or teeth , because it is part of YOUR body . Men have this right . Women have this same right .""",DISAGREE,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""That 's like asking why do you get to choose what to do with your own hair or teeth""",,
13596,3544,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""That 's like asking why do you get to choose what to do with your own hair or teeth , because it is part of YOUR body . Men have this right . Women have this same right .""",DISAGREE,"""Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ?""","""That 's like asking why do you get to choose what to do with your own hair or teeth""",,
13636,3551,"""I think it 's because their laws prevent most criminals from obtaining guns .""","""No , they do not . I know several people in England who posess weapons the bought on the street . How are the gun laws in england working when you can buy a machine gun ? Before the ban , england had lower numbers when it came to firearms related deaths . They also had lower crime numbers . The sociological differences between England and the United States are not be be discounted . It is interesting to note that crime rates in England seem to be rising now that the gun ban has been around for a while . There is even a movement by public officials to arm police officers in response to the rising rate of violent crime . There isa n article and debate about it right here on the forums . The biggest difference lately in the statistics in England in the US is not the numbers , it is how they are recorded . If a guy is confronted by three people outside a bar and shot to death , but the gus get off during trial , it is still recorded in America s a three person homocide . In england , it is NOT recorded . I get the London Times , and they have done several articles accusing th British government of manipulating crime figures . I think that if we in America only recorded solved crimes in our crime statistics , we might become one of the most cime free contries in the world !""",DISAGREE,"""I think it 's because their laws prevent most criminals from obtaining guns""","""I think that if we in America only recorded solved crimes in our crime statistics , we might become one of the most cime free contries in the world !""",,
13640,3551,"""I think it 's because their laws prevent most criminals from obtaining guns .""","""No , they do not . I know several people in England who posess weapons the bought on the street . How are the gun laws in england working when you can buy a machine gun ? Before the ban , england had lower numbers when it came to firearms related deaths . They also had lower crime numbers . The sociological differences between England and the United States are not be be discounted . It is interesting to note that crime rates in England seem to be rising now that the gun ban has been around for a while . There is even a movement by public officials to arm police officers in response to the rising rate of violent crime . There isa n article and debate about it right here on the forums . The biggest difference lately in the statistics in England in the US is not the numbers , it is how they are recorded . If a guy is confronted by three people outside a bar and shot to death , but the gus get off during trial , it is still recorded in America s a three person homocide . In england , it is NOT recorded . I get the London Times , and they have done several articles accusing th British government of manipulating crime figures . I think that if we in America only recorded solved crimes in our crime statistics , we might become one of the most cime free contries in the world !""",DISAGREE,"""I think it 's because their laws prevent most criminals from obtaining guns .""","""No , they do not . I know several people in England who posess weapons the bought on the street .""",,
13646,3552,"""... the fact Von Braun was a nazi does not prove all science is wrong .""","""Nor does the fact that he was a Christian prove all Christianity is wrong .""",DISAGREE,""" the fact Von Braun was a nazi does not prove all science is wrong .""","""Nor does the fact that he was a Christian prove all Christianity is wrong .""",,
13649,3552,"""... the fact Von Braun was a nazi does not prove all science is wrong .""","""Nor does the fact that he was a Christian prove all Christianity is wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""the fact Von Braun was a nazi does not prove all science is wrong .""","""Nor does the fact that he was a Christian prove all Christianity is wrong .""",,
13657,3553,"""For years I 've tried to get one of our resident gay members to debate me on that fact . To date , no takers . Want to step up ?""","""On what that drugs and alchohol are not moral equivelants to being gay ?""",DISAGREE,"""For years I 've tried to get one of our resident gay members to debate me on that fact .""","""On what that drugs and alchohol are not moral equivelants to being gay ?""",,
13666,3554,"""I understand that you support evolution , so do n't get me wrong . However , if something is `` changing in response to new selective pressure , `` then it must be at least somewhat `` purposeful , `` no ?""","""Perhaps I can help :""",DISAGREE,"""I understand that you support evolution , so do n't get me wrong .""","""Perhaps I can help :""",,
13675,3555,"""It does mean they are all the same , concerning mathematics .""","""So when you 're doing math , you 're an atheist ? Of course not . Just because there is overlap does n't mean that the two views are identical .""",DISAGREE,"""It does mean they are all the same , concerning mathematics .""","""Of course not . Just because there is overlap does n't mean that the two views are identical .""",,
13688,3556,"""Genes are the heritable information store of cells , they perform their function , other subsystems perform other functions . The whole constitutes a living cell .""","""* * This much you got right .""",AGREE,"""Genes are the heritable information store of cells , they perform their function , other subsystems perform other functions . The whole constitutes a living cell .""","""This much you got right""",,
13686,3556,"""Genes are the heritable information store of cells , they perform their function , other subsystems perform other functions . The whole constitutes a living cell .""","""* * This much you got right .""",AGREE,"""Genes are the heritable information store of cells""","""This much you got right .""",,
13701,3558,"""Darwinian natural selection as opposed to the Christian theism of creationism has implications for western civilization like few subjects in the modern world .""","""Darwinian natural selection is n't opposed to Christianity . In fact , if you took the time to inform yourself you would find that Christian organizations like the ICR and AIG both clearly state that natural selection is a reality and consider it foolish to deny it . In fact , young earth creationists propose evolution by means of natural selection at rates that boggle the minds of evolutionary biologists . They reason that the millions of species of animals that we know of today evolved in very few years after the flood of Noah from the few thousand `` kinds `` that were aboard the ark . I think that you have confused one of Darwin 's theories with the modern biological theory of evolution . It seems that you are n't aware of the fact that Darwin was not the first scientist to state a theory of evolution . Darwin merely restated the simple idea that populations of animals are observed to change over time , an old idea that was accepted by many naturalists of the day . In fact , even Darwin 's grandfather wrote about evolution . By the time Darwin sailed on the Beagle , evolution was an old idea and by the time Darwin published On the Origin of Species the idea was 28 years older . Darwin proposed a mechanism of evolution , which is why his idea gained such wide acceptance almost immediately . What Darwin 's theory lacked was a mechanism of heredity by which novel characteristics were able to remain in a population and not be overwhelmed by majority of the population that lacked that characteristic . None of the theories of heredity of Darwin 's day could account for the origin and increase of new characteristics in a population . That was the greatest challenge to `` Darwinism `` until the early decades of the 20th century when Mendel 's work was rediscovered .""",DISAGREE,"""Darwinian natural selection as opposed to the Christian theism of creationism has implications for western civilization like few subjects in the modern world .""","""natural selection is n't opposed to Christianity . In fact , if you took the time to inform yourself you would find that Christian organizations like the ICR and AIG both clearly state that natural selection is a reality and consider it foolish to deny it . In fact , young earth creationists propose evolution by means of natural selection at rates that boggle the minds of evolutionary biologists""",,
13704,3559,"""Article : http : //reuters.myway.com/article/200 ... ORTION-DC.html . As I foreshadowed in this thread and this thread , South Dakota has passed a ban on abortion . According to the articla , the South Dakota law punishes those who perform an abortion with a 5 year prison sentence and a $ 5,000 fine . There is a life exception as I understand it .""","""Oh well thats tough hat to victims of rape then . Somehow I doubt this will survive legal challenges , assuming Gov.Rounds actually signs the Bill .""",DISAGREE,"""As I foreshadowed in this thread and this thread , South Dakota has passed a ban on abortion . According to the articla , the South Dakota law punishes those who perform an abortion with a 5 year prison sentence and a $ 5,000 fine . There is a life exception as I understand it .""","""Oh well thats tough hat to victims of rape then . Somehow I doubt this will survive legal challenges , assuming Gov.Rounds actually signs the Bill .""",,
13713,3560,"""The difference then could be construed as pro-life being in favour of all forms of life , no matter how degraded , and pro-choice being in favour of a particular minimum quality of life .""","""All forms of life ? Animal life ? Plant life ? The mold growing in your bathroom ?""",DISAGREE,"""all forms of life , no matter how degraded ,""","""The mold growing in your bathroom ?""",,
13728,3563,"""No more need be said except this : http : //www.4forums.com/political/365910-post53.html""","""And this : `` Speak up for those who can not speak for themselves ; ensure justice for those who are perishing. `` Proverbs 31:8Also ... Exodus 21 22 `` If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury , the offender must be fined whatever the woman 's husband demands and the court allows . 23 But if there is serious injury , you are to take life for life , 24 eye for eye , tooth for tooth , hand for hand , foot for foot , 25 burn for burn , wound for wound , bruise for bruise . 1 ) If a woman gives birth prematurely , but there is no serious injury -- i.e . the baby lives without harm , then a fine results to compensate for the assault . 2 ) If a woman gives birth prematurely , and the baby dies , then the assailant is to be given the death penalty . This point is HUGE ! ! ! What God is saying here is that the value and worth of an adult man is equal to the value and worth of an unborn fetus who was young enough , or injured enough , to die . God equates the loss of an unborn baby as the loss of a life , for He says , `` you are to take life for life , ... `` This point can not be emphasized too strongly . God considers the unborn baby alive , and the loss of that life is considered murder . This murder is punishable with the death penalty . This verse demonstrates three truths : a ) The unborn 's life is equivalent in value to an adult 's life in God 's sight b ) This also outlines God 's Law against criminal feticide . c ) The killing of the unborn is murder Bible and abortion : The Biblical case against abortion""",AGREE,"""No more need be said except this : http : //www.4forums.com/political/365910-post53.html""","""And this : `` Speak up for those who can not speak for themselves ; ensure justice for those who are perishing. ``""",,
13729,3563,"""No more need be said except this : http : //www.4forums.com/political/365910-post53.html""","""And this : `` Speak up for those who can not speak for themselves ; ensure justice for those who are perishing. `` Proverbs 31:8Also ... Exodus 21 22 `` If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury , the offender must be fined whatever the woman 's husband demands and the court allows . 23 But if there is serious injury , you are to take life for life , 24 eye for eye , tooth for tooth , hand for hand , foot for foot , 25 burn for burn , wound for wound , bruise for bruise . 1 ) If a woman gives birth prematurely , but there is no serious injury -- i.e . the baby lives without harm , then a fine results to compensate for the assault . 2 ) If a woman gives birth prematurely , and the baby dies , then the assailant is to be given the death penalty . This point is HUGE ! ! ! What God is saying here is that the value and worth of an adult man is equal to the value and worth of an unborn fetus who was young enough , or injured enough , to die . God equates the loss of an unborn baby as the loss of a life , for He says , `` you are to take life for life , ... `` This point can not be emphasized too strongly . God considers the unborn baby alive , and the loss of that life is considered murder . This murder is punishable with the death penalty . This verse demonstrates three truths : a ) The unborn 's life is equivalent in value to an adult 's life in God 's sight b ) This also outlines God 's Law against criminal feticide . c ) The killing of the unborn is murder Bible and abortion : The Biblical case against abortion""",AGREE,"""No more need be said except this : http : //www.4forums.com/political/365910-post53.html""","""And this : `` Speak up for those who can not speak for themselves ; ensure justice for those who are""",,
13737,3579,"""So you are saying you would not mind if abortion were compulsary ?""","""I think you missed the point of what I was saying""",DISAGREE,"""So you are saying you would not mind if abortion were compulsary""","""I think you missed the point of what I was saying""",,
13744,3581,"""Do n't smoke it , never smoked it , will never smoke it . People who smoke dope are losers . Meanwhile , I drank a fifth of Tequila last night . Perfectly acceptable . Nothing wrong with it .""","""Does this seem a little ironic to anyone else ? Either becoming intoxicated is acceptable or it is n't , why does the method make one acceptable and practitioners of the other `` losers `` ? For the record I do n't drink , smoke or partake of illegal drugs .""",DISAGREE,"""Do n't smoke it , never smoked it , will never smoke it . People who smoke dope are losers .""","""Does this seem a little ironic to anyone else ?""",,
13747,3581,"""Do n't smoke it , never smoked it , will never smoke it . People who smoke dope are losers . Meanwhile , I drank a fifth of Tequila last night . Perfectly acceptable . Nothing wrong with it .""","""Does this seem a little ironic to anyone else ? Either becoming intoxicated is acceptable or it is n't , why does the method make one acceptable and practitioners of the other `` losers `` ? For the record I do n't drink , smoke or partake of illegal drugs .""",DISAGREE,"""Do n't smoke it , never smoked it , will never smoke it .""","""I do n't drink , smoke or partake of illegal drugs .""",,
13749,3582,"""I ca n't judge women who decide their fetus is not a person at the time of abortion . I do know that first trimester is a `` no-brainer `` for me as far as the legality for abortion . Second trimester is probably okay and the third is not in my view . However , the third trimester should not be a deterent if the health of the mother is at issue . She 's most important or the rest of the family will not survive .""","""I know I have told you this before but a trimester has no science meaning in it at all . It is simply just a term to say `` 3 months `` . I 'm not sure how a man-made time split can be used to determine who is an isnt ' a person ... but maybe you can explain this .""",DISAGREE,"""I ca n't judge women who decide their fetus is not a person at the time of abortion""","""a trimester has no science meaning in it at all . It is simply just a term to say `` 3 months ``""",,
13773,3587,"""It certainly did n't protect the Iraqi people against political tyranny .""","""So taking away all their guns would have been better ? The ruling party was certainly well armed how about the other parties ?""",DISAGREE,"""It certainly did n't protect the Iraqi people against political tyranny .""","""So taking away all their guns would have been better ?""",,
13784,3590,"""14 . PREVENT DEALERS FROM LIQUIDATING THEIR INVENTORY WITHOUT BACKGROUND CHECKS AFTER THEIR LICENSES HAVE BEEN REVOKED Even after ATF revokes a dealer ’ s license for violating federal law , it has allowed those dealers to transfer their inventory – frequently hundreds of guns – to their  “ personal collections ,  ” and then sell them .""","""So , which is it ? You do n't want violators of Federal law to have guns , yet you do n't want them to get rid of them either . Ca n't possibly do both , now can you ? Which one ? Do the law breakers keep them , or not ? Make it against the law to keep the guns ... now make it against the law to sell them . DUH ! I guess we 'll just hang out in limbo-land !""",DISAGREE,"""PREVENT DEALERS FROM LIQUIDATING THEIR INVENTORY WITHOUT BACKGROUND CHECKS AFTER THEIR LICENSES HAVE BEEN REVOKED""","""So , which is it ? You do n't want violators of Federal law to have guns , yet you do n't want them to get rid of them either . Ca n't possibly do both , now can you ? Which one ? Do the law breakers keep them , or not ?""",,
13795,3592,"""What we have is a misuse of the Razor . The Razor is not supposed to be used for comparing hypotheses . Instead , it 's supposed to keep hypotheses out of descriptions of phenomenon .""","""Just like evolution was n't supposed to be used to show that fundamentalism is wrong ? Despite my claims that logic is a better tool for refuting fundamentalism , evolution is perceived as the big `` threat. ``""",DISAGREE,"""What we have is a misuse of the Razor . The Razor is not supposed to be used for comparing hypotheses . Instead , it 's supposed to keep hypotheses out of descriptions of phenomenon .""","""Just like evolution was n't supposed to be used to show that fundamentalism is wrong ?""",,
13816,3597,"""I 'll have you know that the abortion went without a hitch , and my uterus is perfectly healthy , thankyouverymuch ( not that it is any of your business ) , and yes , I do plan to have a child in the future , and do n't really care what you think about it .""","""It 's NOT any of my business , but when presenting information to the readers at large , such topics need to be # # # # ing addressed , something militant pro-abortionist seldom want to bring up . I 'm actually happy that you had a good operation and think more should go into ensuring ALL women have the same low risk proceedures when necessary . We 're dealing with health aspects , all , not just selective . And there may even be things I 'm not aware about to consider .""",AGREE,"""abortion went without a hitch , and my uterus is perfectly healthy , thankyouverymuch""","""something militant pro-abortionist seldom want to bring up""",,
13824,3599,"""They say that there can even be variation within a kind , a sort of Biblical evolutionary theory , whereby species develop within the broader `` kind `` classifiacation .""","""Yes . But that means that the cat `` kind `` , a single pair , produced 4 genera with 36 species in , at most , a couple hundred years . And that does n't even include domestic cats . It makes the head of any evolutionary biologist spin ! Creationists who wish to deny evolution invoke hyperevolution for thousands of `` kinds `` to yield millions of species in hundreds of years . And yet , they deny evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""kind a sort of Biblical evolutionary theory , classifiacation""","""Creationists who wish to deny evolution invoke hyperevolution""",,
13822,3599,"""They say that there can even be variation within a kind , a sort of Biblical evolutionary theory , whereby species develop within the broader `` kind `` classifiacation .""","""Yes . But that means that the cat `` kind `` , a single pair , produced 4 genera with 36 species in , at most , a couple hundred years . And that does n't even include domestic cats . It makes the head of any evolutionary biologist spin ! Creationists who wish to deny evolution invoke hyperevolution for thousands of `` kinds `` to yield millions of species in hundreds of years . And yet , they deny evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""a sort of Biblical evolutionary theory , whereby species develop within the broader `` kind `` .""","""But that means that the cat `` kind `` , a single pair , produced 4 genera with 36 species in , at most , a couple hundred years .""",,
13842,3602,"""Well if it saves my life what is the problem ? ? Are n't we pro life here ? ? ? ? ?""","""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""",DISAGREE,"""Well if it saves my life what is the problem ?""","""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul""",,
13855,3604,"""They are utterly nonproductive , they waste health care dollars , they do not begin to adequately provide health care . Truth be told , health insurance companies do more to prevent health care than they cause heath care to occur . Profit and greed and enormous CEO salaries and excessive CEO bonuses are the only reasons for being of health insurance companies . Those who are insured by health insurance companies are almost always totally screwed . They pay and pay premiums and get very little in return .""","""You think its bad now ? Watch what happens if Gov't takes control . I saw a great tagline the other day , it said `` If the US get socialized medicine where will Canadians get healthcare ? `` Anyone who does n't like insurance premiums is free not to pay them , at least until the gov't takes over . Happy New Year""",DISAGREE,"""They are utterly nonproductive , they waste health care dollars , they do not begin to adequately provide health care .""","""You think its bad now ? Watch what happens if Gov't takes control .""",,
13856,3604,"""They are utterly nonproductive , they waste health care dollars , they do not begin to adequately provide health care . Truth be told , health insurance companies do more to prevent health care than they cause heath care to occur . Profit and greed and enormous CEO salaries and excessive CEO bonuses are the only reasons for being of health insurance companies . Those who are insured by health insurance companies are almost always totally screwed . They pay and pay premiums and get very little in return .""","""You think its bad now ? Watch what happens if Gov't takes control . I saw a great tagline the other day , it said `` If the US get socialized medicine where will Canadians get healthcare ? `` Anyone who does n't like insurance premiums is free not to pay them , at least until the gov't takes over . Happy New Year""",DISAGREE,"""They are utterly nonproductive they do not begin to adequately provide health care .""","""You think its bad now ? Watch what happens if Gov't takes control .""",,
13867,3628,"""You do n't seem all that upset over eight children being murdered . Why , is the number too low before you get your dander up ? Does the anti-gun crowd have a threshold of death that has to be reached before there 's outcry over it ?""","""Another slimy attempt by you to misrepresent my position . Of course eight children being murdered is a horrible tragedy but statistically it does n't tell us anything . You and your comrades might want to educate yourselves about the meaning of `` statistical significance `` before responding .""",DISAGREE,"""You do n't seem all that upset over eight children being murdered . Why , is the number too low before you get your dander up ?""","""Another slimy attempt by you to misrepresent my position . Of course eight children being murdered is a horrible tragedy but statistically it does n't tell us anything . ``""",,
13907,3637,"""Yeah , see this is the old `` gateway drug `` fallacy . If anything is a gateway drug , it 's alcohol , so why is it still legal ? If a drug can act as a `` gateway `` to other drugs , is n't that why it 's illegal ?""","""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that herion addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana . Would legalization help this ? I dunno , but probably cause many other problems without everyone legalizing it .""",DISAGREE,"""If anything is a gateway drug , it 's alcohol , so why is it still legal ? If a drug can act as a `` gateway `` to other drugs , is n't that why it 's illegal ?""","""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that herion addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana .""",,
13909,3637,"""Yeah , see this is the old `` gateway drug `` fallacy . If anything is a gateway drug , it 's alcohol , so why is it still legal ? If a drug can act as a `` gateway `` to other drugs , is n't that why it 's illegal ?""","""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that herion addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana . Would legalization help this ? I dunno , but probably cause many other problems without everyone legalizing it .""",DISAGREE,"""Yeah , see this is the old `` gateway drug `` fallacy""","""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that herion addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana""",,
13928,3655,"""You might be interested to know that Chicago had a black mayor from 1983 to 1987 -while the ban was in effect . You 're just playing the race card .""","""And Daley fought harder than anyone to keep it in place . What 's your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""You might be interested to know that Chicago had a black mayor from 1983 to 1987""","""And Daley fought harder than anyone to keep it in place""",,
13941,3658,"""As the floodwaters advanced during the global Flood , humans would have fled to higher ground , swam or held on to floating debris for as long as possible . Also , human corpses bloat and therefore float on the water ’ s surface . Hence very few , if any , humans would be buried by sediment . Instead they would have rotted and decayed without fossilization .""","""Apparently , all them dinosaurs were just too dumb to climb to higher ground or swim ( despite the fact that animals are among the first to do so in disasters - example would be the tsunami in Christmas 2004 ) All of this also avoids the flying reptiles such as the Pteranodons . Also , apparently humans are unique in that they are the only ones whose corpses bload and float to the water 's surface . What garbage will they come up with next ?""",DISAGREE,"""floodwaters global Flood humans would be buried by sediment""","""all them dinosaurs were just too dumb to climb humans are unique""",,
13947,3659,"""When Dr Richard Dawkins admits that `` Universal love and the welfare of the species as a whole simply do not make evolutionary sense , `` he is confirming that tere is no way - or it is very unlikely - to arrive at personal morality from an impersonal universe .""","""And I ask the question again . Have you read Dawkins ? Do you actually know what he says ? It 's a bit disengenuous to make such statements if you have n't read the books in question . How shall I say this ? You have been duped . Well - that 's going to be censored !""",DISAGREE,"""When Dr Richard Dawkins admits that `` Universal love and the welfare of the species as a whole simply do not make evolutionary sense ,""","""And I ask the question again . Have you read Dawkins ? Do you actually know what he says ? It 's a bit disengenuous to make such statements if you have n't read the books in question .""",,
13955,3660,"""In principle , given adequate evidence etc. , there is nothing in the material world that can not be explained by Science .""","""Are you saying that given enough time you can come with answers ? That 's a statement of faith .""",DISAGREE,"""there is nothing in the material world that can not be explained by Science .""","""That 's a statement of faith .""",,
13956,3661,"""Again , I support the death penalty for certain crimes and criminals . Cost has nothing to do with it for me .""","""Well , why do you support it ?""",DISAGREE,"""Again , I support the death penalty for certain crimes and criminals .""","""Well , why do you support it ?""",,
13959,3661,"""Again , I support the death penalty for certain crimes and criminals . Cost has nothing to do with it for me .""","""Well , why do you support it ?""",DISAGREE,"""Again , I support the death penalty for certain crimes and criminals .""","""why do you support it ?""",,
13972,3699,"""Granted these are all not necessarily plausible , but never-the-less they are just as plaussible that the dog was subject to a random bout of evolution . Further , you said ... `` Just to show what my personal feelings are on God , if I seen him appear in the sky right now and waved at me , I 'd drop all my previous ideas and accept that he exists without hesitation. `` I doubt it . You 'd go over what you had that day and see if there was any contamination in the food - or you 'd say you were suffereing some other sort of thing that you could rationalise away they mystery of this event .""","""Well you do n't need to doubt it . I like to be rational but I also wish to believe in God . I need some evidence , any evidence , to believe in God and that would be all I would need .""",DISAGREE,"""Just to show what my personal feelings are on God , if I seen him appear in the sky right now and waved at me , I 'd drop all my previous ideas and accept that he exists without""","""I need some evidence , any evidence , to believe in God and that would be all I would need .""",,
14036,3718,"""The Violinist Argument : this was brought up in the ' I think abortion is OK to an extent ' thread . Personally I do n't believe in an absolutely rights-based system , but I 'm interested in this in terms of the arguments used and whether they 're logically sustainable .""","""The counter arguments put forth by its critics do not defeat the Violinist arguments , at the very least . Whether one accepts the argument anyway is another story : P""",DISAGREE,"""The Violinist Argument I 'm interested in this in terms of the arguments used and whether they 're logically sustainable""","""The counter arguments put forth by its critics do not defeat the Violinist arguments Whether one accepts the argument anyway is another story""",,
14039,3719,"""If this is the future for this country , I do not want to be part of it .""","""So where will you be moving to ?""",AGREE,"""If this is the future for this country , I do not want to be part of it .""","""So where will you be moving to ?""",,
14074,3725,"""First off , Congratulations are in order ( HUGZ ) ! As for a ceremony : If were to ever get married , I think it would be relatively small ( 50 to 100 people max ) and out in a an open meadow ( weather permitting ) , or at least a lush green park or back yard . My partner and I would escort each other up the aisle in matching grey tuxes , to a simple platform with a white garden archway decorated in white flowers , where a justice of the peace presides over a simple ceremony . We would read vows to one another and then be pronounced partners in life , and then just have a fabulous garden party . How doeas that sound ?""","""Pretty close to what we are doing . It is going to be outdoors , in my boss 's backyard ( nice area ) . It will be small , family , friends , 40 people tops . We will have some kind of food , have n't figured that yet . Got a really small budget . We plan on the vows , and rings and our parents doing something . Lucky for us , we have great friends who want to plan it for us . But some details I feel we should decide .""",AGREE,"""Congratulations are in order My partner and I would escort each other""","""It is going to be outdoors Got a really small budget . We plan on the vows""",,
14098,3727,"""Bad comparisons . A fair comparison would be comparing the total number of defensive gun uses to the total number of gun crimes ( not just limiting it to gun homicides ) .""","""Kellerman was n't fair when he did the comparisons for his study , do n't get upset when I use the same standard of review against you .""",DISAGREE,"""Bad comparisons fair comparison would be comparing the total number of defensive gun uses to the total number of gun crimes""","""Kellerman was n't fair when he did the comparisons for his study do n't get upset when I use the same standard of review""",,
14132,3730,"""The reality is we all live on faith .""","""no , you just live on delusions . you ca n't argue the merits of creationism on their own because they do n't exist . Creationism is a fraud regardless of the existance of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""The reality is we all live on faith .""","""you ca n't argue the merits of creationism on their own because they do n't exist""",,
14134,3731,"""Originally posted by lukecrouch What about the woodpecker argument ? Has anyone mentioned that yet ?""","""Which woodpecker argument ?""",DISAGREE,"""What about the woodpecker argument ? Has anyone mentioned that yet ?""","""Which woodpecker argument ?""",,
14140,3731,"""Originally posted by lukecrouch What about the woodpecker argument ? Has anyone mentioned that yet ?""","""Which woodpecker argument ?""",DISAGREE,"""What about the woodpecker argument ?""","""Which woodpecker argument ?""",,
14144,3732,"""A finely crafted handful of dust , gone in a par-sec , out like an old t.v . set ? Pick up a handful of dust and blow it . Gaze at the cemetaries at your most convenient moment , and ask yourself does life end here ? Non recycleable energy , never to be used again ? [ color=dark blue ] Has not Science taught us better than this ? [ /color ] Death , so inaccurataley confused/defined with the natural & amp ; programmed Evolution of the human species , a transformation of sorts , one might compare it to a capiller changing to a butterfly Living in the flesh is a challenge and a experience , but there comes a time when we just have to thank God for the dust and move on .......""","""its difficult to merge life in its purest form with science , even though science 's purpose is to study life . for instance , can life be defined as energy ? can life be compared with energy ? if so , then birth becomes as much of an enigma as death ; is energy created too ? ( not really addressing the debate , but more like raising more thoughts to debate on ... )""",DISAGREE,"""finely crafted handful of dust out like an old t.v . set ?""","""difficult to merge life can life be defined energy created too ?""",,
14150,3732,"""A finely crafted handful of dust , gone in a par-sec , out like an old t.v . set ? Pick up a handful of dust and blow it . Gaze at the cemetaries at your most convenient moment , and ask yourself does life end here ? Non recycleable energy , never to be used again ? [ color=dark blue ] Has not Science taught us better than this ? [ /color ] Death , so inaccurataley confused/defined with the natural & amp ; programmed Evolution of the human species , a transformation of sorts , one might compare it to a capiller changing to a butterfly Living in the flesh is a challenge and a experience , but there comes a time when we just have to thank God for the dust and move on .......""","""its difficult to merge life in its purest form with science , even though science 's purpose is to study life . for instance , can life be defined as energy ? can life be compared with energy ? if so , then birth becomes as much of an enigma as death ; is energy created too ? ( not really addressing the debate , but more like raising more thoughts to debate on ... )""",DISAGREE,"""Pick up a handful of dust and blow it . Gaze at the cemetaries at your most convenient moment , and ask yourself does life end here ? Non recycleable energy ,""","""its difficult to merge life in its purest form with science , even though science 's purpose is to study life""",,
14160,3733,"""< snip of silly , irrelevant religious claptrap > Creation is not a necessity , but I have yet to see substantial evidence to disprove it .""","""But you have n't looked . You may claim that your god did it , and no evidence to support or deny that can be offered . The assertion relies on miracle and has no suporting evidence . But when you start talking about how your god did it , your claims can be debunked by facts . Certainly the mythology of ancient nomadic herdsmen is not accurate . If you look at the world and the history of the world the is evident in the geologic strata , then you can see that the earth is very old , and you can see a succession of organisms through time . When considered with other fields of science from genetics to biogeography to physiology and anatomy , evolution becomes apparent .""",DISAGREE,"""Creation is not a necessity , yet to see substantial evidence to disprove it .""","""you have n't looked no evidence to support or deny that can be offered has no suporting evidence your claims can be debunked by facts . evolution becomes apparent .""",,
14165,3734,"""Evolution is a change in the gene pool of a population over time . Introduction to Evolutionary Biology""","""Here is a more complete definition from Futuyma 's text on evolutionary biology .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution is a change in the gene pool of a population over time . Introduction to Evolutionary Biology""","""Here is a more complete definition from Futuyma 's text on evolutionary biology .""",,
14176,3735,"""Are you incapable of reading , as well as being mind-numbingly assinine ? The thread is about creationism , not evolution . Attacking evolution does not defend the lies of creationists . Your failure to defend biblical creation shows that you can not support your own position and instead have to resort to petty nit-picking of your opponent 's position . This is both stupid and intellectually dishonest .""","""ahhh , thats where youre mistaken . ANY aspect of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance . the theory of electromagnetic radiation being wrong will be proof that God exists . the more we dont understand , the happier creationists are""",DISAGREE,"""Attacking evolution does not defend the lies of creationists .""","""ANY aspect of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance .""",,
14181,3735,"""Are you incapable of reading , as well as being mind-numbingly assinine ? The thread is about creationism , not evolution . Attacking evolution does not defend the lies of creationists . Your failure to defend biblical creation shows that you can not support your own position and instead have to resort to petty nit-picking of your opponent 's position . This is both stupid and intellectually dishonest .""","""ahhh , thats where youre mistaken . ANY aspect of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance . the theory of electromagnetic radiation being wrong will be proof that God exists . the more we dont understand , the happier creationists are""",DISAGREE,"""failure to defend biblical creation shows that you can not support your own position both stupid and intellectually dishonest .""","""thats where youre mistaken of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance . the more we dont understand , the happier creationists are""",,
14187,3736,"""What makes you think the politics of the parents will be the politics of the children ?""","""In the case of Demorats and liberals ; it is monkey see , monkey do .""",AGREE,"""What makes you think the politics of the parents will be the politics of the children ?""","""In the case of Demorats and liberals ; it is monkey see , monkey do .""",,
14192,3736,"""What makes you think the politics of the parents will be the politics of the children ?""","""In the case of Demorats and liberals ; it is monkey see , monkey do .""",AGREE,"""makes you think the politics of the parents will be the politics of the children ?""","""it is monkey see , monkey do .""",,
14215,3739,"""But how often do contraceptives fail ? Planned Parenthood ’ s Alan Guttmacher Institute reported on 10,000 women getting abortions . Of these , 57.5 % said they were using a contraceptive the month they became pregnant . In a similar study in 1987 the figure was 51.3 % .""","""Contraceptives ( for example a condom/ the pill ) are n't going to last a month effectively . Then there 's the fact that contraceptives , given the above data , can still be 99 % effective , as it does n't mention how many pregnancies they 've prevented . What does the writer make of this though ? '' According to this , condoms have a high failure rate for pregnancy. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Of these , 57.5 % said they were using a contraceptive the month they became pregnant .""","""Contraceptives ( for example a condom/ the pill ) are n't going to last a month effectively . Then there 's the fact that contraceptives , given the above data , can still be 99 % effective , as it does n't mention how many pregnancies they 've prevented . '' ``""",,
14213,3739,"""But how often do contraceptives fail ? Planned Parenthood ’ s Alan Guttmacher Institute reported on 10,000 women getting abortions . Of these , 57.5 % said they were using a contraceptive the month they became pregnant . In a similar study in 1987 the figure was 51.3 % .""","""Contraceptives ( for example a condom/ the pill ) are n't going to last a month effectively . Then there 's the fact that contraceptives , given the above data , can still be 99 % effective , as it does n't mention how many pregnancies they 've prevented . What does the writer make of this though ? '' According to this , condoms have a high failure rate for pregnancy. ``""",DISAGREE,"""But how often do contraceptives fail ? Planned Parenthood ’ s Alan Guttmacher Institute reported on 10,000 women getting abortions .""","""Contraceptives ( for example a condom/ the pill ) are n't going to last a month '' ``""",,
14223,3740,"""I guess that is your opinion , so if you ever get raped do n't get an abortion.The point is , is that it is a choice and not yours.If a women ( girl ) is molested or raped and does n't feel comfortable keeping the baby who are you to decide that for them ? Personally if I were raped and became pregnant I WOULD NOT keep the fetus , if someone else thought differently and they decided to keep a rape fetus more power to them , but do n't expect everbody to feel the same as you do.The best person to make that choice is the one that has been through the rape/incest and has to live with the outcome .""","""Do I have tell you exactly how many rape/incest victims are the ones who decide an abortion is neccessary ? How many of them need to have counseling years afterwards because they had the abortion , not because they were a rape/incest victim ? There are very few if any girls in the U.S. that would have an abortion after an experience like that . It 's the family and relations that force them into it in order to keep the matter hush-hush . No doubt some of those reasons seem good , but abortion is an incorrect solution . The help a victim should get is a hug , some tears and comforting words so that they view their future life in a positive light . Instead , they bury them in words of `` GET AN ABORTION , YOU 'LL FEEL BETTER LATER `` . Yeah right . Oh , I think I 'll add that only 1 % of abortions performed yearly are for rape/incest cases . And some years it may even drop lower than that . Should we keep abortion legal for just that 1 % ?""",DISAGREE,"""you ever get raped do n't get an if I were raped and became pregnant I WOULD NOT keep the fetus best person to make that choice is the one that has been through the rape/incest""","""abortion is an incorrect solution . The help a victim should get is a hug , some tears and comforting words only 1 % of abortions performed yearly are for rape/incest""",,
14226,3740,"""I guess that is your opinion , so if you ever get raped do n't get an abortion.The point is , is that it is a choice and not yours.If a women ( girl ) is molested or raped and does n't feel comfortable keeping the baby who are you to decide that for them ? Personally if I were raped and became pregnant I WOULD NOT keep the fetus , if someone else thought differently and they decided to keep a rape fetus more power to them , but do n't expect everbody to feel the same as you do.The best person to make that choice is the one that has been through the rape/incest and has to live with the outcome .""","""Do I have tell you exactly how many rape/incest victims are the ones who decide an abortion is neccessary ? How many of them need to have counseling years afterwards because they had the abortion , not because they were a rape/incest victim ? There are very few if any girls in the U.S. that would have an abortion after an experience like that . It 's the family and relations that force them into it in order to keep the matter hush-hush . No doubt some of those reasons seem good , but abortion is an incorrect solution . The help a victim should get is a hug , some tears and comforting words so that they view their future life in a positive light . Instead , they bury them in words of `` GET AN ABORTION , YOU 'LL FEEL BETTER LATER `` . Yeah right . Oh , I think I 'll add that only 1 % of abortions performed yearly are for rape/incest cases . And some years it may even drop lower than that . Should we keep abortion legal for just that 1 % ?""",DISAGREE,"""I guess that is your opinion , so if you ever get raped do n't get an abortion.The point is , is that it is a choice and not yours.If a women ( girl ) is molested or raped and does n't feel comfortable keeping the baby who are you to decide that for them ?""","""Do I have tell you exactly how many rape/incest victims are the ones who decide an abortion is neccessary ? ``""",,
14231,3740,"""I guess that is your opinion , so if you ever get raped do n't get an abortion.The point is , is that it is a choice and not yours.If a women ( girl ) is molested or raped and does n't feel comfortable keeping the baby who are you to decide that for them ? Personally if I were raped and became pregnant I WOULD NOT keep the fetus , if someone else thought differently and they decided to keep a rape fetus more power to them , but do n't expect everbody to feel the same as you do.The best person to make that choice is the one that has been through the rape/incest and has to live with the outcome .""","""Do I have tell you exactly how many rape/incest victims are the ones who decide an abortion is neccessary ? How many of them need to have counseling years afterwards because they had the abortion , not because they were a rape/incest victim ? There are very few if any girls in the U.S. that would have an abortion after an experience like that . It 's the family and relations that force them into it in order to keep the matter hush-hush . No doubt some of those reasons seem good , but abortion is an incorrect solution . The help a victim should get is a hug , some tears and comforting words so that they view their future life in a positive light . Instead , they bury them in words of `` GET AN ABORTION , YOU 'LL FEEL BETTER LATER `` . Yeah right . Oh , I think I 'll add that only 1 % of abortions performed yearly are for rape/incest cases . And some years it may even drop lower than that . Should we keep abortion legal for just that 1 % ?""",DISAGREE,"""I guess that is your opinion , so if you ever get raped do n't get an abortion.The point is , is that it is a choice and not .""","""How many of them need to have counseling years afterwards because they had the abortion , not because they were a rape/incest victim ? There are very few if any girls in the U.S. that would have an abortion after an experience like that .""",,
14244,3742,"""No , you need to read more carefully : Botched abortions are one of the causes of death , but the primary causes of death are bleeding , infection , high blood pressure and prolonged labor . And , if abortion were safe and legal and offered as an option during the early term of a pregnancy , particularly in the case of young girls , that cause of death would be dramatically reduced .""","""Do you suggest that the USA send supplies or doctors to perform these abortions or that Tanzania does it ?""",DISAGREE,"""abortions""","""Do you suggest that the USA send supplies or doctors to perform these abortions or that Tanzania does it ?""",,
14247,3742,"""No , you need to read more carefully : Botched abortions are one of the causes of death , but the primary causes of death are bleeding , infection , high blood pressure and prolonged labor . And , if abortion were safe and legal and offered as an option during the early term of a pregnancy , particularly in the case of young girls , that cause of death would be dramatically reduced .""","""Do you suggest that the USA send supplies or doctors to perform these abortions or that Tanzania does it ?""",DISAGREE,"""No , you need to read more carefully : Botched abortions are one of the causes of death , but the primary causes of death are bleeding , infection , high blood pressure and prolonged labor .""","""Do you suggest that the USA send supplies or doctors to perform these abortions or that Tanzania does it ?""",,
14254,3743,"""I have brought up the following item for discussion before , but it seems relevant here , too . Assuming abortion is justified as one means of acheiving the goal of population control , is it outrageous to consider 'removing ' non-productive members of our society as another means of achieving the same goal ?""","""By removing you mean Killing the innocent of course , which is different to imprisonment of the criminal .""",DISAGREE,"""I have brought up the following item for discussion before , but it seems relevant here , too . Assuming abortion is justified as one means of acheiving the goal of population control , is it outrageous to consider 'removing ' non-productive members of our society as another means of achieving the same goal ?""","""By removing you mean Killing the innocent of course , which is different to imprisonment of the criminal .""",,
14272,3745,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link , and so to forget about it , but you keep bringing it back , like a puppy with a chewed up slipper . Why is that ?""","""Because you asked me to quote your lies . I did . Not only can you not find whichever source you claim speaks of birds ' infrared vision , you apparently ca n't find any source that does so . Despite this , you 've been whining about how visible and UV camouflage must be moot because of birds IR vision . And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source :""",DISAGREE,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link , and so to forget""","""Despite this , you 've been whining about how visible and UV camouflage must be moot""",,
14273,3745,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link , and so to forget about it , but you keep bringing it back , like a puppy with a chewed up slipper . Why is that ?""","""Because you asked me to quote your lies . I did . Not only can you not find whichever source you claim speaks of birds ' infrared vision , you apparently ca n't find any source that does so . Despite this , you 've been whining about how visible and UV camouflage must be moot because of birds IR vision . And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source :""",DISAGREE,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link""","""And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source :""",,
14274,3745,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link , and so to forget about it , but you keep bringing it back , like a puppy with a chewed up slipper . Why is that ?""","""Because you asked me to quote your lies . I did . Not only can you not find whichever source you claim speaks of birds ' infrared vision , you apparently ca n't find any source that does so . Despite this , you 've been whining about how visible and UV camouflage must be moot because of birds IR vision . And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source :""",DISAGREE,"""keep bringing it back , like a puppy with a chewed up slipper . Why is that ?""","""And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source""",,
14281,3745,"""Many posts ago I told you that I could n't relocate the link , and so to forget about it , but you keep bringing it back , like a puppy with a chewed up slipper . Why is that ?""","""Because you asked me to quote your lies . I did . Not only can you not find whichever source you claim speaks of birds ' infrared vision , you apparently ca n't find any source that does so . Despite this , you 've been whining about how visible and UV camouflage must be moot because of birds IR vision . And to top it off , rather than admit to your mistaken memory , you 're blaming the imaginary source :""",DISAGREE,"""I told you that I could n't relocate the link you keep bringing it back Why is that ?""","""you asked me to your lies . you apparently ca n't find any source that does so admit to your mistaken memory ,""",,
14289,3747,"""Yes I 'm betting your asking me how I know about his teachings if I have never read the bible ,""","""No , not really ...""",DISAGREE,"""Yes I 'm betting your asking me how I know about his teachings if I have never read the bible ,""","""No , not really ...""",,
14293,3747,"""Yes I 'm betting your asking me how I know about his teachings if I have never read the bible ,""","""No , not really ...""",DISAGREE,"""your asking me how I know about his teachings if I have never read the bible ,""","""No , not really""",,
14299,3748,"""Can you tell me how it is that gene transferred horizontally ( without going through selection ) validates darwinism , which says all beneficial traits must pass through selection in order to be adapted ?""","""Fascinating - you blew right through your own usual misunderstandings of Darwinism and Darwinists and ended up with a sentence that is actually meaningful . HGT ( along with genetic drift ) are important parts of modern evolutionary theory , but they do indeed have nothing to do with darwinian evolution sensu stricto , which does indeed insist on natural selection . This is why evolutionary biologists object to being called Darwinists in the sense that you and WW usually try to impose on us , and it is why we insist that there is more to evolution than natural selection or RM & amp ; NS alone , and it is why we talk about the Neodarwinian Synthesis and Modern Evolutionary Theory . HGT validates the modern ToE . Modern evolutionary theory incorporates Darwin 's version , and lot 's more . HGT is part of the `` lots more `` . Some versions of lateral gene transfer have been accepted and studied for many decades , notably versions of conjugation in bacteria . ( It was n't until biologists were able to start sequencing DNA in quantity that we were able to see all the retroviral DNA segments and so forth . ) When someone like Gould ( for example ) talks about Darwinian evolution , depending on context , they are talking about either 1 ) the historical early version of the ToE as Darwin envisaged it , 2 ) the position that natural selection is the dominant process in evolution , or 3 ) an instance of evolutionary change in which natural selection is inferred to have been by far the most significant process . Evolution has moved well beyond Darwin 's initial ideas to include mutations , recombination , and genetic drift , including HGT , in all sorts of combinations with each other and with natural selection . As Chemist says , once HGT has occurred , the new version with the new genes can easily find itself competing with the old version , providing another way that NS can be involved , but it does n't have to be . NS is just not all there is to evolution . I ca n't wait to see how you are going to misinterpret this next .""",DISAGREE,"""Can you tell me how it is that gene transferred horizontally ( without going through selection ) validates darwinism""","""This is why evolutionary biologists object to being called Darwinists in the sense that you and WW usually try to impose on us , and it is why we insist that there is more to evolution than natural selection or RM & NS alone , and it is why we talk about the Neodarwinian Synthesis and Modern Evolutionary Theory . ``""",,
14297,3748,"""Can you tell me how it is that gene transferred horizontally ( without going through selection ) validates darwinism , which says all beneficial traits must pass through selection in order to be adapted ?""","""Fascinating - you blew right through your own usual misunderstandings of Darwinism and Darwinists and ended up with a sentence that is actually meaningful . HGT ( along with genetic drift ) are important parts of modern evolutionary theory , but they do indeed have nothing to do with darwinian evolution sensu stricto , which does indeed insist on natural selection . This is why evolutionary biologists object to being called Darwinists in the sense that you and WW usually try to impose on us , and it is why we insist that there is more to evolution than natural selection or RM & amp ; NS alone , and it is why we talk about the Neodarwinian Synthesis and Modern Evolutionary Theory . HGT validates the modern ToE . Modern evolutionary theory incorporates Darwin 's version , and lot 's more . HGT is part of the `` lots more `` . Some versions of lateral gene transfer have been accepted and studied for many decades , notably versions of conjugation in bacteria . ( It was n't until biologists were able to start sequencing DNA in quantity that we were able to see all the retroviral DNA segments and so forth . ) When someone like Gould ( for example ) talks about Darwinian evolution , depending on context , they are talking about either 1 ) the historical early version of the ToE as Darwin envisaged it , 2 ) the position that natural selection is the dominant process in evolution , or 3 ) an instance of evolutionary change in which natural selection is inferred to have been by far the most significant process . Evolution has moved well beyond Darwin 's initial ideas to include mutations , recombination , and genetic drift , including HGT , in all sorts of combinations with each other and with natural selection . As Chemist says , once HGT has occurred , the new version with the new genes can easily find itself competing with the old version , providing another way that NS can be involved , but it does n't have to be . NS is just not all there is to evolution . I ca n't wait to see how you are going to misinterpret this next .""",DISAGREE,"""Can you tell me how it is that gene transferred horizontally ( without going through selection ) validates darwinism ,""","""HGT ( along with genetic drift ) are important parts of modern evolutionary theory , but they do indeed have nothing to do with darwinian evolution sensu stricto , which does indeed insist on natural selection .""",,
14306,3750,"""Boopie , you ca n't be Catholic and support aborton . You 're automatically excommunicated if you support abortion and only can come back into the church via confession .""","""Excuse me , but you did n't fully read what he wrote . He did n't say that he supported abortion . He said that he was n't as much a freak about it as you 're being .""",DISAGREE,"""Boopie , you ca n't be Catholic and support aborton . You 're automatically excommunicated if you support abortion and only can come back into the church via confession .""","""Excuse me , but you did n't fully read what he wrote .""",,
14314,3751,"""I actually think that ID has a pretty good chance of winning . One reason being is that ID links with the idea of God was taught to them even before they understood it , so it holds a deep impression on many people there . Another reason I think is that most of them probably never took a decent bio class , so they would have no idea what the evolutionsist was talking about . Lastly , people hold God in a lot higher posistion in their minds then evolution , already giving evolution a bad reputation , because its `` competing `` with God .""","""Sadly , you may be correct . The mindless majority of the American people have been duped to believe that science is somehow opposed to their religion . They know that the mythology of bronze age nomads is historically correct . Do n't confuse them with facts - so what if grasshoppers do n't have 4 legs , what if rabbits do n't chew cud , and who cares it bats are not birds ? The Bible is true without error . Certainly people who have bee indoctrinated to believe that `` GODDIDIT `` will believe that question . They have been taught that it is a sin to question revealed truth , and revealed truth is revealed by `` ministers `` who are scientifically illiterate . Why does creationism seem to be a matter of the views of those who are becoming rich from the stupidity of the Christins masses . In the mean time , the U.S. is now a second rate country , where our universities are manned by an increasing number of foreign professors . I do n't have a problem with foreign professors except that there are no qualified U.S. citizens out there . It is becoming increasingly apparent that the leadership of U.S. universities is due to the influx of foreign professors . They get paid more here than in their own country , and of course , they are more qualified than U.S. applicants for their positions . I wonder if our universities will be able to maintain leadership in the world of academia when the entire upper echelon is overtaken by better educated and more qualified foreigners . In fact : Japan has about half the population of the U.S. and graduates about twice the number of students with degrees in science and engineering . Is n't it wonderful that we are debating the pseudoscience of creationism and ID in our school boards ? It is the beginning of the end .""",AGREE,"""I actually think that ID has a pretty good chance of winning . ``""","""Sadly , you may be correct . ``""",,
14324,3774,"""It means even more mass shootings !""","""Only a microscopic number of mass shootings involved the killer holding a concealed carry permit . Plus you ca n't prove the lack of a concealed carry permit would actually stop any killings .""",DISAGREE,"""It means even more mass shootings !""","""number of mass shootings""",,
14343,3778,"""'' If it does n't submit to you peacefully then you shall besiege it ... and put all it 's males to the sword ... and take the women and children as you spoils. `` - Deut . 20:12 - Love your enemies ? ? ? ?""","""Just another example of using a verse meant for personal use and applying it to wars . Sorry , just does n't work that way .""",DISAGREE,"""If it does n't submit to you peacefully then you shall besiege it ... and put all it 's males to the sword ... and take the women and children as you spoils. ``""","""verse meant for personal use and applying it to wars .""",,
14359,3782,"""Look at the 2 side by side . They are as different as night and day . No creature can live without breathing for millions of years except in fairy tales .""","""Yes , and a plausible , possible explaination of how one evolved into another was presented , you 're the only one talking about a creature not breathing for millions of years . This goes back to your complete lack of knowledge of evolution ........ Where did you demonstrate that the avian lung could not evolve from the dinosaurian lung ?""",DISAGREE,"""Look at the 2 side by side . They are as different as night and day .""","""a plausible , possible explaination of how one evolved into another was presented ,""",,
14368,3783,"""Originally posted by Broker I 'm afraid of guns ... makes me wish I had one . I would n't want it and they 'll pay me for it ... excellent ! lol""","""why are you afraid of guns ? has one jumped up and shot at you ? you should never fear a gun , respect the gun .""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by Broker I 'm afraid of guns""","""why are you afraid of guns ?""",,
14389,3787,"""And I 'll bet the formal list of `` great physicists `` who preceded the development of the theory of evolution is meaningful . I wonder how many of these `` great physicists `` also believed that night air could make them ill ? How many beleived in alchemy , like Newton ? I wonder if Newton is in that list ? He did n't believe in the divinity of Christ .""","""This was a comment on the physics book that has biographies of great physicists that were Bible believing christians . Right . Many believed in alchemy ( they were wrong ) , harmful effects of night air ( they were wrong ) , spontaneous growth of maggots from rotting meat ( they were wrong ) , rats arising from grain ( they were wrong ) , and the Bible ( they were wrong ) . If it is important that Newton believed in the Bible , why is n't it as important that he believed in alchemy and did not believe in the divinity of Christ . There is n't any such thing as science from a Christian perspective . Either it is science , or it is n't . You claimed to have studied evolution . You did n't . Why would you tell us that you did ?""",DISAGREE,"""`` who preceded the development of the theory of evolution is meaningful . I wonder if Newton is in that list ? He did n't believe in the divinity of Christ .""","""physics book that has biographies of great physicists that were Bible believing christians . he believed in alchemy and did not believe in the divinity of Christ .""",,
14411,3800,"""Abstinence until marriage is still the best way .""","""Abstinence until you are old enough to handle sexual relationships responsibly should most certainly be preached along with information about and access to birth control . There are plenty of us who have no interest in the institution of marriage - your religion should not determine who amongst is a sexually active adult . Not to mention we have got to stop pushing the got ta get married have a partner to be a happy seccuesful person message - ESPECIALLY TO GIRLS - it will lead to sex , for heaven forbid they be SINGLE .""",DISAGREE,"""Abstinence until marriage is still the best way .""","""Abstinence until you are old enough to handle sexual relationships responsibly should most certainly be preached along with information about and access to birth control .""",,
14445,3830,"""Teaching students to be responsible ! What a crime ! Next youll be whining about students getting kicked off the team because they had drugs off campus !""","""That does n't teach ( here is the topic braille ) student athletes anything , it is discrimination and violation of their 2A rights . Drugs are just a strawman . Strike three !""",DISAGREE,"""Teaching students to be responsible ! whining about students getting kicked they had drugs off campus !""","""here is the topic braille is discrimination and violation of their 2A rights . Drugs are just a strawman .""",,
14447,3830,"""Teaching students to be responsible ! What a crime ! Next youll be whining about students getting kicked off the team because they had drugs off campus !""","""That does n't teach ( here is the topic braille ) student athletes anything , it is discrimination and violation of their 2A rights . Drugs are just a strawman . Strike three !""",DISAGREE,"""Teaching students to be responsible ! What a crime !""","""That does n't teach ( here is the topic braille ) student athletes anything , it is discrimination and violation of their 2A rights""",,
14467,3832,"""Fourth , do you believe the fetus is living ? Why ?""","""We 've said that it is living , but that it was n't a life .""",DISAGREE,"""Fourth , do you believe the fetus is living ? Why ?""","""We 've said that it is living , but that it was n't a life .""",,
14473,3833,"""Now tell me , what is wrong with this logic ? If evolution is true , then you can decide anything for yourself . Nothing stops you .""","""And what does stop you ? You could decide that for yourself . But that would n't make the action just or moral . That action would still hurt people , and it would still be evil . So perhaps I should ask , if God were not threatening religious people with Hell , would they still be good people ? Or are all of the selfless and generous actions of religious people stemmed from the selfish desire to get into heaven ? If they are not stemmed from their own selfish desire to enter heaven , then they are they not rooted in that individual 's own desire to help others . This exists in some people . For those in whom it does not exist , we have the law . We create governments to do that which is in our best interest and that which is in our best interest is that which helps everyone . For that which harms someone else might soon be that which harms us . I have oversimplified what is a very complex understanding of morality , but the point is that the morality of an atheist does not begin with the desire to enter heaven , it begins with the desire to help others or create a society which will help everyone .""",DISAGREE,"""Now tell me , what is wrong with this logic ? If evolution is true , then you can decide anything for yourself . Nothing stops you .""","""And what does stop you ? You could decide that for yourself""",,
14471,3833,"""Now tell me , what is wrong with this logic ? If evolution is true , then you can decide anything for yourself . Nothing stops you .""","""And what does stop you ? You could decide that for yourself . But that would n't make the action just or moral . That action would still hurt people , and it would still be evil . So perhaps I should ask , if God were not threatening religious people with Hell , would they still be good people ? Or are all of the selfless and generous actions of religious people stemmed from the selfish desire to get into heaven ? If they are not stemmed from their own selfish desire to enter heaven , then they are they not rooted in that individual 's own desire to help others . This exists in some people . For those in whom it does not exist , we have the law . We create governments to do that which is in our best interest and that which is in our best interest is that which helps everyone . For that which harms someone else might soon be that which harms us . I have oversimplified what is a very complex understanding of morality , but the point is that the morality of an atheist does not begin with the desire to enter heaven , it begins with the desire to help others or create a society which will help everyone .""",DISAGREE,"""If evolution is true , then you can decide anything for yourself . Nothing stops you .""","""And what does stop you ? You could decide that for yourself . But that would n't make the action just or moral .""",,
14479,3834,"""Unlike teachers , your workplace does n't rely on the vast majority of staff being present to function at all . I was available for work throughout the cold weather , but was told to stay at home , as colleagues travelling from further afield could n't get in .""","""I dont think I have heard a more pathtic excuse for a long time . All but a few of my colleagues could get into work during the very worst of the weather .. why ? because they didnt get paid otherwise . There needs only be a tiny amount of snow for UK teachers to stay away in droves ... what a joke ! Strangely enough when I went to school both the pupils and the teachers seem to manage to get to school in the snow .""",DISAGREE,"""Unlike teachers , workplace does n't rely staff available work throughout cold weather , stay home , colleagues travelling could n't get in""","""dont think heard pathtic excuse long time colleagues get work worst of the weather why ? didnt paid otherwise what a joke ! Strangely enough""",,
14494,3835,"""Depending on perspective , everything or nothing . Many on the liberal front often tell us that the police are there for the purpose of protecting us , that they 'll keep us safe , that we do n't need a gun if we just call 911 and let the police handle it , etc . Well a lot of good that advice is gon na do these South Carolina people , now that the police have been ordered not to pursue criminals who run from the scene of a crime . If they start hopping fences then the police ca n't pursue in their squad cars , and they ca n't get out to chase after them either . So ... even before , the courts have stated explicitly that the job of the police is not to protect anyone , and now we have mayors ordering the police to not apprehend fleeing criminals . This means that those townspeople are gon na need to rely on themselves . And if the gun control laws are liberal and excessively strict , they 're SOL . Innocent people are gon na get getting killed because of this new policy .""","""Poor guys they are so screwed . We get it all the time here in Australia , dont fight back just call the cops , who may be there in 35 minutes as the average response time ! ! Now the cops are not going to stop criminals from running away . This is very very disturbing news for every citizen of not just South Carolina but America .""",AGREE,"""Many on the liberal front often tell us that the police are there for the purpose of protecting us , that they 'll keep us safe , that we do n't need a gun""","""Poor guys they are so screwed .""",,
14498,3836,"""It would also make what appears to be immediate `` jumps `` in the fossil record -- which fits in nicely with what 's been reported . It 's also a natural , orderly process that plays out possible variations on a theme , making the organism not inherently stupid and clueless , but more like a creative artist .""","""So now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record ?""",DISAGREE,"""It would also make what appears to be immediate `` jumps `` in the fossil record""","""now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record ?""",,
14504,3836,"""It would also make what appears to be immediate `` jumps `` in the fossil record -- which fits in nicely with what 's been reported . It 's also a natural , orderly process that plays out possible variations on a theme , making the organism not inherently stupid and clueless , but more like a creative artist .""","""So now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record ?""",DISAGREE,"""It would also make what appears to be immediate `` jumps `` in the fossil record""","""So now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record ?""",,
14505,3836,"""It would also make what appears to be immediate `` jumps `` in the fossil record -- which fits in nicely with what 's been reported . It 's also a natural , orderly process that plays out possible variations on a theme , making the organism not inherently stupid and clueless , but more like a creative artist .""","""So now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record ?""",DISAGREE,"""jumps fossil record fits natural , organism stupid clueless , creative artist""","""you demonstrate ignorant fossil record""",,
14539,3868,"""Mass public shootings are non-existent to rare events around the globe , with the glaring exception of one dystopic society .""","""Well if mass public shootings are so rare and so unlikely to happen in the rest of the world , how do you explain the school shootings in Germany ? Furthermore , if public shootings are so damn rare , why did Germany make their already extremely strict gun control laws even stricter than ever ?""",DISAGREE,"""Mass public shootings are non-existent to rare events around the globe""","""Well if mass public shootings are so rare and so unlikely to happen in the rest of the world , how do you explain the school shootings in Germany ?""",,
14541,3869,"""It seems to me that the pressure Man has placed on most all species of wildlife in every corner of the World as we simultaneously encroached on those ecosystems , that our development would have jump started their social development and creative genes in order for them to adjust to the effects we have had on their Natural Habitats .""","""And that has happened in some cases . Mosquitoes are changing the development cycles to coincide with increasingly warmer temperatures . Fish species are enlarging their habitats as water temperatures rise . Many species are moving north as temperature rises .""",AGREE,"""It seems to me that the pressure Man has placed on most all species of wildlife in every corner of the World as we simultaneously encroached on those ecosystems ,""","""And that has happened in some cases . Mosquitoes are changing the development cycles to coincide with increasingly warmer temperatures .""",,
14550,3871,"""Another masterclass in point elusion . To be fair , there is some doubt as to whether it was ever identifed , so that may remain forever moot . The missing ingredient in Archie 's scenario , ( other than logic ) is of course that his black and white mindset leads him into describing the gun as a `` mere `` tool , resulting in his avoidance of the fact that it is also a facilitator , an efficient effective multiplier of an individual 's killing capacity , which is entirely dependent on the gun , as originally succinctly defined by Ozzy .""","""So you know what Ozzy was trying to say in his pointless statement ? How do you know your interpretation is correct while mine is wrong ? How exactly do you justify taking the word of a man who bit the head off of a bat , as something credible ?""",DISAGREE,"""an efficient effective multiplier of an individual 's killing capacity , which is entirely dependent on the gun , as originally succinctly defined by Ozzy .""","""How do you know your interpretation is correct while mine is wrong ?""",,
14552,3871,"""Another masterclass in point elusion . To be fair , there is some doubt as to whether it was ever identifed , so that may remain forever moot . The missing ingredient in Archie 's scenario , ( other than logic ) is of course that his black and white mindset leads him into describing the gun as a `` mere `` tool , resulting in his avoidance of the fact that it is also a facilitator , an efficient effective multiplier of an individual 's killing capacity , which is entirely dependent on the gun , as originally succinctly defined by Ozzy .""","""So you know what Ozzy was trying to say in his pointless statement ? How do you know your interpretation is correct while mine is wrong ? How exactly do you justify taking the word of a man who bit the head off of a bat , as something credible ?""",DISAGREE,"""Another masterclass in point elusion . To be fair , there is some doubt as to whether it was ever identifed , so that may remain forever moot .""","""So you know what Ozzy was trying to say in his pointless statement ? How do you know your interpretation is correct while mine is wrong ?""",,
14588,3885,"""Why not make it a crime to sell a gun privately .""","""Because that 's the kind of thing Big Brother would do . Firearms are property , and IMHO a restriction such as that is too much .""",DISAGREE,"""Why not make it a crime to sell a gun privately .""","""Firearms are property a restriction such as that is too much .""",,
14590,3893,"""Hmmm , a few problems arise with this theory , when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off , when did he create all the other planets , when did he create all the other stars and comets ? Ineresting he created the earth before the sun , how did he get light , let me guess , he had a torch .""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again . THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",DISAGREE,"""Hmmm , a few problems arise with this theory , when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off , when did he create all the other planets , when did he create all the other stars and comets ?""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again . THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",,
14591,3893,"""Hmmm , a few problems arise with this theory , when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off , when did he create all the other planets , when did he create all the other stars and comets ? Ineresting he created the earth before the sun , how did he get light , let me guess , he had a torch .""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again . THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",DISAGREE,"""Ineresting he created the earth before the sun , how did he get light , let me guess , he had a torch .""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again .""",,
14593,3893,"""Hmmm , a few problems arise with this theory , when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off , when did he create all the other planets , when did he create all the other stars and comets ? Ineresting he created the earth before the sun , how did he get light , let me guess , he had a torch .""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again . THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",DISAGREE,"""let me guess , he had a torch .""","""for God was done with everything then started again""",,
14598,3893,"""Hmmm , a few problems arise with this theory , when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off , when did he create all the other planets , when did he create all the other stars and comets ? Ineresting he created the earth before the sun , how did he get light , let me guess , he had a torch .""","""Actually when you read every thing you have to rationalize ( lie ) what God actually did , for God was done with everything then started again . THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",DISAGREE,"""when did he create the dinosaurs , and when did he kill them off ,""","""THe stories do n't parallel each other they intersect .""",,
14603,3894,"""Biology should n't simply deal with the facts about different animals , natural selection , evolution , etc . but should also deal with how information is gathered , and different ways of analyzing it as well as different hypothesies rather than what is thought at the time to be the facts .""","""If science deals with how information is gathered , different ways of analyzing , and different hypothesis , then it involves worldviews . The base for the worldview of a sizable part of the population should not be excluded . Maybe in Saddam Hussien 's Iraq , maybe in communist Russia , but not in the United States .""",DISAGREE,"""Biology should n't simply deal with the facts about different animals , natural selection , evolution , etc .""","""If science deals with how information is gathered , different ways of analyzing , and different hypothesis , then it involves worldviews .""",,
14609,3894,"""Biology should n't simply deal with the facts about different animals , natural selection , evolution , etc . but should also deal with how information is gathered , and different ways of analyzing it as well as different hypothesies rather than what is thought at the time to be the facts .""","""If science deals with how information is gathered , different ways of analyzing , and different hypothesis , then it involves worldviews . The base for the worldview of a sizable part of the population should not be excluded . Maybe in Saddam Hussien 's Iraq , maybe in communist Russia , but not in the United States .""",DISAGREE,"""Biology should n't simply deal with the facts about different animals , natural selection , evolution , etc . but should also deal with how information is gathered , and different ways of analyzing it as well as different hypothesies rather than what is thought at the time to be the facts .""","""The base for the worldview of a sizable part of the population should not be excluded""",,
14627,3896,"""Let 's see some bullet items to debate , not the sea-of-montalban's-ideas""","""And of course , the sea of Montalban 's assertions as science , the sea of Montalban 's out of context quotes , or the sea of Montalban 's misrepresentations of what others have said . It seems that Montalban knows the `` TROOTH `` and wo n't be discouraged with facts . Sadly , Montalban knows what he believes and reality seems to be irrelevant .""",DISAGREE,"""some bullet items debate sea-of-montalban's-ideas""","""Montalban 's assertions as science context quotes , Montalban 's misrepresentations `` TROOTH `` discouraged with facts .""",,
14621,3896,"""Let 's see some bullet items to debate , not the sea-of-montalban's-ideas""","""And of course , the sea of Montalban 's assertions as science , the sea of Montalban 's out of context quotes , or the sea of Montalban 's misrepresentations of what others have said . It seems that Montalban knows the `` TROOTH `` and wo n't be discouraged with facts . Sadly , Montalban knows what he believes and reality seems to be irrelevant .""",DISAGREE,"""Let 's see some bullet items to debate , not the sea-of-montalban's-ideas""","""And of course , the sea of Montalban 's assertions as science , the sea of Montalban 's out of context quotes , or the sea of Montalban 's misrepresentations of what others have said . It seems that Montalban knows the `` TROOTH `` and wo n't be discouraged with facts .""",,
14633,3897,"""Second , as Behe pointed out ( and as Miller ignored ) , the parts that were used to replace the B- galactosidase function were already in the system . They simply were activated by the mutations .""","""And , as miller pointed out , that is how evolution works . Small changes from preexisting parts providing new function . In this case , the function was to beable to digest lactose .. a function that was not there before .""",AGREE,"""as Miller ignored ) ,""","""as miller pointed out ,""",,
14639,3897,"""Second , as Behe pointed out ( and as Miller ignored ) , the parts that were used to replace the B- galactosidase function were already in the system . They simply were activated by the mutations .""","""And , as miller pointed out , that is how evolution works . Small changes from preexisting parts providing new function . In this case , the function was to beable to digest lactose .. a function that was not there before .""",AGREE,"""Second , as Behe pointed out ( and as Miller ignored ) , the parts that were used to replace the B- galactosidase function were already in the system .""","""that is how evolution works .""",,
14640,3898,"""A similar statment now would be `` If i have a baby , my life will not be the way i want it to be and i will not be able to finance the baby `` .... THEN WHY DID YOU HAVE SEX ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?""","""Because they do n't know any better . Besides , how many unwanted pregnancies have you had ? How many abortions ? Notice that most anti-choicers are men , which exposes the true hypocrisy in this dogma of thinking .""",DISAGREE,"""A similar statment now would be `` If i have a baby , my life will not be the way i want it to be and i will not be able to finance the baby `` .... THEN WHY DID YOU HAVE SEX ? ?""","""Because they do n't know any better . Besides , how many unwanted pregnancies have you had ? How many abortions ?""",,
14650,3899,"""Do pro abortion people support euthanasia as a reason for abortion ? Meaning for instance ... if after amniocentesis it is discovered that the child has down syndrome or if it is discovered the child will be born with no legs the previously hoping and willing parents decide to abort for this reason . Do pro abortion people support this ?""","""Since amniocentesis is done before a fetus has legal personhood aborting such a pregnancy is not mercy killing in any way . One can not show mercy to what constitutes mere tissue . One can show mercy to a human person . Suppose that the fetus in question has for example will have no functioning brain upon birth , then will aborting it constitute in any way the killing of a person . In sever anencephaly there is nothing there to be a person !""",DISAGREE,"""support euthanasia reason for abortion ? Meaning for instance ... amniocentesis it is discovered discovered the child willing parents abortion people support this ?""","""amniocentesis legal personhood aborting not mercy killing in any way . human person functioning brain upon birth killing of a person anencephaly""",,
14661,3900,"""There are allegories in the Bible .""","""And your point is ? If you 're trying to go that since there are allegories in the Bible , then science does not contridict it , then you are clearly a revisionist who is warping and distorting the bible to suit a specific agenda .""",DISAGREE,"""There are allegories in the Bible""","""And your point is ?""",,
14668,3901,"""Responsibility would be easy - whoever was adopting it , its not hard I 've been told to find adoptive parents for babies and if you have up to 9 months to do so then its even easier . However I think the cost of the units means they would still only be used where abortion was not possible - say the fetus had developed past the allowed abortable age ( so for me that means a functioning brain ) . Its not going to be possible to transfer every potential abortion to the womb unit , at least not or a very long time .""","""Cost would certainly be an issue . If the adoptive parents were willing to take on that cost , that would be best . I wonder , though , how much demand there really is out there for adopted babies . As I understand the situation , currently there are far more parents looking to adopt than there are new babies up for adoption . However , if such an artificial womb would exist , then that may not be the case any longer . Would the mother then have to be responsible ? Not that easy a case to ponder since that would be a case of performing abortion not purely out of a sense of a woman 's right over her own body ( since transfer would be an option ) but out of purely financial , practical reasons .""",AGREE,"""Responsibility would be easy - whoever was adopting it , its not hard I 've been told to find adoptive parents for babies and if you have up to 9 months to do so then its even easier .""","""Cost would certainly be an issue . If the adoptive parents were willing to take on that cost , that would be best .""",,
14672,3902,"""And what of when you go by some moral standard to determine what is right and wrong in other peoples ' lives as well ? What ? you do n't do that ? Bull . You ca n't tell me you never have an opinion or judgment on anything anyone else does . But by your logic , that would be imposing on them . Sorry , that dog just does n't hunt . Everyone has some basis for the views they have about they way they think society would be best . There 's no law that says people ca n't participate in that process with religion or anything else as their moral basis . 'Imposing religion ' is not the same as using religion as a basis , and it 's the fact that you are wrong on this that 's why religious people are continually able to have religion as their basis of social change , just as equally as anything else .""","""Of course everyone has some basis for their views . Not even denying that . However there are ways that using that `` basis `` most certainly is an imposition and the gay rights battle is a prime example . There are many , many , many people who have done work to stop/block gay marriage and other gay rights when they , themselves , are not gay . That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition . All I am asking here is that Archie , you , JP , etc . own that .""",DISAGREE,"""And what of when you go by some moral standard to determine what is right and wrong in other peoples ' lives as well ? What ? you do n't do that ? Bull .""","""Of course everyone has some basis for their views . Not even denying that . ``""",,
14676,3902,"""And what of when you go by some moral standard to determine what is right and wrong in other peoples ' lives as well ? What ? you do n't do that ? Bull . You ca n't tell me you never have an opinion or judgment on anything anyone else does . But by your logic , that would be imposing on them . Sorry , that dog just does n't hunt . Everyone has some basis for the views they have about they way they think society would be best . There 's no law that says people ca n't participate in that process with religion or anything else as their moral basis . 'Imposing religion ' is not the same as using religion as a basis , and it 's the fact that you are wrong on this that 's why religious people are continually able to have religion as their basis of social change , just as equally as anything else .""","""Of course everyone has some basis for their views . Not even denying that . However there are ways that using that `` basis `` most certainly is an imposition and the gay rights battle is a prime example . There are many , many , many people who have done work to stop/block gay marriage and other gay rights when they , themselves , are not gay . That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition . All I am asking here is that Archie , you , JP , etc . own that .""",DISAGREE,"""You ca n't tell me you never have an opinion or judgment on anything anyone else does .""","""There are many , many , many people who have done work to stop/block gay marriage and other gay rights when they , themselves , are not gay . That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition .""",,
14697,3906,"""And with just one falsification , it raises eyebrows about everything .""","""So no eyebrows are raised ?""",DISAGREE,"""And with just one falsification , it raises eyebrows about everything .""","""So no eyebrows are raised ?""",,
14703,3907,"""# 2 - Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began , even though no one was there to observe it ?""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to you . I could really be your imagination talking to you , answering your own question in some weird , perverse way . I am merely an illusion , your sub-conscious . Point being : asking for 100 % proof or you do n't buy it is sophistry -- very close to solipsism , in fact , and was discredited as a theory of epistemology many thousands of years ago .""",AGREE,"""Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began , even though no one was there to observe it ?""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to you .""",,
14704,3907,"""# 2 - Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began , even though no one was there to observe it ?""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to you . I could really be your imagination talking to you , answering your own question in some weird , perverse way . I am merely an illusion , your sub-conscious . Point being : asking for 100 % proof or you do n't buy it is sophistry -- very close to solipsism , in fact , and was discredited as a theory of epistemology many thousands of years ago .""",AGREE,"""Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began ,""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to you .""",,
14705,3907,"""# 2 - Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began , even though no one was there to observe it ?""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to you . I could really be your imagination talking to you , answering your own question in some weird , perverse way . I am merely an illusion , your sub-conscious . Point being : asking for 100 % proof or you do n't buy it is sophistry -- very close to solipsism , in fact , and was discredited as a theory of epistemology many thousands of years ago .""",AGREE,"""Can anyone prove to me without a doubt evolution is the way life began , even though no one was there to observe it ?""","""Can you prove to me without any doubt that I am talking to""",,
14707,3908,"""The University of Tennessee ’ s newly announced policy banning all gun ownership by student-athletes is an extreme overreaction to the criminal acts of a few . UT ’ s athletic director , Mike Hamilton , said that under the new policy , the university will automatically dismiss any student-athlete found in possession of a gun — even those with permits and even those living off-campus . This over-reaching policy prevents law-abiding UT student-athletes from hunting and engaging in recreational and competitive shooting . More importantly , it also prohibits them from owning a firearm for self-defense , a right guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution . Let ’ s be very clear — anyone , student-athlete or otherwise , who commits a serious crime ought to be punished . But the law-abiding should not , period . Sports teach everyone that actions have consequences . Sloppy work in practice leads teams to defeat . Criminal acts lead to punishment . A quality team — on and off the court or field — is what Vol fans want . That is not achieved by depriving students — athletes or not — of their civil rights .""","""There 's absolutely no way in hell this could be legal in any sense . That California school got * * * * * slapped for expelling a student who had a gun off campus , beyond the jurisdictional reach of the school . So how can this school believe they can get away with such an insane policy ?""",AGREE,"""an extreme overreaction a right guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution""","""no way in hell this could be legal an insane policy""",,
14723,3911,"""Agreed , when the husband is part of a hetero relationship . Gay husband is not a legally recognized category . Agreed , when the wife is part of a hetero relationship . Gay wife is not a legally recognized category . Agreed , when the spouse is part of a hetero relationship . Gay spouse is not a legally recognized category .""","""So the fact that it is not legally recognized is the problem . What is the reason it 's not legally recognized ? Because the couple is gay .""",AGREE,"""Agreed , when the spouse is part of a hetero relationship . Gay spouse is not a legally recognized category""","""So the fact that it is not legally recognized is the problem . What is the reason it 's not legally recognized ? Because the couple is gay .""",,
14728,3912,"""Just out of curiosity jake are you gay ?""","""Yes .""",AGREE,"""are you gay ?""","""Yes""",,
14730,3912,"""Just out of curiosity jake are you gay ?""","""Yes .""",AGREE,"""Just out of curiosity jake are you gay ?""","""Yes""",,
14731,3913,"""This is an activity that I engage in all the time""","""Really ? Then you need a better sparring partner to sharpen your thinking .""",AGREE,"""an activity that I engage in all the time""","""Really ? need a better sparring partner""",,
14737,3914,"""No problem with the comparison indicated . There is a problem with your usage of the ward  “ aware ” . Puppies are aware , babies are aware ( according to my understanding of the word `` aware `` ) .""","""Maybe sentient would have been a better word to use . In a nutshell my position is it is no more immoral to kill a baby before it becomes sentient ( if there are good reasons to do so ) then it is to euthanatize a dog at the dog pound .""",DISAGREE,"""No problem with the comparison indicated . There is a problem with your usage of the ward  aware . Puppies are aware , babies are aware""","""Maybe sentient would have been a better word to use . In a nutshell my position is it is no more immoral to kill a baby before it becomes sentient""",,
14767,3917,"""The bottom line is that we should be free to believe as we believe while others should be afforded that same right . Thank you .""","""And how have I deprived you of your right to teach your religion to your children in your home and in your church . How does an objection against the imposition of your religion by force of the government deprive you of your rights . I can certainly see how the imposition of your religion would deprive me of my right to the free exercise of my own religion , but why do you feel that you have a right to impose your religion on me ?""",DISAGREE,"""we should be free to believe as we believe others should be afforded that same right""","""how have I deprived you of your right to teach your religion to your children in your home and in your church . How does an objection against the imposition of your religion by force of the government deprive you of your rights I can certainly see how the imposition of your religion would deprive me of my right""",,
14768,3917,"""The bottom line is that we should be free to believe as we believe while others should be afforded that same right . Thank you .""","""And how have I deprived you of your right to teach your religion to your children in your home and in your church . How does an objection against the imposition of your religion by force of the government deprive you of your rights . I can certainly see how the imposition of your religion would deprive me of my right to the free exercise of my own religion , but why do you feel that you have a right to impose your religion on me ?""",DISAGREE,"""we should be free to believe as we believe while others should be afforded that same right .""","""how have I deprived you of your right""",,
14774,3918,"""It is an animal , with a few parts from column A , a few from column B .""","""And therefore a transitional by definition .""",AGREE,"""It is an animal , with a few parts from column A , a few from column B .""","""And therefore a transitional by definition .""",,
14787,3919,"""So we all deserve to be tortured for ever for beleiving in evolution ?""","""tortured ? you shut ur mouth .. , ... if ur not achristian then yes , i will pray for you ....""",DISAGREE,"""all deserve to be tortured for ever for beleiving in evolution""","""you shut ur mouth ..""",,
14790,3920,"""I just say we make a law against abortion , and stop the genocide against the unborn . Why end a human life on the basis size , development , and environment ?""","""And I just say that it would be unjust and unfair of you to force metaphysical belief systems of your own which constitute religious belief upon your follows who may believe otherwise than you . Get pregnant and treat your fetus as a full person if you wish , nobody will force you to abort it . Let others follow their own beliefs differing or the same . Otherwise you attempt to obtain justice by doing injustice.Mo""",DISAGREE,"""I just say we make a law against abortion , and stop the genocide against the unborn .""","""And I just say that it would be unjust and unfair of you to force metaphysical belief systems of your own""",,
14804,3922,"""Gun registration would be abolished ,""","""And how is this a bad thing ?""",AGREE,"""Gun registration would be abolished ,""","""And how is this a bad thing ?""",,
14807,3923,"""Self-organization is another evolutionary force that some experts say whips up complex features or behaviors spontaneously in living and non-living matter , and these traits are passed on to offspring through the generations .""","""Bertvan : Does this self-organization force  “ whip up ” complex features intelligently and purposefully ? Or does it  “ whip them up ” by some unknown deterministic process in which creativity is somehow achieved by accident ?""",DISAGREE,"""Self-organization is another evolutionary force that some experts say whips up complex features or behaviors""","""Does this self-organization force  whip up complex features intelligently and purposefully ?""",,
14809,3924,"""In fact , I 'm not the least bit interested in debating what atoms and molecules do , in and out of a test tube . So if this is where this discussion is headed , I wo n't be around for long .""","""Oh , do n't be so hasty Bear in mind that at the scale upon which bacteria operate , molecules are significant physical structures . The bacterial flagellum , for instance , is an outboard motor constructed directly out of proteins , which are in turn directly , physically translated via RNA from DNA sequences . The physical shape of the folded molecular structure of those proteins is what makes the motor work . So there 's nothing abstract about the relationship between DNA and the organism 's physical form or abilities .""",DISAGREE,"""atoms and molecules""","""bacteria operate , molecules are significant physical structures physically translated via RNA from DNA sequences physical shape of the folded molecular structure of those proteins relationship between DNA and the organism 's physical form or abilities .""",,
14812,3924,"""In fact , I 'm not the least bit interested in debating what atoms and molecules do , in and out of a test tube . So if this is where this discussion is headed , I wo n't be around for long .""","""Oh , do n't be so hasty Bear in mind that at the scale upon which bacteria operate , molecules are significant physical structures . The bacterial flagellum , for instance , is an outboard motor constructed directly out of proteins , which are in turn directly , physically translated via RNA from DNA sequences . The physical shape of the folded molecular structure of those proteins is what makes the motor work . So there 's nothing abstract about the relationship between DNA and the organism 's physical form or abilities .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not the least bit interested in debating what atoms and molecules do ,""","""The bacterial flagellum , for instance , is an outboard motor constructed directly out of proteins , which are in turn directly ,""",,
14823,3927,"""You are so right-on in what you say ! In a Sunday school at a church I formerly attended , an elder of the church remarked that his `` faith was strengthened `` by the `` evidence `` afforded by recent archaeological discoveries in the middle east . In a tone I now rather regret , I blurted out two things ... ... How weak was your faith before ? and ... If the `` evidence `` had gone 'the other way , ' would your faith then have been weakened ? His answer for the second question was a simple 'no , ' which suggests to me that the sense of the term 'evidence ' he was employing was not the same sense you 'd expect a scientist to use . His response to the first was problematic , and interesting . '' My faith , `` he said , has always been -- then he used the most interesting word -- `` complete. `` But he had taken sufficient offence already , it seemed , that I pressed no further . I wish sometimes that I 'd asked : If your faith was `` always complete , `` did the archaeological evidence make it `` more complete `` ? And , if so , does your sense of 'complete ' match that word 's usual application ? I do not quite grasp the notion of there being `` scientific evidence `` for a proposition within the realm of faith . I do not mean to suggest that my claim that scientific and religious propositions reside in different discourses disposes of all worry or complaint . Activity in one realm may be felt in the other . But , re : evolution , I think this ... Given convincing evidence that , say , the earth is billions of years old , not thousands -- a mound of evidence more than high enough for my needs -- my worry is not that the 'Biblical account ' of creation is wrong , erroneous , falsified ... but rather is the quite different worry of wondering what , now , that account 's meaning is , what it affirms . Scientific discovery , evidence , and discourse thus do n't `` disprove the Bible. `` Rather , they serve to displace interpretations of biblical text , and give us cause -- I call it : opportunity -- to find new , richer meaning in scripture . I 'm often embarrassed by the smallness and brittleness of certain Christians ' interpretations . Emphasizing the 'literal , ' as some do -- a very problematic term in itself -- some Christians see in , for example , the Genesis `` tree of the knowledge of good and evil `` nothing more than a tree . A biological tree . Pear tree . Peach tree . Apple tree . Tree of the knowledge of good and evil . Albeit a special species , nonetheless a species . And , for them , there you go -- Eve chowed down on the fruit of a proscribed species , and that 's your story . Lost , in the insistence upon and closing of that interpretation , is the richness of metaphor the story offers . Metaphor , again and again , is variously deliberately denigrated or unconsciously eclipsed , in the readings of certain Christians . Science is not the only victim of such cheesily 'literal ' interpretation . Christian faith -- at least , the possibility of a rich faith robustly aware of its own weight in metaphor , parable , legend and myth , and the transformative power that arises from those aspects of scripture -- is equally victim . I feel more sadness about such a limited believer 's faith than I do about that person 's science . Master_Shake , for your poignantly apt remark -- `` what they have is n't faith at all `` -- thanks . Bless you ! Brad""","""You can have reasoned faith , but it need not rely on 'empirical ' evidence . There are very many forms of evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""You are so right-on in what you say ! In a Sunday school at a church I formerly attended , an elder of the church remarked that his `` faith was strengthened `` by the `` evidence `` afforded by recent archaeological discoveries in the middle east .""","""You can have reasoned faith , but it need not rely on 'empirical ' evidence .""",,
14848,3931,"""The belief that a woman has a right to abort because she is granted under the 14th amendment the right to do what she wishes with her bodily resources lacks sufficient justification .""","""The Due Process Clause is cited in response to the pro-life assertion that the gov't should have the power to force a woman to donate bodily resources against her will and without her consent .""",DISAGREE,"""belief that a woman has a right to abort because she is granted under the 14th amendment the right to do what she wishes with her bodily resources lacks sufficient justification .""","""the pro-life assertion that the gov't should have the power to force a woman to donate bodily resources against her will and without her consent .""",,
14851,3932,"""The fossil record does not support this . So , in an attempt to deal with this problem , Gould and Eldredge came up with a theory called , punctuated equilibrium .""","""Actually , the fossil record does support it . Both Eldredge and Gould have discussed it . Both men made observations of slow gradual speciation in the fossil record in a small geographical area . These changes were reflected at other locations as an abrupt change from one species to another . But given that such changes take place very quickly in populations that are usually under environmental stress and isolated from the main population , and given the rarity of fossilization in the first place , we do n't expect to find many examples in the fossil record . It is a bit like trying to time a 100 yd . dash with a sundial . The fossil record just is n't fine grained enough to see the rapid ( 50-60 thousand years ) changes .""",DISAGREE,"""The fossil record does not support this .""","""Actually , the fossil record does support it .""",,
14859,3933,"""Life begins at conception -- -- -Brainwaves at three weeks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just the facts ...""","""Care to , uh , back up your facts ?""",DISAGREE,"""Life begins at conception -- -- -Brainwaves at three weeks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just the facts ...""","""Care to , uh , back up your facts ?""",,
14881,3944,"""DAVENPORT , Iowa ( AP ) -- Sen. Sam Brownback , who wants to champion social conservatives in the presidential race , said Tuesday he wants a Senate panel to re-question a judicial nominee who attended a same-sex union ceremony . Brownback , a Kansas Republican , said he wants Michigan state judge Janet Neff to testify about her role in the 2002 Massachusetts ceremony , her legal views on same-sex unions and her ability to be impartial if called upon to rule on such cases . Neff 's nomination to a federal district court is among a dozen or so now stalled in the Senate , a logjam in part due to Brownback 's questions about Neff 's attendance at a lesbian commitment ceremony . The Senate Judiciary Committee has already approved her nomination . Neff was traveling outside the country and could not immediately be reached for comment , said Chris Bockheim , her judicial assistant . Earlier this month , Brownback , a prominent opponent of gay marriage who is exploring a presidential run in 2008 , said he would lift the hold he put on Neff 's nomination if the judge agreed to withdraw from ruling on any court case involving the legality of same sex unions . http : //www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/12/ ... f=rss_politics Does n't this just REEK of hypocrisy and partisanship ? He wants to question this judge because she was PRESENT at a same-sex ceremony . I wonder if similar questions are asked of judges to ensure that they can remain impartial if they view homosexuality as a sin ... `` exploring a presidential run ... `` ? ? ? Sounds like yet another Republican attempt to garner votes off of anti-gay hysteria .""","""Well , this is not very surprising coming from Brownback . I live in Kansas City Missouri , but work over on the Kansas side , so I know plenty about Brownback . He 's been quite a bastard toward gay related issues over the years , and I think the same goes for abortion in his case . If he 's the Republican nominee for the presidential election , boy am I voting Democrat just on that principle , not to mention the fact I have n't voted Republican since George W. You know , maybe they should question judges that have attended hetero marriages as to their impartiality as well as those who attend churches that vocally state their anti-gay views . EDIT : Yep , just checked , and he IS strongly pro-life , having referred to the amount of abortions in the United States since Roe V. Wade as `` a holocaust `` , and is also one of the Kansas officials in favor of teaching Intelligent Design alongside Evolution . He also opposes stem cell research .""",AGREE,"""said he wants Michigan state judge Janet Neff to testify about her role in the 2002 Massachusetts ceremony , her legal views on same-sex unions and her ability to be impartial if called upon to rule on such cases""","""Well , this is not very surprising coming from Brownback .""",,
14906,3950,"""So my question is this : ...""","""So my question is this : Why does n't a chihuahua birthe a Siberian husky in the Antarctic , or even in Siberia ? Oh , my other question is this : Why do animals die young instead of adapt ?""",DISAGREE,"""So my question is this :""","""So my question is this : Why do animals die young instead of adapt ?""",,
14907,3950,"""So my question is this : ...""","""So my question is this : Why does n't a chihuahua birthe a Siberian husky in the Antarctic , or even in Siberia ? Oh , my other question is this : Why do animals die young instead of adapt ?""",DISAGREE,"""So my question is this : ...""","""So my question is this :""",,
14920,3953,"""( 9 . ) Sarah Brady hates guns and wants to ban all firearms from private possession , which is why she bought her son a hunting rifle for Christmas .""","""So you 're admitting that Sarah Brady intentionally committed a straw purchase of a firearm , especially one that can be modified and turned into a long range sniper rifle .""",DISAGREE,"""Sarah Brady hates guns and wants to ban all firearms from private possession ,""","""So you 're admitting that Sarah Brady intentionally committed a straw purchase of a firearm ,""",,
14926,3955,"""Hi , I 'm new here , and I 'd like to know a few educated opinions of people on this board . Regarding the Child Custody Protection Act , I 'd like to just ask ... `` Why would someone actually oppose this ? `` Many in the opposition have said that it infringes on Women 's Rights , yet is n't it a mother 's right to know what their daughter is doing ? Furthermore , Parents are generally in charge of their children until they reach the age of 18 , so would someone mind telling me why the opposition is disrespecting parental authority ? ..... I have suddenly found pro-choice as highly irrational .""","""well , it is irrational if you believe that human life is a good thing . Some people tend to think that it is ok to degrade people because it 1 ) makes economic sense 2 ) cuts down on the population 3 ) makes THEIR life easier . However , when you degrade people you make society worse off ... so I really do n't see a point . Nice to see you here by the way .""",AGREE,"""have suddenly found pro-choice as highly irrational .""","""it is irrational if you believe that human life is a good thing""",,
14929,3955,"""Hi , I 'm new here , and I 'd like to know a few educated opinions of people on this board . Regarding the Child Custody Protection Act , I 'd like to just ask ... `` Why would someone actually oppose this ? `` Many in the opposition have said that it infringes on Women 's Rights , yet is n't it a mother 's right to know what their daughter is doing ? Furthermore , Parents are generally in charge of their children until they reach the age of 18 , so would someone mind telling me why the opposition is disrespecting parental authority ? ..... I have suddenly found pro-choice as highly irrational .""","""well , it is irrational if you believe that human life is a good thing . Some people tend to think that it is ok to degrade people because it 1 ) makes economic sense 2 ) cuts down on the population 3 ) makes THEIR life easier . However , when you degrade people you make society worse off ... so I really do n't see a point . Nice to see you here by the way .""",AGREE,"""Many in the opposition have said that it infringes on Women 's Rights , yet is n't it a mother 's right to know what their daughter is doing ?""","""well , it is irrational if you believe that human life is a good thing""",,
14935,3958,"""So guns are more important than the safety of women ? Then the right of women abandoned by their husbands to know about the financial situation of their spouses in a divorce case ?""","""I would agree with you , but first of all , the owner of the show has every right to not allow cameras . Second , it would be a huge invasion of privacy if all women knew what their ex wives could keep spying on what they buy and what they do . They have no buisness doing that .""",DISAGREE,"""the right of women abandoned by their husbands to know about the financial situation of their spouses in a divorce case ?""","""it would be a huge invasion of privacy if all women knew what their ex wives could keep spying on what they buy and what they do""",,
14937,3959,"""I think you 're being a troll , simone , but I blame the parents . I would never have gotten away with calling my mother a bitch . In fact I would n't have even gotten away with calling her by her first name , it was `` mom `` or `` mother `` . I also had work to do , and I did it or I regretted not doing it . Now half the kids in the U.S. do n't have chores and they call their parents names all the time and get away with it . Then you wonder why kids are so spoiled . A bit of common sense advice : do n't whine about problems , try to solve them . If you do n't have a solution , then do n't whine .""","""Wow Ethmi almost sounds like we had the same mother , because I know exactly what you are saying .""",DISAGREE,"""I think you 're being a troll , simone , but I blame the parents . I would never have gotten away with calling my mother a bitch . In fact I would n't have even gotten away with calling her by her first name , it was `` mom `` or `` mother `` . I also had work to do , and I did it or I regretted not doing it .""","""Wow Ethmi almost sounds like we had the same mother , because I know exactly what you are saying .""",,
14941,3961,"""i mean jesus christ ( pun intended ) ... look at what you posted in response to `` i believe in the teachings of jesus christ . '' : `` that 's a vague statement. ``""","""Jesus Christ ! ( Pun intended ) That 's not anger , I 'm saying that he made a vague statement and he should elaborate on it . Someone could believe in some of the teachings of Jesus , but not be a Christian . Someone can believe in everything Jesus said except for him being the Son of God , and not be a Christian .""",DISAGREE,"""look at what you posted in to `` i believe in the teachings of jesus christ . '' : 's a vague""","""That 's not anger , I 'm saying that he made a vague statement and he should elaborate on it .""",,
14955,3965,"""How can absolute , conceptual , abstract laws be derived from a universe of matter , energy and motion ?""","""Stated above .""",DISAGREE,"""How can absolute , conceptual , abstract laws be derived from a universe of matter , energy and motion ?""","""Stated above""",,
14957,3966,"""That 's fine . You 're free to believe whatever fantasy you choose to believe . After all this is a free country .""","""A free country where gays are n't free to marry ( legally ) ? All of you against gay marriage realize that gays are married NOW , do n't you ? They get rings and everything and even adopt kids . It 's all legal and happening right now . Scared ? Is your marriage less valid or degraded ? Is your life affected one bit ? .""",DISAGREE,"""After all this is a free country .""","""A free country where gays are n't free to marry ( legally ) ?""",,
14971,3969,"""Your reasoning of the effects of abortion are correct . The liberals who see abortion as a normal , acceptable , right to choose abortion are aborting themselves into extinction . Reverence , and a love of life is not what motivates Muslims . The power of Islam is . There is nothing to indicate that Muslims `` love `` life . They 'll cut your limbs or head off for nearly any reason . They 'll remove your head with a hacksaw so to take the time for `` you `` the victim to enjoy the moment and to voice your opinion and video it for your family and countrymen to enjoy .""","""If you dont believe that muslims love life they will cut your head right off ! Its an easy choice if you ask me .""",AGREE,"""Your reasoning of the effects of abortion are , Reverence , and a love of life is not what motivates Muslims .""","""If you dont believe that muslims love life they will cut your head right off""",,
14981,3971,"""Ah , how icky the hypocrisy smells . Louisiana Republican Senator David Vitter , one of the leading proponents of a constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage , has just apologized for his `` serious sin `` after his phone number appeared in the records of a DC Madam who ran an escort/prostitution service . Vitter had this to say of his connection to the prostitution service : `` This was a very serious sin in my past for which I am , of course , completely responsible . Several years ago , I asked for and received forgiveness from God and my wife in confession and marriage counseling . Out of respect for my family , I will keep my discussion of the matter there-with God and them . But I certainly offer my deep and sincere apologies to all I have disappointed and let down in any way. `` During his campaign for the U.S. Senate , Vitter had been accused of going to a prostitute , a charge that he then vigorously denied . Now , of course , he 's been caught , and he admits it . Meanwhile , Vitter expressed strong support last year for a proposed constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage . He compared same-sex marriage to hurricanes Katrine and Rita . He said , `` I do n't believe there 's any issue that 's more important than this one. `` It is always amazing when the self-proclaimed defenders of supposedly traditional marriage , the politicians who bolster their campaigns by appealing to popular anti-gay prejudice , are exposed for the hypocrites they are . In this case , this conservative Christian who campaigned against gay rights just could n't keep his own pants zipped . And to make sure he got elected , he lied about it until he was caught .""","""Care to post a link ? Because I googled `` Vitter admits to adultery `` and came up with zero results about this story . And can you show where he is a fundamentalist christian and not just a conservative Republican ? And I find it very hypocritical how frenzied your side can become at his admitted personal sin when in regards to your own personal values system adultery is n't considered sinning at all . If he admitted to sodomy , would you also make an issue of that which you consider totally normal activity ? And ca n't you see the hypocricy and double standard by throwing such stones in the face of seeking acceptance of your lifestyle ? If I were to put myself in your place , would n't it have made more sense to attempt to justify his actions as a non issue in order to show that we are all alike and criticizing any sexual standards of right and wrong is damaging to the human condition ? Again , I ask , where is the consistency in your thinking ?""",DISAGREE,"""Senator David Vitter , one of the leading proponents of a constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage , has just apologized for his `` serious sin `` after his phone number appeared in the records of a DC Madam who ran an escort/prostitution service .""","""Care to post a link ? Because I googled `` Vitter admits to adultery `` and came up with zero results about this story""",,
14993,3973,"""simple .... many Christians have been deceived .... just like Adam and Eve were deceived in the Bible .""","""So , because they do n't interpret the bible as you do , they believe that there are no deities ? That is what you said ...""",DISAGREE,"""Christians have been deceived .""","""because they do n't interpret the bible as you do""",,
14998,3974,"""You all are missing the point that the morning after pill is abortion ( or rather could be ) . It can still kill a human life on purpose .""","""Oh come on Steeeeve , around 50 % of fertilized embroyo 's will fail to implant anyway , so nature 'has killed/'is killing ' half of all the people who have ever existed anyway . You can not tell me that none of those are not just fluke losses of otherwise perfectly healthly embryos . Also , prevention of implantation is only one of several mechanisms by which emergency contraception works- it also prevents ovulation , disrupts passage of a released egg and inhibits fertilzation occuring in the first place .""",DISAGREE,"""You all are missing the point that the morning after pill is abortion""","""around 50 % of fertilized embroyo 's will fail to implant anyway , so nature 'has killed/'is killing ' half of all the people who have ever existed anyway . You can not tell me that none of those are not just fluke losses of otherwise perfectly healthly embryos .""",,
15017,3984,"""Sometimes the state of the education system in the USA makes me cry .""","""Sometimes ? The state of the public education system in the US is downright criminally neglectful .""",AGREE,"""Sometimes the state of the education system in the USA makes me cry .""","""The state of the public education system in the US is downright criminally neglectful .""",,
15041,3988,"""All forms of life ? Animal life ? Plant life ? The mold growing in your bathroom ?""","""I 'm sorry , but I thought it went without saying that we were discussing human life .""",DISAGREE,"""All forms of life ? Animal life ? Plant life ? The mold growing in your bathroom ?""","""I thought it went without saying that we were discussing human life .""",,
15080,4002,"""You are making some false assumptions . However , I guess you are unable to read . I definately know you ca n't read in context .""","""Yep , he dodged it again . Care to explain your views on Creation in the Tanakh for the folks here ?""",DISAGREE,"""I guess you are unable to read . I definately know you ca n't read in context .""","""Care to explain your views on Creation in the Tanakh for the folks here ?""",,
15090,4003,"""What else would you expect from the people who created a god in their own image ?""","""Another wild-butt theory from the radical left . Liberals do love their Michael Moore theories . So prove it .""",DISAGREE,"""What else would you expect from the people who created a god in their own image ?""","""Liberals do love their Michael Moore theories . So prove it .""",,
15101,4006,"""Pregnancy is ALWAYS physically harmful . You try carrying a load of extra weight about and see what that does to your heart . It is also always life threatening - women still die from it and you never know how childbirth is going to go .""","""jessica , all these problems you 've listed , the human body takes care of automatically and remarkably well . the fact still remains that only less than 5 % of all abortions occur because the risk is great enough to be deemed life-threatening to either tha mother or the child . and that percentage is diminishing as well . the overwhelming majority of abortions occur simply because the woman decides she does not wnat to be a mother .""",DISAGREE,"""Pregnancy is ALWAYS physically harmful . You try carrying a load of extra weight about and see what that does to your heart .""","""the human body takes care of automatically and remarkably well .""",,
15106,4008,"""* interupts debate for a second * Yay ! Welcome .""","""Guess what , I 'm pro-life as well , that is why I 'm also pro-choice .""",AGREE,"""* interupts debate for a second * Yay ! Welcome .""","""Guess what , I 'm pro-life as well , that is why I 'm also pro-choice .""",,
15115,4011,"""No way . No friggin ' way . * Majorly ticked * The Goverment ca n't intrude on your life like that . What 's next , they do and they have to have a forced abortion ? This is n't Communist China .... no way . They ca n't do that .... * Begins to consider stockpiling weapons in case of a revolution against the liberal controlled courts *""","""Well , it stated that they would not be forced to have an abortion , but would be held in contempt of court . Was what he said wrong only because he is trying to intrude on their private lives , or because he felt that the couple should not have any more children put onto the taxpayer 's backs ? Is this necessarily a liberal view ?""",AGREE,"""No way . No friggin ' way . The Goverment ca n't intrude on your life like that . What 's next , they do and they have to have a forced abortion ?""","""Well , it stated that they would not be forced to have an abortion , but would be held in contempt of court .""",,
15123,4012,"""So where did we come from ?""","""You have n't defined that yet . Therefore I can not answer .""",DISAGREE,"""So where did we come from ?""","""You have n't defined that yet . Therefore I can not answer .""",,
15127,4013,"""I disagree with this one though . They worded it in such a way to prevent the state from recognizing civil unions for gay couples . I think they should have left that in .""","""Well , then you disagree with almost all the state amendments . You must be out of step with your party ...""",DISAGREE,"""I disagree with this one though .""","""then you disagree with almost all the state amendments .""",,
15139,4014,"""The study you linked us mentions that the BST method required follow up visits , to ensure that the teachings actually stuck . There 's no such mention with the Eddie Eagle program . Why ?""","""And better yet , ask Sinjin what he and his cohorts are doing to teach gun safety ? How much did he and or the Anti-gun orgs spend ? The NRA spent more then 20 MILLION Dollars to teach children to STOP ! DO N'T TOUCH , LEAVE THE AREA , TELL AN ADULT ! The NRA probably could and would do more however , EVEN JUST THAT , is called indoctrination by the Anti-gun crowed , and apparently even Sinjin ! So is the criticism fair ? Is the comparison he made fair ?""",DISAGREE,"""The study you linked us mentions that the BST method required follow up visits ,""","""And better yet , ask Sinjin what he and his cohorts are doing to teach gun safety ?""",,
15147,4015,"""We are n't defending guns . We 're defending the right to be armed .""","""So having guns is not part of being armed ?""",DISAGREE,"""We are n't defending guns . We 're defending the right to be armed .""","""So having guns is not part of being armed ?""",,
15158,4016,"""I understand how elvolution works and all but how can they teach it like a fact in schools when its really just the `` Theory `` of `` evolution ? its just like electritity noone can see it but they teach it in all the schools just cause some scientist believes in it . i think thats just plane dumb , if you ask me , more peeple believe in Jesus and a few have even seen him so right there its more believable then evolution which was invented a couple hundred years ago by some elitist sientist . so why not teach about jessus in the schools since we know more about him , and have actual facts that were written down by people who knew him eg . '' The Bible ! `` plus correct me if im wrong but i think theirs some stuff in there about how man 's kind came to exsist .""","""JUST a theory ? Gravity is a theory . You do n't think electricity exists ? Wow . The person before answered your questions clear enough , I just wanted to point that out .""",DISAGREE,"""I understand how elvolution works and all but how can they teach it like a fact in schools when its really just the `` Theory `` of `` evolution ? its just like electritity noone can see it but they teach it in all the schools just cause some scientist believes in it . ''""","""JUST a theory ? Gravity is a""",,
15168,4017,"""I disagree as all drugs being legalized would surely be a danger to society . As for weed , I think it should only be legalized if every other country ( or most ) does it . Why ? Well , have you ever been to amsterdam ? It sucks . I would hate to be like that .""","""I 've never been to Amsterdam . A friend of mine went and he liked it . I 'd like to go someday . Hell , I 'd just like to get my XXX anywhere , really .""",DISAGREE,"""I disagree as all drugs being legalized would surely be a danger to society .""","""I 've never been to Amsterdam""",,
15165,4017,"""I disagree as all drugs being legalized would surely be a danger to society . As for weed , I think it should only be legalized if every other country ( or most ) does it . Why ? Well , have you ever been to amsterdam ? It sucks . I would hate to be like that .""","""I 've never been to Amsterdam . A friend of mine went and he liked it . I 'd like to go someday . Hell , I 'd just like to get my XXX anywhere , really .""",DISAGREE,"""I disagree as all drugs being legalized would surely be a danger to society . As for weed , I think it should only be legalized if every other country ( or most ) does it . Why ?""","""I 've never been to Amsterdam . A friend of mine went and he liked it . I 'd like to go someday .""",,
15176,4018,"""We hicks just do n't understand . And obviously , us rural Christians are in the dark because our brains just aren ’ t as  “ fit ” or as  “ well-wired ” as evolutionists ’ brains are – which is why they ’ d just assume we ’ d all be  “ unselected ” so they can do all the thinking .""","""The paradox on creation is that it is obessed with proving scientific concepts wrong without taking the time to even understand the basics of how it works . The analogy here is arguing that quantum physics is wrong without understand the basics of how force or momentum operate .""",DISAGREE,"""We hicks just do n't understand .""","""The paradox on creation is that it is obessed with proving scientific concepts wrong without taking the time to even understand the basics of how it works .""",,
15196,4020,"""So you agree that it 's not necessary to have high capacity magazines because gun owners can reload quickly when defending themselves against a criminals . Good we can agree on at least one thing .""","""This is n't my position . I 'm arguing that your attempts to demonize magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds is foolish . Furthermore , if no honest citizen needs a 15 round magazine , then no police officer needs them either . If we can reload them quickly enough for it to not matter , then the police can do it too .""",DISAGREE,"""Good we can agree on at least one thing .""","""This is n't my""",,
15198,4021,"""We have coyotes just outside the yard almost every night . Solo to packs of 10 or more . The males go about 40lbs or thereabouts . The females are used as bait to lure dogs . Dangerous predators ? For dogs and cats maybe . The dingo ate my baby ?""","""No need to read any farther , the expert has spoken from his small shell of ignorance : coyote attacks in california - Google Search He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else . He can outrun almost any child .""",DISAGREE,"""We have coyotes just outside the yard almost every night .""","""coyote attacks in california - Google Search He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else""",,
15199,4021,"""We have coyotes just outside the yard almost every night . Solo to packs of 10 or more . The males go about 40lbs or thereabouts . The females are used as bait to lure dogs . Dangerous predators ? For dogs and cats maybe . The dingo ate my baby ?""","""No need to read any farther , the expert has spoken from his small shell of ignorance : coyote attacks in california - Google Search He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else . He can outrun almost any child .""",DISAGREE,"""Solo to packs of 10 or more . The males go about 40lbs or thereabouts . The females are used as bait to lure dogs .""","""Google Search He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else .""",,
15200,4021,"""We have coyotes just outside the yard almost every night . Solo to packs of 10 or more . The males go about 40lbs or thereabouts . The females are used as bait to lure dogs . Dangerous predators ? For dogs and cats maybe . The dingo ate my baby ?""","""No need to read any farther , the expert has spoken from his small shell of ignorance : coyote attacks in california - Google Search He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else . He can outrun almost any child .""",DISAGREE,"""Dangerous predators ? The dingo ate my baby ?""","""He does n't mind if they eat kids and their pets or someone else .""",,
15212,4022,"""youre more concerned about those 22 to 30 thousand gun laws but Im more concerned about the 22 to 30 thousand lives taken by gun violence each year""","""First of all , gun violence is no joke , but your figures are way too high if you are talking about criminal gun violence . Which is the subject of this group of threads . But you guys push for stuff that will have little to no impact on gun violence . Stuff like an Assault Weapons ban . So called Assault Weapons even if were dis-invented would have less impact than lets say murders committed by beating people to death with hands , and feet . Which by the way , also shows the futility of banning guns in the first place . Brady , I have shown you who commits murder . You are NEVER going to stop all of that by punishing those who do n't take drugs , or sell them , or commit crimes . If you were actually serious about doing what you say you want to do , you would be designing and pushing for resolutions to deal with the actual evidence . Let me also show you what the FBI says are the pertinent factors . Crime factors from the FBI website""",DISAGREE,"""Im more concerned about the 22 to 30 thousand lives taken by gun violence each year""","""So called Assault Weapons even if were dis-invented would have less impact than lets say murders committed by beating people to death with hands , and feet""",,
15223,4023,"""I believe that abortion stands it best chance at being reduced by addressing the things that lead to unplanned pregnancy and the reasons women choose to abort . To demonize women and simply take away choice without addressing these things will not reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies , or gauarantee responsible choices . It will lead desperate women to desperate action , though ( i.e. , coat hangers ) .""","""Well some of ROCC 's comments were addressing issues that lead to unplanned pregnancy . Sexual promiscuity does lead to pregnancy , an increased rate of sex will increase the rate of pregnancies , even when birth control is a factor . I do recognize that there are other problems involved with unplanned pregnancies and issues should be dealt with , though apparently the responsibility of creating solutions to these issues is given primarily to pro-life supporters . There are two main issues that have to be dealt with ; reducing the amount of un-planned pregnancies , and giving more options to people who have an un-planned pregnancy . Now this may differ country to country depending on the social services that are available to support an unplanned pregnancy . Desperate action can not justify making morally objective issues legal , and i say morally objective since I 'm sure any sane person will agree that taking away the life of an innocent person is morally objective . Governments could make a lot of money on taxing narcotics to people who wish to take use in them , though this does not justify legalizing narcotics . Desperate drug addicts will be lead to desperate situations of theft in which they even may morally object to , but must partake in in order to feed their drug addiction . Even in the case of underground back-alley abortion clinics , they were just as safe as abortions are today , and have n't been any more dangerous since the invention of antibiotics and anesthetics . These procedures , though underground , were performed by qualified physicians who either believed that women should have the choice to kill their unborn child , or just realize that there was a small demand to do so . ( The actual statistic on the demand that were presented in Roe vs. Wade were fabricated by the pro-choice community ten times the actual value ) If you require me to prove or source any of this information , I would be glad to provide it .""",DISAGREE,"""believe reduced by addressing the things women choose to abort unwanted pregnancies desperate action""","""Sexual promiscuity does lead to pregnancy responsibility of creating solutions objective issues legal legalizing narcotics kill their unborn child""",,
15246,4033,"""I do n't walk into a building and say , `` Wow , look at what came out of the explosion at the brick factory ! `` That would be utterly ridiculous .""","""Probably because buildings are n't biological or reproductive .""",AGREE,"""I do n't walk into a building and say , `` Wow , look at what came out of the explosion at the brick factory ! ``""","""Probably because buildings are n't biological or reproductive .""",,
15257,4035,"""Lastly and most importantly the prevalence of guns in general makes criminals far more likely to go armed , which raises the chance of you getting shot .""","""Nobody 's armed in England , but the criminals still go armed . What 's your excuse for that ?""",DISAGREE,"""Lastly and most importantly the prevalence of guns in general makes criminals far more likely to go armed""","""Nobody 's armed in England , but the criminals still go armed .""",,
15265,4036,"""I am primarily interested in seeing how the creationists wriggle around this one .""","""Well , let 's see . 1 This is a skull from a modern human , the differences representing pathological deformities . 2 The dating is based on disputed methodology . Creation scientists have proved that radioisotope dating is unreliable . 3 The two pieces are only assumed to be from the same individual . 4 Where 's the conclusive DNA evidence ? ( A nod to easyrider on the Religion board . ) 5 These claims are made by scientists , and all science is an atheistic conspiracy against religion ( thank you marc9000 ) . 6 So where 's the missing link between the new fossil and us ? Huh ? Huh ? Sadly , past experience suggests that creationists can wriggle on indefinitely .""",AGREE,"""I am primarily interested in seeing how the creationists wriggle around this one .""","""Well , let 's see . 1 This is a skull from a modern human 2 The dating is based on disputed methodology""",,
15289,4047,"""There is nothing at all absurd about this take . The Gay agenda has been to normalize homosexuality and what better way to do it than to indoctrinate the young and desensitize them to the negatives of the lifestyle while they 're still impressionable . That way they know that within 20 years they will have normalized this abnormal lifestyle .""","""And this is a bad thing ?""",AGREE,"""There is nothing at all absurd about this take .""","""And this is a bad thing ?""",,
15303,4050,"""Paranoia is so ugly . It 's not OK to teach scientific theory but it is OK to tell them that mythology is fact ?""","""To teach them to look at each side and decide for themselves is not paranoia . Blocking one side , not by the will of the people but by the courts , is actually paranoia .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not OK to teach scientific theory but it is OK to tell them that mythology is fact ?""","""Blocking one side , not by the will of the people but by the courts , is actually paranoia .""",,
15304,4050,"""Paranoia is so ugly . It 's not OK to teach scientific theory but it is OK to tell them that mythology is fact ?""","""To teach them to look at each side and decide for themselves is not paranoia . Blocking one side , not by the will of the people but by the courts , is actually paranoia .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not OK to teach scientific theory but it is OK to tell them that mythology is fact""","""To teach them to look at each side and decide for themselves is not paranoia . Blocking one side , not by the will of the people but by the courts , is actually paranoia .""",,
15318,4052,"""Actually , Dembski is known for his useless maths .""","""Really ; Dembski ? Have you any good sites ? Are they 'published ' anywhere ( hint hint )""",AGREE,"""Actually , Dembski is known for his useless maths .""","""Really ; Dembski ? Have you any good sites ? Are they 'published ' anywhere""",,
15316,4052,"""Actually , Dembski is known for his useless maths .""","""Really ; Dembski ? Have you any good sites ? Are they 'published ' anywhere ( hint hint )""",AGREE,"""Dembski is known for his useless maths .""","""Really ; '""",,
15347,4078,"""I do n't think there are many , who consider the fetus a person in the way you are implying , that are still for abortion `` rights `` . The debate is not if its ok to kill a human being because obviously your not going to get a huge debate on that but rather is the fetus a human being .""","""Whether a fetus is a person is not something open to consideration . An apple is not an orange . The reason that we have two words to apply as labels is simply because they absolutely are not the same thing . It is that simple . Suppose that a fetus is frozen and implanted in a female 22 years later . Is it of legal drinking age at birth ? Obviously not . We currently have the technology to actually do this .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think there are many , who consider the fetus a person in the way you are implying ,""","""Whether a fetus is a person is not something open to consideration .""",,
15352,4079,"""But apparently Bush was dating her . I do n't think on the medical form they ask who you are dating . And is there any actual proof that it was his child that he aborted ? I want to see the test results on that . If that is indeed true , it was a very big mishap for Bush . But I am not voting for him because he claims he is not pro-choice . I am personally pro-choice myself ( in certain cases ) .""","""In Canada anyway , the father must be identified on the medical records ( to the best of the woman 's knowledge anyway ) . I have n't seen the medical records , I do n't know if Bush was indicated as the father or not , but to the best of my knowledge , they have always asked who the father was . The next step is to deny it was his child , Jerry Springer or Jenny Jones style , also typical . Apparently 4 of her friends were willing to sign an affadavit that he was , AT THE TIME OF THE ABORTION . Is that 100 % proof ? Of course not , but it 's pretty compelling evidence . Interesting that despite the fact you are pro-choice , and that you do n't really have any evidence to the contrary , you immediately pounced on this thread with an unwavering defense of Bush . Especially on an issue which you do n't consider as being of high importance in the campaign . Is it not even remotely possible that Bush is n't `` perfect `` ? Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""And is there any actual proof that it was his child that he aborted ? I want to see the test results on that .""","""Apparently 4 of her friends were willing to sign an affadavit that he was , AT THE TIME OF THE ABORTION""",,
15367,4081,"""Indeed . Many people do n't realize that the commandment is not `` thou shalt not kill , `` but `` thou shalt not murder. `` The important question then becomes , when is killing murder ? I have no doubt that God cares for the lives of fetuses . But I also have no doubt that God cares for the lives of pregnant women . The reason I brought up the Exodus passage is that it 's often taken to establish that abortion is murder , and that performing an abortion should be punished accordingly . But the passage is n't talking about abortion at all . Which just leaves us with the question of when it is or is n't acceptable to take a life , and the passage does n't provide guidance to that general question , either .""","""How is that conclusion derived at ? The passage is speaking to the consequences to a man who 's actions cause the death of an unborn child . And the proscribed consequence is death according to OT Law . So although the passage is n't speaking to abortion at all , it is making a very clear statement regarding the value of the unborn , as it is requiring a life for a life just as for any other sentient being according to the OT Law . So these arguments I get from the likes of you and Iangb which argue that until a child shows mental awareness , it is n't actually a person deserving of human rights is a bogus and shortsighted position according to the scriptural point of view . Of that , there is no question .""",DISAGREE,"""Many people do n't realize that the commandment is not `` thou shalt not kill , `` but `` thou shalt not murder""","""The passage is speaking to the consequences to a man who 's actions cause the death of an unborn child . And the proscribed consequence is death according to OT Law""",,
15385,4084,"""Hmm ... seemed really cold this year ...""","""Of corse it was cold this year every year is different Globle warming is a yuppie fraud study . I do not beleve in Globle warming . If there was globle warming we would not have snow like we did 2 and 3 years ago . Every thing has been normal that I can tell . Gee I wonder how much money was wasted on this foolish study and brain washing .""",DISAGREE,"""Hmm ... seemed really cold this year ...""","""Of corse it was cold this year every year is different Globle warming is a yuppie fraud study .""",,
15409,4088,"""Religious faith , by definition , is a `` jump in the dark `` and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet . In principle , given adequate evidence etc. , there is nothing in the material world that can not be explained by Science . But someone who has , so to speak , already jumped into the dark can not see this . The most interesting questions that a supernatural account of human life can raise are concerned with the evolution of law , morality , social conventions , aesthetic sensibility and such like .""","""This is a statement written by someone who obviously has not read scripture . One of the most astonising `` proofs `` if you will , that the Bible is of supernatural origin , is predictive prophecy . Science can not , as you claim , `` explain `` everything , and it has no natural explanation for the predictions made in scripture . How can science explain through statistical probablity the over 600 prophecies in Biblical writings that have come to pass ? Also , how can it explain how supposedly uneducated people ( uneducated in the ways of modern science ) wrote about astronomy as if they knew about the universe as we do today . How could they have described the hydrological cycle as we have only come to know it recently ? Ecclesiastes 1:6 The wind goes toward the south , And turns around to the north ; The wind whirls about continually , And comes again on its circuit . How did they know that the earth `` hangs on nothing `` when the accepted norm of the day did not even accept that possibility ? Job 26:7 He stretches out the north over empty space ; He hangs the earth on nothing . How did they know that the `` vapors `` of the earth rise to create moisture , that is seeded by lightning with nitrogen and then falls as rain to fertilze the soil ? Jeremiah 10:13 When He utters His voice , There is a multitude of waters in the heavens :  “ And He causes the vapors to ascend from the ends of the earth . He makes lightning for the rain , He brings the wind out of His treasuries. ” Hydrothermal vents [ 4 ] are described in two books of the Bible written before 1400BC—more than 3,000 years before their discovery by science . Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah ’ s life , in the second month , the seventeenth day of the month , on that day all the fountains of the great deep were broken up , and the windows of heaven were opened . Even though the Bible is not a scientific text book and does n't purport to be , nowhere is it scientifically inaccurate . In addition , many of the scientific ideas you are so impressed with are nothing new to the Bible . It was speaking of these things long before modern science spoke of them . The story goes `` They ( scientists ) are slowly working their way to the mountain 's peak painstakingly measuring and analyzing every step that they take . After many years of research , they finally arrive at the top of the mountain , scale over its leading edge , only to find a group of theologians sitting there with the answers all along. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Religious faith , by definition , is a `` jump in the dark `` and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet .""","""This is a statement written by someone who obviously has not read scripture . One of the most astonising `` proofs `` if you will , that the Bible is of supernatural origin , is predictive prophecy .""",,
15424,4091,"""The Bible . God did not write the Bible , he inspired the people to write it . You are right , no logical contradiction exists .""","""And that is different how ? I told johnny to write that I 'm infallible . Therefore the book that I told johnny to write proves I 'm infallible . There is no difference .""",DISAGREE,"""God did not write the Bible , he inspired the people to write it""","""I told johnny to write that I 'm infallible .""",,
15430,4092,"""Because you do n't give a damn about the circumstances of the woman . All she is to you is a pregnancy and nothing more .""","""I do n't give a damn about the circumstances of the unborn either ( obvious here I am not saying I do n't care what happens to either , but for the sake of whether or not we should kill the unborn this is my stance ) . Neither one should have a right to kill the other ... and for that matter , no one else should be allowed to come up and murder the women or the unborn . So my views are still treating them as equals . and I will ask you to stay away from more assumtions that you ca n't prove .""",DISAGREE,"""Because you do n't give a damn about the circumstances of the woman .""","""I do n't give a damn about the circumstances of the unborn either""",,
15443,4095,"""It is irrelevant what Sanger 's viewpoint on eugenics was . Even if we accept that she did advocate it remember birth control is not eugenics in itself but one of the tools used to meet its aims .""","""No , it 's plenty relevant . See what I mean , the pro-abortion crowd is attempting to downplay the signifigance of one of their heroines ' philosophies . Especially when you consider that Sanger was in lock-step with Adolph Hitler 's philosophy regarding the `` master race ! ``""",DISAGREE,"""It is irrelevant what Sanger 's viewpoint on eugenics was .""","""No , it 's plenty relevant .""",,
15452,4098,"""Then the issue I & # 8217 ; ve raised has some merit ? Is dark matter the only possible thing we can & # 8217 ; t see using EM waves , or could there be other things that could throw off our conclusions at these great distances ?""","""Throw off our conclusions about what ? I 'm getting a bit confused as to what you 're trying to cast doubt upon . Dark matter is stuff that does n't interact via the electromagnetic force , so again by definition anything that we ca n't 'see ' using EM waves is dark matter . this is an interesting article about one way we can observe it indirectly""",DISAGREE,"""the issue I ve raised has some merit ? conclusions at these great distances ?""","""conclusions about what ? Dark matter is stuff that does n't interact""",,
15456,4099,"""Yea the legalizatioin of drugs would cause an epedimic of problems . Crime , suicide , mental health problems , and physical health problems .""","""Too late , drug usage has already created those epidemics . Legalizing drugs may increase some of them temporarily , but they already exist . I would argue that there would be a decrease in crime , for certain .""",DISAGREE,"""Yea the legalizatioin of drugs would cause an epedimic of problems . Crime , suicide , mental health problems , and physical health problems .""","""Too late , drug usage has already created those epidemics . Legalizing drugs may increase some of them temporarily , but they already exist .""",,
15469,4103,"""Background checks , if you have ever been convicted of a crime involving a firearm or violence against another person you cant have a gun , I wouldnt mind requiring an hour long class on gun safety before you buy your first weapon either , fully automatics should be legal . There is more but right now I cant seem to think correctly so I will come back to this later .""","""the later the better , it seems to me""",DISAGREE,"""Background checks , if you have ever been convicted of a crime involving a firearm or violence against another person you cant have a gun""","""the later the better , it seems to me""",,
15471,4103,"""Background checks , if you have ever been convicted of a crime involving a firearm or violence against another person you cant have a gun , I wouldnt mind requiring an hour long class on gun safety before you buy your first weapon either , fully automatics should be legal . There is more but right now I cant seem to think correctly so I will come back to this later .""","""the later the better , it seems to me""",DISAGREE,"""There is more but right now I cant seem to think correctly so I will come back to this later .""","""the later the better , it seems to me""",,
15498,4108,"""abortion is bad , there should n't be a need for it in the perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""","""For once I agree with you . Your wrong on your thoughts and views with evolution but your right in saying that abortion is wrong .""",AGREE,"""is bad , a in the perfect world , but i 'm not going to force my morality down your throat and force you to abide to MY principals while demanding you abandon your own .""","""For once I agree with you . Your wrong on your thoughts and views with evolution but your right in saying that abortion is wrong""",,
15505,4109,"""So what activates genes ? When a gene product is needed , a signal from its environment , not an emergent property of the gene itself , activates experession of that gene . In otherwords , it 's the environment , stupid. `` Pg/ 52""","""So what you are saying is simply that the genes do not actively control the body . What is wrong with assuming that genes therefore do not control the body is the fact that the genes were the blueprint for the body . The genes decided the arrangement of cells , the number of fingers , etc . The body , the cells , and the organelles within the cells are therefore strongly influenced by the DNA sequence .""",DISAGREE,"""So what activates genes ? When a gene product is needed , a signal from its environment ,""","""So what you are saying is simply that the genes do not actively control the body""",,
15527,4120,"""Nevertheless , I think the woman should have the choice .. and she does . However , if she makes the choice to kill another human being we should punish her or whoever did it .""","""Amen ! ! Punish the whore ! If she would have just had the kid she would discover what we all know ... That the child would have been loved and protected given a nurturing home by her because she is n't really smart enough to know what she wants . She MUST have the kid , when it arrives all will be well ! ! We just know it !""",AGREE,"""However , if she makes the choice to kill another human being we should punish her or whoever did it .""","""Amen ! !""",,
15529,4121,"""So , how many kids do you have ? And , do you know their names ? What they like to do ? It does n't sound like you 've been much of a dad if all you did is providing for them . Did you watch TV sports the rest of the time ?""","""so watching TV sports = bad daddy ? do you let your boyfriend/girlfriend or husband watch TV sports or only feminist approved TV channels ?""",DISAGREE,"""dad watch TV sports""","""daddy watch TV sports""",,
15541,4123,"""In the following example that you provided : What is the context of the word 'truncated ' ? The way I read it - it is talking about a truncated string of code or something . What was truncated ?""","""The gene and therefore the enzyme it produces . LPL is the designation for a gene that encodes Lipoprotein Lipase , an enzyme that hydrolyzes lipids in lipoproteins . The actual gene encodes a protein of 475 amino acids that becomes a mature protein of 448 amino acids after cleavage of a signal peptide . One study was able to identify 3 common SNPs ( Single Nucleotide Polymorphism ) in the coding region of the gene , 2 of which result in small changes in enzyme function in European populations . The third SNP converts that locus to a stop codon and results in an enzyme that is 447 amino acids long . Thus , the enzyme has been truncated . The resulting enzyme , LPL S447X , is functional . In fact , it results in lower incidence of vascular disease and lower blood pressure . Other truncations result in non-functional enzymes .""",DISAGREE,"""What was truncated ?""","""The gene and therefore the enzyme it produces .""",,
15545,4124,"""`` Unlike the Pennsylvania constitution , the language of the Second Amendment is absolute : 'shall not be infringed . '""","""Just like the first amendment starts with `` Congress shall make no law `` , which is no less absolute . OR the fourth , `` The right of the people to be secure in their persons , houses , papers , and effects , against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated `` . Do I need to go on ? Every one of the original ten amendments , witht he exception of the 6th and 7th contain strong language that leave no doubts as to the fact that the rights are protected . Yet we DO have laws regarding free speach , the DMCA , etc ...""",DISAGREE,"""Unlike the Pennsylvania constitution , the language of the Second Amendment is absolute : 'shall not be infringed .""","""Every one of the original ten amendments , witht he exception of the 6th and 7th contain strong language that leave no doubts as to the fact that the rights are protected""",,
15546,4124,"""`` Unlike the Pennsylvania constitution , the language of the Second Amendment is absolute : 'shall not be infringed . '""","""Just like the first amendment starts with `` Congress shall make no law `` , which is no less absolute . OR the fourth , `` The right of the people to be secure in their persons , houses , papers , and effects , against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated `` . Do I need to go on ? Every one of the original ten amendments , witht he exception of the 6th and 7th contain strong language that leave no doubts as to the fact that the rights are protected . Yet we DO have laws regarding free speach , the DMCA , etc ...""",DISAGREE,"""constitution language of the Second Amendment is absolute 'shall not be infringed . '""","""first amendment `` Congress shall make no law no less absolute The right of the people to be secure in their persons , houses , papers , and effects , against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated `` laws""",,
15581,4130,"""Whcih is why , in order to get to at least some semblance of the truth , one must look behind the report to the publication where is appears . There are very few outside the hard right religious radical lunatic fringe ( SoC for example ) who give credence to anything NARTH puts out given their biases . I have yet to see one of these folks explain how allowing same gender couples to marry will negatively impact their own marriages .""","""Prove that it is untrustworthy ... It is an organization of professionals and is as trustworthy as any other Professional organization .""",DISAGREE,"""Whcih is why , in order to get to at least some semblance of the truth , one must look behind the report to the publication where is appears .""","""Prove that it is untrustworthy""",,
15588,4131,"""I have already asked God for forgiveness and he has forgiven me .""","""So , then you DO feel that what you did was a sin . Otherwise you would n't have asked forgiveness for it . I have one question . What was your motivation for starting this thread ? Was it to try and somehow prove that a person can be a Christian and have an abortion ? Just curious . IMO , you are right that you are forgiven for it , as God is a forgiving and loving God . But I hope you do n't do it again .""",DISAGREE,"""has forgiven me""","""you are right that you are forgiven for it ,""",,
15602,4134,"""ID did not initiate a war for hearts and minds .""","""So the creationists behind it are lying when they say that 's exactly what it is ?""",DISAGREE,"""ID did not initiate a war for hearts and minds .""","""So the creationists behind it are lying when they say that 's exactly what it is ?""",,
15610,4135,"""And what is your deal with lunatic fringe leftie ? Antigun laws are clearly not a fringe view , or gun control laws would not have been passed in Congress . You can hardly call the views lunatic . I doubt any doctor would agree that a person with liberal views regarding gun control is mentally insane .""","""Why then wo n't you state your ultimate agenda ... `` reasonable gun control `` is not an agenda if you can not back that statment up . A view that inteferes wih my constitutional right is an attempt by the lunatic fringe to intefere with my life ... Simple .""",DISAGREE,"""And what is your deal with lunatic fringe leftie ?""","""reasonable gun control `` is not an agenda if you can not back that statment up""",,
15612,4135,"""And what is your deal with lunatic fringe leftie ? Antigun laws are clearly not a fringe view , or gun control laws would not have been passed in Congress . You can hardly call the views lunatic . I doubt any doctor would agree that a person with liberal views regarding gun control is mentally insane .""","""Why then wo n't you state your ultimate agenda ... `` reasonable gun control `` is not an agenda if you can not back that statment up . A view that inteferes wih my constitutional right is an attempt by the lunatic fringe to intefere with my life ... Simple .""",DISAGREE,"""And what is your deal with lunatic fringe leftie ? Antigun laws are clearly not a fringe view , or gun control laws would not have been passed in Congress""","""Why then wo n't you state your ultimate agenda ... `` reasonable gun control `` is not an agenda if you can not back that statment up . A view that inteferes wih my constitutional right is an attempt by the lunatic fringe to intefere with my life ... Simple .""",,
15620,4137,"""You said in one post you are a ex-christian . If you new anything of Christianity you would know this is not possible . It is possible you had the title of Christian without the relationship which gives you this title . Christianity subscribes to the power of God to save you , not of any power of your own . If one could be come unsaved , he becomes more powerful than God ( Impossible within Christianity ) .""","""Well then . All of the ex-christians have it both ways do n't they . Since they are saved they can lie , cheat , steal and have wild , illicit sex ( following the example of several christian preachers ) .""",DISAGREE,"""You said in one post you are a ex-christian . If you new anything of Christianity you would know this is not possible .""","""All of the ex-christians have it both ways do n't they . Since they are saved they can lie , cheat , steal and have wild , illicit sex""",,
15627,4145,"""I apologize if you interpreted what I said in that way . I am not attempting to downplay anything . I am only trying to understand why some people are less concerned with things that pose a greater risk .""","""Because violent crime and violent criminals is something that I ca n't control . Heart disease , that can be worked on with good diet , exercise and medicine if necessary . It 's manageable , controllable and can be avoided . You ca n't do that with a violent criminal .""",DISAGREE,"""I apologize if you interpreted what I said in that way""","""Heart disease , that can be worked on with good diet , exercise and medicine if necessary .""",,
15676,4156,"""Can you imagine what the U.S. population would be without abortion ? Who will take care of all these children when the potential parent can not ? Abortion Statistics - U.S . Approximately 1,370,000 abortions occur annually in the U.S. according to the Alan Guttmacher Institute . In 2001 , 1.31 million abortions took place . 88 % of abortions occur during the first 6 to 12 weeks of pregnancy . 60 % of abortions are performed on women who already have one or more children . 47 % of abortions are performed on women who have already had one or more abortions . 43 % of women will have had at least one abortion by the time they are 45 years old . * * information obtained from http : //womensissues.about.com""","""Chastity rather than promiscuity .""",DISAGREE,"""Can you imagine what the U.S. population would be without abortion ? Who will take care of all these children when the potential parent can not ?""","""Chastity rather than promiscuity .""",,
15679,4156,"""Can you imagine what the U.S. population would be without abortion ? Who will take care of all these children when the potential parent can not ? Abortion Statistics - U.S . Approximately 1,370,000 abortions occur annually in the U.S. according to the Alan Guttmacher Institute . In 2001 , 1.31 million abortions took place . 88 % of abortions occur during the first 6 to 12 weeks of pregnancy . 60 % of abortions are performed on women who already have one or more children . 47 % of abortions are performed on women who have already had one or more abortions . 43 % of women will have had at least one abortion by the time they are 45 years old . * * information obtained from http : //womensissues.about.com""","""Chastity rather than promiscuity .""",DISAGREE,"""Can you imagine what the U.S. population would be without abortion ?""","""Chastity rather than promiscuity""",,
15707,4176,"""There 's a huge hole in evolutionary theory and I ’ m about to exploit it . I ’ ve mentioned this before , but truly , mountains of books could be written on this subject . The subject , of course , is the illusion of evolution . My contention is that much of what is perceived as  “ evolution ” is not actually not evolution at all . Part of the problem 20th century scientists had was their definition of  “ evolution. ” Intellectual wars have been fought for the past 150 years about where new traits come from and how they get passed on . Regardless , each side has tried to explain how the information from the environment gets transmitted to offspring . On one side you have Darwinists , who claim that evolution is a two-step process . First there ’ s random genetic mutation , and that ’ s followed up by non-random natural selectionÂ….the two combine to have the effect of transmitting environmental  “ fitness ” to their offspring . Lamarckian inheritance , on the other hand , is a one-step process where the organism simply perceives the environment , adapts phenotypically and passes on these adaptations to their progeny . But there ’ s a hole . A gaping hole that nobody has seemed to exploit . And this hole bypasses both theories . What ’ s the hole ? The hole is that inheritance of new traits is not necessary for  “ evolution. ” In other words , populational evolution does not require traits to be `` passed on. `` This mantra is a giant straw man , as you will soon see , because much -- if not all -- of what we see in the field is merely a matter of environmental evolution . The reality is that a change in phenotype is observed as evolution in the field and in the fossil record . But there is no way to tell from the fossils -- or from non-controlled scientific experiments -- whether new traits are caused by variation arising in the genotype or only from environmental effects acting on the phenotype . Not only that , but there ’ s also no way to tell without close inspection if these traits are inherited or acquired . It ’ s well known that animal embryo development brings about a collaboration between the genetic program , internal signals from the mother , and external signals from the environment . Somehow the embryo processes this information and emerges accordingly . Therefore , the same genome can emerge with different phenotypes depending on environment or external circumstance . This is known as differentiation , and is simply the convergence of an organism ’ s genes and environment during development . Moths and butterflies are perfect example of this phenomenon . As well , tadpoles can not only change the size and shape of their heads , it 's also known that the presence of predators can influence their tail size , shape , color , hatch times and general size of the organism . ( Could this be why Neanderthals had their brow ridges ? Since they had a slightly protruding face ( as many in Europe still do ) , the exertion that no-doubt came from eating a diet heavy in meat ( vigorous chewing ) could very well have put pressure on the facial plates and brow ridges -- and as youngsters with soft bones , this diet help dictate their morphology . ) But it ’ s not just tadpoles ........ As well , rodents , will dine on a variety of seeds and nutsÂ…as youngsters , if a population of mice come across a new food supply , they are all likely to all develop a morphology that suits such a diet . If this food is different than what their parents ’ ate , their morphology could be uniquely different than their parents . This new morphology would follow them until adulthood . If the food supply stuck around long enough time , it could give the appearance that the population was  “ evolving. ” But genetics would have nothing to do with it – instead , it would simply be a cultural , environmental phenomenon . It ’ s an environmental evolution , of sorts . Of course this leaves natural selection out of a job because the entire population would be evolving new , beneficial morphologies without it . Not only that but it bypasses the ridiculous premise that science has constructed for itself -- - which says that new , beneficial traits have to be  “ passed on. ” This is a bogus premise from the very start because it ’ s not necessary for traits to be  “ passed on ” for new morphologies to carry forward into future generations -- all that 's needed is , in this case , for a specific diet to continue to be available to future generations -- which , of course , would carry on those particular traits . '' We think licking affects a methylation enzyme that is ready and waiting for mother to start licking , `` Dr. Meaney said . In perilous times , mothers may be able to set the stress reactivity of their offspring by licking less . When there are fewer dangers around , the mothers may lick more . [ /color ] Really the sky ’ s the limit ; diet , terrain , movement , predators , weather , availability of resources , etc . Life is not about genes , Life is about life . The designer didn ’ t create animals adapted to specific environments , He created them with an adaptive ability to evolve with a changing environment . This is not  “ evolution ” it ’ s an adaptive response . Of course , some say new beak shapes could have formed during development , but either way , selection is not required .... it would be similar situation to the butterfly example I gave above . This of course , is just another example where it is not necessary for traits to be  “ passed on. ” Traits need not be passed on to give the illusion of populational evolution . And what ’ s interesting is Gould ’ s explanation for why Lamarckism is false ... this is very interesting and ties in directly to this : Of course , Gould has set up a giant straw man that has been repeated relentlessly . The straw man is that it 's not necessary pass on traits , for the reasons stated above .... and it is not necessary that  “ environments or acquired adaptations can direct sex cells to mutate in specific directions. ” Life gets around that little scenario because each life is individually adaptive ... and adaptations start during development -- where his eyes could n't see -- or did n't want to . Life changes so rapidly -- if you blink you miss it ! Stephen , I know you ’ re dead , but if you can somehow hear me , please note you have made a great errorÂ… .. you have a giant hole in your theory , which I have just exploited . It ’ s called  “ The Environmental Evolution Revolution. ” Not only have I undercut your snails but I 've undercut most of what you and all your foolish friends say in your books . Evolution surely has a heritable component , but a huge portion of what is perceived as `` evolution `` in the field is not that at all . It 's merely an illusion ... and upon close inspection it disappears altogether .... just like your theory . You see , there is NO EVIDENCE for natural selection sifting through random mutations . What is seen in the field today is not evidence for that , it 's simply evidence that the environment is working on the genetic code of each creature .""","""This is a very interesting post . You show a lot of knowledge and insight . It is quite long and I do n't think I understood all of it . Could you mention what is the most important point ? You make a good point that `` evolution is merely an illusion. `` I am thinking about this and I want to ask you what you see as the ramifications from this . Looking forward to seeing more of your posts .""",DISAGREE,"""ve mentioned this before , but truly , mountains of books could be written on this subject .""","""You show a lot of knowledge and insight . It is quite long and I do n't think I understood all of it .""",,
15708,4177,"""When Christianity , or the Politicalzation of Religion has gone wrong , there is a standard , a moral standard , that declares this wrong . Consider , Nuremburg Trails , when the Nazis said , they were just answering to a higher authority and follow Party power , the judge declared , that they broke their own Laws , and they would answer to a HIGHER POWER - GOD . Case closed , we over road their relativism , or Nazis morality and condemned many to death .""","""Which is what they did to the Jews .""",AGREE,"""Case closed , we over road their relativism , or Nazis morality and condemned many to death .""","""Which is what they did to the Jews .""",,
15727,4194,"""`` Hanoi `` Jane is a disgrace to all Americans ......... She should have been tried for treason in 1971 ...... No true Vietnam Vet will ever accept her apology ...... I do n't condone that vet spitting on her but I do n't blame him ........ As far as the abortion issue goes there is no God that supports the murder of the innocent unborn in the womb ........""","""There is no god that supports the forcing of women to suffer and carry out unplanned pregnancies , just because some PL advocate spits it our . '' Sorry , were going to force you to give birth , those men over there have decided `` . Thats as ridiculous as saying `` There is no god to condones the slaughter of thousands of innocent life forms inside of the cut `` ( referring to disinfecting a cut ) . Pro-lifers have been dropped on their head too many times .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't condone that vet spitting on her but I do n't blame him""","""There is no god that supports the forcing of women to suffer and carry out unplanned pregnancies""",,
15729,4195,"""The 7 day creation I am referring to , not merely the possibility of divine creation through the Big bang etc""","""Ok . I 'm not a YEC . So , God creation through science is a viable option for my faith .""",DISAGREE,"""divine creation through the Big bang etc""","""God creation through science is a viable option for my faith .""",,
15741,4197,"""There is no reason to oppose sex , but people do .""","""I think you 've made a bit of a sweeping generalization here . I have n't heard of many people opposing sex altogether . I have heard of people who oppose both sex before marriage and sex outside of marriage .""",DISAGREE,"""There is no reason to oppose sex , but people do .""","""have n't heard of many people opposing sex altogether . I have heard of people who oppose both sex before marriage and sex outside of marriage .""",,
15748,4198,"""We need to overturn the Roe v. Wade decision and get back to cherishing life in this country . For a country that murders it 's children can not be far from self destruction .""","""It 's one thing that stands between us and a mindless theocracy . It protects the freedom of women from would-be ayatollahs who would make them sexual slaves .""",DISAGREE,"""For a country that murders it 's children can not be far from self destruction .""","""It 's one thing that stands between us and a mindless theocracy .""",,
15757,4199,"""I think gay 'rights ' lobbyists would do well to start realizing that marriage really matters a lot to the majority of people in this country ,""","""You know , I 'd believe that more if there were people like the Shindler family who have pushed for federal courts to intervene and destroy the sanctity of marriage . There is nothing you could do or say that would convince me that Americans somehow have any respect for marriage whatsoever . What heterosexuals have done to destroy this institution from the inside out only tells me that heteros are simply spoiled children who have the attitude of : `` If we ca n't make it work , we are n't going to allow anyone else to come in and do marriage better. ``""",DISAGREE,"""I think gay 'rights ' lobbyists would do well to start realizing that marriage really matters a lot to the majority of people in this country ,""","""You know , I 'd believe that more if there were people like the Shindler family who have pushed for federal courts to intervene and destroy the sanctity of marriage ``""",,
15766,4201,""" “ However the Bible does say `` I create you before I placed you in the womb `` ... this would imply that God created you before you are even conceived. ”""","""So ? God also says he made you out of dirt and then supernaturally lifting the dirt from the ground into the woman ’ s uterus . Oh well , I suppose it is all beliefs no matter how silly it sounds .""",DISAGREE,"""this would imply that God created you before you are even""","""Oh well , I suppose it is all beliefs no matter how silly it sounds .""",,
15777,4203,"""In the explanation I gave to him , and now pass on to you , it 's akin to saying An elephant is a fish that lives on cheese . No amount of evidence will convince me otherwise . All 'proofs ' that you can show me are illogical . ?""","""So you put words in Machs mouth . This would be acceptable if you were not doing it in a malicious fashion to get some sort of sadistic pleasure but you were instead actually trying to get him to explain himself . At any rate it totally disproves your nonsense about how you above me because you do not put words into peoples mouths because you do the same . You were not being dishonest to start with I admit it would be wrong to deliberately misrepesent you but neither of the circumstances apply here .""",DISAGREE,"""No amount of evidence will convince me otherwise . All 'proofs ' that you can show me are illogical . ?""","""At any rate it totally disproves your nonsense""",,
15792,4205,"""Theories change since they are just that - theories . Once time and sufficient investigation has given them sufficient weight , they become laws . Newton 's laws were derived to explain direct human experiences ( we deal with relatively large objects going at slow speeds relative to the speed of light ) and for that regime , they remain true . Since there were still a multitude of basic unanswered questions at the time in Science ( about light , the nature of matter , etc . ) , investigation continued and found , in the 20th century , the laws of relativity and quantum mechanics to explain occurrences outside of the range of the large and slow that we experience . At the beginning of science ( say ~17th century ) , there were a lot more questions than answers . Now , it ’ s the other way around - at least when it comes to the essential theoretical basis behind things that human 's experience .""","""Really ? A lot of people say that every answer makes more questions . In some ways we seem to know less now than we did at the time of Newton , in that we are less certain . And Newton 's laws deal with what happens in a vacuum with no resistance , not direct human experience At any rate , my point is that you ca n't see all the evidence as piling up support for 'science ' as 'science ' is moulded to fit that evidence . Not a criticism of science , btw .""",DISAGREE,"""Theories change since they are just that - theories . Once time and sufficient investigation has given them sufficient weight , they become laws .""","""Really ? A lot of people say that every answer makes more questions . In some ways we seem to know less now than we did at the time of Newton , in that we are less certain .""",,
15835,4220,"""I mean , we live in a Christian nation and we still kind of think , in our heart of hearts , that if a woman or girl is raped IT 'S HER FAULT .""","""You might want to get some help with that . The only people I have ever heard imply such things is feminists . That is really not right . It is time for you folks to understand that if a woman is raped , it is NOT her fault , it is the rapists fault . I do n't undestand how you folks can claim to be pro woman , then spread this draconian mindset .""",DISAGREE,"""I mean , we live in a Christian nation and we still kind of think , in our heart of hearts , that if a woman or girl is raped IT 'S HER FAULT .""","""You might want to get some help with that . The only people I have ever heard imply such things is feminists .""",,
15852,4223,"""Take Chicago , they have strict gun laws and have over 3 times the national rate of murders .""","""Stop trying to muddy the waters . I was talking about developed nations with lower murder rates . You suddenly bring Chicago into the debate- a city with open borders in a nation where guns are freely available . Even if gun control has n't worked there it does n't follow that gun laws ca n't work on a national level .""",DISAGREE,"""Take Chicago , they have strict gun laws""","""You suddenly bring Chicago into the debate- a city with open borders in a nation where guns are freely available""",,
15854,4224,"""You can put whatever spin on this that you want . But no matter how much you try , the number of rounds discharged is always the same . Trying to limit it to multiple magazines instead of just one serves no practical purpose .""","""So you agree that it 's not necessary to have high capacity magazines because gun owners can reload quickly when defending themselves against a criminals . Good we can agree on at least one thing .""",AGREE,"""But no matter how much you try , the number of rounds discharged is always the same . Trying to limit it to multiple magazines instead of just one serves no practical purpose .""","""So you agree that it 's not necessary to have high capacity magazines because gun owners can reload quickly when defending themselves against a criminals""",,
15860,4225,"""I do n't know about capuchins , and I am not going to a website .""","""Let me see if I have this right , Priscilla . You admit your ignorance of the topic and you refuse to read the linked article in order to learn the topic of the thread , and yet you are willing to offer an opinion . As Mr. Jack said , interesting .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't know about capuchins I am not going to a website .""","""You admit your ignorance of the topic and you refuse to read the linked article in order to learn interesting""",,
15870,4226,"""God fearing""","""What does that have to do with anything ?""",DISAGREE,"""God fearing""","""What does that have to do""",,
15875,4227,"""You missed `` should not be required ``""","""as in anyone can purchase a fire arm without a background check or gun safety training ? not a good option . my apology if that was a failed sarcasm . -a|ex""",DISAGREE,"""You missed `` should not be required ``""","""as in anyone can purchase a fire arm without a background check or gun safety training ? not a good option""",,
15892,4233,"""None of these players are in God 's favorite line-up of people : Nebuchadnezzar , Tyre , Egypt . He has determined judgments on all players in this game . Tyre is first to receive the penalty of her errors and God sends Nebuchadnezzar to lay a siege against her . In judging Tyre , God also judges Nebuchadnezzar . Not all of the prophecies against Tyre are fulfilled because God changes his mind about his immediate judgment of the city . He is not under duress to give us his reason why , though you can be sure of this : he completely fulfills his words against the wicked city at a later time . Like a puppet under his control , he turns the heart of Nebuchadnezzar toward Egypt and placates him through the words of the prophet by saying that he will pay the king back for his hard work which ended in frustration . Never in the text does Ezekiel `` admit he was wrong `` as you believe or in any way accuse God . The prophet utters a lengthy judgment against Egypt and the king turns his wrath toward that southern country . He labors hard to conquer it but he does not succeed . God has again changed his mind for the immediate time for reasons we do not understand . God will fully bring his predictions against Egypt to pass at a later time . In the end , three entities are brought low , wasted , assets evaporated , judged : Nebuchadnezzar , Tyre , and Egypt . God has had his way with them . Ezekiel never `` admits he was wrong `` and he never accuses God .""","""So once again you ’ re steering away from the debate ? I do n't understand why your ignoring the debate and going off in a whole new direction even after making this same mistake in your last post . You 're still showing that the Bible has a flaw in it and therefore your making up your own story about what happened . You 're also making predictions about the future based on your own interpretation . I 'm sure you wo n't even considered that your wrong about either of these things though I doubt you have any reason to believe in either of them other than you have the idea stuck in your head now . [ quote ] The above fully answers the apparent contradiction you and others find in these passages . The reason you may think I may be presenting information contrary to normative Christian teaching is that you have picked a peculiarly thorny passage - something that skeptics of the Bible and enemies of God will almost always do . [ \QUOTE ] It only answers the contradiction after you fill in the blanks with your own interpretation and of course your interpretation is based on your personal views and no facts . All the facts that you can work with are in the Bible and as of this moment the Bible seems to have a flaw in it . Your trying to cover this flaw with a story that you made up . I guess in your mind this makes sense but I do n't think many Christians would even agree with you much less those of us who look for logic .""",DISAGREE,"""God sends Nebuchadnezzar to lay a siege against her . In judging Tyre , God also judges""","""Your trying to cover this flaw with a story that you made up . I guess in your mind this makes sense""",,
15912,4239,"""I 'm just trying to correct . sorry if i had offended u .""","""And I was correcting you . If you are offended then that 's the breaks .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm just trying to correct . sorry if i had offended u .""","""And I was correcting you . If you are offended then that 's the breaks .""",,
15919,4240,"""so thats quite contradictory to me ... you would allow a law that killls millions of innocent babies a year and get rid of a law that rightly carries out the law ... wierd sounds like a liberal to me .""","""You mean to tell me that you would deny a woman 's right to her own body for a zygote , yet you have no problem murdering real human beings ? Sounds like a conservative to me ...""",DISAGREE,"""sounds like a liberal to me .""","""You have no problem murdering real human beings ? Sounds like a conservative to me""",,
15920,4240,"""so thats quite contradictory to me ... you would allow a law that killls millions of innocent babies a year and get rid of a law that rightly carries out the law ... wierd sounds like a liberal to me .""","""You mean to tell me that you would deny a woman 's right to her own body for a zygote , yet you have no problem murdering real human beings ? Sounds like a conservative to me ...""",DISAGREE,"""so thats quite contradictory to me ...""","""You mean to tell me that you would deny a woman 's right""",,
15926,4241,"""What a traitor !""","""Traitor ? More like the boy wised up on the matter . So , Brady , how 's it feel to have all your work and hopes destroyed in the blink of an eye ? How does it feel to know that your last best hope for a disarmed society has abandoned you by the side of the road , and you 're now out of options and the only thing left to do is eat the crow ?""",DISAGREE,"""What a traitor !""","""Traitor ?""",,
15937,4244,"""On top of that , what we accomplish with our bigger brain is , as I 've already demonstrated in other threads with reference to feral children , greatly dependent upon the accumulated wisdom imprinted upon the brain during infancy . We teach our children to problem-solve . We teach them language and abstract thought - we train the various parts of the brain to do their job properly . We are n't born 'complete ' . Even as adults , not everyone is equally quick-witted , not everyone has an equal facility for logical thought - and this has a lot to do with how their brain has been trained during its development .""","""And yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at birth . Would n't you think that with that capacity to survive without guidance that they would also have the capacity to learn new things from one generation to another as humans do , resulting in true intellectual evolution over the past 100 million years or so ?""",DISAGREE,"""what we accomplish with our bigger brain is reference to feral children , greatly dependent upon the accumulated wisdom imprinted upon the brain during infancy . We teach our children to problem-solve We teach them language and abstract thought""","""And yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at birth . Would n't you think that with that capacity to survive without guidance""",,
15939,4244,"""On top of that , what we accomplish with our bigger brain is , as I 've already demonstrated in other threads with reference to feral children , greatly dependent upon the accumulated wisdom imprinted upon the brain during infancy . We teach our children to problem-solve . We teach them language and abstract thought - we train the various parts of the brain to do their job properly . We are n't born 'complete ' . Even as adults , not everyone is equally quick-witted , not everyone has an equal facility for logical thought - and this has a lot to do with how their brain has been trained during its development .""","""And yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at birth . Would n't you think that with that capacity to survive without guidance that they would also have the capacity to learn new things from one generation to another as humans do , resulting in true intellectual evolution over the past 100 million years or so ?""",DISAGREE,"""On top of that , what we accomplish with our bigger brain is , as I 've already demonstrated in other threads with reference to feral children , greatly dependent upon the accumulated wisdom imprinted upon the brain during infancy . We teach our children to problem-solve .""","""And yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at""",,
15941,4244,"""On top of that , what we accomplish with our bigger brain is , as I 've already demonstrated in other threads with reference to feral children , greatly dependent upon the accumulated wisdom imprinted upon the brain during infancy . We teach our children to problem-solve . We teach them language and abstract thought - we train the various parts of the brain to do their job properly . We are n't born 'complete ' . Even as adults , not everyone is equally quick-witted , not everyone has an equal facility for logical thought - and this has a lot to do with how their brain has been trained during its development .""","""And yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at birth . Would n't you think that with that capacity to survive without guidance that they would also have the capacity to learn new things from one generation to another as humans do , resulting in true intellectual evolution over the past 100 million years or so ?""",DISAGREE,"""this has a lot to do with how their brain has been trained during its development .""","""yet , many animals survive by instinct only , having been abandoned by their mother at birth""",,
15956,4247,"""After reading some of the posts on the gun control forum , I think that the USA population is a lot more dense .""","""Well , I guess you 're entitled to your opinions . On the gun-control board , I imagine you might encounter a lot of rednecks- not the best specimen of our poplulation .""",DISAGREE,"""After reading some of the posts on the gun control forum , I think that the USA population is a lot more dense""","""On the gun-control board , I imagine you might encounter a lot of rednecks- not the best specimen of our poplulation .""",,
15972,4251,"""Even though our planet is getting warmer , it is still a lot cooler than it was 4000 years ago .""","""The average global temperature follows a sinusoidal pattern , the general consensus is we are supposed to be approaching a peak . Projections show that instead of peaking , there will be continue to be an increase in average global temperature which exceeds that of the peak 4000 years previous .""",AGREE,"""it is still a lot cooler than it was 4000 years ago .""","""Projections show that instead of peaking , there will be continue to be an increase in average global temperature which exceeds that of the peak 4000 years previous .""",,
15978,4252,"""I guess the Creationists ' and Intelligent Design Creationists ' God isn ’ t as good of a designer as one would expect for an all-knowing , all-powerful , loving God . We humans – the pinnacle of His creation – have hearts that just do n't seem to come out right a lot of the time . You ’ d think the Almighty God could do better than that . And this is looking at just heart development , never mind the numerous malformations associated with failure of the neuropore to close , ambiguous sexual phenotype ( you 'd think God would much opposed to this ! ) , and the many other types of problems newborns display , not to mention the millions of spontaneous abortions that occur every year : His designs do n't even make it full term . What an incompetent designer God is .""","""So , you think there is a God ? Bad design does not equate to no design . It really is a poor argument . Much of the force of Darwin 's arguments deal with bad design . I invite anyone to post any of Darwin 's arguments that specifically outline his case against design because of `` bad `` design . That said , consider this , your car is said to operate at 25 % fuel efficiency . One could claim then the car is 75 % bad design , therefore it is not designed , and if it is , certainly not by anyone of any intelligence . Your audio CD 's have Reed-Solomon error correction because the read/write process is full of errors that need correcting . Cleary this is `` bad design `` that engineers would create read/write heads that make so many errors in the first place . Same with modems and host of other devices . Clearly if in the remote chance these bad designs are evidence of design , the designers must be clueless ! Poorly designed dramas have villains and heroes . Clearly a drama ( even a divine drama ) is poorly designed if it has villains in the story . All the characters should be Pollyanna and there should be no great tragedies on the road to a happy ending . Life and the Divine drama , like CD 's and cars , are clearly not designed , or at least not designed by anyone with intelligence , because of all the bad design woven into the designs . The reason audio CD 's have so many read/write errors which are corrected Reed-Solomon error correction ( somewhat like us reading someone 's writing and mentally correcting spelling and grammar errors ) is that it is the most optimal way to get as much data on a CD as possible . The tightest packing of data implies the highest amount of errors based on the Shannon capacity theorem . The Mp3 's and JPEGS are even more `` error `` prone in that they are inexact representations of the original sound or picture , but the goal was not fidelity but compactness . A similar consideration is for the 75 % inefficiency for cars . The goal is for higher acceleration and agility and cost , etc. , not fuel efficiency . The point is `` bad `` design , in the grand scheme of things , might not be bad design after all . The high rate of sickness and death , the eventual death of the universe as predicted by the 2nd law of thermodynamics are not evidences that the Designer is unwise , any more than the many errors in the read/write process of audio CD suggests the engineers of those devices are incompetent . Origin of Species Chapter 13 : There is another and equally curious branch of the present subject ; namely , the comparison not of the same part in different members of a class , but of the different parts or organs in the same individual . Most physiologists believe that the bones of the skull are homologous with that is correspond in number and in relative connexion with the elemental parts of a certain number of vertebrae . The anterior and posterior limbs in each member of the vertebrate and articulate classes are plainly homologous . We see the same law in comparing the wonderfully complex jaws and legs in crustaceans . It is familiar to almost every one , that in a flower the relative position of the sepals , petals , stamens , and pistils , as well as their intimate structure , are intelligible in the view that they consist of metamorphosed leaves , arranged in a spire . In monstrous plants , we often get direct evidence of the possibility of one organ being transformed into another ; and we can actually see in embryonic crustaceans and in many other animals , and in flowers , that organs which when mature become extremely different , are at an early stage of growth exactly alike . How inexplicable are these facts on the ordinary view of creation ! Why should the brain be enclosed in a box composed of such numerous and such extraordinarily shaped pieces of bone ? As Owen has remarked , the benefit derived from the yielding of the separate pieces in the act of parturition of mammals , will by no means explain the same construction in the skulls of birds . Why should similar bones have been created in the formation of the wing and leg of a bat , used as they are for such totally different purposes ? Why should one crustacean , which has an extremely complex mouth formed of many parts , consequently always have fewer legs ; or conversely , those with many legs have simpler mouths ? Why should the sepals , petals , stamens , and pistils in any individual flower , though fitted for such widely different purposes , be all constructed on the same pattern ? On the theory of natural selection , we can satisfactorily answer these questions . Homology was a pre-darwinian idea with the term coined by Owen who rather despised Darwin and his ideas . Darwin tries to argue why a Designer would not use the same for the same function . He says homology is evidence of an unwise design . The premise is a Creator would n't be so inefficient . But , unless one has a handle on the teleological goal , one is free to fabricate all manner of `` bad design `` arguments ( for example read/write errors in audio CD 's or fuel inefficient cars ) . The Biotic Message Theory suggest the teleological goal for biotic reality is to communicate to humans that there is one Designer and author of life , and that life could not have evolved . Like a great novel , the `` imperfections `` of biology are part of a larger plot . It is turning out , Darwin 's argument from homology is a concept in crisis .""",DISAGREE,"""And this is looking at just heart development , never mind the numerous malformations""","""The tightest packing of data implies the highest amount of errors based on the Shannon capacity theorem .""",,
15979,4253,"""What I find hard to believe is that politicos will place their decision above the health of a woman ; only for political expediency""","""What I find hard to believe is that politicians will place their decision above the right to life of a human person only for political expediency .""",DISAGREE,"""politicos will place their decision above the health of a woman ;""","""politicians will place their decision above the right to life of a human person""",,
15983,4254,"""which did God create first , the laws or energy and matter ?""","""Actually energy can be caused by matter . Newton 's Theory of Gravitation shows that gravity is an effect of the presence of mass . The presence of a second mass within the gravitation field of the first mass gives the matter gravitational potential energy , which , without an opposite force to balance it , is converted into kinetic energy .""",DISAGREE,"""which did God create first , the laws or energy and matter ?""","""Actually energy can be caused by matter .""",,
15985,4254,"""which did God create first , the laws or energy and matter ?""","""Actually energy can be caused by matter . Newton 's Theory of Gravitation shows that gravity is an effect of the presence of mass . The presence of a second mass within the gravitation field of the first mass gives the matter gravitational potential energy , which , without an opposite force to balance it , is converted into kinetic energy .""",DISAGREE,"""which did God create first , the laws or energy and matter ?""","""energy can be caused by matter""",,
15997,4257,"""However from the moment of conception organisms have some limited ability to reorganize their development if circumstances warrent , and that ability to change decreases with age .""","""But if there are too many dogs wandering around they do not change to be cats , or rabbits , or humans do they . They do not change so as to have eight legs and spider eyes do they . But yes development of the phenotype is a result of the genetic heritage interacting with the environment , but its not an intelligent process . If you starve a young organism to near the point of death and then rescue it with food it will not develop as if it had food when it needed it . It will not express its full genetic potential . The environment OFTEN changes the outcome of development by imposing limits on reaching the biotic potential provided in the genome .""",DISAGREE,"""from the moment of conception organisms have some limited ability to reorganize their development if circumstances warrent""","""The environment OFTEN changes the outcome of development by imposing limits on reaching the biotic potential provided in the genome .""",,
15995,4257,"""However from the moment of conception organisms have some limited ability to reorganize their development if circumstances warrent , and that ability to change decreases with age .""","""But if there are too many dogs wandering around they do not change to be cats , or rabbits , or humans do they . They do not change so as to have eight legs and spider eyes do they . But yes development of the phenotype is a result of the genetic heritage interacting with the environment , but its not an intelligent process . If you starve a young organism to near the point of death and then rescue it with food it will not develop as if it had food when it needed it . It will not express its full genetic potential . The environment OFTEN changes the outcome of development by imposing limits on reaching the biotic potential provided in the genome .""",DISAGREE,"""However from the moment of conception organisms have some limited ability to reorganize their development if circumstances warrent , and that ability to change decreases with age .""","""But yes development of the phenotype is a result of the genetic heritage interacting with the environment , but its not an intelligent process .""",,
16005,4259,"""This is fairly simple . You have two different worldviews here . In your view the moral code revolves around you being the standard and everyone should live up to that . In mine , the moral code is set outside of my control and I strive to abide by that . This is very evident in your post when you use the phrases `` I have `` and `` I would not `` . With me , it is n't because I , for some unknown reason , feel a certain way but because and outside moral code says I should live my life a certain way . You could just frame it as you believe you are `` god `` while I believe in a God . This is a little harder for people to swallow and I do n't mean for it to sound like an insult but it is an easy way to put it Both of these worldviews are fairly common and it relates to the abortion debate because one worldview almost has to lead to pro-life while the other could go either way .""","""You are distorting my view . I certainly do not think that I am `` god `` or that everyone has to revolve around my standard . However , I do think that morality has to have a rational basis behind it . This is my particular rational basis . My moral code certainly is n't my own invention but is based on the moral codes which I have often heard expressed by others , as well as the moral code of the German philosopher Kant ( often referenced in secular moral discussions ) . Most people from childhood are taught morals at least partly from the same points of view I use . After all , how often have you heard the phrase `` How would YOU like it if that happenned to you ? `` or something similar . That is essentially the same as my basis of morality . It seems to be very common . Even many religions use a similar basic appoach - `` Do unto others ... `` . Of course , we all differ enough in our psychology that we might have some differences in how we would expect to be treated by others . So , this approach that I present would not lead to the same result in all people . Also , this approach depends on the capabilities of the person to see the big picture and to be able to fully see things from the other person 's point of view . Since we are imperfect in these skills , it certainly helps to have moral discussions , moral mentors , etc . who can enlighten us in various situations . It is not a perfect method but at least it is not arbitrary since it is based on reason . Note that the famous German philosopher Kant gave a similar secular moral code in his Categorical Imperative : `` Act only according to that maxim whereby you can at the same time will that it should become a universal law `` . Your view does n't seem to be based on reason but on a blind trust in a religious authority that tells you that a particular set of rules is right and must not be questioned . For those of us who do not hold the same beliefs as you , those rules often seem quite arbitrary . Sometimes some of the reasons behind those rules are illucidated , often not . Sometimes the rules are the same as those derived by secular reasoning , sometimes not . Personally , I would prefer an imperfect moral code that at least is based on reason and is refineable to one that is immovable and based on arbitrary standards . On a last note , there certainly could be moral codes that are based neither on religion nor on some version of the moral code which I have presented . If so , I would be quite interested in hearing them .""",DISAGREE,"""You have two different worldviews here""","""I certainly do not think that I am `` god `` or that everyone has to revolve around my standard""",,
16015,4262,"""What do you mean there is no `` there is no evidence for a god `` ?""","""By `` there is no evidence for a god , `` I mean that there is no evidence for a god . If you think otherwise , then start a new thread in the Religion forum and present some . But of course , when you claim evidence , you are denying faith . If you have empirical evidence of the existance of your god , then your god is not supernatural .""",AGREE,"""there is no evidence for a god ``""","""If you think otherwise , then start a new thread in the Religion If you have empirical evidence of the existance of your god ,""",,
16018,4262,"""What do you mean there is no `` there is no evidence for a god `` ?""","""By `` there is no evidence for a god , `` I mean that there is no evidence for a god . If you think otherwise , then start a new thread in the Religion forum and present some . But of course , when you claim evidence , you are denying faith . If you have empirical evidence of the existance of your god , then your god is not supernatural .""",AGREE,"""What do you mean there is no `` there is no evidence for a god `` ?""","""If you have empirical evidence of the existance of your god , then your god is not supernatural .""",,
16029,4265,"""Evolution theory is not science at all , it is faith . Period . How can I conclude that ? Because an examination of the evidence shows that a bias/ ideology/ Godless belief system is the only real evidence for evolution theory :""","""Well , now , here 's the thing : A hypothesis of special creation of all things ( such as is described in the bible ) is inconsistent with the evidence we can elicit from living things today . For instance , there 's the amount of non-functional DNA we share with other creatures , in particular the other apes . With shared functional DNA , now , one could make a case for economy of design , but deliberately putting the same broken genes and garbage DNA into two entirely seperate species ? Then there 's the fact that some creatures have far better 'designed ' bits than others for no readily apparent reason . A good example is the octopus eye , whose retina is supplied with blood from the rear rather than the front , both anchoring the retina more securely ( no detached retina problems ) and avoiding the 'blind spot ' mammalian eyes possess . There 's no reason at all for a designer capable of making an octupus to use the inferior mammalian design . Then there 's the issue of vestigial features . Vestigial does n't necessarily mean 'useless ' , more properly it describes something that is 'overengineered ' for the purpose it currently serves , and often looks very much like a crippled version of a feature possessed by some other species . Ostrich wings , for example , may be useful for balancing when running , or in mating rituals , but they do n't need to be wings in order to serve those purposes . Their complex and delicate internal structure is clearly 'designed ' to allow flight , but their stunted development and the practical impossibility of such a big bird achieving self-powered flight make them a vestigial structure . Again , what rationale can be made for this being the work of a designer ? Then there 's the fossil record . Try as one might to twist the evidence to fit a biblical flood , it just wo n't go . Paleontologists have found spider tracks sandwiched in sandstone layers . Imagine , if you can , the delicate impressions of a spider 's footsteps surviving a deluge sufficient to suspend and deposit yards and yards of sand atop them . Hydrodynamic sorting of fossils , or burial order , does n't fit either , since it requires that we pretend all dinosaurs were large and slow moving ( they were n't ) and that all mammals are small , agile and fast-moving ( they are n't ) . On and on it goes . If we take evolution off the table completely and look at the evidence before us , we have no explanation that fits . Special creation simply does n't add up . With all creation myths falsified , what are we supposed to do ? Just pretend the history of life on earth does n't matter , or should be ignored ? Evolution is n't what you come up with when you apply atheist thinking . Evolution is what you come up with when you discount all the extant hypotheses that do n't fit the facts , be they religiously inspired or otherwise . Now , you may hold your hand up and complain that we 're not admitting the possibility of some kind of divine guiding hand steering or helping evolution . And that 's fair enough ; we generally do n't , for two different reasons : First , it does n't really add anything to the theory ; it does n't increase its power to explain what we see . So while you can of course choose to believe that 's what 's happening , it does n't have any scientific value . Secondly , there 's arguably some merit in the attitude that religion has had its chance and blown it . For thousands of years religions have claimed to bear upon their backs the infallible word of god . Now , if the bible had been saying all along - centuries before the technology existed to verify it - that god coaxed organisms into evolving from simpler organisms over millions of years , that would be compelling evidence that the bible was accurate and divinely inspired , since it would contain accurate predictions ( which no man could have made ) about what we should find when we look into our DNA or beneath the ground . But it does n't make those predictions . So why should we now pay attention when Intelligent Design evangelists do a 6000-year-too-late handbrake turn and invent a new faith-based explanation for the evidence ? After all , they have no divine mandate to do so - it 's the bible that 's supposedly the word of god ; they 're just making stuff up as they go along .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution theory is not science at all , it is faith Because an examination of the evidence shows that a bias/""","""here 's the thing : A hypothesis of special creation of all things is inconsistent with the evidence""",,
16036,4266,"""Why do you find it necessary to fit observations to Genesis ? or why it makes perfect sense to design creatures that resemble humans but have them evolve from things that look like apes ? and so on ? Are you saying that mankind is the original goal of evolution ?""","""Evolution has no goals , it is merely a beautiful process , like math . Do n't deify it . And who cares what we look like ?""",DISAGREE,"""Why do you find it necessary to fit observations to Genesis ? or why it makes perfect sense to design creatures that resemble humans but have them evolve from things that look like apes ? Are you saying that mankind is the original goal of evolution ?""","""Evolution has no goals , it is merely a beautiful process , like math . Do n't deify it . And who cares what we look like ?""",,
16050,4268,"""Not really . eugenics are not following evolution . Hitler for example did n't follow evolution at all . His entire aryan race did n't have a single fact of evolution in it .""","""So you evolved and the aryan race was created by God ? I have never heard that before .""",DISAGREE,"""eugenics are not following evolution .""","""So you evolved and the aryan race was created by God ?""",,
16060,4270,"""However , I believe this is because most people going in to a scientific field are trying to figure out how life got here . Since they do not believe in God , they must cling to the belief with the most credibility .""","""No scientists believe in gods ? How about the 35 % of the general population that are theists , but still accept evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""I believe this is because most people going in to a scientific field are trying to figure out how life got here . Since they do not believe in God , they must cling to the belief with the most credibility .""","""No scientists believe in gods ? How about the 35 % of the general population that are theists , but still accept evolution ?""",,
16062,4270,"""However , I believe this is because most people going in to a scientific field are trying to figure out how life got here . Since they do not believe in God , they must cling to the belief with the most credibility .""","""No scientists believe in gods ? How about the 35 % of the general population that are theists , but still accept evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""Since they do not believe in God , they must cling to the belief with the most credibility .""","""No scientists believe in gods ? How about the 35 % of the general population that are theists""",,
16074,4279,"""then what kind of logic makes you believe that it takes thousands/millions of years for populations of animals to `` adapt ? ``""","""None . It doesn ’ t take thousands/millions of years to adapt , as you ’ ve been told and shown evidence of dozens of times .""",DISAGREE,"""then what kind of logic makes you believe that it takes thousands/millions of years for populations of animals to `` adapt ? ``""","""None . It doesn ’ t take thousands/millions of years to adapt , as you ’ ve been told and shown evidence of dozens of times .""",,
16078,4280,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ? I suggest in the context of this discussion you take a world perspective -- abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ? Chinese unborn 'potential humans ' for example are equal as American unborn 'potential humans ' are they not ?""",DISAGREE,"""take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was""","""I suggest in the context of this discussion you take a world perspective -- abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ?""",,
16079,4280,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ? I suggest in the context of this discussion you take a world perspective -- abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ? Chinese unborn 'potential humans ' for example are equal as American unborn 'potential humans ' are they not ?""",DISAGREE,"""it was once illegal here""","""is legal now what 's your point ?""",,
16080,4280,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ? I suggest in the context of this discussion you take a world perspective -- abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ? Chinese unborn 'potential humans ' for example are equal as American unborn 'potential humans ' are they not ?""",DISAGREE,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ? abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ?""",,
16082,4280,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ? I suggest in the context of this discussion you take a world perspective -- abortion happens all over the world surely your objective is to see abortion eradicated globally ? Chinese unborn 'potential humans ' for example are equal as American unborn 'potential humans ' are they not ?""",DISAGREE,"""I take an American view because it was once illegal here and I know how it was before it was legal .""","""Well it 's been illegal in other places and is legal now what 's your point ?""",,
16139,4298,"""Take for example Judge Learned Hand 's indictment of ALCOA . What 'crimes ' was ALCOA punished for ? To quote Hand : `` It was not inevitable that it should always anticipate increases in the demand for ingot and be prepared to supply them . Nothing compelled it to keep doubling and redoubling its capacity before others entered the field . It insists that it never excluded competitors ; but we can think of no more effective exclusion than progressively to embrace each new opportunity as it opened , and to face every new- comer with new capacity already geared into a great organization , having the advantage of experience , trade connections and the elite of personnel. `` [ Alan Greenspan , `` Antitrust `` published in Ayn Rand 's Capitalism : The Unknown Ideal ] In other words ALCOA was being punished for being too good a company , too competent in its management , in other words Alcoa 's crime is that it is too competitive .""","""And would not being 'too competitive ' lead to a monopoly ? ( if not for govenment action )""",AGREE,"""In other words ALCOA was being punished for being too good a company , too competent in its management , in other words Alcoa 's crime is that it is too competitive .""","""And would not being 'too competitive ' lead to a monopoly ?""",,
16138,4298,"""Take for example Judge Learned Hand 's indictment of ALCOA . What 'crimes ' was ALCOA punished for ? To quote Hand : `` It was not inevitable that it should always anticipate increases in the demand for ingot and be prepared to supply them . Nothing compelled it to keep doubling and redoubling its capacity before others entered the field . It insists that it never excluded competitors ; but we can think of no more effective exclusion than progressively to embrace each new opportunity as it opened , and to face every new- comer with new capacity already geared into a great organization , having the advantage of experience , trade connections and the elite of personnel. `` [ Alan Greenspan , `` Antitrust `` published in Ayn Rand 's Capitalism : The Unknown Ideal ] In other words ALCOA was being punished for being too good a company , too competent in its management , in other words Alcoa 's crime is that it is too competitive .""","""And would not being 'too competitive ' lead to a monopoly ? ( if not for govenment action )""",AGREE,"""for example Judge Learned Hand 's indictment of ALCOA . What 'crimes ' was ALCOA punished for ? was not inevitable that it should always anticipate increases in the demand for ingot and be prepared to supply them .""","""And would not being 'too competitive ' lead to a monopoly ?""",,
16151,4302,"""How strange that this thread that aims at the heart of the basis of creationism and IDiotism has gone unanswered . Could it be that creationists and XXXXXX recognize the weakness of their position and have no answer ?""","""It 's just the same flip flopping over and over . Depending on the argument , `` science does n't exclude the divine `` , { then switcharoo } , `` science proves there is no divine. `` Just depends on the setting of the argument . ( you do have your copy of Victor Stenger 's book ; God - The failed Hypothesis / how science shows that God does not exist , do n't you ? Now you and five trolls will come pouring in here with needling and ad hominem attacks , to cover the weakness of your position . Your taunt of `` XXXXXX `` already got it started . I probably wo n't respond - it 's funny and depressing at the same time .""",DISAGREE,"""this thread that aims at the heart of the basis of creationism and IDiotism has gone unanswered .""","""Depending on the argument , `` science does n't exclude the divine `` , { then switcharoo } , `` science proves there is no divine. `` Just depends on the setting of the argument .""",,
16156,4304,"""Right now in this house I am sweating . This is how the my body reacts to the 90 degree teperature out side . If I were to spend more time in hotter climates I would adapt in such a way that 90 degrees does n't cause me to sweat . This is adaptaion not mutation .""","""No . That would be adaption . It would n't involve any genetic change . Another word for it might aclimatization . Your example shows little thought . The Polar bear 's webbed feet are genetic . Even if a Polar bear lived it 's whole live in a cage without ever going near water , it would still have webbed feet . That really is absolutely the most ignorant thing I have ever heard . The water stretches the skin through friction ! Do n't you just love `` creation science `` ? You get to make it up as you go .""",DISAGREE,"""If I were to spend more time in hotter climates I would adapt in such a way that 90 degrees does n't cause me to sweat . This is adaptaion not mutation .""","""Do n't you just love `` creation science `` ? You get to make it up as you go .""",,
16192,4312,"""Nobody that supports gun ownership would mention it having any relation to military service .""","""REALLY ? let me reword it for the simple people ... If you are old enough to decide to die in the military for YOUR COUNTRY - you are old enough and mature enough to reasonably care for fire arms properly . IF you can LEGALLY join the military ( as in not a traitor or a criminal ) you should ALSO be allowed to own any weapon you can personally purchase . QUESTION : Are you a MODERATE or really pro FREEDOM ? with an attitude like yours - you MUST be a friggin wishy washy moderate !""",DISAGREE,"""Nobody that supports gun ownership would mention it having any relation to military service""","""If you are old enough to decide to die in the military for YOUR COUNTRY - you are old enough and mature enough to reasonably care for fire arms properly .""",,
16221,4319,"""I have laid down some conditions before I give up my guns . They are not going to happen . There is no way I see within my life , that the 2nd Amendment will be repealled . There is no way that the National Guard will become `` militia-ized `` in my life time .""","""Here is the definition of militia : Function : noun Etymology : Latin , military service , from milit- , miles Date : circa 1660 1 a : a part of the organized armed forces of a country liable to call only in emergency b : a body of citizens organized for military service 2 : the whole body of able-bodied male citizens declared by law as being subject to call to military service Ok here is the 2nd amend : A well regulated militia , being necessary to the security of a free state , the right of the people to keep and bear arms , shall not be infringed . Now if you read the definition of militia as a citizen of America I could be called up to serve in one . But no where can the gun haters produce one document stating a requirement to be in a militia to bear arms . All gun haters want is to do is put limits on the right to bear arms . Once this limit is on the right to bear arms the gun haters will say now that we have a standing military we no longer need militias . So guess what just happened to the right to bear arms . This is why the founding fathers put no limits on our rights . This is why the founding fathers describe our rights as the right of the people ! This is why they are not collective rights like the gun haters want to claim . Gun haters like the word collective . Gun haters will use the communist tactics to harass and threaten people gun haters can not shut up !""",AGREE,"""will be repealled become `` militia-ized ``""","""part of the organized armed forces like the word collective""",,
16240,4323,"""It 's just the same flip flopping over and over . Depending on the argument , `` science does n't exclude the divine `` , { then switcharoo } , `` science proves there is no divine. `` Just depends on the setting of the argument . ( you do have your copy of Victor Stenger 's book ; God - The failed Hypothesis / how science shows that God does not exist , do n't you ?""","""I 'd love to see an explanation about how the study of the natural world disproves the existence of all Deities . Especially the Deistic Gods . And I 'd love to see how science is suppose to disprove a being that is not bound by logic , reason or any laws . What science can do is disprove that God was directly responsible for this or that , the sun rising , the rain season , etc . Did you perhaps realize that many scientists are Buddhists because Buddhism which has beings that behave as Gods with such powers and exist partially within the natural and supernatural ? Or are you again assuming all religions do n't exist except for Christanity ?""",DISAGREE,"""you do have your copy of Victor Stenger 's book ; God - The failed Hypothesis / how science shows that God does not exist , do n't you ?""","""? Or are you again assuming all religions do n't exist except for Christanity ?""",,
16243,4323,"""It 's just the same flip flopping over and over . Depending on the argument , `` science does n't exclude the divine `` , { then switcharoo } , `` science proves there is no divine. `` Just depends on the setting of the argument . ( you do have your copy of Victor Stenger 's book ; God - The failed Hypothesis / how science shows that God does not exist , do n't you ?""","""I 'd love to see an explanation about how the study of the natural world disproves the existence of all Deities . Especially the Deistic Gods . And I 'd love to see how science is suppose to disprove a being that is not bound by logic , reason or any laws . What science can do is disprove that God was directly responsible for this or that , the sun rising , the rain season , etc . Did you perhaps realize that many scientists are Buddhists because Buddhism which has beings that behave as Gods with such powers and exist partially within the natural and supernatural ? Or are you again assuming all religions do n't exist except for Christanity ?""",DISAGREE,"""It 's just the same flip flopping over and over . Depending on the argument , `` science does n't exclude the divine ``""","""I 'd love to see an explanation about how the study of the natural world disproves the existence of all are you again assuming all religions do n't exist except for Christanity ?""",,
16263,4327,"""No , it is you young padawan learner ... that has been mislead , some of the most famous and noted Darwinian Naturalists such as Crick , Huxley , Lipson ... and others have admitted to their own discredit that the entire theory of evolutions rests on chance , here ... but here , lets burst that bubble for you a bit more :""","""I 'm sure you reproduce these quotes in good faith , but you ought to know they are not necessarily what they seem . The Darwin quote is a particularly craven quote mine : he was expressing empathy with those of his readers who found it difficult to imagine how such a thing as an eye could evolve by stages ; effectively putting himself in their place so that he might more readily take them by the hand and show them how such evolution may occur , with ample supporting evidence from the natural world . I refer you to the Quote Mine Project for further edification .""",DISAGREE,"""No , it is you young padawan learner ... that has been mislead""","""I 'm sure you reproduce these quotes in good faith , but you ought to know they are not necessarily what they seem .""",,
16269,4328,"""The story of the literal Genesis is only rejected by those who are not looking to the absolute Truth found in God Almighty .""","""That 's idiotic . A literal reading of Genesis is rejected by every major sect of Christianity . What kind of a XXXXX looks at a bat and then claims that it is a bird because it says so in the wholey buybull ? You 've got to be a freek to count 6 legs on grasshoppers and then claim that your scripture is without error , even when it says they have 4 .""",DISAGREE,"""the literal Genesis is only rejected by those""","""That 's idiotic . A literal reading of Genesis is rejected by every major sect""",,
16277,4330,"""If what you uninformed religious bigots and hatemongers believe was n't so pathetic , it would be funny . What 's a guy aspoda do !""","""You toss out a false assessment as to what you THINK we `` believe `` , and ignore the very real reasons why we have explained that this legislation should fail . And in the course of Archie 's reply , he makes a statement so Freudian it 's kinda funny . Yup ! It 's an Archie reply ... You ask `` What 's a guy aspoda do `` For starters , you could address WHAT WE SAID on the topic instead of tossing out lame allegations . You evidently think it 's okay for the LEGISLATURE to politicize education certification according to their pet PERSONAL theories . You could start by explaining WHY you think this is valid .""",DISAGREE,"""If what you uninformed religious bigots and hatemongers believe was n't so pathetic , it would be funny .""","""You toss out a false assessment as to what you THINK we `` believe `` , and ignore the very real reasons why we have explained that this legislation should fail .""",,
16298,4341,"""Another lie . The sentence you 've quoted never made any such argument .""","""The quote below which Obvious Child responded to does n't make enough sense to be an argument for anything . This whole thing about living side by side with carnivirous crocs by feeding them chicken has little to do with anything , really . Servant of Christ says : `` Thus , the scenes of the African villagers mingling with the crocodiles corroborate that humans could have lived alongside ( or nearby ) even carnivorous dinosaurs . The original  “ magical place ” where that happened was the Garden of Eden , before any animals had turned to carnivory. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Another lie . The sentence you 've quoted never made any such argument .""","""The original  magical place where that happened was the Garden of Eden""",,
16300,4341,"""Another lie . The sentence you 've quoted never made any such argument .""","""The quote below which Obvious Child responded to does n't make enough sense to be an argument for anything . This whole thing about living side by side with carnivirous crocs by feeding them chicken has little to do with anything , really . Servant of Christ says : `` Thus , the scenes of the African villagers mingling with the crocodiles corroborate that humans could have lived alongside ( or nearby ) even carnivorous dinosaurs . The original  “ magical place ” where that happened was the Garden of Eden , before any animals had turned to carnivory. ``""",DISAGREE,"""The sentence you 've quoted never made any such argument .""","""This whole thing about living side by side with carnivirous crocs by feeding them chicken has little to do with anything , really .""",,
16305,4342,"""Creationist make little quips about how evolution must be a racist theory et cetera but when I ask them to explain in more detail they just disappear . I find this quite annoying what should I do about it ?""","""I know the feeling . Its very , very easy to make a statement associating two things ( like racism and scientific evolution ) its an altogether tricker one to then defend that statement against thorough scrutiny . Or should I say they [ YEC 's ] like to teach the contoversy ? Just challenge their assertions , when they do n't defend them and disappear it shows they are just taking the Michael .""",AGREE,"""when I ask them to explain in more detail they just disappear""","""Just challenge their assertions , when they do n't defend them and disappear it shows they are just taking the Michael .""",,
16301,4342,"""Creationist make little quips about how evolution must be a racist theory et cetera but when I ask them to explain in more detail they just disappear . I find this quite annoying what should I do about it ?""","""I know the feeling . Its very , very easy to make a statement associating two things ( like racism and scientific evolution ) its an altogether tricker one to then defend that statement against thorough scrutiny . Or should I say they [ YEC 's ] like to teach the contoversy ? Just challenge their assertions , when they do n't defend them and disappear it shows they are just taking the Michael .""",AGREE,"""Creationist make little quips about how evolution must be a racist theory et cetera""","""I know the feeling . Its very , very easy to make a statement associating two things ( like racism and scientific evolution""",,
16309,4343,"""You surely are not insulting nocturnal09 by calling her an easy target are you ?""","""Nope , rather I 'm suggesting you consider her an easy target because you did n't want anyone else interjecting -- you wanted your prey to remain without more skilled allies .""",DISAGREE,"""calling her an easy target are you ?""","""Nope , rather I 'm suggesting you consider her an easy target""",,
16308,4343,"""You surely are not insulting nocturnal09 by calling her an easy target are you ?""","""Nope , rather I 'm suggesting you consider her an easy target because you did n't want anyone else interjecting -- you wanted your prey to remain without more skilled allies .""",DISAGREE,"""You surely are not insulting nocturnal09 by calling her an easy target are you ?""","""Nope , rather I 'm suggesting you consider her an easy target because you did n't want anyone else interjecting""",,
16321,4345,"""First of all , the government can not increase the volume and social acceptance of a drug - only the market and society can do that . Government can not even decrease the volume or social acceptance of drugs - despite the government 's efforts , drug use has remained relatively constant . What has n't remained constant is violent crime , which has gone up during the drug war as it did during alcohol prohibition .""","""Wrong , the muder rate has been cut substantially since the 1980s . There has been a steady decline in the US for violent crime over the last 25 years . http : //www.fbi.gov/filelink.html ? fil ... xl/01tbl01.xls Some facts for those interested in what a failure law enforcement has been . Direct numbers . Showing that both numbers and per capita rates have declined steadily for the last 10 to 15 years . Hardly an indication of anything being a failure or not working frankly .""",DISAGREE,"""What has n't remained constant is violent crime , which has gone up during the drug war as it did during alcohol prohibition .""","""Wrong , the muder rate has been cut substantially since the 1980s .""",,
16322,4345,"""First of all , the government can not increase the volume and social acceptance of a drug - only the market and society can do that . Government can not even decrease the volume or social acceptance of drugs - despite the government 's efforts , drug use has remained relatively constant . What has n't remained constant is violent crime , which has gone up during the drug war as it did during alcohol prohibition .""","""Wrong , the muder rate has been cut substantially since the 1980s . There has been a steady decline in the US for violent crime over the last 25 years . http : //www.fbi.gov/filelink.html ? fil ... xl/01tbl01.xls Some facts for those interested in what a failure law enforcement has been . Direct numbers . Showing that both numbers and per capita rates have declined steadily for the last 10 to 15 years . Hardly an indication of anything being a failure or not working frankly .""",DISAGREE,"""despite the government 's efforts , drug use has remained relatively constant .""","""Wrong , the muder rate has been cut substantially since the 1980s""",,
16341,4349,"""Actually what they are really doing is ignoring silly irrelevent questions from clueless people with a religious agenda to promote .""","""Really , then show me how I 'm wrong - without dogmatic statements . I would suggest , given the fact that you feel the need to ignore science , deny obvious facts of reason , and cling to evolutionary theory , that it is you that has the problem with religion - your naturalistic religion . I would further suggest that you stop attibuting your personal opinions to science , and start calling your comments what they really are , personal opinion . -By the way , is everyone who disagrees with you promoting a `` religious agenda ? `` Where have I leaned on religion to make my point ? And what makes you think that I need religion to defeat your postion as I have here ? I 've used science , scientific journals , and good sound reasoning to defeat your comments . I suggest you rethink what you 're saying . It sure sounds like you 're the one with the `` religious agenda. ``""",DISAGREE,"""ignoring silly irrelevent questions from clueless people with a religious agenda to promote .""","""I would suggest , given the fact that you feel the need to ignore science , deny obvious facts of reason , and cling to evolutionary theory , that it is you that has the problem with religion - your naturalistic religion . ``""",,
16359,4353,"""Ocean acidity is old news ...""","""What , you mean like this story ( http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3136266.stm ) of scientists warning about ocian acidity levels from 2003 ? Global warming is old news too : it does n't seem to have reached the more remote parts of the world though , like North America for example .""",DISAGREE,"""Ocean acidity is old news ...""","""What , you mean like this story ( http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3136266.stm ) of scientists warning about ocian acidity levels from 2003 ?""",,
16362,4354,"""Reptile develops feathers . They offer reduced protection .""","""They do offer a good insulating blanket which would keep the body of the reptile warm which in turn , would allow the reptile to remain active for a longer period of time . This means more time to hunt and reproduce carrying the mutation onwards .""",DISAGREE,"""Reptile develops feathers . They offer reduced protection .""","""They do offer a good insulating blanket which would keep the body of the reptile warm which in turn""",,
16363,4354,"""Reptile develops feathers . They offer reduced protection .""","""They do offer a good insulating blanket which would keep the body of the reptile warm which in turn , would allow the reptile to remain active for a longer period of time . This means more time to hunt and reproduce carrying the mutation onwards .""",DISAGREE,"""Reptile develops feathers . They offer reduced protection .""","""They do offer a good insulating blanket which would keep the body of the reptile warm""",,
16371,4356,"""Makes about as much sense as saying many of the car hating crowd ( people who support such laws as car registration ) also own cars . More evidence that your handlers have trained you to see the world in black and white .""","""Rosie O'Donnell publicly stated that she felt anyone who owned a gun should be sent to prison . However she has armed bodyguards to protect herself and her children . Talk about a hypocritical sow .""",DISAGREE,"""about as much sense as saying many of the car hating crowd""","""publicly stated that she felt anyone who owned""",,
16384,4358,"""At conception a particular individual 's DNA is established . This is a scientific fact . So from conception one certain individual is forming and most likely will be born if the pregnancy is allowed to proceed ( the majority of pregnancies allowed to proceed result in a live , healthy baby ) . Now , if the mother chooses to abort that person will not be born . You or I would not be here if we had been aborted . And why not ? Because that person 's life was ended while still in the womb . Consider that person whose life was ended by abortion . How is abortion not killing ? Why does it not matter to you that a life is ended by abortion ? Even if it was just a clump of cells ( I can hear this one coming ) in the beginning , the fact is , in the end it will most likely be a live human being and that is n't changed by it 's alleged `` clump of cells in the beginning `` status . Please explain .""","""Actually I believe life begins at conception , that that life matters and abortion ends that life . I also believe mama comes first and until we can seriously address the issues faced by pregnant women rather than demonizing them that they will abort whether it 's legal or not . I also believe that there are times when abortion is appropriate and necessary .""",DISAGREE,"""At conception a particular individual 's DNA is established .""","""Actually I believe life begins at conception , that that life matters and abortion ends that life .""",,
16386,4358,"""At conception a particular individual 's DNA is established . This is a scientific fact . So from conception one certain individual is forming and most likely will be born if the pregnancy is allowed to proceed ( the majority of pregnancies allowed to proceed result in a live , healthy baby ) . Now , if the mother chooses to abort that person will not be born . You or I would not be here if we had been aborted . And why not ? Because that person 's life was ended while still in the womb . Consider that person whose life was ended by abortion . How is abortion not killing ? Why does it not matter to you that a life is ended by abortion ? Even if it was just a clump of cells ( I can hear this one coming ) in the beginning , the fact is , in the end it will most likely be a live human being and that is n't changed by it 's alleged `` clump of cells in the beginning `` status . Please explain .""","""Actually I believe life begins at conception , that that life matters and abortion ends that life . I also believe mama comes first and until we can seriously address the issues faced by pregnant women rather than demonizing them that they will abort whether it 's legal or not . I also believe that there are times when abortion is appropriate and necessary .""",DISAGREE,"""At conception a particular individual 's DNA is established . Why does it not matter to you that a life is ended by abortion ? ``""","""I believe life begins at conception I also believe mama comes first""",,
16397,4360,"""Now , I have no problem with the concept of epigenetic inheritance . But even if it were true it would n't do away with natural selection . Just as with basic genetic mutation , which is n't going to go away , one would expect some individuals to exhibit epigenetic alterations and others not to .""","""Well that 's true under one condition : that there is such thing as a random mutation that creates a new , beneficial body part or function . I 'm not sure this has ever been established as fact . ( How does science go about proving randomness in a mutation , anyway ? ... it seems to me that one must accept that mutations are random by faith . ) '' It is our contention that if  ‘ random ’ is given a serious and crucial interpretation from a probabilistic point of view , the randomness postulate is highly implausible and that an adequate scientific theory of evolution must await the discovery and elucidation of new natural laws . '' — * Murray Eden , `` Inadequacies of Neo-Darwinian Evolution as Scientific Theory , `` in Mathematical Challenges to the Neo-Darwinian Theory of Evolution ( 1967 ) , p. 109 . This still means a population containing a range of variants that natural selection can act on , preserving some epigenetic alterations as opposed to others . but if the variation is nonrandom , it does n't matter : selection 's role , like I said above , would be doing nothing more than eliminating the weaklings . According to ToE , selection is a creative force of evolution , guiding the direction of evolution . Gould : The central logic of Darwinism requires that natural selection not merely operate , but that it be the creative force of evolutionary change . Selection wins its role as a creative force because the other component of evolutionary mechanics — the forces that produce the raw material of genetic variation — are random , in the special sense of  “ not inherently directed toward adaptation. ” That is , if local environments change and smaller organisms are now at an advantage , genetic variation does not produce more small individuals , thus imparting a direction to evolutionary change from the level of variation itself . Variation continues to occur “ at random ,  ” in a broad spectrum about the average size . Selection must impart direction — and be the creative force of evolution — by differentially preserving those random variants yielding smaller than average phenotypes .""",AGREE,"""I have no problem with the concept of epigenetic inheritance .""","""Well that 's true under one condition : that there is such thing as a random mutation that creates a new , beneficial body part or function""",,
16405,4361,"""What Would We Expect to Find if the World Had Flooded""","""Great site ! I know I 'll refer to it in the future . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""What Would We Expect to Find if the World Had Flooded""","""Great site ! I know I 'll refer to it in the future""",,
16410,4362,"""You did n't qualify it by saying `` some `` pregnancies are life threatening or unbearable . Maybe yours was , but how can you say that for every woman in the world ?""","""I 'm sorry , this is pretty damn funny , coming from a pro-life person""",DISAGREE,"""pregnancies are life threatening or unbearable .""","""this is pretty damn funny , coming from a pro-life person""",,
16411,4362,"""You did n't qualify it by saying `` some `` pregnancies are life threatening or unbearable . Maybe yours was , but how can you say that for every woman in the world ?""","""I 'm sorry , this is pretty damn funny , coming from a pro-life person""",DISAGREE,"""some `` pregnancies are life threatening or unbearable .""","""this is pretty damn funny , coming from a pro-life person""",,
16419,4364,"""oh yeah sorry if my definition sucks . i was in a hurry .""","""I suspect that haste had little to do with the suckiness of your definition . * In re : your rhetorical questions as to whether creationism is religion or if it is science . Actually , the courts of the U.S. have clearly stated that creationism is religion and is not science . That is the basis for the exclusion of the teaching of creationism from public school science classes . Laws that have forbidden the teaching of evolutionary biology or required the teaching of creationism , whether alone or in `` balance `` with evolutionary biology , are violations of the establishment clause of the 1st Amendment . See : ( Epperson v. Arkansas , 393 U.S. 97 [ 1968 ] ) , ( McLean v. Arkansas Board of Education , 529 F. Supp 1255 [ 1982 ] ) , and ( Edwards v. Aguillard , 482 U.S. 578 [ 1987 ] )""",DISAGREE,"""sorry if my definition sucks . i was in a hurry .""","""haste had little to do with the suckiness of your definition""",,
16445,4368,"""As to the tired , misleading references to Catholic beliefs we 're seeing here , you 'll note that no `` theistic evolutionist `` ( Christian ) has finished any discussion with me in this forum .""","""Because all you ever do is accuse them of being a phony ( a.k.a . atheist ) as soon as they reveal that their theological beliefs do n't precisely match yours .""",DISAGREE,"""Catholic no `` theistic evolutionist `` ( Christian ) has finished any discussion with me in this forum .""","""Because all you ever do is accuse them of being a phony ( a.k.a . atheist ) they reveal that their theological beliefs do n't precisely match yours .""",,
16455,4371,"""That 's what `` reaching across the aisle `` is all about ! Although there was one Republican from Louisiana who agreed to the bill because Medicaid expansion alone would cover half her state . Otherwise , this `` appeasement `` stuff , as Keith Olbermann noted , is b.s . : You 're babbling .""","""Not ONE Republican will vote in favor of this bill . Just watch .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's what `` reaching across the aisle `` is all about ! Although there was one Republican from Louisiana""","""Not ONE Republican will vote in favor of this bill . Just watch .""",,
16460,4372,"""And neither can millions of other heterosexuals , something you ignore . As for nature , technically anything that occurs ever without supernatural causes is in fact in nature . We are a part of nature . Everything we do is a part of nature . Therefore , by taking the genetic data of two gays , placing it in a egg and having a surrogate mother bring it to term , gays can reproduce themselves .""","""You stoll my idea .... LOL I guess great minds do think alike !""",AGREE,"""And neither can millions of other heterosexuals , something you ignore .""","""You stoll my idea""",,
16473,4376,"""I find it interesting that the slippery slope fallacy keeps popping up again and again in the arguments of pro-gun activists even after the Heller decision .""","""Because the Heller ruling did nothing to dissolve the slippery slope argument .""",AGREE,"""I find it interesting that the slippery slope fallacy keeps popping up again and again""","""the Heller ruling did nothing to dissolve the slippery slope argument .""",,
16495,4382,"""see above""","""Well , yeah , if science has n't provided an explanation for a phenomenon , then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals .""",AGREE,"""see above""","""if science has n't provided an explanation for a phenomenon , then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals .""",,
16496,4382,"""see above""","""Well , yeah , if science has n't provided an explanation for a phenomenon , then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals .""",AGREE,"""see above""","""Well , yeah ,""",,
16550,4391,"""I believe abortion is a crime against humanity and should be outlawed .""","""I think the same about religion . Why should you get your way and tryannise women , and I not get mine ?""",DISAGREE,"""I believe abortion is a crime against humanity and should be outlawed .""","""Why should you get your way and tryannise women""",,
16552,4392,"""A man who remains stiff-necked after many rebukes will suddenly be destroyed -- without remedy . - Proverbs 29:1""","""Translation ; `` Do what I say or I will kick your @ ss. `` Sounds a lot like the mafia . And you love this diety ?""",DISAGREE,"""A man who remains stiff-necked after many rebukes will suddenly be destroyed -- without remedy . -""","""Do what I say or I will kick your @ ss. `` Sounds a lot like the mafia . And you love this diety ?""",,
16562,4393,"""... i 'm confused ...""","""... I 'm not surprised ...""",DISAGREE,"""i 'm confused""","""I 'm not surprised""",,
16583,4397,"""What are you talking about ? I 've been down this road before . I do n't think that gun control is the most important issue in the world but I do intend to own one as soon as I move out of NY in hopefully a year or 2 . I totally agree that people should be free to own guns , as they are . I also have no problems with states making it mandatory for gun owners to have permits , which some states do . I 'm not an extremist . I plan to teach my kids how to properly use guns , much to my wife 's protest . And I 'll probably own more than one , at least one in my bedroom and one in my car . What I do n't get is the what seems to me like an overwhelming fear of `` what if `` from both sides . The pro-gun camp fears that any gun regulation policies , something as simple as a county registration , will inevitably lead to policies that ban all guns . And the anti-gun crowd fears that if people can own guns at all , then gun-toting bandits will jump out of every alley and start popping people randomly . So its a case of total gun freedom vs total `` gunlessness `` . I 'm not convinced that either of these `` what-if `` scenarios will occur . After all , as it is presently , gun crimes still occur , people have their rights to own guns revoked on a case by case basis , and dying of gun shots is actually very rare . I believe a balance can be found . And as for supporting the constitution , this issue is actually about supporting an ammendment to the constitution . If the constitution was so holy and inerrant , why did it need to be ammendments ? I 'm not the one that was so dissatisfied with the document that I had to ammend it anyway . And the insinuations and inuendos you say I made ( not actually saying what they were ) , the rest of your pro-gun team confirmed my observations , just as you did now . Thanks .""","""So you plan to move out of N.Y.in a year or two , and own a gun ? why not now ? N.Y.laws are sticker than most , but not all.You want to teach your kids to shoot ? Better do it now , later on it will probably be harder . Well if you do n't think that gun control is the most important issue in the world and you totally agree that people should be able to own guns , but yet you have no problems with states making it mandatory for gun owners to have permits , thats almost a contradiction of terms for someone that says their pro gun . I may be wrong but is anyone saying or implying total gun freedom ? What we are saying is , to many laws on it no more . 35-40 years ago we did n't have all this B.S.about it , you wanted a gun you went and got one ( in other words very readily available ) Walk down the street with one and you did n't have a S.W.A.T.team on you . We have seen to many gun rights taken so yeah every time a new policy or amendment comes along we are antsy about it . So if you support every amendment made to the constitution pertaining to guns , than I submit your not to interested in owning a gun . And for the record : gun toting bandits ( out here we say bandito 's ) are jumping out of every ally { figuratively speaking } .But the pro-gunners know that if the anti-gunners had their way , only the bandito 's have guns .""",DISAGREE,"""I do intend to own one as soon as I move out of NY in hopefully a year I 'm not an extremist . I plan to teach my kids how to properly use guns , much to my wife 's protest . ``""","""So you plan to move out of N.Y.in a year or two , and own a gun ? why not now ? N.Y.laws are sticker than most , but not all.You want to teach your kids to shoot ? Better do it now , later on it will probably be""",,
16587,4398,"""Do you think the God will be happy with abortion ?""","""I dunno . Do you think the Tooth Fairy will be happy with people drink-driving ? Any argument from a religious stand-point necessitates proving that said religion is true . Do that , and you 'll get a lot of respect from a lot of people .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you think the God will be happy with abortion ?""","""Do you think the Tooth Fairy will be happy with people drink-driving ?""",,
16591,4399,"""No need to change the verbage : `` ... individuals with variations that are fortuitously best suited to changing local environments. `` Like folks who migrated to northern latitudes and happened to have lighter skin ( variation ) were healthier and therefore produced more and healthier offspring . Over generations the lighter skinned came to dominate the group while becomming lighter still . Why is that so difficult ? No one is saying the darker skinned folks never reproduced . They just were n't as successful in the long run .""","""And , the converse is true in the lower latitudes .""",AGREE,"""... individuals with variations that are fortuitously best suited to changing local environments. `` Like folks who migrated to northern latitudes and happened to have lighter skin ( variation ) were healthier and therefore produced more and healthier offspring .""","""And , the converse is true in the lower latitudes .""",,
16620,4405,"""Your attitude is wrong . Instead of using your mind and energies to disprove the bible you should use all your power to to learn how to obey the teachings of the Son of God and mature emotionally and in wisdom .""","""The 'teachings ' either have no substance , or are certainly not original . Demonstrate categorically just who is the Son of God , and why this figure commands worship and obeisance .""",DISAGREE,"""learn how to obey the teachings of the Son of God""","""The 'teachings ' either have no substance , or are certainly not original""",,
16627,4407,"""So it would be more loving to severely beat the child ... forever ?""","""A person going to Hell is a consequence of sin . God does n't want it , but he ca n't stop it .""",AGREE,"""it would be more loving to severely beat the child ... forever ?""","""person going to Hell is a consequence of sin .""",,
16634,4410,"""Here is what I define evolution as : Evolution is a three part theory ,""","""Actually , it is n't .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution is a three part theory ,""","""Actually , it is n't .""",,
16639,4411,"""My point in starting the thread is not merely that Christians fall short of their aspirations . No .... this is worse . Because this particular U.S . Senator , an avowed conservative Christian , has actively worked to restrict the rights of others to marry , supposedly in the name of `` protecting `` or `` defending `` marriage , while at the same time undermining his own marriage . He makes a pretense , for political gain I suspect , of `` defending marriage `` by playing to people 's anti-gay prejudices while himself undermining marriage in his real life . That 's hypocrisy , and it 's dishonesty .""","""Prove your assertion that he has called himself a conservative Christian rather than a conservative Republican OP . Support your clai if you can or stop trying to lump everyone on the right together .""",DISAGREE,"""an avowed conservative Christian , has actively worked to restrict the rights of others to marry ,""","""Prove your assertion that he has called himself a conservative Christian rather than a conservative Republican""",,
16654,4413,"""Really ? Oh , derrrr ! Obviously , some people no longer use a sense of humour ; a relic .""","""Sorry , sometimes sarcasm is quite hard to read .""",AGREE,"""some people no longer use a sense of humour ; a relic .""","""Sorry ,""",,
16676,4417,"""'' When you go to war against your enemies ... suppose you see a beautiful woman whom you desire ... you shall take her .. and she shall marry you. `` - Deut . 21:10""","""Read to the very end of the verse . '' If you are not pleased with her , let her go wherever she wishes . You must not sell her or treat her as a slave , since you have dishonored her. ``""",DISAGREE,"""When you go to war against your enemies ... suppose you see a beautiful woman whom you desire ... you shall take her .. and she shall marry you. `` - Deut . 21:10""","""Read to the very end of the verse .""",,
16700,4428,"""I assure you I never made such a claim .""","""Here 's what I was recalling :""",DISAGREE,"""I assure you I never made such a claim .""","""Here 's what I was recalling :""",,
16712,4430,"""NO I think that if certain religious groups can fire people for being gay then I as a gay man should be allowed to fire those of that certain religion .""","""As much as it pains me I 'm going to agree with Mathew here . If you own a private business then you should be able to hire and fire people for whatever reason you want . If a private company only wants to employ one gender that should be their choice . If a private company only wanted to employ people choosing a gay lifestyle , I would support their right to do so . I also support a persons right to not use businesses who have hiring practices they do n't agree with . Note : I do n't include gov't in this , the rules are and should be different for government .""",AGREE,"""if certain religious groups can fire people for being gay then I as a gay man should be allowed to fire those of that certain religion .""","""I 'm going to agree with Mathew here . If you own a private business then you should be able to hire and fire people for whatever reason you want .""",,
16713,4430,"""NO I think that if certain religious groups can fire people for being gay then I as a gay man should be allowed to fire those of that certain religion .""","""As much as it pains me I 'm going to agree with Mathew here . If you own a private business then you should be able to hire and fire people for whatever reason you want . If a private company only wants to employ one gender that should be their choice . If a private company only wanted to employ people choosing a gay lifestyle , I would support their right to do so . I also support a persons right to not use businesses who have hiring practices they do n't agree with . Note : I do n't include gov't in this , the rules are and should be different for government .""",AGREE,"""gay I as a gay man should be allowed to fire those of that certain religion .""","""If you own a private business then you should be able to hire and fire people for whatever reason you want . If a private company only wanted to employ people choosing a gay lifestyle , I would support their right to do so .""",,
16715,4431,"""Pro-lifers are like slave traders ? What a pro-lifers trading ?""","""Thats not the point . The Pro-lifers advocate force , just like the slave advocates did . The pro-choicers advocate freedom and choice , just like the abolitionists .""",DISAGREE,"""Pro-lifers are like slave traders ? What a pro-lifers trading ?""","""Thats not the point . The Pro-lifers advocate force , just like the slave advocates did .""",,
16723,4432,"""Make a damn point already . Posting nonsense like this proves nothing , other than the fact that you 're an internet troll .""","""Is n't the point pretty obvious- that exposure to a gun can raise testosterone levels and trigger violent and aggressive thoughts and actions ?""",DISAGREE,"""Make a damn point already . Posting nonsense like this proves nothing , other than the fact that you 're an internet troll .""","""Is n't the point pretty obvious- that exposure to a gun can raise""",,
16738,4436,"""a human being forced into dependency on another for its life , is not a `` parasite , ``""","""It 's not a human being it 's a clump of uninvited cells . If it 's not a parasite ( as you claim ) then it would n't need the woman to survive""",DISAGREE,"""human being forced into dependency on another for its life , is not a `` parasite , ``""","""It 's not a human being it 's a clump of uninvited cells . If it 's not a parasite ( as you claim ) then it would n't need the woman to survive""",,
16746,4438,"""For the sake of discussion let 's say it is the same one all the signers of the Declaration of Independence agreed it was .""","""And you believe that to be what ? You really need to just say who/what you think the Creator is to save us from having to make all these clarification posts .""",DISAGREE,"""let 's say it is the same one all the signers of the Declaration of Independence agreed it was .""","""You really need to just say who/what you think the Creator is to save us from having to make all these clarification posts .""",,
16747,4438,"""For the sake of discussion let 's say it is the same one all the signers of the Declaration of Independence agreed it was .""","""And you believe that to be what ? You really need to just say who/what you think the Creator is to save us from having to make all these clarification posts .""",DISAGREE,"""For the sake of discussion let 's say it is the same one all the signers of the Declaration""","""You really need to just say who/what you think the Creator is to save us""",,
16757,4441,"""Repeal of all legislative provisions that restrict the sex or number of persons entering into a marriage unit ; and the extension of legal benefits to all persons who cohabit regardless of sex or numbers""","""So your only link to gay rights and polygamy is a statement put out by a gay rights conference 30 years ago that does not EXPLAIN a link to polygamy , but shows it 's support for it ? Hn ... I 'm with Justine on this one . This is a bit of a stretch . It would be like me implying that your support for `` traditional marriage `` also supports spousal abuse just because marriages in the past allowed for wife beatings .""",DISAGREE,"""Repeal of all legislative provisions that restrict the sex or number of persons entering into a marriage unit all persons who cohabit regardless of sex or numbers""","""So your only link to gay rights and polygamy is a statement put out by a gay rights conference 30 years ago that does not EXPLAIN a link to polygamy""",,
16771,4446,"""`` Brady II `` redefines `` firearm `` to include magazines and `` any part of the action `` ( such as pins , springs , or screws ) . Thus , if a person has two Colt pistols , three Remington rifles , and four magazines ( of any size ) for each gun , then he own an `` arsenal. `` Or if he owned two guns , six magazines , and a box of disassembled gun parts that contained five springs , five pins , and five screws , then he would own 23 `` firearms `` and would have to obtain an `` arsenal `` license .""","""The AR-15 has over 100 parts in its assembly . Under the language of the Brady II bill , if it had passed , anyone wishing to assemble their own AR-15 would be required to acquire an arsenal license just for one gun . A notice to all supporters of gun control : We 're no longer compromising , we 're not the ones who have to . From now on it 's up to you to justify , in an intelligent and sophisticated manner , exactly how your proposals qualify as `` reasonable `` and `` common sense `` and how they `` do n't infringe on the Second Amendment `` .""",AGREE,"""if he owned two guns , six magazines , and a box of disassembled gun parts that contained five springs , five pins , and five screws , then he would own 23 `` firearms `` and would have to obtain an `` arsenal `` license .""","""anyone wishing to assemble their own AR-15 would be required to acquire an arsenal license just for one gun .""",,
16787,4450,"""Outside of the fallacy above you fail to explain how gay relationships are harmful .""","""Well read this link , http : //www.realwomenca.com/newslette ... article_1.html Why take my word for it when you can read it for yourself from professionals , professors , mental health studies , etc . This link also disclaims the links you have listed . Finding flaws in their studies . So thats my source , and thats my stand .""",DISAGREE,"""the fallacy above you fail to explain how gay relationships are harmful""","""read this link also disclaims the links you have listed flaws in their studies""",,
16805,4454,"""There doesn ’ t have to be a defined `` shot calling `` leadership of it any more than there has to be one in Judeo Christianity . The two are actually comparable - Christianity gets its leadership/organization through Biblical reference and church leadership . Evolution gets its leadership/organization through the philosophical writings of everyone from Herbert Spencer to Richard Dawkins .""","""And as I said , Herbert Spencer 's ideas predate Darwin 's . Meanwhile , Dawkins writings on religion are irrelevant to whether evolution is good biology .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution gets its leadership/organization through the philosophical writings of everyone from Herbert Spencer to Richard Dawkins .""","""Herbert Spencer 's ideas predate Darwin 's Dawkins writings on religion are irrelevant to whether evolution is good biology .""",,
16809,4455,"""Great post , Archangel !""","""Thanks , my friend , as you can see , Jito completely ignored the substance of my argument as it applies to the current american culture , as she responded to how it would apply to her personal life 's credo . A more dishonest way of avoiding the meat of my argument could n't be formed except by a manipulative , insincere and philosophical coward of jitobear 's caliber . That 's why there 's nothing she wrote that 's worth responding to . As usual she has n't actually responded to anything I said . Why must these leftists twist what we say as they ignore the actual substance of it ?""",AGREE,"""Great post""","""Thanks , my friend""",,
16818,4458,"""Only 2,000 people ? Is that so ? How many have to die as a result of this bad policy before we get our dander up and start calling for changes ?""","""What do you want to bet that the cops in that town are still encouraged to pursue murder suspects ?""",DISAGREE,"""How many have to die as a result of this bad policy before we get our dander""","""cops in that town are still encouraged to pursue murder suspects""",,
16821,4458,"""Only 2,000 people ? Is that so ? How many have to die as a result of this bad policy before we get our dander up and start calling for changes ?""","""What do you want to bet that the cops in that town are still encouraged to pursue murder suspects ?""",DISAGREE,"""Only 2,000 people ? Is that so ? How many have to die as a result of this bad policy""","""you want to bet that the cops in that town are still encouraged to pursue murder suspects ?""",,
16825,4459,"""There is no way to judge on a case-by-case basis .""","""What do you mean by this ? Could we not have the law treat under-18 capital offenders on an individual basis , determining whether the individual offenders in the individual cases were sufficiently developed ? Also , what would you say to the response that our current law provides that juveniles are sufficiently developed enough to have the responsibility , without parental involvement , to decide whether to obtain an abortion ? Is it not a conflict to say juveniles should not be eligible for the death penalty because they are not morally developed enough , but at the same time say juveniles are morally developed enough to decide whether to obtain an abortion without involving their parents ?""",DISAGREE,"""judge on a case-by-case basis .""","""law treat under-18 capital offenders on an individual basis , determining whether the individual offenders in the individual cases were sufficiently developed""",,
16832,4462,"""Because there IS no evidence against creationism .""","""Actually , there is no evidence to support creationism , which is based on the mythology of bronze age , nomadic herdsmen . Thus , the creationism v. evolution debate becomes an effort by creationists to discredit evolution rather than an effort to offer evidence for creationism . The reason is simple - there is no evidence that supports creationism . On the other hand , it is intentional ignorance to claim that the earth is only 6,000 years old , that there was a universal flood about 4500 years ago , or that the millions of species in the world today evolved from a few thousand species at most at rates no evolutionary biologist would even consider possible . Creationists deny evolution and then offer hyperevolution when they realize that their position is impossible .""",DISAGREE,"""Because there IS no evidence against creationism .""","""Actually , there is no evidence to support creationism , which is based on the mythology of bronze age , nomadic herdsmen . Thus , the creationism v. evolution debate becomes an effort by creationists to discredit evolution rather than an effort to offer evidence for creationism . there is no evidence that supports creationism . Creationists deny evolution and then offer hyperevolution when they realize that their position is impossible .""",,
16839,4464,"""I do n't think it 's invasive at the 2nd grade level , in the school . At least it should n't be -- rather than teachers teaching about relationships , I think they should teach about the subjects that schools are there for . You know , Writing , math , elementary science , geography , etc .""","""So reading and literature are n't to be taught ? I love it . More stupid , paranoid parents for me to mock mock mock . They are sooo part of a great big problem . A problem that sees my kid getting threatened and bullied - so I feel totally justified in my mocking . Frankly , there are days I would like to kick them in the teeth .""",DISAGREE,"""At least it should n't be -- rather than teachers teaching about relationships , I think they should teach about the subjects that schools are there for . You know , Writing , math , elementary science , geography , etc .""","""So reading and literature are n't to be taught ? I love it . More stupid , paranoid parents for me to mock mock mock""",,
16862,4469,"""Why did my post get deleted ? Did you guys realize I was right so you decided to delete it when we exposed the religion of evolution ? Anyway , supersport , good job , keep up the good work . I liked that last link you posted it was really interesting , but someone deleted it - they must have realized the truth it exposed . I think it 's funny how the evolution beleivers can call you a liar and all sorts of other stuff , but when we point out how unfair it is , the evolution mod goes and deletes our posts . Total bias . The mod should at least send you a message to tell you why the post was deleted , if it happens again without warning I 'm going to contact the admin about the bias : I 've kept a record of my posts here because this has happened before on other boards with large evolution support .""","""Yea an explanation would be nice ..... I do n't know that I 've had anything deleted on here before -- ( it could have happened without me knowing it ) -- but I have no idea why that was deleted . If there was something specific I said , the post should have been snipped , not deleted altogether .""",AGREE,"""Did you guys realize I was right so you decided to delete it when we exposed the religion of evolution ? Anyway , supersport , good job , keep up the good work . I liked that last link you posted it was really interesting , but someone deleted it - they must have realized the truth it exposed . I think it 's funny how the evolution beleivers can call you a liar and all sorts of other stuff , but when we point out how unfair it is , the evolution mod goes and deletes our posts . Total bias . The mod should at least send you a message to tell you why the post was deleted""","""Yea an explanation would be nice ..... I do n't know that I 've had anything deleted on here before -- ( it could have happened without me knowing it ) -- but I have no idea why that was deleted .""",,
16866,4470,"""Actually all decisions based on the self ARE selfish decisions . I really do n't care . I make them all the time too . Everyone does . While this is a philosophical issue I really see it as odd that people claim not to be selfish when doing something that benefits them or prevents harm to them with little regard to anyone else .""","""This decision was not solely based on self , but then , I really do n't give a if you want to call me selfish - the facts speak for themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""all decisions based on the self ARE selfish decisions""","""I really do n't give a if you want to call me selfish""",,
16876,4471,"""DALLAS ( AP ) - A shootout outside a north Dallas bank has left at least two people wounded and customers and employees locked in the bank 's vault . The shooting happened just before 11 a.m. outside the United Texas Bank . The bank is located on the first floor of the Four Forest high-rise office building , near the intersection of U.S. 75 and Interstate 635 at 12221 Merit . A Dallas Police spokesman says that it was a targeted shooting and not a random act . Two men , father and son , were the gunman 's victims . Both have been taken to a hospital and are in stable condition . The gunman was shot in an altercation with police . His condition is not known at this time . A witness tells KRLD-AM of Dallas that a bank customer went outside , then came back inside and said , `` You 'd better lock your doors. `` Another witness reported seeing a man sitting in a chair with blood all over his chest .""","""BREAKING NEWS : SHOOTING IN DALLAS OFFICE TOWER - CTnow Ah , the good old gun-crazy US of A .""",DISAGREE,"""shootout outside a north Dallas bank a targeted shooting and not a random act .""","""SHOOTING IN DALLAS OFFICE TOWER good old gun-crazy""",,
16877,4472,"""Steve - its not about qualifications - its about impact . Women are the ones who get pregnant , we should have more authority in the matter .""","""F -- k'in A ! right ! I do n't want some damn MAN deciding what 's going to be legal for my body . They have NO experience with the female anatomy except what they manage to bag , they should n't be allowed to decide for us . They have no idea what pregnancy is like , the damage it does to our bodies and our minds , and they do n't have to pay to support a child that we were forced to accept at knifepoint . Where is the logic is violating women a second time ? Where 's the justification for it ? Does n't the life of the unintended mother account for anything at all ? Do you men have any idea of the dangerous precdent you 'd be setting up with a total ban on abortion ? Women who have been raped and essentially told `` You WILL have this child , you WILL carry it to term , or you WILL go to prison ! `` would likely commit suicide as a result , meaning that TWO lives are gon na be lost .""",AGREE,"""its not about qualifications - its about impact . Women are the ones who get pregnant , we should have more authority in the matter .""","""A ! right ! I do n't want some damn MAN deciding what 's going to be legal for my body .""",,
16878,4472,"""Steve - its not about qualifications - its about impact . Women are the ones who get pregnant , we should have more authority in the matter .""","""F -- k'in A ! right ! I do n't want some damn MAN deciding what 's going to be legal for my body . They have NO experience with the female anatomy except what they manage to bag , they should n't be allowed to decide for us . They have no idea what pregnancy is like , the damage it does to our bodies and our minds , and they do n't have to pay to support a child that we were forced to accept at knifepoint . Where is the logic is violating women a second time ? Where 's the justification for it ? Does n't the life of the unintended mother account for anything at all ? Do you men have any idea of the dangerous precdent you 'd be setting up with a total ban on abortion ? Women who have been raped and essentially told `` You WILL have this child , you WILL carry it to term , or you WILL go to prison ! `` would likely commit suicide as a result , meaning that TWO lives are gon na be lost .""",AGREE,"""its about impact . Women are the ones we should have more authority in the matter""","""be have NO experience with the female anatomy they should n't be allowed to decide for us the dangerous you 'd setting up""",,
16881,4472,"""Steve - its not about qualifications - its about impact . Women are the ones who get pregnant , we should have more authority in the matter .""","""F -- k'in A ! right ! I do n't want some damn MAN deciding what 's going to be legal for my body . They have NO experience with the female anatomy except what they manage to bag , they should n't be allowed to decide for us . They have no idea what pregnancy is like , the damage it does to our bodies and our minds , and they do n't have to pay to support a child that we were forced to accept at knifepoint . Where is the logic is violating women a second time ? Where 's the justification for it ? Does n't the life of the unintended mother account for anything at all ? Do you men have any idea of the dangerous precdent you 'd be setting up with a total ban on abortion ? Women who have been raped and essentially told `` You WILL have this child , you WILL carry it to term , or you WILL go to prison ! `` would likely commit suicide as a result , meaning that TWO lives are gon na be lost .""",AGREE,"""we should have more authority in the matter .""","""I do n't want some damn MAN deciding what 's going to be legal for my body ``""",,
16889,4495,"""Joe ; If it helps , I 'm a an ordained minister . I do n't care if those being married are `` believers `` or not ( like yourself ) all I care about is that those being married truly promice to love and care for each other . I know that you living in RI that the city of Windsor does n't help a whole lot , I would suggest Niagra for you because you 're so much closer to it , that 's if you 're interested in a Canadian Wedding . I will warn you though . Canadian marriage laws state that even though you do not have to be a resident of Canada to get married , you do have to be a Canadian resident for no less than one year to get divorced . ( not really something you 're thinking about , I know ... but it is something to be aware of )""","""Sure you do n't want to visit RI in Sept .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm a an ordained minister . you living in RI that the city of Windsor does n't help a whole lot I would suggest Niagra for you because you 're so much closer to it""","""Sure you do n't want to visit RI in Sept .""",,
16900,4496,"""Originally posted by Benjamin Dont come tell me who is a die hard Christian . That is sick , did God place you in a place of Christian authority ? No , it just so happens , God did not . It would have been far more acceptable for you to come and ask me or some other die hard , proven Christian .""","""Why do n't you point out exactly where I said anything about a `` die-hard Christian `` ? ? ? ? ? ? Creationism has nothing to to with Christianity , and it 's proponents tend to be some of the worst representatives .""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by Benjamin Dont come tell me who is a die hard Christian""","""Why do n't you point out exactly where I said anything about a `` die-hard Christian `` ?""",,
16921,4500,"""I fail to see why one must register an automobile but not a lethal weapon which is used solely to kill or maim .""","""I would like to hear a viable reason why they should be registered . The Canadian system has shown us it is money badly spent . It 's completely useless . I really does nothing to solve crime because for the most part , law abiding citizens would be the only ones registering their firearms .""",DISAGREE,"""I fail to see why one must register an automobile but not a lethal weapon""","""I would like to hear a viable reason why they should be registered .""",,
16947,4512,"""What is not fertilized is what a woman flushes in each monthly cycle . She is n't flushing people or potential people , and how sad it is that you ca n't understand that .""","""Actually , according to your use of the word `` person , `` she is . A significant percentage of fertilized eggs fail to implant and are instead passed . How sad ( and typical ) that you have n't bothered to educate yourself about these things .""",DISAGREE,"""What is not fertilized is what a woman flushes in each monthly cycle""","""A significant percentage of fertilized eggs fail to implant and are instead passed""",,
16957,4514,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason When other people quote statistics that you disagree with you say statistics is a game ? When you quote statistics like your claim that cost of Canada 's gun registration program was underestimated by 49,000 % you expect us to take you seriously ? Hypocritical to say the least .""","""Yeah , yeah we can all do math . Why do you even bother ? You said statistics is just a game . -VOR Take it seriously .""",DISAGREE,"""statistics statistics is a game""","""math statistics is a game""",,
16967,4516,"""Maybe all public speakers and blog owners should be required to undertake federally mandated remedial speaking and typing courses , even if they have a college education , and pass an extensive testing program to prove that they wo n't get their words wrong ... like the Illinois reverend who publicly and vocally advocated the killing of gun store owners and politicians who did n't support gun control .""","""LOL ! By that logic children entering a school with substandard English skills are just as much a threat to others as armed children entering a school with no training in firearms .""",DISAGREE,"""like the Illinois reverend who publicly and vocally advocated the killing of gun store owners and politicians who did n't support gun control .""","""By that logic children entering a school with substandard English skills are just as much a threat to others as armed children entering a school with no training in firearms .""",,
16975,4517,"""Or a more obvious version - if science has over-ruled Noah and the Creation as impossible , why beleive in the reserection , another impossible act ? ...""","""I 'm new to this idea that science has over-ruled Creation . Please explain .""",DISAGREE,"""if science has over-ruled Noah and the Creation as impossible , why beleive in the reserection""","""I 'm new to this idea that science has over-ruled Creation .""",,
16979,4518,"""If you think that it 's OK when the Mother 's life is in danger . Why would n't it be OK when her life is n't in danger ?""","""In a situation where you have to pick who dies there is no winner . You default to some standard which can be the highest chance of living ( save the life you can ) . Lucky this rarely happens ... if ever ( normally both will die in this kind of scenario ) .""",DISAGREE,"""If you think that it 's OK when the Mother 's life is in danger . Why would n't it be OK when her life is n't in danger ?""","""In a situation where you have to pick who dies there is no winner . You default to some standard which can be the highest chance of living""",,
16999,4521,"""ToE is a mechanistic theory -- it says life is like a machine . Machines are n't intelligent , they just do what they 're made/programmed to do .""","""Well , a pretty complex sort of machine , not at all like the kind ( so far ) intelligently designed by humans . And even if we do in the future invent machines that mimic life , that 's all they 'd be : mimics .""",DISAGREE,"""Machines are n't intelligent , they just do what they 're made/programmed to do .""","""And even if we do in the future invent machines that mimic life , that 's all they 'd be : mimics .""",,
17034,4528,"""the child in the womb feels pain .. when you put the needle up there to try to give the child anestesia in the womb , the child moves away to not get stuck by the needle . Its because it feels pain .. this is after 18 weeks . this is a child in the womb ..""","""The woman drinks fruit juice and the baby moves like crazy . This is a dancer in the womb ...""",AGREE,"""the child moves away to not get stuck by the needle . Its because it feels pain""","""The woman drinks fruit juice and the baby moves like crazy . This is a dancer in the womb ...""",,
17036,4528,"""the child in the womb feels pain .. when you put the needle up there to try to give the child anestesia in the womb , the child moves away to not get stuck by the needle . Its because it feels pain .. this is after 18 weeks . this is a child in the womb ..""","""The woman drinks fruit juice and the baby moves like crazy . This is a dancer in the womb ...""",AGREE,"""the child in the womb feels pain ..""","""This is a dancer in the womb ...""",,
17043,4530,"""I would like to see more conclusive data on the subject but most importantly a REAL plausible solution . I 'm not an expert but it does appear most scientists feel global warming is partly man-made . I do get a little sketched out when I see scientists are trying to restrict research for those that go against the theory . They may have strong arguments but that kinda BS really blows your credibility .""","""I see , when you say `` I 'm not an expert `` do you mean you are n't a climate scientist or do you mean you do n't have the scientific knowledge to discuss this ?""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not an expert but it does appear most scientists feel global warming is partly man-made .""","""I see , when you say `` I 'm not an expert `` do you mean you are n't a climate scientist or do you mean you do n't have the scientific knowledge to discuss this ?""",,
17054,4533,"""Abram , I would suggest you study cognitive processes and the evolution of both the human body and the human mind . We take reality and describe it in our minds and thus form it into abstract concepts which we can operate with . Or , for more fun , just read a few articles on camouflage . You 'll see that you do n't become invisible by looking exactly like your surroundings , but by simply not looking like anything at all to the observer 's eye .""","""Iuris , there is something , I want to say something Zenlike in this statement -- but I am not sure .""",AGREE,"""I would suggest you study cognitive processes and the evolution of both the human body and the human mind . We take reality and describe it in our minds and thus form it into abstract concepts which we can operate with . Or , for more fun , just read a few articles on camouflage .""","""there is something , I want to say something Zenlike in this statement -- but I am not sure .""",,
17056,4534,"""The partial birth abortion is rare , but it is not always used to save the mother 's life . At any rate , I may seem radical , but even if it is to save the mother 's life I think it should be disallowed , as it is a very cruel preocedure . Would you do that to a born baby ? Of course not . It 's very sickening that the so called `` land of the free `` would allow such a murderous procedure to be done .""","""So-called `` Partial Birth `` Abortions are so rare as to be negligible . This ban was just a small step onto taking away a woman 's right to choice . If it were a `` born baby `` then they would n't have to perform the abortion . It would be able to survive in a respirator . There you go again misusing a legal term . You are the sick one for using emotional arguements and ignoring the facts .""",DISAGREE,"""I think it should be disallowed , as it is a very cruel preocedure .""","""There you go again misusing a legal term .""",,
17058,4535,"""Could it not be that skull shape has nothing to do with when a person lived ? ? Surely evolutionists do n't have the nerve to call these 6,000 year-old kow swamp people `` sub-human. `` And could it not be that Kow Swamp was a quasi-variation of homo erectus ?""","""Actually , the only people who I hear talk about `` sub-human `` are creationists . There is the possibility that certain Australian fossils may have descended from H. erectus fossils from Indonesia . And why would a fossil make an `` evolutionist `` nervous ? The idea is really , really dumb .""",DISAGREE,"""Surely evolutionists do n't have the nerve to call these 6,000 year-old kow swamp people `` sub-human. `` And could it not be that Kow Swamp was a quasi-variation of homo erectus ?""","""Actually , the only people who I hear talk about `` sub-human `` are creationists . There is the possibility that certain Australian fossils may have descended from H. erectus fossils from Indonesia . And why would a fossil make an `` evolutionist `` nervous ? The idea is really , really dumb .""",,
17060,4535,"""Could it not be that skull shape has nothing to do with when a person lived ? ? Surely evolutionists do n't have the nerve to call these 6,000 year-old kow swamp people `` sub-human. `` And could it not be that Kow Swamp was a quasi-variation of homo erectus ?""","""Actually , the only people who I hear talk about `` sub-human `` are creationists . There is the possibility that certain Australian fossils may have descended from H. erectus fossils from Indonesia . And why would a fossil make an `` evolutionist `` nervous ? The idea is really , really dumb .""",DISAGREE,"""Surely evolutionists do n't have the nerve to call these 6,000 year-old kow swamp people""","""There is the possibility that certain Australian fossils may have descended from H. erectus fossils""",,
17086,4542,"""Whatever , people losing jobs for saying they beleive in intellegent design . Good ? Bad ?""","""Whatever , people lying by saying that they lost their jobs because they said they believe in Intelligent Design ? Good ? Bad ? Utterly predictable ? http : //www.expelledexposed.com/index.php/the-truth""",DISAGREE,"""Whatever , people losing jobs for saying they beleive in intellegent design . Good ? Bad ?""","""Utterly predictable ? http : //www.expelledexposed.com/index.php/the-truth""",,
17089,4543,"""You tell me what evidence it has and I 'll tell you exactly how it does n't workout .""","""Dream on girl !""",DISAGREE,"""You tell me what evidence it has and I 'll tell you exactly how it does n't workout .""","""Dream on girl !""",,
17091,4543,"""You tell me what evidence it has and I 'll tell you exactly how it does n't workout .""","""Dream on girl !""",DISAGREE,"""I 'll tell you exactly how it does n't workout .""","""on girl !""",,
17101,4547,"""Is it harmful ? Yes more so then moderate alcohol use and worse then smoking""","""I do n't believe that . Give me some proof . Besides , one does not have to smoke marijuana to get high .""",DISAGREE,"""Is it harmful ? Yes""","""I do n't believe that . Give me some proof .""",,
17124,4555,"""No one has tried to factor these things into any calculations .""","""Really ? Have you ever heard of population genetics ? Do you know what Hardy-Weinberg equilibrium is ? Do you actually think that you are so bright that you have insight that generations of biologists and mathematicians do n't . Population genetics is exactly the calculations of how mutatiions spread through populations .""",DISAGREE,"""No one has tried to factor these things into any calculations .""","""Have you ever heard of population genetics ? Population genetics is exactly the calculations of how mutatiions spread through populations .""",,
17128,4556,"""i 'm strong in most subjects , but i have never quite understood science . i apologize .""","""No need . I 'm not exactly a rocket scientist myself .""",AGREE,"""i 'm strong in most subjects , but i have never quite understood science . i apologize .""","""No need . I 'm not exactly a rocket scientist myself .""",,
17134,4565,"""You realized you just bolded a statement saying that science had nothing to do with `` them `` accepting evolution ( a `` material explaination `` ) right ? ROFL , that my friend was terrible science on your part .""","""So did you read his mind to determine exactly why he bolded that particular set of words ? You are the first mind reader I have encountered here . And considering your disdain and rejection of science from cosmology to biology what does it matter if something is terrible science . According to you all science should be terrible . Why do you attempt to use a tool which you reject as being useful ?""",DISAGREE,"""You realized you just bolded a statement ``""","""exactly why he bolded that particular set of words ?""",,
17143,4567,"""Erm .... You 're saying that people do n't try to harm one another over those things ? I suggest you surf youtube for a bit . Rememeber however , that kids are more emotionally unstable than adults . Hormones and guns are n't a good combination .""","""So you 're saying that the ones who 're eligible to carry a gun , those who 're 21 or older , never been convicted of a crime , undergo fingerprinting , pay hundreds of dollars , attend an eight hour course held by the police , pass a firearms safety class , and weight three months to finally get their permit , would intentionally use it as an excuse to murder a teacher over a trivial matter like an unfavorable grade ? Would n't it just be easier , as well as more likely , for an emotionally disturbed student to just illegally bring a gun to school and kill their teacher , rather than waiting for a legal alternative to commit murder and go to prison anyway ?""",DISAGREE,"""'re saying that people do n't try to harm one another over those things ?""","""would intentionally use it as an excuse to murder a teacher over a trivial matter like an unfavorable grade ?""",,
17181,4577,"""Nice try . If America was an Ally to Germany during WWII , to this day you would n't forgive US Citizens no matter what excuse they have .""","""I think what he meant to say was , `` I can see Finland from my basement. ``""",AGREE,"""If America was an Ally to Germany during WWII , to this day you would n't forgive US Citizens""","""I think what he meant to say was , `` I can see Finland from my basement. ``""",,
17191,4580,"""There are certainly other theories , but the big bang is the only one supported by the evidence .""","""So , you consider a so called theory which allows a 10 billion year gap out of an alleged potential 10 to 20 billion year age for the occurrence to be the most credible theory ? And is actually supported by evidence ? If they have any evidence , why the 10 billion year gap for wiggle room ? No wonder you accept evolution as a rational possibility . The fact is , they have no credible evidence at all as the big bang is nothing more than a deduction based on theoretical mathematical equations which can neither be confirmed or verified . Just read the link and consider the factors cosmologists must consider before even doing the math required to come up with an age . Now consider how skewed the outcome must be if they are incorrectly interpreting even one aspect of the info they are relying on for the equations which result in an age . Any errors in those results and the out equations are useless . Thus , the 10 billion year gap in their cosmological guessing game . How Old is the Universe ? Now consider the creator of the big bang theory itself . Edwin Hubble proposed the big bang as a possible beginning of the Universe based on the perceived expansion of the universe from a tiny central singularity back in 1929 . Since then it has become the holy grail of the scientific community in explaining how Time and Space began . http : //www.umich.edu/~gs265/bigbang.htm This theory is made up of nothing more than the imaginings of a young cosmologist back in 1929 yet has been adopted as a rational theory by the scientific community as if they are a bunch of lemmings who will grasp at any explanation which does n't claim that God did it .""",DISAGREE,"""There are certainly other theories , but the big bang is the only one supported by the evidence .""","""So , you consider a so called theory which allows a 10 billion year gap out of an alleged potential 10 to 20 billion year age for the occurrence to be the most credible theory ? And is actually supported by evidence ?""",,
17193,4581,"""And for cancer""","""No , that is just sin in general""",DISAGREE,"""And for cancer""","""No , that is just sin in general""",,
17194,4581,"""And for cancer""","""No , that is just sin in general""",DISAGREE,"""And for cancer""","""No , that is just sin in general""",,
17254,4597,"""They are safer . The 300 gun deaths per year rate has dropped since then . Let 's have a little reality intrude on the gun porn fantasies . Only 13 % of Swiss homes ever had an Army-issue weapon in them , Militia service extending only from age 20 to age 30 , and the ammunition was stored in a sealed pack , with severe punishments for the seal being broken .""","""Gee the thimble wearing comic relief slides in .""",DISAGREE,"""They are safer""","""Gee the thimble wearing comic relief slides in .""",,
17310,4617,"""So they ( pro-life peeps ) say abortion is murder . Of course , you can only murder people . So their rule is that fetuses ( feti ? ) are people also . But then they ca n't explain why fetuses are n't listed on the US Census , or why there is n't a funeral every time a woman has a miscarriage . Pretty much , along with the rules of having children , you would have to acquire the birth certificate during conception , you would have to pay taxes for children , even if you 're only pregnant , etc . Or am I missing something ? Care to clarify , anybody who disagrees ?""","""Yes , you are missing something . How come age does n't start at conception ? How come when babies are born they are n't 9 months old instead of , well , seconds old .""",AGREE,"""their rule is that fetuses ( feti ? ) are people also fetuses are n't listed on the US Census have to acquire the birth certificate during conception""","""missing something How come age does n't start at conception ?""",,
17318,4618,"""When that did n't work , they tried to pass laws that required `` equal time `` for the teaching of fundamentalist Christian mythology as science ( `` Creation science `` ) .""","""So , does this mean Creation Science is different from creationism ?""",DISAGREE,"""to pass laws that required `` equal time `` for the teaching of fundamentalist Christian mythology as science ( `` Creation science `` ) .""","""So , does this mean Creation Science is different from creationism ?""",,
17325,4619,"""I 'd be rather stumped too if someone asked me about a gay marriage petition during a job appointment . Leave it to Mass . to call discrimination anything that does n't support a certain viewpoint . What a hypocritical state .""","""Yeah . They should just be more consistent and have no hypocrisy in a stance that just discriminates against gays ... < end sarcasm >""",AGREE,"""I 'd be rather stumped too if someone asked me about a gay marriage What a hypocritical state .""","""Yeah . They should just be more consistent and have no hypocrisy""",,
17324,4619,"""I 'd be rather stumped too if someone asked me about a gay marriage petition during a job appointment . Leave it to Mass . to call discrimination anything that does n't support a certain viewpoint . What a hypocritical state .""","""Yeah . They should just be more consistent and have no hypocrisy in a stance that just discriminates against gays ... < end sarcasm >""",AGREE,"""I 'd be rather stumped too if someone asked me about a gay marriage petition during a job appointment . Leave it to Mass .""","""Yeah . They should just be more consistent and have no hypocrisy in a stance that just discriminates against gays ...""",,
17329,4620,"""As I said , you do n't have a clue . You are SO wrong . These are quotes from Origin of Species . I doubt they will help you , but at least you will have the straight information for your denial .""","""So the `` Origin of Species `` has more information for theistic evolutionists than the Bible does ? ? Does theistic evolution believe in Satan ?""",DISAGREE,"""As I said , you do n't have a clue . You are SO wrong . These are quotes from Origin of Species . I doubt they will help you , but at least you will have the straight information for your denial .""","""So the `` Origin of Species `` has more information for theistic evolutionists than the Bible does ? ?""",,
17332,4620,"""As I said , you do n't have a clue . You are SO wrong . These are quotes from Origin of Species . I doubt they will help you , but at least you will have the straight information for your denial .""","""So the `` Origin of Species `` has more information for theistic evolutionists than the Bible does ? ? Does theistic evolution believe in Satan ?""",DISAGREE,"""These are quotes from Origin of Species . I doubt they will help you""","""So the `` Origin of Species `` has more information for theistic evolutionists than the Bible does ?""",,
17340,4622,"""For example , I do n't believe for a minute that the oil deposits were formed from the liquified remains of mass dinosaur graves from 65 million years ago , but I do trust and respect the scientifically proven techniques for locating and assessing the quality of that oil .""","""But again , that requires a YEC to contradict their belief in the flood . As earlier stated , previous YECs have gone into the field , looked at the data and evidence and abandoned YEC as it makes absolutely no sense . YEC 'science ' is not used in hydrocarbon production .""",DISAGREE,"""I do trust and respect the scientifically proven techniques for locating and assessing the quality of that oil .""","""As earlier stated , previous YECs have gone into the field""",,
17344,4622,"""For example , I do n't believe for a minute that the oil deposits were formed from the liquified remains of mass dinosaur graves from 65 million years ago , but I do trust and respect the scientifically proven techniques for locating and assessing the quality of that oil .""","""But again , that requires a YEC to contradict their belief in the flood . As earlier stated , previous YECs have gone into the field , looked at the data and evidence and abandoned YEC as it makes absolutely no sense . YEC 'science ' is not used in hydrocarbon production .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't believe for a minute that the oil deposits were formed from the liquified remains of mass dinosaur graves from 65 million years ago""","""that requires a YEC to contradict their belief in the flood . YEC 'science ' is not used in hydrocarbon production .""",,
17348,4623,"""A very bad thing all around ... I would like to see how this turns out .""","""Well , the Judge made a ruling late last week that she should not be revived should her breathing stop again , backing the medical assessment of her doctors : http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3723656.stm And yes , very sad . Another dilemma posed by what has become possible through ever advancing medical science .....""",AGREE,"""A very bad thing all around ... I would like to see how this turns out .""","""Another dilemma posed by what has become possible through ever advancing medical science""",,
17352,4624,"""If you 're in America , then go back to Britain where people like you belong .""","""I think he 's referring to intelligent , educated people with a good sense of humour ( good looking too ) who are n't paranoid beyond reason , can spell correctly and know what real beer is . Smiley""",DISAGREE,"""If you 're in America , then go back to Britain where people like you belong .""","""I think he 's referring to intelligent , educated people with a good sense of humour ( good looking too ) who are n't paranoid beyond reason , can spell correctly and know what real beer is .""",,
17354,4624,"""If you 're in America , then go back to Britain where people like you belong .""","""I think he 's referring to intelligent , educated people with a good sense of humour ( good looking too ) who are n't paranoid beyond reason , can spell correctly and know what real beer is . Smiley""",DISAGREE,"""then go back to Britain where people like you belong""","""referring to intelligent , educated people with a good sense of humour""",,
17369,4627,"""Carbon 's half life is too short . Bottom line - it does not go back far enough .""","""Yes . That 's it .""",AGREE,"""Carbon 's half life is too short . Bottom line - it does not go back far enough .""","""Yes . That 's it .""",,
17374,4627,"""Carbon 's half life is too short . Bottom line - it does not go back far enough .""","""Yes . That 's it .""",AGREE,"""Carbon 's half life is too short""","""Yes""",,
17408,4633,"""The fact that restricting access to abortion has tragic side effects does not , in itself , show that the restrictions are unjustified , since murder is wrong regardless of the consequences of prohibiting it ;""","""Hmm , while she is right at the first point , the second does n't follow .""",DISAGREE,"""The fact that restricting access to abortion has tragic side effects does not , in itself , show that the restrictions are unjustified""","""while she is right at the first point , the second does n't follow .""",,
17436,4639,"""the differences between humans and all other members of the animal kingdom are near irreconcilable . chimps really dont even come close . in fact , humans are capable of putting habits into other animals ( and other humans ) that actually can override their natural instincts .""","""So what if overriding other instincts is an instinc ? ( and there you go with natural again , why are human instincts not natural instincts ? ) Pretty much everything we do is instinctual .""",DISAGREE,"""fact , humans are capable of putting habits into other animals ( and other humans ) that actually can override their natural instincts .""","""what if overriding other instincts is an instinc ?""",,
17445,4642,"""if there is no evidence that adam and eve or eden ever existed , did man really ever commit a sin that caused all of mankind to be fallen ?""","""Yes . The better question is , did it happen just like in Genises ? I do n't think so .""",DISAGREE,"""did man really ever commit a sin that caused all of mankind to be fallen""","""did it happen just like in Genises ? I do n't think so .""",,
17455,4645,"""Did n't I just do that above ? Or is it beyond you to comprehend that ! I see no reason to wallow in the mud with you beyond proving my point .""","""Just so we 're clear here , your idea of `` proving your point `` that I 'm dishonest is to call me dishonest . Yeah , not quite how it works outside of Archie-land . Sorry .""",DISAGREE,"""I see no reason to wallow in the mud with you beyond proving my point .""","""proving your point `` that I 'm dishonest is to call me dishonest""",,
17460,4647,"""So if same-sex relationships are legally recognized as `` marriage , `` the idea of marriage as a sexually exclusive and faithful relationship will be dealt a serious blow . Adding monogamy and faithfulness to the other pillars of marriage that have already fallen will have overwhelmingly negative consequences for Americans ' physical and mental health .""","""See above . Whether a couple is or is n't monogomous is not for you to determine or worry about . And speak for yourself if you do n't mind . This member of the American public 's mental health is just fine thank you very much . If gay marriage impacts YOU that much , well that sounds like your problem .""",DISAGREE,"""the idea of marriage as a sexually exclusive and faithful relationship will be dealt a serious blow""","""a couple is or is n't monogomous is not for you to determine or worry about""",,
17463,4648,"""I am intrigued to see that both sides have to be black or white . Either the creationist says the Bible is true down to the last detail or the anti-creationists say it is totally false and absolutely nothing as described ever happened .""","""While that may be true for some - perhaps even many - I was just responding to the OP . That said , I think it foolish to claim/believe that the bible is all wrong . I consider myself an atheist , but I fully recognize - and expect - that much , perhaps even most of the events mentioned in the bible actually occurred . I do , however , also realize that the books of the bible were written at a much different time , that even real events were likely embellished , in some cases to the point of absurdity ( knocking down walls with great shouts and the like ... ) . Although I do not and will not pretend to be a biblical scholar or historian of any sort , it seems to me that the bible could be seen as a biased , mythology-laden chronicle of the history of a particular group of people . Interesting historically , but not very reliable as a guide to the true events of the time , and even less so for a guide to moral behavior and describing a Universe-creating Deity .""",DISAGREE,"""Either the creationist says the Bible is true down to the last detail or the anti-creationists""","""Although I do not and will not pretend to be a biblical scholar or historian of any sort , it seems to me that the bible could be seen as a biased""",,
17518,4672,"""What you say about a nose is of course an aesthetic judgment and entirely subjective . But we are not talking about noses here ; it 's the idea of perfection we have in focus . Ideas are internal to the thinker and it is merely our judgment that relates to the external world . So we could have a perfect idea of a perfect being but still have faults in our judgement . Having an idea of perfection does not imply that the thinker is perfect in some way .""","""yes , and i suppose an idea of perfection can exist , in a thinker 's mind , and subjective to the thinker 's standards of perfection . i could also point out that an imperfect thinker , with no reference or standard of `` objective `` perfection , is incapable of having a perfect idea of anything . therefore the argument falls apart at the first premise , since an `` idea of perfection `` can not exist , unless the thinker himself is perfect , which would make him God by his own definition .""",DISAGREE,"""What you say about a nose is of course an aesthetic judgment and entirely Having an idea of perfection does not imply that the thinker is perfect in some way .""","""yes , and i suppose an idea of perfection can exist , in a thinker 's mind , and subjective to the thinker 's standards of perfection .""",,
17541,4678,"""`` ( 16 . ) Assault weapons don & # 8217 ; t need to be banned because they are 'functionally identical ' to standard hunting rifles and shotguns , and thus not genuine military weapons . They also shouldn & # 8217 ; t be banned because the 'militia ' described in the 2nd Amendment needs them to defend us against a tyrannical government , and standard hunting rifles or shotguns would never be up to the task .""","""The Supreme Court has declared that the Second Amendment is n't about hunting , so this argument is dead and moot . I 'd also suggest that you and this article author do a little research and get with the times . The AR-15 has officially been adopted as the hunting rifle of the 21st century . Remington now makes a version , the R-15 , marketed exclusively toward hunters .""",DISAGREE,"""Assault weapons don t need to be banned because they are 'functionally identical ' to standard hunting rifles and shotguns , and thus not genuine military weapons .""","""The Supreme Court has declared that the Second Amendment is n't about hunting , so this argument is dead and moot .""",,
17553,4681,"""When It Comes to Enabling the Terrorism of Gun Deaths in America , No One Beats the NRA | BuzzFlash.org statesman.com And now we have a nutter in Washington State who assassinated four police officers while they were getting ready for their next shift in a coffee shop . The NRA is the father and mother of pure anarchy and lawlessness .""","""So Simone , if the shooter had instead driven his Toyota Prius into a crowd , killing many as a result , would you call for banning Toyota Priuses ?""",DISAGREE,"""The NRA is the father and mother of pure anarchy and lawlessness .""","""So Simone , if the shooter had instead driven his Toyota Prius into a crowd , killing many as a result , would you call for banning Toyota Priuses ?""",,
17558,4682,"""I like this concept . It seems to do a good job of explaining how microbes adapt so quickly to antibiotics , for example . Our blood cells multiply fairly quickly , but the genetic makeup does not change from one lymphocyte `` generation `` to the next . Yet we know that over our lifetimes they `` learn `` to produce new types of defenses against diseases . These adaptations are clearly not genetic , but they are a form of micro-evolution .""","""Actually , they are genetic . Our cells have receptors which are triggered by exposure to pathogens ; that 's how we `` learn `` to fight off a disease . And not everyone has the same receptors , which ones you posses is a genetic trait . It 's one of the reasons that Native Americans were so vulnerable to European diseases , they had n't evolved the receptors that would have enabled them to build up defences against the diseases the Europeans had lived with for generations . If your hypothesis was correct we would n't see different populations having different reactions to the same disease .""",DISAGREE,"""but they are a form of micro-evolution .""","""If your hypothesis was correct we would n't see different populations having different reactions to the same disease .""",,
17562,4683,"""I do n't think all science is a sham""","""Facts to support your denial are not in evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think all science is a sham""","""Facts to support your denial are not in evidence .""",,
17563,4683,"""I do n't think all science is a sham""","""Facts to support your denial are not in evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think all science is a sham""","""Facts to support your denial are not in evidence""",,
17570,4685,"""I am rather passionate on this subject . My mother died at the age of 58 in 1963 , after several years of declining health .""","""Then you are probably a bit older than I . My mother was 45 in 1963 , the year I entered the Army . My mother will be 86 next month and we have a party planned with her older sister , nieces , grand nephews , grandchildren , and great grand children . I am so sorry for your early loss . My father died at 73 from complications after a `` successful `` surgery . It was still difficult .""",AGREE,"""am rather passionate on this subject . My mother died at the age of 58 in 1963 , after several years of declining health .""","""Then you are probably a bit older than I . My mother was 45 in 1963 , the year I entered the Army .""",,
17574,4686,"""You would think someone of his intellect would have more sense , would n't you ? Let 's just protest this disgraceful train of thought , shall we ? Close the minds of children to think only what we want them to think . Hold on ... that 's the same thing that you 're saying religion is doing ...""","""Well , if intelligent design can come up with evidence , and a way to TEST it , rather than just saying 'This is too complicated , an intelligence must have done it ' , then maybe scientists would take it seriously .""",DISAGREE,"""You would think someone of his intellect would have more sense , would n't you ?""","""Well , if intelligent design can come up with evidence , and a way to TEST it , rather than just saying 'This is too complicated ,""",,
17582,4688,"""From here : Any move towards ending this absurd storm-in-a-teacup has to be welcome .""","""Well of course . This spiritually dead church which exists to serve Man , but not God , must compromise biblical principles in order to attempt to preserve membership in an ever expanding secular humanist society . Just remember that no matter how many churches abandon the spiritual truths outlined in Gods Word in these last days , it does nothing to diminish or nullify that truth .""",DISAGREE,"""Any move towards ending this absurd storm-in-a-teacup has to be welcome .""","""no matter how many churches abandon the spiritual truths outlined in Gods Word in these last days , it does nothing to diminish or nullify that truth .""",,
17583,4688,"""From here : Any move towards ending this absurd storm-in-a-teacup has to be welcome .""","""Well of course . This spiritually dead church which exists to serve Man , but not God , must compromise biblical principles in order to attempt to preserve membership in an ever expanding secular humanist society . Just remember that no matter how many churches abandon the spiritual truths outlined in Gods Word in these last days , it does nothing to diminish or nullify that truth .""",DISAGREE,"""Any move towards ending this absurd storm-in-a-teacup has to be welcome .""","""no matter how many churches abandon the spiritual truths outlined in Gods Word in these last days , it does nothing to diminish or nullify that truth .""",,
17584,4689,"""3 And God said , Let there be light : and there was light . 4 And God saw the light , that it was good : and God divided the light from the darkness . 5 And God called the light Day , and the darkness he called Night . And the evening and the morning were the first day .""","""After God had `` created `` the lights , that means when the lights ca n't pass through an non-transparet object , there 's a shadow and gone `` darKness `` , but the `` one `` who wrote the bible should be God but seemed did n't know this phenomenon , that `` writer `` said : God had to `` divide `` the light from darkness . That prove : - the writer was just someone who did n't have that scientific knowledge in the old days . Do you agree ? ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""3 And God said , Let there be light : and there was light . 4 And God saw the light , that it was good : and God divided the light from the darkness .""","""After God had `` created `` the lights , that means when the lights ca n't pass through an non-transparet object , there 's a shadow and gone `` darKness ``""",,
17591,4690,"""I do n't think all science is a sham ... however I do believe that anything that 's called a `` fact `` should be testable and/or observable ... yet the types of mutations that are required for cumulative selection have never been observed . The fact that there are many in the scientific community who are now looking at regulatory genes should tell you something -- the old way does n't hold water . And this is because it is now known that body parts are not made up by placing one gene on top of another . People can still be atheists -- they just ca n't blame it on neodarwinsim .""","""Again , why would `` some of the world ’ s greatest minds working on and devising ways to keep it afloat so that the vast majority of the population can continue to be snow-blinded ? ``""",DISAGREE,"""People can still be atheists -- they just ca n't blame it on neodarwinsim""","""why would `` some of the world ’ s greatest minds working on and devising ways to keep it afloat""",,
17598,4692,"""Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""Yes , many people I feel are that arrogant .""",AGREE,"""Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""Yes , many people I feel are that arrogant .""",,
17606,4694,"""I think the argument that a woman has the right to determine what is done with her bodily resources during pregnancy lacks justification . For those who do : Do you assume that this is an absolute right and the moral good at any time and in every circumstance ( even before the 14th amendment existed and even in countries where it does not apply ) ? Do you agree that breast milk is a bodily resource of the mother ? If the answers to these questions are yes : Imagine a time when artificial formula did not exist . According to this reasoning it would be legitimate for a woman who suddenly decided she did not want to donate her bodily resources to withhold nutrition until the infant died . In fact , she should be able to dispose of that tissue some call infants through any of the same means as done in abortions ( that would be sticking scissors in the head , burning , ect ) . Infanticide would be a moral option for any woman who does not wish to donate bodily fluids to her newborn  “ parasite ” and does not have access to formula at any moment because of various reasons . I am sure there are women in the world today who do not have access to formula . Are these women justified in deeming these babies as life unworthy of life and disposing of them ?""","""A minor point , but your opening question is confined to `` during pregnancy `` and your concluding scenario is confined to childcare . The baby has no need of breast milk or a substitute formula until it is a breathing human . In that case , the mother ( at least in the USA ) is obligated to feed it , whether she uses her own milk or a substitute . I do not understand the interest in things before the 14th Amendment . * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * The 14th Amendment : Section 1 . All persons born or naturalized in the United States , and subject to the jurisdiction thereof , are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside . No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States ; nor shall any State deprive any person of life , liberty , or property , without due process of law ; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws . Section 2 . Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers , counting the whole number of persons in each State , excluding Indians not taxed . But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States , Representatives in Congress , the Executive and Judicial officers of a State , or the members of the Legislature thereof , is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State , being twenty-one years of age , ( See Note 15 ) and citizens of the United States , or in any way abridged , except for participation in rebellion , or other crime , the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State . Section 3 . No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress , or elector of President and Vice President , or hold any office , civil or military , under the United States , or under any State , who , having previously taken an oath , as a member of Congress , or as an officer of the United States , or as a member of any State legislature , or as an executive or judicial officer of any State , to support the Constitution of the United States , shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same , or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof . But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House , remove such disability . Section 4 . The validity of the public debt of the United States , authorized by law , including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion , shall not be questioned . But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States , or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave ; but all such debts , obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void . Section 5 . The Congress shall have power to enforce , by appropriate legislation , the provisions of this article . * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * This has little to do with a mother 's obligations and rights regarding her children . It does prohibit states from denying rights , but it says nothing of a mother 's milk . States do have laws against deliberately starving children .""",DISAGREE,"""I think the argument that a woman has the right to determine what is done with her bodily resources during pregnancy lacks justification""","""A minor point , but your opening question is confined to `` during pregnancy `` and your concluding scenario is confined to childcare""",,
17611,4695,"""and to say that some christian denomonations believe and accept evolution then i also must ?""","""No , you obviously are not reading the arguments in their contexts . I never said you should believe anything . I simply pointed out that Cali 's statement about MOST Christians believing in a literal Genesis was false . That was my only point .""",DISAGREE,"""some christian denomonations believe and accept evolution""","""obviously are not reading the arguments in their contexts .""",,
17610,4695,"""and to say that some christian denomonations believe and accept evolution then i also must ?""","""No , you obviously are not reading the arguments in their contexts . I never said you should believe anything . I simply pointed out that Cali 's statement about MOST Christians believing in a literal Genesis was false . That was my only point .""",DISAGREE,"""some christian denomonations believe and accept evolution then i also must ?""","""No , you obviously are not reading the arguments in their contexts""",,
17625,4699,"""Abortion very often is touted as an economic solution for poor women , i.e. , `` Black women. `` Strident , pro-abortion feminists cry for abortion as a `` right `` for which they must fight to keep . Unfortunately , this misleading notion has been embraced by some people in the Black community as a civil right .""","""And my favourite ! Contraception does n't work kids ! It 's all a lie ! http : //www.abortionfacts.com/online_ ... g % 20pregnancy ? -Wez""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion very often is touted as an economic solution for poor women""","""And my favourite ! Contraception does n't work kids ! It 's all a lie !""",,
17627,4699,"""Abortion very often is touted as an economic solution for poor women , i.e. , `` Black women. `` Strident , pro-abortion feminists cry for abortion as a `` right `` for which they must fight to keep . Unfortunately , this misleading notion has been embraced by some people in the Black community as a civil right .""","""And my favourite ! Contraception does n't work kids ! It 's all a lie ! http : //www.abortionfacts.com/online_ ... g % 20pregnancy ? -Wez""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion touted as an economic solution pro-abortion""","""And my favourite ! Contraception does n't work kids !""",,
17644,4704,"""Apparently , you have five questions . If by 'ability for inward perspective ' you imply the ability to look at one 's self , it is incongruent to say you are leary of our ability 'to think of life from a gay perspective ' . What you are asking is for people to see your troubles from your perspective ... hardly possible for many . Yes . Were I a logical gay man , I would accept the fact that I can not marry a man due to the definition of marriage . I would accept that fact and continue to demand that all legally joined couples share the same benefits now given to married couples .""","""You say you can not see it from the gay perspective , then you speak from that perspective as a gay man . This is confusing . As a heterosexual , if you are one , would you give up those rights and let gays have the rights ?""",AGREE,"""for inward perspective the ability to look at one 's self""","""can not see it from the gay perspective let gays have the rights ?""",,
17673,4719,"""Let 's not confuse our readers . supersport is not saying it 's evolution ; he 's saying that `` evolutionists `` say that it 's evolution . It should be clear now to the readers that scientists recognized perfectly well that this is an example of plasticity . He 's been avoiding this challenge for months . It should be really easy to do if he were correct , yet ... nothing . Of course , but supersport has never been one to give any weight to evidence ...""","""Peppered moths simply emerged from the egg according to background ... their `` evolution `` had nothing to do with random mutations or natural selection . Butterflies exhibit the same ability ... they can emerge with specific wing variations/markings according to predators and other environmental influences . There is no selection . http : //ourfcs.friendscentral.org/mot ... yphenism1.html ( see bottom picture ) http : //unisci.com/stories/20021/0313021.htm The authors note that what 's not known about wing patterns in butterflies are the genetic mechanisms that result in the great variety of patterns that exist and an understanding of how those mechanisms have evolved through time yea ... no kidding .""",DISAGREE,"""It should be clear now to the readers that scientists recognized perfectly well that this is an example of plasticity""","""The authors note that what 's not known about wing patterns in butterflies are the genetic mechanisms that result in the great variety of patterns that exist""",,
17685,4722,"""The coelacanth , according to fossil records , and according to evolutionists , allegedly went extinct millions and millions of years ago . Until they were found alive . Coelacanth - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia As if this should be any surprise . The theory of evolution mindset once again contradicts observable science .""","""Surely the theory of evolution can not predict whether a species is extinct or not ! I thought that crocodiles and alligators were in about the same state as they were millions of years ago and that was because thier habitat did not require them to change therefore the odd slight mutations that gain the advantage and lead to change was of no advantage . If the coelacanth 's habitat was no condusive to change then the same would apply .""",DISAGREE,"""The theory of evolution mindset once again contradicts observable science .""","""If the coelacanth 's habitat was no condusive to change then the same would apply .""",,
17691,4723,"""A good point . It 's hard to take posts from Rev . Hellhound and Patrick Henry seriously when they depend so much on propaganda from biased web sites .""","""Oh give it a rest ... Just because you have the attention span of a lemur does not mean I am posting `` propaganda `` Kelvin will vouch for the depth I have contributed in the past ... So if you are so willing to violate my civil rights will YOU be coming to get my guns or will you be sending someone elses child to do your nazi dirty work ?""",DISAGREE,"""It 's hard to take posts from Rev . Hellhound and Patrick Henry seriously when they depend so much on propaganda from biased web sites .""","""Just because you have the attention span of a lemur does not mean I am posting `` propaganda ``""",,
17700,4725,"""The poor ca n't afford it and the rich do n't want it .""","""So let 's just kill them and be done with it . Is that what you 're saying ?""",AGREE,"""The poor ca n't afford it and the rich do n't want it .""","""So let 's just kill them and be done with it . Is that what you 're saying ?""",,
17705,4726,"""No they do n't . We did n't have a tyrannical society back in the 1830s when without a doubt personal autonomy did n't exist for some . The thing is , you do n't have absolute personal autonomy now either . And it still does n't answer my question about where the right came from , you just said there had to be one .""","""It needs to come with life to make life meaningful . To have no control of your body - like rape , like an abusive relationship . I would rather be dead than go through it again .""",DISAGREE,"""We did n't have a tyrannical society back in the a doubt personal autonomy did n't exist for some . , you do n't have absolute personal autonomy now either .""","""I would rather be dead than go through it again .""",,
17708,4726,"""No they do n't . We did n't have a tyrannical society back in the 1830s when without a doubt personal autonomy did n't exist for some . The thing is , you do n't have absolute personal autonomy now either . And it still does n't answer my question about where the right came from , you just said there had to be one .""","""It needs to come with life to make life meaningful . To have no control of your body - like rape , like an abusive relationship . I would rather be dead than go through it again .""",DISAGREE,"""And it still does n't answer my question about where the right came from""","""To have no control of your body - like rape , like an abusive relationship""",,
17709,4727,"""Any evolutionists care to explain this phenomenon ? How can this near-miracle happen without intelligence ?""","""RoflÂ… What were they supposed to do if they stayed in the egg longer with more time to feed off of it ? Shrink ?""",DISAGREE,"""evolutionists""","""egg longer""",,
17729,4731,"""If you mean that , literally , `` most `` people stayed away , then I suppose you 're right . But , if that is what you really meant then it is a profoundly weak statement because `` most `` people `` stay away `` from all movies on any given weekend . In comparison to other movies , however , I 'd say that Capitalism : A Love Story did quite well for a documentary : it tied for # 6 in terms of total box-office sales this past weekend , and it was # 4 in terms of per-theater box-office sales . More importantly , however , I 'd say that box-office sales are NOT a good quality measure for documentaries in the first place !""","""Oh , I do n't know about that . March of the Penguins was a box office success ANF an Oscar winner for best documentary . Calling any of Moore 's movies `` a documentary `` requires one to employ some artistic license with the term and some slight of hand .""",DISAGREE,"""however , I 'd say that Capitalism : A Love Story did quite well for a documentary :""","""Calling any of Moore 's movies `` a documentary `` requires one to employ some artistic license with the term and some slight of hand .""",,
17734,4732,"""I have indeed unlocked the secret code of deception of the scietific underworld . It 's an ugly place where the facts are concealed by complete and utter nonsense . It 's a sleight-of-hand maneuver that all of science is evidently in on ... and it 's a tactic that Satan himself would be proud of .""","""Anyone else laugh out loud when they read this ? supersport- Maybe I 've missed it , but have you ever bothered to explain what you think scientists ' motives are behind this absurd and overly complex conspiracy you 've made up ?""",DISAGREE,"""facts are concealed by complete""","""Anyone else laugh out loud""",,
17739,4740,"""and Gould himself : UNDIRECTED . In a sense , the specter of directed variability threatens Darwinism even more seriously than any putative failure of the other two postulates . Insufficient variation stalls natural selection ; saltation deprives selection of a creative role but still calls upon Darwin ’ s mechanism as a negative force . With directed variation , however , natural selection can be bypassed entirely . If adaptive pressures automatically trigger heritable variation in favored directions , then trends can proceed under regimes of random mortality ; natural selection , acting as a negative force , can , at most , accelerate the change . ( Gould 2002 : 145 )""","""See above . I wo n't bother trying to de-quote-mine until you can provide evidnece that variation is directed .""",DISAGREE,"""the specter of directed variability threatens Darwinism even more seriously""","""provide evidnece that variation is directed .""",,
17752,4742,"""frankly the idea that the repeal of the AWB had any effect at all is ludicrous . The AWB was a piece of legislative garbage that was passed as a feel good measure . No more , no less . The entire thing was idiotic . I have an extensive collection of guns . Everythign from dueling pistols to a minigun . I could not always tell what was a `` pre ban `` assault weapon and a `` post ban `` non assault weapon . You had to check the serial numbers to be sure , then check the manufacturers tech sheet to see where that serial number fell . I do think that it is interesting that the Mexicans are blaming the US for their violence problem . The Fully automatic AK-47s used in the beverly hills shootout were smuggled into the country from Mexico . Apparently the mexicans are exporting full auto weaponry and importing semi auto . The truth probably lies somewhere in between . There is no question that mexico has a SERIOUS violence problem . Most mexican cartels used automatic weapons in the 80 's and 90 's , then their use fell off ... probably as they learned that automatic weapons were a good way to chew up all your ammo and not accomplish a damn thing . Now they are downgrading to lighter stuff , and many of those lighter weapons are supplied by the US .""","""Yes , the flow of illegal guns may go both ways . But the article says that 90 % of illegal guns seized by Mexican authorities come from the US . And these assault weapons are easily converted into machine guns . Gadgets that accomplish such a purpose are sold at gun shows . From the previously quoted article : `` When asked if he had any of the deadlier automatics , he led a reporter to a nearby table . '' There , James Ramey of Little Rock , Ark. , was selling Hellfire and Autoburst trigger activation devices , $ 30 gadgets that turn any assault rifle into a rat-a-tatting machine gun. `` I think much of the problem could be solved by extending the Brady background check to all gun sales . It does n't make sense not to . It 's kind of like the law requiring people to get a doctor 's prescription to purchase certain kinds of drugs but then having a `` drug show `` where people can purchase any kind of prescription drug without a doctor 's prescription .""",DISAGREE,"""The AWB was a piece of legislative garbage that was passed as a feel good measure . No more , no less . The entire thing was idiotic""","""Yes , the flow of illegal guns may go both ways""",,
17756,4743,"""Senior police officers have been warning for several months that a growing number of teenagers in big cities are becoming involved in gun crime . The age of victims and suspects has fallen over the past three years as the availability of firearms in some cities has risen .  “ Illegal firearms have become increasingly accessible to younger offenders who appear more likely to use these firearms recklessly ,  ” a report on gun crime commissioned by the Home Office cautioned last year .""","""Oh man . That is what the article first article says too ! Shotguns for £50 : study reveals weapons culture""",AGREE,"""growing number of teenagers in big cities are becoming involved in gun crime availability of firearms in some cities has risen""","""That is what the article first article says too !""",,
17767,4745,""".... The gun rights organizations did nothing wrong and neither did the sponsors or even the guy who rented them the MG . It was completely the fault of the person supervising the child ; his father . The fact is all gun rights organizations stress safety first , it 's not their fault some XXXXX failed to follow procedures .""","""So suddenly , being supervised by not one , but two law-abiding qualified ( in one case an instructor ! ) adults is not safe ? Who administered the training and qualifications of the instructor ? Who drew up the regulations which allowed this to happen ? Who pays lip service to `` safety `` in the use of their deadly toys ? We constantly hear that only criminals with guns are a threat , and the law-abiding gun owner is a paragon of rational safe behaviour . This is all too obviously not so .""",DISAGREE,"""The gun rights organizations did nothing wrong and neither did the sponsors or even the guy who rented them the MG""","""Who administered the training and qualifications of the instructor ? Who drew up the regulations which allowed this to happen ?""",,
17781,4751,"""2 Kings 15:16 16 At that time Menahem , starting out from Tirzah , attacked Tiphsah and everyone in the city and its vicinity , because they refused to open their gates . He sacked Tiphsah and ripped open all the pregnant women .""","""This one certainly seems to be out of context , as reading a mere 2 verses farther yields the statement that `` [ Menahem ] did what was evil in the sight of the Lord . Are you then suggesting that what Menahem did was wrong ? I would agree . And so , apparently , does God .""",DISAGREE,"""He sacked Tiphsah and ripped open all the pregnant women .""","""Are you then suggesting that what Menahem did was wrong ? I would agree . And so , apparently , does God .""",,
17796,4771,"""Even though the Revision argument may have merit , it is not what the focus should be on . Proponents of marraige equality should be getting the message out that ballot box discrimination is not OK . This is the argument that should be taken to the courts . It should be made clear that civil rights are not a voting matter , and that even if 90 % of the people voted to ban gay marriage , targeting a historically vulnerable group and stripping them of a fundamental right is not something that should be put to a vote . That 's what the courts are for , to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority .""","""You make an excellent point , Shooter . While I do n't feel the `` voter referendum `` idea should be abolished completely , there should be limits as to what should and should not ever be put to a simple majority vote , which I feel is like a state being able to cancel out the republican ( little `` r `` ) concept upon which our country is wisely based and revert to mob rule . Whatever the majority of a state 's populace 's preferences or prejudices , they should NOT be allowed to put up for majority vote issues that openly contradict that state 's constitution , as interpreted by those they elected in the first place . ( I 'm speaking California here . I know in some states their Supreme Court judges are appointed -- nevertheless , those that appoint them are elected . ) If they want to vote in new judges , fine . New legislature , fine . But once they 've voted them in , I do n't feel they should be able to go around , gather a few hundred thou signatures , put on the ballot an initiative to negate the rulings , and spend scads of money ( mostly from out of state , yet ! ) to go `` booga booga `` to lie to , mislead and frighten people to overrule the decisions of the people whose legal knowlege and wisdom they voted to abide by in the first place . This voter initiative thing , at least in my state , is seriously flawed .""",AGREE,"""This is the argument that should be taken to the courts . It should be made clear that civil rights are not a voting matter , and that even if 90 % of the people voted to ban gay marriage , targeting a historically vulnerable group and stripping them of a fundamental right is not something that should be put to a vote . That 's what the courts are for , to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority .""","""You make an excellent point , Shooter . While I do n't feel the `` voter referendum `` idea should be abolished completely , there should be limits as to what should and should not ever be put to a simple majority vote , which I feel is like a state being able to cancel out the republican ( little `` r `` ) concept upon which our country is wisely based and revert to mob rule .""",,
17800,4772,"""Rationalization . Either you believe the Bible is correct in every detail or you do n't . The meaning of the verses are quite clear , but you `` interpret `` them to mean what they do not say . Before Copernicus , there was no concept of orbiting planets . And yet you cling to the idea of a flood that covered mountains . The bottom line is that you pick and choose what you will and will not believe . You are quite selective about your Bible belief .""","""I believe the Bible is correct in every detail . The difference is how those who read them choose to interpret their meaning . You , for instance , look at a verse that says the earth can not be moved and take that to mean that the Bible says that the earth does not move PERIOD . I believe that that means that God is powerful enough to keep the earth from simply `` flying out `` of its orbit and rocketing off into space somewhere . Yes , I proudly `` cling `` to the idea that a flood covered the mountains . I believe fully in the ENTIRE Bible ( unlike some people ) and I DO NOT `` pick and choose `` what I believe .""",DISAGREE,"""Either you believe the Bible is correct in every detail or you do n't . The meaning of the verses are quite clear , but you `` interpret ``""","""I believe the Bible is correct in every detail . The difference is how those who read them choose to interpret their meaning .""",,
17813,4776,"""Thats not the question we need to ask . We should be asking `` Would I have done the same thing , given that situation ? `` If enough people answer yes , it is deemed to have been a reasonable course of action . What I heard was that they had caught the guy , and had him pinned onto the floor of the train when one officer shot him at point blank range five times . Which does n't sound reasonable to me .""","""so if for instance enough people think that to exterminate the Jews is good , then it has to be good ? the rule of the mob rules right ?""",AGREE,"""If enough people answer yes , it is deemed to have been a reasonable course of action .""","""so if for instance enough people think that to exterminate the Jews is good , then it has to be good ?""",,
17828,4781,"""An independant perspective does n't make it a good thing . Politicians that propose anti-gun legislation do n't have to live in the real world with those of us that the bill will affect , they should n't be allowed to propose it .""","""Ha , that is just an idiotic perspective . We 'd have no laws ( and many important ones ) if you ca n't make a bill that does n't affect you . Sorry Civil Rights legislation !""",DISAGREE,"""Politicians that propose anti-gun legislation do n't have to live in the real world with those of us that the bill will affect , they should n't be allowed to propose it .""","""that is just an idiotic perspective .""",,
17870,4799,"""Oh , okay , I understand it now . I still think it sounds quick but then again , I 'm not a member of the bird family .""","""Also keep in mind that some changes can happen quickly if you select for a quality that 's already present in the population . Something like beak size will following a bell curve . Most beaks close to average size , some larger than average , some smaller . If pressures change so that those with below average beak size gain some advantage than they can exploit it instantly . From the word go they will be eating better and be more healthy than their big beaked cousins , and so more likely to breed successfully come next breeding season . And if the little beakers are the most successful breeders than we would expect to see alot of little beaks in the next generation . Basically , the genetic variety is already present in the population , so exploiting that variety can happen quickly .""",AGREE,"""bird""","""beak size""",,
17880,4801,"""But they ca n't recognize a kid ? tsk tsk tsk Ah well , just more grist for the brady mill . Just another statistic right sinjin ?""","""Whenever you say , `` tsk tsk tsk `` , I know you got nothin ' .""",DISAGREE,"""But they ca n't recognize a kid""","""Whenever you say , `` tsk tsk tsk `` , I know you got nothin ' .""",,
17890,4803,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason Actually , guns are probably more dangerous per minute of exposure according to this article . http : //www.vahv.org/NEJM-ed.html""","""`` Probably `` is that your feelings on the subject or A scientifically supported statement .""",DISAGREE,"""http : //www.vahv.org/NEJM-ed.html""","""Probably `` is that your feelings on the subject or A scientifically supported statement .""",,
17921,4806,"""It stands to reason there were other perhaps un-related reasons Myers was booted than his objections to the content of the movie .""","""Certainly ... just like how the makers of Expelled have repeatedly refused to publish the interviews in full . It 's not just that PZ and Dawkins object to the content of the movie -- the makers of Expelled do n't want them to be able to object in the first place . It 's always been their favorite argument against PZ to dangle over the head of his criticisms the fact that he has n't even seen the movie . They ca n't pull that one on Dawkins anymore , which is to their disadvantage , but fortunately they managed to spot PZ before it was too late .""",AGREE,"""It stands to reason there were other perhaps un-related reasons Myers was booted than his objections to the content of the movie .""","""Certainly""",,
17932,4807,"""Here in New Hampshire , not known as a bastion of liberalism , Civil Unions passed the state legislature this year . I am now covered under my partner 's state sponsored ( he 's a state worker ) health insurance . We are grateful .""","""And this is a terrific breakthrough . My partner and I are coveered by my company 's health insurance , and the state of Connecticut honors our Civil Union . That being said , I still have to pay tax on my partner 's health insurance as imputed income because the federal government refuses to acknowledge our union . So it has to be marriage . Full and without exception . Civil Unions are not enough when we are treated differently under the law .""",AGREE,"""Civil Unions passed the state legislature this year .""","""this is a terrific breakthrough . My partner and I are coveered by my company 's health insurance ,""",,
17941,4808,"""Abortion in colonial America : Book Review - The Angel of Ashland : Practicing Compassion and Tempting Fate , by Vincent J. Genovese Also , it might be noted : Abortion in early America . [ Women Health . 1979 ] - PubMed Result It is interesting to note that slaves were not permitted abortion because they were chattel , property , and the more they bred the richer their owners might become . So , by many patriarchal religious groups , women are still considered chattel , breeding stock .""","""Oh , boy ... here you come with your anti-religious bigotry rhetoric , who mentioned one thing about religiosity ? C'mon Simone ... let 's coddle those little bats of common sense back under the belfry of reason where they are supposed to roost ... They did n't need laws against it back then because peopel had more human dignity and respect for human life ... and they responded within the realm of decency and basic propriety . It is a shame we actually have to go there ...""",DISAGREE,"""So , by many patriarchal religious groups , women are still considered chattel , breeding stock""","""Oh , boy ... here you come with your anti-religious bigotry rhetoric""",,
17942,4808,"""Abortion in colonial America : Book Review - The Angel of Ashland : Practicing Compassion and Tempting Fate , by Vincent J. Genovese Also , it might be noted : Abortion in early America . [ Women Health . 1979 ] - PubMed Result It is interesting to note that slaves were not permitted abortion because they were chattel , property , and the more they bred the richer their owners might become . So , by many patriarchal religious groups , women are still considered chattel , breeding stock .""","""Oh , boy ... here you come with your anti-religious bigotry rhetoric , who mentioned one thing about religiosity ? C'mon Simone ... let 's coddle those little bats of common sense back under the belfry of reason where they are supposed to roost ... They did n't need laws against it back then because peopel had more human dignity and respect for human life ... and they responded within the realm of decency and basic propriety . It is a shame we actually have to go there ...""",DISAGREE,"""many patriarchal religious groups , women are still considered chattel , breeding stock .""","""They did n't need laws against it back then because peopel had more human dignity and respect for human life ...""",,
17946,4809,"""An `` evolutionist `` or a `` darwinist `` ? Are they merely people who dont follow the ID line ? Or are they those who area of research activley involves evolution , thereby rurling out chemists , physicists , astronomers etc ? or something else entirely ?""","""Here 's an analogy Marc9000 : Ridiculously Absurd Comment User : Refutation Marc9000 : AtHeIsT !""",AGREE,"""An `` evolutionist `` or a `` darwinist `` ? Are they merely people who dont follow the ID line ?""","""Here 's an analogy Marc9000 : Ridiculously Absurd Comment User : Refutation Marc9000 : AtHeIsT !""",,
17944,4809,"""An `` evolutionist `` or a `` darwinist `` ? Are they merely people who dont follow the ID line ? Or are they those who area of research activley involves evolution , thereby rurling out chemists , physicists , astronomers etc ? or something else entirely ?""","""Here 's an analogy Marc9000 : Ridiculously Absurd Comment User : Refutation Marc9000 : AtHeIsT !""",AGREE,"""An `` evolutionist `` or a `` darwinist `` ?""","""AtHeIsT !""",,
17956,4810,"""Besides , EVEN NOW WITH REPRODUCTION cheetahs and birds and so on will eventually die out . Does that mean they aren ’ t living organisms ?""","""Species may die out , but they may also evolve into new forms- without reproduction there is no possibility of continuity over even short periods of earth time , with it there is .""",DISAGREE,"""EVEN NOW WITH REPRODUCTION cheetahs and birds and so on will eventually die out . Does that mean they aren ’ t living organisms ?""","""Species may die out , but they may also evolve into new forms- without reproduction there is no possibility of continuity""",,
17968,4812,"""... does n't mean anything like you think it does , you 're treating them as if one is caused by the other and there is a big chain of disease that all leads up to an excessively sugary diet . did you not read my post ? It 's the other way around ... sugar is the culprit for a changing morphology .""","""You 're saying that if we track the causes of these diseases back to their source its sugar . You are then saying that modern humans have adapted to a high sugar diet by having smaller skulls , because if you eat a very sugar rich diet over a prolonged period of time you will suffer from degenerative diseases that cause the brain to shrink . The next generation responds to their parents degenerative disease by being born with a smaller skull ?""",DISAGREE,"""does n't mean anything like you think it does , you 're treating them as if one is caused by the other""","""You are then saying that modern humans have adapted to a high sugar diet by having smaller skulls""",,
17975,4814,"""Then for no apparent reason , Ian Tattersal in 1999 just pulled out the new date of 300,000 – 400,000 years out of thin air ! This , was obviously done for no other reason to give Rhodesian man adequate time to leave africa and move out into the rest of the world – and most importantly --  “ enough time to evolve ” into a homo spapien ! ! ! !""","""I 'd like to see some proof of this .""",DISAGREE,"""Ian Tattersal in 1999 just pulled out the new date of 300,000 – 400,000 years out of thin air !""","""I 'd like to see some proof of this .""",,
18007,4821,"""You could claim it , but unless you justify the claim rationally , why would anyone believe you ? Aha , if you said `` god could allow it `` , then you still have n't explained HOW , since there also is no evidence of a god . Basically , you can not escape the fact that true/false claims are meaningless unless justifiable .""","""There is no evidence in your eyes . There is tremendous evidence that the universe and everything in it was designed , even Darwin admitted that was the impression the evidence gave . Of course as an atheist he had to believe differently regardless of how absurd the story was . If particles to people was presented as a senario instead of science we would have no argument .""",DISAGREE,"""Aha , if you said `` god could allow it `` , then you still have n't explained HOW , since there also is no evidence of a god .""","""There is no evidence in your eyes . There is tremendous evidence that the universe and everything in it was designed""",,
18013,4823,"""We can only conceive of god in very rudimentary primitive concepts because of our immature and very limited intellect .""","""Primitive and immature as compared to what or whom ?""",DISAGREE,"""We can only conceive of god in very rudimentary primitive concepts because of our immature and very limited intellect .""","""Primitive and immature as compared to what or whom ?""",,
18039,4832,"""I find it interesting that the slippery slope fallacy keeps popping up again and again in the arguments of pro-gun activists even after the Heller decision . In that decision , the Supreme Court recognized an individual right to own guns but rejected the slippery slope argument that has been used by the gun lobby for years . I also find it hard to believe some of what gets posted in favor of the slippery slope argument- such as claims that Sarah Brady wants all guns to be banned which are contradicted by quotes by her in credible online sources and also such statistics as `` [ i ] t is estimated that there are between 22,000 and 30,000 gun laws on the books in America `` which have little basis in fact : `` The belief that there are approximately 20,000 gun-control laws in the United States has become received wisdom ..... But as it turns out , there appears to be little basis for the number .... Since the early 1980s , the National Rifle Association has mounted a very successful campaign to encourage state governments to enact 'preemption ' laws , forbidding local governments from enacting their own gun laws . Today , more than 40 states preempt all or most local gun-control laws , which has likely reduced the overall number of local gun laws .... Clearly the 20,000 figure is more a product of advocacy than science . And however it was initially derived , the trend toward preemption of local laws has substantially reduced the total . The most informative answer to the question of 'how many gun-control laws ? ' is then 'about 300 major state and federal laws , and an unknown but shrinking number of local laws . ' '' http : //www.brookings.edu/es/urban/pu ... s/gunbook4.pdf So why does the slippery slope fallacy keep appearing despite a Supreme Court ruling that stands in the way of it becoming a reality , a decline in the number of gun laws , and little or no credible evidence to suggest that gun control advocates really do intend to ban all guns ? Could it be that pro-gun extremists find it necessary to resort to the slippery slope fallacy because they find it otherwise difficult to make a convincing argument against reasonable and common sense gun laws aimed at protecting law abiding citizens from gun violence and the misuse of firearms ?""","""From your source which indeed does have its own slippery slope built in . '' Another problem with estimating the number of gun laws is agreeing on a definition of just what is to be included . For example , many local laws prohibit carrying or firing guns in public places . Inclusion of such laws would certainly inflate national estimates of the number of gun laws. `` And here comes tada one of the slippery slopes . '' But if one considers only laws that control the manufacture , design , sale , purchase , or possession of guns—the cluster of laws many probably imagine as constituting gun-control laws—the number of local laws will be much smaller . With most gun laws containing numerous , interrelated subparts , there is also no clear rule for defining what should count as a separate law. `` And yet another . '' In short , no matter how the 20,000- gun-law figure was initially derived , the overwhelming trend toward preemption of local laws is likely to have substantially reduced the total . Even a very liberal interpretation of what should count as a separate law would leave the total well short of 20,000. `` Yea right ! '' In our view , the discovery that there may be as few as 300 major statewide laws that fit our definition of a gun-control statute ( with some states having as few as one or two such laws ) yields a far more appropriate figure for public-policy discussion. `` In other words we do n't really have a clue here but we 'll call it short so we win . Nice try though .""",DISAGREE,"""Could it be that pro-gun extremists find it necessary to resort to the slippery slope fallacy because they find it otherwise difficult to make a convincing argument against reasonable and common sense gun laws aimed at protecting law abiding citizens from gun violence and the misuse of firearms ?""","""In other words we do n't really have a clue here but we 'll call it short so we win . Nice try though .""",,
18048,4834,"""and that what determines what or who you are stops at your genes !""","""How utterly stupid and untrue .""",DISAGREE,"""and that what determines what or who you are stops at your genes !""","""How utterly stupid and untrue .""",,
18055,4835,"""Before this thread is finished I 'll be able to quote one of you subconsciously showing that you think the woman is invisible .""","""No , you probably wo n't be able to .""",DISAGREE,"""Before this thread is finished I 'll be able to quote one you subconsciously showing that you think the woman is invisible .""","""No , you probably wo n't be able to .""",,
18058,4836,"""A woman 's rights over her body are n't absolute at all . When a woman who 's OD'ed is brought to a hospital , they take steps to save her ... they do n't just say `` She 's a druggie , she 's obviously sick of life , we 'll respect her right to die `` . Even if she recovers , and lucidly announces the same intent , they will take steps to stop her . It is because it is un-natural . It is un-natural to kill another human or to harm another human . People do it , but we do n't just accept it ... we try and put these people into a place where they 're not going to do it again . Further , if a woman smokes , her 'right to smoke ' might impinge upon my right to be in a smoke free environment . Why is it that restaurants ( at least in this country ) now have to be smoke free ? Why is my right greater than hers ? I might point out that the woman in question has every right to go down and file a DNR and a living will , and then the medical responders would be required by law to adhere to it . If she went and OD'ed again , and was going to die , they would have to let her die ... in effect she has gone through all neccessary legal steps to end her life . When a woman goes into a clinic to have an abortion , she also complies with the law , but for some reason , there will always be someone who does n't think she should be allowed the right to do so . Restaurants are not required to be smoke free . There are some local ordinances that may require it , but it is not a federal law . Workplaces , yes , restaurants , no . Walk into any diner in say , Cheyenne , WY to see it I 'm wrong . The reasons a restauranteur might decide to make his establishment non-smoking are numerous . The fact is , in most venues , the smoker is the minority , and so it only makes sense . My own opinion is that , while a smoker can last an hour or so for dinner without dying for a smoke , some vehement non-smokers could not last two minutes if they were within a half mile of a lit cigarette . ( you know the type , the suburban soccer mom who coughs on sight of a cigarette , the one who will traipse through a discount motel at midnight looking at 10 rooms because none of them `` smell right `` )""","""You are arguing from US law , I am arguing from Australian law . I think I needed to state this at the beginning . I have not heard of a US court case where a woman sued a hospital for bringing her back to life 'against her will ' . Though in America , anything is possible The oath of a doctor is to save a life . A woman who OD'ed would need to be saved .""",DISAGREE,"""Even if she recovers , and lucidly announces the same intent , they will take steps to stop her .""","""I think I needed to state this at the beginning .""",,
18065,4837,"""... That 's the point . It was n't designed , and it was evolved to be a carnivore . '' Ready to go `` , in the sense that living things are equipped with a means of making small errors which are used by natural selection to make new structures . ... The new ones evolved by mutation . Sometimes , we can even observe that happening , or trace the mutation back to a known ancestor . Would you like to learn about it ? ..""","""So you really do believe that organisms `` are equipped with a means of making small errors that allow natural selection `` turn a reptile to a bird and a monkey into a man ? To be `` equipped `` means there is a design feature . You are betraying your belief system . The errors can only be arbitrary and random and the organism is not equipped to function in any predetermined fashion . In the following example that you provided : What is the context of the word 'truncated ' ? The way I read it - it is talking about a truncated string of code or something . What was truncated ? ... * more than 100 LPL gene mutations have been identified , the majority of which cause loss of enzymatic function . In contrast to this , the naturally occurring LPLS447X variant is associated with increased lipolytic function and an anti-atherogenic lipid profile and can therefore be regarded as a gain-of-function mutation . This notion combined with the facts that 20 % of the general population carries this prematurely truncated LPL ... *""",DISAGREE,"""That 's the point . It was n't designed , and it was evolved to be a carnivore . '' Ready to go `` , in the sense that living things are equipped with a means of making small errors which are used by natural selection to make new structures . ... The new ones evolved by mutation .""","""you really do believe that organisms `` are equipped with a means of making small errors that allow natural selection `` turn a reptile to a bird and a monkey into a man ? To be `` equipped `` means there is a design feature . You are betraying your belief system .""",,
18068,4838,"""there have been stones etched in ancient history depicting dinosaurs""","""Oh jeez , not the Ica stones ... http : //skepdic.com/icastones.html""",DISAGREE,"""there have been stones etched in ancient history depicting dinosaurs""","""not the Ica stones""",,
18070,4838,"""there have been stones etched in ancient history depicting dinosaurs""","""Oh jeez , not the Ica stones ... http : //skepdic.com/icastones.html""",DISAGREE,"""there have been stones etched in ancient history depicting dinosaurs""","""Oh jeez , not the Ica stones ... http : //skepdic.com/icastones.html""",,
18087,4841,"""The author is arguing that gun control in rural areas does not constitute crime control in urban areas but somehow you try to spin that into making it sound as if the author is making some blanket statement against all gun control .""","""So what if the author is n't arguing against gun control ? At last , there is indication that England has taken a step in the right direction and realized that taking all guns away from everybody is n't the answer to crime .""",DISAGREE,"""The author is arguing that gun control in rural areas does not constitute crime control in urban areas""","""So what if the author is n't arguing against gun control ?""",,
18101,4843,"""just bumping this because it seems to have been overlooked ...""","""And perhaps you have overlooked the issue of abortion relating to crime . Who knows if were actually aborting future murderers ? Are n't you for crime prevention ?""",DISAGREE,"""just bumping this because it seems to have been overlooked ...""","""you have overlooked the issue of abortion relating to crime . Who knows if were actually aborting future murderers ?""",,
18108,4845,"""Look , the use of certain words can be a tricky thing since words carry connotations . There are often multiple definitions of words since people use them in different ways . One of the list of definitions which I showed you of the word `` a human `` had two versions ( from the American Heritage Dictionary ) - one purely a scientific one and one defining a human as `` a person `` . In a scientific context , I and at least certain other pro-choice supporters would have no problem calling a fetus `` a human `` . But the abortion debate is not a scientific context is it ? It is a context about rights . There , the second definition of `` a person `` is what most of us have in mind and use . If you want a discussion about biology - i.e . homo sapiens vs other mammals , then one might use the term `` a human `` in its most broadest sense since it is being compared to other species . When the topic is not science but politics , the word `` a human `` carries a lot of other connotations that go beyond the scientific definition . We often speak of `` human rights `` , `` humanity `` , etc . The scientific definition does not and can not carry all of the underlying attached meanings behind those phrases . That is why the second dictionary definition of `` a person `` is much more relevant .""","""And we have been down this road . Person can mean a living human ... which the embryo is . So like human , you can have person mean the organism itself .""",DISAGREE,"""That is why the second dictionary definition of `` a person `` is much more relevant .""","""And we have been down this road . Person can mean a living human ... which the embryo is .""",,
18109,4845,"""Look , the use of certain words can be a tricky thing since words carry connotations . There are often multiple definitions of words since people use them in different ways . One of the list of definitions which I showed you of the word `` a human `` had two versions ( from the American Heritage Dictionary ) - one purely a scientific one and one defining a human as `` a person `` . In a scientific context , I and at least certain other pro-choice supporters would have no problem calling a fetus `` a human `` . But the abortion debate is not a scientific context is it ? It is a context about rights . There , the second definition of `` a person `` is what most of us have in mind and use . If you want a discussion about biology - i.e . homo sapiens vs other mammals , then one might use the term `` a human `` in its most broadest sense since it is being compared to other species . When the topic is not science but politics , the word `` a human `` carries a lot of other connotations that go beyond the scientific definition . We often speak of `` human rights `` , `` humanity `` , etc . The scientific definition does not and can not carry all of the underlying attached meanings behind those phrases . That is why the second dictionary definition of `` a person `` is much more relevant .""","""And we have been down this road . Person can mean a living human ... which the embryo is . So like human , you can have person mean the organism itself .""",DISAGREE,"""But the abortion debate is not a scientific context is it ? It is a context about rights .""","""And we have been down this road . Person can mean a living human""",,
18128,4849,"""LOL Kronus - my wife and I do n't sit around the dinner table debating evolution either , she was shocked that people could be so intentionally ingnorant and zealous , supposedly in the name of Christianity .""","""Actually , my wife and I discuss evolution all the time . She 's an evolutionary biologist . She did feel as if she had some duty to watch the show , just to stay on top of the sorts of things being said . She just has a low tolerance for willful stupidity . Which I totally understand .""",DISAGREE,"""my wife and I do n't sit around the dinner table debating evolution either ,""","""Actually , my wife and I discuss evolution all the time . She 's an evolutionary biologist .""",,
18129,4849,"""LOL Kronus - my wife and I do n't sit around the dinner table debating evolution either , she was shocked that people could be so intentionally ingnorant and zealous , supposedly in the name of Christianity .""","""Actually , my wife and I discuss evolution all the time . She 's an evolutionary biologist . She did feel as if she had some duty to watch the show , just to stay on top of the sorts of things being said . She just has a low tolerance for willful stupidity . Which I totally understand .""",DISAGREE,"""my wife and I do n't sit around the dinner table debating evolution""","""Actually , my wife and I discuss evolution all the time .""",,
18161,4855,"""There is evidence that we evolved in Africa , or that we evolved elsewhere . http : //www.chineseprehistory.org/beard.htm suggest man arose in China , not Africa ! * * http : //www.chineseprehistory.org//index.htm is the introduction to this site . It is evidence of the nature of evidence , wholly subjective ; that Chinese nationalism is behind these particular pieces of 'scientific evidence . ' This increases the over-all number of different forms of science there are .""","""BWWWWAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! Are you trying to be deceptive or is it that you really did n't understand what you read ? It 's really pretty simple . The first link does not suggest that man arose in China . It is a discussion of a primate fossil . While humans are primates , all primates are not necessarily humans . The article discusses a primate fossil , the oldest yet discovered . It does not claim that mankind arose in China . Your second link leads to a discussion of well known human fossils from the middle pleistocene or later . None of them are as old at the Australopithecine fossils of Africa . Maybe you did n't read you own links , but I do n't see any claim of the origin of mankind in China . The claim is that early hominids ( Homo erectus ) migrated to China from Africa . The oldest H. erectus fossils are found in Africa and it would therefore seem that that is the origin of the species .""",DISAGREE,"""There is evidence that we evolved in Africa , or that we evolved elsewhere . http : //www.chineseprehistory.org/beard.htm suggest man arose in China , not Africa ! * * http : //www.chineseprehistory.org//index.htm is the introduction to this site .""","""! Are you trying to be deceptive or is it that you really did n't understand what you read ? It 's really pretty simple . The first link does not suggest that man arose in China . It is a discussion of a primate fossil . While humans are primates , all primates are not necessarily humans . The article discusses a primate fossil , the oldest yet discovered . It does not claim that mankind arose in China .""",,
18166,4855,"""There is evidence that we evolved in Africa , or that we evolved elsewhere . http : //www.chineseprehistory.org/beard.htm suggest man arose in China , not Africa ! * * http : //www.chineseprehistory.org//index.htm is the introduction to this site . It is evidence of the nature of evidence , wholly subjective ; that Chinese nationalism is behind these particular pieces of 'scientific evidence . ' This increases the over-all number of different forms of science there are .""","""BWWWWAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! Are you trying to be deceptive or is it that you really did n't understand what you read ? It 's really pretty simple . The first link does not suggest that man arose in China . It is a discussion of a primate fossil . While humans are primates , all primates are not necessarily humans . The article discusses a primate fossil , the oldest yet discovered . It does not claim that mankind arose in China . Your second link leads to a discussion of well known human fossils from the middle pleistocene or later . None of them are as old at the Australopithecine fossils of Africa . Maybe you did n't read you own links , but I do n't see any claim of the origin of mankind in China . The claim is that early hominids ( Homo erectus ) migrated to China from Africa . The oldest H. erectus fossils are found in Africa and it would therefore seem that that is the origin of the species .""",DISAGREE,"""There is evidence that we evolved in Africa , or that we evolved elsewhere .""","""The oldest H. erectus fossils are found in Africa and it would therefore seem that that is the origin of the species .""",,
18171,4856,"""But I see two people involved here . Whether the women is better off or not is irrelevant to me . She has no right to kill the other just like you have no right to kill your neighbor . I 'm not for allowing decisions on everything and to be against `` choices `` is not a bad thing considering every law restricts choices .""","""But the embryo is a mere clump of flesh inside of a woman 's body . Science proves it . It has no sign of intelligence , it is merely cells at this stage . Therefore , it can not be referred to as another person , or neighbor , and is no where near comparable to a human . Choices that harm another should be illegal , but choices regarding your own personal liberty and freedom should be made by the individual . Not the government .""",DISAGREE,"""But I see two people involved here . Whether the women is better off or not is irrelevant to me .""","""Not the government .""",,
18179,4858,"""We now know that human nucleotides exist in large linked clusters or blocks , ranging in size from 10,000 to a million . These linkage blocks are inherited as a single unit , and never break apart . This totally negates one of the most fundamental assumptions of the theorists – that each nucleotide can be viewed as an individually selectable unit . Dr. J.C. Sanford ( geneticist ) ( Of course this annihilates the whole theory as well . )""","""Ok , so are you saying that nucleotides are n't individually selectable ? Is that it ? Well , actually , they are . No , I 'm not saying that they are passed down separately or anything . Please do n't write your rebuttal before reading this post . What I 'm saying is that one nucleotide can make a difference in whether an organism survives or does not survive . For example , let 's consider penguins and the Galapagos . Now , it is a well known fact that the Galapagos were formed relatively recently . Before then , it is generally accepted that penguins were in Antarctica only . In Antarctica , penguins had plenty of feathers , enough to die when they progressed to the tropics . However , penguins also had variation in their feathers , so when a current brought them to the Galapagos , they quickly started to evolve . The few nucleotides that controlled feather thickness made a large difference to the survival of the penguins . In this case , they were important enough to make a difference easily . The DNA was inherited as a single unit , but some single units had single parts that made a difference .""",DISAGREE,"""This totally negates one of the most fundamental assumptions of the theorists – that each nucleotide can be viewed as an individually selectable unit . Dr. J.C. Sanford ( geneticist ) ( Of course this annihilates the whole theory as well . )""","""so are you saying that nucleotides are n't individually selectable ? Is that it ? Well , actually , they are . I 'm saying is that one nucleotide can make a difference in whether an organism survives or does not survive . For example , let 's consider penguins and the few nucleotides that controlled feather thickness made a large difference to the survival of the penguins . In this case , they were important enough to make a difference easily . The DNA was inherited as a single unit , but some single units had single parts that made a difference .""",,
18185,4859,"""That 's a good argument , just post a link and hope that people accept it as a real argument . Show me where a new body part has evolved .""","""The poster claimed no direct evidence for evolution had been observed . Just plain wrong . I gave you a `` new `` body part . A tail that can grasp .""",DISAGREE,"""Show me where a new body part has evolved .""","""gave you a `` new `` body part . A tail that can grasp .""",,
18189,4859,"""That 's a good argument , just post a link and hope that people accept it as a real argument . Show me where a new body part has evolved .""","""The poster claimed no direct evidence for evolution had been observed . Just plain wrong . I gave you a `` new `` body part . A tail that can grasp .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's a good argument , just post a link and hope that people accept it as a real argument . Show me where a new body part has evolved .""","""The poster claimed no direct evidence for evolution had been observed . Just plain wrong . I gave you a `` new `` body part . A tail that can grasp .""",,
18231,4875,"""What is the fun in that ?""","""Seriously ? Well , I come here hoping for something resembling an intelligent discussion . Every once in a while I get one . Most of the time it 's just ramblings like Benjamin 's here . I was kind of hoping that by ignoring the trolls the stupid to interesting ratio might go down . Do you really enjoy the kind of `` debates `` that posts like this inevitably start ?""",DISAGREE,"""What is the fun in that ?""","""Most of the time it 's just ramblings like Benjamin 's here . I was kind of hoping that by ignoring the trolls""",,
18267,4884,"""your definitions are very biased sounding . you dont need to subliminally attack YEC 's just to make your definitions . these should be as objective and factual as possible please""","""What you mean is that we should pretend that creationism has some sort of legitimate basis in reality ? The definitions were accurate . It would be different if someone could actually offer a scientific theory of creation . How about some evidence to support the `` theory. `` By the way , I 'm still waiting for you to tell us about how the definition of evolution has changed . What you really meant was the creationists had invented bogus definitions so that they could lump all of science under `` evolution , `` was n't it ?""",DISAGREE,"""definitions are very biased sounding objective and factual""","""should pretend that creationism creationists had invented bogus definitions""",,
18269,4884,"""your definitions are very biased sounding . you dont need to subliminally attack YEC 's just to make your definitions . these should be as objective and factual as possible please""","""What you mean is that we should pretend that creationism has some sort of legitimate basis in reality ? The definitions were accurate . It would be different if someone could actually offer a scientific theory of creation . How about some evidence to support the `` theory. `` By the way , I 'm still waiting for you to tell us about how the definition of evolution has changed . What you really meant was the creationists had invented bogus definitions so that they could lump all of science under `` evolution , `` was n't it ?""",DISAGREE,"""these should be as objective and factual as possible please""","""What you mean is that we should pretend that creationism has some sort of legitimate basis in reality ?""",,
18270,4885,"""... there wo n't be a 66 I know that""","""I 'll give you that one ... only because I think by then women will be able to place their fertilized ovums in banks . But then again they said the same thing about robot servants and flying cars too !""",AGREE,""" there wo n't be a 66 I know that""","""I 'll give you that one ...""",,
18281,4887,"""It shows""","""Thanks , Christianity worships a blood thirsty God who is too wicked and morally bankrupt to worship . It is below me and I can not take authority from such a moral midget .""",DISAGREE,"""It shows""","""worships a blood thirsty God too wicked and morally bankrupt to""",,
18279,4887,"""It shows""","""Thanks , Christianity worships a blood thirsty God who is too wicked and morally bankrupt to worship . It is below me and I can not take authority from such a moral midget .""",DISAGREE,"""It shows""","""Thanks , Christianity worships a blood thirsty God""",,
18293,4889,"""BB guns are n't useful when robbing a store as they 're too 'weak ' .""","""but they are still used , as long as the person itiis pointed at do n't know it is a bb gun it works too .""",DISAGREE,"""BB guns are n't useful they 're too 'weak""","""but they are still used it works too""",,
18307,4892,"""What has this got to do with the non-material world , of which God and you and I are a part of ?""","""Hmmm ... This is interesting ... If I am not mistaken , you are stating that [ you believe ] at least some physical creatures that occupy mass in the physical realm are actually part of a non-material realm . On what basis do you make this assertion ?""",DISAGREE,"""What has this got to do with the non-material world , of which God and you and I are a part of ?""","""On what basis do you make this assertion ?""",,
18313,4893,"""You lie . You keep saying the same things over and over again , that does n't make them true .""","""The fact that it 's the truth is why I keep repeating it .""",DISAGREE,"""saying the same things over and over again , that does n't make them true""","""The fact that it 's the truth .""",,
18348,4906,"""yeap ... that pretty much sums it up . I fully expect to get insulted any time I post something . But you 're right : these people are activists ... and most have no interest in searching for the truth ... there 's simply no way to change their minds .""","""You deserve to get insulted for the follwoing reasons : You post the same garbage at several forums You start thread after thread with the regurgiposted garbage at forum after forum You refuse to even try to understand the answers you are given , and when given answers , just ask more questions until the answerer grows tired of playing games You abandon threads only to start new ones on the same topics later Lather , rinse , repeat You do not want discussion . You do not want answers . YOu do not want to try to understand the things you read - look at your caterpiller color debacle . Your 'mission ' is to overwhgelm with volume because you know you lose on details . Trying to discuss things with you is like a hamster on a treadmill - it goes round and round and you end up right where you began . For crying outy loud , at CARM you have started yet another thread linking to the same Bruce Lipton website you did a couple of months ago , making the same basic claims as you did then .""",DISAGREE,"""I fully expect to get insulted any time I post something .""","""You abandon threads only to start new ones on the same topics later""",,
18355,4907,"""Would depend on how sucessful they thought the handing in was , but do n't you have to register for a leicence ? So all legal owners are know already and can be checked off against the guns they have handed in , I would imagine that there must be departments of the police who deal with tracking black market unregisted guns so these could be cracked down opon .""","""In any private sale there is no paper record . As some others point out here , when you register to purchase a gun at a licensed dealer , the only information that the federal government recieves is the stuff for your background check , which must be destroyed . What these folks DONT realise , is that all firearms transfers made by licensed dealers are required bt BATF regulation to be recorded in the dealer `` bound book `` of firearm transfers . Federal law says they are required to keep these books forever , or if they fail to renew their FFL , they are required to send the bound book to the ATF . Also by federal law , they are required to make that bound book available to the ATF at any time , without a warrant , in order to facilitate the tracing of firearms . A nationwide datebase of firearm owners is already HERE . It is just fragmented into a bunch of smaller parts and kept by gun dealers instead of in a central database . All it would take is a trip o each gun stor , and they would have a list of everybody who has bought a gun from a licensed dealer . As far as police tracking black market guns , it does n't seem to work now , and I fai to see how they are going to do any better at it int he future . YOu are talking about something that can only really be detected by direct examination . A crate full of guns and a crate full of drill bits looks the same to an X ray . Guns don ; t have a specific odor that dogs can be trained to detect .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't you have to register for a leicence ?""","""In any private sale there is no paper record . As some others point out here , when you register to purchase a gun at a licensed dealer , the only information that the federal government recieves is the stuff for your background check , which must be destroyed . ``""",,
18380,4911,"""Is it possible to tell the real men from the fake men over the internet ? Wait .. let me check ...""","""Hello , Let me see , N.O.W . that 80 % Lesbian Lot ( by their own count and definition ) , continue to whine about women not being given 'equal rights ' , all the while , 51 % of the population ( that 's women ) own the MAJORITY of the wealth , represent the greatest number of teachers , have more rights on college campuses than their male counterparts , have more legal rights than men , are given legal custody of children-even when they are drug addicts/drunks/abusers , and are overwhelmingly the recipients of alimony ( regardless of their being no children in the marriage ) . Ah yes , the 'poor victims ' of all that male power . Women start professional careers later than men , yet demand the same amount of pay that their male counterparts , get , having spent years in the corporate trenches to achieve their status and pay grades . Women continue to whine about how they are victimized by men in the USA , despite the facts to the contrary . N.O.W . has n't bothered a peep about all the Muslim women in the world being beaten , maimed , and murdered , on a daily basis ; they 're too busy complaining that some unsuspecting woman heard a 'sexist ' joke while passing by a male counterpart 's office ( one guy telling another guy a joke ) . Yes indeed , poor 'oppressed ' American women . Whiners the lot of them ; never happy and wanting to make everyone around them just as unhappy . The bottom line is this : there is nothing between a woman 's legs , which is worth putting up with that , which is between her nose and her chin . And you can quote me on that ! Keep up the whining , I 'm sure the Muslim woman being beaten to death , clitorectomies being performed with rusted razor blades , and noses being cut off , wo n't bother you a bit ; you 've got a man in the office whom you wish to undermine , or a corporation you wish to sue , for some slight against your 'womanhood . ' Cheers from the Rockies""",DISAGREE,"""possible to tell the real men from the fake men over the internet ?""","""Muslim woman being beaten to death , clitorectomies being performed with rusted razor blades""",,
18387,4912,"""And what is so special about religion that give people special rights for a choice ? I say no special rights for religion .""","""so you think it would be ok to fire people for being secular atheists ?""",DISAGREE,"""And what is so special about religion that give people special rights for a choice ?""","""so you think it would be ok to fire people for being secular atheists ?""",,
18392,4913,"""This is a matter that i hold very close to my heart just wondered what everyone elses opinion is of the barbaric way these baby 's are treated even after death . http : //www.ashevilletribune.com/in_their_words.htm""","""This is not what hospitals do with biomedical waste . They incinerate it . If these people are really doing this I can `` t imagine who the buyer is , and they are breaking many many laws .""",DISAGREE,"""This is a matter that i hold very close to my heart just wondered what everyone elses opinion is of the barbaric way these baby 's are treated even after death . http : //www.ashevilletribune.com/in_their_words.htm""","""This is not what hospitals do with biomedical waste . They incinerate ``""",,
18394,4913,"""This is a matter that i hold very close to my heart just wondered what everyone elses opinion is of the barbaric way these baby 's are treated even after death . http : //www.ashevilletribune.com/in_their_words.htm""","""This is not what hospitals do with biomedical waste . They incinerate it . If these people are really doing this I can `` t imagine who the buyer is , and they are breaking many many laws .""",DISAGREE,"""This is a matter that i hold very close to my heart just wondered what everyone elses opinion is of the barbaric way these baby 's are treated even after death .""","""This is not what hospitals do with biomedical waste .""",,
18430,4919,"""If were to ever get married , I think it would be relatively small ( 50 to 100 people max )""","""Yikes ! ! The phobes were right about same-sex marriage leading to polygamy ! ! ! : -P""",AGREE,"""If were to ever get married , I think it would be relatively small ( 50 to 100 people max )""","""Yikes ! ! The phobes were right about same-sex marriage leading to polygamy ! !""",,
18435,4920,"""EDIT : I reread , and it seems you are correct . Creationism isn ’ t a theory at all ! On one of my most generous days , I might call it a set of poor hypotheses . It really should be classified as a myth While it is true that science and religion are not generally compatible , because science is based on evidence supporting a hypothesis , which will eventually become a theory after significant support , and a law after virtually proven true ( but never actually proven ) , while religion is a series of stories to try to explain the universe in the simplest way possible ( god did it ) . Science is meant to expand and change over time until the theory of everything is reached . Religion assumes they already have that theory ( god did it ) . Evolution is no mo0re anti-religion than science itself , except that the conflict manifests itself here .""","""So if a story in the bible is proven to be true , like the fact that there is enough water in the ice caps , and the atmosphere to cover the highest mountains , then these `` myths `` would become less rediculous ? Or would there be a logical explanation other than a higher life form did it ? Mayabe a crazy man built a big boat at the right time and happened to have two of each animal at the time ? But that would be crazy talk . Wouldnt it ?""",DISAGREE,"""I reread , and it seems you are correct . Creationism isn ’ t a theory at""","""So if a story in the bible is proven to be true , like the fact that there is enough water in the ice caps , and the atmosphere to cover the highest mountains , then these `` myths `` would become less rediculous ?""",,
18464,4934,"""Both Evolution and Creation are religions .""","""No . Evolution is a scientific study of the evidence of how life changes . Evolutionary theory offers falsifiable explanations of how that works . Creationism is religious in that it is based on no evidence . It is based on mythology .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution and Creation are religions .""","""Evolution is a scientific study Evolutionary theory offers falsifiable explanations""",,
18467,4934,"""Both Evolution and Creation are religions .""","""No . Evolution is a scientific study of the evidence of how life changes . Evolutionary theory offers falsifiable explanations of how that works . Creationism is religious in that it is based on no evidence . It is based on mythology .""",DISAGREE,"""Both Evolution and Creation are religions .""","""No . Evolution is a scientific study of the evidence of how life changes .""",,
18493,4939,"""The idea of abortion as population control is absurd , especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts ago . Anyone who has read a biology book knows the world has methods of population control on its own , we do n't need to be doing stuff like that ourselves . This stat sounds more than a bit inflated . Seeing as it comes from a website called `` women 's issues `` it is probably not all that credible .""","""And , Master Shake , why is it precisely that you are having problems with `` women 's issues `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""The idea of abortion as population control is absurd , especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts ago .""","""why is it precisely that you are having problems with `` women 's issues `` ?""",,
18491,4939,"""The idea of abortion as population control is absurd , especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts ago . Anyone who has read a biology book knows the world has methods of population control on its own , we do n't need to be doing stuff like that ourselves . This stat sounds more than a bit inflated . Seeing as it comes from a website called `` women 's issues `` it is probably not all that credible .""","""And , Master Shake , why is it precisely that you are having problems with `` women 's issues `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""idea of abortion as population control especially forced abortions""","""Master Shake precisely that you are having problems""",,
18500,4940,"""Evolution : Ride a monkey into Hell .""","""But we were n't discussing either monkies or hell . One can only wonder at your thought processes that makes such irrelevant and disconnected thoughts pop up .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution : Ride a monkey into Hell .""","""we were n't discussing either monkies or hell . One can only wonder at your thought processes that makes such irrelevant and disconnected thoughts pop up .""",,
18504,4941,"""Not once has a gun hater ever demand that dangerous criminals be punished .""","""What ? You did a poll ?""",DISAGREE,"""Not once has a gun hater ever demand that dangerous criminals be punished .""","""What ? You did a poll ?""",,
18507,4941,"""Not once has a gun hater ever demand that dangerous criminals be punished .""","""What ? You did a poll ?""",DISAGREE,"""Not once has a gun hater ever demand that dangerous criminals be punished""","""You did a poll ?""",,
18520,4945,"""So you do n't think that women who truly want to have children and continue their pregnancies safely should not , all of them , have access to decent prenatal and obstetrical care ? Because that is the other side of the coin .""","""Simone , are you so out of it that you ca n't comprehend that I said exactly that in my post ? Note the bolded if you will .""",AGREE,"""So you do n't think that women who truly want to have children and continue their pregnancies safely should not , all of them , have access to decent prenatal and obstetrical care ?""","""are you so out of it that you ca n't comprehend that I said exactly that in my post ?""",,
18531,4948,"""MEDICAL FACT : By the 15th day of the seventh month the child is capable of breathing air . He or she is a developed `` tabernacle `` and can be born . However , to achieve maximum strength the child should continue to grow inside its mother for another 80 days . It can thereafter be born and dedicated to the Lord .""","""Wrong and wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""However , to achieve maximum strength the child should continue to grow inside its mother for another 80 days .""","""Wrong and wrong""",,
18539,4950,"""The only reason this bill has advanced is because the NRA has threatened to withhold endorsements from conservative Democrats in tough races this year . http : //www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn ... 090701982.html""","""And why should I care ?""",DISAGREE,"""the NRA has threatened to withhold endorsements from conservative Democrats in tough races this year .""","""I care ?""",,
18553,4953,"""We all agree that God is omnipotent , that is all-powerful . Since when did all-powerful come to mean instantaneous ? Would it in any way `` weaken `` God for this creation to have followed a logical creative path of evolution ?""","""Yes it would have , because it would imply that God needed help to create us .""",DISAGREE,"""Since when did all-powerful come to mean instantaneous ?""","""because it would imply that God needed help to create us .""",,
18565,4955,"""Evolutionist keep chanting that the `` god of the gaps `` is used to fill in where `` science `` can not .""","""Too broad a generalization . I 'm sure most people who believe in evolution do n't chant `` god of the gaps `` .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolutionist keep chanting that the `` god of the gaps `` is used to fill in where `` science `` can not .""","""I 'm sure most people who believe in evolution do n't chant `` god of the gaps `` .""",,
18582,4958,"""`` There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state ( or Federal ) against being murdered by criminals or madmen . It is monstrous if the state fails to protect its residents against such predators but it does not violate the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment , or , we suppose , any other provision of the Constitution . The Constitution is a charter of negative liberties : it tells the state ( gov't ) to let people alone ; it does not require the federal government or the state to provide services , even so elementary a service as maintaining law and order `` ( Bowers v. DeVito , U.S. Court of Appeals , Seventh Circuit , 686F.2d 616 [ 1982 ] ) .""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",DISAGREE,"""Bowers v. DeVito , U.S. Court of Appeals , Seventh Circuit , 686F.2d 616 [ 1982 ]""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",,
18583,4958,"""`` There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state ( or Federal ) against being murdered by criminals or madmen . It is monstrous if the state fails to protect its residents against such predators but it does not violate the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment , or , we suppose , any other provision of the Constitution . The Constitution is a charter of negative liberties : it tells the state ( gov't ) to let people alone ; it does not require the federal government or the state to provide services , even so elementary a service as maintaining law and order `` ( Bowers v. DeVito , U.S. Court of Appeals , Seventh Circuit , 686F.2d 616 [ 1982 ] ) .""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",DISAGREE,"""It is monstrous if the state fails to protect its residents against such predators but it does not violate the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",,
18586,4958,"""`` There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state ( or Federal ) against being murdered by criminals or madmen . It is monstrous if the state fails to protect its residents against such predators but it does not violate the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment , or , we suppose , any other provision of the Constitution . The Constitution is a charter of negative liberties : it tells the state ( gov't ) to let people alone ; it does not require the federal government or the state to provide services , even so elementary a service as maintaining law and order `` ( Bowers v. DeVito , U.S. Court of Appeals , Seventh Circuit , 686F.2d 616 [ 1982 ] ) .""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",DISAGREE,"""There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state ( or Federal ) against being murdered by criminals or madmen .""","""Aye there 's the rub !""",,
18614,4964,"""`` ( 17 . ) The glorification of firearms in movies and video games is wrong and promotes irresponsible gun usage , but the gun industry & # 8217 ; s advertising propaganda , which exploits people & # 8217 ; s fear of criminals to sell guns , is perfectly responsible .""","""Brinks plays on people 's fears to sell security systems that do n't even work . Insurance companies play on people 's fears to sell their policies .""",AGREE,"""gun industry s advertising propaganda , which exploits people s fear of criminals to sell guns , is perfectly responsible .""","""Insurance companies play on people 's fears to sell their policies .""",,
18632,4970,"""In the past , gun activists have labeled scholars who have expressed similar views to the dissents as advocates of the collective rights interpretation .""","""And there is that disingenuousness on display ! The dissenting Justices would never propose the use of a alternate , subjectively interpreted standard of scrutiny to be applied for any other right deemed `` individual `` expressly secured by a provision of the Bill of Rights ( Stevens especially and even for rights NOT enumerated ) . The dissents refuse to consider the incongruousness of saying that , `` based on our precedent and today ’ s opinions , to which . . . the entire Court subscribes `` the 2nd Amendment , `` protects an  “ individual ” right—i.e. , one that is separately possessed , and may be separately enforced `` and then argue that , `` When each word in the text is given full effect , the Amendment is most naturally read to secure to the people a right to use and possess arms in conjunction with service in a well-regulated militia. `` Say what ? ? ? ? The leftist dissenters , while acknowledging the Court 's history of unwavering `` individual right `` conclusions , revert to their old statist ( but invalid ) theories when explaining their unconstitutional , philosophically bankrupt positions .""",DISAGREE,"""gun activists have labeled scholars who have expressed similar views to the dissents as advocates""","""And there is that disingenuousness on""",,
18648,4974,"""Personally , I see no problem with this , and it has more or less been our unofficial policy for years around here . There are holes in the theory of evolution , and there are segments of it that are mostly conjecture .""","""Nonsense . Name the holes and what parts are conjecture ? The parts that are conjecture are never , ever taught in a high school biology class . There is n't time . Only major points are covered about which there is no doubt .""",DISAGREE,"""I see no problem with this , and it has more or less been our unofficial policy for years around here .""","""Nonsense . Name the holes and what parts are conjecture ? The parts that are conjecture are never""",,
18670,4978,"""I admire your zeal . I agree God is real . However , you need to work this into a statement pertinent to the `` Creation v Evolution `` theme of this subject . What exactly do you want people to debate you about , with regards to the topic ?""","""Ironic , since your `` Out of China `` post was basically the same as this post . You even claim you had no debate point , you were just posting `` information `` . It was n't until you claimed that evolution relied on those two mutual theories that we proceeded to debate . Maybe this young 13 year old christian is just following in your golden footsteps ... you might give them a little leeway if you , yourself , do this as well . Or are you above the rules of the average forum participant ? Hmmm . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""I admire your zeal . I agree God is real . However , you need to work this into a statement pertinent to the `` Creation v Evolution `` theme of this subject .""","""Ironic , since your `` Out of China `` post was basically the same as this post .""",,
18676,4979,"""Wars still constitute competition within the species .""","""The question is : To what degree do wars cull out particular genes as opposed to ideas ? Another thing to consider is not who is getting killed , but who is being born . Unless , something is done about the niche , it will just get filled again by whoever was decimated . Compare : Germans ( hypothetically ) settling in the Ukraine versus the US bombing of Hiroshima ( which was not then settled by the US ) . Consistent genetic pressure is really key .""",DISAGREE,"""Wars still constitute competition within the species .""","""To what degree do wars cull out particular genes as opposed to ideas ? Another thing to consider is not who is getting killed , but who is being born . Unless , something is done about the niche""",,
18681,4980,"""No . Abortion is legal , so they do n't have to worry about what they do with a woman 's sexuality . If they knew abortion was not an option , they would probably think twice before having sex with any woman they wanted .""","""So then , you think that the threat of criminalizing abortion will decrease sexual activity . In earlied posts you condemned wome 's `` lust `` . We gather that you think sexuality is a BAD thing . Why ? Are you the avatar of either Saul of Tarsus or Augustine of Hippo ?""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion is legal , so they do n't have to worry about what they do with a woman 's sexuality""","""then , you think that the threat of criminalizing abortion will decrease sexual activity .""",,
18701,4983,"""15 ) Explain to me why we don ’ t see humans or dogs or alligators with accidental wings forming . ( If the possibility was there for random mutations to produce wings on reptiles or mammals in the past , then it should also be happening now . )""","""Oh dear ; where do I even start ? Ok , look , the ToE does n't say that the possibility was ever there for random mutation to suddenly make wings appear out of nowhere . It just does n't . The evolution of something as complex as a wing proceeds by a lot of intermediate steps , each one of them being useful , or at least associated with something useful . We do n't see humans or dogs or alligators suddenly sprouting wings because that would require massive wholesale genomic , and probably epigenetic , change . What we do see are more mundane , less drastic variations which can accumulate over time . It 's tempting to think `` wings evolving from arms ; huh , what about the millions of years when they were neither ; how could they have been 'fittest ' ? `` The mistake there is in visualising a straightforward morph from 'then ' to 'now ' , as if the organism knew where it was headed . A better way to imagine it is via an intermediate stage where the arms were still useful as arms , but also conferred an aerodynamic advantage , such as we see in flying squirrels today . If the original purpose of the arms later becomes less important , those features can atrophy while improved aerodynamic qualities remain strongly selected . The divergence of mice and bats is likely to have followed just such a pattern ; who knows , in another ten million years we might see descendents of flying squirrels that are as adept in the air as bats are today . So in a sense , 'flying squirrels ' are your answer . I ca n't guarantee they 'll evolve more and more wing-like structures over the next few million years , but it 's possible .""",DISAGREE,"""Explain to me why we don ’ t see humans or dogs or alligators with accidental wings forming .""","""The evolution of something as complex as a wing proceeds by a lot of intermediate steps , each one of them being useful , or at least associated with something useful .""",,
18706,4984,"""Why is gun control more likely to increase crime that reducing it ? Mind telling us about your own `` research `` ? You are right about the people who would give uop their gun . It would be the law-abiding ones , but you are saying this as if they would do something immoral .""","""Patrick Henry does n't do any research , nor does he realiset his is not a news board .""",DISAGREE,"""Mind telling us about your own `` research `` ? You are right about the people who would give uop their gun .""","""Patrick Henry does n't do any research , nor does he realiset his is not a news board .""",,
18707,4984,"""Why is gun control more likely to increase crime that reducing it ? Mind telling us about your own `` research `` ? You are right about the people who would give uop their gun . It would be the law-abiding ones , but you are saying this as if they would do something immoral .""","""Patrick Henry does n't do any research , nor does he realiset his is not a news board .""",DISAGREE,"""Why is gun control more likely to increase crime that reducing it ? Mind telling us about your own `` research `` ?""","""Patrick Henry does n't do any research , nor does he realiset his is not a news board .""",,
18720,4987,"""So how do you explain the nylon bug ? It can do something its ancestors could not - for the very simple reason that it 's not the same as its ancestors .""","""That is true , but it is still a Nylon Bug is not a Nylon Horse ... mutations can occur laterally [ intra species ] but not ascending [ something entirely different ] .""",DISAGREE,"""nylon bug It can do something its ancestors could not""","""Nylon is not a Nylon Horse mutations can occur laterally [ intra species ] but not ascending""",,
18728,4989,"""I have to disagree with 1 and 3 . If God exists , and he wanted his existence proven , he could prove it . Likewise , if he wanted to have an impact , he could . I will agree with 1 and 3 if you add `` as things stand now `` , or words to that effect .""","""if God , even a non-biblical God , existed , then would you say that he would have always existed ? wouldnt this God be the same and consistent throughout eternity ? so far , we agree that the existence of a documented/biblical God can not be proven . an undocumented/non-biblical God has never even been encountered , not even in the last 5000 years when the other Gods were being written about . if this God had the ability to make himself known at his perogative , why would he not do so until now ? and if he doesnt show himself/make his existence known now why would he wait until later ? we could extrapolate this forever , and this undocumented/non-biblical God would never `` choose to `` manifest . therefore , the existence of such a God can never be proven the same applies for 3. if such a God never `` decides to `` manifest his presence , then even if he exists it would be of absolutely no consequence to mankind at all""",DISAGREE,"""If God exists he wanted his existence proven , he could prove it if he wanted to have an impact , he could ``""","""if God , even a non-biblical God , existed the existence of a documented/biblical God can not be proven why would he not do so until now ``""",,
18733,4990,"""A third of the nation is armed , many with weapons more powerful than the standard issue arms of the military . If we get p ! $ $ ed off bad enough , it 's gon na get very ugly . The military does n't have the manpower to stop 100 million outraged and armed individuals .""","""And who is going to lead them ? How will they remain safe ? This is n't a game of Warcraft , where the 'player ' can control all individuals at the touch of a button . An organised few can defeat a disorganised many , and often do .""",DISAGREE,"""A third of the nation is armed If we get p ! $ $ ed off bad enough , it 's gon na get very ugly . The military does n't have the manpower to stop 100 million outraged and armed individuals .""","""who is going to lead them ? How will they remain safe ?""",,
18746,5001,"""http : //www.washingtontimes.com/apps/ ... 107170041/1004 I did n't think they would have the guts after getting slapped so badly last time out . I mean , there is loosing a case , and then there is getting kicked up and down the street and dragged through a field of tacks , which is pretty much happened when last time out .""","""This is the `` right `` SCOTUS to hear the case , IMO .""",AGREE,"""I did n't think they would have the guts after getting slapped so badly last time out .""","""This is the `` right `` SCOTUS to hear the case , IMO .""",,
18767,5006,"""Can God evlove ?""","""Well , he certainly shows distinct difference between the old and the new testaments !""",AGREE,"""Can God evlove ?""","""he certainly shows distinct difference between the old and the new testaments !""",,
18775,5009,"""* The three sisters in Australia is evidence of a catastrophic flood ( please ask me to extrapolate on this if you want to ) . * Uluru in the heart of the Australian Outback is another example of a catastrophic flood ( once again ask me to extrapolate on this if you want to ) .""","""Go on .""",DISAGREE,"""The three sisters in Australia is evidence of a catastrophic flood""","""Go on .""",,
18792,5014,"""An irreducibly complex system can not be produced gradually by slight , successive modifications of a precursor system , since any precursor to an irreducibly complex system is by definition nonfunctional .""","""Actually , if you had paid attention , you would know that every example of IR given by Behe has been debunked . Immune system ? Sorry . Debunked . There are examples of organisms with intermediate steps . Blood cloting cascade ? Sorry . There are example of animals that accomplish clotting without all of the `` necessary `` factors . Bacerial flagellum ? Sorry . Type III secretion systems appears to be a simplified sub-set of the bacterial flagellum 's components . If only you took the time to actually educate yourself rather than trying to pass off mythology as reality .""",DISAGREE,"""An irreducibly complex system can not be produced gradually by slight , successive modifications of a precursor system ,""","""if you had paid attention , you would know that every example of IR given by Behe has been If only you took the time to actually educate yourself rather than trying to pass off mythology as reality .""",,
18802,5016,"""The quantitites of marijuana that farmers grow has no effect on its lung toxicity .""","""But once they use pesticides it will .""",DISAGREE,"""The quantitites of marijuana that farmers grow has no effect on its lung toxicity .""","""But once they use pesticides it will .""",,
18821,5019,"""Actually , the whole basis for modern science depends on the assumption that the universe was made by a rational creator . Dr Stanley Jaki has documented how the scientific method was still-born in all cultures apart from the Judeo-Christian culture in Europe ( Science and Creation ( Edinburgh and London : Scottish Academic Press , 1974 ) ) . An orderly universe makes perfect sense if it was made by an orderly Creator . But if there is no creator , or if Zeus and his gang were in charge , why should there be any order at all ? Loren Eiseley stated ( Loren Eiseley : Darwin 's Century : Evolution and the Men who Discovered It , Doubleday , Anchor , New York ( 1961 ) :""","""That 's a completely different argument , order does not imply a creator .""",DISAGREE,"""the whole basis for modern science depends on the assumption that the universe was made by a rational creator""","""That 's a completely different argument , order does not imply a creator""",,
18819,5019,"""Actually , the whole basis for modern science depends on the assumption that the universe was made by a rational creator . Dr Stanley Jaki has documented how the scientific method was still-born in all cultures apart from the Judeo-Christian culture in Europe ( Science and Creation ( Edinburgh and London : Scottish Academic Press , 1974 ) ) . An orderly universe makes perfect sense if it was made by an orderly Creator . But if there is no creator , or if Zeus and his gang were in charge , why should there be any order at all ? Loren Eiseley stated ( Loren Eiseley : Darwin 's Century : Evolution and the Men who Discovered It , Doubleday , Anchor , New York ( 1961 ) :""","""That 's a completely different argument , order does not imply a creator .""",DISAGREE,"""An orderly universe makes perfect sense if it was made by an orderly Creator . But if there is no creator , or if Zeus and his gang were in charge , why should there be any order at all ?""","""That 's a completely different argument , order does not imply a creator .""",,
18823,5020,"""This reality indeed flips all of biology and ToE on its head .""","""Explain why .""",DISAGREE,"""This reality indeed flips all of biology and ToE on its head .""","""Explain why .""",,
18835,5022,"""I bet the shot men get out of the hospital before those women do and with less visible damage . Or mental either for that matter . Know how many lives are lost from medical mistakes each year ?""","""That is where I was going Doc . Twice as many went to the hospital in NJ because criminals do what criminals do .""",AGREE,"""I bet the shot men get out of the hospital before those women do and with less visible damage .""","""That is where I was going Doc Twice as many went to the hospital in NJ because criminals do what criminals do""",,
18851,5024,"""Yeah a decent looking guy with a big gun .... yes it 's a joke lol . But seriously that gun was such a treat it 's so simple to clean , reliable and accurate in the right hands . No wonder the military is having such a pain trying to find a successor ....""","""Seems all the drills would broadcast when they had a leftie . Just could wait for that case of M-1 thumb or the hot one down the shirt .""",DISAGREE,"""Yeah a decent looking guy with a big gun .... yes it 's a joke lol . But seriously that gun was such a treat it 's so simple to clean , reliable and accurate in the right hands .""","""Seems all the drills would broadcast when they had a leftie""",,
18853,5025,"""Many on the liberal front often tell us that the police are there for the purpose of protecting us , that they 'll keep us safe , that we do n't need a gun if we just call 911 and let the police handle it , etc .""","""I 've never heard anyone say this other than you guys . Btw it 's a town of 2000 people .""",DISAGREE,"""tell us that the police are there for the purpose of protecting us , that they 'll keep us safe , that we do n't need a gun if we just call 911 and let the police handle it , etc .""","""I 've never heard anyone say this other than you guys .""",,
18855,5025,"""Many on the liberal front often tell us that the police are there for the purpose of protecting us , that they 'll keep us safe , that we do n't need a gun if we just call 911 and let the police handle it , etc .""","""I 've never heard anyone say this other than you guys . Btw it 's a town of 2000 people .""",DISAGREE,"""we do n't need a gun if we just call 911 and let the police handle it""","""I 've never heard anyone say this other than you guys""",,
18866,5027,"""by the way , only the creator of life can take it away according to the Bible .""","""According to Stalin , only your caretaker , the USSR , can take away your life . God has alot in common with dictators . And often the apologists for dictators have alot in common with apologists such as yourself .""",DISAGREE,"""only the creator of life can take it away according to the Bible""","""God has alot in common with dictators""",,
18880,5030,"""But of course to the `` truth `` which is falsifiable right ? Because otherwise it is not really `` scientific `` is it ?""","""Well , to be `` scientific `` means that it must be falsifiable . Otherwise it is meaningless in a regime of methodological naturalism .""",DISAGREE,"""otherwise it is not really `` scientific ``""","""Otherwise it is meaningless""",,
18881,5030,"""But of course to the `` truth `` which is falsifiable right ? Because otherwise it is not really `` scientific `` is it ?""","""Well , to be `` scientific `` means that it must be falsifiable . Otherwise it is meaningless in a regime of methodological naturalism .""",DISAGREE,"""course to the `` truth `` which is falsifiable right ? otherwise it is not really `` scientific `` is it ?""","""to be `` scientific `` means that it must be falsifiable . Otherwise it is meaningless in a regime of methodological naturalism .""",,
18888,5031,"""Not one person who responded to this thread actually read what I wrote in the op . I was very specific on whose marriages should be targeted . Since the christinists are the ones who want to deny marriage to us then maybe they need to have theirs taken away . We also have thanks to http : //knowthyneighbor.org/ lists of people who should be targets .""","""No Matthew , we all read it . The fact that you have specific targets in mind for your attacks changes nothing ; what everyone says still applies . Please , please , give up this appproach . You 're only hurting those you claim to want to help .""",DISAGREE,"""I was very specific on whose marriages should be targeted""","""The fact that you have specific targets in mind for your attacks changes nothing""",,
18896,5033,"""Absolutely nothing could persuade me to change my mind . It is absolutely abhorrent to me that a woman would be denied ownership and autonomy over her own body . It is a gross violation of human rights and liberty . Here I stand , for liberty and human rights . I shall not be moved .""","""Human rights ? Is a human fetus ( a human child in the fetal stage of their life ) not a human life ? Do I even need to bother with linking to a dictionary on this one anymore ? Just one word ; `` Hypocrisy ``""",DISAGREE,"""It is absolutely abhorrent to me that a woman would be denied ownership and autonomy over her own body . It is a gross violation of human rights and liberty .""","""Human rights ? Is a human fetus ( a human child in the fetal stage of their life ) not a human life ?""",,
18906,5036,"""Evolution it seems can contain tautology , mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terminologies .""","""Evoluition : Change in allele frequency in a population over time . So .... where is your tautology , mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terms ? I 'm not seeing it there . Or are you arguing vs. some definition of evolution that you have n't yet presented ? Let 's see some bullet items to debate , not the sea-of-montalban's-ideas -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution it seems can contain tautology , mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terminologies .""","""Let 's see some bullet items to debate , not the sea-of-montalban's-ideas -Mach""",,
18911,5038,"""I 'd feel the same way about a teacher that tried to tell them about heterosexual relationships too .""","""Well then , have at it . The theme of the day was weddings . Almost everything taught that day , except for this one story , was about heterosexual marriage . Go on , show us your argument against teaching kids about how this society organizes familes . Your opposition to this , homo- or heterosexual , is so obviously contrived . School is there to help socialize children and instruct them in how to be good members of this society , AND YOU KNOW IT . The idea that you would prefer them to ignore discussions of family -- while you simultaneously assert that this society rests on the family and tradition -- is ludicrous . Come on , jyoshu , you do n't have to argue this one ... we wo n't tell your supervisor .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'd feel the same way about a teacher that tried to tell them about heterosexual relationships""","""everything taught that day , except for this one story , was about heterosexual marriage . you do n't have to argue this one""",,
18924,5041,"""Handguns are not necessary .""","""I think this is the crux of our disagreement . In my line of reasoning , I believe since criminals are obviously using firearms , the refusal to allow lawful citizens the same means of defense is unreasonable and unfair . Good people are required to `` bring a knife to a gunfight `` . ( i.e . disproportionate response ) While I believe that any law abiding citizen should be able to have access to the means to defend themselves , I think a reasonable compromise is possible between our two sides . How 's this : Instead of a complete ban , you concede that civilian gun ownership is a good thing and allow the reasonable ownership of handguns for personal protection . Instead of lassiz ' faire `` guns for all who want them `` , I 'll concede that a strict regimen of licencing and training/qualification for those who wish to purchase . ( In the U.K . Although this is reasonable , I 'm not going for it in the U.S . This would be a HUGE concession to government control here . ) A strict licencing/registration scheme would be allowing for MORE freedom in the U.K . It would be tightening a `` Nazi-like `` noose around our necks here in the U.S . If you are being burned at the stake , lethal injection sounds like a wonderful alternative . If you are walking down the sidewalk , it 's not quite as peachy .""",DISAGREE,"""Handguns are not necessary .""","""I believe since criminals are obviously using firearms , the refusal to allow lawful citizens the same means of defense is unreasonable and unfair .""",,
18931,5042,"""what makes there visions of otherworldly beings any differnt then that of moses or allah .""","""What makes them different is that Muslims believe in Allah , and Hindus do not .""",DISAGREE,"""any differnt moses or allah""","""makes them different Muslims believe in Allah , and Hindus do not""",,
18930,5042,"""what makes there visions of otherworldly beings any differnt then that of moses or allah .""","""What makes them different is that Muslims believe in Allah , and Hindus do not .""",DISAGREE,"""what makes there visions of otherworldly beings any differnt then that of moses or allah""","""is that Muslims believe in Allah , and Hindus do not""",,
18941,5043,"""think about what you just typed , that does n't make any sense .""","""There are a lot of these people do n't understand or do n't make sense to them . I guess the things that do n't are just stupid and made-up , huh ?""",DISAGREE,"""does n't make any sense""","""I guess the things that do n't are just stupid and made-up , huh ?""",,
18958,5044,"""When was the last mass murder at a UK university then ?""","""how about a Swiss University ? they have full automatic weapons in most homes , and target shooting is a national sport .""",DISAGREE,"""When was the last mass murder at a UK university then ?""","""target shooting is a national sport .""",,
18967,5045,"""The modern evolutionary synthesis ( often referred to simply as the new synthesis , the modern synthesis , the evolutionary synthesis , neo-Darwinian synthesis or neo-Darwinism ) , generally denotes the integration of Charles Darwin 's theory of the evolution of species by natural selection , Gregor Mendel 's theory of genetics as the basis for biological inheritance , random genetic mutation as the source of variation , and mathematical population genetics . Major figures in the development of the modern synthesis include Thomas Hunt Morgan , R. A. Fisher , Theodosius Dobzhansky , J.B.S . Haldane , Sewall Wright , Julian Huxley , Ernst Mayr , Bernhard Rensch , George Gaylord Simpson , and G. Ledyard Stebbins . Essentially , the modern synthesis introduced the connection between two important discoveries : the units of evolution ( genes ) and the mechanism of evolution ( selection ) . It also represents a unification of several branches of biology that previously had little in common , particularly genetics , cytology , systematics , botany , and paleontology .""","""and further :""",DISAGREE,"""The modern evolutionary synthesis ( often referred to simply as the new synthesis , the modern synthesis , the evolutionary synthesis , neo-Darwinian synthesis or neo-Darwinism ) ,""","""and further""",,
18973,5046,"""Your notion of `` proper `` behavior comes from a book written 2,000 years ago by ignorant people . You only perpetuate their ignorance .""","""And where , pray tell , does your un-'ignorant ' system of proper behaviour come from ?""",DISAGREE,"""Your notion of `` proper `` behavior comes from a book written 2,000 years ago by ignorant people .""","""And where , pray tell , does your un-'ignorant ' system of proper behaviour come from ?""",,
18976,5046,"""Your notion of `` proper `` behavior comes from a book written 2,000 years ago by ignorant people . You only perpetuate their ignorance .""","""And where , pray tell , does your un-'ignorant ' system of proper behaviour come from ?""",DISAGREE,"""proper comes from a book 2,000 years ago""","""And where un-'ignorant ' system of proper behaviour come from ?""",,
18981,5047,"""Have you ever explored micro-biology . It is the most amazing universe you 'd ever want to explore . It makes the macro-biology world look like lego blocks . If you 've ever looked up at the stars and stood in amazement , that 's childs play . Just a bunch of macro-scopic hyper-symmetric globules of matter interacting according to almost perfect text-book formulas . In the micro-biology world , we have almost no understanding of the complexities of interaction .. We have ZERO formulas that can predict appropriate interaction ( though we spend hundreds of billions of dollars trying 'guesswork ' in medical labs ) . micro-biology is the computer-programming world of individual atoms . The number of combinations of atomic interaction is mind-numbing - yet micro-biology has obviously harnessed certain useful patterns . Discovering DNA was like discovering that we can store programming code on electrical tape . That 's a great discovery , but that is a far cry from learning to create software artificial intelligence ( another area we 're probably 100 years away from ) . Defining 'life begins at conception ' is like saying that an airplane becomes an airplane when then contract is signed for a work-order . It 's a meaningless point in time relative to the MILLIONS of complex interactions that are necessary for an airplanes life-cycle . Conception is the formation of a zygote , two gametes that are wonderfully complex machines that come in contact in a VERY small subset of life forms ( most life-forms do not use sex-discrimination as a method of reproduction ) . If you looked at primitive single-celled micro-biology , you 'd be hard pressed to even begin to quantify it 's beauty and complexity . The fact that a subset of micro-biology happens to congregate into multi-cellular organisms for 'communal living ' has both advantages and disadvantages ( microbes will survive global warming , will we ? ) . With multi-cellular life , there 's sex and sexless reproduction ... Again , the conception ( from a mechanical perspective ) is all but meaningless . So to give significance to conception reveals several things about the promoter : 1 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the scope of complexities ( i.e . how primitive humans and our brains are compared to the mechanics of our micro-biological constituents ) 2 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the insignificance of conception as a process ( it merely promotes genetic diversity without the aid of external agents like viruses ) 3 ) There is likely an overt indoctrination of a spiritual element to conception/birth - cognitive dissidence is common where a decision that you 've made earlier in your life ( i.e . that the church is a good source of wisdom ) preempts future decisions , even in the face of new logical evidence . It follows that 'life ' as is primitively portrayed in the `` pro-life `` , `` pro-abortion `` debate neglects the fact that we are not individuals , but a collective of billions of life-forms . Many of which dedicate their brief life to specific mechanical functions ( formation of skin , hair , red-blood-cells , gametes , etc ) . Cells regularly 'commit suicide ' for the good of the collective ( they are programmed to do so ) . Thus the loss of a cell 's life is precious , to be honored , and for the purposes of our discussion , to be taken in context . A zygote is nothing more than a fraction of a second after a mechanical process of two would-be-dead gametes . There is no `` injection-of-a-soul `` . In Rush 's paradigm , I challenge you to know otherwise . There is no measureable change in energy/mass or even appearance . Nothing more than can be derived by watching individual molecular structures interacting with their otherwise boring chemical surroundings . A 'soul ' , as many would promote , must either be intrinsically present before the zygote or be non-existent . There is no measureable guidance ( no random operation - pure machine execution of pre-defined code sequences ) . And , FYI , the DNA is only a SMALL part of the code-sequencing . Each decade we discover new subtle aspects about micro-biology which humbles us in our lack of knowledge . The micro-biology-machine is glorious in it 's complexity . A 'soul ' as one can best be known could exist in the ancestry of micro-biology . The fore-bearers , a plausible architect . And in that vein , every cell that undergoes mitosis ( or meiosis in the formation of gametes ) is a subdivision of the ancestrial architecture . Not the formation of new 'life ' . Nothing changes from the moment prio to and there-after - conception . It is not important for this discussion to elaborate on the origins one way or another . My intent is to express the complete lack of appreciation for what is probably the most important thing humans will ever have the privledge of conceiving . That we truely are insignificant compared to this vast existence .. That we are happily living at the top of the food-chain and chain of understanding ( at least so far as we know there are no other being in our area with greater prowess ) . That we should be humble and respect 'life ' ( which hopefully I 've conveyed as greater than humanity by many orders of magnitude ) . That death is an intricate part of life .. That life MUST commit suicide for the benifit of the many in order for the aggregate to survive .. That given the power to decide who/what lives and dies is not unique to us - even the earliest mobile micro-biology wielded this power . That we must strive to only kill in balance and for the greater good . And from that greater good , abortion becomes a mechanical act with significance . Is the world a better place for the abortion ? Will life flourish because we 've chosen to exclude one lineage of genetic diversity from prospering ? I suggest that abortion can be part of the greater-good in many circumstances . To the same extent that not every sperm or egg is properly utilized .. The fact that some have unintentially become fertilized is irrelevant - to the same extent that a mechanical process is initiated unintentially ( like accidentally hitting the wrong button on the keyboard - you quickly hit the escape function to `` regain control `` ) . If the parents are not ready to organize their lives around producing the best possible children , then they are not fullfilling their duty as macro-scopic being . Or at least not fullfilling their potential and therefore arguably of little use to the collective . When you become parents , YOUR potential for growth is over .. That is , unless you adhere to the classical barefoot and pregnant mother , lifestyle , and you are the 'provider ' . Whatever worth you provide to the world is , in all probability , limited to your contribution as a parent . You are probably not going to become president , etc , and thus have direct political impact on world affairs . But you can choose to raise a child with patience , discipline , intellect , respect and inspiration . And thereby produce a well balanced human that maintains hope for the future of our species . Or you can rush into parenthood , with a disconnected/mal-adjusted family , producing a depressed/ suicidal/introverted offspring . Which , on average , will 'get by ' if not 'devolving ' due to lack of survival-based-genetic-cleansing that our ancestors underwent . I have personally gone through more than one abortion . But they were days after the incident - and as I promote above , the 'escape button ' . Soulfully irrelevant . Mechanically boring . The philosophical aspects are best left to the poets , who 've got nothing better to do with their lives , apparently . I have a beautiful daughter right now for whom I love with my every breath ; but I have no remorse over the false-starts of my past . And I argue , that if you think about it , neither should you .""","""Before writing your biography , Mariast , .... did you happen to note the title and subject of the thread ? '' What would it take to change your mind about abortion ? `` I have a beautiful daughter myself . Her life began at conception . How do I know this ? I was there . Her conception was the very first time that a part of me ( and a part of her mother ) became a part of Her .""",DISAGREE,"""Have you ever explored micro-biology Defining 'life begins at conception ' is like saying that an airplane becomes an airplane when then contract is signed for a work-order . It 's a meaningless point in time relative to the MILLIONS of complex interactions that are necessary for an airplanes life-cycle . ... Again , the conception ( from a mechanical perspective ) is all but meaningless . ``""","""Before writing your biography , Mariast , .... did you happen to note the title and subject of the thread ? '' `` Her life began at conception . How do I know this ? I was there . Her conception was the very first time that a part of me ( and a part of her mother ) became a part of Her .""",,
18983,5047,"""Have you ever explored micro-biology . It is the most amazing universe you 'd ever want to explore . It makes the macro-biology world look like lego blocks . If you 've ever looked up at the stars and stood in amazement , that 's childs play . Just a bunch of macro-scopic hyper-symmetric globules of matter interacting according to almost perfect text-book formulas . In the micro-biology world , we have almost no understanding of the complexities of interaction .. We have ZERO formulas that can predict appropriate interaction ( though we spend hundreds of billions of dollars trying 'guesswork ' in medical labs ) . micro-biology is the computer-programming world of individual atoms . The number of combinations of atomic interaction is mind-numbing - yet micro-biology has obviously harnessed certain useful patterns . Discovering DNA was like discovering that we can store programming code on electrical tape . That 's a great discovery , but that is a far cry from learning to create software artificial intelligence ( another area we 're probably 100 years away from ) . Defining 'life begins at conception ' is like saying that an airplane becomes an airplane when then contract is signed for a work-order . It 's a meaningless point in time relative to the MILLIONS of complex interactions that are necessary for an airplanes life-cycle . Conception is the formation of a zygote , two gametes that are wonderfully complex machines that come in contact in a VERY small subset of life forms ( most life-forms do not use sex-discrimination as a method of reproduction ) . If you looked at primitive single-celled micro-biology , you 'd be hard pressed to even begin to quantify it 's beauty and complexity . The fact that a subset of micro-biology happens to congregate into multi-cellular organisms for 'communal living ' has both advantages and disadvantages ( microbes will survive global warming , will we ? ) . With multi-cellular life , there 's sex and sexless reproduction ... Again , the conception ( from a mechanical perspective ) is all but meaningless . So to give significance to conception reveals several things about the promoter : 1 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the scope of complexities ( i.e . how primitive humans and our brains are compared to the mechanics of our micro-biological constituents ) 2 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the insignificance of conception as a process ( it merely promotes genetic diversity without the aid of external agents like viruses ) 3 ) There is likely an overt indoctrination of a spiritual element to conception/birth - cognitive dissidence is common where a decision that you 've made earlier in your life ( i.e . that the church is a good source of wisdom ) preempts future decisions , even in the face of new logical evidence . It follows that 'life ' as is primitively portrayed in the `` pro-life `` , `` pro-abortion `` debate neglects the fact that we are not individuals , but a collective of billions of life-forms . Many of which dedicate their brief life to specific mechanical functions ( formation of skin , hair , red-blood-cells , gametes , etc ) . Cells regularly 'commit suicide ' for the good of the collective ( they are programmed to do so ) . Thus the loss of a cell 's life is precious , to be honored , and for the purposes of our discussion , to be taken in context . A zygote is nothing more than a fraction of a second after a mechanical process of two would-be-dead gametes . There is no `` injection-of-a-soul `` . In Rush 's paradigm , I challenge you to know otherwise . There is no measureable change in energy/mass or even appearance . Nothing more than can be derived by watching individual molecular structures interacting with their otherwise boring chemical surroundings . A 'soul ' , as many would promote , must either be intrinsically present before the zygote or be non-existent . There is no measureable guidance ( no random operation - pure machine execution of pre-defined code sequences ) . And , FYI , the DNA is only a SMALL part of the code-sequencing . Each decade we discover new subtle aspects about micro-biology which humbles us in our lack of knowledge . The micro-biology-machine is glorious in it 's complexity . A 'soul ' as one can best be known could exist in the ancestry of micro-biology . The fore-bearers , a plausible architect . And in that vein , every cell that undergoes mitosis ( or meiosis in the formation of gametes ) is a subdivision of the ancestrial architecture . Not the formation of new 'life ' . Nothing changes from the moment prio to and there-after - conception . It is not important for this discussion to elaborate on the origins one way or another . My intent is to express the complete lack of appreciation for what is probably the most important thing humans will ever have the privledge of conceiving . That we truely are insignificant compared to this vast existence .. That we are happily living at the top of the food-chain and chain of understanding ( at least so far as we know there are no other being in our area with greater prowess ) . That we should be humble and respect 'life ' ( which hopefully I 've conveyed as greater than humanity by many orders of magnitude ) . That death is an intricate part of life .. That life MUST commit suicide for the benifit of the many in order for the aggregate to survive .. That given the power to decide who/what lives and dies is not unique to us - even the earliest mobile micro-biology wielded this power . That we must strive to only kill in balance and for the greater good . And from that greater good , abortion becomes a mechanical act with significance . Is the world a better place for the abortion ? Will life flourish because we 've chosen to exclude one lineage of genetic diversity from prospering ? I suggest that abortion can be part of the greater-good in many circumstances . To the same extent that not every sperm or egg is properly utilized .. The fact that some have unintentially become fertilized is irrelevant - to the same extent that a mechanical process is initiated unintentially ( like accidentally hitting the wrong button on the keyboard - you quickly hit the escape function to `` regain control `` ) . If the parents are not ready to organize their lives around producing the best possible children , then they are not fullfilling their duty as macro-scopic being . Or at least not fullfilling their potential and therefore arguably of little use to the collective . When you become parents , YOUR potential for growth is over .. That is , unless you adhere to the classical barefoot and pregnant mother , lifestyle , and you are the 'provider ' . Whatever worth you provide to the world is , in all probability , limited to your contribution as a parent . You are probably not going to become president , etc , and thus have direct political impact on world affairs . But you can choose to raise a child with patience , discipline , intellect , respect and inspiration . And thereby produce a well balanced human that maintains hope for the future of our species . Or you can rush into parenthood , with a disconnected/mal-adjusted family , producing a depressed/ suicidal/introverted offspring . Which , on average , will 'get by ' if not 'devolving ' due to lack of survival-based-genetic-cleansing that our ancestors underwent . I have personally gone through more than one abortion . But they were days after the incident - and as I promote above , the 'escape button ' . Soulfully irrelevant . Mechanically boring . The philosophical aspects are best left to the poets , who 've got nothing better to do with their lives , apparently . I have a beautiful daughter right now for whom I love with my every breath ; but I have no remorse over the false-starts of my past . And I argue , that if you think about it , neither should you .""","""Before writing your biography , Mariast , .... did you happen to note the title and subject of the thread ? '' What would it take to change your mind about abortion ? `` I have a beautiful daughter myself . Her life began at conception . How do I know this ? I was there . Her conception was the very first time that a part of me ( and a part of her mother ) became a part of Her .""",DISAGREE,"""Have you ever explored micro-biology . It is the most amazing universe you 'd ever want to explore . It makes the macro-biology world look like lego blocks""","""Before writing your biography , Mariast , .... did you happen to note the title and subject of the thread ?""",,
18987,5047,"""Have you ever explored micro-biology . It is the most amazing universe you 'd ever want to explore . It makes the macro-biology world look like lego blocks . If you 've ever looked up at the stars and stood in amazement , that 's childs play . Just a bunch of macro-scopic hyper-symmetric globules of matter interacting according to almost perfect text-book formulas . In the micro-biology world , we have almost no understanding of the complexities of interaction .. We have ZERO formulas that can predict appropriate interaction ( though we spend hundreds of billions of dollars trying 'guesswork ' in medical labs ) . micro-biology is the computer-programming world of individual atoms . The number of combinations of atomic interaction is mind-numbing - yet micro-biology has obviously harnessed certain useful patterns . Discovering DNA was like discovering that we can store programming code on electrical tape . That 's a great discovery , but that is a far cry from learning to create software artificial intelligence ( another area we 're probably 100 years away from ) . Defining 'life begins at conception ' is like saying that an airplane becomes an airplane when then contract is signed for a work-order . It 's a meaningless point in time relative to the MILLIONS of complex interactions that are necessary for an airplanes life-cycle . Conception is the formation of a zygote , two gametes that are wonderfully complex machines that come in contact in a VERY small subset of life forms ( most life-forms do not use sex-discrimination as a method of reproduction ) . If you looked at primitive single-celled micro-biology , you 'd be hard pressed to even begin to quantify it 's beauty and complexity . The fact that a subset of micro-biology happens to congregate into multi-cellular organisms for 'communal living ' has both advantages and disadvantages ( microbes will survive global warming , will we ? ) . With multi-cellular life , there 's sex and sexless reproduction ... Again , the conception ( from a mechanical perspective ) is all but meaningless . So to give significance to conception reveals several things about the promoter : 1 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the scope of complexities ( i.e . how primitive humans and our brains are compared to the mechanics of our micro-biological constituents ) 2 ) There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the insignificance of conception as a process ( it merely promotes genetic diversity without the aid of external agents like viruses ) 3 ) There is likely an overt indoctrination of a spiritual element to conception/birth - cognitive dissidence is common where a decision that you 've made earlier in your life ( i.e . that the church is a good source of wisdom ) preempts future decisions , even in the face of new logical evidence . It follows that 'life ' as is primitively portrayed in the `` pro-life `` , `` pro-abortion `` debate neglects the fact that we are not individuals , but a collective of billions of life-forms . Many of which dedicate their brief life to specific mechanical functions ( formation of skin , hair , red-blood-cells , gametes , etc ) . Cells regularly 'commit suicide ' for the good of the collective ( they are programmed to do so ) . Thus the loss of a cell 's life is precious , to be honored , and for the purposes of our discussion , to be taken in context . A zygote is nothing more than a fraction of a second after a mechanical process of two would-be-dead gametes . There is no `` injection-of-a-soul `` . In Rush 's paradigm , I challenge you to know otherwise . There is no measureable change in energy/mass or even appearance . Nothing more than can be derived by watching individual molecular structures interacting with their otherwise boring chemical surroundings . A 'soul ' , as many would promote , must either be intrinsically present before the zygote or be non-existent . There is no measureable guidance ( no random operation - pure machine execution of pre-defined code sequences ) . And , FYI , the DNA is only a SMALL part of the code-sequencing . Each decade we discover new subtle aspects about micro-biology which humbles us in our lack of knowledge . The micro-biology-machine is glorious in it 's complexity . A 'soul ' as one can best be known could exist in the ancestry of micro-biology . The fore-bearers , a plausible architect . And in that vein , every cell that undergoes mitosis ( or meiosis in the formation of gametes ) is a subdivision of the ancestrial architecture . Not the formation of new 'life ' . Nothing changes from the moment prio to and there-after - conception . It is not important for this discussion to elaborate on the origins one way or another . My intent is to express the complete lack of appreciation for what is probably the most important thing humans will ever have the privledge of conceiving . That we truely are insignificant compared to this vast existence .. That we are happily living at the top of the food-chain and chain of understanding ( at least so far as we know there are no other being in our area with greater prowess ) . That we should be humble and respect 'life ' ( which hopefully I 've conveyed as greater than humanity by many orders of magnitude ) . That death is an intricate part of life .. That life MUST commit suicide for the benifit of the many in order for the aggregate to survive .. That given the power to decide who/what lives and dies is not unique to us - even the earliest mobile micro-biology wielded this power . That we must strive to only kill in balance and for the greater good . And from that greater good , abortion becomes a mechanical act with significance . Is the world a better place for the abortion ? Will life flourish because we 've chosen to exclude one lineage of genetic diversity from prospering ? I suggest that abortion can be part of the greater-good in many circumstances . To the same extent that not every sperm or egg is properly utilized .. The fact that some have unintentially become fertilized is irrelevant - to the same extent that a mechanical process is initiated unintentially ( like accidentally hitting the wrong button on the keyboard - you quickly hit the escape function to `` regain control `` ) . If the parents are not ready to organize their lives around producing the best possible children , then they are not fullfilling their duty as macro-scopic being . Or at least not fullfilling their potential and therefore arguably of little use to the collective . When you become parents , YOUR potential for growth is over .. That is , unless you adhere to the classical barefoot and pregnant mother , lifestyle , and you are the 'provider ' . Whatever worth you provide to the world is , in all probability , limited to your contribution as a parent . You are probably not going to become president , etc , and thus have direct political impact on world affairs . But you can choose to raise a child with patience , discipline , intellect , respect and inspiration . And thereby produce a well balanced human that maintains hope for the future of our species . Or you can rush into parenthood , with a disconnected/mal-adjusted family , producing a depressed/ suicidal/introverted offspring . Which , on average , will 'get by ' if not 'devolving ' due to lack of survival-based-genetic-cleansing that our ancestors underwent . I have personally gone through more than one abortion . But they were days after the incident - and as I promote above , the 'escape button ' . Soulfully irrelevant . Mechanically boring . The philosophical aspects are best left to the poets , who 've got nothing better to do with their lives , apparently . I have a beautiful daughter right now for whom I love with my every breath ; but I have no remorse over the false-starts of my past . And I argue , that if you think about it , neither should you .""","""Before writing your biography , Mariast , .... did you happen to note the title and subject of the thread ? '' What would it take to change your mind about abortion ? `` I have a beautiful daughter myself . Her life began at conception . How do I know this ? I was there . Her conception was the very first time that a part of me ( and a part of her mother ) became a part of Her .""",DISAGREE,"""There is little appreciation , or at least little awareness of the insignificance of conception""","""Her conception was the very first time that a part of me""",,
18993,5048,"""The researchers suspect this cellular GPS system plays roles other than wound healing . The primary cilia could serve as a fail-safe device against uncontrolled cell movement , says Christensen . Without chemical stimulation , the primary cilia would restrain cell migration , preventing the dangerous displacement of cells that is associated with invasive cancers and fibrosis , the scientists explain . On the other hand , defective primary cilia might fail to provide correct directional instructions during cell differentiation . This failure could be another link connecting primary cilia to severe developmental disorders , the researchers suggest . Protruding through the cell membrane , primary cilia occur on almost every non-dividing cell in the body . Once written off as a vestigial organelle discarded in the evolutionary dust , primary cilia in the last decade have risen to prominence as a vital cellular sensor at the root of a wide range of health disorders , from polycystic kidney disease to cancer to left-right anatomical abnormalities .""","""Demonstrating the vacuity of preaching sub-optimal design ... an idea from faulty Darwinian reasoning ? And taking clues from original design ( cellular machinery ) to design our own optimal nanotechnology ? Does that make the original design optimal/above par/good ? Clockwork That Drives Powerful Virus Nanomotor Discovered""",DISAGREE,"""primary cilia in the last decade have risen to prominence as a vital cellular sensor at the root of a wide range of health disorders ,""","""Does that make the original design optimal/above par/good ?""",,
19006,5051,"""It is not a rational alternative to the theory of evolution , unless you can somehow show that you are n't relying on the unknowable .""","""But we also do n't know that evolution is true - it is a belief system about the past that requires faith for it to have any reason . Your first part is already false ( proved above ) .""",DISAGREE,"""is not a rational alternative to the theory of evolution""","""But we also do n't know that evolution is true""",,
19018,5053,"""Stop trying to muddy the waters . I asked you to back up your claim that gun control is racist . That is not asking others to do my work for me . That is asking you to back up a claim that you made .""","""So the `` black codes `` of the South was n't enough evidence for you ? The neonazi organizations , even with Hitler long dead , are still a racist , white supremacist , kill any minority you do n't like , organization . Time has n't changed them one bit from one the original nazi party stood for . If time has n't changed the nazis , of the KKK , why would time change what gun control was all about ; keeping blacks from being able to be truly free ?""",DISAGREE,"""I asked you to back up your claim that gun control is racist .""","""So the `` black codes `` of the South was n't enough evidence for you ?""",,
19021,5054,"""That 's what the world thought about Camp Delta , and the CIA prisons , and the invasion of Iraq . Since when has the Us given a damn about the views of otherplacians ?""","""I think a more sensible question would be `` How is this relevant ? '' .""",DISAGREE,"""Since when has the Us given a damn about the views of otherplacians ?""","""How is this relevant ?""",,
19022,5054,"""That 's what the world thought about Camp Delta , and the CIA prisons , and the invasion of Iraq . Since when has the Us given a damn about the views of otherplacians ?""","""I think a more sensible question would be `` How is this relevant ? '' .""",DISAGREE,"""Since when has the Us given a damn about the views of otherplacians ?""","""I think a more sensible question would be""",,
19055,5069,"""The zygote is the cell formed when the sperm fertilises the egg . The zygote has no brain , it has no conciousness . You have two tables , one with a small test tube which you know holds a microscopically small living zygote , and another table with a live baby . You are told that one of them will be destroyed and you have just two seconds to decide which , or both will be destroyed . Without a seconds thought I would immediately point in the direction of the zygote , and save the life of the baby . Extreme pro-lifers on the otherhand would probably end up killing the baby or both via indecision and inability to make a choice in just 2 seconds . That 's the morality of pro-life for you : the inability to realise that the chemical reactions that happen when a sperm meets an egg do not define a human person . Am I wrong ? I do n't believe so . The sperm meeting the egg is a really random point to decide the emergance of a human person . Why pick that point specifically ?""","""Let me pose a hypothetical question . Same scenario as yours above but instead there is a genetically normal zygote on one table or on the other table , there is a mentally retarded newborn baby ... which one will you choose if you had 2 seconds to choose ? You see life is existant at both stages , at the single cell and the newborn baby , but our view ( sometimes ignorance , sometimes selfishness ) is why we choose what we choose . So do tell me which one you will choose ?""",DISAGREE,"""the chemical reactions that happen when a sperm meets an egg do not define a human person""","""You see life is existant at both stages , at the single cell and the newborn baby , but our view ( sometimes ignorance , sometimes selfishness ) is why we choose what we choose .""",,
19052,5069,"""The zygote is the cell formed when the sperm fertilises the egg . The zygote has no brain , it has no conciousness . You have two tables , one with a small test tube which you know holds a microscopically small living zygote , and another table with a live baby . You are told that one of them will be destroyed and you have just two seconds to decide which , or both will be destroyed . Without a seconds thought I would immediately point in the direction of the zygote , and save the life of the baby . Extreme pro-lifers on the otherhand would probably end up killing the baby or both via indecision and inability to make a choice in just 2 seconds . That 's the morality of pro-life for you : the inability to realise that the chemical reactions that happen when a sperm meets an egg do not define a human person . Am I wrong ? I do n't believe so . The sperm meeting the egg is a really random point to decide the emergance of a human person . Why pick that point specifically ?""","""Let me pose a hypothetical question . Same scenario as yours above but instead there is a genetically normal zygote on one table or on the other table , there is a mentally retarded newborn baby ... which one will you choose if you had 2 seconds to choose ? You see life is existant at both stages , at the single cell and the newborn baby , but our view ( sometimes ignorance , sometimes selfishness ) is why we choose what we choose . So do tell me which one you will choose ?""",DISAGREE,"""The sperm meeting the egg is a really random point""","""life is at both stages , at the single cell and the newborn baby""",,
19064,5071,"""Termites produce two times the carbon dioxide that humans do ... let 's have a war with termites to get rid of some carbon dioxide . lol""","""That was jsut plain silly . A single car will produce more emmisiosn then all the termites in your state . Rember c02 is one part of the equation .""",DISAGREE,"""Termites produce two times the carbon dioxide that humans do .""","""A single car will produce more emmisiosn then all the termites in your state .""",,
19075,5072,"""you believe that if you kill yourself you go straight to hell just because it says so in the bible ? wow , then everyone is going to hell ; it says so in the bible . do you lie ? yes , then you are off to hell . are there gay christians ? yes , off to hell you go . do you ( or at least have you ) masturbate ( d ) ? yes , again , off to hell you go .""","""I believe that you will go to hell if you commit suicide . It does not say in the Bible that you will go to hell for lying . ( Where is your reference ? ) You can not be a Christian and be gay at the same time . That goes completely against scripture . You do n't go to hell for masturbating ! ( Once again , reference please . )""",DISAGREE,"""are there gay christians ?""","""You can not be a Christian and be gay at the same time""",,
19076,5073,"""Jyoshu , why are you trying so hard to spin this to make it look like PZ was trying to break the law , when he was attending an open advanced screening of a movie he participated in , was paid for , and in which he was thanked in the credits ?""","""I did n't say anything about anyone 'breaking the law . ' I 'm just showing you a different perspective of the events from a witness -- you know , giving you MORE information from which to draw conclusions . Or did you only WANT your information limited to one version of the story , mainly from the account of the one who got booted ? ? I think it was simply a private screening , and the people running the private screening did n't want them there . That 's their prerogative , as it was obviously a private screening and that 's the way it works . Again , read the comments on the blog I linked to as they include comments from people who were there , including more from Stuart and at least one by PZ Myers himself .""",DISAGREE,"""when he was attending an open advanced screening of a movie he participated in , was paid for , and in which he was thanked in the credits ?""","""did n't say anything about anyone 'breaking the law . ' showing you a different perspective of the events from a witness""",,
19088,5075,"""Of course it is . It is just one more cog in the wheel of our moral and social decline that will lead to our complete destruction as a rational and civilized Society . And the radical gay agenda has proven they have the same ethics as Al-Queda and practices a scorched Earth Policy too . You will gladly tear down our Democracy in order to gain the undeserved rights you demand for yourselves . You see nothing wrong with forcing the majority of the population to submit to the immoral will of a tiny minority when all of the human and civil rights protections have already been afforded you . But that is not enough for you . You must force your unnatural lifestyles in our faces and then insist we are bigots for not enjoying or just accepting the perversions you see as natural , normal and right . Just because you ca n't see , or refuse to see the long term negative effects of your unnatural lifestyle being imposed on the larger society , it does n't for one minute mean they are n't real and evident in their destructive consequences .""","""Maybe you 'd be happier living in a moslem nation like Iran or with the Taliban .""",DISAGREE,"""the majority of the population to submit to the immoral will of a tiny minority when all of the human and civil rights protections have already been afforded you""","""Maybe you 'd be happier living in a moslem nation like Iran or with the Taliban .""",,
19089,5075,"""Of course it is . It is just one more cog in the wheel of our moral and social decline that will lead to our complete destruction as a rational and civilized Society . And the radical gay agenda has proven they have the same ethics as Al-Queda and practices a scorched Earth Policy too . You will gladly tear down our Democracy in order to gain the undeserved rights you demand for yourselves . You see nothing wrong with forcing the majority of the population to submit to the immoral will of a tiny minority when all of the human and civil rights protections have already been afforded you . But that is not enough for you . You must force your unnatural lifestyles in our faces and then insist we are bigots for not enjoying or just accepting the perversions you see as natural , normal and right . Just because you ca n't see , or refuse to see the long term negative effects of your unnatural lifestyle being imposed on the larger society , it does n't for one minute mean they are n't real and evident in their destructive consequences .""","""Maybe you 'd be happier living in a moslem nation like Iran or with the Taliban .""",DISAGREE,"""Democracy in order to gain the undeserved rights you demand for yourselves .""","""Maybe you 'd be happier living in a moslem nation like Iran or with the Taliban""",,
19095,5076,"""I am aware of that . I am just having trouble reconciling the idea of removing a fundamental right based on a misdemeanor conviction and was wondering if there is similar precedent elsewhere .""","""I agree with you to some extent . First , the Mr. Hayes was convicted of this crime before the Lautenberg Amendment was passed . Secondly , Virginian law ( where the case originates from ) makes no distinction between a domestic relationship ( that which he was tried and convicted of ) and between the agressor . Quote majority ruling : A domestic relationship , although it must be established beyond a reasonable doubt in a §922 ( g ) ( 9 ) firearms possession prosecution , need not be a defining element of the predicate offense . Pp . 4–13 . Bulldung . If congress wanted to make it simpler they would have just said battery instead of domestic violence . How the heck they came up with that is beyond me . They basically expanded the meaning of the Lautenberg Amendment , which is a big NO NO ! I think that is what Justice Roberts was saying in his dissent . Quote Justice Roberts dissent : That reading does not require the specified domestic relationship in clause ( ii ) to be an element of the predicate misdemeanor statute . Individuals convicted under generic use-of-force statutes containing no reference to domestic violence would there-fore be subject to prosecution under §922 ( g ) ( 9 ) . .... The majority also points out that interpreting  “ commit-ted by ” to modify the  “ use ” of force would render the word “ committed ” superfluous . That may be so , but as shown , reading  “ committed by ” to modify  “ offense ” has its own flaws . All this goes to show that the statute is not an example of elegant syntax under either reading . The majority properly acknowledges that , under its view , the statutory language reflects  “ less-than-meticulous drafting ” and  “ syntactical awkwardness ,  ” and  “ is not a model of the careful drafter ’ s art. ” Ante , at 6 , 12 , 13 . I am willing to acknowledge the same with respect to my reading . But I conclude from such reciprocal shortcomings that the text is at least ambiguous . Which is why this law needs to be rewritten . There is a lot more , but I find the majority decision hard to believe . It just does n't make sense ( well to me that is . ) BTW , this by no means I support Domestic Violent offenders , etc . On the contrary , I believe they should lose their gun rights if convicted of domestic violence , BUT , this decision is wrong . The pieces do not fit together . That is Mr. Hayes was convicted of battery , not domestic violence . The government screwed up , so he should be walking free right now .""",AGREE,"""I am just having trouble reconciling the idea of removing a fundamental right based on a misdemeanor""","""I agree with you""",,
19105,5080,"""So even though this man is in no way an anti-evolutionist , even he had to admit that what had been not only assumed to be true about the coelacanth , but had been widely reported as a discovery which was supported by documented fossil evidence , was a complete myth . Which I believe and assert can be said for all of the so called evidence which exists for the pseudo science of evolution .""","""He 's not talking about the fossil Coelacanth , he 's talking about the modern version of it . And you can assert all you want , without evidence , they 're just that , assertions .""",DISAGREE,"""but had been widely reported as a discovery which was supported by documented fossil evidence , was a complete myth .""","""He 's not talking about the fossil Coelacanth , he 's talking about the modern version of it . And you can assert all you want""",,
19123,5084,"""The fear on the street is palpable . Ever since the election of Barack Obama as President of these United States in November 2008 , coupled with the election of a democrat party majority in both the U.S. House and Senate , concern for the United States and personal safety has ignited like a fire in dry grass . < snip > What is odd about this new fear is that it is not coming from the average citizen gun owner out there , but it is coming from what to me is an almost shocking source : street cops . Street cops and SWAT cops that I know from various agencies – rural , suburban and metro – in my area are scared . Cops that before November 2008 never gave much thought ( that I knew of anyway ) to politics or more importantly to gun rights . For the most part , these are the guys that didn ’ t generally have any interest in shooting or gun ownership beyond keeping track of where their duty gun is , and a few of them didn ’ t even do that so well . The guys I am talking about now are some of the same guys who used to not even carry off duty on a regular basis- but not anymore . They don ’ t scare easily , defenders of the Constitution of this State and the United States ( as our oath of office reads ) , have been buying ARs , survival gear , and all the ammo they can lay their hands on . All of them ( or I should say  “ us ” ) have been discussing and have been acquiring guns to provide a layered perimeter defense . What are we suddenly so afraid of ? Well in our discussions it seems to boil down to four areas ... First , fear of federal government intrusion into our lives . Every time I look at or listen to the news , there is something new and intrusive coming out of the Obama administration and this Congress . New tax schemes , government-run Canadian-style healthcare , a volunteer citizen defense force ( whatever that is , what happened to the National Guard ? ) equipped with funding similar to our military , forced voluntary  “ service ” after retirement , a lack of a southern border with hordes of illegal and criminal aliens pouring over our border , the swine flu scare as well as government forced closing of thousands of privately held Chrysler and GM dealerships , which will be the final nail in the coffin for these companies and the list goes on and on . But these items in the news are just the tip of the iceberg . We can ’ t see the full impact of these actions yet , but we don ’ t know what was added into the thousand of pages of stimulus package bills in the dead of night yet . I predict however that when the plans contained in the stimulus packages go into effect , a lot of us are going to be surprised if not shocked by what has suddenly and sweepingly changed . What also scares us is the second , well-founded fear that there is an assault weapons ban looming , one that would make the Clinton Ban appear like a look of disdain in comparison . I remember well the 1990s and the Clinton years : the rise of militia groups , the  “ black helicopter ” rumors and paranoia , all of which was motivated by the Brady Law and the Assault Weapon ’ s ban . What if a new ban comes requiring registration or confiscation and turn-in of banned weapons as what happened in Australia ? I foresee much civil disobedience coming down the road . Americans are citizens , and not subjects like the British , Canadians or Australians . They just don ’ t always obey the law blindly and not one officer or citizen that I spoke to said anything like  “ I hope I get to keep this gun for awhile before they are banned ; They are fun to shoot , so I would hate to give it up. ” It isn ’ t going to happen , so the cop on the street and the soldier on the base needs to think now what he will do if the orders come down . I think you all get what I am saying here . Which leads me to the third fear , that there is a revolution coming , yes , a revolution on the scale of the original American Revolution . You can hear this topic discussed on many of the talk radio shows by even the big name hosts . The possibility of an armed revolution against the U.S. government being discussed , albeit very gingerly and fleetingly and as something to be avoided , which it is . I never heard this mentioned in the 90s . One of my quietest , low profile officer friends brought it up the other day . He said that at some point in the near future , he felt there is going to be an armed revolt if things keep going the way they are . Something has got to give . I was shocked . Yes , I had heard this from some of my more radical cop friends in the past , but to hear it from a guy like this was unprecedented . Now , these guys are not saying this will happen to foment revolution , preach sedition or to even participate . They just want to be ready if it happens , to at least defend their families , because number four on the fear list is general societal chaos . Cops fear for their parents , wives , children or grandchildren more now than ever before . Most cops are encouraging their spouses and loved ones to get concealed carry permits . Not only that , but some of these same cops are buying gun mounts for their personal cars so they can carry an AR in the family ride at the ready all the time . They are also strapping on heavier forms of off-duty hardware . I have other friends that are issued ARs or subguns for tactical team use , who always have their gear with them and are planning on just commandeering these weapons for personal use in defending hearth and home . Final Notes This is pretty heady and maybe even dangerous stuff . Know fully that I am not advocating anything here . I am reflecting to you what I see and hear going on around me , and maybe saying things that haven ’ t been said in the open , until now . It is something to think about .""","""To our fellow Americans on the Left . Think carefully before you overplay your cards ! But what do I know . I am just a dumb Hillbilly pickup driving , Dumb Bunny !""",AGREE,"""fear is palpable election of a party fear of federal government lack of southern border possibility of armed revolution dangerous stuff""","""To our fellow Americans Left Think carefully overplay your cards ! just a dumb Hillbilly pickup driving , Dumb Bunny !""",,
19125,5084,"""The fear on the street is palpable . Ever since the election of Barack Obama as President of these United States in November 2008 , coupled with the election of a democrat party majority in both the U.S. House and Senate , concern for the United States and personal safety has ignited like a fire in dry grass . < snip > What is odd about this new fear is that it is not coming from the average citizen gun owner out there , but it is coming from what to me is an almost shocking source : street cops . Street cops and SWAT cops that I know from various agencies – rural , suburban and metro – in my area are scared . Cops that before November 2008 never gave much thought ( that I knew of anyway ) to politics or more importantly to gun rights . For the most part , these are the guys that didn ’ t generally have any interest in shooting or gun ownership beyond keeping track of where their duty gun is , and a few of them didn ’ t even do that so well . The guys I am talking about now are some of the same guys who used to not even carry off duty on a regular basis- but not anymore . They don ’ t scare easily , defenders of the Constitution of this State and the United States ( as our oath of office reads ) , have been buying ARs , survival gear , and all the ammo they can lay their hands on . All of them ( or I should say  “ us ” ) have been discussing and have been acquiring guns to provide a layered perimeter defense . What are we suddenly so afraid of ? Well in our discussions it seems to boil down to four areas ... First , fear of federal government intrusion into our lives . Every time I look at or listen to the news , there is something new and intrusive coming out of the Obama administration and this Congress . New tax schemes , government-run Canadian-style healthcare , a volunteer citizen defense force ( whatever that is , what happened to the National Guard ? ) equipped with funding similar to our military , forced voluntary  “ service ” after retirement , a lack of a southern border with hordes of illegal and criminal aliens pouring over our border , the swine flu scare as well as government forced closing of thousands of privately held Chrysler and GM dealerships , which will be the final nail in the coffin for these companies and the list goes on and on . But these items in the news are just the tip of the iceberg . We can ’ t see the full impact of these actions yet , but we don ’ t know what was added into the thousand of pages of stimulus package bills in the dead of night yet . I predict however that when the plans contained in the stimulus packages go into effect , a lot of us are going to be surprised if not shocked by what has suddenly and sweepingly changed . What also scares us is the second , well-founded fear that there is an assault weapons ban looming , one that would make the Clinton Ban appear like a look of disdain in comparison . I remember well the 1990s and the Clinton years : the rise of militia groups , the  “ black helicopter ” rumors and paranoia , all of which was motivated by the Brady Law and the Assault Weapon ’ s ban . What if a new ban comes requiring registration or confiscation and turn-in of banned weapons as what happened in Australia ? I foresee much civil disobedience coming down the road . Americans are citizens , and not subjects like the British , Canadians or Australians . They just don ’ t always obey the law blindly and not one officer or citizen that I spoke to said anything like  “ I hope I get to keep this gun for awhile before they are banned ; They are fun to shoot , so I would hate to give it up. ” It isn ’ t going to happen , so the cop on the street and the soldier on the base needs to think now what he will do if the orders come down . I think you all get what I am saying here . Which leads me to the third fear , that there is a revolution coming , yes , a revolution on the scale of the original American Revolution . You can hear this topic discussed on many of the talk radio shows by even the big name hosts . The possibility of an armed revolution against the U.S. government being discussed , albeit very gingerly and fleetingly and as something to be avoided , which it is . I never heard this mentioned in the 90s . One of my quietest , low profile officer friends brought it up the other day . He said that at some point in the near future , he felt there is going to be an armed revolt if things keep going the way they are . Something has got to give . I was shocked . Yes , I had heard this from some of my more radical cop friends in the past , but to hear it from a guy like this was unprecedented . Now , these guys are not saying this will happen to foment revolution , preach sedition or to even participate . They just want to be ready if it happens , to at least defend their families , because number four on the fear list is general societal chaos . Cops fear for their parents , wives , children or grandchildren more now than ever before . Most cops are encouraging their spouses and loved ones to get concealed carry permits . Not only that , but some of these same cops are buying gun mounts for their personal cars so they can carry an AR in the family ride at the ready all the time . They are also strapping on heavier forms of off-duty hardware . I have other friends that are issued ARs or subguns for tactical team use , who always have their gear with them and are planning on just commandeering these weapons for personal use in defending hearth and home . Final Notes This is pretty heady and maybe even dangerous stuff . Know fully that I am not advocating anything here . I am reflecting to you what I see and hear going on around me , and maybe saying things that haven ’ t been said in the open , until now . It is something to think about .""","""To our fellow Americans on the Left . Think carefully before you overplay your cards ! But what do I know . I am just a dumb Hillbilly pickup driving , Dumb Bunny !""",AGREE,"""I am reflecting to you what I see and hear going on around me , and maybe saying things that haven ’ t been said in the open , until now .""","""To our fellow Americans on the Left .""",,
19126,5085,"""For one to have evolution as their foundation belief , means that one can not be certian of anything ..... There are no absalutes to build from !""","""And as already shown ... `` Scientism , in the strong sense , is the self-annihilating view that only scientific claims are meaningful , which is not a scientific claim and hence , if true , not meaningful. `` http : //skepdic.com/scientism.html Scientism and Objectivism are from the sins of pride ; that man can know everything . It was the first sin ; the first temptation of Adam + EVe . There is no logic to the belief that man can know everything . How can it be believed when 'everything ' is not yet known ; there could be things found that man will never be able to determine what they are .""",AGREE,"""For one to have evolution as their foundation belief ,""","""And as already shown ... `` Scientism , in the strong sense ,""",,
19129,5085,"""For one to have evolution as their foundation belief , means that one can not be certian of anything ..... There are no absalutes to build from !""","""And as already shown ... `` Scientism , in the strong sense , is the self-annihilating view that only scientific claims are meaningful , which is not a scientific claim and hence , if true , not meaningful. `` http : //skepdic.com/scientism.html Scientism and Objectivism are from the sins of pride ; that man can know everything . It was the first sin ; the first temptation of Adam + EVe . There is no logic to the belief that man can know everything . How can it be believed when 'everything ' is not yet known ; there could be things found that man will never be able to determine what they are .""",AGREE,"""means that one can not be of anything no to build from !""","""is not everything no logic to the belief that man can know everything ' yet known there could be things found that man will never be able to determine""",,
19132,5086,"""I am pro-life ......""","""* interupts debate for a second * Yay ! Welcome .""",DISAGREE,"""I am""","""* debate for second * Yay ! Welcome""",,
19156,5090,"""this thread is odd .... are you implying that `` anti-choice `` ( I am going to use `` pro death `` for your position now ) folks want people in Africa to die ? You still have no idea what the `` anti-choice `` position is about and that is why your argument always fails""","""Run that by me again ? That does not make any sense ! Are you upset ?""",DISAGREE,"""are you implying that `` anti-choice `` ( I am going to use `` pro death `` for your position now ) folks want people in Africa to die ?""","""Run that by me again ? That does not make any sense ! Are you upset ?""",,
19163,5092,"""However macroevolution is quite diffrent .""","""No . It 's not . Speciation has been observed . After two lines of organisms are separated for millions of years , they are no longer able to interbreed . Oh , I forgot . You think the earth is only a few thousand years old because your mythology that you believe by faith tells you that .""",DISAGREE,"""macroevolution quite diffrent""","""No . It 's not . After two lines of organisms are separated for millions of years , they are no longer able to interbreed .""",,
19169,5094,"""Maths can delve into possibilities . What are the possibilities that random selection could occur ?""","""What are the possibilities that those doing the Maths realize that selection is NOT random ? Pretty low , it appears ...""",DISAGREE,"""What are the possibilities that random selection could occur ?""","""What are the possibilities Pretty low , it appears""",,
19172,5095,"""10 . ) Show me one instance of a mutation that created a beneficial , selectable modification to an existing structure .""","""Ah , this is a much better place to employ the sickle cell example . Also there are squillions of examples in evolutionary bacteriology .""",DISAGREE,"""Show me one instance a mutation that created a beneficial , selectable modification to an existing structure .""","""Ah , this is a much better place to employ the sickle cell example there are squillions of examples in evolutionary bacteriology""",,
19198,5102,"""Stevens said that bear arms has a military meaning . So was he saying that the right is individual but existed in connection with militia service ? Is this some kind of hybrid model ? Interestingly , scholars who made similar claims in the past got lumped in with those who supported a collective right by the pro gun crowd . But I suppose it sounds good to say that all nine Supreme Court justices supported an individual rights interpretation .""","""`` 4 JUSTICE STEVENS criticizes us for discussing the prologue last . Post , at 8 . But if a prologue can be used only to clarify an ambiguous operative provision , surely the first step must be to determine whether the operative provision is ambiguous . It might be argued , we suppose , that the prologue itself should be one of the factors that go into the determination of whether the operative provision is ambiguous & # 8212 ; but that would cause the prologue to be used to produce ambiguity rather than just to resolve it . In any event , even if we considered the prologue along with the operative provision we would reach the same result we do today , since ( as we explain ) our interpretation of & # 8220 ; the right of the people to keep and bear arms & # 8221 ; furthers the purpose of an effective militia no less than ( indeed , more than ) the dissent & # 8217 ; s interpretation . See infra , at 26 & # 8211 ; 27 . 5 JUSTICE STEVENS is of course correct , post , at 10 , that the right to assemble can not be exercised alone , but it is still an individual right , and not one conditioned upon membership in some defined & # 8220 ; assembly , & # 8221 ; as he contends the right to bear arms is conditioned upon membership in a defined militia . And JUSTICE STEVENS is dead wrong to think that the right to petition is & # 8220 ; primarily collective in nature. & # 8221 ; Ibid . See McDonald v. Smith , 472 U. S. 479 , 482 & # 8211 ; 484 ( 1985 ) ( describing historical origins of right to petition ) . `` DC v. Heller Pages 8 and 9""",AGREE,"""Stevens said that bear arms has a military meaning . who supported a collective right by the pro gun crowd""","""criticizes us for discussing the prologue last .""",,
19200,5102,"""Stevens said that bear arms has a military meaning . So was he saying that the right is individual but existed in connection with militia service ? Is this some kind of hybrid model ? Interestingly , scholars who made similar claims in the past got lumped in with those who supported a collective right by the pro gun crowd . But I suppose it sounds good to say that all nine Supreme Court justices supported an individual rights interpretation .""","""`` 4 JUSTICE STEVENS criticizes us for discussing the prologue last . Post , at 8 . But if a prologue can be used only to clarify an ambiguous operative provision , surely the first step must be to determine whether the operative provision is ambiguous . It might be argued , we suppose , that the prologue itself should be one of the factors that go into the determination of whether the operative provision is ambiguous & # 8212 ; but that would cause the prologue to be used to produce ambiguity rather than just to resolve it . In any event , even if we considered the prologue along with the operative provision we would reach the same result we do today , since ( as we explain ) our interpretation of & # 8220 ; the right of the people to keep and bear arms & # 8221 ; furthers the purpose of an effective militia no less than ( indeed , more than ) the dissent & # 8217 ; s interpretation . See infra , at 26 & # 8211 ; 27 . 5 JUSTICE STEVENS is of course correct , post , at 10 , that the right to assemble can not be exercised alone , but it is still an individual right , and not one conditioned upon membership in some defined & # 8220 ; assembly , & # 8221 ; as he contends the right to bear arms is conditioned upon membership in a defined militia . And JUSTICE STEVENS is dead wrong to think that the right to petition is & # 8220 ; primarily collective in nature. & # 8221 ; Ibid . See McDonald v. Smith , 472 U. S. 479 , 482 & # 8211 ; 484 ( 1985 ) ( describing historical origins of right to petition ) . `` DC v. Heller Pages 8 and 9""",AGREE,"""Stevens said that bear arms has a military meaning""","""the right of the people to keep and bear arms""",,
19216,5106,"""Smoking tobacco is quite unhealthy even without pesticides .""","""Oh , really ? Does that mean that pesticides will be OK on marijuana plants ? NO .""",DISAGREE,"""unhealthy even without pesticides .""","""Does that mean that pesticides will be OK on marijuana plants ?""",,
19219,5106,"""Smoking tobacco is quite unhealthy even without pesticides .""","""Oh , really ? Does that mean that pesticides will be OK on marijuana plants ? NO .""",DISAGREE,"""Smoking tobacco is quite unhealthy""","""pesticides will be OK on marijuana plants ?""",,
19226,5108,"""Right now , I might consider it , as I am now a few weeks away from my graduation . Back then , I would not , as I had just begun college ( I was in my sophomore year for my BS - now I 'm about to get my MS ) . However , there is also that other major part of my decision - I never had the intention to become pregnant , and we even took steps to make sure I would n't . That also is a major factor in any of my decisions on it . Another decision that involves my work is that from about my fifth month on ( acording to the doctors I spoke with ) - I would be unable to work - that 's four months , and while right now I am in good standing with my company and they might even allow me to do that , back then I was just starting out , and would be unable to do so . So , I 'd say that at the moment if that were to happen , and that I was paid a stipend ( I know of no place near me that does so ) and then gave the baby up for adoption , my fiance and I would seriously consider the prospect . I know that in the future - in five years or so - we expect to be able to have paid off all our loans , and we will then consider actually having a baby . So in summary - now I would consider it , but back when I had the actual abortion ( 6 years ago or so ) I would not consider it .""","""That sounds like an honest answer . How did you feel about it at the time ? How do you feel about it now ? Just trying to educate myself more . Huck""",AGREE,"""I might consider it just begun college""","""sounds like an honest answer Just trying to educate myself more .""",,
19269,5116,"""You have beliefs not based on science , but my beliefs not based on your version of science are irrational ?""","""But you have challenged science with your beliefs . You argue against science with your beliefs , based on mythology with no evidential support . You argue against real science so that you can cling to your fairy tales .""",DISAGREE,"""but my beliefs not based on your version of science are irrational ?""","""You argue against science with your beliefs , based on mythology with no evidential support""",,
19279,5120,"""The Killing of George Tiller : A `` Pro-life `` Murder ? '' Pro-life `` as the self-description of the anti-abortion movement has a fundamental flaw at its heart . The moral absolute of `` life `` is not applied consistently , in my view , by the majority of those in this movement . Many in the `` pro-life `` anti-abortion movement seem to me to only be pro-life in the case of abortion -- unlike those who hold an ethic of life across a range of moral issues , not only abortion but also war and the death penalty , This makes `` pro-life `` in regard to abortion not only an inconsistent ethic , but an unstable one . Nothing exposes this fundamental inconsistency and instability in the ethic of life as a description of the anti-abortion movement more than `` pro-life `` murder . .... Violence has been a part of the anti-abortion movement from the beginning , from the overt violence of the murder of other abortion providers to the covert violence of harassing women trying to get to clinics for reproductive services . Violence is a logical outcome of the extreme self-righteousness of those who claim the `` pro-life `` label as an absolute and yet who do not have an actual , consistent ethic of life such as the views held by pacifists . Dr. Charles Kimball , a Baptist minister and professor of religion at Wake Forest University , well explains this logical connection in his book When Religion Becomes Evil . According to Kimball , two warning signs that indicate a religious viewpoint is becoming evil are `` absolute truth claims `` and `` the end justifies any means. `` Violence , in Kimball 's view , is an evil .""","""On Faith : The Killing of George Tiller : A `` Pro-life `` Murder ? - Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite Murder is murder and abortion is not , to steal a phrase from Rabbi Arthur Waskow :""",DISAGREE,"""The Killing of George Tiller : A `` Pro-life `` Murder ? '' Pro-life `` as the self-description of the anti-abortion movement has a fundamental flaw at its heart""","""Murder is murder and abortion is not""",,
19290,5125,"""I do n't 'CHOOSE ' who I think is sexually attractive .""","""i disagree . being heterosexual does not mean you are sexually attractive to every female you come into contact with . you have a set of criteria that you use to determine which female is sexy . most boys ( depending on how they are taught ) are not sexually attracted to their sisters , mothers or females in their immediate family , regardless of how good-looking they are . yet they would be attracted to another female with the same body type and features . how do you explain that ?""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't 'CHOOSE ' who I think is sexually attractive .""","""i disagree . being heterosexual does not mean you are sexually attractive to every female""",,
19296,5126,"""Huh ? How was allowing you to make your own decisions in your own personal life interferance by the goverment ? That 's like saying a parent allowing a child to do what they wish intefering in their personal lives . How are they interferring when they are letting them do what they wish ? You 're not making any sense at all . Sadly yes . People should be able to make their own decisions without a nanny state , but that 's not going to change as the Gop holds the federal govermment . Beyond the fact that government said that you can have a abortion , they were not interferring with your decisions . A goverment that actively promotes freedoms and rights is not interfering with the lives as a govermment that actively restricts rights and monitors for such violations in the personal lives of its citizens .""","""so first you tell me `` how are they intefering by letting them do as they wish `` How are they letting them do as they wish when there are restrictions ? then you say `` sadly yes people should be able to make their own decisions without a nanny state `` am I the only one that does n't get that ?""",DISAGREE,"""How are they interferring when they are letting them do what they wish ? You 're not making any sense at all . Sadly yes . People should be able to make their own decisions without a nanny state , but that 's not going to change as the Gop holds the federal govermment .""","""so first you tell me `` how are they intefering by letting them do as they wish `` How are they letting them do as they wish when there are restrictions ? then you say `` sadly yes people should be able to make their own decisions without a nanny state `` am I the only one that does n't get that ?""",,
19304,5128,"""For the pro-life community , the issue comes down to the fact that every human being has intrinsic value and worth , and their life is valuable for its own sake""","""Really ? 'cuss what I always see with anti-choicers is that they seem to think that the pregnant woman is invisible . This means that all men and all fetuses have a right to life at all times , but women , for some unknown reason , seem to lose that right when they become pregnant . Weird .""",DISAGREE,"""every human being has intrinsic value and worth""","""what I always see with anti-choicers is that they seem to think that the pregnant woman is invisible""",,
19319,5132,"""And it 's politics were talking about here , not home life . If you 're getting into polical discussions and find yourself on the same side as the KKK , you may well benefit from re-examine your positions .""","""Oh , it 's politics ! [ Slapping forehead with hand ] What was I thinking ? ? If I find any KKK members are against relaxing drug laws , I guess I 'd better change my view and start opposing drug laws . And if I happen to find that there are KKK members who do n't mind U.S. involvement in the UN , I 'll be sure and oppose any U.S. involvement in the U.N . I wonder if any of them have parents on medicare ? Doh ! ! Guess I better oppose any form of socialized healthcare !""",DISAGREE,"""And it 's politics were talking about here , not home life . If you 're getting into polical discussions and find yourself on the same side as the KKK , you may well benefit from re-examine your positions .""","""Oh , it 's politics ! [ Slapping forehead with hand ] What was I thinking ? ? If I find any KKK members are against relaxing drug laws , I guess I 'd better change my view and start opposing drug laws . And if I happen to find that there are KKK members who do n't mind U.S. involvement in the UN , I 'll be sure and oppose any U.S. involvement in the U.N . I wonder if any of them have parents on medicare ? Doh ! ! Guess I better oppose any form of socialized healthcare !""",,
19325,5133,"""No it can not exist without being subject to God 's Will . The only way the hypotehtical Rock could exist would be if God would deem to give the rock Free Will and then deem to honor the rock 's Free Will as God honors Free Will -- the vast majority of the time -- within people . This hypothetical is rather pedistrian .""","""an unbreakable rock can not exist , simply because its illogical , not because of God 's will . as long as something is classified as a rock , or any other solid for that matter , it can break . in the same way God can not create a round square . then again , God can set limits on himself , in that he can create a situation that he himself can not revoke . in a way it is similar to the hard rock question . for instance , God can not undo his word . if he says something will happen , or never happen , then it can never be undone . according to genesis , one of the things God can not do is destroy the earth by water . in this sense , here is something God can not do . by God 's own declarations he limits his possible actions . but it doesnt make him less than omnipotent . he still possesses the ABILITY to destroy the earth by global flood , but he can not because he can not lie , and for every declaration he makes , its one more thing he can not do""",DISAGREE,"""it can not exist without being subject to God 's Will""","""illogical , here is something God can not do , but he can not because he can not lie""",,
19340,5136,"""many of my friends growing up had the type of parents that didnt want them or didnt love them enough etc . . . and most of them are in the process of falling through the cracks and most likely will be the next person to rob you . I wouldnt ask ANYONE ( even a pro lifer ) to have to live a unloved life and be unhappy .""","""So , are you saying your friends do n't deserve to live because they have no morals ? I hope you do n't blame the parents for the kids lack of judgement . They really have no excuse . There are , I am sure , many good families that have raised criminals . One of the things that mark maturity is not blaming your parents for your downfalls . So are you saying that a person that is unloved in their youth would have been better off not having a shot at life ? If you are please consider : My Mom and Dad had the abortion appointment set up . That 's how unwanted I was . Do you think I do n't have a right to life ? That I was better served not being able to give life a go ? My sister was divorced ( for lack of a better word ) from her parents , are you saying because they treated her poor she was better off not being ? A lousy beginning in life does not mean that a person 's whole life will be worthless or unhappy . have a nice day , heidi""",DISAGREE,"""many of my friends growing up had the type of parents that didnt want them or didnt love them enough""","""I hope you do n't blame the parents for the kids lack of judgement .""",,
19361,5140,"""2 . Does anyone know who first discovered cave heiroglyphics of what we would call a `` cave man ? ``""","""`` cave men `` did not leave hieroglyphs , unless you want to call ancient Egyptians cave men . The first drawings in caves were found by Marcelino Sanz de Sautuola in 1879 .""",DISAGREE,"""Does anyone know who first discovered cave heiroglyphics of what we would call a `` cave man ? ``""","""cave men `` did not leave hieroglyphs , unless you want to call ancient Egyptians cave men .""",,
19372,5142,"""Innocent humans beings are those free from guilt . Fetuses are free from guilt . Therefore , the fetus is innocent .""","""Oh , the dichotomous world . I almost envy your ignorant bliss . Everything so simple , so categorized , so neat and organized ... .... and then there 's the real world . The real world is n't made of dichotomies like whore who should pay for her sins vs. innocent pure-hearted baby victim . Good/evil , god/devil , white/black ... blah , blah , blah ...""",DISAGREE,"""Innocent humans beings are those free from guilt . Fetuses are free from guilt . Therefore , the fetus is innocent .""","""Oh , the dichotomous world . I almost envy your ignorant bliss . Everything so simple , so categorized , so neat and organized""",,
19377,5143,"""1+1=2 if we know the meaning or not""","""Thank you for repeating me .""",AGREE,"""1+1=2 if we know the meaning or not""","""Thank you for repeating me .""",,
19381,5143,"""1+1=2 if we know the meaning or not""","""Thank you for repeating me .""",AGREE,"""if we know the meaning or not""","""Thank you for repeating me .""",,
19396,5146,"""I would n't say one ca n't be a Christian if they support abortion but I find it really hard to understand how one justifies or rectifies it with the Bible or their faith . Ultimately their are responsible to God for what they believe and how they advise others on what to do in a situation based on that belief . I know that one of the things God HATES and there are n't many things mentioned in the bible that He hates , one of the things is the shedding of innocent blood . If God HATES such a thing then I certainly do not want to support it . I do n't know what could be more innocent than an unborn child . I did a bit of research on abortion & amp ; the bible a few years ago , here is a collection of what I found - Abortion & amp ; The Bible""","""Can we get away from quoting 5 year old posts ? Seriously , if you do n't take the time to actually read the thread why should I respond to your post ?""",DISAGREE,"""I did a bit of research on abortion & the bible a few years ago , here is a collection of what I found - Abortion & The Bible""","""if you do n't take the time to actually read the thread why should I respond to your post ?""",,
19399,5147,"""20 billion years ago there was a Big Bang [ what exploded : since the year 2006 , scientists have claimed that nothing exploded into the universe !""","""Actually its 14 billion years . Hovind is not claiming what science does .""",DISAGREE,"""20 billion years ago there was a Big Bang""","""Actually its 14 billion years .""",,
19417,5151,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason I do intend to help my community and share the responsibility through non-violent means . I 'm not going to go around stabbing and shooting people who I think are criminals . That 's not the way to do it . The way to do it is to pass stricter gun-control laws . I 'm not going to stand by idly and watch as thousands of people are killed each year with guns in the US . You might be content to bury your head in the sand and pretend everything is rosy , but I believe in getting involved and trying to make a difference . It 's called being a concerned citizen .""","""What is your non-violent way of stopping a felon with a knife ? A felon who at 30 has spent 10 years in prison and was raped by other prisoners ? I suspect you will do what most New Yorkers will do when they witness a crime : NOT GET INVOLVED ! I will stop carrying a pistol when life is rosy . What else do you do to protect yourself besides being concerned ?""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not going to go around stabbing and shooting people who I think are criminals""","""What is your non-violent way of stopping a felon with a knife ?""",,
19425,5153,"""I am not Christian""","""It shows by the way , only the creator of life can take it away according to the Bible .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not Christian""","""It shows by the way ,""",,
19441,5156,"""I too find it amusing to read about Canada 's nightmare socialist healthcare system . This past weekend I went to the hospital after injuring myself in a race . From the door to triage : 2 minutes . Triage to admission : 10 minutes . Examined , treated , and discharged within 30 minutes . Discussion of payment : 0 . Never in my life have I had difficulty in seeing any doctor I wanted to , nor have my friends or family members . All this for far less expenditure per gdp than the US .""","""Well , my daughter cut her chin ( in the U.S. ) , which required some stitches . My wife arrived to the emergency room with my daughter around 6:30 PM . We did not come back home until after midnight .""",AGREE,"""This past weekend I went to the hospital after injuring myself in a race . From the door to triage : 2 minutes . Triage to admission : 10 minutes . Examined , treated , and discharged within 30 minutes .""","""my daughter cut her chin ( in the U.S. ) , which required some stitches . My wife arrived to the emergency room with my daughter around 6:30 PM . We did not come back home until after midnight .""",,
19473,5162,"""Based on threads I 've been reading here , there is a real tendency among some of the pro-choicers to portray pregnancy as a horrible thing that cause women to suffer -- that it is somthing bad or undesirable . - How could the opportunity to bring a life into the world , a wonderful miracle , be so awful by default ? Rather than bring into this peripheral thoughts to the question , such as rights and legal issues ( which are discussed at length here already in other threads ) , I 'd love to hear straightforward relelvant answers to this . I am also already aware that pregnancy can sometimes involve complications or that it can at times cause financial constraints . But I am mainly interested in seeing why there is a default tendency in pro-choice arguments to argue from the standpoint of pregnancy being a bad thing . Any thoughts ?""","""As others pointed out , this is a misconception . I have little doubt that the great majority of pro-choice people are quite positive about wanted pregnancies . I suspect that this misconseption comes from the fact that almost all abortion discussions are about pregnancies that are not wanted . Pregnancies that are wanted are almost never discussed since they are not relevant to an abortion debate . After all , who would want to abort a fetus if they wanted to be pregnant and have a baby ( excluding rare cases of risk of mother 's death , severely deformed fetus , etc . ) ?""",DISAGREE,"""the pro-choicers to portray pregnancy as a horrible thing that cause women to suffer -- that it is somthing bad or undesirable .""","""As others pointed out , this is a misconception .""",,
19478,5163,"""Thought you needed some kind of documentation before you get them ? Are they really completely unregistered , documented or anything then or is this a state by state thing ? As for criminals , if owning a gun instantly marked you out as a criminal then some would reconsider as for the rest , some incentive to hand them over and a stiff punishment if they do not . Press I do not think would be a problem , pro-gun extremists always seem worse than anti-gun ones as far as the media is concerend ( worst you can say about the antis is that they are living in some dream world and are a little naive , compared to the worst sterotype of red-neck , shotgun totin ' gun nut is not really a comparison ) . More importantly you would n't instigate the gun ban unless a significant majority were in favour in which case the press ( national at least ) would be more likely to be on your side . Attempting a gun ban on a country that does n't want it on the whole is undemocratic and just asking for trouble anyway-regardless of any moral consideration you are playing right inot the hand sof the pro-gunner 's worst fears of government bullying .""","""Sure , , , ,I have more than a few that was purchased from a individual , , , ,no registration , license , no paperwork.I hand him the money and he hands me the gun.All legal and absolutley no paper trail . As far as guns purchased from a licensed dealer , all that is documented is the info for a background check , And by law that info must be destroyed within , I think 90 days . Kind of puts a snag in the whole confiscation idea , ,ehhhh ?""",AGREE,"""Thought you needed some kind of documentation before you get them ?""","""Sure , , , ,I have more than a few that was purchased from a individual , ,""",,
19480,5164,"""Even if some stupid Christians subscribe to the god of the gaps nonsense it would be the pot calling the kettle black . There is not one single peer reviewed piece of evidence proving a link between birds and dinosaurs , fish to amphibians , a rational explanation of what caused the big bang etc . The comeback is that science just has n't found the proof yet . Or the favorite we have no proof because it happened long ago and far away .""","""There also is n't a single peer reviewed piece of evidence proving a link between me and my ancestors . So what 's your point ? Are you suggesting I have no ancestors ? How absurd .""",DISAGREE,"""pot calling the kettle black , no proof""","""and my ancestors ?""",,
19486,5165,"""Why is only the father punished ? Having consensual sex is just that - consensual on the part of both people . If it is n't consensual , rape laws already cover it and if it is consensual and a pregnancy occurs , why punish only one of the consenting individuals ?""","""Because naturally the man should be responsible to pay for it ... one way or another , to support it ... and her in marraige , or provide child support , as provided in the law ... he did the deed , and must be made to pay .. The idea is that if men are held responsible for abortions , then they will put on a condom instead of taking the chance , ... and hence .. reduce the abortions or the need there of , and this would incourage them to marry .""",DISAGREE,"""why punish only one of the consenting individuals ?""","""naturally the man should be responsible to pay for it .""",,
19506,5169,"""The end result is that the city approved the purchase of 46 Smith & amp ; Wesson M & amp ; P 15 rifles , the same as those used by the city 's SWAT unit . Each weapon will cost the city about $ 1,200 . Federal grants are going to help pay for them . Every officer will be trained on how to use the new weapons .""","""But .... but .... I thought these weapons were used solely to kill large amounts of people ? Can anyone explain to me why we have to ban `` assault weapons `` because they are only designed to mow people down like blades of grass , yet we need to issue the same `` assault weapons `` to our police for their safety ? If they are used solely to kill large amounts of people indiscriminately , why do our police need them , unless it 's to kill large amounts of people indiscriminately ? How can you argue they ARE NOT needed , yet argue that they ARE needed ? Which is it ? Please explain yet another instance of anti-gun `` doublespeak `` .""",DISAGREE,"""the city approved the purchase of 46 Smith & Wesson M & P 15 rifles the same as those used by the city 's SWAT unit . Each weapon will cost the city about $ 1,200""","""But .... but .... I thought these weapons were used solely to kill large amounts of people ? Can anyone explain to me why we have to ban `` assault weapons `` because they are only designed to mow people down like blades of grass , yet we need to issue the same `` assault weapons `` to our police for their safety ?""",,
19513,5170,"""You 'd have to show me their announcements of bias and conspiratorial intent , before I 'd agree that they are as bad as you imply , but I have no question that they admit the possibility of extrapolation of ID for religious purposes far more than atheists admit the possibility of extrapolation of evolution for atheistic purposes . Why ? Because Christians have guidelines about lying .""","""I feel a No True Scotsman coming on . Should I even bother to mention Hovind ?""",DISAGREE,"""announcements of bias and conspiratorial intent bad as you imply , but I have no question Because Christians have guidelines about lying .""","""No True Scotsman coming on . bother to mention Hovind ?""",,
19521,5171,"""... is that they think that ... they are n't loved ...""","""Might be something to be said for that . Are there any studies that show possible causes of suicide ?""",AGREE,"""is that they think that ... they are n't loved ...""","""Might be something to be said for that""",,
19539,5174,"""Care to comment ?""","""So does this mean they have to get tougher on gun control or softer before the results go their way ? That is the real question . My guess is that we are caught in the unhappy medium where going in either direction will be more successful than where we are now .""",DISAGREE,"""comment ?""","""So does this mean they have to get tougher on gun control or softer before the results go their way ?""",,
19549,5175,"""I 've seen some debate over the rate of mutations and it seems difficult on that basis alone for there to be enough beneficial mutations to arise . This makes the chances of passing on any benefit almost impossible .""","""No it does n't . Because you limit beneficial mutations to a single individual who must , in your eyes , be the biggest and strongest or it wo n't be passed on . Would n't it be better to actually learn what you are talking about ? Still waiting for your support of creationism . I just know you have examined the evidence for your position with at least as much intensity . I 'm beginning to think that you do n't have evidence and you do n't have a theory .""",DISAGREE,"""it seems difficult on that basis alone for there to be enough""","""No it does n't .""",,
19558,5176,"""if you give teenagers the option to have an escape goat for getting pregnant at an early age . They 'll never learn !""","""Well lets see here lets take a little look here at what i found here at this website http : //www.eurowrc.org/06.contributi ... contrib.en.htm and this is what is says : `` Every minute in the United States , 1.3 adult women are raped ; 78 women are raped every hour ; 1,871 women are raped every day ; 56,916 women are raped every month ; 683,000 women are raped every year . ( Crime Victims Research and Treatment Center of the National Victim Center , 1992 ) . `` Now these women and teenagers that may have had a great life . They may have had a dream of becoming someone . They may be a good student at a good high school or college . They have been waiting all of their lives for . But ... But but but ... all of those dreams , goals , intentions , all shot down because some guy couldnt control his hormones and made them pregnant . Not only does that destroy you mentally . It also destroys you physically . They have to have this baby because they could not get an abortion and have that fetus , which was not their 's to want , could save a life of a person . They could save them from : cancer , bone thinning , organ failure etc . But no .. no ... no ... no ... because people think that only teens are just fooling around and not thinking and having unprotected sex . They should make abortions illegal . Thats definatly not my opinion""",DISAGREE,"""if you give teenagers the option to have an escape goat for getting pregnant""","""Not only does that destroy you mentally . It also destroys you physically .""",,
19574,5178,"""`` ... registering honest gun owners does n't stop criminals , and in fact focuses in exactly the opposite direction . It is an allocation of resources that has no chance of achieving its goal , if that goal is the reduction of crime. `` And that in a nutshell puts to rest Calico Slimjim 's puffery on registration .""","""It should , but between you me and the wall , you know it wo n't though .""",AGREE,"""It is an allocation of resources that has no chance of achieving its goal , if that goal is the reduction of""","""between you me and the wall , you know it wo n't though .""",,
19583,5178,"""`` ... registering honest gun owners does n't stop criminals , and in fact focuses in exactly the opposite direction . It is an allocation of resources that has no chance of achieving its goal , if that goal is the reduction of crime. `` And that in a nutshell puts to rest Calico Slimjim 's puffery on registration .""","""It should , but between you me and the wall , you know it wo n't though .""",AGREE,"""And that in a nutshell puts to rest Calico Slimjim 's puffery on registration""","""It you know it wo n't though .""",,
19589,5179,"""Hard to argue with that logic . Well thought out I might add .""","""What , I do n't understand how your analogies even work . Parelelle universes came from the big bang ? What ? [ quote ] Paralell universes is one of the theories to explain how the big bang was so perfect . Dark Energy Term had to be accurate to one 10 x 120^ . The way IT accomplished this is that there an infinite number of universes so one exactly like ours had to come about in a big bang just like the one science says happened . It also means some where there is a universe that you created by passing gas and in it you are a creationist and an Elvis Impersonator . If that makes sense to you then the avian lung problem makes sense to you as well .""",DISAGREE,"""Hard to argue with that logic . Well thought out I might add .""","""What , I do n't understand how your analogies even work . Parelelle universes came from the big bang ? What ?""",,
19608,5181,"""Conclusion Based on the above lines of reason , I assert that reproduction is not an absolute requirement of life : that something could be considered to be alive without it necessarily needing to be able to reproduce .""","""The problem with this reasoning is that the criteria you 're refering to are n't a definition for life , they 're a set of guidelines , rules of thumb . They are n't meant to be applied to obviously living marcoscopic things like mules . Their purpose is to give biologists a common ground when discussing things on the microscopic scale . On that scale , where `` living `` is n't obvious , reproduction is one of the things biologists look for to decide if something should be called `` alive `` .""",DISAGREE,"""I assert that reproduction is not an absolute requirement of life""","""Their purpose is to give biologists a common ground when discussing things on the microscopic scale""",,
19610,5182,"""Originally posted by Patriot I agree , but do you think that if abortion were made illegal , and the death penalty/jail sentance were imposed as a punishment for this crime that `` hundereds and then thousands `` of women would have abortions done ? I think not . Chai , please clarify your stand on abortion .""","""I still think there would be thousands of women taking the pill that aborts fetuses every year . I would expect several hundred to be caught .""",DISAGREE,"""I agree , but do you think that if abortion were made illegal , and the death penalty/jail sentance were imposed as a punishment for this crime""","""I still think there would be thousands of women taking the pill that aborts fetuses every year .""",,
19614,5183,"""Generally , most theories have the backing of many experiments .""","""And there are thousands upon thousands of experiments that back evolution . Clearly you have n't bothered to look at any of them . [ more creationist lies snipped for they are getting tedious ]""",DISAGREE,"""most theories have the backing of many experiments .""","""And there are thousands upon thousands of experiments that back evolution . Clearly you have n't bothered to look at any of them""",,
19620,5184,"""did you miss the part where it is ... the attempt to abort . which kills the women ..... -Mosheh Thezion""","""No , you need to read more carefully :""",DISAGREE,"""did you miss the part where it is ... the attempt to abort . which kills the women""","""No , you need to read more carefully :""",,
19636,5187,"""As far as your quotes go , I hope that you realise that Feduucia still believes that they are a transitional . He just disagrees on what they are a transitional of .""","""Once again , my point was that evolutionists contradict each other . One says A. was mostly bird , the other says mostly reptile . One says A. was a link , another says that A. could not have been a link .""",DISAGREE,"""Feduucia still believes that they are a transitional .""","""my point was that evolutionists contradict each other""",,
19641,5189,"""No , that is a false perception .""","""So when the sea and sky informs a sailor , how does it inform ?""",DISAGREE,"""No , that is a false perception .""","""So when the sea and sky informs a sailor , how does it inform ?""",,
19652,5194,"""Thanks , that 's very kind of you .""","""lol you 're welcome""",AGREE,"""Thanks , that 's very kind of you .""","""you 're welcome""",,
19656,5195,"""He found that adaptive genetic mutations arising systematically under these circumstances outnumbered maladaptive and inconsequential mutations to a high degree , statistically speaking . A most significant finding , and one that has been repeated again and again and again , to the point where somatic hypermutation is accepted by bacteriologists as a legitimate 'immune response ' enabling rapid adaptive [ EAM ] evolution [ antibiotic resistance ] in eusocial bacteria .""","""Would you mind telling us just how he determined ALL maladaptive or inconsequential mutations in his test organism and just how he validated such measurements ? To me as a biologist with quite a bit of microbiology under the belt it would seem to be impossible to do so ! After all its very likely that a fairly large portion of the populutaion will have at least one mutation at at least one base pair location in the total sequence ! Your claim would seem to be impossible , but perhaps there is a way he managed to do so .""",DISAGREE,"""He found that adaptive genetic mutations arising systematically under these circumstances outnumbered maladaptive and inconsequential mutations to a high degree , statistically speaking .""","""Would you mind telling us just how he determined ALL maladaptive or inconsequential mutations in his test organism and just how he validated such measurements ?""",,
19660,5196,"""So , in order to be against gay marriage , a person has to be faithful in his own marriage ? Gim me a break . He supports what his constituents want him to support or he does n't get elected . In case you have n't noticed , the majority of Americans are against gay marriage .""","""Political leaders should not oppose gay marriage at all . But if a political leader is going to stomp around proclaiming that he wants to `` defend traditional marriage `` and promote `` family values `` by denying others the right to marry , the voters will not be happy if that political leader is discovered to be cheating on his wife . You seem to be suggesting that the arguments by political leaders in favor of `` traditional morality `` and `` family values `` are entirely meaningless and are just pandering to popular prejudices . That is just what the voters , I think , wo n't like about this ..... that all the `` family values `` talk was nothing but political posturing to garner votes . Which it probably was .""",DISAGREE,"""So , in order to be against gay marriage , a person has to be faithful in his own marriage ?""","""You seem to be suggesting that the arguments by political leaders in favor of `` traditional morality `` and `` family values ``""",,
19679,5201,"""1 ) When Darwin first suggested evolution , he was applying on the basis of `` survival of the fittiest `` and how species tend to `` evolutionate `` from one another .... however none of his arguements were that human came from apes and bacteria .""","""Actually , Darwin did n't like the phrase `` survival of the fittest `` applied to his theory . The phrase was actually coined by sociologist Herbert Spencer in the statement of his social theories . Darwin 's preferred phrase was `` natural selection `` and used the phrase `` survival of the fittest `` only after it had become popular and Alfred Wallace ( a Christian turned spiritualist ) convinced Darwin that he would avoid confusion by using it . If one wants to reduce the hundreds of pages of theory that Darwin wrote to a single sound bite , `` differential reproductive success `` is probably the best . Further , natural selection was a proposed mechanism to explain the observed divergence of species . Darwin was quite aware of the implications of his theory for mankind from the beginning . He was also aware that it would be unpopular with the Church and the religious so he did n't mention it in On the Origin of Species . He waited until the theories expressed in that book had become generally accepted in the scientific community and then published The Descent of Man and Selection in Relation to Sex . In the later book Darwin did argue that mankind shared a common ancestor with apes .""",DISAGREE,"""he was applying on the basis of `` survival of the fittiest ``""","""Darwin did n't like the phrase `` survival of the fittest""",,
19682,5202,"""I am deathly afraid of fatty diets , because the indisputable scientific evidence says I should .""","""Just because something is bad does n't mean you should fear it , because it 's easily avoidable .""",DISAGREE,"""I am deathly afraid of fatty diets , because the indisputable scientific evidence says I should .""","""Just because something is bad does n't mean you should fear it , because it 's easily avoidable .""",,
19701,5204,"""Originally posted by FreeThinker Some of you put your credibility on the line by saying that the Sun is n't shrinking . I did some research in this area , and came up with some interesting results. . .""","""Which are based on old information . The SOHO project ( with which I was indirectly involved , and know some of the participants ) was launched on December 2 , 1995 specifically to make high precision measurements of the sun , especially the oscillations of the size of the surface , which indicate details of the interior . To quote them : Is the Sun expanding or contracting , and at what rate ? ( For an overview of the controversy over solar diameter variations , I recommend John Gribbin 's pre-SOHO book , Blinded By the Light : The Secret Life of the Sun , published in 1991 ) The Sun is not currently expanding or contracting to any measurable extent . It may in fact be shrinking or swelling , but we have no hard data with which to conclude that . It is vibrating , however : http : //helios.tuc.noao.edu/helio.html ( Global Oscillation Network Group ) http : //soi.stanford.edu ( The Solar Oscillations Investigation ) In addition , we expect that the Sun will someday expand into a red giant phase , but that wo n't be for another 4 billion to 5 billion years or so . SOHO FAQ So , have you worked out the length of a day would have been 1 billion years ago ?""",DISAGREE,"""Some of you put your credibility on the line by saying that the Sun is n't shrinking .""","""based on old information . The SOHO project ( with which I was indirectly involved ,""",,
19712,5205,"""CALIFORNIA : Legal with restrictions . Subject to certain restrictions , Section 12403.7 of the Penal Code provides & # 8220 ; & # 8230 ; any person may purchase , possess or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used solely for self-defense purposes & # 8230 ; & # 8221 ; . The definition of tear gas also includes pepper spray . The restrictions include a prohibition against selling such a unit to a minor , and a provision limiting the size to 2.5 ounces by weight . The misuse of tear gas in California comes with state penalties of up to a $ 1000 fine and/or up to three years in prison , not to mention a possible felony conviction on record . Some examples of misuse include ; using tear gas on people in anger , spraying it as a joke , possession of tear gas by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies . To be legally purchased , possessed or used in California , any canister must have a label that says `` WARNING : The use of this substance or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under the law . The contents are dangerous -- use with care. `` The maximum legal net weight for a canister is 2.5 ounces , or 70 grams of OC , CS or CN . CR is not legal for civilian use.is accompanied by a parent or guardian or 12403.8 allows a minor 16 years or older to purchase has their written consent . Since you live there and I do n't I 'm sure you 've already checked all this , but for what it 's worth ...""","""`` The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older `` `` Some examples of misuse include ; spraying on people in anger , as a joke , possession of by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies. `` Do n't know where you got that . I was watching a reality TV show ( my DVR quit on me ) about court files . A CA jury sentenced a teenage girl to 22 years of hard time for stabbing a 47 year old man when he tried to rape her . Assuming this is true ( which it could not be due to the fact that its reality TV ) , how can the jury sleep at night ? The defense proved that the man often made violent sexual advances on women , and the 17 year old girl was not inherently violent . She was convicted on second degree murder and sentenced to the maximum possible amount of time . Seriously , this is one F * cked up state . I ca n't even believe something like that would happen in this day and age .""",AGREE,"""Legal with restrictions . Subject to certain restrictions , Section 12403.7 of the Penal Code provides person may purchase , possess or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used solely for self-defense""","""The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older `` `` Some examples of misuse include ; spraying on people in anger , as a joke , possession of by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies. ``""",,
19714,5205,"""CALIFORNIA : Legal with restrictions . Subject to certain restrictions , Section 12403.7 of the Penal Code provides & # 8220 ; & # 8230 ; any person may purchase , possess or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used solely for self-defense purposes & # 8230 ; & # 8221 ; . The definition of tear gas also includes pepper spray . The restrictions include a prohibition against selling such a unit to a minor , and a provision limiting the size to 2.5 ounces by weight . The misuse of tear gas in California comes with state penalties of up to a $ 1000 fine and/or up to three years in prison , not to mention a possible felony conviction on record . Some examples of misuse include ; using tear gas on people in anger , spraying it as a joke , possession of tear gas by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies . To be legally purchased , possessed or used in California , any canister must have a label that says `` WARNING : The use of this substance or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under the law . The contents are dangerous -- use with care. `` The maximum legal net weight for a canister is 2.5 ounces , or 70 grams of OC , CS or CN . CR is not legal for civilian use.is accompanied by a parent or guardian or 12403.8 allows a minor 16 years or older to purchase has their written consent . Since you live there and I do n't I 'm sure you 've already checked all this , but for what it 's worth ...""","""`` The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older `` `` Some examples of misuse include ; spraying on people in anger , as a joke , possession of by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies. `` Do n't know where you got that . I was watching a reality TV show ( my DVR quit on me ) about court files . A CA jury sentenced a teenage girl to 22 years of hard time for stabbing a 47 year old man when he tried to rape her . Assuming this is true ( which it could not be due to the fact that its reality TV ) , how can the jury sleep at night ? The defense proved that the man often made violent sexual advances on women , and the 17 year old girl was not inherently violent . She was convicted on second degree murder and sentenced to the maximum possible amount of time . Seriously , this is one F * cked up state . I ca n't even believe something like that would happen in this day and age .""",AGREE,"""any person may purchase , possess or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used solely for self-defense""","""The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older ``""",,
19718,5205,"""CALIFORNIA : Legal with restrictions . Subject to certain restrictions , Section 12403.7 of the Penal Code provides & # 8220 ; & # 8230 ; any person may purchase , possess or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used solely for self-defense purposes & # 8230 ; & # 8221 ; . The definition of tear gas also includes pepper spray . The restrictions include a prohibition against selling such a unit to a minor , and a provision limiting the size to 2.5 ounces by weight . The misuse of tear gas in California comes with state penalties of up to a $ 1000 fine and/or up to three years in prison , not to mention a possible felony conviction on record . Some examples of misuse include ; using tear gas on people in anger , spraying it as a joke , possession of tear gas by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies . To be legally purchased , possessed or used in California , any canister must have a label that says `` WARNING : The use of this substance or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under the law . The contents are dangerous -- use with care. `` The maximum legal net weight for a canister is 2.5 ounces , or 70 grams of OC , CS or CN . CR is not legal for civilian use.is accompanied by a parent or guardian or 12403.8 allows a minor 16 years or older to purchase has their written consent . Since you live there and I do n't I 'm sure you 've already checked all this , but for what it 's worth ...""","""`` The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older `` `` Some examples of misuse include ; spraying on people in anger , as a joke , possession of by prohibited persons ; minors , drug addicts or persons convicted of felonies. `` Do n't know where you got that . I was watching a reality TV show ( my DVR quit on me ) about court files . A CA jury sentenced a teenage girl to 22 years of hard time for stabbing a 47 year old man when he tried to rape her . Assuming this is true ( which it could not be due to the fact that its reality TV ) , how can the jury sleep at night ? The defense proved that the man often made violent sexual advances on women , and the 17 year old girl was not inherently violent . She was convicted on second degree murder and sentenced to the maximum possible amount of time . Seriously , this is one F * cked up state . I ca n't even believe something like that would happen in this day and age .""",AGREE,"""Subject to certain restrictions , Section 12403.7 of the Penal Code provides person may purchase ,""","""The use of Pepper Spray is legal for carrying by a person 18 years of age or older ``""",,
19726,5206,"""Actually I have no problem with civil unions as long as civil unions replace the marriage certificate .""","""lol that 'll be the day""",DISAGREE,"""I have no problem with civil unions as long as civil unions replace the marriage certificate .""","""lol that 'll be the day""",,
19746,5208,"""More concrete than the thought processes which dismiss out of hand the flat statement of the US Secretary of State opining that no functioning democracy should allow private ownership of guns , but allow them only to be lawfully held by the state ? Sleep well .""","""No kidding . What could POSSIBLY be more concrete ? As far as I can tell , she has never publicly made a statement specifically about the DC gun ban but since , as you pointed out , she DID say that no functioning democracy should allow private ownership of guns , I have trouble believing that she thinks the private citizens of DC should be allowed to own guns , UNLESS what she is saying is that since we own guns , we should move toward a monarchy or perhapse some kind of dictatorship . She did not , as far as I know , voice her opinion regarding private gun ownership in a totalitarian system .""",AGREE,"""More concrete than the thought processes which dismiss out of hand the flat statement of the US Secretary of State""","""No kidding .""",,
19756,5210,"""Banning the ownership of guns in the United States will not cause Beretta or Glock to cease making guns . Guns will be sold illegally in the USA forever . And the criminals will have a distinct advantage in knowing that their target prey ( the honest man ) is not armed .""","""Only 1 in 4 people in the U.S. own a gun . What if transferring a gun to a felon merited 5 years in prison . Do you think that might discourage `` straw purchases `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""Banning the ownership of guns in the United States will not cause Beretta or Glock to cease making guns .""","""Only 1 in 4 people in the U.S. own a gun . What if transferring a gun to a felon merited 5 years in prison""",,
19768,5213,"""Einstein 's brain had unusual structures in it , could he have had some kind of disorder as well ? One that made him smarter than everyone else ?""","""I dunno about that , but possibly . They do know that those afflicted with ADD have some unusual structures in their brains too . Last I heard they were investigating the causality of homosexuality with developmental deficencies in the brain . The jury is not out yet""",AGREE,"""Einstein 's brain had unusual structures in it , could he have had some kind of disorder as well ?""","""I dunno about that , but possibly . They do know that those afflicted with ADD have some unusual structures in their brains too .""",,
19777,5215,"""I believe that the reason why we have so many youth susicides in Australia and else where ...""","""Is the suicide rate in Australia higher than other places ?""",DISAGREE,"""the reason why we have so many youth susicides in Australia""","""suicide rate in Australia higher""",,
19783,5217,"""but there 's no way to avoid them .""","""Incorrect . Following proper firearm safety procedures will reduce accidents to effectively zero .""",DISAGREE,"""but there 's no way to avoid them .""","""Incorrect . Following proper firearm safety procedures will reduce accidents to effectively zero .""",,
19793,5220,"""http : //www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgcon.html What is so doubtful about it ? It makes sense to me .""","""So the stats come from John Lott .... Was n't he the one who got caught making up statistics and impersonated a woman for three years to support the pro-gun cause ? http : //articles.latimes.com/2006/may ... on/oe-wiener31 http : //whoismaryrosh.com/ .... a bizarre individual who I do n't think can be trusted .""",DISAGREE,"""What is so doubtful about it ?""","""Was n't he the one who got caught making up statistics and impersonated a woman for three years to support the pro-gun cause ?""",,
19805,5232,"""Children only learn what they are taught , so it is up to us , the parents , to be actively involved in their lives AND to be aware of what 's in the popular culture that they are learning from their peers and the media . [ /color ] [ /indent ]""","""Unless God is the parent and Adam & amp ; Eve are the children . Just to good to pass that one up .""",AGREE,"""Children only learn what they are taught , , the parents , to be actively involved in their lives aware of what 's in the popular culture that they are learning from their peers""","""Unless God is the parent and Adam & Eve are the children""",,
19807,5233,"""Orthodox Jews believe that if the mother is pregnant and her life is threatened , she can have an abortion . However , Christian theology is different because we have more books to understand that passage . : - )""","""because you 're right and they 're wrong ?""",DISAGREE,"""Orthodox Jews believe that if the mother is pregnant and her life is threatened , she can have an abortion , Christian theology is different because we have more books to understand that passage""","""you 're right and they 're wrong ?""",,
19809,5234,"""I fully realize what I am talking about . I am talking about your god , the petty , vengeful , cruel and capricious creature depicted in your Bible . What did you think I was talking about ?""","""I think you do not know what you are talking about . Your description fits the matter `` god `` you belive in .""",DISAGREE,"""I am talking about your god ,""","""Your description fits the matter `` god `` you belive in .""",,
19835,5244,"""Under these circumstances [ stress-induced hyper-mutation ] , as per EAM , [ above ] , it has been repeatedly demonstrated [ since 1988 , at Corning , by that scientist whose name escapes me ] that the number of adaptive mutations outnumbers the number of of ineffectual or maladaptive mutations by a strongly significant statistical percentage .""","""On the face of it , the implication is that this kind of thing happens all the time ; that everywhere you look , stress-induced hypermutation is occurring , and along with it adaptive mutations are occurring disproportionately often - that this is part and parcel of everyday evolution . The ardour with which this evidence is brandished is , however , misleading . In only a handful of studies , using specific strains of bacteria with specific genetic features under specific environmental circumstances , have specific adaptive mutations seemed to occur with anomalous frequency . There is no suggestion that these cases are in any way generally representative , and even if the results were being interpreted correctly , the idea that they constitute evidence for a pan-species mechanism of internally directed evolution is , unfortunately , wishful thinking . But what of these rare anomalous cases ? The most famous was reported by J. Cairns and P. L. Foster , in which a dish of starving , non-growing E-coli ( a particular strain with a Lac- mutation ) appeared to preferentially induce a reversion mutation ( to Lac+ ) in order to enable growth when the only source of energy was lactose . Moreover , the mutation did not occur with such frequency if lactose was not present , if there was another growth-inhibiting factor in play , or if food sources other than lactose were available . On top of that , although the adapted bacteria showed evidence of accumulating other non-selected mutations , it was nowhere near enough to explain the rate of adaptive mutation , and the bacteria which did n't adapt showed no accumulation of unselected mutations at all ! Understandably , this looked to them , and other people at the time , like a pretty cut'n'dried example of an environmentally-or-organismically induced adaptive mutation . However , the nagging problem remained that this event was completely unprecedented , and was not observed in the general case of bacteria under starvation conditions . Why was this strain of bacteria so good at inducing this particular reversion mutation in just those circumstances ? The answer , as it turned out , was that the experimental assumption of 'no growth ' taking place in the e-coli colony was in error . The strain of e-coli used in the experiment had a 'leaky ' ( inefficient ) mutant Lac allele , with only 1 % to 2 % of the normal ability to process lactose . That 1 % to 2 % was then deliberately 'smothered ' by the experimenters through the addition of scavenger cells which mopped up the product of what little lactose the e-coli could process , effectively halting their growth . Because the later , visible growing colonies of e-coli had a reversion mutation to lac+ , the experimenters deduced that mutation was required for growth to be possible . However , what they did not take into account at the time was that during normal growth prior to incubation on the test medium , a small proportion of the e-coli colony experienced a duplication of the leaky lac gene . This mutation conferred no advantage - until the colony was plated on lactose . Now , the second copy of the gene increased the total amount of lactose they could process beyond the ability of the scavenger cells to inhibit growth , and the e-coli could ( slowly ) grow and divide . Within these slow-growing microcolonies , selection favoured those cells which experienced further lac- duplications . And the more lac- duplications a cell has , the more likely one of them will experience a reversion mutation to lac+ , explaining the apparently anomalous frequency of that particular mutation . When this happens , cell growth rate jumps considerably - but now it is the additional lac- genes which are holding the organism back , destabilising the chromosome and tying up resources which could be more efficiently processed by the lac+ gene . Selection now favours those lac+ revertants who lose the unstable lac- duplications . By the time the microcolonies become visible to the naked eye , they consist almost entirely of lac+ revertants . This hypothesis agrees with all observations related to the earlier experiments , and was verified in a number of ways , including repeating the experiment with a colony composed entirely of duplicate lac- bacteria , increasing the number of microcolonies 100-fold , which tallies with the ~1 % background rate of chromosomal duplications in those bacteria . Also , bacteria in the late-arriving microcolonies were observed to possess residual duplicate lac- genes . In short , the results of the experiment agree completely with classical evolutionary theory . It should be noted , by the way , that in addition to the late-arriving 'directed mutation ' microcolonies that causes such a stir , the original experimenters also observed the expected number of early-appearing colonies from pre-plating revertant mutants , a la L & amp ; D. EDIT : Reading further around the subject , it seems no stress-induced hypermutable state was involved either . Apparently , 10-20 % of the bacteria with lac- duplications also possessed 'dinB ' ( a mutation-promoting gene apparently , though it 's beyond the scope of my research here ) on the same plasmid . The mutagen 'came along for the ride ' so to speak , as selection favoured the duplication of that section of DNA , and induced hgher rates of mutation in - yep - 10-20 % of the adaptive population . So not only was the hypermutational state of that subpopulation not the cause of the adaptive mutation ( clearly , since the other 80-90 % of adaptation happened without it ) , it was actually harmful . Live n learn ! 2ND EDIT : The same experiment yields similar results with lac- situated within the chromosome itself , only with 100-fold fewer colonies , reflecting the lower incidence of chromosomal duplication and reversion events in comparison with plasmids .""",DISAGREE,"""it has been repeatedly demonstrated [ since 1988 , at Corning , by that scientist whose name escapes me ] that the number of adaptive mutations outnumbers the number of of ineffectual or maladaptive mutations by a strongly significant statistical percentage .""","""On the face of it , the implication is that this kind of thing happens all the time ; that everywhere you look , stress-induced hypermutation is occurring , and along with it adaptive mutations are occurring disproportionately often""",,
19851,5249,"""Then they can seek permission from us to arm themselves , and only for official duties that require it . Afterwards they can just turn them in and go back to being in their proper place .""","""Just how do you suppose the government seeking permision would work in reality ? And what exactly are you afraid of ? It seems odd when people advocate blind trust for Joe Civilian , but then think that the government should n't be allowed to be armed . I think there must be a balance in trust given both ways .""",DISAGREE,"""Then they can seek permission from us to arm themselves , and only for official duties that require it . Afterwards they can just turn them in and go back to being in their proper place .""","""Just how do you suppose the government seeking permision would work in reality ? And what exactly are you afraid of ?""",,
19854,5250,"""382 - 405 are the dates I have , under Pope Damasus I .""","""For the final compilation , yes , but the vast majority , certainly the Gospels and the first few Pauline epistles , were widely accepted long before that , and were regarded as authoritative in the early 2nd century . By all means quibble about 2 Peter , Hebrews and Revelation but do n't try to claim the books of the Bible were selected politically in the 4th century , it simply does n't fit the facts .""",DISAGREE,"""382 - 405 are the dates I have , under Pope Damasus""","""For the final compilation , yes , but the vast majority , certainly the Gospels and the first few Pauline epistles , were widely accepted long before that , and were regarded as authoritative in the early 2nd century .""",,
19862,5252,"""No , it 's not safe . What 's your point ?""","""I believe it to be safe .""",DISAGREE,"""No , it 's not safe .""","""I believe it to be safe .""",,
19876,5256,"""And had the fetus died , the cops would have been charged with a crime .""","""More like put on `` leave with pay `` aka `` taxpayer funded holiday `` while the woman is charged with `` assaulting a police officer `` to try and cover their misdeeds . At least that seems to be the usual tact in 21st century america .""",DISAGREE,"""And had the fetus died , the cops would have been charged with a crime .""","""At least that seems to be the usual tact in 21st century america .""",,
19887,5258,"""All too often those opposed to Intelligent Design simply reject any notion of God no matter how unemotional and rationality based that notion is .""","""Well , that 's your claim , anyway . Truth is that billions of theists accept evolutionary theory as is and reject the standard ID arguments .""",DISAGREE,"""those opposed to Intelligent Design simply reject any notion of God""","""Truth is that billions of theists accept evolutionary theory""",,
19896,5261,"""Everyone together now ... `` STRAW MAN ``""","""You should watch where you cast stones , kido . Your original post is an example of a straw man ... not mine . You should be more careful before operating a gun ... you just yourself in the foot . LOL !""",DISAGREE,"""Everyone together now ... `` STRAW MAN ``""","""You should watch where you cast stones ,""",,
19924,5267,"""'' God ' is a figure that humanity created so that life would not be dull adn so that we would have reasurance ( sp ) that there is an after life""","""Humans are about the furthest thing from perfect . The bible IS perfect , it 's flawless . You ca n't take anything from it and prove it to be incorrect . The only thing that even comes close is misinterpretations of certain sentences . I know plenty of people who do n't believe in any sort of God and are n't bothered by the thought that this is all they have , the only life they 'll ever live . Maybe some people need to believe in more to live more , but all people do n't .""",DISAGREE,"""God ' is a figure that humanity created so that life would not be dull adn so that we would have reasurance ( sp ) that there is an after life""","""Humans are about the furthest thing from perfect . The bible IS perfect , it 's flawless . You ca n't take anything from it and prove it to be incorrect .""",,
19949,5272,"""One of the specific ploys I 've seen them use time & amp ; again is to say that natural selection is either a tautology ... I seem to take a different approach to this objection than most people . The principle of NS is so painfully obvious that I have trouble understanding why people have trouble understanding it . For this reason , I can see how it does sometimes come across as tautologous . Two plus two may be four because we 've defined two and four that way , but that does n't make the equation untrue . Likewise , that those genes that help animals be better able to pass on their genes will be passed on more often ( due to whatever specifics ) is true regardless of objection . Whatever works , works . Those mosquitoes that are n't drawn to the zapper live ; those that are die . Those animals that can withstand the frigid winter live ; those that ca n't freeze . Why is this so hard to understand ? Maybe I 'm misunderstanding the objection ?""","""The tautology argument is rooted in the Spencerian epithet for natural selection , `` survival of the fittest. `` Which organisms survive ? The fittest . Which are the fittest ? Those who survive . But of course , `` survival of the fittest `` is n't a very good statement of the theory of natural selection . Darwin did n't like it and only began using it due to the encouragement of Wallace after it had become popular . It first appeared in `` On The Origin Of Species `` in the 4th edition , and it was never used without an explicit reference to natural selection . I never saw natural selection as being in the slightest tautological before . I too have found natural selection to be painfully obvious . I see what you are saying , but I do n't actually see that as a tautology . Early on I learned that natural selection was differential reproductive success . Perhaps I had good teachers . In that light , natural selection is a statistical tendency for some genetic alleles to be passed along more than others . Once that concept was grasped , population genetics was a logical consequence .""",DISAGREE,"""One of the specific ploys I 've seen them use time & again is to say that natural selection is either a tautology ...""","""The tautology argument is rooted in the Spencerian epithet for natural selection ,""",,
19961,5275,"""Even the ones that are destined to go extinct without producing any `` daughter `` species ? Apeart from that quibble though , you are right . But do n't tell the creationsts ; it 'll only confuse them""","""Well , ok. You 're right . Now that I think about it , `` missing links `` and `` transitional fossils `` are n't really the same thing . All species are potentially transitional , in that if the line continues it will change eventually , maybe even split . But missing links are something different . It 's just a fossil that shows some relationship between other fossils and that 's really all .""",AGREE,"""Even the ones that are destined to go extinct without producing any `` daughter `` species""","""Well , ok. You 're right""",,
19991,5282,"""The healtcare reform addresses these issues . What you are writing is pure demagogy .""","""Really ? I never know why people ca n't objectively look at things . Where would this reduce ANY health care costs ? From every study I 've seen it will cost Americans more""",DISAGREE,"""The healtcare reform addresses these issues . What you are writing is pure demagogy""","""never know why people ca n't objectively look at things""",,
19996,5283,"""Will this be used to support gun control ? If he had n't had a gun they might all be alive today ... or he might have drowned the children , strangled his wife and jumped off a bridge . I say the gun made little difference in the final outcome .""","""But a gun makes things so much easier , does n't it ? We 'll never know if he 'd been up to it without one . Guns make for capable cowards .""",DISAGREE,"""used to support gun control ? strangled his wife and jumped off a bridge""","""a gun makes things so much easier Guns make for capable cowards .""",,
20004,5284,"""Now who 's being disengenuous ? When was the last time one of you gays posted a pro-Christian thread ?""","""So I am anti-Christian because I do n't go around posting pro-Christian threads ? Your logic is really skewed . Can I declare you anti-gay cause you do n't frequently post pro-gay threads ?""",DISAGREE,"""Now who 's being disengenuous ? When was the last time one of you gays posted a pro-Christian thread ?""","""So I am anti-Christian because I do n't go around posting pro-Christian threads ?""",,
20006,5285,"""you could just as eazely not exist if you parents had chosen to abstain , and you wouldent have had any choice in the matter .""","""you would have never existed though .... not cease to exist""",DISAGREE,"""not exist if you parents had chosen to abstain""","""you would have never existed though .... not cease to exist""",,
20016,5287,"""In Nazi Germany , Hitler made it legal to kill or harm Jews . So , Crim , according to your terrible logic , then that was not a crime ?""","""Terrible logic ? It 's called a DEFINITION . Crimes are illegal actions .""",DISAGREE,"""Hitler made it legal to kill or harm Jews . So , Crim , according to your terrible logic""","""Terrible logic ? Crimes are illegal""",,
20028,5289,"""Its yet another definitional issue . Pure semantics not science . No thanks , I find myself becoming anti-semantic . And whats worse your link requires one be a member to even read the darn thing . But I can guess the nature of it .""","""* * Funny how you can dismiss something as 'just a matter of semantics ' when you admit you have n't even read it . Try this link -- http : //www.sciencedaily.com/releases ... 0611154001.htm""",DISAGREE,"""Pure semantics not , find myself becoming anti-semantic""","""how you can dismiss something as 'just a matter of semantics '""",,
20043,5292,"""Remember that Darwin referred to evolution as the secondary cause by which `` the Creator `` acted . So , when Miller says `` I believe in Darwin 's God `` , he is saying that God sustains the natural process of evolution and an intermediate agent .""","""And if the `` natural process of evolution `` is determined by humans in a university lab , many with an atheist worldview , that clash with something the Bible says , you and Kenneth Miller immediately toss the Bible out and accept what the humans say - no questions asked ?""",DISAGREE,"""evolution as the secondary cause by which `` the Creator `` acted .""","""if the `` natural process of evolution `` is determined by humans in a university lab , many with an atheist worldview , that clash with something the Bible says""",,
20045,5293,"""we now still have light and dark moths . The only thing that has changed is the population ratio , assumably by * natural selection * .""","""Exactly . That the change in moth color was due to natural selection was first posed in about 1896 by J.W . Tutt . The funny thing is that as pollution increased , the moths turned black , and then as the pollution was cleaned up , they turned white again . carbonaria have become pretty scarce .""",AGREE,"""we now still have light and dark moths . The only thing that has changed is the population ratio , assumably by * natural selection * .""","""Exactly . That the change in moth color was due to natural selection was first posed in about 1896 by J.W . Tutt .""",,
20049,5294,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question . In the theory of evolution , what did it all start with ? Was it hydrodgen atoms that created the big bang ? Sorry I 'm just trying to learn more .""","""There is not one theory , but a great many to choose from . If you 're talking about the origins of life , many evolutionists believe in abiogenesis - that life somehow just came about out of non-life . Some will say that evolution and abiogenesis are two distinct theories , but there 's a lot of cross-over ; begun with Charles Darwin himself who postulated a primordial soup . Miller-Urey did experiments to try to concoct how life began in a primordial soup of their own design . They failed in essence to demonstrate how life could emerge from non-life through natural means . ( Many work on the philosophy that life came about and evolved through naturalistic , or materialistic processes ) It leads people such as Nobel-winner Francis Crick to come up with certain strange notions ; Panspermia , of which , his version just shifts the problem , rather than answers it . ( see below under PANSPERMIA ) Intelligent Design theorists suggest that some intelligence ; possibly , but not exclusively a deity is behind nature ; that nature seems to have an order . Some here too casually dismiss ID from science but the door 's already open to science SETI looks for ID Cryptographers do to Forensic scientists do THEORIES OF LIFE ... PANSPERMIA Panspermia is the idea that life came from outer space . As with all theories this too is not homogenous . There 's a general panspermia theory , and a 'directed ' panspermia theory . The former is a belief that life came here by random chance , such as on a meteor . The later is that life came here at the behest of an intelligence - such as aliens directing ships to earth laden with the molecules of life . One idea is that the building blocks of life  “ ... Bakes said nitrogenated aromatics exist throughout the Milky Way galaxy. ” http : //www.spacedaily.com/news/life-04zw.html `` Francis Crick also thinks that life on earth may have begun when aliens from another planet sent a rocket ship containing spores to seed the earth . This is no idle thought ; Crick first proposed it with chemist Leslie Orgel in 1973 in an article entitled `` Directed Panspermia `` in a professional science journal called Icarus . A decade later Crick wrote a book , Life Itself , reiterating the theory ; in a 1992 interview in Scientific American on the eve of the publication of his latest book , Crick reaffirmed that he things the theory is reasonable. `` ( Behe , M , `` Darwin 's Black Box `` , p238 ) which as I said , simply moves the problem to 'where did the aliens come from ? ' '' COMPLEXITY THEORY Stuart Kauffman , a theoretical biologist at the Sante Fe Institute , has put forth the idea that when the necessary elements of the cell formed in the primordial soup ( nucleotides , lipids , and amino acids ) , they were instantaneously integrated into a system , a system which we know as the cell ( Cohen , 1996 ) . Kauffman says this was not due to a miracle or chance , but was bound to occur . He rejects other scientists ' need to find some sort of genetic carrier like RNA or DNA , or even an aperiodic solid , saying that the life forms may have had no need for them . ( An aperiodic solid is one in which the atoms are arranged in some non-repeatable geometric pattern , such as a helix , that would allow for the variation within the structure that is necessary for genetic material ) . He believes that such genetic carriers could have evolved after the new life was already flourishing . Kauffman has even designed a computer model that shows that when a few organic molecules have developed some catalytic skills and reach the necessary level of diversity , then they spontaneously form an `` autocatalytic set `` ( a life form ) . His theory is based on the general complexity theory , which states that when a system reaches some critical level of complexity , it will naturally produce a degree of complex order ( 4 ) . `` http : //www.lifesci.utexas.edu/cours ... 2/JENNIFER.html A. G. Cairns-Smith 's Callisto Theory : That life began from a type of living-clay Richard Dawkins says of this `` Cairns-Smith believes that the original life on this planet was based on self-replicating inorganic crystals such as silicates . If this is true , organic replicators , and eventually DNA , must later have taken over or usurped the role. `` http : //originoflife.net/cairns_smith/ `` Other Theories In spite of the intense level of work on the RNA world in the last decade , there is no true consensus theory for precellular life . There are many theories . Here are some of the others ? A few scientists still say that DNA could succeed in starting life on its way ( 11 ) . But even the shortest DNA strand needs proteins to help it replicate . This is the chicken-and-egg problem . There is a `` proteins first `` school . For example , Manfred Eigen of Germany 's Max Planck Institute says , `` There is no doubt that proteins , which are more easily formed , were first on the scene `` ( 11.5 ) . Of course , these first proteins must be much shorter than any used in life today , because of the sheer unlikelihood of forming useful long ones out of a soup of amino acids . Physicist Freeman Dyson proposes to solve the chicken-and-egg problem with a double origin , one for metabolism ( proteins ) and one for replication ( strands of nucleotides ) ( 12 ) . In Seven Clues to the Origin of Life ( 13 ) , A. G. Cairns-Smith says that clay crystals could have served as the scaffolding upon which the first short DNA or RNA genome was constructed . A new elaboration of this idea prompted one writer to wonder , `` Primordial soup or crêpes ? `` ( 14 ) . Even more recently , another tangent on this path leads to zeolite ( 14.5 ) . Biologists Harold J. Morowitz ( 15 ) , David Deamer ( 16 ) , and others ( 17 ) , advocate a theory that could be paraphrased as `` containers first. `` Jeffrey L. Bada of the Scripps Institution of Oceanography holds the minority view that the early Earth was frozen and believes precellular life started in `` cold soup `` under the ice ( 18 , 19 ) . Chemists Claudia Huber and Günter Wächtershäuser say the soup where life originated was actually quite hot , probably , near undersea volcanic vents , where iron and nickel sulfides might catalyze some of the necessary reactions ( 19.5-19.7 ) . Cornell Astronomer Thomas Gold wonders if life might have originated in a hot environment even deeper , in Earth 's crust ( 19.8 ) . Stuart Kauffman of the Santa Fe Institute , says , `` ... whenever a collection of molecules contains enough different kinds of molecules , a metabolism will crystallize from the broth `` ( 20 ) . Another idea is the `` PNA world. `` Because starting the RNA world is so difficult , there probably needs to be a pre-RNA world . PNA , or peptide nucleic acid , might have some of the properties necessary to constitute that world ( 21 ) . This would be pre-precellular life. `` http : //www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm ADDENDUM If you 're interested in aliens , check out `` The Science of Aliens `` by Clifford A. Pickover . A review is given at http : //sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/soa.htm""",AGREE,"""im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . In the theory of evolution , what did it all start with ?""",""" Other Theories In spite of the intense level of work on the RNA world in the last decade , there is no true consensus theory for precellular life . or peptide nucleic acid , might have some of the properties necessary to constitute that world""",,
20052,5294,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question . In the theory of evolution , what did it all start with ? Was it hydrodgen atoms that created the big bang ? Sorry I 'm just trying to learn more .""","""There is not one theory , but a great many to choose from . If you 're talking about the origins of life , many evolutionists believe in abiogenesis - that life somehow just came about out of non-life . Some will say that evolution and abiogenesis are two distinct theories , but there 's a lot of cross-over ; begun with Charles Darwin himself who postulated a primordial soup . Miller-Urey did experiments to try to concoct how life began in a primordial soup of their own design . They failed in essence to demonstrate how life could emerge from non-life through natural means . ( Many work on the philosophy that life came about and evolved through naturalistic , or materialistic processes ) It leads people such as Nobel-winner Francis Crick to come up with certain strange notions ; Panspermia , of which , his version just shifts the problem , rather than answers it . ( see below under PANSPERMIA ) Intelligent Design theorists suggest that some intelligence ; possibly , but not exclusively a deity is behind nature ; that nature seems to have an order . Some here too casually dismiss ID from science but the door 's already open to science SETI looks for ID Cryptographers do to Forensic scientists do THEORIES OF LIFE ... PANSPERMIA Panspermia is the idea that life came from outer space . As with all theories this too is not homogenous . There 's a general panspermia theory , and a 'directed ' panspermia theory . The former is a belief that life came here by random chance , such as on a meteor . The later is that life came here at the behest of an intelligence - such as aliens directing ships to earth laden with the molecules of life . One idea is that the building blocks of life  “ ... Bakes said nitrogenated aromatics exist throughout the Milky Way galaxy. ” http : //www.spacedaily.com/news/life-04zw.html `` Francis Crick also thinks that life on earth may have begun when aliens from another planet sent a rocket ship containing spores to seed the earth . This is no idle thought ; Crick first proposed it with chemist Leslie Orgel in 1973 in an article entitled `` Directed Panspermia `` in a professional science journal called Icarus . A decade later Crick wrote a book , Life Itself , reiterating the theory ; in a 1992 interview in Scientific American on the eve of the publication of his latest book , Crick reaffirmed that he things the theory is reasonable. `` ( Behe , M , `` Darwin 's Black Box `` , p238 ) which as I said , simply moves the problem to 'where did the aliens come from ? ' '' COMPLEXITY THEORY Stuart Kauffman , a theoretical biologist at the Sante Fe Institute , has put forth the idea that when the necessary elements of the cell formed in the primordial soup ( nucleotides , lipids , and amino acids ) , they were instantaneously integrated into a system , a system which we know as the cell ( Cohen , 1996 ) . Kauffman says this was not due to a miracle or chance , but was bound to occur . He rejects other scientists ' need to find some sort of genetic carrier like RNA or DNA , or even an aperiodic solid , saying that the life forms may have had no need for them . ( An aperiodic solid is one in which the atoms are arranged in some non-repeatable geometric pattern , such as a helix , that would allow for the variation within the structure that is necessary for genetic material ) . He believes that such genetic carriers could have evolved after the new life was already flourishing . Kauffman has even designed a computer model that shows that when a few organic molecules have developed some catalytic skills and reach the necessary level of diversity , then they spontaneously form an `` autocatalytic set `` ( a life form ) . His theory is based on the general complexity theory , which states that when a system reaches some critical level of complexity , it will naturally produce a degree of complex order ( 4 ) . `` http : //www.lifesci.utexas.edu/cours ... 2/JENNIFER.html A. G. Cairns-Smith 's Callisto Theory : That life began from a type of living-clay Richard Dawkins says of this `` Cairns-Smith believes that the original life on this planet was based on self-replicating inorganic crystals such as silicates . If this is true , organic replicators , and eventually DNA , must later have taken over or usurped the role. `` http : //originoflife.net/cairns_smith/ `` Other Theories In spite of the intense level of work on the RNA world in the last decade , there is no true consensus theory for precellular life . There are many theories . Here are some of the others ? A few scientists still say that DNA could succeed in starting life on its way ( 11 ) . But even the shortest DNA strand needs proteins to help it replicate . This is the chicken-and-egg problem . There is a `` proteins first `` school . For example , Manfred Eigen of Germany 's Max Planck Institute says , `` There is no doubt that proteins , which are more easily formed , were first on the scene `` ( 11.5 ) . Of course , these first proteins must be much shorter than any used in life today , because of the sheer unlikelihood of forming useful long ones out of a soup of amino acids . Physicist Freeman Dyson proposes to solve the chicken-and-egg problem with a double origin , one for metabolism ( proteins ) and one for replication ( strands of nucleotides ) ( 12 ) . In Seven Clues to the Origin of Life ( 13 ) , A. G. Cairns-Smith says that clay crystals could have served as the scaffolding upon which the first short DNA or RNA genome was constructed . A new elaboration of this idea prompted one writer to wonder , `` Primordial soup or crêpes ? `` ( 14 ) . Even more recently , another tangent on this path leads to zeolite ( 14.5 ) . Biologists Harold J. Morowitz ( 15 ) , David Deamer ( 16 ) , and others ( 17 ) , advocate a theory that could be paraphrased as `` containers first. `` Jeffrey L. Bada of the Scripps Institution of Oceanography holds the minority view that the early Earth was frozen and believes precellular life started in `` cold soup `` under the ice ( 18 , 19 ) . Chemists Claudia Huber and Günter Wächtershäuser say the soup where life originated was actually quite hot , probably , near undersea volcanic vents , where iron and nickel sulfides might catalyze some of the necessary reactions ( 19.5-19.7 ) . Cornell Astronomer Thomas Gold wonders if life might have originated in a hot environment even deeper , in Earth 's crust ( 19.8 ) . Stuart Kauffman of the Santa Fe Institute , says , `` ... whenever a collection of molecules contains enough different kinds of molecules , a metabolism will crystallize from the broth `` ( 20 ) . Another idea is the `` PNA world. `` Because starting the RNA world is so difficult , there probably needs to be a pre-RNA world . PNA , or peptide nucleic acid , might have some of the properties necessary to constitute that world ( 21 ) . This would be pre-precellular life. `` http : //www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm ADDENDUM If you 're interested in aliens , check out `` The Science of Aliens `` by Clifford A. Pickover . A review is given at http : //sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/soa.htm""",AGREE,"""In the theory of evolution , what did it all start with ?""","""There is not one theory , but a great many to choose from If you 're talking about the origins of life , many evolutionists believe in abiogenesis - that life somehow just came about out of non-life Charles Darwin himself who postulated a primordial soup Francis Crick to come up with certain strange notions ; Panspermia Intelligent Design theorists suggest that some intelligence ; possibly , but not exclusively a deity is behind nature There 's a general panspermia theory , and a 'directed ' panspermia theory One idea is that the building blocks of life  ... Bakes said nitrogenated aromatics exist throughout the Milky Way galaxy. `` Francis Crick also thinks that life on earth may have begun when aliens from another planet sent a rocket ship containing spores to seed the earth . '' His theory is based on the general complexity theory , which states that when a system reaches some critical level of complexity , it will naturally produce a degree of complex order A. G. Cairns-Smith 's Callisto Theory : That life began from a type of living-clay Richard Dawkins says of this `` Cairns-Smith believes that the original life on this planet was based on self-replicating inorganic crystals such as silicates A few scientists still say that DNA could succeed in starting life on its way Manfred Eigen of Germany 's Max Planck Institute says , `` There is no doubt that proteins , which are more easily formed , were first on the scene `` Physicist Freeman Dyson proposes to solve the chicken-and-egg problem with a double origin , one for metabolism ( proteins ) and one for replication ( strands of nucleotides ) `` Jeffrey L. Bada of the Scripps Institution of Oceanography holds the minority view that the early Earth was frozen and believes precellular life started in `` cold soup `` under the ice ( 18 , 19 ) Chemists Claudia Huber and Günter Wächtershäuser say the soup where life originated was actually quite hot , probably , near undersea volcanic vents , where iron and nickel sulfides might catalyze some of the necessary reactions Another idea is the `` PNA world. `` Because starting the RNA world is so difficult , there probably needs to be a pre-RNA world . PNA , or peptide nucleic acid , might have some of the properties necessary to constitute that world""",,
20060,5296,"""If the foundation upon which evo is based is false , such as the age of the Earth and the interpretation of fossil information . Then all of the conclusions that are derived from those original faulty conclusions is as wrong as wrong can be , and as deceptive as deceptive can be .""","""And if wishes were horses ... You 've no evidence , AA . None at all . Nothing in the natural world disputes the great age of the earth . Do n't you find that in the least bit remarkable , if it really is a few thousand years old ? Would n't something fail to jibe ? Read my challenge in the debate section : why does n't our earth look like the one in my thought experiment ?""",DISAGREE,"""If the foundation upon which evo is based is false , such as the age of the Earth all of the conclusions that are derived from those original faulty conclusions is as wrong as wrong can be""","""You 've no evidence Nothing in the natural world disputes the great age of the earth""",,
20077,5300,"""meaning creation beats evolution every time .""","""In what race ? Creation , as in a literal interpretation of Genesis ? How is that possible ?""",DISAGREE,"""meaning creation beats evolution every time""","""In what race ? How is that possible ?""",,
20078,5300,"""meaning creation beats evolution every time .""","""In what race ? Creation , as in a literal interpretation of Genesis ? How is that possible ?""",DISAGREE,"""meaning creation beats evolution every time .""","""In what race ?""",,
20079,5301,"""Originally posted by Patriot THAT is what they are making a big fuss over ? ? ? ? ?""","""If anti-gunners can pass a law to make the private sale of guns require a background check at a gun store then they can do it for all private sales . If it is illegal for private citizens to sell guns at a gun show , then what prevents them from simply walking out to the parking lot and concluding the sale there ?""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by Patriot THAT is what they are making a big fuss over ? ? ? ? ?""","""If anti-gunners can pass a law to make the private sale of guns require a background check at a gun store then they can do it for all private sales .""",,
20097,5304,"""Another oft-repeated lie .""","""Did someone give you a wedgie ? It is in black and white in numerous sources not counting the detailed accounts from your own countrymen . Methinks you stand accused all alone ?""",DISAGREE,"""Another oft-repeated lie .""","""Did someone give you a wedgie ? It is in black and white in numerous sources not counting the detailed accounts from your own countrymen . Methinks you stand accused all alone ?""",,
20099,5304,"""Another oft-repeated lie .""","""Did someone give you a wedgie ? It is in black and white in numerous sources not counting the detailed accounts from your own countrymen . Methinks you stand accused all alone ?""",DISAGREE,"""oft-repeated lie .""","""Did someone give you a wedgie ? It is in black and white in numerous sources you stand accused all alone ?""",,
20111,5306,"""Correct me if iIm wrong but I thought entropy was the tendency of all things to go toward dissorder . For instance you can not take a bunch of watch parts , shake them up in a box and expect them to eventually assemble themselves properly wound and calibrated right with enough shakes and enough time . These things just dont happen . They are impossible . All of the watch pieces would become more and more random but never more ordered . So I find it hard to believe that one cell gained more and more intelligence or whatever to evolve into all living thing s that we know of today . There isnt a single natrural process that creates that information that we see in DNA , the information for how all things are put together , that would have had to have been present in order for that single cell to replicate itself and evolve . Life is a creation not an evolution . It is also hard for me to believe that out of nothing came something . I have wondered what evolutionsists say about what was going on befor the `` big bang `` that allowed for whatever it was that started the `` big bang `` to come into being . I would like to know what evolutionists say was going on prior to the `` big bang. `` Its jus that I have never heard a whole lot said about that . So if anyone could help me out in either of these subjects I have just discussed it would be much appreciated .""","""i will correct you since you are wrong . actually , let me just point you to a website that came from folks that have been fed up with entropy 's comparison to disorder simply because it causes confusion , this website has nothing to do with creationism vs. evolution http : //www.entropysite.com/ http : //www.entropysite.com/students_approach.html here is another one http : //www.entropylaw.com/index.html ( this one may have been motivated by c vs. e but is no less accurate ) this page oughta confuse a few creationists : http : //www.entropylaw.com/entropyproduction.html""",DISAGREE,"""me if iIm wrong but I thought entropy was the tendency of all things to go toward dissorder .""","""i will correct you since you are wrong . actually , let me just point you to a website that came from folks that have been fed up with entropy 's comparison to disorder simply because it causes confusion , this website has nothing to do with creationism vs. evolution""",,
20123,5307,"""A more precise term would be `` broaden , `` since nothing about the definition pertaining to the people currently covered by it would be affected , `` diluted `` or altered in any way anyone has yet demonstrated .""","""As if 'broadening ' something ca n't possibly dilute it . I 'm just sure a glass of Napa Valley Merlot would taste better if we broaden it by pouring in a half-glass of Chardonnay . Wine is wine , huh ? If you ca n't understand the concept of sacredness , I doubt there 's anything anyone will be able to tell you that would ever make a difference .""",DISAGREE,"""since nothing about the definition pertaining to the people currently covered""","""Valley Merlot would taste better if we broaden it""",,
20118,5307,"""A more precise term would be `` broaden , `` since nothing about the definition pertaining to the people currently covered by it would be affected , `` diluted `` or altered in any way anyone has yet demonstrated .""","""As if 'broadening ' something ca n't possibly dilute it . I 'm just sure a glass of Napa Valley Merlot would taste better if we broaden it by pouring in a half-glass of Chardonnay . Wine is wine , huh ? If you ca n't understand the concept of sacredness , I doubt there 's anything anyone will be able to tell you that would ever make a difference .""",DISAGREE,"""more precise term would be `` broaden , `` since nothing about the definition pertaining to the people currently covered by it would be affected""","""As if 'broadening ' something ca n't possibly dilute it . I 'm just sure a glass of Napa Valley Merlot would taste better if we broaden it by pouring in a half-glass of Chardonnay .""",,
20129,5308,"""4/10 . See me after class .""","""Sorry I am new here , what does this mean ?""",DISAGREE,"""4/10 . See me after class .""","""Sorry I am new here , what does this mean ?""",,
20132,5308,"""4/10 . See me after class .""","""Sorry I am new here , what does this mean ?""",DISAGREE,"""See me after class""","""what does this mean ?""",,
20154,5311,"""Last I checked , drug prohibition began much earlier than the 1980s . The '80s fall in violent crime is more likely a result of the legalization of abortion than it is a result of the `` success of the war on drugs. ``""","""Demographics plays a role , but it does not explain away the whole shift in the numbers .""",DISAGREE,"""Last I checked , drug prohibition began much earlier than the 1980s .""","""Demographics plays a role , but it does not explain away the whole shift in the numbers .""",,
20165,5312,"""Since pandion can not answer the following question it I would like someone else to . Thanks in advance If my wife 's father was bald but my wife and her siblings show no signs of baldness , and if my father was not bald and neither of my siblings is but I am , what is the probability the my children will be bald . Please make sure that you address the issue of gender .""","""I can well believe that pandion can not answer this question ; no one can accurately answer it . We know that baldness , as a genetic condition , is polygenetic ( ie it 's controlled by multiple genes ) and autosomal ( the genes [ or at least the bulk of them ] do not reside on the X or Y chromosomes ) . Despite being autosomal , people appear statistically slightly more likely to exhibit balness if the trait comes from their mother 's side of the family . Even if we knew precisely which genes were involved and which of those genes your kids had , we still can not tell you the likihood of your children being bald . The chances of the gene combination being expressed in the correct way to cause baldness are dependent on age , hormone levels , stress and probably a variety of other environmental conditions .""",DISAGREE,"""Since pandion can not answer the following question it I would like someone else to .""","""I can well believe that pandion can not answer this question ; no one can accurately answer it .""",,
20177,5313,"""March 25 , 2004 Washington , DC - Planned Parenthood Federation of America ( PPFA ) today denounced the Senate 's passage of S. 1019 , the so-called Unborn Victims of Violence Act ( UVVA ) , which creates a penalty for anyone convicted of harming a fetus during commission of certain federal crimes . The UVVA would give separate legal status to a fertilized egg , embryo , or fetus even if the woman does not know she is pregnant . '' The so-called Unborn Victims of Violence Act ( UVVA ) is not intended to protect pregnant women from domestic violence or punish individuals who harm them , `` said PPFA President Gloria Feldt . '' It is part of a deceptive anti-choice strategy to make women 's bodies mere vessels by creating legal personhood for the fetus. `` The UVVA was created with the sole aim of undermining the 1973 U.S. Supreme Court Roe v. Wade decision , in which the Supreme Court ruled that `` the word 'person ' as used in the Fourteenth Amendment , does not include the unborn. `` This bill elevates the legal status of a fetus to make it equal to that of the adult woman who actually suffers the primary injury . It is part of ongoing attempts to bestow personhood on the fetus by granting it separate legal rights equal to and independent of those of the pregnant woman . This legislation , which passed the Senate 61 to 38 , fails to mention the harm to the woman resulting from an involuntary termination of her pregnancy . Sponsors of the UVVA today made their ideological goal abundantly clear : when given the opportunity to vote for a substitute bill that had virtually identical criminal penalties but recognized the pregnant woman , rather than the fetus , as the victim , they voted against the alternative . '' Violence against women , including pregnant women , is a significant problem in America , one that should be addressed , `` stated Feldt . '' This bill does nothing but shift the focus away from real solutions by undermining women's health and reproductive freedoms. `` Because the UVVA is a Federal Bill , it can not actually be used in any murder case , which would fall under State Law . This would make the UVVA ineffectual in actually protecting a pregnant woman , but create a stepping stone for a national ban on abortion . An alternate version of the bill , which recognizes the pregnant woman as the victim , and includes a provision to the Tenth Amendment ( States Rights ) , was voted against by the same people who voted for the UVVA .""","""That is fairly rediculous . The bill is being used as a political tool and will not help women at all . I hate it when all these self-righteous `` pro-life `` senators say how much they want to help , and ignore what will actually help . As a note , John Kerry voted for the alternative bill .""",DISAGREE,"""women 's This bill does nothing but shift the focus away from real solutions by undermining health and reproductive""","""The bill is being used as a political tool and will not help women at all""",,
20183,5315,"""Anyone can use scientific evidence . As long as people have agendas , science ca n't be treated as objective truth . Science , or scientific facts can be used to show a number of proofs , depending upon your own personal bias . *""","""Yes . That 's what creationists do . They skip the part about hypothesis , prediction and testing and make the facts conform to their agenda - POOF ! GODDIDIT !""",DISAGREE,"""As long as people have agendas , science ca n't be treated as objective truth .""","""Yes . That 's what creationists do .""",,
20186,5316,"""Whether this has anything to do with marriage or not , it is deplorable that A PERSON who loves another person should be denied a hospital visit for any reason other than concerns related to health .""","""The problem is that there is no test the staff can administer to determine love . They ca n't tell if someone is really a loved one , or just some freak off the street that gets off on looking at unconscious people . Restricting access to family members is not an inherently bad idea , but it must include in its definition of family same sex couples . And since the only way to guarantee that definition is legally , what we have here is one more reason why gays should be allowed to get married .""",AGREE,"""Whether this has anything to do with marriage or""","""The problem is that there is no test the staff can administer to determine love .""",,
20192,5318,"""I survived an abortion attempt' Gianna Jessen 's mother was seven-and-a-half months pregnant when it was decided to abort the foetus she was carrying . A saline solution was injected into Gianna 's mother 's womb , which doctors thought would kill the foetus within hours . This time , most unusually , the procedure failed and Gianna was born alive , thanks in part to a shocked nurse . She was so taken aback by Gianna 's live delivery that she summoned an ambulance to whisk her from the abortion clinic to the hospital . She weighed only two pounds at birth and needed to stay in hospital for nearly three months . In an ironic twist of fate the abortionist had to sign her birth certificate . Now American-born Gianna , aged 28 , is in London to give her message against abortion .""","""Opinions ?""",DISAGREE,"""Now American-born Gianna , aged 28 , is in London to give her message against abortion .""","""Opinions""",,
20202,5321,"""Tsk""","""Oh , gosh ! You really do feel our pain . Quick ! Someone get me a beach blanket to wipe up all of Jyoshu 's crocodile tears ...""",DISAGREE,"""Tsk""","""Someone get me a beach blanket to wipe up all of Jyoshu 's crocodile tears""",,
20218,5325,"""One of the quotes in your signature is- `` The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is , as a last resort , to protect themselves against tyranny in government . -Thomas Jefferson `` But this is a bogus quote . http : //www.guncite.com/gc2ndbog.html Why do you use a bogus quote ?""","""That 's the best you could do ? There 's the other three and here 's a bonus one : 'To disarm the people is the best , most effectual way , to enslave them . ' - George Mason""",DISAGREE,"""The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is , as a last resort""","""There 's the other three and here 's a bonus one : 'To disarm the people is the best , most effectual""",,
20229,5328,"""It 's not the composition of the sugar I want redefined ; it is who is allowed to use it . Changing the composition of sugar would affect other people who want to use it ,""","""Since sugar ( in this analogy ) represents opposite-sex marriage ( which IS marriage , IMO ) , everyone can use it . You just do n't want to . So instead of being willing to use a different sweetner , you DO want to change the composition of sugar .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not the composition of the sugar I want redefined ; it is who is allowed to use it . Changing the composition of sugar would affect other people who want to use it ,""","""Since sugar ( in this analogy ) represents opposite-sex marriage ( which IS marriage , IMO ) , everyone can use it . You just do n't want to . So instead of being willing to use a different sweetner , you DO want to change the composition of sugar .""",,
20270,5335,"""I 'm sorry , I mispoke- It could have resulted in two deaths . Once again , your article does not give us much insight into the situation . If the baby has sepsis , or some other type of contamination , it is very likely she would get it too .""","""But how would abortion laws ( at least the ones I would like , and most of pro-lifers ) cause this ?""",DISAGREE,"""your article does not give us much insight into the situation .""","""But how would abortion laws ( at least the ones I would like , and most of pro-lifers ) cause this ?""",,
20295,5337,"""OccamsRazor : To look at it from another perspective could life as we know it ever come to be without reproduction ? no . Perhaps now we have reached a state where we may soon be able to cheat death and become individually immortal we are still products of reproduvtive ancestors- remove those an we would never have been .""","""While your previous problem fell because it dealt with the future , this one falls because it deals with the past . I am interested in the NOW - the moment when the determination is being made . That PREVIOUS organisms needed to reproduce in order for things to end up where we are today does not tell us that it is REQUIREMENT for something existing NOW ( at the time the determination is being made ) to reproduce in order to be considered living .""",DISAGREE,"""To look at it from another perspective could life as we know it ever come to be without reproduction ?""","""While your previous problem fell because it dealt with the future ,""",,
20290,5337,"""OccamsRazor : To look at it from another perspective could life as we know it ever come to be without reproduction ? no . Perhaps now we have reached a state where we may soon be able to cheat death and become individually immortal we are still products of reproduvtive ancestors- remove those an we would never have been .""","""While your previous problem fell because it dealt with the future , this one falls because it deals with the past . I am interested in the NOW - the moment when the determination is being made . That PREVIOUS organisms needed to reproduce in order for things to end up where we are today does not tell us that it is REQUIREMENT for something existing NOW ( at the time the determination is being made ) to reproduce in order to be considered living .""",DISAGREE,"""could life as we know it ever come to be without reproduction ? no . able to cheat death and become individually immortal""","""PREVIOUS organisms needed to reproduce in order for things to end up where we are today does not tell us that it is REQUIREMENT for something existing NOW""",,
20318,5340,"""But then , the justification for abortion rests on the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish . As such , I have not been absolutely convinced of this . Do you mind helping me out a little by drawing this argument out in a little more detail ?""",DISAGREE,"""the justification for abortion rests on the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish , I have not been absolutely convinced of this .""",,
20320,5340,"""But then , the justification for abortion rests on the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish . As such , I have not been absolutely convinced of this . Do you mind helping me out a little by drawing this argument out in a little more detail ?""",DISAGREE,"""the justification for abortion rests on the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish .""",,
20322,5340,"""But then , the justification for abortion rests on the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I 've seen that argued throughout these posts , but I do n't think I 've seen the argument from start to finish . As such , I have not been absolutely convinced of this . Do you mind helping me out a little by drawing this argument out in a little more detail ?""",DISAGREE,"""the right to control one 's own body , not population control .""","""I have not been absolutely convinced of this""",,
20324,5341,"""Yes they do . Modern Coelocanth : Modern Coelocanth No they do n't . Fossil Coelocanth : Fossil Coelocanth No , it was based upon the fact we had n't seen one , yet there were fossils of them . Then when we did see the descendants of the fossils and it got changed , that 's how science works , when better data is found , the theories are changed .""","""A model of a live fish and fossils of a fish are going to be significantly different under any circumstances . There was a gap in the fossil record , scientists looked it at it , and using the theory of evolution mindset , automatically assumed that it went extinct millions and millions of years ago . But of course , it was absolutely wrong . A prediction was made based on the theory of evolution and it was absolutely wrong . Simple .""",AGREE,"""No they do n't . Fossil Coelocanth : Fossil Coelocanth No , it was based upon the fact we had n't seen one , yet there were fossils of them .""","""A model of a live fish and fossils of a fish are going to be significantly different under any was a gap in the fossil record ,""",,
20350,5345,"""Originally posted by kelvin90701 Toy guncontrol the ultimate insult to personal responsibility as given in the example with the orginal post .""","""I think you got it backwards Kelvin . You 're the one that said you would n't let your children play with toy guns because you 're afraid that your children would n't be able to tell the difference between a real gun and a toy gun . Blindone never advocated toy gun-control . On the contrary , Blindone was pointing out that toy guns do n't harm children . And if your children ca n't tell the difference between fantasy and reality how do you expect them to handle a gun responsibly ? They might try to shoot the boogey man or their own shadow .""",DISAGREE,"""Toy guncontrol the ultimate insult to personal responsibility""","""You 're the one that said you would n't let your children play with toy guns because you 're afraid that your children would n't be able to tell the difference between a real gun and a toy gun .""",,
20351,5345,"""Originally posted by kelvin90701 Toy guncontrol the ultimate insult to personal responsibility as given in the example with the orginal post .""","""I think you got it backwards Kelvin . You 're the one that said you would n't let your children play with toy guns because you 're afraid that your children would n't be able to tell the difference between a real gun and a toy gun . Blindone never advocated toy gun-control . On the contrary , Blindone was pointing out that toy guns do n't harm children . And if your children ca n't tell the difference between fantasy and reality how do you expect them to handle a gun responsibly ? They might try to shoot the boogey man or their own shadow .""",DISAGREE,"""Toy guncontrol the ultimate insult to personal responsibility as given in the example with the orginal post .""","""you would n't let your children play with toy guns because you 're afraid that your children would n't be able to tell the difference between a real gun and a toy gun . Blindone never advocated toy gun-control .""",,
20368,5356,"""I do n't believe it is DrNo , because by its very definition evolution claims that Man evolved from the lower animals . It relegates us to nothing more than a biological organism with no more value than an viral bacteria . Another problem you run into regarding Genesis is the spiritual relationship Man has with God and Adams fall from grace . Evolution erases that relationship which erases the need for the need for being reunited with God through the shed blood of Christ on the Cross . Also , you must redefine what evolution teaches altogether in order to credit God with original creation and then assume evolution is His plan for humanity . That 's why the evolutionists are rejecting your premise out of hand . Your version of it is a sacrilege because it goes from being Natural to Supernatural if God is credited with original Creation . One must not compromise what the bible says in order to find a happy medium with the worlds philosophies . That is folly and will only lead to confusion . What you should ask yourself is why are beasts which can only be described as dinosaurs be found mentioned in the bible ? How did Ancient , so called stone aged men describe living creatures at the time , in their world which evolutionists will tell you were extinct for at least 60 million years by then , only 6,000 to 10,000 years ago ? Here 's what I mean . Behemoth has the following attributes according to Job 40:15-24 It  “ eats grass like an ox. ” It  “ moves his tail like a cedar. ” ( In Hebrew , this literally reads ,  “ he lets hang his tail like a cedar. ” ) Its  “ bones are like beams of bronze , His ribs like bars of iron. ”  “ He is the first of the ways of God. ”  “ He lies under the lotus trees , In a covert of reeds and marsh. ” Job 40:15-24 ( New International Version ) 15 `` Look at the behemoth , [ a ] which I made along with you and which feeds on grass like an ox . 16 What strength he has in his loins , what power in the muscles of his belly ! 17 His tail [ b ] sways like a cedar ; the sinews of his thighs are close-knit . 18 His bones are tubes of bronze , his limbs like rods of iron . 19 He ranks first among the works of God , yet his Maker can approach him with his sword . 20 The hills bring him their produce , and all the wild animals play nearby . 21 Under the lotus plants he lies , hidden among the reeds in the marsh . 22 The lotuses conceal him in their shadow ; the poplars by the stream surround him . 23 When the river rages , he is not alarmed ; he is secure , though the Jordan should surge against his mouth . 24 Can anyone capture him by the eyes , [ c ] or trap him and pierce his nose ? Leviathan has the following attributes according to Job chapter 41 , Psalm 104:25,26 and Isaiah 27:1 . This is only a partial listing—just enough to make the point .  “ No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up. ”  “ Who can open the doors of his face , with his terrible teeth all around ?  ”  “ His rows of scales are his pride , shut up tightly as with a seal ; one is so near another that no air can come between them ; they are joined one to another , they stick together and can not be parted. ”  “ His sneezings flash forth light , and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning . Out of his mouth go burning lights ; sparks of fire shoot out . Smoke goes out of his nostrils , as from a boiling pot and burning rushes . His breath kindles coals , and a flame goes out of his mouth. ”  “ Though the sword reaches him , it can not avail ; nor does spear , dart , or javelin . He regards iron as straw , and bronze as rotten wood . The arrow can not make him flee ; slingstones become like stubble to him . Darts are regarded as straw ; he laughs at the threat of javelins. ”  “ On earth there is nothing like him , which is made without fear. ” Leviathan  “ played ” in the  “ great and wide sea ” ( a paraphrase of Psalm 104 verses 25 and 26—get the exact sense by reading them yourself ) . Leviathan is a  “ reptile [ a ] that is in the sea. ” ( Isaiah 27:1 ) [ a ] Note : The word translated  “ reptile ” here is the Hebrew word tanniyn . This shows that  “ Leviathan ” was also a  “ tanniyn ” ( dragon ) . Job 41:18-21 18 By his exhaling a light does shine , and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning . 19 Out of his mouth go burning lamps , and sparks of fire leap out . 20 Out of his nostrils goes smoke , as out of a seething pot or caldron . 21 His breath kindles coals , and a flame goes out of his mouth . Isa 27:1 In that day the LORD with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent , even leviathan that crooked serpent ; and he shall slay the dragon that [ is ] in the sea . How do we rationally explain these creatures existence so recently in our human history if they were extinct for millions of years ? And if they were the imaginings of bronze age sheep herders as your atheists/evolutionists would have you believe , then how did these ignorant people describe creatures we can now recognize from fossil evidence ? And while your at it , ask yourself if it 's reasonable that the bones of dead creatures have survived from 60 million years to some estimated to be more than 200 million years without becoming dust ? Does that make rational sense to you ? Just look at the egyptian embalming methods for preserving the Pharaohs . They are still a marvel to modern scientists yet they are nothing more than frail shells no more solid than the texture of a bees nest after a short 3000 to 4000 years in a dry and sealed sarcophagus . Yet bones/fossils buried in the Earth with the upheavals , alkalis and acids in the earth in addition to the weather have survived over 60 million years ? You must ask yourself if sciences explanations pass the smell test in the realm of common sense . And that decision is yours alone .""","""This is why religion may not survive the future . People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail . The only hope is if the nuts stop making it in to an adversarial situation . Arch is doing nothing but distorting the very thing he holds so dear , but that is already clear to anyone who knows his work here .""",AGREE,"""I do n't believe it is DrNo , because by its very definition evolution claims that Man evolved from the lower animals""","""This is why religion may not survive the future . People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail""",,
20381,5360,"""According to atheists , fossils in the ground show that evolution , not intelligent design , produced all life on earth . That ’ s ridiculous , the Bible clearly says God created man in his own image , though some deluded scientists also say you can see evolution happening in the mutations of drug resisting bacteria . Give me a break – God [ inaudible mumbling ] genes so that Christians can go to heaven , and that means we [ George Bush/monkey visual ] came from monkeys ?""","""The George Bush visual , the reference to heaven/monkeys was apparently used to emotionally cover the inadequacy of the  “ fossils in the ground ” , and  “ mutations of drug resisting bacteria ” as complete explanations .""",AGREE,"""According to atheists , fossils in the ground show that evolution , not intelligent design , produced all life on earth""","""mutations of drug resisting bacteria as complete explanations""",,
20404,5365,"""# ( n. ) The realization of an inventive or decorative plan ;""","""because that 's the subject of this thread : what designing a solution to a problem actually entails .""",DISAGREE,"""The realization of an inventive or decorative plan ;""","""that 's the subject of this thread :""",,
20427,5370,"""Back it up right there sinjin ! How dare you say that somebody has no right to take any action that might harm others even though there 's a threat that needs to be addressed ? Are you saying that the people on the 9/11 flights had no right to try and take the terrorists down ? That they should 've just remained in their chairs and behaved themselves as they waited to die ? You 're an XXXXX ! I say again , how dare you say that you do n't have a right to try and protect yourself and others from a dangerous situation ? It 's the duty of every American to do the right thing ! You just do n't seem to get it , not in the least . What you 're advocating is allowing the wolves to kill the sheep until they get their fill in hopes that they 'll leave the others alone . You 're saying that it 's better to be a victim and remain helpless , then try to fight back and potentially overwhelm and disarm one of the attackers . You 're basically trusted demented individuals to decide not to hurt you .""","""You are not only rude but incorrect in calling sinjin an XXXXX . His opinion is just as valid as yours . He is quite far from idiocy . I percieve his point to be that you do not have a right to endanger the lives of others by engaging in a firefight with some perps who may not have fired if you had n't shown up playing Sheriff . While we have not yet perfected a method of reliably predicting exactly what some perp will do if left in control with a gun in his hand in a crowded mall , we can assume that more harm will come if he is not taken down and disarmed . The fact that a citizen may legally have a gun in his pocket capable of knocking down a large animal rather than a pea-shooter that will only make it mad is comforting to me . I like big guns , too . I can agree somewhat with the idea of hesitating to interfere when an altercation seems imminent , but I can not agree that armed citizens should never `` endanger the lives of others `` by pulling his piece and firing at the perp . By the way , when you quote someone you should use their exact words , not your version of what they said ... and you should apologize to sinjin for calling him an XXXXX .""",DISAGREE,"""Back it up right there sinjin ! How dare you say that somebody has no right to take any action that might harm others even though""","""and you should apologize to sinjin for calling him an""",,
20428,5370,"""Back it up right there sinjin ! How dare you say that somebody has no right to take any action that might harm others even though there 's a threat that needs to be addressed ? Are you saying that the people on the 9/11 flights had no right to try and take the terrorists down ? That they should 've just remained in their chairs and behaved themselves as they waited to die ? You 're an XXXXX ! I say again , how dare you say that you do n't have a right to try and protect yourself and others from a dangerous situation ? It 's the duty of every American to do the right thing ! You just do n't seem to get it , not in the least . What you 're advocating is allowing the wolves to kill the sheep until they get their fill in hopes that they 'll leave the others alone . You 're saying that it 's better to be a victim and remain helpless , then try to fight back and potentially overwhelm and disarm one of the attackers . You 're basically trusted demented individuals to decide not to hurt you .""","""You are not only rude but incorrect in calling sinjin an XXXXX . His opinion is just as valid as yours . He is quite far from idiocy . I percieve his point to be that you do not have a right to endanger the lives of others by engaging in a firefight with some perps who may not have fired if you had n't shown up playing Sheriff . While we have not yet perfected a method of reliably predicting exactly what some perp will do if left in control with a gun in his hand in a crowded mall , we can assume that more harm will come if he is not taken down and disarmed . The fact that a citizen may legally have a gun in his pocket capable of knocking down a large animal rather than a pea-shooter that will only make it mad is comforting to me . I like big guns , too . I can agree somewhat with the idea of hesitating to interfere when an altercation seems imminent , but I can not agree that armed citizens should never `` endanger the lives of others `` by pulling his piece and firing at the perp . By the way , when you quote someone you should use their exact words , not your version of what they said ... and you should apologize to sinjin for calling him an XXXXX .""",DISAGREE,"""I say again , how dare you say that you do n't have a right to try and protect yourself and others from a dangerous situation ?""","""The fact that a citizen may legally have a gun in his pocket capable of knocking down a large animal rather than a pea-shooter that will only make it mad is comforting to me .""",,
20435,5372,"""1979 , Would you ask the same of an environmentalist ? Would you ask him to pay for buying the all of the rainforests he hopes to save ? The scientific research ? etc . Would you ask this of any other cause except the abortion one ? This is faulty reasoning . No one who supports any cause is expected to pay for the entirety of that cause . BUT anti-abortionists do pay for quite a bit in this regard . There are help centers all over the nation . Have n't you seen the signs ? '' Call if you are pregnant and in need of assistance. `` Do you think that the woman will not relive the rape on a daily basis if she destroys the child ? Not likely . I think she will still suffer through those thoughts . Killing the baby complicates this . What happens if she has horrible thoughts about a rape with more thoughts about the abortion ? I would guess that you judge actions all the time without necessarily knowing what is in a person 's heart . That is , there are certain things you can say are wrong actions without knowing the fullness of what is in someone 's heart or mind . You made that judgment about rape . Who are you to judge that the rapist was n't craving affection , maybe he was mistreated by his mother , etc . No matter the reason he did this it remains wrong . Maybe someone murdered someone else out of anger , revenge , to further himself . It is still wrong no matter the reason . We can judge abortion in the same manner . Is the act wrong ? Yes . Are the circumstances contributory ? Possibly , but this does not change the wrong .""","""I understand your points ... all I am saying is that these are issues that come up .. not saying that these are the ONLY issues ... I 'm not judging that the rapist in the example was n't craving affection or anything like that ... I 'm not judging anyone on that one ... my point was that if a woman is raped and becomes pregnant , she has become pregnant through no choice of her own . But I am not about to take the side of a rapist ... I do n't care how abused they were . When I said that the woman would be reliving the rape , I did n't mean that they would n't otherwise ... but think if you were a woman and were raped , and became pregnant by someone you did n't know or know anything about ... As for the murder part of it , what is it called when anti-abortionists picket outside clinics and shoot and kill the abortion doctors ? Is that not murder ? Does n't that make them hypocrites ?""",DISAGREE,"""No one who supports any cause is expected to pay for the entirety of that cause .""","""When I said that the woman would be reliving the rape , I did n't mean that they would n't otherwise""",,
20433,5372,"""1979 , Would you ask the same of an environmentalist ? Would you ask him to pay for buying the all of the rainforests he hopes to save ? The scientific research ? etc . Would you ask this of any other cause except the abortion one ? This is faulty reasoning . No one who supports any cause is expected to pay for the entirety of that cause . BUT anti-abortionists do pay for quite a bit in this regard . There are help centers all over the nation . Have n't you seen the signs ? '' Call if you are pregnant and in need of assistance. `` Do you think that the woman will not relive the rape on a daily basis if she destroys the child ? Not likely . I think she will still suffer through those thoughts . Killing the baby complicates this . What happens if she has horrible thoughts about a rape with more thoughts about the abortion ? I would guess that you judge actions all the time without necessarily knowing what is in a person 's heart . That is , there are certain things you can say are wrong actions without knowing the fullness of what is in someone 's heart or mind . You made that judgment about rape . Who are you to judge that the rapist was n't craving affection , maybe he was mistreated by his mother , etc . No matter the reason he did this it remains wrong . Maybe someone murdered someone else out of anger , revenge , to further himself . It is still wrong no matter the reason . We can judge abortion in the same manner . Is the act wrong ? Yes . Are the circumstances contributory ? Possibly , but this does not change the wrong .""","""I understand your points ... all I am saying is that these are issues that come up .. not saying that these are the ONLY issues ... I 'm not judging that the rapist in the example was n't craving affection or anything like that ... I 'm not judging anyone on that one ... my point was that if a woman is raped and becomes pregnant , she has become pregnant through no choice of her own . But I am not about to take the side of a rapist ... I do n't care how abused they were . When I said that the woman would be reliving the rape , I did n't mean that they would n't otherwise ... but think if you were a woman and were raped , and became pregnant by someone you did n't know or know anything about ... As for the murder part of it , what is it called when anti-abortionists picket outside clinics and shoot and kill the abortion doctors ? Is that not murder ? Does n't that make them hypocrites ?""",DISAGREE,"""1979 , Would you ask the same of an environmentalist ? Would you ask him to pay for buying the all of the rainforests he hopes to save ?""","""Does n't that make them hypocrites ?""",,
20441,5374,"""sinjin what does the word sophistry mean ? Its not in my websters dictonary . Certianly mine is at least 40 years old , so is that a new word ? In answer to your question sin jin . God just as he answered me simply above , does not always explain in detail his ways to mankind . But my study and prayer tells me that babies born who live only a short while , may have been saved from worse fates that awaited them had they lived longer . They may indeed be the lucky ones who were so loved by God he craved to have them walk the earth only a short while to be counted among men , he knew thier souls were not in need of years of learning many of us must do on earth to evolve into who we become . They were simple , beautiful souls who did not reguire the rigors of the world to perfect them . hope that helps .""","""My god , you 're almost as bad as EZ .""",DISAGREE,"""God just as he answered me simply above , does not always explain in detail his ways to mankind .""","""you 're almost as bad as EZ""",,
20446,5376,"""Maybe only one person could build a computer , maybe one person could make a car , maybe one person could run the mile in under 4 minutes . That does n't mean that God can do ALL of these things . It means that whoever we define to be the greatest being , we can call him god and thus he exists . Of course this would n't be sufficient to Christians as this says that God is probably mortal and has the limits of being a physical being .""","""exactly .""",AGREE,"""Of course this would n't be sufficient to Christians as this says that God is probably mortal and has the limits of being a physical being""","""exactly""",,
20462,5379,"""I believe there has to be a God because I see no compelling evidence that life spontaneously generated from non living chemicals .""","""Argument from ignorance . Nevermind that marc9000 is largely ignorant of chemistry , too .""",DISAGREE,"""see no compelling evidence""","""Argument from ignorance .""",,
20466,5380,"""If I get the government to steal your pig , give it to me , and then I throw pig droppings at you all year and then keep all the pork , that is fascist economic theory . See the difference ? ? ?""","""I see the difference , but that 's not what Obama is trying to do . He got us to buy the pig at a firesale and is hoping to make money selling it back to the original farmer or give it to the fieldhands .""",DISAGREE,"""that is fascist economic theory . See the difference ?""","""I see the difference , that 's not what Obama is trying to do buy the pig at a firesale to make money selling it back to the original farmer or give it to the fieldhands .""",,
20477,5382,"""Only a fool would deny the validity of Geology in legitimate science . Just as only a fool would deny the bible answers our questions in spiritual matters , such as how did we get here . But to apply Geology to a false science such as evo is to corrupt it and will no doubt be proven to result in false conclussions ln many areas of its application . So much for this thread that was started in order to bait and mock rather than seek to learn or actually teach anything .""","""So , you accept Geology , and in turn accept the fact that the earth is around 4.56 billion years old ( and not the literalist age given by fundies who worship the bible ) . And yet you reject all of the discoveries of geology ( the fossil record , etc . ) that evolution explains perfectly . And , as Pandion said before , it stands alone and shows the fact that life has existed in other forms billions of years ago , and humans only appeared recently . BTW , the `` fools `` that are denying the validity of Geology as a legitimate science are your fellow creationists . As to the bible answering `` how did we get here `` , it is as good and trustworthy at that as any other mythology of any other civilization . The bible is mostly a collection of myths , folklore , fairy-tales , and politically influenced propoganda .""",DISAGREE,"""Geology in legitimate science . bible answers our questions in spiritual matters false science such as evo is to corrupt it result in false conclussions""","""you accept Geology , the earth is around 4.56 billion years old you reject all of the discoveries of geology that evolution explains perfectly""",,
20492,5385,"""No one , nothing lives forever . So who is killing off all these things ?""","""I think a better question is what preserved their life for so long ? It is the mercy of God that upholds and preserves people in this life . It is the sin of human beings that is responsible for death .""",DISAGREE,"""nothing lives forever . So who is killing off all these things ?""","""It is the mercy of God that upholds and preserves people in this life . It is the sin of human beings that is responsible for death .""",,
20497,5386,"""Some say that the fetus is comparable to parasite and has no value until birth .""","""What people say does not matter . There is simply no legitimate rational basis for this assertion .""",DISAGREE,"""Some say that the fetus is comparable to parasite and has no value until birth .""","""What people say does not matter . There is simply no legitimate rational basis for this assertion .""",,
20534,5392,"""Quite frankly Jim , can you present ANY EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER to show it is not genetic ?""","""I think it is very difficult , if not impossible to prove a negative .""",DISAGREE,"""can you present ANY EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER to show it is not genetic ?""","""if not impossible to prove a negative .""",,
20549,5395,"""So what if my idea is unscientific ? yours is un-religous , whats your point ?""","""You were passing it off as scientific . -I do n't know anything about the evolution of heart chambers . -We see the same mutation happen all the time . Not all people with Down 's Syndrome have parents with Down 's Syndrome genes .""",DISAGREE,"""So what if my idea is unscientific ?""","""You were passing it off as scientific .""",,
20560,5398,"""Quote : Originally Posted by chemist99a View Post GOD was proved not to exist many years ago details if you wish . I would be honored to see those details .""","""See the refutations of Augustines various proofs for the details . Its not actually very interesting since its so elementary . There are many disproofs on the net in addition . One novel one which seems rather neat is this one .""",DISAGREE,"""GOD was proved not to exist""","""Augustines various proofs disproofs on the net""",,
20570,5401,"""Rustle in the bush . Feathers devolve .""","""Since we see birds today with feathers on them , I do n't see how you can claim that feathers are a impediment to a species survival and would devolve .""",DISAGREE,"""Rustle in the bush . Feathers devolve .""","""Since we see birds today with feathers on them , I do n't see how you can claim that feathers are a impediment to a species survival and would devolve .""",,
20571,5401,"""Rustle in the bush . Feathers devolve .""","""Since we see birds today with feathers on them , I do n't see how you can claim that feathers are a impediment to a species survival and would devolve .""",DISAGREE,"""Feathers devolve .""","""we see birds today with feathers , I do n't see how you can claim""",,
20574,5402,"""Skull shape has nothing at all to do with darwinian selection or random mutations and it has everything to do with diet and lifestyle .""","""And I guess it does n't have anything to do with brain size either .""",DISAGREE,"""Skull shape has nothing at all to do with darwinian selection or random mutations""","""I guess it does n't have anything to do with brain size either .""",,
20584,5405,"""I 'm really confused ...""","""And so am I ... Dear rapture -- With all due respect , I would encourage you to formulate a clear thought and communicate it in a way that an average joe like me will be able to understand . As your two posts are written , I have no clue what you are attempting to communicate . I do have some interest in the topic of viability though , so if you could perhaps explain what you are saying , I would be interested in discussing the topic with you . Thanks ! The Bootfitter""",AGREE,"""I 'm really confused ...""","""do have some interest in the topic of viability though , so if you could perhaps explain what you are saying , I would be interested in discussing the topic with you . Thanks""",,
20589,5406,"""Abram , I would suggest you study cognitive processes and the evolution of both the human body and the human mind . We take reality and describe it in our minds and thus form it into abstract concepts which we can operate with . Or , for more fun , just read a few articles on camouflage . You 'll see that you do n't become invisible by looking exactly like your surroundings , but by simply not looking like anything at all to the observer 's eye .""","""Sounds like lots of arbitrary statements . Your assuming things to be true , and attacking the person not the argument .""",DISAGREE,"""Abram , I would suggest you study cognitive processes and the evolution of both the human body and the human mind""","""Your assuming things to be true , and attacking the person not the argument .""",,
20590,5406,"""Abram , I would suggest you study cognitive processes and the evolution of both the human body and the human mind . We take reality and describe it in our minds and thus form it into abstract concepts which we can operate with . Or , for more fun , just read a few articles on camouflage . You 'll see that you do n't become invisible by looking exactly like your surroundings , but by simply not looking like anything at all to the observer 's eye .""","""Sounds like lots of arbitrary statements . Your assuming things to be true , and attacking the person not the argument .""",DISAGREE,"""You 'll see that you do n't become invisible by looking exactly like your surroundings , but by simply not looking like anything at all to the observer 's eye .""","""Your assuming things to be true , and attacking the person not the argument .""",,
20594,5407,"""Ha ! Show us your Anti-Theism ! ! ! Bring it on !""","""Premise 1 : God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe . ( Definition of God ) Premise 2 : If something exists , then it can be detected/sensed . ( Definition of Existence ) Contrapositive of Premise 2 : If something can not be detected/sensed , then it does not exist . Conclusion : God does not exist . The reason that this doens't prove Atheism is that it can not disprove the existence of , say , the Hindu gods , which are defined as beings in this world that can be seen . It just disproves theism .""",DISAGREE,"""Anti-Theism Bring it on !""","""God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) If something can not be detected/sensed""",,
20601,5409,"""Prudence ? What does prudence have to do with the ability of the people to freely exercise their constitutionally recognized and protected rights ?""","""So you would like pre-teens to have open access to buy , carry and use firearms ? The prudence is because them exercising their 'rights ' can lead to someone else being deprived of all of theirs .""",DISAGREE,"""Prudence prudence have to do with the ability protected rights""","""pre-teens carry and use firearms ?""",,
20602,5409,"""Prudence ? What does prudence have to do with the ability of the people to freely exercise their constitutionally recognized and protected rights ?""","""So you would like pre-teens to have open access to buy , carry and use firearms ? The prudence is because them exercising their 'rights ' can lead to someone else being deprived of all of theirs .""",DISAGREE,"""Prudence ? What does prudence have to do with the ability of the people freely exercise their constitutionally recognized and protected rights ?""","""So you would like pre-teens to have open access to buy , carry and use firearms ? The prudence is because them exercising their 'rights ' lead to someone else being deprived""",,
20608,5410,"""I 'm 21 . I want to move to Switzerland now ..... I want a military grade assault rifle . I miss my M-16 Of course it was special cause I 'm left handed""","""Yer lucky you ai n't as old as me . They would have loved you with the M-1 !""",AGREE,"""I want a military grade assault rifle . I miss my M-16 Of course it was special cause I 'm left handed""","""Yer lucky you ai n't as old as me . They would have loved you with the M-1 !""",,
20623,5414,"""Yea I know that , but there is no `` abortion `` pill that will terminate a fetus .""","""Actually there is , RU-486 ( AKA Mifepristone ) , which aborts upt to two months into the pregnancy . But again , this poster sems to be talking about Plan B , which is NOT an abortion pill , and was what was allowed in the military .""",DISAGREE,"""Yea I know that , but there is no `` abortion `` pill that will terminate a fetus .""","""Actually there is""",,
20630,5416,"""Im sorry you guys are oblivious to sarcasm .. i was merely making a statement about existence ... that guy was just as much existing as an embryo in the womb ...""","""Actually , if you read the friggin article ( * GASP * HERESY ! ! ! ) , you 'd see that this guy was attacked while WALKING FROM THE STORE . If you ca n't see the difference between his mental existence ( quite enough to allow him to move about and do relatively ordinary chores like going to the store ) , and a foetus that does not have mental existence , there is no hope for you .""",DISAGREE,"""Im sorry you guys are oblivious to sarcasm ..""","""that this guy was attacked while WALKING FROM THE STORE . If you ca n't see the difference between his mental""",,
20643,5420,"""You must admit Peeling that the holy grail of evolution has always been finding the missing link that proves that that magical transitional link between Ape and modern Man exists . This has always been considered the most important discovery in evo""","""I think you 're confusing 'important ' with 'sensational ' .""",DISAGREE,"""You must admit Peeling that the holy grail of evolution has always been finding the missing link that proves that that magical transitional link between Ape and modern Man exists .""","""I think you 're confusing 'important ' with 'sensational ' .""",,
20647,5420,"""You must admit Peeling that the holy grail of evolution has always been finding the missing link that proves that that magical transitional link between Ape and modern Man exists . This has always been considered the most important discovery in evo""","""I think you 're confusing 'important ' with 'sensational ' .""",DISAGREE,"""the most important""","""you 're confusing 'important '""",,
20713,5442,"""I think the fetus is a human being , it is just a human being at such an early stage of development that it does not think or feel as it does later in its development . In this stage of development , it is still part of the mother 's body .""","""well , based on this argument , why shouldnt we kill mute , paralysed , vegetable , comatose , and very very drunk people , since they all cant think , or if they can they cant communicate that they are thinking . How about new-born babies that dont know anything ? how about retarded children ? you are fooling yourself if you think that women undergo abortions because they dont like that particular `` part of their body `` . women undergo abortions because they dont want to raise the child when its born . until you face that truth , you 'll be arguing under a dellusion""",DISAGREE,"""it is still part of the mother 's body .""","""well , based on this argument , why shouldnt we kill mute , paralysed , vegetable , comatose , and very very drunk people , since they all cant think , or if they can they cant communicate that they are thinking .""",,
20715,5443,"""Let 's say the parents wanted to send their child to a public school but they did n't want the evolution class . The kid could just not attend the evolution classes .""","""See above , again""",DISAGREE,"""but they did n't want the evolution class . The kid could just not attend the evolution classes .""","""See above , again""",,
20719,5443,"""Let 's say the parents wanted to send their child to a public school but they did n't want the evolution class . The kid could just not attend the evolution classes .""","""See above , again""",DISAGREE,"""public school""","""See above""",,
20733,5446,"""all lving flesh feels pain , even bacteria will move away from being proded under a microscope . Its the soul thats important .""","""Wrong again . A nervous system is required in order to feel pain . Many species of living-flesh animals have no nervous system and can not feel pain of any description ... crickets included . I do not know at what point the nervous system in a fetus is developed enough to transmit pain signals .""",DISAGREE,"""Its the soul thats important .""","""Wrong again""",,
20737,5448,"""Honestly Duck would you base your views off a 74 year old with parkinson 's if he were n't the pope . The bible is pretty much silent on abortion ( if anything it says life starts at birth with the first breath ) , and the current pope 's record is hardly without blemishes . Why could n't this be a little different that the official line ?""","""To step in for Duck , Why would he follow a 74 year old with parkinson 's if he were n't the pope ? We would n't . The whole point is that he is the pope . We look to the pope to be the messenger of Christ and thus an authority on faith and morals . ( By the way he 's 84 years old and I think he gives a powerful message about the value of life and purpose in the elderly . ) So we do n't just follow any 74 year old with parkinson 's . We follow the one who is the 264th successor of Peter who was appointed by Christ to lead his Church . But to address your assertion on the bible and abortion : Nowhere in the Bible is abortion specifically prohibited but the foundation of Christian argument from a biblical perspective is the fact that the unborn being is established as a person from the moment of creation . The unborn being is considered a child . Thus the commandment , `` Thou shalt not kill `` applies . Check out some of these verses as a start : Exodus 21:22-25 , Psalm 139:13-16 , Psalm 71:6 , Deutoronomy 30:19 , Luke 1:15 and 1:41 , Isaiah 49:1 , Jeremiah1:5 , 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 It is also of note that it was , in a sense , a curse to be barren in the Jewish/Christian community . Children were thought of as a blessing from God Psalm 127:3-5 , Matthew 18:10 ( there are many other indications of this as well ) . An attempt at abortion would go against the prevailing culture and mindset . The early Church also spoke out against abortion . Look at this link to see excerpts of the Church Fathers on the subject : http : //www.catholic.com/library/Abortion.asp Keep in mind that not all Christian practices and beliefs are explicity spelled out in scripture . In discussing abortion in the light of Christianity ( including scripture ) , there are some essentials that must be noticed . The Bible unequivocally `` tells `` us that abortion is wrong and in stark contrast to the Christian message . It does that in the nativity of the Gospel of Luke and it does that in the Passion narratives of the four Gospels . The Christian story is about birth , creation , joy , and perseverance . It is also about sacrifice for others and giving life . Father Frank Pavone illustrates this by describing a remarkable contrast in thought on abortion between abortion supporters and Christ . Abortion supporters say , `` This is my body , I can do with it what I want . I can destroy others to preserve my life . I can destroy others so that I may live as I want . Do not interfere with me. `` Whereas , Christ says , `` This is my body , which is given up for you. `` '' This is my body `` -- same words but much different in intent , in action , in charity , in love , in faith , in hope ... Jesus gives his body away so that others live . Abortion proponents cling to their own bodies so that others die .""",DISAGREE,"""bible silent on abortion""","""Bible `` tells `` us that abortion is wrong""",,
20741,5449,"""http : //www.aramaicpeshitta.com/Cool/evolution.htm It destroys the theory of evolution . Plain and simple __________________ Our standard expectation of evolution -- slow , steady , gradual improvement , hence change , through time -- is indeed a myth . Niles Eldredge""","""Tell me , how does a link to a religious nut who thinks the New Testament was first written in Aremic , despite tons of evidence to the contrary , have anything to do with refuting the scientific theory of evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""It destroys the theory of evolution . Plain and simple Our standard expectation of evolution -- slow , steady , gradual improvement , hence change""","""how does a link to a religious nut who thinks the New Testament was first written in Aremic , despite tons of evidence to the contrary""",,
20747,5451,"""Truth and morality are not relative to any given situation .""","""Actually both are relative in every situation . Especially `` The Truth `` as espoused by religious fundamentalists such as yourself , as there are as many different versions of the truth as there religious fundamentalists .""",DISAGREE,"""Truth and morality are not relative to any given situation .""","""Actually both are relative in every situation . Especially `` The Truth `` as espoused by religious fundamentalists such as yourself""",,
20746,5451,"""Truth and morality are not relative to any given situation .""","""Actually both are relative in every situation . Especially `` The Truth `` as espoused by religious fundamentalists such as yourself , as there are as many different versions of the truth as there religious fundamentalists .""",DISAGREE,"""Truth and morality are not relative to any given situation .""","""Actually both are relative in every situation . ``""",,
20757,5461,"""In the vanishingly small likelihood of the event ever coming down down to it , your handgun is not going to face them down or give them a moment 's pause on any measure . They would squash you like a bug , and barely notice .""","""That 's why the Second Amendment protects the private ownership of arms like the .50 BMG and other such powerful weapons .""",DISAGREE,"""event ever coming down down to it , your handgun is not going to face them down or give them a moment 's pause""","""protects the private ownership of arms like the .50 BMG and other such powerful weapons .""",,
20761,5461,"""In the vanishingly small likelihood of the event ever coming down down to it , your handgun is not going to face them down or give them a moment 's pause on any measure . They would squash you like a bug , and barely notice .""","""That 's why the Second Amendment protects the private ownership of arms like the .50 BMG and other such powerful weapons .""",DISAGREE,"""your handgun is not going to face them down""","""That 's why the Second Amendment protects the private ownership of arms like the .50 BMG and other such powerful weapons .""",,
20769,5462,"""I have been reminded by my wife today that our 31st anniversary is coming at the end of this month . If these developments mean that you are nearer to experiencing the same marital bliss/sentence as me then I am happy for you . See you in the pit JJ""","""Thanks . Well I 'm a resident of California currently but my partner has orders to Virginia . If they allow outside residents to apply for a license we 'll do it Considering DC is only a four hour drive or so .""",AGREE,"""If these developments mean that you are nearer to experiencing the same marital bliss/sentence as me then I am happy for you .""","""Thanks .""",,
20803,5466,"""Here on earth having billions of christian , catholic , muslim , buddhist are following their friends , their parents , their country 's people to believe in God since born or during growth but do n't know what God is or dare to ask if there 's really GOD in the universe !""","""I 'll respond when I can figure out what you 're trying to say .""",DISAGREE,"""Here on earth having billions of christian , catholic , muslim , buddhist are following their friends , their parents , their country 's people to believe in God since born or during growth but do n't know what God is or dare to ask if there 's really GOD in the universe !""","""I 'll respond when I can figure out what you 're trying to say .""",,
20811,5467,"""Sorry I missed your thread on that . It sounds like you are mainly concerned with health issues that could very potentially lead to the mother 's death and or/complete debilitation ( like paralysis ) , and I 'd be much more open to that . But as you said , we have two extremes to choose from , and SCOTUS chose the one that does n't take into account the woman 's health for this particular procedure . I 'd also add that because this is a late term procedure , if health is the reason to not take the baby to term , then caesarian delivery very well might be an option , in many cases .""","""I agree that all other reasonably safe options ( such as caesarian delivery , in womb operations , etc . ) should be looked into before resorting to abortion in that third trimester . As with the example of the friend of jitobear , sometimes there is just not a reasonably safe option for a particular woman since her conditions might not allow those alternate procedures . As for the question of limits on the health exception , yes , the exceptions that are clearer to me are the ones that could ultimately lead to the mother 's death or complete debilitation . However , there is also a gray region that I am undecided on . For example : - What if the pregnancy would lead to less critical loss - such as the loss of use of her legs or arms ? What about one limb - such as the use of one arm ? - What if the pregnancy would give a medium chance of loss - such as a 20 % chance of paralysis ? The gray region is harder to quantify and the moral balance gets trickier . Perhaps that is why this issue has n't really been addressed specifically in law . Where decisions in morally gray regions are concerned , it is too easy to criticize them and politically unwise to venture into that territory .""",AGREE,"""health issues that could very potentially lead to the mother 's death and or/complete debilitation caesarian delivery""","""I agree that all other reasonably safe options ( such as caesarian delivery , in womb operations , etc . ) should be looked into limits on the health exception , yes , the exceptions that are clearer to me are the ones that could ultimately lead to the mother 's death or complete debilitation""",,
20816,5467,"""Sorry I missed your thread on that . It sounds like you are mainly concerned with health issues that could very potentially lead to the mother 's death and or/complete debilitation ( like paralysis ) , and I 'd be much more open to that . But as you said , we have two extremes to choose from , and SCOTUS chose the one that does n't take into account the woman 's health for this particular procedure . I 'd also add that because this is a late term procedure , if health is the reason to not take the baby to term , then caesarian delivery very well might be an option , in many cases .""","""I agree that all other reasonably safe options ( such as caesarian delivery , in womb operations , etc . ) should be looked into before resorting to abortion in that third trimester . As with the example of the friend of jitobear , sometimes there is just not a reasonably safe option for a particular woman since her conditions might not allow those alternate procedures . As for the question of limits on the health exception , yes , the exceptions that are clearer to me are the ones that could ultimately lead to the mother 's death or complete debilitation . However , there is also a gray region that I am undecided on . For example : - What if the pregnancy would lead to less critical loss - such as the loss of use of her legs or arms ? What about one limb - such as the use of one arm ? - What if the pregnancy would give a medium chance of loss - such as a 20 % chance of paralysis ? The gray region is harder to quantify and the moral balance gets trickier . Perhaps that is why this issue has n't really been addressed specifically in law . Where decisions in morally gray regions are concerned , it is too easy to criticize them and politically unwise to venture into that territory .""",AGREE,"""health issues the mother 's death and or/complete debilitation ( like paralysis ) late term procedure caesarian delivery""","""reasonably safe options ( such as caesarian delivery , in womb operations , etc . ) should be looked into third trimester the mother 's death or complete debilitation 20 % chance of paralysis ?""",,
20824,5470,"""This has got to the state where I ca n't think of a single argument backing up his ( Chuz 's ) 'fact ' that I have not seen ( or , in many cases , written ) a rebuttal to .""","""That 's great , ... hopefully you will re-post some of them here and we can debate/ discuss them .""",AGREE,"""This has got to the state where I ca n't think of a single argument backing up his ( Chuz 's ) 'fact ' that I have not seen ( or , in many cases , written ) a rebuttal to .""","""That 's great , ... hopefully you will re-post some of them here and we can debate/ discuss them .""",,
20841,5475,"""This is n't interesting at all . What did these magical `` light-sensitive cells `` evolve from ? What were they before and what event or process caused them to evolve into light sensing cells ? Why do bats continue to rely on sonar to `` see ? `` Why have n't they evolved eyes over time ? In my opinion , this guy is basically saying that if you had a bunch of bricks and mortar , a building could be built . He just leaves out how you get the bricks and mortar , which is the whole problem .""","""actually , human skin is sensitive to light , not to mention nearly all plants are sensitive to light . light sensitive cells are abundant even where there are no eyes . just a tiny bit of reading and youll realise that they didnt `` magically `` appear .""",DISAGREE,"""This is n't interesting at all . What did these magical `` light-sensitive cells `` evolve from ?""","""just a tiny bit of reading and youll realise that they didnt `` magically `` appear .""",,
20848,5476,"""Professor Heribert Nilsson , an evolutionist ...""","""Are you incapable of reading , as well as being mind-numbingly assinine ? The thread is about creationism , not evolution . Attacking evolution does not defend the lies of creationists . Your failure to defend biblical creation shows that you can not support your own position and instead have to resort to petty nit-picking of your opponent 's position . This is both stupid and intellectually dishonest .""",DISAGREE,"""Professor Heribert Nilsson , an evolutionist""","""The thread is about creationism , not evolution .""",,
20853,5477,"""OMG . Here we go again .""","""Yes , it seems you never learn , so I have no hope of educating you , and absolutely no intention .""",DISAGREE,"""OMG . Here we go again .""","""Yes , it seems you never learn""",,
20855,5478,"""Have you ever given orders to the morning , or shown the dawn its place , that it might take the earth by the edges and shake the wicked out of it ? The earth takes shape like clay under a seal ; its features stand out like those of a garment .""","""Uhm , where does this say that the earth rotates ? Nowhere . Simply speaking of morning or dawn does not show knowledge of earth 's rotation . In today 's world it does , but not back then . In fact , the verse our Creationist conveniently left out says the the Earth has edges ... this is probably more flat earth mentality , like the four-cornered earth mentioned elsewhere in the Bible . PS : And while we 're at it , let 's not forget about the things that Bible gets completely wrong , like bats being birds ( Leviticus 11:13-18 ) .""",DISAGREE,"""The earth takes shape like clay under a seal""","""Simply speaking of morning or dawn does not show knowledge of earth 's rotation .""",,
20870,5481,"""So , your saying an eyewitness would mean nothing . Yeah right .""","""Your logic is that if no one was there to witness it , it therefore did not happen . Under that logic , creation did not happen because no one was there to witness it , God does not count because we ca n't even prove it exists , much less hold it accountable for being there to witness it . The entire argument based around the witness via your argument is worthless .""",DISAGREE,"""So , your saying an eyewitness would mean nothing""","""Your logic is that if no one was there to witness it , it therefore did not happen .""",,
20880,5483,"""Well , you 've told me you do not believe , literally , in the book of genesis . God did n't create the world in six days , the earth and the rest of the universe are actually billions of years old , etc . But I assume you do believe , literally , in the ten commandments ? That they are really the words of god ? Why the dichotomy ? How can you write the creation story of as something to interpret as you wish , but the ten commandments are solid and correct ? .""","""The 10 commandments are a real time story , told and recorded by the person with whom it happened to ... Moses . Genesis , is a history lesson , told by a man who had no understanding of modern science , or the language to describe it in that fashion ... Moses . If God chose to reveal to you in some special way , the origins of the universe , for you to write down for generations to come .. you would write a different story than Moses . Just as one person views art differently from another person . I see no duplicity between the two .""",DISAGREE,"""Well , you 've told me you do not believe , literally , in the book of genesis""","""If God chose to reveal to you in some special way , the origins of the universe , for you to write down for generations to come""",,
20888,5484,"""I keep hearing gays say that but every time it 's put to a vote , you lose . I 'd say that it 's time to try another tact because the current one is a losing proposition . The only thing forcing gay marriage on a population does is galvanize them against the forced action . And when they respond on the ballot , they do so punatively . Just wait until you see the repercussions of the current efforts to give ALL Federal Employee 's same sex partners bennies on OUR DIME despite DOMA . I 'm guessing that some additional Democratic heads will roll in the fall election if that flies . You need a PR strategy that highlights the advantages of gay unions over bathhouse and gay bar existences . I believe that a true majority of people would support civil unions but NOT marriage . And I count myself amongst that majority .""","""Actually JP so far 5 states have passed gay marriage so no not every time it is put to a vote do we lose . And how am I forcing anyone to accept gay marriage ? Am I forcing these voters to attend my wedding or dare I say be in a marriage themselves ? And I can not agree with you more about changing the image of the gay community as a whole .. We are not all a bunch of promiscuous sex crazed people running around ... What I find funny is once strait people find out how boring we really are , and how we pay taxes just like every other joe schmo they 'll think nothing more of special rights lol ... But actually like I stated earlier in another thread if those unions constituted the same legal rights as married couples I would be content .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'd say that it 's time to try another tact because the current one is a losing proposition""","""And how am I forcing anyone to accept gay marriage""",,
20899,5486,"""To sacrifice anyone to the interests of others , to deny them the quality of life to which they are entitled , is an evil proposition .""","""what is your basis ? what do you mean by `` evil `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""to deny them the quality of life to which they are entitled , is an evil proposition .""","""what do you mean by evil""",,
20913,5488,"""To expound on my last post : And yet this is taken to be fact unanimously in our history books . Funny how easy this book gets a pass .""","""Funny how you have n't had a literature or history class recently . Would you like me to contact the several history and literature/English teachers in my school and ask them if they credit Homer as the actual author of those epics ?""",DISAGREE,"""To expound on my last post : And yet this is taken to be fact unanimously in our history books .""","""Funny how you have n't had a literature or history class recently .""",,
20915,5488,"""To expound on my last post : And yet this is taken to be fact unanimously in our history books . Funny how easy this book gets a pass .""","""Funny how you have n't had a literature or history class recently . Would you like me to contact the several history and literature/English teachers in my school and ask them if they credit Homer as the actual author of those epics ?""",DISAGREE,"""And yet this is taken to be fact unanimously in our history books""","""Would you like me to contact the several history and literature/English teachers in my school and ask them if they credit Homer as the actual author of those epics""",,
20917,5489,"""It really does make one wonder though , if there is really nothing to hide , why are pro-abortionists so desperate to hide and mask the truth about abortion ?""","""Just out of interest , which particular aspect of `` truth `` are you getting at here ?""",DISAGREE,"""why are pro-abortionists so desperate to hide and mask the truth about abortion ?""","""which particular aspect of `` truth `` are you getting at here ?""",,
20922,5491,"""Every child needs a mom and dad if at all possible . Research has proven this . Our prisons are full of children with no fathers in their lives ! ! Two moms or two dads has never been proven necessary .""","""You might want to consider talking to the children of gay people about their parents . You could start with mine . When he hears arguments like yours - his response `` shame on them. `` He 's 11 , but he gets it , and finds your point of view as repulsive as racism . '' You do n't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows. `` ~ Bob Dylan""",DISAGREE,"""Every child needs a mom and dad if at all possible""","""do n't need a weather man to know which way the wind""",,
20925,5492,"""... any consistent pro-life advocate must urge any mother who accidentally loses her child due to actions she undertook , be charged with manslaughter .""","""The problem is that she would have had to display reckless disregard for the situation , such as drinking heavily . I think that many consistent pro-lifers would be happy to have her charged with manslaughter .""",DISAGREE,"""any consistent pro-life advocate must urge any mother who accidentally loses her child due to actions she undertook""","""I think that many consistent pro-lifers would be happy to have her charged with manslaughter .""",,
20929,5493,"""Yes they have . Are you denying that conservatives and religious-right advocates have not been trying to ban gay marrige ?""","""Of course they have been . They are following the Bible which says homosexuality is a sin .""",AGREE,"""Are you denying that conservatives and religious-right advocates have not been trying to ban gay marrige ?""","""Of course they have been . They are following the Bible which says homosexuality is a sin .""",,
20950,5498,"""No . You 've completely missed the point . But then again you like in the United Kingdom so I 'm not really surprised that you did . Your society has so much fear and distrust that it could actually be sold by the slice . Your paranoia is so pervasive that you 've insisted on the 10,000 security cameras being implemented in just the city of London alone . You 're so worried about a threat to your perceived safety that you do n't even trust your down police because you 're afraid they might wind up killing you . Fear is n't when you need a firearm to protect yourself . Fear is when you lock yourself away from the rest of the world and become unable to trust the police or your neighbors because you believe they 're out to murder you . Fear is when you give up your liberties and rights because you want the government to be your parents and protect you from yourself . The United Kingdom is nothing more than a society of fear , distrust and raging paranoia . Yours is a society that we wish to have no part of . Kindly keep your distrust of your neighbors to yourself and do n't try to tell us how we should run our country .""","""`` [ On ancient Athens ] : In the end , more than freedom , they wanted security . They wanted a comfortable life , and they lost it all & # 8211 ; security , comfort , and freedom . When the Athenians finally wanted not to give to society but for society to give to them , when the freedom they wished for most was freedom from responsibility , then Athens ceased to be free and was never free again. `` & # 8211 ; Edward Gibbon History repeats itself when forgotten .""",DISAGREE,"""No . You 've completely missed the point . You 're so worried about a threat to your perceived safety that you do n't even trust your down police because you 're afraid they might wind up killing you .""","""History repeats itself when forgotten .""",,
20955,5499,"""Fact is grant money is n't going to embryonic stem cell research because it has n't yielded results favorable to the investment .""","""That 's only true because of the bonehead in the whitehouse . Once bush leaves you will see a lot of great things becoming reality through embryonic stem cell research""",DISAGREE,"""grant money is n't going to embryonic stem cell research because it has n't yielded results favorable to the investment .""","""only true because of the bonehead in the whitehouse . Once bush leaves you will see a lot of great things becoming reality through embryonic stem cell research""",,
20974,5502,"""You have repeatedly alleged that ALL of these fossils have ALWAYS been found at just the right stratum implying that it is absolute evidence of the accuracy of evo 's findings and conclusions . I challenge you to offer 2 links with two cut and paste quotes of any two scientific sources that both claim that every single fossil ever found to contribute to the theory has been found at precisely the right strata that coincides with its alleged age .""","""And I challange you to find just one instance where he 's ever claimed that ALL fossils have ALWAYS been found at precisely the right depth . And then link to it , of course . It will be amusing to see how you misinterpreted whatever was actually said .""",DISAGREE,"""I challenge you to offer 2 links with two cut and paste quotes of any two scientific sources that both claim that every single fossil ever found to contribute to the theory has been found at precisely the right strata that coincides with its alleged age .""","""And I challange you to find just one instance where he 's ever claimed that ALL fossils have ALWAYS been found at precisely the right depth . And then link to it , of course""",,
20978,5502,"""You have repeatedly alleged that ALL of these fossils have ALWAYS been found at just the right stratum implying that it is absolute evidence of the accuracy of evo 's findings and conclusions . I challenge you to offer 2 links with two cut and paste quotes of any two scientific sources that both claim that every single fossil ever found to contribute to the theory has been found at precisely the right strata that coincides with its alleged age .""","""And I challange you to find just one instance where he 's ever claimed that ALL fossils have ALWAYS been found at precisely the right depth . And then link to it , of course . It will be amusing to see how you misinterpreted whatever was actually said .""",DISAGREE,"""scientific sources that both claim that every single fossil ever found to contribute to the theory has been found at precisely the right strata that coincides with its alleged age .""","""where he 's ever claimed that ALL fossils have ALWAYS been found at precisely the right depth . And then link to it , of course .""",,
20989,5513,"""With registration , people have to apply for a licence to own a firearm and in most cases successfully complete a Firearms Safety Course before the licence will be issued . With gun registration , the government has the right to deny a person permission to own a gun . This seems to be a direct contradiction of the premise & # 8220 ; innocent until proven guilty & # 8221 ; . Gun owners are worried that total gun registration will eventually lead to the disarming of the people and cite the Nazi disarming of the Jews after gun registration became law in Germany . They also cite examples from Great Britain saying that after gun registration became law , different kinds of guns will gradually be outlawed until no one will be allowed to own a gun of any kind . No amount of gun registration will effectively wipe out crime in either large cities or rural areas . In Russia , for example , private possession of firearms is illegal , yet there are accounts of mass murders . Modern day serial killers all had guns that were bought through legal channels . Even if gun registration does become law , the government has no idea who owns guns in the country . People who disagree with the law will simply choose not to register their firearm and no one will know anything about it . The fact of trying to get everyone in a country as large as the United States or Canada to register their firearms is a very costly venture and one that will not achieve its objectives .""","""Gun registration part of the plan all along""",AGREE,"""Gun owners are worried that total gun registration will eventually lead to the disarming of the people and cite the Nazi disarming of the Jews after gun registration became law in Germany . They also cite examples from Great Britain saying that after gun registration became law , different kinds of guns will gradually be outlawed until no one will be allowed to own a gun of any kind . No amount of gun registration will effectively wipe out crime in either large cities or rural areas . In Russia , for example , private possession of firearms is illegal , yet there are accounts of mass murders""","""Gun registration part of the plan all along""",,
20995,5515,"""Until you are introduced to one , you do n't have knowledge of them . For example , you have no knowledge of the concept of `` hofflenosh `` , which is what this thread is all about , but it is still an abstract concept .""","""Just because we do not know the laws of logic does not mean they do not exist . I could debate someone and violate the laws of logic and claim I don ’ t have any knowledge of them and therefore they don ’ t exist for me . Attacking the person again , not the argument , I guess atheists can make logical fallacies because it ’ s a concept that they can choose to not exist like the concept of  “ hofflenosh ”""",DISAGREE,"""Until you are introduced to one , you do n't have knowledge of them .""","""Just because we do not know the laws of logic does not mean they do not exist . I could debate someone and violate the laws of logic and claim I don ’ t have any knowledge of them and therefore they don ’ t exist for me .""",,
21003,5517,"""Originally posted by Calligirl The entire Bible is `` man made `` . When you start believing that parts of the Bible are infallible , where does it end ?""","""As a Christian comfortable with their faith and reality .""",DISAGREE,"""where does it end ?""","""comfortable with their faith and reality .""",,
21004,5518,"""No , the church is not evolving . Neither is society , language , ethics , morality , or our ability to shop . Only biological populations evolve .""","""Evolve is used for a lack of a better word . Change could be used but that is more of a short term process . Evolve indicates a measured change over a long period of time . It even works in suggesting one idea and split off into many versions of the same idea . So I would agree that for lack of a better word , the church is evolving . What would you say ?""",DISAGREE,"""No , the church is not evolving .""","""for lack of a better word , the church is evolving .""",,
21017,5521,"""He did n't ! I hope you reported that to the admin""","""He did and I did n't . Kind of prefer to fight my own battles .""",DISAGREE,"""He did n't ! I hope you reported that to the admin""","""He did and I did n't .""",,
21034,5525,"""The serious violent crimes included are rape , robbery , aggravated assault , and homicide .""","""And the good news is that this good trend has continued . According to the latest FBI UCR . Crime in the United States -- by Volume and Rate per 100,000 Inhabitants , 1989 & # 8211 ; 2008""",DISAGREE,"""The serious violent crimes included are rape , robbery , aggravated assault , and homicide .""","""And the good news is that this good trend has continued . According to the latest FBI UCR""",,
21046,5527,"""We need the ability to identify and prosecute straw purchasers and complicit dealers . ] quote""","""Well maybe on the 4473 they could put a little box to check if you are a straw purchaser , maybe a psychic in the back room or ask them politely if they are straw purchasers .""",DISAGREE,"""We need the ability to identify and prosecute straw purchasers and complicit""","""Well maybe on the 4473 they could put a little box to check if you are a straw purchaser ,""",,
21053,5529,"""The reason that 's the case is because there are many limitations on marriage but only homosexuals claim they are being discriminated against .""","""And if you rewind a little over 40 years , the exact same thing could be said about interracial marriage . Archie 's reply is a non-argument , and false at that . Multiple other groups state discrimination in marriage , but there are LEGITIMATE STATE INTERESTS prohibiting their marriage . Little things like child rape , lack of consent , and other issues .""",DISAGREE,"""The reason that 's the case is because there are many limitations on marriage but only homosexuals claim they are being discriminated against .""","""And if you rewind a little over 40 years , the exact same thing could be said about interracial marriage . Archie 's reply is a non-argument , and false at that""",,
21066,5531,"""There is no evidence to support the claim that the entire Iraq population was at any point heavily armed and capable of overthrowing a dictator .""","""`` Iraq , one of the most heavily armed countries in the world , is believed to harbor enough guns to arm every one of its 24 million citizens . Iraqi civilians also have access to other light weapons , such as rocket- propelled grenades , mortars , and bombs - making their arsenals potentially more deadly . '' In the absence of a governing force in Iraq , some Iraqis are looking to increase their personal weapons caches in order to protect themselves from looters and roving armed gangs ; others want small arms to conduct illegal activities and gain political power . Reports have surfaced that gun merchants have set up shop on the streets of Baghdad , selling AK-47s for as little as $ 10. `` War ends , but Iraq battle over small arms just begins | csmonitor.com In this thread I was told that handguns were useful in combating tyranny- Is The Second Amendment No Longer Relevant ? So I 'm supposed to believe that handguns are useful in battling tyranny but not having numerous amounts of the above weapons ? Shows how inconsistent people can be when it serves their agenda .""",DISAGREE,"""There is no evidence to support the claim that the entire Iraq population was""","""Iraq , one of the most heavily armed countries in the world , is believed to harbor enough guns to arm every one of its 24 million citizens""",,
21068,5532,"""Well the Supreme Court has seen fit to say that this position is absolutely wrong , making it dead and buried and gone .""","""Even with the Supreme Court ruling , Sinjin and Chet have said otherwise ... on the day this was posted !""",DISAGREE,"""Well the Supreme Court has seen fit to say that this position is absolutely wrong , making it dead and buried and gone""","""Even with the Supreme Court ruling , Sinjin and Chet have said otherwise ... on the day this was posted !""",,
21070,5532,"""Well the Supreme Court has seen fit to say that this position is absolutely wrong , making it dead and buried and gone .""","""Even with the Supreme Court ruling , Sinjin and Chet have said otherwise ... on the day this was posted !""",DISAGREE,"""the Supreme Court has seen fit to say that this position is absolutely wrong""","""Even with the Supreme Court ruling , Sinjin and Chet have said otherwise""",,
21074,5533,"""The California doctor entered a profession that promises to & # 8220 ; first , do no harm & # 8221 ; and the law requires her to treat a patient in need & # 8211 ; gay or straight , Christian or Muslim & # 8211 ; regardless of her religious beliefs . The law does not , and can not , dictate her faith & # 8211 ; it can only insist that she follow her oath as a medical professional .""","""Actually , no , my understanding is that in most states the law does n't require this at all . Many doctors take what is known as the Hipocratic oath , but it 's not a legally binding oath . Doctors may be subject to personal lawsuits , but that 's not the same thing . Also , the fact the church you mentioned owns a `` beachside pavillion `` has nothing to do with much of anything . If the church truly owns it , they can refuse any ceremony they want . That it has been `` open to all for years `` carries no weight whatsoever . It is church property -- which is essentially the same as a church saying it does n't want gay ceremonies in its sanctuary which churches are free to refuse . Maybe churches are imposed upon in such ways in Canada , but not in the US . Given these matters , I 'm not sure the HRC is being any more honest than the video they are responding to .""",DISAGREE,"""The California doctor entered a profession that promises to first , do no harm and the law requires her to treat a patient in need""","""Actually , no , my understanding is that in most states the law does n't require this at all . Many doctors take what is known as the Hipocratic oath""",,
21077,5533,"""The California doctor entered a profession that promises to & # 8220 ; first , do no harm & # 8221 ; and the law requires her to treat a patient in need & # 8211 ; gay or straight , Christian or Muslim & # 8211 ; regardless of her religious beliefs . The law does not , and can not , dictate her faith & # 8211 ; it can only insist that she follow her oath as a medical professional .""","""Actually , no , my understanding is that in most states the law does n't require this at all . Many doctors take what is known as the Hipocratic oath , but it 's not a legally binding oath . Doctors may be subject to personal lawsuits , but that 's not the same thing . Also , the fact the church you mentioned owns a `` beachside pavillion `` has nothing to do with much of anything . If the church truly owns it , they can refuse any ceremony they want . That it has been `` open to all for years `` carries no weight whatsoever . It is church property -- which is essentially the same as a church saying it does n't want gay ceremonies in its sanctuary which churches are free to refuse . Maybe churches are imposed upon in such ways in Canada , but not in the US . Given these matters , I 'm not sure the HRC is being any more honest than the video they are responding to .""",DISAGREE,"""a profession that promises to first , do no harm""","""the Hipocratic oath , but it 's not a legally binding oath""",,
21104,5539,"""No , think about what you just said . A cancer cell does n't mutate , it attacks healthy cells and causes the destruction of healthy tissue . Kinda like liberals in a healthy society - they are the free radicals of the body politic , huh ... go figure .""","""So ... humans are born with cancer cells already inside them ? I 'm not talking about what cancer does once it 's there , I 'm talking about what it does in the first place .""",AGREE,"""No , think about what you just said . A cancer cell does n't mutate , it attacks healthy cells and causes the destruction of healthy tissue .""","""I 'm not talking about what cancer does once it 's there , I 'm talking about what it does in the first place .""",,
21107,5540,"""`` ( 8 . ) Through this elusive 'black market ' , criminals can acquire any types of weapons they desire , including fully automatic weapons , grenades , and rocket launchers . But despite having access to such powerful weaponry , they & # 8217 ; ll still be deterred from committing a crime by the possibility of confronting a victim who is carrying a concealed .38 snub-nose or sub-compact Glock .""","""I 'm sure they 're concerned about the intended victim with the shotgun or the rifle just as much .""",DISAGREE,"""But despite having access to such powerful weaponry , they ll still be deterred from committing a crime by the possibility of confronting a victim who is carrying a concealed .38 snub-nose or sub-compact Glock .""","""I 'm sure they 're concerned about the intended victim with the shotgun or the rifle just as much .""",,
21108,5540,"""`` ( 8 . ) Through this elusive 'black market ' , criminals can acquire any types of weapons they desire , including fully automatic weapons , grenades , and rocket launchers . But despite having access to such powerful weaponry , they & # 8217 ; ll still be deterred from committing a crime by the possibility of confronting a victim who is carrying a concealed .38 snub-nose or sub-compact Glock .""","""I 'm sure they 're concerned about the intended victim with the shotgun or the rifle just as much .""",DISAGREE,"""Through this elusive 'black market ' , criminals can acquire any types of weapons they desire""","""I 'm sure they 're concerned about the intended victim with the shotgun or the rifle""",,
21112,5541,"""So why does the slippery slope fallacy keep appearing despite a Supreme Court ruling that stands in the way of it becoming a reality , a decline in the number of gun laws , and little or no credible evidence to suggest that gun control advocates really do intend to ban all guns ?""","""Why ? Because people like you are still pushing gun bans regardless of the Heller ruling ! It does n't help your side 's argument when your people continually talk about `` reasonable `` and `` common sense gun regulations `` and their examples include bans on `` assault weapons `` , semi-automatic firearms , `` armor piercing ammunition `` , `` high capacity magazines `` , waiting periods , mental health evaluations , fingerprinting and photographing of gun owners , permits , nationwide registration , etc . DC is a fine example of this . After Heller dissolved their gun laws they basically said `` Fine ! If it ca n't be 100 % impossible to get a gun in DC then we 'll make it 99.9999999 % impossible ! `` They did this through the enactment of so-called `` emergency legislation `` which violates the Heller ruling in every conceivable way . DC even sold out their home rule to California in the sake of having gun control . Do n't you dare forget that DC denied a woman the ability to register her legally owned handgun because it 's color scheme was n't on a list of approved firearms . People like you are continually demanding that magazines capable of holding more than 10 rounds of ammunition be banned , saying that nobody has a legal use for them and they 're used exclusively for killing large groups of people , or turning animals into meat paste . Yet at the same time you claim that `` Saturday Night Specials `` as you call them , are the preferred choice of criminals , and yet not one of these `` Saturday Night Specials `` is capable of holding more than 7 rounds of ammunition in their magazine . People like you continually talk about gun violence , but your answer to the question always involves more laws that only affect the law-abiding . This suggests that you 're either too stupid to live , or you have an absolute distrust of anyone who is n't a government working dog . Which is it that you fit into , stupid or paranoid ? Why does the slippery slope argument prevail ? Because to you anti-gunners nothing is ever good enough ! There are more than enough laws regulating every possible facet of gun ownership and possession and punish anybody for committing a criminal act , and to you that 's just not good enough !""",DISAGREE,"""So why does the slippery slope fallacy keep appearing despite a Supreme Court ruling that stands in the way of it becoming a reality , a decline in the number of gun laws , and little or no credible evidence to suggest that gun control advocates really do intend to ban all guns ?""","""Why ? Because people like you are still pushing gun bans regardless of the Heller ruling ! ``""",,
21123,5544,"""... Can you name one successful government that has ever won a guerrilla war ? Russia fought in Afghanistan for how long before it limped back home ? ....""","""I can . Americans won the Revolutionary War which was primarily a guerilla war .""",DISAGREE,"""government that has ever won a guerrilla war ? Russia fought in Afghanistan for how long before it limped back home ? ....""","""Americans won the Revolutionary War which was primarily a guerilla war .""",,
21129,5553,"""Well it does n't go against the US constitution ... Does it go against the California constitution ? I have n't seen much credible evidence for this .. then again I do n't know much about the California constitution . Do you ? What do you care ? You always admit you find pleasure in seeing conservatives suffer .""","""Because conservatives take pleasure in people suffering .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you ? What do you care ? You always admit you find pleasure in seeing conservatives suffer .""","""Because conservatives take pleasure in people suffering .""",,
21135,5555,"""Evolutionism does not stem from either science , nor the Bible . It is a naturalistic belief system [ or religion ] about the past , i.e . how everything here today - which we call the evidence - came to be .""","""So what does evolution stem from then ? did Darwin find an annoymous manuscript in his study one day entitled `` The Origin of the Species `` that had appeared out of nowhere ? Lets not try to paint up some new faces for paganism""",DISAGREE,"""Evolutionism is a religion""","""did Darwin find an annoymous manuscript in his study one day entitled `` The Origin of the Species `` that had appeared out of nowhere ?""",,
21143,5557,"""The only mind you need to know in this particular thread is your own . The only awareness you need concern yourself with to answer the question `` what does it take to change YOUR mind on abortion ? `` Is Yours . Please treat the question and this thread ( indeed this forum ) with some consideration for those who take the time to start a thread to explore a specific question or topic . Please ?""","""While I do n't appreciate your tone , you are correct in that I misunderstood the premise of this thread . The short answer is that I would have to be convinced that a soul exists and that a soul is injected at any point in the process of conception through labor . An unlikely situation given that I 'm an agnostic . Though I have said that I 'm amendable to banning 3'rd trimester abortions as a compromise . Loosely related to having my mind changed .""",DISAGREE,"""The only mind you need to know in this particular thread is your own .""","""you are correct in that I misunderstood the premise of this thread""",,
21151,5560,"""Originally posted by Broker We control the government ... of course I trust it .""","""GW Bush , just authorized the killing of US citizens overseas in the war against terrorism . There is no wording for preventing the CIA to extend that mission within the borders of the USA . In effect the CIA has license to kill anyone , without a trial , without due process , without oversight , and all in secret . Trusting the government means you trust politicians to tell the truth , always do what in in the public interest , will nerver lie , cheat , or steal . The politicians are the government .""",DISAGREE,"""We control the government .""","""The politicians are the government""",,
21168,5566,"""... and ? Hate to remind you but our government has always been SECULAR ! It was meant to be secular , has always been secular and dang-it-all , SHOULD ALWAYS be secular ! It 's really simple .""","""You couldnt be more wrong . Our goverment was built on the word of God . Its ALL OVER our founding documents . George Washington was quoted to say `` You can not call yourself an American and subvert the word of God. `` Your only argument can go back to the sep.of church and state . Which is new compaired to when our laws were drafted . So not always ... just unfortuanatly now . Which is a BIG mistake by the way and could be the downfall of our country . Try again ...""",DISAGREE,"""Hate to remind you but our government has always been SECULAR""","""You couldnt be more wrong . Our goverment was built on the word of God .""",,
21177,5570,"""Consider an extreme literalist , asked to put the two Genesis accounts side by side and then asked , `` according to the two accounts , on what day was man created ? `` Everyone not a literalist can see that the two accounts conflict when read literally . But I 've known literalists say , `` I see no contradiction `` - and they meant it .""","""Because their axiom is that the bible is infallible , so any problems with reading it are the reader 's fault , whereas yours is that contradiction implies error . What Ken 's saying is that we ca n't draw a distinction between your axioms and those of a bible literalist in terms of which is 'right ' , because axioms are stated not proved : axioms define what is 'right ' . To reiterate : his error is in forgetting that the universe operates according to its own axioms , whatever they may be , and we can judge whether or not our axioms are congruent .""",DISAGREE,"""But I 've known literalists say , `` I see no contradiction `` - and they meant it .""","""whereas yours is that contradiction implies error .""",,
21194,5577,"""If there is a lot of resistance you could make possesion of a gun attempted murder , would make people think very carefully whether they would want to carry them , especailly criminals- comunity service or light sentace for a mugging or long term prison sentance for attempted murder if they are carrying a gun while doing it , even in bank robbery they would likely think twice about the additional years .""","""I think you are right on this one . People would reconsider when they are looking at that kind of penalty . I take the opposite view as you , thoug , I think this would simply encourage them to carry bigger , badder guns . If you are looking at life for robbing a bank , you may as well use a rocket launcher and an M-60 as use a handgun . This would virtually ensure that the police would not get you , as most police departments on the planet are not equipped to deal with heavy machine guns and rocket launchers . If hte penalty is the same though , why not ? People tend to miss the most obvious ( and most dangerous ) way to institute gun control That is to restrict the sale and manufacture of bullets . Without bullets , your gun is nothing but a paper weight . Bullets are also much more difficult to produce than guns . While they can be reloaded , casings are incredibly difficult to make on a small scale . The only way to really do it is to turn them down one at a time on a lathe . Dogs CAN be used to sniff out gunpowder and primers . This is a danger I think people miss when they start bannign certain types of ammunition . Right now , `` cop killer `` ammo is outlawed in the united states . Gun advocates laughed our butts off when they did this , since the `` cop killer `` amunition as they described it does not exist ouside of hollywood ( NO , coating a bullet with teflon will not enable it to pierce body armor , it will lubricate your barrel when you shoot it , though ) . I personally don ; t think this is anything to laugh about . BAnning guns is a stupid and unworkable plan , banning ammo could actually be dangerous .""",AGREE,"""they would likely think twice about the additional years .""","""I take the opposite view as you""",,
21198,5578,"""Yup . Give me an example of a true inaccuracy , instead of working to poke fun . Do you honestly think anyone will take you seriously ( except the evolutionists ) if you do n't provide reasons for your apparent problem with scriptures .""","""What came first , trees or humans ? Genesis 1:12-31 `` And the earth brought forth grass and herb yielding seed after his kind , and the tree yielding fruit , whose seed was in itself , after his kind : And the evening and the morning were the third day ... And God said , Let us make man in our image ... And the evening and the morning were the sixth day `` vs. Genesis 2:5-9 `` And ever plant of the field before it was in the earth , and every herb of the field before it grew , for the Lord God had not caused it to rain upon the earth , and there was not a man to till the ground ... And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground ... And the lord God planeted a garden eastward of Eden and there he put the man who he had formed . And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight , and good for food `` One contracition , among thousands of inaccuracies . Unfortunately for your argument , the bible is a man-written text in support of faith , not reason . It does not need to make sense , it is interepereted , in support of a particular faith , which is hopefully something that gives you comfort , and NOT something that interferes with reason in your daily life . I see from your posts it IS interfering , wheras I see other religious poster who seem to have no problem having faith for their own benefit , but do not attempt to mix the two ( reason and faith ) . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""you do n't provide reasons for your apparent problem""","""One contracition , among thousands of inaccuracies .""",,
21199,5578,"""Yup . Give me an example of a true inaccuracy , instead of working to poke fun . Do you honestly think anyone will take you seriously ( except the evolutionists ) if you do n't provide reasons for your apparent problem with scriptures .""","""What came first , trees or humans ? Genesis 1:12-31 `` And the earth brought forth grass and herb yielding seed after his kind , and the tree yielding fruit , whose seed was in itself , after his kind : And the evening and the morning were the third day ... And God said , Let us make man in our image ... And the evening and the morning were the sixth day `` vs. Genesis 2:5-9 `` And ever plant of the field before it was in the earth , and every herb of the field before it grew , for the Lord God had not caused it to rain upon the earth , and there was not a man to till the ground ... And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground ... And the lord God planeted a garden eastward of Eden and there he put the man who he had formed . And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight , and good for food `` One contracition , among thousands of inaccuracies . Unfortunately for your argument , the bible is a man-written text in support of faith , not reason . It does not need to make sense , it is interepereted , in support of a particular faith , which is hopefully something that gives you comfort , and NOT something that interferes with reason in your daily life . I see from your posts it IS interfering , wheras I see other religious poster who seem to have no problem having faith for their own benefit , but do not attempt to mix the two ( reason and faith ) . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""Give me an example of a true inaccuracy , instead of working to poke fun""","""What came first , trees or humans ? Genesis 1:12-31 `` And the earth brought forth grass and herb yielding seed after his kind , and the tree yielding fruit , whose seed was in itself , after his kind : And the evening and the morning were the third day""",,
21203,5580,"""The validity of the violinist arguement might change if the analogy is to the fetus becoming a person some time into the pregnancy . Then the violinist analogy might be go something like this :""","""How about : A woman wakes up to find herself connected to a body . A body without a brain , which is using her own organs to be alive . Doctors are preparing to transplant a brain from a dying violinist into this new one connected to her and the date is set in the future . Would it be morally correct to disconnect herself and kill this body that has no identity , mind , consciousness or existence in actuality ?""",DISAGREE,"""change if the analogy is to the fetus becoming a person some time into the pregnancy""","""A body without a brain , which is using her own organs to be alive .""",,
21206,5580,"""The validity of the violinist arguement might change if the analogy is to the fetus becoming a person some time into the pregnancy . Then the violinist analogy might be go something like this :""","""How about : A woman wakes up to find herself connected to a body . A body without a brain , which is using her own organs to be alive . Doctors are preparing to transplant a brain from a dying violinist into this new one connected to her and the date is set in the future . Would it be morally correct to disconnect herself and kill this body that has no identity , mind , consciousness or existence in actuality ?""",DISAGREE,"""The validity of the violinist arguement might change if the analogy is to the fetus becoming a person some time into the pregnancy .""","""A woman wakes up to find herself connected to a body .""",,
21212,5581,"""I am motivated to understand God 's creation from what I believe to be a biblical , creationist perspective . Evolution itself is not flawed or without evidence . Please do n't be duped into thinking that somehow evolution itself is a failure . Please do n't idolize your own ability to reason . Faith is enough . If God said it , that should settle it . Maybe that 's not enough for your scoffing professor or your non-Christian friends , but it should be enough for you .""","""So neither is a failure , and neither is ultimately true . In reality , one is true and one is false . Faith is n't enough , when they clash politically . One will lose , and one will win . There is a huge gap in this persons reasoning . Why is it that atheists seem to have more respect for this type of creationist than they do for others - others who do n't regard what atheists in science produce as unquestionable evidence ? It seems to be the same for Kurt Wise . A quick google search turns up these Dawkins remarks about Mr . Wise ;""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution itself is not flawed or without evidence . Please do n't be duped into thinking that somehow evolution itself is a failure .""","""A quick google search turns up these Dawkins remarks about Mr . Wise ;""",,
21227,5582,"""I ’ m going back to what you said about our ability to make machines that can  “ read precise wavelengths ” - I took that as an implication that we can make machines that can see colors that we can ’ t .""","""Let 's clean up our terminology . '' Color `` is just our brains ' way of comprehending wavelength of light , so instead of saying `` color , `` let 's say `` wavelength. `` You took Kronus 's statement as meaning that we can make machines that can see wavelengths that we ca n't see with our eyes . This is true .""",DISAGREE,"""I took that as an implication that we can make machines that can see colors that we can ’ t .""","""You took Kronus 's statement as meaning that we can make machines that can see wavelengths that we ca n't see with our eyes .""",,
21243,5584,"""I standby this claim : gays do lobby for a 'right ' to adopt children - do a simple google news search .""","""And if I google `` christian loch ness monster `` , I 'll get some hits too ... None of the gays here are calling it a `` right `` . You 're trying to make hay out of thin air on the issue of what it is `` called `` . The actual `` right `` involved is the right to EQUAL PROTECTION . A constitutional right which mandates that people are free from unwarranted discrimination . And preventing gays from adopting is clearly unwarranted .""",DISAGREE,"""gays do lobby for a 'right ' to adopt children - do a simple google news search .""","""And if I google `` christian loch ness monster `` , I 'll get some hits too ... None of the gays here are calling it a `` right `` .""",,
21254,5585,"""Kenneth Miller : These are all elements , as I understand them , of the creation science or the creationist or scientific creationism movement . Now the difference between this movement and intelligent design ironically is that intelligent design has withdrawn the testable scientific predictions made by scientific creationists .""","""So Miller says that ID is less worthy , scientifically , than even Young Earth Creationism ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !""",DISAGREE,"""intelligent design ironically is that intelligent design has withdrawn the testable scientific predictions made by scientific creationists .""","""So Miller says that ID is less worthy , scientifically , than even Young Earth Creationism !""",,
21263,5586,"""Should the Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""They can go somewhere ( feel the heat ) but law school would not be my first choice .""",AGREE,"""Should the Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""They can go somewhere""",,
21262,5586,"""Should the Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""They can go somewhere ( feel the heat ) but law school would not be my first choice .""",AGREE,"""Georgia General Assembly go back to law school or what ?""","""They can go somewhere ( feel the heat ) but law school""",,
21266,5587,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't . We are allowed to kill flies all the time but not humans . What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ? Many people for gay marriage will argue that since animals are gay as well that proves gayness is natural . I say what is so outragous about the fact that they could be making a decision too ? I am for gay marriage being legal but that 's not what I 'm talking about . Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image . Then as a added bonus he gave us dominion over other animals , which is a great source of boastfulness for some people ( Consider the pride of a man , his chest swelling as he contemplates his intellectual superiority over a billy goat , for instance ) . This combination allows for the thinking that humans are n't natural in this world and are somehow above it all IMO , which leads to your observation of `` arrogance `` .""",AGREE,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't .""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image .""",,
21267,5587,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't . We are allowed to kill flies all the time but not humans . What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ? Many people for gay marriage will argue that since animals are gay as well that proves gayness is natural . I say what is so outragous about the fact that they could be making a decision too ? I am for gay marriage being legal but that 's not what I 'm talking about . Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image . Then as a added bonus he gave us dominion over other animals , which is a great source of boastfulness for some people ( Consider the pride of a man , his chest swelling as he contemplates his intellectual superiority over a billy goat , for instance ) . This combination allows for the thinking that humans are n't natural in this world and are somehow above it all IMO , which leads to your observation of `` arrogance `` .""",AGREE,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't . We are allowed to kill flies all the time but not humans . What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ? Many people for gay marriage will argue that since animals are gay as well that proves gayness is natural .""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's""",,
21272,5587,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't . We are allowed to kill flies all the time but not humans . What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ? Many people for gay marriage will argue that since animals are gay as well that proves gayness is natural . I say what is so outragous about the fact that they could be making a decision too ? I am for gay marriage being legal but that 's not what I 'm talking about . Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image . Then as a added bonus he gave us dominion over other animals , which is a great source of boastfulness for some people ( Consider the pride of a man , his chest swelling as he contemplates his intellectual superiority over a billy goat , for instance ) . This combination allows for the thinking that humans are n't natural in this world and are somehow above it all IMO , which leads to your observation of `` arrogance `` .""",AGREE,"""What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ?""","""This combination allows for the thinking that humans are n't natural in this world""",,
21273,5587,"""I 'm just wondering why all of the other species in the world , of which most would agree we evolved from are considered `` in nature `` yet we are n't . We are allowed to kill flies all the time but not humans . What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ? Many people for gay marriage will argue that since animals are gay as well that proves gayness is natural . I say what is so outragous about the fact that they could be making a decision too ? I am for gay marriage being legal but that 's not what I 'm talking about . Are we so arrogant that we assume we are the only animals capable of thought or choices ?""","""I think your questions could be considered in a theological context . We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image . Then as a added bonus he gave us dominion over other animals , which is a great source of boastfulness for some people ( Consider the pride of a man , his chest swelling as he contemplates his intellectual superiority over a billy goat , for instance ) . This combination allows for the thinking that humans are n't natural in this world and are somehow above it all IMO , which leads to your observation of `` arrogance `` .""",AGREE,"""What makes us so elite ? Why are we above the term `` animal `` for most people ?""","""We 're taught that we are a `` special creation `` , made in God 's image . Then as a added bonus he gave us dominion over other animals""",,
21277,5588,"""2 . Chemical evolution , explains ( or tries to anyway ) how life could arise from lifeless chemicals naturalsitically .""","""Nope . Chemical evolution has nothing to do with life . It has to do with changes that chemicals undergo when combined under certain conditions . The science of the origin of life is called abiogenesis . Life is a precondition of evolution . If you wish to claim that `` POOF - my god did it `` is the source of that life , then that does n't argue for or against evolution . [ quote ] 3 . Biological evolution , explains how a single-celled creature could evolve into the range of creatures we observe today by naturalistic means ( evidence for this : transitional forms - if I am wrong , then why is the transitional fossil argument still used by many evolutionists ? ) . [ /qote ] While you claim to be seeing the big picture , you actually have a very restricted idea of evolution . Evolution is a change in the frequencies of alleles in a population over time . Unless you can apply that to the big bang , changes in chemicals , and even the origin of life , you are not talking about evolution . You are trying to apply your misunderstanding the the science of biology . You are demanding that you should be able to define what biologists mean by the vocabulary they use .""",DISAGREE,"""Chemical evolution , explains ( or tries to anyway ) how life could arise from lifeless chemicals naturalsitically .""","""Chemical evolution has nothing to do with life . It has to do with changes that chemicals""",,
21287,5589,"""Yet according to PP themselves , they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services . : P PPFA Services ( 2002-2003 ) Surgical abortions : 227,385 Emergency contraception : 633,756 Prenatal care : 15,860 Adoption referrals : 1,963 ( Source : www.plannedparenthood.org )""","""You left out a couple of things , though , which makes your post less reliable . But so nobody gets confused or deceived , here is more accurate statistics : http : //www.plannedparenthood.org/lib ... 2Services.html -- -- Service No . of Procedures Referrals Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Women 2,208,483 Emergency Contraception Clients 633,756 Tubal Sterilization Clients 680 Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Men 60,476 Vasectomy Clients 2,522 Abortion Procedures 227,375 HIV Testing Clients — Women 126,477 HIV Testing Clients — Men 48,991 Prenatal Clients 15,860 Infertility Clients 325 Colposcopy Procedures 31,248 Cryotherapy Procedures 3,913 LOOP/LEEP Procedures 1,781 Midlife Clients 10,575 Pregnancy Tests 1,081,772 Breast Exams/Breast Care 1,062,727 Adoption ( Referred Out ) 1,963 Primary Care Clients 24,483 STI Procedures , Women and Men 1,255,036 Other Services — Women 58,626 Other Services — Men 17,905 Totals 6,873,011 Total Unduplicated Clients 2,744,554 - In 2002 , more than 1,500 affiliate staff and volunteer educators provided nearly 101,000 educational programs to more than 1.4 million people of all ages and in a variety of settings - more than 6,500 training programs were provided by 117 affiliate staff and volunteers to more than 66,000 professionals who work with children , teens , and young adults - In 2002 , plannedparenthood.org logged more than 720,000 visits per month and teenwire®.com received approximately 400,000 visits per month and replied to more than 500 personal inquiries a week . PPFA also produced and distributed more than two million consumer health pamphlets . The Katharine Dexter McCormick Library responded to more than 3,000 research and information requests from researchers , sexual health professionals , and the general public -- -- So your claim about their abortions being more in number than their other services , well that just turned out to not be true .""",DISAGREE,"""FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services .""","""So your claim about their abortions being more in number than their other services ,""",,
21293,5589,"""Yet according to PP themselves , they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services . : P PPFA Services ( 2002-2003 ) Surgical abortions : 227,385 Emergency contraception : 633,756 Prenatal care : 15,860 Adoption referrals : 1,963 ( Source : www.plannedparenthood.org )""","""You left out a couple of things , though , which makes your post less reliable . But so nobody gets confused or deceived , here is more accurate statistics : http : //www.plannedparenthood.org/lib ... 2Services.html -- -- Service No . of Procedures Referrals Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Women 2,208,483 Emergency Contraception Clients 633,756 Tubal Sterilization Clients 680 Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Men 60,476 Vasectomy Clients 2,522 Abortion Procedures 227,375 HIV Testing Clients — Women 126,477 HIV Testing Clients — Men 48,991 Prenatal Clients 15,860 Infertility Clients 325 Colposcopy Procedures 31,248 Cryotherapy Procedures 3,913 LOOP/LEEP Procedures 1,781 Midlife Clients 10,575 Pregnancy Tests 1,081,772 Breast Exams/Breast Care 1,062,727 Adoption ( Referred Out ) 1,963 Primary Care Clients 24,483 STI Procedures , Women and Men 1,255,036 Other Services — Women 58,626 Other Services — Men 17,905 Totals 6,873,011 Total Unduplicated Clients 2,744,554 - In 2002 , more than 1,500 affiliate staff and volunteer educators provided nearly 101,000 educational programs to more than 1.4 million people of all ages and in a variety of settings - more than 6,500 training programs were provided by 117 affiliate staff and volunteers to more than 66,000 professionals who work with children , teens , and young adults - In 2002 , plannedparenthood.org logged more than 720,000 visits per month and teenwire®.com received approximately 400,000 visits per month and replied to more than 500 personal inquiries a week . PPFA also produced and distributed more than two million consumer health pamphlets . The Katharine Dexter McCormick Library responded to more than 3,000 research and information requests from researchers , sexual health professionals , and the general public -- -- So your claim about their abortions being more in number than their other services , well that just turned out to not be true .""",DISAGREE,"""Yet according to PP themselves , they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services""","""You left out a couple of things , though , which makes your post less reliable . But so nobody gets confused or deceived ,""",,
21298,5590,"""Cops deal with tense every day , it is what they are trained to deal with .""","""Oh ? They 're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline , in broad daylight , in the middle of a busy parking lot ? They 're trained to deal with that specific kind of # # # # every single day ?""",DISAGREE,"""Cops deal with tense every day , they are trained to deal""","""Oh ? They 're trained to deal with that specific kind of # # # # every single day ?""",,
21300,5590,"""Cops deal with tense every day , it is what they are trained to deal with .""","""Oh ? They 're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline , in broad daylight , in the middle of a busy parking lot ? They 're trained to deal with that specific kind of # # # # every single day ?""",DISAGREE,"""Cops deal with tense every day , it is what they are trained to deal with .""","""They 're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline ,""",,
21302,5590,"""Cops deal with tense every day , it is what they are trained to deal with .""","""Oh ? They 're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline , in broad daylight , in the middle of a busy parking lot ? They 're trained to deal with that specific kind of # # # # every single day ?""",DISAGREE,"""Cops deal with tense every day , it is what they are trained to deal with""","""They 're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline""",,
21319,5592,"""Franz Halberg of the University of Minnesota is widely considered the `` father of chronobiology `` .""","""I once walked into Halbergs office in an effort to borrow a big XY plotter his group had available . Before I left he overwhelmed me with an extended lecture on chronobiology and his current work as well as a large sheath of reprints and reviews . A very vocal advocate of his field ( and it WAS his field ) and quite a character . Of course I met him in the morning and perhaps he was on a chronobiological peak at the time who can say . Anyway I did get access to the plotter for some chemical work I was doing , and I learned a bit about his work and interests . Productive meeting .""",AGREE,"""Franz Halberg of the University of Minnesota is widely considered the `` father of chronobiology `` .""","""I once walked into Halbergs office in an effort to borrow a big XY plotter his group had available . Before I left he overwhelmed me with an extended lecture on chronobiology""",,
21336,5594,"""They ca n't win a intellectual argument as to the merits of ID or the problems of evolution , therefore they rely upon stacking the deck and the board . How infantile . Still , even after this change Kansas is the laughing stock of the world .""","""Hey now ! Yes , yes , I know it is , but take it easy , I live here ya know .""",AGREE,"""How infantile . Still , even after this change Kansas is the laughing stock of the world .""","""Hey now ! Yes , yes , I know it is , but take it easy , I live here ya know .""",,
21355,5597,"""also your `` science `` is scissors , glue , and tape .""","""Which is why your computer does n't work , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""also your `` science `` is scissors , glue , and tape .""","""Which is why your computer does n't work , right ?""",,
21368,5599,"""Afraid of ? Well guns are a pretty good deterrent from the government trying to take away my rights . And shooting at criminals makes criminals rethink trying to steal my stuff .""","""Finally someone answered the question . Thanks . I thought it might be the government . Does your government attempt to do this ? What do you think about other democratic nations that have citizens that are less armed ? Do you think that they 're in danger - or is it only the American government that 's out to do this ?""",AGREE,"""Afraid of ? Well guns are a pretty good deterrent from the government trying to take away my rights""","""Finally someone answered the question . Thanks .""",,
21395,5604,"""Perhaps those who are more knowledgeable on this can tell me ... The main purpose of a scientific theory is to establish a model that can explain phenomena observed in the natural world . An example is that we find chemical reactions always result in the same amount of mass as when you started . This , along with many other observations led to atomic theory . Now , let 's say that some chemical reaction was performed and it seemed as though there was mass produced by the reaction . Initially , this would be seen as an anomaly or faulty experimentation . If other people observed the same results similar conditions , an alteration of atomic theory , or a new model that is completely different from atomic theory , would have to be produced . However , even if this hypothetical experiment was confirmed , you would not throw out atomic theory as wrong without another theory to replace it . Atomic theory is a very useful model , backed up by massive amounts of observations and provides excellent predictions for the result of reactions that have n't occurred . To replace that , a model that explains all those previous observations plus this new anomaly must be made . It is also helpful if this new model can make predictions on phenomena that have n't yet occurred . An example would be when the periodic table was first produced ; it was able to give a reasonably accurate prediction of chemicals that had not yet been discovered . The question I 'm posing for this thread is , what exactly the theory of creation that will replace evolution is . This theory would have to : 1 . Explain the fossil record as it stands either by showing that creation occurred multiple times or that all species existed at the same time . 2 . Explain genetic modification and propose how responsible it is for alteration in organisms 3 . Present a model of interaction that can make predictions about life forms in the way evolution currently does 4 . Present a new system of classification ( the current Kingdom Phylum Class etc etc . is mostly an evolutionary system ) 5 . Be experimentally verifiable . If there is no extensive evidence supporting the previous claims , they can not form a stable theory . These are 5 criteria that need to be met to overturn evolution , though I 'm sure some would argue my list is too short an far too general . I 've listened to many creation v evolution arguments , but an actual creationism theory has never been presented to me . If you have any links to such information I 'd appreciate the info""","""The thread was quickly shut down by the forum because :""",DISAGREE,"""an actual creationism theory has never been presented to me .""","""The thread was quickly shut down by the forum because :""",,
21399,5604,"""Perhaps those who are more knowledgeable on this can tell me ... The main purpose of a scientific theory is to establish a model that can explain phenomena observed in the natural world . An example is that we find chemical reactions always result in the same amount of mass as when you started . This , along with many other observations led to atomic theory . Now , let 's say that some chemical reaction was performed and it seemed as though there was mass produced by the reaction . Initially , this would be seen as an anomaly or faulty experimentation . If other people observed the same results similar conditions , an alteration of atomic theory , or a new model that is completely different from atomic theory , would have to be produced . However , even if this hypothetical experiment was confirmed , you would not throw out atomic theory as wrong without another theory to replace it . Atomic theory is a very useful model , backed up by massive amounts of observations and provides excellent predictions for the result of reactions that have n't occurred . To replace that , a model that explains all those previous observations plus this new anomaly must be made . It is also helpful if this new model can make predictions on phenomena that have n't yet occurred . An example would be when the periodic table was first produced ; it was able to give a reasonably accurate prediction of chemicals that had not yet been discovered . The question I 'm posing for this thread is , what exactly the theory of creation that will replace evolution is . This theory would have to : 1 . Explain the fossil record as it stands either by showing that creation occurred multiple times or that all species existed at the same time . 2 . Explain genetic modification and propose how responsible it is for alteration in organisms 3 . Present a model of interaction that can make predictions about life forms in the way evolution currently does 4 . Present a new system of classification ( the current Kingdom Phylum Class etc etc . is mostly an evolutionary system ) 5 . Be experimentally verifiable . If there is no extensive evidence supporting the previous claims , they can not form a stable theory . These are 5 criteria that need to be met to overturn evolution , though I 'm sure some would argue my list is too short an far too general . I 've listened to many creation v evolution arguments , but an actual creationism theory has never been presented to me . If you have any links to such information I 'd appreciate the info""","""The thread was quickly shut down by the forum because :""",DISAGREE,"""The main purpose of a scientific theory is to establish a model that can explain phenomena observed in the natural world , if this hypothetical experiment was confirmed , you would not throw out atomic theory as wrong without another theory to replace it .""","""The thread was quickly shut down by the forum""",,
21411,5606,"""Ok , so there 's about 2 per person . But how does natural selection work against these ? Do n't they just build up over time , causing degeneration ?""","""Not if they are so bad that the person does n't live long enough to reproduce . Evolution is a very wasteful process and self-correcting to a certain extent . Plus , not all bad mutations are life threatening .""",DISAGREE,"""Ok , so there 's about 2 per person . But how does natural selection work against these ? Do n't they just build up over time , causing degeneration ?""","""Not if they are so bad that the person does n't live long enough to reproduce .""",,
21423,5617,"""The US Government knows it 's history -- it knows that Mao Tse-Tung , Pol Pot , and even Hitler started out as leader of a small group of lunatics who had easy access to firearms . They used their guns to intimidate people , and thus gain power .""","""Oh really ? What evidence do you have ? These people started out as soldiers in the army .""",DISAGREE,"""The US Government knows it 's history -- it knows that Mao Tse-Tung , Pol Pot , and even Hitler started out as leader of a small group of lunatics who had easy access to firearms .""","""Oh really ? What evidence do you have ? These people started out as soldiers in the army .""",,
21427,5619,"""There is none . Please do not consider it . '' Gun Registry Costs Could Balloon to $ 2 Billion by 2012 `` - http : //www.taxpayer.com/newsreleases ... March24-03.htm Please note , that all they wanted to do was collect names and addresses . Finger printing is names/addressess + expensive lab work . Please note that this could possibly be THE most expense cost over run in the history of the free world . A 2 million dollar project expected to cost 2 Billion .""","""Yes , that does seem to be the primary concern , and it does seem to be that the the cost of the program could be considerable . However , I do ask again that you at least consdier the following , presented by the Center for Gun Policy and Research , part of the Johns Hopkins School of Public Health . ( Link on an above post . ) ... the costs of creating , maintaining , and using a federal system are likely to be substantial . The projected costs of the system must be weighed against the potential to reduce the enormous social and economic costs associated with gun violence . Eighty lives per day—almost 29,000 per year—are lost to gun violence in the United States.16 The social costs of gun violence in the United States have been estimated to be an extraordinary $ 100 billion per year.17 If ballistic fingerprinting laws result in significant reductions in gun violence— by strengthening law enforcement efforts to identify and prosecute violent offenders and deterring illegal gun use by and transfers to criminals and youth—the investment will be well worth it . Also , -In 1994 , the lifetime medical costs associated with firearm injuries and deaths totaled $ 2.3 billion . - Approximately 49 % of the costs of gun-related injuries and deaths is paid by the public . -The hospitalization costs associated with firearm-related injuries in 1997 exceeded $ 800 million . -Thirty percent ( 30 % ) of hospitalized patients were uninsured , and an additional 30 % were enrolled in government health insurance programs . -The direct costs ( e.g. , medical , productivity ) and social costs ( e.g. , quality of life , emotional ) of gun violence are an estimated $ 100 billion per year Like I have , said , it seems that perhaps not enough research has been done , to figure out precisely what the program will cost , and how how effective it would be . But I am suprised that there are those who seem so set against even considering such a program , when it appears that there may be a substantial benefit .""",AGREE,"""`` Please note that this could possibly be THE most expense cost over run in the history of the free world . A 2 million dollar project expected to cost 2 Billion .""","""I am suprised that there are those who seem so set against even considering such a program , when it appears that there may be a substantial benefit .""",,
21435,5622,"""Materialists simply hate the idea that life is an abstract , undefinable , unmeasurable process . Somehow , some way , the framers of materialistic ToE just HAD to make life a materialistic , definable  “ thing ” and cram it into a materialistic , definable theory .""","""And yet SS according to you they say .""",DISAGREE,"""Materialists simply hate the idea that life is an abstract , undefinable""","""And yet SS according to you they say .""",,
21444,5625,"""It 's ashame that everyone keeps looking for the judiciary to do the legislature 's work . When will the people press Congress to take up abortion ? It is the job of Congress after all , to address the issues desired by it 's constituents .""","""I think its actually the states job ... the judiciary does need to overturn Roe v. Wade to get this done though ... which does n't mean it becomes illegal .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's ashame that everyone keeps looking for the judiciary to do the legislature 's work""","""I think its actually the states job""",,
21454,5629,"""Were you hung-over ? I can tear up to the most silly programes when hung-over . Heck , I once cried to a re-run of `` XXXXX eye for a straight guy `` ( or something .. I ` m not sure about name in english ) ... I was mighty hung-over though . Note that I ` m not saying there is anything wrong with displaying emotions unless your drunk or hung-over , I cry even when I ` m not hung-over I ` ve just noticed this weird relationship between movies or tv-shows , crying and hang-overs .""","""No , it 's often an emotional show . They choose their families based on submitted videos , usually from families with one or more physically challenged members , then they build them a house to fit their needs . There was one in particular with a blind autistic boy who loved to swing . The joy on his face when he got the new swing would make any sensitive person weep with joy for him . There was another about a deaf couple whose new home included and lot of strobe light signaling systems . BTW , alcohol is a depressant !""",DISAGREE,"""Were you hung-over ? I can tear up to the most silly programes when hung-over .""","""No , it 's often an emotional show .""",,
21497,5646,"""The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that just 27 % now say the U.S. health care system is poor .""","""And so what ? I do n't think we rank ( yet ) along the lines of the Phillipines , Slovakia or Mexico . Does that mean we are supposed to be grateful as standards keep dropping further down ? Besides , the latest Thomson Reuters Survey shows that 60 % of Americans want a public option included in the healthcare reform legislation . That number , of course , does n't include those who would scrap the legislation entirely as a better approach for achieving single payer . Since the public option in the current legislation appears so weak , at this point .""",DISAGREE,"""now say the U.S. health care system is poor .""","""Survey shows that 60 % of Americans want a public option included in the healthcare reform legislation""",,
21507,5649,"""* A little off subject * If gay marriage is legalized , then so should multiple partners for marriage ?""","""Yes absolutely remember that polygamous marriage is not only biblical but also the biblical norm . People should be free to form any type of family structure they want to .""",AGREE,"""If gay marriage is legalized , then so should multiple partners for marriage""","""polygamous marriage is not only biblical but also the biblical norm""",,
21511,5657,"""The man has no say so whatsoever .""","""That is not necessarily true . I have known girls who have gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion but the fathers of the babies told them they did n't want them to have an abortion so the did n't and now the baby is healthy .""",DISAGREE,"""The man has no say so whatsoever .""","""That is not necessarily true . I have known girls who have gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion but the fathers of the babies told them they did n't want them to have an abortion so the did n't and now the baby is healthy .""",,
21515,5658,"""Lurch : So scientists are the ones who define everything ?""","""No . I 'll type slowly so I do n't get ahead of you this time . Follow with your finger and move your lips if no one is watching . Scientists get to define what they mean by the scientific words that they use . Not you and not your preacher . Do I get to define what you mean by the word `` prayer ? `` Why not ?""",DISAGREE,"""Lurch : So scientists are the ones who define everything ?""","""No . I 'll type slowly so I do n't get ahead of you this time .""",,
21516,5658,"""Lurch : So scientists are the ones who define everything ?""","""No . I 'll type slowly so I do n't get ahead of you this time . Follow with your finger and move your lips if no one is watching . Scientists get to define what they mean by the scientific words that they use . Not you and not your preacher . Do I get to define what you mean by the word `` prayer ? `` Why not ?""",DISAGREE,"""So scientists are the ones who define everything ?""","""No""",,
21533,5662,"""If that is your conception , no wonder you are having problems .""","""I believe I wrote several times that I am not arguing against the rational theory of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""If that is your conception , no wonder you are having problems .""","""I believe I wrote several times that I am not arguing against the rational theory of evolution .""",,
21530,5662,"""If that is your conception , no wonder you are having problems .""","""I believe I wrote several times that I am not arguing against the rational theory of evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""If that is your conception""","""I am not arguing against the rational theory of evolution .""",,
21538,5664,"""Ok , follow along ... There is NO TIME where God is concerned . The concept of time is part of the conditions of this universe ( that he allegedly created ) right along side everything else attributed to the material universe .""","""So on what day did he create time on . Its not mentioned anywhere in the biblical text which seems to simply assume time .""",DISAGREE,"""There is NO TIME where God is concerned""","""mentioned anywhere in the biblical text which seems to simply assume time .""",,
21540,5665,"""I contacted Oolon a short while back about two I 'd like to see added , nasal drainage and -- an even better one , IMO -- the human plantaris muscle . I 've yet to see a creationist explanation of that one ... By the way , chloroplasts have their own DNA , too .""","""I remember that now , but it must have slipped my mind when I was writing the above ...""",AGREE,"""yet to see a creationist explanation of that one""","""I remember that now ,""",,
21561,5672,"""ah yes ... the `` what 's your point `` defense -- even though you just read my point ... which was the blacks got a later start under the darwin plan of evolution -- which prompted the whole `` out of africa `` version evolution so they could avoid their theory being labled as racist . That 's the point ... it was right in front of you . What 's your point for asking such a dumb question ?""","""What do you not understand ? Homo Erectus left Africa as well as stayed . You 're under a idiotic notion that there was a exodus out of Africa . The simplest answer is that some H Es stayed in Africa and were around cohabitating with Sapiens until a 100,000 or so years ago . Do you understand the concept of Occzam 's razor ? http : //www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CA/CA005.html you 're wrong as usual .""",DISAGREE,"""ah yes ... the `` what 's your point `` defense -- even though you just read my point""","""What do you not understand ? Homo Erectus left Africa as well as stayed .""",,
21568,5673,"""I did n't mention that the physical entity needs nothing but nourishment , oxygen , and a safe environment to be able to grow into an adult human being , but that is also a statement of fact that can not be reasonably disputed .""","""Actually , it can . The zygote does n't always develop into an adult human being . In fact , about 60-70 % of all zygotes never implants or gets rejected and end up being flushed down the toilet . And of those who do implant , some turn into blighted ovums or hydatidiform moles . So no , your claim is not as all-encompassing as you want to present it . [ quote ] Conception/fertilization is the time in which this physical entity comes into existence . Prior to that time , this unique physical entity did not exist . [ quote ] Which is also true after ANY cell division of any kind , and as such again is a rather meaningless point .""",DISAGREE,"""I did n't mention that the physical entity needs nothing but nourishment , oxygen , and a safe environment to be able to grow into an adult human being""","""it can . The zygote does n't always develop into an adult human being . In fact , about 60-70 % of all zygotes never implants or gets rejected and end up being flushed down the toilet""",,
21580,5675,"""Says an evolutionary biologist : `` Perhaps it would be easier , and in the long run more productive , to abandon the attempt to force the data . . . into the mold provided by Darwin ``""","""Uncited , unreferenced , altered , and out of context quotes are generally ignored .""",DISAGREE,"""Says an evolutionary biologist : `` Perhaps it would be easier , and in the long run more productive ,""","""Uncited , unreferenced , altered , and out of context quotes are generally ignored .""",,
21583,5676,""" “ Hey Pseudo , try discussing things without adding a strawman everytime. ”""","""You mean a strawman logic fallacy , right ? Yeah that would require me using a statementÂ…not a question . But at least you tried .""",DISAGREE,"""try discussing things without adding a strawman everytime.Â""","""that would require me using a statementÂ…not a question . But at least you tried .""",,
21593,5677,"""Let me also remind you that black people were sentient . Fetuses are not .""","""Ok , what about the black baby in the womb ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""Let me also remind you that black people were sentient . Fetuses are not .""","""Ok , what about the black baby in the womb ?""",,
21597,5679,"""You , in effect , are still accepting this straw man depiction of Darwinism , even after I pointed out that natural selection works on traits that are passed on from one generation to another by individuals - not social classes or racial groups .""","""* * This , of course , is completely wrong , since all we ever hear from morning 'til nite is that , according to the population genetist prevailing norion of evolution , Darwinian evolution does not work on individuals but only on 'populations ' ! ! Social classes and groups divided by skin colour or cultural norms are as much , 'populations ' , as ever there were . Class warfare is every bit a part of Darwinian cut-throat , competitive , war of all against all in order to acquire large stocks of scarce resourses for oneself and 'people like us ' , as any other off-shoot of laissez-faire capitalism or feudal land-grabbing or any other form of of institutionalised , legalised , inequality . To this very day it is used over and over again to block social and economic reform by blaming the victim of property laws set up to preserve elitism by inheritance instead of individual talent and effort , and to deprive the disadvantaged of the benefits that should be theirs by simple membership in the commonwealth . OTH , Lamarckian evolution is a matter of individual organisms surviving , thriving , and reproducing by their own individual efforts , regardless of anything any other organism around them is doing to adapt to the stimuli of a vitally and chronically , randomly altered environment .""",DISAGREE,"""natural selection works on traits that are passed on from one generation to another by individuals""","""completely wrong ,""",,
21603,5681,"""For the record - the level of assistance available ( pregnant or not ) varies from state to state . I was living in New Mexico when I got pregnant and a clever woman working at the welfare office figured out a way to fib to the state to get me the medical care they would have otherwise denied .""","""Thus , 'virtually ' . I am familiar with KY and IN legalistics . But , your point is taken . The slack can also be covered for by the adoptor of the child on a case by case basis .""",AGREE,"""the level of assistance available ( pregnant or not ) varies from state to state New Mexico fib to the state to get me the medical care""","""KY and IN legalistics But , your point is taken .""",,
21607,5682,"""Obviously you have the answer to this question , along with evidence that your answer is correct and factual , ......................""","""Yes , I do .""",DISAGREE,"""Obviously you have the answer along with evidence""","""Yes , I do""",,
21634,5688,"""This is pretty random - but I 'd be willing to be the judge . I 've had a reasonable amount of experience with debates and I feel I could be a judge objectively . Up to you .""","""If you do n't mind , could you just outline your paradigm please ? and also , when you say you have experience , do you mean in `` real `` debating ( HS and College ) or just on this and other sites ?""",DISAGREE,"""I 've had a reasonable amount of experience with debates and I feel I could be a judge objectively .""","""when you say you have experience , do you mean in `` real `` debating ( HS and College ) or just on this and other sites ?""",,
21649,5691,"""Its good to see the senate isnt agreeing . Dangerous legislation that would have forced states to allow dangerous individuals to carry loaded guns in public was defeated in the U.S. Senate . This outrageous legislation was introduced as the Thune Amendment ( No . 1618 ) to the Defense Authorization bill ( S. 1390 ) . It would have allowed the carrying of loaded , concealed firearms outside a person 's home state , even by persons legally barred from possessing guns in the state where the carrying occurs . It would have allowed the weaker concealed carry laws of one state to nullify the restrictions on gun carrying of other states . We applaud those Senators who stood firm for the public 's safety and rejected the gun lobby 's dangerous legislation .""","""`` restrictions `` of an inalienable right is something to be proud of ? Most would call it treason . Are you an advocate of treason ? Of course you are ! Whatever are you going to do when the SCOTUS reaffirms and incorporates the right in every State Constitution as has already been done in every civil rights case and even in Roe V. Wade ? The clock is ticking so rant and propagandize all you want because it will not stop a right clearly stated in the Constitution .""",DISAGREE,"""to see the senate isnt agreeing .""","""The clock is ticking so rant and propagandize all you want because it will not stop a right clearly stated in the Constitution .""",,
21653,5692,"""In the growth factor field , started looking for multiple forms of the same growth factor . They had no data within that hypothesis to do so . They just discarded the Razor and began looking . And their efforts were immediately rewarded . There are 21 interleukins and over 18 fibroblast growth factors .""","""So should people also look for more neucleotides and more planets within Mercury 's orbit ? The list of things that people could look for goes on and on . You have provided two examples of the hypothesis that assumed the fewest number of things being wrong . I can provide many more of it being right . Shall I ?""",DISAGREE,"""In the growth factor field , started looking for multiple forms of the same growth factor .""","""So should people also look for more neucleotides and more planets within Mercury 's orbit ?""",,
21656,5693,"""FINALLY ! ! ! ! ! excellent news . one state at a time !""","""This is bigger then your realize . Prop 8 goes down on equal protection grounds then all state constitutional amendments go down .""",AGREE,"""FINALLY ! ! ! ! ! excellent news . one state at a time !""","""Prop 8 goes down on equal protection grounds then all state constitutional amendments go down .""",,
21661,5694,"""`` So , anyhow , can you tell me , in a nutshell , how looking at the bone structure can tell one how a creature lived it 's life ? It 's specific habitats ? What it ate ? `` Outside of a nutshell , you still did n't answer the question .""","""I did n't answer or you did n't understand ? Actually I did answer . The knee joint I described is from a bipedal hominid - there is no question about it . The skull , even though I gave it very ape-like features , is from a biped . There are many examples of what I described .""",DISAGREE,"""Outside of a nutshell , you still did n't answer the question .""","""I did n't answer or you did n't understand ? Actually I did answer .""",,
21672,5696,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",DISAGREE,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",,
21673,5696,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",DISAGREE,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",,
21674,5696,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",DISAGREE,"""Why did the boy part of $ 850 ?""","""He did not .""",,
21682,5698,"""I probably should have phrased that differently . I what I should have said is that the Constitution only allows laws based on religion if it serves a secular purpose .""","""Yes , it recognizes there will be religion in our country , it allows all to follow which ever religion suits that individual as long as it does not impose upon others who do not follow that religious system . Our constitution allows for dissent , opposition and opinions . It actually requires such dissent in order to come to conclussions which would serve everyone equally . If for some reason there is a practice which excludes certain individuals from the protections of the law , then it needs to be challenged .""",AGREE,"""phrased that based on religion""","""will be religion follow which ever religion""",,
21693,5700,"""Just thought I would ask ( for fun ) , what are your ideas for a same sex wedding ceremony that is not religious and is also not to `` heterosexual `` but is still is a nice ceremony ? In other words , what pieces of a `` traditional `` ceremony would you keep and which would you decide are too `` hetero `` ? I am sure this question seems bizarre but I thougt that would make it more thought provoking , not to mention I am serious . I am going to have a ceremony and was looking for ideas . Figured you guys might have some at the same time debate the issue of what makes a ceremony or union similar and different .""","""First off , Congratulations are in order ( HUGZ ) ! As for a ceremony : If were to ever get married , I think it would be relatively small ( 50 to 100 people max ) and out in a an open meadow ( weather permitting ) , or at least a lush green park or back yard . My partner and I would escort each other up the aisle in matching grey tuxes , to a simple platform with a white garden archway decorated in white flowers , where a justice of the peace presides over a simple ceremony . We would read vows to one another and then be pronounced partners in life , and then just have a fabulous garden party . How doeas that sound ?""",AGREE,"""same sex wedding ceremony that is not religious and is also not to `` heterosexual""","""My partner and I would escort each other up the aisle in matching grey tuxes ,""",,
21705,5703,"""Got any objective sources ?""","""Yes . www.talkorgins.org""",AGREE,"""Got any objective sources ?""","""Yes . www.talkorgins.org""",,
21707,5703,"""Got any objective sources ?""","""Yes . www.talkorgins.org""",AGREE,"""Got any objective sources ?""","""Yes""",,
21708,5704,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well . It 's like banning an action without trying to resolve why it happens in the first place .""","""o_c hit the nail on the head . The intent is to encourage sexual responsibility . The problem is that this is what Planned Parenthood does . These numbskull protesters have their idea of what sexual responsibility is : abstinence outside of marriage . The problem is that this is a pipe dream ; you wo n't stop people from having sex using threats and scare tactics . Instead , the only thing this fearmongering accomplishes is scaring people into being caught with contraceptives by authority figures , so they do n't have any ... but they still have sex . Contrastingly , PP encourages proper and effective contraception and sexual health . Only an XXXXX ca n't see which one goes farther toward preventing the abortions that those XXXXXX are protesting in the first place .""",AGREE,"""fact anti-comprehensive sexual education in""","""hit the nail on the head""",,
21712,5704,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well . It 's like banning an action without trying to resolve why it happens in the first place .""","""o_c hit the nail on the head . The intent is to encourage sexual responsibility . The problem is that this is what Planned Parenthood does . These numbskull protesters have their idea of what sexual responsibility is : abstinence outside of marriage . The problem is that this is a pipe dream ; you wo n't stop people from having sex using threats and scare tactics . Instead , the only thing this fearmongering accomplishes is scaring people into being caught with contraceptives by authority figures , so they do n't have any ... but they still have sex . Contrastingly , PP encourages proper and effective contraception and sexual health . Only an XXXXX ca n't see which one goes farther toward preventing the abortions that those XXXXXX are protesting in the first place .""",AGREE,"""most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well .""","""you wo n't stop people from having sex using threats and scare tactics .""",,
21715,5705,"""What counts is understanding the functions of the various subsystems . A cell is not a dominance heiracrchy .""","""* * Sheer nonsense . What couints is the functioning of the system as a whole . Reducing it to subsytems , and those subsystems to material and mechanical components , is a task subordinate to the principal , primary objective , i.e. , an understanding of the whole , what is it that it is , why it does what it does , and how it does it . Only you anthropocentrically expand your psychological understanding of connotations of words pertaining to human social systems to all other systems , everywhere . But that is , of course , what you guys did when first you applied the term 'selection ' to the behaviour of abstractions and other non-human entities , so no big surprise there , I guess .""",DISAGREE,"""What counts is understanding the functions of the various subsystems . A cell is not a dominance heiracrchy .""","""Sheer nonsense . What couints is the functioning of the system as a""",,
21729,5715,"""So .... you actually think the collapse of the Minnesota bridge is because of gay marriage ? ? ? Unbelievable .""","""Yes , but if true it would certainly make the investigation go easier and the repair of other bridges faster and cheaper . Ban gay marriage - your bridges never collapse - imagine that !""",DISAGREE,"""collapse of the Minnesota bridge gay marriage Unbelievable""","""certainly make the investigation go easier Ban gay marriage""",,
21730,5715,"""So .... you actually think the collapse of the Minnesota bridge is because of gay marriage ? ? ? Unbelievable .""","""Yes , but if true it would certainly make the investigation go easier and the repair of other bridges faster and cheaper . Ban gay marriage - your bridges never collapse - imagine that !""",DISAGREE,"""you actually think the collapse of the Minnesota bridge is because of gay marriage ? ? ?""","""Yes , but if true it would certainly make the investigation go easier and the repair of other bridges faster and cheaper .""",,
21752,5719,"""It does n't matter if it 's 'earth shattering ' or not . By admitting that we hold different standards for the Bible proves my entire point : hypocrisy on the part of skeptics . More proof to prove my point , thanks ! It does not matter what the document contains ! The same procedure should be done for every document . What the writing says is irrelevant to its authenticity ! You wrongly use Occam 's Razor as well . If the document is well preserved , has many copies , has copies relatively close to the original , etc , then the most likely assumption we can make is that the document itself is a valid source . Then and only then , should we examine the contents within and determine if they happened . We can do this through archaeological evidences and from other writings as well that agree with that one . Much of which we in fact do not have for many of Caesar 's expeditions , but yet again , we accept them as fact in our history books . But , it is funny that you should mention Caesar splitting a river . While he did n't do that , he did claim to have created a massive bridge in a very short time period and then destroyed it a few days later . Sounds like a pretty audacious claim from guys without any modern equipment . Should we discount this too because it 'does n't seem practical ' as we do with the bible despite the overwhelming documentation for it ? But here you are admitting that you set different standards 'depending on what the writing claims ' . Thanks again for proving my point I guess .""","""Ah , if you 'd just waited fifteen minutes , you would n't have posted this scathing accusation of unfairness before I explained precisely why your accusation is nothing but fabrication . Oh well , maybe you 'll eat your humble pie without making a fuss ... but I wo n't hold my breath .""",DISAGREE,"""By admitting that we hold different standards for the Bible proves my entire point""","""you would n't have posted this scathing accusation of unfairness before I explained""",,
21758,5729,"""In both cases ; human and bacteria , before the advent of a human product , a particular group of individuals from each larger group would die off .""","""Can you state that in English ? What does that mean ?""",DISAGREE,"""before the advent of a human product , a particular group of individuals from each larger group would die off .""","""Can you state that in English ? What does that mean ?""",,
21763,5732,"""And these concepts are something we invented""","""So before `` we invented `` the laws of logic they did not exist ? Something could be itself and not itself at the same time , before `` we invented `` the law of non-contradiction ?""",DISAGREE,"""concepts are something we invented""","""before we invented the laws of logic they did not exist ?""",,
21778,5743,"""* * Just rece8ived a threat of banning from a 'moderator ' . Why ? Apparently because 1 or more darwinists have complained to him that I refuse to learn about evolution . This , of course , is a complete crock , butr apparently the 'mod ' never bothered to check it out before leaping to do the dawinist 's bidding . The fact is that I know more about 'evolution ' than most of the members , and I never stop searching for web material that will help me to learn more . There is , so far as I am aware , no regulation that says any person posting to the 'evolution ' forum must have , or be in the process of obtaining , a recognised degree in evolutionary biology , genetics , biochemistry , molecular biology , or kindred field of study . The fact that none of the darwinists in this forum is capable of intellibly explaining the basic mechanics behind his/her gene-based , genetic determinist , RMNS hypothesis of evolution 's driving force/cause/mechanism is certainly no fault of mine , or anyone save themselves . That is their problem , and if they can not sell their notion because they can not explain it in empirical terms , that should be their concern and nobody else 's . But for them to try and reverse the situation by p [ retending that their incompetence is my laziness , is not merely ludicrous and ridiculous , it is a scurrilous lie . Which is par for the course and comes with the territory when you are arguing with ideologues , but when you discover that there is someone who , given the responsibility of moderating a forum fairly and impartially , is acting simply as an 'intimidator ' for the darwinists , that 's when you know that the cards are stacked , the dice weighted , sand your voice will soon be smothered . If you hear no more from me , you 'll know why not . If the 'mod ' erases this post before I 'm 'disappeared ' , you wo n't . C'est la vie . ww [ Mike Turner ]""","""I find it difficult to believe that one would be banned from this site simply for not learning about evolution . There must be something else involved here . Either someone is joking with you about having you banned or you 're not telling us the whole story . Now if there 's a move to ban you for incessant challenges of things that have been clearly explained over and over and over , there may be grounds for extraction . I 'd like to read the whole story . Will the real moderator please stand up ?""",DISAGREE,"""I never stop searching for web material that will help me to learn more . If you hear no more from me , you 'll know why not . If the 'mod ' erases this post before I 'm 'disappeared ' ,""","""I find it difficult to believe that one would be banned from this site simply for not learning about evolution . Now if there 's a move to ban you for incessant challenges of things that have been clearly explained""",,
21785,5744,"""`` Even the sight of guns , which people think of as objects that can hurt others , can induce aggressive ideas. `` -Leonard Berkowitz""","""So you see a cop on the streets , you see he 's armed , that 's enough to induce aggression and violence , possibly cause you to hurt others , simply because you saw that somebody else was armed ?""",DISAGREE,"""Even the sight of guns , which people think of as objects that can hurt others , can induce aggressive""","""that 's enough to induce aggression and violence , possibly cause you to hurt others , simply because you saw that somebody else was armed ?""",,
21795,5746,"""He presented no arguement as to why he thought that this was not mere reflex action . As someone with only a minimum of medical knowledge , I personally can not tell the difference between reflex action and a true sense of pain . That is true for most of us and seems to be true for this physician . I am left with having to trust scientists to distinguish between the two and scientists seem to agree that one needs a sufficiently developed cerebral cortex in order to register pain - which does not happen until the start of the third trimester .""","""Well , it seems to me that if you have a reflex it means you have an at least partially developed and functional nervous system which would tell me that you can feel pain .""",DISAGREE,"""He presented no arguement as to why he thought that this was not mere reflex action .""","""Well , it seems to me that if you have a reflex it means you have an at least partially developed""",,
21797,5747,"""Not true- there is more than one species of bacteria . In fact , there is more than one genus of bacteria , and so on . Just so you know , there is plenty of competition between bacteria within one species and even more above the species level .""","""yea , above the species level at least sounds plausible .""",AGREE,"""Not true- there is more than one species of bacteria . In fact , there is more than one genus of bacteria , and so on .""","""above the species level at least sounds plausible .""",,
21798,5747,"""Not true- there is more than one species of bacteria . In fact , there is more than one genus of bacteria , and so on . Just so you know , there is plenty of competition between bacteria within one species and even more above the species level .""","""yea , above the species level at least sounds plausible .""",AGREE,"""there is plenty of competition between bacteria within one species and even more above the species level .""","""above the species level at least sounds plausible .""",,
21811,5752,"""We would expect , for example , to find trilobites alongside modern day rays , rabbits with velociraptors , etc .""","""You mean like this ? Pleistocene or Ice Age mammals , such as mammoths and musk oxen , had been found in Lake Bonneville deposits along the Wasatch Front as early as the 1870s . The Salt Lake Tribune noted a musk ox skull found near downtown Salt Lake City in 1871 . Pleistocene fossils , including invertebrates , fish , and birds , as well as the large extinct mammals , continue to be found in Pleistocene deposits throughout Utah.Utah History Encyclopedia And evidence similar to this has been found all over the world . But you ignore it or interpret it to fit your agenda . This Why ? And who cares what YOU would expect to find when we are speaking about what happened in reality ? It 's all a matter of interpreting the same available info and we interpret it very differently . But only in your mind does that make your interpretation correct and ours wrong . In the Beginning : Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood - Testing the Theories Can you explain these aberrations in the fossil record ? In the Beginning : Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood - 25. # # Out-of-Place Fossils""",DISAGREE,"""trilobites alongside modern day rays , rabbits with velociraptors""","""Pleistocene or Ice Age mammals , such as mammoths and musk""",,
21814,5754,"""No , only LIVING things can be intelligent , is n't it obvious that when plants communicate , that demonstrates intelligence , but when machines communicate , it does n't demonstrate intelligence ! ! ! Any 5 year old knows the difference between alive and a machine ! ! !""","""So how do you propose that communication in one instance over a network differs from communication over a network in the other . If for example I tell you that there exists a network and that communication takes place over it can you tell me if that indicates intelligence or not ? And how do you propose to PROVE that only living things CAN be intelligent ? What evidence would suffice ? Clearly according to you communication over a network is NOT sufficient proof ! What you have in fact done is to claim that all living things are intelligent and that communication is not evidence of that intelligence . So if communication is not adequate to demonstrate intelligence what criterion do you use ? Frankly I think you have no criterion in mind other than a system being what you call alive - itself a vague and difficult to pin down category ! Are viruses intelligent or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""only LIVING things can be intelligent ,""","""And how do you propose to PROVE that only living things CAN be intelligent ?""",,
21818,5755,"""I do n't suppose any evolutionist have realized that all the evidence for evolution is also evidence for ID .""","""No it 's not . Perhaps because you do n't understand much about evolutionary theory you have confused it with ID . ID is not science and has no evidence to support it .""",DISAGREE,"""evolutionist have realized evolution is also evidence for ID""","""you do n't understand evolutionary theory no evidence to support it""",,
21819,5756,"""Professional scientists ? Science educators ?""","""So who 's the head honcho ? It 's not like all these professional scientists all see eye to eye . There are even scientists that hold to theistic evolution .""",DISAGREE,"""Professional scientists ? Science educators ?""","""It 's not like all these professional scientists all see eye to eye . There are even scientists that hold to theistic evolution .""",,
21824,5757,"""There are not enough stone-age skeletons ...""","""Because Humphreys went out looking ? How many should we allegedly find ?""",DISAGREE,"""not enough stone-age skeletons""","""went out looking ? How many should we allegedly find ?""",,
21855,5773,"""That 's your business ; I do n't care what you do . I do n't think it 's moral behavior , but I 'm not going to condemn you for it and I sure do n't think it should be illegal . It 's your business .""","""So you do n't think our behavior is `` moral `` in that respect . Do you consider your own behavior `` moral `` and therefore superior to ours ?""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think it 's moral behavior""","""So you do n't think our behavior is `` moral `` in that respect .""",,
21863,5775,"""Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right is a slave trader ... like a right to life ... ? ? ?""","""That logic can be applied to weeds or trees . Anything that is non-sentient , or non-mental existant . Should we make gardening illegal too ? The thing is , you have no base for calling it a human being or giving it the same rights as us . Human beings are , by nature , sentient . That is what makes us different from wildlife . When that only difference is separated , then it should not share the same rights as you or me . An accurate analogy would be someone who 's brain was ripped out and was kept on life support . It would only be a body , no person inside of it . Same goes with an embryo . It simply can not override the rights of its host .""",DISAGREE,"""Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right is a slave trader ...""","""That logic can be applied to weeds or trees .""",,
21871,5777,"""Huh ?""","""All of these nations have had one gun ban after another , after enacting registration schemes . Do you have the nerve to deny this fact ?""",DISAGREE,"""Huh ?""","""All of these nations have had one gun ban after another , after enacting registration schemes .""",,
21875,5778,"""Since when does the word `` access `` get translated into `` must perform `` ? Women should have access to all medical diagnostic tests that can help them throughout their pregnancy . They should have access to sonagrams , CAT Scans , EKGs , EEGs , MRIs , blood tests , X-rays , etc. , None of these are forced procedures or tests now . While I have n't read the actual text of the legislation , I would find it unfathomable that any legislator would force a woman into a medical procedure .""","""Required , another word for forced , is in the text . They have to undergo the procedure but are not required to view the results . Required medical procedures should make anyone with even a breath of freedom left become ill . If you have any familiarity with typical legislative processes you 're aware the formula is getting the first half passed and required viewing can be tacked onto a peanut museum funding bill . http : //www.grtl.org/printerfriendly.asp ? aaid=78 ~Full Disclosure Ultrasound Act – Representative James Mills introduced HB 888 Full Disclosure Ultrasound Act to require an ultrasound or sonogram examination of each unborn child before an abortion is performed or a referral for an abortion is made . All facilities where abortions are performed and all facilities of physicians who refer for abortions will be required to have functional ultrasound or sonogram equipment on site or have access to the equipment through other medical facilities . As part of the informed consent to abortion , a pregnant female desiring an abortion will be offered an opportunity to view the ultrasound or sonogram image of her unborn child . This will be a top priority for GRTL in 2006.~ I lived in Georgia and it 's not beyond my comprehension legislators would propose legislation requiring medical procedures not applicable to women without the intent of abortion . It has n't been that many years since they considered skin color other than white as a lesser race and used state legislation to segregate all non-whites . It was difficult to believe I was in the US while experiencing Georgia 's segregation policies in the 1960s .""",DISAGREE,"""Women should have access to all medical diagnostic tests that can help them throughout their pregnancy . They should have access to sonagrams , CAT Scans , EKGs , EEGs , MRIs , blood tests , X-rays ,""","""a pregnant female desiring an abortion will be offered an opportunity to view the ultrasound or sonogram image of her unborn child .""",,
21893,5781,"""In the third paragraph , What leads you to believe that it would see us as an extension of the planet since we are indeed distinct and separate from the planet ( after all we are able to orbit the planet and even leave it all together ) ?""","""This is a toughie . Let me think about it and I 'll get back to you ...""",DISAGREE,"""What leads you to believe that it would see us as an extension of the planet since we are indeed distinct and separate from the planet""","""Let me think about it and I 'll get back to you""",,
21900,5783,"""Sounds right to me . What 's the problem ?""","""So you do n't have a problem with turning real graduate degrees into degrees on par with diploma mills ?""",DISAGREE,"""What 's the problem""","""real graduate degrees into degrees on par with diploma mills""",,
21904,5783,"""Sounds right to me . What 's the problem ?""","""So you do n't have a problem with turning real graduate degrees into degrees on par with diploma mills ?""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds right to me""","""So you do n't have a problem with turning real graduate degrees into degrees on par with diploma mills ?""",,
21916,5786,"""New York 's tough gun-control laws were central to its success in reducing crime .""","""Really ?""",DISAGREE,"""New York 's tough gun-control laws were central to its success in reducing crime""","""Really ?""",,
21922,5787,"""So ? My source is more recent . Would n't it make more sense to use a more recent source to determine whose side he is currently on ?""","""Then find him voicing his support for DC 's unconstitutional gun control laws , and his claim that they should 've been allowed to remain on the books .""",DISAGREE,"""My source is more recent . Would n't it make more sense""","""Then find him voicing his support for DC 's unconstitutional gun""",,
21923,5787,"""So ? My source is more recent . Would n't it make more sense to use a more recent source to determine whose side he is currently on ?""","""Then find him voicing his support for DC 's unconstitutional gun control laws , and his claim that they should 've been allowed to remain on the books .""",DISAGREE,"""So ? My source is more recent . Would n't it make more sense to use a more recent source""","""Then find him voicing his support""",,
21935,5790,"""Yes , they do show a faithful devotion to the ultimate reality that there are no gods .""","""That 's not a faithful devotion , it 's a logical conclusion .""",DISAGREE,"""show a faithful devotion ultimate reality that there are no gods .""","""faithful devotion logical conclusion .""",,
21942,5790,"""Yes , they do show a faithful devotion to the ultimate reality that there are no gods .""","""That 's not a faithful devotion , it 's a logical conclusion .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , they do show a faithful devotion to the ultimate reality that there are no gods .""","""That 's not a faithful devotion , it 's a logical conclusion .""",,
21956,5792,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason Yeah right , like one man 's opinion is a death blow to socialism .""","""Yes I exaggerate . As long a Americans who love freedom and have the means to protect it , you will never see the same oppressive taxation in Europe happen here . If Bellesiles is the poster boy for academia and socialism , then I rather not have utopia run by men like him .""",DISAGREE,"""voiceofreason death blow to socialism .""","""exaggerate If Bellesiles is the poster boy for academia and socialism""",,
21958,5792,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason Yeah right , like one man 's opinion is a death blow to socialism .""","""Yes I exaggerate . As long a Americans who love freedom and have the means to protect it , you will never see the same oppressive taxation in Europe happen here . If Bellesiles is the poster boy for academia and socialism , then I rather not have utopia run by men like him .""",DISAGREE,"""Yeah right , like one man 's opinion is a death blow to socialism .""","""Yes I exaggerate . As long a Americans who love freedom and have the means to protect it , you will never see the same oppressive taxation in Europe happen here .""",,
21960,5792,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason Yeah right , like one man 's opinion is a death blow to socialism .""","""Yes I exaggerate . As long a Americans who love freedom and have the means to protect it , you will never see the same oppressive taxation in Europe happen here . If Bellesiles is the poster boy for academia and socialism , then I rather not have utopia run by men like him .""",DISAGREE,"""Yeah right , like one man 's opinion is a death blow to socialism .""","""Yes I exaggerate . As long a Americans who love freedom and have the means to protect it""",,
21972,5793,"""1 . Anti-something movements by themselves will fail .""","""So scientists are doing science , lots of it . Check the August 2007 issue of Evolution , for example . On the other hand IDists produce nothing , do no lab work , but just harp and harangue against evolution . As the article says , `` Its passionate diatribes virtually advertise the program they attack . People must fight for something that they want to achieve , not simply reject an evil , however bad it may be. ” Shoe fits you lot , WW , not us .""",DISAGREE,"""movements themselves fail""","""On the other hand IDists produce nothing , do no lab work `` People must fight for something that they want to achieve ,""",,
22010,5797,"""im not saying the religions are bad . BUT DONT DONT GO SEE HARRY POTTER BECOUSE A BOOK SAID IT IS EVIL . people like that are just close minded jurks""","""Actually I have read the entire Bible and it never mentioned Harry Potter - even once . People who do n't see Harry Potter are SILLY ! Especially since this latest one is awesome . Very funny . Harry Potter is about witchcraft like Star Wars is about NASA . This is the same silly as those who fretted over the DaVinci Code . It 's FICTION . By the way you spelled `` jerks `` wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""BUT DONT DONT GO SEE HARRY POTTER BECOUSE A BOOK SAID IT IS EVIL .""","""It 's FICTION . By the way you spelled `` jerks `` wrong .""",,
22014,5798,"""I would if such statistics were kept and available for analysis .""","""And why do you suppose they are n't ? Could it be that such an occurrence is exceptionally rare ?""",DISAGREE,"""I would if such statistics were kept and available for analysis .""","""And why do you suppose they are n't ? Could it be that such an occurrence is exceptionally rare ?""",,
22019,5798,"""I would if such statistics were kept and available for analysis .""","""And why do you suppose they are n't ? Could it be that such an occurrence is exceptionally rare ?""",DISAGREE,"""I would if such statistics were kept and available for analysis .""","""Could it be that such an occurrence is exceptionally rare ?""",,
22036,5800,"""You show a gap to be inexplicable by trying to explain it from an atheist worldview ? That ’ s an objective , fair way to do it ? So completely unfair and unbiased that ID ’ s different methods of searching add NOTHING ? ?""","""You show a gap to be inexplicable via natural forces by trying to explain it via natural forces . You ca n't do it by hypothesising supernatural forces , because that 's just meaningless unfalsifiable speculation . ID does n't have a different method of searching - all it does is give up quicker . That 's how it 'detected design ' in the eye ; that 's how it 'detected design ' in blood clotting , the immune system - it just gave up looking for natural explanations and assumed design filled the gap .""",DISAGREE,"""You show a gap to be inexplicable by trying to explain it from an atheist worldview ?""","""You ca n't do it by hypothesising supernatural forces , because that 's just meaningless unfalsifiable speculation .""",,
22032,5800,"""You show a gap to be inexplicable by trying to explain it from an atheist worldview ? That ’ s an objective , fair way to do it ? So completely unfair and unbiased that ID ’ s different methods of searching add NOTHING ? ?""","""You show a gap to be inexplicable via natural forces by trying to explain it via natural forces . You ca n't do it by hypothesising supernatural forces , because that 's just meaningless unfalsifiable speculation . ID does n't have a different method of searching - all it does is give up quicker . That 's how it 'detected design ' in the eye ; that 's how it 'detected design ' in blood clotting , the immune system - it just gave up looking for natural explanations and assumed design filled the gap .""",DISAGREE,"""inexplicable by trying to explain it from an atheist worldview""","""inexplicable via natural forces by trying to explain""",,
22046,5801,"""Just because he 's a hypocrite does n't make his movie wrong or his message false . Bush is correct about federal spending getting out of hand even though he was much of the cause . There was a hard core religious Christian who warned about the dangers of gambling even though he had a huge underground habit himself . While a hypocrite may be contemptable , that does not make their message wrong .""","""No but his complete dependence on a media machine certainly takes away from the validity of his message . The models for climate change that Gore recites are strictly weather and do not look at global climate patterns and do not look at climate changes within history . The changes that are occuring now are within the limits of changes that have happened elsewhere in history . His information is just a `` part `` of the story . That is why he is incorrect .""",DISAGREE,"""Just because he 's a hypocrite does n't make his movie wrong or his message false .""","""No but his complete dependence on a media machine certainly takes away from the validity of his message""",,
22075,5812,"""Fellow Christians in this 'Creation v. Evolution ' forum ... Who knows -- rise to the challenge and perhaps you can bring a straying `` evil-lutionist `` back into the fold ... Bradley""","""You ask to debate a lot of issues at once . Do you believe in a literal Adam ? Do you not think that the idea is completely connected to Jesus ' ministry ? If it were n't for sin - Jesus would need not have come .""",DISAGREE,"""Who knows -- rise to the challenge and perhaps you can bring a straying `` evil-lutionist `` back into the fold ... Bradley""","""Do you believe in a literal Adam ? Do you not think that the idea is completely connected to Jesus ' ministry ?""",,
22079,5812,"""Fellow Christians in this 'Creation v. Evolution ' forum ... Who knows -- rise to the challenge and perhaps you can bring a straying `` evil-lutionist `` back into the fold ... Bradley""","""You ask to debate a lot of issues at once . Do you believe in a literal Adam ? Do you not think that the idea is completely connected to Jesus ' ministry ? If it were n't for sin - Jesus would need not have come .""",DISAGREE,"""Who knows -- rise to the challenge and perhaps you can bring a straying `` evil-lutionist `` back into the fold""","""You ask to debate a lot of issues at once Do you believe in a literal Adam ? Do you not think that the idea is completely connected to Jesus ' ministry ?""",,
22085,5813,"""by this stupidity a KKK mob with guns is a militia !""","""The KKK use of firearms is n't a legal and lawful use , as dictated in the Heller ruling . Next argument please !""",DISAGREE,"""by this stupidity a KKK mob""","""The KKK use of firearms is n't a legal and lawful use""",,
22092,5815,"""I 'm about as far right as you can get politically . So far right that I do n't believe that the government has any grounds for regulating substances that we want to ingest , smoke , snort or inject . Where I differ from those on the Left is I do n't feel compelled to help the druggies who get themselves in over their heads . To me , if you jump in a lake with weights around your ankles , do n't expect me to jump in after you . Want to spend your life stoned , fine . Just do n't expect me to pay your medical bills when you get sick . '' Die * * * * er ! `` As Scrooge once quipped `` better to die and decrease the surplus population. ``""","""Idealy this MIGHT not be a bad solution ... however , the risks to everyone else and the pain it would cause the rest of society would probably be greater .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't feel compelled to help the druggies who get themselves in over their heads Want to spend your life stoned , fine . Just do n't expect me to pay your medical bills when you get '' ``""","""however , the risks to everyone else and the pain it would cause the rest of society would probably be""",,
22098,5816,"""Excerpts from a recent report : `` It has been claimed that in the United States , 'guns are used for defensive purposes about five times as often as they are used for crimes'.1,2 This claim is made even though the criminal chooses both the time and place of the crime , most households don ’ t have guns , and very few of the individuals who own guns are carrying at any time ... `` After controlling for other aspects of the surveys , these surveys indicate that criminal gun use is far more common that self-defense gun use . For example , in May 2000 , a Washington Post national random-digit dial survey asked 'Not counting military service , have you ever been threatened with a gun or shot at ? ' Twenty-three percent ( 23 % ) said yes . In that same month ( May 2000 ) , a Gallup national random-digit dial survey asked 'Not including military combat , have you ever used a gun to defend yourself either by firing it or threatening to fire it ? ' Seven percent ( 7 % ) of respondents said yes .... `` So how can anyone claim that there are more self-defense gun uses than criminal gun uses ? They do so by comparing different types of surveys . They compare the results of Box B with Box C ! However , it is completely inappropriate to compare estimates which come from two radically different survey methodologies ..... `` Second , there is no accepted understanding of what constitutes a criminal or a self-defense gun use . For example , criminals often believe that their gun use during a crime was in self-defense ... `` The opportunity for a law-abiding gun owner to use a gun in a socially desirable manner -- against a criminal during the commission of a crime -- will occur , for the average gun owner , perhaps once in a lifetime . It is a rare event . Other than self-defense , the use of a gun against another human is socially undesirable . Regular citizens with guns , who are sometimes tired , angry , drunk , or afraid , and who are not trained in dispute resolution , have lots of opportunities for inappropriate gun uses . People engage in innumerable annoying and somewhat hostile interactions with each other in the course of a lifetime . It should not be surprising that inappropriate , socially undesirable 'self-defense ' gun uses by people who believe they are law-abiding citizens outnumber the appropriate and socially beneficial use of guns.6 `` http : //www.hsph.harvard.edu/research ... pring_2009.pdf What do we learn ? The claim that guns are used much more often in self defense is based on making inappropriate comparisons . If the same survey methodology is used to measure both criminal and defensive gun use , many more people will report that they have been a victim of a gun crime than having used a gun in self defense . Most of the `` defensive gun uses `` reported in studies that ask every respondent directly about gun use are actually criminal uses of guns .""","""I learned a few things from the post . The author claimed `` most households don ’ t have guns `` . According to 1997 stats , 25 % of ALL US adults owned firearms . If you assume that there are typically two adults per household , that means 50 % of households have guns , so the statement is false . On a personal note , someone tried to break into my brother 's apartment shortly after he was married . He quickly opened the door , yelled `` freeze MFer or I 'll blow your head off ! `` while holding a short-barrelled shotgun and watched the perp # # # # himself . being half asleep and in possession of a slightly modified shotgun , my brother did n't call the cops to report this self-defensive use of a firearm .""",DISAGREE,"""most households ’ t have guns""","""According to 1997 stats , 25 % of ALL US adults owned firearms . If you assume that there are typically two adults per household , that means 50 % of households have guns , so the statement is false .""",,
22099,5816,"""Excerpts from a recent report : `` It has been claimed that in the United States , 'guns are used for defensive purposes about five times as often as they are used for crimes'.1,2 This claim is made even though the criminal chooses both the time and place of the crime , most households don ’ t have guns , and very few of the individuals who own guns are carrying at any time ... `` After controlling for other aspects of the surveys , these surveys indicate that criminal gun use is far more common that self-defense gun use . For example , in May 2000 , a Washington Post national random-digit dial survey asked 'Not counting military service , have you ever been threatened with a gun or shot at ? ' Twenty-three percent ( 23 % ) said yes . In that same month ( May 2000 ) , a Gallup national random-digit dial survey asked 'Not including military combat , have you ever used a gun to defend yourself either by firing it or threatening to fire it ? ' Seven percent ( 7 % ) of respondents said yes .... `` So how can anyone claim that there are more self-defense gun uses than criminal gun uses ? They do so by comparing different types of surveys . They compare the results of Box B with Box C ! However , it is completely inappropriate to compare estimates which come from two radically different survey methodologies ..... `` Second , there is no accepted understanding of what constitutes a criminal or a self-defense gun use . For example , criminals often believe that their gun use during a crime was in self-defense ... `` The opportunity for a law-abiding gun owner to use a gun in a socially desirable manner -- against a criminal during the commission of a crime -- will occur , for the average gun owner , perhaps once in a lifetime . It is a rare event . Other than self-defense , the use of a gun against another human is socially undesirable . Regular citizens with guns , who are sometimes tired , angry , drunk , or afraid , and who are not trained in dispute resolution , have lots of opportunities for inappropriate gun uses . People engage in innumerable annoying and somewhat hostile interactions with each other in the course of a lifetime . It should not be surprising that inappropriate , socially undesirable 'self-defense ' gun uses by people who believe they are law-abiding citizens outnumber the appropriate and socially beneficial use of guns.6 `` http : //www.hsph.harvard.edu/research ... pring_2009.pdf What do we learn ? The claim that guns are used much more often in self defense is based on making inappropriate comparisons . If the same survey methodology is used to measure both criminal and defensive gun use , many more people will report that they have been a victim of a gun crime than having used a gun in self defense . Most of the `` defensive gun uses `` reported in studies that ask every respondent directly about gun use are actually criminal uses of guns .""","""I learned a few things from the post . The author claimed `` most households don ’ t have guns `` . According to 1997 stats , 25 % of ALL US adults owned firearms . If you assume that there are typically two adults per household , that means 50 % of households have guns , so the statement is false . On a personal note , someone tried to break into my brother 's apartment shortly after he was married . He quickly opened the door , yelled `` freeze MFer or I 'll blow your head off ! `` while holding a short-barrelled shotgun and watched the perp # # # # himself . being half asleep and in possession of a slightly modified shotgun , my brother did n't call the cops to report this self-defensive use of a firearm .""",DISAGREE,"""indicate that criminal gun use is far more common that self-defense gun use .""","""25 % of ALL US adults owned firearms . 50 % of households have guns so the statement is false""",,
22111,5818,"""Sure you do n't want to visit RI in Sept .""","""Honey ! ! ! What do you think I was hinting at ? ? ? ? Hmmm ... wonder if I could get my partner to actually step onto a plane ... Hey , has TF Green changed all that much in the past fifteen years ? At least I 've got some friends I could stay with ! ! ! ( and no ... I do n't mean you ... remember I used to live in RI )""",AGREE,"""visit RI""","""live in RI""",,
22113,5818,"""Sure you do n't want to visit RI in Sept .""","""Honey ! ! ! What do you think I was hinting at ? ? ? ? Hmmm ... wonder if I could get my partner to actually step onto a plane ... Hey , has TF Green changed all that much in the past fifteen years ? At least I 've got some friends I could stay with ! ! ! ( and no ... I do n't mean you ... remember I used to live in RI )""",AGREE,"""Sure you do n't want to visit RI in Sept .""","""What do you think I was hinting at ? ? ? ?""",,
22130,5823,"""Bet the crime rate skyrockets , but I wonder what happens if you ( officers ) just put a bullet in them , you know for resisting arrest ? Who does that pinhead mayor remind you of ?""","""I was about to take a sip of coffee when I read that ! Would have lost the keyboard and monitor ! ! !""",DISAGREE,"""Bet the crime rate skyrockets , but I wonder what happens if you ( officers ) just put a bullet in them , you know for resisting arrest ?""","""I was about to take a sip of coffee when I read that ! Would have lost the keyboard and monitor ! ! !""",,
22133,5823,"""Bet the crime rate skyrockets , but I wonder what happens if you ( officers ) just put a bullet in them , you know for resisting arrest ? Who does that pinhead mayor remind you of ?""","""I was about to take a sip of coffee when I read that ! Would have lost the keyboard and monitor ! ! !""",DISAGREE,"""crime rate skyrockets , bullet in them ,""","""Would have lost the keyboard and monitor ! ! !""",,
22165,5836,"""are you suggesting that the chemical ingredients that make nylon never existed before man combined them to create nylon ? The bacteria works on a microscopic level and could n't care less what product we have made from those chemicals which it thrives on . So your example is both fallacious and moot .""","""So , when you talk about the chemical ingredients are you talking about compounds or elements ? If you are talking about compounds Peeling 's point is valid . If you are talking about elements you answer your own question .""",DISAGREE,"""suggesting chemical ingredients nylon never existed before man""","""If you are talking about compounds Peeling 's point is valid""",,
22171,5837,"""The comeback is that science just has n't found the proof yet .""","""Well , yeah , if science has n't provided an explanation for a phenomenon , then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals .""",AGREE,"""The comeback is that science just has n't found the proof yet .""","""if science has n't provided an explanation for a phenomenon , then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals .""",,
22179,5838,"""An interesting analysis of that article you keep quoting from the World Net Daily . http : //www.saneguns.org/commentary/comment002.html""","""More propaganda ! Analysys my thoin ! its propagandist opinionary `` The news does reach the press -- including WorldNetDaily , which gives it a particularly ... ah ..... WorldnetDaily spin . ( WND , out of California , still believes Ken Starr is part of the Vince Foster cover-up ) . `` ^^^Ad Hominen ? They hold a certain opinion on something completley unrelated to prove that WND does not know what its talking about .... Nothing to back this claim up , nor any attempt to show contradicting data . They mysteriously have data from a website from what I could tell was last updated in 1996 that does not even ASK THE QUESTION ABOUT USE OF GUNS IN CRIME ! Pitiful .""",DISAGREE,"""interesting analysis""","""More propaganda !""",,
22196,5848,"""And folks that refuse to see the legitimate ones put us all at risk . Touche .""","""The frequency of legitimate ones does n't warrant my walking around armed all the time IMO . How does my being unarmed put you at risk ? Think I should be prepared to shoot someone for you in case of emergency ? Touchee yourself .""",DISAGREE,"""And folks that refuse to see the legitimate ones put us all at risk""","""The frequency of legitimate ones does n't warrant my walking around armed all the time IMO .""",,
22201,5849,"""You show a gap to be inexplicable via natural forces by trying to explain it via natural forces . You ca n't do it by hypothesising supernatural forces , because that 's just meaningless unfalsifiable speculation . ID does n't have a different method of searching - all it does is give up quicker . That 's how it 'detected design ' in the eye ; that 's how it 'detected design ' in blood clotting , the immune system - it just gave up looking for natural explanations and assumed design filled the gap .""","""Evolution is all about godlessness , yet it ’ s not atheistic . I see . ID gives up looking for natural explanations , evolution gives up looking for supernatural ones . ID hypothesizes supernatural , evolution hypothesizes natural origins .""",DISAGREE,"""You ca n't do it by hypothesising supernatural forces , because that 's just meaningless unfalsifiable speculation .""","""ID gives up looking for natural explanations , evolution gives up looking for supernatural ones .""",,
22205,5850,"""Mmmmm , not necessarily . Many of the arguments of against gods ( those with specific properties , not just a general diety ) deal with incompatible traits , like a square circle has . One does not have to search the universe to know square circles do not exist .""","""How do you know square circles do not exist ? Modern man could 've named a square circle something different than it is . Ancient man could 've called an object a square circle . For a question like that , you would have to search the universe to be 100 % sure square circles do not exist .""",DISAGREE,"""One does not have to search the universe to know square circles do not exist .""","""For a question like that , you would have to search the universe to be 100 % sure square circles do not exist .""",,
22213,5851,"""Why do n't YOU take a class on creation ? Or are YOU afraid that your `` faith `` is too fragile to stand a class on creation ?""","""Oh wait , I have ... I was a creationist for 18 years of my life . 10 of which I was coherent enough to understand some aspects of science and about 5 of which I understood the more complex ones . I know all the Creationist arguments , I have used them . And I used to be a darn good creationist debater ... I could almost convince atheists who just did n't understand enough science to refute me . I had learned evolution in high school . I could repeat the facts , but I did n't believe them . I never argued with high school biology teachers becasue they did n't know enough about it to argue back . Then cam college . I took a course in evolution , because I am a curious and open-minded person . I went to class I took the notes and I talked to my prof. during his office hours . For each of the proofs he gave me , I gave him reasons ( creationist arguments ) that they were n't proof or that they were wrong , and he was able to easily refute any argument I gave him . I always questioned him and refuted things in the book , but he always refuted mine right back , and he did a better job and used undeniable empirical evidence . ( No I am not going to give you any here I have neither the time nor the degree ) At this point I was a very confused Christian , I talked to other Christians , I found sites online and then I found a creationist debate site . I asked what they thought and after hearing points from all sides : atheist , hard-core creationist , theistic evolution , self-righteous butt heads . I came to my own conclusion with all the facts that I had . Since then I have seen Kent Hovind speak ... and I uh ... wo n't go there . The fact of the matter is ... can my belief in an old evolved earth withstand creationist arguments ... I would say so . Have I taken classes in Creation ... heck yeah . Will I take more in the future ... sure if I think they have anything to add to my knowledge . In fact there is a professor at my college who is a creationist and if he ever speaks I will certainly go to hear him . So am I close minded or afraid to learn something new or change my opinion ... no . I look to find the truth through facts and knowledge . Because after all when you find truth you find God . So instead of attempting to turn my question back to me , why do n't you actually ask yourself ... are you afraid to take a detailed class in evolution taught by someone with a PhD ... could Creationism stand up to it . I ca n't answer that question for you , and I ca n't even tell you whether you should try to find the answer or not , it 's your choice . But do n't forget , whenever you believe something do n't just belive it because someone said so , find out WHY you believe it to make sure that you should""",DISAGREE,"""Why do n't YOU take a class on creation ? Or are YOU afraid""","""I have ... I was a creationist for 18 years of my life .""",,
22238,5856,"""Both atheists and agnostics will tell you they see no evidence for the existence of any god . Some will continue with `` thus , there is not one `` and other will continue with `` as for the other , i do n't know `` . The agnostic position is obviously tentative , however even though the atheist does not explicitly state his position is tentative , you will be hard pressed to find an atheist who states `` there is absolutely , positively , with out a doubt , no god at all `` .""","""That distinction may be irrelevant since they do say that no god that any religious person believes in exists . And that is what I was getting at originaly . Still I think that the idea that the existence of all religious gods can be ultimately refuted based on the logic you bring up is invalid .""",DISAGREE,"""Both atheists and agnostics will tell you they see no evidence for the existence of any god . Some will continue with `` thus""","""That distinction may be irrelevant since they do say that no god that any religious person believes in exists .""",,
22254,5859,"""I described materialism embracing new forces and phenomena which have withstood the rigors of the scientific method .""","""* * You can 'describe ' materialism in ways that are untrue , but that wo n't make change the reality of the case . What materialism has done , under a long series of name changes , [ the last being 'naturalism ' , if I 'm not mistaken ] , has been to desperately rationalize the evidence of actual reality in the form of 'forces ' and other phenomena antithetical to its principles and assumptions by pretending that what it says is n't what it means . For example that its denial of all things immaterial and incorporeal and insubstantial does n't apply to forces , mass , energy , and so on . All very darwinian SOP .""",DISAGREE,"""I described materialism embracing new forces and phenomena""","""You can 'describe ' materialism in ways that are untrue , but that wo n't make change the reality of the case . What materialism has done , under a long series of name changes , [ the last being 'naturalism ' , if I 'm not mistaken ] , has been to desperately rationalize the evidence of actual reality in the form of 'forces ' and other phenomena antithetical to its principles and assumptions by pretending that what it says is n't what it means .""",,
22265,5861,"""Have you ever noticed that there are some gay couples that seem to bypass all the hate and ignorance of the anti-gay movement ... couples like Ray Horn and life partner , the guy that was Oprah 's designer and his life mate , and sometimes Ellen Degeneres ? Why do these people get treated well overall and not lumped into that `` but he/she 's gay `` group ? It 's good that these people are in the world and showing people that gay does n't mean sick or abnormal .""","""I think at least part of the reason is that they do n't wear their sexuality on their shoulder and flaunt it . And they do n't seem to live for the purpose of 'gay pride . '""",AGREE,"""some gay couples anti-gay movement Ellen Degeneres ?""","""least part of the reason sexuality on their shoulder and flaunt it""",,
22288,5865,"""Anyways I do n't hold it against God for creating us the way we are if indeed he did create us . However we were created I think it did a pretty poor job of it and it is time for us to begin redesigning ourselves .""","""Well , evolution by natural selection makes things look as if they were designed for the environment in which they live . I do n't presume to give God instructions on how he should go about His work . I only observe it .""",DISAGREE,"""hold it against God for creating us the way we are""","""evolution by natural selection makes things look as if they were designed""",,
22297,5866,"""I would like to know where the topic starter stands in this debate , so that a reasonable debate can take place . Do you feel as if they should be excused because of their mental illness , or do you feel they should be punished ? !""","""The Simone persona is not capable of serious thought . Let alone debate . Ad homs , personal attack and spin is what it thinks is debate . The exchange here should tell you all you need to know about this persona .""",DISAGREE,"""so that a reasonable debate can take place""","""The Simone persona is not capable of serious thought . Let alone debate""",,
22302,5881,"""He had ALREADY MADE the animals . '' now the Lord God HAD FORMED ... `` not `` now the Lord God formed ... `` See the difference ? He already HAD FORMED the animals before he brought them to Adam . He made the animals before Adam .""","""It says had formed because the narrative is in the past tense . However , the preceding line says `` I will `` implying he had not made them as of that point .""",DISAGREE,"""He had ALREADY MADE the animals""","""says had formed because the narrative is in the past tense""",,
22319,5885,"""I believe that equality means equality of opportunity , not forced results . The firefighters in NE demonstrated that AA policies that punish fairness are unconstitutional , for instance .""","""Come on JP really . So what happens when opportunity is not equal ? What is the point of doing anything to solve a problem if there is a disregard for achieving measurable results . The whole point of creating an equal opportunity is to correct an imbalance . What type of results , if any , would be acceptable ? I did n't say the government is always right or the intended goals are always achieved . That is our fault for putting people in government with the intelligence of carpet and then allowing them to stay .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe that equality means equality of opportunity , not forced results . The firefighters in NE demonstrated that AA policies that punish fairness are unconstitutional , for instance .""","""So what happens when opportunity is not equal ? What is the point of doing anything to solve a problem if there is a disregard for achieving measurable results . The whole point of creating an equal opportunity is to correct an imbalance . I did n't say the government is always right or the intended goals are always achieved . That is our fault for putting people in government with the intelligence of carpet and then allowing them to stay .""",,
22329,5887,"""What has this got to do with guns ? The root cause of crime/murder/etc is : 1 ) Family instability 2 ) Lack of education/economic opportunity 3 ) Drugs and hopelessness 4 ) Society acceptance of violence/media violence 5 ) In essence , social ills .""","""Well , until all those problems above are solved and we live in a utopia we 'll still need gun-control . As long as we live in an imperfect society gun-control is necessary in the interest of public safety . Do n't you keep bringing this subject up again and again ?""",DISAGREE,"""The root cause of crime/murder/etc is : 1 ) Family instability 2 ) Lack of education/economic opportunity 3 ) Drugs and hopelessness 4 ) Society acceptance of violence/media violence 5 ) In essence , social ills .""","""As long as we live in an imperfect society gun-control is necessary in the interest of public safety .""",,
22338,5889,"""Nor is it 'natural selection ' at work either .""","""Certainly not . Why would you make such a remark ? While a mutation that allowed a bacteria to metabolize nylon waste products is most certainly an example of evolution , heart transplants ( artificial or otherwise ) are n't . It is an ignorant assertion to claim that they are .""",DISAGREE,"""Nor is it 'natural selection ' at work either .""","""Certainly not . Why would you make such a remark ?""",,
22344,5890,"""And lets not neglect the fact that he was tetotal and a vegetarian to boot .""","""Well , I 'm not sure if he consumed alcohol or not , but his doctor gave him daily `` vitamin `` shots that contained vitamins as well as amphetamines and maybe other drugs that doctors at the time thought were mentally beneficial . And I 've never heard of him being a vegetarian . I saw some show that talked about his voracious apetite , but I do n't think they mentioned his being a veggie .""",DISAGREE,"""And lets not neglect the fact that he was tetotal and a vegetarian to boot .""","""And I 've never heard of him being a vegetarian . I saw some show that talked about his voracious apetite , but I do n't think they mentioned his being a veggie .""",,
22377,5906,"""Clanking like ceramic , all of these bones were fossilized .""","""Except the picture of the human remains are clearly NOT fossilized""",DISAGREE,"""all of these bones were fossilized .""","""the picture of the human remains are clearly NOT fossilized""",,
22383,5909,"""In short order we would have the same waiting periods as Canada and Great Britain .""","""Yes , a guarantee that you can see a GP within 3 days ( same day or even a home visit within the hour in an emergency ) would be catastrophic , I can see that . And being seen in ER within 4 hours ( for non-urgent cases ) would be terrible .""",AGREE,"""we would have the same waiting periods as Canada and Great Britain""","""Yes , a guarantee that you can see a GP within 3 days ( same day or even a home visit within the hour in an emergency ) would be catastrophic And being seen in ER within 4 hours ( for non-urgent cases ) would be terrible .""",,
22392,5911,"""Why do women opt for abortion over adoption ?""","""Because they are unable to maintain a pregnancy - money , job and education security , health ( physical , mental and emotional ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do women opt for abortion over adoption ?""","""Because they are unable to maintain a pregnancy - money , job and education security , health ( physical , mental and emotional ) .""",,
22411,5915,"""Simply put , the majority of Christian teaching today differs a lot from when Jesus started it . In fact , I 'd go as far as saying that the majority of so-called `` Christians `` today are an insult to Jesus . Jesus used the bible when speaking to his people and he condoned it . Therefore , as Christians you have to follow ALL the bible . Not just pick and choose which bits you like . Christendom today gives true Christians a bad name , it is false worship . Take a look at these examples of `` Christians `` that go against what the bible teaches : The Roman Catholic Church permits the worship of Jesus ' mother marry . This tradition has PAGAN origin ( http : //bupc.montana.com/whores/marywors.html ) and was not part of the Christian faith . Even worse , the bible condemns any worship that is n't directed at God - Deuteronomy 5:9 ; 6:13 ( Jesus himself refered to this scripture when the devil was trying to temp him ) . One of the ten commandments strictly forbids worshipping anything other than God ( Idolatry ) . Plenty religions permit idolatry , which is a great defiance of God 's word -  “ You must not have any other gods against my face . You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or that is on the earth underneath or that is in the waters under the earth . You must not bow down to them nor be induced to serve them. ” —Ex . 20:3-5 . And here are plenty other scriptures not permitting idol worship : Rom . 6:14 ; 1 # Cor . 6:9 , 10 ; 10:7 , 14 ; 2 # Cor . 6:16 ; Gal . 5:19 , 20 ; 1 # John 5:21 ; Rev . 21:8 ; 22:15 . What do you define as idol worship ?  “ The giving of absolute devotion and ultimate trust to something that is not God ; immoderate attachment or veneration for something ; respect or love that approaches that due a divine power. ” —Webster ’ s Third New International Dictionary . Do you not see church members bowing down/praying at pictures , statutes , shrines etc ? Christmas Christmas is the biggest joke of Christendom . Christmas did n't get it 's origin from the bible or early Christians . Jesus never once said to celebrate his birth , yet he did say to celebrate his death ( i.e . what his life accomplishment has achieved ) through a memorial , or `` Lords supper `` ( this is a serious comemoration that does n't need any showy displays ) -  “ Now as they were eating , Jesus took bread , and blessed , and broke it , and gave it to the disciples and said ,  ‘ Take , eat ; this is my body. ’ And he took a cup , and when he had given thanks he gave it to them , saying ,  ‘ Drink of it , all of you ; for this is my blood of the covenant , which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. ’  ” On that occasion Jesus also commanded , as reported by the apostle Paul :  “ Do this in remembrance of me. ” Matt . 26:26-28 ; 1 # Cor . 11:24 To say that Christmas is Christian just goes to prove you do n't know anything about it 's origin . It started from the Winter Festivals which was a period where cultures celebrated the `` rest period `` ( agricultural activity was put on hold during the cold seaon ) . - http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_holiday_season This in itself is a direct contradiction of the belief that Jesus was born at Christmas - would sheperds have been out looking after the sheep ( as in the Nativity ) ? The idea that Jesus was born at Christmas was simply made up . Another reason why Christmas is n't Christian is it 's pagan attributes Yule and Saturnalia - http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas Christians are to shun paganism . ... There are plenty other things I could say about how the majority of todays `` Christians `` go against the bible and Jesus but my fiancee is going to kill me if I do n't get off this computer !""","""I may want to give a quick reminder that the bible was written by human beings , not a supernatural entity or Jesus . It is very unlikely that Jesus or God had anything to do with the bible , since the bible is not a very righteous , and preaches much hate . People who truely believe in doing good in the world and being followers of God would not even glance at this 2000 year old abomination .""",DISAGREE,"""Simply put , the majority of Christian teaching today differs a lot from when Jesus started it . In fact , I 'd go as far as saying that the majority of so-called `` Christians `` today are an insult to Jesus . Jesus used the bible when speaking to his people and he condoned it . Therefore , as Christians you have to follow ALL the bible . Not just pick and choose which bits you like""","""I may want to give a quick reminder that the bible was written by human beings , not a supernatural entity or Jesus . It is very unlikely that Jesus or God had anything to do with the bible , since the bible is not a very righteous , and preaches much""",,
22448,5923,"""now all of you have made your points on what you believe . but why do you believe it ? what good is it to believe somehitng when you dont even know if its true ?""","""Because even if we never know all the details , the theory is sound since ever increasing numbers of observations are consistent with the theory . Not so for Biblical literalist types that are forced to deal with ever increasing refutation of their beliefs .""",DISAGREE,"""but why do you believe it ? what good is it to believe somehitng when you dont even know if its true ?""","""the theory is sound since ever increasing numbers of observations are consistent with the theory""",,
22450,5924,"""5 panelists does n't equal the opinion of all health professionals .""","""Just , at the very least , 60 % of American physicians . Then there are all those nurses , radiologists , lab technicians , ambulance drivers , medics , emergency room people , etc etc etc ... Not to mention the majority of the American public .""",DISAGREE,"""5 panelists does n't equal the opinion of all health professionals .""","""at the very least , 60 % of American physicians .""",,
22473,5927,"""I 'm not sure what you mean by either genetic determinism or neo-darwinism , but there is no contradiction between multi-purpose genes and evolution by natural selection , or the principle that genotypic alterations have a phenotypic expression . Just because a gene may have more than one function , or multiple genes make contribute to a single characteristic , does n't make any substantive difference to the theory of evolution , which you should recall was inititally developed before there was any understanding of genetics at all .""","""* * Hi jo ; Going by your various posts that I 've read , I think that you are probably a person that I could like and whose opinions I could respect . But quite frankly , on the issue of darwinism and the way darwinists play sly games with the English language , corrupting trhe language to suit their ideology , you seem to have been very much duped by their semantic dishonesty . '' Genetic determinism `` and `` neo-darwinism `` are terms that , as a result of constant and perpetual darwinist equivocation are among those that no longer have one , single , and definite meaning among those that employ them . That is , you can never be sure what they mean when darwinists employ them . What do they mean when you use them ? IAC , if 'genetic determinism ' depends upon the linear chemical process of one gene maps to one protein [ it is now known that this is not the case ] , then a 'theory ' of evolution dependent upon phenotypic mutations determined by genotypic mutations is plausible , [ not necessarily true , but plausible ] , even when the genotypic mutations are accidental/undirected/random . But such a `` theory `` , [ that is , a hypothesis whereby the origin/evolution of biological novelty and increased sytematic complexity and productivity is held to be directly and linearly and mechanically and deterministically traceable to accidental genetic alterations ] , becomes entirely implausible when you have `` multi-purpose genes `` , and whole genomes self-organising their own genetic 'pieces ' . Then phenotypic expression is not the sum , or anything like , the deterministic linear outcome of any given mutated gene , or collection of mutated genes , taken together . The entire fisherian notion of `` Random genetic mutation as the source of adaptive phenotypic traits `` goes straight down the tubes , -- just as it always should have done , from day one . But now you are back to where Darwin was , 150 years ago -- he had no explanation for the ORIGINS of species . All he had was a mechanism [ `` NS `` ] for the numerical distribution [ aka 'fitness ' ] of species . That `` theory `` can `` explain `` [ well , not really ] why some species are plentiful , while others are extinct , but it can not and does not explain how they 'evolved ' in the first place . It was because Darwin had this fact rubbed in his face by his contemporaries that he cribbed from Lamarck , and came up with a 'theory ' of origins that he called , 'pangenesis ' . And without `` RM `` , latterday darwinists are in the same position neo-darwinists were in prior to fisherism 's 'modern synthesis ' . They have no mechanism for the origin of traits [ evolution ] , but only one for the preservation and distribution of traits [ inheritance , heretibility , conservation ] . And a very nebulous 'mechanism ' that is , anyway . Now you may be among those who conveniently forget or ignore the fact that `` NS `` does not , and can not , account for evolution , i.e. , the origins of species , but some of us refuse to do that , despite much pressure from darwinists . And we have been `` recalling `` that fact on a regular basis for 150+ years .""",DISAGREE,"""is no contradiction between multi-purpose genes and evolution by natural selection""","""you seem to have been very much duped by their semantic dishonesty '' ``""",,
22494,5934,"""`` The Mexican Ambassador to the United States , Auturo Sarukhan , appeared on a CBS news program recently and repeated a lie we have heard for many months about the violence in Mexico . The ambassador says Americans are to blame for the violence wrecked on his country by the Mexican drug cartels because  “ most of the guns confiscated by Mexican police can be traced back to the United States. ” That is not true , but the way that claim has been accepted by American politicians and the mainstream media raises suspicions about a hidden agenda . ATFE ’ s Fake Number We can almost forgive the Mexican ambassador for being confused when the United States agency responsible for enforcing our gun laws , the Federal Bureau of Alcohol , Tobacco , Firearms and Explosives , has made so many contradictory statements on the matter . ATFE Assistant Director William Hoover told Congress last year that 90 % of the weapons seized in Mexico crime scenes can be traced to gun sales in the US . The problem is that 90 % number is n't true . Yet , that has n't kept it from being picked up and used by members of Congress , Secretary of State Hillary Clinton , and , of course , Mexican officials like Ambassador Sarukhan who are eager to blame the US for Mexico ’ s problems . Real Weapons Source ? The 90 % number reported by Hoover came from a small group of weapons turned over to the U.S. for tracing , but they were by no means all of the weapons seized by Mexican authorities . A spokesman for the ATFE , Matt Allen , has now `` clarified `` the number and admitted that only 17 % of the weapons found at crime scenes in Mexico have been traced to the U.S. Ironically , while Mexican officials have freely used the 90 % number from the ATFE , they have not themselves made such a charge based on their own numbers . The truth is , they know better . We can easily understand Mexico 's reasons for preferring the 90 % number to the more accurate 17 % . Mexico does not want to openly discuss the many other sources of advanced weapons being used by the drug cartels . Thousands of advanced weapons and tons of military equipment are stolen from its own military and state police . Weapons are smuggled across its southern borders from Guatemala and by boats landing on its 8,000 miles of coastline , weapons that often originate in Venezuela , Colombia , and Nicaragua , or from purchases in Eastern Europe . But it is easier for a Mexican politician to blame the U.S. than to explain his own government ’ s failure to police its borders , its ports of entry and its military installations . Did the Mexican ambassador mention that over 100,000 soldiers have deserted the Mexican army in the past seven years and that many of them took their weapons with them and joined the cartels ? Lax Vehicle Inspection Certainly , no one will deny that thousands of guns have been smuggled from the U.S. into Mexico , but not the rocket-propelled grenades and 50 caliber machine guns that the cartels have in abundance . You ca n't buy that stuff at gun shops in Texas or Arizona . But for the sake of argument , what if it was true that 30 % of the weapons used by the cartels originated in the U.S. ? Could it be that Mexico has invited this traffic by its policy of not inspecting the vehicles entering Mexico from the U.S. ? Mexico only changed that policy two weeks ago and announced that it will beef up its border inspections . And could it be that Mexico 's decades-long opposition to a U.S. border fence and increased border patrol vigilance has something to do with the success of the cartels ' gun-smuggling operations ? Why Strange Obama Response ? But what accounts for the Obama administration 's eagerness to let Mexico blame the U.S. for its spiraling violence ? Two explanations are possible : It may be that blaming American gun laws is for many Americans an easy answer to what seems like an insoluble problem . If we can end Mexico ’ s chaos by making changes on this side of the border , that 's far easier than expecting Mexico to make difficult and painful changes of its own -- like hiring honest cops and paying them a decent wage . The other explanation is more troublesome . Maybe the Obama administration has no clue how to help Mexico but sees an opportunity to help itself . It is obvious that Obama ’ s teams at the Justice Department and the State Department are exploiting the violence in Mexico to justify more restrictions on gun ownership by Americans . The Obama crew ’ s hostility to the Second Amendment has been clear for months . This may be yet another example of Rahm Emanuel 's maxim : `` Never let a good crisis go to waste. `` Mexico needs to face its own demons , beginning with the corruption within its law enforcement agencies and at its ports of entry . The U.S. can help in many ways , such as enhancing our own border security . But adding more restrictions on the ownership of guns by law-abiding Americans will not help Mexico . If we are lucky , this theme of blaming American gun owners and gun shops is only a temporary distraction . If it is more than that , if the Obama administration really believes this is the answer to Mexico 's problems , then we are lost in a swamp. ``""","""`` As President Calderón and I discussed , I am urging the Senate in the United States to ratify an inter-American treaty known as CIFTA to curb small arms trafficking that is a source of so many of the weapons used in this drug war , `` President Obama proclaimed in Mexico City last month . He also incorrectly repeated the errant statistic that 90 percent of guns in the hands of Mexican drug cartels come from America . ( In actuality , according to ATF special agent William Newell , about 17 percent of guns associated with crime in Mexico came from the United States . And this figure has not been broken down to see how many came from civilian gun shops and how many were purchased from the U.S. military by Mexico 's government . ) '' We 're going to be very focused on this . It 's going to be a top priority. `` ABC News quoted an administration official who said that Obama `` felt that it was important to push now for the ratification of this treaty because the question of illegal small-arms is of great concern to the countries throughout the hemisphere a [ s ] it affects their safety. ” You have the ATFE Assistant Director William Hoover spouting the 90 % figure , Then everyone up and on down jumping on board with it . Then ATF special agent William Newell corrects the figure and goes on to state they do n't know how many came from the private sector and how many came from the US Gov giving them to Mexico . Yet we are supposed to punish the law abiding because other countries either ca n't or wo n't get control of their criminals .""",DISAGREE,"""ATFE Assistant Director William Hoover told Congress last year that 90 % of the weapons seized in Mexico crime scenes can be traced to gun sales in the US . The problem is that 90 % number is n't true .""","""President Obama proclaimed in Mexico City last month . He also incorrectly repeated the errant statistic that 90 percent of guns in the hands of Mexican drug cartels come from America . ''""",,
22496,5935,"""I think they are doing it out of fear . They see the moral decline in America and they have latched onto the GLBT Community as their scapegoat . Since it 's no longer PC To attack African-Americans for their obvious differences , it 's not PC to go after other religions ( especially Judaism - not that it actually stops pure hate groups from doing it ) they have decided that attacking a group of people which are sexually different should be the way to go . I mean , their religion tells them that premarital sex is bad and wrong . Even though there is a multi-billion dollar industry based around HETEROSEXUAL sex , they actually depend on that money too much to bite the hand that feeds them . Insted , they attack a group that has not legal rights to marriage let alone little legal standing as far as individual rights . It 's easier that way .""","""I can see what you are saying . It 's pretty much true ... being a Jewish homosexual , I know it first hand . But just for once , could n't they pick on somebody else ? It seems almost like a bully tactic for the Christian heterosexuals who are against same sex marriages to pick on someone who does n't have a legal leg to stand on ... that 's sad .""",DISAGREE,"""I think they are doing it out of fear . They see the moral decline in America and they have latched onto the GLBT Community as their""","""I can see what you are saying . It 's pretty much true ...""",,
22499,5937,"""I see ... a lack of substance on your behalf . Anything to fill the void after a rather damning debunk on the thread I suppose . A very typical tactic on your behalf and I would not expect more .""","""This coming from the person that makes insane claims without providing evidence . Atleast provide some when asked !""",DISAGREE,"""a lack of substance on your behalf .""","""Atleast provide some when asked""",,
22504,5938,"""[ b ] [ font=Courier New ] Is it not true that the reasons the woman has the problems she has now is because of the choices she has made with her body ?""","""You mean I can get pregnant all by myself ! COOL ! Out with the men . They have been ticking me off for YEARS !""",DISAGREE,"""Is it not true that the reasons the woman has the problems she has now is because of the choices she has made with her body ?""","""You mean I can get pregnant all by myself ! COOL ! Out with the men""",,
22535,5952,"""you might criticize me for believing evolution happened simply because scientists say it did , but alas , thats the reason why . anyway ...""","""No . Unless you wish to actually undertake the study of the relevant science , that 's what you need to do . Creationists do the same thing . the problem is that creationists tend to accept the word of those who are n't any more educated than they are . Thus , a creationist will accept Hovind 's dust on the moon argument or his shrinking sun argument as `` proof `` of a young earth .""",DISAGREE,"""you might criticize me for believing evolution happened simply because scientists say it did , but alas ,""","""No . Unless you wish to actually undertake the study of the relevant science ,""",,
22557,5956,"""Your arguing apples and oranges . There are laws already on the books , prior to the unfunded mandate statute , that prohibit discrimination in employment . Gays partners have no legal status today , so the granting of legal status to them will result in increased expenditures by business .""","""But there were not always laws on the books that prevented these things . I was presenting a hypothetical situation in which those laws are not already on the books . The situtation was intended to show only that a ruling allowing same-sex marriage would not have to cost companies a dime .""",DISAGREE,"""There are laws already on the books , prior to the unfunded mandate statute , that prohibit discrimination in employment .""","""But there were not always laws on the books that prevented these things .""",,
22571,5958,"""What great scientific discoveries will we make with it ?""","""That science is all wrong""",DISAGREE,"""What great scientific discoveries will we make with it ?""","""That science is all wrong""",,
22572,5958,"""What great scientific discoveries will we make with it ?""","""That science is all wrong""",DISAGREE,"""What great scientific discoveries will we make with it""","""That science is all wrong""",,
22579,5960,"""What 's the difference between humans and chimps ? According to the blowhards in the scientific world for the past 60 years , they said it was genetic mutations . But according to these three articles , including a September 2006 Science article it 's cooked food and fire ..... you see these things cause our genes to be expressed differently .""","""Eating cooked food is a change in diet , evolutionary speaking its not different from if you stopped eating leaves and started eating fruit . Its still mutations that are resulting in evolution but the selection process for beneficial mutations includes social things as well as purely environmental ones .""",DISAGREE,"""it 's cooked food and fire ..... you see these things cause our genes""","""Eating cooked food is a change in diet""",,
22578,5960,"""What 's the difference between humans and chimps ? According to the blowhards in the scientific world for the past 60 years , they said it was genetic mutations . But according to these three articles , including a September 2006 Science article it 's cooked food and fire ..... you see these things cause our genes to be expressed differently .""","""Eating cooked food is a change in diet , evolutionary speaking its not different from if you stopped eating leaves and started eating fruit . Its still mutations that are resulting in evolution but the selection process for beneficial mutations includes social things as well as purely environmental ones .""",DISAGREE,"""blowhards in the scientific world for the past 60 years , they said it was genetic mutations But according to these three articles , including a September 2006 Science article it 's cooked food and fire""","""Eating cooked food is a change in diet , evolutionary speaking its not different from if you stopped eating leaves and started eating fruit . Its still mutations that are resulting in evolution but the selection process for beneficial mutations includes social things as well as purely environmental ones .""",,
22596,5964,"""SNIP Stuart Taylor Jr. is NOT on your side . A Right to Keep and Bear Arms ? - The Atlantic ( March 20 , 2007 )""","""So ? My source is more recent . Would n't it make more sense to use a more recent source to determine whose side he is currently on ?""",DISAGREE,"""SNIP Stuart Taylor Jr. is NOT on your side . A Right to Keep and Bear Arms""","""Would n't it make more sense to use a more recent source to determine""",,
22597,5965,"""Kudos to athiests then . That 's your answer is it : you believe your god just bodged together life in a convenient fashion rather than doing a proper job ? What a lazy-arsed god you believe in .""","""Sir Issac Newton was an XXXXX and you are a genius ? Hmm . Let me think about that for a second ? Your god does not exist and therfore did nothing . My God only had to speak .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's your answer is it : you believe your god just bodged together""","""Let me think about that for a second ? Your god does not exist and therfore did nothing .""",,
22613,5966,"""Given that this is the gun control forum , it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",DISAGREE,"""it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",,
22615,5966,"""Given that this is the gun control forum , it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",DISAGREE,"""it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",,
22616,5966,"""Given that this is the gun control forum , it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",DISAGREE,"""it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate .""","""It 's completely illogical .""",,
22621,5967,"""sounds like what the supreme court did to terry schiavo""","""And , I 'm sure that Terri Schiavo was fully aware of all that Bush and radical rightwing religionists did for her and appreciates what they did .""",DISAGREE,"""sounds like what the supreme court did to terry schiavo""","""I 'm sure that Terri Schiavo was fully aware of all that Bush and radical rightwing religionists did for her and appreciates what they did .""",,
22626,5967,"""sounds like what the supreme court did to terry schiavo""","""And , I 'm sure that Terri Schiavo was fully aware of all that Bush and radical rightwing religionists did for her and appreciates what they did .""",DISAGREE,"""sounds like what the supreme court did to terry schiavo""","""I 'm sure that Terri Schiavo was fully aware of all that Bush and radical rightwing religionists did for her""",,
22627,5968,"""how many animals were there on the Ark , Hank ? you 'll probably tell me 2 times the number of species we have in the world today ... I say , perhaps not . here 's where evolution actually supports the Bible""","""No when talking about the ark , I like to agree on what we are talking about when using the term  ‘ kind ’ . And I like to give the person that believes in the flood the opportunity to define it . That includes whether they think dinosaurs and other extinct animals were on the ark . So I ’ m interested in how you define  ‘ kind ’ and your opinion on the dinosaurs and others .""",DISAGREE,"""how many animals were there on the Ark , Hank ? you 'll probably tell me 2 times the number of species we have in the world today I say , perhaps not""","""No when talking about the ark , I like to agree on what we are talking about when using the term ‘ ’ And I like to give the person that believes in the flood the opportunity to define it . That includes whether they think dinosaurs and other extinct animals were on the ark So ’ m interested in how you define ’ and your opinion on the dinosaurs and others .""",,
22639,5969,"""Any random change in a complex , specific , functioning system wrecks that system .""","""False . Beneficial mutations in bacteria have been observed in the lab . Far from wrecking the system , they allowed the system to continue to live while those without the mutations died : the mutations improved the system 's ability to survive and perpetuate itself .""",DISAGREE,"""Any random change in a complex , specific , functioning system wrecks that system .""","""False . Beneficial mutations in bacteria have been observed in the lab . Far from wrecking the system""",,
22646,5969,"""Any random change in a complex , specific , functioning system wrecks that system .""","""False . Beneficial mutations in bacteria have been observed in the lab . Far from wrecking the system , they allowed the system to continue to live while those without the mutations died : the mutations improved the system 's ability to survive and perpetuate itself .""",DISAGREE,"""specific , functioning system wrecks that system .""","""they allowed the system to continue to live while those without the mutations died""",,
22656,5970,"""One says A. was mostly bird , the other says mostly reptile . One says A. was a link , another says that A. could not have been a link .""","""I see that you lack the integrity to even learn how to spell the words necessary to discuss the topic . Let me help . That is Archaeopteryx . Those who have actually invested the integrity to learn what they are talking about and those who have studied evolutionary theory in detail know that A. is only meaningful when previously referenced and then , only when the species is also mentioned - in this case A. lithographica or A. bavarica . But since you ca n't spell platypus , why would anyone expect that you had actually done a detailed study to the extent that you could spell Archaeopteryx ? But , no matter . Your total ignorance of science is apparent from the very fact that you think that disagreement on some details casts a doubt on the grander theory . ( Of course , you do n't seem to see disagreements on major tenets of faith as evidence against your form of christianity , based primarily on mythology ) A minority of evolutionary biologists disagrees with the theory that birds evolved from theropod dinosaurs . One of those is Allan Feduccia , a favorite son of creationists , in spite of the fact that gives no credence to creationism . Creationists even offer quotes from Feduccia as if they were somehow supportive of creationism . Those who do are , without question , totally ignorant of the principles of logic and science . Disproof of one hypothesis does not support any other . Thus , any arguments against evolutionary theory are not support for creationism . Creationism must either stand or fall on its own merits . Scientists ( who were also creationists ) struck down a literal reading of Genesis more than 200 years ago . And yet , American fundamentalist creationists have reject their contradictory findings , based on actual study , in favor of the mythology of nomadic herdsmen .""",DISAGREE,"""One says A. was mostly bird , the other says mostly reptile . One says A. was a link , another says that A. could not have been a link .""","""you do n't seem to see disagreements on major tenets of faith as evidence against your form of christianity , based primarily on mythology""",,
22657,5971,"""BTW , I think Anthony Flew is wrong about the Christian God .""","""You do n't say !""",AGREE,"""Anthony Flew is wrong about the Christian God .""","""You do n't say !""",,
22684,5976,"""I would be willing to debate anyone on the topic of whether homosexuals should be allowed to marry . I will take the position that they should not .""","""if you can find an impartial judge , i 'll take you up .""",DISAGREE,"""willing to debate anyone on the topic of whether homosexuals should be allowed to marry .""","""if you can find an impartial judge , i 'll take you up .""",,
22708,5981,"""Logic can not come from experience because people 's experiences change and are different which means that the laws of logic could change . Logic does not come from your mother 's teaching because not everyone has a mother and mothers think differently .""","""Please introduce me to someone who has no mother . The deductions regarding experiments in physics involve logic and logical conclusions based upon repeated observations of things happening around us . To logically conclude that an apple will fall to the ground if released from any given height above the ground has no dependence whatsoever on whether a god made all this matter that we 're part of .""",DISAGREE,"""Logic can not come from experience because people 's experiences""","""Please introduce me to someone who has no mother""",,
22728,5985,"""And although many darwinists kid themselves that they are here to debate 'science ' , they are not . They are here to defend their metaphysics and its place in their personal psychological identity , i.e. , ego , against the metaphysics of others , just like everybody else .""","""So you 're not wrong ; everyone else is a liar .""",DISAGREE,"""They are here to defend their metaphysics and its place in their personal psychological identity , i.e. , ego , against the metaphysics of others just like else""","""So you 're not wrong everyone else is a liar .""",,
22746,5990,"""15 The LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to till it and keep it . 16 And the LORD God commanded the man , saying , `` You may freely eat of every tree of the garden ; 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat , for in the day that you eat of it you shall die. `` 18 Then the LORD God said , `` It is not good that the man should be alone ; I will make him a helper fit for him. `` 19 So out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air , and brought them to the man to see what he would call them ; and whatever the man called every living creature , that was its name . 20 The man gave names to all cattle , and to the birds of the air , and to every beast of the field ; but for the man there was not found a helper fit for him . 21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man , and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh ; 22 and the rib which the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man .""","""now bear in mind that all this happened in one day ( day 6 ) . How many species of animals can a man name in a day ? OK , Noah is 9 generations after Adam , and according to the story , a generation was like 200 years on average , plus at the time Noah built the ark , he was some 200 something himself ( cant remember the exact figure ) . so say its 2000 years or so after the creation day . Anyway , its possible that not a lot of speciation took place in that time , plus its arguable that there wasnt a lot of migration away from the Eden area either . so all the animals in the Earth were relatively close-by , and there couldnt have been a great number of new or variant species from the ones originally created . From the Creation to the Flood , the story makes sense . multiply the number of animals Adam named in a day by 2 , and add 25 % for speciation , and thats the number of animals that needed to be in the ark . sounds logical to me but then again , its just a story ...""",DISAGREE,"""The man gave names to all cattle , and to the birds of the air , and to every beast of the field ;""","""How many species of animals can a man name in a day ? OK , Noah is 9 generations after Adam , and according to the story , a generation was like 200 years on average , plus at the time Noah built the ark""",,
22754,5992,"""But how can you be against a proven method of reducing abortions at the same time ?""","""It 's a self-defeating question . You 're asking why numbskulls participate in numbskullery .""",DISAGREE,"""how can you be against a proven method of reducing abortions""","""It 's a self-defeating question .""",,
22791,6054,"""Sigh . You defend your version of science by re-stating the definition of your version of science . That is circular reasoning .""","""No more circular than your . Except that your assertions are n't backed up by any evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""That is circular reasoning .""","""No more circular than your .""",,
22794,6055,"""By the same logic many economists use , we could find any number of absurd things . For example there is a well known correlation between skyscraper construction and economic downturn , we could conclude from this that tall buildings depress economies and that recessions can be avoided if we disallow the construction of record-height buildings . The other thing economists need to realise is that economic statistics are entirely historical , they provide empirical information about a particular group at a particular time , not universal truths about mankinds ' behaviour in general . Even if we run an experimental design in the realm of human action showing X causes Y , differing social and cultural norms may result in the precise opposite effect at another period of time .""","""So , the cavaet is `` The death penalty is a deterrent in the USA TODAY ! `` I can live with that .""",AGREE,"""For example there is a well known correlation between skyscraper construction and economic downturn , we could conclude from this that tall buildings depress economies and that recessions can be avoided if we disallow the construction of record-height buildings . The other thing economists need to realise is that economic statistics are entirely historical , they provide empirical information about a particular group at a particular time , not universal truths about mankinds ' behaviour in general . Even if we run an experimental design in the realm of human action showing X causes Y , differing social and cultural norms may result in the precise opposite effect at another period of time .""","""So , the cavaet is `` The death penalty is a deterrent in the USA TODAY ! `` I can live with that .""",,
22815,6059,"""No , its not . Thats a strawman . I have never stated anything of the sort .""","""Strawman argument , obviously you never `` said `` it , your inferior Intellect can not articulate what you really mean , it requires articulation by a Superior Being such as I . This the formal structure of your argument , citizen-slave , even if you are too slavebound to recognise Real Ultimate Truth .""",DISAGREE,"""a strawman never stated anything of the sort .""","""obviously you never `` said `` it , inferior Intellect can not articulate""",,
22822,6060,"""Very well said , but remember , Evolution doesnt mean atheism , but creationism means religion .""","""There 's just enough truth in that statement to keep me from saying it 's false , but if I analyze it , it will help make my point ; The word `` evolution `` has such a broad meaning that it does n't have to mean atheism , but it since it is practically the only weapon that atheists have to combat the religious worldview , that 's what it often DOES mean . If it should n't mean it , but it is used so that it does , then that 's what it actually means . Creationism means religion , but it also involves a belief in the authenticity of historical documents that have been meticulously preserved over thousands of years . That 's not just religion , it 's secular , observed history - something evolution does n't have . So if a person hearing your statement does n't consider it carefully , it 's very easy to be mislead by it . It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false ) is somehow a secular , observable truth - while creationism is nothing but a religion , a superstition . Since evolution ca n't prove the book of Genesis ( ancient history ) false , and creationism does have some historical backing , they are comparable and they directly conflict . The problem is , a school teacher can make the statement you made , and it ca n't be legally questioned by anyone . Yet there was a case that I read about somewhere , where a sticker was placed in science textbooks advising children to study evolution `` with an open mind `` , and an ACLU lawsuit ensued . Of all those likely to be mislead by your statement , it 's young impressionable school children . Publicly paid school teachers misleading them with statements like that , without a full explanation ( prohibited by the courts ) does get an establishment of atheism started . It 's what I mean when I say that when church and state are separated , atheism and state are combined . Maybe government could be neutral , if it was small . The U.S. government is no longer small .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution doesnt mean atheism , but creationism means religion .""","""There 's just enough truth in that statement to keep me from saying it 's false ,""",,
22855,6072,"""44 % believe gun laws should be more strict , 43 % believe they should stay the same , and 12 % believe they should be less strict .""","""So 43 % + 12 % = 55 % that oppose new laws in the Gallop .""",DISAGREE,"""44 % believe gun laws should be more strict , 43 % believe they should stay the same , and 12 % believe they should be less strict .""","""43 % + 12 % = 55 % that oppose new laws in the Gallop .""",,
22882,6074,"""Yeah , it is a good first step though . While they should have allowed gays to get married , it is progress , but they will eventually find out that seperate but equal will not work .""","""Many who voted for this said as much . They 're hoping that in a few years gays will actually get full rights . We can only hope .""",AGREE,"""While they should have allowed gays to get married , it is progress""","""They 're hoping that in a few years gays will actually get full rights . We can only hope .""",,
22888,6075,"""Dear Chloe , Do you really want women tried for murder because they decide to take a pill that will cause an abortion ? That is the only logical position a court can take once a zygote , embryo and fetus are legislated into the status of Human Beings . If one kills a human being , one is guilty of murder .""","""yes , that would be correct .""",AGREE,"""Dear Chloe , Do you really want women tried for murder because they decide to take a pill that will cause an abortion ?""","""yes , that would be correct .""",,
22893,6075,"""Dear Chloe , Do you really want women tried for murder because they decide to take a pill that will cause an abortion ? That is the only logical position a court can take once a zygote , embryo and fetus are legislated into the status of Human Beings . If one kills a human being , one is guilty of murder .""","""yes , that would be correct .""",AGREE,"""you really want women tried for murder because they decide to take a pill that will cause an abortion""","""yes , that would be correct .""",,
22898,6076,"""Actually , it 's not a good point . I usually question the maturity of people who judge other people by where they were born and raised . There are good things about every state . Louisianna is just as good as any other state . So are most of the people who live there . There are crooks in every state , also .""","""Because there are good things about every state means .... what exactly ? Of course there is good in bad in most everything , which has nothing to do with what I said . Yes , great food , crawfish as a staple , great fishing , bayous , New Orleans , Mardi Gras .... long beads ...... sure , some great things . With regards to achievement or vision ? I 'm not seeing it . Legal gambling ? That was another recent `` achievement `` . What about wanting to secede from the Union ? Yes , Louisiana is the consistent trend-setter for the civilized world . Oh wait , it is n't . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""So are most of the people who live there . There are crooks in every state , also .""","""Louisiana is the consistent trend-setter for the civilized world . Oh wait , it is n't . -Mach""",,
22900,6076,"""Actually , it 's not a good point . I usually question the maturity of people who judge other people by where they were born and raised . There are good things about every state . Louisianna is just as good as any other state . So are most of the people who live there . There are crooks in every state , also .""","""Because there are good things about every state means .... what exactly ? Of course there is good in bad in most everything , which has nothing to do with what I said . Yes , great food , crawfish as a staple , great fishing , bayous , New Orleans , Mardi Gras .... long beads ...... sure , some great things . With regards to achievement or vision ? I 'm not seeing it . Legal gambling ? That was another recent `` achievement `` . What about wanting to secede from the Union ? Yes , Louisiana is the consistent trend-setter for the civilized world . Oh wait , it is n't . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""it 's not a good question the maturity of people who judge other people""","""there are good things about every state means""",,
22901,6076,"""Actually , it 's not a good point . I usually question the maturity of people who judge other people by where they were born and raised . There are good things about every state . Louisianna is just as good as any other state . So are most of the people who live there . There are crooks in every state , also .""","""Because there are good things about every state means .... what exactly ? Of course there is good in bad in most everything , which has nothing to do with what I said . Yes , great food , crawfish as a staple , great fishing , bayous , New Orleans , Mardi Gras .... long beads ...... sure , some great things . With regards to achievement or vision ? I 'm not seeing it . Legal gambling ? That was another recent `` achievement `` . What about wanting to secede from the Union ? Yes , Louisiana is the consistent trend-setter for the civilized world . Oh wait , it is n't . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""the of people by where they born and raised are about state is""","""things about state , to . great food great fishing , bayous , New Orleans , Mardi Gras some `` the Louisiana""",,
22918,6095,"""I fear that would lead to extermination of the women .""","""Nonsense ! There are already a number of Islamic Feminist groups . And , quite frankly , the vast majority of Muslims are quite fond of their women and would be rabidly opposed to exterminating them .""",DISAGREE,"""I fear that would lead to extermination the women""","""There are already a number of Islamic Feminist groups""",,
22916,6095,"""I fear that would lead to extermination of the women .""","""Nonsense ! There are already a number of Islamic Feminist groups . And , quite frankly , the vast majority of Muslims are quite fond of their women and would be rabidly opposed to exterminating them .""",DISAGREE,"""I fear that would lead to extermination of the women .""","""Nonsense ! Muslims are quite fond of their women""",,
22922,6097,"""If you want a contradiction how about conservatives who are against abortion , but advocate the death penalty , Who think nothing of sending their sons and daughters off to die in war with someone who was not a real threat and call it patriotism . Who , with one hand , sell the very weapons they condemn with the other . That is your real contradiction""","""You are clearly against the Iraq War , and this is n't what I was planning to debate . I think the Pro-lifers have an edge on the contradiction between abortion and the death penalty because one is the ending of an innocent life , while the other is of a guilty person ’ s life . I think every soldier who gives his life in a justified or an ambiguous war should be honored by all Americans for giving his or her life for their country , and yes , I do believe they are patriots !""",DISAGREE,"""a contradiction advocate the death penalty""","""clearly against the Iraq War I think every soldier who gives his life""",,
22939,6099,"""Yes , socialist . Check the definition . I do n't watch Fox . Is that the best you can do ?""","""If you mean by this that we ’ re left shifted relative to the American spectrum then yes we are , and thank God for that ! However we ’ re not a socialist country . We have a pseudo socialist government in at the moment , but they aren ’ t enforcing any true socialist policies . Blair realised that the only way to get re-elected repeatedly is to stay middle of the road ...""",DISAGREE,"""Check the definition . I do n't watch Fox .""","""If you mean by this that we ’ re left shifted relative to the American spectrum then yes""",,
22941,6099,"""Yes , socialist . Check the definition . I do n't watch Fox . Is that the best you can do ?""","""If you mean by this that we ’ re left shifted relative to the American spectrum then yes we are , and thank God for that ! However we ’ re not a socialist country . We have a pseudo socialist government in at the moment , but they aren ’ t enforcing any true socialist policies . Blair realised that the only way to get re-elected repeatedly is to stay middle of the road ...""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , socialist . Check the definition""","""we ’ re not a socialist country . We have a pseudo socialist government in at the moment , but they aren ’ t enforcing any true socialist policies .""",,
22951,6100,"""Finish the other threads in which you 're being crushed before moving onto another .""","""Collin , that 's precisely why he 's moving to another one ...""",AGREE,"""Finish the other threads in which you 're being crushed before moving onto another""","""that 's precisely why he 's moving to another one""",,
22957,6101,"""Not many women would say they had an abortion now , let alone back when it was illegal . It is an emotionally trying event . I can understand why she would n't for that reason alone . Another possibility is that the Administration is buying her silence , or it could be a combination of the two .""","""So since she does n't come out , we just assume that the four people that they have affidavits from are not lying , or maybe BEING PAID BY THE KERRY CAMPAIGN ?""",DISAGREE,"""Not many women would say they had an abortion now , let alone back when it was illegal . Administration is buying her silence , or it could be a combination of the two .""","""So since she does n't come out , we just assume that the four people that they have affidavits from are not lying , or maybe BEING PAID BY THE KERRY CAMPAIGN ?""",,
22971,6103,"""if the laws of logic are human constructs then how can they be absolute since humans think differently and often contradictorily .""","""That the thinking of some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""",DISAGREE,"""if the laws of logic are human constructs then how can they be absolute since humans think differently and often contradictorily .""","""That the thinking of some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""",,
22972,6103,"""if the laws of logic are human constructs then how can they be absolute since humans think differently and often contradictorily .""","""That the thinking of some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""",DISAGREE,"""if the laws of logic are human constructs then how can they be absolute since humans think differently and often contradictorily .""","""That the thinking of some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""",,
22986,6104,"""Yet , consistently , when asked to justify your position , you , and others , have seen fit to use locker rooms as justification . If all these bad analogies are not justification , then what is your justifcation ? Please tell us ,""","""First , there is no `` us `` on your part regarding this . I am talking to you . Others here that argue your same positions have been much less beligerent , so as far as I 'm concerned your attitude sets you apart . Second , I was n't trying to give you justification , nor am I obligated to . You should be giving justification for wanting to redefine marriage as an institution which you have n't done . But I do n't owe you any justification . Take your silly games up with Mana'ia ; they wo n't work with me .""",DISAGREE,"""locker rooms as justification . analogies are not justification then what is your justifcation ?""","""there is no `` us `` . Others here that argue your same positions have been much less beligerent I was n't trying to give you justification , nor am I obligated to You should be giving justification for wanting to redefine marriage""",,
23018,6110,"""SS : [ color= `` DarkGreen `` ] No they 're not .... do zoos document the changes in phenotype that no-doubt occur ? This is not the zoo 's job -- their job is not experimentation on animals -- that 's science 's job . Besides that , zoos do their darndest to house the animals in habitats that mimic the animals ' natural settings .""","""We 've covered that : zoos do not include predators or prey in those environments . And even if they did n't document minor phenotypic changes , they would surely notice a porcupine being born with no quills , or a tortoise with no shell !""",DISAGREE,"""not zoos changes phenotype zoo 's job not experimentation animals science 's job , darndest natural settings .""","""covered zoos not include predators or prey environments did n't document minor phenotypic , porcupine with no quills , tortoise with no shell !""",,
23025,6111,"""So with that , it ’ s also pretty easy to imagine that there was no NEED for the human genome to mutate to accommodate a fruitless/vitaminC-less diet . Likewise , we also know that primates also consume a diet high in fruits , leaves and berries , thereby getting plenty of vitamin C. So like humans , primates would have no reason for their genomes to mutate if they ate fruits and leaves high in vitamin C from the beginning .""","""Well yes , but thats not what DEFECTIVE GULO indicates . If one has external sources of vitamin C , GULO can mutate to be inactive without causing a problem , and once inactive the inactive gene can be inherited without causing problems so long as vitamin C intake is high enough . An inactive GULO indicates that the species has external sources of vitamin C which is essential to many metabolic processes .""",DISAGREE,"""it ’ s also pretty easy to imagine that there was no NEED for the human genome to mutate to accommodate a fruitless/vitaminC-less diet .""","""but thats not what DEFECTIVE GULO indicates . If one has external sources of vitamin C , GULO can mutate to be inactive without causing a problem ,""",,
23034,6113,"""They 're not a very reliable source of info ...""","""Why is that ? Because you disagree with them ?""",DISAGREE,"""They 're not a very reliable source of info ...""","""Why is that ? Because you disagree with them ?""",,
23037,6114,"""As of today , 11-08-04 , the Cobb County ( GA ) school system is being tested in court about the validity of their warning sticker pasted in every Evolution textbook . The sticker basically says that evolution is a theory and should be approached with an open mind . The evolutionists are saying this is an endorsement of creationism , therefore is a religious doctrine being taught in school ... against the law . This is the same school system whose leader recently tried to have the word `` evolution `` deleted from the school curriculum . Is the Bible Belt getting too tight ?""","""Yes , it is . I 'm actually considering moving out of the south specifically for that reason . I will miss the largemouth bass fishing .... wth is a pike ? It 's always been that bad though , now that I think about it . It 's just I ignored it more when I was younger . The sticker is moronic IMO . If they label `` evolution `` with that , they should go ahead and label every single book , TV , everyone 's forehead , and every object that can hold a sticker in the entire world . Some people thing there is `` openess `` about being correct or incorrect . On some things that are opinion , sure . On reality ? Not the case . I mean , I 'm not running around believing John Kerry actually won the election despite the evidence , although I certainly could , if I approached the election results with `` an open mind `` . Although I could .... hmmm ... just have to keep it up for 4 years ! -Mach""",AGREE,"""the Cobb County ( GA ) school system is being tested in court about the validity of their warning sticker pasted in every Evolution textbook The evolutionists are saying this is an endorsement of creationism , therefore is a religious doctrine being taught in school `` Is the Bible Belt getting too tight ?""","""Yes , it is . The sticker is moronic IMO If they label `` evolution `` with that , they should go ahead and label every single book , TV , everyone 's forehead , and every object that can hold a sticker in the entire world .""",,
23040,6115,"""http : //www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main ... 7/nfert107.xml Arab 's birth rate - 7-10 kids Birth rate in UK - below 2 .... And we wonder why it seems muslims are taking over the world ... DUH ! ! ! THEY care about life more than the `` free `` world .... I believe that one of the reasons we are dealing with terrorism in the world is because we are committing mass murder on babies in the womb ... Need i say more ...""","""Cause you know - nobody in the UK is aware of how to use birth control or makes concious choices not to have kids . Your article does n't even talk about abortion . Hell - I am pro-choice and can come up with better arguments against abortion than this .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe that one of the reasons we are dealing with terrorism in the world is because we are committing mass murder on babies in the womb""","""nobody in the UK is aware of how to use birth control or makes concious choices not to have kids . Your article does n't even talk about abortion .""",,
23044,6116,"""Even though the Bible is the most heavily documented writing of its day , still skeptics require more in order to believe the Gospels are actually true .""","""And we 're back to internal contradiction coupled with anonymous authorship . Do you consider The Odyssey a representation of truth ? I sure as hell do n't , but that 's because I hold the Bible and these stories to an equal standard , and none pass . You apparently have no problem with nonsense and absurdities in the Bible , but you have no problem believing in Scylla and Charybdis and the Sirens and Circe turning men into pigs ?""",DISAGREE,"""Even though the Bible is the most heavily documented writing of its day , still skeptics require more in order to believe the Gospels are actually""","""You apparently have no problem with nonsense and absurdities in the Bible""",,
23046,6117,"""The ability to make petrified wood could hold promise for separating industrial chemicals , filtering pollutants and soaking up contamination , said Yongsoon Shin , research scientist at the Pacific Northwest National Laboratory .""","""Not to mention a new onslaught of YEC 's saying , 'See , I told you so. `` I bet Kent Hovind is folding this information into a new presentation as we speak .""",AGREE,"""The ability to make petrified wood could hold promise for separating industrial chemicals , filtering pollutants and soaking up contamination ,""","""Not to mention a new onslaught of YEC 's saying , 'See , I told you .""",,
23047,6117,"""The ability to make petrified wood could hold promise for separating industrial chemicals , filtering pollutants and soaking up contamination , said Yongsoon Shin , research scientist at the Pacific Northwest National Laboratory .""","""Not to mention a new onslaught of YEC 's saying , 'See , I told you so. `` I bet Kent Hovind is folding this information into a new presentation as we speak .""",AGREE,"""The ability to make petrified wood could hold promise for separating industrial chemicals , filtering pollutants and soaking up contamination , said Yongsoon Shin""","""Not to mention a new onslaught of YEC 's saying , 'See , I told you ``""",,
23050,6118,"""And these can be extended to portable civil unions .""","""So could heterosexual marriage .""",DISAGREE,"""these can be extended to portable civil unions .""","""So could heterosexual marriage""",,
23054,6119,"""# 1 See the post titled `` Biblical Failures `` in the Religion section of this forum . If the Bible has a single inaccuracy in it , then it can not be considered 100 % true . This post shows inaccuracies so the Bible can not be considered a reliable source for things that can not be proven and that includes trying to say whether an unborn baby has a soul . Besides , why should you be able to force your beliefs on everyone else ? Perhaps you could justify a law that says all Christians can not have abortions .""","""Whether or not there are innaccuracies in the Bible is hottly debated , but it is not really the point I was trying to make . I was simply attempting to point out the different viewpoints , not debate on the validity of the Bible . Please read , take a deep breath , and think before you reply from simple emotion .""",DISAGREE,"""1 See the post titled `` Biblical Failures `` in the Religion section of this forum . If the Bible has a single inaccuracy in it , then it can not be considered 100 % true . This post shows inaccuracies so the Bible can not be considered a reliable source for things that can not be proven and that includes trying to say whether an unborn baby has a Besides , why should you be able to force your beliefs on everyone else ? Perhaps you could justify a law that says all Christians can not have abortions .""","""Whether or not there are innaccuracies in the Bible is hottly debated , but it is not really the point I was trying to I was simply attempting to point out the different viewpoints , not debate on the validity of the Please read , take a deep breath , and think before you reply from simple emotion .""",,
23059,6120,"""`` If you talk to God you are religious . If God talks back you 're delusional. `` Dr. House""","""God talks to me , and he specifically told me that I am his favorite .""",DISAGREE,"""If you talk to God you are religious . If God talks back you 're delusional. ``""","""God talks to me , and he specifically told me that I am his favorite .""",,
23088,6125,"""PENNSYLVANIA CONSTITUTION Section 21 . Right to Bear Arms The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned . I do n't see the word `` qualified `` in there .""","""Agreed . Try telling that to congress .""",AGREE,"""PENNSYLVANIA CONSTITUTION Section 21 . Right to Bear Arms The right of the citizens to bear arms""","""Agreed . Try telling that to congress .""",,
23098,6140,"""Not all of them .""","""Not ALL of them ? ! ! ! Come on , Simone , it 's doctors like Tiller that slaughter thousands , not their typical adversary .""",DISAGREE,"""Not all of them .""","""Not ALL of them ? ! ! !""",,
23100,6140,"""Not all of them .""","""Not ALL of them ? ! ! ! Come on , Simone , it 's doctors like Tiller that slaughter thousands , not their typical adversary .""",DISAGREE,"""Not all of them .""","""Not ALL of them ? ! !""",,
23116,6142,"""1 ) What good does it do to `` disregard the bible `` when there are Christians wanting to enforce the laws of the Bible on gays regardless of whether or not we `` regard `` it ? ? ?""","""because the question of whether or not a gay act is a sin is purely religious , and has nothing to do with law . read carefully what i posted""",DISAGREE,"""What good does it do to `` disregard the bible `` when there are Christians wanting to enforce""","""because the question of whether or not a gay act is a sin is purely religious""",,
23119,6143,"""From a book review of BETTER FOR ALL THE WORLD : The Secret History of Forced Sterilization and America 's Quest for Racial Purity by Harry Bruinius : http : //www.nytimes.com/2006/02/26/bo ... w/26satel.html Hmmm , Teddy Roosevelt , Winston Churchill , the Rockefeller foundations , millions of Americans , the State of Indiana . . . all these embraced the concept of EUGENICS . Interesting , yes ?""","""Yes . However , our great forefathers have supported something far worse than that . SLAVERY !""",AGREE,"""From a book review of BETTER FOR ALL THE WORLD : all these embraced the concept of EUGENICS . Interesting""","""However , our great forefathers have supported something far worse than that . SLAVERY !""",,
23151,6146,"""So lets say that if , and I know this has nothing to do with the topic of gay marriage , but do the people have a right to amend the constitution to introduce slavery ? Does the majority have a right to deny a minority freedom ? I already know you answer . You believe in the tyranny of the majority .""","""Well , assuming that the slavery amendments to the federal constitution were repealed , then slavery certainly could be reintroduced . Minority freedoms are denied all the time . The right to murder , for example . I do not believe in the tyranny of the majority ; I believe in the majority 's right to legitimately wield its power . If we are not going to be governed by majority rule , then what will we be governed by ? If not rule by the many , do you propose we be ruled by the few ? Would you really be happy to live under a dictator ?""",DISAGREE,"""So lets say that if , and I know this has nothing to do with the topic of gay marriage , but do the people have a right to amend the constitution to introduce slavery ? Does the majority have a right to deny a minority freedom ? I already know you answer . You believe in the tyranny of the majority .""","""Well , assuming that the slavery amendments to the federal constitution were repealed , then slavery certainly could be reintroduced . Minority freedoms are denied all the time . If we are not going to be governed by majority rule , then what will we be governed by ? If not rule by the many , do you propose we be ruled by the few ? Would you really be happy to live under a dictator ?""",,
23156,6147,"""When you resort to name calling you have lost the argument before you even start .""","""Ah , yes .""",AGREE,"""When you resort to name calling you have lost the argument before you even start .""","""Ah , yes .""",,
23157,6147,"""When you resort to name calling you have lost the argument before you even start .""","""Ah , yes .""",AGREE,"""When you resort to name calling you have lost the argument before you even start .""","""yes""",,
23174,6151,"""2 ) Just because something has changed from one age to the next , this does not necessarily mean that one begat the other .""","""Well , that was badly stated . But we 've been over this before and you still do n't seem to grasp . No one claims that any particular living animal is descended from any particular fossil . However , given the nature of life that we do observe , where we can see many species of equus , 36 species of cat , 28 species of canid , 8 or 10 species of bear ( with as many more extinct species ) , 850,000 species of beetle , and on and on , we conclude that life was similar in the past . And while we can look at a fossil species of theropod dinosaur and find many avian characteristics , we do not conclude that this fossil was ancestral to birds . But we know that there were probably many species of theropods that had avian characteristics , just like there are many animals with cat-like features . Recent discoveries are bearing out that conclusion . So we do n't say that this fossil is ancestral to that fossil or to this living organism . But we do say that this fossil shows characteristics that we would expect in an ancestral form . Thus , Archaeopteryx is not claimed to be ancestral to birds - in fact , is is believed to have eventually gone extinct ( in all three known species ) . What we do say is that Archaeopteryx shows characteristics of both theropod dinosaurs and birds . Is in one of a broad lineage of many species with such characteristics , at least one of which is ancestral to modern birds ( but we ca n't determine which one or ones that might be ) . And we have n't even gotten into the question of derived morphology . Why do n't we assume that dogs are descended from some very dog-like artiodactyl ? In fact , why do we conclude that these dog-like animals are , in fact , artiodactyls ?""",DISAGREE,"""Just because something has changed from one age to the next , this does not necessarily mean that one begat the other .""","""Well , that was badly stated""",,
23185,6154,"""They know it 's wrong , and the feeling of guilt which almost never leaves them is an emotional ball and chain they need to carry around for years and sometimes the rest of their life .""","""Someone who does n't agree with abortion might feel this , but you need to back it up otherwise . We have no problem with ending billions of lives over the course of our lives , if we do n't think that they matter ( cooking and even having food , having an immune system , disinfectants etc ) . If you do n't recognise the organism as something worth worrying about , why would you ? I say that its more likely that its more an embarrasment for most people than a feeling that they have killed someone ( though to be fair , I ca n't back that up ) .""",DISAGREE,"""the feeling of guilt which almost never leaves emotional ball and chain""","""does n't agree with abortion might feel this We have no problem with ending billions of lives""",,
23190,6154,"""They know it 's wrong , and the feeling of guilt which almost never leaves them is an emotional ball and chain they need to carry around for years and sometimes the rest of their life .""","""Someone who does n't agree with abortion might feel this , but you need to back it up otherwise . We have no problem with ending billions of lives over the course of our lives , if we do n't think that they matter ( cooking and even having food , having an immune system , disinfectants etc ) . If you do n't recognise the organism as something worth worrying about , why would you ? I say that its more likely that its more an embarrasment for most people than a feeling that they have killed someone ( though to be fair , I ca n't back that up ) .""",DISAGREE,"""They know it 's wrong , and the feeling of guilt which almost never leaves them is an emotional ball and chain""","""Someone who does n't agree with abortion might feel this ,""",,
23193,6155,"""I 'm not talking about evolving viruses , I 'm talking about evolving SPECIES .""","""Well , ok. You 're wrong because evolving viruses are examples of evolution , as are bacteria and the new strains that have become resistant to antibiotics . But if you want some examples I 'll give three . I certainly hope that you have the courtesy to read them and actually think about them .""",DISAGREE,"""evolving viruses""","""'re wrong examples you""",,
23195,6155,"""I 'm not talking about evolving viruses , I 'm talking about evolving SPECIES .""","""Well , ok. You 're wrong because evolving viruses are examples of evolution , as are bacteria and the new strains that have become resistant to antibiotics . But if you want some examples I 'll give three . I certainly hope that you have the courtesy to read them and actually think about them .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not talking about evolving viruses , I 'm talking about evolving SPECIES .""","""Well , ok. You 're wrong because evolving viruses are examples of evolution ,""",,
23201,6156,"""You tell me that Job and Jonah are fiction . I tell you that evolution is fiction . Maybe we are both right .""","""No . Not only are you wrong , you seem to lack the integrity to learn the basics of what you claim to oppose . You oppose evolution you say , but you have no idea of what it is . Most educated creationists not only admit evolution , they propose evolution at rates that make real biologists laugh .""",DISAGREE,"""Job and Jonah are fiction evolution is fiction""","""lack the integrity to learn the basics of what you claim to oppose propose evolution at rates that make real biologists laugh .""",,
23203,6156,"""You tell me that Job and Jonah are fiction . I tell you that evolution is fiction . Maybe we are both right .""","""No . Not only are you wrong , you seem to lack the integrity to learn the basics of what you claim to oppose . You oppose evolution you say , but you have no idea of what it is . Most educated creationists not only admit evolution , they propose evolution at rates that make real biologists laugh .""",DISAGREE,"""Job and Jonah are fiction evolution is fiction""","""No Not only are you wrong you seem to lack you have no idea""",,
23208,6156,"""You tell me that Job and Jonah are fiction . I tell you that evolution is fiction . Maybe we are both right .""","""No . Not only are you wrong , you seem to lack the integrity to learn the basics of what you claim to oppose . You oppose evolution you say , but you have no idea of what it is . Most educated creationists not only admit evolution , they propose evolution at rates that make real biologists laugh .""",DISAGREE,"""Job and Jonah are fiction . evolution is fiction .""","""you wrong""",,
23217,6157,"""`` Pro-Gun `` States Lead the Nation in Per Capita Firearm Death Rates Violence Policy Center Analysis of New Data Reveals : Louisiana , Alaska , Montana , Tennessee , and Alabama Top List of Deadliest States in the Nation Blind Allegiance to the Second Amendment Takes Deadly Toll Washington , DC & # 8212 ; States in the South and West with weak gun laws and high rates of gun ownership lead the nation in overall firearm death rates according to a new analysis issued today by the Violence Policy Center ( VPC ) of Centers for Disease Control and Prevention ( CDC ) data . The new VPC analysis uses 2005 data ( the most recent available ) from the CDC 's National Center for Injury Prevention and Control . The analysis reveals that the five states with the highest per capita gun death rates were Louisiana , Alaska , Montana , Tennessee and Alabama . Each of these states had a per capita gun death rate far exceeding the national per capita gun death rate of 10.32 per 100,000 . By contrast , states with strong gun laws and low rates of gun ownership had far lower rates of firearm-related death . Ranking last in the nation for gun death was Hawaii , followed by Massachusetts , Rhode Island , New Jersey and New York . ( See chart below for top and bottom five states . See http : //www.vpc.org/fadeathchart.htm for a ranking of all 50 states . ) http : //vpc.org/press/0804gundeath.htm So how do the people who claim guns save lives explain this ?""","""Really , so California is just a peachy crime free place because of its strict firearms laws ? What about New York ? But wait ! Do n't forget good ol Washington DC ! Their crime rate is lower than Bush 's approval rating because of their strict firearm laws ! Of course they are going to have a higher rate of firearms death , but they 're obviously going to have a lower rate of everything else ( criminal related ) death . In the end , Its lower .""",DISAGREE,"""States Lead the Nation in Per Capita Firearm Death Rates""","""so California is just a peachy crime free place""",,
23218,6158,"""Nice try , but no cigar . It 's been widely reported , even on liberal-run media , that states with 'conceal carry laws ' have had a reduction in overall crime and more dramatic reductions in specific crimes like murder , etc . Myself , I do n't worry with providing 'raw data ' for lazy liberals who wo n't be swayed in their rabid hatred of 'gun ownership ' anyway . Just keep believing Sarah Brady and the rest of those fools . However , you might want to read some of John Lott 's stuff : http : //www.johnrlott.com/ http : //www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/493636.html""","""`` According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation 's Uniform Crime Reports , from 1997 to 1998 the nation 's overall crime rate dropped 6.4 % , from 4930.0 to 4615.5 crimes per 100,000 population . More telling is this continuing trend where crime fell faster in states that have strict carrying concealed weapons ( CCW ) laws or that do not allow the carrying of concealed weapons at all than in states which have lax CCW laws. `` '' From 1992 to 1998 ( the last six years for which data exists ) , the violent crime rate in the strict and no-issue states fell 30 % while the violent crime rate for the 11 states that had liberal CCW laws ( where law enforcement must issue CCW licenses to almost all applicants ) during this entire period dropped only 15 % . `` http : //www.bradycampaign.org/facts/r ... truth & amp ; menu=gvr""",DISAGREE,"""states with 'conceal carry laws ' have had a reduction in overall crime and more dramatic reductions in specific crimes like murder""","""the violent crime rate in the strict and no-issue states fell 30 % violent crime rate for the 11 states that had liberal CCW laws dropped only 15 %""",,
23254,6163,"""One of these aspects of existence which we arbitarily believe in is cause and effect . Another is the external world . A third is the consciousness of others . A fourth is the past etc . etc .""","""They originally might have been an arbitrary guess , but experience of all humans always has given them a very high probability of being true ( at least the existence of the outside world , the others are abstract logical concepts that do n't have a physical reality , just an abstract one ) .""",DISAGREE,"""arbitarily consciousness past etc . etc .""","""arbitrary guess probability of being outside world abstract logical just an abstract one""",,
23258,6163,"""One of these aspects of existence which we arbitarily believe in is cause and effect . Another is the external world . A third is the consciousness of others . A fourth is the past etc . etc .""","""They originally might have been an arbitrary guess , but experience of all humans always has given them a very high probability of being true ( at least the existence of the outside world , the others are abstract logical concepts that do n't have a physical reality , just an abstract one ) .""",DISAGREE,"""we arbitarily believe in is cause and effect .""","""They originally might have been an arbitrary guess ,""",,
23269,6166,"""Yes , panic attacks are sparking many very long winded rants .""","""So any long publication must be due to a panic attack ? It takes a few minutes to read those posts , but it takes an hour and a half to watch Expelled ; does that mean that IDers are having the mother of all panic attacks ? Your logic ca n't even be described as `` tortured , `` marc , because it 's completely nonexistent .""",DISAGREE,"""panic attacks are sparking many very long winded rants .""","""any long publication must be due to a panic attack ?""",,
23279,6189,"""Once again , this shows the true colors of liberals . Oh they 'll scream `` tolerance `` and `` acceptance `` when it relates to them or their causes . But whenever conservatives speak up , to quote Rush : `` Racist , Sexist , Bigot , Homophobe `` are the standard fare that is heard .""","""What liberals ? http : //www.republicansforchoice.com/ Last time I checked abortion was n't a clear cut partisan issue . By the way you implied it , you act like it is either expected or common for conservatives to be intolerant racists , homophobes or sexists . Oh well , thanks for playing the knee-jerk , partisan card for us . It is always a crowd pleaser . Next you can tell us about how liberals have a big laser cannon on the moon that is being used to vaporize decency and morality in America and how they 'll force 4 year old children into watching Brokeback Mountain at public schools from their secret base . Those dastardly liberals !""",DISAGREE,"""Racist , Sexist , Bigot , Homophobe `` are the standard fare that is heard .""","""abortion was n't a clear cut partisan issue .""",,
23289,6190,"""Donna Santa Marie was a 16-year-old girl who was forced by her parents and abortionist to have an abortion against her will . Her father even punched her in the stomach to try to induce a miscarriage . The abortionist had to be called in to perform an abortion without her consent . Despite these horrific facts , New Jersey Federal Courts have ruled that Donna Santa Marie can not sue the doctor , the abortionist , because the infant was not born alive and have cited Roe v. Wade as justification . If Roe v. Wade is supposed to be based on a woman 's choice , how can she be forced to have an abortion and have no remedy under the law .""","""I think you guys are missing out on the fact that the Judge ruled that there was not injury done to Donna Santa Marie . So much for the arguement that the unborn human is part of the mother . What a disgusting and unfortunate case . It was n't born alive , so it does n't matter . What unsettles me the most is that some of you do n't seem to care . You sound more worried about the possible blow to abortion than the women who have been hurt .""",DISAGREE,"""The abortionist had to be called in to perform an abortion without her consent . Despite these horrific facts , New Jersey Federal Courts have ruled that Donna Santa Marie can not sue the doctor , the abortionist , because the infant was not born alive and have cited Roe v. Wade as justification . If Roe v. Wade is supposed to be based on a woman 's choice , how can she be forced to have an abortion and have no remedy under the law .""","""I think you guys are missing out on the fact that the Judge ruled that there was not injury done to Donna Santa Marie . So much for the arguement that the unborn human is part of the mother . What a disgusting and unfortunate case . It was n't born alive , so it does n't matter .""",,
23306,6191,"""also they did n't seem to mind that the abortion rate which was declining under clinton has been raising under Bush ... maybe they 're not that bothered .""","""For what it 's worth , I certainly AM bothered by this if it 's true . I 'd like to see the source where you got that information about the abortion rate climbing under Bush 's presidency , if you would . Of course , we also need to note that the rise and fall of abortion rates are not necessarily linked to who is president at the time .""",DISAGREE,"""the abortion rate which was declining under clinton has been raising under Bush""","""information about the abortion rate climbing under Bush 's presidency , if you would .""",,
23299,6191,"""also they did n't seem to mind that the abortion rate which was declining under clinton has been raising under Bush ... maybe they 're not that bothered .""","""For what it 's worth , I certainly AM bothered by this if it 's true . I 'd like to see the source where you got that information about the abortion rate climbing under Bush 's presidency , if you would . Of course , we also need to note that the rise and fall of abortion rates are not necessarily linked to who is president at the time .""",DISAGREE,"""rate which was declining under clinton has been raising under Bush""","""Bush 's presidency , if you would . Of course , we also need to note that""",,
23310,6192,"""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it . Sorry if this is just turning into word games .""","""Not answering for trebor - this is my two-penn'orth . If you 're going to describe anyone 'open to evidence ' as agnostic , then this is a word game : there 'd be by definition no ( reasoning ) atheists in the world . The ( negative ) atheist position is that in the complete absence of evidence to believe that a proposed entity exists , withholding belief is the default position - as with sinjin 's leprechauns . To call that agnosticism has always struck ne as mealy-mouthed : I 'd rather come right out and declare myself an atheist ( the negative or 'weak ' variety , like Big Bear Scot ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Is that not agnostic ?""","""If you 're going to describe anyone 'open to evidence ' as agnostic , then this is a word game :""",,
23314,6192,"""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it . Sorry if this is just turning into word games .""","""Not answering for trebor - this is my two-penn'orth . If you 're going to describe anyone 'open to evidence ' as agnostic , then this is a word game : there 'd be by definition no ( reasoning ) atheists in the world . The ( negative ) atheist position is that in the complete absence of evidence to believe that a proposed entity exists , withholding belief is the default position - as with sinjin 's leprechauns . To call that agnosticism has always struck ne as mealy-mouthed : I 'd rather come right out and declare myself an atheist ( the negative or 'weak ' variety , like Big Bear Scot ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it""","""Not answering for trebor - this is my two-penn'orth .""",,
23316,6192,"""Is that not agnostic ? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it . Sorry if this is just turning into word games .""","""Not answering for trebor - this is my two-penn'orth . If you 're going to describe anyone 'open to evidence ' as agnostic , then this is a word game : there 'd be by definition no ( reasoning ) atheists in the world . The ( negative ) atheist position is that in the complete absence of evidence to believe that a proposed entity exists , withholding belief is the default position - as with sinjin 's leprechauns . To call that agnosticism has always struck ne as mealy-mouthed : I 'd rather come right out and declare myself an atheist ( the negative or 'weak ' variety , like Big Bear Scot ) .""",DISAGREE,"""leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it .""","""the complete absence of evidence to believe that a proposed entity exists""",,
23320,6193,"""The average human being has about 50-100 mutations""","""Almost every human today is living fine with 50-100 mutations .""",AGREE,"""The average human being has about 50-100 mutations""","""Almost every human today is living fine with 50-100 mutations .""",,
23325,6193,"""The average human being has about 50-100 mutations""","""Almost every human today is living fine with 50-100 mutations .""",AGREE,"""The average human being has about 50-100 mutations""","""Almost every human today is living fine with 50-100 mutations""",,
23334,6194,"""Exactamundo , finally the ignoramus gets something right .""","""Which makes your view of God exponentially disturbing . If man kills it 's wrong . If God exterminates millions , it 's morally just .""",DISAGREE,"""finally the ignoramus gets something right .""","""If man kills it 's wrong""",,
23335,6194,"""Exactamundo , finally the ignoramus gets something right .""","""Which makes your view of God exponentially disturbing . If man kills it 's wrong . If God exterminates millions , it 's morally just .""",DISAGREE,"""the ignoramus gets something right .""","""view of God exponentially disturbing .""",,
23340,6195,"""That 's how I think it works , so the ball in in your court now .""","""I 'm foolishly looking forward to this as if we 're going to see anything besides the standard baloney . How silly . ( Yes , I am still alive ; I 've just been incredibly busy and really hardly have the time even now to check in . )""",DISAGREE,"""That 's how I think it works , so the ball in in your court now .""","""How silly . ( Yes , I am still alive ; I 've just been incredibly busy and really hardly have the time even now to check in . )""",,
23349,6203,"""On what evidence do you base your claim that an arctic fox would not change color in the winter if brought to Arizona ? temperature , cold . Tell me , if you took your dog to the arizona desert , do you think it would it would put on a winter 's coat ? If it had a winter 's coat do you think it would keep it ?""","""That 's not evidence , that 's an assertion . As for my dogs ( cats ) , yes . They do put on a winter coat in the much warmer winter climate than Arizona in which I live . So I return to my original question , on what evidence do you base your claim that an arctic fox would not change color in the winter in Arizona ?""",DISAGREE,"""what evidence your claim an arctic fox would not change color in the winter if brought to Arizona ? if you took your dog to the arizona desert put on a winter 's coat""","""that 's an assertion for my dogs ( cats ) , yes put on a winter coat""",,
23374,6207,"""( by the way , he is in no way an ID guy ... he is a hard-core evolutionist -- yet he admits that the modern synthesis is indeed a fairytale . )""","""Just like StuporSnort to fail to read the entire page . If you 'll direct your attention to the very first comment , you 'll see that crazy Sal is talking out of his XXX .""",DISAGREE,"""no way an ID guy a hard-core evolutionist modern synthesis is indeed a fairytale""","""fail to read the entire page first comment that crazy Sal talking out of his XXX""",,
23417,6216,"""Brother ... you are sick . Why would I lie about homo erectus being a human being ? Think about the name : `` Homo Erectus `` ... it means upright human""","""No , it means 'upright member of the genus Homo ' . You put too much faith in literal translations . The fact that the genus has been given a Latin name meaning 'man ' does not make all of the genus human , any more than Ichthyosaurus has to be a kind of fish-lizard .""",DISAGREE,"""Think about the name : `` Homo Erectus `` ... it means upright human""","""No , it means 'upright member of the genus Homo ' .""",,
23418,6216,"""Brother ... you are sick . Why would I lie about homo erectus being a human being ? Think about the name : `` Homo Erectus `` ... it means upright human""","""No , it means 'upright member of the genus Homo ' . You put too much faith in literal translations . The fact that the genus has been given a Latin name meaning 'man ' does not make all of the genus human , any more than Ichthyosaurus has to be a kind of fish-lizard .""",DISAGREE,"""you are sick Why would I lie about homo erectus it means upright human""","""No , it means 'upright member of the genus Homo ' too much faith in literal translations Latin name meaning 'man ' does not make all of the genus human""",,
23420,6231,"""`` ( 20 . ) The only reason gun crime is so high in the U.S. is because we don & # 8217 ; t punish criminals harshly enough ; after all , the U.S. only imprisons more people per capita than any other democratic nation in the world .""","""Felony possession of a firearm is five years in prison . Gun trafficking is ten years per gun . Murder brings the death penalty . None of these punishments are handed down for the crimes that get committed . It 's a matter of quantity over quality .""",DISAGREE,"""only reason gun crime high U.S. we punish criminals harshly enough only imprisons more people per capita than any other democratic nation in the world""","""Felony possession five years in prison trafficking is ten years per gun None of these are handed down crimes that get committed quantity over quality""",,
23471,6240,"""simple : science has no materialistic origin of anything : dna , rna , brains , eyes , kidneys , potassium , sodium , any of the billions of compounds , time , space , matter , consciosness -- nothing .""","""And special creation has no nonmaterial cause for anything either . Come to think of it special creation can only rely on nonmaterial causes .""",DISAGREE,"""science has no materialistic origin of anything""","""Come to think of it special creation can only rely on nonmaterial causes""",,
23482,6242,"""Jesus was such a Great liar of the world !""","""Are you like a Chinese government official or something ? Oh wait . I forgot , the Chinese government controls what you say anyway , so I guess it matters not .""",DISAGREE,"""Jesus was such a Great liar of the world !""","""I forgot , the Chinese government controls what you say anyway , so I guess it matters not .""",,
23495,6245,"""What great faith you evilutionists have in nothingness ! LOL""","""Actually , is n't it creationists who claim that the universe was created from nothing ? Creationists even have a magazine formally called `` Ex Nihilo `` ( changed to `` Creation `` because creationists did n't know what it meant . )""",DISAGREE,"""evilutionists nothingness""","""Actually , is n't it creationists who claim that the universe was created from nothing ? Creationists even have a magazine formally called `` Ex Nihilo `` ( changed to `` Creation `` because creationists did n't know what it meant . )""",,
23498,6245,"""What great faith you evilutionists have in nothingness ! LOL""","""Actually , is n't it creationists who claim that the universe was created from nothing ? Creationists even have a magazine formally called `` Ex Nihilo `` ( changed to `` Creation `` because creationists did n't know what it meant . )""",DISAGREE,"""What great faith you evilutionists have in nothingness !""","""Actually , is n't it""",,
23504,6246,"""6 . Global warming is a problem for everyone and will make us all hot and miserable ! Did you know that in Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Let 's talk about the people in Sri Lanka , which has lost hundreds of acres in the recent past due to climate changes . Who , with just a few more degrees on average , will be completely submerged soon . I have a feeling if we just go democratic on this , there 's a few more votes in the tropical region than in the arctic .""",DISAGREE,"""Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Sri Lanka has lost hundreds of acres in the recent past due to climate changes .""",,
23516,6249,"""illegal traffickers""","""are taking""",DISAGREE,"""illegal traffickers""","""are taking""",,
23528,6251,""" “ WT1 has been conserved throughout vertebrate evolution , although only mammals possess numerous protein isoforms. ” ( Nucleic Acids Research , 2003 , Vol . 31 , No . 11 2795-2802 , Faithful expression of a tagged Fugu WT1 protein from a genomic transgene in zebrafish : efficient splicing of pufferfish genes in zebrafish but not mice )""","""So it has gone from an indeterminate ( based on my quick searches ) number of fewer isoforms in lower vertebrates to the 24 found in mammals . That 's an increase in information .""",AGREE,"""WT1 vertebrate although only mammals possess numerous protein""","""isoforms lower vertebrates 24 found in mammals""",,
23532,6252,"""Originally Posted by jyoshu I want to learn more about this issue .""","""Lets start simple then , I teach you the first thing you need to know . It is n't just a behavior . Being gay is about emotions , not behavior . As soon as you learn and understand that first rule , I will suddenly have more respect for you .""",DISAGREE,"""I want to learn more about this issue .""","""I teach you the first thing you need to know .""",,
23540,6254,"""Because they could n't own models like the AR-15 or AK-47 ? Last I checked those were banned in Chicago and much of Illinois , limiting people to mainly deer rifles . Whatever you read is irrelevant . In Heller the judges ruled it was illegal and unconstitutional to ban ownership of an entire class of firearms , such as handguns . In McDonald they extended that same standard to all 50 states . Gun control makes crime worse . Look at how many murders Chicago admitted they experienced each year that involved handguns . Nearly all of them .""","""And they could have experienced more without gun control . You 're jumping to conclusions .""",DISAGREE,"""Because they could n't own models like the AR-15 or AK-47 ? Last I checked those were banned in Chicago and much of Illinois , limiting people to mainly deer rifles . Whatever you read is irrelevant""","""And they could have experienced more without gun control . You 're jumping to conclusions .""",,
23560,6258,"""Sounds like a fact which has been blown out of all proportion - possibly by the pro-gun side attempting to ridicule it . It is a fact , however , that the presence of a gun can increase aggression levels in individuals . See other times I have brought this up , here ( to the end of the thread ) and here ( again , that post till the end of the thread ) .""","""Can cause aggression , does not mean that it will though . Alcohol has a far greater record of this but yall are not trying to ban that . So do women but we arent going to ban them now are we , Sorry but I was in a marriage from hell and just had to throw that in .""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds like a fact which has been blown out of all proportion - possibly by the pro-gun side attempting to ridicule it .""","""Can cause aggression , does not mean that it will though . Alcohol has a far greater record of this but yall are not trying to ban that . So do women but we arent going to ban them now are we , Sorry but I was in a marriage from hell""",,
23563,6258,"""Sounds like a fact which has been blown out of all proportion - possibly by the pro-gun side attempting to ridicule it . It is a fact , however , that the presence of a gun can increase aggression levels in individuals . See other times I have brought this up , here ( to the end of the thread ) and here ( again , that post till the end of the thread ) .""","""Can cause aggression , does not mean that it will though . Alcohol has a far greater record of this but yall are not trying to ban that . So do women but we arent going to ban them now are we , Sorry but I was in a marriage from hell and just had to throw that in .""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds like a fact which has been blown out of all proportion - possibly by the pro-gun side attempting to ridicule it""","""Sorry but I was in a marriage from hell and just had to throw that in .""",,
23601,6280,"""Wait a minute . You say that any physical attack is wrong , but in the sentence after you say you do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it . Are you for real ?""","""Yes , I 'd say I do exist ( to answer your question ) . Furthermore , I do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it .... he is the one thinking we are `` at war `` and he states that he is willing to do the same things . I assume he finds this behavior during `` a war `` to be fairly standard and if the opposite situation had happened he would be all for it .""",DISAGREE,"""Wait a minute any physical attack is wrong , Matthew S""","""I 'd say I do exist at war opposite situation had happened""",,
23605,6280,"""Wait a minute . You say that any physical attack is wrong , but in the sentence after you say you do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it . Are you for real ?""","""Yes , I 'd say I do exist ( to answer your question ) . Furthermore , I do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it .... he is the one thinking we are `` at war `` and he states that he is willing to do the same things . I assume he finds this behavior during `` a war `` to be fairly standard and if the opposite situation had happened he would be all for it .""",DISAGREE,"""say that any physical attack is wrong , after you say you do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it . Are you for real ?""","""Yes , I 'd say I do exist . I do n't see why Matthew S has a problem with it""",,
23616,6281,"""So , what all of sudden made these primates change into a weaker species no doubt ?""","""Once again , you prove Pandion 's asseration correct . Weaker species ? Who said anything about that ? Some species evolved to meet new niches , acquire more food , safer habitats . Hardly weaker . As for suddenly , you basically admit you are ignorant about evolution and sciences , which was Pandion 's basic asseration . They did not change suddenly , but over time .""",DISAGREE,"""all of sudden made these primates change into a weaker species no doubt ?""","""Pandion 's asseration Who said anything about that ?""",,
23647,6284,"""The popultion [ sic ] has been told for decades that they are simply a culmination of their genes .""","""I 'm not sure what the means . I think that you have been listening to the creationist version of evolutionary biology . As an evolutionary biologist I 've never heard anything like that .""",DISAGREE,"""The popultion [ sic ] has been told for decades that they are simply a culmination of their genes .""","""I 'm not sure what the means .""",,
23652,6285,"""And with the possible exception of collecting , Australian licensing laws allow all of the above . I should know I have lived and shot over there . The idea of such laws is to remove weapons from those who have no good reason to own such things , and put extra safety restrictions on those who do .""","""Really ? When ? I have talked to many an Aussie who do martial arts and THEY are n't even allowed to get a permit to teach with swords as they to Have the wrong hands""",DISAGREE,"""the possible exception of collecting , Australian licensing laws allow all of the above . I should know I have lived and shot over there""","""I have talked to many an Aussie who do martial arts and THEY are n't even allowed to get a permit""",,
23672,6287,"""Now yes i agree with the death penalty as written by law and placed into law by those we entrust our laws too , that is what you vote for after all.This as nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that i believe that a woman should have the choice to abort or carry to full term.What about if the child will live for four weeks in terrible pain , should that child be born , a bit inhumane do you not agree ? .""","""Yes , it should be born . Who are you to say that a life lived in pain is not worth living ? Who are you to say that you ca n't help the child ? If you believe in the `` choice `` thing then for you to say this child should n't live because `` I `` would n't want to be like that is taking the choice from him/her . Thus , that is inconsistent .""",DISAGREE,"""will live for four weeks in terrible pain , should that child be born , a bit inhumane do you not agree .""","""Who are you to say that a life lived in pain is not worth living""",,
23700,6290,"""The difference is where you feel you can demand accountability . I think pro-life people who accept an exception in the case of incest and rape do n't view the child as less precious , they simply do n't feel the mother has the same accountability as she did not consent to the pregnancy . ( Granted , there are misogynistic lifers those who want to hold women as slaves to any and all pregnancies that come along ... ) I really do n't think the big pro-life vs pro-choice argument is about where life begins or whether or not life is precious . It 's more a debate over 1 - whether the rights of mother or the child take precedence , 2 - how much accountability can we hold a pregnanct woman to .""","""I believe this is a clear and concise way of putting it . Regarding number 2 , pro-life people believe there is a moral responsibility and , if the woman does not believe the same , wish to make it into a legal responsibility . I think Duo 's question was directed mostly at Voice of Reason The same question has been posed to him time and time again and he weasels out of it . ETA , Jitobear , I just noticed you and I joined in the same month : P""",AGREE,"""difference is where you feel you can demand accountability more a debate over 1 - whether the rights of mother or the child take precedence how much accountability can we hold a pregnanct woman to .""","""pro-life people believe there is a moral responsibility if the woman does not believe the same , wish to make it into a legal responsibility . has""",,
23702,6290,"""The difference is where you feel you can demand accountability . I think pro-life people who accept an exception in the case of incest and rape do n't view the child as less precious , they simply do n't feel the mother has the same accountability as she did not consent to the pregnancy . ( Granted , there are misogynistic lifers those who want to hold women as slaves to any and all pregnancies that come along ... ) I really do n't think the big pro-life vs pro-choice argument is about where life begins or whether or not life is precious . It 's more a debate over 1 - whether the rights of mother or the child take precedence , 2 - how much accountability can we hold a pregnanct woman to .""","""I believe this is a clear and concise way of putting it . Regarding number 2 , pro-life people believe there is a moral responsibility and , if the woman does not believe the same , wish to make it into a legal responsibility . I think Duo 's question was directed mostly at Voice of Reason The same question has been posed to him time and time again and he weasels out of it . ETA , Jitobear , I just noticed you and I joined in the same month : P""",AGREE,"""I think pro-life people who accept an exception in the case of incest and rape do n't view the child as less precious , they simply do n't feel the mother has the same accountability as she did not consent to the pregnancy .""","""I believe this is a clear and concise way of putting it .""",,
23704,6290,"""The difference is where you feel you can demand accountability . I think pro-life people who accept an exception in the case of incest and rape do n't view the child as less precious , they simply do n't feel the mother has the same accountability as she did not consent to the pregnancy . ( Granted , there are misogynistic lifers those who want to hold women as slaves to any and all pregnancies that come along ... ) I really do n't think the big pro-life vs pro-choice argument is about where life begins or whether or not life is precious . It 's more a debate over 1 - whether the rights of mother or the child take precedence , 2 - how much accountability can we hold a pregnanct woman to .""","""I believe this is a clear and concise way of putting it . Regarding number 2 , pro-life people believe there is a moral responsibility and , if the woman does not believe the same , wish to make it into a legal responsibility . I think Duo 's question was directed mostly at Voice of Reason The same question has been posed to him time and time again and he weasels out of it . ETA , Jitobear , I just noticed you and I joined in the same month : P""",AGREE,"""The difference is where you feel you can demand accountability . I think pro-life people who accept an exception in the case of incest and rape do n't view the child as less precious , they simply do n't feel the mother has the same accountability as she did not consent to the""","""I believe this is a clear and concise way of putting it .""",,
23722,6292,"""I am not asking for the church or any religion to endorse , for lack of a better word , a gay marriage . What I am asking for is civil rights . The same rights any other couple receive under the law . Religion has nothing to do with it . As far as understanding , it really is not difficult . I am not heterosexual , however I understand and accept heterosexuality . If those who oppose or do n't understand could accept that fact the homosexuality is something one is born with and not something that one chooses , maybe it would make more sense to them . Me trying to explain to you why I am homosexual would be like you trying to explain to me why you are heterosexual . Homosexuals no more chose to be homosexual any more than an african american chose the color or their skin . Just look at your own life , your own desires , your own sexuality as it developed and evolved throughout your life . There is no difference other than mine are not towards the opposite sex , but otherwise exactly the same .""","""Welcome to 4forums .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not asking for the church or any religion to endorse , for lack of a better word , a gay marriage . What I am asking for is civil rights .""","""Welcome to 4forums .""",,
23723,6292,"""I am not asking for the church or any religion to endorse , for lack of a better word , a gay marriage . What I am asking for is civil rights . The same rights any other couple receive under the law . Religion has nothing to do with it . As far as understanding , it really is not difficult . I am not heterosexual , however I understand and accept heterosexuality . If those who oppose or do n't understand could accept that fact the homosexuality is something one is born with and not something that one chooses , maybe it would make more sense to them . Me trying to explain to you why I am homosexual would be like you trying to explain to me why you are heterosexual . Homosexuals no more chose to be homosexual any more than an african american chose the color or their skin . Just look at your own life , your own desires , your own sexuality as it developed and evolved throughout your life . There is no difference other than mine are not towards the opposite sex , but otherwise exactly the same .""","""Welcome to 4forums .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not asking for the church or any religion to endorse , for lack of a better word , a gay marriage .""","""Welcome to 4forums .""",,
23739,6294,"""So we can make machines to see better than we do ?""","""You 're kidding , right ? Telescopes , microscopes , radio telescopes . Surely you 've heard of these . And we even have devices called spectometers which let us see what wavelengths make up a sample of light . There are some sample pics of their output here : http : //www.science.uwaterloo.ca/~cch ... /hspectra.html""",DISAGREE,"""So we can make machines to see better than we do ?""","""http : //www.science.uwaterloo.ca/~cch ... /hspectra.html""",,
23745,6295,"""It the religious nut cases that are against abortion , and think it was judical activism to award abortion rights with ROE then why do n't they just put the question of abortion on the ballot ? They believe in putting other civil rights issues on the ballot . Why not abortion ?""","""Because you can not reverse an incorrect United States Supreme Court decision with a ballot . Simple as that . Additionally , prior to 1973 , abortion was already settled democratically in most states . And , regardless of whether 99.9 % of the people in the US approve of the court 's decision in Roe , that decision would still be judicial activism , and as such , would still merit reversal by the Supreme Court .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion it was judical activism to award abortion rights with ROE why do n't they just put the question of abortion on the ballot ?""","""Because you can not reverse an incorrect United States Supreme Court decision with a ballot . Additionally , prior to 1973 , abortion was already settled democratically in most states . regardless of whether 99.9 % of the people in the US approve of the court 's decision in Roe , that decision would still be judicial activism , and as such , would still merit reversal by the Supreme Court .""",,
23747,6295,"""It the religious nut cases that are against abortion , and think it was judical activism to award abortion rights with ROE then why do n't they just put the question of abortion on the ballot ? They believe in putting other civil rights issues on the ballot . Why not abortion ?""","""Because you can not reverse an incorrect United States Supreme Court decision with a ballot . Simple as that . Additionally , prior to 1973 , abortion was already settled democratically in most states . And , regardless of whether 99.9 % of the people in the US approve of the court 's decision in Roe , that decision would still be judicial activism , and as such , would still merit reversal by the Supreme Court .""",DISAGREE,"""religious nut cases that are against abortion , judical activism to award abortion rights why do n't they just put the question of abortion on the ballot ?""","""can not reverse an incorrect United States Supreme Court decision with a ballot . Additionally , prior to 1973 , abortion was already settled democratically still be judicial activism""",,
23755,6297,"""since to disprove this you essentially have to disprove the existance of god""","""But no one is trying to disprove it . But , the burden of any proof is on those making a positive claim . Unless there is a way to test for a designer , intellegent design is not science .""",DISAGREE,"""disprove you essentially have to disprove the existance of god""","""But no one is trying to disprove it . burden of any proof""",,
23757,6297,"""since to disprove this you essentially have to disprove the existance of god""","""But no one is trying to disprove it . But , the burden of any proof is on those making a positive claim . Unless there is a way to test for a designer , intellegent design is not science .""",DISAGREE,"""since to disprove this you essentially have to disprove the existance of god""","""But no one is trying to disprove it . But , the burden of any proof is on those making a positive claim .""",,
23761,6298,"""i 've no problems with gay couples marrying if they have kids straight couples can adopt as well""","""Please , so you actually advocate `` down-grading `` any union which does not raise children ? That 's simply insane ! Not to mention also highly unconstitutional .""",DISAGREE,"""i 've no problems with gay couples marrying if they have kids straight couples can adopt as well""","""Not to mention also highly unconstitutional .""",,
23763,6298,"""i 've no problems with gay couples marrying if they have kids straight couples can adopt as well""","""Please , so you actually advocate `` down-grading `` any union which does not raise children ? That 's simply insane ! Not to mention also highly unconstitutional .""",DISAGREE,"""i 've no problems with gay couples marrying if they have kids straight couples can adopt as well""","""you actually advocate `` down-grading `` any union which does not raise children ? That 's simply insane ! Not to mention also highly unconstitutional .""",,
23771,6300,"""Those Who Abort Them Know Otherwise . I posted this on Youdebate , but as this is becoming more popular , I 'll post it here too . -- - So my question is this . Why don ' y they call those bunch of cells a baby ? Do they : 1 . Do it because they believe it really is a baby or 2 . Do it because it eases their conscience when they kill it ?""","""I believe that most women are n't in denial about what they are aborting . I have n't heard any women who have had an abortion call it `` a bunch of cells `` . I have n't heard any women post abortion not consider it a `` human being `` . I have heard the term `` fetus `` more than `` baby `` . This could be because 1 . Eases their conscious or 2 . It 's a 'more correct ' scientifically phrase . ( up for debate with some ) With the women I 've talked to , if they 've had an `` early on `` abortion they feel less like it was a baby and more like it was an unknown that lacked personification b/c it lacked personality , they could n't feel it , they did n't `` show `` , they did n't allow themselves to name it , use their imagination over what kind of person it would grow up to be , etc . Denial ? Perhaps . I think it 's a choice they make in their best interests , and they have to come to terms with their conscience . If they can not come to terms with their conscience regarding having an abortion , then they have the child .""",DISAGREE,"""Those Who Abort Them Know Otherwise . I posted this on Youdebate , but as this is becoming more popular , I 'll post it here too . -- - So my question is this .""","""I believe that most women are n't in denial about what they are aborting . I have n't heard any women who have had an abortion call it `` a bunch of cells `` .""",,
23781,6309,"""I see no legal use handguns can fulfil""","""olympic sports are legal , and use handguns too .""",DISAGREE,"""I see no legal use handguns can fulfil""","""olympic sports are legal , and use handguns too .""",,
23797,6311,"""It would appear that it is the Brits , rather than  “ the Gun Nuts ” who  “ claim that when guns are banned people will just use knives instead ” . Apparently they have moved beyond knives and are simply using whatever tool is available to commit violent crime . They are succeeding at a rate nearly 5 times that of the US `` gun culture `` .""","""You ca n't accuse others of 'slight ( sic ) of hand ' and then produce this ! The same Home Office survey you linked to shows : 17 % of total violent crime was 'common assault with NO injury ' ( i.e . pushing and shoving , spitting at someone or verbal abuse ) 43 % was 'common assault with less serious injury ' ( e.g , a scuffle outside a bar ) 20 % were 'harrassment - no injuries suffered . 5 % were 'other violent crimes ' including carrying a weapon . Only 2.1 % of all violent crime led to a serious injury . The weapon most commonly used is , of course , the fist - in 78 % of all cases . In order to make this comparison make any sense we need to know how the FBI defines violent crime .""",DISAGREE,"""They are succeeding at a rate nearly 5 times that of the US ``""","""You ca n't accuse others of 'slight ( sic ) of hand ' and then produce this !""",,
23798,6312,"""[ Jesus said : ]  “ If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother , his wife and children , his brothers and sisters – yes , even his own life – he can not be my disciple. ” ( Luke 14:26 )""","""And for the other quote in Luke , in other translations , it says despise . Despise : To regard as unworthy of one 's interest or concern . And that has to be what Jesus meant because John 13:34 says , `` A new command I give you : Love one another . As I have loved you , so you must love one another. `` In other words , you have to love God more than you love your family . Here 's how the message translation puts it ( correctly ) : Luke 14:26 `` Anyone who comes to me but refuses to let go of father , mother , spouse , children , brothers , sisters - yes , even one 's own self ! - ca n't be my disciple. `` Mark 12:28 , `` One of the teachers of the Law came and heard them debating . Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer , he asked Him , 'Of all the commandments , which is the most important ? ' 'The most important one , ' answered Jesus , 'is this : hear , oh , Israel , the Lord our God , the Lord is One . Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength . The second is this : love your neighbor as yourself . There is no commandment greater than these . ' ''""",DISAGREE,"""[ Jesus said : ]  If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother , his wife and children""","""Luke 14:26 `` Anyone who comes to me but refuses to let go of father , mother , spouse , children , brothers , sisters - yes , even one 's own self ! - ca n't be my""",,
23805,6313,"""Where abortion is concerned , `` I ' did not start to exist before I did so mentally ( which would have been sometime in the third trimester ) .""","""This , in a way , is another moral proclamation . You feel mental existence is of importance for existing ( or being of value ) . I 'm not saying that is wrong or bad ( well ... I do say that but just not right now ) but it is a moral stance .""",DISAGREE,"""Where abortion is concerned , `` I ' did not start to exist before I did so mentally ( which would have been sometime in the third trimester ) .""","""This , in a way , is another moral proclamation . You feel mental existence is of importance for existing ( or being of value ) . I 'm not saying that is wrong or bad ( well ... I do say that but just not right now ) but it is a moral stance .""",,
23821,6315,"""yet cancer cells are not a human being ... good fallacy though . A unique group of cells with a unique DNA would be a human being though ( assuming human DNA ) .... such as the embryo . You also have it backwards ... giving people the right to live is an american value .... taking away the want to kill someone is an american value .""","""Yet to the woman the fetus is nothing more then cancer . The fetus is in her body and still should remain HER choice . Until someone comes up with a way for a fetus to live outside the body , without help , then it is nothing more then cancer and a parasite on the womans body . How about a compromise on this issue MEN should not have a say or decision about abortion and we all leave any legal desions to women . Since this is a womans issue let them decide and males but out .""",DISAGREE,"""yet cancer cells are not a human being ... good fallacy though . A unique group of cells with a unique DNA""","""Yet to the woman the fetus is nothing more then cancer . The fetus is in her body and still should remain HER choice .""",,
23836,6317,"""I have to ask : do you seriously not know , or do you just want him to up and say it ?""","""Oh , I know what he is trying to establish there . I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish . Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen ( according to him ) . In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""",DISAGREE,"""I have to ask : do you seriously not know , or do you just want him to up and say it ?""","""I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish . Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen""",,
23842,6317,"""I have to ask : do you seriously not know , or do you just want him to up and say it ?""","""Oh , I know what he is trying to establish there . I do want him to own up and admit what he is trying to establish . Do n't expect him to , but hey , `` miracles `` happen ( according to him ) . In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""",DISAGREE,"""do you seriously not know""","""Oh own up admit `` In fact as a return question does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish existence Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""",,
23843,6318,"""originally posted by archangel : this woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , personally , i think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""+1 .............""",AGREE,"""originally posted by archangel : this woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , personally , i think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation""","""+1 .............""",,
23845,6318,"""originally posted by archangel : this woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , personally , i think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""+1 .............""",AGREE,"""this woman is a jerk""","""+1 .............""",,
23847,6318,"""originally posted by archangel : this woman is a jerk and feels so entitled because she 's black , personally , i think some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals who want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation .""","""+1 .............""",AGREE,"""jerk entitled black some of the worst racists are the flaming liberals want to keep blacks content on their government-paid plantation""","""+1""",,
23868,6320,"""Btw it 's a town of 2000 people .""","""Only 2,000 people ? Is that so ? How many have to die as a result of this bad policy before we get our dander up and start calling for changes ?""",AGREE,"""Btw it 's a town of 2000 people .""","""Only 2,000 people ?""",,
23869,6321,"""Euthanization is actually a word that we use in the scientific community .""","""Is that the part of the scientific community that quotes Dr. Seuss ? Maybe if you ever said something closely resembling science , that would approach being a believable statement . Chloe , being a receptionist in a vet 's office does n't really qualify .""",DISAGREE,"""Euthanization is actually a word that we use in the scientific community .""","""Is that the part of the scientific community that quotes Dr. Seuss ? Maybe if you ever said something closely resembling science , that would approach being a believable statement .""",,
23883,6322,"""If the Brady Campaign wishes to claim that they do n't want to restrict citizen access to firearms , then they had no business supporting the DC handgun ban in the first place , or referring to its overturning as `` judicial activism at its worst ! ``""","""Well you know they are lying when they say that they do n't want to restrict citizen access .""",DISAGREE,"""If the Brady Campaign wishes to claim that they do n't want to restrict citizen access to firearms ,""","""Well you know they are lying when they say that they do n't want to restrict citizen access .""",,
23898,6324,"""Seven thousand two hundred thirty-four . If Chicago is your home , that number tells you something about your city , and police say it 's not necessarily good . As CBS 2 's Kristyn Hartman reports , there have been 7,234 guns recovered or confiscated by Chicago Police so far this year . When you think about it , that 's about one gun for every 400 people , in a city with an ordinance that prohibits them . Chicagoan Robert Herbert hears gunshots all the time in his neighborhood . He says lots of people have them . '' All the time , every day , yesterday , the day before yesterday , `` Herbert said . Police are finding some of the guns . '' So far year to date , there 's been seven thousand , two hundred and thirty four firearms recovered in Chicago , `` said Deputy Chicago Police Chief Nick Roti . Roti says the number , which is up , really tells the tale of two cities . One is the mean streets story . '' Guns are found in parks , under porches , `` Roti said . The other is the safer streets story . '' The good news is we 're recovering the guns , `` he said . '' I think people are getting fed up with public violence , It 's evidenced by reporting of it. `` Roti says increased search warrants net guns . Buybacks , patrol stops and putting cops in the right places also net guns . Police say most of what they recover comes from south of the Stevenson Expressway , generally the South Side of Chicago , in neighborhoods like Englewood . There , gangs , drugs and firearms all seem to go together . Herbert is happy with the work , but he fears the guns are replaced as quickly as they are removed . If it were legal , he says he 'd have one for protection . When asked if there is a justification for carrying a weapon , Roti said : `` Not really for me to say . It 's against the law in Chicago. `` National Rifle Association Legislative Liaison Todd Vandermyde said if people were allowed to have a weapon for self-defense , it would `` absolutely `` deter crime . '' But Chicago has put its citizens in victimization mode , because they have n't allowed them the use of self-defense , `` he said . '' The only guys carrying guns on the streets are the bad guys. `` The city 's 27-year-old handgun ban is under court challenge . Meanwhile , police hope to challenge street violence with a provision waiting for Gov . Pat Quinn 's signature . It would mean gang members caught with guns would spend a mandatory three years behind bars . The ordinance would be named after Alex Valadez , a Chicago Police Officer who was killed .""","""So Chicago has a total handgun ban , no exceptions for anyone except politicians with influence . Gangs are routinely armed with Chicago-illegal weaponry . The number of weapons has recovered has jumped to 7,000+ just for this year . And apparently Chicago thinks it knows better than the federal government . They 're not playing ball with the mandatory five year prison sentence that armed criminals are supposed to face .""",DISAGREE,"""Seven thousand two hundred Kristyn Hartman reports ,""","""Chicago has a total handgun ban Gangs are routinely armed""",,
23905,6325,"""But psychologically speaking , a first trimester fetus is not a being since it lacks sentience . DNA is all it takes to confirm that something is human ; like your fingernail pairings .""","""This is the argument concerning 'choice ' that , to me , rings untrue and is a potential weak point . The whole 'when does life begin/when is it human ? ' is n't where those that favor woman 's rights should stake their claim . I support a woman 's right to control her body and I feel that one of the best ways to 'judge ' a culture is to see how they treat women . I think that it is imperative to allow a women to control her body , regardless of when life begins , etc ... Now I also abhor abortions and I extol responsibility . However , # $ % ( happens and a woman MUST be able to retain the ability to decide what to do in the event of an unexpected pregnancy . Now , considering responsibility important , I can understand and appreciate time limits and whatnot , because that is humane . But we should call a spade a spade ... a fetus is or will be human and an abortion does 'kill ' it . Its horrible that it happens , but we have to allow women that right .""",DISAGREE,"""psychologically speaking DNA is all it takes to confirm that""","""rings untrue and is a potential weak point considering responsibility important""",,
23932,6328,"""But the point you miss is that a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly ; a puppy is NOT a full grown dog ; a ZYGOTE and a FETUS are NOT children .""","""No , the point was you said that `` noting grows into anything else `` , and I proved otherwise .""",DISAGREE,"""a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly ; a puppy is NOT a full grown dog ; a ZYGOTE and a FETUS are NOT children""","""No , the point was you said that `` noting grows into anything else `` , and I proved otherwise .""",,
23944,6336,"""That is an incorrect statement . Viability seems to be the topic that gets little mention here . Humanity , consciousness , personhood , sentience , etc . are all extremely debatable , as has been demonstrated , sometimes ad nauseam .""","""To you , it may be an incorrect statement . But if it is , you have to tell me what it is you kill and take the life away from when you abort the zygote . Not knowing if it is being killed or not knowing someone wants to kill it makes no difference . Injustice is still practiced there , and not even some abortion doctors realize it .""",DISAGREE,"""That is an incorrect statement . Viability seems to be the topic that gets little mention here . Humanity , consciousness , personhood , sentience , etc . are all extremely debatable , as has been demonstrated , sometimes ad nauseam .""","""To you , it may be an incorrect statement . But if it is , you have to tell me what it is you kill and take the life away from when you abort the""",,
23978,6342,"""I made the same mistake .""","""No , this is not about abortion , and I think that is very clear . If I wanted to discuss abortion , then I would mosey on along to the abortion forum and post there . The point about abortion that I brought up is that it questions the premise offered by thelmoose with respect to juvenile development . In fact , this point was made in the dissent of a Supreme Court opinion dealing with executing juvenile offenders . On the one hand , it is argued that juveniles do posses enough moral maturity to be able to have the same right to abortion as an adult , but on the other hand , it is argued that they do not posses enough moral maturity to be able to be held to the same standard as adults when it comes to the decision to commit cold blooded murder . For your convenience , I underlined the key parts . We have here two contradictory statements . That is what I was pointing out .""",DISAGREE,"""I made the same mistake .""","""If I wanted to discuss abortion , then I would mosey on along to the abortion forum and post there .""",,
24015,6348,"""It is my understanding that the number of states that have amendments banning same-sex marriage is now at 19 . Even California is working on it . The number of states that have laws that ban it is 33 . ( Maybe more now ; that number was from early 2004 ) I think gay 'rights ' lobbyists would do well to start realizing that marriage really matters a lot to the majority of people in this country , and to realize that they are treading on an institution that is traditionally and fundamentally opposite-sex by nature and definition . The number of states not allowing gay marriage is on the rise dramatically , since gay activists began pushing things so strongly in the last few years . The more gay people push to redefine marriage , the harder they are going to make it for themselves .""","""No , that 's a myth . The less gay rights activists push for complete equality , the less they are going to get . People do justify banning civil unions as well as marriage because `` gays deserve it for pushing so hard toward marriage `` . Of course , that logic is horrible , for people do not deserve to be punished because they 've asked for equal rights . But regardless , if gay rights activists asked for only civil unions , then people would feel just as obligated to suggest a compromise between civil unions and no unions , then they would feel obligated in banning that too , because gay people should n't have been pushing for civil unions . If we do not push for complete equality , there will never be complete equality , and no matter how many states decide to ban it , things will never change if this fight does not happen .""",DISAGREE,"""The more gay people push to redefine marriage , the harder they are going to make it for themselves .""","""No , that 's a myth The less gay rights activists push for complete equality , the less they are going to get . justify banning civil unions as well as marriage `` gays deserve it for pushing so hard toward marriage `` people do not deserve to be punished because they 've asked for equal rights . If we do not push for complete equality , there will never be complete equality ,""",,
24024,6364,"""-A record of those who have had/or have mental illnesses . This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""But on the other hand , you are willing to violate a person 's right to privacy ( medical records ) in order to limit their access to firearms . Which right is more important ? - Your right to privacy or your right to own a machine gun ?""",DISAGREE,"""record of those who have had/or have mental illnesses . This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""But on the other hand , you are willing to violate a person 's right to privacy ( medical records ) in order to limit their access to firearms . Which right is more important ? - Your right to privacy or your right to own a machine gun ?""",,
24025,6364,"""-A record of those who have had/or have mental illnesses . This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""But on the other hand , you are willing to violate a person 's right to privacy ( medical records ) in order to limit their access to firearms . Which right is more important ? - Your right to privacy or your right to own a machine gun ?""",DISAGREE,"""record of those who have had/or have mental illnesses . This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""But on the other hand , you are willing to violate a person 's right to privacy ( medical records ) in order to limit their access to firearms .""",,
24028,6364,"""-A record of those who have had/or have mental illnesses . This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""But on the other hand , you are willing to violate a person 's right to privacy ( medical records ) in order to limit their access to firearms . Which right is more important ? - Your right to privacy or your right to own a machine gun ?""",DISAGREE,"""This is perfectly reasonable , but it also requires the help of the citizens to help the person in need .""","""Your right to privacy or your right to own a machine gun ?""",,
24031,6365,"""Do you attempt to improve your collection by selling a firearm that another hobbyist wants and then reinvesting in the & # 8220 ; latest firearm or piece of gear & # 8221 ; found in your favorite gun magazine ? Have you ever had to liquidate some of your collection to finance a project that was very important to you or your family ? FBI Special Agent John Shipley has been indicted by a Federal Grand Jury in El Paso , Texas for buying and selling firearms without a license . What the government does not understand is that the personal sale of a firearm is NOT illegal . The Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide clearly states that a & # 8220 ; Dealer is defined as : & # 8220 ; ( c ) Dealer in firearms other than a gunsmith or a pawnbroker . A person who devotes time , attention , and labor to dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade or business with the principal objective of livelihood and profit through the repetitive purchase and resale of firearms , but such a term shall not include a person who makes occasional sales , exchanges , or purchases of firearms for the enhancement of a personal collection or for a hobby , or who sells all or part of his personal collection of firearms. & # 8221 ; Since John & # 8217 ; s livelihood is as a Special Agent of the Federal Bureau of Investigation ( FBI ) his life is dedicated to upholding and enforcing the laws of the United States of America . His grandparents sparked his interest in firearms and had even contributed to his collection . But after qualifying for a SWAT team and becoming a sniper for the FBI , his interests and guns began to more closely line up with his needs and wants to become a firearms instructor for the FBI . In most cases , a crime is committed and justice searches for the person that committed the crime . But in this case , justice has found a person and they are searching for a crime to pin upon him . Having a personal collection of firearms , ammunition , and related items is NOT Illegal . Reading firearms magazines , belonging to a gun club and frequently going to the firing range is also NOT Illegal . Buying and selling guns to improve or enhance a personal collection or to even liquidate a part or all of a collection is NOT Illegal . So why is John Shipley being accused of selling firearms without a license , when a license is not required ? I guess we will have to watch this case very closely , because if an FBI Special Agent can be targeted , any gun enthusiast could be next !""","""An FBI agent of all people , the federal standard of police and law enforcement !""",AGREE,"""FBI Special Agent John Shipley has been indicted by a Federal Grand Jury in El Paso , Texas for buying and selling firearms without a license .""","""An FBI agent of all people , the federal standard of police and law enforcement !""",,
24071,6374,"""Why do some of you guys insist on being rabid haters of anyone who cares about the enviroment . The question is n't why do these people care about the enviroment , it 's WHY DO N'T YOU ? ?""","""Not sure who this was aimed at or even what it 's based on , but like Duo Maxwell , I do n't have a problem with those that are pro-environment , I consider myself pro-environment . What I do have a problem with is misinformation and extremism . There 's too much of both coming out of the `` pro-environment `` camp these days IMHO . Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""you guys insist on being rabid haters of anyone who cares about the enviroment""","""I do n't have a problem with those that are pro-environment , I consider myself pro-environment""",,
24081,6376,"""Secondly , why would it matter to you about someone trying to define God , who paradoxically , is be definition , undefinable ?""","""By definition is undefinable ? So then God you can not claim that god is : loving , good , omnipotent , ominiscent , etc .... Or do you claim such . Again I ask you describe what it is that you believe in ? Is your answer than you believe in the undefinable of which you do not know any further ?""",DISAGREE,"""Secondly , why would it matter to you about someone trying to define God , who paradoxically , is be definition , undefinable ?""","""By definition is undefinable ?""",,
24101,6380,"""Thus , 'virtually ' . I am familiar with KY and IN legalistics . But , your point is taken . The slack can also be covered for by the adoptor of the child on a case by case basis .""","""But it does go to show that addressing the reasons will do more than condemnation or criminalization . Not sure where you stand on those issues - but I am a strong proponent of doing more of this as a way to address abortion . All kinds of energy goes into the legalities . I think there are so many ways that both sides could work together .""",AGREE,"""I am familiar with KY and IN legalistics .""","""I think there are so many ways that both sides could work together .""",,
24127,6384,"""such as how did we get here .""","""But the Bible provides very little detail that can be reconciled with reality . Two myths do n't actually answer many questions .""",DISAGREE,"""such as how did we get here .""","""the Bible provides very little detail that can be reconciled with reality""",,
24132,6385,"""how is either Genesis 1 or 2 in error ? it looks to me as though Gen 1 is an overview of the creation week , and Gen 2 brings the specific creation of man and woman into focus . how is that error ? maybe I dont see it ...""","""Because both have different creation orders . Even if chapter 2 is 'specific ' that does n't even address the problem that the OP presented . Basically , what is the order of creation-chapter 1 or 2 ? Please justify your answer .""",DISAGREE,"""it looks to me as though Gen 1 is an overview of the creation week , and Gen 2 brings the specific""","""Even if chapter 2 is 'specific ' that does n't even address the problem that the OP presented .""",,
24135,6386,"""It 's even worth pointing out that many of them occurred in officially Christian countries , such as Germany , Poland and Tzarist Russia , or devoutly Islamic countries such as Pakistan -- and all these for religious reasons that had nothing to do with atheism .""","""And yet all were done mainly by atheistic leaders whose atheism gave them the framework to justify what they were doing .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's even worth pointing out that many of them occurred in officially Christian countries , such as Germany , Poland and Tzarist Russia , or devoutly Islamic countries such as Pakistan and all these for religious reasons that had nothing to do with atheism .""","""And yet all were done mainly by atheistic leaders whose atheism gave them the framework to justify what they were doing .""",,
24146,6388,"""Of course we can ignore all the emotional and physical problems women lose when terminating a pregnancy .""","""And we can ignore the fact that a women 's body is designed for birth ( yes , I used the word `` designed `` , which many evolutionists use for the lack of a better term ) . We can also ignore personal responsibility for conscious decisions that lead to a pregnancy . Just keep ignoring and see where it gets us .""",DISAGREE,"""physical problems women lose when terminating a pregnancy .""","""personal responsibility for conscious decisions that lead to a pregnancy . Just keep ignoring and see where it gets us .""",,
24152,6389,"""Do you know the story of Jonah . God told him that he would destroy a city unless they repented . Jonah went to that city and preached that they all faced destruction . Then God took mercy upon them after they had repented . Jonah felt like he looked like a fool , because he promised punishment and retribution and none happened ... Why did n't you include this as an example of a 'failed ' prophecy as you are determined to take things out of contect .""","""My list was simply one off of a website . I 've read through the Bible once but ca n't say that I was able to pick out flaws in it through my own reading . I was glad to see that someone with much more time and a keener eye was able to list out a few valid flaws on those websites . I remember the story that you speak of only vaguely . I suppose I should look it up and read it again if you could mention the passage . Anyways , the way you describe it , Jonah went to the cities , gave them a warning , they repented which canceled the warning , and therefore nothing happened just like God said . Jonah may have felt stupid , but the story makes perfect sense . All the loose ends are tied up . I guess you will have to expand on why you believe this is a failed prophecy .""",AGREE,"""Jonah felt like he looked like a fool , because he promised punishment and retribution and none happened ...""","""Jonah may have felt stupid , but the story makes perfect sense""",,
24153,6390,"""From one of the cited papers : Third , while previous analyses suggest that the canonical code outperforms most alternatives , a comprehensive search of possible code structures suggests that far better alternatives are possible ( Wong 1980Citation ; DiGiulio 1989 , 1994Citation ; Goldman 1993Citation ) Early Fixation of an Optimal Genetic Code -- Freeland et al . 17 ( 4 ) : 511 -- Molecular Biology and Evolution That , and the fact that the genetic code varies a bit in some kingdoms , pretty much rules out the notion of an `` optimal code. ``""","""Bare in mind they only conluded that after taking one parameter into consideration .""",AGREE,"""one of the cited papers the canonical code outperforms most alternatives""","""Bare in mind only conluded that""",,
24159,6391,"""That 's incorrect . The Constitution begins with Article 1 which does not contain the Bill of Rights . The Constitution contains seven articles which are followed by the Bill of Rights and the rest of the amendments . If you really are from England as you claim then I guess your lack of knowledge about the American Constitution is understandable .""","""We call that an evasion tactic . That 's not the main point .""",DISAGREE,"""The Constitution contains seven articles which are followed by the Bill of Rights""","""We call that an evasion tactic . That 's not the main point .""",,
24166,6392,"""The militia of the Second Amendment is a militia that is described as being well regulated ( regulated by both the federal government and the states as spoken of in Article 1 of the Constitution ) . In our own day , I think the National Guard would be the only militia that qualifies as being well regulated . Alexander Hamilton spoke of the desirability of the militia being well regulated : `` It requires no skill in the science of war to discern that uniformity in the organization and discipline of the militia would be attended with the most beneficial effects , whenever they were called into service for the public defense . It would enable them to discharge the duties of the camp and of the field with mutual intelligence and concert an advantage of peculiar moment in the operations of an army ; and it would fit them much sooner to acquire the degree of proficiency in military functions which would be essential to their usefulness . This desirable uniformity can only be accomplished by confiding the regulation of the militia to the direction of the national authority . It is , therefore , with the most evident propriety , that the plan of the convention proposes to empower the Union `` to provide for organizing , arming , and disciplining the militia , and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States , RESERVING TO THE STATES RESPECTIVELY THE APPOINTMENT OF THE OFFICERS , AND THE AUTHORITY OF TRAINING THE MILITIA ACCORDING TO THE DISCIPLINE PRESCRIBED BY CONGRESS. `` The Federalist Papers - THOMAS ( Library of Congress ) We could go back to the days when most citizens were required to enroll in the militia , have guns and get military training- to what the Founders really meant when they spoke of a well regulated militia being the security of a free state . But the Supreme Court along with pro-gun activists claiming to be pro- Second Amendment have decided to turn their back on that part of the Second Amendment while giving the lip service to the idea of a militia .""","""These official groups are jokes . Armed citizens are much more effective .""",DISAGREE,"""The militia of the Second Amendment is a militia that is described as being well regulated""","""These official groups are jokes . Armed citizens are much more effective .""",,
24190,6397,"""The genetic code has the remarkable property of error minimization , whereby the arrangement of amino acids to codons is highly efficient at reducing the deleterious effects of random point mutations and transcriptional and translational errors . Whether this property has been explicitly selected for is unclear . Here , three scenarios of genetic code evolution are examined , and their effects on error minimization assessed . First , a simple model of random stepwise addition of physicochemically similar amino acids to the code is demonstrated to result in substantial error minimization . Second , a model of random addition of physicochemically similar amino acids in a codon expansion scheme derived from the Ambiguity Reduction Model results in improved error minimization over the first model . Finally , a recently introduced 213 Model of genetic code evolution is examined by the random addition of physicochemically similar amino acids to a primordial core of four amino acids . Under certain conditions , 22 % of the resulting codes produced according to the latter model possess equivalent or superior error minimization to the standard genetic code . These analyses demonstrate that a substantial proportion of error minimization is likely to have arisen neutrally , simply as a consequence of code expansion , facilitated by duplication of the genes encoding adaptor molecules and charging enzymes . This implies that selection is at best only partly responsible for the property of error minimization . These results caution against assuming that selection is responsible for every beneficial trait observed in living organisms .""","""Also form the article :""",DISAGREE,"""The genetic code has the remarkable property of error minimization ,""","""Also form the article :""",,
24201,6413,"""Life is not chaotic it is orderly and requires replication . Without this you just have a lot of chemicals mixing in an infinite variety . The reason that life must be derived from life ( biogenesis ) in the minds of most is that this is the only way we have ever seen it happen . '' You can imagine anything you like but you can only understand the truth `` as Newton said . Now if amino acids are the mirror image of nucleic acid sugars and this in true of all living things then we are limited to this as fundamental to life . This in my opinion is the fundamental first step and it can not happen peicemeal , it all has to happen all at once .""","""Another critical error . Evolution does n't say life is chaotic . Mutations are random , not natural selection or evolution . It 's a heavily guided process . We have already shown that the primary building blocks of life can be simulated and created . These formed into molecules and cells and so on . They can even explain how the human eye developled -- a recent discovery . It was an extention of light sensitive cells .""",DISAGREE,"""The reason that life must be derived from life ( biogenesis )""","""Mutations are random , not natural selection or evolution .""",,
24204,6414,"""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that heroin addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana .""","""Heh ? That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""",DISAGREE,"""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that heroin addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana .""","""Heh ? That 's news to""",,
24208,6414,"""Nah , it is a gateway in the fact that heroin addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends of yours that supply the marijuana .""","""Heh ? That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""",DISAGREE,"""addicts and crack addicts are in the same room and are the same friends""","""That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while""",,
24214,6415,"""I disagree . If there were 500,000 gay couples in the US today that wanted to get married and Uncle Sam said `` OK `` , instantly , 500,000 people who 5 minutes before had zero legal standing and NO chance of gaining any benefits as a married partner , with respects to SS , Medicare , gov't pensions , tax breaks , etc. , suddenly become stakeholders . I 'd call that the creation of a new class of dependent . To argue otherwise is to be in denial .""","""Well , to argue so reveals an ignorance of the meaning of the word `` class `` . There would be no new class , as there would be no new categories above . Would there be more members of the `` married `` class ? Yes . I thought you righties thought more married folks was a good thing ? ? ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""If there were 500,000 gay couples in the US today that wanted to get married""","""Would there be more members of the `` married `` class ?""",,
24216,6416,"""No-one experiences the existence of an outside world . Explanations such as the Matrix can explain sense impressions as well as some concept of 'external reality ' . We have no more evidence for one than the other . The fact no-one takes them seriously is a psychological point about human beings , nothing to do with reality per se . How is that based on experience ? We have no data that says 'an outside world exists ' . The assumption that such a world exists is made before we can use the data . But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""","""Lets put it another way then . If the world did not exist or did not run by the theories and laws presented by science , you would think that there would be SOME experience at SOME point in reliably recordeable human history that people had which would have shown this . Experience is the only interaction we have with existence . If some aspect of existence exists ( ex . some hypothetical parallel universe ) that never manifests itself in human experience then we have no way of knowing its existence . We can guess but our guesses , not being based on experience , are completely arbitrary . Given that there are a nearly infinite number of imaginary scenarios that we can think up , the probability of the reality of any of those scenarious is miniscule . One other point : Say that the laws of physics ( which are derived from mutual human experience ) are wrong but just appear to be right and that some omnipotent being can change them whenever he likes . If these apparent laws have remained the same for all of recorded human time , then why should we suspect that they may change at any moment ? It all comes down to probability - if things are not what we expect they are from Science , then that should have manifested itself by now .""",AGREE,"""No-one experiences the existence of an outside world .""","""Experience is the only interaction we have with existence""",,
24217,6416,"""No-one experiences the existence of an outside world . Explanations such as the Matrix can explain sense impressions as well as some concept of 'external reality ' . We have no more evidence for one than the other . The fact no-one takes them seriously is a psychological point about human beings , nothing to do with reality per se . How is that based on experience ? We have no data that says 'an outside world exists ' . The assumption that such a world exists is made before we can use the data . But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""","""Lets put it another way then . If the world did not exist or did not run by the theories and laws presented by science , you would think that there would be SOME experience at SOME point in reliably recordeable human history that people had which would have shown this . Experience is the only interaction we have with existence . If some aspect of existence exists ( ex . some hypothetical parallel universe ) that never manifests itself in human experience then we have no way of knowing its existence . We can guess but our guesses , not being based on experience , are completely arbitrary . Given that there are a nearly infinite number of imaginary scenarios that we can think up , the probability of the reality of any of those scenarious is miniscule . One other point : Say that the laws of physics ( which are derived from mutual human experience ) are wrong but just appear to be right and that some omnipotent being can change them whenever he likes . If these apparent laws have remained the same for all of recorded human time , then why should we suspect that they may change at any moment ? It all comes down to probability - if things are not what we expect they are from Science , then that should have manifested itself by now .""",AGREE,"""We have no more evidence for one than the other . The fact no-one takes them seriously""","""Given that there are a nearly infinite number of imaginary scenarios that we can think up ,""",,
24225,6417,"""U.S. guns arm Mexican drug cartels - Los Angeles Times""","""And how exactly do you explain the article mentioning the hand grenades and rocket launchers ? Are you saying that the average gun store has such items in stock ? Trigger 's link is much more accurate than yours is . Mexico Cartels Do n't Buy Assault Weapons from U.S. `` The next day I went into work and sat down with a trusted senior Mexican manager . I looked at him and said , `` I thought guns were illegal in Mexico. `` He chuckled and said , `` So you stayed in town last night ? `` As the conversation progressed , it became clear that guns are as common in Mexico as tamales at Christmas . Everyone he knows , including himself , own at least one gun . And , it matters not whether it 's a semi-auto or fully automatic , they 're all illegal , so why stop with semi-autos ? Though clearly illegal in the states in most instances , a lot of Mexicans have more firepower in terms of military weapons than we can only dream of owning here. `` '' These are not the so-called `` assault weapons `` you can buy at the local gun shop in the U.S. , but full select-fire military-issue rifles . Now , I know you want to know and are dying to ask ; Did I see any U.S. military-issue weapons stolen from the U.S. military ? Not a single one was marked with U.S. military markings . Everything was marked with additional foreign markings on the receiver , including M16 rifles , or they had nothing at all . I saw firearms manufactured in Europe , China , Russia and South America along with U.S. manufactured weapons . I saw rifles that looked familiar with no place of manufacture , no serial number or manufacturer 's logo . The information was not removed , it was never there to begin with . I can only assume they came from illegal arms manufacturers in India or Pakistan that produce copies of weapons . It was obvious that none of these firearms came from a U.S. gun shop in Tucson or San Diego . You could n't buy them from a gun shop in the states if you tried. `` '' Despite being able to own .22 caliber pistols or rifles , Mexican law requires them to be stored at an approved firing range . Where 's the firing range I asked many times ? No one knew of one . Where 's the gun stores in town to buy legal guns ? Gun stores ? No one ever recalled seeing one anywhere in Mexico , let alone their city. `` '' All this flies in the face of news articles published by the U.S. media in the last week or two . Mexico 's gun problems are a direct result of gun runners buying `` assault weapons `` in the U.S. and taking them into Mexico to arm drug cartels , says the U.S. media and government . That is a bunch of government and media nonsense . The cartels are n't arming themselves from U.S. gun stores with semi-auto AR15 and AK47 rifles . They 've moved on up. `` '' Cartels buy their arms from countries around the world , most any place where military weapons can be purchased on the black market , or from countries wishing to destabilize North America . They arm themselves from a worldwide black market of full auto military weapons including grenades , land mines and RPGs . They also `` procure `` their weapons from the less than savory from within the Mexican military. `` '' The drug cartels can easily afford to fly their weaponry into Mexico using their own fleet of aircraft on to remote airfields , or land them on remote Mexican shores from their fleet of vessels . They do it with drugs all of the time . Drug cartels buying semi-auto AR15 or AK rifles from U.S. gun dealers is viewed as a joke by Mexico 's drug cartel , most Mexicans , and unfortunately by the Mexican government . The only people fooled by all the political rhetoric are Americans listening to the likes of Attorney General Eric Holder and other anti-gun politicians. `` Latin American Herald Tribune - Mexico Arrests Cartel Hit Man in Execution of Army General `` In the operation , the Mexican army also seized 23 assault rifles , 20 handguns , 23 grenades , two grenade launchers , a rocket launcher , cartridges and ammunition clips , $ 42,000 worth of cash , six vehicles and radio equipment. `` Where the hell did the grenades and launchers come from ?""",DISAGREE,"""U.S. guns arm Mexican drug cartels - Los Angeles Times""","""the article mentioning the hand grenades and rocket launchers""",,
24230,6418,"""Basically this thread will talk about the following : Human rights and how they come to exist Reasons for human rights How human rights relate to abortion How morality deals with the issues of abortion What makes someone deserving of human rights""","""So , are you both still interesting in debating these topics ?""",AGREE,"""Human rights and how they come to exist Reasons for human rights How human rights relate to abortion""","""So , are you both still interesting in debating these topics ?""",,
24242,6420,"""See , here is the example of how .. out of touch you are . Of course it could be dangerous . I have not only been gay bashed once , but twice in my life . The first time coming out of a bar when I was in my early 20s . I was beaten by five guys with baseball bats . My head swelled 3 times it 's size and I was out cold for 4 days . I had `` nike `` imprinted into my skin from the bottom of their sneakers . The second time , I met a friend for dinner at a local bar . We met at about 7pm , had a drink and as we left the bar to go to a diner I was body slammed by two college kids running down the street . Broke my collar bone and was knocked out . When the owner of the bar came out he asked ... do you think this was a hate crime . We have been having some problems .""","""How long ago were those instances ? Things have changed a lot in my opinion , over the years .""",DISAGREE,"""Of course it could be dangerous . I have not only been gay bashed once , but twice in my life .""","""Things have changed a lot in my opinion , over the years .""",,
24250,6422,"""So what ? Most of them are still getting killed with guns . A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue . The basic idea is to `` win `` an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic . This sort of `` reasoning `` has the following form : 1 . Topic A is under discussion . 2 . Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A ( when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A ) . 3 . Topic A is abandoned .""","""You just committed one then ! Stick around brady , I reckon Bryan will be along directly ? Always ask yourself , what would MLK say .""",DISAGREE,"""getting killed with guns irrelevant topic divert attention""","""committed one""",,
24253,6422,"""So what ? Most of them are still getting killed with guns . A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue . The basic idea is to `` win `` an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic . This sort of `` reasoning `` has the following form : 1 . Topic A is under discussion . 2 . Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A ( when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A ) . 3 . Topic A is abandoned .""","""You just committed one then ! Stick around brady , I reckon Bryan will be along directly ? Always ask yourself , what would MLK say .""",DISAGREE,"""Most of them are still getting killed with guns . A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue .""","""You just committed one then ! Stick around brady""",,
24263,6424,"""You evolutionists are deluding yourselves if you think you 'll ever know the origin of DNA or anything else .""","""Really ? Can you support your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""You evolutionists are deluding yourselves if you think you 'll ever know the origin of DNA or anything else .""","""Can you support your point ?""",,
24262,6424,"""You evolutionists are deluding yourselves if you think you 'll ever know the origin of DNA or anything else .""","""Really ? Can you support your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""You evolutionists are deluding yourselves if you think you 'll ever know the origin of DNA or anything else .""","""Can you support your point ?""",,
24294,6444,"""Well , at least they 're trying to do it the right way , instead of finding some biased judges to render them some ruling .""","""Of course , since this has never happened , you really do n't need to worry about it that much .""",AGREE,"""at least they 're trying to do it the right way ,""","""Of course , since this has never happened , do n't need to worry about it""",,
24298,6444,"""Well , at least they 're trying to do it the right way , instead of finding some biased judges to render them some ruling .""","""Of course , since this has never happened , you really do n't need to worry about it that much .""",AGREE,"""at least they 're trying to do it the right way , instead of finding some biased judges to render them some ruling .""","""since this has never happened , you really do n't need to worry about it that much .""",,
24299,6445,"""Look around . Faith did not spontaneously generate out of thin air . It is obviously part of our psyche . Every civilization throughout history has felt the need for some type of faith . Even on different sides of the planet . It 's as natural as the sun rising .""","""But what about the hypothetical ? I ca n't think of a single child on this planet that has never been exposed to the ideas of the supernatural . So , what I was asking is whether faith is nature or nurture . That 's why I brought up kids being afraid of the dark , likely no matter what anyone tells them . I think it 's this fear of the unknown linked to the `` logical `` brain of a human that possibly creates this need for explanations . But faith involves specifics , so when the specifics are filled in and `` make sense `` to more than one person , these specific `` explanations `` can be passed down . So I do n't know how much of faith is nature and how much is nurture .""",DISAGREE,"""Look around . Faith did not spontaneously generate out of thin air .""","""But what about the hypothetical ? ``""",,
24300,6445,"""Look around . Faith did not spontaneously generate out of thin air . It is obviously part of our psyche . Every civilization throughout history has felt the need for some type of faith . Even on different sides of the planet . It 's as natural as the sun rising .""","""But what about the hypothetical ? I ca n't think of a single child on this planet that has never been exposed to the ideas of the supernatural . So , what I was asking is whether faith is nature or nurture . That 's why I brought up kids being afraid of the dark , likely no matter what anyone tells them . I think it 's this fear of the unknown linked to the `` logical `` brain of a human that possibly creates this need for explanations . But faith involves specifics , so when the specifics are filled in and `` make sense `` to more than one person , these specific `` explanations `` can be passed down . So I do n't know how much of faith is nature and how much is nurture .""",DISAGREE,"""Look around . Faith did not spontaneously generate out of thin air . It is obviously part of our psyche .""","""But what about the hypothetical ? So , what I was asking is whether faith is nature or nurture . ``""",,
24318,6455,"""How corrupt are you to claim I am lying when you have never supported or proven the original claim""","""You mean the whole `` seabed `` issue you deliberately wish to avoid ? You ever going to get around to how YEC does n't make any sense with oil and gas exploration ?""",DISAGREE,"""How corrupt are you to claim I am lying when you have never supported or proven the original claim""","""You mean the whole `` seabed `` issue you deliberately wish to avoid ? You ever going to get around to how YEC does n't make any sense with oil and gas exploration ?""",,
24338,6459,"""( Playing devil 's advocate ) And , by what authority would you deny a woman 's `` right to choose `` an abortion that happens to be `` late in her pregnancy ? ``""","""Thats a very good question . To be honest - I would prefer no legislation period - but I would not get up in arms about a late term restriction like I described because 1 ) a fetus could very well survive outside of the mom at that point , 2 ) most reputable doctors wo n't conduct an abortion at that stage without a legitimate medical reason anyway .""",DISAGREE,"""And , by what authority would you deny a woman 's `` right to choose `` an abortion that happens to be `` late in her pregnancy ? ``""","""a fetus could very well survive outside of the mom at that point , 2 ) most reputable doctors wo n't conduct an abortion at that stage without a legitimate medical reason anyway .""",,
24346,6460,"""Already provided above .""","""Not hardly . Show where they initiated it . Your first link showed it to be a reaction to the initiation done by evolutionists .""",DISAGREE,"""Already provided above .""","""Not hardly . Show where they initiated it .""",,
24350,6461,"""No I listened , but I was wondering what others had to say . I do n't know how old you are nor if you can remember that stuff about life coming from non-life experiment that was being done . In the end I think they ended up producing some amenio acids .""","""You are perhaps thinking of the Miller-Urrey experiment . No one expected life to appear . They were merely curious about what would happen if they simulated the conditions of the early Earth . Since then , we 've found pretty much the same thing in the interior of stony meteorites , including an excess of L-forms . So , it 's confirmed the findings of Miller-Urey . None of this has anything to do with evolution , however . Evolution is the change in allele frequencies over time . This happens in populations ; individuals do n't evolve . Everything else in evolution is an elaboration of this phenomenon .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't know how old you are nor if you can remember that stuff about life coming from non-life experiment that was being done .""","""experiment . So , it 's confirmed the findings of Miller-Urey None of this has anything to do with evolution , however . Evolution is the change in allele frequencies over time . This happens in populations ; individuals do n't evolve .""",,
24354,6461,"""No I listened , but I was wondering what others had to say . I do n't know how old you are nor if you can remember that stuff about life coming from non-life experiment that was being done . In the end I think they ended up producing some amenio acids .""","""You are perhaps thinking of the Miller-Urrey experiment . No one expected life to appear . They were merely curious about what would happen if they simulated the conditions of the early Earth . Since then , we 've found pretty much the same thing in the interior of stony meteorites , including an excess of L-forms . So , it 's confirmed the findings of Miller-Urey . None of this has anything to do with evolution , however . Evolution is the change in allele frequencies over time . This happens in populations ; individuals do n't evolve . Everything else in evolution is an elaboration of this phenomenon .""",DISAGREE,"""No I listened , but I was wondering what others had to say . I do n't know how old you are nor if you can remember that stuff about life coming from non-life experiment that was being""","""They were merely curious about what would happen if they simulated the conditions of the early Earth . Since then , we 've found pretty much the same thing in the interior of stony meteorites , including an excess of L-forms .""",,
24365,6464,"""When asked why did the scientific world leap at the Origin of the Species , `` [ I suppose the reason ] we jump at the Origin was because the idea of God interfered with our sexual mores. `` Sir Julian Huxley""","""evolution is prefered because its immoral""",DISAGREE,"""the idea of God interfered with our sexual""","""evolution is prefered because its immoral""",,
24391,6477,"""`` Does a gunbuyback Work ? Do Bears # # # # in the Woods ?""","""So you think the money spent on gun buybacks was better spent there than on say , more hospitals , medical equipment or doctors ?""",DISAGREE,"""Does a gunbuyback Work ?""","""So you think the money spent on gun buybacks was better spent""",,
24399,6479,"""The whole `` change the definition of marriage `` is mainly a scare tactic used by anti-gay religious bigots . They do n't seem to realize that words can have several meanings .""","""Funny how they never claimed that naming a computer pointing device a `` mouse `` was blasphemous to Mickey .""",AGREE,"""tactic used by anti-gay religious bigots . words can have several meanings .""","""Funny how they never claimed naming a computer pointing device a `` mouse `` was blasphemous to""",,
24403,6479,"""The whole `` change the definition of marriage `` is mainly a scare tactic used by anti-gay religious bigots . They do n't seem to realize that words can have several meanings .""","""Funny how they never claimed that naming a computer pointing device a `` mouse `` was blasphemous to Mickey .""",AGREE,"""change the definition of marriage words can have several meanings .""","""they never claimed that naming a computer pointing device""",,
24404,6480,"""Also , if the Christian worldview is against rape , why does Moses say that Yahweh allows the Israelites to take the virgin children of the Midianites captive to do with what they would in Numbers 31 ?""","""Well , first , those were Hebrews , not Christians . Secondly , the scripture does n't say they raped them , it says `` keep them for yourselves. `` That could mean rape , however , I 'm pretty sure that was not Moses 's intention . Also , the Hebrews considered it impure to lie with non-Hebrew women or men , so if there was any sexual immorality going on it was very small . However , that DOES N'T mean it was justified or right .""",DISAGREE,"""Moses say that Yahweh allows the Israelites to take the virgin children of the Midianites""","""the Hebrews considered it impure to lie with non-Hebrew women or men""",,
24417,6482,"""But I do take offence at you characterizing my ability to reason logically and to think with some originality as being nothing more than 'manipulation ' and sophistry .""","""The value of logical reasoning is dependent upon your axioms . Highly religious people are no less capable of reasoning logically than anyone else - but the unshakeable axiom that their personal version of god really exists enters into every equation . For you , one axiom is the existence of Vitality ; volition made quantifiable , and the other is that darwinian evolution must be wrong and worthless in every respect . There is no logical reason for you to deride NS the way you do ; it 's an integral part of any evolutionary theory that seeks to explain the big picture of how the organisms we see around us came to be ; the occurrence of mutations , volitional or otherwise is not enough on its own . But your axioms prevent you from incorporating it into EAM and getting on with your life .""",DISAGREE,"""my ability to reason logically and to think with some originality as being nothing more than 'manipulation ' and sophistry .""","""There is no logical reason for you to deride NS the way you do""",,
24419,6483,"""If a woman does not want to be pregnant , she can abstain from sex . It works !""","""She could , but not all do Despite the fact that it works , there are still unwanted pregnancies That does n't change the fact that a pregnancy would not be pleasant to a woman who does not want to be pregnant Forcing pregnancy by law is a step toward fascism .""",DISAGREE,"""woman want to be pregnant abstain from sex""","""Despite the fact that it works a pregnancy would not be pleasant""",,
24431,6485,"""You gather information from other forums , then use it as bait on yet another forum ? Exactly how many forums do you belong to ? I would hope you would n't be too surprised that others sometimes ignore you . Is this your main activity in life ?""","""Actually other forums have intelligent people adding new products . Frankly , I just consolidating their posts . Amusingly , I have yet to find a single creationist who can offer a single tangible , non-print product . If your belief was true , why is there absolutely no commercialization of it aside from books and print related material ? Maybe because your belief is absolute total garbage ?""",DISAGREE,"""Exactly how many forums do you belong to ? I would hope you would n't be too surprised that others sometimes""","""Amusingly , I have yet to find a single creationist who can offer a single tangible , non-print product .""",,
24438,6486,"""from there they spread throughout the world .""","""Yes , our origins were probably in Africa . That 's where the oldest humanoid fossils are found .""",AGREE,"""there they spread throughout the world .""","""Yes , our origins were probably in Africa""",,
24443,6487,"""Are you familiar with the three basic laws of logic from philosophy `` 101 `` ? 1 . Law of identify . Anything is itself . If a proposition is true , than it is true . 2 . The law of the excluded middle : anything is either A , or not A . A proposition can either be true , or false . 3 . Law of contradiction ( your favorite ! ! ) - nothing can be both A , and not A . A proposition can not be both true , and false . -Mach""","""Something need not be A nor B , but C , which is a different property altogether , such as 'reasoned faith' I 'm still waiting for your turn on providing evidence on that one ... hell will freeze over .""",DISAGREE,"""nothing can be both A , and not A . A proposition can not be both true , and false .""","""Something need not be A nor B , but C""",,
24451,6489,"""where is the lies ?""","""Everywhere . There is not one single piece of evidence in support of creation and there is a mountain of evidence against it . Any claim that creation is anything but utterly disproven is a lie .""",DISAGREE,"""where is the lies ?""","""Everywhere""",,
24455,6490,"""This coming from a man who thinks [ quote""","""And now we know why Neanderthals be came extinct .""",DISAGREE,"""This coming from a man who thinks [ quote""","""And now we know why Neanderthals be came extinct .""",,
24470,6492,"""Can you be aganist abortion at the same time as aganist measures that reduce abortion such as comphrensive Sex Education , contraceptives , and other forms of prevention and education ?""","""Only a fool could believe that getting rid of contraceptives , and other forms of prevention and education will reduce the abortion rate ! !""",DISAGREE,"""Can you be aganist abortion at the same time as aganist measures that reduce abortion such as comphrensive Sex""","""Only a fool could believe that getting rid of contraceptives ,""",,
24480,6494,"""We could ask you the same thing . Why do you constantly try and oversimplify things by claiming that gun control will work , while at the same time not discussing matters relating to income , surroundings , upbringing , recidivism rates , prison sentences and other such matters ?""","""Given that this is the gun control forum , it seems logical to focus on gun control rather than other factors relevant to the crime rate . This is just a slimy attempt by you to misrepresent my position .""",DISAGREE,"""We could ask you the same thing . Why do you constantly try and oversimplify things by claiming that gun control will work ,""","""Given that this is the gun control forum""",,
24500,6498,"""Tsk , tsk same old claims about the death of evolutionary theory based on misreadings of the literature of molecular biology . Nothing new here . Not one bit .""","""This crushes ToE at the most fundamental level . I 've been telling this board for months that the gene is not the player in biological change that everyone thinks it is . The popultion has been told for decades that they are simply a culmination of their genes . How many times have you heard , `` It 's in the genes .... '' ? ? ? ? Not only that but the whole theory of evolution is a result of changes in genes ( or alleles ) . Ha ! Now , however , genes are `` losing their glitter. `` Now , it 's RNA that seems to be `` running the show. `` How can it get anymore embarrassing for science that they got the premise wrong for all these years ? Why do you think the dude in the article said how `` depressing `` all this is ? Evolutionists have screwed up in that they have always assumed that the gene is the fundamental unit of life , that complexity goes no further down in the organism and that what determines what or who you are stops at your genes ! FALSE ! DNA does not dictate who we are , it 's the other way around : DNA is just a representative of what we are , where we live , what our social environment is , what our ecological environment is , etc . DNA is not a dictator of life nor does it define us ...... it 's a follower of life and is manipulated by who we are . This reality indeed flips all of biology and ToE on its head . You can deny it all you want -- and I 'm sure you will because you have completely brainwashed yourself . The sun is setting on ToE . Science has lead us astray for decades , and now it 's coming back to bite them . What an embarrassment .""",DISAGREE,"""the death of evolutionary theory based on misreadings of the literature of molecular biology""","""This crushes ToE at the most fundamental level . I 've been telling this board for months that the gene is not the player in biological change that everyone thinks it is . The popultion has been told for decades that they are simply a culmination of their genes . How many times have you heard , ``""",,
24504,6499,"""Being pro-life 'except for rape ' does n't make any sense . It 's the same organism regardless of the father .""","""I think it 's hipocritical for pro-lifers to call themselves pro-life except for rape . It 's either a child or it 's not . If it is a child , then no matter what , the child must survive , becuase it has every right to . If the fetus is n't a child , then we can do whatever the hell we wnat with it . But it 's a child , since humans only produce children , and not being of other speices , in accordance to the Principle of Biogenesis . Therefore , abortion is wrong in all cases .""",AGREE,"""Being pro-life 'except for rape ' does n't make any sense . It 's the same organism regardless of the father .""","""I think it 's hipocritical for pro-lifers to call themselves pro-life except for rape . It 's either a child or it 's not .""",,
24509,6501,"""First , a comment about your second link . Gould had this to say about the quotes on that page : It seems that creationists are still at it . Yes . That is one component of evolutionary thought . But there is more to it than that . Another component of evolutionary thought is that many times species remain static ( as far as the fossil record reveals ) for long periods of time , sometimes millions of years . Another component of evolutionary thought is that sometimes speciation can happen relatively rapidly , in a flash of geological time , maybe as little as 50 or 60 thousand years . Even Darwin hypothesized that changes that caused speciation took place in peripheral segments of the population . Just before World War II Dobzhansky and Mayr discussed the gaps in the fossil record and the reasons for them . They agreed with Darwin . Finally , in the 1960s Eldredge and Gould worked out the first statement of what became the theory of punctuated equilibria in which they elaborated on the previous thoughts of Darwin , Dobzhansky , and Mayr . I think their paper , in which they discussed their observations from the fossil record of just such events , was published in 1972 . Actually , the fossil record does support it . Both Eldredge and Gould have discussed it . Both men made observations of slow gradual speciation in the fossil record in a small geographical area . These changes were reflected at other locations as an abrupt change from one species to another . But given that such changes take place very quickly in populations that are usually under environmental stress and isolated from the main population , and given the rarity of fossilization in the first place , we do n't expect to find many examples in the fossil record . It is a bit like trying to time a 100 yd . dash with a sundial . The fossil record just is n't fine grained enough to see the rapid ( 50-60 thousand years ) changes . Nope . It does . Or maybe it supports the hypothesis of successive creation . The fossil record that we find certainly does n't support the creation as told in the Bible . Even the creationists who went in search of evidence of the flood some 200 years ago realized that the geology did n't support what the Bible said . So they thought that the geology represented many floods , the last one from the Bible being on top . This objection has already been answer by Gould in the quote above . But of course , what creationists demand is eyedropper precision from a fire hose . Nevertheless , we have some spectacular transitional forms . My favorite is Archaeopteryx . And there is a great progression from four legged land animal to two finned aquatic whales . Some whales in that progression had rear legs that would have been useless for walking . Really ? What evidence is that ?""","""I will answer the remainder later as I am pressed for time . Archaeopteryx is not a transitional form . It has well defined feathers . Where is the evidence for transition from scales to feathers that is predicted by evolution . Natural selection in particular but overall evolution . If you read Gould 's original work he does not say what he says above and in fact actually contradicts it . It appears like a response that is back peddling at best . As I said , more later . EF""",DISAGREE,"""Gould had this to say about the quotes on that page : It seems that creationists are still at it . Yes . That is one component of evolutionary thought . But there is more to it than that . Another component of evolutionary thought is that many times species remain static ( as far as the fossil record reveals ) for long periods of time""","""I will answer the remainder later as I am pressed for time . Archaeopteryx is not a transitional form . It has well defined feathers . Where is the evidence for transition from scales to feathers that is predicted by evolution .""",,
24528,6506,"""Very good point wjim but I want to drain the water from the Canada argument and leave it dry . If no statistics saying that Canada 's strict gun laws lowered crime then the argument is dry and useless . So far I have found statistics that say gun control results in a rise in crime . No one has disputed this with statistics . FACT : Gun control raises crime . or do you have proof saying the opposite If not then the argument saying gun control would lower crime is invalid . Agreed ?""","""The Brady Bill does not lower crime : http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/284/5/585 A little dated , 1997 , but also note that both Cook and Ludwig were both anti-gunners . '' Brady Law Proponents : Ludwig , Cook , JAMA Among Lott 's harshest critics have been anti-self-defense academics Professors Jens Ludwig and Philip J. Cook . In a study funded by the anti-self-defense Joyce Foundation and published in the Journal of the American Medical Association ( JAMA ) they set out to debunk Lott 's findings regarding the Brady law . There was just one problem : they couldn't. `` http : //rpc.senate.gov/~rpc/releases/1999/gc083100.htm""",AGREE,"""So far I have found statistics that say gun control results in a rise in crime .""","""The Brady Bill does not lower crime http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/284/5/585 ,""",,
24530,6507,"""uh huh ... I 'm not buying it .""","""OK just Google Haldane Cambrian Rabbit . Lots of links ! ! ! ! Of course Haldane while he predicted ( indeed feared ) his prediction did not live long enough to see it dug up !""",DISAGREE,"""uh huh ... I 'm not buying it .""","""Google Haldane Cambrian""",,
24534,6508,"""8 . Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question . Example : `` What do you thinkk of carbon dating ? `` '' you spelled think wrong `` . If you want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well .""","""There was nothing wrong with my answer . I did the correction after being insulted , double-standard huh . I am not entitled to my own opinion if it does n't agree with yours . I expected alot more from you , you 've let me down . Your obviously only looking at one side of the argument .""",DISAGREE,"""What do you of carbon dating think want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well""","""There was nothing wrong with my answer . I did the correction after being insulted , double-standard""",,
24533,6508,"""8 . Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question . Example : `` What do you thinkk of carbon dating ? `` '' you spelled think wrong `` . If you want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well .""","""There was nothing wrong with my answer . I did the correction after being insulted , double-standard huh . I am not entitled to my own opinion if it does n't agree with yours . I expected alot more from you , you 've let me down . Your obviously only looking at one side of the argument .""",DISAGREE,"""Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question . Example : `` What do you thinkk of carbon dating ? `` '' you spelled think wrong `` . If you want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well .""","""There was nothing wrong with my answer . I did the correction after being insulted , double-standard huh . I am not entitled to my own opinion if it does n't agree with""",,
24539,6509,"""If so , what would be bad about allowing a view that places objective value in human life to be the basis for making law ?""","""1 - It is innacurate . We allow killing in times of war , in self defense , and in state sanctioned executions . So we already have a situation where , when given X mitigating factors , it is justifiable to take a life . It is impossible to say all life is equal , and then to apply that as law . People will be outraged . I know I would be . 2 - Objective to who ? Who gets to decide how valuable life is ? And why should they get to ? And who says they are right ? The relative value of life works fine , thanks very much .""",DISAGREE,"""would be bad about allowing a view that places objective value in human life to be the basis for making law""","""It is innacurate . We allow killing in times of war , in self defense , and in state sanctioned executions""",,
24543,6510,"""But is it petrified ?""","""No , but my wife is !""",DISAGREE,"""it petrified ?""","""No , but my wife is !""",,
24570,6538,"""This is not what hospitals do with biomedical waste . They incinerate it . If these people are really doing this I can `` t imagine who the buyer is , and they are breaking many many laws .""","""Sorry to shatter you little world but this is happening it has been happening 25 years and it is happening now and it is completly legal no laws have been broken and yes there is a market for fetal tissue /limbs and bodies . Do some research you will be surprised what you will find .""",DISAGREE,"""they are breaking many many laws .""","""is completly legal""",,
24576,6539,"""No . They are no longer making the decisions and therefore should not be allowed to pick . However , if a criminal requests the death penalty , are there retrials to ensure the state is n't killing a innocent person ?""","""Well I do n't support ever using the death penalty but as long as we 're saying there is the death penalty and allowing them to choose then definately do n't have retrials . They should n't want to send an innocent person to prison for life either so it should have been pretty clear they were guilty already . If they do n't want to kill an innocent person , stick to life in prison .""",AGREE,"""are there retrials to ensure the state is n't killing a innocent person ?""","""it should have been pretty clear they were guilty already""",,
24587,6540,"""Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe . A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship . The life or condition of a person in a religious order . A set of beliefs , values , and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader . A cause , principle , or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion .""","""When the founding fathers determined that religion should not be established , nor prohibited from being freely exercised , they probably would n't have considered atheism ( the assertion that there is no God ) to be a religion , because at the time it was n't organized , or funded . The Judeo Christian religions were organized and funded at the time , as were other types of religion . They were n't concerned with what beliefs majorities or minorities had , they were concerned with impositions a religion could put on segments of the population with their organizational requirements , or money issues . They could see atheists needing protection from religion , but they could n't see religion needing protection from atheism , because it was n't organized . While it can be argued that atheism is not a religion , it ca n't be argued that it is n't an EQUIVALENT to religion today , with the organization and funding that it now has . 200 years ago , an organization needed buildings and meetings and transportation to be organized . With today 's communications , it does not . Just type `` atheism `` in any search engine and note the organization , and political action . I 'm not using the term `` atheism `` in a derogatory manner . It 's an assertion that there is no God . But today it 's every bit as organized and politically active as any religion - it has happened practically overnight , thanks to modern communications . It now has the same ability to impose itself on society exactly like religion , and is covered by the first amendment the same as any religion . It can not claim science as its god , and force it upon public education . 3 ) One of the most interesting things about this whole issue is the fact that the same thing , only reversed , was going on in the US 100 years ago . http : //www.campusmagazine.org/articl ... 2-2f7cc3afdb0f The concept of evolution was recently founded at that time , and some closed minded religious people were afraid of it , and vehemently opposed having it taught in schools . Today , the concept of intelligent design , ( void of any certain religion and its associated faith ) is vehemently opposed by closed minded Darwinists , who are afraid of it in exactly the same way . I suspect the same thing was at the root of it all 100 years ago just like today - concerns of how the money flows . Religious leaders seek funding - secular science seeks funding . If I would have been alive 100 years ago , would I have opposed having evolution taught in schools ? Of course I would have , because I would n't have been able to forsee how the benefits that the study of microevolution , genetics , and other non controversial aspects of evolution have benefited society . Chances are there are equal , undiscovered things about intelligent design that could be discovered it we would give it a chance . In the words of biologist Arthur Jones ;""",DISAGREE,"""for a supernatural power or powers regarded creator and governor of the universe . practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader .""","""religion should not be established , meetings and transportation to be organized `` concept of evolution was recently founded at that time ,""",,
24592,6541,"""Your answers are ridiculous , ChuzLife , just like all the others . I never mentioned a child trap . You are all liars trying to distort My posts , and hide from the realities of abortion . I said a womb-trapped child . Thats 100 % descriptive . Its a child , in the womb , who is not able to leave . I never said that they are trapped by the vagina . I never suggested that pre-birth children float around and are somehow `` caught `` in a trap . None of your can face up to the Forbidden Truth on abortion .""","""Using the word trap in any way to describe the location of the fetous is stupid . Face up to that""",DISAGREE,"""I never mentioned a child trap . You are all liars trying to distort My posts""","""describe the location of the fetous is stupid . Face up to that""",,
24613,6543,"""According RM & amp ; NS all creativity is the result of genomic accidents .""","""No is the only answer one can make to that claim - its false . Indeed there is no claim made within NDS to `` creativity `` at all . NDS does not to deal with creativity which is a mental process . NDS deals with plain old biology . Evolution does not require creativity although NS does provide a non-random element to the process .""",DISAGREE,"""According RM & NS all creativity is the result of genomic accidents .""","""No is the only answer one can make to that claim - its false . Indeed there is no claim made within NDS to `` creativity `` at all . NDS does not to deal with creativity which is a mental process .""",,
24616,6543,"""According RM & amp ; NS all creativity is the result of genomic accidents .""","""No is the only answer one can make to that claim - its false . Indeed there is no claim made within NDS to `` creativity `` at all . NDS does not to deal with creativity which is a mental process . NDS deals with plain old biology . Evolution does not require creativity although NS does provide a non-random element to the process .""",DISAGREE,"""all creativity is the result of genomic accidents .""","""only answer one can make to that claim - its false . `` Evolution does not require creativity a non-random element to the process .""",,
24619,6544,"""Show me winking and nodding going on , marc . Stop insinuating bad behaviour and show me the evidence . Show me atheism being taught in the science classroom .""","""http : //www.numberwatch.co.uk/religion.htm Atheism is becoming a worship of the earth .""",DISAGREE,"""Show me atheism being taught in the science classroom""","""Atheism is becoming a worship of the earth .""",,
24623,6544,"""Show me winking and nodding going on , marc . Stop insinuating bad behaviour and show me the evidence . Show me atheism being taught in the science classroom .""","""http : //www.numberwatch.co.uk/religion.htm Atheism is becoming a worship of the earth .""",DISAGREE,"""nodding going on , taught in the science classroom""","""Atheism is becoming a worship""",,
24630,6545,"""This one line stuck out because it mentioned evolution in a future context . Something I have not heard before .""","""I have not heard of it before either . Any information that you or other member 's can gather on this subject would be of great interest . I will also keep my eyes open .""",AGREE,"""This one line stuck out because it mentioned evolution in a future context . Something I have not heard before .""","""I have not heard of it before either .""",,
24638,6553,"""Voted To Ban Gay Marriage Christian Conservative GOP Senator Linked To DC Madam by The Associated Press""","""So you 'll post the title and the AP source but not the article or link to it ? It must be some damming evidence samiinh .""",DISAGREE,"""Voted To Ban Gay Marriage Christian Conservative GOP Senator Linked To DC Madam by The Associated Press""","""So you 'll post the title and the AP source but not the article or link to it ? It must be some damming evidence samiinh .""",,
24639,6553,"""Voted To Ban Gay Marriage Christian Conservative GOP Senator Linked To DC Madam by The Associated Press""","""So you 'll post the title and the AP source but not the article or link to it ? It must be some damming evidence samiinh .""",DISAGREE,"""Voted To Ban Gay Marriage Christian Conservative GOP Senator Linked To DC Madam The Associated Press""","""So you 'll post the title and the AP source but not the article or link to it ? It must be some damming evidence samiinh .""",,
24675,6557,"""It is perfectly valid for someone to have the opinion that 'life ' begins with recordable brain activity ( as early as 40-days post-conception ) ... or 'self-awareness ' or any other such concept , or when the entity would be 'viable ' outside the womb . But there are varying levels of brain activity . There is no agreed upon definition of self-awareness .""","""There are some minimum requirements , though . The brain have to be able to receive stimuli and input . That happens during the 26th week of pregnancy , when the thalamocortical tract developes . Otherwise , it is no different than a computer that is turned off .""",DISAGREE,"""perfectly valid for someone to have the opinion that 'life ' begins with recordable brain activity as early as 40-days post-conception But there are varying levels of brain activity .""","""The brain have to be able to receive stimuli and input . 26th week of pregnancy Otherwise , it is no different than a computer that is turned off .""",,
24702,6559,"""Now that 's what I 'm talking about .""","""You mean you are as biologically ignorant and as easily refuted as the thread originator ? Yes , we knew that already . Why all the big letters ?""",DISAGREE,"""Now that 's what I 'm talking about .""","""You mean you are as biologically ignorant and as easily refuted as the thread originator ?""",,
24703,6559,"""Now that 's what I 'm talking about .""","""You mean you are as biologically ignorant and as easily refuted as the thread originator ? Yes , we knew that already . Why all the big letters ?""",DISAGREE,"""Now that 's what I 'm talking about""","""You mean you are as biologically ignorant and as easily refuted as the thread originator ?""",,
24708,6567,"""Many times , rape results in possible health problems for the mother , in which case I would have no qualms about abortion . But the truth is that the baby can not help having been brought into the world any more than the woman could have helped being raped , and does n't deserve to be killed any more than the woman does .""","""And a woman 's life choices , health , and finances are n't up for hi-jacking . Every time a lifer talks about demanding the nine month rape , they talk about what the baby deserves or not deserves and how it should n't be punished . This SCREAMS that you do n't value and respect women . The very idea that a woman is aborting as an act of revenge - it 's absurd and insulting .""",DISAGREE,"""But the truth is that the baby can not help having been brought into the world any more than the woman could have helped being raped""","""Every time a lifer talks about demanding the nine month rape , they talk about what the baby deserves or not deserves and how it should n't be punished .""",,
24726,6570,"""Can you own property ?""","""Actually no . My state does NOT protect gays and lesbians in matters regarding land ownership , employment or temporary shelter . ( Such as hotel and motel accomodations )""",AGREE,"""Can you own property ?""","""Actually no .""",,
24729,6571,"""Now , if we found an account from Roman times of how Julius Caesar split the waters of the Rubicon by urinating in it so his troops could pass ... Occam 's Razor would not point towards accepting it as true .""","""It does not matter what the document contains ! The same procedure should be done for every document . What the writing says is irrelevant to its authenticity ! You wrongly use Occam 's Razor as well . If the document is well preserved , has many copies , has copies relatively close to the original , etc , then the most likely assumption we can make is that the document itself is a valid source . Then and only then , should we examine the contents within and determine if they happened . We can do this through archaeological evidences and from other writings as well that agree with that one . Much of which we in fact do not have for many of Caesar 's expeditions , but yet again , we accept them as fact in our history books . But , it is funny that you should mention Caesar splitting a river . While he did n't do that , he did claim to have created a massive bridge in a very short time period and then destroyed it a few days later . Sounds like a pretty audacious claim from guys without any modern equipment . Should we discount this too because it 'does n't seem practical ' as we do with the bible despite the overwhelming documentation for it ? But here you are admitting that you set different standards 'depending on what the writing claims ' . Thanks again for proving my point I guess .""",DISAGREE,"""Now , if we found an account from Roman times of how Julius Caesar split the waters of the Rubicon by urinating in""","""It does not matter what the document contains !""",,
24736,6572,"""Can we get an unbiased point of view ? The bible is not just a book . It is the infallible word of God . And I would like to know what proof there is for evolution ?""","""Well , a good start would be at http : //www.talkorigins.org And , what evidence do you have that the bible is the infallible word of God ? Other , than of course , unsubstantiated claims the bible makes .""",DISAGREE,"""Can we get an unbiased point of view ?""","""Well , a good start would be at http : //www.talkorigins.org""",,
24745,6573,"""The whole who is on top thing is an inapplicable concept .""","""* * But here you blow it . No system , as a whole , is subservient , subordinate , inferior , or secondary to any or all of its parts . By simple definition a whole system is greater than , and superior to , any and all of its constituent parts .""",DISAGREE,"""inapplicable concept""","""subservient , subordinate , definition a whole superior constituent parts .""",,
24750,6575,"""A recent study by the FBI found that out of a random sampling of various criminals booked on firearms charges , only ONE of the polled individuals had procured a gun from a gun show .""","""Maybe so , but a random sampling is far from a statistical fact of any kind . And remember , I am against any government intervention that makes it more difficult for law abiding people to own as many weapons as they choose to own . But I do feel we must be not only more responsible today , but vigilant in our desire to make sure that criminals , illegal aliens and terrorists are not able to procure weapons through legal channels . Especially since we already know they can procure them through so many illegal channels already . What I posted above was the type of regulations that I could live with even though I 'm sure that criminals would find a way to usurp them as they do most every safeguard that 's adopted .""",DISAGREE,"""only ONE of the polled individuals had procured a gun from a gun show .""","""a random sampling is far from a statistical fact""",,
24769,6588,"""I actually do n't think anyone should be forced into parenthood . But if you do n't want to be a dad - then sign away your parental rights and be up front about it . You do n't walk six months into the pregnancy or after the kid is born .""","""The law does n't provide for that . It 's a pay as you go proposition . It 's actually even worse than some people think it is . It is not actually necessary to have actual intercourse to bring about pregnancy . But the DNA donor will still have to pay the piper . That 's the law .""",DISAGREE,"""I actually do n't think anyone should be forced into parenthood . But if you do n't want to be a dad - then sign away your parental rights and be up front about it . You do n't walk six months into the pregnancy or after the kid is born .""","""The law does n't provide for that . It 's a pay as you go proposition . It 's actually even worse than some people think it is .""",,
24777,6589,"""Leviathan has the following attributes according to Job chapter 41 , Psalm 104:25,26 and Isaiah 27:1 . This is only a partial listing—just enough to make the point .  “ No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up. ”  “ Who can open the doors of his face , with his terrible teeth all around ?  ”  “ His rows of scales are his pride , shut up tightly as with a seal ; one is so near another that no air can come between them ; they are joined one to another , they stick together and can not be parted. ”  “ His sneezings flash forth light , and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning . Out of his mouth go burning lights ; sparks of fire shoot out . Smoke goes out of his nostrils , as from a boiling pot and burning rushes . His breath kindles coals , and a flame goes out of his mouth. ”  “ Though the sword reaches him , it can not avail ; nor does spear , dart , or javelin . He regards iron as straw , and bronze as rotten wood . The arrow can not make him flee ; slingstones become like stubble to him . Darts are regarded as straw ; he laughs at the threat of javelins. ”  “ On earth there is nothing like him , which is made without fear. ” Leviathan  “ played ” in the  “ great and wide sea ” ( a paraphrase of Psalm 104 verses 25 and 26—get the exact sense by reading them yourself ) . Leviathan is a  “ reptile [ a ] that is in the sea. ” ( Isaiah 27:1 ) [ a ] Note : The word translated  “ reptile ” here is the Hebrew word tanniyn . This shows that  “ Leviathan ” was also a  “ tanniyn ” ( dragon ) .""","""Wow , a story about a sea monster . How ........ original .........""",DISAGREE,"""This shows that  Leviathan was also a  tanniyn ( dragon ) .""","""Wow , a story about a sea monster . How ........ original""",,
24785,6591,"""Factual ? Last time I checked , it was the THEORY of evolution , not the LAW of evolution . Evolution and Creation are both theories , neither of them can be proved scientifically per se .""","""Oh dear . Do you actually know what a scientist means when they call something a `` theory `` ? Because it seems to me that you do not . The concept of gravity is `` only a theory `` , yet oddly enough I do n't see anyone trying to say that we should stop accepting the existence of the force of gravity because of this . The SCIENTIFIC theory of Evolution is a scientific theory that has been and continues to be extensively researched and developed . It should be taught in schools . Creationism ( or Intelligent Design ) is not a scientific theory , and is not supported by any evidence . If it must be allowed into schools at all it should be confined to the religious studies classroom , not the science laboratory .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution and Creation are both theories , neither of them can be proved scientifically per se .""","""Do you actually know what a scientist means when they call something a `` theory `` ?""",,
24812,6595,"""Supersport , where art thou now ... Bah , who am I kidding . Of course he wo n't come over here ...""","""Well he HAS admitted he ca n't prove his belief . I guess that posting here would admit his false dichotomies that it 's either literal genesis or evolution are false and god knows the world will end when that happens . Super admitting he 's wrong ? Never going to happen .""",DISAGREE,"""where art thou now ... Bah , who am I kidding .""","""Well he HAS admitted he ca n't prove his belief .""",,
24813,6596,"""This is what evolutionists do when they have no argument , they change the subject .""","""This is what you do when they have no argument-insult . Let me fix up the thread title for you : `` There is absolutely no evidence of the theory of evolution that would convince me `` There , all fixed up for you .""",DISAGREE,"""This is what evolutionists do when they have no argument , they change the subject .""","""This is what you do when they have no argument-insult . Let me fix up the thread title for you : `` There is absolutely no evidence of the theory of evolution that would convince me ``""",,
24830,6600,"""Wait a minute , I fail to see how it not being availible will affect teenagers doing it or not .""","""Because it will encourage teens to engage in riskier behavior . Abstinence until marriage is still the best way .""",AGREE,"""Wait a minute , I fail to see how it not being availible will affect teenagers doing it or not .""","""Because it will encourage teens to engage in riskier behavior . Abstinence until marriage is still the best way .""",,
24838,6602,"""So the argument that this is a breach of separation of church and state is pretty weak , IMO .""","""Oh , oh , and do n't forget to include the proposed Federal Kosher Amendment 's text , which just coincidentally matches the Levitical proscriptions , in your argument that things like the FMA have nothing to do with separation of church and state .""",DISAGREE,"""the argument that this is a breach of separation of church and state is pretty weak""","""in your argument that things like the FMA have nothing to do with separation of church and state .""",,
24843,6603,"""I agree about your second point . Was this peppered moth not hailed as an `` example of evolution in action `` ? If so , this implies that it is proof of evolution .""","""No it does n't . Changes in allele frequencies in a population over time were observed . That is an example of evolution . Evolution is n't something that is `` proved. `` It is observed . Populations of organisms change over time due to the changing frequiencies of genetic make up . That is observed . Evolutionary biology tries to explain the reasons for the observed evolution . In the case of the peppered moth , natural selection due to the predation of birds has been proposed .""",DISAGREE,"""I agree about your second point . Was this peppered moth not hailed as an `` example of evolution in action `` ? If so , this implies that it is proof of evolution .""","""No it does n't . Changes in allele frequencies in a population over time were observed""",,
24854,6606,"""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ? Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""","""Partly because it is entirely dependent on one particular human being for its survival , after birth the baby can be looked after by pretty much anyone , before it is entirely reliant on one person , if that person dies , the feotus dies . I place value on the life of the feotus because it is close to human , it has the potential to become human . The closer any being is to being human the more value I tend to place on its life . I value monkeys more than I value cows , for example , I value cows more than I value mice , or rats . I would only kill cows for food , not for sport or because they were irritating . Mice I would kill or have killed if there was an infestation and I could n't get rid of them any other way , insects I 'm not too bothered about swatting if they annoy me . The feotus I consider to be close to human , closer than any other species and , whilst I consider it wrong to kill it , I can understand why others do n't and recognise that banning abortion also results in suffering and loss of life . It 's a difficult decision for me whether the loss of feotuses is balanced by the suffering prevented , lives saved and freedom promoted by keeping it legal .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""","""Partly because it is entirely dependent on one particular human being for its survival , after birth the baby can be looked after by pretty much anyone , before it is entirely reliant on one person , if that person dies , the feotus dies . I place value on the life of the feotus because it is close to human , it has the potential to become human""",,
24881,6619,"""I have some questions for everyone here . For example , what is each side trying to prove ? Are the evolution supporters trying to convince others of evolution , or are they trying to defend evolution ?""","""As a Biology teacher , I 'm trying to defend my subject against ignorant abuse . If you ask whether endless exchanges with the wilfully ignorant actually constitute effective defence , I 'll pass .""",DISAGREE,"""Are the evolution supporters trying to convince others of evolution , or are they trying to defend evolution ?""","""As a Biology teacher , I 'm trying to defend my subject against ignorant abuse""",,
24890,6621,"""The livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems , at every scale from local to global . The findings of this report suggest that it should be a major policy focus when dealing with problems of land degradation , climate change and air pollution , water shortage and water pollution , and loss of biodiversity . In the report , senior U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization official Henning Steinfeld reports that the meat industry is  “ one of the most significant contributors to today ’ s most serious environmental problems `` [ 3 ] and that `` urgent action is required to remedy the situation . '' [ 4 ] Other points the report makes are that the world 's livestock industry `` generates 65 per cent of human-related nitrous oxide , which has 296 times the Global Warming Potential ( GWP ) of CO2 `` [ 5 ] and `` that livestock are responsible for 18 percent of greenhouse gas emissions , a bigger share than that of transport . '' [ 6 ]""","""http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livestock's_Long_Shadow""",DISAGREE,"""livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems""","""http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livestock's_Long_Shadow""",,
24891,6621,"""The livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems , at every scale from local to global . The findings of this report suggest that it should be a major policy focus when dealing with problems of land degradation , climate change and air pollution , water shortage and water pollution , and loss of biodiversity . In the report , senior U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization official Henning Steinfeld reports that the meat industry is  “ one of the most significant contributors to today ’ s most serious environmental problems `` [ 3 ] and that `` urgent action is required to remedy the situation . '' [ 4 ] Other points the report makes are that the world 's livestock industry `` generates 65 per cent of human-related nitrous oxide , which has 296 times the Global Warming Potential ( GWP ) of CO2 `` [ 5 ] and `` that livestock are responsible for 18 percent of greenhouse gas emissions , a bigger share than that of transport . '' [ 6 ]""","""http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livestock's_Long_Shadow""",DISAGREE,"""The livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems , `` ''""","""http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livestock's_Long_Shadow""",,
24895,6622,"""Define evil . The concept of evil is very subjective . If something is truly evil , then there must be an absolute concept of evil . But you will never come to agreement with everyone else in the world as to what makes something truly evil or good . What is your standard for determining what is evil ?""","""Yes , it 's very subjective . I was using evil as an example that was incorrectly used on the website . Even though evil is subjective , you can still be evil . ( you can do evil to take away your goodness , but the only way to make yourself colder is by removing your heat , not adding `` cold `` )""",DISAGREE,"""concept of evil to the""","""evil as incorrectly used the website to""",,
24908,6624,"""Because the correct alternative to the best naturalistic explanation scientists have come up with so far may well be an even better naturalistic explanation , not divine intervention .""","""Really ? Care to expound on that other natural explanation my christian brother ? Or do you really mean another version of the original natural explanation and you 're playing yet another game of semantics .""",DISAGREE,"""the best naturalistic explanation scientists have come up with so far""","""Really ? Care to expound on that other natural explanation my christian brother ?""",,
24916,6626,"""Homosexuality is deviant in the sense that it is n't `` the norm `` . That does n't mean that it ca n't have benefits that outweigh its 'abnormal `` nature . I 'm a very strong advocate for kids and I believe that any loving couple is better than a single parent home or similar .""","""You mentioned here that same-sex marriage may have benefits which outweigh its `` abnormal `` nature . I must point out that even if we consider it abnormal , there is no reason to suggest that abnormal is somehow bad . In a free and equal society , abnormal deserves all the rights and privleges thet normal receives . Any benefits that exist in allowing same-sex marriage are n't being weighed down by abnormality . [ quote ] The concept of equality is a lot easier to conceptualize than to put into practice . We , as a society , preach equality in principle , but practice inequality in all aspects of our lives . As I mentioned above , the tax code is a great example of institutionalized inequality . Businesses practice institutionalized inequality daily . For example , I am considered , by my employer , to be an HCI ( highly compensated individual ) . As a result , I pay a much higher rate for the same healthcare coverage that my fellow employees get . Is that fair ? I guess as I get older , I worry less about abstract concepts that sound good in theory but do n't exist in practice . [ quote ] Well , I wo n't argue that we will never be truly equal , and I wo n't argue that equality is the answer to everything , but I will argue that equality is worth striving for and that equality does exist in practice , it is just so ingrained into our mindset that we forget it is there . Compare US law to the laws of Europe before the revolution . In Europe there existed classes of nobles with extra rights under the law as well as kings and royalty with even more rights . As you went higher up in class , you 'd get more and more political power . In America , we all have one vote . We all have an equal ability to participate in government . It is true that we use that vote to choose someone to make decisions for us in the government , but our ability to participate in government set a new precedent in equality . Consider even slaves or women 's rights . These are cases where equality won out not just in theory but in practice . I will admit that we can not simply just make everyone equal in every way , but we do our best to give them equal rights and equal represenation . In the case of same-sex marriage , I can think of no reason why we should not extend the same rights that opposite-sex couples have to same-sex couples ( and plenty of reasons why we should ) .""",DISAGREE,"""That does n't mean that it ca n't have benefits that outweigh its 'abnormal `` nature""","""I must point out that even if we consider it abnormal , there is no reason to suggest that abnormal is somehow bad""",,
24917,6626,"""Homosexuality is deviant in the sense that it is n't `` the norm `` . That does n't mean that it ca n't have benefits that outweigh its 'abnormal `` nature . I 'm a very strong advocate for kids and I believe that any loving couple is better than a single parent home or similar .""","""You mentioned here that same-sex marriage may have benefits which outweigh its `` abnormal `` nature . I must point out that even if we consider it abnormal , there is no reason to suggest that abnormal is somehow bad . In a free and equal society , abnormal deserves all the rights and privleges thet normal receives . Any benefits that exist in allowing same-sex marriage are n't being weighed down by abnormality . [ quote ] The concept of equality is a lot easier to conceptualize than to put into practice . We , as a society , preach equality in principle , but practice inequality in all aspects of our lives . As I mentioned above , the tax code is a great example of institutionalized inequality . Businesses practice institutionalized inequality daily . For example , I am considered , by my employer , to be an HCI ( highly compensated individual ) . As a result , I pay a much higher rate for the same healthcare coverage that my fellow employees get . Is that fair ? I guess as I get older , I worry less about abstract concepts that sound good in theory but do n't exist in practice . [ quote ] Well , I wo n't argue that we will never be truly equal , and I wo n't argue that equality is the answer to everything , but I will argue that equality is worth striving for and that equality does exist in practice , it is just so ingrained into our mindset that we forget it is there . Compare US law to the laws of Europe before the revolution . In Europe there existed classes of nobles with extra rights under the law as well as kings and royalty with even more rights . As you went higher up in class , you 'd get more and more political power . In America , we all have one vote . We all have an equal ability to participate in government . It is true that we use that vote to choose someone to make decisions for us in the government , but our ability to participate in government set a new precedent in equality . Consider even slaves or women 's rights . These are cases where equality won out not just in theory but in practice . I will admit that we can not simply just make everyone equal in every way , but we do our best to give them equal rights and equal represenation . In the case of same-sex marriage , I can think of no reason why we should not extend the same rights that opposite-sex couples have to same-sex couples ( and plenty of reasons why we should ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Homosexuality is deviant in the sense that it is n't `` the norm `` I 'm a very strong advocate for kids and I believe that any loving couple is better than a single parent home or""","""same-sex marriage may have benefits which outweigh its `` abnormal `` nature .""",,
24919,6627,"""No . The fetus does not have all of these things up and running until birth . The baby needs more than nutrition . It relies on the mother 's anti-bodies for it 's immune system ( even AFTER birth to some degree ) , it does not breath or take in oxygen on it 's own , and none of body systems are developed until late in the pregnancy .""","""well , whatever the case may be , that baby has a full function nervous system and can feel the pain whenever it is aborted . Does that not disturb you ? People always tend to think `` oh the mother is going to go through pain `` BLA BLA BLA .. BUT WHAT ABOUT THE BABY THAT IS BEING TORTURED TO DEATH ? cmon .""",DISAGREE,"""It relies on the mother 's anti-bodies for it 's immune system ( even AFTER birth to some degree ) , it does not breath or take in oxygen on it 's own , and none of body systems are developed until late in the pregnancy""","""Does that not disturb you ? People always tend to think `` oh the mother is going to go through pain `` BLA BLA BLA .. BUT WHAT ABOUT THE BABY THAT IS BEING TORTURED TO DEATH ? cmon""",,
24953,6633,"""I 'm not as sad as that . The definition of sad is defending something ( evolution ) that does n't have a leg to stand on anymore ( fossil evidence does n't prove evolution ) . There are that many holes in the evolution theory it 's a joke .""","""Oh God , not again . You 're correct in the fact that the fossil record does n't prove evolution . Fossils , being the lithified remains of long dead organisms , have great problems providing any evidence on thier genetic make-up . What the fossil record does show is cases where , over time , modifications can be seen in animals morphology . There is also the fact you can find animals which are 'almost ' another type of animal . A good example is Synapsids ( otherwise known as 'Mammal-like reptiles ' ) . The fossil record provides data which is best explained by the ToE , rather than 'Goddidit ' . The argument between ToE and ID is not something in which the fossil record can be involved . As far as I can tell , you do n't talk about God as the personalised deity that most mainstream christian traditions talk about . In fact you seem to have a rather 'hippy-ish ' view in that God is an energy . Just so you know , the idea that humans die when seeing Gods goes back at least as far as the ancient Greeks . Zeus killed one of his lovers when she demanded to see him in his true form ( just by the power revealed in him ) . I think she was the mother of Perseus or something .... Just so you know , if God is a force , we 've probably already picked him out and got him down as an unexplained physical constant , and if he 's a spirit , we ca n't pick him up scientifically , and therefore are n't trying to prove him or disprove him . It 's true that we are not hugely advanced in terms of our understanding , but we are hugely advanced beyond 5-600 years ago , when the christians were doing thier best to burn anyone who asked questions . Nowadays we agree that Gallileo was a very smart man , rather than a heretic . Religion still has a place today , but it no longer directs the entire course of human life .""",DISAGREE,"""fossil evidence does n't prove evolution holes in the evolution theory it 's a joke .""","""not again . fossil record provides data""",,
24961,6634,"""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""","""No brother ... complete controll of everything you do by a power structure you 'll be powerless to stop . Enjoy !""",DISAGREE,"""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""","""No brother ... complete controll of everything you do by a power structure you 'll be powerless to stop .""",,
24967,6635,"""BeHereNow : Well , you ’ re just begging the question of what is evidence . You are saying religious belief ( others might say religious knowledge ) is not evidence . If it is scientific , it is evidence . If it is not scientific , it is not evidence . Have I got it right ? Obvious child : If you use the proper definition of faith yes . Faith is a belief in something with no evidence .""","""Well , I certainly never used the word faith , but since you brought it up , what do you put your faith in ? What is it you believe in with no evidence ? Could it be science ? What is your evidence that science is true , except more science ? Scientific evidence which supports science is circular reasoning . It is no different than using the bible to support the bible . The bible is evidence for creationism , if you accept the bible as literally true . And there are many reasons ( mostly non-scientific ) to accept the bible as true . Every belief system is supported by pillars of belief , ultimately based on faith . Some of these belief systems have pillars that are short , and solid , and other systems are supported by pillars that are tall and spindly . Each of us intuits one or more pillars to be true , and our belief system follows . You have intuited science to be true , and the resulting belief system finds the bible to be based on faith . Others have intuited the bible to be true , and the resulting belief system finds science to be based on faith . I intuit that you each have it half right , combining faith and evidence to arrive at your belief system .""",DISAGREE,"""Well , you ’ re just begging the question of what is evidence . You are saying religious belief ( others might say religious knowledge ) is not evidence . If it is scientific , it is evidence . If it is not scientific , it is not evidence .""","""Well , I certainly never used the word faith , but since you brought it up , what do you put your faith in ?""",,
24976,6644,"""You have two tables , one with a small test tube which you know holds a microscopically small living zygote , and another table with a live baby . You are told that one of them will be destroyed and you have just two seconds to decide which , or both will be destroyed . Without a seconds thought I would immediately point in the direction of the zygote , and save the life of the baby .""","""A no-brainer . Zayonara zygote !""",AGREE,"""table with a live baby . You are told that one of them will be destroyed""","""A no-brainer . Zayonara zygote !""",,
24983,6645,"""Bush Is The Man , how can you question the story aganist Bush yet spin and ignore stories with the same amount of evidence aganist Kerry ?""","""Because there is evidence against Kerry . They proved him wrong about Cambodia , the atrocities that did n't occur , him throwing his medals away , etc . I have only seen 1 source to back up the Bush assumption that his girlfriend had an abortion . There is no evidence of medical records , the girlfriend coming out , any credible witnesses , etc . That 's why . Did you hear Kerry 's latest flip flop ? Two weeks ago , at an interview with ABC , Kerry said he wanted to move US troops out of Europe and the Korean peninsula . Then the other day , just 2 days after Bush said he wanted to move 12,000 troops out of Korea in the next 10 years , Kerry says that is n't what we need to do . Now , just 2 weeks after saying he wanted to remove troops from Korea , he changes his mind and says removing troops from Korea is a bad idea . Can you reasonably change your mind about something like that in 2 weeks ? Is he a pathological liar or does he just say the opposite of everything Bush says ?""",DISAGREE,"""how can you question the story aganist Bush yet spin and ignore stories""","""Kerry said he wanted to move US troops out of Europe and the Korean peninsula .""",,
24987,6646,"""To Ooaman ; This is evolution as observed across a span of a couple of generations , which is the unit that evolutionary change occurs . Obviously a generation of a small bird is n't as long as it is for us , for example .""","""Oh , okay , I understand it now . I still think it sounds quick but then again , I 'm not a member of the bird family .""",AGREE,"""which is the unit that evolutionary change occurs . Obviously a generation of a small bird is n't as long as it is for us , for example .""","""I understand it now . I still think it sounds quick but then again , I 'm not a member of the bird family .""",,
24992,6647,"""Are you claiming that black women are being forced into abortion ? If not , then how is `` genocide `` being committed if they themselves are choosing abortion ? By the way , the rates of abortion in whites vs blacks are similar to the rates of teenage pregnancy between whites and blacks . From http : //www.teenpregnancy.org/america ... sp ? ID=3 & amp ; sID=20 , there is a roughly three times higher rate of teenage pregnancies among black women than among white women ( 153/1000 vs 55/1000 ) . From http : //www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/race.asp , the abortion rate for whites is 12/1000 while it is 31/1000 for black women . Note , the 1000 refers to 1000 women of child-bearing age ( or 1000 teenage women in the case of teenage pregancy rates ) . Since there is a much higher rate of teenage pregnacny among black women , it makes sense that there would be a much higher rate of abortion among black women . So , the main question is `` Why is there so much more teenage pregnancy among black women ? '' . I would think that poverty is a main reason . African Americans started off poor because of the legacy of slavery and stayed poor for ages because of unbridled discrimination . The last few decades have produced enormous changes in laws and practices governing discrimination . Unfortunately for African Americans , just as they were gaining more freedoms from discrimination in law and practice , socio-economic changes in the US made it more difficult for anybody who was poor ( black or white ) to get into the middle class . However , I hope that more African Americans will be able to take more advantage of those opportunities that they do still have to advance to higher levels ( in education , sports , etc . ) .""","""Ok , I 'm going to have to question your statement as far as this post goes . I really do n't like the fact that you brought out , how African Americans , abort because of poverty , and low education . But white people abort for different reasons . That is basicly what you said . I find that to be an insult . My cousin , was not poor , nor was she uneducated when she had her abortions . As well as my sister . I think that is some kind of rasist idea that alot of people like to keep as regards to black people . Because I never saw you pin a reason , on why white people abort . But in your mind its understandable . But WOE ! To the uneducated black folks ! Then you go on to state that black people should in fact take advantage of the higher education , and sports provided for them . By that statement , it seems to me as if you 're implying that black people do n't take the oppurtunity to benefit ourselves . Need I remind you , that black people are leading in the sports world . And that there are thousands of black people who are taking advantage of higher learning . And what is your advice for those who are white , who lead uneducated lives , and abort because of being poor . Believe it or not , there are alot in that situation . So do n't you dare classify one race . And assume , they are uneducated , and poor . Thus they have abortions . Expecially since I see that with people of all races . It seems to me like you never took that into consideration .""",DISAGREE,"""If not , then how is `` genocide `` being committed if they themselves""","""Expecially since I see that with people of all races .""",,
24993,6647,"""Are you claiming that black women are being forced into abortion ? If not , then how is `` genocide `` being committed if they themselves are choosing abortion ? By the way , the rates of abortion in whites vs blacks are similar to the rates of teenage pregnancy between whites and blacks . From http : //www.teenpregnancy.org/america ... sp ? ID=3 & amp ; sID=20 , there is a roughly three times higher rate of teenage pregnancies among black women than among white women ( 153/1000 vs 55/1000 ) . From http : //www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/race.asp , the abortion rate for whites is 12/1000 while it is 31/1000 for black women . Note , the 1000 refers to 1000 women of child-bearing age ( or 1000 teenage women in the case of teenage pregancy rates ) . Since there is a much higher rate of teenage pregnacny among black women , it makes sense that there would be a much higher rate of abortion among black women . So , the main question is `` Why is there so much more teenage pregnancy among black women ? '' . I would think that poverty is a main reason . African Americans started off poor because of the legacy of slavery and stayed poor for ages because of unbridled discrimination . The last few decades have produced enormous changes in laws and practices governing discrimination . Unfortunately for African Americans , just as they were gaining more freedoms from discrimination in law and practice , socio-economic changes in the US made it more difficult for anybody who was poor ( black or white ) to get into the middle class . However , I hope that more African Americans will be able to take more advantage of those opportunities that they do still have to advance to higher levels ( in education , sports , etc . ) .""","""Ok , I 'm going to have to question your statement as far as this post goes . I really do n't like the fact that you brought out , how African Americans , abort because of poverty , and low education . But white people abort for different reasons . That is basicly what you said . I find that to be an insult . My cousin , was not poor , nor was she uneducated when she had her abortions . As well as my sister . I think that is some kind of rasist idea that alot of people like to keep as regards to black people . Because I never saw you pin a reason , on why white people abort . But in your mind its understandable . But WOE ! To the uneducated black folks ! Then you go on to state that black people should in fact take advantage of the higher education , and sports provided for them . By that statement , it seems to me as if you 're implying that black people do n't take the oppurtunity to benefit ourselves . Need I remind you , that black people are leading in the sports world . And that there are thousands of black people who are taking advantage of higher learning . And what is your advice for those who are white , who lead uneducated lives , and abort because of being poor . Believe it or not , there are alot in that situation . So do n't you dare classify one race . And assume , they are uneducated , and poor . Thus they have abortions . Expecially since I see that with people of all races . It seems to me like you never took that into consideration .""",DISAGREE,"""the rates of abortion in whites vs blacks are similar to the rates of teenage pregnancy between whites and blacks ''""","""I find that to be an insult .""",,
24999,6648,"""funny how darwinists , when presented with evidence that lifeforms are intelligent and dynamic -- which refutes their mechanistic theory -- turn around claim it as evidence for their theory . Go figure . I guess that 's about all they can do at this point : play dumb and hope nobody notices .""","""Sport , if life-forms - including bacteria - are 'intelligent and dynamic ' , why does genetic engineering work ? Why do n't these 'intelligent and dynamic ' bacteria reject or ignore the foreign DNA and go on working as before ?""",DISAGREE,"""with evidence that lifeforms are intelligent and dynamic""","""Why do n't these 'intelligent and dynamic ' bacteria reject or ignore the foreign DNA""",,
25007,6650,"""* * If you are talking to me , I did read it -- that 's why I posted it .""","""In that case , I 'm wondering why you did n't notice that it provided evidence for an aspect of evolutionary theory ... Basically , it provided evidence that a previous ad-hoc hypothesis was unnecessary to explain the development of hands and feet . I 'd summarize the rest of the article for you , but you ought to understand it already .""",DISAGREE,"""If you are talking to me , I did read it -- that 's why I posted it .""","""Basically , it provided evidence that a previous ad-hoc hypothesis was unnecessary""",,
25021,6652,"""Accidents for one . Just last week a man who was drinking and cleaning his firearm accidentally shot and killed his daughter . Run a google search for `` man shoots self `` the amount of accidental shootings is rather disturbing yet funny . Most of these however are due to improper gun safety though .""","""Once upon a time , a man killed another man with a tire iron . We 've simply got to ban tire irons ... and bats ... and hatchets ... and knives ... and scissors ... and sharp pencils ... and plastic bags ... and nail clippers .""",DISAGREE,"""Accidents firearm accidentally `` man shoots self `` rather disturbing improper gun""","""tire iron . hatchets knives scissors sharp pencils plastic bags clippers""",,
25025,6653,"""Genomes are littered with nonfunctional pseudogenes , faulty duplicates of functional genes that do nothing , while their functional cousins ( the word does n't even need scare quotes ) get on with their business in a different part of the same genome . And there 's lots more DNA that does n't even deserve the name pseudogene . It , too , is derived by duplication , but not duplication of functional genes . It consists of multiple copies of junk , `` tandem repeats `` , and other nonsense which may be useful for forensic detectives but which does n't seem to be used in the body itself .""","""Luckily science moves forward and these arguments from ignorance get left behind and the proponents of these arguments fade into history as proponents of ignorance trying to sell meaningless metaphysics . Junk DNA is a myth . Examples abound of research finding fascinating functions for these previously thought non-functional parts of the genome ( out of ignorance and bad metaphysics -- Dawkins : `` And there 's lots more DNA that does n't even deserve the name pseudogene . '' ) . Model unravels rules that govern how genes are switched on and off""",DISAGREE,"""Genomes are littered with nonfunctional pseudogenes , faulty duplicates of functional genes that do nothing , while their functional cousins ( the word does n't even need scare quotes ) get on with their business in a different part of the same genome .""","""Luckily science moves forward and these arguments from ignorance get left behind and the proponents of these arguments fade into history as proponents of ignorance trying to sell meaningless metaphysics . Junk DNA is a myth . ''""",,
25036,6655,"""James Madison in Federalist 51 explained , `` In framing a government which is to be administered by men over men the great difficulty lies in this : You must first enable the government to control the governed , and in the next place , oblige it to control itself. ``""","""I believe you are misinterpreting Mr. Madison . James Madison made it clear throughout his writings that a powerful government was something to be worried about and carefully watched . But , lets say your right . Where do you draw the line ? For example : seeing as religion has most likely killed more people than cancer , under your theory , what is to stop government from outlawing organized religion ? You once told me you were studied in the ways of Joseph Smith and Brigham Young , would you be willing to give up your freedom of religion to protect other freedoms ?""",DISAGREE,"""James Madison `` You must first enable the government to control the governed , and in the next place , oblige it to control""","""I believe you are misinterpreting Madison . James Madison made it clear throughout his writings that a powerful government was something to be worried""",,
25068,6659,"""I think his point is paulie , that if evolution is actually as evo defines it , as changes made by way of random mutations , then why does n't life reflect those random mutations ? For example , why have n't a large number of lower animals who live their lives being hunted by carnivores adapted eyes in the back of their heads as a needed early warning system to see their stalkers coming from behind them ?""","""I 'm in a bit of a rush , so I 'll just cover this point . Er . . . they have , sort of . Prey animals , such as antelope , have eyes on the sides of their heads so as to spot approaching carnivores . This gives them a very wide field of vision . For example the pronghorn antelope has a field of vision of around 320 degrees . Smiley""",DISAGREE,"""evolution is actually as evo defines it , as changes made by way of random mutations , then why does n't life reflect those random mutations ?""","""of , as""",,
25080,6660,"""YouTube - Armed Citizen - Cape Girardeau , Missouri So a sex offender rapes a 57 year old woman , and five days later he comes back , cuts her electricity , and she shoots him with a shotgun and kills him . She does n't face any charges for her actions . I consider that justice served .""","""I agree , but the libs would weep and call her a murderer . I suppose they 'd rather have her submit to this vile person . They support pacifism , and in New York , she 'd be in prison . Good thing people in my area have common sense .""",AGREE,"""YouTube - Armed Citizen - Cape Girardeau ,""","""I agree""",,
25082,6661,"""A 10 years in Jail offense .""","""That is what a straw purchaser gets . 10 years in a Federal Prision .""",DISAGREE,"""A 10 years in Jail offense .""","""10 Federal""",,
25089,6661,"""A 10 years in Jail offense .""","""That is what a straw purchaser gets . 10 years in a Federal Prision .""",DISAGREE,"""A 10 years in Jail offense .""","""That is what a straw purchaser gets 10 years in a Federal Prision .""",,
25101,6662,"""This is a push to promote lawlessness . The San Francisco fiasco is the prime example . People with certain agendas are refusing to follow the laws . This is a devastating precedent for our Nation .""","""First of all , it 's not a precedent . this is the seventh or eighth state where a higher court has found anti-gay discrimination in marriage unconstitutional . Secondly , when so many rulings go in this direction , it can hardly be called `` lawlessness `` . It 's a call for lawful , constitutional interpretation of statutes . It takes extraordinary intellectual dishonesty to pretend there is some `` agenda `` at work . These decisions are the consequence of two things : our long history of rationally applying those silly words about equality that folks smarter than this generation of politicians put in the Constitution AND a long-term correction of the misunderstandings of what homosexuality IS and what its consequences are . I know you do n't personally believe it , but there is nothing wrong with us .""",DISAGREE,"""This is a push to promote lawlessness . People with certain agendas are refusing to follow the laws . This is a devastating precedent for our Nation .""","""this is the seventh or eighth state where a higher court has found anti-gay discrimination in marriage unconstitutional . Secondly , when so many rulings go in this direction , it can hardly be called `` lawlessness `` .""",,
25114,6664,"""You missed the point ! Earlier in Life , Freud described God as a Father wish fullfilment notion . Later in Life , Freud condicted himself and saluted the Swiss Theologian AND God ! Now , look , we all evolve , and grow our childish beliefs ( e.g . atheism ) I will go further , NO one is an Atheist on their Death bed or in a Fowhole as the WWII guys knew all too well .""","""Sorry , but I have to say this . Who the hell gives a flaming turd what Freud thought ? He was a coke head quack who pulled a bunch of bunk out of his butt and called it psychotherapy . ..""",DISAGREE,"""Earlier in Life , Freud described God as a Father wish fullfilment notion . Later in Life , Freud condicted himself and saluted the Swiss Theologian AND God !""","""Sorry , but I have to say this . Who the hell gives a flaming turd what Freud thought ? He was a coke head quack""",,
25129,6665,"""Well your right , Waxy There is no real `` logic `` to my post , because if one thinks about the art of debating religion , the concept of logic goes out the window . A true believer has only the bible to support their beliefs , they can not go to a lab or science room and prove their beliefs on a table , or use cobalt to date religous belief , so their belief is all based on unseen faith . I have only a high school education , therefore I do not have the vocabulary the master debators use on here , nor the artistic way of putting together sentences . So bear with me please , while I try to explain my post a little better .... Since you put me in the spotlight here , I will use you , with great respect to you of course , as my point of debate . You have went on record here stating many times , that you do not believe in a `` god `` the way we believers do . Now with that notion in mind , why do you and others hang out debating on a religous forum ? ? In case you havent noticed , the posts against the notion of God and Christianity , greatly outnumber the posts of the believers . Is that not a interesting fact when you think about it ? I dont believe in a lot of things that I am exposed to in my walk though life here on earth , so I have NO interest in trying to prove those things wrong , THAT I feel have no validity . Clear as mud now , ? ?""","""I think there 's a few points to be made here - 1 ) This is a forum specifically for the purpose of discussing God and religion . Thousands , hundred 's of thousands , maybe even billions of people who do n't believe in God have n't bothered to seek it out , they have no interest , it attracts those that do have an interest in learning how and why others think and do as they do . 2 ) Discussing something , no matter what the reason or how much it is discussed , does not lend any validity to what is being discussed . There is an infinite number of examples I could give to illustrate that point . Take in a sci-fi convention some time as a prime example . 3 ) I do n't see so much the discussion of `` is there a God/is n't there a God `` , as I do the discussion of religion and the Bible . That is a very important distinction . Religion is very real , and affects all of us , whether we are believers in it or not . Whether or not Bigfoot exists , or the Klingons are invading someone , has no bearing whatsoever on my life or reality , religion does . I think that is the reason you see such fervent discussion and rejection of Christianity on forums like this . Why the large outcry ? Those in the minority always tend to be more vocal , they have to be , or they 'd simply be overwhelmed by the `` silent `` majority . Waxy P.S . Do n't sell yourself short , you more than hold your own on these forums .""",DISAGREE,"""do not have the vocabulary the master debators use why do you and others hang out debating on a forum ? outnumber the posts of the believers""","""Religion is very real , and affects all of us be overwhelmed by the `` silent `` majority . more than hold your own""",,
25132,6666,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",AGREE,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",,
25136,6666,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",AGREE,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",,
25139,6666,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",AGREE,"""Ca n't you read ?""","""Clearly , he ca n't .""",,
25142,6667,"""1. legal relationship between spouses : a legally recognized relationship , established by a civil or religious ceremony , between two people who intend to live together as sexual and domestic partners 2. specific marriage relationship : a married relationship between two people , or a somebody 's relationship with his or her spouse""","""American Heritage http : //www.bartleby.com/61/2/M0120200.html""",DISAGREE,"""legal relationship between spouses : a legally recognized relationship , established by a civil or religious ceremony , between two people who intend to live together as sexual and domestic partners 2. specific marriage relationship : a married relationship between two people , or a somebody 's""","""American Heritage http : //www.bartleby.com/61/2/M0120200.html""",,
25152,6668,"""`` He said the ruling would affect those in jail for three or four months because of parole violations , those getting early release dates , and those who might qualify for early release for taking part in rehabilitation programs. `` sinjin - Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""IOW , you do n't have a clue . The usual nothing just a WAG . I am surprised NATO bit on a line like that ? Perhaps he thought you actually knew something""",DISAGREE,"""He said the ruling would affect those in jail for three or four months because of parole violations , those getting early release dates , and those who might qualify for early release for taking part in rehabilitation programs. `` sinjin - Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""IOW , you do n't have a clue . The usual nothing just a WAG . I am surprised NATO bit on a line like that ?""",,
25170,6669,"""I 've just done a bit of hunting around , and I ca n't find anything to say Jerome had anything to do with the compilation of the Bible , only the translation of the Latin vulgate , which I 'll gladly admit is not an accurate translation . As for why I have argued the point , I think the truth is important , and I think it 's two easy to take a blanket `` oh , it was all political so we ca n't trust any of it `` approach to the Bible , and this is done largely in a manner that resembles special pleading . No other historical source or collection of sources is questionned with anything like this level of intensity or scepticism . It smacks of an attempt to justify ones own disbelief by discrediting the evidence . It does n't seem to be about a search for the truth , only to justify a preconcieved position .""","""The sources state that Jerome declared three books to be apocryphal , and his correspondence includes replies to claims that his rejection of those books was political . If he was n't involved in the selection why would he write that ? If I wanted a justification for disbelief I 'd quote Galileo , it 's much easier . This is mainly about leveling the playing field with SoC , had he bothered to reply .""",DISAGREE,"""I 've just done a bit of hunting around , and I ca n't find anything to say Jerome had anything to do with the compilation of the Bible ,""","""This is mainly about leveling the playing field with SoC , had he bothered to reply .""",,
25171,6670,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well .""","""Amazing how regularly they shoot themselves in the foot is n't it ?""",DISAGREE,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well .""","""Amazing how regularly they shoot themselves in the foot is n't it ?""",,
25179,6670,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well .""","""Amazing how regularly they shoot themselves in the foot is n't it ?""",DISAGREE,"""In fact some of the most ardent anti-abortion people I 've met are also some of the most ardent anti-comprehensive sexual education people as well .""","""Amazing how regularly they shoot themselves in the foot""",,
25181,6671,"""Powerful opponents of eco-terrorism are mounting the nation 's most formidable campaign against the homegrown sabotage . But the crime wave they hope to quell -- a 2½-year escalation of arsons and property destruction -- subsided last summer , perhaps due to law enforcement crackdowns . A congressional subcommittee held a hearing on eco-terrorism last month in which lawmakers , keyed up about terrorists since the Sept. 11 attacks , likened America 's green underground to al-Qaida . An FBI official testified that the Earth Liberation Front and Animal Liberation Front had become the nation 's most active and destructive domestic terrorist groups .""","""Radio Towers Bulldozed by Eco-Terrorists Tuesday September 8 , 2009""",DISAGREE,"""An FBI official testified that the Earth Liberation Front and Animal Liberation Front had become the nation 's most active and destructive domestic terrorist groups .""","""Radio Towers Bulldozed by Eco-Terrorists Tuesday September 8 , 2009""",,
25182,6671,"""Powerful opponents of eco-terrorism are mounting the nation 's most formidable campaign against the homegrown sabotage . But the crime wave they hope to quell -- a 2½-year escalation of arsons and property destruction -- subsided last summer , perhaps due to law enforcement crackdowns . A congressional subcommittee held a hearing on eco-terrorism last month in which lawmakers , keyed up about terrorists since the Sept. 11 attacks , likened America 's green underground to al-Qaida . An FBI official testified that the Earth Liberation Front and Animal Liberation Front had become the nation 's most active and destructive domestic terrorist groups .""","""Radio Towers Bulldozed by Eco-Terrorists Tuesday September 8 , 2009""",DISAGREE,"""opponents of eco-terrorism formidable campaign against the homegrown sabotage escalation of arsons and property destruction hearing on eco-terrorism lawmakers likened America 's green underground to al-Qaida Earth Liberation Front Animal Liberation Front nation 's most active destructive domestic terrorist groups""","""Radio Towers Bulldozed by Eco-Terrorists Tuesday September 8 , 2009""",,
25191,6679,"""`` Certainly , I think it would be fair to say that it would be more likely for a court decision to impose the recognition of same-sex marriage from Massachusetts on another state in the event of the repeal of D.O.M.A. , `` Pepperdine Law Prof. Douglas Kmiec told ABC News .""","""I think this is unlikely under the current makeup of the Supreme Court . But that of course is the fear that many have , i.e. , that gay marriage would be imposed via judicial fiat ( whether at the state or federal level ) rather than through legislative means .""",DISAGREE,"""Certainly , I think it would be fair to say that it would be more likely for a court decision to impose the recognition of same-sex marriage""","""I think this is unlikely under the current makeup of the Supreme Court .""",,
25194,6679,"""`` Certainly , I think it would be fair to say that it would be more likely for a court decision to impose the recognition of same-sex marriage from Massachusetts on another state in the event of the repeal of D.O.M.A. , `` Pepperdine Law Prof. Douglas Kmiec told ABC News .""","""I think this is unlikely under the current makeup of the Supreme Court . But that of course is the fear that many have , i.e. , that gay marriage would be imposed via judicial fiat ( whether at the state or federal level ) rather than through legislative means .""",DISAGREE,"""I think it would be fair to say that it would be more likely for a court decision to impose the recognition of same-sex marriage from Massachusetts on another state""","""that of course is the fear that many have , i.e. , that gay marriage would be imposed via judicial fiat""",,
25198,6680,"""I think the relationship between science and faith is often distorted by the nature of the discussions we have here . We debate matters where faith is being used to advocate views that are in direct contradiction of what science has discovered- the YEC view ( for example ) is an extreme . I do n't think this paints a very complementary picture of faith in most peoples minds . We touch far less on the more intriguing and subtle matters such as the reconcilliation of scientific outlook with a religious one .""","""I 've noticed . It 's like walking into a rock fight between two of your best friends , and getting tore up . It saddens me to see such brilliant people ignore or supress one of the most beautiful parts of being a human .""",DISAGREE,"""the relationship between science and faith is often distorted by the nature of the discussions we have here""","""I 've noticed . It 's like walking into a rock fight between two of your best friends , and getting tore up .""",,
25213,6682,"""Forget law abiding , convicted felons on death row are free to marry if they so desire . I have never found anything wrong with that either . At the end of the day marriage deals with the two consenting adults who have decided to legally document their partnership .""","""I think you 're right , but prisoners usually marry women , do n't they ?""",DISAGREE,"""Forget law abiding , convicted felons on death row are free to marry if they so desire .""","""I think you 're right , but prisoners usually marry women , do n't they ?""",,
25222,6684,"""The people should decide becasue that is democracy . There have been times which democracy has failed but when the courts intiate against the people . The people have the right to change the constitution when courts abuse their poswers . They ca n't violate separation of powers and not expect the people to change it .""","""Actually it 's a Republic . Shall we put your marriage to the vote ?""",DISAGREE,"""The people should decide becasue that is democracy . The people have the right to change the constitution when courts abuse their poswers .""","""Actually it 's a Republic . Shall we put your marriage to the vote ?""",,
25221,6684,"""The people should decide becasue that is democracy . There have been times which democracy has failed but when the courts intiate against the people . The people have the right to change the constitution when courts abuse their poswers . They ca n't violate separation of powers and not expect the people to change it .""","""Actually it 's a Republic . Shall we put your marriage to the vote ?""",DISAGREE,"""The people have the right to change the constitution when courts abuse their poswers""","""Actually it 's a Republic . Shall we put your marriage to the vote ?""",,
25228,6685,"""Verify the obvious , not ignore it in favor of some mindless postulations [ oddly ] convenient to how someone wants to live their life ; amazing how that works out ...""","""So there 's the typical creationist claim that , `` if you do n't believe as I do , then you are trying to escape the punishment of my petty god. `` How bizzare that you claim that science has something to do with how one wants to live his life , while ID creationism and creationism are somehow based on evidence . So , why not present the evidence that ID creationism has any logical or empirical support . Show me the evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""convenient to how someone wants to live their life ; amazing how that works out ...""","""How bizzare that you claim that science has something to do with how one wants to live his life , while ID creationism and creationism are somehow based on evidence .""",,
25233,6693,"""Incidentally , is the title of this forum meant to imply that creationism and Intelligent Design are two names for the same thing ? While I agree that they are more similar to each other than to evolution , it troubles me that anyone would believe that they are synonymous . For those that think the title is justified , what about the two beliefs do you find similar enough to class them as the same idea ?""","""Because of the history of it . Well , ID is actually identical to 'scientific creationism ' , but spruced up with more scientific terminology to attempt to pass 'seperation of church and state ' . Let 's just say that I.D . is an attempt to teach Creationism in school .""",DISAGREE,"""the title of this forum meant to imply that creationism and Intelligent Design are two names for the same thing ? what about the two beliefs do you find similar enough to class them as the same idea ?""","""Because of the history of it . ID is actually identical to 'scientific creationism ' , but spruced up with more scientific terminology to attempt to pass 'seperation of church and state ' .""",,
25234,6693,"""Incidentally , is the title of this forum meant to imply that creationism and Intelligent Design are two names for the same thing ? While I agree that they are more similar to each other than to evolution , it troubles me that anyone would believe that they are synonymous . For those that think the title is justified , what about the two beliefs do you find similar enough to class them as the same idea ?""","""Because of the history of it . Well , ID is actually identical to 'scientific creationism ' , but spruced up with more scientific terminology to attempt to pass 'seperation of church and state ' . Let 's just say that I.D . is an attempt to teach Creationism in school .""",DISAGREE,"""Incidentally , is the title of this forum meant to imply that creationism and Intelligent Design are two names for the same thing ? While I agree that they are more similar to each other than to evolution , it troubles me that anyone would believe that they are synonymous .""","""Because of the history of it . Well , ID is actually identical to 'scientific creationism ' , but spruced up with more scientific terminology to attempt to pass 'seperation of church and state""",,
25240,6695,"""i have a 2 years old child . i have come to believe i am unfit as a parent . i plan to kill this child at next available opportunity .""","""You need help pal . joke or not you need help .""",DISAGREE,"""i have a 2 years old child . i have come to believe i am unfit as a parent . i plan to kill this child at next available opportunity .""","""You need help pal . joke or not you need help .""",,
25241,6695,"""i have a 2 years old child . i have come to believe i am unfit as a parent . i plan to kill this child at next available opportunity .""","""You need help pal . joke or not you need help .""",DISAGREE,"""i plan to kill this child at next available opportunity .""","""You need help pal . joke or not you need help .""",,
25247,6697,"""If we look into the Bible , we can find that there are many instances where it talks of things we never knew of before until today . ... Biology Blood Circulation , Leviticus 17:11""","""Here 's what that verse actually says .""",DISAGREE,"""Leviticus 17:11""","""Here 's what that verse actually says .""",,
25255,6700,"""......... So in conclusion , as the alleged science of evolution is based solely on pre-determined assumptions , so is the myth of Global Warming .""","""In short , you have nothing but faith , and seek to project it where it has no place .""",DISAGREE,"""So in conclusion , as the alleged science of evolution is based solely on pre-determined assumptions , so is the myth of Global Warming .""","""In short , you have nothing but faith , and seek to project it where it has no place .""",,
25272,6702,"""Chloe , in the very first post of this thread you failed to disclose what it is about the so-called `` pro-life `` view of women that makes their views superior to the pro-choice view .""","""No she did n't .""",DISAGREE,"""Chloe , in the very first post of this thread you failed to disclose what it is about the so-called `` pro-life `` view of women that makes their views superior to the pro-choice view .""","""No she did n't .""",,
25274,6702,"""Chloe , in the very first post of this thread you failed to disclose what it is about the so-called `` pro-life `` view of women that makes their views superior to the pro-choice view .""","""No she did n't .""",DISAGREE,"""Chloe , in the very first post of this thread you failed to disclose what it is about the so-called `` pro-life ``""","""No she did n't .""",,
25285,6703,"""3 ) Being gay is immoral in the eyes of God . Taking humans out of consideration , why did God create some animals with both sex organs ( hermaphradites ) , switch sexes ( male to female , or vice versa ) when one sex is dominate , or engage in homosexual activities ? Just wondering if any of the anti-gay activist can answers these . I 'm curious . Thanks !""","""First of all , why would you take humans out of consideration ? Does n't the verse I posted above show where in addition to God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage , it speaks of God giving humanity dominion over every creature on Earth which humanities personal history is evidence of actually happening ? So since we are made in Gods image : Gen 1:26 Then God said , `` Let Us make man in Our image , according to Our likeness ; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth , and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth . '' And notice how here , as He decides to create us in His image , He repeats Himself by giving us the same authority over all living things as He did when He blessed Adam and Eve and commanded them to be fruitful and multiply 2 verses later at Genesis 1:28 ? So just because homosexuality is found in the animal kingdom , who also never sinned against God and fell from grace by the way , it 's irrational to compare animals sexual habits to Mans as we are made in Gods image and live by different morals and values than animals do . And btw , welcome to the forum .""",DISAGREE,"""Being gay is immoral eyes of God humans consideration God create some animals both sex organs switch sexes sex is dominate homosexual anti-gay""","""take humans out of consideration ? God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage God giving humanity dominion Gods image Let Us make man in Our image Our likeness same authority over all living things blessed Adam and Eve to be fruitful and multiply Genesis sinned against God animals sexual habits to Mans different morals and values""",,
25287,6703,"""3 ) Being gay is immoral in the eyes of God . Taking humans out of consideration , why did God create some animals with both sex organs ( hermaphradites ) , switch sexes ( male to female , or vice versa ) when one sex is dominate , or engage in homosexual activities ? Just wondering if any of the anti-gay activist can answers these . I 'm curious . Thanks !""","""First of all , why would you take humans out of consideration ? Does n't the verse I posted above show where in addition to God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage , it speaks of God giving humanity dominion over every creature on Earth which humanities personal history is evidence of actually happening ? So since we are made in Gods image : Gen 1:26 Then God said , `` Let Us make man in Our image , according to Our likeness ; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth , and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth . '' And notice how here , as He decides to create us in His image , He repeats Himself by giving us the same authority over all living things as He did when He blessed Adam and Eve and commanded them to be fruitful and multiply 2 verses later at Genesis 1:28 ? So just because homosexuality is found in the animal kingdom , who also never sinned against God and fell from grace by the way , it 's irrational to compare animals sexual habits to Mans as we are made in Gods image and live by different morals and values than animals do . And btw , welcome to the forum .""",DISAGREE,"""Being gay is immoral in the eyes of God . Taking humans out of consideration , why did God create some animals with both sex organs ( hermaphradites ) , switch sexes ( male to female , or vice versa ) when one sex is dominate""","""why would you take humans out of consideration ? Does n't the verse I posted above show where in addition to God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage , it speaks of God giving humanity dominion over every creature on Earth which humanities personal history is evidence of actually happening ?""",,
25288,6703,"""3 ) Being gay is immoral in the eyes of God . Taking humans out of consideration , why did God create some animals with both sex organs ( hermaphradites ) , switch sexes ( male to female , or vice versa ) when one sex is dominate , or engage in homosexual activities ? Just wondering if any of the anti-gay activist can answers these . I 'm curious . Thanks !""","""First of all , why would you take humans out of consideration ? Does n't the verse I posted above show where in addition to God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage , it speaks of God giving humanity dominion over every creature on Earth which humanities personal history is evidence of actually happening ? So since we are made in Gods image : Gen 1:26 Then God said , `` Let Us make man in Our image , according to Our likeness ; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth , and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth . '' And notice how here , as He decides to create us in His image , He repeats Himself by giving us the same authority over all living things as He did when He blessed Adam and Eve and commanded them to be fruitful and multiply 2 verses later at Genesis 1:28 ? So just because homosexuality is found in the animal kingdom , who also never sinned against God and fell from grace by the way , it 's irrational to compare animals sexual habits to Mans as we are made in Gods image and live by different morals and values than animals do . And btw , welcome to the forum .""",DISAGREE,"""Being gay is immoral in the eyes of God . Taking humans out of consideration""","""why would you take humans out of consideration ? Does n't the verse I posted above show where in addition to God blessing Adam and Eve in marriage""",,
25296,6704,"""I hope that we will have had the most informative . intellectually honest and civil discussion possible . And that it serves as an example and benefit to others . Let 's get it on !""","""Ditto ! With that in mind ... I want to let you make your own arguments for your position before I post a rebuttal to any of them , for reasons described above . Instead , though , I can post a brief few arguments of my own . Firstly : the statement you are trying to support is `` Biologically speaking , a human individual 's life begins at conception `` . However , the word 'life ' - that which you are arguing has a factually determinable beginning , does not have an absolute biological definition . To quote the wikipedia article on it : `` It is still a challenge for scientists and philosophers to define life in unequivocal terms `` . This is doubly the case when considering the 'life ' of an individual , as opposed to the 'life ' of , say , a skin cell . For example , a person with no brain activity can be composed of living cells if they are kept on life support , but legally and medically the individual is considered dead . The argument , then : If 'life ' has no definitive definition , how can you argue that it has a clearly definable start ? Secondly : Consider a zygote . According to you , it is an individual . But a zygote can split into two - to form monozygotic , or 'identical ' , twins . Before splitting , it is one 'individual ' . Afterwards , it is two . Where has the extra individual come from ? Given that the split can happen up to 15 days after fertilisation , when was the start of that individuals life ? Thirdly : In contrast to identical twins , consider a chimera organism . A chimera is made up of cells containing one of two different strands of human DNA - they are formed when two fertilised eggs or early embryos collide and become one embryo , which then goes on to be a single human being . Given that the single individual was created by the merging of two different individuals ( by your definition ) , when was the biological start of their life ?""",DISAGREE,"""I hope that we will have had the most informative . intellectually honest and civil discussion possible .""","""With that in mind ... I want to let you make your own arguments for your position before I post a rebuttal to any of them , for reasons described above .""",,
25300,6705,"""An example where both natural selection and mutations work together to enable a creature to survive also results in a loss of genetic information . Consider that flightless bird in the Galapagos Islands , oh , what is it 's name ? I think it is called something like the flightless conrade .""","""Oh goody . Some more of your well informed opinion based on wishful thinking , no research and even less actual thought . Probably the bird you are talking about is the Cormorant ( Nannopterum harrisi ) . Yes , it is flightless because it has no need to fly . There were no natural preditors in the Galapagos and the bird is a sea bird . It swims and eats fish . It 's wings are much reduced because it swims by kicking rather than by `` flying `` through the water like a penguin . Like the penguin it is a diving bird .""",DISAGREE,"""enable a creature to survive also results in a loss of genetic information .""","""informed opinion based on wishful thinking , no research and even less actual thought .""",,
25308,6706,"""What are the best arguments for/against gun-control ? When I asked this question at http : //p078.ezboard.com/bguncontrol4778 people there seemed to think that gun-control was a good idea . Bush and Kerry both seemed to favor gun-control in the debate , but Kerry seems to believe more strongly in it .""","""30 million Russian citizens killed . 5-12 million German citizens ( depending on the source you read ) along with 6 million Jewish people killed . An estimated 100 million Chinese citizens killed . 20 million Africans killed in various countries in Africa . 2 million Cambodians slaughtered . This is just the first 5 off the top of my head that occured in the world during the 20th Century . All occured after sweeping gun control took place and forced disarmament of citizens . In America , every state that has enacted restrictive gun control has seen an increase in crime , police brutality , questionable law enforcement practices such as violations of 4th amendment rights and so on . Washington DC enacted a total handgun ban in 1976 , if you look at the crime rate reports from the years before and the years after that took effect , the truth is very telling . In Britain and Australia , both nations enacted sweeping gun bans and forced confiscation . The crime rates of both nations has skyrocketed . Violent crime has especially increased in both countries as criminals realize they have little to fear from their victims now . Reports of police brutality in both nations is on the rise . A consequence of the gun ban in Britain is the repeal of their guarantee of a quick and fair trial . This bit of legislation basically allows a suspect to be held indefinitely without a trial or even being notified of the crimes he or she is accused of . For a very telling reason against gun control , I recommend you watch the UN Gun Debate between Rebecca Peters and Wayne LaPierre . Then , examine the international poll results online from the debate . Gun control kills . History has proven this over and over again . I know that some gun control advocates have the best of intentions at heart but what they fail to realize is that by opening that door , they allow those with less than the best intentions to take advantage of the situation . This is exactly what Hitler did in 1938 . He took advantage of the 1935 gun control act of Germany . He used it to find his enemies and eliminate them . Is over 150 million victims of gun control reason enough for you ? It is for me . Mike""",DISAGREE,"""best arguments for/against gun-control ? Bush and Kerry favor gun-control in the debate""","""30 million Russian citizens killed 5-12 million German citizens with 6 million Jewish people killed 100 million Chinese citizens killed . 20 million Africans killed 2 million Cambodians slaughtered forced disarmament UN Gun Debate Rebecca Peters and Wayne LaPierre advantage exactly what Hitler did in 1938 1935 gun control act of Germany enemies and eliminate""",,
25317,6707,"""Not all of them .""","""Correction : hardly any of them . This is just another lame attempt to use the `` guilt by association `` BS .""",DISAGREE,"""Not all of them .""","""Correction : hardly any of them . This is just another lame attempt to use the `` guilt by association `` BS .""",,
25325,6708,"""We must take it upon ourselves to set right and heal and care for all our citizens . It is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation .""","""Well then just rescind the OP and we can discuss this within those parameters ( which you have unfortunately already dismissed in your conversation with JP in 31 ; `` This is an endeavor not of a voluntary nature but an effort to fix a crumbling system that is bankrupting and jeopardizing the health and well being of a majority of Americans. `` )""",DISAGREE,"""set right and heal and care for all our citizens . It is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation""","""This is an endeavor not of a voluntary nature bankrupting and jeopardizing the health and well being of a majority of""",,
25329,6708,"""We must take it upon ourselves to set right and heal and care for all our citizens . It is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation .""","""Well then just rescind the OP and we can discuss this within those parameters ( which you have unfortunately already dismissed in your conversation with JP in 31 ; `` This is an endeavor not of a voluntary nature but an effort to fix a crumbling system that is bankrupting and jeopardizing the health and well being of a majority of Americans. `` )""",DISAGREE,"""it is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation .""","""This is an endeavor not of a voluntary nature but an effort to fix a crumbling system that is bankrupting""",,
25332,6708,"""We must take it upon ourselves to set right and heal and care for all our citizens . It is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation .""","""Well then just rescind the OP and we can discuss this within those parameters ( which you have unfortunately already dismissed in your conversation with JP in 31 ; `` This is an endeavor not of a voluntary nature but an effort to fix a crumbling system that is bankrupting and jeopardizing the health and well being of a majority of Americans. `` )""",DISAGREE,"""We must take it upon ourselves to set right and heal and care for all our citizens . It is not a question of rights in my opinion , but a moral obligation .""","""Well then just rescind the OP and we can discuss this within those parameters ( which you have unfortunately already dismissed in your conversation with JP in 31""",,
25343,6710,"""3 . Therefore abortion is wrong .""","""Nope .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion is wrong .""","""Nope .""",,
25348,6710,"""3 . Therefore abortion is wrong .""","""Nope .""",DISAGREE,"""Therefore abortion is wrong .""","""Nope""",,
25351,6711,"""Well , then , I guess that in America we ca n't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we ?""","""Well , well , well , Samantha Lee and Rebecca Peters rolled up all in one . Who is to blame ? The citizenry and the Constitution or one man , a politician of the elite ? One of your own . If he did it ? What about the Yale student who wrote the definitive book on self-defense that agrees with your line of babble ? We can place the blame at your doorstep then ca n't we ? Why I just imagine you are mad enough to kill ! ! We warn repeatedly that you can not put your faith nor your life in jeapardy for a meaningless piece of paper . You getting the message yet ? The police have no duty to protect you , you are on your own .""",DISAGREE,"""America we ca n't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we ?""","""We can place the blame at your doorstep then ca n't we ? Why I just imagine you are mad enough to kill ! ! The police have no duty to protect you , you are on your own""",,
25353,6711,"""Well , then , I guess that in America we ca n't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we ?""","""Well , well , well , Samantha Lee and Rebecca Peters rolled up all in one . Who is to blame ? The citizenry and the Constitution or one man , a politician of the elite ? One of your own . If he did it ? What about the Yale student who wrote the definitive book on self-defense that agrees with your line of babble ? We can place the blame at your doorstep then ca n't we ? Why I just imagine you are mad enough to kill ! ! We warn repeatedly that you can not put your faith nor your life in jeapardy for a meaningless piece of paper . You getting the message yet ? The police have no duty to protect you , you are on your own .""",DISAGREE,"""Well , then , I guess that in America we ca n't possibly be safe""","""is to blame ? The citizenry and the Constitution or one man , a politician of the elite ?""",,
25354,6711,"""Well , then , I guess that in America we ca n't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we ?""","""Well , well , well , Samantha Lee and Rebecca Peters rolled up all in one . Who is to blame ? The citizenry and the Constitution or one man , a politician of the elite ? One of your own . If he did it ? What about the Yale student who wrote the definitive book on self-defense that agrees with your line of babble ? We can place the blame at your doorstep then ca n't we ? Why I just imagine you are mad enough to kill ! ! We warn repeatedly that you can not put your faith nor your life in jeapardy for a meaningless piece of paper . You getting the message yet ? The police have no duty to protect you , you are on your own .""",DISAGREE,"""in America we ca n't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we ?""","""The police have no duty to protect you , you are on your own .""",,
25366,6712,"""And Cali , you did n't respond to this ...""","""Well , maybe if you had taken the time to read through the previous posts you 'd see my response . But I 'll answer it again for your sake .""",DISAGREE,"""you did n't respond to this""","""maybe if you had taken the time to read through the previous posts you 'd see my response""",,
25374,6713,"""600 ? Oh really ? Looks like the following scriptures are vague enough that they could apply to anything and nothing at the same time . Making vague enough comments can easily look prophetic . The fact that there are n't specifics is a key failure in your argument . If the bible was truly prophetic and scientifically accurate , terms that would easily be seen as represenativive of the natural force would be found everywhere , yet they are not . You are talking a little and making it to be far more then it is . Once again , anything vague enough can be taken for anything in any light under any condition .""","""Well , I guess you can refuse to see something that 's pretty obvious . It 's up to you .""",DISAGREE,"""600 ? Oh really ? Looks like the following scriptures are vague""","""Well , I guess you can refuse to see something that 's pretty obvious . It 's up to you .""",,
25381,6714,"""`` I think the school and the district made a terrible , terrible judgment , `` he told the Times. ``""","""Because they let the GSA act like any other club with the same amount of rights and lack of adminstration interference ?""",DISAGREE,"""I think the school and the district made a terrible , terrible judgment""","""Because they let the GSA act like any other club with the same amount of rights""",,
25393,6716,"""That 's what I thought SuperSport does n't have the guts or the intelligence to stand by his own statements .""","""My great , great , great grandfather dug a hole when he was 15 . He put a time capsule in that hole . After years of erosion , I come across it at the same time a dead bug is found near it . According to you , they are both the same age since they were both found on top of the ground . Do you agree with this or do you disagree ? once again , you are assuming erosion when that may or may not have happened . Your contention that all fossils found on the surface got there by way of erosion is nothing but speculation . So how exactly does cement-like rock get removed from fossils ?""",DISAGREE,"""That 's what I thought SuperSport does n't have the guts or the intelligence to stand by his own statements .""","""Your contention that all fossils found on the surface got there by way of erosion is nothing but speculation . So how exactly does cement-like rock get removed from fossils ?""",,
25392,6716,"""That 's what I thought SuperSport does n't have the guts or the intelligence to stand by his own statements .""","""My great , great , great grandfather dug a hole when he was 15 . He put a time capsule in that hole . After years of erosion , I come across it at the same time a dead bug is found near it . According to you , they are both the same age since they were both found on top of the ground . Do you agree with this or do you disagree ? once again , you are assuming erosion when that may or may not have happened . Your contention that all fossils found on the surface got there by way of erosion is nothing but speculation . So how exactly does cement-like rock get removed from fossils ?""",DISAGREE,"""does n't have the guts or the intelligence to stand by his own statements .""","""to you both the same age since they were both found on top of the ground . Your contention that all fossils found on the surface got there by way of erosion speculation So how exactly does cement-like rock get removed from fossils ?""",,
25396,6717,"""I thought of somthing sunday , as I was teaching sunday school ( I know shocking ) ,""","""You are n't serious are you ? ? ? Is this a joke ? You 're one of the most active attackers of Christianity in these threads . Are n't you the one that likes to use the term `` Christonazi ? ``""",DISAGREE,"""I was teaching sunday school ( I know shocking )""","""You 're one of the most active attackers of Christianity in these threads .""",,
25409,6719,"""* * Just rece8ived a threat of banning from a 'moderator ' . Why ? Apparently because 1 or more darwinists have complained to him that I refuse to learn about evolution . This , of course , is a complete crock , butr apparently the 'mod ' never bothered to check it out before leaping to do the dawinist 's bidding . The fact is that I know more about 'evolution ' than most of the members , and I never stop searching for web material that will help me to learn more . There is , so far as I am aware , no regulation that says any person posting to the 'evolution ' forum must have , or be in the process of obtaining , a recognised degree in evolutionary biology , genetics , biochemistry , molecular biology , or kindred field of study . The fact that none of the darwinists in this forum is capable of intellibly explaining the basic mechanics behind his/her gene-based , genetic determinist , RMNS hypothesis of evolution 's driving force/cause/mechanism is certainly no fault of mine , or anyone save themselves . That is their problem , and if they can not sell their notion because they can not explain it in empirical terms , that should be their concern and nobody else 's . But for them to try and reverse the situation by p [ retending that their incompetence is my laziness , is not merely ludicrous and ridiculous , it is a scurrilous lie . Which is par for the course and comes with the territory when you are arguing with ideologues , but when you discover that there is someone who , given the responsibility of moderating a forum fairly and impartially , is acting simply as an 'intimidator ' for the darwinists , that 's when you know that the cards are stacked , the dice weighted , sand your voice will soon be smothered . If you hear no more from me , you 'll know why not . If the 'mod ' erases this post before I 'm 'disappeared ' , you wo n't . C'est la vie . ww [ Mike Turner ]""","""Well some of us at least tried to get you to learn more . But I seriously doubt that you would be banned for not having a biology degree , I rather suspect other factors came into play . Certainly I never have complained to any moderators about your posts . I rather suspect nobody has , indeed I rather suspect you catalyzed any banning yourself , but I do not see how since you are rather mild mannered ( but more verbal ) than the average creo .""",DISAGREE,"""Just rece8ived a threat of banning from a 'moderator ' . Why ? Apparently because 1 or more darwinists have complained to him that I refuse to learn about evolution .""","""Well some of us at least tried to get you to learn more . But I seriously doubt that you would be banned for not having a biology degree ,""",,
25411,6719,"""* * Just rece8ived a threat of banning from a 'moderator ' . Why ? Apparently because 1 or more darwinists have complained to him that I refuse to learn about evolution . This , of course , is a complete crock , butr apparently the 'mod ' never bothered to check it out before leaping to do the dawinist 's bidding . The fact is that I know more about 'evolution ' than most of the members , and I never stop searching for web material that will help me to learn more . There is , so far as I am aware , no regulation that says any person posting to the 'evolution ' forum must have , or be in the process of obtaining , a recognised degree in evolutionary biology , genetics , biochemistry , molecular biology , or kindred field of study . The fact that none of the darwinists in this forum is capable of intellibly explaining the basic mechanics behind his/her gene-based , genetic determinist , RMNS hypothesis of evolution 's driving force/cause/mechanism is certainly no fault of mine , or anyone save themselves . That is their problem , and if they can not sell their notion because they can not explain it in empirical terms , that should be their concern and nobody else 's . But for them to try and reverse the situation by p [ retending that their incompetence is my laziness , is not merely ludicrous and ridiculous , it is a scurrilous lie . Which is par for the course and comes with the territory when you are arguing with ideologues , but when you discover that there is someone who , given the responsibility of moderating a forum fairly and impartially , is acting simply as an 'intimidator ' for the darwinists , that 's when you know that the cards are stacked , the dice weighted , sand your voice will soon be smothered . If you hear no more from me , you 'll know why not . If the 'mod ' erases this post before I 'm 'disappeared ' , you wo n't . C'est la vie . ww [ Mike Turner ]""","""Well some of us at least tried to get you to learn more . But I seriously doubt that you would be banned for not having a biology degree , I rather suspect other factors came into play . Certainly I never have complained to any moderators about your posts . I rather suspect nobody has , indeed I rather suspect you catalyzed any banning yourself , but I do not see how since you are rather mild mannered ( but more verbal ) than the average creo .""",DISAGREE,"""darwinists I refuse to learn about evolution . arguing with ideologues""","""Well some of us at least tried to get you to learn more mild mannered than the average creo""",,
25445,6726,"""I was actually hoping to receive the onslaught from the creationists . I considered that post more as bait to begin a logical discussion for evolution vs creationism . I wanted to hear -- from a creationist -- why one can concede to evolution within a species within just 100 years , but can never agree to macroevolution across the span of hundreds of millions of years . It 's tantamount to believing each species of creature now has always been here and has only transformed through microevolution . ( Well , maybe the cockroach . Those things are the best , albeit icky , animal survival machines : P ) Besides , there are many examples of macroevolution which would be brought up as a creationist ignorantly believes this never happens . Of course , the end result would be that the creationist will not concede because s/he can not think logically , which is why they 're a creationist in the first place .""","""Well , I am a creationist , and I would hope I can think logically ( it 's generally a good quality for an accountant and tax attorney to have ) . The difference between microevolution and evolution as an explanation for the beginning of a species is simple . In microevolution a species is simply adapting to it 's environments . In evolution as is usually meant by the word you are talking about the formation of an entirely new creature from inorganic compounds . If this is possible I pose a few questions for you . 1 ) Why have no new creatures evolved from inorganic compounds in human memory ? 2 ) How did these inorganic compounds decide that some creatures should evolve , while others of the same species did not ? Why are there not some apes that have evolved into humans by now ? Why did n't all apes evolve into humans ? 3 ) One of my favorite pieces of confusion from evolutionists involve fossils . How do you know how old a fossil is ? Every evolutionist I have asked has stated that fossils are dated by the rock layer they are found in , but if you then ask them how the rock layer is dated they answer that it is dated by the fossils that where discovered in it ! That 's a classical example of circular reasoning . I am not a scientist , so I can not present all the evidence against evolution as clearly as someone with a scientific education and background might do . If you are truly interested in learning more about the creationist arguments against evolution you can check out the article located at http : //www.answersingenesis.org/docs2004/1106ng.asp . This article also has many links to other articles with even more information .""",DISAGREE,"""I considered that post more as bait to begin a logical discussion for evolution vs creationism .""","""If you are truly interested in learning more about the creationist arguments against evolution you can check out the article located at http :""",,
25455,6728,"""The guy can have an opinion but the ultimate choice is up to the woman who can listen to what the guy says or not , it 's up to her . I believe that is what sinjin was saying .""","""I see what she was saying now . When she said it it sounded like the man had no opinion at all .""",AGREE,"""The guy can have an opinion but the ultimate choice is up to the woman who can listen to what the guy says or not""","""I see what she was saying now""",,
25461,6729,"""Nice raising the bar . Fallacies are a creationist 's best friend . You claimed : `` have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing structure. `` Now you are changing your argument away from structure as new proteins and especially enzymes ( which are proteins ) do n't count .""","""first of all , the claim is that random changes in molecules do not produce bodiliy structures . Proteins are molecules and are thus not what I was referring to . Second , there are no new enzymes or new proteins produced by any mutations ... and not only that but none of those mutations have been shown to be random . So for all the billions of bodily structures in the world , ToE can not account for even ONE of them .""",DISAGREE,"""You claimed : `` have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing""","""the claim is that random changes in molecules do not produce bodiliy structures .""",,
25478,6734,"""So that if a cecal valve became necessary the lizard was ready to go . Having the built-in redundancy makes this possible without missing a beat .""","""`` Ready to go `` , in the sense that living things are equipped with a means of making small errors which are used by natural selection to make new structures . Barbarian , regarding mutations : There is a lot of that . Many mutations are recessive and a population over time accumulates a lot of genetic variation that can become useful if the environment changes . The founder population of lizards , for example , could have had at most , 20 alleles for any gene locus , since each lizard can only have 2 . The new ones evolved by mutation . Sometimes , we can even observe that happening , or trace the mutation back to a known ancestor . Would you like to learn about it ? .""",DISAGREE,"""a cecal valve became necessary the lizard was ready to go .""","""Many mutations are recessive and a population over time accumulates a lot of genetic variation that can become useful if the environment changes The new ones evolved by mutation .""",,
25481,6734,"""So that if a cecal valve became necessary the lizard was ready to go . Having the built-in redundancy makes this possible without missing a beat .""","""`` Ready to go `` , in the sense that living things are equipped with a means of making small errors which are used by natural selection to make new structures . Barbarian , regarding mutations : There is a lot of that . Many mutations are recessive and a population over time accumulates a lot of genetic variation that can become useful if the environment changes . The founder population of lizards , for example , could have had at most , 20 alleles for any gene locus , since each lizard can only have 2 . The new ones evolved by mutation . Sometimes , we can even observe that happening , or trace the mutation back to a known ancestor . Would you like to learn about it ? .""",DISAGREE,"""So that if a cecal valve became necessary the lizard was ready to go .""","""Would you like to learn about it ? .""",,
25484,6735,"""A federal judge has blocked the implementation of a new Arizona law that would strip same-sex domestic partners who are state employees of family health care benefits . The judge ruled that the new law violates the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment to the U.S. constitution . Check out the story in the Arizona Republic : Judge blocks Arizona law on domestic-partner benefits""","""Good news . It seems as time goes on Arizona attempts to become more and more intolerant and bigoted . Thankfully he put an end to this one ( too bad not the immigration one ) .""",AGREE,"""federal judge has blocked the implementation of a new Arizona law ruled that the new law violates the equal protection clause""","""Good news Thankfully he put an end to this one""",,
25496,6739,"""tactics not motives""","""Tactics ? Let 's see , Nazi body count : ball park , 20,000,000. pro-abortion body count : ? ? ? , ? ? ? , ? ? ? , ? ? ? , ? ? ? and counting . pro-life body count : 10 ? 20 ? Produced by people resorting to murder for their goal .""",DISAGREE,"""tactics not motives""","""Tactics ? Let 's see""",,
25526,6746,"""Give to God what belongs to God . Give to science what belongs to science""","""I see the similarity with the original scripture , in which Jesus was recognizing the authority of both God and Caesar in the world . However , Jesus was talking about the political power in the world . Jesus called the academics of his day , vipers and hypocrits , because they pretended to be holy but were evil . He called the wisest of men fools , because they did not believe in God . Also , as I stated before , truth should be the ultimate goal . I do not fear science . I do not see any truth that science may happen to reveal as a threat to faith . Why ? Because God is Truth . Jesus said , `` And the truth shall set you free `` ! ! !""",AGREE,"""Give to God what belongs to God . Give to science what belongs to science""","""I see the similarity with the original scripture , in which Jesus was recognizing the authority of both God and Caesar in the world""",,
25535,6748,"""That all changed after he became a radical gun activist ! Charlton Heston 's civil rights credentials are seriously sullied by his bigoted and homophobic remarks and his attacks on racial minorities . The endorsement by white supremacist David Duke further threatens to erode the considerable respect many Americans felt toward Heston for his years-ago commitment to human rights . -Julian Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""Really Brady . It is widely recognized that Mr. Heston gave away a very promising film career in order to take such an unpopular stand at that time . In fact he worked very little in films after that . I think the above statement was a political one , an anti-gun one , without much fact to back it up . I do n't think a man of such principle changes his mind when all he actually work to accomplish comes to pass . But you can push your poison just as far as you want to . You have a first Amendment right to do so . Mr. Heston would have wanted it that way !""",DISAGREE,"""Charlton Heston 's civil rights credentials are seriously sullied by his bigoted and homophobic remarks""","""Mr. Heston gave away a very promising film career in order to take such an unpopular stand at that time .""",,
25544,6751,"""Aside from the general gay bias demonstrated by the author ,""","""By gay bias do you mean disagrees with your opinion ?""",DISAGREE,"""Aside from the general gay bias demonstrated by the author ,""","""By gay bias do you mean disagrees with your opinion ?""",,
25546,6751,"""Aside from the general gay bias demonstrated by the author ,""","""By gay bias do you mean disagrees with your opinion ?""",DISAGREE,"""Aside from the general gay bias demonstrated by the author""","""By gay bias do you mean disagrees with your opinion ?""",,
25606,6764,"""Yes I believe in strict government regulation of business . I see the agenda behind the question .""","""So you for strict regulation of business but not people ? Interesting ... do you know who runs businesses ? Yeah , people .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes I believe in strict government regulation of business . I see the agenda behind the question .""","""So you for strict regulation of business but not people ? Interesting ... do you know who runs businesses ? Yeah , people""",,
25615,6765,"""Eighteen and pregnant , Sycloria Williams went to an abortion clinic outside Miami and paid $ 1,200 for Dr. Pierre Jean-Jacque Renelique to terminate her 23-week pregnancy . Three days later , she sat in a reclining chair , medicated to dilate her cervix and otherwise readied for the procedure . Only Renelique did n't arrive in time . According to Williams and the Florida Department of Health , she went into labor and delivered a live baby girl . What Williams and the Health Department say happened next has shocked people on both sides of the abortion debate : One of the clinic 's owners , who has no medical license , cut the infant 's umbilical cord . Williams says the woman placed the baby in a plastic biohazard bag and threw it out . Police recovered the decomposing remains in a cardboard box a week later after getting anonymous tips .""","""Doctor investigated in botched abortion - Crime & amp ; courts- msnbc.com""",AGREE,"""One of the clinic 's owners , who has no medical license , cut the infant 's umbilical cord . Williams says the woman placed the baby in a plastic biohazard bag and threw it out .""","""Doctor investigated in botched abortion - Crime & courts- msnbc.com""",,
25625,6766,"""Lets say that at some point in the near future a world was found on which lived beings with an intelligence and self awareness like our own along with society , religion and culture . These Beings have a religion that contains a story that says their world was created by a deity 3000 years after when literal Genesists say the earth was created ( ie . if now , this would make their universe 3000 years old ) . When the religious members of each race discover the others beliefs , it causes much consternation as both claim to have the truth of God on their side . How would each group of literal belivers react to the other ? the Genesists say the Beings story can not be correct because the Bible is the word of God and it records 6000 years of history . The Beings can not accept the history of Genesis as it claims th universe existed 3000 years before their holy text records the creation of the universe and their first members by their God . Both claim to have the evidence of the word of God in their holy books , and their respective histories are truth . But their truth 's disagree ........ who is `` right `` who has the real `` truth `` ?""","""Why even set this in sci-fi ? We 've got heaps of religions on the known world . Here 's one for you ... say a number of people entered a debate forum with the purpose of defending 'evolution ' which follows 'scientific method ' . They dispute religion because they say , 'if religion is true , .... which one ? ' . Then someone shows them that evolution is not an homogenous theory ; not only are there different modes of theories of evolution ; materialism , ID-theory , etc , but even within their version ( materialism ) there 's different conflicting theories , some of which are mutually exclusive . Further to that , many of their notions about science are n't scientific , but based on philosophies of science ; such as their false belief that there 's only one 'scientific method ' , or that materialism , itself , is the only method of evolutionary theory . And to top it all off , science ca n't actually determine what is true , anyway . So they 're arguing against a belief in certainty from a belief in uncertainty . They deride people 's beliefs in God , etc , as being irrational , or illogical , but do n't even realise the faulty basis of their own assumptions about evolutionary science . How do they react to this revelation ? I would guess that there would be howls of protests , lots of ad hominems etc . This of course does n't disprove 'evolution ' , but they do n't even look to that , they 're too busy attacking someone who 'd dare question their a priori notions about science . That is , in this 'hypothetic forum ' I 'm talking about""",DISAGREE,"""Lets say that at some point in the near future""","""We 've got heaps of religions on the known world . 'evolution ' which follows 'scientific method ' . ca n't actually determine what is true , anyway""",,
25630,6767,"""Nobody advocates abortion , Maximus , they advocate choice . Being in favor of choice for rape victims is not the same as thinking that children of rape should have been killed . I would not have a problem expressing my position on choice in instances of rape in the presence of a child of rape any more than I would have a problem advocating choice for pregnancies of consensual sex in the presence of myself , a child of consensual sex .""","""You advocate choice to one out of two parties involved in a pregnancy .... let us be clear that you are telling the person of rape that they had no choice could just as easily not exist .""",DISAGREE,"""advocates abortion , choice favor rape victims same thinking children killed pregnancies consensual sex""","""advocate choice one out of two parties pregnancy clear telling person of rape no choice not exist""",,
25631,6767,"""Nobody advocates abortion , Maximus , they advocate choice . Being in favor of choice for rape victims is not the same as thinking that children of rape should have been killed . I would not have a problem expressing my position on choice in instances of rape in the presence of a child of rape any more than I would have a problem advocating choice for pregnancies of consensual sex in the presence of myself , a child of consensual sex .""","""You advocate choice to one out of two parties involved in a pregnancy .... let us be clear that you are telling the person of rape that they had no choice could just as easily not exist .""",DISAGREE,"""Nobody advocates abortion , Maximus , they advocate choice . Being in favor of choice for rape victims is not the same as thinking that children of rape should have been killed .""","""You advocate choice to one out of two parties involved in a pregnancy .... let us be clear that you are telling the person of rape that they had no choice could just as easily not exist .""",,
25632,6767,"""Nobody advocates abortion , Maximus , they advocate choice . Being in favor of choice for rape victims is not the same as thinking that children of rape should have been killed . I would not have a problem expressing my position on choice in instances of rape in the presence of a child of rape any more than I would have a problem advocating choice for pregnancies of consensual sex in the presence of myself , a child of consensual sex .""","""You advocate choice to one out of two parties involved in a pregnancy .... let us be clear that you are telling the person of rape that they had no choice could just as easily not exist .""",DISAGREE,"""Nobody advocates abortion , Maximus , they advocate choice . Being in favor of choice for rape""","""You advocate choice to one out of two parties involved in a pregnancy .... let us be clear that you""",,
25648,6769,"""I can not prove the latter , though with the former , I can demonstrate some parts of the Bible which are inaccurate , and just plain wrong .""","""Based on who 's opinions ? Atheist.com and christianssuck.com ?""",DISAGREE,"""I can not prove the latter , though with the former , I can demonstrate some parts of the Bible which are inaccurate , and just plain wrong .""","""Based on who 's opinions ? Atheist.com and christianssuck.com ?""",,
25650,6769,"""I can not prove the latter , though with the former , I can demonstrate some parts of the Bible which are inaccurate , and just plain wrong .""","""Based on who 's opinions ? Atheist.com and christianssuck.com ?""",DISAGREE,"""parts of the Bible which are inaccurate""","""Based on who 's opinions ? Atheist.com and christianssuck.com ?""",,
25652,6769,"""I can not prove the latter , though with the former , I can demonstrate some parts of the Bible which are inaccurate , and just plain wrong .""","""Based on who 's opinions ? Atheist.com and christianssuck.com ?""",DISAGREE,"""I can not prove the latter , though with the former , I can demonstrate some parts of the Bible which are inaccurate , and just plain wrong .""","""Based on who 's opinions ?""",,
25668,6771,"""But , what if , everything in the universe was originally `` placed `` pretty much where we see it now ?""","""For me , this is like the idea that the speed of light was once very fast and has now slowed down . Both ideas indirectly call god a liar . This is bad . If all of our experiments show the Earth is 4.5 billion years old , then that is how old it is . If the Bible says something different , then either God meant Genesis for peoples past and now uses scientists to explain things better ( though I am uncomfortable with this idea as many scientists are atheists ) , or our puny minds , compared with God 's , have n't yet worked out how Genesis and an old Earth tie together .""",DISAGREE,"""universe was originally `` placed `` pretty much where we see it now""","""then either God meant Genesis for peoples past and now uses scientists to explain things better ( though I am uncomfortable with this idea as many scientists are atheists )""",,
25670,6772,"""We would expect to find no signs of life within this layer ( no tracks or burrows , and no signs of growing plant life such as paleosols are tree roots ) .""","""Prove it ! Prove that there would be no rooted trees at all within the sedimentary layers at all . And prove that there would be no tracks or burrows or evidence of plant life as we find . In fact we would expect to find all of those things as evidence that this event was fast and cataclysmic in order to find all of these things together in the same areas .""",DISAGREE,"""life within this layer no tracks or burrows no signs of growing plant life paleosols are tree roots""","""no rooted trees at all within the sedimentary layers no tracks or burrows or evidence of plant life as we find evidence that this event was fast things together in the same areas .""",,
25676,6773,"""And , a circle could be called a circle in the English language , but I could make up a new language in which a circle would be called a square and a square a circle .""","""But your new language would be meaningless . The definition of a circle or a square does not vary from language to language . Mathematical definitions are not matters of opinion but quite precise descriptions so that all mathematicians will understand what is meant when the term is used . The words may change but the meaning does n't . Math is not opinion . It is not my opinion that a triangle has three angles . That is a matter of definition . Apparently Habbit does n't understand that substituting the words of another language does not change the concept . That sort of argument is basically ignorant XXXX .""",DISAGREE,"""a circle could be called a circle in the English language I could make up a new language in which a circle would be called""","""But your new language would be meaningless The definition of a circle or a square does not vary from language to language""",,
25683,6774,"""You can not begin to hold a rational debate about the unknowable . -Mach""","""Religious faith , by definition , is a `` jump in the dark `` and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet . In principle , given adequate evidence etc. , there is nothing in the material world that can not be explained by Science . But someone who has , so to speak , already jumped into the dark can not see this . The most interesting questions that a supernatural account of human life can raise are concerned with the evolution of law , morality , social conventions , aesthetic sensibility and such like .""",DISAGREE,"""begin to hold rational debate about the unknowable . -Mach""","""jump in the dark Scientific Materialism can meet . aesthetic sensibility and such like .""",,
25686,6774,"""You can not begin to hold a rational debate about the unknowable . -Mach""","""Religious faith , by definition , is a `` jump in the dark `` and there is really little ( if any ) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and Scientific Materialism can meet . In principle , given adequate evidence etc. , there is nothing in the material world that can not be explained by Science . But someone who has , so to speak , already jumped into the dark can not see this . The most interesting questions that a supernatural account of human life can raise are concerned with the evolution of law , morality , social conventions , aesthetic sensibility and such like .""",DISAGREE,"""You can not begin to hold a rational debate about the unknowable""","""The most interesting questions that a supernatural account of human life can raise are concerned with the evolution of law , morality ,""",,
25687,6775,"""We are only living organisms in a line of changes . No goal no origin , only meaningless existence . Therefore no law should ever be passed . Why would one ape in the jungle rule another ape . While territorial they are not governing .""","""And that is meaningless babble . Evolution is a process that has been observed whether you like it or not . It is not a moral statement nor is it a statement of faith . It does not deal with government , laws or culture . Whining about it wo n't change it .""",DISAGREE,"""No goal no origin , only meaningless existence . Therefore no law should ever be passed .""","""And that is meaningless babble . Evolution is a process that has been observed whether you like it or not .""",,
25701,6784,"""No , I don ’ t think so .""","""It does n't matter what you think . You are wrong simply because you have learned your `` evolution `` from creationists .""",DISAGREE,"""No , I think so""","""It does n't matter what you think You are wrong simply because""",,
25700,6784,"""No , I don ’ t think so .""","""It does n't matter what you think . You are wrong simply because you have learned your `` evolution `` from creationists .""",DISAGREE,"""No , I don ’ t think so .""","""It does n't matter what you think .""",,
25707,6785,"""Hm ... And I allowed to bring the amendments into this ?""","""Please do . I always enjoy a good twisted leftist view of the Constitution . But I 'll warn you , the Preamble has no legal standing .""",DISAGREE,"""I allowed to bring the amendments into this ?""","""I always enjoy a good twisted leftist view of the Constitution""",,
25711,6786,"""According to who ? Though it may not have been practiced to its fullness , it in no way follows that all men are not created equal .""","""According to history . I see you litterally ignored how it was wrong when one looks at how blacks were treated . How does it not ? Blacks were paid less because they were black , Black soldiers were n't sent to fight because they were black . Black officers could n't even command moderate level units . Black soldiers were treated as slaves when captured and often executed , not even afforded the rights of captured white northern soldiers . In fact it went so far as if a White officer in command of a black unit was captured , he was executed because he commanded a black unit . White officers captured from white units were treated as prisoners . White soldiers who did n't even speak english recruited off immigrantion ships from Europe were paid the normal amount . White soldiers were sent to fight , not sent to dig fortifications or ditches or latrines . Blacks were not treated equally in any way during the war , and reconstroction period in the north and the south shows a stark contrast in a belief of unequal creation . I suggest you go back and learn something about the war before talking about it .""",DISAGREE,"""to who ? Though it may not have been practiced , all men are not created equal""","""According to history I see you litterally ignored how it was wrong How does it not ? , In fact it went so far as I suggest you go back and learn something about the war before talking about it .""",,
25720,6787,"""Logical truths simply follow from the way in which concepts are defined . 1 + 1 = 2 is true and always true because of the meaning of ( 1 ) , the + sign , and = . They are not dependent on matter , nor are they dependent on god . It is true regardless of whether there is any matter which the number 1 can be used to describe , or regardless of whether any conscious being exists which can think it . These are not concepts created by man , but discovered by him . I am not sure what you mean here by derived . If you mean created , they are certainly not created by the physical universe , they are true regardless of whether any universe exists at all . Yes this may contradict the view of some `` strict `` naturalists , who claim that the physical , material world is all that exists , but they simply deny that things like the `` law of non-contradiction `` exist at all . If you say it exists , they will ask you to point to its physical manifestation .""","""1+1=2 if we know the meaning or not where do concepts come from when all that exist is matter , we know concepts are outside and are not dependent on matter or experence , or being discovered ( if we did not discover them they would still exist ) how can matter bring about something that is not matter""",DISAGREE,"""Logical truths , They are not dependent on matter , nor are they dependent on god If you say it exists , they will ask you to point to""","""if we know the meaning or not where do concepts come from when all that exist is matter , how can matter bring about something that is not matter""",,
25735,6790,"""Well you never know cause your pro life and for the death penalty .""","""I believe he said 100 percent of the time ........... The difference between pro life and pro choice/abortion people is we have a wider tent ........ With you pro abortion/choice people its just kill the baby no matter what ..........""",DISAGREE,"""know cause your pro life and for the death penalty .""","""100 percent of the time With you pro abortion/choice people its just kill the baby no matter what""",,
25740,6790,"""Well you never know cause your pro life and for the death penalty .""","""I believe he said 100 percent of the time ........... The difference between pro life and pro choice/abortion people is we have a wider tent ........ With you pro abortion/choice people its just kill the baby no matter what ..........""",DISAGREE,"""you never know cause your pro life and for the death penalty .""","""With you pro abortion/choice people its just kill the baby no matter what ..........""",,
25754,6800,"""First of all , it 's not a precedent . this is the seventh or eighth state where a higher court has found anti-gay discrimination in marriage unconstitutional . Secondly , when so many rulings go in this direction , it can hardly be called `` lawlessness `` . It 's a call for lawful , constitutional interpretation of statutes . It takes extraordinary intellectual dishonesty to pretend there is some `` agenda `` at work . These decisions are the consequence of two things : our long history of rationally applying those silly words about equality that folks smarter than this generation of politicians put in the Constitution AND a long-term correction of the misunderstandings of what homosexuality IS and what its consequences are . I know you do n't personally believe it , but there is nothing wrong with us .""","""This judge stated that it was UN-Constitutional ( according to California Constitution ) to limit marriage to opposite-gender couples . So . . . . . why did we vote in 2000 on the definition of marriage ? And since the majority stated that marriage was between one man and one woman - why was that not taken into consideration with this ruling ? Why is it that when the people speak their voice , it is IGNORED ? ? Not only the mayor of SF - but this Superior Court judge as well ?""",DISAGREE,"""a this is in can I""","""This judge stated that it was UN-Constitutional ( according to California Constitution ) to limit marriage to opposite-gender couples .""",,
25785,6806,"""Making abortion illegal is an unrighteous law . Were n't there laws forbidding African Americans from sitting in the front of a bus ? Was n't that law broken ?""","""and she got punished for it Good thing too because it led to the law being changed . If someone thought drunk driving was an unrighteous law and so they did it and got punished ... I do n't think you will see much sympathy . It many states that is probably true for abortion . Why is it unrighteous anyway ? Only because you disagree with it""",DISAGREE,"""Making abortion illegal is an unrighteous Was n't that law broken ?""","""she got punished for it Good thing too because it led to the law being changed .""",,
25793,6808,"""Really , so California is just a peachy crime free place because of its strict firearms laws ? What about New York ? But wait ! Do n't forget good ol Washington DC ! Their crime rate is lower than Bush 's approval rating because of their strict firearm laws ! Of course they are going to have a higher rate of firearms death , but they 're obviously going to have a lower rate of everything else ( criminal related ) death . In the end , Its lower .""","""You obviously dont know what your talking about . Ever since Florida became the first state to allow people to carry guns around Florida has been number 1 or 2 in violent crime each year according to the FBI !""",DISAGREE,"""California strict firearms laws New York Washington DC they 're obviously going to have a lower rate of everything else ( criminal related ) death""","""Florida became the first state to allow people to carry guns Florida has been number 1 or 2 in violent crime each year according to the FBI !""",,
25809,6811,"""The number of deaths wouldn´t be lower in any way . After all , countries like Rwanda and Sierra Leone don´t have a working governmental strucure so couldn´t enforce such a ban .""","""Entirely wrong on this point . I was in sierra leone during hte rebellion , nad they did have a working government structure from begining to end . Civilians in rebel controlled portions of sierra leone were hacked apart with machetes ( literally ) and horribly treated because they had no way to fight back . In several circumstances , entire villages were bypassed by the rebels becasue one or 2 people had ignored the ban on guns . Rebels showed up , took fire from the town , and went and found an easier town to pick on . There was a move by certain british folks who worked for certain british companies to arm the civilian population . Unfortunatly , the UN impoased an arms embargo against sierra leone and short circuited the plan .""",DISAGREE,"""After all , countries like Rwanda and Sierra Leone don´t have a working governmental strucure""","""In several circumstances , entire villages were bypassed by the rebels becasue one or 2 people had ignored""",,
25819,6813,"""yet many debaters spend more posts arguing what is evolution and why youre wrong to call such-and-such evolution , and not enough time actually discussing how the facts , evidence and theories fit into the bigger picture""","""Actually it is the creationists who do n't know what they are talking about . If they wish to talk about cosmology , then by all means talk about it . Just do n't pretend that anything discusses has any bearing on evolutionary theory .""",DISAGREE,"""arguing what is evolution and why youre wrong to call such-and-such evolution""","""If they wish to talk about cosmology , then by all means talk about it .""",,
25820,6813,"""yet many debaters spend more posts arguing what is evolution and why youre wrong to call such-and-such evolution , and not enough time actually discussing how the facts , evidence and theories fit into the bigger picture""","""Actually it is the creationists who do n't know what they are talking about . If they wish to talk about cosmology , then by all means talk about it . Just do n't pretend that anything discusses has any bearing on evolutionary theory .""",DISAGREE,"""debaters spend more posts arguing what is evolution and why youre wrong to call such-and-such evolution , and not enough time""","""Just do n't pretend that anything discusses has any bearing on evolutionary theory .""",,
25842,6818,"""It is curious how lately christians have been telling me that being an aethiest ( which I am ) , is a religion . The above post is a good example of this misunderstanding . First - the lack of a religion is NOT a religion . Second , I 'll simply disagree with your statement . Observation , reasoning , and deduction is exactly what leads me to understand that there is no god , and that religion is merely an attempt to explain what we have not yet been able to reason out . As our knowledge increases , our need for a god decreases , and we can begin to see through the emotional fog of religion that keeps us in ignorance .""","""Well , the type of atheism you are talking about here requires faith . If you say `` I know there is no god , `` this statement requires faith . You have not observed anything that would lead you to reason or deduce that there must not be a god . The presence of religion has nothing to do with this faith and it 's not a religion , just a gross assumption with no `` proof. ``""",DISAGREE,"""It is curious how lately christians have been telling me that being an aethiest ( which I am ) , is a religion .""","""no `` proof. ``""",,
25845,6818,"""It is curious how lately christians have been telling me that being an aethiest ( which I am ) , is a religion . The above post is a good example of this misunderstanding . First - the lack of a religion is NOT a religion . Second , I 'll simply disagree with your statement . Observation , reasoning , and deduction is exactly what leads me to understand that there is no god , and that religion is merely an attempt to explain what we have not yet been able to reason out . As our knowledge increases , our need for a god decreases , and we can begin to see through the emotional fog of religion that keeps us in ignorance .""","""Well , the type of atheism you are talking about here requires faith . If you say `` I know there is no god , `` this statement requires faith . You have not observed anything that would lead you to reason or deduce that there must not be a god . The presence of religion has nothing to do with this faith and it 's not a religion , just a gross assumption with no `` proof. ``""",DISAGREE,"""It is curious how lately christians have been telling me that being an aethiest ( which I am ) , is a religion . Observation , reasoning , and deduction there is no god""","""Well , the type of atheism you are talking about here requires faith . If you say `` I know there is no god , `` this statement requires faith . You have not observed anything that would lead you to reason or deduce that there must not be a god .""",,
25850,6819,"""TalkOrigins contains nothing but barely readable obscure ramblings .""","""And this is from the one who posts links to AiG ... Since everything your complaining about is adressed at TO , I 'm not going to rebut any of your `` arguments `` . Rather , find the counter argument at TO and post what 's wrong with it .""",DISAGREE,"""TalkOrigins contains readable obscure ramblings""","""one who posts links to AiG ... complaining about is adressed at TO ,""",,
25852,6820,"""Dae , I hear you and have said many times that I 'm not a Laissez Faire type guy . My point was that the ability to accumulate capital ( personal property ) is the reason that the US is the country it is today . Sure there 's a place for the govt . in ANY system , including this one . However , the reason our country has done so well , for so long and the reason we 're so productive as workers is the fact that we have a right to participate in the system and accumulate wealth . Yes , the govt . will be needed to provide certain services . Yes , it is necessary to have rules , taxes , and a govt . to provide security and facilitate trade and etc ... I 've never said any different . However , there 's a difference between saying that and saying that everything good has come through the govt . That 's not true and if it was the USSR ( or Germany ) would rule the world today . The private sector is what drives the govt . and the economy . Without the Private Sector , there would n't be any govt . or tax money or tax payers to fund all the wonderful things that the govt . does . But too much govt . and the private sector whithers and with it , the govt . as well .""","""I think you undervalue the combination of poor immigrants and vast untapped natural resources as it pertains to our success .""",DISAGREE,"""ability to accumulate capital productive as workers is the fact drives the govt . and the economy tax money or tax payers to fund all""","""combination of poor immigrants and vast untapped natural resources""",,
25881,6824,"""It 's in this video- YouTube - Illegal Sale # 2 : Allowing Illegal Straw Purchase""","""I see no evidence of a straw purchase having actually taking place . The video is so grainy and jumpy you can barely make out anything . And there 's no camera evidence from the female investigator who was supposedly filling out the paperwork . And there are so many jumps in footage it almost looks like the film was cut multiple times to tell a brand new story . Although I did notice at the beginning the introduction stated that it 's illegal for someone to fill out the paperwork for you , and that it 's a federal felony . So once again I must ask , if they have this evidence on tape , why were no arrests made ? Supposedly these are licensed investigators , fully authorized and everything . Why did they choose to let a blatant offense go unpunished ? By law and duty they were obligated to make arrests on the scene .""",DISAGREE,"""Illegal Sale # 2 : Allowing Illegal Straw Purchase""","""Why did they choose to let a blatant offense go unpunished ?""",,
25898,6828,"""He CLAIMED to be a Christian . Here you go : I am a woman . So based on your logic despite all the characteristics of a man I possess I am still a woman .""","""Christianity is a belief , not a trait . If one claims to be a Christian -and is n't lying- , then they are .""",DISAGREE,"""He CLAIMED to be a Christian . Here you go : I am a woman . So based on your logic despite all the characteristics of a man I possess I am still a woman .""","""Christianity is a belief , not a trait . If one claims to be a Christian -and is n't lying- , then they are .""",,
25899,6828,"""He CLAIMED to be a Christian . Here you go : I am a woman . So based on your logic despite all the characteristics of a man I possess I am still a woman .""","""Christianity is a belief , not a trait . If one claims to be a Christian -and is n't lying- , then they are .""",DISAGREE,"""He CLAIMED to be a Christian . Here you go : I am a woman . So based on your logic despite all the characteristics of a man I possess I am still a woman .""","""Christianity is a belief , not a trait . If one claims to be a Christian -and is n't lying- , then they are .""",,
25907,6829,"""Gallileo was killed because of blasphemy of the church , saying the Earth goes around the sun .""","""Actually , Galileo was n't killed . He was sentenced to house arrest . And his sin was in declaring that the earth moved since the Bible states that the earth does n't move .""",DISAGREE,"""Gallileo was killed because of blasphemy of the church ,""","""Actually , Galileo was n't killed .""",,
25909,6830,"""If intelligence of any form is involved , including some intelligent organizing force innate to living systems , life is intelligently designed .""","""And if intelligence is not involved in evolution but rather is a product of evolution then life is not intelligently designed . Which of the two alternatives do you think has empirical support . Whats the IQ of the metaphorical pond scum ? From whence did an `` intelligent `` organizing force arise ? And so forth .""",DISAGREE,"""If intelligence of any form is involved , including some intelligent organizing force innate to living systems , life is intelligently designed .""","""And if intelligence is not involved in evolution but rather is a product of evolution then life is not intelligently designed .""",,
25931,6841,"""Now the word of the Lord came to me saying , `` Before I formed you in the womb I knew you , and before you were born I consecrated you ; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations. ``""","""This verse seems to point out that Jeremiah was more than simply a `` product of conception. `` He was a product of the Creator , formed in the womb by Him in the same manner that Adam was formed out of the dust and in the image of the maker .""",DISAGREE,"""Before I formed you in the womb I knew you , and before you were born I consecrated you""","""This verse seems to point out that Jeremiah was more than simply a `` product of conception. ``""",,
25968,6849,"""A woman owns her head , just as she owns the rest of her body . If you accept women as legitimate self-owners and not a slave caste , both the legality of abortion and the illegality of steamrolling their heads follows .""","""The * mind * ( self-owned ) holds beneficial possibilities ( that self-deceived atheists in the current culture-of-death do n't realize ) . Fortunately , we can choose to follow Jesus Christ , in His culture-of- * life ... Abundant * Rather than dying , how much do you want to Live Annie""",DISAGREE,"""A woman owns her head , just as she owns the rest of her body .""","""Fortunately , we can choose to follow Jesus Christ , in His culture-of- * life ... Abundant * Rather than dying , how much do you want to Live Annie""",,
25977,6850,"""Anyway , you 're going way overboard with what marijuana does to people .""","""Rationalizing again It is It 's truly less harmful than alcohol . [ /quote ] Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol with one beer or even 2 beers a day ( which is pretty much average for a person of non-college age ) . You have a guy drink a beer a day and a guy smoke up a day and see the difference in 50yrs ... you will know which one is the weed addict . I 've lost 2 friends to weed and my gf has actually had a friend get his head blown off so you probably wo n't convince me it is a good drug .... however , like alcohol , it is impossible to convince someone addicted about how their addiction hurts them .""",DISAGREE,"""you 're going way overboard with what marijuana does to people .""","""Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol""",,
25983,6852,"""what scientists do has nothing to do with the debate that goes on wrt to philosophical merits of darwinism versus creationism versus neo-lamarckism , i.e. , devo-evo , aka , Endogenous Adaptive mutagenesis .""","""You are absolutely correct . Scientists do science . Philosophers wander around inside their own domain . On the other hand I am much more interested in the scientific merits of NDS and EAM than in the musings of philosophers . Science supports NDS , science fails to support the vitalist views of EAM . Simple as that . Its not a philosophical issue , its a scientific one .""",AGREE,"""what scientists do has nothing to do with the debate that goes on wrt to philosophical merits of darwinism versus creationism""","""You are absolutely correct . Scientists do science . Philosophers wander around inside their own domain .""",,
26014,6858,"""We 're all addicted to something . I had a tough time recently giving up coffee . It was interfering with my life .""","""lol , and you prove my point ... rationalization for the win""",AGREE,"""We 're all addicted to something . I had a tough time recently giving up coffee . It was interfering with my life .""","""lol , and you prove my point ... rationalization for the win""",,
26021,6859,"""`` We call in the doctor to save us from deathÂ…Â ” Yeah , but fetuses and the terminally ill do not call the doctor to save themselves from death . That is the fallacy of Chesterton .""","""Fetuses do not call the doctor at all . But if they did , I do n't think it would be for him to kill them .""",DISAGREE,"""fetuses and the terminally ill do not call the doctor to save themselves from death .""","""Fetuses do not call the doctor at all""",,
26042,6864,"""A lot of the items listed would be Destructive Devices or Any Other Weapons under the NFA .""","""the only thing i see that would be a NFA would be the `` Semi-automatic pistol with A folding , telescoping or thumbhole stock `` of corse having a stock means it is not a pistol , but a SBR , but why let facts stop them . i wpnder if the bb guns that you put the bb in a plastic cartrage would quilifie as an assalt rifle if this passes .""",DISAGREE,"""A lot of the items listed would be Destructive Devices""","""Semi-automatic pistol with A folding , telescoping or thumbhole stock""",,
26047,6865,"""What the theory of evolution states is that monkeys and apes came from a common ancestor , and that humans are apes from a taxonomy point of view . While there are 'gaps ' in knowledge , I suspect if you did a study about what we actually do know about evolution , and human evolution in specific , you would be amazed at what we DO know .""","""I know we know a great deal but even if it is from a taxonomy point of view I still do n't think there is conclusive evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""you would be amazed at what we DO know""","""we know a great deal but do n't think there is conclusive evidence""",,
26052,6867,"""and the latter because it 's understandable and familiar to you .""","""* * Meaning ? ! ? !""",DISAGREE,"""it 's understandable and familiar to you""","""* * Meaning ? ! ? !""",,
26061,6869,"""Most often the Christians that do question  “ evolution ” they question Macro-evolution also known as speciation ( depending on what definition of speciation you use ) , which is the concept that at certain times evolution makes huge jumps in genetic shifts that result in  “ new ” species ( an over simplification and there are many theories in specie formation ) .""","""And if it depends on `` what definition of speciation you use , `` why did n't you give yours so that we can be clear as to what we are discussing . Finally , macroevolution is not 'the concept that at certain times evolution makes huge jumps in genetic shifts that result in  “ new ” species ( an over simplification and there are many theories in specie formation ) . ' Speciation does not require `` huge jumps in genetic shifts , `` whatever that means ( another example of semi-literate English ) . Would you like to hear of some examples of single populations in which the geographical extremes are separate species ( i.e. , they have overlapping ranges and are genetically isolated ) ?""",DISAGREE,"""Christians that do question depending on definition evolution""","""And if it depends `` definition `` why did n't you give yours Finally macroevolution is not `` huge jumps in genetic shifts `` whatever that means semi-literate Would you like to hear""",,
26068,6870,"""All pieces of information must have a sender .""","""Oh dear . We once again see the fallacious 'information ' argument being used . The craters on the moon give us information about past impacts , do we demand that information has a 'sender ' ? Spectroscopy gives us information about the constitution of stars , do we demand that information has a 'sender ' ? And indeed even if we use the argument that all 'information ' has a sender and recipient , genetic material has ... neither . It 's just chemicals and forces . Nothing more . There is no identifiable 'sender ' , and there is no identifiable 'recipient ' . Sure , you can chuck a god in here or there if you like , but that 's not where the evidence leads . DNA is not a code , DNA is certainly not a 'language ' , and it only falls under the definition of 'information ' that pretty much everything we decide to look at does .""",DISAGREE,"""All pieces of information must have a sender""","""Oh dear once again fallacious 'information ' argument do we demand that information has a ? sender recipient There is no identifiable 'sender ' chuck a god in here or there""",,
26070,6870,"""All pieces of information must have a sender .""","""Oh dear . We once again see the fallacious 'information ' argument being used . The craters on the moon give us information about past impacts , do we demand that information has a 'sender ' ? Spectroscopy gives us information about the constitution of stars , do we demand that information has a 'sender ' ? And indeed even if we use the argument that all 'information ' has a sender and recipient , genetic material has ... neither . It 's just chemicals and forces . Nothing more . There is no identifiable 'sender ' , and there is no identifiable 'recipient ' . Sure , you can chuck a god in here or there if you like , but that 's not where the evidence leads . DNA is not a code , DNA is certainly not a 'language ' , and it only falls under the definition of 'information ' that pretty much everything we decide to look at does .""",DISAGREE,"""All pieces of information must have a sender .""","""We once again see the fallacious 'information ' argument being used . And indeed even if we use the argument that all 'information ' has a sender and recipient , genetic material has ... neither . It 's just chemicals and forces . Nothing more . There is no identifiable 'sender ' , and there is no identifiable 'recipient ' .""",,
26098,6883,"""However that is beside the point . I would normally agree with you on other medical procedures , because of these reasons . This is an exception , as I have stated above . This is the case where parents will act more immature by either forcing their daughter to have or to not have the abortion against her wishes .""","""Your assumption that the parents are less mature than the child is equally as ludicrous as your claim that a 14 year old is mature enough to make this decision before she is old enough to sign ANY LEGALLY BINDING CONTRACT , and that includes 15 , 16 and 17 year olds . They are still below the age of consent so the issue should be moot . But unfortunately , in this day and age when parents are becoming more like caretakers rather than moral guides , it is only a matter of time before they lose all authority over their child 's decisions to the State .""",DISAGREE,"""This is the case where parents will act more immature by either forcing their daughter to have or to not have the abortion against her wishes .""","""Your assumption that the parents are less mature than the child is equally as ludicrous as your claim that a 14 year old is mature enough to make this decision before she is old enough to sign ANY LEGALLY BINDING CONTRACT , in this day and age when parents are becoming more like caretakers rather than moral guides , it is only a matter of time before they lose all authority over their child 's decisions to the State .""",,
26118,6887,"""What interest would a state that does n't recognize gay marriage in the first place have in allowing gay divorce ?""","""Justice ? Equality ? I realize that people who `` do n't recognize gay marriage `` often do n't have those things in mind when it comes to gays , but those would be the reasons ...""",DISAGREE,"""What interest does n't recognize gay marriage""","""Justice ? Equality ? I realize that people who `` do n't recognize gay marriage `` often do n't have those things in mind""",,
26122,6888,"""Since you pretend to be speaking from a position of authority , one hopes that you have actually done some research , otherwise you are being dishonest . I know what I 'm talking about .""","""Actually , it is quite apparent that you do not . For one glaring example , below you incorrectly state that a dinosaur fossil has been dated by C-14 . Another example of you lack of understanding of the topic is your failure to understand why very old fossils are found on the surface and the principles of dating from geologic strata .""",DISAGREE,"""one hopes that you have actually done some research I know what I 'm talking about .""","""Actually , it is quite apparent that you do not . you incorrectly state that a dinosaur fossil has been dated by C-14 you lack of understanding of the topic your failure to understand why very old fossils are found on the surface and the principles of dating from geologic strata""",,
26129,6890,"""US big business happened to it . Next question ?""","""And here is what you get when the Government gets a hold of it . Premature baby 'left to die ' by doctors after mother gives birth just two days before 22-week care limit | Mail Online""",AGREE,"""US big business happened to it . Next question ?""","""And here is what you get when the Government gets a hold of it .""",,
26142,6894,"""It 's not an `` arrogant assumption `` to point out that religious faith involves making a `` leap in the dark `` - it 's a metaphor that attempts to illustrate the facts of the case .""","""I 'd agree ..... faith is a `` leap in the dark `` ( or whatever similiar phrase we care to use ) on at least some level , there is always an element of the intangible there . I know Christians who have described there faith to me in such terms before .. sounds quite reasonable to me .""",AGREE,"""It 's not an `` arrogant assumption `` to point out that religious faith involves making a `` leap in the dark""","""I 'd agree ..... faith is a `` leap in the dark `` ( or whatever similiar phrase we care to use ) on at least some level , there is always an element of the intangible there .""",,
26152,6896,"""As a side not , rationalization is a sign of addiction .""","""We 're all addicted to something . I had a tough time recently giving up coffee . It was interfering with my life . It was making me feel like XXXX , I could n't sleep right , my bowels were out of whack , but I could n't just stop cold turkey . I tried , but I got these really bad headaches and my whole body felt like XXX . It was hell at work , my head felt like it was going to explode and I was achy all the time . I had to gradually wean myself from it . Now I drink tea which has less caffiene but I still sometimes feel like I have to have it . Since I 've cut down ( I do n't think I 've really gotten totally over my caffiene addiction ) I fell so much better . I have more energy during the day , I do n't wake up half dead desperately needing a quad espresso .""",AGREE,"""As a side not , rationalization is a sign of addiction .""","""We 're all addicted to something""",,
26163,6898,"""See Sarge 's post about Ted Kennedy being listed . What did he do that would make him get on the terrorist watch list ?""","""Nothing . '' T . Kennedy `` is an alias of a known terrorist .""",DISAGREE,"""What did he do that would make him get on the terrorist watch list ?""","""Nothing . '' T . Kennedy `` is an alias of a known terrorist .""",,
26179,6901,"""I hate to even bring up that our brain does n't work or store at full capacity since I know so little about the subject but if I 'm wrong I 'm sure I 'll be corrected . ( So much for public education )""","""They used to tell us that in school a long time ago . Then they started doing EEGs and other types of brain scans and they found that everyone uses all of their brain . I 'm not sure how I could use more of my brain .""",DISAGREE,"""I hate to even bring up that our brain does n't work or store at full capacity since I know so little about the subject but if I 'm wrong I 'm sure I 'll be corrected .""","""They used to tell us that in school a long time ago . Then they started doing EEGs and other types of brain scans and they found that everyone uses all of their brain .""",,
26186,6902,"""In fact , it could be said that the man has the only independent perspective .""","""An independant perspective does n't make it a good thing . Politicians that propose anti-gun legislation do n't have to live in the real world with those of us that the bill will affect , they should n't be allowed to propose it .""",DISAGREE,"""In fact , it could be said that the man has the only independent perspective .""","""An independant perspective does n't make it a good thing .""",,
26203,6906,"""Your point here would be stronger if you yourself did not constantly engage in the same tactics that you accuse others of doing . I have answered nearly all of the points you ever made to me ( I might have missed one or two during your period of multiple replies ) . You , however , have very often engaged in the very behavior toward me that you accuse those on the pro-choice side of engaging in .""","""I see you offer no links to posts or anything other than this baseless allegation . Do you think you could maybe provide a link to a post where I have engaged in a tactic that I have accused others of ? Please ? I do n't think you can .""",DISAGREE,"""Your point here would be stronger if you yourself did not constantly engage in the same tactics that you accuse others of doing .""","""I see you offer no links to posts or anything other than this baseless allegation .""",,
26214,6909,"""Is all science a sham ?""","""Well , at least the biological sciences and physics . The physicists also try to devise ways to keep their pet theories afloat so that the vast majority of the population can continue to be snow-blinded . Take their lie that there is some magical attraction between bodies of matter . The truth lies in Intelligent Falling - glory to the intelligent designer .""",DISAGREE,"""Is all science a sham ?""","""at least the biological sciences and physics""",,
26213,6909,"""Is all science a sham ?""","""Well , at least the biological sciences and physics . The physicists also try to devise ways to keep their pet theories afloat so that the vast majority of the population can continue to be snow-blinded . Take their lie that there is some magical attraction between bodies of matter . The truth lies in Intelligent Falling - glory to the intelligent designer .""",DISAGREE,"""Is all science a sham ?""","""at least the biological sciences and physics .""",,
26221,6910,"""How is that a affect of deterrence ? Deterrence works by preventing people through the fear of consequences . A dead man has no fears . Furman Vs. Georgia , where the supreme court specifically noted that there is not a single piece of conclusive evidence that the penalty is a effective deterrent .""","""-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I do not believe that the supreme court adressed the the problem of convicted fellons having the death penelty reduced to life in prison and going on to kill in prison .""",DISAGREE,"""the supreme court specifically noted that there is not a single piece of conclusive evidence that the penalty is a effective deterrent .""","""I do not believe that the supreme court adressed the the problem of convicted fellons having the death penelty reduced to life in prison and going on to kill in prison .""",,
26226,6911,"""This is why religion may not survive the future . People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail . The only hope is if the nuts stop making it in to an adversarial situation . Arch is doing nothing but distorting the very thing he holds so dear , but that is already clear to anyone who knows his work here .""","""Here is what fascinates me about the judgmental criticism you offer of my opinion . In typical fashion you make claims which you do n't support at all . Here is my post below , point out WITH EVIDENCE ! ! ! what I am distorting in any way ; especially that which I hold dear . In other words , write a cogent and rational post which makes sense when applied to the quoted post it intends to attack .""",DISAGREE,"""People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail .""","""Here is what fascinates me about the judgmental criticism you offer of my opinion .""",,
26229,6911,"""This is why religion may not survive the future . People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail . The only hope is if the nuts stop making it in to an adversarial situation . Arch is doing nothing but distorting the very thing he holds so dear , but that is already clear to anyone who knows his work here .""","""Here is what fascinates me about the judgmental criticism you offer of my opinion . In typical fashion you make claims which you do n't support at all . Here is my post below , point out WITH EVIDENCE ! ! ! what I am distorting in any way ; especially that which I hold dear . In other words , write a cogent and rational post which makes sense when applied to the quoted post it intends to attack .""",DISAGREE,"""This is why religion may not survive the future . People like Arch are setting it as opposed to science and in that position it will be doomed to fail .""","""In typical fashion you make claims which you do n't support at all .""",,
26241,6912,"""Fear of restrictions spurs huge boost in gun sales Unfortunately Democrats have a credibility problem . Many Pro-gun Democrats have been elected , and America is giving them a chance , but apparently they do not believe Obama because of his past Anti-gun support and votes . However Ms. Feinstein 's comments about waiting for the correct timing to bring up gun control did not help the creditability problem either . I guess only time will tell .""","""Forwarded to me by one of my co-workers ; `` HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & amp ; Record of Sales Act of 2009 Please send this to everybody on your list ... this is Obama gun control by secrecy . Very Important for you to be aware of a new bill HR 45 introduced into the House . This is the Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & amp ; Record of Sale Act of 2009 . We just learned yesterday about this on the Peter Boyles radio program . Even gun shop owners did n't know about this because it is flying under the radar . To find out about this - go to any government website and type in HR 45 or Google HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & amp ; Record of Sales Act of 2009 . You will get all the information . Basically this would make it illegal to own a firearm - any rifle with a clip or ANY pistol unless : .It is registered .You are fingerprinted .You supply a current Driver 's License .You supply your Social Security # .You will submit to a physical & amp ; mental evaluation at any time of their choosing .Each update - change or ownership through private or public sale must be reported and costs $ 25 . - Failure to do so you automatically lose the right to own a firearm and are subject up to a year in jail . .There is a child provision clause on page 16 section 305 stating a child-access provision . Gun must be locked and inaccessible to any child under 18 . The Government would have the right to come and inspect that you are storing your gun safely away from accessibility to children and fine is punishable for up to 5 yrs . in prison . If you think this is a joke - go to the website and take your pick of many options to read this ... OpenCongress - Text of H.R.45 as Introduced in House Blair Holt 's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 It is long and lengthy . But , more and more people are becoming aware of this . Pass the word along . Any hunters in your family - pass this along . He suggests the best way to fight this is to tell all your friends about it and `` spring into action `` . Also , he suggests we all join a pro-gun group like the Colorado Rifle Association , hunting associations , gun clubs and especially the NRA . This is just a `` termite `` approach to complete confiscation of guns and disarming of our society to the point we have no defense - chip away a little here and there until the goal i s accomplished before anyone realizes it . ( Did Obama promise transparency ? It seems his motives are more and more transparent while his methods are hidden in back rooms . ) This is one to act on whether you own a gun or not. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Fear of restrictions spurs huge boost in gun sales Unfortunately Democrats have a credibility problem .""","""This is one to act on whether you own a gun or not. ``""",,
26265,6915,"""Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""I 'd find it interesting to discover how many of those 58,000 were looking at very long and serious sentences , but were given a plea deal for reduced charges .""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""I 'd find it interesting to discover how many of those 58,000 were looking at very long and serious sentences , but were given a plea deal for reduced charges .""",,
26266,6915,"""Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""I 'd find it interesting to discover how many of those 58,000 were looking at very long and serious sentences , but were given a plea deal for reduced charges .""",DISAGREE,"""Sounds like primarily drug offenses . Nothing about guns .""","""I 'd find it interesting to discover how many of those 58,000 were looking at very long and serious sentences , but were given a plea deal for reduced charges .""",,
26282,6917,"""That crime fighting tool senario you just described is REALLY REALLY spooky .""","""Ballistic fingerprinting is , like most `` gun control `` a measure that is full of unintended consequences .""",AGREE,"""That crime fighting tool senario you just described is REALLY""","""Ballistic fingerprinting is , like most `` gun control `` a measure that is full of unintended consequences .""",,
26303,6921,"""I agree""","""But , do you have a rational explanation for the Big Bang ?""",DISAGREE,"""I agree""","""do you have a rational explanation for the Big Bang ?""",,
26304,6921,"""I agree""","""But , do you have a rational explanation for the Big Bang ?""",DISAGREE,"""I agree""","""do you have a rational explanation for the Big Bang ?""",,
26306,6922,"""You believe this .""","""No , I know this to be true . As shown , over and over .""",DISAGREE,"""You believe this .""","""I know this to be true . As shown , over and over .""",,
26310,6923,"""Atheists feel that their views are more than a denial of a God ; for them , atheism is also way to find new purpose and meaning in life without confining themselves , or their beliefs , to a set of rules . Quick fix Comparative Religions teacher Cherie McGinn has always been aware of atheism among her students , but says that it is often a temporary belief . McGinn feels atheism can often be a `` quick fix `` for students who are still searching or need a way to declare their independence . '' It 's easier to say ' I do n't believe in God ' than to say , ' I believe in this , `` McGinn explains . According to McGinn , most people who claim to be atheists are probably agnostic , or people who do not believe God 's existence can be proved either way . '' It takes a strong level of commitment and understanding to be a true atheist , `` says McGinn .""","""The `` truth `` about atheism is that it 's the only proposition that makes sense ( apart from agnosticism ? ) to people who conclude , as I do , that religious principles are not based on reason . I know it 's a bit unusual in a public forum but I 'd like to introduce a little personal history here by way of illustration of my path to atheism : I was educated during my most impressionable years ( 11-18 ) at a grammar school controlled by the Jesuits . All my teachers were priests and many were of formidable intellect . Every morning began with `` divine service `` , every lesson was started and ended with a prayer . At noon we sang the Angelus and at 3.30 in the afternoon we finished the school day with Benediction . We had at least one session a day learning and reciting the catechism - so we could be word perfect in our answers to metaphysical questions . Yet all this religious conditioning failed to arouse any spark of faith in me . Sure , I conformed to all outward appearances , but inwardly I rebelled and I did not believe . So why did n't I believe - because my clergymen teachers gave me no REASONS to do so . When , eventually , during my last days at school I chose to reveal my disbelief - the Rector said , `` Well , after all , faith is a gift from God ! `` , and I had received no such gift . Since , in my view , there is no reasoned evidence for God 's existence , why succumb to wish-fulfillment ? It 's less comforting but more honest to be an atheist .""",DISAGREE,"""Atheists feel that their views are more than a denial of a God""","""I rebelled and I did not believe . So why did n't I believe""",,
26338,6927,"""How so ... ?""","""I see His presence in the wonderful world around me . I have felt His guiding hand in my life . I know others who have the same knowledge of God .""",DISAGREE,"""How so ... ?""","""I see His presence in the wonderful world around me""",,
26340,6928,"""Anyone displaying the level of paranoid thinking displayed in the above post should be a natural for a senior NRA position , or committal .""","""You 're obviously an Obama supporter , they 're the only people who would n't be upset at his abusive tactics of threatening lawsuits against anyone that runs unfavorable ads against him , thus showing that he does n't support the First Amendment .""",DISAGREE,"""Anyone displaying the level of paranoid thinking displayed in the above post should be a natural for a senior NRA position , or committal .""","""thus showing that he does n't support the First Amendment .""",,
26345,6929,"""More children die swimming or riding bikes ? That 's probably because children spend a lot more time doing those things than shooting firearms . That does n't show which is more dangerous per minute of use .""","""Well if they 're not spending much time shooting firearms in the first place , then what are you worried about ?""",DISAGREE,"""That 's probably because children spend a lot more time doing those things than shooting firearms .""","""if they 're not spending much time shooting firearms in the first place , then what are you worried about ?""",,
26352,6930,"""I would really like to know how something with no heartbeat or a brain has the intelligence to control a human being .""","""So far as I am aware , nobody but you believes this to be the case .""",DISAGREE,"""I would really like to know how something with no heartbeat or a brain has the intelligence to control a human being .""","""nobody but you believes this to be the case .""",,
26378,6934,"""4 ) If many offspring must die ( for not all can be accommodated in nature 's limited ecology ) , and individuals in all species vary among themselves , then on average survivors will tend to be those individuals with variations that are fortitously best suited to changing local environments .""","""Looks like you did n't copy/paste this one . One obvious error is bolded for you to see .""",AGREE,"""then on average survivors will tend to be those individuals with variations that are fortitously""","""Looks like you did n't copy/paste this one .""",,
26384,6935,"""Exhibit A . One book : the Bible . Um , that 's it though .""","""Actually the bible really barely comments . Look how short and jumbled the Genesis account is . Genesis did not even fit what humans knew when it was written . So matching any creation theory to genesis is impossible . Unless you believe God created the heaven and earth twice , and created animals twice . Sure you can explain it away , but a verbal reading of the ACTUAL TEXT will make your head swim . I don ’ t wana be sacrilegious , but some parts of Genesis makes God look like he was telling a fish story to a really dumb scribe too lazy to get on his camel and go to the library of Alexandria , or worse one of his interns . I am a irrational creationist btw .""",DISAGREE,"""Exhibit A . One book : the Bible . Um , that 's it though .""","""Alexandria , or worse one of his interns . I am a irrational creationist btw .""",,
26397,6937,"""God did n't write the Bible . People wrote it to the best of their understanding . They can be mistaken in their understanding .""","""Well again , this is not what the Bible claims of itself . 2Ti 3:16 All scripture [ is ] given by inspiration of God , and [ is ] profitable for doctrine , for reproof , for correction , for instruction in righteousness : 17 That the man of God may be perfect , throughly furnished unto all good works . In fact , Jesus himself quotes Genesis as though it were literal history ( cf . Genesis 2:24 and Matthew 19:4 , 5 ) . Additionally , Jesus himself said that he was subject to the Old Testament : Matthew 5:17 Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets . I did not come to destroy but to fulfill . The `` law and the prophets `` are a common reference for `` scripture `` or the Old Testament . Either the Bible is what it claims to be , or it is not . If it is not what it claims to be , then how can we possibly trust that Jesus was who he claimed to be ? The two concepts are directly tied together .""",DISAGREE,"""God did n't write the Bible They can be mistaken in their understanding .""","""this is not what the Bible claims of itself law and the prophets""",,
26398,6937,"""God did n't write the Bible . People wrote it to the best of their understanding . They can be mistaken in their understanding .""","""Well again , this is not what the Bible claims of itself . 2Ti 3:16 All scripture [ is ] given by inspiration of God , and [ is ] profitable for doctrine , for reproof , for correction , for instruction in righteousness : 17 That the man of God may be perfect , throughly furnished unto all good works . In fact , Jesus himself quotes Genesis as though it were literal history ( cf . Genesis 2:24 and Matthew 19:4 , 5 ) . Additionally , Jesus himself said that he was subject to the Old Testament : Matthew 5:17 Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets . I did not come to destroy but to fulfill . The `` law and the prophets `` are a common reference for `` scripture `` or the Old Testament . Either the Bible is what it claims to be , or it is not . If it is not what it claims to be , then how can we possibly trust that Jesus was who he claimed to be ? The two concepts are directly tied together .""",DISAGREE,"""God did n't write the Bible . People wrote it to the best of their understanding . They can be mistaken in their understanding .""","""Well again , this is not what the Bible claims of itself . 2Ti 3:16 All scripture [ is ] given by inspiration of God , and [ is ] profitable for doctrine , for reproof , for correction , for instruction in righteousness : 17 That the man of God may be perfect , throughly furnished unto all good works . ``""",,
26401,6938,"""Leaders of the campaign to outlaw same-sex marriage in California are warning businesses that have given money to the state 's largest gay rights group they will be publicly identified as opponents of traditional unions unless they contribute to the gay marriage ban , too . ProtectMarriage.com , the umbrella group behind a ballot initiative that would overturn the California Supreme Court decision that legalized gay marriage , sent a certified letter this week asking companies to withdraw their support of Equality California , a nonprofit organization that is helping lead the campaign against Proposition 8 . '' Make a donation of a like amount to ProtectMarriage.com which will help us correct this error , `` reads the letter . '' Were you to elect not to donate comparably , it would be a clear indication that you are in opposition to traditional marriage . ... The names of any companies and organizations that choose not to donate in like manner to ProtectMarriage.com but have given to Equality California will be published. `` The letter was signed by four members of the group 's executive committee : campaign chairman Ron Prentice ; Edward Dolejsi , executive director of the California Catholic Conference ; Mark Jansson , a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ; and Andrew Pugno , the lawyer for ProtectMarriage.com . A donation form was attached . The letter did not say where the names would be published . The unusual appeal reflects the increasing tension surrounding the tight race over Proposition 8 , which would change the California Constitution to limit marriage to a man and a woman . In recent days , both sides in the debate have accused their opponents of threatening their respective campaign volunteers and misleading voters.Calif . gay marriage ban backers target businesses So , evidently now `` blackmail `` is a `` traditional family value `` ? ? ? I do n't think these people have any shame ...""","""They do n't at all ! They even put little innocent kids on their campaign commercials and the giant electronic bilboards on the freeway to give this allure of impending doom . It 's scare tactics and as much as I hate to say it it 's working .... I pass that sign every day I go home from college and I think I 'm the only car in Corona that has a No on 8 sticker . I get a hell of alot of dirty looks believe me . But I just smile and say God loves you too . It 's sickening how dirty these `` moral `` people will go to immoral means to justify their homophobic bigoted views .""",DISAGREE,"""Leaders of the campaign to outlaw same-sex marriage in California are warning businesses that have given money to the state 's largest gay rights group they will be publicly identified as opponents of traditional unions unless they contribute to the gay marriage ban , too . ''""","""They do n't at all ! They even put little innocent kids on their campaign commercials and the giant electronic bilboards on the freeway to give this allure of impending doom .""",,
26410,6939,"""Scott Roeder is guilty of murder and so should be punished accordingly . However , what about all the murders that happen every day regarding the unborn ? ? Justice should work both ways . Unfortunately we have a government that dictates what justice is and is not .""","""Thank God you have that unfortunate government . It permits you the opportunity to decide on how justice is defined and how it may best be served for all of us . In a perfect world these types of choices would not be necessary , but then in a perfect world there would be no purpose for religion . We do the best we can in proportion to how much we care . Want a different government vote . Want a better government vote wisely . Want a better government quickly . Get others to do the same .""",DISAGREE,"""Scott Roeder is guilty of murder and so should be punished accordingly .""","""Thank God you have that unfortunate government""",,
26412,6940,"""There is considerable confusion about the legal theory underlying the `` right to keep and bear arms `` . This is a brief outline for a clarification of the discussion of this issue . > ( 1 ) The Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution does not establish the right to keep and bear arms . None of the provisions of the Constitution establish any `` natural `` rights . They recognize such rights , but the repeal of such provisions would not end such rights . Such rights were considered by many of the Framers as obvious or `` self-evident `` , but they were immersed in the prevailing republican thought of the day , as expressed in the writings of Locke , Montesquieu , Rousseau , Madison , Hamilton , and others , which discussed `` natural rights `` in some detail . Others argued that at least some of the rights needed to be made explicit in the Bill of Rights to avoid having future generations with less understanding of republican theory weaken in their defense of those rights . That has turned out to have been a good idea > ( 2 ) The right to keep and bear arms is a natural right of individuals under the theory of democratic government . This was clearly the understanding and intent of the Framers of the U.S. Constitution and was a long-established principle of English common law at the time the Constitution was adopted , which is considered to be a part of constitutional law for purposes of interpreting the written Constitution .""","""So please tell me who would be the actual criminals if the Government violated the Supreme Law of the Land and made all guns illegal ? But I do thank you for proving that there are people out there who want them all , despite The Bill of Rights says and what the Supreme Court proved was the correct meaning !""",DISAGREE,"""There is considerable confusion about the legal theory underlying the `` right to keep and bear arms `` . This is a brief outline for a clarification of the discussion of this issue . > ( 1 ) The Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution does not establish the right to keep and bear arms . None of the provisions of the Constitution establish any `` natural ``""","""So please tell me who would be the actual criminals if the Government violated the Supreme Law of the Land and made all guns illegal ?""",,
26418,6941,"""A taste of what could be our future if the left has its way .""","""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""",DISAGREE,"""A taste of what could be our future if the left has its way .""","""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""",,
26420,6941,"""A taste of what could be our future if the left has its way .""","""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""",DISAGREE,"""A taste of what could be our future if the left has its way .""","""Two gun deaths per 100,000 population per year instead of fourteen ?""",,
26433,6943,"""I think it 's a stretch to take a genetic definition of human life to count as a moral definition of personhood because then we must admit non-persons such as cells , organs , tumours , etc to personhood . It 's better to define people formally as well as ontologically , unless we want to define things as their constitutive elements .""","""A human zygote along with its unique genetic code and great potential is a human life , bottom line . Where do you get this idea of `` personhood `` anyway ?""",DISAGREE,"""I think it 's a stretch to take a genetic definition of human life to count as a moral definition of personhood""","""A human zygote along with its unique genetic code and great potential is a human life ,""",,
26444,6945,"""Yet , evolutionists over the decades have mis-characterized many of these adaptive qualities as examples of Darwinian evolution , more specifically selectionist evolution : guppies , cichlids , peppered moths , flies , lizards . [ bold added ]""","""A long time ago , a simple experiment was proposed to supersport . This experiment could easily convince an observer of the validity of his viewpoint . All supersport has to do is tag some Biston betularia such that they can be identified individually , and move typica morphs to polluted areas and carbonaria to cleaner areas . If any individual changes form , supersport would be vindicated . supersport has been ignoring this proposal since its introduction .""",DISAGREE,"""evolutionists over the decades have mis-characterized many of these adaptive qualities""","""simple experiment was proposed to supersport""",,
26450,6946,"""I 'm not Canadian , but I suspect you greatly underestimate the amount of under-the-radar opposition and frustration about gay marriage in your country . Polls often do n't give an accurate picture of the full situation . You have a significantly liberal govt and liberal media that even goes so far as to stifle and prevent free speech on this issue . I 've read the views of many religious people in Canada , and a lot of them feel that they are truly being persecuted and oppresed by tha lack of free speech your govt . gives them on this issue . One reason it appears `` dead `` is that your govt . stifles free speech about this issue . You 've lost religious freedom in an overboard attempt to provide `` freedom `` in another area . You should have found a way to have both .""","""So now it 's a massive nation wide government conspiracy to stifle free speech ? Canada stifles and oppresses religious freedom ? Honestly Jyoshu , where do you get this stuff ? This is utter BS , if you can find ANY proof of the Canadian gov't stifling free speech on this issue , religious freedom , or any other issue for that matter , please post it . If not , retract your BS statement , and admit that it 's a fabrication . I honestly do n't think I underestimate it at all . I come across a very broad spectrum of people in my line of work , from one end of the scale to the other . The most common negative response I get is from those that are opposed to homosexuality in general and respond along the lines of `` I do n't like , I do n't want to see it , but rights are rights , as long as it does n't negatively affect me , I do n't have a problem with it/I do n't really care. `` I have come across a couple of people who were strongly opposed to the use of the term `` marriage `` but were fine with allowing homosexual `` civil unions `` . I think you overestimate how big of a `` moral issue `` this really is for most people . Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not Canadian , but I suspect you greatly underestimate the amount of under-the-radar opposition and frustration about gay marriage in your country . Polls often do n't give an accurate picture of the full situation""","""now it 's a massive nation wide government conspiracy to stifle free speech ?""",,
26449,6946,"""I 'm not Canadian , but I suspect you greatly underestimate the amount of under-the-radar opposition and frustration about gay marriage in your country . Polls often do n't give an accurate picture of the full situation . You have a significantly liberal govt and liberal media that even goes so far as to stifle and prevent free speech on this issue . I 've read the views of many religious people in Canada , and a lot of them feel that they are truly being persecuted and oppresed by tha lack of free speech your govt . gives them on this issue . One reason it appears `` dead `` is that your govt . stifles free speech about this issue . You 've lost religious freedom in an overboard attempt to provide `` freedom `` in another area . You should have found a way to have both .""","""So now it 's a massive nation wide government conspiracy to stifle free speech ? Canada stifles and oppresses religious freedom ? Honestly Jyoshu , where do you get this stuff ? This is utter BS , if you can find ANY proof of the Canadian gov't stifling free speech on this issue , religious freedom , or any other issue for that matter , please post it . If not , retract your BS statement , and admit that it 's a fabrication . I honestly do n't think I underestimate it at all . I come across a very broad spectrum of people in my line of work , from one end of the scale to the other . The most common negative response I get is from those that are opposed to homosexuality in general and respond along the lines of `` I do n't like , I do n't want to see it , but rights are rights , as long as it does n't negatively affect me , I do n't have a problem with it/I do n't really care. `` I have come across a couple of people who were strongly opposed to the use of the term `` marriage `` but were fine with allowing homosexual `` civil unions `` . I think you overestimate how big of a `` moral issue `` this really is for most people . Waxy""",DISAGREE,"""you greatly underestimate the amount of under-the-radar opposition and frustration about gay marriage Polls often do n't give an accurate picture of the full situation . your govt . stifles free speech about this issue .""","""now it 's a massive nation wide government conspiracy to stifle free speech ? if you can find ANY proof of the Canadian gov't stifling free speech on this issue , you overestimate how big of a `` moral issue `` this really is for most people .""",,
26461,6948,"""A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State , if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law . A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes , if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law . A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State . However , a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector . [ 18 U.S.C . 922 ( a ) ( 3 ) and ( 5 ) , 922 ( d ) , 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30 ] A person may only acquire a firearm within the person ’ s own State , except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun , in person , at a licensee 's premises in any State , provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides . A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes . [ 18 U.S.C . 922 ( a ) ( 3 ) and ( 5 ) , 922 ( b ) ( 3 ) , 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30 ]""","""I think a more appropriate question would address what laws you believe would have been effective in preventing the scenario that you inquire about . Justin""",DISAGREE,"""sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State""","""a more appropriate question would address what laws you believe""",,
26460,6948,"""A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State , if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law . A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes , if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law . A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State . However , a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector . [ 18 U.S.C . 922 ( a ) ( 3 ) and ( 5 ) , 922 ( d ) , 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30 ] A person may only acquire a firearm within the person ’ s own State , except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun , in person , at a licensee 's premises in any State , provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides . A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes . [ 18 U.S.C . 922 ( a ) ( 3 ) and ( 5 ) , 922 ( b ) ( 3 ) , 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30 ]""","""I think a more appropriate question would address what laws you believe would have been effective in preventing the scenario that you inquire about . Justin""",DISAGREE,"""A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State , if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal""","""a more appropriate question would address what laws you believe would have been effective in preventing the scenario that you inquire about . Justin""",,
26478,6951,"""But rich people stole my freedom for forty hours a week for many years . look at the big picture""","""so quit whining , and go start your own buisness .""",DISAGREE,"""But rich people stole my freedom for forty hours a week for many years . look at the big picture""","""so quit whining , and go start your own buisness .""",,
26487,6953,"""Three questions : What country operates under an `` unbridled capitalism `` system ?""","""Currently none however all the western powers operated this way in the 19th century and people suffered . Let conservatives dismantle regulations and it will be the return to the 19th century .""",DISAGREE,"""Three questions : What country operates under an `` unbridled capitalism `` system ?""","""Currently none however all the western powers operated this way in the 19th century and people suffered .""",,
26489,6954,"""We only get involved in your warmongering to protect our interests i.e . to get something in return from the USA such as favourable trade deals . America has no real friends just friends of convenience .""","""Well , if that 's how you feel , you do n't have to get involved in our `` war-mongering `` . Odd that you should say that when the majority of people in the US have already forgotten 9-11 ,""",DISAGREE,"""We only get involved in your warmongering to protect our interests""","""if that 's how you feel , you do n't have to get involved in our `` war-mongering ``""",,
26503,6958,"""I think it is undeniable that the courts have rendered the 14th amendment meaningless . I think they do `` fear `` how things would play out but they have done it so much that they have no idea how to proceed now . Substantive due process is n't well defined , no one knows what the privileges and immunities clause means and what it comes down to is like a fail-safe argument for the courts to claim a 14th amendment violation when they have nothing us . Anywho , to answer your question , yes , Thomas relied on the privileges and immunities clause .""","""I think even the Court knows that the Fourteenth was not well crafted , at least in terms of forsight . However , once it was ratified the Court really had no choice but to try to work it into the legal landscape . Certainly State power needed to be curtailed to stop such institutions such as slavery , but I do n't think restructuring how the entire Constitution works was the right move .""",AGREE,"""I think it is undeniable that the courts have rendered the 14th amendment meaningless""","""I think even the Court knows that the Fourteenth was not well crafted , at least in terms of forsight""",,
26514,6968,"""`` Modern `` Atheists have only been around for a short time . In biblical times , Atheists were people who beleved in God ( s ) , but did n't believe He/they intervened with life on Earth . How and why do you think the terms have changed , and what are the similarities between tham ?""","""And why do you say that in ancient times that atheists were people who believed in 'God ( s ) , but did n't belive in intervention ) ( a.k.a Deists ) . Why do you think that people who did n't believe in god exist ?""",DISAGREE,"""Modern `` biblical times God ( s ) , intervened similarities""","""ancient atheists ( a.k.a Deists ) god exist ?""",,
26519,6969,"""By number of people , absolutely . Take a look at the table : http : //www.plannedparenthood.org/lib ... 2Services.html Service No . of Procedures Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Women 2,208,483 Emergency Contraception Clients 633,756 Tubal Sterilization Clients 680 Reversible Contraceptive Clients — Men 60,476 Vasectomy Clients 2,522 773 Abortion Procedures 227,375 HIV Testing Clients — Women 126,477 HIV Testing Clients — Men 48,991 Prenatal Clients 15,860 Infertility Clients 325 Colposcopy Procedures 31,248 Cryotherapy Procedures 3,913 LOOP/LEEP Procedures 1,781 Midlife Clients 10,575 Pregnancy Tests 1,081,772 Breast Exams/Breast Care 1,062,727 Primary Care Clients 24,483 STI Procedures , Women and Men 1,255,036 Other Services — Women 58,626 Other Services — Men 17,905 Totals 6,873,011 Total Unduplicated Clients 2,744,554 Or to shorten it down : 227K Abortions : 5,426K Birth control : 175K STD test : 1,081K Pregnancy test : 15K OB checks : 1,102K Gynecological : 1,356K Other""","""Is this chart the number of abortions in the U.S. , internationally , or both ? The chart is under the international section on the website . What is considered `` emergency contraception `` as stated on the chart ? Did n't PP perform 213,026 abortions in 2001 ? In 2002 the number of abortions they performed actually increased right ? You say that `` by number of people `` the `` main business `` of PP is offering contraception and sex ed . What is their `` main business `` by revenue ?""",AGREE,"""http : //www.plannedparenthood.org/lib Clients — Women Contraception Clients 633,756 Sterilization Vasectomy Abortion Procedures 227,375 HIV Testing Clients Colposcopy LOOP/LEEP STI STD test : Gynecological""","""emergency contraception `` PP abortions in 2001 ? by number of people `` `` main business `` revenue ?""",,
26524,6970,"""Hmmm . Why would someone assume that Eugenics , an idea created and a word coined by Sir Francis Galton the evolutionist and Cousin of Charles Darwin , have any relationship at all to the theory of evolution ? That 's a tough one . What do you think ?""","""I think that if for arguments sake that if Darwin was a racist that carried out genocides then I still do n't see what Macroevolution would have to do with it . I will say it again . If you start with the mistaken belief some people are inferior then Eugenics immediately seems reasonable since it only relies on the idea that some people are inferior and the fact that parents are like their offspring .""",DISAGREE,"""Eugenics Francis Galton evolutionist Charles Darwin evolution ?""","""Darwin genocides Eugenics immediately offspring""",,
26535,6972,"""Creation : The belief that the universe ( and of course everything in it ) was created by some supernatural entity . To support creation you must first tackle the concept of something `` outside `` the knowable universe . Because this is irrational , the entire concept of creation is irrational to `` believe `` in . You can believe in it , but you must accept that the belief is not a rational belief .""","""`` Usually , `` rationality `` is a Humpty-Dumpty word , that means whatever the user finds is convenient to club his opponents with. `` http : //world.std.com/~mhuben/skept/rationality.html Knowledge itself is a limited commodity . To make a claim that everything is knowable is a statement that is impossible to prove ; Scientism makes this claim . Closely related to it is Objectivism . '' Scientism , in the strong sense , is the self-annihilating view that only scientific claims are meaningful , which is not a scientific claim and hence , if true , not meaningful. `` http : //skepdic.com/scientism.html Recommended Reading : `` Why People Believe Weird Things : Pseudoscience , Superstition , and Other Confusions of Our Time `` by Michael Shermer Not only does it include creationism , but also the philosophy of Ayn Rand ( Objectivism )""",DISAGREE,"""The belief that the universe ( and of course everything in it ) was created by some supernatural entity .""","""Scientism makes this claim . Closely related to it is Objectivism .""",,
26546,6974,"""Also , you dictate what others do all the time . Maybe indirectly but the official you vote for create laws which restrict freedoms . This is needed for society .""","""Yes and no . I agree that civilized society must restrict certain behavior from time to time . However , a person 's right in choosing what is best for them is not something that should ever be restricted . If there are consequences for our actions , we should be prepared to accept them , either in the eyes of the law , or in that god fellow so many people talk about . What did he say ? Judge not lest ye be judged ? Now I do n't know if that god fellow is for real or not , but those sound like pretty good words anyway . There were some very learned people who wrote in the bible . It 's too bad that society has forgoten some of the lessons handed down to use over the last 2000 years .""",DISAGREE,"""you dictate what others do all the time . create laws which restrict freedoms needed for society""","""Yes and no . civilized society must restrict certain behavior from time to person 's right in choosing what is best for them is not something that should ever be restricted""",,
26547,6974,"""Also , you dictate what others do all the time . Maybe indirectly but the official you vote for create laws which restrict freedoms . This is needed for society .""","""Yes and no . I agree that civilized society must restrict certain behavior from time to time . However , a person 's right in choosing what is best for them is not something that should ever be restricted . If there are consequences for our actions , we should be prepared to accept them , either in the eyes of the law , or in that god fellow so many people talk about . What did he say ? Judge not lest ye be judged ? Now I do n't know if that god fellow is for real or not , but those sound like pretty good words anyway . There were some very learned people who wrote in the bible . It 's too bad that society has forgoten some of the lessons handed down to use over the last 2000 years .""",DISAGREE,"""Also , you dictate what others do all the time . Maybe indirectly but the official you vote for create laws which restrict freedoms . This is needed for society .""","""Yes and no . I agree that civilized society must restrict certain behavior from time to time . However , a person 's right in choosing what is best for them is not something that should ever be restricted .""",,
26563,6977,"""Origins have to be taken on faith because nobody was there to see it happen .""","""So geology is a religion because we were n't here to see rock X formed ?""",DISAGREE,"""Origins have to be taken on faith because nobody was there to see it happen .""","""So geology is a religion because we were n't here to see rock X formed ?""",,
26566,6978,"""The growth in complexity of physical organisms is analogous to the growth of social complexity in human societies : the study of the former can throw light on the development of the latter .""","""Much of history is cyclical . I am unaware of evolution being mapped in such the same manner .""",DISAGREE,"""The growth in complexity of physical organisms is analogous to the growth of social complexity in human societies :""","""Much of history is cyclical . I am unaware of evolution being mapped in such the same manner .""",,
26575,6980,"""I see the publication of Darwin 's Origin of Species to be a watershed event that permenantly established the single common ancestor model as the foundation of evolutionary biology .""","""Could be .""",AGREE,"""I see the publication of Darwin 's Origin of Species to be a watershed event that permenantly established""","""Could be .""",,
26589,6985,"""If you can find something untrue in the article , point it out and proffer your evidence ; otherwise ... I did n't think posters were required to `` balance `` their opinions here .""","""That 's the thing . JPSartre12 ca n't point to anything inaccurate , so you see this mundane complaint that * you 're posting something I do n't like * ... Quite frankly , if Christianity insists on trying to tell the government how it should perform marriages , I think that street should cut both ways and the government should be able to have input on how religion performs marriages ... JPSartre12 's reply is reflective of the * anti-gay Christians are seeking discrimination against gays , but we 're going to try to pretend we 're the real victims while we bash them * school of thought .""",DISAGREE,"""If you can find something untrue in the article , point it out and proffer your evidence ``""","""ca n't point to anything inaccurate , so you see this mundane complaint that * you 're posting something I do n't like *""",,
26599,6987,"""Sorry , I should n't have jumped to that conclusion Sometimes this forum gets the best of me ... sorry again .""","""forgetaboutit . Hey , it 's Memorial Day weeeekeend and the sun is shining . I think I 'll go outside and play .""",DISAGREE,"""I should n't have jumped to that conclusion Sometimes this forum gets the best of me .""","""it 's Memorial Day weeeekeend and the sun is shining .""",,
26601,6988,"""My main issue is with the single common ancestor model and the only other viable explanation for the origin of life on earth , creationsim . I see the publication of Darwin 's Origin of Species to be a watershed event that permenantly established the single common ancestor model as the foundation of evolutionary biology .""","""That 's one problem . Creationism ( christian ) is n't the only other `` viable `` ( if you call it that ) system of origin . ( well , evolution is the only viable on in real , but to further the conversation ) , There are many others . Christianity is only one religion , and it 's not even the largest one . All religions have equally `` valid `` systems of origin . ALl of these religions , however , are hopelessly mythical and subjective . Most people set up a bifurcation ; they do n't realise that christianity 's creationism is n't the only other option .""",DISAGREE,"""the single common ancestor model and the only other viable explanation for the origin of life on earth , creationsim .""","""All religions have equally `` valid `` systems of origin .""",,
26604,6988,"""My main issue is with the single common ancestor model and the only other viable explanation for the origin of life on earth , creationsim . I see the publication of Darwin 's Origin of Species to be a watershed event that permenantly established the single common ancestor model as the foundation of evolutionary biology .""","""That 's one problem . Creationism ( christian ) is n't the only other `` viable `` ( if you call it that ) system of origin . ( well , evolution is the only viable on in real , but to further the conversation ) , There are many others . Christianity is only one religion , and it 's not even the largest one . All religions have equally `` valid `` systems of origin . ALl of these religions , however , are hopelessly mythical and subjective . Most people set up a bifurcation ; they do n't realise that christianity 's creationism is n't the only other option .""",DISAGREE,"""My main issue is with the single common ancestor model and the only other viable explanation for the origin of life on earth , creationsim""","""Creationism ( christian ) is n't the only other `` viable `` ( if you call it that ) system of origin""",,
26613,6990,"""I ’ m not sure why we are repeating this over and over . It ’ s a being but not a human being until it has brain waves in my opinion .""","""Well obviously it has to be something . It ’ s not the mother , it ’ s its own being . Hence , it is some sort of living thing . All living things have to be part of a species . Is the species  “ A potential human ” ?""",DISAGREE,"""It ’ s a being but not a human being until it has brain waves in my opinion .""","""it is some sort of living thing . All living things have to be part of a species . Is the species  A potential human ?""",,
26632,6993,"""Hey I 'm new . I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions .""","""Welcome my friend ............ We can always use another pro life advocate ....... Looking forward to your input ..........""",AGREE,"""I 'm new . I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions""","""We can always use another pro life advocate""",,
26635,6993,"""Hey I 'm new . I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions .""","""Welcome my friend ............ We can always use another pro life advocate ....... Looking forward to your input ..........""",AGREE,"""Hey I 'm new . I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions .""","""Welcome my friend ............ We can always use another pro life advocate ....... Looking forward to your input""",,
26637,6994,"""Under then bill pushed through in the middle of the night : 1.a healthy 25-year-old in Milwaukee will see his costs rise by 178 % . 2.A small business in Richmond with eight employees will see a 23 % increase . 3.Insurance for a 40-year-old family with two kids in Indianapolis will pay 106 % more 4.Collection of payroll taxes for the new plan will begin Jan. 2010 , but benefits do n't start until 2014 . 5 . Payment to doctors for Medicare patients will decrease 21.5 % next year and more after that . How many doctors do you think will continue to treat Medicare patients when that happens ? 6 . The plan will cost $ 871Billion over the next decate , but 98 % of the cost occurs after 2014 . 7 . Medical device manufacturers pay $ 2Billion/year in taxes . This will rise to $ 3Billion/year in 2018 , removing $ 1Billion that could be used for R & amp ; D and adding it to the cost of current devices instead . 8 . The rest of the country will pay ALL of Nebraska 's state contributions to Medicare FOREVER because that was the bribe that the Democrats made for the 60th vote . Now , Cake Lady , prove me wrong !""","""Well , this comes from the same people who invented the death pannels . The truth is that all the developed countries ( all of Europe , Canada , Japan , Australia , New Zealand , Taiwan , Israel ) have universal healthcare . Their COST per capita is about half of ours . They have better outcomes . Universal healthcare has been tried in many places and it does work . What does not work is our current system . Wellpoint has just increased premiums by 30 % even wiyhout a reform bill . They spend 30 % on administrative costs . BTW , do you oppose the bill that would force them to limit the administrative costs to 20 % ?""",DISAGREE,"""Milwaukee Richmond Indianapolis payroll Medicare patients $ 871Billion manufacturers R & D Nebraska 's FOREVER Democrats""","""developed countries Europe Australia New Zealand Taiwan Israel COST Wellpoint premiums 30 % on administrative costs BTW 20 % ?""",,
26673,7000,"""Originally posted by Peach47 I do n't gather information from other people opinions .""","""And yet all you do is present your own opinions without supporting facts .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't gather information from other people opinions .""","""all you do is present your own opinions without supporting facts .""",,
26675,7000,"""Originally posted by Peach47 I do n't gather information from other people opinions .""","""And yet all you do is present your own opinions without supporting facts .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't gather information from other people opinions .""","""And yet all you do is present your own opinions without supporting facts .""",,
26681,7001,"""I apologise if I have offended you Jason . Furthermore I must admit that I do not actually own a camel .""","""Apology accepted . I kind of figured you did n't .""",AGREE,"""I apologise if I have offended you""","""Apology accepted""",,
26682,7001,"""I apologise if I have offended you Jason . Furthermore I must admit that I do not actually own a camel .""","""Apology accepted . I kind of figured you did n't .""",AGREE,"""I do not actually own a camel .""","""I kind of figured you did n't .""",,
26690,7003,"""The decision by the 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco said the amendment 's right to bear arms is intended to maintain effective state militias and is not an individual right . '' The historical record makes it equally plain that the amendment was not adopted in order to afford rights to individuals with respect to private gun ownership or possession , `` Judge Stephen Reinhardt wrote . The 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals is the same federal court that ruled earlier this year that the phrase `` under God `` in the Pledge of Allegiance violates the separation of church and state . http : //www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,72371,00.html""","""That settles the matter .""",AGREE,"""The decision by the 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco said the amendment 's right to bear arms is intended to maintain effective state militias and is not an individual right""","""That settles the matter .""",,
26693,7003,"""The decision by the 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco said the amendment 's right to bear arms is intended to maintain effective state militias and is not an individual right . '' The historical record makes it equally plain that the amendment was not adopted in order to afford rights to individuals with respect to private gun ownership or possession , `` Judge Stephen Reinhardt wrote . The 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals is the same federal court that ruled earlier this year that the phrase `` under God `` in the Pledge of Allegiance violates the separation of church and state . http : //www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,72371,00.html""","""That settles the matter .""",AGREE,"""The historical record makes it equally plain that the amendment was not adopted in order to afford rights to individuals with respect to private gun ownership or possession , ``""","""That settles the matter""",,
26704,7006,"""Atheist answer : its relgious PEOPLE that expect us to believe in God . God himself does n't have any kind of expectations . Theist answer : the bible says that without faith its impossible to please God , and since the bible also says that the bible is God 's true word , then we only need faith to believe the bible and by extension to believe in God .""","""Actually , everything the bible say 's belies your `` atheist answer `` . The reality is that the world itself and all of Gods Creation speaks to His existence as being self evident . It takes a degree of faith to accept Jesus as our personal Savior , but as far as accepting the reality of God Himself , all one need do is look observe the world we live in to see that only an incredible and loving God could create such a Beautiful and marvelous World with so many amazing symbiotic and perfectly interdependent forms of life .""",DISAGREE,"""Atheist answer Theist answer""","""all one need do is look observe the world we live in to see that only an incredible and loving God could create such a Beautiful and marvelous World""",,
26703,7006,"""Atheist answer : its relgious PEOPLE that expect us to believe in God . God himself does n't have any kind of expectations . Theist answer : the bible says that without faith its impossible to please God , and since the bible also says that the bible is God 's true word , then we only need faith to believe the bible and by extension to believe in God .""","""Actually , everything the bible say 's belies your `` atheist answer `` . The reality is that the world itself and all of Gods Creation speaks to His existence as being self evident . It takes a degree of faith to accept Jesus as our personal Savior , but as far as accepting the reality of God Himself , all one need do is look observe the world we live in to see that only an incredible and loving God could create such a Beautiful and marvelous World with so many amazing symbiotic and perfectly interdependent forms of life .""",DISAGREE,"""answer : its relgious PEOPLE that expect us to believe in the""","""Actually , everything the bible say 's belies your `` atheist answer `` .""",,
26712,7007,"""You clam something can be outside the scope of knowledge ( science ) . To claim so is a contradiction , you can not claim to know something of the unknowable . It 's by definition ... yes , as we 've been through this countless times , UNKNOWABLE .""","""Actually `` I do n't know `` is quite a valid answer in science . However , again you slip into this false construct of a belief that all that can be known is in the scope of science ; which you 've also denied saying you believe in the past . [ quote=Montalban ] Is this a rational statement ? If so , prove it rationally , by science .""",DISAGREE,"""To claim so is a contradiction , you can not claim to know something of the unknowable""","""I do n't know `` is quite a valid answer in science .""",,
26720,7010,"""Evolution requires an old Earth , an old solar system , and an old universe .""","""Yes , it does . But determining that age is not a question answered by evolution .""",AGREE,"""Evolution requires an old Earth ,""","""Yes , it does .""",,
26722,7011,"""all point to the fact that all the supposed geologic periods actually occurred at the same time in the recent past .""","""Which again provides no evidence of creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""all point to the fact that all the supposed geologic periods actually occurred at the same time in the recent past .""","""Which again provides no evidence of creationism .""",,
26727,7012,"""This is their words as nothing science has `` proven `` overturns anything the Bible says . Most scientist agree is not proof . Many times most scientist are wrong .""","""? ? What are you trying to say ? Science is knowledge , all knowledge , that is , anything we find to be true . There is no other `` truth `` out there , if there were , we 'd be omniscient .""",DISAGREE,"""nothing science has `` proven `` overturns anything the Bible says""","""What are you trying to say ? Science is knowledge , all knowledge , that is , anything we find to be true""",,
26733,7014,"""Ah the non human part .""","""Now , now ZSU , we learned from comrade star gazer that GW created the Continental Army . I am sure these gentlemen have some equally illogical and inaccurate 'facts ' to scatter around the barnyard""",DISAGREE,"""Ah the non human part .""","""Now , now ZSU , we learned from comrade star gazer that GW created the Continental Army .""",,
26743,7016,"""I place value on the life of the feotus because it is close to human , it has the potential to become human .""","""Why do you place value on human life ?""",DISAGREE,"""I place value on the life""","""Why do you place value""",,
26752,7018,"""so yes the existance of other religions can be seen as disproof for your god , becuas logic dictates that you must ask yourself why your god didint speak to people in asia or south america .""","""There are several scientific explanations for the nature of the earth . Some use 'science ' to say that the world is flat . Granted that these beliefs are n't widely accepted , but then not all religions are widely accepted . By your reasoning or 'logic ' you must ask yourself about whether you should rely on science when there are many different scientific theories . The Flat Earth News , at least back then , had a regular column , `` One Hundred Proofs Earth is Not a Globe. `` ( go to http : //www.flat-earth.org/ ) Other theories taught as science phrenology alchemy evolution eugenics neptunism Theories of the Aether Articles relating to the Emergence of Scientific Theories of the Cosmic Aether ( http : //www.mountainman.com.au/aether.html ) What about 'metascience ' ? http : //www.calresco.org/lucas/science.htm Or , sciences used to support political ends ... What about Marxist Science http : //www.marxists.org/archive/hald ... philosophy.htm or Chaos Theory and Marxism http : //www.marxist.com/science/chaostheory.html There 's Nazi Science http : //www.webster.edu/~woolflm/naziscience.html Nationalist Science http : //www.ljudmila.org/nettime/zkp4/08.htm Or social ends ... Scientific Racism http : //www.press.uillinois.edu/f02/tucker.html Mainstream scientists instead of using the word 'heretic ' use the word 'pseudo-science ' to categorise fringe beliefs .""",DISAGREE,"""so yes the existance of other religions can be seen as disproof for your god""","""There are several scientific explanations for the nature of the earth""",,
26761,7020,"""For your info just a many Democrat go to church as well so whats that suppose to mean too . Come on Satin get with the real world .""","""Actually , I reported the real results of a study . Regular church attendees are twice as likely to vote Republican ... etc. , the conclusion was , however , meant to be a joke . Most got it , you did n't .""",AGREE,"""Democrat go to church as well so whats that suppose to mean too .""","""I reported the real results of a study . Regular church attendees are twice as likely to vote Republican""",,
26763,7020,"""For your info just a many Democrat go to church as well so whats that suppose to mean too . Come on Satin get with the real world .""","""Actually , I reported the real results of a study . Regular church attendees are twice as likely to vote Republican ... etc. , the conclusion was , however , meant to be a joke . Most got it , you did n't .""",AGREE,"""many Democrat go to church as well so whats that suppose to mean too""","""Regular church attendees are twice as likely to vote Republican ...""",,
26773,7023,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for centuries . I 've just gotten tired of it -- and righteously so .""","""Actually I 'm so sure of my manhood that even though I knew that charge would be levelled against me I still posted anyway . Anyway if you feel that men need to be degraded to make up for past actions to women you have gone from `` righteous `` to bitter .""",DISAGREE,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for centuries . I 've just gotten tired of it -- and righteously so .""","""Actually I 'm so sure of my manhood that even though I knew that charge would be levelled against me I still posted anyway . Anyway if you feel that men need to be degraded to make up for past actions to women you have gone from `` righteous `` to bitter .""",,
26775,7023,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for centuries . I 've just gotten tired of it -- and righteously so .""","""Actually I 'm so sure of my manhood that even though I knew that charge would be levelled against me I still posted anyway . Anyway if you feel that men need to be degraded to make up for past actions to women you have gone from `` righteous `` to bitter .""",DISAGREE,"""Women have been denigrated and made fun of for centuries .""","""if you feel that men need to be degraded to make up for past actions to women you have gone from `` righteous `` to bitter .""",,
26782,7025,"""It may be perfectly legitimate to make these inferences , but the point of the statement from wikipedia was that micro-evolution is directly and ( more importantly ) currently observable . This seems to be a huge difference between macro and micro evolution , especially when one remembers the defintion of the scientific method .""","""No , not really . All that is different is the number of steps . What is YOUR definition of 'macro-evoution ' ? Is it speciation ? Or is it a brand new genus ? We have observed speciation , where new species happened .""",DISAGREE,"""It may be perfectly legitimate to make these inferences , but the point of the statement from wikipedia was that micro-evolution is directly""","""No , not really . All that is different is the number of steps . What is YOUR definition of 'macro-evoution ' ? Is it speciation ?""",,
26785,7026,"""where do concepts come from when all that exist is matter , we know concepts are outside and are not dependent on matter or experence , or being discovered ( if we did not discover them they would still exist ) how can matter bring about something that is not matter""","""Logical truths do not come from `` somewhere `` , your question makes as much sense as `` What time is a moose ? '' . You do not appear to have read my post at all , variously repeating what I have said and addressing things I did not say .""",DISAGREE,"""where do concepts come from when all that exist is matter , we know concepts are outside and are not dependent on matter or experence""","""Logical truths do not come from `` somewhere `` , your question makes as much sense as `` What time is a moose ?""",,
26796,7028,"""humans did not evolve from Blobs , they did not `` evolve `` from fishes , this is not reality , the first humans looked exactly like us today as the human race looked 2000 years ago .""","""Really ? How do you explain this picture ? http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comd ... /hominids2.jpg I 'm really interested .""",DISAGREE,"""the first humans looked exactly like us today as the human race looked 2000 years ago .""","""Really ? How do you explain this picture ?""",,
26794,7028,"""humans did not evolve from Blobs , they did not `` evolve `` from fishes , this is not reality , the first humans looked exactly like us today as the human race looked 2000 years ago .""","""Really ? How do you explain this picture ? http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comd ... /hominids2.jpg I 'm really interested .""",DISAGREE,"""humans did not evolve from Blobs , they did not `` evolve `` from fishes""","""Really ? How do you explain this picture ?""",,
26813,7032,"""There is no evidence either way .""","""No evidence of what ?""",DISAGREE,"""no evidence either way .""","""No evidence of what ?""",,
26827,7035,"""Primitive and immature as compared to what or whom ?""","""Do you think humans have the pinnacle of processing power and reason in our brain for the entire universe ? ( aside from god )""",DISAGREE,"""Primitive and immature as compared to what or whom ?""","""Do you think humans have the pinnacle of processing power and reason in our brain for the entire universe ?""",,
26851,7039,"""* Yes , evolution is a theory . Then again , what is God ?""","""Well , it seems pretty evident that you have know idea of the meaning of the word theory when used in science .""",DISAGREE,"""Yes , evolution is a theory .""","""you have know idea of the meaning of the word theory when used in science .""",,
26856,7040,"""Only a complete XXXXX , devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""","""A textbook description of a liberal !""",AGREE,"""Only a complete XXXXX would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""","""description of a liberal !""",,
26858,7041,"""I can not prove that my belief in my specific God is true any more then I can prove that leprechauns , unicorns , the flying spaghetti monster , magical space monkeys and living care bears exists . That does n't mean I do n't believe in God however .""","""actually , it can be proven whether leprechauns , unicorns , the flying spaghetti monster , magical space monkeys and livining care baers , and even god , exists or not . the question of proving a belief seems kinda self-contradictory to me . if something is a fact that can be proven , then your belief about it is irrelevant . likewise , if you believe something , whether there are facts to support it or not , its still your belief . there are people who believe things inn the absence of supporting facts , and sometimes even in the face of opposing facts . the term for that is faith faith is the belief of something in the absence of evidence . if you have faith in something , proof is irrelevant , or at least it should be""",DISAGREE,"""I can not prove that my belief in my specific God is true any more then I can prove that leprechauns .""","""actually , it can be proven whether leprechauns and even god , exists or not .""",,
26865,7042,"""... except for the surprising lack of feathers present .""","""I 'm not sure what you are saying . Are you saying that you think that theropod dinosaurs should have more feathers than this Sinornithosaurus does ? First you claim that the entire forelimb would have been useless , and when shown that it was not you claim that the feathers could not have existed because they would be useless , and now when shown a fossil that shows feathers , you are surprised that there are not more . I suspect that not all of the feathers on this creature are apparent in the fossil . http : //research.amnh.org/vertpaleo/feather5.jpg http : //research.amnh.org/vertpaleo/feather9a.jpg http : //research.amnh.org/vertpaleo/feather11.jpg But there are enough to show that feathered dinosaurs did , in fact exist . Any argument about whether or not is is possible that such creatures existed is moot . It is irrelevant that you feel that such limbs would have been useless . Obviously they were not . So now we return to your original confused and erroneous arguments .""",DISAGREE,"""except for the surprising lack of feathers present .""","""I 'm not sure what you are saying . Are you saying that you think that theropod dinosaurs should have more feathers""",,
26872,7043,"""Global warming sure is a threat . Some of the Polar Ice Caps already melted . Average temperatures have rised since 50+ years ago at a constant rate . We better stop polluting now , or we will be in big trouble .""","""The Polar Icecaps have been melting for the past 14,000 years according to experts . Many in the scientific community believe that it would be another 100-1000 years before the melting of Polar Ice becomes a factor in the rise of sea level . What they believe is more important is the thermal expansion of the world 's water that comes with the increase in the oceans ' mean temperature . Some predict that the rise in sea level could be 3 ' by 2100 , so do n't invest long-term in any beach-front property that is n't on tall stilts and you 'll be OK .""",AGREE,"""Average temperatures have rised since 50+ years ago at a constant rate .""","""What they believe is more important is the thermal expansion of the world 's water that comes with the increase""",,
26874,7044,"""It says right in the Constitution ... `` We hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal , and that they are endowed with certain unalienable rights , life , liberty , and the pursuit of happiness ... etc . etc . '' Would n't one gay man marrying another be considered a 'pursuit of happiness ' ? Just my thoughts .""","""That is the declaration of independence not the constitution . I can go you one better admendment 9 and 10 talk about certain rights retained by the people . Amendment IX The enumeration in the Constitution , of certain rights , shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people . Amendment X The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution , nor prohibited by it to the states , are reserved to the states respectively , or to the people . The conservatives would argue that by offering same sex marriage that their persute of happiness is denied by gay people even existing and that they have to look at us .""",AGREE,"""all men are created equal , and that they are endowed with certain unalienable rights , Would n't one gay man marrying another be considered a 'pursuit of happiness ' ?""","""That is the declaration of independence not the constitution , The conservatives would argue that by offering same sex marriage that their persute of happiness is denied by gay people even existing and that they have to look at us .""",,
26885,7046,"""Let me illustrate : A creation teacher is teaching about creation when an atheist student raises his hand . '' Yes ? `` says the teacher . The student explains , `` Teacher , I 'm an atheist . There is no god. `` '' Then what is 'right and wrong ' ? You have to have standards to these thoughts or being an atheist is irrational. `` declares the teacher . The student replies , `` That 's easy . I 'm the god of my own universe. `` '' Well that 's just wonderful because I am going to shoot you in 5 minutes. `` claims the teacher . The student exclaims , `` You ca n't do that ! `` '' Oh yes I can . See , I 'm the god of my own universe. ``""","""The claim that only through a belief in the Biblical God - or any God - can right and wrong be known is completely stupid . 1 ) Ever hear of humanism ? 2 ) EVEN CHIMPS HAVE A SENSE OF BEING TREATED RIGHTLY OR WRONGLY ! AND EVEN CHIMPS HAVE BEEN SEEN TO DO FOR OTHERS WHAT THEY WOULD WANT DONE FOR THEM ! EDIT : Excuse , I double checked and I was wrong ... but that 's BAD news for the Creationist ! EVEN CAPUCHIN MONKEYS - WHICH ARE NOT AS RELATED TO HUMANS AS ARE CHIMPS - HAVE A SENSE OF WHETHER THEY ARE BEING TREATED FAIRLY OR NOT ! ! ! http : //www.sciencedaily.com/releases ... 0918092951.htm Chimps take this one step farther by adding into the mix how closely their social bonds are to the other participant . So chimps have a more complex sense of fairness than do capuchin monkeys . http : //www.whsc.emory.edu/press_rele ... nt_id_seq=2819""",DISAGREE,"""what is 'right and wrong ' ? You have to have standards to these thoughts or being an atheist is""","""claim that only through a belief in the Biblical God - or any God - can right and wrong be known is completely stupid""",,
26907,7049,"""ahhh , thats where youre mistaken . ANY aspect of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance .""","""Not really . That 's the fallacy of exclusion of the middle . Because there are only two choices , if one is wrong somehow , the other is therefore correct . The problem is that there is n't only two choice for sure . Besides , science is wrong all the time , it does n't prove that creation is right . In fact , for instance , science estaimtes of moon dust have been proven wildly wrong , and those corrections actually harm creation .""",DISAGREE,"""ANY aspect of science that can be discredited helps strengthen the creationist stance""","""Not really""",,
26920,7051,"""Geologic time/millions of years ago ( mybp ) /days per year late Precambrian/900mybp/487 days earliest Cambrian Period/600mybp/424 days early Ordovician Period/500mybp/412 days middle Devonian Period/370mybp/398 days Permo-Triassic boundary/245mybp/386 days `` Jurassic Park `` /180mybp/381 days end Cretaceous ( Chixulub ) /65mybp/371 days""","""But that does n't help much with calculating the length of a day from actual astronomical observations . Perhaps if we told Freeofthought that the current rate of slowing of the earth is 0.005 sec/year/year . I have no doubt that Freeofthought will misunderstand that number - it is a rate . Just assume that rate has been unchanging even though it has n't been . A lot of the creationists misunderstanding comes from remarks like the following .""",AGREE,"""Geologic time/millions of years ago ( mybp ) /days per year late""","""Perhaps if we told Freeofthought that the current rate of slowing of the earth is 0.005 sec/year/year .""",,
26925,7052,"""not sure about that . Viralistic ? That does n't seem to make alot of sense . Most of humanity is n't actively invading and replicating itself for seemingly no real reason .""","""I dunno , I keep seeing more and more chinese around here ! ! And they all have 3 kids ! They come over here just so they can breed . They invade a host that is more favorable for replication . Viral ! [ please , this is a joke , any chinese out there , just a joke ! ]""",DISAGREE,"""Most of humanity is n't actively invading and replicating itself for seemingly no real reason .""","""They come over here just so they can breed .""",,
26952,7064,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question .""","""Being new is n't a problem . Nor is uncertainty about a position . The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places . However , a problem with message boards is that , without experience , it may be difficult to tell who is speaking from knowledge and who is speaking from ignorance or faith .""",AGREE,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question""","""Being new is n't a problem . Nor is uncertainty about a position .""",,
26956,7064,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question .""","""Being new is n't a problem . Nor is uncertainty about a position . The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places . However , a problem with message boards is that , without experience , it may be difficult to tell who is speaking from knowledge and who is speaking from ignorance or faith .""",AGREE,"""I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question""","""The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places .""",,
26951,7064,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question .""","""Being new is n't a problem . Nor is uncertainty about a position . The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places . However , a problem with message boards is that , without experience , it may be difficult to tell who is speaking from knowledge and who is speaking from ignorance or faith .""",AGREE,"""Hey everyone im new to the whole creation vs evolution thing . I do n't really know where i stand but i have a question .""","""Being new is n't a problem . Nor is uncertainty about a position . The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places .""",,
26967,7066,"""If god could create the world in 7 days then he sure as hell could get someone pregnant .""","""So parthenegenic births are always female . Where did the X chromosome come from ? Is this another case of `` POOF , it was a miracle `` when faced with reality ?""",DISAGREE,"""If god could create the world in 7 days then he sure as hell could get someone pregnant .""","""So parthenegenic births are always female . Where did the X chromosome come from ? Is this another case of `` POOF , it was a miracle `` when faced with reality ?""",,
26981,7069,"""Do you want them all dead ?""","""See above .""",DISAGREE,"""Do you want them all dead ?""","""See above .""",,
27000,7072,"""Another problem I have that feeds this preconceived notion assertion is the mislabeling of these allegedly ancient fossils by referring to them as Java MAN , Peking MAN , Neanderthal MAN when they were n't absolutely , necessarily men at all , but simply primates that are assumed once again , to be related to us .""","""But would you understand what I was talking about if I referred to AL 288-1 , Trinil 2 , Sangiran 17 , KNM-ER 1813 , OH 13 , KNM-WT 15000 , or Saccopastore 1 ? You know so little that you do n't even realize that the names to which you object are not scientific names but names popularized by the press for people , like you , who know so little about it . Scientifically , both Java Man and Peking Man are Homo erectus . They are classified as such because there are no significant differences between them . In fact , there is little difference between Java Man ( Trinil 2 ) and the skull of Nariokotome Boy ( KNM-WT 15000 ) , from Africa , or KNM-ER 3733 for that matter . But you are obsessed with the words . You are so bent out of shape because transitional species between ape-like ancestors and us , that walked upright and used tools are called `` man `` . And they are n't assumed to be ancestral . Why do n't you learn what you are talking about before you speak . You make yourself look foolish when you speak from ignorance . ] quote ] Regarding the Java Man , How is this skull cap evidence of anything concrete ? [ /quote ] How is it that you think that evidence against your mythology based point of view supports your mythology ?""",DISAGREE,"""I have that feeds this preconceived notion assertion is the mislabeling of these allegedly ancient fossils by referring to them as Java MAN""","""But would you understand what I was talking about if I referred to AL 288-1 , Trinil 2 , Sangiran 17""",,
27004,7072,"""Another problem I have that feeds this preconceived notion assertion is the mislabeling of these allegedly ancient fossils by referring to them as Java MAN , Peking MAN , Neanderthal MAN when they were n't absolutely , necessarily men at all , but simply primates that are assumed once again , to be related to us .""","""But would you understand what I was talking about if I referred to AL 288-1 , Trinil 2 , Sangiran 17 , KNM-ER 1813 , OH 13 , KNM-WT 15000 , or Saccopastore 1 ? You know so little that you do n't even realize that the names to which you object are not scientific names but names popularized by the press for people , like you , who know so little about it . Scientifically , both Java Man and Peking Man are Homo erectus . They are classified as such because there are no significant differences between them . In fact , there is little difference between Java Man ( Trinil 2 ) and the skull of Nariokotome Boy ( KNM-WT 15000 ) , from Africa , or KNM-ER 3733 for that matter . But you are obsessed with the words . You are so bent out of shape because transitional species between ape-like ancestors and us , that walked upright and used tools are called `` man `` . And they are n't assumed to be ancestral . Why do n't you learn what you are talking about before you speak . You make yourself look foolish when you speak from ignorance . ] quote ] Regarding the Java Man , How is this skull cap evidence of anything concrete ? [ /quote ] How is it that you think that evidence against your mythology based point of view supports your mythology ?""",DISAGREE,"""assertion is the mislabeling of these allegedly ancient fossils""","""You know so little that you do n't even realize that the names to which you object are not scientific names""",,
27014,7074,"""Then do n't post because there is no reason any of us should listen to you . You are just a classic example of the pot calling the kettle black .""","""So I am not intitled to my opinions ? Your statement is so ironic because it seems that others also suffer from pot and kettleism and do n't realize it .""",DISAGREE,"""there is no reason any of us should listen to you . You are just a classic example of the pot calling the kettle black""","""Your statement is so ironic because it seems that others also suffer from pot and kettleism and do n't realize it .""",,
27018,7075,"""lol , zenodotus . You refute your own point and strengthen mine . You stated that we can not know whether the fetus is or is not morally a person , yet now you state that the fetus is morally a person to you ? That was my point , that we can know because some think it is morally a person and some think it is not morally a person . Me stating that is was not morally a person to me was merely an example .""","""Just as you were stating that it was not as an example , so was I stating that it was to me as an example . So , your reasoning that we can know if it is or is not a person is because people disagree on whether or not it is ? That theory could use a bit more explanation .""",DISAGREE,"""refute your own point and strengthen mine You stated that we can not know whether the fetus is or is not morally a person""","""Just as you were stating that it was not as an example , So , your reasoning that we can know if it is or is not a person is because people disagree on whether or not it is ?""",,
27025,7076,"""It gets worse . I went to a presentation of Creation Science once and this 80 year old `` archaeologist `` told me that before the flood , the atmospheric pressure of the planet was double what it is now and that the oxygen content was higher .""","""Oh never mind that such a condition would be toxic ... not to mention that no ice cores support such magical ideas .""",DISAGREE,"""I went to a presentation of Creation Science once and this 80 year old `` archaeologist ``""","""no ice cores support such magical ideas .""",,
27030,7077,"""Originally posted by dsadevil Why do n't I have a right to drive ? What objective standard are you using to determine what I do and do not have a right to do ?""","""You do not have a right to drive . No one does . Driving is not a right . The state does not owe it to you to give you a license to drive . The activity of driving is a priveldge granted by the state , not a right . Rights are not regulated by government . You have them and no earthly authority can take it away from you . The state never gave me my rights , I already had them , nor do I have to ask for permission to exercise them .""",DISAGREE,"""Why do n't I have a right to drive ?""","""Driving is not a right . The state does not owe it to you to give you a license to drive .""",,
27034,7077,"""Originally posted by dsadevil Why do n't I have a right to drive ? What objective standard are you using to determine what I do and do not have a right to do ?""","""You do not have a right to drive . No one does . Driving is not a right . The state does not owe it to you to give you a license to drive . The activity of driving is a priveldge granted by the state , not a right . Rights are not regulated by government . You have them and no earthly authority can take it away from you . The state never gave me my rights , I already had them , nor do I have to ask for permission to exercise them .""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by dsadevil Why do n't I have a right to drive ? what I do and do not have a right to do ?""","""You do not have a right to drive . No one does . Driving is not a right The activity of driving is a priveldge granted by the state , not a right""",,
27045,7086,"""He was a gun owner and a terrorist .""","""How do you know he was a gun owner ? Maybe he borrowed it . And I bet he was a carnivore , walked upright and drove a car , as well .""",DISAGREE,"""He was a gun owner""","""How do you know he was a gun owner""",,
27047,7087,"""The family of Greg Baer , Bank of America executive , is located in a jurisdiction protected by the Montgomery County Police Department ( MCPD ) , which responded promptly to a disturbance call from his neighborhood last weekend . According to Corporal Dan Friz , an MCPD spokesperson in Rockville , Maryland , the department received a disturbance call from one of Baer ’ s neighbors at 4:10 pm last Sunday . Four MCPD units arrived at Baer ’ s Greenville Rd . address at 4:15 pm . At least two Metropolitan Police Department units from the nearby District of Columbia were already at the scene when they arrived .""","""So the local police did respond .""",AGREE,"""located in a jurisdiction protected by the Montgomery County Police Department ( MCPD ) , which responded promptly to a disturbance call from his neighborhood last weekend . Four MCPD units arrived at Baer ’ s Greenville Rd""","""local police did respond""",,
27055,7088,"""( Now remember , people actually thought this way in the name of evolution and science ! )""","""And I think that if I fall off a tall cliff , I 'll die . Does that mean that gravity and science are either evil or incorrect ?""",DISAGREE,"""people actually thought this way in the name of evolution and science !""","""And I think that if I fall off a tall cliff , I 'll die . Does that mean that gravity and science are either evil or incorrect ?""",,
27062,7089,"""Portugal 's Parliament Approves Gay Marriage""","""So country by country , the world is going to hell in a hand basket . And this pleases you , why ?""",DISAGREE,"""Portugal 's Parliament Approves Gay Marriage""","""So country by country , the world is going to hell in a hand basket .""",,
27066,7090,"""Halton Arp is far from suppressed.Any complaints about telescope time echo the complaints of astronomers everwhere that have to clamor and compete for the same telescopes .""","""He was barred for presenting hard evidence against the Big Bang . Observable evidence . He was the head astronomer at Mt Carmel not just another astronomer . He was our best one . Being barred from the telescopes he was in charge of , being fired , and having to move to Germany is not what you consider suppression ? I am not willing to discuss this with you anymore if you refuse to do it honestly . You can say anything .""",DISAGREE,"""Halton Arp is far from suppressed.Any complaints about telescope time echo the complaints of astronomers everwhere that have to clamor and compete for the same telescopes .""","""Being barred from the telescopes he was in charge of , being fired , and having to move to Germany is not what you consider suppression ?""",,
27071,7091,"""For anti-choicers , it 's just about control and power over women . They do n't care about life . ( Except their own . )""","""I 'm not big on the abortion issue , but are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you is sexist and arrogant ? That 's a tactic straight from the leftist playbook . Clearly you 're the one who 's arrogant , if you can make these kinds of baseless generalizations of your opponents . Is n't it you who always accuses conservatives of being intolerant of people who think differently than them ? Now that 's irony !""",DISAGREE,"""just about control and power over women . They do n't care about life . ( Except their own . )""","""anyone who disagrees with you is sexist and arrogant ? straight from the leftist playbook . 're the one who 's arrogant intolerant of people who think differently than them ?""",,
27074,7091,"""For anti-choicers , it 's just about control and power over women . They do n't care about life . ( Except their own . )""","""I 'm not big on the abortion issue , but are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you is sexist and arrogant ? That 's a tactic straight from the leftist playbook . Clearly you 're the one who 's arrogant , if you can make these kinds of baseless generalizations of your opponents . Is n't it you who always accuses conservatives of being intolerant of people who think differently than them ? Now that 's irony !""",DISAGREE,"""anti-choicers , it 's just about control and power over women""","""I 'm not big on the abortion issue , but are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you is sexist and arrogant ?""",,
27080,7099,"""Not only that but the whole theory of evolution is a result of changes in genes ( or alleles ) .""","""No it 's not . Would n't it be nice if you knew enough to differentiate between theory , evidence and definition . [ /quote ] Ha ! Now , however , genes are `` losing their glitter . '' [ /quote ] I was n't aware that they glittered . What are you talking about ?""",DISAGREE,"""the whole theory of evolution is a result of changes in genes ( or alleles ) .""","""No it 's not . Would n't it be nice if you knew enough to differentiate between theory , evidence and definition .""",,
27086,7100,"""It was part of the reason I chose to have my tubes tied and I refuse to marry again .""","""So , you got your tubes tied because `` With womens right 's getting shredded in the debate over abortion , fewer and fewer women are going to want to even risk have sex with men at all . It 'll cause a wave of abstinence and imprisonment that will cut succesive generations in half . That 'll even further errode the solvancy of social security. `` Why would one get their tubes tied if they were swearing off men ? And do you really believe the rest of the load about imprisonment and SS solvancy erosion , too ?""",DISAGREE,"""It was part of the reason I chose to have my tubes tied and I refuse to marry again .""","""So , you got your tubes tied because `` With womens right 's getting shredded in the debate over abortion , fewer and fewer women are going to want to even risk have sex with men at all .""",,
27112,7104,"""http : //www.catholiceducation.org/art ... on/ab0102.html I actually have n't read all of this article yet , but it looks interesting .""","""I think I posted that awhile ago . Its huge BS . Thats like saying `` Civil rights hurt blacks `` . Even though abortion may have some unwated side affects , its no where near the emotional and physical pain and suffering for the rest of your life than a forced pregnancy . Just goes to show that the pro-life movement is desperate .""",DISAGREE,"""read yet but it looks interesting""","""think posted ago a""",,
27117,7105,"""First of all , i can turn around right here , because i can see that you already have no idea what you are talking about . Pro-choicers do not advocate the abortion of fetuses . Anti-choice antics are getting pretty dirty these days .""","""but they do support the choice to abort a fetus or embryo . An argument made for slavery was that `` you do n't have to own them but do n't tell us what to do `` .. a fairly similar argument but does n't show whether or not abortion is wrong just that some lines of thinking should be questioned .""",DISAGREE,"""Pro-choicers do not advocate the abortion of fetuses .""","""but they do support the choice to abort a fetus or embryo .""",,
27132,7110,"""To be fair , there are extreme views on the pro-choice side that would alllow almost anything to be considered a health issue - ex . if the mother is stressed out about the pregnancy , or she has high blood pressure during the pregnancy , etc. , and this is the extreme arguement that McCain is addressing . Nevertheless , he is vastly exagerating the pro-choice view based on extreme examples . The trouble is that we as a society , including the pro-choice community , have NOT outlined any criteria for which health issues would be valid reasons and which would not . I think that most of us would view extreme health issues ( such as high chance of paralysis or major heart problems ) to be valid reasons while minor health issues ( short-term stress , or change in post-pregnancy metabolism to have greater weight gain tendency , etc . ) to not be valid reasons for third trimester abortions . I tried to start a thread here once - `` The mother 's health exception - where do we draw the line ? `` - but it did n't get very far in resolving the issue here . Perhaps this could be a good topic to address here .""","""I believe that a number of issues are to be considered in regard to a pregnant woman 's health . How damaging to her health would continuation of the pregnancy be ? What sort of family responsibilities does she have ? Most women , it seems , have family responsibilities of one sort or another , as opposed to men who tend to let family responsibilities go by the wayside . Is she the breadwinner of the family ? If she 's disabled , what will happen to her family ? I hate it when men , I presume that most of the trivializers are men , when men trivialize the issue of a woman 's health . And we very well know that McCain has little use for women . He is a supreme user of women . He married his first wife for her beauty and discarded her when she lost that beauty . He married his next wife for her beauty and wealth but did not hesitate to call her the C word and denounce her for a trollop for putting on so much makeup . The woman is no longer the youthful beauty she once was , so why should n't she use make-up if that pleases her ? McCain has repeatedly demonstrated he hates women :""",DISAGREE,"""this is the extreme arguement that McCain is addressing""","""I believe that a number of issues are to be considered in regard to a pregnant :""",,
27137,7112,"""Professional Ethics Report""","""This says absolutely nothing about gays . It talks about Congress investigating Science and Ethics . Quite frankly , I think some of the people they NEED to be investigating is NARTH , as I just proved that their article MISQUOTED other research articles . Furthermore , I can supply you with a long list of other anti-gay researchers who likewise have been guilty of misrepresenting other people 's research . On a separate note , this article was further down on that web-page . It had this title : `` Federal Judge Dismisses Scientific Misconduct Claim ``""",DISAGREE,"""Professional Ethics Report""","""I can supply you with a long list of other anti-gay researchers who likewise have been guilty of misrepresenting other people 's research .""",,
27181,7121,"""You would n't want the perp to be disadvantaged too much now would you ? How many shots must one allow the perp before you can fire back ?""","""I 'm not against concealed carry in principle but open carry seems silly to me . I smell posers .""",DISAGREE,"""You would n't want the perp to be disadvantaged too much now would you ? How many shots must one allow the perp before you can fire back ?""","""I 'm not against concealed carry in principle but open carry seems silly to me . I smell posers .""",,
27190,7122,"""If the pharmacist is an employee then it 's a company issue as Big Orn said although you could sue the company . If no other pharmacy is available and the pharmacist owns the pharmacy I 'd say sue him/her and buy online . Those Canadians will sell you anything .""","""Just out of curiosity , what do you feel you could sue the company for ? Descrimination ? Could I sue Wal Mart or Dillons for not carrying a line of adult movies and sex toys ? After all , I have a right to own adult movies and sex toys . Does n't that mean that Wal Mart automatically has the responsibillity to provide those goods ? After all , they are the biggest retailer in my area .""",DISAGREE,"""If the pharmacist is an employee then it 's a company issue as Big Orn said although you could sue the company . If no other pharmacy is available and the pharmacist owns the pharmacy I 'd say sue him/her and buy online . Those Canadians will sell you anything .""","""Just out of curiosity , what do you feel you could sue the company for ? Descrimination ? Could I sue Wal Mart or Dillons for not carrying a line of adult movies and sex toys ? After all , I have a right to own adult movies and sex toys . Does n't that mean that Wal Mart automatically has the responsibillity to provide those goods ? After all , they are the biggest retailer in my area .""",,
27203,7124,"""This is the old viability arguement , but it just does n't hold up . It means that as our medical technology has gotten progressively better , and a premature baby can survive outside the womb at earlier and earlier stages because of this , the point at which it is unethical and/or considered murder has gotten earlier .""","""There is a point , however , that the fetal lung is not mature enough to survive outside the womb even with mechanical assistance . So , unless our technology will be pretty radically different in the future , it is n't about getting it out , it 's about it not surviving when it is out .""",DISAGREE,"""This is the old viability arguement , but it just does n't hold up .""","""There is a point , however , that the fetal lung is not mature enough to survive outside the womb""",,
27218,7127,"""That wasnt sarcasm .""","""I believe I would know when my own post is sarcasm or not ...""",DISAGREE,"""That wasnt sarcasm .""","""I believe I would know when my own post is sarcasm or not ...""",,
27242,7129,"""The discovery of a fossilised rabbit in the Burgess Shale may demolish one of the pillars of modern science , the theory of evolution . The late J . B. S. Haldane famously said that all it would take to falsify evolution is a single Cambrian rabbit fossil , and that is exactly what has been uncovered by paleontologist Dr Wilfred Splenebyrst of the London School of Ergonomics .""","""Those nasty deceptive Darwinians have been overthrown at last .""",AGREE,"""The late J . B. S. Haldane famously said that all it would take to falsify evolution is a single Cambrian rabbit fossil , and that is exactly what has been uncovered by paleontologist Dr Wilfred Splenebyrst of the London School of Ergonomics .""","""Those nasty deceptive Darwinians have been overthrown at last .""",,
27251,7130,"""Abortion is wrong by every standard . John Roberts and Sam Alito will overturn Roe v. Wade .""","""It 's ashame that everyone keeps looking for the judiciary to do the legislature 's work . When will the people press Congress to take up abortion ? It is the job of Congress after all , to address the issues desired by it 's constituents .""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion is wrong by every standard .""","""When will the people press Congress to take up abortion ?""",,
27260,7131,"""the fact that you think life can be created out of non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""You still have n't learned what Google is have you Yankee Fan ? HowStuffWorks `` Artificial Life `` Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years - Science - redOrbit And relying entirely on insults is not a good way of gaining credibility . It did n't work on Livewire , it wo n't work here .""",DISAGREE,"""the fact that you think life can be created out of non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""You still have n't learned what Google is have you Yankee Fan ?""",,
27256,7131,"""the fact that you think life can be created out of non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""You still have n't learned what Google is have you Yankee Fan ? HowStuffWorks `` Artificial Life `` Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years - Science - redOrbit And relying entirely on insults is not a good way of gaining credibility . It did n't work on Livewire , it wo n't work here .""",DISAGREE,"""created out of non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""good way of gaining credibility . It did n't work on Livewire ,""",,
27257,7131,"""the fact that you think life can be created out of non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""You still have n't learned what Google is have you Yankee Fan ? HowStuffWorks `` Artificial Life `` Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years - Science - redOrbit And relying entirely on insults is not a good way of gaining credibility . It did n't work on Livewire , it wo n't work here .""",DISAGREE,"""non-life in 10 years show how little you know about biology""","""redOrbit And relying entirely on insults is not a good way of gaining credibility""",,
27271,7133,"""In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead .""",AGREE,"""does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead .""",,
27273,7133,"""In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead .""",AGREE,"""In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead .""",,
27274,7133,"""In fact , as a return question , I 'd like to ask him : does someone rely on the Odyssey to establish the existence of Pallas Athene , Circe or Calypso ?""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead .""",AGREE,"""does someone rely on the Odyssey""","""I 've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route""",,
27309,7140,"""Here you reveal exactly what I 've just spoken of -- you assume that science and the scientific method equates to , is synonymous with , materialism/mechanism . It most certainly is not . Nor is the accompanying assumption , i.e. , that any science which does not strictly adhere to materialust/mechanist assumptions , is not , and can not be , real science . Equally untrue .""","""And here you reveal your prediliction for reading what you want to see into the words of others . I described materialism embracing new forces and phenomena which have withstood the rigors of the scientific method . I explicitly described science as a methodology , not a philosophy . You are wrong about me , WW , and the longer you pretend otherwise , the more time you 're going to waste on strawmen and the more chances I 'm going to get to make your arguments look silly . It 's up to you . Argue with me , or argue with the person you want me to be .""",DISAGREE,"""Here you reveal exactly what I 've just spoken of -- you assume that science and the scientific method equates to , is synonymous with , materialism/mechanism . It most certainly is not . Nor is the accompanying assumption""","""And here you reveal your prediliction for reading what you want to see into the words of others . I described materialism embracing new forces and phenomena which have withstood the rigors of the scientific method""",,
27319,7141,"""Then why are you and other `` antis `` so hung up on preserving it for your exclusive use ?""","""Because we view it as something much more than just a gravy train from the govt. , that 's why . For you it seems to be about the word , and the govt . saying `` oh , you use THAT term ( `` marriage `` ) , ok we recognize it. `` For us it 's about the commitment .""",DISAGREE,"""Then why are you and other `` antis `` so hung up on preserving it for your exclusive use""","""we view it as something much more than just a gravy train from the govt""",,
27320,7142,"""This statement is wrong ... Thats proof for me that Jesus existed and that he is God ...""","""Your penultimate sentence sums this up well with the emphasis that I added . What you describe is sufficient 'proof ' for you to believe . Why ? Because you believe . Other than the Bible ( which is far from being an accurate historical textbook ) from where do you obtain the evidence of these prophets and their prophecies ? I am not discussing the God/Person of Jesus specifically . I am not discussing whether or not Jesus is the Son of God , who rose from the dead in atonement for our sins and the sins of the whole world . ( Which , incidentally , I believe . ) I am discussing the God of the Hebrews ( or any other god for that matter ) . To believe the prophesies of which you speak , one must have faith . To believe that Jesus actually rose from the dead and ascended into heaven , one must have faith . There is no physical evidence that I am aware of to indicate that it did happen the way the Bible said it happened ... except for in writings of human beings allegedly inspired by God . It takes faith to believe that those human beings were inspired by God . It takes faith to believe that what they describe actually happened the way they describe it . What I can say with certainty that can not be disputed as far as I 'm aware , is that whatever happened ... happened . If a woman named Mary was impregnated by the Holy Spirit and conceived a child that she named Jesus who was crucified , died and buried , only to come back to life three days later and ascend into heaven after 40 days ... then that 's what happened . I believe that 's what happened , but there 's no physical evidence to prove that 's actually what happened . It takes faith to believe .""",DISAGREE,"""proof that Jesus existed and that he is God""","""If a woman named Mary was impregnated by the Holy Spirit and conceived a child that she named Jesus who was crucified , died and buried , only to come back to life three days later and ascend into heaven after 40 days ... then that 's what happened . I believe that 's what happened , but there 's no physical evidence to prove that 's actually what happened . It takes faith to believe .""",,
27334,7144,"""Bullrah ! Bullrah ! Bunk ! BS ! Batchips ! Cat crapola and bunches of stuff like that !""","""Well then quit trolling , and start debunking the BS by providing links to cases that were solved by having a gun registry in place .""",DISAGREE,"""Batchips ! Cat crapola and bunches of stuff like that""","""start debunking the BS by providing links to cases that were solved""",,
27342,7145,"""The Big bang theory predicts that no object in the universe can be older than the Big Bang . Yet the large-scale voids observed in the distortion of galaxies can not have been formed in the time since the Big Bang , without resulting in velocities of present-day galaxies far in excess of those observed . Given the observed velocities , these voids must have taken at least 70 billion years to form , five times as long as the theorized time since the Big Bang .""","""And the other website says they are working on `` over unity `` machines . You know , perpetual motion . http : //www.earthtech.org/about/index.html""",DISAGREE,"""five times as long as the theorized time""","""they are working on `` over unity `` machines . You know , perpetual motion .""",,
27361,7156,"""I ca n't recall the name of this particular fallacy , but if I were to name it it would be the `` If it were possible , someone would have done it already `` fallacy , the consistent application of which leads one to believe it is impossible for anything to happen for the first time .""","""No Peeling , it would be , `` We proved it was possible to evolve as humans have , so why can only we do it ? `` Why has n't one other creature on Earth ever evolved to our level of sophistication in the same alleged 4 billion years that we have had to attain our level of evolution ? If evo is real , then it seems only right that it should touch all species equally and that all species that were n't forced into extinction , but survived and overcame the pressures they faced should have ended up in a similar evolved place that man has attained in 4 billion years . Unless of course that the science of evolution is a humanistic justification to explain our origins but has no basis in fact what so ever . And that is my claim and belief .""",DISAGREE,"""ca n't recall the name of this particular fallacy""","""No Peeling , it would be""",,
27362,7156,"""I ca n't recall the name of this particular fallacy , but if I were to name it it would be the `` If it were possible , someone would have done it already `` fallacy , the consistent application of which leads one to believe it is impossible for anything to happen for the first time .""","""No Peeling , it would be , `` We proved it was possible to evolve as humans have , so why can only we do it ? `` Why has n't one other creature on Earth ever evolved to our level of sophistication in the same alleged 4 billion years that we have had to attain our level of evolution ? If evo is real , then it seems only right that it should touch all species equally and that all species that were n't forced into extinction , but survived and overcame the pressures they faced should have ended up in a similar evolved place that man has attained in 4 billion years . Unless of course that the science of evolution is a humanistic justification to explain our origins but has no basis in fact what so ever . And that is my claim and belief .""",DISAGREE,"""I ca n't recall the name of this particular fallacy , but if I were to name it it would be the `` If it were possible , someone would have done it already""","""Peeling , it would be , `` We proved it was possible to evolve as humans have""",,
27376,7160,"""Originally posted by Peach47 3 . Whether you happen to like someone or not , if they are pointing a gun in your face nad threatening your life , would n't you shoot them ?""","""Well , if they are already pointing a gun at me , I would n't have a chance to pull out a gun and shoot them . They would shoot me before I did that .""",DISAGREE,"""Whether you happen to like someone or not , if they are pointing a gun in your face nad threatening your life , would n't you shoot them ?""","""I would n't have a chance to pull out a gun and shoot them . They would shoot me before I did that .""",,
27389,7169,"""I do n't think DOMA is an abhorrent law . It 's real intent is to preserve the sovereignty of the individual states over an issue ...""","""No , not in the least . It 's real intent was to throw a bone to the people pretending to have `` family values `` . The religious right , the conservatives , that lot .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think DOMA is an abhorrent law . It 's real intent is to preserve the sovereignty of the individual states over an issue ...""","""No , not in the least .""",,
27384,7169,"""I do n't think DOMA is an abhorrent law . It 's real intent is to preserve the sovereignty of the individual states over an issue ...""","""No , not in the least . It 's real intent was to throw a bone to the people pretending to have `` family values `` . The religious right , the conservatives , that lot .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think DOMA is an abhorrent law""","""It 's real intent was to throw a bone to the people pretending to have `` family values""",,
27396,7171,"""Like it or not Fetus is the latin word for Baby . If we can prove a person was at a crime scene through DNA evidence . Then we can prove a person is in his or her Mother 's womb at the time of conception . That statement is pure scientific fact .""","""Really ? A human can be determined scientifically . Personhood is a human legal construct . You can not prove scientifically what a `` person `` is .""",DISAGREE,"""Like it or not Fetus is the latin word for Baby . we can prove a person is in his or her Mother 's womb at the time of conception .""","""A human can be determined scientifically . Personhood is a human legal construct .""",,
27397,7171,"""Like it or not Fetus is the latin word for Baby . If we can prove a person was at a crime scene through DNA evidence . Then we can prove a person is in his or her Mother 's womb at the time of conception . That statement is pure scientific fact .""","""Really ? A human can be determined scientifically . Personhood is a human legal construct . You can not prove scientifically what a `` person `` is .""",DISAGREE,"""Like it or not Fetus is the latin word for Baby . If we can prove a person was at a crime scene through DNA evidence""","""A human can be determined scientifically""",,
27398,7171,"""Like it or not Fetus is the latin word for Baby . If we can prove a person was at a crime scene through DNA evidence . Then we can prove a person is in his or her Mother 's womb at the time of conception . That statement is pure scientific fact .""","""Really ? A human can be determined scientifically . Personhood is a human legal construct . You can not prove scientifically what a `` person `` is .""",DISAGREE,"""we can prove a person is in his or her Mother 's womb at the time of conception .""","""Personhood is a human legal construct . You can not prove scientifically what a `` person `` is .""",,
27410,7173,"""And I just looked up Gentry because I 've never heard of him . I 'd say that if he is `` suppressed `` then its merely due to the fact that he has n't survived the peer review process . This is true for any number of people who have devised alternate theories to the BB . None of these guys has a beef with godless creation , they just think they have the right answer . There are people into the plasma universe , and the electric universe , or whatever , then there are people like Eugene Savov and his `` fireworks `` universe . These people are generally considered crackpots , but they are n't pushing creationism , they are just pushing theories weaker than the BB theory . But really , the BB theory has problems all over the place , most physicists will admit this .""","""He has been published . Not on the Big Bang -that is not going to happen in America .You are either getting your information from propogandist or making it up yourself . he was a fellow at Los Alamos and Oakridge for more than a decade . Only an XXXXX would consider him a crackpot he is a brilliant scientist . He is presently involved in a lawsuit for being excluded form a scientific forum for posting his objections to the Big Bang . To you everyone who is not an atheist is a crackpot . According to you 96 % of Americans are crackpots . Your comparing Gentry to fireworks man shows your bias , your inability to think for yourself or your total lack of integrity .""",DISAGREE,"""'d say that if he is `` suppressed `` then its merely due to the fact that he has n't survived the peer review process . This is true for any number of people who have devised alternate theories to the BB .""","""He has been published . Not on the Big Bang -that is not going to happen in America .You are either getting your information from propogandist or making it up yourself .""",,
27426,7176,"""By golly ! A day does n't go by in the great and wonderful United States of America that another shooting does n't occur , with a number of deaths and serious wounds . Is n't America wonderful ? That we get to carry around a whole bunch of guns and go out every day and kill and maim ? Wonderful work ! NRA ! Every time I see another story about another shooting in America , sometimes ever two or three shootouts and killings , it absolutely thrills me because I know that the NRA has armed even more Americans and more Americans can now go out and shoot and kill and maim . So , carry on , NRA ! I know you 're working on that wonderful time when every time a new baby is born in this country , right after a baby takes its first breath , a gun will be placed in his or her tiny hand .""","""Just curious , is it beyond you to make a post that includes common sense and logic ? I 'm thinking it is since all of you posts seem to be based on rhetoric and emotion . Three paragraphs and all of them contain a falsehood/ lie , congrats your batting 1.000 .""",DISAGREE,"""A day does n't go by in the great and wonderful United States of America that another shooting does n't occur , That we get to carry around a whole bunch of guns and go out every day and kill and maim ?""","""is it beyond you to make a post that includes common sense and logic ? Three paragraphs and all of them contain a falsehood/ lie""",,
27428,7176,"""By golly ! A day does n't go by in the great and wonderful United States of America that another shooting does n't occur , with a number of deaths and serious wounds . Is n't America wonderful ? That we get to carry around a whole bunch of guns and go out every day and kill and maim ? Wonderful work ! NRA ! Every time I see another story about another shooting in America , sometimes ever two or three shootouts and killings , it absolutely thrills me because I know that the NRA has armed even more Americans and more Americans can now go out and shoot and kill and maim . So , carry on , NRA ! I know you 're working on that wonderful time when every time a new baby is born in this country , right after a baby takes its first breath , a gun will be placed in his or her tiny hand .""","""Just curious , is it beyond you to make a post that includes common sense and logic ? I 'm thinking it is since all of you posts seem to be based on rhetoric and emotion . Three paragraphs and all of them contain a falsehood/ lie , congrats your batting 1.000 .""",DISAGREE,"""ever two or three shootouts and killings , it absolutely thrills me because I know that the NRA has armed even more Americans""","""Just curious , is it beyond you to make a post that includes common sense and logic""",,
27458,7182,"""I see you Americans deal as loosely with the French and Spanish languages , as you do with English ! Surely it is something like Viva Libertad , or Vive la Liberte , but Viva La Liberty ? ? ? ? ? Leo""","""Actually I do n't deal with spanish or french because I do n't have to . I speak english .""",DISAGREE,"""Surely it is something like Viva Libertad , or Vive la Liberte , but Viva La Liberty ? ? ? ? ? Leo""","""I do n't deal with spanish or french because I do n't have to . I speak english .""",,
27469,7185,"""Here it implies that almost all if not all creeping things on the earth have the breath of life . The breath of life is supposedly where Adam got his soul . So , if animals have it , then they must have souls . Oh , and btw , in the literal translation , here is Genesis 2:7 No mention of a soul here . Only that Adam was a living creature .""","""Yes , it does infer that doesn ’ t it , but as I said earlier you have to read it thoroughly in order to see that there is a physical and spiritual make-up to all human beings .""",DISAGREE,"""all creeping things on the earth have the breath of life""","""I said earlier you have to read it thoroughly in order to see that there is a physical and spiritual""",,
27479,7187,"""thanks for the comments sinjin . it is true that i had no time to read previous threads but i do think that other things said about my character is unjustified . it is just a thought and every plan is bound to have a flaw . i would be welcome to any views that will strengthen the idea posted or can destroy it completely .""","""Writing takes longer than reading .""",DISAGREE,"""it is true that i had no time to read previous threads but i do think that other things said about my character is unjustified .""","""Writing takes longer than reading .""",,
27500,7192,"""The Congress , whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary , shall propose Amendments to this Constitution , or , on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States , shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments , which , in either Case , shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes , as part of this Constitution .""","""So there you have it : AMENDMENTS ARE PART OF THE CONSTITUTION .""",AGREE,"""shall propose Amendments to this Constitution""","""AMENDMENTS ARE PART OF THE CONSTITUTION""",,
27532,7198,"""Nice link . It destroys NATO 's higher death rate `` argument `` , and proves my point . California = `` toughest gun laws `` = 9.8 gun deaths per 100,000 population . Florida = lax gun laws = 11.1 gun deaths per 100,000 population .""","""And right at the top of the list , at a whopping 31.2 per 100,000 , is Washington DC , even though they had a complete and total gun ban in place . How the hell do you explain that ? Nobody could own handguns , nobody could ever carry a gun , nobody could have a gun outside of their home , nobody could even load their private guns , so how do they get to be at the top of the list or death rates ?""",AGREE,"""gun deaths per 100,000 population""","""nobody could ever carry a gun , nobody could have a gun outside of their home""",,
27536,7199,"""In June 2007 , Nature magazine openly denied ( specifically in the name of evolution ) that humans are created in the image of God , which simply points to what evolutionist James Rachels told everybody 17 years earlier , that Darwinian evolution makes the image-of-God claim AND its derivative claim of inherent human dignity , unsustainable and therefore Out-The-Window .""","""Do you have a quote ? a link ? anything to make us think that you 're not spinning this like you tend to spin everything else ? Here 's something you did n't think through : you say that `` inherent `` human dignity is a derivative of the image-of-God claim . First , that makes it most certainly not inherent but derived . Second , you insult the entire human race when you claim that human dignity is dependent upon anything else . I 'm sorry that you think so little of humans .""",DISAGREE,"""humans are created in the image of God ,""","""human dignity is a derivative of the image-of-God claim""",,
27552,7202,"""Do sufficient science and history in its total amount to enough evidence to conclusively disprove the existence of God ?""","""I think perhaps you 're confused . 1 . I know of no meaningful definion of the term `` god ' as it pertains to reality . 2 . When you mention science and history , that implies you are interested in reality . 3 . There is no evidence to support mythological deities , god or God or Odin or the easter bunny . * So , yes THERE IS NO EVIDENCE of the existence of any mytholgoical gods . * * Yes , there is no evidence that the universe was created , or if that statement even has meaning if the universe always was , and always will be . p.s . There is easter bunny . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""Do sufficient science and history in its total amount to enough evidence to conclusively""","""There is no evidence to support mythological deities , god or God""",,
27549,7202,"""Do sufficient science and history in its total amount to enough evidence to conclusively disprove the existence of God ?""","""I think perhaps you 're confused . 1 . I know of no meaningful definion of the term `` god ' as it pertains to reality . 2 . When you mention science and history , that implies you are interested in reality . 3 . There is no evidence to support mythological deities , god or God or Odin or the easter bunny . * So , yes THERE IS NO EVIDENCE of the existence of any mytholgoical gods . * * Yes , there is no evidence that the universe was created , or if that statement even has meaning if the universe always was , and always will be . p.s . There is easter bunny . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""Do sufficient science and history in its total amount to enough evidence to conclusively disprove the existence of God ?""","""I think perhaps you 're confused . 1 . I know of no meaningful definion of the term `` god ' as it pertains to reality .""",,
27581,7208,"""You prove my point exactly . Just because 99 % of scientists believe in evolution , why should I ?""","""Because it 's a blatantly obvious fact of nature and intellectually honest experts in the field accept it .""",DISAGREE,"""Just because 99 % of scientists believe in evolution , why should I ?""","""Because it 's a blatantly obvious fact of nature""",,
27598,7211,"""If you really care about millions of people being murdered , why have you done nothing about it ? Because you do n't .""","""Well , i vote , that seems to be working enough seeing that 2 pro-life judges have been appointed within 1 year . interesting , im takin a cheesecake break ..""",DISAGREE,"""If you really care about millions of people being murdered ,""","""Well , i vote , that seems to be working enough seeing that 2 pro-life judges have been appointed within 1""",,
27616,7215,"""Your hypothetical is just that - hypothetical . In reality , a militia would stand small chance against military might .""","""And how would Bush look if his own people hated him so much that they revolted ? That would be very bad publicity , and quite an embarrassment that I would n't want as a country leader .""",DISAGREE,"""Your hypothetical is just that - hypothetical""","""And how would Bush look if his own people hated him so much that they revolted ?""",,
27625,7217,"""Felony arrest , severe mental illness or disturbance ( like the kind that gets you off of felony murder charges because you were found not competent to stand trial , or not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect ) , drug addiction , or treasonous action against the country ( not the current government , but the country itself ) .""","""If Obama had his way , standing against the government would be the most patriotic thing someone could do .""",DISAGREE,"""felony murder charges because you were found not competent to stand trial , or not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect ) , drug addiction , or treasonous action against the country""","""If Obama had his way , standing against the government would be the most patriotic thing someone could do .""",,
27632,7219,"""So it 's just a coincidence that nations that ban guns like England have much lower levels of gun violence and murder than the US ? That 's kind of hard to believe . NYC was so effective in reducing crime that the mayor of NYC was invited to Mexico City to help them reduce crime there . So I do n't think the possibility that gun control has been effective in cities like NYC can be ruled out . You may be confusing cause and effect . You would n't walk into a hospital and declare that because there are a lot of sick people in a hospital that hospitals do n't help people get better .""","""So the fact that there are fewer crimes in britain is evidence , but the fact that there is a great deal more crime in S Africa , despite having some of the strictest gun control laws in the world , is not ? In new york , the reduction in crime was the result of an overhaul of police and the criminal justice system . Couple pages on that : http : //www.city-journal.org/html/15_1_ny_crime.html http : //www.ny.gov/governor/patrecord/crime.html New York started instituting prohibitive firearms laws in the 60s . Most of the firearms laws they `` enjoy `` now were put in place in the 70s ( except for a brief round of idiocy in the 90 's having to do with semi-auto rifles .... `` assault weapons `` , which they banned despite the fact that the police commissioner of NY City testified that they had no record of one ever being used in a crime ) . So , they had prohibitive gun control for 30+ years , and then when they spent billions on theri criminal justice system and police , none of which had anything to do with gun control , their crime rate started to fall , and somehow you want us to believe that this was due to the gun control ? Nobody here is that gullible .""",DISAGREE,"""You would n't walk into a hospital and declare that because there are a lot of sick people in a hospital that hospitals do n't help people get""","""So the fact that there are fewer crimes in britain is evidence , but the fact that there is a great deal more crime in S Africa , despite having some of the strictest gun control laws in the world , is not ? In new york , the reduction in crime was the result of an overhaul of police and the criminal justice system""",,
27644,7223,"""Or perhaps you meant things like inheritance rights , SS survivors benefits , hospital visitation , immigration status , adoption , housing , employment , etc. , etc. , etc ............................................... ............. I guess those are all `` straight things `` too ?""","""No , everyone should have those regardless of marriage . You 're the one here who seems to think straight and gay marriage should be a litmus test for those things .""",DISAGREE,"""Or perhaps you meant things like inheritance rights , SS survivors benefits , hospital visitation""","""No , everyone should have those regardless of marriage .""",,
27652,7225,"""It is so easy , so simple , so evident is not it ?""","""Actually , it is n't . It is complex and complicated . It requires diligent study of difficult concepts . But when you grasp the basics , it does become evident . But most creationists are n't willing to put in the effort .""",DISAGREE,"""It is so easy , so simple , so evident""","""Actually , it is n't . It is complex and complicated""",,
27660,7226,"""Maybe if there was a gun culture in the UK the police would have been more used to dealing with gun rampages . Maybe if everyone in the UK owned a gun then someone would have shot this man before he killed so many people . I dont know but I do know that the solution to stopping this happening again does not lie in making guns easier to get ! The USA can have as many guns as it wants but to allow Brits to obtain guns as easy as they can it the States would be madness .""","""Alarm at routine patrols by armed police - Crime , UK - The Independent""",DISAGREE,"""if there was a gun culture in the UK the police would have been more used to dealing with gun rampages""","""Alarm at routine patrols by armed police""",,
27661,7226,"""Maybe if there was a gun culture in the UK the police would have been more used to dealing with gun rampages . Maybe if everyone in the UK owned a gun then someone would have shot this man before he killed so many people . I dont know but I do know that the solution to stopping this happening again does not lie in making guns easier to get ! The USA can have as many guns as it wants but to allow Brits to obtain guns as easy as they can it the States would be madness .""","""Alarm at routine patrols by armed police - Crime , UK - The Independent""",DISAGREE,"""Maybe if everyone in the UK owned a gun then someone would have shot this man before he killed so many people .""","""Alarm at routine patrols by armed police""",,
27665,7227,"""Pro-choice . I think abortion is awful and I would like to see it reduced to the bare minimum .""","""Hi jitobear . I am also pro-choice . This comment jumped out at me , though . Do you think it 's seen as awful do to cultural conditioning ? Could this have it wrong ? There is no scientific basis that it 's a human person , at the stage of development when the vast majority of abortions occur . I worry that by suggesting it 's so negative , it ca n't help but be a stigma on the woman who chooses to abort her pregnancy . No woman should feel the need to apologize in relation to abortion , which is just about control over one 's own body .""",DISAGREE,"""I think abortion is awful and I would like to see it reduced""","""I am also pro-choice .""",,
27709,7237,"""Of course , no one expects that you would have made any effort to actually educate yourself before you accepted creationist dogma from someone else who is as ignorant as you . There have been several continuing experiments with anole lizards in the Caribbean . I 'll leave it to you to search the peer reviewed literature for the several papers on the topic . I 'm sure that it wo n't be a problem for you , given your constant quest for knowledge .""","""It 's worse than that , Pandion . For example , here 's what I told him over at ARN on the same subject back on April 5th . http : //www.arn.org/ubbthreads/showfl ... e # Post30331420""",AGREE,"""no one expects that you would have made any effort to actually educate yourself""","""It 's worse than that ,""",,
27718,7240,"""Two of the things I mentioned ( better locks and security systems ) have an effect at preventing home invasion . Having a gun does nothing to prevent the crime , it only serves to stop it once it has begun .""","""And once it has begun , which would you rather have ?""",DISAGREE,"""Having a gun does nothing to prevent the crime , it only serves to stop it once it has begun .""","""And once it has begun , which would you rather have ?""",,
27722,7240,"""Two of the things I mentioned ( better locks and security systems ) have an effect at preventing home invasion . Having a gun does nothing to prevent the crime , it only serves to stop it once it has begun .""","""And once it has begun , which would you rather have ?""",DISAGREE,"""I mentioned ( better locks and security systems ) have an effect at preventing home invasion .""","""once it has begun , which would you rather have ?""",,
27724,7241,"""I suppose the correct terminology would be that G. fortis evolved a smaller beak due to competition from a larger billed recent imigrant . I suppose that we just are n't subjected to the same word selection pressures this side of the Atlantic .""","""Well , I did say I was being nit-picky : all I was objecting to was the way the original wording suggested that the change was occurring in order to avoid competition . Assuming it was due to selection , the competition from the larger birds was the putative agent of that selection . ( Incidentally , I suspect we live on the same side of the Atlantic . )""",DISAGREE,"""I suppose the correct terminology would be that G. fortis evolved a smaller beak due to competition from a larger billed recent imigrant .""","""I was objecting to was the way the original wording suggested that the change was occurring in order to avoid competition .""",,
27730,7242,"""It 's called an analogy . The article claimed that the relationship between homosexuals and discrimination and between gun owners and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` Thus , I extended this analogy so that the relationship between gun owners and discrimination and between serial racists and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` The analogy that I made was not comparing gun owners to serial rapists , but rather , it was comparing the relationship of the two groups with discrimination .""","""So will you be comparing gays to child molesters and priests in your same examples ? Or blacks with slinging drugs and hoochie mammas ? Or will you note the eerie similarities betweenn the wording of some of our gun laws to the Nazi gun laws ?""",DISAGREE,"""The analogy that I made was not comparing gun owners to serial rapists , but rather , it was comparing the relationship of the two groups with discrimination .""","""So will you be comparing gays to child molesters and priests in your same examples ? Or blacks with slinging drugs and hoochie mammas ?""",,
27731,7242,"""It 's called an analogy . The article claimed that the relationship between homosexuals and discrimination and between gun owners and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` Thus , I extended this analogy so that the relationship between gun owners and discrimination and between serial racists and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` The analogy that I made was not comparing gun owners to serial rapists , but rather , it was comparing the relationship of the two groups with discrimination .""","""So will you be comparing gays to child molesters and priests in your same examples ? Or blacks with slinging drugs and hoochie mammas ? Or will you note the eerie similarities betweenn the wording of some of our gun laws to the Nazi gun laws ?""",DISAGREE,"""I extended this analogy so that the relationship between gun owners and discrimination and between serial racists and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. ``""","""So will you be comparing gays to child molesters and priests in your same examples ?""",,
27741,7244,"""Rocks tell the truth to those who interrogate them throughly and with an open mind . To others the rocks say whatever their interrogator chooses them to do .""","""And you say I 'm crazy ? ! This guy interrogates rocks !""",DISAGREE,"""Rocks tell the truth to those who interrogate them throughly and with an open mind .""","""And you say I 'm crazy ? !""",,
27749,7246,"""I also find it hard to believe some of what gets posted in favor of the slippery slope argument- such as claims that Sarah Brady wants all guns to be banned which are contradicted by quotes by her in credible online sources""","""First of all , when gun owners say ban guns , it means , if you want to ban ANY Gun , you are a gun banner ! You guys want to muck up the argument with we do n't want to ban all guns , just some guns ! However , that statement is just for now ! If you get the ban more will be following ! Nelson T. 'Pete ' Shields -- Founder of Handgun Control , Inc .""",DISAGREE,"""claims that Sarah Brady wants all guns to be banned which are contradicted by quotes""","""if you want to ban ANY Gun , you are a gun banner !""",,
27753,7247,"""This post definately is n't up to your typical standards Greg . That 's some pretty poor logic . Waxy""","""Well your right , Waxy There is no real `` logic `` to my post , because if one thinks about the art of debating religion , the concept of logic goes out the window . A true believer has only the bible to support their beliefs , they can not go to a lab or science room and prove their beliefs on a table , or use cobalt to date religous belief , so their belief is all based on unseen faith . I have only a high school education , therefore I do not have the vocabulary the master debators use on here , nor the artistic way of putting together sentences . So bear with me please , while I try to explain my post a little better .... Since you put me in the spotlight here , I will use you , with great respect to you of course , as my point of debate . You have went on record here stating many times , that you do not believe in a `` god `` the way we believers do . Now with that notion in mind , why do you and others hang out debating on a religous forum ? ? In case you havent noticed , the posts against the notion of God and Christianity , greatly outnumber the posts of the believers . Is that not a interesting fact when you think about it ? I dont believe in a lot of things that I am exposed to in my walk though life here on earth , so I have NO interest in trying to prove those things wrong , THAT I feel have no validity . Clear as mud now , ? ?""",AGREE,"""This post definately is n't up to your typical standards""","""bear with me please , while I try to explain my post a little better Clear as mud now , ? ?""",,
27763,7249,"""I will not put up with people that scroll down to the end read the closing comments by the author and then proceed to argue .""","""( I 'm just curious what you mean by you 'will not put up with [ it ] ' ? You may have to put up with it , as there may be some people who choose to do that , and you have no control to stop them . Just as a suggestion , you may get further by asking respectfully that people not comment unless they have read the entire article . My two cents . ) In this particular article , Mr. Alcorn does not back up any of his assertions with evidence . Some of what he states in this article is common knowledge that needs no documentation ( i.e . a human fetus is human and it is alive ) . But in this article , he states many generalities , he states many opinions ( to which there are alternate views ) , and he backs nothing up . I 'm not saying that the facts he presents can not be backed up , but until they are backed up with solid documentation , there are a lot of holes in what he is saying . For example : `` 2f . There is substantial scientific reason to believe frozen embryos are persons , and should be granted the same rights as older , larger and less vulnerable persons. `` Substantial scientific reason ? ? ? Like what ? A 'person ' is not a scientific concept . Science does not identify the definitions of what can or can not be labeled a 'person . ' That is a legal and/or philisophical topic . '' 3g . Even before the unborn is obviously human in appearance , she is what she is-a human being. `` Here again , a human being is not a scientific term . '' 3e . Every abortion stops a beating heart and terminates measurable brain waves. `` This is not necessarily true . Mr. Alcorn also asserts that the birth control pill causes abortions prior to implantation of the blastocyst in the uterine lining . There is no beating heart or measurable brain activity at this stage of biological development . Both of his assertions , as stated , can not be correct . If one statement is true , then the other must logically be false . '' 5d . It is a scientific fact that there are thought processes at work in unborn babies. `` Where 's the evidence ? Define 'thought processes . ' It may be a fact ... that leaves open the possibility that it may not be true . '' 5h . Arguments against the personhood of the unborn are shrouded in rationalization and denial. `` This is his opinion ... to which he is entitled . '' 9a . Once we grant that the unborn are human beings , it should settle the question of their right to live. `` True . But we have not yet granted that unborn are 'human beings . ' '' 13b . The poor choice of premarital sex is never compensated for by the far worse choice of killing an innocent human being. `` Again . This is merely Mr. Alcorn 's opinion -- both that premarital sex is a 'poor choice ' and the remainder of the statement . '' 14a . Early feminists were prolife , not prochoice. `` Define 'early . ' Are we talking back to the days of Eve ? I do n't believe Margaret Sanger was prolife . '' 14d . The basic premises of the abortion-rights movement are demeaning to women. `` Unsupported opinion . '' 17a . Every child is wanted by someone-there is no such thing as an unwanted child. `` How many children are on the street in this great country ? How many children are waiting to be adopted ? It may be true that all children are wanted by someone , but it is also true that there are many , many children without a home and without a family ... who are being bounced around from foster home to foster home , not finding anyone who 'wants ' them . This is fact . A dear friend of mine is a child protection social worker in a metropolitan area . She deals with this every day . '' 18c . If children are viewed as expendable before birth , they will be viewed as expendable after birth. `` Not sure if I follow this one ... if someone wants a child in the womb , they are not viewed as expendable before birth ... if someone does n't want a child in the womb and it is aborted , there wo n't be anything to be expendable after birth . '' 20b . The dramatic decline in our birth rate will have a disturbing economic effect on America. `` Ummm ... this may be true . It may not be true . Fact is ... we do n't know . We can only make educated guesses . I could go on ... but I think my point has been made . One final one , though ... I had to giggle when I read this one : `` Abortion has made us a nation of schizophrenics about our children. `` It seems that you are fervent in your beliefs that abortion is 'wrong . ' I respect you for knowing what you believe and for standing up for it . Understand , though , that there are individuals who may disagree with you . To imply that they are 'wrong ' and you are 'right ' or they are ignorant or stupid or anything of the sort is a rather self-centered view of the world . In this mindset , it is possible that you are looking at everything from the 'wrong ' perspective . Maybe the other person is actually 'right ' and you are the ignorant one . ( Note : I 'm not suggesting that you are calling anyone stupid or ignorant ... nor am I suggesting you are stupid or ignorant . I 'm just making a point . ) I challenge you to develop a logical argument -- based on facts with supporting evidence , and not based on opinions or 'moral ideals ' -- that is so convincing that even the most 'pro-choice ' person in the world could see ( if they are being honest with themselves and the world ) that abortion is 'wrong . '""",DISAGREE,"""I will not put up with people that scroll down to the end read the closing comments by the author and then proceed to argue .""","""You may have to put up with it , as there may be some people who choose to do that""",,
27774,7252,"""I do not believe abortion is generally about convenience because preganancy is more than mere inconvenience . Even if she does not have to raise the child , it does not mean she is emotionally , mentally , physically , or economically able to support a pregnancy . I have frequently suggested finding ways of bringing abortion down by addressing these issues - but according the lifers around here these problems do n't exist and all that needs to be done is taking punitive measures against women . But then - when they take that stance they really do lose all credibility . At least for me . Would n't leave my kid alone with someone who loves like that .""","""No one , I repeat no one wants to take punitive actions against any woman unless you call carrying the baby to term punitive action ......... All we want is for the baby in the womb to have the same chance you did if possible ...........""",DISAGREE,"""abortion preganancy is more than mere inconvenience""","""punitive actions against any woman carrying the baby to term""",,
27784,7254,"""Please try to maintain your rhetoric in the Debate Challenge section to a higher degree than what we normally experience in our regular forums . Some of the terms being used are at worst poisoning the well , and at the least are making me wince .""","""Well excuuuuse me if I screwed that up in this post . Have a nice day .""",DISAGREE,"""Please try to maintain your rhetoric""","""Well excuuuuse me if I screwed that up in this post .""",,
27787,7255,"""Oh ? Do tell , what awful things have happened to Baghdad by the Bay ?""","""I think a better comparison is Sodom ..........""",DISAGREE,"""Oh ? Do tell , what awful things have happened to Baghdad by the Bay ?""","""I think a better comparison is Sodom ..........""",,
27821,7269,"""Hey , I wonder what they would need to see in order to be convinced of design . I think most scientists would admit the universe looks designed , so what would convince them that it actually is ?""","""You are making up your own strawman arguments as you go along . Asking `` what they would need `` is a poor mask to avoid the fact that YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE in the first place . A lot of `` does n't this look like ... `` , but that 's akin to interpreting Rorschach tests . You see what you want to .""",DISAGREE,"""I think most scientists would admit the universe looks designed , so what would convince them that it actually is ?""","""You are making up your own strawman arguments as you go along""",,
27822,7270,"""5 . ) Do n't think so . 6 . ) The only thing classical ad-naeseum is your own preconceived idea's of creationism and creationist . You do n't want to debate the issues like normal civil people , you just want try to make fools of creationists . Usually you 're the one who start 's the insulting . Your hatred is obivious and you 're open to nothing . Just good 'ol boys patting each other on the back . I know this probably does n't apply to everyone , there are some good guys out there .""","""Anyway Duo_Maxwell this is n't only creationist debaters , there are many more who do the same thing with different debates . you also forgot 7 . Make random accusations of logical fallacies when they have no idea what they even mean . Example : You said that my spelling is wrong , that 's the biggest strawman I 've ever heard 8 . Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question . Example : `` What do you thinkk of carbon dating ? `` '' you spelled think wrong `` . If you want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well .""",DISAGREE,"""The only thing classical ad-naeseum is your own preconceived of creationism and creationist . You do n't want to debate the issues like normal civil people 's""","""Make random accusations of logical fallacies when they have no idea what they even mean .""",,
27823,7270,"""5 . ) Do n't think so . 6 . ) The only thing classical ad-naeseum is your own preconceived idea's of creationism and creationist . You do n't want to debate the issues like normal civil people , you just want try to make fools of creationists . Usually you 're the one who start 's the insulting . Your hatred is obivious and you 're open to nothing . Just good 'ol boys patting each other on the back . I know this probably does n't apply to everyone , there are some good guys out there .""","""Anyway Duo_Maxwell this is n't only creationist debaters , there are many more who do the same thing with different debates . you also forgot 7 . Make random accusations of logical fallacies when they have no idea what they even mean . Example : You said that my spelling is wrong , that 's the biggest strawman I 've ever heard 8 . Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question . Example : `` What do you thinkk of carbon dating ? `` '' you spelled think wrong `` . If you want to correct spelling , fine but answer the question as well .""",DISAGREE,"""You do n't want to debate the issues like normal civil people , you just want try to make fools of creationists""","""Make random accusations of logical fallacies when they have no idea what they even mean""",,
27830,7272,"""Most of the evo crowd has probably seen this already , but this is pretty funny : http : //scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/03/expelled.php PZ Meyers was ordered to leave the premises by police on threat of arrest , by order of the producer . Prety funny . The funniest part is his guest was allowed to enter with no problems . His guest ? Richard Dawkins .""","""What 's great is that somebody had to have been on the lookout for PZ out of fear of his getting in . What 's greater is that they opened themselves to ridicule : he 's a good source when his statements can be edited and removed from context , but FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO N'T LET HIM SEE THE MOVIE !""",DISAGREE,"""the . part is his guest allowed to enter with no""","""they opened themselves to ridicule""",,
27834,7273,"""well heck , if lifeforms can not realistically be strung together by small , gradual , materialist increments ( which they ca n't and there is no evidence for ) then the only alternative is special creation .""","""So much for your cover . Its blown . You just made another gaps argument making the assumption that if theory X does not explain observation Y that a theory which is untested and untestable MUST be the only alternative explanation . Balderdash and shame on you . The alternative theories would likely be numerous and the ONLY one is not something untested and untestable . But I forgive you GOD probably made you make the error for his own mysterious reasons . Or else your statement is evil and was forced upon you by the devil . Maybe you will never know - in this life at least""",DISAGREE,"""if lifeforms can not realistically be strung together by small , gradual , materialist increments""","""But I forgive you GOD probably made you make the error for his own mysterious reasons""",,
27841,7295,"""Except that that would be the author 's words , not a direct quote . Notice the absence of quotation marks ? Special Agent Newell never said `` 17 % came from the US `` . The author has as much trouble with the stats as you . 17 % of the total have been traced to the US . We do n't know the percentage of the total that did indeed come from the US but is untraced or untraceable . See the difference ?""","""I see that river runs wide and deep on the left bank , de Nile .""",DISAGREE,"""would be the author 's words , not a direct The author""","""I see that river runs wide and deep on the left bank""",,
27844,7296,"""After something happens , it 's easy to go back and take a look and analyze what could have been done in order to prevent it beforehand . That does n't do much good after the crime has already been committed . Most people do n't purchase guns and sit up late at night hoping a prowler comes along so they can blow them away . The gun is there so , if your other measures fail for any reason , you are not defenseless in a face to face confrontation . Heck , there are plenty of cases where criminals are scared off once they realize somebody is home and armed .""","""And there are plenty of cases where criminals are scared off by much less than a gun .""",DISAGREE,"""The gun is there so , if your other measures fail for any reason , you are not defenseless in a face to face confrontation""","""And there are plenty of cases where criminals are scared off by much less than a gun .""",,
27851,7297,"""Maybe they just drink too much coffee . And you probably work with more `` reefer heads `` than you think .""","""Well , I do n't work with any `` reefer heads `` or pot smokers now ... this was awhile back .""",DISAGREE,"""you probably work with more `` reefer heads `` than you think .""","""I do n't work with any `` reefer heads `` or pot smokers now .""",,
27861,7298,"""`` This case is about free inquiry in education , not about a religious agenda , `` said Patrick Gillen of the Thomas More Law Center in his opening statement . The center , based in Ann Arbor , Michigan , lobbies for what it sees as the religious freedom of Christians and is defending the school district .""","""So , this statement is from a 'law center ' that is dedicated to defend the religious freedom for CHristians . Yet , this is n't about 'religion ' . Why do I find that hypocritical .""",DISAGREE,"""This case is about free inquiry in education , not about a religious agenda ,""","""Yet , this is n't about 'religion . Why do I find that hypocritical""",,
27867,7299,"""It 's nice to think that you 'll 'plan ' a child later but , life seldom works that way . I 'd hate to think that once you 're finally ready to have a child , your uterus has been scarred to infertility or have sever complications in conception , carrying the child to term or delivery . I 'd be ironic for another yuppy type who ca n't have children on their own due to an abortion to have to incure greater medical costs to have one or legal costs to adopt ... and maybe even seeking a foreign child as there are n't any easily to be had here ... since they were all aborted . Also , the older you get , the more health issues possible for the child .""","""I 'll have you know that the abortion went without a hitch , and my uterus is perfectly healthy , thankyouverymuch ( not that it is any of your business ) , and yes , I do plan to have a child in the future , and do n't really care what you think about it .""",DISAGREE,"""nice to think child later ready to have a child""","""the abortion went without a hitch I do plan to have a child""",,
27869,7300,"""* There is abundant evidence that many of the rock strata were laid down quickly , one after the other , without significant time breaks between them . For example , preservation of ripple marks requires rapid burial , as in the Flood ( e.g . lower Triassic rock , England ) . Folding of sedimentary rock without cracking or heating , such as at Eastern Beach , Auckland , New Zealand , suggests the folding occurred before the sand and mud had time to turn into stone , consistent with rapid deposition during the Flood .""","""This is simply false . Rock can be folded under pressure . This has been proven by lab experiment . However there are many features in sedimentary rocks that can not be formed quickly , for example , fossil trackways .""",DISAGREE,"""Folding of sedimentary rock without cracking or heating , such as at Eastern Beach , Auckland , New Zealand , suggests the folding occurred before the sand and mud had time to turn into stone , consistent with rapid deposition during the Flood .""","""there are many features in sedimentary rocks that can not be formed quickly , for example , fossil trackways .""",,
27872,7300,"""* There is abundant evidence that many of the rock strata were laid down quickly , one after the other , without significant time breaks between them . For example , preservation of ripple marks requires rapid burial , as in the Flood ( e.g . lower Triassic rock , England ) . Folding of sedimentary rock without cracking or heating , such as at Eastern Beach , Auckland , New Zealand , suggests the folding occurred before the sand and mud had time to turn into stone , consistent with rapid deposition during the Flood .""","""This is simply false . Rock can be folded under pressure . This has been proven by lab experiment . However there are many features in sedimentary rocks that can not be formed quickly , for example , fossil trackways .""",DISAGREE,"""There is abundant evidence that many of the rock strata were laid down quickly , . preservation of ripple marks requires rapid burial , as in the Flood""","""This is simply false . many features in sedimentary rocks that can not be formed quickly ,""",,
27892,7305,""" ‘ There are no beneficial mutations. ’ This is not true , since some changes do confer an advantage in some situations . Rather , we should say ,  ‘ We have yet to find a mutation that increases genetic information , even in those rare instances where the mutation confers an advantage. ’ For examples of information loss being advantageous , see Beetle Bloopers : defects can be an advantage sometimes , New eyes for blind cave fish ? and Is antibiotic resistance really due to increase in information ?""","""They say : do n't say this incorrect statement , say this other one instead ! Wow , the `` information `` thing will never cease to kill me .""",DISAGREE,""" ‘ There are no beneficial mutations. ’ This is not true , and Is antibiotic resistance really due to increase in information ?""","""do n't say this incorrect statement , say this other one instead ! Wow , the `` information `` thing will never cease to kill me""",,
27893,7305,""" ‘ There are no beneficial mutations. ’ This is not true , since some changes do confer an advantage in some situations . Rather , we should say ,  ‘ We have yet to find a mutation that increases genetic information , even in those rare instances where the mutation confers an advantage. ’ For examples of information loss being advantageous , see Beetle Bloopers : defects can be an advantage sometimes , New eyes for blind cave fish ? and Is antibiotic resistance really due to increase in information ?""","""They say : do n't say this incorrect statement , say this other one instead ! Wow , the `` information `` thing will never cease to kill me .""",DISAGREE,"""information loss being advantageous""","""information thing will never cease to kill me""",,
27899,7306,"""Bus driver Terrance Gavan manufactured highly dangerous firearms and explosives at the home where he lived with his mother in Batley , West Yorkshire . Police discovered 54 improvised bombs including nail bombs and a booby-trapped cigarette packet , as well as 12 firearms .""","""And last years stats say , 3rd July 2009 The most violent country in Europe : Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S .""",AGREE,"""highly dangerous firearms and explosives at the home""","""The most violent country in Europe""",,
27906,7308,"""City Hall & # 8211 ; Speaker Christine C Quinn , together with Council Member Al Vann , today announced legislation that would increase penalties for selling a toy gun by 500 percent . The legislation would also enhance the Department of Consumer Affairs & # 8217 ; enforcement ability and allow the agency to shut stores that are repeat offenders of the law . Department of Consumer Affairs ( DCA ) Commissioner Jonathan Mintz and Criminal Justice Coordinator John Feinblatt joined the Speaker and Council Members at the announcement . The officials also announced a new citywide public awareness campaign about the dangers of toy guns that look real and real guns that look like toys . & # 8220 ; Despite the fact that New York City & # 8217 ; s toy and imitation gun law has been in existence for several years many merchants continue to sell items that resemble real guns , & # 8221 ; said Council Speaker Quinn . & # 8220 ; Our communities are at risk when they can not tell a fake toy gun from a real one and the dangers these items present are all too real . Children have been hurt and even killed as a result of these guns being out in our communities. & # 8221 ; The City Council & # 8217 ; s Consumer Affairs Committee will hold a hearing on the legislation this afternoon . The proposed bill would increase the fine for a first violation from $ 1,000 to up to $ 5,000 . It would also increase the fines for subsequent violations within a two year period from $ 3,000 to up to $ 8,000 . Finally , it would also permit DCA to seal , for up to five days , the premises of a store found guilty of three or more violations within a two year period . Current law imposes a fine of up to $ 1,000 but does not increase that amount for subsequent violations . Since 2002 , DCA has removed more than 7,200 imitation guns from the shelves of nearly 240 stores throughout the city and levied $ 2.4 million in fines . Today , the City also announced a new subway advertising campaign , to be displayed in 2,100 subway cars , all 468 subway stations and more than 5,400 buses . The campaign warns New Yorkers of the dangers of realistic-looking toy guns and the dangers of real guns that are painted to look like toys . The campaign & # 8217 ; s advertisements demonstrate potential confusion about gun coloration and warn people that it is illegal either to make a fake gun look real or make a real gun look like a toy . New Yorkers are encouraged to call 311 about either problem . Calls to 311 that concern real guns that look fake will be forwarded to the Police Department & # 8217 ; s Gun Stop hotline . Callers can receive a $ 1,000 reward for information that leads to a conviction and can remain anonymous . The City has received a grant from the New York State Division of Criminal Justice Services to support the ad campaign . & # 8220 ; Gun violence is plaguing the Bedford-Stuyvesant and Crown Heights neighborhoods that I represent , as well as communities across the city and country , & # 8221 ; said Council Member Al Vann , prime sponsor of the bill . & # 8220 ; When I introduced this legislation , my intentions were also to stem the glorification of guns within our communities , and push the businesses that we patronize to be responsible members of our neighborhoods . I will continue working to address gun violence and its underlying issues . In light of the senseless shooting that occurred in my district Sunday night , it is apparent that we must work more diligently to stem the violence that is afflicting our neighborhoods. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; There is little debate that realistic-looking toy guns pose a serious threat to the safety and welfare of police officers and New Yorkers as a whole , & # 8221 ; stated Deputy Majority Leader Leroy Comrie . & # 8220 ; Sadly , violence resulting from toy guns has happened too many times in this city . This bill is a common sense solution to a very serious threat to our safety. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; Toy guns that look real and real guns that look like toys threaten the safety of our dedicated police officers and our children , especially during this holiday season , & # 8221 ; said Criminal Justice Coordinator John Feinblatt . & # 8220 ; This public awareness campaign will help to educate the public about the dangers posed by these guns. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; Imitation firearms that look real are not party items to be wrapped up and given as gifts during the holiday season , and they & # 8217 ; re certainly not toys , & # 8221 ; said Consumer Affairs Commissioner Jonathan Mintz . & # 8220 ; DCA appreciates the Council & # 8217 ; s strong and unequivocal message to the City & # 8217 ; s retailers who must do right by their customers and their communities by keeping these dangerous items off their shelves forever. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; With the holiday season in full swing , it is particularly important to bring attention to the fact that toy guns can cause accidents resulting in serious injury or death , & # 8221 ; said Council Member Maria del Carmen Arroyo , Co-Chair of the Black , Latino and Asian Caucus . & # 8220 ; Time and time again our communities are at risk and at serious danger when someone carries what is perceived to be a fake gun . I want to thank the Speaker and the Administration for strengthening the penalties in hopes that repeat offenders cease to sell improper toy guns. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; Last month an there was an unfortunate incident in my district where a young teen was shot by police because they mistook his toy gun for a fake one , & # 8221 ; said Council Member Larry Seabrook . & # 8220 ; We need to hold these toy gun sellers accountable for selling such a heinous product . Our children & # 8217 ; s lives are at stake . It is my hope that these penalties will finally deter stores from selling these toys . Our communities need to work together . I ask when they see someone selling bad toy guns or when they see someone concealing a real gun for a fake one to call 311. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; This legislation will help prevent further violence by deterring businesses from selling toy guns that look real , & # 8221 ; said Council Member Melissa Mark-Viverito . & # 8220 ; The increased regulations created by this bill will not only prevent toy guns from being used to commit crimes , but also will avert children from being wounded or killed by confused police officers who mistake their toy for a real gun. & # 8221 ; & # 8220 ; Harlem Mothers S.A.V.E . fully supports the action to increase penalties for store owners who are repeat offenders of the law and we agree that the city should have the authority to shut down such establishments and prevent their further endangering lives of our children and safety of community , said Jackie Rowe Adams , Co-founder . Under New York City & # 8217 ; s Public Safety Law , it is against the law to sell or offer to sell any toy or imitation firearm that can reasonably be perceived to be an actual firearm unless the exterior surface of the toy or imitation firearm is predominantly brightly colored . The range of acceptable colors includes white , bright red , bright orange , bright yellow , bright green , bright blue , bright pink or bright purple .""","""The desperate flailings of a city with absolutely no common sense . They 're so impotent in their abilities to get tough on criminals , they feel it necessary to go after the most unrelated sources to try and make themselves look big and busy . Why not just build a big wall to cut itself off from the rest of the world , and set up high security check points so cars coming and going can be checked to ensure no contraband is being smuggled in .""",DISAGREE,"""existence for several years many merchants continue to sell items that resemble real guns""","""set up high security check points so cars coming and going can be checked to ensure no contraband is being smuggled in""",,
27915,7317,"""This contradiction between the fossil data and the predictions of evolutionary theory falsifies the theory.38""","""Horrible conclusion , drawn from premises known to be false .""",DISAGREE,"""This contradiction between the fossil data and the predictions of evolutionary theory falsifies the""","""Horrible conclusion , drawn from premises known to be false .""",,
27947,7322,"""How about you let me speak for myself ? It 's a given that criminals do n't obey laws . Why labor that point ? If the record of private party sales is kept with a FFL doing the background check , as is the case with initial sales , trace data could be available to law enforcement . The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE of course , since the FFL that corresponds to the serial number would no longer have a record of the current owner . Probably time I look into specifics of how it works in CA .""","""Because you seem to lose sight of that with your whackjob ideas . Case in point `` The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE `` now you have the manufacturer involved in law enforcement . Would you have the big 3 involved in pointing out to LE who last bought their products involving drive bys and vehicular homicide ? You have no clue as to how the whole process works yet you are going to put your oar in and muddy the process . Here 's a small lesson for you . The manufacturers of firearms do n't sell to dealers . They sell to distributors who in turn sell to dealers . You are still lacking any valid proof that the law abiding are the problem .""",DISAGREE,"""If the record of private party sales is kept with a FFL doing the background check , as is the case with initial sales , trace data could be available to law enforcement . The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE of course , since the FFL that corresponds to the serial number would no longer have a record of the current owner .""","""Case in point `` The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE `` now you have the manufacturer involved in law enforcement . Would you have the big 3 involved in pointing out to LE who last bought their products involving drive bys and vehicular homicide ? You have no clue as to how the whole process works yet you are going to put your oar in and muddy the process . Here 's a small lesson for you . The manufacturers of firearms do n't sell to dealers . They sell to distributors who in turn sell to dealers .""",,
27948,7322,"""How about you let me speak for myself ? It 's a given that criminals do n't obey laws . Why labor that point ? If the record of private party sales is kept with a FFL doing the background check , as is the case with initial sales , trace data could be available to law enforcement . The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE of course , since the FFL that corresponds to the serial number would no longer have a record of the current owner . Probably time I look into specifics of how it works in CA .""","""Because you seem to lose sight of that with your whackjob ideas . Case in point `` The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE `` now you have the manufacturer involved in law enforcement . Would you have the big 3 involved in pointing out to LE who last bought their products involving drive bys and vehicular homicide ? You have no clue as to how the whole process works yet you are going to put your oar in and muddy the process . Here 's a small lesson for you . The manufacturers of firearms do n't sell to dealers . They sell to distributors who in turn sell to dealers . You are still lacking any valid proof that the law abiding are the problem .""",DISAGREE,"""If the record of private party sales is kept with a FFL doing the background check , as is the case with initial sales""","""Case in point `` The manufacturer would have to know where to point LE ``""",,
27953,7323,"""How does it not refute creationism ? Creationism states that the world is 7,000 years old . Carbon dating is only accurate up to a point , and that point is WELL beyond creationism 's statements .""","""How do you know carbon dating is so accurate ? Would you bet your life on it ?""",DISAGREE,"""Creationism states that the world is 7,000 years old""","""How do you know carbon dating is so accurate ?""",,
27962,7326,"""Most abortions are consentual , no one FORCED them to have consentual sex . So , instead of women taking accountability for their actions , they will FORCE their views on another human being ... die you sucker die . You are right , we need to stop FORCING people . Lets start with the mother shall we ?""","""so since most abortions were n't rape , do you still support abortions for people who are raped ? Just wondering .""",DISAGREE,"""Most abortions are consentual , no one FORCED them to have consentual sex .""","""do you still support abortions for people who are raped ?""",,
27966,7327,"""Who 's to say that anyone Bush might appoint would n't strike down a constitutional amendment that bans gay marriage ? The justices are not to be the puppets of the legislature or the president . Do n't forget Richard Nixon 's appointment of Harry Blackmun .""","""Because the judges President Bush nominates are strict constructionist.They interpret the law not make it ........... That is the worse nightmare for a liberal or a gay who depend on judges to over rule the vote of the people ............ They ca n't win at the ballot box so they think they can win in the courts .... It wo n't happen.get use to it ................""",DISAGREE,"""Who 's to say that anyone Bush might appoint would n't strike down a constitutional amendment that bans gay marriage ?""","""Because the judges President Bush nominates are strict""",,
27970,7328,"""Or by not granting them to the child you are endangering the rights of the child carried by the woman . You are giving her a dictatorship .""","""And what exactly am i granting to the suit-wearing politicians in washington by giving them the right to revoke her ability to make these decisions for herself ? I do n't think dictatorship is the right word , since she is not asking for the power over anyone but herself , and her child . Would you call a man dying of inoperable cancer who decides to end his chemotherapy a dictator ? Or a parent who decides to remove their child from life-support ? Would you rather it be a democracy ? That everytime a woman is faed with this predicament , we put it to a vote ? How about an oligarchy- where her situation is put in front of some committee who decides her fate ?""",DISAGREE,"""the child you are endangering the rights of the child carried by the woman""","""I do n't think dictatorship is the right word , since she is not asking for the power over anyone but herself , and her child""",,
27977,7329,"""Many countries already ban private gun ownership . Rwanda and Sierra Leone are two notable examples . Yet , with more than a million people hacked to death over the last seven years , were their citizens better off without guns ?""","""The number of deaths wouldn´t be lower in any way . After all , countries like Rwanda and Sierra Leone don´t have a working governmental strucure so couldn´t enforce such a ban .""",DISAGREE,"""Many countries already ban private gun ownership""","""The number of deaths wouldn´t be lower in any way""",,
27991,7332,"""By multi-formation you mean spontaneous , simultaneous mutations in all the related genomes ?""","""They would not have to be spontaneous or simultaneous but they would have to exactly copy many structures of each other , highly unlikely .""",DISAGREE,"""multi-formation you mean spontaneous , simultaneous mutations in all the related genomes""","""spontaneous or simultaneous but they would have to exactly copy many structures of each other , highly unlikely""",,
28021,7337,"""Hmm , abortion debate ... walks away very very slowly .""","""haha , probably very smart of you It gets heated in here""",DISAGREE,"""Hmm , abortion debate ... walks away very very slowly""","""haha , probably very smart of you It gets heated in here""",,
28030,7339,"""And like usual , you are wrong . Abiogenesis - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""","""Yes , I 'm always a step behind the word definition switcharoos . I have been told many times on 4forums that abiogenesis is not science .""",DISAGREE,"""you are wrong .""","""Yes , I 'm always a step behind the word definition""",,
28035,7340,"""Interesting . What you call a fine for non-compliance , I call a benefit FOR compliance . There are lots of examples of laws designed to promote social changes . Tax codes that favor married couples is but one example . Another would be IRAs . Uncle Sam rewards people for saving money by deferring taxes on that money . It rewards home owners with deductions for mortgage interest . I do n't see rewarding hetero marriage as being any different . The government is promoting hetero marriage .""","""Well , I do understand that you call it a benefit for compliance , but my argument was that a benefit for compliance is the same thing as a fine for non-compliance and that in reality , the government is simply promoting one lifestyle over another . That is equivalent to destroying freedom . I do understand that the government rewards people for taking certain actions . IRA 's are an example , yes , promoting investment in an IRA does destroy freedom in a sense . But there is at least a debatable reason behind the government using taxpayer money to reward IRA investers . The government wants people to have money in their old age so that they will be happier in the long run . But when the government is promoting heterosexual marriage , it is n't because promoting heterosexual marriage over homosexual marriage is a good thing , and it is n't because heterosexual couples deserve more money or more benefits than same-sex couples . It is because the majority is willing to use religious beliefs as a reason to give themselves more benefits under the law , as a reason to hurt others while benefiting themselves , as a reason to promote their own religoius beliefs over someone else 's .""",DISAGREE,"""I call a benefit FOR compliance""","""my argument was that a benefit for compliance is the same thing as a fine for non-compliance""",,
28039,7341,"""ON the subject of your starting arguments , I notice you selectively ignored my view that I posted . Could n't come up with an argument ?""","""Actually I did n't even read it ( and doubt I ever will ) . Do n't get all worked up over it .""",DISAGREE,"""I notice you selectively ignored my view that I posted .""","""Actually I did n't even read it""",,
28059,7346,"""`` They do n't have .38s anymore . They have AK-47s . ... They have automatic weapons now , `` said Sgt . Pfeil .""","""Well if they 're automatic weapons then they 're obviously importing them illegally from outside the country and violating federal regulations . You 've got even bigger problems than you think .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't have .38s anymore . They have AK-47s . ... They have automatic weapons now , `` said Sgt . Pfeil .""","""Well if they 're automatic weapons then they 're obviously importing them illegally from outside the country and violating federal regulations .""",,
28065,7347,"""Should it be legalized ? Yes . Is it harmful ? No , not nearly as much as alcohol or tobacco . Should it be taxed once legalized ? Yes . Should laws still aply to it , such as DUIs and the like ? Yes .""","""Should it be legalized ? Only if every other country did it Is it harmful ? Yes more so then moderate alcohol use and worse then smoking Should it be taxed once legalized ? Yes . Should laws still apply to it , such as DUIs and the like ? Yes .""",DISAGREE,"""Should it be legalized ? Yes . Is it harmful ? No , not nearly as much as alcohol or tobacco . Should it be taxed once legalized ? Yes . Should laws still aply to it , such as DUIs and the like ? Yes .""","""Should it be legalized ? Only if every other country did it Is it harmful ? Yes more so then moderate alcohol use and worse then smoking Should it be taxed once legalized ? Yes""",,
28070,7348,"""The report is very recent . Lack of action by the ATF within a few days of a report being released is not evidence of anything . Secondly , the ATF ca n't just walk into a gun show and randomly choose people to investigate . They have to have specific information about the identity of people suspected of breaking the law at gun shows before investigating . So unless they are given such information about the sellers in the NYC report they ca n't do anything .""","""You know you are full of it when you claim they ca n't just walk into a gun show . Strange that can can do just that at a licensed dealers . What would be so very different than checking licensed dealers at a gun shop and investigating the same at a show ? Go back to the Brady bunch and see if they have any facts that prevent the BATF from doing any thing . Try again Brady as your logic and facts just do n't hold up . edit : The BATFE checks paperwork as part of their investigations . Federal laws are not suspended at gun shows as you would have the uneducated and ill informed believe .""",DISAGREE,"""the ATF ca n't just walk into a gun show and randomly choose people to investigate .""","""that can can do just that at a licensed dealers .""",,
28075,7349,"""While I again feel that it should be assumed he would do so to begin with , I can agree that a simple answer as you say would have been easy enough .""","""You accuse others of making an assumption to the answer . But then you admit that YOU think the answer should have been assumed . Do you see a problem here ?""",DISAGREE,"""While I again feel that it should be assumed he would do so to begin with , I can agree that a simple answer as you say would have been easy enough .""","""You accuse others of making an assumption to the answer . But then you admit that YOU think the answer should have been assumed . Do you see a problem here ?""",,
28079,7350,"""The Washington DC city council has turned down ballot initiatives to allow the people of DC to vote on this issue ( as well as some other issues recently ) . Considering the amount of support these initiatives appeared to have I think were going to see some new blood on the council soon . They have made some decisions of late that have n't sat to well with the people of DC , this appears to be one of them .""","""DC has a law that human and civil rights can not be put up for a vote , this is the way it should be in the rest of the country . Why do you want to be able to vote on other peoples lives ? Why is it that you are so cruel ?""",DISAGREE,"""The Washington DC city council has turned down ballot initiatives to allow the people of DC to vote on this issue ( as well as some other issues recently ) . Considering the amount of support these initiatives appeared to have I think were going to see some new blood on the council soon .""","""DC has a law that human and civil rights can not be put up for a vote , this is the way it should be in the rest of the country . Why do you want to be able to vote on other peoples lives ?""",,
28083,7358,"""Well , that makes no sense at all That 's like saying atheists love the idea of a number so big that no number could be bigger .""","""Here ’ s how it makes sense ; If atheists seek to support their belief system , they are more likely to accept what science tells them about topics like this without giving the details much thought . People are often short on patience you know , post # 40 indicates it . I honestly wonder if those analogies don ’ t soar over many peoples heads . They 're not scientific , they 're common sense . But if an educated person disregards them because of impatience , or arrogance directed at the source , it can obliterate the effect of their education . It 's the difference in having been taught what to think , vs. knowing how to think . There is a reason why the most successful countries involve people besides only the educated in the political process .""",DISAGREE,"""that makes no sense at all That 's like saying atheists love the idea of a number so big that no number could be bigger .""","""’ s how it makes sense ; If atheists seek to support their belief system , they are more likely to accept what science tells them""",,
28086,7359,"""I think I 'm getting what you are saying here , and I sort of agree . It is both the body and the mind that make a person , and each are important . If you have one without the other- the body ( very underdeveloed in this case ) without the mind in the case of a foetus , it does not make a person .""","""That means that you view mental existence as being critical to our existence as a person . What about the body ? If we were all mind and no body ( this , granted , is purely a hypothetical and is often referred to in the hypothetical supernatural sense as a soul ) , would we still exist as people ? If not , then what would we be ? I agree that our bodies are an important part of how we view ourselves but are they part of the very core ? I would sincerely miss my legs if they had to be amputated . However , I would still exist . Taking it to the extreme , I would sincerely miss my body if all that were left was a functioning brain , but I would still exist .""",AGREE,"""If you have one without the it does not make a person""","""However , I would still exist .""",,
28119,7368,"""For a 13 year old girl that could greatly damage her body to have a pregnancy so young . She is just starting to grow and mature , and its not healthy , natural , or right to have a pregnancy at that age . She could cause alot of damage being that young .""","""WF , that is true and if the young lady life is endangered then to terminate the pregnancy would be appropriate but get a neutral doctor to make that decision , not one from Planned Parenthood or and abortion clinic who have a biased interest in performing abortions ............... That is all I ask ...........""",AGREE,"""For a 13 year old girl that could greatly damage her body to have a pregnancy so young . She is just starting to grow and mature , and its not healthy , natural , or right to have a pregnancy at that age .""","""WF , that is true and if the young lady life is endangered then to terminate the pregnancy would be appropriate but get a neutral doctor to make that decision , not one from Planned Parenthood or and abortion clinic who have a biased interest in performing abortions""",,
28136,7373,"""Personally , I feel that abortion is wrong , even if the mother is in danger of loosing her life when the baby is born . Think about , just for a second , not only did God create us , but he also decides when our work for him is over and we can return home to Him . With that in mind , if the mother is in danger of loosing her life , it is God 's will . Her work here on earth is done . Some may argue that `` who cares ? it wasnt alive anyway , and besides , what are the chances that it would have actually done something great like find a cure for AIDS ? `` I have had many people use that in an arguement , well , my answer for them is always `` what are the chances that would n't ? `` Think about it . One of the 3000 or so aborted babies a day , could have found the cure for AIDS or another disease . Another may have found a way to have the closest thing to world peace that we can have .""","""Well you just made the ultimate mistake . Trying to justify things based on your belief in God skews your views and does n't allow you to make a logical decision anyways . This has basically just become a religious debate instead of one on abortion and I think if you want to find the answer to this question you will need to debate on the Religion board . Also if everything that occurs is Gods will , then is n't it Gods will that an abortion take place if it does occur ? I wo n't debate that an aborted baby could have been responsible for an important event in the future if it had been born , but this is a rare event . I submit to you this idea as well if you like the cases of rare events . What if one of those babies grew up and killed someone who would be responsible for an important future event had he lived long enough to do so ? That is a rare case as well . I 'm sure you will say this does n't justify abortion and I 'll agree with you because both our points about low probability instances are so rare that they should n't matter in this debate anyways .""",DISAGREE,"""if the mother is in danger of loosing her life , it is God 's will""","""This has basically just become a religious debate instead of one on abortion""",,
28143,7375,"""ythe medical establishment has convinced people that we are what we are because what our genes say we are""","""Which is why the `` medical establishment `` endorses smoking , drinking heavily and a fatty diet , with no excercise , because they believe we are predestined by our genes , right ? Why do you persist with these blatant lies ?""",DISAGREE,"""medical establishment has convinced people""","""medical establishment `` endorses smoking , drinking heavily and a fatty diet ,""",,
28154,7377,"""This is a serious problem that government caused , not the greedy capitalist pigs they would like us to believe . I ca n't imagine an insurance company would agree to coverage of a person who found out he had cancer yesterday and applied for insurance today . They had mandates forcing this on them . Anyone who buys insurance has to make up the loss . There has to be another way to solve the problem .""","""I ca n't imagine it either , but if I had to pick one type of business most capable of turning a government mandate into a profit , insurance companies would get my vote . I 'm afraid that too many people subconsiously think that conflicts between opposites like health providers ( or trial lawyers ) vs. insurance companies result in victory for the general public . Shandag 's comments show that they both can have common interests ( State mandates ) that result in wins for both of them and a loss for the general public .""",AGREE,"""This is a serious problem that government caused , not the greedy capitalist pigs they would like us to believe .""","""I ca n't imagine it either""",,
28163,7380,"""Whether an all-out ban on guns is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , or an assault-weapons ban is good or bad ( or constitutional ) , it should be obvious to any reader that the Columbus city council is trying to push through an all-out ban on guns by calling this an assault weapons ban .""","""The Second Amendment does not apply to an Ohio Law . Thus , this ban is not unconstituitonal under the US Constitution . The Ohio Constitution , may however , protect gun rights , but I have n't read it .""",DISAGREE,"""all-out ban on guns is good or bad , or an assault-weapons ban is good or bad calling this an assault weapons ban""","""does not apply to an Ohio Law , this ban is not , may however , protect gun rights , I have n't read it""",,
28172,7382,"""I 'm just waiting for a logical arguement to debate against . I have n't heard one yet . Neo-darwinism is more than just gasping for air -- it 's stone-cold dead .""","""Well , you would n't find a logical argument if you only read your own posts , now would you ? To find a logical argument to debate against , I would recommend 4forums.com in the creation vs. evolution section . Of course , only creationists have the honor of debating against logical arguments . Also , denying that our arguments are logical does nothing . Please attempt to refute them . We refute yours , even though we see no logic . Finally , Darwin 's Theory of Evolution by Natural Selection is not a theory in crisis in any way . Get over it .""",DISAGREE,"""I have n't heard one yet . Neo-darwinism is more than just gasping for air""","""Also , denying that our arguments are logical does nothing . Please attempt to refute them .""",,
28184,7385,"""`` ... guns intimidate and make people uncomfortable. `` Crazy Californians .""","""And a lot of people are made uncomfortable by a presence of a mother breastfeeding her baby in public . You ca n't simply let standards of discomfort rule and guide the course of law . There 's no constitutional or human right to be free of discomfort and not intimidated . If you 're intimidated by somebody walking a large , powerful looking dog that could probably break your arm in its mouth , should we take steps to prevent such dogs from being owned , or walked in places where other people are present ? I 'm sure if you look you can find plenty of women who are uncomfortable in the presence of black men , for whatever reason . Should we take action to free them of their discomfort ?""",DISAGREE,"""make people Crazy Californians""","""lot of people are made uncomfortable by a presence of a mother breastfeeding her baby in public let standards of discomfort rule and guide the course of law , where other people are present Should we take action to free""",,
28198,7387,"""What is ? Whether abortion is right or wrong is a matter of opinion , unless you 're trying to say that everyone who supports it secretly is against it .""","""Well then . Murder is an opinion .""",DISAGREE,"""Whether abortion is right or wrong is a matter of opinion , unless you 're trying to say that everyone who supports it secretly is against it .""","""Well then . Murder is an opinion""",,
28203,7388,"""There 's plenty of people here with more science than I . Does anyone know of science tests for 'dark ' ? If not , would this not suggest that it is non-material ?""","""You 've got to be kidding me . Dark : [ a region of space/time ] devoid or partially devoid of light Even Amazon.com : http : //www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/se ... 167429-5007155 http : //www.dasdistribution.com/produ ... cal_models.htm http : //www.professionalequipment.com ... qx/default.htm Althought I think the average adult could have answered it , or a photographer , or someone who can do a search on amazon.com . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""Does anyone know of science tests for 'dark ' ? If not , would this not suggest that it is non-material ?""","""You 've got to be kidding me . Dark devoid or partially devoid of light Even ,""",,
28236,7394,"""This is no different than the discredited Kellerman study !""","""Oh sure there is ! I bet this one was printed on recycled paper .""",DISAGREE,"""This is no different than the discredited Kellerman study !""","""Oh sure there is !""",,
28250,7397,"""Each individual has the right to self defense no matter what their IQ , or no matter how `` dumb `` they appear to be . There are set standards and `` guidelines `` most states have set up in order to determine whether or not a person `` qualifies `` to carry a gun . While I understand the purpose , and I understand what these state CCW qualifications are designed to do , I am NOT comfortable with the idea of having the state use any method to determine if I `` qualify `` for a right . Do you have to pass a qualification for free speech ? How about a test to see if you can go to church ? Do you have to fill out a questionairre to get protection from illegal search and seizure ? Each and every individual , regardless of their intelligence , should have the right to defend their lives in the most efficient manner they choose . Are there some people out there who just should n't have a gun ? Of course . There is a method used to weed these people out . When they do something illegal or truly `` dumb `` , the cops arrest them and take away their legal ability to carry . Until that time EVERYONE deserves the right to carry a gun , no matter where they fall on your personal intelligence scale .""","""Who would I trust with a firearm ? Anyone I would trust to drive a car . Until they did something to justify why they should n't have one . We are all free , until we do something that justifies the removal of our freedom . We are not born as slaves who have to qualify to receive it .""",DISAGREE,"""While I understand the purpose , and I understand what these state CCW qualifications are designed to do , I am NOT comfortable with the idea of having the state use any method to determine if I `` qualify `` for a right .""","""Who would I trust with a firearm ? Anyone I would trust to drive a car . Until they did something to justify why they should n't have one .""",,
28254,7398,"""All creationists have to date things is a BOOK . Paleontology uses scientific methods .""","""But if the Bible is the Word of God , then it is the truth , is it not ? Hence , this would be far more reliable than man-made methods . You interestingly enough bring up the so-called `` scientific dating methods `` . Well , did you know that out of the 200 possible dating methods that we can apply , only 20 of those methods bring an age for things that fits with the evolutionary theory . Since you have some education in paleontology I trust that you know that most fossils do not usually contain radioactive minerals , so they can not usually be dated by radiometric means . What is usually done is to find a volcanic flow in association with the fossil layer , and try to date that using methods such as the potassium-argon dating . Now , there have been several examples where radio-dating methods have failed . In the `` Creation Magazine `` there have been detailed reprots in which wood found in `` 250-million-year-old `` sandstone , or in volcanic rock `` tens of millions of years old `` has given carbon-dating results of only thousands of years . Now you should know that if the wood was really 250 million years old there would be no radio-carbon isotopes in the wood . Radio-carbon dating only gives dates limited to a few thousand years according to evolutionary theory . So now comes the question , which one are you going to trust ? This example came from : Snelling , A. , `` Radioactive dating in conflict ! '' , Creation 20 ( 1 ) :24-27 , 1998 . Also when creation geologists sample volcanic rock known to have flowed in historic times , sending it to reputable radiometric dating labs , such as Oxford , the `` dating `` almost invariably gives results in the millions of years ! This came from : Snelling , A. , `` Radioactive Dating Failure `` , Creation 22 ( 1 ) :18-21 , 2000 . This strongly suggests that the assumptions behind the dating methods are flawed . Now creationists do n't have all the answers when it comes to radio-active dating , but they know that there is something wrong with it , examplified by the examples above .""",DISAGREE,"""Paleontology uses scientific methods .""","""Since you have some education in paleontology""",,
28261,7399,"""face it -- life has stumped science -- it can not be defined , it can not be measured ... it can not be explained in any sort of scientific way .""","""No you face it . Science has managed to show that life and non-life are not distinct and are indeed simply a continuium of molecular complexity and function . There is no clear difference which can separate life from molecules which are generally NOT considered to be living . There is only matter and energy found in configurations of widely differing complexity thats it so far as matter/energy at the basic temperature range we exist in . Nobody is stumped by this at all . Indeed one might well declare that life is dead - except it sounds strange .""",DISAGREE,"""can not be explained in any sort of scientific way .""","""No you face it""",,
28262,7399,"""face it -- life has stumped science -- it can not be defined , it can not be measured ... it can not be explained in any sort of scientific way .""","""No you face it . Science has managed to show that life and non-life are not distinct and are indeed simply a continuium of molecular complexity and function . There is no clear difference which can separate life from molecules which are generally NOT considered to be living . There is only matter and energy found in configurations of widely differing complexity thats it so far as matter/energy at the basic temperature range we exist in . Nobody is stumped by this at all . Indeed one might well declare that life is dead - except it sounds strange .""",DISAGREE,"""has stumped science -- it can not be defined , it can not be measured ... it can not be explained in any sort of scientific way .""","""Science has managed to show that life and non-life are not distinct and are indeed simply a continuium of molecular complexity and function""",,
28271,7401,"""`` ( 22 . ) Criminals , being the lowlife , deviant scum they are , would never be smart enough to anticipate the possibility that their victims might be armed , and would thus never take along guns themselves .""","""Criminals continually inform the public that their greatest fear is a victim capable of fighting back against them and possibly killing them .""",DISAGREE,"""Criminals , being the lowlife , deviant scum they are , would never be smart enough to anticipate the possibility that their victims might be armed""","""Criminals continually inform the public that their greatest fear is a victim capable of fighting back against them and possibly killing them .""",,
28289,7405,"""NO I mean every word of what I type . If they institute these rules I will back off gay claim to marriage and accept that marriage is about children . As long as they continue to let 70 and 80 year olds get married marriage is not about children and there is no reason to exclude gay people . I would also add one more lisencing rule 8 No one may have children with out a marriage lisence .""","""Well I got ta hand it to you , Matt , you 're consistent .""",DISAGREE,"""70 and 80 year olds get married marriage is not about children""","""Matt , you 're consistent .""",,
28310,7408,"""Evolutionists like to think that Selection can reverse the effects of biological decay . They ’ ve argued this for decades .""","""True .""",AGREE,"""Selection can reverse the effects of biological decay""","""True""",,
28327,7411,"""Any of these arguments sound familiar ? Dailymotion - Atheist Delusion ( Satire ) - un vídeo de Cortos & amp ; Series Is Archie just the greatest example ever of Poe 's law , or is he really serious ? Hard to tell , is n't it ?""","""I 'm convinced .""",AGREE,"""Archie just the greatest example ever of Poe 's law , or is he really serious""","""I 'm convinced""",,
28331,7412,"""There will also be a push to repeal the so-called Tiahrt amendment , named after Rep. Todd Tiahrt , R-Kan. , that limits the authority of the Bureau of Alcohol , Tobacco , Firearms and Explosives to disclose gun-trace data to the public and requires that certain records submitted to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System be destroyed after 24 hours . Both the Third Way 's Bennett and Helmke said it may take another major gun crime , like the shootings at Columbine High School or Virginia Tech , to get Congress to act on more ambitious gun control initiatives . Those include overturning a law enacted in 2005 that denies gun crime victims the right to sue firearms manufacturers and dealers for damages . Sen. Dianne Feinstein , D-Calif. , said she plans to push legislation to reinstate a federal ban on some assault weapons that became law during the Clinton administration in 1994 but expired under the Bush administration in 2004 . Another long-term goal is requiring that all gun shows conduct background checks before selling firearms . The NRA 's Cox said his group is gearing up to fight a new assault weapons ban , noting that Obama supports one and that Attorney General Eric Holder recently linked the proliferation of military-style weapons to the violence along the Mexican border . '' It 's laughable if it was n't so serious to suggest that diminishing the Second Amendment will positively impact the situation down in Mexico , `` Cox said .""","""And to put some meat on the bones of what Daewoo said about the NRA .""",DISAGREE,"""There will also be a push to repeal the so-called Tiahrt amendment ,""","""And to put some meat on the bones of what Daewoo said about the NRA .""",,
28339,7413,"""I think bringing `` emotions `` into the question of whether God exists or not tends to cloud the issue a bit . Is n't the essence of atheism a rational enquiry which concludes that in the absence of any credible evidence , there is no reason to believe in God ? An emotional attachment to `` non-belief `` would be irrelevant ( and irrational ) .""","""This is more accurate , but let me modify it a bit . Without evidence there is no reason to conclude that there MUST be a god . A lack of evidence does not ensure that there is no god , just that we ca n't assume that there is .""",DISAGREE,"""I think bringing `` emotions `` into the question of whether God exists or not tends to cloud the issue a bit""","""Without evidence there is no reason to conclude that there MUST be a god . A lack of evidence does not ensure that there is no god , just that we ca n't assume that there is .""",,
28341,7414,"""And yet , in this case , your candidate emphatically says no to supporting gay marriage . And you are n't outraged by that ? That 's what I do n't understand .""","""Well gee , that 's what I spent all that time trying to explain to you . Perhaps you want to go back to that discussion , and not segue off onto other topics ?""",DISAGREE,"""no to supporting gay marriage .""","""that 's what I spent all that time trying to explain to you .""",,
28348,7415,"""It 's not faith if it 's validated scientifically .""","""Why not ? There 's no rules that say faith and science must be separate .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not faith if it 's validated scientifically .""","""There 's no rules that say faith and science must be separate .""",,
28353,7416,"""how many animals do you think were on the Ark ? how many species existed at the time ? the story of the ark does not coincide with contemporary science , but it does work with the rest of Genesis . this is Genesis 2 : 15-23 now bear in mind that all this happened in one day ( day 6 ) . How many species of animals can a man name in a day ? OK , Noah is 9 generations after Adam , and according to the story , a generation was like 200 years on average , plus at the time Noah built the ark , he was some 200 something himself ( cant remember the exact figure ) . so say its 2000 years or so after the creation day . Anyway , its possible that not a lot of speciation took place in that time , plus its arguable that there wasnt a lot of migration away from the Eden area either . so all the animals in the Earth were relatively close-by , and there couldnt have been a great number of new or variant species from the ones originally created . From the Creation to the Flood , the story makes sense . multiply the number of animals Adam named in a day by 2 , and add 25 % for speciation , and thats the number of animals that needed to be in the ark . sounds logical to me but then again , its just a story ...""","""That & # 8217 ; s not the problem . The problem is how do you account for all the different species that are on the earth today coming from what you say were on the ark ?""",DISAGREE,"""but it does work with the rest of Genesis . this is Genesis 2 : 15-23 now bear in mind that all this happened in one day ( day 6 ) . How many species of animals can a man name in a day""","""That s not the problem . The problem is how do you account for all the different species that are on the earth today coming from what you say were on the ark ?""",,
28358,7417,"""What is IIDB ?""","""someone needs to go over to IIDB and invite those kooks over here to debate me on this thread . There 's currently an open thread over there with my name on it ... seems they like obsessing over me .... they 're like a bunch of teeny boppers obsessing and salivating over a Backstreet Boy .""",DISAGREE,"""What is IIDB ?""","""go over to IIDB and invite those kooks""",,
28373,7419,"""mercy and killing should never be put together . there is no such thing as having so much compassion that justifies you putting a toddler to death . Dont people realize that children are gifts and not something that should be taken so lightly as to steep so low in stopping a beating heart all for the sake of selfishness and convenience for one 's self .. There is absolutely no thought whatsoever in the baby , its all about `` how can i live easier without this problem ? '' . there is no such thing as compassionate killing . What it really means is `` killing in the name of mercy for my comfort `` . people need to start realizing that the world doesnt revolve around them and that life itself is a gift TO ALL ! EVEN THOSE LITTLE ONES THAT PEOPLE RIGHT NOW THINK DONT HAVE ANY RIGHT TO LIVE . look in the mirror !""","""My life was a gift from my parents , no more , no less . When i look in the mirror , i do not see an embryo . If someone gives you something , they have every right to take it away if they feel you are not suited to handle it , or if they had second thoughts . I would think this was ok if the baby was stopped in an earlier stage , but once its in its third trimester , you have no right to kill it .""",DISAGREE,"""mercy and killing should never be put together . there is no such thing as having so much compassion that justifies you putting a toddler to death""","""My life was a gift from my parents , no more , no less . When i look in the mirror , i do not see an embryo""",,
28391,7424,"""Is marriage a civil right or a religious right ?""","""I believe the OP misspoke ; I * think * the question ought to have been 'Is marriage a civil or religious rite ? ' . Hopefully they can post back and confirm .""",DISAGREE,"""Is marriage a civil right or a religious right ?""","""I believe the OP misspoke ; I * think * the question ought to have been 'Is marriage a civil or religious rite ? ' . Hopefully they can post back and confirm .""",,
28415,7431,"""I have brought up the following item for discussion before , but it seems relevant here , too . Assuming abortion is justified as one means of acheiving the goal of population control , is it outrageous to consider 'removing ' non-productive members of our society as another means of achieving the same goal ?""","""Non-productive how ? Criminals ? How about bad artists ? Stock brokers ? Clergy ? Philosophers ? YGMD .""",DISAGREE,"""Assuming abortion is justified as one means of acheiving the goal of population control , is it outrageous to consider 'removing ' non-productive members of our society as another means of achieving the same goal ?""","""Non-productive how ? Criminals ? How about bad artists ? Stock brokers ? Clergy ? Philosophers ? YGMD .""",,
28436,7443,"""As others pointed out , this is a misconception . I have little doubt that the great majority of pro-choice people are quite positive about wanted pregnancies . I suspect that this misconseption comes from the fact that almost all abortion discussions are about pregnancies that are not wanted . Pregnancies that are wanted are almost never discussed since they are not relevant to an abortion debate . After all , who would want to abort a fetus if they wanted to be pregnant and have a baby ( excluding rare cases of risk of mother 's death , severely deformed fetus , etc . ) ?""","""Ok , this makes sense . I do think however , that wanted pregnancies should be a part of the abortion debate , even though as you say , they usually are not . Part of the abortion issue ( and the most important part , IMO ) is the perception of pregnancy itself . If society moves in a direction where having a baby is looked upon as a negative thing , this is not good . One way to help make abortion rarer is to help people view having a baby as a positive thing . As Clinton himself once said , abortion should be rare .""",AGREE,"""I suspect that this misconseption comes from the fact that almost all abortion discussions are about pregnancies that are not wanted .""","""I do think however , that wanted pregnancies should be a part of the abortion debate , even though as you say , they usually are not .""",,
28439,7443,"""As others pointed out , this is a misconception . I have little doubt that the great majority of pro-choice people are quite positive about wanted pregnancies . I suspect that this misconseption comes from the fact that almost all abortion discussions are about pregnancies that are not wanted . Pregnancies that are wanted are almost never discussed since they are not relevant to an abortion debate . After all , who would want to abort a fetus if they wanted to be pregnant and have a baby ( excluding rare cases of risk of mother 's death , severely deformed fetus , etc . ) ?""","""Ok , this makes sense . I do think however , that wanted pregnancies should be a part of the abortion debate , even though as you say , they usually are not . Part of the abortion issue ( and the most important part , IMO ) is the perception of pregnancy itself . If society moves in a direction where having a baby is looked upon as a negative thing , this is not good . One way to help make abortion rarer is to help people view having a baby as a positive thing . As Clinton himself once said , abortion should be rare .""",AGREE,"""Pregnancies that are wanted are almost never discussed since they are not relevant to an abortion debate .""","""One way to help make abortion rarer is to help people view having a baby as a positive thing . As Clinton himself once said , abortion should be rare .""",,
28446,7445,"""So you 're accusing me of the thing that your most guilty of ? As I remember your posts have been censored several times by admin because you resorted to viscious personal attacks and name calling . And are n't you interested in the truth . Why is n't whether Jefferson said it or not important ?""","""TImbo Timbo Timbo ... This is the internet ... IT ca n't hurt you .. Why do n't you drop the venom .... I do n't know what a `` viscious `` personal attack is ... I have only retaliated in kind ... You seem incapable of fostering your own thoughts and can only critisize others ... I know where most people stand on these boards but you like a typical lunatic fringe liberal keep your agenda under wraps ...""",DISAGREE,"""As I remember your posts have been censored several times by admin because you resorted to viscious personal attacks and name calling . And are n't you interested in the truth .""","""I do n't know what a `` viscious `` personal attack is ... I have only retaliated in kind ... You seem incapable of fostering your own thoughts and can only critisize others ...""",,
28447,7445,"""So you 're accusing me of the thing that your most guilty of ? As I remember your posts have been censored several times by admin because you resorted to viscious personal attacks and name calling . And are n't you interested in the truth . Why is n't whether Jefferson said it or not important ?""","""TImbo Timbo Timbo ... This is the internet ... IT ca n't hurt you .. Why do n't you drop the venom .... I do n't know what a `` viscious `` personal attack is ... I have only retaliated in kind ... You seem incapable of fostering your own thoughts and can only critisize others ... I know where most people stand on these boards but you like a typical lunatic fringe liberal keep your agenda under wraps ...""",DISAGREE,"""And are n't you interested in the truth . Why is n't whether Jefferson said it or not important""","""I know where most people stand on these boards but you like a typical lunatic fringe liberal keep your agenda under wraps""",,
28457,7447,"""Usually if you speak to a christian on subjects surrounding creation they come up with `` There are many theories `` . If they were challenged to come up with 1 scientist who believed that humans do not share common ancestry with apes Behe would have been possibly the weak link . If even he believes in common ancestry do the creationists have a leg to stand on ? ( Not that lack of credibility seems to be a barrier to them ... )""","""It 's not a difficult challange . http : //www.answersingenesis.org/Home ... os/default.asp""",DISAGREE,"""If they were challenged to come up with 1 scientist who believed that humans do not share common ancestry with apes Behe would have been possibly the weak link .""","""It 's not a difficult challange . http : //www.answersingenesis.org/Home ... os/default.asp""",,
28456,7447,"""Usually if you speak to a christian on subjects surrounding creation they come up with `` There are many theories `` . If they were challenged to come up with 1 scientist who believed that humans do not share common ancestry with apes Behe would have been possibly the weak link . If even he believes in common ancestry do the creationists have a leg to stand on ? ( Not that lack of credibility seems to be a barrier to them ... )""","""It 's not a difficult challange . http : //www.answersingenesis.org/Home ... os/default.asp""",DISAGREE,"""If they were challenged to come up with 1 scientist who believed that humans do not share common ancestry with apes ...""","""It 's not a difficult challange . http : //www.answersingenesis.org/Home ... os/default.asp""",,
28474,7451,"""Pregnancy is ALWAYS physically harmful . You try carrying a load of extra weight about and see what that does to your heart . It is also always life threatening - women still die from it and you never know how childbirth is going to go . These are the normal , frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy : -- exhaustion ( weariness common from first weeks ) -- altered appetite and senses of taste and smell -- nausea and vomiting ( 50 % of women , first trimester ) -- heartburn and indigestion -- constipation -- weight gain -- dizziness and light-headedness -- bloating , swelling , fluid retention -- hemmorhoids -- abdominal cramps -- yeast infections -- congested , bloody nose -- acne and mild skin disorders -- skin discoloration ( chloasma , face and abdomen ) -- mild to severe backache and strain -- increased headaches -- difficulty sleeping , and discomfort while sleeping -- increased urination and incontinence -- bleeding gums -- pica -- breast pain and discharge -- swelling of joints , leg cramps , joint pain -- difficulty sitting , standing in later pregnancy -- inability to take regular medications -- shortness of breath -- higher blood pressure -- hair loss -- tendency to anemia -- curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities -- infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease ( pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women , and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases ) -- extreme pain on delivery -- hormonal mood changes , including normal post-partum depression -- continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period ( exacerbated if a c-section -- major surgery -- is required , sometimes taking up to a full year to fully recover ) These are the normal , expectable , or frequent PERMANENT side effects of pregnancy : -- stretch marks ( worse in younger women ) -- loose skin -- permanent weight gain or redistribution -- abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness -- pelvic floor disorder ( occurring in as many as 35 % of middle-aged former child-bearers and 50 % of elderly former child-bearers , associated with urinary and rectal incontinence , discomfort and reduced quality of life ) -- changes to breasts -- varicose veins -- scarring from episiotomy or c-section -- other permanent aesthetic changes to the body ( all of these are downplayed by women , because the culture values youth and beauty ) -- increased proclivity for hemmorhoids -- loss of dental and bone calcium ( cavities and osteoporosis ) These are the occasional complications and side effects : -- hyperemesis gravidarum -- temporary and permanent injury to back -- severe scarring requiring later surgery ( especially after additional pregnancies ) -- dropped ( prolapsed ) uterus ( especially after additional pregnancies , and other pelvic floor weaknesses -- 11 % of women , including cystocele , rectocele , and enterocele ) -- pre-eclampsia ( edema and hypertension , the most common complication of pregnancy , associated with eclampsia , and affecting 7 - 10 % of pregnancies ) -- eclampsia ( convulsions , coma during pregnancy or labor , high risk of death ) -- gestational diabetes -- placenta previa -- anemia ( which can be life-threatening ) -- thrombocytopenic purpura -- severe cramping -- embolism ( blood clots ) -- medical disability requiring full bed rest ( frequently ordered during part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of either mother or baby ) -- diastasis recti , also torn abdominal muscles -- mitral valve stenosis ( most common cardiac complication ) -- serious infection and disease ( e.g . increased risk of tuberculosis ) -- hormonal imbalance -- ectopic pregnancy ( risk of death ) -- broken bones ( ribcage , `` tail bone `` ) -- hemorrhage and -- numerous other complications of delivery -- refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease -- aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions ( e.g . epilepsy is present in .5 % of pregnant women , and the pregnancy alters drug metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the number and frequency of seizures ) -- severe post-partum depression and psychosis -- research now indicates a possible link between ovarian cancer and female fertility treatments , including `` egg harvesting `` from infertile women and donors -- research also now indicates correlations between lower breast cancer survival rates and proximity in time to onset of cancer of last pregnancy -- research also indicates a correlation between having six or more pregnancies and a risk of coronary and cardiovascular disease These are some less common ( but serious ) complications : -- peripartum cardiomyopathy -- cardiopulmonary arrest -- magnesium toxicity -- severe hypoxemia/acidosis -- massive embolism -- increased intracranial pressure , brainstem infarction -- molar pregnancy , gestational trophoblastic disease ( like a pregnancy-induced cancer ) -- malignant arrhythmia -- circulatory collapse -- placental abruption -- obstetric fistula And a few more permanent side effects : -- future infertility -- permanent disability -- death . And I 'm sure I 've missed some . Why the cheap shot against pp ?""","""So , tell me , if it is ALWAYS life-threatening , why are there so few life-threatening conditions mentioned above ? I agree that pregnancy can tax a person 's system , but so does exercise , the flu , and a million other things and only , rarely , do these result in death . In fact , I 'm willing to bet that you 're more likely to die from the flu than pregnancy . Want to take me up on the bet ? Oh and my `` love `` of PP stems from my knowledge of its original goal and current practices .""",DISAGREE,"""You try carrying a load of extra weight about and see what that does to your heart . It is also always life threatening - women still die""","""why are there so few life-threatening conditions mentioned above ? I agree that pregnancy can tax a person 's system ,""",,
28479,7453,"""IF you keep it .""","""Yep .""",AGREE,"""IF you keep it .""","""Yep .""",,
28499,7459,"""Modern-day citizens are far more likely to be aware of the sheer range of religious views in human cultures , past and present , and the consequent improbability that just one of them ( and hey , waddaya know ? It 's mine ! ) is wholly true and all the others wholly false . This leads some into woolly New-Age-ist pick-and-mixing ; others to conclude that the world 's religions are all the product of a similar , purely mundane , process of cultural evolution , and that none actually reflects fundamental truths .""","""These are n't the only two options available . The many philosophical views of the material world or ethics do n't mean these two things do n't exist .""",DISAGREE,"""the sheer range of religious views in human cultures , past and present , and the consequent improbability""","""philosophical views of the material world or ethics""",,
28517,7470,"""http : //www.straight-talk.net/evolution/explosion.htm""","""Out of curiosity , are you aware that that page is from a Young-Earth Creationist site ? The material it presents is outdated , wrong , and/or has been distorted by them , in order to fit into their fundamentalist , religious worldview .""",DISAGREE,"""http : //www.straight-talk.net/evolution/explosion.htm""","""Out of curiosity , are you aware that that page is from a Young-Earth Creationist site ?""",,
28542,7474,"""If this was on Indian property , the Federal Gun Control Laws do n't apply anyway .""","""So if the laws did n't apply here because of it being a reservation , stricter laws would not change anything ( unless ammended to apply ) . But even so , the killer would still have gotten the guns because the person he got them from had the right and duty to have them .""",DISAGREE,"""this was on Indian property , the Federal Gun Control Laws do n't apply anyway .""","""So if the laws did n't apply here because of it being a reservation , stricter laws would not change anything""",,
28546,7475,"""One of the standard rebuttals you hear is `` How did the Kangaroos get to Australia `` ? I do n't know if that 's covered in the Bible ... if God transported them or not .""","""If God transported them , we immediately have removed the flood myth from the realm of science . As if the flood itself did not do this already ...""",DISAGREE,"""How did the Kangaroos get to Australia `` ? I do n't know if that 's covered in the Bible ... if God transported them or not .""","""If God transported them , we immediately have removed the flood myth from the realm of science .""",,
28558,7477,"""That 's a pretty inane interpretation . By that logic , if we have a multi-billion dollar church , it could conceivably spend millions on political activism . But if a church only took in about twice of that same `` millions `` , the other church would be declared as violating ?""","""Actually its a pretty accurate interpretation . Take for instance the money spent by the catholic church promoting abortion restrictions , yet their tax exempt status has never seriously been called into question , that I know of . The fact of the matter is a couple hundred G 's is a drop in the bucket for an organization the size of the LDS church , so proving that it is a substantial portion of their activities under section 501 would be difficult at best .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's a pretty inane interpretation . By that logic , if we have a multi-billion dollar church , it could conceivably spend millions on political activism . But if a church only took in about twice of that same `` millions `` , the other church would be declared as violating ?""","""Actually its a pretty accurate interpretation . Take for instance the money spent by the catholic church promoting abortion restrictions , yet their tax exempt status has never seriously been called into question , that I know of .""",,
28576,7480,"""Science has now quantitated that a genetic mutation of as little as 1 billionth ( 0.0000001 % ) of an animal 's genome is completely fatal .""","""Bull XXXX . Best I can tell , our Creationist is confusing CAN with CERTAINLY WILL . In certain cases , a specific single nucleotide change CAN be lethal , but that 's not at all what the Creationist is claiming . Although this is an imperfect analogy , to see the general flaw in his logic , consider this statement : `` Science has now shown that being in a car accident is completely fatal. ``""",DISAGREE,"""a genetic mutation of as little as 1 billionth ( 0.0000001 % ) of an animal 's genome is completely fatal .""","""Creationist is confusing CAN with CERTAINLY WILL .""",,
28582,7482,"""He finishes the book with `` What kind of God do I believe in ? The answer is in these words . I believe in Darwin 's God. ``""","""And what does he mean by that ? You apparently do n't have a clue . Tell me , do you have any idea what `` secondary cause `` is ?""",DISAGREE,"""He finishes the book with `` What kind of God do I believe in ? The answer is in these words . I believe in Darwin 's""","""And what does he mean by that ? do you have any idea what `` secondary cause is ?""",,
28587,7483,"""I don ' want any more children . My son is nearly ten . That is a pretty big age difference . I especially do n't want to raise any more alone , and I do n't have a big confidence level in men ( my problem due to my history with them - I know there are good ones out there ) . Current conservative legistlation has me worried . Although I am indeed abstinate and have been for years , I ca n't guarentee that in the future . And although I practice safe sex when sexually active , there are remote chances of rape , or the more likely failed birth control . I would not have an abortion unless rape or medical need - so I will do all I can not to get pregnant again - now or in the future . And it sends a message . This body is mine . I choose now - to never be pregnant again - regardless of the circumstances .""","""I think that getting your tubes tied is a responsible act . I was just inquiring about the motive for doing so . Too bad more women ( and men ) do n't share your level of responsibility . If they did , we would n't need to debate the `` need `` for abortions .""",AGREE,"""I don ' want any more children . My son is nearly , This body is mine . I choose now - to never be pregnant again - regardless of the circumstances .""","""I think that getting your tubes tied is a responsible act . I was just inquiring about the motive for doing so .""",,
28601,7486,"""There is n't an 'evolution mod ' , its just Admin who deals with all of these sort of things and I 've not seen any bias from them at all - a quick look over the rest of the forums shows that there certainly is n't any weighting towards science or religion , . Its probably just a lot of people logging on at once messing with the server ( it finds long posts are particularly delicious , make sure you 've copied a version into word before you click reply ) - you 're not going to get told off for reposting anything . - Supersport There has been a radical change in biology , particularly at the molecular level in less than a decade as how knowledge of how genes work has increasived massively in the wake of the human genome project and the advent of 'omic ' technologies . The person who wrote the article really needs to update this as they are quite a bit behind the times working from a 1998 text book - especially if you 're going to be critising approachs to biotech . A huge amount has happened in the ten years since it was written . She 's also using a few odd terms , DNA - > RNA - > Protein is known as the 'Central Dogma ' of molecular biology and does n't really have much to do with what she is talking about , we already know there were some exceptions to this with retroviruses and we 've only recently discovered that RNA plays a lot larger role than just being an intermediate . On top of this , her 'fluid ' genome is part of the central dogma - its only a very simplistic description of what happens in the cell and does n't really go into all the modifications that the protein and RNA undergo that are n't encoded within the gene . Most of the 4 assumptions have just been made up though , Is clearly wrong , as its never been beleived that one protein = one trait . Prior to the human genome project it was thought that each gene encoded one protein ( hence why the estimates for the total number of genes in the human genome were so high ) but we 've always known that proteins interacted with each other than that many genes will only produce a trait in combination with particular allele of another gene - even Mendel knew that and he did n't even know what the 'inherited particles ' were . Again , we 've know pretty much since the first protein structures were worked out that the mRNA does n't directly translate into the protein and that the translated polypeptide is still not the end protein - that they are both cut up and rearranged . Assumption 3 is pretty much accurate , though we have seen some unusual cases that suggest that susceptability to mutation is heritable and even sometimes selected for ( indirectly at least ) . There are also wierder cases of some microorganisms 'stealing ' genes from other nearby organisms in times of stress . She is misrepresenting how common these things are though and how easy it is to proove this . If we replace 'genes ' with 'sections of the genome ' then she is dead wrong and this is n't a common assumption - transposable elements are a good example of how we know DNA sometimes does this . Basically they are bits of a retrovirus that got 'stuck ' in our genomes rather than producing new viruses - they 've lost most of the coding useful to the virus and now just have enough to write themselves out and them back in again . Post human genome project we know that over 40 % of our genome is actually made up of these broken viruses and other similar elements . Assumption 4 is exactly the same as Assumption 3 - and even now we know that 99.9 % of the time this is the case , however we 're not entirely sure whether she would count the surrounding ecosystem as part of the 'environment ' . We know bacteria can share ( or scavenge ) new genes and viruses can spread , or at least infere with , them as well .""","""So since you admit there 's been a `` radical change `` in biology do you still think neo-darwinism explains evolution ? If so , how ... if not ... what is your new explantion ?""",DISAGREE,"""There is n't an 'evolution mod ' , its just Admin who deals with all of these sort of things and I 've not seen any bias from them at all - a quick look over the rest of the forums shows that there certainly is n't any weighting towards science or religion , . Its probably just a lot of people logging on at once messing with the server ( it finds long posts are particularly delicious , make sure you 've copied a version into word before you click reply ) - you 're not going to get told off for reposting anything . - Supersport There has been a radical change in biology , particularly at the molecular level in less than a decade as how knowledge of how genes work has increasived massively in the wake of the human genome project and the advent of 'omic ' technologies""","""So since you admit there 's been a `` radical change `` in biology do you still think neo-darwinism explains evolution ? If so , how ... if not ... what is your new explantion ?""",,
28603,7486,"""There is n't an 'evolution mod ' , its just Admin who deals with all of these sort of things and I 've not seen any bias from them at all - a quick look over the rest of the forums shows that there certainly is n't any weighting towards science or religion , . Its probably just a lot of people logging on at once messing with the server ( it finds long posts are particularly delicious , make sure you 've copied a version into word before you click reply ) - you 're not going to get told off for reposting anything . - Supersport There has been a radical change in biology , particularly at the molecular level in less than a decade as how knowledge of how genes work has increasived massively in the wake of the human genome project and the advent of 'omic ' technologies . The person who wrote the article really needs to update this as they are quite a bit behind the times working from a 1998 text book - especially if you 're going to be critising approachs to biotech . A huge amount has happened in the ten years since it was written . She 's also using a few odd terms , DNA - > RNA - > Protein is known as the 'Central Dogma ' of molecular biology and does n't really have much to do with what she is talking about , we already know there were some exceptions to this with retroviruses and we 've only recently discovered that RNA plays a lot larger role than just being an intermediate . On top of this , her 'fluid ' genome is part of the central dogma - its only a very simplistic description of what happens in the cell and does n't really go into all the modifications that the protein and RNA undergo that are n't encoded within the gene . Most of the 4 assumptions have just been made up though , Is clearly wrong , as its never been beleived that one protein = one trait . Prior to the human genome project it was thought that each gene encoded one protein ( hence why the estimates for the total number of genes in the human genome were so high ) but we 've always known that proteins interacted with each other than that many genes will only produce a trait in combination with particular allele of another gene - even Mendel knew that and he did n't even know what the 'inherited particles ' were . Again , we 've know pretty much since the first protein structures were worked out that the mRNA does n't directly translate into the protein and that the translated polypeptide is still not the end protein - that they are both cut up and rearranged . Assumption 3 is pretty much accurate , though we have seen some unusual cases that suggest that susceptability to mutation is heritable and even sometimes selected for ( indirectly at least ) . There are also wierder cases of some microorganisms 'stealing ' genes from other nearby organisms in times of stress . She is misrepresenting how common these things are though and how easy it is to proove this . If we replace 'genes ' with 'sections of the genome ' then she is dead wrong and this is n't a common assumption - transposable elements are a good example of how we know DNA sometimes does this . Basically they are bits of a retrovirus that got 'stuck ' in our genomes rather than producing new viruses - they 've lost most of the coding useful to the virus and now just have enough to write themselves out and them back in again . Post human genome project we know that over 40 % of our genome is actually made up of these broken viruses and other similar elements . Assumption 4 is exactly the same as Assumption 3 - and even now we know that 99.9 % of the time this is the case , however we 're not entirely sure whether she would count the surrounding ecosystem as part of the 'environment ' . We know bacteria can share ( or scavenge ) new genes and viruses can spread , or at least infere with , them as well .""","""So since you admit there 's been a `` radical change `` in biology do you still think neo-darwinism explains evolution ? If so , how ... if not ... what is your new explantion ?""",DISAGREE,"""There is n't an 'evolution mod ' , its just Admin who deals with all of these sort of things and I 've not seen any bias from them at all""","""So since you admit there 's been a `` radical change""",,
28608,7488,"""In your analogy I would say they are confusing too . I do n't smoke however it is not because I am against smoking it is because I do n't wan na do it even though I do n't think it is `` wrong `` . This is a far cry from saying you think something is wrong yet support others doing it if they want to .""","""Ok. You do n't want to do it because you do n't want to do that to your body . Do you support other 's right to do it despite not wanting to do it to yourself ?""",DISAGREE,"""In your analogy I would say they are confusing too . I do n't smoke however it is not because I am against smoking it is because I do n't wan na do it even though I do n't think it is `` wrong `` . This is a far cry from saying you think something is wrong yet support others doing it if they want to .""","""Ok. You do n't want to do it because you do n't want to do that to your body . Do you support other 's right to do it despite not wanting to do it to yourself ?""",,
28616,7490,"""Of course they do . Just look at Black Phoenix . You would probably be suprised how many people believe just like he does . I live in the Bible belt , so the majority of people I know are creationists .""","""I 've lived in the Bible Belt ( little rock , ark . ) and maybe I still do ( nashville ) , and the majority of average middle class people there were quite southern baptist and pentacostal ( in nashville it 's Church of christ or assemblies of god , whatever that is ) . But , I 'm not so sure how they stand on creationism . I 'll bet a lot of them just go ahead and believe something close to genesis ( not literal ) , but surely they do n't totally discount evolution ( at least the people I have met and have known ) . But , if you asked them if it takes faith to believe evolution , they will all say `` Yes , it 's just a shaky unproven theory that requires faith to accept. `` And that makes them feel better about believing the absurd .""",AGREE,"""so the majority of people I know are creationists .""","""And that makes them feel better about believing the absurd .""",,
28647,7496,"""What on earth are you talking about ? You have n't done anything to show that the global warming material lacks scientific veracity .""","""Not global warmings existence , global warmings CAUSE . Does it come as a shock to you that the cause of global warming is controversial ? http : //www.canadafreepress.com/2007/ ... ming020507.htm There was also a piece of a formal debate about it on these forums . It was so lopsided , the global-warming-is-caused-by-man advocate fled the debate halfway through .""",DISAGREE,"""What on earth are you talking about ?""","""Not global warmings existence , global warmings CAUSE .""",,
28651,7497,"""* * Just for fun , some recent research -- http : //www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/ ... endix-use.html""","""and your point is ?""",DISAGREE,"""Just for fun , some recent""","""and your point is ?""",,
28653,7497,"""* * Just for fun , some recent research -- http : //www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/ ... endix-use.html""","""and your point is ?""",DISAGREE,"""some recent research -- http : //www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/ ... endix-use.html""","""and your point is ?""",,
28665,7500,"""However , a better set of inequalities is as follows : c + e > c - e e - c > e + c""","""Oops , I think YOU made a mistake here on the second one . This is the correct inequality based off of my original equation . e-c < e+c So , start over again .""",DISAGREE,"""However , a better set of inequalities is as follows : c + e > c - e e - c > e + c""","""This is the correct inequality based off of my original equation . e-c""",,
28667,7501,"""Ummm , no . How could I possibly be forcing my beliefs on you when my view is for each person to have a choice . Your view is to force society to do away with all abortions .""","""Your view of choice is your belief . I do n't `` believe `` that a pregnant woman or anyone else should be able to choose for the child . That child does not have a choice . Choosing to kill someone is a choice , but it is not a choice that should be legal . Therefore , you are forcing your view of `` choice `` on me by making abortion ( murder ) illegal .""",DISAGREE,"""forcing my beliefs on you choice""","""That child does not have a choice . Therefore , you are forcing your view of `` choice `` on me by making abortion ( murder ) illegal .""",,
28670,7501,"""Ummm , no . How could I possibly be forcing my beliefs on you when my view is for each person to have a choice . Your view is to force society to do away with all abortions .""","""Your view of choice is your belief . I do n't `` believe `` that a pregnant woman or anyone else should be able to choose for the child . That child does not have a choice . Choosing to kill someone is a choice , but it is not a choice that should be legal . Therefore , you are forcing your view of `` choice `` on me by making abortion ( murder ) illegal .""",DISAGREE,"""How could I possibly be forcing my beliefs on you when my view is for each person to have a choice .""","""Your view of choice is your belief . I do n't `` believe""",,
28675,7503,"""Why is this clear ?""","""You 'll have to ask gnojek that . It appears he thinks that any pronouncement by a scientist suggesting CO2 production is a problem is a conspiracy theory by scientists to get bigger budgets : `` As scientists we will tell you that there is a major problem that can only be solved through science , which can only be done with money . We 're scientists and we really like grant money to do research . Would n't it be great if we had a global initiative to fund this research indefinitely , or until the global warming problem is solved ... `` It 's the YEC movement all over again : there 's no proof , the evidence could be interpreted either way , it 's a scientific conspiracy theory , the Devil is behind it : it 's un-Christian to cut back on fossil fuel burning etc""",DISAGREE,"""Why is this clear ?""","""It appears he thinks that any pronouncement by a scientist suggesting CO2 production is a problem is a conspiracy theory by scientists to get bigger budgets : `` As scientists we will tell you that there is a major problem that can only be solved through science , which can only be done with money . We 're scientists and we really like grant money to do research . Would n't it be great if we had a global initiative to fund this research indefinitely , or until the global warming problem is solved ... `` It 's the YEC movement all over again : there 's no proof , the evidence could be interpreted either way , it 's a scientific conspiracy theory , the Devil is behind it : it 's un-Christian to cut back on fossil fuel burning etc""",,
28680,7504,"""Radioisotope dating is done on the rocks that fossils are found in .""","""Actually , the dating is done on layers above and below the rock in which fossils are found . You see , generally fossils are found in some sort of sedimentary rock . And sedimentary rock can not be dated . But a layer of volcanic ash above and below the fossil can be dated and thus give a date within a range .""",DISAGREE,"""Radioisotope dating is done on the rocks that fossils are found in .""","""Actually , the dating is done on layers above and below the rock in which fossils are found . You see , generally fossils are found in some sort of sedimentary rock""",,
28698,7508,"""A woman 's right to choose to keep her legs together is not in any way abridged by this bill . Ho , ho , f * * * ing ho .""","""Your mama , your wife , your sista , mista .""",DISAGREE,"""woman 's right to choose to keep her legs together is not in any way abridged by this bill .""","""Your mama , your wife , your sista , mista .""",,
28718,7512,"""You ca n't create an artificial minority , wave a magic wand and declare that they should be granted a special status . That not how it should works .""","""Yes you can it is called belonging to a religious group . Which should not be protected as it is only a choice .""",DISAGREE,"""You ca n't create an artificial minority , wave a magic wand and declare that they should be granted a special status .""","""Yes you can it is called belonging to a religious group""",,
28719,7512,"""You ca n't create an artificial minority , wave a magic wand and declare that they should be granted a special status . That not how it should works .""","""Yes you can it is called belonging to a religious group . Which should not be protected as it is only a choice .""",DISAGREE,"""You ca n't an artificial minority , wave a magic wand and declare that they should be granted a special status""","""Yes you can religious group""",,
28720,7513,"""You got numbers ? I 'm curious .""","""There is the ever popular `` smartest state `` report that places kansas at # 15 in the nation . It can be found at http : //www.morganquitno.com/edrank.htm A lot of kansas educators take exception to that report because it factors in things that may not be related . For example , Kansas kids score in the top 5 states in ALL testing categories , BUT , we score 38th in spending per pupil . We score poorly in teacher salaries ( 28 ) , and do not have teachers on our school boards ( conflict of interest ) . All those factors count against us , as well as several others . Then you have new jersey and vermont , where the kids apparently ca n't take a test , and where their average SAT scores may be confused with a shoe size , and they score in the top 5 because they spend a LOT more than kansas . A lot of people argue that they penalize states for efficiency in their education system . If you want the most comprehensive report out there , go to www.alec.org and request a copy of their `` report card for education `` . I think it is free , and it breaks down the states by several categories . It is what I always used to figure out how good a job our system was doing .""",AGREE,"""You got numbers ? I 'm curious .""",""" report that places kansas at # 15 in the nation . It can be found at http : //www.morganquitno.com/edrank.htm For example , Kansas kids score in the top 5 states in ALL testing categories score 38th in spending per pupil they score in the top 5 because they spend a LOT more than kansas""",,
28739,7515,"""They are suggesting that evolution be taught acuratly .""","""It is . What do you know about it ?""",DISAGREE,"""They are suggesting that evolution be taught acuratly .""","""It is . What do you know about it ?""",,
28755,7516,"""citizens would need to have machine guns , bazookas , shoulder launched missiles , tanks , blackhawk helicopters ,""","""I agree , for the most part . Once you get to tanks and helicopters though ? Too big , too easy a target for a tyrannical regime . Do you see the Iraqis and Afghanis using tanks and helicopters ? I 'm sure they could get them if they really wanted , but they 're useless against a government that invests in satellite technology and bombers . Better to stick with the rocket launchers and mines .""",AGREE,"""tanks helicopters""","""Once you get to tanks and helicopters though ? Too big , too easy a target for a tyrannical regime . Do you see the Iraqis and Afghanis using tanks and helicopters ? I 'm sure they could get them if they really wanted , but they 're useless against a government that invests in satellite technology and bombers . Better to stick with the rocket launchers and mines .""",,
28758,7517,"""An intelligent designer would design a system to produce the product as easily as possible .""","""With regard to this statement you have to consider : 1 . How can anyone know what product an `` intelligent designer `` wanted . 2 . Even from the example of life on Earth we can clearly see there is nothing easy at all about the path life has taken over the millenia . But I think it is possible to hold your position , although it can be a tricky one by virtue of the entrenchment of opinions that has occured in the religion science debate- due to the less than pragmatic attiudes of some of the participants .""",DISAGREE,"""An intelligent designer produce the product as easily as possible""","""How can anyone know nothing easy at all about the path life , it can be a tricky""",,
28775,7519,"""Do n't you think any gay person posting here already knew that ? Do you think this comes as any surprise ? I mean really ! Kansas ? ? ? ? I also understand Conneticutt is ready to pass legislation approving civil unions for same-sex couples without court intervention .""","""Is the glass half empty or half full ? ? We are wining rights in some states and losing in others . Soon we will be a country divided , oh wait ... we already are .""",DISAGREE,"""understand Conneticutt is ready to pass legislation approving civil unions for same-sex couples without court intervention""","""We are wining rights in some states and losing in others . Soon we will be a country divided""",,
28784,7520,"""Archangel is right on this one . It 's completely absurd to compare a tumour to a healthy fetus , which has a separate blood system , and in a relatively short space of time will be an independent person ...""","""Archie is NOT right - he has an opinion , as we all do . Pro-lifers seem to want the definition of human with attendant rights to begin at conception . The blastocyst is now turning into a tumour . So the pro-lifers can now alter their views on what constitutes 'human ' as and when it suits their purpose . Forget the emotive view of what an embryo/foetus looks like : some think that as long as it has appendages and looks human , then it IS . It is n't . It 's still a parasitic organism dependant on the host mother . You ca n't deny that . Contraception v. abortion is a separate issue : in the meantime , the host mother should be the final arbiter of what happens to her body .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's completely absurd to compare a tumour to a healthy fetus""","""it has appendages and looks human , then it IS""",,
28780,7520,"""Archangel is right on this one . It 's completely absurd to compare a tumour to a healthy fetus , which has a separate blood system , and in a relatively short space of time will be an independent person ...""","""Archie is NOT right - he has an opinion , as we all do . Pro-lifers seem to want the definition of human with attendant rights to begin at conception . The blastocyst is now turning into a tumour . So the pro-lifers can now alter their views on what constitutes 'human ' as and when it suits their purpose . Forget the emotive view of what an embryo/foetus looks like : some think that as long as it has appendages and looks human , then it IS . It is n't . It 's still a parasitic organism dependant on the host mother . You ca n't deny that . Contraception v. abortion is a separate issue : in the meantime , the host mother should be the final arbiter of what happens to her body .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's completely absurd to compare a tumour to a healthy fetus , which has a separate blood system , and in a relatively short space of time will be an independent person""","""Forget the emotive view of what an embryo/foetus looks like : some think that as long as it has appendages and looks human , then it IS . It is n't . It 's still a parasitic organism dependant on the host mother .""",,
28782,7520,"""Archangel is right on this one . It 's completely absurd to compare a tumour to a healthy fetus , which has a separate blood system , and in a relatively short space of time will be an independent person ...""","""Archie is NOT right - he has an opinion , as we all do . Pro-lifers seem to want the definition of human with attendant rights to begin at conception . The blastocyst is now turning into a tumour . So the pro-lifers can now alter their views on what constitutes 'human ' as and when it suits their purpose . Forget the emotive view of what an embryo/foetus looks like : some think that as long as it has appendages and looks human , then it IS . It is n't . It 's still a parasitic organism dependant on the host mother . You ca n't deny that . Contraception v. abortion is a separate issue : in the meantime , the host mother should be the final arbiter of what happens to her body .""",DISAGREE,"""Archangel is right on this one""","""Archie is NOT right""",,
28786,7521,"""Anyway , I honestly do n't really see a problem with salvaging things from the dead that are going to benefit the rest of mankind . It sounds icky , and is to a degree but seems better than feeding them to maggots or just burning them""",""". This is the most obscene , disgusting and down right vilest thing i have ever had the misfortune to come across.Do you watch the news or read the papers , because it was all over the national news and the papers so much in fact that the goverment set up an inquiry , and a commitee to deal with it . To say my sons body was salvage is bang out of order and i would thank you to think about the effect that your uncaring words have on people . How long have been on this board , because it is all over the place that fishx { my wife } is staunchly pro life and it would of been more helpful for your case than asking such a stupid question as to ask if she had had an abortion . You live in good old blighty and yet claim no knowledge of what was going on do you not remember alder hey childrens hospital.The system you are discussing is the same system that you live under , it was hope hospital in salford that took my babys body and never returned it .""",DISAGREE,"""I honestly do n't really see a problem with salvaging things from the dead that are going to benefit the rest of mankind .""","""This is the most obscene , disgusting and down right vilest thing i have ever had the misfortune to come""",,
28787,7521,"""Anyway , I honestly do n't really see a problem with salvaging things from the dead that are going to benefit the rest of mankind . It sounds icky , and is to a degree but seems better than feeding them to maggots or just burning them""",""". This is the most obscene , disgusting and down right vilest thing i have ever had the misfortune to come across.Do you watch the news or read the papers , because it was all over the national news and the papers so much in fact that the goverment set up an inquiry , and a commitee to deal with it . To say my sons body was salvage is bang out of order and i would thank you to think about the effect that your uncaring words have on people . How long have been on this board , because it is all over the place that fishx { my wife } is staunchly pro life and it would of been more helpful for your case than asking such a stupid question as to ask if she had had an abortion . You live in good old blighty and yet claim no knowledge of what was going on do you not remember alder hey childrens hospital.The system you are discussing is the same system that you live under , it was hope hospital in salford that took my babys body and never returned it .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't really see a problem with salvaging things from the dead that are going to benefit the rest of mankind""","""disgusting and down right vilest thing i have ever had the misfortune to come""",,
28808,7524,"""Jyoshu , if these questions already had a pat and universal answer , it would n't be necessary to ask them in the first place . Since a QUESTION was being asked , it seems fairly reasonable to realize that no ASSUMPTION as to the answer to the question was being made ...""","""Well , I 'd say that since that sort of question do n't have a pat and universal answer , then that 's why they should n't have been asked in the first place , in this case . My view is that questions over a job like this should be about a person 's qualifications .""",DISAGREE,"""if these questions already had a pat and universal answer , it would n't be necessary to ask them in the first place . Since a QUESTION was being asked""","""they should n't have been asked in the first place , in this case . My view is that questions over a job like this should be about a person 's qualifications .""",,
28817,7526,"""obvious_child and sickdelirium refuse to acknowledge the fact that the observation that the fish are dead is correct . They insist that the observation was wrong . Fossils were found of the fish . No other living fish has been found . Is the observation that all the fish found are dead correct ?""","""Yes it is , however , it was YOU on the opening post who claimed they were still alive . Let me quote you again :""",DISAGREE,"""Fossils were found of the fish . No other living fish has been found . Is the observation that all the fish found are dead correct ?""","""Yes it is , however , it was YOU on the opening post who claimed they were still alive .""",,
28825,7528,"""So you support the idea of the government forcing or endorsing families that `` raise their children the right way ? `` And who gets to define that right way ?""","""I know I am raising my away as far away from the `` right `` way as possible . Get it ? wuka wuka wuka""",DISAGREE,"""support the idea of the government forcing or endorsing families""","""I am raising my away Get it ? wuka wuka wuka""",,
28843,7532,"""You have made yourself a fool with nothing but names and insults .""","""Let me make your accusations correct . * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Now , after that , for once you 're telling the truth .""",DISAGREE,"""You have made yourself a fool with nothing but names and insults .""","""Now , after that , for once you 're telling the""",,
28853,7535,"""The old school creationists seem to be taking a new tact of proclaiming evolution to be a religion rather than true science . I do n't think this approach is all that new , but I have to admit that I have n't been around as many of the old-school creationists .""","""I 've been around the creationist/science discussions for a number of years , about 20 or so . The `` you believe in evolution `` argument has been around for at least that long . In my experience it has been a waste of breath to try to convince creationists that I do n't believe in evolution any more than they do . As I recall , the argument was even presented in a court case back in the late 60s , or maybe it was the early 80s . I could be wrong . I 'll have to check on that .""",AGREE,"""I have n't been around as many of the old-school creationists .""","""I 've been around the creationist/science discussions for a number of years , about 20 or so""",,
28856,7536,"""True , but as Lurch corrected me before : It is the theory of evolution .""","""And I 'm going to correct you again . The theory of evolution is by no means an extreme view . It is the prevailing view . More than 99 % of biologists accept the theory of evolution as the best explanation for the observations .""",DISAGREE,"""True , but as Lurch corrected me before : It is the theory of evolution .""","""And I 'm going to correct you again . The theory of evolution is by no means an extreme view .""",,
28869,7539,"""Ah , but then , it might not have been Homer . But then again , whether it was Homer or someone else , is n't earth shattering .""","""It does n't matter if it 's 'earth shattering ' or not . By admitting that we hold different standards for the Bible proves my entire point : hypocrisy on the part of skeptics .""",DISAGREE,"""But then again , whether it was Homer or someone else , is n't earth shattering .""","""It does n't matter if it 's 'earth shattering ' or not""",,
28903,7546,"""Depends on which cell you mean . Mammalian red blood cells , for example , have had their entire nuclei and mitochondria removed . Not so much as a smidgeon of DNA .""","""and ? ? ? ? ? ? ... that did n't answer my question .""",DISAGREE,"""for example , have had their entire nuclei and mitochondria removed .""","""that did n't answer my question .""",,
28906,7547,"""This yet-to-be-named new view ,""","""If it is that new , then it is not universally accepted ( even within biologists ) .""",DISAGREE,"""This yet-to-be-named new view ,""","""If it is that new , then it is not universally accepted""",,
28932,7552,"""So it 's not evidence vs evidence , it 's evidence vs religious belief .""","""Well , you ’ re just begging the question of what is evidence . You are saying religious belief ( others might say religious knowledge ) is not evidence . If it is scientific , it is evidence . If it is not scientific , it is not evidence . Have I got it right ?""",DISAGREE,"""So it 's not evidence vs evidence , it 's evidence vs religious belief .""","""’ re just begging the question of what is evidence . You are saying religious belief ( others might say religious knowledge ) is not evidence""",,
28954,7557,"""Bill lets public use lethal force on intruders | Irish Examiner Finally some common sense is coming to Ireland . Now the criminals are going to be behind the 8 ball rather than the homeowners . The Irish will soon have the ability to beat a home invader into unconsciousness with a bat , hunk of pipe or any other implement , if they catch them in the process of stealing their TV . And the burglar wo n't be able to do a damn thing about it . That 's how civilized society is supposed to work . The Castle Doctrine is spreading out from America to other nations , and it 's about damn time .""","""You think someone deserves to be beaten into unconsciousness with a bat for trying to steal a TV ?""",DISAGREE,"""Now the criminals are going to be behind the 8 ball rather than the homeowners . The Irish will soon have the ability to beat a home invader into unconsciousness with a bat ,""","""You think someone deserves to be beaten into unconsciousness with a bat for trying to steal a TV ?""",,
28960,7558,"""for a creationist to concede to evolution would mean believing that genesis is false , which would mean that the bible is not true , which would mean that it can not be the word of God , which would mean there is nothing to found a God-based religion upon .""","""And that is why they are referred to as creationists and not merely as christians . They are only a small subset of the huge christian population .""",AGREE,"""a creationist to concede to evolution would mean believing that genesis is false""","""They are only a small subset of the huge christian population""",,
28997,7566,"""Maybe freedom FROM religion would be more appropriate in this case .""","""I figure that for freedom OF religion to continue , our freedom FROM religion must be guaranteed . How can our freedom OF religion be a sure thing , when other religions force themselves upon us throught the government and legal system ?""",AGREE,"""Maybe freedom FROM religion would be more appropriate in this case .""","""I figure that for freedom OF religion to continue , our freedom FROM religion must be guaranteed .""",,
29011,7569,"""The `` solution `` is what 's causing all of the ocean currents to produce `` mega `` hurricanes , tsunamis , and other `` freak weather `` . If the more ice melts , the weather could only get much worse . That is why we must act fast . I am not trying to scare you , or freak you out by this , but this is a very serious matter .""","""We do n't actually know this for sure . There is some data but much speculation as to what is exactly causing larger and more frequent storms . The bigger problem of reducing salinity is the currents themselves and how they intergrate with migration and heat transfer . Sources of food that humans depend upon could disappear if currents drastically change . And the basis of Day after Tommorrow is correct in how the gulf stream helps regulate temperatures in Europe .""",DISAGREE,"""ocean currents to produce `` mega `` hurricanes , tsunamis , If the more ice melts , the weather could only get much worse .""","""We do n't actually know this for sure .""",,
29030,7574,"""But wo n't the streets run red with blood if people are allowed to defend themselves ? Wo n't traffic accidents become gun battles when tempers flair ?""","""Ill be the first to agree with the saying `` If you can ... and have the place to ... you will `` But like anything else .. you have to look at the better side of things ... It would act like a deterant to allow our responsable citizens to be armed .. yes perhaps what you said might take place .. but the benefits would outway them .. and thats all we can ask for in life . As for our irresponsable citizens ... they are already armed .""",AGREE,"""the streets run red with blood traffic accidents become gun battles when tempers""","""first to agree with the saying `` If you irresponsable citizens""",,
29038,7576,"""Let 's use your logic :""","""You mean ; let 's use a straw-man . But anyway ...""",DISAGREE,"""'s use logic :""","""let 's use a straw-man . But""",,
29040,7576,"""Let 's use your logic :""","""You mean ; let 's use a straw-man . But anyway ...""",DISAGREE,"""Let 's use your logic :""","""You mean ; let 's use a straw-man . But anyway""",,
29063,7580,"""... merely a projection of the childish wish for the protection of an all-powerful father .""","""Which would make that belief :""",DISAGREE,"""protection of an all-powerful father .""","""make that belief""",,
29073,7581,"""Your argument , I believe . The one I said does n't hold water . It appears to claim that the placing of restrictions upon items specifically designed for the killing of other human beings is somehow comparable to and a prelude for the banning of everyday items whose intended use is in no way connected to harm of others . Your title then equates this with a step towards a form of government in which one person is afforded executive , legislative and judiciary power over the country they control .""","""My article was about the banning of swords in Australia . Another step in the tyrranicle overstepping of power by a government over its people . Its called victim disarmament as the criminals that use guns , swords , cars , etc will still use these items to harm . Disarming the law abiding does nothing but flex the power of the fedgov sow .""",DISAGREE,"""Your argument , I believe .""","""My article was about the banning of swords in Australia""",,
29081,7590,"""Probably the same reason why John Kerry wo n't disclose his medical and senate attendance records . She is not going to be punished now for aborting a kid 30 years ago .""","""This is such a typical response on your part . Do n't actually respond to the post , simply deflect the attention to Kerry . Always `` yeah , but John Kerry ... `` rather than a response that actually considers the content of the post .""",DISAGREE,"""Probably the same reason why John Kerry wo n't disclose his medical and senate attendance records .""","""is such a typical on your part . Do n't actually respond to the post , simply deflect the attention to Kerry .""",,
29082,7590,"""Probably the same reason why John Kerry wo n't disclose his medical and senate attendance records . She is not going to be punished now for aborting a kid 30 years ago .""","""This is such a typical response on your part . Do n't actually respond to the post , simply deflect the attention to Kerry . Always `` yeah , but John Kerry ... `` rather than a response that actually considers the content of the post .""",DISAGREE,"""Probably the same reason why John Kerry wo n't disclose his medical and senate attendance records . She is not going to be punished now for aborting a kid 30 years ago .""","""This is such a typical on your part . Do n't actually respond to the post , simply deflect the attention to Kerry .""",,
29092,7592,"""Nopers , VT ! We all crawled out of the muck .""","""where did the muck come from ?""",DISAGREE,"""Nopers , VT ! We all crawled out of the muck .""","""where did the muck come from ?""",,
29098,7593,"""I also notice you have resorted to attacking other people 's views rather than following the topic of the thread , which is to share YOUR views .""","""yeah , that is correct .""",AGREE,"""I also notice you have resorted to attacking other people 's views rather than following the topic of the thread ,""","""yeah , that is correct .""",,
29111,7596,"""Fair enough . I 'm sorry for making such a newbie mistake . If there 's a way to delete this thread , I 'll be pursuing it . Thanks !""","""You ca n't ... only admin can ... and there 's no need to be sorry .""",DISAGREE,"""If there 's a way to delete this thread , I 'll be pursuing it .""","""You ca n't .""",,
29114,7597,"""( if anything it says life starts at birth with the first breath )""","""Like the above quote , why is the church trying to stop abortion when they would consider one to be alive after taking a breath . if you were to look at it from a scientific standpoint , the individual ovum and sperm are living cells , but they die all the time and no one cares . An embryo or fetus is something starting to develop into a human and that ca n't be stopped without killing it or injecting differnt DNA , but it 's still not too different from sperm and ovum . If you ca n't trust the church to make fair decisions and follow values and morals and rules they put in place , how can you expect an honest good decision about anything from it .""",DISAGREE,"""it says life starts at birth with the first breath""","""why is the church trying to stop abortion when they would consider one to be alive after taking a breath .""",,
29122,7600,"""http : //www.bloomberg.com/apps/news ? p ... d=awia81URdshw Who the hell is he to say the love between my partner and I of 8 years is weak ? ! It 's stronger than many heterosexual couples .""","""You forget , Popeman has the power of infallibility""",AGREE,"""Who the hell is he to say the love between my partner and I of 8 years is weak ? !""","""You forget , Popeman has the power of infallibility""",,
29150,7616,"""That is an erroneous line of reasoning because it fails to take into account the myriad of other options open to a women after birth to remove the newborn from her care without any ill effects ( physically anyway ) . Killing in the instance of a newborn is not justified because of those other options open to her .""","""Sigma I have taken into account the options a woman has after pregnancy . However , there are no doubt cases in the history of the world ( not just within America ) where there were no options available to a mother but to keep her child ( ie : the first human woman to give birth in the history of the world ) . For this pro-choice line of reasoning to be absoulutely true it must be true in every possible situation . Are you saying that the killing would be justified if no other options were available to her ?""",DISAGREE,"""Killing in the instance of a newborn is not justified""","""this pro-choice line of reasoning to be absoulutely true it must be true in every possible situation .""",,
29178,7623,"""Originally posted by FreeThinker Lurch , What do you mean there is no `` there is no evidence for a god `` ? And there is nothing surprising about my being able to think for myself and reject the religion of evolution . Both Evolution and Creation must be taken by faith .""","""Absolutely right . I 'd like to put another ticker mark on the Creationists ' side . What about the woodpecker argument ? Has anyone mentioned that yet ?""",AGREE,"""there is no evidence for a god `` ? And there is nothing surprising about my being able""","""I 'd like to put another ticker mark on the Creationists ' side""",,
29212,7630,""" “ The topic at hand was abortion , not his God. ”""","""I don ’ t know if you actually read his/her entire post but God was invoked into it . So why can ’ t I use any reference to God if they are using it ?""",DISAGREE,"""The topic at hand was abortion , not his""","""So why ’ t I use any reference to God if they are using it ?""",,
29214,7631,"""Collecting on the 150 year-old debt for assisting their rebellion against their lords and masters ....""","""I 'll ask the question that needs to be asked . If France qualifies as a `` developed nation `` as we 've been lead to believe , why did the homeowner have to resort to getting close enough that he could strangle the burglar ? Surely if you 're a developed nation , you 're not going to force your own people to put themselves in harms way while they 're in the process of saving themselves , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""Collecting debt for assisting against their lords""","""why did the homeowner have to resort strangle the burglar not force your own people to put themselves in harms way""",,
29217,7631,"""Collecting on the 150 year-old debt for assisting their rebellion against their lords and masters ....""","""I 'll ask the question that needs to be asked . If France qualifies as a `` developed nation `` as we 've been lead to believe , why did the homeowner have to resort to getting close enough that he could strangle the burglar ? Surely if you 're a developed nation , you 're not going to force your own people to put themselves in harms way while they 're in the process of saving themselves , right ?""",DISAGREE,"""150 year-old debt for assisting their rebellion against their lords and masters ....""","""Surely if you 're a developed nation , you 're not going to force your own people to put themselves in harms way while they 're in the process of saving themselves , right ?""",,
29233,7634,"""People as a whole are largely biased , uninformed , and care only about the wellbeing of the majority , persecuting the minority any chance they get . Simply put , the will of the people is too often to benefit the majority and persecute the minority , and this can be seen everywhere throughout history . The will of the people often deserves to be not only ignored but put in a little can and crushed , for the voice of the people is not the voice of the people at all ; it is the voice of the majority .""","""Yours is the voice of a bitter gay person talking , who has only seen one side of things ( probably hardship ) . But there are many good examples of the population being informed and doing things right . In fact I think typcially , the populace DOES take care of people -- I think Americans are generally pretty humanitarian people . That 's my opinion . I think the reason there has been resistance to redefine marriage is that people really know that this is not a civil rights issue , despite attempts by the gay lobby to paint it that way . I will say this though : gay people need to be treated as well as anyone else in this country and acts of violence should not be permitted . We should all be able to get along . But that does n't mean we should have to redefine marriage to do it . As I said , states have the ability to amend their constitution to protect the institution of marriage from redefinition , and 13 states have already done so -- many others are working on it . You should probably get used to it . Marriage is just too important to too many people to be redefined so easily .""",DISAGREE,"""People persecuting the minority any chance they get""","""Yours is the voice of a bitter gay person talking""",,
29251,7638,"""Third , the violinist illustration is not parallel to pregnancy because it equates a stranger/stranger relationship with a mother/child relationship . This is a key point and brings into focus the most dangerous presumption of the violinist illustration , also echoed in McDonagh 's thesis . Both presume it is unreasonable to expect a mother to have any obligations towards her own child .""","""The argument is that it is unreasonable to expect a mother to have the obligation to share her body with anyone , whether a stranger/stranger , mother/child , sister/brother , father/son , friend/friend , person/acquaintance or any combination of these .""",DISAGREE,"""Third , the violinist illustration is not parallel to pregnancy because it equates a stranger/stranger relationship with a mother/child relationship .""","""The argument is that it is unreasonable to expect a mother to have the obligation to share her body with anyone , whether a stranger/stranger , mother/child , sister/brother , father/son , friend/friend , person/acquaintance or any combination of these .""",,
29259,7639,"""So far the only proof of God 's existence by lucaspa is : `` trust me , I 'experienced ' God therefore God exists `` There is incrdible suffering and pain in this world , and I can not conceive a God who is the embodyment of goodnes , compassion , love etc , to turn a blind eye to all the suffering going on on Earth . All this nonsense about 'free will ' and God testing us , is just nonsensical attempts to reconcile the imaginary existence of God with the sad realities of our existence""","""Well , as the Christain Zealots say , `` Eve ate the apple `` .""",AGREE,"""So far the only proof of God 's existence by lucaspa is : `` trust me""","""Well , as the Christain Zealots say , `` Eve ate the apple `` .""",,
29260,7639,"""So far the only proof of God 's existence by lucaspa is : `` trust me , I 'experienced ' God therefore God exists `` There is incrdible suffering and pain in this world , and I can not conceive a God who is the embodyment of goodnes , compassion , love etc , to turn a blind eye to all the suffering going on on Earth . All this nonsense about 'free will ' and God testing us , is just nonsensical attempts to reconcile the imaginary existence of God with the sad realities of our existence""","""Well , as the Christain Zealots say , `` Eve ate the apple `` .""",AGREE,"""There is incrdible suffering""","""Well , as the Christain Zealots say , `` Eve ate the apple `` .""",,
29267,7641,"""Radical/Fundamentalist : Islam Christanity Judaism Marc9000 has asserted that evolution is a atheist tool used against religion . Therefore all religions that accept evolution , including metaphorical/liberal Abrahamic beliefs and their followers are in fact atheists . Never mind how this makes radical and fundies atheists as well . Do you agree with the logic of Marc9000 that all religions that are n't of the radical Abraham are n't religions and all of their followers are atheists ?""","""No , that is far too narrow-minded . However , I suppose that a fundamental Christian looking out from their beliefs would probably agree . Other believers might think that we do not know everything and others may have some understanding of areas where we do not""",DISAGREE,"""Do you agree with the logic of Marc9000""","""I suppose that a fundamental Christian looking out from their beliefs would probably agree .""",,
29285,7644,"""So we have , in order of humility : Agnosticism : Do n't know , ca n't know . But I have my opinion . Note : Many religious people and humanists alike fit into this category . Theism : Probably ca n't know , but does n't realize it . My `` heart/soul/essence/whatever `` tells me it is truth . Note : Often impossible to reason with . No scientifically measurable way to prove position . Atheism : Ca n't know , but thinks and says otherwise . Note : Usually angry . No scientifically measurable way to prove position .""","""You have done a marvelous job knocking down strawmen of your own construction . Having offered a naive and superficial caricature of atheism , agnosticism , and theism , you then imagine a self-serving hierarchy that is , in a word , worthless - all in a silly effort to show yourself most humble . Ironic .""",DISAGREE,"""in order of humility Ca n't know , but thinks and says otherwise .""","""and superficial caricature of atheism self-serving hierarchy show yourself most humble""",,
29334,7661,"""There is two theory 's regarding homo neadertalus one is that he is a separte creature now extint . the other is that he was a human with bigger bones . The reason the DNA is different is because is because neadertalus was much bigger , tougher , and coarser .""","""See above""",DISAGREE,"""There is two theory 's regarding homo neadertalus one is that he is a separte creature now extint .""","""See above""",,
29345,7663,"""I condemn the Wrong at every opportunity . Whackjob Nutso Drivel is a fraudulent use of the term `` news `` . The WOT is and was a hoax , but Koolade drinkers enjoy squandering the lives of others on their adventures abroad .""","""Really ? Then why have n't you condemned organizations such as the Brady Campaign ? They continually put out the lie that the .50 BMG is capable of bringing down commercial planes as if the entire process was mere child 's play , but there 's absolutely not a shred of evidence to support this claim .""",DISAGREE,"""I condemn the Wrong at every opportunity . ``""","""Really ? Then why have n't you condemned organizations such as the Brady Campaign ?""",,
29351,7664,"""This is correct . However , these rights not found in the Constitution are able to be restricted . '' And , seeing how you agree that the right to abortion is not in the Constitution , then it follows that the right to abortion can be restricted. ``""","""Just because it is n't verbally found in the Constitution does n't mean I feel that it is constitutionally irrelevant . I feel that it is . Here is my question to you ... do you understand why abortion is constitutional ?""",DISAGREE,"""However , these rights not found in the Constitution are able to be restricted .""","""Just because it is n't verbally found in the Constitution does n't mean I feel that it is constitutionally irrelevant .""",,
29353,7664,"""This is correct . However , these rights not found in the Constitution are able to be restricted . '' And , seeing how you agree that the right to abortion is not in the Constitution , then it follows that the right to abortion can be restricted. ``""","""Just because it is n't verbally found in the Constitution does n't mean I feel that it is constitutionally irrelevant . I feel that it is . Here is my question to you ... do you understand why abortion is constitutional ?""",DISAGREE,"""However , these rights not found in the Constitution are able to be restricted .""","""Just because it is n't verbally found in the Constitution does n't mean I feel that it is constitutionally irrelevant""",,
29363,7673,"""I 'm discussing what should be legal""","""In other words , you 're discussing when government should use violence . Which according to you , is a lot of the time . Especially should someone dare to defend themselves against a home invader . You really do n't see the hypocrisy in condemning someone for violence and simultaneously calling for more violence , do you ?""",DISAGREE,"""discussing what should be legal""","""Which according to you , is a lot of the time . Especially should someone dare to defend themselves against a home invader .""",,
29361,7673,"""I 'm discussing what should be legal""","""In other words , you 're discussing when government should use violence . Which according to you , is a lot of the time . Especially should someone dare to defend themselves against a home invader . You really do n't see the hypocrisy in condemning someone for violence and simultaneously calling for more violence , do you ?""",DISAGREE,"""discussing what should be legal""","""discussing when government should use violence .""",,
29386,7679,"""Talkin ' out your XXX again I see . What happens if I do not vote ? Initially the Australian Electoral Commission will write to all apparent non-voters requesting that they either provide a reason for their failure to vote or pay a $ 20 penalty . If , within 21 days , the apparent non-voter fails to reply , can not provide a valid and sufficient reason or declines to pay the penalty , then prosecution proceedings may be instigated . If the matter is dealt with in court and the person is found guilty , he or she may be fined up to $ 50 plus court costs . Voting Australia""","""So you get fined for not voting , i said you get fined for not voting yet i am talking out the back of my arse . How did you figure that ? I provided accurate information and get abused by a gun hater , i can live with that as gun haters are well known for hating facts NATO I could not agree with you more !""",DISAGREE,"""What happens if I do not vote ? Initially the Australian Electoral Commission will write to all apparent non-voters requesting""","""not the ? I""",,
29409,7690,"""I don ’ t consider the finger to be alive .""","""Take somes cells from one of you fingers and put it under a microscope .""",DISAGREE,"""I don ’ t consider the finger to be alive .""","""Take somes cells from one of you fingers and put it under a microscope .""",,
29419,7692,"""Wrong . 1 ) Science has disproven the young-earth Creationists ' God . 2 ) Science is starting to shed light on people 's spiritual beliefs .""","""I will agree science has disproven the literal reading of a number of different scriptures , such as the literal reading of Genesis ( which was never meant to be literal to begin with , but that is a different matter ) . It also might explain why spiritiual beliefs exist for people . However , when it comes to this vaguly defined entity that alledgely created the universe , science has nothing to say about the existance of this alledged supernatural being .""",DISAGREE,"""Wrong Science Creationists spiritual beliefs .""","""disproven created existance supernatural""",,
29421,7692,"""Wrong . 1 ) Science has disproven the young-earth Creationists ' God . 2 ) Science is starting to shed light on people 's spiritual beliefs .""","""I will agree science has disproven the literal reading of a number of different scriptures , such as the literal reading of Genesis ( which was never meant to be literal to begin with , but that is a different matter ) . It also might explain why spiritiual beliefs exist for people . However , when it comes to this vaguly defined entity that alledgely created the universe , science has nothing to say about the existance of this alledged supernatural being .""",DISAGREE,"""Science has disproven the young-earth Creationists ' God . 2 ) Science is starting to shed light on people 's spiritual beliefs .""","""I will agree science has disproven the literal reading of a number of different scriptures""",,
29426,7693,"""While certainly the reasons people use drugs should and must be addressed , I think it disingenuous to suggest that easy access to drugs is not part of the problem . Cutting off the supply is a justifiable goal .""","""And after 40 years of the war on drugs and drug control , just how close are we to that ? You must remove the demand for illegal drugs because as long as there is a demand there will be someone there to smuggle it , make it , or grow it and supply it .""",DISAGREE,"""While certainly the reasons people use drugs disingenuous to suggest that easy access to drugs""","""40 years of the war on drugs and drug control smuggle it , make it , or grow it and supply it .""",,
29442,7695,"""Why do n't we just ASK women who 've had abotions ... that 's all the proof you need ! I have been reading stories of women who in their own words talked about their abortion experiences .... even the ones who claim to be pro choice and still are after the abortion make statements of lingering feeling guilt and regret over having it done as well as nightmares about it . If it 's really no big deal , then why would they feel that way ?""","""So if I go out and buy a Brand X car and then regret it a year later , does that mean that nobody should be allowed to go out and buy a Brand X car ? Am I entitled to have an opinion and share it with others ... sure . However , could others purchase a Brand X car and never regret it ... absolutely . Should my negative experience be used to prevent others from engaging in something that they might consider positive ? Sounds kinda fascist to me .""",DISAGREE,"""I have been reading stories of women who in their own words talked about their abortion experiences""","""Sounds kinda fascist to me .""",,
29456,7698,"""At least now we see what passes for `` moderation `` on this board . ( That 's right , folks : you ca n't put JPS on your ignore lists , 'cuz he 's a `` moderator. `` You know , like Glen Beck on `` fair and balanced `` Fox News . )""","""Meh . Foundit66 is moderator on a different site . Nobody cares . It 's a rare case that a board could ever find a truly centrist person to moderate . If you have a problem with JP as a mod on this forum , no one 's making you participate . I do n't post on the forum Foundit mods , myself . If it 's really that big a deal to you that JP mods a forum catagory on this site , then put your money where your mouth is and do n't let the door hit you where the good Lord split you , on the way out .""",DISAGREE,"""At least now we see what passes for `` moderation `` on this board . ( That 's right , folks : you ca n't put JPS on your ignore lists , 'cuz he 's a `` moderator. `` You know , like Glen Beck on `` fair and balanced `` Fox News . )""","""It 's a rare case that a board could ever find a truly centrist person to moderate . If you have a problem with JP as a mod on this forum , no one 's making you participate . I do n't post on the forum Foundit mods , myself .""",,
29459,7698,"""At least now we see what passes for `` moderation `` on this board . ( That 's right , folks : you ca n't put JPS on your ignore lists , 'cuz he 's a `` moderator. `` You know , like Glen Beck on `` fair and balanced `` Fox News . )""","""Meh . Foundit66 is moderator on a different site . Nobody cares . It 's a rare case that a board could ever find a truly centrist person to moderate . If you have a problem with JP as a mod on this forum , no one 's making you participate . I do n't post on the forum Foundit mods , myself . If it 's really that big a deal to you that JP mods a forum catagory on this site , then put your money where your mouth is and do n't let the door hit you where the good Lord split you , on the way out .""",DISAGREE,"""At least now we see what passes for `` moderation `` on this board .""","""Nobody cares .""",,
29462,7699,"""I support your choice , as I 'd support anyone 's choice , but""","""Actually you support `` my choice `` not . - For you see , your choice of the word BUT negates your words preceding it , for one . For two , your own lack-of-understanding is causing you to feel `` disgust me , because I 'm pretty sure `` < -- what you said here , confirms the above . And Telling & amp ; transparent is : `` So you saying `` God `` is against abortion , is the same as me saying `` God `` wants me to kill non-believers and adulterers. `` Annie : only by your twisted arguments . Your entire post here , is built on one false manipulation after another . And after you managed to get yourself into this fix , no wonder the above non-sense is the best you can come up with .""",DISAGREE,"""I support your choice , as I 'd support anyone 's choice , but""","""Actually you support `` my choice `` not . - For you see , your choice of the word BUT negates your words preceding it , for""",,
29475,7701,"""You really should be careful about posting nonsense like this . If your article has any validity , it would be grounds for disarming the police , since them having access to guns would make them more violent towards the people , and more likely to kill innocent bystanders .""","""Police are probably much more aggressive than the average citizen , but most of the time their aggression is channeled against the bad guys . And do n't you find it significant that a gun , a symbol and tool of violence , can raise levels of testosterone ? What kind of effect does testosterone have on behavior ? Dogs become more friendly when testosterone is reduced in their bodies through neutering : `` One of the most important behavioral advantages of castration is that as adults , these dogs will tend to be less aggressive both toward other male dogs and also people . The androgen ( male ) hormones , of which testosterone is the most important , are responsible for the development of many behavioral patterns . When young puppies are sexually mounting their 7 and 8-week old litter mates this is because of androgen surges in their bodies . The same is true with aggressive behavior. `` Benefits of Neutering ( Castrating ) Male Dogs & amp ; Puppies""",DISAGREE,"""If your article has any validity , it would be grounds for disarming the police""","""Police are probably much more aggressive than the average citizen""",,
29480,7702,"""No one can deny that after a human being is conceived it will develop into the very same being as those debating this issue .""","""Unfortunately for this argument , nature denies this a lot of the time . Most conceptions spontaneously abort .""",DISAGREE,"""No one can deny that after a human being is conceived it will develop into the very same being as those debating this issue .""","""Unfortunately for this argument , nature denies this a lot of the time .""",,
29483,7703,"""Another lie commonly perpetuated by Creationist cranks is the fable of the Haeckel hoax . They allege that Haeckel 's theory that ontology recapitulates phylogeny was promoted even in modern biology text books by inclusion of Haeckel 's iconic , but wrong , diagram of embryological development . Thus they accuse biologists of deliberate fraud . They accuse them of doing what they do so often themselves . One of the Creationist icons is Jonathan Wells , who devotes a chapter of his mendacious book , Icons of Evolution , to the longevity of Haeckel diagram . Are his claims accurate ? Not very . Here 's what TalkOrigins has to say about what little is true about Wells 's claims : This quote is from : Wells and Haeckel 's Embryos The rest of this extensive commentary explains what is wrong with Wells 's claims . The author concludes : One can fault some biology text books for not clearly explaining the context of Haeckel 's diagram . It was neither accurate nor entirely objective . It was misleading . However , one can not fault them for perpetuating Haeckel 's theories themselves . They do n't . They present current data in support of evolution , data that no Creationist dare read for fear of losing their immortal souls . That does n't depend on Haeckel . So as ever , the Creationist motto : Per Ardua Ad Ignoratia . Forever .""","""And yet , here his drawings are used , as plain as day in a 2002 text book to teach evolution . You can choose to just ignore evidence you do n't like lesz , but that does n't make it go away . Evolution News & amp ; Views : The Textbooks Don ? t Lie : Haeckel ? s Faked Drawings Have Been Used to Promote Evolution : Raven & amp ; Johnson ( 2002 ) ( Part 2 ) When will you people learn that since Talk Origins exists to defend the fraudulent pseudo science of evolution , it stands to reason that all it does is perpetuate lies and misinformation !""",DISAGREE,"""lie commonly perpetuated fable of the Haeckel hoax .""","""here his drawings are used teach evolution""",,
29523,7710,"""Later in a statement Ridgway said that murdering young women was his `` career `` .""","""The man seemed have a thing about prostitutes . I believe he felt it was his God-given destiny to punish them . Cybererratus is a very interesting persona . He manifests a number of very interesting character traits . I do n't believe that he likes women very much . In fact , I am rather concerned about how Cybererratus feels about women . Andrea Yates was certifiably insane and her killing of her children had nothing to do with post partum depression . And , she is being punished . She is serving life in prison -- as is Mr. Ridgway . I also find the comparisons that Cybererratus makes to be morally troubling .""",AGREE,"""Later in a statement Ridgway said that murdering young women was his `` career `` .""","""She is serving life in prison""",,
29522,7710,"""Later in a statement Ridgway said that murdering young women was his `` career `` .""","""The man seemed have a thing about prostitutes . I believe he felt it was his God-given destiny to punish them . Cybererratus is a very interesting persona . He manifests a number of very interesting character traits . I do n't believe that he likes women very much . In fact , I am rather concerned about how Cybererratus feels about women . Andrea Yates was certifiably insane and her killing of her children had nothing to do with post partum depression . And , she is being punished . She is serving life in prison -- as is Mr. Ridgway . I also find the comparisons that Cybererratus makes to be morally troubling .""",AGREE,"""said that murdering young women was his `` career `` .""","""he felt it was his God-given destiny to punish them .""",,
29542,7712,"""A . Guns save more lives than they take ; prevent more injuries than they inflict * Guns used 2.5 million times a year in self-defense . Law-abiding citizens use guns to defend themselves against criminals as many as 2.5 million times every year -- or about 6,850 times a day.1 This means that each year , firearms are used more than 80 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.2 * Of the 2.5 million times citizens use their guns to defend themselves every year , the overwhelming majority merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers . Less than 8 % of the time , a citizen will kill or wound his/her attacker.3 * As many as 200,000 women use a gun every year to defend themselves against sexual abuse.4 * Even anti-gun Clinton researchers concede that guns are used 1.5 million times annually for self-defense . According to the Clinton Justice Department , there are as many as 1.5 million cases of self-defense every year . The National Institute of Justice published this figure in 1997 as part of `` Guns in America `` -- a study which was authored by noted anti-gun criminologists Philip Cook and Jens Ludwig.5 * Armed citizens kill more crooks than do the police . Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as police do every year ( 1,527 to 606 ) .6 And readers of Newsweek learned that `` only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal . The 'error rate ' for the police , however , was 11 percent , more than five times as high . '' 7 * Handguns are the weapon of choice for self-defense . Citizens use handguns to protect themselves over 1.9 million times a year.8 Many of these self-defense handguns could be labeled as `` Saturday Night Specials. `` B . Concealed carry laws help reduce crime * Nationwide : one-half million self-defense uses . Every year , as many as one-half million citizens defend themselves with a firearm away from home.9 * Concealed carry laws are dropping crime rates across the country . A comprehensive national study determined in 1996 that violent crime fell after states made it legal to carry concealed firearms . The results of the study showed : * States which passed concealed carry laws reduced their murder rate by 8.5 % , rapes by 5 % , aggravated assaults by 7 % and robbery by 3 % ; 10 and * If those states not having concealed carry laws had adopted such laws in 1992 , then approximately 1,570 murders , 4,177 rapes , 60,000 aggravated assaults and over 11,000 robberies would have been avoided yearly.11 * Vermont : one of the safest five states in the country . In Vermont , citizens can carry a firearm without getting permission ... without paying a fee ... or without going through any kind of government-imposed waiting period . And yet for ten years in a row , Vermont has remained one of the top-five , safest states in the union -- having three times received the `` Safest State Award . '' 12 * Florida : concealed carry helps slash the murder rates in the state . In the fifteen years following the passage of Florida 's concealed carry law in 1987 , over 800,000 permits to carry firearms were issued to people in the state.13 FBI reports show that the homicide rate in Florida , which in 1987 was much higher than the national average , fell 52 % during that 15-year period -- thus putting the Florida rate below the national average . 14 * Do firearms carry laws result in chaos ? No . Consider the case of Florida . A citizen in the Sunshine State is far more likely to be attacked by an alligator than to be assaulted by a concealed carry holder . 1 . During the first fifteen years that the Florida law was in effect , alligator attacks outpaced the number of crimes committed by carry holders by a 229 to 155 margin . 2 . And even the 155 `` crimes `` committed by concealed carry permit holders are somewhat misleading as most of these infractions resulted from Floridians who accidentally carried their firearms into restricted areas , such as an airport.15 C. Criminals avoid armed citizens * Kennesaw , GA . In 1982 , this suburb of Atlanta passed a law requiring heads of households to keep at least one firearm in the house . The residential burglary rate subsequently dropped 89 % in Kennesaw , compared to the modest 10.4 % drop in Georgia as a whole.16 * Ten years later ( 1991 ) , the residential burglary rate in Kennesaw was still 72 % lower than it had been in 1981 , before the law was passed.17 * Nationwide . Statistical comparisons with other countries show that burglars in the United States are far less apt to enter an occupied home than their foreign counterparts who live in countries where fewer civilians own firearms . Consider the following rates showing how often a homeowner is present when a burglar strikes : * Homeowner occupancy rate in the gun control countries of Great Britain , Canada and Netherlands : 45 % ( average of the three countries ) ; and , * Homeowner occupancy rate in the United States : 12.7 % .18 Rapes averted when women carry or use firearms for protection * Orlando , FL . In 1966-67 , the media highly publicized a safety course which taught Orlando women how to use guns . The result : Orlando 's rape rate dropped 88 % in 1967 , whereas the rape rate remained constant in the rest of Florida and the nation.19 * Nationwide . In 1979 , the Carter Justice Department found that of more than 32,000 attempted rapes , 32 % were actually committed . But when a woman was armed with a gun or knife , only 3 % of the attempted rapes were actually successful.20 Justice Department study : * 3/5 of felons polled agreed that `` a criminal is not going to mess around with a victim he knows is armed with a gun . '' 21 * 74 % of felons polled agreed that `` one reason burglars avoid houses when people are at home is that they fear being shot during the crime . '' 22 * 57 % of felons polled agreed that `` criminals are more worried about meeting an armed victim than they are about running into the police . '' 23 -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- 1 Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz , `` Armed Resistance to Crime : The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense With a Gun , `` 86 The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology , Northwestern University School of Law , 1 ( Fall 1995 ) :164 . Dr. Kleck is a professor in the school of criminology and criminal justice at Florida State University in Tallahassee . He has researched extensively and published several essays on the gun control issue . His book , Point Blank : Guns and Violence in America , has become a widely cited source in the gun control debate . In fact , this book earned Dr. Kleck the prestigious American Society of Criminology Michael J. Hindelang award for 1993 . This award is given for the book published in the past two to three years that makes the most outstanding contribution to criminology . Even those who do n't like the conclusions Dr. Kleck reaches , can not argue with his impeccable research and methodology . In `` A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed , `` Marvin E. Wolfgang writes that , `` What troubles me is the article by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz . The reason I am troubled is that they have provided an almost clear-cut case of methodologically sound research in support of something I have theoretically opposed for years , namely , the use of a gun in defense against a criminal perpetrator .... I have to admit my admiration for the care and caution expressed in this article and this research . Can it be true that about two million instances occur each year in which a gun was used as a defensive measure against crime ? It is hard to believe . Yet , it is hard to challenge the data collected . We do not have contrary evidence. `` Wolfgang , `` A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed , `` The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology , at 188 . Wolfgang says there is no `` contrary evidence. `` Indeed , there are more than a dozen national polls -- one of which was conducted by The Los Angeles Times -- that have found figures comparable to the Kleck-Gertz study . Even the Clinton Justice Department ( through the National Institute of Justice ) found there were as many as 1.5 million defensive users of firearms every year . See National Institute of Justice , `` Guns in America : National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms , `` Research in Brief ( May 1997 ) . As for Dr. Kleck , readers of his materials may be interested to know that he is a member of the ACLU , Amnesty International USA , and Common Cause . He is not and has never been a member of or contributor to any advocacy group on either side of the gun control debate . 2 According to the National Safety Council , the total number of gun deaths ( by accidents , suicides and homicides ) account for less than 30,000 deaths per year . See Injury Facts , published yearly by the National Safety Council , Itasca , Illinois . 3Kleck and Gertz , `` Armed Resistance to Crime , `` at 173 , 185 . 4Kleck and Gertz , `` Armed Resistance to Crime , `` at 185 . 5 Philip J. Cook and Jens Ludwig , `` Guns in America : National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms , `` NIJ Research in Brief ( May 1997 ) ; available at http : //www.ncjrs.org/txtfiles/165476.txt on the internet . The finding of 1.5 million yearly self-defense cases did not sit well with the anti-gun bias of the study 's authors , who attempted to explain why there could not possibly be one and a half million cases of self-defense every year . Nevertheless , the 1.5 million figure is consistent with a mountain of independent surveys showing similar figures . The sponsors of these studies -- nearly a dozen -- are quite varied , and include anti-gun organizations , news media organizations , governments and commercial polling firms . See also Kleck and Gertz , supra note 1 , pp . 182-183 . 6Kleck , Point Blank : Guns and Violence in America , ( 1991 ) :111-116 , 148 . 7George F. Will , `` Are We ' a Nation of Cowards ' ? , `` Newsweek ( 15 November 1993 ) :93 . 8Id . at 164 , 185 . 9Dr . Gary Kleck , interview with J. Neil Schulman , `` Q and A : Guns , crime and self-defense , `` The Orange County Register ( 19 September 1993 ) . In the interview with Schulman , Dr. Kleck reports on findings from a national survey which he and Dr. Marc Gertz conducted in Spring , 1993 -- a survey which findings were reported in Kleck and Gertz , `` Armed Resistance to Crime. `` br > 10 One of the authors of the University of Chicago study reported on the study 's findings in John R. Lott , Jr. , `` More Guns , Less Violent Crime , `` The Wall Street Journal ( 28 August 1996 ) . See also John R. Lott , Jr. and David B. Mustard , `` Crime , Deterrence , and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns , `` University of Chicago ( 15 August 1996 ) ; and Lott , More Guns , Less Crime ( 1998 , 2000 ) . 11Lott and Mustard , `` Crime , Deterrence , and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns. `` 12Kathleen O'Leary Morgan , Scott Morgan and Neal Quitno , `` Rankings of States in Most Dangerous/Safest State Awards 1994 to 2003 , `` Morgan Quitno Press ( 2004 ) at http : //www.statestats.com/dang9403.htm . Morgan Quitno Press is an independent private research and publishing company which was founded in 1989 . The company specializes in reference books and monthly reports that compare states and cities in several different subject areas . In the first 10 years in which they published their Safest State Award , Vermont has consistently remained one of the top five safest states . 13Memo by Jim Smith , Secretary of State , Florida Department of State , Division of Licensing , Concealed Weapons/Firearms License Statistical Report ( October 1 , 2002 ) . 14Florida 's murder rate was 11.4 per 100,000 in 1987 , but only 5.5 in 2002 . Compare Federal Bureau of Investigation , `` Crime in the United States , `` Uniform Crime Reports , ( 1988 ) : 7 , 53 ; and FBI , ( 2003 ) :19 , 79 . 15 John R. Lott , Jr. , `` Right to carry would disprove horror stories , `` Kansas City Star , ( July 12 , 2003 ) . 16Gary Kleck , `` Crime Control Through the Private Use of Armed Force , `` Social Problems 35 ( February 1988 ) :15 . 17Compare Kleck , `` Crime Control , `` at 15 , and Chief Dwaine L. Wilson , City of Kennesaw Police Department , `` Month to Month Statistics : 1991. `` ( Residential burglary rates from 1981-1991 are based on statistics for the months of March - October . ) 18Kleck , Point Blank , at 140 . 19Kleck , `` Crime Control , `` at 13 . 20U.S . Department of Justice , Law Enforcement Assistance Administration , Rape Victimization in 26 American Cities ( 1979 ) , p. 31 . 21U.S. , Department of Justice , National Institute of Justice , `` The Armed Criminal in America : A Survey of Incarcerated Felons , `` Research Report ( July 1985 ) : 27 . 22Id . 23Id .""","""http : //www.gunowners.org/sk0802.htm""",DISAGREE,"""Guns save more lives than they take `` ''""","""http : //www.gunowners.org/sk0802.htm""",,
29545,7713,"""Like evolution , right ? You have your conclusion , so everything else must adhere to it . Just answer the question . How to you account for the statements above ?""","""As a child I took the existence of God as a given . For the life of me I ca n't understand how so many believers discount the life experience of non-believers . I never set out to abandon God . I simply can not believe based on what I have learned in my life . I suspect my story is not unique . I have seen the same `` evidence `` and have heard the same arguments my whole life . I am not `` in league `` with you know who nor am I deluding myself just to prop up science for its own sake . I wanted something to believe in that did not require me to deny that which is before my eyes and that which could be logically explained and/or observed . The fact of evolution is a conclusion based on scientific study and fits the evidence . As far as your scriptural quotes , as I have said , you are reading in science when only prose exists . The fact of creation is a conclusion based on mythology and faith .""",DISAGREE,"""Like evolution , right ? You have your conclusion , so everything else must adhere to it .""","""As a child I took the existence of God as a given . For the life of me I ca n't understand how so many believers discount the life experience of non-believers . I never set out to abandon ``""",,
29547,7713,"""Like evolution , right ? You have your conclusion , so everything else must adhere to it . Just answer the question . How to you account for the statements above ?""","""As a child I took the existence of God as a given . For the life of me I ca n't understand how so many believers discount the life experience of non-believers . I never set out to abandon God . I simply can not believe based on what I have learned in my life . I suspect my story is not unique . I have seen the same `` evidence `` and have heard the same arguments my whole life . I am not `` in league `` with you know who nor am I deluding myself just to prop up science for its own sake . I wanted something to believe in that did not require me to deny that which is before my eyes and that which could be logically explained and/or observed . The fact of evolution is a conclusion based on scientific study and fits the evidence . As far as your scriptural quotes , as I have said , you are reading in science when only prose exists . The fact of creation is a conclusion based on mythology and faith .""",DISAGREE,"""You have your conclusion""","""conclusion based on mythology and faith""",,
29556,7714,"""trebor : Katrine is being particularly unkind to Alabama .""","""OH MY GOD ! ! ! I JUST REALIZED ... I 'M TO BLAME ! My letter to the editor was printed in Sunday 's newspaper and Sunday night the storms started hitting the south ! That can not be coincidence . God has lifted his protecting hand because of my letter . But seriously , 3 people I ran into today told me they saw it . Two were people at work : one just said she read it without saying how she felt about it , the other went a bit farther to say that it really did n't offend her . But if you think about it , just her comment indicates that she felt that the way most people would respond would be negatively . The other person was my dentist , who I just happened to have an appointment with today . He starting talking at great length about Hugh Ross , and Gerald Shroeder , and how his own personal faith in Jesus and science get along just fine . I listened for about 15 minutes , only saying a few things now and then . And when I did , I did n't argue against his position ... I just pointed out that people really have to accept that evolution is true and that the Earth is billions of years old , which he had already said he accepted .""",DISAGREE,"""Katrine is being particularly unkind to Alabama .""","""I 'M TO BLAME ! God has lifted his protecting hand because of my letter""",,
29566,7716,"""No , there really are n't . As for Robertson , why do you think I said he was right ( as in global warming is happening and we are largely responsible ) by sheer luck ?""","""Yes , there ARE good scientists on both sides of the issue -- you 've been shown this before already in another thread , as I recall .""",DISAGREE,"""No , there really are n't""","""Yes , there ARE""",,
29577,7720,"""Archangel fails to understand the basis of Animism ( as usual ) . Animism seeks to explain things it can not by assigning them supernatural associations . Often that is done through a soul . The principle argument I 've argued in their similarities is that of why they do such a thing . What can not be explained now or its relation to the greater whole is credited to a supernatural being , a being or set of beings that exists not entirely of the natural world . Where ancient animists believed that lightning was associated with the Gods , and that Volcanoes were the manifestation of Pele , the principle is the same . What can not be explained or understood now is of a higher being . How did this rock get here ? Where did deer come from ? How do they exist in the larger picture ? Animists assign souls , or anima to the inanimate and animate objects as a way to place what they do not understand into a coherent organized picture . Intelligent design is no different . Only that it has replaced lightning , volcanoes and rain with the human eye and origin of the life . While it may not use the same identical concepts of anima to inanimate object , the core logic is identical . What is too complex to understand or explain now is of a higher being .""","""Oh , I see now , you must pervert and completely redefine what animism is in order to apply it to your corruption of what christianity is according to the bible . I have accurately defined what animism is above in comparison to the Old and New Testament which it has nothing in common with . But in usual fashion you will claim it is me who does n't understand when it is you who must corrupt the truth with the lies and distortions you tell . BTW , your explanation above which I have posted in its entirety is nothing more than self indulgent gibberish . http : //www.religion-cults.com/Ancien ... sm/Animism.htm Do IDers actually want Intelligent Design taught in schools ?""",DISAGREE,"""Archangel to the of Animism ( as usual ) . Animism to explain it can not by them supernatural . Often that is done through a soul . be explained""","""Oh , I see now , you and redefine animism is in order to apply it to your of the . I have what animism is above comparison""",,
29597,7725,"""Would depend on how sucessful they thought the handing in was , but do n't you have to register for a leicence ? So all legal owners are know already and can be checked off against the guns they have handed in , I would imagine that there must be departments of the police who deal with tracking black market unregisted guns so these could be cracked down opon . In addition you would have to make possesion of a firearm illegal , then you have to balance defending your property with revealing you are commiting a crime ( will be fairly obvious if you use one and you would have to get rid of it anyway when forensics investigate the crime scene ) . Would also have to look at countries that have carried out sucessful ones to see if there are any little points or mistakes to pick up . If there is a lot of resistance you could make possesion of a gun attempted murder , would make people think very carefully whether they would want to carry them , especailly criminals- comunity service or light sentace for a mugging or long term prison sentance for attempted murder if they are carrying a gun while doing it , even in bank robbery they would likely think twice about the additional years .""","""Register for a license ? ? ? ? What do you meen ? I have quite a few firearms and have never registered for a license for any of them .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't you have to register for a leicence ?""","""Register for a license ? ? ? ? What do you meen ? I have quite a few firearms and have never registered for a license for any of them .""",,
29599,7726,"""WHAT ? I do n't see anything regarding that . Seriously , what are you talking about ?""","""Look again .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't see anything regarding that .""","""Look again .""",,
29612,7729,"""Over 10,000 signatures of Christian Clergy have been collected , and have endorsed this letter .""","""Well , then . They 're not TROO christians . Just ask a certain poster on this board . When I told this certain poster that I have known several clergymen from several Christian denominations who accepted evolutionary theory , that 's what he told me . That certain poster and others would rather claim Newton , who was an arian , as a christian rather than clergymen who accept the divinity of Christ . Those clergy just understand both science and religion better .""",DISAGREE,"""Christian Clergy have been collected""","""They 're not TROO christians""",,
29622,7732,"""I realize this . But I have n't heard of breaking research in areas like growing crops in deserts , or re-purifying urine . I would think that if the world is truly as over-populated as you make it out to be , we would be desperate for technologies like these .""","""Well , the areas which might want these technologies do n't really have research facilities on every block .""",DISAGREE,"""we would be desperate for technologies like these .""","""the areas which might want these technologies do n't really have research facilities on every block .""",,
29625,7733,"""There is no evidence for a distant shell of cometary material surrounding the solar system , and there is no known way to add comets to the solar system at rates that even remotely balance their destruction .""","""Actually , there is . Well over 200 trans-Neptunian objects have been directly imaged by various means . All but Pluto have been found since 1992 , and way over half have been found since 1998 . I notice that of your references , one was published early in the year that the first ( third if you count Pluto and Charon ) was discovered , another was published two years later , and the third was published in 1974 ( ! ) . MY GOD ! ! 1974 ! I also notice that none of them have anything to do with comet origin .""",DISAGREE,"""surrounding the solar system ,""","""trans-Neptunian objects have been directly imaged by various""",,
29626,7734,"""Hey Penfold , I have to agree with Issly , because it has already been done here . It happened in New Orleans during catrina , the only difference is what Happened in New Orleans never went nationwide as it will if Obama is elected . The NRA called Obama up and invited him to go on a bear hunt , Obama agreed to go but said he wanted nothing to do with a gun though , Obama said he would only be an observer of the bear being hunted . The NRA then asked Obama if he went unarmed and found himself face to face with an angry bear how he would handle the situation , Obama replied `` I will enter into direct peace negotiations with the bear , if that fails I will place sanctions on him . People who support obama are like sheep being led to slaughter . You better wake up and do the background research on Obama before you make the biggest mistake of your life by voting for that XXXXX . You can view the New Orleans gun confiscation video on you tube or the NRA web-site either one .""","""Why is the bear angry ?""",DISAGREE,"""go on a bear hunt""","""the bear angry""",,
29659,7753,"""I do n't see how you logically derive this conclusion from what I said . Can you elaborate ?""","""If you believe that it is the development of thinking ability that makes a human count as a life with rights , it seems reasonable to think that people with superior thinking ability would have superior rights .""",DISAGREE,"""you""","""If you believe that it is the development of thinking ability that makes a human count as a life with rights""",,
29683,7765,"""Bias in action .""","""Only a profetallifer would look upon scientific evidence as bias . Then again , there IS a bias here ; it 's a bias in favor of science over sheer emotionalism . We understand that this represents a radical break from the past eight years , but you will just have to adapt .""",DISAGREE,"""Bias in action .""","""Only a profetallifer would look upon scientific evidence as bias .""",,
29690,7766,"""3 ) Pat has a condition called `` chimerism `` which is the result of two zygotes becoming fused during development in the womb - somewhat like siamese twins , but the two sets of genetically-distinct cell populations in the body are highly integrated . In Pat 's case each zygote was of a different sex and as a result , Pat is not only made-up of two genetically distinct people , but one of them is male and the other female . Pat 's brain is composed of the female cell line and decides to undergo medical treatment that would remove the male genitalia from the male person in Pat 's body and replace those areas with female physical features . Should the government step-in to prevent this operation in order to protect the male person that is part of , but distict from Pat ?""","""So Pat is an example of gonadal dysgenesis ( or an intersexual . ) Are you sure it is correct to describe this condition as being `` made-up of two genetically distinct people `` ? Is is not the case that Pat is one genetically distinct person made up of two complete chromosome sets ?""",DISAGREE,"""Pat has a condition called `` chimerism `` which is the result of two zygotes becoming fused during development in the womb - somewhat like siamese twins , but the two sets of genetically-distinct cell populations in the body are highly integrated .""","""Are you sure it is correct to describe this condition as being `` made-up of two genetically distinct people `` ?""",,
29691,7766,"""3 ) Pat has a condition called `` chimerism `` which is the result of two zygotes becoming fused during development in the womb - somewhat like siamese twins , but the two sets of genetically-distinct cell populations in the body are highly integrated . In Pat 's case each zygote was of a different sex and as a result , Pat is not only made-up of two genetically distinct people , but one of them is male and the other female . Pat 's brain is composed of the female cell line and decides to undergo medical treatment that would remove the male genitalia from the male person in Pat 's body and replace those areas with female physical features . Should the government step-in to prevent this operation in order to protect the male person that is part of , but distict from Pat ?""","""So Pat is an example of gonadal dysgenesis ( or an intersexual . ) Are you sure it is correct to describe this condition as being `` made-up of two genetically distinct people `` ? Is is not the case that Pat is one genetically distinct person made up of two complete chromosome sets ?""",DISAGREE,"""Pat is not only made-up of two genetically distinct people , but one of them is male and the other female .""","""Are you sure it is correct to describe this condition as being `` made-up of two genetically distinct people `` ?""",,
29702,7767,"""It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man `` when you realised that the pseudo-scientific criticism of evolution was just making you look like XXXXXX ?""",DISAGREE,"""It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man `` when you realised that the pseudo-scientific criticism of evolution was just making you look like XXXXXX ?""",,
29705,7767,"""It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man `` when you realised that the pseudo-scientific criticism of evolution was just making you look like XXXXXX ?""",DISAGREE,"""evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man ``""",,
29709,7767,"""It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man `` when you realised that the pseudo-scientific criticism of evolution was just making you look like XXXXXX ?""",DISAGREE,"""It implies that `` evolution `` ( the branch that declares that the book of Genesis is false )""","""You mean the branch that you and other creationists created as a `` straw man""",,
29718,7768,"""Finally , Wells details how Darwinists have succeeded in imposing a government-supported monopoly on the biological sciences in this country -- and how opponents of Darwinism are being driven from their careers by Darwinist heresy-hunters .""","""So says Wells , who received a Ph.D. in biology despite being a fundy creationist , and is now a fellow at the Disco Institute . Can you believe what this guy is trying to get away with ?""",DISAGREE,"""Wells details how Darwinists have succeeded in imposing a government-supported monopoly on the biological sciences in this country""","""So says Wells , who received a Ph.D. in biology despite being a fundy creationist""",,
29735,7770,"""I dont care how many frauds you can copy paste and quote .""","""And I do n't think Doc cares how many points you can dismiss with a one-liner . BTW if you want to comment on fraudulent sources , stop citing the Brady Campaign or the VPC as your excuse for evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""I dont care how many frauds you can copy paste and quote .""","""And I do n't think Doc cares how many points you can dismiss with a one-liner .""",,
29742,7770,"""I dont care how many frauds you can copy paste and quote .""","""And I do n't think Doc cares how many points you can dismiss with a one-liner . BTW if you want to comment on fraudulent sources , stop citing the Brady Campaign or the VPC as your excuse for evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""I dont care how many frauds you can copy paste and quote .""","""I do n't think Doc cares how many points you can dismiss with a one-liner""",,
29755,7788,"""`` What I find most interesting `` is to consider a humanity purged of the chronic scourge of rabid religion . How much more pleasant , and saner would the world be . And how many Indigenous peoples around the planet would have continued to survive and thrive unmolested by what i consider the evilest of all manmade plagues , religion .""","""But the question is Can you prove your belief system is true ? And all you 've done is spew hate for religion but have n't even tried to actually answer the question . And ask yourself this . If the idea of God is such a man made plague , then God does n't even exist right ? So if God does n't exist then what has He done to you to make you so venomous and angry at him ? Why would you be so angry at a non existent being ? I challenge you to come up with a rational answer .""",DISAGREE,"""a humanity purged of the chronic scourge of rabid religion""","""idea of God is such a man made plague , then God does n't even exist right""",,
29761,7791,"""When the citizens are allowed to vote for a ban on same-sex marriage , and it passes alarmingly , in some instances by a 70 % margin , how can people fight to try and get it repealed ? All of the 11 initiatives passed by at least 10 % , and I think 8 of them also banned civil unions . With this alarming margin of appeal , why are gays still trying to fight this ? Some times you ca n't have everything the way you want it . What 's next ... do we try and have the results of the election reversed because some people did n't like the outcome ? Stop whining and move somewhere where it 's legal to get married to another guy and stop trying to impose your way of life on people everywhere .""","""Yes Joe , please quit trying to impose your way of life on us . The majority of americans are against this sort of behavior , yet you continue to try to impose this aberrant behavior on the rest of society . We dont want any part of it .""",DISAGREE,"""When the citizens are allowed to vote for a ban on same-sex marriage , and it passes alarmingly , in some instances by a 70 % margin , how can people fight to try and get it repealed ?""","""please quit trying to impose your way of life on us . The majority of americans are against this sort of behavior ,""",,
29764,7792,"""I am NOT going to spend the next 3 months of my life teaching you basic biology so I can get you to the point where you would understand how many errors and bone headed questions you asked in your OP .""","""Just three months . Man you have to be the best biology teacher in the world . Where did you learn to pull off a miracle like that ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am NOT going to spend the next 3 months of my life teaching you basic biology so I can get you to the point where you would understand how many errors and bone headed questions you asked in your OP .""","""Just three months . Man you have to be the best biology teacher in the world . Where did you learn to pull off a miracle like that ?""",,
29776,7795,"""Can you show me where God promises a perfect life ?""","""What kind of God creates a world in which rapists , killers , terrorists go free ? Or third world countries in which people are lucky to get one meal a day ?""",DISAGREE,"""Can you show me where God promises a perfect life ?""","""What kind of God creates a world in which rapists , killers , terrorists go free ? Or third world countries in which people are lucky to get one meal a day ?""",,
29785,7797,"""aswell as the socialogical aspects of how conveniant religion is huh ? if your nice and stay orderly youll exist for eternity in heaven ( wow that sounds like a pretty sweet deal )""","""How has the 'convenience ' of a religion disprove the existence of God ? What sociological aspects are you referring to ? Are these the same forces that make anti-religious feeling more 'convenient today ?""",DISAGREE,"""as the socialogical aspects of how conveniant religion is huh ? if your nice and stay orderly youll exist for eternity in heaven""","""How has the 'convenience ' of a religion disprove the existence of God ?""",,
29807,7804,"""Hi Rogue , This is simply false . Rock can be folded under pressure . This has been proven by lab experiment . However there are many features in sedimentary rocks that can not be formed quickly , for example , fossil trackways . This is false . http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/polystrate/trees.html I 'm not sure what you 're talking about here . Go on . There are flood stories carried by many cultures , however they do n't match in the details with noah flood myth . Not one mentions noah by name . Reference please . The Grand canyon could not have been created by a flood event , the geology is all wrong : http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/icr-science.html The flood explains nothing which can not be explained by other , better-supported means and directly contradicts vast swathes of evidence : Biodivesity and the fossil record are not consistent with the flood . Genetic profiling is not consistent with the flood ( in humans and animals ) The Ark could not hold all animal life . A global mark would have left marks across the entire globe at a consistent time period ; these marks are not found .""","""I think that what you two are doing is simply trading evidences . Saying someone is 'wrong ' and directing them to a atheist web-site is not proof . You should merely be saying , 'here is an alternative argument' I say this because I can access a number of science posts that state the exact opposite of what you say , and show that they can find evidence for a flood .""",DISAGREE,"""The flood explains nothing which can not be explained by other , better-supported means and directly contradicts vast swathes of evidence : Biodivesity and the fossil record are not consistent with the flood .""","""can access a number of science posts that state the exact opposite of what you say , and show that they can find evidence for a flood .""",,
29823,7808,"""I do have some interest in the topic of viability though , so if you could perhaps explain what you are saying , I would be interested in discussing the topic with you .""","""What is it ? Exactly""",DISAGREE,"""if you could perhaps explain what you are saying , I would be interested in discussing""","""What is it ? Exactly""",,
29827,7809,"""Abortion is n't a legal crime . How ever , in all other ways , it certainly is a crime . I think the moderator should move this to abortion discussion .""","""If it 's not illegal * , it 's not a crime , by definition . Can we stipulate that while it is not illegal in most countries under most circumstances , it is indeed immoral ? * Or the president does it .""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion is n't a legal crime . How ever , in all other ways , it certainly is a crime""","""If it 's not illegal * , it 's not a crime , by definition .""",,
29836,7811,"""Then explain to me why a pregnant woman was hit by a car not long ago leading to the death of both mother and baby . Resulting in a double vehicular homicide charge being leveled against the driver ? How can that be if the unborn child does n't have rights as a human being ? And why could the mother have aborted that baby legally if she chose to ? Is n't that a true catch 22 for the unborn , and a contradiction in the law ?""","""Because that the law one has to presume and of course the law applied to that specific case . As to it being contradictory - well the law is loaded with contradictions if you look at all closely . On the other hand consider that the driver killed the woman AND obviously damaged her fetus beyond recovery - WITHOUT the consent of the woman . In other words the death of the fetus was not by consent of the person who holds the right to decide but rather by the negligence or intent of the guilty party . And yes prior to her death ( assumming all other requirements were met ) she could have AT HER CHOICE and UN-COERCED have chosen to abort the fetus without incurring a legal penalty . But that would of course be much different .""",DISAGREE,"""unborn child does n't have rights as a human being ? true catch 22 ,""","""damaged her fetus beyond recovery - WITHOUT the consent of the woman death of the fetus was not by consent""",,
29837,7812,"""I do ask you to question the belief because of the makeup of the female in God ’ s scheme of things and undue burden legislation would put on a woman . I think that Alan Simpson , Conservative Republican of Wyoming said it best when he said ,  “ Not only shouldn ’ t men have a vote on the issue , they should keep their mouths shut. ”""","""Just because a woman is made to bear children does n't mean she has some God given right to abort her child . I do n't think you can support this view with God 's word . -theo""",DISAGREE,"""Not only shouldn ’ t men have a vote on the issue , they should keep their mouths""","""does n't mean she has some God given right to abort her child""",,
29844,7820,"""Where were the French on D-Day and the Normandy Invasion when Hitler was burglering their Nation ? I do n't recall history mentioning a Frenchman around but the Americans were saving their rears once again ...""","""Are you really this historically ignorant ? Free French Forces - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia French Resistance - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't recall history mentioning a Frenchman around""","""Free French Forces""",,
29849,7821,"""For example , it 's widely accepted that Judaism did not arise in a cultural vacuum , but that the ancient Hebrews borrowed theology and mythology from the Canaanites , Babylonians , and Persians .""","""And from the Egyptians . I was skimming through a book last night called `` 101 Myths of the Bible `` ( IIRC ) that explained how the Creation myth in Genesis ( and many other myths in the Bible ) was a modified form of Egyptian ( and possibly , Bablylonian , etc . - I ca n't remember ) mythologies .""",AGREE,"""For example , it 's widely accepted that Judaism did not arise in a cultural vacuum , but that the ancient Hebrews borrowed theology and mythology from the Canaanites , Babylonians , and Persians .""","""And from the Egyptians . I was skimming through a book last night called `` 101 Myths of the Bible `` ( IIRC ) that explained how the Creation myth in Genesis ( and many other myths in the Bible ) was a modified form of Egyptian ( and possibly , Bablylonian , etc . - I ca n't remember ) mythologies .""",,
29856,7822,"""It is when you rely on them to determine what is to be right and wrong in other people 's lives . Since you are heterosexual and have rallied against gay rights/gay marriage you have done this and are therefore imposing your religion on others .""","""Are you too blind and hypocritical to appreciate that your attempts to impose your amoral and unethical world view on we traditional moralists via the legislative activism you participate in , is doing precisely what you are accusing me of doing ? Why is it ok for your side to determine what is right for society but when I offer my vote/opinion , I am imposing something evil on you ? And why do you people constantly assert how tolerant you are and how intolerant we are when you have absolutely no tolerance for our position regarding the immoral and perverse lifestyle you defend ? Where is my right to disagree with you secular humanists whose immorality has led us down the slippery slope of social chaos our society finds itself in today ? Here 's one example of what I mean . What is a `` rainbow party `` ? I overheard my daughter saying she is going to attend another one . Is this something I should be concerned about ? Best Answer - Chosen by Asker The girls wear different colored lipstick and take turns performing oral sex on the boys -- leaving a rainbow of colors on the the boys ' private parts . Watch the movie `` Thirteen `` ( Thirteen ( 2003 ) ) and get more involved in the life of your daughter ( and other kids if you have any ) ! There is no pleading ignorance on this one ... this information is readily out there , and has been for a few years . Children only learn what they are taught , so it is up to us , the parents , to be actively involved in their lives AND to be aware of what 's in the popular culture that they are learning from their peers and the media.What is a `` rainbow party `` ? - Yahoo ! Answers This is the result of your secular humanist pop culture which has completely secularized our society and has attempted to erase God and any recognition of his values from our society over the past 50 years . But what is most sad is that you will respond with the opinion that we do n't even have a problem at all . You are completely void of the ability to recognize that we have lost our way morally speaking as a people , and are running to destruction with our fingers in our ears as a civilization . We traditionalists understand very well that we either rise or fall together as a people which is why we still oppose what you represent . But we do n't do it to oppress you at all , we do it to preserve our Nation because God will surely lift His hand from protecting us as we abandon Him and His values which you humanists have worked so hard to erase . But alas , I waste my time even attempting to reason with a spiritually dead secular humanist who has nothing more to respond with but excuses and shallow justifications for your world view !""",DISAGREE,"""therefore imposing your religion on others .""","""Are you too blind and hypocritical to appreciate that your attempts to impose your amoral and unethical world view on we traditional moralists via the legislative activism you participate in , is doing precisely what you are accusing me of doing ?""",,
29867,7824,"""Unfortunately , Dembski and his `` explanatory `` filter are more hot air than substance . He has claiming to have 'discovered ' desing in nature by using the 'filter ' , but for some strange reason , he has yet to publish his amazing discovery . he said he was going to do it in `` Mere Creation `` , then he said it would be iun `` No Free Lunch `` - so tell us , IS IT actually in his newest collection of apocryphal tall tales , or is is just assumed that he has done so ? Common tactic - keep claiming that you will do something , then claim to have already done it later on , without , of course , actually doing it . The only times Dembski has acxtually applied it , he did it to things1 . we know were the product of design and 2. never did it on anything biological . It is all fluff and hot air .""","""So how long did Darwin take to publish ?""",DISAGREE,"""Dembski and his `` explanatory `` filter are more hot air than substance he has yet to publish his amazing discovery""","""So how long did Darwin take to publish ?""",,
29871,7825,"""I do n't doubt you do . To do otherwise would be to admit you 're wrong , which you choose not to do , because it would reduce your beliefs to the irrational . However , you are both wrong , and the belief is irrational .""","""Really , so you are totally knowable ? Show me the site that has the Mach User-Manual where I can know everything about you .""",DISAGREE,"""which you choose not to do , because it would reduce your beliefs to the irrational""","""I can know everything about you .""",,
29891,7829,"""P.S . If it 's ok with you , IANGB , ... I would like to keep this debate ONLY between the two of us ; and ( if it 's ok with Admin ) I would like to create a mirror thread in the Abortion forum for those who want to add their 2 cents .""","""That sounds good to me . Although it might be easiest to preserve flow later on it we do n't actually mirror each of our posts once comments arrive ( and inevitably digress ) - just let people quote/cite us from this one if needs be . I certainly plan on adding in more off-topic commentary/digressions in the mirror thread ( marked in these posts as * , when I remember to ) . Incidentally , I hate to be finicky with names , but there 's not need to go all-caps with my name - I keep imagining you shouting it ! Iangb , iangb or just plain Ian is all good .""",AGREE,"""I would like to keep this debate ONLY between the two of us""","""sounds good to me""",,
29893,7829,"""P.S . If it 's ok with you , IANGB , ... I would like to keep this debate ONLY between the two of us ; and ( if it 's ok with Admin ) I would like to create a mirror thread in the Abortion forum for those who want to add their 2 cents .""","""That sounds good to me . Although it might be easiest to preserve flow later on it we do n't actually mirror each of our posts once comments arrive ( and inevitably digress ) - just let people quote/cite us from this one if needs be . I certainly plan on adding in more off-topic commentary/digressions in the mirror thread ( marked in these posts as * , when I remember to ) . Incidentally , I hate to be finicky with names , but there 's not need to go all-caps with my name - I keep imagining you shouting it ! Iangb , iangb or just plain Ian is all good .""",AGREE,"""I would like to keep this debate ONLY between the two of us""","""That sounds good to me .""",,
29897,7830,"""Gun sales are booming nationwide — and in Erie County , applications for pistol permits are rolling in at nearly three times last year ’ s rate , the county clerk ’ s office reports . Meanwhile , in the nation ’ s capital , gun control has become , in essence , dead on arrival . Chalk it all up to the election of a Democratic president with a long record of supporting gun restrictions and a Congress that includes a surprising number of pro-gun Democrats from rural areas . The election of Barack Obama as president is sparking a run on firearms and ammunition in both Buffalo and nationwide , according to gun dealers and experts on the issue .""","""Unfortunately Democrats have a credibility problem . Many Pro-gun Democrats have been elected , and America is giving them a chance , but apparently they do not believe Obama because of his past Anti-gun support and votes . However Ms. Feinstein 's comments about waiting for the correct timing to bring up gun control did not help the creditability problem either . I guess only time will tell .""",AGREE,"""applications for pistol permits are rolling in at nearly three times last year ’ s rate""","""Pro-gun Democrats have been elected , and America is giving them a chance""",,
29910,7833,"""In my veiw , no law can make any country crime free . The only way to make a country crime free is to get rid of laws , which would just be ridiculous . If somebody wants to do something bad enough , no law can stop them from doing it . As long as there are laws , there will be crime .""","""How right you are to , and given the forum here , make it a crime to own to own a gun , well I think most of us are automatically criminals . It 's like the signs you see ... SHOPLIFTERS WILL BE PROSECUTED ! lot a good they do. , yeah know matter how illegal their will be crime .""",DISAGREE,"""In my veiw , no law can make any country crime free . The only way to make a country crime free is to get rid of laws , which would just be ridiculous""","""It 's like the signs you see ... SHOPLIFTERS WILL BE PROSECUTED ! lot a good they do. , yeah know matter how illegal their will be crime .""",,
29946,7848,"""What is it with the eyes of organisms ? Why are we ( not only humans ) compelled to `` look into the eyes `` of others ?""","""Because the eyes reveal where someone ( or something ) is looking . Since we have a narrow range of perception this information tells the looker important information about what we are interested in at that time . Note that many animals do n't look into each others eyes ( most herbivours ; since they have near-360 degree vision , eyes convey almost no information ) , and many animals take different information from them than we do ( cats for example take looking at them as hostile behaviour , and narrowing the eyes and looking away as friendly ) .""",DISAGREE,"""What is it eyes ? Why we not only humans `` look into the eyes of others ?""","""eyes information , and many animals them than do ( cats for example take looking at them as hostile behaviour , and narrowing the eyes and looking away as friendly ) .""",,
29951,7850,"""So easy to do in America , a nation which refuses to acknowledge the need for responsible gun ownership .""","""Yes . It is ALL my fault ! So do you use illegal drugs ? All who do are far more responsible than I am ! No illegal drug demand equals no Mexican drug cartel ! How do you feel about abortion ?""",DISAGREE,"""a nation which refuses to acknowledge the need for responsible gun ownership .""","""No illegal drug demand equals no Mexican drug cartel !""",,
29968,7857,"""So you think that people that express a different point of view than you are doing something illegal ? You must disagree with freedom of speech . You 're a scary guy .""","""Is English your first language ... Let me take you for a ride on the logic bus ... VoR , You , and the other would be civil rights violators are so certain in your views about guns but are hesitant to put a sign in your window claiming that your home is a `` Gun Free Home `` . Yet you want to take away my personal property all in the guise of public saftey . My very simple point was that a criminal would be much happier breaking into your home than he would mine as he would most likley walk out of your house with a little loot to support his drug habit while in my castle he would be carried out in a body bag all seen on the 6 oclock news for your entertainment .... My question ( a R h e t o r i c a l one ) was an open question for would be criminals , asking Which house would you rather break into ? Let me ask you this ... If your liberty , your very life is not worth fighting for then what purpose do you have consuming oxygen ? In lifes tennis match which are you ... THe player , or the ball boy ....""",DISAGREE,"""You must disagree with freedom of speech .""","""If your liberty , your very life is not worth fighting for then what purpose do you have consuming oxygen ?""",,
29985,7861,"""Also , I noticed you have n't posted on the theistic evolution thread . Why do n't you defend your claims that evolution is atheistic and/or that it is only for destroying religious views .""","""Yes , time is a factor - the gang is trying to bleed me out . I 'll try to get to it .""",AGREE,"""I noticed you have n't posted on the theistic evolution thread . Why do n't you defend your claims that evolution is atheistic""","""Yes , time is a factor - the gang is trying to bleed me out . I 'll try to get to it .""",,
29987,7861,"""Also , I noticed you have n't posted on the theistic evolution thread . Why do n't you defend your claims that evolution is atheistic and/or that it is only for destroying religious views .""","""Yes , time is a factor - the gang is trying to bleed me out . I 'll try to get to it .""",AGREE,"""Why do n't you defend your claims that evolution is atheistic and/or that it is only for destroying religious views .""","""Yes , time is a factor - the gang is trying to bleed me out .""",,
30013,7867,"""The first bird link did not work , so I can not look into that one .""","""Power out . That was a link to the American Museum of Natural History in New York . Go back and look later if you want .""",DISAGREE,"""The first bird link did not work so I can not look into that one .""","""Power out . That was a link to the American Museum of Natural History in New York Go back and look later if you want .""",,
30021,7868,"""In this way , pro-lifers are keeping our nation from going to far to the left .""","""yup , those damn libruls harping on about equal rights and other rubbish . Lets force our morality on them , quick !""",DISAGREE,"""pro-lifers are keeping our nation from going to far to the left .""","""yup , those damn libruls harping on about equal rights and other rubbish""",,
30031,7872,"""and redundant terms ? I 'm not seeing it there .""","""Well , I 'm not seeing it in anything that Montalban has presented . I do n't doubt that it may be possible . I ca n't think of an example , but I accept the possibility that there may be redundant terms . Since both terms carry the same meaning for me , I am not even aware that they exist . I can see how it would be confusing for the uneducated . I can understand how the use of such terms might be a matter of preference or education for any given biologist . More than once another biologist and I have hashed out such terms , only to find that we were talking about the same thing . But such redundancy is so trite that I ca n't remember specific examples . My response tends towards , `` so what ? ``""",DISAGREE,"""and I it .""","""it . I do n't there terms see and about what ?""",,
30061,7886,"""What a politically naive statement . Those Democrats are likely set for long and fruitful careers in Congress as a number of them have already had . You obviously have not been paying attention at all . But not surprising given your other written contributions .""","""I believe it 's you that has n't been paying attention . This Democratic Congress had a recent approval rating of 9 % , IIRC .""",DISAGREE,"""What a politically naive statement . Those Democrats are likely set for long and fruitful careers in Congress as a number of them have already had . You obviously have not been paying attention at all . But not surprising given your other written contributions .""","""I believe it 's you that has n't been paying attention . This Democratic Congress had a recent approval rating of 9 % , IIRC .""",,
30073,7888,"""If you 're prepared to eat livestock feed you 've got a plan .""","""Bad , bad , bad . 1 ) Reducing meat consumption will create a change towards more agricultural farming which is more sustainable for humans and the environment . 1 ) Some , perhaps all `` Livestock feed `` is actually edible for humans ; GM maize is regularly consumed in the US and Mexico . 2 ) One does not have to consume those foods as there are thousands of plant foods that can be eaten .""",DISAGREE,"""If you 're prepared to eat livestock feed you 've got a plan .""","""Bad , bad , ``""",,
30077,7888,"""If you 're prepared to eat livestock feed you 've got a plan .""","""Bad , bad , bad . 1 ) Reducing meat consumption will create a change towards more agricultural farming which is more sustainable for humans and the environment . 1 ) Some , perhaps all `` Livestock feed `` is actually edible for humans ; GM maize is regularly consumed in the US and Mexico . 2 ) One does not have to consume those foods as there are thousands of plant foods that can be eaten .""",DISAGREE,"""If you 're prepared to eat livestock feed you 've got a plan .""","""Reducing meat consumption will create a change towards more agricultural farming which is more sustainable for humans""",,
30079,7889,"""We 're all quite impressed with your knowledge of third grade insults , unfortunately , this is not debate .""","""Thank You . You know how much I love to impress people .""",AGREE,"""We 're all quite impressed with your knowledge of third grade insults , unfortunately , this is not debate .""","""Thank You . You know how much I love to impress people .""",,
30105,7895,"""So , we are forced , in the interest of continuing dialogue , to point out all of the flaws in there argument .""","""So you admit there is NO scientific evidence of any theory of creation . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""So , we are forced , in the interest of continuing dialogue , to point out all of the flaws in there argument .""","""So you admit there is NO scientific evidence of any theory of creation . Thanks .""",,
30107,7895,"""So , we are forced , in the interest of continuing dialogue , to point out all of the flaws in there argument .""","""So you admit there is NO scientific evidence of any theory of creation . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""in the interest of continuing dialogue , to point out all of the flaws in there argument""","""So you admit there is NO scientific evidence of any theory of creation""",,
30109,7896,"""You 're not one of those people who does n't consider Catholics christians are you ?""","""There all types of denominations of the Catholic religion . However , most religions that I consider `` Christian `` are really not the same as `` Catholic. `` Catholicism tends to be even more strict and loony than Christianity .""",DISAGREE,"""You 're not one of those people who does n't consider Catholics christians are you ?""","""Catholic . most religions that I consider `` Christian `` are really not the same as ``""",,
30111,7897,"""So , by having a national `` group `` , healthcare costs are kept lower .""","""And what 's more , the huge numbers of uninsured are getting their health care for free - at least what they get . An uninsured person brought in to an emergency room with a heart attack is a total loss to the hospital and the doctor . Maybe it would have been cheaper to get that poor soul high blood pressure pills . Where do you think the money comes from for his hospital stay ? Our pockets too in the form of higher costs to those who can pay . There 's no free ride for any of us .""",AGREE,"""healthcare costs are kept lower .""","""An uninsured person brought in to an emergency room with a heart attack is a total loss to the hospital and the doctor . Maybe it would have been cheaper to get that poor soul high blood pressure pills . Where do you think the money comes from for his hospital stay ? Our pockets too in the form of higher costs to those who can pay .""",,
30116,7897,"""So , by having a national `` group `` , healthcare costs are kept lower .""","""And what 's more , the huge numbers of uninsured are getting their health care for free - at least what they get . An uninsured person brought in to an emergency room with a heart attack is a total loss to the hospital and the doctor . Maybe it would have been cheaper to get that poor soul high blood pressure pills . Where do you think the money comes from for his hospital stay ? Our pockets too in the form of higher costs to those who can pay . There 's no free ride for any of us .""",AGREE,"""So , by having a national `` group `` , healthcare costs are kept lower .""","""And what 's more , the huge numbers of uninsured are getting their health care for free""",,
30126,7898,"""Fetal Homocide ? Toddler Homicide ? A human in different stages of development ..... Why/or What is the difference ? And if someone wanted this legal ( Toddler Homicide ) ... I do n't see much anybody could do legally to stop it .. When women kill their tots they are locked up/ and branded with a criminal record vs the female who callously kills durning the fetal stage . ( Double standard ? ) I have a couple friends , who have aborted more than once , because they did n't want to lose their girly figure ( trivial ) . I find it eerie and disturbion .....""","""Well , an abortion ca n't technically be called 'fetal homicide ' because it is n't illegal ... homicide is . If a woman kills her toddler , that is homicide , and it is n't legal , and I do n't see how it ever could/would be ... all murder is illegal , but to call an abortion murder is really only your personal opinion on the issue , because as of now it is a legal procedure . Some people consider it to be murder , and some do n't .. it is n't an open and shut thing either way ; if it were , there would n't be so much debate over it , and if it were considered to be murder all around , no questions , then it would not be legal . Maybe the laws will change someday , who knows .. but right now it 's not illegal for a woman to have an abortion . You can call it a double standard , but again that is mainly just opinion . But I also have had friends who have had abortions because they did n't want to 'get fat ' .. I know of one girl who had 7 by the time she was 22 ... that is pretty disturbing , and I do n't think that it 's really right to do it for reasons like that ... like I said to her , if she were so afraid of getting pregnant , or getting 'fat ' , she should have either not had sex or she should have used protection ... there are ways to prevent pregnancy , and birth control costs a hell of a lot less than an abortion ( especially 7 times ) .. but at the same time I also had a friend who got pregnant , and got scared , and made an appointment to a clinic , and once she got there she did n't think she could go through with it , and now she has a healthy , adorable 5 year old and she is very thankful that she did n't have the abortion after all ... but in the cases of my friends , all I could do was offer an opinion if they asked , but I did n't feel I had the right to tell them what to do either way . You really ca n't know what is going on in a woman 's mind when she is considering an abortion , or after she has had one done .""",DISAGREE,"""Fetal Homocide ? Toddler Homicide ? A human in different stages of development ..... Why/or What is the difference ?""","""Well , an abortion ca n't technically be called 'fetal homicide ' because it is n't illegal ... homicide is . If a woman kills her toddler , that is homicide , and it is n't legal ,""",,
30139,7900,"""I 'm a little surprised by this . The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial . Then again , seeing as how the lies and fear mongering have already started , I can see how they might want to avoid having the elections muddied with the inevitable dirty fighting that would be thrown at them . Not the most couragous stance , but perhaps safer in the long run . You are right that the longer society fails to collapse the more inane the doomsayers seem .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm a little surprised by this . The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",,
30141,7900,"""I 'm a little surprised by this . The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial . Then again , seeing as how the lies and fear mongering have already started , I can see how they might want to avoid having the elections muddied with the inevitable dirty fighting that would be thrown at them . Not the most couragous stance , but perhaps safer in the long run . You are right that the longer society fails to collapse the more inane the doomsayers seem .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",DISAGREE,"""The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",,
30142,7900,"""I 'm a little surprised by this . The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial . Then again , seeing as how the lies and fear mongering have already started , I can see how they might want to avoid having the elections muddied with the inevitable dirty fighting that would be thrown at them . Not the most couragous stance , but perhaps safer in the long run . You are right that the longer society fails to collapse the more inane the doomsayers seem .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",DISAGREE,"""The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",,
30145,7900,"""I 'm a little surprised by this . The polls I 've seen show that Mass voters favor gay marriage . I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition on the record before the elections would be beneficial . Then again , seeing as how the lies and fear mongering have already started , I can see how they might want to avoid having the elections muddied with the inevitable dirty fighting that would be thrown at them . Not the most couragous stance , but perhaps safer in the long run . You are right that the longer society fails to collapse the more inane the doomsayers seem .""","""It will either be killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next ConCon in 2007 .""",DISAGREE,"""I would have thought that getting those who oppose it to put their opposition""","""killed after the election or it will be voted up then killed at the next""",,
30148,7901,"""This just happens to be one of my favorite ID concepts . The concept of impossible improbabilities . If it is unlikely , then it is impossible .""","""I know ..... I 've wondered from time to time exactly what this improbability is . I mean most of us would find the probabilities of dealing a given sequence from a deck of 52 card pretty `` improbable `` . I guess its best to avoid those tricky fact things and stick to words only .""",AGREE,"""This just happens to be one of my favorite ID concepts . The concept of impossible improbabilities .""","""I 've wondered from time to time exactly what this improbability is . I mean most of us would find the probabilities of dealing a given sequence""",,
30159,7902,"""Yes ... because black people are Neanderthals""","""I believe white supremacists hate all non-whites , not just blacks .""",AGREE,"""Yes ... because black people are Neanderthals""","""I believe white supremacists hate all non-whites , not just blacks .""",,
30162,7902,"""Yes ... because black people are Neanderthals""","""I believe white supremacists hate all non-whites , not just blacks .""",AGREE,"""Yes""","""not just blacks .""",,
30171,7903,"""Also , The `` pro-lifers `` here need to learn something if they wish to get their message across . When you call someone an XXXXX or insulting people they will not listen to you . I believe many pro-lifers on here are not doing a good job with presenting their message because of this . I believe the pro-lifers are correct and do not need to resort to tactics of name-calling in order to prove a point . Use facts and reason and the answer to abortion is clear .""","""Oh both sides arguing have played dirty ....""",AGREE,"""Also , The `` pro-lifers `` here need to learn something if they wish to get their message""","""Oh both sides arguing have played dirty""",,
30190,7906,"""probably because I want him to think for himself ( assuming a he ) and not be fed stuff from people that ca n't respect others wishes like yourself . Do you realize that there was a time when abortion was illegal and that dead infants were not just lining the streets . Stop with straw-man arguments that you hold so dear .""","""Whoah ! Ohmigawd ! You talk about your historical illiteracy ! Some little peabrains have never assimilated the knowledge that until rather recently IT WAS QUITE COMMON TO ABANDON UNWANTED INFANTS IN THE WILDS TO FEED THE BLOODY WOLVES AND SUCH ! IN FACT , IN OLD ROME THE RIGHT OF PATERFAMILIA INCLUDED THE RIGHT TO PASS JUDGMENT ON NEWLY BORN INFANTS IN HIS FAMILY , WOULD THEY BE WELCOMED INTO THE FAMILY OR EXPOSED ! ! ! ! ! ! ! Do I have to explain to the various peabrains what the term `` exposed `` means ?""",DISAGREE,"""Do you realize that there was a time when abortion was illegal and that dead infants were not just lining the streets . Stop with straw-man arguments that you hold so dear .""","""Whoah ! Ohmigawd ! You talk about your historical illiteracy !""",,
30207,7909,"""What about the healthy child that is allowed to be born who does n't need any major medical care except for the last 10-15 years of their life ? The elderly present this same scenario that you seem to think is an ill effect . So let 's just kill them and be done with it . Is that what you 're saying ?""","""No we should not kill the sick and dieing . But when you need medical care in the last 10-15 years of their lives there is a reason . Old age , disease , accident , using drugs ( and yes tobacco is a drug ) , etc .. That goes with life . Have you ever stepped on an ant ? That is a life form Squashed a spider , Eaten a chicken , wear leather ? And to say a fetus is a life how can you eat eggs ? A fetus becomes a baby the baby becomes a adult and the adult becomes the elderly . A chickens egg becomes a chicken or breakfast . Why not defend the egg ? We kill animals for luxury of their skin ( leather ) Not to keep warm but for the look and feel only . If life is that important that we dictate it is at conception why not defend all life . Animals included .""",AGREE,"""What about the healthy child that is allowed to be born who does n't need any major medical care except for the last 10-15 years of their life ?""","""No we should not kill the sick and dieing . But when you need medical care in the last 10-15 years of their lives there is a reason . Old age , disease , accident , using drugs ( and yes tobacco is a drug ) , etc""",,
30218,7918,"""So what are some examples of restrictive gun laws in South Africa ? The people in South Africa think their gun laws are not strict enough . In one of your previous posts you seem determined to use South Africa as evidence that outlawing guns does n't work . But gun ownership is still legal there .""","""Some in S Africa do not think their gun laws are strict enough . Some in New york city do not think THEIR gun laws are strict enough . This just shows that there are XXXXXX everywhere . In S Africa , you are required to have a permit to own any firearm . Any criminal activity , or `` questionable `` associations result in the refusal of a permit . Over 60 % of permit applications are denied , and penalties for posession of an unlicensed weapon are severe . YET , unlicensed weapons outnumber licensed ones . The problem with gun control laws is that they seldom contain a crime control element . Somebody who is going to rob a liquor store is not likely to stop and rethink their plan because their firearm is illegal . They are getting ready to commit a felony anyway . Nobody is going to decide NOT to murder somebody because they fear being charged with illegal posession of a firearm . Gun laws essentially only apply to law abiding citizens . A criminal is , by definition , somebody who does not obey the law . You can not legislate away criminality .""",DISAGREE,"""The people in South Africa think their gun laws are not strict enough .""","""This just shows that there are XXXXXX everywhere . ``""",,
30227,7921,"""Why must you people come to threads I 'm on and derail them with ridiculous minutia rather than actually deal with the debate that is being argued ? I 'll tell you why . Because you know that the living chimpanzee that shares 98 % of our genetic code , and is living evidence that such shared DNA is in no way evidence of human descent at all completely nullifies and negates all of the claims made by evolutionists that these genetic markers in long dead animals could possibly ever be proven to actually be our ancestors . It is common sense evidence of the delusions of the secular humanist to insist that evo is anything more than wishful thinking . That is why you will all derail the thread with stupid attacks rather than even try to deal with the points I 've raised that you ca n't answer . So here are five quotes of Peeling making the same basic claim in our short debate together which is why I asked for this evidence to support his claims .""","""And not one of these geniuses has even attempted to deal with the meat of my argument but will go around the edges of what I say looking to create disputes on terminology and senseless minutia . Anything to derail the thread .""",DISAGREE,"""Why must you people come to threads I 'm on and derail them with ridiculous minutia rather than actually deal with the debate that is being argued ?""","""looking to create disputes on terminology and senseless minutia . Anything to derail the thread .""",,
30242,7926,"""So why should merchant ships be required to go unarmed and defenseless in dangerous areas ?""","""Well , if they were armed , one of the pirates could possibly be injured . I dunno . I wonder if Mr. and Mrs. Chandler have ever heard of Munir Hussain ? I hope they are following the advice the British government has given Myleene Klass . '' Do n't defend yourselves ! You might injure an attacker ! ``""",DISAGREE,"""defenseless in dangerous areas""","""one of the pirates could possibly be injured""",,
30268,7934,"""I think its a good thing and it does make the family superior and makes heterosexual behavior superior and right in my eyes .""","""But it increases the population in and overpopulated world .""",DISAGREE,"""I think its a good thing and it does make the family superior""","""But it increases the population in and overpopulated world""",,
30280,7937,"""How can the Bible be used as a source while you deny the truth of its claims ? What parts of the Bible are true , and how do you disguingish between the information that is true and not true ? I wonder how a modern court would view the testimony of 500 credible witnesses to a supernatural event ?""","""The documents contained in the bible are historical artifacts . They reflect the beliefs and values of the people who wrote them . When we read Paul we might not believe everything he says but overall we can believe that he preached a gospel that Jesus was born , crucified , died , and risen . We can discern his message from the 7 or so letters we know of his . We can generally believe that he met people named Peter , James , and John who were `` reputed to be pillars `` and `` seemed to be important. `` We know that he claimed his knowledge of Jesus came through revelation and scripture and claimed that other apostles had similar sources of knowledge . I think we can trust Paul 's claims on these things . Do we need to believe he really had revelations ? I do n't know . Maybe in his own way he did . I think we need to lean toward Paul believing in the truth of his claims . I would think the court would think very dimly of the hearsay claim that 500 anonymous people had a revelation of the Risen Christ .""",DISAGREE,"""How can the Bible be used as a source while you deny the truth of its claims ?""","""The documents contained in the bible are historical artifacts . They reflect the beliefs and values of the people who wrote them . When we read Paul we might not believe everything he says but overall we can believe that he preached a gospel that Jesus was born , crucified , died , and risen""",,
30281,7937,"""How can the Bible be used as a source while you deny the truth of its claims ? What parts of the Bible are true , and how do you disguingish between the information that is true and not true ? I wonder how a modern court would view the testimony of 500 credible witnesses to a supernatural event ?""","""The documents contained in the bible are historical artifacts . They reflect the beliefs and values of the people who wrote them . When we read Paul we might not believe everything he says but overall we can believe that he preached a gospel that Jesus was born , crucified , died , and risen . We can discern his message from the 7 or so letters we know of his . We can generally believe that he met people named Peter , James , and John who were `` reputed to be pillars `` and `` seemed to be important. `` We know that he claimed his knowledge of Jesus came through revelation and scripture and claimed that other apostles had similar sources of knowledge . I think we can trust Paul 's claims on these things . Do we need to believe he really had revelations ? I do n't know . Maybe in his own way he did . I think we need to lean toward Paul believing in the truth of his claims . I would think the court would think very dimly of the hearsay claim that 500 anonymous people had a revelation of the Risen Christ .""",DISAGREE,"""How can the Bible be used as a source while you deny the truth of its claims ?""","""The documents contained in the bible are historical artifacts .""",,
30283,7938,"""How about the ability to marry multiple partners ? Or do you think that nothing is capable of undermining the institution of marriage ?""","""Those cultures that permit multiple wives at least do have issues as a result , but hard to say they fail miserably . We are complex animals and not all animals mate for life . There is significantly more involved in the lifelong union of humans than reproduction . Multi-marry under the right circumstances works , but it is n't for everybody and even for those that it is for does n't mean it 's for them always . In a nutshell marriage is the biggest commitment any person will make and should be given the consideration and thought it deserves . Same sex marriage can cause a perfect union of two people the same as M/F and can make a mockery or marriage just as many M/F unions currently do . The emotional investment is the same , the responsibility and obligations are the same , the only difference is genitalia and a little more hair in some cases .""",DISAGREE,"""How about the ability to marry multiple partners ? Or do you think that nothing is capable of undermining the institution of marriage ?""","""Those cultures that permit multiple wives at least do have issues as a result , but hard to say they fail miserably . We are complex animals and not all animals mate for life . There is significantly more involved in the lifelong union of humans than reproduction . Multi-marry under the right circumstances works ,""",,
30288,7946,"""I must admit this is a very long winded fairy tale you tell .""","""And yet you can offer nothing to show it 's impossible ! It most certainly is a plausible explaination ! Fairytale ? ! ? Do n't think so , a logical path for the developement of the avian lung .""",DISAGREE,"""this is a very long winded fairy tale you tell""","""offer nothing to show it 's impossible a logical path for the developement""",,
30291,7947,"""Sorry my brain was n't working that early this morning . What I was trying to say was I ca n't understand those who wish to completely take guns away from civilians . Now I think it does get a little extreme with owning several M-16s , but if I want to own a pistol , a shotgun , and some fancy automatic , well that 's my right .""","""Well , maybe the pistol and the hunting rifle , what do you need an automatic weapon ? Have the deer gotten faster ?""",DISAGREE,"""pistol shotgun some fancy automatic""","""maybe the pistol the hunting rifle what do you need an automatic weapon ? Have the deer gotten faster ?""",,
30296,7948,"""As theorized , the concept of evolution is analogous to slow morphing , rather than quick abrupt changes in a species . MORPHING ! , as can be done with computer graphics programs designed by intelligent beings . Evolution implies species go through a process of advantagous and purposful change -- but morphing is accomplished by unintelligent random processes , or at least that 's how the story goes -- the created universe and life were random events . I have been patiently waiting for many years but to date have never seen or heard of any species morphing into another species . I am aware of genetic defects that limit species but unaware of mutations that perpetuate new species . Clearly variation within species is possible and has been observed , such as poodles and great danes , but they remain members of the same species . Mankind has thousands of years of written history and I am unaware of anyone observing species morphation ( Is that a word ? ) . Although it is approaching 200 years after Darwin hypothesised how species might have originated , we are no closer to observing a species morphing than Darwin . Humans attempt to create new species , such as breeding donkey with horses to get mules and lions with tigers to get ligers , but these `` NEW `` species are almost always born sterile and unable to perpetuate themselves . Besides observing it , the way to demonstrate evolution is to manipulate a species until it developes into a new species , but alas , then all you will have proven is directed efforts of intelligent beings create species . Hmm , wonder what intelligent being ( s ) created us ?""","""I would suggest you look at the faero island mouse then . That is a new species , and it is not man doing it , but rather nature itself .""",DISAGREE,"""As theorized , the concept of evolution is analogous to slow morphing , rather than quick abrupt changes in a species . MORPHING""","""I would suggest you look at the faero island mouse then .""",,
30301,7949,"""I seriously doubt it 's that dangerous , for that reason anyway . Your son could be in as much danger as much as any child for lots of different reasons ( traffic , for instance ) .""","""See , here is the example of how .. out of touch you are . Of course it could be dangerous . I have not only been gay bashed once , but twice in my life . The first time coming out of a bar when I was in my early 20s . I was beaten by five guys with baseball bats . My head swelled 3 times it 's size and I was out cold for 4 days . I had `` nike `` imprinted into my skin from the bottom of their sneakers . The second time , I met a friend for dinner at a local bar . We met at about 7pm , had a drink and as we left the bar to go to a diner I was body slammed by two college kids running down the street . Broke my collar bone and was knocked out . When the owner of the bar came out he asked ... do you think this was a hate crime . We have been having some problems . The world is not a safe place for gays and lesbians . We never know when we will be someplace where we could be assulted . You , jyoshu , live in dreamland when it comes to gays and lesbians . That has been shown to those of us here in the board a thousand times over . YOu understand so little of what being gay is about .""",DISAGREE,"""Your son could be in as much danger as much as any child""","""Of course it could be dangerous""",,
30302,7950,"""Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahaha . The deliberately out-of-context quotes again that directly contradict the conclusions of the authors .""","""is n't it a good feeling wake up , log on to the internet , and see your theory smoked ?""",DISAGREE,"""deliberately out-of-context quotes""","""is n't it a good feeling wake up , log on to the internet , and see your theory smoked ?""",,
30306,7951,"""1 ) Reptile develops feathers . They offer reduced protection . They itch . Rustle in the bush . Feathers devolve .""","""They do not . They offer increased thermal protection and thus make a greater range of habitats possible . Feathers also offer increased protection from attack . They are so good that several native American cultures were known to make armor from feathers . They absorb and spread impact quite well . Feathers do n't itch and they do n't rustle in the bush . Do you have an answers that are n't examples of shallow thinking ?""",DISAGREE,"""They offer reduced protection . They itch . Rustle in the bush .""","""American cultures were known to make armor from feathers .""",,
30332,7959,"""If it had there would be scientific peer reviewed papers supporting macro-evolution . Not one exist-not one .""","""Ah , the classic macroevolution attack . http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/ http : //www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB901.html Huh . Guess you 're wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""If it had there would be scientific peer reviewed papers supporting macro-evolution""","""Ah , the classic macroevolution attack .""",,
30352,7969,"""Here is a good reason to ban magazines that can hold a lot of bullets . '' A gunman walked into a military hospital clinic at Fairchild Air Force Base where he killed four people and wounded 21 others using a Chinese-made MAK-90 semi-automatic assault rifle .... Spokane County Sheriff Larry Erickson called the semi-automatic assault rifle a 'mankiller ' and claimed it is likely far fewer people would have been hurt had another weapon been used . 'This [ gun ] gave him the capability to fire as fast as he could pull the trigger . And that 's a lot of rounds when you 've got a 50-round magazine . ' '' http : //feinstein.senate.gov/assault-weapons-support.htm""","""OK you have convinced me high capacity magazines are the root cause of crime . Senator Feinstein , she has a concealed weapon permit and is licensed to carry a gun .""",DISAGREE,"""Here is a good reason to ban magazines that can hold a lot of bullets '' [ gun ] gave him the capability to fire as fast as he could pull the trigger . And that 's a lot of rounds when you 've got a 50-round magazine .""","""you have convinced me high capacity magazines are the root cause of crime""",,
30357,7970,"""Anyway Duo_Maxwell this is n't only creationist debaters , there are many more who do the same thing with different debates . you also forgot""","""I know and I would say they are wrong also . I may be overly enthusiastic , but I do believe people can disagree and still be civil .""",AGREE,"""there are many more who do the same thing""","""I know and I would say they are wrong also .""",,
30360,7971,"""And that would make you the one that IS advocating the murder of our future generation .""","""Your lie about me is duly noted .""",DISAGREE,"""that would make you the one that IS advocating""","""Your lie about me is duly noted .""",,
30375,7973,"""Did I ever say that ?""","""say what ? i am just saying that i can tell you are a good person .""",AGREE,"""Did I ever say that ?""","""say what""",,
30380,7982,"""Have we ever seen an example of life emerging from a sterile , lifeless environment ?""","""Replicating molecules and lipid membranes have arisen spontaneously in the lab . Functioning viruses have been created from the correct sequencing of nucleic acids . Besides , what are you talking about ?""",DISAGREE,"""an example of life emerging from a sterile , lifeless environment ?""","""Functioning viruses have been created from the correct sequencing of nucleic acids""",,
30391,7986,"""true , but do you see a diffrence in consentual acts and forced acts ?""","""Yes and can you see there is so many things that are consensual liek polygamy , under age sex , prostitution .""",DISAGREE,"""but do you see a diffrence in consentual acts""","""so many things that are consensual liek polygamy , under age sex , prostitution .""",,
30392,7986,"""true , but do you see a diffrence in consentual acts and forced acts ?""","""Yes and can you see there is so many things that are consensual liek polygamy , under age sex , prostitution .""",DISAGREE,"""true , but do you see a diffrence in consentual acts and forced acts ?""","""Yes and can you see there is so many things that are consensual liek polygamy , under age sex , prostitution .""",,
30403,7996,"""On this 35th anniversary of the Roe v. Wade decision , I would like to share my views on the issue of abortion . Life begins at the point of conception . No one can deny that after a human being is conceived it will develop into the very same being as those debating this issue . What astounds me is that those who favor abortion went through an identical development stage as the being they are condemning to death . Would these very same people agree that a similiar choice should have been made about their own existence ? Abortion today is used primarily as a birth control of convenience because people are too self-centered to take precautions . They prefer their own pleasurable self-indulgence over the care and sanctity of the life they created . What ever happened to taking responsibility for one 's actions in this country ? Is it too much to ask a woman who has conceived to place the child into adoption ? Nine months of discomfort is nothing compared to life in prison for voluntary manslaughter ! Does the father of the child have a say in this ? And what about the constitution of the United States ? Are not all people conceived in this country deserving of life , liberty and the pursuit of happiness ? I believe abortion is a crime against humanity and should be outlawed . We need to overturn the Roe v. Wade decision and get back to cherishing life in this country . For a country that murders it 's children can not be far from self destruction .""","""You have some good points here , but what do you do in the event of pregnancy due to rape ? Or a pregnancy that is going to put the life of the mother at risk ? And to push the line a bit further , what about failed contraception , where the 'morning after ' pill is taken ? Does that count as abortion as it happens after conception ? Smiley""",AGREE,"""I would like to share my views Life begins at the point of conception . Are not all people conceived in this country deserving of life , liberty and the pursuit of happiness ? I believe abortion is a crime against humanity and should be outlawed .""","""good points but what do you do in the event of pregnancy due to rape ? Or a pregnancy that is going to put the life of the mother at risk ? And to push the line a bit further , what about failed contraception , where the 'morning after ' pill is taken ? Does that count as abortion as it happens after conception ?""",,
30409,7997,"""Who ’ s Tiggerward ?""","""Just another one of Chuzlife 's overgeneralizing personal attacks . Along with child molester , mass murderer , ad nauseum ... Chuzlife may not need God , but he needs the good guys and the bad guys in his worldview .""",DISAGREE,"""Who ’ s Tiggerward ?""","""Along with child molester , mass murderer , ad nauseum""",,
30416,7998,"""Have you ever heard of `` Project Rachel `` < http : //www.hopeafterabortion.com/ >""","""I think I 'm going to start a `` Hope After Propoganda `` site after reading that . But really where the agony comes is when women go through with an unwanted pregnancy . Abortions usually solve a lot of women 's problems , and most women never regret it .""",DISAGREE,"""Have you ever heard of `` Project Rachel ``""","""But really where the agony comes is when women go through with an unwanted pregnancy""",,
30425,7999,"""Why not read `` The Science of Consciousness—The Next Scientific Paradigm `` by William A. Guillory , Ph.D. which states in part ... `` The Science of Consciousness is essentially the study of the non-material world . It is the study of metaphysical phenomena that , for the most part , are not subject to the theories and laws of Newtonian-Cartesian science . However , the human implications of the results of studying consciousness , beyond the physical realm , are immense. `` http : //creativityandinquiry.org/Scie ... ciousness.html Consciousness is non-material . Perhaps reading `` Empirical Evidence for the Non-Material Nature of Consciousness `` by Juleon M. Schins might shed some light .""","""Why not tell us in your own words , since you have made such claims ? If all of your sources agree with you , then they are not relevant to the debate . Let 's assume ever source you name agrees with your point of view , and from there , you can answer the questions . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""The Science of Consciousness is essentially the study of the non-material world . It is the study of metaphysical phenomena""","""Why not tell us in your own words , since you have made such claims ?""",,
30428,8000,"""`` When a slaveowner strikes his slave with a rod and the slave immediately dies , the owner shall be punished . If however the slave lives for a few days , then the owner shall not be punished for the slave is his property. `` - Exodus 21:20""","""A slave was a piece of property taken after a war . Slavery back then was completely different then it is now .""",DISAGREE,"""When a slaveowner strikes his slave with a rod and the slave immediately dies , the owner shall be punished .""","""A slave was a piece of property taken after a war .""",,
30432,8000,"""`` When a slaveowner strikes his slave with a rod and the slave immediately dies , the owner shall be punished . If however the slave lives for a few days , then the owner shall not be punished for the slave is his property. `` - Exodus 21:20""","""A slave was a piece of property taken after a war . Slavery back then was completely different then it is now .""",DISAGREE,"""When a slaveowner strikes his slave with a rod and the slave immediately dies , the owner shall be punished .""","""Slavery back then was completely different then it is now .""",,
30433,8001,"""If you want to see whether guns save lives , you need to look at their impact on total killing rates , not only their impact on gun-killing rates . The fact you choose to examine a misleading statistic indicates to me you are aware that you are wrong .""","""but they only effect gun killing rates just like traffic laws only effect car accidents and not other kinds of accidents""",DISAGREE,"""If you want to see whether guns save lives , you need to look at their impact on total killing rates , not only their impact on gun-killing rates .""","""but they only effect gun killing rates just like traffic laws only effect car accidents and not other kinds of accidents""",,
30441,8009,"""Third , the violinist illustration is not parallel to pregnancy because it equates a stranger/stranger relationship with a mother/child relationship . This is a key point and brings into focus the most dangerous presumption of the violinist illustration , also echoed in McDonagh 's thesis . Both presume it is unreasonable to expect a mother to have any obligations towards her own child . The violinist analogy suggests that a mother has no more responsibility for the welfare of her child than she has to a total stranger . McDonagh 's view is even worse . She argues the child is not merely a stranger , but a violent assailant the mother needs to ward off in self-defense . This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ? Blood relationships are never based on choice , yet they entail moral obligations , nonetheless . This is why the courts prosecute negligent parents . They have consistently ruled , for example , that fathers have an obligation to support their children even if they are unplanned and unwanted . If it is moral for a mother to deny her child the necessities of life ( through abortion ) before it is born , how can she be obligated to provide the same necessities after he 's born ? Remember , Thompson concedes that the fetus is a person from the moment of conception . If her argument works to justify abortion , it works just as well to justify killing any dependent child . After all , a two-year-old makes a much greater demand on a woman than a developing unborn .""","""This seems to be the central argument : the article continues to give many examples of moral disapproval of neglecting or murdering your children . However , it ignores the fact that parenthood is a relationship which is not defined simplistically by genetic relation or by being in the womb ( it is unclear if he thinks surrogate mothers should be able to have abortions ) . We can be prosecuted for neglecting an adopted child or step-child , or anyone we have parental responsibility for . On the other hand , if a person gives their child up for adoption then they can not be charged with negligence if the child is deserted by its new parents . One interesting part :""",AGREE,"""courts prosecute negligent parents . fathers have an obligation to support their children even if they are unplanned and unwanted .""","""the article continues to give many examples of moral disapproval of neglecting or murdering your children""",,
30447,8009,"""Third , the violinist illustration is not parallel to pregnancy because it equates a stranger/stranger relationship with a mother/child relationship . This is a key point and brings into focus the most dangerous presumption of the violinist illustration , also echoed in McDonagh 's thesis . Both presume it is unreasonable to expect a mother to have any obligations towards her own child . The violinist analogy suggests that a mother has no more responsibility for the welfare of her child than she has to a total stranger . McDonagh 's view is even worse . She argues the child is not merely a stranger , but a violent assailant the mother needs to ward off in self-defense . This error becomes immediately evident if we amend Thompson 's illustration . What if the mother woke up from an accident to find herself surgically connected to her own child ? What kind of mother would willingly cut the life-support system to her two-year-old in a situation like that ? And what would we think of her if she did ? Blood relationships are never based on choice , yet they entail moral obligations , nonetheless . This is why the courts prosecute negligent parents . They have consistently ruled , for example , that fathers have an obligation to support their children even if they are unplanned and unwanted . If it is moral for a mother to deny her child the necessities of life ( through abortion ) before it is born , how can she be obligated to provide the same necessities after he 's born ? Remember , Thompson concedes that the fetus is a person from the moment of conception . If her argument works to justify abortion , it works just as well to justify killing any dependent child . After all , a two-year-old makes a much greater demand on a woman than a developing unborn .""","""This seems to be the central argument : the article continues to give many examples of moral disapproval of neglecting or murdering your children . However , it ignores the fact that parenthood is a relationship which is not defined simplistically by genetic relation or by being in the womb ( it is unclear if he thinks surrogate mothers should be able to have abortions ) . We can be prosecuted for neglecting an adopted child or step-child , or anyone we have parental responsibility for . On the other hand , if a person gives their child up for adoption then they can not be charged with negligence if the child is deserted by its new parents . One interesting part :""",AGREE,"""The violinist analogy suggests that a mother has no more responsibility for the welfare of her child than she has to a total stranger . McDonagh 's view is even worse .""","""This seems to be the central argument : the article continues to give many examples of moral disapproval of neglecting or murdering your children""",,
30471,8012,"""The original 1921 report , written by Dr. Arthur Smith Woodward says this :  “ The skull is in a remarkably fresh state of preservation , the bone having merely lost its animal matter and not having been in the least mineralized. ” Â….The occupation of the cave , therefore , seems to have been at no distant date – it may not even have been so remote as the Pleistocene period. ” -- this period ends 11,000 years ago .""","""Woodward was a fraud , and I recall that was actually about the Piltdown man . You 're confusing your hominids . I 'm not surprised your site says so . Confusing one homind for another and citing a known fraud maker .""",DISAGREE,"""The original 1921 report , written by Dr. Arthur Smith Woodward says this""","""I recall that was actually about the Piltdown man""",,
30483,8013,"""Very interesting Matt . A little confused are you ? What on earth makes you think that a gay men could succeed in seducing a straight man , and a lesbian could seduce a straight woman . Of course there always are exceptions . Some people will do anything for money .""","""Because the gay personals are full of married straight men looking for discrete gay sex""",DISAGREE,"""What on earth makes you think that a gay men could succeed in seducing a straight man , and a lesbian could seduce a straight woman .""","""Because the gay personals are full of married straight men looking for discrete gay sex""",,
30495,8014,"""First thing I want to say is that I dont want to offend anyone but for me abortion was the best option . I also want to say that I love Christ will all my heart . He has forgiven me for my sins and because ive had an abortion does not mean im not a Christian and yes I was a christian when I did have an abortion . I had an abortion just this past june . ... I grew up in a christian home and was anti abortion most of my life but honestly I felt so relieved after having the abortion .""","""I am so sorry to hear about what has happened to you . I hope you get away from this terrible man and surround yourself with people who love you . I must ask , though , why are you a Christian ? You completely disagree with typical Christian sentiments on abortion , you feel none of the purported guilt the religious movement implies is inevitable , you feel like you did the right thing , so why would you continue to profess to belong to this religion if you disagree with one of the major issues of the day ?""",AGREE,"""He has forgiven me for my sins and because ive had an abortion does not mean im not a Christian and yes I was a christian when I did have an abortion .""","""why are you a Christian ? You completely disagree with typical Christian sentiments on abortion , you feel none of the purported guilt the religious movement implies is inevitable""",,
30504,8015,"""The biggest thing that really # # # # # # me off though are the carry laws where I live ( california ) . Essentially , you ca n't get a concealed carry permit in California ( I say essentially because technically they are allowed to issue them , but it 's essentially only for celebrities and political figures ) . so ... let me get this straight ... I can own my handgun for self-defense , but it 's illegal for me to carry it to defend against a threat . But then again , the muggers wont have concealed weapons also , right ? Of course not , because it is illegal to carry it with you , and muggers and other criminals have a high amount of respect for the law .""","""And that ( among a number of other reasons ) is why I will probably never , ever live in the state of California . Personally I have no desire to live somewhere that wo n't let me take the means to adequately defend my family and myself , if necessary .""",AGREE,"""a concealed carry permit in California""","""ever live in the state of California""",,
30515,8016,"""Originally posted by wjim1269 # 1 ) Could you please tell me where that argument was posted ? I ca n't find it . # 2 ) Gun control does n't take guns from the criminals . It just tacks on another offense when they use them . Maybe that argument is n't the best , but it shows that gun control is actually useless .""","""It 's posted here in another thread at http : //www.youdebate.com/vBulletin/s ... 5 & amp ; pagenumber=3 The car/gun analogy keeps being brought up . Kelvin has n't addressed the objections to the car/gun analogy . When you only look at the the things that support your point of view and ignore other things that do n't support your point of view then it 's pretty easy to reach the conclusion you want .""",DISAGREE,"""Gun control does n't take guns from the criminals . It just tacks on another offense when they use them . Maybe that argument is n't the best , but it shows that gun control is actually useless .""","""The car/gun analogy keeps being brought up has n't addressed the objections it 's pretty easy to reach the conclusion you want .""",,
30518,8017,"""Its really sad what these gay predator priests did to those children and they should be punished to the full extent of the law ...""","""Yep , homosexuals join to practice a religion that hates them just so they can gain access to children . I mean , so much for joining any of those adult dating services ... I suppose becoming a priest is much easier . When will Christians such as yourself learn to stop spinning the story for your own hate agenda upon gays ? Have you ever heard of accountability ?""",AGREE,"""Its really sad what these gay predator priests did to those children and they should be punished to the full extent of the law ...""","""homosexuals join to practice a religion that hates them just so they can gain access to children .""",,
30532,8018,"""Yes , it is interesting how we draw an arbitary `` legal line in the sand `` with regards to determining how late into a pregnancy an elective abortion is available .""","""But how can we make rules without legal lines in sand ? At least its better than an illegal line .""",DISAGREE,"""it is interesting how we draw an arbitary `` legal line in the sand `` with regards to determining how late into a pregnancy an elective abortion is available .""","""how can we make rules without legal lines in sand ? At least its better than an illegal line .""",,
30545,8020,"""hi ! We are 2 dutch students and we dont get why almost everybody here want 's a gun . In the Netherlands having a gun is a crime . And we think thats really good , cause you see the results in the US . Kids killing each other with daddy 's gun , and we think that when you own a gun the proberbility to use it is always much closer then when you do n't own a gun . A lot of people feel safer when they have got a gun in their home , cause then you always can use it , even when you are drunk or something like that . And you are always thinking about : `` when should i use my gun `` . So . people do n't buy a gun ! what 's the use ? ! Just make sure that you do'nt get in any problems . Greets , Joszi ( age:16 ) Bram ( age:16 ) Nijmegen , The Netherlands ( best country to live )""","""I know at least one person from the Netherlands who owns a pistol . Are you sure that it is ENTIRELY illegal to own a firearm , or is it possible to obtain a permit for one ? Also , the whole `` school shooting `` business in the US is not really any sort of major problem . The thing is , the media reports every single incident making it seem more common than it really is . As far as uses for a gun : In the US lots of people live in rural areas where it could take police about an hour , or even longer , to respond . People in that situation can not rely on police protection . In addition , our police force is NOT obligated to serve as a protection force for citizens . Instead , our police are supposed to solve crimes after they occur . People in the US grew up with firearms and shooting sports . Hunting , trap and skeet , and target shooting are important parts of American culture . In fact , our government thought it was so important for citizens to be able to use firearms that they created the Civilian Marksmanship Program ( CMP ) . The CMP sells high-powered military surplus rifles at cost , to US citizens . Joszi and Bram , what experience with firearms do you have ? Maybe a day at the range would change your opinions . pickleweaseler -- The US of A ( the REAL best country to live [ in ] )""",DISAGREE,"""gun is a crime daddy 's gun `` when should i use my gun `` people do n't buy a gun ! what 's the use ? Greets , Nijmegen""","""ENTIRELY illegal obtain a permit for one ? school shooting `` even longer , police force is NOT obligated the Civilian Marksmanship Program Joszi and Bram firearms do you have ? The US of A""",,
30551,8020,"""hi ! We are 2 dutch students and we dont get why almost everybody here want 's a gun . In the Netherlands having a gun is a crime . And we think thats really good , cause you see the results in the US . Kids killing each other with daddy 's gun , and we think that when you own a gun the proberbility to use it is always much closer then when you do n't own a gun . A lot of people feel safer when they have got a gun in their home , cause then you always can use it , even when you are drunk or something like that . And you are always thinking about : `` when should i use my gun `` . So . people do n't buy a gun ! what 's the use ? ! Just make sure that you do'nt get in any problems . Greets , Joszi ( age:16 ) Bram ( age:16 ) Nijmegen , The Netherlands ( best country to live )""","""I know at least one person from the Netherlands who owns a pistol . Are you sure that it is ENTIRELY illegal to own a firearm , or is it possible to obtain a permit for one ? Also , the whole `` school shooting `` business in the US is not really any sort of major problem . The thing is , the media reports every single incident making it seem more common than it really is . As far as uses for a gun : In the US lots of people live in rural areas where it could take police about an hour , or even longer , to respond . People in that situation can not rely on police protection . In addition , our police force is NOT obligated to serve as a protection force for citizens . Instead , our police are supposed to solve crimes after they occur . People in the US grew up with firearms and shooting sports . Hunting , trap and skeet , and target shooting are important parts of American culture . In fact , our government thought it was so important for citizens to be able to use firearms that they created the Civilian Marksmanship Program ( CMP ) . The CMP sells high-powered military surplus rifles at cost , to US citizens . Joszi and Bram , what experience with firearms do you have ? Maybe a day at the range would change your opinions . pickleweaseler -- The US of A ( the REAL best country to live [ in ] )""",DISAGREE,"""We are 2 dutch students and we dont get why almost everybody here want 's a gun .""","""I know at least one person from the Netherlands who owns a pistol .""",,
30554,8021,"""There is no doubt that if it were not for the pro-life movement , people like Senator Kennedy would not consider it important for abortion to be `` rare. ``""","""Why ? All pro-choicers want abortion to be rare because women are n't having UPPs or health problems in the first place .""",DISAGREE,"""if it were not for the pro-life movement , people like Senator Kennedy would not consider it important for abortion to be `` rare. ``""","""All pro-choicers want abortion to be rare because women are n't having UPPs or health problems in the first place .""",,
30555,8021,"""There is no doubt that if it were not for the pro-life movement , people like Senator Kennedy would not consider it important for abortion to be `` rare. ``""","""Why ? All pro-choicers want abortion to be rare because women are n't having UPPs or health problems in the first place .""",DISAGREE,"""There is no doubt that if it were not for the pro-life movement , people like Senator Kennedy would not consider it important for abortion to be `` rare. ``""","""All pro-choicers want abortion to be rare because women are n't having UPPs or health problems in the first place .""",,
30567,8022,"""I get it , it was Obama that generated our debt and not the president who started a war that cost $ 1,015,002,700,000 and counting . Nice one . Did you honestly think you 'd get away with that ?""","""The war is n't the reason banks shelled out millions of dollars to people who could never repay it . All that money came from somewhere , like corporations that expected to see a return on their investments . They got nothing , they laid off people as a result , which lead to the rates of unemployment and the housing fiasco .""",DISAGREE,"""I get it , it was Obama that generated our debt and not the president who started a war that cost $ 1,015,002,700,000 and counting .""","""The war is n't the reason banks shelled out millions of dollars to people who could never repay it .""",,
30615,8031,"""In principle , there is no difference between the two as the result is the same , a dead baby . I 've always disliked this line of logic because it implies that the value of somebody 's life depends on their relative accomplishments and it invites the counter argument that the unborn in question could also become a criminal . Indeed , it has been argued that abortion has reduced crime , poverty , overpopulation and the depletion of natural resources .""","""Indeed there is no diffrence it is still a dead baby but throwing a baby in a trash can and leaving it for dead is far more cruel than abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""In principle , there is no difference between the two as the result is the same , a dead baby . I 've always disliked this line of logic""","""Indeed there is no diffrence it is still a dead baby""",,
30624,8032,"""What are you talking about ample time ? I starting following this tread last afternoon ? What is your point ? 1 ) Did the NRA and KKK ever burn a cross together ? 2 ) Does Lockheed Martin in Colorado build nukes , missiles , and bombs ? 3 ) Did Chuck Heston ever say `` From my cold dead hands in Denver `` ? 4 ) How many edits does it take to make a point ? If it is a documentry then why minipulate a speech ? 1 ) That is a cartoon ? Do you believe in cartoons ? My nephew believes that things he sees in Bugs Bunny is real . Do you ? Moore manufactured a monster from the NRA . You were manipulated .""","""You answered the first one already ... it is a 'cartoon ' . It showed that just as one was out-lawed , the other was born . You decide what to believe from this . By the way ... `` Lockheed Martin is a global leader in the design , development and production of missiles and missile defense solutions for the United States and its allies around the world . The goal : Defend against attacks by ballistic missiles , cruise missiles and other airborne threats. `` http : //www.lockheedmartin.com/wms/fi ... =0 & amp ; ti=0 & amp ; sc=400""",DISAGREE,"""Does Lockheed Martin in Colorado build nukes , missiles , and bombs ?""","""the United States and its allies around the world .""",,
30632,8033,"""Premise 1 : God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe . ( Definition of God ) Premise 2 : If something exists , then it can be detected/sensed . ( Definition of Existence ) Contrapositive of Premise 2 : If something can not be detected/sensed , then it does not exist . Conclusion : God does not exist . The reason that this doens't prove Atheism is that it can not disprove the existence of , say , the Hindu gods , which are defined as beings in this world that can be seen . It just disproves theism .""","""I hate to break this to you but this is racked with illogic . Well , ok it 's `` logical `` but the premises rely on things that are pure assumptions . Just because something ca n't be detected does n't mean that it does n't exist . And , of course , if god is god the way we think about it , then God is everywhere , including in this universe . He is the universe ( but we ca n't detect him ) . Does he exist now or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected""","""And , of course , if god is god the way we think about it , then God""",,
30635,8033,"""Premise 1 : God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe . ( Definition of God ) Premise 2 : If something exists , then it can be detected/sensed . ( Definition of Existence ) Contrapositive of Premise 2 : If something can not be detected/sensed , then it does not exist . Conclusion : God does not exist . The reason that this doens't prove Atheism is that it can not disprove the existence of , say , the Hindu gods , which are defined as beings in this world that can be seen . It just disproves theism .""","""I hate to break this to you but this is racked with illogic . Well , ok it 's `` logical `` but the premises rely on things that are pure assumptions . Just because something ca n't be detected does n't mean that it does n't exist . And , of course , if god is god the way we think about it , then God is everywhere , including in this universe . He is the universe ( but we ca n't detect him ) . Does he exist now or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe . ( Definition of God ) Premise""","""I hate to break this to you but this is racked with illogic .""",,
30636,8033,"""Premise 1 : God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe . ( Definition of God ) Premise 2 : If something exists , then it can be detected/sensed . ( Definition of Existence ) Contrapositive of Premise 2 : If something can not be detected/sensed , then it does not exist . Conclusion : God does not exist . The reason that this doens't prove Atheism is that it can not disprove the existence of , say , the Hindu gods , which are defined as beings in this world that can be seen . It just disproves theism .""","""I hate to break this to you but this is racked with illogic . Well , ok it 's `` logical `` but the premises rely on things that are pure assumptions . Just because something ca n't be detected does n't mean that it does n't exist . And , of course , if god is god the way we think about it , then God is everywhere , including in this universe . He is the universe ( but we ca n't detect him ) . Does he exist now or not ?""",DISAGREE,"""God lives in another universe ( Heaven ) and therefore can not be detected in this universe .""","""I hate to break this to you but this is racked with illogic .""",,
30642,8034,"""Wow , I do n't think I 've ever seen an argumentum ad Muslim TM in the abortion debate before .""","""I 'm sure you have n't . But it is a worthy thread because of the reality that Islam `` is `` closing in on what we consider `` the free world `` . If you love your freedom and the choices you now have , you should pay attention to Islam . They are consumed with a hatred for the west and are dedicated to their cause . Symbiote declares this the worst thread ever . It is unpleasant , but , Islam will not be denied . The numbers Cruiser provided mean a lot . Especially to progressives .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think I 've ever seen an argumentum ad Muslim TM in the abortion debate before""","""I 'm sure you have n't . But it is a worthy thread because of the reality that Islam `` is `` closing in on what we consider `` the free world `` . . They are consumed with a hatred for the west and are dedicated to their cause""",,
30655,8035,"""argue with the pro-choicers ... I do n't agree with what the women says because she agrues for pro-choice .""","""Your misrepresentation does n't make it so .""",DISAGREE,"""do n't agree with what the women says because she agrues for pro-choice .""","""Your misrepresentation does n't make it so .""",,
30653,8035,"""argue with the pro-choicers ... I do n't agree with what the women says because she agrues for pro-choice .""","""Your misrepresentation does n't make it so .""",DISAGREE,"""argue with the pro-choicers ...""","""Your misrepresentation does n't make it so .""",,
30668,8036,"""Sorry , I also meant to talk about safety , not control . But I don´t think that zero-gun-tolerance at schools would be a conflict to gun-safety courses . If the teachers of this subject start with something like `` I´ll tell you about safety but a gun is evil , evil ! '' , then it there would be much sense . Imo the goal of the subject had to be that children know about the dangers of guns . Idiotic parents forget to keep away their guns from kids too often . At least the kids should know about that `` chrome toy on the table `` .""","""Idiotic anti gun/gun control advocates that make remarks about guns being evil are the problem . All of this hatred for an item that does nothing until a person picks it up ! Cars as with guns do nothing until a person operates them . Cars kill far more kids then guns and yet do teachers tell kids cars are evil ? No ! In fact we have an entire business around advertisements to make kids want to buy these deadly cars . More kids die daily while driving to school then from guns and there is not demand for this deadly practice to be stopped . The cost to school districts to make parking facilities for these deadly cars is another burden people pay to make kids want to buy deadly cars . When will there be a demand for car free zones at schools ?""",DISAGREE,"""Sorry , I also meant to talk about safety , not control `` ''""","""Idiotic anti gun/gun control advocates that make remarks about guns being evil are the problem""",,
30692,8044,"""Is Sarah Palin being a manly sort when she shoots a wolf from a helicopter ?""","""Dealing with a designated nuisance species is n't the same thing as hunting . It 's wildlife management .""",DISAGREE,"""Is Sarah Palin being a manly sort when she shoots a wolf from a helicopter ?""","""Dealing with a designated nuisance species is n't the same thing as hunting .""",,
30745,8050,"""By definition , scientific enquiry arrives at hypotheses after gathering evidence from observations and experiment . Any law , knowledge , etc . that is arrived at by scientific method is open to modification or falsification if new evidence comes to light that must be taken into account . All science in this sense is provisional .""","""Sigh . You defend your version of science by re-stating the definition of your version of science . That is circular reasoning . If you read anything on the history of science you will know that your version is but one of many . Isaac Newton sought out the hand of God , through science . He is a prime example of what I mean . He thought differently about science than you ... as science could be used as a tool for furthering his understanding of God .""",DISAGREE,"""All science in this sense is provisional .""","""He thought differently about science than you ... as science could be used as a tool for furthering his understanding of God""",,
30746,8050,"""By definition , scientific enquiry arrives at hypotheses after gathering evidence from observations and experiment . Any law , knowledge , etc . that is arrived at by scientific method is open to modification or falsification if new evidence comes to light that must be taken into account . All science in this sense is provisional .""","""Sigh . You defend your version of science by re-stating the definition of your version of science . That is circular reasoning . If you read anything on the history of science you will know that your version is but one of many . Isaac Newton sought out the hand of God , through science . He is a prime example of what I mean . He thought differently about science than you ... as science could be used as a tool for furthering his understanding of God .""",DISAGREE,"""Any law , knowledge , etc . that is arrived at by scientific method is open to modification or falsification if new evidence comes to light that must be taken into account .""","""If you read anything on the history of science you will know that your version is but one of many .""",,
30752,8051,"""What asshattery ! This was addressed . Freud thinks : `` A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity `` -Sigmund Freud , `` General Introduction to Psychoanalysis `` I cut and paste , research raw data post raw data to backup my claims . You misrepresent cases . Use this Besilles collective right theory , cut and paste XXXX form victim disarmament , anti civil rights groups and hide your true colors of wanting to ban all guns . At least on my side WE ARE CLEAR in our goals ..... BTW am I correct that YOU DO NOT EVEN LIVE IN THE US ANYMORE ? ! ? ! ?""","""And there is the difference . The postings I was particularly speaking of have to do with court decisions ( such as Cruikshank ) where hlaf a paragraph , entirely out of context , is quoted to support the anti-gun viewpoint . I have looked at the major anti-gun web pages , I recognise a cut and paste job when I see one . Cutting and pasting a bunch of statistics is one thing , doing the same and making it your entire argument is ignorant .""",DISAGREE,"""Freud thinks : `` A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity `` -Sigmund Freud , `` General Introduction to Psychoanalysis ``""","""postings I was particularly speaking of have to do with court decisions""",,
30758,8057,"""Many legal analysts predict that Chicago 's handgun ban is done for .""","""And it is .""",AGREE,"""legal analysts predict that Chicago 's handgun ban is done""","""And it is""",,
30762,8065,"""I am personally saddened that the Pope would take the words of fallible man above the Word of God for whom he serves . Is this not putting man 's word ( who was n't there ) above God 's Word ( who was there ) ? I am just thankful that we have ministries like AiG and ICR who stand up for God 's Word - The Bible - and defend it from the very first verse .""","""Really , well , the pope sees it differently , what do you want me to do about it ? AiG and ICR defend dogma in contradiction to reality , you like that ? Not surprising . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""I am personally saddened that the Pope would take the words of fallible""","""Really , well , the pope sees it differently , what do you want me to do about it ?""",,
30766,8066,"""That would most likely ( imo ) reduce the number of abortions performed . It would depend , I think , on how viable it is to transfer the embryo into the artificial womb . Forced surgery would not be an option if I had anything to do about it .""","""What if the surgery for transferring the embryo/fetus would be equal in difficulty , risk , etc . to having an abortion ? There would then be no extra physical cost incurred in keeping the embryo/fetus alive . What would be the reasons , in such a case , to keep abortion as an option ?""",DISAGREE,"""That would most likely ( imo ) reduce the number of abortions performed . It would depend , I think , on how viable it is to transfer the embryo into the artificial womb . Forced surgery would not be an option if I had anything to do about it .""","""What if the surgery for transferring the embryo/fetus would be equal in difficulty , risk , etc . to having an abortion ? There would then be no extra physical cost incurred in keeping the embryo/fetus alive . What would be the reasons , in such a case , to keep abortion as an option ?""",,
30784,8069,"""That 's a badge of honor , IMO .""","""Because ... 1 ) that Texas has a higher rate of violent crime ? 2 ) that Texas fails to prevent such crimes ? 3 ) that Texas sees a huge fisical deficit from such cases ? Strange sense of honor you got there .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's a badge of honor""","""Strange sense of honor you got there .""",,
30794,8070,"""Have you ever noticed that there are some gay couples that seem to bypass all the hate and ignorance of the anti-gay movement ... couples like Ray Horn and life partner , the guy that was Oprah 's designer and his life mate , and sometimes Ellen Degeneres ? Why do these people get treated well overall and not lumped into that `` but he/she 's gay `` group ? It 's good that these people are in the world and showing people that gay does n't mean sick or abnormal . Anyone else ever notice this ?""","""Oh and let us not forget the wonderful couples of just a generation or two ago . Johnny Mathis and partner , Edwin August partner to Jack Kerrigan , Gareth Hughes , producer Ryszard Ordynski and play set designer George James Hopkins , stage actors Franklin Pangborn and Edward Everett Horton and oh so many more . Some were indeed wonderful , some were leturous playboys who moved with the `` Gay `` crowds . But never were they shunned or their careers ruined because of it . In fact , some of their careers flourished because of their associations .""",DISAGREE,"""Have you ever noticed that there are some gay couples that seem to bypass all the hate""","""Oh and let us not forget the wonderful couples of just a generation or two ago""",,
30822,8076,"""Evolution it seems can contain tautology , mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terminologies ..""","""My response , included this quote , which is what it was in response to . Evolution most certainly does n't `` contain `` these things , given the widely accepted definition of evolution that I posted .. and that you 've read countless times on this same forum . So no , I 'm not mixed up . I am `` curious `` however , why you 're now saying that you are arguing that a tautology is a tautology ? It seems ... misleading the way you try to broaden the tautology of one phrase , to all of evolution , as seen in your statement `` evolution contains tautology `` . Again , I think it 's lack of clarity , possibly intential lack of clarity , in favor of casting doubt on the theory of evolution . Which of course , is n't being debated in science , on the whole . It is being debated by religious people , but that 's to defend a dogma , not to understand the world through rational belief . -Mach""",DISAGREE,"""mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terminologies""","""I think it 's lack of clarity , possibly intential lack of clarity , in favor of casting doubt""",,
30840,8080,"""The Pro-Choice Democrats do n't love born people that much , either . Our representatives are signed , sealed and delivered over to the health insurance industry . Displayed concern just a vehicle for ruthless , driven greed and profit .""","""Just so ! ! We are witnessing an arrogant display of the power that money has over the Congress in Big Health 's attempt to scuttle health care reform . My two Blue Dog Democratic Senators refuse to stick their necks out and take a stand . If JFK were writing today , he would have a new book called Profiles in Cowardice , and my two Senators would make up the first two chapters .""",AGREE,"""The Pro-Choice Democrats""","""Democratic Senators refuse""",,
30857,8084,"""Court : Seattle police OK to stun pregnant woman By GENE JOHNSON & # 8232 ; ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER SEATTLE -- Three Seattle police officers were justified when they used a stun gun on a pregnant mother who refused to sign a traffic ticket , a federal appeals court ruled Friday in a case that prompted an incredulous dissent . Malaika Brooks was driving her son to Seattle 's African American Academy in 2004 when she was stopped for doing 32 mph in a school zone . She insisted it was the car in front of her that was speeding , and refused to sign the ticket because she thought she 'd be admitting guilt . Rather than give her the ticket and let her go on her way , the officers decided to arrest her . One reached in , turned off her car and dropped the keys on the floor . Brooks stiffened her arms against the steering wheel and told the officers she was pregnant , but refused to get out , even after they threatened to stun her . The officers - Sgt . Steven Daman , Officer Juan Ornelas and Officer Donald Jones - then stunned her three times , in the thigh , shoulder and neck , and hauled her out of the car , laying her face-down in the street . Brooks gave birth to a healthy baby two months later , but has permanent scars from the Taser . She sued the officers for violating her constitutional rights , and U.S. District Judge Richard Jones allowed the case to continue . He declined to grant the officers immunity for performing their official duties and said Brooks ' rights were clearly violated . But in a 2-1 ruling Friday , a panel of the 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals disagreed . Judges Cynthia Holcomb Hall and Diarmuid F. O'Scannlain held that the officers were justified in making an arrest because Brooks was obstructing them and resisting arrest . The use of force was also justified because of the threat Brooks posed , Hall wrote : `` It seems clear that Brooks was not going to be able to harm anyone with her car at a moment 's notice . Nonetheless , some threat she might retrieve the keys and drive off erratically remained , particularly given her refusal to leave the car and her state of agitation. `` They also noted that the force used was n't that serious because the Taser was in `` touch `` mode rather than `` dart `` mode , which hurts more . They reversed the lower court 's opinion and held that the officers were entitled to immunity from the lawsuit . The officers ' lawyers , Ted Buck and Karen Cobb , said the officers made the right decision under the circumstances they faced . '' Police officers have to have the ability to compel people to obey their lawful orders , `` Buck said . That 's all the court recognized today . The 9th Circuit just applied the law instead of getting caught up in the otherwise unfortunate factual circumstances. `` The majority 's opinion outraged Judge Marsha Berzon , who called it `` off the wall. `` '' I fail utterly to comprehend how my colleagues are able to conclude that it was objectively reasonable to use any force against Brooks , let alone three activations of a Taser , in response to such a trivial offense , `` she wrote . She argued that under Washington law , the officers had no authority to take Brooks into custody : Failure to sign a traffic infraction is not an arrestable offense , and it 's not illegal to resist an unlawful arrest . Berzon said the majority 's notion that Brooks obstructed officers was so far-fetched that even the officers themselves did n't make that legal argument . To obstruct an officer , one must obstruct the officer 's official duties , and the officers ' only duties in this case were to detain Brooks long enough to identify her , check for warrants , write up the citation and give it to her . Brooks ' failure to sign did not interfere with those duties , she said . Furthermore , Brooks posed no apparent threat , and the officers could not have known how stunning her would affect the fetus , or whether it might prompt premature labor - another reason their actions were inexcusable , Berzon said . Brooks ' lawyer , Eric Zubel , said he would ask the 9th Circuit to rehear the case . '' This is outrageous - that something like this could happen to a pregnant woman , in front of an elementary school , at 8:30 in the morning , to someone who posed no threat whatsoever , `` he said .""","""For anti-choicers , it 's just about control and power over women . They do n't care about life . ( Except their own . ) This same mother could be a person who did n't have access to pre-natal care . They would n't defend that right either . Because they DO N'T care about the fetus . They do n't care about life . They do n't care about health . They care about power and money and pushing people around . That 's all .""",AGREE,"""Seattle police OK to stun pregnant woman""","""Because they DO N'T care about the fetus .""",,
30875,8087,"""Yea , and so is gardening . Both are `` murdering `` living things . Both do not mentally exist . A strand of DNA is the only difference , which is n't very much .""","""So what do you think about the fact that this baby is much younger and smaller and far less developed than many of those who are aborted ? While this baby 21 week baby is living in one hospital room , down the hall a 22/23/24/25/26 ect week baby is being aborted because it was in the wrong place at the wrong time .""",DISAGREE,"""A strand of DNA is the only difference""","""what do you think about the fact that this baby is much younger""",,
30885,8089,"""I did n't misunderstand you at all . Like I said , you are for persecuting religious people if they do n't agree 100 % with you .""","""Is it only religious people who insite violence and hatred toward gays ? NO ! You 're attempting , weakly at that , to jump on the Frist-train by saying hes persecuting religious people . As if religious people are being singled out .""",DISAGREE,"""I did n't misunderstand you at all""","""NO ! You 're attempting""",,
30887,8089,"""I did n't misunderstand you at all . Like I said , you are for persecuting religious people if they do n't agree 100 % with you .""","""Is it only religious people who insite violence and hatred toward gays ? NO ! You 're attempting , weakly at that , to jump on the Frist-train by saying hes persecuting religious people . As if religious people are being singled out .""",DISAGREE,"""you are for persecuting religious people if they do n't agree 100 % with you .""","""You 're attempting to jump on the Frist-train by saying hes persecuting religious people""",,
30891,8090,"""So the ultimate answer comes down to your own convictions , knowledge , and experiences . Leaving the answer to the life long mystery as to `` Why are we here ? `` up to the individual he or she must find the answer themself .""","""So the ultimate answer to whether or not the sun exists comes down to convictions . And you feel it 's just as likely that it does exist , vs does n't exist ? If no , and you think it 's more likely that the sun does indeed exist , then you 're , I 'm guessing here , ultimately contradicting yourself . Truth has nothing to do with conviction , to claim it does is unethical . If you killed my brother and you were completely and utterly convinced that he killed himself , I 'm sorry Black Phoenix , you 're not off the hook . How inhuman can one get ! ! ? Yes , you should arrive at the answer yourself , but the answer about reality is n't dependant on your wishes or convictions . -Mach""",AGREE,"""So the ultimate answer comes down to your own convictions , knowledge , and experiences .""","""So the ultimate answer to whether or not the sun exists comes down to convictions .""",,
30918,8094,"""The New Haven , CT plant that produced the Gun That Won The West closed . The venerable Winchester line of guns is no more , despite a heroic two month effort to find a buyer . I have a hard time believing someone will not try to resurrect the name , but perhaps it 's best to let it die away . Certainly , it should not suffer its name on inferior product lines . We 've allowed other great names , like Spencer , to become extinct . But what exactly killed it ? Just another American manufacturer unable to compete ?""","""Lots of makers are still churning out lever action rifles . I am sad to see Winchester closed , but sad feelings is not a good financial reason to keep a poorly run company open .""",DISAGREE,"""it should not suffer its name on inferior product lines .""","""Lots of makers are still churning out lever action rifles .""",,
30919,8094,"""The New Haven , CT plant that produced the Gun That Won The West closed . The venerable Winchester line of guns is no more , despite a heroic two month effort to find a buyer . I have a hard time believing someone will not try to resurrect the name , but perhaps it 's best to let it die away . Certainly , it should not suffer its name on inferior product lines . We 've allowed other great names , like Spencer , to become extinct . But what exactly killed it ? Just another American manufacturer unable to compete ?""","""Lots of makers are still churning out lever action rifles . I am sad to see Winchester closed , but sad feelings is not a good financial reason to keep a poorly run company open .""",DISAGREE,"""The venerable Winchester line of guns is no more , despite a heroic two month effort to find a buyer .""","""Lots of makers are still churning out lever action rifles .""",,
30926,8095,"""From a Biological standpoint life begins at the moment of conception . So abortion is in fact killing off life . Have any of you ever seen a partial birth abortion ?""","""Actually your arguement should follow have you ever seen an aborted 2 week old embryo""",DISAGREE,"""From a Biological standpoint life begins at the moment of conception . So abortion is in fact killing off life .""","""Actually your arguement should follow have you ever seen an aborted 2 week old embryo""",,
30935,8096,"""seems atheism has been disproven as well ....""","""Thats well known to be an observational artifact .""",DISAGREE,"""atheism has been disproven""","""observational artifact .""",,
30947,8097,"""How Darwin 's `` strongest single class of facts `` -- the early vertebrate embryos -- shows the opposite of what he thought it showed""","""Even if this vague claim were true , would it weaken evolutionary theory ? No .""",DISAGREE,"""How Darwin 's `` strongest single class of facts `` -- the early vertebrate embryos -- shows the opposite of what he thought it showed""","""Even if this vague claim were true , would it weaken evolutionary theory ? No .""",,
30955,8098,"""1 ) It 's hardly `` solved `` .Same-sex marriage is not legal in France . As of 2006 , one same-sex marriage ceremony has been conducted in France and was declared void . France has a statute authorizing civil unions , known as PACS , between same-sex and unmarried opposite-sex couples . Same-sex marriage was an issue in the 2007 presidential election , with the Conservative UMP opposing it and the Socialist Party supporting it , though both candidates support civil unions ( PACS ) . .... On June 5 , 2004 , former Green Party presidential candidate Noà « l Mamère , Mayor of the Bordeaux suburb of Bègles , conducted a same-sex marriage ceremony for two men , Bertrand Charpentier and Stéphane Chapin . Mamère claimed that there was nothing in French law to prohibit such a ceremony , and that he would appeal any challenge to the European Court of Human Rights . French Justice Minister Dominique Perben had stated that such unions would be legally void , and called for judicial intervention to halt the ceremony.Same-sex marriage in France - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia What France has is `` well , both the blacks and the whites can enter by the side-door , but only the whites can enter by the main door `` We would n't find such an `` acommodation `` satisfactory for blacks . And furthermore , I think you would find that it 's the ANTI-GAYS who have the problem with this . If Obama is able to try to put up `` civil unions `` on the federal level , you can bet dollars to doughnuts it will be the religious right who fight him . Not the gays ...""","""If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS ( or some other legally recognized union ) as married couples , why does it matter which `` door `` they come in through ? They get all the same benefits , including the benefits that come when one partner dies . What 's the beef ... except that you ca n't say that you 're `` married `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""As of 2006 , one same-sex marriage ceremony has been conducted in France and was declared void . France has a statute authorizing civil unions , known as PACS , between same-sex and unmarried opposite-sex couples .""","""If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS ( or some other legally recognized union ) as married couples , why does it matter which `` door `` they come in through ?""",,
30958,8098,"""1 ) It 's hardly `` solved `` .Same-sex marriage is not legal in France . As of 2006 , one same-sex marriage ceremony has been conducted in France and was declared void . France has a statute authorizing civil unions , known as PACS , between same-sex and unmarried opposite-sex couples . Same-sex marriage was an issue in the 2007 presidential election , with the Conservative UMP opposing it and the Socialist Party supporting it , though both candidates support civil unions ( PACS ) . .... On June 5 , 2004 , former Green Party presidential candidate Noà « l Mamère , Mayor of the Bordeaux suburb of Bègles , conducted a same-sex marriage ceremony for two men , Bertrand Charpentier and Stéphane Chapin . Mamère claimed that there was nothing in French law to prohibit such a ceremony , and that he would appeal any challenge to the European Court of Human Rights . French Justice Minister Dominique Perben had stated that such unions would be legally void , and called for judicial intervention to halt the ceremony.Same-sex marriage in France - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia What France has is `` well , both the blacks and the whites can enter by the side-door , but only the whites can enter by the main door `` We would n't find such an `` acommodation `` satisfactory for blacks . And furthermore , I think you would find that it 's the ANTI-GAYS who have the problem with this . If Obama is able to try to put up `` civil unions `` on the federal level , you can bet dollars to doughnuts it will be the religious right who fight him . Not the gays ...""","""If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS ( or some other legally recognized union ) as married couples , why does it matter which `` door `` they come in through ? They get all the same benefits , including the benefits that come when one partner dies . What 's the beef ... except that you ca n't say that you 're `` married `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""marriage is not legal in Same-sex On June 5 , 2004 , former Green Party presidential candidate""","""If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS""",,
30962,8098,"""1 ) It 's hardly `` solved `` .Same-sex marriage is not legal in France . As of 2006 , one same-sex marriage ceremony has been conducted in France and was declared void . France has a statute authorizing civil unions , known as PACS , between same-sex and unmarried opposite-sex couples . Same-sex marriage was an issue in the 2007 presidential election , with the Conservative UMP opposing it and the Socialist Party supporting it , though both candidates support civil unions ( PACS ) . .... On June 5 , 2004 , former Green Party presidential candidate Noà « l Mamère , Mayor of the Bordeaux suburb of Bègles , conducted a same-sex marriage ceremony for two men , Bertrand Charpentier and Stéphane Chapin . Mamère claimed that there was nothing in French law to prohibit such a ceremony , and that he would appeal any challenge to the European Court of Human Rights . French Justice Minister Dominique Perben had stated that such unions would be legally void , and called for judicial intervention to halt the ceremony.Same-sex marriage in France - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia What France has is `` well , both the blacks and the whites can enter by the side-door , but only the whites can enter by the main door `` We would n't find such an `` acommodation `` satisfactory for blacks . And furthermore , I think you would find that it 's the ANTI-GAYS who have the problem with this . If Obama is able to try to put up `` civil unions `` on the federal level , you can bet dollars to doughnuts it will be the religious right who fight him . Not the gays ...""","""If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS ( or some other legally recognized union ) as married couples , why does it matter which `` door `` they come in through ? They get all the same benefits , including the benefits that come when one partner dies . What 's the beef ... except that you ca n't say that you 're `` married `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""Same-sex marriage in France - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia What France has is `` well""","""They get all the same benefits , including the benefits that come when one partner dies""",,
30969,8099,"""A consequence of the pro-choice position would mean the man does n't pay child support unless he wants to . It is irrelevant who carries the child . Maybe he is not ready for a child ... this is the same excuse allowable for women under the pro-choice argument . So he should n't have to pay it if he does n't want to . In fact , alimony she go the same way under the pro-choice thinking . If not then you just look like a hypocrite .""","""I believe you can relinquish the child support responsibility if you also relinquish parental rights . Complicated stuff - kind of going through it right now as we are working on revoking my son 's bilogocal father 's parental rights . Once that is done I can not pursue him for support . Plus , plenty of dads do it the easy way , do n't pay , do n't care and disappear .""",DISAGREE,"""would mean the man does n't pay child support unless he wants to .""","""I believe you can relinquish the child support responsibility if you also relinquish parental rights .""",,
30992,8104,"""Belief is belief . Sometimes persons believe hard , solid facts , most times they do not .""","""Well , I would say they simply disagree with how  “ facts ” are determined . You will be hard pressed to find someone who says  “ I ignore the hard , solid facts ” . Everyone believes hard , solid facts . But everyone disagrees about what constitutes hard , solid facts .""",DISAGREE,"""Belief is belief . Sometimes persons believe hard , solid facts , most times they do not .""","""I would say they simply disagree with how  facts are determined .""",,
31002,8106,"""TRUE""","""* - edit : you know , actually , evidence in the form of experimental results are reviewed , or at least the methods are reviewed , and then if the experiment is n't reproducible then the evidence becomes suspect , so in that light evidence is , sort of , reviewed . Eh , who cares ? )""",DISAGREE,"""TRUE""","""evidence in the form of experimental results are reviewed""",,
31010,8117,"""Do you know much of our atmosphere is made of C02 ? 0.035 % !""","""The amount of atmospheric greenhouse gases ( CO2 is not the only greenhouse gas ) threatens to snowball because of the rapid depletion of available carbon sinks and the consumption of existing ones . The MAIN problem with de-forestations is NOT that the trees are no longer removing CO2 from the atmosphere , but our use of them is adding CO2 to it ( burning , etc . ) and the other sources we could turn to to remove it are also being used up . Methane hydrates in the polar seabeds threaten to rapidly increase the amount of atmospheric greenhouse gases as soon as the temperature increases enough to destablize the ice crystals holding them in place .""",AGREE,"""Do you know much of our atmosphere""","""The other sources we turn to""",,
31030,8123,"""Many evolutionists are pretty bright , yes , No one can deny that .""","""And it remains to be seen if your are . Pick an unreasonable and dumb argument go with it .""",DISAGREE,"""Many evolutionists are pretty bright , yes , No one can deny that .""","""And it remains to be seen if your are .""",,
31055,8127,"""I think you are entirely correct . From the page VOR linked : There is no evidence ANYWHERE that the second ammendment is a collective right . We ghave been over this multiple times , and the evidence simply does not exist , and an organization like the ACLU should be well aware of this .""","""Well , that 's your own strong bias speaking . Many of the courts and scholars have disagreed with you .""",DISAGREE,"""There is no evidence ANYWHERE that the second ammendment is a collective right .""","""Many of the courts and scholars have disagreed""",,
31063,8135,"""Enjoy . link""","""Another question might be , have evolutionists figured out the `` mock `` gene yet ? Mockery was a great ingredient in Christian salvation . Judas mocked Jesus in the garden , the chief priests and scribes laughed him to scorn , Herod mocked him , the servants and the soldiers jeered at him and insulted him , and on the cross all sorts of taunts were thrown at him . I do n't claim to be perfect - mockery could possibly be an effective tool in certain instances , but I may be wrong about that . Is mockery synonymous with evil ? The opposite of love ? Do atheists do it more than Christians ?""",DISAGREE,"""Enjoy . link""","""Another question might be , have evolutionists figured out the `` mock ``""",,
31069,8136,"""That is not necessarily true . I have known girls who have gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion but the fathers of the babies told them they did n't want them to have an abortion so the did n't and now the baby is healthy .""","""The guy can have an opinion but the ultimate choice is up to the woman who can listen to what the guy says or not , it 's up to her . I believe that is what sinjin was saying .""",DISAGREE,"""have gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion but the fathers of the babies told them they did n't want them to have an abortion so the did n't""","""The guy can have an opinion but the ultimate choice is up to the woman who can listen to what the guy says or not ,""",,
31071,8137,"""Laci Peterson 's pregnancy was far past the point of viability , so she would not have been able to get an abortion unless her health was in danger . Also , an abortion is a legal medical procedure , while cutting a fetus out of a woman with a knife is not . If I ran up to you and knocked you out and then performed some pseudo medical procedure on you , I 'd be arrested , regardless of whether or not you could get a legitimate version of that procedure on your own .""","""But if the fetus is n't a human , then it 's not murder .""",DISAGREE,"""an abortion is a legal medical procedure , while cutting a fetus out of a woman with a knife is not .""","""But if the fetus is n't a human , then it 's not murder .""",,
31075,8137,"""Laci Peterson 's pregnancy was far past the point of viability , so she would not have been able to get an abortion unless her health was in danger . Also , an abortion is a legal medical procedure , while cutting a fetus out of a woman with a knife is not . If I ran up to you and knocked you out and then performed some pseudo medical procedure on you , I 'd be arrested , regardless of whether or not you could get a legitimate version of that procedure on your own .""","""But if the fetus is n't a human , then it 's not murder .""",DISAGREE,"""past the point of viability , would not have been able to get an abortion unless her health was in danger an abortion is a legal medical procedure , while cutting a fetus out of a woman with a knife is not .""","""But if the fetus is n't a human , then it 's not murder .""",,
31083,8139,"""Pure ignorance here , everybody take note . In Heller v. DC , in 2008 , the SCOTUS reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws . The Indiana Law Blog : Courts - New DC gun laws tested under Heller standard [ Updated again ] So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ? Absolutely not . According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home .""",DISAGREE,"""So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens""","""According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home .""",,
31084,8139,"""Pure ignorance here , everybody take note . In Heller v. DC , in 2008 , the SCOTUS reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws . The Indiana Law Blog : Courts - New DC gun laws tested under Heller standard [ Updated again ] So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ? Absolutely not . According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home .""",DISAGREE,"""So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home""",,
31086,8139,"""Pure ignorance here , everybody take note . In Heller v. DC , in 2008 , the SCOTUS reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws . The Indiana Law Blog : Courts - New DC gun laws tested under Heller standard [ Updated again ] So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ? Absolutely not . According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home .""",DISAGREE,"""reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws .""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ? Absolutely not .""",,
31088,8139,"""Pure ignorance here , everybody take note . In Heller v. DC , in 2008 , the SCOTUS reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws . The Indiana Law Blog : Courts - New DC gun laws tested under Heller standard [ Updated again ] So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ? Absolutely not . According to DC your rights do n't extend past your home , and it barely even exists inside your home .""",DISAGREE,"""Pure ignorance here , everybody take note . In Heller v. DC , in 2008 , the SCOTUS reinterpreted the 2nd amendment and invalidated DC gun laws . The Indiana Law Blog : Courts - New DC gun laws tested under Heller standard [ Updated again ] So gun nuts got their way in DC and now look what happens ...""","""And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner , having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country ?""",,
31091,8140,"""So what . Congress can pass any law it wants . Does n't mean it will stand up in court . The first portion , `` A well regulated Militia , being necessary to the security of a free State , `` is a qualifier to what follows `` the right of the people to keep and bear Arms , shall not be infringed. `` It seems pretty clear to me . But I 'm not one of the Justices . This decision has been made , although I do n't like it or agree with it . I do n't see where today 's hobbyist meets the intent - most especially in the well-regulated part . But there comes a point where what the dead guys thought just does n't matter that much . It is 200+ years later . They left us with the ability to adjust with time and we 've done that . They recognized their own shortcomings which might have the the wisest thing they did . The current interpretation is clear . We look at the last portion of the statement only . I do n't think that , as I said before , a little common sense , is going to alter the interpretation in any meaningful way . After all , I could easily argue ( if I was totally stupid ) that my front yard is the perfect place for a working cannon . We both know that is n't going to fly . Just where does the armament argument end . With a cannon ? Or with a Nuc . Let 's face it . They said arms and they meant arms . Not guns . They 'd probably let me have the cannon . The founding fathers never envisioned the kind of weapons we 'd have available today or what they 'd be used for . That 's why their thoughts are purposely criptic and open ended . Since we will always draw the line someplace , why not draw it at a good compromise between you and me .""","""You asked where the line should be drawn in regards to weapons ? How about where ownership and use of weapons does not violate the rights of others . Before you respons think about it . Do anything you want . If I do n't violate anyone then what is the beef ? If I do n't break any laws or endanger anyone what is the beef ? The safe storage and handling of cannon , cannon propellant , and cannon ammo is well known . They can be stored in places typical of homes without violating the rights of others . BTW a cannon is not a weapon . It is considered a 'firework ' by the ATF . Ever see a civil war renactment ? Lots of cannons ? So yes having a cannon in your front yard does fly .""",DISAGREE,"""why not draw it at a good compromise between you and me .""","""How about where ownership and use of weapons does not violate the rights of others""",,
31098,8141,"""Vermont legalizes gay marriage -- chicagotribune.com chicagotribune.com Vermont legalizes gay marriage The Associated Press 6:57 PM CDT , April 7 , 2009 MONTPELIER , Vt. -- The marriage proposal came not over a candlelit dinner or on a scenic mountaintop ; instead the couple were surrounded by a throng of gay rights supporters outside the Vermont House chamber . '' We have n't decided who 's going to propose to who yet , `` former lawmaker Robert Dostis said as he stood next to his longtime partner , Chuck Kletecka . '' But we 've been together 25 years in September , and I think September 14th would be a nice wedding day. `` '' Sounds good to me , `` Kletecka replied . '' I accept. `` The exchange came just after the Vermont House narrowly achieved the two-thirds majority necessary to overcome Republican Gov . Jim Douglas ' veto of a gay marriage bill . Vermont was the first state to give gay and lesbian couples legal recognition with its civil unions law in 2000 . It jumped to the lead again Tuesday : After courts in three other states had legalized gay marriage , Vermont became the first to have its Legislature do so on its own . Bills to allow same-sex marriage are currently before lawmakers in New Hampshire , Maine , New York and New Jersey . The three other states that allow same-sex marriage -- Connecticut , Massachusetts and Iowa -- moved to do so first through the courts , not their legislatures . '' For a popularly elected legislature to make this decision is a much more democratic process `` because lawmakers have to answer to the voters every other November , said Eric Davis , a retired Middlebury College political science professor . Courts typically deal with arcane points of constitutional law . While legislatures debate some of the same principles , the process may become much more personal . In Vermont , some of the most gripping debate came when gay lawmakers took to the House floor last Thursday and told their own love stories . Getting gay marriage approved in a political , rather than purely legal , forum is a big step , said Boston University law professor Linda McLain , an expert on family law and policy . '' What may give courage to other legislatures is that this legislature managed to do it , `` she said . She added that using the civil rights language of equality -- the measure in Vermont was dubbed the marriage equality bill -- could help make gay marriage more acceptable elsewhere . Opponents said they , too , believe activists will be emboldened in other states and could attack the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act , which defines marriage as a legal union between a man and a woman and provides that states need not recognize the marriage of a same-sex couple from another state . The Vermont action comes just days after the Iowa Supreme court ruled that not permitting gay marriage there was unconstitutional . '' To the millions of Americans who care about marriage , we say , 'Get ready . President Obama and Democrats will use Vermont as an excuse to overturn the bipartisan federal Defense of Marriage Act , ' `` said Brian Brown , executive director of the National Organization for Marriage , which waged a radio campaign against the measure . '' The next step is to ask the Supreme Court to impose gay marriage on all 50 states. `` To date , the same-sex marriage movement 's main gains have been in New England , which some attribute to Yankee liberalism and the gradual acceptance of gay relationships after Vermont 's groundbreaking civil unions law took effect in 2000 . Douglas had announced his intent to veto the gay marriage bill two weeks ago , saying he believed marriage should be limited to a man and a woman and calling the issue a distraction from more important economic and budgetary issues . In Tuesday 's vote , a yes was needed from two-thirds of those present to override the governor 's veto . The goal was easily achieved in the Senate , which voted 23-5 , but in the House the vote was much closer , 100-49 . The speaker 's announcement of the results to a packed Statehouse chamber set off whistles and cheers among supporters whose hopes had been temporarily dashed when the governor announced he would veto the measure if it passed the Legislature . Among the celebrants were Kletecka and Dostis , who recalled efforts to expand gay rights dating to an anti-discrimination law passed in 1992 . '' It 's been almost 20 years to get to this point , `` Dostis said . '' I think finally , most people in Vermont understand that we 're a couple like any other couple . We 're as good and as bad as any other group of people. `` Craig Bensen , a gay marriage opponent who had lobbied unsuccessfully for a nonbinding referendum on the question , said his side was outspent by supporters by 20-1 . '' The other side had a highly funded , extremely well-oiled machine with all the political leadership except the governor pushing to make this happen , `` he said . '' The fact that it came down to this tight a vote is really astounding. `` The measure had only 95 yes votes when it passed the House on Friday . But some changed their votes Tuesday . Rep. Jeff Young , D- St. Albans , who voted no twice because he 's philosophically opposed to gay marriage , joined most other Democrats in voting to override Douglas ' veto . '' I think if I wanted to continue my career here and have any chance of being effective , I had to vote with my caucus , `` he said . '' You have some pet projects , you think you can help your district back home with things that need to happen . I want to get a railroading bill through . I would n't even have had a chance to testify , let alone get it through . Now , people will listen to me . It 's the way the political game is played. `` Copyright 2009 Associated Press . All rights reserved . This material may not be published , broadcast , rewritten , or redistributed .""","""Great news !""",AGREE,"""Vermont legalizes gay marriage ''""","""Great news !""",,
31101,8142,"""1 ) All organisms tend to produce more offspring than can possibly survive . False and that does n't invalide evolution given how it 's a misrepresentation of one of the statements in the theory .""","""Actually , it 's true . One Darwin 's basic ideas upon which he based the theory of natural selection .""",DISAGREE,"""All organisms tend to produce more offspring than can possibly survive . False""","""Actually , it 's true . One Darwin 's basic ideas upon which he based the theory of natural selection .""",,
31104,8143,"""BTW , Jim , this reminds me of that thread about men wearing make-up . If you want to call me on that – okay – but that was for televisionÂ…and that ’ s it . I mean it . Seriously""","""Yes , I remember , and I agree . Johnny was just primping for the cameras . I do believe though that historically men have been vain and will continue to be so . Your expression of machoism in the toughness of your truck is just another vanity . Vanity can be expressed by the pride one takes in the amount of mud hanging on the four wheeler after a spin in the backwoods . Face it , BO . You 're just a vain man , such as I am . Our quest to have the biggest , baddest truck on the block is not much different from a woman wanting to be the belle of the ball . And often men express their vanity in the `` possession `` of a trophy wife .""",AGREE,"""this reminds me men wearing make-up If you want to call me on that – okay – but that was for televisionÂ…and that ’ s it .""","""Yes , I remember , and I agree . Johnny was just primping for the cameras . I do believe though that historically men have been vain and will continue to be so . ``""",,
31109,8144,"""Third , it is most tiresome to see all the horrors of the world ascribed to atheism when atheism has nothing to do with them . Atheism has nothing to do with the nationalism of the Nazis and Fascists , has nothing to do with the cult of personality established by various dictators and similar . And do n't even try to claim I do n't know any of it . I LIVE in the area you claim as `` Tito 's slaughterhouse `` . I KNOW what it was all about . And atheism did n't get even nearly close to the true causes .""","""Oh , buddy , Atheism has EVERYTHING to do with that . The morality-less framework of Atheism ALLOWED them to justify the horrors that they inflicted .""",DISAGREE,"""the horrors of the world ascribed to atheism when atheism has nothing to do with them .""","""Atheism has EVERYTHING to do with that""",,
31112,8145,"""Surely the theory of evolution can not predict whether a species is extinct or not !""","""You are correct . That fossil species have gone extinct is an observation .""",AGREE,"""theory of evolution can not predict whether a species is extinct or not !""","""You are correct . That fossil species have gone extinct is an observation .""",,
31123,8149,"""That was the whole point of asking the questions , to prove evolution is n't an absolute truth""","""Let 's see , what else in science is n't the absolute truth ..... Well , it 's still the heliocentric theory , so the earth orbitting the sun is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the germ theory so germs and viruses causing disease is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the atomic theory so atoms are n't the absolute truth and since chemistry stems from the atomic theory ( chemicals and elements are , according to the theory , made up of atoms ) chemistry is n't the absolute truth . gravity ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's still the theory of gravity . And electricity sure ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's part of the electromagnetic theory . It should also be noted that the theory of evolution is one of the most well supported theories in science , even though it is n't the absolute truth .""",DISAGREE,"""That was the whole point of asking the questions ,""","""It should also be noted that the theory of evolution is one of the most well supported""",,
31124,8149,"""That was the whole point of asking the questions , to prove evolution is n't an absolute truth""","""Let 's see , what else in science is n't the absolute truth ..... Well , it 's still the heliocentric theory , so the earth orbitting the sun is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the germ theory so germs and viruses causing disease is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the atomic theory so atoms are n't the absolute truth and since chemistry stems from the atomic theory ( chemicals and elements are , according to the theory , made up of atoms ) chemistry is n't the absolute truth . gravity ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's still the theory of gravity . And electricity sure ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's part of the electromagnetic theory . It should also be noted that the theory of evolution is one of the most well supported theories in science , even though it is n't the absolute truth .""",DISAGREE,"""That was the whole point of asking the questions , to prove evolution is n't an absolute truth""","""Let 's see , what else in science is n't the absolute truth ..... Well , it 's still the heliocentric theory , so the earth orbitting the sun is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the germ theory so germs and viruses causing disease is n't the absolute truth . It 's still the atomic theory so atoms are n't the absolute truth and since chemistry stems from the atomic theory ( chemicals and elements are , according to the theory , made up of atoms ) chemistry is n't the absolute truth . gravity ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's still the theory of gravity . And electricity sure ca n't be the absolute truth because it 's part of the electromagnetic theory . It should also be noted that the theory of evolution is one of the most well supported theories in science , even though it is n't the absolute truth .""",,
31164,8163,"""Thus , there is no way that selection will have a variant to choose from .""","""Ouch . That leads to an easy refutation .""",DISAGREE,"""there is no way that selection will have a variant to choose from""","""leads to an easy refutation .""",,
31200,8166,"""And your claims that you have debunked anything only prove you a liar .""","""Really ? Look above ; all I have to do is repeat things I 've already told you to respond to your `` debunkings. ``""",DISAGREE,"""And your claims that you have debunked anything only prove you a liar .""","""Really ? Look above ; all I have to do is repeat things I 've already told you to respond to your `` debunkings. ``""",,
31201,8166,"""And your claims that you have debunked anything only prove you a liar .""","""Really ? Look above ; all I have to do is repeat things I 've already told you to respond to your `` debunkings. ``""",DISAGREE,"""And your claims that you have debunked anything only prove you a liar""","""Really ? Look above ; all I have to do is repeat things I 've already told you to respond to your `` debunkings. ``""",,
31204,8167,"""You have this odd notion that only the Biblical faiths count as religions .""","""No i dont ... as im a plurilist ....""",DISAGREE,"""only the Biblical faiths count as religions .""","""No i dont ... as im a plurilist ....""",,
31222,8168,"""After the person 's case is thoroughly investigated , and they are guilty , the death penalty should stay""","""But the problem is with determining whether or not a person ACTUALLY is guilty . If we could determine 100 % for sure whether or not a person is guilty , I would definitely be pro-death penalty . However , I do n't think it is worth the risk to sacrifice one innocent life in order to punish others .""",DISAGREE,"""After the person 's case is thoroughly investigated , and they are guilty ,""","""would definitely be pro-death penalty . However , I do n't think it is worth the risk to sacrifice one innocent life in order to punish others .""",,
31229,8169,"""So right off the bat we ’ re expected to have blind faith in a miracle that ’ s never been seen , proven , tested – or even witnessed . But that ’ s just the tip of the iceberg .""","""I could n't have said it any better myself . Could I use that quote ?""",AGREE,"""never been seen , proven , tested""","""I could n't have said it any better myself .""",,
31230,8169,"""So right off the bat we ’ re expected to have blind faith in a miracle that ’ s never been seen , proven , tested – or even witnessed . But that ’ s just the tip of the iceberg .""","""I could n't have said it any better myself . Could I use that quote ?""",AGREE,"""So right off the bat we ’ re expected to have blind faith in a miracle that ’ s never been seen , proven , tested – or even witnessed .""","""I could n't have said it any better myself .""",,
31231,8169,"""So right off the bat we ’ re expected to have blind faith in a miracle that ’ s never been seen , proven , tested – or even witnessed . But that ’ s just the tip of the iceberg .""","""I could n't have said it any better myself . Could I use that quote ?""",AGREE,"""So right off the bat we ’ re expected to have blind faith in a miracle that ’ s never been seen , proven , tested – or even witnessed""","""I could n't have said it any better myself .""",,
31272,8177,"""nothing new can be created by making copies , i 've addressed this many times""","""This is a laughable oversimplication of reproduction . Humans do n't make copies . Do you reproduce asexually ? I know I do n't .""",DISAGREE,"""nothing new can be created by making copies , i 've addressed this many times""","""This is a laughable oversimplication of reproduction . Humans do n't make copies .""",,
31289,8181,"""This is wrong . You yourself find `` mental existence `` to be `` sacred ' in a way . There is no rational argument for mental existence being the point of obtaining rights ... no matter how hard any of us try""","""We 're legally dead when we no longer mentally exist ( hence the term `` brain-dead `` ) , so there is no logical reason to set the beginning point as anything other than the start of the mental existence . Just as people who are dead and without mental existence do not have the ability to obtain rights , a collection of human cells without a mental existence can not obtain rights . I also notice you have resorted to attacking other people 's views rather than following the topic of the thread , which is to share YOUR views .""",DISAGREE,"""This is wrong . You yourself find `` mental existence `` to be `` sacred ' in a way . There is no rational argument for mental existence being the point of obtaining rights ... no matter how hard any of us try""","""We 're legally dead when we no longer mentally exist ( hence the term `` brain-dead `` ) , so there is no logical reason to set the beginning point as anything other than the start of the mental existence . Just as people who are dead and without mental existence do not have the ability to obtain rights , a collection of human cells without a mental existence can not obtain rights . I also notice you have resorted to attacking other people 's views rather than following the topic of the thread , which is to share YOUR views .""",,
31293,8182,"""If you disagree with them , you are branded as a religious zealot who 's determined to take their rights away .""","""So try actually responding to the points I 'm making rather than just making up stuff to attack me over .""",DISAGREE,"""If you disagree with them , you are branded as a religious zealot who 's determined to take their rights away .""","""So try actually responding to the points I 'm making rather than just making up stuff to attack me over .""",,
31311,8195,"""Excerpts from the Bible which may point to actual historical events or documented figures do not by rote prove that Jesus walked on water .""","""No it does not . God never attempted to provide proof anyway , aside from the testimony of a few witnesses . He leaves it to every person to decide for himself and believe in him or not . He requires that we believe in him without solid evidence based solely on the changed lives of those who do believe . Anyone who searches for indisputable evidence of God ’ s existence will not find it . There will be no physical evidence , no wonders , no miracles , no voice from the sky . You will only see God working in the lives of people or within your own life . That is the basis of faith . To believe what you can not see .""",DISAGREE,"""Bible which may point to actual historical events or documented figures do not by rote prove that Jesus walked on water""","""He leaves it to every person to decide for himself and believe in him or not . He requires that we believe in him without solid evidence based solely on the changed lives of those who do believe . Anyone who searches for indisputable evidence of God ’ s existence will not find it""",,
31318,8198,"""Personhood- being able to think , communicate and feel pain Given this definitions , Reflect on the following questions . 1 . When does a human become a person ? 2 . When does a humna stop being a person ? 3 . Can a fetus be considered human if it has not yet experienced life ? 4 . Can a living human who is brain dead still be considered a person even if he/she can not communicate , understand and experience life ? Just interested in some of your opinions . Thnx .""","""1 . When their mind develops and begins working . 2 . When their mind stops working . 3 . No , it should not , at least until its mind develops . 4 . No , they are no longer living , and can not exist without their brain .""",AGREE,"""Can a living human who is brain dead still be considered a person even if he/she can not communicate , understand and experience life ?""","""When their mind develops and begins working . 2 . When their mind stops working . 3 . No , it should not , at least until its mind develops""",,
31337,8201,"""I 'm looking out from political action in the western world .""","""And that does n't make you wrong ? But it only applies here despite the mountain of evidence saying I 'm so wrong that I have fecal matter coming out of my pores ! That does n't make you right . Just foolish . And as others have stated in past threads , all that is required to prove your atheistic evolution # # # # claims false is a single theist accepting evolution . As you were annihilated in that formal debate , there 's not much question that your beliefs are not only narrow , but completely self serving and unable to comprehend or incorporate airtight refutations of your asinine claims . in laymans ' terms , you plug you ears and say la-la-la-la when you 're wrong . And you 're not doing very well in that thread . More evidence that you 're not only massively dishonest ( not that anyone disagrees ) but you love cherry picking and ignoring how you 've been ground into dust""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm looking out from political action in the western world""","""And that does n't make you wrong ?""",,
31343,8202,"""Second , do you believe there is such a thing as right and wrong ?""","""Yes , but all concepts of right or wrong are subjective .""",AGREE,"""do you believe there is such a thing as right and wrong""","""Yes , but all concepts of right or wrong are subjective .""",,
31362,8205,"""However , I will come right out and ask you : HeavenBound -- What is your opinion with regard to the evolution / creationism debate ?""","""I believe in both creationism and evolution . I realize the evolution process is still going on today . I do n't feel the need to debate the issue as it would probably be a moot point for all involved . All I wanted was some honest answers to my questions .""",DISAGREE,"""However , I will come right out and ask you : HeavenBound""","""I believe in both creationism and evolution .""",,
31388,8207,"""The theory of pangea ( One continent Earth ) fits the Biblical early Earth .""","""Yeah , but everything that creationists ca n't deny is claimed to fit the Biblical picture . Please cite the verses . How could all of this tectonic activity have happened in just a few few years after the mythical flood ? You do know that it produces heat , do n't you ?""",DISAGREE,"""The theory of pangea ( One continent Earth ) fits the Biblical early Earth .""","""Yeah""",,
31391,8208,"""When Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982 , it was part of a trend . Washington , D.C. , had done it in 1976 , and a few Chicago suburbs took up the cause in the following years . They all expected to reduce the number of guns and thus curtail bloodshed . District of Columbia Attorney General Linda Singer told The Washington Post in 2007 , `` It 's a pretty common-sense idea that the more guns there are around , the more gun violence you 'll have. `` Nadine Winters , a member of the Washington City Council in 1976 , said she assumed at the time that the policy `` would spread to other places. `` But the fad never really caught fire — even before last summer , when the U.S. Supreme Court struck down the D.C. law and cast doubt on the others , including the Chicago ordinance before the court Tuesday . The Second Amendment may kill such restrictions , but in most places , it was n't needed to keep them from hatching in the first place . Maybe that 's because there were so many flaws in the basic idea . Or maybe it was because strict gun control makes even less sense at the municipal level than it does on a broader scale . At any rate , the policy turned out to be a comprehensive dud . In the years following its ban , Washington did not generate a decline in gun murders . In fact , the number of killings rose by 156 percent — at a time when murders nationally increased by just 32 percent . For a while , the city vied regularly for the title of murder capital of America . Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States . One problem is that the bans did n't actually have any discernible effect on the availability of guns to people with felonious intent . As with drugs and hookers , when there is a demand for guns , there will always be a supply . Who places the highest value on owning a firearm ? Criminals . Who is least likely to fear being prosecuted for violating the law ? Criminals . Who is most likely to have access to illicit dealers ? You guessed it . If we were starting out in a country with zero guns , it might be possible to keep such weapons away from bad guys . But that 's not this country , which has more than 200 million firearms in private hands and a large , perpetual supply of legal handguns . Only a tiny percentage of those weapons has to be diverted to the underground trade for crooks to acquire all the firepower they need . While gun bans greatly impede the law-abiding , they pose only a trivial inconvenience to the lawless . This is especially true at the local level . Banning guns from one city makes about as much sense as banning them on one block . It 's hard enough to halt the flow of guns over international borders , where governments police traffic . It 's impossible to stop them from crossing municipal boundaries — which are unmonitored , undefended and practically invisible . Tens of thousands of cars enter Washington and Chicago each day from places where guns are easily and legally obtainable . Any of those vehicles could be transporting a carton of pistols to sell to willing thugs . If you 're on an island , you 're going to get splashed by the waves . The proponents obviously knew all along this city-by-city approach had serious shortcomings . But they figured it was bound to curtail gun availability somewhat . They also hoped that by prohibiting handguns in one place , they were beginning a bigger process . First , they expected that other cities and states would follow suit . Second , they wagered that strict controls at the local level would acclimate Americans to new regulations at the national level . But things did n't work out that way . The persistence of crime in supposedly gun-free zones did n't build support for broader gun control by showing the limits of piecemeal legislation . It weakened the case , by proving that such regulations have little impact on the people who present the biggest danger . Instead of a broad upward avenue , it was a dead end . Gun control supporters fear that if the Supreme Court invalidates local handgun bans , the consequences will be nothing but bad . That would be easier to believe if the laws had ever done any good .""","""Only a complete XXXXX , devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""",DISAGREE,"""When Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982 , it was part of a trend .""","""devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban""",,
31397,8208,"""When Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982 , it was part of a trend . Washington , D.C. , had done it in 1976 , and a few Chicago suburbs took up the cause in the following years . They all expected to reduce the number of guns and thus curtail bloodshed . District of Columbia Attorney General Linda Singer told The Washington Post in 2007 , `` It 's a pretty common-sense idea that the more guns there are around , the more gun violence you 'll have. `` Nadine Winters , a member of the Washington City Council in 1976 , said she assumed at the time that the policy `` would spread to other places. `` But the fad never really caught fire — even before last summer , when the U.S. Supreme Court struck down the D.C. law and cast doubt on the others , including the Chicago ordinance before the court Tuesday . The Second Amendment may kill such restrictions , but in most places , it was n't needed to keep them from hatching in the first place . Maybe that 's because there were so many flaws in the basic idea . Or maybe it was because strict gun control makes even less sense at the municipal level than it does on a broader scale . At any rate , the policy turned out to be a comprehensive dud . In the years following its ban , Washington did not generate a decline in gun murders . In fact , the number of killings rose by 156 percent — at a time when murders nationally increased by just 32 percent . For a while , the city vied regularly for the title of murder capital of America . Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States . One problem is that the bans did n't actually have any discernible effect on the availability of guns to people with felonious intent . As with drugs and hookers , when there is a demand for guns , there will always be a supply . Who places the highest value on owning a firearm ? Criminals . Who is least likely to fear being prosecuted for violating the law ? Criminals . Who is most likely to have access to illicit dealers ? You guessed it . If we were starting out in a country with zero guns , it might be possible to keep such weapons away from bad guys . But that 's not this country , which has more than 200 million firearms in private hands and a large , perpetual supply of legal handguns . Only a tiny percentage of those weapons has to be diverted to the underground trade for crooks to acquire all the firepower they need . While gun bans greatly impede the law-abiding , they pose only a trivial inconvenience to the lawless . This is especially true at the local level . Banning guns from one city makes about as much sense as banning them on one block . It 's hard enough to halt the flow of guns over international borders , where governments police traffic . It 's impossible to stop them from crossing municipal boundaries — which are unmonitored , undefended and practically invisible . Tens of thousands of cars enter Washington and Chicago each day from places where guns are easily and legally obtainable . Any of those vehicles could be transporting a carton of pistols to sell to willing thugs . If you 're on an island , you 're going to get splashed by the waves . The proponents obviously knew all along this city-by-city approach had serious shortcomings . But they figured it was bound to curtail gun availability somewhat . They also hoped that by prohibiting handguns in one place , they were beginning a bigger process . First , they expected that other cities and states would follow suit . Second , they wagered that strict controls at the local level would acclimate Americans to new regulations at the national level . But things did n't work out that way . The persistence of crime in supposedly gun-free zones did n't build support for broader gun control by showing the limits of piecemeal legislation . It weakened the case , by proving that such regulations have little impact on the people who present the biggest danger . Instead of a broad upward avenue , it was a dead end . Gun control supporters fear that if the Supreme Court invalidates local handgun bans , the consequences will be nothing but bad . That would be easier to believe if the laws had ever done any good .""","""Only a complete XXXXX , devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""",DISAGREE,"""When Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982 , it was part of a trend .""","""Only a complete XXXXX , devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills""",,
31398,8208,"""When Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982 , it was part of a trend . Washington , D.C. , had done it in 1976 , and a few Chicago suburbs took up the cause in the following years . They all expected to reduce the number of guns and thus curtail bloodshed . District of Columbia Attorney General Linda Singer told The Washington Post in 2007 , `` It 's a pretty common-sense idea that the more guns there are around , the more gun violence you 'll have. `` Nadine Winters , a member of the Washington City Council in 1976 , said she assumed at the time that the policy `` would spread to other places. `` But the fad never really caught fire — even before last summer , when the U.S. Supreme Court struck down the D.C. law and cast doubt on the others , including the Chicago ordinance before the court Tuesday . The Second Amendment may kill such restrictions , but in most places , it was n't needed to keep them from hatching in the first place . Maybe that 's because there were so many flaws in the basic idea . Or maybe it was because strict gun control makes even less sense at the municipal level than it does on a broader scale . At any rate , the policy turned out to be a comprehensive dud . In the years following its ban , Washington did not generate a decline in gun murders . In fact , the number of killings rose by 156 percent — at a time when murders nationally increased by just 32 percent . For a while , the city vied regularly for the title of murder capital of America . Chicago followed a similar course . In the decade after it outlawed handguns , murders jumped by 41 percent , compared with an 18 percent rise in the entire United States . One problem is that the bans did n't actually have any discernible effect on the availability of guns to people with felonious intent . As with drugs and hookers , when there is a demand for guns , there will always be a supply . Who places the highest value on owning a firearm ? Criminals . Who is least likely to fear being prosecuted for violating the law ? Criminals . Who is most likely to have access to illicit dealers ? You guessed it . If we were starting out in a country with zero guns , it might be possible to keep such weapons away from bad guys . But that 's not this country , which has more than 200 million firearms in private hands and a large , perpetual supply of legal handguns . Only a tiny percentage of those weapons has to be diverted to the underground trade for crooks to acquire all the firepower they need . While gun bans greatly impede the law-abiding , they pose only a trivial inconvenience to the lawless . This is especially true at the local level . Banning guns from one city makes about as much sense as banning them on one block . It 's hard enough to halt the flow of guns over international borders , where governments police traffic . It 's impossible to stop them from crossing municipal boundaries — which are unmonitored , undefended and practically invisible . Tens of thousands of cars enter Washington and Chicago each day from places where guns are easily and legally obtainable . Any of those vehicles could be transporting a carton of pistols to sell to willing thugs . If you 're on an island , you 're going to get splashed by the waves . The proponents obviously knew all along this city-by-city approach had serious shortcomings . But they figured it was bound to curtail gun availability somewhat . They also hoped that by prohibiting handguns in one place , they were beginning a bigger process . First , they expected that other cities and states would follow suit . Second , they wagered that strict controls at the local level would acclimate Americans to new regulations at the national level . But things did n't work out that way . The persistence of crime in supposedly gun-free zones did n't build support for broader gun control by showing the limits of piecemeal legislation . It weakened the case , by proving that such regulations have little impact on the people who present the biggest danger . Instead of a broad upward avenue , it was a dead end . Gun control supporters fear that if the Supreme Court invalidates local handgun bans , the consequences will be nothing but bad . That would be easier to believe if the laws had ever done any good .""","""Only a complete XXXXX , devoid of even the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""",DISAGREE,"""there is a demand for guns , there will always be a supply""","""the slightest measurable amount of critical thinking skills , would support Chicago 's handgun ban .""",,
31419,8211,"""Obviously I am saying that we do not know whether it is a person or not `` morally , `` as you describe it . Yes , this does suggest a universal moral code . To say that this requires a God tells me you need to learn some philosophy . Ever heard of Kant ? The Categorical Imperative ? Read up on Kant and come tell me a God is necessary for a moral code .""","""I know something of philosophy , and feel free to use Kant to refute me . I did not say God is necessary for a moral code to exist , I said some sort of Supreme Being is necessary for a moral code to exist objectively outside the human mind . What is your support that we do not know whether it is a person or not  “ morally ” ? I tell you now , a fetus is not morally a person to me . There , you are refuted .""",DISAGREE,"""To say that this requires a God tells me you need to learn some philosophy .""","""I did not say God is necessary for a moral code to exist ,""",,
31434,8213,"""Well , it was n't just a footnote that Lott supposedly lost . It was all his raw data to support his claim that 98 % of defensive gun uses do n't involve the firing of the weapon . And Lott did lie because changed his story about who conducted the story . '' When Lott cited the statistic peripherally on page three of his book , he attributed it to 'national surveys . ' In the second edition , he changed the citation to ' a national survey that I conducted . ' He has also incorrectly attributed the figure to newspaper polls and Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck. `` http : //www.townhall.com/columnists/m ... 20030205.shtml So was it a newspaper poll ? Did Kleck conduct it ? Now Lott claims he did it . If true , he must have been lying when he said that others conducted the study . '' He has forgotten the names of the students who allegedly helped with the survey and who supposedly dialed thousands of survey respondents long-distance from their own dorm rooms using survey software Lott ca n't identify or produce. `` Interesting how he ca n't remember anyone who helped him .""","""Yet , tehre seem to be people who remember taking the poll . Regardless , in his report it was a minor point . From a realistic standpoint , it took nothing away from the report when he removed it . Lott was investigated for this , just like Bellisiles . He was not found guilty of any academic misconduct ( unlike Bellesiles ) . When you consider the thousands fo data sets that he compiled to put that report together , the folks investigating him did n't think it was at all unbelieveable that he scoudn ; t remeber the details of where that number came from . Again , though , he ended up removing that number from his report ( the single place that it appeared ) and apologised for using it since he could not provide the raw data or a good cite for it . Here is how he responded to the article you link to : http : //johnrlott.tripod.com/malkinsoped.html It is rather interesting , and well documented . It addresses a couple of inacuracies in the article , such as the misconseption that he had attributed the disputed numner to Kleck .""",AGREE,"""And Lott did lie because changed his story about who conducted the story .""","""He was not found guilty of any academic misconduct""",,
31439,8214,"""Out of the approximate 1 million abortions DO YOU know how many are women of RAPE ? No you do n't because the statisitcs are NOT out there .""","""Well , you are talking to Mr. Statistics here so I am quite aware of how few abortions result from women who become pregnant following rape .... the numbers are not hard to find even from the sort of `` official `` unbiased sources many pro-lifers seem so quick to decry . For example , first hit on Google . Or if you have the patience to read it , this article . Now we settled that , you are asserting it is fine to deny the women of South Dakota access to abortion if they are pregnant from a rape just because they are in a minority . I have problems with such an approach .""",DISAGREE,"""No you do n't because the statisitcs are NOT out there .""","""the numbers are not hard to find even from the sort of `` official `` unbiased sources many pro-lifers seem so quick to decry .""",,
31445,8216,"""That is generally true .""","""Not really ; genetics has a hell of a lot to do with it . How do you think most hot women and attractive men get that way ? Beauty sleep ? ( Oh , wait , must be plasticity ... )""",DISAGREE,"""That is generally true .""","""genetics has a hell of a lot to do with it .""",,
31454,8218,"""Hey I 'm new . I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions .""","""Does that mean you are also aganist invitro fertilization ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am also pro-life 100 % . No Exceptions .""","""Does that mean you are also aganist invitro fertilization ?""",,
31478,8223,"""a Hey everyone -- -I 'm new here . CAn somebody tell me why it 's worth while to have an abortion and why it 's not worth while to have an abortion . I 'm not asking in a mean way . I just do n't know the sides of abortion ... Can anyone help me ? Evelyn Waugh .""","""If you were the real Evelyn Waugh who converted to catholicism you would know the answer to your question by now""",AGREE,"""CAn somebody tell me why it 's worth while to have an abortion and why it 's not worth while to have an abortion .""","""If you were the real Evelyn Waugh who converted to catholicism you would know the answer to your question by now""",,
31504,8227,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it .""","""Unfortunately for you , that is not shown , the evidence points in one direction , and one direction only . That of evolution and to the fact that the flood never happened .""",DISAGREE,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it .""","""the evidence points in one direction , and one direction only .""",,
31501,8227,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it .""","""Unfortunately for you , that is not shown , the evidence points in one direction , and one direction only . That of evolution and to the fact that the flood never happened .""",DISAGREE,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence""","""of evolution and to the fact that the flood never happened""",,
31523,8229,"""Hello all . I am new here . I 've been lurking a bit and wondered why homosexuality is even an issue for heteros ? Is it because it 's been hated or `` taboo `` for so long ( a learned reaction perhaps ) ? As a heterosexual , how has homosexuality hurt or affected your life in any way ? As a heterosexual , what gives you the right to dictate how homosexual people live ? What if you have a non-christian living here in America ( that would be me ) ... do you require them to live their lives the Christian way ? Please explain . Thanks , Ladywolf""","""Well Ladywolf , that is really more of an argument than it is an honest question . If marriage was truly a private affair that impacted nobody outside the couple themselves , then , yes , that question would be valid . But that is a very shallow understanding and a very uninformed understanding of the nature of marriage , because marriage is just as much — if not more so — about the community as it is about the couple themselves . But it 's not the community that gets married . No , it 's not the community that gets married , but it 's the community that enforces marriage and develops marriage . We need to understand that marriage is just as much a social norm — a social ideal — of the kind of behavior that we expect and need for a healthy vibrant society ; as much as it is about the emotional commitment of two people . One of the biggest issues is the social role of marriage . Marriage domesticates men . Men who are not attached permanently to a woman are men that will practice and engage in socially unhealthy behaviors at a much higher level . How will same-sex marriage effect the concept of `` marriage `` ? Marriage becomes reduced down to nothing , because the moral argument for same-sex marriage is the same moral argument for group marriage , for polygamy , and it is going to be impossible to deny polygamous groups — and group marriage people — who come forth in all sincerity and say , `` If you ca n't restrict marriage to only couples of opposite sex , then you ca n't restrict marriage to only two people. `` They are all very much interwoven . The three things that you lose are : 1 ) the domesticating influence of marriage on men ; 2 ) the protective influence of marriage upon women from being victimized and objectified by men ; and 3 ) it provides mothers and fathers for children . When monogamy is lost as an ideal , the idea that a man should commit himself and forego all other sexual relationships but ( the one with ) his wife , then women become commodities to be used and collected by men . When committing yourself to a woman and subjugating your sexual desires for the sake of that woman — when that becomes just one lifestyle choice among many , it is devastating to a culture . Same-sex `` marriage `` also denies every child it touches access to either a mother or father . It is never compassionate to intentionally deny a child either a mother or father .""",DISAGREE,"""why homosexuality is even an issue for heteros ? Is it because it 's been hated or `` taboo `` for so long ( a learned reaction perhaps ) ?""","""that is really more of an argument than it is an honest question . If marriage was truly a private affair that impacted nobody outside the couple themselves , then , yes , that question would be valid .""",,
31536,8230,"""The difference , and I think it is a significant difference , is that Omegamon spoke of feeling the threat of potential harm . I believe that understanding the risks that are faced every day does not require being fearful of those risks . Nor does it require being stupidly fearless . We all take reasonable steps to reduce our risk of danger every day . To me , the use of a firearm to reduce risk does not seem all that reasonable . The intent of my opening post was to find out why Omegamon and others feel differently .""","""Because we have different experiences than you and are more educated on the subject . The only ones who tend to ask `` Why do you feel you need a firearm to protect yourself `` are the ones who 've never faced such a situation and do n't know what it 's like to be in such a position .""",DISAGREE,"""The intent of my opening post was to find out why Omegamon and others feel differently""","""Why do you feel you need a firearm to protect yourself""",,
31546,8232,"""Nothing other than natural selection which man has been aware of for thousands of years has been proven .""","""Microevolution has occured . Several times over and recorded in the lab and the natural world .""",DISAGREE,"""Nothing other than natural selection""","""has""",,
31562,8233,"""So the start of personhood for a particular person is a variable , based on that individual ’ s memory . Twenty years ago I could remember events at my fourth birthday , but today those memories are gone . For a while I had personhood at 4 years of age , but today , looking back , I did not have personhood until I was 6 . As I age and my memory fails , it may turn out that I did not have personhood until I was 21 years old . Personnhood comes and goes . Do I have it right ?  ” Not aware ” ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Not aware of what ? Shoot a gun behind them and they will flinch . They are aware of loud noises . Throw them wildly into the air and they will cry . They are aware of their own movement . Pinch them , they will cry . They are self aware as they chew on their toes . And of course puppies are aware as well . Unless of course I do not understand what you mean by aware .""","""My goal was not to state a precise definition because as you say everyone is different but to say the age that a person becomes aware in a substantial way . As far as I can see puppies are probably more functional then human babies are probably just as intelligent . I don ’ t see why you would have trouble with the comparison .""",DISAGREE,"""They are aware of loud noises . Throw them wildly into the air and they will cry . They are aware of their own movement . Pinch them , they will cry .""","""I don ’ t see why you would have trouble with the comparison .""",,
31588,8236,"""Did you read the article ? A capuchin is type of monkey , in this case , the type that was used in the experiment .""","""Really ? Oh , derrrr ! Obviously , some people no longer use a sense of humour ; a relic .""",DISAGREE,"""A capuchin is type of monkey , in this case , the type that was used in the experiment .""","""Obviously , some people no longer use a sense of humour ; a relic .""",,
31600,8237,"""One idea is that organisms are equipped with the flexibility to change their physical or other features during development to accommodate environmental changes , a phenomenon called phenotypic plasticity . The change typically does n't show up in the genes . For instance , in social bees , both the workers and guards have the same genomes but different genes get activated to give them distinct behaviors and appearances . Environmental factors , such as temperature and embryonic diet , prompt genetic activity that ends up casting one bee a worker and the other a guard . If beneficial , this flexibility could be passed on to offspring and so can lead to the evolution of new features in a species . '' This plasticity is heritable , and natural selection can favor different kinds of plasticity , depending on the range of environmental conditions the organism encounters , `` Pigliucci said .""","""Bertvan : Endogenous Adaptive Mutagenesis proposes that living individual organisms , not their genomes , respond to internal and environmental challenges , intelligently and purposefully , that such adaptations are inherited epigenetically , as they develop , and the phenotype only instigates a reorganization of its genome to reflect such adaptations if they persistent over many generations .""",DISAGREE,"""The change typically does n't show up in the genes . For instance , in social bees , both the workers and guards have the same genomes but different genes get activated to give them distinct behaviors and appearances .""","""as they develop , and the phenotype only instigates a reorganization of its genome to reflect such adaptations if they persistent over many generations .""",,
31604,8237,"""One idea is that organisms are equipped with the flexibility to change their physical or other features during development to accommodate environmental changes , a phenomenon called phenotypic plasticity . The change typically does n't show up in the genes . For instance , in social bees , both the workers and guards have the same genomes but different genes get activated to give them distinct behaviors and appearances . Environmental factors , such as temperature and embryonic diet , prompt genetic activity that ends up casting one bee a worker and the other a guard . If beneficial , this flexibility could be passed on to offspring and so can lead to the evolution of new features in a species . '' This plasticity is heritable , and natural selection can favor different kinds of plasticity , depending on the range of environmental conditions the organism encounters , `` Pigliucci said .""","""Bertvan : Endogenous Adaptive Mutagenesis proposes that living individual organisms , not their genomes , respond to internal and environmental challenges , intelligently and purposefully , that such adaptations are inherited epigenetically , as they develop , and the phenotype only instigates a reorganization of its genome to reflect such adaptations if they persistent over many generations .""",DISAGREE,"""One idea is that organisms are equipped with the flexibility to change their physical or other features during development to accommodate environmental changes ,""","""Endogenous Adaptive Mutagenesis proposes that living individual organisms ,""",,
31609,8238,"""Originally posted by Pie Hmm , just found this . Turns out that the theropod theory is n't as solid as it seems . If this is incorrect , and you can prove it ( this pertains primarily to Lurch ) try not to get your panties in a twist , okay ? There are a couple problems here : -There are supposed `` inherited similaritys `` in the forelimbs of birds and theropods . Both have a three-fingered `` hand `` , but embryological studies indicate that the `` hand `` of the bird consist of digits II-III-IV , but theropods have I-II-III . This is very contrary to the view that theropods evolved evolved into birds . ( Burke A.C. and Feduccia A. Developmental patterns and the identification of homologies in the avian hand . Science , 24 October 1997 , Volume 278 , 666-668 ) . -A second problem is the structure of the lungs . When studied , Sinosauropteryx revealed that in theropods , the thoracic cavity is seperate from the abdominal cavity near the diaphram . Birds have no such separation . There is no clear way that this could change without debilitating effects to the bird . ( Ruben J.A. , Jones T.D. , Geist N.R . and Hillenius W.J . Lung structure and ventilation in theropod dinosaurs and early birds . Science , 14 November 1997 , Volume 278 , 1267-1270 ) . -Finally , the hips are a trouble spot . While birds are `` bird hipped `` ( duh ) the theropod dinosaurs were `` lizard hipped `` . If evolution is true , then birds should have evolved from the ornithischian dinosaurs , whom were bird hipped .""","""Did you get this from a website or did you actually go and browse the journals ? I 'm guessing the former as these objections have been specifically addressed before . Do you really expect to learn anything by copying creationist argument after creationist argument from websites that usually requires an understanding , that has taken biologists years to learn , then simply say `` here , deal with this `` ? Yet when the errors are explained you simply move on to the next subject . I asked myself some time ago , `` What would it take to convince myself that evolution is a good explanation for biodiversity `` , then I set out a series of subjects I did n't understand , read as much creationist material as I could find , then juxtaposing it with as much evolutionary material as I could find and tried to see who was most convincing . Three years and half a biological science degree later I came to several conclusions . 1 ) Creationists have little understanding about the nature of science and evolution for many reasons . 2 ) Evolutionary Biologists have already thought of objections that take creationists years to come up with and debunked them several times over , or made appropriate changes to hypothesis with explanations that are several orders of magnitude more impressive than any creationist material . 3 ) Creationists will obstinately perpetuate falsehoods with inordinate banality , misquote out of context , demonise and vilify beyond logical explanation . 4 ) Evolutionary theory is predictive , falsifiable , consistent , parsimonious and well established amongst the scientific community ; it is the best scientific explanation for biological diversity . As much as I hate saying `` here read this `` , hip morphology is confusing and complicated but is well explained in the journal of dinosaur palaeontology . Follow the link if you want to resolve the confusion with hips . Let 's try and keep it civil people .""",DISAGREE,"""theropod theory inherited similaritys embryological studies birds should have evolved from the ornithischian dinosaurs""","""evolution is a good explanation for biodiversity Evolutionary Biologists , hip morphology dinosaur palaeontology""",,
31646,8242,"""f it does n't , that pretty much debunks the flood `` theory `` . But you just ignore that do n't you ?""","""The `` flood : scientifically possible ? `` thread is evidence that arch ignores essentially everything scientifically and factually relevant about the flood . Fossil record shows sorting largely by complexity , not density . Huh . That 's magic water ! Geological record lacks a uniform layer of sediment similar to the K-T iridium layer . Magic water again ! Geological record does n't support massive geological changes happening in 4,000 years . Magic Land perhaps ? Basic marine organisms ca n't tolerate massive salinity changes . Maybe Noah had a giant magical aquarium ?""",DISAGREE,"""f it does n't , that pretty much debunks the flood `` theory `` . But you just ignore that do n't you ?""","""The `` flood : scientifically possible ? `` thread is evidence that arch ignores essentially everything scientifically and factually relevant about the flood . Fossil record shows sorting largely by complexity , not density . Huh .""",,
31649,8243,"""Perhaps an analogy . Lets say for the sake of the argument you do not smoke or drink ( personally against it , for whatever reason ) . However , you believe others should have the right to drink and smoke if they so choose . So , you are personally against drinking and smoking but you are `` pro-choice `` in that regard ( meaning you believe every person should make that determination for themselves ) . Pro-life would be : You do n't drink and smoke ( morally against it perhaps ) and you are going to make sure that no one else is able to either .""","""This is a poor poor analogy . Abortion is dealing with the decision to end another 's life in order to sustain a preferred lifestyle . I think you may have been better off putting it this way . Say you dont drive drunk ( personally against it for whatever reason ) . However , you believe others should have the right to drive drunk if they so choose . So , you are personally against drunk driving but you are `` pro-choice `` in that regard ( meaning you believe every person should make that determination for themselves ) . Therefore there should be no laws preventing it and no punishment for the sad results . Pro-life would be : You do n't drive drunk ( morally against it perhaps ) and you are going to make sure no one else is able to either .""",DISAGREE,"""Lets say for the sake of the argument you do not smoke or drink""","""Abortion is dealing with the decision to end another 's life in order to sustain a preferred lifestyle .""",,
31656,8244,"""there is nothing surprising about my being able to think for myself and reject the religion of evolution .""","""Too bad evolution is a scientific theory and an empirically verified fact .""",DISAGREE,"""there is nothing surprising about my being able to think for myself and reject the religion of evolution .""","""Too bad evolution is a scientific theory and an empirically verified fact .""",,
31662,8245,""": It probably would have been better if Scalia had said to himself when the case was brought before the court , `` There certainly is no consensus about the meaning of the Second Amendment and I , as an amateur historian , am certainly not going to force my own personal views on others . I will let the people decide through their elected representatives how much gun control is necessary in their own communities. `` Nice interpretation by Dennis Henigan of HCI . He would have loved that but pretending it has n't been ruled as an individual right by the 82nd Congress , the DOJ in August 2004 with all the history and also by 35 Supreme Court rulings and TWO CENTURIES of lower court cases that fills a 660 pg . book with majority opinion , he is either deaf/blind or outright deceitful ... I opt for the latter . He and they know full well that all the courts now are bound to consider any Second Amendment case as a civil rights issue thanks to this ruling . '' letting people decide `` has already been done , once when the Constitution was ratified with the BOR and again when the XIVth Amendment was passed . He may as well say race issues will be decided by elected representatives the racial balance necessary in their own communities `` He is completely dishonest and knows full well that this is a Republic based on the Law of the Land , The Constitution and not a democracy as he suggests . One may as well follow the Piper over the cliff like a herd of lemmings to not recognize this time worn tune played by the gun grabbers .""","""Even new Justice Sotomayor , who claimed she ruled by precedent will be bound by the Heller Decision if she remains true to her purported philosophy . The debate between Sui Juris and Res Judicia should no longer be an issue with the liberals on this RIGHT ! It either applies to all or it applies to none which would result as Justice W.O . Douglas wrote : `` a revolution `` . It is in the government 's ( federal especially ) best interests to keep our soldiers employed in foreign countries . BTW , I think the court decision in Nunn vs. State of Georgia did the best summation of this right !""",AGREE,"""It probably would have been better if Scalia had said to himself when the case was brought before the court , `` There certainly is no consensus about the meaning of the Second Amendment and I , as an amateur historian , am certainly not going to force my own personal views on others . I will let the people decide through their elected representatives how much gun control is necessary in their own . '' communities""","""Even new Justice Sotomayor , who claimed she ruled by precedent will be bound by the Heller Decision if she remains true to her purported philosophy .""",,
31718,8261,"""The Bible tells us God is involved in our creation from the womb : `` Did not He who made me in the womb make him , And the same one fashion us in the womb ? ( Job 31:15 ) Yet Thou art He who didst bring me forth from the womb ; Thou didst make me trust when upon my mother 's breasts . Upon Thee I was cast from birth ; Thou hast been my God from my mother 's womb . ( Psalms 22:9-10 ) For Thou didst form my inward parts ; Thou didst weave me in my mother 's womb . I will give thanks to Thee , for I am fearfully and wonderfully made ; Wonderful are Thy works , And my soul knows it very well . My frame was not hidden from Thee , When I was made in secret , And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth . Thine eyes have seen my unformed substance ; And in Thy book they were all written , The days that were ordained for me , When as yet there was not one of them . ( Psalms 139:13-16 ) Thus says the LORD who made you And formed you from the womb , who will help you , ` Do not fear , O Jacob My servant ; And you Jeshurun whom I have chosen . ( Isaiah 44:2 ) Thus says the LORD , your Redeemer , and the one who formed you from the womb , `` I , the LORD , am the maker of all things , Stretching out the heavens by Myself , And spreading out the earth all alone , ( Isaiah 44:24 )""","""Then Exodus says the following :""",DISAGREE,"""The Bible tells us God is involved in our creation from the womb :""","""Then Exodus says the following :""",,
31715,8261,"""The Bible tells us God is involved in our creation from the womb : `` Did not He who made me in the womb make him , And the same one fashion us in the womb ? ( Job 31:15 ) Yet Thou art He who didst bring me forth from the womb ; Thou didst make me trust when upon my mother 's breasts . Upon Thee I was cast from birth ; Thou hast been my God from my mother 's womb . ( Psalms 22:9-10 ) For Thou didst form my inward parts ; Thou didst weave me in my mother 's womb . I will give thanks to Thee , for I am fearfully and wonderfully made ; Wonderful are Thy works , And my soul knows it very well . My frame was not hidden from Thee , When I was made in secret , And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth . Thine eyes have seen my unformed substance ; And in Thy book they were all written , The days that were ordained for me , When as yet there was not one of them . ( Psalms 139:13-16 ) Thus says the LORD who made you And formed you from the womb , who will help you , ` Do not fear , O Jacob My servant ; And you Jeshurun whom I have chosen . ( Isaiah 44:2 ) Thus says the LORD , your Redeemer , and the one who formed you from the womb , `` I , the LORD , am the maker of all things , Stretching out the heavens by Myself , And spreading out the earth all alone , ( Isaiah 44:24 )""","""Then Exodus says the following :""",DISAGREE,"""creation from the womb : mother 's breasts . mother 's womb depths of the earth my unformed substance ; LORD Redeemer heavens""","""Exodus""",,
31732,8264,"""That ’ s a bit creepy . Let me ask you something . You think there are no objective rights and wrongs , I believe there are . Do you think I ’ m wrong ?""","""All concepts of right and wrong are subjective . It is that atheists and agnostics are more honest about it .""",DISAGREE,"""You think there are no objective rights and wrongs""","""All concepts of right and wrong are atheists and agnostics""",,
31734,8264,"""That ’ s a bit creepy . Let me ask you something . You think there are no objective rights and wrongs , I believe there are . Do you think I ’ m wrong ?""","""All concepts of right and wrong are subjective . It is that atheists and agnostics are more honest about it .""",DISAGREE,"""think there are no objective rights and wrongs , I believe there are .""","""All concepts of right and wrong are subjective .""",,
31737,8264,"""That ’ s a bit creepy . Let me ask you something . You think there are no objective rights and wrongs , I believe there are . Do you think I ’ m wrong ?""","""All concepts of right and wrong are subjective . It is that atheists and agnostics are more honest about it .""",DISAGREE,"""creepy rights wrongs believe""","""concepts right wrong atheists agnostics honest""",,
31739,8265,"""A light year is the distance light would travel in a year if at the speed we have computed it to be on earth . How gravity affects light in space in pure specualtion as almost all of the cosmological theories are .""","""Ever heard of gravitational lensing ? It was the FIRST test of general relavtivity back in 1919. http : //archive.ncsa.uiuc.edu/Cyberia ... steinTest.html""",DISAGREE,"""How gravity affects light in space in pure specualtion as almost all of the cosmological theories are .""","""Ever heard of gravitational lensing ? It was the FIRST test of general relavtivity back in""",,
31743,8265,"""A light year is the distance light would travel in a year if at the speed we have computed it to be on earth . How gravity affects light in space in pure specualtion as almost all of the cosmological theories are .""","""Ever heard of gravitational lensing ? It was the FIRST test of general relavtivity back in 1919. http : //archive.ncsa.uiuc.edu/Cyberia ... steinTest.html""",DISAGREE,"""How gravity affects light in space in pure specualtion as almost all of the cosmological theories are .""","""It was the FIRST test of general relavtivity back in""",,
31782,8273,"""Originally posted by lurch Evolution is a change in the frequency in alleles in a population over time .""","""Could you please cite where you are getting this biological definition of evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution is a change in the frequency in alleles in a population over time .""","""Could you please cite where you are getting this biological definition of evolution ?""",,
31785,8273,"""Originally posted by lurch Evolution is a change in the frequency in alleles in a population over time .""","""Could you please cite where you are getting this biological definition of evolution ?""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by lurch Evolution is a change in the frequency""","""please cite where you are getting this biological definition of evolution""",,
31802,8277,"""When you use the word `` creation `` ( usually in reference to the Bible ) , are you not referring to the creation of the universe up to now , including the events of Noah 's Flood and the confusion at Babel ?""","""I am refering to the YEC position when I use the term `` creation `` .""",AGREE,"""creation Noah 's Flood Babel""","""YEC position ``""",,
31808,8279,"""Government is there to apply limits to what is permitted , based on the will of the people .""","""I 've heard a lot of naive stuff before , but that 's a new one . I do n't think I 've ever heard anything more simpleminded in nature . With your own government dictating that you ca n't inflict injury on those that would hurt you , they 're not acting in your best interest . Nor are they when the police are tasked with making sure your windows and doors are locked up tight at night .""",DISAGREE,"""Government is there to apply limits to what is permitted , based on the will of the people .""","""simpleminded With your own government dictating that you ca n't inflict injury on those that would hurt you""",,
31810,8279,"""Government is there to apply limits to what is permitted , based on the will of the people .""","""I 've heard a lot of naive stuff before , but that 's a new one . I do n't think I 've ever heard anything more simpleminded in nature . With your own government dictating that you ca n't inflict injury on those that would hurt you , they 're not acting in your best interest . Nor are they when the police are tasked with making sure your windows and doors are locked up tight at night .""",DISAGREE,"""Government is there to apply limits to what is permitted , based on the will of the people .""","""With your own government dictating that you ca n't inflict injury on those that would hurt you , they 're not acting in your best interest .""",,
31812,8280,"""The only American administration to seize weapons was the Bush administration during the Katrina disaster on the Gulf Coast . Republicans are the only ones who invade your homes to seize your weaponry""","""Say that again ? Mayor Nagin was the one who gave the order for all weapons to be seized , Bush had absolutely nothing to do with it . President Bush even signed into federal law the bill that would prevent such an occurrence from ever happening again , by making it a crime for any government organization to seize firearms during a declared state of emergency . Try again , Simone .""",DISAGREE,"""Republicans are the only ones who invade your homes to seize your weaponry""","""Mayor Nagin was the one who gave the order for all weapons to be seized ,""",,
31838,8286,"""No , because 2+2= 4 if you agree with it or not . It ’ s a concept that is not dependent on man to agree with it .""","""That 's EXACTLY the point . Regardless of whether or not human minds think differently , whichever mind produced and agrees that 2+2=4 is absolutely correct , the rest are wrong . We know this because we can observe and test the concept in the physical world and prove that it is true . This goes for just about anything , dissention in the face of facts does not change the facts . IMHO , this invalidates your claim that something produced in the human mind is not absolute due to some human minds being contradictory .""",DISAGREE,"""No , because 2+2= 4 if you agree with it or not . It ’ s a concept that is not dependent on man to agree with it .""","""this invalidates your claim that something produced in the human mind is not absolute due to some human minds being contradictory .""",,
31851,8290,"""how is disproving the best explanation scientists can come up with for the diversity of life without divine intervention not an argument for divine intervention ?""","""Because the correct alternative to the best naturalistic explanation scientists have come up with so far may well be an even better naturalistic explanation , not divine intervention .""",DISAGREE,"""the best explanation scientists come up with divine intervention not an""","""Because the correct alternative to the best naturalistic explanation scientists have come up with so far may well be an even better naturalistic explanation , not divine intervention .""",,
31858,8291,"""Actually , the title is a little deceptive , however I have noticed that one verse in his new song `` Runaway Love `` , one of the verses brings up something relevant on the abortion debate . Verse 3 goes of the song , I noticed goes : `` Little Erica is eleven years old She 's steady trying to figure why the world is so cold So she pops x to get rid of all the pain 'Cause she 's having sex with a boy who 's sixteen Emotions run deep and she thinks she 's in love So there 's no protection he 's using no glove Never thinking 'bout the consequences of her actions Living for today and not tomorrow 's satisfaction The days go by and her belly gets big The father bails out he ai n't ready for a kid Knowing her mama will blow it all outta proportion Plus she lives poor so no money for abortion Erica is stuck up in the world on her own Forced to think that hell is a place called home Nothing else to do but get her clothes and pack She say she 's about to run away and never come back. `` I know its not completely relevant to the abortion issue , but it is very relevant to the lives of little girls living in poverty and being abused . I would like to know what your opinion of the verse is .""","""Ludacris and many others in the hip hop scene disrespect women with their lyrics and videos . Much of what hip hop puts out contributes to unwanted pregnancies .""",DISAGREE,"""I have noticed that one verse in his new song""","""their lyrics and videos""",,
31855,8291,"""Actually , the title is a little deceptive , however I have noticed that one verse in his new song `` Runaway Love `` , one of the verses brings up something relevant on the abortion debate . Verse 3 goes of the song , I noticed goes : `` Little Erica is eleven years old She 's steady trying to figure why the world is so cold So she pops x to get rid of all the pain 'Cause she 's having sex with a boy who 's sixteen Emotions run deep and she thinks she 's in love So there 's no protection he 's using no glove Never thinking 'bout the consequences of her actions Living for today and not tomorrow 's satisfaction The days go by and her belly gets big The father bails out he ai n't ready for a kid Knowing her mama will blow it all outta proportion Plus she lives poor so no money for abortion Erica is stuck up in the world on her own Forced to think that hell is a place called home Nothing else to do but get her clothes and pack She say she 's about to run away and never come back. `` I know its not completely relevant to the abortion issue , but it is very relevant to the lives of little girls living in poverty and being abused . I would like to know what your opinion of the verse is .""","""Ludacris and many others in the hip hop scene disrespect women with their lyrics and videos . Much of what hip hop puts out contributes to unwanted pregnancies .""",DISAGREE,"""Actually , the title is a little deceptive , however I have noticed that one verse in his new song `` Runaway Love `` , one of the verses brings up something relevant on the abortion debate .""","""Ludacris and many others in the hip hop scene disrespect women with their lyrics and videos . Much of what hip hop puts out contributes to unwanted pregnancies .""",,
31917,8304,"""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""","""but there is no federal law that says children cant tote around guns their parents own how many times do I have to explain it you""",DISAGREE,"""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""","""but there is no federal law that says children cant tote around guns their parents own""",,
31918,8304,"""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""","""but there is no federal law that says children cant tote around guns their parents own how many times do I have to explain it you""",DISAGREE,"""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""","""but there is no federal law that says children cant tote around guns their parents""",,
31921,8305,"""Good , then you go back to the first point , which is that you can not rationally claim to have knowledge of the unknowable . So yes , you 're back to either being rational and not accepting god , or being irrational and accepting knowledge of the unknowable . I do n't make the rules Jim .""","""Not having knowledge of an unknown says nothing about it 's existence . I am thankful ( to God ) that neither you nor I make the rules . ... God be with you .""",DISAGREE,"""rationally claim knowledge unknowable accepting god the rules Jim""","""having knowledge existence God God be""",,
31928,8305,"""Good , then you go back to the first point , which is that you can not rationally claim to have knowledge of the unknowable . So yes , you 're back to either being rational and not accepting god , or being irrational and accepting knowledge of the unknowable . I do n't make the rules Jim .""","""Not having knowledge of an unknown says nothing about it 's existence . I am thankful ( to God ) that neither you nor I make the rules . ... God be with you .""",DISAGREE,"""knowledge of the unknowable I do n't make the rules""","""Not having knowledge of an unknown says nothing about it 's existence I am thankful ( to God ) that neither you nor I make the rules""",,
31933,8306,"""They would open up to sicknesses far more easily when wounded , hardly the sort of thing a species wants .""","""Again , modern birds seem to do fine as do gliding mammals such as flying squirrels .""",DISAGREE,"""would open up to sicknesses hardly the sort of thing a species wants""","""Again modern birds seem to do fine""",,
31940,8307,"""I think you , The Barbarian , and Close_slave_can are basically asking the same question . The problem is , you are all trying to look at these predictions through the lense of the evolutionary paradigm .""","""Well , the question I am asking is for you to provide a valid scientific prediction based on creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""predictions through the lense of the evolutionary paradigm""","""prediction based on creationism""",,
31943,8307,"""I think you , The Barbarian , and Close_slave_can are basically asking the same question . The problem is , you are all trying to look at these predictions through the lense of the evolutionary paradigm .""","""Well , the question I am asking is for you to provide a valid scientific prediction based on creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""The Barbarian , and Close_slave_can are basically asking the same question .""","""the question I am asking is for you to provide a valid scientific prediction based on creationism .""",,
31949,8308,"""Let 's get real here . The man puts out fires and rescues people . Do you really think he 's going to stop and ask people before he carries them out of a burning building `` wait . . . are you gay ? Because if you are I 'm sorry someone else will have to do this. `` This idea that someone 's political and/or ideological view on a public referendum issue should have any bearing on whether he should be allowed to do other things is scary , if you ask me . It 's stepping into the realm of thought-police fascism .""","""No . It steps firmly in the realm of REALITY Jyoshu . Have you never heard people talk about how police in an area respond in X amount of time for one situation , but for a different situation , like in a neighborhood predominantly black or gay or ___ , the response time is four times as long ? Have you never heard of how there have been cases where people have died because they tried to get medical help at the `` white `` hospital ? Or how about you read about THIS case and tell me that these concerns are n't real ...""",DISAGREE,"""Do you really think he 's going to stop and ask people before he carries them out""","""Have you never heard people talk about how police in an area respond""",,
31954,8308,"""Let 's get real here . The man puts out fires and rescues people . Do you really think he 's going to stop and ask people before he carries them out of a burning building `` wait . . . are you gay ? Because if you are I 'm sorry someone else will have to do this. `` This idea that someone 's political and/or ideological view on a public referendum issue should have any bearing on whether he should be allowed to do other things is scary , if you ask me . It 's stepping into the realm of thought-police fascism .""","""No . It steps firmly in the realm of REALITY Jyoshu . Have you never heard people talk about how police in an area respond in X amount of time for one situation , but for a different situation , like in a neighborhood predominantly black or gay or ___ , the response time is four times as long ? Have you never heard of how there have been cases where people have died because they tried to get medical help at the `` white `` hospital ? Or how about you read about THIS case and tell me that these concerns are n't real ...""",DISAGREE,"""Do you really think he 's going to stop and ask people before he carries them out of a burning building `` wait . . . are you gay ?""","""No""",,
31958,8309,"""The reason his sentiments confirm the worst fears of creationists is n't because Lewontin alone has those sentiments , it 's because creationists can clearly see those sentiments in the NY Times editorial board , CNN , ABC , Dan Rather , Handgun Control , The Sierra Club - the list is almost endless .""","""So everyone thinks that `` evolutionists `` should seize power or something ? If that is true , it is because evolution is very widely accepted .""",DISAGREE,"""The reason his sentiments confirm the worst fears of creationists is n't because Lewontin alone has those sentiments , it 's because creationists can clearly see those sentiments""","""everyone thinks that `` evolutionists `` should seize power or something ?""",,
31960,8309,"""The reason his sentiments confirm the worst fears of creationists is n't because Lewontin alone has those sentiments , it 's because creationists can clearly see those sentiments in the NY Times editorial board , CNN , ABC , Dan Rather , Handgun Control , The Sierra Club - the list is almost endless .""","""So everyone thinks that `` evolutionists `` should seize power or something ? If that is true , it is because evolution is very widely accepted .""",DISAGREE,"""sentiments confirm creationists Lewontin NY CNN ABC Dan Rather The Sierra almost endless .""","""evolutionists `` something ? evolution widely accepted .""",,
31979,8323,"""... and it would be safe to assume God does n't have reproductive organs .... because he is a Holy God ...""","""Are you implying that an entity with reproductive organs can not be holy ? Are you implying that reproduction in itself is not a holy process ?""",DISAGREE,"""have reproductive organs .... because he is a Holy God ...""","""Are you implying that reproduction in itself is not a holy process""",,
31990,8332,"""Strike 2 .""","""He 's almost out , folks !""",DISAGREE,"""Strike 2""","""He 's almost out""",,
31993,8333,"""Look at S Africa , where illegal posession of a firearm can net you the death penalty . Besides the highest murder rate in the western world , and the fact that they drive around with flamethrowers on their cars because carjackings and violent thefts are so common , it is virtually a pacifist utopia .""","""You started off with criticizing gun banning , but now you seem to be criticizing tough punishments for criminals . A May 2006 article in the Cape Times said that `` National law currently provides for a sentence of 25 years for illegal firearm possession. `` http : //www.capetimes.co.za/index.php ... icleId=3230121 So if the death penalty is the punishment for illegal gun possession then I suppose the law must have changed recently . I wonder if the people who claim that we do n't need more gun laws but just tougher punishments for people who break current gun laws would support such a penalty .""",DISAGREE,"""illegal posession of a firearm can net you the death penalty .""","""but now you seem to be criticizing tough punishments for criminals .""",,
32019,8337,"""You say , `` The universe and earth are very old . We know this as a fact. `` What is meant by `` old `` ?""","""I can not remember the latest figures , but the Earth is around 4.5 billion years old and the universe is around 13 billion years old I think .""",DISAGREE,"""You say , `` The universe and earth are very old . We know this as a fact. `` What is meant by `` old `` ?""","""I can not remember the latest figures , but the Earth is around 4.5 billion years old and the universe is around 13 billion years old I think .""",,
32016,8337,"""You say , `` The universe and earth are very old . We know this as a fact. `` What is meant by `` old `` ?""","""I can not remember the latest figures , but the Earth is around 4.5 billion years old and the universe is around 13 billion years old I think .""",DISAGREE,"""The universe and earth are very old .""","""but the Earth is around 4.5 billion years old""",,
32027,8339,"""Very interesting , and I agree with you . However , one thing to consider while debating pro-lifers is that they generally do not care about women 's rights .""","""It 's not that we pro life people do n't care about womens rights it 's that we care about the babies rights too . They wo n't do abortion after the 3rd month right ? Well the baby is living , it has a heartbeat , it has nerves , eyes , and all that . I think it is sickening when people say that the baby or fetus whatever you want to call it does n't feel anything . Everyone always says `` what if they get raped ? Would you have the baby ? `` Well for one only 1 % of abortions are done because of rape . Secondly if you are raped you can go to the hospital and tell them what happened and they will do an emergency IUD . Why does the women get to choose who can come into the world ? They are going to kill it and they do n't care . You never knew what the baby could have been . They could have been the one to find the cure to cancer , aids , or another uncurable disease . Your not giving the baby a chance and that is wrong and not fair . Thats my opinion .""",DISAGREE,"""one thing to consider while debating pro-lifers is that they generally do not care about women 's rights .""","""It 's not that we pro life people do n't care about womens rights it 's that we care about the babies rights too .""",,
32039,8341,"""I saw Bowling for Columbine . It was excellent . It showed how many Americans have this idea that problems are solved with violence . That 's the way that problems are often dealt with domestically and overseas . That 's why America drops so many bombs on people in foreign nations and kills them . They interviewed some Canadians in the film and the Canadians says that they like to negotiate and work things out . That 's the way they solve problems- not through violence and killing people . I think this is very relevant to the gun culture in America . Those in the gun culture tend to have the attitude that problems can be solved with violence- thus the necessity of owning an instrument of death and destruction . I remember that Michael Moore went into the house of one gun owner and the gun owner showed him the loaded gun that he slept with under his pillow . I think that 's dangerous and totally stupid to sleep with a gun under your pillow . The film also examined famous people from the gun culture like Terry Nichols and Timothy McVeigh . Moore also accomplished some good things . He went to K-mart with some victims of Columbine and convinced K-mart to stop selling handgun ammunition .""","""And you do not have an agenda ... oh and we should be more like the Canadiens ? Why does n't Canada fund a militrary ? And what do they do with that 80 % tax rate ... obnoxious ......""",DISAGREE,"""the Canadians says that they like to negotiate and work things out .""","""Why does n't Canada fund a militrary ?""",,
32058,8345,"""Offspring vary among themselves , and are not carbon copies of an immutable type . Stop the Press ! Evolutionists often just glide over this very important point . Indeed , each creature in a population is not a carbon copy of the next .... HOWEVER ... the notion that these differences can spell the difference between who breeds and who does n't is in huge error . Humans , for instance vary widely in appearance ... but does that mean that some of us will be genetically less likely to breed ? That makes no sense .""","""Not `` genetically `` ; `` statistically `` is more accurate . Yes , even some people are statistically less likely to breed . There are currently many solutions to problems which would usually be disabling to people , but selection is evident in countries without those solutions .""",DISAGREE,"""Humans , for instance vary widely in appearance ... but does that mean that some of us will be genetically less likely to breed""","""Not `` genetically `` ; `` statistically `` is more accurate . Yes , even some people are statistically less likely to breed""",,
32070,8347,"""Teach the kids what is conjecture and what is not .""","""We do . We do n't even teach the conjecture . And we do n't teach superstition . That 's why creationism is n't taught .""",AGREE,"""Teach the kids what is conjecture and what is not .""","""We do""",,
32081,8350,"""What are you talking about .... This is the law : A well regulated Militia , being necessary to the security of a free State , the right of the people to keep and bear Arms , shall not be infringed . How is this Anarchy ? BTW the article is being sarcastic if you did n't get it , It demonstrates the hypocracy of the lunatic fringe lefties out there ... Did Rosie bring her armed guards to san fran to get hitched ?""","""There is quite a bit of debate what the militia can be interpreted as , and individuals ignoring the laws as they see fit is anarchy ( checked out the Free State project , you are a beleiver in Arnacho-captalism or so it seems which is a form of anarchy ) , nothing nessesarily wrong with it though . Understood the point it was making , just the logic is flawed . The fact the city had to disobey state laws is a good example of the lunatic right , though this is n't really the issue here .""",AGREE,"""How is this Anarchy ? BTW the article is being sarcastic if you did n't get it , It demonstrates the hypocracy of the lunatic fringe lefties out there""","""fact the city had to disobey state laws is a good example of the lunatic right , though this is n't really the issue here""",,
32084,8350,"""What are you talking about .... This is the law : A well regulated Militia , being necessary to the security of a free State , the right of the people to keep and bear Arms , shall not be infringed . How is this Anarchy ? BTW the article is being sarcastic if you did n't get it , It demonstrates the hypocracy of the lunatic fringe lefties out there ... Did Rosie bring her armed guards to san fran to get hitched ?""","""There is quite a bit of debate what the militia can be interpreted as , and individuals ignoring the laws as they see fit is anarchy ( checked out the Free State project , you are a beleiver in Arnacho-captalism or so it seems which is a form of anarchy ) , nothing nessesarily wrong with it though . Understood the point it was making , just the logic is flawed . The fact the city had to disobey state laws is a good example of the lunatic right , though this is n't really the issue here .""",AGREE,"""A well regulated Militia , being necessary to the security of a free State , the right of the people to keep and bear Arms , shall not be infringed .""","""There is quite a bit of debate what the militia can be interpreted as , and individuals ignoring the laws as they see fit is anarchy""",,
32102,8368,"""Oh ! You mean how it 's a tail during the earlier stages of fetal develop -- Ah , now I see . That was supposed to be the trick . Sorry Electrolyte , but that was not a funny joke .""","""You know , I 'm all for punny jokes ( even moreso than most people ) , but that 's not what I meant . I seriously want a designist explanation for the development , as opposed to the Hovindian `` it is an anchor point for muscles `` explanation of its existence . ( Although , it 's not as if we do n't have any examples that do n't have that `` problem. `` )""",DISAGREE,"""That was supposed to be the trick . Sorry Electrolyte , but that was not a funny joke .""","""You know , I 'm all for punny jokes ( even moreso than most people ) , but that 's not what I meant .""",,
32103,8369,"""For I was an hungred , and ye gave me meat : I was thirsty , and ye gave me drink : I was a stranger , and ye took me in : Naked , and ye clothed me : I was sick , and ye visited me : I was in prison , and ye came unto me .""","""Interesting that Jesus does not say , `` This do , only after you have determined whether or not I am an illegal , or whether or not the reason why I am homeless is a reason that satisfied you . I am sorry that someone near to you was attacked . I do not believe that the attack occurred simply because the attacker was illegal . As a matter of fact , all such attacks are illegal , unlawful , whether perpetrated by an `` illegal `` or anyone else . I hope that the attacker was brought to justice and punished .""",DISAGREE,"""I was thirsty , and ye gave me drink : I was a stranger , I was in prison , and ye came unto me .""","""I am sorry that someone near to you was attacked . I do not believe that the attack occurred simply because the attacker was illegal""",,
32106,8369,"""For I was an hungred , and ye gave me meat : I was thirsty , and ye gave me drink : I was a stranger , and ye took me in : Naked , and ye clothed me : I was sick , and ye visited me : I was in prison , and ye came unto me .""","""Interesting that Jesus does not say , `` This do , only after you have determined whether or not I am an illegal , or whether or not the reason why I am homeless is a reason that satisfied you . I am sorry that someone near to you was attacked . I do not believe that the attack occurred simply because the attacker was illegal . As a matter of fact , all such attacks are illegal , unlawful , whether perpetrated by an `` illegal `` or anyone else . I hope that the attacker was brought to justice and punished .""",DISAGREE,"""For I was an hungred , and ye gave me meat : I was thirsty ,""","""Interesting that Jesus does not say , `` This do ,""",,
32133,8375,"""What amazes me is someone could actually believe a constitutional ban on gay marriage is in anyway a contributing factor to divorce rates .""","""Simone continues to amaze us all""",AGREE,"""What amazes me is someone could actually believe a constitutional ban on gay marriage is in anyway a contributing factor to divorce rates""","""Simone continues to amaze us all""",,
32155,8380,"""If a particular animal had a beneficial mutation , it may not necessarily be able to breed to pass that on ... it might have the ability to digest a new type of food , but it may be too small to compete against a larger male .""","""I see . You are claiming that this is the case with every single beneficial mutation in every species through all time ? If that is not what you are saying , then what is your point ? Suppose what you say is true half the time . Then the gene gets passed on half the time . And what if the mutation occurs in the larger male ?""",DISAGREE,"""If a particular animal had a beneficial mutation , it may not necessarily be able to breed to pass that on ... it might have the ability to digest a new type of food , but it may be too small to compete against a larger male .""","""I see . You are claiming that this is the case with every single beneficial mutation in every species through all time ? If that is not what you are saying , then what is your point ? Suppose what you say is true half the time . Then the gene gets passed on half the time . And what if the mutation occurs in the larger male ?""",,
32178,8384,"""Logical truths simply follow from the way in which concepts are defined . 1 + 1 = 2 is true and always true because of the meaning of ( 1 ) , the + sign , and = . They are not dependent on matter , nor are they dependent on god . It is true regardless of whether there is any matter which the number 1 can be used to describe , or regardless of whether any conscious being exists which can think it . These are not concepts created by man , but discovered by him .""","""I 'm still having a hard time with this . If nothing exists , no matter , then how can `` the number one `` exist ? On what basis is it defined ? If there is only nothing , then you ca n't add to it , like I said 0+0=0 . I know this is getting slightly off topic and philosophical , but it would seem to me that `` concepts `` , and I 'm not sure exactly how that 's being defined , must have a basis in reality , and therefore in matter .""",DISAGREE,"""They are not dependent on matter , nor are they dependent on god .""","""On what basis is it defined ? If there is only nothing , then you ca n't add to it ,""",,
32185,8386,"""Well , there it is . You have 'gone over to the dark side ' . Too bad . I hope it 's a temporary lapse , but if not , our debate was quite good while it lasted .""","""I think I 've been remarkably patient so far , actually . I made a simple personal statement to qualify my opinions , and you have decided that I 'm lying or deluded because that better fits the image of 'darwinists ' you like to think you 're debating . I 've endured with very little complaint regular comments deriding my intellect , and even kept my temper when hours of painstakingly constructed logical argument and evidence is completely ignored or dismissed as 'blowing smoke ' because you ca n't come up with a better response . The idea that I 'm the one somehow teetering on the brink of civilised debate , and should mend my ways lest I topple into your personal oubliette ... I think you need a quick perspective and soda .""",DISAGREE,"""Well , there it You have 'gone over to the dark side ' . Too bad . I hope it 's a temporary lapse , but if not , our debate was quite good while it lasted .""","""I think I 've been remarkably patient so far , actually . I made a simple personal statement to qualify my opinions , and you have decided that I 'm lying or deluded because that better fits the image of 'darwinists ' you like to think you 're I 've endured with very little complaint regular comments deriding my intellect , and even kept my temper when hours of painstakingly constructed logical argument and evidence is completely ignored or dismissed as 'blowing smoke ' because you ca n't come up with a better The idea that I 'm the one somehow teetering on the brink of civilised debate , and should mend my ways lest I topple into your personal oubliette ... I think you need a quick perspective and soda .""",,
32191,8388,"""Then , how much money should spend on the war on terror ? Should we bankrupt the country to do it ? Is it necessary to spend so much that we go bankrupt , or is it better to wisely spend the money we have and to fight an intellegent war against terror ?""","""If we bankrupt the country , the war on terror wo n't be the reason . Wasteful domestic spending is the only reason we have trouble funding the war on terror . We need to get intellegent with domestic spending . We could start with the $ 7 billion EPA .""",DISAGREE,"""how much money should spend on the war on terror ? Should we bankrupt the country to do it ?""","""If we bankrupt the country , the war on terror wo n't be the reason .""",,
32214,8404,"""None that prove one became another . Of course dinos , birds , and fish exist and scientist study them -or their remains as with dinos . Of course some dinosaurs are still alive like alligators , monitor lizards etc .""","""Well , there is now string theory , which has grown into M-theory , which may have a rational answer ( at least a mathematical one ) . But calling it a theory is really a misnomer . It 's more like a hypothetical model .""",DISAGREE,"""None that prove one became another . Of course dinos , birds , and fish exist and scientist study them -or their remains as with dinos . Of course some dinosaurs are still alive like alligators , monitor lizards etc .""","""Well there is now string theory , which has grown into M-theory , which may have a rational answer ( at least a mathematical one ) . But calling it a theory is really a misnomer . It 's more like a hypothetical model .""",,
32213,8404,"""None that prove one became another . Of course dinos , birds , and fish exist and scientist study them -or their remains as with dinos . Of course some dinosaurs are still alive like alligators , monitor lizards etc .""","""Well , there is now string theory , which has grown into M-theory , which may have a rational answer ( at least a mathematical one ) . But calling it a theory is really a misnomer . It 's more like a hypothetical model .""",DISAGREE,"""Of course some dinosaurs are still alive like alligators , monitor lizards etc .""","""there is now string theory , which has grown into M-theory , which may have a rational answer""",,
32230,8409,"""You 're the expert on that feeling .....""","""You got ta wonder . He keeps saying he 's won but he constantly ignores people calling his bluffs . I 'm not sure whether to laugh or cry at a guy who think 's he 's so smart when he ca n't even understand what erosion is and takes the commercial art of villagers as proof of creation .""",DISAGREE,"""You 're the expert on that feeling""","""He keeps saying he 's won but he constantly ignores people calling his bluffs .""",,
32232,8409,"""You 're the expert on that feeling .....""","""You got ta wonder . He keeps saying he 's won but he constantly ignores people calling his bluffs . I 'm not sure whether to laugh or cry at a guy who think 's he 's so smart when he ca n't even understand what erosion is and takes the commercial art of villagers as proof of creation .""",DISAGREE,"""You 're the expert on that feeling""","""He keeps saying he 's won but he constantly ignores people calling his bluffs .""",,
32236,8410,"""You have fallen into the same trap as the IDers . When we say `` designed `` there is an unspoken prepositional phrase -- `` by an intelligent entity `` . What is really meant by `` designed `` -- in both Paley and IDers -- is that plants and animals are manufactured . Just like the watch was manufactured .""","""But not all `` designs `` are manufactured . Take the repetitive ridges of sand on a beach . They are created by the motion of the water . Shall I remind you of the humorous story about the `` image of Jesus `` that attracted much attention , yet turned out to be a coincidence of shadows ? This is why I insist upon your defining the terms you 're using .""",DISAGREE,"""designed by an intelligent entity""","""But not all `` designs `` are , be a coincidence""",,
32260,8414,"""They crammed these critters in a sea worthy vessel made exclusively of gopher wood . The gopher wood was structurally sound enough to support the weight of said critters . The ark floated about like a cork for 40 days , etc whereupon the cargo was released to repopulate the world to present population levels .""","""Many of the animals were young so they weighed less than full grown animals , they did n't get pregnant and make more animals during the journey and they consumed less food because of their size . I 'm surprised you did n't know that Mutz .""",DISAGREE,"""The gopher wood was structurally sound enough to support the weight of said critters .""","""Many of the animals were young so they weighed less than full grown animals , they did n't get pregnant and make more animals during the journey and they consumed less food because of their size .""",,
32270,8417,"""`` Am I prepared to be a mother ? '' , who gets to answer it ? Is it the role of the State or of the Church to tell her what the answer to that question is ?""","""I would just want the woman to ask that question before she spreads her legs . Dono""",DISAGREE,"""Am I prepared to be a mother ? '' , who gets to answer it ?""","""I would just want the woman to ask that question before she spreads her legs .""",,
32271,8417,"""`` Am I prepared to be a mother ? '' , who gets to answer it ? Is it the role of the State or of the Church to tell her what the answer to that question is ?""","""I would just want the woman to ask that question before she spreads her legs . Dono""",DISAGREE,"""Is it the role of the State or of the Church to tell her what the answer to that question is ?""","""I would just want the woman to ask that question before she spreads her legs""",,
32282,8422,"""Criminals continually inform the public that their greatest fear is a victim capable of fighting back against them and possibly killing them .""","""And that fear could motivate the criminals to be armed themselves- thus putting the public in more danger . Such a fear could start an arms race . Try looking at the big picture .""",DISAGREE,"""their greatest fear is a victim capable of fighting back against them and possibly killing them .""","""fear could motivate the criminals to be armed""",,
32287,8423,"""Originally posted by Tim So you say that God is fake ? How about considering the arguments for God 's existence on this website ? http : //home.clear.net.nz/pages/bryanp/Other/atheis1.htm""","""The Ontological argument ? Seriously ? Those strawmen concerning atheism , question-begging and non-sequiturs were n't too shabby either .""",DISAGREE,"""How about considering the arguments on this website""","""The Ontological argument ? Seriously ?""",,
32292,8424,"""I have already listened to 163 words of your wind up ( which my computer tells me can be surmised in 17 ) so cut some slack jones ! See ? Your logic is allready falling apart . I dont think this is worth my time . What do you think ?""","""[ note : post deleted ] You appear not to understand the purpose of this thread : to find out what side people are on and why . What you have done instead of answer the questions is made irrelevant comments on various aspects of my writing , my username , and my personal beliefs . If you do not intend to add relevant information to the thread ( such as your views ) , please do not post here . Finally , consider what you have posted so far : a ) you fail to understand/respond to what I ask b ) you accuse my logic of falling apart when this thread is based mostly on opinion c ) you believe that your computer is better at writing posts than a person is Is that relevant information ?""",DISAGREE,"""already Your logic is falling apart . I think this is worth my time . do""","""What you have done instead of answer the questions is made irrelevant comments on various aspects of my writing , my username , and my personal beliefs .""",,
32293,8424,"""I have already listened to 163 words of your wind up ( which my computer tells me can be surmised in 17 ) so cut some slack jones ! See ? Your logic is allready falling apart . I dont think this is worth my time . What do you think ?""","""[ note : post deleted ] You appear not to understand the purpose of this thread : to find out what side people are on and why . What you have done instead of answer the questions is made irrelevant comments on various aspects of my writing , my username , and my personal beliefs . If you do not intend to add relevant information to the thread ( such as your views ) , please do not post here . Finally , consider what you have posted so far : a ) you fail to understand/respond to what I ask b ) you accuse my logic of falling apart when this thread is based mostly on opinion c ) you believe that your computer is better at writing posts than a person is Is that relevant information ?""",DISAGREE,"""I have already listened to 163 words of your wind up ( which my computer tells me can be surmised in 17 ) so cut some slack jones ! See ?""","""You appear not to understand the purpose of this thread : to find out what side people are on and why What you have done instead of answer the questions is made irrelevant comments on various aspects of my writing , my username""",,
32296,8425,"""... Wow . You think creationism has hard things to explain ? Not near as hard as evolutionism . But I 'd love to hear the attempts .""","""Just for the sake of argument , let 's assume evolutionists had trouble explaining away the tongue of the woodpecker . How in any sense is creationism the alternative ? No explanation therefore God . What bloody rubbish . And why do the same people keep posting the same crapola on different sites under different names ? Ah , yes . Created without a brain . The only logical non-evolutionary explanation .""",DISAGREE,"""You think creationism has hard things to explain ? Not near as hard as evolutionism . But I 'd love to hear the attempts .""","""Just for the sake of argument , let 's assume evolutionists had trouble explaining away the tongue of the woodpecker .""",,
32308,8427,"""Yet another false assessment . Why is posting Christian historical context `` anti-Christian `` ?""","""Now who 's being disengenuous ? When was the last time one of you gays posted a pro-Christian thread ? lYou ONLY post anti-Christian threads , even though Christianity has been responsible for much of the good in the world .""",DISAGREE,"""Why is posting Christian historical context `` anti-Christian `` ?""","""When was the last time one of you gays posted a pro-Christian thread ?""",,
32314,8428,"""As I see it the problem in this country is not guns . The problem is that our society has gotten soft on crime and pretty much gotten to the point of `` no one is responsible for their own behavior `` . Take the law suits against the gun manufacturer 's . Colt comes to mind . Someone used a Colt firearm in a murder and the victim 's family sued Colt for the wrongful death of a family member . The court 's basically said that colt should have known that their products may have been used in a crime and not sold them to someone who could have used it in the commision of a crime . That being the case , why ca n't the auto manufacturer 's be sued when one of their vehicles is used in the commision of a crime ? Why ca n't Ford or Chevy be sued when one of their vehicles is used in a DUI vehicular homicide ? The reasoning I have read is that the auto maker 's are unable to control the end use of their products . So how can one manufacturer be held responsible for the end use of their product and not another ? Another case in point . Less than a hundred years ago , if you were convicted of a murder you were sentenced to death and the sentence was carried out . Now if you murder somebody , you can plea bargain it down to involuntary manslaughter , get sentenced to 18 to 23 months , and be paroled in 9 to 12 month 's on good behavior . Now some would say the death penalty is cruel and unusual punishment . To them I put this question . What do you call kidnapping a child from her bedroom , raping and sodomizing her , putting her on a hot engine block , then strangling her . Do n't know about the rest of society , but that qualifies as cruel and unusual punishment in my book . By the way , the guy that did this was sentenced to life in prison on the taxpayer 's dime . No longer does the punishment fit the crime in this country . We have put a price tag on human life and I must say it is a damn cheap one . Guns are not the problem in this country . The problem is a government who trying to erode our rights to further their own agenda . Now for those who say we have a police force to protect us , if you would actually read their purpose , you would see that the police force has no duty to protect the individual , only the public in general . I have quite a few friends at the local state police barracks and in general they are opposed to gun control . Most police organization who are for gun control who are for gun control are politically motivated . For those who are going to say I 'm a right wing nut job , I 'll give you this . I served my country in various special operations forces . I can not go into anymore more detail than i 'll give you here , so please do n't ask . Automatic weapons were designed for assualt purposes so I will give you that one . However , as a highly decorated combat veteran I will say this . The most dangerous and demoralizing weapon ever made was a sniper rifle . Death can come from anywhere at anytime . Most have an effective range well over any automatic weapon . Sniper rifles are basically modified hunting rifles that can be duplicated by any gunsmith worth his salt . The effective range on a 5.56mm round ( basically a .223 remington ) fired from an M-16 ( or An AR-15 ) is just over 450 meters . A 7.62 x 54 mm round ( a .308 , a very popular hunting round ) is about 1200 meters . To put this in perspective there is just over 1700 meters in a mile . I do carry a M1911 Colt .45 as a concealed carry weapon . After reading some of the other posts here , I must say I am deeply offended by someone saying that because I carry a CCW I 'm going to shoot someone over a fender bender . I will say that their are some who should n't be carrying a CCW . And I do take responsibilty for my weapons . Unfortunately . I have had to use my weapon on a couple of occasions . Most of the time simply brandishing the weapon and taking control of the situation is enough to end it in a positive way . Only once have I had to discharge my weapon in self defense . By the way , the criminal in on the receiving end of that one had a very long and violent criminal history . I have shed the same blood in the same mud as alot of others to insure that EVERYONE in this country has the freedom to have their own opinions about things . That is a right guarenteed in The Constitution of the United States . Just as it is a right for me to own arms of my choice . Some would say that my RKBA is outdated . To them I ask , what if I think your right to free speech or freedom to religion is outdated ? Should it be changed too ? There are no easy solutions to the problem we as a society are facing . But blaming guns or free speech for our problems is like saying flies cause garbage . It is easy to blame guns for our problems . But they are merely a tool , like a shovel , that unless put into use by a person or persons . it merely just sits there and does nothing . Our society has pushed the issue of not being responsible or held accoutable for your actions way to far . I do have a solution to these problems , but most would find it offensive . What the hell , I 've probably offended alot already , so here goes . We have a three time loser law , that if you have three felony convictions you are considered a career criminal . Now alot of those crimes involve firearms . So if you are convicted of three felony firearms crimes , you should get the death penalty to be carried out immediately . It will take some time to get the message across but iI do believe when the message gets out , firearms crimes will be reduced drastically . Well , I need to get some things done so I 'll write more later . Later all ......""","""I think you hit it pretty much on the money . Gun control does not cure anger , hate , and violence . Talk about responsibility . Gun grabbers blame you and me and our behavior for the violence in this country . They blame everyone except the one who pulls the trigger and takes human life .""",AGREE,"""It is easy to blame guns for our problems . But they are merely a tool , like a shovel , that unless put into use by a person or persons . it merely just sits there and does nothing . Our society has pushed the issue of not being responsible or held accoutable for your actions way to far .""","""They blame everyone except the one who pulls the trigger and takes human life .""",,
32319,8429,"""Pro choicers claim they are for the rights of women . If that is true why do n't pro-choicer want the pregnant women who seek abortion to be informed . I read yesterday , how the pro-choice people are trying to block legislation that would help women make better CHOICES about their pregnancy . If I find the link , I 'll post it , but the legislation was anyone who seeks an abortion , must have access to a sonogram before the abortion . That having an abortion `` may `` cause post-abortion stress syndrome , which for some it does ! It 's sad , pro-choicer , do n't want women to be `` informed `` to the best of their ability . Sonogram can be helpful tool to the WOMAN in helping her make a better CHOICE , and are n't pro-choicers all about CHOICE . So why block this legislation ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate .""","""Anti abortion people want to take a womens right to an abortion away period . Would you force someone to get a sonagram of a tumor and be forced to look at it and think `` do I really want to have this tumor removed ? `` That is exactly what a fetus is and for some women that is how it is viewed .""",DISAGREE,"""Pro choicers claim they are for the rights of women .""","""Anti abortion people want to take a womens right to an abortion away period .""",,
32315,8429,"""Pro choicers claim they are for the rights of women . If that is true why do n't pro-choicer want the pregnant women who seek abortion to be informed . I read yesterday , how the pro-choice people are trying to block legislation that would help women make better CHOICES about their pregnancy . If I find the link , I 'll post it , but the legislation was anyone who seeks an abortion , must have access to a sonogram before the abortion . That having an abortion `` may `` cause post-abortion stress syndrome , which for some it does ! It 's sad , pro-choicer , do n't want women to be `` informed `` to the best of their ability . Sonogram can be helpful tool to the WOMAN in helping her make a better CHOICE , and are n't pro-choicers all about CHOICE . So why block this legislation ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I do n't understand why pro-choicers have so much hate .""","""Anti abortion people want to take a womens right to an abortion away period . Would you force someone to get a sonagram of a tumor and be forced to look at it and think `` do I really want to have this tumor removed ? `` That is exactly what a fetus is and for some women that is how it is viewed .""",DISAGREE,"""pro-choice people are trying to block legislation that would help women make better CHOICES about their pregnancy""","""force someone to get a sonagram of a tumor and be forced to look at it That is exactly what a fetus is and for some women that is how it is viewed .""",,
32325,8430,"""With no idea how or why he came about , he trusts in his mummy it will all be sorted out . From time to time a tune will be played , it 's only his mother humming away . It is like being in space and bouncing around , especially when mum is running up and down . But it is all cut short one bad day , a bladed catheter sliced me away . First it ripped and severed my leg , then it punctured my guts , removed them today . The jabbing and slicing makes me feel bad , I wonder why mummy is making me sad ? I never got the chance to see her face , now I 'm dismembered all over the place . I will never know her or see her , not a trace , I have been removed from the human race . Want to cuddle and give her a kiss , and say hi to my brothers I know I will miss .""","""The only reason why that makes no sense is that no one exists inside the embryo . It would be like writing about someone weeding their garden from a weeds point of view . The anthropomorphization of non-mental existant beings is implausible at least .""",DISAGREE,"""The jabbing and slicing makes me feel bad , I wonder why mummy is making me sad ?""","""It would be like writing about someone weeding their garden from a weeds point of view .""",,
32329,8430,"""With no idea how or why he came about , he trusts in his mummy it will all be sorted out . From time to time a tune will be played , it 's only his mother humming away . It is like being in space and bouncing around , especially when mum is running up and down . But it is all cut short one bad day , a bladed catheter sliced me away . First it ripped and severed my leg , then it punctured my guts , removed them today . The jabbing and slicing makes me feel bad , I wonder why mummy is making me sad ? I never got the chance to see her face , now I 'm dismembered all over the place . I will never know her or see her , not a trace , I have been removed from the human race . Want to cuddle and give her a kiss , and say hi to my brothers I know I will miss .""","""The only reason why that makes no sense is that no one exists inside the embryo . It would be like writing about someone weeding their garden from a weeds point of view . The anthropomorphization of non-mental existant beings is implausible at least .""",DISAGREE,"""With no idea how or why he came about , he trusts in his mummy it will all be sorted out .""","""The anthropomorphization of non-mental existant beings is implausible at least .""",,
32336,8431,"""You mean where the judge did the job she 's paid to do by ruling on the constitutionality of a law ? Or is this only a problem when it 's laws that you like that are ruled unconstitutional ? This is Civics 101 . If the legislature writes a law that is unconstitutional , it 's the job of the judicial branch to strike it down . The legislature can then rewrite the law , or get the constitution amended . I 've yet to see you demonstrate this process being abused in the matter of gay marriage . All you 've done is point out rulings you do n't like .""","""True so true Now a true judicial activist would rule the unconstitutional the very state amendments that definds marriage between a man and a woman even though they are in the constitution . The laws such as in Mass . and other states that ruled on marriage were gender nutral . If the era http : //www.now.org/issues/economic/eratext.html where in the US constitution then marriage equility could be fought in the courts on that level .""",AGREE,"""All you 've done is point out rulings you do n't like .""","""equility could be fought in the courts on that level .""",,
32340,8431,"""You mean where the judge did the job she 's paid to do by ruling on the constitutionality of a law ? Or is this only a problem when it 's laws that you like that are ruled unconstitutional ? This is Civics 101 . If the legislature writes a law that is unconstitutional , it 's the job of the judicial branch to strike it down . The legislature can then rewrite the law , or get the constitution amended . I 've yet to see you demonstrate this process being abused in the matter of gay marriage . All you 've done is point out rulings you do n't like .""","""True so true Now a true judicial activist would rule the unconstitutional the very state amendments that definds marriage between a man and a woman even though they are in the constitution . The laws such as in Mass . and other states that ruled on marriage were gender nutral . If the era http : //www.now.org/issues/economic/eratext.html where in the US constitution then marriage equility could be fought in the courts on that level .""",AGREE,"""judge did the job she 's paid to do by ruling on the constitutionality of a law""","""True so true Now a true judicial activist would rule the unconstitutional the very state amendments that definds marriage between a man and a woman even though they are in the constitution""",,
32358,8433,"""A slightly misleading title by the BBC , but an interesting article non the less ... http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4056559.stm""","""Thanks for the link it was an interesting read . I found the comment in the second to last paragraph most intriguing : 'Scientists have also identified the smallest number of genes required to sustain life in a bacterial cell ( about 350 ) . If they can overcome the many technical hurdles of building a wholly artificial cell in the lab , it is conceivable they could `` create `` - albeit simple - `` life `` . ' Who knows what that line of research might lead us to ?""",AGREE,"""A slightly misleading title by the BBC , but an interesting article non the less ... http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4056559.stm""","""Thanks for the link it was an interesting read . I found the comment in the second to last paragraph most intriguing : 'Scientists have also identified the smallest number of genes required to sustain life in a bacterial cell ( about 350 ) . If they can overcome the many technical hurdles of building a wholly artificial cell in the lab , it is conceivable they could `` create `` - albeit simple - `` life `` . ' Who knows what that line of research might lead us to ?""",,
32359,8433,"""A slightly misleading title by the BBC , but an interesting article non the less ... http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4056559.stm""","""Thanks for the link it was an interesting read . I found the comment in the second to last paragraph most intriguing : 'Scientists have also identified the smallest number of genes required to sustain life in a bacterial cell ( about 350 ) . If they can overcome the many technical hurdles of building a wholly artificial cell in the lab , it is conceivable they could `` create `` - albeit simple - `` life `` . ' Who knows what that line of research might lead us to ?""",AGREE,"""an interesting article http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4056559.stm""","""Thanks for the link it was an interesting read .""",,
32367,8434,"""More like put on `` leave with pay `` aka `` taxpayer funded holiday `` while the woman is charged with `` assaulting a police officer `` to try and cover their misdeeds . At least that seems to be the usual tact in 21st century america .""","""If the taser led to the death of an innocent , they would have been charged with a crime . There is no doubt about that once the investigation was completed . But this is all irrelevant since the baby did n't die and was born without complications . This whole thread is founded upon a huge what if in order to demonize pro-lifers while ignoring what the pro-death advocates truly represent as they support infanticide for the sake of the convenience of irresponsible women .""",DISAGREE,"""At least that seems to be the usual tact in 21st century america .""","""If the taser led to the death of an innocent , they would have been charged with a crime .""",,
32371,8434,"""More like put on `` leave with pay `` aka `` taxpayer funded holiday `` while the woman is charged with `` assaulting a police officer `` to try and cover their misdeeds . At least that seems to be the usual tact in 21st century america .""","""If the taser led to the death of an innocent , they would have been charged with a crime . There is no doubt about that once the investigation was completed . But this is all irrelevant since the baby did n't die and was born without complications . This whole thread is founded upon a huge what if in order to demonize pro-lifers while ignoring what the pro-death advocates truly represent as they support infanticide for the sake of the convenience of irresponsible women .""",DISAGREE,"""while the woman is charged with `` assaulting a police officer `` to try and cover their misdeeds .""","""the to charged with a . is and while""",,
32374,8435,"""ServantOfChrist For every side of every issue you will find studies backing opposing theories . Whatever it is that you believe , if you search within your bias you will always find information and 'evidence ' to support it .""","""Whcih is why , in order to get to at least some semblance of the truth , one must look behind the report to the publication where is appears . There are very few outside the hard right religious radical lunatic fringe ( SoC for example ) who give credence to anything NARTH puts out given their biases . I have yet to see one of these folks explain how allowing same gender couples to marry will negatively impact their own marriages .""",AGREE,"""you search within your bias you will always find information and 'evidence ' to support it .""","""couples to marry will negatively impact their own marriages .""",,
32378,8435,"""ServantOfChrist For every side of every issue you will find studies backing opposing theories . Whatever it is that you believe , if you search within your bias you will always find information and 'evidence ' to support it .""","""Whcih is why , in order to get to at least some semblance of the truth , one must look behind the report to the publication where is appears . There are very few outside the hard right religious radical lunatic fringe ( SoC for example ) who give credence to anything NARTH puts out given their biases . I have yet to see one of these folks explain how allowing same gender couples to marry will negatively impact their own marriages .""",AGREE,"""For every side of every issue you will find studies backing opposing theories .""","""Whcih is why , in order to get to at least some semblance of the truth , one must look behind the report to the publication where is appears .""",,
32389,8444,"""Why has n't natural selection weeded out species with their inferior `` optical vision `` and given them all echolocation , which would allow them superior senses in day and night , rather than just daytime ?""","""Because natural selection works on a cost/benefit basis . For bats and whales and cave-dwelling birds echolocation confers huge advantage , allowing them to exploit niches closed to competing species . For ground- or tree-dwelling terrestrial animals , it would be of marginal or zero benefit , given the 'noise ' in their immediate surroundings .""",DISAGREE,"""Why has n't natural selection weeded out species with their inferior `` optical vision `` and given them all echolocation , ?""","""Because natural selection works on a cost/benefit basis .""",,
32397,8446,"""That 's really simplified . It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant . It lives off her life processes - her blood , her immune system , her calories - it puts stress on her joints , muscles , heart , and bladder . Pregnacy can demand major sacrifices in behavior and diet - some of which can be detrimental . No a baby is n't the woman 's body - but a pregnancy IS .""","""HA wouldnt you say someone who is really overweight actually has more of a problem with stress on their joints , muscels , heart , and bladder than a woman carrying a small child in her womb ? Obesity can demand major scarifices in behavior and diet . Some of which can be detrimental . I really dont see your point because this isnt just a woman 's problem when it comes to these issues you pointed out . And im not really sure what a `` pregnancy `` is according to you .. please explain .. When i hear the word pregnant , i think of 2 people , not just 1 . Also , the baby has its own blood , its own immune system , and contains its own calories once consumed . theres nothing that the mother has that the baby doesnt other than it just needs nutrtion . Just like you need food everyday .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant .""","""HA wouldnt you say someone who is really overweight actually has more of a problem with stress on their joints""",,
32444,8466,"""Acutally global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter , which is bad for any living thing .""","""Source ?""",DISAGREE,"""global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter ,""","""Source ?""",,
32478,8477,"""( edited for brevity ) Abortion is the greatest moral evil of our time . Dr. James Dobson .""","""Well , considering that quote comes from somebody whose throat I would just as soon slit as have come within ten feet of my child , it means nothing .""",DISAGREE,"""Abortion is the greatest moral evil of our time Dr. James Dobson .""","""considering that quote comes from somebody whose throat I would just as soon slit as have come within ten feet of my child , it means""",,
32481,8478,"""I find it interesting that the slippery slope fallacy keeps popping up again and again in the arguments of pro-gun activists even after the Heller decision . In that decision , the Supreme Court recognized an individual right to own guns but rejected the slippery slope argument that has been used by the gun lobby for years .""","""Soooo lets see . You are denying a slippery slope exists . OK we have all of the gun laws you guys got during the Clinton Administration . 1.The assault weapons ban . 2.The ten round magazine , 3.institution of the waiting period , 4.Brady background checks for all handgun buyers , 5.Excessive fees and regulations that drove many legitimate gun shop owners out of business . 6.Making it illegal for anyone under 18 to own or even possess a handgun . 7.The President 's executive order stopping the importation of many guns , 8 . Additional disqualification 's and changes to legal firearms purchases on form 4473 , 9 . Insta Check ! 10 . The widening of Brady to include background checks from just handguns to include all new firearm purchases . 11 Lautenburg . and just recently the NICS improvement act ! But Yet , you want to add even more gun laws . But the Slippery Slope does not exist ? Is that what you are saying ? We have on this board alone , demands on our Constitution 's Bill of Rights of total Gun Registration , Mandatory Storage with as of yet undefined penalties , a photo ID . Some advocate banning Assault Weapons , and you yourself have put forth several arguments that the 2nd amendment is not an Individual Right , and it applies only to a states right to form a militia . But the slippery slope does not exist !""",DISAGREE,"""In that decision , the Supreme Court recognized an individual right to own guns but rejected the slippery slope argument that has been used by the gun lobby for years .""","""Soooo lets see . You are denying a slippery slope exists .""",,
32492,8484,"""When was the last mass murder at a UK university then ?""","""When was the last time there was ever a mass murder at a gun range full or armed patrons ? Or an International Practical Shooting Confederation match ? Or any of our shooting sports that people come from all over the world to take part in ? If the `` gun culture of America `` is truly to blame for all these campus massacres , how come none of the shooters ever seem to be members of the NRA , or took part in a hunter 's safety course , or anything else along those lines ?""",DISAGREE,"""When was the last mass murder at a UK university then ?""","""If the `` gun culture of America `` is truly to blame for all these campus massacres , how come none of the shooters ever seem to be members of the NRA , or took part in a hunter 's safety course , or anything else along those lines ?""",,
32503,8496,"""Lack of a Natural Mechanism . Charles Darwin , in his Origin of Species , proposed Natural Selection to be the mechanism by which an original simple-celled organism could have evolved gradually into all species observed today , both plant and animal . Darwin defines evolution as `` descent with modification. `` However , Natural Selection is known to be a conservative process , not a means of developing complexity from simplicity . Later , with our increased understanding of genetics , it was thought perhaps Natural Selection in conjunction with genetic mutation allowed for the development of all species from a common ancestor . However , this is theoretical and controversial , since `` beneficial `` mutations have yet to be observed . In fact , scientists have only observed harmful , `` downward `` mutations thus far . Time Constraints . Both Creationists and Evolutionists agree that if evolution is at all possible , there needs to be an excessive ( if not infinite ) amount of time . For much of the 20th century , it was thought evolutionists had all the time they needed . If the earth ever looked too young for certain evolutionary developments to have occurred , the age was pushed back in the textbooks . In 1905 , the earth was declared to be two billion years old . By 1970 , the earth was determined to be 3.5 billion years old , and by the 1990 's , the earth had become 4.6 billion years old . However , Young Earth advocates have identified quite a few Young Earth chronometers in recent years . Currently , there are approximately five times more natural chronometers indicating a `` Young Earth `` than an `` Old Earth. `` Each discovery is a separate `` Limiting Factor `` that places a constraint on the possible age of the earth . For example , moon drift , earth rotation speed , magnetic field decay , erosion rates , chemical influx into the oceans , ocean salinity , etc , all constrain the possible age of the earth . Each Limiting Factor is distinct . If one were successfully challenged , there is still the problem of all the rest . Furthermore , there are Limiting Factors constraining the possible age of the universe , such as spiral galaxies where they 're maintaining their spiral shapes despite their centers spinning faster than their extremities .""","""You are incorrect when it comes to the age of the earth . All inidciation by all branches of science indicate an earth that is over 3 billion years old . ( aside from the lies of the Young earth creationism . Each and every one of those 'indications ' are based on misunderstandings and out right lies about science . A discussion about the various methods ( and where the YEC claims go wrong can be found at http : //www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html""",DISAGREE,"""Charles Darwin , in his Origin of Species , proposed Natural Selection to be the mechanism . Darwin defines evolution as `` descent with modification. `` However , Natural Selection""","""You are incorrect when it comes to the age of the earth . All inidciation by all branches of science indicate an earth that is over 3 billion years old .""",,
32511,8514,"""The empire you defend is tyrannical . They are responsible for the death of millions .""","""Says a person from the only nation to have used a nuclear weapon in anger . You ’ re a young country , but you ’ re fast surpassing our death toll . I ’ d personally argue that in many cases the British Empire brought benefits to the nations involved . Some countries weren ’ t even conquered ...""",DISAGREE,"""The empire you defend is tyrannical .""","""Says a person from the only nation to have used a nuclear weapon in anger .""",,
32540,8526,"""Keeping porn legal and accessible on the internet , keep taxes high , keep abortion legal .... keep people voting democrat . Send as many people to hell as possible .""","""The US is 3 trillion dollars in debt , abortion is not clear cut ( just visit a debate ) , and you appear to be stereotyping democrats . Also , you may need to read the first ammendment again . For your answer to work , people would have to agree with you first , then they would understand ( and agree with ) you .""",DISAGREE,"""keep abortion legal .... keep people voting democrat .""","""abortion is not clear cut ( just visit a debate ) , and you appear to be stereotyping democrats""",,
32553,8530,"""So how would you make a study that shows the benefits of gun ownership ? I don´t think there is any way to do this .""","""There have been several conducted by the department of justice .""",DISAGREE,"""So how would you make a study that shows the benefits of gun ownership ?""","""There have been several conducted by the department of justice .""",,
32563,8533,"""You will have to look at the big picture to understand my point .""","""My bet is I know more about it than you do . I am aware of the `` big picture `` because I know that evolutionary biology does n't apply the the origin of the universe . Please explain how the origin of the universe applies to genetic information . Why does a change in a population of organisms require an increase in information ?""",DISAGREE,"""You will have to look at the big picture to understand my point .""","""Why does a change in a population of organisms require an increase in information ?""",,
32603,8550,"""Just a word of advice . If you stopped doing all those stupid things with font size and color some people , me included , might give your posts more serious consideration . If you need to be `` clever `` in your presentation to get your point across then your point ca n't be all that well formulated .""","""-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- - First of all .... I agree , in retrospect , that the font size was too large in this particular post ... Therefore , I have changed it . Second .... I thought the content was more important , than the font size . THIRD ...... WHAT COLOR are you talking about the original post ? ? ? Forth ..... What is it with your attitude ? It would have been nice if you had just sent me a private message INSTEAD . This would have been appreciated . Because it is not my intent to have people NOT read the post due to font size problems . Fifth ..... You have a problem with larger font sizes & amp ; color ? ? ? Maybe write to 4fourmns and tell them they should remove the color & amp ; font options ! ! ! !""",DISAGREE,"""If you stopped doing all those stupid things with font size and color some people , me included , might give your posts more serious ``""","""You have a problem with larger font sizes & color ? ? ?""",,
32637,8560,"""MEDICAL FACT : On the fiftieth day the embryo begins to form into a human fetus .""","""Wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""On the fiftieth day the embryo begins to form into a human fetus .""","""Wrong""",,
32647,8564,"""But the training material does not have the honesty to inform docents about these resources . For example , the Guide ’ s resource list includes the National Academy of Sciences ’ Teaching about Evolution and the Nature of Science ( 1998 ) , but it does not include any creation books , such as Dr. Jonathan Sarfati ’ s Refuting Evolution , which ably demolished the bad logic of the book .""","""Hmm , I wonder why that is ?""",DISAGREE,"""But the training material does not have the honesty to inform docents about these resources .""","""Hmm , I wonder why that is ?""",,
32653,8566,"""I assume you are referring to the first entry on the page . Then you are as ignorant as all the `` religious `` people you mock .""","""And your not beef , your bull XXXX .""",DISAGREE,"""I assume you are referring to the first entry on the page . Then you are as ignorant as all the `` religious `` people you mock .""","""And your not beef , your bull XXXX .""",,
32656,8567,"""There is no reason to perpetuate these harms . I have heard many arguments opposed to same-sex marriage , but there is not even one of them that justifies these harms . In fact , I would even say that there is not one argument against same-sex marriage that makes logical sense at all . Thus , even if same-sex marriage brought no benefits , there would be no reason to keep it illegal ; a free and equal society does not deny rights or benefits to anyone , unless it has a very good reason to . And there just is n't any reason to deny rights and benefits to same-sex couples .""","""Well , its not just morally wrong in America , but its morally wrong in the middle east as well . And i think that if we continue our way downward morally as a nation , it would give terrorists even more hate for america because we are supposedly a `` christian nation `` and dont live morally . anyways .""",DISAGREE,"""And there just is n't any reason to deny rights and benefits to same-sex couples .""","""And i think that if we continue our way downward morally as a nation , it would give terrorists even more hate for america because we are supposedly a `` christian nation `` and dont live morally .""",,
32667,8569,"""I do n't suppose any evolutionist have realized that all the evidence for evolution is also evidence for ID . They often talk about the mountains of irrefutable evidence , but the fact that the sun rose and set every day was evidence for the sun orbiting the earth , but it 's also evidence for the earth spinning . Likewise all the evidence for evolution can be condensed into one statement `` life forms are similar to other life forms `` , This is predicted by the intelligent design hypothesis as well . Direct evidence for ID that would not support evolution would be irreducibly complex biology , direct evidence for evolution that would not support ID would be more than just adaptation , it would have to be original useful DNA , or a simulation showing that coherent structure can be achieved without intelligent design by randomization and elimination .""","""The fact that the sun rises every day is not evidence for the sun orbiting the Earth , this effect is seen because of the rotation of Earth . ToE does not state that `` life forms are similar to each other `` . Direct evidence for ID/Creationism has never been established so there is no reason to suppose it to be true . Direct evidence for allele frequency change is freely available for all to see . You also need to define original , useful DNA . 4/10 . See me after class .""",DISAGREE,"""the fact that the sun rose and set every day was evidence for the sun orbiting the earth ,""","""The fact that the sun rises every day is not evidence for the sun orbiting the Earth , this effect is seen because of the rotation of Earth .""",,
32670,8570,"""Of course , we also need to note that the rise and fall of abortion rates are not necessarily linked to who is president at the time .""","""Clinton gave access to b/c which is known to prevent pregnancies . Bush has reduced access to b/c ( including e/c ) . A primary reason for aborting is money - Americans have been less well off under Bush .""",DISAGREE,"""Of course , we also need to note that the rise and fall of abortion rates are not necessarily linked to who is president at the time .""","""Clinton gave access to b/c which is known to prevent pregnancies . Bush has reduced access to b/c ( including e/c ) . A primary reason for aborting is money - Americans have been less well off under Bush .""",,
32683,8572,"""Regarding the stars , I have a thought . We measure the distance of stars in light years , then try to predict their age . Perhaps when measuring the distance , that 's all we get is distance- not actual `` time `` , or age . If this were true it would explain the difference between the `` old `` and `` new `` earth theory .""","""Sandy suppose you lived in New York and knew it was 3000 miles between California and New York Now suppose there was a car that was parked in your driveway that you also knew had been driven from California and that car had a maximum speed of 100 miles per hour . That would of course mean it would have taken at least 30 hours to make the drive . Do you see how you could deduce that the car was at least 30 hours old ? That ’ s the same principle used for dating the stars and the universe . If we know how far away a star is and we know the maximum speed of light , then the star must be at least as old as the time it would take for the light to get to the earth so we could see it .""",DISAGREE,"""We measure the distance of stars in light years , then try to predict their age . Perhaps when measuring the distance ,""","""If we know how far away a star is and we know the maximum speed of light , then the star must be at least as old as the time it would take for the light to get to the earth""",,
32681,8572,"""Regarding the stars , I have a thought . We measure the distance of stars in light years , then try to predict their age . Perhaps when measuring the distance , that 's all we get is distance- not actual `` time `` , or age . If this were true it would explain the difference between the `` old `` and `` new `` earth theory .""","""Sandy suppose you lived in New York and knew it was 3000 miles between California and New York Now suppose there was a car that was parked in your driveway that you also knew had been driven from California and that car had a maximum speed of 100 miles per hour . That would of course mean it would have taken at least 30 hours to make the drive . Do you see how you could deduce that the car was at least 30 hours old ? That ’ s the same principle used for dating the stars and the universe . If we know how far away a star is and we know the maximum speed of light , then the star must be at least as old as the time it would take for the light to get to the earth so we could see it .""",DISAGREE,"""Regarding the stars , I have a thought . We measure the distance of stars in light years , then try to predict their age . Perhaps when measuring the distance , that 's all we get is""","""If we know how far away a star is and we know the maximum speed of light , then the star must be at least as old as the time it would take for the light to get to the earth so we could see it .""",,
32691,8573,"""why the comparison of gun owners yo violent killers and serial rapists ? What law have I broken ? Since we are doing comparisons your anti-freedom agenda is very similar to the bazi gun control laws of the 1930s , it is like the jim crow laws of the US . Your agenda is one of racism . This is insulting , ignorant , and shows your true colors as an enemy of freedom .""","""It 's called an analogy . The article claimed that the relationship between homosexuals and discrimination and between gun owners and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` Thus , I extended this analogy so that the relationship between gun owners and discrimination and between serial racists and discrimination is the same because the discrimination in both cases is because of `` who they are. `` The analogy that I made was not comparing gun owners to serial rapists , but rather , it was comparing the relationship of the two groups with discrimination . And what is your deal with lunatic fringe leftie ? Antigun laws are clearly not a fringe view , or gun control laws would not have been passed in Congress . You can hardly call the views lunatic . I doubt any doctor would agree that a person with liberal views regarding gun control is mentally insane . My anti-freedom agenda ? What the hell are you talking about ? Are you an anarchist ? That 's the only way to have 100 % freedom . The fact that government exists means that there are restrictions . So unless you are an anarchist , I can call you anti-freedom as much as you call me anti-freedom . The question is the degree to which government should restrict freedoms , and that is not an obvious question to answer . Can you please explain how my views on gun control reveal that I 'm racist . Have I proposed a law which would restrict gun usage for only a certain race ?""",DISAGREE,"""why the comparison of gun owners yo violent killers and serial rapists ? What law have I broken ? Since we are doing comparisons your anti-freedom agenda is very similar to the bazi gun control laws of the 1930s ,""","""The article claimed that the relationship between homosexuals and discrimination and between gun owners and discrimination is the same because the discrimination""",,
32693,8574,"""It is rather disrespectful but do n't think it is limited to one side . Most protestors on both sides are n't great .""","""I agree that during debate of an issue like this both sides can get pretty nasty . However , you would be hard-pressed to find a place where those that are choice are screaming in your face , interrupting your personal life on an already hard day like this .""",AGREE,"""It is rather disrespectful but do n't think it is limited to one side .""","""I agree that during debate of an issue like this both sides can get pretty nasty .""",,
32698,8575,"""I would call a fossil that had both reptillian and avian features a strange creature that God created at the beginning of time .""","""Exactly , there is absolutely no evidence that biologists could show you that would make you think , `` hey that would count of as transitional . Why ? Because you have already accepted your previous convictions and closed your mind to anything new . How about doing what Porky Pine asked and giving us your definition of a transitional form ? If you have spent any time at University , you should know that references older than 10 years should n't be used . Science has usually progressed sufficiently in this time , so that the information in the older articles/books , probably contains errors or invalid information . Scientists contradict each other all the time ? It 's the first step in finding correct answers . New hypotheses are proposed and tested , observations made etc and falsified ideas are discarded . It 's what makes it work .""",DISAGREE,"""I would call fossil that had both reptillian and avian features a strange creature that God created at the beginning of time""","""there is absolutely no evidence that biologists could show you that would make you think , `` hey that would count of as transitional""",,
32705,8576,"""They have no imagination or sense of reason that allows them to create as we do so easily . After millions of years of so called evolution they are still monkeys and science is impressed that they have learned to use a stick to reach into an ant hill . What they ignore is that they learned to do that a thousand generations ago . Nothing new since then though where as Humanity has built up the World and conquered the Air , Sea and Space in that time .""","""But wait , you said that science is unprovable . How did we build up the world , conquer the air , sea and space without unprovable science ? !""",DISAGREE,"""They have no imagination or sense of reason that allows them to create as we do so easily . are still monkeys and science is impressed that they have learned to use a stick to reach into an ant hill""","""you said that science is unprovable . How did we build up the world , conquer the air""",,
32719,8583,"""T.Q. , why oh why did you supply this resource ? You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all along -- that there is an atheist science conspiracy .""","""Uh-oh ... Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",DISAGREE,"""You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all""","""Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",,
32722,8583,"""T.Q. , why oh why did you supply this resource ? You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all along -- that there is an atheist science conspiracy .""","""Uh-oh ... Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",DISAGREE,"""T.Q. , why oh why did you supply this resource ? You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all along -- that there is an atheist science conspiracy .""","""Uh-oh ... Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",,
32723,8583,"""T.Q. , why oh why did you supply this resource ? You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all along -- that there is an atheist science conspiracy .""","""Uh-oh ... Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",DISAGREE,"""You 've given Marc9000 a confession from his opponent ! Now everyone will know Marc was right all along -- that there is an atheist science conspiracy .""","""Uh-oh ... Pay no attention at all to the man behind the curtain !""",,
32726,8584,"""Once upon a time , a man killed another man with a tire iron . We 've simply got to ban tire irons ... and bats ... and hatchets ... and knives ... and scissors ... and sharp pencils ... and plastic bags ... and nail clippers .""","""Your love of assumption is quite amusing ( it also highlights your inability to argue honestly ) . All I did was point out that accidents are a cause of injuries and fatalities dealing with firearms . Nowhere did I suggest banning them in the slightest . Furthermore , I specifically noted that most of the accidents were due to improper gun safety . So how about you take the stick out of your XXX and stop assuming whatever the * * * * you want for a change ? You are a joke Isly . About time you admit it .""",DISAGREE,"""We 've simply got to ban tire irons ... and bats ... and hatchets ... and knives ... and scissors ... and sharp pencils ... and plastic bags ... and nail clippers .""","""Furthermore , I specifically noted that most of the accidents were due to improper gun safety""",,
32731,8585,"""Social darwinism is anti-darwinian , because natural selection does not work at the level of social classes ,""","""* * As above , 'social classes ' are 'populations ' , and modern darwinian evolution focuses entirely on the 'evolution ' of 'populations ' , NOT individual organisms . Neo-Lamarkian theory focuses on individual , internally driven effort , instead of inherited advantage , which is the be-all and end-all of Darwinism , and of modern economic and political social theory . Just as it has always been .""",DISAGREE,"""Social darwinism is anti-darwinian , because natural selection does not work at the level of social classes ,""","""As above , 'social classes ' are 'populations ' , and modern darwinian evolution focuses entirely on the 'evolution ' of 'populations ' , NOT individual organisms .""",,
32747,8587,"""it combines the worlds of evolution ( including biology , genes , cells , etc ) , spirituality , and health/diseases . He basicallly says that most of the billions of dollars pumped in to bio-tech is wasted because fixing genes will never fix the physical cause of disease . ( RIGHT ON , Brother ! ) .....""","""But it will stop the disease from being passed on to offspring ... Or is that unimportant ?""",DISAGREE,"""He basicallly says that most of the billions of dollars pumped in to bio-tech is wasted because fixing genes will never fix the physical cause of disease""","""But it will stop the disease from being passed on to offspring""",,
32787,8599,"""How many civil rights are you willing to give up in the name of a few less murders each year ?""","""In 2000 , the U.S. recorded close to 11,000 firearm homicides and more than 16,000 firearm suicides . The European Union -- an area with a population approximately 25 % higher than that of the U.S. -- reported fewer than 1,300 firearm homicides for the same year . In Japan , the number was 22. sinjin - The US firearm homicide rate is more than 180x that of Japan .""",DISAGREE,"""How many civil rights are you willing to give up in the name of a few less murders each year ?""","""In 2000 , the U.S. recorded close to 11,000 firearm homicides and more than 16,000 firearm suicides The US firearm homicide rate is more than 180x that of Japan .""",,
32808,8614,"""So since we are made in Gods image :""","""Is it possible for an omnipotent being to have a definable 'image ' ? I guess the stock answer is 'yes , He made us in it ' , but that 's somewhat ... unsatisfying . Are you implying that God is a hetrosexual ?""",DISAGREE,"""we are made in Gods image""","""Are you implying that God is a hetrosexual ?""",,
32811,8615,"""Great , I guess since ted kennedy agrees with prolifers that must mean abortion is wrong for ted kennedy is the absolute truth ! ! He 's just a freakin everyday person .. sheesh . So what if he changed his mind or whatever .""","""Yet he has n't . No pro-choice person I know wants abortion to be prevalent , they just want it to be an option . Wanting it safe and rare and available is not an abnormal positon for a pro-choice person .""",DISAGREE,"""He 's just a freakin everyday person .. sheesh . So what if he changed his mind or whatever .""","""Yet he has n't . No pro-choice person I know wants abortion to be prevalent""",,
32821,8619,"""And because marriage is a government institution then they can not discriminate against same sex couples and must provide the same benefits to them as is provided to straight couples . And it can not be a separate institution either because separate is not equal .""","""And upon what grounds do you base this claim ? Government chooses not to recognize different types of marriages all the time , not just same sex marriages ie . polygamist marriages , relatives , age limits , etc . These recognitions are not only federal but vary state to state , for instance some states recognize 1st cousin marriages while others do n't , as I recall , the age of consent to marry also differs among states .""",DISAGREE,"""because marriage is a government institution then they can not discriminate against same sex couples and must provide the same benefits to them as is provided to straight couples .""","""And upon what grounds do you base this claim ? Government chooses not to recognize different types of marriages all the time , not just same sex marriages ie .""",,
32830,8620,"""I think the Obama administration has been working with Republicans , and much too much . That 's why the bill is what it is . Although I think it was Feingold who said that Obama has gotten the bill he intended to , from the beginning . Even worse , as this is not a compromise since there is no public option , for starters .""","""Yea right , the chosen one told the pugnicans to sit down and shut up I won . More funny cake lady ! You are right the dems got the bill they wanted . 2000+ pages that no one knows whats in it . Robs Medicare to partly pay for it and who knows what other unpleasant nasty suprises are in it . Wise up no one wants your public option .""",DISAGREE,"""I think the Obama administration has been working with Republicans , and much too much""","""Yea right ,""",,
32836,8622,"""Chloe has advanced a statement that the pro-life position toward women is higher then the pro-choice view of women . The topic is : is this the case or is this not the case ? The topic is not why this might be the case or why it might not be the case .""","""And she has referenced her religious beliefs as the foundation of her position .""",AGREE,"""Chloe has advanced a statement that the pro-life position toward women is higher then the pro-choice view of women""","""And she has referenced her religious beliefs as the foundation of her position .""",,
32843,8623,"""The California judge would probably not have the authority to refer to the Federal Constitution ; it would have to be taken to the Federal Courts for that .""","""State courts can rule based on state and/or federal law . In this case , the answer was found in the state constitution , so the judge did not need to pursue the issue further . Also , a state constitution can offer more protection that the federal one , as long as , in so doing , it does not contradict the federal constitution .""",DISAGREE,"""The California judge not have the authority to refer to the Federal Constitution it would have to be taken to the Federal Courts""","""State courts can rule based on state and/or federal law . the judge did not need to pursue the issue further a state constitution can offer more protection that the federal one""",,
32847,8624,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg , an embryo , a fetus , is a heinous , anti-life crime . To demand such a sacrifice is to place families themselves on the altar of religious extremism , an extremism which denies women their right place in humanity , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""","""The opposite is actually the case , to deny the sanctity of life is to sacrifice potential families on the alter of the religion of secularism , an extremism which denies humans their right place in nature , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""",DISAGREE,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg , an embryo , a fetus , is a heinous , anti-life crime . To demand such a sacrifice is to place families themselves on the altar of religious extremism ,""","""The opposite is actually the case , to deny the sanctity of life is to sacrifice potential families on the alter of the religion of secularism""",,
32848,8624,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg , an embryo , a fetus , is a heinous , anti-life crime . To demand such a sacrifice is to place families themselves on the altar of religious extremism , an extremism which denies women their right place in humanity , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""","""The opposite is actually the case , to deny the sanctity of life is to sacrifice potential families on the alter of the religion of secularism , an extremism which denies humans their right place in nature , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""",DISAGREE,"""To demand such a sacrifice is to place families themselves on the altar of religious extremism""","""The opposite is actually the case , to deny the sanctity of life is to sacrifice potential families""",,
32850,8624,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation to the life of a fertilized egg , an embryo , a fetus , is a heinous , anti-life crime . To demand such a sacrifice is to place families themselves on the altar of religious extremism , an extremism which denies women their right place in humanity , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""","""The opposite is actually the case , to deny the sanctity of life is to sacrifice potential families on the alter of the religion of secularism , an extremism which denies humans their right place in nature , which sacrifices the welfare of children to a very narrow and restricted religious belief .""",DISAGREE,"""To sacrifice the life of a mother in that situation""","""The opposite is actually the case""",,
32859,8627,"""Well , I do n't work with any `` reefer heads `` or pot smokers now ... this was awhile back .""","""Sure about that ?""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't work with any `` reefer heads `` or pot smokers now ... this was awhile back .""","""Sure about that ?""",,
32865,8628,"""Probably not , one rather sucspects sea vents or pools rather hotter than mere soup . Complex chemistry templated by surfaces - Probably something like the RNA world hypothesis . Its not signed and dated by the author of the journal and its not confirmed by a witness ! Spirit ? I thought he said Mind . Mind is a product of biochemistry , Spirits are what you buy at the liquor store . Granted spirits can be passed down among humans . Not feasable . For any organism the genes are there before the mind . Genes preceed the mind and indeed are the platform which constructs the platform which constructs the platform that brains are underlain by , and the brain cerates the mind . Can not have effect coming before the cause you know .""","""Oh , some holes in the bottom of the ocean . Phew , I 'm so glad I was wrong . They did not date their works back then . Signatres were worth nothng back then . The witness , however , is every early christian and , of coarse , God himself . Actually , liquor is bought at a liquor store ( dee-de-dee ) . The mind is the product of God . Supersport meant spirit when he said mind . Again , the spirit lies the platform for the genes . I thought I had already made that clear .""",DISAGREE,"""Probably something like the RNA world hypothesis . Its not signed and dated by the author of the journal and its not confirmed by a witness !""","""The witness , however , is every early christian and , of coarse , God himself .""",,
32869,8629,"""New ultrasound technology has even proven that babies in the womb smile when external stimulus like an abdomen rub is introduced .""","""I had not heard this ... do you have a source on it ?""",DISAGREE,"""New ultrasound technology has even proven that babies in the womb smile when external stimulus like an abdomen rub is introduced .""","""I had not heard this ... do you have a source on it ?""",,
32873,8630,"""* walks in * * looks at posters * * notes no fundies have spoken out yet * Well , it 's OBVIOUS that you do n't have a discerning spirit and are thinking with your carnal mind . If you 'd only have accepted the truth of the undying and never changing word of God , then you 'd understand . You just gottsta believe first . It 's as simple as that . But , no , you go right on hating God and you 'll soon see where that will get you . BURNING IN HELL ! ! ! Hahahah , FOOL ! You are soo going to roast . In pain . FOR EVER ! But , that 's not my words . That 's Gods ! Me ? I love you . I love you long time . Like forever even . If only you 'd accept Jesus into your heart . Cause if you did . You 'd see no contradictions in what you posted . Seriously ... Drink the flavoraid . edit : Capitalize , size increase , italicize and underline various parts of my post . Color them some and insert random , out of contest bible passages to support my claims .""","""I think it 's manifestly obvious that I 'm a prophet . Therefore , the question of my diety should also be of little surprise .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's as simple as that . But , no , you go right on hating God and you 'll soon see where that will get you .""","""I think it 's manifestly obvious that I 'm a prophet""",,
32874,8630,"""* walks in * * looks at posters * * notes no fundies have spoken out yet * Well , it 's OBVIOUS that you do n't have a discerning spirit and are thinking with your carnal mind . If you 'd only have accepted the truth of the undying and never changing word of God , then you 'd understand . You just gottsta believe first . It 's as simple as that . But , no , you go right on hating God and you 'll soon see where that will get you . BURNING IN HELL ! ! ! Hahahah , FOOL ! You are soo going to roast . In pain . FOR EVER ! But , that 's not my words . That 's Gods ! Me ? I love you . I love you long time . Like forever even . If only you 'd accept Jesus into your heart . Cause if you did . You 'd see no contradictions in what you posted . Seriously ... Drink the flavoraid . edit : Capitalize , size increase , italicize and underline various parts of my post . Color them some and insert random , out of contest bible passages to support my claims .""","""I think it 's manifestly obvious that I 'm a prophet . Therefore , the question of my diety should also be of little surprise .""",DISAGREE,"""it 's OBVIOUS that you do n't have a discerning spirit and are thinking with your carnal mind""","""it 's manifestly obvious that I 'm a prophet""",,
32884,8634,"""I say legalize pot and tax the hell out of it . Why should us alcoholics have to pay all the sin taxes ?""","""There are biliions of dollars to be made from the taxation of marjuana . Institutions like The DEA and the state and federal prison systems would see fincncial stress relieved from them . Its also a realistic way to increase revenue to lower the deficit Who 's to say what drug is bad for you and what one is n't ?""",AGREE,"""Why should us alcoholics have to pay all the sin taxes ?""","""There are biliions of dollars to be made from the taxation of marjuana .""",,
32891,8638,"""I am not imposing my belief on you or anyone else so far as abortion goes . Its a matter of individuals making their own moral decisions freely and voluntarily .""","""But you are . You ca n't just claim someone is not a person and therefore say you are not imposing beliefs on them . If this were the case then I 'd just say you are n't a person and therefore when I hurt you it would n't be wrong .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not imposing my belief on you or anyone else""","""But you are""",,
32896,8639,"""And can you please tell me the difference between nonrandom variation and directed variation ? I 'd also like a link to verify what you say . Thank you . God Bless !""","""Directed variation seems unlikely : http : //www.blackwellpublishing.com/r ... ariation17.asp Would not selection of mating partners produce nonrandom variation ?""",DISAGREE,"""tell me the difference between nonrandom variation and directed variation""","""Directed variation seems unlikely : http : //www.blackwellpublishing.com/r""",,
32904,8640,"""Pah ! Child 's play ! .""","""Oh ? Then what do you take this to mean ? : http : //www.accessmylibrary.com/comsi ... d=0286-6387354 `` researchers no longer believe that races are distinct biological categories created by differences in the genes that people inherit from their parents. `` http : //academic.udayton.edu/race/01race/race.htm There are no genetic characteristics possessed by all Blacks but not by non- Blacks ; similarly , there is no gene or cluster of genes common to all Whites but not to non-Whites . One 's race is not determined by a single gene or gene cluster , as is , for example , sickle cell anemia . Nor are races marked by important differences in gene frequencies , the rates of appearance of certain gene types . The data compiled by various scientists demonstrates , contrary to popular opinion , that intra-group differences exceed inter-group differences . That is , greater genetic variation exists within the populations typically labeled Black and White than between these populations . This finding refutes the supposition that racial divisions reflect fundamental genetic differences . Along the way , various minds tried to fashion practical human typologies along the following physical axes : skin color , hair texture , facial angle , jaw size , cranial capacity , brain mass , frontal lobe mass , brain surface fissures and convolutions , and even body lice . As one scholar notes , `` [ t ] he nineteenth century was a period of exhaustive and -- as it turned out -- futile search for criteria to define and describe race differences . '' . . . Attempts to define racial categories by physical attributes ultimately failed . By 1871 , some leading intellectuals had recognized that even using the word `` race `` `` was virtually a confession of ignorance or evil intent. `` The genetic studies of the last few decades have only added more nails to the coffin of biological race . Evidence shows that those features usually coded to race , for example , stature , skin color , hair texture , and facial structure , do not correlate strongly with genetic variation""",DISAGREE,"""Child 's play !""","""Then what do you take this to mean ? :""",,
32903,8640,"""Pah ! Child 's play ! .""","""Oh ? Then what do you take this to mean ? : http : //www.accessmylibrary.com/comsi ... d=0286-6387354 `` researchers no longer believe that races are distinct biological categories created by differences in the genes that people inherit from their parents. `` http : //academic.udayton.edu/race/01race/race.htm There are no genetic characteristics possessed by all Blacks but not by non- Blacks ; similarly , there is no gene or cluster of genes common to all Whites but not to non-Whites . One 's race is not determined by a single gene or gene cluster , as is , for example , sickle cell anemia . Nor are races marked by important differences in gene frequencies , the rates of appearance of certain gene types . The data compiled by various scientists demonstrates , contrary to popular opinion , that intra-group differences exceed inter-group differences . That is , greater genetic variation exists within the populations typically labeled Black and White than between these populations . This finding refutes the supposition that racial divisions reflect fundamental genetic differences . Along the way , various minds tried to fashion practical human typologies along the following physical axes : skin color , hair texture , facial angle , jaw size , cranial capacity , brain mass , frontal lobe mass , brain surface fissures and convolutions , and even body lice . As one scholar notes , `` [ t ] he nineteenth century was a period of exhaustive and -- as it turned out -- futile search for criteria to define and describe race differences . '' . . . Attempts to define racial categories by physical attributes ultimately failed . By 1871 , some leading intellectuals had recognized that even using the word `` race `` `` was virtually a confession of ignorance or evil intent. `` The genetic studies of the last few decades have only added more nails to the coffin of biological race . Evidence shows that those features usually coded to race , for example , stature , skin color , hair texture , and facial structure , do not correlate strongly with genetic variation""",DISAGREE,"""Pah ! Child 's play !""","""Then what do you take this to mean ? : http : //www.accessmylibrary.com/comsi .""",,
32907,8641,"""But guess what ... evolutionists call NS on the populational level random !""","""Absolutely not . One of the points that have to be drilled into the heads of creationists over and over again is that natural selection is not random . You are either a liar or ignorant .""",DISAGREE,"""But guess what ... evolutionists call NS on the populational level random !""","""Absolutely not . One of the points that have to be drilled into the heads of creationists""",,
32928,8644,"""Read the preceding verse . '' 18 The LORD God said , 'It is not good for the man to be alone . I will make a helper suitable for him . 19 Now the LORD God had formed out of the ground all the beasts of the field and all the birds of the air . He brought them to the man to see what he would name them ; and whatever the man called each living creature , that was its name . 20 So the man gave names to all the livestock , the birds of the air and all the beasts of the field . But for Adam no suitable helper was found. `` ( Genesis 2:18-20 )""","""Okay , here is how it went : God made the animals . He said , `` Hey , Adam needs a helper. `` He brought the animals to Adam to name . He could n't find a helper for Adam . He then took a rib out of Adam 's side to create Eve . This was done on the sixth day . God created them both on the sixth day , Adam first , then Eve out of Adam 's side after he had Adam name the animals .""",DISAGREE,"""Read the preceding verse . '' 18 The LORD God said , 'It is not good for the man to be alone . I will make a helper suitable for him .""","""This was done on the sixth day . God created them both on the sixth day , Adam first , then Eve out of Adam 's side after he had Adam name the animals .""",,
32933,8645,"""Again , which is your usual tact you attack the messengers Justine but in your heart of hearts you know what we say is the truth ...""","""You know , I really do n't know if she does . I 'd like to think that she does care about the moral concerns of most people in the nation , but it 's starting to become more and more apparent that may not be the case . At the rate they are going , gay rights people in this country are going to bring a constitutional amendment on themselves before they truly realize the value of actually trying to see the issue through someone 's eyes other than their own , and actually dialoging rather than trying to dictate their views onto the nation . By then it will be too late .""",DISAGREE,"""Again , which is your usual tact you attack the messengers Justine but in your heart of hearts you know what we say is the truth ...""","""You know , I really do n't know if she does . I 'd like to think that she does care about the moral concerns of most people in the nation , but it 's starting to become more and more apparent that may not be the""",,
32946,8647,"""The proof of the racism of Darwinism is overwhelming , if you do n't believe that you have never read Darwin .""","""Actually , Darwin was much less racist than was typical of the Victorian British of his day . Possibly you should read what Darwin had to say about his encounters with slavery in South America . Nevertheless , Darwin was a Victorian Englishman and his attitudes were colored by that culture , where Victoria was , by the Grace of God , Queen , and the head of the Church of England , which dominated the culture and academic life of the time . You know , the slavery that was propagated and approved by the European Christian churches . And , of course , the slave trade in the U.S. was supported and approved by the protestant churches . The Southern Baptist Convention was formed for the sole purpose of excluding blacks from the Christian churches . In 1997 the Southern Baptist Convention issued an official apology to African Americans for its history of racism . Of course , you are probably quite aware that the KKK was fromed by southern Christians - still is . There is also the Aryan Brotherhood , which also claims to be Christian . So I guess we could call that proof of the racism of Christianity . Of course you will squeal and cry about it and offer excuses , but facts are facts .""",DISAGREE,"""The proof of the racism of Darwinism is overwhelming""","""You know , the slavery that was propagated and approved by the European Christian churches .""",,
32961,8650,"""The so called `` pro-choice `` movement is in fact in favour of only one choice , ie abortion . For example , a woman who telephones the `` British Pregnancy Advisory Service ( sic ) `` looking for help with a crisis pregnancy will not be given any help or advice . They only deal in abortions , performing over a quarter of all UK abortions . They will not even refer the woman to pro-life organisations such as Life . So much for choice !""","""Oh , you mean unlike the pro-life organizations that regularly refer women that come to them to pro-choice organizations ? I 'm being facetious , to get it out of my system , but seriously why would a `` pro-choice `` organization refer people to a `` pro-life `` organization when such organizations are regarded ( rightly or wrongly ) as `` pro-paternalism `` ? The claim that `` the so called `` pro-choice movement is in fact in favour of only one choice `` is certainly a important criticism that the pro-choice movement faces , because it is about supporting a woman 's choice to have an abortion . Unfortunately so much time and attention is devoted to protecting that choice that it overshadows the whole point of the pro-choice position : the woman 's right to choose . Too little time and attention is spent protecting a woman 's autonomy in making that choice or supporting a woman 's choice not to have an abortion . Fortunately in Canada , where abortion is legal , the pro-choice movement is quickly recognizing that providing women with the information and support to make an informed decision either way is just as important as providing the means to exercise one choice . I 'm pointing this out because I think you may be mistaking the pro-choice 's struggle to keep the abortion option open with what the pro-choice movement is actually in favour of : the informed choice of a woman with regard to how she wants to deal with pregnancy .""",DISAGREE,"""so called `` pro-choice `` movement is in fact in favour of only one choice , ie abortion , a woman who telephones the `` British Pregnancy Advisory Service ( sic ) `` looking for help with a crisis pregnancy will not be given any help or advice .""","""Oh , you mean unlike the pro-life organizations that regularly refer women that come to them to pro-choice organizations ?""",,
33000,8656,"""There are quite a lot of other differences between modern human and neaderthals other than just 'brain size ' . Well , right ... neanderthals were short and stocky and big-boned ...""","""Among other things , generally adaptions to a colder environment . As for your theory as a whole , does n't the whole 15 , 000 year gap between the extinction of the Neanderthalls and the development of farming ( particularly the grains youre talking about ) .""",DISAGREE,"""There are quite a lot of other differences between modern human and neaderthals other than just 'brain size""","""As for your theory as a whole , does n't the whole 15 , 000 year gap between the extinction of the Neanderthalls and the development of farming""",,
33011,8658,"""Word games Darwinists play ( example : exploiting the diverse meanings of `` evolution `` to distract critics )""","""Distract ? No . If Wells is accusing equivocation , he 'd better be able to back up his claim .""",DISAGREE,"""Word games Darwinists play ( example : exploiting the diverse meanings of `` evolution `` to distract critics )""","""Distract ? No""",,
33016,8659,"""Radiocarbon dating : This tells us that the bottom layers of the Grand Canyon are newer than the top .""","""No it does n't . It tells us that creationists are either liars of very sloppy in gathering samples . I suspect that you 've been duped again , and as usual , nothing but assertion without evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""Radiocarbon dating : This tells us that the bottom layers of the Grand Canyon are newer than the top .""","""No it does n't . It tells us that creationists are either liars of very sloppy in gathering""",,
33032,8662,"""] How many different ways can ToE be invalidated ? In a scientific theory , there are NO exceptions -- exceptions mean holes -- holes mean trouble . The answer is none so far . Your article and the mechanism involved do not impact upon TOE which makes only very broad assumptions about heritable elements . And what you reference does not constitute a hole in TOE , although it may be a new mechanism of inheritance .""","""yea , I often forget ToE is a mental concept , not a scientific one . Nothing -- and I mean nothing -- will ever dismantle it in the minds of the faithful . Materialism is so entrenched in your mind that even if an animal generates a new piece of morphology by mere thought , sensation or awareness , and then passes that trait down to progeny , ( which has been shown on here ) you still think materialism stands . It 's an unfalsifiable mindset that you and millions of others have created for yourselves .""",DISAGREE,"""How many different ways can ToE be invalidated ? In a scientific theory , there are NO exceptions -- exceptions mean holes -- holes mean trouble . The answer is none so far .""","""yea , I often forget ToE is a mental concept , not a scientific one .""",,
33061,8668,"""Those 2 % included CO2 and had a number specifically attached to it . I do n't remember what that number was , but if it were 'actually ' showing measurable increases , why are we not all kept up to speed on how drastic the increases are ? [ i.e . 1970 it was 0.0123 % and now it is 0.0124 % ] .""","""Erm ... we are ? Levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are usually quoted as parts per million , currently a little over 380ppm , 150 years ago closer to 280 . In 1970 about 330ppm . Carbon dioxide in the Earth 's atmosphere - Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia""",DISAGREE,"""Those 2 % included CO2 and had a number specifically attached to it .""","""Levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are usually quoted as parts per million ,""",,
33071,8670,"""tens of thousands of smuggled guns""","""into Mexico . Even your `` source `` subtly acknowledges that the problem is with enforcement of the law , not absence of it . You ca n't stop logs from burning by throwing more logs on top .""",DISAGREE,"""tens of thousands of smuggled guns""","""Even your `` source `` subtly acknowledges that the problem is with enforcement of the law ,""",,
33075,8671,"""Yeah , that 's generally the conclusion that I come to which is why I see nothing wrong with abortion . I 'm probably not going to be killed by abortion any time soon .""","""here we go Dan . your problem with the law is not whether its fair or not , its whether you can benefit personally from it . you have no problem with abortion because your not going to be the victim of such a law , but youd definitely have a problem if you were the one suffering from the law . Apparently you dont care if the law disadvantages or is unfair to others , as long as it does n't hurt you , you 're OK with it .""",DISAGREE,"""I see nothing wrong with abortion . I 'm probably not going to be killed by abortion any time soon""","""Apparently you dont care if the law disadvantages or is unfair to others , as long as it does n't hurt you , you 're OK with it .""",,
33112,8679,"""And you just sound ignorant . You would n't make this statement if you knew about how Britain 's current gun control laws came into existence .""","""You/he could just have said 'slippery slope ' in the first place ; that argument is an old one , which I though was dealt with a long time ago . You ca n't disapprove of A on the grounds that it might lead to B - firstly because you have little to no evidence that it will , secondly because A is not necessary for B to happen and thirdly because that difference between A and B is all the argument you need to prevent B but be in favour of A . You can approve of punishing criminals but be against the death sentance .""",DISAGREE,"""And you just sound ignorant .""","""You/he could just have said 'slippery slope ' in the first place""",,
33121,8682,"""As you noted , Supersport 's theory predicts DNA from extinct species to be the same as modern DNA . Not modified , because the modification is in the expression of parts of the DNA , not the total package . Well , DNA from mammoths and Neandertals have been tested and it is not the same as modern elephants or humans .""","""Actually true . But I fail to understand the point . mtDNA from Neandertals seems to indicate that they are not ancestral and did not interbreed with modern humans . Neither are mammoths ancestral to modern elephants . In both cases the evidence indicates that they are related species . What was your point ?""",DISAGREE,"""Supersport 's theory predicts DNA from extinct species to be the same as modern DNA""","""Actually true .""",,
33130,8684,"""Do they keep you in ignorance over there ? It 's not illegal for UK politicians to own guns .""","""So you have no problem with UK gun laws ? Your hypothetical is just that - hypothetical . In reality , a militia would stand small chance against military might .""",DISAGREE,"""Do they keep you in ignorance over there ? It 's not illegal for UK politicians to own guns .""","""So you have no problem with UK gun laws ?""",,
33135,8685,"""A modern microbiologist adds : `` Throughout 150 years of the science of bacteriology , there is no evidence that one species of bacteria has changed into another ``""","""What did I just get through saying ?""",AGREE,"""Throughout 150 years of the science of bacteriology , there is no evidence that one species of bacteria has changed into another ``""","""What did I just get through saying ?""",,
33168,8693,"""3a ) If you do the math , severe earthquakes ( caused by God ) could have very easily covered the Earth in approximately 2 miles of water at some points . Also , with these severe earthquakes , not all of the Earth would have to be covered equally at one time . There could have been some parts shallow enough to actually see the ground below . 3b ) Who said the Earth started out as a flat super continent ? I believe that God made the Earth only a few thousand years ago , not that much geographically different from the way it is now .""","""You contradict yourself . If the earth was then much as it is today , then there is n't enough water on earth to cover it in any fashion . I have done the math . Do you have any idea of how high the Himalayas , the Alps , the Andes , and the Rockies are ? Besides , the Bible talks about a flood that lasted a year , not a series of tsunamis .""",AGREE,"""believe that God made the Earth only a few thousand years ago ,""","""You contradict yourself .""",,
33187,8702,"""( An accident on the way to work has a specific cause , yet can be modelled statistically ) You would n't be able to have that analogy in context ... because if there is nothing , cause can not help you . That is the whole argument ... without anything to start you can not have cause be the agency for events to follow .""","""But there are ample known causes for such novelty as is required by evolution . Mutation induced by chemical or energetic interference , recombination through sexual reproduction - surely you are not suggesting that these processes do not occur ?""",DISAGREE,"""( An accident on the way to work has a specific cause , yet can be modelled statistically ) You would n't be able to have that analogy in context ... because if there is nothing , cause can not help you . That is the whole argument ... without anything to start you can not have cause be the agency for events to follow .""","""But there are ample known causes for such novelty as is required by evolution . Mutation induced by chemical or energetic interference , recombination through sexual reproduction - surely you are not suggesting that these processes do not occur ?""",,
33191,8703,"""So country by country , the world is going to hell in a hand basket . And this pleases you , why ?""","""Oh get over yourself and your self delusional narrow fundamentalist mentality .... I thought monogamy was a positive thing was it not ? Oh that 's right it does n't matter about two people loving one another . Two consensual adults being able to express their love in a private ceremony and having that love protected under the law ....""",DISAGREE,"""the world is going to hell in a hand basket .""","""get over yourself and your self delusional narrow fundamentalist mentality .""",,
33193,8703,"""So country by country , the world is going to hell in a hand basket . And this pleases you , why ?""","""Oh get over yourself and your self delusional narrow fundamentalist mentality .... I thought monogamy was a positive thing was it not ? Oh that 's right it does n't matter about two people loving one another . Two consensual adults being able to express their love in a private ceremony and having that love protected under the law ....""",DISAGREE,"""So country by country , the world is going to hell in a hand basket . And this pleases you , why ?""","""Oh get over yourself and your self delusional narrow fundamentalist mentality .... I thought monogamy was a positive thing was it not ?""",,
33201,8705,"""The Chicago Tribune says : The end of the Chicago handgun ban""","""Oh my , where are these rights going to end ? Gun Groups File Lawsuit To Validate Montana Firearms Freedom Act Seems like kalifornia might be in line pretty soon""",AGREE,"""The end of the Chicago handgun ban""","""where are these rights going to end ?""",,
33236,8714,"""That is a lot , but I want gun control . I want : 1 ) Instant background checks . No waiting period . No cool off time . No central database of gun owners . 2 ) Larger budget for law enforcement for persecution of firearm offenders . No larger budget for law enforecemnt + unconstitutional gun laws on the same bill before Congress . 3 ) Expanded civilian training such as Civilian Marksmanship Program to include all manner of modern military weapons . 4 ) If the militia is the National Guard , then I want formal seperation of National Guard from Federal authority .""","""Here is the definition of pro : 1 : an argument or evidence in affirmation < an appraisal of the pros and cons > 2 : the affirmative side or one holding it You claim to be defending the right to bear arms . Yet you defend the very gun control laws that the gun haters want ! How are you defending the right to bear arms if you want the very same gun control laws as the gun haters ?""",DISAGREE,"""That is a lot , but I want gun control . I want : 1 ) Instant background checks .""","""Here is the definition of pro : 1 : an argument or evidence in affirmation""",,
33237,8714,"""That is a lot , but I want gun control . I want : 1 ) Instant background checks . No waiting period . No cool off time . No central database of gun owners . 2 ) Larger budget for law enforcement for persecution of firearm offenders . No larger budget for law enforecemnt + unconstitutional gun laws on the same bill before Congress . 3 ) Expanded civilian training such as Civilian Marksmanship Program to include all manner of modern military weapons . 4 ) If the militia is the National Guard , then I want formal seperation of National Guard from Federal authority .""","""Here is the definition of pro : 1 : an argument or evidence in affirmation < an appraisal of the pros and cons > 2 : the affirmative side or one holding it You claim to be defending the right to bear arms . Yet you defend the very gun control laws that the gun haters want ! How are you defending the right to bear arms if you want the very same gun control laws as the gun haters ?""",DISAGREE,"""want gun control . I want : 1 ) Instant background checks . No waiting period . No cool off time . No central database of gun owners .""","""How are you defending the right to bear arms if you want the very same gun control laws as the gun haters ?""",,
33258,8717,"""Did you know that in Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Acutally global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter , which is bad for any living thing .""",DISAGREE,"""Did you know that in Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Acutally global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter , which is bad for any living thing""",,
33260,8717,"""Did you know that in Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Acutally global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter , which is bad for any living thing .""",DISAGREE,"""Did you know that in Siberia they are HAPPY that it ’ s getting warmer up there ?""","""Acutally global warming causes it to be hotter in the summer and colder in the winter""",,
33269,8718,"""Not a coincidence , just a stupid population to look at to understand whether marijuana does or does not lead to `` harder `` drugs . And the word of some guy you heard about is how you draw conclusions ?""","""Oh , so this only happens here , huh ? Every single hardcore drug addict is here , huh ?""",DISAGREE,"""the word of some guy you heard about is how you draw conclusions ?""","""Every single hardcore drug addict is here , huh ?""",,
33281,8719,"""For two thousand years the bible has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""What do you mean by 'Yet it still stands ' ? Are you saying that it has ultimate authority , or it is simply a cultural fairy tale that so many are frightened to discard ?""",DISAGREE,"""two thousand years the bible has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""Are you saying that it has ultimate authority , or it is simply a cultural fairy tale""",,
33283,8719,"""For two thousand years the bible has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""What do you mean by 'Yet it still stands ' ? Are you saying that it has ultimate authority , or it is simply a cultural fairy tale that so many are frightened to discard ?""",DISAGREE,"""the bible has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""it is simply a cultural fairy tale that so many are frightened to discard ?""",,
33280,8719,"""For two thousand years the bible has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""What do you mean by 'Yet it still stands ' ? Are you saying that it has ultimate authority , or it is simply a cultural fairy tale that so many are frightened to discard ?""",DISAGREE,"""has been disputed yet it still stands .""","""Are you saying that it has ultimate authority , or it is simply a cultural fairy tale that so many are frightened to discard ?""",,
33292,8720,"""( 2 ) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage < same-sex marriage >""","""Dictionary.com http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage""",DISAGREE,"""same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage""","""Dictionary.com http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage""",,
33308,8721,"""The whole argument is weak unless gun control advocates are only pressing the issue due to accidental deaths .""","""No . The point is that doctors are more dangerous than guns , highlighting the stupidity of the anti-gun crowed who believe that guns should be outlawed because they are & # 8220 ; dangerous. & # 8221 ; Furthermore , if we wanted to include deliberate killing , we would have to include doctors who deliberately kill . And we would have to point out that many people who are killed with guns - should be killed ( violent criminals , for example ) . A few other education links are here : http : //www.aapsonline.org/press/medsentgun.htm http : //teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/ ... n/doctors.html""",DISAGREE,"""The whole argument is weak unless gun control advocates are only pressing the issue due to accidental deaths .""","""No . The point is that doctors are more dangerous than guns , highlighting the stupidity of the anti-gun crowed who believe that guns should be outlawed because they are dangerous. Furthermore , if we wanted to include deliberate killing , we would have to include doctors who deliberately kill . And we would have to point out that many people who are killed with guns - should be killed ( violent criminals , for example ) . A few other education links are here : http : //www.aapsonline.org/press/medsentgun.htm http : //teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/ ... n/doctors.html""",,
33310,8721,"""The whole argument is weak unless gun control advocates are only pressing the issue due to accidental deaths .""","""No . The point is that doctors are more dangerous than guns , highlighting the stupidity of the anti-gun crowed who believe that guns should be outlawed because they are & # 8220 ; dangerous. & # 8221 ; Furthermore , if we wanted to include deliberate killing , we would have to include doctors who deliberately kill . And we would have to point out that many people who are killed with guns - should be killed ( violent criminals , for example ) . A few other education links are here : http : //www.aapsonline.org/press/medsentgun.htm http : //teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/ ... n/doctors.html""",DISAGREE,"""The whole argument is weak unless gun control""","""No . The point is that doctors are more dangerous than guns , highlighting the stupidity of the anti-gun crowed who believe that guns should be outlawed""",,
33330,8724,"""In class I have to debate why if we were to start a new country why it should be socialistic . I do n't want this to turn into a debate , I only wants links and reasons on why we should go socialistic over capitalistic . Thanks for helping . * REMINDER * please do not turn this into a debate !""","""Socialism is a very broad category of political ideals , which particular form were you thinking of ? And just so you know , Fascism is not a form of socialism in any way . Socialism does not have oppressive governments . The purpose of socialism is to remove the class differences in society , if there is a small group of bureaucrats enforcing their will on the workers then that 's a class difference .""",AGREE,"""why we should go socialistic over capitalistic""","""which particular form were you thinking of ? The purpose of socialism is to remove the class differences""",,
33332,8724,"""In class I have to debate why if we were to start a new country why it should be socialistic . I do n't want this to turn into a debate , I only wants links and reasons on why we should go socialistic over capitalistic . Thanks for helping . * REMINDER * please do not turn this into a debate !""","""Socialism is a very broad category of political ideals , which particular form were you thinking of ? And just so you know , Fascism is not a form of socialism in any way . Socialism does not have oppressive governments . The purpose of socialism is to remove the class differences in society , if there is a small group of bureaucrats enforcing their will on the workers then that 's a class difference .""",AGREE,"""In class I have to debate why if we were to start a new country why it should be socialistic .""","""Socialism is a very broad category of political ideals ,""",,
33334,8725,"""`` Results . After adjustment , individuals in possession of a gun were 4.46 ( P < .05 ) times more likely to be shot in an assault than those not in possession . Among gun assaults where the victim had at least some chance to resist , this adjusted odds ratio increased to 5.45 ( P < .05 ) . Conclusions . On average , guns did not protect those who possessed them from being shot in an assault . Although successful defensive gun uses occur each year , the probability of success may be low for civilian gun users in urban areas . Such users should reconsider their possession of guns or , at least , understand that regular possession necessitates careful safety countermeasures. `` http : //works.bepress.com/cgi/viewcon ... dennis_culhane Not owning a gun makes me safer and two cherry picked 911 calls does not disprove that .""","""Tell that to Ruth Price . The murder rate in DC went up 200 % after the handgun ban . It dropped 50 % in Florida after Shall Issue laws were reinstated . You argue that people can not be trusted with guns , because they might injure themselves in accidents ( hence the 4.46 figure ) . My argument is that I 'd rather take my chances than be defenseless , because I 'm relatively sure that I wo n't shoot myself or anyone else by accident . I can not say that no one will every try to violently attack me or my family within the course of my life with the same certainty . Stop trying to protect people from themselves and start trying to protect them from criminals .""",DISAGREE,"""After adjustment , individuals in possession of a gun were 4.46""","""Tell that to Ruth Price . The murder rate in DC went up 200 % after the handgun ban .""",,
33339,8727,"""Strange that you seem to miss the meaning of your own quotes . Of course the phrase , `` survival of the fittest `` is a tautology .""","""Which Darwin thought was a superior phrase .""",DISAGREE,"""to miss the meaning of""","""was a superior""",,
33354,8738,"""Once again came from the article :  “ Many biologists start with theories and then test them in the field . Majerus takes the opposite and less fashionable approach : `` There 's another way of doing science , which is first find your organism and look at it incredibly closely , for a long time , in great detail and see what questions it asks you , `` he says. ”""","""Do n't those science writers make things so clear for you people who have no idea of what science is or how it works ? Actually , what is tested is the hypothesis . It is tested by making a prediction of a necessary observation and then devising a test of the prediction . Only when the hypothesis is supported should it be called a theory .""",DISAGREE,"""Once again came from the article :  Many biologists start with theories and then test them in the field .""","""Do n't those science writers make things so clear for you people who have no idea of what science is""",,
33356,8738,"""Once again came from the article :  “ Many biologists start with theories and then test them in the field . Majerus takes the opposite and less fashionable approach : `` There 's another way of doing science , which is first find your organism and look at it incredibly closely , for a long time , in great detail and see what questions it asks you , `` he says. ”""","""Do n't those science writers make things so clear for you people who have no idea of what science is or how it works ? Actually , what is tested is the hypothesis . It is tested by making a prediction of a necessary observation and then devising a test of the prediction . Only when the hypothesis is supported should it be called a theory .""",DISAGREE,"""Majerus takes the opposite and less fashionable approach : `` There 's another way of doing science , which is first find your organism and look at it incredibly closely , for a long time""","""It is tested by making a prediction of a necessary observation and then devising a test of the prediction .""",,
33358,8739,"""Since when has a big bang anywhere produced the order that we see in the Universe ? Big bangs can not produce the order that we see in the planets .""","""Would you like to learn how ?""",DISAGREE,"""Big bangs can not produce the order that we see in the planets .""","""Would you like to learn how ?""",,
33363,8740,""" ‘ The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics began at the Fall ’ . This law says that the entropy (  ‘ disorder ’ ) of the Universe increases over time , and some have thought that this was the result of the Curse . However , disorder isn ’ t always harmful . An obvious example is digestion , breaking down large complex food molecules into their simple building blocks . Another is friction , which turns ordered mechanical energy into disordered heat—otherwise Adam and Eve would have slipped as they walked with God in Eden ! A less obvious example to laymen might be the sun heating the Earth—to a physical chemist , heat transfer from a hot object to a cold one is the classic case of the Second Law in action . Also , breathing is based on another classic Second Law process , gas moving from a high pressure to low pressure . Finally , all beneficial processes in the world , including the development from embryo to adult , increase the overall disorder of the universe , showing that the Second Law is not inherently a curse . Death and suffering of nephesh animals before sin are contrary to the Biblical framework above , as are suffering ( or  ‘ groaning in travail ’ ( Rom . 8:20–22 ) ) . It is more likely that God withdrew some of His sustaining power ( Col. 1:15–17 ) at the Fall so that the decay effect of the Second Law was no longer countered .""","""SO the 2nd law of thermodynamics did n't start at the fall , but it STILL disproves evolution ! ! !""",DISAGREE,"""It is more likely that God withdrew some of His sustaining power ( Col. 1:15–17 )""","""SO the 2nd law of thermodynamics did n't start at the fall , but it STILL disproves evolution ! ! !""",,
33370,8741,"""Hey buddy ... I like what you are saying , but I ca n't understand much of it because you keep messing up the quotes . Please fix that so I can actually read what you 're saying . Thanks !""","""Sorry , taken care of .""",AGREE,"""I like what you are saying , but I ca n't understand much of it because you keep messing up the quotes""","""Sorry , taken care of .""",,
33374,8742,"""Originally posted by JFriday You are really going to hurt for that statement . WHERE ARE YOUR STATS BACKING THAT UP ? ! ? ! ? ! http : //www.crimereduction.gov.uk/statistics21.htm . Enjoy !""","""JFriday : In fairness , no one , pro or ant-gun can ever use UK stats to support thier argument again . Back in Jan '03 the UK government finally came clean and announced that they had been seriously fu * * ing with crime statistics . You can make the argument that the UK state had something to hide with guncontrol and you would probably be right . Reliable information from UK ministries should now be accepted as less than credible .""",DISAGREE,"""You are really going to hurt for that statement .""","""Back in Jan '03 the UK government finally came clean and announced that they had been seriously fu * * ing with crime statistics .""",,
33384,8744,"""It is now well established that the pattern of diversity at a molecular level conforms to a highly ordered hierarchic system . Each class at a molecular level is unique , isolated and unlinked by intermediates . Thus molecules , like fossils have failed to provide the elusive intermediates so long sought by evolutionary biology .""","""Try a google on cytochrome c .""",DISAGREE,"""molecules , like fossils have failed to provide the elusive intermediates so long sought by evolutionary biology .""","""Try a google""",,
33391,8748,"""and you can quite easily ( and do every day ) , reason something to a false conclusion .""","""Demonstrated by your postings .""",DISAGREE,"""can quite easily ( and do every day ) , reason something to a false conclusion .""","""Demonstrated by your postings .""",,
33393,8749,"""Do I need to go into detail about what organs necessery to survival are ?""","""Most certainly . The fact that you think that it is unnecessary only underlines your ignorance . Why do n't you discuss beetle lungs for us . Those are organs necessary for the survival of both bears and cheetahs . How about livers . Same story . Thyroid ? Pituitary ? Pancreas ? Go for it .""",DISAGREE,"""Do I need to go into detail about what organs necessery to survival are ?""","""Most certainly . The fact that you think that it is unnecessary only underlines your ignorance .""",,
33394,8749,"""Do I need to go into detail about what organs necessery to survival are ?""","""Most certainly . The fact that you think that it is unnecessary only underlines your ignorance . Why do n't you discuss beetle lungs for us . Those are organs necessary for the survival of both bears and cheetahs . How about livers . Same story . Thyroid ? Pituitary ? Pancreas ? Go for it .""",DISAGREE,"""Do I need to go into detail about what organs necessery to survival are ?""","""Most certainly""",,
33398,8751,"""Can we test the hypothesis ? Absolutely .""","""According to Coyne and according to Mike Gene , the author of your article , Absolutely NOT .""",DISAGREE,"""we test the hypothesis ? Absolutely .""","""Absolutely NOT .""",,
33406,8752,"""Yep it is easy . Lizards did n't evolve an avian lung . This should be easy for the creationist : The avian lung is far more efficient than the mammalian lung . Why did n't your god therefore fit the superior lung design to mammals , especially that apparent `` special creation `` , us humans ? Also please explain why he fitted a superior eye design to squid and octupuses than what he fitted to all vertibrates . Once you have answered these two easy questions , I 've a few hundred more for you""","""Only an atheist is arrogant enough to presume to question why God decided to do that . The greatest scientist in history said about the order of the universe : The Author of the system must have found it convenient . Birds did not evolve one either . They were created with it up an running .""",DISAGREE,"""Yep it is easy . Lizards did n't evolve an avian lung . This should be easy for the creationist""","""Only an atheist is arrogant enough to presume to question why God decided to do that .""",,
33415,8754,"""... it should be banned . However , in the course of banning the right the choose abortion allowances must be made . These are in regards to providing for the pregnant couple the services they need . I also think some `` PR `` work would need to be done to accomplish the destigmatization of unwed mothers so they really felt like they could unshamefully carry a child to term . Of course , I understand some folks think that they should be ashamed to be having sex outside of marriage , but the point here is to decrease the need for abortions . Get rid of the reasons why people have abortions and then ban abortion . Anyone want to live in Utopia ?""","""There are all kinds of social services , religious and otherwise available that will provide assistance to any woman who wants to carry her baby to term ........ When pro abortion people use that as and argument it is just a red herring and smoke screen ........""",DISAGREE,"""Get rid of the reasons why people have abortions and then ban abortion .""","""and otherwise available that will provide assistance to any woman who wants to carry her baby to term ........""",,
33417,8754,"""... it should be banned . However , in the course of banning the right the choose abortion allowances must be made . These are in regards to providing for the pregnant couple the services they need . I also think some `` PR `` work would need to be done to accomplish the destigmatization of unwed mothers so they really felt like they could unshamefully carry a child to term . Of course , I understand some folks think that they should be ashamed to be having sex outside of marriage , but the point here is to decrease the need for abortions . Get rid of the reasons why people have abortions and then ban abortion . Anyone want to live in Utopia ?""","""There are all kinds of social services , religious and otherwise available that will provide assistance to any woman who wants to carry her baby to term ........ When pro abortion people use that as and argument it is just a red herring and smoke screen ........""",DISAGREE,"""it should be banned . the course of banning the right the choose abortion allowances must be made `` carry a child to term . I understand some folks think that they should be ashamed to be having sex outside of marriage""","""that will provide assistance to any woman who wants to carry her baby to term ........ When pro abortion people use that as and argument it is just a red herring and smoke screen""",,
33421,8755,"""Wez it does n't matter whether they are legal or not . You can still get them . If keeping them illegal has worked at all I would say go for it , but it has n't . If I want a drug I can get a drug in about an hour . The same goes for any of you .""","""Legalising them would increase use however . Most people ca n't get hard drugs easily . If they get hard drugs at all , it 's still a lot harder to get hard drugs , than say alcohol . Then there 's the risk factor . Most people are n't willing to take that and risk becoming embroiled with dealers . I do n't particularly want an increase in hard drug use . -Wez""",DISAGREE,"""You can still get them If keeping them illegal has worked at all I would say go for it , but it has n't . If I want a drug I can get a drug in about an hour .""","""Most people ca n't get hard drugs easily If they get hard drugs at all , it 's still a lot harder to get hard drugs""",,
33430,8756,"""Would you call yourself a moral relativist ?""","""Why should I call myself that since everyone on the planet is as well ?""",DISAGREE,"""Would you call yourself a moral relativist ?""","""Why should I call myself that since everyone on the planet is as well ?""",,
33449,8770,"""The Pope is not biased and never has been . That does n't even make any sense .""","""I think her point was that the pope is biased because he 's catholic .""",AGREE,"""The Pope is not biased and never has been . That does n't even make any sense .""","""I think her point was that the pope is biased because he 's catholic .""",,
33454,8772,"""LOL ! 1 . You have a mistaken Ockham 's Razor .""","""Really ? Except for that one point , I believe I got it entirely right .""",DISAGREE,"""You have a mistaken""","""Except for that one point , I believe I got it entirely right .""",,
33459,8772,"""LOL ! 1 . You have a mistaken Ockham 's Razor .""","""Really ? Except for that one point , I believe I got it entirely right .""",DISAGREE,"""LOL ! 1 . You have a mistaken Ockham 's Razor .""","""Really ? Except for that one point , I believe I got it entirely right .""",,
33464,8773,"""# 4 - How do we know without a doubt the world is billions of years old ?""","""How do we know anything for sure ? We ca n't be certain of the Earth 's age in billions of years , but we can use carbon dating to figure out it 's older then 55,000 years , which refutes creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""know without a doubt the world is billions of years""","""but we can use carbon dating to figure out it 's older then 55,000 years , which refutes creationism""",,
33467,8773,"""# 4 - How do we know without a doubt the world is billions of years old ?""","""How do we know anything for sure ? We ca n't be certain of the Earth 's age in billions of years , but we can use carbon dating to figure out it 's older then 55,000 years , which refutes creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""How do we know without a doubt the world is billions of years old ?""","""How do we know anything for sure ? We ca n't be certain of the Earth 's age in billions of years , but we can use carbon dating to figure out it 's older then 55,000 years , which refutes creationism .""",,
33479,8774,"""Originally published in Science Express on 17 May 2007 Science 8 June 2007 : Vol . 316. no . 5830 , pp . 1484 - 1488 DOI : 10.1126/science.1138341 Prev | Table of Contents | Next Reports RNA Maps Reveal New RNA Classes and a Possible Function for Pervasive Transcription Philipp Kapranov,1 Jill Cheng,1 Sujit Dike,1 David A. Nix,1 Radharani Duttagupta,1 Aarron T. Willingham,1 Peter F. Stadler,2 Jana Hertel,2 Jörg Hackermüller,3 Ivo L. Hofacker,4 Ian Bell,1 Evelyn Cheung,1 Jorg Drenkow,1 Erica Dumais,1 Sandeep Patel,1 Gregg Helt,1 Madhavan Ganesh,1 Srinka Ghosh,1 Antonio Piccolboni,1 Victor Sementchenko,1 Hari Tammana,1 Thomas R. Gingeras1 * Significant fractions of eukaryotic genomes give rise to RNA , much of which is unannotated and has reduced protein-coding potential . The genomic origins and the associations of human nuclear and cytosolic polyadenylated RNAs longer than 200 nucleotides ( nt ) and whole-cell RNAs less than 200 nt were investigated in this genome-wide study . Subcellular addresses for nucleotides present in detected RNAs were assigned , and their potential processing into short RNAs was investigated . Taken together , these observations suggest a novel role for some unannotated RNAs as primary transcripts for the production of short RNAs . Three potentially functional classes of RNAs have been identified , two of which are syntenically conserved and correlate with the expression state of protein-coding genes . These data support a highly interleaved organization of the human transcriptome .""","""And the introductory paragraph is interesting also .""",DISAGREE,"""Significant fractions of eukaryotic genomes give rise to RNA , much of which is unannotated and has reduced protein-coding potential . The genomic origins and the associations of human nuclear and cytosolic polyadenylated RNAs longer than 200 nucleotides ( nt ) and whole-cell RNAs less than 200 nt were investigated in this genome-wide study .""","""And the introductory paragraph is interesting also .""",,
33500,8776,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human , and I do n't think it is right to dispose of the feotus on a whim , for personal convenience .""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ? Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human , and I do n't think it is right to dispose of the feotus on a whim , for personal convenience .""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ? Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""",,
33502,8776,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human , and I do n't think it is right to dispose of the feotus on a whim , for personal convenience .""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ? Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human , and I do n't think it is right to dispose of the feotus on a whim , for personal convenience .""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ?""",,
33504,8776,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human , and I do n't think it is right to dispose of the feotus on a whim , for personal convenience .""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there `` for this position ( personally against but prochoice ) ] but .... What do you mean by `` fully human `` ? Why do you think the fetus is not fully human ? Also , why do you place any value in the life of a fetus ?""",DISAGREE,"""I am against abortion because I think that the feotus is alive , though not fully human ,""","""Not to derail the thread so soon [ cause I 'd like to learn and discuss as many reasons and basis as are out `` there""",,
33522,8778,"""Then how do we morally judge God ?""","""That 's kind of the point ... to morally judge would mean they that being is on the same level or beneath you . It does n't make sense for the servant to such a thing .""",DISAGREE,"""how do we morally judge God ?""","""mean they that being is on the same level does n't make sense""",,
33523,8778,"""Then how do we morally judge God ?""","""That 's kind of the point ... to morally judge would mean they that being is on the same level or beneath you . It does n't make sense for the servant to such a thing .""",DISAGREE,"""Then how do we morally judge God ?""","""morally judge would mean they that being is on the same level or beneath you .""",,
33525,8778,"""Then how do we morally judge God ?""","""That 's kind of the point ... to morally judge would mean they that being is on the same level or beneath you . It does n't make sense for the servant to such a thing .""",DISAGREE,"""Then how do we morally judge God ?""","""That 's kind of the point ... to morally judge would mean they that being is on the same level or beneath you . It does n't make sense for the servant to such a thing .""",,
33533,8780,"""the only stupid gun laws are the laws that arent strict enough like the law that gun nuts wanted that would allow children to tote around assault rifles how stupid can you be""","""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""",DISAGREE,"""the only stupid gun laws are the laws that arent strict enough like the law that gun nuts""","""We explained to you ( more than once ) that federal law ( which says otherwise ) always trumps local law .""",,
33537,8781,"""Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol with one beer or even 2 beers a day ( which is pretty much average for a person of non-college age ) . You have a guy drink a beer a day and a guy smoke up a day and see the difference in 50yrs ... you will know which one is the weed addict .""","""Rationalizing ? I guess so , since I 'm trying to explain why it 's silly for it to be illegal . But , guess what , you are rationalizing why beer is legal . And you 're SO WRONG about drinking beer for 50 years . Drink enough beer to get a buzz and smoke enough pot to get a buzz every day and the beer drinker will be worse off . But you and I both know that all this depends on the person . If you want to limit it to a beer a day then I can limit it to one toke a day . There you go ... If weed is good enough , one or two tokes is all you need . You probably got WAY less tar than a cigarette and you did n't tax your liver with alcohol . ( You also did n't tax your kidneys and GI tract with caffiene . ) [ quote ] I 've lost 2 friends to weed and my gf has actually had a friend get his head blown off so you probably wo n't convince me it is a good drug .... [ /quote } Good lord , let 's all go watch Reefer Madness everyone . Please , explain how you `` lost `` these friends `` to weed. `` If your friend of a friend got his head blown off , that had everything to do with it being ILLEGAL ... But really dude , you 're making this up anyway and it 's silly .""",DISAGREE,"""Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol with one beer or even 2 beers a day ( which is pretty much average for a person of non-college age""","""I guess so , since I 'm trying to explain why it 's silly for it to be illegal .""",,
33538,8781,"""Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol with one beer or even 2 beers a day ( which is pretty much average for a person of non-college age ) . You have a guy drink a beer a day and a guy smoke up a day and see the difference in 50yrs ... you will know which one is the weed addict .""","""Rationalizing ? I guess so , since I 'm trying to explain why it 's silly for it to be illegal . But , guess what , you are rationalizing why beer is legal . And you 're SO WRONG about drinking beer for 50 years . Drink enough beer to get a buzz and smoke enough pot to get a buzz every day and the beer drinker will be worse off . But you and I both know that all this depends on the person . If you want to limit it to a beer a day then I can limit it to one toke a day . There you go ... If weed is good enough , one or two tokes is all you need . You probably got WAY less tar than a cigarette and you did n't tax your liver with alcohol . ( You also did n't tax your kidneys and GI tract with caffiene . ) [ quote ] I 've lost 2 friends to weed and my gf has actually had a friend get his head blown off so you probably wo n't convince me it is a good drug .... [ /quote } Good lord , let 's all go watch Reefer Madness everyone . Please , explain how you `` lost `` these friends `` to weed. `` If your friend of a friend got his head blown off , that had everything to do with it being ILLEGAL ... But really dude , you 're making this up anyway and it 's silly .""",DISAGREE,"""Rationalizing again It is still worse then alcohol with one beer or even 2 beers a day""","""Rationalizing ? I guess so , since I 'm trying to explain why it 's silly for it to be illegal .""",,
33549,8785,"""But you may need to take a few classes on how to analyze historical documents and Hermeneutics before you get it .""","""If the evidence is so weak that you have to take classes on the subject in order to be able to `` see `` the connection , that 's not very good evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""But you may need to take a few classes on how to analyze historical documents and Hermeneutics before you get it""","""If the evidence is so weak that you have to take classes on the subject in order to be able to `` see `` the connection , that 's not very good evidence""",,
33550,8785,"""But you may need to take a few classes on how to analyze historical documents and Hermeneutics before you get it .""","""If the evidence is so weak that you have to take classes on the subject in order to be able to `` see `` the connection , that 's not very good evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""But you may need to take a few classes on how to analyze historical documents""","""If the evidence is so weak that you have to take classes on the subject in order to be able to `` see `` the connection , that 's not very good""",,
33552,8786,"""The Daily Beacon There 's absolutely no way in hell this could be legal in any sense . That California school got * * * * * slapped for expelling a student who had a gun off campus , beyond the jurisdictional reach of the school . So how can this school believe they can get away with such an insane policy ?""","""Hummm , student athletes not all students . They got big problems .""",DISAGREE,"""There 's absolutely no way in hell this could be legal in any sense""","""Hummm , student athletes not all students .""",,
33560,8787,"""Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar 's and to God the things that are God 's . And good moral character is one of the things to render unto God . So , the answer is there is a higher Law than the Constitution . God rules !""","""Sure , that 's what you believe . But the Constitution is what this country is founded on , so naturally laws should reflect it . If you personally choose to live your life in accordance to the bible , that 's fine . But the Bible , like many other foreign documents , has no place in politics . Religious influence in government is highly un-American .""",DISAGREE,"""So , the answer is there is a higher Law than the Constitution . God rules !""","""the Constitution is what this country is founded on , so naturally laws should reflect it . the Bible has no place in politics""",,
33572,8790,"""oh , it 's obvious that non-darwinists have no affect on you guys . Nothing will ever change your mind because your mind is not made up on the evidence ... it 's made up on your worldview and your belief in materialism .""","""Oh the irony ....""",DISAGREE,"""Nothing will ever change your mind because your mind is not made up on the evidence""","""Oh the irony""",,
33582,8792,"""My belief is that abortion should n't be a right , but it should n't be something that 's criminal if the reasons are justifiable . I think it should be treated akin to homicide , you do n't get punished if your actions were truly justified .""","""And who gets to decide if it is `` justified `` ? Rest assured that the right-wing fundies wo n't allow YOU to do so for yourself .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion should n't be a right , but it should n't be something that 's criminal if the reasons are justifiable""","""And who gets to decide if it is `` justified `` ?""",,
33592,8800,"""Is your point that citizens should be allowed to have guns to defend themselves from the government or that citizens should be allowed to have guns to protect themselves from other citizens ? As for protecting form the government , I highly doubt that the U.S. military would be used to massacre U.S. citizens because its actions are far too public . It certaintly is possible that a more secretive organization such as the NSA would be able to carry out plans such as the ones which you described in other countries . However , do you think it would be possible for ordinary citizens armed with firearms to stop the highly trained employees of the NSA ? As for protection from other citizens , I think that the government should allow this , but I also think that people should n't have guns . So if the number of guns owned by citizens in the U.S. were to decrease , I would want it to be a voluntary change , not one forced by the government . There should still be gun regulation just as there is regulation of any product on the market .""","""You might want to pick up a history book and read it . Try reading both the Federalist and Anti-Federalist Papers for starters . If you were familiar with them , then you would 've already had the answer to your first question . Your selective memory is at work again . As I recall , in Waco military vehicles and equipment were used against the Branch Davidians . Nevermind the presence of members of Delta Force which was denied , at first , by the government . Then they were caught lying again about using flammable tear gas which , ironically enough , is banned by the Geneva Convention for use against enemy troops . In the end , the 'open and shut case ' the government thought they had , blew up in their faces because of their lies and abuses . I also recall , at some point around the time of the Great Depression that U.S. troops were called out to quell food riots in New York , I think it was . There were a couple of young officers present by the name of MacArthur and Patton , I believe . There are a few other instances I 'm sure . I note your glee about secret agencies and their awesome firepower in which mere citizens would be defenseless against . Is your closet full of brown shirts ? You must be proud . Huh ? You 're for protecting yourself against other citizens as long as it does n't involve guns ? Of course , that would n't apply to the criminal that you 're protecting yourself against ! Why do n't you read how well your gun bans are working in other countries ? Regulation ? The only regulation should be mandatory firearms training for all citizens like in Switzerland . Not the 'regulation ' that you liberals would propose which , of course , always leads to an outright ban of private ownership . Why do you fear the 'people ' ? It does n't matter what you think , the second amendment is clear enough all by itself . Try reading the Constitution again .""",DISAGREE,"""Is your point that citizens should be allowed to have guns to defend themselves from the government or that citizens should be allowed to have guns to protect themselves from other citizens ? As for protecting form the government , I highly doubt that the U.S. military would be used to massacre U.S. citizens because its actions are far too public . It certaintly is possible that a more secretive organization such as the NSA would be able to carry out plans such as the ones which you described in other countries . However , do you think it would be possible for ordinary citizens armed with firearms to stop the highly trained employees of the NSA ? As for protection from other citizens , I think that the government should allow this , but I also think that people should n't have guns . So if the number of guns owned by citizens in the U.S. were to decrease , I would want it to be a voluntary change , not one forced by the government . There should still be gun regulation just as there is regulation of any product on the market .""","""You might want to pick up a history book and read it . Try reading both the Federalist and Anti-Federalist Papers for If you were familiar with them , then you would 've already had the answer to your first Your selective memory is at work As I recall , in Waco military vehicles and equipment were used against the Branch Nevermind the presence of members of Delta Force which was denied , at first , by the government . Then they were caught lying again about using flammable tear gas which , ironically enough , is banned by the Geneva Convention for use against enemy troops . In the end , the 'open and shut case ' the government thought they had , blew up in their faces because of their lies and abuses I also recall , at some point around the time of the Great Depression that U.S. troops were called out to quell food riots in New York , I think it was . There were a couple of young officers present by the name of MacArthur and Patton , I There are a few other instances I 'm sure . I note your glee about secret agencies and their awesome firepower in which mere citizens would be defenseless Is your closet full of brown shirts ? Huh ? You 're for protecting yourself against other citizens as long as it does n't involve guns ? Of course , that would n't apply to the criminal that you 're protecting yourself against ! Why do n't you read how well your gun bans are working in other countries ? Regulation ? The only regulation should be mandatory firearms training for all citizens like in Switzerland . Not the 'regulation ' that you liberals would propose which , of course , always leads to an outright ban of private Why do you fear the 'people ' ? It does n't matter what you think , the second amendment is clear enough all by itself . Try reading the Constitution again .""",,
33595,8801,"""Look at Hawaiian Honeycreepers . Willful ignorance is a way of life . Hawaiian honeycreeper : Information from Answers.com""","""That 's a good argument , just post a link and hope that people accept it as a real argument . Show me where a new body part has evolved .""",DISAGREE,"""Look at Hawaiian Honeycreepers""","""post a link and hope that people accept it as a real argument . Show me where a new body part has evolved .""",,
33606,8802,"""They do provide many more services than providing abortions : P""","""Yet according to PP themselves , they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services . : P PPFA Services ( 2002-2003 ) Surgical abortions : 227,385 Emergency contraception : 633,756 Prenatal care : 15,860 Adoption referrals : 1,963 ( Source : www.plannedparenthood.org )""",DISAGREE,"""They do provide many more services than providing abortions""","""they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services""",,
33625,8804,"""Though it does n't really say why , the Bible says that is what will happen . See Matthew 7 :13,14 . It 's part of God 's plan . Free will .""","""What 's this ? Do we really get to pick apart the free will defense now ?""",DISAGREE,"""Though it does n't really say why , the Bible says that is what will happen""","""Do we really get to pick apart the free will defense now ?""",,
33628,8804,"""Though it does n't really say why , the Bible says that is what will happen . See Matthew 7 :13,14 . It 's part of God 's plan . Free will .""","""What 's this ? Do we really get to pick apart the free will defense now ?""",DISAGREE,"""See Matthew 7 :13,14 It 's part of God 's plan Free""","""What 's this ? Do we really get to pick apart the free will defense now ?""",,
33637,8805,"""To have a fin and a finger will not allow for survival . This mutated animal will find itself unable to flee it 's preditors .""","""Really ? So because you do n't understand how evolution takes place it must not be true . Because you have n't invested enough effort to learn what you are talking about , it must not be true . '' POOF `` is a much better answer for you because you do n't have to think . You have the answer to every question , your goddidit !""",DISAGREE,"""To have a fin and a finger will not allow for survival""","""So because you do n't understand how evolution takes place it must not be true""",,
33652,8808,"""Evo is based on what appears to be , in the physical World around us .""","""Well , assume God not to be a giant liar ... your belief requires God to practice deception , which contradicts is benevolent and perfect nature : Again why you put me on the ignore list . I highlight your theological contradictions .""",DISAGREE,"""Evo is based on what appears to be , in the physical World around us .""","""Again why you put me on the ignore list . I highlight your theological contradictions .""",,
33670,8814,"""I am surrounded by pseudo intellectual elitists who are so steeped in ignorance that they sanctimoniously claim that the full extent of the christians/creationists education starts and stops with the phrase `` God did it `` . If what you uninformed religious bigots and hatemongers believe was n't so pathetic , it would be funny . What 's a guy aspoda do !""","""So tell us irreligious types what religious bigots and hatemongers really believe , since you obviously know better than we atheists , looking in at it from the outside as we do .....""",DISAGREE,"""I am surrounded by pseudo intellectual elitists who are so steeped in ignorance that they sanctimoniously claim that the full extent of the christians/creationists education starts and stops with the phrase `` God did it ``""","""So tell us irreligious types what religious bigots and hatemongers really believe , since you obviously know better than we atheists""",,
33671,8814,"""I am surrounded by pseudo intellectual elitists who are so steeped in ignorance that they sanctimoniously claim that the full extent of the christians/creationists education starts and stops with the phrase `` God did it `` . If what you uninformed religious bigots and hatemongers believe was n't so pathetic , it would be funny . What 's a guy aspoda do !""","""So tell us irreligious types what religious bigots and hatemongers really believe , since you obviously know better than we atheists , looking in at it from the outside as we do .....""",DISAGREE,"""surrounded by pseudo intellectual elitists who are so steeped in ignorance If what you uninformed religious bigots and hatemongers believe ,""","""tell us irreligious types what religious bigots and hatemongers really believe you obviously know better than we atheists""",,
33692,8829,"""Crime has dropped significantly in New York and Los Angeles in recent years .""","""Crime has been dropping nationwide in recent years . Whoopdee do . There are some interesting statistics at http : //www.ncpa.org/pub/st/st176/s176c.html For example :""",DISAGREE,"""Crime has dropped significantly in New York and Los Angeles in recent years .""","""Crime has been dropping nationwide in recent years . Whoopdee do . There are some interesting statistics""",,
33705,8835,"""No it could n't . For starters Poplawski was dishonorably discharged from military service . In case you did n't know it , a dishonorable discharge carries an automatic life ban from firearms possession , meaning that his possession of an AK-47 was 100 % illegal .""","""So you claim .""",DISAGREE,"""For starters Poplawski was dishonorably discharged from military that his possession of an AK-47 was 100 % illegal .""","""So you claim .""",,
33715,8837,"""Today , almost half a century after the publication of the encyclical ( Humani Generis ) , new knowledge has led to the recognition of the theory of evolution as more than a hypothesis . ( Aujourdhui , près dun demi-siècle après la parution de l'encyclique , de nouvelles connaissances conduisent à reconnaitre dans la théorie de l ' évolution plus qu'une hypothèse . ) It is indeed remarkable that this theory has been progressively accepted by researchers , following a series of discoveries in various fields of knowledge . The convergence , neither sought nor fabricated , of the results of work that was conducted independently is in itself a significant argument in favor of this theory .""","""The statement was made in an address to the Pontifical Acacemy of Sciences in 1996 . It is clear that the Pope considers the theory of evolution to be valid . However , this is not a an encyclical and not a statement ex cathedra . Therefore it is not a statement of doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church . However , he is stating that , recognizing a restriction , the theory of evolution does not contradict Christian faith . He reaffirmed the statement made by Pius XII of that restriction . They is , `` If the human body take its origin from pre-existent living matter , the spiritual soul is immediately created by God. `` So yes . Catholics may be theistic evolutionists , evolutionary creationists or ID creationists . I suppose they can even fit into the other categories . I have known some YEC Catholics .""",DISAGREE,"""Today , almost half a century after the publication of the encyclical ( Humani Generis ) , new knowledge has led to the recognition of the theory of evolution as more than a hypothesis .""","""The statement was made in an address to the Pontifical Acacemy of Sciences in 1996 . It is clear that the Pope considers the theory of evolution to be valid . ``""",,
33725,8840,"""Not true . I most certainly do apply EAM to all empirical observations of biological originality , just to see if it still applies . To date , it always has .""","""That 's because it 's not a falsifiable hypothesis . No matter what happens to an organism , you will always be able to say it happened on purpose . The observations you cherry-pick are those you use when attempting to prove that darwinian evolution can not work . So you ignore the countless studies where variation is unambiguously stochastic and focus on the very small number which seemed initially to show non-random mutation . You ignore the countless studies where adaptive mutations arise , and can be elevated by carcinogens , in the absence of any hypermutational organismic response , and focus only on those where it does occur .""",DISAGREE,"""Not true . I most certainly do apply EAM to all empirical observations of biological originality , just to see if it still applies .""","""That 's because it 's not a falsifiable hypothesis . No matter what happens to an organism , you will always be able to say it happened on purpose .""",,
33735,8842,"""I fail to see how any evidence could better fulfill my burden of proof . I showed from my very first post that IC and Darwinism can not mix . Clive brought up objections , and I refuted them . Exactly what is the alternative ?""","""Well I suppose it is a matter of having a rebuttal strong enough to assert proof .""",DISAGREE,"""I fail to see how any evidence could better fulfill my burden of proof .""","""Well I suppose it is a matter of having a rebuttal strong enough""",,
33749,8846,"""President Obama poses a real and present danger to the Second Amendment , and he 's working to pack the Supreme Court with justices who will undermine Americans ' gun rights . Mr. Obama did n't fess up to this radical agenda when running for the highest office in the land . '' I have said consistently that I believe that the Second Amendment is an individual right , and that was the essential decision that the Supreme Court came down on , `` Mr. Obama told Fox News in June 2008 . Despite the campaign rhetoric , Mr. Obama is appointing judges who strongly oppose that position . The most recent pick , Elena Kagan , ran much of President Clinton 's war on guns from 1995 to 1999 . When Ms. Kagan served as Mr. Clinton 's deputy domestic policy adviser , she was a feverish proponent of gun control . From gunlock mandates to gun-show regulations , she was instrumental in pushing anti-gun policies , according to the Los Angeles Times . Every court nomination counts . Two years ago , the Supreme Court barely mustered a narrow 5-4 majority to strike down the extreme District of Columbia gun ban . Should Justice Anthony Kennedy or one of the four more conservative justices retire or die while Mr. Obama is in office , the high court likely will undo such narrow victories for the Second Amendment . While Ms. Kagan was nominated to replace the liberal Justice John Paul Stevens , and thus wo n't swing the court in a new direction , her being there will necessitate that gun owners concentrate more than ever on fighting outright gun bans . Ms. Kagan 's defenders acknowledge her liberal political views but claim that as a judge , the former Harvard Law School dean will somehow manage to separate her judgments from her political opinions . The hitch is that her legal views correspond with her political views . When Ms. Kagan clerked for Justice Thurgood Marshall , she wrote , `` I 'm not sympathetic `` to the claim that `` the District of Columbia 's firearms statutes violate [ an individual 's ] constitutional right to 'keep and bear Arms . ' '' Her memos to Justice Marshall foreshadow an activist judge who would n't hesitate to fall back on her own personal views to override policy decisions made by elected officials . She clearly counseled Justice Marshall on how he should rule based upon whether she thought policies made `` sense. `` Take her advice in the case of Robertson v. Methow Valley Citizens Council , in which an appeals court stopped federal agencies from issuing a permit to build a ski lodge in a national forest . Ms. Kagan might feel that stopping ski resorts from such building makes `` policy sense , `` but that is n't the job of a judge . Ms. Kagan is Justice Sonia Sotomayor 's soul sister when it comes to gun control . Last year , during her confirmation hearings , Ms. Sotomayor insisted the Supreme Court had never found that an individual right to self-defense exists . Two of Justice Sotomayor 's own appeals court decisions came to the same conclusion . One ruling denied there is an individual right to self-defense . In another case , even after the Supreme Court struck down the District 's gun ban , Judge Sotomayor opined that any restrictions on self-defense would pass constitutional muster so long as politicians who passed it said they had a good reason . Senators must realize that a vote for Ms. Kagan for the Supreme Court is another vote against gun rights .""","""Anyone who votes for Kagan might as well tender their resignation .""",DISAGREE,"""Senators must realize that a vote for Ms. Kagan for the Supreme Court is another vote against gun rights .""","""Anyone who votes for Kagan might as well tender their resignation .""",,
33767,8850,"""I think it 's fair . The pro-gun side has a consistent history of being in favor of protecting individual rights against collective entities like government and big businesses . The gun-ban side has a consistent history of being in favor of the removal of individual rights and trying to criminalize lawful behavior because they do n't like it . If you ca n't stand the heat then stay out of the furnace !""","""The pro gun-control side tries to protect individual rights from being violated by criminals . In contrast , the pro-gun side is more interested in protecting the profits of the gun industry .""",DISAGREE,"""of being in favor of protecting individual rights against collective entities like government and big businesses .""","""to protect individual rights from being violated by criminals .""",,
33768,8851,"""If pressures change so that those with below average beak size gain some advantage than they can exploit it instantly . From the word go they will be eating better and be more healthy than their big beaked cousins , and so more likely to breed successfully come next breeding season .""","""Again , true . But that does n't take into account that there are two populations under consideration .""",AGREE,"""and so more likely to breed successfully come""","""Again , true .""",,
33773,8852,"""( 25 . ) I believe in gun control ( and wrote this piece to satirize pro-gunners ) because I hate guns and want to see them all banned , which is why I own guns and also enjoy reading firearms-related literature .""","""Just like Rosie O'Donnel , or Josh Sugarmann , or Sarah Brady .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe in gun control""","""Just like Rosie O'Donnel , or Josh Sugarmann , or Sarah Brady .""",,
33775,8852,"""( 25 . ) I believe in gun control ( and wrote this piece to satirize pro-gunners ) because I hate guns and want to see them all banned , which is why I own guns and also enjoy reading firearms-related literature .""","""Just like Rosie O'Donnel , or Josh Sugarmann , or Sarah Brady .""",DISAGREE,"""because I hate guns and want to see them all banned , which is why I own guns""","""like Rosie O'Donnel , or Josh Sugarmann , or Sarah Brady .""",,
33793,8857,"""Evolution is not needed to explain such an event , as natural selection clearly accounts for it .""","""Evolution does n't explain the event . The event is an example of evolution - a change in the frequency of alleles in a populatioin over time . The explanation may or may not be evolution by natural selection . You merely asserted that based on your imagined case .""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution is not needed to explain such an event""","""You merely asserted that based on your imagined case .""",,
33800,8860,"""Not if it were enforced and a suggestions for how the law could be better enforced are given in the report .""","""No it did n't , there 's no suggestions for how to enforce background checks to stomp out straw purchases . Stop offering non-solutions .""",DISAGREE,"""Not if suggestions are given""","""it did n't""",,
33814,8864,"""I see no way the federal government can force states to marry gays .""","""Well , you must not be a GOP lawmaker or the President of the United States . They 're convinced that the only way to prevent the SCOTUS finding in favor of same-sex marriage is to amend the Constitution .""",DISAGREE,"""I see no way the federal government can force states to marry gays .""","""They 're convinced that the only way to prevent the SCOTUS finding in favor of same-sex marriage is to amend the Constitution .""",,
33827,8869,"""We thought it would take roughly a million years for bacteria to evolve enzymes capable of digesting nylon ( because the compound is so different than any they were able to digest ) but it took less than a century . .""","""Were they able to show a previously non-existing code that mutated on a gene somewhere and created this new enzyme activity ? It sounds to me that this `` new `` enzymatic activity came from non-coding dna switching on a gene to produce it . That is what one would expect to find . ... * Two new enzyme activities , 6-aminohexanoate cyclic dimer hydrolase and 6-aminohexanoate dimer hydrolase , were detected in the adapted strains . * ...""",DISAGREE,"""million years bacteria to evolve enzymes less than a century""","""non-existing code that mutated new enzyme activity non-coding dna switching , detected in the adapted strains""",,
33830,8870,"""Is this the sort of thing that is being taught at that bastion of liberal science , MIT ? How can this be presented as fact rather than theory ? New and improved nuclear fuel created Nuclear fission , neutrons and protons , and even the atom itself are just theories . No one has ever seen an atom or a neutron . No one has ever observed an atom split . Why are our liberal news media allowed to present this as fact ? Moreover , are n't nuclear reactors designed by intelligent humans ? I also notice that this research was funded by our hard earned tax dollars without requiring that the benevolence of God also be researched in equal time . This is yet another shameful example of the godless attitude of science .""","""Good pick up . Also , how do we `` know `` that the heat generated in these reactors is from so-called `` nuclear fission `` and not a heavenly gift to allow us our god-given right to toasters and ipods . The scientists had funny foreign names , so they are likely non-christian terrorists who hate freedom . Anyway , this nucular physics stuff is just another religion .""",DISAGREE,"""Is this the sort of thing that is being taught at that bastion of liberal , This is yet another shameful example of the godless attitude of science .""","""Good pick up""",,
33843,8876,"""While anyone can accept that a  “ perfect ” judiciary system would only send real murderers to death row , even if this were the case , it does not negate the problems mentioned before . The death penalty costs the tax payers more and benefits neither the dead , nor society , in any way , and society doesn ’ t punish in order to  “ get revenge. ”""","""And again :""",DISAGREE,"""The death penalty costs the tax payers more and benefits neither the dead , nor society , in any way , and society""","""And again""",,
33845,8884,"""A little antiabortion propaganda for your commute Ads , paid for by a Roman Catholic group , that ask `` Abortion : Have We Gone Too Far ? `` are n't faring very well on the Bay Area Rapid Transit System , the San Francisco Chronicle reported Friday . '' One ad , headlined ' 9 months ' in large letters , features nine months of a calendar and reads : 'Because of Roe vs. Wade , this is the amount of time the Supreme Court says it 's legal to have an abortion , ' `` the paper reported . '' The other contains the message : 'The Supreme Court says you can choose : after the heart starts beating , after its arms and legs appear , after all organs are present , after the sex is apparent , after it sucks its thumb , after it responds to sounds , after it could survive outside the womb . ' '' The campaign , which began three weeks ago , and cost $ 43,200 , consists of 280 ads on BART cars and 48 larger versions in train stations . It was paid for by Respect Life Ministry of the Oakland Diocese of the Roman Catholic Church . BART says that it had to accept the ads , since they 're a form of free speech under the First Amendment . But the campaign is seeing some vocal dissent from BART riders : `` Critics of the ads also seem to be taking matters into their own hands . Hundreds of the ads have been defaced with markers , had stickers placed over them or have been torn down and ripped up , according to Monika Rodman , coordinator of the group that placed the ads . '' 'The defacement has taken to religious epithets , profanity , everything you can think of , ' she said . A billboard at the MacArthur station in Oakland was torn to shreds , she said , and mini-essays were written on others . '' So many of the ads have been destroyed , she said , that a supply of a couple of dozen extras has been exhausted , and the ministry has ordered reinforcements from its printer . The group , which funded the campaign through donations , according to Rodman , is also asking BART 's ad agency , CBS Outdoor ( formerly Viacom Outdoor ) , for extra display time to compensate for the vandalism. `` Let 's hope that the controversy over the defacement of the ads does n't help the Catholic group 's fundraising so Bay Area commuters wo n't have to put up with still more of this nonsense on the way to work . -- Katharine Mieszkowski""","""Are the commuters who deface or tear down the anti-abortion ads exercising their right to free speech and expression ?""",DISAGREE,"""The group , which funded the campaign through donations , according""","""Are the commuters who deface or tear down the anti-abortion ads""",,
33848,8886,"""There is a right to own property and to travel as recognized by the US Supreme Court .""","""As a gun owner I 'm also a property owner . Or are you denying that guns are property ?""",AGREE,"""There is a right to own property""","""are you denying that guns are property""",,
33865,8892,"""I guess I 'm not going to get an answer from CountryGirl . Maybe she does n't know why she believes as she does .""","""She only posts like once every 3 months it seems ... so it makes the conservation awkward .""",AGREE,"""I guess I 'm not going to get an answer from CountryGirl .""","""She only posts like once every 3 months it seems ... so it makes the conservation awkward .""",,
33879,8895,"""No , he is right . You 're thinking about evidence after it 's been interpreted rather than the raw data available to all - which is not to say that it is equally scrutinised by all . The difference is that the interpretation of those facts that supports common descent is based on axioms that have many times proved their worth as accurate and predictive . That 's the part Ken does n't seem to appreciate : although axioms are indeed stated rather than derived or proved , where they lead you , the expectations they engender , can be compared with reality in order to see whether your axioms are congruent with those upon which reality operates .""","""I think Ham is simply being disingenuous - he advances the idea that we all have the same evidence so that he can then go on to argue that indeed it 's a matter of interpretation and that it 's unfair to deny the bible as an interpretative tool , because he knows perfectly well that any fair-minded person will stop and consider the argument . But in practice , he and the people whose opinions he defends do not actually think like this . We do not have all the same evidence , because something that you and I and all other reasonable people will agree is evidence even though interpretations may diverge will be rejected as evidence ab initio . And that is my point - albeit probably expressed unclearly in my earlier post .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's the part Ken does n't seem to appreciate""","""But in practice , he and the people whose opinions he defends do not actually think like this""",,
33896,8898,"""Historically , the causes and origins of crime have been the subjects of investigation by many disciplines . Some factors that are known to affect the volume and type of crime occurring from place to place are : Population density and degree of urbanization . Variations in composition of the population , particularly youth concentration . Stability of population with respect to residents ' mobility , commutingXpatterns , and transient factors . Modes of transportation and highway system . Economic conditions , including median income , poverty level , and job availability . Cultural factors and educational , recreational , and religious characteristics . Family conditions with respect to divorce and family cohesiveness . Climate . Effective strength of law enforcement agencies . Administrative and investigative emphases of law enforcement . Policies of other components of the criminal justice system ( i.e. , prosecutorial , judicial , correctional , and probational ) . Citizens ' attitudes toward crime . Crime reporting practices of the citizenry .""","""And gun control is not on the list .""",DISAGREE,"""Historically , the causes and origins of crime have been the subjects of investigation by many disciplines . '""","""And gun control is not on the list""",,
33893,8898,"""Historically , the causes and origins of crime have been the subjects of investigation by many disciplines . Some factors that are known to affect the volume and type of crime occurring from place to place are : Population density and degree of urbanization . Variations in composition of the population , particularly youth concentration . Stability of population with respect to residents ' mobility , commutingXpatterns , and transient factors . Modes of transportation and highway system . Economic conditions , including median income , poverty level , and job availability . Cultural factors and educational , recreational , and religious characteristics . Family conditions with respect to divorce and family cohesiveness . Climate . Effective strength of law enforcement agencies . Administrative and investigative emphases of law enforcement . Policies of other components of the criminal justice system ( i.e. , prosecutorial , judicial , correctional , and probational ) . Citizens ' attitudes toward crime . Crime reporting practices of the citizenry .""","""And gun control is not on the list .""",DISAGREE,"""Historically causes crime investigation factors density urbanization composition of the population youth concentration conditions median income poverty level job availability educational recreational religious characteristics family cohesiveness strength of law enforcement agencies criminal justice system reporting practices""","""And gun control is not on the list .""",,
33899,8899,"""That has nothing whatsoever to do with my post that you replied to . I was agreeing with a post by Flygirl which pointed out that the hospital displayed a basic lack of common decency , which I trust you also agree with .""","""Sure I agree with it . The thing is , you used to argue ( not in these exact words of course ) that decency on the part of the hospital was n't required , all that gays needed to do was visit a lawyer and they 'd be all set . I am asking you to clarify that position now to see if you still hold that opinion or if you 've changed it , specificially in light of this event . Simple question , no gotcha waiting to pounce .""",AGREE,"""nothing whatsoever to do with my post that you replied to""","""decency on the part of the hospital was n't required""",,
33902,8899,"""That has nothing whatsoever to do with my post that you replied to . I was agreeing with a post by Flygirl which pointed out that the hospital displayed a basic lack of common decency , which I trust you also agree with .""","""Sure I agree with it . The thing is , you used to argue ( not in these exact words of course ) that decency on the part of the hospital was n't required , all that gays needed to do was visit a lawyer and they 'd be all set . I am asking you to clarify that position now to see if you still hold that opinion or if you 've changed it , specificially in light of this event . Simple question , no gotcha waiting to pounce .""",AGREE,"""with . the hospital displayed a basic lack of common decency I trust you also agree""","""Sure I agree with it . that decency on the part of the hospital was n't required""",,
33905,8900,"""How do you get from `` chance `` to `` mistake `` ?""","""Either way it is a series of events that happened at random being explained by the results of those events .""",AGREE,"""How do you get from `` chance `` to `` mistake `` ?""","""Either way it is a series of events that happened at random being explained by the results of those events .""",,
33914,8901,"""The point is that a gun took MLKs life !""","""So you would be OK with MLK and Browning sharing the day if MLK had been stabbed ? Hows the list coming Brady ? Poking the Troll is a fun game""",DISAGREE,"""The point is that a gun took MLKs life !""","""So you would be OK with MLK and Browning sharing the day if MLK had been stabbed ?""",,
33920,8902,"""Are you sure about that ? Heterosexual sex goes as follows : The female 's one millimeter hole gets a one inch hidious peg rammed into it , tearing the hole until it is big enough for the peg . Wow , how ... not physical damaging . I think lesbian activities are a lot less harmful .""","""Well be cynical if you want , if someone in your family had done as you ascribed you would n't be here to be so glib . Nor would the human race or any other species where penile-vaginal sex takes place . I guess all those years of biological reproduction show it . You will also notice I did n't make it an absolute statement . I said `` minimal or negligable physical damage `` .I understand that female biology undergoes truama too during sex , the fact is the trauma of vaginal sex i ..... 1. more forgiving and 2 . Obviously possible of greater/important final result . And um , like with lesbian activities , the size of the `` peg `` also matters so how do you know lesbian activities are a lot less harmful .""",DISAGREE,"""The female 's one millimeter hole gets a one inch hidious peg rammed into it , tearing the hole until it is big enough for the peg . Wow , how ... not physical damaging . I think lesbian activities are a lot less harmful .""","""if someone in your family had done as you ascribed you would n't be here to be so glib . I said `` minimal or negligable physical damage `` .I understand that female biology undergoes truama too during sex And um , like with lesbian activities , the size of the `` peg `` also matters so how do you know lesbian activities are a lot less harmful .""",,
33930,8904,"""So why do some feel it necessary to deceive in order to `` put a lump in the throat `` of the American People ?""","""Because a major portion of them are not as American educated and schooled in the Constitution and BOR . A quick streetwalk with Jay Leno proves that . I bet many do not even know who the sitting president is much less VP . Their concepts come from folks such as yourself who would deny rights up to the point of no return . Still you would say , `` boosh did it `` . Meanwhile , back at the ranch , Where is Old Sarge ? I have n't read a post from him here lately .""",AGREE,"""So why do some feel it necessary to deceive in order to `` put a lump in the throat `` of the American People ?""","""Because a major portion of them are not as American educated and schooled in the Constitution and BOR .""",,
33951,8909,"""`` If men strive , and hurt a woman with child , so that her fruit depart from her , and yet no mischief follow : he shall be surely punished , according as the woman 's husband will lay upon him ; and he shall pay as the judges determine . And if any mischief follow , then thou shalt give life for life. `` - Ex 20:22-23 this suggests that when an abortion occurs , the one responsible will be punished , but not by death unless the woman is killed . even the bibles says that the mother 's life is more important than the fetus .""","""This applies only when men strive ... that is fight . If a man `` Accidently `` hits a woman while in a fight and causes her to lose her child then all he has to do is pay a fine . But if he keeps fighting and hurt other people he gets killed . Even in the Bible you dont get punished so severly on accidents .""",DISAGREE,"""even the bibles says that the mother 's life is more important than the fetus .""","""Even in the Bible you dont get punished so severly on accidents .""",,
33952,8909,"""`` If men strive , and hurt a woman with child , so that her fruit depart from her , and yet no mischief follow : he shall be surely punished , according as the woman 's husband will lay upon him ; and he shall pay as the judges determine . And if any mischief follow , then thou shalt give life for life. `` - Ex 20:22-23 this suggests that when an abortion occurs , the one responsible will be punished , but not by death unless the woman is killed . even the bibles says that the mother 's life is more important than the fetus .""","""This applies only when men strive ... that is fight . If a man `` Accidently `` hits a woman while in a fight and causes her to lose her child then all he has to do is pay a fine . But if he keeps fighting and hurt other people he gets killed . Even in the Bible you dont get punished so severly on accidents .""",DISAGREE,"""If men strive , and hurt a woman with child so that her fruit depart from her he shall be surely punished when an abortion occurs , the one responsible will be punished , but not by death unless the woman is killed""","""This applies only when men is fight . ``""",,
33966,8919,"""Dont know if I really buy into this or not , but it makes for some interesting reading : the origins of gun control http : //www.lizmichael.com/racistgc.htm the racist root of gun control http : //www.law.ukans.edu/jrnl/cramer.htm""","""Well , there 's also the theory that the second amendment has racist origins . According to the VPC , the second amendment was written because they felt that an armed militia was an important protection against the possibility of a slave revolt . http : //www.vpc.org/fact_sht/hidhist.htm""",DISAGREE,"""Dont know if I really buy into this or not , but it makes for some interesting reading""","""Well , there 's also the theory that the second amendment has racist origins .""",,
33967,8919,"""Dont know if I really buy into this or not , but it makes for some interesting reading : the origins of gun control http : //www.lizmichael.com/racistgc.htm the racist root of gun control http : //www.law.ukans.edu/jrnl/cramer.htm""","""Well , there 's also the theory that the second amendment has racist origins . According to the VPC , the second amendment was written because they felt that an armed militia was an important protection against the possibility of a slave revolt . http : //www.vpc.org/fact_sht/hidhist.htm""",DISAGREE,"""Dont know if I really buy into this or not , but it makes for some interesting reading""","""Well , there 's also the theory that the second amendment has racist origins""",,
33979,8922,"""It is much more important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""","""LOL ! And yet you look both ways when crossing street .""",DISAGREE,"""important that you concern yourself with the destiny of your soul , not how many years you can stay on the earth .""","""LOL ! And yet you look both ways when crossing street .""",,
33996,8925,"""Is n't it wrong to violate women 's rights on a chance guess or ( at best ) a gut feeling or a belief in a perhaps completely mythical God ? We know she deserves rights .""","""Well , you are apparently admitting that I am correct in that we do not know for sure . What God has to do with it I do not know , because I did not bring that side of the debate up . My argument is purely of logic and philosophy . Consider for a second that you are wrong , and that abortion really is the killing of thousands and thousands of people . Then is abortion a woman 's right ? Of course not . No one has the right to take a life for the sake of convenience ( I 'm not talking about aborting because the mother 's life is at stake , for now just clear-cut convenience ) . So you commit a logical fallacy by assuming women have this right , because you assume that people are not being killed , while you provide zero hard evidence that this is the case . So , once again you are risking thousands and thousands of lives based on a hope .""",AGREE,"""Is n't it wrong to violate women 's rights""","""you are apparently admitting that I am correct in that we do not know for sure . What God has to do with it I do not know""",,
34009,8929,""". But we know there is such a thing as legal precedent , and while your idea of people marrying pets is pretty silly , it is certainly NOT beyond the pale for marriage to be broadened to the point of including other arrangements as well like polygamy in some cases . The idea that gay marriage is not an example if simply broadening and moving marriage to a more wide-open concept for anything like many other examples is pretty ridiculous .""","""Actually polygamy is about one man marrying more than one woman . It is a heterosexual insitution . By your argument , it is traditional man/woman marriage that is the slippery slope to this `` broadening `` of marriage . You do not see any same-sex couples asking for a legal marriage for multiple partners . That is the realm of the straights , and all of them is mighty religious , as well .""",DISAGREE,"""But we know there is such a thing as legal precedent , and while your idea of people marrying pets is pretty silly ,""","""That is the realm of the straights , and all of them is mighty religious , as well .""",,
34026,8934,"""Then a man who needs an artificial heart to survive is a new species of man . That is the analogy I gave , and you ignored . In both cases ; human and bacteria , before the advent of a human product , a particular group of individuals from each larger group would die off .""","""I 'm not trying to participate in gang debate , but well .. The population of `` people with heart trouble `` would only be in jeopardy if the heart trouble made it more difficult to reproduce . If reproduction is not hindered then there is much less chance of dying off .""",DISAGREE,"""a man who needs an artificial heart to survive is a new species of man""","""people with heart trouble `` would only be in jeopardy if the heart trouble made it more difficult to reproduce""",,
34032,8935,"""........ You would not recognize the place now ..........""","""Oh ? Do tell , what awful things have happened to Baghdad by the Bay ?""",DISAGREE,"""recognize the place now""","""happened to Baghdad by""",,
34034,8935,"""........ You would not recognize the place now ..........""","""Oh ? Do tell , what awful things have happened to Baghdad by the Bay ?""",DISAGREE,"""You would not recognize the place now""","""Oh ? Do tell , what awful things have happened to Baghdad""",,
34061,8940,"""3 ) This variation is passed down by inheritance to future generations . ( We know that black folks have black kids ; white folks , white kids ; tall parents tend to have tall children ; and so on . ) Lackmarian evolution died a long time ago . Why have n't you ?""","""Again , you are off the mark . This is not a reference to Lamarckism ( which is what I guess you were trying to say ) . Even Darwin observed that novel characters were passed on to offspring . And he was smart enough to realize that these were not characteristics gained from use .""",DISAGREE,"""Lackmarian evolution died a long time ago . Why have n't you ?""","""Again , you are off the mark . This is not a reference to Lamarckism""",,
34064,8940,"""3 ) This variation is passed down by inheritance to future generations . ( We know that black folks have black kids ; white folks , white kids ; tall parents tend to have tall children ; and so on . ) Lackmarian evolution died a long time ago . Why have n't you ?""","""Again , you are off the mark . This is not a reference to Lamarckism ( which is what I guess you were trying to say ) . Even Darwin observed that novel characters were passed on to offspring . And he was smart enough to realize that these were not characteristics gained from use .""",DISAGREE,"""Lackmarian evolution died a long time ago . Why have n't you ?""","""This is not a reference to Lamarckism ( which is what I guess you were trying to say ) . Even Darwin observed that novel characters were passed on to offspring .""",,
34068,8941,"""A simple question really ... if this bill supposedly reduces health care costs per person then who is getting less money ? Please see the below graph to answer this question . http : //biglizards.net/Graphics/Foreg ... bution2007.jpg I 'm honestly asking ... will doctors get paid less ? Will people making health care equipment get paid less ? All of the above ? It wo n't all come from the health insurance companies , in fact , they will probably benefit ( the large ones that is ) . Just tell me ... who gets less money .""","""I think this is rather simple . There will be a decrease in volume or quantity of healthcare services . This will not include time of doctors who mostly tell their spport staff to do yet another test . So it will mostly include support staff , administrative staff , equipment manufacturers . They will not necessarily get paid less , there will just be fewer of them . Per person that is .""",AGREE,"""It wo n't all come from the health insurance companies , in fact , they will probably benefit ( the large ones that is ) . Just tell me ... who gets less money .""","""I think this is rather simple . There will be a decrease in volume or quantity of healthcare services""",,
34073,8942,"""Thats nice . How 's those `` 32 `` guns you `` own `` and hows your `` training `` going . Funny though how you can believe or not believe a question ....""","""Actually , he said he did n't believe you . Come to think of it , I do n't believe he has 32 guns either .""",DISAGREE,"""Thats nice . How 's those `` 32 `` guns you `` own `` and hows your `` training `` going . Funny though how you can believe or not believe a question ....""","""Actually , he said he did n't believe you . Come to think of it , I do n't believe he has 32 guns either .""",,
34074,8942,"""Thats nice . How 's those `` 32 `` guns you `` own `` and hows your `` training `` going . Funny though how you can believe or not believe a question ....""","""Actually , he said he did n't believe you . Come to think of it , I do n't believe he has 32 guns either .""",DISAGREE,"""Thats nice . How 's those `` 32 `` guns you `` own `` and hows your `` training `` going .""","""Come to think of it , I do n't believe he has 32 guns either .""",,
34088,8944,"""That 's really simplified . It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant .""","""Picture an astronaut connected to a spaceshuttle ... without that cord he wouldnt be able to live . so is he really able to live on his own or is he depending on something else to live ? ? i really dont see your point .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not like a woman 's body is a suitcase and the fetus is biologically self-reliant .""","""so is he really able to live on his own or is he depending on something else to live ? ?""",,
34122,8950,"""That 's exactly it . It 's not as though we can effortlessly rebuttle every single one of your posts as we 've done in the past . It 's not as though we 're tired of your absence when it 's your turn to defend your position . Oh no , it 's only because the cat 's got my tongue .""","""yea you 've rebuttled every one of my posts with rhetoric . How do you explain how The Computational and Analytical Molecular Evolution Laboratory is calling for a new synthesis based on `` biased `` mutations ? ? ? ? ? ? let 's hear it .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's not as though we can effortlessly rebuttle every single one of your posts as we 've done in the past .""","""you 've rebuttled every one of my posts with rhetoric .""",,
34128,8952,"""Lurch , I do n't appreciate your condescending tone . If you want to challenge my assertion that you are a pompous XXX that jumps to conclusions , you will need to be a little less judgemental and start thinking outside of Darwin 's Black Box .""","""Well it was n't actually condescending but a challenge . Are you saying that you are n't up to it ? If you want I 'll start calling you names too . Is n't it funny how creationists begin that sort of thing when someone doubts their dogma ? As for thinking outside the box , I can guarantee that evolutionary biology requires more thinking and encountering of new and difficult ideas than creationism does . To study science no one begins by signing an agreement to believe only religious dogma or to reject any scientific fact that disagrees with the mythology of bronze age herdsmen . In fact , you make a name in science by challenging established dogma . Just think about the famous scientists . Besides , how can I speak to you on an equal level about science when you do n't seem to understand it very well . Anyone who demands proof has no idea what science is or how it works . Then shall we start with a discussion of the carina ? I was n't sure that you were familiar with the terms and it makes the discussion easier to use the correct terms . Without discussing these structures and comparing them to theropods and birds you really ca n't understand why it is so clearly a transitional . But if you do n't want the condescending tone , then you need to pay attention . Perhaps if I told you to follow with your finger as you read it would help . If you can call me a pompous XXX the it should be OK if I call you ignorant , is n't it ? Why else would you be asking me at the end of your post I claimed exactly the opposite of what I actually claimed . I 'll explain at the risk of hurting your feelings again . Herring gulls and Lesser black-backed gulls do not interbreed . They are reproductively isolated . They fit quite nicely into the definition you gave of an insipient species . So Herring gulls do n't reproduce with Lesser black-backed gulls but herring gulls can reproduce with American herring gulls to the west , which can reproduce with gulls to the west and so on until you get to the Lesser black-backed gull ( which do n't reproduce with Herring gulls ) They are classified as separate species even though they are at the extreme ends of a single population . They illustrate one way that species develop . There are other examples of ring species , the most famous being a salamander in California and a bird around the Tibetan plateau . So how about this ? Genetic studies were done of Brown bears from around the world . Their DNA was very similar and they seem all populations seem to be able to interbreed as far as we know . Except for the Brown bears of the ABC Islands Although they look like other Brown bears , the have distinctive differences in their DNA . It is closer to Polar bear DNA , even though the Polar looks quite different and has characteristics not found in Brown bears . But guess what . All these bears can interbreed , including Polar bears with Grizzly bears . OK . Your turn for a few insults . I have come to expect it from creationists .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't appreciate your condescending tone .""","""Are you saying that you are n't up to it ? If you want I 'll start calling you names too""",,
34140,8954,"""He probably means `` heathens. `` You know those non-fundamentalists , they all look alike !""","""I think he does n't really know what he means , I do n't think all heathens follow a particular set of beliefs , though I do n't know as many as I do pagans .""",AGREE,"""He probably means `` `` You know those non-fundamentalists , they all look alike !""","""I think he does n't really know what he means , I do n't think all heathens follow a particular set of beliefs""",,
34162,8958,"""To say a fish became amphibian , and offer no transtional from is ridiculous .""","""And to deny that there are no transitionals without having the integrity to at least making an effort to learn what you are talking about is ridiculous . There are lots of transitional fossils . Museums are full of them and more are being discovered on an almost daily basis . There are news stories that report them all over the place . Try reading At the Water 's Edge : Fish with Fingers , Whales with Legs , and How Life Came Ashore but Then Went Back to Sea by Carl Zimmer . It will tell you about two transitional series . Also read Taking Wing : Archaeopteryx and the Evolution of Bird Flight by Pat Shipman for the story of what we can learn from even limited transitional specimens and why . Also read The Mistaken Extinction : Dinosaur Evolution and the Origin of Birds by Lowell Dingus and Timothy Rowe . I found the book excellent even though recent finds of feathered dinosaurs have made some of the material a bit dated . It will give you an idea of how the fossil record fits together . At least you might learn what a transitional is .""",DISAGREE,"""To say a fish became amphibian , and offer no transtional from is ridiculous .""","""There are lots of transitional fossils .""",,
34164,8958,"""To say a fish became amphibian , and offer no transtional from is ridiculous .""","""And to deny that there are no transitionals without having the integrity to at least making an effort to learn what you are talking about is ridiculous . There are lots of transitional fossils . Museums are full of them and more are being discovered on an almost daily basis . There are news stories that report them all over the place . Try reading At the Water 's Edge : Fish with Fingers , Whales with Legs , and How Life Came Ashore but Then Went Back to Sea by Carl Zimmer . It will tell you about two transitional series . Also read Taking Wing : Archaeopteryx and the Evolution of Bird Flight by Pat Shipman for the story of what we can learn from even limited transitional specimens and why . Also read The Mistaken Extinction : Dinosaur Evolution and the Origin of Birds by Lowell Dingus and Timothy Rowe . I found the book excellent even though recent finds of feathered dinosaurs have made some of the material a bit dated . It will give you an idea of how the fossil record fits together . At least you might learn what a transitional is .""",DISAGREE,"""To say a fish became amphibian , and offer no transtional from is ridiculous .""","""And to deny that there are no transitionals without having the integrity to at least making an effort to learn what you are talking about is ridiculous .""",,
34173,8959,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to ( as long as we do n't destroy ourselves in misusing that knowledge ) .""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",DISAGREE,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience""","""God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",,
34172,8959,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to ( as long as we do n't destroy ourselves in misusing that knowledge ) .""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",DISAGREE,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience .""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief""",,
34169,8959,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to ( as long as we do n't destroy ourselves in misusing that knowledge ) .""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",DISAGREE,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself .""",,
34168,8959,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to ( as long as we do n't destroy ourselves in misusing that knowledge ) .""","""But the belief that 'its gotten us far ' is itself a 'scientific ' type belief , in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself . Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying 'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",DISAGREE,"""All the knowledge from Science has come from trusting mutual experience . It has gotten us far and will continue to""","""'God must exist , because God is good and would not allow a world without God ' .""",,
34176,8960,"""On the contrary , the Pro-lifers are acting like the slave traders . Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right because of a physical feature is more like the slave traders than everything . Let me also remind you that black people were sentient . Fetuses are not .""","""Pro-lifers are like slave traders ? What a pro-lifers trading ? Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right is a slave trader ... like a right to life ... ? ? ?""",DISAGREE,"""On the contrary , the Pro-lifers are acting like the slave traders . Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right because of a physical feature is more like the slave traders than everything Let me also remind you that black people were sentient . Fetuses are not .""","""Pro-lifers are like slave traders ? What a pro-lifers trading ? Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right is a slave trader ... like a right to life ... ?""",,
34183,8961,"""Ah , the excuse for deadbeat dads . Seems like you are advocating for more abortions , then ! Just different ones . He does n't have to endure the pregnancy , f.ex . That is how God designed it for the man . Luckily the woman also have additional choices such as abortion , since she also has to rpovide a body to the pregnancy .""","""And for those who are not deadbeats ? Would you grant them any `` rights ? ``""",DISAGREE,"""the excuse for deadbeat dads . Seems like you are advocating for more abortions""","""And for those who are not deadbeats ? Would you grant them any `` rights ? ``""",,
34202,8965,"""God_is_real : The question is even deeper , however . Chickens have many proteins . Each protein is coded for by the DNA/RNA system . However , many specific proteins are needed in order to manufacture DNA/RNA . So which came first : proteins or DNA/RNA ? The logical explanation is that they were both created .""","""No , the logical explanation was already worked out by scientists several decades ago . RNA was theorized to be able to perform both informational and catalytic ability , thus serving the biological roles of both DNA ( information storage ) and proteins ( biocatalysts ) . The theory was confirmed , I believe in the early 1980s , when ribozymes - catalytic RNAs - were disovered . And since then , scientists have been able to evolve in the lab a ribozyme that is capable of copying part of its own sequence . They are getting close to confirming the theory that an RNA molecule can serve as the information store and the catalytic machinery for its own replication .""",DISAGREE,"""The question is even deeper , however . Chickens have many proteins . Each protein is coded for by the DNA/RNA system . However , many specific proteins are needed in order to manufacture DNA/RNA . So which came first : proteins or DNA/RNA ?""","""No , the logical explanation was already worked out by scientists several decades ago . RNA was theorized to be able to perform both informational and catalytic ability , thus serving the biological roles of both DNA ( information storage ) and proteins ( biocatalysts ) .""",,
34203,8965,"""God_is_real : The question is even deeper , however . Chickens have many proteins . Each protein is coded for by the DNA/RNA system . However , many specific proteins are needed in order to manufacture DNA/RNA . So which came first : proteins or DNA/RNA ? The logical explanation is that they were both created .""","""No , the logical explanation was already worked out by scientists several decades ago . RNA was theorized to be able to perform both informational and catalytic ability , thus serving the biological roles of both DNA ( information storage ) and proteins ( biocatalysts ) . The theory was confirmed , I believe in the early 1980s , when ribozymes - catalytic RNAs - were disovered . And since then , scientists have been able to evolve in the lab a ribozyme that is capable of copying part of its own sequence . They are getting close to confirming the theory that an RNA molecule can serve as the information store and the catalytic machinery for its own replication .""",DISAGREE,"""God_is_real : The question is even deeper , however . Chickens have many proteins . Each protein is coded for by the DNA/RNA system .""","""No , the logical explanation was already worked out by scientists several decades ago . RNA""",,
34214,8967,"""Job 32:8 But it is a spirit in man giving them perception , even the breath of the Almighty . 9 It is not the great that are wise , nor the aged who perceive justice ...""","""Good words to live by , despite all else . We seem to forget who needs to do the talking sometimes . I would like to add also that it is the Sword of the Spirit that we must be prepared to use at all times ...... and it does n't depend on any factors , for any reason .""",DISAGREE,"""spirit in man , breath of the perceive justice ...""","""Sword of the prepared to use""",,
34215,8968,"""Creationism means religion , but it also involves a belief in the authenticity of historical documents that have been meticulously preserved over thousands of years . That 's not just religion , it 's secular , observed history - something evolution does n't have .""","""Not historical documents but mythology . Genesis is n't historical . To believe that it is takes a certain intentional ignorance of the universe .""",DISAGREE,"""a belief in the authenticity of historical documents""","""Genesis is n't historical""",,
34217,8968,"""Creationism means religion , but it also involves a belief in the authenticity of historical documents that have been meticulously preserved over thousands of years . That 's not just religion , it 's secular , observed history - something evolution does n't have .""","""Not historical documents but mythology . Genesis is n't historical . To believe that it is takes a certain intentional ignorance of the universe .""",DISAGREE,"""That 's not just religion , it 's secular , observed history""","""Not historical documents but mythology . Genesis is n't historical .""",,
34219,8969,"""America has no reason to listen to people in the uk about gun control and now Knife control when its shockingly clear that criminals can still get any gun they want .""","""And yet , our instances of gun crime are much much lower per capita than yours . Hmmmmm , interesting no ?""",DISAGREE,"""America has no reason to listen to people in the uk""","""And yet , our instances of gun crime are much much lower per capita than yours""",,
34226,8971,"""They itch .""","""How do you know this and why would this be a detriment to the species ?""",DISAGREE,"""They itch .""","""How do you know this""",,
34227,8972,"""Well , at least the biological sciences and physics . The physicists also try to devise ways to keep their pet theories afloat so that the vast majority of the population can continue to be snow-blinded . Take their lie that there is some magical attraction between bodies of matter . The truth lies in Intelligent Falling - glory to the intelligent designer .""","""HEY ! I resemble that remark ! As a textbook-thumpin ' ( bio ) chemist , I am outraged at your ignorance of the chemistry pro-evolution sham . Remember , we 're responsible for the Miller-Urey experiment and all of its subsequent variations . We 've devised ways to analyze biochemically important molecules without altering them beyond recognition . We 're the methods behind such processes as genetic analysis and gene cloning . Carbocation hyperconjugation , keto-enol tautomerization ... C'mon , `` stable `` radioactive decay rates where if we lose half after 5700 years , we do n't lose the other half after 5700 more ? It 's all just a ruse to save Darwinian theory . Hell , chemistry is the glue that holds biology and physics together ! You 'd better think twice about calling us a real science . We 're just as much a sham as everyone else ...""",DISAGREE,"""The physicists also try to devise ways to keep their pet theories afloat so that the vast majority of the population can continue to be snow-blinded .""","""I am outraged at your ignorance of the chemistry pro-evolution sham .""",,
34240,8975,"""Creationists define true Christians to be only those who agree with them . Consequently these clergy are not Christians so their opinions can be discarded .""","""There are n't many christians then .""",DISAGREE,"""Creationists define true Christians to be only those who agree with them""","""There are n't many christians then""",,
34245,8976,"""Obama Pushes Anti-gun Treaty `` In actuality , according to ATF special agent William Newell , about 17 percent of guns associated with crime in Mexico came from the United States. `` I ca n't find a quote from Special Agent Newell saying any such thing . Mr. Newman 's figure of 17 % coming from the US is also erroneous . The 17 % can only be attached to those weapons for which there was a successful trace back to the US from the group of 11,000 submitted by Mexican authorities . The percentage of the total confiscated that actually came from the US is not known since some submitted for trace could n't be traced while the majority confiscated were not even requested to be traced , for whatever reason .""","""Its the reading comprehension thing kicking in . ... [ according to ATF special agent William Newell , about 17 percent of guns associated with crime in Mexico came from the United States . ... 5th paragraph""",DISAGREE,"""The percentage of the total confiscated that actually came from the US is not known since some submitted for trace could n't be traced while the majority confiscated were not even requested to be traced , for whatever reason .""","""Its the reading comprehension thing kicking in""",,
34260,8980,"""Is asking two people really a poll ? Waxy""","""Just how many graduates of the ICR Graduate School in geology and working in the oil industry do you think there are ?""",DISAGREE,"""asking two people really a poll ?""","""how many graduates of the ICR Graduate School in geology and working in the oil industry do you think there are ?""",,
34265,8981,"""I must say , it takes a butt to know a butt and to hang out exclusively for butt news .""","""Hello dierrier ! I would say you got your steotopegia handed to you in your hat I bet the shot men get out of the hospital before those women do and with less visible damage . Or mental either for that matter . Know how many lives are lost from medical mistakes each year ? Take a wild ( a word you are very familiar with ) guess ? You are over ten times more likely to die from a medical mistake than to ever be shot . Why do we tolerate this ? Just like guns , doctors prevent more deaths than medical error costs . Now these women will probably be doing the moon walk for a long time if not forever . Your chance of dying from a medical mistake is 90 times more likely from the hands of your doctor than ever being accidentally shot !""",DISAGREE,"""it takes a butt to know a butt""","""Hello dierrier ! I would say you got your steotopegia handed to you in your hat""",,
34274,8983,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason A study done by the Violence Policy Center showed that lots of terrorists , presidential assassins , white supremacists , and criminals visit gun shows and purchase dangerous weapons .""","""# 1 , There have n't exactly been a lot of presidential assassins , or gun weilding terrorists for that matter , for the Violence Policy center to be harping about . Where are these lots of terrorists and presidential assassins hiding at ? If the VPC knows and has n't reported them , then the VPC has committed a felony . # 2 And there is nothing illegal about being a white supremacist . While I despise their ideas , I fully support their right to have them .""",DISAGREE,"""A study done by the Violence Policy Center showed that lots of terrorists , presidential assassins , white supremacists , and criminals visit gun shows and purchase dangerous weapons .""","""There have n't exactly been a lot of presidential assassins , or gun weilding terrorists for that matter , for the Violence Policy center to be harping about .""",,
34276,8983,"""Originally posted by voiceofreason A study done by the Violence Policy Center showed that lots of terrorists , presidential assassins , white supremacists , and criminals visit gun shows and purchase dangerous weapons .""","""# 1 , There have n't exactly been a lot of presidential assassins , or gun weilding terrorists for that matter , for the Violence Policy center to be harping about . Where are these lots of terrorists and presidential assassins hiding at ? If the VPC knows and has n't reported them , then the VPC has committed a felony . # 2 And there is nothing illegal about being a white supremacist . While I despise their ideas , I fully support their right to have them .""",DISAGREE,"""A study done by the Violence Policy Center showed that lots of terrorists""","""There have n't exactly been a lot of presidential assassins ,""",,
34278,8984,"""If IC is a concept then it can be defeated by a concept .""","""So the only purpose of the concept of scaffolding is to defeat IC ?""",DISAGREE,"""If IC is a concept then it can be defeated by a concept .""","""So the only purpose of the concept of scaffolding is to defeat IC ?""",,
34303,8990,"""That Department of Justice study does n't support your opinion since it does n't examine crime statistics after the UK gun ban . Sounds like the UK crime rate has been going down to me . Alfaholic is jumping to conclusions .""","""I guess you failed to look at these two . http : //reason.com/0211/fe.jm.gun.shtml http : //www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,59866,00.html Here 's a little question .... If you were a criminal .... would you rather rob from a house where you knew the owner did n't have a gun or would you rob someone you knew had a gun ?""",DISAGREE,"""That Department of Justice study does n't support your opinion since it does n't examine crime statistics after the UK gun ban .""","""If you were a criminal .... would you rather rob from a house where you knew the owner did n't have a gun or would you rob someone you knew had a gun ?""",,
34305,8991,"""I 'm not sure on the details of their plan , likely because they are n't sure of them . We 're still in the process of spending around 3 billion to register all the firearms in Canada . The announcement is a blatant attempt to garner votes in Toronto and Ontario , key election areas , where gun violence is highest . I have no use for handguns , and I do n't even know anyone that would be directly affected by the ban , but it 's a matter of principle . It 's the first step on a slippery slope . We all know that the vast majority of gun crime is carried out with registered , legally obtained handguns . Therefore , banning handguns in Canada will surely solve the problem . Where do they find the retards that dream this stuff up ? First of all , handguns are nearly impossible to obtain legally in Canada as it is , 95 % + of handguns used in crimes in Canada have been illegally smuggled into the country from the USA . Even the police forces are saying that the law is pointless as it would only serve to increase the smuggling of handguns from the US , and would likely not have any impact on the rate of handgun use in crimes . On top of that , it would no doubt be another extremely expensive venture . There are times when I really question the intelligence of the average Canadian , especially those in Ontario and Quebec . Some of them need a dose of reality . Waxy""","""Does the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms permit the private ownership of handguns or perhaps ( as in the US ) grant a right to bear arms `` that shall not be infringed `` ?""",AGREE,"""We all know that the vast majority of gun crime is carried out with registered , legally obtained handguns . Therefore , banning handguns in Canada will surely solve the problem . Where do they find the retards that dream this stuff up ?""","""Does the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms permit the private ownership of handguns or perhaps ( as in the US ) grant a right to bear arms `` that shall not be infringed `` ?""",,
34330,8997,"""EDIT : with regards to specifically Nazism - the Nazis passed two relevant laws in 1938 . One loosened gun control on the general populace , the other banned Jews from weapon ownership .""","""And the Jews were the ones who got killed off in large numbers .""",AGREE,"""regards to specifically Nazism One loosened gun control""","""the Jews were the ones who got killed off in large numbers .""",,
34333,8998,"""Pregnancy is ALWAYS physically harmful . You try carrying a load of extra weight about and see what that does to your heart . It is also always life threatening - women still die from it and you never know how childbirth is going to go . These are the normal , frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy : -- exhaustion ( weariness common from first weeks ) -- altered appetite and senses of taste and smell -- nausea and vomiting ( 50 % of women , first trimester ) -- heartburn and indigestion -- constipation -- weight gain -- dizziness and light-headedness -- bloating , swelling , fluid retention -- hemmorhoids -- abdominal cramps -- yeast infections -- congested , bloody nose -- acne and mild skin disorders -- skin discoloration ( chloasma , face and abdomen ) -- mild to severe backache and strain -- increased headaches -- difficulty sleeping , and discomfort while sleeping -- increased urination and incontinence -- bleeding gums -- pica -- breast pain and discharge -- swelling of joints , leg cramps , joint pain -- difficulty sitting , standing in later pregnancy -- inability to take regular medications -- shortness of breath -- higher blood pressure -- hair loss -- tendency to anemia -- curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities -- infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease ( pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women , and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases ) -- extreme pain on delivery -- hormonal mood changes , including normal post-partum depression -- continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period ( exacerbated if a c-section -- major surgery -- is required , sometimes taking up to a full year to fully recover ) These are the normal , expectable , or frequent PERMANENT side effects of pregnancy : -- stretch marks ( worse in younger women ) -- loose skin -- permanent weight gain or redistribution -- abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness -- pelvic floor disorder ( occurring in as many as 35 % of middle-aged former child-bearers and 50 % of elderly former child-bearers , associated with urinary and rectal incontinence , discomfort and reduced quality of life ) -- changes to breasts -- varicose veins -- scarring from episiotomy or c-section -- other permanent aesthetic changes to the body ( all of these are downplayed by women , because the culture values youth and beauty ) -- increased proclivity for hemmorhoids -- loss of dental and bone calcium ( cavities and osteoporosis )""","""Hmm . . . a lot of these could also be brought on by sitting in a chair for long periods of time trying to make sweeping online statements that pregnancy is always harmful and trying to back it up with either temporary issues , worst-case scenarios that rarely happen , or things for which it is debatable whether or not it is truly 'harmful . '""",DISAGREE,"""Pregnancy is ALWAYS physically harmful varicose veins""","""a lot of these could also be brought on by sitting""",,
34343,9000,"""Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? - Yahoo ! Mxico Respuestas Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? When a serial killer of women acts , nobody says that it is OK because he is getting women `` freedom of misery `` . It is evident that not all his victims were poor and that murder is not the way to solve poverty . Is it not evident then that argument , applied to infanticide is only a dirty trick to say that it is compassionate an evil selfish action ?""","""Yeah - lets see how many fetuses get to leave that womb successfully when mom is starving .""",DISAGREE,"""Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ?""","""lets see how many fetuses get to leave that womb successfully""",,
34344,9000,"""Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? - Yahoo ! Mxico Respuestas Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? When a serial killer of women acts , nobody says that it is OK because he is getting women `` freedom of misery `` . It is evident that not all his victims were poor and that murder is not the way to solve poverty . Is it not evident then that argument , applied to infanticide is only a dirty trick to say that it is compassionate an evil selfish action ?""","""Yeah - lets see how many fetuses get to leave that womb successfully when mom is starving .""",DISAGREE,"""Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? - Yahoo ! Mxico Respuestas Are poverty and starvation only an excuse for abortions ? When a serial killer of women acts ,""","""Yeah - lets see how many fetuses get to leave that womb successfully when mom is starving .""",,
34356,9002,"""best way to create jobs has always been to go to war .""","""I think you are probably right .""",AGREE,"""best way to create jobs has always been to go to war .""","""I think you are probably right .""",,
34372,9005,"""I will Arch , as soon as you debunk this list : EvC Forum : 100 Categories of Evidence Against Noah 's Flood Yes , it has 100 categories that refute a global flood . How about that ?""","""hahahahahah . That place is holy water to vampires . Arch and Cash will never post there . Arch and Cash arguing honest arguments where they ca n't threaten eternal damnation , call people liars and insult them as the basis of their arguments ? never going to happen .""",AGREE,"""as soon as you debunk this list""","""That place is holy water to vampires""",,
34377,9007,"""This argument ... bascially suggests ... an orignial adam and eve ... and simply places the time ... as much farther back ... much farther .""","""Well ... yes .. it does ... and it makes adam ... and eve ... rather ... hairy ...""",AGREE,"""This argument ... bascially suggests ... an orignial adam and eve""","""Well ... yes .. it does ... and it makes adam ... and eve ... rather ... hairy ...""",,
34378,9007,"""This argument ... bascially suggests ... an orignial adam and eve ... and simply places the time ... as much farther back ... much farther .""","""Well ... yes .. it does ... and it makes adam ... and eve ... rather ... hairy ...""",AGREE,"""This argument ... bascially suggests ... an orignial adam and eve ... and simply places the time ... as much farther back ... much farther""","""Well ... yes .. it does ... and it makes adam ... and eve ... rather ... hairy""",,
34384,9008,"""Because you are using a word that already has a definition . Main Entry : mar·riage Pronunciation : \ & # 712 ; mer-ij , & # 712 ; ma-rij\ Function : noun Etymology : Middle English mariage , from Anglo-French , from marier to marry Date : 14th century 1 a ( 1 ) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law Do you see Jews celebrating Christmas ? NO ! They already have a holiday that is defined . And I believe the only reason they added same sex marriage to Webster 's Dictionary is so not to make flamboyant gay men cry . I am not anti-gay , but I am sick of hearing about it . Your rights do not compare to that of a religious background or ethnicity . That 's like comparing an apple to a cardboard box . The only thing the 2 share is the fact that they are nouns . I agree that it should n't be voted on . That 's a waste of my tax dollar . Do you think I ask the government to give me attention because I JUST HAVE to watch Everybody Loves Raymond in hi def ? And you 're in the wrong category if you mention gay rights and civil rights in the same sentence . Civil rights are non political and gays are always protesting something that has to do with the government . I would also like to add that I think it 's tacky that gays ONLY vote for liberals just because they `` love the gays `` . Those people do n't give a # # # # about you . They say that because the Conservatives have n't and intend to get your vote . Voting for one political party over one issue seems morally wrong . You 're gay . Get over it . Move on ..........""","""WOW it comes down to this ; heterosexuals are given a privledge just because of who they are and who they love . Gay people are denied equal treatment to heterosexuals because of who they are and who they love . The way I understand this is that segregation deined blacks equal treatment to whites because of who they where . You would not deny that the latter is a civil rights issue but you can not bring yourself to see the former is also . Why is that ? So what you are saying is that it is ok to discriminate based upon sexual orientation but not race or religion ? Why ? When heterosexuality and homosexuality are treated equally and both are considered normal and acceptable then I will move on . There is nothing wrong with being gay , it is not a sin , and it is not immoral . Until being gay is considered equal to being a hetero then you will just have to continue being sick of hearing about it . I am sick of hearing evil funamenalists insult my family because of who we are . I am sick of being denied marriage because of someone elses privledge , and religious beliefs . Btw this is also the definition of marriage from this site http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage""",DISAGREE,"""Because you are using a word that already has a definition . Main Entry : mar·riage Pronunciation : , Function : noun Etymology : Middle English mariage , from Anglo-French , from marier to marry Date : 14th century 1 a ( 1 ) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law Do you see Jews celebrating Christmas ? NO ! ``""","""WOW it comes down to this ; heterosexuals are given a privledge just because of who they are and who they love . Gay people are denied equal treatment to heterosexuals because of who they are and who they""",,
34381,9008,"""Because you are using a word that already has a definition . Main Entry : mar·riage Pronunciation : \ & # 712 ; mer-ij , & # 712 ; ma-rij\ Function : noun Etymology : Middle English mariage , from Anglo-French , from marier to marry Date : 14th century 1 a ( 1 ) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law Do you see Jews celebrating Christmas ? NO ! They already have a holiday that is defined . And I believe the only reason they added same sex marriage to Webster 's Dictionary is so not to make flamboyant gay men cry . I am not anti-gay , but I am sick of hearing about it . Your rights do not compare to that of a religious background or ethnicity . That 's like comparing an apple to a cardboard box . The only thing the 2 share is the fact that they are nouns . I agree that it should n't be voted on . That 's a waste of my tax dollar . Do you think I ask the government to give me attention because I JUST HAVE to watch Everybody Loves Raymond in hi def ? And you 're in the wrong category if you mention gay rights and civil rights in the same sentence . Civil rights are non political and gays are always protesting something that has to do with the government . I would also like to add that I think it 's tacky that gays ONLY vote for liberals just because they `` love the gays `` . Those people do n't give a # # # # about you . They say that because the Conservatives have n't and intend to get your vote . Voting for one political party over one issue seems morally wrong . You 're gay . Get over it . Move on ..........""","""WOW it comes down to this ; heterosexuals are given a privledge just because of who they are and who they love . Gay people are denied equal treatment to heterosexuals because of who they are and who they love . The way I understand this is that segregation deined blacks equal treatment to whites because of who they where . You would not deny that the latter is a civil rights issue but you can not bring yourself to see the former is also . Why is that ? So what you are saying is that it is ok to discriminate based upon sexual orientation but not race or religion ? Why ? When heterosexuality and homosexuality are treated equally and both are considered normal and acceptable then I will move on . There is nothing wrong with being gay , it is not a sin , and it is not immoral . Until being gay is considered equal to being a hetero then you will just have to continue being sick of hearing about it . I am sick of hearing evil funamenalists insult my family because of who we are . I am sick of being denied marriage because of someone elses privledge , and religious beliefs . Btw this is also the definition of marriage from this site http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage""",DISAGREE,"""is so not to make flamboyant gay men cry I would also like to add that I think it 's tacky that gays ONLY vote for liberals""","""heterosexuals are given a privledge just because of who they are and who they love ,""",,
34386,9009,"""This fine upstanding pillar of the shooter community had a ccw permit .""","""So ? Last time I checked , MASS MURDER was against the law . Did n't care too much for following that one , did he ? This is like pointing out that the man who drove through a retirement community killing 3 elderly people and 2 grandchildren in a drunk driving accident was a liquor store owner . According to your logic , this would mean he was a drunk driver because he was a liquor store owner , therefore , all liquor store owners are drunk drivers . But according to my logic , instead of focusing on a mere `` feel good `` bit of information , I would look at the actual drunk driving records of liquor store owners . What if I found out that this was the only incident of a liquor store owner killing someone in the past 50 years ? Which is closer to the truth : Your assertion that liquor store owners are all dangerous because of this one incident , or mine that they are n't because of the actual facts ? The state of Virginia has no requirement for a CCW permit . CCW permits are available for request for those citizens who desire documentation in order to carry in other states . There have been over 225,000 permits issued in Virginia . This means : HOW MANY PEOPLE CARRY HAVING NOT REQUESTED A PERMIT ? ( We know at least 225,000 are carrying there because they have requested one ) ..... let 's be conservative and say that half of them have done so . This means that over 50 % of gun carriers enjoy paperwork . My guess would be less than half desire documentation , but hey , I 'm gon na be conservative . So , over 500,000 people carrying CCW in Virginia everyday and one of them goes nuts . This means that CCW holders account for less than 1/10th of 1 percent of shootings in Virginia . ( It looks like this - < .01 % ) What 's the murder rate for the general population in Virginia , Penfold ? By stating that this one shooter had a CCW , are you trying to point out to us that the crime rate for CCW holders in Virginia is 20 times better than the general population , or 50 times better ? Maybe you 're trying to point out that it 's 75 times better ? Even if it 's only 10 times better ...... .... it is still better ( in multiples ) than NON CCW holders ! WHAT DO YOU FAIL TO GRASP ABOUT CCW HOLDERS COMMITTING SUBSTANTIALLY FAR FEWER CRIMES THAN THE REST OF THE WORLD ? ( BTW : This is just CCW holders in Virginia . Now go through the entire nation ! ...... and you point out that one has committed a murder ! Wow ! That 's a real crime wave ! One out of millions and millions ! Whew ! Maybe if another CCW holder commits another murder in a few more years IT WILL BE A TREND ! )""",DISAGREE,"""This fine upstanding pillar of the shooter community had a ccw permit""","""So ? Last time I checked , MASS MURDER was against the law .""",,
34395,9012,"""No , I ’ m saying if you put the memory of machine one into machine two , machine two with the memory of machine one will still be machine two . It will have the memory of machine one though , but it would still be machine 2 .""","""Okay I don ’ t care what you call it , but let ’ s take it back to the human being part . If your brain was transplanted into Steve ’ s body , would the new person have your memory and your life experiences and your reasoning powers ? For instance , you believe a human being begins at conception . If Steve believed a human being began at birth , would this  “ new ” individual believe that a human began at conception or at birth ?""",DISAGREE,"""It will have the memory of machine one though , but it would still be machine 2 .""","""I don ’ t care what you call it""",,
34402,9014,"""By Reduction to the Absurd :""","""Yes this is absurd . All things are subject to the Will of God the Creator . Nothing exists or can exist that is not subject to God 's Will . God is not perfect at everything . God is not perfectly evil either . Your analogy is flawed . Try again .""",DISAGREE,"""By Reduction to the Absurd :""","""Yes this is absurd .""",,
34405,9015,"""It does n't really matter where we start with the imaginary predictions you rely so faithfully on for your World view , as they are all based on ABSOLUTELY UNPROVABLE ASSUMPTIONS WHICH ARE DERIVED FROM MAKING ABSOLUTELY UNPROVABLE CONCLUSIONS WHICH ARE BASED ON ABSOLUTELY UNVERIFIABLE PREDICTIONS THAT DETERMINE THE EXPERIMENTS YOU MAKE THAT CAUSE YOU TO COME TO YOUR FAULTY , AND VERY MISLEADING CONCLUSIONS .""","""And yet , and yet ... all these unprovable assumptions and unprovable conclusions and unverifiable predictions , all this faulty and misleading nonsense based on nothing more substantial than a desire to deny the existence of god ... keeps paying off .""",DISAGREE,"""ABSOLUTELY UNPROVABLE ASSUMPTIONS WHICH ARE DERIVED FROM MAKING ABSOLUTELY UNPROVABLE CONCLUSIONS WHICH ARE BASED ON ABSOLUTELY UNVERIFIABLE PREDICTIONS THAT DETERMINE THE EXPERIMENTS YOU MAKE THAT CAUSE YOU TO COME TO YOUR FAULTY , AND VERY MISLEADING CONCLUSIONS .""","""And yet , and yet ... all these unprovable assumptions and unprovable conclusions and unverifiable predictions , all this faulty and misleading nonsense based on nothing more substantial than a desire to deny the existence of god .""",,
34407,9016,"""( It rather looks like ...""","""so you finding it difficult to accept `` harsh reality `` , you make it `` look like `` ... because you like that better . Sorry , it does n't work that way .""",DISAGREE,"""( It rather looks like""","""so you finding it difficult to accept `` harsh reality `` , you make it `` look like `` ... because you like that better . Sorry , it does n't work that way .""",,
34427,9025,"""Yes The only other option would be multi-formation , leaving the similarity in genetic material entirely unexplained .""","""By multi-formation you mean spontaneous , simultaneous mutations in all the related genomes ?""",DISAGREE,"""leaving the similarity in genetic material entirely unexplained .""","""simultaneous mutations in all the related genomes""",,
34431,9026,"""Four campus shootings in one week .""","""with tens of millions of gun owners , and hundreds of millions of guns in the US , and you think the guns are still the problem ....""",DISAGREE,"""Four campus shootings in one week""","""and you think the guns are still the problem""",,
34439,9027,"""I can give you two reasons why pro-life groups do n't do things that you suggest in your post . 1 . Because they may have children of their own they 're providing for since they are pro-life , 2 . Because of this . PRO-LIFER `` It is now our job to nurture and take care of those children who wo n't have a good future because of their parents or resources . DESPERATE MAN `` Honey ! Let 's go ahead and dump all our kids on these people because they want to raise our children so we wo n't have to ! Let 's tell the whole neighboorhood or even the whole city ! Mr. Pro-lifer is going to care for them all now !""","""But you do n't have any problem with forcing women to go through pregnancies that they do not want -- forcing them to give birth to children they are unable to care for . Nice .""",DISAGREE,"""I can give you two reasons why pro-life groups do n't do things that you suggest in your post .""","""But you do n't have any problem with forcing women to go through pregnancies""",,
34441,9027,"""I can give you two reasons why pro-life groups do n't do things that you suggest in your post . 1 . Because they may have children of their own they 're providing for since they are pro-life , 2 . Because of this . PRO-LIFER `` It is now our job to nurture and take care of those children who wo n't have a good future because of their parents or resources . DESPERATE MAN `` Honey ! Let 's go ahead and dump all our kids on these people because they want to raise our children so we wo n't have to ! Let 's tell the whole neighboorhood or even the whole city ! Mr. Pro-lifer is going to care for them all now !""","""But you do n't have any problem with forcing women to go through pregnancies that they do not want -- forcing them to give birth to children they are unable to care for . Nice .""",DISAGREE,"""pro-life groups do n't do things that you suggest in your post . have children of their own they 're providing for since they are pro-life , DESPERATE MAN `` Honey ! Let 's go ahead and dump all our kids on these people because they want to raise our children""","""forcing women pregnancies birth to children""",,
34465,9030,"""As I said , this is just my personal opinion . Free will is n't discussed in the Bible - so really all we can do is form our own opinions based on what we do know about God and his attributes .""","""the Biblical support for free will is the assumption that God is not willing that any man should perish , but that all should come to repentance . If God chooses everybody 's decisions for them ( or forces them to choose only the options He approves of ) then the trillions of people that are bound for Hell were forced to go there by God himself . in fact , God must have wanted them to go there from the beginning of time . this is obviously contrary to the nature of God according to the Bible , as far as I know""",DISAGREE,"""Free will Bible God and his attributes .""","""Biblical support for free will , nature of God according to the Bible ,""",,
34466,9030,"""As I said , this is just my personal opinion . Free will is n't discussed in the Bible - so really all we can do is form our own opinions based on what we do know about God and his attributes .""","""the Biblical support for free will is the assumption that God is not willing that any man should perish , but that all should come to repentance . If God chooses everybody 's decisions for them ( or forces them to choose only the options He approves of ) then the trillions of people that are bound for Hell were forced to go there by God himself . in fact , God must have wanted them to go there from the beginning of time . this is obviously contrary to the nature of God according to the Bible , as far as I know""",DISAGREE,"""opinions God""","""free will , repentance of God""",,
34487,9034,"""The enumeration in the Constitution , of certain rights , shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people . Rights Retained by the People Aside from contending that a bill of rights was unnecessary , the Federalists responded to those opposing ratification of the Constitution because of the lack of a declaration of fundamental rights by arguing that inasmuch as it would be impossible to list all rights it would be dangerous to list some because there would be those who would seize on the absence of the omitted rights to assert that government was unrestrained as to those . 1 Madison adverted to this argument in presenting his proposed amendments to the House of Representatives . '' It has been objected also against a bill of rights , that , by enumerating particular exceptions to the grant of power , it would disparage those rights which were not placed in that enumeration ; and it might follow by implication , that those rights which were not singled out , were intended to be assigned into the hands of the General Government , and were consequently insecure . This is one of the most plausible arguments I have ever heard against the admission of a bill of rights into this system ; but , I conceive , that it may be guarded against . I have attempted it , as gentlemen may see by turning to the last clause of the fourth resolution . '' 2 It is clear from its text and from Madison 's statement that the Amendment states but a rule of construction , making clear that a Bill of Rights might not by implication be taken to increase the powers of the national government in areas not enumerated , and that it does not contain within itself any guarantee of a right or a proscription of an infringement . 3 Recently , however , the Amendment has been construed to be positive affirmation of the existence of rights which are not enumerated but which are nonetheless protected by other provisions .""","""The purpose of the Bill of Rights . Preamble to the Bill of Rights""",AGREE,"""The enumeration in the Constitution , of certain rights , shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people""","""The purpose of the Bill of Rights . Preamble to the Bill of Rights""",,
34491,9035,"""Sure . Bring on the free machineguns to every male of military service and the paper tape . BTW are YOU going to clean your machinegun ? You are going to have to own a machinegun in your home you know . Your going to be forced to keep your machinegun clean . Your going to be forced to learn to place head shots at 300 yards . Your going to be forced to keep ammo sealed by paper tape . Sure I do all that right now . I 'd be happy to do that with a free machinegun and free ammo . Is that what YOU want ? The government handing out free machineguns ? Just checking if you want that . I want it . Give me a free machinegun . Give my friends who shoot at the range and shoot rifle matches , give them all free machineguns and free ammo . Bring it on .""","""Count me in for a couple of MP5s . I 'd even take American made M4s if they 're running short on the HKs . I 'll keep the paper sealed ammo tins intact and buy my own ammo . Quality 9mm has gotten so inexpensive I ca n't afford to reload it . 5.56 has always been that way . I like that idea .""",AGREE,"""Bring on the free machineguns to every male of military service and the paper tape clean your machinegun ,""","""I 'll keep the paper sealed ammo tins intact and buy my own ammo .""",,
34488,9035,"""Sure . Bring on the free machineguns to every male of military service and the paper tape . BTW are YOU going to clean your machinegun ? You are going to have to own a machinegun in your home you know . Your going to be forced to keep your machinegun clean . Your going to be forced to learn to place head shots at 300 yards . Your going to be forced to keep ammo sealed by paper tape . Sure I do all that right now . I 'd be happy to do that with a free machinegun and free ammo . Is that what YOU want ? The government handing out free machineguns ? Just checking if you want that . I want it . Give me a free machinegun . Give my friends who shoot at the range and shoot rifle matches , give them all free machineguns and free ammo . Bring it on .""","""Count me in for a couple of MP5s . I 'd even take American made M4s if they 're running short on the HKs . I 'll keep the paper sealed ammo tins intact and buy my own ammo . Quality 9mm has gotten so inexpensive I ca n't afford to reload it . 5.56 has always been that way . I like that idea .""",AGREE,"""Give my friends who shoot at the range and shoot rifle matches""","""Count me in for a couple of MP5s""",,
34525,9044,"""Supreme Court Justice Stevens also made a similar criticism . '' With emphasis on the word 'genuine , ' Stevens said that ' a genuine judicial conservative ' would not have inserted the Court into the 'political thicket ' of the gun rights debate as Scalia had done. ``""","""Too damn bad . The nature of the Second Amendment had to be addressed , it was , now shut up and move on .""",DISAGREE,"""Supreme Court Justice Stevens also made a similar criticism""","""nature of the Second Amendment had to be addressed , it was , now shut up and move on""",,
34526,9044,"""Supreme Court Justice Stevens also made a similar criticism . '' With emphasis on the word 'genuine , ' Stevens said that ' a genuine judicial conservative ' would not have inserted the Court into the 'political thicket ' of the gun rights debate as Scalia had done. ``""","""Too damn bad . The nature of the Second Amendment had to be addressed , it was , now shut up and move on .""",DISAGREE,"""With emphasis on the word 'genuine , ' Stevens said that ' a genuine judicial conservative""","""The nature of the Second Amendment had to be addressed""",,
34538,9050,"""That is why kids freak . There not stupid , their being told right from wrong in the old fashiioned sense most likely . What would be worse , to tell them right from wrong and omit parts out for sake of political correctness or allow them the full knowledge of what is acceptable and what is not ?""","""But how is homosexuality wrong ?""",DISAGREE,"""That is why kids freak , their being told right from wrong in the old fashiioned sense most likely .""","""But how is homosexuality wrong ?""",,
34571,9061,"""Adam , Eve and T. Rex Please tell me that was a spoof news story . Do people actually believe that the Earth is only 6,000 years Old and Dinosaurs shared the Earth with Humans at one point ?""","""Yes , some do , They are known as 'Young Earth Creationists `` . Check out http : //www.icr.org/""",AGREE,"""Do people actually believe that the Earth is only 6,000 years Old and Dinosaurs shared the Earth with Humans at one point ?""","""Yes , some do , They are known as 'Young Earth Creationists `` .""",,
34575,9062,"""I do n't think pro-choicers in general care whether or not abortion is truly rare . If they did they would put more effort into making sure it is rare , and not just legal .""","""I know you 're talking to Jessica , so I will only comment on this . It would be easier to make it rare if pro-life people were n't intent on making it illegal . Pro-choice people have to make it as available as possible to counter pro-life attempts to shut it down entirely . If pro-life people did n't exist , then the reasonable people could work towards making abortion rare . Take the current debates for example . My entire point is that it should not be illegal . That abortion should be available as a safe and legal choice ( it can only be really safe if it 's legal ) . We spend all our time and effort debating the legality that we spend no time on creating programs to help women choose to continue their pregnancies instead of having an abortion , legal or not .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion is truly rare . making sure it is rare , and not just legal .""","""it rare if pro-life people were n't intent on making it illegal .""",,
34578,9062,"""I do n't think pro-choicers in general care whether or not abortion is truly rare . If they did they would put more effort into making sure it is rare , and not just legal .""","""I know you 're talking to Jessica , so I will only comment on this . It would be easier to make it rare if pro-life people were n't intent on making it illegal . Pro-choice people have to make it as available as possible to counter pro-life attempts to shut it down entirely . If pro-life people did n't exist , then the reasonable people could work towards making abortion rare . Take the current debates for example . My entire point is that it should not be illegal . That abortion should be available as a safe and legal choice ( it can only be really safe if it 's legal ) . We spend all our time and effort debating the legality that we spend no time on creating programs to help women choose to continue their pregnancies instead of having an abortion , legal or not .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think pro-choicers in general care whether or not abortion is truly rare . If they did they would put more effort into making sure it is rare , and not just legal .""","""Pro-choice people have to make it as available as possible to counter pro-life attempts to shut it down entirely . If pro-life people did n't exist , then the reasonable people could work towards making abortion rare .""",,
34595,9067,"""Originally Posted by sinjin You are welcome to carry ordinance in international waters all you like .""","""Yes , but how do you legally get it into international waters ? Once there , where do you go ? There are n't too many ports where ordinance is allowed . Since I am a law abiding citizen , where , other than international waters , may I legally have a gun ?""",DISAGREE,"""Originally Posted by sinjin You are welcome to carry ordinance in international waters all you like""","""Yes , but how do you legally get it into international waters ?""",,
34606,9071,"""If we look to biology to answer the question of when a unique entity begins its biological development that will not end until it 'dies , ' then the answer is conception/fertilization .""","""Nope , it is at its mom 's fetal stage ( in the case of humans , 18-45 years before its birth ) .""",DISAGREE,"""If we look to biology to answer the question of when a unique entity""","""Nope , it is at its mom 's fetal stage""",,
34619,9074,"""Fine by me . First , I do n't consider having a marriage recognized by government to be a `` right `` . Second , I 've said many times I do n't think government should be in the marriage business at all . I 'm a fan of less gov't not more .""","""Yes an I am sure you love unbridled capitalism , cruel self centred people do . Capitalism is a cruel system that kills people , lets them starve , makes them homeless , and exploits the poor for the gain of a few .""",DISAGREE,"""Fine by me . First , I do n't consider having a marriage recognized by government to be a `` right ``""","""Yes an I am sure you love unbridled capitalism , cruel self centred people do .""",,
34626,9075,"""I am new to this . It seems that many posters do not take you seriously . This seems unfair . You must be very frustrated after putting so much intelligence and effort into gathering this information . If you are right -- I am not completely sure yet , but my dorm-mates think you are -- the big question we ask is how would your insight actually change anything ?""","""We do n't take him seriously anymore because despite having been refuted over and over ( both here and on at least four other boards ) , he still posts the same garbage . Whenever it looks like there has been overwhelming refutation of his thread , he abandons it and starts a new one saying basically the same thing as the one before it . THAT is why he is n't taken seriously , and no , it is not `` unfair `` . I also have to ask why you think he puts so much intelligence into his posts , when all he does is either cut and paste from some anti-evolution site , or say things like `` science is a joke `` My pet dog could do better .""",AGREE,"""many posters do not take you seriously . This seems unfair .""","""Whenever it looks like there has been overwhelming refutation of his thread ,""",,
34645,9080,"""@ kronus Imagine you are shown god exists and did create the universe `` genesis stlye `` . How would it change YOUR behaviour ? Would it change YOUR ethics ?""","""the problem with a `` un-genesis style `` creation is that it would effectively nullify everything in the bible . the biblical god both created life on earth in 6 days and sent his son to die for the sins of humankind . to me there is something very wrong with blatantly rejecting one biblical claim and blindly embracing another the god in this context ( one that created the world some other way , and may not necessarily disapprove gays ) may also not care about your ethical code . then such a god 's existence should have no bearing on how we live our lives , now would it ? if such a god requires us to be ethical , is not against homosexuality , and created the world in a way other than genesis ' description , then you are talking about a god of specific characteristics that would lend itself to a precise definition . we would require a lengthy list of rules by which we should live , and a description of how the world was actually created , as well as historical references of god 's interaction with mankind in times past . you 'd end up with another bible""",DISAGREE,"""`` . How would it change YOUR behaviour ? Would it change YOUR ethics ?""","""creation is that it would effectively nullify everything in the bible may also not care about your ethical code . then such a god 's existence should have no bearing on how we live our lives , now would it""",,
34650,9081,"""Jim , The working class has shown themselves unfit to lead . What now ?""","""personally I do n't accept the premise of the question .""",DISAGREE,"""The working class has shown themselves unfit to lead""","""I do n't accept the premise of the question""",,
34658,9082,"""Where were the French on D-Day and the Normandy Invasion when Hitler was burglering their Nation ? I do n't recall history mentioning a Frenchman around but the Americans were saving their rears once again ...""","""Collecting on the 150 year-old debt for assisting their rebellion against their lords and masters ....""",DISAGREE,"""Where were the French on D-Day and the Normandy Invasion when Hitler was burglering their Nation ?""","""Collecting on the 150 year-old debt for assisting their rebellion against their lords and masters""",,
34664,9083,"""Many people would allow abortions in extreme cases because they figure that since extreme cases make up about 5 % of abortions then if they can get all but extreme cases then they will be saving at least 95 % , which is better than nothing . After that they can work towards stopping all abortions . It 's a step-by-step process . I say abortion of all kinds should be illegal . 95 % of abortions are a result of consentual sex . We should n't cater to the 5 % just because they 've had a tough situation . I sympathize with them and would do what I could to help them , but they do still need to have the baby , whether they give it up for adoption or not . This is n't a horribly unreasonable position . It 's just a difficult position . Saying it 's alright to kill a baby for any reason is a horribly unreasonable position . People need to face the facts too . Sex is n't there for pleasure , it 's there for procreation and happens to be pleasureable . Someone who indulges in this pleasure should be ready to deal with the outcome , which oftentimes is a baby .""","""Save 95 % of fetuses ? Pro-lifers have a weird obsession with non-sentient fetal tissue .""",DISAGREE,"""since extreme cases make up about 5 % of abortions then if they can get all but extreme cases then they will be saving at least 95 % ,""","""Save 95 % of fetuses ?""",,
34669,9084,"""That the thinking of some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""","""Your right , logic does not change because mans thinking is flawed that because logic is not a human construct . If is was , logic would change at the whem of our thinking .""",AGREE,"""some men is flawed does not mean the constructs of others is in error .""","""Your right""",,
34671,9085,"""Actually , I probably should have included the Big Bang to show the complete body of knowledge that opposes the fundamentalist interpretation of the bible . This is for the sake of completion , as the bible includes a story of how the universe began .""","""I dunno ... we already have enough fundies thinking that the Big Bang is part of evolution ...""",DISAGREE,"""I probably should have included the Big Bang to show the complete body of knowledge that opposes the fundamentalist interpretation of the bible""","""I dunno ... we already have enough fundies thinking that the Big Bang is part of evolution ...""",,
34700,9093,"""* * Genes are subordinate to cells And not the other way round , as darwinists insist . see- http : //www.sciencedaily.com/releases ... 0524145045.htm""","""Its odd that you would use that concept at all . Do you really think terms used to describe power structures in human organizations are applicable to cells and their subsystems ? Genes are the heritable information store of cells , they perform their function , other subsystems perform other functions . The whole constitutes a living cell . The whole who is on top thing is an inapplicable concept . What counts is understanding the functions of the various subsystems . A cell is not a dominance heiracrchy .""",DISAGREE,"""Genes are subordinate to cells And not the other way round , as darwinists insist .""","""The whole who is on top thing is an inapplicable concept . What counts is understanding the functions of the various subsystems . A cell is not a dominance heiracrchy .""",,
34702,9094,"""That was jsut plain silly . A single car will produce more emmisiosn then all the termites in your state . Rember c02 is one part of the equation .""","""CO2 is only a part . Do n't forget the methane that termites produce .""",DISAGREE,"""A single car will produce more emmisiosn then all the termites in your state . Rember c02 is one part of the equation .""","""CO2 is only a part . Do n't forget the methane that termites produce .""",,
34706,9094,"""That was jsut plain silly . A single car will produce more emmisiosn then all the termites in your state . Rember c02 is one part of the equation .""","""CO2 is only a part . Do n't forget the methane that termites produce .""",DISAGREE,"""jsut plain silly A single car will produce more emmisiosn""","""CO2 is only a part Do n't forget the methane that termites produce""",,
34715,9095,"""Well it all depends on who is going to determine `` right `` , is n't it ? Abortion is not math . There are no finite answers . Just a myriad of opinions which inevitable lead to either abortion is right or abortion is wrong . No different now then when Roe v Wade became law or any other times in history . I do like Aristotle 's take ; He taught that a fetus originally had a vegetable soul but he did n't say what kind of vegetable .""","""I do not understand why people are stuck in this mindset that we have to define ALL abortions as either right or wrong . In between , there is the option of calling abortion under certain circumstances as right or wrong or calling abortion in certain trimesters as right or wrong . Why limit yourself to the extreme views ? I do not believe that the original post asked for an absolute answer , just a survey of opinions . After all , as you say , abortion is not math and there is no one answer that everyone might agree with . However , the question of people 's opinions on the beginning of personhood and how it relates to the morality of abortion lies at the very core of the debate on abortion rights . Really ... what other question is more relevant ?""",DISAGREE,"""depends on who is going to determine `` right ``""","""just a survey of opinions .""",,
34730,9097,"""In truth , we could put everything we absolutly know about evolution ( have physical proof for ) in a box , and it would be a small one .""","""Actually , we have museums full of evidence . Only a fool talks about scientific proof . On the other hand , we would n't need any box for the evidence of creation or ID that you think is OK to teach as science . It does n't exist .""",DISAGREE,"""absolutly know about evolution""","""museums full of evidence we would n't need any box for the evidence""",,
34735,9097,"""In truth , we could put everything we absolutly know about evolution ( have physical proof for ) in a box , and it would be a small one .""","""Actually , we have museums full of evidence . Only a fool talks about scientific proof . On the other hand , we would n't need any box for the evidence of creation or ID that you think is OK to teach as science . It does n't exist .""",DISAGREE,"""we could put everything we absolutly know about evolution in a box small""","""we have museums full of evidence""",,
34736,9097,"""In truth , we could put everything we absolutly know about evolution ( have physical proof for ) in a box , and it would be a small one .""","""Actually , we have museums full of evidence . Only a fool talks about scientific proof . On the other hand , we would n't need any box for the evidence of creation or ID that you think is OK to teach as science . It does n't exist .""",DISAGREE,"""we could put everything we absolutly know about evolution""","""we have museums talks about scientific proof""",,
34773,9103,"""Obviously not about abortion .""","""So , none of those women who slept with men were pregnant at the time ?""",DISAGREE,"""Obviously not about abortion .""","""none of those women who slept with men were pregnant at the time ?""",,
34778,9104,"""Police officer deaths fell sharply in 2008 -- number has n't been that low since 1999""","""But I thought it was an epidemic , more cops killed than civilians ?""",DISAGREE,"""Police officer deaths fell sharply in 2008""","""I thought it was an epidemic , more cops killed than civilians ?""",,
34790,9107,"""you believe God and ALL of what He says or you dont believe in any of it at all ..""","""But first , you have to believe ( on faith - no evidence ) that you know what god said . And then you have to interpret that so that it is acceptable to you . Most people who use your same `` word of god `` believe all of it but understand what it says differently .""",DISAGREE,"""you believe God and ALL of what He says or you dont""","""Most people who use your same `` word of god `` believe all of it but understand what it says differently .""",,
34895,9127,"""It also means some where there is a universe that you created by passing gas and in it you are a creationist and an Elvis Impersonator .""","""And how does that mean evolution is wrong and creation is correct ? You do realize that even if you somehow manage to prove evolution false ( not likely ) , you are still miles from proving creation right ?""",DISAGREE,"""It also means some where there is a universe that you created by passing gas""","""And how does that mean evolution is wrong and creation is correct ?""",,
34897,9127,"""It also means some where there is a universe that you created by passing gas and in it you are a creationist and an Elvis Impersonator .""","""And how does that mean evolution is wrong and creation is correct ? You do realize that even if you somehow manage to prove evolution false ( not likely ) , you are still miles from proving creation right ?""",DISAGREE,"""universe creationist Elvis Impersonator .""","""creation is correct ? creation right ?""",,
35001,9155,"""Conclusion from data and reason , not belief .""","""So theistic evolution is not a belief , not a faith at all ? It is simply a humanistic idea that is based on science , using God to fill gaps ?""",DISAGREE,"""Conclusion from data and reason""","""So theistic evolution is not a belief""",,
34999,9155,"""Conclusion from data and reason , not belief .""","""So theistic evolution is not a belief , not a faith at all ? It is simply a humanistic idea that is based on science , using God to fill gaps ?""",DISAGREE,"""Conclusion from data and reason , not belief .""","""So theistic evolution is not a belief , not a faith at all ? It is simply a humanistic idea that is based on science , using God to fill gaps ?""",,
35004,9156,"""Whose hands do they have ?""","""The civil rights violators claim they want to keep guns out of the wrong hands , when the truth of the matter is you and I `` have the wrong hands ``""",DISAGREE,"""Whose hands do they have ?""","""The civil rights violators claim they want to keep guns out of the wrong hands , when the truth of the matter is you and I `` have the wrong hands ``""",,
35014,9158,"""Something like beak size will following a bell curve .""","""Probably true .""",AGREE,"""Something like beak size will following a bell curve .""","""Probably true .""",,
35019,9159,"""Or , why ca n't it be a mix of both beliefs .""","""Because one is n't a belief .""",DISAGREE,"""why ca n't it be a mix of both beliefs .""","""is n't a belief .""",,
35025,9161,"""As for the topic of the thread , I will give my little idea .""","""Yes . Little .""",DISAGREE,"""As for the topic of the thread , I will give my little idea .""","""Yes . Little .""",,
35041,9171,"""How did such complexity explode upon the scene fully integrated into a living thing in that first split second of formation ? What random mechanism , what wild chance collision of atoms and molecules formed such a wondrous amazing blueprint ? Where is your evidence of that ? Where is your logic ? Your thousands of scientists working in labs around the world seeking to create life from scratch are wasting time and money .""","""I see patterns here . My girlfriend and I have been debating this subject a lot lately . When we first started debating , she did so in `` solid support of creationism `` ( yes Frog I did not write those words by accident ) . She said , and I quote , `` Evolution is bullsh * t `` . Last night , after two or three evenings of this stuff back and forth ( after I resoundingly bested her on every point , basically ) she affirmed that she does believe in evolution and has `` kind of `` always believed in evolution , but that she has many reservations and questions about it . The pattern ? '' Solid support of creationism turns into an admission that evolution is the truth , but with reservations. `` I find that pattern a little bit amusing . Last night , she had abandoned most of her philosophical objections because I made the concession that everyone has to make if they want to make any headway whatsoever with a budding evolutionist who ca n't let go of their religious objections : `` Okay , maybe it had God 's stamp of approval. `` When you say that , you can move on to a real conversation . In this case , she bombarded me with a million questions that I could n't answer . She seemed excited about it , not debating , but asking me about the wonders of biology with a long series of `` ... but what about this `` and `` ... what about that `` type of questions . One thing she keyed on was evolution as it applies to a larger ecosystem . I could n't quite grasp what she was asking because I do n't think she herself was very clear on the question , but to make a long story short , I got the distinct impression that she simply ca n't wholeheartedly accept evolution because she ca n't begin to fathom the complexity of the science behind it . I have told her time and time again : `` Just because you do n't understand something , that does n't make it wrong. `` I see this same pattern here in your words , Frog . You 're talking about wild collisions of atoms and saying that the foundations who donate hundreds of millions of dollars a year to research know less than you do , because they 're wasting their money . You 're making this subject so much bigger and more philosophical than it has to be , Frog . Is evolution by far the best answer we have to the question of the diversity of species ? The answer is yes , overwhelmingly so . Everything else is moot . It belongs elsewhere .""",DISAGREE,"""How did such complexity explode upon the scene fully integrated into a living thing in that first split second of formation ?""","""It belongs elsewhere .""",,
35042,9171,"""How did such complexity explode upon the scene fully integrated into a living thing in that first split second of formation ? What random mechanism , what wild chance collision of atoms and molecules formed such a wondrous amazing blueprint ? Where is your evidence of that ? Where is your logic ? Your thousands of scientists working in labs around the world seeking to create life from scratch are wasting time and money .""","""I see patterns here . My girlfriend and I have been debating this subject a lot lately . When we first started debating , she did so in `` solid support of creationism `` ( yes Frog I did not write those words by accident ) . She said , and I quote , `` Evolution is bullsh * t `` . Last night , after two or three evenings of this stuff back and forth ( after I resoundingly bested her on every point , basically ) she affirmed that she does believe in evolution and has `` kind of `` always believed in evolution , but that she has many reservations and questions about it . The pattern ? '' Solid support of creationism turns into an admission that evolution is the truth , but with reservations. `` I find that pattern a little bit amusing . Last night , she had abandoned most of her philosophical objections because I made the concession that everyone has to make if they want to make any headway whatsoever with a budding evolutionist who ca n't let go of their religious objections : `` Okay , maybe it had God 's stamp of approval. `` When you say that , you can move on to a real conversation . In this case , she bombarded me with a million questions that I could n't answer . She seemed excited about it , not debating , but asking me about the wonders of biology with a long series of `` ... but what about this `` and `` ... what about that `` type of questions . One thing she keyed on was evolution as it applies to a larger ecosystem . I could n't quite grasp what she was asking because I do n't think she herself was very clear on the question , but to make a long story short , I got the distinct impression that she simply ca n't wholeheartedly accept evolution because she ca n't begin to fathom the complexity of the science behind it . I have told her time and time again : `` Just because you do n't understand something , that does n't make it wrong. `` I see this same pattern here in your words , Frog . You 're talking about wild collisions of atoms and saying that the foundations who donate hundreds of millions of dollars a year to research know less than you do , because they 're wasting their money . You 're making this subject so much bigger and more philosophical than it has to be , Frog . Is evolution by far the best answer we have to the question of the diversity of species ? The answer is yes , overwhelmingly so . Everything else is moot . It belongs elsewhere .""",DISAGREE,"""Your thousands of scientists working in labs around the world seeking to create life from scratch are wasting time and money .""","""Just because you do n't understand something , that does n't make it""",,
35044,9171,"""How did such complexity explode upon the scene fully integrated into a living thing in that first split second of formation ? What random mechanism , what wild chance collision of atoms and molecules formed such a wondrous amazing blueprint ? Where is your evidence of that ? Where is your logic ? Your thousands of scientists working in labs around the world seeking to create life from scratch are wasting time and money .""","""I see patterns here . My girlfriend and I have been debating this subject a lot lately . When we first started debating , she did so in `` solid support of creationism `` ( yes Frog I did not write those words by accident ) . She said , and I quote , `` Evolution is bullsh * t `` . Last night , after two or three evenings of this stuff back and forth ( after I resoundingly bested her on every point , basically ) she affirmed that she does believe in evolution and has `` kind of `` always believed in evolution , but that she has many reservations and questions about it . The pattern ? '' Solid support of creationism turns into an admission that evolution is the truth , but with reservations. `` I find that pattern a little bit amusing . Last night , she had abandoned most of her philosophical objections because I made the concession that everyone has to make if they want to make any headway whatsoever with a budding evolutionist who ca n't let go of their religious objections : `` Okay , maybe it had God 's stamp of approval. `` When you say that , you can move on to a real conversation . In this case , she bombarded me with a million questions that I could n't answer . She seemed excited about it , not debating , but asking me about the wonders of biology with a long series of `` ... but what about this `` and `` ... what about that `` type of questions . One thing she keyed on was evolution as it applies to a larger ecosystem . I could n't quite grasp what she was asking because I do n't think she herself was very clear on the question , but to make a long story short , I got the distinct impression that she simply ca n't wholeheartedly accept evolution because she ca n't begin to fathom the complexity of the science behind it . I have told her time and time again : `` Just because you do n't understand something , that does n't make it wrong. `` I see this same pattern here in your words , Frog . You 're talking about wild collisions of atoms and saying that the foundations who donate hundreds of millions of dollars a year to research know less than you do , because they 're wasting their money . You 're making this subject so much bigger and more philosophical than it has to be , Frog . Is evolution by far the best answer we have to the question of the diversity of species ? The answer is yes , overwhelmingly so . Everything else is moot . It belongs elsewhere .""",DISAGREE,"""around the world seeking to create life from scratch are wasting time and money .""","""she had abandoned most of her philosophical objections""",,
35050,9172,"""I believe in adoption of the worlds children before reproduction .""","""So if you fall in love with your soul mate , you would have no problem adopting or be opposed to someone making you adopt instead of having your own children ?""",DISAGREE,"""I believe in adoption of the worlds children before reproduction .""","""So if you fall in love with your soul mate , you would have no problem adopting or be opposed""",,
35051,9172,"""I believe in adoption of the worlds children before reproduction .""","""So if you fall in love with your soul mate , you would have no problem adopting or be opposed to someone making you adopt instead of having your own children ?""",DISAGREE,"""I believe in adoption of the worlds children before reproduction .""","""So if you fall in love with your soul mate , you would have no problem adopting""",,
35063,9173,"""Barack Obama promised change . Then he took on one of Washington 's toughest issues : health care . During his first year in office , he found himself making one deal after another with Capitol Hill 's powerful insiders -- lobbyists and influential members of Congress . He angered his political base , watched his popularity sink , and nearly failed to pass the bill . In Obama 's Deal , FRONTLINE follows the story of the president 's historic victory and offers the first in-depth look at how the Obama administration operates . Veteran FRONTLINE producer Michael Kirk ( Bush 's War , Dreams of Obama , Inside the Meltdown ) provides a sobering view inside Obama 's deals and reveals the realities of American politics , the power of special interest groups , and the role of money in policy making . FRONTLINE : Coming Soon - Obama 's Deal | PBS""","""I am understanding the show will also cover how single payer advocates were not allowed a seat at the discussion table , and how , a year ago today , they were arrested at the Senate Finance Committee hearing for nevertheless speaking out in challenge to Max Baucus . This thread is for discussing the show , so if you do n't plan on seeing it , do n't bother saying something stupid , Archie . Steeve , you do n't even exist . Go back to cooking your daily books , for the health insurance ghouls you work for . It 's good that they 're expanding the safety net , but ultimately , this bill bringing 30 million new customers to the health insurance industry is not what we need . What we need is simple single payer legislation opening up Medicare to all Americans . Health care is a human right .""",DISAGREE,"""Barack Obama promised change . Then he took on one of Washington 's toughest issues : health care""","""I am understanding the show will also cover how single payer advocates""",,
35075,9174,"""'' HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & amp ; Record of Sales Act of 2009""","""H.R.45 - Blair Holt 's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009""",DISAGREE,"""HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & Record of Sales Act of 2009""","""H.R.45 - Blair Holt 's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009""",,
35081,9175,"""I read the essay . The only mention of a `` hair follicle `` came from you .""","""Actually no . You read the article again , and thoroughly this time .""",DISAGREE,"""I read the essay . The only mention of a `` hair follicle `` came from you .""","""Actually no . You read the article again , and thoroughly this time .""",,
35087,9175,"""I read the essay . The only mention of a `` hair follicle `` came from you .""","""Actually no . You read the article again , and thoroughly this time .""",DISAGREE,"""The only mention of a `` hair follicle `` came from you .""","""Actually no .""",,
35094,9176,"""Why would this be any of your business ? Do I ask you about the medical care you 've received ?""","""I know , you 're right . However , if you do n't want to do as Shady1 and share your sincere experience , tell me what you think the post-abortion trauma means in the grander scheme of things . Does its widespread existence tell us something about abortion as a practise ?""",DISAGREE,"""Why would this be any of your business ?""","""Does its widespread existence tell us something about abortion as a practise ?""",,
35109,9177,"""All of these reasons are way vague , some are outright ridiculous ( unless they are meant way ) .""","""Agreed , many of the reasons are ridiculous . But to some people , no restriction on gun ownership is unreasonable .""",AGREE,"""some are outright ridiculous""","""Agreed reasons are ridiculous""",,
35110,9177,"""All of these reasons are way vague , some are outright ridiculous ( unless they are meant way ) .""","""Agreed , many of the reasons are ridiculous . But to some people , no restriction on gun ownership is unreasonable .""",AGREE,"""reasons vague ridiculous""","""Agreed ridiculous But to some people no restriction on gun ownership is unreasonable""",,
35116,9178,"""The church is unfit to rule on abortion because it acts on what benefits them or they 're ideas . Like what I quoted , saying that `` Thou shalt not kill. `` Thousands of not millions of people are killed in wars . The Crusades is an example . It does not say `` Thou shalt not kill except when trying to claim territory or to land or if the person being killed disagrees with you religiously. `` It does n't say that . The church seems to decide when it will follow it 's rules , and when not . Yes , war is sometimes a neccessary method of self defense , but the many of the Crusades were not neccessary . Most of them were failures , but Christianity is still the second biggest religion in the world ( if not the first ) . The church ca n't be allowed to rule on abortion when they disregard their own laws . Like the above quote , why is the church trying to stop abortion when they would consider one to be alive after taking a breath . if you were to look at it from a scientific standpoint , the individual ovum and sperm are living cells , but they die all the time and no one cares . An embryo or fetus is something starting to develop into a human and that ca n't be stopped without killing it or injecting differnt DNA , but it 's still not too different from sperm and ovum . If you ca n't trust the church to make fair decisions and follow values and morals and rules they put in place , how can you expect an honest good decision about anything from it .""","""Cahuella , The Crusades ( for the most part ) were a justified reaction to Muslim aggression . If you would like to see a recent discussion of this then go to the `` Compromise `` thread on this forum and see what Simone and I discussed . As to the sperm and egg being a thing very similar to a fertilized egg .. I think that may be a bit of a simplification . As to the Church making fair decisions , I believe it does . That 's why it distinguishes an order of morality with degrees of goodness and badness . That 's why a war may be permissable but an abortion is not . Parcum , glad to see you back . I was wondering where you had gone .""",DISAGREE,"""The church is unfit to rule on abortion because it acts on what benefits them or they 're ``""","""Cahuella , The Crusades ( for the most part ) were a justified reaction to Muslim aggression . ``""",,
35134,9182,"""So , you consider a so called theory which allows a 10 billion year gap out of an alleged potential 10 to 20 billion year age for the occurrence to be the most credible theory ? And is actually supported by the evidence ? If they have any evidence , why the 10 billion year gap for wiggle room ? No wonder you accept evolution as a rational possibility .""","""Honest question Arch : where is the problem with a potential variance of 10 billion years ? I know this question may appear ridiculous to you but could you take the question in the spirit it was meant ?""",DISAGREE,"""theory allows a 10 billion year gap potential 10 to 20 billion year age for the occurrence to be the most credible theory ?""","""where is the problem with a potential variance of 10 billion years ?""",,
35147,9184,"""Are rights a useful framework at all ?""","""Yes . A proper understanding of rights is neccessary to know when you are aggressing against another person . Most children learn about rights intuitively through social interaction , a child take 's another child 's toy `` That 's mine `` , they say , they may fight over it , but they learn that when people lay contrary claims to things , violent conflict is the result . It is useful to refine this intuitive belief system into something consistent , both individually , and in shaping the law of a society . A society in which people work together through trade and friendship will always be more prosperous and safe than one in which rights are systematically ignored and violent conflict is the norm . It is not useful to talk about rights with people who treat them as subjective , based on value judgements , ie `` People have a right to life , because life is more valuable than being able to have an abortion `` , or `` People have a right to have an abortion , because being able to have an abortion is more important than a fetus `` . There is nothing to debate , we may as well go over whether strawberry or chocolate is a better flavour for a milkshake . In a free society we can disagree over what is `` more important `` and make our own choices , but if value judgements are used to determine law , the only possible outcome is the oppression of those with minority values . No argument can be made about value judgements , they do not convince anyone , they do not provide just solutions . Politically , to demand your values be enforced ( by virtue of your political power ) is to demand the rule of force rather than justice . There are only two choices : The rule of law , justice , a free society , built on the moral foundation of individual rights - or the rule of the majority , built on the arbitrary value judgements and preferences of those weilding power .""",AGREE,"""Are rights a useful framework at all ?""","""Yes .""",,
35155,9188,"""I 'm not surprised that no one on your side of the debate would correct you , but wolves and dogs are both members of the same species . The Canid species , specifically the Gray Wolf , or the Canis lupus which the domesticated dog is an extremely close relative of , differing from it by at most 0.2 % of mtDNA sequence .""","""EHHHHHHHHHHH ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! WRONG ! Wow , you 're even wrong when yoget away from your precious Bible and try to sound scientific . there is no such thing as the `` Canid species `` . You are so bloody wrong it is n't even funny . '' Canid `` ( or rather Canis ) referrs to the GENUS , the WORD FOLLOWING IT referrs to SPECIES . Perhaps you should head back to school and learn some simple biological classification/taxonomic ranking .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm not surprised that no one on your side of the debate would correct you ,""","""you 're even wrong""",,
35200,9201,"""If it is part of a woman it can not be a parasite .""","""If it meets the definition , it can""",DISAGREE,"""If it is part of a woman it can not be a parasite .""","""If it meets the definition , it can""",,
35205,9202,"""If they pass this bill , it 's strange , but I really do hope they pass it on Christmas Eve . It will show our Democratic Party up for the Grinches they truly are , in league with the Republicans . As they give a BIG BIG present to the health insurance industry .""","""Nonsense . The Republicans are all voting against this loser bill . And the Republicans did n't want the age 55 buy in because they knew is was going to be another budget buster and redistribution of wealth fiasco . The N.O.W . ( NAGS ) are a bunch of hypocrites anyway . You hardly ever see them stand up for women if it 's a conservative woman under attack . And they support the infanticide of the unborn under the guise of women 's health care , which is something only spiritually-dead imbeciles do . NOW deserves whatever they get .""",DISAGREE,"""It will show our Democratic Party up for the Grinches they truly are""","""And they support the infanticide of the unborn under the guise of women 's health care""",,
35206,9202,"""If they pass this bill , it 's strange , but I really do hope they pass it on Christmas Eve . It will show our Democratic Party up for the Grinches they truly are , in league with the Republicans . As they give a BIG BIG present to the health insurance industry .""","""Nonsense . The Republicans are all voting against this loser bill . And the Republicans did n't want the age 55 buy in because they knew is was going to be another budget buster and redistribution of wealth fiasco . The N.O.W . ( NAGS ) are a bunch of hypocrites anyway . You hardly ever see them stand up for women if it 's a conservative woman under attack . And they support the infanticide of the unborn under the guise of women 's health care , which is something only spiritually-dead imbeciles do . NOW deserves whatever they get .""",DISAGREE,"""If they pass this bill , it 's strange , but I really do hope they pass it on Christmas Eve . It will show our Democratic Party up for the Grinches they truly are , in league with the Republicans .""","""Nonsense . The Republicans are all voting against this loser bill . And the Republicans did n't want the age 55 buy in because they knew is was going to be another budget buster and redistribution of wealth""",,
35220,9205,"""Do pro abortion people support euthanasia as a reason for abortion ? Meaning for instance ... if after amniocentesis it is discovered that the child has down syndrome or if it is discovered the child will be born with no legs the previously hoping and willing parents decide to abort for this reason . Do pro abortion people support this ?""","""An abortion is an abortion . Your emotional use of the word `` euthanasia `` is pointless and irrelevant . Either you object to abortion or you do n't . Do n't play semantics with regard to disability in order to try to catch prochoicers out . It wo n't wash . I support elective abortion up to viability , and after viability health/life of mother and severe abnormality of fetus ( severe abnormality meaning those conditions that are recognised today as being so severe as to require a late term abortion ) . Do n't like it ? ... TOUGH ! And Phyllis ... its a good idea to let prochoicers answer posts for themselves rather than you imposing what you think are our opinions . If you continue to post prochoicers opinions for them , then you might as well just stand in the mirror and argue with yourself .""",DISAGREE,"""Do pro abortion people support euthanasia as a reason for abortion ? Meaning for instance ... if after amniocentesis it is discovered that the child has down syndrome or if it is discovered the child will be born with no legs the previously hoping and willing parents decide to abort for this reason . Do pro abortion people support this ?""","""An abortion is an abortion . Your emotional use of the word `` euthanasia `` is pointless and irrelevant . Either you object to abortion or you do n't . Do n't play semantics with regard to disability in order to try to catch prochoicers out . It wo n't wash . I support elective abortion up to viability , and after viability health/life of mother and severe abnormality of fetus (""",,
35235,9209,"""I personally think that abortion is wrong . I think that a fetus is still a baby . I do think that abortion can be okay but only if the mother 's life is in danger , otherwise they should live with it . They should have stayed away from the causes of pregnancy .""","""Preganancy should not be used as a punitive measure against women who are sexual . What you think is not reflective of the reality of women and their cicumstances that exist in the world . The reasons to abort are numerous and complicated . Some reasons are more valid than others . But you have no way of knowing that for millions of women , only they can really know . And although there are some youngsters in this forum who negate life experience , it is not to be negated . Ther is a lot to be said for `` walking in a mile in another 's shoes `` . Be careful about your desire to take the life circumstances of a stranger in your hands . Are you ready to be morally cuplable for the damage you could do ?""",DISAGREE,"""I personally think that abortion is wrong . I think that a fetus is still a baby . I do think that abortion can be okay but only if the mother 's life is in danger ,""","""Preganancy should not be used as a punitive measure against women who are sexual .""",,
35237,9210,"""So , in summation , your position is that the US should be more like the Europeans ? Should we also bathe less frequently ? Have poor dental hygeine ? Become an `` also ran `` economy ? No thanks . I have no desire to mimic Europe .""","""Yeah , let 's live in our own narcissistic bubble .""",DISAGREE,"""US should be more like the Europeans""","""own narcissistic bubble""",,
35239,9210,"""So , in summation , your position is that the US should be more like the Europeans ? Should we also bathe less frequently ? Have poor dental hygeine ? Become an `` also ran `` economy ? No thanks . I have no desire to mimic Europe .""","""Yeah , let 's live in our own narcissistic bubble .""",DISAGREE,"""So , in summation , your position is that the US should be more like the Europeans ?""","""Yeah""",,
35260,9217,"""If your body split and grew another body identical to you , then where was this other human all the time you were alive ? And would you stay in the same body or move into the other body while this other being inhabited the original body ? Are we in the twilight zone yet ?""","""Here ’ s a question ; which one split from the other ? Which one is the  “ new ” being ? None of them are . If I get a cake and slice into two exact pieces , which one is the  “ new ” slice ? They are both equally new .""",AGREE,"""split and grew another body identical to you , then where was this other human all the time you were alive""","""which one split from the other ? Which one is the  new being ? None of them are""",,
35265,9219,"""As a woman , I do n't want any MAN to be deciding for me what I can and ca n't do with my own body .""","""But you are ok with a woman deciding what is right for someone else 's own body ... specifically the babies ? Seems to me a woman is n't more qualified to deal with the issue of abortion than a man . In fact , it could be said that the man has the only independent perspective .""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't want any MAN to be deciding for me what I can and ca n't do with my own body .""","""Seems to me a woman is n't more qualified to deal with the issue of abortion than a man .""",,
35295,9225,"""claiming to be 'just like me ' detracts from that argument . claiming to be 'just like everyone else ' would work , and i 'll assume you meant something like that ( if you want to know why , read some of my other posts ) . this also goes against roughly 1/3rd of the philosiphies of the gay couples i know and commonly associate with- those philosiphies being 'hey ! sex is for pleasure , and if you 're trying to avoid having kids the best way is to * * * * the same sex as yourself ! '""","""Well , I would not make the claim that anyone is just like anyone else , but I would make the claim that gay people are just as likely to be good people as anyone else . Now , I would wager that I know far more gay people than you do . I wager this only because I am in a variety of gay rights organizations , as well as other gay-friendly organizations . I also have many gay friends outside of these organizations . I know of none being sexually promiscuous , though perhaps some are doing it behind my back . I know of many who do believe that sex is for pleasure , but an equal , if not greater percentage of heterosexuals who also believe sex should be used for pleasure . Further , I know a number of very promiscuous heterosexuals . Yet we let those heterosexuals marry . In truth , I see no reason not to . Lots of people of all sexual orientations believe that sex should be used for pleasure , not just children . This fact is a religious / moral belief , and it does not make these people bad parents , nor does it make these people bad people , nor does it make these people less in need of the benefits of marriage should they decide to start a family . If we are going to give marriage to some people , it is inexcusable to deny that marriage to others who are in equal need of it . If you would like others to respect your status as a husband ( or wife , or whatever you would prefer that I refer to you as ) , then you must be willing to respect the marriage of others in return .""",DISAGREE,"""claiming to be 'just like everyone else ' would work""","""I would not make the claim that anyone is just like anyone else ,""",,
35300,9226,"""No Electrolyte , science lies ! here is the undisputed truth : Noah and his three sons traveled the globe , collected two representatives of each species ( or seven of each clean species depending on the chapter ) . They crammed these critters in a sea worthy vessel made exclusively of gopher wood . The gopher wood was structurally sound enough to support the weight of said critters . The ark floated about like a cork for 40 days , etc whereupon the cargo was released to repopulate the world to present population levels . Meanwhile , there must have been provisions on the Ark for marine animals and fish as the rainwater would have undoubtedly altered the water pH and saline content . Also not mentioned is the fact that Noah and sons must have collected seeds from every PLANT on earth because I am personally not aware of many plant types that can survive completely submerged for 40 days . So you see , it is much harder to believe in a fossil record and sediment deposit stratigraphy , than in a giant boat crammed to the gills full of elephants , octopus , and cacti . I hope I cleared this up for everyone . We have found fossils , but they are all fake . We have not found an arkÂ….but it is realÂ… .""","""If you read this as if he is talking sarcastically it is quite funny . good argument against himself . What he is suggesting is hilarious ... just thinking about three ( or whatever ) amount of people collecting all the non-flood-live-able species in the world and putting them on a vessel is very immaginative and quite frankly impossible ... as I 've said before , get real .""",DISAGREE,"""science lies ! Noah and his three sons traveled the globe , collected two representatives of each species""","""If you read this as if he is talking sarcastically it is quite funny is hilarious ,""",,
35306,9236,"""You say that my moral code is a code that puts faith only in myself . That is not true . I very openly acknowledge that if I never had input from the outside - moral codes which were presented to me with the reasons behind them - then my moral code as determined solely by myself would have been meager indeed . I have had a wide range of influences which have helped determined my moral code :""","""You gave a list here . What is your reasoning for believing they are true ? Because it makes sense to you ? Well mine makes sense to me . Why is it that when I state mine comes from an outside source it is unreasoned but when yours is somewhat developed from outside sources it is not ? In the end , you have a moral code developed by you whether influenced by the outside or not . It therefore puts faith in yourself and lends itself to be compromised . I can even relate this to the accounting world We have something called segregation of duties . It basically is used so you have more accountability . In my case , I have a moral code outside of my control . I have to be accountable to that . In your case you are only accountable to yourself and thus it is fairly easy to change the moral code to suit some self desires . This is a bit of a tangent so lets move on The main point is , your code still works on some level of blind faith as you claim mine does . I freely admit mine is blind faith and I only wish others would admit to theirs as well . Just think of it as you ca n't prove anything you can only assume certain things and make calls based upon those very basic assumptions .""",DISAGREE,"""I have had a wide range of influences which have helped determined my moral code :""","""Just think of it as you ca n't prove anything you can only assume certain things and make calls based upon those very basic assumptions .""",,
35312,9239,"""You should also note that the one scenario I think the death penalty is acceptable for is if they try to escape using violence or if they attack another prisoner . This has shown that they are willing to commit acts of violence and frankly have nothing to lose .""","""So the initial murder was n't enough to show `` that they are willing to commit acts of violence `` ? This makes absolutely no sense .""",DISAGREE,"""the death penalty is acceptable for is if they try to escape using violence or if they attack another prisoner . they are willing to commit acts of violence""","""initial murder was n't enough to show `` that they are willing to commit acts of violence `` ?""",,
35335,9243,"""so why did ToE ignore horizontal gene transfer for so many decades ? Can you tell me how it is that gene transferred horizontally ( without going through selection ) validates darwinism , which says all beneficial traits must pass through selection in order to be adapted ?""","""Obviously , because we were actively suppressing it because it disproves evolution . That is what you want to think , right ? Decades ? When was it even discovered , dipsy doodle ? It was not recognized until 1984 . Since then , there have been 12,600 papers published on the subject , and that is just counting those with the exact phrase `` horizontal gene transfer `` in the title or text . Do you really consider that ignoring something ?""",DISAGREE,"""so why did ToE ignore horizontal gene transfer for so many decades ?""","""Do you really consider that ignoring something ?""",,
35349,9244,"""point me toward the right way then ? if creationists are wrong then why is evolution right ? this is a biased answer based on your beliefs . please tell us how creationists were wrong . i would gladly like to see you try !""","""It is very simple . Creationism is not a valid scientific theory . It can not be , and has never been , demonstrated that Creationism or ID are valid scientific theories . Therefore Creationism and ID should not be taught in science class . Evolution has been shown to be a valid scientific theory through research and experimentation over a century . It should be taught in science classes . That is the only issue . Should any idea , whether or not it is a valid scientific theory , be taught in a science class .""",DISAGREE,"""point me toward the right way then ? if creationists are wrong then why is evolution right ? this is a biased answer based on your""","""It is very simple . Creationism is not a valid scientific theory . It can not be , and has never been , demonstrated that Creationism or ID are valid scientific theories .""",,
35351,9244,"""point me toward the right way then ? if creationists are wrong then why is evolution right ? this is a biased answer based on your beliefs . please tell us how creationists were wrong . i would gladly like to see you try !""","""It is very simple . Creationism is not a valid scientific theory . It can not be , and has never been , demonstrated that Creationism or ID are valid scientific theories . Therefore Creationism and ID should not be taught in science class . Evolution has been shown to be a valid scientific theory through research and experimentation over a century . It should be taught in science classes . That is the only issue . Should any idea , whether or not it is a valid scientific theory , be taught in a science class .""",DISAGREE,"""point me toward the right way then ? if creationists are wrong then why is evolution right ?""","""It is very simple . Creationism is not a valid scientific theory .""",,
35360,9245,"""I oppose it because it is disgusting . Two men having a sexual relationship with each other is disgraceful , unmanly and perverted . I view it the same way you might view a man and a goat # # # # ing each other up the XXX and then calling that marriage .""","""So as a conservative ... you believe in having someone else decide for you what kind of sex you can have in the privacy of your home ? Wow , maybe I 'm not conservative after all . Some Jews think pork is disgusting ... would you support them banning you from eating pork ? I 'm not saying you ca n't think what you want about whatever you want ( I personally think drinking blood and eating dead flesh is creepy but would never attempt to enjoin a christian from doing so ) ... but you cross the line when you attempt to deny someone liberty when it does n't effect you .""",DISAGREE,"""I oppose it because it is disgusting . Two men having a sexual relationship""","""you believe in having someone else decide for you what kind of sex you""",,
35364,9246,"""I think we are talking about different things . A belief in adam and eve is not the same as being a good christian . The disbeleif in adam and eve can not DIRECTLY be used as a excuse to murder . Also did hitler talk about anything else other than keeping bloodlines pure ? Because these ideas to rely on the main theme of darwins origin of the species , in your quote you show how darwin states that eugenics is just an obvious consequence of the facts of animal husbandry .""","""A belief in Adam and Eve is a fundamental necessity to being a Christian at all . Jesus Christ believed in Adam and Eve , after all He created them . Gen 5:2 Male and female created he them ; and blessed them , and called their name Adam , in the day when they were created . [ Adam means man ] These arevthe words of Jesus Christ . You will notice He refers to the Old Testement as History . Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them , Have ye not read , that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female , Mat 19:5 And said , For this cause shall a man leave father and mother , and shall cleave to his wife : and they twain shall be one flesh ? Mat 19:6 Wherefore they are no more twain , but one flesh . What therefore God hath joined together , let not man put asunder . Mat 19:7 They say unto him , Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement , and to put her away ? Mat 19:8 He saith unto them , Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives : but from the beginning it was not so . Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word , and the Word was with God , and the Word was God . Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God . Joh 1:3 All things were made by him ; and without him was not any thing made that was made . Joh 1:4 In him was life ; and the life was the light of men . Joh 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness ; and the darkness comprehended it not . Joh 1:6 There was a man sent from God , whose name was John . Joh 1:7 The same came for a witness , to bear witness of the Light , that all men through him might believe . Joh 1:8 He was not that Light , but was sent to bear witness of that Light . Joh 1:9 That was the true Light , which lighteth every man that cometh into the world . Joh 1:10 He was in the world , and the world was made by him , and the world knew him not . Hitler said it was necessary to attack America because the best aryan stock had already moved here and would evolve into the master race .""",DISAGREE,"""The disbeleif in adam and eve can not DIRECTLY be used as a excuse to murder . Also did hitler talk about anything else other than keeping bloodlines pure ?""","""A belief in Adam and Eve is a fundamental necessity to being a Christian at all . Jesus Christ believed in Adam and Eve , after all He created them .""",,
35390,9251,"""This is obviously not talking about abortion . This is obviously not talking about abortion . This is obviously not talking about abortion . This is obviously not talking about abortion .""","""All these quotes from the bible are wher God has either killed children or sanctioned the killing of children and pregnant women . So to say that Giod does n't want abortion is strange when He has killed children by the thousands .""",DISAGREE,"""This is obviously not talking about abortion .""","""So to say that Giod does n't want abortion is strange when He has killed children by the thousands .""",,
35392,9252,"""Secondly tell me how you calculated the odds for your assertion that it would violate the statistical probablity ..... I 'll bet even money on you not being able to do so .""","""Well , you have me there . I did n't do a statistical analysis , but I 'm not a statistician either and could n't perform an analysis even if there was enough data . However , if such an occurrence were probable , you 'd think that scientists would have an easy time of producing the evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""tell me how you calculated the odds for your assertion that it would violate the statistical probablity""","""I did n't do a statistical analysis , but I 'm not a statistician either and could n't perform an analysis even if there was enough data""",,
35396,9253,"""The strata is another real problem for evolution ,""","""And we will get to that , but I 'd really like to keep this discussion on track . That 'll have to do for now , it 's 2:30am and I have work tomorrow .""",AGREE,"""The strata is another real problem for evolution ,""","""I 'd really like to keep this discussion on track""",,
35408,9257,"""28c . Clinic workers commonly prey on fear , pain , and confusion to manipulate women into getting abortions .""","""While 'commonly ' may or may not be true , this does end up happening at least some of the time ( and possibly a lot of the time ) . It 's highly doubtful that clinic workers do this with ill-intent ... for example , a woman enters a clinic because she 's confused and thinking about getting an abortion ... she wants to consider the option of abortion , though she 's not really comfortable with the idea . The clinic worker assures the woman that abortion is a painless procedure , and that lasting psychological effects rarely ( if ever ) occur . The clinic worker may ask the woman to think about how having a child would interfere with the woman 's life . I 'd encourage you to read the book `` Forbidden Grief `` by Theresa Burke . It is a fascinating look at real women who have had abortions , and the experiences they have gone through . Some of the women described in the book feel that they were manipulated by clinic workers into having an abortion . ( In reality , short of physical force , no one can 'force ' you to do something you do n't want to do , but things can be said and done to mislead a person -- intentionally or otherwise -- into thinking that 's what they want themselves . )""",DISAGREE,"""Clinic workers commonly prey on fear , pain , and confusion to manipulate women into getting abortions""","""While 'commonly ' may or may not be true , this does end up happening at least some of the time""",,
35422,9262,"""You mean the truth of thousands of young teen girls dead with a coat hanger in hand ? Abortion is a neccessity so that it can be regulated . People will have abortions legal or not legal . At least provide a safety net other than a coat hanger .""","""Well yes , that is a truth in this debate . I wonder if Vek would add vivid photgraphs of such tragic ends to his gallery ? After all , the position is called pro-life .""",AGREE,"""Abortion is a neccessity so that it can be regulated . People will have abortions legal or not legal .""","""that is a truth in this debate""",,
35428,9263,"""They sneer down at anyone like me who doesn ’ t agree with them . Instead of debating the facts , evolutionists will often resort to attacking the intelligence ( or lack of it ) in their opponent .""","""Actually , I do n't sneer at you . I laugh at you . And I do n't attack your intelligence but your knowledge . You are intentionally ignorant .""",DISAGREE,"""Instead of debating the facts , evolutionists will often resort to attacking the intelligence ( or lack of it ) in their opponent .""","""I do n't attack your intelligence but your knowledge . You are intentionally ignorant .""",,
35427,9263,"""They sneer down at anyone like me who doesn ’ t agree with them . Instead of debating the facts , evolutionists will often resort to attacking the intelligence ( or lack of it ) in their opponent .""","""Actually , I do n't sneer at you . I laugh at you . And I do n't attack your intelligence but your knowledge . You are intentionally ignorant .""",DISAGREE,"""They sneer down at anyone like me""","""Actually , I do n't sneer at you . I laugh at you""",,
35433,9264,"""`` Modern `` Atheists have only been around for a short time . In biblical times , Atheists were people who beleved in God ( s ) , but did n't believe He/they intervened with life on Earth . How and why do you think the terms have changed , and what are the similarities between tham ?""","""In older times man had more questions without answers than today . Some men believed if a God of fire because they did not understand what fire was . Because of their misunderstanding they invented an answer , the Fire God . Today we know exactly what fire is and we do n't need to invoke some mythical explanation . Today 's atheists know that there are many other questions we do n't have answers for and it 's OK to simply say we do n't know instead of buying into the whole `` let's-invent-some-god-to-explain-it `` mentality ....""",DISAGREE,"""Atheists have only been around for a short time . In biblical times , Atheists were people who beleved in God ( s ) , but did n't believe He/they intervened with life on Earth""","""Some men believed if a God of fire because they did not understand what fire was . Because of their misunderstanding they invented an answer , the Fire God .""",,
35436,9265,"""Life threatening condition that is always physically harmful `` ? What a giant load of steamy BS . Rarely is pregnancy physically harmful and even rarer is it life threatening . There are over 6 Billion people on this earth today . If motherhood was so damn dangerous , do n't you think the population would be a lot lower , even if it was just due to mothers keeling over after giving birth ? Where do you get this BS from , Planned Parenthood ?""","""They used to keel over regularly before modern medicine and my wife has been on medication for a thyroid condition ever since she delivered . '' During the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries , between 1 percent and 1.5 percent of all births ended in the mother 's death as a result of exhaustion , dehydration , infection , hemorrhage , or convulsions . Since the typical mother gave birth to between five and eight children , her lifetime chances of dying in childbirth ran as high as 1 in 8 . This meant that if a woman had eight female friends , it was likely that one might die in childbirth. ``""",DISAGREE,"""Rarely is pregnancy physically harmful and even rarer is it life threatening""","""'' the typical mother gave birth to between five and eight children , her lifetime chances of dying in childbirth ran as high as 1 in 8 ``""",,
35441,9266,"""No , I am not in the least saying that people born into poverty , or impoverished people , should be sent to a gas chamber .""","""Really , fetal persons are born . Science has demostrated that birth really occurs into the womb , not when one leaves it .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not in the least saying that people born into poverty , or impoverished people , should be sent to a gas chamber .""","""birth really occurs into the womb , not when one leaves it .""",,
35442,9266,"""No , I am not in the least saying that people born into poverty , or impoverished people , should be sent to a gas chamber .""","""Really , fetal persons are born . Science has demostrated that birth really occurs into the womb , not when one leaves it .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not in the least saying that people born into poverty , or impoverished people , should be sent to a gas chamber .""","""fetal persons are born . Science has demostrated that birth really occurs into the womb , not when one leaves it .""",,
35459,9270,"""And this is the case here . Language skills , in case you missed them must be learnt at a specific age - or you 've missed the boat . Cave-man may have come up with words for 'fire ' 'water ' and 'air ' etc , and teach these to his cave-kids , but he would have had to have been taught complex language skills as a child in order to pass these on to his cave-kids . The cases of the 'wild-children ' show that even with a normal brain and the best of scientific and social help , they ca n't acquire these skills in their own life time ... because they 've missed the boat .""","""So the simpler proto-languages had to be learned at an early age , too . So what ?""",DISAGREE,"""The cases of the 'wild-children ' show that even with a normal brain and the best of scientific and social help , they ca n't acquire these skills in their own life time ...""","""So what ?""",,
35471,9274,"""Bonus Question : We do n't know . We credit Homer for the silly reason that a blind guy telling epic stories makes for good imagery . The stories were likely oral traditions passed along and embellished repeatedly .""","""Why then is this not taught in history classes ? Why are we taught AS FACT that Homer wrote them ?""",DISAGREE,"""The stories were likely oral traditions passed along and embellished repeatedly .""","""Why are we taught AS FACT that Homer wrote them ?""",,
35489,9279,"""Why do women opt for abortion over adoption ?""","""When contraception failed in my monogamous long term relationship , I heavily researched both options , as well as parenting . I looked into requirements for Medicaid , WIC , and other subsidized assistance offered in my community . I called a few clinics around town . That 's an interesting story , but not for here . I had heart to heart talks to many different people with different viewpoints . I decided to have an abortion because I was sick all the time . I had diagnosed migraine headaches constantly , and my seizure disorder that had laid dormant for years returned . I could n't leave my house . I lost my job . I was in the middle of my education ( it was early summer ) and if I continued my pregnancy it would have put me back a semester , thus costing thousands of dollars . The father did not want me to continue the pregnancy because he was concerned about my physical health . Just thinking about that time period makes me nauseated . I understood the merits of adoption , especially since my father was adopted . I talked to my aunt about adoption and foster care , since she has participated in both . I also thought about parenting , the love and all the things I have to offer . I knew that the father would have supported my decision to parent , I knew that our financial hardships could be dealt with , and I knew that my education could be continued later . I came to the conclusion that abortion was the best choice for me and my health . I appreciate that some may find this decision selfish , and essentially it is , since it was made with my best interests in mind . I would also hope that even if they consider it selfish , they understand the reasons why I made that decision . And if it was your wife , daughter , friend , and she was dealing with what I was , you would not expect her to continue a pregnancy .""",AGREE,"""Why do women opt for abortion over adoption ?""","""abortion was the best choice for me and my health .""",,
35495,9280,"""You think most people would incorporate the golden rule ? I do n't think so -- I think most people are willing to make a buck off of others ( business ventures ) , land that job they want before someone else gets it , curse someone for cutting them off in traffic , get that parking spot before the guy coming around the corner gets it , or even get in an intentionally insulting dig to someone in a discussion forum such as this . The examples could go on and on ... I think a lot of people like to THINK they incorporate the golden rule , but at close , honest examination would find that they rarely do .""","""The golden rule is not just one sided . It does not expect us to do all giving and no taking . I have expectations of how others should treat me ( the taking part ) but , to be consistent , I should realize that they have expectations of me ( the giving part ) . Though people may want to win out in a job interview over someone more qualified , most do n't morally expect that that should happen since they realize that that expectation would not be fair . They may make a buck off of a person but , unless they are con artists who lie to get that buck , most will do it in a way they consider fair , under laws they themselves would be willing to live under . ( As a side note : Even most con artists might admit that , if they themselves were conned , then they would have deserved it for being suckers . ) The rule of treating others as we would want or expect to be treated does n't necessarily lead to a hugely generous society - just to one that seems to minimize suffering in a realistically achievable way .""",AGREE,"""You think most people would incorporate the golden rule ?""","""The golden rule is not just one sided . It does not expect us to do all giving and no taking .""",,
35504,9282,"""A lab in Washington State was able to mineralize wood in matter of days , not the millions of years scientist claim it takes to occur . ...""","""... I can get wood in seconds !""",AGREE,"""A lab in Washington State was able to mineralize wood in matter of days""","""I can get wood in seconds !""",,
35505,9283,"""So you do n't support Connecticut passing a civil union law ?""","""Why ca n't you answer questions directly ? anyway , I support ct in passing civil unions or marriage lite as I like to see it , but It does n't confer equality . If it is really equ8al than it would be marrige . Reason beinbg portablity ( irealize you think that some day we might have that , but we do n't so far and we can not ccontrol other countries who may have gay marriage but not cilvil unions and may not recognize civil unions but recognize marriage . ) If it is good for straight couples , it should be equally good for all couples. . No one is more superior . Everyone should be equal . Marriage for all is equals .""",DISAGREE,"""So you do n't support Connecticut passing a civil union law ?""","""anyway , I support ct in passing civil unions or marriage lite as I like to see it , but It does n't confer equality .""",,
35509,9284,"""If the Irish people had n't kept their arms and kicked you tyrannical control freaks out of their country , you people would have slaughtered them wholesale and Ireland would be part of your bloody empire . Thanks for proving my point .""","""Actually in terms of populations we ’ re the same people as the Irish . If you want tyranny try the oppression of the Native Americans . Did you know that the Natives and the blacks were both on the British side during the War of Independence ? Amazing how we tyrants command such free support huh ....""",DISAGREE,"""Ireland would be part of your bloody empire""","""Actually in terms of populations ’ re the same people as the Irish . we""",,
35535,9297,"""I can agree with legalizing Marijuana , but it is very similar to alcohol . Your reaction time is slowed down considerably . Before being legalized , there needs to be a test , similar to the BAC test . It should n't be illegal to smoke marijuana , but it should be the same as alcohol ; you ca n't smoke and drive .""","""But you can drink and drive , you just can not be intoxicated over a certain limit and drive . There is no test possible in the field ( like a breathylizer used for alcohol ) that would allow for testing of THC levels . It should be like anything else , if you are causing a problem or showing visible signs of impairment , you get detained and taken for further testing , which they can actually draw a THC level on you in a lab . And since you bring it up , marijuanna does not slow down reaction times near as much as alcohol . Alcohol is far more physically impairing than even high doses of THC .""",DISAGREE,"""I can agree with legalizing Marijuana , but it is very similar to alcohol .""","""But you can drink and drive , you just can not be intoxicated over a certain limit and drive Alcohol is far more physically impairing""",,
35548,9300,"""there is no one right answer to this debate and no one is in a position to say that their view is the only right view whle all other persons are wrong . if this was really the case , we would not be debating this today .""","""Would n't this be the same thing as two people deciding whether or not YOU should die and then telling you that your view is not meaningful ?""",DISAGREE,"""there is no one right answer to this debate and no one is in a position to say that their view is the only right view""","""YOU should die and then telling you that your view is not meaningful ?""",,
35560,9303,""" ‘ Plate tectonics is fallacious. ’ AiG believes that Dr John Baumgardner ’ s work on Catastrophic Plate Tectonics provides a good explanation of continental shifts and the Flood . See Q & amp ; A : Plate Tectonics . However , AiG recognises that some reputable creationist scientists disagree with plate tectonics .""","""Did these reputable creationists realize that we can measure continental drift ?""",DISAGREE,"""Dr John Baumgardner ’ s work on Catastrophic Plate Tectonics provides a good explanation of continental""","""these reputable creationists realize that we can measure continental drift ?""",,
35568,9306,"""( Besides , marc , why single out evolution ? Why are n't you for putting stickers on all science books labeling all of that satanic , methodological naturalistic study as highly suspect ? )""","""Because evolution is the main weapon that is used against traditional U.S. morals and customs .""",DISAGREE,"""why single out evolution ? Why are n't you for putting stickers on all science books labeling all of that satanic , methodological naturalistic study as highly suspect ?""","""Because evolution is the main weapon that is used against traditional U.S. morals and customs .""",,
35569,9306,"""( Besides , marc , why single out evolution ? Why are n't you for putting stickers on all science books labeling all of that satanic , methodological naturalistic study as highly suspect ? )""","""Because evolution is the main weapon that is used against traditional U.S. morals and customs .""",DISAGREE,"""stickers on all science books labeling all of that satanic""","""used against traditional U.S. morals""",,
35571,9307,"""My point was to show what I thought of pro-abortionist 's reasons for bringing up the arguement of independant survival for reasons other than being lame at debating . .""","""Well could you please explain it again , because I do n't understand what you were saying ? I do n't even understand the current comment . Thanks .""",DISAGREE,"""independant survival lame at debating""","""explain it again , I do n't understand""",,
35573,9308,"""While I do not appreciate your rude comments given that I began with none ,""","""But I have dealt with you before and you reap what you have sown . Suddenly I am to believe that you have changed ?""",DISAGREE,"""While I do not appreciate your rude comments given that I began with none""","""But I have dealt with you before and you reap what you have""",,
35601,9324,"""But Governor Palin does n't think so : http : //www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1 ... /97/640/631928""","""What typical leftist simone quality propaganda . What 's this victims name ? If she 's a real victim and willing to make an ad , why not give her name to personalize her message ? And are you actually suggesting that it 's ok to justify the killing of at least 1.3 million other babies per year because less than 1 % of the women who get abortions were raped ? HERE 'S the 1 % statistic . And Here 's searching beyond the myths . Rape , Incest and Abortion : Searching Beyond the Myths David C. Reardon , Ph.D. `` How can you deny an abortion to a twelve-year-old girl who is the victim of incest ? `` complains an indignant supporter of abortion . '' And how can you call yourself a loving Christian if you would force a victim of violent rape to give birth to a rapist 's child ? `` Every pro-lifer has heard these same challenges in one form or another . They are the emotionally charged questions designed to prove either 1 ) that pro-lifers are insensitive `` fetus lovers , `` 2 ) or ethically inconsistent , allowing abortion for some circumstances but not others . Unfortunately , most pro-lifers have difficulty answering these challenges because the issue of sexual assault pregnancies is so widely misunderstood . Typically , both sides of the debate accept the presumption that women with sexual assault pregnancies would want an abortion and that the abortion would in some way help them to recover from the assault . Thus , the pro-lifer is left in the uncomfortable position of arguing that the sanctity of life is more important than the needs of the sexual assault victim with whom everyone should rightly sympathize . But in fact , the welfare of the mother and child are never at odds , even in sexual assault cases . Both the mother and child are helped by preserving life , not by perpetuating violence . The reason most people reach the wrong conclusion about abortion in cases of rape and incest is that the actual experiences of sexual assault victims who became pregnant are routinely left out of the debate . Most people , including sexual assault victims who have never been pregnant , are therefore forming opinions based on prejudices and fears which are disconnected from reality . For example , it is commonly assumed that rape victims who become pregnant would naturally want abortions . But in the only major study of pregnant rape victims ever done , Dr. Sandra Mahkorn found that 75 to 85 percent chose against abortion.1 This evidence alone should cause people to pause and reflect on the presumption that abortion is wanted or even best for sexual assault victims . Several reasons are given for not aborting . First , approximately 70 percent of all women believe abortion is immoral , even though many also feel it should be a legal choice for others . Approximately the same percentage of pregnant rape victims believe abortion would be just another act of violence perpetrated against their bodies and their children . Second , some believe that their child 's life may have some intrinsic meaning or purpose which they do not yet understand . This child was brought into their lives by a horrible , repulsive act . But perhaps God , or fate , will use the child for some greater purpose . Good can come from evil . Third , victims of assault often become introspective . Their sense of the value of life and respect for others is heightened . They have been victimized , and the thought that they in turn might victimize their own innocent child through abortion is repulsive . Fourth , at least at a subconscious level , the victim may sense that if she can get through the pregnancy , she will have conquered the rape . By giving birth , she can reclaim some of her lost self-esteem . Giving birth , especially when conception was not desired , is a totally selfless act , a generous act , a display of courage , strength and honor . It is proof that she is better than the rapist . While he was selfish , she can be generous . While he was destroying , she can be nurturing . If giving birth builds self respect , what about abortion ? This is a question which most people fail to even consider . Instead , most people assume that an abortion will at least help a rape victim put the assault behind her and go on with her life . But in jumping to this conclusion , the public is adopting an unrealistic view of abortion . Abortion is not some magical surgery which turns back time to make a woman `` un-pregnant. `` Instead , it is a real life event which is always very stressful and often traumatic . Once we accept that abortion is itself an event with ramifications on a woman 's life , then we must carefully look at the special circumstances of the pregnant rape victim . Will an abortion truly console her , or will it only cause further injury to her already bruised psyche ? In answering this question , it is helpful to begin by noting that many women report that their abortions felt like a degrading and brutal form of medical rape.2 This association between abortion and rape is not hard to understand . Abortion involves a painful examination of a woman 's sexual organs by a masked stranger who is invading her body . Once she is on the operating table , she loses control over her body . If she protests and asks for the abortionist to stop , she will likely be ignored or told : `` It 's too late to change your mind . This is what you wanted . We have to finish now. `` And while she lies there tense and helpless , the life hidden within her is literally sucked out of her womb . The difference ? In a sexual rape , a woman is robbed of her purity ; in this medical rape she is robbed of her maternity . This experiential association between abortion and sexual assault is very strong for many women . It is especially strong for women who have a prior history of sexual assault , whether or not she is presently pregnant as the result of an assault.3 This is just one reason why women with a history of sexual assault are likely to experience greater distress during and after an abortion than other women . Second , research shows that after any abortion , it is common for women to experience guilt , depression , feelings of being `` dirty , `` resentment of men , and lowered self-esteem . What is most significant is that these feelings are identical to what women typically feel after rape . Abortion , then , only adds to and accentuates the traumatic feelings associated with sexual assault . Rather than easing the psychological burdens of the sexual assault victim , abortion adds to them . This was the experience of Jackie Bakker , who reports : `` I soon discovered that the aftermath of my abortion continued a long time after the memory of my rape had faded . I felt empty and horrible . Nobody told me about the pain I would feel deep within causing nightmares and deep depressions . They had all told me that after the abortion I could continue my life as if nothing had happened. `` Those encouraging abortion often do so because they are uncomfortable dealing with rape victims , or perhaps out of prejudice against victims whom they see as being `` guilty for letting it happen. `` Wiping out the pregnancy is a way of hiding the problem . It is a `` quick and easy `` way to avoid dealing with the woman 's true emotional , social and financial needs . According to Kathleen DeZeeuw , `` I , having lived through rape , and also having raised a child 'conceived in rape , ' feel personally assaulted and insulted every time I hear that abortion should be legal because of rape and incest . I feel that we 're being used by pro-abortionists to further the abortion issue , even though we 've not been asked to tell our side. `` The case against abortion of incest pregnancies is even stronger . Studies show that incest victims rarely ever voluntarily agree to an abortion.4 Instead of viewing the pregnancy as unwanted , the incest victim is more likely to see the pregnancy as a way out of the incestuous relationship because the birth of her child will expose the sexual activity . She is also likely to see in her pregnancy the hope of bearing a child with whom she can establish a true loving relationship , one far different than the exploitive relationship in which she has been trapped . But while the incest victim may treasure her pregnancy because it offers her hope of release , and the hope of finding a nurturing love , her pregnancy is a threat to the exploiter . It is also a threat to the pathological secrecy which may envelop other members of the family who are afraid to acknowledge that the abuse is occurring . Because of this dual threat , the victim may be coerced into an unwanted abortion by both the abuser and other family members . For example , Edith Young , a 12-year-old victim of incest impregnated by her stepfather , writes twenty-five years after the abortion of her child : `` Throughout the years I have been depressed , suicidal , furious , outraged , lonely , and have felt a sense of loss ... The abortion which was to 'be in my best interest ' just has not been . As far as I can tell , it only 'saved their reputations , ' 'solved their problems , ' and 'allowed their lives to go merrily on. ' ... My daughter , how I miss her so . I miss her regardless of the reason for her conception. `` Abortion providers who ignore this evidence , and neglect to interview minors presented for abortion for signs of coercion or incest , are actually contributing to the young girl 's victimization . They are not only robbing the victim of her child , they are concealing a crime , abetting a perpetrator , and handing the victim back to her abuser so that the exploitation can continue . Finally , we must recognize that the children conceived through sexual assault also have a voice which deserves to be heard . Julie Makimaa , conceived by an act of rape , works diligently against the perception that abortion is acceptable or even necessary in cases of sexual assault . While sympathetic to the suffering her mother endured at the hands of her attacker , Julie is also rightfully proud of her mother 's courage and generosity . Regarding her own view of her origin , Julie proclaims : `` It does n't matter how I began . What matters is who I will become. `` That 's a slogan we can all live with .""",DISAGREE,"""But Governor Palin does n't think so :""","""If she 's a real victim and willing to make an ad , why not give her name to personalize her message ?""",,
35610,9333,"""I ca n't name specifics any more than a Darwinist of 100 years ago could name the specifics of microevolution and genetics that we know today . But I can name one thing in general - it has the potential to mathematically ( and otherwise ) challenge positive , self serving statements by evolutionists that presuppose that there is no God . Science has been , and always will be , politicized .""","""Again , so does the `` theory `` of the flying spaghetti monster . Please explain how ID should be taught as a valid alternative to evolution but not the flyinig spaghetti monster `` theory `` .""",DISAGREE,"""I ca n't name specifics any more than a Darwinist of 100 years ago could name the specifics of microevolution and genetics that we know today""","""Please explain how ID should be taught as a valid alternative to evolution but not the flyinig spaghetti monster `` theory""",,
35620,9335,"""And ? Ignoring your absurd claim that an embryo can choose its location , why does it matter . There is nobody living inside of the baby , it is not mentally existing . It would be the equivalent of chopping someone 's head off and calling the body a person .""","""Speaking of chopping heads off ... what would you say if the mother of this child , having delivered it at 22 weeks , decided she did not want to care for it anymore ( or was really mad at it for coming so early ) , and therefore she wanted to chop its head off . What would you say of this scenario , considering that a fetus/child at 22 weeks does not possess the magic trump card of `` mental existence `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""And ? Ignoring your absurd claim that an embryo can choose its location , why does it matter .""","""What would you say of this scenario , considering that a fetus/child at 22 weeks does not possess ``""",,
35623,9336,"""My posts are not meant to project smugness . All I 'd like to say is that systems operate , other than your own ; It is possible to be a democracy without everyone carrying around a 9mm . That is why I also give examples of other countries such as Great Britain and New Zealand ( both of whom have a general police force that is itself unarmed ) . I say this because the was an argument put forward to suggest that without a heavily armed citizenry , the people could be oppressed . So , rather than deal with a hypothetical - what if this happened in the USA , I thought I 'd look to where there are actual cases of democracies with unarmed citizens . There are differing degrees of gun control . Canada has a fair few guns ... but I do n't believe it 's a 'constitutional ' issue . However , the large amount of small arms in the USA must have something to do with the large amount of deaths by small-arms""","""Well were are fine thank you very much . If we did it any other way then we would not be Americans . The UK police are not unarmed . Just as the government takes civilian guns away . They were giving them to cops : http : //www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Ar ... 099970,00.html They are carrying full auto machine guns on patrol . Even US cops on patrol do not carry machine guns . '' On Monday in Brixton , south London , 28-year old Derek Bennett was shot six times by an officer who thought he was armed. `` http : //www.wsws.org/articles/2001/ju ... shot-j23.shtml Do n't trust the cops to be in your best interest . Authority is authority . Authority is not in the business of charity , nurture , or progressiveness . Authority is about control . At all levels , from the PIG cop giving tickets for kicks , to tyranical rape and murder ; authority is about control . Ask any cop from any country . They will tell you , when they put on a uniform , something `` magical `` happens . It is the semblance and air of AUTHORITY . Do you really think politicians enter politics for `` public good `` . They all want the office , they want the bearing of the office , they want PRIVILEDGES of office . If they want to be about charity and public good , they why are n't they working for charities ? Why are n't they working in labs to cure cancer ? Why are n't they in soup kitchens ? Why are n't they clegry ? Because none of those idealist efforts offer the priviledges , bearing , and authority of office . Come on , you know they want it . No matter what country your from or what political system , you know they want it . Firearms are not a necessary requirement for freedom . They are a necessary requirement for fighting oppression . I am quite happy to have my politicians and elected represenatives fear me . They are my servants . When people in power do not fear citizens , then people in power have a writ to try anything . Soviets had a meaningless Constitution . Every oppressed industrial government in modern times had a government that had no fear of represials from citizens .""",DISAGREE,"""All I 'd like to say is that systems operate , other than your own ; It is possible to be a democracy without everyone carrying around a 9mm .""",""" No matter what country your from or what political system , you know they want it . Firearms are not a necessary requirement for freedom . They are a necessary requirement for fighting oppression .""",,
35631,9337,"""Your personal safety is your own responsibility . There is no community responsibility owed to you .""","""Then why do the police and the FBI exist ? How about neighborhood watch programs ? According to your logic these programs and organizations should all be abolished . Safety is a personal as well as a community responsibility .""",DISAGREE,"""Your personal safety is your own responsibility .""","""Then why do the police and the FBI exist ?""",,
35645,9340,"""If in truth , you do see the possibilty of arms being needed to overthrow a despotic government , then surely you must see the need to NOT usurp the rights of good and honest men , but to only infringe on those that break the law . Civil discourse and unrest , is in and of itself , not necessarily bad . Criminal misuse of that freedom , as with all freedoms is .""","""Well , criminals are per definition those who break the law and the law is what you make of it . If private fire arms where illegal , those who would carry a firearm without proper license or permision would be considered criminals . Civil unrest , when turning into violence , is often something bad ...""",DISAGREE,"""Criminal misuse of that freedom , as with all freedoms is""","""criminals are per definition those who break the law and the law is what you make of it""",,
35655,9342,"""Shotguns are used for hunting .""","""so are handguns .""",AGREE,"""Shotguns are used for hunting .""","""so are handguns .""",,
35661,9343,"""You can conclude that the odds of happenstance origins are more remote than previously thought . Ruling something out , or considering it less likely by using numbers is a very scientific and logical thing to do .""","""Again , I do n't know what happenstance origins are , but ruling something out because it 's unlikely does n't work . I have made the poker analogy very often . If you are dealt in order , the 3 of spades , then the 5 of hearts , then the 9 of clubs , then the 4 of diamonds , then the 6 of hearts , would you decide immediately that it was not true ? The odds are ( 1/52 ) * ( 1/51 ) * ( 1/50 ) * ( 1/49 ) * ( 1/48 ) = 1/311,875,200 . This could be done for multiple games . The odds get slimmer and slimmer , but the difference is that something had to happen . No matter what cards you got , the odds of you getting the same card in that order would be this slim .""",DISAGREE,"""Ruling something out , or considering it less likely by using numbers is a very scientific and logical thing to do .""","""If you are dealt in order , the 3 of spades , then the 5 of hearts , then the 9 of clubs , then the 4 of diamonds""",,
35665,9344,"""that 's right , i do n't want ANOTHER parental figure to tell me what to do , when to do it , and how to do it .""","""Of course you do n't . It 's the natural humanistic way of thinking .""",DISAGREE,"""that 's right , i do n't want ANOTHER parental figure to tell me what to do""","""Of course you do n't . It 's the natural humanistic way of thinking .""",,
35671,9345,"""In my humble opinion ..... because there are none ! You could do a much more compelling speech as to why not have guns ... especially if small children are invovled ... especially when guns are so incredibly easy to get ..... ask your local postman !""","""Well such a compelling speech ( cough cough ) but this whole small children being involed is irrellivent , since it is the parents moral responsibility to `` lock all guns and ammo in sperate safes or cabinats `` qouting the gun and hunter safety quizes . That and I would also like to make a clear statement on my childhood , I have been around guns well since I was born ... Yet I do n't have an extra breathing hole in my head either , so it aint the guns its the parents who do n't teach there kids proper gun safety and to NEVER PLAY WITH GUNS ! qouting the NRA saftey tips .""",DISAGREE,"""You could do a much more compelling speech as to why not have guns ... especially if small children are invovled""","""this whole small children being involed is irrellivent""",,
35676,9346,"""What is that Pesky word in the Constitution & # 8217 ; s Bill of Rights again ? Oh Yeah , now I remember . Due Process ! So the writers of this bill chooses not only to deny one , of their 2nd Amendment right , but also their 14th Amendment right as well .""","""Actually , the Second Amendment does n't say anything about due process . It does not say that people on a terror watch list can not be prohibited from buying weapons , but the right can be infringed with due process of law . In fact , the Second Amendment says nothing about the circumstances under which it can be infringed . One scholar comments on the implications of this for the individual rights interpretation : `` If read as an individual right , criminals , convicted felons , pirates , or revolutionaries could all be armed in the District of Columbia or in the federal territories . Pirates could load up their ships on the Potomac River and sail out to sea . Hunters could trample through Yellowstone or some other national park , guns in hand . [ 185 ] Anyone might board a plane , gun in hand , or carry a weapon into Congress , the White House , or any other federal building ... The Fifth Amendment allows the taking of liberty under some circumstances , while the Second , if read as an individual right , does not. `` Chicago-Kent Law Review 18th Century Pennsylvania , which had its own RKBA , passed a law which required citizens to take an oath of allegiance to the state or face being disarmed . This was to protect the state against those who might be loyal to the British Crown . So why ca n't the US take similar measures to protect itself against terrorists ?""",DISAGREE,"""Due Process ! So the writers of this bill chooses not only to deny one""","""Pirates could load up their ships on the Potomac River and sail out to sea .""",,
35690,9347,"""If all life evolved from a common ancestor , then there should be countless instances of new body parts evolving . Body parts such as eyes , muscle , bone , etc . We have not seen one instance of a new body part evolving in a population in which it has not existed previously . Evolutionists will wave the magic `` time wand `` and simply claim that such a change could never be observed in a few decades . What about fruit flies ? One generation of fruit flies = around a day . Fruit flies were exposed to x rays to speed up mutation rates , we have observed the equivalent of millions of years ( in terms of human generations ) of super-accelerated mutation and .... no new body parts . Evolutionists will also list in steps how a new body part can arise . This is only plausible if each of those steps could be directly observed . If not , then it is nothing more than science fiction . Evolutionists have been searching for any direct evidence of the theory of evolution since the 1800 's . They are still looking .""","""in defense of the fruit fly , why would one evolve when one is already suited well to their environment ? what good does a 7th leg do ? and about the experiment itself - please , ALWAYS post references . who did the experiment ? when ? under what conditions ? how ? assuming you were correct about the experiment , were variables put in place such as habitat changes to reflect the timeline you speak of , a large variety of fruit flies to begin with , random mating , etc etc or did some people just shoot some x rays at a couple fruit flies , did some arithmetic which was probably wrong and called it that ? and im sorry , but there is mountains of direct evidence for evolution , you just need to go and look at it .""",DISAGREE,"""If all life evolved from a common ancestor , then there should be countless instances of new body parts evolving""","""why would one evolve when one is already suited well to their environment ?""",,
35695,9348,"""The publicity does not matter .""","""In this case I 'm afraid it does . ( 1 ) To see if the OJ scene would once again playout . ( 2 ) To see a ruling made on behalf of an unborn child . All the rest is one dumb killer , IMO .""",DISAGREE,"""The publicity does not matter .""","""In this case I 'm afraid it does .""",,
35708,9350,"""Other than for propaganda purposes , why do you and your playmates post this stuff ? Who is it aimed at ? Do you really expect to be changing anyones mind , or is it preaching to the converted ?""","""Actually I did not know what Nato had posted . I found it quite interesting . I know that when I and my wife attended church , I thought about that possibility . Someone who Hates us just because we go to church , and I thought about bringing the problem up . I quickly dismissed the probability of something like this happening because right across the street , is the Fairview Police Station . However , this is exactly where things like this do happen . In places where one is not allowed to carry a concealed firearm .""",DISAGREE,"""Other than for propaganda purposes , why do you and your playmates post this stuff ? Who is it aimed at ?""","""Actually I did not know what Nato had posted . I found it quite interesting . I know that when I and my wife attended church , I thought about that possibility""",,
35713,9350,"""Other than for propaganda purposes , why do you and your playmates post this stuff ? Who is it aimed at ? Do you really expect to be changing anyones mind , or is it preaching to the converted ?""","""Actually I did not know what Nato had posted . I found it quite interesting . I know that when I and my wife attended church , I thought about that possibility . Someone who Hates us just because we go to church , and I thought about bringing the problem up . I quickly dismissed the probability of something like this happening because right across the street , is the Fairview Police Station . However , this is exactly where things like this do happen . In places where one is not allowed to carry a concealed firearm .""",DISAGREE,"""why do you and your playmates post this stuff ?""","""I did not know what Nato had posted . I found it quite interesting .""",,
35720,9351,"""But genetics has nothing to do with it .""","""So you are saying that genetics has nothing to do with genetics ?""",DISAGREE,"""But genetics has nothing to do with it""","""So you are saying that genetics has nothing to do with genetics ?""",,
35725,9351,"""But genetics has nothing to do with it .""","""So you are saying that genetics has nothing to do with genetics ?""",DISAGREE,"""genetics has nothing to do with it .""","""you are saying that genetics has nothing to do with genetics ?""",,
35734,9352,"""somehow you alone know the truth about God""","""Actually no , I know of many others who agree with this and the number of people believing in religion worldwide is decreasing , but just to make this interesting , why do n't you prove you are right . Show me one place where I said exactly what God was . Go ahead hot shot I 'd like to see it . LOL""",DISAGREE,"""about God""","""worldwide decreasing LOL""",,
35736,9353,"""Haha . How did I know that you were going to say that ?""","""But he is right : Ray offered yet more evidence that he is at least as stupid as HUnter and you totally failed to refute that evidence . What 's the current odds BTW that both Hunter and Ray will fail to address Pandion 's evidence that Hitler was YEC ?""",DISAGREE,"""Haha . How did I know that you were going to say that ?""","""Ray offered yet more evidence that he is at least as stupid as HUnter and you totally failed to refute that evidence .""",,
35738,9353,"""Haha . How did I know that you were going to say that ?""","""But he is right : Ray offered yet more evidence that he is at least as stupid as HUnter and you totally failed to refute that evidence . What 's the current odds BTW that both Hunter and Ray will fail to address Pandion 's evidence that Hitler was YEC ?""",DISAGREE,"""How did I know that you were going to say that ?""","""Ray offered yet more evidence that he is at least as stupid as HUnter and you totally failed to refute that evidence""",,
35752,9357,"""Wow , I hope I 'm not the only person who went directly to your source to check it out . Lets review several points here :""","""lol , you know what , I think you were !""",DISAGREE,"""Wow , I hope I 'm not the only person who went directly to your source to check it out .""","""lol , you know what , I think you were !""",,
35761,9359,"""Lovely . I guess there are n't any children at all outside of the United States .""","""Well abortion is a law thing and for the most part it seems like he was getting after the US ( as he has done in other posts ) ... nevertheless , starving children are around even with abortion and there is no reason to believe abortion has `` helped `` this problem .""",DISAGREE,"""I guess there are n't any children at all outside of the United States .""","""Well abortion is a law thing and for the most part it seems like he was getting after the US""",,
35764,9360,"""I think we should not only allow GAYs to have legal marriage rights but also those who want to practice insist as well as all who want to practice polygamy . Let us not stop there let us sanction union between human and animals . After all I love my Dog and my Parrot . Why stop with GAYs ? By the way where does the term GAY come from for homosexuals .""","""Oh my . Where to begin . First of all , being homosexual has abso-f'n-lutely nothing to do with beastiality . I get so tired of that correlation . Homosexuals are humans that have sex with the humans of the same sex . Nothing to do with animals . Next time you eat a hamburger , let 's arrest you for accessory to murder , after all , killing a cow is just as illegal as killing humans , at least according to your logic . As for the word `` gay `` , it started as an insult towards the homosexual community . Similarly to `` nigger `` , it was adopted by the very people it insulted to take some of the power out of the word . Now , with that said , I do NOT belittle the racist struggle by making that comparison . I know that the African-Americans have struggled thru much more than the homosexual community . I do n't make the comparison according to scale , but to the logic of it .""",DISAGREE,"""I think we should not only allow GAYs to have legal marriage rights Let us not stop there let us sanction union between human and animals .""","""being homosexual has abso-f'n-lutely nothing to do with beastiality .""",,
35765,9361,"""But let 's look at 9-13 year-old Turnkana boy -- one of the most famous homo erectus fossils , which is supposed to be one of the oldest humans fossils . ( link removed ) Upon just a quick glance you can tell this person is simply a human being .""","""Actually , when I opened this picture it appeared to be approximately 6 inches tall . Upon just a quick glance , I determined that this was the skeletal remains of an ancient smurf . My God man ! You have just confirmed the existence of Papasmurfidae ! I would n't pontificate on the nature of the scriptures based upon a quick glance any more than I would attempt to determine the origin of the species by glossing through Ask Jeeves . I can tell you however that jacob begetting enoch and enoch begetting Ralph , etc etc etc , does not approach the current acceptable age of the earth Sir . Even if you allow for Methuselah to live 900 years . Describe the shape of your skull sir . Perhaps a break through awaits . As for my own skull , it is deforming with each successive post from repeated blows to the forehead by my open palm . If the lack of complete records has you befuddled , consider my own curiousity at the utter dearth of evidence for a planet of an age described in the bible . Evolutionists may not have all of the puzzle pieces in place , but one can determine what the picture looks like . I ca n't think of one piece that would support the view to which you subscribe .""",DISAGREE,"""let 's look at 9-13 year-old Turnkana boy -- one of the most famous homo erectus fossils""","""You have just confirmed the existence of Papasmurfidae ! I ca n't think of one piece that would support the view to which you subscribe .""",,
35772,9364,"""This is a statement written by someone who obviously has not read scripture . One of the most astonising `` proofs `` if you will , that the Bible is of supernatural origin , is predictive prophecy . Science can not , as you claim , `` explain `` everything , and it has no natural explanation for the predictions made in scripture . How can science explain through statistical probablity the over 600 prophecies in Biblical writings that have come to pass ? Also , how can it explain how supposedly uneducated people ( uneducated in the ways of modern science ) wrote about astronomy as if they knew about the universe as we do today . How could they have described the hydrological cycle as we have only come to know it recently ? Ecclesiastes 1:6 The wind goes toward the south , And turns around to the north ; The wind whirls about continually , And comes again on its circuit . How did they know that the earth `` hangs on nothing `` when the accepted norm of the day did not even accept that possibility ? Job 26:7 He stretches out the north over empty space ; He hangs the earth on nothing . How did they know that the `` vapors `` of the earth rise to create moisture , that is seeded by lightning with nitrogen and then falls as rain to fertilze the soil ? Jeremiah 10:13 When He utters His voice , There is a multitude of waters in the heavens :  “ And He causes the vapors to ascend from the ends of the earth . He makes lightning for the rain , He brings the wind out of His treasuries. ” Hydrothermal vents [ 4 ] are described in two books of the Bible written before 1400BC—more than 3,000 years before their discovery by science . Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah ’ s life , in the second month , the seventeenth day of the month , on that day all the fountains of the great deep were broken up , and the windows of heaven were opened . Even though the Bible is not a scientific text book and does n't purport to be , nowhere is it scientifically inaccurate . In addition , many of the scientific ideas you are so impressed with are nothing new to the Bible . It was speaking of these things long before modern science spoke of them . The story goes `` They ( scientists ) are slowly working their way to the mountain 's peak painstakingly measuring and analyzing every step that they take . After many years of research , they finally arrive at the top of the mountain , scale over its leading edge , only to find a group of theologians sitting there with the answers all along. ``""","""Once one is adept at finding evidence after a conclusion is presumed , all sorts of `` proofs `` reveal themselves . What 's next , Nostradamus ?""",DISAGREE,"""Science can not , as you claim , `` explain `` everything , and it has no natural explanation for the predictions made in scripture .""","""Once one is adept at finding evidence after a conclusion is presumed , all sorts of `` proofs `` reveal themselves""",,
35775,9366,"""When I was an atheist , I was quite unconvinced by rational arguments for the existence of God . Now that I am a Christian , I am quite unconvinced by rational arguments for the existence of God . B""","""Well , we 're not devoid of emotion . So you can know God through your whole self , not just a small part of you ( i.e . logic ) . We Orthodox believe in noetic knowledge , that is , knowledge gained through 'the heart ' .""",DISAGREE,"""When I was an atheist , I was quite unconvinced by rational arguments for the existence of God am a Christian , I am quite unconvinced""","""So you can know God through your whole self , not just a small part of you ( i.e . logic ) .""",,
35779,9367,"""How are they going to pay for this ? Oregon hardly has the money to properly fund its school systems much less pay for a universal healthcare system .""","""I do n't know anyone on the committees , but people I know who have taken a look at the initial proposal and understand the current Oregon public health program ( manages Medicaid and other fed/state health funds ) say it 's financially feasible by the proposal to combine current private policy subscriptions ( including civil service at all levels other than federal ) and fed/state/muni contributions . I 'm told the key will be deductibles and how they scale them . Oregon 's schools ( excluding rural designations ) would have plenty of money if educator unions did n't have funding in a stranglehold . Word is that unless benefits and retirement now equaling private sector CEO levels are n't cut back the system will crash within the next decade . Off-topic , but civil service pay and benefits are an upcoming US crisis . Unions have switched from ruining manufacturing industries to the public sector . The county I live in already has a dual work force , union and non-union , with union workers to eventually disappear by attrition . Maybe sooner when looking at budget forecasting .""",DISAGREE,"""Oregon hardly has the money to properly fund its school systems much less pay for a universal healthcare system .""","""people I know who have taken a look at the initial proposal and understand the current Oregon public health program ( manages Medicaid and other fed/state health funds ) say it 's financially feasible""",,
35781,9368,"""The pro-life argument quite plainly revolves around the premise that fetuses are human beings , and therefore have a right to life . However , many ( if not all ) pro-lifers say that they will allow abortions in the `` extreme cases `` of rape or incest . Now , what does that imply ? Rape/incest fetuses are n't human beings , while others are ? Pro-lifers say that they do n't want the government picking and choosing who has the right to life and who does n't , but this sounds like picking and choosing to me . I think this inconsistency effectively nullifies the pro-life argument . Of course , to get rid of the inconsistency , the pro-lifers can bring rape and incest babies into the sphere of protected beings . The result - a horribly unreasonable position I ca n't suport .""","""Many people would allow abortions in extreme cases because they figure that since extreme cases make up about 5 % of abortions then if they can get all but extreme cases then they will be saving at least 95 % , which is better than nothing . After that they can work towards stopping all abortions . It 's a step-by-step process . I say abortion of all kinds should be illegal . 95 % of abortions are a result of consentual sex . We should n't cater to the 5 % just because they 've had a tough situation . I sympathize with them and would do what I could to help them , but they do still need to have the baby , whether they give it up for adoption or not . This is n't a horribly unreasonable position . It 's just a difficult position . Saying it 's alright to kill a baby for any reason is a horribly unreasonable position . People need to face the facts too . Sex is n't there for pleasure , it 's there for procreation and happens to be pleasureable . Someone who indulges in this pleasure should be ready to deal with the outcome , which oftentimes is a baby .""",AGREE,"""pro-life argument quite plainly revolves around the premise that fetuses are human beings pro-lifers say that they will allow abortions in the `` extreme cases `` of rape or""","""I say abortion of all kinds should be illegal .""",,
35793,9371,"""Basically what Sigma said . The devil is always in the details and the Child Custody Protection Act seems to assume that all parents are good parents when unfortunately there are plently of * * * * -poor parents out there . It fallaciously assumes homogeneity in the use of parental authority . The problem is letting the good parents get on with raising their children while preventing the bad parents from further screwing up their childrens ' lives . Protecting both parental authority for those capable of handling it and the children who may be victims of its abuse is not something that the CCPA seems to do well enough .""","""And there you have hit the nail on the head ; there are both good and P-poor parents out there . Each case should be taken on its own merits ; it 's dam tough to make one rule fit all . Impossible , actually .""",AGREE,"""the Child Custody Protection Act seems to assume that all parents are good parents unfortunately there are plently of * * * * -poor parents out there Protecting both parental authority for those capable of handling it and the children who may be victims of its abuse is not something that the CCPA seems to do well enough""","""And there you have hit the nail on the head there are both good and P-poor parents out there Each case should be taken on its own merits ; it 's dam tough to make one rule fit all . Impossible , actually .""",,
35817,9376,"""And the risk to minority 's civil rights is , of course , the reason for the bill .""","""And yet they also claim other reasons ... fraud and $ , which I was addressing .""",DISAGREE,"""And the risk to minority 's civil rights is , of course , the reason for the bill .""","""And yet they also claim other reasons ... fraud and $ , which I was addressing .""",,
35823,9377,"""It is a direct accusation by the CURATOR OF BIRDS for the SMITHSONIAN INSTITUTION against all the proponents of the dino bird story .""","""Incorrect- I think Olsen is very specific in citing those he feels have overstepped the mark in this instance . He is not ruling out the possibility of a link at all- he ( rightly IMO ) is targeting certain workers and publications .""",DISAGREE,"""It is a direct accusation by the CURATOR OF BIRDS""","""He is not ruling out the possibility of a link at all- he ( rightly IMO ) is targeting certain workers and publications .""",,
35840,9379,"""I bet if someone wanted to they could write a paper on the theory your ancestors were human and it would pass review .""","""Never get published though""",DISAGREE,"""they could write a paper on the theory it would pass review .""","""Never get published""",,
35846,9380,"""Smith & amp ; Wesson , the famed American gunmaker once owned by Tomkins , the British conglomerate , expects to nearly double its annual sales in the next three to five years as demand for its firearms soars in the recession . It is not alone . All over America demand for firearms and ammunition is rising amid concerns that rising unemployment , which passed 10 per cent this month , will lead inexorably to higher rates of crime . Fears of terrorism have also helped to lift demand , as have concerns among gun owners that the Obama Administration may introduce restrictions on gun ownership and impose additional taxes . ..  “ People are worried about personal protection with unemployment and crime on the rise ,  ” he said in a presentation to investors , adding that 30 per cent of customers who had bought the company ’ s guns in the first half of this year were  “ first-time gun owners ” , up from 9 per cent nine a year earlier .""","""I know the Left thinks this is just an example of delusional paranoia , but allow me to add some incite ! ( Not that I , or we , care about what you think is driving this increased sales , because it is really None of Your Business ! ) However , I have a very liberal friend who often talked of his concern about people he didn ’ t want to be armed . However , back when the Brady Bill requiring background checks was passed , and before it ’ s implementation , he purchased a 357 Magnum handgun with some of the nastiest hollow points that were on the market ! When I asked him why , he told me that he didn ’ t want the government to know what he owned . It simply was none of their business , because they work for us ! It is not the other way around ! ( I liked that saying so much I stole it from him and you have seen it used several times here now . ) The above is the REAL answer to the question of why this is happening now ! And there is NOTHING you on the Left can do about it either ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! Total NICS Firearm Background Checks November 30 , 1998 - October 31 , 2009""",DISAGREE,"""expects to nearly double its annual sales in the next three to five years""","""When I asked him why , he told me that he didn ’ t want the government""",,
35863,9385,"""I concur . Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago and the Wild West still has n't gotten here . What the hell is it waiting for ?""","""It never will . The Wild West , incidently , had a markedly lower crime rate than we have today . Potential criminals knew they could be shot by just about any passerby who witnessed their crime .""",DISAGREE,"""Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago the Wild West still has n't gotten here""","""It never will . The Wild West , , had a markedly lower crime rate than we have today . criminals knew they could be shot by just about any passerby""",,
35864,9385,"""I concur . Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago and the Wild West still has n't gotten here . What the hell is it waiting for ?""","""It never will . The Wild West , incidently , had a markedly lower crime rate than we have today . Potential criminals knew they could be shot by just about any passerby who witnessed their crime .""",DISAGREE,"""Michigan adopted a shall-issue system three years ago and the Wild West still has n't gotten here""","""It never will . The Wild West , incidently , had a markedly lower crime rate than we have today .""",,
35882,9389,"""Some people wo n't read for themselves but condem others who do .""","""Yo shush yo mouth ! Doncha knows that tha bible is fo believahs ! Yas got ta believah furst ! That 's right , if you read it without believing first , you 'll see the flaws and contradictions . You need to magic indwelling spirit of Suspension of Disbelief to fully understand what they bibles about .""",AGREE,"""Some people wo n't read for themselves but condem others who do .""","""Yo shush yo mouth ! Doncha knows that tha bible is fo believahs !""",,
35883,9390,"""Faith is the cornerstone of religion , yes . But who says God cares about religion ? Religion is a completely human invention , and as such is a poor indicator for God 's will . If God felt like showing up , and thus proving his existance , I do n't think he 'd let the fact that it would screw up most of the world 's religions stop him .""","""Well said , Kronus . Very well indeed .""",AGREE,"""Religion is a completely human invention ,""","""Very well indeed .""",,
35907,9395,"""Hey Simone , would you be interested in debating gun control with me ? IÂ ’ m serious , now . I can try to show you the error of your ways , and you can try to do the same with me . You can even bring Brady along for backup , if you can catch him .""","""Mullets swim into this big old placid lagoon seeing nothing but calm clear waters not realizing it is filled with a bunch of voracious sharks""",DISAGREE,"""would you be interested in debating gun control with me ? . I can try to show you the error of your ways ,""","""Mullets swim into this big old placid lagoon seeing nothing but calm clear waters not realizing""",,
35906,9395,"""Hey Simone , would you be interested in debating gun control with me ? IÂ ’ m serious , now . I can try to show you the error of your ways , and you can try to do the same with me . You can even bring Brady along for backup , if you can catch him .""","""Mullets swim into this big old placid lagoon seeing nothing but calm clear waters not realizing it is filled with a bunch of voracious sharks""",DISAGREE,"""Hey Simone , would you be interested in debating gun control with me ? IÂ ’ m serious , now . I can try to show you the error of your ways , and you can try to do the same with me . You can even bring Brady along for backup , if you can catch him""","""Mullets swim into this big old placid lagoon seeing nothing but calm clear waters not realizing it is filled with a bunch of voracious sharks""",,
35916,9397,"""Perhaps when the Roman Catholic Church has cleansed itself of its own sins it could have a dialogue with women about abortion -- WHICH IS NOT A SIN .""","""That 's is ridiculously poor logic . Simply becuase the church makes mistakes does n't mean it 's incorrect in all other charges . The US government is WAY more corrupt than the Catholic Church , and yet we obey every god-damned thing big brother makes us do .""",DISAGREE,"""Perhaps when the Roman Catholic Church has cleansed itself of its own sins it could have a dialogue with women about abortion""","""That 's is ridiculously poor logic""",,
35925,9399,"""I fully agree with Close_slave_can . I 'm an atheist , yet I see a great need for laws , morals etc and consider it self evident that such things can exist and function just fine in a purely subjective context . I can only assume that I am therefore emotionally and morally superior to the religion-bound that imply they would murder and steal were it not for their belief in absolute laws and morals imposed upon them by their personal choice of god .""","""And I agree with that . Religion is rubbish , imo .""",AGREE,"""I 'm an atheist , I see a great need for laws , morals""","""And I agree with that . Religion is rubbish""",,
35931,9400,"""Then there 's that state thaht wants to remove the use of BC and AD from the calendar . I guess they 'll change it to some neutral like plus and minus numbers just to stay with the rest of the world .... or maybe 2005 will change to 133,956,373,278 .""","""actually , the more common usage would be CE . and BCE ( COmmon era , and before common era )""",AGREE,"""that state thaht wants to remove the use of BC and AD from the calendar .""","""the more common usage would be CE . and BCE""",,
35938,9409,"""This is the correct inequality based off of my original equation . e-c < e+c""","""So ? I was n't just re-expressing YOUR inequalities . In fact , I made it clear that I was providing BETTER inequalities than you did . YOU EVEN QUOTED ME AS SAYING THAT ! ! ! Then you turn right around and pretend that I did n't anything of the sort ? ! ? ! Get real dude . PS : The most correct representation of the three main combinations of e and c is as follows ( one which I did present in the post you are replying to ) : e - c > e + c > c - e""",DISAGREE,"""This is the correct inequality based off of my original equation .""","""I made it clear that I was providing BETTER inequalities than you did .""",,
35954,9413,"""Originally posted by FreeThinker If Man did n't descend from Monkeys , where do you think they descended from ?""","""Which , Monkeys or Man ?""",DISAGREE,"""Originally posted by descend from Monkeys""","""Monkeys or Man ?""",,
35977,9417,"""Babys are the outcome of sex , If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex ! ! ! ! ! !""","""I only wish it were so simple .""",DISAGREE,"""Babys are the outcome of sex , If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex""","""I only wish it were so simple .""",,
35979,9417,"""Babys are the outcome of sex , If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex ! ! ! ! ! !""","""I only wish it were so simple .""",DISAGREE,"""If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex ! ! ! ! ! !""","""I only wish it were so simple .""",,
35983,9417,"""Babys are the outcome of sex , If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex ! ! ! ! ! !""","""I only wish it were so simple .""",DISAGREE,"""Babys are the outcome of sex , If you do n't want a baby , do n't have sex""","""only wish it were so simple .""",,
36016,9421,"""-Julian Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""Actually , the old Black Codes were made useless by the 14th amendment and did more good for the Black movement and civil rights workers who could then protect themselves . Last time I saw the NAACP and Black Panthers was in Houston and the streets were lined with BP armed with AK 47s so I think your quote by Julian Bond is a mite off base Of course we know you would never stoop to deceive""",DISAGREE,"""Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""Last time I saw the NAACP and Black Panthers was in Houston I think your quote by Julian Bond is a mite off base Of course""",,
36018,9421,"""-Julian Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""Actually , the old Black Codes were made useless by the 14th amendment and did more good for the Black movement and civil rights workers who could then protect themselves . Last time I saw the NAACP and Black Panthers was in Houston and the streets were lined with BP armed with AK 47s so I think your quote by Julian Bond is a mite off base Of course we know you would never stoop to deceive""",DISAGREE,"""Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""the old Black Codes were made useless by the 14th amendment and did more good for the Black movement and civil rights workers""",,
36019,9421,"""-Julian Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""Actually , the old Black Codes were made useless by the 14th amendment and did more good for the Black movement and civil rights workers who could then protect themselves . Last time I saw the NAACP and Black Panthers was in Houston and the streets were lined with BP armed with AK 47s so I think your quote by Julian Bond is a mite off base Of course we know you would never stoop to deceive""",DISAGREE,"""Bond , Board Chairman , NAACP""","""your by Julian Bond is a mite off base""",,
36027,9422,"""Diseases used to be ascribed to God and it was thought that those people who got sick deserved to be sick because of their lack of piety . Now we know that diseases strike indiscriminately ( where piety is concerned ) and affect people only based on their risk of acquiring the virus and their general state of health . There are many other examples .""","""See above . Nothing has been demonstrated that convinces me that God has been ruled out of all these issues . He probably is n't active in all situations , but there 's nothing that says he ( or even Satan ) are totally inconsequential either .""",DISAGREE,"""Diseases used to be ascribed to God Now we know that diseases strike indiscriminately""","""Nothing has been demonstrated that convinces me that God has been ruled out""",,
36020,9422,"""Diseases used to be ascribed to God and it was thought that those people who got sick deserved to be sick because of their lack of piety . Now we know that diseases strike indiscriminately ( where piety is concerned ) and affect people only based on their risk of acquiring the virus and their general state of health . There are many other examples .""","""See above . Nothing has been demonstrated that convinces me that God has been ruled out of all these issues . He probably is n't active in all situations , but there 's nothing that says he ( or even Satan ) are totally inconsequential either .""",DISAGREE,"""Diseases used to be ascribed to God Now we know that diseases strike indiscriminately""","""Nothing has been demonstrated that convinces me that God has been ruled out He probably is n't active in all situations , but there 's nothing that says he inconsequential""",,
36062,9434,"""This sort of development , in which one creationist theory , c-decay , is overtaken by another , is a healthy aspect of science . The basic biblical framework is non-negotiable , as opposed to the changing views and models of fallible people seeking to understand the data within that framework ( evolutionists also often change their ideas on exactly how things have made themselves , but never whether they did ) .""","""http : //www.answersingenesis.org/docs/405.asp What we can say is , however , that it passed Peer Review :""",DISAGREE,"""The basic biblical framework is non-negotiable ,""","""that it passed Peer Review""",,
36068,9436,"""You are not the type of theist I am interested in talking to .""","""Well excuuuuuuuuuuuse me . You are obviously not simply inquiring into the way people think then , so instead of asking generally what people think , why do n't you tell us exactly who you are looking for so they can present themselves .""",DISAGREE,"""You are not the type of theist I am interested in talking to""","""why do n't you tell us exactly who you are looking for so they can present themselves""",,
36076,9444,"""Homosexuals are attracted to adults of the same sex . Pedophiles are attracted exclusively to children . There are people , such as the case with these priests , who molest children , who are not pedophiles . Molestation , like rape , is n't about sexual attraction . It is VIOLENCE . People do n't molest or rape because they are so turned on they ca n't help themselves , they do it to HURT somebody . Get some information before shooting off at the mouth VOR . Most of those priests were probably niether gay nor pedophiles . I HATE IT - when people spread this * * * * . It is FALSE information that does nothing but HARM . It puts blame on the innocent while the guilty get ignored and children get hurt . Do not use this lie to justify your bigotry - for you do so at the cost of innocent people - adults and children .""","""Homosexuals are attracted to people of the same sex whether they be adults are children ............. The vast majority of the priests who were charged admitted to being gay ............""",DISAGREE,"""Homosexuals Pedophiles not pedophiles . VIOLENCE HURT VOR I HATE IT spread this * * * * . FALSE HARM""","""sex whether vast majority of the priests admitted to being gay""",,
36101,9449,"""A mother who killed herself and her disabled daughter had been terrorised by a gang of youths and had her repeated pleas for help ignored by police , an inquest was told yesterday . The single mother , her daughter and teenage son , Anthony , had endured ten years of being virtual prisoners in their own home as a gang of up to 16  “ street kids ” tormented them for simply  “ existing ” Despite Mrs Pilkington and her family repeatedly calling the police and reporting that they had received death threats , she was told to close her curtains and ignore the children , a jury was told . A Leicestershire Police log shows that she called them more than twenty times in seven years to say that her severely dyslexic son ’ s life had been threatened , her daughter , who had acute special needs , was being bullied and her house was under attack from the gang of youths .""","""I know a bit about this myself . However the difference is that I was allowed to carry a gun under the reasonable man statute . An Armed person truly can not be bullied ! The old saying is . God created man and Samuel Colt made them equal ! Old , disabled , female and all , are on an equal footing with these vicious predators !""",AGREE,"""A mother who killed herself and her disabled daughter had been terrorised by a gang of youths and had her repeated pleas for help ignored by police ,""","""I know a bit about this myself . However the difference is that I was allowed to carry a gun under the reasonable man statute .""",,
36107,9450,"""That 's a stretch you do n't need to make though . Not even considering the fact that the bible contradicts itself .. i.e . god performs miracles , speaks to people , etc ... .. it 's the definition that god is supernatural that in itself , can not be reconciled with god `` appearing `` . The same goes for any diety , or imaginary thing , if by definition they are imaginary/supernatural . Once you `` find `` something supernatural , they are no longer imaginary or supernatural , thus , you can never find them , they can only exist , by definition , without evidence , with faith . It 's relativity in action yet again The contradiction you illustrate stands apart from the bible . -Mach""","""that is not true . a levitating guru that has been seen and proven to levitate doesnt make the process natural . an alien that has been seen and proven to teleport and abduct people in their retractor beam doesnt make the process less paranormal . the definition of supernatural/paranormal doesnt automatically mean they can never be observed , just that they defy physical law . the definition of God is a special case that includes never being observed/proven""",DISAGREE,"""The same goes for any diety , or imaginary thing , if by definition they are imaginary/supernatural""","""an alien that has been seen and proven to teleport and abduct people in their retractor beam doesnt make the process less paranormal""",,
36114,9451,"""Playing devils advocate . But statistically you may kill me in the future with your gun . You have to give up your rights now . Your violating my rights . ( Although I know you are and I ca n't name the right nor find the right in the Constitution )""","""Oh my goodness , yes . I had forgotten that scenario . How silly of me .""",DISAGREE,"""you may kill me in the future with your gun . You have to give up your rights now . Your violating my rights .""","""I had forgotten that scenario . How silly of me .""",,
36115,9451,"""Playing devils advocate . But statistically you may kill me in the future with your gun . You have to give up your rights now . Your violating my rights . ( Although I know you are and I ca n't name the right nor find the right in the Constitution )""","""Oh my goodness , yes . I had forgotten that scenario . How silly of me .""",DISAGREE,"""But statistically you may kill me in the future with your gun . You have to give up your rights now .""","""Oh my goodness , yes . I had forgotten that scenario . How silly of me .""",,
36124,9453,"""I am not sure were it is in his book if it is in his book at all it may be in his diary . And It may have been in a earlier version . And since you say that the 6th edition is the definitive one well ok .""","""Actually , you are still quibbling . First , after I told you that you were wrong you came up with the `` it may be in his diary `` bit . Later it has moved to an earlier version of OTOOS . The answer is quite simple . NOPE . I searched through The LIfe and Letters of Charles Darwin , vol I & amp ; II , More Letters of Charles Darwin , vol I & amp ; II , On the Origin of Species , 1st and 6th editions , The Autobiography of Charles Darwin , and The Voyage of the Beagle . None even contain the word `` microbiology `` . Darwin made several references to microscopes and his use of them . He had one on the Beagle . But nowhere does any of that discussion refer to the impossibility of his theory . Maybe you would be so kind as to tell me where you had access to Darwin 's diary . Or maybe you either made up that assertion or were just an ignorant dupe of someone like Hovind making a claim like that . Where did it come from .""",DISAGREE,"""I am not sure were it is in his book if it is in his book at all it may be in his diary .""","""Actually , you are still quibbling . First , after I told you that you were wrong you came up with the `` it may be in his diary NOPE . I searched through The LIfe and Letters of Charles Darwin""",,
36128,9454,"""Simple and insightful , I agree . I wonder what EZ thinks ?""","""I think dropping trou for illicit gay sex has nothing to do with genes . It 's a deliberate behavior .""",DISAGREE,"""Simple and insightful , I agree . I wonder what EZ thinks ?""","""I think dropping trou for illicit gay sex has nothing to do with genes . It 's a deliberate behavior .""",,
36134,9455,"""As was already pointed out . Sheesh , I 've got furniture that 's smarter than this .""","""Well at least more coherent if the joints are tight and the glue is any good at all !""",AGREE,"""I 've got furniture that 's smarter than this .""","""the glue is any good at all !""",,
36145,9457,"""who 's job is it to protece ME from crime ?""","""Well you should protect yourself of course , that is your right ( and duty ) as a human being , but that 's not what the 2nd amendment is for . It 's just convenient that the tools that protect you from tyranny can also be used to protect yourself against criminals .""",DISAGREE,"""who 's job is it to protece ME from crime ?""","""Well you should protect yourself of course , that is your right""",,
36151,9479,"""-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I do not believe that the supreme court adressed the the problem of convicted fellons having the death penelty reduced to life in prison and going on to kill in prison .""","""How is that related to deterrence ? Once again , deterrence is preventing through the fear of consequences . What you are talking about is not related to the subject of deterrence .""",DISAGREE,"""I do not believe that the supreme court adressed the the problem of convicted fellons""","""What you are talking about is not related to the subject of deterrence .""",,
36155,9480,"""chaoticgnome Longhorn ?""","""Yeah . The natural fission reaction is really interesting , I had n't heard about it . nifty link : http : //www.curtin.edu.au/curtin/cent ... LO/index.shtml""",AGREE,"""chaoticgnome Longhorn ?""","""Yeah . The natural fission reaction is really interesting""",,
36162,9482,"""Why is their no option for changing the constitution against the right to bear arms ?""","""Because the purpose of the US Bill of Rights is to grant or guarantee rights , not to prohibit or curtail personal freedoms .""",DISAGREE,"""Why is their no option for changing the constitution against the right to bear arms ?""","""Because the purpose of the US Bill of Rights is to grant or guarantee rights , not to prohibit or curtail personal freedoms .""",,
36174,9484,"""Your claim is also sunk by the fact that in states with shall-issued concealed carry , people do n't just start killing each other when there 's a traffic accident . They 're not getting out of their cars , yelling incoherently and then pulling a piece to fill the other full of holes for having the nerve to bend their fender . There are no wild west shootings in store parking lots over somebody snagging a prime parking spot that somebody else was trying to get but was just too slow .""","""What 's that ? '' Wild west ! Wild west ! '' ? But I digress ... You appear to be exaggerating my position , exactly as I suggested a pro-gunner would likely do ; in my very first post in this thread . The fact that guns do n't trigger aggressiveness to the extent you exaggerate does n't change the fact that they do increase it by a measurable amount .""",DISAGREE,"""They 're not getting out of their cars , yelling incoherently and then pulling a piece""","""I suggested a pro-gunner would likely do ; in my very first post in this thread .""",,
36187,9486,"""Do you disagree that The inheritance of acquired characteristics is simply changes in physiology acquired over the life of an organism that are transmitted to offspring ?""","""That definition is n't what I 'm disagreeing with I 'm just pointing out why it 's not happening here . Retroviruses , as I said , open up some very interesting possibilities . I 'm not aware of any conclusive research taking place - I know the immune system makes use of them but I do n't think there 's any evidence of immunity being passed down in that way : early mothers ' milk is the mechanism for that ( packed with a payload of antibodies to prime the infant 's immune system ) . To be honest , I think the existence of that system rather stomps on the plausibility of Lamarckian inheritance ; why bother going to all that trouble if the parent could simply code immunity into the genes it passes to its offspring ?""",DISAGREE,"""The inheritance of acquired characteristics is simply changes in physiology""","""To be honest , I think the existence of that system rather stomps on the plausibility""",,
36199,9488,"""So the fact that we still have criminals who choose to kill others , should be used against is in determining whether we can be trusted or not ?""","""So the fact that terrorists board airplanes should be used against people in determining whether they can be trusted or not ? My government must not trust an ordinary dirtbag like me because it makes me go through a security check before boarding a plane .""",DISAGREE,"""the fact that we still have criminals who choose to kill others , should be used against is in determining whether we can be trusted or not ?""","""the fact that terrorists board airplanes should be used against people in determining whether they can be trusted or not ?""",,
36202,9489,"""I dont get it . This must only make sense to you , Peddler eight eleventy one""","""Often that screen name is taken-Peddler-out of habit I attach a number to it .""",AGREE,"""I dont get it . This must only make sense to you , Peddler eight eleventy one""","""Often that screen name is taken-Peddler-out of habit I attach a number to it .""",,
36209,9490,"""Actually , there is , my poor addle-minded friend . Indeed , you can argue that she was even exercising her responsibility as a citizen with more civic-mindedness than many because she non-violently and patiently refused to sign the ticket . She has a right not to sign .""","""Again you focus on irrelevant minutia in the hope of making excuses and justifying the actions of someone who was clearly in the wrong . Here again is what the Judges said in their ruling , one being a fellow woman whom you are calling a racist , and it does n't bode well for your law suit partial criminal : But in a 2-1 ruling Friday , a panel of the 9th U.S . Circuit Court of Appeals disagreed . Judges Cynthia Holcomb Hall and Diarmuid F. O'Scannlain held that the officers were justified in making an arrest because Brooks was obstructing them and resisting arrest . The use of force was also justified because of the threat Brooks posed , Hall wrote : `` It seems clear that Brooks was not going to be able to harm anyone with her car at a moment 's notice . Nonetheless , some threat she might retrieve the keys and drive off erratically remained , particularly given her refusal to leave the car and her state of agitation. ``""",DISAGREE,"""she was even exercising her responsibility as a citizen she non-violently and patiently refused to sign the ticket""","""someone who was clearly in the wrong , officers were justified in making an arrest because Brooks was obstructing them and resisting arrest""",,
36212,9491,"""Some animals do not fall neatly into the categories of being warm or cold-blooded . Bats , for example , are mammals who can not maintain a constant body temperature and cool off when they are not active . Echidnas maintain a range of body temperatures which usually lies between 77 and 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit and have difficulty cooling down . Mole Rats are another group of mammals who are unable to regulate their body temperature , however , since they live underground , the temperature of their environment does not change much . Some warm-blooded animals , such as bears , groundhogs , gophers and bats hibernate during the cold winter . During hibernation these animals live off of stored body fat and can drop their body temperatures by as much as 50 degrees Fahrenheit . The Hawk Moth is an insect which can raise its body temperature well above the temperature of its surroundings when it is flying because of its huge wing muscles which generate heat when in use . Bees are another example of insects that can raise their body temperatures above that of their environment by moving their wings rapidly to generate heat .""","""More discussion : http : //www.enchantedlearning.com/sub ... my/Blood.shtml""",DISAGREE,"""Bats , for example , are mammals who can not maintain a constant body temperature""","""http : //www.enchantedlearning.com/sub ... my/Blood.shtml""",,
36223,9492,"""This is clearly the worst one . Mr. Harvey shows his ignorance and dislike of science .""","""So what if he dislikes science ? If he believes something else , he has the right to believe that way . My problem here is that he shows more closed-mindedness to the viewpoints of others .""",DISAGREE,"""This is clearly the worst one""","""So what if he dislikes science ?""",,
36230,9503,"""There is good evidence of a very large flood in the middle east , however . This would have been the whole world to the Bible writiers - and certainly those who actually knew Yaweh .""","""Let 's hear more . Remember ; it is estimated that over 6 billion people were on earth at the time of the flood . Also , Genesis 1 : 6 thru 1 : 10 - Water was above and below the firmament of Heaven . What happened to the waters that were above the firmament ? Was this used for the deluge that covered the earth ? It had never rained before The Flood . Why , if someone made up this story , would they have said such a thing ? Would n't it be much more believeable if they would have said , `` There had never been such a rain as this ... `` ?""",DISAGREE,"""There is good evidence of a very large flood in the middle east , however . This would have been the whole world to the Bible writiers""","""? Why , if someone made up this story , would they have said such a thing ? Would n't it be much more believeable if they would have said , `` There had never been such a rain as this ...""",,
36235,9505,"""That 's a classical example of circular reasoning .""","""Yes . It is also a classic example of a creationist straw man . It demonstrates that you have n't bothered to learn the most basic ideas of the topic and that you are willing to let some creationist hack dupe you . The methods of dating fossils was first developed by creationists when they discovered that certain suites of fossils were always found in the same order in geological strata . They reasoned that the deeper the fossils were , the older they were . Thus , they assigned relative ages to certain types of strata . Of course , their estimates of actual age were way off , since they thought that the earth was only a few million years old . We now have several methods of radiometric dating and can more accurately determine the ages of fossils . The relative dating methods of the creationist scientists has been confirmed - the dates are just older than they thought .""",AGREE,"""That 's a classical example of circular reasoning .""","""Yes . It is also a classic example of a creationist straw man""",,
36249,9516,"""Genesis 19:24-25 24 Then the LORD rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah—from the LORD out of the heavens . 25 Thus he overthrew those cities and the entire plain , including all those living in the cities—and also the vegetation in the land .""","""This is obviously not talking about abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""Then the LORD rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah—from the LORD out of the heavens . 25 Thus he overthrew those cities and the entire plain , including all those living in the cities—and also the vegetation in the land .""","""This is obviously not talking about abortion .""",,
36254,9517,"""For you , you seem to be suggesting that truths in the physical world can only be gathered by scientific means .""","""It depends on your intention and your methods . Of course , things that do n't have some sort of physical manifestation that can be measured ca n't be studied by science . Science is naturalistic . Scientific data can only include that which can be observed and quantified by natural means . I read it in a book of mythology is n't scientific .""",DISAGREE,"""For you , you seem to be suggesting that truths in the physical world can only be gathered by scientific means .""","""It depends on your intention and your methods .""",,
36274,9521,"""this is terrible . Kansas should have kept how it was instead of teaching the beleif of evolution like it was a fact when it is jst a theory and a beleif system of atheirsts""","""More people actuallysupport the FSM school of creationsim - would you agree that this could be a suitable compromise ?""",AGREE,"""Kansas should have kept how it was instead of teaching the beleif of evolution like it was a fact when it is jst a theory and a beleif system of atheirsts""","""More people actuallysupport the FSM school of creationsim - would you agree that this could be a suitable compromise ?""",,
36279,9521,"""this is terrible . Kansas should have kept how it was instead of teaching the beleif of evolution like it was a fact when it is jst a theory and a beleif system of atheirsts""","""More people actuallysupport the FSM school of creationsim - would you agree that this could be a suitable compromise ?""",AGREE,"""Kansas should have kept how it was instead of teaching the beleif of evolution""","""More people actuallysupport the FSM school of creationsim""",,
36295,9523,"""But , it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet ...""",AGREE,"""it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet ...""",,
36298,9523,"""But , it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet ...""",AGREE,"""it 's a simplistic answer to a complicated situation""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet""",,
36300,9523,"""But , it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet ...""",AGREE,"""it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course .""",,
36302,9523,"""But , it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course . Afterall , this is the internet ...""",AGREE,"""it 's a really simplistic answer to a much more complicated situation .""","""Of course""",,
36315,9525,"""A curse ? If you do n't agree with it that 's one thing . Many people have died because of Christianity .""","""Bad Religion or misapplied Religion has been in every century , country and culture .""",DISAGREE,"""If you do n't agree with it that 's one thing . Many people have died because of Christianity .""","""Bad Religion or misapplied Religion has been in every century , country and culture .""",,
36332,9526,"""If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics , in canada and states that still premit abortion . Are we to fill the prisons with those seeking abortions in places where it is legal if they live in states that do not allow abortions ? Prolifers better becare for what they wish for . Prolifers tend to be conservative and do not like taxes . They better get ready to pay , in taxes , for the extra prisons and social programs needed for all those abandoned children .""","""21st Century cause and effect is not something those desiring adhesion to 2000-year mythical belief systems are prepared to accept . As a current example displaying what will happen with outlawing abortion , I offer over-the-counter cough medicine used as a ingredient in cooking crystal meth , the ( US ) current street drug of choice . Sales of that simple ingredient were banned in my state by politicians claiming it would 'dry up ' meth production . No support whatsoever from LE due to the simple fact that cheap finished product from Canada and Mexico would simply flood the market , eliminating the need for local production , expand usage by increased availability and fill up our jails with the aftermath of crimes against property and people . Guess what ? That 's exactly what 's happening . Christian morality regarding abortion and drugs might be the predominate factor in many of our criminal statutes , but there 's certainly no doubt it 's a cost we can no longer afford on a social or financial basis .""",DISAGREE,"""abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics""","""that simple ingredient were banned in my state by politicians claiming it would 'dry up ' meth""",,
36323,9526,"""If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics , in canada and states that still premit abortion . Are we to fill the prisons with those seeking abortions in places where it is legal if they live in states that do not allow abortions ? Prolifers better becare for what they wish for . Prolifers tend to be conservative and do not like taxes . They better get ready to pay , in taxes , for the extra prisons and social programs needed for all those abandoned children .""","""21st Century cause and effect is not something those desiring adhesion to 2000-year mythical belief systems are prepared to accept . As a current example displaying what will happen with outlawing abortion , I offer over-the-counter cough medicine used as a ingredient in cooking crystal meth , the ( US ) current street drug of choice . Sales of that simple ingredient were banned in my state by politicians claiming it would 'dry up ' meth production . No support whatsoever from LE due to the simple fact that cheap finished product from Canada and Mexico would simply flood the market , eliminating the need for local production , expand usage by increased availability and fill up our jails with the aftermath of crimes against property and people . Guess what ? That 's exactly what 's happening . Christian morality regarding abortion and drugs might be the predominate factor in many of our criminal statutes , but there 's certainly no doubt it 's a cost we can no longer afford on a social or financial basis .""",DISAGREE,"""If abortion is made illegal I predict that you will see across the border abortion clinics Prolifers""","""2000-year mythical belief systems outlawing abortion cheap finished product from Canada and Mexico would simply flood the market Christian morality""",,
36336,9527,"""Most scientists agree that there needs to be a sufficiently developed cerebral cortex in order for pain to be registered as such . The cerebral cortex is not sufficiently developed enough in the fetus to feel pain until roughly the start of the third trimester . Otherwise , the movements of an early fetus or embryo away from a stimulus are simply reflex action . Those of you who might have disected a frog in biology class in High School might have experienced it yourself when seeing the leg of a newly dead frog move under stimulus . For the novice , it may appear to be a reaction to a felt pain but it is not . Here is one link to a comprehensive study on fetal pain made by the American Medical Association : http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/294/8/947""","""GULLIBLE TREATMENT OF TRUMPED UP `` STUDY `` ON FETAL PAIN ISSUE SHOULD EMBARRASS J.A.M.A . AND SOME JOURNALISTS This memo offers a number of points of information regarding the article `` Fetal Pain : A Systematic Multidisciplinary Review of the Evidence , `` published in the August 24 edition of the Journal of the American Medical Association ( JAMA ) . Any of the material below , if not otherwise attributed , can be attributed to NRLC Legislative Director Douglas Johnson ( Legfederal @ aol.com ) , who prepared this memorandum . See this here : http : //www.nrlc.org/abortion/Fetal_P ... uttalJAMA.html The following excerpt is from : http : //abort73.com/HTML/I-A-2a-pain.html `` Sir Albert Lilley , widely considered the `` Father of Fetology `` , and unabashedly pro-life ( as anyone with his vast knowledge of fetal development should be ) makes some remarkable statements about fetal pain in an interview he conducted for the book The Tiniest Humans . Question : In the case of an 8- to-10-week fetus , if you apply pressure will it tend to try to get out of the way ? Answer : Normally it would be extremely difficult , apart from putting a foreign instrument or needle into the uterus to apply pressure , but with a fetus at that maturity you have a very small fetus in a larger capsule of fluid . However , as the famous work of Dr. Davenport Hooker shows , in his many thousands of feet of film , babies at this maturity are responsive to touch . The fetus also responds violently to painful stimuli-needle puncture and injection of cold or of hypertonic solutions- stimuli which you and I find painful , children will tell you are painful , and the neonate , to judge from his responses , finds painful . -- - I have been told by advocates of abortion that we have no proof that the fetus actually feels pain . Strictly , they are quite correct . Pain is a peculiarly personal and subjective experience and there is no biochemical or physiological test we can do to tell that anyone is in pain - a phenomenon which makes it very easy to bear other people 's pain stoically , which is an important point for obstetricians to remember . By the same token we lack any proof that animals feel pain . However , to judge from their responses , it seems charitable to assume they do . Were this not so there would be no point in having an organization like the Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals , and I for one would be unhappy to think we would withhold from the human fetus a charitable consideration we were prepared to extend to animals . Question : The question , then , of pain felt by the fetus - it is your personal opinion , I gather from what you say in your paper , that in effect the fetus does feel pain ? Answer : I can only say that the fetus responds violently to stimuli that you and I would find painful . Bertrand Russell once remarked that a fisherman had told him that fish had neither sense or sensation , but how he knew that the fisherman would not tell him. `` The following excerpt is from : http : //www.theinterim.com/2000/nov/21fetalpain.html `` Dr . Glover 's research in the area of fetal pain is hardly groundbreaking . Sir Albert W. Liley , the pre-eminent fetologist from New Zealand , had no doubt , on the basis of objective evidence , that the fetus has a capacity to feel pain . In 1963 , Dr. Liley , the founder of fetology , developed the first surgical technique for administering intrauterine blood transfusions to the fetus . According to Liley , the fetus feels pain as early as three months . In offering instructions for carrying out the surgical technique of fetal blood transfusions , he advised his colleagues to take into serious consideration this fact of fetal pain . During the actual surgical procedure , the child must be sedated and given pain-relieving medication . Dr. Margaret Liley , wife and assistant to her husband , and a distinguished fetologist and pediatrician in her own right , remarks in her well-known book , Modern Motherhood : When doctors first began invading the sanctuary of the womb , they did not know that the unborn baby would react to pain in the same fashion as a child would . But they soon learned that he would . By no means a  ‘ vegetable ' as he has so often been pictured , the unborn knows perfectly well when he has been hurt , and he will protest it just as violently as would a baby in a crib . In referring to aborting a 12-week-old fetus by dilatation and curettage , ( in which the neck of the womb is dilated and the fetus removed in pieces after the womb has been scraped by a sharp instrument called a curette ) , Dr. Eugene Diamond stated in 1971 : `` When this procedure is done , there is little doubt that the fetus , in fact , feels what is done to it. `` In a comprehensive treatment of fetal pain , published in 1985 in the New England Journal of Medicine , Dr. K. Annand , a Harvard physiologist , stated that the fetus first perceives pain as early as 12 weeks . In a May 1975 piece in Atlantic , Willard Gaylin and Marc Lappe argue for fetal experimentation , which they contend is far less traumatic for the unborn than certain forms of abortion . If society allows a child in the womb to be subjected to `` unimaginable acts of violence , `` they write , such as `` dismemberment , salt-induced osmotic shock , or surgical extirpation , `` how can it balk at fetal experimentation , most forms of which are incomparably more benign . Fetal pain , of course , is a matter of fact , not ideology . Science , of course , should be based on fact , not political correctness . We live in a Therapeutic Culture in which popping pills has become a national pastime . We are only too sensitive about pain , inconvenience , and possibly offending someone . Yet our own ultra-sensitivity to pain does not , in general , extend to the unborn . Are we inconsistent in our war against pain ? Is there a blatant contradiction that runs through the very heart of our Therapeutic Culture ? The answer to this apparent dilemma lies in the fact that there are different levels of pain . Pain exists on a spiritual as well as on a physical level . Of the two , as many psychologists and psychiatrists have averred , the spiritual kind is more difficult to bear . The difference between the two is akin to the difference between pain and suffering . The suffering in one 's soul that can arise from humiliation , guilt , despair , and terror , are formidable . An athlete would rather risk breaking his neck driving for a fly ball than feel the humiliation of being called a wimp . A soldier would rather risk injury and even death , than suffer the shame of dishonor . A Christian would rather mortify himself than experience the disgrace that comes with mortal sin . Defeat , dishonor , disgrace , as a rule , are far more devastating than physical pain . There is a pain that goes with being egregiously wrong ( shame ) or being recklessly immoral ( disgrace ) or being purposely obtuse ( humiliation ) that is more acute than physical pain . Our Therapeutic Culture is not inconsistent . Those who promote abortion want to spare themselves the pain that goes with suffering shame , disgrace , and humiliation . Because of that , they are willing to deny the pain that the aborted baby feels . To acknowledge what abortion really means is too painful for them . They would rather retreat into the presumed security of their comforting ideology . Pain and birth go together in a mysterious way , like death and life , fall and redemption . The birth of a child or the rebirth of an adult requires a certain amount of pain . Birth and redemption both demand pain . Abortion was instituted in an attempt to avoid pain . But it has magnified the very thing it had sought to reduce . We are drowning in a sea of tranquilizers while we increase our suffering . We thought we could eliminate physical suffering , but brought about spiritual torment . The abortion issue , like an ellipse , has two foci : one is the birth of the child ( which is accompanied by pain ) ; the other , the rebirth of the pro-abortionist ( which is accompanied by suffering ) . Part of the painful truth about the abortion issue is that it includes both the unborn and the unrepentant. `` Dr. DeMarco is a professor of philosophy at St. Jerome 's University in Waterloo , Ont .""",DISAGREE,"""The cerebral cortex is not sufficiently developed enough in the fetus to feel pain""","""but with a fetus at that maturity you have a very small fetus in a larger capsule of fluid .""",,
36338,9527,"""Most scientists agree that there needs to be a sufficiently developed cerebral cortex in order for pain to be registered as such . The cerebral cortex is not sufficiently developed enough in the fetus to feel pain until roughly the start of the third trimester . Otherwise , the movements of an early fetus or embryo away from a stimulus are simply reflex action . Those of you who might have disected a frog in biology class in High School might have experienced it yourself when seeing the leg of a newly dead frog move under stimulus . For the novice , it may appear to be a reaction to a felt pain but it is not . Here is one link to a comprehensive study on fetal pain made by the American Medical Association : http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/294/8/947""","""GULLIBLE TREATMENT OF TRUMPED UP `` STUDY `` ON FETAL PAIN ISSUE SHOULD EMBARRASS J.A.M.A . AND SOME JOURNALISTS This memo offers a number of points of information regarding the article `` Fetal Pain : A Systematic Multidisciplinary Review of the Evidence , `` published in the August 24 edition of the Journal of the American Medical Association ( JAMA ) . Any of the material below , if not otherwise attributed , can be attributed to NRLC Legislative Director Douglas Johnson ( Legfederal @ aol.com ) , who prepared this memorandum . See this here : http : //www.nrlc.org/abortion/Fetal_P ... uttalJAMA.html The following excerpt is from : http : //abort73.com/HTML/I-A-2a-pain.html `` Sir Albert Lilley , widely considered the `` Father of Fetology `` , and unabashedly pro-life ( as anyone with his vast knowledge of fetal development should be ) makes some remarkable statements about fetal pain in an interview he conducted for the book The Tiniest Humans . Question : In the case of an 8- to-10-week fetus , if you apply pressure will it tend to try to get out of the way ? Answer : Normally it would be extremely difficult , apart from putting a foreign instrument or needle into the uterus to apply pressure , but with a fetus at that maturity you have a very small fetus in a larger capsule of fluid . However , as the famous work of Dr. Davenport Hooker shows , in his many thousands of feet of film , babies at this maturity are responsive to touch . The fetus also responds violently to painful stimuli-needle puncture and injection of cold or of hypertonic solutions- stimuli which you and I find painful , children will tell you are painful , and the neonate , to judge from his responses , finds painful . -- - I have been told by advocates of abortion that we have no proof that the fetus actually feels pain . Strictly , they are quite correct . Pain is a peculiarly personal and subjective experience and there is no biochemical or physiological test we can do to tell that anyone is in pain - a phenomenon which makes it very easy to bear other people 's pain stoically , which is an important point for obstetricians to remember . By the same token we lack any proof that animals feel pain . However , to judge from their responses , it seems charitable to assume they do . Were this not so there would be no point in having an organization like the Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals , and I for one would be unhappy to think we would withhold from the human fetus a charitable consideration we were prepared to extend to animals . Question : The question , then , of pain felt by the fetus - it is your personal opinion , I gather from what you say in your paper , that in effect the fetus does feel pain ? Answer : I can only say that the fetus responds violently to stimuli that you and I would find painful . Bertrand Russell once remarked that a fisherman had told him that fish had neither sense or sensation , but how he knew that the fisherman would not tell him. `` The following excerpt is from : http : //www.theinterim.com/2000/nov/21fetalpain.html `` Dr . Glover 's research in the area of fetal pain is hardly groundbreaking . Sir Albert W. Liley , the pre-eminent fetologist from New Zealand , had no doubt , on the basis of objective evidence , that the fetus has a capacity to feel pain . In 1963 , Dr. Liley , the founder of fetology , developed the first surgical technique for administering intrauterine blood transfusions to the fetus . According to Liley , the fetus feels pain as early as three months . In offering instructions for carrying out the surgical technique of fetal blood transfusions , he advised his colleagues to take into serious consideration this fact of fetal pain . During the actual surgical procedure , the child must be sedated and given pain-relieving medication . Dr. Margaret Liley , wife and assistant to her husband , and a distinguished fetologist and pediatrician in her own right , remarks in her well-known book , Modern Motherhood : When doctors first began invading the sanctuary of the womb , they did not know that the unborn baby would react to pain in the same fashion as a child would . But they soon learned that he would . By no means a  ‘ vegetable ' as he has so often been pictured , the unborn knows perfectly well when he has been hurt , and he will protest it just as violently as would a baby in a crib . In referring to aborting a 12-week-old fetus by dilatation and curettage , ( in which the neck of the womb is dilated and the fetus removed in pieces after the womb has been scraped by a sharp instrument called a curette ) , Dr. Eugene Diamond stated in 1971 : `` When this procedure is done , there is little doubt that the fetus , in fact , feels what is done to it. `` In a comprehensive treatment of fetal pain , published in 1985 in the New England Journal of Medicine , Dr. K. Annand , a Harvard physiologist , stated that the fetus first perceives pain as early as 12 weeks . In a May 1975 piece in Atlantic , Willard Gaylin and Marc Lappe argue for fetal experimentation , which they contend is far less traumatic for the unborn than certain forms of abortion . If society allows a child in the womb to be subjected to `` unimaginable acts of violence , `` they write , such as `` dismemberment , salt-induced osmotic shock , or surgical extirpation , `` how can it balk at fetal experimentation , most forms of which are incomparably more benign . Fetal pain , of course , is a matter of fact , not ideology . Science , of course , should be based on fact , not political correctness . We live in a Therapeutic Culture in which popping pills has become a national pastime . We are only too sensitive about pain , inconvenience , and possibly offending someone . Yet our own ultra-sensitivity to pain does not , in general , extend to the unborn . Are we inconsistent in our war against pain ? Is there a blatant contradiction that runs through the very heart of our Therapeutic Culture ? The answer to this apparent dilemma lies in the fact that there are different levels of pain . Pain exists on a spiritual as well as on a physical level . Of the two , as many psychologists and psychiatrists have averred , the spiritual kind is more difficult to bear . The difference between the two is akin to the difference between pain and suffering . The suffering in one 's soul that can arise from humiliation , guilt , despair , and terror , are formidable . An athlete would rather risk breaking his neck driving for a fly ball than feel the humiliation of being called a wimp . A soldier would rather risk injury and even death , than suffer the shame of dishonor . A Christian would rather mortify himself than experience the disgrace that comes with mortal sin . Defeat , dishonor , disgrace , as a rule , are far more devastating than physical pain . There is a pain that goes with being egregiously wrong ( shame ) or being recklessly immoral ( disgrace ) or being purposely obtuse ( humiliation ) that is more acute than physical pain . Our Therapeutic Culture is not inconsistent . Those who promote abortion want to spare themselves the pain that goes with suffering shame , disgrace , and humiliation . Because of that , they are willing to deny the pain that the aborted baby feels . To acknowledge what abortion really means is too painful for them . They would rather retreat into the presumed security of their comforting ideology . Pain and birth go together in a mysterious way , like death and life , fall and redemption . The birth of a child or the rebirth of an adult requires a certain amount of pain . Birth and redemption both demand pain . Abortion was instituted in an attempt to avoid pain . But it has magnified the very thing it had sought to reduce . We are drowning in a sea of tranquilizers while we increase our suffering . We thought we could eliminate physical suffering , but brought about spiritual torment . The abortion issue , like an ellipse , has two foci : one is the birth of the child ( which is accompanied by pain ) ; the other , the rebirth of the pro-abortionist ( which is accompanied by suffering ) . Part of the painful truth about the abortion issue is that it includes both the unborn and the unrepentant. `` Dr. DeMarco is a professor of philosophy at St. Jerome 's University in Waterloo , Ont .""",DISAGREE,"""pain Here is one link to a comprehensive study on fetal pain made by the American Medical Association : http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/294/8/947""","""GULLIBLE TREATMENT OF TRUMPED UP `` STUDY `` ON FETAL PAIN ISSUE SHOULD EMBARRASS J.A.M.A . AND SOME JOURNALISTS Fetal Pain : A Systematic Multidisciplinary Review of the Evidence , `` published in the August 24 edition of the Journal of the American Medical Association ( JAMA )""",,
36342,9527,"""Most scientists agree that there needs to be a sufficiently developed cerebral cortex in order for pain to be registered as such . The cerebral cortex is not sufficiently developed enough in the fetus to feel pain until roughly the start of the third trimester . Otherwise , the movements of an early fetus or embryo away from a stimulus are simply reflex action . Those of you who might have disected a frog in biology class in High School might have experienced it yourself when seeing the leg of a newly dead frog move under stimulus . For the novice , it may appear to be a reaction to a felt pain but it is not . Here is one link to a comprehensive study on fetal pain made by the American Medical Association : http : //jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/294/8/947""","""GULLIBLE TREATMENT OF TRUMPED UP `` STUDY `` ON FETAL PAIN ISSUE SHOULD EMBARRASS J.A.M.A . AND SOME JOURNALISTS This memo offers a number of points of information regarding the article `` Fetal Pain : A Systematic Multidisciplinary Review of the Evidence , `` published in the August 24 edition of the Journal of the American Medical Association ( JAMA ) . Any of the material below , if not otherwise attributed , can be attributed to NRLC Legislative Director Douglas Johnson ( Legfederal @ aol.com ) , who prepared this memorandum . See this here : http : //www.nrlc.org/abortion/Fetal_P ... uttalJAMA.html The following excerpt is from : http : //abort73.com/HTML/I-A-2a-pain.html `` Sir Albert Lilley , widely considered the `` Father of Fetology `` , and unabashedly pro-life ( as anyone with his vast knowledge of fetal development should be ) makes some remarkable statements about fetal pain in an interview he conducted for the book The Tiniest Humans . Question : In the case of an 8- to-10-week fetus , if you apply pressure will it tend to try to get out of the way ? Answer : Normally it would be extremely difficult , apart from putting a foreign instrument or needle into the uterus to apply pressure , but with a fetus at that maturity you have a very small fetus in a larger capsule of fluid . However , as the famous work of Dr. Davenport Hooker shows , in his many thousands of feet of film , babies at this maturity are responsive to touch . The fetus also responds violently to painful stimuli-needle puncture and injection of cold or of hypertonic solutions- stimuli which you and I find painful , children will tell you are painful , and the neonate , to judge from his responses , finds painful . -- - I have been told by advocates of abortion that we have no proof that the fetus actually feels pain . Strictly , they are quite correct . Pain is a peculiarly personal and subjective experience and there is no biochemical or physiological test we can do to tell that anyone is in pain - a phenomenon which makes it very easy to bear other people 's pain stoically , which is an important point for obstetricians to remember . By the same token we lack any proof that animals feel pain . However , to judge from their responses , it seems charitable to assume they do . Were this not so there would be no point in having an organization like the Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals , and I for one would be unhappy to think we would withhold from the human fetus a charitable consideration we were prepared to extend to animals . Question : The question , then , of pain felt by the fetus - it is your personal opinion , I gather from what you say in your paper , that in effect the fetus does feel pain ? Answer : I can only say that the fetus responds violently to stimuli that you and I would find painful . Bertrand Russell once remarked that a fisherman had told him that fish had neither sense or sensation , but how he knew that the fisherman would not tell him. `` The following excerpt is from : http : //www.theinterim.com/2000/nov/21fetalpain.html `` Dr . Glover 's research in the area of fetal pain is hardly groundbreaking . Sir Albert W. Liley , the pre-eminent fetologist from New Zealand , had no doubt , on the basis of objective evidence , that the fetus has a capacity to feel pain . In 1963 , Dr. Liley , the founder of fetology , developed the first surgical technique for administering intrauterine blood transfusions to the fetus . According to Liley , the fetus feels pain as early as three months . In offering instructions for carrying out the surgical technique of fetal blood transfusions , he advised his colleagues to take into serious consideration this fact of fetal pain . During the actual surgical procedure , the child must be sedated and given pain-relieving medication . Dr. Margaret Liley , wife and assistant to her husband , and a distinguished fetologist and pediatrician in her own right , remarks in her well-known book , Modern Motherhood : When doctors first began invading the sanctuary of the womb , they did not know that the unborn baby would react to pain in the same fashion as a child would . But they soon learned that he would . By no means a  ‘ vegetable ' as he has so often been pictured , the unborn knows perfectly well when he has been hurt , and he will protest it just as violently as would a baby in a crib . In referring to aborting a 12-week-old fetus by dilatation and curettage , ( in which the neck of the womb is dilated and the fetus removed in pieces after the womb has been scraped by a sharp instrument called a curette ) , Dr. Eugene Diamond stated in 1971 : `` When this procedure is done , there is little doubt that the fetus , in fact , feels what is done to it. `` In a comprehensive treatment of fetal pain , published in 1985 in the New England Journal of Medicine , Dr. K. Annand , a Harvard physiologist , stated that the fetus first perceives pain as early as 12 weeks . In a May 1975 piece in Atlantic , Willard Gaylin and Marc Lappe argue for fetal experimentation , which they contend is far less traumatic for the unborn than certain forms of abortion . If society allows a child in the womb to be subjected to `` unimaginable acts of violence , `` they write , such as `` dismemberment , salt-induced osmotic shock , or surgical extirpation , `` how can it balk at fetal experimentation , most forms of which are incomparably more benign . Fetal pain , of course , is a matter of fact , not ideology . Science , of course , should be based on fact , not political correctness . We live in a Therapeutic Culture in which popping pills has become a national pastime . We are only too sensitive about pain , inconvenience , and possibly offending someone . Yet our own ultra-sensitivity to pain does not , in general , extend to the unborn . Are we inconsistent in our war against pain ? Is there a blatant contradiction that runs through the very heart of our Therapeutic Culture ? The answer to this apparent dilemma lies in the fact that there are different levels of pain . Pain exists on a spiritual as well as on a physical level . Of the two , as many psychologists and psychiatrists have averred , the spiritual kind is more difficult to bear . The difference between the two is akin to the difference between pain and suffering . The suffering in one 's soul that can arise from humiliation , guilt , despair , and terror , are formidable . An athlete would rather risk breaking his neck driving for a fly ball than feel the humiliation of being called a wimp . A soldier would rather risk injury and even death , than suffer the shame of dishonor . A Christian would rather mortify himself than experience the disgrace that comes with mortal sin . Defeat , dishonor , disgrace , as a rule , are far more devastating than physical pain . There is a pain that goes with being egregiously wrong ( shame ) or being recklessly immoral ( disgrace ) or being purposely obtuse ( humiliation ) that is more acute than physical pain . Our Therapeutic Culture is not inconsistent . Those who promote abortion want to spare themselves the pain that goes with suffering shame , disgrace , and humiliation . Because of that , they are willing to deny the pain that the aborted baby feels . To acknowledge what abortion really means is too painful for them . They would rather retreat into the presumed security of their comforting ideology . Pain and birth go together in a mysterious way , like death and life , fall and redemption . The birth of a child or the rebirth of an adult requires a certain amount of pain . Birth and redemption both demand pain . Abortion was instituted in an attempt to avoid pain . But it has magnified the very thing it had sought to reduce . We are drowning in a sea of tranquilizers while we increase our suffering . We thought we could eliminate physical suffering , but brought about spiritual torment . The abortion issue , like an ellipse , has two foci : one is the birth of the child ( which is accompanied by pain ) ; the other , the rebirth of the pro-abortionist ( which is accompanied by suffering ) . Part of the painful truth about the abortion issue is that it includes both the unborn and the unrepentant. `` Dr. DeMarco is a professor of philosophy at St. Jerome 's University in Waterloo , Ont .""",DISAGREE,"""Otherwise , the movements of an early fetus or embryo away from a stimulus are simply reflex action""","""We thought we could eliminate physical suffering , but brought about spiritual torment .""",,
36357,9530,"""That 's right , a higher view of the fetus than there currently is typically in our culture . I have no problem with anyone referring to it that way .""","""Or in any culture . Women abort WORLDWIDE you know jyoshu . For what it 's worth , I certainly AM bothered by this if it 's true . I 'd like to see the source where you got that information about the abortion rate climbing under Bush 's presidency , if you would . http : //www.nytimes.com/2004/10/30/op ... d % 2fColumnists ( sorry about the long address - also you may need to register , but it 's free ) and an interesting article on http : //www.myrtlebeachonline.com/mld ... on/9924004.htm""",DISAGREE,"""That 's right , a higher view of the fetus than there currently is typically in our culture .""","""Or in any culture . Women abort WORLDWIDE you know jyoshu . For what it 's worth , I certainly AM bothered by this if it 's true .""",,
36361,9531,"""Ah so , the extremely biased right wing rag owned by cult leader Sun Myung Moon , founder of the Unification Church cult which believes that Moon is the Christ .""","""It 's been reported in the Telegraph as well as several other news outlets . Want to slander them as well or do you want to try to disprove their story based on its content . I suggest the former , because the University has already confirmed the authenticity of the e-mails and documents .""",DISAGREE,"""the extremely biased right wing rag owned by cult leader Sun Myung Moon ,""","""already confirmed the authenticity of the e-mails and documents""",,
36388,9535,"""From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that . Your clearly very wrong .""","""Then why does the NRA use that quote at this link ? http : //www.nraila.org/Issues/FactShe ... ad.aspx ? ID=108""",DISAGREE,"""From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that .""","""Then why does the NRA use that quote at this link ?""",,
36410,9539,"""BTW , if you have no problem with gay marriage between two biologically related gay people , then you are sick . Lets see how many are sick enough to be FOR marriage between two biologically related gay men/women , such as brothers/sisters , who are at age of consent . I am consistent . I am ONLY for traditional marriage ... between a man and a woman . No gay marriage of any type , thank you .""","""Actually it seems you are the one that is sick . You have this obsession with what others do with their sex life and want the government to try and prevent any kind of sex you don ’ t approve of . It looks like you are trying hard to repress homosexual desires you have . Otherwise why do you care what others do when it doesn ’ t affect you ? I 'm not for or against what other adults do with their consentual sex life . It 's none of my business .""",DISAGREE,"""BTW , if you have no problem with gay marriage between two biologically related gay people , then you are sick .""","""Actually it seems you are the one that is sick .""",,
36429,9543,"""And since they each orgnansim is constructed in a way that all are physically equally able to breed , then the process of who breeds is essentially a random process .""","""Not all `` orgnansims `` are able to breed . Some are sterile ( mules or ones with mutations ) , some die in the `` lottery `` ( which is biased against certain traits ) , and some simply breed less ( those who ca n't get as much food , for example ) .""",DISAGREE,"""And since they each orgnansim is constructed in a way that all are physically equally able to breed""","""Not all `` orgnansims `` are able to breed . Some are sterile ( mules or ones with mutations ) , some die in the `` lottery ``""",,
36444,9549,"""Are you an acolyte of McIntyre and McKitrick , perchance ?""","""Are you actually suggesting that McIntyre and McKitrick are the only voices which oppose the fraud of man made global warming ? How about the actual scientists who reject the media promotion of this issue ? Here 's an excerpt : Climatologists Reject Media Claims of Global Warming Consensus `` [ i ] n November 2004 , German climatologist Hans von Storch , director of the GKSS Institute for Coastal Research ( IfK ) in Geesthacht , Germany , foresaw that claims of alarmist consensus would be made by nonscientists ... `` Environment & amp ; Climate News > August 2005 Environment Environment > Climate : Consensus Email a Friend Written By : Alan Caruba Published In : Environment & amp ; Climate News > August 2005 Publication date : 08/01/2005 Publisher : The Heartland Institute Leading climatologists spent the month of June fighting false proclamations from non-scientists claiming scientists have reached agreement that catastrophic global warming is occurring . Alarmists Claim Debate Over On June 1 , California Gov . Arnold Schwarzenegger ( R ) claimed `` the debate is over `` and global warming alarmists ' predictions had carried the day . The Natural Resources Defense Council on June 9 declared , `` The world 's leading scientists now agree that global warming is real and is happening right now . According to their forecasts , extreme changes in climate could produce a future in which erratic and chaotic weather , melting ice caps and rising sea levels usher in an era of drought , crop failure , famine , flood and mass extinctions. `` On June 13 , USA Today declared , `` The debate 's over : Globe is Warming. `` In support of its claim , the newspaper cited the positions of some left-leaning religious groups , some corporations who will reap a financial windfall from a switch to alternative fuel sources , and some politicians . Scientists Disagree While each of the above claims from non-scientists received significant media coverage , leading climatologists spent the month of June rebutting such proclamations . Atmospheric physicist S. Fred Singer , professor emeritus of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia and former director of the U.S . Weather Satellite Service , sent a letter to the editor of USA Today directly refuting its claim . '' Your editorial ... claim [ s ] the global warming debate is over . Not so , `` wrote Singer . Singer wrote , `` Sea level will continue to rise by only seven inches per century as it has for thousands of years no matter what we do or what the EPA [ U.S. Environmental Protection Agency ] says . And temperatures in the next 100 years will likely rise by less than one degree F -- not exactly a catastrophe. `` Added Singer in a subsequent letter to the Canadian media , `` Thousands of scientists from many countries now fully understand that Kyoto and other efforts to control human emissions of carbon dioxide ( CO2 ) are ineffective and entirely unfounded scientifically . '' Even if you ignore the enormous cost of Kyoto ( estimated recently by Prof. George Taylor of Oregon State University -- see http : //www.sitewave.net/news/s49p628.htm -- at one trillion U.S. dollars a year for full implementation in OECD countries ) , climate science research is rapidly moving AWAY from the hypothesis that the human release of greenhouse gases , specifically CO2 , is in any way significantly contributing to global climate change. `` Sun Called Primary Cause `` If we just look at the historical data , there is a scientific consensus that the global mean temperature has risen modestly during the twentieth century , `` said Myron Ebell , director of global warming and environmental policy at the Competitive Enterprise Institute . '' The impacts have been small and probably beneficial in aggregate . This historical data puts the onus of demonstration on those who think this gradual warming trend will accelerate and lead to dire consequences. `` The controlling driver of global temperature fluctuations , according to Dr. Benny Peiser of England 's John Moore 's University , is solar ray activity . '' Six eminent researchers from the Russian Academy of Science and the Israel Space Agency have just published a startling paper in one of the world 's leading space science journals . The team of solar physicists claims to have come up with compelling evidence that changes in cosmic ray intensity and variations in solar activity have been driving much of the Earth 's climate , `` Peiser was quoted as saying in the May 17 National Post . Moreover , reports Peiser , Jan Veizer , one of Canada 's top earth scientists , published a comprehensive review of recent findings and concluded , `` empirical observations on all time scales point to celestial phenomena as the principal driver of climate , with greenhouse gases acting only as potential amplifiers. `` Added Peiser , `` In fact , the explicit and implicit rejection of the 'consensus ' is not restricted to individual scientists . It also includes distinguished scientific organizations such as the Russian Academy of Science and the U.S. Association of State Climatologists , both of which are highly skeptical of the whole idea . '' Heartland Institute - Article And here 's more : Renowned Scientist Defects From Belief in Global Warming – Caps Year of Vindication for Skeptics October 17 , 2006 October 17 , 2006 Washington DC - One of the most decorated French geophysicists has converted from a believer in manmade catastrophic global warming to a climate skeptic . This latest defector from the global warming camp caps a year in which numerous scientific studies have bolstered the claims of climate skeptics . Scientific studies that debunk the dire predictions of human-caused global warming have continued to accumulate and many believe the new science is shattering the media-promoted scientific  “ consensus ” on climate alarmism . Claude Allegre , a former government official and an active member of France ’ s Socialist Party , wrote an editorial on September 21 , 2006 in the French newspaper L'Express titled  “ The Snows of Kilimanjaro ” ( For English Translation , click here : U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works ) detailing his newfound skepticism about manmade global warming . See : http : //www.lexpress.fr/idees/tribune ... asp ? ida=451670 Allegre wrote that the  “ cause of climate change remains unknown ” and pointed out that Kilimanjaro is not losing snow due to global warming , but to local land use and precipitation changes . Allegre also pointed out that studies show that Antarctic snowfall rate has been stable over the past 30 years and the continent is actually gaining ice .  “ Following the month of August experienced by the northern half of France , the prophets of doom of global warming will have a lot on their plate in order to make our fellow countrymen swallow their certitudes ,  ” Allegre wrote . He also accused proponents of manmade catastrophic global warming of being motivated by money , noting that  “ the ecology of helpless protesting has become a very lucrative business for some people !  ” Allegre , a member of both the French and U.S. Academy of Sciences , had previously expressed concern about manmade global warming . '' By burning fossil fuels , man enhanced the concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere which has raised the global mean temperature by half a degree in the last century , `` Allegre wrote 20 years ago . In addition , Allegre was one of 1500 scientists who signed a November 18 , 1992 letter titled  “ World Scientists ' Warning to Humanity ” in which the scientists warned that global warming ’ s  “ potential risks are very great. ” See : Warning to Humanity Allegre has authored more than 100 scientific articles , written 11 books and received numerous scientific awards including the Goldschmidt Medal from the Geochemical Society of the United States . Allegre 's conversion to a climate skeptic comes at a time when global warming alarmists have insisted that there is a  “ consensus ” about manmade global warming . Proponents of global warming have ratcheted up the level of rhetoric on climate skeptics recently . An environmental magazine in September called for Nuremberg-style trials for global warming skeptics and CBS News  “ 60 Minutes ” correspondent Scott Pelley compared skeptics to  “ Holocaust deniers. ” See : U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works & amp ; Scott Pelley And Catherine Herrick On Global Warming Coverage - Public Eye In addition , former Vice President Al Gore has repeatedly referred to skeptics as `` global warming deniers. `` This increase in rhetorical flourish comes at a time when new climate science research continues to unravel the global warming alarmists ’ computer model predictions of future climatic doom and vindicate skeptics . 60 Scientists Debunk Global Warming Fears Earlier this year , a group of prominent scientists came forward to question the so-called  “ consensus ” that the Earth faces a  “ climate emergency. ” On April 6 , 2006 , 60 scientists wrote a letter to the Canadian Prime Minister asserting that the science is deteriorating from underneath global warming alarmists .  “ Observational evidence does not support today 's computer climate models , so there is little reason to trust model predictions of the futureÂ…Significant [ scientific ] advances have been made since the [ Kyoto ] protocol was created , many of which are taking us away from a concern about increasing greenhouse gases . If , back in the mid-1990s , we knew what we know today about climate , Kyoto would almost certainly not exist , because we would have concluded it was not necessary ,  ” the 60 scientists wrote . See : Open Kyoto to debate  “ It was only 30 years ago that many of today 's global-warming alarmists were telling us that the world was in the midst of a global-cooling catastrophe . But the science continued to evolve , and still does , even though so many choose to ignore it when it does not fit with predetermined political agendas ,  ” the 60 scientists concluded .. : U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works : : Press Room : . So in conclusion , as the alleged science of evolution is based solely on pre-determined assumptions , so is the myth of Global Warming .""",DISAGREE,"""Are you an acolyte of McIntyre and McKitrick , perchance ?""","""Are you actually suggesting that McIntyre and McKitrick are the only voices which oppose the fraud of man made global warming ?""",,
36454,9551,"""I live in a place where local evening news includes a story about children being shot or killed at least weekly . Shot by whom ? Adults , other children , gang related , accidents , suicides , unintended target , etc. ? just telling us `` shot or killed `` does n't really tell us anything . Also , if you do n't mind a city name or general area of where you live would be helpfull .""","""Most times children have been shot simply for living in a neighborhood with active gangs . Sometimes on the street , sometimes through the wall of their homes . Unintended targets often but also intended but without cause . I live in Los Angeles .""",AGREE,"""I live in a place where local evening news includes a story about children being shot or killed at least weekly . Shot by whom ? Adults , other children , gang related , accidents , suicides , unintended target , etc. ? just telling us `` shot or killed `` does n't really tell us anything .""","""Most times children have been shot simply for living in a neighborhood with active gangs . Sometimes on the street , sometimes through the wall of their homes . Unintended targets often but also intended but without cause . I live in Los Angeles .""",,
36470,9553,"""Besides that , selection on the individual level is completely random ...""","""Actually , it 's not . Mutations are random . Selection is differential reproductive success .""",DISAGREE,"""Besides that , selection on the individual level is completely random""","""Mutations are random . Selection is differential reproductive success .""",,
36472,9554,"""Heh ? That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""","""Try going to a concert , party , club , and see if the guy selling weed is on the opposite end of the guy selling coke .... doubtful ( unless it is second hand ) as weed has no real value compared to coke and what not . The whole leads to something for a better high is pretty dependable .. many crack heads will tell you that they wanted a better high but that does n't mean every pot head will go to crack . HBO had a good special about this some time back .""",DISAGREE,"""Heh ? That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""","""Try going to a concert , party , club , and see if the guy selling weed is on the opposite end of the guy selling coke .... doubtful ( unless it is second hand ) as weed has no real value compared to coke and what not .""",,
36475,9554,"""Heh ? That 's news to me . Most potheads I know smoke in parks , while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""","""Try going to a concert , party , club , and see if the guy selling weed is on the opposite end of the guy selling coke .... doubtful ( unless it is second hand ) as weed has no real value compared to coke and what not . The whole leads to something for a better high is pretty dependable .. many crack heads will tell you that they wanted a better high but that does n't mean every pot head will go to crack . HBO had a good special about this some time back .""",DISAGREE,"""while heroin/cocaine addicts do n't use their drugs in public for somewhat obvious reasons .""","""Try going to a concert , party , club , and see if the guy selling weed is on the opposite end of the guy selling coke .""",,
36483,9556,"""You could n't tear your way out of your own rectum . You do n't scare me , Immigrant-Boy .""","""That is the apex of your understanding and 'uneducated ' assessment rolled up in a one liner . Proof that you again have nothing relevent to say . Instead of a troll , you surely must be designated a hobbit . Once you got past the stage of beating things with stone tools , you regressed once again to your true level of incompetence and incontinence . Perhaps you should follow your own advice you keep philandering on the board without rhyme nor reason , holding the mirror up and full of sound and fury ... signifying NOTHING . Is that yet another of your famouse `` strawmen `` filled with red herrings ? Poor insignificant creature that you are living in a failed state which you call civilized measured by your loss of rights just as any other gun grabber anti-Constitutionalist .""",DISAGREE,"""You could n't tear your way out of your own rectum .""","""Once you got past the stage of beating things with stone""",,
36488,9557,"""I would think you 'd want to know WHY he 's against gay marriage . Particularly since he 's your preferred candidate , and gay marriage seems to be a very important issue to you . But hey , maybe you do n't care !""","""Actually , no . I do n't care why he 's against gay marriage . Pragmatically , what does it benefit to know ? You keep trying to make an issue over why quizzing Palin and not Biden . Biden 's position is plain . I do n't see any confusion on it . A while back another poster on another forum argued with me that Palin was not against gays . That she was supportive . I do n't see it . Last night she had a chance to clarify , but she chose not to . Her response was thoroughly devoid of any useful information , except to show me that she is n't the biggest anti-gay advocate I could imagine , and that she is against gay marriage which I already knew . Palin had a chance last night to help eliminate any confusion on her position . She chose not to . I do n't see any confusion on Biden 's position . While it 's not what I would ultimately want , it 's the best option out there in this presidential race .""",DISAGREE,"""I would think you 'd want to know WHY he 's against gay marriage .""","""Actually , no . I do n't care why he 's against gay marriage .""",,
36492,9558,"""That 's kind of true . The Roman Catholic church is considered not credible based on it 's support of lies , not because they archaically force their priests to act like they do n't want some , then a significant percentage of the preists fondle and abuse their flock as a result of a. being sexually repressed by their mythical laws b. close proximity to young kids c. in a position of power/trust among kids d. for all the other average reasons people do things like that . Kind of reminds us all that made-up laws and made-up law enforcement lead to nothing . Reality however , where we do have and enforce laws , actually has meaning . The conclusion is , yes indeed , the catholic church is unfit to rule anything , and anyone looking to a house of superstision for answers to life 's real problems , is not firing on all cylinders . I mean really , we could sift through some chicken guts and find the answers according to some religious shaman .. no difference really . -Mach""","""Mach , Let me first say that you may be dealing more with chicken brains than in chicken guts in light of your most recent post . But if you can find in reading chicken guts , the richness and depth of thought that you find in the Catholic Church , then you are indeed a powerful mystic and soothsayer . The Church and its priests do not seek to erase the love and sexual feelings that men naturally have toward women ( in your words they do not seek to act like they do n't `` want some `` ) . They seek to control them and sacrifice them for a higher love . They are not pretending that they do not exist . If they do n't then you are probably dealing with an unhealthy individual who may not be fit for the priesthood . Secondly , there is much basis to the Catholic Church 's teachings on celibacy . It is not without foundation . These are not made up laws with made up enforcement . Thirdly , if you believe celibacy to be related to the perversion of pedophilia then I have a few questions for you : Have you ever had thoughts of having sex with a child when you were in a celibate period in your life ? Would being in close proximity to children in a position of authority instigate in you inclinations to molest children ? If for some reason , your significant other died or lived but for health reasons could no longer have sex would you consider pedophilia as a normal sexual outlet/interaction ? If you were required to be celibate your entire life do you think that you would be attracted to children ? And if celibacy is the problem then why does pedophilia occur in Protestant congregations at a similar rate when the pastor is not required to be celibate ? Pedophilia is a perversion , a sickness , a disorder . It has little to do with celibacy .""",DISAGREE,"""The Roman Catholic church is considered not credible based on it 's support of lies , not because they archaically force their priests to act like they do n't want some , then a significant percentage of the preists fondle and abuse their flock""","""The Church and its priests do not seek to erase the love and sexual feelings that men naturally have toward women ( in your words they do not seek to act like they do n't `` want some `` ) . They seek to control them and sacrifice them for a higher love .""",,
36519,9563,"""I 'm really looking forward to your providing of this . Until then , you are n't worth my time , strawman .""","""It helps to know what a strawman is before you accuse someone of using it . Your argument is no different then the one I presented .""",DISAGREE,"""Until then , you are n't worth my time , strawman .""","""Your argument is no different then the one I presented .""",,
36530,9564,"""In reality , there are no concrete 'reasons ' for believing in God . If you believe in God , you believe based on faith . There is no incontrovertible physical evidence anywhere to even suggest that God exists ... unless you first believe through faith that God exists .""","""This statement is wrong . People from hundreds of years before Jesus was born prophesied that a baby would be born , in Bethlehem , of a virgin . There were over 50 more prophesies that were made about his life , and the sacrafice he made to pay for the sins of man , and the bigest one of all ... He completely fufilled scripture when he rose from the dead . These men were inspired by Jesus , God , how can you argue that he is not the christ ? The odds of one man filling all the prophesies is impossible . And these scriptures have been unchanged for the past 2000-2500 approx years ! Thats proof for me that Jesus existed and that he is God . PM me if you like .""",DISAGREE,"""In reality , there are no concrete 'reasons ' for believing in God .""","""This statement is wrong .""",,
36535,9565,"""in creating the feature depends upon the existence - the plentiful existence - of proximate intermediate features .""","""Well , that 's a bald assertion , and although it may even be true , I can not accept it at face value . You 'll have to take little time and explain to a non-scientist , amateur ontologist , just what it is that you intend that we should understand from these words , and why we should accept that understanding as true .""",DISAGREE,"""creating the feature the plentiful existence""","""that 's a bald assertion I can not accept it at face value""",,
36546,9566,"""So easy to do in America , a nation which refuses to acknowledge the need for responsible gun ownership .""","""Well if it 's so easy then how about you provide the names of the dealers who 're selling howitzers and anti-aircraft missiles and fragmentation grenades ? And while you 're at it , supply the names of the companies who 're making them in violation of the various federal restrictions .""",DISAGREE,"""So easy to do in America""","""if it 's so easy then how about you provide the names of the dealers who 're selling howitzers and anti-aircraft missiles and fragmentation grenades ?""",,
36550,9566,"""So easy to do in America , a nation which refuses to acknowledge the need for responsible gun ownership .""","""Well if it 's so easy then how about you provide the names of the dealers who 're selling howitzers and anti-aircraft missiles and fragmentation grenades ? And while you 're at it , supply the names of the companies who 're making them in violation of the various federal restrictions .""",DISAGREE,"""a nation which refuses to acknowledge the need for responsible gun ownership .""","""Well if it 's so easy then how about you provide the names of the dealers""",,
36560,9567,"""I would either put them in an institute to determine why they committed their crime ,""","""Some people commit crimes on accident , some do it for revenge , some do it out of fear , and some do it for fun .""",AGREE,"""determine why they committed their crime""","""Some people commit crimes on accident""",,
36562,9568,"""Let 's assume such a asseration is correct . That if the majority wants something , that it is free to make any such laws , even if the strip specific individuals of any and all rights . Under your logic , you must therefore support any action by the majority that wants to tar , feather and quater any user who goes by the name of VTcruiser [ /b ]""","""Well , that is obsurd and you know it yourself .. If you are going to make arguments , at least make ones that matter .""",DISAGREE,"""That if the majority wants something , that it is free to make any such laws""","""If you are going to make arguments , at least make ones that matter .""",,
36564,9568,"""Let 's assume such a asseration is correct . That if the majority wants something , that it is free to make any such laws , even if the strip specific individuals of any and all rights . Under your logic , you must therefore support any action by the majority that wants to tar , feather and quater any user who goes by the name of VTcruiser [ /b ]""","""Well , that is obsurd and you know it yourself .. If you are going to make arguments , at least make ones that matter .""",DISAGREE,"""That if the majority wants something , that it is free to make any such laws ,""","""that is obsurd and you know it yourself .""",,
36565,9568,"""Let 's assume such a asseration is correct . That if the majority wants something , that it is free to make any such laws , even if the strip specific individuals of any and all rights . Under your logic , you must therefore support any action by the majority that wants to tar , feather and quater any user who goes by the name of VTcruiser [ /b ]""","""Well , that is obsurd and you know it yourself .. If you are going to make arguments , at least make ones that matter .""",DISAGREE,"""assume such a asseration to make any such laws""","""that is obsurd and you know it yourself""",,
36589,9571,"""...... it 's a follower of life and is manipulated by who we are .""","""BWAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH . That 's good .""",DISAGREE,"""it 's a follower of life and is manipulated by who we are .""","""That 's good .""",,
36600,9573,"""I knew that there were other reasons that I did n't care for you . Thank you for elucidating them . And , Jitobear , this is exactly what I was saying when I spouted the abortion statistics in the US . The bulk of abortions in the US are for selfish reasons .""","""I know I know . Unless a woman is gestating or dieing she is being selfish .""",DISAGREE,"""when I spouted the abortion statistics in the US . The bulk of abortions in the US are for selfish reasons .""","""Unless a woman is gestating or dieing she is being selfish .""",,
36636,9586,"""I believe that there is no god because I see no compelling evidence .""","""I believe there has to be a God because I see no compelling evidence that life spontaneously generated from non living chemicals .""",DISAGREE,"""I believe that there is no god because I see no compelling evidence .""","""I believe there has to be a God because I see no compelling evidence that life spontaneously generated from non living chemicals .""",,
36644,9588,"""Can you explain to me what that is ? I 've never been able to get a straight answer . In particular , what was supposed to have happened , and when ?""","""The ID movements form of ID states that there are `` large gaps `` in the theory of evolution that can only be explained by the presence of a supernatural designer . Behe is happy to think that it is the christian god ( like the rest of them ) , but they ar n't allowed to say that , because if they do , they violate that annoying ammendment ! The ID argument is not scientific , because it 's not falsifiable , and has no supporting evidence . The ID movement relies solely on LACK of evidence for evolution , which is complete bunk . Just because we do n't know yet , it does n't mean that godditit . ( Incedentally , most of Behe 's claims of `` Irreducible Complexity `` are already destroyed by science , as DamEtel will be more than happy to explain . )""",AGREE,"""In particular , what was supposed to have happened , and when""","""The ID movements form of ID states that there are `` large gaps `` in the theory of evolution that can only be explained by the presence of a supernatural designer . Behe is happy to think that it is the christian god ( like the rest of them ) , but they ar n't allowed to say that , because if they do , they violate that annoying ammendment ! The ID argument is not scientific , because it 's not falsifiable , and has no supporting evidence .""",,
36643,9588,"""Can you explain to me what that is ? I 've never been able to get a straight answer . In particular , what was supposed to have happened , and when ?""","""The ID movements form of ID states that there are `` large gaps `` in the theory of evolution that can only be explained by the presence of a supernatural designer . Behe is happy to think that it is the christian god ( like the rest of them ) , but they ar n't allowed to say that , because if they do , they violate that annoying ammendment ! The ID argument is not scientific , because it 's not falsifiable , and has no supporting evidence . The ID movement relies solely on LACK of evidence for evolution , which is complete bunk . Just because we do n't know yet , it does n't mean that godditit . ( Incedentally , most of Behe 's claims of `` Irreducible Complexity `` are already destroyed by science , as DamEtel will be more than happy to explain . )""",AGREE,"""I 've never been able to get a straight answer . In particular , what was supposed to have happened , and when ?""","""The ID argument is not scientific , because it 's not falsifiable , and has no supporting evidence . The ID movement relies solely on LACK of evidence for evolution , which is complete bunk .""",,
36645,9589,"""Anyone starting from this materialist point of view will be unable to deal with the essential reality of intelligence and all other psychical qualities , properties , traits as real causes , or to attribute their observable and observed effects on material entities back to them , rather than to the motion of particles in space .""","""But you see , for the materialist , there is no distinction between `` intelligence `` and `` the motion of physical particles in space `` , its not an either/or proposition - they may well say `` He scored 155 on the IQ test because he is intelligent ( by intelligent , meaning his brain has certain physical characteristics ) .""",DISAGREE,"""Anyone starting from this materialist point of view will be unable to deal with the essential reality of intelligence and all other psychical qualities , properties , traits as real causes , or to attribute their observable and observed effects on material entities back to them""","""But you see , for the materialist , there is no distinction between `` intelligence `` and `` the motion of physical particles in space `` , its not an either/or proposition""",,
36648,9590,"""gay marriage : is n't one of the main points of being gay , besides the ' i was born this way'-ism kind of a way to tell convention to go shove it ? as far as i 'm concerned , marriage is simply a way of providing a stable home life for children , thus giving them a better chance of succeeding outside the home . and it does n't always work ! look at the divorce rates- whats the average marriage length now , two or three years ? while we 're on it , why are you fighting for state sanctions anyway ? is it tax benefits or something ? i simply ca n't understand this , and its driving me up the wall ! so far i 've seen you guys ( and girls , or whatever you would prefer that i refer to you as ) say 'to hell with the system ! we 're outside it , we do n't need it ! ' and then you turn around and say 'we want back in ! give us this this and this , or we 'll have gay pride parades and march on washington ! ' would somebody care to explain this to me so i can go about my life in a slightly more politically correct manner ?""","""Well you 're right , the gay pride movement embodies counter-culturalism . It does n't take a rocket scientist to see that . In my opinion it 's another outgrowth of the sexual revolution taken to the extreme .""",AGREE,"""so far i 've seen you guys ( and girls , or whatever you would prefer that i refer to you as ) say 'to hell with the system ! we 're outside it , we do n't need it ! ' and then you turn around and say 'we want back in ! give us this this and this , or we 'll have gay pride parades and march on washington ! ' would somebody care to explain this to me so i can go about my life in a slightly more politically correct manner ?""","""Well you 're right , the gay pride movement embodies counter-culturalism . It does n't take a rocket scientist to see that . In my opinion it 's another outgrowth of the sexual revolution taken to the extreme .""",,
36649,9590,"""gay marriage : is n't one of the main points of being gay , besides the ' i was born this way'-ism kind of a way to tell convention to go shove it ? as far as i 'm concerned , marriage is simply a way of providing a stable home life for children , thus giving them a better chance of succeeding outside the home . and it does n't always work ! look at the divorce rates- whats the average marriage length now , two or three years ? while we 're on it , why are you fighting for state sanctions anyway ? is it tax benefits or something ? i simply ca n't understand this , and its driving me up the wall ! so far i 've seen you guys ( and girls , or whatever you would prefer that i refer to you as ) say 'to hell with the system ! we 're outside it , we do n't need it ! ' and then you turn around and say 'we want back in ! give us this this and this , or we 'll have gay pride parades and march on washington ! ' would somebody care to explain this to me so i can go about my life in a slightly more politically correct manner ?""","""Well you 're right , the gay pride movement embodies counter-culturalism . It does n't take a rocket scientist to see that . In my opinion it 's another outgrowth of the sexual revolution taken to the extreme .""",AGREE,"""gay marriage : is n't one of the main points of being gay , kind of a way to tell convention to go shove it we 'll have gay pride parades""","""Well you 're right , the gay pride movement embodies counter-culturalism it 's another outgrowth of the sexual revolution taken to the extreme .""",,
36652,9591,"""A gay man can marry any woman that will have him . A lesbian can marry any man that will have her . You are not denied the right to marry ... so long as you comply with the rules of marriage ... including the one about one male and one female .""","""Frankly , that 's like saying `` You ca n't be Jewish , but you can pick any sect of Christianity you want to . You ca n't wear a star of david , but you can wear a cross . So that 's * equal * `` ... You 're saying we can marry HETEROSEXUALLY , so HOMOSEXUALS must pretend that 's equal ? ? ? Makes no sense ...""",DISAGREE,"""You are not denied the right to marry ... so long as you comply with the rules of marriage ... including the one about one male and one female""","""'re saying we can marry HETEROSEXUALLY , so HOMOSEXUALS must pretend that 's equal ? ? ? Makes no sense ...""",,
36660,9592,"""The moral values of the Judeo Christian religion simply get in the way of so much that science wants to do .""","""Well , maybe some people 's idea of Judeo-Christian . I know a lot of them got extremely angry when science showed that there are no biological human races . I 'm thinking you 're upset about what some people want to apply the new knowledge to do . Science is n't about application . Talk to doctors and engineers .""",DISAGREE,"""The moral values of the Judeo Christian religion simply get in the way of so much that science wants to do .""","""Well , maybe some people 's idea of Judeo-Christian .""",,
36661,9593,"""You mean where the judge did the job she 's paid to do by ruling on the constitutionality of a law ? Or is this only a problem when it 's laws that you like that are ruled unconstitutional ?""","""When it 's obviously a law that 's not unconstitutional , then it 's obvious the judge was biased in the ruling . A strict constitutionalist would never overturn a law like that , as the constitution does not define marriage .""",DISAGREE,"""is this only a problem when it 's laws that you like that are ruled unconstitutional ?""","""A strict constitutionalist would never overturn a law like that , as the constitution does not define marriage .""",,
36666,9594,"""Evoluition : Change in allele frequency in a population over time . So .... where is your tautology , mutually exclusive theory , and redundant terms ? I 'm not seeing it there . Still no reply ? Did you miss it ? That 's OK if you did , I understand you 're busy cutting and pasting the entire literary works of the last century ( Without having read them all oddly enough ) . -Mach""","""No I did n't miss it , I was hoping you 'd actually put forward an argument against what I said , not what you think I said . See what I actually said was the tautology . Then make your argument . Note Post 30""",DISAGREE,"""Change in allele frequency in a population over time . So .... where is your tautology , mutually exclusive theory""","""No I did n't miss it , I was hoping you 'd actually put forward an argument against what I said , not what you think I said""",,
36675,9595,"""Truth has amazing properties Lurch . It can not be decided by majority votes or `` scientific `` speculations .""","""And it ca n't be detected by mindless clutching at mythology .""",DISAGREE,"""Truth has amazing properties can not be decided by majority votes or `` scientific `` speculations .""","""it ca n't be detected by mindless clutching at mythology .""",,
36682,9597,"""? ? What are you trying to say ?""","""That evolutionist call on the god of time and chance , The Almighty IT to explain what can not be observed or tested . Little insignificant changes turned fish into amphibians long ago and far far away .""",DISAGREE,"""What are you trying to say ?""","""evolutionist call on the god of time and chance IT to explain what can not be observed or tested""",,
36683,9597,"""? ? What are you trying to say ?""","""That evolutionist call on the god of time and chance , The Almighty IT to explain what can not be observed or tested . Little insignificant changes turned fish into amphibians long ago and far far away .""",DISAGREE,"""What are you trying to say ?""","""Little insignificant changes turned""",,
36720,9613,"""If your god were to 'destroy his creations ' because they are 'flawed ' , how come any one of us is still here ? Smiley""","""Because God is free to show grace to some and judgement to others . It is what makes Him God and we ca n't begin to understand His perspective . He is not obliged to explain His eternal perspective to us at all .""",DISAGREE,"""If your god were to 'destroy his creations ' because they are 'flawed ' , how come any one of us is still here ?""","""Because God is free to show grace to some and judgement to others""",,
36731,9615,"""Modern evolutionary synthesis From Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia • Learn more about using Wikipedia for research • Jump to : navigation , search The modern evolutionary synthesis refers to a set of ideas from several biological specialities that were brought together to form a unified theory of evolution accepted by the great majority of working biologists . This synthesis was produced over a period of about a decade ( 1936-1947 ) and was closely connected with the development from 1918 to 1932 of the discipline of population genetics , which integrated the theory of natural selection with Mendelian genetics . Julian Huxley invented the term , when he summarised the ideas in his book , Evolution : The Modern Synthesis in 1942 . Though the 'Modern Synthesis ' is the basis of current evolutionary thinking , it refers to a historical event that took place in the 1930s and 1940s . Major figures in the development of the modern synthesis include R. A. Fisher , Theodosius Dobzhansky , J.B.S . Haldane , Sewall Wright , Julian Huxley , Ernst Mayr , Bernhard Rensch , George Gaylord Simpson , and G. Ledyard Stebbins . The modern synthesis solved difficulties and confusions caused by the specialisation and poor communication between biologists in the early years of the twentieth century . Discoveries of early geneticists were difficult to reconcile with gradual evolution and the mechanism of natural selection . The synthesis reconciled the two schools of thought , while providing evidence that studies of populations in the field were crucial to evolutionary theory . It drew together ideas from several branches of biology that had become separated , particularly genetics , cytology , systematics , botany , morphology , ecology and paleontology .""","""And""",DISAGREE,"""search The modern evolutionary synthesis""","""And""",,
36733,9615,"""Modern evolutionary synthesis From Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia • Learn more about using Wikipedia for research • Jump to : navigation , search The modern evolutionary synthesis refers to a set of ideas from several biological specialities that were brought together to form a unified theory of evolution accepted by the great majority of working biologists . This synthesis was produced over a period of about a decade ( 1936-1947 ) and was closely connected with the development from 1918 to 1932 of the discipline of population genetics , which integrated the theory of natural selection with Mendelian genetics . Julian Huxley invented the term , when he summarised the ideas in his book , Evolution : The Modern Synthesis in 1942 . Though the 'Modern Synthesis ' is the basis of current evolutionary thinking , it refers to a historical event that took place in the 1930s and 1940s . Major figures in the development of the modern synthesis include R. A. Fisher , Theodosius Dobzhansky , J.B.S . Haldane , Sewall Wright , Julian Huxley , Ernst Mayr , Bernhard Rensch , George Gaylord Simpson , and G. Ledyard Stebbins . The modern synthesis solved difficulties and confusions caused by the specialisation and poor communication between biologists in the early years of the twentieth century . Discoveries of early geneticists were difficult to reconcile with gradual evolution and the mechanism of natural selection . The synthesis reconciled the two schools of thought , while providing evidence that studies of populations in the field were crucial to evolutionary theory . It drew together ideas from several branches of biology that had become separated , particularly genetics , cytology , systematics , botany , morphology , ecology and paleontology .""","""And""",DISAGREE,"""This synthesis was produced over a period of about a decade""","""And""",,
36730,9615,"""Modern evolutionary synthesis From Wikipedia , the free encyclopedia • Learn more about using Wikipedia for research • Jump to : navigation , search The modern evolutionary synthesis refers to a set of ideas from several biological specialities that were brought together to form a unified theory of evolution accepted by the great majority of working biologists . This synthesis was produced over a period of about a decade ( 1936-1947 ) and was closely connected with the development from 1918 to 1932 of the discipline of population genetics , which integrated the theory of natural selection with Mendelian genetics . Julian Huxley invented the term , when he summarised the ideas in his book , Evolution : The Modern Synthesis in 1942 . Though the 'Modern Synthesis ' is the basis of current evolutionary thinking , it refers to a historical event that took place in the 1930s and 1940s . Major figures in the development of the modern synthesis include R. A. Fisher , Theodosius Dobzhansky , J.B.S . Haldane , Sewall Wright , Julian Huxley , Ernst Mayr , Bernhard Rensch , George Gaylord Simpson , and G. Ledyard Stebbins . The modern synthesis solved difficulties and confusions caused by the specialisation and poor communication between biologists in the early years of the twentieth century . Discoveries of early geneticists were difficult to reconcile with gradual evolution and the mechanism of natural selection . The synthesis reconciled the two schools of thought , while providing evidence that studies of populations in the field were crucial to evolutionary theory . It drew together ideas from several branches of biology that had become separated , particularly genetics , cytology , systematics , botany , morphology , ecology and paleontology .""","""And""",DISAGREE,"""modern evolutionary synthesis refers to a set of ideas theory of evolution accepted by the great majority of working biologists .""","""And""",,
36736,9616,"""Okay , let 's look at evolution .""","""Oh ! Goody ! At last someone who wants to actually discuss evolution instead of mythology !""",AGREE,"""Okay , let 's look at evolution .""","""Oh ! Goody ! At last someone who wants to actually discuss evolution instead of mythology !""",,
36741,9617,"""OK. That 's probably correct . I did the calculations in cubic kilometers .""","""Well , then I 'd have to convert everest to kilometers . I live in the US . Metric is alien . haahh .""",AGREE,"""I did the calculations in cubic kilometers .""","""then I 'd have to convert everest to kilometers""",,
36762,9621,"""These are n't the only two options available ...""","""Of course not , nor did I intend to imply that they were . I merely suggest that an increase , through education , in awareness of the diversity of religious belief has led some to a fuzzy-minded many-paths mentality , some to the conclusion that if 99.99 % are wrong , there 's a strong probability they 're all wrong . There are lots of other positions .""",AGREE,"""These are n't the only two options available ...""","""Of course not , nor did I intend to imply that they were . fuzzy-minded many-paths mentality""",,
36767,9622,""" “ The amount went up after it was legalized and peaked in the 80s . It has sense gone down a bit and is leveling off ( some suggest because of studies that have come out about abortion and the fact that people that do n't support abortion has gone up sense the 80s and early 90s ) . ”""","""It shot up as soon as Reagan launched his failed campaign of anti-sex education , cutting social services for the poor and destroying the US economy into a recession that favored the rich against the poor . Since social-economical reasons are often the reason why people have abortions it is no surprise we saw abortion sky-rocket under Reagan ‘ s political atmosphere that was hostile to lower class families . If people were becoming more against abortion in the 90s then how can you explain Clinton ’ s popularity in winning two elections ? The a friendlier economic atmosphere , contraception education and relief from Reaganism helped reduce the abortion rate .""",DISAGREE,"""It has sense gone down a bit and is leveling off""","""If people were becoming more against abortion in the 90s then how can you explain""",,
36778,9623,"""Creationism does not necessarily=YEC . The YEC crowd is their own little clique of scientific illiterates .""","""But most creationists are YECs . The word has taken on bad connotations so it sounds a bit sour to call a theistic evolutionist a `` creationist. `` The most usual use of the word is as the name of someone who believes that the Bible is literal , including creation in 6 days , Adam and Eve in a magic garden , and a global flood . Someone who relieves in God but recognizes that much of the Bible is composed of moral tales and the mythology of the ancient Hebrews is n't really a `` creationist. `` I guess we could run down the list of degrees of creationism from flat earth to theistic evolution if you want .""",DISAGREE,"""Creationism does not necessarily=YEC . little clique of scientific illiterates .""","""most creationists are YECs . word has taken on bad connotations""",,
36799,9630,"""18-19 year olds anyway . It 's still illegal for over the counter under the age of 18 .""","""Try this scenario . A 15 or 16 year old girl has her 18 year old boyfriend pick up the medication .""",DISAGREE,"""It 's illegal under 18""","""16 year old has 18 year old""",,
36806,9633,"""Yet without it the vessel is just worms , mud , then dust , like rock & amp ; tree houses , not made to endure , yet , the life force , energy , back to the cosmos/source , converted , capable of being rewinded , paused , and fastfowarded , like a movie screen amongst the stars , revealing our lives .""","""its still not a bilateral relation . all living thing manifest energy , but not all things that manifest energy are alive . its easy to turn on your car ignition and make the engine run , heat up , generate electricty and make noise , all from the chemical energy in the gasoline . Still the car isnt alive . on the other hand , in the living body , energy is constantly being converted from chemical to other forms , and the moment energy stops transferring , the body is dead . the relationship between life and energy exists , but it still doesnt conclude that life is energy""",DISAGREE,"""without it the vessel is just worms , mud , then dust , like rock & tree houses energy converted""","""all living thing manifest energy , but not all things that manifest energy are alive make the engine run , heat up , generate electricty and make noise , all from the chemical energy in the gasoline . Still the car isnt alive constantly being converted""",,
36817,9635,"""Maybe they should look in an abortionist 's sink and check of the bloody remains of the babies that are butchered . And if they think what they see in that sink is ok with God then they 're really sick individuals .""","""I highly doubt they throw them in the sink . They probably put them in a red plastic biohazard bag , tie it shut , and throw it on the pile of other red bags to be shipped off to a medical waste incinerator to be burned . May sound graphic and callous to you , but it is probably far more accurate that a `` sink full of bloody baby remains `` . Why must the anti-abortion crowd use such fallacious images to sell their point ?""",DISAGREE,"""Maybe they should look in an abortionist 's sink and check of the bloody remains of the babies that are butchered . And if they think what they see in that sink is ok with God then they 're really sick individuals .""","""I highly doubt they throw them in the sink . They probably put them in a red plastic biohazard bag , tie it shut , and throw it on the pile of other red bags to be shipped off to a medical waste incinerator to be burned .""",,
36821,9635,"""Maybe they should look in an abortionist 's sink and check of the bloody remains of the babies that are butchered . And if they think what they see in that sink is ok with God then they 're really sick individuals .""","""I highly doubt they throw them in the sink . They probably put them in a red plastic biohazard bag , tie it shut , and throw it on the pile of other red bags to be shipped off to a medical waste incinerator to be burned . May sound graphic and callous to you , but it is probably far more accurate that a `` sink full of bloody baby remains `` . Why must the anti-abortion crowd use such fallacious images to sell their point ?""",DISAGREE,"""Maybe they should look in an abortionist 's sink and check of the bloody remains of the babies that are butchered""","""I highly doubt they throw them in the sink""",,
36836,9638,"""The first refutation is not a refutation at all - it is a retreat .""","""Fair enough .""",AGREE,"""The first refutation is not a refutation at all - it is a retreat .""","""Fair enough .""",,
36845,9639,"""Originally posted by oldskool79 The idea that the earth was flat was an `` accepted `` principle as well . There is no verse that I know of that ever claims man has `` free will `` . In fact , the Bible actually says that before you can even choose to follow God he must first choose you .""","""Well its not much of a religious debate to me when it comes to free will . I believe the Bible fully supports the idea of free will and even assuming that it says nothing at all , based on the way some things go it is hard to believe a good God would not only allow it to happen , but to make it happen is even worse . I mean , what else is there ? If we do n't have free will and God is the ultimate power , then he must be the one making decisions for us . Ca n't blame the Devil for everything . Nah I guess you could , but that would n't make God sound too good either if he was letting all of his prized creations have their fake lives destroyed by a demon .""",DISAGREE,"""The idea that the earth was flat was an `` accepted `` principle as well . There is no verse that I know of that ever claims man has `` free will ``""","""its not much of a religious debate to me when it comes to free will . I believe the Bible fully supports the idea of free will and even assuming that it says nothing at all""",,
36848,9640,"""and more Democrats favoring bigger domestic government .""","""And where has Marc9000 been in the past oh 30 years ? Do we need to remind him of the size of the gov't under Reagan ? or how about Bush Sr , or Bush Jr ? Ah yes , so a party that supports the intervention of the federal government in the personal disputes of a family is not favoring bigger domestic government ? That crack rock has to be strong stuff .""",DISAGREE,"""and more Democrats favoring bigger domestic government .""","""Do we need to remind him of the size of the gov't under Reagan ? or how about Bush Sr , or Bush Jr ?""",,
36859,9643,"""In my time I have been practicing Christian and now I would consider myself a 'Weak Atheist ' . I came across an article on the BBC website ( The article is linked below ) on agnosticism and has got me thinking about my position on the existence of deities . Is agnosticism the more logical position ? Or is it merely an exercise in intellectual fence sitting ? http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6199716.stm Wikipedia Entry on Agnosticism - http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnostic""","""It depends . Do you feel the same way about the Yeti ? How about the Lock Ness monster ? You can make the statement 'Based on the current available evidence , I do not believe in the existance of any god/gods . ' I think it is intellectual fence sitting myself . I feel the same way about God as i do about fairies , the yeti , alien abductions , and 'psychic powers ' . There is no evidence that any of these exist , so based on the evidence , I do n't believe they exist . Should new evidence be forthcoming , I will reevalutate my position based on that evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""I have been practicing Christian and now I would consider myself a 'Weak Atheist ' . I came across an article on the BBC website ( The article is linked below ) on agnosticism and has got me thinking about my position on the existence of deities Is agnosticism the more logical position ? Or is it merely an exercise in intellectual fence sitting ?""","""depends . Do you feel the same way about the Yeti ? You can make the statement 'Based on the current available evidence , I do not believe in the existance of any god/gods . ' I feel the same way about God as i do about fairies , the yeti , alien abductions , and 'psychic powers ' . There is no evidence that any of these exist , so based on the evidence , I do n't believe they exist Should new evidence be forthcoming , I will reevalutate my position based on that""",,
36861,9643,"""In my time I have been practicing Christian and now I would consider myself a 'Weak Atheist ' . I came across an article on the BBC website ( The article is linked below ) on agnosticism and has got me thinking about my position on the existence of deities . Is agnosticism the more logical position ? Or is it merely an exercise in intellectual fence sitting ? http : //news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6199716.stm Wikipedia Entry on Agnosticism - http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnostic""","""It depends . Do you feel the same way about the Yeti ? How about the Lock Ness monster ? You can make the statement 'Based on the current available evidence , I do not believe in the existance of any god/gods . ' I think it is intellectual fence sitting myself . I feel the same way about God as i do about fairies , the yeti , alien abductions , and 'psychic powers ' . There is no evidence that any of these exist , so based on the evidence , I do n't believe they exist . Should new evidence be forthcoming , I will reevalutate my position based on that evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""In my time I have been practicing Christian and now I would consider myself a 'Weak Atheist ' .""","""It depends . Do you feel the same way about the Yeti ? How about the Lock Ness monster ?""",,
36867,9645,"""Who 's ignoring effect C ?""","""Well , Kellerman for one .""",DISAGREE,"""Who 's ignoring effect C ?""","""Kellerman for one .""",,
36872,9646,"""The outlawing of guns , and an increased presence of government in our homes , go hand in hand .""","""and to think we got back a few gun rights , and we still have the patriot act . i know all the reasons given for why `` THEY `` want to disarm us , what I am trying to understand is why one person wants to see them outlawed .""",DISAGREE,"""The outlawing of guns , and an increased presence of government in our homes , go hand in hand .""","""i know all the reasons given for why `` THEY `` want to disarm us , what I am trying to understand is why one person wants to see them outlawed .""",,
36884,9658,"""Wow , I just have to say that Sinjin , Trebor , And Colonel , have shown me what a fool I have been for believing in God , and trying to live my life as a good and God fearing person , I guess now since there really is no God , I can just act like some kind of hate mongering heathen with nothing to fear from a higher power who says not to act like that ( heathen ) . Man if we had leaders like you , and our kids were taught to believe as you three do , our society would be so much better off . We would have more crime , less morality , churches could shut down and not help strugling people with things like food and bills , we would be able to remove `` In God we Trust `` from our money and replace it with `` We dont trust or believe in squat `` . And by the way , if God is not real as you have plainly made me see , why is Gods name on our money , why is Gods name in our pledge of allegiance , why have people believed in God and the bible since before you and I were ever thought of , before your fancy psychology was ever thought of , for that matter why do we have AD and a Bc eras . I once heard on the news that Nohas Ark had been found , but hoe is that possible . I guess I will just keep on being the fool that yall think I am by believing in God , I am a lot better off in many ways .""","""And there you go again .. first of all , misrepresenting all the things everyone has said , and second of all , bringing up that red herring of 'In God We Trust ' . You see , you are mixing up what your basic beliefs are with how you are acting . I do think it is very amusing that the Knights of Columbus , in an effort to 'show how different we are from the Godless Commies `` have tricked the Christians of this country into the worshiping of Idols . They turned the pledge into a prayer , and the flag into an idol , and Money into a God . Do keep on bringing up all these things about 'Noah 's ark ' and such . I guess you hear a sound bit on TV , and believe it hook line and sinker . It demonstrates to me what has to be changed in the schools on that we should teach people how to listen critically , and to actually learn things . I find that knowledge is the enemy of both religion and right wing fundamentalism . When people can actually learn and understand things on their own , and to be able to critically process information , they tend to stop being red neck fundamentalists , and can actually contribute to society .""",DISAGREE,"""I guess I will just keep on being the fool that yall think I am by believing in God , I am a lot better off in many ways .""","""I find that knowledge is the enemy of both religion and right wing fundamentalism""",,
36913,9663,"""So there you have it . An evolutionist 's formulation of an IDists response . Appropriately , because ID as a whole is essentially an argument from ignorance , ignorance plays a role the answers to all your questions . ( `` Do n't know `` / `` Do n't care `` / `` Does n't matter. `` ) ID simply sidesteps these issues . Also notice that none of the statements are testable or falsifiable , except for the parts of the OEC view that are perfectly compatible with geology and evolution . Some will claim that they `` have no reason `` to doubt common descent ( a la Behe ) but do a conspicuously good job of not saying they actually believe it . And if any IDists have a problem with my responses , they 're able to post their own responses . However , they were able to do that even before I responded , and they did n't ...""","""Yes , intelligent design is another incarnation of the `` God of the gaps `` idea . What separates it in conceptual terms from YEC ( for example ) is its gaps are much , much smaller , but remain nonetheless . I wonder if we have a true advocate of Behe 's Intelligent Design to argue the corner ?""",AGREE,"""So there you have it . An evolutionist 's formulation of an IDists response . Appropriately , because ID as a whole is essentially an argument from ignorance , ignorance plays a role the answers to all your questions . ( `` Do n't know `` / `` Do n't care `` / `` Does n't matter. `` )""","""Yes , intelligent design is another incarnation of the `` God of the gaps ``""",,
36915,9663,"""So there you have it . An evolutionist 's formulation of an IDists response . Appropriately , because ID as a whole is essentially an argument from ignorance , ignorance plays a role the answers to all your questions . ( `` Do n't know `` / `` Do n't care `` / `` Does n't matter. `` ) ID simply sidesteps these issues . Also notice that none of the statements are testable or falsifiable , except for the parts of the OEC view that are perfectly compatible with geology and evolution . Some will claim that they `` have no reason `` to doubt common descent ( a la Behe ) but do a conspicuously good job of not saying they actually believe it . And if any IDists have a problem with my responses , they 're able to post their own responses . However , they were able to do that even before I responded , and they did n't ...""","""Yes , intelligent design is another incarnation of the `` God of the gaps `` idea . What separates it in conceptual terms from YEC ( for example ) is its gaps are much , much smaller , but remain nonetheless . I wonder if we have a true advocate of Behe 's Intelligent Design to argue the corner ?""",AGREE,"""So there you have it . An evolutionist 's formulation of an IDists response .""","""Yes""",,
36918,9664,"""i can not prove 100 % that God exist , the atheist can not prove100 % that God does not exist because absolute proof is not posible . However , theisn better fites the evidence than atheism .""","""Only if you make invalid assumptions .""",DISAGREE,"""i can not prove 100 % that God exist , the atheist can not prove100 % that God does not exist because absolute proof is not posible . However , theisn better fites the evidence than atheism .""","""Only if you make invalid assumptions .""",,
36950,9667,"""I do n't know about that , but yes the ACLU has been sketchy about the support of the Constitution . Thier passion is most definately there , but thier brains are not . Just the fact they equate auto registration and gun ownership shows they got some freaky ideas about the Constitution . BTW VOR you do n't fool me . Your not after gun control . Your after gun bans .""","""So are you saying I do n't want gun registration ? BTW you do n't fool me . Your intention is not to protect people 's right to life and follow the Constitution .""",DISAGREE,"""Just the fact they equate auto registration and gun ownership shows they got some freaky ideas about the Constitution""","""Your intention is not to protect people 's right to life and follow the Constitution""",,
36954,9668,"""WASHINGTON -- New Jersey 's U.S. senators plan to introduce a bill that would make it illegal for anyone , except a police officer or military official , to purchase or use an assault pistol that fires bullets capable of penetrating a bulletproof vest . The Five-SeveN gun made by FN Herstal of Belgium has already been denounced by three national police organizations and the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence . The handgun is small and lightweight and easily concealed in a person 's""","""It looks like the anti gunners are at it again , only now they have a new target . For those who do not follow such things , the FN five seven fires a new round , the 5.7x28 . There are 2 versions of the round availabe , one is an aluminum base , steel core , FMJ round designed to pierce body armor . It is not available to civilians int he US , it is law enforcement only . The other round avaliable IS a civilian round , it is a hollowpoint which has already been cleared by the ATF as a non armor piercing round . The civilian round ( the non AP one ) WILL pierce body armor , as will a .22 magnum , and most solid point .22 LR rounds . Body armor is specifically designed to take the implact from large , slow moving rounds , not small , fast rounds . I am also a little confused as to what makes this an `` assault pistol `` . I have 2 of them . I purchsed them specifically because when the civilian version came out , I fully expected that thet antigunners would pitch a fit and we would see attempts to ban the weapon , which would boost the value of them . They pretty much look like a glock . Why is the five seven an `` assault pistol `` and the glock is not ? While I am sure we are all used to GG 's pushing for bans that have no basis in reality , even I was a little surprised that they moved so quickly on this one . Now , my anti social side is pushing me to pass on a secret regarding AP rounds . If you want a REALLY good AP round , get a 7.62x25 ( tokarev ) . You can pick up a pistol for this caliber VERY cheap ( $ 200 or less for a good makarov ) . Hand load your rounds , but instead of using the 7.62 , order some .30 sabots . You can get them from a bunch of places ( just do a search for `` .30 sabot `` on google ) . They cost about $ 10 for 100 of them . Load your 7.62x25 with a fast burning powder , and you can load a heavier powder load . Use a .223 speer FMJ . Our experiments ( we experimented with this at work when we were working on a contract related to ceramic body armor ) showed that this will go through TWO kevlar vests and 16 inched of ballistics gel , which implies rather heavily that you can reasonably expect to shoot right through 2 police officers using the round , vest or no . This being the case , does n't it seem a little frivolous to be banning a weapon , and the ammo for that weapon , especially since the ATF has already given it the green light as non AP ?""",DISAGREE,"""senators plan to introduce a bill that would make it illegal for anyone , except a police officer or military official , to purchase or use an assault pistol that fires bullets capable of penetrating a bulletproof vest .""","""looks like the anti gunners are at it again""",,
36955,9668,"""WASHINGTON -- New Jersey 's U.S. senators plan to introduce a bill that would make it illegal for anyone , except a police officer or military official , to purchase or use an assault pistol that fires bullets capable of penetrating a bulletproof vest . The Five-SeveN gun made by FN Herstal of Belgium has already been denounced by three national police organizations and the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence . The handgun is small and lightweight and easily concealed in a person 's""","""It looks like the anti gunners are at it again , only now they have a new target . For those who do not follow such things , the FN five seven fires a new round , the 5.7x28 . There are 2 versions of the round availabe , one is an aluminum base , steel core , FMJ round designed to pierce body armor . It is not available to civilians int he US , it is law enforcement only . The other round avaliable IS a civilian round , it is a hollowpoint which has already been cleared by the ATF as a non armor piercing round . The civilian round ( the non AP one ) WILL pierce body armor , as will a .22 magnum , and most solid point .22 LR rounds . Body armor is specifically designed to take the implact from large , slow moving rounds , not small , fast rounds . I am also a little confused as to what makes this an `` assault pistol `` . I have 2 of them . I purchsed them specifically because when the civilian version came out , I fully expected that thet antigunners would pitch a fit and we would see attempts to ban the weapon , which would boost the value of them . They pretty much look like a glock . Why is the five seven an `` assault pistol `` and the glock is not ? While I am sure we are all used to GG 's pushing for bans that have no basis in reality , even I was a little surprised that they moved so quickly on this one . Now , my anti social side is pushing me to pass on a secret regarding AP rounds . If you want a REALLY good AP round , get a 7.62x25 ( tokarev ) . You can pick up a pistol for this caliber VERY cheap ( $ 200 or less for a good makarov ) . Hand load your rounds , but instead of using the 7.62 , order some .30 sabots . You can get them from a bunch of places ( just do a search for `` .30 sabot `` on google ) . They cost about $ 10 for 100 of them . Load your 7.62x25 with a fast burning powder , and you can load a heavier powder load . Use a .223 speer FMJ . Our experiments ( we experimented with this at work when we were working on a contract related to ceramic body armor ) showed that this will go through TWO kevlar vests and 16 inched of ballistics gel , which implies rather heavily that you can reasonably expect to shoot right through 2 police officers using the round , vest or no . This being the case , does n't it seem a little frivolous to be banning a weapon , and the ammo for that weapon , especially since the ATF has already given it the green light as non AP ?""",DISAGREE,"""The handgun is small and lightweight and easily concealed in a person 's""","""since the ATF has already given it the green light as non AP""",,
36963,9670,"""The fact is , I would still be lost if I had not taken a hard look at the evidence that God gave me . Thus , in a way , I do believe my faith is evidence-based . I believe God gave us evidence in the form of His word – The Bible – and I believe He gave us evidence of His eternal greatness through his miraculous Creation . It ’ s all here for everyone to see . There are no excuses . But I submit that the Liberals in this country have one supreme goal -- trashing this evidence – on both fronts . The first thing they ’ ve done is trashed the Bible . They ’ ve taken it out of our schools , out of the public arena , off the airwaves , out of courthouses , out of the military , and generally out of sight anywhere besides inside churches and homes . Instead of reading/analyzing the Bible and celebrating life , liberals would just assume everyone analyze porn and worship death .""","""As to your first point , as far as I can tell , you looked at the world and said , `` Naw , there 's no way this happened without God. `` And not just any God , but Trinity father son holy spirit God . The miraculous creation of our existance does not point to Christianity at all . However , you did n't just look at the 'miraculous creation , ' no you had a study guide . Allow me to mention something right here , and point out I 'm a Methodist .... ahem THE BIBLE WAS WRITTEN BY MEN . Arguing that the events in the bible happened or not is a different issue , but God did not give us a master copy of the bible and tell us to copy it . Biblical scholars have noted that the bible is an amalgam of different authors who had different outlooks on God . The bible is an excellent source of faith and guidance , it is not an infallible work and does not answer all questions . As to your second point , argueing that liberals wish to analyze porn and worship death just shows you have n't really put much thought into this contention . You are right that the government has removed references to Christianity in its subsidiaries like public school . There is a good reason for this . I ca n't for the life of me recall where this quote is from but it said : `` Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion , or prohibiting the free exercise thereof ; or abridging the freedom of speech , or of the press ; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble , and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. `` This means government is n't suppose to support religious groups . What would you define mandatory school prayer as ? Anyone who has ever argued that a seperation between church and state is n't a good thing has obviously never been the religious minority . I lived in Saudi Arabia for 10 years and I can tell you state supported religion is not good .""",DISAGREE,"""Instead of reading/analyzing the Bible and celebrating life , liberals would just assume everyone analyze porn and worship death .""","""I lived in Saudi Arabia for 10 years and I can tell you state supported religion is not good .""",,
36967,9671,"""The truth is , his nation is even worse than those he condemns . Why he tries to hide the truth is beyond belief ! ! The only unarmed people in Eurasia are the law abiding ones and he thinks this is a good thing ? Pure evil ! !""","""Well that explains the twisted thought pattern on our constitution is broken .""",DISAGREE,"""Why he tries to hide the truth is beyond belief ! ! The only unarmed people in Eurasia are the law abiding ones and he thinks this is a good thing ? Pure evil ! !""","""Well that explains the twisted thought pattern on our constitution is""",,
36969,9672,"""What if my own words and feeling sound just like that dusty book ? What if I happen to agree with it ? What if I take it in context ? Actually one would be hard pressed to show where I have ever taken it out of context . If I say that I worship Him because he is powerful , beautiful and has loved me greatly , does that mean you now get to argue those points and say he is not any of those . I would say you do not get to argue my assumptions about God as they are mine . YOu may argue my conclusions based on my assumptions but you could not argue my assumptions , nor I yours . Is that a fair statement of how to answer the question ?""","""It ’ s a lot more interesting for us to read if it is in your own words . If I wanted to read a bible , I ’ d steal one .""",DISAGREE,"""I would say you do not get to argue my assumptions about God as they are mine .""","""If I wanted to read a bible , I ’ d steal one .""",,
36980,9675,"""What did change ? What exactly happened , that 's the direct fault of the NRA , that allowed this to happen ?""","""Well by that logic , why was n't the Brady campaign , police , or law there to save them ?""",DISAGREE,"""change happened direct fault of the NRA , that allowed this to happen ?""","""logic campaign""",,
36986,9676,"""If the coelacanth 's habitat was no condusive to change then the same would apply .""","""Deep ocean is probably the least changed environment on earth . That 's were modern coelacanths live .""",DISAGREE,"""If the coelacanth 's habitat was no condusive to change then the same would apply .""","""Deep ocean is probably the least changed environment on earth . That 's were modern coelacanths live .""",,
36999,9678,"""Creation has been around a lot longer than your post implied . It was recorded in Genisis and passed down for many generations .""","""Yes , the mythology has been around for a long time . Most cultures had their own . You have adopted the mythology of ancient Hebrews . You probably even somehow reconcile both stories of creation in your mind . But the technology and the techniques to use that technology did n't develop until about 400 years ago . Every since then we have used the idea that we can learn about our world by careful observation and experimentation . About 150 years ago , Darwin and Wallace recognized a mechanism for why living things change . About the same time , Mendel recognized how those changes were passed on to off spring . That the Biblical mythology of creation was false was actually demonstrated by men who believed in creation . They tried to reconcile their Bible with what was obviously true from the observations they made . But creationism has only been around since the early 20th century . It grew out of the anti-science movement of fundamentalism . It actually became popular in the 1960 's .""",DISAGREE,"""Creation has been around a lot longer . was recorded in Genisis and passed down for many generations""","""Yes the mythology has been around for a long time . the Biblical mythology of creation was false creationism has only been around since the early 20th century""",,
37009,9680,"""Are they going to argue that all the petrified woods could have been formed within the 6000 year life of the earth ?""","""Exactly . I can hear it now - `` Scientist have created petrified wood in 3 days . This throws serious doubt on the millions of years theory for its development currently accepted by evolutionists , and is strong evidence that the petrified wood touted as evidence for an ancient earth by evolutionists is capable of , and in fact more likely to have been , produced within a short time span of less , certainly less than 6000 years. `` I should be the next `` Dr. `` Hovind . Waxy P.S . I agree on the use of Argon .""",AGREE,"""Are they going to argue that all the petrified woods could have been formed within the 6000 year life of the earth ?""","""I can hear it now - `` Scientist have created petrified wood in 3 days""",,
37010,9681,"""Yes , I am saying that reasoned arguments from anthropology can and do account for the evolution of morals , the law , etc . in human societies .""","""Do you believe , like Dawkins in a 'religious gene ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""saying arguments anthropology evolution""","""believe Dawkins""",,
37014,9681,"""Yes , I am saying that reasoned arguments from anthropology can and do account for the evolution of morals , the law , etc . in human societies .""","""Do you believe , like Dawkins in a 'religious gene ' ?""",DISAGREE,"""that reasoned arguments from anthropology can and do account for the evolution of morals , the law ,""","""Do you believe like Dawkins in a 'religious gene ' ?""",,
37018,9682,"""Your knowledge of the Bible does not impress me at all . I find it hard to believe you ever read it .""","""Well done , I have n't read it fully . It does n't interest me . My knowledge of it is near nonexistant . I therefore avoid commenting upon it where possible .""",DISAGREE,"""Your knowledge of the Bible does not impress me at all .""","""My knowledge of it is near""",,
37028,9684,"""If you draw a gun on someone holding a gun and do n't shoot straight away then you 're likely to get shot yourself . Without a gun you 're not a threat . If you have a gun but get taken by surprise , or a burglar goes for your gun first when he breaks in you 've just given him a better weapon . Lastly and most importantly the prevalence of guns in general makes criminals far more likely to go armed , which raises the chance of you getting shot .""","""Actually , might I say that you assume that the criminal had a firearm , correct ? This may seem foolish of me , but I 'll go along with you . Now , you can assume that a criminal doens't have the right mindset . There 's always a first crime , but is n't it illegal for an ex-con , a drug addict/alcholic , or someone who has a few screws loose up there to own a firearm ? So we could assume in your situation that the law was n't enforced . So let 's pretend like the law actually is enforced , shall we ? What makes you think the criminal has a firearm ? If he has a firearm , how do you know that it 's because the law was n't enforced ? The solution is to put a bit of muscle into enforcing the laws we have now . You would n't be this guy , would you ? Oh , no , my house is on fire ! I better throw some gasoline onto it ! ... Oh , no , that made it worse ! There 's some trees there that could burn the entire neighborhood down if they catch , so I better throw some more gas onto it ! ... Why is n't it working ? You , over there ! Yeah , you ! Tell everyone that my house is fine !""",DISAGREE,"""If you draw a gun on someone holding a gun and do n't shoot straight away then you 're likely to get shot yourself . Without a gun you 're not a""","""Actually , might I say that you assume that the criminal had a firearm , correct ?""",,
37063,9698,"""Professor Heribert Nilsson , an evolutionist ,""","""Funny , I thought Heribert Nilsson was a botanist . Do n't let little details like that get in your way though .""",DISAGREE,"""Professor Heribert Nilsson , an evolutionist ,""","""Funny , I thought Heribert Nilsson was a botanist .""",,
37073,9701,"""The only reason someone would n't breed would be because they 've either chosen not to , or because they have n't had the fortune of meeting the right person . But genetics has nothing to do with it . There are just as many females in the population as males . Therefore , everyone has an equal chance -- no matter how `` inferior `` one might be .""","""That is generally true . However , have you heard of a disease called AIDS ? Some people are resistant to that disease . Guess what ? They are reproducing more than those who are n't resistant .""",DISAGREE,"""The only reason someone would n't breed would be because they 've either chosen not to , or because they have n't had the fortune of meeting the right person .""","""That is generally true . However , have you heard of a disease called AIDS ?""",,
37083,9711,"""Actually , the heating and the expanding would have had to happen at the same time .""","""Because .... expansion occurs after heat is added . How can a expansion occur with a prior cause ? You 're saying the reaction and cause happen at the same time . Show me an example that does that .""",DISAGREE,"""the heating and the expanding would have had to happen at the same time .""","""expansion occurs after heat is added .""",,
37086,9711,"""Actually , the heating and the expanding would have had to happen at the same time .""","""Because .... expansion occurs after heat is added . How can a expansion occur with a prior cause ? You 're saying the reaction and cause happen at the same time . Show me an example that does that .""",DISAGREE,"""the heating and the expanding would have had to happen at the same time .""","""How can a expansion occur with a prior cause ?""",,
37101,9714,"""Because of the motor 's strength -- to scale , twice that of an automobile -- the new findings could inspire engineers designing sophisticated nanomachines . In addition , because a number of virus types may possess a similar motor , including the virus that causes herpes , the results may also assist pharmaceutical companies developing methods to sabotage virus machinery .""","""Related article : Biologists Learn Structure , Mechanism Of Powerful 'Molecular Motor ' In Virus One has to wonder were the next spate of these poorly thought out arguments are going to come from ? Perhaps the the low optimality of the genetic code ? Perhaps not ... Maybe the inefficiency of biomolecular machines ? Maybe not ... Arguments from bad design should be taken with a pinch of salt as they are often made out of ignorance with hidden metaphysical propositions .""",AGREE,"""In addition , because a number of virus types may possess a similar motor , including the virus that causes herpes , the results may also assist pharmaceutical companies developing methods to sabotage virus machinery .""","""Mechanism Of Powerful 'Molecular Motor ' In Virus One has to wonder were the next spate of these poorly thought out arguments are going to come from ? Perhaps the the low optimality of the genetic code ? Perhaps not ... Maybe the inefficiency of biomolecular machines ? Maybe not""",,
37112,9716,"""But they ca n't be true christians if they accept evolution .""","""That 's your opinion . Why ca n't they be true Christians ? Does everyone have to fall under the same guidelines ? Do n't you think people are intelligent enough to come to their own conclusions based on fact ?""",DISAGREE,"""But they ca n't be true if they accept evolution""","""Why ca n't they be true Christians""",,
37114,9724,"""A member of a powerful political clan on Tuesday pleaded not guilty to murder charges in the Philippines ' worst election massacre of 57 people , including journalists and members of a rival 's family . Andal Ampatuan Jr. , a town mayor in southern Maguindanao province where his family ruled unopposed for years , has been initially charged with 41 counts of murder in the Nov. 23 attack & # 8230 ; Prosecutors said they have witnesses who will testify that Ampatuan led more than 100 government-armed militiamen and police in stopping the caravan at a security checkpoint outside Ampatuan township , then forcing the victims at gunpoint to a hilltop clearing where they were gunned down and buried in mass graves .""","""And this . GUNS HERE TO STAY""",DISAGREE,"""Prosecutors said they have witnesses who will testify that Ampatuan led more than 100 government-armed militiamen""","""GUNS HERE TO STAY""",,
37138,9732,"""So now Wiesmann 's barrier is the most important thing to the ToE ? Somehow I doubt that biologists agree , but obviously creationists have more authority on the topic of evolution ...""","""Well since you guys say it 's not important I guess it 's not . However , that 's not what the dogma has been for several decades .""",AGREE,"""So now Wiesmann 's barrier is the most important thing to the ToE ? Somehow I doubt that biologists agree ,""","""Well since you guys say it 's not important I guess it 's not""",,
37140,9733,"""I 'm glad to see you 've finally come around .""","""too bad darwinian evolution has nothing to do with it ..... proven by the fact that not ONE example of a beneficial random mutation can be presented/proven , nor can ONE example of natural selection be proven on the level of the individual . Thus , there 's only one thing left .... lamarckian inheritance . The body simply has the ability to transmit information about the external environment . It 's that simple . see the butterfly link in the OP .""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm glad to see you 've finally come around""","""ONE example of a beneficial random mutation can be presented/proven""",,
37176,9747,"""Hardly any criminals go armed in England , and certainly not with guns . Burglars and muggers have enough sense to know that while getting done for burglary or mugging will not be pleasant , getting done for burglarly or mugging AND possession of a firearm will be far , far worse , assuming they survive the arrival of the armed response squad .""","""All of the British papers keep going on about how bad it is , how more people than ever are being gunned down in the streets , how guns are being imported into Britain and resold through underground channels , how criminals employ young women to act as gun mules for transporting and storage , etc . Now who should we believe more , your or the papers that relate the news to us ?""",DISAGREE,"""Hardly any criminals go armed in England , and certainly not with guns . getting done for burglarly or mugging AND possession of a firearm will be far , far worse , assuming they survive the arrival of the armed response squad .""","""All of the British papers keep going on about how bad it is , more people than ever are being gunned down in the streets , guns are being imported into Britain who should we believe more , your or the papers that relate the news to us ?""",,
37213,9757,"""there were state laws ( not the new admendments ) that made a same sex couple illegal . some of them being writen in the 1800 's""","""NO , these were all ammedments . all passed . All written recently . There are laws on the book from the 1800 's but that is n't what just passed .""",DISAGREE,"""there were state laws ( not the new admendments ) that made a same sex couple illegal""","""were laws the that""",,
37212,9757,"""there were state laws ( not the new admendments ) that made a same sex couple illegal . some of them being writen in the 1800 's""","""NO , these were all ammedments . all passed . All written recently . There are laws on the book from the 1800 's but that is n't what just passed .""",DISAGREE,"""there were state laws that made a same sex couple illegal""","""NO , these were all ammedments .""",,
37219,9759,"""If you 're after concealment my favorite and regular carry is the Kel-Tec .380 . Fits in the watch pocket of a pair of Levis , feeds six hollow points flawlessly and weighs almost nothing . Several of our deputy sheriffs carry them as summer off-duty pieces , which is how I discovered the convenience .""","""That is a nice little pistol with lots of smack for only 11 onces . Also , I like DA automatics .""",AGREE,"""If you 're after concealment my favorite and regular carry is the Kel-Tec .380""","""That is a nice little pistol with lots of smack for only 11 onces .""",,
37229,9761,"""Those quotes have nothing to do with abortion . This one has to do with babys in the woumb `` Befor I formmed you in the woumb , I knew you , and before you were born I consecrated you ; I appointed you a prophet amoungst nations `` Jeremiah 1:4-5 I think this is rellavent because God wants everyone to be a prophet who he can work through .""","""If that were true , why are there millions of miscarriages each year ? I do n't believe a word of it .""",DISAGREE,"""I think this is rellavent because God wants everyone to be a prophet who he can work through .""","""If that were true , why are there millions of miscarriages each year ? I do n't believe a word of it .""",,
37237,9763,"""Antiabortion Effort in Europe , With U.S. Money , Widens Its Conservative Agenda""","""So the latest imported culture from the US of A . Do n't worry though , while we get the Anti-abortionists from stateside , America gets our animal rights activists in return""",AGREE,"""Antiabortion Effort in Europe , With U.S. Money , Widens Its Conservative Agenda""","""Do n't worry though , while we get the Anti-abortionists from stateside , America gets our animal rights activists in return""",,
37248,9765,"""`` Babies `` are a stage reached after birth . If you are talking about abortions , then no babies are involved , anti-choice , histrionic revisionist linguistics none withstanding""","""Baby can be used to describe a human fetus . Get over it .""",DISAGREE,"""If you are talking about abortions , then no babies are involved ,""","""Baby can be used to describe a human fetus . Get over it""",,
37254,9773,"""You do n't really care which side , you just like the argument , huh ?""","""If you were n't a newbie , you 'd know that I was anti-abortion .""",DISAGREE,"""You do n't really care which side , you just like the argument""","""If you were n't a newbie , you 'd know that I was anti-abortion .""",,
37278,9777,"""Most of the laws of the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia are aimed at rendering the citizens into prey . You ca n't point to many that do n't . Self defense is not allowed there I am afraid .""","""Hey Sarge , add Democratic on their , and it could be called the DPRK ; its kinda going that way anyhow.People start calling it that now , they will fall in line faster .""",AGREE,"""laws of the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia You ca n't point to many that do n't .""","""Democratic on their , and it could be called the DPRK they will fall in line faster .""",,
37281,9777,"""Most of the laws of the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia are aimed at rendering the citizens into prey . You ca n't point to many that do n't . Self defense is not allowed there I am afraid .""","""Hey Sarge , add Democratic on their , and it could be called the DPRK ; its kinda going that way anyhow.People start calling it that now , they will fall in line faster .""",AGREE,"""You ca n't point to many that do n't . Self defense is not allowed there I am afraid .""","""start calling it that now , they will fall in line faster .""",,
37285,9778,"""The two main problems with ID , and why it is rejected among the scientific community , are : 1 . It depends solely upon the ignorance of certain scientific disciplines and the current limits of scientific discovery . In other words , every time more information about biology is discovered , ID becomes diminished , rather than bolstered .""","""JUST LIKE ABIOGENESIS ! Every time more information about biology is discovered , abiogenesis becomes diminished , rather than bolstered .""",DISAGREE,"""In other words , every time more information about biology is discovered , ID becomes diminished , rather than bolstered""","""JUST LIKE ABIOGENESIS ! Every time more information about biology is discovered , abiogenesis becomes diminished ,""",,
37292,9779,"""Really ? When ? I have talked to many an Aussie who do martial arts and THEY are n't even allowed to get a permit to teach with swords""","""Possibly , I must admit I never tried to gain access to swords whilst over there .""",AGREE,"""When ? I have talked to many an Aussie who do martial arts and THEY are n't even allowed to get a permit to teach with swords""","""Possibly , I must admit I never tried to gain access to swords whilst over there .""",,
37303,9783,"""How can you say such things ? The Bible says that God CREATED over and OVER and OVER again ! And you reject that and say that everything came about by evolution ? If you reject the literal account of the Creation in Genesis , you are saying that God is a liar ! If you can not trust God 's Word from the first verse , how can you know that the rest of it can be trusted ?""","""It 's not a literal account unless you interpret it that way .""",DISAGREE,"""Bible says that God CREATED over and OVER and OVER again ! If you reject the literal account of the Creation in Genesis , you are saying that God is a liar""","""It 's not a literal account unless you interpret it that way .""",,
37315,9787,"""Shoot them . That 'll larn em .""","""Illinois government probably agrees . They should be shot immediately . Because once they 're armed , it wo n't be so easy .""",AGREE,"""Shoot them . That 'll larn em .""","""Illinois government probably agrees . They should be shot immediately . Because once they 're armed , it wo n't be so easy .""",,
37323,9787,"""Shoot them . That 'll larn em .""","""Illinois government probably agrees . They should be shot immediately . Because once they 're armed , it wo n't be so easy .""",AGREE,"""Shoot them""","""They should be shot immediately""",,
37328,9788,"""Doctors should be schooled in nutrition so they can teach their patients how to cure themselves .""","""Doctors ARE schooled in nutrition , however inadequately , this does n't mean they 're going to recommend crackpot `` raw food `` dietary schemes to prevent destructive `` lamarckian evolution `` on the basis of a single flawed experiment on cats .""",DISAGREE,"""Doctors should be schooled in nutrition""","""Doctors ARE schooled in nutrition , however inadequately""",,
37330,9788,"""Doctors should be schooled in nutrition so they can teach their patients how to cure themselves .""","""Doctors ARE schooled in nutrition , however inadequately , this does n't mean they 're going to recommend crackpot `` raw food `` dietary schemes to prevent destructive `` lamarckian evolution `` on the basis of a single flawed experiment on cats .""",DISAGREE,"""Doctors should be schooled in nutrition""","""Doctors ARE schooled in nutrition""",,
37359,9791,"""Our Inner City youth in the U.S. tend to believe that you can not allow anyone to insult you , or you are a punk .""","""And this stems back to drug prohibition . Since drug dealers ca n't go to the police or any other security agency for protection from their customers or competitors , they are forced to rely on their reputation for violence . Remove drug prohibition and you 'd solve most of America 's problem with murder . Within a year , there 'd be no street drug trade . Sure , there 'd still be drug addiction , but it would be a health and safety problem , like nicotine or alcohol addiction , not a murder problem . Adding gun prohibition on top of drug prohibition is only likely to compound it .""",AGREE,"""Inner City youth in the U.S. tend to believe that you can not allow anyone to insult you""","""Since drug dealers ca n't go to the police or any other security agency for protection from their customers or competitors , they are forced to rely on their reputation for""",,
37354,9791,"""Our Inner City youth in the U.S. tend to believe that you can not allow anyone to insult you , or you are a punk .""","""And this stems back to drug prohibition . Since drug dealers ca n't go to the police or any other security agency for protection from their customers or competitors , they are forced to rely on their reputation for violence . Remove drug prohibition and you 'd solve most of America 's problem with murder . Within a year , there 'd be no street drug trade . Sure , there 'd still be drug addiction , but it would be a health and safety problem , like nicotine or alcohol addiction , not a murder problem . Adding gun prohibition on top of drug prohibition is only likely to compound it .""",AGREE,"""Our Inner City youth in the U.S. tend to believe that you can not allow anyone to insult you , or you are a punk .""","""And this stems back to drug prohibition . Since drug dealers ca n't go to the police""",,
37363,9792,"""So , what 's my point in all this ? I 'm not trying to say that Unkerpaulie 's doctrine is wrong . I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis , Fall , or Creation , and so there 's no necessary conflict between being a good Christian and believing evolution . There are certainly certain branches of Christianity for which evolution is anathema , but that 's a property of those particular branches , and not an inherent property of Christianity as a whole .""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine . as you demonstrated above , in order to remove the significance of genesis , you must fill in the gaps with explanations that are not based on , and sometimes contrary to , the bible . clearly , why even call that a christian if they are not folowing the pattern of christ , dont believe in redemption and original sin , and dont believe that this very redemption restores man back to the form man was originally intended to live . that said , i 'm very curious to hear exactly how this `` brand `` of christian fits evolution into the scripture as a basis for their christianity . in order to do that , they 'd need to : - understand exactly what the `` allegory `` of genesis represents - explain how man can be considered in the likeness of God presently - explain exactly why jesus died if there is no original sin - identify the time in history that God was first revealed to man - account for the souls of the homonid species before modern man so far , noone has even ever come close to scratching the surface on these questions . in fact , members of this `` brand `` of christianity become VERY hard to find when discussions like these arise . yet they are quick to pat themselves on the back for `` not being like those fundamentalists who reject science `` . if your version of christianity is the right one , lets discuss it""",DISAGREE,"""So , what 's my point in all this ? I 'm not trying to say that Unkerpaulie 's doctrine is wrong . I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis , Fall , or Creation , and so there 's no necessary conflict between being a good Christian and believing evolution .""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine . as you demonstrated above , in order to remove the significance of genesis , you must fill in the gaps with explanations that are not based on , and sometimes contrary to , the""",,
37364,9792,"""So , what 's my point in all this ? I 'm not trying to say that Unkerpaulie 's doctrine is wrong . I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis , Fall , or Creation , and so there 's no necessary conflict between being a good Christian and believing evolution . There are certainly certain branches of Christianity for which evolution is anathema , but that 's a property of those particular branches , and not an inherent property of Christianity as a whole .""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine . as you demonstrated above , in order to remove the significance of genesis , you must fill in the gaps with explanations that are not based on , and sometimes contrary to , the bible . clearly , why even call that a christian if they are not folowing the pattern of christ , dont believe in redemption and original sin , and dont believe that this very redemption restores man back to the form man was originally intended to live . that said , i 'm very curious to hear exactly how this `` brand `` of christian fits evolution into the scripture as a basis for their christianity . in order to do that , they 'd need to : - understand exactly what the `` allegory `` of genesis represents - explain how man can be considered in the likeness of God presently - explain exactly why jesus died if there is no original sin - identify the time in history that God was first revealed to man - account for the souls of the homonid species before modern man so far , noone has even ever come close to scratching the surface on these questions . in fact , members of this `` brand `` of christianity become VERY hard to find when discussions like these arise . yet they are quick to pat themselves on the back for `` not being like those fundamentalists who reject science `` . if your version of christianity is the right one , lets discuss it""",DISAGREE,"""So , what 's my point in all this ? I 'm not trying to say that Unkerpaulie 's doctrine is wrong . I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine .""",,
37366,9792,"""So , what 's my point in all this ? I 'm not trying to say that Unkerpaulie 's doctrine is wrong . I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis , Fall , or Creation , and so there 's no necessary conflict between being a good Christian and believing evolution . There are certainly certain branches of Christianity for which evolution is anathema , but that 's a property of those particular branches , and not an inherent property of Christianity as a whole .""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine . as you demonstrated above , in order to remove the significance of genesis , you must fill in the gaps with explanations that are not based on , and sometimes contrary to , the bible . clearly , why even call that a christian if they are not folowing the pattern of christ , dont believe in redemption and original sin , and dont believe that this very redemption restores man back to the form man was originally intended to live . that said , i 'm very curious to hear exactly how this `` brand `` of christian fits evolution into the scripture as a basis for their christianity . in order to do that , they 'd need to : - understand exactly what the `` allegory `` of genesis represents - explain how man can be considered in the likeness of God presently - explain exactly why jesus died if there is no original sin - identify the time in history that God was first revealed to man - account for the souls of the homonid species before modern man so far , noone has even ever come close to scratching the surface on these questions . in fact , members of this `` brand `` of christianity become VERY hard to find when discussions like these arise . yet they are quick to pat themselves on the back for `` not being like those fundamentalists who reject science `` . if your version of christianity is the right one , lets discuss it""",DISAGREE,"""I 'm just trying to show that it 's pefectly possible to believe in Christianity and the Bible without believing in a literal Genesis""","""i wouls suggest that `` brand `` of christianity that doesnt take genesis as literal is based on an unbiblical doctrine""",,
37370,9793,"""But there was a big evolutionary hyp over this and some people were saying `` They are just that close in showing how life could come from non-life. ``""","""Really ? I suspect that you have been duped by creationist ministers . There is no hype about Miller/Urey . It was an interesting experiment that demonstrated possibilities .""",DISAGREE,"""But there was a big evolutionary hyp over this and some people were saying `` They are just that close in showing how life could come from non-life. ``""","""I suspect that you have been duped by creationist ministers""",,
37396,9798,"""You are n't serious are you ? ? ? Is this a joke ? You 're one of the most active attackers of Christianity in these threads . Are n't you the one that likes to use the term `` Christonazi ? ``""","""You mean he does not agree with your view of christianity .""",DISAGREE,"""You are n't serious are you ? Is this a joke ?""","""You mean he does not agree with your view of christianity .""",,
37401,9799,"""Try this scenario . A 15 or 16 year old girl has her 18 year old boyfriend pick up the medication .""","""Good . Better yet if they had access to and used birth control to begin with .""",DISAGREE,"""15 or 16 year old girl has her 18 year old boyfriend pick up the medication""","""Good . Better yet if they had access to and used birth control""",,
37420,9802,"""The person paying for the disposal .""","""So you believe that the person who is going to die has no say so in the matter of what happens to their body ? What if they said that because of organ donor shortages that now it would be law in your state that when you die , all of your organs would be taken out of your body and reused without your permission . Would that be OK for them to do ?""",DISAGREE,"""The person paying for the disposal .""","""So you believe that the person who is going to die has no say so in the matter of what happens to their body ?""",,
37424,9803,"""Does it have any use at all , aside from promoting a religious agenda ?""","""That is the only purpose it was created for . One must wonder if BS can have several uses to man and ID has but one which is the more valuable ?""",AGREE,"""Does it have any use at all , aside from promoting a religious agenda ?""","""One must wonder if BS can have several uses to man and ID has but one which is the more valuable ?""",,
37432,9803,"""Does it have any use at all , aside from promoting a religious agenda ?""","""That is the only purpose it was created for . One must wonder if BS can have several uses to man and ID has but one which is the more valuable ?""",AGREE,"""Does it have any use at all , aside from promoting a religious agenda ?""","""the only purpose it was created for .""",,
37437,9804,"""The purpose of this thread is to continue/reboot the debate between myself and Chuz Life within the general topic of abortion legality .""","""Fair enough . However , before we start I would like to clarify a few minor points in your opening challenge .""",AGREE,"""this thread is to continue/reboot the debate between myself and Chuz Life within the general topic of abortion legality .""","""Fair enough . However , before we start I would like to clarify a few minor points in your opening challenge""",,
37454,9806,"""Is this another personal attack ? Or is it killing you that i would donate money to an organization that opposes your secular humanist agenda so you feel you must lash out like an angry child ? Is that your issue lyteboy ?""","""You can do whatever you want to do with your money . The fact that you do n't know any better than to do that with your money is telling , though . If you think that the C ( R ) SC actually does ID-based scientific research , you 're exactly the dupe they 're looking for . I 'm serious . Do the research for yourself . I wo n't even give you links , because you 'll blow them off as propaganda . Find any scientific journal article written by a DI member that 's actually based on actual scientific experimentation or investigation and supports ID . I dare you .""",DISAGREE,"""Or is it killing you that i would donate money to an organization that opposes your secular humanist agenda so you feel you must lash out like an angry child ?""","""You can do whatever you want to do with your money . The fact that you do n't know any better than to do that with your money is telling , though .""",,
37458,9806,"""Is this another personal attack ? Or is it killing you that i would donate money to an organization that opposes your secular humanist agenda so you feel you must lash out like an angry child ? Is that your issue lyteboy ?""","""You can do whatever you want to do with your money . The fact that you do n't know any better than to do that with your money is telling , though . If you think that the C ( R ) SC actually does ID-based scientific research , you 're exactly the dupe they 're looking for . I 'm serious . Do the research for yourself . I wo n't even give you links , because you 'll blow them off as propaganda . Find any scientific journal article written by a DI member that 's actually based on actual scientific experimentation or investigation and supports ID . I dare you .""",DISAGREE,"""Is this another personal attack ? Or is it killing you that i would donate money to an organization that opposes your secular humanist agenda so you feel you must lash out like an angry child ?""","""You can do whatever you want to do with your money .""",,
37479,9810,"""I do n't think pro-choicers in general care whether or not abortion is truly rare . If they did they would put more effort into making sure it is rare , and not just legal .""","""Like campaigning for better information on and access to b/c you mean ? That 's what pro-choice groups do . Like seeking to improve benefits and general support for single parents ? yup , they do that too . As an individual , i give up time and resources to help the local family planning clinic . I ran sexual health campaigns at college . I recently did a drive to get goods to sell at a jumble sale , the profits of which go to a local single parent ( note - not just single mother ) group - and that 's just for starters . What do you do to help lower the abortion rate ?""",DISAGREE,"""I do n't think pro-choicers in general care whether or not abortion is truly rare""","""i give up time and resources to help the local family planning clinic .""",,
37496,9813,"""He is before all things , and in him all things hold together . ( Colossians 1:17 )""","""and""",DISAGREE,"""He is before all things""","""and""",,
37508,9823,"""If I was a creationist , I 'd try to avoid discussing the merits of my belief.Which is probably why you are not a creationist . But consider it from the point of view of a true believer . First comes the ideology , any discussion of that ideology will by a true believer will FIND justifications after the fact of the belief . SS is a good example of this . As is I suppose WW . Ideologues first arrive at the belief and then find justifications for it . Scientists study data and obeservations and draw conclusions which those data and observations support . The two approaches are entirely separate and opposed to one another . Scientists draw inferences , true believers make declarations of faith .""","""* * Which is why you darwinists , for all that you parade yourselves as 'scientists ' , are really nothing but 'true believers ' , intent upon evangelizing your core ideology , materialist atheism .""",DISAGREE,"""Scientists draw inferences , true believers make declarations of faith .""","""Which is why you are really nothing but 'true believers '""",,
37513,9824,"""Is he a pathological liar or does he just say the opposite of everything Bush says ?""","""Using Bush as a 180 compass is just fine by me .""",DISAGREE,"""Is he a pathological liar or does he just say the opposite of everything Bush says ?""","""Using Bush as a 180 compass is just fine by me .""",,
37532,9828,"""The theory of aggregated production , which is the point of the following book , nevertheless can be much easier adapted to the conditions of a totalitarian state [ eines totalen Staates ] than the theory of production and distribution of a given production put forth under conditions of free competition and a large degree of laissez-faire . This is one of the reasons that justifies the fact that I call my theory a general theory . Since it is based on fewer hypotheses than the orthodox theory , it can accommodate itself all the easier to a wider field of varying conditions . Although I have , after all , worked it out with a view to the conditions prevailing in the Anglo-Saxon countries where a large degree of laissez-faire still prevails , nevertheless it remains applicable to situations in which state management is more pronounced . For the theory of psychological laws which bring consumption and saving into relationship with each other , the influence of loan expenditures on prices , and real wages , the role played by the rate of interest—all these basic ideas also remain under such conditions necessary parts of our plan of thought .""","""And no , Simone , a market is a metaphor for countless individual relationships . To say it should be regulated is to say the government should interfere with consensual relationships .. To say that consensual relationships are immoral and that interfering with them is moral is turning morality on it 's head ; .""",DISAGREE,"""The theory of aggregated production , which is the point of the following book ,""","""And no , Simone , a market is a metaphor for countless individual relationships .""",,
37533,9828,"""The theory of aggregated production , which is the point of the following book , nevertheless can be much easier adapted to the conditions of a totalitarian state [ eines totalen Staates ] than the theory of production and distribution of a given production put forth under conditions of free competition and a large degree of laissez-faire . This is one of the reasons that justifies the fact that I call my theory a general theory . Since it is based on fewer hypotheses than the orthodox theory , it can accommodate itself all the easier to a wider field of varying conditions . Although I have , after all , worked it out with a view to the conditions prevailing in the Anglo-Saxon countries where a large degree of laissez-faire still prevails , nevertheless it remains applicable to situations in which state management is more pronounced . For the theory of psychological laws which bring consumption and saving into relationship with each other , the influence of loan expenditures on prices , and real wages , the role played by the rate of interest—all these basic ideas also remain under such conditions necessary parts of our plan of thought .""","""And no , Simone , a market is a metaphor for countless individual relationships . To say it should be regulated is to say the government should interfere with consensual relationships .. To say that consensual relationships are immoral and that interfering with them is moral is turning morality on it 's head ; .""",DISAGREE,"""theory of aggregated production adapted to the conditions of a totalitarian state it remains applicable to situations in which state management is more pronounced""","""market is a metaphor for countless individual relationships To say that consensual relationships are immoral and that interfering with them is moral is turning morality on it 's head ;""",,
37544,9830,"""If you 've noticed , I never point out the flaws in evolution to `` make Creationism true. ``""","""But that is your goal whether you want to admit it or not . And that is your sole way of defending creationism as you have admitted you can not argue creationism based on its own merits . Creationism is wrong independent of Evolution . Even if you somehow manage to disprove evolution ( along with every science ) you still have to even take a single step towards proving Creationism .""",DISAGREE,"""evolution to `` make Creationism true. ``""","""Creationism is wrong independent of Evolution . Even if you somehow manage to disprove evolution ( along with every science ) you still have to even take a single step towards proving Creationism .""",,
37548,9831,"""[ Not arguing with creationists ] This is not because I can not answer their arguments , but because I have better things to do with my time and I do not want to give them the oxygen of publicity .""","""Well either way he did n't answer the question . I saw the video . I saw and heard his responce . He ca n't squirm his way out of the fact that he did n't know the answer . The internet site also quotes :""",DISAGREE,"""This is not because I can not answer their arguments""","""Well either way he did n't answer the question . I saw the ca n't squirm his way out of the fact that he did n't know the answer .""",,
37556,9833,"""The study did n't address causes , and only noted the correlation , but the lead doctor did speculate that it may have something to do with hormonal changes that need to run to completion .""","""How strange that so much depends on the first pregnancy , and not the others .""",AGREE,"""doctor did speculate that it may have something to do with hormonal changes that need to run to completion .""","""much depends on the first pregnancy , and not the others""",,
37568,9837,"""( Oh , and I see you 're still equating `` atheist `` with `` anyone who does n't believe as I do `` )""","""And I see you still flip back and fourth from being an atheist to not being an atheist .""",DISAGREE,"""( Oh , and I see you 're still equating `` atheist `` with `` anyone who does n't believe as I do `` )""","""And I see you still flip back and fourth from being an atheist to not being an atheist .""",,
37575,9839,"""Originally posted by thistownwilleat Mr. Konsen speculates that the word  “ arms ” encompasses nearly the whole of the modern military arsenal . ( See Mr. Konsen ’ s paper , http : //www.cga94.com/contributors/stuff/arms/iii.htm to see his explaination . ) '' -- So ... then the laws that say that I ca n't own a tank are unconstitutional ?""","""It is not speculation . When the 2nd Amendment was written , modern military weapons were flint lock rifles . The whole purpose of the 2nd Amendment was so common people could fight off a state armed with modern military weapons . Today the weapons have changed , but the need or the intent has not . The 2nd Amendment does not mean we fight a tyrannical government with flint lock rifles .""",DISAGREE,"""Mr. Konsen speculates encompasses nearly the whole of the modern military arsenal , the laws that say that I ca n't own a tank are unconstitutional ?""","""It is not speculation When the 2nd Amendment was written , modern military weapons were flint lock rifles .""",,
37579,9840,"""Do n't count on it . The number of scientists in the American scientific community that subscribe to creationism is about % 5 , based upon a relatively recent poll . I will try to dig it up . Also , calling most Kansas residents stupid for voting in Christian Board of Education members is ridiculous . Religious views are almost never even mentioned in local politics . At the most , you see perhaps a flyer that says `` Vote ______ `` . The Christians who want to teach Intelligent Design in schools are an extreme minority that the media , in all its story-searching rating-mongering glory , is blowing out of proportion .""","""EXTREME minority . Pandions ascertations are rediculous . In the end , the decision will be made based on the accuracy of the proposal , nothing else . Back in 1999 when they removed macro evolution from the curriculum requirements , they did so because their science advisory board , a board composed of college professors from our state colleges , including a couple of folks who are cinsidered some fo the top biologists in the world , told them unanimously that while macro evolution was the best theory we currently have , it may be wrong . Apparently while there is a huge amount of data and emprical evidence to support micro evolution , the same body of evidence does not necessarily prove macro evolution . Panion is simply a zealot on the other side of the issue from the YEC folks . He/She sees gloom and doom for anybody that dares approach the theory . This kind of thinking is what sets us back to the middle ages . If we do not present the holes and weak spots in the theory , how are they ever going to be filled ?""",DISAGREE,"""Do n't count on it . The number of scientists in the American scientific community that subscribe to creationism is about % 5""","""EXTREME minority . Pandions ascertations are rediculous""",,
37619,9848,"""If you use both faith AND reason to support your belief , you are using circular reasoning .""","""Really ?""",DISAGREE,"""If you use both faith AND reason to support your belief""","""Really ?""",,
37632,9857,"""If the student answers `` 6000 years `` for the last question it is a wrong answer because the question does not call for their personal opinion .""","""But , of course , this is true of any test question in any science class . No test question in science ever asks for an opinion . They all ask for answers that confirm a knowledge of the science . The law is meant to intimidate teachers . But if a student expresses a religious opinion on a biology test , that opinion is actually irrelevant . The only consideration in grading the test is whether or not the correct answer was provided . The student may also give an answer based on religious mythology , but as long as the correct answer is given , the student passes . However , if a student answers all questions in a class of earth science or life science with religious mythology , that student fails . He/she is n't being penalized because he/she expressed his/her religious mythology , he/she is being penalized because he/she did n't answer the question correctly . Students are not asked to express opinions , religious or otherwise , on tests of knowledge of science . They are required to confirm that they have a grasp of the science .""",AGREE,"""If the student answers `` 6000 years `` for the last question it is a wrong answer because the question does not call for their personal opinion .""","""this is true of any test question in any science class . No test question in science ever asks for an opinion . They all ask for answers that confirm a knowledge of the science""",,
37636,9858,"""In developed nations with stricter gun laws there are less murders .""","""Is supposed to be logical but is a fallacy oft repeated to lure unsuspecting readers to your conclusion without any factual evidence . It is similar to the claim `` stricter gun laws prevent suicides `` . We know this is false from Japan 's history and statistics . We also know from criminologist and sociologists that method substitution does nothing to prevent suicides . In fact , in kanada , suicides increased with stricter gun laws ... another failed experiment . YOUR hint of `` developed nations `` is misleading and by presentation you try to lure the reader into thinking that gun control only exists in `` developed nations `` as if there is a superiority in people who inhabit them . Tell you what star gazer , list the `` undeveloped nations `` . I would say your nation is barbaric and undeveloped At the very least , you demonstrate it is uneducated""",DISAGREE,"""In developed nations with stricter gun laws there are less murders .""","""Is supposed to be logical but is a fallacy oft repeated to lure unsuspecting readers to your conclusion without any factual evidence . ``""",,
37644,9860,"""It is a physical entity . It has physical existence in reality . It is possible to see it , touch it , etc .""","""And as such , the term as you use it is utterly meaningless as it could be applied to any cell or sell remnant of human origin .""",DISAGREE,"""It is a physical entity . It has physical existence in reality . It is possible to see it , touch it , etc .""","""And as such , the term as you use it is utterly meaningless as it could be applied to any cell or sell remnant of human origin .""",,
37659,9863,"""ARe you really that stupid to not understand ?""","""So you actually have no answer but insult ? It would be nice if you could respond with some intelligence just once .""",DISAGREE,"""ARe you really that stupid to not understand ?""","""So you actually have no answer but insult ? It would be nice if you could respond with some intelligence just once .""",,
37683,9868,"""You make some great points but she could carry the baby to term and then put it up for adoption ........... There are long lists of people wanting to adopt babies ........... I know a couple that waited 5 years and then adopted a child from South Korea .......... Why does the innocent baby have to forfeit its life ?""","""For a 13 year old girl that could greatly damage her body to have a pregnancy so young . She is just starting to grow and mature , and its not healthy , natural , or right to have a pregnancy at that age . She could cause alot of damage being that young .""",DISAGREE,"""but she could carry the baby to term and then put it up for adoption Why does the innocent baby have to forfeit its life ?""","""For a 13 year old girl that could greatly damage her body to have a pregnancy so young .""",,
37690,9869,"""And you call atheism the curse ?""","""Worse , as Plato said , it is like a disease in the brain . When Christianity , or the Politicalzation of Religion has gone wrong , there is a standard , a moral standard , that declares this wrong . Consider , Nuremburg Trails , when the Nazis said , they were just answering to a higher authority and follow Party power , the judge declared , that they broke their own Laws , and they would answer to a HIGHER POWER - GOD . Case closed , we over road their relativism , or Nazis morality and condemned many to death . So , in every case , when Christians , or those foolishly acting in the name of Christianity have gone wrong , they are condemned by an objective moral standard . Athiesim has no such standard , and I do n't want to hear about relative `` ethics `` that mean nothing , or have no longevity , or change with the winds .""",DISAGREE,"""And you call atheism the curse ?""","""Worse , as Plato said , it is like a disease in the brain . When Christianity , or the Politicalzation of Religion has gone wrong , there is a standard , a moral standard , that declares this wrong .""",,
37693,9870,"""It is not a life until it is born .""","""Oh really ? Then what is it ?""",DISAGREE,"""It is not a life until it is born .""","""Oh really ? Then what is it ?""",,
37707,9873,"""Meaning , I take it , pure chance , accident , or just plain 'luck ' .""","""No , I mean evolution , in which statistically random variation is but one factor . It 's a terrible mistake to equate evolution with pure chance .""",DISAGREE,"""Meaning , I take it , pure chance , accident , or just plain 'luck ' .""","""No , I mean evolution , in which statistically random variation is but one factor .""",,
37711,9874,"""Since evolution ca n't prove the book of Genesis ( ancient history ) false , and creationism does have some historical backing , they are comparable and they directly conflict .""","""Only those ignorant of science and evolution think that `` evolution `` has anything to do with the Bible . I guess that 's because creationism is an attempt to pretend that mythology is somehow scientific and makes silly statements about science . It seems that science is somehow anti-Bible in that case when science debunks ignorance .""",DISAGREE,"""Since evolution ca n't prove the book of Genesis ( ancient history ) false , and creationism does have some historical backing , they are comparable and they directly conflict .""","""Only those ignorant of science and evolution think that `` evolution `` has anything to do with the Bible .""",,
37714,9875,"""I mean , why are there thousand of web sites like this one How To Protect Your Unborn Baby During Pregnancy From Serious Infections if the unborn have no value , and a lack of conscious sentience is a valid argument for killing them in the womb ? Why are you so blind as to fail to recognize that you ca n't have it both ways by arguing that the unborn only has value if the woman wants it , but is disposable if she does n't . Are you totally blind to the hypocrisy and double standard which such a shallow perspective represents ?""","""Yes , it does have value only if the woman wants it , in the early stages , when it does n't have sentience , only potential and DNA . Because then it has value only because of a woman 's wants and choices and her dreams for the future . Nothing else gives it value .""",DISAGREE,"""I mean , why are there thousand of web sites like this one How To Protect Your Unborn Baby During Pregnancy From Serious Infections if the unborn have no value , and a lack of conscious sentience is a valid argument for killing them in the womb ?""","""Yes , it does have value only if the woman wants it , in the early stages , when it does n't have sentience , only potential and DNA . Because then it has value only because of a woman 's wants and choices and her dreams for the future""",,
37734,9879,"""Does any part of the theory of evolution give an accounting of how we transitioned from quadruped movements of the ape to biped ?""","""It is more along the lines of tree dwelling to prairie . Take a look at how the current tree dwelling primate loco move , then look the mammals that live on the plains tend to stand up to peer over the grass to see if enemies are coming .""",AGREE,"""how we transitioned from quadruped movements of the ape to biped ?""","""Take a look at how the current tree dwelling primate loco move , then look the mammals that live on the plains tend to stand up to peer over the grass to see if enemies are coming .""",,
37750,9883,"""Consciousness , along with human DNA .""","""I think that you 're right to point out that both human DNA along with consciousness is necessary since there is life that is conscious but does n't have human DNA ( dogs , cats , etc . ) and there are bodies that have human DNA , yet are dead ( we 're buried with our human DNA intact ) . But I actally disagreewith `` consciousness `` being a necessary quality of `` human beings `` , since it 's unreasonable to believe that we stop being people when we go to sleep . But maybe you have a more nuanced definition of `` consciousness `` .""",DISAGREE,"""Consciousness , along with human DNA .""","""and 're buried with our human DNA intact `` it 's unreasonable to believe that we stop being people when we go to sleep""",,
37758,9884,"""So , I could certainly see , if variation was truly random that selection could theoretically pick from a pool of random variants . Unfortunately for evolutionists , the concept of randomness when it comes to new traits has never actually been proven . In fact , whenever animals experience an environmental shift , they have this bad habit of shifting right along with it , starting with an internal response from each creature who somehow `` senses `` this change . It 's hardly logical to call this random . But if each individual of a population experiences the same environmental cue , and each member simultaneously evolves the same traits epigenetically , not only will this speed up evolution exponentially , but it will also give each member the same traits at the same time -- which ultimately gives them the same basic fitness -- -- - which undermines natural selection , making mortality/breeding success mostly a lottery of circumstance , with a little sexual selection thrown in .""","""Well , yes , but this begs the question of whether , even assuming epigenetic inheritance is real , all individuals would experience the same epigenetic alterations . Now , I have no problem with the concept of epigenetic inheritance . But even if it were true it would n't do away with natural selection . Just as with basic genetic mutation , which is n't going to go away , one would expect some individuals to exhibit epigenetic alterations and others not to . This still means a population containing a range of variants that natural selection can act on , preserving some epigenetic alterations as opposed to others . Of course , if the claim is that epigenetic alterations are somehow directed by the environment , i.e . are teleological in origin , then the onus is on the advocates to demonstrate how this direction occurs . Until they do , there is no reason to suppose there is any direction at all .""",AGREE,"""So , I could certainly see , if variation was truly random that selection could theoretically pick from a pool of random variants . Unfortunately for evolutionists , the concept of randomness when it comes to new traits has never actually been proven .""","""Well , yes , but this begs the question of whether , even assuming epigenetic inheritance is real , all individuals would experience the same epigenetic""",,
37766,9888,"""I have met a creationist who believed in a semi-literal who knew more about evolution then the people flaming him .""","""And I once had a discussion with a YEC who was a degreed chemist who actually knew what science is and how it works . We had a lengthy discussion about the fossil reactors at Oklo . He limited himself to what he knew - chemistry . The discussion became one of the solubility of various salts and oxides . The chemist could find no information while I did .""",AGREE,"""I have met a creationist who believed in a semi-literal who knew more about evolution then the people flaming him .""","""And I once had a discussion with a YEC who was a degreed chemist who actually knew what science is and how it works .""",,
37769,9889,"""By the way , if you are in the least bit intellectually honest , I challenge you to actually act on any of those doubts about the reality of existence and any other reality that we understand from all human experience . Otherwise , if you never act on those doubts , you are simply being hypocritical .""","""That question is a product of flawed reasoning . It is like asking the scientific researcher to test his vaccination on himself . Do you apply that standard to all of your actions and thoughts ? For the scientist it is bad science ; for a thoughtful person it faulty reasoning .""",DISAGREE,"""By the way , if you are in the least bit intellectually honest , I challenge you to actually act on any of those doubts about the reality""","""That question is a product of flawed reasoning .""",,
37781,9893,"""Our local school district rents out school buses to groups and rents building facilities out for events all the time . It is smart .... they have the resources on hand and it provides a little extra money for the district . Granted that explanation does not fit your agenda , and it would be much easier for you to make your point if we all ignored the most LIKELY solution and instead accepted your EXTREMELY UNLIKELY solution at face value , but you cant actually expect people with any intelligence at all to do that .""","""What 's that ? Campaigning and use of taxpayer funded facilities like transportation for political purposes ? I suppose they paid the cops for going out of their jurisdiction too ?""",DISAGREE,"""Our local school district rents out school buses to groups and rents building facilities out for events all the time . It is smart .... they have the resources on hand and it provides a little extra money for the district .""","""What 's that ? Campaigning and use of taxpayer funded facilities like transportation for political purposes ?""",,
37786,9895,"""So far there is no mechanism for an organism to grow wings when it previously had none .""","""Well , actually there is . Bat wings for example are one of the easier problems for evolution to solve ( we can even see potential transitional stages in other animals like the flying squirrel ) . The co-option of existing structures is the bread and butter of evolution . Now , if bats and birds had four legs and wings , that would be more of a head-scratcher .""",DISAGREE,"""So far there is no mechanism for an organism to grow wings when it previously had none .""","""actually there is . Bat wings for example are one of the easier problems for evolution to solve""",,
37822,9902,"""Creationism is not something new , it was the prevailing view of scientists up until Darwin .""","""Oh . I know it 's not new . Being old does n't make it any more legitimate . Real science can tell the difference between valid and invalid .""",DISAGREE,"""Creationism is not something new""","""Being old does n't make it any more legitimate""",,
37820,9902,"""Creationism is not something new , it was the prevailing view of scientists up until Darwin .""","""Oh . I know it 's not new . Being old does n't make it any more legitimate . Real science can tell the difference between valid and invalid .""",DISAGREE,"""Creationism is not something new , it was the prevailing view of scientists up until Darwin .""","""Being old does n't make it any more legitimate . Real science can tell the difference between valid and invalid .""",,
37837,9904,"""Next time you walk into your doctor 's office , please notice that there 's no literature about how to control inflammation naturally .... instead , his walls , magazine racks and end tables are littered with advertisements for expensive drugs . It 's all about the money ..... and it 's money that fuels corruption .""","""just is n't the case in countries with nationalised health care , yet those countries also have a large number of pharmaceutical companies that are based there .""",DISAGREE,"""please notice that there 's no literature about how to control inflammation naturally""","""yet those countries also have a large number of pharmaceutical companies that are based there .""",,
37844,9906,"""Ah living room , bedroom all around the house , out front , outback ( backyard ) . Up and down the street , across the street , sometimes the yard next door . And after that its time to shower up with a good old bar of soap , so far not on the endangered items list .""","""Well since airsoft is COMPLETELY ILLEGAL over here i wanted to know of some of the best Urban and CQB fields over in America .""",DISAGREE,"""so far not on the endangered items list .""","""airsoft is COMPLETELY ILLEGAL over here wanted to know of some of the best Urban and CQB fields over in America .""",,
37851,9909,"""What did Jesus have to say about the issue of abortion ?""","""Well I do n't believe Jesus said anything directly about abortion but I 'm pretty sure that Jesus would not support abortion since it is murder . To further support my point on this as proving that the child developing inside the mother is not part of the mother but an individual life please click here to read a very important article discussing this issue . -theo""",DISAGREE,"""What did Jesus have to say about the issue of abortion ?""","""To further support my point on this as proving that the child developing inside the mother is not part of the mother""",,
37858,9913,"""The Christian Century ; 1/16/2002 Pope John Paul II has moved quietly to give the Vatican 's highest doctrinal authority direct control over the growing problem of pedophile priests , the official Vatican gazette has disclosed . The pope and Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger , prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith , have ordered bishops to inform the Vatican immediately of any accusations of pedophilia against priests and instructed them to swiftly investigate any suspicion of pedophilia within ...""","""And guess who cardinal Joseph Ratzinger is today . Pope Benedict XVI . He was known in the Vatican as `` The Enforcer `` . If you think that the Vatican is giving a free pass to wayward pedophile priests , you 're sadly mistaken .""",DISAGREE,"""pope and Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger , prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith , have ordered bishops to inform the Vatican immediately of any accusations of pedophilia against priests and instructed them to swiftly investigate any suspicion of pedophilia within ...""","""And guess who cardinal Joseph Ratzinger is today . Pope Benedict XVI . He was known in the Vatican as `` The Enforcer `` . If you think that the Vatican is giving a free pass to wayward pedophile priests , you 're sadly mistaken .""",,
37877,9917,"""So will you be comparing gays to child molesters and priests in your same examples ? Or blacks with slinging drugs and hoochie mammas ? Or will you note the eerie similarities betweenn the wording of some of our gun laws to the Nazi gun laws ?""","""Let me try explaining this another way . According to the logic presented in the original article : Gun Owners : discrimination by gun control laws : : Serial Rapists : discrimination by anti-rape laws You see , it 's the RELATIONSHIP that I 'm comparing . That 's what an analogy is . I 'm NOT comparing the gun owners to the serial rapists , but rather the RELATIONSHIP between discrimination and gun owners as presented in the original article and the RELATIONSHIP between discimination and serial rapists .""",DISAGREE,"""molesters and priests in your same examples ? Or blacks with slinging drugs and hoochie mammas ?""","""That 's what an analogy is . I 'm NOT comparing the gun owners to the serial rapists""",,
37889,9920,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it .""","""True . There 's the interpretation that assumes the outcome and then looks for evidence disregarding all that does n't agree . And then there is the interpretation that looks at the evidence and then makes conclusions based on that evidence . You abide to assume the outcome , look for evidence . And you have constantly asserted with absolutely no evidence , that your religious interpretation is correct . Essentially you are soapboxing as nothing you 've said has any empirical basis whatsoever .""",DISAGREE,"""shown very clearly these scientific interpretation""","""There 's the interpretation that assumes the outcome""",,
37894,9920,"""What is shown very clearly from all of these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it .""","""True . There 's the interpretation that assumes the outcome and then looks for evidence disregarding all that does n't agree . And then there is the interpretation that looks at the evidence and then makes conclusions based on that evidence . You abide to assume the outcome , look for evidence . And you have constantly asserted with absolutely no evidence , that your religious interpretation is correct . Essentially you are soapboxing as nothing you 've said has any empirical basis whatsoever .""",DISAGREE,"""these scientific interpretation of the same evidence is that there are two ways to interpret it""","""You abide to assume the outcome , look for evidence . And you have constantly asserted with absolutely no evidence , that your religious interpretation is correct .""",,
37917,9923,"""You know perfectly well that lots of good science is being done , particularly over the past few decades , that supports the devo-evo , neo-lamarckian , whole-system , responsive , dynamic , teleological view of biological evolution , that is , ID , and contradicts your particulate , passive , accidental , directionless and random darwinian notion .""","""I know you keep claiming that , but that is not an accurate depiction of reality .""",DISAGREE,"""You know perfectly well that lots of good science is being done , particularly over the past few decades""","""I know you keep claiming that , but that is not an accurate depiction of reality .""",,
37931,9925,"""XXX ? ! She is n't allowed to walk down a public alley IYO ?""","""You know I 'm not saying that . Is there no alley you 'd avoid given the chance ? Was she looking for trouble ? Police would certainly want to know what she was doing there .""",DISAGREE,"""She is n't allowed to walk down a public alley IYO ?""","""Is there no alley you 'd avoid given the chance ? Was she looking for trouble ?""",,
37939,9925,"""XXX ? ! She is n't allowed to walk down a public alley IYO ?""","""You know I 'm not saying that . Is there no alley you 'd avoid given the chance ? Was she looking for trouble ? Police would certainly want to know what she was doing there .""",DISAGREE,"""She is n't allowed to walk down a public alley""","""You know I 'm not saying that""",,
37986,9931,"""Milesian Race vs Anglo-Saxon race . They just happen to be Protestants and Catholics . Sorry , I should have known that would be over your head .""","""So you subscribe to the inaccurate idea that Irish people are part of a different group to the English people ? Genetics indicate that the UK is made up of a fairly homogenous group of people stretching back for thousands of years ....""",DISAGREE,"""They just happen to be Protestants and Catholics .""","""Genetics indicate that the UK is made up of a fairly homogenous group of people stretching back for thousands of years""",,
37992,9931,"""Milesian Race vs Anglo-Saxon race . They just happen to be Protestants and Catholics . Sorry , I should have known that would be over your head .""","""So you subscribe to the inaccurate idea that Irish people are part of a different group to the English people ? Genetics indicate that the UK is made up of a fairly homogenous group of people stretching back for thousands of years ....""",DISAGREE,"""Milesian Race vs Anglo-Saxon Protestants and Catholics""","""subscribe to the inaccurate idea Irish people are part of a different group""",,
38000,9932,"""Many Christians often say that the proofs for Evolution is very doubtful ... hmmm ... but is n't the `` Word of God `` in the bible doubtful , too ? I mean , it is just a book that is over 2000 years old . Throughout history there have been many people who tried to manipulate the basics of church . There is no real and definite proof that the words in the bible are the complete truth and that 's why there is no real proof for Creationism .""","""Just because the bible is over 2000 years old does n't make it unreliable , I mean your placing all your money on a billion year old one cell organism . You do n't have any absolute proof and neither do I .""",DISAGREE,"""but is n't the `` Word of God `` in the bible doubtful , too ? I mean , it is just a book that is over 2000 years old .""","""Just because the bible is over 2000 years old does n't make it unreliable""",,
37999,9932,"""Many Christians often say that the proofs for Evolution is very doubtful ... hmmm ... but is n't the `` Word of God `` in the bible doubtful , too ? I mean , it is just a book that is over 2000 years old . Throughout history there have been many people who tried to manipulate the basics of church . There is no real and definite proof that the words in the bible are the complete truth and that 's why there is no real proof for Creationism .""","""Just because the bible is over 2000 years old does n't make it unreliable , I mean your placing all your money on a billion year old one cell organism . You do n't have any absolute proof and neither do I .""",DISAGREE,"""but is n't the `` Word of God `` in the bible doubtful , too ? I mean , it is just a book that is over 2000 years old .""","""Just because the bible is over 2000 years old does n't make it unreliable""",,
38008,9933,"""How ignorant does anyone have to be to not be aware that carbon dating is not appropriate for dating H. erectus ? It is wrong for two reasons ; the fossils are too old and they are rock . You ca n't date rocks with carbon dating . How do you KNOW the bones are old ? Just because someone says they are ?""","""I see that you missed to point . I was correcting you lack of knowledge about carbon 14 dating . You think that you can date fossils of this age with carbon . You also seem to think that you can date rocks with carbon 14 . You ca n't . Time after time you reveal your ignorance by your inability to respond appropriately . KNM-WT 15000 was dated from stratigraphic studies of the area and dating of specific , appropriate rock samples from above and below the fossils .""",DISAGREE,"""does anyone have to be to not be aware that carbon dating is not appropriate for dating H. erectus ?""","""KNM-WT 15000 was dated from stratigraphic studies of the area and dating of specific , appropriate rock samples from above and below the fossils .""",,
38019,9935,"""Sorry to tell you this , but Behe already refuted the idea :  “ The important question for us biochemists is , can symbiosis explain the origin of complex biochemical systems ? Clearly it can not . The essence of symbiosis is the joining of separate cells , or two separate systems , both of which are already functioning ... Because symbiosis starts with complex , already functioning systems it can not account for the fundamental biochemical systems we have discussed in this book. ” ( Darwin ’ s Black Box , page189 )""","""And once again , is this a strong enough rebuttal to assert proof ? no , Behe assumes that a biochemical system that exists today can not have a precursor , or less complex state of existence . Clive did a good job of demolishing this notion with the mouse trap example he lin the debate thread .""",DISAGREE,"""Behe already refuted important question for us biochemists is , can symbiosis explain the origin of complex biochemical systems ? Clearly it can not . Because symbiosis starts with complex""","""is this a strong enough rebuttal to assert proof ? no Behe assumes less complex state of existence .""",,
38027,9937,"""how is that fair ? basically your reasoning is `` lets just give the christians the whole marriage thing , and let the gays get married at city hall by a 67 year old judge who probably doesnt agree with them anyways. `` i mean , what happened to the separtion of church and state ? did we , somewhere along the line forget , that little document we call the constitution . it dosnt simply say `` see bible `` everybody should have equal rights . no matter your race , creed , or religion . if joe and bob want to get married , how the heck is it our place to stop them ? and im sorry if it makes you uncomfortable to think of that , but unless joe comes to your house to shoot your dog , its not really your concern . and come on , im tired of all these ppl using the bible to cover up simple ignorance and prejudice . so why dont we all take a hop-skip-and- jump into 2007 , re evaluate our morals , and get a clue .""","""You have to remember that those christians believe that the laws of God superceed those of man . That thier allegiance is to God and his laws above those of the constitution . They also believe that all should be subject to Gods by force if nesesary .""",DISAGREE,"""christians the whole marriage , gays get married at city hall `` see bible `` everybody should have equal rights joe and bob want to get married""","""christians believe that the laws of God superceed those of man believe that all should be subject to Gods by force""",,
38040,9939,"""Really ? Do you know how many people get shot in the UK ? Handgun violence has gone up .""","""But your own link says that the rise in crime was partially explained by the new system the UK police were using for recording crime and that the British Crime Survey showed a decrease in crime since 1997 .""",DISAGREE,"""you know how many people get shot in the UK ?""","""your own link says that the rise in crime was partially explained by the new system the UK police""",,
38042,9940,"""( 4 ) No example of true evolution from one basic `` kind `` into another `` kind `` is known either in the present world or in the fossil record of the past .""","""What 's a `` kind `` ? Of course , evolution is a slow process so only a fool would expect to see one `` kind `` of animal change into another `` kind. `` But there are some quite good examples in the fossil record . The horse and the whale are two . And the dinosaur to bird line is getting better all the time .""",DISAGREE,"""No example of true evolution from one basic `` kind `` into another `` kind `` is known either in the present world or in the fossil record of the past""","""kind evolution is a slow process so only a fool would expect to see one `` kind `` of animal change into another `` .""",,
38057,9943,"""Ok , let 's give that a try . Evolution does n't require something to have evolved from nothing , so this is n't a valid criticism . Evolutionary theory seeks to explain the plain fact of common descent .""","""I know that . Evolution releases itself from its foundation at will . When it wants to speculate about things like abiogenesis and claim it to be science , it allows itself to do that . It 's that interchangeability thing you spoke of above .""",AGREE,"""Evolution does n't require something to have evolved from nothing , so this is n't a valid criticism .""","""Evolution releases itself from its foundation at will . When it wants to speculate about things like abiogenesis and claim it to be science , it allows itself to do that .""",,
38062,9944,"""To disarm the people is the best , most effectual way , to enslave them . ' - George Mason""","""Is George Mason some kind of anarchist ? It seems to me that the por-gun people are more and more pushing towards the 'every man for himself , the government can´t protect us , we have to defend our property and way of life ' . Shouldn´t the government be improved instead ? Besides , where I live we have very restrictive gun-laws and I´ve never feeled 'enslaved ' in any way . Ok , a comment to these 'myths ' . First of all , where did you get these facts ? Second of all , no matter how you try , now matter how much statistics you dig forth , no matter how many references to the constitution you do , you can never , ever convince me that harsh gun-restrictions would not reduce the amount of murders and the amount of armed crime . Besides , all people doesn´t share your attitude of : a good criminal is a dead criminal , so those arguments get a bit meaningless .""",DISAGREE,"""To disarm the people is the best , most effectual way , to enslave them . ' - George Mason""","""Is George Mason some kind of anarchist ? It seems to me that the por-gun people are more and more pushing towards the 'every man for himself , the government can´t protect us , we have to defend our property and way of life ' .""",,
38067,9945,"""There is nothing racist about the truth .""","""Your stated stereotype of the person in the story is racist . It 's a racist stereotype and you know it . You 're so entrenched in your own world and nothing outside of it , you would n't know the `` truth `` if came into your face like a lemon meringue pie .""",DISAGREE,"""There is nothing racist about the truth .""","""Your stated stereotype of the person in the story is racist . It 's a racist stereotype and you know it . ``""",,
38071,9946,"""The gun haters use their 1st amend right to attack the right to bear arms . When racist use their 1st amend right to attack other peoples right it is called hate speech . So why is it that gun haters demanding the banning of the right to bear arms is not considered hate speech ? After all gun haters are just like the other hate groups . All they do is attack the right to bear arms .""","""Probably because the 'hate ' is directed at the gun , not the person . Are you defending the rights of racists to exercise their free speech ? I thought 'slander ' was against the law in the US .""",DISAGREE,"""When racist use their 1st amend right to attack other peoples right it is called hate speech .""","""Are you defending the rights of racists to exercise their free speech ?""",,
38073,9946,"""The gun haters use their 1st amend right to attack the right to bear arms . When racist use their 1st amend right to attack other peoples right it is called hate speech . So why is it that gun haters demanding the banning of the right to bear arms is not considered hate speech ? After all gun haters are just like the other hate groups . All they do is attack the right to bear arms .""","""Probably because the 'hate ' is directed at the gun , not the person . Are you defending the rights of racists to exercise their free speech ? I thought 'slander ' was against the law in the US .""",DISAGREE,"""The gun haters use their 1st amend right to attack the right to bear arms .""","""because the 'hate ' is directed at the gun , not the person .""",,
38080,9947,"""If it was anybody I was choose adult stem cells . My whole point is that adult stem cells work and embryonic cells do n't .""","""well , then why are the doctors trying 2 also test the embyonic cells ? what 's their reason then ? we do n't know , because the doctors might not want everything that they 're doing be on the front page of every newspaper . they have their reasons for their actions , and they just do n't want people like you to know about them . or ... they already have their reasons published and everything and you 're just 2 close-minded 2 take the information in .""",DISAGREE,"""My whole point is that adult stem cells work and embryonic cells do n't .""","""you 're just 2 close-minded 2 take the information in .""",,
38079,9947,"""If it was anybody I was choose adult stem cells . My whole point is that adult stem cells work and embryonic cells do n't .""","""well , then why are the doctors trying 2 also test the embyonic cells ? what 's their reason then ? we do n't know , because the doctors might not want everything that they 're doing be on the front page of every newspaper . they have their reasons for their actions , and they just do n't want people like you to know about them . or ... they already have their reasons published and everything and you 're just 2 close-minded 2 take the information in .""",DISAGREE,"""My whole point is that adult stem cells work and embryonic cells do n't .""","""why are the doctors trying 2 also test the embyonic cells ? they just do n't want people like you to know about them .""",,
38087,9949,"""ah , but why do you use the word concept for both evolution and intelligent design ? Evolution is a theory that has been studied , given evidence , and offered up for peer review . Intelligent design is simply a concept , a single belief . Evolution is a theory that can be backed up and the world can benefit from it . How can the world benefit from a simple statement that there is an intelligent designer . This has absolutely no application to the natural world today .""","""Intelligent design is a recent concept ( not associated with any one religion ) and it has n't had over 100 years to be studied . Why not start now ? It ca n't happen if we block it from future generations . Why not give it a chance , study it , search for evidence , and offer it up for peer review ? What are you afraid of ? That it can mathematically rule out previous evolutionary theories ?""",DISAGREE,"""Evolution is a theory single belief .""","""Intelligent design ( not associated with any one religion ) 100 years to be studied""",,
38098,9950,"""The reason you wo n't go into how all men were created equal during reconstruction is because you can not prove that all men are not created equal .""","""depends on what you consider proof . A beliief that they are is rubbish as it can not be proven . A argument based upon behavior , history and countless examples , well it seems you do n't consider that you be of any use . That sentence does n't even make sense ! I wo n't go into arguing that your claim is right because I do n't believe it .""",DISAGREE,"""The reason you wo n't go into how all men""","""you consider proof right because I do n't believe it""",,
38095,9950,"""The reason you wo n't go into how all men were created equal during reconstruction is because you can not prove that all men are not created equal .""","""depends on what you consider proof . A beliief that they are is rubbish as it can not be proven . A argument based upon behavior , history and countless examples , well it seems you do n't consider that you be of any use . That sentence does n't even make sense ! I wo n't go into arguing that your claim is right because I do n't believe it .""",DISAGREE,"""you can not prove that all men are not created equal""","""depends on what you consider proof and That sentence does n't even make sense !""",,
38105,9952,"""Its not even allowed in Minnesota .""","""So Minnesota is the one state Ohioprof was referring to ?""",DISAGREE,"""Its not even allowed in Minnesota""","""is the one state Ohioprof was referring to ?""",,
38138,9959,"""Put a fork in it . Socialized medicine is DOA . The possible scenarios that could get the healthcare bill made into law are both suicidal moves that will cause the Democrats to become Washington outsiders in quick order . They are : 1 . Get the HR to pass the Senate Bill without any changes . This will be suicidal to the most liberal Democrats and the most Conservative ones , because the Senate Bill is a neutered version of the House Bill . 2 . They drag their feet on certifying Brown until after the reconsiliation process occurs so that they maintain their supermajority . This option is ever worse than Option 1 because it exposes every Democrat in Congress for the unprincipled b @ # $ % rds that they are and will cause a firestorm against them for years to come . If there 's one lesson that crooked politicians should have learned by now , it 's the lesson of Watergate . The people have long memories when it comes to blatant attempts to throw elections .""","""So you are saying that the democrats have no choice but to inaugarate Brown and let him stop the bill ? You suggest that whatever option they pick will be political suicide .""",AGREE,"""The possible scenarios that could get the healthcare bill made into law are both suicidal moves""","""have no choice but to inaugarate Brown and let him stop the bill ? You suggest that whatever""",,
38145,9960,"""Just because the bible is over 2000 years old does n't make it unreliable , I mean your placing all your money on a billion year old one cell organism . You do n't have any absolute proof and neither do I .""","""But at least Evolutionist can give physical proofs for their beliefs . It is right that nothing is completely sure and clear , but Evolutionists and Scientists have shown a lot more evidence that shows that Evolution is right , Creationists just ca n't show enough ... ( my opinion ) And it 's right that most stuff Evolutionists are dealing with are millions of years old , but it still all makes more sense than some stuff in the bible ... There is no complete proof for any of the theories , but Evolution just gives more evidence ... And if Creationists just want some credit for their beliefs and work , they should n't want evolution to be deleted vom Education . No one knows what is right but right now the theories of Evolution just shows more evidence and is widely accepted and used ...""",DISAGREE,"""You do n't have any absolute proof and neither do I .""","""no complete proof for any of the theories""",,
38151,9962,"""Huh ? Did we win ? When ?""","""And more importantly , where 's my damn prize ?""",AGREE,"""Huh ? Did we win ? When ?""","""And more importantly , where 's my damn prize ?""",,
38156,9963,"""Our standard expectation of evolution -- slow , steady , gradual improvement , hence change , through time -- is indeed a myth . Niles Eldredge""","""I googled your signature , and I found this just before your quote mine : `` Some of the most mythic of scientific notions lie in the realm of evolutionary biology . Evolution — the proposition that all organisms are related — is as highly verified a thesis as can be found in science . Subjected to close scrutiny from all angles for over a century now , evolution emerges as the only naturalistic explanation we have of the twin patterns of similarity and diversity that pervade all life . The basic notion that life has evolved is as certain as the existence of gravity or the idea that the earth is spheroidal . We call such highly verified notions  “ facts ” when they consistently escape all attempts to prove them false . Evolution is no myth. `` Finally , please present evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""evolution -- slow , steady , gradual improvement , hence change , through time -- is indeed a myth""","""Evolution is no""",,
38160,9963,"""Our standard expectation of evolution -- slow , steady , gradual improvement , hence change , through time -- is indeed a myth . Niles Eldredge""","""I googled your signature , and I found this just before your quote mine : `` Some of the most mythic of scientific notions lie in the realm of evolutionary biology . Evolution — the proposition that all organisms are related — is as highly verified a thesis as can be found in science . Subjected to close scrutiny from all angles for over a century now , evolution emerges as the only naturalistic explanation we have of the twin patterns of similarity and diversity that pervade all life . The basic notion that life has evolved is as certain as the existence of gravity or the idea that the earth is spheroidal . We call such highly verified notions  “ facts ” when they consistently escape all attempts to prove them false . Evolution is no myth. `` Finally , please present evidence .""",DISAGREE,"""Our standard expectation of evolution , is indeed a myth . Niles Eldredge""","""Some of the most mythic of scientific notions lie in the realm of evolutionary biology . all attempts to prove them false . Evolution is no myth. `` Finally , please present evidence .""",,
38162,9964,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional""","""Then you need no other reason . The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm is that : I want one . I need no other reason .""",DISAGREE,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional""","""The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm is that : I want one""",,
38163,9964,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional""","""Then you need no other reason . The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm is that : I want one . I need no other reason .""",DISAGREE,"""it is unconstitutional""","""The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm""",,
38165,9964,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional""","""Then you need no other reason . The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm is that : I want one . I need no other reason .""",DISAGREE,"""i agree that it is unconstitutional""","""Then you need no other reason . The only reason I need to have any kind of legal firearm is that : I want one . I need no other reason .""",,
38168,9965,"""This would imply that things such as 'love ' are not 'true ' because they ca n't be measured by science .""","""Are you sure ? Love is an emotion . Do my cat and my dog love me ? They certainly have emotions . Tell you what . Why do n't you propose a method by which `` love `` can be quantified . That way there would be no question as to whether it was scientific or not . I think that it comes back to your constant insistance that science denies anything that is non-material just because science admits a lack of tools to study the topic . Put up or shut up . How can I measure the love for my wife and children and quantify it . Do I have a limited amount of love such that I love my wife less because I also love my children ? Do I love one child more ? How is this scientific ? Are you so unable to grasp the ideas expressed that you still have n't realized that naturalistic science does not deny that there are things that can not be measured by science . Science does not deny any god . Neither can it support a god .""",DISAGREE,"""This would imply that things such as 'love ' are not 'true ' because they ca n't be measured by science .""","""Are you sure ? Love is an emotion . Do my cat and my dog love me ? ``""",,
38178,9966,"""If it behaves in such a way as to maximise profit , like its private sector alternatives , what possible purpose does it serve ? It 's either a ) Pointless . Why do n't we also have a `` public option `` pizza restaurant chain and a `` public option `` door to door sales force ? or b ) Very bad . With about a 99.999 % probabilty of b )""","""So why are you so afraid of it ? If it is bad you will have a choice to go to a private insurance company .""",DISAGREE,"""what possible purpose does it serve ?""","""So why are you so afraid of it ?""",,
38183,9967,"""2 ) God loves the gay people but hates the Sin- there is help- I can get any gay person in contact with someone who used to be gay and has been set free and he will be willing to help , just let me know and i will get his websight to you and his phone number if you like .""","""No thanks . There are other ways to meet dates . It 's very easy for gays to meet dates that are not officially gay .""",DISAGREE,"""I can get any gay person in contact with someone who used to be gay and has been set free and he will be willing to help""","""No thanks . There are other ways to meet dates""",,
38188,9968,"""Since they are issued by the military I would think so .""","""But you still feel they have the right idea when it comes to firearms ?""",DISAGREE,"""Since they are issued by the military I would think so .""","""But you still feel they have the right idea when it comes to firearms ?""",,
38210,9975,"""`` Although we do not undertake an exhaustive historical analysis today of the full scope of the Second Amendment , nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill , or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings , or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. `` -US Supreme Court in D.C. v. Heller So the US Supreme court recognizes that some restrictions are reasonable such as not allowing felons to own guns or prohibiting people from carrying guns in school areas .""","""So how are those gun free zones working out for you ?""",DISAGREE,"""-US Supreme Court in D.C. v. Heller So the US Supreme court recognizes that some restrictions are reasonable such as not allowing felons to own guns or prohibiting people from carrying guns in school areas .""","""So how are those gun free zones working out for you ?""",,
38218,9977,"""Many of the gun hating crowd also own guns . It 's the elitism belief , that they 're superior to all humans and thus deserve to be armed , while everyone else in the world should be unarmed and bow before them as if they 're gods .""","""Makes about as much sense as saying many of the car hating crowd ( people who support such laws as car registration ) also own cars . More evidence that your handlers have trained you to see the world in black and white .""",DISAGREE,"""Many of the gun hating crowd also own guns .""","""More evidence that your handlers have trained you to see the world in black and white .""",,
38219,9978,"""Can you please provide a cite in the Constitution that supports the notion that a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law `` and the subsequent power to make it so ? I did n't think so .""","""She made no such `` declaration `` . I suggest you re-read what was reported , and consult a dictionary .""",DISAGREE,"""a cite in the Constitution that supports the notion that a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law ``""","""She made no such `` declaration `` . I suggest you re-read what was reported , and consult a dictionary .""",,
38220,9978,"""Can you please provide a cite in the Constitution that supports the notion that a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law `` and the subsequent power to make it so ? I did n't think so .""","""She made no such `` declaration `` . I suggest you re-read what was reported , and consult a dictionary .""",DISAGREE,"""provide a cite in the Constitution that supports the notion that a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law""","""She made no such `` declaration `` . I suggest you re-read what was reported , and consult a dictionary""",,
38221,9978,"""Can you please provide a cite in the Constitution that supports the notion that a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law `` and the subsequent power to make it so ? I did n't think so .""","""She made no such `` declaration `` . I suggest you re-read what was reported , and consult a dictionary .""",DISAGREE,"""a Supreme Court Justice nominee has the power to declare that any case is `` settled law `` and the subsequent power to make it so ? I did n't think so .""","""She made no such `` declaration `` .""",,
38224,9979,"""`` As for the 'holes ' , well that could just as easily be said about the use of contraception , or the decision not to have children . Am I creating a population 'hole ' when I use a condom ? What about the high percentage of miscarriages that happen before the fourth week of pregnancy- more holes ? Is every moment that people could potentially have had a child creating holes ? Or is this just another invention ? ``""","""Okay , you are right ... we need a definition for a 'hole , ' as it is a bit of a subjective concept . Allow me to define 'hole ' like this : The void created by the intentional destruction of something already in existence . Using 'hole ' with this definition makes Alcorn 's statement ( minus the word 'terrible ' ) a true fact in the physical realm . And it precludes any of your other ideas from creating 'holes , ' since they all deal with potentiality , not reality .""",DISAGREE,"""that could just as easily be said about the use of contraception , or the decision not to have children .""","""we need a definition for a 'hole , ' as it is a bit of a subjective concept .""",,
38227,9980,"""A prediction was made based on the theory of evolution and it was absolutely wrong . Simple .""","""The prediction was NOT made based on the theory of evolution , but on the fact that there were fossils up until a certain time , then there were no more fossils and nobody had seen the thing . What 's so hard to understand here ?""",DISAGREE,"""A prediction was made based on the theory of evolution""","""The prediction was NOT made based on the theory of evolution""",,
38230,9981,"""However , in regards to the Bible , skeptics overturn the use of Occam 's Razor and require more than adequate proof of the Bible 's claims .""","""Look , bub , if you 're trying to paint nonbelievers and unfair because we accept Homer as the author of epics while rejecting Moses as the author of the Pentateuch or Matthew as the author of the book of Matthew , then you 're lying : we put equal scrutiny into these questions , and -- as you can see , despite your claims to the contrary -- we do n't swallow the claim that Homer wrote these epics the way we know people write books and poems today . More importantly , there are n't ( as far as I know ) absurdities that make it obvious that Homer did n't write the Iliad or The Odyssey . This is n't true of the Bible : How could Moses have written that no man as humble as Moses came before or after Moses ? ( And would n't that be pretty damn un-humble for the humblest man ever to say ? )""",DISAGREE,"""in regards to the Bible , skeptics overturn the use of Occam 's Razor""","""This is n't true of the Bible""",,
38247,9984,"""Voice of Reason ? HmmÂ…He used to be in Military Intelligence hence the debacle in Vietnam . He probably still thinks that the US won the war .""","""Are you sure ? VOR is a 14 year old kid from Florida . His IP is squarely from a ISP from Florida . If he is retired , he is the first person I have ever heard who was 60+ that used slang normally reserved for street gangs . Not to mention that his war stories place him in two different seas at the same time . Somehow 2 tours turned into 4 , midlevel ship officer turned into high ranking military advisor . All in all , VOR is far more of a liability to any of his allies because of his lying , lack of education and reading comphrension problems .""",DISAGREE,"""He probably still thinks that the US won the war .""","""Are you sure ? VOR is a 14 year old kid from Florida""",,
38251,9984,"""Voice of Reason ? HmmÂ…He used to be in Military Intelligence hence the debacle in Vietnam . He probably still thinks that the US won the war .""","""Are you sure ? VOR is a 14 year old kid from Florida . His IP is squarely from a ISP from Florida . If he is retired , he is the first person I have ever heard who was 60+ that used slang normally reserved for street gangs . Not to mention that his war stories place him in two different seas at the same time . Somehow 2 tours turned into 4 , midlevel ship officer turned into high ranking military advisor . All in all , VOR is far more of a liability to any of his allies because of his lying , lack of education and reading comphrension problems .""",DISAGREE,"""Military Intelligence hence the debacle in Vietnam . He probably still thinks that the US won the war""","""squarely from a ISP from Florida . If he is retired , he is the first person I have ever heard who was 60+""",,
38263,9985,"""We are all headed downhill . This contradicts the basic dogma of evolutionists . Life is not gaining complexity or creating new informationÂ….it ’ s in a state of rapid decay and decline .""","""See above .""",DISAGREE,"""We are all headed downhill . This contradicts the basic dogma of evolutionists . Life is not gaining complexity or creating new informationÂ….it ’ s in a state of rapid decay and decline""","""See above""",,
38272,9986,"""Can you reasonably change your mind about something like that in 2 weeks ? Is he a pathological liar or does he just say the opposite of everything Bush says ?""","""Would you like to see a list of links to Bush 's flip flops ? www.dailykos.com/story/2004/3/7/213753/1954 - http : //www.americanprogress.org/site ... RJ8OVF & amp ; b=42263 www.matthewyglesias.com/archives/002709.html www.democrats.org/specialreports/top10_flipflops www.compassiongate.com/promises econ161.berkeley.edu/movable_type/2004_archives/000444.html www.flipfloppingbush.com www.metafilter.com/mefi/31638 http : //www.interventionmag.com/cms/m ... le=article & amp ; sid =685 wampum.wabanaki.net/archives/000820.html happy ?""",DISAGREE,"""Is he a pathological liar or does he just say the opposite of everything Bush says ?""","""Would you like to see a list of links to Bush 's flip flops ?""",,
38274,9987,"""Max has outed himself as a hillbilly who can not spell or incorporate correct punctuation .""","""Ok , if Max is a hillbilly for his punctuation , then you , Ray , aspire to hillbilly-hood ! Max hitting some typos while talking about other 's intelligence was funny . You going after someone 's English is just plain ludicrous ! Do you really not know how awful your writing is ?""",DISAGREE,"""spell or incorporate correct punctuation .""","""aspire to hillbilly-hood ! Do you really not know how awful your writing is ?""",,
38293,9988,"""Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another : reason and force . If you want me to do something for you , you have a choice of either convincing me via argument , or force me to do your bidding under threat of force . Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories , without exception . Reason or force , that 's it . In a truly moral and civilized society , people exclusively interact through persuasion . Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction , and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm , as paradoxical as it may sound to some . When I carry a gun , you can not deal with me by force . You have to use reason and try to persuade me , because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force . The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pound mugger , a 75-year old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year old gangbanger , and a single gay guy on equal footing with a carload of drunk guys with baseball bats . The gun removes the disparity in physical strength , size , or numbers between a potential attacker and a defender . There are plenty of people who consider the gun as the source of bad force equations . These are the people who think that we 'd be more civilized if all guns were removed from society , because a firearm makes it easier for a mugger to do his job . That , of course , is only true if the mugger 's potential victims are mostly disarmed either by choice or by legislative fiat -- it has no validity when most of a mugger 's potential marks are armed . People who argue for the banning of arms ask for automatic rule by the young , the strong , and the many , and that 's the exact opposite of a civilized society . A mugger , even an armed one , can only make a successful living in a society where the state has granted him a force monopoly . Then there 's the argument that the gun makes confrontations lethal that otherwise would only result in injury . This argument is fallacious in several ways . Without guns involved , confrontations are won by the physically superior party inflicting overwhelming injury on the loser . People who think that fists , bats , sticks , or stones do n't constitute lethal force watch too much TV , where people take beatings and come out of it with a bloody lip at worst . The fact that the gun makes lethal force easier works solely in favor of the weaker defender , not the stronger attacker . If both are armed , the field is level . The gun is the only weapon that 's as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weightlifter . It simply would n't work as well as a force equalizer if it was n't both lethal and easily employable . When I carry a gun , I do n't do so because I am looking for a fight , but because I 'm looking to be left alone . The gun at my side means that I can not be forced , only persuaded . I do n't carry it because I 'm afraid , but because it enables me to be unafraid . It does n't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason , only the actions of those who would do so by force . It removes force from the equation ... and that 's why carrying a gun is a civilized act .""","""Just in case you missed it :""",DISAGREE,"""beings only have two ways to deal with one another : reason and force I can not be forced , only persuaded . I do n't carry""","""Just in case you missed""",,
38298,9989,"""That does not mean , however , that we should refrain out of politeness from making statements of established scientific fact just because a listener might have been exposed to contradictory religious beliefs . It is not the job of science to fix or accommodate the inaccuracies of religion . Within science classrooms , science is and should remain pre-eminent , so that people can make informed decisions .""","""But it should be the job of science to establish a clear line between just where established fact stops and philosophy starts . There 's no indication that they 're getting it done .""",DISAGREE,"""politeness from making statements of established scientific fact just because a listener might have been exposed to contradictory religious beliefs""","""job of science to establish a clear line between just where established fact stops and philosophy starts""",,
38314,9992,"""I would be interested in know who was the first creationist to finally accept that natural selection is a real phenomenon , and when they accepted it . I do n't know his name , but I 'll research it for you and tell you in a week or so .""","""My bet is that it wo n't be natural selection .""",DISAGREE,"""I would be interested in know who was the first creationist to finally accept that natural selection is a real phenomenon""","""My bet is that it wo n't be natural selection .""",,
38321,9994,"""Also , if what you say is true , and they can just `` marry `` without the celebration , what 's the point in banning it ? They 're getting `` married `` anyway , right ?""","""Who said anything about banning it ?""",DISAGREE,"""if what you say is true , and they can just `` marry `` without the celebration , what 's the point in banning it ? They 're getting `` married `` anyway , right ?""","""Who said anything about banning it ?""",,
38343,10002,"""I know one thing , anything that happens , politically motivated people will demonize us , anyway ! Like this . FBI Arrests Three Men in Terror Plot that Targeted New York If not directly blame us , they would be screaming that the Right instigated or financed it or something . That is where we are now . The Crazies have take over the parties and corruption is so rampant , that this does not look anything like the country you , I , and I guess Doc grew up in . Now we train our investigators on the law-abiding , cause we ca n't trust even them ! About the only thing I can say Sarge , is Beam me up Scotty ! Everything is sure Bazaar now .""","""Was n't sinjin crowing about his plans to take the family , wife and children , to the fair this weekend because it `` was so safe since normal folks could n't carry in that gun free pardise ? `` Insane killer escapes on field trip to county fair - Yahoo ! News""",DISAGREE,"""FBI Arrests Three Men in Terror Plot that Targeted New York If not directly blame us""","""Was n't sinjin crowing about his plans to take the family""",,