(dp0
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sa(dp6
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sa(dp7
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sa(dp8
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sa(dp9
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I1
sa(dp10
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sa(dp11
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I1
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
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I0
sa(dp1696
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I0
sa(dp1697
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sasS'texts'
p3264
(lp3265
S'Therefore you accept that the Republican party almost as a whole is "grade A USDA approved Liberalism." About time you did.   '
p3266
aS"More chattering from the peanut gallery? Haven't gotten the memo, you're no longer a player? Honestly....clamoring for attention is so low budget. No shame."
p3267
aS'Yep, suppressing natural behavior is always the way to go. We should also get them to stop pooping.'
p3268
aS'I guess we all missed your point Justine, whatever it might have been. emoticonXConfused Better luck next time. emoticonXGood'
p3269
aS'Evidence, I dont need no sticking evidence. This is what I beleive, and thats it, but I will dig up some proof that supports my point.'
p3270
aS'And I would appreciate your refraining from calling your mythology a theory.'
p3271
aS'What is it that you disagree with? My statement of fact? Or the fact that I made a politically incorrect assertion? emoticonXConfused   '
p3272
aS"Tell you what-get your math and science skills up to a grade 6 level and I'll consider taking advice from you, 'kay?  "
p3273
aS'In my case, it isn\'t \'god fearing\'.. so much as "believer fearing\''
p3274
aS'yeah just like you and your idols Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, etc.'
p3275
aS'HOLY COW!!!! Is this the "Sacred Institution of Marriage" you and jyoshu are so fervent to protect?'
p3276
aS'So a gun is a fire hazard in a public place? I gotta say the gun haters are getting more creative with their arguments.'
p3277
aS'Oh gosh , a whole bunch of cut/pastes from a 14 year old that is showing off their lack of knowledge. These are not unknown situations, and are very easily explained.'
p3278
aS"Wow, everyone's just shakin' in their boots that your imaginary god will magick them off the earth! emoticonXKillemoticonXKillemoticonXKillemoticonXBanghead"
p3279
aS'Quite amusing that you refer to westerners as Gringos. The last time I heard that was in a film about Pancho villa!'
p3280
aS"It looks like just Mucusaur, you and me, along with an entire thread of bots! (I'm not too sure about Mucusaur, to be honest!) ;)"
p3281
aS'Ah, historical inevitability. I had no idea you were a marxist, Steeeeve! Unfortunately for you the same argument applies to the collapse of capitalism. And once again you conflate capitalism and freedom. Have you never heard of anarcho-syndicalism? And why is someone more free when their life is controlled by corporations than when those corporations are restrained by a democratic government?'
p3282
aS'I have no idea what "women\'s rights" might be either. You could try to explain that to me while you are at it.'
p3283
aS'Says the one who calls everyone who disagrees with him about politics a "Bush hater" and then cowardly runs away. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3284
aS'You can thank Slick Willie Clinton who pushed through the sub-prime lending fiasco that eventually blew up under Bush. And gay-boy Barney Franks who oversaw the program.  '
p3285
aS"Don't even think about contriving how gay marrige violates YOUR RIGHTS assmonkey. That's the most ludicrous, inane statement I have yet heard from the Religious Right."
p3286
aS'Look, the "no one was around to see it" argument. "If a tree falls in the woods, and no one was around to see it, did it really fall?" You lost this one a long time ago, too. You never learn.  '
p3287
aS"Well, this guy is so bad ad arguing and so good at alienating people that if we sent him into the abortion forum, it is likely, he'd be so ineffective at defending his pro-life position thathe'd actually be contributing to the pro-choice position..."
p3288
aS"Another red herring gay argument. Ever hear of a medical power of attorney? You don't need marriage to have one, you know. emoticonXRolleyes   "
p3289
aS'  Anyone wanna make any bets on who the newbie is here???'
p3290
aS"Doctor, not guy/gal. Say the words...... A doctor.   Baby is synonymous with infant. Is fetus synonymous with infant? Strange, isn't it?"
p3291
aS"Dude, it's, like, all over the Bible, man! Maybe if you hit your forehead with Bibles more often, you would know these things!"
p3292
aS"Wow, that must be some good stuff he was drinking to keep him 'under the influence' for THAT long!! :p"
p3293
aS'Lets all make vast generalizations that are not true. Seems fun emoticonXRolleyes'
p3294
aS'That must be why they like to wear boots in Texas.'
p3295
aS'Only those ignorant of science and evolution think that "evolution" has anything to do with the Bible. I guess that\'s because creationism is an attempt to pretend that mythology is somehow scientific and makes silly statements about science. It seems that science is somehow anti-Bible in that case when science debunks ignorance.'
p3296
aS"So why did you say pot was worse than alcohol? Just because both are apparently bad, doesn't make one 'worse'. I'll point out that you compared the two first, so saying it's dumb to compare the two's shooting yourself in the foot."
p3297
aS'No but it will be funny to see what sex tapes this tramp did too....'
p3298
aS"Yes, it doesn't agree with your agenda so it must be trolling.   "
p3299
aS"Apparently someone doesn't read. Trebor was talking about me not being jewish in the following quote.  "
p3300
aS"Probably neat excuse. Do you expect jim to back that claim up? emoticonXGood Don't hold your breath."
p3301
aS'We all agree that abortion is "killing". Killing something that has yet to become self aware is different IMO. Funny you request an open "mind". My point is that it ain\'t a human being if it ain\'t got no mind. That\'s why they unplug you when you\'re brain dead.'
p3302
aS'Excuse me?! Didn\'t AIDS started because your homies either ate or did the nasty with monkeys, thereby crossing the species boundary? What did it have to do with "da man"? And crime and poverty in Africa is also the white devil\'s doing? emoticonXConfused  '
p3303
aS'It probably was a bunny suit that he was supposed to wear. I guess he changed his mind, once again, and decided to wear this suit.'
p3304
aS"THe religious reigh is not mainstream either. And frankly, you are also confusing politics and religion. You do KNOW that there is a difference? You also know there is a differnece between hateful proclimations and scholarship, don't you??"
p3305
aS"I'm not going anywhere with this thread. I just wanted to point out the obvious hypocrisy of everything your side represents, and nothing more. You all go right ahead and massage your shallow World views."
p3306
aS"Well, I guess you got something there. . . . . .can't put the cart before the hose!!"
p3307
aS'The VPC has a political agenda. The FBI? That is like saying I believe Coke taste better than Pepsi because the Coke commericial says so.'
p3308
aS"So what you're saying is that by mentioning both in the same post, I'm saying that unless someone is a YEC then they aren't a christian? Because that is what you attributed to me. Yet you have yet to post evidence of me saying that to anyone. Nor have you supported your original claim here, you said this: Last I checked, no credible fossil fuel firm hired YEC geologists. Prove this assertion since you researched it thoroughly enough to start a thread about."
p3309
aS"We came from apes not created. Why can't people figure that out did any body go to school around here."
p3310
aS'So, how many unborn babies did your God drown in Genesis? Talk about hypocrisy.'
p3311
aS"Not only would I throw the switch, I'd pay the electric bill, too. emoticonXGood"
p3312
aS'Stick with the bass guitar. emoticonXRolleyes   And if you break a string....TRY not to blame it on Clinton. :p'
p3313
aS'Over the Internet that can be a particularly difficult call...'
p3314
aS'Why would I want lies , deceptions and superstition? I mean, if believing in Jesus makes people act like you, NO THANKS'
p3315
aS'Because the NY Times, CNN, ABC, Dan Rather, and Handgun Control are all atheist-lead and anti-Christianity. Yeah.'
p3316
aS'Well, when the people who market prayer come up with evidence that it works as described, let us know! As a meditation technique, it might work fine, who knows, but then, so do many other methods.  '
p3317
aS'Buy stock in the failing banks? What a great investment. Tell me, where does the money come from?'
p3318
aS"I'll let you know if or when I'm ignoring you, O Hell-bound spawn of Satan."
p3319
aS'so if right now, i ask god for forgivness, someone kills me, i will go to heaven by default? makes sense to me, i mean, i dont have time to sin...'
p3320
aS"Not quite sure what you are talking about, Iangb. And I really don't have time to crack the code so if you have a specific question, just ask it already."
p3321
aS"  Are you being dense on purpose? I said that I'm not all into the semantics of baby/fetus. I'll conceid that its killing a baby. The TERM for it is fetus, fetus' become babies. I see the logic there (in fact I think I'm agreeing with you). Why must you keep pounding this drum?  "
p3322
aS'When do you advocate breeding blond haired, blue eyed citizens to purify the US?'
p3323
aS"that's right, i don't want ANOTHER parental figure to tell me what to do, when to do it, and how to do it."
p3324
aS'...or we could feed the criminals to the dinosaurs!...save the cows for meatloaf.'
p3325
aS'You question others sources and credibility yet you parade around under the name of a giant cartoon Shake?'
p3326
aS"* - edit: you know, actually, evidence in the form of experimental results are reviewed, or at least the methods are reviewed, and then if the experiment isn't reproducible then the evidence becomes suspect, so in that light evidence is, sort of, reviewed. Eh, who cares?)"
p3327
aS'And yet here we are and neo-Darwinism continues to have empirical support right and left with no sign of it being falsified in sight as of yet. Why might that be? And you Bertvan do not exist since you are so highly improbable. Therefore I can safely assume that your post above just happened without your existense.'
p3328
aS'Said like a lazy, ignorant person who would rather live off the sweat of others than go out and earn for himself.'
p3329
aS"Yeah, so will slaves who don't know their Biblical place under their masters, and women who don't submit to men."
p3330
aS"So you haven't got an answer to the question and prove that you are 'busted'.. That's OK...as long as we can all see that."
p3331
aS"You wouldn't. More likely you'll pursue your Wiccan follies until Judgment Day and then wonder what hit you."
p3332
aS"If I had said that, I would have been wrong. But the fact is that I didn't say that. You seem to have a problem in undertanding English. Let me help. Here is what I said:  "
p3333
aS'It is also enough for me to realize you people are using words without definitions.   '
p3334
aS"Yeah. It's snowing sooner here in the Midwest. I think the next Ice Age is coming."
p3335
aS'Yeeees, that\'s why option 4 as I wrote it says "reinterpret" as opposed to "reject."   Having a bad reading day, eh?'
p3336
aS"It also isn't a baby yet either. It is called a fetus."
p3337
aS'You already screwed them over when you decided to cover their country in radioactive dust. Depleted uranium is a real bitch.  '
p3338
aS'You know my answer: There is no god and no one "created" mankind. But the discussion over the existence of god belongs rightly under "Religious" or "Philosophy" section, not abortion.   Is this one of the tactics you fundies frequently practice? Change the subject when you are about to lose?'
p3339
aS'No, you at least need a sling shot and ball bearings, lol.'
p3340
aS'And you are only trying to earn yourself brownie points in hell.'
p3341
aS'And like I said, your opinion is worth exactly NOTHING. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3342
aS'Are you kidding me?! You think that blacks living in Third World Carribean and African countries are "content?!" They\'re starving by the tens of thousands per day or living so far below the poverty level that it\'s unimaginable. Maybe you should wander off the beach sometime and see for yourself.  '
p3343
aS'The horsehoe bend was cretaed by the flood in the image of the immaculate horseshoe. repent heathen!'
p3344
aS"  I know, maybe the American criminals will just import guns in with their Mexican illegal drugs. I don't know for sure but I believe the Mexican Drug gangs wouldn't mind another revenue stream. Net results, Zilch, nada, zero. But you know that! emoticonXSmilie Gun control is nothing but a scam!"
p3345
aS'Careful now, Simone. A lesser man might report you to the moderator.;)  '
p3346
aS'If the same question had been posed by different polls over time it would be easier to draw trends from the responses..... but good luck with finding some trends in amongst that lot.'
p3347
aS"Ah, the esteemed Washington Times, the rag of that Korean Reverend who does the mass marriages and other weird stuff--um, what's his name now?"
p3348
aS"Haaaaa Haaaaa Haaaaaaah haahhhha HAhaaaa. My GOD I can't stop laughing Heeee Haaaa."
p3349
aS"Well you wouldn't have to 5hit yourself everytime you walked down the streets if you had a gun yourself."
p3350
aS'Your problem is that you take the Bible as the Literal Word of the Invisible man which everyone with a brain knows it is NOT. There are other "Sins\' listed in the old testament that you ignore and try to explain away but you know as well as I that Jesus did not change the Laws. If you want others to live by your False book of fairy tales it would be a Good Idea for you to read it and follow it yourself first. Choosing one or two scriptures and using them to attack people is only making you look foolish.  '
p3351
aS'Good news. It seems as time goes on Arizona attempts to become more and more intolerant and bigoted. Thankfully he put an end to this one (too bad not the immigration one).'
p3352
aS'Once again archie squirms when the definition of regime is pointed out to him and it nullifies his claims.........'
p3353
aS"Two Vikings on one board? Time to beat a hasty retreat before I'm pillaged emoticonXChicken"
p3354
aS'Once again, you have attempted to use the Bible to further your agenda and have been found lacking. emoticonXRolleyes   '
p3355
aS'So you are saying that we determine our DNA? Do you actually think before typing?'
p3356
aS'Ha.a.a.a :p emoticonXGood Good one, sinjin.  What is the sound of one hand clapping.....?  Ladywolf,  Your answer will probably come from many different sources. Your idea that it evolved is pretty-much it, IMO.'
p3357
aS'Oh, look, removing a quote from its context. How about your address my textbook definition next?  '
p3358
aS"Only some? what's this then:  hxxp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Pakicetus_(1).jpg  Replace the xx with tt in case you're wondering why I put the link up like that, it's the stupid post count thingy."
p3359
aS'Is this a rational statement? If so, prove it rationally, by science.'
p3360
aS'Let me return the kindness. The correct spelling is ==> especially   '
p3361
aS'It is only difficult to sort out if you are a neocon and fail to recognize that neocons are nothing but militant liberals.   Bush was BY FAR the most liberal president we have had for at least 20 years.   Maybe you need to research traditional conservative values.'
p3362
aS'What, pray, is a real answer? Because, you know, if it is anything like a corrcect answer you are doing a rather poor job of it, mate.'
p3363
aS"The riddles continue? emoticonXConfused Wouldn't it have taken less time and have been less ambiguous if you or Dr Spock just posted the # of the post?emoticonXRolleyes emoticonXRolleyes"
p3364
aS"My pursuit of happiness is denied by trees existing. Let's burn them down and destroy the environment. It's much better than me being unhappy."
p3365
aS'Pathetic, why would you let anyone besides yourself determine who you call family? Nobody is forcing their religion on you. Nobody is even saying who you can or can\'t get married to. What is being said is that you, or anyone else, doesn\'t have the "right" to have that marriage recognized by gov\'t. Universal recognition by gov\'t doesn\'t even happen in hetro marriages. Nowhere in the founding documents of this nation does it say "All gov\'t entities shall recognize all people\'s marriages". Since we have "a government for the people by the people", the duties of government not spelled out in the founding documents are determined by the people. You have the freedom to vote your beliefs and so does everybody else.'
p3366
aS"Of course I can't. Can you guarantee that the apparent mugging about to happen isn't some poor slob about to ask directions?   Big guy, dark parking lot, bang bang. Better safe than sorry, eh?"
p3367
aS'Yup. Give me an example of a true inaccuracy, instead of working to poke fun. Do you honestly think anyone will take you seriously (except the evolutionists) if you don\'t provide reasons for your apparent problem with scriptures. Are you scared because you see the "ancients" commenting on subjects you thought science had "discovered" since the "enlightenment"? Man, how arrogant can you get? You remind me of the Pharasees. Arrogant presuppositions are no substitue for confronting your ignorance my friend. Either explain how the Bible speaks accurately on sophisticated subjects as given above, or don\'t bother posting.'
p3368
aS'Hmmm, a mere human-mother cannot make decisions concerning her own body, but you, sk8joyful, can usurp the position of God and tell another human, especially a mere human-mother, what she is allowed to do with her body.'
p3369
aS"Me, too. I'd probably throw in some counseling as well, just for starters."
p3370
aS'Including the mentally ill, those with previous violent felonies, and children?'
p3371
aS'And here is the crux of the matter where I think Libertarians are missing it: As one Founding Father said, "There can be no liberty without virtue." Someone else once said, "Intemperate men can never be free because their passions give rise to their bindings".   If the God of the Bible is right, a nation which legalizes sin and intemperance loses the favor of God. And when the sins of a nation reach their fullness (in God\'s eyes), that disfavor can turn to judgment (Genesis 15:16, Deuteronomy Chapter 28 - "The blessings of obedience and curses of disobedience). Therefore, while many of the Libertarians mean well on liberal social issues, they nevertheless either don\'t see the big picture, or they don\'t believe it will occur.'
p3372
aS"If it isn't so hard then why haven't you found it yet? I am still waiting and you becoming cocky is not helping you."
p3373
aS"Good point here, because the media never insults right-wingers....emoticonXRolleyes   I don't think anybody is denying that Imus' comments were tasteless and offensive. The point that is being made here is that he has the right to make such comments. He didn't discriminate against anyone. He simply said something stupid. If this is going to be considered a crime, we would all be locked away."
p3374
aS'Well then, using just the Bible, what is the value of pi to the third decimal point?'
p3375
aS'Nice spin. Would you have preferred "the civilized world" instead? Or Western Civilization or Gay Western Civilization? Your preference? One case in 1959 isn\'t a pandemic.   '
p3376
aS"Oh spare me the condemnation ya' XXXX-hard. You aren't interested in saving souls. If you were, you would bother to have payed attention to the countless times you have been told that your abrasive, insulting tactics DON'T WORK.   Plus an eternity in hell or an eternity with a terroristic God? I think I will stick with being able to live with myself for even today, let alone an eternity.  "
p3377
aS"The fact that you think the 9-9-9 plan is good only proves you are as stupid as Herman Cain is. Maybe you and Grover Norquist can get with Herman Cain and start construction on Utopian dreamworld, and don't forget to stop by and pick up your other dumbass Ron Paul on your way ."
p3378
aS'This just goes to prove that these nasty gays are maliciously infiltrating the military far more than we suspected (anyone would think they want to defend the country or something). But no, they just want to infect them with nasty squiggly crawly things. EEeew!! Look the SEALS must be a bunch of raving deviants. Quick, club the lot of them before this thing spreads.emoticonXRolleyes   Er . . . *puts down burning cross and slinks into shadow*'
p3379
aS'He didn\'t pursue the "master race of white Protestant." He was a pure Aryanist, genius one. The very least you could do is get your facts straight, but you probably like spreading this bullcrap on purpose. (Seeing as how you\'re an atheist.)'
p3380
aS'Yeah guess that probably makes me a gun-toten redneck drunk,shooten everything in sight huh.emoticonXKillemoticonXGood'
p3381
aS"And you're accusing him of not debating properly? That's the best you can do?"
p3382
aS'You mean like how you suck any rationale thought or discourse from a debate topic? Talk about ABORTING.'
p3383
aS'I thought you had vowed never to post in this forum again. ????? I suppose with your views on divorce, your wedding vows have as much weight as your vow not to post here.'
p3384
aS'Wow that worked well. Please explain where his logic is flawed in the point he made. You cant, because its not. This just proves how much this "point" along with all your other arguments have "flaws in logic" if you will.'
p3385
aS'Find me a mass shooting in Utah where concealed carry on campus is legal.'
p3386
aS"****! I go to Home Depot, have a basic understanding of car maintenance, love to fish, always wear sensible shoes and will frequently go without make-up. I never knew I was a XXXX. Man if I can't get my stereotypes right, I guess I will just have to give up my crush on the cute dude guitar player I saw last night..... :p"
p3387
aS'This is from an article I read on it...so if we just get a bunch of aerosol spray cans we can combat any warming emoticonXGood'
p3388
aS'I guess I am just "psychologically conditioned" to be blue eyed.?'
p3389
aS"No I can't marry them becasue some of them are married. Also none have intent to li ve within Mass."
p3390
aS"Um no... It's the truth... Um, I guess it was sarcasm, but I don't think that would be something that you would understand."
p3391
aS'I suppose if you Truly Believe its not dishonest to repeat anothers ideas as if they were your own. I will keep this in mind the next time I have to write a paper. Woe betide any professor who accuses me of plagiarism, for he is trampling my religious freedoms!  '
p3392
aS"Pure conjecture on your part. As a father of three, I have as much vested interest in my kids as my wife has. To suggest otherwise is BS. But, maybe you don't understand that because you haven't walked a mile in a father's shoes. emoticonXRolleyes"
p3393
aS'I feel a No True Scotsman coming on. Should I even bother to mention Hovind?'
p3394
aS"I won't waste my time with trolls here. Do you have anything useful to say?"
p3395
aS"I see you've met my stalker. Lovely soul, isn't s/he? ;)"
p3396
aS"That's like looking at a rainbow and insisting it only has the color red in it.  "
p3397
aS"Actually, breeding horses and donkeys isn't an effort to create a new species. Where did you get such a thoughtless idea. And neither is interbreeding lions and tigers. However, you don't seem to be aware that neither ligers or tigons are sterile. They are capable of breeding with each other or with either of the parent species. And then there are polar bears and brown bears, which can and will interbreed if given the opportunity. And the offspring are perfectly fertile."
p3398
aS'You really are an idiot if you think China follows Jefferson'
p3399
aS'Come now, VoR. Everyone knows that the French would never fight another country.....by themselves. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3400
aS'Is it not extremely cold at 35,000 feet? Did he not suffer from hypothermia due to the extreme cold at 35,000 feet? Did he not fall from the sky and break near all his bones when the wheel well opened for landing after a lengthy flight at 35,000 feet? Do I have to give you the flight number and type of airplane in order to get my stuffed animal circus prize?'
p3401
aS"Well are there 4 or are there none? What about the Archaeopteryx lineage, why do you keep avoiding the question by changing the subject? It's no wonder scientists get annoyed with creationists."
p3402
aS'Really. If that\'s being "saved," I prefer to go down with the Titanic.'
p3403
aS'Sheeple never understand where money comes from nor do they know cliffs even exist. Full bellies, breeding, mindless entertainment and a government sheppard are their sole requirements.'
p3404
aS'Already busted, Mr. Trebor. Went in one eye and out the other. Come back when you have something other than generalized rhetoric.'
p3405
aS"He wasn't trying to. Shooterandproud may be an unreasonable gun nut, but he accepts evolution."
p3406
aS"No, you wouldn't have. I'd have a better chance of winning the lottery without buying a ticket."
p3407
aS'Well since Bush took office the mantra has bee "Local Control" has it not. Apparently the people of your state want whats happening. Local control in action. Rejoice in your victory.'
p3408
aS"B.S. simone. He was the perfect age for Vietnam. Why hasn't he released his draft card? I know, they only sent them to citizens."
p3409
aS"So which argument do you want to stick with/ The one above that says the black vote was irrelevent or your previous argument in which you claimed was significant. I'll refresh your memory::  "
p3410
aS'Well, we have our head in the sand in more ways than one.'
p3411
aS'You are so FUN. Its amazing to hear you say this considering how much you applaud a law that pretty much allows this in Arizona.'
p3412
aS"Liar, liar, pants on fire. You pro gay sex heathens haven't a clue what's coming your way. And you don't have to like it.  "
p3413
aS'How about not clicking the "reply " button twice (heh,heh,) No, we didn\'t (Thank goodness) AND! PM Blair is recanting from the Kyoto protocol. Bully for him!'
p3414
aS'I have no problem with them preaching against gays in their churches and the privacy of thier homes. Its when they crawl out from under their rocks that I have a problem. I also have absolutly no problem what so ever with them talking about Jesus if only they would keep to the subject of Jesus and leave all gay issues alone. Unfortually Paul has replaced Jesus in many churches.'
p3415
aS'Aaahhh, so just not accomplishing our goals and going home is not defeat, there has to be paperwork for it to be a defeat. Gotcha.   '
p3416
aS'And you wonder why people call "republicans" racist, women hating bigots. (hint: it\'s comments like yours)'
p3417
aS'In England we have a sack with a couple of bricks inside it.'
p3418
aS"I'm sure Jebbo has no alterior motive in this at all emoticonXClown   No, really he doesn'temoticonXConfused   Honestly emoticonXDonno   Please stop smirking emoticonXBye"
p3419
aS"I can't convert you JSD, only Christ can. But you must be open to Him and His Spirit for that to happen so don't be looking to me to save you. And you may think I'm self deluted, as in somehow watered down, but you are self deluded as in completely entrenched in your bigotry and ignorance of what is right and true. But thanks for judging me. I welcome it. :p"
p3420
aS"This is a laughable oversimplication of reproduction. Humans don't make copies. Do you reproduce asexually? I know I don't."
p3421
aS'Don\'t forget that he\'s the anti-Christ and wants to starve Seniors and "babies". That\'s part of the DNC mantra too. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3422
aS'Yes, we should have a speedier route to the needle. If we miss a few, send a few innocent people to their deaths, no harm no foul.'
p3423
aS'You are, in effect, telling me that putting someone in a position that will inevitable leave them dead does not make you responsible for their death. If I fire a bullet at your head, while that bullet is in mid-air, I am no longer doing anything to hurt you, and you are fine. However, I have set in motion affects that will result in your demise. This makes me responsible for your death.'
p3424
aS"And the scientific papers don't. The problem here is that creationists don't read the scientific papers. In fact, most can't even understand them."
p3425
aS"Oh what a shame! Especially if it's true! Where did you get the idea that ID theory is not based on evidence and/or testing?"
p3426
aS'I sincerely doubt any of that happened. If so you would have links. Yea we know you are cyber brave to the point of heroine status. You are a troll pure and simple.'
p3427
aS"Ok, if Max is a hillbilly for his punctuation, then you, Ray, aspire to hillbilly-hood! Max hitting some typos while talking about other's intelligence was funny . You going after someone's English is just plain ludicrous! Do you really not know how awful your writing is?"
p3428
aS'I am un-aware of a conservative nazi party. Did Howard Dean tell you this?'
p3429
aS'Yes, necessarily for YOUR genocidal rantings. But not for actual reality.  '
p3430
aS"Hey, it's the same god, just older. The birth of his son mellowed him out, you know,.. made him think about the future more, and have to worry about responsibility and all that stuff."
p3431
aS"EZ is just delusional , you are ignorant.. there's a big difference. You should know considering he's your best friend...emoticonXHoho"
p3432
aS'If I ever need a kidney to live, I know who to tell them to harvest from... whether or not you agree to it :P  '
p3433
aS'Yes when not hailing jesus, he likes to leave droppings here and there about the boards ...'
p3434
aS'Nice try. Now, tell me how atheists are paying for "Christian benefits"? Do Canadians give money to people based on their religion? They surely don\'t here in the States. I can only collect SS if I pay into the system. My employer AND I pay for my family\'s healthcare. As for their tax-free status, I would have no problem removing it...just as I\'d love to see the ACLU and other crackpot liberal organizations lose their tax-exempt status. emoticonXGood   '
p3435
aS'Oh vey! Vat du they say about the U.S. Marshals service committing more crimes than people they have actually arrested for a crime?'
p3436
aS"So you are an expert in this like you were about the economics of sending money out of the country?  The problem with letting people like you call the shots is that you really have no idea what you are talking about.  It's something I see in a lot of conservatives."
p3437
aS"Yes I apologize for your ignorance and your inability to 'get it'....   "
p3438
aS'But in all reality an embryo is inside a uterus, living solely through a placenta and a two month old baby is not. That is a significant difference. One may argue how significant, but it is silly to say the only difference is time.'
p3439
aS"That's good - so you no longer believe all actions that result in inevitable deaths are killings, only cruel ones. This is an improvement on your previous:  "
p3440
aS'Yes, but if true it would certainly make the investigation go easier and the repair of other bridges faster and cheaper. Ban gay marriage - your bridges never collapse - imagine that!'
p3441
aS"And then you can go pat yourself on the back and pretend it's all better. I hope your personal comfort level will be worth the havoc that will be brought upon the lives of women."
p3442
aS'That is the greatest monologue in the history of Earth. Instead of a resume, I will just fax this to my next prospective employer.   Great stuff.'
p3443
aS"When's the last time you heard of someone being killed by the accidental discharge of a fire extinguisher? Or when the last time a fire extinguisher was stolen from a home and then used in the commission of a crime? And don't you think the likelihood of being in a car accident is greater than that of being required to shoot someone?"
p3444
aS"You seem to require a slick answer to a complicated question - so how about this:  Question: Was Stalin a communist ?  Answer: That's what he said he was.  Hope this is glib and vacuous enough to meet with your exacting standards."
p3445
aS"I'm sorry, did Article V have a clause I'm missing that says you can only amendment the constitution if it accomplishes more freedom? Is there anywhere in the history of that provision that supports this? Can you point to ANYTHING that supports your incorrect viewpoint?   "
p3446
aS"And isn't it time that the Bush haters on the opposite side of the argument quit spreading lies about the constitutionality of the law? I'm sick of unsubstantiated liberal blather, aren't you? emoticonXRolleyes"
p3447
aS"So all of this ballyhoo and really you've changed nothing? emoticonXConfused   The entire system of inheritance and wills would still be in place.  "
p3448
aS"Except for, ya know, like the whole Old Testament.   False testament: archaeology refutes the Bible's claim to history"
p3449
aS'Hey that cheeseburger is on me,and make sure it has extra  rat poison!'
p3450
aS"Yep, so much for a pastor knowing his sheep(le).  It's no wonder that they aren't noticed when they go missing.  What ever happened for the shepherd going out and seeking his lost sheep to bring them back to the fold???  As to this case.  I mentioned earlier about Rick Warren (author of A Purpose Driven Life)...he doesn't have armed guards in his mega church.  But, then again, he's not a fleecing WofF in shepherds clothing who seeks to ravenously devour a flock."
p3451
aS"Come on down to skid row with the rest of us 'lower class' I'll even buy a bottle of MD 20/20 on me.  "
p3452
aS'The last known passenger pigeon died in 1914. Your attempt to inflame the discussion fails on the grounds of utter stupidity. Might as well be asking if he bagged a tasmanian tiger, or a chupacabra, or the mothman.'
p3453
aS"Well if you already know you're for guns, then you should know the basic reasons, right? Or was this an uninformed decisions (I heard from my friend that guns are good)? But basically other people have said it. They're protected by the Constitution, they generally result in lower crime rates, and they can be used for defense as well as hunting. Oh, but the burden of proof isn't on the people supporting guns, but those who wish to ban guns. Most arguments for banning guns are easily refutable."
p3454
aS"The vast majority of scientists do not believe in Creationism, and all those people you listed who say there are only 2 varients evolution or creationism--they are't anthropological or theological experts. All they know is their westernized view. Their opinions have no reflection on Biology in that sense. THey should stick to Biology. There is only 1 true way--that's evolution. THe other's are wishful thinking, whether they be the primordial flood, the divine parrot, or magic god who made people from dust."
p3455
aS'Do you think that red herrings and strawmen will help your case? ;)'
p3456
aS'Well nobody has turned up the Ark have they, termites could assure that if properly used. After 40 days and more they would be ravenous.'
p3457
aS'they held a big bash in honor of sluttish welfare queen Ayn Rand:  '
p3458
aS"Oh, I think you take delight in spelling it out in excruciating detail. Otherwise, you'd reply on point.  "
p3459
aS"And you know he is NATO's boy how? You get a bit more looney with each post there comic relief. Keep the laffs coming tho."
p3460
aS"Good, associate yourself with him. After all, having a best pal who weaves a web of contridictions and lies can't hurt you right?"
p3461
aS"Who is this god you speak of? Can I call him? I have some things I'd like done and he can just say them while on the phone I'm hoping.  -Mach"
p3462
aS"Oh but he is different in the mule's tiny mind. The Southern Baptist types are Christian and so uphold the mule's way of life, so it's alright for them to call for mass death."
p3463
aS'So, in your scenario, Prototype, are you anti-choice folk going to force us who believe in choice, who believe that a woman owns her very own body, are you going to place us in re-education jails so that we, too, believe that a fertilized egg is a human being?'
p3464
aS'No. I\'ll type slowly so I don\'t get ahead of you this time. Follow with your finger and move your lips if no one is watching. Scientists get to define what they mean by the scientific words that they use. Not you and not your preacher. Do I get to define what you mean by the word "prayer?" Why not?'
p3465
aS'Hang in here everyone, Bassman\'s been reading "_____"\'s posts over and over and they\'ve got him talking about the "American Holocaust"! emoticonXBanghead   Until you have been in my exact situation, I wouldn\'t expect someone like you to understand. I really don\'t give a emoticonXCensored if you think it is selfish or not - it is not for you to judge.'
p3466
aS'No, but I read some of the evidence and it looked pretty solid. If this person was sentenced to life in prison without parole would you question the verdict?'
p3467
aS"Look what is talking about insane, immune to reason, a prisnor of his own giant ignorance, slavery fetishist and one of the comic relief 3 stooges. You might have a dialogue but then insult isn't part of one. No one gives a rat's patoot about your opinion. If it were your country maybe they would but I doubt it. Mean while eat your heart out as you rail in fear about us buying and keeping arms."
p3468
aS'But how can we make rules without legal lines in sand? At least its better than an illegal line.'
p3469
aS'I thought it was at the bottom of a large body of water.'
p3470
aS'Death might not bother you, but the afterlife is going to be a real killer!'
p3471
aS"Dude, you only figured that out now?   I'm disappointed in you.   just joking. Everything he states has a hidden agenda."
p3472
aS'Are there many liberal democrat left wing thinking born again Christians? Weird huh?'
p3473
aS"I can tell that you dismissed the post below that. And I feel I can assume that you didn't read it. Odd that a paranoid conspiracy theorist / communist who concluded that communism has never led to dictatorship should accuse me of being a fanatic."
p3474
aS"Really?! Wow! You must know only hardcore pro-lifers. I'm a pro-lifer who believes in birth control and I can rattle the names of about a zillion others who share my opinion. emoticonXWow"
p3475
aS"And you have a right to cling to superstition and magic as true. But that doesn't make mythology true."
p3476
aS'Your definition of "Godly wisdom" is agreeing with your political positions and your spurious theological justifications for them, so it\'s hardly surprising you don\'t encounter any liberals who you think have "Godly wisdom"'
p3477
aS"Funny, I thought Heribert Nilsson was a botanist. Don't let little details like that get in your way though."
p3478
aS'Here you are using the misogynist POV. No "Rushspeak" if you please.  '
p3479
aS'Why doesn\'t this apply to Soviet Russia - which had a population of similar size ? Presumably, your answer would be that the USSR was less "developed" than the US ?'
p3480
aS'April was "recent" ? Please provide evidence from the memo of these "examples".'
p3481
aS'No need for further evidence why this law would be dangerous to those who do not think exactly like you do!   Instead of calling it a government terrorist watch list, we should just drop the pretension and call it what it would be come. The Democrat Political Enemies Terrorist Wish List! :lol:   Bloomberg: Deny Second Amendment to People on Terror Watch List'
p3482
aS"Oh, it gave me quite a shock when that happened! I wasn't expecting it at all! emoticonXRolleyes"
p3483
aS"You just had to bring Godwin into didn't you. >_>   Besides what good is a corpse? Nevermind you're never going to understand my logic so I might as well not waste the time."
p3484
aS'Oh . . . please be gentle with me. Whew! :p   '
p3485
aS"Well then the courts must be insane. Because I'm sure there are some gun control laws that they're struck down due to their ineffectiveness."
p3486
aS'How do they use "the empirical evidence prove it", when they do no research, and no evidence actually supports their "theory"?'
p3487
aS"Fundies don't say do as I say, not as I do. We say do as God says, not as I do. There's a huge difference."
p3488
aS'Oh! Goody! At last someone who wants to actually discuss evolution instead of mythology!'
p3489
aS"Poor little poopie.   If your gay sex agenda wasn't of the devil himself you might be better received in the world."
p3490
aS"If science deals with how information is gathered, different ways of analyzing, and different hypothesis, then it involves worldviews. The base for the worldview of a sizable part of the population should not be excluded. Maybe in Saddam Hussien's Iraq, maybe in communist Russia, but not in the United States."
p3491
aS'It ok if one persons bottle is bigger or do they kinda have to be roughly equal in size? really.'
p3492
aS"With a standing president breaking the law to 'protect' you, this should be expected."
p3493
aS'Was that so hard? Anti gay Christians do want gays to oppose their, marriages, discriminate against them, oppose christians from being able to adopt, and practice thier religion. Since anti gay christians are doing all these things to gay people then that is how they want gay people to treat christians.'
p3494
aS"Would it be the lawless Cardinal Law officiating at one of the funerary masses for JPII and otherwise serving in a prominent role in all the pomp and circumstance surrounding the pope's death?"
p3495
aS"Then what's Mississippi's problem? They must be run by a-holes because they are being forgotten.  "
p3496
aS'Really? Then why did you start off your little rant by admitting that "...microevolution cannot be reasonably disputed." Evolution has been observed, and that is a fact. Speciation in both plants and animals has been observed, and that is a fact. Apparently you don\'t know what a theory is. Might it not be wise to learn just a little about science before you make yourself look so foolish? Theories explain facts.'
p3497
aS'Really. Have you got any quotes from them endorsing monopolies?'
p3498
aS'Appears a lot of sensible folks are investing in their 401G and 401A plans ;)'
p3499
aS"I didn't know neanderthals like you and Mr. Grimm had the social graces to know what to do with toilet paper."
p3500
aS'But you still feel they have the right idea when it comes to firearms?'
p3501
aS"...? Either you've misread what I said, twisted what I said, or you're just stupid."
p3502
aS'And we all know when you say "We" you mean your buddies the Mormons and their Money are the ones voting down such bills.. It\'s just a matter of time before people start to wake up. Once they realize they\'ve been duped by an invisible man they\'ll do the right thing and give gay people their rights.  '
p3503
aS"I'm a redneck because, unlike you, I believe in self-determination?! emoticonXWow"
p3504
aS"Oh. Then you're just a dupe rather than being dishonest. Your information comes from a moonie. Funny that the Discovery Institute doesn't mention that. The fact that he decided to study biology with the express purpose of disproving evolution. So he had made up his mind that it was wrong before he undertook to find out what is was. Wells was encouraged by the Rev. Moon. He is known selective presentation of data."
p3505
aS"Numbers don't lie, unless they come out of the mouth of a Politican."
p3506
aS"You're lying to yourself.. So I'll just keep letting you know until the cloud of delusion dissipates.  "
p3507
aS"Deliberate deception would be putting million year old dinosaur bones on a thousand year old planet. Even more deceiving would be putting vast amounts of oil here as well which takes millions of years to create. I would put the stars in the sky in the same category as this in terms of deception. The stars could be more of a cosmetic thing as far as God is concerned. He could have just added them to our sky without concern for whether it made sense or not. I personally wouldn't fault him for this."
p3508
aS"Actually the defending of ATF wouldn't do much with regular guns since they have little to do with them. ATFs function is with NFA guns, which you probably know little, or nothing about."
p3509
aS"Because there couldn't possibly be any undetected illegal gun trafficking, could there be?  "
p3510
aS'WOW and the republicans would never do anything like that now would they.......They would never impeach a president over a BJ now would they?'
p3511
aS'Where is your "proof" that a magical being in the Heavens created us ?'
p3512
aS"If we could rub a brass lamp, make three wishes and fix our energy problems immediately, I'd agree with you. But since we live in the REAL WORLD, we must become OIL INDEPENDENT while we are perfecting and building an infrastructure of renewable energy sources."
p3513
aS"Yeah, right, JO, socialist countries are Eden Mecca's all over the world today. No matter how many times they fail, its proponents just need another chance."
p3514
aS'Oh my goodness, yes. I had forgotten that scenario. How silly of me.'
p3515
aS"So you see a cop on the streets, you see he's armed, that's enough to induce aggression and violence, possibly cause you to hurt others, simply because you saw that somebody else was armed?"
p3516
aS'Oh, I get it. So you believe, but you don\'t exactly "believe".'
p3517
aS'Thats nice...Care to make an argument, or are you just op-eding my viewpoints?'
p3518
aS'I thought God forbid them to eat dead cows, or was it poultry ? emoticonXRolleyes'
p3519
aS"And posts like yours serve no purpose other than to detract from the subject at hand. The subject at hand involves how some people choose to fear the law-abiding and feel safer with the law-breakers. You've done absolutely nothing to dispute these facts and prove them wrong."
p3520
aS'So you disagree with Zardoz then? True christians are those who profess faith and bear false witness? True christians are those who are ignorant, vain, boastful insulting liars?  Interesting...'
p3521
aS"The truth hurts doesn't it? They are anti my morals, anti my family, anti my equality, anti my america, and defintely homophobic and I would add one more bigot."
p3522
aS"I am here right now brady. Doesn't look like you are doing so well. All of your claims and propaganda points a simmering ashes just like your .org soon will be. Have you got any useful skills so you can make a living? emoticonXHoho"
p3523
aS'I thought the almighty expressed his will in the Bible for mortal men to know it...'
p3524
aS'I am not the origin of anything....I originated in my parents....from where did they originate?'
p3525
aS'So you are saying that genetics has nothing to do with genetics?'
p3526
aS'Yeah, there are quite a number of dumb Republican bureacrats running Califorhia.'
p3527
aS'lol Seriously boring is right. Just think, no Larry Craig scandals.'
p3528
aS'Well personally I tend to always question the intelligence of someone who believes that that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own 2000 year old space god father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...'
p3529
aS"So you are pro-life and you hate liberals? Actually Republicans are being liberal in this case (liberal=bigger government, more laws).   But I'll assume you mean Democrats on this. What if the baby is a democrat? If it's a democratic parent it's most likely it will grow up democratic and one more person to attempt to keep abortion legal."
p3530
aS"I'd lo9ve to test your hypothesis sometime by dropping a few Democrats into a pack of wolves and seeing who survives. emoticonXSmilie"
p3531
aS'Last time I checked most state boards merely set the guidelines, whether or not they are followed is something entirely different. Still the fact that you have a board of education spouting such ridiculousness is pretty damn amusing.'
p3532
aS"Abstinence until heterosexual marriage isn't encouraging heterosexual marriage?  I've never heard of an abstinence-until-domestic-partnership program. Perhaps you could point us to an inclusive abstinence-only program somewhere.  Perhaps not...."
p3533
aS"So that's what, at least 4 lies in 8 days? Pretty impressive Archie. You should be on your knees asking god's forgiveness for your lies."
p3534
aS'I did, you rejected my evidence with your usual excuses. Now, tell me about the big bang.'
p3535
aS'Good- we were tired of you not responding or saying, "it isn\'t worth my time."'
p3536
aS'Do you have to work at becoming so scientifically illiterate? What ever happened to the creationist chant about evolution being a product of pure chance? You seem to chant all of the other creationist tripe.'
p3537
aS'Only if you include the fact that while cleaning up the water he is beating the pipe with a hammer.'
p3538
aS'Oh, ok, I can be politically correct if it makes you feel better. How about I refer to them as "intelligence deficient". And I was really not referring to bona fide "retarded" individuals (those with true pathology). I agree that there is nothing funny about that. How about I refer to them as people who drive like XXXXXX...Is that better?'
p3539
aS"I've been a fan ever since your first fake hairflip goodbye. emoticonXGood"
p3540
aS"And where, pray tell, does your un-'ignorant' system of proper behaviour come from?"
p3541
aS'Oh, I think they ought to creat this superstate and we Americans will REALLY have a big laugh. Go for it. I need the levity.'
p3542
aS'It was a hypothetical question that has been answered..please try to keep up.'
p3543
aS"Really?!! I'm not aware of any kids being born to two gay biological parents (unless one is a lesbian and the other a gay man, that is).  "
p3544
aS'I did not know that Obama was of low IQ and a conservative, for he is most assuredly a racism and bigot.'
p3545
aS"So you support allowing a 10 y/o to buy an Uzi and carry it into a federal court house or school as long as he does not commit a crime? Wow.   And your logic about taking criminals off the street and then having no gun control concerns would be perfect...if we had a finite number of criminals. We don't. New murderers and theives and carjackers and dope dealers and bank robbers and child rapists are born every day."
p3546
aS'Do you know why gay sex sinners refuse to repent? Because they have an idol - gay sex.'
p3547
aS"Yes, it's been supressed. Only 14 people knew it before some brave soul tortured them until they confessed the horrible truth!!"
p3548
aS"No I think YOU are the imbecile. And it's great to see you follow your buddy EZ and his ways.. I suppose you've been training with him for some time now.. You're almost identical twins .. give it a bit more time and we won't be able to tell you apart."
p3549
aS'Really, can you show me this science? You are just as genetically similiar to a white person as you are to an embryo.'
p3550
aS"How about this explanation - you're reading WAAAAAY too much into your precious Bible."
p3551
aS'gooey cute as this reads, how is this relevant to the philosophy discourse?'
p3552
aS'Yeah, the lesbians. emoticonXRolleyes It would also mean the end of the human race. emoticonXGood'
p3553
aS'Which is why 50 million Americans are uninsured, including 9 million children. With 27,000 from that group dying every year, as a result of "freedom", and unpaid hospital bills the leading cause of bankruptcy and homelessness. Also for the other 50 million who are underinsured.'
p3554
aS"Dear Jill:  P.S. Remember, I gave you the morning after pill? Use it! Or hey make a few thousand dollars and donate it to research (cha-ching)!!  P.S.S. Thanks for the herpes! emoticonXGood And you think you have a medical problem, all you have to do is take a pill and you're done with the situation I gave you, but what about the situation you have now given me???   What's that (new) quote: All is fair in Love, sex and war? emoticonXKill   Jack"
p3555
aS"Kudos to Dubya! I thought that Brown was, well I don't know, INCOMPETENT!"
p3556
aS"And yet the species that exist today are the exact same as the species during the high oxygen content? That makes little sense. It's like saying the world was vastly different before yet perfectly suited for the species that exist today. That is COMPLETELY nonsensical.   Where did all of the oxygen go?"
p3557
aS'I believe Alan Keyes already have used that term on us.   (Alan Keyes, the ultra-concervative Republican Candidate for the Illinois Senate seat - in opposition to Barack Obama. The Maryland resident the Republican party had to recruit because they couldn\'t find anyone else in their right mind who would go against Barack. Also the very same Maryland resident/Television talkshow host who beratted Hilary Clinton for moving to NY and expecting to be able to "represent" NY\'ers. Yeah, look who\'s the hypocrit now.)'
p3558
aS"That would be the fault of you rather than us. Everyone knows a small mind can't see what's beyond it's comprehension level.  "
p3559
aS'Hmmm.... your religious predecessors would have sentenced you to house arrest for something so heretical.'
p3560
aS"What case? You don't have a case, or a leg to stand on! emoticonXRolleyes"
p3561
aS'Then God should have used someone they trusted and respected to deliver that message. emoticonXRolleyes   '
p3562
aS'Because we have different experiences than you and are more educated on the subject. The only ones who tend to ask "Why do you feel you need a firearm to protect yourself" are the ones who\'ve never faced such a situation and don\'t know what it\'s like to be in such a position.'
p3563
aS"Back in 1967, societal view of marriage was opposite-sex. Wait ... it's STILL that way. (Seen the ballot initiatives around the country?!) The point is that letting blacks marry whites didn't fundamentally redefine marriage, because it was still between a man and a woman.  "
p3564
aS'So theistic evolution is not a belief, not a faith at all? It is simply a humanistic idea that is based on science, using God to fill gaps?'
p3565
aS'Not the same thing at all! Most gay pride floats are moade of crate paper and glue guns. Not gold. I think you have stratched this one really far. Nice try, thanks for playing. Try again soon! Wow, nicotine cravings make me a mean person!'
p3566
aS'Oh dear, deluded philisopher nutter alert. No one can empirically prove anything. Fact. End of discussion.'
p3567
aS'Watch out, Jim. She believes that the only good man is a neutered man. emoticonXIc'
p3568
aS'WW, are you talking to yourself?  If not, then please learn how to attribute statements to the person who made them.'
p3569
aS'No, this is the point of the 10th amendment. Article 1 Section 8 applies to Congress...the 10th amendment grants all powers not listed to the states or people.   The 14th amendment is not the "federal government can do whatever" amendment.   '
p3570
aS"Hey, someone has to clean our toilets. This may sound brutal, but one of the biggest reasons why Indians, Asians, etc all are heavy on education is because their lives sucked. They didn't get a education and they were living in poverty. Thus, they seem education, mainly the sciences and the maths as a way to escape poverty. Japanese and Chinese parents are massively strict on their kids because they want their kids of excel as the parents either were poor or grew up poor and know what that's like. This may be necessary for these religious homeschooled folks to find out. Spending a life time in poverty or working 3 jobs to make ends meet will change someone's view point on education."
p3571
aS"ROFLMAO! Nice way of restating the 'inaccurate' statement basically the same way."
p3572
aS"So biology didn't exist before the theory of evolution was formulated?"
p3573
aS'And this coming from a so called, self proclaimed "rational christian" ? It appears you have blown your cover as a poser by showing your true colors as an anti-christian atheist and a hatemonger. Thanks for revealing your true Nature. emoticonXGood'
p3574
aS'Hollow bones however when equipped with wings allow for greater flight distance.'
p3575
aS"LOL! Aye, Lad, you're lucky that I'm not in my Berserker mood today!"
p3576
aS"Most certainly. The fact that you think that it is unnecessary only underlines your ignorance. Why don't you discuss beetle lungs for us. Those are organs necessary for the survival of both bears and cheetahs. How about livers. Same story. Thyroid? Pituitary? Pancreas? Go for it."
p3577
aS"Your extremist views are surfacing. It's likely you'd rather follow California into the pits of wierdism."
p3578
aS'Oh, i thought "bullet" was some sort of slang term. Never mind.'
p3579
aS'Ok genius, explain to me how come it is that I dont believe in monsters, in ghosts,in luck,the tooth fairy, the easter bunny, and so many other things that a lot of people believe in, but yet I believe in God. Do I have some deep seated delusional fantasy or something like that. You seem to be wise and all knowing( maybe all powerfull as well). Yep, im convinced you are a legend in your own mind. You believe what you will, and I will do the same, and in the end we will see who is right and who is not.'
p3580
aS'I just linked you to it. (You do understand how amendments work, yes?) Note the "to lay."  '
p3581
aS"Except that the government was tapping phones, and isn't interfering with freedom of speech. But if you ignore reality, then your parallel kinda works, I guess."
p3582
aS'Hardy, har har! It is nice to see sinjin is still "hanging" around :)'
p3583
aS'So, Steeeeve, I take it you are not for a FAIR society?   Is an unfair society a moral society? Please explain. I find it difficult to comprehend.'
p3584
aS"Why not, after all, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. emoticonXRolleyes   Waxy"
p3585
aS'Well, either the real or imaginary Phyllis implied those things in the post under discussion.'
p3586
aS"Well, you got that one exactly right. I didn't bother to watch your video. It was pretty predictable coming from you - personal attacks on creationists. I quoted YOU because of what YOU said."
p3587
aS'If we did not have criminals, we wouldnt have "shoot outs" as you so call them.'
p3588
aS'Ever see someone try to kill you?that can causes paranoia also.emoticonXRolleyes'
p3589
aS'  I guess I SHOULD give you some time to mourn, so go back and dry your snot'
p3590
aS"Interestingly everyone but 'the left' can assimilate what is being said, however, the left is notorious for their ever-present attitude that everyone else is mindless. You don't got no brownie points....."
p3591
aS"I see. So you actually reject all of science and still are willing to use a computer and the Internet. Don't you know that you are being led astray by your IBM processor?"
p3592
aS'If you can\'t prove or deal in absolutes, then the basis of your argument, the "absolute" nature of logic, just became pretty shaky.'
p3593
aS'How about you post all the " Great Amount" of evidence concerning the Gospel Mythology. The fact that you don\'t even bother to read the actual information and form an argument tells me you have nothing......'
p3594
aS'I think that might mean that you should shut your trap about other people and not pass judgement on them (i.e. Carl Sagan right here in this topic, etc.). What do you think?'
p3595
aS"But AA's not responsible for that, because he is an A-rab."
p3596
aS'Hey Matt, if that paintbrush were any broader, you could paint a room in just five minutes'
p3597
aS">_> one would think pulling the power, breaking into someone's house, and having raped her once and been reported would have been proof enough.   What do you want a video of him raping her or something?"
p3598
aS"You mean other than the fact that Mr. Pocketwatch and Mrs. Pocketwatch don't meet up for a night of whoopee and end up with little baby pocketwatches some time later? How about: I know that humans manufacture pocketwatches."
p3599
aS'Kill or be killed, survival of the fittest? No compassion, the rule of tooth and fang? WOW, color me impressed!'
p3600
aS"Great job straight out of the leftard playbook. Can't refute the message so go after the messenger. Would it matter if it was printed in the NY Slimes, I doubt it."
p3601
aS"So being easy to know makes it good? methinks that's not quite right."
p3602
aS'I suppose Piltdown Man was the product of newspapers, cute indeed!'
p3603
aS'Yet another non-response. (We\'re not going to have to start counting these, are we?) It fails to address your dilemma of the "just are" theories.  '
p3604
aS"I've decided that I will answer this question once and for all if someone can prove to me why people need tennis racquets. If someone can answer this for me, I will attempt the definitive assault weapon response. Have at it."
p3605
aS'So do you think that the earth is hundreds of millions of years old?'
p3606
aS"You mean you're for real? You're not setting out deliberately to make creationists look as if they don't know what they're talking about? Because that's all you're achieving.  Still no source for the trillions, I see."
p3607
aS'I was under the impression that he was referencing the video...since he always interchanges the words embryo and fetus I just rolled with it.   Secondly, an embryo does have instructions for a brain...while a plant does not. I guess the answer hear depends on the ever evolving definition of "mental existence".'
p3608
aS'You mean you are as biologically ignorant and as easily refuted as the thread originator? Yes, we knew that already. Why all the big letters?'
p3609
aS"Oh no. The main disagreement between theistic evolutionists and Fundmentalists is that Fundies aren't worshipping God, but a false idol of their own making."
p3610
aS'Yeah yeah whatever and there are gay catholics also. The point is that the vast majority of baptists are the <term that has been banned>'
p3611
aS"You mean Priests? Because I hear the ladies are crawling all over them, can't get enough of that catholic loving..."
p3612
aS"You know, I've seen this BS from you quite often. Is your life sour? Do you need to make other peoples lives as miserable as you can just so you can get through the day?"
p3613
aS'how about small cute animals? whare is the line of what religion allows, and law forbids? we know it is not where harm comes to another person, or poligamy would be legal'
p3614
aS'And refusing to donate your resources is killing, so I have killed someone by not donating my blood etc.  '
p3615
aS'So, is a giant Panda a bear? Or some other "kind"?'
p3616
aS'Interesting, this is the same type of angry rants that Capo used to post on the abortion debates before he was banned. How interesting that you should get so angry and worked up over such an innocent exchange between me and chloe.  '
p3617
aS'You would say that, because you are neither a woman, nor gay. Families were ruled by the husband with a clenched iron fist by the way, and women and children had few rights. The family structure was "secure" that way. Yes, the fact that there was lower teen pregnancy outside of marriage, is just such a good thing in and of itself. This meant fewer people burning in hell, which is what is really important.emoticonXRolleyes'
p3618
aS'I actually agree. Make it legal and sign away your rights. However - there are plenty of fathers who opt....... "Deadbeat Dad" is practically a profession.'
p3619
aS"A tenth grade education? Why am I not surprised. That explains why you swallow this evo dung, because it makes you feel smart and enlightened. It is the most popular form of intellectual masturbation for the uninformed and pseudo intellectual today; not to mention the religion of the Natural Man. And here's a clue for you buddy, don't believe everything you read on the internet. Try using common sense before swallowing this tripe and if you want to exercise your common sense muscle, go back and reread all of my posts and try to answer all of my questions objectively. You know, those questions that you and every one of your compadres have completely ignored and not attempted to directly answer at all."
p3620
aS'I am just passing on what I seen personally. I am not trying to prove anything. Just sharing an observation.   PS...from "our" point of view? You got a mouse in your pocket? Please explain.'
p3621
aS"I have an avatar? And I wasn't born in 1990. Remember what the say about assumptions..."
p3622
aS"and you shouldn't forget the thousands of gays incinerated at this death camp!!!"
p3623
aS'Quote Mining. You got to love it. Always fascinating when stuff is dishonestly taken out of context. Normally, we see this from creationists, but you are by no means the first prolifer who has engaged in this practice. But lets look at it'
p3624
aS'Agreed, and the vehicle they will be riding in will be the Prosperity Express.:)'
p3625
aS'There are certainly more people who think that species evolve from earlier species than there are than people who think species evolve from later species.'
p3626
aS"You know what I find amusing here...your entire argument revolves around how it will affect your wallet. Forget about the lives of the people who are denied rights in this country that you take forgranted. That is the true christian-American spirit isn't it? Oh how proud our forefathers would be if they could see us now...oh wait...most of them owned people...nevermind."
p3627
aS'And it seems that the only thing that repulses you is religion. Curious... emoticonXRolleyes'
p3628
aS"If that's the case I wish someone would unplug me. I'm getting tired of this version of reality."
p3629
aS"It's only obvious to the delusional ones, as I did not lift it from anyone. Just stating the truth. If it hurts, tough."
p3630
aS"Waxy, don't you have better things to do than cruise gay threads. ;)"
p3631
aS"And I didn't have to choose to be homosexual. It is a natural inclination. I chose not to hide or lie about who I am. However you are the one who seems to be under the delusion that being gay is a choice. Once again I ask you if it is just a choice then you choose to be gay this moment."
p3632
aS"Oh come on. If those words were hateful, then you need to 'investigate' probably millions of people, because those are pretty normal sentiments. Canada must have a LOT of tax dollars. I don't entirely agree with what he said either, but I think it's downright scary that your govt. investigates something like that."
p3633
aS'What is it about the same piece of paper you do not understand?'
p3634
aS'Well, Jews have always been indecisive. Like this joke says:  Q: How many Jews does it take to screw in a light bulb?  A: 4; 1 to screw it in and 3 to argue about which way it turns.'
p3635
aS"Right, what I think doesn't make you naive or delusional, what you think does."
p3636
aS"Oh, but it does mean something to him. He can't/won't say what, but it sure isn't based on homophobia, no siree! It's just really, really important that marriage stay a striaghts only club, for reasons that can't be explained, but there's no bigotry, don't worry on that score. emoticonXRolleyes"
p3637
aS"You mean the guy who didn't tell his own cabinat he was going to Argentina to go get a little.. and left a power gap because no one knew where he was? You mean that guy?  That is a heck of a lot worse that actually having an affair. Eliot Spitzer at least had the decency to resign when he got caught being a hypocrite.   I personally don't care about his diddling with some woman.. although it does make him a hypocrite since he ran on the 'family values' campaign. It's that little thing about leaving his duties behind without communication that is the real destruction the public trust."
p3638
aS"Exactly my point! After four pages he finally gets it! Give him a hand! There's a brain in that head after all! But my point is, that unless you do disagree with the stats, your argument is irrelevant.   [QUOTE]What I have been saying for the last three pages is that your question is idiotic, as you're comparing things which are completely different in function. They are not analogous.  "
p3639
aS"Why is it that people don't want to admit that it was Bush's' reckless spending on a War that we didn't need , the tax cuts for the richest 2 % of America, The Fact that under Bush they had to ADD space on the Debt clock, not to mention that he was as dumb as a rock, yet they can place all this blame on Obama who inherited this mess and has done more to get us out of it than Bush or any Republican would have done. Unemployment is High, we know this, but it was on it's way up when Obama took over because under Bush more corporations left this country , more businesses closed down, the Banks were allowed to do whatever they wanted without regulation of any kind, and yet none of it is his fault?.. Enlighten me..."
p3640
aS'Somebody needs to check his Little Golden Dictionary. "Random" and "selective" are antonyms. To say that selection is random is to admit ignorance of the English language.'
p3641
aS'Yeah, lets tax those rich greedy jerks!!! I mean really, why be equal when you want something for free right??? SCREW FREEDOM I WANT MY HEALTHCARE!!!'
p3642
aS'Well he can defend his tax difficulties by claiming he is a creationist and thus cannot be trusted with quantitative processes involving a bit of mathematics. Then again he can tell IRS that GOD will provide and they should contact Bush to get Gods cell number. I am sure that IRS, GOD, and Hovind can work it all out.'
p3643
aS"But that is a misunderstanding of what the big bang theory is. What it isn't is an explosion. I don't suppose you have actually studied any astrophysics or astronomy upon which you base your rejection of the big bang, have you?"
p3644
aS'He certianly is better educated about things like that than certain evangalic christians.'
p3645
aS'The question is do the dogs want to be protected ? Those poor dogs, for all you know they might prefer death.'
p3646
aS"Two answers: they were either of the ant kind and didn't eat wood until they underwent hyperevolution after the landing of the ark, or they were placed in a suspended state of hibernation by 'Awlmighty Gawd' (only two - one male and one female, in spite of the fact that termites don't actually propagate that way). It is, after all, the word of Gawd, as revealed in the wholly babble."
p3647
aS"I did not say that I thought that, that would be putting words in my mouth. Sure they'd have access to the report... Sneddon probably had his grubby hands on it ASAP. So what if the investigation was done by private investigators? If Sneddon did it, he would plant evidence... he probably did that when they searched MJ's house. Oops I mean... the government NEVER lies. emoticonXWow"
p3648
aS'Can you say "OVER GENERALIZATION"? Can you say "UNJUST STEREOTYPING"? Can you say "LIES"? Can you say "MISINFORMATION"? Can you say "MUDDYING THE WATERS? Can you say "JAAAMAN"?'
p3649
aS'Maybe you can talk when you provide us with the actual translation.'
p3650
aS'but you too are a figment of my imagination, and you only think you are a giant alien dreaming about this world because i imagined you as such. you cannot disprove this either.'
p3651
aS"Damn, takes some real gonads (wait, you're a Lib, so scratch THAT one) to claim the power to get inside the minds and hearts of the masses...a protest by Conservatives MUST be racist, but a protest by Libs is pure and righteous, correct?"
p3652
aS"if you can find an impartial judge, i'll take you up."
p3653
aS"No, Archangel, if it wasn't done with a gun present any murders committed do not count. In this case, one armed person could have ended the slaughter so quickly it would be incredible but the blood dancers still could have had their day by celebrating that the gun put the children at risk more than the knife murderer and no telling what else they could say to dramatize the situation by claiming that guns were banned there and THAT person broke the law so off with his head...after they harvested his body for useful organs that is."
p3654
aS'My house evolved over millions of years. it built itself . Prove me wrong. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3655
aS'Because all scientists hate god. Again, this is a fact.'
p3656
aS'Because the gay personals are full of married straight men looking for discrete gay sex'
p3657
aS'So, do you spend all of your days as an Obama shill? You have two posts, both anti-McCain. I hope Obama pays well. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3658
aS'Yes. So you are indeed committing the genetic fallacy. And apparently unaware of the semantic ambiguity of the sixth commandment. Thanks for clarifying.'
p3659
aS'Proof for a non-event? What century did your purported non-event supposedly occur, Einstein?'
p3660
aS'On the other hand abortion is only opposed by the born and wars are started only bu the born and choices are made etc etc etc etc.'
p3661
aS'Which is why the "medical establishment" endorses smoking, drinking heavily and a fatty diet, with no excercise, because they believe we are predestined by our genes, right? Why do you persist with these blatant lies?'
p3662
aS'Your "opinion" was a kindergarten question outlining a "problem" that never existed, a "problem" that was explained to you 3 or 4 times. How is it our fault that you ask such embarassing questions repeatedly, despite having the answers explained to you repeatedly? How does this reflect poorly on anyone but you?'
p3663
aS'But yet you have the right to make an an a-s-s out of yourself? As far as the nude beaches go, it would be worth the plane fare if I knew you were going to be at one so I could laugh my a-s-s off.   FROTFLMAO  '
p3664
aS"You said there wasn't a pro-choice group before Roe v Wade. However I would have to do my research to dig up a group in 1850. Hold on..."
p3665
aS'I dunno. Those Priuses are so small inside and out. How much explosive compound could Hasan fit into the thing and still be able to get in and drive it?'
p3666
aS"Well, you certainly defended this video, Archangel. How interesting to now hear that you were defending material you hadn't even viewed.   But I'm not going to do your homework for you. It's on this thread; jyoshu posted it. So search his posts on these pages.  "
p3667
aS'And so you have it... Socialist lunatic fringe view that human lives are only worth what the government says its worth....'
p3668
aS"This is begging so many darn quesions it's boggling my mind!"
p3669
aS'Quite True. I guess those are pretty useless. I suppose His Noodly Appendage works in mysterious ways.  '
p3670
aS"###!! You're seriously advocating allowing kids to take guns to school? Don't you have enough greiving parents already without giving kids the option to shoot out a disagreement?"
p3671
aS'Those damn black people! All wanting respect and equal opportunity! They should just be happy with what they got!Why should they work for the same pay? They are just selfish! [/end sarcasm]  This argument is tired *yawn*'
p3672
aS'Have you EVER read anything that Dawkins wrote? Any of his books? Now didn\'t you tell me that I shouldn\'t be so "self-confident" about the Bible because you thought that I hadn\'t read it? Can you spell hypocrisy? I knew you could.'
p3673
aS'Cheerio and thanks for the examples! Yes these are perfect examples of animals creating "unnatural" things- I happen to be thinking of Beavers and their dams but hey, thats just me.'
p3674
aS"Considering what you turkeys did to the State of California, with its budget and social depravity, you have no room to talk. I'm surprised the Lord hasn't cast San Francisco and L.A. into the Pacific Ocean yet."
p3675
aS'You forget, that all those nice rewards? None of them are rights.'
p3676
aS"The IDEA isn't a bunch of bull, but our implementation of it does leave a lot to be desired. Too bad Jefferson wasn't immortal!!!  "
p3677
aS'I agree, it is pure genius...especially how it has infiltrated politics and governments. emoticonXBanghead'
p3678
aS'Nothing anyone has said has proven anything I have said wrong in any way because all you have are unprovable and unproven assumptions. Now go over to the other debate Creation versus evolution like a good little boy and you will get my response to Tiktaalik. Nkaaaay?'
p3679
aS'Ah! So wellspoken for an addle-pated twiddle poop! I congratulate you!  And a total lie! Who the Hades wants 13-year-old children to be sexually active? No responsible, thinking person could wish such a thing. You malign Planned Parenthood.  You have ceased to be a credible commentator on this issue.'
p3680
aS'I note the bolding but the reason for it is as inscrutable as the peculiar form of what appears to be English which is used.'
p3681
aS"Give them a bus schedule or are they too good to ride public transportation? Can they carpool? There's always a solution to temporary transportation problems and it usually doesn't come from Uncle Sam. emoticonXRolleyes   "
p3682
aS'You actually have some full insight into gays and what we have gone through and think were pathetic. Once again insults and a bigoted view Archie. You never cease to amaze me.'
p3683
aS'Sounds like a lot of ***Bull*** to me. bah du bup. BTW, Sammy the Bull spelled his name Gravano, not Grevano. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3684
aS'For one to have evolution as their foundation belief, means that one cannot be certian of anything.....'
p3685
aS"In other words you would wait until we were attacked again before doing what is required. If we vacillate and wait for the nuclear cloud it will be too late. It amazes me; utterly amazes me, at how strongly felt the left believes in the good will of bin Laden and the terrorists to clean up their act. Just amazing. But with Bush? Noooooooo. He's ALWAYS wrong and never right. Isn't that about it?"
p3686
aS'Yes, but an adult asking such a question is not capable of understanding the answer. ;)'
p3687
aS"Please be sure to give that message to all the criminals out there. We wouldn't like to have the situation where all the law abiding citizens got rid of their guns and the criminals kept them, would we?"
p3688
aS'The Archbishop of York has a screw loose too on that subject.'
p3689
aS'Oh please... You just refuse to acknowledge anything of a victory for LGBT people.'
p3690
aS'Repent, you Christ-denying, gay bashing radical heathen.. well, you already are going to end up in the Pit.'
p3691
aS"It's not often you see such a golden opportunity handed to you on a silver platter.  "
p3692
aS"V.P.C. once again I am shocked and awed. Why no mention of our fearless atf's  and the agents they caused to be killed. And all the Mexican citizens they have caused to be killed? Oh wait if the vpc did that it would be kinda like jumping outta bed with your partner.  SPECIAL NOTE: Some ATF agents are fearless.  Drug War Victims Drug WarRant  These are a few of the one known about.It works both way's Brady and more our way much more."
p3693
aS'Born again? Pardon me for getting it right the first time. ;)'
p3694
aS'You do realize you just disproved your own basic points yes?   The pictures you posted are falsified because abortion clinics and small health clinics contract out to places to have their medical waste incinerated.   Good job on failing to realize you just proved Cunx correct.'
p3695
aS"Wait until Gen. Petraus' report comes out, then you'll eat those words. BTW, do you take ketchup or mustard with that? ;)"
p3696
aS'you always run and hide behind Bryan like the true coward you are'
p3697
aS'So now you want to demonstrate that you are also ignorant of the fossil record?'
p3698
aS'emoticonXRolleyes Drink Kool-Aid often?   No major party in the US supports the mass murder of an entire race of people.'
p3699
aS"So this time you are really serious about leaving emoticonXRolleyes   So now mental existence isn't good enough (as it is not unique which was my point) but human cells is important and something of a human brain. Well what importance are human cells and a human brain? It seems the idea of a human having importance is not just limited to me...you just happen to add another criteria at the end that you feel is important as well."
p3700
aS"Who is Allah, Alex? Great, I'll take 'things a terrorist god would do' for $1600 Alex.  "
p3701
aS"I didn't think you had either the intellectual or logical ability to respond. :)"
p3702
aS'I wonder if I can convince a judge that all other legal documents should be read in an "enlightened" way. I can perhaps get out of contracts and speeding tickets if I just show them the light and error of their ways!   Your supercilious post amazes me.'
p3703
aS'Well actually I have not seen your point of view expressed anywhere but on these forums. Seems to me if its rising to ascendancy at least ONE scientist somewhere would have recently at least mentioned it. Quick search reveals NO mentions at all. Of course if you say its displacing NDS then I guess I will have to agree - you being a well known biologist and all, but I remain perhaps a bit irrationaly skeptical.'
p3704
aS'Contribute? Oh please.... Take your crying act somewhere else. Like I said no one is buying your Bull anymore....'
p3705
aS'Yeah, and we all know what happened when they did that with Galileo. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3706
aS'Ah yes, adopting the Nazi Germany policy of encouraging neighbors to snitch on others, to reward tattle tails for violating the trust of others and invading privacy.'
p3707
aS"I'd argue that the woman wants to control who lives or dies. That's scarier to me. emoticonXRolleyes"
p3708
aS"Oh you do love to do the psychological technique known as 'transference' don't you...or is it 'projection'???   You are so obsessed with gay sex, I would not be surprised if you and Ted Haggard have a lot to talk about."
p3709
aS'Sheesh ! What a way to bring goodwill to all people in the world, "yearning" for democracy. And if I remember right Saddam was our toady during the first Reagan Administration. Hmmmmmm, wasn\'t George Herbert Walker Bu$h our Veep then ?'
p3710
aS"Don't take it personal EZ, Mental illness is a disease, not something you can do anything about...."
p3711
aS"So wait, Phunting's good deeds will get he or she a higher position in heaven...but (Phunt, what sex are you?) he or she is going to hell anyway...gotta love Christian logic."
p3712
aS'About a third of the weapons seized in Mexico were referred to the U.S. for tracing; approximately 11,000 out of 29,000.   About half were successfully traced. Better than 90% of those to U.S. dealers.   Of course your definition of "minute" might differ from mine.'
p3713
aS'No, they don\'t. Creationists do. "Why haven\'t all animals turned into humans?"'
p3714
aS"Right. I'm damaged because I'm not a Christian wing-nut. I'm still looking for at least some refutation."
p3715
aS"You your qualifications in logic allow you to judge that? I suspect that you are talking out of your elbow since I haven't seen any evidence that you know what logic is. Mostly I see hysteria and superstition in your posts."
p3716
aS'Flip back to page 9 and do try to keep up.   I am not going to spam the board for the weakest link.'
p3717
aS'On the evidence, that must have been where his brain was located.'
p3718
aS'Do try to keep up with yourself. People like you are always talking about how we need gun control laws in response to the crimes taking place. But you have absolutely no answer for what to do when said laws are violated.'
p3719
aS'You are just playing dumb, right? There will be fewer technicians and fewer orders for equipment PER INSURED. Their pay will not be cut. There will be fewer of them PER INSURED. Initially the absolute volume will increase.'
p3720
aS'How remarkable. What a singular idea to invent a contest of skill in which a person in opposition tries to prevent one from outperforming them. Is this the only type of game in which there are two sides, or is this a novelty?  '
p3721
aS'For being such a "happy Aussie", you sure do love to take shots and criticize people. Run out of those happy pills, perhaps? :)'
p3722
aS'Did you go to college, Trebor? You might want to look up how "pedophilia" is spelled. LOL!! Then you can go have a beer with Orion and watch his head swivel.'
p3723
aS"Use some common sense, would you. And while you're at it, trying reading! I said, and you quoted me as saying:  "
p3724
aS"Gansao, don't be bitter because of what you had to do with a producer, all those years ago, to get your act onto the Gong Show.emoticonXClown"
p3725
aS'Ha! There are a lot more gay owned and straight non-homophobic or non-religious businesses than that. Thanks for the cheap and clueless stereotype though!'
p3726
aS'You know I actually considered that. Too much work, though. I have added to my list of things to do when I retire. That is, of course, assuming that we turned things around by then. If not, I will likely be too busy "holding the fort" against the hordes of starving yuppies.'
p3727
aS"So it's alright for a Evo to insult you and go off on a tangent, and expect to get answer. What's the point in answering if your being mocked, before you give answer. Now I know why there are few Creo's on this forum."
p3728
aS'Even Joe the plumber abandoned the garbage scow? Say it aint so!'
p3729
aS'Winning any political election has never been about electing the "best" man for the office, it simply means you appeal to the majority of people that showed up to vote. Smartest and most popular aren\'t necessarily the same person, if you went to school you probably remember that. ;)'
p3730
aS"VoR is about as Catholic as the Archbishop of Cantebury. I'm curious about what I'm right about though, seeing as I asked you whether you think that medically un-necessary abortions should be legal or not."
p3731
aS'I though the torture was just a result of the number of wing nuts there were around the place.'
p3732
aS'And you can be described as a "pre-dead corpse" as well. Histrionic revisionist linguistics only serve to push some form of dishonesty agenda that can not stand by itself on the facts. It is the coward\'s route. Are you a coward???'
p3733
aS'Oh, I agree....private security companies are the answer. Very republican of you.'
p3734
aS'So, faith and argument from incredulity.   If you find it impossible please state exactly what part is impossible. Then maybe an actual scientist could take over.  Major in molecular biology? Not even a full degree; not like your going to doing anything original.'
p3735
aS'Ah yes, the Might Makes Right principle. Mob rule. You are so fond of it I have to assume that you assume the mob is always going to agree with you. Poor, naive soul...'
p3736
aS"First off, your sick. To actually want to see more death and destruction.  Are Americans somehow less intelligent? Your notions are racist for lack of a better term. What to meet stupid? Walk out your front door and sample the people on the side walk. You'll find the same stupid around the world."
p3737
aS'Even then, your statement does nothing. They aren\'t "getting themselves pregnant". A doctor is doing a medical procedure, that may or may not result in a pregnancy (ya know, those little sperm thingies?) emoticonXAngel'
p3738
aS'Are you just not bright enough to make the connection between:  '
p3739
aS'So then the handgun ban did absolutely nothing. Nice to see you could finally admit the truth.'
p3740
aS"Impressive. Misses the point, biggoted, and regionalistic. You've got a whole ignorance trifecta going there! Well done. emoticonXGood"
p3741
aS'No, no, no. If humans were created 4,000 years ago, then the earth was created 4,000 years and a few days ago. At least try and get it right.'
p3742
aS'You don\'t see protesters walking around going "I wanna marry my dog" or "beastiality rocks" do you?!'
p3743
aS'What part did your real daddy play in it? Will he be on the island, too?  This is a good example of a scant level of maturity. Your simple out for various arguments is to play the idiot/XXXXX card.  More and more each day I see you as a complete waste of oxygen.'
p3744
aS"Well, I suppose creationists would object to careful definition of terms and the assiduous distinguishing of fact from non-fact, wouldn't they? It runs counter to all they hold dear."
p3745
aS"And, let's see, when did the job loss actually start?   Oh yes.. We can trace the troubles starting in 2007, with a big melt down in August/September of 2008. Let's see.. Obama must have been a terrible president to have caused that.. oh WAIT. That wasn't Obama, that was BUSH.. Excuse Me."
p3746
aS'You know something is wrong with this world when people attack the act of posting an opinion (that of Ms. King) and another condemns the idea that someone may read it and develop their own opinion. Saving lives is not just a Republican goal. And yes it is an act of desperation. All acts are an act of desperation when it comes to saving the natural process of life with out interference of those who place their comfort above the life inside them.   Whatever is wrong outside the womb, is not the fault of the inhabitant within the womb.'
p3747
aS'So Simone, if the shooter had instead driven his Toyota Prius into a crowd, killing many as a result, would you call for banning Toyota Priuses?'
p3748
aS'Well as long as you ignore the evidence, why do you need proof. Blind faith works just fine.'
p3749
aS"Are you suggesting the pollsters are bias? Nooooooooooo, that couldn't be. You think they were trying to sway the election? Noooooooooo, that couldn't be.   These guys along with their Hollywood and music industry buddies are lossing their base. They need to go back to movies and music and leave the politics alone."
p3750
aS'You mean the Conservative tilting Supremes donot know the law ? You want to tell them that ? emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken'
p3751
aS'Anything to get around doing things the normative way ... emoticonXDonno'
p3752
aS'I must agree with Sarge about the homophone,could that be why Mr.Obama appears to stand tall from your view?emoticonXCensored'
p3753
aS"That's what's known around here as a lie, and I wish you were capable of feeling ashamed of yourself."
p3754
aS"I'm sure the response is that He could. But, y'know, God's a real XXX sometimes... (Besides, who do you think used His uber-complex biochemical engineering skills to create the prions responsible for FFI, anyway?)"
p3755
aS"Well good at least you are aware there is no reason beyond your opinion of morality against gay marriage. So by all means don't marry a man and the problem is solved."
p3756
aS"Thanks, for giving me the balls. I didn't know you were trying to convert me. So, because I don't believe what you want me to I'm retarded. You know I could say the same about you, it works both ways. You see I don't want to convert you, all I'd like to see is you open your mind to other possibilities. Adios, Arrevideci"
p3757
aS"Very Interesting! After only 33 posts Mintaka already has the political and gun advocacy priorities of individual members here down pat; or should I say the resurrected antonia, our resident National socialist healthcare freak does and couldn't help but expose her personal insights where none should exist for this alleged newbie."
p3758
aS"So you're claiming the beardy bloke nailed to a couple of bits of 2X4 didn't actually exist?emoticonXRolleyes"
p3759
aS'And have a child with a terminal disease and watch them most likely die slowly because of my "soul mate." Yeah. I\'m thinking if they\'re willing to make me go through that they\'re not a soul mate at all. >_>'
p3760
aS"oh ok, so I assume you don't live in your own house? I was trying to picture over 61 people fitting into one house. :)"
p3761
aS'Spoken like a true Conservative, not one of those liberal "compassionate conservatives". emoticonXGood   '
p3762
aS"I'd be curious if Berkowitz studied whether a sword or club produced the same effect as a firearm?   Short of castrating all boys at the onset of puberty, I'm afraid boys will be boys."
p3763
aS'We have a terrorist supporter among us, objecting to restrictions on terrorists! Why do you hate America?'
p3764
aS'And ill continue to have pity for abused and unplanned pregnant women lacking basic healthcare.'
p3765
aS"Doesn't surprise me lets all jump ship and put our heads in the sand... Even more of a reason I should run for public office :p  "
p3766
aS"Sounds like a movie... We could threaten to use our old nukes on all the potential enemies...oh, yeah, we've already done that."
p3767
aS'Well if no siege comes, I guess no harm no foul.'
p3768
aS"You're the one who needs to get a grip. Lots could get worse, but not for the reasons you're stating.   But I take it you're finally admitting that (actually) 50 million uninsured human beings who could die or go bankrupt is a big problem."
p3769
aS'There you are NATO, you have justified a Final Solution for the "Mexican problem". Let me quote you   '
p3770
aS"Did the bill include burning heretics at the stake, stoning them out of the village or removing a women's right to vote?"
p3771
aS'Here is a mind blower. Maybe they are celebate because being married to Jesus they are saving themselves for sex with him.'
p3772
aS"Then you would want me to be something god did not create me to be? Silly, I 'd say! Humans are part of the animal kingdom. Mammals if I remember from biology. Are you not an animal? If not, maybe the mothership will come and pick you up soon."
p3773
aS"Really? Well, when I have a kid, I'll be sure to just leave it in the woods, since it can apparently care for itself."
p3774
aS"It's Satan, not Satin. And he's your daddy, not ours (John 8:44)."
p3775
aS'No, you shot off a smart remark while failing to address any of the issues. Par fro the course for you. It seems like maybe you would be more comfortable on a blogging page than a forum page, especially a blogging page without a space for reader responses.'
p3776
aS'ah but freedom of speech has many limitations. Since liberals are opposed to American principles their speech can be considered treasonous. No country can survive if it allows itself to be undermined. Lincoln went all out to preserve the country, we should do the same things by making liberals illegal.  '
p3777
aS'Kinda like, "Don\'t speak of the speck in your brothers eye when you have a plank in your own?" :p :p   The scary part of this insane reality is that there are a LOT of whackos that think just like and actually support Pat Robertson. And I would venture to say that 98% of them who voted, voted for Bush. Ha! There\'s one born every minute.   Perhaps this might clue some folks in, as to the concerns the folks have on the left, as to the direction this nation is headed? Or, then again, maybe not. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3778
aS'Oh, Mrwriterman made a funny. I guess not all gays are humorless. :)   '
p3779
aS"Public policy? Takes waaaay too much thought. Now one can go to ballpark here and pay $8.50 for a half pound hot dog, smothered in thick layers of chili, cheese and grilled onions (2,200 calories, 55 grams of saturated fat, 1,600 milligrams of sodium). That's a no-brainer (literally).  Dono"
p3780
aS"Balderdash! Atheism isn't science. That's nonsense. And science is atheistic in the same way that plumbing is.  "
p3781
aS'OMG SO TRUE!!! Two of my friends chose to be asian, my mom chose to be a woman, and my PE teacher chose to be black. OMGZZ@! YOURE SO RIGHT!!!'
p3782
aS'Yeah.. caught that... But, hey.. I think you made a mistake.'
p3783
aS'Hmm maybe I should take that one to a local patent office...'
p3784
aS'Funny how people who are "for" capital punishment don\'t see it that way...'
p3785
aS"First of all a man cannot terminate tissue he isn't carrying.The father can opt out all he wants but when that fetus becomes a born person he is responsible just like the mother is."
p3786
aS'Oh yes yes... never mind the thousands of lives destroyed, the shame, the guilt, the anger, the fear and all the while perhaps being in a combat zone and having that stress...  Never mind the hundreds of millions wasted retraining new people because we kicked out perfectly able people because of their sexuality...   All you can do is sit here and spew non threatening bunk to try and scare people and make your bigotry somewhat tangible to your warped mind...'
p3787
aS"Can't you come up with your own line? I really did not think you would see the bucket of worms that would be stirred up if gay marriage was lawful but I tried to give you my best shot.............I did not even mention the income tax implications if this was allowed............"
p3788
aS'How about the pass that the Clintonistas routinely gave to Bubba for his Oval Orifice tryst with Monica??   '
p3789
aS'Yes but of course was that rreally a consious choice? I see sarcasm but no real answer that is credible.......seesh if I wanted srcasm I would have watched the Orielly factor. (oh wait thats yelling and bicering) knida like politics! (oops sarcasm hehe)'
p3790
aS'ROTFLMAO. The guy is more like Bush than I realized.   Come on, Easy, if you have never tried pot or XXXX, you are in the minority.   Nobody cares.'
p3791
aS'with tens of millions of gun owners, and hundreds of millions of guns in the US, and you think the guns are still the problem....'
p3792
aS'Unriggable, your statement should read the so-called "pro-life" since they are anything but.'
p3793
aS"And that's why I think you are a troll. There really aren't any experts here. There are several who are knowledgable in a variety of topics, but that knowledge seems to me to be the result of being both educated and widely read. It also indicates an ability to reason and an open mind."
p3794
aS'Perfect. A creationists caught repeating the same refuted arguments on different forums. Resistance is met, run like a coward to another forum.'
p3795
aS"Methinks it's rather obvious that mintaka is JimIrvine because no rational newbie would come here and agree with Irvine's ridiculous and juvenile attacks/assertions out of the box. emoticonXRolleyes"
p3796
aS"A woman's right to choose to keep her legs together is not in any way abridged by this bill. Ho, ho,f***ing ho."
p3797
aS'how about a Swiss University? they have full automatic weapons in most homes, and target shooting is a national sport.'
p3798
aS'Plenty of examples,law abiding citizens are shot by criminals daily.However the O.P. is about police going off the edge.Oh did I mention that some of those law abiding citizens sometimes shoot the criminal trying to kill them?'
p3799
aS'Is this another attempt of yours to paint all that believe in smaller, less-intrusive government as loonies? Very transparent, sorry. :('
p3800
aS'Society highly values the creation of future taxpayers, especially under deficit-spending socialist presidents. :p'
p3801
aS"You're deluded, as usual. Anything that doesn't balance the budget is based on LIBERAL THINKING. And you don't balance the budget with massive tax hikes and gutting the military like the liberals are fond of doing. And you're going to vote for liberals? Obama? His latest budget plan was defeated 414-0 in the House. Not even his liberal cohorts would vote for it. And you vote for Obama? What the hell is the matter with you people?"
p3802
aS'Not nearly as tired as the "YOU can\'t live like that because it is against MY religion" argument. Hell, that one pre-dates Christianity!'
p3803
aS"And yet we're still waiting for your mental condition to finally hit you like a ton of bricks.... Denial is the usual reaction..."
p3804
aS'You put such confidence in articles written by partisan plebes, using unsupported, irrelevant links to make the printed text pseudo-intelligent. I cannot imagine you holding your own in a serious debate.'
p3805
aS"Tell us, Steve, now you've been thoroughly snowed (again) by the GOP, how's the weather up there in CloudCuckooLand?"
p3806
aS'You can believe what you want, your beliefs are not relevant to the issue.'
p3807
aS"...but you are just fine with marijuana smoke huh?  I am working on the assumption that you run home to tell mommie or you run to find your teacher and report it immediately. Midgets like you got to have some backup.  How and why do you always change the subject? Can't take the heat? Do you ever read headers?  You got a mouth on you as big as grand canyon."
p3808
aS'I can neither confirm nor deny at this particular juncture that I may or may not be either male or female. :)  '
p3809
aS"Apparently in Marc9000's small, small, small world, if you're not a Christian, you're a atheist.   Thus over 4 billion people are atheists. emoticonXAgree"
p3810
aS'This is great. You mean none of the Davidic line ever copulated with women to produce their descendents? LOL!  '
p3811
aS'You will soon learn, my friend, that fundies have very, very short memories when it comes to refutations of their arguments...'
p3812
aS'  I guess cheer leaders are the new tough guys and gals!'
p3813
aS'That\'s the difference between liberals and conservatives (AKA "real Americans.) Conservatives have a sense of humor. Liberals don\'t.'
p3814
aS'Ah the Pinhead element of the tinfoil hat brigade raises its pointy head.'
p3815
aS'I thought that the most commonly accepted date for the alleged birth of Jesus was in 4 B.C. Assuming the current calendar really were keyed on the birth of Christ, how could Christ have been born Before Christ?'
p3816
aS"You mean your hypothetical I presume? Murder violates the rights of the murdered by relieving them of their life. That's why it's illegal.   You're a bit slow I see."
p3817
aS'  How does this address your claim that the Second Amendment served as a defense against a tyrannical federal government? Are you moving the goalposts now?  '
p3818
aS"Of course God would have something to offer to lowely peon, but that doesn't explain what use God has for lowely peons, except for doing stupid pet tricks."
p3819
aS'You and your spiritually-challenged friends are obviously too stupid to understand the difference between a cult and Biblical Christianity.'
p3820
aS"so you're one of the many people you got question 1 right emoticonXIdea thank you...thank you. You are the many reasons why the US is still standing on its foundations and not collapsing into senseless ignorance...THANK YOU! :)"
p3821
aS'so you think it would be ok to fire people for being secular atheists?'
p3822
aS"Anyone who can read the entire page will find that Zeus is in there, but since you apparently can't read I forgive your ignorance.. emoticonXByeemoticonXBye"
p3823
aS"Like the crusades and the inquisition? How about the Southern Baptist Convention, formed at the end of the Civil War with the express purpose to discriminate against blacks? And of course, the KKK and the Aryan Brotherhood make the same claims as you. Of course, you're going to tell me that you are a christian and they aren't. But when people tell me they are christians you aren't always around so I just never turn my back on them. That way, even if they are follow that strange pull to make a bad decision, I will at least have my eye on my money."
p3824
aS"Really. Some people would think I'm in cahoots with the creationists. I predict their behavior and then they go and do it."
p3825
aS"And this differs from your cell how? (oh wait it doesn't).  "
p3826
aS'Well, you did... only that "you" then resided in countries like France, Brittain, Sweden, Norway, Germany, Ireland, Botswana, China etc, etc ;).... And yes, we where all racists back then...'
p3827
aS'I typically don\'t read Antonia\'s propaganda pieces, so is she holding up the UK as a shining example of dental health? If so, I suggest that she ask a typical Brit to smile, so she can see for herself the folly in such an assertion. The US\' "bubbas" have better teeth than the average Brit. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3828
aS'You are like, so totally noble and sensitive! I really admire your pro-humanity stance. That is going out on limb.'
p3829
aS"Just because you don't hold the same beliefs as we do, does not invalidate our belief. I feel sorry for you if all you have to believe in is a small petri dish of algae. You do need absolute proof if your going claim it as the only possible way of creation."
p3830
aS"LoL What part of a Binding Document, the Constitution with it's Bill of Rights, don't you understand!   You demand that we obey the law, but you would allow Government to break the Supreme law of the Land, and you call me a nut? I gotta say my friend, THAT is truly nutty! emoticonXSmilie"
p3831
aS'Maybe I wanted it from a source that was worth looking at'
p3832
aS"That's nice, but have you ever thought of reading your own religion's Holy Book so that you can intelligently discuss what it is that Jesus and his disciples said?  "
p3833
aS'Actually no. You read the article again, and thoroughly this time.'
p3834
aS'How often to you poke your nose into monkey genitals in order to know that?'
p3835
aS"Look who uses profane language; And you claim I'm regressing ! emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken emoticonXChicken"
p3836
aS'Do you have something-other then words from a dusty old book of myth to offer as an explanation?'
p3837
aS"A gay person is a homosexual, friend. He can't change that part about himself. He was wired that way. If you don't like the idea of gay sex, then I'd suggest you not participate in gay sex. That's pretty simple. If you don't want gay marriage, then don't get one."
p3838
aS"Well if it's so easy then how about you provide the names of the dealers who're selling howitzers and anti-aircraft missiles and fragmentation grenades? And while you're at it, supply the names of the companies who're making them in violation of the various federal restrictions."
p3839
aS"Well, the French have always been an independent and rebellious lot, not like those staid northern Europeans. And let's remember how much we all owe to those heathens of Greece and Rome!  "
p3840
aS"Like you were raised? Looks like it didn't work and now those hormones must be kicking in? Nothing worse than a menopausal female grinding her ax...their favorite victims? Males."
p3841
aS"My article say's this. it needs to be noted the alleged evidence for extensive history assumes uniformitarian geology. Because of this fact, this response adds up to: Your theory doesn't work under my theory, so your theory is wrong. Of course you don't want to consider that fact, do you?"
p3842
aS'Not the best school system there although the Mayor has a nice car I hear emoticonXClown'
p3843
aS'Why would anyone want to get to Heaven? Archangel and people like him would be there, praying and chanting 24/7 . Thanks but no thanks!'
p3844
aS"So, in order to be against gay marriage, a person has to be faithful in his own marriage? Gimme a break. He supports what his constituents want him to support or he doesn't get elected. In case you haven't noticed, the majority of Americans are against gay marriage."
p3845
aS"Just as being anti-gun won't compensate for being born with a small brain."
p3846
aS'So how are those gun free zones working out for you?'
p3847
aS"It doesn't take a Ph.d. to understand who wrote the first Gospel. Grade school children can look up who was the first man to walk on the moon."
p3848
aS"I see you still don't understand what a strawman is. It is hard to have a strawman when the comment wasn't directed at any particular claim...."
p3849
aS"Uhuh! And you've got a bridge in Brooklyn you want to sell me. . . ."
p3850
aS"And I'd hate to let you sneak across your dishonesty, distortions, disingenuous, and unsupported false assertions."
p3851
aS'hunter, would you be interested in actually discussing this logically? or do you simply wish to toss out empty assertions and run away when challenged? if your view is the truth, then you have no reason to run.'
p3852
aS"By your own admission you haven't 'hung out' with stoners for a while and you're making generalisations about them to people who do spend a lot of time with stoners?"
p3853
aS'Of course anyone can cite exceptions.....did you see the baby? Probably not.......As long as the mother is OK the baby does not count....... emoticonXRolleyes'
p3854
aS"I don't have to say anything here, your post made it sound sick enough. Yes, freedaom at all cost. Isn't that the theory this country was founded by?"
p3855
aS"This is odd. You voluntarily participate in a Religion discussion forum - indeed, the frequency of your posting suggests that this participation occupies a substantial portion of your leisure time - but when someone presents you with the opportunity to demonstrate the validity of your position, you 'have better things to do'."
p3856
aS"And so goes the fact you're more than willing to let rapists and murderers go free."
p3857
aS'Here in Michigan, they closed down the first rest area on I-75 because of the high amount of gay encounters taking place there. Maybe you should poke your head out of your closet once in a while and see what the rest of your community is up to.   '
p3858
aS"Other than the Soldini firearms were purchased legally there is no proof that he had a concealed carry permit. If he had the AP and the rest of the left-tard media (redundancy alert) would still be shouting it from the roof tops. Just because the Brady bunch-VPC says so doesn't make it true. Then what else can we expect from a self confessed torturer of helpless small animals and arsonist?"
p3859
aS'"I don\'t know; just like I do with everything else, I pretend it\'s not a problem for my indefensible beliefs." emoticonXRolleyes'
p3860
aS'But did you consider it relative when you posted this on another thread?:'
p3861
aS'Somehow I seriously doubt that "Testimonium Flavianum itself" meant "from the website by Peter Kirby entitled \'Testimonium Flavianum\' that happens to have the text of Josephus\' An 20.9.1." But if that\'s what you\'re going with, whatever.   '
p3862
aS'And it remains to be seen if your are. Pick an unreasonable and dumb argument go with it.'
p3863
aS'I am still waiting for you to tell me why the gay priests only molested boys.......It has to do with how they are physically contructed.........'
p3864
aS'I would argue against this but I would need to introduce subjectivism into the argument. lolemoticonXCensored'
p3865
aS"Don't you have that other weird warped forum your posting in now?! Go there with your advice."
p3866
aS"Hey Dane, you're real good at calling people ignorant, sanctimoniously declaring everything they say as false, blatantly false, or falsehoods. But would it be too much to ask for you to back up your rejection of berts arguments with anything more than insults? Like some actual facts for example?"
p3867
aS"Then you must have expected him to be a mute on the show. He was basically just there; he made no worthy comments. It was so bad he had to resort to an emotional hypothetical. He made no sense, and that comment had no part in the interview. Bush doesn't send kids to Iraq. First of all they volunteer. Second of all, they are older than 18. Please let me know what comments Michael Moore made that you thought were worthy. You might have trouble.  "
p3868
aS"Yea I guess you're right, you people tend to blur together after a time."
p3869
aS"The first Christians were Jews. Anyone who claims to be a Christian but hates Jews is a XXXXX. An anti-Semetic Christian is like an oxymoron term. And an Aryan is supposed to be someone with blue-eyes, brown-hair, and light-skin. You don't have to believe in 'Aryanism' to be Aryan, and the mortal enemies of Aryans are not Jews. 'Aryans' may hate Jews, but most Jews aren't bigoted. By the way, Hitler did not like just Jews but others he considered 'inferior' to the 'superior' 'Aryan race.'   Do some actual research instead of pulling XXXX out of the air to conform to your screwed up opinions."
p3870
aS'No more of a poison than alcohol (actually far less), should we start lacing that with strychnine?   ***I can see it now***  *Excuse me bartender...what are the drink specials?  -We got Bud Light bottles for $4.00, Jagerbombs for $7.50, and this new drink called Convulsions on the Beach. First one is on the house!'
p3871
aS"What's Sesame Street?... Oh wait that's where you got your pathetic education isn't it, no wonder you're so ignorant. ... emoticonXChickenemoticonXChicken"
p3872
aS'Im still waiting to find the text book that will show me how to get perfect order out of nothing explodeing!. What we need is theory to revolve around facts not facts to revolve around theory, other wise all we are ever gonna be are unanchored ships on stormy seas!..'
p3873
aS'Or maybe they do? Could this sick, perverted individual be the spokesperson for the so called "gay movement"?'
p3874
aS"So, then you DO feel that what you did was a sin. Otherwise you wouldn't have asked forgiveness for it.   I have one question. What was your motivation for starting this thread? Was it to try and somehow prove that a person can be a Christian and have an abortion? Just curious. IMO, you are right that you are forgiven for it, as God is a forgiving and loving God. But I hope you don't do it again."
p3875
aS'How about he pulls it out from under the Ramadan tree and unwarps it rather than your Hitler Youth moment?'
p3876
aS'Yeah, they should only teach the sexual positions the Pope would approve of.'
p3877
aS'If by "We the People" you mean a handful of self appointed persons with strong financial intrest in the running of the country...   The document is largely a copy of the theories of Montesqieu and John Locke.'
p3878
aS"You don't understand words; why the hell was I thinking you'd understand numbers? emoticonXRolleyes"
p3879
aS'Not even Answers in Genesis thinks that these ideas have any credence. But Mr. Kent Hovind still does.'
p3880
aS'What part of the Christian worldview? A part of the Christian worldview says stealing is wrong, so you must mean stealing is good? A part of the Christian worldview says rape is wrong, so you must mean rape is good? A part of the Christian worldview says sexual immorality is wrong, so you must mean sexual immorality is good?'
p3881
aS"No, back to school... turn in what educational credntials you feel you have, and just stay at the coffeehouses... at least you have a .005% of hearing someone ineject some truth in one of those sidewalk tete a' tete's you nutters are so fond of... but here you are dead wrong. Have you ever heard of an egg? ever heard of a sperm? An egg is still considered a multiple cell organism, and a sperm as well. You're gonna have a hard time pulling that one off."
p3882
aS'The gentleman (??) in question has been presented the facts numerous times. He "pooh-pooh"s them as irrelevant. He places himself above scientific research. He doesn\'t know the difference between unsolicitated testimonials and scientific evidence.'
p3883
aS"What difference does it make? Do you only care about frequent killings and choose to ignore isolated incidents? If so doesn't that mean that innocent people dying only interests you when it's in large enough numbers that you can try and exploit them for your own selfish agendas?"
p3884
aS'Very impressive how you argue science. Are your arguments science, or are they anger? When Dawkins argues it with his above statement, that Darwinism is as all-encompassing as God is stated to be in the Bible, is it really science, or is it religion?'
p3885
aS"And once again (s)he rambles on while responding to nothing said in the prior post. At least you're consistent in your irrational hate speech. BTW, the term sword of truth implies no violence against anyone at all. Except in the mind of paranoid hate mongers, that is. emoticonXGood"
p3886
aS'Man, you are really enriching this debate. We should all sit and listen to your wisdom.'
p3887
aS'Yea, at least on earth you get some relief, you die eventually.'
p3888
aS'Whatever. First you say no one is calling you a hypocrite, than you say people do it, but it just an attack tactic. If you ever get to a mental state where you can entertain the possibility that a critisism of you can be grounded in reality, than go back to my post where I say "This is why..." and give it a read again. Maybe you\'ll learn somethig. Till then...'
p3889
aS"Come on, Aivlis. Give the guy a break. He's just practicing being a grown person.emoticonXHoho"
p3890
aS"What I posted lays out the 4 conventions if you will just read it, your questions will be answered. I can't read it for you ya know."
p3891
aS"In America it's called free speech. If anyone here there, or elsewhere in America doesn't like free speech, and doesn't like a debate forum where the Word of God is found, then they can go whine to their mothers (yo mama)."
p3892
aS'However, we do give people alcohol, there are many people who drink it on a regular basis who are not addicts. What do these substances you mention have to do with being gay? Would it perhaps be okay for me to have homosexuality on the weekends or after work during happy hour?  '
p3893
aS"It's as much of a point that Phillp Johnson has. Trying to use Philip Johnson as a source about evolution is like trying to use Jack Chick as a source about Catholism."
p3894
aS"Well, it's not as though you hold your tongue all that often when it serves in support of an anti-gay argument.  "
p3895
aS'And creationism was investigated and explored completely and shown to be false.'
p3896
aS"Except, of course, the evidence is totally against that. Plus, there is the little matter of infant mortality... and lack of resources.   But hey, don't let common sense and evidence stop you."
p3897
aS"And if there's one thing I can count on, it's your insistence that we can assume guilt and should make a public spectacle of the matter before even investigating any matter.   "
p3898
aS"If you need a decision made for you, ask me. I'll be glad to. Be prepared to raise your child though."
p3899
aS'That has to be a typo my friend. If you can compress the EB into only 1012 bits then you can write your own ticket in the field of data compression! Lets see 100 million pages into 1012 bits - fantastic - please tell us how. I really would like to put the entire literature of mankind (and more) on an Ipod.'
p3900
aS'Oh relax for cripes sakes. This is the "fun debates" forum if you didn\'t notice.'
p3901
aS'Oh, so this only happens here, huh? Every single hardcore drug addict is here, huh?'
p3902
aS"Forgive me. A few minutes with Google ought to give enough info to refute what he said, so I didn't bother.  "
p3903
aS'And of course, the sea of Montalban\'s assertions as science, the sea of Montalban\'s out of context quotes, or the sea of Montalban\'s misrepresentations of what others have said. It seems that Montalban knows the "TROOTH" and won\'t be discouraged with facts. Sadly, Montalban knows what he believes and reality seems to be irrelevant.'
p3904
aS'So the "Origin of Species" has more information for theistic evolutionists than the Bible does?? Does theistic evolution believe in Satan?'
p3905
aS'Hoo boy! That target just got larger. You still don\'t get it, do you? Not a "slave contract," but a covenant, a promise :)'
p3906
aS"How do you know if they WANT to believe in a deity? They simply don't."
p3907
aS"Man cannot invent anything that did not already exist in form. Did we invent the wheel, or discover the idea? Did the Wright brothers invent machine powered flight, or was it that they stumbled upon it? In every culture, in every society, man looks to something greater than himself. They simple don't leave it at themselves and be done with it."
p3908
aS"It's a self-defeating question. You're asking why numbskulls participate in numbskullery."
p3909
aS'Like the crazy idea the Earth goes around the Sun.'
p3910
aS'Horse manure. When did you invent that self-serving rule? Put it back in your ditty-bag.'
p3911
aS'So what? How long did the idea of magical creation out of nothing in 6 days hold prevelance before somebody actually challenged it scientifically?'
p3912
aS'No - but they certainly have a bias. As do we all.'
p3913
aS'My apoligies emoticonXAngel It must have been the testosterone emoticonXBanghead emoticonXBanghead'
p3914
aS"To bad you don't have the power to define the situation."
p3915
aS"well if I don't get an answer here I'll just spread it around the whole internet. Fine with me."
p3916
aS'Are you blind? I was refering to Nancy Pelosi\'s "\'fair\' speech" policies, not free speech. Fair speech is an attempt to limit free speech.'
p3917
aS'To the exclusion of all others? I thought you were working for acceptance and inclusion. You are the only one allowed to "exclude?"   '
p3918
aS'Ever hear of artificial ensemination? Why is that heteros only think there is one way to produce children? I find hetero sex disturbing,and an unnatural lifestyle choice.'
p3919
aS'Yes none of the organs flown in from Africa or India would be farmed from murdered people, would they?  '
p3920
aS'Well I suppose I could\'ve always put up a sign that said "Trespassers will be held with legal counsel, robbers will be shot, survivors will be shot again" but you\'re just welcoming trouble with that.'
p3921
aS"Are you jealous because they won't let you out of the institution while gansao get's to run all over the place?"
p3922
aS"No, it's one of those rare instances in which YOU are on the right side of an issue. :p;)"
p3923
aS"And the ability to digest nylon is not a new function?? You seem to have a different conception of 'new function' that what matches with reality."
p3924
aS'My mistake; I read it wrong. And guess what? I do know what the moon is ;)'
p3925
aS'Am I suppose to take that as an insult or just a passing remark,hmmm?'
p3926
aS"I know. Sad indeed. Orion and his liberal ilk make it a habit to come up with these sophomoric ideas. As if Jesus (who is God according to Scripture) would come out and give Moses the commandments against gay sex and then turn around and incarnate as a gay man. Get real. When the antichrist comes he'll probably be gay (one OT scripture alludes to the antichrist as having no affinity for women, and Satan loves to mimic God's kingdom with some kind of diabolical twist.). Then Orion will prostrate himself before him and receive him as his long lost savior."
p3927
aS'I suspect a good many monitors and keyboards got cleaned on that one? ;)'
p3928
aS"And woman's law superceeds both, or hasn't your mummy taught you that little lesson yet Hunted?"
p3929
aS'Most congregations are expecting to leave the U.C.C.? Where did you see this, or are you making up the news again?'
p3930
aS'Does this mean that you have finally repented of your multiple divorces??'
p3931
aS'Mr. Brown was able to attend ball games. Not exactly held captive was he?'
p3932
aS'Cannot be helped. You make it far too easy. But do not think of yourself as a loser, think of yourself as a student with significant learning deficets.'
p3933
aS'We accept your forfiet. Two more to go! Once they post, this thread will be pretty much closed. I predict Penfold will go first, followed by Jo. emoticonXSmilie'
p3934
aS'by this stupidity a KKK mob with guns is a militia!'
p3935
aS'Did you start the thread in the hope that no one would respond to it ? Is responding to and pointing out the trolling and hypocrisy you have shown wrong ? But I congratulate you for finally admitting that this is a trolls thread. That is more than I expected from you. And as for me reinforcing your contention about conditional christian love ? I do love you my friend, I just hate what you represent which is why I express my love by correcting you and calling you on your every hypocritical contradiction. emoticonXAngel I am Archangel after all. emoticonXGood'
p3936
aS'Sigma, I was only joking. It hit me this morning though that if I\'m willing to talk about abortion without bringing up God, I wonder if the Pro-Choicers could argue their position without bringing up "women\'s rights". ;-)'
p3937
aS"well that won't help you when you go to hell...Woo hoo"
p3938
aS"The judge should be informed that 'the leading' IDist admits that ID is religion. (yes, I've posted this before...) What else could an unembodied designer, which naturalism perforce excludes, be but a deity? So Dembski's ID has one or more unspecified deities - supernatural, unembodied designers - creating biological systems, at some unknown time, at some unknown place, by some unknown series of steps. What a great scientific theory! :-)"
p3939
aS'Ahh, pointy tailed devils with pitchforks, more of your menagerie of divvels, demons, saints, angels, demigods, ghosts and other varied superstitious nonsense. Which of your gods created them, Snerdley?'
p3940
aS'And none of those explanations have anything to do with a magic being who made everything out of nothing. Science should teach currently held theory.'
p3941
aS"We gotta GET them law-abiders for having the audacity to believe the Constitution's Bill of Rights! Huh Brady!"
p3942
aS"Well so is falling out of a building onto a piece of rebar. Or getting mashed in a car crash. There are a lot more of those than shootings but you don't seem to care. Why is that? Is it because you love to dance in blood?"
p3943
aS"Thats funny, because these scrambled eggs sure don't taste like KFC to me."
p3944
aS"You mean my dog 'CIgarette'??  I took him out for a drag."
p3945
aS"So, all knowledge is ignorance, and all events not in the present are ignorance. I'm not following you here. How about we leave the definitions as they are, so that we can differentate true from false? Calling everything ignorance doesn't move us forward in the debate. If we accepeted your claim, we are typing ignorance and concuding ignorance, so what would the point be?"
p3946
aS'Yeah, renaissance right back to the dark ages, that is what you a holes did the last time you were in charge.'
p3947
aS'But the official IUPAC name for acetylsalicylic acid is 2-acetyloxybenzoic acid. Duh.'
p3948
aS'You mean the malcontents bred? Oh Noes! Who are the "we" who get to do it back, and whose army will you borrow to do it with? the present bunch of obese felons are already struggling to cope with their present duties.'
p3949
aS"I don't recall seeing anyone who's for gay marriage come out truly in favor of the idea here that I recall. Can you? Naw, didn't think so. emoticonXSmilie"
p3950
aS"Really? Why don't you go out and start randomly hurting and killing people and see how far that argument gets you in court.  "
p3951
aS'Well, she IS getting her info outta the bible, one of the bloodiest snuff novels ever written lol...'
p3952
aS'You mean like a tapeworm? Should removing tapeworms be illegal too?'
p3953
aS'Actually, no one cares if you believe in god. That is your business since it is something that you take on faith without any evidence that it is true. And no one believes in "evolutin" [sic]. The theory of evolution is an explanation for observed facts that has been repeatedly tested. It is the best explanation that scientists have been able to formulate. It is based on evidence and not faith.'
p3954
aS"That's quite a leap, even for you. How did you know that the officiers were pro-life? Or that any pro-life people would condone the officiers' behavior in this instance.   I certainly think it was excessive. I guess I must not be pro-life by your illogic."
p3955
aS'More irrational drivel, and have you forgotten that I am an arab? A smaller minority in this country than blacks? Yet you must play the race card and assume that because I oppose this criminal woman for threatening the life of her unborn child by actually holding her responsible for her own poor conduct that I am somehow a racist. Your argument is as pathetic as your character is found wanting, you immoral apologist for all that is wrong with this country.'
p3956
aS'So how is the oil and gas agreement with China working out for you antipodeans?'
p3957
aS'The CIA seems to agree with me. Appears to me that you tinfoil hat is starting to fray about the edges.'
p3958
aS'So AIDS is the fault of "the gays"?emoticonXRolleyes   lol it\'s been a long time, JP.'
p3959
aS"And you're a poor replacement for that koolaid-drinking Seer Travis."
p3960
aS'and where did they find the participants for this study, bath houses and bars? Gay men are a hidden population in statistical relms. It is very hard to get a true random sample of data on gay men. Studies will say whatever the funder of the study wants it to say. You just get data from the right place. If you want gay men to look like raging alcoholics get your study participants in a bar. If you want them to look like sexaholics then you get your study subjects in bathouses. The truth is that to have honest statistical data you need RANDOM SAMPLES.'
p3961
aS'Why? Would you rather get stabbed to death for twenty minutes than get hit in the head with a bullet? A desire to have suffering extended - hmmmm...'
p3962
aS"Being' immune' and being 'less prone' do not mean the same thing.  I doubt that you will become the poet laureate of Dallas if you do not understand words sweetplums.  You are an old camp fruit and a snivelling bigot .  Are we talking daddies? What does an old fruit like you know of daddies?  I bet he's sure proud of you.emoticonXChicken  I wouldnt be proud of having a mincing bigot for a son..must have set his sights low.  Do white men still leave a bad taste in your boyfriends mouth sweetplums?  You are not married .."
p3963
aS"Wow, make up your mind. Either populations change over time (evolve) or they don't.   Would your wingless beetles be able to produce wings again if they were somehow beneficial again? You are starting to sound like Darwin and his finches."
p3964
aS"Even if winnie the poo could read he simply doesn't have the brain power to comprehend."
p3965
aS'Yeah, ok, keep up with your "Creationist" therory and I\'ll stick to my much more believable idea of "Evolution." Keep your religion out of MY Government!'
p3966
aS'Good one, Truthsayer emoticonXGood   ...a rich white woman... LOL! Gotta be from Texas. :p'
p3967
aS'They are the people who dont get their boilers serviced regularly:)'
p3968
aS"ok, fine, you can use that line, but there is also a moajority that believes in other things. there's this crazy thing, called a choice. we all have that. remember? i made the choice to have sex, you're making the choice to be a total ***hole. we all make a decision, and its the strong ones that stick with them, even though there are others who dont believe the same thing."
p3969
aS'I think if that happened, Texas probably will go back to being the lone star state.'
p3970
aS'Just another bogus reason for having and abortion............There are thousands of them.........'
p3971
aS"Whatever. emoticonXRolleyes I think you're making a mountain out of a molehill here, but that's up to you."
p3972
aS'Right, because besides rape and health concerns these really are the only other reasons women have abortions. emoticonXRolleyes'
p3973
aS"Superglue! How you gonna make the DNA?  This is all facinating but it doesn't have a thing to do with information theory.  Copying DnA to do reasearch is a neat trick and quite useful.  Is there a point to this?"
p3974
aS"And Sotomayor argued that the American people have absolutely no right to defend themselves. What's your point?"
p3975
aS'thats true. i helped. my next bible will be 10 times better if i get around to finishing it'
p3976
aS'Oh, really?   Translation: the only amendments that rise and fall are the ones that I want to.'
p3977
aS"Just be like the Jews and Christians and steal the idea! A lot of their mythology isn't original: it was stolen from other people who thought it up first."
p3978
aS'What a relief, I would hate to think Batman was so gullible. But Dems, I can understand them thinking that. emoticonXHoho'
p3979
aS'And if the majority supported banning Christianity would that be ok just because the majority supports it? Civil rights should not be up for a vote ever no matter what.'
p3980
aS'Anyone can "give consent". The issue is wether the parson is old enough to make that decission. I bet the children Michael Jackson raped gave their consent. Does that make it "allright"? Are the kids "mature enough" to take the consequences of those actions?'
p3981
aS'So then I guess you could also debate that algebra serves no purpose as well.'
p3982
aS'Enlighten me. What evidence came out Monday, Tuesday Wednesday, Thursday or Friday of this week?'
p3983
aS'Go ahead and toss your Bible in the trash so you can justify your gay sex sin. See if that gets you into heaven.'
p3984
aS"perhaps you would like to explain simplistic.  Is the anthropic principle simplistic?  What natural law created natural law?  Where did the information come from?  Is matter creating matter simplistic? Matter creating information?  Here;s a deep thought:  If matter created the Universe what if it changes it's mind! emoticonXRolleyes"
p3985
aS"You mean you don't think you have your own made-up religion?? How interesting! Do you really think you're fooling God? Or us?? Or even yourself??"
p3986
aS"Wow, you are high on Christ...Scary...I haven't seen this addiction up close emoticonXRolleyes"
p3987
aS'Well I guess then it\'s open season to call all anti\'s "CHRISTONAZI"'
p3988
aS"Wow, what a group of rude, self important, pompous, pseudo intellectuals who will insult and personally attack a person for one grammatical error. I meant to say the UNIVERSE has aged from 4 to 14 billion years old since I was in school but rather than deduce that you call me dumb and ignorant ? With all of your so called intelligence can you prove the Universe is now precisely 14 billion years old ? Can you prove Neanderthal Man was a human descendant ? because DNA tests dont prove that out and yet PHDs and Masters Degreed scientists insist they are. That's why the bible say's that the wisdom of this World is foolishness to God."
p3989
aS"Now, that logic is so bad, it's worse than circular reasoning. It's figure eight reasoning."
p3990
aS'And it will, I guess, take an amendment to deny rights to and make a whole segment of the population second class citizens.'
p3991
aS"Since he's commented on it several times now, and seems to have me confused with someone else, maybe he's channeling a past life or something--who knows? Better yet, who cares? :p"
p3992
aS"Really? What book is that, because I have seen no quotes or links to any source of any info at all from you anywhere above on this page. So once again accipiter, what in the world are you referring to? You and the obvious child oughta get along fine since you both offer nothing more substantial than personal attacks which are based on your own warped beliefs and corrupted interpretations of that which you disagree with.   Here's my original post again, I challenge you to explain how these alleged stone age sheep herders whom you scoff at and mock described contemporary living creatures which paleontologists today identify as dinosaurs, from skeletal remains?"
p3993
aS"If they haven't been discovered yet, HOW THE BLOODY HELL DO YOU KNOW?  Ten percent more brains and you'd be pondlife. emoticonXKill"
p3994
aS"whooooosh. emoticonXBye  That was the sound of my point as it went over your head.  How much do you want to but I don't find any?  Go ahead bet me! Are you afraid?"
p3995
aS"Well that's a stupid statement. Stupid enough that I can't even wrap my head around it and make a proper comparison."
p3996
aS'Oh, but Sina does not live in a womb so she is unimportant.'
p3997
aS'Somewhere in the middle? I always though it was solidly to the Right. :p   '
p3998
aS'An immaculately presented response, entirely avoiding the topic, or indeed reason, in order to unwittingly further the case for retrospective abortion.'
p3999
aS'Explain that one to the thread starter. He claims he is the victim of age discrimination when he states "I am a person 15 years of age and I want my gun, yet I can\'t get one. Why not?"'
p4000
aS'And how do you know what other animals can analyze? Is that another supreme abilities of us humans? To read the minds of animals?'
p4001
aS'Depends on how basic they are. Not much call for using flint, steel and tinder to start fires.'
p4002
aS'Dont mind him, hes just sticking up for his new boyfriendemoticonXLove'
p4003
aS"And I'm sure you of all people know the mind of God... Please, you just take snippets of scripture, and twist it into well this is absolute. God loves gays and lesbians, but you fling god out as a way to justify your slander and bigotry.   "
p4004
aS"Well then. All of the ex-christians have it both ways don't they. Since they are saved they can lie, cheat, steal and have wild, illicit sex (following the example of several christian preachers)."
p4005
aS"I dont need a sex lesson from a little boy.  Once again you missed the point( getting to be a habit).  We are talking about behaviour that was condemned by the preacher, one of which was adultery..not fornicating but I am sure the preacher would condemn that too  If you read the link you would know.  If homosexuality is condemned by god then they cannot marry in gods eyes..keeping up?  If gays cannot marry then gay sex must be outside of marriage therefore it is fornicating.  You really should try to use your little head more.  'Lets stay on topic' who made you a mod?emoticonXChicken"
p4006
aS'There are somewhere between 10 and 20 million gay people is America. 10,000 is a small minority, yes. And even your article admits this number is unsubstantiated, AA. More lying for JESUS.'
p4007
aS'Yes, because Republicans are the only hypocrites in the government, right? emoticonXRolleyes'
p4008
aS'Here we go again with the name calling..............See what I mean Justine.......no wonder the gay movement is losing traction in this country........'
p4009
aS"Anything that doesn't fit your preconcieved prejudices is automaticlly wrong?"
p4010
aS'Considering what the TOE says, if a dolphin ever gave birth to a chipmunk, it would disprove evolution.'
p4011
aS"So in your own words the police want to go on murder sprees, because they're armed. According to you the military is just waiting for the first convenient excuse to open fire on anyone, be them designated enemies or just innocent bystanders."
p4012
aS"You're a Bush-man, aren't you, gnojek? Come on, admit it. With that stance, you'll be in the White House before sunrise.  (You do realize that I was being sarcastic - right?) emoticonXRolleyes"
p4013
aS"Yes, that was one of Galileo's more absurd leaps of logic."
p4014
aS'Yeah, so if on my math test, I put "The answer is 7 because my god says so" and the teacher marks it wrong, he\'s the XXXXX?'
p4015
aS"Let's allow same-sex marriage only. Then heterosexuals will have the same right to marry someone of the same sex.   "
p4016
aS'Being put in a cell with Howard Dean for life? emoticonXCry'
p4017
aS'Good point. If she is old enough to be licenced to drive, presumably. If she travels by bus, train or plane, are those companies complicit?'
p4018
aS"Your own source said the amendments are 11-27. Amazing how the 2A got incorporated into the XIV isn't it without Article V. emoticonXGood"
p4019
aS'That could also be very effective in a positive manner during political campaign speeches.'
p4020
aS'You really think so? Im flattered, but I think you are wrong.'
p4021
aS'Umm I dunno that whole faith thing is kind of important. Oh I get it you were being insulting.... Gotcha.... BTW hows that whole spiritual enlightenment thing working out for you?  '
p4022
aS'Good point. emoticonXAgreeemoticonXAgree The poor guy would be like a midget that got his stepladder taken from him!'
p4023
aS"You apparently know as much about law as you do about science. You wouldn't be arrested for having someone willingly consume a plant unless that plant was a controlled substance and last time I checked, poppy and weed weren't cancer cures."
p4024
aS"Says the one who uses the abortion card when he's about to lose a death penalty thread.   "
p4025
aS'the same way most people on planet earth dont give a XXXX about american "football"  '
p4026
aS'I get the feeling they have filed under: Plague, Avoid like the.'
p4027
aS'Translation: Muslims are worth nothing. Christianity is superior, therefore they are worth nothing. Let the US come in and kill them, ruin their cities, and take their oil.'
p4028
aS'Right, expect when talking about the 14th amendment. The way you guys like to define "equal protection" would make it so any restriction is unequal.'
p4029
aS'Here come the Christians, thinking they can know everything by guessing, and commiting the genetic fallacy left and right.'
p4030
aS'So the fact that we still have criminals who choose to kill others, should be used against is in determining whether we can be trusted or not?'
p4031
aS"I don't think it's a cover-up. I think that it's a conspiracy between the black helicopters and the aliens beaming suggestions to those without the foil-lined hats on. :)"
p4032
aS"Please emoticonXRolleyes Why dont YOU post something thats not one sided and full of non factual evidence that isn't full of spin and your crazy agendas?"
p4033
aS'In that case a man in a coma is not a person then, is he?'
p4034
aS'Ah?"scratching head"I just woke up,what?womens choice,her body,death penalty?ah ok gotch ya.emoticonXFrazzled'
p4035
aS"Obviously, in the event of a disaster, George W. Bush sure thinks he has a right to choose.  Hmmm, let's see, should I interrupt my vacation just because people are drowning in New Orleans? Naw, I don't think I should. They're just poor people and they probably didn't vote for me."
p4036
aS"Plain with the benefit of hindsight. I love how you're able to determine, not having been there, precisely what was said and precisely where it fell in relation to the law. If it was so clear, we'll see the prosecution for wrongful arrest in due course, I'm sure."
p4037
aS"And yet it's usually the liberal democrats who are in favor of murdering innocent children..."
p4038
aS'Does your use of the past tense "was" imply that you\'ve seen a burning bush and been converted to reality? Or are you still an "anti-american pinko commie bleeding heart liberal?"'
p4039
aS"You have no Idea how glad I was that I was sitting down when I read this!!  First it shocks me that you haven't labeled all those who claim to see UFO's liberals.  Then I have to wonder didn't at one time the RCC say we were the center of the universe,... The sun went around the earth,... the earth was flat ?? Theres no one but us .. It was all created for us??  Ok I'm goning to go take a little breath of fresh air and rest for a moment as this is very disturbing to me! .... V.O.R. and I agree on something. I think I'm going to be sick!! Back in a few."
p4040
aS'Simone, read the sentence again please. It was "Saving lives is "not just" a Republican goal." It concerns the subject of abortion.   The only way it relates to the politics of Iraq, is that abortionist would rather kill our kids before they get to "volunteer" their services for Iraq.   I can\'t let one statement you made go though. Terrorist continue to terrorize us? Where have they attacked in the U.S. since 9-11? Consider continuing this in an appropriate thread.'
p4041
aS"Thankyou for bringing to my attention that atoms, neutrons and protons are merely scientific assumptions. Now as I gaze at the night sky with all its' bits and pieces spinning around each other I can sleep happily knowing that our solar system is not part of a housebrick afterall."
p4042
aS"What makes you think I don't. Yours is not the only religion on earth!! And I didn't just jump to the concluision that your soul needed concern, so don't jump to it with me."
p4043
aS"It was a troll. Now that we've activated email response, it could take another look or expand some mail list."
p4044
aS'As usual, you shoot from the lip. I have no illusion of perfection, However I am convinced that as long as you live I will never be the dumbest man on earth.   '
p4045
aS'And yet the post-Dunblane handgun ban happened after only one event.'
p4046
aS'Like evolution, right? You have your conclusion, so everything else must adhere to it. Just answer the question. How to you account for the statements above?'
p4047
aS"Just helping something live doesn't affect evolution unless it affects the ability to reproduce viable offspring.   If there was no nylon before the 1940s and there is an organism that can survive by eating NOTHING else, what does that tell you? There could not have been a population of nylon-eating bacteria before 1940. This is a new population that did not exist before."
p4048
aS'Nah, he has been TRAINED to recognize demonic possession as part of his B.A.'
p4049
aS'I think jyoshu has posted a BS meter which is pretty nice.'
p4050
aS"What's your point? Unicorns breathe toxic gas and have low density, so they can get around all they want."
p4051
aS'I want to know how giving her abusers more reason to abuse her makes sense too.  '
p4052
aS"Don't forget cheaper to feed, take orders better, and are harder to hit."
p4053
aS'Wow, so Balrogs existed according to the Bible? Whoda thunk.'
p4054
aS"Oh yes, Mr Behe makes a comfortable living out of selling to the ignorant. His newest book is just a rehash of his old book, and has the very same flaws that have been destroyed over and over again. As for your 'religious authors' being respected.. they are respected perhaps by the fundamentalists that do not understand what science is about."
p4055
aS'You bet. Got a Scriptural problem with that, \'O "jesus"? Or are you not familiar with your own inspired Word?'
p4056
aS"I guess the Sinagua ruins and the Kayenta, Anasazi Wukoki ruins in Arizona just don't stack up against them big old Jewish buildings."
p4057
aS"Oh it applies, but if we were to look at the Bible that way, God wouldn't allow one single bad thing to happen."
p4058
aS"That's an out that's peculiar to Christians. Good? Godidit. Bad? Devil's work."
p4059
aS"Oh, dear. I seem to have lost you again. 'Peer' just means a group of people holding the same biases."
p4060
aS'because you wanna be wrong all the time...that seems like a good reason :)'
p4061
aS'Because of massive cultural differences. You might as well be asking "if both Americans and British people speak basic english, why do British people refer to apartments as flats?"'
p4062
aS'Possibly, I must admit I never tried to gain access to swords whilst over there.'
p4063
aS"Isn't that exactly what I said! Clearly we have an issue of a probably overweight white man who is without a doubt racist (because if we know anything it is that every white male that has short hair is a racist) coming down on a black woman!   You nailed it again MA! Props to you for uncovering this mystery."
p4064
aS'I know I know. Unless a woman is gestating or dieing she is being selfish.'
p4065
aS'Then by that standard, christianity is horse puckey! Christians contradict each other. Oh! But wait. Anyone who disagrees with you isn\'t "really" a christian.'
p4066
aS"Gee, I wonder why the liberal left is so quiet? I remember when Bush's DWI from decades previously came out, and you couldn't shut the hypocrites up!   It's hilarious."
p4067
aS"Or, since he didn't have $37-million tucked away from questionable business practices and a rich daddy, perhaps he paid attention to the ramifications of abnormal deficit spending."
p4068
aS"Uncle Sam hasn't tried to pass a law saying people can't install left-handed doornobs, to supposedly protect the doornobs of right-handed people. I guess right-handed people don't feel threatened by the minority. What a concept!"
p4069
aS'Anyone speaking English could well be an illegal from the UK then, right?   I guess Puerto Ricans better watch out too.'
p4070
aS"Are you really so dim that you think me answering a question you POSTED is somehow any implication at all on thelmoose's intelligence? emoticonXRolleyes"
p4071
aS'Na. Probably from smokin the Bovine Excrement they are trying to pedal! emoticonXSmilie'
p4072
aS'lol...you read my whole post only to conclude with "what\'s your point." Evolutionist brilliance on display. I\'m not mistaking nothing for nothing. I know my stuff. You obviously know nothing and don\'t care to learn it.'
p4073
aS'Have you lost your mind? I got no idea what you are talking about.'
p4074
aS'Your signal to noise ratio was too low for my tastes: too much "wackiness" (I assume "wackiness" was what you were trying for) and irrelevant side discussions.'
p4075
aS'Have some cheese with your whine, turkey?  Who is the liar? It is the person who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is an antichrist. 1 John 2:22  That would be you and those like you. Repent, you heathen!'
p4076
aS"Let's establish a campaign to search for the hypocrisy of people who call themselves pro-life yet find nothing wrong with killing a grown human being."
p4077
aS'Why am I not surprised chester, that chloe directly giving an in depth answer to you is perceived as not being germane to the topic. Since you never directly answer any proposition forwarded as you derail every thread by just serving up your off topic tripe. emoticonXGood  '
p4078
aS"I wasn't aware that a hairstyle could choose to believe (or not believe) in a god............."
p4079
aS"Look at Dunblane. Then look at Columbine. Who had the higher death toll?  How often do school shootings take place in Germany?  When was the last time somebody went driving and shooting in a killing spree in America?  Name the last mass public killing in America, in a public place where the number of victims reached double digit territory.  Go on Brady, we're waiting for you to prove that you actually have a point. Don't disappoint us."
p4080
aS'And the Brady background check has not been repealed either so by your "logic" it must be effective.'
p4081
aS'Leave it to a leftist to cite a leftist forum for evidence that a leftist agenda is supported by dedicated leftists. Go figure, huh? This post just proves that attempting to reason with such an irrational thinker is truly a waste of time and effort.'
p4082
aS'It appears that peddler is finally open to learning new things! (Unless, of course, peddler is simply being facetious... which is not obvious from the immediate context.)'
p4083
aS'Do you know how many Osama Bin Ladens we Killed???? emoticonXRolleyes'
p4084
aS"<flush>  Just come up with something that discredits the resurrection, if you think you can. Should be easy for you Einsteins, shouldn't it?  But in two years I haven't seen it yet. Not from you or anybody else.  Where's the beef?"
p4085
aS'Sounds like he/she has a problem with abstinence within the RCC and you have a thin skin about it.'
p4086
aS'Congratulations, Hunter. You have just accepted the 5 primary tenets of fundamentalism. So I guess that makes you a fundamentalist.  '
p4087
aS"Sweetie, if every gay person were as wealthy as Mary Cheney, we could laugh all the way to the bank and ignore the prejudice in society the way she does. Indeed, we'd probably be the darlings of the GOP. Unfortunately for your delusion, gays are no more or less wealthy on average than anyone else."
p4088
aS'That post is not only off topic, but yet a further example of your being completely out of touch with reality.'
p4089
aS'I think you need to breathe in a bag for a while..then maybe have a nap.'
p4090
aS'Please do, because according to your source McVeigh called himself an Agnostic.  '
p4091
aS"You're equating atheism and homosexuality with terrorism and drug dealing? Really? Can you stop being a reactionary dolt long enough to convince me you're worth even trying to converse with? If not, I'll understand... and not be surprised."
p4092
aS"Cower in fear of your god Easy, I'm not afraid, and nothing that you say is going to make me fear things which I believe to be imaginary.   Thankfully, our nation does not make laws based on your Phelpsian beliefs that god punishes the masses for the sins of others."
p4093
aS'Sorry baby the story was in the religion of peace land. Your strawman is burning.'
p4094
aS'Is that right next to ANWR? Are the Canadians downplaying ANWR while they side drill to extract our precious fluids? emoticonXClown'
p4095
aS'A truly charming publication. Over flowing with the warmth of human goodness.'
p4096
aS'You also need to borrow a new insult. Did you get that one from Crim?  '
p4097
aS"So? What does that prove? That Cheney's draft number was called more often than Slick's? emoticonXConfused"
p4098
aS'Senior citizen yachties stand little chance of defending themselves against pirates.   Piracy needs to be dealt with using military might.'
p4099
aS"Someone once said that the poor would always be with us.   I'll keep in mind that your core beliefs include the notion that what the poor really need is a hard day's work. You're a prophet I tell ya!"
p4100
aS"Oops, my bad. You're right of course. Port is an interface on a computer. It's also a harbour, so you're wrong too! :P"
p4101
aS"I guess I'd rather live among them, too, than have a hot poker shoved up my bottom."
p4102
aS"Did you notice how what I was responding to was said? I didn't think so. Your tunnel vision is showing again.   "
p4103
aS"You mus think you're pretty smart huh? Well guess what? You're confusing common, most common, majority, and norm. Lefthandedness is considerd common and the norm. You're using a superstistion from 300 years ago to qualify left handedness as deviant. Good try though.  Also left handed is genetic. It's not a gene but it's genetically related to the person's physical characteristics."
p4104
aS'No. What the doctor was doing was going to church. He was not a monster. He was not a "sicko." He was a murder victim.   What his murderer did was murder.'
p4105
aS"Yes, we shouldn't let those slaves be citizens, they will burden our legal system since they will now have...OMG...rights!"
p4106
aS"Ha, that is just an idiotic perspective. We'd have no laws (and many important ones) if you can't make a bill that doesn't affect you. Sorry Civil Rights legislation!"
p4107
aS'Well then, you would immediately notice a 15% reduction in bullying! Rejoice!   '
p4108
aS'That does not surprise me. A whole world filled with people who look, speak, think, and do things different than you must be absolutely terrifying.  '
p4109
aS'Yep, you libs would love that. Then you could party on end without having your carnal consciences tweaked, LOL! No sin then no need for a Savior.'
p4110
aS'Yep, Martha is in trouble and the democrats are panicking.   I think the strong Independent support for her opponent is due to Martha\'s own lack of appeal.   By they way, I have to ask....since "The anointed one" was in your neck of the woods, did you get a peek at him? prehaps even wave at him (with all 4 fingers) ;)'
p4111
aS"Which you would do by having teachers teach kids that being gay is alright. You would teach those kids, against their parents wishes, that being gay is alright. You would do that after you make it legal WITHOUT A POPULAR VOTE. Seems that you really don't give a rat's XXX about this poor dead kid at all. You just see his corpse and throw him on top of your gay marriage banner. How noble of you.   "
p4112
aS"So I take it you don't accept my challenge on the basis that it is impossible? Why is it impossible? Or better yet, why don't we al just evolve into perfect, anti-sinning creatures with 500 IQ points a piece?  "
p4113
aS'I believe that the theory you speak of is called slavery; everybody is equal because they have nothing and need to work long and hard just to earn the privilege of living in order to serve their masters.'
p4114
aS'Ok, so you utterly missed the whole religion vs. faith part of the discussion, got it.  '
p4115
aS"Well, then, I guess that in America we can't possibly be safe from kill-happy gunners can we?"
p4116
aS"Oh, well, then that settles the argument doesn't it. It must be a person because she says so, now. Maybe she will change her mind again?"
p4117
aS'Wow ehat a brave new world you live in.... Now lets say just 1% of all gun owners resisted (in the us that is several hundred thousand peppered through the land). With media attention to such infighting between government and citizens how do you deal with this?'
p4118
aS"Here's some advice, if you're going to try and crack on me, make your 'jokes' (I'll be nice and call them that) less passive and more active, grammar-wise.   Crim-   A definition is the meaning of word that someone created using their own opinions. Is there a difference?   And, a circle could be called a circle in the English language, but I could make up a new language in which a circle would be called a square and a square a circle."
p4119
aS'So you advocate religion not because it is the truth, but instead because it gives you comfort and security? The opiate of the masses eh?'
p4120
aS"First off, kudos on getting the quotes right! It's much appreciated.  Now, what's your actual assertion? If you spell it out than we can put this definition debate in context, and maybe actually get somewhere."
p4121
aS"ER, you're doing the God complex again. Sandra Fluke might not even use birth control because she may very well be celibate. Only God ... and ER who thinks he's God ... know."
p4122
aS"I just bet you thought you were smart just now? I'll go you several...   How about:  1. Murder  2. Stealing  3. Adultery  4. Rape  Almost every culture since the dawn of civilization has put to death those who have trespassed those basics. But I guess you didn't get that on the Recovery Channel huh? Your idiocy is profound only as your ignorance."
p4123
aS'Did your mummy read you scary stories when you were littler?'
p4124
aS'Oh, gee! There goes my irony meter. It pegged and started smoking at the end of the first sentence. Archy is just being christian by trying to impose his twisted morality on everyone.'
p4125
aS"Before you were claiming it was a slippery slope. Now you're claiming it's a strawman. Perhaps you don't understand what either term means."
p4126
aS"But rather than be honest about your mistake, you just changed things without paying any attention to the fact that we've shown you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to the claims of the scientific community.. at least, not until somebody tells you. (And you accuse me of not having a teacher's mentality as I educate you in something you didn't previously know... How pathetic.)  "
p4127
aS"Tell me genius, how is me accurately and correctly pointing out your mistake colluding to misdirect anyone? Either you are again using words you don't know the meaning of to make such an inaccurate statement, or you're just lying. So which is it penfold, are you ignorant or just being dishonest again? emoticonXConfused"
p4128
aS"Talk about a crock! How can you wail on anyone with your imaginary truth stick of no mercy when you wouldn't know the truth if you tripped over it? And you going ballistic like this just proves the exact point I made in that you'll allow my free speech until I say something you disagree with and then you attack me to shut me up. Which is exactly what I said above that precipitated your childish tirade. See?"
p4129
aS'Michael Moore Hates America is also coming out in theaters some time in October.'
p4130
aS'Hey, maybe some chosen by God religious fundamentalist will offer up his own daughters to be gang-raped, and then later have sex with those same daughters and children by them. You know, the way Lot did in the Bible. The one Peter called "a righteous man".'
p4131
aS"My point stands, just because you can't get it has no impact at all on its validity. YouTube - The jokes on you..."
p4132
aS'Tell me, how does one "steal land" from a nomad? emoticonXConfused'
p4133
aS'You forgot to mention that we would have to change our numbering system so that grasshoppers had 4 legs.'
p4134
aS'Ok, EF, so am i likely to win the lottery before i meet an alian?'
p4135
aS"Like I said, Catholic school. Or it could be that you're like 80 years old or something, because nowadays, if you talk about God or the Bible, then you don't get in trouble, you get criticized and made-fun-of, not only by your peers, but also by teachers."
p4136
aS"I noticed that you do reply to mine. Perhaps you should reconsider since you're getting your ar$e handed to you with every reply I write. ;)"
p4137
aS"So, once again, the lack of criminal prosecution isn't due to the red herring that you claim, but rather the incompetence of the Justice Department. Franken's bill doesn't have a provision for making the Justice Department do its job, does it?"
p4138
aS"I don't really give a flying hippo's arse what you think - your posts here and on the other forums are repugnant, and as of now, you are being put on ignore (to take a page from Steeeeve)."
p4139
aS'Not only is Phyllis right in calling you what you are but you clearly ignore reality. You were already called on using incorrect facts once...you might as well say "denying abortion will cause 10000000 bagillion deaths a day"'
p4140
aS'I\'m against polygamy, marriages with underaged minors and marriages to livestock as well, so don\'t feel that you are the only ones not "accomodated".   '
p4141
aS"<Flush>  Your own source said there's a cliff a mile and a half away, and I'm the liar? Go find it and jump off it, you flaming, incompetent, scatter-brained, dishonest cretin."
p4142
aS"An objective test? Wow! Tell me, how do you prove this test is a true useful test? Please don't tell me reason or yet another objective test.  "
p4143
aS"Strange, I thought it was supposed to be a global flood that wiped out all of man except the chosen few. That would be 'involving Australia' one assumes."
p4144
aS"So it doesn't matter that someone dies in their forties from hunger and cold because they are homeless and penniless, whilst another lives in luxury with the best food and medicines until his 80s: they are both equal? What planet do you live on, for it sure aren't the real world..."
p4145
aS'You mean that the planets and stars have always existed? Really - so how come we see stars being made in nurseries via the Hubble telescope.'
p4146
aS"And I'm guessing by your misinformed posts that you have not been high before. Did you recently watch a film called Reefer Madness by any chance?"
p4147
aS'Is this satire? If so...bravo...well done. emoticonXGood If you are really serious...ummmm...excuse me. emoticonXEmbarrassed'
p4148
aS'Not to speak for Jim, but I\'m going to go out on a limb here and guess it was "Rebuttlickan". Just a hunch.'
p4149
aS'On the bright side, it appears that the Rapture will solve the Social Security financing problem...'
p4150
aS'So somebody try and tell us, that with stuff like this going on, that America still needs to overhaul its gun laws to bring them more in line with those of Mexico.'
p4151
aS"Ah, so I don't like democracy, and yet it is you who in the post are telling me that I have to support McCain's statement. Are you serious? That sure doesn't sound like democracy to me. I also find it funny that you claim that I don't like democracy when my very post stated that I would be voting for the Democrat party. But then, I guess if we don't support Bushyboy and his fellow republicanazis, we must be against democracy, right? Get real, Phyllis."
p4152
aS'Not in the mood? Oh I see because they restrict you already your not in the mood to remove the regulations that do not work and insert proper ones that do. Excellent ignore the issue at hand and give no suggestion to improve upon the current laws and restrictions....  '
p4153
aS'Really??? Maybe you should do a little research before you make sweeping statements like that. -- http://www.rainbowbaptists.org/'
p4154
aS'Once one is adept at finding evidence after a conclusion is presumed, all sorts of "proofs" reveal themselves. What\'s next, Nostradamus?'
p4155
aS"In my lifetime, we've made huge strides, but there's a lot more to learn."
p4156
aS"And why would you say something like this? Because Christianity prohibits it? I can't think of any other reason."
p4157
aS"It's a real mess, though you've to got to give them points for originality."
p4158
aS"60% accepting Roe v Wade is a high figure don't you think? More people support abortion then the president."
p4159
aS'Do you need faith to know the sun will rise tomorrow or that 2 + 2 = 4 or to know that if you drop a rock it will fall to the ground?'
p4160
aS"I'm not big on the abortion issue, but are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you is sexist and arrogant? That's a tactic straight from the leftist playbook. Clearly you're the one who's arrogant, if you can make these kinds of baseless generalizations of your opponents. Isn't it you who always accuses conservatives of being intolerant of people who think differently than them? Now that's irony!"
p4161
aS"I'm sure it is many a doctors' spiritual duty to relieve suffering, just as Jesus healed the sick.   Besides, who wants to go back to 40 year average lifespan, like they have in Afghanistan? Not me."
p4162
aS'If the rejecting of the "lifestyle" results in death, beatings, job displacement, eviction, insults or inequality, then what would YOU call it? "Religious moral code?"'
p4163
aS'Waxy, please read this. Maybe it will help you. When you said the proper way to say it was, "....tell me I\'m wrong, at least do it grammatically." you made absolutely no sense. Do something grammatically? You obviously have to use grammar when you write a sentence.'
p4164
aS"Ah, so we shouldn't get all stirred up because little girls are singled out for slaughter?  Please excuse me for having misplaced priorities."
p4165
aS"Sorry did I say pacifist?I meant yellow bellied pacifist.However if its any consolation, I meant anti's in general not just you Sinj.sorry if it sounded that way."
p4166
aS'So, some parts of the Bible are erroneous oral history after all! What a refreshing admission.'
p4167
aS'Are you serious? Man I thought you actually had a brain in that dense hollow cranium of yours. You do realize there are Straight Atheists and GAY Christians right Gans?'
p4168
aS'You can start your own thread on how historical the Gospel accounts, etc., are.   How about dealing with the question now instead of running scared and going down another rabbit trail?'
p4169
aS'If it did that, then you might have won an argument by now.'
p4170
aS'The point being that nobody is spoiling Christmas for the children, you paranoid fruit cake.'
p4171
aS"While I fully realize you can't do math and thus why you consider it atheism, but post #96 and post #81 are not the same post. But then again, you were the one who argued that post 113 came before 106 so maybe you do think that complete failure to understand math and linear thinking is sane?   "
p4172
aS'Demolishing your "rebuttal" in post #14 does, however. You missed it.'
p4173
aS"Maybe because it's a loaded question? If another evolution hoax were discovered similar to Piltdown man, would you reject evolution and become a Christian? :p"
p4174
aS'You are the only one in this discussion that shows a predominant lack of logic or reason. Your position has been proven wrong, get over it .'
p4175
aS"What about them? Is this a question?   Um. Have you read Leveticus? And I mean, read it. Not skimmed it.   Because, God loves everybody. Are you reaching?   And what does fast and loose mean? I'm confused. I think you are trying to label me.. but I'm not quite sure what I'm being labled as.   What part about people burning in hell for eternity?"
p4176
aS'Symbiote seems to have had a large hair across his butt.'
p4177
aS'Because of your question " What is your definition of pure", I now know how to make soap. I\'ll never stink again!!! And I think homeopathic medicine is all about using things like vitamin c to prevent colds, and making sure you ingest lots of calcium if you are worried about ostioperosis. Ya know stuff that makes sense.'
p4178
aS'Is it possible to be an adult and be as clueless as you seem to be?  This was in response to the question did Jesus not believe in evolution.  Only someone with similar mental capacity to yours would ask such a question.  It seems unfair I have to answer this senseless comment you added to the nonsense.'
p4179
aS'We are figments of our own imaginations, sent here by Satan to annoy the faithful! emoticonXAngel'
p4180
aS'Well, in the case of a creationist, the bias determines what evidence will be discarded, what evidence will be twisted, what evidence will simply be ignored.'
p4181
aS'ah yes....."Gaytheist," the terminal homosexual atheist liar at various forums such as IIDB and Tweb misrepresents me to some guy who studies tadpoles. The little XXXX liar atheist claimed to the author that I used his paper as "evidence" of lamarckism -- which was a bold-face lie that she couldn\'t back up when I pressed her on it. This was merely his response to her strawman lie. Funny how you must repeat these lies to help cover up how pathetic your theory is.'
p4182
aS'What\'s your evidence that the Gospel prophecies are "spurious claims"? Seems like you\'ve bought into a scalding case of rational tunnel-vision (or political correctness, if you prefer).'
p4183
aS'That explains your excellent use of grammar, word choice and spelling? ROTFLMAO'
p4184
aS"Aw shucks! And I reckon in Kansas they won't ever care whether or not you learn how to spell ATHEIST."
p4185
aS"BOY-HOWDY!! Why don't you let me know how you really feel? I have not tried to demonize anything. Rap music does that to itself without any help from me. Rap is the lowest form of music that I have ever heard. It is just too primative for my tastes. Once again, I am not a racist, nor am I sexist. I do my own washing. I wish you and your child nothing but the best in life. Some folks think that exposing young children to Rap music is a form of child abuse, I agree with those folks.  P.S. Tell that Southern girl to find another room-mate, you sound like a horrible role model. Well, got to go wash some more underwear."
p4186
aS"That's because the Taliban in Afghanistan didn't have any oil with which to bribe them."
p4187
aS":p I wish! If I did, I'd be as wealthy as the Church, who does. emoticonXHoho"
p4188
aS'Make up your mind. Is it because of diet or is it because of evolution. It would be nice if you pick a horse and ride it.'
p4189
aS"I'm now slightly less confused about why I've never seen this discussed before."
p4190
aS'Never thought of that. If that "person" has rights, do they have responsibilities? Could a fetus be charged for causing toxemia? How about suing the little tyke for giving mom varicose veins and stretch marks?'
p4191
aS'Yea right you are likely to know. Stick with the enema hotline.'
p4192
aS"So, you're just an anti-geologist, anti-cosmologist, anti-archaeologist, anti-physicist, and probably a few more that I can't be arsed to think of right now. *shrugs* Might as well get it over with and just say you're an anti-science religious nutter."
p4193
aS"Just like it's the job of the gun control lobby to try and pass an overwhelming, unreasonable level of fear of an inanimate object?"
p4194
aS"Talk about incoherent wishful thinking. Instead of unsubstantiated claims and baseless attacks, why don't you provide, oh, I don't know, mybe some peer-reviewed EVIDENCE? You know, that little old thing that is required for anyone to take your wild claims even remotely seriously?"
p4195
aS"I like the Grape Flavored best, But I won't be drinking any KoolAid with you or one of your religious Cult Fanatics...   And why would I be embarrassed about telling the truth?...."
p4196
aS'Well, if history were binding we would still have slavery...and abortions being illegal for that matter. Something being done for a long time doesn\'t mean it makes it in the constitution. I don\'t know which part of the constitution has a "preserve history" clause.  '
p4197
aS'Oh yeah right, like sociopaths who are bent on killing and slaughtering everyone around them, can be fixed with something as stupid as school counseling.'
p4198
aS'I guess it is a bad thing to make his wife cry but the republicans can make any hatefilled statement of attack against gay and lesbian americans and that is ok.'
p4199
aS"Why don't you answer Bryan's post above troll? He has some important information you would never figure out by yourself?"
p4200
aS'What! You mean that WE don\'t want to do all of those things? Who knew? I didn\'t get the memo? emoticonXConfused   And you forgot "make Seniors eat dog food". emoticonXGood'
p4201
aS'This coming from the guy who is accurate on every thread on this forum and provides factual and analytical evidence to a intellectual arguement. (sarcasim) PleaseemoticonXRolleyes'
p4202
aS"So what are you claiming now? That all this time that Rosie was making fun of the Chinese, she's actually been Chinese all the while? Because that's the only legitimate way you could draw a parallel with those people who are hypocritically attacking gays while being gay themselves."
p4203
aS'Well, if you combined his plan with all the others, then make all the cuts at once, you would be like 25% of the way there!!   Come on, Steeeve...we have limited material to work with here.....'
p4204
aS"I can hear all the scores of laughter now. emoticonXRolleyes emoticonXRolleyes emoticonXRolleyes   But alas, this is pointless, as are you. I'm bored and done.   ciao"
p4205
aS'That "brilliant" statement has absolutely NOTHING to do with the original point.   ...later'
p4206
aS'Why not? My mother has been 39,for the last 39 years.'
p4207
aS"Since you're so fond of reporting personal attacks to the mod, maybe someone should return the favor to you? emoticonXRolleyes"
p4208
aS'Apparently Archie thinks this is golf, where the lowest score wins. Who wants to clue him in?'
p4209
aS'Are you trying to be funny in a "I\'m the one who drew attention to this aspect in the first place, but now I\'m going to criticize you for talking about what I drew attention to" type mentality?  '
p4210
aS'Um, Bassman, so you, the one person in the world who is as "pure as the wind-driven snow," is the one who may judge others, including Democrats. Um, for the record I grew up on the prairie and saw a goodly bit of "wind-driven snow" and it was not particularly pure. A feeble and laughable metaphor.'
p4211
aS'If only Ann Coulter could report a pie throwing to the admin like a spoiled little cry baby. emoticonXRolleyes   She\'s probably more of a "man" than that though. :p   Waxy'
p4212
aS'Somehow I think most people are going to be a lot more comfortable with their kids seeing people in African atire with long hair than with scantily-dressed (or topless) people simulating sex acts. emoticonXRolleyes   '
p4213
aS'Balloon Juice Blog Archive BoBo Brooks, New King of the Media Village Courtiers?'
p4214
aS'You mean like Korea? Oh wait we are still there....  Is Israel a nice secure place safe from terrorism? The notion that Iraq will be without conflict will not occur in our life time.'
p4215
aS'Confucius, that is one of the biggest puddles of sentimental puppy dribble that has ever been manufactured.'
p4216
aS'I get what you are trying to do but it doesn\'t work. You might as well say "let\'s print a bunch of money...pay off the debts...and then force people to burn it!".'
p4217
aS"Only in your mind could lying about me be telling the truth smiley. And if you had any concept of what truth is, you wouldn't be an anti-christian atheist my spiritually blind friend. emoticonXAngel"
p4218
aS'I think pedophilia is a disorder as opposed to an illness but I\'d have to look back at some psychology books. How do I define illness? Well, I have a few contexts for this. The flu...obvious illness. Christians feel that sin is an "illness", so in that sense we are all rather ill :). As for wrong...same deal.  '
p4219
aS'Now you\'re just being an butt. The word Dungarees is a coloquialism. Do you know what that word means?   Also that\'s what jeans were called before the word "jeans\' entered the venacular. (Do you know what that word means?)   So, now are you going to tell me that only homosexuals have larger vocabularies?   Get a life...and preferably not mine...I\'m living it at the moment.'
p4220
aS"Odd. I can't seem to find any racial slurs or racist ideology in those sentences. In fact, I don't see any race or races in general even mentioned. You're just one of those people who thinks you can win a discussion by accusing your opponents of being racist. Sorry simone, but in the real world, people can disagree with your leftist views (which are barely existent) without being racist."
p4221
aS'And oddly enough you have been given several on silver platters. Perhaps you need to visit a neurologist and get checked for memory problems? Just to remind you once more - SICKLE CELL TRAIT is a mutation AND it benefits the phenotype under specific definable conditions. Do you really want to get hit about the head with that bat yet again?'
p4222
aS'You mean the truth of thousands of young teen girls dead with a coat hanger in hand? Abortion is a neccessity so that it can be regulated. People will have abortions legal or not legal. At least provide a safety net other than a coat hanger.'
p4223
aS"So if Jitobear's mother had the option to abort Jitobear in utero, you want Jitobear to have the same option with any children she carries? That's awfully progressive of you."
p4224
aS"I think it would be best for neither one to have a gun, as there would be no chance of me getting hurt. After all, I could beat up a guy armed with a plastic fork. However, if the hijacker has a gun, I'd like someone (not me, I'm half blind in each eye, I'd probably hit a passanger or something) to have a gun."
p4225
aS"  So what do ya Say! Come On. Be reasonable! Do it for the children! Or don't we care about these children because they weren't hurt or killed by a firearm?"
p4226
aS'Makes about as much sense as saying many of the car hating crowd (people who support such laws as car registration) also own cars. More evidence that your handlers have trained you to see the world in black and white.'
p4227
aS"Is North Korea a bastion of peace and good-living? Nope. Is it religious? Nope. Therefore obstacles to 'peace' don't necessarily have to be tied in with religiosity.  Hope that's spelt out enough for you. Try to keep up."
p4228
aS'Speaking from ignorance once again, eh SP? Did you, by chance, ever read the 2000 Census form? Did you happen to see the category "unmarried partner"? I didn\'t think so. Now, go eat some crow. emoticonXHoho   http://www.census.gov/population/www...0/samesex.html'
p4229
aS"Perhaps some people here aren't on the same level of intelligence. Seems you and chester understand it now so that is good."
p4230
aS"Yup, I get the drift. You're the sort that is in denial about how he feels about gays; equating tolerance for gays with tolerance for murderers, while pretending you're doing something else. Now I know how you think, thanks!"
p4231
aS"Worship me and I'll bless you too. With money of course. He can't even give you money. I am the true god and I created the mindset that he was a god in him. Worship me and spread the word about the true religion. Everyone who joins my church will instantly get $1,000 and after a week of membership you will get $1 million. The end of the week is when my project is and then you can go into the real world. All those who didn't believe in me will be destroyed when my world I created gets to the dump."
p4232
aS'Hmmm, was that an ad hominem attack? You know, what you accuse others of doing? Hypocrite.'
p4233
aS"OMG, are you for real? I'd think that if you saw a plane flying low, being chased by a fighter jet, you'd get out of the way. Any SANE person would...  Further, you'd be peeved if you found out that it was your govt. being completely insensitive (not to mention wasteful). The govt. screwed up...if it had been Bush you'd be crying bloody murder."
p4234
aS"You of course have documentation of Darwin laying out his plan as to how to weasel evolution into classrooms to oust theism, right? No? You're making it all up? Shocking.  "
p4235
aS'Well, considering how ambiguous and contradictory the Christian scriptures are, I guess this interpetation makes as much sense as any of the others.'
p4236
aS'Good, good, good, good and good. You should also know that Ron Paul will personally club one baby seal for every vote Hillary gets in the primary. He will then consume all socialists with fire from his eyes.'
p4237
aS"Yet another of your posts that wouldn't pass the Turing Test..."
p4238
aS'Nice to know that you are breaking the law responsibly. emoticonXGood'
p4239
aS'Do you even read what anyone posts? Try it, you might learn something.......maybe not.......'
p4240
aS'Thanks for that little ad hominem! Shall I share with you my guesses about your motives?... But I digress.  '
p4241
aS'Well, maybe the pistol and the hunting rifle, what do you need an automatic weapon? Have the deer gotten faster?'
p4242
aS'As "special" as being one of over 100Million makes me. emoticonXRolleyes'
p4243
aS"I guess it's okay to lie for Jesus just so long as He ain't intently watching."
p4244
aS'Get away? We never went near it in the first place.'
p4245
aS"didn't Kevin Costner do a movie about this in 1995?"
p4246
aS'Clue: It\'s there in your own sentence. Five letters, beginning and ending with "S". If you need further interpretive assistance, don\'t bother with Sarge, she\'s waiting for an original thought.'
p4247
aS"FYI you'll get sand in your ears from sticking your head in too deep...."
p4248
aS'Seems short compared to the hit list on infants since the last 36 ...'
p4249
aS"Oh? What keeps you from having 6 or eight or for that matter having crossed bandoleers across the chest?   I suspect kalifornia law will be changed a bunch and one in the pipe will be in vogue as well as a loaded mag in the gun for utility sake. You wouldn't want the perp to be disadvantaged too much now would you? How many shots must one allow the perp before you can fire back?"
p4250
aS"Dude, my own father had hospice care in my home up until he died. I think I know a thing or two about it. None of what you say disproves that end-of-life can still be a scary thing. Maybe if you'd stop just being belligerent about it and actually thoughtfully discuss it, you might actually find some things I'm saying you find agreeable. (GASP!)"
p4251
aS"Absolutely, and I am suggesting we first attack Sweden. That's my plan. emoticonXBanghead emoticonXBanghead"
p4252
aS"That's military snipers, not for what passes for elite police in the land of the fruits and nuts. SEALS, Marines and Army for the most part."
p4253
aS"I'll give you His phone number and you can call yourself. It's 1-333-NOS-ODOMY. emoticonXAngel"
p4254
aS"So what's your point, Bush is as Liberal as the most Liberal Senator in Congress?  "
p4255
aS"WHAT QUOTES??? That's what I was asking you to repost because I can't find anything intelligent you have either posted or quoted at all!"
p4256
aS'I would be scared about a huge segment of society that considers me a clever ape.'
p4257
aS'I was right wasnt I? You do have buck teeth and play the banjo...look see if the Sesame street web site has a definition of zombie..what an arsehole lol'
p4258
aS"Non-aggressive, yeah. That's why it's Israel that's the occupying force in Palestine and not the other way around. emoticonXWow"
p4259
aS'Absolutely. Because atheists are spiritually constipated and are too dumb to realize God and Christ are real.'
p4260
aS"NONONONONONONO! I wasn't talking about you JoeBrummer I was talking about aNaCaLaGoN! Don't worry I try not to pick on people who don't like it!Right Sinjin?"
p4261
aS"You know, if the God deniers even let the baby out of the mother's womb alive to begin with then he's already one step ahead of the game.  As for what to do with him then, show me under the New Covenant where Jesus said to stone kids?  Personally, I think we should stone obese, jaded statues of weird looking holy men."
p4262
aS"Eighty-nine times. Still quite a junior partner. I must admit that he doesn't like to be slighted though, as evidenced by Luke 12:10. One can say some nasty things about the Son of Man, and all's fine. But say one off-colored comment about the Holy Ghost and it's lakes-o-fire time. He needs to get thicker skin, IMO. Do ghosts have skin, BTW?   "
p4263
aS'Do you have to have human organs to be considered a person? Who made this rule??? You? What if you get lung removed...are you less of a person? So around 8 weeks though you believe it is in fact a human?  '
p4264
aS'Maybe you are and maybe you are not. You can criticize but there again you may incur the wrath of ole Doc too. emoticonXSmilie  '
p4265
aS'Trying to argue with a person who is babbling nonsense is not my idea of a productive time to spend my time. I\'ve explained myself and that\'s the end of it.   You can label my posts anything you want but that doesn\'t mean anything. It just means you are proficient in throwing out insults. So for purposes of this discussion I crown you the "insult king" of this forum.'
p4266
aS'He stated that " statistics show that firearms cause aggression in individuals", no mention of the word can anywhere in there that I saw.'
p4267
aS"That is exactly what he is here for. To spread god's.. 'love'."
p4268
aS'that was a cheap shot my friend.. lets keep at around an a*d*u*l*t level.. shall we?'
p4269
aS'What is this "we" stuff? Got a mouse in your pocket? I thought god was going to destroy it...not "we".   '
p4270
aS"Quite true. Top that with the adolescent mentality exhibited by SP and the boys and you've got yourself a reason to consider calling Dr. Jack Kevorkian.  "
p4271
aS'So most of your friends have had sex with your guy too? emoticonXGood  You and I both know that homosexuals have different partners regularly, at least compared to heterosexuals.'
p4272
aS'I take it that you are not educated about maternal mortality in pregnancy, then?  '
p4273
aS'Say hello to my little friend! We the people, through our State Governments!'
p4274
aS"Sure you don't want to address the gaping holes in your argument. That's up to you.  "
p4275
aS'In the thousands of scientific papers that present the thousands of bits of evidence that go to prove evolution beyond all sensible sane and reasonable doubt.'
p4276
aS'But what makes them any different from ant hills or beaver dams? skyscrapers are natural because humans are a part of nature and they built them.'
p4277
aS'I must say, you are quite a creepy addict. You seem pretty dangerous when high, especially since you think everything is a good idea. And why would you want his soul? emoticonXConfused Are you in a cult? Is that why you get high? I can see why teachers would need to go to attitude school after meeting you. They might need some help, as well as do you. And as contrary to your side subject, I think I am quite different than you.'
p4278
aS'Can cause aggression, does not mean that it will though. Alcohol has a far greater record of this but yall are not trying to ban that. So do women but we arent going to ban them now are we, Sorry but I was in a marriage from hell and just had to throw that in.'
p4279
aS"Nice attempt at an audition. Since the law firm you hired is supposed to find a director and president for your crumbled .org do you think you will get the job? What's the matter, didn't Hennigan cut it after the other lawyer fled when he saw the handwriting on the wall? emoticonXGood"
p4280
aS'I am actually getting my entertainment value out of WW and his lack of knowledge, along with his attempts to ########. If you or the others are bothered by his ignorant banter please let me know, and I will stop forcing him to give answers on subjects that he so obviously has no clue.'
p4281
aS'Well uh I am a fan. & you remind me of Humpty Dumpty.  '
p4282
aS'As I have pointed out, the only BS here is your accusations.'
p4283
aS"When I think of the great minds of literature, Ann Coulter is certainly not on the top of my list. In fact, when I think of minds, I don't even think she has one. I hope that you write this in jest, otherwise...I would seriously suggest that you expand you horizons. emoticonXFrazzled"
p4284
aS'WOW are we seeing the softer, gentiler Jyoshu?   Your snoopy avatar must be afecting you :) :p'
p4285
aS'BOY-HOWDY!!!!! You have spoken the truth and spoken it well. Welcome to you from the conservative South.'
p4286
aS"So according to you, you'd prefer it if only the bad guys are armed, because that makes it easy to tell who's the bad guy and who's the good guy; being the good guy is never armed, and thus never able to defend themselves."
p4287
aS"And, I'm sure you ask yourself that very question before you unzip your fly and whip out your pecker, right?"
p4288
aS'Ok if we can not use guns. Can we use baseball bats? Is that OK with you?'
p4289
aS"And the UN seems to feel it's necessary to spell out that you have the right to marry and have a family."
p4290
aS'And would guns in the hands of citizens have stopped that? Or does publicity, which has only increased since those events, stop them? Your selective reading ability is at work.'
p4291
aS'Nonsense. Just look at all the great things that the Dark Ages did for Europe!'
p4292
aS'Yeah, cause there are sooo many 100 year old corks just kickin around.'
p4293
aS"I think he is just disturbed because he didn't get his 40 acres and mule?"
p4294
aS"Someone's help? Whoever are you talking about? It wasn't any much work at all. A simple search. I'm pointing it out to you in the hopes that you'll get some new material. That and the fact I'd rather not see you banned."
p4295
aS'I guess you never thought that many Cathoilics have gays in their family, or should they ask them to take their lives ?'
p4296
aS"You'll never have that problem comic relief. You'll always be young mentally."
p4297
aS"Where do you get off saying that kind of tripe to somebody?  That kind of insane comment is typical of far left loons like you who lie for a living and don't have the common sense of a fence post.  And that goes for Jo Bennett too if he's agreeing with you.  Cretins."
p4298
aS'Oh, EZ, so this god of yours wants to see ME, does he?  Well and good. Because when I have access to that god he is going to get an earful from me about how his people have screwed over the world.'
p4299
aS'This will kill innovation. do you know how many years a start up business might be in the red before it generates a profit? Why bother when you know you are going to be clubbed as soon as you realize a profit? Yep, way to incentivize business there...  '
p4300
aS"No, the law didn't specifically mention gays, or dwarfs, or one-eyed pirates, or 6 toed individuals. emoticonXRolleyes   "
p4301
aS'Archie, the only way you can possibly come to that conclusion is by literally ignoring everything the author says, every accepted definition of the words socialism, statism, capitalism, fascism and nazism. If we ignore everything the author says and make up our own definitions for those words, it STILL does not work because the argument is STILL illogical and you look like a dishonest fool making it.   Face it. You got pwned. Are you really not bright enough to recognize that?  '
p4302
aS'Did you actually read it? I suspect not. Did you think that I wouldn\'t? I suspect so. Did you think that no one here would have any knowledge of good old "Kimisaurus" (that\'s what it was tagged when Kim was telling us about it)? I suspect so.  '
p4303
aS'Dragons and Dinosaurs coexisting only recently? hmm when they did dissapear? Maybe Conan the Barbarian killed them all!'
p4304
aS"No EasyRidden.. It's you right wing fundies who have attempted for years to rewrite history to fit your religion into our constitution. America is a nation which has always had a population of christians, but it was never a Christian nation. The Words God, Jebus, Holy Spirit.. are NOT included in any of the founding documents. You can continue to ignore the history, you're the one looking like a buffoon."
p4305
aS'But being American, she knew killing Iraqi children would be the right thing to do FOR TOTAL VICTORY FOR AMERIKA!!1!!'
p4306
aS'i assume you can demonstrate that everyone that opposes or critiques gay rights are personally attacking an individual or group? please, be my guest'
p4307
aS"I've got a better compromise. We'll keep our magazines in whatever size we please, and we'll ban you, J Miro, Simone, and a random forum troll to be named later. That sounds fair and even in terms of trade to me."
p4308
aS"I guess it's a good thing I wasn't replying and/or talking to you then. But thanks for your input, it has been noted."
p4309
aS"Reasonable gun regulation is an oxymoron like military intelligence. You mean like Bill Ayers (sic) and his wife or Carl Rowen? Wait my bad they aren't from the right."
p4310
aS"Well it came from somewhere and presumably changed as it went along.   Careful there that ones been clearly shown to be the case - in a laboratory environment to boot. Not to mention in the form of a hydrogen bomb!   You mean that the planets and stars have always existed? Really - so how come we see stars being made in nurseries via the Hubble telescope.   So you don't believe that life had an origin! WOW so you think its always been present on the Earth? Not even the bible goes that far! And you fail to account for the observation that there IS life.   Thats not an evolutionary theory, at least not a scientific one. Kinds is a theological construct not a biological one and MOST creationists use the KINDS thing as a support for their arguments."
p4311
aS"ROFL....Yeah, right, since you 'left wingers' seriously see yourself as center-right.....whaddayah know?"
p4312
aS"And you're baffled that you don't have more intelligent debate with people. I'm shocked."
p4313
aS"Math is confusing too, doesn't mean we should get rid of it."
p4314
aS'It has been 33 years. The allies managed to stop the holocaust in only two. You guys are certainly dragging your feet at stopping the great American "holocaust" against "unborn babies."'
p4315
aS"It truly is sad when an opponent is friendlier than an ally, Mega. At least Ian responded in a friendly way, and me and him don't even agree on this issue."
p4316
aS"Archie, you're not one of those Westboro Baptist Chuch types, are you? You don't buy that stuff about 'God Hates the ### Army' and 'God hates America' do you?"
p4317
aS"Oh thats not politically kerect and secially wif the chosen one doing the world apology toure I don't see that going down.   Well lay a few on us sin baby. Give us the deal."
p4318
aS'I guess they could if they knew where all the parts were located. Oh, I would think they would be in hell. I can\'t imagine "God" would have anything to do with mass murderers; do you?   BTW, this is Osama\'s technical guide for the terrorists.   http://www.almostaproverb.com/images4/osama_dummies.jpg'
p4319
aS"So let's just kill them and be done with it. Is that what you're saying?"
p4320
aS'And what does he mean by that? You apparently don\'t have a clue. Tell me, do you have any idea what "secondary cause" is?'
p4321
aS"Aw declare victory and slither off eh. I made an assertof fact that was backed up. You made a strawman of abandonment. No one made that claim but you. They come here because they don't get the proceedure in a timely manner. Get it now? Hence you lose as usual."
p4322
aS'Actually, isn\'t it creationists who claim that the universe was created from nothing? Creationists even have a magazine formally called "Ex Nihilo" (changed to "Creation" because creationists didn\'t know what it meant.)'
p4323
aS'So you carry grenades and 75 pounds of gear, all while wearing camouflage fatigues and can call in an airstrike bombing?'
p4324
aS"Where are those organizations with such scientific rigor? If they truly do exist, they must be in the position to understand the God of the Gaps they're worshipping has become microscopic."
p4325
aS"I don't care for the respect of utter nincompoops. I'm happy to tolerate them, but don't expect me not to laugh at them."
p4326
aS'Primarily from your side of the aisle in all arguments. You really described yourself a T.'
p4327
aS'So this singularity that appeared out of no were became a greater singularity which took on perfect balance and form?'
p4328
aS'Prove something besides your ignorance? Homo-erectus and Neandertals differ in cranium size, bone size, bone structure, number of bones as well as the length and width of individual bones. I can see why people are laughing at you'
p4329
aS'So you\'re claiming that you "transformed" from part of your mother to a human. So you\'re claiming that you were once almost your mom\'s arm or leg? lol! Biologically, this is simply a farce statement.'
p4330
aS"Here's a novel idea - how about the right gives up the abstinence programmes (scientifically unproven) and improves access to and information on b/c to stop women having UPPs in the first place? Just a thought."
p4331
aS'You should really think about what you say before you say it. I have heard this before and its garbish, I have been around and owned guns my whole life and I have never, not even once, had the thought of getting a gun just because someone ###### me off. I would never use a gun on a person unless that person were a viable threat to my life, such as coming at me with a knife for example.'
p4332
aS'Selective reading huh? Well, there is none so blind as he who will not see.'
p4333
aS'Well with thinking challenged individuals like slimjim floating around it is no wonder we have a rogue agency with no oversight attacking the honest citizens. See Ruby Ridge and Waco for examples.'
p4334
aS'You know you have outwitted a conservative thinker when they completely dodge the argument you have made.'
p4335
aS'Now you are being insulting. Evolution makes no statments about your god. For that matter, neither does cosmology, astronomy, chemistry, physics or geology.'
p4336
aS'Ah yes resort to attack when you have no case - perfect example. Its a marvellous demonstration of projection.'
p4337
aS"So if a jew tells a big nose joke, he's saying that all jews have big noses? This is a joke thread; I posted a joke, get over it."
p4338
aS'And you have just described "creation science." No application of the scientific method. No testing. The conclusions are known before the judicious quoting of scientific authority has even begun. I notice that you use one of those quotes of a scientific authority below. You show that you are what you decry.'
p4339
aS"Functioning? The fetus breathes freely? It cries when it is hungry or uncomfortable? It demands attention? It smiles and coos and is cute to those who behold it?  Wow! Didn't know that fetuses were that active and functional."
p4340
aS'i dont like watching videos. or following steps. isnt there just one thing i could do? you know, like be forgiven or whatever?'
p4341
aS"They can't, if you value science and common sense, however, science and common sense are irrelevent in their world."
p4342
aS"I don't see how you figure that. Are you intoxicated by any chance? I'm not trying to insult you, I'm serious. You're not writing well, and I'm not refering to your point either."
p4343
aS"Ahh but what if all the shirts have only american flags on them. Would it them be a group of patiotic americans and their children? I mean you do tend to see american flag wear, including tee shirts, everywhere. Would it still be considered a protest if all of them had american flag shirts on them.  AHHHH Joe I it hit me of course this is like Ghandis' salt march."
p4344
aS'Thank you for this thoughtful exposition on the historicity of your loving mentor.'
p4345
aS"You jsut don't get it. You act like two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for lunch. You as a hetero get to go and get married to the person of your choice but I do not. What part of that do you not understand. You say this isn't personal and for you this is true but for me the man I love is nothing but a stranger to me in the eyes of the law. How cruel can you be"
p4346
aS"Er . . . how do you know that god hasn't told anyone to kill enmasse (in the last 2000 years)? Does he run all his orders by you?"
p4347
aS"Where? I don't see it. My monkey brain's fine but my eyes aren't what they used to be.  I'm guessing we're through discussing the legality of armed self-defense in Australia given the flurry of OT links?"
p4348
aS'Oh, if we only had the requisite absolute civilian gun bans, sick things like this would never happen! Huh Brady?'
p4349
aS"Maybe you aren't aware, but something that hasn't happend but has a possibility or probability of happening is potential, so the word is accurate to describe it. And since I'm sure Steeeeve (the dictionary worshipper) will step in, here is the definition:  "
p4350
aS"So your biased reading of the Bible coupled with your personal flaws and your misunderstanding of science is the basis of your religiosity? Somehow I don't think that's something you'd really want to brag about..."
p4351
aS'Well then, I guess I must be a turkey-sandwich worshipper! emoticonXAngel'
p4352
aS"But I thought it was the easy gun laws in the U.S. that made Mexico's cities a shooting gallery? Same as L.A. and less than D.C.?   Amid Drug War, Mexico Less Deadly Than Decade Ago"
p4353
aS"Again he was under attack. Listen to yourself. And talk about a parrot?   No one is arguing Saddam was a saint. But he wasn't and threat and he wasn't insane enough to commit sucide. You are too busy being a lemming and being led over the cliff with president Shrub (Molly Irvins -- GW is to small to be a Bush). ;)"
p4354
aS'After Rump Limpballs and his XXXXX followers started calling me a "Feminazi", I was granted a license to call TeaBaggers TeaBaggers.'
p4355
aS'Better still , you pop down to your local army barracks and explain it to thememoticonXClown'
p4356
aS"So? God also says he made you out of dirt and then supernaturally lifting the dirt from the ground into the woman's uterus. Oh well, I suppose it is all beliefs no matter how silly it sounds."
p4357
aS'  well there is an educated answer :) thanks for the feedback'
p4358
aS"That is a completely subjective assessment. Thelmoose and Unkerpaulie were already quick to dissociate themselves from any smugness or self righteousness on this very thread.   It's a schism! I'm filing for their excommunication! emoticonXWow"
p4359
aS'You should watch where you cast stones, kido. Your original post is an example of a straw man...not mine. You should be more careful before operating a gun...you just yourself in the foot. LOL!'
p4360
aS"Damn, had 2 of them on my doorstep yesterday. Why didn't I think of that?"
p4361
aS"You are apparently unwilling to extend your thinking process to the other side of the argument Galileo, and by this I mean, and repeat that it isn't criminals owning hand guns which we defenders of gun rights are fighting for. WE AGREE THAT CRIMINALS SHOULDN'T BE ARMED, and the laws already exist on the books to punish them when convicted criminals are caught with guns. But your solution to disarm all honest citizens in the belief that this will make them unavailable to criminals also is ludicrous to the point of self destructive insanity. It is that premise which we are fighting against through the NRA and other lobbying efforts."
p4362
aS'From the threads I see, you would be banned in 10 posts, and everything deleted. The level of discourse over there intelligence over there makes ER looks semi-intelligent.'
p4363
aS'So the Establishment Clause was included to promote atheism, eh?'
p4364
aS'None... unless she uses abortion as a form of birth control and has them regularly.'
p4365
aS"well, then why are the doctors trying 2 also test the embyonic cells? what's their reason then? we don't know, because the doctors might not want everything that they're doing be on the front page of every newspaper. they have their reasons for their actions, and they just don't want people like you to know about them. or...they already have their reasons published and everything and you're just 2 close-minded 2 take the information in."
p4366
aS"That's right, a broken clock tells the right time twice a day, and gun hating hoplophobes are never right."
p4367
aS"Thanks for contributing absolutely nothing as you make unfounded claims without supporting them with even the slightest proof. But hey, talks cheap; and you've proven you've got plenty of that since showing up here."
p4368
aS'...that is on every single one of his posts? Still going to claim you read other peoples stuff properly?'
p4369
aS"And I suppose you feel it would've been better if she died at the hands of a knife-wielding killer?"
p4370
aS"I know this may seem obvious to most people, but it seems to have escaped the notice of creationists. Birds are tetrapods, as are amphibians, reptiles, and mammals. Birds didn't just grow wings. Wings are adaptions of the front limbs that were covered with feathers. Perhaps you are unaware of the evidence that indicates that maniraptors had feathers, probably for thermoregulation. Saying that there is no mechanism for birds to grow wings when they previously had none is like saying that there is no mechanism for mankind to grow arms when he previously had none. You see, mankind's closest relatives are the two species of chimpanzee - they are quadrupeds."
p4371
aS"Well you'd know fascist wingnuts for sure. Hitting a meeting tonite?"
p4372
aS'Yawn.. you are so obsessed with gay sex. I am not. Enough said.'
p4373
aS'Oh, yea. You are damn right those European socialists are dangerous. Americans might look and see their governments actually doing something USEFUL for the people and think that we should have that here.   I am surprised we have not nuked them yet.'
p4374
aS"WHAT??? Jito, are you saying that motherhood is difficult? emoticonXWow Now that's a shock..."
p4375
aS'Did you even read ythe OP? Did you even read the title?   Pointless distinction? Huh.   I understand what you are saying. I also know you are changing your argument. When it was proven that Sanford did indeed run on family values, you changed your argument. Instead of just owning up and admitting that, you weasel out of it.   '
p4376
aS'You would not celebrate Osama being out of the picture? Maybe not throw a party, but a not even a simple "yippee!"?   Yeah, right. What a load.'
p4377
aS"But there seem to be so darn many of them, everywhere you look among the religious right. Why is that? Can't they go out and recruit people with IQs somewhat above room temperature?"
p4378
aS'You should use the same quote when whining about use of partial quotes, and not introduce different ones. Nozza made a false assertion and was refuted with his own words. You introduce a different false assertion and fail. Epically.'
p4379
aS'Could you avoid your constant use of strawman`s fallacies please?'
p4380
aS'Then you would have to be believe that out of the supposed millions upon millions of people who walked the Earth none of them were pregnant and there were no newborns either. Then again, to be Christian, you also have to believe the world was created in 7 days and their was a Biblical great flood too. The best part about writing a fairytale is that the author gets to make up everything as they go along.'
p4381
aS"Yes, some people are jumping ship, which is a crying shame. STICK TO YOUR GUNS MEN! WE'RE WINNING!"
p4382
aS'Want to know how to make a gay sex liberal mad and whine? Tell him the truth.  Then they get their knickers in a wad and whine for the politically correct policeman.  p.s. Unless Mother Theresa repented she will not have gone to heaven either.'
p4383
aS"Sorry, I was busy looking at your Base21 source, the one where you post your own article. I figured someone had made up an article on it.   Hey, according to PNC=WW3, if I don't like the people who put the information into the State Dept. website, I don't have to believe it. That's according to him."
p4384
aS"But you are the accuser. I've read the Bible and I have studied religion, more than you can imagine. I have also studied biology, performed experiments and reached conclusions. The problem is that you seem unable to think for yourself."
p4385
aS'You say some of us are lying and then you say you apologize "if" we\'re "somehow" offended. Gee, that\'s mighty white of you.'
p4386
aS"You're right it'll be fighting the war in Iraq. )Nah, really it'll be from social security, etc etc."
p4387
aS"Too late. I am a child of the 70's. My mind evaporated decades ago.emoticonXDonno"
p4388
aS'Thats why I say my gayness is His gift and blessing to me. There is nothing more joyous then gay sex.'
p4389
aS'You missed out mean-spirited, which fits like a very well fitting glove.'
p4390
aS"Which ones? Ineffective how?   I'd guess the laws weren't struck down simply because too many people broke them."
p4391
aS'glad to know you bring spelling into this. Shows where you are in the argument. And where did the life saving question come from?'
p4392
aS"I disagree. Well, only in that I think it's high time we held everybody to a higher standard. We should suspend hetero marriage until they clean up their act!"
p4393
aS"Oh gosh, silly, silly me, not blaming an entire group of people for something a few nutjobs did. My, I'm so embarassed for being so intolerant and thinking that! emoticonXBangheademoticonXBanghead  "
p4394
aS"I don't know? How about a person from a group known to do almost anything to get money, but also realises the pain they would bring to a child if they had one."
p4395
aS"You still don't get it do you, Smiley... emoticonXBanghead   If cupcakes were human? It would."
p4396
aS'Every time the KKK burns a cross NRA members are there. So what? Every time they burn a cross Christianity is there.'
p4397
aS'Try the ( Law of Common Sense) . If your an ex-atheist, you already know the ( Law of Relativity ).'
p4398
aS'First off, no one says that if there is evil, there can\'t be a God. They say that if there\'s evil, then God can\'t be omnipotent and all benevolent. Let\'s keep the topics straight. Also, I see no way in which the existence of good bolsters the argument that God exists. I could posit the existence of a God of popcorn, and then say "look, here\'s some popcorn, my God must be real!" Somehow, I don\'t think that would convince you.'
p4399
aS"Lotsa gay animals out there, man. Wonder what Jaaaman's sources are. He seems very perturbed by homosexuality."
p4400
aS"Good observation! He is very good at presenting fellatious viewpoints and lack of knowledge and content. He is one of the more fellatious people I know and you won't find him taking notice of the Constitution as the Supreme Law of the Land either."
p4401
aS'You can take a horse to water. I provided evidence to support my assertion. You provided ............ "Oh no it isn\'t!"'
p4402
aS'probably because this is an abortion forum and not a forum about the Iraq War..not only that, there is no parallel.'
p4403
aS'So you evolved and the aryan race was created by God? I have never heard that before.'
p4404
aS"I'm not interested in who isn't hitting on you. Do you want an ugly, flaming, gay cellulite blubber-wench hitting on you for three years or not??? Or maybe a pod of those whales all hitting on you??  For the record, gays make normal men's skin crawl, and not in a good way. So keep the spiritually-challenged heathens out of the men's barracks, and out of their showers. Just because you and the rest of the pro-gay crowd thinks that kind of depraved activity is ok doesn't mean the rest of society does."
p4405
aS"Of course you don't. It's the natural humanistic way of thinking."
p4406
aS'Jyoshu, stop drinking the Kool-Aid before your brain is totally fried.'
p4407
aS'So taking peoples rights away is an american value? I think I will push for legislation to make cancer surgery illegal. After all cancer cells are human life too and with modern medical tech they could become a human being also.'
p4408
aS'Will the Catholics ever elect somebody who is not a complete knob? He speaks just like he knows something about gay relationships. emoticonXRolleyes'
p4409
aS'You never bought something you liked? You never went somewhere with someone you liked or went to meet them?   '
p4410
aS"It is supported, I have shown that it is true. Your only argument is to claim that organisations that perpetrate genocide don't agree that it is genocide. Wow what an argument you have.  "
p4411
aS"Oh, oh, and don't forget to include the proposed Federal Kosher Amendment's text, which just coincidentally matches the Levitical proscriptions, in your argument that things like the FMA have nothing to do with separation of church and state."
p4412
aS'And here it is, corrected to remove that little hint of sensationalism that you feel is needed to drum up support for your cause.'
p4413
aS'Only in the mind of a secular humanist atheist would it make sense. emoticonXGood'
p4414
aS"What, you mean like this story (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3136266.stm) of scientists warning about ocian acidity levels from 2003? Global warming is old news too: it doesn't seem to have reached the more remote parts of the world though, like North America for example."
p4415
aS'So if I go out and buy a Brand X car and then regret it a year later, does that mean that nobody should be allowed to go out and buy a Brand X car? Am I entitled to have an opinion and share it with others...sure. However, could others purchase a Brand X car and never regret it...absolutely. Should my negative experience be used to prevent others from engaging in something that they might consider positive? Sounds kinda fascist to me.'
p4416
aS'Turned?  What do you mean turned?  (Oh man! Got you one more time! Brutal! lol)'
p4417
aS'As compared to "Truth" (capital T). Yes, creationist theocrats have this tendency to portray their subjective beliefs as truth, their wishful thinking as facts. No surprise there.  '
p4418
aS"This remark would be funny if you didn't actually mean it...."
p4419
aS"Based on what besides your own immediate knee-jerk denials?  You're always in the tank for the Bible bashers."
p4420
aS'Abortion is not immoral? End of story? Simone, are you trying to impose your own personal moral code upon me? Well I never....'
p4421
aS'pay attention to what ? to the voices in your head ?   your age is irrelevant to your recognized lack of intelligence, but being a minor would be relevant since it would excuse your ignorance.  My advice to you ?  keep all your life pretending in forums that you are just a kindergarten kid and therefore people would think that for a 4 year old kid you are not too dumb and of course knowing nothing is understandable.'
p4422
aS'I truly mourn for you cookie. I pity the emptiness and shallowness of your soul. emoticonXCry'
p4423
aS"Brave words. Next they'll be limiting free speech. Oh wait. Done that already.  "
p4424
aS'Indeed true. God created man in his own likeness and man returned the favor. Man created a vindictive, vengeful, and vicious god, according to the Bible. So where does a loving god come from?'
p4425
aS'Right. Catholics say prayers to a woman that they hate. Next!'
p4426
aS"ROFL you don't even believe that given the democrat party's known escapades. I do hope you haven't stroked out due to the Brown victory. Let the games begin!"
p4427
aS"You really don't get it. The best thing about a free market is when someone acts like a fool they get burned. Thanks to government intervention and regulation when someone acts like a fool they get bailed out.   If you like we can have the trains run like Amtrak."
p4428
aS"Oh no an open minded church that doesn't hate? GASP! And sorry but the bible has many interpretations as is clearly seen in the WIDE and VAST amount of differing denominations. Just because their not closes binded right wing bigots doesn't mean you can grill them cause their interpretation is different..."
p4429
aS'Just out of interest, which particular aspect of "truth" are you getting at here?'
p4430
aS"Ah yes, the 'Let's pull a smug and self serving quote out of context from the bible and use it as in insult, therefore god exist' routine. That arrogant method of using self congratulatory bible quotes to insult and denigrate your opponent is neither an effective debate technique, or does it help convince those people on the boarder line to convert to Christianity. It does drive them away, so please, be my guest and keep on trying to use it. I figure the ratio of people you drove away from Christianity to those people who were converted to Christianity from you must be way lop sided."
p4431
aS'Interesting.... have you ever been to a schoolyard recently? I think the "taunts" are more directed at gays. Like "f@ggot" and "fairy". What taunts do you get on a daily basis? What... being called out on your negativity towards the rights of a minority? boo hoo.'
p4432
aS"But that is how creationism works - half truth. Evolution is a theory but don't make it quite clear that in science the word theory doesn't mean half-assed guess, as it does in creationism. Check out that little piece of **** that was added to the bottom of the Patterns of Cumulative Change paragraph on page 7. That is pure YEC. And you aren't a YEC?"
p4433
aS"I think we're seeing a culture war. Hardly seems a fair fight though, since only one side has any.:p"
p4434
aS"You'd have to drown a few puppies too. Kittens might do, but you might fall a little short."
p4435
aS"I believe we have a human responsibility to one another. That we are our brother's keeper. Tell me, Bassman, if there aren't enough jobs, and the costs of medical care are skyrocketing through the roof, what do you suggest your fellow Americans do? Just drop dead?"
p4436
aS'Oh boy,,.. I got ignored with a potty remark. Why is that not surprising?'
p4437
aS'Why do "they" want it to be true? Some "gay" science agenda?'
p4438
aS'Seems all the drills would broadcast when they had a leftie. Just could wait for that case of M-1 thumb or the hot one down the shirt.'
p4439
aS'So, you have no problem with the fact that this is abortion and was caused by god?'
p4440
aS"Well, you're writing from an embryo's point of view, when an embryo doesn't even have a point of view. It would be like writing from a rock's point of view."
p4441
aS"I didn't know that doctors have the constitutional right to perform abortions. What provision in the Constitution guarantees that right?"
p4442
aS'Well that lets out most of the supreme court when RvW comes up! And of course 1/2 give or take of the voters would be disqualified if relevant issues come up to a vote. Perhaps we should start an effort to amend the constitution to incorporate your idea!'
p4443
aS'I see you missed the entire point of my post. Good job on analyzing the sarcastic opening though.'
p4444
aS"Wow! ...... If your interpretation were correct, there would be a connection between his post and the USSR! But it's not, and there isn't."
p4445
aS"Oh, I see. So America does not care for the rights of the people? America cares only for the opinion of the majority? Hrm, that's funny. I fail to remember learning that part in all my US history classes. When did the founding fathers say that? Where in the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence, or the Bill of Rights might I find such a notion?  'Rouge"
p4446
aS"Is there some sort of a symbolic potent phallic aspect to holding a gun in one's hand? Is Sarah Palin being a manly sort when she shoots a wolf from a helicopter?"
p4447
aS"What does spelling have to do with your own opinion? Again this isn't just about you although I think you did resort to correcting someone's spelling and just didn't answer the question. This has nothing to do with being entitled to your own opinion. It is equally bad for anyone to resort to personal attacks on either side of the debate."
p4448
aS'So then how do you know that abortion isn\'t in the plan then? If as you say we have "VERY LIMITED PERSPECTIVE"'
p4449
aS'since when has religion been pragmatic or based upon systems that works?  Obvious answer: never.'
p4450
aS'A nameless face to the feds? In this era of paranoia and fear and overgrown governments? As if any of us are private and unknown individuals anymore.'
p4451
aS'The poor in the US certainly seem to eat more than the rich in most countries.'
p4452
aS"Hey Jitobaby - if you're that insecure with your beliefs that you have to throw this kind of a snit when people are making a case contrary to your failed radical liberalism, then maybe you need to watch Michael Moore on TV instead of reading my posts."
p4453
aS"Now you've ruined it! You're not supposed to mention god. That's the whole idea. ID is stealth creationism. XXXXXX pretend that there is some scientific basis for the assertion that there is some sort of magical designer that is responsible for everything, but they don't say it's god. If they did that, then ID would be religion and introducing it into schools would be unconstitutional."
p4454
aS"Just because you fail to realize what the article says doesn't make what you said true. Since you seem to like logical fallacies can you reconginze which one you just committed?"
p4455
aS'So your claim that no pre-existing belief is necessary is untested by you. Do you have an example of an actual non-believer having a religious experience that made a believer of them? In my experience God never appears to atheists. Funny that.'
p4456
aS'So atheists are capable of goodness, love, kindness, generosity and sympathy but they have no meaning unless one conforms the the fundamentalist christian morality.'
p4457
aS"Crouching Libertarian, Hidden cost. Can't pay extra expenditures get's ya penalized! No special education requirements (they are't unders state or federal control!) No requirement to moniter student progress...that seems safe."
p4458
aS"Yes...I think I would agree with you. That's what happens when you have superstition coupled with self-imposed ignorance I suppose. It's a shame!"
p4459
aS"Please tell me, why did you believe your pastor, but not me? What did he say that was so convincing? And please, PLEASE, tell me what you think the Bible might not be saying that could have any bearing on this in the slightest. How can the fact that we don't know Ehosh's second cousin twice removed have any bearing on this at all, or whatever you think the Bible wasn't saying?  "
p4460
aS'I was hoping that talking in Old English would help him understand.'
p4461
aS'Where, exactly, did the article say that bacteria exhibit intelligence????'
p4462
aS"Right on! The Obama administration is a colossal financial disaster. If he doesn't have another trillion dollars to XXXX he can't do anything. Tax and spend - that's all those liberal turkeys know how to do."
p4463
aS"Compared to what? The U.S.? That would be laughable if it wasn't so serious, it is plain ridiculous. The CDC and NAS studies Tither has posted so many times still hasn't sunk it has it? There is no benefit to any gun control law that has been studied! Now here you are ignoring and contradicting scientific facts...again. Take Chicago, they have strict gun laws and have over 3 times the national rate of murders."
p4464
aS"You mean you've spent your good, hard-earned money on his revisionist follies? ROTFLOL!! You could have had a six pack to really make your day."
p4465
aS"Why does they admin let EZ post comments like this to other people, if he can't be vicl and debate like an adult to others, why is he here......to spread god's love ...right?"
p4466
aS'Just which god might that be? Yahweh? Krishna? he Great Spirit? Allah?  Please specify.'
p4467
aS'Looks like dancing in the blood of innocents to me.'
p4468
aS'Oh I understand plenty. What you want is a system where a person is held responsible for crimes that they didn\'t commit. You want "guilty by association" extended to the point of ridiculousness where anybody who even met the criminal even once can be held as an accomplice.'
p4469
aS"Uhhhh, I just said that I DO JUDGE! So what in the hell are you talking about? You're not well. I didn't bother to adress your points about slavery because there's no point. I disagree with your claims as I suspect would most historians. But it doesn't surprise me that Christians would try to claim that they ended slavery since they also try to falsely claim they founded the country."
p4470
aS"All science is provisional. For absolutes, we look to your interpretation of your bible. That's always absolute and beyond any correction.  "
p4471
aS"I can understand your disappointment. Its very difficult to cure someone of chronic religious delusions. No easy way to relieve the suffering of the victim. But if you really work hard at it for another decade or so you may recover yet. Best of luck and don't fall for the quacks peddling quick cures."
p4472
aS"Oh look, Gansao the blowhard is still living in his world of ignorance and denial... like his daddy Ezridden.   You couldn't educate a rock ya stupid bastard.emoticonXBye"
p4473
aS'I guess since he said so it must be true... poor daewoo, just remember only whiners point out logic fallacies like ad hominem and argument by dismissal.'
p4474
aS'Are you sure? VOR is a 14 year old kid from Florida. His IP is squarely from a ISP from Florida. If he is retired, he is the first person I have ever heard who was 60+ that used slang normally reserved for street gangs. Not to mention that his war stories place him in two different seas at the same time. Somehow 2 tours turned into 4, midlevel ship officer turned into high ranking military advisor.   All in all, VOR is far more of a liability to any of his allies because of his lying, lack of education and reading comphrension problems.'
p4475
aS'I have. Yet I can`t seem to be able to do the creative math that will show that europe will become pre-dominatly muslim in any near future.  '
p4476
aS"Evidence? We're talking religion here. Religion. If there were evidence, then it would be science."
p4477
aS'But religion is not a topic for science classes. Teach the science in class and if that presents a problem for your religion at home, perhaps you should think about your religion a bit more critically and realistically. What is being attempted is to cast doubt on well established scientific theory and pretend that magic is a viable alternative.'
p4478
aS'Perhaps then the problem is a shortage of fiber in you diet?'
p4479
aS'Our pumping of CO2 is certaintly not helping. Does that mean we should pump gasses and make people in big cities sneeze?'
p4480
aS'I could have labeled my post "TRAP" and you wouldn\'t notice. Tell me, are these two contradictory:  '
p4481
aS"If truth makes you uncomfortable, feel free not to respond to me. I will continue to point out hypocrisy , and bigotry. I'll mock anybody who says 'slavery wasn't all that bad' either."
p4482
aS'Yes, I will mark that on my calendar for future reference.....get help man....really...you need it.'
p4483
aS"Seriously, in part is Waxy saying, I was here first? (It's my forum, I'll whine if I want to.)"
p4484
aS'I also took a look and think your evaluation is charitable.'
p4485
aS"Actually they apologised because it's a bit of a fad amongst the limp-wristed politicians at the moment. And anyway, the blood is fairly even on both sides."
p4486
aS'Ah yes, the ever popular 3rd grade "they started it" response. Didn\'t jesus say to turn the other cheek?'
p4487
aS'Care to post some proof or should everyone just believe it because you say it?..'
p4488
aS'You show me the post where I said I thought terrorists killing children was a good idea and I will eat my keyboard.'
p4489
aS"But if this was a republican program, you'd have no problem with it. You are a rightwing hypocrite, Archie Baby."
p4490
aS"And you know what I think? I think that everyone who doesn't have sex 24 hours a day 7 days a week is denying human beings life every second. I'm sure some of those sperm would love to have the chance to breathe the air that you are breathing in vain because you don't think they should live [/sarcasm]. Why don't you think this? Why embryos? Embryos are the one thing that have great potential to cause harm in a woman, and you just so happen to choose them as human beings. Very suspicious..."
p4491
aS'True they should have passed raincoats and knee boots to protect peoples clothes from the XXXX that the president was spewing out.'
p4492
aS'This, coming from an atheist. How consistently shallow of you. emoticonXRolleyes'
p4493
aS"yea, I often forget ToE is a mental concept, not a scientific one. Nothing -- and I mean nothing -- will ever dismantle it in the minds of the faithful. Materialism is so entrenched in your mind that even if an animal generates a new piece of morphology by mere thought, sensation or awareness, and then passes that trait down to progeny, (which has been shown on here) you still think materialism stands. It's an unfalsifiable mindset that you and millions of others have created for yourselves."
p4494
aS'Well it depends he could always be a sperm donor or make some Lesbian couple happy :)'
p4495
aS'No, I for one dislike your posts because I know you intentionally write irrational posts to help support your religious cause.   Just for the record montalban, basically every single legitimate scientist is "pro-evolution". Creation theory is not taught in public schools, not by chance, but because...*gasp* it\'s RELIGIOUS MUMBO JUMBO. There is no evidence to support it. Creation fiction has made no progress with it\'s "faith-based" (lackofevidence) with rational people.   And I\'ll also say that I\'d welcome ad hominem over irrational thinking any day. Ad hominem is just a lack of patience, or someone who doesn\'t care to hide their emotion or opinion. Irrational thinking on the other hand is often only cured by death. Someone guilty of ad hominem can still hold a rational debate. The irrational..well, why bother?   -Mach'
p4496
aS"How about other religious theories. What about teaching about the sun god? I don't mean that they believed that, but teach it as a choice because everyone deserves the right to choose in what they believe. Actually let's also teach how the theory of gravity could be wrong and people can choose to believe that invisible fairys pull people down towards the Earth and other massive objects. We should teach the theory of gravity also but we need to give them the choice on what to believe.  "
p4497
aS"Excuse me, I stand corrected. For 'pretend' please substitute 'wrongly believe'."
p4498
aS"No surprise there. You would have to invest some thought to define something. Why don't you just consult your Little Golden Dictionary?"
p4499
aS"Actually, I don't sneer at you. I laugh at you. And I don't attack your intelligence but your knowledge. You are intentionally ignorant."
p4500
aS"That sort of warms the cockles of my heart. Namely that some Europeans might be disinclined to visit or stay here. Don't let the door hit you in the buttocks on the way out."
p4501
aS"So the BBC folks are frauds and liars? You really are an idiot aren't you? Piltdown Bird is a colorful way of saying it was a Piltdown like fraud.   National Geographic knew it was a fake and published the article anyway.  Of course you probably still believe in the original Piltdown don't you?  You probably believe the Nebraska Man and Haeckels speechless apes were real too.  There is an echo when you think isn't there?"
p4502
aS'Cool I want to be free of the regulation that I wash my hands before preparing other peoples food. After all it should be my choice to wash my hands after going to the restroom and I should be able to make that choice without restraint. In your world there are no courts, police, or governments to hold me accountable for killing someone or giving them hepatitis.'
p4503
aS'Well bravo for you - they must not be all that good considering. Or did you simply learn to be deceptive yourself and confuse that with deception by others? Who can say?'
p4504
aS'your "minds"? How many do you have? Oh, and "I wanted to see what inferior it was"? Nice example of your supposed superiority.'
p4505
aS"I'm glad that you're the one living in fear of becoming a criminal for defending your family and not me."
p4506
aS"I have an entire New Testament. You've got what - a mouthful of denial? When you get to the level of the NT works let us know."
p4507
aS"And you tell people not to call you a gay basher? LOLemoticonXRolleyes emoticonXRolleyes emoticonXCensored   I know very well what faux means - that is the reason it is bashing to call someone's marriage that."
p4508
aS"I won't hold my breath awaiting a retraction of this piece of balderdash you've composed. Guess we'll chalk it up to puffery."
p4509
aS'You see, that\'s the problem: "generally". You obviously know little or nothing of how prejudice works in this country.'
p4510
aS'Well, at least you are more consistent about equality than a lot of people in your movement.   '
p4511
aS"I know that. Evolution releases itself from its foundation at will. When it wants to speculate about things like abiogenesis and claim it to be science, it allows itself to do that. It's that interchangeability thing you spoke of above."
p4512
aS'And yet after investigating for over a year, our inspectors agree with me, not you. Hmmm.'
p4513
aS'All sin undermines society, including illicit gay sex sin. Or have you forgotten Sodom and Gomorrah? Coming to a San Francisco bath house near you.'
p4514
aS"If you don't get all 10 according to landover you are not a true christian."
p4515
aS'Sorrowfully, you are so right. That\'s exactly why we have all "suffered" for 8 long years. Sheer. . . . .no I refuse to write it!! :)'
p4516
aS'I\'m actually in the Detroit Subs with one kid in a Blue Ribbon High School and two in college nearby. And yes, the mayor\'s got the bling goin on in his wife\'s city-leased Escalade. I\'m not sure if it has "dubs" on it or not, though, but I bet the stereo\'s kickin\'. :)'
p4517
aS'HELLO!! THAT\'S WHY!! Then we see the standard dance of how innocent and objective science really is.   6) And the standard "theistic evolution" dance. Atheistic evolutionists can\'t get along without it! I wonder if Kenneth Miller will see the movie, and comment on it. I wonder if he\'d have refused to be a part of it.'
p4518
aS"So what you are saying is that the actual purpose of prison is to be raped in the shower by some 400 pound guy called Betty? Or brutalised by a guard with an inferiority complex...and these don't strike you as cruel and unusual?"
p4519
aS"Isn't the point pretty obvious- that exposure to a gun can raise testosterone levels and trigger violent and aggressive thoughts and actions?"
p4520
aS'Yea they get over it in a year or two. Haaa Haaa'
p4521
aS'So you yourself could have gone gay but chose to be attracted to women?'
p4522
aS'Spain, unlike most modern democracies, very very recently had the uh.. privilege of living under a strong, "moral" government that supported the uh.. "family values" so important to the right.   That they are running like hell away from it should tell people something.'
p4523
aS'So now name calling and accusations as to my mental health are what you concider as rational thought?   I expect that you must be some sort of expert on warfare, in paticular this war? Am I to believe that you are a soldier there now?   Your rage towards me in your post only shows just how easily upset you are. I posted exactly what I meant to and you went off on a tangent. I asked you for proof and all you can do is a schoolyard tactic if "show me yours before I show mine?" Pitiful.'
p4524
aS"Oh, sorry, I didn't think that was a serious answer. Thanks."
p4525
aS'Hehehe. Sounds like an American in a big SUV looking at $4/gallon gasoline with a maxed out credit card listening to fundamentalist talk radio.'
p4526
aS'Cute. And I can come up with about 5,000 to 7,000 examples that do have a bright orange muzzle.'
p4527
aS"Oh...come on Steeeeve...you know Bush is actually making it worse. After all, it is happening on Obama's watch, and we have got to have someone to blame. Bush was the president...let's just blame him. emoticonXRolleyes"
p4528
aS"Judicial activism? What brand of stupid is it that you use? What judicial activism do you see here; the judge stating that open carry is legal and has been, and that you can't be arrested when you haven't committed a crime? Or that the police can be sued for damages when they choose to break the law to persecute an innocent bystander?"
p4529
aS'So you\'re saying that God is a "respector"?-of-persons - iow, the mom\'s "more"-important to *God*? than the unborn.'
p4530
aS'I\'m one of those cruel heartless bastards that thinks the Constitution doesn\'t apply to terrorists. Break out the cattle prods and "LET\'T PARTY" emoticonXRolleyes'
p4531
aS'And the funeral dirge of the Left and comparisons to Nazi Germany and/or the collapse of the Roman Empire will begin in 3....2.....'
p4532
aS"Losing again I see. Don't change the subject. How are supporting 'gay sex debauchery' and lying in any way synonymous?  You have made the accusation. Back it up.  If different words are too much for your miniscule brain to cope with, I suggest you try yelling your hogwash on a street corner, where less people will be able to see how much of a fool you are."
p4533
aS"I'd be pretty dumb to buy something from someone who doesn't even believe in what they're selling. Those teachers may teach it, but they don't believe in it."
p4534
aS'No. Not only are you wrong, you seem to lack the integrity to learn the basics of what you claim to oppose. You oppose evolution you say, but you have no idea of what it is. Most educated creationists not only admit evolution, they propose evolution at rates that make real biologists laugh.'
p4535
aS"When I want the opinion of a spiritually-dead nincompoop I'll call you."
p4536
aS"So, it's a proven fact that children denied the act of abortion suffer negative effects? Hmmmmmm"
p4537
aS'But you sure don\'t hesitate to portray them that way when you use one to bolster the other! Or when you fail to actually (GASP) qualify the matter by noting the differences as well as the similarities. Hey, it\'s just accuracy, so why get in a fuss over it, huh? emoticonXRolleyes Why not go ahead and invoke the Jewish genocide while you\'re at it, or call anyone who has a different opinion "Hitler?" I mean it\'s the same sort of generalization.  '
p4538
aS"Neat my very own living spell check I can't wait to see well it works."
p4539
aS'Here is yet another example of Duo holding other people\'s arguments to a higher standard than he holds his own. Duo, you said "Second, no one call actually tell the age of anyone here. To declare such when the verifiability that the claim depends on does not exist is sheer insanity." Are you right? Anyone claiming to know age on these boards without evidence is insanity? Duo, if you are right, you are calling yourself insane. That\'s not going to help you out on the credibility meter. Perhaps you might want to amend some of you posts?'
p4540
aS'So, I\'m wondering, did you neglect to note the reason because you "forgot" or because it would weaken your statement and its connotation that we really didn\'t want him that badly? emoticonXConfused   '
p4541
aS"There you go. It's difficult to find which side of your mouth to talk out of when the facts are the facts!"
p4542
aS'And there you have the "***** Eye for the Straight Guy" review of the inauguration. :p   Never mind the expense, the protests, the rather scary IMHO precendent Bush has set in terms of the inauguration, let alone his foreign policy, let\'s talk about Laura Bush\'s outfit. emoticonXRolleyes   Waxy'
p4543
aS"It is impossible to read something that can't be found."
p4544
aS'Well Duh!   The answer has ALWAYS BEEN Drugs, and Drug Traffickers. Concentrate on them and you have the answer to the problems!'
p4545
aS'How uninteresting must that be for you to intentionally spend time annoying people on the internet?'
p4546
aS'NO, gun registration should not be mandatory anywhere in the US. The government has no business knowing who has a gun. Gun registration could possibly allow the government to infringe on constitutional guarantees provided by the Bill Of Rights. Just knowing that there are many Senators and Congressmen who would like to abolish gun rights gives credence to the fact that government could actually try to limit or ban the 2nd Amendment in the future.   P.S. Crazy is as Crazy says. Scary to think that some would believe that a registered gun that becomes a stolen gun would help in finding the thief or killer if that same criminal gets rid of the gun. Which, if later found, would then be traced back to the legitimate owner, who may not even know the gun had been stolen. The alibi better be outstanding!'
p4547
aS"Dear smiling, friendly, forgiving Archangel:  I would be quite happy to respond to you if you could organize your incoherent mental states into logical, debatable points. Please refer to Chester's Questions for Bible-thumpers for guidelines.  As for staying on topic: since there is no God, it is rather pointless to have religious ceremonies in any case, isn't it?  As for my nom de Web, you have missed the point altogether. Either you are not quick on the uptake and/or you are completely ignorant of the Japanese language. Hint: surely you have seen the starry emblem on all Subaru cars?  To end on a conciliatory note: I entirely agree with the last sentence of your posting [except the punctuation].  -"
p4548
aS'If you had a look at all of the other threads on this topic you would see that.'
p4549
aS'3101 posts! what a waste of cyber real estate! at least you are brief.'
p4550
aS"78.4 years? Well excuse me but I intend to live much longer than that. I was thinking about 112.7 years. Yeah. That's about right."
p4551
aS'Again, key word "genetic". My hair has the genetic characteristics of a human, but that doesn\'t make getting a haircut murder does it?  '
p4552
aS"Looks like someone couldn't grip with the fact that he was a closest racist. emoticonXCry"
p4553
aS"And you offer none for your's. Heteros engage is risky business as well. Therefore on the same grounds we ban straight marriage.   It's not just STD's, it's all sorts of physical issues as well. Cancers, hepatitus, bacterial infections, that result from anal and vagina sex. Add one word and BAM, it works aganist you."
p4554
aS'You have conviced no one or even come remotely to forming an argument.'
p4555
aS"So you're a perfect clone of one your parents with zero copying errors? Amazing."
p4556
aS'what other forest? By your logic there would only be one left in the entire world, and it would be what, the size on central park?'
p4557
aS"That's ok, cause it's completely legal to light up a cigarette while driving. I guess some feel that must be a lot safer than using a phone.  "
p4558
aS"Ahh Good old (and I mean OLD) Ronnie. This man doesn't know XXXX about foreign policy."
p4559
aS'  Me thinks thou dost be too kind. Yon creature willst make the false charge in any event. emoticonXKill'
p4560
aS"Thanks for what? Pointing out that you have once again misread an article? No problem, I'll be sure to keep up the effort seeing as how you apprecitate so much. emoticonXGood"
p4561
aS'Oh Blah! Blah! Blah!  What the devil do Comanches know?  The sisterhood and brotherhood of Sioux, Navajo, Iroquois and other sundry tribes.'
p4562
aS'You know, its those happy-smiley cartoons that really freak me out. Is this just me or does anyone else find them creepy?'
p4563
aS'Oh? And what is the specific amount of pot you have to smoke before you become a drug crazed fiend?'
p4564
aS"It's a lot easier to kill someone with a gun than a cigarette or a beer."
p4565
aS"And we have an emotional post with no substance whatsoever. I'm sure your twin will be checking in soon. I think I'll keep a count of this type of post."
p4566
aS"What's that? Campaigning and use of taxpayer funded facilities like transportation for political purposes? I suppose they paid the cops for going out of their jurisdiction too?"
p4567
aS'You can try and deny the facts all you like. Here they are from the CDC for 2003, go spin them.'
p4568
aS'And of course, the theory of gravity isn\'t "physically" proven either. Neither is the heliocentric theory or atomic theory or the germ theory of disease. However, evolution has been observed to occur and the current theories are the best explanations that we have for the observations. As far as your mangling of the "Out of Africa" theory, it would be nice if you actually learned what you are talking about before you babble such nonsense.'
p4569
aS"so your saying he was 200% god-man? i'm not a mathematician but that can't be right surley."
p4570
aS"Sorry but I don't read your posts, do you think I worship your word or something?  "
p4571
aS"No, I have no idea. He didn't build the Bush Library as Marc Rich did to get a pardon from Clinton, did he?   "
p4572
aS'How can they visually express themselves without their right to expression, besides funky hairdoos.  '
p4573
aS'Says the man who wants to criminalize being a victim of a crime. :)'
p4574
aS"Now settle down charlie, and try to think rationally, just for a second. Have you ever heard of a tumor growing into a sentient life form as a fetus does? I'd appreciate a link documenting such an occurrence so we pro-lifers can start planning save the tumor rally's."
p4575
aS"And I was correcting you. If you are offended then that's the breaks."
p4576
aS'So your answer to the question then is "Nothing", Marc?'
p4577
aS"PROJECTION, again.... I'm amazed you can't recognise the amount you do it...."
p4578
aS'So did you read his mind to determine exactly why he bolded that particular set of words? You are the first mind reader I have encountered here. And considering your disdain and rejection of science from cosmology to biology what does it matter if something is terrible science. According to you all science should be terrible. Why do you attempt to use a tool which you reject as being useful?'
p4579
aS'The tooth fairy has a different function than the Easter bunny.'
p4580
aS"It wasn't meant as an insult...just a statement of fact. I likely have as many or more inadequacies than do you."
p4581
aS"Simone baby I'll see your Sanford and raise you a Mark Spitzer, John Edwards, Jim McGreevey and of course the king of sleeze der slickmeister Willie."
p4582
aS'Yippie doo! A 23 year old quote from an ornithologist defending his point of view. And his point of view has (or had) merit. But since then, several feathered dinosaurs (not birds) have been found. It has also been shown that the difference between a scale and a feather may be no more than a single point mutation. (You do know what I\'m talking about, don\'t you Calli? You do know what a "point mutation" is, don\'t you?) Bottom line is that there may be no intermediate between scales and feathers. A single point mutation produces feathers from scales. Various kinds of feathers require only further mutation.'
p4583
aS'Not true. I googled "helpful mutation" and got a nice list of examples. I wish creationists would do some research before making wild assertions.'
p4584
aS'Your god sees no degree of sins. Shaving your beard, baby-rape, etc, are all punishable by death. That is, unless you repent. emoticonXBanghead'
p4585
aS"I suspected as much, well part of my job then is to ignore and make snide comments to people who don't come to debate :)  "
p4586
aS'Now name one country with universal socialized healthcare with a population of 300 million citizens modulus, just one if you can. Your exemplar countries are tiny in comparison to us so lets get realistic and compare apples to apples for once, ok?'
p4587
aS'So, a forty year old having sex with a twelve year old is ok then?'
p4588
aS'Thank You. You know how much I love to impress people.'
p4589
aS"This is often called: 'talking out of both sides of your mouth'"
p4590
aS'Tell us Brady, does the information that While Males ratified the 13th and 14th put a twist in your knickers? emoticonXSmilie'
p4591
aS'Sounds like my 9mil. is more secure under my bed in hands reach.'
p4592
aS'What is your theory about the foot fetish gene ?'
p4593
aS"Well that's fine because I don't really listen to lunatics insult me too much either...  "
p4594
aS"If I thought you'd understand in the least bit why it's important to scrutinize possible occupants of the White House, I'd explain how I feel about. However, you are a hopeless case."
p4595
aS'Half of the country is stupid enough to think that four (or eight) more years of Dumbya would be good.'
p4596
aS'No, but they will be forced to have babies if they have sex.'
p4597
aS"To summarize, since penfolds reasoning has been shown to be both ignorant and short sighted, his only recourse is to offer a trollish quip before skulking away like the irrational philosophical coward that he is. At least you're consistent penfold. emoticonXRolleyes"
p4598
aS'See, a terrorist attack is probably the sort of thing I would use as an excuse to not go to work...'
p4599
aS'do you go to study hall? probably not. It is a requirement where the athletes sign in and sit in the library with their teams and are monitored to make sure that their studying is getting done.'
p4600
aS"Well I am polishing my grave dancing shoes as these people in their 70's can not live forever."
p4601
aS"what about God? So many God-fearing people, he must be a terrorist :)  seriously I really don't know much about terrorists. I know that Bin Laden was behind 9/11 but he wasn't the only one, but that's about it."
p4602
aS'Are you like a Chinese government official or something? Oh wait. I forgot, the Chinese government controls what you say anyway, so I guess it matters not.'
p4603
aS"So you are truthful, but I am a liar. Just like you are clever, but I am stupid. You have no respect for me, WW; I've never seen you demonstrate respect for anyone."
p4604
aS"So they haven't gone into bankruptsy yet? I guess the illegal loans are helping after all. emoticonXRolleyes"
p4605
aS"Actually in terms of populations we're the same people as the Irish. If you want tyranny try the oppression of the Native Americans. Did you know that the Natives and the blacks were both on the British side during the War of Independence? Amazing how we tyrants command such free support huh...."
p4606
aS'No, you can go on the public dole and have the rest of us hard-working Americans wipe your arse for you or you can buy your own or be fined for not doing so.  '
p4607
aS"So if it's not human, we can kill it? But I dare say that's a different topic completely. Sorry, that was more along animal rights than abortion. Abortion is this for me: If the baby is going to endanger the mother's life as well as the baby, why endanger the baby and the mother? Sticking on the decided path, would you rather kill something you know is human, or something that you're not sure is human. It sounds a bit cruel and I didn't intend it to be that way at all. It's just that one loss would hard enough, why make it two?"
p4608
aS"It's ironic that you should talk about lack of evidence. At least we have a source to believe."
p4609
aS'Why would I worry about a book of myths and fairy tales?'
p4610
aS'Amusing coming from someone who falsely claimed another user misused the term "light year."   If I am so ignorant, explain how your argument does not require exactly what I said: That God operated the named light sources on a very different set of physical laws and removed all evidence of their existence to meld them with the current set of physical laws that we know do not support young Earth Creationism.   I\'m betting you don\'t even understand your original argument. Prove me wrong. Explain how it does not result in God being a liar.   '
p4611
aS"Gee right on schedule here's the other half of the comic relief. Get a job and a life and off the dole. PS I think mum would be happy to see you out of her basement too."
p4612
aS"Where is the government in this? Clinicians made a clinical decision, and hid behind a non-mandatory guideline, which was set by other more senior clinicians, expert in their field. Assuming the woman's very detailed recall of the stressful series of events is accurate, perhaps it was God's way of telling this unmarried mother that after five previous miscarriages, she still wasn't getting the message."
p4613
aS"Did I mention premarital or adulterous heterosexual sex?  I think not!  As usual 'big' boy is putting words in others posts!  Was better when I was on his ignore list..for about five minutesemoticonXConfused"
p4614
aS"Yeah, but now the special interests won't have access to congress' deep pockets emoticonXRolleyes (hopefully)"
p4615
aS"Gee, and in what year did he state that? 2005? No way. 2000? No. 1995? Nope. 1990? Nah. 1985? Couldn't be. Without more information I can give an exact date, but seeing as how Simpson died in 1984, he must have said that at least 21 years ago (and if he said it in the middle of his life/career, it would have been more like 60 years ago!) - he did not know back then what we now know."
p4616
aS'Within one post.   Thanks for proving that creationist are incapable of discussing the original topic and automatically move to change the subject.'
p4617
aS'I see you know nothing about the subject...hardly a surprise.'
p4618
aS'Feel free samiinh. After all, chemist asked me the same question just yesterday pertaining to the same subject. And the same question about being angry at an allegedly non existent God applies to you too.'
p4619
aS'LOL! Dodging the problem Easyrider. So, is sidestepping the best you can do?'
p4620
aS"No, not at all. Read the post above. 'Christmas cracker'?? What's that? Here, we have Fortune cookies.:)"
p4621
aS"Everyone is welcome to give their opinion on public gun possession here-whether you're for or against gun control (or does gun possession justifies itself) and please state the reasons as well. I would really appreciate it if you guys could include some extra informations regarding this issue."
p4622
aS"What's sick is your theological comprehension.  God took Ananias and Sapphira (Acts chapter 5) off the earth just for lying. And you want to give JFK, the serial adulterer, a pass? That's how lame your theological thinking is."
p4623
aS'You don\'t want anyone saying gay people are whacked, but you will make it your business to insult someones religion?! You are a hypocrite!! You say,"Don\'t judge gays!" But you are judging people by their religon?! I thought you were more mature then that. Hey you live ad learn.emoticonXRolleyes'
p4624
aS"You evidentally didn't grasp the apparently immense complexity and vagueness of my post.  "
p4625
aS'I guess he was a "democrat" as well. He certainly would not have been a republican.'
p4626
aS'I forgot you support the NKorea government....yeah, it would be a triumph to you.'
p4627
aS'Stalin died of natural causes while in power, I believe. Perhaps the fall of communism is due in part that the purges stopped. So, killing hundreds of thousands of people was wise for Stalin, huh? Good. Good. Anybody disagree with canadianman76?'
p4628
aS"Modest as well I see. You haven't answered my question at all. If you are going to wander into a thread like this and make such a comment as follows:"
p4629
aS"Haven't we all . The difference is some of us know that most people have or will and that it does not make us a fount of knowledge. As you show us so well."
p4630
aS"Now marc, that just isn't fair. They believe in freedom of speech.... if you agree with them. I just find it difficult agreeing with secular humanists. emoticonXSmilie emoticonXAngel"
p4631
aS'So says a ghoul who delights in digging up the body of a dead man.'
p4632
aS'I was thinking moreso Canada, Great Britain, and Israel rather than "Happyland" but whatever floats your boat.  '
p4633
aS'Might as well attribute intelligence to your thermostat as rape seed plants.'
p4634
aS'How the hell can you narrow it down to three? The competition in the entire top ten is fierce.'
p4635
aS"You can't create an artificial minority, wave a magic wand and declare that they should be granted a special status. That not how it should works."
p4636
aS"Is your thinking really this simplistic? Either I have to agree with you or I am an anarchist? Is that all the complexity you can handle? This or that? Black or white? The best soda in the world is Sprite and everything else is wrong? What a boring little pigeon-holed world you live in.  No harm no foul - that is where I stand on sex and romance. Kids, animals and those who don't or can't consent are off-limits. K? Now that I have established (AGAIN) how I feel on that matter, let me reinstate.  Any God that allows love and intimacy for only a select group is viscious."
p4637
aS'Thanks god we sorted that out! I mean, the whole South America - Africa thing is just a coincidence right? Right?'
p4638
aS'Ha. Those must be the same folks who believe in the missing link like you do.'
p4639
aS"I'll give you that one...only because I think by then women will be able to place their fertilized ovums in banks.   But then again they said the same thing about robot servants and flying cars too!"
p4640
aS"Well, you must not be a GOP lawmaker or the President of the United States. They're convinced that the only way to prevent the SCOTUS finding in favor of same-sex marriage is to amend the Constitution."
p4641
aS'Have you stopped beating your wife yet?  Give it up! Good grief! emoticonXDonno'
p4642
aS"Yeah, but it's the NYTimes. And it's an editorial. Two things that, together, make a pungent recipe for a nice dish of bias."
p4643
aS'The Fact that you believe there is some sort of salvation in Jebus proves you are the dumb one.. You should stop rejecting reality ....'
p4644
aS"Gee, I'm just bowled over by your mature and articulate counterargument.emoticonXRolleyes We all know genitals have nothing to do with sex."
p4645
aS"A gutless coward mocking a soldier like a parrot, that's funny. Roasted parrot under glass is a fitting end emoticonXGood"
p4646
aS'It\'s a look....ad hominem all you got? Evidently. Where\'s your picture at so we can make fun of you? What\'s the matter? A vasectomy got you shooting blanks? And by the way, if one of your cronies "outed" me, then he was no buddy of mine. Evidently, he is intimidated, also. You should hear how they talk about you at TPA. LOL.'
p4647
aS'Does it function better on tobacco? Alcohol? Caffine? How about hundereds and hundereds of different pills?'
p4648
aS'Oh my!!!!! Salon.com and Huffington Post think the guy was at fault! Get out!'
p4649
aS'Based on your irrational rants, you are most definitely the sockpuppet you proclaimed yourself to be in the post above.   '
p4650
aS'Coveting is the basis for capitalism. Without coveting, there is no motivation!'
p4651
aS'Nothing I have stated is incorrect. If I did you would get specific.'
p4652
aS'Do you have any New Testament passages to back these up - or were you just interested in having a rant?'
p4653
aS'World government is just around the bend! What shall we call it...The Company...The Authority...The End?'
p4654
aS"So, if having children isn't a requirement fro marriage, then gays should be OK, right?   If it is what it is all about, if you marry a woman who is incapable of having children, even with scientific methods, then you are not really married?   What about lesbians? They can have childre, with a little help from the local sperm bank. In facst, they can BOTH get pregnant. Does tht mean that a marriage between 2 lesbians is twice as valid?   What if a couple of gay men adopt? Then is their marriage valid?   If I have a vasectomy, am I divorced?   You are confusing me. Please explain."
p4655
aS'Well....it was easier to get them to use those rather than the ones that just said "White trash onboard".......'
p4656
aS'Just to be pedantic, a better analogy would be: "If you are here, why do you have brothers and sisters?"'
p4657
aS'So if you quoted Ted Kennedy when he said to his wife in an event that wasn\'t even publicized "Good morning, sweetie", that would be an answer?'
p4658
aS"Was your pretty graph supposed to convince me that the universe can't be understood? Perhaps I was to intuitively understand that you're right :p"
p4659
aS"More heretical misinformation from dear old cap0.   'Zionism is Racism' - a Dead Issue"
p4660
aS"That's it? That was your post? To attack a source without anything backing you up? Bravo!"
p4661
aS'Try and comprehend this child, your siggy is your OPINION. It is evidence of nothing real or imagined. Only in your mind does it prove anything at all.  '
p4662
aS"But on the other hand, Genesis isn't a scientific document. No wonder. Why would a bronze age nomad from the Levant be aware of at least 3 tailless species of primates, or even the tailed primates from Africa, South America, and even Madigascar. If they aren't mentioned in the Bible, do they exist?"
p4663
aS'Because the soundbite "survival of the fittest" was coined to explain evolution to the stupid masses.'
p4664
aS'Well if you are Catholic you would should probably find him pretty credible.'
p4665
aS"let's have an up or down vote on your marriage rights too Lurch....."
p4666
aS'And irrational emotional appeals seldom hold up in the face of logic'
p4667
aS"oh cc, apparently, 10% of the population has the power to destroy the other 90% somehow. We can't be in the military because we have the power to undermine things, we can't get married cause we will destroy marriage for everyone, we cannot possibly have committed relationships because it would make Britney look bad ( although, I have her beat by 4 years and counting, still happy and going) We have the power. We are gay, ten percent taking out the other 90% or so they say (ask jaaman for more info)"
p4668
aS'Yes yes yes. We know you are bigoted against any non-christian. I am sure that the out of context quotes are totally misrepresenting Islam. But, your out of context quotes totally misrepresent Judaism too.. so that is no surprise.'
p4669
aS"It's sophomoric remarks like that that hurt the gay cause in America.   God isn't mocked, though. And I doubt the people are either.   And I'm glad California outlawed the sin. The only thing you have left is to hope the far left, spiritually-stunted judges in the US Supreme Court are pro Sodom and Gomorrah."
p4670
aS"Big Bear, ye mae be thinkin' o the Mennonites. Er the Hutterites, er the Amish. Er mebbe the followers of thet Zwingli feller."
p4671
aS'Tell me then, does someone who is mentally retarded have a self-interest in staying alive? What about someone in a coma?'
p4672
aS"I find it funny you think Article V was repealed yet the bill of rights references Article V for passage.   So we have the bill of rights which can't be repealed but Article V which was repealed meaning all the amendments we had are unconstitutional? You've really lost it haven't you.  "
p4673
aS"Has the American Medical Association decided to recognize that aluminum, steel and polymer and addictive narcotic substances that can drastically alter a person's mental status?"
p4674
aS"Observations? Like the posts I have made? Which would be documented via quotes?....emoticonXConfused You demanded 'links' for your recurring rudeness, I produced them. I demand 'links' for my creationism."
p4675
aS"It's also hard to convince a rational person that something is so if there is zero evidence of its truth, but then you wouldn't have any clue about that."
p4676
aS'I think we should not only allow GAYs to have legal marriage rights but also those who want to practice insist as well as all who want to practice polygamy. Let us not stop there let us sanction union between human and animals. After all I love my Dog and my Parrot. Why stop with GAYs?   By the way where does the term GAY come from for homosexuals.'
p4677
aS'Are you going to go and urinate on his grave as well?  My! My! What hatred and vitriol! What does it feel like to have so black a heart?'
p4678
aS'have you considered a career in advertising?  by the way you f***ed us too. Australians troops were cannon fodder in WWI for the British Empire, remember Gallipoli?'
p4679
aS'Actually, I read that the god of the bible was really a macaroni monster. He likes cheese, too.'
p4680
aS"What's the matter? Can't anybody in KC afford to have 2 cars? emoticonXWow"
p4681
aS"So...all Christians have some sort of brain damage, trebor? You're not getting any better at this are you?"
p4682
aS'Wow Archie, way to suck the fun out of something. Let me use your words here:  '
p4683
aS"Alexander, I don't give a rat's rectum about King James. emoticonXBanghead"
p4684
aS"No, actually, we don't.   I suppose it's pointless to ask someone who would speak for God to not tell me what I know."
p4685
aS"O.K. lets' play your game. Gun control has worked exactly WHERE?"
p4686
aS'I don\'t understand your outrage. McChrystal\'s your boy\'s general now. Are you saying that you disagree with "the Great One"?'
p4687
aS'It appears the safety Nazis feel gun free zones should be ran like prisons. Maybe the safety Nazis should take a field trip to their states prison system and ask the guards if guns or any other weapons ever make it into the prisons. Prisons are considered gun and drug free zones. If this was true then how can an inmate get shot by a gun in prison?'
p4688
aS'Plenty. You haven\'t noticed how many "sentences" you post that aren\'t sentences?  '
p4689
aS'Nor is there any need for some mythical molecular elemental, nebulas natural selection, or mystical transitionals based on peicemeal forensics and antithestic rhetoric.'
p4690
aS'The egg is now a conscious human? In under 72-hours? Wow.'
p4691
aS'You actually posted something that made good sense, and was funny too, maybe there hope for you yet.'
p4692
aS'point me toward the right way then? if creationists are wrong then why is evolution right? this is a biased answer based on your beliefs. please tell us how creationists were wrong. i would gladly like to see you try!'
p4693
aS'And you, on the other hand, because you are not educated in science in general, and evolutionary theory (why the quotation marks?) specifically, are qualified to correct those of us who spent years in study of the topic.'
p4694
aS'John/John would figure out a way for the American taxpayers to foot the bill.'
p4695
aS'You mean to tell me you would deny a life to be lived out and someone to get away with a harmful crime?? wow, sounds like a liberal to me..'
p4696
aS"Did you even notice that they were not the first to report it? Oh wait, you didn't because you are obviously using the fallacy of selective observation.  "
p4697
aS'All the more reason to be armed to the teeth huh,does this mean you see it our way?'
p4698
aS"No, think about what you just said. A cancer cell doesn't mutate, it attacks healthy cells and causes the destruction of healthy tissue. Kinda like liberals in a healthy society - they are the free radicals of the body politic, huh... go figure."
p4699
aS'And Anarchy. Am I allowed to kill someone if I feel like it ?'
p4700
aS'Sounds like an abortion bill amendment to restrict all travel by minors is needed by those demanding that young girls give birth after being impregnated by rapists, fathers, uncles, etc. Might as well include adults, just to simplify matters and enhance state police power. Bubbah will be pleased.'
p4701
aS'For someone that knows how each side thinks, I would have thought you would have had an eye opening response that would have had me recanting everything I have said in the past and glorifying your name and everything you would say in the future, BUT, instead I got   '
p4702
aS"  Now that is a diaper load. How's that free speech thing doing up there by the way."
p4703
aS"I see. Sounds too nebulous to stand up to scrutiny in the US. I'm guessing that the SCOTUS would strike down such as law as being too vague."
p4704
aS'Ahhh I see so God was more than willing to use extreme punishment for not loving your neighbor. Like how Sodom and Gomorrah were punished for not loving their neighbor.  '
p4705
aS'I guess the European union is a great failure? Is that why the Euro is trending 1.5 dollars as liberalism creats misery?'
p4706
aS"So now those that are opposed to even more laws on the books and a return to Old Testament practices are considered left wing? What's this world coming too? LOL"
p4707
aS"I was eight at the time. I'll read up and get back to you. Mind your manners."
p4708
aS'Hmm.. does that include the Muslim Communities you were associated with too?.. We know as rational people that Denial is the Christians best weapon. You should seriously consider increasing your medications..   '
p4709
aS"Yes but your one of those Christians people hear about, but never find. You don't really exist. :)"
p4710
aS"so you are into pommy bashing now? mae honey, is there anybody you don't like? emoticonXRolleyes"
p4711
aS'So cross jurisdictional escort is a fairly common occurrence in the area. You will note that it is not the local cops talking about not being informed....it is the author of the article whining about it.'
p4712
aS'...Because everyone knows there are no married men sexually abusing children. emoticonXConfused'
p4713
aS'Well, the pill has the ability to not let it implant, which "God" already cause for around 60% of its contemporaries. The pill doesn\'t destroy the "entity" at all.'
p4714
aS'Oh.. that makes sense. Because, it sounds exactly like modern day republicans.'
p4715
aS"But apparently they can't say no to renting the property for a gay wedding, even if they decide to just say 'no' to everyone and get out of business. go figure"
p4716
aS"Good to know that sence of humor hasn't completely evaded you.   Had me worried there for a moment, or two, or three... emoticonXWow"
p4717
aS'oh do tell us of this dooms day event, will we need new nike sneakers and $1.75 in our pocket when we all die?'
p4718
aS"Never heard of him...however, looks like those ever-loving proponents of free speech up in Canada showed Anne Coulter that 'free-speech' is Only what liberals make it to be....."
p4719
aS'Whose culture are we talking about, here?  I thought I was a member of the culture. What am I, chopped liver?'
p4720
aS"Well, good, I'm glad as heck you have a mom you can tell that to. Mine would've hit the roof, and then hit me on the way back down. Did she flip or was she pretty cool about it?  Just remember (who would we be if not preachy? Us ol' adults, we don't know nuthin') that b.c. isn't one hundred percent reliable or that condoms can break and you can still get nasty bugs all kinds of different ways."
p4721
aS"So everything that other people say on a website or in a book is just and opinion? And everything you say is a fact? Nice how you've got things set up."
p4722
aS"It's also a noun. But since you're unable but to repeat your self, maybe a few more times will make it 'true'"
p4723
aS'Good lesson! Always take the easy way out to try and avoid consequences of actions. Instead of leaving a note on a car saying you accidently hit you...you should just casually drive away. Thanks Simone!'
p4724
aS'Really? Can you link to a creationist website that does not connect evolution to people doing bad things?'
p4725
aS'And that would make you the one that IS advocating the murder of our future generation.'
p4726
aS"No you don't cede that decision to her, Steeeve, you want to butt into her personal life and make her decision for her."
p4727
aS"Ready to condemn blind faith yet, jyoshu? Or are you going to stick to the argument that blind faith is fine so long as you can see you're not doing harm?"
p4728
aS"Umm, don't know about you but I also eject waste through my penis - just don't do it when having sex, just not polite (unless they ask, now there's another fetish I don't get). Isn't it odd if the anus was not designed for a penis its still pleasurable?  "
p4729
aS"Hey don't insult Olberman... he looks good on the tube emoticonXGood lol...."
p4730
aS"You're out of your depth here kid. Go and clean your push-bike before you go out on your paper round....it's a disgrace!"
p4731
aS"After all he isn't a cousin after all is he. You obviously are older than I thought or spent too much time around the DPC. Old joke? Q. 'where do cousins come from,' A. 'aunt holes'.   Darn J.P. and after all this time we spent together emoticonXHoho"
p4732
aS"Dear god.You really haven't a clue about what your talking about.Away with the birdies i think.Yousef was responsible for the 93 bombing,and he himself had very broad associations with some of the Al-Qaeda hardcore(Osama said he didn't know him and was in Sudan while Yousef stayed in Peshewer).Osama wasn't responsible for the 93 bombing,he wasn't responsible for Bali and Madrid and i don't care what the world media tells you.But by all means keep spouting your misinformation,i for one find it hilarious.  The Yousef-Osama-Saddam link is a conspiracy theory."
p4733
aS"And I didn't. Did you note how I explicitly put [Jesus said] for the first two quotes from the Bible, but not for the third one? Any idea why? Come on, think ... you can do it!"
p4734
aS'What, to be "open-minded?" or to embrace your definition of "tolerance?"'
p4735
aS'This coming from someone that is very choosy in the question that they answeremoticonXRolleyes'
p4736
aS'So if you are not naive then you must be evil'
p4737
aS'Well, I guess this all just proves that more brain dead crack babies are surviving than I originally thought.'
p4738
aS'Well, the antichrist is going to come and make any true believer a heretic any way so what am I worried about? I knew the risks before I accept the job. :-)'
p4739
aS"What prompted this?  I guess I need to check what website I'm in...  Your response, Orion, (like trs) is that of a gutless, spineless, dip-wad. One who would tinkle in your drawers if you made such a claim while facing me. But, I've dealt with your sorry, trashy kind before and have found that no matter what is said, you'll act like you're ten foot tall and bulletproof.  But, carry on, Orion. You've shown your true colors now. Cluck at will... emoticonXChicken emoticonXRolleyes"
p4740
aS'In the future, please try to spare me the theatrical flair.   ....'
p4741
aS"Are we talking about the same Obama here? The same one, who's head of the DHS, told law enforcement to be on the lookout for anyone who disagreed with the government?"
p4742
aS"Just to let you know you're welcome to come back and debate Islam, don't hurry, you've a lot of reading to catch up on.emoticonXHoho emoticonXLove"
p4743
aS'wow....there is a real person under there. Good luck on your recovery, chemist.'
p4744
aS'A load of unowhat repeated for many years now. Junk science commissioned to get results that were desired. Check out lung cancer rates for Rastafarians. Nothing abnormally high. Gateway my arse.'
p4745
aS'I made contact with God once, but the acid wore off....  '
p4746
aS'So you are happy that they chopped of the most sensitive part of your penis? That someone took and cut out a part of your body without your consent? What if it where your nipples? After all nipples on men serve no purpose.'
p4747
aS"I'm with Smiley: you're describing yourself perfectly, save for referring to conservatives instead of liberals."
p4748
aS"That's deep.  Movement is not matter, I will use that the next time I decide to babble.  Are the particles no longer matter when there moving ?  Your funny."
p4749
aS"Looks like my first response to this was deleted? I'll risk it again since this post was not deleted.  Anyhoo,  This post just wreaks of the emotional and psychological development, maturity, morality, character, and integrity of SOME Republicans/Conservatives. emoticonXRolleyes   Waxy"
p4750
aS"Of course it's solely a product of women's behavior simone. It's the women that has to make the phone call to the stork. The stork doesn't answer calls from men."
p4751
aS"I knew the mangling of Jesus's teachings would be forthcoming, and entertaining. emoticonXHoho   And of course lying about what I've said is just par for the course. Standard stuff, nothing to compare with trying to make Jesus out to be pro-cruelty."
p4752
aS'Sounds like someone could be lying... hmmm who could it be? emoticonXIc'
p4753
aS'My thoughts are my own, not from some 2000 year old Book that makes as much sense as a bag of Rocks. And I have only ever called anyone a name in response to an attack on me,   If you call what you have been doing debating then I see what the problem really is.'
p4754
aS"It might be telling that super heroes typically don't use firearms. That I'd prefer my crowds to have few if any guns concealed within hardly makes me pro-crime. Nor does it make me a pacifist. I'm a big fan of violence. The hands on kind."
p4755
aS"Name them. Real contemporary people who testified about a real superman. And don't forget to identify the time period and where they lived and their written historical accounts."
p4756
aS"Wow. I particularly like the part where you criticize someone for a lack of intelligence while making an elementary grammar mistake. It's you're not your.  "
p4757
aS'Haaa Haaa Haaa Haaa haaa haaa haaa haaa Thats a good one not. emoticonXClown'
p4758
aS"Or possibly your Holy Fathe has resorted to XXXXX-bashing. It's all perspective. Frankly, I don't think that the views on this message board will fuel discrimination and hatred of Popes everywhere around the world, so I think they have less to answer for."
p4759
aS'Again, you speak as if gays and lesbians are not worthy of their relationships being sacred to them. As if gays and lesbians are unable to hold dear any concept of commitment, loyalty, partnership.   What a sad and mean little man you are.'
p4760
aS'Pro-lifers are like slave traders? What a pro-lifers trading? Anyone who denies a human being a fundamental human right is a slave trader...like a right to life...???'
p4761
aS'I think that is true of so many things. Wanna screw something up royal? -- add humans.  I heard once that a gallon (or maybe is was a barrel) of Coca Cola (syrup) is more expensive than the same amount of oil. Things that make you go hmmm.'
p4762
aS"maybe he'll unban himself on the third day (or was that three days and three nights...)"
p4763
aS'Bush is a Luddite...Yadda, yadda, yadda..... Bush is the anti-Christ ...Yadda, yadda, yadda emoticonXRolleyes'
p4764
aS'As you both also ignore the fact that it was TQ who first posted in the largest red bolded font possible. But hey, since when do you children care about facts or truth. emoticonXRolleyes  '
p4765
aS'He was in Indonesia dear. Read his XXXX (my marks)  I thought he was as old as the devil??'
p4766
aS"I'd be happy to be of service in distributing those assets but Alan is probably armed."
p4767
aS"Exactly, because it's not just an issue of 'her body'. What she does (the smoker) affects other people. Thanks for missing the point.  "
p4768
aS"Shhhh . . . don't tell anyone: Habitat for Humanity is a religious (GASP) organization. Those mean old hateful Christians--helping giving homes to needy people . . ."
p4769
aS'Is there some kind of prize for most consecutive straw-man arguments. I ask this because you seem to be going for a record. No where have I claimed that I would fix your problems, many though there are.  '
p4770
aS"So it's your contention that hundreds of thousands of firearms stolen from residences annually is just par for the course?"
p4771
aS"Oh he won't read that... This American in exile (does not even live here anymore) just disappears for a while whe the heat is on only to resurface with his same propaganda after the heat has died down."
p4772
aS"And Creationists who can't tell the difference between cats and nuclear reactors don't understand fluid mechanics."
p4773
aS'So then will you go the way on liberty (repeal stoopid laws) or tyranny (enact more unconstitutional laws)?'
p4774
aS"Archie, you have said so many incorrect things about evolution on this thread that it's hard to know where to begin. The idea that 'evolution teaches essentially that a fish walked out of the ocean and survived long enough to become a mammal 'springs readily to mind.  "
p4775
aS'Waxy:  Why are you standing by saying nothing while one of your own is continuing to show how ignorant he is by asserting Isochron was not used at KBS Tuff ?  Ray M.'
p4776
aS'What the freaking hell are you even talking about, dude? Hi its Me did not even post that. Do you even read the dang posts here before spouting off your drivel!? Not to mention that it proved the unintelligence of creationists (as well as their predictive abilities, which, I must say are very poor).'
p4777
aS"Crammed with them, sure, why not? It's easy, only a few million light years. The scientific method is used in weather forecasting too."
p4778
aS"Well, it does take some scientific knowledge to understand the evidence for evolution. One doesn't expect Creationists to possess it."
p4779
aS'And because this man said it, it must be true? A simple appeal to authority.'
p4780
aS"People make mistakes (excepting some pro-evolutionists who respond with anger and blame others of 'twisting their words'.)"
p4781
aS'Oh damn it...and I was going to sell this joke and retire!'
p4782
aS'Why should you mutilate your son? Maybe you should have listened'
p4783
aS'Is that your logic? Does the phrase, "crime of opportunity" ring a bell?'
p4784
aS"Yawn, again you keep repeating this. You not only refute yourself by providing an example of knowledge of the unknowable, but you gave an example of what is unknowable, by telling me I'd never be able to know you!  "
p4785
aS'Interesting. It seems that you like to get your news from Aljazeera.  '
p4786
aS"'Who's definition? Yours? Do you OWN the copyright to a word? I didn't think words were copyrightable. emoticonXWow   Geez. emoticonXRolleyes More bovine excerment."
p4787
aS'Nice excuse? You mean you want an excuse to have dessert without dinner?'
p4788
aS'So, I guess in your view, educating people against prejudice and intolerance is a bad thing.'
p4789
aS'Your posts read like gibberish when you fail to complete the thought. Try to be more careful in the future.'
p4790
aS'Was she on her knees, taking lessons from you...or was she skilled already?'
p4791
aS'You do that, and be sure to use it when I repeatedly and ignorantly claim that the unborn are parasites while refusing to actually prove it as ingus has done here. Unless you too are making that claim also, then I would make the same challenge to you.'
p4792
aS'This is a free market of ideas. The good ones survive. The bad one die like dinosaurs.'
p4793
aS"You don't mean Ethel and Julius Rosenberg, do you? The Russian spies? Nah, you said wrongfully accused....."
p4794
aS'Really? Is it of the flesh eating variety that is resistant to all but the strongest antibiotics? Because if so, then that is big news.'
p4795
aS'You forgot about the youth recruitment efforts as well. I am president of the local chapter of "Get \'Em While They\'re Young." Our mission (agenda, if you will) is to recruit and convert the kids in an effort to increase the prevalence of homosexuality to 20% by 2015, then 51% by mid-century when we will have total control, muahahahahaha!!!'
p4796
aS'No, we don\'t claim to know the truth. We gladly say "we don\'t know" to questions like "why are we here" instead of making up fairy tale answers just because we\'re too impatient to look for the truth. Tell us, do you still believe in the fire god and the tooth fairy too?'
p4797
aS"I've got to concentrate...concentrate...concentrate. I've got to concentrate...concentrate...concentrate...Hello?.. .Hello?...Hello? Echo...Echo...Echo...Pinch hitting for Pedro Colon...Manny Mota...Mota...Mota..."
p4798
aS'The fact they are blond has nothign to do with the fact they are dumb. The right wing mindless talking points from Fox News is another matter.'
p4799
aS'I\'m not a "TROLL" unless of course disagreeing or believing differently from you makes me one. If so then I wear the title with pride.'
p4800
aS"EasyRider just doesn't like gay men trying to shove it down his throat! emoticonXAngel"
p4801
aS'He has a persecution complex. He thinks that every intelligent white male is out to put chains on him and make him sing Gospel songs. ;)'
p4802
aS"So if it was deemed by 'those with the knowledge that give their opinion weight' that a fetus can feel pain and stress during a termination you would agree that the termination should not be carried out..well done  "
p4803
aS'Just trying to bring some consistency to the debate. You love it when Democrats pander but not when Republicans do it. Why am I not surprised? ;)   '
p4804
aS"Examined the record? Now it's not even the patient, just the record? Good god man! Many times, only a number of criteria must be met, not all of them. It would be like me saying that there must be gas in your car since it is running. Then you tell me that I must look at the gauge then physically take the tank off to be able to say without a doubt there is gas in it. Flat EEG in the cerebral cortex means no brain activity in cerebral cortex means PVS. There is no reason to test a swallowing reflex, a pain response reflex, or sphincter tone.   "
p4805
aS"Simone: I'm a chronic sufferer: I thought of asking Easyrider for a prescription."
p4806
aS'Actually what sank that debate was a bunch of paleontologists from K state who started arguing for punctuated equilibrium. That was pretty much the end. I remember one board member was quoted as saying "These are public schools. We are luck if we can teach the kids to read"'
p4807
aS"From the Catholic Educators Resource Center...Yeah...I am sure there would be no myths in there...sure you're right. emoticonXRolleyes"
p4808
aS"I think it's a pretty neat trick for a dead baby to sit upright in that little tub."
p4809
aS"with you it's pretty easy, we just assume it's all BS, works every time."
p4810
aS"Yes but its like sharks when there is blood in the water. Plus I at least do this for fun and why should I not get in my own ideas and have my fun with creationists. They are getting pretty rare you know. Can't let those other rationalists keep them all to themselves. emoticonXAgree   "
p4811
aS'Why did the president have to lie. Kerry served, Bu$h just helped himself to the cocaine.'
p4812
aS"So, if a baby is having trouble breathing that's been born already, you don't consider it a 'person'? Methinks you've not thought through the implications of your argument here at all."
p4813
aS"Um, of course, it was too much to expect murderers to shell out for burying their victims. I keep forgetting I'm in Dick Cheney's America."
p4814
aS"I can see that you're as impressed by PZs propaganda as an infant is with a pacifier Collin, but I'm not. emoticonXFrazzled emoticonXBye"
p4815
aS'I reply to them out of courtesy...but be amused all you want...it looks like you need it.'
p4816
aS'Look who\'s talking.   Besides, it\'s a free country. It\'s not "Politically Correct Treborville" that we\'re playing here.'
p4817
aS'Actually that was obvious based on your type of irrational reasoning.  '
p4818
aS'I avert your gaze. I submit myself to your mercy. Henceforth I shall only respond to your web postings. I shall not respond to postings you make on the web....Wait.....  '
p4819
aS"LOL. Glad he didn't come across a dung pile while he was fashioning us."
p4820
aS"Well, if you claim you can give 95% of Americans a tax cut then you'd have to be on par with Jesus."
p4821
aS'The Pastors are claiming themselves as a "Spiritual shield" against witchcraft. Of course you don\'t need such a shield until you find a witch, guess what happens next.'
p4822
aS'Not only is everyone in agreement, which scares me enough, but Parcum even agrees with me. This is really shocking!!!! :)'
p4823
aS"  They're not Jews, and not rabbis, just like you, who are not in your right mind, and who is an authority on nothing but rubbish."
p4824
aS"Yeah, gassing and murdering 6,000,000 Jews doesn't qualify as suffering very much.   emoticonXRolleyes   I wonder how many slaves were killed by comparison........"
p4825
aS'So what are you proposing? Death panels? Do you think we should euthanase the elderly or should we simply stop their social security payments and healthcare?'
p4826
aS'Unfortunately for you, that is not shown, the evidence points in one direction, and one direction only. That of evolution and to the fact that the flood never happened.'
p4827
aS"You're right, why not simply kill these people in the shortest amount of time possible. I got it! We can advertise each killing (hanging, rock slaying, Guillotine, etc.) weeks in advance, kinda like moves, and show it on pay-per-view. You can buy tickets to watch the show live as well. I mean c'mon, if we're going to have the death penalty we might as well utilize in the most gruesome, cost efficient, and swift method possible. Right? That is how punishment was executed a few centuries ago.   Honestly, how you feel is how a lot of people culturally conceive such offenders. In regards to the death penalty debate, it falls along a continuum between morality and scientific reasoning."
p4828
aS"Oh that greatly changes the equation doesn't it? Very unrealistic, but for the sakes of the debate, why not? Well, alledgedly, 23 innocent people have been put to death, and for sure two unrefutable cases. I don't support killing people as a deterrent or as any means in a justice system."
p4829
aS"According to Genesis? Why are you trying to present that as scientific evidence? Should I present The DaVinci Code as scientific evidence? How about Darwin's On the Origin of the Species?"
p4830
aS'Insects are not birds. Get your terminology correct. Also please stop lying. It makes baby jesus cry.   '
p4831
aS"  How do you KNOW Bush let's Cheney run the government..oh yeah, that's right, CNN/CBS told you. So you will knock one of the greatest minds this country has because he has a bad heart and can't stand for long periods of time? What a goober, so I guess Stephen Hawking should die too, huh?  "
p4832
aS'god, this has been argued against a thousand times. by this deffinition masterbation is killing, menstration is involentary manslauter. by this deffinition you kill someone every time you walk by a carrot without eating it.'
p4833
aS"Well, I guess you can refuse to see something that's pretty obvious. It's up to you."
p4834
aS'Yep, but those "mixed views" are slanted way left of center. A good offense always beats a good defense :) My guess is you are not very mature nor old? You out of high school yet?  '
p4835
aS'French like turkeys even the yanks eat turkeys. What has a turkey got to do with the French voting No! By the way, why do you spell turkey with a capital T?'
p4836
aS"I guess we just haven't shaken all of our Imperialist ways. After all, we've only been away from the British Empire for a little over 200 years.:p"
p4837
aS'Because their reasoning is obviously on the same level as their reading comprehension level.'
p4838
aS"So if you were attacked by a 250 pound man who is an 8th Degree Blackbelt, you'd prefer a fair fight?"
p4839
aS'That may seem like a brainstorm to you kronus, but to the enlightened, it was an obvious brainfart. emoticonXGood But I would never expect you to know the difference.'
p4840
aS'NAAAAA, actually it makes ME sound quite sane...I\'m not denying a woman the "right" to have sex all she wants. THere ARE ways of having sex WITHOUT getting pregnant, I\'m sure you\'d agree. SO, it actually makes YOU sound like you are desperately hanging on to the "right" to take an innocent life just because you don\'t want to be inconvenienced. In Bizarro world, you might be right, but not in reality'
p4841
aS'What part of "I don\'t want a penis" do you not quite understand?   Is it that maybe you are the one who wants a penis? There are ways to resolve that issue. emoticonXRolleyes'
p4842
aS'So you believe if a kid threatens to shoot up the school it should be just ignored as children"s innocent mischief..........Tell that to the kids that died at Colombine..... emoticonXRolleyes'
p4843
aS"The surcharge should go on gasoline from ME oil used by 300+Million Americans daily. But wait! That would unfairly burden the working poor that drive gas-guzzlin' hoopdies, so scrap that idea. Let's just soak the rich for the hell of it..... because we can. emoticonXRolleyes"
p4844
aS"It's either that or he's a frustrated tenor for the Vienna Boys Choir. ;)"
p4845
aS'Well, if you want to tell the truth, the theory of evolution is NOT a religion, it involves no magical deities, it takes nothing on faith. And since creation involves supernatural forces that are supported by absolutely NO evidence, it is not a scientific theory.'
p4846
aS'He was referring to the mimivirus which does NOT act like any other virus. Some of you people need to study a little harder :)   '
p4847
aS"I don't know about you..but being shot in the back is more human than being taken apart piece by piece. If I recall correctly, Chinese inmates sentenced to death are executed this way to minimize the pain."
p4848
aS'OK, where do we start? The NAACP. Affirmative Action? UNCF? Miss Black America? emoticonXRolleyes'
p4849
aS'Oh come on! Instead of turning my sarcasm on it\'s head why don;t you log off and go listen to some more Chuck Smith tapes? I\'m sure the Calvary Chapel brigade could use another "donation."'
p4850
aS'Wasn\'t that you spewing "facts" that had no content and were incorrect? gee, what do you wanna be when you grow up?   '
p4851
aS'.. I pointed it out in capitals in the hope that it may help you understand the point...did it work? Who knows'
p4852
aS'Mr Rodgers was a pedophile and Big Bird was a flamer. ;)'
p4853
aS"So much bandwidth; so little substance.   Aren't you embarrassed to post such inconsistent ramblings?   Women with pre-existing mental problems are more likely to experience post-abortion issues. Well, DUH!!!"
p4854
aS"You mental midgets insult my intelligence when you aren't even aware that the word omnibenevolent isn't even found in the Catholic Online - Catholic Encyclopedia . In fact, the word isn't found in any popular dictionary what so ever. It's an urban slang with no historical usage in theological studies or history at all. I ought to know, because it never came up in Bible College, ever. But here it is in the famous and highly referred to URBAN DICTIONARY: Urban Dictionary: omnibenevolent Once again guys, get a clue before you start spouting off your criticisms which you haven't an actual clue about."
p4855
aS"Tell ya what; I got this Rolex I'm wiling to sell ya for $50.00. Give me the money and wait here. I'll be right back!"
p4856
aS'So I pray to chance every night before I go to bed?'
p4857
aS"You're living in an absolute naive dream world about this guy. I think I should be trying to sell YOU the beachfront property."
p4858
aS'Better a godly set of morals being crammed down your throats than the perverted gay sex hedonism of the devil himself.'
p4859
aS'i take by your redundant posts that you havent read the previous 20..'
p4860
aS'Having politicians monitor their ethics is much like having the mafia monitor crime.   '
p4861
aS'This is not to say that every current dictionary includes such a definition... yet... but a number of major on-line ones demonstrably do, and to my knowledge human civilization has yet to suffer any negative effects.   (By the way, the above entries also include the typical "husband and wife" kind of arrangement as well. Funny how words can have more than one meaning, isn\'t it?)'
p4862
aS'Just like Obama is? Really? Have you researched it at all?   '
p4863
aS'Exactly, they are big on condeming the sins of those other guys. It makes them feel better about themselves. Also, it is always a good idea to have a vitriolic campaign about something that will never change so they will always have an enemy - homos are not going to disappear, abortion will never be made illegal. That\'s how the religious right recruits folks - get \'em all indignant about the "others" and they never notice they are being fleeced by the fat little pastor.'
p4864
aS'I see -- in your opinion is it is "illegitimate", therefore it must be so. I think I trust the legal opinions of the courts more, but then, they do occasionally make mistakes. It\'s just not at all obvious they\'ve made one in this instance.'
p4865
aS'If you\'d have taken the time to watch the movie "Expelled" you wouldn\'t find it nearly so absurd. emoticonXAngel'
p4866
aS"Don't worry, think everyone knows that your side doesn't have the sole monopoly on crazy.  "
p4867
aS"So the fact that it is not legally recognized is the problem. What is the reason it's not legally recognized? Because the couple is gay."
p4868
aS"You still trying to push your propaganda film? Let me ask you something, why would the fetus try and avoid the forceps? An infant will cheerfully try and grip a knife that is about to end it's life."
p4869
aS'Actually, it is quite apparent that you do not. For one glaring example, below you incorrectly state that a dinosaur fossil has been dated by C-14. Another example of you lack of understanding of the topic is your failure to understand why very old fossils are found on the surface and the principles of dating from geologic strata.'
p4870
aS"So you'd ask on these issues even if you didn't know if they had signed it?"
p4871
aS"Don't get your panties in a wad, 38 State Attorney Generals signed a brief in opposition to any gun control this clown can dream up."
p4872
aS'That should get the natives milling around looking for victims. Fundamentalist Christianity does not take kindly to criticism.'
p4873
aS"This rates an 8 out of 10 on the hypocracy scale. Weren't you just scolding people both for using false analogies and for citing emotionally laden imagery for political purposes? Tsk tsk."
p4874
aS'who knew? I wonder if I could have passed all those philosophy tests based on the philosophy I absorbed?  '
p4875
aS'What exactly are the age ranges of these "children" in the news stories?'
p4876
aS"Hey that would be great. The law would FORCE all anti-gunners of military service age and ability to own a fully automatic rifle. The law would FORCE all anti-gunners to train with the weapon. The law would FORCE VOR to keep his rifle clean. Hey VOR how about it? Keep your rifle clean or go to jail. I'm not talking about my rifle, I'll be glad to keep my free government rifle clean. How about you?"
p4877
aS"There is the potential for a human that comes out of many, crude and vulgar things. Some end up on a maxi pad or when a guy reaches for the box of Kleenex. Should I feel a special bond with the conceptions rudely flushed out because they couldn't make it to the uterine wall? They had the potential, the DNA, were once a life too, and made a valiant effort. Life is constantly in motion. We don't value all life, or maybe not all life the same. When it appears to have some aspects of human personhood, this would seem like a logical marker, where we'd place greater value."
p4878
aS'And I just spent all that money on a new camera. Pity.'
p4879
aS"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO just because I stated that some presidents....cough.... Clinton.......don't get experience in one term doesn't"
p4880
aS"That's a Damascene conversion if ever there was one! Archie's seen the light!"
p4881
aS"This should be in the science section, not the CvE section. Don't give SS any more reason to believe that the big bang is part of biology."
p4882
aS'yea you\'ve rebuttled every one of my posts with rhetoric. How do you explain how The Computational and Analytical Molecular Evolution Laboratory is calling for a new synthesis based on "biased" mutations??????   let\'s hear it.'
p4883
aS"oh, it's obvious that non-darwinists have no affect on you guys. Nothing will ever change your mind because your mind is not made up on the evidence...it's made up on your worldview and your belief in materialism."
p4884
aS'So, am I looking for attention or am I mentally ill?'
p4885
aS'you told me in an earlier post that the mother should die, even if they predict the fetus will kill the mother. your bible states otherwise.'
p4886
aS"When 90 percent of this forum is left wing out of work Liberals it is not a surprise that polls don't go the Conservative way........."
p4887
aS"Since you seem to know Jebus so well why don't you ask him to make an appearance and tell all of us heathens the error of our ways.. Why not let Jebus tell the world what he thinks about Homosexuals ... Oh wait.. Jebus never mentioned the subject so this is just YOU and YOUR ilk spreading more homophobic paranoia ...   You've reached a new Low EZridden.. and I never thought you could get any lower ...emoticonXBounceremoticonXBouncer"
p4888
aS"I have never, and will never stand for reasonable gin control laws. After all, I hate vodka martini's."
p4889
aS'Actually, it makes sense only to you. If you look at nature for just a little while, you willl become aware of a great deal of death. But it is mostly very economical since scavengers make sure that there is minimal waste.'
p4890
aS"Are you blind, or can't you read? NATO just provided evidence right now.  "
p4891
aS"You resort to the Bible, just in whatever way is convenient to what you want it to say. Just like fundies do. Zardoz, the problem is that when you play devil's advocate (which you like to do), you ONLY take a fundie approach toward the scriptures. In fact, you're often more fundamentalist in the way you approach scripture than fundamentalists. You'd make a good fundie, the best of them, I suppose."
p4892
aS"So you think that ID is actually Christanity?   [quote]But in usual fashion you will claim it is me who doesn't understand when it is you who must corrupt the truth with the lies and distortions you tell."
p4893
aS'Funny. Foreigners are always cited when liberals talk about how great gun control is and how much good can come from it.'
p4894
aS'Dear Hypocrite,  Do you wish to be a competent poster and actually respond to questions and requests? If so, please answer my request (on the other thread) and I will be happy to answer your questions.'
p4895
aS"While I'm not going to consider Dr. Tiller a pillar of society, I'm certainly not going to condone his murder."
p4896
aS"Isn't agreeing with what? The senate hasn't passed any laws that would restrict right to carry anymore than it already is."
p4897
aS"If you feed me a lot of caffinated coffee i start to wiggle and squirm too. I'm not really in any pain."
p4898
aS'So you feel that Mrs Vo should have been allowed to run the risk of dying?      Your statement "An abortion never has to be done" only holds true if you place the value of the unborn child over that of the mother in all cases. Do you really believe that?'
p4899
aS'Really? I suspect that you have been duped by creationist ministers. There is no hype about Miller/Urey. It was an interesting experiment that demonstrated possibilities.'
p4900
aS"Actually, I don't have any respect for creationism in most of it's varied forms. I have had great respect for several individual creationists that I have met. But they earned that respect."
p4901
aS'You know, this little phrase, "minutes before birth," keeps popping up in reference to abortion.Could someone please explain to me the point of having an abortion "minutes before birth"? What is the point?How many, if any, of this sort of abortion is performed?Could I get a really honest answer to that? Please, no lies.How many?Can anyone tell me?'
p4902
aS"I don't know if we can be as accurate as a couple of million years, but I agree that the age of the earth is just right for supporting man."
p4903
aS"uh, yeah, that was their intent! Under color of law no less. The truth always seems to be your worst enemy doesn't it?"
p4904
aS"And if God was so against killing the unborn, why did he fail to make an exception for the pregnant women? If you alleged that the Biblical God is totally against killing the unborn, why did he tell him to kill all of the non-virgin women?I bet you won't answer the question and just rely on insults as an attempt to cover up your argumentative failures as you always do. See my signature for examples. "
p4905
aS"It has a chance. Any scientist has the opportunity to study ID. We are discussing the science classroom. We already teach it as a hypothesis in most schools. But it simply should not be taught as a valid alternative to evolution. That's what this debate is over."
p4906
aS"Actually, I've heard it all before and it is wrong. The article is full of misinformation and misrepresentation. It is, as you say, slanted rather than an honest report of the data."
p4907
aS'No, but in some cultures they mutilate them for meaningless tradition.'
p4908
aS"No, genesis is not a history lesson. It is a combination of 'just so' stories, and a religious message in allegory format. If you bothered to learn understand some of the hebrew puns behind many of the words, and also see the political commentary of events that were happening during the time it was written, that would be obvious."
p4909
aS"Not at all, more stories that have been fed to you. The notion of a literal Genesis was rejected two hundred years ago, when no evidence of it could be found. the leading scientists of the day were often also trained in divinity, so they were looking HARD for it. But they had the integrity to admit that it wasn't there."
p4910
aS'And Stephen Hawking, the only thing he has said was "I do not believe in a personal god", which would make him a pantheist or deist at best.'
p4911
aS'Your use of the word "replace" reveals your ignorance of evolution.'
p4912
aS'One reason for conversion is that they do practice many religions. Jesus said He is the only way to God. I believe that, so how can I just turn a blind eye when people follow so many different religions? I would not be following the commands of my Lord.'
p4913
aS'And how have I deprived you of your right to teach your religion to your children in your home and in your church. How does an objection against the imposition of your religion by force of the government deprive you of your rights. I can certainly see how the imposition of your religion would deprive me of my right to the free exercise of my own religion, but why do you feel that you have a right to impose your religion on me?'
p4914
aS"Except that the word for day in Genesis 1 is 'yom' and was understood to be a twenty-four hour day."
p4915
aS'The human collective is the authority. One major advantage of this authority over a theistic one is that it actually exists.'
p4916
aS"That's the standard dance. Victor Stenger didn't say it that way. On the back of his book, one review puts it this way;"
p4917
aS'Ah, but the issue in this thread is what the fetus really means to anti-choicers/anti-lifers.'
p4918
aS"No I'm not Kronus. I haven't made excuses for him or denied what he did. OP said he is a conservative Christian which is a lie and I'm exposing that lie for what it is. Unless she can prove he is anything more than a conservative secular Republican, then he is no more a morally responsible person than an atheistic democrat. To attempt to mark all fundamental christians with the actions of this guy because he's a republican is a truly fallacious argument and a slanderous lie regarding me and all believers. None of this excuses what Vitter himself is responsible for doing. But she is wrong for immorally attempting to paint us all as adulterers because of his sin."
p4919
aS'Actually, this data point is perfectly meaningless.NONE of the other information (or the conclusions) presented in this talk require "26".If we made it 260, does it change ANY of the other conclusions? No.A failure to recognize non-sequitur data tidbits is usually indicative of an argument that includes other errors.'
p4920
aS'Very true, especially since when someone asks "is there a God" they are most likely really asking "does the God in which I believe exist"'
p4921
aS'Marriage is not a religious institution. It is a government contract nothing more. Many people choose to have a religious ceremony to celebrate their marriage but that doesnt make it a religious institution. Need proof? You can get married without the permission of the church but you cant get married without the permission of the government. And because marriage is a government institution then they cannot discriminate against same sex couples and must provide the same benefits to them as is provided to straight couples. And it cannot be a separate institution either because separate is not equal.   But as I have already said this shouldnt be up for a vote. Civil rights never should be.'
p4922
aS"See my post above, Hi. marc ignores fundamentals of Miller's beliefs that he clearly spells out in trying to push his anti-Miller argument."
p4923
aS'WF, that is true and if the young lady life is endangered then to terminate the pregnancy would be appropriate but get a neutral doctor to make that decision, not one from Planned Parenthood or and abortion clinic who have a biased interest in performing abortions...............That is all I ask...........'
p4924
aS'I think the energy( essence of the human life) always was'
p4925
aS"Then why doesn't He answer prayers like He says He will in the Bible?   So is Jesus, aka God, a liar?   Or was not even one of the millions of believers who prayed for Terri Schiavo's life to be saved really God's child? Gee, I wonder how many people out there are being led by a pastor, priest, or what have you, that prayed but God didn't listen because that religious leader is a fraud? Hmmm, maybe the rape or molestation of young boys, adulty, and so on, by religious leaders is more widespread than anyone could have imagined?!?!?!"
p4926
aS"Again, nonrandom is not the same as Lamarckian. Phenotypic variation can be nonrandom because the organisms can select the most attractive/successful mates with whom to breed. Once again, you're totally stuck on one aspect of the ToE, random mutation; the ToE is much more than that."
p4927
aS"But recognition of the big bang as a very good explanation of cosmology isn't limited to evolutionsits. In fact, most other scientists also believe so, most especially cosmologists and astrophysicists, who are directly concerned with the early universe. Evolutionists, even though the origin of matter and time are irrelevant to the study of evolution, are also educated in science and probably accept the work done by these other scientists."
p4928
aS"Because it's a blatantly obvious fact of nature and intellectually honest experts in the field accept it."
p4929
aS"oh don't kid yourself, you people were miserable long before I got here. Darwinists' arrogance is astounding."
p4930
aS"No it doesn't!It cost way more money in appeals than it does to excute someone. WE the taxpayers pay for legal represenatation for them and us, plus the cost of keeping them in jail. The appelas process alone costs the tax payers millions.It is far more expensive to kill them than to leave them in jail with no chance of parole."
p4931
aS'Actually, according to your use of the word "person," she is. A significant percentage of fertilized eggs fail to implant and are instead passed. How sad (and typical) that you haven\'t bothered to educate yourself about these things.'
p4932
aS'Who is to say that the guys teaching the geology know what they are teaching?'
p4933
aS"I don't believe Hell is a place either (or even if I believe in hell to begin with), but tell me more about what you mean by this. It sounds interesting."
p4934
aS"Exactly. Most people would incorporate it, from childhood most often. Steeeeve can't seem to wrap his mind around that."
p4935
aS"There is a point, however, that the fetal lung is not mature enough to survive outside the womb even with mechanical assistance. So, unless our technology will be pretty radically different in the future, it isn't about getting it out, it's about it not surviving when it is out."
p4936
aS'lets see im going to ask you some questions.are you ?are you a ? do you have blue eyes? do you have brown eyes? now if you say NO to one of those things isnt that cosidered an answer? where i come from its yes or no.2 possible answers. not just yes every time to get what you want.'
p4937
aS'Right. It was thrown out of schools back in the 1960s, and again in the 1980s when attempts were made to dress creationism up in the jargon of science and call it "Creation science."'
p4938
aS"Which, we suppose, in your mind releases the sperm donor of any responsibility whatsoever, right?Isn't it interesting that your solution for the abortion issue demands that women deny their sexuality while permitting men to run the gamut of theirs.Does this attitude, of which you are not the only proponent, stem from a hatred or a fear of women?"
p4939
aS'Well, let\'s be honest here. People fear gay marriage, not that it might come about via judicial fiat. That\'s just the current whipping horse because that\'s how it happened first, for some broad values of judicial fiat of course. There was a recent post here about rights granted gays by their state legislature, Oregon I think, and a group jumped in and forced the law on hold via a petition drive. So it really isn\'t the means by which gays get equality that upsets some folks, it\'s the equality itself. "judicial fiat" is just a phrase people can use so they can avoid stating their true motives, preventing gays from being treated as equals.'
p4940
aS'Indeed. And that fact makes the old creationist plum about how evolutionary theory is dogmatic or that evolutionary biologists aren\'t allowed to disagree with "standard" theory a laugh. Clearly, evolutionary biologists disagree and those disagreements are published openly. Science makes progress by questioning and disagreement.'
p4941
aS'SNIPThis opinion piece was put forth by the Violence Policy Center, the same people who opposed all forms of firearms safety training and gun locks, because they might encourage people to feel that they\'re more capable of safely operation a firearm. The Violence Policy Center also pushed the idea of an "assault weapons ban" because it was easier than a handgun ban, claiming that the uneducated people are unable to tell what is a machine gun and what isn\'t a machine gun, making passage of such a law all the easier.'
p4942
aS'Yes, T. Kennedy is the alias of a known terrorist, and Ted Kennedy got punished because of it. And many are advocating that such a system be used to deny Second Amendment rights and be used to try innocent people in a court of law.'
p4943
aS"If a square is opposite to a circle (and it isn't, by the way), then gas/liquid/solid must be opposites therefore you contain opposites (by your own argument), in that you contain elements that are in these 'opposite' states. It's an argument I raised before, you said they weren't opposites, now you cite non-opposites! Why do you keep refuting previous arguments they YOU have made?"
p4944
aS'Yea the legalizatioin of drugs would cause an epedimic of problems. Crime, suicide, mental health problems, and physical health problems.'
p4945
aS"Well, you didn't have my experiences, now did you? Each woman who has an abortion coul have innumerous circumstances and experiences."
p4946
aS"Just so you know Peach, the 167 death row inmates are now serving life in prison. At least that one who's not guilty might now have a chance to be free."
p4947
aS'But the number of criminals that have firearms can be reduced. In developed nations that have very strict gun laws there are a lot less criminals obtaining and using guns to commit crimes. How does your theory explain that?'
p4948
aS'I never said anything about a conspiracy Peeling. I very clearly gave valid reasons to Consider that scientific GRANTS and pay increases for these scientists are based on making new and previously undiscovered claims that forward the science. That is the greatest motivation to lie, cheat, create and falsify evidence which adds to the scientists personal wealth and further promotes a false science that is rife with selfish motivations to preserve, protect and promote it.'
p4949
aS"'IF' is the question. It suggests that Holy Tradition does not know the answer.   Secondly, the issue of the flood itself could still be true and tested scientifically... as to whether an historical Noah existed that you might consign to 'myth'.   Does anyone here not find it interesting that there is almost a universal factor in societies concerning a global flood?   PS I have already discussed M-Eve on another post."
p4950
aS"You are incorrect when it comes to the age of the earth. All inidciation by all branches of science indicate an earth that is over 3 billion years old. (aside from the lies of the Young earth creationism. Each and every one of those 'indications' are based on misunderstandings and out right lies aboutscience. A discussion about the various methods (and where the YEC claims go wrong can be found at http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html"
p4951
aS"I am hardly a phyicist, but I am under the impression that there is at least some people who feel there is reason that there are 'uncaused causes'. I think thatthe terms used are 'Vacuum flucuations', and 'virtual particles'. I am not awareof any peer reviewed articles on it , but a popular press book is 'Achilles in the quantum world' by Richard Morris."
p4952
aS"What the father wants is ultimately irrelevent.It's the woman's body that carries the fetus. It ultimately the woman's decision. As wrong as that may seem to you, it is the reality.If we, as a society, would just address the issue of unwanted pregnancies, then we, as a society, will resolve the isse of abortion."
p4953
aS"No. you're not making any sense. Where is symbiote? I got a horrible argument for him to dispell."
p4954
aS"Why so many claims in opposition? I make a single claim, that can be refuted through logic, if it's fallacy. But the claim is correct.This new claim is an interesting one that I have seen others use. I'll tell you on what basis. Based on reason. To hold that nothing can be known for certain, is ultimately reduced to absurd unintelligble nonsense. I'll start a thread about this claim, it's a hot topic to be sure!"
p4955
aS"Actually, qualified biologists know no such thing. In fact, I've never known one who would agree with that assertion. Can you give us some peer reviewed references to support your assertion?"
p4956
aS'So parthenegenic births are always female. Where did the X chromosome come from? Is this another case of "POOF, it was a miracle" when faced with reality?'
p4957
aS'Very well said, but remember, Evolution doesnt mean atheism, but creationism means religion. I know Christians that believe in evolution, but i dont know atheists that believe in creationism.'
p4958
aS'I fail to see where I broke any of those rules, no names were called, there was no labeling, there was no none of it. And even if there was, you do it all the time, so what makes you any different. Practice what you preach Penfold.'
p4959
aS"Those cultures that permit multiple wives at least do have issues as a result, but hard to say they fail miserably. We are complex animals and not all animals mate for life. There is significantly more involved in the lifelong union of humans than reproduction. Multi-marry under the right circumstances works, but it isn't for everybody and even for those that it is for doesn't mean it's for them always. In a nutshell marriage is the biggest commitment any person will make and should be given the consideration and thought it deserves. Same sex marriage can cause a perfect union of two people the same as M/F and can make a mockery or marriage just as many M/F unions currently do. The emotional investment is the same, the responsibility and obligations are the same, the only difference is genitalia and a little more hair in some cases."
p4960
aS'I see what she was saying now. When she said it it sounded like the man had no opinion at all.'
p4961
aS'No kidding. What could POSSIBLY be more concrete? As far as I can tell, she has never publicly made a statement specifically about the DC gun ban but since, as you pointed out, she DID say that no functioning democracy should allow private ownership of guns, I have trouble believing that she thinks the private citizens of DC should be allowed to own guns, UNLESS what she is saying is that since we own guns, we should move toward a monarchy or perhapse some kind of dictatorship. She did not, as far as I know, voice her opinion regarding private gun ownership in a totalitarian system.'
p4962
aS'And it doesn\'t stop there. Another of my favorites is how they loudly criticize radiometric dating (most commonly radiocarbon dating because they know no other kind) then shout from the rooftops that radiometric dating confirms the "genuineness" of ~2000 year old manuscripts...'
p4963
aS"The 'teachings' either have no substance, or are certainly not original. Demonstrate categorically just who is the Son of God, and why this figure commands worship and obeisance."
p4964
aS"So we don't? I thought we had the capacity to destroy it. That seems within the range of control eh?"
p4965
aS"Actually, the process of fossilisation is not slow and can be done relatively quickly. All what you need is for sediments to quickly cover a dead (or an alive body - as what would have happened to Noah's Flood) and hence, fossilsation can occur rapidly; evolutionarly speaking, fossils take millions of years to fossilise a bone, but unless the bone is covered by sediments quickly, the bone will never fossilise. "
p4966
aS'I hope I have already begun to change your mind.'
p4967
aS"So what? If somebody wants to die then they'll kill themselves no matter what."
p4968
aS'Right. Please, reread your argument. Not to mention what Woodward actually said about Piltdown man. www.talkorigins.org'
p4969
aS'This is why the title is "God exists!!! (but he\'s not who you think he is). It\'s a funny proof which I don\'t think Christians would agree this definition was God. But basically it\'s saying that take the set of all human beings. Call the greatest God. God exists.Not only that, but the final conclusion is one of the premises. The proof is one big circle :)'
p4970
aS'That sounds like an honest answer. How did you feel about it at the time? How do you feel about it now? Just trying to educate myself more.   Huck'
p4971
aS'No, neither am I suggesting that illegality makes something immoral. Legality and morality are completely separate things.'
p4972
aS"Well then it sounds like you don't even know what a SM is seeing as the 3rd one is the main one that people like you bring up when debating this isse."
p4973
aS'Abortion is their best choice?????? Yet women deserve better? Why do you think abortion is their best choice?'
p4974
aS"The same ones you've been told about, what, a few dozen times now? :)A small exerpt:"
p4975
aS"We share a border with Mexico. The drug cartel is armed with missile and grenade launchers. But when was the last time 72 of our police officers were murdered on American soil, in a single day, at a single location?   The countries with the greatest number of legal gun ownership, they're absent these mass killings that take place on a regular basis. There's no rebels in America killing entire cities worth of people without opposition; not even in the small towns that're without a local police force.   Explain that one away."
p4976
aS'Over 10,000 signatures of Christian Clergy have been collected, and have endorsed this letter.'
p4977
aS'How do you know he was a gun owner? Maybe he borrowed it. ;)And I bet he was a carnivore, walked upright and drove a car, as well.'
p4978
aS"This isn't discrimination because the adult once did have have the right to live in a womb until it could live otherwise. Once out of the womb and living on his/her own this right has been exhausted because there is no need to be living in the womb. Much like you can drive but this 'right' is exhausted when you are drunk or too old to see anything."
p4979
aS'True. Gallup couches the questions in a way that favors spiritualism. That is his preference and I think that his polls are slanted that way. I don\'t think I have ever seen a poll that actually asked the question directly and "no religion" doesn\'t really ask it. The numbers are just guesses. I think Big Orn is correct 7 to 10% is probably a bit low.'
p4980
aS'I know this would be somewhat of a drain on your time but I think it would be helpful if you would make a short post at the end of each post stating how much time the next poster has, what post number this is, how many are left, any comments concerning going outside the rules, etc.'
p4981
aS"Why are you dishonest enough to claim that you aren't trying to get YEC into the schools."
p4982
aS'deliberate acts of fabrication to produce false and fradulent claims as to what others have said. You cited my posts which did not imply anything of the sort you claimed it did and what I thought. In fact, some of the cited refute such claims.'
p4983
aS'There is some truth here. Did you ever see "Independence Day"? They were taking pot-shots at the alien ships when they first arrived. It didn\'t stop the aliens... sure only a film... let\'s look at real life...modern - Iraq - Sadaam gave guns out to the people just before Gulf War IInot so modern - Boer War - Dutch farmers in South Africa were all excellent marksmen - Britain still invaded.US Civil War - I believe that the Confederate States were pretty well armed as far as the white citizens were concerned. US still invaded.'
p4984
aS"She could, but not all do :) Despite the fact that it works, there are still unwanted pregnancies :) That doesn't change the fact that a pregnancy would not be pleasant to a woman who does not want to be pregnant :)Forcing pregnancy by law is a step toward fascism."
p4985
aS"Because of the history of it. Well, ID is actually identical to 'scientific creationism', but spruced up with more scientific terminology to attempt to pass 'seperation of church and state'. Let's just say that I.D. is an attempt to teach Creationism in school."
p4986
aS'And if the "natural process of evolution" is determined by humans in a university lab, many with an atheist worldview, that clash with something the Bible says, you and Kenneth Miller immediately toss the Bible out and accept what the humans say - no questions asked?'
p4987
aS"I think you might want to check your logic here... As far as I am aware, drug addicts cause a great deal of crime to support their habit. As you are, I am not terribly fond of policing someone's personal habits, but when drugs are the motivating force behind burglaries, assaults and muggings and addicts carry diseases such AIDS and tuberculosis then means of curtailing this should be explored. This may include policing or controlling the supply of drugs to an area to cut down and the amount of drugs sold, and thus less crime to support fewer habits.Easy access to drugs is, logically, part of the problem."
p4988
aS"And how would Bush look if his own people hated him so much that they revolted? That would be very bad publicity, and quite an embarrassment that I wouldn't want as a country leader."
p4989
aS"The logic we use to make statements about reality is derived from the way we observe material things behaving, and that logic is not immutable. Quantum physics demonstrates the fundamentally uncertain nature of reality at very tiny scales: the 'law of excluded middle' in particular taking it firmly in the shorts. Given that logic can vary on such a simple metric as physical scale, your argument is starting to look more than a bit frayed at the edges :)"
p4990
aS'So,in your opinion,are you saying that this invading force that you are talking about,would never bat an eye as to whether the people of the USA are armed to the teeth or not in their pre-war planning?Surely any country that tried to overtake the USA would suffer severe damage to its military in all aspects.And even if it succeeded,it would still have to deal with our armed citizens.Are you trying to tell me that this is not a ditterent?Sure,if you dream up some DARTH VADER size invasion,no one stands a chance.But if you put it real world perspective.Say,2 or 3 of the bigger countries got together and decided to over take the USA.I would assume "armed citizens" would be a major factor in deciding whether to invade or not.'
p4991
aS"Really? I don't think you know what you are talking about. Please provide evidence to back your claim. Thanks."
p4992
aS"So was I. I did say I was playing devil's advocate. As far as I'm concerned, Tiktaalik is a triumph of scientific deduction."
p4993
aS'No. Unless you wish to actually undertake the study of the relevant science, that\'s what you need to do. Creationists do the same thing. the problem is that creationists tend to accept the word of those who aren\'t any more educated than they are. Thus, a creationist will accept Hovind\'s dust on the moon argument or his shrinking sun argument as "proof" of a young earth.'
p4994
aS"As I mentioned above, science curriculums follow paths. One's worldview plays heavily on one's interpretation of scientific data. An agnostic, or atheist teaching establishment can become satisfied with one path of scientific theories without searching for others. There may be more to be discovered about thermodynamics, cell structure, irreducible complexity, the decay rate of the earth's magnetic field, radiometric dating, the fossil record, and countless other things that a teaching establishment may not be interested in exploring, if it's comfortable with it's interpretation of current data's indications that the happenstance origins worldview is correct. It goes back to what we touched on before - teaching students HOW to think, not WHAT to think."
p4995
aS'Here\'s a question; which one split from the other? Which one is the "new" being? None of them are. If I get a cake and slice into two exact pieces, which one is the "new" slice? They are both equally new.'
p4996
aS"That seems unlikely. He gets banned everywhere he goes with his multiple names. He's not very good at hiding his identity and not very good at controlling his temper when dealing with the sort of creation believing XXXXXX that you get frequenting these boards (I can't say I blame him on the latter point).Look around the web though and you will find him elsewhere..."
p4997
aS'As an aside I do admire your way with words, bravo!'
p4998
aS'Yes that is a problem. But there is an instance when the 2nd Amendment did protect the USA from invaders:"Someone at the table asked a Japanese admiral why, with the Pacific Fleet devastated at Pearl Harbor and the mainland US forces in what Japan had to know was a pathetic state of unreadiness, Japan had not simply invaded the West Coast" - http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/ayoob70.htmlIf it wasn\'t for the 2nd Amendment you would be speaking Japanese if you live on the West coast, German if you live on the East coast.'
p4999
aS'Sure. The outcome of Heller vs DC and Florida Shall - Issue laws support that statement. According to Brady logic, the more helpless you are, the safer you are from criminals.'
p5000
aS"Actually, at 24 weeks is when the the interconnection of the fetal brain begins. The nerve cells from the neocortex begin to synapse with the nerve cells of the thalamus. It is at this point that bursts of recognizable brain waves start to appear among the random signals that go on before. It is at this point that some scientists believe a fetus can feel pain as well.It is also at this point that a fetus can possibly survive outside of the womb (23-24 weeks), though the cance of survival is low and the risk of impairment very serious. This point probably won't change with technology either because the fetal lung is not mature enough until this point for even mechanical-assisted breathing."
p5001
aS'And yet there are plenty of websites written by scientists with the details:'
p5002
aS"What is a 'higher' species. If you mean a more intelligent primate?? The concept there is a hierarchy of 'higher' and 'lower' species is incorrect. Theonly difference between man and the other primates is that man has a hyperdeveloped brain. There are two sugars that are naturally produced by body by most mammals. When investingating the presnece of these chemicals, one of them is present in much lower concentrations in the brainsof all mammals. However, humans have a mutation that interrupted the production of this chemical. A piece of random junk got inserted into the middle of the gene that produces this chemical,and disabled it. Sometimes,evolution is not so much about what is added, but what is removed."
p5003
aS'maybe firstly you should explain how god works? In what way does he manupilate matter in defience of the laws of physics, where does he dwell, how can we not observe such a being? And all the other questions of the supernatural. The theory of a god is actually a lot, lot more complicated than evolution as you have to explain *how* God works to get even basic science points.'
p5004
aS"Throw off our conclusions about what? I'm getting a bit confused as to what you're trying to cast doubt upon.Dark matter is stuff that doesn't interact via the electromagnetic force, so again by definition anything that we can't 'see' using EM waves is dark matter. this is an interesting article about one way we can observe it indirectly"
p5005
aS'I see the similarity with the original scripture, in which Jesus was recognizing the authority of both God and Caesar in the world. However, Jesus was talking about the political power in the world. Jesus called the academics of his day, vipers and hypocrits, because they pretended to be holy but were evil. He called the wisest of men fools, because they did not believe in God. Also, as I stated before, truth should be the ultimate goal. I do not fear science. I do not see any truth that science may happen to reveal as a threat to faith. Why? Because God is Truth. Jesus said, "And the truth shall set you free"!!! '
p5006
aS"It's not just cars and catalytic converters have greatly decreased emissions."
p5007
aS"So, IOW, you are saying that those of us who are intelligent enough to realize that your non existent imaginary god doesn't exist have a chemical imbalance? Wow, that's quite a stretch even for you Archie baby."
p5008
aS'Ill be the first to agree with the saying "If you can...and have the place to...you will" But like anything else..you have to look at the better side of things...It would act like a deterant to allow our responsable citizens to be armed..yes perhaps what you said might take place..but the benefits would outway them..and thats all we can ask for in life.As for our irresponsable citizens...they are already armed.'
p5009
aS'Your wrong. Airplanes and courthouses are gun free zones but these places never have massacres.'
p5010
aS'Sure, but then you get into all sorts of problems of classifications, slippery slopes, and other awkward messes. Arguing whether an embryo or a fetus is a person seems to raise more trouble than it might solve. It seems better to err on the side of caution and devise a pro-choice argument that assumes the embryo or fetus to be a person rather than worry whether they are a person.'
p5011
aS"This is a separate issue, Voice of Reason. Some didn't understand how pro-choice people can say they personally wouldn't do something and/or think something is wrong but still support other's right to do it, and that's what I was answering."
p5012
aS'Tell this to those infants and adults in the netherlands who are being euthanized against their will. this is a logical conclusion of a quality of life ethic without a sanctity of life basis.'
p5013
aS"I think there are two separate questions here.(1) When does personhood begin?(2) Who gets to make such arbitrary, moral decisions on behalf of a pregnant woman?Both are legitimate issues of contention. You can't just dismiss the one you don't want to argue as unimportant. There are lots of excellent arguments going every which way, and many of them are objectively unresolvable, such as the one pertaining to the onset of personhood. They are truly matters of opinion.So, since there is obviously little agreement between people about when an egg and sperm become a person with full human rights, the practical question really is whose opinion matters most? The woman's, or the faceless bureaucrat's? emoticonXGood"
p5014
aS"Kent Hovind is a slimy, uneducated, hack. His only education past high school is a degree from an unaccredited bible school. He is also a liar, since I just can't believe that anyone could be so stupid to say some of the things that he does. Of course, there are other people that are so stupid that they actually believe him."
p5015
aS"And if you rewind a little over 40 years, the exact same thing could be said about interracial marriage.Archie's reply is a non-argument, and false at that.Multiple other groups state discrimination in marriage, but there are LEGITIMATE STATE INTERESTS prohibiting their marriage.Little things like child rape, lack of consent, and other issues."
p5016
aS"It's quite obvious that it's the ID proponents who have issues with definitions, particularly among themselves. Behe has changed his own definition of IC, and Dembski changed Behe's definition of IC."
p5017
aS"I'm not surprised.   That's a typical response when someone calls your bluff.   Waxy"
p5018
aS"Because their axiom is that the bible is infallible, so any problems with reading it are the reader's fault, whereas yours is that contradiction implies error. What Ken's saying is that we can't draw a distinction between your axioms and those of a bible literalist in terms of which is 'right', because axioms are stated not proved: axioms define what is 'right'.To reiterate: his error is in forgetting that the universe operates according to its own axioms, whatever they may be, and we can judge whether or not our axioms are congruent."
p5019
aS"But you haven't looked. You may claim that your god did it, and no evidence to support or deny that can be offered. The assertion relies on miracle and has no suporting evidence. But when you start talking about how your god did it, your claims can be debunked by facts. Certainly the mythology of ancient nomadic herdsmen is not accurate. If you look at the world and the history of the world the is evident in the geologic strata, then you can see that the earth is very old, and you can see a succession of organisms through time. When considered with other fields of science from genetics to biogeography to physiology and anatomy, evolution becomes apparent."
p5020
aS"Nobody should be forced to even have a sonagram. I think that you'll find reasonable pro-life and pro-abortion people believe that much."
p5021
aS'What basis do fundamental rights derive from? In other words, how can we tell whether something is a fundamental human right?'
p5022
aS'Now you\'re playing word games to confuse people. Page 11 of the Heller ruling stated that the definition of "arms" include all modern forms of bearable arms that\'re in common use. They didn\'t rule on machineguns because they weren\'t part of the case.'
p5023
aS'Well, I don\'t believe in evolution. I believe in things for which I have no evidence. And while it is true that everyone has bias, using correct science and the process of peer review works to eliminate. Not all is perfect, and people are people, but overall the system works. Not a lot of bad science gets through. In the case of "creation science" we know that there is no science involved. Only talk that sounds scientific. There is no hypothesis, prediction or testing. Only ad hoc stories constructed of selected bits of evidence to support the foregone conclusion.'
p5024
aS'**True, and the confusion was my bad, as explained already. However, the fact of revertant mutation in eusocial bacteria colonies, as demonstrated by Ames and by Cairns, still shoots great big holes in the darwinist assumptions arising out of your old war-horses, Luria & Delbruck \'43, and its "clone", Lederberg and Lederberg \'52.'
p5025
aS'I believe you have even debated that it is conditioned into humans to be religious and therefore it validates religions. So why is there a need to debate whether animals love if they are acting on a conditioned response?'
p5026
aS"And yet you can offer nothing to show it's impossible! It most certainly is a plausible explaination! Fairytale?!? Don't think so, a logical path for the developement of the avian lung."
p5027
aS'I see, when you say "I\'m not an expert" do you mean you aren\'t a climate scientist or do you mean you don\'t have the scientific knowledge to discuss this?'
p5028
aS'That\'s NOT the equivalent of ID - you\'re mixing causes & effects. The theory of evolution, and the theory of intelligent design would equally observe, measure, and publish the effects of the apple falling. Then the evolutionists would say that happenstance origins caused gravity to work that way, and ID proponents would say that a supernatural design caused gravity to work that way. Students shouldn\'t have it implied to them that happenstance origins are the only possible cause of gravitational behavior. Your "apple falling" scenario is a simple one - the original cause of gravity has practically no impact on how we observe and deal with it\'s effects. Other scientific subjects aren\'t that simple. '
p5029
aS'And you\'ve been failing miserably, partly because your definition of "atheism" is asinine. Even most Christians would disagree with you.'
p5030
aS"The concept that science no longer looks at animals boggles my mind. My brother is a wildlife biology major in college meaning his primary focus is......looking at animals and their relationships to one another. It is somewhat understandable that your misconception could arise because molecular biology and genetic engineering are the latest crazes in science. The simple fact is most of the big breakthroughs when studying whole animals have been made. A similar turn has occured in chemistry. I could argue that chemists have subtly turned away from chemical reactions. All the research now is about electron orbitals and nano-structures. The reason for this is these are new fields that are relatively young and many scientists are interested in them. I myself am doing research on buckminster fullerenes. It doesn't mean we've abandoned good old fashioned reactions, we just have more field to play in now."
p5031
aS'Really? Why? Bacteria don\'t need to see to exist. They don\'t depend on light to live. In fact, bacteria thrive in dark, moist areas. Why would natural selection determine this ability as being advantageous? If populations of bacteria with the ability to sense light are "better suited" than other bacteria, how many different types of light-sensing bacteria are there? '
p5032
aS"I know it's almost as silly as thinking gay marriage will undermine heterosexual marriage."
p5033
aS'my my you are up on the current events. Thanks for shedding light on this for everyone here.'
p5034
aS"Here is what fascinates me about the judgmental criticism you offer of my opinion. In typical fashion you make claims which you don't support at all. Here is my post below, point out WITH EVIDENCE!!! what I am distorting in any way; especially that which I hold dear. In other words, write a cogent and rational post which makes sense when applied to the quoted post it intends to attack. emoticonXDonno"
p5035
aS"Really Brady. It is widely recognized that Mr. Heston gave away a very promising film career in order to take such an unpopular stand at that time. In fact he worked very little in films after that. I think the above statement was a political one, an anti-gun one, without much fact to back it up.I don't think a man of such principle changes his mind when all he actually work to accomplish comes to pass. But you can push your poison just as far as you want to. You have a first Amendment right to do so. Mr. Heston would have wanted it that way!"
p5036
aS'Actually, there is no such thing as "an evolutionary mutation of a gene." A mutation is a mutation. For evolution to have occurred requires neither that a mutation be new nor useful and they don\'t require new structures nor structures.Here\'s a little mental exercise for you. At most, a person can have only two alleles for any gene. This would have been the condition of the human race 6,000 years ago according to creationists. It would not have been possible for there to be more than 2 alleles for any given gene. Now consider that for every gene in the human genome there is an average of 14 different alleles, sometimes more, sometimes less. Where did all of those alleles come from?'
p5037
aS'But if the repeated tests just confirm the same errors or misinterpretations of the results, all of the independent reviews in the World wont make a difference.'
p5038
aS"Actually, I pulled the number out of the air for illustrative purposes only, but after reading the CBO report, I see that I wasn't far off. They predicted 600,000 gay couples would want to get married it allowed."
p5039
aS'So every woman who has an abortion lives an irresponsible life. Care to give any examples, or are you just spouting rubbish with no experience or knowledge whatsoever?'
p5040
aS'So you know how foolish you are and hope that name calling will distract from that being recognized by everyone. Erectus skulls were smaller because the brain was smaller. You brought up KNM-WT 15000 (Turkana Boy) and you weren\'t even aware that as an adult he would have been about 6\'1" tall? Why is his skull smaller than modern humans?'
p5041
aS"You could've just as easily revived the last thread, commenting on how the antis are unusually silent."
p5042
aS"Because Apes, monkeys and chimps are on different paths. You wouldn't expect a shark to evolve into a barracuda-like animal. things evolve to fill niches, we currently fill a niche, there is nothing pushing apes, chimps or other primates to fill a niche that is occupied. "
p5043
aS"But a slightly larger brain than average is still feasible and offers enough of a benefit in a large social group that its worth the price - however something the size of a modern humans brain is far too demanding. That slightly larger brain can be supported by an organism or society that hasn't developed fire, but is also able to discover the uses of it, from then on nutrician isn't the big limiting factor that restricts how big a brain can get from then on. "
p5044
aS'Well regulated as in the second amendment does not mean regulated by the government, it means well equiped and prepared. The framers of the constitution often spoke of a tyrannical government and how to keep one from coming to power, so why in the hell would they have said lets just give the government total control of guns. Your definition of well regulated makes about as much sense as adding another day to the week.'
p5045
aS'Well, since you have natural selection completely wrong, it must not go too well with the Biblical account. By the way, now you have introduced another word that has no meaning in the context. What is a "kind." Please be specific so that I will be able to recognize a "kind." Please show why a "kind" only has the ability to lose information.'
p5046
aS"And that is different how? I told johnny to write that I'm infallible. Therefore the book that I told johnny to write proves I'm infallible. There is no difference.   You do realize that there are other religions out there? That science is constantly updating?   Your arguments have been nothing more then false dichotomies assuming there are only two choices despite history laughing in your face."
p5047
aS"It's the first couple of paragraghs from the article in this weeks NS. If you had an online subscription or got a copy from your newsagent you could read the whole thing, unfortunately with this one the intro rambles on a bit and doesn't get to the point till the second column..."
p5048
aS"See above. Whether a couple is or isn't monogomous is not for you to determine or worry about. And speak for yourself if you don't mind. This member of the American public's mental health is just fine thank you very much. If gay marriage impacts YOU that much, well that sounds like your problem."
p5049
aS'Nice raising the bar. Fallacies are a creationist\'s best friend. You claimed:"have never shown to add any new structure or even a new part to any existing structure."Now you are changing your argument away from structure as new proteins and especially enzymes (which are proteins) don\'t count.'
p5050
aS'No! At conception we are a person and human.All living things belong to a species and the foetus is a living thing, for that reason a foetus must belong to a species, and that species is human.A fingernail is dead so cannot be considered a living human, nor will it develop into a human.The sperm only has half the chromosomes so is not human.The unique human is the key element here, if you cut your nail, the DNA from the nail can be replicated by the living persons nail, a foetus when destroyed cannot have itself replicated, the unique DNA that is destroyed will never be see on earth again, that individual has gone forever, howver, the man with the nail clipped is still alive.'
p5051
aS"True, they can change laws if the are unconstitutional. So what makes a ban on abortion unconstitutional?   Also, what makes the dealth penalty for minors constitutional one day and not the next? In fact 15yrs ago it wasn't an unconstitutional decision. I guess now it is??? Makes no sense.   Clive14,   those are obviously not my beliefs as I think everyone is equal.   I am not sure your wealth makes you different from someone else. It means you wealth is unequal..we are talking about just people. We all end up 6 foot under (so to speak) in the end."
p5052
aS'I think this is a bad way to put it...the evidence that they earth has been warming since we have had the ability to measure temperature is overwhelming...the cause is unknown and whether or not it is natural is unknown. It does seem fairly narasistic to think in 100 years we have caused so much damage to an earth that at least has been here 10,000 years.'
p5053
aS"Possibly, depends on what you read and by whom. Still, the war wasn't aganist slavery."
p5054
aS'Heart bypass, prostate cancer.......I have a couple of Canadian friends who needed those surgeries and one was told he had a 4 month wait and the other a 6 month wait so they both came down to Bellingham Wash and had the Surgery within 2 weeks............'
p5055
aS"I never said they would actually follow it all the time. I said that most would incorporate it (referring to a world morality). Just because they would accept it doesn't mean they would follow it. Maybe you should stop trying to tear down your little strawmen."
p5056
aS'I see your point, Iangb but I\'m not about to be leaving before you\'ve had a chance to respond. I won\'t be "leaving" at all. You challenged me to produce an argument, so I\'m going to produce my argument. I will then summarize the argument, and you can respond to it and we can then discuss / debate those specifics that you have a problem with.Truthfully, this is how I should have first responded to your challenge. Doing it piece meal has only resulted in a less focused debate.--Chuz'
p5057
aS"Yes, it is, and I'll gladly excuse his grammar compared to my zero ability in Hungarian."
p5058
aS"Because self-defence, unlike most other 'reasons', automatically allows all citizens firearm access, and in most cases allows firearm acess without mandatory training/evaluation. When this occurs, you are much more likely to get misuse of firearms.If you read around you'll see that I consider all rights as needing justification. This comes both from my stance as a relativist and as a UK citizen, where there is no formalised Constitution. Ask yourself this - if a right cannot be justified, why should it be treated as a 'right'?"
p5059
aS'people keep saying thats the law in texas,so Im saying that this is the law in New York,He broke the law so he had it coming,next time dont disrespect the law and get a license,Im just showing how some of the people on this board are major hypocrites,you suddenly get all soft on crime when you dont like the law,'
p5060
aS'But the responsibility does not end with the woman who experiences the pregnancy. If it did, then men would not be required by law to pay child support.'
p5061
aS"You lie. You keep saying the same things over and over again, that doesn't make them true. Your addiction to violence is showing.Tony Martin shot an unarmed 16 year old kid in the back as he was running away. That's not self-defence, that's cold blooded murder.It is not the role of individuals to exact revenge for crimes committed against them. You don't get to take the law into your own hands. Munir Hussain ran after the intruders and beat them up with a cricket bat in the street. That's not self-defence, that's revenge."
p5062
aS'I disagree for the same reasons I have been giving all along. There may be some legislation that was passed that has kept corporations small (Anti-trust) but did it really benefit the society?'
p5063
aS'True, but I was referring to psychological explanations, not genuine reasons.'
p5064
aS"I don't see how this is not a debate about abortion. True, it's become mildly less concrete, but that's what happens when you try to get it right."
p5065
aS'actually they probably drifted much faster than that.....probably upon a pole reversal.'
p5066
aS'Well, it seems to me that if you have a reflex it means you have an at least partially developed and functional nervous system which would tell me that you can feel pain.'
p5067
aS'If you truly believe this then I think you need to re-read your posts and put yourself in the shoes of those on the receiving end. '
p5068
aS"So, this statement is from a 'law center' that is dedicated to defend the religious freedom for CHristians. Yet, this isn't about 'religion'. Why do I find that hypocritical."
p5069
aS"You don't even take into consideration the possibility that Japan could have a higher mass murder rate- perhaps the same as the US- if guns were freely available in that country. You have a lot of explaining to do if you expect me to buy what you're trying to peddle. "
p5070
aS'Really? The transcript shows that he did not ask her anything in the Gay marriage section of the discussion.Transcript can be found here: http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/pr...al-debate.htmland here: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/...ipt/index.html (click on the same-sex benefits section and the transcript shows up right next to the video)'
p5071
aS"well yes that's what he did, but he did not try to present this as positive evidence for anything. the biomorphs were used to illustrate the point that random mutations are much more likely to produce beneficial results when the mutations are small. analogies always break down at some level, this analogy was used to illustrate a certain point. the assertion that dawkins was suggesting that a biomorph happening to look like a real life object were proof that evolution and natural selection could produce such creatures is false. montalban, to restore integrity i suggest you retract the conclusion you drew from snippets and quotes from dawkins as your paraphrasing was clearly not representative of dawkins' ideas."
p5072
aS"I think you're mixing up socialist and fascist. Patriotism is anathema to socialism."
p5073
aS'Yes, to follow his commandments to love God and to love one another.'
p5074
aS"There is a pretty huge difference.Civil unions aren't nationally recognized, for one thing, since not every state has them. If you travel to a state that does not offer civil unions, then your union is not valid there.I think there's a problem with dissolving those unions as well.The big difference, though, are the rights that these unions provide. There are over 1,000 legal protections and rights that marriage provides that civil unions don't. I'll try and find a list of differences."
p5075
aS"Pretty good considering Darwin wasn't aware of genetics. Too bad Wells is stuck in 1859. The modern synthesis provides perfectly legitimate mechanisms."
p5076
aS'HA wouldnt you say someone who is really overweight actually has more of a problem with stress on their joints, muscels, heart, and bladder than a woman carrying a small child in her womb? Obesity can demand major scarifices in behavior and diet. Some of which can be detrimental.I really dont see your point because this isnt just a woman\'s problem when it comes to these issues you pointed out.And im not really sure what a "pregnancy" is according to you.. please explain.. When i hear the word pregnant, i think of 2 people, not just 1.Also, the baby has its own blood, its own immune system, and contains its own calories once consumed. theres nothing that the mother has that the baby doesnt other than it just needs nutrtion. Just like you need food everyday.'
p5077
aS"Cases v United States, 131 F. 2d 916 (1st Cir. 1942), cert. Denied sub nom., Velazquez v. U.S, 319 U.S. 770 (1943). Basically, The US Curcuit Court upheld that the Second Amendment didn't apply to weapons that couldn't be carried by an individual."
p5078
aS'Butwhat of the fetus/babies that were wanted by daddy but not by mummy what does termination stop then?'
p5079
aS"Well I'm glad its no problem for your son. No child deserves to be harrassed."
p5080
aS"This is more of a legal question involving whether or not it was negligence(sp). If so, you can't really sue for amounts of money you MIGHT get in the future. He could sue for lost pay on the job and other medicial procedures. So ya know :). I don't really know what the question is."
p5081
aS"So you're saying that the theory of evolution is similar to ####, in that they both make large messes when they come into contact with fans?"
p5082
aS"Yes, because its THEIR decision, its THEIR stomachs, and its THEIR lives. I agree that some decisions do need to be made with parental consent, but not this one.   Irrelevant. How does purchasing a house have to do with abortion?   Ok, so what if the kid wants to have the baby and the adults want to get rid of it? What if the adults want her to have the baby and the kid wants to get rid of it? You would force the kid to have a child (that doesn't seem responsible at all), or you would force the kid to abort her child (thereby taking away her son or daughter). Both of those decisions don't sound very consitent or responsible. The decision is best left up to the person that is pregnant, regardless of their age."
p5083
aS'Actually you are incorrect. The most commonly used rifles on the competition circuit are so-called "assault weapons".The "assault weapon" moniker is a term just recently fashioned to describe a military looking weapon.There are several target competitions designed solely for these types of rifles.'
p5084
aS'Yes, the Byzantines are a Catholic Rite. The Catholic Church is divided into rites- there are seven I believe, the Roman, of course, being the largest. The Byzantine Catholics are an Eastern Catholic Rite, and as you said are almost identicle to the Orthodox Churches except that they acknowledge the Pope as the head of the Church.East to West, a website regarding all the churches of the Catholic Church, especially those of the east.Real quick, the Orthodox acknowledge the Pope as the successor of Peter, but not as the head of the Church. Am I correct?'
p5085
aS'I would be interested to see where I made such a claim. Prove your assertion.'
p5086
aS'You do realize that the rules are supposed to be absurd, to point up the absurdity of a recent court ruling, right?'
p5087
aS'That is what supersport is hoping to do... However, assuming that you are correct in your interpretation, he has no chance of doing it so well.'
p5088
aS'I believe it is merely all known living species against those known by the fossil record and extinct. There are undoubtedly more extinct species that we are unaware of than living ones.'
p5089
aS'It is not only supposedly "junk DNA" that was used for these kind of arguments. The vertebrate eye has been preached to be a bad design. Why? Why is it a bad design?      The human eye contain bona fide optical fibers to conduct light (nice illustration). B'
p5090
aS'From my first post, starting with the quote from the religioustolerance website;'
p5091
aS'And folks that refuse to see the legitimate ones put us all at risk. Touche.'
p5092
aS'Yes. It\'s not logical to simply cite, "the Bible tells me so, the Bible was written by God," and consider that an argument. The Bible has been wrong. It\'s also not logical to cite authority to God. It necessarily begs further questions about your God\'s unproven existence to those who don\'t believe in that God, or in any God. If we don\'t simply believe in your God, on the basis of your presupposition, he can have no authority over the rest of us. One must come up with another argument.Should each religion have it\'s own definition or completely different idea of logic, which favours that religion and its God? '
p5093
aS'"He" is real to all of us fjp, whether we acknowledge Him or not, God is alive and well on Planet Earth. And the day comes for each man when he faces that reality. For some of us it\'s a long awaited day of joy and for others a long dreaded day. But believe me when I tell you that just because one denies that God exists, it does nothing to lessen His reality.'
p5094
aS"No it doesn't. First, the changes may not be neutral. I will presume that you are intelligent enough to grasp that idea the mutations in and of themselves are neither advantagous nor disadvantageous, and the they have no purpose. Evolution happens when the mutations (and other mechanisms that increase genetic diversity) are acted upon by other mechanisms of evolution. Even in natural selection there is no purpose. Natural selection is differential reproductive success. Some organisms tend to produce more offspring because they have characteristics that give them an advantage in a particular environment."
p5095
aS'so we would penalize financially those who want to have kids?'
p5096
aS'If your friend is hearing voices in her head to walk into traffic, she needs some psychiatric help.'
p5097
aS'Being in the minority or in the majority is irrelevant. Belief has no bearing on reality.'
p5098
aS'Yes, it is very hard, even for theologians, to explain.'
p5099
aS'Actually the details of HOW embryogenesis proceeds is becoming increasingly understood. And it goes way the heck beyond speculation. Check out how homeobox genes work and how regulation by master switches is understood as just two examples.'
p5100
aS'Why would that even be expected? When you consider that it is important to maintain some sort of consistency in study populations, obvious mutants are excluded from the breeding stock. And yet, there are frequent observed mutations. In fact, my elder son once observed two mutations in a single fly in one of his populations. One fly had no wings and white eyes.'
p5101
aS"I'm not arguing that gun control will change the nature of men- though guns may make them more willing and confident to engage in crime. With guns criminals can do even more damage. Adding guns to crime is like adding gasoline to a fire- it makes an already existing problem worse. If you think that just as many people die from stabbing and beatings in other developed nations as people die from guns in the US then you need to do more research."
p5102
aS'Its amazing how the facts are in front of thier faces yet they still claim they are only for "Reasonable" gin control laws.'
p5103
aS'I do not argue so much the quality of llife of an individual woman but more for the quality of life, indeed of having access to life itself, of the children of the woman involved, because in many situations the concern and nurturance of a mother may be the only thing keeping children alive, especially in poor, war-torn nations that do not enjoy the relative wealth of the United States.'
p5104
aS'Interesting, but it appears to ignore the fact that there is pre-existing variation (just look at the pictures). Emphasizing mutations is ok, but relying solely on them will probably skew results.'
p5105
aS"There are in place control procedures for traveling with weapons. All he should be charged with, and I expect he will before this is tried in court is breaking the Airport procedures, or maybe they are FAA procedures which could imply Federal laws.   This guy should have contacted the Airport at check in to report each and every weapon he was traveling with. They would have advised him precisely how to store them and he wouldn't have had any issues at all. Here's the FAA Regs for traveling what is and isn't allowed. I must say that I'm somewhat alarmed at some of what is allowed if I put my terrorist thinking cap on. FAA News"
p5106
aS"You know Brady, you've said a lot of stupid stuff over the years. I even remember finding a post of yours where you said all guns and gun owners should be registered, but sex offenders shouldn't be. This latest post of yours is just another senseless and stupid rambling of somebody that's so hateful and fearful of an inanimate object that it's impossible for him to function in our society and can barely handle his own needs."
p5107
aS"I think some people will and have argued that. I'll work on finding a quote, but I believe it was somebody here who argued that, because of the recent SCotUS ruling, home invasion in DC would decrease because criminals would be more worried about encountering a homeowner with a gun. You do have a point about preventing a worse crime from occuring,though."
p5108
aS'Nothing.... they both have to live with the shame of killing their baby.'
p5109
aS'No, Creationism is the specific idea that the creation story in Genesis is literally true (creation ex nihilo, direct creation of organisms, global flood, etc). It is false.'
p5110
aS"...and 8 beers are imo worse than one joint. People tend not to smoke as many 'doses' of pot as they drink 'doses' of alcohol."
p5111
aS"And my interpretation of my writing is that I didn't mean that. Who has more authority?"
p5112
aS"It is worse then that they just don't get it. Once you put some civil rights on the ballot nothing is off limits. Freedom of speech, religion, assembly ect.. they are all up to be voted out of existence for an unpopular minority by the majority. They just don't get it."
p5113
aS"I'm not sure that your comment will encourage any sort of discussion. Certainly no one is glad because your mother died so young. Not even creationists are likely to be gleeful."
p5114
aS'Because if evolution cannot explain all changes it is false, Unless you propose some creatures evolved and some were specially created. Is that what you mean?Genesis says that all creatures were specially created. It fits with the observational evidence but there is no smoking gun that proves it.Statis is the norm not the exception.One is right the other wrong. It cannot be both ways.Do you have an answer to how a lizard can morph into a bird considering the amazing difference in the lungs?'
p5115
aS'Pregnancy is a health issue only for the woman. Your glib remark pretending to sympathy is insulting.'
p5116
aS"IF! But here's the thing, Mexico is making absolutely no attempt to truly stomp out the drug cartels, they're catering to them! Various political figures and police officers are on the take, they're getting massive amounts of bribe money from the cartels, stopping them would prove detrimental."
p5117
aS"Accidents happen, that's just how life works. They're tragic, and they're upsetting, but there's no way to avoid them."
p5118
aS"But I'll bet that you don't know what any of them are. "
p5119
aS"Just out of curiosity, what do you feel you could sue the company for? Descrimination? Could I sue Wal Mart or Dillons for not carrying a line of adult movies and sex toys? After all, I have a right to own adult movies and sex toys. Doesn't that mean that Wal Mart automatically has the responsibillity to provide those goods? After all, they are the biggest retailer in my area."
p5120
aS'So producing a child is the defining characteristic of a marriage? What about love, trust, respect, companionship? My wife and I may decide to not have a child, does that mean our marriage should be made illegal? Again, you keep posting nambla this and nambla that. Nambla is a group of deviant pedophiles, homosexuals despise this behavior too. GROW UP DHARD...I mean DMG2FUN. ;)'
p5121
aS"It's worse than that, Pandion. For example, here's what I told him over at ARN on the same subject back on April 5th. http://www.arn.org/ubbthreads/showfl...e#Post30331420"
p5122
aS'Criminals continually inform the public that their greatest fear is a victim capable of fighting back against them and possibly killing them.'
p5123
aS"Humans are about the furthest thing from perfect. The bible IS perfect, it's flawless. You can't take anything from it and prove it to be incorrect. The only thing that even comes close is misinterpretations of certain sentences. I know plenty of people who don't believe in any sort of God and aren't bothered by the thought that this is all they have, the only life they'll ever live. Maybe some people need to believe in more to live more, but all people don't."
p5124
aS'Yes, but we do not know that homosexuality is not inherited, and it is the arguments like this that make people want to prove that homosexuality is genetic. Also, people born infertile cannot reproduce, so are those people inferior in a relationship because of what they cannot do?'
p5125
aS'And religion is what caused the Crusades and most other wars in the past, and many wars, and bloody disputes, to this very day. Many, many, many, many, many more people have died in the name of religion than in anything that could be called "in the name of atheism".'
p5126
aS'Incorrectly by those who don\'t understand evolution. Talking about the evolutionist theories about the big bang is pretty mindless, since the big bang is cosmology. Whether or not there was or was not a big bang is irrelevant to evolutionary biology. Lumping other sciences under "evolution" is a method of creationists so that they can claim that they don\'t oppose "science" but only evolution. To be a creationist is to reject the last 400 years of science - cosmology, astronomy, astrophysics, nuclear physics, geology, paleontology, tectonics, biogeography, genetics, population genetics, and so on. You get the idea.'
p5127
aS'Life evolved over billions of years rather than being created in a few days.'
p5128
aS'People have entertained and will always continue to entertain beliefs in all manner of propositions. Many people once believed that the earth is flat:perhaps some still do. But this has nothing to do with scientific truth.There is no "version" of science that one chooses from a menu of possibilities.By definition, scientific enquiry arrives at hypotheses after gathering evidence from observations and experiment. Any law, knowledge, etc. thatis arrived at by scientific method is open to modification or falsification if new evidence comes to light that must be taken into account. All science in this sense is provisional.The apostles may have believed that Jesus walked on water: that does NOTmake it true.'
p5129
aS"It's thanks to the opposers of the theory that all this rubbish about descending from monkeys and slimeball came about, all ppl need is a bit more education and things should become clearer."
p5130
aS"And what if it is one to me? Then your refute is equally refuted. The support for us not knowing lies in you and other's inability to provide anything beyond speculation as support for the assertion that an unborn child is not a person. Your own inability is my support."
p5131
aS"They can if they're Catholics since Evolution is accepted doctrine now in the Church."
p5132
aS"Well, this gets rather complicated. A very young child does not get to choose his or her adoptive parents. Who decides on who adopts whom depends on the kind of adoption and the policies of the particular adoption system. In private domestic adoption, the birth mother usually gets to decide on who will adopt her baby. The foster care system is organized differently, and international adoption is different still and depends on the country from which the child is being adopted. So it's pretty much impossible to generalize about adoption policies and practices. They vary greatly.The point is that the purpose of adoption is to protect the rights of the child."
p5133
aS'I see I jumped the gun. That was well stated.'
p5134
aS'Chloe, the point of this thread is to help you understand what the argument is, not to give analogies to abortion.'
p5135
aS"And what would make them separate species? How about wolves and dogs, separate species? How about Great Danes and Chihuahuas? They cannot interbreed under any circumstances (even artificially - the fetus isn't viable)."
p5136
aS'Please provide the actual estimates of the time required along with the necessary references if you please! How much time WOULD it take with confidence limits please!'
p5137
aS'Actually both are relative in every situation. Especially "The Truth" as espoused by religious fundamentalists such as yourself, as there are as many different versions of the truth as there religious fundamentalists.'
p5138
aS"The majority of criminals don't want to deal with trouble. Most aren't looking for a shootout where there's a risk of them getting shot at and most don't even want to shoot period. Most are just looking for the free stuff they can get or in cases of rape they're definately not looking to fight an armed victim. It has been shown that criminals are less likely to break into a house whose owner has a gun."
p5139
aS'Well, I did say I was being nit-picky: all I was objecting to was the way the original wording suggested that the change was occurring in order to avoid competition. Assuming it was due to selection, the competition from the larger birds was the putative agent of that selection.(Incidentally, I suspect we live on the same side of the Atlantic.)'
p5140
aS'And the loss to society because people used guns instead of an alternate weapon is?'
p5141
aS"The US is still the closest thing to a pure capitalist country in the world. But you are correct, our system is not a pure capitalist one. We have reminants of all types of systems including socialism. In the modern world I don't think a society as large as the US is could be run under just one pure system."
p5142
aS"Just to contribute, I'm pro-gun, have had training in the proper use and laws in my area, and have owned weapons for more than 30 years."
p5143
aS'the reason why premise 1 can logically stand is that God is first of all defined as the "greatest possible being". no matter what reality we are considering, such a thing as the greatest possible being in that relity must exist. "greatest" is a superlative, compared to all other beings that existits like "the oldest man alive". no matter what scenario, such a person as the oldest man alive will always exist, therefore such a man (that fits that definition) will have a necessary existence'
p5144
aS'Would you mind telling us just how he determined ALL maladaptive or inconsequential mutations in his test organism and just how he validated such measurements? To me as a biologist with quite a bit of microbiology under the belt it would seem to be impossible to do so! After all its very likely that a fairly large portion of the populutaion will have at least one mutation at at least one base pair location in the total sequence! Your claim would seem to be impossible, but perhaps there is a way he managed to do so.'
p5145
aS"here we go Dan. your problem with the law is not whether its fair or not, its whether you can benefit personally from it. you have no problem with abortion because your not going to be the victim of such a law, but youd definitely have a problem if you were the one suffering from the law. Apparently you dont care if the law disadvantages or is unfair to others, as long as it doesn't hurt you, you're OK with it."
p5146
aS'So? The point was that people who support gun control are not necessarily communists.'
p5147
aS'I see. Then you are attempting to define evolution out of existance. By your definition (not that of evolutionary biologists) evolution requires an increase in information. An unsupported creationist argument. Define information in a meaningful way. Please apply your definition to genetics and show why all genetic changes are a decrease in information.'
p5148
aS'Very well said. However, we also believe that gun owners should get as much training as possible, necessary, desired etc. It just should not be required to participate in a Right Recognized by your Constitution as Inalienable, and therefore protected. That sets a bad precedence for the rest of our Bill of Rights. However, safe handling of any potentially dangerous tool is just common sense.'
p5149
aS'Exactly. That the change in moth color was due to natural selection was first posed in about 1896 by J.W. Tutt. The funny thing is that as pollution increased, the moths turned black, and then as the pollution was cleaned up, they turned white again. carbonaria have become pretty scarce.'
p5150
aS"This makes more sense then anything else I've heard on this thread."
p5151
aS"Your stats aren't broken down into meaningful groups, so nothing is learned WRT Muslims."
p5152
aS'If same sex couples are offered equal rights under a PACS (or some other legally recognized union) as married couples, why does it matter which "door" they come in through? They get all the same benefits, including the benefits that come when one partner dies.What\'s the beef...except that you can\'t say that you\'re "married"?'
p5153
aS'There is never a question of "killing people" in such circumstances, it a matter of deciding if treatment should be withdrawn and thus allow them to die, i.e. where there is no possibility of any sort of a recovery.'
p5154
aS"I do not empathise with an embryo or early fetus the way I imagine I would with my late-term fetus or born child.I fully intend to have children in the future, including through adoption possibly. When I do I will love them with all my heart and put their needs above my own. I'm not going to do a half-assed job of parenting; I'll give it 100%.But not yet.Prototype:"
p5155
aS'logic would lead one to believe abortion is wrong...but why be consistent in your thinking.The point is, logic and rational thinking is not a requirement to make a law. You can ban abortion is you want...the states did it and the constitution allows it, even if 5 legislatures think otherwise.'
p5156
aS'See above. A lock can create doubt about the ease of entry into a residence. Many criminals move from door to door until they find one that is unlocked, rather than drawing undue attention by smashing one in.'
p5157
aS'Well, there is a little more to it than that, but agreed.'
p5158
aS'Well said. It is a disgrace that the "Flat Earth" side of the argument never gets a look in geography lessons and that the "Spontaneous Creation" side of the argument never gets a look in when teaching kids about the life cycle of insects. Do you realise that they refuse to present the "Cheese" side of the argument when teaching about the moon these days? It\'s outrageous, how can our kids get a balanced education if such bias is allowed to continue!'
p5159
aS'Well excuuuuse me if I screwed that up in this post. Have a nice day. :)'
p5160
aS"But not just any seven judges, seven judges who's job is to define the constitution."
p5161
aS'YES, of course, they could not actually hunt, since that would be illegal, possibly a felony, whihc could lead to forfeiture of your rights.'
p5162
aS"So what? It's not like institutions in this country haven't been changed before, including the supposed intitution of marriage! Guess what? It's called progress, get used to it. "
p5163
aS'Actually, I meant the behaviour refered to in her post was interesting.'
p5164
aS"I think the FSM threw these guys a bone. They cherrypicked which taxa would give them the most statistically significant results. If they were to expand the method to include more and more taxa, they'd see the Noodly Appendage of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Ramen."
p5165
aS"And the point was, Benjamin, that it is dishonest to cite the work of others, with no indication that it is the work of others. If you take what someone else wrote, they you need to indicate that, telling where you got it. If it is a book, then the author, title, publisher, date and page. If it is a web page, then the URL should be given.Even better, express your own point and tell how reference supports it. Tell why it is important and why it shows your opponent wrong - then just give a link. Generally AIG is really bad science and isn't very interesting. It is misleading, intentionally. However, on these boards are familiar with their stuff."
p5166
aS'"True" is not a good use of language to describe opinion. With regard to his opinion, I think he makes some good points, so I don\'t really need to ask him if its true. You on the other hand do need to speak to Olsen as you are claiming his letter rubbishes the concept of evolution- an opinion I hazard he would very much disagree with.'
p5167
aS'Not only do their superiors in higher courts think they are a joke, but their peers in other circuit courts think they are a joke.'
p5168
aS"How is that a strawman? Your challenge directly relies upon something you assume to be proven, but has not been. Therefore even in a hypothetical stance, your underlying arguments are invalid, thus leading to everything else being invalid. You're not doing so well on this forum."
p5169
aS"And what is an inheritance? Proverbs 13:13 he who feareth the commandment shall be rewarded. 14 The law of the wise is a fountain of life. 15 Good understanding giveth favor 16 Every prudent man dealeth with knowledge 17 a faithful ambassador is health 18 but he that regardeth reproof shall be honoured. 19 The desire accomplished is sweet to the soul 20 He that walketh with wise men shall be wise 21 but to the righteous good shall be paid. What inheritance should a good man leave to his children's children? Solomon wasn't talking of money, but of God's law. In Solomon's view, the wicked can have their money, the true reward goes to the righteous. Why this should contrast with selling your luxuries and giving to the poor I'm not sure. "
p5170
aS"Except in the Dred Scott case the court wasn't trying to determine whether slavery was a collective or individual right, or what the constitution applied to in regard to slavery."
p5171
aS"Well, HRC estimates that the costs would be negligable and that some governments would actually save money. They site many studies on the issue, which I have not taken the time to look up, as I think this sort of statistic is worthless. It is unreasonable to ask same-sex couples to pay for the marriage of opposite-sex couples without asking opposite-sex couples to return this payment. Still, you seem very concerned about it, so I will provide this link:http://www.hrc.org/Template.cfm?Sect...entDisplay.cfmIt is an interest group in favor of gay rights, yes, but that doesn't make them wrong. I did have a link to an actual study on the topic, but I cannot seem to find it. I'm sure if I scoured the Internet more, I could come up with something."
p5172
aS'But people start threads here all the time against Christianity regardless of whether someone claims something here about it or not. It\'s prejudice, pure and simple, and you\'re no exception. Now, one would think, being the supposedly non-Christian enlightened person you are, you would simply say "oh, I didn\'t realize that my posts came across as anti-Christian sometimes, and that it indicates a prejudice on my part, and will try to not have prejudices in my thinking." I mean, one would think those of you are do this sort of thing would be happy that someone had pointed out the obvious prejudice going on, as it would be a case to help you move away from prejudicial thinking.'
p5173
aS"Still clueless and still presenting a barrel of laffs I see. Have someone that can read and comprehend spell it out for you. I bet yer mun is considering that to get you out of the basement. How's the weight loss coming by the way?"
p5174
aS"And think of what other animals have built (and for an actual purpose). Take a look at a bee hive. It's so complex and so perfect for them. They built that. An ant hill is at least 20 times the size of an ant. That's 120 feet for us (for a 6 foot person)."
p5175
aS"You've asked a good question cash, the way you know that is by all of the excuses you're getting rather than any attempts to actually answer you directly with solid evidence. Of course we know that evidence doesn't exist, but they'll never admit that either. emoticonXGood"
p5176
aS"It seems to be the reason for crafting this new, individual right against the States. Since the original purpose of the Second Amendment doesn't appear to be needed, there is a new use that is protected."
p5177
aS'Bad comparisons. A fair comparison would be comparing the total number of defensive gun uses to the total number of gun crimes (not just limiting it to gun homicides).'
p5178
aS"This is poor example. Focusing on saving lives over burying the dead doesn't do anything to trump personal autonomy."
p5179
aS'I dunno... we already have enough fundies thinking that the Big Bang is part of evolution...'
p5180
aS'Do you believe that the freedom to not participate in any religion whatsoever is not covered by the expression "Freedom of Religion"?'
p5181
aS'Things like future proof of a young earth - evolution needs billons of years. Or proof of severe weather conditions that would destroy the evolutionary process. Life on earth dies completely if it gets out of a fairly narrow temperature range, any time during those billions of years.'
p5182
aS'"Usually, "rationality" is a Humpty-Dumpty word, that means whatever the user finds is convenient to club his opponents with."http://world.std.com/~mhuben/skept/rationality.htmlKnowledge itself is a limited commodity. To make a claim that everything is knowable is a statement that is impossible to prove; Scientism makes this claim. Closely related to it is Objectivism."Scientism, in the strong sense, is the self-annihilating view that only scientific claims are meaningful, which is not a scientific claim and hence, if true, not meaningful."http://skepdic.com/scientism.htmlRecommended Reading:"Why People Believe Weird Things: Pseudoscience, Superstition, and Other Confusions of Our Time" by Michael ShermerNot only does it include creationism, :) but also the philosophy of Ayn Rand (Objectivism)'
p5183
aS'Lots of makers are still churning out lever action rifles. I am sad to see Winchester closed, but sad feelings is not a good financial reason to keep a poorly run company open.'
p5184
aS"Actually, it isn't. It is complex and complicated. It requires diligent study of difficult concepts. But when you grasp the basics, it does become evident. But most creationists aren't willing to put in the effort."
p5185
aS"It doesn't make sense because no one makes that claim. There are some random events that take place that may have an effect on evolution. That does not mean that evolution is random."
p5186
aS"Because the judges President Bush nominates are strict constructionist.They interpret the law not make it...........That is the worse nightmare for a liberal or a gay who depend on judges to over rule the vote of the people............They can't win at the ballot box so they think they can win in the courts....It won't happen.get use to it................"
p5187
aS'Who said it did? I was only pointing out the absurdity of gun control laws and how they lead to federal overlords deeming that your not capable of playing with matches. (I would not be suprised if this were next.)'
p5188
aS'You can forget the loaded language including false notions of progress. Lifeforms are evolving by way of purely physical and chemical mechanisms.'
p5189
aS'He is a hell of a lot wiser than thee.'
p5190
aS'Yes. Oddly, the picture makes as much sense as most creationists. :)'
p5191
aS"So what? I don't care! Gun ownership is an individual right and that's the end of it! You don't have to exercise a right hundreds of thousands of times a year for it to be protected by the Constitution."
p5192
aS'Well, ya know, if you actually, oh I don\'t know, VISITED THE SITE, you\'d see that the "friendlyatheist.com" is a blog-like page (and not the one that is actually giving the info on the evolutionary migration of humanity) and it gave a link to the actual website that we are talking about (the second link I gave): http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/journey/But then, maybe we\'re expecting a little too much from a creationist. emoticonXBanghead emoticonXBanghead'
p5193
aS"Evolution doesn't explain the event. The event is an example of evolution - a change in the frequency of alleles in a populatioin over time. The explanation may or may not be evolution by natural selection. You merely asserted that based on your imagined case."
p5194
aS'All born children, and every woman had the right to be rid of them. Killing them is not required as abortion is when they are in the womb (during the timeframe the majority of abortions occur, at least). They are not comparable.'
p5195
aS'Well then, my skeptic fellow Australians, what is the answer to the question? Do any of you guys here know? I sure as hell don\'t. Creationists did not misquote Dawkins because the words came from his mouth. And Dawkins is a professional at biology, but he could not answer such a question.In the little amount of fossils that we do see, they are not evolutionary. There is no clear cut fossils showing the evolution of man, is there. By "true human" I mean they were just like us, just varients of human kind that we have today - looked human, walked like us, most likely were quite intelligent. I have got to go to school, continue this later.'
p5196
aS"So you still choose to believe that someone who's a victim of crime should be punished as if they committed the crime themselves?"
p5197
aS"Actually, this (if what that article is true, which I am not quite sure) is a healthy part of science. Old theories are disgarded and new ones come in as more evidence is brought to bare. Every theory made by fallible man is prone to being disproven and destroyed. Man's theories change everyday, while God's word has remained the same."
p5198
aS'But it is based on history. There is plenty of history showing that women had illegal abortions. Or, if their families had money. went to Costa Rica or Britain to have a legal one in those countries.Women died or had severe medical emergencies due to illegal abortions. Doctors and nurses were prosecuted for providing these services.'
p5199
aS'Since evolution is a non-theistic theory (it does not consider if there is a god or not), you will have to look at some like http://www.theistic-evolution.com/I would also look up Kenneth MIller on the web... a highly Christian biologist who defends evolution.'
p5200
aS'?? What are you trying to say?Science is knowledge, all knowledge, that is, anything we find to be true. There is no other "truth" out there, if there were, we\'d be omniscient.'
p5201
aS"Pregnancy is always harmful to the woman's body. However, if the pregnancy is desired then the changes are welcomed by the woman.To a woman who does not want to be pregnant then those changes are very unwelcome and are a bad thing. Pregnancy is always harmful, but the perception of what is happening changes depending on the woman.You do not understand that whether or not pregnancy harms the woman's body is objective, but whether or not the woman wants the pregnancy anyway depends on the woman. You are mixing the two."
p5202
aS"**Here you reveal exactly what I've just spoken of--you assume that science and the scientific method equates to, is synonymous with, materialism/mechanism. It most certainly is not. Nor is the accompanying assumption, i.e., that any science which does not strictly adhere to materialust/mechanist assumptions, is not, and cannot be, real science. Equally untrue.Both assertions are unnecessary to an objective approach to science, per se, but are part and parcel of an emotional defence of materialism/mechanism and its biological aspect, RMNS darwinism."
p5203
aS'This assumes brain-dead is a logical choice to consider one dead. Even so, it proves nothing about when life begins. What says they have to be the same? This is a classic example of a conclusion not following from the premise.'
p5204
aS"And they could have experienced more without gun control. You're jumping to conclusions."
p5205
aS"Like the above quote, why is the church trying to stop abortion when they would consider one to be alive after taking a breath. if you were to look at it from a scientific standpoint, the individual ovum and sperm are living cells, but they die all the time and no one cares. An embryo or fetus is something starting to develop into a human and that can't be stopped without killing it or injecting differnt DNA, but it's still not too different from sperm and ovum.If you can't trust the church to make fair decisions and follow values and morals and rules they put in place, how can you expect an honest good decision about anything from it."
p5206
aS"The terrorists saw it as absolutly necessary. Personally, I disagree. When we kill children in Iraq, we see it as absolutly necessary, call it a horrible side effect of war. I disagree on that, too, I don't think it is necessary at all."
p5207
aS'Yeah, see this is the old "gateway drug" fallacy.If anything is a gateway drug, it\'s alcohol, so why is it still legal?If a drug can act as a "gateway" to other drugs, isn\'t that why it\'s illegal?So are people sitting around drinking alcohol all day, waiting for someone to come by with something "harder"? No, and the same is true for people who smoke pot. Oh, sure they may also do other things once and a while, but it wasn\'t simply because they tried that first joint. It\'s just a personality trait and a common one. If pot didn\'t exist, these people would be doing something else. The same with alcohol and cigarettes. If they didn\'t exist, people would find some other type of vice.'
p5208
aS'So much for your cover. Its blown. You just made another gaps argument making the assumption that if theory X does not explain observation Y that a theory which is untested and untestable MUST be the only alternative explanation. Balderdash and shame on you. The alternative theories would likely be numerous and the ONLY one is not something untested and untestable.But I forgive you GOD probably made you make the error for his own mysterious reasons. Or else your statement is evil and was forced upon you by the devil. Maybe you will never know - in this life at least :('
p5209
aS"Yes, the horror of voluntarily taking orders from someone in exchange for monetary rewards!!   If you hate your job that much, quit. You aren't being oppressed because someone offered you the option to do something. If you don't like it, don't do it. If you hate trade, you can go wander through the wilderness and eat berries and roots."
p5210
aS"You said there that you wanted guns in schools so that kids could defend themselves. How is that a misinterpretation?   You're asking for proof of a negative. How many massacres would have occured if guns were common in school? We don't know...   Erm.... You're saying that people don't try to harm one another over those things? I suggest you surf youtube for a bit. Rememeber however, that kids are more emotionally unstable than adults. Hormones and guns aren't a good combination.   I agree that's silly. I'm more worried about your statement that students should carry in class."
p5211
aS'Actually, it has.      The last time I checked, well still have gay marriages in Massachusetts. As a matter of fact, it seems that it is difficult for most politicians to be elcted in the state without being supportive of marriage equality.'
p5212
aS'Actually Electro, do you remember this thread?   Evidence for a flood? Oddly enough it took 20 pages before one of them even tried to argue against the reasons why the flood did not occur.'
p5213
aS"You said who would it hurt? I'm asking you who would it hurt if there was prostituion? Just to help you think that there are injuries that are proximate to everyone."
p5214
aS"Just because they're our representatives, doesn't give them permission to trample the Constitution and the protections provided to the citizens. Look at how many laws have been passed, only to be invalidated and ruled as unconstitutional."
p5215
aS'You are assuming that the TOE of evolution has remained static since Darwins time.I have to say that is false. We have 150 years of experimental data beyond that. In addition, we not only have the arguement from homology, but we have genetic data to back it up. So sorry, but you struck out.'
p5216
aS'What about the pain and death inflicted upon the innocent women and girls forced to give birth? Have you no regard for them?'
p5217
aS'Whether a fetus is a person is not something open to consideration. An apple is not an orange. The reason that we have two words to apply as labels is simply because they absolutely are not the same thing. It is that simple.Suppose that a fetus is frozen and implanted in a female 22 years later. Is it of legal drinking age at birth? Obviously not. We currently have the technology to actually do this.'
p5218
aS"You haven't proven anything. All you have done is spew your same old drivel which ignores what I actually say and reinterprets it to mean what you want it to say. You must corrupt what I say since you can't accept the truth of my beliefs and win your fallacious argument."
p5219
aS'A being is something that is conceivable as existing...or something that actually exists.A human being is one of us, a homo-sapien, a member of the group of beings known as animals.A rock is a being of inanimate qualities.God is the supreme being, not capable of being understood totally as this would put Him (or It, or She) on the same level as those that He created.We will never be able to define exactly what or who God is!God is great.God is good.Let us thank Him for our food.God is my shepherd.God is my Light.God is my Co-pilot.God is what keeps me from believing that all this (the totality of all things and happenings) came about by accident.When God made man, She was only kidding! ;)'
p5220
aS"But we also don't know that evolution is true - it is a belief system about the past that requires faith for it to have any reason. Your first part is already false (proved above)."
p5221
aS"Iangb, I would have thought that you would be intellectually honest enough to have (at least) accepted the fact that I have supported my claims. I also thought that (by now) someone from your side of the abortion issue would step in (in this thread or by private message) and hold you to your claims of being 'intellectually honest.' At this point, I actually have you questioning Planned Parenthood's definitions? QUOTE; "
p5222
aS'Well, the question I am asking is for you to provide a valid scientific prediction based on creationism.'
p5223
aS'Creationism is not something new, it was the prevailing view of scientists up until Darwin. None of them belived in a divine parrot that is just plain silly. In the crucible of natural science throughout the Middle Ages, the Scientific Revolution and well into the 19th century theology was the queen of the sciences. Now we subject students to higher math studies that they will most likely never use and speculations about conceptual mechanisms like natural selection that have no practical application. Naturalistic presumption has become sacrosanct in the rhetoric of the professional scientists who have been crystal clear on how they define creationism. You can ignore the statement by D.J.Futuyma and identical ones made by Gould, Mayr, Dawkins, Dobzhansky and others but not without departing from mainstream evolutionary biology. '
p5224
aS'At what cost? How many civil rights are you willing to give up in the name of a few less murders each year? Are you perfectly willing to be stopped by the police on a block-by-block basis and forced to show identification and traveling papers, all the while the officers on location are pointing their guns right at your head, ready to XXXX you away at the first sign of a twitch or if you display even a hint of hesitation to comply?How desperately do you crave a police state? How much do you favor a nationwide curfew where violators can be arrested by the police and held without legal counsel for an indefinite period of time? Do you favor the use of physical and mental torture to force convictions even from the innocent?'
p5225
aS'Well, if Genesis was in fact true, then we would have to assume that God is real and the Bible more or less explains what he wants, right? And if there is someone "up there" who will damn you to eternal torment if you don\'t do what he wants (which is one interpretation of the Bible) than that might effect the way you act. I realize that that isn\'t exactly the same as changing your moral compass, but history has demonstrated that most people\'s moral will stretch to accomodate pressing needs, and I think an actual vengeful diety would qualify.'
p5226
aS'So for example if I say "you are a part of my body, and therefore I have a right to kill you", is this simply a matter of ideology?I admit the distinction is not clearcut at early stages of development, but how do you support the idea that post-birth children are "a part" of their mothers\' bodies and therefore legitimate to kill?It is no more legitimate to say that a fetus is a part of a woman\'s body than it is to say that a woman is a part of a fetus\' body. Just as a woman is not a subordinate slave to the fetus within her, the fetus cannot be considered subordinate in rights to the woman it is inside.'
p5227
aS"23,000 firearms were handed in when the UK had its gun ban. According to your logic those people that handed in their firearms can still be prosecuted because they took possession of a firearm prior to the ban. I don't think so."
p5228
aS'But bestiality consists of animal cruelty, so very much hurts another. Just not another human.'
p5229
aS'I think it goes something like that. Scientists have tried to repeat what they believe happened, but to no success. Anyway, atheistic evolution says that there is no intelligence, the scientists who were trying to repeat what may have happened have intelligence and they made many such measurements to try and create life from lifeless chemicals - in other words, the experiment was already logically flawed!'
p5230
aS'The fact that they were too heavy, is simply untrue, see previous post. Hunting depends on many ecological factors, such as their predational preference. Also new fossils suggest a trees down development of bird flight so fully developed flight muscles and feathers were not necessary.'
p5231
aS'So country by country, the world is going to hell in a hand basket. And this pleases you, why? emoticonXFrazzled'
p5232
aS"Hello, please read http://www.reasons.org/resources/apo...ing.shtml?mainIt is a good christian site that explains that there are lots of problems with Dr Russell Humphreys' hypothesis.The universe and Earth are very old. We know this as a fact. Why would God lie to us? If the Universe looks old, then it is. To claim otherwise is to call God a liar."
p5233
aS"Well, that's generally true of any process that uses energy. Some is wasted."
p5234
aS"I don't think that any marriage rights are required at all by the Consitution."
p5235
aS'And I just say that it would be unjust and unfair of you to force metaphysical belief systems of your own which constitute religious belief upon your follows who may believe otherwise than you. Get pregnant and treat your fetus as a full person if you wish, nobody will force you to abort it. Let others follow their own beliefs differing or the same. Otherwise you attempt to obtain justice by doing injustice.Mo'
p5236
aS"But growth is fairly irrelevant. My sperm can grow into a human too, and have mental existence, yet ejaculating isn't murder. It just becomes a huge debate on where to draw the line, therefore it is best to focus on the state that it is right NOW. Not what it was or could possibly be.That seems reasonable to me.[/QUOTE]"
p5237
aS'You know what is far worse than murder itself? Executing people to save some money.'
p5238
aS'Well be cynical if you want, if someone in your family had done as you ascribed you wouldn\'t be here to be so glib. Nor would the human race or any other species where penile-vaginal sex takes place. I guess all those years of biological reproduction show it. You will also notice I didn\'t make it an absolute statement. I said "minimal or negligable physical damage".I understand that female biology undergoes truama too during sex, the fact is the trauma of vaginal sex i.....1. more forgiving and 2. Obviously possible of greater/important final result. And um, like with lesbian activities, the size of the "peg" also matters so how do you know lesbian activities are a lot less harmful.'
p5239
aS"I see the difference, but that's not what Obama is trying to do. He got us to buy the pig at a firesale and is hoping to make money selling it back to the original farmer or give it to the fieldhands."
p5240
aS'When the President is in public, there are plenty of people around him ...with guns.'
p5241
aS'I have no idea what this could possibly mean. It makes no sense, semantically or logically. It is so vague as a concept as to be worthless in terms of the pursuit of knowledge.'
p5242
aS"Intelligent design comes in many flavors too.ID that submits as a designer something that has any quality of the unknowable is irrational.ID that submits we were created/designed by things inside the universe that are knowable are rational claims. However, they have no evidence, so they have a long way to go to be shown to be worthwhile to pursue. Even a simple application of Occam's razor tells us that to suspect a thousand theories on how life has changed on earth is unecessary when another theory can fulfill the description entirely, of life, and they have evidence to support it. It's why this theory is discarded onto the heap of any number of theories that simply isn't going anywhere. You can make up a theory right now about how life began, but if it cannot be supported by evidence or is redundant to a theory already described...why would we?"
p5243
aS"Just curious, is it beyond you to make a post that includes common sense and logic? I'm thinking it is since all of you posts seem to be based on rhetoric and emotion. Three paragraphs and all of them contain a falsehood/ lie, congrats your batting 1.000."
p5244
aS"So who's the head honcho?   It's not like all these professional scientists all see eye to eye. There are even scientists that hold to theistic evolution."
p5245
aS'I believe a man should be able to opt out of fatherhood.The problem with this article for me is the moral ambiguity - there is no consistent argument laid out for free choice, that is choice for women and men, or even one for consistent slavery (forced births from women, forced money from men). It reeks of the vindictiveness that can be seen in any number of fringe movements, of the "I don\'t really care whether we live in a just society, as long as you\'re not treated better than me".So yes, I "a real pro-choicer" agree with Matt here, the pro-choicers who are portrayed as disagreeing appear to be some kind of stereotyped 1970s feminist-socialist-activist-bra-burning type.'
p5246
aS'If there is a positive relationship between drug consumption and crime, it doesn`t seem very likely that crime would go down as a result of lowering the price on drugs (and thus rasing consumption).'
p5247
aS'Actually it would be impossible for the monblock to spin. There is NO PLACE OUTSIDE OF IT from which to observe! Any observer would necessarily be inside the budding universe - no place else to go you see. Indeed its still impossible for us to know whether the universe as a whole is spinning or not!!!! Sorry I was being a bit ironic thinking you would see the point. Guess not though.'
p5248
aS"And that's the rub: it never has (apart from when it has of course, with the various versions that exist). You choose to put faith in the writings of a primitive bronze age society. I prefer to trust a textbook that is regularly updated to reflect our latest findings; our most up to date and accurate knowledge of the world."
p5249
aS"Chuz, the purpose of this summary is not to summarise your arguments as a whole - it is to summarise what your argument is up to this point.   Why not post just a summary of your position so far, as you see it - I can do the same, then you can continue with your argument?   There's no point in writing an argument, summarising it and then leaving the thread before I've had a chance to respond to even your argument (never mind your summary). If you are going to simply ignore any criticisms of your reasoning, then I struggle to see the point of you repeatedly requesting a one-on-one debate in the first place - you essentially regress your argument to the 'because I said so' that you are (presumably) hoping to avoid, it's just that there's slightly more detail."
p5250
aS"Jake good try at manipulating scriptures. Jesus is all about family values. The point of thsoe scriptures is that His gospel is above everything else. The only thing that comes before family is GOD. He loves families but won't let a family bring someone down. The US rescues kids from bad homes too because to be in an enviroment that is detrimental serves no one."
p5251
aS"This has everything to do with guns,how are these people suppose to protect   themselves?Since the police have been told to just let them go, crime will run   rampant, it will become THE place to go if you feel like duing a little robbery a little burglary,gosh wonder if they gotta let rapo's and killers runaway to.   Only 2000? I lived in George Wa. and the population was less than 2000,it was also just off I-90 and we had plenty of crime from people passing through not   necessarily from people who lived there."
p5252
aS"Really? 'cuss what I always see with anti-choicers is that they seem to think that the pregnant woman is invisible. This means that all men and all fetuses have a right to life at all times, but women, for some unknown reason, seem to lose that right when they become pregnant. Weird."
p5253
aS"it has been known for a long time -- it's just been surpressed because it contradicts genetic determinism and neo-darwinsm in general."
p5254
aS'That distinction may be irrelevant since they do say that no god that any religious person believes in exists. And that is what I was getting at originaly. Still I think that the idea that the existence of all religious gods can be ultimately refuted based on the logic you bring up is invalid.'
p5255
aS"I think the OP said it pretty well. If an organism or cell can process information and then make decisions based on that information, that's intelligence."
p5256
aS'Depends on the usage. Generally, it just refers to the Theory of Evolution or a change in allele frequencies in a population.'
p5257
aS'So please tell me who would be the actual criminals if the Government violated the Supreme Law of the Land and made all guns illegal?But I do thank you for proving that there are people out there who want them all, despite The Bill of Rights says and what the Supreme Court proved was the correct meaning!'
p5258
aS'Oh I can easily spend $1,000 dollars an hour. If I could I would also have plenty of reason to live to be 114.'
p5259
aS'If this is what passes for American healthcare, then your need for change is even more desperate. None of these "treatments" is available on the NHS.'
p5260
aS"Sure they matter. But that isn't the issue here. You posted this in the abortion forums as if this medical malpractice which is taking place in an impoverished third world country is justification for it in America. That is a ludicrous and totally bogus argument to make.If you thought rationally, you would have it in the health forum and be complaining about how third world countries are so ill prepared for this common problem when we have the technology so readily available to avoid it. My Lord simone, a simple C-Section is all that is required to make this a non issue for mother and baby. But you ignorantly post this drivel as if abortion is the solution. It makes no sense at all, and yet you post it thinking that you're contributing something rational. Go figure, huh!!! emoticonXFrazzled"
p5261
aS"Oh, I don't think there's anything wrong with it, I'm completely for it."
p5262
aS'Well to get healthcare from $6000 per person to $3,400 per person you\'d have to pay them less or fire them. So do I understand you correctly that we will either cut pay or fire doctors and nurses?EDIT: that seems dramatic...not "fire" them but they will basically go into another profession since they are no longer needed.'
p5263
aS"But doesn't Genesis imply that creation occured in one 7-day period (though the days could be symbollic)?"
p5264
aS'This question is premised on an untenable assumption: that people should not be allowed to vote on particular issues. This premise is clearly not true in any democratic society, and is especially not true in the United States. In the United States, it is a contradiction in terms to say someone is not allowed to vote on X. I have demonstrated this before, and yet the same silly question keeps coming up.'
p5265
aS"I think that's a good question. I also wonder how long the medical establishment has had this rule? Since there must be some long-standing procedures in executions in the United States that require, by law, a doctor's supervision."
p5266
aS'Though I know you directed this question at Cthulhu, I will nonetheless jump in to say that I would quickly choose the newborn mentally retarded baby to live and the zygote to die. That is obvious to me since the mentally retarded baby is a currently existing person vs. the zygote being merely a potential person. That zygote may have more potential for the future but the decision is being made in the present. I would feel far more guilt in sentencing a real person to die than in sentencing a potential person (now merely a cell) to die.'
p5267
aS'That interpretation is fine except that God says, "I WILL make a helper suitable for him." He hadn\'t made the animals yet in verse 18, but he created Adam in verse 7.'
p5268
aS"Apparently you thought I was claiming that pro-lifers thought that the baby's life was more valuable than the mother's life. So I clarified:"
p5269
aS"Well if you're going to quote that article that mentions Canada to support your opinion, then does that mean you're in favor of gun registration and licensing? Canada has them. And if the NRA is really interested in enforcing laws why do they ask congress to reduce the budget of law enforcement? The NRA uses its political muscle to make it easier for criminals to obtain guns. Robert Ricker, former top lawyer of the NRA, talks about it. "
p5270
aS'Because he was found guilty of murdering a minor rather than an adult. Any crime committed by an adult against a child is more heinous in nature.'
p5271
aS'What Is a Human Person and Who Counts as a Human Person?: A Crucial Question for Bioethics by Prof. William E. MayThere is also an extremely academic school of thought which views the human person in terms of the ego in all its derivations. I cannot hope to summarize what this is all about, please refer to:Philosophical Critiques: The Human Person - 3 One could also consider the social development of an infant, inasmuch as humans are, in most cases, very social animals.According to primatologist Sarah Blaffer Hrdy, the human species is specifically developed to be part of a social system and a newborn infant comes ready made to push all the buttons of the system:'
p5272
aS'Actually, I believe it was a Reagan policy continued by both Bushes.'
p5273
aS'This does not mean that the column is fantastic nor imaginative. It may very well be that not all areas of the earth accumulated all types of rock that form the column; this does not mean that the years at which similar columns were deposited in different places in the world are not similar. And of course, even if the Geologic column is not true, this provides no evidence of creationism.'
p5274
aS'Although i personally oppose abortion,i agree that two wrongs dont make it right.'
p5275
aS"Yes. The better question is, did it happen just like in Genises? I don't think so."
p5276
aS"Out-and-out lie. There's really no other way to put this."
p5277
aS"Yes yes, this was all covered in Wells' previous book, Icons of Evolution. It has been refuted numerous times (some even on this forum). See here for a thorough debunking."
p5278
aS"Because I am one who likes see things from different angles. What better way to fight your enemies then to understand their viewpoint. Before I am attacked on the the last statement, just because I understand a viewpoint does not meant that I accept it as true or that I don't reject it."
p5279
aS"Not many women would say they had an abortion now, let alone back when it was illegal.It is an emotionally trying event. I can understand why she wouldn't for that reason alone. Another possibility is that the Administration is buying her silence, or it could be a combination of the two."
p5280
aS'This coming from the person that makes insane claims without providing evidence. Atleast provide some when asked!'
p5281
aS'You can not create the general from the specific, only the specific from the general'
p5282
aS"If I were to become upset merely because you told me the ideas were wrong, you might have a point. But I don't; never have, so far as I recall. An idea can't be stupid, or simple-minded. An idea can be right or wrong, or perhaps partly both. When you describe an idea as stupid, you are saying it is wrong and one would have to be stupid to think that. When you describe an idea as simple minded you are saying it is wrong and one would have to be simple-minded to think that."
p5283
aS"An independant perspective doesn't make it a good thing. Politicians that propose anti-gun legislation don't have to live in the real world with those of us that the bill will affect, they shouldn't be allowed to propose it."
p5284
aS'I think you need to answer the same question I asked the other guy, who is God?'
p5285
aS"Just how do you suppose the government seeking permision would work in reality? And what exactly are you afraid of? It seems odd when people advocate blind trust for Joe Civilian, but then think that the government shouldn't be allowed to be armed. I think there must be a balance in trust given both ways."
p5286
aS'Do you actually have any idea how science works? Why are you not embarrassed for creationism?'
p5287
aS"I see. So you can't give an example of a dinosaur being dated with carbon 14. None of us thought you could."
p5288
aS'Actually, natural selection tends to preserve a species with only minor changes in a stable environment. But environments tend to change. I don\'t know what that "incipient organ" junk is supposed to mean. Is that another way of saying "what good is half a wing." Well, check out a penguin to find out. Look at a seal flipper. It has the same bones, arranged in the same way as a monkey. What good is it for a land animal? And what does "fully functional" mean? What function? Perhaps the new organ had a different purpose - take the clawed hands of fossil birds for example. They were good for catching prey and climbing, just like they were for their dinosaur ancestors. But those clawed wings also allowed early birds to fly.'
p5289
aS'They are both written in the bible. Neither of them have any evidence (apart from the bible) to support their existence. One of them has been proven to be utterly false. This naturally discredits the other, as they appear in the same publication by the same author. Why decide one is true when the other is clearly not, and neither have any other supporting evidence?'
p5290
aS"I'll have you know that the abortion went without a hitch, and my uterus is perfectly healthy, thankyouverymuch (not that it is any of your emoticonXCensored business), and yes, I do plan to have a child in the future, and don't really care what you think about it."
p5291
aS"Actually, we didn't. The first record of a melanic form was in 1848. Presumably other melanic individuals had appeared before this, both in Biston bebularia as well as other moths. We know that a similar mutation occucrred in other moths North America some years after the 1848 record of the B. betualria.There are actually several alleles of the gene responsible for color that form a dominence hierarchy with the fully black morph (called carbonaria) as the top dominant and the typical as recessive. The intermediate forms are referred to as insularia. They are uncommon. At any rate, by 1895, 98% of observed B. betularia in industrialized areas were carbonaria."
p5292
aS"Both. It's where a human life begins but not a life yet."
p5293
aS"You're right, I think he has made such comments. Sorry. I think he's wrong and went too far."
p5294
aS'You think "the unborn child is worthy of protection"..."but not more so than the mother, probably less"...yet you believe "in most circumstances the child should be carried to term?"'
p5295
aS"Yer lucky you ain't as old as me. They would have loved you with the M-1!"
p5296
aS"And Atilla's army of as many as 1/2 million men was beaten and forced into retreat by the Romans and Visigoths in 451AD. A year later, he was forced to make peace after devastating the Roman countryside...but NOT Rome itself.He died a year later in 453AD."
p5297
aS'Oh it\'s no mistake Montalban. I, unlike you, am quite clear in my arguments, and have a direction and a goal. We can take your other definitions of creationism one at a time, thank you very much. I\'d like to first focus on the one that involves your god, or any god, described as being unknowable (which you have said your god is). Will you "allow" us to focus on ONE thing? You see, if we have a list of 4 things, and we go through them one by one, we can maybe arrive at the end!!! Crazy thought isn\'t it!'
p5298
aS"I'm not sure where anyone said it related to evolution, the big bang, etc., but I might have missed something."
p5299
aS"But it should be the job of science to establish a clear line between just where established fact stops and philosophy starts. There's no indication that they're getting it done."
p5300
aS"You're working at the wrong end of the problem. We need young to survive. It's the old that are expendable."
p5301
aS'But that is your goal whether you want to admit it or not. And that is your sole way of defending creationism as you have admitted you cannot argue creationism based on its own merits. Creationism is wrong independent of Evolution. Even if you somehow manage to disprove evolution (along with every science) you still have to even take a single step towards proving Creationism.'
p5302
aS'you based this (and other claims) on a summary of the biomorphs program at website that either a) didn\'t also provide dawkins limitations on the program or b) had the limitations and you didn\'t bother to relay this information to the forum. You then make incredulous statements about how unrealistic the biomorphs are. any quotations of web pages are irrelevant because they do not address the basic issue that you are suggesting dawkins puts the biomorphs forth as a model of evolution and natural selection. This is not true as i have quoted part of his book that puts limitations on the biomorphs program, and draws attention to what "morals" should be drawn out of the biomorphs.'
p5303
aS"You don't have to be the best organism to survive. You just have to be good ENOUGH."
p5304
aS'Well firstly we do not know that "volition" must be embodied in living organisms only - computers MIGHT be capable of exhibiting it. I think you will find that there is NO valid reason for believing otherwise. And volition itself is NOT a defining characteristic of life. No biologist would buy that assumption. Sponges, bacteria, corn plants etc etc etc are mindless organisms and so far as can be determined do not act out of volition.'
p5305
aS'Just to be sure you understood, it was the picture below that picture you were supposed to look at.'
p5306
aS'And you believe that to be what? You really need to just say who/what you think the Creator is to save us from having to make all these clarification posts.'
p5307
aS'So what if he dislikes science? If he believes something else, he has the right to believe that way. My problem here is that he shows more closed-mindedness to the viewpoints of others.'
p5308
aS"It doesn't matter whether it is religous or not. The odds of anyboy being fired over such a thing are slim to none. Morning after pills can not possibly make up eough of any given pharmacys revenue to make it worth the expense of replacing a skilled employee."
p5309
aS'this statement isn\'t logical.It does not follow that if the person who creates the laws has to therefore follow them or can\'t change them...or even that they apply to him. If a teacher says "no talking in the classroom" it doesn\'t apply to the teacher now does it.'
p5310
aS'So please, feel free to leave this thread to those who DO wish to discuss the issue. No one is forcing you to discuss the topic of this or any other thread. I notice you evidently are not interested in "Understanding "Sexual Prejudice"" That is absolutely fine with me.Or are you now opposed to "Freedom of Speech" also?'
p5311
aS'Not true Our laws were originally founded on the precepts of the 10 commandments........'
p5312
aS"So then women who are pregnant shouldn't be allowed to   1) Smoke   2) Take any kind of drug that could possibly harm the child   3) Drink   or do any otherwise legal action?   And VOR takes another giant step towards fascism."
p5313
aS"But the belief that 'its gotten us far' is itself a 'scientific' type belief, in fact it has less proof on the empirical assumptions than the science itself. Justifying the validity of experience by experience is the intellectual equivalent of saying'God must exist, because God is good and would not allow a world without God'."
p5314
aS'Oh, buddy, Atheism has EVERYTHING to do with that. The morality-less framework of Atheism ALLOWED them to justify the horrors that they inflicted.'
p5315
aS"I may be a pro-gunner but what doe's that have to do with with gay rights?   Since I'm a pro- gunner I won't force my life style or views on you,if you don't force yours on me.Deal?   After all you seem to be the expert on gay rights."
p5316
aS'1 - It is innacurate. We allow killing in times of war, in self defense, and in state sanctioned executions. So we already have a situation where, when given X mitigating factors, it is justifiable to take a life. It is impossible to say all life is equal, and then to apply that as law. People will be outraged. I know I would be.2 - Objective to who? Who gets to decide how valuable life is? And why should they get to? And who says they are right? The relative value of life works fine, thanks very much.'
p5317
aS'Actually, as long as any group is not breaking laws, their ownership of guns is legal. The KKK can even own guns as long as the KKK is abiding by the law. I noticed Brady refered to the KKK as a mob, I get the picture Brady thinks that if gun owners gather for whatever the reason, that we are mobs as well, but when his side gathers they are an organization. And no Brady, I dont belong to or associate with hate groups.'
p5318
aS"Don't you think this would fit the 'Creationism is nothing but lie's thread a bit better? Although I notice The Skeptic making disparaging remarks about your examples, it seems he attacks you more than deal with the well documented   examples you have."
p5319
aS'But the big bang did not create matter. Matter can neither be created nor destroyed. The matter was already there.You might just as easily ask if god was there to create the universe, where did this god come from.Your answer would be that god has always been there, but I would argue that the matter has always been there. The only difference between these theories is that mine has one less assumption.'
p5320
aS"Again, this wasn't just about you and me. I do think you corrected someone's spelling and if you didn't it was another creationist."
p5321
aS"Yes, they do show a faithful devotion to the ultimate reality that there are no gods. You're an atheist, aren't you?"
p5322
aS'Please define "climb upward" and "downhill slide" in biologically meaningful terms. Please define "degeneration."'
p5323
aS"Considering your previous comment, that isn't you. Once again, that opinion is based upon who you read."
p5324
aS'Steve - its not about qualifications - its about impact. Women are the ones who get pregnant, we should have more authority in the matter.'
p5325
aS'Having human DNA does not necessarily make one a human being. Transgenic animals can have human DNA, does that make them human beings.'
p5326
aS"Because you know the peer review process is biased. Anything submitted for peer review with a recognizable name like Dembski or Behe will be automatically rejected before the first word is read. The scientific community's problems are just that big."
p5327
aS"So you're accusing me of the thing that your most guilty of? As I remember your posts have been censored several times by admin because you resorted to viscious personal attacks and name calling. And aren't you interested in the truth. Why isn't whether Jefferson said it or not important?"
p5328
aS"No, that was not an argument. It was an illustration of a point. The point was this: that in order to stand in moral judgment of God, you would have to be of higher moral character than God. In other words, you would have to be God in order to judge God. Now, the point I made is that this is highly unlikely, as any being claiming to be God would not misspell words, no matter how closely the letters are on the keyboard.To be clear, I was not attacking you (at least I didn't intend to) by calling out your spelling mistake. I was trying to illustrate a point. And the point was this: you are not perfect, and therefore, you are not God. And if you are not God, then you really cannot stand in moral judgment of God."
p5329
aS'And once it has begun, which would you rather have?'
p5330
aS'the blog is just the link for the article....geez, get a grip.'
p5331
aS'But it\'s not detecting any "new" wavelength. It\'s just detecting a wavelength that our eyes are incapable of detecting. You can\'t see radio waves, so radio waves are meaningless to your eye, but they\'re not meaningless to your clock radio receiver.'
p5332
aS'With all the debt Obama has generated for our nation, he deserves to be filibustered into the ground. For too long the democrats had absolute power and ran amok and unchecked, answering to absolutely nobody and ignoring the will and the voice of the people.'
p5333
aS"The thing is the Dempski didn't provide any kind of testable or detectable definition about what information is either. He used vague but scienficially sounding terms to push his case. He knew it too."
p5334
aS"George Bush won the majority of votes (the first majority winner in 16 years) in an election with the highest turnout in US history (>117Million voters). The Senate Minority Leader was defeated by a nobody. Democrats lost at least 3 seats in each of the House and Senate, something that never happens in a Presidential election year. This gave the Republican majority in both branches of Congress even more control. 11 Liberal ballot initiatives went down in flames by huge margins. If liberalism ISN'T dead, then it's in ICU on a heart and lung machine. emoticonXRolleyes "
p5335
aS"Because there are people who are trying to deny the theory of evolution it's place as a vital part of public school's biology curriculum."
p5336
aS'Did you read the article? A capuchin is type of monkey, in this case, the type that was used in the experiment.'
p5337
aS"It is an acronym for 'Y'oung 'E'arth 'C'reationist. In other words... someone who believes that the earth is only 6,000 - 10,000 years old and was created in six days by a being known as God."
p5338
aS"Well I guess Nato basically::p summed it up:Stupid is as stupid doe's."
p5339
aS'And it is much easier to have an abortion than to be a mother.'
p5340
aS"It's one thing that stands between us and a mindless theocracy. It protects the freedom of women from would-be ayatollahs who would make them sexual slaves."
p5341
aS'What are you talking about? Please define information. What does "new" information have to do with natural selection or evolution? Evolution is NOT defined by evolutionary biologists as an increase in information.So I ask again, please define information in a meaningful way as it applies to DNA and the genome of an organism.'
p5342
aS'But the law of angular momentum does not require that all parts of a spinning object spin in the same way now does it. If so then something like a rotary engine for an aircraft would not be possible!'
p5343
aS'No, not in the least. It\'s real intent was to throw a bone to the people pretending to have "family values". The religious right, the conservatives, that lot.'
p5344
aS"I think that we've got to draw a line at some point, to demarcate between adult and child. Where ever we do draw it, it will seem, in some situations to be arbitrary. If we made it 20, the question would be why 20 year olds and not 19. Through the years society has determined that by 18 people should have attained enough life experience to form intent and to comprehend that their actions have consequences (at least as it applies to the death penalty, they can be tried as adults w/o death). We don't execute people who can't comprehend the nature of their crimes and society says that, under 18 you can't fully comprehend criminal actions."
p5345
aS"I believe the large majority of such deaths occur among inner city kids who don't know anything about guns except for what they see on TV and movies."
p5346
aS'Huh? With a 26" barrel the .50 is good out to 2100 yards. With the 29 or 36 that increases to 2500, but the world record sniper shot was made with a .50 BMG and it was 2657 (1.51 miles).'
p5347
aS"Actually I don't deal with spanish or french because I don't have to. I speak english. emoticonXRolleyes"
p5348
aS'Preganancy should not be used as a punitive measure against women who are sexual. What you think is not reflective of the reality of women and their cicumstances that exist in the world. The reasons to abort are numerous and complicated. Some reasons are more valid than others. But you have no way of knowing that for millions of women, only they can really know.And although there are some youngsters in this forum who negate life experience, it is not to be negated. Ther is a lot to be said for "walking in a mile in another\'s shoes". Be careful about your desire to take the life circumstances of a stranger in your hands. Are you ready to be morally cuplable for the damage you could do?'
p5349
aS"Thats a very good question. To be honest - I would prefer no legislation period - but I would not get up in arms about a late term restriction like I described because 1) a fetus could very well survive outside of the mom at that point, 2) most reputable doctors won't conduct an abortion at that stage without a legitimate medical reason anyway."
p5350
aS'I think a free society works better by saying "You have to have at least a certain variety to give your customers a choice in products". Businesses should have the restrictions, not private citizens.'
p5351
aS"That's not exactly true now, is it? People get to vote for elected officials, and that's all that's guaranteed federally. Some states have provisions for allowing people to vote on local laws, but in some states the government is allowed to prevent the vote. And of course there is no provision at all allowing the people to vote on federal laws. So in point of fact it is a true statement that in the United States someone is not allowed to vote on X, for some values of X."
p5352
aS'How is that related to deterrence?       Once again, deterrence is preventing through the fear of consequences.      What you are talking about is not related to the subject of deterrence.'
p5353
aS'True, but what i was trying to state is that the bible has little to do with christianity if you dont believe in it. I know many christians who believe in god, and jesus etc, but think the bible is completely false, and is only a book of fables. Thats what i was trying to imply.'
p5354
aS'You know, I heard that from my mom last week. My parents moved to Arkansas when my dad retired a few years back. Mom thought it was amusing and disgusting that the state she moved to would have voted in such an alarming manor yet takes no measure to secure the marriages they already have. Ironic indeed.'
p5355
aS"You SERIOUSLY need to take a basic biology course so you can stop sticking your foot in your mouth emoticonXRolleyes An egg is NOT larva, and larva is NOT a caterpillar, and a caterpillar is NOT a butterfly - much the same as a zygote is NOT a embryo, and a embryo is NOT a fetus, and a fetus is NOT a baby, and a baby is NOT an adult. I challenge you to prove that a larva is exactly the same as a butterfly. If you can't even do something as simple as that, then you'll never understand the process/transformation of what a human has to go through, and THAT in and of itself should give you a clue as to how much in denial you are in, and how much you have to twist the truth around just to justify your version of events. Deal with it!"
p5356
aS'This seems to conflict with some of your earlier posts wherein you support terrorists.'
p5357
aS'And if there are two competing hypotheses that are actually hard to choose between? As they get closer, it becomes less possible to choose by instinct or testing. A principle comes in handy.'
p5358
aS'Would that work like the ban on illegal drugs in American? Does that ban keep illegal drugs out of American? The ban on illegal drugs does one thing, it does keep illegal drugs from law-abiding citizens. Law-abiding citizens are the only ones that respect the law when it comes to bans.'
p5359
aS"For me, this is like the idea that the speed of light was once very fast and has now slowed down. Both ideas indirectly call god a liar. This is bad. If all of our experiments show the Earth is 4.5 billion years old, then that is how old it is. If the Bible says something different, then either God meant Genesis for peoples past and now uses scientists to explain things better (though I am uncomfortable with this idea as many scientists are atheists), or our puny minds, compared with God's, haven't yet worked out how Genesis and an old Earth tie together."
p5360
aS"The comic relief doesn't even recognize it has passed in on, or attempted to!"
p5361
aS"YES! the founding fathers realized government was to serve the people it governed. With out a set of rules that limited the government it would run wild (as england did). They made the bill of rights and constitution so that it would limit the government (to keep it from becoming too powerful, and overstepping it's bounds). And the only way the constitution could actually be enforced was for the population to uphold it.Back in the time of it's writing they probably saw the best way for a population to force a government to not over step it's bounds was to force it... er... by force.Today in the information age, a much better weapon is our right to vote. Sweeping changes can be implemented with out the use of force using the system. "
p5362
aS'But you are forgetting life-without-parole (and I do mean WITHOUT parole). With life without parole, there is also no recidivism.'
p5363
aS"And there are plenty of people who smoke who don't develop lung cancer. You're cherry picking."
p5364
aS"Right. And that is the reason for peer review. Creationists don't subject their ramblings to peer review. That is why so much care is devoted to the proper construction of experiments to test the hypotheses by real scientists. Creationists just invent ad hoc stories without any experimentation."
p5365
aS'A more precise term would be "broaden," since nothing about the definition pertaining to the people currently covered by it would be affected, "diluted" or altered in any way anyone has yet demonstrated. Nothing about the definition that pertains to people who already are, or can be married changes one iota. Their rights, benefits, and protections remain exactly the same. The only "change" would be to other  people, people who have no connection to, nor impact on, the marriages of anyone else: the gays who\'ll marry if the legal definition is broadened to encompass them. And the only "change" in that regard will be the fact that they are  encompassed by it, nothing more. No substantive aspect of the definition as it currently stands changes in the slightest.The change is not in the definition itself. It\'s in who it applies to.'
p5366
aS"Excuse me, but you didn't fully read what he wrote. He didn't say that he supported abortion. He said that he wasn't as much a freak about it as you're being."
p5367
aS"Evolution wasn't introduced until 1859. When did abortion become popular?The industrial revolution occurred in the 1800s. Maybe that was the cause of abortion's alleged popularity.Grover Cleveland was elected in the 1800s. Clearly he had something to do with the alleged increase in abortion's popularity.The American Civil War occurred in the 1800s. It must have been the impetus for the rise in popularity of abortion.A human embryo does have features that look like gill slits. They are not gills but pharyngeal clefts. No modern book presents any information that human embryros have gill slits as if it is fact."
p5368
aS"Well let me put it like this, I consider it your duty because if you don't protect yourself then you basically shift that responsibility to someone else. Not only is this incredibly selfish, but 9 out of 10 times the 'protection business' gets outsourced to the State.This in itself it dangerous because when people decide that a third party like the State (which has no real accountability) has control over their lives it can all to easily lead to a situation where the State becomes tyrannical.More people have been killed by their own government than by any foreign government."
p5369
aS"Hang on....think about it.......if there is a large group of people who live in the south, and this large group of people moved to the north, WHY -- being from the south -- would there be anyone in the population that had light skin? Look at Iraq -- all those people have the same exact skin color. Same with Kenya. Same with Japan. Same with Russia. Thus, if any of those groups of people were to migrate, they'd all be in the same boat! There would be NO measurable variation of skin color. Your premise is faulty -- as is the whole premise of Toe."
p5370
aS"And can you please tell me the difference between nonrandom variation and directed variation? I'd also like a link to verify what you say. Thank you. God Bless!"
p5371
aS'And yet you "and other women" feel free to impose their version of reality on innocent lives.'
p5372
aS'So...what was all that bull**** about terrorists exploiting America\'s "weak gun control laws" in order to amass arsenals of deadly weapons?It seems to me that they don\'t need undercover operatives to come to America, forge documents and undergo background checks just to get civilian weapons. They\'ve got their own arms manufacturing plants over there, they can make whatever they need or want.'
p5373
aS"Apart from the 'horizontally instead of vertically' part which I didn't understand - we're a hundred or so years too late, unfortunately. You might as well ask for an example of a book or website on cosmology that 'admits' the sun may just be a big ball of fire pushed by a scarab beetle, and not a nuclear furnace about which the earth orbits. There comes a point where continuing to seriously 'consider' a viewpoint becomes a waste of time and resources, because sufficient testing has been done and evidence recovered to discount it. We may one day encounter evidence that completely overturns the whole applecart, but so far it hasn't happened."
p5374
aS'The quality of life ethic is far different from sactity/dignity of life ethic. A quality of life ethic carried out to its logical conclusions does not promote a pro-life society. Instead, there would be genocide against the handicapped, elderly, and people who people of power have deemed life unworthy of life. The problem with this ethic is that it is centered in arbritrary people deciding arbritarily which person passes the "quality of life" test.'
p5375
aS"Actually, I don't ask how the idea occurred. As I mentioned, Darwin suggested it. I'm not sure what the rese of that paragraph means."
p5376
aS'Because everyone is equal in the eyes of the law, and rightly so. As for moral standing, you see no problem with equating his immoral behaviour with your own response. Most would.'
p5377
aS'Actually there is a better solution.   Mandatory male and female birth control pills, financial penalties if you stop taking. Anyone who would get off the pill would want a kid, therefore, abortions would cease.'
p5378
aS'I think you do not know what you are talking about. Your description fits the matter "god" you belive in.'
p5379
aS'Anyway Duo_Maxwell this isn\'t only creationist debaters, there are many more who do the same thing with different debates. you also forgot7. Make random accusations of logical fallacies when they have no idea what they even mean. Example: You said that my spelling is wrong, that\'s the biggest strawman I\'ve ever heard8. Correct spelling mistakes and convienantly not answer the question. Example: "What do you thinkk of carbon dating?" "you spelled think wrong". If you want to correct spelling, fine but answer the question as well.'
p5380
aS'Yes because it is "officially" a life.Whether a person believes in life at conception or not they all agree it is life at birth and half way through life it is still life and right before death it is still life.If she does not want the child she can refrain from sex,use a contraceptive or abortion.If he does not want it he can refrain from sex (not likely for men),use a condom (not a guarantee to work),have surgery (hard to reverse) but that is it.So if he was to use a condom and get her pregnant she still has the last option.'
p5381
aS"Well, since you've called those who've disagreed with you here stupid (and variations thereof), and insinuated that they're too stoned to understand you, I think you have the most ground to make up. You also provide no support for your statements, most of which were debunked years ago as drug czar propoganda."
p5382
aS'Ludacris and many others in the hip hop scene disrespect women with their lyrics and videos. Much of what hip hop puts out contributes to unwanted pregnancies.'
p5383
aS'You have to remember that those christians believe that the laws of God superceed those of man. That thier allegiance is to God and his laws above those of the constitution. They also believe that all should be subject to Gods by force if nesesary.'
p5384
aS"You're an idiot who has obviously never worked ina first responder category. If you think that increasing the volume and social acceptance of drug use to the same level of alcohol will 'solve' anything, then you are just an idiot. You have obviously never seen whart drug abuse does to families and people's lives. You're right, alcohol is worse, and the main reason its worse is because of 2 reasons, volume and availability ala social acceptance. Legalizing all drugs would have catastrophic social impacts.Don't feed me that line about taxing it and using the money for rehab. We have taxed the XXXX out of tobacco and alcohol the last 100 years and the last time I checked alcoholism and lung cancer hadn't been erradicated."
p5385
aS'But it, along with the uranian tapeworm hypothesis, is just as valid as intellegent design as a hypothesis. Actually, the uranian tapeworm hypothesis,. as far fetched as it may be, is more testable than a supernatural designer.I think maybe the kids SHOULD be taught intellegent design as an example of pseudo-science. Hopefully they will see why it is not science and why evolutionary theory is.'
p5386
aS"You mean that it must have has a beginning, don't you?"
p5387
aS"Yes, but if seen from space (something the ancients couldn't do) it LOOKS like it hangs on nothing. Don't worry, I don't mind spelling it out for you."
p5388
aS"And I think that if I fall off a tall cliff, I'll die. Does that mean that gravity and science are either evil or incorrect?"
p5389
aS'Yes. It describes an action without ascribing its form to its end result, outcome, whatever but strictly to a cause/s force/s in action. That is why \'selection\' is always teleological. In order to select or choose anything, an end must always be in view. There must always be a volitional discrimination of options based upon a criterion dictated by the desired end. The only time "channel" becomes teleological is when something live [a human or a beaver, let\'s say] intententionally does the channeling. But since it is understood that mechanical forces can also \'channel\', unintentional, out of simple mechanics, the word channel cannot be called teleological. In the same way, \'sorting\' can be considered non-teleological, hence mechanical, and thus suited to your glossary, because things can be sorted by mechanical forces alone. But \'selection\' always requires volition and awareness. So \'selection\' is always teleological.'
p5390
aS'You lost me there. Try them how and for what?'
p5391
aS'And here we have a leading YEC showing how he starts with his preexisting religious position and is not about to change it, no matter what the scientific evidences show.'
p5392
aS'Invalid argument to assert that mutations can map a road outside of their assigned task in illogical, where would the information to do so come from? Biology works because every individual cell doing what it was created to do along with what the one next to it was, though created to perform another set of instructions creates the molecular change that the combination of the cells together would produce. But there is no additional information there... not int he way you assert.'
p5393
aS'Said like a cruel evil person who has no concern for his fellow man.'
p5394
aS"The idea of abortion as population control is absurd, especially forced abortions as someone mentioned a few posts ago. Anyone who has read a biology book knows the world has methods of population control on its own, we don't need to be doing stuff like that ourselves."
p5395
aS'And she was having unprotected sex? So she knew becoming pregnant was a possibility? Yeah, I could see that being condemned by pro-lifers.'
p5396
aS"That's EXACTLY the point. Regardless of whether or not human minds think differently, whichever mind produced and agrees that 2+2=4 is absolutely correct, the rest are wrong. We know this because we can observe and test the concept in the physical world and prove that it is true. This goes for just about anything, dissention in the face of facts does not change the facts.IMHO, this invalidates your claim that something produced in the human mind is not absolute due to some human minds being contradictory."
p5397
aS"Well then maybe you can prove it somehow. California has all these laws you support, and even more than that. So if they have these laws on the books and have had them for a while now, and if they're effective at fighting crime, then you must surely have evidence of some sort to prove your case."
p5398
aS'No offense, but I am in my early teens and understand the situation more than you.'
p5399
aS"What's your point? Of course they will be bound by Heller just as the courts are bound by Roe v. Wade. That point wasn't in dispute. As long as you're talking about 19th Century Second Amendment case law, I like The State v. Buzzard (1842)."
p5400
aS'1) Charliegone\'s article was a published research article.I would love to know where "NARTH\'s" editorial was published, if it even was published.2) NARTH\'s article DID NOT show any "higher homosexual activity" because of legalized gay marriage.It thoroughly failed to show ANY rise in homosexuality in ANY "gay marriage" country. It showed some studies which were reportedly done in those countries, but that\'s it.'
p5401
aS'And how exactly do you propose this suggestion actually be enforced? Have you got it all thought out and prepared to defend in a debate, or are you just throwing out what the liberal loonies tell you is a good idea?'
p5402
aS'Sigh...for the ill informed who understand nothing about their religion. http://www.religioustolerance.org/abo_hist.htm'
p5403
aS'It is so the womans decision. If the baby is in the womb they haven\'t experience life, so how can they miss it. And if they are a so called "soul" then they will come out somewhere else.'
p5404
aS"So, you don't see how stating that in a functioning democratic society guns belong only in the hands of the state is not anti gun?? Maybe you could give us an example of a statement that is more anti gun that that because I am having trouble imagining one."
p5405
aS"I'll give you that, though there is a whole school of debate about what thoughts are."
p5406
aS'I see no mention below of any judges in Mass.'
p5407
aS'Which of course says volumes. On the other hand such metaphors are appropriate in many cases. For example consider the vaccination program for smallpox which eradicated the disease FAPP. It was indeed a struggle and new tools and techniques were critical to reaching the objective. From Jenner to the end of the virus as a human pathogen.'
p5408
aS'And you will cowardly ignore the validity of the difference, as you whine that there is one ...A person goes to the doctor, that information is NOT public information. A doctor / patient can claim doctor/patient confidentiality. It\'s a recognized and valid situation.But with the "knowthyneighbor", these polls are PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE. The purpose of publicizing them is to prevent fraud.If you weren\'t so intent on trying to bash, you would recognize the obvious distinctions... emoticonXRolleyes'
p5409
aS'Yes, but I think you missed my point. I stated this above, remember the prohabition? People actually drank MORE alchohal. Without a ban, law abiding citizens and criminals will have them, with a ban, there will be just criminals.'
p5410
aS"And compare that to an equivalent sized human - if you compared the skill to a 10-13 year old boy, the erectus skeleton's cranial capacity would be significantly smaller. Doesn't contradict in the slightest other than the bizarre positions you decide other people should hold."
p5411
aS'I know what you meant.My comment was to demonstrate the counter side of the issue.Interracial marriage laws were overturned at a time when this country disapproved of interracial marriage by a margin of three to one.By your approach, interracial marriage laws SHOULD NOT have been overturned in the 1960\'s.In fact, by your approach we still would have had illegal interracial marriage into the late 80\'s, early 90\'s.The 14th amendment makes no proviso about allowing unjust discrimination in cases of majority rule.By your approach, WHAT WOULD BE THE POINT?If the majority disapproves of the discrimination, they simply "vote" it out of existence. No need for the courts at all.'
p5412
aS'But your own link says that the rise in crime was partially explained by the new system the UK police were using for recording crime and that the British Crime Survey showed a decrease in crime since 1997.'
p5413
aS'You say that alot but discussion is about taking other people seriously.'
p5414
aS"But is the Red Cross Christian? Obviously most contributors are Christian. That's obvious as most Americans are Christian."
p5415
aS'And your point was demonstrated to be specious using your own source. To contain strawmen even as you claimed it to be a strawman.'
p5416
aS"It wouldn't. Altering any of the fundamental universal constants changes them all. We wouldn't be considering some small change here and small change there. The universe probably wouldn't exist in any form."
p5417
aS'Not by any means. Evolution works on genetic change that future generations will inherit. Adaptation does no such thing. It changes an individual, but not its genes.For example, if my parents volunteered to be part of a scientific experiment where they two additional arms fused onto their body before I was ever conceived, I would not be born with two extra arms.On the other hand, if a genetic mutation made it advantageous to have two additional arms, and both my parents had that mutation, I would be born with both arms.'
p5418
aS'How do you explain the change of appearance of the animals over time, as recorded by fossils?'
p5419
aS"That's not evidence, that's an assertion. As for my dogs (cats), yes. They do put on a winter coat in the much warmer winter climate than Arizona in which I live. So I return to my original question, on what evidence do you base your claim that an arctic fox would not change color in the winter in Arizona?"
p5420
aS"The Second Amendment does not apply to an Ohio Law. Thus, this ban is not unconstituitonal under the US Constitution. The Ohio Constitution, may however, protect gun rights, but I haven't read it."
p5421
aS"I'm sure you reproduce these quotes in good faith, but you ought to know they are not necessarily what they seem. The Darwin quote is a particularly craven quote mine: he was expressing empathy with those of his readers who found it difficult to imagine how such a thing as an eye could evolve by stages; effectively putting himself in their place so that he might more readily take them by the hand and show them how such evolution may occur, with ample supporting evidence from the natural world. I refer you to the Quote Mine Project for further edification."
p5422
aS'How do you know carbon dating is so accurate? Would you bet your life on it?'
p5423
aS"No, we shouldn't abolish every flawed system. However, when the flaw results in putting innocent people to death, it is not worth the risk.In 26 years the death penalty has been in effect in my home state of Illinois, there have been more people exonerated due to irrefutable evidence than have been put to death. I think that constitutes a serious problem."
p5424
aS'You know that, I know that, but the creationists do not know that.'
p5425
aS'I\'m not trying to participate in gang debate, but well..The population of "people with heart trouble" would only be in jeopardy if the heart trouble made it more difficult to reproduce. If reproduction is not hindered then there is much less chance of dying off.'
p5426
aS'People are protected by law from being harassed, assaulted and/or murdered because they are people. Not because they are a certain religion. Because they are people it would be wrong to allow such things.'
p5427
aS"I think often abortion is wrong but I do not agree with criminalizing it. Primarily the reasons that are used to justify criminilzation are hugely fallacious and secondarily because it won't do a thing that is positive. A woman who is determined to end her pregancy - will. Criminalization will simply make it extremely dangerous. I am responsible, have even had my tubes tied, but if I were to become pregnant and that pregnancy were the result of rape or a threat to my health or livlihood I would end it - and I will not be checking the law books first. Every woman has her line in the sand - abortion will go on regardless of its legal standing. There are a miriad of reasons seek abortion - comdemning those reasons does nothing (i.e. calling them selfish) - addressing them could help. The reasons are valid."
p5428
aS'Bad, bad, bad. :( 1) Reducing meat consumption will create a change towards more agricultural farming which is more sustainable for humans and the environment.1) Some, perhaps all "Livestock feed" is actually edible for humans; GM maize is regularly consumed in the US and Mexico.2) One does not have to consume those foods as there are thousands of plant foods that can be eaten.'
p5429
aS"Do me a favor. Write, in your own words, two paragraphs. One explaining the electromagnetic spectrum (and the visible spectrum's place in it), and one discussing rods and cones in the eyes."
p5430
aS'Nonsense, societies change over time, therefore they evolve. Only biological populations evolve through natural selection and the theory of evolution only applies to biological populations, but the term "evolution" applies to other things too.'
p5431
aS"No, say you've got 200 of some species. By some event, 100 member are seperated. Now we have two groups of 100. Each group goes through different selections and they accumulate small changes. Eventually, they will be different enough so that they are no longer able to interbreed. That doesn't mean one group automatically has to die so we remain at the same number of species.Of course, one group might get some significant advantage which allows it to come back and ownzor the original area so the other group gets wiped out."
p5432
aS'No baby is more precious than another as far as my personal beliefs go it is no more alright to terminate a baby concieved through rape/incest than it is to terminate a baby classed as a mistake/inconvenience.'
p5433
aS"So, you're saying that you believe in absolutely everything your church believes and you support everything it does and the moment it did anything oustide of these you'd leave right?"
p5434
aS'It is disappointing that you would continue with this mistake. I said that God is both knowable and unknowable. You simply think that equates to the same thing, and thus you argue against what you believe I say, rather than what I said.'
p5435
aS"No, I think you're trying to do more than that. You're trying to say that the increase in crime is due to a lack of gun ownership, aren't you? Because if you are, the article you cite doesn't back up that claim.   What, no actual data to back up any of your claims? Do you have access to US crime numbers? How many armed breakins do you get in a country where people do have guns? That's the comparison that needs to be made here."
p5436
aS"It depends on your intention and your methods. Of course, things that don't have some sort of physical manifestation that can be measured can't be studied by science. Science is naturalistic. Scientific data can only include that which can be observed and quantified by natural means. I read it in a book of mythology isn't scientific."
p5437
aS'Actually, you gave (and misspelled) one of the common names given to the fossil, "Turkana Boy" It is also sometimes called "Nariokotome Boy". But the real designation of the fossil is KNM-WT 15000 and any knowledgeable discussion of that fossil will refer to it as such. That fact, by the way, is how I know that Turkana Boy and Nariokotome Boy are one and the same fossil.'
p5438
aS"Archie is NOT right - he has an opinion, as we all do. Pro-lifers seem to want the definition of human with attendant rights to begin at conception. The blastocyst is now turning into a tumour. So the pro-lifers can now alter their views on what constitutes 'human' as and when it suits their purpose.Forget the emotive view of what an embryo/foetus looks like: some think that as long as it has appendages and looks human, then it IS. It isn't. It's still a parasitic organism dependant on the host mother. You can't deny that.Contraception v. abortion is a separate issue: in the meantime, the host mother should be the final arbiter of what happens to her body."
p5439
aS'Old news. There have been accusations of similar stories for years.'
p5440
aS'What if the surgery for transferring the embryo/fetus would be equal in difficulty, risk, etc. to having an abortion? There would then be no extra physical cost incurred in keeping the embryo/fetus alive. What would be the reasons, in such a case, to keep abortion as an option?'
p5441
aS"Marriage is a secular condition set up by various Societies over the millenia and one of the prerequisites set out is that such a union should be between people of different genders.Religion has supported this and sanctified it but did not invent it.You don't curse the Church you lobby Society to see if you can effect a change. People who believe the different gender aspect are entitled to lobby for no change."
p5442
aS'Same in the US. The father does not have the right to choose.'
p5443
aS'And people say I make strawman arguments.Simply put, not enough to justify your "concerns".'
p5444
aS"For anti-choicers, it's just about control and power over women. They don't care about life. (Except their own.)This same mother could be a person who didn't have access to pre-natal care. They wouldn't defend that right either.Because they DON'T care about the fetus. They don't care about life. They don't care about health. They care about power and money and pushing people around. That's all."
p5445
aS"Very sad news. I'm gonna have to say that if I was talking to the assemblyman that they quoted said that to my face, I'd tell the little bigot that his filthy viewpoint sounds exactly like the arguments used against interracial marriage, against civil rights for blacks, women, and various minorities, and also against ending slavery."
p5446
aS'So if an atheist believes that humans are the highest form of intelligence, and a devout Christian believes God is the highest form of intelligence, the Christian should allow the atheist to force him to behave as if humans are the highest form of intelligence?'
p5447
aS'How about getting the government out of marriage entirely? That is the goal of the libertarians, and maybe the liberals. No standards would be redefined if that happened, and gays would get their right to marry.'
p5448
aS'I believe that\'s true, and as a "believer" (creationist), here is what is hard to understand about that; In Matthew, 12:30, Jesus says "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters". It is safe to say that both creationists and theistic evolutionists would accept that statement from Jesus, and would seek to be "with" him, while agnostic and atheists would consider themselves "not with" him. Yet theistic evolutionists are comfortable to (usually politically) be "with" agnostics and atheists, and separate themselves from creationists. If they\'re genuine Christians, knowing about the warnings in the Bible about false teachings, how can they be comfortable with that?Miller laments in several places throughout the book that atheists use evolution as a weapon against religion, and that it shouldn\'t be that way - that it causes more strife between the two than should exist. '
p5449
aS"Well, it showed how it was physically possible to generate amino acids from inorganic material. That's rather impressive. Again, irrelevant and unrelated to the Scientific theory of Evolution, regardless of you trying to create that association. Your continued attempt at doing so despite having been shown and told multiple times that the two are unrelated, well that only shows one thing, namely that you are dishonest."
p5450
aS"Oh shut up! You're just sore because your side lost in the McDonald case and now you're left with absolutely nothing. You know that many gun laws are going to fall to the sword of justice, and you just can't stand the fact that your side is going to be brought back into check, just like any other."
p5451
aS'The big bang, life from non-life, the progression of life from the simple to the complex, just to name a few. None of these can be proved (even on the balance of probabilities) to be true by operations science. All of these contradict scientific observations of the present. As a result, you must take them by purely blind faith.'
p5452
aS'I suspect that you are thinking of birds. But early birds had fingered claws on those wings. It is generally true that no organ ever springs into existance completely developed where nothing existed before. The wings of bats, birds, and pterodactyls are merely the modified fore-limb of a tetrapod. There is evidence that insect wings may have arisen from some sort of thermal panel. And of course, size has considerable relevance to flight. Wingless spiders fly by spinning a loop of silk that is carried by the moving air. Very small insects require almost no wings to fly. What they do is more similar to a whale in water than a bird in air. If by chance, a small animal is upsized because of a competetive advantage, and the wings are too, then it becomes a larger flying animal.'
p5453
aS'The tactics pro-lifers use make the Nazis look like the little league. I mean, seriously. The reason we are dealing with terrorism is because women have the right to the abortion procedure. Wow. Please give me one way those two things relate to each other.'
p5454
aS"I'm talking about the woman, of course. The fetus does not have a positive right to suck nutrients out of the woman's body against her will."
p5455
aS"Well, not completely, but yes, quite the same. However, this is irrelivent- she wasn't a person, because she was in a coma. Does that give me the right to kill her? Of course not!   What about fetuses born in comas? Can we kill them?   What about people in vegetative states? After all, they arn't perfect, so let's kill them!"
p5456
aS'So what?? Who cares what the number of assumptions are? What we care about is whether the idea is correct. And to determine whether it is correct, you have to have data, not counting assumptions.'
p5457
aS"Well I'm not arguing that this is adaptation...I have never said that.. What I am saying is the environment -- in this case diet is the cause for these traits to emerge in offspring.....but like I said earlier ToE does not admit that the diet or any enviornmental variable can influence traits in offspring. Traits are dictated by genes and genes are closed off from the enviornment. This is the basic dogma of Weismann's barrier. I'm not necessarily calling this evolution....I'm just simply pointing out that acquired traits can be inherited. There is no other way to describe this other than Lamarckism. Do you disagree that The inheritance of acquired characteristics is simply changes in physiology acquired over the life of an organism that are transmitted to offspring?"
p5458
aS"What laws are these that you speak of? Kindly provide the bill name and number so you have some actual proof and aren't simply parroting from the fear-mongering Brady Campaign and Violence Policy Center.During World War II the American people rounded up Japanese-Americans and herded them into concentration camps because you were at war with the people of Japan and thought that they were the sleeping enemy even though they had no proof. What you're speaking of is no different than this.The way I see it Brady, your hatred for guns and gun owners is so overwhelming and logic defying, that you'd be perfectly alright with unleashing a life-ending pandemic plague on the people of earth if you believed it would put an end to all gun owners everywhere."
p5459
aS'Dealt with. Wolves and dogs share a genus, not a species. Along with coyotes and jackels. See above for lots of transitionals, also.'
p5460
aS'Now everyone will know Marc was right all along--that there is an atheist science conspiracy.'
p5461
aS"How right you are to,and given the forum here, make it a crime to own to own a gun,well I think most of us are automatically criminals.It's like the signs you see...SHOPLIFTERS WILL BE PROSECUTED!lot a good they do.emoticonXBanghead,yeah know matter how illegal their will be crime."
p5462
aS'You hear that cry...allowing gays to marry will cause the downfall of civilization...but you never hear "how" or "why"? More Chicken Little ####.'
p5463
aS"So you refuse to engage in an informal debate on the topic, but you all of a sudden are itchin' for a formal debate? How about you make the challenge?"
p5464
aS'That is a nice little pistol with lots of smack for only 11 onces. Also, I like DA automatics.'
p5465
aS"The issue of whether or not gay marriage is a 'human' / 'civil' right is begging the question ..."
p5466
aS"It isn't offered to make that assertion at all. It is offered to show that God values the life of the unborn if He will demand that a man responsible for causing its death in the womb be held accountable by paying the ultimate price."
p5467
aS"Well, I didn't really mean to go that far. But I'm talking about problems like that all worked out, thought about previously, and that the problem was worked out. I'm talking more about, what if you could make laborers stronger, scientists smarter, and rid us of physical and mental abnormalities ( such as down syndrome, narcolepsy, etc.). I don't think of making everyone the same for that reason. I'm just saying, what if there was a way to better society without going overboard? If the problems were worked out, which I'm sure they will be, what would your moral view on it be?"
p5468
aS'I suggested nothing. You are reading into this some thing that is absent. "The nurse then informed me, if I had answered yes to any of the questions, I would have lost my concealed carry permit as it would have gone into my medical records and the VA would have reported it to Homeland Security. Looks like they are going after us vets."'
p5469
aS'But even worse, even if there were some unknown mechanism to cause such movement, it would generate heat. The heat generated by the creation of the mountains of the world would be more than enough to reduce the entire surface to molten lava. Add to that the fact that the condensation of the "vapor canopy" would release enough heat to boil all of the water on earth. '
p5470
aS'Oh no, I completely hit the point and exposed it for what it is. Your continuing to compare the ID concept to a flat earth belief proves my point even more. That and the fact that you referred to the flying spaghetti monster seven times in your last post.'
p5471
aS'Well, "reasonable" is clearly subjective... So the authors of the letter are practicly saying that any gun laws not interfering with the state militia would be permited according to the second amendment. But that gun laws obviously should be reasonable. But what reasonable is, is best left to the democratic will of the people. Or am I reading it wrong?'
p5472
aS"In case you were wondering, no one here has missed the fact that you're trying to divert attention from the real issues by beating one minor issue into the ground."
p5473
aS"Actually, my wife and I discuss evolution all the time. She's an evolutionary biologist. She did feel as if she had some duty to watch the show, just to stay on top of the sorts of things being said. She just has a low tolerance for willful stupidity. Which I totally understand. :)"
p5474
aS'No Ted Kennedy is not a fundie but Vitter is. For God sake the pope is a nazi and a fundie.Marlene Elwell, the nazi *itch, who put the evil mariage amendment on the michigan ballot is a Roman Catholic also. If you are a christian and you believe in the suppression of homosexuality then you are a fundie and a christianist.'
p5475
aS'Even new Justice Sotomayor, who claimed she ruled by precedent will be bound by the Heller Decision if she remains true to her purported philosophy. The debate between Sui Juris and Res Judicia should no longer be an issue with the liberals on this RIGHT! It either applies to all or it applies to none which would result as Justice W.O. Douglas wrote: "a revolution". It is in the government\'s (federal especially) best interests to keep our soldiers employed in foreign countries. BTW, I think the court decision in Nunn vs. State of Georgia did the best summation of this right!'
p5476
aS"Your claim is not supported in the least. If we look to the landmark abortion case Roe v. Wade, we find that it was not women seeking abortions that were punished, but the people who procured the abortion that were. It would be the same if abortion were again made illegal. To prove this, we need only to look at a recent abortion regulatory statute: the Partial Birth Abortion Ban Act. Needless to say, there are far less doctors who perform abortions than there are women who seek them, and because it was not a problem executing abortion law prior to 1973, it likewise won't be a problem executing abortion law should abortion be made illegal again."
p5477
aS"If guns laws don't affect criminals then how do you explain the low rates of criminal gun use in nations like the UK?"
p5478
aS"So it is claimed.   Tiahrt Amendment Facts | ProtectPolice.org   I've noticed a pattern. Pro-gun activists give lip service to the idea of enforcing the law and catching the bad guys while supporting legislation that actually makes it harder for law enforcement to do so. They send a mixed message. It's happened before such as when the NRA has lobbied Congress to reduce the budget of the ATF. How can reducing the budget of law enforcement help them do their job better? It gives us a clue to what the gun lobby's true motives are. Truly disturbing."
p5479
aS"You were crowing a bit. What I don't understand is why. How could you possibly be pleased by some strangers religious views. Would you have been pleased if he switched to liking broccoli? (Or disliking as the case may be)"
p5480
aS'Were they able to show a previously non-existing code that mutated on a gene somewhere and created this new enzyme activity? It sounds to me that this "new" enzymatic activity came from non-coding dna switching on a gene to produce it. That is what one would expect to find. ...*Two new enzyme activities, 6-aminohexanoate cyclic dimer hydrolase and 6-aminohexanoate dimer hydrolase, were detected inthe adapted strains.*... '
p5481
aS'This is actually humorous coming from you who has absolutely no concept that you are a spiritual being, or the extra dimension of yourself which that reality means to you. In other words antonia, It is the epitome of self deceit to lie to oneself about who they are. And you define that darkness which is the great lie you represent so completely.'
p5482
aS"And we know this how? You complain about the 90% figure being erroneous and then make an unsupported statement like this?Furthermore, if Mexico is making an earnest attempt to smash the cartels and we're financing it in part, wouldn't we want to help reduce the weapons traffic flowing south into the cartel's arsenals?"
p5483
aS'Well, it seems pretty evident that you have know idea of the meaning of the word theory when used in science.'
p5484
aS'Actually, it is a mutation. Just like the color of the fur is a mutation. Polar bear fur is not white, it is colorless. Moreover, it is hollow. That is another mutation. And Polar bears have longer legs than their closest relatives, the brown bears. They have smaller ears. None of the changes are caused by "friction".By the way, the webs between the toes of a Polar bear are very much like the webs between the toes of a duck.Adaptation is, by the way, evolution. I presume that is the word you meant to use. Adaptation is not adaption. You talk about the process as if it were adaption and then call it adaptation. In reality it is adaptation.'
p5485
aS'No it means that the genome operates in a more complex way than was previously believed. It does not mean that "life is irreducibly complex" since that term is not even sufficiently well defined to test the assertion. And given the scattering of information into many pieces I would say that more and more it looks like "pieces that happen to be fitted together". More and more like a complex kludge. Exactly what one might expect to find in an evolved system rather than a designed or deliberate or intentional one!'
p5486
aS"It's been reported in the Telegraph as well as several other news outlets. Want to slander them as well or do you want to try to disprove their story based on its content. I suggest the former, because the University has already confirmed the authenticity of the e-mails and documents. emoticonXRolleyes"
p5487
aS'Well survival of the fittest was not Darwins term- although he may of used it it the later editions of the Origin. The phase was actually coined by Herbert Spencer in 1851.Weiner could be forgiven for his statement- if he had read the first edition of the Origin (regarded as being the best version as it contains no responses to critiscsms that were levelled at the preceeding editions) he would not have come across it under Darwins name.It is moot really, as natural selection is the term that is used in this context today.'
p5488
aS"I think the currently popular belief is that time itself is limited. Space, time, energy, matter and laws all came into existence together. Of course that's impossible for us to envisage...."
p5489
aS"You don't beleive that it is possible to do something wrong to prevent a larger number of wrongs in the future? Do you think the ends can ever justify the means?"
p5490
aS"No you haven't. You expressed your opinion but refuted nothing."
p5491
aS"Again, it's not just 'evidence' but 'evidence constructed into a workable theory'."
p5492
aS'And yet this is what they fossil record shows. There is alot of information floating around on the uses of feathers for insulation, hunting techniques, display etc before flight.Half a feather might not be as good for flight as a "fully developed" one, but dinosaurs had them and they probably were able to glide, albeit poorly, with them. Even less of a feather might shade a pool of water to allow them to spot small fish or for display to attract a potential mate. To say they were "totally useless", is simply false. Evolution works on adapting already functional structures for different functions.'
p5493
aS"I don't see why it is so hard to accept he lied. He lost is award and lost his job over his data."
p5494
aS"Do you mean someone who was wrong? I asked you before to give an example of where Newton found empirical evidence of God. You failed to do so. I suspect that you can't."
p5495
aS'I see a subtle distinction here. Creationism is concerned with the spiritual origins of people. "Evolutionism" is entirely concerned with explaining the nature and history of the physical world. The conflict of opinion arises out of the importance of the detail- can Genesis be accepted as a parable which contains a fundemental truth or must it be taken as a historical account?'
p5496
aS'You answered the first one already... it is a \'cartoon\'. It showed that just as one was out-lawed, the other was born. You decide what to believe from this.By the way..."Lockheed Martin is a global leader in the design, development and production of missiles and missile defense solutions for the United States and its allies around the world. The goal: Defend against attacks by ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and other airborne threats."http://www.lockheedmartin.com/wms/fi...=0&ti=0&sc=400'
p5497
aS'Oh never mind that such a condition would be toxic...not to mention that no ice cores support such magical ideas.'
p5498
aS"I'm not moving the goal posts, this is just your attempt at intellectual dishonesty. Heller was about an individual right protected in the Constitution, Dred Scott wasn't. Therefore these two cases aren't comparable anymore than cotton candy and scrap metal."
p5499
aS'And what evidence do you have that having two gay parents would confuse a child about weahter they should be gay? Did you know that the same percentage of children that were brought up by gay couples turn out to be gay as children who are brought up by straight couples? I would say that destroys your conception that the kid would be confused.I know a number of people who were brought up by commited gay couples (admittedly not many), and not one of the ones I know turned out to be gay.'
p5500
aS"One shouldn't assume ignorance on the part of creationists. That is a mistake that too many evolutionists make.   In the real world, we have people willing to say things they already know isn't true. Why should creationists be any different? After all, they are people, too. But rather than accept that fact, evolutionists argue that creationists are ignorant of a subject when, in reality, they (creationists) were simply telling lies."
p5501
aS'So Minnesota is the one state Ohioprof was referring to?'
p5502
aS"Well, all I can say then is that no action is just about as bad as failed action, and IS as bad in terms of anything current. Either way you don't have gay marriage. You have a majority in Congress right now, and you're not demanding much change just because of fear of backlash? Yeah, there would be backlash. Heck, the Civil War was the ultimate backlash, but that didn't stop abolitionists from demanding more than TOKEN change, and it's a good thing they did. It's your gig, though, so do what you want. I don't see much point in laboring this discussion any more; I'm just pointing out my observations."
p5503
aS'When was the last mass murder at a UK university then?'
p5504
aS"Atheism doesn't have that standard because it's not that encompassing a thought. All athiesm is, is a lack of theism, period. It says nothing about morals or ethics. Your typical athiest, though, looks within to find what's moral or ethical and it usually just stems from what's acceptable behavior within the human species. This is also where religion gets its morality and ethics. But times change, and eating shellfish won't kill you, and eating meat on friday won't make the farmers go broke, so the morals and ethics change to fit the society."
p5505
aS'But Miller is with Jesus (and by extension, you): he says that God exists and that Christianity is true. Or, if you insist that he\'s against you, you\'re left with this conundrum: You call Miller and theistic evolutionists incorrect, and he calls you and anti-evolutionists incorrect; why is your position any more logical than his?Regarding your citation about atheists using evolutionary findings to support their concepts, you omit the remainder of the paragraph. Shame on you, marc, for your quote mine. Miller clearly continues with "philosophical pronouncements" that many atheists do not forward. Over the following three paragraphs, he examines a single philosophical insinuation -- not a plethora of them -- and then moves beyond "atheistic philosophical pronouncements."'
p5506
aS"Actually there are already a couple floating around. One fascinating one: Gaia theory and the Daisyworld model. It's all around self-organising systems and the earth as a self-regulating system/organsism/something or other. James Lovelock and co. Interesting to read but sometimes feels a little too 'lets-all-just-get-along' to be real, hard-core theory. Either way, it's probably a lot more likely to be accepted than creationism, should evolutionism for some reason be disproved."
p5507
aS"Quite frankly, you don't know squat about me. So stop trying to pretend you do.I have gone on record to say I think Christianity does a lot of good in the world.I have even tried to correct Matthew in his anti-Christian tirades. (Until I gave up realizing it would do no good... emoticonXFrazzled )I hate to break it to you, but the WORLD typically functions with people putting out negative news.You hear about how Joe XXXX broke the law.Do you ever hear about how Johnny Atlas keeps the law?emoticonXFrazzled"
p5508
aS'Hmmm... He may get things right only when he thinks getting it right contradicts evolution...'
p5509
aS'Falling, the fact that the homeschoolers you mentioned don\'t choose to socialize with you, doesn\'t mean they\'re not far more capable of functioning in the "REAL WORLD" than you might think. I would not choose to socialize with you in the "REAL WORLD", and you most likely would not choose to socialize with me, but that does not make me your social inferior!'
p5510
aS'Because? The conventional big bang is just as unlikely as God. Therefore your claim is wrong.   However the current believe mainly among physicists and astronomers is that there is no end and there is no beginning to the universe. Expansionary theories along with contractionary theories that are being observed have led many to believe that the current universe was born from the death of the last universe. There is no end and there is no beginning.   You are out of your league.'
p5511
aS'You are very right. We too will have to pay tax on the insurance for me. Not fair.'
p5512
aS"There is no need for prey animals to grow a third or forth eye as a defense mechanism. Binocular vision works. Its balanced and can render 3d positioning in the mind accurately. The lizard that you mentioned is born with a spot sensitive to light which helps the body absorb vitamin d, as humans do due to skin that is light-sensitive to a certain extent. It isn't an eye for defending against predators, and it doesn't need one. As for insects, the fact that they've survived for such a long time goes to show that they have adapted adequately and are doing well. Have you tried sneaking up on a fly lately?"
p5513
aS'I think perhaps you\'re confused.1. I know of no meaningful definion of the term "god\' as it pertains to reality.2. When you mention science and history, that implies you are interested in reality.3. There is no evidence to support mythological deities, god or God or Odin or the easter bunny.* So, yes THERE IS NO EVIDENCE of the existence of any mytholgoical gods.** Yes, there is no evidence that the universe was created, or if that statement even has meaning if the universe always was, and always will be.p.s. There is easter bunny.-Mach'
p5514
aS'Well that may be your contention, but medically that is not necessarily true. Maybe being gay doesn\'t mean you are suicidal or depressed, but there is more of it going on in the gay life than in the hetero. That in itself is a wake up call. Depression and suicide are harmful, even if it doesn\'t touch you personally. If it were as simple as you say the APA wouldn\'t be re-evaluating "reorientation therapies" would they and with positive critiques too. You wouldn\'t have prominent gay activists like Camile Paglia deriding the gay community for being malcontent when those unhappy with being gay seek and desire the way to be hetero.'
p5515
aS'Yet according to PP themselves, they provide FAR more abortions and EC services than any of their other services. :PPPFA Services (2002-2003)Surgical abortions: 227,385 Emergency contraception: 633,756 Prenatal care: 15,860 Adoption referrals: 1,963 (Source: www.plannedparenthood.org)'
p5516
aS"No I shouldn't be fighting against abiogenesis, I'm for unrestricted freedom to explore it all!"
p5517
aS"Actually I didn't even read it (and doubt I ever will). Don't get all worked up over it."
p5518
aS'So what you are saying is simply that the genes do not actively control the body.What is wrong with assuming that genes therefore do not control the body is the fact that the genes were the blueprint for the body. The genes decided the arrangement of cells, the number of fingers, etc.The body, the cells, and the organelles within the cells are therefore strongly influenced by the DNA sequence.'
p5519
aS'Why didn\'t they "fire" and "bar" him in the sixties?'
p5520
aS'Actually, creation explains nothing. Evolution is an observation that is explained by theories that explain why populations of animals change. One explanation is the theory of natural selection.'
p5521
aS"it can't always be cared by anyone. What if no one wants the baby or you can't get to a place where you can give the baby up (maybe snowed in for a week). Can you kill the baby then because it is now dependent on you."
p5522
aS"Well of course it's about petitions that would lead to amendments. What else would it be about? Nevertheless it is still a voting process. That's how amendments are done. What I'm asking is, does this bill mean that ANY issue that could come up as an amendment would be illegal? And if not, (the more important question) how would they determine what constitutes civil rights. (Which you didn't answer, but rather basically said 'I don't know but rest assured they do' (to paraphrase). Get it now? Anyway, on further review, I believe that the bills only apply to whatever falls under the catagory of 'civil rights', however the heck that is to be determined! emoticonXDonno "
p5523
aS'Too late, drug usage has already created those epidemics. Legalizing drugs may increase some of them temporarily, but they already exist. I would argue that there would be a decrease in crime, for certain.'
p5524
aS'Not at all. The theory of evolution contains many many things.'
p5525
aS'Evolutionary scientists is a confusing term. A geochronologist might work out an age for a lava sample for example. Astronomers have also made comment on the age of the earth as have paleontologists studying certain fossils.So why would no flood make radiometric much more likely to accurate as you say? Can we hear some specific detail on this as it is kinda significant to backing you your assumption.'
p5526
aS'But the sea and sky are the same regardless. I would say the sailor conceives the information with language. He infers the information with language.'
p5527
aS'And like the police , the Navy could plan and execute raids.'
p5528
aS'Your statment is like saying we evented 2+2= 4. We did not envent it, it aways existed. Same with logic, its a concept that exists apart from the meterial universe. But in the atheists worldview, only the meterial universe exists.'
p5529
aS"See above. Nothing has been demonstrated that convinces me that God has been ruled out of all these issues. He probably isn't active in all situations, but there's nothing that says he (or even Satan) are totally inconsequential either."
p5530
aS'Homo-erectus and Neandertals had different bone structures. How could they be fully human when their anatomy is fundementally different?'
p5531
aS"A little of both. Japan is known for allowing its police officers to physically and mentally torture suspects and deny them legal counsel if they determine that such counsel will interfere with their interrogation. Suspects aren't allowed to read confessions before signing them either.Is that what Penfold really wants?"
p5532
aS'BUt it comes down to gay people being harmed by not being allowed to marry. Any time a group is excluded because of someone elses religious beliefs that group is harmed.'
p5533
aS'The process of evolution has no scientifically known teleology and follows no known predestined plan. It does not teach that there cannot be any such things as teleology or forethought. This is where your mistake lies.'
p5534
aS"No-one experiences the existence of an outside world. Explanations such as the Matrix can explain sense impressions as well as some concept of 'external reality'. We have no more evidence for one than the other.The fact no-one takes them seriously is a psychological point about human beings, nothing to do with reality per se."
p5535
aS'Recent comparisons between the complete chimp genome and the human genome have found that possibly fewer than 3 million nucleotide differences exist in functional DNA.'
p5536
aS"Actually, the fossil record does support it. Both Eldredge and Gould have discussed it. Both men made observations of slow gradual speciation in the fossil record in a small geographical area. These changes were reflected at other locations as an abrupt change from one species to another. But given that such changes take place very quickly in populations that are usually under environmental stress and isolated from the main population, and given the rarity of fossilization in the first place, we don't expect to find many examples in the fossil record. It is a bit like trying to time a 100 yd. dash with a sundial. The fossil record just isn't fine grained enough to see the rapid (50-60 thousand years) changes."
p5537
aS"The VAST majority of abortions are performed within the first trimester. When they are performed in the second trimester it's a serious procedure for the mother to go through, and is something she obviously wouldn't go into lightly. Her reasons for choosing an abortion as late as that would have to far outweigh anything else, and she would need consent from two doctors to go ahead with it. Basically what I'm trying to say is something like the foetus being developed enough to feel pain would not change the mind of a woman who had just found out she was pregnant and she'd been raped, or was going through something you can't understand. For an abortion that late she'd have to deliver the foetus anyway, which is traumatising enough. "
p5538
aS"Just as soon as peddler's cheek stops stinging and he picks the glove up..."
p5539
aS"So were the officers on the front lines of the Mumbai massacre. But they didn't shoot back, they hid like cowards. They let people get killed for no good reason."
p5540
aS'So what is being monitored by the ribosome? Information. Material representations (amino acid sequence vs DNA sequence) of information. But, it does not only monitor it, it manipulates it as a means to an end... fidelity.'
p5541
aS"Well, there is now string theory, which has grown into M-theory, which may have a rational answer (at least a mathematical one). But calling it a theory is really a misnomer. It's more like a hypothetical model.But, do you have a rational explanation for the Big Bang?Or do you think that the Big Bang didn't happen?"
p5542
aS'Actually I\'m so sure of my manhood that even though I knew that charge would be levelled against me I still posted anyway. Anyway if you feel that men need to be degraded to make up for past actions to women you have gone from "righteous" to bitter.'
p5543
aS'Nope. And since the melanic form is the dominant allele, your point is moot.'
p5544
aS'So the intent hiding behind abortion laws all along was to keep women in the gutter. There was not any legititamte concern for the unborn fetus. It was all about how they could keep women down. Tell me then, would someone who supports a ban on partial birth abortion do so simply because they want to repress women?'
p5545
aS'GREED but what you fail to admit is that that standard of living comes at a price for someone.'
p5546
aS'think of it as a photocopy of a check for a million dollars. yes the copy is in the image and likeness of the original check, but it is not the check. you cannot cash the photocopy, regardless of how accurate the copy is, it is not the check, only an image of it. that doesn\'t mean anything is "wrong" with the original, and it doesnt mean that the copy has to have all the properties and function of the original. its just an image'
p5547
aS'My life was a gift from my parents, no more, no less. When i look in the mirror, i do not see an embryo. If someone gives you something, they have every right to take it away if they feel you are not suited to handle it, or if they had second thoughts. I would think this was ok if the baby was stopped in an earlier stage, but once its in its third trimester, you have no right to kill it.'
p5548
aS"Sucide? Isn't that a mental health issue? If you take a gun from a sucidal and depressed person, does that cure depression?   If it does that you have addressed the root cause of sucide.   If it does not than you really have not done anything to cure the fundamental cause of sucide."
p5549
aS'Yes, it is interesting how we draw an arbitary "legal line in the sand" with regards to determining how late into a pregnancy an elective abortion is available.'
p5550
aS'I think bringing "emotions" into the question of whether God exists or not tends to cloud the issue a bit.Isn\'t the essence of atheism a rational enquiry which concludes that in the absence of any credible evidence, there is no reason to believe in God ? An emotional attachment to "non-belief" would be irrelevant (and irrational).'
p5551
aS"I don't see anyone without healthcare. None of my friends, none of my family, none of my neighbors. ZILCH. NADA. NAUGHT. CIPHER.   Now I don't go wandering around the inner cities looking for half-crazy winos and crack addicts either, so maybe that's why."
p5552
aS'pro-choice is only pro child if the choice is not abortion and they are only pro family when the choice for family. So really pro choice can be pro child or anti child and pro family or anti family.'
p5553
aS'I\'m sure the racist white segregationists after Plessey thought exactly as you do now, "That settles the matter."Little Louise Brown had a big SURPRISE!!! for them.You still have not walked upon the thin ice of the "well regulated" wording, we note.'
p5554
aS'The only person who can take away your sin is God. No human can ever cleanse himself of his sins, so get over it.'
p5555
aS"And that part of the decision (not allowing for the woman's health to be taken into account) is why I do not agree with nor do applaud this decision (in fact I am rather disgusted with it). If you'd like to see a more concise view from me, you can see the thread that Another_opinion started here: http://www.4forums.com/political/abortion-debates/9678-mothers-health-exception-where-do-we-draw-line.html"
p5556
aS'The egyptians predicted his birth, death, WWI, WWII, and they have predict the supposed end of the world. Are you saying that this religion was wrong? They predicted a lot more that I have not put that have come true.'
p5557
aS"I know ... I know. I agree with you that it's sad more of those people couldn't or didn't take advantage of concealed carry to help prevent so many deaths. That needs to change along with education so more people can defend themselves."
p5558
aS"Actually, that's not true. While all of the sciences actually support one another, one can be a chemist and not accept evolution. One can even do good science without accepting evolution, but it is difficult. For example, cosmology, astrophysics and astronomy see a very old universe. That's not compatible with young earth creationism. Geology finds an old earth, wich isn't compatible with the mythologies of sacred writings. But that is not to say that one cannot be a qualified scientist and a deist or a theist. There are lots of good Christian scientists who accept evolution."
p5559
aS"Actually JP so far 5 states have passed gay marriage so no not every time it is put to a vote do we lose.And how am I forcing anyone to accept gay marriage? Am I forcing these voters to attend my wedding or dare I say be in a marriage themselves?And I cannot agree with you more about changing the image of the gay community as a whole.. We are not all a bunch of promiscuous sex crazed people running around...What I find funny is once strait people find out how boring we really are, and how we pay taxes just like every other joe schmo they'll think nothing more of special rights lol...But actually like I stated earlier in another thread if those unions constituted the same legal rights as married couples I would be content."
p5560
aS'Could you perhaps define "teleology" as you understand it and say why you believe there is teleology in the universe?'
p5561
aS'I think your idea has merit. However, before I would fully endorse it, I am interested in how you see it being implemented and administered from the standpoint of equal protection under the law.'
p5562
aS'I know what you mean. You should see some of the other "books" he has at his site as well.Well, now we know that Muslim creationists are even nuttier than Christian creationists, but both still use the same twisted ideas and concepts to justify their pseudo-science of creationism (Read: Religious beliefs). ;)'
p5563
aS"Ok, now I'd like to know why Lappster thinks evolution has anything to do with morality? Do you actually know what evolution is Lappster?"
p5564
aS"Actually, this guy was an ex-con. It's illegal for a convicted felon to own firearms. Galileo actually helped us more than he helped you. This proves once again that criminals will always refuse to surrender their weapons."
p5565
aS"And an even funnier thing is it won't affect his wallet at all."
p5566
aS'I know that. I asked those questions to show how dumb and ridiculous unkerpaulies question was - took it to other examples where such a question is obviously ridiculous to illustrate the ridiculousness of his question.'
p5567
aS'To be more accurate, (not something noted amongst the pro-gun rabble) the right of protestants to have arms for their defence against catholics.I think we\'ve all seen quite enough of this "defence" in Northern Ireland. (assuming that yanks can locate the place with a map emoticonXRolleyes )'
p5568
aS"How is that conclusion derived at? The passage is speaking to the consequences to a man who's actions cause the death of an unborn child. And the proscribed consequence is death according to OT Law. So although the passage isn't speaking to abortion at all, it is making a very clear statement regarding the value of the unborn, as it is requiring a life for a life just as for any other sentient being according to the OT Law. So these arguments I get from the likes of you and Iangb which argue that until a child shows mental awareness, it isn't actually a person deserving of human rights is a bogus and shortsighted position according to the scriptural point of view. Of that, there is no question."
p5569
aS'BWAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH![/QUOTE]So you are saying that my DNA reflects the fact that I live in Texas?'
p5570
aS'What\'s "cumulative selection?" Do you mean a series of mutations with small but beneficial influence that occur over the period of thousands or millions of years? Just how do you propose to observe such mutations? In fact, we can observe such mutations by comparing the genomes of related species.'
p5571
aS"You bring up a very interesting point.   All those state level marriage amendments which were voted on also made civil unions illegal as well. When polled, residents in those areas were actually unaware that the amendments also outlawed civil unions.   So, not only are the anti's disingenuous as far as what they promoted, but were so in HOW these amendments were promoted."
p5572
aS'Because we view it as something much more than just a gravy train from the govt., that\'s why.For you it seems to be about the word, and the govt. saying "oh, you use THAT term ("marriage"), ok we recognize it." For us it\'s about the commitment.'
p5573
aS'Well yes, but thats not what DEFECTIVE GULO indicates. If one has external sources of vitamin C, GULO can mutate to be inactive without causing a problem, and once inactive the inactive gene can be inherited without causing problems so long as vitamin C intake is high enough. An inactive GULO indicates that the species has external sources of vitamin C which is essential to many metabolic processes.'
p5574
aS'You are missing the entire point (again). Why do you feel ashamed? Because you know that what you did is bad. I have heard from a great Australian war hero, one of our remaining ANZACs soliders (recently passed away I think) that we he stabbed the enemy soldier with the spike thing on the end of their gun (WWI era) and he saw him die that it was "the worst feeling that a human can possibly endure". He said that that image will haunt him for the rest of his life. He knows that he did something wrong, but it was a war, and unfortuantely that kind of thing will happen. You are way off the plot. But let us continue.'
p5575
aS'They are not exactly the same. See the examples above. It is not random.'
p5576
aS"I agree it's a threat to us but the point is whether it's really caused by increaing amount of carbon dioxide and how big the threat is.Maybe global warming is just a part of process of global climate change which occured several times long time ago, ie, ice age things like that.As far as I know, global warming is one of the catastrophe which leads to extinction of human beings. However, there might be another problems which are also big threat to us and all creatures on the earth.Anyway, I'm not an expert of environment, so I might be wrong but at least I can say it seems there are some bad effetcts of global warming such as rising sea level, abnormal climate pattern, things like that.We should do something, which might not be appropriate way to solve the problem but it's surely the beginning."
p5577
aS"Well, the slavery analogy for gay rights is past it's applicability at this point--one was a property issue (also rooted in deep prejudice), the other is a morality issue. Many people oppose gay marriage out of morality and NOT prejudice. The same can't be said for slavery. There are many ways that the analogy doesn't work and that's just one of them. In fact, it could as easily be an analogy to reverse it and say that the ones who did the enslaving were analogous to gay rights lobbyists and the abolitionists were analogous to those who seek to protect marriage. After all, the plantation owners were the ones really fighting for ill-conceived rights--rights that they shouldn't have had. "
p5578
aS"Funny. That's not what the articles say. All of the articles pretty much concentrate on the research as significant in support of the dinosaur/bird link. If you had been paying attention, you would have been aware that it had been previously established through other tests that protein remnants were present. Thus, the amazement that protein remnants so old had been found had already passed."
p5579
aS'I have noticed he seems content to drop a Ad Hominem neglecting to actually argue.'
p5580
aS'Again, they must be alive. Previously, you submitted that there are many problems with society and life or whatever. Could it be that some people might be able to survive those problems? Could it be that those survivors would be the ones to reproduce?'
p5581
aS"Nope. Frame-shifts move the whole code down one step, making entirely new genes. Often, this is disastrous, but sometimes, a useful new enzyme results.Barbarian observes:It's remarkable then, how much progress we've made. You may or may not approve of the theory, but it works very well at learning more about biology.And, as you may have noticed, we've been very successful at interpreting the data. We've learned to do a lot of things as a result. One of the most important reasons scientists accept the theory is that it works."
p5582
aS"And what exactly am i granting to the suit-wearing politicians in washington by giving them the right to revoke her ability to make these decisions for herself? I don't think dictatorship is the right word, since she is not asking for the power over anyone but herself, and her child. Would you call a man dying of inoperable cancer who decides to end his chemotherapy a dictator? Or a parent who decides to remove their child from life-support?Would you rather it be a democracy? That everytime a woman is faed with this predicament, we put it to a vote? How about an oligarchy- where her situation is put in front of some committee who decides her fate?"
p5583
aS'And yet, even though creationists ask for detailed lists of every creature in transition over a period of several million years, I have never found a single creationist who can trace his ancestors back to Adam, a period of only about 6,000 years. The best I can do is to trace my ancestors back to the 1600s.'
p5584
aS"Oh? They're trained to deal with irate exhusbands who are stabbing their wives and dousing them in gasoline, in broad daylight, in the middle of a busy parking lot? They're trained to deal with that specific kind of #### every single day?"
p5585
aS'Yes, but gays would also want laws changed to accomodate THEIR form of marriage as well. The fact that one requires less change than the other shouldn\'t matter, should it? Should having to do more reworking of laws and more paperwork hinder the pursuit of equality? It seems to me your argument boils down to "polygamy requires more work to make the laws accomodate it." Yeah--such is the price for marriage equality.Let\'s face it--if society really wanted to make marriage an open-ended institution of equality rather than for opposite-sex couples which comprise most relationships, they could pull it off--polygamy, gays, letting 17 year olds marry, etc. All those civil servants are there and can do it as directed as legislation is changed. Means could be set up to determine inheritance, for example. Laws can be worded to do it.'
p5586
aS'Since when were proteins no longer structures? A basic freshmen tool for teaching is the phrase "structure defines function."'
p5587
aS"Really? What a surprise! So tell me. If you don't know what it is or how it works, how do you know that you are opposed to it?"
p5588
aS'Hardly any criminals go armed in England, and certainly not with guns. Burglars and muggers have enough sense to know that while getting done for burglary or mugging will not be pleasant, getting done for burglarly or mugging AND possession of a firearm will be far, far worse, assuming they survive the arrival of the armed response squad.'
p5589
aS'I think the only valid reason for owning a gun is because you want to. Every person (with some exceptions) has the right to keep and bear arms, why you do it is your own business. Giving specific reasons for gun ownership is the top of a slippery slope towards banning certain firearms.   While I have specific reasons for owning specific guns, to include hunting, I own some of my guns for no other reason than they are fun to shoot.   A humorus side note: I own one gun strictly for fishing, sounds odd but its common practice (at least in Alaska) to shoot large Halibut before bringing them aboard.'
p5590
aS'In my reading of the Declaration (and using the 1st. Amendment as a filter) it doesn\'t matter who or what the founders meant by "Creator." The conlusion is the same; regardless. Namely; The fact that the founders considered our basic rights to be inherrent.'
p5591
aS'Actually we do not know who the first human to get AIDS was. Most likely it was an African who got it from a green monkey last I looked into the matter, most likely by eating the creature. You are perhaps referring to case zero, but thats only as far back as the chain can be traced, its not the first case in humans.'
p5592
aS'and how do you know this......oh I see...you said "I think"....but you don\'t really "know" what most Americans favor or don\'t favor...you just "think"'
p5593
aS"Just another example of using a verse meant for personal use and applying it to wars. Sorry, just doesn't work that way."
p5594
aS"ZERO. I don't think he ####ed one African. Unless you can demonstrate otherwise, your statement is false."
p5595
aS'What is incredible is that this is probably the most enlightened response I can expect from this crowd.'
p5596
aS'In your first post. If you are to qualify that by stating I assert that reproduction is not an absolute requirement of life over the ontogeny of an individual then of course reproduction is not essential character of life.'
p5597
aS'ummm... the death penalty has always been around. i never claimed that death was the penalty for every crime, nor that it was the most common punishment. try to catch up'
p5598
aS'When is wealth redistributed on a whim? The NHS is one of the few good things to come out of WWII and is the mark of a fair society (if you ask me). Restricting health-care according to wealth is despotic....'
p5599
aS"But it took a lot longer to develop. My point was that only after about 5000 years of human civilization did empiricism as science develop. Religion, supernaturalism, and mythology trace back into prehistory. What we know as science didn't even begin to exist until the late 1500s and 1600s. Before that it was OK to do science like Aristotle did - no experiment, only thinking about a logical answer. Thus, heavy objects fell faster than light ones and any fool could tell that the sun orbited the earth.But science is more than an inner way of thinking. It is a process and a method for learning about the universe. It is called methodological naturalism. That is not to say the science asserts that nothing exists except what is natural. It says that science can't study the supernatural."
p5600
aS'Working on it. Apparently we are still waiting for to to be graded (it was really big, at leat 20 typed pages). I plan on buying from them when they get it back, and maybe putting up a whole page in honor of it. Partly because I think it is very telling, partly because I remember what it was like to be in college and get a little recognition for your work.'
p5601
aS"If you think that it's OK when the Mother's life is in danger. Why wouldn't it be OK when her life isn't in danger?"
p5602
aS'And those pillars will be replaced by something stronger like equality and Justice.'
p5603
aS'This argument is self-defeating. A theory is not a fact, no matter how much evidence may support the theory. Bad wording. But again, if you claim something as a fact, you must have proof, verified in both your method of reasoning, and the reasoning utilized by the person you are proving the fact to.'
p5604
aS"They do it on purpose, alright. But not because it'll be shot down -- in at least one state, the Supreme Court decided that similar legislation did not address more than one issue.The reason they put them together is that, in most states, a ban on civil unions would FAIL."
p5605
aS'Strawman. The argument is not to do whatever one wishes with ones body. The argument is soley that one does not have to have another attached, ever, against ones will.'
p5606
aS"They originally might have been an arbitrary guess, but experience of all humans always has given them a very high probability of being true (at least the existence of the outside world, the others are abstract logical concepts that don't have a physical reality, just an abstract one)."
p5607
aS'Recent studies apparently show that pot is more harmful than you say. One joint is said to contain more carcinogens than four tobacco cigarettes.I doubt your 20,000 joints theory.You have a simplistic argument going for pot. I can\'t agree that legalizing all drugs would be a good thing either. Programs in Holland have failed to produce significant if any benefits to society in general. The druggies seem to have benefitted by having arrest-free drug zones and access to whatever they want, but the cost of drugs still requires some income, something that most of them likely do not have other than from crime, begging or social programs.One "benefit" I see from legalizing drugs is that the users could be more easily identified.'
p5608
aS"The man seemed have a thing about prostitutes. I believe he felt it was his God-given destiny to punish them.Cybererratus is a very interesting persona. He manifests a number of very interesting character traits. I don't believe that he likes women very much. In fact, I am rather concerned about how Cybererratus feels about women.Andrea Yates was certifiably insane and her killing of her children had nothing to do with post partum depression.And, she is being punished. She is serving life in prison -- as is Mr. Ridgway.I also find the comparisons that Cybererratus makes to be morally troubling."
p5609
aS"No, everyone should have those regardless of marriage. You're the one here who seems to think straight and gay marriage should be a litmus test for those things."
p5610
aS'It has a financial impact on ALL taxpayers. To say that it has no impact on anyone else is disengenuous.'
p5611
aS"Oh, boy... here you come with your anti-religious bigotry rhetoric, who mentioned one thing about religiosity? C'mon Simone... let's coddle those little bats of common sense back under the belfry of reason where they are supposed to roost... They didn't need laws against it back then because peopel had more human dignity and respect for human life... and they responded within the realm of decency and basic propriety. It is a shame we actually have to go there..."
p5612
aS"Exactly and if you accept that animals have been on the Earth for millions of years then why can't evolution be a process that God created and controls?"
p5613
aS"Actually, one. After the adoptions years ago, we hit the financial slump and had a suprise... The costs will extremely low. I've also been in discussion with numerous friends who've delivered, same story. Somehow, no matter how there is no money and no help, babies get born. And as I've said, there are plenty of organizations that will cover all costs finacially in cases of adoption."
p5614
aS"It's possible that Archaeopteryx is not a direct descendant of modern birds but it's certainly not far from the line and it shares both avian and therepodian characteristics."
p5615
aS"If that's truly what the organization says, then it's a hypocrite of an organization."
p5616
aS'And from this we are to infer that Leakey doubts human evolution? There is by now a huge variety of fossil hominids. If Leakey was admitting that it was difficult to be certain which were or were not directly ancestral to modern humans, this is no more than scientific honesty.'
p5617
aS'This is absurdity. I suppose then that medicine should wreak my body. How about viruses? Am I destroyed by them?'
p5618
aS'So what is your point? Are you claiming that the tenets of christianity are in doubt because the several thousand denominations hold contradictory views? Science proceeds by challenges and contradictions. Contradiction in science is not evidence of doubt but evidence of a field of advance. In religion, it is without question, a matter of the veracity of the ultimate truth. Which of the thousands of christian faiths hold the truth?'
p5619
aS'Well, at least accoreding to your "because I say so" belief. The woman, of course, don\'t need to pay attention to your desire to control her own body in bondage to your particular brand of outraged morality.'
p5620
aS'Your XXX-umption that is a poor attempt to certify a false delimma has long been answered. How many people have been killed in Africa with short handled hoes and machetes? Nary a gun amoungst them.'
p5621
aS'Well, what faults? You say that innocent people are sentenced to death far too often. Well, the death penalty does not sentence people, our judiciary system does. The death penalty is mearly a punishment. I will agree that some innocent people have been sent to death row, and when their innocence was discovered, they were released. A perfect judiciary system would not sentence innocent people, and would alleviate all problems with the death penalty. If we had a perfect system and no innocent person was ever sent to death row, we could take them directy from sentencing to a little room beside the courtroom containing a bed and a few drugs, put an IV in them, and carry out the sentence before the jurors got out of the courthouse. Of course, we know that our judiciary system is an imperfect thing, so we understand the need for appeals. '
p5622
aS'Actually, the Mormon seminaries aren\'t "on the grounds," although they may be on an adjacent, privately owned piece of property. It would be unconstitutional for the seminaries to be on property owned by the school district. The children go to the seminary on released-time, which has been found to be constitutional (although I don\'t see how).Pertinent decisions about religious instruction and schools are:McCollum v. Board of Education (333 U.S. 203)Zorach v. Clauson (343 U.S. 306)McCollum found that religious instruction on school property is unconstitutional, while Zorach found that "accommodating" religious instruction by releasing students from school for that purpose was not.'
p5623
aS"Well then what the devil are you moaning about then? It's not like Browning shot King, or actually made the rifle that was used or anything like that. Hell it wasn't even a rifle made by the Browning company.There's absolutely no connection between the two for you to be bitching about."
p5624
aS'Well, I can\'t speak for anyone else, but I support any choice that the woman wants to make. No, I don\'t support forced abortions anywhere, I don\'t support what\'s going on in China and India because they\'re still taking a choice away from the women.What I don\'t get is that many prolifers think that prochoicers are ONLY for the choice of abortion. All the prochoicers I know support any choice the woman feels right about making. For example, I was called a hypocrite because I\'m prochoice and pregnant. The person said "You\'re forcing others to abort while you carry to term." I have NEVER forced anyone to do anything, nor will I ever. I\'ve also never aborted...and many prolifers automatically assume that if one is prochoice they\'ve aborted.'
p5625
aS"So?I look into the clouds and see a cow. Clouds aren't telling me to have a steak."
p5626
aS'This joke is based on some reality, "the conquest of the North Pole is traditionally credited to Anglo-American Navy engineer Robert Edwin Peary, who claimed to have reached the Pole on April 6, 1909.   Anyhow, not all jokes are completely true, how many stand up comedians have you heard??? If you were to nit pick every joke out there (being politicaly correct etc) there would be no jokes left!'
p5627
aS'What would you know about fair and balanced?emoticonXCensoredI know a lot of truths about gays. Do you want me to start posting incessant threads pointing them all out?And I am the moderator for the formal debate forum, not the entire board. Want to debate me on the benefits of gays on society vs Christianity?'
p5628
aS"Actually, if you look at the example I've given, that's false. The probability of A in one organism may be low, but the probability of A in some organism approaches 100% as the population and the number of generations gets larger. And if A is useful and comes to dominate the population, then the probability of an AB individual appearing then also tends towards 100%. In the example above, the chance of an AB mutant occurring, if A and B are substantially useful mutations, is almost a dead certainty. It would be amazing if they didn't stack. So saying that AB occurring is less likely than A is misleading at best, downright wrong at worst. Behe is clearly misapplying probability theory."
p5629
aS'Actually Archie it was neither left nor right. he went after both democrat and republican and took a center tone to the entire issue at hand. Portraying the reality of the suffering of his hometown due to jobs leaving the US and the greed on wall street.'
p5630
aS"That is what it said. Now your website gives a false translation to this. It clearly is talking about if the unborn is harmed.Not to mention the numerous other quotes I gave you about how a person (in the Christian faith) is formed before conception! This shows that God has already created you. God also talks about how you can't kill a person he created. This is an easy concept to follow.I suggest if you wish to learn what the Bible says you read it and not take what a biased website has to say. Religioustolerance.org is a joke that misleads people into making God what they want him to be."
p5631
aS"I think you are the same person as usa all the way and again.. you have no right to talk about murder because you murder the english language everytime you post.And no.. the baby does not belong to god because there is no baby and I don't know if there is a god or not. Btw.. I'm not going to incubate something in my body because of you think it's wrong because someone who may or may not exist said so."
p5632
aS'And I see you still flip back and fourth from being an atheist to not being an atheist.'
p5633
aS'Those who set the rules can do with them as they please. It isn\'t illogical nor hypocritical. It IS illogical to assume you can chew gum if the rule is "you cant chew gum" and the teacher allows one student to chew gum.'
p5634
aS"Pandion has already pointed out that this isn't a theory, it's a mode of wishful thinking. More damagingly, however, if you examine it for more than a moment it doesn't even fulfill the role you give it. You say 'many things in nature make no sense without God', but how do god's origins and nature make sense? Where did he/she/it spring from? All you do by invoking god as an 'explanation' is push the problems one step further back. The god hypothesis may look like an explanation, but it is not."
p5635
aS"And here you reveal your prediliction for reading what you want to see into the words of others. I described materialism embracing new forces and phenomena which have withstood the rigors of the scientific method. I explicitly described science as a methodology, not a philosophy. You are wrong about me, WW, and the longer you pretend otherwise, the more time you're going to waste on strawmen and the more chances I'm going to get to make your arguments look silly. It's up to you. Argue with me, or argue with the person you want me to be."
p5636
aS'oh yeahrubbish rubbish,scientifically speaking, human life (using a most bsic term) begins at conception. the twins exist as two seperate entities the moment each contains the individual human dna. seems to me you better be certain when it begins before you go around ending it. if you are driving at night an you "think" you might see a person ahead in the middle of the road you are hopefully not gonna drive over that person. Instead that uncertainty should lead you to stop. If you dont like that example, consider a hunter who is unsure what is in the bushes.'
p5637
aS"Sounds pretty neat. I've never been there but I'll keep it in mind for a road trip some time.So you are of the belief that dinosaurs and man lived at the same time? I know that there are people who believe in this but I don't come across them very often. So what information do you have to share with us about this idea?"
p5638
aS"Among other things, generally adaptions to a colder environment.    As for your theory as a whole, doesn't the whole 15, 000 year gap between the extinction of the Neanderthalls and the development of farming (particularly the grains youre talking about)."
p5639
aS"So when you're doing math, you're an atheist? Of course not. Just because there is overlap doesn't mean that the two views are identical."
p5640
aS"No one mentioned helping or not helping people here, or even dealing with the consquences of pregnancy at all. Its more;'If abortion were banned, what measures or research would you suggest to reduce the pressure for people to have illegal ones or unwanted pregnancies'."
p5641
aS"Just like the Brady Campaign. Often when trying to paint concealed carry holders as dangerous individuals, most instances they cite either never had a concealed carry permit to begin with, or the matters of the case were instances that lacked mens-rea and weren't crimes to begin with."
p5642
aS"That's obviously not what is said. The sun's energy is not claimed to be a mechanism that makes order of disorder. What it does do is override the tendancy within the 2LoTD where total usable energy in a system decreases."
p5643
aS"Can we get away from quoting 5 year old posts? Seriously, if you don't take the time to actually read the thread why should I respond to your post?"
p5644
aS'They have changed. For example, ancient examples of coelacanth were shallow water species, while the modern coelacanth is a deep marine species (actually, two or three species). And the differences are enough to put them in different families.By the way, ark guy, what do you know about taxonomy?'
p5645
aS'Logical truths do not come from "somewhere", your question makes as much sense as "What time is a moose?".You do not appear to have read my post at all, variously repeating what I have said and addressing things I did not say.'
p5646
aS'Obviously that is the case. We cannot simply say that a certain God exists and have it be so.'
p5647
aS'A taste of what could be our future if the left has its way.'
p5648
aS'What do you mean by other definitions? Before you stated "Creation is...." thus it is implicit in this that you are arguing against a single homogonous construct. And it\'s embarrassing for you to realise that there\'s actually as much variance of opinion in this, as in evolution.'
p5649
aS"Do you want to explain what you think the problem is? You're going to see a much larger change if you start fiddling with the controls than if you were replacing bases within the protein coding sequence - a lot of those wouldn't change anything in the protein, and a lot of the changes to the protein wouldn't have a significant effect either."
p5650
aS'And science helped Stenger write his book. How can the same subject make a stronger case for both of two completely opposing viewpoints?   another'
p5651
aS"That's certainly your right, but supersport is interested in hawking a religious agenda, not a scientific one. He may want it disguised as a scientific one, but a perusal of his posts here bely that desire."
p5652
aS"They do not. They offer increased thermal protection and thus make a greater range of habitats possible. Feathers also offer increased protection from attack. They are so good that several native American cultures were known to make armor from feathers. They absorb and spread impact quite well.Feathers don't itch and they don't rustle in the bush.Do you have an answers that aren't examples of shallow thinking?"
p5653
aS"False and that doesn't invalide evolution given how it's a misrepresentation of one of the statements in the theory.       Gould can take his comments and shove them up his ***."
p5654
aS'There are no objective reasons to condemn gays. Marriage is not a matter of state and so it is meaningless to argue whether a state should recognize it.My advocating of perfect liberty allows no contradictions or exceptions, believe me I have lost alot of support from conservatives for this, perhaps even gays if one really applied it to all extremes.'
p5655
aS'And only a "miniscule and negligible fraction of the total wild moth population" has even been observed resting anywhere else. Despite my explanation of his mathematical misleading, wabbit continues with it.Some of you with better short-term memory might remember that I stated that there is little debate that many of Kettlewell\'s experiments were imperfect. wabbit has posted some excerpts to this effect, but really, all we need to do here is realize that wabbit has quote mined to his little heart\'s content. Here\'s a portion he purposely excised:'
p5656
aS'Some references please? In general, it seems that most climatologists agree that severe weather systems will occur more frequently with an increase in average global temperature. (ref:http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc_tar/wg2/061.htm#1434)'
p5657
aS'This applies only when men strive...that is fight. If a man "Accidently" hits a woman while in a fight and causes her to lose her child then all he has to do is pay a fine. But if he keeps fighting and hurt other people he gets killed. Even in the Bible you dont get punished so severly on accidents.'
p5658
aS'This is a push to promote lawlessness. The San Francisco fiasco is the prime example. People with certain agendas are refusing to follow the laws. This is a devastating precedent for our Nation.'
p5659
aS'With regard to this statement you have to consider:1. How can anyone know what product an "intelligent designer" wanted.2. Even from the example of life on Earth we can clearly see there is nothing easy at all about the path life has taken over the millenia.But I think it is possible to hold your position, although it can be a tricky one by virtue of the entrenchment of opinions that has occured in the religion science debate- due to the less than pragmatic attiudes of some of the participants.'
p5660
aS'Well, one person got it right...where in the constitution does it say something about health having to be protected?'
p5661
aS"The value of logical reasoning is dependent upon your axioms. Highly religious people are no less capable of reasoning logically than anyone else - but the unshakeable axiom that their personal version of god really exists enters into every equation. For you, one axiom is the existence of Vitality; volition made quantifiable, and the other is that darwinian evolution must be wrong and worthless in every respect.There is no logical reason for you to deride NS the way you do; it's an integral part of any evolutionary theory that seeks to explain the big picture of how the organisms we see around us came to be; the occurrence of mutations, volitional or otherwise is not enough on its own. But your axioms prevent you from incorporating it into EAM and getting on with your life."
p5662
aS'I think a more telling question would be, why the hell would you rather feel constantly threatened than feel safe? It seems completely idiotic to me.   Smiley'
p5663
aS"Why can't you answer questions directly?anyway, I support ct in passing civil unions or marriage lite as I like to see it, but It doesn't confer equality. If it is really equ8al than it would be marrige. Reason beinbg portablity ( irealize you think that some day we might have that, but we don't so far and we cannot ccontrol other countries who may have gay marriage but not cilvil unions and may not recognize civil unions but recognize marriage.)If it is good for straight couples, it should be equally good for all couples. . No one is more superior. Everyone should be equal. Marriage for all is equals."
p5664
aS"And then there's this:Alarm at routine patrols by armed police - Crime, UK - The Independent"
p5665
aS'And depending on what human is "finding the answers" it can unfortunately cheapen and deny many central Biblical teachings.'
p5666
aS"That's good. You're right, all we can do is hope and pray (I pray for things like this every day, and in a way, God has answered my prayer in this case)."
p5667
aS'And melting the entire surface of the earth and boiling the oceans. Even creationist who propose the nonsense that you spout admit that they have no way to explain where the heat went. In an effort to answer where the water went, they encounter the problem of explaining where the heat went.'
p5668
aS'You may have missed the context from the other thread I referred to.The point I made is that the unlikeliness of a Presidential signature did not stop Senator Obama from voting in favor of a required Iraq troop withdraw timetable. The promised veto threat didn\'t matter in this instance. He was "standing on principle." Well, same would apply for his newfound views disfavoring DOMA as well in my view.'
p5669
aS"It hasn't been proven that the Second Amendment is solely about tyrannical governments and not about dealing with violent criminals."
p5670
aS'You need to read what people say more thoroughly, and think about it before you respond. When he said "can" (and there are not many simpler words than that!) It didn\'t mean "will", "must", or "shall" be more aggressive. It has been shown that in some cases it "CAN" happen. It may not have happened with you. It still might, we don\'t know. We might even say that it is not likely to happen, but we can\'t say that it won\'t, because sometimes some people do behave more aggressively when they have a gun.'
p5671
aS"And if someone had written an ad proclaiming that black Americans are inferior the same thing would have happened as well. I can't justify what they did but when you put such a hot-button issue out like that into the open...it has to be expected. People have strong feelings about abortion rights (just like racism) and it is naive to think something like this wasn't going to happen."
p5672
aS'To point our an error, i believe the baby was at the infant stage, not the toddler.'
p5673
aS"There are precious few areas on the planet that have not been explored. Those that haven't would not support the kinds of life we are talking about. There is no evidence of any interim species of apes and humans. Not one shred. Those items in the fossil record that are claimed as possibles are only possibles, are dubious at best, and are extremely rare. A recent study also showed that most characteristics of supposed alternate species of hominids were well within the variation seen in current homo sapiens. The point I was making is that if they existed we would see them."
p5674
aS'Well, it depends on your definition of retarded I guess. The standards to get a drivers license are really not that high. Think of how dumb the average person is, and realize that 50% of people are dumber than that. Kinda makes you cringe.   And you wonder what has prevented me from being in an accident? Well, perhaps the fact that I am a concientious, defensive, and skilled driver who excercises caution while on the road. Maybe next time someone pulls out in front of me, I should just throw my hands in the air and scream "take the wheel jesus!" I am sure some magical being will fly down from heaven and save me from crashing. Yeah...sure.'
p5675
aS"I'll assume this is figurative since they do not literally melt."
p5676
aS"It won't. I'd think any responsible parent with a teen under the age of 18 who has a sound relationship with that teen would discuss the possibility of her becoming sexually active (a normal function in spite of some puritan attitudes) and offer simple avoidance of possible pregnancy and abortion. Like vehicle insurance she may never need it, but going without either one is plain stupid."
p5677
aS'Actually, the storm lasted for 40 days and 40 nights. The ark was actually afloat for a year or so. So I guess the answer is that the ark had all kinds of pestilent insects winging about and biting and stinging the occupants. The problem is, how did these aquatic breeders actually propagate in the feces and urine infested bilge of the ark?'
p5678
aS'Again, you are the affirmative, you must support your claims. Please support the claim that we are using an atheist presupposition. I think we are using more an agnostic presupposition, which is a neutral one.'
p5679
aS'And religious folk in the south used the Bible to justify enslavement of thousands or millions of blacks, and also to justify their treating blacks as mere property. I suppose (but am not familiar enough with all of the details to know for sure) that some even used the Bible to justify linching blacks.'
p5680
aS"Congratulations. You are now part of a minority group. Marriage tends to either work or it doesn't. I know, brilliant observation. What I mean is either the couple is together for decades or spend x amount of years being unhappy until the unhappy is more than the baggage of divorce."
p5681
aS'I think that you missed the point of the argument. VT is arguing that the low birth rate in the West is attributable to high abortion rates and the high birth rates amongst Arabs creates a numbers game in favor of the Arabs. Since they respect life (their own, that is) more than the West, their numbers are growing much quicker, while our lack of respect for human life is causing the gap to widen.'
p5682
aS"Well, we'll ignore the fact that you think dinos are the same as modern day reptiles, and we'll ignore the fact that you are assuming that what goes today must have gone before (something you rant against on a daily basis). Who said anything about reptiles or dinosaurs?"
p5683
aS"A fairly good explanation, toned down a bit from Darwin's explanation (for the average person who does not have a PHD in biology)."
p5684
aS"Oh, so you were not in any way talking about evolution in these posts? Then why are they posted on the c vs e board?   Please, that's just pathetic."
p5685
aS'No proof anyone ever went from gay orientation to straight orientation.'
p5686
aS'First off, define "government funded". The FBI? The CIA? Other federal law enforcement agencies? The military? All vital government entities that are and should be armed. The fact that governments around the world have killed their own citizens after disarming them does not mean that they should not be armed, it means that the citizens should not be disarmed. Think of what our country would have become over the last 100 years without an armed government.'
p5687
aS'how many animals do you think were on the Ark? how many species existed at the time?      the story of the ark does not coincide with contemporary science, but it does work with the rest of Genesis. this is Genesis 2: 15-23'
p5688
aS"Actually the majority of homosexuals will tell you it's not a choice. And I, being the wacky gal I am, have a tendency to believe the word of homosexuals on that particular subject over the word of straight neonazicons."
p5689
aS"You know 'my kind'? How very presumptuous on your part. Then you know individual choice is the issue, not enforced medical procedures. You didn't answer the question regarding pregnant women who intend to carry to term being required to have a sonogram."
p5690
aS"So then the law is flawed because criminals could just as easily get their hands on select firearms, ban or no ban. You've just admitted that the bill did nothing and thus there's no justification for it to be reinstated."
p5691
aS"It hasn't happened yet is not absolute proof, just that it makes the probability of it being wrong quite small. By the way, if you are in the least bit intellectually honest, I challenge you to actually act on any of those doubts about the reality of existence and any other reality that we understand from all human experience. Otherwise, if you never act on those doubts, you are simply being hypocritical."
p5692
aS'Actually, I find it near impossible to discuss the second amendment without gun control advocates bringing up the third argument. Weak? Yes. Rare? No.      In my opinion, all arguments in favor of gun control are weak.'
p5693
aS'Yes, you do have a problem with Archaeopteryx. You can\'t explain it from a creationist point of view. I\'m not claiming that it is a "link," whatever that may be. It is a transitional form. It is a small theropod dinosaur that has characteristics that are common to theropod dinosaurs and only theropod dinosaurs and their ancestors. It also has characteristics that exist in birds and only birds. Some characteristics exist in both. The furcula, for example. A furcula has been identified in some theropods, but it is rather rare and then only imprefectly preserved. An indication that it may be mostly connective tissue. Archaeopteryx has a furcula. But even at that it doesn\'t compare to the same structure in birds. It is intermediate. Imagine that!'
p5694
aS'actually some did talk about the complexity of life as well as irreducible complexity even though it may not be mentioned in the title'
p5695
aS'So? There are other articles and books that do. Is your link the ultimate authority on the cause of crime?'
p5696
aS'Far from showing any modern knowledge of blood circulation, this shows:1) if you take the blood out of an animal it will die. A simple fact all civilizations of the time would have known.2) God like for his followers kill living things. He is the God of blood.'
p5697
aS'Neener neener - is it time to go in from the playground yet?'
p5698
aS"No you can prevent the life of the unborn because they are not living but I don't think you should end the life of the born."
p5699
aS'That\'s why I voted as I did as well. Ideally I\'d prefer the "none required" policy.'
p5700
aS"The burden of a pregnancy is the woman's. It should be left up to her and her doctor to decide what is best for her."
p5701
aS'But because your book of mythology tells you about a week of creation, you prefer that (because it requires less thought) to examining reality.'
p5702
aS'You could put the stranger out even if they had nowhere to go and it was freezing cold out.'
p5703
aS"Notice the double-standard here? The homosexual lobby accuses us of harassment, yet they are willing to provide names and addresses of people who oppose their agenda. I can't wait to see the backlash from this one."
p5704
aS'Socialsim and Communism in the Soviet Union failed because the USSR spent its entire existence recovering from war. The country was bombed to hell by Germany twice, around the time of the world wars. The united states put unspeakable amounts of money into their war machine, which forced the Soviets to do the same. I, for one, would buy a gun If I knew my neighbor had six, and he wanted me dead.The CIA and American military carried out immoral operations in 60+ countries since 1945. The soviet KGB, as far as I know, has only been in Germany, korea, China, and Afgahnistan.'
p5705
aS"If we bankrupt the country, the war on terror won't be the reason. Wasteful domestic spending is the only reason we have trouble funding the war on terror. We need to get intellegent with domestic spending. We could start with the $7 billion EPA."
p5706
aS'You do have a problem with this person defending himself or you would not be attacking him. Fear made him do this. The fear was created in him by the buglers.   You want unarmed passengers to attack armed terrorists on airplanes, but you have a problem with a home owner killing buglers.'
p5707
aS'And just how are the criminals and terroists to be kept from entering a school while armed? Airplanes, probably with some of the new technology, but schools, or bars, or post offices, or government buildings? Just a law that says it is illegal, surely is not going to work. emoticonXDonno'
p5708
aS"Yes, do you? It's in a country with no medical facilities, no sterile place to get it done. A country full of HIV and AIDS. I wouldn't be surprised if these mothers had HIV/AIDS and knew they'd leave their child an orphan."
p5709
aS'I know of at least 3 personally, including my brother. He fought for custody for years and it nearly bankrupted him. He was trying to get his kids away from an ex-wife that would go away with her boyfriend for weekends at a time and leave their 15 year old daughter in charge of threee younger siblings. '
p5710
aS'Yes, but all concepts of right or wrong are subjective.'
p5711
aS'What I\'ve been saying here, and after awhile - the guilt, depression, etc - will get buried, deeper & deeper - but no negative/damaging experiences leave people. They stay quietly in the background-computer base -until, as you said: Hopefully, the person "finds some way of forgiving themselves", right. But what about in the mean-time? - And we know, from research & quite a number of Healers, that rot (inside a person) is damaging... and often in very unsuspecting ways.Much better to life benevolently, in the first place.Annie'
p5712
aS"What does adoption have to do with being pro choice or life? I thought that the waiting list was years and years long to get a baby. (Not trying to argue, just don't understand)"
p5713
aS'Because there are still a lot of people in this country that support oppression and injustice toward gay people.'
p5714
aS'It is \'change over time\', not \'gradual change over time\'. The morphological changes tend to happen with a change in the environment. The difference between \'micro\' evolution and \'macro\' evolution is the number of steps. "Macro" evolution is a bunch of \'micro\' evoltultions that add up. You have two populations that you can compare that used to interbreed, and for some reason, do not, and then you add on a few 1000 \'mircro-evolution\' events to each, they become very very different.'
p5715
aS'Origins of science, whether truly started by those of faith or not, is irrelevant. Whatever science was, it has become a body of knowledge, through application of reason.'
p5716
aS"Mach, your ability to make the wrong argument on the wrong post continues. I ask a question of this person, you reply not to them, but to me, and with ad hominem, and a 'just-so' statement."
p5717
aS"Not really. That's the fallacy of exclusion of the middle. Because there are only two choices, if one is wrong somehow, the other is therefore correct. The problem is that there isn't only two choice for sure. Besides, science is wrong all the time, it doesn't prove that creation is right. In fact, for instance, science estaimtes of moon dust have been proven wildly wrong, and those corrections actually harm creation. "
p5718
aS"I've always gone the Scylla and Charybdis route before instead."
p5719
aS'Exactly. Moreover, in Emerson the discussion of the 2nd Am. is dicta (arguments not pertinent to the verdict) so it is not a binding precedent even for the courts in the same Circuit.A question for the "original intent" crowd:What did the Founding Fathers intend with the misplaced comma in the 2nd Amendment?'
p5720
aS'What this highlights is that the laws of the land are ignored and some people try to place the blame on the victims.'
p5721
aS"I don't think we have any business forcing anyone to do something they don't want to do. The father is supplying his DNA when he engages in sexual relations. After than point he has in effect signed a blank check. It's like the old saw, if you don't want to do the time, don't do the crime. Fathers to be shouldn't be engaging in sex unless they intend to pony up with the montly check. I come from a bit of a bias on this subject because this was my area of endeavor for some 20+ years."
p5722
aS'In some cases yes, in others no. If the mutation gives a huge advantage, then there will be a decline in the size of the gene pool for a while (eg when the Australian rabbit population was reduced form 500 million to 100 million by myxomatosis, the gene pool strunk as a result and the genetic "mutation" that gave increased resistance spread throughout the whole population as a result). Most of the time though single mutations do not have such a huge advantage and so genetic variation is maintained.'
p5723
aS'The counter arguments put forth by its critics do not defeat the Violinist arguments, at the very least. Whether one accepts the argument anyway is another story :P'
p5724
aS"I believe you are thinking of orders, not denominations. There is a big difference.   Strict and loony? Could you be a little more specific, because this statement sounds like it's coming out of complete ignorance.   You also seem to be making the assumption that all of the non-Catholic Christians are somehow very similar, which couldn't be further from the truth."
p5725
aS"Well, there's also carbon dating... Didn't you post something about a decay curve? Are you now going to deny the accuracy of that?"
p5726
aS"We don't live on carbon dioxide. We live from the energy stored in carbon compounds when we break them down."
p5727
aS'You either did not read my post thoroughly, or are intentional misrepresenting me. Post 250 (which I had actually read before starting this thread) is nothing but DamEtel rambling about homologies between vertebrae embryos. That has absolutely nothing to do with the unexplained homologies that the Denton talks about. Evolution simply cannot, reasonably speaking, account for the homology between your arm and leg, among other examples.'
p5728
aS"No. We know that evolution happens. What would be a problem would be to find the processes that made evolution happen as such incredible rates. There isn't any evidence that it can happen that fast."
p5729
aS'Because there is no evidence against the virgin birth and there is considerable evidence against Adam -- including the text of Genesis 1.'
p5730
aS'Little boy, you need to do a little study on Nazis. They specialized in death. Unlike pro-life people.'
p5731
aS'And yet, for most pro-choice folk on these forums, this question really is meaningless. For, even when it is assumed by these folk that the embryo has rights, they nevertheless argue that abortion is still acceptable. Even you believe this Shooter.'
p5732
aS'Well then quit trolling, and start debunking the BS by providing links to cases that were solved by having a gun registry in place.'
p5733
aS"From a book review of BETTER FOR ALL THE WORLD: The Secret History of Forced Sterilization and America's Quest for Racial Purity by Harry Bruinius:http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/26/bo...w/26satel.htmlHmmm, Teddy Roosevelt, Winston Churchill, the Rockefeller foundations, millions of Americans, the State of Indiana. . . all these embraced the concept of EUGENICS.Interesting, yes?"
p5734
aS"You contradict yourself. If the earth was then much as it is today, then there isn't enough water on earth to cover it in any fashion. I have done the math. Do you have any idea of how high the Himalayas, the Alps, the Andes, and the Rockies are? Besides, the Bible talks about a flood that lasted a year, not a series of tsunamis."
p5735
aS'In older times man had more questions without answers than today. Some men believed if a God of fire because they did not understand what fire was. Because of their misunderstanding they invented an answer, the Fire God. Today we know exactly what fire is and we don\'t need to invoke some mythical explanation. Today\'s atheists know that there are many other questions we don\'t have answers for and it\'s OK to simply say we don\'t know instead of buying into the whole "let\'s-invent-some-god-to-explain-it" mentality....'
p5736
aS"Come on, people. You don't butcher an innocent baby for the conveience or sins of the parents. There's plenty of people in the world who would have adopted that baby. And if no one else would have, I would have."
p5737
aS'Why don\'t we do the same for straight marriages then?Why doesn\'t a straight couple that gets married in Colorado, and then moves to Virginia, have to get their divorce "remotely" from Virginia.Or maybe you should start thinking about what AUTHORITY Colorado has to grant a divorce to Virginian RESIDENTS.'
p5738
aS'Actually, the answer might depend more on the nature of the question, or the particular religious cult of the person being asked, etc. In questions of science, fundamentalists will tell you that the answer was revealed to them by their god in their holy scripture.On the other hand, you are characterizing religion as insanity. I think that you really mean that when religion is offered as science, then that is insane.'
p5739
aS"Well . . . one could make that argument about anything--voting for instance. Amendments are created by voting, and people and legislatures vote (hopefully) their conscience (and the will of their constituents), even if they are religious. I think this is a different matter than, say, displaying religious icons on courtroom walls or grounds, which is a clear endorsement of religion by the government. The 18th amendment was religion-motivated, but it didn't get rescinded for THAT reason. It got rescinded because it didn't work practically. (and because FDR wanted to see the returns on the economy for his New Deal)"
p5740
aS'Exactly. It is their fault, but they can do what they choose. It is punishment and you know it, and it is not your job to make sure no "irresponsible" pregnant woman goes unpunished.'
p5741
aS'You do not have a right to drive. No one does. Driving is not a right. The state does not owe it to you to give you a license to drive. The activity of driving is a priveldge granted by the state, not a right.Rights are not regulated by government. You have them and no earthly authority can take it away from you. The state never gave me my rights, I already had them, nor do I have to ask for permission to exercise them.'
p5742
aS'I believe you, OTHERS pick and choose what you believe. What is sad is how many lose their faith when they find how much they have been mislead.'
p5743
aS'This stat sounds more than a bit inflated. Seeing as it comes from a website called "women\'s issues" it is probably not all that credible.'
p5744
aS"And evolution is exhausted. It can't do anything with origins, and recent discoveries of the complexities of the simplest forms of life exhaust it even more."
p5745
aS'Well he has further political aspirations..........The 9th circuit in Sodom (SF) is always making law instead of interpreting it........That is why they are over ruled so often.......'
p5746
aS"Well let's see . . . the last time a state started recognizing gay marriages, suddenly there was more support for a Federal Marriage Amendment than ever, Democrats lost more seats in Congress, the minority Democratic leader was defeated after years in office, a protestant presidential candidate carried the Catholic vote against a Catholic candidate, evangelicals in the country were energized, the pro-FMA candidate WON re-election even though his approval rating was 50%, and the state that recognized gay marriage fell under a slew of legal challenges to the point where it's up in the air again.The more you push you agenda through activist judges, the closer you get to the people having to pass an amendment. At least New York was smart enough not to do it right before an election."
p5747
aS'It can go both ways. We all doubt. It is what you do with it that matters.[QUOTE=gnojek]If a child grew up never hearing the words religion, gods, spirits, etc. would this child still have faith of some sort?Is faith some innate human tendency?It could be seeing as how there is the "god spot" in the brain, but maybe the god spot wouldn\'t develop as fully in the child that was never exposed to religion or thoughts of the supernatural.QUOTE]Look around. Faith did not spontaneously generate out of thin air. It is obviously part of our psyche. Every civilization throughout history has felt the need for some type of faith. Even on different sides of the planet.It\'s as natural as the sun rising.'
p5748
aS"Well, those who keep using that story can't see the real sins of those cities. They are so sure that it was rampent homosexuality which lead to their destruction. Even though we know that before the Angels were ever sent God had spelled out why he was going to destroy them. He sent the angels because they promiced to find even one righteous man. They failed in that because the angels were attacked for being foreigners. Noone who abuses this story is ever going to admit this fact. They can't see past the supposed homosexual issue."
p5749
aS'Thats true. However, do we not have a state of reasonable compromise at the moment?'
p5750
aS'Yes, I would stay out of it, unless I knew the woman, and she spoke up and asked me for an opinion, or advice. And even in the case of the woman being my best friend, and knowing all the different aspects to the situation, I still would not feel comfortable weighing in. Just like if it was me in the situation, I know that ultimately, it would be my decision, and I would have a right to that decision.'
p5751
aS'No nation is perfect, Rev. Not even the USA! A singular instance that you quote is not an argument as anyone can just as easily find criticism with the USA over people freed early from jail.You will find black people over-represented in the jails of the UK, the USA and Australia. There is injustice everywhere.'
p5752
aS'For a 13 year old girl that could greatly damage her body to have a pregnancy so young. She is just starting to grow and mature, and its not healthy, natural, or right to have a pregnancy at that age. She could cause alot of damage being that young.'
p5753
aS"But pro-lifers often base the pro-life stance on preventing harm. Not just religion. (And in this case they are one-in-the-same anyway.) This isn't a case of harm-preventative-morality versus religious-morality; it's a case of two harm-preventative moralities in conflict, due to each only focusing mostly on one aspect (either the mother or the unborn baby)."
p5754
aS"Well if your claim is that you shouldn't push a gun owner's buttons and make them mad, then why are you arguing with me when that's what you're claiming is the wrong thing to do?"
p5755
aS"Oh dear, you're back to your nasty ad hominem self. I could have made fun of the fact that you don't know about materialism, and how its a major force behind evolution. Which is itself a suggestion that you are unaware of the socio-political forces driving western evolutionary theory.**The issue is about people behind sciences, making many different 'sciences'; based on bias, cultural/political/historical. 'Peer' doesn't mean anything because 'peers' are just people with the same background/bias etc.I notice you didn't touch upon Nationalist Sciences. Or for that matter, Capitalist Science.*You mean 'understanding' written English.**I say 'western' because there are other evolutionary theories - Marxist, Nazi, Feminist etc.Thank you, come again."
p5756
aS'They do offer a good insulating blanket which would keep the body of the reptile warm which in turn, would allow the reptile to remain active for a longer period of time. This means more time to hunt and reproduce carrying the mutation onwards.'
p5757
aS'It is clear that the profetallifers wish to make the pregnant woman a slave to her fetus.'
p5758
aS'Bad Religion or misapplied Religion has been in every century, country and culture.'
p5759
aS'The fact that some scientists totally dismiss god is proof of there ignorance of scientific method. There is growing evidence to support the existence of a supreme being, and a lot of scientists are ignorant of this fact, yet they accept theories from the quantum level wich are not proven beyond the proof of the existence of god. Mayabe your mind isnt as closed as others I have spoke with on this subject. I do believe in scientific method, but I also have faith that god is out there.'
p5760
aS"So you're actually claiming that it is a lie to say that the UK has a lower gun crime rate than the US? Even if the police were miscounting crimes it's still a huge and unjustified leap in logic to conclude from that that the UK does not have a lower gun crime rate."
p5761
aS'But behind that are deeper, more fundamental issues about what homosexuality IS and the morality of it. To many people who view homoseuxality as immoral, your movement seems to be trying to write immorality into law.'
p5762
aS'State courts can rule based on state and/or federal law. In this case, the answer was found in the state constitution, so the judge did not need to pursue the issue further.Also, a state constitution can offer more protection that the federal one, as long as, in so doing, it does not contradict the federal constitution.'
p5763
aS'It is horribly oppressive of women, though, to oppose both abortion and contraceptives. That means that women will have no control over their pregnancies at all.'
p5764
aS'All of these examples are scientifically recognized as human life with a unique genetic code.'
p5765
aS'As proved above by definition of reason above, it all depends on what premise or starting assumption you have as to what conclusion you will reason out. You are correct that faith does not neccessary require evidence. But there is usually always evidence to support the validity of a particular faith, in this case Christianity.'
p5766
aS"That is just conservative bias. Conservatives are just as guilty of the same things as liberals and then each has their own ideological idiocy that is unique to each group. Conservatives like classes and don't like change. A pure conservative society would fail just as quickly as a pure liberal one. The last 10 - 20 years as we have become more us vs. them the overall prosperity and well being of the country has declined. With both sides taking the country to extremes. Conservatives eased restrictions and corporations run wild. Those laws are in place for a reason. Liberals overreact and put a choke hold on growth. There was a reason for less restrictive laws, but now they can't do anything meaningful."
p5767
aS"I don't know if you ever heard of the UK Poll Tax but I could have seen myself protesting by non-payment against such a grotesquely unfair system of taxation had I been of the age to do so."
p5768
aS"Again, what evidence? anthropic principle doesn't have anything to do with creation. Puntucated Equlibrium anyone? How is symbiotic relations beteween plants and insects sign of creation?What are you talking about? A dog can't have a cat. That's retarded. What facts are you talking abot? "
p5769
aS'Because in the case of glacial/interglacial variation, CO2 functions as a feedback from orbital forcing. Again, this is all very simple, basic stuff outlined in chapter 6 of the AR4.'
p5770
aS"Because when something passes every experiment thrown at it and when something fits observation better than anything else, then it's as near as damnit fact. We can get pedantic over this if you want, but the conclusion that reaches is that there are no facts."
p5771
aS"And that is why they are wrong. They don't understand science. Science is not the presentation of proof but explanations of the evidence that have been tested."
p5772
aS'Either a gross misunderstanding or a gross misrepresentation of evolutionary theory.'
p5773
aS"so what about jesus' life is credible if the source is unreliable? was it that jesus didnt walk on water but he fed 5000 with 5 loaves? was it that he didnt forgive the samaritan harlot but he raised lazarus from the dead? what did the authors get right? i mean, i can easily believe jesus said he came to bring a sword and not peace. but you dont. so how do we possibly pattern our lives according to how jesus lived if we dont know whether what they recorded was actually what he did?it is necessary to believe that the gospels are true, otherwise you cannot follow a pattrn you dont have."
p5774
aS'They have. Prey animals have their eyes to the sides of their heads which allows them to see in every direction, almost 360 degrees around. Predator animals have their both eyes facing forward.'
p5775
aS'Does any part of the theory of evolution give an accounting of how we transitioned from quadruped movements of the ape to biped? '
p5776
aS'Does the sexual orientation of the would-be single parent even come up?'
p5777
aS"Yes, but our cells, are functional. It's cells are not yet functional beyond dividing."
p5778
aS'Honest question Arch: where is the problem with a potential variance of 10 billion years? I know this question may appear ridiculous to you but could you take the question in the spirit it was meant?'
p5779
aS"And I'm going to correct you again. The theory of evolution is by no means an extreme view. It is the prevailing view. More than 99% of biologists accept the theory of evolution as the best explanation for the observations."
p5780
aS'Given that I do not hold that opinion, I would challenge you show where I have stated such.'
p5781
aS'I think you have your image of an assault weapon slightly skewed. an assault weapon by its very name is a weapon designed to harm another human. this does not mean full auto it just means that it was never designed to be a target/hunting/self defense weapon.'
p5782
aS'"Ready to go", in the sense that living things are equipped with a means of making small errors which are used by natural selection to make new structures.Barbarian, regarding mutations:There is a lot of that. Many mutations are recessive and a population over time accumulates a lot of genetic variation that can become useful if the environment changes. The founder population of lizards, for example, could have had at most, 20 alleles for any gene locus, since each lizard can only have 2. The new ones evolved by mutation. Sometimes, we can even observe that happening, or trace the mutation back to a known ancestor. Would you like to learn about it? .'
p5783
aS'Actually "I don\'t know" is quite a valid answer in science.However, again you slip into this false construct of a belief that all that can be known is in the scope of science; which you\'ve also denied saying you believe in the past.[quote=Montalban]Is this a rational statement? If so, prove it rationally, by science. '
p5784
aS"Oh? And what do you consider yourself when it comes to gun rights? Are you moderate or fanatical? Would you actually declare yourself a fanatic or would you like to be known as a moderate?   I don't think any organization who wants to be taken seriously will declare themselves fanatical about their cause because that would take away from their credibility."
p5785
aS'Listen, I have forgotten more than you will ever learn about what is real and true in this world, so either back up your insults with facts or get lost because It is becoming painfully obvious that attempting to reason with you is an exercise in futility. kind of like trying to travel from point A to point B on a merry-go-round.'
p5786
aS'Well sigma, which is more painful??   Being burnt with salene for 30 minutes to an hour and if that doesnt work after the 3rd time, being born prematurally and laid on a table and starving to death.....   OR   A woman sticking a clothes hanger up and accidentally killing herself but intentionally killing the kid within her?   seems to me that people dont really care about how the baby feels. It has just as much feeling as the mother.'
p5787
aS"Today's students are tomorrow's scientists. They are unlikely to study something that, if they hear about it at all, they hear about it on a less serious level than they do the happenstance origins of atheist evolution. To reduce ID to other classes like literature or social sciences, etc. (where poetry, fiction, and prehistoric beliefs are the subject matter) is nothing more than a clever, dishonest attempt to belittle it."
p5788
aS"Many natural disasters such as tornados, destructive flood, severe drought probably have something to do with global warming.I don't know which is first regarding these combinations. Maybe flood is caused due to global warming, maybe reverse.These phenomena are related each other, so it can't be seperated when we think about it.Maybe global warming itself is not such a big threat but many disadvantages resulting from this are threats to us."
p5789
aS'And how did the Wise Creator come into existence? All that wisdom and creativity cannot come to existence accidentally or spontaneously...'
p5790
aS"I think you got it backwards Kelvin. You're the one that said you wouldn't let your children play with toy guns because you're afraid that your children wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a real gun and a toy gun. Blindone never advocated toy gun-control. On the contrary, Blindone was pointing out that toy guns don't harm children.   And if your children can't tell the difference between fantasy and reality how do you expect them to handle a gun responsibly? They might try to shoot the boogey man or their own shadow."
p5791
aS'You state "the woman comes first". This seems to be your only "absolute". Why does the woman come first? Is it because she is fully developed? Is she more important than the child she is carrying?'
p5792
aS"How do we know anything for sure? We can't be certain of the Earth's age in billions of years, but we can use carbon dating to figure out it's older then 55,000 years, which refutes creationism."
p5793
aS"Actually the kid was on a panel, all pretty much saying the same thing.       Why didn't YOU cite them?"
p5794
aS'But my relationship is between a man and woman. You would be asking marriage to be redefined to do that. Remember, part of what defines marriage is that it is between a man and woman.'
p5795
aS'No Peeling, it would be, "We proved it was possible to evolve as humans have, so why can only we do it?" Why hasn\'t one other creature on Earth ever evolved to our level of sophistication in the same alleged 4 billion years that we have had to attain our level of evolution? If evo is real, then it seems only right that it should touch all species equally and that all species that weren\'t forced into extinction, but survived and overcame the pressures they faced should have ended up in a similar evolved place that man has attained in 4 billion years.Unless of course that the science of evolution is a humanistic justification to explain our origins but has no basis in fact what so ever. And that is my claim and belief.'
p5796
aS'And many news stories have referred to the New York shooter as being armed with a "high powered rifle" despite the fact that this was blatantly false. Why should we take this story as being fully factual about the details of background checks and gun shows?And a lot of newspapers are repeating the claims that fully-automatic machine guns, anti-tank missiles, fragmentation grenades and rocket launchers, are being bought by mexican drug cartel members -even though they couldn\'t possibly pass a background check- and that they\'re being bought from gun stores in America! But no matter how many times we demand proof of such, NONE IS EVER PRESENTED!Come back with undeniable proof that FFL dealers never conduct federally mandated background checks when selling guns at gun shows, otherwise don\'t post on the topic anymore since you have nothing but lies and scare mongering tactics.'
p5797
aS'an image is not the original. a photo of you is not you, its an image of you. the image cannot be or replace the original, and isnt intended toregardless of how "perfect" the photocopier is, you cannot cash the "perfect" copy of the check. it may be a perfect replica, to the detail, but it is still only an image. the problem isnt the quality of the copying process, but the fact that the copy itself is just that, a copy, not the original'
p5798
aS"The biblical end has got to be near. This was a Doctor who spends all of his life saving people's lives."
p5799
aS"Well either way he didn't answer the question. I saw the video. I saw and heard his responce. He can't squirm his way out of the fact that he didn't know the answer.    The internet site also quotes:"
p5800
aS"Besides the hundreds of cases in which such things are directly observed, I guess you're right."
p5801
aS"Not once have I said he is perfect. But when people criticize things that I either know are false or I don't agree with, I will back him up. Just like people back up Kerry. I will remember that when you try to defend anyone."
p5802
aS"No it's not. Perhaps because you don't understand much about evolutionary theory you have confused it with ID. ID is not science and has no evidence to support it."
p5803
aS'well i was downplaying your argument because really, pregnancy is not that demeaning to a womans body. ITS NATURAL! OBESITY ISNT!'
p5804
aS'The laws of physics are short, descriptive statements that describe the operation of certain natural phenomena that always seem to occur in the same way. Many times the "laws of physics" have been amended by further information, causing the law to be restated.Actually, I think he meant the way that we have observed the universe and all of nature to operate.'
p5805
aS"And as I said, Herbert Spencer's ideas predate Darwin's. Meanwhile, Dawkins writings on religion are irrelevant to whether evolution is good biology."
p5806
aS"But just try and remove them from those that think we do and you will have a war on your hands. It's too bad we didn't become more like Canada is respect to gun ownership. A lot more people would be alive today and others not sitting in prison for crimes they commited."
p5807
aS'Is that not agnostic? You leave yourself open to change if evidence dictates it.   Sorry if this is just turning into word games.'
p5808
aS'Not in the concept of what God is like. Jesus, salvation, the afterlife are other topics. Believing that there is a supreme being is only one step.'
p5809
aS"The only 'duty' that any human being has with a parasite is to extract it as quickly as they can, if they chose to do so."
p5810
aS'But I see two people involved here. Whether the women is better off or not is irrelevant to me. She has no right to kill the other just like you have no right to kill your neighbor. I\'m not for allowing decisions on everything and to be against "choices" is not a bad thing considering every law restricts choices.'
p5811
aS'How does being poor limit your responsibility to protect yourself? I know a poor woman who has 10 kids just hoping that one day she would find a man that would be willing to help raise the rest. Also, what do you mean by "less fortunate? It never happened but she kept having kid after kid and hoping it would. Should she be excused for her behavior because she is poor? No, she kept going to BARS looking for good men. Bad choices = bad outcome. Do you think that this is proof that abortion is necessary? Nope, abortion IS NOT the answer in cases like this, only responsibility can solve the problem. The bad thing is that only one of the men do anything for the children and he doesn\'t do enough. She has never filed for child support and the kids are almost never disciplined. '
p5812
aS'I\'ve been around the creationist/science discussions for a number of years, about 20 or so. The "you believe in evolution" argument has been around for at least that long. In my experience it has been a waste of breath to try to convince creationists that I don\'t believe in evolution any more than they do. As I recall, the argument was even presented in a court case back in the late 60s, or maybe it was the early 80s. I could be wrong. I\'ll have to check on that.'
p5813
aS"Oh, is THAT where you are getting your information? The Biotic Message? I read the book tens years ago and eventually sold it because it wasn't worth keeping. You do know that it is a book on biology written not by a biologist, but by an engineer. Right? Walter Jame ReMine is a mere engineer of some sort, and has no degree in biology. And biologists strongly argue against his claims. PS: I even had a few exchanges with ReMine when I was posting at ARN. I argued against him, even though I was an IDist at the time, because he was not being truthful."
p5814
aS"For years I've tried to get one of our resident gay members to debate me on that fact. To date, no takers. Want to step up?"
p5815
aS'The gene and therefore the enzyme it produces. LPL is the designation for a gene that encodes Lipoprotein Lipase, an enzyme that hydrolyzes lipids in lipoproteins. The actual gene encodes a protein of 475 amino acids that becomes a mature protein of 448 amino acids after cleavage of a signal peptide. One study was able to identify 3 common SNPs (Single Nucleotide Polymorphism) in the coding region of the gene, 2 of which result in small changes in enzyme function in European populations. The third SNP converts that locus to a stop codon and results in an enzyme that is 447 amino acids long. Thus, the enzyme has been truncated. The resulting enzyme, LPL S447X, is functional. In fact, it results in lower incidence of vascular disease and lower blood pressure. Other truncations result in non-functional enzymes.'
p5816
aS'How is that a affect of deterrence? Deterrence works by preventing people through the fear of consequences. A dead man has no fears. Furman Vs. Georgia, where the supreme court specifically noted that there is not a single piece of conclusive evidence that the penalty is a effective deterrent.'
p5817
aS"So God already knows if a particular person will become an addict? That doesn't leave much free choice for that person, does it? If I go to a restaurant and God already knows I'm going to choose the poached salmon for my entree, then I don't have much choice in the matter, do I? Omniscience and free will are mutually exclusive. If God is omniscient, then we are indeed ultimately robots. Deluded with the perception of free will, but robots none the less.Unless of course, God is so omnipotent that he can know everything and still allow free choice. But then reason, logic, and thought become delusional. Sounds like a loose / loose situation to me."
p5818
aS"To the extent that working toward social change on any moralistic issue is an 'imposition', sure. But I think one could say that about anything that has a social effect."
p5819
aS'This is a very simple, easily answerable question. Most people, especially in America, have problems with people telling them what to do. Teenagers hate being under the authority of adults. Adults hate being under the authority of the government and enforcers of the law. Everyone in the world is under worldly authority, but to actually have a God who created you, which gives him the right to make commandments stating what is good for you and what is not, that makes most people really XXXXXX off. '
p5820
aS"I've been posting at least a few times a week. That's a lot more than once a month. I pointed out that the US has higher levels of gun crime than most developed nations while you tried to focus on a few tragedies in response to someone questioning the claim that criminals will always get guns. I think it's obvious whose argument is more cherry picked. "
p5821
aS"Yes, in my view, it would be morally correct since it has no brain and, in my definition, is not a person with rights. However, if she doesn't want to support the violinist in that future, she has the responsibility to disconnect from (and therefore kill) that brainless body before the brain gets transplanted. Otherwise, if she waits to disconnect until it is too late, she would be guilty of killing the violinist (a person)."
p5822
aS'Nothing "proves" evolution. However, there\'s an overwhelming amount of evidence that supports evolution.'
p5823
aS'Yes, but the statement directly contradicts proponents of "creation science" and of ID. Their claim is that they are doing science, even though they can\'t show how. Scientists have claimed all along that creationists/IDers are doing philosophy and religion, but not science. That is the problem. They never offer any evidence that supports their assertions, only mythology and superstition.But now we have Ray admitting that creationism and ID are not science and can\'t be included in science. They either philosophy or theology, but not science.'
p5824
aS'Well, if burglars want to steal guns then it makes sense that they would be likely to target the homes of gun owners. And the source is from the recently published book Evaluating Gun Policy which you can read and review. The source is listed at the bottom.'
p5825
aS'Because that the law one has to presume and of course the law applied to that specific case. As to it being contradictory - well the law is loaded with contradictions if you look at all closely. On the other hand consider that the driver killed the woman AND obviously damaged her fetus beyond recovery - WITHOUT the consent of the woman. In other words the death of the fetus was not by consent of the person who holds the right to decide but rather by the negligence or intent of the guilty party.And yes prior to her death (assumming all other requirements were met) she could have AT HER CHOICE and UN-COERCED have chosen to abort the fetus without incurring a legal penalty. But that would of course be much different.'
p5826
aS"Unfortunately Democrats have a credibility problem. Many Pro-gun Democrats have been elected, and America is giving them a chance, but apparently they do not believe Obama because of his past Anti-gun support and votes. However   Ms. Feinstein's comments about waiting for the correct timing to bring up gun control  did not help the creditability problem either. I guess only time will tell."
p5827
aS'And he accomplished all this human carnage without a gun. This just proves that if it was possible to eliminate all projectile firing weapons from existing on earth, men would find a way to commit atrocities against his own kind just as he did before such weapons existed if murder was in his heart. Guns are not the issue, the corrupted heart/nature of humanity is.'
p5828
aS'I think I posted that awhile ago. Its huge BS. Thats like saying "Civil rights hurt blacks". Even though abortion may have some unwated side affects, its no where near the emotional and physical pain and suffering for the rest of your life than a forced pregnancy. Just goes to show that the pro-life movement is desperate.'
p5829
aS'Nothing. "T. Kennedy" is an alias of a known terrorist.'
p5830
aS"I know you're talking to Jessica, so I will only comment on this. It would be easier to make it rare if pro-life people weren't intent on making it illegal. Pro-choice people have to make it as available as possible to counter pro-life attempts to shut it down entirely.If pro-life people didn't exist, then the reasonable people could work towards making abortion rare.Take the current debates for example. My entire point is that it should not be illegal. That abortion should be available as a safe and legal choice (it can only be really safe if it's legal). We spend all our time and effort debating the legality that we spend no time on creating programs to help women choose to continue their pregnancies instead of having an abortion, legal or not."
p5831
aS"If the fetus is human is not relevant? So if everyone says it is human then it still doesn't have a right to live then huh? Do you really support the killing of an innocent life for whatever reason? Do you really think placing one human over another is good (in this case women is more important then baby)?"
p5832
aS"Wow, I think this is the first time I've ever heard anyone claim that the pro-choice movement is for the sake of the child. Sorry, you aren't even close. I don't know a pro-choicer period that would say it's for anything other than the sake of the woman."
p5833
aS'You say you cannot see it from the gay perspective, then you speak from that perspective as a gay man. This is confusing. As a heterosexual, if you are one, would you give up those rights and let gays have the rights?'
p5834
aS"Well, their cash cow dried up and even Toby Hoover is going to have to get a new gig. No matter how many times these dire warnings were given they just never came to pass and over 2/3rds of the people are wise to them now and they have lost any credibility at all. Folks all over are now standing up demanding their rights and the left has expended both it's money and political and emotional capital. Stick a fork in them Lucy, they are done emoticonXHoho"
p5835
aS'And so on. Yes. a lie generated by creationist liars is what you use as source for what scientists are claimed to adhere to? Your dishonesty is actually rather startling. This is the worst attempt at dishonesty I have seen from lying creationists yet, and your gleeful introduction of that lie shows how truly and completely dishonest you are. Would you stop your lies. You are pathetic.'
p5836
aS'No more so than the Scalia/Uncle Clarence Thomas cabal opining that the words NO LAW mean something other than what they do when they rule in a First Amendment case.'
p5837
aS"You're obviously an Obama supporter, they're the only people who wouldn't be upset at his abusive tactics of threatening lawsuits against anyone that runs unfavorable ads against him, thus showing that he doesn't support the First Amendment."
p5838
aS'So given that there are cases where both dies... we just have to give up the mother\'s right to live over a fetus (which will die)? What if the mother isn\'t physically ready to have a baby. In the case of a young female (I\'m talking age of 9 and younger, cause there are cases of young kids having their periods) being raped, doesn\'t she a "baby" (and I say baby, because she is still at an age where a parent would consider her their youngin)... have the right to live? For me, if I knew my child was raped and is in no way ready for a child of her own, physically or mentally... I would rather her not risk her life to try and bring that fetus into the world.Abortion should be pro-choice.'
p5839
aS'I dunno about that, but possibly. They do know that those afflicted with ADD have some unusual structures in their brains too. Last I heard they were investigating the causality of homosexuality with developmental deficencies in the brain. The jury is not out yet'
p5840
aS"No it doesn't. That's why Darwin objected to the use of that phrase in reference to his theory. Those who don't bother to learn the theory tend to misunderstand. Fittness is not a reference to big and strong. It makes it too easy to misrepresent evolutionary theory.I'll state it again since you seem to have missed or ignored it the first time. Natural selection is differential reproductive success. Those organisms that are well adapted to their environment tend to survive to reproduce in greater numbers, and therefore they tend to leave more offspring, than those organisms that are less well adapted.You've got to be a pretty shallow thinker to equate an environmental advantage with big and strong."
p5841
aS'Could you please cite where you are getting this biological definition of evolution?'
p5842
aS"You only say that it won't make a change because you support the effects it will have."
p5843
aS'382 - 405 are the dates I have, under Pope Damasus I.'
p5844
aS"Nice try. If America was an Ally to Germany during WWII, to this day you wouldn't forgive US Citizens no matter what excuse they have."
p5845
aS"Well then there's grounds for a lawsuit. Find a group of veterans and get them to sue the VA, funded by the NRA, and take the whole organization to court on charges of violating federal standards."
p5846
aS'Again, we never said that a human fetus was a different species.'
p5847
aS"I'm not against concealed carry in principle but open carry seems silly to me. I smell posers."
p5848
aS'Then should not your challenge be re-worded to say "What might be the best..."Because at present we are not at a stage where by we know everything about \'pain\' therefore in the current climate, rather than what might be known down the track, I think I have met the majority of your challenge. After-all, you are insisting now on what \'you can measure\', and we can\'t measure all that there is about pain, at present.'
p5849
aS"I'm not aware that the police used violence in arresting any of the people discussed in this case. Besides, I'm not discussing personal morality here, I'm discussing what should be legal, and what is practical in a society where not everyone shares the same moral views. Government is there to apply limits to what is permitted, based on the will of the people."
p5850
aS"No its federal property and falls under AR190-11 and other applicable regulations.   If they live off post I believe so if they follow policy and regulations. If they live on post then the POWs must be stored in unit arms rooms and only drawn out with the commander's permission."
p5851
aS"Socialism is a very broad category of political ideals, which particular form were you thinking of?And just so you know, Fascism is not a form of socialism in any way. Socialism does not have oppressive governments. The purpose of socialism is to remove the class differences in society, if there is a small group of bureaucrats enforcing their will on the workers then that's a class difference."
p5852
aS"I agree, for the most part. Once you get to tanks and helicopters though? Too big, too easy a target for a tyrannical regime. Do you see the Iraqis and Afghanis using tanks and helicopters? I'm sure they could get them if they really wanted, but they're useless against a government that invests in satellite technology and bombers. Better to stick with the rocket launchers and mines."
p5853
aS'You offer no positive evidence towards Creationism nor did you deny that the idea of Creationism as scientific was destroyed long ago.'
p5854
aS"so since most abortions weren't rape, do you still support abortions for people who are raped? Just wondering."
p5855
aS"None of the 'fishersci' links would take, but I did get a look at the fibre optic systems. Will try again later."
p5856
aS"Also another example put forward is a bacteria that can only sustain itself by eating Nylon. The theory goes - nylon is a recent invention therefore this bacteria must have eolved recently.What it suggests however is that a portion of an existing population would have died if not for nylon... the bug has to have nylon, or it will die.It is akin to looking at a portion of the human population who would die from heart-trouble. But thankfully we've now got artificial hearts, therefore this portion can survive. They are not a new species of human, but live only because of a recent invention."
p5857
aS'He was barred for presenting hard evidence against the Big Bang. Observable evidence. He was the head astronomer at Mt Carmel not just another astronomer. He was our best one.Being barred from the telescopes he was in charge of , being fired , and having to move to Germany is not what you consider suppression? I am not willing to discuss this with you anymore if you refuse to do it honestly. You can say anything.'
p5858
aS"Well do you mean Texas or Texans? Because Texas holds the record for execusions in the US. Not something I'd be proud of."
p5859
aS"That wasn't my question. My question wasn't what you said, but what you believed. You sort of answered that. But the same people spouting off about the second ammendment being the reason for guns should also be for it defending your right to a nuclear bomb."
p5860
aS'I have never disagreed that marriage is a special dependent class. My point is that it is a society-sanctioned special class.'
p5861
aS"I don't think people have a right to kills themselves (obviously not natural and obviously not legal right now). As for the other question, I wouldn't think a blatent disregard for the others health is morally ok."
p5862
aS"I do not understand why people are stuck in this mindset that we have to define ALL abortions as either right or wrong. In between, there is the option of calling abortion under certain circumstances as right or wrong or calling abortion in certain trimesters as right or wrong. Why limit yourself to the extreme views? I do not believe that the original post asked for an absolute answer, just a survey of opinions. After all, as you say, abortion is not math and there is no one answer that everyone might agree with. However, the question of people's opinions on the beginning of personhood and how it relates to the morality of abortion lies at the very core of the debate on abortion rights. Really ... what other question is more relevant?"
p5863
aS"Oh, we don't have to - sorry, I wasn't clear enough there. What I'm trying to do is correct your misapprehensions concerning common descent. You said this:"
p5864
aS'The 7 day creation I am referring to, not merely the possibility of divine creation through the Big bang etc'
p5865
aS'Well, as usual the Creationist is trying to make an arguement against science using their moral viewpoint. Forget about all that pseudo science trying to discredit evolution and geochronology, all it comes down to is this: "My religion has the exact answers to questions about my origins, I do not like what science has to say on this subject".Its so much more succinct that way, I just wish they could be up front about it.'
p5866
aS"No. I never mentioned grades. You brought that one up. I'm saying that having guns on school campus isn't a good plan due to the high level of emotions in the area."
p5867
aS"Yes Peeling; you say this with such assurance, yet what you can't explain with any assurance is why only one offshoot of the Primate genus evolved into what human beings are today. Why only us, when we all allegedly started in the same environment with the same ecosystems putting the same pressures on us. What I'm saying is that in every place where our alleged primate ancestors fossils have been found, so haven't the fossils of animals described as lower primates been found. So your explanation that one species evolved while another stagnated or died out rings hollow with me. Especially since you can actually prove absolutely none of this. Can't you see that Peeling? None of this is provable."
p5868
aS"Yea I agree with you on how there was no exact se t of laws at the beginning of creation. The reason I say that they most likely didn't marry their sisters is mostly cause God gets mad at Cain and places a mark on his head so everyone he runs across will not kill him unless they want to die a death 10 times worse than his. Kinda just says that there are other people out there."
p5869
aS'That is an erroneous line of reasoning because it fails to take into account the myriad of other options open to a women after birth to remove the newborn from her care without any ill effects (physically anyway). Killing in the instance of a newborn is not justified because of those other options open to her. By contrast, a pregnant woman has exactly one option open to her to remove the fetus from her care and that is abortion. I would contend that the same line of reasoning that allows for adoption can be used here, that no one must donate their resources to a dependant.Your reasoning that a woman, using the same line of reasoning that pro-choice people employ, can withhold her bodily resources "until the newborn dies" as if that is equal to withholding bodily resources in pregnancy is faulty.'
p5870
aS"But that doesn't help much with calculating the length of a day from actual astronomical observations. Perhaps if we told Freeofthought that the current rate of slowing of the earth is 0.005 sec/year/year. I have no doubt that Freeofthought will misunderstand that number - it is a rate. Just assume that rate has been unchanging even though it hasn't been.A lot of the creationists misunderstanding comes from remarks like the following."
p5871
aS'You blame others for your failure to understand the basics.'
p5872
aS"Any form of legislation is a voting matter. That's the way our system works."
p5873
aS"Lurch, I don't appreciate your condescending tone. If you want to challenge my assertion that you are a pompous XXX that jumps to conclusions, you will need to be a little less judgemental and start thinking outside of Darwin's Black Box."
p5874
aS'Well, in the sense that we cannot actually detect the intelligent design Behe proposes, then it it OUTSIDE the limit of actual detection.'
p5875
aS"Right on! A real man supports those he loves, through thick and thin. He doesn't try and control the things he can't either.In the end, it's not a man's decision. It is not his body, therefore, he has no right to make the ultimate decision. He can only express his view. That's about it. (I'm pretty sure it's not any easier for her to decide). So cudos to those men."
p5876
aS"So what, the thread isn't about her signature. If we started responding to threads by attacking people's signatures, we'd all be in serious trouble. Especially me emoticonXAngel"
p5877
aS"You JUST said they get health care in the hospital! Read your post, where's there NO healthcare. And it IS based on the ability to pay...you just want me to pay for someone else's and in the most inefficient way possible."
p5878
aS'They need to keep their opinions to themselves and out of the law the effect gay peoples lives. I see nothing wrong with locking up those who incite hatred towards gay people just as we lock up people who shout fire in a crowded theatre.'
p5879
aS"I will stop quoting here. Don't want people to have too big a read. Actually ToE isn't all that random. To a certain degree yes. But Sexual Selection aka a part of the ToE. Dictates that when there is a benificial/attractive change. That change will be enhanced almost exponentially. Because the female of the species will be programmed to search for that and will carry the gene herself so will give it to her off spring. And the male will be more succesfull so produce more off spring. So no instant eyes or anything like that. I think that's what you were implying. Sorry for responding in Kronus's stead. I'm sure he can defend himself but I found it unjust the way you replied to his post and attacked it on foundations that you didn't have."
p5880
aS'Even though I am for gay marriage I do agree. Correlation is not causation.'
p5881
aS'I think it would be an exception as well.But if you see an indicator that might point to an "exception", I think the question should be asked.Consider the flip side of things. The question doesn\'t get asked.If Skip had been the type of man to let a gay couple\'s house burn to spite gays, don\'t you think that the gay couple would have had grounds to sue the city in such a situation?Part of this is just the city covering its own XXX. If they ask the question, and the guy lies, they have helped to cover their own XXX by asking the question.'
p5882
aS'Holy grail implies it is like a religion, which it is not. If evidence is found that overturns this theory, it will be discarded in favour of a better one.'
p5883
aS'wow... you are bent on harping on creationists arguments at whatever the cost.first of all, you are not even considering that the majority of people are misinformed of what evolution is not because they have creationist motives, but because they go to the dictionary for definitions'
p5884
aS"Incorrect.   Evolution is not something that must be adhered to. It is a scientific theory. As such, if evidence was brought to light that evolutionary theory couldn't account for, then the theory would be altered or scrapped. It's really quite simple."
p5885
aS"Yes, you are missing something. How come age doesn't start at conception? How come when babies are born they aren't 9 months old instead of, well, seconds old."
p5886
aS"As a gun owner I'm also a property owner. Or are you denying that guns are property?"
p5887
aS'Logically incorrect. One can as many red balls as one likes, and still only have one green one.'
p5888
aS"Apples and oranges. We're not demanding that they have abortions either."
p5889
aS'But let me guess ... if they step down RIGHT after they find they will have to issue to gay couples, you\'d be in favor of them being able to be sued for it, simply because the "discrimination" in such an event was toward gays? Right? At least if you are consistent with your stance elsewhere in regards to \'timing\' ... emoticonXRolleyesAnyway, aside from that inconsistency with your position elsewhere, I agree that county officials should need to comply. After all, there are probably OTHER examples whereby county officials have to do things that they are religiously against, such as issue divorce papers. Or marry some drunk couple that they know aren\'t really being serious even though they\'re tying the knot ... If all county officials could just refuse to do their job because of their objections--for WHATEVER reasons--it would be a collosal mess.'
p5890
aS"Gun control maintains its racist roots even in this day and age. What other reason would there be for Form 4473 to ask applicants what their race is? What is the importance of knowing if somebody's white, black or mexican when they're buying a gun?"
p5891
aS'Actually the Alan Guttmacher Institute is quite reputible. They have their own web site. Check it out. Also, why would a site called "womens issuses" be in valid?'
p5892
aS'would that be legaly owned guns, or criminals who have guns (and also ues guns) for there crimes? most Gang members have guns, if they are killed in a drive by shooting, is the gun responsable, or would it be the illegal activitys?'
p5893
aS'To you, it may be an incorrect statement. But if it is, you have to tell me what it is you kill and take the life away from when you abort the zygote. Not knowing if it is being killed or not knowing someone wants to kill it makes no difference. Injustice is still practiced there, and not even some abortion doctors realize it.'
p5894
aS'Oh joy another drive by with absolutely no proof or evidence.'
p5895
aS"Everyone expects that. What they don't and shouldn't have to expect is that they will be specifically targeted and have to pay more, be penalised more, etc. than hetero couples such as yourself or me and my husband."
p5896
aS'"Babies" are a stage reached after birth. If you are talking about abortions, then no babies are involved, anti-choice, histrionic revisionist linguistics none withstanding'
p5897
aS'None of these alternate views go outside the framework of evolution. They all use poor wording, though, and try to lead one to some conclusion about "information" or something.'
p5898
aS"You know what they mean, I know what they mean, but as someone involved in teaching evolution to high school kids I wish they'd avoid the implication of purposeful change and just refer to beak size changing in response to new selective pressure.As I said, I may just be being nit-picky. Language apart, this is another nice example of evolutionary change happening right before our eyes."
p5899
aS"They are safer. The 300 gun deaths per year rate has dropped since then.Let's have a little reality intrude on the gun porn fantasies. Only 13% of Swiss homes ever had an Army-issue weapon in them, Militia service extending only from age 20 to age 30, and the ammunition was stored in a sealed pack, with severe punishments for the seal being broken."
p5900
aS'Heller is about determining the answer to a long standing question on the nature of the Second Amendment, and how much gun control is legally allowed. Roe v. Wade is about finding legal precedent for the murder of unborn children.I see absolutely no comparison between the two.'
p5901
aS"Many of the gun hating crowd also own guns. It's the elitism belief, that they're superior to all humans and thus deserve to be armed, while everyone else in the world should be unarmed and bow before them as if they're gods."
p5902
aS"But I think that is the point. What if you didn't agree with the germ theory of disease? Does that mean that it shouldn't be taught in health classes in our schools? Should it be replaced by the bad humors of night air theory? But not everyone agrees with that theory either."
p5903
aS'if the only choices we can possibly make are the one God approves, then we dont have free will, because we cannot free choose the option that God does not approve of, which means we are forced to only choose the options that God approves of. this is not free will'
p5904
aS'We cannot prove the existence of God for, by definition, he dwells in a reality outside our own. Similarly, I cannot prove the existence of a Flying Shoe in Hyperspace, nor can I disprove it, but I can prove that the Flying Shoe does not exist in our world because it exists, by definition, in Hyperspace.I can make up anything I want and say it exists in another universe. A round square, a colorless green idea that sleeps furiously, you name it.'
p5905
aS'Well, it might help if you could propose a mechanism for such changing traits that would stand up as well as the current model of genetic inheritance.'
p5906
aS'I think more than this is the principle of human dignity. That humans have inherent dignity and value at every stage of life. This is transcendent of whether they are conscious or unconscious and it is why we treat 24 week premies who have no real conscious existence and a 30 year old automobile accident victim in a coma on a respirator and you and me the same. So strongly do humans recognize this inherent dignity that even in death a person is dignified with a funeral ceremony recognizing their life had inherent meaning and value. We build memorials to those who were victimized in life.'
p5907
aS"To say nothing of the possible threats to people's safety, if not actual acts of violence."
p5908
aS"So have I, since I know that evolution has and does take place. But I catch it from both sides because I don't believe the scientific explanation of the origins of life or the beginning of intelligent awareness."
p5909
aS'Those abortions that are perpetrated as "birth control" should be outlawed.'
p5910
aS"Dealing with a designated nuisance species isn't the same thing as hunting. It's wildlife management."
p5911
aS"So, I guess you didn't get the memo that this country was FOUNDED on Christian/Judaic beliefs. Remember: You do have rights; to an extent."
p5912
aS"It may only be salvaging to you but to the parents involved it is body theft.Let me just ask you to step in our shoes for just 10 minutes imagine trawling around 100's of hospital labs and medical schools seeing all these poor little babies lined up in jars and i don't mean just a few there is up to 50 in each hospital and school imagine looking at those jars hoping that one of them is your child so you can at lastgive him the burial he/she deserves(a basic human right) yet at the same time praying that none of them are yours.Having done that can you still say that it is only salvage bearing in mind our children were only sent for post mortem and many of us have not seen them since?"
p5913
aS"End the guessing right now. Don't guess. The meaning of the 2nd Amendment is explained in two documents: 1) The Militia Act of 1792 and 2) Federalist Papers #29. Both of which was written by the same Congress and same men who wrote the 2nd Amendment, the Constitution, and established the political philosophy of our country.First the Militia Act states WE AREA ALL IN THE MILITIA and that all citizens bring thier own weapons. - http://www.constitution.org/mil/mil_act_1792.htmThe more broader philosophy and intent of the 2nd Amendment and the Militia Act is further explained in the Federalist #29. - http://federalistpapers.com/federalist29.htmlThese documents are the thoughts and intent of the men who wrote the 2nd Amendment. So gun control slime are guessing or trying to reinvent history when they think gun ownership is collective. None of these documents anywhere support the collective idea."
p5914
aS"You asked where the line should be drawn in regards to weapons?How about where ownership and use of weapons does not violate the rights of others. Before you respons think about it. Do anything you want. If I don't violate anyone then what is the beef? If I don't break any laws or endanger anyone what is the beef?The safe storage and handling of cannon, cannon propellant, and cannon ammo is well known. They can be stored in places typical of homes without violating the rights of others. BTW a cannon is not a weapon. It is considered a 'firework' by the ATF. Ever see a civil war renactment? Lots of cannons? So yes having a cannon in your front yard does fly."
p5915
aS'Semantics. God has mandated against homosexuality. My point is, people are prepared to admit that the creation story, and the story of noahs arc are metaphors. They read them, and then look at the evidence to hand and say "Well, it can\'t be really true the way it is written, so it must mean this..."But the bias of the church against homosexuality is based of a small passage of text which, it seems, cannot be interpreted away. That part that condemns homosexuality is accurate, straight-from-gods-mouth truth. Again, why the dichotomy? Why are some parts of the bible open to interpretation, but others are rigid?'
p5916
aS'Actually they do. Whether or not you think they should is another matter entirely. Did you not notice where the article came from? From a paper in India. I also found articles on the same subject from papers all over the country as well as in other countries such as Romania.   Save your snobbery for someone else.'
p5917
aS"Just some interesting information I learned when we went caving a couple years ago (a real cave, not one of the commercialized ones). Bats actually have better eyesite than humans, but even they can't see in pitch black. No eye can."
p5918
aS'I think that the type of weapon does make a difference. A tyrant would be more dangerous to the world if he was armed with WMDs rather than knives.'
p5919
aS'Kronus said this was a win for science. He never mentioned that religion was discredited- never mentioned religion at all. Religion and science are utterly unrelated. Why would you make that connection?'
p5920
aS'Then 99% of creationists are not informed as far as I can tell. It seems that your position is that "informed" creationists are neo-Darwinists, fully accepting of the theories of evolution.'
p5921
aS"No, they're the same species. If you put all these fish in the same pool at the end they would all breed with each other. The example wasn't of speciation, merely of a change in a population driven by the environment, which is the essense of evolution."
p5922
aS'But if you actually take time to read the study that is posted on that website it appears that the claims of the NSPOF are doubtful, inconsistent with other studies, and likely biased in favor of people answering that they had used a gun to defend themselves. '
p5923
aS'Actually in high school I had a friend who used to be in placement. He was sixteen years old an he said he got the s*** beat out of him by an eight year old boy. "Street kids" get their XXX beat every day, pain is nothing new to them. It seems they\'re immune to it. It doesn\'t matter how hard you can hit, if you can\'t take a punch, then you can\'t call yourself street-worthy.'
p5924
aS"I don;t really know anything about british gun control in colonial india, and don't really see it's relevance, since colonial india is gone. I DO know that this had nothing to do with the British refusal to conscript indians into the British Army. This was directed at the disarming of the Indian Army under british rule. The indian citizens were never actually disarmed under British rule, just the army. During WWI, indians were allowed to volunteer for the British army (the British knew it was a bad idea to conscript men from colonies)."
p5925
aS'Crime has dropped significantly in New York and Los Angeles in recent years. '
p5926
aS"I'm glad you made the same correlation I did. ToE is a substitute for #### in this case."
p5927
aS'Actually, everything the bible say\'s belies your "atheist answer". The reality is that the world itself and all of Gods Creation speaks to His existence as being self evident. It takes a degree of faith to accept Jesus as our personal Savior, but as far as accepting the reality of God Himself, all one need do is look observe the world we live in to see that only an incredible and loving God could create such a Beautiful and marvelous World with so many amazing symbiotic and perfectly interdependent forms of life.'
p5928
aS"So sorry, Anastasia...that's a horrible thing to face. And now, using that excuse? What!   If justice was swift for the guilty then he would not have escaped only to do it again. Some criminals never change, and via your testimony, only live to do it again.   There are some who need to be put to death.   Your situation made me shudder, Anastasia. But, I am glad you didn't let it (revenge) effect you to the point of taking his life yourself.   If it would have been my father, those many years ago, I cannot say that I would have waited, nor would have accepted that lame excuse of retardation. I could very well be in prison myself."
p5929
aS"And where exactly did you hear this? I find it hard to believe a governent that couldn't keep an affair or a low-level break-in under wraps could keep something like that secret................. Also if it is true and among alliance forces why do you blame solely the US?"
p5930
aS'Except several rligious organizations around the country have financed, and gathered signatures to put anti gay marriage amendments on the ballot. They have a religious belief that marriage is between one man and one woman. They have turned this belief into law regaurdless of the religious beliefs of gay people. Any one who has voted yes to place these amendments into state constitutions because they have a religious belief that excludes gay people from marriage has also imposed those religious beliefs upon gay people. In short I have been barred from marrying the person I love because someone else, that I do not know and who does not know me, has some sick religious belief.'
p5931
aS'So we should just say "god did it", and give up?'
p5932
aS"NOt true,California's ammendments are not doing as well as other states did. You are talking about a very liberal state. If it is decided that marriage is allowed by the courts, then you are talking about taking away rights people have been granted by the courts. I just don't think that will happen in Calf. much too liberal."
p5933
aS'What you are talking about here is the *potential* to exist being important. I would personally also thinking that potential existence is important, but not nearly as important as an existing person. After all, unfertilized eggs and sperm also have the *potential* to become full people but no one is concerned about their loss. For many of us it is the actual mentally-existing person that is most important. For both the \'braniac" case you present and for the early term fetus, if there is no reason to kill it, then don\'t. However, if there is a contest between the rights of a living, existing person and the rights of either *potential* person, then I think the rights of the living person win out.'
p5934
aS"Because....expansion occurs after heat is added. How can a expansion occur with a prior cause? You're saying the reaction and cause happen at the same time. Show me an example that does that."
p5935
aS"That's because its sophistry. Its an inherent contradiction and it simply means we don't have the capacity to understand it. Another more common example is that the assertion that the universe cannot be endless, and yet as far as we know it is. Trying to understand it is for us humans like an ant trying to fathom the theory of relativity.Damn are we ever conceited as a race...we seem to think that if we can't understand something, it cannot be. We also tend to think, in every generation, that we have achieved somehow the pinnacle of progress."
p5936
aS'So what standards of proof do you hold the bible to? What allows you to hold it next to other religious or fantastical texts and say "Yes, this one is definately, without fail, the word of God, and this one is not."'
p5937
aS'So do you want to argue my points or do you want to argue me? Which of my bullits are wrong? Which of them are right?'
p5938
aS'Accidents for one. Just last week a man who was drinking and cleaning his firearm accidentally shot and killed his daughter. Run a google search for "man shoots self" the amount of accidental shootings is rather disturbing yet funny. Most of these however are due to improper gun safety though.'
p5939
aS"Yes I disagree with that point. The navy, just like the police, can't possibly be everywhere that danger might raise its ugly head. Merchant ships can't afford a 24/7 navy escort anymore than the average citizen can afford to hire body guards 24/7.There's no legitimate reason why merchant ships should be unarmed and unable to address dangers that deliberately come after them."
p5940
aS"Any belief system is a religion loosely defined. I'd like to know how you think rights are afforded to born persons if not by a belief system or at the very least a belief in natural rights. Either way, that doesn't address the point I had. If I can't impose my beliefs on you then who you are to impose your belief of me not hurting chemist99a?"
p5941
aS"Obviously not. If the right to life trumps all other rights, then it follows that the mother's right to life and the child's right to life cancel each other out.       Mind you, if it's her choice then the pro-life movement endorses such heroism, right?"
p5942
aS'And were THIS the 17th century, I might understand that, but this is the 21st century. We don\'t "bleed" people to make them well; we don\'t have barbers performing surgery and we usually have a trained physician in the delivery room.'
p5943
aS"It's still not right for religious people to have to never speak their beliefs. It's a form of tyranny."
p5944
aS"So, in summary, you aren't against the death penalty on principle. You just want it used judiciously? Same here. Where we'll differ is in the details of what's judiciously."
p5945
aS"You can't...only admin can...and there's no need to be sorry."
p5946
aS"Well we assume a right to your own body here. It is also important for you to justify why there should be a difference in human and person and then justify why doing so this time is different from when this was previously done in history.I guess I don't agree with the idea that you have no rights until you can prove you should have them...if this is the standard then we are all in trouble."
p5947
aS'Read to the very end of the verse. "If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her."'
p5948
aS'Bellesiles claimed his data was destroyed in a flood. Lott claimed his data was destroyed in a computer crash. Some people have been calling John Lott "the Bellesiles of the Right." Read this article "The Bellesiles of the Right? Another firearms scholar whose dog ate his data."http://slate.msn.com/id/2078084/John Lott has already admitted to inventing a fan (Mary Rosh) to praise himself. That\'s intentionally trying to deceive people. http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...&notFound=true'
p5949
aS"Every relationship does entail moral obligations in one way or another, but the argument is that there is no relationship that morally obligates one to share ones body. They are trying to generalize 'moral obligations' as if that justifies anything. There are things that cannot be morally obligated, no matter the relationship, so the argument tries to prove."
p5950
aS"And the reasons have been discussed at length and most of us agree about the mother's life being endangered or possibly in cases of rape and incest.........Where we disagree with you is unecessary abortions...such as for birth control, a headache on just and inconveniencce........You think any abortion is alright...We don't....."
p5951
aS'Should it be legalized? Only if every other country did itIs it harmful? Yes more so then moderate alcohol use and worse then smokingShould it be taxed once legalized? Yes.Should laws still apply to it, such as DUIs and the like? Yes.'
p5952
aS'Mayabe this is a miniscule amount of suffering compared to what awaits you on the flipside. Weather it be an eternity of Bliss or agony and suffering. Who really knows. Mayabe those who have this happen to them have it coming to them?'
p5953
aS'You have done a marvelous job knocking down strawmen of your own construction. Having offered a naive and superficial caricature of atheism, agnosticism, and theism, you then imagine a self-serving hierarchy that is, in a word, worthless - all in a silly effort to show yourself most humble. Ironic.'
p5954
aS"This was a comment on the physics book that has biographies of great physicists that were Bible believing christians. Right. Many believed in alchemy (they were wrong), harmful effects of night air (they were wrong), spontaneous growth of maggots from rotting meat (they were wrong), rats arising from grain (they were wrong), and the Bible (they were wrong). If it is important that Newton believed in the Bible, why isn't it as important that he believed in alchemy and did not believe in the divinity of Christ.There isn't any such thing as science from a Christian perspective. Either it is science, or it isn't.You claimed to have studied evolution. You didn't. Why would you tell us that you did?"
p5955
aS"Thank God. I too hope it doesn't keep going back and forth. While I live across the river in Parkville, Missouri, I used to live in Overland Park Kansas and went to school there. I think they are generally pretty good public schools, it's just the state school board that keeps effing everything up when they get some christonazis on board."
p5956
aS"besides pain, there is a plethora of experiences that take place in a person's mind that cannot be yet detected by science. imagination, taste, dreams, art appreciation, etc. even though these things are real, they cannot be quantitatively described in physical terms, so they cannot be treated by science"
p5957
aS"No no; again, you don't get it. He's only struggling because of people like you who deny the obvious. Rather than listen to what Majerus says about Majerus's project, you're listening to Mr. Mistaken Coyne and the author of the the Science article, which doesn't say what you think it says."
p5958
aS'Well, to say it has no mental existence doesn\'t really tell the whole story. The fetus WILL have (more than likely) full mental existence in a very short time. It seems to me that if you "view humanity with mental existance as important" you\'d also view as important that the unborn baby WILL indeed reach that point, in all likelihood. '
p5959
aS"So, because they don't interpret the bible as you do, they believe that there are no deities? That is what you said..."
p5960
aS'Again???? Gun control laws by design are meant to kept inner city citizens (i.e. black) from owning guns... Liberal terms such as "saturday night special" all have racist undertones. Also since the majority of gun violence in the US is minority on minority... Who are these laws meant to target?'
p5961
aS'It also allows SCOTUS to strike down State laws that violate constitutional rights ;)'
p5962
aS"It's truly amazing that even someone like KH can disprove evolution so quickly."
p5963
aS'If Obama had his way, standing against the government would be the most patriotic thing someone could do.'
p5964
aS"That's a bit of a sidestep. Abortion is not genocide because abortion is not destruction of a certain group of people based on race, religion, ethnicity, etc. There is no way to make a case for abortion being genocide without making capitol punishment qualify as genocide. Frankly, I think it's easier to do the latter (yet most pro-lifers are also pro-death penalty).If you want to make an argument, then make an argument. But don't call abortion genocide; that's just dumb."
p5965
aS'Really, fetal persons are born. Science has demostrated that birth really occurs into the womb, not when one leaves it.'
p5966
aS'Theropods had hollow bones like birds. It was "developed to be lighter[sic]."'
p5967
aS"Actually, it hasn't. Phylogenetic analysis has no relevance to Occam's Razor. Further, DNA for all organisms is the same until you examine specific sequences. It isn't that the DNA is different, what matters is the the sequence of the bases is different."
p5968
aS"And what is the full quote? Was it talking about, lets say for example, tutles, where over 90 percent of them die before reaching adulthood?In many species, that is true. The 'rule of thumb' is that the more individuals do not reach adulthood, the more offspring that species has."
p5969
aS'If that is a human being, then is my kidney a human being too?'
p5970
aS'So ban guns? That is like curing the headache by cutting off the head. Why not make it a crime to sell a gun privately. Perhaps make it a legal requirement to go to a licensed firearms dealer who at no charge to the parties other than the cost of the background check run the potential buyer through the database. I would certainly be willing to do this. As a responsible gun owner, I would hate to think that the firearm I was going to sell to someone might be going to a felon, or someone likely to use it to commit a crime. '
p5971
aS'Just because we interpret the available evidence differently, for you to assume from that, that we believers know nothing about the universe we inhabit is arrogance to the max.'
p5972
aS'No. I will never allow "the people of the country" to tell me what is best for my my life or my health.To quote Jane Austen in Pride and Prejudice."I am only resolved to act in that manner, which will, in my own opinion, constitute my happiness, without reference to you, or to any person so wholly unconnected with me."'
p5973
aS'we do......most fossils found are surface finds -- which means anything found on the ground probably contradicts uniformitarian principles because every fossil found laying on the ground probably -- according to ToE -- did not die at the same time. For example, many mammal bones are found on the surface -- yet so are dinosaur and other "ancient" bones from animals that supposedly lived millions of years beforehand. Of course evolutionists will come back and claim "erosion" with no evidence of such, not to mention how rock can be removed from bone after millions of years of being cemented to it.I\'ve got a 900-page book called "Hidden Archeology" (Cremo) that dives into hundreds of fossils and artifacts that are in the "wrong" strata. Your assertion is blatantly false.'
p5974
aS"I can see what you are saying. It's pretty much true...being a Jewish homosexual, I know it first hand. But just for once, couldn't they pick on somebody else?It seems almost like a bully tactic for the Christian heterosexuals who are against same sex marriages to pick on someone who doesn't have a legal leg to stand on...that's sad."
p5975
aS'Nonsense. The most widely accepted idea is that these epics were oral traditions that were finally recorded in writing, possibly by a guy named Homer. Read and read.'
p5976
aS'Nearly all the food humans eat today, even in the Western world is GM including maize, tomatoes, and soy, etc, etc. used as ingredients in products such some soymilk. Essentially everything is with the exception of "organic". However, as i noted above, I wouldn\'t make this argument because I think GM soy esecially is not very healthy for people snd GM foods tend to be more prone to bacterial infection which can make people sick. I haven\'t read from all sides, however.'
p5977
aS"I disagree. I've been in a loving, committed relationship for 25 years to the same person exclusively...how does this have a negative affect on you?"
p5978
aS'And last years stats say, 3rd July 2009   The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.'
p5979
aS'So there you have it: AMENDMENTS ARE PART OF THE CONSTITUTION.'
p5980
aS"Thanks, Clive, you're a good sport. Of course I can't agree with the idiot part. Rash, unwise, unknowledgeable, maybe, but not fools."
p5981
aS"It's a flawed step in the right direction. I support it compared to nothing. I did not support it when they were considering CUs vs. full marriage. They took the politically expedient way out.Lest you leap to any unwarranted conclusions, my main objection is the blatent inequality inhererent in CUs."
p5982
aS'The difference of 43 deaths a year is the 4th largest flucuation since 1990 - not what you call insignificant. Would this difference be made if more guns did equal more crime?'
p5983
aS'Well... someone hasn\'t been following the campaigns for the so-called "protection of marriage" amendments, federal or state.'
p5984
aS"I think you are on to something.The problem I see is that any proponent of a plan such as this will have toi take on both the health insurance lobby and the pharma lobby and their bottomless well of $$$ and propaganda.Here's hoping now that there's a new sheriff in town."
p5985
aS"Well, in the case above, it was step-by-step. First, an existing enzyme was modified to a new use, and over time, became refined to work better and better. This is the way evolution works. Nothing is de novo; it's always a modfication of something else. Second, a mutation produced a regulator that only allowed the enzyme to be produced if the substrate was available. Again, this was refined by natural selection over time. In the end, the newly-evolved system was irreducibly complex, because all three parts have to be present for the system to work. And do show us your numbers proving that such processes can't produce new information. If you don't know how, I'd be pleased to show you how a mutation changes the information in a population."
p5986
aS'So would you care if abortion were outlawed. If so, what would be bad about allowing a view that places objective value in human life to be the basis for making law?'
p5987
aS"I didn't answer or you didn't understand? Actually I did answer. The knee joint I described is from a bipedal hominid - there is no question about it. The skull, even though I gave it very ape-like features, is from a biped. There are many examples of what I described."
p5988
aS'That would be more likely than finding evidence for abiogenesis.'
p5989
aS"Oh really ? Parts of New Orleans were under water for more than 40 days before all the water receeded. Hasn't the plant life there replenished naturally in the wild ? Of course it has. The Earth is very able to repair itself in spite of modern mans sense of self importance. Here's some interesting photographic evidence of it. www.pbase.com/andrys/noah"
p5990
aS"Or that they tend to be better prepared, or even less willing to accept help from others or get breakdown cover. That's the trouble with these kind of stats, the interpretations are pretty open to debate."
p5991
aS"I didn't vote for a republican or a democrat in 2008 and in 2010 it doesn't matter because my rep is not challenged."
p5992
aS'So do I, but my reasoning is highly speculative, even by my own standards.'
p5993
aS'Because the men who wrote it mixed their mythology in with their heros. The first 11 chapters of Genesis are obviously mythology. And if what you say is true, then I guess that means that the Illiad is historical. Why would Homer be right about some lives and events, but wrong about others? And of course, there are other parts of the Bible that are pure fiction - Jonah and Job for example.'
p5994
aS'the fetus would be a real person...and it seems like....in order to make the iraq war/abortion connection....you would have to support the war!'
p5995
aS"Well if they're automatic weapons then they're obviously importing them illegally from outside the country and violating federal regulations. You've got even bigger problems than you think."
p5996
aS'Well this is what i am saying. The probability of a and b in one organism i very low. And the probability of A and B in many generations is lower than just A. This is what Behe deals with in his book. One reason evolution of primates interest me more than bacteria is the the number of organisms and generations is much much lower, and the changes involved must be pretty big. It involves Real evolution as opposed to stuff like antibiotic resistance or sicke cell haemoglobin that i see more as a reversable adaption, not a developement to a permanently better/more complex state.   IMO there should be possible to make some sort of calculation regarding the probability of RM being cause of the changes.'
p5997
aS"Actually, Mega didn't make any claims. He just reposted an editorial."
p5998
aS'Really? Do all your views depend on somebody else changing them for you?'
p5999
aS'I think our culture is going to play a big role in this as well. I think that is where the majority of this problem lies.'
p6000
aS"But your new language would be meaningless. The definition of a circle or a square does not vary from language to language. Mathematical definitions are not matters of opinion but quite precise descriptions so that all mathematicians will understand what is meant when the term is used. The words may change but the meaning doesn't. Math is not opinion. It is not my opinion that a triangle has three angles. That is a matter of definition.Apparently Habbit doesn't understand that substituting the words of another language does not change the concept. That sort of argument is basically ignorant XXXX."
p6001
aS"Well, I've personally measured the gravitational pull of a ball of lead about 5cm in diameter. Are you suggesting that angels push the planets around? That was the leading theory before Newton."
p6002
aS"That's why the Second Amendment protects the private ownership of arms like the .50 BMG and other such powerful weapons."
p6003
aS"This is not my problem. As I explained above, I just have to show inconsistency in order to reject the validity of all the claims in the Bible as being undeniable truth. And with the Bible, that's damn easy to do."
p6004
aS'Well said.   With this religion, the gap is very wide between the "average guy" and "authority", because their clergy is more involved in politics than the clergy of Christianity, or the Creator himself. It fits with more Democrats being evolutionists, and more Democrats favoring bigger domestic government.'
p6005
aS'I would suggest you look at the faero island mouse then. That is a new species, and it is not man doing it, but rather nature itself.'
p6006
aS"Ah, you've engaged in the grammarian nitpick function of debate. Sad, but predictable.       Obviously, I was discussing the entire article, which is making that argument. It is generally bad form to quote an entire post when it reaches such length."
p6007
aS"Guess what, I'm pro-life as well, that is why I'm also pro-choice."
p6008
aS'Hope you have fun carrying your pistol through the post office lobby!'
p6009
aS'Ok...many many people have been killed in Africa because of the policies of the countries in the EU, South America, Asia, and so on....this hypocrisy annoys me.'
p6010
aS'Because it shows that Ockham was arguing against what Hi_Its_Me says the Razor is.'
p6011
aS"**   This is the best response you've got!?! What a loser!!"
p6012
aS'ICBM, but I believe the termites make up the largest land-based biomass on earth.'
p6013
aS"So now Wiesmann's barrier is the most important thing to the ToE? Somehow I doubt that biologists agree, but obviously creationists have more authority on the topic of evolution..."
p6014
aS'They were both created on the sixth day according to Genesis 1.'
p6015
aS'Doctors ARE schooled in nutrition, however inadequately, this doesn\'t mean they\'re going to recommend crackpot "raw food" dietary schemes to prevent destructive "lamarckian evolution" on the basis of a single flawed experiment on cats.'
p6016
aS'Your right, this is not complete free will. But as I mentioned before, if you give yourself free will, then you are saying God has no control over you or your actions -- and therefore he is not God anymore.'
p6017
aS'I will agree science has disproven the literal reading of a number of different scriptures, such as the literal reading of Genesis (which was never meant to be literal to begin with, but that is a different matter).It also might explain why spiritiual beliefs exist for people.However, when it comes to this vaguly defined entity that alledgely created the universe, science has nothing to say about the existance of this alledged supernatural being.'
p6018
aS'Last time I checked, it was a debate about religion and evolution co-existing. Not a debate about Creationism vs. "science" and "reality".'
p6019
aS"Yes the facts speak for themselves, they just don't sing the song you think they do. No biologist will find any need at all to wave any hands in this instance, for as you say the facts DO speak for themselves."
p6020
aS'Like most things theists that statement is based on ignorance.'
p6021
aS'I think we should not spend inordinate amount of resources on trying to determine who is homeless and if it his own fault. Anyway, whose business is it where someone lives?'
p6022
aS"What possible concern is any of that to you?    Some actually search for knowledge through debate. This is a debate forum if you recall. Don't play if you're not so inclined but to post warnings not to fall in this trap, c'mon."
p6023
aS"Yes I know, a lot of people have done a lot of work to try to refute Behe's work. From your link;"
p6024
aS'Now you\'re being ridiculous. The big bang is not the evolution of the universe. The words "evolution of the universe" do not necessarily entail the big bang. For example, brane theory offers an alternative theory to explain the evolution of the universe.But claiming that the "evolution of the universe" is part of the theory of evolution is somewhat like claiming that because Kate Hudson has achieved stardom, she is producing vast amounts of energy through hydrogen fusion. Why is it that creationists believe that every word has only a single meaning?By the way, I have always heard the creationist invention "GTE" referred to as the General Theory of Evolution - you know, as if there is some relation to the general theory of relativity.'
p6025
aS"Well i know it wouldn't be sensible for anyone to call my child an it that is just disrespectfull to both your partener and child."
p6026
aS"Because I don't feel like copying and pasting articles into a forum when they can be easily accessed online. But for a quick summary: The CCR-5 gene mutation is present in about 15% of caucasians, with 1% having the homogeneous version. These 1% are completely immune. The heterogeneous people possess some immunity."
p6027
aS'Being refuted by organized groups with an agenda they support does not make Supwersports ideas wrong. You call it garbage. I AM interested in what Supersport thinks about how his ideas will get wider respect and how he thinks this will change our society.I think this is an important question, because otherwise posting here seems like a kind of mutual masterbation trading facts and arguments that have no effect.Until I hear from SS, I give him the benefit of the doubt.'
p6028
aS'For once I agree with you. Your wrong on your thoughts and views with evolution but your right in saying that abortion is wrong.'
p6029
aS"But isn't that the problem? This creationist decided that science should be limited to his religion. He's afraid of flying."
p6030
aS"It's all in how you word the questions.You worded the questions with an obvious bias, they did not come across as an honest attempt to learn, but rather as a challenge.Word them properly, and I guarantee you that the people here will be most helpful.WaxyP.S. Your username has a large affect on how you are initially perceived."
p6031
aS'I am so sorry to hear about what has happened to you. I hope you get away from this terrible man and surround yourself with people who love you.I must ask, though, why are you a Christian? You completely disagree with typical Christian sentiments on abortion, you feel none of the purported guilt the religious movement implies is inevitable, you feel like you did the right thing, so why would you continue to profess to belong to this religion if you disagree with one of the major issues of the day?'
p6032
aS'Yes California is following European socialism. Just like socialist Europe, they are going broke. Socialism depends on large income taxes to fund social programs. Try the same taxes here in the USA and people will get thier guns and shoot all the politicians trying to tax them. Remember this country was born over a fight over taxes.'
p6033
aS'The article is saying that it was genetic changes. Changes in genes encoding certain transcription factors is what caused changes in the expression of other genes.'
p6034
aS'so if cells are controlled by their genes (and the environment), what would you predict would happen to the cell if its genes were removed?'
p6035
aS'I think that the bad guys will be happy if any gun control law goes into effect, because then there will be less chance of the victum having a weapon for their defense, and the crime rate will rise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'
p6036
aS'Well, first, those were Hebrews, not Christians. Secondly, the scripture doesn\'t say they raped them, it says "keep them for yourselves." That could mean rape, however, I\'m pretty sure that was not Moses\'s intention. Also, the Hebrews considered it impure to lie with non-Hebrew women or men, so if there was any sexual immorality going on it was very small. However, that DOESN\'T mean it was justified or right.'
p6037
aS'Demographics plays a role, but it does not explain away the whole shift in the numbers.'
p6038
aS"While the current cannon was 'accepted' by the late second century, there were numerous other 'gospels' that existed by then, and were eliminated at the 4th century time frame. Most of those copies were destroyed, but some have been unearthed."
p6039
aS'Gary Ridgway, the serial murderer of some 60 or more women, possibly more.'
p6040
aS'So why are you here? Do you have anything to offer of any substance?'
p6041
aS"Actually, Galileo wasn't killed. He was sentenced to house arrest. And his sin was in declaring that the earth moved since the Bible states that the earth doesn't move."
p6042
aS"That's is ridiculously poor logic. Simply becuase the church makes mistakes doesn't mean it's incorrect in all other charges. The US government is WAY more corrupt than the Catholic Church, and yet we obey every god-damned thing big brother makes us do."
p6043
aS'"Supposedly"? You ran from those threads. You are the one making assertions that you don\'t back up. You are the one unwilling (i.e. unable) to show that Arctic foxes can adapt to a Phoenix summer. You are the one who keeps ignoring (what I will henceforth refer to as) The Chihuahua Challenge. For somebody claiming to be so clearly right and so obviously vindicated by the evidence, you\'ve done nothing to show it, and you\'ve done everything to run from it.'
p6044
aS'Because, when each is in its natural habitat, they are reproductively isolated.'
p6045
aS'Oh, really? Does that mean that pesticides will be OK on marijuana plants? NO.'
p6046
aS'George Tiller shot to death at Wichita church | News Updates | Wichita Eagle'
p6047
aS'So you are saying that the democrats have no choice but to inaugarate Brown and let him stop the bill? You suggest that whatever option they pick will be political suicide.'
p6048
aS'Regardless of the name change, the calendars are still keyed on the birth and death of Christ...and that will be so at least until the atheists are able to come up with another numbering system and force it on everyone else just to pacify their own baby mentalities.'
p6049
aS"Actually, I snipped your remarks because 1) you twisted what I said and 2) I'm already spending too much time arguing with random complainers and I was in a hurry to do something more important at the time."
p6050
aS'Only approximate and really depends upon what day you start counting, before or after menses.'
p6051
aS"oh, now we're getting somewhere. Explain more, please. Oh, and some evidence of incremental modifications would be nice too."
p6052
aS"Why do people on the pro-gun side continuously try to oversimplify the issue? No one is really arguing that there would be zero murder without guns. The question is would there be less murders without guns. In developed nations with stricter gun laws there are less murders. At any rate, I don't think you can draw such conclusions based on one incident."
p6053
aS"well heck, if lifeforms cannot realistically be strung together by small, gradual, materialist increments (which they can't and there is no evidence for) then the only alternative is special creation."
p6054
aS'I wish you guys would quit trying to "muddy the waters" by introducing facts that contradict my claims, innuendo, cliches and WAG. - signed X gazer'
p6055
aS"You mean to tell me it's a falsehood??   I don't believe it."
p6056
aS'It is pretty bizzare. There are plenty of groups out there that will reach whatever "conclusion" you pay them to reach. Why he didn\'t cite one of them instead of an easily checkable source that says the opposite of what he says they do is beyond me.'
p6057
aS'Because Humphreys went out looking? How many should we allegedly find?'
p6058
aS'I\'ll address the later question. They may not "need" teeth that big, I couldn\'t say. Just because a creature has a feature doesn\'t mean its necessary or useful. While evolution does select for useful traits and against harmful traits, that doesn\'t mean that a trait won\'t develop that is simply odd. As long as it isn\'t particularly negative there\'s no reason to assume it will go away, and so sometimes you get traits that aren\'t "useful", they\'re simply not harmful. Those teeth could be such a case.'
p6059
aS"I have posted responses to Demon38's earlier post. I have offered DNA findings as evidence to begin with. It is not my evidence, but scientific evidence. That is the only evidence that I will provide in this discussion. I think there is ample evidence to cause scientists to rethink their theories, evidence that they do not want to accept because it puts certain hypothesis they have advanced in a poor light."
p6060
aS'And the comments section is usually where the real comedy lies.'
p6061
aS"But wouldn't it make it more likely that a gun dealer that was involved in gun trafficking would be audited and caught by the ATF? If there are less FFLs then the ATF has more time to monitor and inspect each gun dealer."
p6062
aS'I think an open mind is the best thing to have when it comes to theories. I think there is some truth in everything.'
p6063
aS"Again, it's not the point. There are many who don't deny evolution, they believe it was guided. Showing examples of guidence - through artificial selection supports this theory"
p6064
aS'and my wife is also a lot more likely to be overpowered if she has to close to with in a couple of feet of an invader, than if she can stay 15 or 20 feet back.'
p6065
aS"There's nothing to help, because what you said has no resemblance to reality.If someone is a junkie, they might also smoke pot, or if someone is a crackhead, they might also smoke pot, but the large majority of pot smokers DO NOT do heroin or smoke crack."
p6066
aS"So 5,000 to 10,000 women dying from illegal abortions isn't high? Dude, that is nearly five times the number of women who were dying from abortions in the 1940s! That is VERY high!"
p6067
aS'not according the SCJ of Mass. This was part of the grounds of their ruling FOR marriage in Mass.'
p6068
aS"And that is meaningless babble. Evolution is a process that has been observed whether you like it or not. It is not a moral statement nor is it a statement of faith. It does not deal with government, laws or culture. Whining about it won't change it."
p6069
aS'No, the question is why you let violent individuals remain free in public.'
p6070
aS"So what if the author isn't arguing against gun control? At last, there is indication that England has taken a step in the right direction and realized that taking all guns away from everybody isn't the answer to crime."
p6071
aS'Because the location of the tracks used to be a tidal plane. In other words, it used to be at the edge of the ocean. Around that time the sea coast advanced and receded several times. The tracks were buried. The tracks actually had to be uncovered. The tracks were originally discovered immdiately after an unusually severe storm in the area in which an unusual amount of water came down the Paluxy. That unusual flow of water washed away the soil that covered some of the tracks. Other tracks have been intentionally uncovered. For example, in one case, where a trackway went under a bank, several feet of the bank was removed to expose more tracks.'
p6072
aS'Because it will encourage teens to engage in riskier behavior. Abstinence until marriage is still the best way.'
p6073
aS'again, please explain what possible benefits you forsee with teaching intelligent design. Please show me where it is anything than a belief. Evolution was always considered science. It used the scientific method, and offered evidence for everyone to see and peer review. Until the "theory" of intelligent design does that, I will always be forced to put quotes around the word theory, because it will simply be a religious belief.'
p6074
aS'"A story in some early editions of yesterday\'s Daily News incorrectly reported that gun-control advocate Sarah Brady may have skirted Delaware\'s gun laws when she bought a rifle for her adult son but did not declare who was going to own the weapon."The Delaware Department of Justice initially insisted to The News that gun purchasers must declare who the weapon was intended for so that person\'s background could be checked. Yesterday, a spokeswoman for the Delaware Department of Justice said it misinterpreted the law and that Brady was not obligated to state that the gun was for her son as long as he was legally qualified to own a firearm."In addition, a spokesman for Brady said, \'Sarah Brady told the gun store that the gun was for her son and filled out the forms that they asked her to fill out.\'"The News regrets the error."CORRECTION'
p6075
aS'It is in the first place unclear to whom the "further harm" is done. But even granting that the fetus dies, it is not clear how the situation is analogous to abortion, because the intentions of not only the man but even more importantly of the pregnant woman are completely different.'
p6076
aS'In 2000, the U.S. recorded close to 11,000 firearm homicides and more than 16,000 firearm suicides. The European Union -- an area with a population approximately 25% higher than that of the U.S. -- reported fewer than 1,300 firearm homicides for the same year. In Japan, the number was 22.sinjin - The US firearm homicide rate is more than 180x that of Japan.'
p6077
aS"Again, true. But that doesn't take into account that there are two populations under consideration."
p6078
aS'The purpose of the Bill of Rights.  Preamble to the Bill of Rights'
p6079
aS'Actually, you have slipped into talking Bible here and seem to be refering to the miracle of Lazarus.'
p6080
aS'Oh, probably about as many as there are killed by bayonet lugs, pistol grips, heat shields, detachable magazines, and folding stocks.'
p6081
aS"So the stats come from John Lott.... Wasn't he the one who got caught making up statistics and impersonated a woman for three years to support the pro-gun cause? http://articles.latimes.com/2006/may...on/oe-wiener31http://whoismaryrosh.com/....a bizarre individual who I don't think can be trusted."
p6082
aS'you know why? because God touches our hearts like nothing you have ever felt before. it is amazing'
p6083
aS"Actually, the majority of my first post in this thread came from Robert H. Churchill's article who is an advocate of the individual rights interpretation."
p6084
aS'If information came into being by chance, how can we know that anything is true? How do you know what is false and what is "true"? If we are just products of chance, your brain is also a product of chance. Therefore, the thought patters that determine your logic are also products of chance. If your logic is the result of chance processes, you can\'t even be sure it evolved properly. You can\'t even be sure you can reason properly (using your definition) because you can\'t trust your own logic.As for the second part, no, you\'ve got it backward, rational belief is based on faith in a rational creator. References:* The Creationist Basis for Modern Science.* The Lie: Evolution ~ Ken Ham.* Evolution: Fact or Fiction? ~ John Blanchard.'
p6085
aS'The difference, Eddie is simply this. If the Constitution needs to be changed, the founders instigated a means to do so. Said means is doubly hard as to make sure what is done, has been given much thought and study. The plan afoot today by the Gun Grabbers is to incrementally usurp the rights of free men, until, the fait accompli has been established. If the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, or any of the other rights guaranteed by the Constitution are to be abridged, they must ne done so by legal means, i.e. constitutional amendment.'
p6086
aS"ToE is a mechanistic theory -- it says life is like a machine. Machines aren't intelligent, they just do what they're made/programmed to do. Darwinists say lifeforms do what they do because of the way their particular genes program them. This is basic stuff.....yet you come along and say this isn't so. So which is it? Is life intelligent or not? If it is intelligent, what is illogical about believing life was designed intelligently by an intelligent designer? The intelligence had to come from somewhere. Where did the information in the DNA code come from?"
p6087
aS"Not if they give him the death penalty, then it's apeals till your ears bleed."
p6088
aS'Not quite. To be more correct regarding government and guns, the right to own weapons is for the right to revolt and revolt with violence.Our political philosophy is very clear on this:"that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it" - Declearation of IndependaceYou have the right to try and revolt with violence. You don\'t have the right to win a revolt.'
p6089
aS"But we weren't discussing either monkies or hell. One can only wonder at your thought processes that makes such irrelevant and disconnected thoughts pop up."
p6090
aS'Actually, 2 viruses and a bacteria have been constructed by building the genome from nucleic acids.'
p6091
aS"If that's true, then Freedom of Speech is doomed. Harassment is subjective. Now I can claim that a book I don't like is harassing me, and it will be banned."
p6092
aS"I'm still confused by this comment. Did you actually mean that? If you did, that is not Pro-choice but Pro-abortion. Women did not have a choice in whether their pregnancies were terminated or not which, having it, is the definition of the PC point of view. So no, they were NOT Pro-choice."
p6093
aS'The memo is real, nobody has ever been able to disprove it. Handgun Control Inc. (the people who later became the Brady Campaign) have claimed that the memo is a hoax and that what was released has never been their official position. However them simply stating this, is no different than Obama making a statement on national news, and then several months later saying "I never said that" and trying to reverse his position.Until it can be proven beyond doubt as being untrue and simple propaganda, the memo is real and explains in detail exactly what the gun control groups are after.'
p6094
aS'Not all evolution takes place over billions of years. There has been speciation that we have actually seen occuring within a few years at a time. "bacteria, birds etcs."Natural selection occures frequently. You can "observe" evolution through the fossile record, DNA, morphology etcs.Evolution has made predictions, these predictions have come true, ergo, it\'s good.'
p6095
aS"Yep. But our ancestors lived in an area of abundant fruit, and we got all we needed from our diets, so it was no big thing when the gene broke. A few non-primate organisms also have it broken, but it's broken in a different way.Barbarian observes:It's remarkable then, how much progress we've made. You may or may not approve of the theory, but it works very well at learning more about biology."
p6096
aS"Then for you, you made the right decision at the time. I'd personally have been leary of not getting to work or go to school easily from the doctors statements, especially in regards to keeping the child."
p6097
aS' I know a bit about this myself.  However the difference is that I was allowed to carry a gun under the reasonable man statute. An Armed person truly cannot be bullied! The old saying is. God created man and Samuel Colt made them equal! Old, disabled, female and all, are on an equal footing with these vicious predators!'
p6098
aS'You have any examples of that? Shooting people for throwing rocks and eggs at houses that is.'
p6099
aS'What we have here is simply a perspective problem, which is the problem with most debates. I see the Bible as sound, and every "error" in the Bible I have researched (I have admittedly not researched them all) have been refuted.'
p6100
aS"I think they have more of a chance becasue, while many manage to delude themselves into believing that an unborn child is not a baby, it would be much more difficult to convince yourself that a crying baby isn't a baby. Even in the animal kingdom (which we are all part of) you see some animals hesitate to kill the young of their own species. Evne coyotes will not generally kill a pup (I have even seen a pack of coyoptes pass a domestic pup without killing it, though they could have. I am told this is because of the stubby nose, which shows the coyotes that it is, indeed, a puppy, even though it looks unfamiliar to them)."
p6101
aS"Actually, no. If it had not been for the gay couples and the organizations who helped them fight for equality it wouldn't be an issue now, but it would still be an issue."
p6102
aS'So God gets to do these terrible things, but He gets a free pass because He\'s God?Kinda funny what happens when you show Archie that the Bible doesn\'t even support his beliefs, isn\'t it guys?I still like the fact that the Bible says not to count children under one month of age as persons, yet here Archie expects us to count a zygote as "a human life."'
p6103
aS'Well, thank you for this thread Santafeur. I must say though that I peruse various threads just to read stuff. The C vs. E topic does not strike a nerve with me. In fact, I also wonder what it is about the human mind that makes people so desperate to want to know how we came about. What difference does it make? We are here now. Could we possibly just accept that we got here somehow, and just move on?'
p6104
aS'This statement is wrong. People from hundreds of years before Jesus was born prophesied that a baby would be born, in Bethlehem, of a virgin. There were over 50 more prophesies that were made about his life, and the sacrafice he made to pay for the sins of man, and the bigest one of all...He completely fufilled scripture when he rose from the dead. These men were inspired by Jesus, God, how can you argue that he is not the christ? The odds of one man filling all the prophesies is impossible. And these scriptures have been unchanged for the past 2000-2500 approx years! Thats proof for me that Jesus existed and that he is God. PM me if you like.'
p6105
aS"(My evidence does not require this quote, it's for comparison only)The theory of evolution is based on evidence, the existence of god, is not..Reason cannot be applied to it. Furthermore, since evolution relies on reason, faith cannot be applied to it. To attempt to label science as a faith is a contradiction. I know it irks you that your faith cannot be proven, but that's the definition of faith!! It wouldn't be faith without it. As Montalban says in a contradiction of motives: His particular faith does not rest on the foundations of [reason]. Why then look for support from reason?"
p6106
aS'From your own link it is very clear the NRA DID NOT say that or publish that. Your clearly very wrong.'
p6107
aS'And I would agree with you as long as all marriages for all couples were called civil unions and there is no two tiered system.'
p6108
aS'And for good reason. Electrical engineers in general have a pretty poor track record when discussing issues that have nothing to do with... electrical engineering. Examples: Walter ReMine, Fred Williams, etc.'
p6109
aS'You still haven\'t learned what Google is have you Yankee Fan?HowStuffWorks "Artificial Life"Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years - Science - redOrbitAnd relying entirely on insults is not a good way of gaining credibility. It didn\'t work on Livewire, it won\'t work here. '
p6110
aS"It would be 'an' analogy, but like the language analogy, it has its limitations.It is interesting to note that creationist computer software developers/programmers cannot seem to agree on the implications of 'mutations' when using such analogies - one such person, C.K. Lester, declared that computer programs can accumulate up to 30% 'random change', just like DNA (hypothetically) can, therefore, the computer analogy is a good one. But programmer R. David Pogge declares that even a single altered bit in a line of computer code a million bits in length would destroy it."
p6111
aS"Because the Iliad and Odyssey do not claim to be divine does not mean they should be placed under a different threshold as the Bible. Otherwise, it's special pleading on your part, and thus logically fallacious. This is one of many inconsistencies between skeptics in regards to the scrutiny of the Bible. They are unwilling to put the standards they have on the Bible against other books similar in age. If they did, there would not be a single book left standing."
p6112
aS'Not the way I see it from my experiences. I let the readers decide on their own. '
p6113
aS'No one said he invented guns!A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent\'s position.[1] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by substituting a superficially similar proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.[1][2]'
p6114
aS"Actually, it's not conjecture. The genetic makeup of the several subspecies of arctic foxes bear it out. The dominant allele is rare because it is less adaptive. The dominant allele is most likely ancestral. But even foxes below the Arctic circle show differences in their fur between summer and winter. So yes, foxes that were able to change color in the north had a differential reproductive advantage over those who couldn't."
p6115
aS'Schumer is a bonafide idiot, as are many in the Senate. He failingly tried to draw Alito into exposing how he would rule on abortion if presented a case. Alito is far too intelligent to be logically trapped by a buffoon such as Shumer.It is also plain to see he interrupts when he supposes the response will indeed make sense against his flailings.'
p6116
aS'And as their populations grew over thousands of years, civilizations seperate out and independent nations form, laws are set up, and some prosper while others wallow in poverty, how long do you think it will take until people begin to kill each other on your peaceful planets? Nice dream, but real life does not work like that.'
p6117
aS"Hey, as Collin said, P.Z. registered, and got it. I would say that booting him out is the height of hypocrisy. It confirms to be that it is based on a lie, and the producer knows it. The movie was making a claim that the 'opposition' was silencing I.D., and the presentation of alternate ideas. Yet, what do they do? They kicked someone out they INTERVIEWED for the movie (based on false pretenses to be sure, but they did pay him for appearing in the movie).That sounds that THEY are the ones trying to suppress opposing ideas, not science. Yes, they had the legal right. But, boy did it put egg on their face, considering everything. It shows them to be hypocrites and liars."
p6118
aS'Straw man. I am not attacking the achievements of science. I am attacking the notion that you have that scientists are exempt from the catalogue of influences that affect everyone else; with only the slightest admission of a tiny possibility of cultural influence - which was quickly dismissed anyway with the false analogy of comparing evolution to aeronautical engineering.'
p6119
aS"If you paid attention the BATFE said so.       Yes but some people don't want to close the borders. They prefer no border controls."
p6120
aS"But it really does deal with thinking. It can invite a more wide open scientific investigation of ecological and developmental patterns. It's not politically afraid to pursue facts about newly discovered complexities of life which pose problems for those trying to make a case for happenstance origins. It invites thought, not suppression, of irreducible complexity, another problem for happenstance origins. "
p6121
aS"That's because these questions were never, ever, EVER raised in the original Parker case. None of the six DC people who took the city to court possessed a felony record, they didn't bring up anything other than the fact that DC made it impossible for them to legally buy and own a handgun. That's all the court addressed. If they addressed anything else in the Heller case it would've been judicial activism, legislating from the bench."
p6122
aS"I don't agree with this debate. If preventing the Devil from interfering on earth should not be prevented by God then why is it that God did prevent the Devil from interfering in heaven after he was defeated? They are both essentially taking the Devil away from an area where he could potentially harm those that are good. God seemingly saw fit for one to occur but not the other. Why would that be?"
p6123
aS'This is why arguments like "well, our population is out of control" never convince ANY Pro-Life advocate that abortion is okay. I think it is amusing when pro-choice people use such arguments... Pro-Lifers have a priority list, and Life makes it to the top. For Pro-Lifers, it\'s a little like saying "Well, Big Macs taste good, so you should never, ever eat filet mignon since burgers taste good!" I mean, sure, burgers taste good, but filet mignon is so much better.'
p6124
aS"But the military is pretty much all a volunteer thing. It's not a hiring process--employer/employee thing. That arrangement lends itself more to the soldier not volunteering for service in the first place."
p6125
aS"Absolutely true!I discovered that with my fluoride research...For whatever reason, most people take another's word for what the truth actually is instead of searching for it themselves.If the lie is an easier pill to swallow than the truth pill, they'll take the lie. emoticonXFrazzled"
p6126
aS'And how does this compare to your ideas on artificial selection?'
p6127
aS'Sounds like the Brady Law has stopped a lot of criminals from obtaining handguns.'
p6128
aS"Finally someone answered the question. Thanks. I thought it might be the government.Does your government attempt to do this?What do you think about other democratic nations that have citizens that are less armed? Do you think that they're in danger - or is it only the American government that's out to do this?"
p6129
aS'Incorrect- I think Olsen is very specific in citing those he feels have overstepped the mark in this instance. He is not ruling out the possibility of a link at all- he (rightly IMO) is targeting certain workers and publications.'
p6130
aS'As was pointed out in some of your own quotations, survival is not an \'end\' of natural selection. Natural selection is the differential reproductive success of organisms with more favorable suites of characteristics. It is a statistical tendency. Individual organisms may work to survive, but they also work to reproduce. That\'s as close as it gets to "purpose." And as you know, Darwin\'s favored term was natural selection. He never used the phrase "survival of the fittest" without also making a reference to natural selection. The opposite is not the case. Since Darwin\'s time "survival of the fittest" has been rejected by evolutionary biologists because it is such a poor representation of the extent of the theory.'
p6131
aS"Actually, it's true. One Darwin's basic ideas upon which he based the theory of natural selection."
p6132
aS"You weren't referring to your home in your little story of helplessness."
p6133
aS"No, there really aren't. As for Robertson, why do you think I said he was right (as in global warming is happening and we are largely responsible) by sheer luck?"
p6134
aS"your probably referring to the mexican basin crater. mass extinction doesn't prove evolution. the flood as described in the Bible is an example of mass extinction. besides, in order for the asteroid theory to work, the asteroid would have to create an almost global tidal wave that would effectively kill the animals by drowning. also similiar to the effects of the flood."
p6135
aS"Well, I personally agree that I 'spanked' marc9000 (http://www.4forums.com/political/showthread.php?t=6348). But we'll have to leave it to the judges to make the formal decision."
p6136
aS'The anti-abortionists claim a load of **** on many issues. I don\'t listen to them. To put the "life" of an unfertilized egg above that of a person is grotesquely sick IMO. I support any such stem cell research wholeheartedly.'
p6137
aS"You forgot to fully quote John 8:18. here is the rest: and the Father that sent Me beareth witness of Me. He isn't bearing witness to Himself here. Two witnesses are, one of which is Himself, which is why He said in John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. John 5:30-32 is saying this exact same thing. "
p6138
aS"Well said. Most Americans favor more gun control, but unfortunately this majority of Americans tends not to vote based on the issue of gun control while a very vocal minority composed of gun activists definitely does vote based on the issue. This is something politicians have realized since 1994 so they have been more hesitant to support gun control. There probably will be more gun control supporters in office in the coming years but I'm not sure how much this will change things."
p6139
aS"It's not about how she treated cops. It's about how cops treated her as an American citizen with rights."
p6140
aS"What does being a priest have to do with anything? It wouldn't matter if he were a Satan worshipper."
p6141
aS"I'm not claiming any omnipotent deciever. I'm not sure where you derive 'probability' from, or how you can have any degree of certainty over your past experiences or those of other consciousnesses.And in any case, saying 'it hasn't happened yet' is hardly logical proof."
p6142
aS"Forgive me if this seems picky, but I just want to try and fully understand this argument. I should say that I don't necessarily agree with it, and would like to respond as to why. I just want to give a proper representation of your argument so that I can make a sound response.As such, you can no more force her, against her will, to provide bodily resources to an embryo or fetus, than you can yourself be forced to give of your bodily resources against your will.... Where does this right originate from, i.e., is it from the US Constitution via the 14th amendment etc?"
p6143
aS'So a theory was revised... does that mean that it was wrong afterwards?'
p6144
aS"He didn't! I hope you reported that to the admin"
p6145
aS"Don't expect your misrepresentations of the findings of those studies to sink in. I'm not that easily fooled."
p6146
aS"Form 4473, question 11a reads as follows:11.a. Are you the actual buyer of the firearm(s) listed on this form? Warning: You are no the actual buyer if you are acquiring the firearm(s) on behalf of another person. If you are not the actual buyer, the dealer cannot transfer the firearm(s) to you.Sarah Brady lied on the background check form, she bought the gun on behalf of her son and supplied it to him, thus ensuring that he wouldn't have to worry about the NICS check red flagging him. By gun control standards she's guilty of a straw purchase and should've been sentenced to ten years without parole in a federal prison."
p6147
aS'But the point is why are there relatively few creationists. The reason is that the creationist position cannot be defended in open debate. That is why creationist boards censor opposing views. On boards where creationists are not protected there are few.'
p6148
aS"So it's the blog's fault that Miller sided with the creationists. Right-o, marc. (I suspect you haven't even read the blog entry in question; I'd be surprised if you've read more than a paragraph of PZ's blog.. ever.)"
p6149
aS"That's fair enough, but I just think it's important to at least acknowledge and realize that the unborn baby does have worth and importance, and not just a piece of tissue as it's so often callously viewed."
p6150
aS"And if they are governed and regulated people can be victimized by the system. In fact, the regulation might be the very thing victimizing people. Again, it isn't the system but the people who are in society that make a morality."
p6151
aS"Now, now ZSU, we learned from comrade star gazer that GW created the Continental Army. I am sure these gentlemen have some equally illogical and inaccurate 'facts' to scatter around the barnyard emoticonXHoho"
p6152
aS'you should be allowed to buy as many as you want to'
p6153
aS'Well, yes. Eleven years is quite swift, but it actually supports the theory of evolution through natural selection. The estimates of the speed of evolution that you seem to be depending on were done by George Gaylord Simpson way back in the 1940s or 1950s. Since then, we have observed fruit flies, as well as other specimens, to evolve quite rapidly, showing significant evolution in only a decade or so. More recently, however, scientists have been able to observe evolution in natural settings and have found that it can sometimes be quite rapid when environmental change is rapid. Besides the studies that Reznick did on guppies, there are also the studies of the Galapagos finches by the grants, and studies of anole lizards in the Bahamas. These are observable phenotypical changes, not speciation events.'
p6154
aS"No, I mean evolution, in which statistically random variation is but one factor. It's a terrible mistake to equate evolution with pure chance."
p6155
aS'So they had guns that could shoot down planes even before they had planes?   Their primitive muskets were that powerful? I am not that easy to fool!'
p6156
aS'You did when you talked about someone loving objects, or a mokey, etc.'
p6157
aS'A lot of work has been done on that topic. I would recommend reading Debating Design from Darwin to DNA It is a monster of a book, but it is definitely worth the read.'
p6158
aS'Yes I do understand this. But you must admit that the instantaneous formation of a living organism, even an extremely primitive one, complete with the complexity of the DNA code as a result of random encounters of atoms and molecules is a little too much to buy. There is evidence right there for creationism. Only intelligence could have formed such an elaborate complex system for the structure of life and its propagation. '
p6159
aS'So any long publication must be due to a panic attack? It takes a few minutes to read those posts, but it takes an hour and a half to watch Expelled; does that mean that IDers are having the mother of all panic attacks?Your logic can\'t even be described as "tortured," marc, because it\'s completely nonexistent.'
p6160
aS"That's right. It merely has the capacity to make errors which sometimes slightly improves function in a particular environment. And those tend to accumulate over time."
p6161
aS"Exactly. If you are a child rapist and someone pops you in the head than you should go to jail for murder. Sorry, two wrongs don't make a right."
p6162
aS'So what\'s the deal when GWB "gives" $3,000 but the insurance premiums cost $6,000, the family can\'t make up the difference and the $3,000 goes unspent. All we\'ve accomplished is to transfer $ out of the U.S. Treasury. You think it\'s a good idea to just give money away and not get anything for it? You\'re thinking of the Clinton years when there was a surplus.'
p6163
aS'Might be something to be said for that. Are there any studies that show possible causes of suicide?'
p6164
aS"Not at all. The issue is receiving the marriage benefits. If gays were given all of the benefits of marriage for just living together, we wouldn't have a fight at all as you would have gotten what you want. It isn't the marriage that is important to you but the benefits. And the debate in Italy of singles who live together seeking marriage benefits also is a good example of the can of worms that will be opened if society concedes to the gay crusaders the undue rights they are demanding.Why is it absolutely impossible for you to reply to an issue without first redefining it to fit your warped World view? Have you no objectivity within you at all?"
p6165
aS'Umm...thats the point of saying God of the Gaps - when science fills in the gaps then there is less for your God to do.'
p6166
aS"Because natural selection works on a cost/benefit basis. For bats and whales and cave-dwelling birds echolocation confers huge advantage, allowing them to exploit niches closed to competing species. For ground- or tree-dwelling terrestrial animals, it would be of marginal or zero benefit, given the 'noise' in their immediate surroundings."
p6167
aS"this is totally false. the laws of logic being absolute does nothing to support a case for god. in fact, everything the bible tells us about god's nature indicates that god is illogical, unpredictable, unreliable and irreplicable. this is totally the opposite of logic"
p6168
aS'But does anyone actually need a marriage to do this? No.   Are there any laws stating one must be married before giving birth? No.'
p6169
aS"Not realy they are still being manufactured for civilian use and are legal in most states even in states where machine guns are not allowed. You would be actualy supprised at how available they are. You sign your life away and are no longer a name less face to the feds but you may be able to own one in your state. All thats needed is to get your chief law enforcment officer to sign your fourm 4, pay $200 to BATFE, pass an FBI back ground chk and wait appx. 2 mo's and you have one."
p6170
aS"Good old monkeys! What can't we learn from them :)Since we are in the Creation vs Evolution section I'm guessing that your debate here is that monkeys and humans show some similar ways of thinking such as in this experiment. It does seem like further evidence that evolution did take place between our two species although it isn't a case cracker by any means."
p6171
aS'just cause you dont buy it doesnt mean it is not true. that life is sacred does provide a (if not the only) compelling altruistic basis for and responsibility to social justice whether it is actually walked out or not. I think that the fact that it is not really walked out in america proves that the majority of americans are not pro life (including a majority of those who actually claim to be pro life). This doesnt negate the truth though.'
p6172
aS'The other articles on her website are also well worth reading: Musings on Christianity, Homosexuality & the Bible'
p6173
aS'Depends on which cell you mean. Mammalian red blood cells, for example, have had their entire nuclei and mitochondria removed. Not so much as a smidgeon of DNA.'
p6174
aS'addition works in the intangible as well. 1 minute + 1 minute = 2 minutes. 1 idea + 1 idea = 2 ideas. the concept of quantity is not limited to matter. if there was just a vaccous void were absolutely nothing was happening, then there would be no application of logic. but even that in itself would be logical. nothing + nothing = nothing is logical. it would actually be logical if a void with nothing added to it result in something. so even in a void, logic still prevails'
p6175
aS"Man, these guys can't even get into the science before they're outright lying..."
p6176
aS'Prove your assertion that he has called himself a conservative Christian rather than a conservative Republican OP. Support your clai if you can or stop trying to lump everyone on the right together.'
p6177
aS"Actually, it is quite correct. You misunderstand. The text book was trying to make it simple so that you would understand. The text book wasn't simple enough. The first record of carbonaria was in 1848. The discussion you quote was trying to explain quite simply, so that you might understand why the change took place. There is no record of anyone ever seeing a carbonaria before 1848. It is probably a safe assumption that an occasional mutation caused some to be born from time to time, but they were not able to reproduce to the extent that they were ever noted before 1848."
p6178
aS'Define "many". What you really mean one is too much. Even when the one is used soles for personal defense. Besides your in Austraila, no one cares what you think.'
p6179
aS'And the follow-on that Archie throws out there demonstrates his ignorance on the subject.Such laws DO NOT just protect homosexuals.They protect EVERYBODY from being fired just cause they are gay OR straight (or bisexual or nonsexual).It protects the straights just as much as it protects the gays.It has nothing to do with "better than" or "superior".If people like Archie understood legislation like ENDA, they wouldn\'t try to make such an absurd allegation! emoticonXEmbarrassed'
p6180
aS"You have this habit of making sweeping claims with little to no substantiation.And even if we were to completely ignore LeVay altogether, there is MOUNDS of other evidence showing a genetic cause.Like I keep pointing out, but nobody on your side of the fence seems to realize, NARTH's OWN CITED REFERENCES say there is a genetic cause!"
p6181
aS"Could it be that the Supreme Court does not view the right protected by the Second Amendment as being fundamental? This is the same court that said that only guns in common use are protected by the Second Amendment. That tells me the Supreme Court doesn't think the right to bear arms is as fundamental as other rights protected by the Bill of Rights. The protection of a newspaper by freedom of the press does not depend on the newspaper being in common use."
p6182
aS'Well, if you breed them, you could get taller monkeys with less hair (and other humanlike characteristics). Even so, it would take a long time.'
p6183
aS'Well, the 40Ar/39Ar method was used to say that it was 65 mya.This same method was used to date volcanic rock from the Mt. Vesuvius eruption to within 7 years. But the KT boundary was dated using several radiometric methods that all agree to within a couple of million years.Here is where I got that info:http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/rnc...12_30_1899.aspLook at table 2.'
p6184
aS'I gotta admit, I got a real chuckle out of this one. :pWaxy'
p6185
aS'But not all "designs" are manufactured. Take the repetitive ridges of sand on a beach. They are created by the motion of the water. Shall I remind you of the humorous story about the "image of Jesus" that attracted much attention, yet turned out to be a coincidence of shadows? This is why I insist upon your defining the terms you\'re using.'
p6186
aS'You are a known anti-gun supporter, should we really be surprised at your presidential choice. Funny thing is, you are going to get screwed just like the rest of us if Obama wins. He might try to take our guns away, but your rights that are important to you wont be very far behind.'
p6187
aS'So what this guy is saying is that he believes in natural selection but not evolution?'
p6188
aS"This is a pretty loose definition.It's like saying you have faith that Jesus will come again because you personally witnessed his ressurection.But you didn't, you have faith because you believe this with absolutely no material evidence or logic to back it up."
p6189
aS"Well, I have heard people on the pro-gun side say that most defensive gun uses don't involve firing even one round. So limiting the capacity would probably have less of an effect on the ability to defend yourself than on crime. So why are people from the gun lobby always whining about restrictions like this? When semi-automatic rifles were banned in Australia, hunters welcomed the law. They saw it as a challenge because it takes greater skill to shoot an animal with a bolt action rifle. Not so in America where some gun owners like to use guns that could take down planes to shoot small animals."
p6190
aS'Simone is quite right...women will no longer breed to order according to the dictats of outdated religion. British Muslim women will follow at some point (many already are). There are a few hothead extremists who sit on London street corners with placards stating that "UK will be Islamic", "Sharia Law for UK" etc. etc. But those nutters are ignored along with all the other (non-religious) nutters currently walking the streets of London. (For the record, Muslims make up 2.1 per cent of the total United Kingdom population. They are hardly "taking over" )."muslims are taking over the world" is a poor excuse of a reason to be anti-abortion and shows desperation, IMO!'
p6191
aS'And he has still yet to provide one. If more gun-control means more lives saved then more gun-control means more self preservation.'
p6192
aS'And thats factually (and logically incorrect). There are many alternatives virtually an infinitude of them in fact.'
p6193
aS"And I don't expect you to. The reason you won't go into how all men were created equal during reconstruction is because you cannot prove that all men are not created equal."
p6194
aS"When it comes to all the examples that Behe had provided in both his first book, and his second book , it has been shown to be able to evolve naturally.   That means, in principle, IC systems can evolve. If you don't believe so, bring forth the I.C. system of your choice.   To say 'But you don't know all the answers' is just the logical fallacy known as 'argument from ignorance'.   Behe brings a system up that he claims is IC.. the pathway for evolution is discovered, and Behe trys another one. How dishonest can you get?   The concept is falsified."
p6195
aS'why the comparison of gun owners yo violent killers and serial rapists? What law have I broken? Since we are doing comparisons your anti-freedom agenda is very similar to the bazi gun control laws of the 1930s, it is like the jim crow laws of the US. Your agenda is one of racism. This is insulting, ignorant, and shows your true colors as an enemy of freedom.'
p6196
aS"No it didn't, there's no suggestions for how to enforce background checks to stomp out straw purchases. Stop offering non-solutions."
p6197
aS"You can have reasoned faith, but it need not rely on 'empirical' evidence. There are very many forms of evidence."
p6198
aS"I think you fail to take into account that for most opposers of abortion, they genuinely feel they are trying to save lives by their opposition. In many cases it's not a matter of trying control sexual prermissiveness in society but preventing lives from being killed. Disagree or not, you can't separate the anti-abortion message from the fact that it holds to the view that abortion is a form of murder."
p6199
aS"Catholics have a different belief. The goal is to always save both mother and child. If the fetus dies during the attempt to save both, then that's what happens. For instance, with an ectopic pregnancy, the goal isn't to kill he fetus, the goal is to save both mother and fetus."
p6200
aS'Please off one scientific piece of evidence in support of biblical creation.'
p6201
aS'I responded to your posts on the thread of "Lets discuss the actual..." I suggest we continue that discussion there.'
p6202
aS'This is exactly what I said in a pm to her. I also suggested that she talk to women who have had abortions, who have not, who have had adoptions, and who have been adopted. I wish there was some kind of "place" you could go to automatically get this kind of dialogue. Not internet sites, but face to face stuff.Want to start a counseling center? :)'
p6203
aS"But there is evidence that we do evolve. I'll give you an example. In areas of west Africa where malaria is endemic there is an allele of hemoglobin that confers resistance when heterozygous. In other environments that allele is not beneficial and is, in fact, deleterious. It is fatal when homozygous. Now according to evolutionary theory such an allele should decline where it offers no benefit. Studies show that this allele is less frequent by about 2 percentage points in Americans of west African ancestry."
p6204
aS"The meticulously preserved, unchanging 66 Books of the Bible aren't compelling?"
p6205
aS"And why would I be anti Christianity when I am Christian?   Oh and by the way to who ever it was who said I don't believe in Jesus, or something to that extent, I never said anything to that extent, you just made up what you wanted and got mad about it. I believe in the teachings of Jesus. Yes I'm betting your asking me how I know about his teachings if I have never read the bible, My mom is someone who has re-read the bible like 6 or 7 times. So she's told me all about it, and what its supposed to teach us."
p6206
aS'Really! Then I assume that you have read Darwin - at least On the Origin of Species. Otherwise you are babbling. Please cite specific passages from Darwin\'s books where he made "morals and ethics" a joke. Please also do the same for the works of Dawkins. Your assertion presumes that you have read the works of both men.'
p6207
aS'Because to not view it as sacred presents a greater potential for harm. People sometimes to take a disposable view of things that they consider unimportant. To view humanity as sacred helps protect humanity.'
p6208
aS"I'm not familiar with the book, so can't comment upon it first hand. However http://www.ncseweb.org/icons/ appears to have a detailed critique of the book and may be of interest to you too. As I say I haven't read the original so cannot judge the quality of the link I'm supplying, so apologies in advance if it grossly misrepresents Mr Well's case."
p6209
aS'Really, with C being between 1/2 and 2 million defensive gun uses per year. Or perhaps the hundreds of millions of legal, non-defense related, gun uses per year. When you compare the number times a guns are used legally to the number of times they are used illegally, B becomes pretty insignificant.'
p6210
aS'Proof? All I can think to say is that a mind is a terrible thing to waste.'
p6211
aS"Actually, I reported the real results of a study. Regular church attendees are twice as likely to vote Republican...etc., the conclusion was, however, meant to be a joke. Most got it, you didn't. emoticonXRolleyes"
p6212
aS"But still, if you think there are rights in the bill of rights that is wrong, that should not be granted or guaranteed, it would be a viable option to vote for removing them.What debate are you trying to end here? The debate: 'do you want little or less gun-control'?"
p6213
aS"Honestly I'm not sure if it was ever said in the Bible, but I sure have heard a lot of the Bible thumpers saying free will is a gift from God."
p6214
aS"Because the modern application of gun control is to target everyone. But that doesn't change the fact that gun control began as a purely racist concept."
p6215
aS'Well of course everybody is entitled. But as history has shown many southern states in America chose to ignore the Constitution and deny black people their rights on the basis of their skin color, using the "black codes" enacted after the Civil War. If it weren\'t for the 14th Amendment that forced state governments to abide by the constitution, minorities would still be out in the cold.The only thing we\'ve been over, is that government and gun control is racist, not the Second Amendment.'
p6216
aS'You realise I\'m talking about if the burglar is running away, not the householder, right? Looking at it again I realise I may not have phrased it clearly enough. I\'m saying that some of those "violent" crimes may simply have been burglars pegging it when disturbed.'
p6217
aS"And many of those countries are having problems with it. Furthermore, we aren't even proposing what other countries have."
p6218
aS'Simply pointing out that swords cut in both directions.   Be that as it may, no one has refuted that there are more cases of Concealed Carry Permit holders who have gone off and assaulted people than there have been school shootings.   Care to try? Omegaman tried, failed, and went silent on the topic.'
p6219
aS"Well, I forgot to add one thing: a legal notice to the gov't about such behavior."
p6220
aS"Well before there was a law someone came up with a difference, I didn't ask if they end result was the same, I asked if there was a difference in the two. Maybe a moral difference or something."
p6221
aS'Give it a rest... what is evident here is more coffeehouse vasilation on your part... no foam.'
p6222
aS'It is ALL repeated time after time, and time again then again. But you are correct. Here is one of the links to those studies. emoticonXSmilie http://www.4forums.com/political/gun...tml#post354115But what do we do about this? http://works.bepress.com/cgi/viewcon...dennis_culhane Which is a study of criminals shooting criminals but it is hoped that people will think it is about Law Abiding Concealed Carry. This is NOT representative of Law-abiding Concealed Carry or legal gun ownership in any way. And we have this.Guns and Death - Firearms Research - Harvard Injury Control Research Center - Harvard School of Public HealthSo lets look at the actual crime figures to see if any of this holds water.  According to this 1999 article  there were 250 million guns in circulation in 1999.   Total NICS Background Checks November 30, 1998 - June 30, 2009 '
p6223
aS"It's all very interesting, but you left out a critical piece of information. You deliberately omitted the fact that most of the black victims were killed by fellow blacks. These weren't murders carried out by racist white guys, they're the examples of black on black violence."
p6224
aS'Problem is, you think requiring a woman not to kill someone is "treating them as breeding animals". Kind of an odd thought.'
p6225
aS"I have heard that the USA spends around 40% (total) more on health care than Canada does. That would be impressive if it weren't for one fact. The USA has 900% of our population. It is your administration costs what are getting you the most. We only spend around 11% on administration while the USA spends around 25% of their health care dollars. We have a cap on how much a doctor can be sued for as well. Yes, our system isn't perfect, but it still works.Nearly 50 million Americans don't have health care at all, that is around 18% of your total population. This is quite shameful. As I've stated, the USA is the only Nation in the Industrialize world to not have universal health care."
p6226
aS"Are you saying that given enough time you can come with answers? That's a statement of faith."
p6227
aS"Brinks plays on people's fears to sell security systems that don't even work. Insurance companies play on people's fears to sell their policies."
p6228
aS"Hi Smallax, welcome to the forum. I did a search and have found some products which might give you an idea about costs and concepts for performing such an experiment. It sounds interesting by the way.First, I found Glass Bell jars that are safe at high pressure. https://www1.fishersci.com/wps/porta...=y&fromSearch=Here's a Nalgene vacuum chamber as another option to the Bell Jar depending on the pressure you're going to use.https://www1.fishersci.com/wps/porta...=y&fromSearch=Here's a motor driven vacuum pump: https://www1.fishersci.com/wps/porta...=y&fromSearch=Here's a precalibrated absolute zero apparatus: https://www1.fishersci.com/wps/porta...=y&fromSearch=This link gives a wide range of products that you might want to be aware of for a wider selection of potential equipment:https://www1.fishersci.com/wps/porta...&catCode=SE_SCHere's a fiber optic system which is interesting and utilizes natural light: Huvco Daylighing Solutions | Parans Fiber Optic Systems | Tubular Skylights | High Performance SkylightsHere's another design but is a different company: SUNLIGHT DIRECTKeep us informed if you run the experiment. I'd be interested in the results."
p6229
aS"I looked it up and apparently there is a synthetic form of THC on the market, (generically known as Dronabinol and sold under the trade name Marinol). But it is only allowed under restricted prescription (it's a Schedule II controlled substance, the same as morphine or cocaine) and is far less effective than plant-derived THC."
p6230
aS'Let me explain this to you.You want to stop abortions for someone else. You want to take a womans right to choose away. Where as Jito supporting a womans right to choose does not impose upon your life in any way.You want to stop me from being able to marry this does not effect your life in any way yet has a devastationg effect on my life. The left supports rights while your side want to limit the rights of others.You want to stop me from being able to marry because you have a religious belief against it even though I may have a religious belief that supports it. Therefore you are imposing your religious and moral views on me when I do not share those beliefs.'
p6231
aS'Actually, society hasn\'t said this. 5 judges, in very recent times, have. I for one think that some 17 year olds fully comprehend the full implications of murder, and therefore should be held accountable in the same way as an 18 year old. I guess I just don\'t see any reason why a jury could not address the issue on a case by case basis. I do not see the "18 and over execution rule" in the eighth amendment.'
p6232
aS'Right. They can never show how the belief in their deity is not a textbook case of the special pleading fallacy. (Pretty funny after all the hubbub earlier about double standards...)'
p6233
aS"Because Africa isn't one big homogeneous ecosystem. There are jungles, plains, deserts, swamps. Himps living in the jungle weren't in competition with himps that started migrating out onto the plains. Their food sources are different, their territories are different. The more suited to plains-dwelling we became, the less attractive a prospect it was to return to the jungle. Pretty straightforward, really."
p6234
aS'I wouls also add that humans have been able to make CHIHUAHUAs and Irish wolf hounds from wolves.'
p6235
aS'********. Utter fraking ****. Scientists have already accumulated mounds of evidence which suggest the common ancestor. You choose to ignore it as do most scientifically ignorant christians.'
p6236
aS"Yeah, it does have risk unlike the embryonic stem cells, but I think that if it comes out the way they hope, it will eventually lead to more embryonic uses as well when people realize that this can have risks. I think it is good to have this way as a back up while people argue over the use of cells that would otherwise be disposed, and get some treatment to people who need it rather than letting it be denied to them by anti-abortionists. And yeah, it's pretty much guaranteed that someone will find something to object about, claiming it is immoral (maybe it will now be that these stem cells are potential human life and we can't use them emoticonXRolleyes ), but it will likely not have as many objections."
p6237
aS'No contradiction; the Permian extinction was the most severe in history and noted as such in the page linked.'
p6238
aS'Of course not. That battle has already been lost. Creationism is religion and it cannot be taught in a science class, even when it is called "creation science" and the data is distorted and mininterpreted. The most recent attempt by creationists in Kansas on the State Board (and yes, they were YECs) was to eliminate all requirements to teach evolution, and all references to an old earth from all curriculum standards.'
p6239
aS'I believe in a strict interpretation of the Constitution, this makes me neither a liberal or conservative. The SN was inspired by VOR who kept signing his posts with quotes from Karl Marx.'
p6240
aS'Agreed that they are still the same species, much like the "13 species" of Darwin\'s Finches, and I have no problem with evolution in that respect. I can even see the plausibility of different subspecies evolving eventually into different species if they are geographically separated for a sufficiently long time. But I still don\'t see where evolution, in that sense of the term, can account for dozens of species of monkeys occupying the same patch of rainforest, or dozens of species of gazelles occupying the same patch of grassland.'
p6241
aS"The reported killings in European countries have rivaled the levels of Columbine. Quite a feat for a country with strict gun control laws. How can even a rare and isolated incident in a country with draconian gun control, meet or exceed something that's supposedly relatively common in America?"
p6242
aS'And as such, the term as you use it is utterly meaningless as it could be applied to any cell or sell remnant of human origin.'
p6243
aS"A master baiter like you should present your thesis to be taken seriously, you haven't and you aren't. "
p6244
aS"'Self-defense' never enters into it, imo. Unwillingness to share ones body is not necessarily self-defense, so this does not apply."
p6245
aS'You should have said that. I might have agreed with you.'
p6246
aS"Wrong and no one has ever called bone marrow an inner sanctum and I don't know what a baby's tabernacle might be."
p6247
aS'Almost all did. In fact, probably all that you are aware of did. Even the energy in the steak that you eat came from the sun ultimately. The thing is that evolution seems to have resulted in an organism to take advantage of almost every form of available energy. And what energy is left by "higher" animals is used by others - insects, microbes - until there is little usable energy left. That even goes so far that there are some organisms that get their energy from geothermal sources - no light involved.'
p6248
aS"AGREED!!!!That has to be BY FAR the best series I've ever read!Also, Asimov's Foundation triligoy is good. And again, the classics:Fahrenheit 4511984Catcher in the Rye...and all those other depressing books..."
p6249
aS'And some of those tests fail. There are holes in the theory of gravity. Yet gravity remains fact in simple every day terms. Evolution is fact because "we can observe it\'s effects on objects and we can do tests to determine more about it". Further there are very few holes in that theory. Evolution is therefore more deserving of being called fact than gravity is. What I think you are really trying to say is that you can think you understand gravity (drop ball; ball falls) therefore you see it as a fact. But evolution is complex even at a basic level, so you do not see it as fact.'
p6250
aS'But the fact remains that guns are, by design, weapons.'
p6251
aS'very true. logic exists whether people are there to grasps its concepts or not.where we disagree is at your assumption that god created logic. how can this be? logic is not contingent on any intelligent entity, whether it be man or god, to exist. the logic of increasing a quantity by adding to it would remain whether god existed or not. you have yet to tie the existence of logic to god as its cause'
p6252
aS'Gun writer Jeff Snider point out. Obama: No AWB for Now?'
p6253
aS'You misunderstand me I believe they should all be locked up. Anyone who preaches against gay people freely living their lives as equal citizens with all the rights and responsibilites should be locked up in the darkest dungeon. There can be no compromise on this issue peoples lives are at stake.'
p6254
aS'To force women to have babys that they dont even want is even more "preposterous".'
p6255
aS"I think hip hop and the arts are reflections of society. It is good to bring these issues to light, if only so that those who wouldn't normally be aware of them are enlightened."
p6256
aS'What do you mean by this? Could we not have the law treat under-18 capital offenders on an individual basis, determining whether the individual offenders in the individual cases were sufficiently developed?Also, what would you say to the response that our current law provides that juveniles are sufficiently developed enough to have the responsibility, without parental involvement, to decide whether to obtain an abortion? Is it not a conflict to say juveniles should not be eligible for the death penalty because they are not morally developed enough, but at the same time say juveniles are morally developed enough to decide whether to obtain an abortion without involving their parents?'
p6257
aS'You are the only one defending them now...the funny part it, planned parenthood had the stats as reasons why abortion should be legal (or is legal). But wait! As we established the number of people that died from abortions went down to under a thousand so this reason is still not accurate and is still misleading. Anymore ideas?'
p6258
aS'Of course everyone has some basis for their views. Not even denying that. However there are ways that using that "basis" most certainly is an imposition and the gay rights battle is a prime example. There are many, many, many people who have done work to stop/block gay marriage and other gay rights when they, themselves, are not gay. That is not merely passing judgement - that is imposition. All I am asking here is that Archie, you, JP, etc. own that.'
p6259
aS"No. That's not what I said. I said that natural selection is differential reproductive success. I said that those organisms that possessed advantageous characteristics would tend to reach reproductive age more frequently and therefore they will tend to produce more offspring, while those with disadvantageous characteristics will tend to produce fewer offspring. As a result, the heritable characteristics of the population will change over time."
p6260
aS'Almost?   Usually, that is true, and it involves selection between populations. However, there are often times when some of a population is better able to survive. Those times, selection occurs within a population.'
p6261
aS"You have some good points here, but what do you do in the event of pregnancy due to rape? Or a pregnancy that is going to put the life of the mother at risk?And to push the line a bit further, what about failed contraception, where the 'morning after' pill is taken? Does that count as abortion as it happens after conception?Smiley"
p6262
aS'No, you are mistaken. Evolution is concerned with the change in allele frequency over time. The age of the Universe is irrelevent.'
p6263
aS'Religious faith, by definition, is a "jump in the dark" and there is really little(if any) common intellectual ground on which Creationism and ScientificMaterialism can meet. In principle, given adequate evidence etc., there isnothing in the material world that cannot be explained by Science. Butsomeone who has, so to speak, already jumped into the dark cannot see this.The most interesting questions that a supernatural account of human life can raise are concerned with the evolution of law, morality, social conventions,aesthetic sensibility and such like.'
p6264
aS"But I think that Gods originally came about to explain why a large yellow thing goes up and down everyday. To a caveman the most logical explanation is there is a God. Now we know better. Just because there are still things we can't explain does not mean they must be from God."
p6265
aS"Like blacks once were? Wasn't that the main thrust of the 14th amendment and incorporation? Given incorporation, imagine the suits those acts of discrimination would bring emoticonXGood "
p6266
aS"Well then this doesn't answer my question.If you have 10 doctors for 100 people (this is just an example) and only 50 of them have health insurance and each doctor gets paid $100 a year then your health care per capita is $10 ([10doctors x $100]/100 people). If you change it to 100 people with health insurance you now have $10 per capita as well because you population did not change. Health care costs are shown per capita and not per person insured: Per Capita Health Expenditures by Country, 2007 &mdash; Infoplease.comSo again, if you go from $6,000 per capita per that website given above to say Switzerland levels at $4,100 per capita then where did that money come from?"
p6267
aS"Apparently this is a petition opposing the pending resolution before the Illinois lawmakers that will deprive the rights given in the Constitutions. It is to encourage the lawmakers to vote against it. The lawmakers have not yet agreed to vote it down. Knowing the State of Illinois, I am predicting they will pay no attention to the commoners.   The only thing a glean out of this is that the common people have more sense than the lawmakers. But I've actually known that for a long time."
p6268
aS'Well memory is NOT something that is immaterial is it. Its always implemented in the form of material processes well known to biochemistry. Metabolism, ion flows, neuron activity and interconnections, along with potentiation of those connections into networks.Free-will of course is what we call the experience of our choices being not wholly determined by external states alone. By no means does that exclude the fact that our internal states (of which we are largely ignorant) also play a role. The autonomy arises from the operation of the brain and those internal states. Again a purely materialist explanation. And there is no evidence of anything other than material processes in the experience of free-will. In other words neither memory nor free-will require a non-materialist viewpoint.'
p6269
aS"So you've gone from evolution and ID to cosmology. You have a real problem with maintaining established realms. ID addresses evolutionary theory, not abiogenesis, and not cosmology."
p6270
aS"Being new isn't a problem. Nor is uncertainty about a position. The way to learn is to ask questions in appropriate places. However, a problem with message boards is that, without experience, it may be difficult to tell who is speaking from knowledge and who is speaking from ignorance or faith."
p6271
aS'There is just one thing however. The coelacanths found are different from those in the fossil record. Further, ALL evidence pointed to them being extinct, until we found other evidence, and we changed it. And, to top it off, the article says NEARLY extinct, not COMPLETELY. Although, this article was of course written after the coelocanths were re-discovered. Of course, this has absolutely nothing to do with the theory of evolution, which explains the mechanisms responsible for the change of allele frequencies in populations over time.'
p6272
aS'The whole "change the definition of marriage" is mainly a scare tactic used by anti-gay religious bigots. They don\'t seem to realize that words can have several meanings.'
p6273
aS"So? In your religion's view, everyone sins. Their sin is no greater or more unforgiveable than yours."
p6274
aS'This also applies to tapeworms. I fail to see how it is therefore relevent to any debate on abortion.'
p6275
aS'Manslaughter involves a direct action that causes an unintentional death. Miscarriage is involuntary; besides the person suffering a miscarriage might well want to keep the baby. To equate miscarriage with manslaughter is preposterous.'
p6276
aS"The interesting thing about the 'quality of life ethic' is that, in a pro-choice framework, it means that we can't degrade anyone's quality of life without their permission. So far from entailing a cull of the elderly, the infirm, the handicapped, and the ugly, the quality of life ethic entails that we cannot kill them off. Each person is entitled to the quality of life that they desire where what they desire does not infringe on other's quality of life. "
p6277
aS'So the initial murder wasn\'t enough to show "that they are willing to commit acts of violence"? This makes absolutely no sense.'
p6278
aS'The anti-abortionists claim that would be killing a human life to save one.'
p6279
aS"No it doesn't, as abortion WAS a legal option in this case.   This was not a legality issue, but an education issue."
p6280
aS"All of the points above should be considered if you want to produce a solid argument that a series of events actually occured in the past. If you wish others to take this seriously please produce some relevant evidence from a source that held to a higher level of credibility. By your standards I should make a thread based on the National Enquirer or Star about Kerry's life as a male gigolo or golddigger."
p6281
aS"If that were true, why are there millions of miscarriages each year? I don't believe a word of it."
p6282
aS"And we all know that is what it will become. I'm willing to bet money that Marc is going to argue that abiogenesis is a part of evolution as well as the big bang. There's a clear reason why he won't accept the definitions before the debate starts."
p6283
aS'The problem here is that Christians (such as I am) consider the Bible to be Proof.'
p6284
aS"I'm not trying to prove anything. I'm asking if you'd think differently in that case, and you're not answering."
p6285
aS'Clinton gave access to b/c which is known to prevent pregnancies. Bush has reduced access to b/c (including e/c). A primary reason for aborting is money - Americans have been less well off under Bush.'
p6286
aS"You/he could just have said 'slippery slope' in the first place; that argument is an old one, which I though was dealt with a long time ago. You can't disapprove of A on the grounds that it might lead to B - firstly because you have little to no evidence that it will, secondly because A is not necessary for B to happen and thirdly because that difference between A and B is all the argument you need to prevent B but be in favour of A. You can approve of punishing criminals but be against the death sentance."
p6287
aS"First of all, the government cannot increase the volume and social acceptance of a drug - only the market and society can do that. Government cannot even decrease the volume or social acceptance of drugs - despite the government's efforts, drug use has remained relatively constant. What hasn't remained constant is violent crime, which has gone up during the drug war as it did during alcohol prohibition."
p6288
aS"These aren't the only two options available. The many philosophical views of the material world or ethics don't mean these two things don't exist."
p6289
aS"Yet it is the only source I've seen that counted the incedents in which a gun was used in self-defence, but nobody was injured. I could assume that all of your sources and Ians only count occasions where one was injured. According to the source, they'd 91.7% of all times where a gun was used in self-defence."
p6290
aS"He's pointing out that the situation is about the mother and the baby, and that the baby's right to life ends exactly where the woman's right to personal autonomy begins. That's the interesting thing about rights-based ethics, that the rights of any individual are limited precisely by the rights of all other individuals."
p6291
aS"I think that scientists don't work with religion and religion has no place in science class."
p6292
aS'When the criminal has greater civil protections than his victim, and this is viewed as being civilized, a society is doomed.'
p6293
aS"Well let's put it this way. I really like playing baseball. So I put in a law that says everyone has to play baseball unless they're in a position where it will threaten their life. Since it's such a wonderful thing no one should have any problem with a law passed, right?"
p6294
aS'I think you are entirely correct. From the page VOR linked:'
p6295
aS'So, if there was a way to know that that baby would be infertile it would be alright in your view to abort?'
p6296
aS"Not entirely true. While we can't disprove that God created the universe, we can disprove many creationist claims. For example, we can disprove that the earth is 6000 years old."
p6297
aS'And it is. The ToE is a theory, however. It explains evolution, which has been observed. Do not attempt to deny that.'
p6298
aS'No one wants to take your "marriage" away Matt. It\'s a free country--no one\'s going to block your way to any chapel that will marry you. Do your gay thing. But let marriage be marriage--it\'s a different matter. People just want to keep you from tampering with the institution of marriage.'
p6299
aS'See Above.I can\'t help but notice your signature. What are you, Patriot under a different username? Bad show, Patriot. Sock Puppets aren\'t good debate form.Patriot-- About your statement that you\'ve been vindicated. I hope you\'re just fooling around. :)TruthSeeker\'s first post doesn\'t even belong in a debate forum. She stated an opinion, and then stated absolutely nothing to back it up in any way. No evidence. No reasoning. Not one "because". Nothing. It was like entering a presidential candidate debate and saying, "I think the other guy sucks" and leaving. Hence why I asked her as politely as possible to elaborate.'
p6300
aS'When the needs of the two are in conflict this is unavoidable.'
p6301
aS"Actually, I don't remember that they did. What they did take bets on was that AIG would be able to find enough stupid people who would buy into their ignorant and scientifically illiterate tripe. As I recall, most who were actually aware of how stupid creationists can be bet that they would be able to do so. So now, besides their other so called 'peer reviewed' magazine, they want to pretend that they are doing science here."
p6302
aS'Exactly, which brings us back to square 1. Creationism is based on religion, and Evolution is based on the Scientific method, but is not proven. Creationism isnt even near being proven. So, why would you try to impose your religious beliefs on public school children?'
p6303
aS"just isn't the case in countries with nationalised health care, yet those countries also have a large number of pharmaceutical companies that are based there."
p6304
aS"Yet another application of a different meaning of the word in an effort to group everything in science that you don't understand and won't accept under one word."
p6305
aS'Again, modern birds seem to do fine as do gliding mammals such as flying squirrels.'
p6306
aS"Too much spin there buddy. The potentiality arguement is used by those who believe women have a right to have control over their fertility. As an aside it is also a fundemental tenent in Judaism's view of the unborn- the foetus is a potential life, but has not yet attained that state of being, which occurs at birth."
p6307
aS'And you think this a good thing? It just shows the weak cowardly position of the creationist.'
p6308
aS"No, there isn't a consensus among Christians, at least not beyond the fact that God was responsible in one way or another for the universe existing. There is no consensus about method."
p6309
aS'Do you see the other cities pushing for outrageous standards like NYC?'
p6310
aS"Now this is a totally inaccurate generalization.I don't think you actually realize the sheer numbers of people who smoke pot in this country, and I'm talking on a regular basis.I am certainly one of them. I have friends that do it and friends that don't.We all lead your typical normal life."
p6311
aS"If DOMA isn't declared unconstitutional, then those arguing against Prop 8 are micturating into the wind."
p6312
aS'The original molecule had some lipolytic function, but removing some amino acids from it, in the right place, made it fit better into the substrate, and thereby greatly increased its functionality. Barbarian observes:We thought it would take roughly a million years for bacteria to evolve enzymes capable of digesting nylon (because the compound is so different than any they were able to digest) but it took less than a century. .'
p6313
aS"A law baning same-sex marriage, then I'd agree. But the reason same-sex marriage doesn't exist (other than Mass.) is not because of law; after all, there are plenty of states that don't have same-sex marriage with no law that outlaws it. You're barking up the wrong tree--this is a cultural issue more than a legal one."
p6314
aS"Well, actually society has said that 18 is the dividing line. It can then also say, that under certain circumstances, for a particularly bad person, in some cases it will be considered if the person is 16 or 17. That's why we have all the judges and lawyers, etc..."
p6315
aS'Stevens said that bear arms has a military meaning. So was he saying that the right is individual but existed in connection with militia service? Is this some kind of hybrid model? Interestingly, scholars who made similar claims in the past got lumped in with those who supported a collective right by the pro gun crowd. But I suppose it sounds good to say that all nine Supreme Court justices supported an individual rights interpretation. '
p6316
aS"And the risk to minority's civil rights is, of course, the reason for the bill. They are, after all, limiting what can be started via initiative, not eliminating the initiative process altogether. The fraud was merely an example of why the change is needed. As has been argued here before, if civil rights need protecting, it's from the majority. Allowing civil rights to be modified via the initiative process simply makes it too easy for the majority to impose it's will on the minority. That's not what a Democracy is about, at least not our Democracy."
p6317
aS'That\'s not true -- actually, it doesn\'t make sense. Science is just a bunch of rules (by definition). "Biology uses science to study life" is true. "Physics uses science to study the physical world" is true, but "science\'s purpose is to study life" is not true. '
p6318
aS"Actually, I am of the opinion that the fetus has no natural rights of its own. Any rights we grant to a person as a citizen or national are granted at the moment of birth. By granting equal rights to a 3week old fetus that you do to a 20 year old man, you are endangering the rights of the woman who carries that child. Yes, I believe that in most circumstances, the child should be carried to term, but there are exceptions to every rule, and I'm not quite ready to forsake the lives and health of women to protect unborn children. Yes, I think the unborn child is worthy of protection, but not any more so than the mother, in fact probably less."
p6319
aS'Ah ha! Someone who understands the application of information theory to biological organisms. By the biological specific definition of information, the genome of any organism is information about the environment in which it lives.'
p6320
aS"It stops us from saying we ara a rational people. I don't support any laws that would allow a father not to have a say so about his child being aborted. Are there any?? If it were a life or death thing for the mother no question.As I stated I don't like the idea but making it illegal would simply put more unwanted kids in state homes. Lets take care of the living first!"
p6321
aS"But himps living in the jungle were in competition with other himps which didn't migrate to the plains. And pressures from predators, climate and changes in the ecosystem should have continued to force the need or desire to control their environment as our line of himp grew to do. My point is that with all of the same basic tools to start out with such as fingers, opposable thumbs and walking upright, there is no reason why only our line evolved to the level that human beings have attained with the same hundreds of millions of years, and the same pressures pushing us all forward, or towards extinction."
p6322
aS"It's not a literal account unless you interpret it that way."
p6323
aS'Since they are issued by the military I would think so. '
p6324
aS'Let\'s not confuse our readers. supersport is not saying it\'s evolution; he\'s saying that "evolutionists" say that it\'s evolution. It should be clear now to the readers that scientists recognized perfectly well that this is an example of plasticity.'
p6325
aS"That's an interesting subject, I had not heard of that b4. Did our bodies once produce Vitamin C?."
p6326
aS"Actually all decisions based on the self ARE selfish decisions. I really don't care. I make them all the time too. Everyone does. While this is a philosophical issue I really see it as odd that people claim not to be selfish when doing something that benefits them or prevents harm to them with little regard to anyone else."
p6327
aS"I believe it's there, but I'm certainly no one to push that belief on anyone."
p6328
aS'Sigma I have taken into account the options a woman has after pregnancy. However, there are no doubt cases in the history of the world (not just within America) where there were no options available to a mother but to keep her child (ie: the first human woman to give birth in the history of the world). For this pro-choice line of reasoning to be absoulutely true it must be true in every possible situation. Are you saying that the killing would be justified if no other options were available to her?'
p6329
aS"I guess I'd have to reluctantly admit that it didn't take long for some....but I'm an eternal optimist and think civility will prevail. Besides, I try not to judge everybody by the acts of a few."
p6330
aS"You can do whatever you want to do with your money. The fact that you don't know any better than to do that with your money is telling, though. If you think that the C(R)SC actually does ID-based scientific research, you're exactly the dupe they're looking for.I'm serious. Do the research for yourself. I won't even give you links, because you'll XXXX them off as propaganda. Find any scientific journal article written by a DI member that's actually based on actual scientific experimentation or investigation and supports ID. I dare you."
p6331
aS'Do you think that the woman will not relive the rape on a daily basis if she destroys the child? Not likely. I think she will still suffer through those thoughts. Killing the baby complicates this. What happens if she has horrible thoughts about a rape with more thoughts about the abortion?'
p6332
aS"I think they are doing it out of fear. They see the moral decline in America and they have latched onto the GLBT Community as their scapegoat. Since it's no longer PC To attack African-Americans for their obvious differences, it's not PC to go after other religions (especially Judaism - not that it actually stops pure hate groups from doing it) they have decided that attacking a group of people which are sexually different should be the way to go.I mean, their religion tells them that premarital sex is bad and wrong. Even though there is a multi-billion dollar industry based around HETEROSEXUAL sex, they actually depend on that money too much to bite the hand that feeds them. Insted, they attack a group that has not legal rights to marriage let alone little legal standing as far as individual rights. It's easier that way."
p6333
aS"Evolution's evidence is that life is similar, you won't be able to find an exception I am sure."
p6334
aS"So, because she's bigger, she can kill the fetus off? That is generally the idea the school yard bully has."
p6335
aS"There's a distinct difference... so what? No baby at any age can live outside the womb. It still needs care and attention like any other. This difference in age doesn't mean anything."
p6336
aS'that is not true. a levitating guru that has been seen and proven to levitate doesnt make the process natural. an alien that has been seen and proven to teleport and abduct people in their retractor beam doesnt make the process less paranormal. the definition of supernatural/paranormal doesnt automatically mean they can never be observed, just that they defy physical law. the definition of God is a special case that includes never being observed/proven'
p6337
aS'So everyone thinks that "evolutionists" should seize power or something? If that is true, it is because evolution is very widely accepted.'
p6338
aS'They can "marry" whomever they love. Benefits though, are a different matter. The state and society views marriage as an opposite-sex institution. It\'s not about anyone getting harmed; no one said it was.'
p6339
aS'That and VOR keeps flip flopping on his positions and he refuses to clarify his contridictions.'
p6340
aS'You believe two things that are incorrect: that you have refuted evolutionary theory, and that we will now accept intellegent design because of your attempt.'
p6341
aS"How do you know there isn't a tiger in the bathroom? You feel very strongly and have over-whelming evidence that there is no tiger in your bathroom? (You live in an urban area, there are no zoos, you don't hear scratching or biting or the maiming of your poodle, and the water is going) But you cannot prove a negative. Which is also why you won't be able to prove that creationism is wrong, and why we can't prove evolution is wrong. The focus must be on proving one right. How you might do that depends on your method of reasoning and thought."
p6342
aS'If putting the child up for adoption, this can be covered too. However, you havingto take time out per doctors instructions is something you might not desire as it could affect career opprotunities in certain lines of work.'
p6343
aS'#2 was questioning the personal, non-scientific beliefs of the evolution believer'
p6344
aS"There's no adding of firearms going on, because they're already there! The criminals have them, that's a hard fact of life that can't ever be changed. Deal with it. What we want is for the intended victims to be on equal footing with the bad guys. There's nothing unreasonable about that."
p6345
aS"Cars are a privilege, your gun isn't. Show me evidence that would support the registration of your first amendment rights being constitutional."
p6346
aS"I laughed when I first saw the ad on MSNBC's Hardball tonight. It shows the fear, insecurities and the fallacies that guide anti-gay equality rights activists."
p6347
aS"Sorry to inform you, but until you are 18 years old in this country, you are not granted full protection of your rights under the constitution of the united states. I don't agree with testing either, but saying that it violates your rights is not a valid argument. "
p6348
aS'Actually, it is. There are multitudes of known characteristics that have been shown to be the result of a single point difference in the gene. The discovery of regulatory functions of some translated segments of DNA does not in any way discount what is known about gene function.'
p6349
aS'it is no "story"........i am debating on the whole evolution thing... look at the facts. so many great ppl, physics people, niels bohr, he was for evoulution, then he found out all of the facts that it is junk, so he became a christian'
p6350
aS'We\'re legally dead when we no longer mentally exist (hence the term "brain-dead"), so there is no logical reason to set the beginning point as anything other than the start of the mental existence. Just as people who are dead and without mental existence do not have the ability to obtain rights, a collection of human cells without a mental existence cannot obtain rights. I also notice you have resorted to attacking other people\'s views rather than following the topic of the thread, which is to share YOUR views. emoticonXBanghead'
p6351
aS'This whole riff where people talk about preventing employers from firing gays JUST cause they are gay as a "special right" is something that seems to fool those who are prejudiced against gays...... but for most people, they recognize it as a propagandic phrasing with little merit.I think our laws should include something that prevents people from firing employees based on the employee\'s sexual orientation.But to utilize your phrasing Archie, do you think that religion is something that deserves "special rights"?'
p6352
aS'"Healthy Families" seems like a strange name for this group that the link is to.'
p6353
aS'actually, it can be proven whether leprechauns, unicorns, the flying spaghetti monster, magical space monkeys and livining care baers, and even god, exists or not.the question of proving a belief seems kinda self-contradictory to me. if something is a fact that can be proven, then your belief about it is irrelevant. likewise, if you believe something, whether there are facts to support it or not, its still your belief. there are people who believe things inn the absence of supporting facts, and sometimes even in the face of opposing facts. the term for that is faithfaith is the belief of something in the absence of evidence. if you have faith in something, proof is irrelevant, or at least it should be'
p6354
aS"But you know what really doesn't make sense? Why are they evangelising to people (who they know most of them will reject them) if those people get a special dispensation? They'd be condemning people to hell by evangelizing, would they not? Why not leave the people be and let them get the special dispensation? emoticonXConfused"
p6355
aS'That is not quite what the \'mitochondrial Eve\' hypothesis posits.Science. 1995 Dec 22;270(5244):1930-6. The myth of Eve: molecular biology and human origins.Ayala FJ.University of California, Irvine, USA.It has been proposed that modern humans descended from a single woman, the "mitochondrial Eve" who lived in Africa 100,000 to 200,000 years ago. The human immune system DRB1 genes are extremely polymorphic, with gene lineages that coalesce into an ancestor who lived around 60 million years ago, a time before the divergence of the apes from the Old World monkeys. The theory of gene coalescence suggests that, throughout the last 60 million years, human ancestral populations had an effective size of 100,000 individuals or greater. Molecular evolution data favor the African origin of modern humans, but the weight of the evidence is against a population bottleneck before their emergence. The mitochondrial Eve hypothesis emanates from a confusion between gene genealogies and individual genealogies.'
p6356
aS'I see no reason why secular shows should be required to mention your mythology.'
p6357
aS'Because if you let gays marry because it is an alternitve way the equal protection says that if you let one happen you have to let the others have that right to. But that is not really my point my real point is that if we let this happend it will ruin marriage in this country, marriage is a bond between a man and a women and if we let gays marry this country will be ruining that tradition thus making this country more secular then it all ready is. AND WE HAVE TO STOP THAT.'
p6358
aS'I believe the question was "who?"I\'m christian and I believe in evolution. Whether it contradicts the Old Testament or not makes no difference to me. Jesus contradicted the Old Testament.The Bible is the inspired word of God, not a dictation to scribes. Men wrote the allegories describing the creation of things.Saying that mankind took a long time to understand certain things is not limiting the power of God. He could have chosen to make early man Einsteinian, but He didn\'t. He could have chosen for mankind to bypass the flat-earth concept, but He didn\'t. He could have chosen for all humans to be highly intelligent, but He didn\'t. What He did was to leave us alone and let us figure things out on our own, including how long it took to get where we are now.'
p6359
aS'In what universe is there a right to murder?Unfortunately, we in the United States have only recently recognized that abusing children and owning slaves is not a right.And, only recently have women enjoyed the right to vote in the United States.What certain activities are forbidden in public?Some of the conservative red states have only recently decreed that there should be speek limits. Not for safety reasons, of course.And, George Walker Bush has guaranteed the right of corporations to dump dangerous chemicals into lakes and rivers and the oceans.'
p6360
aS"Well you don't need to doubt it. I like to be rational but I also wish to believe in God. I need some evidence, any evidence, to believe in God and that would be all I would need."
p6361
aS'They are: those that survive better reproduce more. Members of a species can die if other members have better food/light/attention/camaflouge.'
p6362
aS'See above. Give kids credit. You give them a bogus answer and they will know. We have got to stop treating sex like a dirty little secret.'
p6363
aS'And if we can actually doing anything about it. From what I hear on the fringes, the debate should not be about how to change or stop it, but how to change to deal with it and what we should expect as society adapts to a change in climate.'
p6364
aS"It can't come up with evidence if it's suppressed from future generations. Until you can show that happenstance origins are science, you have no basis to declare that intelligent design is not science. I agree that I haven't shown how ID has a potential advantage to the political corruptness of today's scientific community, but I've shown it's potential advantage to our society. I've shown how thinking is involved with it, the type of thinking involved in any school class involving philosophy, which you said science classes should have."
p6365
aS'I think you misunderstand my view. I think that a third-term fetus is already sufficiently a person, so I would CERTAINLY consider a newborn baby a person. To me, a person is one who has the most basic, rudimentary sense of thought and emotion. A late-term fetus, from my point of view, is no less a person than an Einstein. An Einstein, of course, is much more useful to a much greater number of people, but from the simple point of view of whether he is more of a person, I would say not.'
p6366
aS'Well this involves the free will / determinism debate, you say you aren\'t free if your preferences are implanted... I say you are free when you act in accordance with your preferences, regardless of how those preferences were arrived at. I think to claim you need to "choose" your preferences is absurd, as the act of choosing requires prior preferences, which presumably also required a choice.... and the question of how we acquired our first preference arises...'
p6367
aS"That's the thing, though; even a self-professed non-expert can perfectly well refute the ridiculous points supersport continually spouts. supersport, on the other hand, doesn't know any better."
p6368
aS"The fact that it's the truth is why I keep repeating it."
p6369
aS'Sorry to shatter you little world but this is happening it has been happening 25 years and it is happening now and it is completly legal no laws have been broken and yes there is a market for fetal tissue /limbs and bodies.Do some research you will be surprised what you will find.'
p6370
aS'Mythology. But nevertheless, shipbuilding has been going on for a lot longer than 500 years. There have been a lot of skilled shipbuilders who have passed along their knowledge from generation to generation. Do you think that every time someone builds a ship that they invent the whole process? Nah. 300 ft is about the limit for wood no matter how you design it. Even worse it you cast a big box adrift in a huge storm. How did the animals survive the rolling and rolling?'
p6371
aS'Somehow I don\'t think a high percentage of Ham\'s "facts" are facts.'
p6372
aS"I'm afraid it is you who is wrong. I created you so that you would think you created me to think I created everything, even though I did. It's more of a challenge that way to try to convert people to the one true religion. Since you can see that I won't be able to convert the world (it's due in a week), you can pay $100 dollars to me so I will take you with me to the upper world."
p6373
aS'Yes, everyone is a "potential" felon. Fortunately most people never commit a felony. And there are many different types of weapons, all which could be used by previously law abiding citizens to commit an act of violence.'
p6374
aS"Because some restrictions that might pass constitutional muster, don't amount to an outright ban. How would impossibility ever be considered constitutional?"
p6375
aS'Since when does the fate get decided by the victim? A woman could be said to have a biased opinion on it because she is an involved party. Even so, I take the stand that no one has any authority over the other to make that decision.'
p6376
aS"The short answer is that it isn't. See the details here: Phil Plait"
p6377
aS'Yes. The assumption happens to be that maybe the bible isn\'t literal. "Lets look into ourselves, shall we?" Behold we did, and Lo! The Earth is old!'
p6378
aS'No. It steps firmly in the realm of REALITY Jyoshu.Have you never heard people talk about how police in an area respond in X amount of time for one situation, but for a different situation, like in a neighborhood predominantly black or gay or ___, the response time is four times as long?Have you never heard of how there have been cases where people have died because they tried to get medical help at the "white" hospital?Or how about you read about THIS case and tell me that these concerns aren\'t real...'
p6379
aS"No, but the Roman persecution of Christians, covering Christians in pitch, Roman garden parties, witnesses for Christ being killed for their faith etc. is as irrelevant as it gets. Just be careful, that's all I'm saying. There is a place for that topic."
p6380
aS'Again? What do you mean? I am talking about different sciences per se. What is your question?'
p6381
aS"Sounds like the same skeptic argument above. I don't know about you Nu Leader, but when I'm certain my mind exists. Are you not certain? You are actually required to be, to deny you exist would require existence, and that would be logically contradictory."
p6382
aS"The criminals in DC already have their guns. All striking down DC's handgun ban will do is let the law abiding be able to better defend themselves and be armed for a change."
p6383
aS"Oh, undoubtedly - but the offspring aren't inheriting traits as such are they? They're just suffering the same symptoms of malnutrition as their parents, except that for them it's happening in vitro so they exhibit the effects from birth. That's why it's such a bad example for what you're trying to get others to accept."
p6384
aS"But the embryo is a mere clump of flesh inside of a woman's body. Science proves it. It has no sign of intelligence, it is merely cells at this stage. Therefore, it cannot be referred to as another person, or neighbor, and is no where near comparable to a human. Choices that harm another should be illegal, but choices regarding your own personal liberty and freedom should be made by the individual. Not the government."
p6385
aS'So why should you care about their non-scientific beliefs in a debate on science? Most people who believe in evolution do so because of science, so their non-scientific beliefs are irrelevant.'
p6386
aS"And, what percentage is that? How was the poll conducted? Who conducted it? How was the determination made about who was a 'scientist'?"
p6387
aS'That is true but that is the procedure.........Do you deny it?'
p6388
aS'But the whole process was done in the courts using the process set up by the constitution. Where the laws are not clear on an issue, such as in Massachusetts, it is the courts job to decide. The courts are a check on the injustice towards minorities by the majority.'
p6389
aS'I believe I said I would change my view. I will change my view on the issue of whether homosexuality is genetic.'
p6390
aS'Please note that I added the word "human" to your comment above IANGB. After all it is not my claim that all zygotes are human beings / "persons." Agree? Also, I want to make it clear that I am arguing only for the most basic of human rights (life) and not for the full panopoly of rights that say an adult human individual would have.'
p6391
aS'I believe that science explains the way God created the universe.'
p6392
aS"Just because a man pays support doesn't mean he is part of the childs life.He has no obligation to do *fatherly* things with his child.Women pay child support BTW."
p6393
aS'That was a nice rant that had absolutely nothing to do with anything. The essential question is not what various religous leaders have said about the issue, but what the Bible says about the issue.'
p6394
aS'First of all, it\'s not a precedent. this is the seventh or eighth state where a higher court has found anti-gay discrimination in marriage unconstitutional. Secondly, when so many rulings go in this direction, it can hardly be called "lawlessness". It\'s a call for lawful, constitutional interpretation of statutes.It takes extraordinary intellectual dishonesty to pretend there is some "agenda" at work. These decisions are the consequence of two things: our long history of rationally applying those silly words about equality that folks smarter than this generation of politicians put in the Constitution AND a long-term correction of the misunderstandings of what homosexuality IS and what its consequences are.I know you don\'t personally believe it, but there is nothing wrong with us.'
p6395
aS'You got it. People make mistakes. Finally you see that scientists are just as human as religious people.'
p6396
aS"O they don't make space anymore. They'll just put him in a cell with pot growers and crack addicts. He'll be lucky if he gets a spot on the floor to sleep on."
p6397
aS"no base for calling it a human being? Other than the fact that a fetus is scientifical a human being. Seems you have no basis for saying I can't call a fetus a human being."
p6398
aS'What you quoted is what Answers in Genesis said. Please do not be dishonest and tell others that I said this as I did not.'
p6399
aS'This is simply false. Rock can be folded under pressure. This has been proven by lab experiment. However there are many features in sedimentary rocks that cannot be formed quickly, for example, fossil trackways.'
p6400
aS"The argument that the baby is not a parasite, but is rather 'in its natural environment' seems a false dichotomy: it is natural for a parasite to be in the enviroment of another's body, invading it. The relationship element will be dealt with in the third section."
p6401
aS"Well, yeah, if science hasn't provided an explanation for a phenomenon, then all we can do is shrug and submit grant proposals."
p6402
aS"Well, that's your claim, anyway. Truth is that billions of theists accept evolutionary theory as is and reject the standard ID arguments."
p6403
aS"But wouldn't the biochemical similarities speak for themselves? That is, does one have to believe that the two specimens (which share biochemical similarities) evolved in order to infer that they will respond similarly to antibiotics? The observable facts of the similarities would seem sufficient (and more scientific?)."
p6404
aS"And for the record, i think anyone that tries to take away a women's right to her own body is a sexist and has no respect for human life, or has any concious about the woman at stake here. You care merely about a couple of cells and not about the real humans, nor do you care about society. It seems to me you are only trying to earn yourself brownie points in heavan. I am not influenced by that, im going to have my own opinions, and speak about what i feel is right instead of some christian god telling me what to do."
p6405
aS"If you can't eliminate demand you could try to limit supply and control access to that supply."
p6406
aS"Why would they be useless? They aren't useless on birds? And how is this qustion different in any meaningful way from the above? Aren't wings forelimbs with feathers? It seems that soaring or gliding or even faster running would be extremely useful."
p6407
aS'He made a post suggesting you were a troll, it has been removed it seems. Anyway, glad to help.'
p6408
aS'Well let\'s deal with one thing at a time. The NEJM study about Washington D.C. concluded that banning handguns saved 47 lives each year. The study didn\'t conclude that it was just a "curious relationship in the numbers." Go back to that thread and read the study. If you\'re looking for evidence that is absolutely without any degree of uncertainty then you won\'t find it. You can\'t prove things to a 100% certainty with statistics. What you can do is show what is probably true and what is probably not true. Even in court you\'re not expected to prove that someone is guilty to a 100% certainty. You\'re expected to prove that they are guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.'
p6409
aS"Erm... we are? Levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are usually quoted as parts per million, currently a little over 380ppm, 150 years ago closer to 280. In 1970 about 330ppm.   Carbon dioxide in the Earth's atmosphere - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia"
p6410
aS'That would most likely (imo) reduce the number of abortions performed. It would depend, I think, on how viable it is to transfer the embryo into the artificial womb. Forced surgery would not be an option if I had anything to do about it.'
p6411
aS'Really? A human can be determined scientifically. Personhood is a human legal construct. You cannot prove scientifically what a "person" is.'
p6412
aS"I wouldn't say most cjurches, because you cannot prove that. There is a long list of churches that are accepting of gay folks."
p6413
aS'In the examples you gave, the doctor is clearly trying his* very best to save the most lives he can. What if the Siamese twins were in no mortal danger while together? And what if one Siamese twin has legs but the other doesn\'t? Isn\'t the other twin dependent on the one with legs? Could a doctor ethically remove the legless twin if the legged twin wanted to and if the legless twin was retarded and the procedure would leave the legless twin dead?*(or her best.. I\'m sorry but my doctor is male, so I will no longer use "his/her" or "he/she"... it just gets tiring after a while...)'
p6414
aS"A slimey claim you cannot support as usual. In developed Nations, the U.S. is far down the list as has been posted on this very board at least 5 times. Those 'other' Nations also have far more crime and violent crime than the U.S."
p6415
aS'Not sure how you can tell that since very little is mentioned about his methods.'
p6416
aS'I did not say that evolution precludes God, all I am saying is that many Atheists seem to think it does, and thus it likely contributes to the number of people who beleive there is no God. If a person does not beleive in God, then they must beleive there is no ultimate morality.'
p6417
aS'732,000 DIDN\'T sign the petition. It seems only 5% of South Dakotans say "repeal the extreme abortion ban" and that is ASSUMING that all the signatures are valid. The good news for South Dakota is that come November they can show America how they really feel about abortion as opposed to having the courts decide laws.'
p6418
aS"jessica, all these problems you've listed, the human body takes care of automatically and remarkably well. the fact still remains that only less than 5% of all abortions occur because the risk is great enough to be deemed life-threatening to either tha mother or the child. and that percentage is diminishing as well. the overwhelming majority of abortions occur simply because the woman decides she does not wnat to be a mother."
p6419
aS"Well he HAS admitted he can't prove his belief. I guess that posting here would admit his false dichotomies that it's either literal genesis or evolution are false and god knows the world will end when that happens. Super admitting he's wrong? Never going to happen."
p6420
aS'DC has a law that human and civil rights can not be put up for a vote, this is the way it should be in the rest of the country. Why do you want to be able to vote on other peoples lives? Why is it that you are so cruel?'
p6421
aS'And yet quantum physics tends to be very contradictory, at least to our perceptions. Acausal events happen. A particle can be in two places at the same time. A particle can disappear and reappear in a different location without traversing that distance. And et cetera.Since the beginning of our local universe occurred at quantum levels, I would be cautious about drawing philosophical conclusions based on our macro-world experiences.'
p6422
aS"You can do so, and if I don't check your source I guess I'm SOL, eh? I've seen the story many places, but this is beyond simply a site dedicated to outing Bush since its a radio show :P"
p6423
aS'Of course the bolshevik revolution was doomed from the start as Russia was not indsutrialised and the revolution was imposed by a minority of the bourgeoisie rather than a mass movement of the proletariat (not that there was a proletariat in Russia at the time).'
p6424
aS'The goal of anti-abortionist is clear. The job of self restraint is that of each participant in their close encounters.'
p6425
aS'Just like no one is really "for" abortions, but they think that it\'s the woman\'s right to decide. Maybe that\'s like when congress gave the President the right to decide to go to war, even when they were supposed to declare war.'
p6426
aS"The guy can have an opinion but the ultimate choice is up to the woman who can listen to what the guy says or not, it's up to her. I believe that is what sinjin was saying."
p6427
aS'Ditto squared. If they support killing a perfectly healthy unborn child, they will argue that the reason stated in the Op is the main reason Abortion is needed and justified. And I must say that if 98% of all abortions were performed for that reason, the public stance against them might not be so strong.'
p6428
aS'Yes, it\'s very subjective. I was using evil as an example that was incorrectly used on the website. Even though evil is subjective, you can still be evil. (you can do evil to take away your goodness, but the only way to make yourself colder is by removing your heat, not adding "cold")'
p6429
aS'Then how exactly did a time capsule that was buried several feet underground get to the surface at the same rate as the surrounding area?'
p6430
aS'Yet without it the vessel is just worms, mud, then dust, like rock & tree houses, not made to endure, yet, the life force, energy, back to the cosmos/source, converted, capable of being rewinded, paused, and fastfowarded, like a movie screen amongst the stars, revealing our lives.'
p6431
aS"It doesn't have to be that way because it's the death penalty. It's that way because of our ever deteriorating legal system."
p6432
aS'Because of? Hardly. I feel it does change the morality of it, but it is not the sole criteria.'
p6433
aS"Exactly. Trying to prove that God, if he exists, didn't make us as good as an all powerful being should have made us doesn't prove anything in the God debate. I could always debate that since God is all powerful and all knowing he could have always thought of something better to do. If he made those changes, then of course there would still be something better he could have thought of. This would be an endless loop of creating something better and better until finally he would have to stop and say that is good enough. But even then this debate that he didn't make us as good as he could have would be valid in my view."
p6434
aS'He had ALREADY MADE the animals. "now the Lord God HAD FORMED..." not "now the Lord God formed..." See the difference? He already HAD FORMED the animals before he brought them to Adam. He made the animals before Adam.'
p6435
aS'I did not say that violent crime "rarely" occurs, merely that the risk of being a victim of such is lower relative to other risks. I am genuinely curious if you care as much about protecting your heart as you care about protecting yourself from criminals.'
p6436
aS'And right at the top of the list, at a whopping 31.2 per 100,000, is Washington DC, even though they had a complete and total gun ban in place. How the hell do you explain that? Nobody could own handguns, nobody could ever carry a gun, nobody could have a gun outside of their home, nobody could even load their private guns, so how do they get to be at the top of the list or death rates?'
p6437
aS"I think its actually the states job...the judiciary does need to overturn Roe v. Wade to get this done though...which doesn't mean it becomes illegal."
p6438
aS'emoticonXWowYou are making up your own strawman arguments as you go along.Asking "what they would need" is a poor mask to avoid the fact that YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE in the first place.A lot of "doesn\'t this look like ...", but that\'s akin to interpreting Rorschach tests. You see what you want to.'
p6439
aS"Just making sure that everybody is aware of his evasion, misrepresentation, and dishonesty. I figured a good time to do that would be while he was accusing scientists of these things... (I figure it's a damn good illustration when a paper's author tells him to stop misrepresenting the paper, and he keeps doing it anyway.)In fairness, being a creationist isn't necessarily an indicator of dishonesty; there are plenty of creationists who are creationists simply because they are uneducated about the subject. Unfortunately, supersport isn't part of this group; he has seen the evidence and is willfully ignorant of it."
p6440
aS"Even if it was murder, do you really expect me to side with the party that broke into Martin's house and robbed him?"
p6441
aS'Hmm, when you say "numberless" do you mean something other than the standard definition of infinite? If not, please explain how an infinite number of organisms could be created in a finite time with finite space and resources. Thank you.'
p6442
aS'There are several scientific explanations for the nature of the earth. Some use \'science\' to say that the world is flat. Granted that these beliefs aren\'t widely accepted, but then not all religions are widely accepted. By your reasoning or \'logic\' you must ask yourself about whether you should rely on science when there are many different scientific theories.The Flat Earth News, at least back then, had a regular column, "One Hundred Proofs Earth is Not a Globe."(go to http://www.flat-earth.org/)Other theories taught as sciencephrenologyalchemyevolutioneugenicsneptunismTheories of the Aether Articles relating to the Emergence of Scientific Theories of the Cosmic Aether(http://www.mountainman.com.au/aether.html)What about \'metascience\'?http://www.calresco.org/lucas/science.htmOr, sciences used to support political ends...What about Marxist Sciencehttp://www.marxists.org/archive/hald...philosophy.htmor Chaos Theory and Marxismhttp://www.marxist.com/science/chaostheory.htmlThere\'s Nazi Sciencehttp://www.webster.edu/~woolflm/naziscience.htmlNationalist Sciencehttp://www.ljudmila.org/nettime/zkp4/08.htmOr social ends...Scientific Racismhttp://www.press.uillinois.edu/f02/tucker.htmlMainstream scientists instead of using the word \'heretic\' use the word \'pseudo-science\' to categorise fringe beliefs.'
p6443
aS'Been saying that ever since the first time I heard about creationsism.'
p6444
aS"Right. It's called stasis. Species that are well adapted to their environments tend to change little in a stable environment. It is still true that fossil crocs are not the same as modern crocs. There are obvious differences."
p6445
aS"I believe you mean pro-choice, don't you. A pro-life mod might agree with you."
p6446
aS'Notice that even in this version there are elipses just before the quote in question. My bet is if we were to actually refer to this 44 years old book, Simpson would not be saying what Toxey wants him to say.'
p6447
aS'Are you sure? What about animals that had a combination of both long and short hair. Such fur would function more efficiently as insulation that either long or short alone.'
p6448
aS'Actually, scientists who discard the global flood are taken seriously.'
p6449
aS"Is that a trick question? No, the tabloid and other gutter press keep going on about how bad it is, because they sell papers by fanning fear and hatred, and fear of crime is one of their biggest markets. Yes there has been an increase in gun crime over the years, but that's largely attributable to increased attractiveness of crime in a society where social mobility has come to a standstill. In any case the number of incidents where firearms are used in crime is still very small, which is why every time someone gets shot it is headline news.   Guns are incredibly rare in this country, the only time I've seen guns in real life (other than air rifles) is on a military base."
p6450
aS'So much for lists of registration and "safe storage". Same thing happened when Hitler took over a country and got hold of all the lists. They were especially interested in the gun lists and radio lists.'
p6451
aS'Homo habilis is the first species to use fire as a tool I think.'
p6452
aS'If he lies about being pro-life, what else will he be willing to lie about in order to be elected? That is a legitimate, not-made-up issue that is relevant to elections.'
p6453
aS'They are merely taking chemicals that they can detect in outer space and reproducing the enviroment they are found in, by exposing them to ultraviolet. You are exposed to ultraviolet when you walk outside in the sunshine.Every chemical that they used is readily detected in interstellar molecular clouds.'
p6454
aS"Oh I certainly don't pretend that and certainly didn't claim that either--though a couple of left-wing posters here (who will remain nameless for now) might take the bizarre step of saying my post to you amounted to as much, if history is any indicator. Maybe we'll all luck out and they'll forget their Lenses of Bias at home, and instead read claims people actually make."
p6455
aS"JFriday:In fairness, no one, pro or ant-gun can ever use UK stats to support thier argument again. Back in Jan '03 the UK government finally came clean and announced that they had been seriously fu**ing with crime statistics.You can make the argument that the UK state had something to hide with guncontrol and you would probably be right. Reliable information from UK ministries should now be accepted as less than credible."
p6456
aS"This is not true. Rather, when there is conflict between one's sanctity of life vs another's quality of life, the sanctity of life must win."
p6457
aS'What\'s a "marriage officer"? If that\'s like a priest or minister, than certainly they shouldn\'t have to perform a ceremony that doesn\'t coincide with their beliefs. But if it\'s a government position, like a justice of the peace, then they should either leave their religion at home when they go to work, or get a job that doesn\'t conflict with their beliefs. Religious freedom does not give you the freedom to deny freedom to someone else.'
p6458
aS"Yet he hasn't. No pro-choice person I know wants abortion to be prevalent, they just want it to be an option. Wanting it safe and rare and available is not an abnormal positon for a pro-choice person."
p6459
aS'So gay people, in your opinion, have no right to form the families of their choice? So you are defending the continued oppression of gay people?We are sick of conservative family types. We are tired of the closet. The phrase "we are mad as hell and we are not going to take it any more" applies. I see in your response the comming of the camps to lock and exterminate gay people. It is that type of thought, that jews were subhuman, that led to the final solution. As it is here with conservatives and religious right nuts, who believe gay people are sub human sickos in need of curing or killing.'
p6460
aS'Well if there can be a Constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage, why not to remove marrriage from the federal government? Where do they get that power Constitutionally? So that would mean states can choose not to recognize any marriage Constitutionally. I think that marriage is a church issue. Let gays, straights, everyone get civil unions to be recognized legally. But leave marriage to the churches.'
p6461
aS'When you have no constructive comment just attacks the messenger with your insultsand name calling.....typical...............so very sad..........Its radicals like you that hurt the cause of gay rights.........'
p6462
aS"I don't find it surprising. It's probably a strategic sacrifice on their part rather than a change in their personal views . They don't want to lose votes and possible support from gun owners for their priorities like health care reform because of a difference of opinion on gun control policy. They know that the Republicans are going to hit them with everything they've got during election time and exaggerated accusations about the Democrats wanting to take away people's guns would hurt them. The Republicans learned during the Clinton years that creating as much as paranoia as possible about the Democrats supporting big government is the way to regain a majority in Congress. It's all politics."
p6463
aS"False. Beneficial mutations in bacteria have been observed in the lab. Far from wrecking the system, they allowed the system to continue to live while those without the mutations died: the mutations improved the system's ability to survive and perpetuate itself."
p6464
aS'By all means, burn those books . . . er, I mean, take down those nativity scenes.'
p6465
aS'Well, assuming that when the Bible says "you" in passages that are telling "you" to do something with your soul, I would hope that it also applies to women. But it never comes out and says "women and men have souls." This doesn\'t mean they don\'t have them.Same thing with animals. The book isn\'t written for non-humans, so when it says "you" we can assume it doesn\'t refer to non-humans. But the book never says "animals don\'t have souls."So we can\'t assume that they don\'t (according to the bible).'
p6466
aS'Well done Monty. Mark that up as your first ever 100% honest and accurate post here.'
p6467
aS'So, the Supreme Court rested its decision not on the 9th Amendment as the District Court had done, but chose instead to base it on the 14th Amendment.'
p6468
aS"Got evidence to back that up??      I'm not sure how a stoner's worse than an alcoholic really.      -Wez"
p6469
aS"because that's the subject of this thread: what designing a solution to a problem actually entails."
p6470
aS"That's not quite right. More accurate would be: Nothing that occurs outside the realm of physical law is in the realm of science. Science by no means precludes the possibility of there being something outside the realm of science."
p6471
aS'My mom can only trace her family back a few generations. By the time we get to the clan that lived in Ohio in the middle of the 19th century, the records get very confusing and very incomplete. By creationist logic, we must then accept that my ancestors, white Americans, were specially created in North America by God.'
p6472
aS"You lost this debate Skeptic, why drag it back up again? There are plenty of other subjects that we could debate instead. Pick one of them and let's debate again. Alternatively, how about a formal debate on ID in which you never once mention Behe? That'll be a completely different one and worth considering."
p6473
aS"You mean, the perpetrator is convicted and the defender acquitted? Yes, that's the rule and not the exception. Notice here how no-one ended up dead, or even particularly seriously injured. Additionally the circumstances described are incredibly rare, that's why it makes the news."
p6474
aS'The article continues to comment that this mechanism serves as a mechanism tailored for evolution? Irrespective of its origins, somehow, life utilizes evolution FOR evolution.      B. Convergence   As seen in the docking simulation, the solutions all converg'
p6475
aS'Really? Let me see. Two creation myths and a global flood myth where 5 million "kinds" of animal were crammed into a big box that magically floats for a year - yeah, that\'s secular history.'
p6476
aS'There are some very rare cases where abortion is legitimately allowable by society. However, most abortions do not fall under this catagory.'
p6477
aS'Not really. World forests are at risk for farm land and non-paper logging, not for paper which is being replaced by post consumer waste at increasing rates. Most paper people use today contains at least some recycled paper.'
p6478
aS'And for years they did. They still can. Again, there is not a real problem with pirates.'
p6479
aS'Yep - that\'s someting that many "pro-lifers" also never take into account.'
p6480
aS'So what? That means in a firefight with police, the criminal will run out of ammunition in a matter of seconds and be ripe for the picking.'
p6481
aS'Actually, the more educated a person is, the less likely he is to be a creationist. Creationists tend to be semi-literate (poorly educated), rural, poor, and female.'
p6482
aS'But what about the hypothetical?I can\'t think of a single child on this planet that has never been exposed to the ideas of the supernatural.So, what I was asking is whether faith is nature or nurture.That\'s why I brought up kids being afraid of the dark, likely no matter what anyone tells them. I think it\'s this fear of the unknown linked to the "logical" brain of a human that possibly creates this need for explanations. But faith involves specifics, so when the specifics are filled in and "make sense" to more than one person, these specific "explanations" can be passed down.So I don\'t know how much of faith is nature and how much is nurture.'
p6483
aS"Simple. The big government people will tell you that it's in everybody's best interest. The criminals will just kill you without debate."
p6484
aS"Oh, there's no hypocrisy involved, just you being your usual self and not even looking at the actual information (or, more likely, looking at the information and then deliberately playing dumb)."
p6485
aS"No, it's often an emotional show. They choose their families based on submitted videos, usually from families with one or more physically challenged members, then they build them a house to fit their needs.There was one in particular with a blind autistic boy who loved to swing. The joy on his face when he got the new swing would make any sensitive person weep with joy for him. There was another about a deaf couple whose new home included and lot of strobe light signaling systems.BTW, alcohol is a depressant! emoticonXWow"
p6486
aS"I wish you could put your hands on that poll as well. Until then I'll remain skeptical. Let's remember that Democrats and liberals hunt. Remove that group and what's left? Something less than 20% of Americans that own only handguns."
p6487
aS'Not in matters of atheism. Tell me, when science discovers something that seems to agree with the 150 year old writings of Darwin, are the writings of Darwin disregarded? Or is that type of history trumpeted to the masses?'
p6488
aS'I suppose the fact that Indian law only applies to its people. Who qualifies as an Indian is another matter. Many people who have as little as one-tenth Indian blood qualify for liberal hunting privileges here in Minnesota.'
p6489
aS'Because there are no dinosaur fossils above the iridium layer.'
p6490
aS'Well it all depends on who is going to determine "right", isn\'t it? Abortion is not math. There are no finite answers. Just a myriad of opinions which inevitable lead to either abortion is right or abortion is wrong. No different now then when Roe v Wade became law or any other times in history. I do like Aristotle\'s take; He taught that a fetus originally had a vegetable soul but he didn\'t say what kind of vegetable.'
p6491
aS"How do you define evolution? If you don't see any, then you aren't using the definition used by evolutionary biologists. The question is who should define the vocabulary of evolutionary biologist, evolutionary biologists or creationists?"
p6492
aS'Well, by the strict defintion of the word "born", an abortion is considered a premature birth.'
p6493
aS"Well, if they've re-established control in New Orleans(and it seems they have), then taking a gun away from someone carrying it on the street would be what the police normally do in any city. If they were taking it away from peoples' homes, and not letting them keep them, that would be over and above what they normally do. (I'm very pro-2nd Amendment, so don't get me wrong here. I'm just pointing out that taking guns away from people happens in every city every day)I also think that it's kind of disingenuous to complain about the military coming in--just a week ago everyone was criticizing the govt. for NOT sending in the military. Now people are criticizing them for doing it???"
p6494
aS'Your reason for believing this lies entirely within the Bible. I hardly consider a 1500 year old book "making clear what he wants". Particularly given that even among those who believe the book, they still can\'t agree on what God wants. And of course, that doesn\'t even beging to address the issue of all the other holy books which contradict the Christian Bible. You may personally believe that you know what God wants, but if so it\'s not because God has been clear about it.'
p6495
aS"Reading Difficulties, huh?      There's a cure for that. It's called school. Perhaps you should go there....."
p6496
aS"The problem with happenstance origins is that there is no evidence, and it's simply not possible to falsify it. If we were able to prove so many scientific proceedures (from abiogenesis to radiometric dating - all based on the presupposition that there is no God) were indisputably true, then ID would be falsified. There is not enough supporting evidence for happenstance origins. Yet so much of happenstance origins is considered science, so all too often, there is no line between religion and science. "
p6497
aS"sinjin - I didn't mean to imply any linkage between your opinions and those of another poster. Apologies."
p6498
aS'This is my understanding as well. Interestingly, concepts only approximate that which they intend to define. Confusion between concept and actuality is fertile ground for misunderstanding.'
p6499
aS'And here our Government recognizes:  Rule of Law: Fundamental Rights of Citizens Democracies exist to serve their people'
p6500
aS'i\'m impressed! this is a very precise description, in regular englishand yes, the deduction in 9 seems presumptious if all we state is God has a "possibility of existence". how this was cleverly cleared up (from the same source site) was simply a trip back to the definition: "greatest possible being". the "greatest possible being", by definition, MUST have a possible existence. in otherwords, we cannot assume that there is a possibility that the greatest possible being does not exist. yeah, it sounds like the whole "proof" is pointless because your premise is already the proofjust keep in mind that for the purposes of this proof, God is defined as "the greatest being possible". as long as that definition is maintained, the proof works...does that mean that God exists? hmmm....emoticonXFrazzled'
p6501
aS'You know that what you call "immoralism" is my life. Why do you hate me so much that you would be willing to deny my the happiness that you take forgranted and as your due? You don\'t even know me yet you are willing to defame me just because I am different from you. I don\'t understand how I am running over you by living my life openly and wanting the same thing as you the right to consider whom I choose to be my family. If you have an opinion about gay rights thats fine. If you want to deny me the same rights, as you take for granted, because of your opinion and beliefs though laws then that is bigotry.'
p6502
aS'You\'re a little confused about that. It\'s all real DNA. Some of it just doesn\'t code for anything. But some parts of non-coding DNA (which you call "junk") has other functions besides coding for proteins.'
p6503
aS"Yes it is, police aren't obligated by the US Constitution to protect individual citizens. If they were, lawsuits could be filed every time a crime is committed, and the police would go bankrupt really quick."
p6504
aS"What's your claim? That the seasonal molt of arctic foxes is evolution or that it is not? As usual, your responses show muddled thinking."
p6505
aS'But my point is that the Supreme Court has disagreed. Hence the illegitimate legal doctrine of substantive due process, which maintains that the due process clause can be violated even in cases where due process has been given.'
p6506
aS'So Lewontin is the person who determines the opinion of the general public or something?'
p6507
aS'If a God exists, then God is as God is.'
p6508
aS"Look up the evolution of colour vision in primates. It's my personal favourite - but what do you think?"
p6509
aS"I think this is a fair conclusion. I went as far as I did because of what it seems to say about the governor calling for a joint session. I may be wrong, but the text seems to instruct the governor to keep them in joint session until final action is taken. In other words, it doesn't appear that the governor has an option. And it does not seem that the Constitution allows for a legislative session that never ends. I'm not sure how else to square the two except that the legislature should pursue final action. Of course, as you have pointed out, it really is hard to speculate on this one without any historical context of the amended Amendment Process, and/or the relevant legal precedent surrounding it. Any thoughts on this?"
p6510
aS"You yourself said you don't even know what the gun laws in California are. Yet you're saying there you believe they have legitimate tests?"
p6511
aS"You think open carrying of loaded handguns in public will become fashionable in CA?   I think if anyone took to this they'd find themselves asked to leave establishments routinely."
p6512
aS'If the child is to be born into a poverty stricken part of the world and is expected to die by the age of 7 by either disease or lack of food, why not spare pain and abort?'
p6513
aS"And this is a terrific breakthrough. My partner and I are coveered by my company's health insurance, and the state of Connecticut honors our Civil Union. That being said, I still have to pay tax on my partner's health insurance as imputed income because the federal government refuses to acknowledge our union.So it has to be marriage. Full and without exception.Civil Unions are not enough when we are treated differently under the law."
p6514
aS'actually, the only valid question plotter asked is about the existence of dinosaurs (How did they fit into the creation schedule?) Good question plotter...Plotter: "when did he create all the other planets, when did he create all the other stars and comets?"Gen. 1:14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth." And it was so. and XQ, what stories are you talking about?'
p6515
aS"And are people in DC legally allowed to carry their guns with them in a concealed manner, having them readily available like the rest of us do in the country?Absolutely not. According to DC your rights don't extend past your home, and it barely even exists inside your home."
p6516
aS'I think that case was in Georgia (a different state) and so far as I know homosexuality was not involved. However if you want to worry about a legal case you need to look at Dover Pa. Not the sticker case in Cobb County.'
p6517
aS"That's not something you can really blame on the pro-life movement. In fact, a lot of effort in the pro-life movement does go into helping single mothers. Many pro-life counseling services help single mothers offering support in a variety of ways, including financially."
p6518
aS"Giving an answer to a conumdum doesn't necessarily solve it."
p6519
aS'but they do support the choice to abort a fetus or embryo. An argument made for slavery was that "you don\'t have to own them but don\'t tell us what to do"..a fairly similar argument but doesn\'t show whether or not abortion is wrong just that some lines of thinking should be questioned.'
p6520
aS'Actually your posts are providing increasing evidence for just how simple folks can get.'
p6521
aS'Most Christians are, as is frequently pointed out by numerous posters in many different threads on this board.'
p6522
aS"Because that's when the law says that they have the 'right to live.' Rights are legal terms that are fabricated by humans. They are not constant, but rather change whenever we wish to change them."
p6523
aS'And a lot of blacks were killed through hangings. Are you against rope vendors?'
p6524
aS"First of all, when gun owners say ban guns, it means, if you want to ban ANY Gun, you are a gun banner! You guys want to muck up the argument with we don't want to ban all guns, just some guns! However, that statement is just for now! If you get the ban more will be following!   Nelson T. 'Pete' Shields -- Founder of Handgun Control, Inc."
p6525
asS'val_ind'
p6526
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